>>from around the globe. It's the Cube with digital coverage of AWS reinvent 2020 sponsored by Intel, AWS and our community partners. Welcome to the Virtual Cube and our coverage of aws reinvent 2020. I'm Lisa Martin. I'm joined by Ali Siddiqui, the chief product officer of BMC Software. We're gonna be talking about what BMC and A W s are doing together. Ali, it's great to have you on the Cube. Thank >>you, Lisa. Get great to be here and be part off AWS treatment. Exciting times. >>They are exciting times. That is true. No, never a dull moment these days, right? So all he talked to me a little bit. About what? A w what BMC is doing with AWS. Let's dig into what you're doing there on the technology front and unpack the benefits that you're delivering to customers. Great >>questions, Lisa. So at BMC, we really have a close partnership with AWS. It's really about BMC. Placido Blue s better together for our customers. That's what it's really about. We have a global presence, probably the largest, uh, off any window out there in this in our industry with 15 data centers, AWS data centers around the globe. We just announced five more in South Africa. Brazil Latin Um, a P J. A couple of them amia across the globe. Really? The presence is very strong with these, uh, data centers because that lets us offered local presence, Take care of GDP are and we have great certification. That is Aw, sock to fedramp. I'll four Haifa dram. We even got hip certifications as well as a dedicated Canada certifications for our customers. Thanks to our partnership, close partnership with the WS and on all these datas into the cross. In addition, for our customers, really visibility into aws seamless capability toe do multi cloud management is key and with a recent partnership with AWS around specifically AWS >>s >>S m, which gives customers cream multi cloud capabilities around multi cloud management, total visibility seamlessly in AWS and all their services whether it's easy toe s s s three sage maker, whatever services they have, we let them discover on syphilis. Lee give them visibility into that. >>That 360 degree visibility is really key to understand the dependencies right between the software in the services and help customers to optimize their investments in a W s assume correct. >>Exactly. With the AWS s s m and r E I service management integration. We really give deep visibility on the dependency, how they're being used, what services are being impacted and and really, AWS s system is a key, unique technology which we've integrated with them very, very happy with the results are customers are getting from it. >>Can you share some of those results? Operational efficiencies, Cost savings? Yeah, >>Yeah, least another great question. So when I look at the general picture off E I service management in the eye ops, which we run with AWS across all these global dinner senses and specifically with AWS S S M people are able to do customers. And this is like the talkto hyper scale, as we're talking about, as well as large telcos like Ericsson and and some of the leading, uh, industry retail Or or, you know, other customers we have They're getting great value because they're able to do service modeling, automatically use ascend to get true deep visibility seamlessly to do service discovery with for for for all the assets that they run or using our S service management in the eye ops capabilities. It really is the neck shin and it's disrupting the service idea Some traditional service management industry with what we offering now with the service management, AWS s, S M and other AWS Cloud needed capabilities such as sage Maker and AWS, Lex and connect that we leverage in our AI service management ai absolution. We recently announced that as a >>single >>unified platform which allows our customers to go on BMC customers and joined with AWS customers to go on this autonomous digital enterprise journey Uh, this announcement was done by our CEO of BMC. I'm in Say it in BMC Exchange recently, where we basically launched a single lady foundation, a single platform for observe ability, engagement with automation >>for the autonomous digital enterprise. I presume I'd like to understand to, from your perspective, this disruption that you're enabling. How is it helping your customers not just survive this viral disruption that we're all living with but be able thio, get the disability into their software and services, really maximize and optimize their cloud investments so that their business can operate well during these unprecedented times, meet their customer demands, exceed them and meet their customers. Where? There. How is this like an accelerator of that >>great question, Lisa. So when we say autonomous digital enterprise, this is the journey All our customers they're taking on its focus on three trips, agility, customer center, city and action ability. So if you think about our solutions with AWS, really, it's s of its management. AI ops enables these enterprises to go on this autonomous digital enterprise journey where they can offer great engagement to the employees. All CEOs really care about employee engagement. Happy employees make for more revenue for for those enterprises, as well as offer great customer experience for the customers. Uh, using our AI service management and AI ops combined. 80 found in this single platform, which we are calling 80 foundation. >>Yeah, go ahead. Sorry. >>No, go ahead, please. >>I was going to say I always look at the employee experience, and the customer experience is absolutely inextricably linked with the employee experience is hampered. That's bride default. Almost going to impact the customer experience. And right now, I don't know if it's even possible to say both the employee experience and the customer experience are even mawr essential to really get right because now we've got this. You know this big scatter That happened a few months ago with some companies that were completely 100% on site to remote being able, needing to give their employees access to the tools to do their jobs properly so that they can deliver products and services and solutions that customers need. So I always see those two employees. Customer experience is just inextricably linked. >>Absolutely. That's correct, especially in this time, even if the new pandemic these epidemics time, uh, the chief human resource offers. The CEOs are really thick focused on keeping the employees engaged and retaining top talent. And that's where our yes service management any other solution helps them really do. Use our digital assistance chat boards, which are powered by a W X and Lex and AWS connect and and and our integration with, uh, helix control them, which is another service we launched on AWS Helix Control them, which is our South version off a leading SAS product automation product out there, a swell as RP integrations we bring to the table, which really allows them toe take employing, give management to the next level And that's top of mind for all CEOs and being driven by line of business like chief human resource officers. Such >>a great point. Are you? Are you finding that mawr of your conversations with customers are at that sea level as they look to things like AI ops to help find you in their business that it's really that that sea level not concerned but priority to ensure that we're doing everything we can within our infrastructure, wherever where our software and services are to really ensure that we're delivering and exceeding customer expectations? That a very tumultuous time? >>Yes, What we're finding is, uh, really at the CEO level CEO level the sea level. It's about machine learning ai adopting that more than the enterprise and specifically in our capabilities when I say ai ops. So those are around root cause predictive I t. And even using ai NLP for self service for self service is a big part, and we offer key capabilities. We just did an acquisition come around, which lets them do knowledge management self service. So these are specific capabilities, predictability, ai ops and knowledge management. Self service that we offer that really is resonating very well with CEOs who are looking to transform their I T systems and in I t ops and align it with business is much better and really do innovation in this area. So that's what's happening, and it's great to see that we will do that. Exact capabilities that come with R E Foundation. The unified platform forms of ability and lets customers go on this autonomous digital enterprise journey without keeping capabilities. >>Do you see this facilitating the autonomous digital enterprise as as a way to separate the winners and losers of tomorrow as so much of the world has changed and some amount of this is going to be permanent, imagine that's got to be a competitive advantage to customers in any industry. >>We believe enterprises that have the growth mindset and and want to go into the next generation, and that's most of them. Toe, to be honest, are really looking at the ready autonomous digital price framework that we offer and work with our customers on the way to grow revenue to get more customer centric, increase employee engagement. That's what we see happening in the industry, and that's where our capabilities with 80 Foundation as well as Helix. Whether it's Felix Air Service management, he likes a Iot or now recently launched Helix Control them really enable them toe keep their existing, uh, you know, tools as well as keep their existing investments and move the ICTY ops towards the next generation off tooling and as well as increase employee engagement with our leading industry leading digital assistant chat board and and SMS management solution that that's what we see. And that's the journey we're taking with most of our customers and really, the ones with the growth mindset are really being distinguished as the front runs >>talk to me about some validation from the customer's perspective, the industry's perspective. What are you guys hearing about? What you're doing s BMC and with a w s >>so validation from customer that I just talked about great validation. As I said, talk to off the hyper skills users for proactive problem management. Proactive incident management ai ops a same time independent validation from Gardner we are back wear seven years and I don't know in a row So seven years the longest street in Gartner MQ for I t s m and we are a leader in that for seven years the longest run so far by any vendor. We are scoring the top in the top number one position in 12 of the 15 critical capabilities. As you know, Gardner, I d s m eyes really about the critical capability that where most customers look. So that's a big independent validation. Where we score 12 off the way were number one in 12 of the 15 capability. So that was the awesome validation from Gardner and I. D. S M. We also recently E Mei Enterprise Management Associates published a new report on AI Ops and BMT scored the top spot on the charts with Business impact and business alignment. Use cases categories for AI ops. So think about what that means. It's really about your business, right? So So we being the top of the chart for business impact and business alignment for ai ops radar report from Enterprise Management associated with a create independent validation that we can point toe off our solutions and what it is, really, because we partner very closely with our customers. We also got a couple of more awards than we want a lot more, but just to mention two more I break breakthrough, which is a nursery leading third party sources out there for chat boards and e i base chat board solution lamed BMC Helix Chat Board as the best chat board solution out there. Uh, SAS awards another industry analysts from independent from which really, uh really shows the how we're getting third parties and independents to talk about our solutions named BMC SAS per ticket and event management, which is really a proactive problem and proactive incident solution Revolution system as as the best solution out there for ticketing and event management. >>So a lot of accolades. A. Yes. It sounds like a lot of alcohol. A lot of validation. How do customers get How do you get started? So customers looking to come to BMC to really understand get that 3 60 degree visibility. How did they get started? >>Uh, well, they can start with our BMC Discovery, which integrates very tightly with AWS s s M toe. Basically get the full visibility off assets from network to storage toe aws services. Whether there s three. Uh, easy to, uh doesn't matter what services they did. A Kafka service they're using whatever. So the hundreds of services they're using weaken seamlessly do that. So that's one way to do that. Just start with BMC Helix Discovery. Thea Other one is with BMC Knowledge Management on BMC Self Service. That's a quick win for most of our customers. I ai service management, tooling That's the Third Way and I I, off stooling with BMC, Helix Monitor and AI ops that we offer pretty much the best in the industry in those that customers can start So the many areas, and now with BMC, control them. If they want to start with automation, that's a great way to start with BMC control them, which is our SAS solution off industry leading automation product called Controlling. >>And so, for just last question from a go to market perspective, it sounds like direct through BMC Channel partners. What about through a. W. S? >>Yes, absolutely. I mean again, we it's all about BMC and AWS better together we offer cloud native AWS services for our solutions, use them heavily, and I just mentioned whether that S S M or chat boards or any of the above or sage maker for machine learning I and customers can contact the local AWS Rep toe to start learning about BMC and AWS. Better together. >>Excellent. Well, Ali, thank you for coming on the program, talking to us about what BMC is doing to help your customers become that autonomous digital enterprise that we think up tomorrow. They're going to need to be to have that competitive edge. I've enjoyed talking to you >>same year. Thank you so much, Lisa. Really. It's about our customers and partnering with AWS. So very proud of Thank you so much. >>Excellent for Ali Siddiqui. I'm Lisa Martin and you're watching the Cube.

>> Narrator: From around the globe. It's theCUBE with digital coverage of AWS re;Invent 2020 special coverage sponsored by AWS global partner network. >> Welcome to theCUBE. This is our coverage of AWS reinvent 2020 with special coverage of the APN partner experience. I'm Lisa Martin I've got a couple of gentlemen from BMC software joining me. Please welcome Greg Bukowski, the technology solutions director and Simon Blanks, area vice president Gentlemen it's great to have you on theCUBE virtual. >> Great to be here Lisa. >> Representing social distancing from across the country here. So guys, I'd like to just start Greg with you give our audience an understanding of your role technology solutions director your role and responsibilities at BMC. >> Sure I play the role of a field CTO. So I actually am aligned with our strategic CTO office and I bring their message to our customers all of our strategic customers within North America. >> And Simon, tell us a little bit about your role as area vice president. >> Well first of all, thanks for having us I have responsibility for our channels and our partners in the Americas. So I get to work both within our organization with our customers and with our partners to help them grow, to help us grow and deliver value to our customers. >> Speaking of your customers Simon the last year has been incredibly challenging and brought on a lot of challenges but opportunities. Talk to me about how that has impacted BMCs customers. >> That's a great question. You know, I think our customers are wanting to simplify that they're wanting to focus on what makes them win, right and get away from the things that, you know are not the competitive advantage. We see a lot of customers wanting to get out of the day-to-day operation of the data centers and migrate to the world of AWS but it's not as easy as we would all like it there's lots of challenges. AWS consulting partners are there to help them. One of the largest areas of challenges we see that they are having to address is manage these millions of IT assets that are constantly changing and some of them they don't even know exist and moving those to AWS, but moving them quickly, securely and of course, in a cost-effective manner. >> Talk to me a little bit about some of the speed like in the last nine months, have you seen an acceleration of those customers wanting to move workloads to AWS as we think of way back when the pandemic started and every business had to suddenly send workforces home no access to a data center or very limited. Is that something that you've seen speed up the last few months? >> Yeah we believe it's not only gained in velocity but will continue. We don't think that some of these changes to how a business is conducted are going to stop once the vaccine comes out. So yeah and you know the complexity of making this happen, you know it's difficult, especially in some of the very large organizations be it banks or telecoms or manufacturers or retailers you know it's not an easy chore and you know we've experienced some great wins in that area and helping some of our most strategic customers make that happen. >> So talk to me a little bit about Simon, what's your elevator pitch when you're going and i know you talk with customers, you talk with partners how do you describe BMC and what you guys deliver? >> Well BMC is a 40 year old company with 6,000 employees. we help 93% of the global 1000 manage their IT infrastructure right. In addition to that we help thousands of other customers with the same problems. So, you know what I tell organizations is we're there to help them be successful and to make things tick. >> Awesome thank you. So Greg, talk to me about more about the BMC solutions. You said in your role, you're also field CTO. What are some of the BMC solutions that you recommended AWS consulting partners consider to help customers, especially in this time as you're seeing more and more migrations AWS? >> Yeah I think that's a great point, Lisa. I mean, with the pandemic coming in, you know there was an initial pullback right that we saw from our customers and now as that trend, you know as the summer came on, not that it's gotten less, right. I mean obviously it's a big concern for customers but the realization of how they're going to operationalize themselves and still be a tech driven company and tech driven organization has really accelerated their digital transformation and it's driven more than anything the adoption of cloud technologies and to move into that cloud space it's brought about understanding customers how did they become more digital and to do that they have to connect their services. So underlying that challenge is really what we wanted to bring today to talk about is that BMC has an industry leading solution it's called a BMC discovery solution and it automatically goes within an organization's footprint and understands the dependencies between their infrastructure and their applications. That's really difficult, right? Typically we can just find assets, right? A lot of solutions out there can do that. What BMC does or what our solution does. That's unique in this space is that it understands relationships so that you understand from an application viewpoint which ultimately ties back to a business service into the software that runs on those assets into the applications that are supporting that as well as the platforms and infrastructure and that becomes more and more complex to date. What we see with our customers as they have cloud services they've got containers, they've got on-premise stuff. So we're working with customers today, right? We are the largest retailers in the US working with them to actually transform how they're doing business continuity. So it becomes not only an acceleration but a risk aversion program for them as well as a cost savings effort of trying to adopt that understanding those services from both within their data center, through the mainframe back into their cloud, right and understanding all those interdependencies so that they can run their business more efficiently. >> So Greg have you automated what used to be a traditionally manual lengthy process of that discovery. >> I think that is the key point Lisa. I mean when partners look to us for what value we can bring to them it's about accelerating that time all about reducing the time through automation what used to be a manual effort of understanding how these things connect and being able to having go talk to the application teams. We worked with a large bank as well. They were using other solutions in the marketplace and were taking six to nine months to map a single business service which is complex right it's got about a dozen applications that support it. We brought in our solution and they did it in three hours with one piece of information from an application team. It was unbelievable, right and these are the stories we hear all the time from our customers and this is a great solution that we have that runs in AWS. That's part of our AWS migration competency that we have and you know this is why we're here today on theCUBE. >> Well that speed improvement is massive as you just talked about Greg you know, when you think of organizations now that there is no time, there is no six to nine months to figure things out anymore right. Especially because we've all learned, I think a lot in the last nine months, professionally and personally but there's competition out there. That's ready to come and be nimble and faster and maybe with less legacy than any type of whether it's a retailer or a financial institution. So being able to get in there and discover and align this business and IT services folks to discover what they have, where they should move it that fast is really something that sounds to me like not just a survival mechanism, keeping the lights on during a strange time, but something that may even set apart the winners and the losers of tomorrow. >> Absolutely right. I mean you have to be able to tie into your existing infrastructure for print that traditional legacy or heritage as we call it for print that you have, that still runs your core business. Right, if you're a retailer it's probably some kind of supply chain rate If you're a bank it's all the financial transaction stuff that you do but then also adopt the technology and innovation that exists within the fintech space for a financial services customer and bringing that together and when you're doing that at the native integration point a lot of it comes into the cloud services, right and that's really where they're going to get the acceleration to attack new markets grow their margin in that space and that's where they need partners to help them. To adopt and learn those technologies and integrate those additionally, right we have other advanced capabilities that we offer from an AWS migration competency standpoint around cloud optimization. So when those services are running in there we also do a cost optimization that doesn't look at it from the infrastructure standpoint but actually it takes the same discovery data and lines it back to the lines of business. So the line of business now has visibility into if they're going to change what their operating model is how that's going to affect the cost in the backend services they can optimize their resources. >> So Simon looking at the capabilities that BMC is delivering. Talk to me about the BMC partner program. Why become a BMC partner? I think there's a couple of answers to that. First of all, what Greg was talking about in terms of this you know massive I'll call it reinvention of the amount of time it takes to perform some of these tasks. Some of these tasks that are done in every migration from you know months to days or hours that in and of itself can help the AWS consulting partners massively you know in their efforts. So that's one but I think more importantly than that is the culture of BMC and the importance of partners and the focus that it's getting whether or not it be from our board or CEO or down the management rank. So the channel has become massively important to our success and we're committed to helping our partners be successful right, we're committing to help them make money, right. We're actually, as a part of AWS re;Invent here were going to offer an incentive to partners to come and join our family. Traditionally there's enablement and costs associated with that and we're going to refund that cost. Plus we're going to invest our monies and refund any costs associated with the first co-marketing effort together that we can go out to the market and help them. So I think you know, it's sort of the three legs of the stool. The technology itself is you know, impressive the commitment of our leadership and we're also willing to make it you know, very economically attractive so that would be the reasons >> Everybody likes that, especially economically attractive. So in terms of what you're offering you said that around re;Invent with respect to interested perspective partners, how do they move forward with BMC to become an AWS consulting partner? What's that process like? >> Well, we have you know an onboarding team that Susan DuRoff she reports in to me and helps me with that process. But the best way to do it would be to contact me directly. My email address is simon_blanks@bmc.com and if you reach out to me directly, I'll make sure we get back to you promptly. We can have further discussions and you know, facilitate it and we really look forward to making that happen. >> That's pretty excellent personal service I like that. So Greg talk to me as we get towards the wrap here as field CTO, looking forward into 2021 which we all hope is going to be trim significantly better than 2020. What are some of the opportunities that you see that this time has uncovered for the IT folks and the business folks to get even stronger alignment? >> Yeah, I think this is a great opportunity for customers to realize that bringing together the IT organizations in alignment with their business organizations is a great opportunity from the Revolut to accelerate their adoption of technology accelerate their migrations into adoption of cloud services. But then also look for the opportunities to take advantage of, to grow revenue streams. Right I mean, challenges present opportunities and opportunities present growth, right? That's how customers grow when they recognize those opportunities and become agile enough to adopt them and go after them. >> That's a great mindset because it's absolutely true. It's not matter of how we look at it and look at what's being uncovered to then kind of exploit for good new products, new services, competitive differentiators all sorts of things going on. Well gentlemen, it's been a pleasure having you on theCUBE virtual today. Thank you for joining me. >> Thank you so much appreciate the time and thank you. >> All right. For my guests. I'm Lisa Martin. You're watching theCUBE. (upbeat music)

>> Narrator: From around the globe. It's theCube, with digital coverage of AWS re:Invent 2020 sponsored by Intel, AWS and our community partners. >> Welcome to the cubes coverage of AWS re:Invent 2020. This is the cube virtual, I'm Lisa Martin and I have a new member, new guests on the cube today. Please welcome Gur Steif, the president of digital business automation at BMC Software. Gur, it's nice to have you on the program. >> Very nice to e-meet you, thank you so much for having me. >> Yes, nice to e-meet you as well. I like your office, your background, very nice by the way. >> It's a real background, it's not virtual. >> I Can tell, you got style. So, so much has changed this year and that's, and that's probably the most overused statement of 2020, right? But as we look at, you know, on theCube, every day we talk to businesses and vendors and every industry every part of the world. And we've been talking a lot about the acceleration of digital transformation, that one of the things that this challenging time has brought is that acceleration. Talk to me about it, as the leader of that for BMC, what are some of the things that you are seeing, what are you hearing from customers? >> It's a great question because customers are in fact having a hard time because there is an absolute acceleration and the need to really innovate more and faster than ever before. At the same time, a lot of customers have a lot of existing, I mean, you know, I don't like using the term legacy because it connotes something negative and in many cases those technologies are what made those companies great. So I really don't like using legacy as a negative term, but it is something you've got to carry with. And many of our customers, and we have been in a journey with our customers, have grown from the mainframe to distributed systems to virtual systems, to kind of first-generation cloud and now going into serverless architectures. And by the way, that's just the infrastructure view. At the same time, you know, on the data aspect, they went from, you know, traditional five systems to databases and SQL databases and now to all kinds of like no sequel databases and big data and streaming machine learning pipelines and on application technologies, we went from something very monolithic to client server to web and mobile and now it's all about DevOps. And the really challenging thing for customers for many of the companies we talk with is that none of those things go away, right? IT is in some cases, for some of our customers, is the archeological science. So we may want to create this amazing new system of innovation and system of engagement that is going to be 100% cloud-based. But some of the data and some of the fundamental elements come from systems of record that may run on a different environment. So this is very complex for customers. What we've done over the years is we're able, we're helped customers to move for distant transition and always manage new technologies and new capabilities without abandoning everything else and really managing it as one thing. What we're really excited about this year is that we are actually going SaaS, right? We've announced that the Control-M is going to be available as BMC Helix Control-M, available as SaaS, starting December 1st. Now, the really interesting element here is that when we are working with customers to do this, to really help them manage their environment better, it's not that we're saying, hey you're going to have to move all your estate from an on-prem to SaaS. Many customers actually tell us that this complexity is not going away. But because they're going to keep running a lot of their on-prem systems on prem, right a lot of their system of record. If you're a bank and you have a mainframe, you're not likely to just get rid of it anytime soon. Kind of like global warming, even with global warming glaciers take a long time to melt, right? The mainframe is going to be here for a really long time and systems of record are going to be on the mainframe and on-prem for a long time. And customers want to keep managing that because what we do is we help them run those systems better and they want to make sure they keep doing this but for all the no systems of innovation, they want to be able to do that natively in the cloud. And a SaaS offering is perfect for that. So we really try to help make it easy for customers, try to help them to manage any type of system they have from more legacy or more traditional systems to brand new serverless technologies and do it in a way that makes sense, whether it's on-prem or SaaS. >> Right, so in that hybrid multi-cloud environment which so many businesses are living in and as you talked about, I like your take on legacy versus sort of existing and sort of maybe business building foundational technologies that were essential at the time. So that hybrid multi-cloud world is just something that many companies are living in whether it's strategically, whether it's by, you know, organically by acquisition. In terms of having that workload automation across on-prem, public cloud, private cloud. Talk to me about how this is like aligning, I'm thinking like the DevOps folks with the lines of business. Because they all want to be driving towards business outcomes. And especially right now, it's about how can we keep pivoting our business as the world is changing to be successful and to be meeting our customer's demands where they want them to be met. >> It's a very very good point because the business requirement in many cases is really around agility. How can we move faster? And all those things we talked about, whether it's going into cloud or going into DevOps, or going into machine learning, it's about agility. It's agility on infrastructure or agility on the application architecture or agility on how we drive value out of data. So the business wants to move fast. At the same time, we have the requirement for stability, reliability, governance. Many industries are very, very regulated. If you're in the financial services industry, you spend a tremendous amount of time on dealing with regulation and compliance. So one of the things that we really try to do to help customers accelerate innovation is really help them incorporate everything that we do into the DevOps model, right? But do it in a smart way so that they can create automation rules, they can create everything that has to do with application, using code, right? It's jobs as code. So all the flow, all the definitions, all, everything that we do is all managed as code and the developers can store it as part of their, use DevOps tool chain. But there's an element there that allows the more traditional elements of the it organization to drive standards, to drive compliance, to drive policies to drive rules, that it has to be validated against before it goes into production. But what that does is it allows, it makes the developer, it makes it easier for a developer to really make sure that, as soon as they build the application, it is going to be compliant with all those policies. So it's not like they do all of that and roll it on, they do all these beautiful DevOps in tests and when it needs to go into production, it's close to a screeching halt because ops need to look at it and goes, wow, no, you need to change this, this, this, this, this and that, right? They're able to make sure it's all compliant from the get-go, which is really really valuable and allow companies to really accelerate their transformation, which is what everybody wants to do to drive the business outcomes. >> Exactly. We're looking for that, that catalyst or those catalysts that really facilitate businesses not just surviving today but really becoming the winners of tomorrow. So talk to me Gur, about the BMC and AWS, we talked about sort of this multi-cloud environment, the move with Control-M into SAS, what are you guys doing with AWS? So when we decided to move into SaaS, we said, we have to host our solution center. And it's important that we support multiple clouds before, like you could use Control-M on prem and use it to drive workloads that run in AWS or Azure or GCP, or you name it or private clouds for that matter all the way down to the mainframe. But when we were saying, we're going to roll Control-M out in SaaS, we said, we have to host it somewhere and we have to have a partner that's going to help us. I have an amazing team of developers that are the best, bar none in writing on-prem code. And they are going to be trading SaaS code for the first time. And we just found it that Amazon AWS with their SaaS factory, with the network of partners, with the tools was just a really really valuable way for us to accelerate that process. AWS has distinct that they call SaaS Factory which really helped us think through how we code some things, how to properly think about security, how to properly think about availability zones, how to properly think about so many things that are absolutely critical when you go into the SaaS world. So it really helped us accelerate the process. They also have a great network of partners that we're able to leverage and truly been a great partnership. >> So Control-M, Helix Control-M hosted on AWS. Talk to me about a customer situation. Now, for example, BMC customer, AWS environment needing to really drive their business forward, get that control and that visibility across their entire environment. How do you all work together, customer BMC, AWS? >> Great question. If they're an existing BMC customer, then they could simply talk to us, We can help them and we can introduce AWS where it's relevant or where they have some questions about how to work with the cloud. And many of our customers have a lot of experience with us in the on-prem world and they're choosing AWS as their cloud partner and so that's just a natural evolution and that's a super easy situation. There are cases where we actually work with AWS and AWS, as they work with customers to digitally transformed their environment, go and say, you could actually benefit from this. So there've been cases where we've actually worked together with AWS on some of those customer situations. Now we are in early days, right, the product is going to go GA December 1st. So right now we have about a dozen customers in what we call the early access program that we have not yet rolled this as generally available to the general public but the early integration, early work that we've done with AWS, not just on the technical side but across the ecosystem has been great. >> So go to market direct, go to market also through AWS. There's customers in that early access program, some of the things I'm thinking about when you're talking about what you guys are enabling is operational efficiencies, cost efficiencies. >> Absolutely. >> Anything that you can give us from one of those customers that's in early access, big business outcomes that they're achieving? >> I think the most fundamental aha moment for me, talking to the early access customers was, when we're thinking on-prem, we're thinking, okay, you know customer buys something, and we don't really cheap CDs, right, they download it. But you're thinking of time to value that's measured the days, sometimes weeks. And when we did the first proof of value with some of the early access customers, they didn't want to get into all the technical capabilities of the product at first, but the fact that they were able from the moment they got the welcome to BMC Control-M email, to the point that they were able to actually run jobs and drive value from the product in less than 10 minutes. That was eye opening for them and frankly, eye opening for me because I realized that the way you think about is different. because the fact that you can start to driving value within 10 minutes of getting your, welcome to BMC helix Control-M email, is just phenomenal. It's something that nobody could really accomplish with an on-prem environment. >> We've been talking about time to value for a long, long, long time. But I think in the context of today's world it's different 'cause as we saw when this pandemic first started, there was massive pivot. Businesses are pivoting and pivoting and pivoting. It's not just the one time, but it was really in the beginning I think about keeping the lights on and survival. Now it's as we get into this, and as we expect certain parts of this to be permanent in terms of how we work is changing, how we deliver services to customers that consumer demand is there in the consumer space, it's there in the it world as well. But like give me some nuggets of, what's of value to say like a higher education, like a university for example, is it being able to get students online faster? I'm just kind of looking for that silver nugget of value in a contextual setting. >> Let me give you an example from, actually let's, I'm going to pick an example from a really old industry, like a company that's been around for over a hundred years, right? So they've been around since before the mainframe, right? They build farming equipment, they build tractors, they build trucks. And every one of those has hundreds and thousands of sensors that collect data. So if you think about it now, this is a company that's been around for over a hundred years and never thought of itself as a technology company, but now they collect all this sensor data, they aggregate it, they try to make sense out of it. And then not only do they try to figure out, hey, you're going to have, one of your gaskets in the engine's going to to blow. They also kind of integrate that to some of the more legacy applications where they store customer data and parts information and dealer networks. So they can send the owner or the operator of the vehicle, an email saying, we can tell that your gasket is going to blow in the coming week, here are three dealers in your area that have that part on hand and are certified to make that repair, Would you like us to schedule an appointment? And they were able to reduce unplanned vehicle downtime by 40%. Now think of this, what this really means is that revenue producing assets are working more, more efficiently. Now, whether this is farm equipment, or, again, I'm deliberately picking old line industries to kind of make the point. So whether it's it's farming equipment or oil pipelines and oil Wells, right that if you have your revenue producing assets running at the higher uptime, that is a business outcome that everybody loves. >> Absolutely. I always loved those stories of traditional businesses that you talked about, who've really embraced digital transformation, done it in a smart way. But last question for you, that's a cultural shift. I'd love to just get your perspectives on the conversations that you're having with customers now, as you work with companies like that, like the traditional historical businesses, how quickly are they able to adapt their cultures and align those IT and business folks so that they don't get you swept by a newer fresher company born in the cloud that maybe has more agility and more willingness to take risks. >> One of our core beliefs of BMC is that companies are evolving into what we call the autonomous digital enterprise. That's a big transformation that the companies go through. And there are several tenants then on what it takes to really become an autonomous digital enterprise and you don't necessarily make progress on all of them at the same time. But one of those, as an example is enterprise DevOps, right? How do you read a drive agility, not just in your DevOps development processes but across how you think about it as an enterprise, right? Part of it is the data driven business, right? So the example we just gave, is how you really use data and turn it into insight and actually drive actionability, based on what you can really get from data. Which if you think about it makes so much sense, but it's not that easy to do and it requires you to also have these enterprise DevOps mindset as you innovate. There's many things, right? One of those things is automation everywhere, right? But at the end of the day we talk about automation. The more you automate, the more you could actually free up valuable resources to go do things that are high value. So there's plenty of elements to it but we believe, it's one of our core fundamental beliefs of BMC that enterprises are evolving and will continue to evolve to become autonomous digital enterprises. They will have to be digital, they will have to rely on technology to really survive and thrive in the decades to come. And we just want to be we with AWS, with BMC Control-M, Helix Control-M, just want to help them succeed in that mission. >> As a facilitator at that autonomous digital enterprise, well, Gur, it's been just a pleasure to have you on the program. Thanks for joining me today and sharing with us what BMC and AWS are doing together and how you're helping those organizations become the autonomous digital enterprise. We appreciate your time. >> Thank you so much. For Gur Steif, I'm Lisa Martin and you're watching theCUBE. (soft music)

(upbeat music) >> Hi and welcome to another Cube conversation. This one from BMC Helix Immersion Days in Santa Clara Marriott in Santa Clara, California. I'm Peter Burris. Every organization that attempts significant change, and there are a lot of organizations attempting digital transformation, which is about as significant a set of change as you can make, has to worry about what platform, what foundation has to be in place to make that change easier, and that's what we're going to be talking about in this conversation. We've got John Fraser, who's the Managing Director of Service Management in Online Business Systems. John, welcome to the Cube. >> Thanks Peter. >> So, tell us a little bit about online business systems. Let's start there. >> So, online business systems is a Canadian digital transformation in cyber security consultancy. We've been around now for 33 years. We're headquartered in beautiful Winnipeg, Manitoba, but I have operations all across North America and we're about 330 people today and growing rapidly. >> Winnipeg happens to be one of my favorite cities in the world, so good for you. >> Perfect. All right. So, let's talk about, I mentioned up front this notion of a stable platform, a stable foundation. Tell us a little bit about what your understanding of, as you work with your clients, what constitutes that stable foundation for change? >> Well, one of the biggest challenges we see with companies, is they try to make change in the wrong way. Too much, too fast with no control, no governance and they just don't have the proper controls in place. One of the biggest challenges with change in an organization in digital transformation today is they don't know where they're starting from. So, one of the fundamentals is really understanding where they're beginning and what they're trying to change. It's staggering to see organizations, and I've got lots of stories to tell around companies that have gone through major program transformations to really trying to embrace digital technologies only to fail again and again and again, because they don't understand how things are connected together or where they're starting from. >> So, the foundation has to start with knowing what's in the foundation? Have I got that right? >> That's right. You can't change what you don't know. >> So, it's online business systems helps clients move through some of these digital transformations. I got to believe that the service management element is a crucial feature of any successful transformation. >> Absolutely, we begin with embracing technology to help companies understand where they're starting from. We leverage a lot of tools and techniques in terms of understanding where they're starting as an organization, the people, and then using tools like BMC's Helix discovery to understand all of the components that make up the systems within their organization that they're trying to transform and how they're all connected together. >> Now, as we go through this process, one of the things that a lot of my clients are discovering is that the cyber security challenges get that much more extreme. One of the things that's become increasingly obvious is as companies talk more about digital business, talk more about how they're transforming and generating new classes of revenue or customer experience, they become more obvious target to the bad guys. What is the relationship between digital transformation, service management, and cyber security? >> Yeah, and interesting you say that. We believe as an organization that they're intertwined. You can't do digital transformation without a strong cyber security program. You can't do either one of them without automation. The pace of change and more importantly the volume of threats and challenges facing the organizations is beyond human capability. You can't do it manual anymore. It doesn't matter how many people you throw at it, it's just impossible. So, you've got to automate, you've got to leverage technology, artificial intelligence to really face these challenges. >> So, given your standing and working on the service management side, what are some of the steps that your customers are taking to ensure that they are going to succeed with digital transformation in a way that doesn't open them up to security issues? >> So, one of the key areas is understanding, like I said before, where they're starting from. How all of the components that make up their business service fit together and then, understanding from a security aspect how to prioritize fixing those threats. One of the biggest challenges in securing your organization, today is understanding what to work on. The average large organization gets thousands and thousands of new vulnerabilities a day and the back log just becomes insurmountable. So, without being able to understand how to prioritize that work against valuable business services, they're never going to win. >> So, you mentioned something about service capabilities or service components, the historical norm for IT has been, until a few years ago, to focus on mainly the hardware or infrastructure assets as the things to be managed and that has been not working as well in a world where we're delivering digital services to customers and partners for revenue or other purposes. So, what constitutes a service capability or a service component in your mind as kind of the new notion of asset within IT? >> It's assets, anywhere. It could be the traditional hardware sitting in your server room. It could be servers and/or microservices sitting in a cloud location, it could be a software as a service component. They all make up business services together. >> Or combinations of all of them. >> It often is combinations of all of them together and that's one of the biggest challenges is understanding how they all fit together and how the information flows. So, for instance, if an organization is trying to prioritize how to secure a business service. Let's use automated tellers as an example. They may have traditional on premise servers, they may have cloud offerings and they may have third-party software as a service just protecting their servers on premise is not going to protect that business service, so you really need to understand how all of the pieces fit together. >> So, are you actually working with business leaders and IT leaders to do a better job with defining what constitutes a digital business capability and use that as an organizing principal for how they think about how all their resources come together? >> Yes, it's critical that you have business and IT working together and you have the right level of business working with IT. Without sponsorship at the executive level, digital transformation will fail. >> Even in Canada? >> Even in Canada. >> Well, this has been a great conversation. John Fraser who's a Managing Director and Service Management in Online Business Systems. Thanks very much for being on the Cube. >> Thanks Peter. >> And once again, this has been a Cube conversation from BMC Helix Immersion Days in Santa Clara Marriott and I'm Peter Burris. Thanks until next time. (upbeat music)

(upbeat electro music) >> Hi and welcome to another CUBE Conversation. This one from BMC Helix's Immersion Days, Santa Clara Marriott in Santa Clara, California. I'm Peter Burris. As we think about what organizations have to do over the next few years, imagine a world in which technology's being applied to generating revenue where customer experience is dependent upon technology, where your overall operational fabric and framework and likelihood of staying in business is tied to how well your technology plant works. That's where we're going and bringing an IT capability that's capable of supporting and sustaining those demands on business is an absolutely essential thing for businesses of all side. Fundamental, we have to think about how digital services that's delivering those new sources of revenue, new experiences and operations management which is ensuring that the predictability and certainty of how operations work is at the heart of many of the changes within IT today. Got a great guest to talk about that. Vidya Srinivasan is the Product Strategy and Marketing Executive at BMC Software. Vidya, welcome back to the CUBE. >> Pleasure to be here. >> So I said a lot upfront but lets start by getting the simple update. Where is BMC Helix today? >> Yeah, so Peter you were there for our first launch last year. I think about a year and a half ago. So since then obviously we've come a long way. We've onboarded a lot of customers, existing customers as well as new logos. So we are at a point where our customers are happy with Helix. They want to see more. They're working with us to roll out chat bots, really implementing a lot of our AI automation technologies. And as you heard today, eighteen months in, we now have Helix kind of expanded into the ITOM world. So we are actually bringing together the conversions of ITSM and ITOM with our Helix platform. So now officially, Helix is able to support a lot of the IT operations management functions that include monitoring , that include remediation, that include capacity and cost optimization. So it's really bringing together the two worlds of IT. That's really a foundation for a lot of our IT organizations. So we are very happy to announce it today at the Immersion Day Events and we are looking forward to a great update probably in the next six months. Back with you. >> Well one of the many challenges that an IT organization faces is that the nature of the assess that they're trying to generate returns on or changing away from hardware up into often software defining for structure and software and data as well. And that's one of the catalysts for why this ITOM/ITSM conversions is starting to happen. So we have had these people in silos. What kind of tensions is that generating as businesses try to deploy and utilize their IT in new and expressive and innovative ways? >> Yeah that's a great question. When we talk about the foundation of anything to do with IT, right, is knowing what you have. And as people heard in the keynote today, it's turning your unknowns to knowns, right? A big part of the challenge with IT is not knowing what you have. So discovery, as you said, is one of the foundational solutions we have within the Helix Suite that helps customers discover what they have whether it's as assets, it could be software, especially in a software world. So really understanding what you have and then being able to proactively and predictively monitor those assets, knowing what vulnerabilities you have, being able to automatically remediate those, and ultimately it's delivering the ultimate service experience to the end customer. So that's where Helix as a whole with Discover, Monitor, Service, Re Media and Optimize gives you the whole good handle on what you have and be able to ultimately provide the service of the future that we all as consumers in our day to day lives expect, we'll start expecting in our work lives. >> Well there has historically been some tension between the ITOM people and the ITSM people. They've been very strong siloed, each intent on optimizing their own capabilities. That has undermined business in many respects and certainly undermined the IT mission because a lot of people look at IT as being the problem in large measure because they have been throwing information back over the fence and sometimes at each other. So in your experience, now Helix has been out there for a year and a half. In your experience, how are ITOM and ITSM groups starting to work better together? Utilizing tooling that's not built for just one but is actually built for the idea, the promise of a greater more converged set of functions? >> Yeah so I think the tug of ITSM and ITOM organizations continue to exist and the convergence starts happening when the organization starts starting to mature in their life cycles. So let's take a simple example of a ticket. You as an end user open a service request, it goes to a service desk, somebody picks it up, and ultimately if that ticket is associated with an asset or a service that's running somewhere and the actual Cloud instance or something is broken, that's a perfect example of an end user, an agent in an ITSM scenario and an IT operations person having to all work together to make the customer happy. So that is a typical scenario in every organization and every organization has multiple service desks and multiple lines of business, not just IT issues. So making sure that through our solutions, making sure that we can minimize the existence of IT silos is a big part of what Helix brings to the table. And as we rule out the capabilities, whether you call them Discover, you know, the five capabilities that we outlined or whatever you might be referring to within the organization. It is important to make sure that the ultimate platform that brings them together is seamlessly integrated, whether it's all on one physical platform or through integration strategies across other tools in the industry, but that's kind of the intent of bringing together these two worlds. >> But at least the data is working together. >> Exactly. >> So I want to highlight one of the things you said and why it's so important we start thinking about this differently. You noted the idea of a user, an ITSM or a Service Management professional and then someone who's on the operations side doing configurations or provisioning of resources. When that person that started that off, who generated that ticket, is an employee we have certain degree of control over how fast we can service them. When we start talking about that user being a customer, now we're really talking about service experience. We're really talking about the brand. We're really talking about revenue. How is the emergence of a new class of users, being customers and increasingly using things like Robotic Process Automation, other forms of software, that are generating these kinds of requirements, altering the demand for some of these advanced tools? >> Yeah there's quite a bit of things you touched in that question so from an end user standpoint, automation comes in various forms and obviously from an end user standpoint it's this channel of preference and that's where leveraging technologies like chat bots from an end user experience standpoint, being able to use your phone, it could be your tablet, whatever it might be or your voice assistance through your phone, all of those are things that customers are expecting because you know, that's how I communicate on a day to day basis so it's nothing new. On the RPA and the automation side on the back end of things there's definitely this notion of augmented, I know a lot of our speakers spoke about this earlier, this notion of augmented intelligence that we all need to kind of embrace in order for us to deliver that end user experience and end user doesn't have to be B2B. It can be B2E, B2C, whatever it might be. At some point at least in this world we are kind of getting to a point where it doesn't matter whether it's a B2B, B2C, or B2E. It's everybody is an end user and there is no delineation in terms of the experience that anybody expects. So that's kind of what we expect to transcend into the back office whether it's IT service desk or if it's the IT operation's persona. Being able to discover or scan things from your chat bot, from your tablet, instead of having a honking machine that you normally think of when you think of a knock. So those are all things I think are sort of going to be erased in terms of what we think of IT ops. as we look into the next three to five years. So that's the experience that I think, it's not just limited to an end user but across the IT organization. What does that experience look like for all the various personas to coexist and collaborate within the construct of an enterprise. >> So, you again, have been out with customers. Either taking remedy customers and bringing them to Helix or brand new customers and bringing them to Helix. What are some of the patterns of success that you're starting to see? Where does it tend to start? What kinds of outcomes are they achieving? Where do you see your happiest customers being? >> I think it's spectrum of customers right, so it's a range. There are customers who are at an early stage in terms of just thinking about how to move to Cloud so those customers are simply thinking about okay I've been using your OnPrem Solution Remedy for a while and we are at a point where we need to move it to in to a SaaS model. So there are customers who are just looking to lift and shift and move to a SaaS model. There are other customers who, it's a no-brainer, they started with us in a SaaS model and then now they're looking to leverage more of the NextGen experience, so they are looking at chat bots, they're looking at RPA bots and working with us on that. And then there are customers who are just looking to integrate with us on different fronts. They might be using other tools and then they're looking at leveraging our integration capabilities or whatever it might be so there's a variety of different customers in different stages but obviously a big part of this shift we are seeing that's common across these is the move to SaaS and the fact that they don't want to worry about running their operations as much as they want to reinvent and innovative and grow. So that's the common theme that we're seeing across the variety of customers that we're helping today. >> Vidya Srinivasan, Product Strategy, Marketing Executive, BMC Software, once again thanks for being on the CUBE. >> Thank you very much for having me. >> And from the BMC Helix Immersion Days at Santa Clara Marriott in Santa Clara, California, I'm Peter Burris. Once again this has been a CUBE Conversation. Until next time. (upbeat electro music)

>>Hi and welcome to another Cube conversation today were BMC Felix's Immersion Days and the Senate Clara Marry on Santa Clara, California We're having a great series of conversations about the convergence of digital service's and operations management on one of the most important features of that is How do you realise Analytics Analytics is on? The tip of everybody's tongue is these days, but it's being applied marketing and sales >>kind of the >>surely cobbler's children that aren't getting the same treatment or, in fact, the IittIe organization. So what we're gonna do in this next few conversation is learn more about how I t analytics is beginning to transform I t. And facilitating this convergence of digital service is in operations management. And to do that, we've got Gore over Bari. Who's the president's or co founder on CEO of numeric fi. Welcome to the Cube. >>Thank you, Peter. Pleasure to be here. >>So, Gaurav, tell us a little about new verify. Let's start there. >>Sure. Yeah, I know. I liked, you know, in your opening statement, he talked about I t in terms of its own use of analytics being a little like, you know, a situation where the cobbler's children don't have any shoes because I t stood up pretty powerful analytical applications for the CMO, the CFO, VP of sales, et cetera, but not for writing itself. And so we think. Yes, it's ironic, but it's also untenable. And it's untenable because in the age of digital transformation, where you're opening up digital channels for revenue generation and the like and customer engagement, I t. Is really moving up from the basement to the boardroom, right? So you have CEOs who worry now about things like availability, about sort of a speed of innovation with quality and things like that. And so to be able to have a decision support system ah, system of intelligence, if you will, that across rank and file off i t across the plan bill run life cycle across the entire idea. State from infrastructure to ABS to Business Service's gives you recommendations and intelligent insights on how to, you know, improve the quality of your work, the health of your systems to reduce the risk of your systems that we felt it was an idea whose time had come on. So that's why we got started with the Mer if I and we rolled out a bunch of targeted analytical applications across areas like Project Analytics develops analytic service and lyrics, Asset Analytics and the like. And so it's sort of a string of purse that you can deploy across your I T organization and its interconnected s so you can ask cross getting questions as well. So that's in a nutshell. The story in America, Fi in its vision. >>So, Garv, I've been within a proximate to i t You're in I t for a long time now. And it's not that we didn't have reporting because I t was always doing reporting. We have poured on no stop lights projects wherever they were. But I think what you're saying is something a little bit more fundamental. It's really Can we do a better job of really capturing the resources that are creating value for the business, understand how to deploy them or successfully We're not just talking about the infrastructure. We're talking a lot about people. I got that right. >>You hit that nail on the head there. Ultimately, you know it is a business, and you have to if you want to face sort of the epic challenges and opportunities off tomorrow that I t alone can really take on. You have to understand the people process, project and product dimensions of the I t business. And so what that means is, if you want to drive down your iron oh, costs from, you know, roughly 72% of I t budget, which is what it was. The average today to 50% is the gold standard. That's half a trillion dollars for the G two K, right? And you want to take that savings and reinvest it in agility in foster app. David. Higher quality, right? How do you do that without tapping into things like automation and the use of analytics to drive down your ire no cost rationally and increase your dev your development velocity intelligently? Right? So that's where analytics has a huge role to play. >>But also it's got to be fucking interrupt you. It's gotta be that you have to have. You have to start with visibility. Yep, into what resource is are generating the greatest return? Yeah. Why air they generating that return? Why are other resources not generating return? Yeah, and seeing how all that gets connected across the range of activities that a nightie organization is performing on behalf of the business. >>Yeah, I know exactly. I think the how is really about getting that visibility across sources, and it's a non trivial problem to do that when you have a plethora of sources that were never built to talk to one another. You may want to, for example, with an I t. Understand. You know, the total open work on each person's plate, right? So they may have a bunch of incident resolution work that they're doing, and the data and the signal from that comes from a B, M, C or a service now and yet they may be pulled into apt of work, which the signal is coming from Ajira or a C A. How do you pull that together into a single dashboard that gives you that view of what everyone's working on? And then you can make decisions like goodness with so much unplanned work that's gone Fred's way, there is no way that the epic that he's involved with is going to, you know, be completed on time. So I have Project Chris. I have released risk as a result, I may even have attrition risk. And so the ability to pull together data into a single model answer the visibility question, too. You're to the point you make and then go the next step off predicting likely outcomes. That's the magic. And that's the use of analytics to sort of trance for my tea into, um, you know, operating in a far more intelligent paradigm than it has thus far. >>Other tools have attempted to do this, but they attempted to basically be the soup to nuts tool. So they forced users Thio install agents everywhere that there was a single process model that was expected to be employed to administer all kinds of different resources. There are very significant limits on how you considered application development application management, For example, Why is numeric five different? >>Yeah, what we've tried to do is really take ah leaf from the page on books of those who have set up succeeded in this endeavor before. So if you look at you know the solutions that a CMO might have it at her fingertips or a CFO might have right fundamentally, it's about pulling data into existing systems, not requiring a change of behavior but pulling data from existing systems into a canonical model into a standard sort of analytical data model that runs on surfing. Ah, a dedicated stack on. Then you basically have this layer off descriptive, prescriptive and predictive analytics sort of folded in on. That's the approach we've taken where we say, Hey, look, we want There is such a thing as a change management system that doesn't go away. We would like to mind the accumulated history of all the changes you've ever put into production by tapping into your service management system and then your upstream Devon test system. Because change is often a piece of court, it began its life somewhere in a in a death cycle. So how many times was that piece of court rollback tested? How many times that it failed the testing cycle? Who worked on it? What's been their success rate thus far? And then, with respect to the change itself in the past, how often has a change like this failed? You know, if changes were done on a weekend through a combination of an unsure in offshore team, is that implicated in a failed changes in the past and then downstream of the change in the past, you know, Was it a decline in performance or usage availability as gleaned from your monitoring tools? So we pull all data from all these sources without requiring you to re instrument them into a standard model. And then, for every upcoming change, we tell you Hey, this one is a risky change. Go look at it. Send it back for further testing. Hey, this one is a lower exchange pusher to production directly and so inherently thehe bility toe pull data from multiple existing sources into a standard data model and have best practice reports and insights sort of layer on top. That's the approach taken. >>Well, look, I really like this. Uh, let me let me see if I can summarize something you just said So Numeric fei is not immediately antagonistic to anything that anybody has with the shop. That it starts from a proposition. That look what you're doing is working or not, But let's start from across from a premise. It you're doing something now. Let's learn more about it. Let's then asked Can we do it better? Yes or no? You have the intelligence to do that. And if it should be replaced, can you actually get to the point of that? You can actually indicate or suggest how and when to replace something. >>Yeah, that's a fabulous question. I think you know, increasingly what we're seeing is that our customers are pulling us in the direction off, making active recommendations on decisions that they could potentially make such as, you know, you may want to consider consolidating a certain class of applications because, you know, given its revenue and usage, the amount of support button associated with it is too high here. You might want to take a more refined and data driven, inside driven approach to asset retirement because you know this whole, >>you know, >>everything that Lenovo, in five years old Moscow is too blunt an instrument, you know, retired those assets that are the most error prone and keep alive those assets that still have useful life >>And that process, maybe itself be extremely expensive, very limited returns >>precisely precisely. So the ability to transcend now from just visibility on dashboards to providing active recommendations for every action along the way, you know, project race release risk, patrician risk, change, risk service quality risk, et cetera. We see that as as the as the vision for us. You know, it's the use of a I not just for automation, you know, sort of Ah, which clearly the ops field is investing in, but also the use of a i for decision support for providing you with intelligent recommendations across the full sphere of activities that I t undertakes. >>Grove Ari from the from the verify. Thanks very much for being on the Cube. >>My pleasure. Thank you. >>Once again, this has been a cute conversation from BMC. Helix is immersion days and the we look forward to seeing you again. Thanks for listening.

>>Hi, I'm Peter Burress. And welcome to another cute conversation. This one from BMC Helix is immersion days in Santa Clara Marriott in Santa Clara, California One of the biggest challenges that every IittIe organization faces. In fact, every business is how to start merging greater control through I t sm as well as greater change and evolve ability of systems through Dev ops. It's a big topic. A lot of folks looking at how best to do it. We've got a great person here to talk to us about it. Dick Stark is the president CEO of right star Dick. Welcome to the Cube. >>Well, thanks very much for having me. I really appreciate the opportunity beyond the Cube here. >>Excellent. Well, why don't we start? Tell us a little about right start? >>Sure. Right. Stars in I t sm consultancy and we happen to be a dev Ops consulted to say at the same time, we're also a BMC solution provider and lasting solution provider. Now, we've been a BMC solution provider for for 16 years, so we've been in this space a long time and we've earned several accolades up along the way. We made it into the Forrester I t s m service provider. It's not called a Magic Quadrant because that's what God gardener uses. But instead it's a wave report. And so we made it sort of into the far right hand quadrant there. And if you added up all the points we ended up in North America being rated number five out of all the different idea Sam Consultancy. So it's very proud about that. And then last year with BMC, we were the North American Solution provider of the year in the D S. M space. >>Well is an export person, I can tell you Congratulations. Those waves very seriously. Let's jump into this question, though off what does I t. S m from a technology and people in process standpoint have to do to accommodate some of the changes that are being founded and defusing out of the Hole Dev Ops world, which is just having an enormous impact on our I t thinks and does >>it really has. And you know, we've been in the space a long time and I t s m Sometimes I tell the words are interchangeable and there are about if you can believe this about three million people That ended up getting an Idol certification of some short like an Idol Foundation certificate. And over time, that's been have been a really a big, big deal. However, Idol now is lost, its luster just a little bit. And it's allowed Dev ops to sort of sneak in or add dollar whatever you won't want to call it, and I'd listen. Standing still, though, they've bounced back and bounce back in a hard way. And they've they've come up with what's now called Idle for an Idol For was just released this this year, and it takes some of those Dev ops principles, and it has its own value stream as well and is a result Idle for or agile idol or whatever you wanna call it now is taking a little bit stronger position. And when I say Dev ops principles, it's things like Collaborate. It's things like promote, it's It's things like operate and automate. It's It's It's all about it again. It's all about collaboration in some of these other values that that you'll see in Dev ops. I guess what what happened is we spent a lot of time on the Idol side of things, and we did things for process sake and a good example would be changed management and spent a lot of time putting together is change management processes per this idol framework. Okay, And what what happened is that a lot of the users then rebelled a little bit because it might take longer to go through and fill out all the paperwork of It's not paperwork the online tool set then to do a change than to actually perform the change itself. So I don't got a little bit of a bad rap. And so that's where this whole Dev ops thing has come in. And the whole idea right now is to get Dev and Ops under the Shame umbrella, because that's not typically very used to do. But it's, but it's certainly happening. >>Well, let's talk about why that intersections happening, right? So I'm gonna I'm gonna show a little bit of history from my perspective as well, you know, I told began, First of all, it started in some government agencies many years ago, but it started as the basis of it was How do we take better care of the assets with an I T. Which at the time were mainly hardware. In many respects, what we've seen happen over the last 25 30 years that Idol has been an extent. Is that the nature of the assets that I t recognizes? His acknowledges delivering value for the business has changed. We've gone from hardware to infrastructure is code. That's where Dev Ops is so many respects. What you're saying is that Iittle is now trying to bring the best of what it means to do a good job of asset management with a new class of assets. Namely, software is code infrastructures code, and that's where we have to have that marriage. I got that right. >>That's that's correct. And you don't want to have silent silos. You want to be a silo buster if if anything else. And I just wanted to mention something else that I think is kind of fun along with this Idol. Four. We now do what's called the Mars Lander simulation traded it replaced. If you've heard of the Apollo 13 simulation, will Mars four, even though it's idle for specific, it's really all about Dev ops, and I took the Mars board just about a month or so ago, and it's a lot of fun. You sit down and the whole objective is to get get to Mars and you're a business. So and you're going to be selling the data that you're going to collect along along the way. And so the whole idea is to is to make a profit, and you have all these different roles that you play. When I went through it, I was the release manager then. But you might have a business analyst. You might have a service desk person. You have vendors and a it's it's really it's very realistic that and typically like a lot of large enterprises, you start playing the game and it's just chaos, and you have to go back and try this over and over again until essentially you get it right. And I was surprised how easy it is to get sucked in. If you're in a big enterprise, your silent, you have a specific role that you have to d'oh and you have instructions how you're supposed to do that and you want to stick to it. Whatever you know, whatever your assignment is, you have to do that. But that's not the right thing to Dio. Remember, it's about collaboration. It's about transparency. It's been it's about posting your goals, posting the results and moving forward from from there. And so I was surprised how I got sucked into it. And so I can understand why we need to make some progress in this space. And it's all about getting people to change their behavior a little bit in some of these new tool set certainly help >>well, as well. You're going back to what you said. He used to be the three R's of any regime or rolls responsibilities and relationships, and so the roles have are evolving. But often it's just in name only the responsibilities. You know today it's still code. It still has to run on hard, where it's not a bunch of hamsters, they're doing things. But as you said, it's really the relationships amongst the various actors as we introduce more business people. As technology gets put into position to generate more revenue or to do more with customer experience, the relationships are being pressured, are being really pushed to evolve. So how do you see in your practice in right stars practice. How do you see the relationships between Dev ops and I T s M and the business starting to evolve so that you can have amore coherent, comprehensive view of how you make sister? Well, >>I think in that particular case, it's gonna take some time. I mean, it's not gonna happen overnight. I mean, that's why you have agile coaches, or that's while you have the scales agile, or the safe framework is because people don't get it. And they need to understand how to work together better with others. And so it's not gonna happen by just implementing a new new tool set turning the key and then say, OK, everything's gonna be fine. It's good to get the integration between the different tool sets. And the technology is certainly there to do that. But without having some instruction to begin with and having the door in users cooperate. You're not going to see that kind of kind of performance improvement or cost statements or whatever it is that you're looking for. You're not going to see that >>they're one of the biggest challenges in any changes. Abandonment. The user's ultimately abandoned. So as you look a tte. The ideas M tool set that you're utilizing mainly from being right is it is that there's a degree of there's always a degree of pedagogic tool away, it says. Here's how you should do things. What you're discovering is that tool set is really catalyzing. Helping to catalyze positive changes in your mind within a lot of your customer base is, well, the >>thing about Helix, and I'm very excited about this because we're making a lot of good progress with. He likes our customer base that we have right now and give you a good example. George Washing University were based in a D C. Area day. If they are, too, they've been a long time remedy customer. We've moved them to Helix, and then, just recently, when I say recently started a year ago in August, they moved to the BMC Chap Cat box platform. Then, this past August, they totally went cold turkey with chatbots throughout the entire university. That makes a tremendous difference in the performance and not just performance, but also on the cost and the efficiency that the university, particularly from a service management perspective, is providing to its university employees and to its students, just like you mentioned today in the keynote session that it's all about mobility. And practically practically all the students there rely on their their cellphone day in and day out. And so when they have a question at G W. If it's how do I get a new account? How do I get a park parking permit? G on the wireless in my dorm room isn't working. You don't pick up the phone and call. Nobody does that you texted at. And this is a chap off its power by IBM Watson, and it works great. And there's lots of good things that are gonna come out of that. For example, students, I think they probably still have to turn paper sent. You know, maybe that's all Elektronik Lee delivered, but I think you might still have to print out a paper and turn it into your professor. You know, I'm not sure, but bluebirds Anyway, you're probably you're probably gonna do this late at night when the service desk is an open. So what do you do if you can't get the printer to work? Well, you pick up your cell phone, you text in that That the issue and bingo. You've got a response. So those are the sorts of things that are gonna make for a tremendous amount of impact, and it's gonna cause people to change their behavior in really a good way. Another good example. We have another longtime hospital customer. They have a 24 by seven service desk. They're huge, and they pay a lot of money to operate that 24 by seven. But they hardly get any call said at night. Right? Because not that many people work. So why don't they just turn that and you start using chatbots and think of that the r A. Y. It's just incredible. And I think you're going to see more. And that more situations like that as we move forward. >>Dick start President CEO of right Starr. Yep. Thanks very much for being too. >>Thanks very much. Appreciate it. Okay. >>And what's going on? Peter Burress. You've been watching other cube conversation from BMC Helix immersion days in Santa Clara. Thanks very much. Next time

>>Hi, I'm Peter Burress. And welcome to another cube conversation. This one from B M sees Helix Immersion Days and Santa Clara, California The Senate Clara Marriott. Every organization of any scale now has to lean on their suppliers in the technology world in different ways. It used to be you could almost have an antagonistic relationship with whoever was offering you technology. But today, every business is becoming increasingly dependent on technology suppliers that are providing crucial strategic service's. And that relationship is changing the way we think about technology. That is nowhere more obvious than the Manage service's provider space or the MSP space, which is highly dependent upon very complex delivery of very rich service's and a set of analytics that air allow the many service provider in the business to work together to achieve strategic ends. Now have a conversation about how that's working and how that's changing. We've got a great cube conversation got Aldo Romero, who's the cross service is deputy director at Keio Networks Mexico. Alda, Welcome to the Cube. So let's start with what is key networks tell us a little bit about Kiyo Networks. >>Okay, Kyo networks. Personally, he canna from dad and me, you know so much. Probably. Service is a technology. Inform us on the mission critical tenemos court. Enter data centers until Mexico Panorama making quarter political American Guatemala. So if >>we think about this challenge upfront, I said that increasingly, business has to think about treating its suppliers differently in the manage service providers at the vanguard of that, what catalyzed Keogh Network's decision to start thinking about how digital service is and operations management. We're gonna have to start coming together so that you could provide a better set of managed service capabilities to your clients. >>Another 50 are intellectuals For most of the heat does Bella Paralysis. Harvey Seo is a wall of stones in front under the remit Parma coral and triggers. A reason was clean and it's Santy Okay, on a work visa, no Russian grand plataforma CCTV shows was gonna transform our nose and Monroe and Moroccan era Watson was clean. A the city most cake. Alex LaMarca Hello, Obama said a roller. I mean telekinesis. Thomas put up a little emporia. Sorry. C'mon, process. So that's a gimme into control. Purple rules transformer heat element. So as >>you think about using BMC Helix and other classes of technology. You must have a vision in mind of where your relationships and how your service is are gonna be provided. Tell us a little bit about the relationship that you have with BMC Helix and how it's informing and altering and adjusting the promises in the value propositions that you have to your manage. Service customers. >>LaMarca parties with the most. The teleconference. A Norman 10. Vamos a bodyguard Transformer journals. You have a key on networks LLC and technology on the set of issues it processes your lot ago, most in your mutual momentous and those qualities of Israel experience. Check every message from Ministro. Probable servicios is most polio liberal exito process a literal form. A syndicate tile in our mentor mentor now look innocent of all arsonist risk. Leontes, his former meant importante para nosotros a parabola guarantee survey. No Star Service >>manage Service's has been around for a while. We're now talking about Cloud Service isn't as important subset of the manage service of space, but as one that over the course of the next few years might even become more important, especially in countries like Mexico that are growing so fast and introducing increasingly complex capabilities within their economies. As Keogh Networks evolves, do you see yourself being a leader in how cloud service is evolve as well? >>See if you determine, take yours leader in Lapa Improbable level problems servicios the clout that most officials the club go on Amazon. The notary's is the cloak on Microsoft tennis officials that throughout the opening stock include Syria. Infinity tormented knows Romans camellia in America. >>So one last question as you envision moving forward with this increasingly combined digital service, is management and operations management. What kind of leadership are you looking to be? Him? See? He looks for >>Leader Yasuoka. Stumbled booze can do is for their their arms. Trustee in testing facility. Tireless operaciones Sartre Business officials. The mission. Critical contextual. Here's the MTA cameras were Mr Alex Cee Lo Vamos con una Fortaleza, You know, in a para para nuestros revisions in America, he said, mass value. So spar partners >>Aldo Aldo Romero. Thank you very much for being on the Cube. Thank you. All the romero is tthe e Crawl Service is Deputy director Keogh Networks in Mexico, and once again, I'm Peter Burns. This has been another cute conversation until next time

>>Hi and welcome to another cube conversation this time from BMC helix immersion day at Santa Clara Marriott in Santa Clara, California. I'm Peter Burris, your host for today. One of the biggest challenges that every company faces as they try to think about how they're going to do more with digital services and operation in support of more complex business. And the need for greater simplicity is how to extend their ecosystem to include other sources of knowledge, other sources of insight about how a company can accelerate its journey to this new D S O M world. And to have that conversation, we've got a great partner, uh, here at BMCs helix immersion days. Rob graves is the vice president at data trend. Rob, welcome to the cube. >>Thank you Peter. Glad to be here. >>So tell us a little bit about data train. It's a, it's a BMC partner. You've been around for a long time, helping customers do some relatively important infrastructure things. Where are you guys today? >>Yeah, well I'll go back a little history. We've been in business since 1987. Same two owners, a lot of stability. They continue to drive the business for us. Um, heavy in the infrastructure space, really got started in the data center and a regional multi-site, uh, businesses, large enterprises in the hospitality, retail, financial services, et cetera, where we've grown up, um, started out like a lot of businesses selling hardware and pretty quickly as customers ask for higher value, have moved into consulting and broader services, really consider ourselves, uh, infrastructure centric systems integrator if that's a mouthful. That's really who we are and what we do. Um, as we have all of those consulting practices, more and more, we realized the need to understand our customer's environments better, oftentimes better than they even do. And came across a product called Tideway, which was launching the U S became one of their launch partners here in the U S and shortly thereafter BMC acquired them. So we became a BMC partner in 2009 and it's just been a great journey ever since. Um, at the time they were probably the most robust discovery tool and uh, uh, they've continued to keep that leadership since then. >>Well, let's pick up on that. So discovery is historically been a kind of a domain that was used mainly by an it group to have some, a little bit better understanding of what types of things they needed to do, a task needed to perform. But in a digital business, discovering digital assets becomes absolutely a strategic capability. So how has discovery of volved and then how are you using it to bring these new levels of value? >>It's a great question and it's a more and more essential as the world gets more complex and devices get more complex with cloud, with IOT and centers, Penn transient or right. It was one thing to, to be able to recognize I have these physical service servers here in my data center or maybe even in remote offices. Then, um, our friends at VMware came along and made everything virtual. So how do I manage a workload going from this physical device to another physical device? Fantastic. Actually one of my favorite Cuba, uh, interviews ever of old friend of mine, Pat Gelsinger, I just love watching all his cube interviews just came off of VMworld, very bright tastic love. But, um, they really got that going as cloud really started to, to launch, okay, now I've got application workloads, pieces of my it all over the place. Um, and keeping on top of that is just daunting. Right? And somebody's gotta give BMC a lot of credit, uh, as they've continued to remarket themselves and, and build capabilities. They are absolutely at the front of the curve, the BMC helix discovery product, um, all sorts of competitors, little startups through some very large players. But whenever we bring it into a customer, hands down, we're able to get more done. That comprehensive view of the infrastructure through the applications, through the business services. Um, we constantly come in and replace other products. Bring this back in. >>Well, one of the things that I've observed as a guy who has spent a lot of time watching the industry is, uh, technologies like discovery were especially important at the very largest enterprises because they had all these physical assets that they, that people were buying and installing and they never knew quite was what was on the network. And it was always like this thing was kind of, maybe it was appropriate for a mid size enterprise, but it didn't have the same numbers. But when you start introducing, as you said, virtualization or software robots or other transient assets and resources that are going to have a significant impact in how the business operates, the number of things that you have to stay on top of means it's now an appropriate set of technologies for virtually any size organization. Do you see that as well? >>Absolutely. And especially companies that have lots of locations, lots of sites complex it, I love that BMC jumped pretty early into extending the, the helix discovery into the IOT space. We do a lot of multisite deployments. Um, we're part of the, several of the large OEMs, IOT systems integration programs. And when you're starting to talk hundreds, thousands, even millions of devices out there, how do these companies, these users keep track of all that and make sure that they're operating properly? The security is a big issue. I mean, one of the best things I like about the helix discovery is, uh, how can you secure something you don't understand? I mean, I can't tell you how many times we've gone in with discovery. Uh, to handle one use case. Something as simple as, um, populating a CMDB or, uh, making sure that dr plan is, is solid or relocating a data center, which kind of the classic use cases of a discovery product. >>And you have the security guys come into the room just cause they're everywhere. They have to be watching everything, right? Then all of a sudden I, one of the large stock brokerages, all of a sudden the security guy jumped in the front room and said, stop, stop. What is that? And he points at our application map that came out of helix discovery. It's that, that should not be talking to that. Right. And uh, you know, basically found a big vulnerability just because of an application dependency that the security team wasn't aware of. Um, BMC has got quite a few good examples where they'll almost an accidental big security play happen just from a security guy being in the room and watching the output from discovery and seeing things that their tools had never shown them. >>And I do not want to be the guy that agitated the security guy in a meeting like that. So I was great. Isn't that the satellite board is pretty funny. So, so tell us a little bit about your customer base and how they are utilizing some of this new tooling, uh, to, uh, to extend current but also alter and change future types of business. >>Yeah, there's a, a variety of, uh, great stories. We typically play in larger enterprises, a lot of fortune one hundreds. Um, I'll, I'll leave some of the, uh, our good customers nameless, protect the guilty and the innocent. Right. But, uh, one of the large airlines, you know, went through an exercise of stamps, new dr capability. Uh, it's still wrapping that up. Um, they've had a number of unplanned outages based on new changes. They're doing a lot of change, modernizing applications, moving into new data centers. Screen new dr capabilities. You know, they thought they had decent understanding. Their environments went through their change control process. Oops. Didn't realize that other applications would depend on this server that we just did in the last upgrade on, um, took their line down for a couple of hours. You know, that's not good. Um, uh, bringing in these discovery tools very quickly, they've seen, Hey, I can prevent that. >>I can really understand in real time what's talking to what and make sure I avoid out. That's a big one. I mentioned some of the security conversations. Uh, something that we've been doing some innovation with BMC is getting to some of the discovery as a service type of capabilities and that's allowing us to do some what we're calling micro use cases. Even some simple challenges like, um, a network switch maintenance. Everyone wants to reduce the cost of, of hardware maintenance. What's really hard to discern with hundreds or even thousands of switches, which ones are supporting which workloads. So we can go into an environment and say, Hey, you've got a thousand network switches. You know, 500 of them are just supporting test. I want you to take those off 24 by seven, two hour support and really give them a real time mapping. And that's a money saver right there. That's been very difficult for them to figure out on their own. Um, because that connection from the infrastructure to the apps and the services that are being delivered. So there's a variety of different use cases like that. >>So when you think about where data trends is going to go and, uh, as your business expands in response to the new types of things that customers want to do, where do you think you're going to be spending your time with customers in say, three years? And how is this set of digital services and operations management tooling going to make it possible for you to deliver that service more reliably, more profitably, et cetera? >>Yeah, no, it's uh, it's interesting. Um, while we grew up in the data center, we touch a lot of, uh, large edge environments as well. And we're seeing more and more innovation coming at the edge. Uh, Sanjay from gen pack spoke earlier and you used a great phrase again, innovation at the edge, governance at the core, and it's really, um, something that, uh, we're seeing a lot. So new workloads out on the edge. Gotta be able to understand that, see what's out there, because more and more compute and analytics that can be done at the edge, not in your data center. That's a place we're putting a lot of focus right now. >>Rob graves, vice president of data trend. Thanks again for being on the queue. All right. You got it. Thank you. And once again, this is Peter Burris from the Santa Clara Marriott at BMCs helix immersion days. Thanks for watching. Until next time.

[Music] hi and welcome to another cube conversation this time from the MCS Hilux immersion day at the Santa Clara Marriott beautiful Northern California we're going to be spending the entire day having a series of discussions about what it means to do a better job of both digital services management and operations management and how those technologies are coming together to dramatically alter how business operates how customers get value and ultimately how profits are generated we're going to start this conversation with a CDO a chief digital officer from Genpact sanjay sri tvasta welcome to the cube thank you very much so to start tell us a little bit about Jim pacts interesting company comprised we are indeed Genpact is a large global professional services provider for digital transformation services we serve many of the fortune 500 companies around the world and we help them think through their business processes in the business models and digitally transform that to take advantage of so all the new capabilities that are coming through so digital service outcomes is a very important feature of that because I presume that when you have those conversations with customers you're talking about the outcomes that they're trying to achieve yeah and not just the services that you're gonna provide it's fine so tell us a little bit about what is a digital service outcome and why is it so important yeah well I think the reality is that what technology is doing it it's disintermediating the ecosystem so many of the industries our clients operate in and they have to go back and reimagine their value proposition of the core of what they do with the use of new innovative technologies and it's that intersection of new capabilities of new innovative business models that really use emerging technologies but intersect them with their business models with their business processes and the requirements of their clients and help them rethink reimagine and deliver the new value proposition that's really what it's all about so digital service outcome would then be the things that the business must do and must do well but ideally with a different experience or with a different degree of flexibility and agility or with and cost profile I got that right correct so when we think about that what are some of the key elements of a digital service success we like to think about three critical success factors in driving any digital transformation the first one is the notion of experience and what I mean by that is not user interface for a piece of software but the journey of a customer an employee a provider a partner in engaging with you in your business model and we think about journey mapping that scientifically we think about design thinking on the back of that and we think about reimagining what the new experience looks like one of the largest things we learned in the industry is digital transformation on the back of costs take out a productivity or efficiency is is is insufficient to drive and optimize the value that digital can bring and using experience as the compass is sort of the Northstar in that journey is a meaningful differentiator and drive our business benefits so that's number one in the second area that's become increasingly apparent is the intersection of domain with digital and the thinking there is that to materialize the benefit of digital in an enterprise you have to intersect it with the specifics of that business how users interact what clients seek how does business actually happen you know we talk about it artificial intelligence a lot we do a lot of work in AI is an example and there's key thing about machine learning is goal orientation and what is goal orientation it's about understanding the specifics of your environments you can actually orient the goal of the machine learning algorithm to deliver higher high accuracy results and it's something that can often easily get overlooked so indexing on the two halves of the whole the yin and the yang the the the piece around digital and the innovative technologies and being able to leverage and take advantage of them but equally be founded and domain understand the environment and use that knowledge to drive the right materialization of the and that's the second critical success factor I think to get it right I think that third one is the notion of how do you build a framework for innovation you know it's not the sort of thing where large fortune company 100 500 fortune 500 companies can necessarily experiment and you know it's a little bit for go happy-go-lucky strategy it doesn't really work you have to innovate at scale you have to do it in a fundamental fashion you have to do it as a critical success factor and so one of the biggest things we focus on is how do you innovate at the edge innovation must be at the edge this is where the rubber meets the road but governance has to be at the core let me build on that for a second because you said innovations at the edge so basically that means where the brand promise is being enacted for the customer and that could be at an industrial automation setting or it could be in recommendation if any any number of things but it's where the value proposition is realized for the customer correct okay that's exactly right and that's where innovation must happen so as a large corporation you must be you know it's important to set up a framework that allows you to do innovation at the edge otherwise it's not meaningful innovation if you will it's just a lot of busy work and yet as you do that and if you change your business model is you bring new components to the equation how do you drive governance and it's increasingly becoming more important you think about we're gonna be in a AI first world increasingly more and more that's the reality the world we're going in and in that AI first world you know III work here in Palo Alto I walk into my office a couple of hundred people in any given day if tomorrow morning I walked in and hundred people didn't show up for work I would know right away because I can see them now fast forward to an environment where we have digital workers we have automation BOTS we have conversationally I chat box and in that world understanding which of my AI components are on which ones are off which ones showed up for work today which ones fell sick and really being able to understand that governance and that's just the productivity piece of it then you think about data and security AI changes complete dimensions on that and you think about bias and explained ability to become increasingly important and notion of a digital ethics board and thinking about ethics more pervasively so I think that companies and clients we serve that do really well in digital transformation are those that keen on those three things the notion of experience is the true compass for how you try transformation the ability to intermix domain and digital in a meaningfully intersecting fashion and to be thoughtful proactive and get governance right up front in the journey to come so let me again building out a little bit because people are increasingly recognizing that we're not going to centralized with cloud we're going to greater distribute we're going to distribute data more we're going to distribute function more but you just added another dimension that some some of us have been thinking about for a long time and that's this notion of distributing authorities yeah so that an individual at the edge can make the decision based on the data and the resources that are available with the appropriate set of authorities and that has to be handled at a central in a in a overall coherent governed way so that leaves the next question and just before you go that I mean I think the best example of that is we do that most corporations do that really well in the financial scheme of things business is that the edge make decisions on a day-to-day basis on pricing and and relationships and so on and so forth and yet there's a central audit committee that looks through the financials and make sure it meets the right requirements and has the right framework and much in the same way we're gonna start seeing digital ethics committees that become part of these large corporations as they think about digitizing the business governance at the end of the day is how do you how you orchestrate multiple divergent claims against a common set of assets and and being able to do that it's absolutely essential and it leads to this notion of we've got to cite these ideas of digital business digital services and operations management how are we going to weave them together utilizing some of these new technologies new fabrics that are now possible to both achieve the outcomes we're talking about at scale in its speed yeah well the the technology capabilities are improving really well in that area and so the good news is there's a set of tools that are now available that give you the ingredients the the components of the recipe that's required to make dinner well you know the the work that needs to happen is actually how to orchestrate their that to figure out which components you to come in and how do you pull together a vertical stack that has the right components to meet your needs today and more importantly to address the needs of the future because this is changing like no other time in history you want options with everything you do now you want to make sure that you have a stream of options for the future and that's especially important here that's right that's exactly right and and the the the quick framework we've established there is sort of the three-legged stool of how do you integrate quickly how do you modular eyes your investments and how do you govern them into one integrated whole and those become really important I'll give you examples you know much of the work we do will work with the consumer bank for instance and they'll want to do a robotic process automation engagement will run on for nine months they'll get 1,800 robots up and running and the next question becomes well now we have all this data that we didn't really have because now we have an RPA running how do I learn some machine learning insights from there and so we then work with them to actually drive some insights and get these questions answered and then the engagement changes to well now that we have this pattern recognition that we understand more questions will be asked how do I respond to those questions a automatically and before they get asked this notion of next best action and so you think about that journey of a traditional client you know the requirements change from robotics to machine learning to conversationally AI to something else and keeping that string of investments that that innovative sort of streak true and yet being able to manage govern and protect the investments that's the key role and especially if we do want to look at innovation at the edge because we want to see some commonalities otherwise we freaked people out along the way don't exactly right so I'm J Street of AUSA thank you very much for being on the cube thank you for having me and once again I'm Peter Burroughs and we'll be back with our next guest shortly from BMC Hilux immersion day here at the Santa Clara Marriott thanks very much for listening

>>Hi, I'm Peter Burress. And welcome back to know the Cube conversation. This one from B M sees Helix Immersion Day at Santa Clara Marriott in Santa Clara, California. Once again, we've got a great set of topics for today Today, Right now we're gonna talk about is the everybody talks about the explosion in the amount of data, but nobody talks about the resulting or associated explosion in software. And that may in fact, be that an even bigger issue than the explosion and data. Because ultimately, we want to apply that data and get work done. That's gonna require that we rethink service's rethink service management, rethink operations and rethink operations management in the context of how all this new software is gonna create new work but also can perform new classes of work. Soto have that conversation. We've got a couple of great guests. New York. And here is the BMC president of Digital Service is in operations management division to BMC. Welcome back to the Cube. >>Thank you. >>And me Here shoot Close the CEO of Automation anywhere here. Welcome to the Cube. So Naoki, I want to start with you. A year ago, we started on this journey of how this new digital service is is going to evolve to do Maur types of work for people. How has be emcees? Helix Platform evolved in that time. >>So if you remember last time, it's almost a year. Back when we launched Helix, which was all around taking the service management capability that we had on Prem Minute available in cloud continue rise so customers can run and cut of their choice and provided experience through various channels bought as channel off that customer experience. This is what we had released last time. We call it the three C's for Helix, Everything in cloud containerized with cognitive capabilities so customers can transform that experience in this version. What we are extending helix is with the operation side. So although I Tom capabilities that we have in our platform are now a part off Felix, so we have one entering platform so that customers can discover every asset that they have on prominent loud monitor those assets detected anomalies service bought four lines of business and for i t. For immediate issues that happen, vulnerabilities that are there in the system and automatically optimized capacity and cost on holistic. This whole closed loop off operations and service coming together is what this next day off innovations that were launching BMC Helix >>Soma here New York He's talked about very successfully, and Felix has been a very successful platform for improving user experience. But up front, I noted that we're not just talking about human beings as users anymore. We're talking about software is users R p a robotic process. Automation is a central feature of some of these new trends. Tell us a little bit about how robotic process automation is driving an increased need for this kind of digital service in operations management capability? >>Sure think it a high level you have to think of. The new organization has augmented organization that are human and what's working side by side, each doing what they're best at. And so, in a specific example of a service organization, uh, the the BMC hell ex ist Licht Alexis Taking this is Think of this as a utility where the way you plug it into an electricity outlet and switch on the light and you get the electricity, you plug into the BMC helix, and behind it, you have augmented workforce of chat boards are pia bots, human beings each doing what they're best at and giving a far superior customer experience and like any other that is happening now. And that's the future off service industry. >>But when you point a human, so to speak metaphorically into that system, there's a certain amount of time there's a certain amount of training. There's a certain, and as a consequence, you can have a little bit more predictable scale. That doesn't mean that you don't end up with a lot of complexity, but our p A seems that the potential of our P A seems that you're going to increase the rate at which these users, in this case, digital users are going to enter into the system. You don't have a training regimen you can attach to them. They have to be tested. They have to be discovered. You have to be put in operation with reliability. How is that ultimately driving the need for some of these new capabilities? >>I think you if you think of this, if you think of this box as a digital workers, you almost have to go through the same process that you would go through human beings. You onboard them in terms of you, configure them. You trained them with cognitive capabilities and the and then in. The one difference is the monitor themselves. Without any bias they give, they can give you. They can give their own performance rating performance rating card. Um, but the beauty off this is when human and what's work together because there are some functions that the bots can do well. And then at some point they can hand off to the human beings and human beings. Do some of the more interesting work that is based on judgment. Call customer service. All of that, um, so that the combination is is the end goal for everybody >>and to add would be here said right, that customer experience, whether you're providing experience to employees, are consumers and customers. That is the ultimate goal. That's ultimate result of what you want to get and the speed at which you provided experiences, the accuracy of which you provide experience of the cause, that which you provided experience becomes a competitive sensation, which is where all this automation, this augmentation that they're doing with humans and bots is what enables us to do that right for or large enterprise customers May major service organizations trying to transform into that beautiful. >>But increasingly, it seems as though the, uh, the things that we have to do to orchestrate in ministry Maur users digital and human undertaking Maur complex tasks where each is best applied is really driving a lot of new data mentioned upfront, an enormous amount of software and you said new experiences. But those experiences have to be reliable, have to be secure. They have to be predictable. So that suggests this overwhelming impact of all of these capabilities. You talk about a digital tsunami? What are some of the key things? Do you think Enterprise is gonna have to do to start engaging that? >>Yeah, I'm incredibly college 40 nursery revolution. Whether we call our initial transformation, I think what we all are experiencing is the tsunami Texan ami, right, Tsunami of clouds, where you have corruption clouds, private clouds have a close marriage clouds, tsunami of devices, not just more valid visors, but also has everything alone, as is getting connected devices, tsunami of channels. I mean, as an end user, I wantto experience that in the channel of my preference lack as a journalism as a channel tsunami of bots, off conversation, bullets in our Peabody. So in this tsunami, I think what everyone is trying to figure out is, how do they manage this explosion? It's humanly impossible to do it all manually. You have toe augment it. But of course, intelligence, I'm all. But then, of course, boss, become a big part of that augmentation toe. Orchestrate all of them back to back cross. >>I would say that the this is no longer nice to have, because if you look it from over consumer's perspective, last 20 years of digital technologies off from my Amazons and Google's of the World, Netflix and others they have created this mind set off instant customer gratification, and we all been trained for it. So what was acceptable five years ago is no longer acceptable in our own lives, I e. And so this new standard off instant result instant outcome. Instant respond. Instant delivery V. Just expected. Right. Once you're end, consumer begins to do that. We as a business is no longer have a choice that's writing on the wall. And so what? This new platform Zehr doing like you'd be emcee. Hellickson automation anywhere is delivering their instant gratification. And when you think about it, more and more of the new customers that are millennials, they don't know any other way. So for them, this is the only experience they will relate. Oh, so again, this is not nice to see Oh, it is. But it is the only way only the world will operate, right? >>Well, what we're trying to do is take on new classes of customer experience, new operational opportunities to improve our profitability, innovate and find new value propositions. But you mentioned time arrival rate of transaction is no longer predictable. It's gonna be defined by the market, not by your employees. We could go on and on and on with that. What is taught us a little bit about automation anywhere and what automation anywhere is doing to try to ensure that as businesses go off to attend to the complexity creates new value at the same time can introduce simplicity where they could get scale and more automation. >>Sure, you earlier mentioned that with explosion of data came the explosion off applications And what? Let me focus on what problem or permission anywhere solves. If you look at large organizations, they have vast amount of applications, sometimes 408 100 few 1000 what we have seen. What we've been doing historically is using people as a human bridges between this applications. And we have a prettier that way for too long. And that's the world today. >>So humans are the interface >>humans at the bridges between applications and often called the salty air operations. That's the easiest way to describe it. So the what are two mission ever does is it offers this technology platform robotic process automation area in an Arctic split form that integrates all off it together into a seamless automation bought that can go across and with the eye it can make intelligent, intelligent choices. Um, and so now take that Combined with the BMC, Alex, and you have a seamless service platform that can deliver superior experience. >>So we've got now these swivel chair users now being software, which means that we could discover them more easily. We can monitor them more easily, and that feeds. He looks >>absolutely so you know, in our consumer wall, in a day to day life We are used to a certain experience of how we consume data or consume experiences with our TVs and all the channels that experience that we have an identity. Life is what people expect when they walk into the company, right walking to the Enterprise, which every IittIe organization is trying to figure out. How do they get to that level of maturity? So this is what the combination of what we're doing with Felix and automation anywhere brewing's that consumer great experiences into an enterprise >>world. Some here when we think about our p A. We're applying it in interesting and innovative ways, no question about it. But there are certain patterns of success. Give us some visibility into what you are seeing leads to success. And then what's the future of our P? A. How's that gonna involve over the next few years? >>Sure. Um, R P has been deployed across virtually every industry and virtually every department, so there are many ways to get started in All of them are right. But often we find is that you can either start in a central organization where in terror organization is doing everything centrally. It is a great way to get started. But eventually we learned that the Federated Way is the best way to end where hundreds of offices all over the world, if you are especially large organization, each business unit is doing it with I t providing governments and central security and policies and an actual bots running and being implemented all over the world eventually for a large gilt transformation. That is a common pattern we have seen among successful customers. >>And where do you think this is? Houses pattern going to evolve as enterprises gained more familiarity with it, innovating new and interesting ways and his automation anywhere, and others advance the state of the art. Where do you think it's gonna end up? >>The read is going is is I define it as an app store experience or a Google play experience. So if you think about how we operate over mobile devices today, if you want something on your device, you would look for a nap that does that. We're getting to a point where there is bought for everything in a digital worker for everything. So if you need certain job done, you first go to a what store? Uh that is an automation anywhere website. Look for about that. Does something higher or download that Bart. Get the work done and it comes pre built. Like many. There are works with BMC Felix on many of those, So s. So that is your 1st 1st way you will look, look for getting your work done in a new body economy. And if it if there's no but available, then you look for other options. It will transform how we work and how we think of >>work. In many respects, it's the gig economy with perfect contractor, and it's that leads to some very in string challenges. Ultimately, we start thinking about service Is so Ni aki based on what me here just talked about. Where does digital service is go as our P A joins other classes of users in creating those new experiences at new Prophet points and new value propositions, >>it becomes a competitive. How you provide that service can become a big competitive sensation for financial institutions. For telcos, which is a service industry, right, you're providing that service and, like two meters point, then the user hits that switch. They expect the light to come on If I'm an end user, that consumer warning a service from my telco provider, all from my, um, financial institution. I expect that service to be instantaneous at the highest accuracy accuracy at which super wide is gonna start driving competitor, official for financial institutions of financial institution Telco two Telco and that So I C companies, differentiating and really surviving are thriving in the long term. >>It's no longer becoming something that's nice to have its jacks or better in business, too. >>That's right. And the demo of the live demo that we saw today was really impressive because it sure that what would have taken a few days to happen now happens in three minutes. Right? It is, which is, which is almost the time it takes to call an uber. You know, when interpreters begin to do work at a pace that what you call an uber that's that's that's the future. Yes, it's here. >>Yes, so do I mean the demo that we do the entire enter and demo to request additional storage and being able to provisional remediating issues that we see predict cost and make it available to the end user develop whoever it is is asking for it in minutes. Alright, which used to take days and days. No, no, no, not to mention sometimes in pixels. >>It's typically done faster at scale, with greater reliability. Greater greater security, Certainly greater predictability, et cetera. All right. Here. Shukla, CEO of automation Anywhere. Yeah. Kenny, our president off the dental Service is and operations management division at BMC. Thanks both of you for being on the Cube. >>Thank you. >>Thank you. >>Once again, I'm Peter Burress and I want to thank you for participating in this cube conversation from Santa Clara Marriott at B M sees helix immersion days until next time.

>> Live from Midtown Manhattan, it's theCUBE. Covering BigData New York City 2017. Brought to you by SiliconANGLE Media and its ecosystem sponsors. (calm electronic music) >> Basil Faruqui, who's the Solutions Marketing Manger at BMC, welcome to theCUBE. >> Thank you, good to be back on theCUBE. >> So first of all, heard you guys had a tough time in Houston, so hope everything's gettin' better, and best wishes to everyone down in-- >> We're definitely in recovery mode now. >> Yeah and so hopefully that can get straightened out quick. What's going on with BMC? Give us a quick update in context to BigData NYC. What's happening, what is BMC doing in the big data space now, the AI space now, the IOT space now, the cloud space? >> So like you said that, you know, the data link space, the IOT space, the AI space, there are four components of this entire picture that literally haven't changed since the beginning of computing. If you look at those four components of a data pipeline it's ingestion, storage, processing, and analytics. What keeps changing around it, is the infrastructure, the types of data, the volume of data, and the applications that surround it. And the rate of change has picked up immensely over the last few years with Hadoop coming in to the picture, public cloud providers pushing it. It's obviously creating a number of challenges, but one of the biggest challenges that we are seeing in the market, and we're helping costumers address, is a challenge of automating this and, obviously, the benefit of automation is in scalability as well and reliability. So when you look at this rather simple data pipeline, which is now becoming more and more complex, how do you automate all of this from a single point of control? How do you continue to absorb new technologies, and not re-architect our automation strategy every time, whether it's it Hadoop, whether it's bringing in machine learning from a cloud provider? And that is the issue we've been solving for customers-- >> Alright let me jump into it. So, first of all, you mention some things that never change, ingestion, storage, and what's the third one? >> Ingestion, storage, processing and eventually analytics. >> And analytics. >> Okay so that's cool, totally buy that. Now if your move and say, hey okay, if you believe that standard, but now in the modern era that we live in, which is complex, you want breath of data, but also you want the specialization when you get down to machine limits highly bounded, that's where the automation is right now. We see the trend essentially making that automation more broader as it goes into the customer environments. >> Correct >> How do you architect that? If I'm a CXO, or I'm a CDO, what's in it for me? How do I architect this? 'Cause that's really the number one thing, as I know what the building blocks are, but they've changed in their dynamics to the market place. >> So the way I look at it, is that what defines success and failure, and particularly in big data projects, is your ability to scale. If you start a pilot, and you spend three months on it, and you deliver some results, but if you cannot roll it out worldwide, nationwide, whatever it is, essentially the project has failed. The analogy I often given is Walmart has been testing the pick-up tower, I don't know if you've seen. So this is basically a giant ATM for you to go pick up an order that you placed online. They're testing this at about a hundred stores today. Now if that's a success, and Walmart wants to roll this out nation wide, how much time do you think their IT department's going to have? Is this a five year project, a ten year project? No, and the management's going to want this done six months, ten months. So essentially, this is where automation becomes extremely crucial because it is now allowing you to deliver speed to market and without automation, you are not going to be able to get to an operational stage in a repeatable and reliable manner. >> But you're describing a very complex automation scenario. How can you automate in a hurry without sacrificing the details of what needs to be? In other words, there would seem to call for repurposing or reusing prior automation scripts and rules, so forth. How can the Walmart's of the world do that fast, but also do it well? >> Yeah so we do it, we go about it in two ways. One is that out of the box we provide a lot of pre-built integrations to some of the most commonly used systems in an enterprise. All the way from the Mainframes, Oracles, SAPs, Hadoop, Tableaus of the world, they're all available out of the box for you to quickly reuse these objects and build an automated data pipeline. The other challenge we saw, and particularly when we entered the big data space four years ago was that the automation was something that was considered close to the project becoming operational. Okay, and that's where a lot of rework happened because developers had been writing their own scripts using point solutions, so we said alright, it's time to shift automation left, and allow companies to build automations and artifact very early in the developmental life cycle. About a month ago, we released what we call Control-M Workbench, its essentially a community edition of Control-M, targeted towards developers so that instead of writing their own scripts, they can use Control-M in a completely offline manner, without having to connect to an enterprise system. As they build, and test, and iterate, they're using Control-M to do that. So as the application progresses through the development life cycle, and all of that work can then translate easily into an enterprise edition of Control-M. >> Just want to quickly define what shift left means for the folks that might not know software methodologies, they don't think >> Yeah, so. of left political, left or right. >> So, we're not shifting Control-M-- >> Alt-left, alt-right, I mean, this is software development, so quickly take a minute and explain what shift left means, and the importance of it. >> Correct, so if you think of software development as a straight line continuum, you've got, you will start with building some code, you will do some testing, then unit testing, then user acceptance testing. As it moves along this chain, there was a point right before production where all of the automation used to happen. Developers would come in and deliver the application to Ops and Ops would say, well hang on a second, all this Crontab, and these other point solutions we've been using for automation, that's not what we use in production, and we need you to now go right in-- >> So test early and often. >> Test early and often. So the challenge was the developers, the tools they used were not the tools that were being used on the production end of the site. And there was good reason for it, because developers don't need something really heavy and with all the bells and whistles early in the development lifecycle. Now Control-M Workbench is a very light version, which is targeted at developers and focuses on the needs that they have when they're building and developing it. So as the application progresses-- >> How much are you seeing waterfall-- >> But how much can they, go ahead. >> How much are you seeing waterfall, and then people shifting left becoming more prominent now? What percentage of your customers have moved to Agile, and shifting left percentage wise? >> So we survey our customers on a regular basis, and the last survey showed that eighty percent of the customers have either implemented a more continuous integration delivery type of framework, or are in the process of doing it, And that's the other-- >> And getting close to a 100 as possible, pretty much. >> Yeah, exactly. The tipping point is reached. >> And what is driving. >> What is driving all is the need from the business. The days of the five year implementation timelines are gone. This is something that you need to deliver every week, two weeks, and iteration. >> Iteration, yeah, yeah. And we have also innovated in that space, and the approach we call jobs as code, where you can build entire complex data pipelines in code format, so that you can enable the automation in a continuous integration and delivery framework. >> I have one quick question, Jim, and I'll let you take the floor and get a word in soon, but I have one final question on this BMC methodology thing. You guys have a history, obviously BMC goes way back. Remember Max Watson CEO, and Bob Beach, back in '97 we used to chat with him, dominated that landscape. But we're kind of going back to a systems mindset. The question for you is, how do you view the issue of this holy grail, the promised land of AI and machine learning, where end-to-end visibility is really the goal, right? At the same time, you want bounded experiences at root level so automation can kick in to enable more activity. So there's a trade-off between going for the end-to-end visibility out of the gate, but also having bounded visibility and data to automate. How do you guys look at that market? Because customers want the end-to-end promise, but they don't want to try to get there too fast. There's a diseconomies of scale potentially. How do you talk about that? >> Correct. >> And that's exactly the approach we've taken with Control-M Workbench, the Community Edition, because earlier on you don't need capabilities like SLA management and forecasting and automated promotion between environments. Developers want to be able to quickly build and test and show value, okay, and they don't need something that is with all the bells and whistles. We're allowing you to handle that piece, in that manner, through Control-M Workbench. As things progress and the application progresses, the needs change as well. Well now I'm closer to delivering this to the business, I need to be able to manage this within an SLA, I need to be able to manage this end-to-end and connect this to other systems of record, and streaming data, and clickstream data, all of that. So that, we believe that it doesn't have to be a trade off, that you don't have to compromise speed and quality for end-to-end visibility and enterprise grade automation. >> You mentioned trade offs, so the Control-M Workbench, the developer can use it offline, so what amount of testing can they possibly do on a complex data pipeline automation when the tool's offline? I mean it seems like the more development they do offline, the greater the risk that it simply won't work when they go into production. Give us a sense for how they mitigate, the mitigation risk in using Control-M Workbench. >> Sure, so we spend a lot of time observing how developers work, right? And very early in the development stage, all they're doing is working off of their Mac or their laptop, and they're not really connected to any. And that is where they end up writing a lot of scripts, because whatever code business logic they've written, the way they're going to make it run is by writing scripts. And that, essentially, becomes the problem, because then you have scripts managing more scripts, and as the application progresses, you have this complex web of scripts and Crontabs and maybe some opensource solutions, trying to simply make all of this run. And by doing this on an offline manner, that doesn't mean that they're losing all of the other Control-M capabilities. Simply, as the application progresses, whatever automation that the builtin Control-M can seamlessly now flow into the next stage. So when you are ready to take an application into production, there's essentially no rework required from an automation perspective. All of that, that was built, can now be translated into the enterprise-grade Control M, and that's where operations can then go in and add the other artifacts, such as SLA management and forecasting and other things that are important from an operational perspective. >> I'd like to get both your perspectives, 'cause, so you're like an analyst here, so Jim, I want you guys to comment. My question to both of you would be, lookin' at this time in history, obviously in the BMC side we mention some of the history, you guys are transforming on a new journey in extending that capability of this world. Jim, you're covering state-of-the-art AI machine learning. What's your take of this space now? Strata Data, which is now Hadoop World, which is Cloud Air went public, Hortonworks is now public, kind of the big, the Hadoop guys kind of grew up, but the world has changed around them, it's not just about Hadoop anymore. So I'd like to get your thoughts on this kind of perspective, that we're seeing a much broader picture in big data in NYC, versus the Strata Hadoop show, which seems to be losing steam, but I mean in terms of the focus. The bigger focus is much broader, horizontally scalable. And your thoughts on the ecosystem right now? >> Let the Basil answer fist, unless Basil wants me to go first. >> I think that the reason the focus is changing, is because of where the projects are in their lifecycle. Now what we're seeing is most companies are grappling with, how do I take this to the next level? How do I scale? How do I go from just proving out one or two use cases to making the entire organization data driven, and really inject data driven decision making in all facets of decision making? So that is, I believe what's driving the change that we're seeing, that now you've gone from Strata Hadoop to being Strata Data, and focus on that element. And, like I said earlier, the difference between success and failure is your ability to scale and operationalize. Take machine learning for an example. >> Good, that's where there's no, it's not a hype market, it's show me the meat on the bone, show me scale, I got operational concerns of security and what not. >> And machine learning, that's one of the hottest topics. A recent survey I read, which pulled a number of data scientists, it revealed that they spent about less than 3% of their time in training the data models, and about 80% of their time in data manipulation, data transformation and enrichment. That is obviously not the best use of a data scientist's time, and that is exactly one of the problems we're solving for our customers around the world. >> That needs to be automated to the hilt. To help them >> Correct. to be more productive, to deliver faster results. >> Ecosystem perspective, Jim, what's your thoughts? >> Yeah, everything that Basil said, and I'll just point out that many of the core uses cases for AI are automation of the data pipeline. It's driving machine learning driven predictions, classifications, abstractions and so forth, into the data pipeline, into the application pipeline to drive results in a way that is contextually and environmentally aware of what's goin' on. The history, historical data, what's goin' on in terms of current streaming data, to drive optimal outcomes, using predictive models and so forth, in line to applications. So really, fundamentally then, what's goin' on is that automation is an artifact that needs to be driven into your application architecture as a repurposable resource for a variety of-- >> Do customers even know what to automate? I mean, that's the question, what do I-- >> You're automating human judgment. You're automating effort, like the judgments that a working data engineer makes to prepare data for modeling and whatever. More and more that can be automated, 'cause those are pattern structured activities that have been mastered by smart people over many years. >> I mean we just had a customer on with a Glass'Gim CSK, with that scale, and his attitude is, we see the results from the users, then we double down and pay for it and automate it. So the automation question, it's an option question, it's a rhetorical question, but it just begs the question, which is who's writing the algorithms as machines get smarter and start throwing off their own real-time data? What are you looking at? How do you determine? You're going to need machine learning for machine learning? Are you going to need AI for AI? Who writes the algorithms >> It's actually, that's. for the algorithm? >> Automated machine learning is a hot, hot not only research focus, but we're seeing it more and more solution providers, like Microsoft and Google and others, are goin' deep down, doubling down in investments in exactly that area. That's a productivity play for data scientists. >> I think the data markets going to change radically in my opinion. I see you're startin' to some things with blockchain and some other things that are interesting. Data sovereignty, data governance are huge issues. Basil, just give your final thoughts for this segment as we wrap this up. Final thoughts on data and BMC, what should people know about BMC right now? Because people might have a historical view of BMC. What's the latest, what should they know? What's the new Instagram picture of BMC? What should they know about you guys? >> So I think what I would say people should know about BMC is that all the work that we've done over the last 25 years, in virtually every platform that came before Hadoop, we have now innovated to take this into things like big data and cloud platforms. So when you are choosing Control-M as a platform for automation, you are choosing a very, very mature solution, an example of which is Navistar. Their CIO's actually speaking at the Keno tomorrow. They've had Control-M for 15, 20 years, and they've automated virtually every business function through Control-M. And when they started their predictive maintenance project, where they're ingesting data from about 300,000 vehicles today to figure out when this vehicle might break, and to predict maintenance on it. When they started their journey, they said that they always knew that they were going to use Control-M for it, because that was the enterprise standard, and they knew that they could simply now extend that capability into this area. And when they started about three, four years ago, they were ingesting data from about 100,000 vehicles. That has now scaled to over 325,000 vehicles, and they have no had to re-architect their strategy as they grow and scale. So I would say that is one of the key messages that we are taking to market, is that we are bringing innovation that spans over 25 years, and evolving it-- >> Modernizing it, basically. >> Modernizing it, and bringing it to newer platforms. >> Well congratulations, I wouldn't call that a pivot, I'd call it an extensibility issue, kind of modernizing kind of the core things. >> Absolutely. >> Thanks for coming and sharing the BMC perspective inside theCUBE here, on BigData NYC, this is the theCUBE, I'm John Furrier. Jim Kobielus here in New York city. More live coverage, for three days we'll be here, today, tomorrow and Thursday, and BigData NYC, more coverage after this short break. (calm electronic music) (vibrant electronic music)

(upbeat music) [Announcer] Live, from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE, covering AWS Re:Invent, 2018. Brought to you by Amazon Web Services, Intel, and their ecosystem partners. >> Hello, welcome back here to Las Vegas. We're at the Sands Expo in Hall D, perhaps a friend in the area, come on by, say hi to Justin Warren and John Walls here, on the set of theCUBE, joined here by David Cramer, who is the President of Digital Services Operations for BMC software. David, good to see you. >> Good to see you. Thanks for having me. >> All the way from Austin, Texas, deep in the Lone Star state. >> Yes sir. >> All right, so everyone's going to the cloud, right? That's obviously, why, you know, why so many people are here. What do you see it in terms of how they get in there, what are they doing there, and who hasn't made that move yet, and why not? >> Yeah, it's a great question. So a lot of people are in different spots in this journey. Some people are just starting out with the journey to cloud, which is surprising, but as popular as cloud is there are still some companies out there who just haven't made the move. Sometimes for regulatory reasons, sometimes for cost reasons, or sometimes they just don't have the business need, or they just don't see the opportunity. Then the majority of the customers I talk to are somewhere on that path. They've either begun to move applications or they're actually moving applications and building new applications to take advantage of the cloud. And so for us as a company, we see a tremendous opportunity to help our customers figure out the right way to move to cloud. Because it wasn't that long ago, just a few years back, when you heard people talking about cloud first, lift and shift, I'm moving everything to the cloud. I think people have stepped back from that and said, well, wait a minute, let's think about what cloud infrastructure, cloud services can provide us, and then let's optimize what we put in the cloud because certainly you can spend a lot of money using cloud services if you're not too careful. >> Yeah, you hit a big word there. Optimize. Right, it's about, it's kind of fun to just start throwing, I wouldn't say, mud on the wall, but just making the big move and also you realize you're into it for a little more money than maybe you thought you should have been. >> Absolutely, and there's a cultural phenomenon that's driving this, and that is DevOps and the desire to release more software to get new products, new features, innovation into the market means that you have to let your teams be autonomous. You can't have a command and control structure where every decision comes from the top. But that autonomy creates an opportunity for waste, creates an opportunity for mistakes, misconfigurations, security issues. So one of the reasons that I mention the everybody moves everything there and then says, wait a minute. Maybe that wasn't the right move, maybe we should be cloud smart instead of cloud first. >> Yeah. I do speak a lot with developers and companies in that ecosystem and there's a lot of talk about replatforming, taking applications that we had on our existing on-side infrastructure and then replatforming that to cloud because cloud requires doing things in a completely new way. Whereas, if you just take the old thing that you had, and just lift and shift and move it to cloud it tends not to work out quite so well. We're noticing a trend and we've heard that a lot today here at this show that people aren't moving everything to cloud and we now have a change in Amazon's view of the world, that actually, cloud is not the one true way, you are actually allowed to have some stuff on-site now. Some things can stay there and that's okay. So what is BMC doing with customers to help them decide which things should be moved and which things should stay where they are. >> It's a great point you brought up, because there were a lot of people who were saying let's rearchitect for the cloud and the applications that they were looking at weren't going to benefit from the elasticity or the things that cloud environment provides. And I've talked to lots of CIOs who will tell you I can deliver a virtual machine for a lot less money than the virtual machines the cloud vendors deliver. >> Yeah. >> So to answer the question, BMC has a rich history in the data center. So one of the first things we learn is that our performance data, our capacity data, and the information we have about the application architectures and the way they live in the data center, whether that be physical infrastructure, virtual infrastructure, containers, we can help a lot to identify what are the high value assets where you can save a lot of money by migrating them to a cloud. What are the assets that aren't going to save you a lot of money and you're just going to lift and shift and not get those benefits. So I say that from a performance and capacity optimization standpoint, that's one of the starting places. A second is application discovery and dependency mapping. One of the challenges in IT has long been is what do I have and how is it configured. If I'm going to move something to the cloud, I sure need to know what it looks like in my data center and we provide a lot of help there with our world class discovery technologies. >> Right. Another thing about moving to the cloud that we've heard with a bunch of previous guests here on theCUBE today, is security. >> Yes. >> Security is a fundamental thing that we have to get right, particularly when we move to cloud. So what are some of the things of BMC, what's your security story, Dave? >> Yeah, it's a very important part of the strategy and one that we developed because we began this journey ourselves about five years ago, as we looked at our customers and the way they wanted to consume services. We said, well, shoot, we should be building new apps in Amazon environments and we actually have services that leverage Amazon Lambda. So, we then said great, now we have to learn about running cloud-hosted applications or cloud-native applications and how to secure them. So a lot of our solutions came from our own learnings. Specifically our focus areas are around optimizing the security and configuration of the cloud infrastructure layer and the platform layer. A lot of customers don't realize the shared responsibility model that Amazon. They've done a great job of telling people about this model. But a lot of customers, like the ostrich in the sand, they're just not thinking, or they're not looking at it, and so they expect Amazon or someone else to take care of all these problems. And when you set up a service and Amazon, certainly, they're taking care of a lot of security but they're not securing the things that you put in that environment, your software, the middleware, the different services you connect together. So we're helping customers secure the configuration of those services, but we're also helping customers with spend, because one of the challenges we just talked about around DevOps and autonomy is if you give a developer access to Amazon and the suite of services they offer, it's like a kid in the candy store. And of course, they want gold-plated everything. I want the best environment with the best database, the most advanced services, and all that ends up costing a whole lot of money. >> Yeah, you got to put me in the candy store. That's exactly where I'm going. >> Right. >> Right. >> All right, so we've also been talking about volume, data volume, and how it kind of boggles the human mind now, right? >> Oh, yeah. >> And why automation is essential. You have to keep up. >> Huge part. >> Is it beyond our ability now to keep up with it as humans. >> I think, most people who we talk would agree that we're past human scale. You know, when you begin to look at the number of containers that services like Google Maps. If you do some research, they're spending up millions of containers every day and then spending them back down in some cases. So, you can't take old methods and old approaches to an environment like that where you're at hyper-scale some of the time, and you're not at hyper-scale other times. And so we've seen a huge shift in mindset. We used to talk about push button automation. 'Cause we've been selling automation in the data center, gosh, all the way back to the mainframe, BMC's been selling automation. But it was smart people figuring out what to automate and then hitting the button. What we're now seeing is trust, where they're allowing the automation routines to take over and actually run. Now in some cases that's driven by machine learning and really advanced algorithms. In other cases, it's very simple policy based. But we are seeing a big shift from I don't trust automation to gosh, I have to trust it. And I think some of that is based on Amazon themselves, with things like auto skill rules. >> It's still got to be hard to cede control like that when you're used to doing it yourself, and now to rely on another mechanism. That just runs against my nature. >> Yeah, and it runs against the DevOps cultural trend we talked about, where you're trying to let the teams be autonomous. Every CIO I've spoken to in the last five years cares about what they call guard rails or governance. They realize that it can't be top-down decision-making. They have to let the teams have some freedom, but they also realize that if they don't put up guard rails, and they don't restrict the choices, restrict the opportunity for mistakes, they're going to be in trouble from a cost or a security or even a performance perspective. >> Innovation is fabulous until you fall off a cliff and die. We do actually need to have a fence at the edge of that cliff. That would be a good plan. >> Well, yeah, if you talk to the DevOps teams themselves, one of the things I always like to ask is who are the ops guys in the room? And normally you have a bunch of developers, and you ask well, who cares about compliance. Nobody. They want to build cool new features. >> Right >> Who cares about code scanning and testing your software. Maybe one guy puts his hand up and says I'm the QA guy, or I'm the security guy. So there's also a cultural thing that we're seeing operations blend into these new models, and we're seeing operations teams who are classically central, IT-Ops teams, moving into the DevOps world, moving into the cloud-Ops world. >> We were just commenting before during the break about the nature of this show. And that IT pros, and your traditional infrastructure type people, they would be at different shows. They're all here now. >> They are. >> We are definitely seeing that real blend between what used to be purely developers, front-end software developers would be at this show. Now we have IT pros, we have all the infrastructure groups, we have all the companies. >> Security guys. >> Security guys. All of these people are now at this show, working together in that one team idea. >> Yeah, it's fascinating. We've talked a lot about ops everywhere. We've talked about development everywhere. Because if you go to any large enterprise, the new IT operators they're trying to hire, all have development skills. They all have programing backgrounds. And they're all coming to shows like this because they're being tasked with this concept that BMC calls run and reinvent. You've got to continue to run your existing business. Well who better than the IT operators to do that. They've been doing that for years. But you've also got to reinvent, and you've got to compete, and who better to do that than our innovators, our developers, the people out front trying to create that innovation that will transform or game-change an industry. So it's fascinating >> Reinvent. I mean, that'd be a great name for a trade show. >> And I didn't even do that on purpose. (laughing) >> David, thank you for sharing your time with us and good luck on down the road. >> Great. Thanks a lot. >> David Kramer, joining us from BMC software. We will be back from re:Invent in just a moment. We're live here in Las Vegas. You're watching theCUBE. (lively music)

(upbeat music) >> Live from New York, it's theCUBE. Covering theCUBE New York City 2018. Brought to you by SiliconANGLE Media and its ecosystem partners. >> Okay, welcome back everyone to theCUBE NYC. This is theCUBE's live coverage covering CubeNYC Strata Hadoop Strata Data Conference. All things data happen here in New York this week. I'm John Furrier with Peter Burris. Our next guest is Basil Faruqui lead solutions marketing manager digital business automation within BMC returns, he was here last year with us and also Big Data SV, which has been renamed CubeNYC, Cube SV because it's not just big data anymore. We're hearing words like multi cloud, Istio, all those Kubernetes. Data now is so important, it's now up and down the stack, impacting everyone, we talked about this last year with Control M, how you guys are automating in a hurry. The four pillars of pipelining data. The setup days are over; welcome to theCUBE. >> Well thank you and it's great to be back on theCUBE. And yeah, what you said is exactly right, so you know, big data has really, I think now been distilled down to data. Everybody understands data is big, and it's important, and it is really you know, it's quite a cliche, but to a larger degree, data is the new oil, as some people say. And I think what you said earlier is important in that we've been very fortunate to be able to not only follow the journey of our customers but be a part of it. So about six years ago, some of the early adopters of Hadoop came to us and said that look, we use your products for traditional data warehousing on the ERP side for orchestration workloads. We're about to take some of these projects on Hadoop into production and really feel that the Hadoop ecosystem is lacking enterprise-grade workflow orchestration tools. So we partnered with them and some of the earliest goals they wanted to achieve was build a data lake, provide richer and wider data sets to the end users to be able to do some dashboarding, customer 360, and things of that nature. Very quickly, in about five years time, we have seen a lot of these projects mature from how do I build a data lake to now applying cutting-edge ML and AI and cloud is a major enabler of that. You know, it's really, as we were talking about earlier, it's really taking away excuses for not being able to scale quickly from an infrastructure perspective. Now you're talking about is it Hadoop or is it S3 or is it Azure Blob Storage, is it Snowflake? And from a control-end perspective, we're very platform and technology agnostic, so some of our customers who had started with Hadoop as a platform, they are now looking at other technologies like Snowflake, so one of our customers describes it as kind of the spine or a power strip of orchestration where regardless of what technology you have, you can just plug and play in and not worry about how do I rewire the orchestration workflows because control end is taking care of it. >> Well you probably always will have to worry about that to some degree. But I think where you're going, and this is where I'm going to test with you, is that as analytics, as data is increasingly recognized as a strategic asset, as analytics increasingly recognizes the way that you create value out of those data assets, and as a business becomes increasingly dependent upon the output of analytics to make decisions and ultimately through AI to act differently in markets, you are embedding these capabilities or these technologies deeper into business. They have to become capabilities. They have to become dependable. They have to become reliable, predictable, cost, performance, all these other things. That suggests that ultimately, the historical approach of focusing on the technology and trying to apply it to a periodic or series of data science problems has to become a little bit more mature so it actually becomes a strategic capability. So the business can say we're operating on this, but the technologies to take that underlying data science technology to turn into business operations that's where a lot of the net work has to happen. Is that what you guys are focused on? >> Yeah, absolutely, and I think one of the big differences that we're seeing in general in the industry is that this time around, the pull of how do you enable technology to drive the business is really coming from the line of business, versus starting on the technology side of the house and then coming to the business and saying hey we've got some cool technologies that can probably help you, it's really line of business now saying no, I need better analytics so I can drive new business models for my company, right? So the need for speed is greater than ever because the pull is from the line of business side. And this is another area where we are unique is that, you know, Control M has been designed in a way where it's not just a set of solutions or tools for the technical guys. Now, the line of business is getting closer and closer, you know, it's blending into the technical side as well. They have a very, very keen interest in understanding are the dashboards going to be refreshed on time? Are we going to be able to get all the right promotional offers at the right time? I mean, we're here at NYC Strata, there's a lot of real-time promotion happening here. The line of business has direct interest in the delivery and the timing of all of this, so we have always had multiple interfaces to Control M where a business user who has an interest in understanding are the promotional offers going to happen at the right time and is that on schedule? They have a mobile app for them to do that. A developer who's building up complex, multi-application platform, they have an API and a programmatic interface to do that. Operations that has to monitor all of this has rich dashboards to be able to do that. That's one of the areas that has been key for our success over the last couple decades, and we're seeing that translate very well into the big data place. >> So I just want to go under the hood for a minute because I love that answer. And I'd like to pivot off what Peter said, tying it back to the business, okay, that's awesome. And I want to learn a little bit more about this because we talked about this last year and I kind of am seeing it now. Kubernetes and all this orchestration is about workloads. You guys nailed the workflow issue, complex workflows. Because if you look at it, if you're adding line of business into the equation, that's just complexity in and of itself. As more workflows exist within its own line of business, whether it's recommendations and offers and workflow issues, more lines of business in there is complex for even IT to deal with, so you guys have nailed that. How does that work? Do you plug it in and the lines of businesses have their own developers, so the people who work with the workflows engage how? >> So that's a good question, with sort of orchestration and automation now becoming very, very generic, it's kind of important to classify where we play. So there's a lot of tools that do release and build automation. There's a lot of tools that'll do infrastructure automation and orchestration. All of this infrastructure and release management process is done ultimately to run applications on top of it, and the workflows of the application need orchestration and that's the layer that we play in. And if you think about how does the end user, the business and consumer interact with all of this technology is through applications, k? So the orchestration of the workflow's inside the applications, whether you start all the way from an ERP or a CRM and then you land into a data lake and then do an ML model, and then out come the recommendations analytics, that's the layer we are automating today. Obviously, all of this-- >> By the way, the technical complexity for the user's in the app. >> Correct, so the line of business obviously has a lot more control, you're seeing roles like chief digital officers emerge, you're seeing CTOs that have mandates like okay you're going to be responsible for all applications that are facing customer facing where the CIO is going to take care of everything that's inward facing. It's not a settled structure or science involved. >> It's evolving fast. >> It's evolving fast. But what's clear is that line of business has a lot more interest and influence in driving these technology projects and it's important that technologies evolve in a way where line of business can not only understand but take advantage of that. >> So I think it's a great question, John, and I want to build on that and then ask you something. So the way we look at the world is we say the first fifty years of computing were known process, unknown technology. The next fifty years are going to be unknown process, known technology. It's all going to look like a cloud. But think about what that means. Known process, unknown technology, Control M and related types of technologies tended to focus on how you put in place predictable workflows in the technology layer. And now, unknown process, known technology, driven by the line of business, now we're talking about controlling process flows that are being created, bespoke, strategic, differentiating doing business. >> Well, dynamic, too, I mean, dynamic. >> Highly dynamic, and those workflows in many respects, those technologies, piecing applications and services together, become the process that differentiates the business. Again, you're still focused on the infrastructure a bit, but you've moved it up. Is that right? >> Yeah, that's exactly right. We see our goal as abstracting the complexity of the underlying application data and infrastructure. So, I mean, it's quite amazing-- >> So it could be easily reconfigured to a business's needs. >> Exactly, so whether you're on Hadoop and now you're thinking about moving to Snowflake or tomorrow something else that comes up, the orchestration or the workflow, you know, that's as a business as a product that's our goal is to continue to evolve quickly and in a manner that we continue to abstract the complexity so from-- >> So I've got to ask you, we've been having a lot of conversations around Hadoop versus Kubernetes on multi cloud, so as cloud has certainly come in and changed the game, there's no debate on that. How it changes is debatable, but we know that multiple clouds is going to be the modus operandus for customers. >> Correct. >> So I got a lot of data and now I've got pipelining complexities and workflows are going to get even more complex, potentially. How do you see the impact of the cloud, how are you guys looking at that, and what are some customer use cases that you see for you guys? >> So the, what I mentioned earlier, that being platform and technology agnostic is actually one of the unique differentiating factors for us, so whether you are an AWS or an Azure or a Google or On-Prem or still on a mainframe, a lot of, we're in New York, a lot of the banks, insurance companies here still do some of the most critical processing on the mainframe. The ability to abstract all of that whether it's cloud or legacy solutions is one of our key enablers for our customers, and I'll give you an example. So Malwarebytes is one of our customers and they've been using Control M for several years. Primarily the entire structure is built on AWS, but they are now utilizing Google cloud for some of their recommendation analysis on sentiment analysis because their goal is to pick the best of breed technology for the problem they're looking to solve. >> Service, the best breed service is in the cloud. >> The best breed service is in the cloud to solve the business problem. So from Control M's perspective, transcending from AWS to Google cloud is completely abstracted for them, so runs Google tomorrow it's Azure, they decide to build a private cloud, they will be able to extend the same workflow orchestration. >> But you can build these workflows across whatever set of services are available. >> Correct, and you bring up an important point. It's not only being able to build the workflows across platforms but being able to define dependencies and track the dependencies across all of this, because none of this is happening in silos. If you want to use Google's API to do the recommendations, well, you've got to feed it the data, and the data's pipeline, like we talked about last time, data ingestion, data storage, data processing, and analytics have very, very intricate dependencies, and these solutions should be able to manage not only the building of the workflow but the dependencies as well. >> But you're defining those elements as fundamental building blocks through a control model >> Correct. >> That allows you to treat the higher level services as reliable, consistent, capabilities. >> Correct, and the other thing I would like to add here is not only just build complex multiplatform, multiapplication workflows, but never lose focus of the business service of the business process there, so you can tie all of this to a business service and then, these things are complex, there are problems, let's say there's an ETL job that fails somewhere upstream, Control M will immediately be able to predict the impact and be able to tell you this means the recommendation engine will not be able to make the recommendations. Now, the staff that's going to work under mediation understands the business impact versus looking at a screen where there's 500 jobs and one of them has failed. What does that really mean? >> Set priorities and focal points and everything else. >> Right. >> So I just want to wrap up by asking you how your talk went at Strata Hadoop Data Conference. What were you talking about, what was the core message? Was it Control M, was it customer presentations? What was the focus? >> So the focus of yesterday's talk was actually, you know, one of the things is academic talk is great, but it's important to, you know, show how things work in real life. The session was focused on a real-use case from a customer. Navistar, they have IOT data-driven pipelines where they are predicting failures of parts inside trucks and buses that they manufacture, you know, reducing vehicle downtime. So we wanted to simulate a demo like that, so that's exactly what we did. It was very well received. In real-time, we spun up EMR environment in AWS, automatically provision control of infrastructure there, we applied spark and machine learning algorithms to the data and out came the recommendation at the end was that, you know, here are the vehicles that are-- >> Fix their brakes. (laughing) >> Exactly, so it was very, very well received. >> I mean, there's a real-world example, there's real money to be saved, maintenance, scheduling, potential liability, accidents. >> Liability is a huge issue for a lot of manufacturers. >> And Navistar has been at the leading edge of how to apply technologies in that business. >> They really have been a poster child for visual transformation. >> They sure have. >> Here's a company that's been around for 100 plus years and when we talk to them they tell us that we have every technology under the sun that has come since the mainframe, and for them to be transforming and leading in this way, we're very fortunate to be part of their journey. >> Well we'd love to talk more about some of these customer use cases. Other people love about theCUBE, we want to do more of them, share those examples, people love to see proof in real-world examples, not just talk so appreciate it sharing. >> Absolutely. >> Thanks for sharing, thanks for the insights. We're here Cube live in New York City, part of CubeNYC, we're getting all the data, sharing that with you. I'm John Furrier with Peter Burris. Stay with us for more day two coverage after this short break. (upbeat music)

>> Live from San Francisco, it's theCUBE. Covering Google Cloud Next, 2018. Brought to you by Google Cloud, and its ecosystem partners. >> Hi this is Peter Burris from Wikibon SiliconANGLE, stepping in for John Furrier and Dave Vellante. Continuing our CUBE coverage here at Google Next 2018 from Moscone South, an impressive array of talent, and that includes my next guest, Jon Thomas. Jon is the director of Product Management for Digital Services Management Cloud Services at BMC Software. Welcome to theCUBE, Jon. >> Thank you for having me. >> You know this is a really an interesting topic for me, because as an old infrastructure hack, someone who's been in IT operations in a couple different worlds, as well as being an Industry Analyst in infrastructure, it's important that we not lose sight of the fact that there's a lot of expertise out there regarding how we run complex systems, that the Cloud companies are demonstrating, but the business as an adopt Cloud services, nonetheless, has to sustain. So talk to us a little bit about what BMC is doing to try to bring some of that knowledge over 30 years of working in the data center, and apply it for businesses as they become better Cloud citizens. >> Yeah, thank you for asking. So, BMC is worked with some of the largest IT organizations. In fact, over 80% of the Fortune 500 use BMC software to help them manage IT. At this point when I go out and talk to those customers, they're all on a Cloud journey. And the really exciting thing is that the conversations stop becoming if we're going to use public cloud, but it's going to be a how to use public cloud, and really at this point, it's about how do we use it in a way that we can scale that out, scale that innovation out within the organization. And we're seeing that those organizations are actually, in a lot of times, they're reorganizing in order to really facilitate that innovation. And so BMC, like you said, is taking that expertise that we've had and helping them manage the data center asset, and to apply the same learnings that we had with a new spin to actually work with the public cloud as they start to adopt public cloud. >> So, give us an example of a few of the more modern approaches in the cloud that are being employed by BMC to ensure that you get the type of control, manageability, and automation, that BMC customers have gotten used to on-premise. >> Yeah, I mean, one great example is for a very long time BMC has had the BladeLogic Product Line, and we've helped customers to make sure that they can harden their servers and their network devices and their databases on premise. Now as they move the public cloud, there's a big question, what does it mean to even harden a public cloud configuration? And a lot of organizations are trying to understand what is their responsibility in that shared responsibility model. And so one thing that we've done is take that knowledge about hardening assets and apply it to public cloud resources, and also just in the way that we do it. You know if you think about traditionally, IT's gotten a bad rap as being Captain No, and now with the public cloud and the ability of application teams that go directly to the public cloud, IT has to just change the way that it's providing its services to their consumers, their internal consumers. So, now instead of putting a big block in the process, instead we're enabling IT to provide services. Because application teams, they don't want to be insecure. They're not out there nefariously trying to break things and leave data out there. >> They may sometimes not know when they're not being secure. >> Exactly, and so IT's new and changing role is about how do you provide services and consultation to your business to be a facilitator. And so with the products that we're offering now, we think we've taken that history, and that legacy, and our heritage, and hardening in that data center, and then applying that same model to the public cloud, but in a model that fits for how you leverage public cloud resources. >> I presume that a customer that decides to go with, say, Google or Google Cloud-- >> Yeah. >> Or decides to go with Amazon or AWS, is going to use your product and exploit the best or the capabilities of both clouds. as they are uniquely provided, is that accurate? >> Absolutely. Yeah when we talk to our customers, very few of them have the luxury of only using one public cloud vendor. Whether it's based off of decisions from application teams or even acquisitions, a lot of times they have to manage across multiple clouds on top of all of that on-premise infrastructure that they still have to manage. And so we do, we try to help to simplify that complexity for them by bringing it all together into one visibility, into what is the state of the risk of their cloud services. >> But to employ, or to be able to exploit the best that each of those platforms has, while at the same time from an overall manageability standpoint, being able to provide a common view to those different resources, have I got that right? >> Exactly, exactly. >> Now, how does that tie back in to the data center? One of the things that we've seen over the course of the last week is something that Wikibon has been calling it your private cloud. The idea that there are going to be circumstances when an enterprise's data requires that you move the cloud to the data, as opposed to moving the data to the cloud. >> Yeah. >> And there's no doubt there's going to be a lot of data that's going to, for any number of physical, legal, election property control reasons, will be on-premise, or within the confines of the business. So, how do you envision that the practices and tooling and automation regimes that are currently on-premise, and what we're doing now on the cloud are going to start together, come together over the next few years. So we can put data where it naturally should be. >> Yeah, I'm glad you asked that. It's just, some of the tools and some of the reasons that we're able to help our customers on their cloud journey is because we have that knowledge of their on-premise infrastructure. So being able to do things like discover what they have on-prem, and understand the dependencies, helps us to be really uniquely positioned to help them with cloud migration. And migration might not be just from on-premise to cloud, it could be from cloud back to on-premise, it could be between clouds or even between different regions based off of the need of the business at that time. >> So that's migration, what about overall classes of integration that might allow a DevOps person, for example, to be able to look at an application that spans multiple places, or multiple locations, but still be able to administrate as a coherent resource? >> Yeah, so in that same discovery capabilities that we have, we've extended those out to the public cloud as well, so we can discover on-premise, in the public cloud, so that whenever you need it, you can go to a single place and understand what's the state of your infrastructure, no matter where it exists. >> So what do you think of Google Next? Are you having good conversations with customers? Do you see Google Cloud coming on more? And how does BMC going to make it easier for everybody? >> Absolutely, we're really excited by the progress that Google Cloud is making and we're seeing a lot of adoption in particular certain segments of our businesses are really, really fond of Google Cloud. And what we're doing is trying to make sure that from the tools that we have that we're integrating into Google Cloud, so that it gives our customers that choice to pick what's the right cloud for them at the right time and for the right circumstances, and then still get that simplification by putting it all into the same tool where they can get in the single view. >> Now every company has a challenge as they migrate to the cloud, both from a standpoint of where the applications are being developed, where the applications are being run. But also, strategically, the cloud has a pretty significant impact. BMC seems to be one of those companies that's able to partly, I would presume in large measure, because of 30 years of really working with the customers is having a relatively facile time enacting that transformation. Give us a sense, especially in the Product Management Committee, thinking about how BMC's going to provide value in the cloud. What is BMC think the future of cloud and cloud management looks like? >> Well, we see it's evolving. Right now a lot of organizations are creating centralized Cloud Centers of Excellence just to figure out how, like I said, to scale out best practices within their organization. And right now, those teams really have a couple of areas of focus. Number one is the migration, so figuring out how to do their migration projects. Number two is how do we do security of those resources, so being able to understand what's their risk posture, and set up some governance around that, we say a cloud with guard rails. And the last thing is last year was really a time of customers coming to us because they had 10 ex-million dollar surprise builds. And so one of the things that we want to do to help facilitate the use of public cloud, because we believe that it can be as safe or safer, as efficient or more efficient, is to take away those concerns that would keep a company from feeling like they're able to migrate more workloads to the cloud, or build more applications to the cloud. >> So, Jon, I'm going to do kind of a lightning round here. >> Alright. >> I'm going to put something in front of you and I want you to respond as best as you can from a standpoint of how the value proposition's going to play out. Let's start with speed to value. How does the tooling that you're providing improve speed to value, especially to those companies that are looking for greater flexibility than strategies? >> Well, speed to value, one of the biggest things is in order to have real data up in the public cloud, organizations just need to understand what is their risk posture, make sure that those services that they're creating are hardened. And so with our true side cloud security product, we're able to give them that visibility so that they can get the check mark to move quickly to go to market with the solutions they're creating in the public cloud. >> The second thing, modern application development, containers, Kubernetes, those types of things. >> Yeah, absolutely. In the same platform that we support the public cloud, it's really all new modern innovations. So we also support Kubernetes, and Docker as well, so you bring that all into the same platform and the same visibility. >> Big data, advanced analytics, and AI. >> So as companies want to leverage AI, that's one of the examples where they're trying to figure out as they do it, what are their costs going to do? New services, we've heard stories where people turn on a brand new service and then find out that that service costs them a lot of money. And so with some of our expense management for a cloud tools, we're able to do baselines of their spending and start to forecast out, identify when you have something that is going to come and surprise you later on. >> Can't talk about cloud without talking security. >> Absolutely. Yeah, so through true side cloud security, we're helping organizations to not only identify where they might have a risky configurations that might leave them open to data breaches, but also built in automated remediation so that you can take action, and to bring yourself to a very safe place. >> One of the big challenges of the cloud on a global basis is privacy, trust, local. How does GDPR fit into this mix, for example? >> Well, one of the requirements that GDPR is really to have state of the art, that's what they say. And so you have to have state of the art controls in place. So with our solution, especially just like cloud security, that allows organizations to be able to not only have state of the art prosthesis in place and tools to access their risk, but to also prove it. And I think that's a big aspect. >> IoT. >> IoT is also something that's coming up a lot in our customer base, so being able to manage those same cloud resources in terms of the cost of the resources and the security as well. >> Serverless? >> Yeah, Serverless. In fact, internally when we developed our application, we used a lot of Serverless. So we love cloud native artifacts, we believe that they really can help application teams to develop applications quicker. And so one of the things that we provide is the ability to look at hardening of applications built on cloud native resources. >> Now you've already mentioned cost, but what's it cost to? How do you use the tooling to get the most out of your expenditures in the cloud? >> So, first off we give you the visibility in to what you're spending, and then run that through machine learning to search and do forecasting to help you identify when you're going to overrun your cost, but the second part of that is to actually look at optimization. So we're examining out your accounts to understand, do you have idle VM's that are out there? Do you have ones that were over revision? Different ways that we can help bring down your cost to make it sure that your maximizing your cost in the public cloud. >> Okay, so, the next two years at BMC, going to continue to drive its affinity with these new cloud-based workloads. What are you most excited about as you look out at working with customers over the next couple of years? >> Really looking at the adoption going bigger. And, right now, and they talked about it in The Keynote this morning, the number of workloads in the public cloud, it is still relatively small to what they have on-premise. And so we believe that as organizations start to do hardware refreshes, starts to do data center consolidation projects, they're going to start looking into public cloud more and more, and we're going to see more and more resources making their way to the public cloud, and we find that very exciting. >> A wide opportunity for thought leadership, isn't there Jon? >> Absolutely. >> Alright, Jon Thomas, who's been crucial to driving a lot of the product management efforts around some of BMC's cloud management software. Thanks very much for being on theCUBE, Jon. >> Thanks for having me. >> Okay, we'll be right back with more coverage from Google Next, thanks for watching.

(dynamic music) >> Hi, I'm Peter Burris, and welcome to another CUBEConversation. This is another very special CUBEConversation in that it's part of a product launch. Today, BMC has come on to theCUBE to launch Helix, a new approach to thinking about cognitive services management. And we're, over the course of the next 20 minutes or so, gonna present some of the salient features of Helix and how it solves critical business problems. And at the end of the segment, at the end of this video segment, we're gonna then go into a CrowdChat and give you, the community, an opportunity to express your thoughts, ask your questions, and get the information that you need from us analysts, from BMC, and also from your peers about what you need to do to exploit cognitive systems management in your business. Now this is a very real problem, this is not something that's being made up. The reality is we're looking at a lot of data-first technologies that are transforming the way business works. Technologies like AI, and machine learning, and deep learning, technologies like big data, having an enormous impact about how businesses behave. These technologies invoke much greater complexity at the application at the systems level and Wikibon strongly believes that we do not understand how businesses can pursue these technologies and these richer applications without finding ways to apply elements of them directly into the IT service management stack. And the reason why is if you don't have high-quality, lower-cost, speedy automation inside how you run your service management overall platform, then it's going to create uncertainty up hiring stack and that's awful for digital business. So to better understand and take us through this launch today, we've got some great guests. And it starts, obviously, with the esteemed Nayaki Nayyar who is the President of the Digital Services Management business unit at BMC, CUBE alum. Nayaki, thanks very much for being here. >> Thank you, Peter, really excited to be here and look forward to our conversation. We are too excited about the launch of BMC Helix and happy to share the details with you. >> So let's start with the why. Obviously, there's a... You know, I've articulated kind of a generalization of some of the challenges that businesses face but it goes deeper than that. Take us through some of the key issues that your customers are facing as they think about this transition to a new way of running their business. >> So, let's put ourselves in the customers' shoes. Then you look at what their journey looks like. Customers are evolving from the online world into the digital world and what we see is, what we call, cognitive world. And the way their journey looks like, especially as customers are entering into the digital world, there are proliferation of clouds. They don't have just one cloud, they have private clouds, hybrid clouds, managed clouds, we call it multi-cloud. So they're entering into a multi-cloud world. In addition, there's also proliferation of devices. It's not just phones that we have to worry about now. As IoT's getting more and more relevant and prevalent, how you help customers manage all the devices and how you provide the service through not just one channel but channel of our customers' or consumers' preference. It could be a Slack as a channel, SMS as a channel, Skype as a channel. So across this multi-cloud, multi-device, and multi-channel, this explosion of technology that is happening in every customer's landscape, and to address this explosion, is where AIML, chatbots, and virtual agents really play a role for them to handle the complexities. So the automation that AIML, chatbots, and virtual agents bring to help customers address these multi-cloud, multi-channel, multi-device world is what we call how we have them evolve from ITSM to cognitive services management. >> Let's talk about that a little bit. We'll get into exactly what you're announcing in a second but historically when we thought about service management we thought about devices. What you're really describing, this transition is, again that notion of how all of these different elements come together in, sometimes, very unique ways and that's what's driving the need for the cognitive. It's not just, you can do multiple clouds, multi-devices, multiple channels, it's your business can put them together in ways that serve your business' needs the best. And now we need a service management capability that can attend to those resources. >> Absolutely. So if you go 10, 15 years back, BMC had a great portfolio. We had Remedy Service Management Suite. We also had Discovery to help customers discover the on-prem assets and provide its service to remedy service management. That's what we had, we were very successful. ITSM, as a category, was created for that whole space. But in this new world of multi-cloud, right, where customers have private clouds, managed clouds, hybrid clouds, multi-devices where IoT is becoming more and more relevant, and multi-channel, customers now have to discover these assets. We call it Discovery as-a-Service but now they can discover the assets across AWS, Azure, OpenStack, and Cloud Foundry and evolve into providing service from reactive to proactive service, and that's what we call Remedy as-a-Service, and then extend that service beyond IT to also lines of business. Now you wanna also provide that service to HR, and procurement, and also various lines of business. And the most important thing is how you provide that experience to your end-users and your end-customers is what we call Digital Workplace-as-a-Service where now customers can consume that service in channel of their preference. They can consume that service through mobile device, of course through web, but also Slack, SMS, chatbots, and virtual agents. So that's what we are combining all of that, that entire suite, we are containerizing that suite using Dockers and Kubernetes so that now customers can run in their choice of cloud. They can run it in AWS cloud, Azure cloud, or in BMC cloud. This whole suite is what we call BMC Helix and helps our customers evolve from ITSM to what we call cognitive services management. >> So that's what BMC's announcing today. >> Yes. >> It's this notion of BMC Helix. >> Yes. >> And it's predicated on the idea, if I can, also of, not only you're going to use these technologies to manage new stuff, we have to bring the old stuff forward. Additionally, we're gonna see a mix of labor, or people, and automation as companies find the right mix for them. >> Right. >> And so we wanna bring and sustain these practices and these approaches forward. Nobody likes a forced migration, especially not in an IT organization. >> Right. >> So that's how we see Helix. if I got this right. >> Yes. >> Helix is gonna help customers bring their existing assets, existing practices, modernize them using some of the new technologies and that's how we get to this new cognitive vision. >> Absolutely. The investments customers have already made in their on-prem assets, in their managing their IT assets, that same concepts come into this new multi-cloud, multi-device, and multi-channel world but now it extends beyond that. It extends beyond just IT to also lines of business and also all these, what we call, omni-channel experiences that you can provide. And this whole suite is, what we call, 3 C's, Helix stands for 3 C's. Everything as a service, Remedy as-a-Service, Discovery as-a-Service, Business Workplace as-a-Service, containerized so that customers can run this in the choice of their cloud, they can run in AWS cloud, Azure cloud, or our cloud with cognitive capabilities, with AIML, and chatbots. And that's how we help them evolve from that existing implementations to this whole new world as they enter into the cognitive world. >> Exciting stuff. >> Absolutely. We are very excited about it. We've been working with a lot of customers already, and we have made really, really good traction. >> So let's do this, Nayaki, let's take a look at a product video that kinda describes how this all comes together in a relatively simple, straightforward way. >> Absolutely. (upbeat music) >> Hi, Peter Burris again, welcome back. We're talking more about BMC's Helix announcement. Great product video. Once again, we're here with Nayaki Nayyar, but we're also being joined by Vidhya Srinivasan who's in Marketing within the Digital Services Management unit at BMC. Thank you very much for joining us in theCUBE. >> Great to be here, thank you. >> So we've heard a lot about the problems, we've heard a lot about BMC Helix as a solution, but obviously it's more than just the technology. There's things that customers have to think about, about how these technologies, how service management, cognitive service management's going to be impacting the business. As businesses become more digital, technology and related services get dragged more deeply into functions. So, Nayaki, tell us a little bit more about how the outcomes within business, the capabilities of businesses are gonna change as a consequence of applying these technologies. >> Absolutely, Peter. So if you look at, traditionally, IT service management was a very reactive process. Every ticket that came in was manually created, assigned, and routed. That was a very reactive process. But as we enter into this cognitive world and you apply intelligence, AIML, you evolve into what we call a proactive and predictive. Before an issue actually happens, you want to resolve that issue. And that's what we call the cognitive services management. And the real business outcomes, you put yourself in a customer's shoes who's providing this service and evolving into this proactive, predictive, and cognitive world, they wanna provide that service at the highest accuracy, at the highest speed, and the lowest cost. That's what is gonna become competitive advantage for every company indifferent of the industry. They could be in a telco, they could be in high-tech, or pharmaceutical. It doesn't matter which industry they are in, how they provide this service at the highest accuracy, highest speed, and lowest cost is gonna be fundamentally a competitive advantage for these customers. >> And when we talk about accuracy, again we're not just talking about accuracy in a technology context. We're talking about accuracy in terms of a brand promise, perhaps. >> Absolutely. >> Or a service promise, or a product promise. >> Yes. >> That's the context. We wanna make sure that the customer is getting what they expect fast, with accuracy, and at low cost. >> Right, every time you tweet or you're SMS-ing your service provider, you expect that response to be at the highest accuracy, at the speed, and the cost. >> So when we start talking about multi-channel, Vidhya, what we're really saying is that this is not just your, you know, this is not just service management for the traditional technology service desk. We're talking about service management for other personas, other individuals, other consumers as well. Take us through that a little bit. >> Yeah, that's right. So we actually take a very holistic approach, right, across the enterprise. So we have end-users who are, at the end of the day, the key subscribers or consumers of our service and we wanna make sure they're very happy with what we provide. We have the agents which kinda goes to the IT persona that people know about in the service desk. But then, as Nayaki said earlier, it's also about extending to a lines of business so you have HR agents, right, people who support HR requests, people who support facilities or procurement request. So making sure that the agent persona is able to do everything that they need to do at the most efficiency level that they can so that they can meet their SLAs to their end consumers is a big part of what Helix, BMC Helix and cognitive service management can provide. And ultimately, when you think about this transformation and where they wanna go, there's a lot of custom applications and custom needs that businesses have. So really thinking about the developer persona and how you actually embed and build intelligent applications through our cognitive microservices that BMC Helix provides is a big part of that value proposition we provide. So as you navigate through this journey and become a cognitive enterprise, how do you make sure that all of these personas throughout your enterprise is able to deliver and get value out of this is what BMC Helix provides for the whole enterprise. >> So the whole concept of incorporating these cognitive capabilities into a service management stack allows us to not only envision, in a traditional way, more complex applications but actually extend this out to new classes of users because we are masking a lot of the complexity and a lot of the uncertainty associated with how this stuff works from that customer. >> That's correct. >> For end-users, for agents, and for developers, and consumers, and customers too. >> Great. >> That's good. >> So you know what... Great conversation. But let's hear what a customer has to say about it, shall we? >> Absolutely, okay. >> My name is Marco Jongen. I work for a company called DSM. And I'm the Director for Service Management within the Global Business Services department. Royal DSM is a global science-based company active in health, nutrition, and materials. And by connecting our unique competencies in life science and in material sciences, DSM is driving economic prosperity, environmental progress, and social advance to create sustainable value for all stakeholders simultaneously. The Global Business Service department is serving the 20,000 employees of DSM spread over 200 locations globally. We are handling, annually, about 600,000 tickets, and we are supporting four business functions: finance, HR, procurement, and IT. We started together with BMC on a shared services transformation across IT, HR, finance, and procurement. And we created a unified ticketing system and a self-service portal using the Remedy system and the Digital Workplace environment. And with this, we are now able to handle all functions in one unified ticketing tool and giving visibility to all our employees with questions related to finance, HR, purchasing, and IT. We were still have and involved with BMC in bringing this product to the next level and we are very excited in the work we have done with BMC so far. >> That was great to hear Royal DSM is transforming its shared services organization with cognitive services management. But, Nayaki, there's no such thing as an easy transformation especially one of this magnitude. We're talking about digital business which is, we're using data assets differently, it's affecting virtually every feature of business today. And now we've got a technology set that's gonna have potentially an enormous impact on IT but everything that IT is being, or everywhere that IT is being employed. That kind of a transformation is not something that people do lightly. They expect their suppliers to help them out. So what is BMC gonna do to ensure that customers are successful as they go through this transformation to cognitive services management? >> Absolutely, Peter. I always say these transformations are not one-month, two-month transformations. These are multi-year transformations and it's a journey that customers go through. We partner very closely with customers in this journey, assessing their requirements, understanding what their future looks like, and helping them every step of the way. Especially in service management, this change, this transformation that is happening, is gonna be very disruptive to their end-to-end processes. Today, all service desks are manned by individuals. Every ticket that comes in gets manually created, assigned, and routed. But if you fast forward into the future world in the next two to three years, that service desk function, which is especially level zero, level one, level two, service desk function, will completely get replaced by bots or virtual agents. It could be 50-50, 70-30, you can pick what the percentage-- >> Whatever the business needs. >> Right? But it is coming. And it is very important for customers to see that change and that transformation that is happening and to be ready for it. And that's where we are working very closely with them in making sure it's not just a system transformation. It's also the people side and the process that have to change. And companies who can do that, what we call cognitive service management using bots and virtual agents at the highest accuracy, highest speed, and the lowest cost, I keep coming back to that because that is what is gonna give them the highest competitive advantage. >> Lot to think about. >> Absolutely. >> Exciting future, crucial for IT if it's gonna succeed moving forward, but even if the business choose to use cloud, you're going to need to be able to discover and sustain service management at a very, very high level. >> Absolutely. How we discover, how we help them discover, how we help them provide that service proactively, predictively, and provide that experience through omni-channel experiences, what this whole thing brings together for our customers. >> Excellent, this has been a great conversation. Nayaki Nayyar, President of BMC's Digital Services Management business unit. Thank you very much for being here on theCUBE and working with us to help announce Helix. Now don't forget folks, that immediately after this, we'll be running the CrowdChat. And in that CrowdChat, your peers, BMC experts, us analysts will be participating to help answer your questions, share experience, identify simpler ways of doing more complex things. So join us in the CrowdChat. Once again, Nayaki, thank you very much. >> Thank you, Peter, and thank you everyone. Thank you all.

>> Narrator: Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE, covering AWS re:Invent 2017. Presented by AWS, Intel and our ecosystem of partners. >> Welcome back, we are live here in Las Vegas, located at the Sands. Day three of our coverage here at re:Invent. AWS starting to wrap things up, but still, I think, making a very major statement about the progress they're making in their making in their market. 45,000 plus attendees here, thousands of exhibitors and exhibit space being used here in hundreds of thousands of square footage. Sort of a reflection of the vibrancy of that market. I'm with James Kobielus, who's the lead analyst at Wikibon and we're joined, once again, second appearance on theCUBE in one day, how 'bout that for Nayaki Nayyar, who is the President of Digital Services Management at BMC. Glad to have you back, we appreciate the time. >> Thank you, John, thank you, Jim. Great to be here and I'm becoming a pro at this, right? >> You are. >> My second time of the day. >> We'll punch your card and you win a prize by being on theCUBE more than once a day. >> Twice in four hours, I mean, that's a pretty good track record. >> We'll pick up your toy, you know. >> Tell me about, first off, just your thought about the show in general. I mean, you've been in this environment for some time now, but I'm kind of curious what you think about what you're seeing here and the sense of how this thing's really taking off. >> So, first of all, it's just the energy, the vibe, the fun that we're having here is just amazing. But, I do want to drop to the keynote that Andy did yesterday, it's just phenomenal the pace at which AWS is innovating. Just to be releasing over 1300 features in a year, that is phenomenal. >> James: I think he said innovations in a year. >> Features a year. >> Did he say features, okay. >> Yeah, I think so. But, independent of that, I'm just saying the pace at which, and their model of new stuff that they're bringing to the market is just phenomenal. For customers like us, vendors, it's just phenomenal. >> We hear a lot about, I mean, it's the buzzword, digital transformation and all that. So, what does it really mean to service? What transformation is happening in that, what is that pushing you on that side of the fence to have to be thinking about now? >> You said the word, digital, and sometimes it's very hyper-used. And what we have done at BMC, since our core is service management, we have defined what service management looks like for our customers in this digital age. And we have defined it, because we were primarily in I.T. service management for the last 10-15 years, the future of the service management in this digital world is what we call cognitive service management. Where service management is no longer just reactive, it is proactive and it is also a conversational through various agents like chatbots, or Alexa or virtual agents. So, it's a complete transformation that we are experiencing and we are driving most of that change for our customers right now. >> And, of course, the word cognitive signals the fact that there's some artificial intelligence going on behind the scenes, possibly to drive that conversational UI. With that in mind, I believe that, at BMC, you are one of AWS's partners for Alexa for businesses, is that true? And you're bringing it into an I.T. service management context. That's sounds like an innovation, can you tell us more about that? >> Absolutely, so we announced partnership with AWS on multiple fronts. One of them is with Alexa, Alexa for Business, where we do integrate with Alexa for providing that end user experience. So, Alexa was known for consumer world, my son used it all the time. >> Tell me the temperature? >> But now, we are looking at how we could bring it into the enterprise world, especially to provide service to all employees. So that, you don't actually have to send an email or pick up the phone to call a service agent, now you can actually interact with Alexa or a chatbot to get any service you need. So that's what we call omni-channel experience for providing that experience for end users, employees, customers, partners, anyone. >> So, do you have, right now, any reference customers, it's so new? Or, can you give us a sense for how this capability is working in the field in terms of your testing? Do business people understand, or are they comfortable, with using essentially a consumer appliance as an interface to some serious business infrastructure? Like, being able to report a fault in a server, or whatnot. There's a risk there of bringing in a technology, like a consumer technology, before it's really been accepted as a potential business tool. Tell us how that's working. >> That's a very interesting. We are actually seeing a very fast pace at which customers are adopting it. As we speak, I have three customers I'm working with right now, who not only wants to use a chatbot, or a virtual agent, for providing service, not just to employees but to the end customers, also want to use Alexa inside their company for providing service to their employees. So, it's starting the journey, we already have the integration that is working with Alexa. Customers have gotten very excited about it, they're doing POCs, they're starting their journey. I think in the next couple of years, we'll see a huge uptake with customers wanting to do that across the board. >> Well, give me an example, if I'm working and I need to go to Alexa Business, how deep can I go? What kind of problems can be solved? And then, at what point where does that shut off and then we trip over to the human element? >> James: Don't forget where the A.I. fits in to the picture. If you could just have a little bit of the plumbing, not too much. >> So, let me give you like two segments, one is the experience through Alexa, the second one is, where does deep learning get embedded into the process. So, usually every company has level one, level two service desk agents who are taking the calls, are responding to emails for resetting passwords or fixing foreign issues, laptop issues. So, that level one, level two service desk process is what is being replaced through a chatbot or an Alexa. So, now you can take the routine kind of a task away from having a human respond to it, you can have Alexa or a chatbot respond, do that work. The second piece, for high-complex scenarios, is where it switches. So, being able to automatically switch between an Alexa to a live agent, is where the beauty comes in and how we handle the transition. It has all the historical interaction through the whole journey for the customer. >> But then, Alexa forwards any information it has gained from the conversations- >> That interaction history we call it. >> To a human being who takes it to the next step. >> Nayaki: So when I- >> Can a human kick it back to Alexa at some point? >> No, no, we haven't seen that go back. It's usually, level one, level two is where Alexa takes care and then level three is where the human takes care and goes forward. Now, the second piece, the A.I.-ML piece. In a service management, there are a lot of processes that are very, I would say, routine and very manual. Like, every ticket that comes in, customers have millions of tickets that come in on a periodic basis. Every ticket that comes in, how you assign the ticket to the right individual, log the ticket and categorize the ticket is a very labor intensive and expensive process. So, we are embedding deep learning capabilities into that so we can automate, customers can automate all of those. >> James: Natural language processing, is that? >> With NLP embedded into it. Now, customers can choose to use an NLP engine of their choice, like Watson, or Amazon, or Cortana. And then, that gets fed back into the service management process. >> In fact, that's consistent with what AWS is saying about the whole deep learning space. They are agnostic as to the underlying deep learning framework you use to build this logic, whether it be TensorFlow or MXNet, or whatever. So, what you're saying is very consistent with that sort of open framework for plugging deep learning, or A.I., into the, in this case, the business application. Very good. So, developers within your customer base, what are you doing, BMC, to get developers up to speed on what they'll need to do to build the skills to be able to drive this whole service management workflow? >> So, all this work that we're doing with, what we call these cognitive services, they're all micro services that we are built into our platform. That, not only we are using in our own applications, like in Remedy, like in, what we call digital workplace, but also we have made it available for all the developers, partners, ecosystems, to consume it in their own applications. Just like what Amazon is doing with their micro services strategy, we have micro services for every one of these processes that developers can now consume and build their own special use cases, or use cases that are very unique to their business or to their customers. >> So who, I mean we were talking about this before we started the interview, about invent versus innovation, so, on the innovation side, what's driving that? I mean, are these interactions that you're having with customers and so you're trying to absorb whatever that input is, that feedback? Or, are you innovating almost in a vacuum, or in space a little bit, and are providing tools that you think could get traction? >> No, in fact, no, we are not just dreaming in our labs and saying, "This is what we should go do." (laughing) >> James: Dreaming in our labs. >> That's not where the driver is. What's really happening, independent of the industry, you pick any industry like telcos or financial industry, any industry is going through a major transformation where they are under competitive pressure to provide a service at the highest efficiency, highest speed, at the lowest cost. So if I'm a bank, or if I'm a telco, when a customer calls me and they have an issue, the pace at which I provide the service, the speed, and the cost at which I provide that service, and the accuracy at which I provide that service, is my competitive advantage. So, that is what is actually driving the innovations that we are bringing to market. And, all the three things that I talked about, end user experience through bots or through virtual agents, how we are automating the processes inside the service management, and how we are also providing it for the developers. All these three, create a package for our customers in every one of those industries, to address the speed, the efficiency and the cost for their service management. >> John: Go ahead James. >> At this show, AWS, among their many announcements that are building on their A.I., they have a new product called, and it's related to this, the accuracy, it's called Amazon Comprehend. Which is able to build on Polly, their NLP, their Natural Language Processing, to be able to identify in a natural language, entities like, "Hey, my PC doesn't work "and I think it's the hard drive," those are entities. But, also identify sentiment, whether the customer is very angry, mildly miffed, and so forth. Conceivably, you could use, or your customers could use that information in building out skills that are more fine-grained in terms of handing off to level two or level three support, "Okay, we've identified with a high degree of confidence "that the problem might reside in this particular component "of the system, the customer is really out of joint, "you need to put somebody on this right away." So forth and so on. Any thoughts about possibly using this new functionality within the context of Alexa for Business as you were deploying it at BMC? In the future? Your thoughts? >> Absolutely, in fact that was what I was very excited about that, when they announced that. You know, in an NLP, NLP has been around for many years now and there's been a lot of experiments around NLP. >> The first patent for NLP was like in the late '50s. >> But the maturity of NLP now, and the pace at which, like Amazon, they're innovating is just phenomenal. And the real beauty of it would be, when an NLP engine can really become intelligent when it can understand the sentiment of the customer, when the customer is saying something, it should detect that the customer is angry, happy, or on the edge. We are not there yet, I'm really excited to see the announcements from AWS on the Comprehend side. If they really can deliver on that understanding sentiment, I think it would be phenomenal. >> I don't want to get us off the tracks, but it's a fascinating point. Because, as you know words, in a static environment can be misinterpreted one of 50,000 ways. So, how do you get this A.I. to apply to emotional pitch, tone, agitation? How do you recognize that? >> That is where NLP, the maturity of an NLP, is what's gonna be game changing in the long term. For it to be able to know what the underlying sentiment. >> Anger, excitement, joy, despair, I mean, all those things. "I've had enough," can be said many different ways. >> And that's when we'll switch to a live agent, if it's not able to do it, we will quickly switch to a live agent. (laughing) >> The bot gives up, right? (laughing) >> Or is it emotion threshold where a human being might be the best immediate front-line support. >> Just curious, it's fascinating. Well, thank you for the time, we certainly appreciate that. And, we promise, this'll be it for the day. (laughing) All right, no more CUBE duty. But, we certainly wish you all the best down the road. And, like you, I think we've certainly seen, and have a deeper appreciation for what's happening in this marketplace with what we've seen here this week. It was extraordinary. >> Fascinating. >> Thank you, John, it was a pleasure. And really excited to have two CUBE interviews in a day. >> John: How 'bout that? >> But, I think it's a great forum for us to get our message out and get the world to know what we are doing as BMC and the innovations we're beginning. >> We're excited to talk to real innovators in the business world, so, all power to you. >> Thanks for the time. >> Thank you. >> Nice to meet you. Back with more, we are live here at re:Invent AWS in Las Vegas. Back with more live here on theCUBE right after this break. (upbeat music)