>> Live from Washington, D.C., it's theCUBE. Covering Inforum DC 2018. Brought to you by Infor. >> Good afternoon and welcome back to Inforum 2018. Our coverage here on theCUBE as we start to wrap up our two days of coverage here at the show. We're in Washington, D.C. at the Walter Washington Convention Center, along with Dave Vellante, John Walls here. We're joined now by Mayumi Hiramatsu, who is the SVP of Cloud Operations Engineering and Security at Infor. Mayumi, how are you doing? >> Great to be here, thanks for coming. >> And a recent honoree by the way, Woman of the Year at the Women in IT Awards, so congratulations on that. (clapping) >> Awesome! >> Thank you. >> Very nice honor. >> Great. >> Tell us... big picture here, cloud strategy as far as Infor is concerned and why that separates you from the pack. What makes that stand out, you think, from your peers? >> I think there are a couple of things. One is that when I think of cloud, a lot of people will think about cloud as, it's a software running in the cloud, but it's more than that. It's about the solution and the capabilities that we're building on the cloud. And Infor is perfect, in that we're building enterprise software solutions. So if you look at Infor and compare us to the competition, we may have multiple of competition wrapped together in a solution. And that's really powerful, and you can only do that, really well, in the cloud because it's already built for that. It's integrated and the power of data is really amazing, because when you think about cloud, it's not just the software, it's the data, what you can do with it. And with the latest technologies around artificial intelligence and machine learning, there is so much insight we can give to our enterprise customers to make them successful in their business. So, I think of cloud as not only the technology, which I love, because I'm actually an engineer, but it's really the business transformation, digital transformation that the cloud enables, with the technologies like artificial intelligence, data analytics, data science, machine learning. There's just so much bolted on, that you can really only do in the cloud. >> Can you help us understand that competitive nuance? >> Yeah. >> I'm not sure I fully understand, 'cause others will say, well, we have cloud too. What's different between the way in which you provide solutions in the cloud and... pick a company. >> Yeah. >> Another company says, we have cloud, all of our SaaS is in the cloud. >> Right, so I think the first thing is, Infor's always focused on solutions, which means that our competition may have one of, let's say, a dozen things that we put together. So, if you're using our competition, they may have a cloud and some of them were born in the cloud, but then you have to figure out, how do I integrate it with the rest of the world? Because if you think about it, ERP. It's running your business. And it might be your HR and about your employees. It might be CRM and customer information. It could be supply chain and figuring out what parts I need to buy. It could be billing and figuring out how do I bill my customers. All these different solutions today, if you look at our competition, they may solve one, two, three different portions, but certainly not a dozen of these all together and then tailored towards the industry. So, we can pretty much bolt on and get started pretty quickly, if you think about, for example, healthcare. We already have a healthcare solution ready to go, so you don't have to figure out how do I put 12, 15 different software, glue it together and make it work? And maybe some of it is running in the cloud, maybe some of it is not running in the cloud, then the integration and making it work gets really complex. But ours is already pre-built, ready for that, whether it's healthcare, manufacturing, food & beverage, fashion. We have a lot of these already ready to go, so then you just have to customize it, as opposed to starting from scratch, figuring out how to integrate all these different software, making sure they work together and then harnessing the data, and then adding all these different, artificial intelligence and machine learning capabilities that is so powerful today. You can't do that without the cloud and you certainly can't do it if you're trying to glue together different solutions. It's just really not easy. And I'll add one more thing, I was talking to a customer about this today, which I thought was brilliant. The other thing is security. Most people worry about security in the cloud and I run our security as well, the Chief Information Security Officer reports in to me and the whole security team does. And I can tell you, if you're combining 12, 15 different types of software and trying to have consistent security all across? Oh, that's a very difficult thing to do. But we've already figured it out. So all you have to do is buy the package, the solution, it' already working together. You already have security overlay on it. They have consistency in terms of how we manage the security, whether it's single sign-on and who has access, and making sure that that gets all the way through, all the way up to the data lake, where all of the data gets captured, all the way up to the artificial intelligence. So, if you think about security and how important that is, and how difficult it might be to do on one software, let alone a dozen software, the fact that we've already built that, is a big differentiator. >> So it's all there, and when you talked about, all you have to do is customize it, you're talking about, you're not talking about hardcore coding, you're talking about things like naming and setting it up. Is that right? >> Yeah, and-- >> Or are you talking about deeper levels of custom mods? >> In our multi-tenant cloud, we don't do mods, but instead, we have extensions. And extensibility is really important because now those are, again, essentially plug-and-play. We already built it for you, so it's so much easier than creating each piece of code every single time. Again, it's about, how do you make sure that you can integrate these very important sets of business processes together. Not only how quickly can you use it, how secure is it? And ensuring that you can actually focus on your business value, right, because trying to assemble all of this together and making it work, it's an enormous amount of work and I think, as an enterprise, you want to focus on actually giving customer value instead of trying to figure out, the mechanics underneath the hood. >> I mean, you certainly get the value of cloud software, right, and cloud ERP. Who doesn't? Like out of the industries that you're trying to, get in front of or whose attention you're trying to get. Where's the, if there's someone that's kicking and screaming a little bit, who might that be or what might that be? >> I don't think that there's a specific industry, if you will, I think some industries, in fact, and when I think about it, all industries are getting disrupted, right? If they don't, they're actually getting left behind. So, I think some industries feel it more, as in, they might be behind the curve. And I wouldn't necessarily say industry, maybe some of the companies in that industry. >> Companies within? >> Yeah, are waking up to it. I went to a Gartner Supply Chain Conference a couple years ago and they were talking about bimodal supply chain, right. You have the teams that are doing the old way and then companies that are doing the new way. And companies are literally going through this shift. And I had this interesting conversation that it's really not bimodal. Companies are essentially somewhere in that spectrum and what they need to do is figure out from point A to point B and how you make that transition. It's a huge transition. I would also say that there's a cultural element as well, and so one of the key things that, especially for companies that are moving from on-prem to cloud. As a provider, it's really important to realize it's a completely different business model. And it's not always talked about, again, a lot of times people think, oh well, you know, Infor, you just moved the software into AWS and you're calling it SaaS. It's more than that. Besides the capabilities, its a huge cultural shift that even Charles talked about on-stage, which is that, software companies you focus on the product, versus, as a SaaS, the last 'S', Software as a Service, you are focusing on the service. So, the analogy I use a lot is, maybe we were actually a food company, we'd build beautiful food, delicious food, nutritious food, maybe it was a rotisserie chicken, right? But now I switch to a restaurant. Food is only table stakes. And you know, restaurant reviews is about services, the ambiance, how quickly you respond, how clean it is, all these other elements matter. And if you think about Infor or any other company for that matter, that we're focused on product and software, to then becoming a SaaS service provider, it's a huge transformation for a company, and I can tell you we're going through that, right? Infor as an on-prem company moving to the SaaS, and there's so much focus now on customer experience, is because realizing that we're no longer a software company, we're a Software as a Service company. And there's a lot more we need to put in, in terms of making sure the customer experience is good. As our customers go through the same journey, they also need to realize, it's no longer about providing that product, but the experience that they're providing to the customers, and we see our customers actually going through that journey. Some might be harder to move within whatever industry, because maybe they have legacy product, legacy machines, right, to be able to lift and ship to quickly. But there's definitely a path, and if you think about some of these industries that's been around for a long time, they're definitely going through this transition, and in fact, I think they have to. >> So how did you set priorities in terms of, you come to that recognition that we're services, in the cloud. Luckily, you don't have to manage data centers, so you could take that off the table, so what were your priorities and where did you start, and what are you focused on now? >> One of the first things that I did was really pushing this cultural shift for the company, because a lot of people, some people may think, okay, it's software, I'm putting in the AWS, it's cloud. But all the other service elements, like that restaurant analogy, it wasn't mature in terms of where we needed to be and therefore you hear a lot about customer experience and customer success and a lot of these elements that we really have to put more emphasis on. But the other areas that I focused, so I came in, I focused on cloud operations, security, tooling, and architecture, that was the set that I was focused on. What I did was essentially transformation, right, it's People Process Technology in addition to culture, so culture we already talked about, the sense of urgency is very different as well. On-prem, maybe you don't have to respond in two seconds, but in cloud, you do, and so making sure that we had crisp KPIs, which are different than on-prem, making sure that processes were completely redefined. I've actually done benchmark with our competition to see that our SLAs and KPIs are either on par or better. I'm a big proponent of engineering and technology, so we built a lot of technology monitoring, tooling, so that we can do a lot more in terms of self-service and automation, that's really the only to scale, and execute consistently. Spent a lot of time over the last year, literally re-defining the identity of our jobs to how do we make sure we have the right skillset, and retraining some of the folks who may have a new identity and they need to learn new skills, to coming up with new tools and technologies that they can use, to changing our processes so we can up our SLA and make sure that we're either meeting or beating our customers' SLAs, complete transformation in the last year. >> You must be exhausted. (laughs) >> When do you sleep? >> I don't sleep much, but... >> You must not. >> So, new metrics, this is intriguing to me. Can you give us an example of sort of this, new KPIs as a result of this cloud, SaaS world? >> Yeah, for sure. I think every company has their own sort of core KPIs that are public, and cloud is usually uptime, right? If you have support, it could be how quickly you respond, we call it mean time to respond. Underneath the hood, I've created key KPIs for, what I call, critical cloud qualities. One is, of course, reliability, so that would be in addition to uptime, like 99.7%, which is two hours and 11 minutes by the way, per month downtime, so making sure that we're actually meeting that. >> Sorry, just to interrupt. >> Yeah. >> You're measuring from the application view right, not the green light on the server, is that fair? >> That's a great question, because that is exactly the evolution we want as well, so when I talk about the transformation at my organization, we were measuring the hardware first. We are now measuring, essentially, outages. So I don't care if the server's still running, but if the customers can't log in, it's an outage, right? But that's not something you can monitor by looking at a server because sometimes the server's up and running. But maybe a process went down. >> System's fine. >> Exactly. So that's the monitoring-- >> Okay, so slight adjustment in the typical metrics, sorry to interrupt, but please carry on. >> That was a perfect question. >> Okay. >> So KPIs, so underneath the hood, so here are some examples of metrics for availability. Mean time to detect, that's an internal metric, and my internal metric is five minutes, meaning, if you don't know we have an issue in five minutes, it's probably not automated and monitored, so we better hook up some additional monitoring as an example. Mean time to respond, that's a very public one, a lot of times, customers demand that, and if you look at competition, that is the only metric that's actually public, potentially even on a contract, right? So we have mean time to respond, we also have mean time to resolution, that's usually an internal metric. I'm sure competition has that as well, but making sure that we have that response right away, because it's one thing to respond, but if it's not resolved as quickly, it's not good. Other metrics when it comes to reliability, mean time to communicate. And this is really interesting. One of the things that I found was, we could be working on something but we're not telling the customers, so they're wondering if we're actually sleeping on the job, even though we're actually actively working in the background, right? >> Did they get the message, right? >> Right, so mean time to communicate, as an example of reliability metrics. So reliability is one of the core tenets. The other tenets? Performance, how quickly do you respond, right? And I always say that if performance is too long, it's equivalent of being down. Imagine if you're using Google and you put a search in, and it takes you three minutes to get a response time, you probably have left by then. So that performance, page load time, page response time, these response times actually matter. So we have actually metrics around that and we monitor and manage them. Security, we have a boatload of security KPIs, whether it's number of critical vulnerabilities, how quickly we respond to security incidents, a boatload of those as well, and then, last but not least, agility. So how quickly we can respond if we have to do a deployment. So what that means is, let's say, every software company has a bug, and let's say we actually had to quickly respond to that, can we do it within 24 hours if we needed to? Security is a perfect example. A mature company should be able to say, okay, there was a security alert that got to the industry, right? We should be able to quickly respond to that and apply a patch immediately and address it. A company that may not be so mature, it might take them months to go through thousands of machines. So I call that time to market, how quickly can we actually deploy something, and that's not just deploying it, but testing it and making sure it's not going to break anything and be able to test it and verify it. So these are examples of metrics-- >> Great examples. Are your SLAs... for a SaaS company, your SLAs presumably have to be more strict than you'll contractually agree to, but maybe not, then your typical SLA out of AWS or Google, or Microsoft Azure. Is that true? >> Yes. >> So you guys will commit contractually to these types of SLAs that you would expect in an enterprise, versus kind of the standard, off-the-shelf AWS SLA, and how do you reconcile the gap or do you have a different agreement with AWS? >> We do have a... The SLA is pretty much standard when it comes to AWS specifically, right? >> 'Cause they want-- >> Yeah. >> Homogeneity. >> Exactly. So I think the challenge is, every SaaS provider needs to architect around it and when you think about it, hardware failure rate is usually 4% industry-wide. You can expect the hardware will go down, right? >> Yep. >> Network goes down, various things go down. So then it's our job that sits on top of it, to make sure that we build it for reliability. Perhaps we actually have redundancy built-in, and we can actually go from one side to the other, we have that, for example. So if AWS goes down, and they do, all right? I ran data centers for many, many years, it happens. It's our job to make sure that we can fail over it, and not have that customer experience, so it's an overlay availability that we have to build-- >> You're architecting recovery into the system, I know we're tight on time, but I got to ask you, 'cause Pam couldn't make it today. You're part of the WIN, the Women Infor Network, I presume, right? >> Yes. >> So maybe we can just talk a little about that-- >> Yeah. >> It's a great topic. >> Women in technology, right? >> I got some of the best interviews at Infor shows with women, Deborah Norville came on, Naomi Tutu, Lara Logan. Just some awesome folks, but so-- >> So your thoughts, we know you're passionate about the role of women in technology, so how you feel about that, if you want, and Infor, what's being done, or what can be done about that? >> Great questions. So I'm a big proponent of women in technology. Partly because I went through my pain, right, I've always been a small percentage in terms of engineering role as female in technology. I'm also a board member of Girls in Tech, and I channel my energy that way as well as I try to mentor and help others, for example, mentoring engineering students at Berkeley. I'm a Berkeley alum. And I think it's really important that we get more women in technology and keep in them in technology, and candidly, our latest trend is actually going down. So the reason why I think it's important, besides making sure that everybody has a chance, and all those good reasons, we have statistics that actually show, the more diversity you have, the better your product is going to be, and the better it's actually going to hit your top line revenue. And over and over again, whether it's women in the board seat, or women executives, or women engineers, no matter where, by getting women's input into technology, you're actually representing 50% of the consumer base. >> The user base, right. >> Right and so, if we don't do that as a company, we're actually not going to be able to get the user base feedback and I think it's so really important, not only for the economy to have those wonderful workforce in the job, but also for the company products to actually reflect the user's needs and actually improve the revenue, right? So from that perspective, I think it's really important, I love the fact that at Infor, we do a couple of things when it comes to diversity. So one, is WIN, as you know, Women Infor Network. I think it's a fabulous program, and in fact, I get a lot of male colleagues saying they want to join WIN, and they do. My last session, there were actually women and men joining it, because it's really about leadership and how do we cultivate our next, next talented workforce to be successful. The other one is EAP, the Infor Education Alliance Program, so that not only looks at women, but just diversity, right, and bringing students into this workforce. I think it's a great way to help the economy, help the products, help the company. And at the end of the day, why not? >> You're awesome, super impressive and articulate, and really self-confident, and hopefully an inspiration for young women out there watching, so thank you so much, really appreciate it. >> And hope you get some sleep sometime too. (laughing) >> Thank you. >> Busy, busy schedule. All right, thank you. Thank you Mayumi. We're back with more here on theCUBE, you are watching us live in Washington, D.C., and we'll be right back. (upbeat music)

>> Live from Washington, D.C., it's theCUBE. Covering Inforum, DC 2018. Brought to you by Infor. >> We are back this afternoon here in Washington, D.C., at the Walter Washington Convention Center. As we continue our coverage here of Inforum 2018 along with Dave Vellante, I'm John Walls, and we now welcome Mr. Cormack Watters to the program today, EVP of Emea and APAC at Infor. Cormack, good to see you sir. >> Nice to be here. >> So, we're going to talk about Guinness, over in Ireland (chuckling). Cormack's from Dublin, so we had a little conversation. We're getting a primer here. >> It's actually the best conversation we should have, right? >> Right, we'll save that for the end. How about that? So, you're fairly new, right? About a year or so. >> Ten months or so, not that I'm counting it by the day >> No no no, always going forward, never backward. But a big plate you have, right, with EMEA and APAC? Different adoptions, different viewpoints, different perspectives... We've talked a lot really kind of focusing domestically here for the past couple of days. Your world's a little different than that though, right? >> It is. It is. And it's very good that you've actually recognized it because that's actually the biggest challenge that we have. To be a little bit humble about it, I think we've got world-class products and solutions. I actually fundamentally believe that. But we have lots of different languages, cultures, and localization requirements in the multiple Countries that we look after. So, it's great to have great products, but it needs to be in French, Spanish, Portuguese, Italian, Swedish, Norwegian, Finish, Arabic, which most of them are. Customers realize that we are actually international and localized for many, many markets. But now we've become an intriguing option for them, if you're a multi-national business, with subsidiaries all over the world. So, it's good that Infor is big enough to do that. We need to do a better job of letting everybody know that we've done that, if that makes any sense. >> Sure. >> So what's happening in Europe? Europe's always pockets, there's no..I mean.. Yes, EU but there's really still no one Europe. What's going on? Obviously, we have Brexit hanging over our head. I felt like U.S. markets are maybe a little bit overheated in Europe has potential upside. >> Yeah >> And it seems like others seem to agree with that. What happening on the ground? Any specific, interesting areas? Is Southern Europe still a concern? Maybe you can give us an update? >> Yeah, so Brexit is quite a dominant conversation. I am from Ireland. I live in Dublin, but I'm working all over Europe, the Middle East, Africa and the Far East. So, I don't get to be at home very often, except the weekends. London is really our regional headquarters from a European perspective, and Brexit is on everybody's mind. Interestingly, when you go outside the UK, Brexit is not such a big topic because... That's Europe. And they kind of go, "Well if you don't want to be here, then you don't need to be here." Right? So it's a little bit of that, and they're saying, "Well, we'd like for them to stay, but if they don't want to stay, well, don't wait around." But in the UK, it's causing a lot of uncertainty. And the UK's one of our biggest markets. It's a lot of uncertainty, and what would be best is if we just knew what was going to happen, and then we could deal with it. And actually, once we know what's going to happen, that's going to bring a degree of change. And change, from our industry perspective means there's going to be some requirements that emerge. So, we need to be ready to serve those, which is opportunity. But the uncertainty is just slowing down investment. So, we need that to be resolved. >> So, clarity obviously is a good thing obviously a good thing in any market. Are there any hotspots? >> Yeah, actually for us, we're doing, for us the Hotspots right now, we're doing incredibly well in Germany. Which, one of our lesser known competitors is a small Company called SAP. And they're headquartered in Germany. It's quite interesting to see that we're actually taking a lot of market there in Germany, which is fantastic. That's a little bit unexpected, but it's going very well right now. We're seeing a ton of activity in the Asia Pacific, I would say that region is probably our fastest growing in all of Infor. And consistently so for several quarters and maybe past a year at this point. So Asia Pacific, Germany, U.K., and then as it happens, we are doing very well in Southern Europe, which is a combination of countries really. France, Italy, Spain, Portugal and Greece. Hard to put it down to which particular Country is doing well, but there seems to be a general uplift in that region. Because they were hit the hardest, arguably, by the crash back in 2008. So they've definitely come out of that now. >> And when they come out, excuse me I'm sorry John, but, they come out, Cloud becomes more important to them, Right? >> Yeah, I mean, absolutely. Anyone who's been delaying investment for years, can actually leapfrog what's been happening and jump straight to what you might call the future. So lots of Companies, lots of our Customers, are trying to simplify their Business. So Cloud is a great equalizer. We believe in your, what we call Last Mile of Functionality per industry. And that should make the projects shorter, more compact more predictable and the infrastructure worries go away, because that's our responsibility to the Customers. >> We definitely so that in the U.S., 2008-2009, CFO's came in said shift to the Cloud, because we want to shift Capx to Opx, and when we came out of the downturn, they said "wow this stuff works pretty well, double down on it" and then there were other business benefits that they wanted to accelerate, and so maybe Southern Europe was a little bit behind >> I think that may be the case right, and they are picking up. And what we're seeing are a lot of other advantages. Not to make this a sale's pitch, but, I am here so >> Go for it >> You've got a microphone >> I've got a microphone and I'm Irish, so I've got to talk right? What the Cloud is actually doing is, lots of Companies have put in big ERP over the years, the decades. And then they get stuck at various points and maybe years behind, because upgrades become painful and really want to avoid them. So what they're seeing is, if they can get onto the Cloud, they never need to upgrade again. Because it's always current, because we upgrade it every week, or every month and they're never falling behind. So they want to be ready to take advantage of the innovations that they know about and those that they don't even know about. So by keeping on the latest version, that opportunities open to them. Also, there's a big issue in Europe specifically about a thing called GDPR, which is data protection. Security. So we believe that we can do a better job of providing that, than any individual Company. Because we provide it for everybody, our resources can be deployed once and then deployed many times. Where as if you're an individual customer, you've got to have that speciality and put it in place. So GDPR is a genuine issue in Europe, because, the fines are absolutely huge if a Company is found to breach it. >> It's become a template for the globe now, California's started moving in that direction, GDPR has set the frame work. >> Well and just to follow up on that, and now you're dealing with a very different regulatory climate, then certainly here in the United States. And many U.S. Companies are finding that out, as we know. Overseas right now. So how do you deal with that in terms of, this kind of balkanized approach that you have, that you know that what's working here doesn't necessarily translate to overseas, and plus you have, you know, you're serving many masters and not just one or two. >> What's happening is the guys in our RND have done very well, is they understand the requirement of, in this instance, GDPR. They look at the other regulatory requirements, lets say in Australia, which is subtly different, but it is different, and they can take, well what do we have to do? What's the most extreme we have to achieve? And if we do that across our suite into our platform suite, the N4RS, that can then be applied to all the applications. And then becomes relevant to the U.S. So it's almost like some requirement across the seas, being deployed then becoming really relevant back here because over here you do need to be aware of the data protection, as well, it's just not as formalized yet. >> It's coming >> A Brewing issue right? >> What about Asia Pacific? So you have responsibility for Japan, and China, and the rest of the region. >> Right >> Which you are sort of re-distinct... >> Really are right? There are several sub regions in the one region. The team down there, as I say, arguably the most successful team in Infor right now, so Helen and the crew. So you see Australia, New Zealand then you see Southeast Asia, then you see China, Japan and so on. So different dynamics and different markets, some more mature than others, Japan is very developed by very specific. You do need very specialized local skills to succeed. Arguably Australia, New Zealand is not that similar from say some of the European Countries. Even though there are differences and I would never dream to tell an Australian or a New Zealander that they are the same as Europeans, cuz I get it. I smile when people say "you're from the U.K and you're not from Ireland?" I understand the differentiation. (laugher) And Southeast Asia, there's a ton of local custom, local language, local business practice that needs to be catered for. We seem to be doing okay down there. As I say, fastest growing market at scale. It's not like it's growing ridiculously fast but from a small base. It's as a big market already and growing the fastest. >> And China, what's that like? You have to partner up? >> Oh yeah >> To the JV in China? >> You have to partner up, there are several of the key growth markets that it's best to go in with partners. Customers like to see we've got a presence. So that they can touch and feel that Infor entity. We can't achieve the scale we need, and the growth we want fast enough without partnering. So we have to go with partners to get us the resources that we need. >> And in the Middle East, so my business partner, Co-Host, John Furrier, is on a Twenty Hour flight to Bahrain. The Cube Bahrain. Bahrain was the first Country in the Middle East to declare Cloud first. AWS is obviously part of that story, part of your story. So what's going on over there? Is it a growing market? Is it sort of something you're still cracking? >> No, no, again it's growing. We have several key markets down there, big in hospitality in that part of the world. Hotels, tourism obviously. Shopping, very interesting markets, and Healthcare, interestingly enough. I think arguably some of the worlds best Hospitals are in that region. Definitely the best funded Hospitals. >> Probably the most comfortable. (laughter) >> So again part of our stent is the number of industries we serve, so if you can put in our platform as it were, then you could have multiple of the industry flavors applied. Because what's interesting in that part of World, there seem to be a number of, I guess we call them conglomerates. So maybe family owned, or region owned, and they have just a different array of businesses all under the one ownership. So you would have a retailer that's also doing some tourism, that's also doing some manufacturing. So we can put our platform in, and then those industry flavors they can get one solution to cover it all. Which is a little bit unusual, and works for us. >> Your scope is enormous. I mean essentially you're the head of Non-U.S. I mean is that right? >> Yeah, and Latin America as well. >> That's part of it? That's not... >> Excluding the Americas. So there's Americas and then everything else, and you're everything else. >> I missed a meeting you see so they just gave it to me >> What you raised your hand at the wrong time? >> I wasn't there (laughter) >> So how do you organize to be successful? You obviously have to have strong people in the region. >> Right. So the key is people, right. We organize somewhat differently to over here. We've gone for a regional model, so I have six sub-regions, that I worry about. So four in Europe, the Nordic Countries. Scandinavian, Sweden, Norway, Finland, Denmark. We call Western, which is Ireland, U.K. and the Benelux. Germany is Central and East, and then Southern is the Latin Country, Spain, Portugal, Greece and so. Then we've got the Middle East, and Africa, and then we got Asia Pacific. I've got six regional teams, all headed by a regional leader, and each of them are trying to be as self contained as they can. And where we see we've got an opportunity to move into something new, we've got one team working with me directly as an incubator. For example, we're driving a specific focus on Healthcare, in our part of the world, because it's very big over here. We haven't quite cracked the code over there. When we get some scale, then it'll move into the regions, but for now that's incubating under me. >> And, what about in Country? Do you have Country Managers? One in the U.K., one in France, one in Germany. >> We have what we call local leaders, right? So in some cases it could be a sales oriented individual, it could be consulting, others it could be the local HR guy. So that's more for us to make sure we're building a sense of community within Infor. Rather than it being more customer facing. We're still trying to make sure that there is a reasonably scarcity of senior skills. So regionalizing lets us deploy across several Countries, and that works with the customer base, but for employees we need local leaders to give them a sense of feeling home and attached. >> So the regions are kind of expertise centers if you will? >> Yes >> So I was going to ask about product expertise, where does that come from? It's not parachuted in from the U.S. I presume? >> No, we're pretty much self-sufficient actually, which is great. So from both what we call solution consulting, which is the product expertise, and then consulting which is the product deployment. And we're doing more and more of our deployments with Partners. As I say, we need to really rapidly embrace that partner ecosystem to give us the growth opportunity. RND, is all over the World. That's not under my direct control. So for a major suites, take for example, LN, happens to be headquartered out of Barneveld, in the Netherlands. From a Historic perspective, which is great. And Stockholm, which is also great. But a lot of the development resource room in Nila and in India. So we work closely with the guys, even though they don't actually report to me. >> And out of the whole area, the area of your responsibility what's the best growth opportunity? We all think of China, but that's been fits and starts for a lot of people. >> Yeah, yeah I think we've got multiple opportunities, you can look at it a few ways. You can look at it geographically, and you would say China. You can look at Eastern Europe, and you can look at Africa. There's a ton of opportunity in those regions, geographically. Interestingly we are also at a point where I think the Nordics, and we've got a very solid base Historically, and so on. But we probably haven't put enough focus on there in recent times, that the opportunities are really scaled in Nordics is really quite significant. And then they can look at it from a Product Perspective. So for example, we have, what we believe to be World Leading, and actually a Company called Gartner would equally agree with us. Enterprise Asset Management, EAM, that's a product suite that can fit across all of our industries. I think that could well be the significant growth area for us across the entire six regions. And it's a huge focus for us here at the conference actually. So we can do it by product, EAM, Healthcare, or by Region. I think Eastern Europe, China, and Africa, as well as the Nordics. >> And the other big opportunity is just share gains, market share gains, particularly in Europe, I would think, with your background. >> Yup. Completely, I mean, that's why I said, it's really interesting that we are winning market share in Germany. Who'd of thought that a few years ago? That's a big market, I mean, Germany, U.K., France, Italy. They're huge. Right, I mean U.K., is what, Sixty-Five Million People? It's a big economy, so we've got many of the worlds G7, in our backyard. So we just really need to double down on those, and give them the opportunities to grow that we need. >> And just back to Japan for a second. Japan has traction, it takes a long time to crack Japan. I know it first from personal experiences. >> Yeah, Okay, Interesting. >> Yeah you just got to go many many times and meet people. >> That's it, Right. And it's a different culture, of when you think they're saying yes and you think they're there, that's just yes to the next step. (laughter) >> Alright, so it does take time to get there. We've actually cracked it to some extent, that we've now got some solid referenceability, and some good wind. We need local leaders in Japan, to really crack the code there. >> And then once you're in, you're in. >> I think that once you've proven yourself, it's a lot of word of mouth and referencing. >> Well I hope you get home this weekend. Are you headed home? >> Yes! Actually I'm lucky enough. My Wife is originally from Chicago. So she and our Daughter have come over for the weekend, to go sight seeing in Washington. So that'll be fun. So we'll be going home on Sunday. >> Your adopted home for the weekend then. >> That's exactly right. >> Well we'll talk Guinness in just a bit. Thanks for the time though, we appreciate it. >> Thank you Gentlemen. >> Good to see you, Sir. Alright, back with more here from Inforum 2018, and you're watching Live, on theCube, here in D.C. (electronic music)

>> Live from Washington DC, it's theCUBE covering Inforum DC 2018 brought to you by Inforum. >> Well we are back here at Inforum 2018 in Washington DC John Walls with Dave Vellante. We are in the nation's capital and joined right now by Massimo Capoccia who is SVP of Info OS and Rick Rider, product director at for common at Infor. Gentlemen, thanks for joining us, >> Thank you >> Good to see you both. >> Thank you for having us >> Thank you >> Let's start first off good job by the way >> Welcome to keynote.. thanks stage this morning we had some time to shine out there. Your thoughts about the show in general so far? We've been a couple of days in now, how is it going for you? >> Yeah, very very well the customers have received the Infor OS and the technology innovation and what we do with the AI very very well. You know lots of people in the hub, lots of sessions, so lots of interest on the technology innovation for Infor OS and for Infor as well. >> Sure, Rick for you? >> Yeah, its been great, it's been interesting. What we are finding out is getting a lot of this out in front of customers and partners is bringing up some interesting opportunities for us moving forward. So it is not everyday we get the opportunity to get in front of these many people within our network, so it's been great. >> So we'll be hearing from folks Let's talk about AI, especially for those who maybe don't know, haven't embraced it yet. What are the Hesitation, reservations, I mean what are you hearing from them as far as what's going to trigger them to make a decision? >> Yeah, to be honest I think they have been hesitant in the past just because it hasn't really been clear. We have talked about AI in the technology community, it's been hard to define. Some people might in fact define incorrectly, because we are making assumptions about what technology can and can't do. I think what we are uncovering. I feel we've got a pretty unique approach to what we are doing here with Infor OS and common connected to it. We are working directly with customers to identify use cases on how we can apply AI. Rather than just starting at the top and saying, "hey we should be doing all these great things and let's see how we can make it work for our customers." It's kind of we are flipping the script and starting backwards and saying, "hey what are the issues? What are the opportunities the customers have? How can we build the technology using AI to make it meaningful?" So we have business impact they want. And by doing that, I think it's a lot more understandable, it's a lot more relatable, it's a lot more trust able from our customers. >> We from in theCUBE here, watch and observe the ascendancy of the hype and so called big data. And which is sort of moderated now. But in data is plentiful, insights aren't. and so we feel we have come to the conclusion that the innovation recipe, if you will, for the next decade or so, is data, applying machine intelligence, that data and having a cloud to be able to scale it. Having cloud economics to be able to track innovation. You guys seem to have all three >> Yeah >> Of those pieces But AI without the data is just.. I don't know what it is? >> Right? Excited. >> Data without the ability to extract (laughs)...you know insights... What good is it? >> Right >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Then you got to have cloud to scale it. Your thoughts on from a platform perspective with that means? >> Yeah, Absolutely. So I was seeing the interview that you were doing with Charles, says we build this platform from the beginning. And one of the big element is that we have you know, made it possible to synchronize you know real time all this data that the applications will generates, into a single place called the data lake. So when you have the data and data lake then you can do many many things and not only analytics and reporting, which is the classical use case, but now it allows you to do AI. And the difference is we don't have one domain of the data. So some of the vendors have only CRM data or ACM data or financial data. With Infor we have all different domains of data. So we can go from ACM from financials, to asset management, to IoT readings for IoT devices, to ERP and CRM also. So when you combine when you can cross and combine the relationship with this data, then your AI is much more smart and intelligent. When you have only the AI focused on a domain, is less intelligent. So that's actually the power that we do. And our Coleman will take advantage of that, you know that you know rich data lake. >> Okay and we talked a lot to someone earlier about the stack. and that the bottom layer, is the OS >> Yes >> So everybody is familiar with what the operating system does in computer science. How is your OS similar and different? What's the function that it does if we can double-click on that? >> Yeah, so we.. It's in for operating service and we call it a service. Because it's not actually in the database and operating system level, right? So we believe... We are more in the application technology. We are the layer that takes you know the bare technology and makes it usable for a business, for an enterprise. And we build applications on top of it. So what we believe at Infor, when you have an architecture with this composite of a suite of applications. Or even the new Microsoft architecture that developers built. You still have to deliver a uniform user experience, a uniform business process, uniform security and data management and even AI. So if you look at services like Facebook or Netflix, they have maybe the entire Microsoft architecture thousands of that, but the experience is one.alright? Thus what we want to bring it to the enterprise. Infor OS big.. that unify the experience both from the end user and business process, to the enterprises. And we do it for all the cloud suites. Infor OS is all the cloud suites not just one but all of them the same services. >> So, I love the Netflix example, because if you think about digital... digital transformation, digital business. My experience with Netflix is just with Netflix I don't have a... There's no marketing department, sales department service department. I do have a problem, I go to Netflix on my app(laughs) I interact with... >> Absolutely >> So that's... I considered that what's called a product. So Rick, how does this capability get translated into product? >> Yeah. You know one thing that you brought up a lot earlier is, with all this interconnectivity and how we have to package things. So we've got all these different services that OS offer. So we've got the data lake, we've got the API gateway. We've got the integration platform, and... All those pieces is what bring this together to where, we can actually deliver something to our customers. In my case, it's an AI model or it's RPA, because of all these things are packaged together. So they don't actually see what's happening, because it's already packaged for them. >> Okay, so... what I was saying the Charles, you probably you might have seen it, is when we first discovered Infor was like, "What do you guys do?" It wasn't clear exactly what you guys were doing. But he said, and I believe him, was always our vision to have a platform. Now that... the... it's not opaque anymore, the platform is pretty clear. Now you've added the Birst Analytics, you've added Coleman AI on top of that. So you know Andy Jassy AWS always talks about the flywheel effect. So I suspect that you're entering this flywheel phase. What is that phase? What does it kind of mean for you guys, for customers, in terms of innovation? >> Yeah, is a very good question. Actually I worked for years with... We started with this platform, this journey with Charles and we start really with... okay, what's the first first issue. You know, we want to solve the integration promise. We want to give an integration platform. Then we build that. Then we start to say, okay, we want to unify the experience. We build a unified portal with a single sign on. Then we say, okay, we want to unify the data, we build a data lake. So we continue to build out the platform. We are now at the level we have a platform and its unique platform because you can say it fits in one Magic Quadrant. Because yeah, it does the iPass in the past. So with all these magic quadrants. But it doesn't fit in one, it's in all of them, right? So and in... The analyst looks at that and say, Okay, we have a platform doesn't fit in one, if it's in all of them, right? >> The Magic Quadrant is now becoming outdated, because... >> Exactly. >> Because its as you said... I don't need 15 stove pipes... >> Exactly. >> With the stove pipe thinking. >> Exactly. So.. >> With all due respect to my friends at Gartner (laughs) >> But the Fly wheel is... Yeah, the platform is going to become more and more important, relevant. The customers that... you know are in the cloud, are not in the cloud, they will use the platform to get to the cloud. It's going to be a new enabler for those customers are still on premises, to go to the cloud. We the Infor OS is enabler for hybrid process. So some some application can be in the on premises or in the cloud. With the OS they can take the journey and get to the cloud and their own place. >> So architecturally, you don't care. >> We don't care what the application side, >> Okay. But you've certainly done a lot of work to optimize AWS, you know, we're AWS customer, we know it's, it's not trivial, you have to, you know work it. It's simple, developers love it, but to really take advantage of it, integrate it with your processes will take some work. But architectural, you don't care. But it's not. That's not a that's not an offering statement, is it? I mean, today, can I run that multi cloud, run their software anywhere? >> Well >> Doing that? >> Well, today, we have a mix off, we use open source library, but we do utilize AWS, the data lake is built on S3. On AI, we use Laks, or Sagemaker for the training on the models. So we do a lot of AWS, Because it gives you our computing power and any out of the box solution for certain certain pieces. What we do we build interfaces to our application, so that our customers doesn't need to take care of all the plumbing, it's all interconnected and done. So that's, that's one of the power of Infor OS. It brings that application technology layer, between the business application and you know, the basic, you know, technologies >> And the customer doesn't want to think about the plumbing these days, right? >> Right. >> To most customers, infrastructure is irrelevant, you know, again, apologies to my hardware, friends, but they don't care about hardware, right? I mean, >> Yeah. >> It's interesting, Charles said in the keynote yesterday, when we were an onPrem software company, we didn't manage servers for our customers. Customers didn't care really about the server, and any more than they care about the plumbing today, right? >> Right. Yeah. And if I want to relate that to the AI space, all the training, all the science, all the highly computational things that we have to do, customers don't really want to know what that means or how to use that. So what we're actually doing is in conjunction with some of the AI services we're working with, with AWS is we've built a modeling platform to where they're operating in one location. They've got no concept of where this is hosted, what's going on behind the scenes, and then we connect it, we expose an API, and they can do any sort of RPI that they want to. >> So...I mean you are talking about when you talk about your customers, and they don't care about, you know, what's behind the curtain, they just wanted it to handle, maybe something up front, but yet, you have to understand what they can do. Right? You have to understand their potential. So how do you do that, when you're dealing with different companies, different sizes, different priorities, different challenges, they're different technology stages. How do you all address them individually and help them get to that better place? >> Yeah, I think, you know, it's never a one size fits, all right. So we try to give them what we've called citizen developer tool sets in the past. And I've even started to try to say, citizen data science tool set. So how can we make it more consumable by all types of users? So yes, we can provide templates, we can create these things that might work somewhat out of the box. But each one of these customers their data is, is just slightly different than need to make tweaks. So we really want to be able to, you know, provide all that flexibility. And it gets back to we start with our use cases. And then we build from there. So we get all that feedback, and make sure we're making we're hitting those key points. >> So I want to pick up on something you said about citizens, citizen data scientists. I've used that term before in front of data scientists some of them don't like it, right. That denigrates what they do. And it's true, a data scientist is a math whiz, maybe a stats, was there a data hacker they can code, Okay. And that's not every business person, right? Clearly. However, when you think about things like our RPA, I mean, you really want to enable business users. You don't want to repeat the same problem that we had for years with things like decision support, where you had two people in the company that knew how to build a Cube. And you had to have line up with an ask, please can you build my cube, I have a deadline while everybody else does too. Just there wasn't effective. So things like our RPA and low code, citizen data scientists spread that technology throughout. Now, part of that is having a platform that is I vision a studio, whereas a user, I can actually create some kind of process and code that in software, you know, code it. It is something that's repetitive that I don't have to do every day. I do it every day, I do it the same way. Somebody gave the example might have been Soma, I know somebody else, expense report approval? >> Yeah, yeah. Yeah. >> I've never not approved and expense report. I don't crack them open. Look, I don't know, maybe every now and then somebody does. Somebody does, by the way. (laughs) >> (shouts) So don't get any idea here. >> I always press the approval button, right? Why can't a robot do that and look for anomalies and say, Oh, a $300 scotch? That's... >> Yeah Yeah. Absolutely... So is that a capability that you're working on, that you have today. That what I'm envisioning a studio and then I imagine this got some orchestrator... >> Yeah. So yeah, so if you look at throughout all Infor OS, is completely Model Driven. So either you, you build a new integration, or a workflow, or a, an AI model, or a even, we have a platform as a service Mongols, where you build with low code applications. So you can take it to end to end where you you train models in AI, us suppose as an API. You can build your own app on top of it with low code and then, you know, give it to your business users. Very, very simple and in the cloud. You know, in the browser and you can do every customer can do it. So that's very important for us. We work from the beginning with this model to give you know, the tools to everybody, not only an elite of people that can do and then you know, there is the rest of the people that cannot do it. Every new computer science engineer that comes out gets you know, AI out of the box. When I did computer science, Yeah, I got some AI, you know, but it was not really like today. So every everybody can program AI now. And we want to give this tools to every developer and not just went to an elite. >> Yeah. And the workflow prediction model that you've been talking about. If you want to come join us down there, we've actually got a model that we're working on for that exact use case. >> Oh, cool. >> Yeah. So yeah. Giving the ability for those business users, as you say to... it's almost like lowering the barrier to entry to a lot of this AI technology. It's not devaluing or anything, data science, because we've got those advanced tool sets, to where if you want to do something in our studio, bring it over into the Coleman AI platform. You certainly can, we're not devaluing that. But you know, what, if we want to start and take little bites off and you want to give this in the hands of the business users, we've got a great solution for that. >> So this is all the cool stuff. This is stuff that business users care about? I mean, do they... My question is, do people care about what's under the covers? I mean, are they asking you or what's the database? And how does this work? How does that work? Or they just really want to focus on that functionality that they're getting in the business impact? >> Yeah, with the advent of the cloud, you know, people, just those questions like we sh... you know, operating system database, which technology you use? it just went away, right? So people just want to know, the functionality and the value. You know, maybe there are companies that I have more, you know, an IT architects and they want to know, more, you know, that's what they want to go down into the details, then you go into the architecture of the OS, of the application, we integrate with AWS. So we do that as well. We, you know, we talk to customers about it. But most of them, they just want to know, okay, "how can I use this platform to make my business better," right. So it runs the cloud suit, but I now I can connect to other cloud services, I can connect to the other application, I can build my own app and bring it in. So they want that business value immediately. And that's why we built this Infor OS, so that they can run the cloud suite and add business value. >> You guys at last year's analyst meeting, gave a little glimpse of some of the architecture and it was very useful, actually, analysts love that kind of stuff. I didn't get the invite this year, maybe something the some smarmy questions I ask. (laughs) But I found that actually quite impressive in terms of the tech behind it and the RND that you guys are doing there. But ultimately, it comes down to what products you can build and what business impact that has, right? >> Yeah, absolutely. I think where we're heading with this, we really don't have many limitations for what we're seeing right now. We're built in a way to where we can apply to every single industry, every single cloud suite. We have the unique, you know, possibility to where we can go through all these different industries and create these sort of value. So we've got a very unique future ahead of us. >> So. Yeah, So how much better or can you give us an idea of a road map a little bit about what you think Coleman can go? >> Yeah so, we're starting to play in the image recognition space a little bit. Maybe looking at how we can utilize things like drone technology and do inspection reports, those sort of things. It's maybe and at least my opinion, I think others kind of express the same, it's maybe the least developed area and we want to make sure we have something that works for customers the way that they're going to see value immediately. But also we're starting look at edge AI. So how can.... not necessarily just an IoT, but how can we how can we build something in the cloud? How can we create a model, then deploy that for our onprem customers who aren't quite ready, so that they can get that AI experience as well, and that predictive insight. >> It's dvallante@Siliconangle.com Is that right? Your email for the invitation >> David.valante... >> (laughs) to make sure... so what will exchange information later. >> We'll invite you (laughs) >> I'm sure this is not your territory. (laughs) >> Its on me. >> Thanks for joining us. >> Thank you. >> Its been a pleasure. Thank you for the time we appreciate that. Back with more here from Washington DC right after this. You're watching theCUBE.

(upbeat electronic music) >> Live from Washington D.C. It's theCUBE. Covering Inforum D.C. 2018. Brought to you by Infor. >> And welcome back to Washington D.C. We're in the Washington Convention Center here for Inforum 2018, continuing the coverage here on theCUBE, I'm John Walls with Dave Vellante, we're joined now by Anne Benedict, who is the S.V.P. of human resources at Infor. Anne good afternoon to you. >> Thank you, thanks for having me. >> You bet, thanks for being here. Now, 17,000 employees, so obviously you've got a lot of responsibility there. You're not only an Infor Executive, but you wear the hat of being an Infor client, (laughs) as well. Tell us about that, and how that works out, and, I guess, how you can test drive a lot of different services on your own before it goes out to the market. >> I like to joke that I feel like I have the best HR leadership role in the business, or in the world perhaps, because I get to not only lead a great company full of great people, 17,000 employees around the world, I'm so proud of them, but then I also get to be a customer of one of the greatest products in the HCM world that there is, and I have a direct line to the product managers, to the developers, to the consultants who can really help us to use our product to it's fullest advantage internally for our selves. So, it's like a toy box that every H.R. executive dreams of, and it's right there at my door step to test, to use, to innovate with them. They're always open to our ideas, our feedback internally. We're often a beta customer for the features, and functionality that are coming out to our customers, so it's a great position to be in. >> So what about the relationship, because there is a great give and take. Obviously, because you are a tremendous resource on the development side. What is that exchange like, and how does that work in terms of what's working, what's not, what you think others would want instead, or what they'd like to tweak a little bit. How does that work? >> So, you know, we're trying to sort of straddle a balance between using the product as it's intended to be designed for the breadth of our customers, no matter what industry they're in. We're obviously in a technology industry, but we have a lot of health care customers, government customers, services customers who have their own particular needs. So, we like to experiment with the technology the way it's designed for other industries, but then also I can make adjustments for use for our own company as a services company, as a technology company, and a good example of that for example is I'm working very closely with product management right now to help them design the next iteration of what our talent management suite will look like. So, we have a design concept for how we want to give performance feedback, for example, internally at Infor, and we're sharing that design the product management team to help them create the next version of the product that will meet the design requirements that we've set out for ourselves, and that I think a lot of other companies are moving towards. It's a modern approach to talent management, and we're working very closely hand in hand with product management to make sure they're designing something that we, we're co-designing it with them really. So, what I'm expecting is for us to have a really great next iteration of that product that is very modern, and up to date on what science is telling us about performance feedback. >> So, you're a pioneer, in a way, but you probably don't want to mess with with core H.R., that's table stakes. Talent management is something that, frankly, not a lot of companies do well. So, you may be more receptive to experimentation there. Is that a fair assertion? >> Yeah, I would say that's true, and also my background is, I grew up in H.R. with quite a breadth of experiences, but my depth of expertise has always been on the talent management and leadership development side. So, that's been sort of where I've been wanting to play with the product, and give my point of view on where I think it should evolve. It's just my particular strength that I bring, I think, to this role and to the product as well. >> How do you see the role of the Senior H.R. Executive evolving? How has it changed in the last several years? How is, maybe, digital transformation, this whole big data, the data movement? How does that factor into that role, and your vision of where that goes? >> Yeah, I think companies are looking for a different type of H.R. Executive than they have in the past. And I was fortunate that this wasn't by design. It was very serendipitous, but my career path led me, I think, in the exact right direction. So, I started my first 10 years of my career as a consultant at Mercer doing H.R. consulting. So, I was consulting the companies how to make, how to create the best H.R. department possible, how to create H.R. strategy, how to operationalize that. And, it was that consulting mindset that I've taken with me throughout my career. After consulting I moved internally to various companies, and that skill set of just being able to identify a problem, come up with a solution, and measure an implementation, I've taken with me in my role. So, I think companies are looking for H.R. executives who bring that sort of mind set to the role. And, I think that's what I've been able to do at Infor. And then, I think also when I was a consultant I was also advising customers and clients on technology, and how to use technology for H.R., so that's why I'm so thrilled to have this role, because it's the best of both worlds where I get to play with the technology, and also be a cutting edge H.R. leader. >> Alright so-- >> Hopefully. >> How do you asses the Infor HCM capabilities? Come on, give us the good, the bad, what's on the to do list. You know, give us the rundown. >> Yeah, I think it's a phenomenal product, and I'm not just saying that. >> Okay, what makes it phenomenal? >> When I walked in the door a year and nine months ago we were just about to go live with the multi-tenant cloud product. We were one of the first to do that, and we did it in over 65 countries with 17,000 employees, and since then we have subsequently rolled out more functionality, benefits enrollment, absence management, compensation planning, LMS, and each time we learn a little bit more. I can't underestimate the importance of getting the process right before you get the technology in, and the change management that goes around it. If I would say, I would give us a B it might have been around those areas, but the product itself is really it has the perfect balance of coming out of the box with some functionality that you can use right away that's best practice process. >> So you get value right off the bat. >> Yeah, and not a lot of configuration required, easy to get in. We implemented it with that broad scope in a very, very short amount of time, which is almost impossible with our competitors, so. So, I think for that it's fantastic, and then for the specific needs that we've had it's been very easy to build that in as well, so it has best of both worlds I would say. >> So, we saw some pretty cool demos yesterday around talent science, and it struck me as an audience member. There were all kinds of different kinds of attributes of, you know, ambition and et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, but you know the one that wasn't on there was like performer, but it struck me that these attributes lead to performance. I guess that's the basic philosophy, but I wanted to test that with you. Just give me the bottom line. >> Yeah. >> But it really is more complicated than that, isn't it? >> It is, yeah, and that's one of the most exciting things about H.R. right now too, I think. And this comes back to H.R. Executive of the future is, I come from an IO Psychology background where data, we used to have to do experiments on subjects with, and collecting data was always the hardest part to studying work, and studying personalities, studying behavior, and now we have all this data available to us that we've never had before. And, talent science is a perfect example of how data is really empowering our decisions. And, to answer your question about how it is predicting performance; A particular attribute doesn't necessarily lead to performance in any role. So, in one role, ambition, really high ambition is actually not a factor for success. In another role, it is. So, it really is, there is no right personality profile that can predict success in any role. It's very role specific. And what talent science is able to do is really find the science behind what is the specific role that will lead to success, and what are the attributes that will lead to non-success, also in a role. And, that's such a powerful thing. What we've found with talent science is that depending on the role we can reduce turnover by 20 up to 70% by choosing people who fit a role profile versus those who don't. >> It's interesting it's like, you know, those books, like the seven attributes or-- >> Or Covey-- >> Of highly successful people, but essentially you're codifying that by role. And, that's true. It doesn't just work for any role. Sales person may be different than an engineer, may be different than a an operations person et cetera. >> So, this is really fascinating, because you have the human science, right, we're all imperfect, we make crazy decisions, sometimes irrational, we act wild, or predictably, whatever it is. And, now you're taking data science, and overlaying with that, so you're trying to come up with some kind of predictable markers, or whatever, for imperfect beings in a way. How's all that merging, I mean, how is technology being the glue in that process? >> Yeah, well I think there's no such thing as right and wrong, or perfect and imperfect. You know, I could get into a leadership speil, but any strength that either of you might have, if you use that to an extreme it becomes a weakness, actually. And, like I used in the example of ambition, high ambition in certain roles, may not be a factor toward success. Where as other roles it might be. Whatever particular DNA, behavioral DNA, that you bring to a role as an individual, it's incumbent upon us as a company to figure out what is the right role for the personality that you bring, and the behavior, and the strengths that you have. And, that's what we're really able to do with talent science, which is, so, if you apply for a role where you don't match the profile I may be able to propose to you, hey, you have really high ambition that's not right for this role, but it may be right for this other role. Have you ever considered that? And, that way we can really, you know, we talk about human potential here, at Inforum. That's the real tool, real tangible way that we can really find the human potential in every single person, no matter what their profile looks like, or strengths, or weaknesses, or faults, as you say. Whatever-- >> Whatever it is, right? >> Whatever they come with we can find the right fit. >> Does technology, generally, and say artificial intelligence or machine intelligence, specifically, can it moderate or adjudicate human bias? Or, does it actually reinforce it? >> Yeah, that's a very good question, and obviously very pertinent to today. I think, a couple of things. So, the assessment I'm speaking of, we would never rely on the machine to make a decision. So, it's telling you, as a manager, here are some of the gaps that a particular individual has towards the role that you are planning to hire them for, but we suggest that you ask these interview questions, and make a decision for yourself. So, you really can't replace that human intervention in the process, that human judgment, their sense from an interview, but it really helps them hone the interview in on the things that they really should focus on. Figuring out, are we comfortable with those gaps? Does the person realize they have those gaps? And, really, for both the candidate and the manager to make the right decision. So, in the assessment it's always, we never rely on the machine to make a decision. But, it is incumbent on us to make sure that as we're designing these tools, as we're designing the technology behind them that we have as much diversity in the people who are designing them as possible. To make sure they're being designed in a way that doesn't have bias built into them. And, that's why it's so important for us to have diversity in technology. Why we're doing SB code. Why we believe in bringing up people from all backgrounds to participate in technology, 'cause it's so important to have that diversity, as we're building this stuff. >> Can't take the humans out of the equation, yet. >> There's still some gut check, right, there's still some intuition that has to come into play here. >> Yeah, absolutely, and that's one of the attributes of humans that we, machines can't replace yet. So, that ability to empathize, the ability to show all the emotional skills, we know machines can't do that today, maybe someday they will. But, today they can't, so humans will bring that. But, I really think that the power comes in the combination of AI, and machines, and humans. And, that's what we're talking about here around human potential. It's the power of the combination of the two. And, I think we will see that that combination will be required for a very long time, before machines take over the world (laughs) >> I always tell the story, John and I interviewed Garry Kasparov. >> That was great. >> The great chess champion. >> Chess master. >> When he lost to the IBM supercomputer, instead of giving up he said, "I'm going to beat the supercomputer", so he took machines plus humans to beat the supercomputer, so to this day the greatest chess player in the world is a machine and a supercomputer. So, that is a great example of augmentation. Now, it probably doesn't work so well for autonomous vehicles, but-- (all laughing) >> Well now, thanks for being with us. Thanks for sharing the story. We appreciate that, the time. And, if you see our application come down the pike-- >> Okay (laughs) >> Flag us where we're deficient, if you would, please. >> You'll be welcome, you're welcome. >> Excellent (laughs) >> Thanks for having me. >> Thank you, Anne Benedict, thanks for being with us. We'll be back with more here on theCUBE. We're live in the nation's capitol, Washington D.C. >> That was awesome. >> Thank you. (upbeat electronic music)

>> Live from Washington, D.C., it's theCUBE! Covering Inforum D.C. 2018. Brought to you by Infor. >> Good afternoon, and welcome back to the Walter Washington Convention Center, we're at Inforum 2018, here live on theCUBE, John Walls with Dave Vellante, and it's a pleasure now to welcome the CEO of Infor, Charles Phillips with us. Charles, good to see ya! >> Good to see you guys again, another year. It's great, it's great. >> Yeah, I tell ya, you are a man of demand aren't you? I mean, tell me about the week so far for you, how it's gone, and just your overall thoughts about the show? >> Yeah, it's been a fun Inforum for 2018 here. Great attendance, and a lot of energy level, and the common feedback we get is you guys just keep innovating and bringing new things, this is great, and that's why they come, they want to see what we're working on and kind of dream the art of the possible. We know what you, what we think you get a couple years ago, but if we don't have someone pushing us and painting a picture of what we could be doing, and we just think we might be missing it, so we want to hear it first hand. So that's what the conference is about, and hopefully they got that. >> Well, certainly thematically, human potential, you talk about that, you see that on the keynote stage, that's been a very consistent theme with our guests here, we've heard that a lot, you hear it down on the show floor. Talk about the theme if you would, a little bit, in terms of it's development, where that came from, and in how you think that's being expressed here this week. >> Well, we're one of the few companies that build mission critical operational systems, be it manufacturing or hospital operations, but we're also in HCM in a big way. And so we were talking to kind of both sides of the house, for some applications you're talking to the line of business manager, but for HCM you're talking to the CHRO, and rarely were those two people talking, and we saw obvious synergies. Don't you want to know how your people are doing, how to allocate people, and how they're performing, how they're changing the outcomes on a manufacturing floor or in a hospital, and a lot of HR directors weren't thinking like that because they think of HR, and they have their own world, they go to HR conferences and that's it. And the manufacturing guys are the same thing, and so we're trying to bring these two worlds together and say "Actually, you're in the same business, it's the same goals, and you actually could help each other a lot." And so by focusing on putting the employee at the center of all these applications and mapping all these operational processes to HR data, it's a different way of thinking about the role of HR. They can actually help drive the business, not just be an administrative function, and so it's resonating with a lot of the CHROs we met with, 'cause they want a seat at the table, they want to be more strategic, and this is a way for them to do that and at the same time the operational people want to know how their people are doing, want to develop talent, and want to know what are the tools out there I could be doing differently, and how am I doing, and which employees are working the best So, I think we can bring both sides together. >> So I first met Infor through AWS, at re:Invent, Pam Murphy came on, and we were like Infor? Back then it was like 2012, 2013 was kind of Infor who? And then we were invited to New Orleans, and then started to learn more about your micro-vertical strategy and a little bit about the platform, it was somewhat opaque to me. And now, fast forward last year and this year it's really starting to come in to view. The OS, the platform vision, the Birst acquisition, and of course Coleman, and I'm a sucker for platform plays especially when there's real R&D behind it that's actually having a business impact. So I wonder if you could talk about that piece of the strategy, I love the stack, was that sort of always your vision and now you're getting aggressive in it, did it sort of come together serendipitously, how'd we get here? >> Having our own stack and a platform was always the vision, but it's a lot harder to do than it sounds like, and it takes time. And so, when we arrived almost eight years ago, there were different applications, all had their own separate stacks and would say "This is not going to work." So, we need, just to be able to scale, to be able to serve multiple industries with different products, we can't have every development organization building their stack as well. So we set about taking that away from the development groups we're going to do this as a shared service, but it takes time, and as we build it you will adopt components of it. So what's changed is we've built out the entire stack, so, starting with ION, with integration, then we added document management, workflow, analytics, now AI and a lot of other services, Mongoose, platform as a service, on and on and on, in collaboration, those things took time, they're all on a single platform, federated security, single siloed across it all, and now it makes the developers job who's developing apps so much simpler. So they have Infor OS for the immediate platform, for cloud services they have AWS, I don't have to worry about any of those things anymore, just go and develop industry functionality. So, it's come together nicely, but the fact that we had the time to do it and the money to do it, and we weren't public, and we told our investors "This is the only way this is going to scale, this is the future, and it'll pay out later, you just got to trust us." And now that we've gotten there, they're seeing the synergy and go "Okay, now we see why you did that." >> So, Michael Dell's been on theCUBE many times, he used to talk about the 90 day shot clock, we obviously see what he's done in terms of transforming; but I want to talk about your business a little bit, because you've had that patient capital, I mean you're a quasi-public company in the sense that you do report so we can see the numbers on the income statement, but the income statement doesn't really tell the whole story It's about three billion in revenue, several hundred billion dollars on the balance sheet, but if you look at the SaaS component of it it looks rather small, maybe about 25% of the business, but from a booking standpoint I'm sure it's much, much larger than that. So how should we interpret the income statement in terms of the momentum in your business, where is all the action? >> So as a percentage of our sales, it's the highest of any of our competitors, so, about 70% of our new sales are on SaaS, we have about a $700 million SaaS business, so it's growing. There's nothing we can do about the maintenance piece of it, if it's related to perpetual, so if you take that out, it's a big percentage of our business. And over time the maintenance will turn into SaaS, so that's one of our big opportunities to look at that maintenance space and say "Move those over to cloud customers." and that's usually a financially lucrative thing for us to do, because we do even more for them, because they usually add on four or five other products when they move, they replace these third party products and so we get a bigger suite of products if they decide to move to the cloud. So that's part of the strategy, that's what UpgradeX is, let's move you from on-premise, so that maintenance revenue will turn into SaaS revenue, but bigger SaaS revenue over time. >> So let me make sure I understand, so it's not the classic case where you see a lot of software companies that are going from a perpetual model to a ratable model, you're goin' from a maintenance model which is ratable to a ratable model which is SaaS, but there's cohorts sales which increase the top line, is that correct? >> Exactly. So usually, because of what we do, we're doing something mission critical. So if you're going to take that, then you should do ACM financials, all the other things around it. So why would I move to core and leave the edge on-premise? So, almost by definition we have to do the whole suite. So when we do that it expands the deal, 'cause on-premise we may have been one vendor with 30 other ones existing, but the whole reason they want to get out of all of that is to move to the cloud and simplify. So we can't take all that with us, so we have to have the full suites, we've built that now. So now we can move them, but, it expands the size of the deal because we're replacing all these other products. >> Okay, and then some of the stats, just correct me if I don't get this right. Your SaaS business grown 50% faster than Oracle's, growing at a rate, I'd say 2X SAP's and a rate comparable to Workday, are those correct figures? >> Those are correct, and profitable. >> Oh, and profitable. >> Throw that in. (all laugh) >> Right, so okay. And then last year Koch Industries invested, so you kind of recap the company, you've made a big deal about that. One of the things that we've noted is you're seeing a tailwind there in terms of guys like Accenture and Capgemini, we've asked them "Do you guys service Koch Industries?" they said "Yep!" they helped us see the opportunity, and they said "Look, look for something substantive, we're not going to try to force you to do something, but we want you to take a look." So that's been helpful. Talk about that and maybe other things Koch has brought to the table? >> It's a, the relationship with the integrators is evolving, it probably was not a plus for us in the first four, five years. More recent years we've won enough deals where they had to say "Okay, we can't keep losin' these deals." And where they wanted to get engaged. Koch helped, because they had relationships and they wanted to run that business, that's why they're implementing our products globally, and so, they're a large customer for all of these guys, and one of the largest for Deloitte for instance, but what's really more-- that helped, but it was more the, what was happening in the market, the fact that we're in a Liberty Steel and replace SAP, or that we're in a Travis Perkins interview with SAP and Microsoft, so, if you're on the wrong side of those deals enough times your manager starts to ask you what's goin' on, and you got all these people on the bench here, okay, we train them for Infor if they're winning in that region, or in that industry. So, we just had to earn our way into it, our initial strategy was not one that, at least on the surface, looked like it was integrator-friendly because we were trying to take all those mods they like to do and put 'em in the product, and that's the whole thesis, let's the take the vertical industry features and let's put it in there once, I don't want everybody customizing my apps, we do that. And so now they've had to move up, okay we can do other things, configuration, changed management, there's AI, there's other things you can do, but you're not going to do that. So now that they've accepted that, there's a basis for us to work together, and, it just had to take time to get there. >> What can you tell us about where you want to go with this? I mean you've presided over public companies before, you know that business well, you were a rockstar analyst, is there an advantage to being a public company, is that something that you eventually want to do? >> I would say there are pluses and minuses, our board is evaluating that, that's going to be their call. The upside is, it would solve probably our biggest challenge which is brand recognition, almost instantly, because would be a top 10 tech IPO. It makes it a little easier to hire people because they can see public currency, they can value more quickly, and it gives you some acquisition currency; so those are the positives. But then you're on the 90 day cycle, and we're kind of on that anyway, 'cause we report publicly and we have publicly traded bonds. So for us it's, in some sense we have the worst of all worlds, right? We have the discipline of being a public company, and the scrutiny, without the capital, (laughs) and the branding, so. I think that's what everybody's evaluating. Every bank on Wall Street's visiting us telling us to go now, the window's great, you have the numbers. >> Oh, of course. (Dave and John laugh) >> And so, so we could do it, I just don't know what their decision's going to be. The advantages to being private as well, you have a little more flexibility obviously, and, we don't need the capital, we have plenty of capital coming from Koch and others who want to invest. >> Well, the flip side of that too, is you get to write your own narrative, right? >> Yeah. >> I mean, we're talkin' about the nuances of the income statement, the Street is obviously right now hooked on growth heroin, and if you got the transition in the base it doesn't become a tailwind, so, no rush from that standpoint. I want to pivot to the theme of this event, which is the human potential. My understanding is you sort of were instrumental in coming up with that. HCM this year got a big play on stage, where's that come from? >> Yeah, just as I talk to CEOs who are struggling to find talent, like I mentioned on stage 6.7 million jobs that are unfulfilled. It's not like we don't have people here, we have people here with their own skills, so, you're not going to fill those jobs any other way, we're not doing immigration to any degree and scaling more, that's been shut down. We have an aging population with the baby boomers, so the most logical thing that you would do is train people who are already here who want to work. And, let's take people who have jobs that they probably aren't thrilled about, and give them different skills so they can fill these 6.7 million jobs. So to do that, you have to make these applications easier to use, and I felt like we're probably in the best position to do it because we actually know what they do for a living, 'cause we wrote all those last features in those industries, we understand what they do. And if you're just doin' HR replication or financials, you actually have no idea what they do. So, we had to learn those jobs to automate those jobs, so we can find ways to use our HCM applications to better train people, professional development, coaching, take all these HR skills, and put them as part of the applications in the context of while you're working. >> We had Anne Benedict on just a little bit ago talking about really a test case that you can be for yourself. So how are you putting these things to practice yourself, and how are you working out maybe some kinks before you take them out to somebody else? And so, you can leverage your own success for your own success, and also learn from mistakes too I would think. >> We do. So we have this program called Infor at Infor, where everything we do, we want it to be on an Infor product, which was not the case when we arrived. Like a lot of companies, a mish mash of different things, and so we've implemented not only HR Financials of course, Birst, but the big innovation has really been talent science, that every employee we hire has to take that test, and all the executives have taken it as well. And what we've discovered is, is that, when people hire and go against the talent science recommendation, 68% of the time they end up being wrong. So it's better at judging people than people are sometimes, and you can't use it exclusively, but it'll tell you these are the things you should look into, some questions you might want to ask, here's how they rate on certain skillsets, they're very well meshed for this job, they look like they'd see their best performance in this area, but ask these questions. And so people don't know how to interview and how to think about this, and so, having a guide to go into an interview is actually pretty helpful. We hire much better people now by using that. >> So it's like StrengthsFinder in a way? >> No, it's different from that, this is AI, it's kind of Moneyball for business people. >> Well you're talking about that today, almost there. >> Yeah so it's 39 personality attributes, behavioral attributes we call them, so, empathy, resistance to authority, do you have the ambition or not, and depending on the job, you think all those things are good, depends on the job, so. For some jobs, it's actually better to have low ambition because, a lot of our customers who have low wage, fast food service jobs, people who have ambition are going to leave in four months, right? They're not going to stay, so, okay we're not going to be here long, at least know that going in, and know who wants to get promoted, and other people are fine with it. And so it depends on the mix of skills, just like I said, 39 attributes, and for that job role, you tune it to the people who like that job, they look like this. And, we've also found that it's 60% more diverse when you hire using science, because you don't know that when you're looking at the data, what they look like. >> It must've been super interesting getting those reports. You took it, obviously right? >> Yeah I took it. >> How'd you do? (laughs) >> Uhhh, nobody really likes their profile. (all laugh) >> I was going to say, I imagine I would be really defensive about this, oh I don't know. >> This can't be right! >> That is not me! I am not like that! (all laughing) >> Every person on our executive team said the same thing so. That's what it's for is to, you have certain perceptions even about yourself, and it calls it out, right? And there's no gaming the system because the questions have no right or wrong answer, it just puts you in scenarios that you answer what would you do, how do you feel about this? You're not clear what they're trying to get at, and you only have 27 minutes or 22 minutes to do the test. >> So you can't game it? >> You can't game it. >> Data doesn't lie! >> And we built the science, we know when someones trying to game it, they're taking to long on multiples, and changing their answers too much, so it's-- And we've now, I think we've tested some 200 million people over time, over years, so we have 20 years of data about people. >> That's, I mean, sounds unique, certainly unique of being infused into enterprise software, I've not seen anything like this from another enterprise software company. Can you confirm that, or? >> Yeah, so, we're the only ones that do this at scale, there's a few startups trying to do it, but they're trying to do it all facial recognition which is, we think pretty ridiculous, we're trying to get away from physical attributes not use that. So there's a company out there doing that, depending on your facial movements, but this is, we're eliciting responses about your personality in response to situations that we give you, and have a bunch of scientists that crunch the data and they basically shape it to the job role. And they test your best performance, and you get a DNA profile for your best performance for that job role, and then, that's what you're matching, and it's highly accurate. So we had a company on the Las Vegas Strip use it, because they have to hire in volume a lot, and essentially what they wanted to do was get better blackjack dealers. You need somebody that's good at math, good under pressure, not too emotive, don't give away anything; and so we did that, fine tuned the test, they call us back nine months later and said "We need you to change the test." We said "We did exactly what you wanted, what happened?" He said well, the winnings went up 30%, but everybody's leaving the hotel in 24 hours 'cause they lost all their money, so we don't need them to be that good. (all laugh) >> Dial it down a little bit. >> Which we did. And so that's part of the service is we fine tune it, you tell us what your goals are, and we'll tune to that. >> That's a great story. The other surprise for me this week has been the emphasis on robotic process automation, it's a space that we've kina looked at. And a lot of people are scared about software robots replacing humans, but if you talk to people who are using RPA, they love it. It's taking away these mundane tasks, I didn't realize that you guys had such capabilities there? >> Yeah, so we built that as part of a Coleman RPA platform, and not only can we automate and use RPA for ourselves, but we've built a whole development environment for our customers to build their own, 'cause we can't think of every process that they might want to automate, and we gave that platform to our partners as well, so. We don't want them doing database schema work anymore, and they used to get paid for that, there's other things you can do up the stack in AI, here's what we want you to focus on. So we had that meeting on Monday with the partners, and they all agreed that's what we're going to do. But there's tons of mundane things that people shouldn't be spending time on, and they can be much more productive, it makes them more loyal to the company, they're enjoying their job more, and they're thinking and innovating more. So I don't see it as replacing people, as making people better. And giving that engagement that I talked about during the keynote, they're engaged now, because they can do things that are more value adding now. >> So, back to New Orleans next year? That's the first Inforum that theCUBE was ever at was in N'Orleans, and, jazz, you like jazz, obviously, right? >> I like jazz, I met with the mayor when I was down there, Mitch Landrieu at the time, and he became a customer after that meeting, so the city of New Orleans runs on Infor software, it's another reason to go there; so thank you. >> You've get--nice. >> Yeah, thank you Mitch, so that worked well. And so as a thank you we're going back down there, they're a big customer now, and it's always fun, you know what I mean, you know. >> That's great. >> Just, before you go, you mention, I watched in the keynote this morning, Brooks Koepka. >> Yes. So you're working with him. I do a little bit of work on the golf side as well, so I was just intrigued because, he's not the, well he's not Tiger, right? >> Yeah. >> U.S. Open Champion, twice over. What was the attraction to him, and then can you play in the golf world a little bit, and with those brands, and is that an entry into that world? >> Well, we always like to bet on the scrappy guy, the next up and coming generation guy, and that's kind of our brand that's what we are, the Brooklyn Nets, someone who's not quite there yet, but they're moving up, that's kind of our scrappiness, that's why we like the whole Brooklyn image as well. And we started talkin' to him, like I said, before he won the U.S. Open, because he was ranking pretty high, moving up, but wasn't well known. A quite guy, very personable when you meet him, we thought he'd be good in front of clients, let's bet on his career, and we're going to work with him; and literally three weeks later he wins the U.S. Open, we go "Okay." (all laugh) >> Good grab! >> We'll take it! (laughs) So, we didn't even think it'd happen that quickly, and now he's a rockstar so. We were planning on hosting a CX event with him, and, we're not sure how many people are going to come, but when that happened, now, everybody RSVP'd right away of course. So now it's doing exactly what we wanted. >> Do you play golf? >> I don't play golf, I just started playing, 'cause we were doing these golf tournaments with customers over the last year, but I haven't had enough time to get out there yet. >> I'll bet Brooks would give you a lesson or two. (laughs) >> Yeah, he, a lot of people want to lesson from him. >> Charles thank you >> Alright, thank you guys, >> for the time, great show. >> Good to see ya again. See ya in New Orleans. >> Thank you, yeah. >> Congratulations. >> Alright guys, see ya. >> Wonderful week here in Washington, D.C. Back with more live on theCUBE here from D.C. right after this. (bubbly music)

>> Live from Washington DC, it's theCUBE. Covering Inforum DC 2018. Brought to you by Infor. >> Well good afternoon, and welcome back here on theCUBE as we continue our coverage here at Inforum 2018, live from Washington, DC. We're in the Washington Convention Center centrally located, I got to tell ya. The White house less than a mile that way, Capital Hill's just right up the street as well. We're kind of caught in the middle. Bad spot to be these days! (laughing) >> I hope you're not setting the tone for this. >> We'll leave that alone. >> I like being in the middle, personally. (laughing) I'll take it from both sides. >> When you sit in the middle of the road, there's a six inch yellow line, you get it equally hard from both sides. >> Bring it on! >> So, lets stay away from that. Dave Vellante, John Walls and Rod Johnson, who is the EVP of Manufacturing and Supply Chain, and the GT Nexus Business Unit at Infor. Rod, good to see you Sir! >> Great to be here, thanks guys. >> You're okay with being in the middle? >> Yeah, sure! Yeah, of course. >> Independent thought, right? I love it. >> Middle of the road. It's the place to be. >> So you're the new kid on the block, right? >> One of them, yeah. >> You've been here, just at Infor for a few months now, assuming the EVP role. How's it been for you so far? >> Hey, it's been a breath of fresh air. I was 11 years with one of our competitors, the Oracle Corporation. Its quite a breath of fresh air. Go with a company that's agile, innovative, much more customer centric. I think the timing is perfect for a company like Infor, that's really grown up in these key industries and working with customers for over decades. Now its made this transition to the Cloud, and now I think all the markets are waking up. It's not just CRM or HR, they're looking at: How do I take advantage of all this innovation, the Cloud's the platform, and who's the companies that really understand our type of business, whether you're a distribution company, or a food company, or an A&D Company. So it's a great time to be here, there's a lot of good energy, a lot of good innovation. A lot of good buzz from the customers about what we're doing. >> Necessity is the mother of invention, as the saying goes. I mean, you're right. The model of just having an install base that you can have locked in and just keep milking is very hard to do these days. Unless, you know, some of the private equity guys have done it, that's clearly not the case here at Infor. You know, Oracle is successful at it. I think it's because they do spend a lot of money on R&D, but boy oh boy! That model, you can't just go and reinvent that. >> Right. >> You're going to fail. >> Right. >> And if you're trying to hold on to that model, maybe they're the exception that proves the rule, but you're going to be toast. You know, in the long run. So you see what Amazon's doing, you see what Microsoft; how Microsoft completely pivoted away from that model. >> Right, Right. >> And Infor's riding that wave. >> Right, right. Hey, this is a business model. Fundamental business model change. You know, we can talk a lot about the technology, but transitioning from a product company that sells a license that sits on a maintenance base is a model that's no longer viable for what customers expect. They want a service provider that's delivering continuous innovation in service, and that's a big change. That's a big change to how we engage with our customers, how we support them, the service levels we're committing to. So, I lived through a bunch of that stuff at Oracle, transitioning to the cloud had a role for the last six years; doing that both from a sales and a global strategy role. Here, we're trying to do it better, faster, and never lose sight of the customer. >> So, you've serviced the manufacturing sector. >> Yeah, yeah. >> It's still a lot of Infor's business that install base and that maintenance. You're in the process of transitioning those customers. >> Yeah. >> So, that takes a lot of care, a lot of feeding, cause anytime there's a transition everybody wants a piece of that action. So how's that going, what's the conversation like, and why should they stay with Infor? >> The conversation is, One: We really believe in a pragmatic business-led path to the Cloud. There's not going to be any forced march, no technology agenda that's going to drive us. It's got to be driven by value. We've got to present a business case to them that makes sense. That makes them more productive, now allows them to better engage with their customers, delivers innovation to their supply chain. So that's what we're spending a lot of time talking about. What's the case for change? What's the business case for change? I mean, all of the stuff about operating the Cloud, the service levels, potential total co-services, great! But, at the end of the day we deal with pretty, we're dealing with manufacturers. They're pretty down to earth. They know that they make their money building stuff, and shipping stuff and servicing that product. So we got to be engaged at that level, to show them how we help them do that better. I think the excitement is growing. That they recognize that there is real net new business value, new innovation that could really help their business. >> So lets talk about that. Forced march is a powerful phrase and you certainly see that in the industry. Thinking about supply chain, and the opportunities to drive even more efficiencies out of the supply chain, maybe through automation, we've heard a lot about RPA. >> Yeah. >> Maybe even bring back some of that offshore manufacturing. >> Right. >> That's certainly a conversation >> Right. >> that's going on in your world, so talk about that a little bit. >> Yeah, so one of our diamonds in the Infor portfolio is a product called GT Nexus. Which is, its been around for about 20 years. We have 65,000 companies around the world who are operating on a common network based platform that provides supply chain visibilities, supplies supply chain financial processing. Connects brands to their manufacturers to provide all the visibility and control and that. So, that's a powerful capability because you're right, it's an incredibly dynamic time. With the change of trade wars, weather events that are ever increasing. The supply chain's a very hard thing to manage. So if the asset is we've got a platform that enables companies to connect much deeper in their supply chain then use that information to make far better decisions on how they get their products to their customer at the right cost. So, and I see, you know the supply chain market, I always think of this transition to Cloud in waves. You know, we had the first wave breaking was the sales. Then the HR, the finance function. Operations in supply chains is the one that's cresting on the horizon. And you know, keep that going, we've got our surfboards in the water, we've got great capability. And we're really, really excited about what we can do for our clients! >> You got to ride the waves or you'll become driftwood >> How big is that wave? >> Well, hey that's the biggest market, right? I mean, you look at the size of the Enterprise software spend. Core ERP supply chain industry functionality is the big piece. It's probably two. It's probably by an HR, CRM, financials together, and it's not even as big as sort of the industry supply chain, manufacturing, procurement market core ERP market. So, its big! Its a big opportunity, but it requires a much more sophisticated response because you talk to our customers they're like hey, we operate our plants 365 days a year, three shifts sometimes in peak seasons. We can't afford an environment that isn't mission critical, that doesn't step up to service levels. So, you know, we're working really hard to address the mission critical system challenge, not just the benefits and payroll. >> So, there's certainly an opportunity with AI, with machine learning, certainly more analytics, bringing that to the manufacturing world. >> Oh yeah. >> So that's clearly fundamental to your strategies. >> Yeah. >> Is that, in your view, the tipping point to get really this whole market moving? >> I think. I mean I would agree with you. Its sort of an accumulation of digital capabilities. Certainly, mobility's sort of proved that its important, but its a little bit of a nice-to-have. Some of the innovations around user experiences, is really important but nice-to-have. I think that is the game changer. When you can use data as a weapon, a competitive weapon that you can make decisions faster, and how you discount your product or how you identify shortage faster than someone else. That's where, there's real money that comes out of that. >> What about Block Chain? We hear a lot about Block Chain in the supply chain and cutting out the middle man. We haven't heard much here about it, its not something. We're going to ask Charles. Somebody said to me, Once Charles gets on it, boom the company is behind it. >> Yeah. >> But, how real is that in manufacturing and supply chain specifically? Is it just way too early? Do you think there's potential there? Have you looked at it? >> Obviously we've looked at it, we've worked on with customers on prototypes. There's a couple areas, you know, there's a lot of hype as you guys know. You talked to a lot of us, a lot of hype in that space. It's certainly unproven in a lot of areas. But we think in the area of supply chain financing, Block Chain has a very, very powerful, you know, where you have multi parties, you've got suppliers and logistics companies and banks all who need a piece of information. We need distributed capabilities around that. We think there's a big potential in some of that area. We're talking. We're working with some of the banks on that. We think in the area of getting deeper into the supply chain around sustainability, to the ethical and traceability of the Supply Chain. You know, where you're goin down. Yeah we got customers in the pero business that are going down to the farms. They want to know exactly the lineage of all of their stuff that's going into their product that's ending up in a consumer. That's potentially a more efficient mechanism, to have all these different entities collaborating on a distributed model. So, I mean; and especially if we talk about the GT Nexus Network. There's natural extensions to it. That it already is a common platform that is serving a wide variety of companies, logistics companies, and manufacturers. So there's a lot of natural exit points from that, sort of, that integrated network to support a couple of these more extended processes that are a little bit more distributed. >> Yes, the smart contracts maybe fits there, and you talked about distributed a couple of times. What about IOT? The pendulum seems to be swinging now. Obviously Cloud is hot. Its got a re-centralization. But IOT's a whole new world. You get a lot of IT companies kind of pushing the IT model top down into operations technology and we don't think that's the way it's going to work. That the OT guys are actually going to drive the standards and the trends. What are you seeing? >> Well I think yeah hey, the people that have the, that make the equipment, you know, make the pipelines. Hey, obviously they got a big stake in this. You know, they understand how their kipid works, they know how to attach the sensors. They know how to translate things that are going on in the machines into data. We're going to be, and we're going to be taking that data, and how do you connect it to a business process. That's something that they don't understand. They don't understand how a heat event could translate, could connect to a maintenance process and how do you deploy a technician with the right part to go in there so they can offer some proactive service? So I think there's going to be a very tight partnership, where people coming from the equipment up, or the asset up, connect with the people that understand process analytics and sort of execution. >> Yeah. You talked about sustainability there just a moment ago, so obviously companies, their focus is changing in that regard. Right? People are paying more attention, a lot of that is being customer driven. >> Right >> At the same time too, in terms of distribution, in terms of manufacturing, customer expectations are changing too. Right? >> Right. >> We expect things on a much different time table. >> Absolutely. >> So how are you helping your clients recognize all those things? Like you're thinking about tomorrow today, and trying to get them to address that in terms of their technology plays down the road to meet these really fast changing demands. >> Yeah, I mean one of our really dominant industries is distribution. You know, probably three out of five distribution companies around the world run our software. So distribution is a space, typically between the manufacturing world and the consumer or the retail world is under tremendous pressure. While Amazon is inching into distribution centric industry so there's a lot of pressure from that, but there's also rising expectations that you have to do instantaneous fulfillment. That you have to provide complete visibility into where my order is, when am I going to get it, because I don't want to carry this supply. You got to carry it. So we're seeing a big rejuvenation of that industry, a little because of the pressures driving them to rethink e-commerce, to rethink the types of services they're providing to their companies. That even in some cases they're sneaking into retail, and having that type of experience because they need to compete in different ways. And I think that's always, the industry change is good for companies like us that have a lot of experience in the industry cause we can help them! Ya know, and they need a catalyst, right? They need a catalyst to go out and change and rethink how they operate, and it's created a pretty interesting opportunity. >> So, I wonder Rod if you could talk a little bit about, I know you're only a few months in, but just your impressions of the differentiation. Give us the bumper sticker pitch. Why Infor? How are you different? >> So, I mean, three things. Just netted out three things. Industry, and we talk a lot about industry. We talk a lot about last mile, its real. Its compelling to our customers. They're tired of having to finish the software for the vendor at their site. They want the provider to finish the software and take it to meet their unique needs. Two is I think even though we're smaller than some of the big, big names out there, I think pound for pound we out innovate almost every company. And I can talk very specifically, transitioning from a very, very large competitor. When you're actually looking into the detail of what we've actually delivered around AI, or what we've actually delivered around analytics or mobility, and pound for pound we fight way above our weight on that front. And I think, you know, if you look at even what we've done at Hook and Loop Digital over the years, the types of proof points we have with customers are something that very few of our competitors could boast. So I think, digital over use term, but just sort of understanding how this new technology works and being able to translate that to our customers is huge. And three, is culture. I think we have a fast oriented culture. There's not a lot of levels. We can cut through the nonsense for our customers pretty quickly. We organize around our customers, we don't have 3,000 sales teams trying to sell them piece parts so we can do the solution thing. And we're really working hard to differentiate on customer centricity. I made the comment yesterday at our executive forum that, in general, service at Enterprise Software stinks. You wouldn't accept, ya know, if a retailer was treating you the way the average Enterprise Software, you wouldn't accept it, right? You'd go somewhere else. We've had the benefit, or we've had customers that have such big investments in us, they have to deal with it. And we need to, we have an opportunity to fix that, to change that, to really reorganize and reorient our customer around the outcomes that matter to them. And its so important, if they're going to trust us. And its really about trust. They got to trust us to run their applications, our mission critical applications in our Cloud. We need to really change the game on that front, and we're doing a lot of things structurally. Like for example, maybe someone talked about were taking development customer support in Cloud operations, integrating that into a common organization. So, there's no finger pointing. If something goes down, its not well its the network, Its a bug, Its a knowledge issue. It's one team that's accountable for making sure that we resolve that issue rapidly. Same on the field side. So now we're organizing for manufacturing and distribution. Really, all the resources we need to both sell and service, deliver for our customers in a common team, so there's accountability. And on both sides. There's our product side, product and Cloud ops side, there's accountability and from a sort of customer engagement or accounts management accountability. And then, you know, we got to do a lot of things around service and automation, and better, proactive. We're running their cloud, we should be able to tell them, hey, this isn't running optimally. We need to come in and do this change. I mean, that's where we need to get. That's where the industry needs to get. And we want to get there first. >> Well, you're on the right path. >> Yeah. >> Again, congratulations on the new position, >> Yeah, thank you! >> and we appreciate the time here today, and wish you all the best down the road. >> I appreciate what you guys do. I love your show and content. >> Thank you, Rod. We appreciate that. Thank you sir. Back with more here on theCUBE. We are at Inforum 2018. We're in Washington, DC. (electronic jingle)

>> Live from Washington DC, it's theCUBE, covering Inforum DC 2018, brought to you by Infor. >> Well, good morning. Welcome back here on theCUBE. We are live in Washington DC, at Inforum 2018. You can tell, Infor's just over the shoulder here. We're on top of the show floor, looking down, and a lot of buzz, a lot of activity out there. Good to be a part of that excitement here in DC. I'm John Walls, along with Dave Vellante, and we're joined by, he said, "Just call me Soma." Soma Somasundaram, who's the CTO at Infor. Soma, good job on the keynote stage this morning. Thanks for joining, appreciate that. >> Yeah, and yesterday. >> Yup, yup, thanks. >> So, talk about a couple of new products, one launched, one in beta. Why don't you go ahead and tell our audience a little bit about that, about what you're bringing to the marketplace now? >> Yeah, so, you know, we have, you know, as I mentioned in today's keynote, we're all about product innovation, and we're engineers. Charles is an engineer, I'm an engineer, and we're constantly driving new innovation. So, some of the innovation, there's fundamentally, we want to build what I would call a shared services platform that all of our cloud suites can utilize. There's no need for each of the applications to go reinvent the wheel to build a middleware, or a data lake, or an API layer, so we built a shared services platform, which is what we called Infor OS. As part of Infor OS, we continued to release new things. You heard today, we released something called Infor Go. As the name might suggest, the idea is that you as an employee in one of the customer organizations, you want to have, easily go to the app store, download something called Infor Go, it automatically is configured for your role. It gives you, if let's say you're a salesperson, it gives you access to CRM data, to curate your pipeline, it gives you access to employee data, because you're an employee of the organization, gives you ability to file expense reports, because you're a traveler. You get the idea. So, in a role, you don't want to be dealing with 20 different apps. It's just one thing. You just go in, one sign on, you get access to everything you need. That's one announcement we made. That's on the technology side. And on the functional side, you know, we launched a new CRM this morning, and the idea there again is that, we're in the CRM business not to build a horizontal CRM. Our idea is, you build, anything you do must be industry-specific, right? When you are selling and servicing an excavator, and you are a dealer of moving equipment, you want to know what kind of configuration installed, what kind of accessories I can sell to this farmer, what kind of terrain they're operating on. That is industry-specific. So to us, that is important. That's what we're doing with CRM. We built it on obviously our own platform, technology platform, multi-tenant, running in the cloud, but the main differentiation is industry, right? So that's something we announced. We've been on building a next generation HCM suite, which we talked about a lot yesterday. The final piece of that is payroll, which is important. So that payroll, which just went beta this morning. It's all built on the exact same platform, with Infor OS, multi-tenant, and it's highly extensible, so that completes our HCM suite on a unified platform. Those were the announcements we made today. >> So I wanted to talk a little bit about the platform. So last year, after Inforum 17, I wrote a blog post, and I put up the strategy and technology stack, and I kind of missed the OS underneath. So we'll come back and maybe course-correct that. But one of the problems with enterprise software, especially suites, is there are a lot of cul-de-sacs. You go down a road, and then you hit a dead end, and then you have to come all the way back, and if you want some other function, you have to go down and come all the way back, and it's a very frustrating user experience. So, I'm inferring that what you guys have done is try to address that and other problems with a platform approach. So a platform, in my view, beats products. So maybe talk about platform and what that means to you guys, and then I would love to get into the sort of conceptual and actual stack. >> Yeah, so, it is what should be common sense, in my opinion, that if you buy a HCM suite from a provider of software, you buy ERP from that same provider, you buy travel and expense application from the same provider. You would think that they all have the same user experience, and are integrated out of the box, they all seamlessly work together, with single sign-on. That would be a normal expectation as a customer, I would think, but unfortunately, the market's not going that way, right? Everybody's got their own, even within one company, you have multiple products, they don't work together well. Our idea is that if you buy an industry cloud suite, you must feel like it came from Infor, it all should have one single user experience, it all should work together as an integrated suite, it should all be sharing data for analytics, and so on and so forth. So that is the whole idea behind building this Infor OS. So, Infor OS has got several services underneath, starting with, you know, user experience, which is developing a hook and loop. So we have all of the controls, whether it's a dropdown box, or a grid control, or date picker, they all behave exactly the same way. Whether you're in CRM, or HCM, or inside a purchasing application, they all work the same, right? So, starting with that, then you go-- >> So if I can interrupt, so the Infor OS has the core services that you need, that the software needs to access for any function that you're building, correct? >> Exactly, yeah, yeah. >> Okay, please. >> So it's user experience, then you have integration. We have one integration layer called ION, and ION supports both an API layer, if you want to build a mobile app, you need APIs into the software, so built a lot of APIs into our applications. Those are exposed through a single gateway. There's one way to get into Infor applications through this API layer. We built that as part of Infor OS. We also built Coleman, which we announced last year. Coleman depends on two things. One, a lot of access to data, so I can crunch and do machine learning, and a lot of access to APIs. So what if you could create an acquisition, tucked into a device, versus having to open up a form, right? To do that, you need APIs. If you can order Domino's pizza from home, using Alexa, why can't you do that at work? So we built this framework for those kind of things. So it's got APIs, it's got Coleman, it's got data lake. So all of this data is in one place, so you can build analytics. We have Birst, which sits on top of the data lake, and I can go on. So that's really what we're doing with Infor OS. It's really, that's very, very important. It's not like your Intel Inside kind of thing. Without Infor OS, Infor apps don't work. >> So, if I can, if you bear with me, just to conceptualize the stack, the OS is at the bottom layer, and then you've got your micro-vertical functions as sort of the next layer, and then the cloud, which is really AWS, is the cloud infrastructure, then you've got the GT Nexus, essentially, the network commerce platform, so all those data and supply chain connection points that you have access to, Birst, the analytics, which was in acquisition last year, and then the Coleman AI completes the stack. My question is, as it relates to, for instance, Birst, that was an acquisition. So, you have to bring that in and do some engineering work to make it fit into the stack, is that right, or is it just kind of bolted on? >> No, you know, so, everything has to be done with the conscious way of design, right, so it just doesn't happen by itself. So, Birst is a fantastic world-class analytics platform, right? They as a company built a world-class platform that allows for department analytics, so if you're working in sales or working in marketing, you can go bring your own data, you can do analytics. It's great at that. At the same time, it's great at enterprise analytics, where you have all of this data in one place, you harmonize the data and do that. As a platform, it's a fantastic platform, but we're about delivering content on top of that platform, so we need to bring the network data, like you said, we need to bring the industry data, we need to bring the employee data from HCM. Bringing it all together and exposing that using Birst as the visualization layer is how we are exposing it. So to that extent, Birst was connected into the data lake, and it sits on top of the data lake, leverages that data. We built a semantic layer, which reflects the model of data that we have in the data lake, so yeah, it does, and we have the single sign-on, so it actually surfaces within Ming.le, within the homepage of a purchasing manager or whoever, and that's work, that's what we did. >> So you essentially re-platformed it. So of course, part of the due diligence is how challenging it's going to be to do that, how fast you can get that to market, but this is complicated. It requires a significant engineering resource on Infor's part. We talked about this a little bit at the analyst meeting last year, the industry analyst session. Couple things, one is the integration and exploitation of AWS cloud, and all the services there, the data pipelines, and the services there, but also modern software development. You know, microservices, and containers, and all of that good stuff. Can you talk about those sort of two dimension and any other points that you'd like to emphasize in terms of the things that Infor developers are doing to create this modern platform? >> Yeah, so, first of all, you know, we are all about applications, right, so we're not building databases, we're not building our own data centers, we're not building our own operating systems. We're a business software application company. Our belief is that if you try to verticalize and try to innovate on every single layer of what you do, it stifles innovation. Why not embrace industry's innovation, right? Can we out-spend AWS, in terms of building a cloud infrastructure? I don't think so. >> No way. >> No one can. And so, it's important to focus on what you do best, and leverage innovation that's coming in outside the four walls of Infor, to embrace that to deliver what the customer requires. So, what we really did is we took the AWS services, and we encapsulated them into our application, so when the application does disaster recovery, it's actually AWS services, right? When we call Elasticsearch, we're using AWS services there. We use DynamoDB for graphing the data in the data lake. Much like Facebook works on Open Graph, of trying to find people who are connected to each other, data inside the data lake is connected, right? Sales order is connected to a sales person. It's connected to a customer. Customer is connected to returns, and so on and so forth, so, we've done those kind of things. So, we've built a layer above the web services of AWS to actually create hooks into the application that leverages that, and we built our application itself in a sort of a microservices architecture. Granular APIs is a better way to describe how we did it, so that those granular APIs can be used in a digital project to create your own mobile app. It's the same APIs that are used in Coleman, for our digital assistant, or chat bots. All of those things require clear thought in terms of design, how you expose the functionality, and how you expose data, and that's what we did. >> Yeah, so, as a developer, in an engineering organization, having access to those primitives, those granular APIs, gives you what, greater flexibility, if the market turns, you can turn more quickly. I mean, it's more complicated, right, but it gives you finer grain control. Is that fair? >> Absolutely the case, yeah, and by the way, we know that the world is heterogeneous, right? I would love for a customer organization to just use Infor for everything, nothing else, right? But that's probably not realistic. So we built this to be able to work in a heterogeneous environment. So creating APIs and having this loosely-coupled architecture allows for that to happen. Ultimately, the customer has a choice. We obviously have to work to earn their business, but if they have other things outside of Infor that they're running in their ecosystem, you need to be able to embrace that. So this architecture actually allows for that. >> So it's the architecture, but if you're saying, if I'm a customer, and I want to run in the Google cloud, or Azure, technically, at least in theory, you can support that, but do you actually do that today, or is that sort of roadmap stuff? >> Technically, you could do that, right, but we obviously leveraged a lot of AWS services in our stack. What I meant to say in heterogeneity is that if you run a non-Infor application, right, so like, Salesforce for CRM, right? I would love for the customer to use Infor CRM, 'cause we think we are very competitive, but if they are running Salesforce, and they don't want to replace that, we need to be able to work in that environment, where it's running in a different cloud, it's running in a different architecture. So, we built Infor OS and the layer to be able to deal with that kind of hybrid deployments. >> Technically, what's the enabler there? Is it just sort of an API-based framework, or... >> It is API-based framework. It's also got federated security built into it. It's got the middleware understands, ION understands that data could come from a non-Infor system. As long as you're talking, you know, you go to United Nations, if everybody there has a headset, to really translate what anyone is saying, versus if everyone speaks English, well, world would be wonderful. >> But they spoke English yesterday. (John laughs) >> I got one more, I got one more geeky question. Anytime I get the head of engineering, you know, the CTO-- >> You love this. >> We love to get into it. The audience eats the stuff up. >> Yes. >> And we love the business talk too. But, I've heard a lot about multi-tenant architecture. My friends at servers now make a big deal about multi-instance, saying, oh, and I don't know if it's, if it can't fix a feature kind of thing, or if there's really, you know, additional value there, but the claim is it's more secure. Multi-tenant, I think conceptually, is certainly more cost-effective. What's your take on sort of multi-tenant? Why is it important? Maybe discuss the security levels that you guys engineer in, your comments. >> Yeah, yeah, if you have something that you can call it a feature, you can, like you said, but our belief is that multi-tenant architecture allows for faster innovation, easier update to the customer, to keep them current, and you know, you think about having thousands of individual instances that you have to update, on a weekly basis, because we will get to a weekly update. We are currently doing monthly update, and we get to a weekly update. That requires a natural act to create automation to be able to update all of them. I mean, there's, you know, you could argue which is really more pure, but multi-tenant architecture for us is one single application server farm that is able to work for different tenants, understanding their configuration, their business process, and operate the way they want it to be operated, but it is running in one single farm, that we can update as frequently as we need, without obviously causing disruption, so that is, I think is a good design scenario. Having said that, we actually isolate the data of a tenant, right, because you could have a scenario where all tenants' data is in one database. We don't do that. We actually insulate tenants so that data is not permeable. You can't go across tenants. So, we think that this is an elegant way to architect and keep it agile, and we can bring innovation faster to the customer. >> So when you go from monthly to weekly, to daily, to hourly, to minutely. Every customer comes with you, whereas in the multi-instance world, you actually have to plan for it. You've got to plan the migration. You're maybe N minus one, or maybe even N minus two, if that's supported, and it's more disruptive. >> That's correct. >> Okay, and then, you've got to engineer, you know, the security, and other factors. Thank you for that explanation. >> So, I always like to get back to, at the end of the day, you know, what are folks doing with what you're providing them, right? So, in kind of like your new services world, your new product world, what are some of the more, I guess, unique ways in which your customers are putting these great tools that you have to work for them, that you would like to use as kind of the poster child of success, and say, you know, we're providing this new value and these new enhancements, and give you the chance to take it to others, and use them as examples? >> Yeah, so, fundamentally, I'll be remiss if I don't start with the industry, right? So, it may not be very sexy, but ultimately, if I'm in a food and beverage industry, I really need to have a piece of software that understands that, right? Like for example, if you're an ice cream plant, you pay by part of a carton, you don't pay for the gallons of milk you get, right, so, does the software understand that? Right, if it don't, then you have to work around it, right? So, it may not sound sexy, but that's important to us, right? So, customers deploy without customization is very, very important for us. That's why we call it last man functionality. But if you flip to the technology side of things, I think that we're just scratching the surface in terms of what users want to do with Coleman. Coleman digital assistant, for example, like I earlier said about placing an acquisition target into a device. I think our idea is that every single employee of our customer organization should be using technology. Typical ERP, as it was deployed 20 years ago, only power users used it, right? Other people wrote on a piece of paper and sent it around. >> Same thing with decision support. There was like, three guys, two guys in the company who knew it. You had to go ask them to build a cube for you. >> Exactly. That doesn't scale, exactly. And we're living in a very diverse, global sort of set up. It doesn't work if you have three people who understand how to do BI, you know, two people who can create work flows, and I always like to use this example of this website called ifttt.com. I don't know if you've tried this or not. It literally stands for if this, then that. If I can go and describe something, and if this happens, then do that. Why can't we do that in enterprise software, right? Why is it that you have to go to knock on the door of IT to do it? So our idea is to bring that level of innovation, so we can innovate, our partners can innovate, customers can innovate, we don't step on each other. >> I got to ask you about a topic that we've heard a lot about this week, is robotic process automation, and you guys have essentially intimated, or at least, I've inferred that you've got quite a bit of capabilities in that regard. We're talking about software robots here, essentially, to replace sort of humans doing mundane tasks, or maybe augment humans. What is the capability that you have with RPA? Is it something that you're shipping today, and I have some follow up questions, if I may. >> Yeah, so, we built ION when we started building this years ago. We built it with the notion of build it on a data-rich architecture, right? What I mean by that is when something happens, an event happens in an application, a sales order is taken, or it's updated, give me a full copy of that document, that anyone can understand, right? That is a foundation of what you need to be able to externalize things like RPA. So we have access to the document as things happen. That's point number one. Point number two is that we built the Coleman AI platform, which we talked about earlier today. That actually leverages that workflow, as points in the workflow, to be able to go and do AI-based services that are hooks that are there in the workflow. So, where human beings need to intervene, I give an easy example. How often, like, there are people reporting to you, I do, and we get expense reports that people submit. First of all, I don't even look at them, Michelle looks at them, and do you think she opens and actually looks at how much somebody spent for dinner? No, you just push the button and approve. Why are we doing that, right? Why can't a robot figure out is there something that looks not quite right, then flag it, versus having to do this mundane work? So why can't Coleman do that? That's the way we've done it, and it's because we have a workflow engine, we have the API architecture, we have an AI platform, it's easy to wire these things together and having data externalized allows us to do that. >> So, in looking at the RPA market, there's several companies out there, and a lot of software companies, many of which are very, very complicated. You can't get your hands on the software. There is some, or maybe one in particular, it's easy, you download it, and it's low code or even no code, so I would imagine, I'm envisioning some kind of studio for a user like myself, who can, you know, is not technical, who can use it, and then maybe some kind of orchestrator, to be able to actually effect what I want done to get done. Is that something that you're shipping today, or how do I do it, as a user, and is it low code or no code? >> As an end user, if you are trying to figure out, yeah, I'll go to them to deploy, then obviously, you need a data scientist, okay? So, that part of it, we have a platform that is available for the data scientist, to be able to go look at the data, curate the data set, allow them to deploy different algorithms to figure out which one work, is the right for certain, then deploy that, and when you say deploy, it automatically creates an API, and allows for use anywhere. From an end user standpoint, like I said, this ifttt.com, you should be able to go in and say, set up your own alerts, that if I see, if you see, you know, X, Y, Z happen, let me know, or if I see X, Y, Z happen, you know, do this. So that part of capability exists in the platform, right? So, you can't completely replace data science and everything with the real end user doing it, but if you package the services in such a way that an end user can actually pick and choose and deploy, that can be done today. >> Your expense report, or approval example, and there are many, many others, so, are great, thank you for great. >> Soma, thank you, for the time too. We appreciate that. Thanks for dropping in, and again, great job on the keynote stage, and wish you success down the road here. >> Thanks a lot, appreciate it. >> I don't think you need it, though, I think you've got your, your act together really well. >> And your hands full. >> Yes, you do. A lot going on. All right, back with more here. We're live in Washington DC. You're watching theCUBE.

(upbeat music) >> Live from Washington, D.C., it's theCUBE, covering Inforum D.C. 2018, brought to you by Infor. >> Well, back here on theCUBE, we are at Inforum '18. We're in Washington, D.C. here in the Walter Washington Convention Center. Not far from the White House. It's about a mile that way, and Capitol Hill's about a mile that way, I think. I know we're right in here, but I know we are smack dab in the middle of it. Dave Vellante and John Walls and Kevin Curry, who's the SVP of the global public sector at Infor. Good to have you with us. Good to see you, sir. >> Great to be here. Thanks for your time. >> So public sector, you're in the heart of it here, and you were telling us before we went on the air that you've got more than 700 clients here at the show this week? >> We do, we do. It's the best attendance we've had yet for Inforum, and I joined about six and a half years ago. And we built this business pretty much from the ground up. So it's been a great experience, and now we're starting to get a lot of adoption within the government, across the government, from federal to state to locals. >> What's the process been like, especially across those three, because I assume they're all different? You know, local, state, federal, everybody has different pain points and there's different tolerances. >> They do, they do. I mean, there's different micro-verticals within each of those statements. As an example, if you look at local governments, it could be anything from transit agencies to K-12 schools, to public works, to police, to fire. They all have all different requirements. State's the same thing, whether it's Department of Transportation or Department of Health and Human Services. And then when you get the federal side of it, then it's from the intelligence community to Department of Defense, healthcare within Defense, like the VA and DoD and Defense agencies as well. So it's a pretty wide swatch of use cases and business cases that you need to be able to sell to. >> Charles said something interesting in the keynote today. I want to ask you about it. He said, "We made a strategic decision to go to the cloud. "We didn't want to compete with Google "and Amazon and Microsoft for CloudScale. "That didn't make any sense for us." And he said, "When we were an on-prem software vendor, "we weren't managing servers for our customers." Now what struck me there is if you look back at the software company back in the day, they really didn't care about the server, right? It was just sort of infrastructure. It was kind of irrelevant to them. The cloud feels different. It seems like a more strategic relationship with Amazon. You know, we talk about Teresa Carlson and what a force she is in the government. AWS in the GovCloud has been a huge force. They had a giant lead. So have you been able to draft off that or is it just another sort of infrastructure platform? >> No, they're a major strategic partnership there with AWS and NN4. At the company level, and especially for me, with the government, they've made the right investments at the right time, I mean, and they actually have cloud environments that are very specific to different segments of the government and to different geographies. So as an example, in the federal government they have an intelligence cloud called C2S, which we work with them on. There's a very large procurement out right now for the Department of Defense called Jedi, which Amazon's going after, as well as the other larger cloud providers, so we're obviously riding that horse with AWS. And also for local governments, and they've done all of the compliancy for the government, whether it be FedRAMP, whether it be CJIS for those departments that are worried about the justice type of requirements. And as you get outside of the U.S., they're putting clouds and we're a global company as well, putting clouds in all the right places. They have a G-Cloud offering in the U.K. and as we talked about earlier when we sat down, they're opening a cloud in the Middle East right now too, in Bahrain that I think traces on oil over there as we speak. >> Right, right. The first Middle East country to claim cloud first. But it just seems like there's a strategic advantage there. And even with the other cloud suppliers. I mean, you know, Google's got its niche, big niche, you know, Microsoft, with its software state, but it seems like Amazon, they talk about that flywheel effect, brings certain technologies that, you know, when you talk to Soma, you guys have been able to take advantage of. It just feels a lot different than the old traditional server manufacturer. Oh, it's a Unix box and there's no difference between vendor A, B and C. >> Absolutely correct. And for us, we've taken advantage of the tools that Amazon has and obviously, we're doing all the compliancy on our applications and they've got whole the infrastructure piece of it, so the two work very well together. >> And that has allowed you to focus on your knitting, if you will. >> Yes. >> The things that you do best, which is a micro-verticals, suite across the application portfolio, bringing AI to the equation, automation, we heard a lot about robotic process automation, which is probably a hot topic in the government. >> Yes. I mean, Charles famously, he may have had a quote. I'm sure you heard it. It's friends don't let friends build data centers. >> Great quote. >> You know, that's not a business we're in. We're a software company. >> Right. >> So the public sector, obviously a different animal than the private sector. Very different needs, different constituents, you got tax payers, you got all that. When you bring the technology into the public sector, what does that do for it or how does that have to be, I don't know, re-conformed or adapted? And ultimately, what's the payoff, right? What's the return on that investment? >> So it was actually pretty shocking how quickly the government has adopted and moved towards the cloud. Typically, they're laggards. Everything happens in the commercial market and then government's a little bit of a late adopter, right? But we're seeing them very quickly go to the cloud and there's a lot of reasons for that. One being, you have an aging workforce. Okay, so the baby boomers are all retiring so a lot of that intellectual knowledge is going out the door. Two, is there's some economies of scale to be realized by doing that because once you're in the cloud, I mean, it's up to the vendor who's maintaining it to maintain that for you. So, you know, the people behind the scenes, they have to do it. You know, when you upgrade your software to go from one release to the other, it's automatically done for you. I mean, so there's real cost savings to be had, you know, from a care and feeding perspective there as well. Also a lot of the, on the ERP side of the things, a lot of the systems that are out in the marketplace today that governments have bought, like the Oracles or the SAPs, a lot of these systems are at end-of-life and the companies are no longer supporting them. So it's a re-implementation for them. You know, and so now they're looking, okay, if we have to re-implement and we have to look at our new options, we're going to do it in a cloud. >> So when you've been around as long as I have, Kevin, >> Right. >> you've seen the pendulum swing. You don't have to agree so vehemently. (laughing) But from mainframe to client server and so you're back to the cloud, and now with IoT, it seems like the pendulum is swinging back to a distributed environment. So help us understand where IoT fits to the cloud and even your on-prem business. >> Okay, so like I say, cloud is a pretty broad topic, okay? We have multiple applications that would run in that environment. So when I look at IoT, I think of things like our asset management platform. We have a very strong enterprise asset management platform that runs in the cloud or runs on-prem. And if you think about infrastructure as an example, which government has a lot of, okay. Think about the ability to have sensors on different pieces of equipment and being able to read that information. Think about using drone technology, okay, to be able to do physical inspections under bridges, so you're not having people having to climb around underneath there. I mean, so being able to do live feeds of data and be able to streamline the way you do business and have that automatically captured within an application. So yes, that is one area where we see it. I mean, I think you're going to see more and more of robotics and artificial intelligence and all the things come into play. I think you heard a lot about that here and it's here. I mean, they were things we saw in movies before but now the technology's here today. >> Well, the other thing we heard this morning that Charles has always talked a lot about the data. You guys always talked about your data lake. I like to think of it as a data ocean. You think about all the data out of GT Nexus and, you know, your customers that are providing data to inform. The data model starts to really expand and you guys have seemed to really take advantage of that. Talk about the data, the importance of data, the importance of securing data to the government. >> Well, think about that. I mean, there's islands of information that governments have that if they were able to consolidate that data and put some intelligence into it, be able to make business decisions versus, you know, one system sitting over here, one system sitting over here and none of them ever communicating or talking to each other. You know, the ability to, You could do from anything from, just think about crime statistics, okay? The ability to deploy resources where the crime is and then as it moves, be able to further deploy resources. You know, New York, years ago, did things like that with CompStat when they were cleaning up Times Square and so forth. But just think of that as a concept, realtime being able to manage data. >> So you've got, here at the show, we were talking about earlier, 700 and some odd clients, 725. You've got the federal forum for the first time. Why now? And what are you getting out of that or what do you hope to get out of that at the end of the week? >> So the whole executive team and our board of directors have made significant investments in this marketplace because they understand that government is a very large beast, if you will, and there's a lot of opportunity for deployment of our solutions and there's a real need to solve problems for constituents here as well. So they've made very significant investments in things for security like FedRAMP, compliancy. You know, some companies are doing it on some of their solutions. We're doing it across the board on all the products that we take to the government marketplace. So we're invested in it. You've probably heard today, Charles talked about the fact that we're going to have a federal cloud suite, which we are. So that means federal financials, okay? Actually being able to solve all the problems for the federal government and comply to all their needs and all the things that are part of mandated accounting for the federal government. They made all the right investments and human capital management would be another area. If you think about, we've got an application called Talent Science. The ability to hire the right people for the right job and retain those people. Just think about, ICE is a good example. You heard that they have to hire thousands of people to deploy on the borders, right? How do you quickly ramp and hire these right people if you don't have the right tools to do it? >> You were quoted in TIME magazine, Marc Benioff's new publication, about America's crumbling infrastructure. What role do you see technology playing generally and specifically in for software and helping with that problem? >> So we do a lot today around infrastructure. As an example, we have a very strong presence in transit agencies here in the U.S. New York City runs us, amounts to about a trillion dollars worth of assets there. So anything moving in, out or around the city, so subways, buses, trains, tunnels, bridges, Metro-North, Long Island Rail Road. L.A. runs us, San Francisco runs us, Chicago runs us, Dallas runs us and many others. So we're managing all of that infrastructure. So you hear a lot about infrastructure bills coming out of the federal government. And they're right. I mean, a lot of these tunnel, a lot of these bridges and tunnels and even roadways were built back during World War II, right? And they're aged, you know, they are starting to crumble and there's going to be a lot of money spent to do that and when it comes to rebuilding those types of things, there's a lot of assets that are going to need to be managed, you know, to do that. So we think there's a real opportunity for software such as what we bring to the marketplace to help with that process. >> How about talent retention? I mean, obviously, as administrations come and go, you know, people move, but there's been a lot of brain drain. I mean, take the Patent Office, people in commercial industry stealing some of the best and brightest out of government. Can software play a role in helping better retain, train, you know, evolve growth paths and careers? >> Yes. I guess, in a couple different ways. I mean, number one, I think the applications of today versus the applications of yesterday have changed so much. I mean, you look at, you know, the applications you have on your mobile phone. The ability to have that look and feel, I mean, our kids today are going to go into the workforce and they won't settle for anything less. They're going to want to have that look and feel. They're going to want to have those intuitive type of applications that help them do their job. And that's the kind of offering we're bringing to the marketplace. Then from just actually bringing the right people and we have an application called Talent Science, as an example, where actually there's multiple different areas of your personality that it can determine and map it back to your top performers in your company. And determine the right people for the right job where they'll fit into that environment and then they would thrive hopefully. And it should increase retention on the staff. In government, we've actually sold it to Department of Health and Human Services for hiring case workers. Okay? Or to police departments for hiring of law enforcement. So there's a real opportunity to take those types of applications and do some pretty creative things. >> What's, I hate to say, the pain side of it. But dealing with the government obviously contracts is an issue, right? And a challenge sometimes maybe for you. I'm curious, in a quickly evolving space such as yours, how do you help them keep up with you and their regulatory oversight and whatever mandated restrictions they have? All those things, you know, that come with government. It just doesn't square up with what you do. >> It is, it's a very, again, to your point, it's a different, it's a different industry with different requirements. And everything here is very open and above board. It's open procurements. Everything is competitively bid. There are contractual vehicles that you competitively bid for that'll allow you to be able to do business a lot easier in the future. I mean, in the feds you have things like the GSA 70 Schedule. U.K., you have something called the G-Cloud contract. A lot of states have vehicles where you can bid for it, so all states and local can buy off of those contracts without having to go to a competitive offering. So there's ways that the business can get done without having to go through a lot. >> Every hoop and every, yeah, right. >> The major pain process. But then there's also competitive RFPs, which, you know, well, they'll put a bid out, it'll be very detailed. You have to answer 3,000 requirements. And then after that you'll end up going into an orals and a demo process and, you know, nine months later, they're going to pick a winner. (laughs lightly) Then you go through, but then you have to go through a very painful contract negotiation process. >> That's the process I was talking about. (laughing) Exactly what I was talking about, right. >> Right. >> Yeah, yeah. Well, Kevin, thanks for being with us. We appreciate the time. >> It's my pleasure. >> And it sounds impressive, right, with the turnout you had, so I'm sure you're very, very pleased with the response you've had here on the show for so far. >> I am and I thank you for your time and >> You bet. >> have a good show. >> Look forward to seeing you down the road. Alright, sir, thank you. Back with more here live on theCUBE. We're at Inforum '18 and we are in Washington, D.C. >> I'm quite sure they got me pinned up back here, but I can't-- (upbeat music)

>> Live from Washington DC. It's theCUBE, covering Inforum DC2018, brought to you by Infor. >> Well good afternoon and welcome back to Inform18, we are live in Washington DC, the nation's capital for this year's show. Joining Dave Vellante and me is Corey Tollefson, who is the Senior Vice President and General Manager for retail at Infor. Corey good to see you today sir. >> Good to see you, good to be seen. >> Yeah, right (laughs) it is, under any circumstance right. >> Absolutely. >> So retail, you talk about a world that's kind of upside down now. The brick and mortar guys are, they aren't brick and mortar anymore. So talk about the state of the industry if you would a little bit since it's moved to the digital platform and how that's changing your work with it. >> It certainly was simple 20 years ago. Manufacturers manufactured things, wholesale distributors distributed things, and then retailers sold things. Right, and so the whole business model has been disrupted. Mainly because of the advent of the mobile phone, a mobile device. I said it last year it feels like everyday you wake up and it's very chaotic and there is a lot of disorder. And I think it's an amazing opportunity for retailers to reinvent themselves into a modern 21st century retailer. Everyday is a challenge but we're working on it. >> So what's it like, I mean, every retailer I talk to has this sort of Amazon war room. They're trying to use their physical presence to drive online. They're really getting creative. Amazon continues to do super well. There are those who are predicting the end of of retail stores because of AI etcetera. What's your take? You're knee deep in this business. >> Well I feel, I mean Amazon certainly is bringing a lot of downward pressure. It's the first digital, retail is the first industry to be digitally disrupted. It is happening in healthcare, its happening in manufacturing, but retail brought on the initial wave so to speak. And what I'm seeing is a lot of the middle of the road retailers that don't have too much of an online presence, their legacy brands that maybe had their following 20 years ago. They're going to get squeezed out because the middle in this group is going to get squeezed out. The high end brands that control their own brand image, they brand manufacture their own products, they also have their own retail stores. Those are the companies that are uniquely qualified to compete and thrive against Amazon because the last I looked having stores and having an outlet for immediate gratification of getting products and services is a good thing. The retailers that we are working with are combating that against pure plays like Amazon. >> But there's some consumer friction there right, and it's generational, so how we shop is different then how our kids shop. They look at retail in a very different, through a very different prism then we do. So how do you address that in terms of, how do you help your clients address that through different segmentation of their audiences and addressing those unique problems? >> Well even as a kid I remember that the retail shopping was a destination shopping experience, so we'd load up the family truck, and we'd go to a mall, and spend the whole day. There would be entertainment there, there would be restaurants to eat at. We'd shop and then we'd come home, it was a destination. Try doing that when it is 24 hours, seven days a week, 365 days a year on your phone, suddenly the social engagement, with social media, and Snapchat, and Twitter, and Facebook. Facebook is a little old for a lot of the younglings now, but the moral of the story is social media takes on everything and that's where the influence is. And that whole shopping experience it used to be, well I'm just going to get some product information and then I'm going to go into the store. That's been completely disrupted as well. One other aspect of this is the whole concept of consumerism is disrupted. There is a lot of, you know you look at a lot of the cool brands that are in other adjacent industries whether its Uber or Airbnb, they don't own any of their assets. Same thing is happening in retail, a lot of the new emerging brands are going to have disruptive business models. Like you go into a store and they don't even have any inventory. It's all made to order right. So there's a lot of disruption that's happening and we're working with a lot of brands to help. >> So talk about the next big thing NBT, next big thing in retail is that one of them? I go into a store and say that's what I want send it to my house, what else? >> Well I think one of the next big things that we're working on is the whole concept of machine learning. I think you guys have heard about this before, but the whole technology singularity where its the point in which there is no differentiation between engaging with a customer. Oh sorry engaging with a human versus engaging with a computer. We're not that far away and its a little bit scary. I think we talked about it a couple years ago but the whole concept is why do I need to interact with a human being for my shopping experience? I can just interact with a chat bot, for example. As long as I the customer gets the information I need to make an informed decision, I don't really feel weird talking to a computer anymore. >> Yeah so that's the idea of systems of agency, right, where the machine is taking action on behalf of the brand, and the consumer either doesn't know or doesn't care. >> Right that's right. >> So do you have customers that are on the precipice of doing that? >> Yeah we do. In one of the areas I have talked about this before, machine learning-based demand forecasting. So getting better at forecasting the right product, the right skew on a store-by-location basis. And what we do is we leverage a lot of the inherent capabilities of the internet. A lot of companies talk about cloud as simply a cost reduction. We view cloud as taking advantage of the world's greatest super computer which is the internet. And so, that's one of the areas in which we've been using machine learning. >> So what's the, you say the company, that mid-lane, or middle range, what are they to do now? Because they are kind of stuck, they have their challenges, they have this legacy approach that they are kind of in a tough spot. >> The die has been cast, if I was in their shoes, a lot of these middle of the road retailers. I would look at finding ways to optimize what I have. So whether that's optimizing your inventory, optimizing your labor. That's another thing we talked about, Charles this morning mentioned the whole concept of unleashing maximizing human behavior and unleashing human capital. For years we've been on shows like this talking about products, instead it's about engaging your customer. Everybody's a customer, if you're in healthcare you're a customer. In manufacturing distribution, you have customers. To look at it more from a human element around store associates, I think there's are a lot of middle of the road retailers that have an old iconic brand that could reinvent themselves with time and enough patience. >> How do you deal with the inevitable, well first of all how do your customers deploy your software? It's in the cloud. >> Yeah. >> It's in the Amazon cloud right? >> Well three years ago we made a fundamental decision that we were not going to be an on premise company. So we are a cloud-only applications provider. The second decision point we made was, do we want to be suite or best-to-breed. And when we say suite that was our decision. The third point was, how do you want it to be able to be deployed? So when I started off in this industry which felt like yesterday. I feel like I'm super old now, I started off as a software developer for a company called Retech out of Minneapolis. You know I was doing batch forms, and Oracle PL/SQL and everything was tied to the database, and the user experience was basically a graphical depiction of a database. (Dave laughs) But back in those days-- >> And it still is in a lot of apps. >> Yeah. In those days it was pretty much all about developing that individual code. I kind of lost my train of thought on that. The way you can deploy our assets is on an individualized basis. You can deploy our demand forecasting engine for example. You can deploy our allocation and replenishment engine. And when you tie it all together, you can have a suite that doesn't need to be deployed like it used to be in the old days is where I was going. Which is you have to deploy the whole data model to get all the information that you're looking for. >> Okay so in retail you've got the inevitable, oh well, I'm going to run this in Amazon, they're my big competitor, they're disrupting me. What's the conversation like with customers? How do you guarantee we're protecting their data, you point to Netflix and say hey it's working for them? What do you say? >> Well I think, I mean we're Infor, we're a big company. It's on a case-by-case basis. Yes we have a relationship with AWS and yes they are a strategic partner for us. That doesn't preclude the fact that we work with Google we work with Azure. We are cloud agnostic in retail so, it hasn't been as big of an issue as a lot of industry critics and analysts have made it out to be. >> So if there were an issue, you'd could run it anywhere you want. >> Yeah you just swap it out yeah. >> Alright I want to change gears here. Announcement on the stage today, keynote Van Jones from CNN was talking about #YesWeCode, an organization he has an affiliation with. You've created this, well launched an initiative NextGen. First off explain what that is but fill us back up to the genesis of that because as we found out just a few moments before it's a pretty interesting journey. >> Yeah. >> That you personally were involved in. >> Yeah, I know I am sure a lot of friends and family that know me well are going to be tired of hearing this story. I will give you the condensed version, which is-- >> Take your time. >> Growing up in Minneapolis, I was a huge Prince fan like most Minneapolis people are. And through serendipity I met Prince's brother, and Prince's brother pre-social, pre-internet, pre-mobile, put me on Prince's private guest list for parties at Paisley Park. And so here I am I had a loving family, and I can't believe my mom and dad would let me do this, but I am 16, 17 years old going to parties with Prince. And when I say parties I mean these were intimate parties, maybe the most was 50 people in his house. Sometimes there's like five of us, and what happened at these parties were he would play new music. If we danced and got up there and jammed with him, then he'd put it on an album. If it wasn't very good, or he felt like there wasn't a good strong reaction he put it in his vault. So we were a test case, a Petri dish so to speak, for his music. And I got to build a relationship with him as much as anyone that could. He was a very stand-offish person, but a brilliant artist, and a brilliant human being for that matter. I got to build that relationship and through that relationship I met Van Jones. We hooked up again at one of Prince's memorials a couple of years ago after his death, and we looked at each other and we connected and I said I'm in the technology industry. And he goes we got to talk because there's some things related to Prince's legacy we should really talk about. Which ties us back to #YesWeCode and the announcement we made today about GenOne. >> For GenOne excuse me I said NextGen. >> Yeah GenOne. >> My fault. >> Yeah no, no worries. And the genesis of this was Prince, Rogers Nelson, and Van Jones had a conversation right after Trayvon Martin was shot and killed. And a lot of people suspect the main reason was he looked suspect because he had a hoodie on. And here is an African American kid wearing a hoodie, they follow him and bad things happen right. Van Jones asked Prince directly he goes, you know clearly that guy was racist. And Prince said, think again, maybe if that was a white kid in Silicon Valley wearing a hoodie he'd be a dot.com billionaire, but because we haven't produced enough people of color in CEO level positions in our tech industry, that's on us. Meaning we need to develop more of our own. And so this project means a lot to us, because of the fact that we don't think diversity is just a check box that you have on your corporate mission statement. We think diversity can change the DNA of your company and it can influence better products, solutions, and services to our customers. So it's really important for us and this is just the first step of a multi-echelon, multi-year, multi-faceted program. That we want to take this and roll it out to the entire industry. I'd love for Salesforce and Oracle and SAP and Workday. I'd love for all of them to adapt a program similar to this. This isn't pride of ownership, it's the right thing to do and putting brilliant kids and brilliant minds that maybe came from a bad circumstance, they all deserve a chance too. And it only makes all of us better, and I feel like a lot of great things have happened to me in my career and I feel like I have to give back. And if I can be a small part of this with Van, so be it. >> So that's a very thoughtful response by Prince, and you were saying earlier Corey it was sort of hard to get to know him. Was that typical of Prince, was he sort of introspective and maybe pensive and prescient in that way? >> Well the piece the people that don't understand about Prince is that the whole story of his life is written in his music. And he's released over two thousand songs, you know I'm sure the family and the estate might see this but I've heard another couple thousand songs that have been unreleased and it's beautiful brilliant music and his whole life story is there. You just need to listen to the lyrics, or read the lyrics and listen to the music. >> So was... You mentioned this story, and I just thought 17-year-old kid, I mean with all do respect you don't look like one of Prince's friends right. You're a Minnesota guy, he was too, but just different and I think, did you ever just think that what in the world am I doing here? >> I had that moment, I will never forget that one moment. So it was probably the summer of 1995, Prince was standing five feet from me. He had his right hand strumming his electric guitar, his left hand was playing lead keyboard lines on the keyboard, his right foot was controlling the pitch of the guitar, the left foot was controlling the pitch on the keys, and he was singing vocals and dancing. And I said to myself, I pinched myself, and I said this moment in time, if Amadeus Mozart was standing here he would be blown away. Because there is nobody in the history of music that can write, produce all this great music, but also maintain that look, that image. And then the musicianship, he's a musician's musician. You know we talk about Lenny Kravitz, I ran into Lenny Kravitz about 20 years ago sitting on Prince's couch. He probably doesn't remember me, I am pretty sure he doesn't. >> We'll find out tomorrow night. >> We'll find out tomorrow, but I mean the moral of the story is he was a musician's musician. I'll never forget sitting on the couch and this really soft spoken gal said to me she was really nervous to perform tonight. And I am like don't worry you go this, and it was an 18 year old Alicia Keys. And Prince behind the scenes had been cultivating and developing talent whether its Beyonce, Alicia Keys, Nora Jones, you know. These people he helped develop behind the scenes, and no one really knew it. >> Well his band members were always incredibly talented. I don't know if you ever saw Prince live. >> Nope, did not. >> You've saw him many times. Man as he would say, that band was tight. (laughing) >> That's right. >> Well the program's a great legacy. >> It is. >> And one that is certainly not apparent, but it is great to know that back story to know the generation of that. What got going and certainly I think there's a lot seems like of emotional equity that you and the company have invested, to make sure it's successful as well. >> We think that it was Prince's legacy, but we feel like he has passed the torch between Van, myself and Charles. This really means a lot to us. So we want to take it to the next level so, we are pretty excited. >> Fantastic. >> Congratulations. >> Thanks for having me here. >> Thanks for sharing the story too. I'm glad and it's just wonderful and look forward to talking to Charles about it, when we have him on tomorrow. Alright back with more we are live here, theCUBE is covering Inforum18 in Washington D.C. (upbeat music)

>> Live from Washington D.C, it's the Cube, covering inforum DC 2018 Brought to you by inforum. >> And welcome back to Washington D.C. I think you kind of guess where we are. [Mumbles] Over my shoulder there inforum 2018, along with Dave Vellante. I'm John Walls, we are live here at the Walter Washington convention center for this years show. We are joined by Martine Cadet, who is vice president of the educational arts program at Inform. Martine, good to see you. >> Thank you. >> And Jennifer Bucanan who is manger and head of the Inforum practice and CFO Solutions. Jennifer, good to see you. >> Thank You >> Let's talk about the program. Martine, ou can give us, first off, the inside scope of this. And then Jennifer you're on the other side of the fence. >> Right >> Because the very people, the individuals that Martine and her program are training, you're hiring. >> Absolutley. >> So I want to hear, first off lets talk about the program in general and then to you, Jennifer for about why. And what do you find really attractive about these people? >> Absolutley >> So the Education Alliance Program is 4 years old this year actually, so we're very excited about that. And what we really set out to do was build a talent pipeline that our company and our ecosystem of partners and customers can tap into. So there's been a lot of conversation about the fact that there's not enough talent to fill the positions that are in the industry. So we wanted to do something different where by we could actually grow that talent organically. So instead of going to the oricals and the SAP And having that revolving desk of okay we can leave this here and go to this competetor and work for them and be experienced. We need to find another way to be able to grow our talent so that as an organization, we can continue to be innovative and grow as we move forward. So EAP really kind of serves within that gap, but we do it a little differently than some of the other programs. We really focus on not just identifying talent, but really training them on the industry skill set. So what people `learn in school is amazing, but it is usually more theory. How do you take that theory and really apply it to what is really needed in the industry today, In a real job today? And that where the Education Alliance Program really kind of serves that niche. >> And generally speaking, the age group would be what? Of the trainees. >> The majority of the people that we train are more college age. So 18 all the way up to, I would say early 30's. So early in career talent is what we think about. >> Okay, are they in school? >> Some of, yeah. >> The majority of them right now are in school, but we also welcome people who are outside of school. We've kind of evolved our program where its not just partnerships with colleges and universities, but we train people who come from training organizations; like Yes We Code, and New York Urban League and things of that nature. And You're Up is another great partnership that we started having relationships with. So we do everything from the traditional integrate within a classroom setting, to more of a bootcamp model where talent gets trained over the course of a couple of months to meet this business needs that we have and are here now. >> Okay, and so Jennifer, then on the hiring side of this the advantage to you is what? >> Well for us, we are always looking for folks that coming out of school, whether it's a masters degree or a bachelors degree, that they have a little bit of a focus going into consulting and implementation services. There's a mix of skills that you look for. Some of it is that commitment to being a forthcoming service orientated person. Somebody with a little bit of perspective. And when we met the EAP students, that ambition just comes right out of those folks. And they have purpose in mind because they started to get a little bit of a taste of the real world of what they want to do. So they've got context and they've got direction and a lot of the folks that we've met with had some good accounting and finance knowledge, which we value. Plus they had the IT component, where traditionally if I just go to try to do some campus recruiting I might get one or the other, but it's hard to get both. >> So training that revolving door, that martine described which, there's still some of that going on, but you get a lot of viable knowledge. You know where the skeletons are buried. They can fast pass some of it. Trading that for excitement, diversity, maybe a different type of creativity. Certainly not as much well that's the way it's done in the enterprise. Right? Maybe discuss that a little bit. >> Yeah absolutley, the folks that, what we need coming in have that creative element and they're not just, ya know, crunching out and doing maybe the theory that you have mentioned. They've had a little bit of experience at a practical site of understanding how to apply technology and solve buisiness problems. Cause that experience that they go through in the EAP program is almost like a simulation and gives them a little taste of that. And when we talk about what we do and we introduce them to our business and try to look for a fit. They have a better understanding of what we are talking about and do. >> So Martine, in the 4 years since we've first met, what has changed? Has the scope, the goals expanded? What did you not forget that actually happened? >> Yeah Maybe you could share some of your experiences. >> Yeah, so in the four years we've gone deeper around world based training. So when we started, it was more around exposing students to different career opportunities, to what is EAP. I've been in the industry forever, but I was always more on the consumer side. So I didn't know what ERP was. [Laughing] Is this even professional? So helping students see the opportunities there, was kind of the initial focus and getting them to have kind of a toe in the water. We've gone much deeper this year, in particular going to role based training. So, what do you need? What skills encompanies you to be an amazing sales professional versus somebody who's going into the development space, or somebody who's going to manage kind of the cloud space, which is where our company is focused. So that's been one of the biggest evolutions in which we have done within EAP over the last couple years and were much more global than we were when we first started. So we are excited about that as well. And then in terms of things that surprised us. I think of of the areas that surprised us, it was a little bit harder to place students frankly, than we had initially had thought it would be. And so one of the ways that we've worked through that is we've worked with our talent science team, and they've been phenomenal at really helping identify fit. And so now we can have much richer conversations with the hiring managers around. Yes, I know that you would like an expereinced hire perhaps, but this is a reason why one of these more inexperienced hires is actually a great fit and will be your next superstar on you team. And on the flip side, we can have conversations with the talent around career opportunities that they might not have even thought about before. Cause now we've got kind of there fit for different roles. >> So were certainly seeing in many buisiness settings, that gut feel is being replaced by, you know, data and fact. When it comes to hiring people though, there's still that, well there's several things. There's gut feel, there's repor, there's biases, so are technologies like machines intelligence, and programs like this cutting through that? >> Yeah that's what we're trying to have happen. I mean it's hard, it's hard. Everyones trying to tackle these issues, but with technologies like talent signs, with having programs which address the feedback of well I don't know where to find a first talent. Well if you go to the same three schools that you always go to, that are by nature not diverse, then you're not going to find the diverse talent you are looking for. So if you can tap into a program where we go out of our way to make sure we're actually fishing in new ponds, and that we're bringing in amazing talent to the forefront that people can tap into. And we are really proud about that. >> Well, what's really key about that, and we were having this conversation earlier. Is that if you really want to bring diversity into your organization, you have to look beyond your inner circle. But it's a pain to do that, its time consuming. So what you've done, is you've fast passed that. Right? And give an opportunity for somebody to dive in. >> Yeah >> Yeah >> Sure, and some of those folks became part of our circle. Cause a year ago we met a wide group of the folks in the EAP program, and we were impressed by the broadness. Like I mentioned earlier, you've got some folks that are still sophomore, junior year that are just getting started. We've got relationships foudning with those folks. We have folks that are just getting ready to graduate, and we have folks that have been in the workplace, came back. So we've got a breath of experience, but folks from all over. And we were one of those folks who would go to the same school over and over. And you know, we would get good talent but, it's that breath, and that new perspective that comes in. And now that's our pipeline. We've got folks at different levels in their educational career that we stay in touch with. And a lot of the students reaching back to us is what helped us make connections for folks to bring on. >> So how do you find me? If I'm an interested student? >> Yeah >> Or how do I find you? >> Yeah >> If I am at a school. That's one question, and secondly once I'm in, is it like ROTC? Like I have a three year commitment after that? [Laughing] [Mumbling] >> You're invested in me. >> That's a great idea. [Laughing] >> A lot of resource time is being put into me, developing me, so what am I going to give you back? >> Yeah absolutely. >> Take on both of those if you would. >> Its more about finding the member institutions and then finding me the right talent within those organizations. Right? And so we do a lot of research and analysis on where we want to go. So we do want to make sure we are building pipelines that fit the busininesses needs first and foremost. So where do we have a majority of our offices? Where do our partners and customers have a majority of their offices? Where are the hiring needs and the types of roles? Then based on that we look for organizations that actually have core programs that align to that. And those are the ones that we want to have relationships with first and foremost. And then we seek out the talent. We actually have marketing communications people who are out there and promoting the courses and the partnerships that we have in the classroom to hopefully get the talent to actually apply to the class itself.. >> Alright so once I'm in. >> Once your in. >> You've got me. >> Yeah. >> I'm a junior, I'm studying, I'm doing my thing. >> Yeah. >> You're training me. Well I'm going to graduate in a year. So am I on the hook, or will you place me? >> We investin their training, and we also try to provide wrap around support services. So we've got people on the team who are beyond passionate and focused on making sure they've got the soft skills, who are also focused on making sure they are introduced to hiring managers within our ecosystem and within our organization who might be interested in talking to them. We set up kind of meet and greets as well, where we have events around that so placements important to us. We can't commit and guarantee a role per say, but we can open up opportunities perhaps the students didn't have before. And give them the training so that when they are compared against their peer, they can come out ahead. >> So having that Charles several times and interviewing him a number of times, this is, it certainly feels more than optics. What are the success metrics that you look at, and can you share some with us? >> Yeah, so we do look at how many people we actually trained and made it through the program. We look at how many people have been placed within Inforum as well as our ecosystem. We are looking to see how many students will actually pursue a path to certification, and go through the deeper training and learning. And then we look and see how many people are actually liking the program. Like what they're getting out of it. We'd love to see, I'd personally love to see in a couple years that people will have gone through EAP are now future customers, your future partners. You know, placement is one piece, but its also how are we influencing the industry as a whole? And for competitors, hiring EAP students, that actually goodness. Like we are trying to really change what is going on in the injustry perspective on how we grow and change talents. Because the way its working today doesn't work for everybody. So we've got to do something different. And the fact that Inforum has stepped up to actually grow it organically, I think is you know, a testimony to Charles. >> Great mindset, I mean you're not trying to just hang on and you're certainly embracing this. But if when an individual leaves, to whether even a competitor, there's some pride in that. Like hey we trained this individual and we're changing the industry. And you know, sometimes those things just have a way of coming back around. >> Yes, yeah, yes >> Absolutely >> So Jennifer, from the clients side if you will, how big could this program be for you? Like how helpful has it been, and how much more do you need it in order to meet these employee gaps? Cause as we've heard, the numbers aren't adding up right now. >> Right, right. So for us we've been having some conversations about how do we grow together on this? They've offered to say hey, CFO Solutions, would you like to be involved in some of the teaching opportunities? So we've been having dialouge about how that might be. And we've been talking about particular skill sets. You know, they start out with kind of a broad skill set and we work with a very specialized component of that. So we've been talking about the product mix that they involve in their program and bringing something more direct to what we're working with. So that's a big. >> Personalized learning. >> Yes. So its helping us kind of refine our pipeline because we know what's going to be coming out of it and we know that is is getting that slice of this US and the world if necessary right? It gives us a little assurity that we can get folks at different levels of their career. We can start talking to them now and we can start working with these guys on honing the skillset that they'll be coming in with. The soft skills piece that you had mentioned earlier was on of the real standout skills that we saw come out of this. All these folks, I can't overemphasize the driviness, the commitment they had, the communicating with me over a year period. And they're boldness, cause that's one of the main things that we need out of the folks that we bring and put in front of our clients. >> So this is all awesome, touchy feely stuff too, but at the end of the day, I've read that it has a buisiness impact. >> Absolutely, absolutley. >> So what's your experience been in terms of the bottom line? >> Well, so buiness impact wise, when we take a risk and bring somebody fresh out of school, and we bring him to a porject where you require very specialized skills, we need people that we can take a risk on, who will hit the ground running. So if I go and grab somebody from anywhere, I don't know what I'm going to get. I don't know if they're going to like their career. I don't know if they're going to understand what we are doing. And there's a lot of ramp up time, time before I can bill for that source, just to be practical. And when we bring in Eap students, I know they've had a taste of it, and they're ambitious and driven for it. And I can get them billable more quickly. And then I can be proud to have them out in front, because they can tell a story. A lot of this is a relationship business. I can have them come to a project kickoff and they can talk about what they've come from. And that they've had an involvement with Inforum, not just hey I'm fresh out of school. I don't know what I'm doing here. It's hey, I've been working with a product for a couple years. Even now and they hit the ground running just so much more quickly. >> So faster time to value. >> Yes, faster time to value. We've seen internally for the folks we've hired, that we've got one hundred percent voluntary retention rate. >> That's amazing. >> For early retention rate. For early career talent, four years into the program, where that's about 20% better than the rest of the talent that we have, right? So we're looking at retention, cause we know if you lose somebody, that's nine months of salary probably to replace them and to retrain somebody else. >> That's right, yes >> Absolutely >> Much easier to hang onto somebody than go find somebody new. >> Okay so you're getting the billing faster, higher quality, I heard. Which means better customer retention and less employee turnover. >> Less employee turnover. >> Which means lower cost. >> Absolutely. >> And on the recruiting side of things too, the development of trying to find talent, there's a lot of time invested and we're a firm that has a very lean operations team. A lot of us wear many hats. So one of my hats is my recruiting and development, and this just streamlines things for me and makes it so much easier. I don't have to spread myself thin trying to find folks. I know I've got kind of a pipeline and I've been sharing it with my other leadership in the other practices to kind of share that along the firm >> And to put it in context, I mean so for the trainings that are around rules and careers, were looking at getting the students to have 200 plus hours of training over bootcamp experience. Now, put that against somebody else who has zero right? You're getting to faster productivity, you're shaving off anywhere from 3 to 4 to 6 months of on boarding time by hiring somebody through this program. >> Yeah. >> And minimizing on boarding frustration which would help. >> Yeah, yeah. >> Sympathize with. >> Makes perfect sense. Great sounding program, we appreciate the insight today. Thanks for being with us. >> Martini- Yeah, thank you. >> And you're wearing many hats, you'll need a rain hat out there today. >> I will, I will. [Laughing] >> Congratulations. >> One more, yeah. Great program, thank you ladies. We're back with more on Live. The Cube is in Washington D.C at Inforum 2018.

(upbeat music) >> Live from Washington D.C., it's theCube, covering Inforum D.C. 2018. Brought to you by Infor. >> Welcome back here on theCube, we are live at Inforum '18 in the nation's capital Washington D.C. Where these days there's never a dull moment and we'll just leave it at that. I'm with John Walls, Dave Vellante and Stuart Applebaum is joining us here. He's the EVP of North America Service Industries at Infor, and Stuart, thanks for joining us here. >> No, thank you, looking forward to it, you're right. >> You got your hands on a lot of pies, right. >> Yeah. >> The bank, you got a retail, you got healthcare, hospitality. >> Right. >> And you've had some wins in hospitality of late. First off, what's driving that? What do you think as being-- >> Yes, sure, well I mean whether you look at hospitality whether it's managed food service or hotels or restaurants a lot the technology that's out there is dated, right, and the technology is not upkeeping with the requirements and the demand for a really different customer service level. So, you take the look and feel of what we've been able to do as a company over the last 10 years and build up a lot of knowledge base and seniority around what it means to serve those markets, but then re-architect with new products, right. Cloud first approach type technology that really allows for us to deliver a, you know what I would say a much more better experience for the guest at a hotel, or at a front at a cash register at a restaurant, or in a managed food service environment in a hospital, right. All those environments are a lot of touches that go on and the more the technology is modern the better you can improve those technology and those interactions that go on. You also look at the idea that these guys trying to manage these, whether it's a hotel chain, or a company like Sodexo where they have managed food service entities all over. Business in industry, healthcare, it doesn't matter what you see, a cafeteria somewhere, there's high odds that it's either a company like Sodexo or another managed food service provider. The complexity of trying to maintain on premise solutions is just, is backbreaking for them. So for them to be able to now actually get to a level with a company like Infor who not only has the experience in the space, but also have invested into the next generation cloud based solutions, really allows us to kind of differentiate ourselves in the marketplace. And the marketplace has been pushing us for that as well. >> Are these typically, install based Infor customers that you're now moving to a cloud model? Is it, sort of new logos? I'm wondering if you could describe that dynamic? >> Yeah, I would tell you it's pretty mixed, right. Our customer base is fairly broad. We serve hotels for example, in over 100 countries and territories today. A lot of those customers came up through legacy applications much like we complete in a marketplace on. So we've done really great job of migrating those customers up into the cloud with the next generation technology. But what's also happened is, as you look at the area in which people serve the hotel space, a lot of them are really legacy applications that have been around for 20, 30 years, and while those companies have tried to encapsulate modern technology and move into some cloud level environment, only Infor has actually re-architect and built them from the ground up. So what we're finding is a lot of different style of companies and groups. One great example of this is Mandarin Oriental has begun to role out our company, or role out our products globally. So being able to take a brand that's as exclusive as that, that's so focused on "How do we make the guest, at the forefront of everything that we do to make them feel special?" Well, they couldn't do that with the technology that they have today, right. So in order to be able to make those differences and those changes in how they're going to service their guest, they have to move to a next generation technology. So we're seeing a lot of new logo business in that space. We're also seeing a lot of new logo space in the casino marketplace, right. You think about how massive and big these casinos are so most of these guys are very careful and concerned, just like our banking customers for example, in being able to move into the cloud, move to new technology, cause, can companies really scale? Can they bring that capability and put it in the cloud? Well we very much started to prove that with these large casinos to the point where we just recently announced about a year ago signing one of the largest, or second largest casino company in the world, and 40 hotels with over 50,000 hotel rooms, right. The idea to be able to take these kind of technologies at that scale and pace, is driving a lot of new logo new customer business being driven from our competition, which has not been able to keep pace with that kind of technology in the cloud. >> So what are the winning attributes? I'm hearing architecture, we heard this morning platform, we had Nunzio on, the design, the whole user experience. There's the cloud component. Are those the sort of key factors? What else? >> They're very much the key but it's how Infor OS which I think maybe people have talked a little about. We have this capability to create a model that allows for not only a free flow of communication and understanding between systems, whether it's for a hotel environment or a hospital environment so that information can be shared amongst systems and among resources to be able to collaborate and do something with that information. But equally as important, at the same time, we put all that information into a data lake. So that we can now use Birst and we can use Coleman, to really start to help people understand not only what does it look like or what's the interactions occurring at the hotel space, or might you want to tell this customer or say to this customer to, "Hey, we're going to give you this information up front instead of guessing what that might look like, or guessing what you might want to offer that client." It's a very different approach. >> Give me an idea, I mean specifically, you talk about Mandarin, we'll just use them as an example. >> Yup >> What are you helping them do better, that they couldn't do before? Because when I think of service, I think of Mandarin, they did things pretty well before. So what are you doing to help them improve their processes and what are they turning to you for future? >> Sure, well, I mean from a simplistic standpoint talk about how they're able to interact with you as a guest, right. If you're a Mandarin type of client you're probably very much a more affluent business traveler or a-- >> Dave Vellante >> Yeah, a Vellante example right. At the end of the day while you want all the level of service that you expect at that kind of property the amount of effort or work they have to do or you might have to do to make them understand what that is, is very taxing. And it's also very hard for you guys to interact and change that. By getting to, what we have, HMS, which is Infor's hotel property management system, allows them to really streamline not only understanding who you are, what your preferences are, how you like to interact with them, but then also be able to deliver that in a mode of interaction that you like. Whether it be through mobile, whether it be through text, whether it be through personal conference calls, or discussions or touchpoints. That kind of capability in their legacy systems took a whole bunch of manual intervention to make that happen. Now we're able to automate that, make that information realtime so it's not just a few people digging in to try to find this information to go back and try to make that guest fell like they understood it. It's every point, right, every contact that touches that customer who has access to our solutions, is fed that information realtime, which gives the customer a much different experience. At the same time, it allows you guys to interact in a much different experience. You may not want to talk to people you want to check in on your phone, show up at the hotel, go to your room, open your door. Well, legacy architectures and technologies with closed type of infrastructure don't allow for that open API capability. Versus our technologies allow it free flowing out of a cloud scenario, which is even a more complex thing, to give the ability for those hoteliers like Mandarin, to say "Hey, I'm going to give Vellante a unique experience that is exactly what he likes, with all the information that I know about him to be what I would consider the best way I can service Vellante. >> So self-service is an obvious one. I don't want to have to wait on the phone on hold to check out for example. Just give me a pad or something that I can just go boom. And there are numerous other examples, but you've got to get the user experience and the design right. Maybe talk about how you guys approach that. >> Yeah, well, you guys had a chance to meet with Nunzio on our Hook & Loop. Hook & Loop is very instrumental in what we do in the hospitality space as well, as well in the healthcare space. Anytime people are interacting, not only as an employee but as a guest, whether you're an invited guest you know from a doctor to get to a hospital to have some kind of treatment or acute care. Or if you're a hotel guest where you're coming to stay. There is some level of interaction that's going on that requires a very unique, specific kind of touchpoint between the two. And in that area and in that space, there's a lot of data and elements that go on that if you feed those and understand what those elements are, and start to really understand what it is that individuals require in terms of their personal care or their personal interaction or stay at a hotel, the more unique an experience and the better experience that they can have. >> Stuart we heard about the skills gap, the skills shortage this morning. How can Infor and it's software help close that gap? >> Right, well you can look at it in a couple different ways. If you look at it at the grassroots of some of the industries that we serve that we've talked about. Whether it's hospitality or retail, or even healthcare in some scenarios. Not talking about professionals in the healthcare industry, but people who are just working day to day operations. Simplifying the interaction on how they use the solutions that they do their jobs everyday, minimizes the training requirements and the skilled labor that has to go on that would occur in legacy solutions and architects. So being able to hire a front desk guest agent who's got a great personality who knows how to interact and talk to people but maybe has never used a hotel system before to be able to put them in front of that hotel system and act just like their phone or their iPad, it gives them the ability to be interactive and understand and be on board pretty quickly. So that's one side, is simplifying, working with Hook & Loop, designing, making sure the applications, the workflows make sense. So it simplifies the work effort and simplifies the ability for people who are maybe less skilled in a particular area to jump in really quickly with less training. The other side of it is trying to find the right resources. And, going through the process of having a skilled attribute level of understanding of what your successful people look like, we can help through our Talent Science solutions find similar type of people. That doesn't mean, now we'll get to the education enablement side of it, that doesn't mean day one, that maybe they have the exact training they have required but that we found that they are the perfect fit for the job. So if they are going to be interacting on an everyday basis with a guest for example, and they're a front desk manager, there's attributes around that are so critical important. Now, they may not understand all the facets of the job but once we find that right resource you bring them into the talent solution and then really start to understand where are their gaps, where are the training requirements, what are the certifications by the way, depending on if you're in a complex industry like manufacturing or healthcare where there are certifications and safety regulations you have to occur. How do you maintain all that into one spot and be able to identify and be able to give them and provide them the personal interaction on what is it that they need to maintain and grow in terms of their own abilities to be suitable for the next job or the job that they're being hired for, and how do they actively get the learning and the education, the e-learning that goes with it. So, we've been able to kind of formulate that into a comprehensive product set that we think is pretty much best of breed in the industry, right. So not only do we have a great learning management system, an unbelievable talent acquisition and science system, a fabulous way to hire, to promote, to retire structure on understanding employees, what their skills are and how to place them, but bringing all that together from a unified front, and then being able to standardize that into an experience that makes it a much more different approach from what you would traditionally have had in finding skilled labor in the workforce. >> In automation, in AI, it's now a layer on top of all this that you're bringing to the table with Coleman you started to role out some capabilities there. What's the reaction been of customers? Is there uncertainty? Is there fear? Is there doubt? Are they embracing it? What is the conversation like? >> Really instead of saying, it's better to think of it, it's not on top, right. This is the underpinnings of how we built our cloud suites. >> Injected into the-- >> So we've taken our cloud suites and everything we've opened from a technology perspective to inform every information and job that flows through, whether it's in personal intervention into a task or whether it's machine to machine, goes through that Infor OS. So all of that interaction and data whether it's from a person or from a machine gets captured so you can start to begin to build intelligence on top of that. Now, what that means is, wherever those interactions and communications occur, Coleman is sitting in there understanding and learning, sitting on top of our data lake to say, "You know what? This is a process that is repeated a hundred times a day, by 50 different people on a particular firm. Why don't we automate that process and why don't we make that known to the entity and then adjust our process to automate that so no one has to interact with it, right. So being able to have that as an underpinning, not an overlay, right, cause a lot of businesses will come in and say "Hey we'll provide analytics and BI over the top." That's great, analytics and BI on the top is pulling information out of all different kinds of sources trying to make sense of all that data trying to make sense of all those sources. Versus what we're trying to do is every interaction that occurs between systems, we're not trying to identify right at that point what makes sense to store somewhere and put somewhere, it all goes into our data lake, and then the machine learning starts to tell you, "Here's some things you should understand about the data and the interactions. >> We've heard the theme about human potential, unlocking that. So, how does that translate in your world, I mean in your mind? How do you apply that in terms of the industries that you're providing services for? >> Again it goes back to, it also goes to our focus on bringing a diverse workforce to the table. To improve our capabilities and improve the way we approach things. But, it's understanding individual attributes of people and how they may interact and work within a company is a starting point, right. So they may not have a particular skill, but they have a capability or an ability to learn or they may have a personal interaction that is far excessive than what normal people would come in to interview first like a job. Well being able to do these type of talent assessments and understand as a baseline where they are, all of a sudden you're getting a more broader pool of skilled resources for what you're looking for, right. And then even if that skilled resource happens to be from a different part of the country than what your typical hiring manager is, or they look different, or their education background is different, it strips that out, right. It is giving you the personal attributes of that individual. So that allow a broader pool to look at. Then from that pool, then we can start to say "Okay, well here's a great candidate pool of people that may be able to quickly be skilled into a job or into a role, and then start to place those people into those positions. And then as the life cycle of that employee goes on so do their attributes, right. So what made them who they are as other roles and jobs as they build their resume within the company, they still have those capabilities so as a role in a management place comes up that has a good fit for this persons individual skills and their personal attributes, they're a natural fit for moving up into the world. And that's how we kind of continue to get that engine rollin in terms of how do we bring more people in without a prescriptive, only a prescriptive model, right. This is a scientific model of what is going to be the right fit for an employee for Infor, right. Or an employee for one of our customers or another company. And that's where we start with bringing in that ability to broaden our workforce and identify people who could be successful, without necessarily saying "You didn't punch this type of button for the last 10 years so you're not qualified for the job." >> So I'm hearing a lot of differentiation and I'd love to hear it more in your words from an executive of Infor. Every company out there, every software company says "Yeah, we have AI too." I'm sure you hear it: "Oh company A B and C, they have their new AI platform, everybody's doing AI." When you're talking to customers, how do you differentiate what Infor is doing, not with just machine intelligence, but across the board, from the competition? >> Well I would tell you to start with, one is the comprehensive set of our solutions, right. So by being able to go into an industry and have a cloud suite that we formulated that has the capability to manage a very significant portion of their operations already integrated together, already with the last industry model functionality built into it. It gives us a leg up in our competition. So when we walk into a healthcare, or a hospital, and they have challenges with nurse scheduling, they have financials they need to look at, they have general HR that they have to look at, and by the way, they're also trying to look at "Are we going to be profitable? And how do we become profitable? All these different touchpoints are a nightmare for us." Well as Infor, what we present to our customers and brought together was: "Hey we have that capability to do all your nurse scheduling, your workforce planning, your time attendance. We can manage your facilities, your assets, your expensive cost structures there." We have the ability to have a very complex set of financials that may serve 15 different hospitals that might also have different infused levels of ownership or investment or management. Being able to come to the table with that as a comprehensive system, eliminates a lot of the guesswork. Now, again, once you have that in there, someone coming in and selling AI, or BI, they still would have to, if it wasn't us, to come in over the top and say, "Well, if it's all Infor, that's good. At least we can connect all Infor. But if it's got Epic or it's got Cerner, it's got whatever solution's sitting out there, well all of a sudden you're not only having to connect those points but you're having to connect all over the place versus the way we built it is that cloud suite, all those points of connection are already prebuilt, right. And they're already dumping it into the data lake. So that now all you have to do is take some ancillary pieces of data to pull into that perspective. And with capabilities of clinical integrations that we have, to be able to follow and track those things. And we just actually announced not too long ago TrueCost. TrueCost is the ability to really understand down to a procedure level what something may cost to perform at a particular hospital. And that is, you would think that wouldn't be that hard but you're talking about people, you're talking about equipment, you're talking about what kind of room? What equipment's in that room that creates a certain cost per hour to do a procedure? All those things come to play in determining exactly what is profitable and what's not. So being able to really understand the true cost of care, not only at the hospital level, but by the way, how do we take into account what happened before? How do we take post care into that? And then how do we start to do predictive analytics on that kind of capability? Well, since we have this cloud suite healthcare, for example, building around all of these different components where we track the resources, we understand the rooms and the cost. We understand the doctor cost, we understand the facilities cost. We understand the care and the time that it take to go under the care. We can now start to really take and give hospitals an idea of saying: "Hey, maybe if we approach this a little differently." Or even with Coleman now, maybe you approach it this way. You can start to do and provide that specific care in a different way that will lower your cost to care, not only for your hospital but for your patients, and then hence you become more profitable as an entity. >> It's a real business impact. And the alternative would be, you would have to what? Develop custom modifications, or bring in an ISV who's got deep expertise there. Bring in another system. >> You could have a combination of it, right. Some of our competition would have to bring in a different workforce management and scheduling system. They'd have to bring in a different time and attendance system. They would probably have to bring in a different analytical engine and underlying platform to work with it. They would have to bring in a different talent assessment or talent management type of solution. They would have to bring in a different supply chain and materials management system for a healthcare environment for example. I mean, the list can go on and on. Where we've went out and built and looked for, whether it was through acquisition, where we then brought these cloud based products into our cloud suite, or we identified gaps or areas that we needed to build from scratch. And we talk about, you know, people don't really think about it, but as a percent of revenue, we outspend our competition 5x, right. And we talk about how much we've spent in the last several years in R&D. We do that because we know that if we can build a platform in the next generation for healthcare, for hospitality, for retail, then we can really be the leaders in the marketplace. And I think that's what's going to really differentiate us from our competition who's trying to either come in with a point area, start to broaden it a little bit. We've already broadened it, we integrated it, we built it together and we underpin it with the ability to do artificial intelligence and analytics from the box, right. That's a very different approach. >> And keep it simple. >> Right >> For me, right? At the end of the day-- >> Yeah, make it easier for the users. >> Stu thanks for the time. >> No, this was great. I appreciate it. >> Thanks for the run down. Stuart Applebaum from Infor. Back with more here from Inforum '18. We are live in Washington D.C. And you're watching theCube. (upbeat music)

>> Live from Washington DC, it's theCUBE! Covering Inforum DC 2018 brought to you by Infor. >> And good afternoon, or I guess at least Eastern Time, good afternoon. We're in Washington DC, theCUBE live here at Inforum '18. We're at the Washington D.C. Convention Center along with Dave Vellante, I'm John Walls. It's a pleasure to welcome Nanzio Esposito who's a VP and Head of Experience at Infor and you can tell he's the coolest guy in the room right now. (all laughing) Yeah, Nanzio, good to see ya. Thanks for joining us, we appreciate that. >> Thank you, thank you for asking. >> So you had a, as part of your primary responsibility, the in-house creative agency. >> Yep. >> Hook and Loop. First off, let's just deal with design, from an approach standpoint. Why is that so important for Infor to have its own in-house agency? >> Well I mean, we have amazing capabilities, and a lot of, and those capabilities really differentiate us against our competitives that. But what ends up happening is that our end users essentially want to have a more enjoyable and more satisfying experience, through their work. So, the reason why design is extremely important to Infor is because, through design, we get to do things like provide efficiency through workflows. We get to do things like create a design system that helps to escale and empower and enable our development teams to pick up UX best practices and UI assets so that they can build quicker. Or open-sourcing those kind of capabilities to be able to empower our partners and our customers to build apps with kind of a standard code base. So, I would tell you that the reason why design is so important is because we look at things from a very macro view, strategically. Design is very holistic, it's problem-solving. And it's taking the best of some of design's key attributes of modernizing the UI, being able to apply design thinking to understand kind of what the business value needs to come out of the system or the solution that's put in play. And how that mutually creates a beneficial kind of delivery mechanism to each user as they're doing their work. And also looking at kind of just the raw, sheer amount of assets that we have from data and being able to find ways to essentially come up with solutions that businesses today really need. And it's a very competitive landscape. And what best to have a designer be able to try to solve some of your business application needs. >> And does it change depending upon the vertical in which you're working? So, I mean, those have to be considerations too, and the environment, right, from the mobile if you're going to be at the desktop, you're going to be on a laptop or? >> Yep, yep. >> On iPad or whatever. All that factors into that. >> Yeah, definitely. You know, it is interesting. I mean, part of Infor strategy has always been to, you know, have industry-focused cloud suites. And from a design perspective, for us, we do tend to see patterns. So, it depends on user roles, kind of access points, you talked about devices. So we see the use of device in, say, healthcare industry, very different, say, than to the use of a device in manufacturing. But mobile, is really starting to kind of blur those lines. And you brought up something that was part of our mobile strategy, internal that was kind of finished out in October of 2017. Which is essentially what we call mobility in context. So context is very important. Knowing situationally where a user is in a moment so that they can, from one moment, work with, say, some portal. And that portal may be a laptop to a, say, an iPhone or even just an Alexa device, and be able to understand where they are, allow them to continue on in that workflow and make sure that it's integrated, it's smooth and it's direct and to the point. So, that's what has kind of transpired through the evolution of Hook and Loop because design has evolved and it's bigger than just modernizing our user interfaces here at Infor. >> So when we first heard about Hook and Loop, it was through Infor. It was the early part of this decade. The mobile was only five or six years old. I mean, smart phones. >> Yeah. >> At the time. So in was early days, you guys were first, certainly, of all the major software company enterprises to focus on that. Now, subsequently, we hear you've always heard a lot about UI. >> M-hmm. >> And UX. Subsequently, much more recently we're hearing much more around design. You're seeing, you know, you go to conferences like Service Now and they're focusing on this stuff and you guys have always been there. What's the difference between UX, UI, and sort of design at the core? >> Yeah, sure. I mean, I think it, sometimes the lines are blurred, right, and it depends on the industry and it depends on where you're speaking as far as when you say user experience design or if you say just design in general. So, I'm going to just take two steps back. The reason why I didn't go for head of design at Hook and Loop was just because design means, has a certain definition here at Infor. We are obviously an enterprise, it's very vast, it's extremely broad and at that point, each, say, of our major constituents, product management, it could be a product development, it could be a customer, they have different mental models on what design means. So, we wanted to go with something that's a little more elusive. Alright, so Head of Experience. But, essentially, now, through our evolution in our sixth year, we're really focused on product experience. So what that means is taking kind of all the learnings that we've had in the industry around modernizing UI, so that's essentially the way in which the solution manifests itself, how it looks, and the best of user experience. Essentially, what is the flow? What are the click states? How can we provide efficiency in form fields? But now you bring in A.I. and that obviously puts a different dimension on that process. But when it kind of all comes together, it's really just about making a strategic call on what the solution needs to be able to satisfy, all the different configurations in which it needs to account for, and then how to package that in a very lightweight manner. So, it's almost to the point that a company or a user doesn't need any instructional information on how to use it. And that's always been a goal at Hook and Loop. Through the six-year journey, strategically, even with some prior leadership, there was a very amazing strategic call to focus on a more mobile first initiative and mobile first, that brought forward kind of all the responsive web behaviors to our applications. So, that's great. Because that just essentially means that on any device, the application will conform, will render, to kind of provide the best usability that it can. As we're evolving, though, we're realizing that the future of work, and I mentioned this to the analysts yesterday, the future of work, which is now post-Millennial, and I know that sounds crazy 'cause I think we're all still seeing millennials in our workforce and trying to reconfigure, figure out what the company culture is, the purpose is, and how business solutions help to support that. But the article in the New York Times talked about iGen, and you know, the theme that Inforum here is all about human potential. Well, in the iGen generation, it's all about the personal aspects of the way in which they communicate, the way they do work, the way they have social gatherings. And I found it very profound because that essentially really supports what the vision of Hook and Loop is now in this era, which is the personal enterprise. And there's nothing more personal than the device that we choose on a daily level, which is the mobile device. So, at that point, it's extremely innate. And it definitely kind of personifies who we are in our digital world, our digital selves, and because it actually has all this tons of capability that's packed into it, what ends up happening is not about kind of the nine to five anymore, and I think you guys, and myself, we all know that. We're getting notifications and communication to, say, a loved one or some kind of social event that's going on and then getting pinged through some kind of communication or notification of work that we have jobs to do, there's things that have to get done. So, it moves from work-life balance to a work-life blend. And for our enterprise, and through kind of I think the investment that we've done with design, that allows us at Hook and Loop to really push the boundaries of user experience and think about the balance of all those to kind of give our customers always only exactly what the user needs right now. And that's been our new mantra, where we've kind of strategically pivoted, evolved, and been essentially looking at our principles and re-looking at our work, given all this investment in our capabilities. >> We heard this morning in the keynotes that you're basically infusing A.I. into your applications, in an effort to create better outcomes. Giving users advice as to how they maybe could have done things differently, maybe tracking some KPI's and giving feedback to the user, so that they can have better outcomes. How does A.I. from a design standpoint change the way in which you have to think about presenting data and information to the user? And not being intrusive, but being helpful? >> Yeah. I could probably talk about that for like the next two to five hours, but the reality is there's different versions or flavors of A.I. So, some of it could be more backend processes, like you alluded to and presenting, say, best potential outcomes that a user, or paths that a user can navigate or select or go down. One thing that we saw from a design perspective is the fact that you don't want to just present the recommendation. You don't want to lose the human factor. You have to establish trust with A.I. over time. So, in just saying, hey I got that or I got that done or here's the best KPI to use, you want to still have a system that can offer up why. And be able to kind of promote choice. A user doesn't want to feel, essentially, controlled. They want the system to be able to make them feel like they're in control. So, those are some nuances there. When it gets into kind of the more conversational aspects of A.I., you know, and I'm going well beyond kind of chat bots, having conversations and having it kind of leverage some of our CIR capabilities, find business objects and promote it, say through our GUI, conversations get intense. And why I say intense, it's some of the terminology we use at Hook and Loop. But that's just because utterances and variancing in the way in which we communicate, are complex. You might say, OK and I might say yeah. You might say I am on it and I might say, yo, I'm doin' that. And just through-- >> That's exactly right, as a matter of fact, that's exactly what David would say. (all laughing) >> I wasn't trying to say this or that. But they all mean the same thing, or in different contexts or whatever the inquiry was, we have to understand that kind of user intent and be able to map all those correlations. So, it's not so easy as just saying hey, we have A.I. and we'll put it into play. And from a design perspective, the last thing we want to do is ever alienate a user. So. >> A frustrated user. >> And frustrated user, exactly. So, just because you can doesn't mean you should and we really need to think strategically in a way in which we ultimately empower a user. So when I say user we're saying a name for customer's employee, or a new force customer customer. So it's a very interesting strategic place that we sit within Infora in our product development teams. >> Yeah, within user experience and best practices, so obviously there are some general trends or general concepts, what do you find out though amongst your clients and your user base maybe that offers additional insight or is giving you maybe a little sneak peak about something that you are uniquely discovering, if you can talk about that? >> Oh yeah, sure. I mean, I think as we evolved kind of our business model this year and our services, I think one of the things that we've learned over the years is that, like, we're no subject matter experts. Like at all. So it's kind of like, well, how do we get this information? How can we learn more? How can we provide or satisfy or create solutions that satisfy these certain pain points? So what we ended up doing is, ya know, I hear this from my team constantly, it's like who's the customer? Or who's the user? And we need personas. And we need to understand the journey maps. And we lose sight of some of the more internal mechanisms that we have that really kind of give us that information. So, we've, over the last few months, have gotten access to Infor Concierge, which is a tool that Infor created for our customers to be able to kind of understand what's new in the product. If they have any product enhancement requests, issues, that they would love to see, bugs, defects. They're finding that their Infor is working really well in creating kind of a two-way conversation. Well, what best to have design team, which, you know, product experience team, to be able to have access to all of that information. Be able to comb and sift through it. So, we're learning kind of what the customer and the user wants, but they're participating in that. So it's a really interesting orchestration or concert. And then on the flip side, we have a ton of subject matter experts. So, and that goes well beyond just our solution, industry solution, architects. This goes into like, our sales teams, or our solution consultants, or our channel partners. So, strategically over these last six to eight months, I think what we have uncovered is that we have a lot of support. And there's like ways for us to make decisions quicker and be able to test or have successes or failures in a very like small, confined box, so to speak. So that we make decisions that don't necessarily create massive ramifications in the enterprise but get us to kind of create value quicker in a more kind of sizeable chunk in deployment mechanism. So, I think the biggest thing that we've uncovered is the fact that, not only do we have a lot of talent but we have a lot of amazing, bright ideas. And that is why we moved from an in-house design agency to product experience because essentially Infor has grown and our team is everyone's becoming a designer. And that's you want. You want to go from a design organization which was the goal in 2012 to now in 2017, 2018 and where we're headed, to move from a design org to a design culture. And I think that's what is going to definitely going to get Infor to differentiate against its competitive landscape. >> 'Cause one of the problems with design is oftentimes the design, the ideal design, there's a gap between that and the actual functionality of the product. And then you end up with this kind of hybrid. Some of the design intent matches the outcome but then the functionality is sort of becomes roadmap. >> Yeah, and a lot of that was happening, I think 'cause we were going through an evolution. What we noticed is we need to move design closer to our product development teams in Hyderabad, Manila. You know, development is getting done all over the globe. So what we did was, we wanted to ensure that UX practitioners were, ya know, sitting side by side of our development teams so that in a moment's time they can have a conversation, quickly make a decision, and obviously just continue on their way. Another piece, though, is what is the right balance between having massive amounts of engineering capacity to, say, a designer that's in partnership with them? So we started practicing and growing our team to be less focused on some of the more baseline design capabilities and we brought in some really smart and talented engineers that understand design, find ways to translate it. And we're doing that kind of translation right now in building native mobile applications inside of Hook and Loop. And that gives us a mechanism to prove out our work, understand some of our decisions, get kind of the feasibility more done upfront so that when we make strategic calls or we want to scale from there, we start to minimize the gap between wouldn't this be amazing if it could render or do this, to, oh, God, we just did like, patchwork, or it was a quill that we created to get it done. We want to bridge that gap and get closer and closer to what the original concept or the idea was. >> So you announced one of those apps this week. >> Yeah, that was super exciting! >> If you want to talk about that. Congratulations. >> Thank you, thank you. Yeah, I mean leveraging the best of human-centered design, I can't mention the customer's name given the NDA, but we did work with a very large consulting firm that had 18,000 users. And they're kind of road warriors. So, strategically working with our C suite, we were focusing on more agnostic solutions and then scale to more industry-focused solutions, so this is in expense management. But we needed something that was insanely high consumer grade. So really driven by usability. But offered more of the baseline utility. So leveraging the capabilities of XM, this was all kind of like the road warrior, I just need to capture my receipt, potentially build a queue, wait 'til my credit card feeds in these data points, my expenses, match these expenses, submit a report, and like can I just get back on my day 'cause we all hate doing that. So the app that we just released, it's available on Apple iTunes, the Apple Store, today. It's called Infor Expense. It acts as a companion to Infor Expense Management. We say companion because if you're an Infor Expense Management customer today, you have access to it. And it really is a mechanism to kind of promote the best of what Hook and Loop is trying to scale, continues to scale, inside of Infor. At the same time, it's a playground for us. It's a playground for us to test new capabilities, leverage capabilities that are on the device. You know, evolve our design patterns and our UI assets. So that we kind of always stay at the tip of the spear. And that's essentially where Hook and Loop sits for Infor from a product strategy perspective. >> Well if you make expense reports easy, I'm all for it. >> Me too, right? >> I got my parking ticket right here, we can start as soon as we're done. >> Alright, you want me to take a picture of that? (all laughing) >> Nunzio, thanks for the time. >> Awesome. >> Congratulations. I know you're moving into your second year, it'll be an exciting time for you I'm sure. >> Yeah, I'm excited. >> Keynote tomorrow, right? >> Yeah, I'm opening up day two. >> Just give us real quick, sneak peak, what are you going to talk about? >> Yeah, it's, I think it's really just all about design's evolution inside of Infor, really setting the stage that Hook and Loop went from an internal kind of creative agency and is really moving towards product experience. So that's product strategy, product thinking, how do we aggregate all of that capability, from a data and A.I. perspective, and then find deployment mechanisms that not only inspire our internal teams, but more importantly, inspire our customers in the market. >> Good deal. >> Thank you again for the time. Pleasure. >> Alright, thank you. >> See you tomorrow morning. Nunzio Esposito joining us from Infor. Back with more, we're at Inforum '18. We're live in Washington D.C. and you are watching theCUBE. (light upbeat music)

>> Live, from Washington D., it's the Cube. Covering Inforum DC 2018. Brought to you by Infor. >> And welcome back to Inforum '18. We're live here in Washington DC as Inforum has brought its show to our nation's capital. I'm John Walls along with Dave Vellante. It's now a pleasure to welcome Vice President of corporate communications Dan Barnhardt. >> Thank you. >> Hey Dan, good morning to you. >> Good morning to you. Good to see you again. >> We were kidding before we got started about why you're here in Washington. We think it's for the weather, right, because it's so nice. >> It's gorgeous. >> But there is a reason. I mean, you've released a federal product today, have an announcement we'll get to in just a moment. But about coming to Washington. You've been in New York before, you've been in New Orleans. Why DC, why now? >> Well, it's important for us to make sure that our customers can access the event. We've got more customers that came this year than came previous years, certainly, than last year. And it's important to be in a city where it's accessible for our customers not just in the US, but also from Europe and Asia Pacific, Latin America and Washington DC's very accessible. We also are one of the largest suppliers to public sector organizations. That's, uh, local, state, and federal government. We've got a particular focus on federal government and fed ramp compliance this year, which we achieved. And, so, we're here so that we can show off some of that new technology that you just mentioned. >> Yeah, what about the significance of that? Of reaching the compliance goal. And what does that mean to the business going forward? >> Well, it's yet another example of the benefits of our cloud strategy and working with the AWS beginning in 2014. Infor was the first large ISV to embrace a public cloud. And Amazon and Amazon web services in particular has been very helpful in achieving fed ramp. They have a lot of federal customers. They've got a very large federal agency with three initials that is a customer and they require compliance with all of the federal regulations that continually change and the utmost security for customers and we're able to offer that to our customers as well. >> Yeah, we were talking on the kick off about that - how you guys can draft the AWS innovations and things like fed ramp and other compliance. They were first, they were way ahead of anybody. You as an ISV, you don't have to worry about all that stuff. I mean, you've still got to connect to it, but they do a lot of the heavy lifting, so that's cool. You got some other hard news. >> Well we also are able to focus on our products by doing that. We don't have to invest in proprietary cloud infrastructure or data centers or databases. We can focus on delivering innovation in our products and functionality that makes a difference for our customers. Their business is not - their customers don't care what infrastructure they're running on, they care how they're able to provide goods and services. So Infor focuses just on delivering better goods and services for our customers. >> What Charles said at the keynote this morning - our strategy, we didn't want to compete with Google and Amazon and Microsoft for scale of cloud. That made no sense. It also made the point that when we were an on prem - exclusively on prem software company, we didn't go out and manage servers for our clients. So we don't want to do that. So, big differentiator for sure, from some of the other SAS players. >> And it's paying off now in a way that our competitors are starting to come after us when they used to not want to acknowledge us. One of our larger competitors - on premise legacy vendor - had an anti-Infor ad on their homepage. They've got cabs outside of here. >> We're talking about- - Yeah >> And then Charles said, ya know if you're - we're welcome the competition here if you'd like to see innovation in enterprise software, this is the place to be. >> Well, congratulations, right, 'cause, well, you know, when Oracle's coming at you, it means you succeeded - that's good. Um, other hard news that you guys had this week - you got true cost accounting in healthcare and some other things, take us through those. >> Well health care has been a major focus industry for us, just along with government, which we mentioned. Um, seventy plus percent of large hospitals in the United States are automated using an Infor software. And healthcare has been an industry that's undergone a lot of disruption, obviously, for the last ten, twelve years, with the Affordable Care Act and others. And we're trying to figure out - we as a society are trying to figure out - how to deliver better care to patients, that's the goal for healthcare organizations. And to do that, they need to better understand what's the cost of care. So the Infor true cost, which we announced in January and have now delivered and have customers implementing, will help our customers understand better what is the cost of the care that they're giving so that they can give better care to their patients and allocate their resources in a way that will help more people heal better and feel better. >> We heard on the intro to the keynotes today, Turing, Edison, and Coleman. It sounded like it was Charles' voiceover. I don't know if it was or not, but >> It was. >> It was. He's got the smooth, mellifluous voice. Um, last year Coleman, Catherine, Coleman, Johnson - you named your AI offering platform after her. Give us the update where you're at today, you've got some other announcements around that as well. >> We do. It's a big announcement for Coleman here. We've got the GA of Coleman digital assistant, which is - enables humans to have - everyone to have an assistant at work with them to help automate certain functions such as search and gather, which can take twenty percent of people's time just collecting the information to make a decision. But now with Coleman digital assistant being live and customers implementing and going live on it right now, they're able - users are able to ask Coleman to fetch information and deliver not only the information but predictions and smart intelligence that helps people make better decisions and be more productive. >> So we had a lot of conversation this morning about robotic process automation, which is really interesting. I mean, essentially, we're talking about software robots taking over mundane tasks to humans. Now a lot of people like to talk about how - and we talked about this in the Cube all the time - how, oh, the machines are taking away jobs, but in speaking to numerous customers about RPA, they're thrilled that they don't have to do these mundane tasks because it makes them more valuable, they're doing more interesting things, and they're getting offers from others that are asking them to do this type of automation for their company. So they're more valuable to their existing company and outside companies. So, RPA - hot topic. You guys are leaning in hard. >> We definitely are. We definitely believe that there are jobs that - there are functions that can be better served by automation, particularly search and gather that we mentioned. There are multiple functions that will always be done by people. Human interaction is not going to change so we are looking to have a digital assistant make productivity better. Productivity is a function of being able to do more, having more workers, and we'd like to do both with this. We'd like people to be more productive using artificial intelligence assistance. And, also, a conversational user experience with software will make it easier and less intimidating for a lot of people to interact with technology at work. And we think that will also help people be able to be more productive in their jobs and have more people able to take more jobs that right now or in the past have required a level of technical expertise that you won't need when you can simply ask the computer to do something for you using your own conversational language. >> Some major data points - excuse me - >> That's okay. that came out of the keynote this morning - one is that there are now more job openings than there are unemployed individuals and productivity, even though the tech spending is booming, it doesn't show up in the productivity numbers. We saw this actually, you know, a couple decades ago in the nineties. And all of a sudden you saw this massive productivity boom. I've predicted that with automation and artificial intelligence you're going to see something similar. It seems like Infor's on a mission - that human potential tagline - on a mission to really drive that productivity and help close those gaps. >> We definitely are. Our tagline is "design for progress" and we are looking to promote progress around the world and do what we can in order to help human progress and the theme at Inforum is human potential and that's what we're looking to do here. We have seen a lot of productivity growth in people's personal lives. I now - I don't know how to set a timer to cook anymore, I just ask Alexa to do it, but we haven't seen that at enterprise yet. So we're bringing consumer grade technology that people have gotten used to in their everyday lives but they don't see at the office. We're bringing it to the office to help make them equally as productive as they are in their personal lives. >> Yeah, that's what I wanted to hit on, actually, was the theme of the show. We're talking about human potential and which Hervan Jones talking about that, you know, from a personal mission statement if you want - that's the way he worded it. But, what's the broad scope of that in terms of how you apply that thematically throughout the company when you talk about human potential, because it's just not you, obviously you're trying to do that for your clients, you're trying to do that for the people they serve, do it for taxpayers, right, through the federal sector. But talk about that from the thirty thousand foot level about human potential - unlocking that and how Infor totally is, I guess, trying to illustrate that or put that in place. >> Certainly. The first thing I would mention is our human capital management. Infor is a very large provider of HR software - there's others that are perhaps better known, but Infor has many customers that are using our HR software, but they're also using our software for other key functions. And by integrating those two things, we're able to help people be their best self at work. Because it's not just the HR management, but the HR system knows what you're working on, they can help with professional development, and talent management, and align that to the business processes that the company has. We're also looking to engage workers. As you mentioned, there are more job openings than there are unemployed people that we believe seeking employment right now, but they're not very engaged. So we're hoping to have technology and learning management to help engage more workers. And then we'd also like to increase new business creation. One of the things that Charles mentioned that slowed down is the introduction of new businesses and small businesses. We believe one of the reasons for that is that there is so much business automation that goes on that in order to achieve that to be competitive requires so much capital investment that it makes it difficult to start a new business. But if we're able to automate a lot of that business, we're able to make it really easy through Infor cloud suite for new business starting, we feel like we'll be able to help entrepreneurs generate new businesses which will employ more people and offer more engaging and rewarding jobs and help fill some of those gaps that we have. >> We've talked a lot about AI - not just some magic thing that you throw at your business - it has to be operationalized and the likely way in which organizations are going to consume AI is it's going to be infused in applications. And this is exactly what your strategy it, isn't it? >> It is. The artificial intelligence is only going to be as smart as the amount of data that it can access and that it can analyze. It doesn't have a brain, it looks at data and learns from that data and where it tells you. And Infor has access to data that very few companies have - mission critical data, ERP, data manufacturing, distribution - core processes that we're able to put in the cloud, and not just in the cloud, but in a multi-tenant cloud environment where it can be drawn from analytics, from our burst analytics engine. And then, Coleman can make decisions based on that data - not only from within the enterprise but across the network using GT Nexus commerce network. >> Yeah, so we're hearing a lot about HCM, of course, at this show, you know, human potential, fits into talent management, HCM. You guys have a very competitive product there, it's sort of a knife fight with some of the large SAS players, but I was excited to see so much attention paid to HCM as a key part of your SAS portfolio - your thoughts? >> I do, I agree with you and I think one of the differentiating points that we just mentioned was that Infor HCM also connects to Infor systems that automate core business processes. So it's not just about those business processes, but also knowing who the people are that work on them and helping companies navigate. So much time is wasted from what we would call tribal knowledge - an employee getting up to speed or figuring out how to navigate inside an organization, particularly a large enterprise. And Infor HCM can help make that easier, but they can do that while attached to a business process so that everything can move faster and more efficiently for the customer. >> I wonder if you could comment, Dan, on this notion of best of breed versus a full suite. It seems like - so for decades, there's been this argument of oh, best of breed point products will sometimes win but full suite, people want a single throat to choke and that integration - It seems like with your micro-vertical strategy you're trying to do both - be both best of breed and have a full suite across the enterprise application portfolio. Is that right, you know, do you feel like you guys are succeeding at that, uh where do you think you fit in that whole spectrum? >> That is correct, and it's one of the things that we're able to do because of our cloud strategy - is to offer the complete suite and the artificial intelligence that comes on top of it. In the past, when there wasn't an artificial intelligence layer, there wasn't the machine learning that needed to draw from all of that data, best of breed individual applications would work. But now that we're trying to pull data together so that you can make more intelligent and you get actionable insights that let you make more intelligent decisions, that requires an integrated suite. And that can be done now in a multi-tenant cloud environment that couldn't be done before. >> The other thing I would observe - we talked about this, John - is - >> I'd also really quick just add that I think that that's proving to be correct in the amount of growth that we're seeing. Infor is significantly outgrowing from a revenue perspective. Oracle, more than forty percent last year, more than double the rate of growth of SAP and our growth rate for cloud applications is up there with work day which is setting the bar for cloud software companies. >> Yeah, that's true, that's a great point. I mean work day has set the bar and this is an example of what was essentially a narrow point product there to, of course, trying to get into other spaces. Of course, SAP and Oracle always have had a large suite. Your strategy has seemed to be working in terms of being a place where a customer can come in and access a lot of different functionality. The other thing that we heard today - a year in - is the Koch Industries investment. I was noticing that you now see Accenture here, you see Grant Thorton, Deloitte- >> Capgemini >> Yeah, Capgemini - these people are taking notice of - I would imagine Koch Industries does a lot of business with those guys and one of the gentlemen from Koch told me last year - said "Hey, we're going to expose these SI's to the Infor opportunity." It seems like it started to happen and I've heard that there's been several large deals that they've helped to catalyze, so it's great to see that presence here. Talk a little bit about the Koch Industries dynamic and what that's brought to the table. >> Well, the Koch relationship for Infor has been so helpful. First, obviously, there's a large infusion of cash from the investment. It was 2.5 billion dollars - one of the largest tech investments that wasn't an acquisition in history. And we're able to use that capital to increase more functionality. Not only that, but Infor has an industrial background. The majority of our customers are in manufacturing or distribution - industries that Koch Industries is a big player in. So not only do we have a great partner, but we have a living lab in one of the world's best and most efficient companies with which to develop our software, implement our software, and test our software. And we've got a willing partner in Koch that can do that and provide a lot of that expertise. >> I was telling Dave that that's what really struck me listening to the keynote was that - yeah - it's this wonderful symbiotic relationship and they gave you money - that's nice, right - but you have an opportunity now to roll out services, products, experiment a little bit. >> We do. >> See how it works within the Koch family, if you will, before you take it out further and so you've got this great test lab at your disposal that you didn't have before. >> And like Infor, Koch is a private company, so we don't feel the same pressure to provide quarterly return to shareholders that public companies do. So we're able to invest more of our revenue in development and R and D in ensuring that our products are going to deliver the best experience and the best functionality for our customers. >> Well, to me, the key for Infor - a key - is you've got a large install base and you're trying to get that install base to come to a more modern, SAS-like, cloud-like platform. To do that, you got to be relevant. So, the stuff like Coleman, the burst acquisition, your micro-verticals - those are all highly relevant. You know, your ability eliminate custom mods because you go that last mile. Highly relevant to companies that have to place a bet. Now, when they have to move to this new world, you know, others are going to try to grab them, so you got to hang on to them. To me, relevance, and showing a road map, and showing an investment, and things like R and D, is critical - your thoughts? >> I agree with you, I think that's the reason that we're seeing those large global system integrators partner with Infor now and develop practices that Accenture and Deloitte, Grant Thornton, and Capgemini, that will implement Infor software at their customers. They're having the demand from the customers that they're working with, including up to the largest of enterprises, for Infor software, just simply because we are able to automate processes and help them get to a level of automation that will let them compete in the digital era. There are companies all over are fearing that they're going to be disrupted by a digital, native competitor or a digitally enabled competitor. And we're looking to help Infor customers become digitally enabled themselves and to be that disruptive competitor in their field. >> Well, Dan, we appreciate the time >> Thank you very much. >> Good seeing you, thanks for having us here. >> Thanks for coming back again. >> Overlooking the show floor, got a great seat - >> Yeah, a lot of activity down there. >> And, uh, good luck with the rest of the show. >> Thank you very much. >> Dan Barnhardt, from Infor back with more. Live on the Cube here from Washington DC at Inforum '18. (bright, electric music)

>> Live from Washington, D.C., it's theCUBE! Covering Inforum D.C. 2018. Brought to you by Infor. >> Well, welcome back to Washington, D.C., We are alive here at the Convention Center at Inforum 18, along with Dave Vellante, I'm John Walls. It's a pleasure now, welcome to theCUBE, Leigh Martin, who is the Senior Director of the Dynamic Science Labs at Infor, and good afternoon to you Leigh! >> Good afternoon, thank you for having me. >> Thanks for comin' on. >> Thank you for being here. Alright, well tell us about the Labs first off, obviously, data science is a big push at Infor. What do you do there, and then why is data science such a big deal? >> So Dynamic Science Labs is based in Cambridge, Massachusetts, we have about 20 scientists with backgrounds in math and science areas, so typically PhDs in Statistics and Operations Research, and those types of areas. And, we've really been working over the last several years to build solutions for Infor customers that are Math and Science based. So, we work directly with customers, typically through proof of concept, so we'll work directly with customers, we'll bring in their data, and we will build a solution around it. We like to see them implement it, and make sure we understand that they're getting the value back that we expect them to have. Once we prove out that piece of it, then we look for ways to deliver it to the larger group of Infor customers, typically through one of the Cloud Suites, perhaps functionality, that's built into a Cloud Suite, or something like that. >> Well, give me an example, I mean it's so, as you think-- you're saying that you're using data that's math and science based, but, for application development or solution development if you will. How? >> So, I'll give you an example, so we have a solution called Inventory Intelligence for Healthcare, it's moving towards a more generalized name of Inventory Intelligence, because we're going to move it out of the healthcare space and into other industries, but this is a product that we built over the last couple of years. We worked with a couple of customers, we brought in their loss and data, so their loss in customers, we bring the data into an area where we can work on it, we have a scientist in our team, actually, she's one of the Senior Directors in the team, Dawn Rose, who led the effort to design and build this, design and build the algorithm underlying the product; and what it essentially does is, it allows hospitals to find the right level of inventory. Most hospitals are overstocked, so this gives them an opportunity to bring down their inventory levels, to a manageable place without increasing stockouts, so obviously, it's very important in healthcare, that you're not having a lot of stockouts. And so, we spent a lot of time working with these customers, really understanding what the data was like that they were giving to us, and then Dawn and her team built the algorithm that essentially says, here's what you've done historically, right? So it's based on historic data, at the item level, at the location level. What've you done historically, and how can we project out the levels you should have going forward, so that they're at the right level where you're saving money, but again, you're not increasing stockouts, so. So, it's a lot of time and effort to bring those pieces together and build that algorithm, and then test it out with the customers, try it out a couple of times, you make some tweaks based on their business process and exactly how it works. And then, like I said, we've now built that out into originally a stand-alone application, and in about a month, we're going to go live in Cloud Suite Financials, so it's going to be a piece of functionality inside of Cloud Suite Financials. >> So, John, if I may, >> Please. >> I'm going to digress for a moment here because the first data scientist that I ever interviewed was the famous Hilary Mason, who's of course now at Cloudera, but, and she told me at the time that the data scientist is a part mathematician, part scientist, part statistician, part data hacker, part developer, and part artist. >> Right. (laughs) >> So, you know it's an amazing field that Hal Varian, who is the Google Economist said, "It's going to be the hottest field, in the next 10 years." And this is sort of proven true, but Leigh, my question is, so you guys are practitioners of data science, and then you bring that into your product, and what we hear from a lot of data scientists, other than that sort of, you know, panoply of skill sets, is, they spend more time wrangling data, and the tooling isn't there for collaboration. How are you guys dealing with that? How has that changed inside of Infor? >> It is true. And we actually really focus on first making sure we understand the data and the context of the data, so it's really important if you want to solve a particular business problem that a customer has, to make sure you understand exactly what is the definition of each and every piece of data that's in all of those fields that they sent over to you, before you try to put 'em inside an algorithm and make them do something for you. So it is very true that we spend a lot of time cleaning and understanding data before we ever dive into the problem solving aspect of it. And to your point, there is a whole list of other things that we do after we get through that phase, but it's still something we spend a lot of time on today, and that has been the case for, a long time now. We, wherever we can, we apply new tools and new techniques, but actually just the simple act of going in there and saying, "What am I looking at, how does it relate?" Let me ask the customer to clarify this to make sure I understand exactly what it means. That part doesn't go away, because we're really focused on solving the customer solution and then making sure that we can apply that to other customers, so really knowing what the data is that we're working with is key. So I don't think that part has actually changed too much, there are certainly tools that you can look at. People talk a lot about visualization, so you can start thinking, "Okay, how can I use some visualization to help me understand the data better?" But, just that, that whole act of understanding data is key and core to what we do, because, we want to build the solution that really answers the answers the business problem. >> The other thing that we hear a lot from data scientists is that, they help you figure out what questions you actually have to ask. So, it sort of starts with the data, they analyze the data, maybe you visualize the data, as you just pointed out, and all these questions pop out. So what is the process that you guys use? You have the data, you've got the data scientist, you're looking at the data, you're probably asking all these questions. You get, of course, get questions from your customers as well. You're building models maybe to address those questions, training the models to get better and better and better, and then you infuse that into your software. So, maybe, is that the process? Is it a little more complicated than that? Maybe you could fill in the gaps. >> Yeah, so, I, my personal opinion, and I think many of my colleagues would agree with me on this is, starting with the business problem, for us, is really the key. There are ways to go about looking at the data and then pulling out the questions from the data, but generally, that is a long and involved process. Because, it takes a lot of time to really get that deep into the data. So when we work, we really start with, what's the business problem that the customer's trying to solve? And then, what's the data that needs to be available for us to be able to solve that? And then, build the algorithm around that. So for us, it's really starting with the business problem. >> Okay, so what are some of the big problems? We heard this morning, that there's a problem in that, there's more job openings than there are candidates, and productivity, business productivity is not being impacted. So there are two big chewy problems that data scientists could maybe attack, and you guys seem to be passionate about those, so. How does data science help solve those problems? >> So, I think that, at Infor, I'll start off by saying at Infor there's actually, I talked about the folks that are in our office in Cambridge, but there's quite a bit of data science going on outside of our team, and we are the data science team, but there are lots of places inside of Infor where this is happening. Either in products that contains some sort of algorithmic approach, the HCM team for sure, the talent science team which works on HCM, that's a team that's led by Jill Strange, and we work with them on certain projects in certain areas. They are very focused on solving some of those people-related problems. For us, we work a little bit more on the, some of the other areas we work on is sort of the manufacturing and distribution areas, we work with the healthcare side of things, >> So supply chain, healthcare? >> Exactly. So some of the other areas, because they are, like I said, there are some strong teams out there that do data science, it's just, it's also incorporated with other things, like the talent science team. So, there's lots of examples of it out there. In terms of how we go about building it, so we, like I was saying, we work on answering the business, the business question upfront, understanding the data, and then, really sitting with the customer and building that out, and, so the problems that come to us are often through customers who have particular things that they want to answer. So, a lot of it is driven by customer questions, and particular problems that they're facing. Some of it is driven by us. We have some ideas about things that we think, would be really useful to customers. Either way, it ends up being a customer collaboration with us, with the product team, that eventually we'll want to roll it out too, to make sure that we're answering the problem in the way that the product team really feels it can be rolled out to customers, and better used, and more easily used by them. >> I presume it's a non-linear process, it's not like, that somebody comes to you with a problem, and it's okay, we're going to go look at that. Okay now, we got an answer, I mean it's-- Are you more embedded into the development process than that? Can you just explain that? >> So, we do have, we have a development team in Prague that does work with us, and it's depending on whether we think we're going to actually build a more-- a product with aspects to it like a UI, versus just a back end solution. Depends on how we've decided we want to proceed with it. so, for example, I was talking about Inventory Intelligence for Healthcare, we also have Pricing Science for Distribution, both of those were built initially with UIs on them, and customers could buy those separately. Now that we're in the Cloud Suites, that those are both being incorporated into the Cloud Suite. So, we have, going back to where I was talking about our team in Prague, we sometimes build product, sort of a fully encased product, working with them, and sometimes we work very closely with the development teams from the various Cloud Suites. And the product management team is always there to help us, to figure out sort of the long term plan and how the different pieces fit together. >> You know, kind of big picture, you've got AI right, and then machine learning, pumping all kinds of data your way. So, in a historical time frame, this is all pretty new, this confluence right? And in terms of development, but, where do you see it like 10 years from now, 20 years from now? What potential is there, we've talked about human potential, unlocking human potential, we'll unlock it with that kind of technology, what are we looking at, do you think? >> You know, I think that's such a fascinating area, and area of discussion, and sort of thinking, forward thinking. I do believe in sort of this idea of augmented intelligence, and I think Charles was talking a little bit about, about that this morning, although not in those particular terms; but this idea that computers and machines and technology will actually help us do better, and be better, and being more productive. So this idea of doing sort of the rote everyday tasks, that we no longer have to spend time doing, that'll free us up to think about the bigger problems, and hopefully, and my best self wants to say we'll work on famine, and poverty, and all those problems in the world that, really need our brains to focus on, and work. And the other interesting part of it is, if you think about, sort of the concept of singularity, and are computers ever going to actually be able to think for themselves? That's sort of another interesting piece when you talk about what's going to happen down the line. Maybe it won't happen in 10 years, maybe it will never happen, but there's definitely a lot of people out there, who are well known in sort of tech and science who talk about that, and talk about the fears related to that. That's a whole other piece, but it's fascinating to think about 10 years, 20 years from now, where we are going to be on that spectrum? >> How do you guys think about bias in AI and data science, because, humans express bias, tribalism, that's inherent in human nature. If machines are sort of mimicking humans, how do you deal with that and adjudicate? >> Yeah, and it's definitely a concern, it's another, there's a lot of writings out there and articles out there right now about bias in machine learning and in AI, and it's definitely a concern. I actually read, so, just being aware of it, I think is the first step, right? Because, as scientists and developers develop these algorithms, going into it consciously knowing that this is something they have to protect against, I think is the first step, for sure. And then, I was just reading an article just recently about another company (laughs) who is building sort of a, a bias tracker, so, a way to actually monitor your algorithm and identify places where there is perhaps bias coming in. So, I do think we'll see, we'll start to see more of those things, it gets very complicated, because when you start talking about deep learning and networks and AI, it's very difficult to actually understand what's going on under the covers, right? It's really hard to get in and say this is the reason why, your AI told you this, that's very hard to do. So, it's not going to be an easy process but, I think that we're going to start to see that kind of technology come. >> Well, we heard this morning about some sort of systems that could help, my interpretation, automate, speed up, and minimize the hassle of performance reviews. >> Yes. (laughs) >> And that's the classic example of, an assertive woman is called abrasive or aggressive, an assertive man is called a great leader, so it's just a classic example of bias. I mentioned Hilary Mason, rock star data scientist happens to be a woman, you happen to be a woman. Your thoughts as a woman in tech, and maybe, can AI help resolve some of those biases? >> Yeah. Well, first of all I want to say, I'm very pleased to work in an organization where we have some very strong leaders, who happen to be women, so I mentioned Dawn Rose, who designed our IIH solution, I mentioned Jill Strange, who runs the talent science organization. Half of my team is women, so, particularly inside of sort of the science area inside of Infor, I've been very pleased with the way we've built out some of that skill set. And, I'm also an active member of WIN, so the Women's Infor Network is something I'm very involved with, so, I meet a lot of people across our organization, a lot of women across our organization who have, are just really strong technology supporters, really intelligent, sort of go-getter type of people, and it's great to see that inside of Infor. I think there's a lot of work to be done, for sure. And you can always find stories, from other, whether it's coming out of Silicon Valley, or other places where you hear some, really sort of arcane sounding things that are still happening in the industry, and so, some of those things it's, it's disappointing, certainly to hear that. But I think, Van Jones said something this morning about how, and I liked the way he said it, and I'm not going to be able say it exactly, but he said something along the lines of, "The ground is there, the formation is starting, to get us moving in the right direction." and I think, I'm hopeful for the future, that we're heading in that way, and I think, you know, again, he sort of said something like, "Once the ground swell starts going in that direction, people will really jump in, and will see the benefits of being more diverse." Whether it's across, having more women, or having more people of color, however things expand, and that's just going to make us all better, and more efficient, and more productive, and I think that's a great thing. >> Well, and I think there's a spectrum, right? And on one side of the spectrum, there's intolerable and unacceptable behavior, which is just, should be zero tolerance in my opinion, and the passion of ours in theCUBE. The other side of that spectrum is inclusion, and it's a challenge that we have as a small company, and I remember having a conversation, earlier this year with an individual. And we talk about quotas, and I don't think that's the answer. Her comment was, "No, that's not the answer, you have to endeavor to reach deeper beyond your existing network." Which is hard sometimes for us, 'cause you're so busy, you're running around, it's like okay it's the convenient thing to do. But you got to peel the onion on that network, and actually take the extra time and make it a priority. I mean, your thoughts on that? >> No, I think that's a good point, I mean, if I think about who my circle is, right? And the people that I know and I interact with. If I only reach out to the smallest group of people, I'm not getting really out beyond my initial circle. So I think that's a very good point, and I think that that's-- we have to find ways to be more interactive, and pull from different areas. And I think it's interesting, so coming back to data science for a minute, if you sort of think about the evolution of where we got to, how we got to today where, now we're really pulling people from science areas, and math areas, and technology areas, and data scientists are coming from lots of places, right? And you don't always have to have a PhD, right? You don't necessary have to come up through that system to be a good data scientist, and I think, to see more of that, and really people going beyond, beyond just sort of the traditional circles and the traditional paths to really find people that you wouldn't normally identify, to bring into that, that path, is going to help us, just in general, be more diverse in our approach. >> Well it certainly it seems like it's embedded in the company culture. I think the great reason for you to be so optimistic going forward, not only about your job, but about the way companies going into that doing your job. >> What would you advise, young people generally, who want to crack into the data science field, but specifically, women, who have clearly, are underrepresented in technology? >> Yeah, so, I think the, I think we're starting to see more and more women enter the field, again it's one of those, people know it, and so there's less of a-- because people are aware of it, there's more tendency to be more inclusive. But I definitely think, just go for it, right? I mean if it's something you're interested in, and you want to try it out, go to a coding camp, and take a science class, and there's so many online resources now, I mean there's, the massive online courses that you can take. So, even if you're hesitant about it, there are ways you can kind of be at home, and try it out, and see if that's the right thing for you. >> Just dip your toe in the water. >> Yes, exactly, exactly! Try it out and see, and then just decide if that's the right thing for you, but I think there's a lot of different ways to sort of check it out. Again, you can take a course, you can actually get a degree, there's a wide range of things that you can do to kind of experiment with it, and then find out if that's right for you. >> And if you're not happy with the hiring opportunities out there, just start a company, that's my advice. >> That's right. (laughing together) >> Agreed, I definitely agree! >> We thank you-- we appreciate the time, and great advice, too. >> Thank you so much. >> Leigh Martin joining us here at Inforum 18, we are live in Washington, D.C., you're watching the exclusive coverage, right here, on theCUBE. (bubbly music)