(upbeat music) >> Narrator: From Seattle, Washington it's theCUBE. Covering AWS Imagine. Brought to you by Amazon Web Services. >> Hey, welcome back everybody, Jeff Rick here with theCUBE. We're at AWS Imagine, it's a show all about education. That's whether it's university, K to 12, community college, post-military service. Amazon is very, very committed to education market. It's part of the public sector group underneath Teresa Carlson. This is the second year of the conference. We're excited to be back, and really some interesting conversations about how does education move forward. 'Cause it doesn't necessarily have the best reputation for being the most progressive industry out there. So we're excited to have our next guest all the way from London, she's Dr. Amanda Broderick, the Vice-Chancellor and President of the University of East London. Welcome. >> Thank you very much. Thank you, very nice to meet you. >> Absolutely, so first off before we get into it, just kind of your impressions of this event, and kind of what Amazon is doing. Teresa did the keynote today, which is not insignificant. She's a super busy lady, and kind of what does this ecosystem, these resources, this kind of focus, do for you as an educator? >> The main reason that we're working with AWS in such a significant way is actually because of our genuine values alignment. Institutionally, those core priorities are really where we want to go as an organization. And for me this conference, this summit, has been an opportunity to share best practice, to innovate, to truly explore the opportunity to disrupt for ultimately, the end goal. Which is about the education, the development of our next generation, and the support of talent development for the future. >> But unfortunately, a lot of times it feels like institutions put the institution first, and we're seeing a lot of conversations here in the US about these ridiculously crazy, large endowments that sit in piles of money. And is the investment getting back to the students? Are we keeping our eye on the ball? That it's the students that need the investment, not all the other stuff, all the other distractions, that get involved in the higher education. >> I suppose that is where the University of East London is fundamentally different. Core to our mission is driving social mobility, and as such we have to be absolutely clear what those learner outcomes are, and they are about being able to access and accelerate in their careers, and indeed in their lifelong learning to enable them to progress in portfolio careers. >> Right, so it's interesting ahead the three topics for this shows is tomorrow's workforce, which we've talked a lot about the education. The role of ML, which I think is interesting that it got its own bullet. Just because machine learning is so pervasive, and software, and doing lots of things. And the one that that struck me is the effort to have higher predictability on the success of the student, and to really make sure that you're catching problems early, if there is a problem. You're actually using a lot of science to better improve the odds of that student success. A lot of conversation here about that topic. >> Absolutely, absolutely, and that machine learning approach is one of the key dimensions in our relationship with AWS. And this is not just about the student outcomes around continuation, engagement, progression, student success, but actually for the University of East London, it's also been about the identification of students at risk. So we fundamentally believe that health gain is a precondition of learning gain. Particularly important for an institution like ours that is so socially inclusive, and therefore what we're doing, we're actually one of ten institutions that have been funded by the government and working in partnership with AWS as a pilot to share best practice across the UK as a whole, is to identify the proxies. For example, mental health issues, to be able to signpost and traffic light the sign posting to areas of support and to be able to direct prevention, intervention and postvention strategies to those students at risk. And that project is actually a key area of our partnership development with AWS. >> And how long has that been going on? We talked it a little bit about it before we turn the cameras on, and it just seems so foundational to me that without putting in that infrastructure for these kids, regardless of their age, their probability of success on top of that, without a good foundation is so much less. So when did this become a priority? How are you prioritizing it? What are some of the really key measures that you're using to make sure that you're making progress against this goal? >> Absolutely, so the university has made good progress in terms of the fundamental issues of identifying where the correlations and the causations are between both physical and mental health and well-being, and outcomes. What we haven't been able to do at this point is the scalability of this issue, and that's really where this pilot project, which has literally been announced in the last couple of weeks, that we're working very closely with AWS in order to convert that core foundational research and development into scalable solutions. Not just for my own university, but actually for the sector as a whole. >> Right, so we talked about academic institutions, maybe not necessarily have the best reputation for innovation, especially kind of old storied ones with old ivy plants growing up old old brick walls. Is this a new kind of realization of the importance of this? Is this coming from maybe some of the more vocational kind of schools, or is it coming from the top? Do they realize that there's more to this than just making sure people study, and they know what they're doing when they turn in their test and get their paper in on time? >> It's both a top-down and bottom-up approach. It's fundamental to the University of East London. It's new ten year strategy vision 2028. Health gain is that precondition of learning gain. It's fundamental to the realization of our learner's success. But also it's come from a groundswell of the research and development outcomes over a number of years. So it's absolutely been the priority for the institution from September 2018, and we've been able to accelerate this over the last few months. >> So important. Such important work. Flipping the point a little bit on to something a little lighter, a little bit more fun, it's really innovation on the engagement with the students around things like mobile. We've had a lot of conversations here about integrating Alexa, and voice, and competing with online, and competing with other institutions, and being a little bit more proactive in engaging with the customer as your students. I wonder if you can share some thoughts as to how that has evolved over time. Again, you've been in the business for a while, and really starting to cater and be innovative on that front end, versus the back end, to be more engaging and help students learn in different ways. Where they are in little micro segments. It's a very different kind of approach. >> It absolutely is and one of our four major facilitating transformation projects, it's called our digital verse project, and that is across all of our activities of an institution, in terms of business transformation, our particular priority is prospect engagement, and how we actually convert our potential learners in more effective ways. Secondly, enhancing deeper learning, and how we then produce better learner outcomes. Thirdly, how we develop access to new ways of educational provision, 24/7 global access. And fourthly, how do we connect with employers in partnership to make sure that we get those challenges around pre-selection recruitment strategies, and we're unable to get the students, our learners, into careers post graduation. >> Right, and then what's the kind of feedback from the teachers and the professors? They have so much on their plate. Right, they've got their core academic research that they're doing, they're teaching their students, they've got a passion around that area. I always tell people it's like driving in the car in the snow at night with your headlights on, right. Just like all types of new regs that are coming in and requirements and law, and this that and the other. Now we're coming in with this whole four point digital transformation. Are they excited, are they overwhelmed, are they like finally, we're getting to do something different? I mean what's the take within the academics, specifically in your school? >> I think the answer to that is all of the above. >> All of the above. >> It really reflects the classic adoption curve. So you do have the innovators, you have the early adopters, and then you also have the laggards at the other end. And an often actually, the most traditional academics that have been doing things for many, many years, who are very set in their ways, if you expose them to new opportunities, new experiences, and actually provide them with the tools to innovate, they could be some of the best advocates for the transformation and we've certainly found that to be the case. >> Good, well Amanda, thanks for taking a few minutes of your time, it sounds like they're going to start the dancing here behind us soon. So I think we'll have to leave it there, but I look forward to seeing you sometime in London. >> Thank you very much. >> Alright, she's Dr. Amanda Broderick, I'm Jeff Rick, you're watching theCUBE. We're at AWS Imagine in Seattle. Thanks for watching we'll see you next time. (upbeat music)

>> live from London, England. It's the queue covering a ws summat. London twenty nineteen, brought to you by Amazon Web services. >> Welcome back to London, Everybody. This is David Lamont and you watch the Cube. The leader and live tech coverage has been a incredible week for the Cube. Three events this week in London that we had six events worldwide. We started out yesterday with a public sector session. Special mini session We did for Teresa Carlson at eight of US headquarters. And we did it impact investor event last night, Of course. All day here at the eight of US Summit in London at Excel Centre. Twelve thousand people. We're going to wrap up now. My good friend Kim Myers here is the managing director of M. C. I experience Kim. Thanks for coming on. My pleasure. First time on the Cube You got to give you a sticker. >> Thank you. Make you know, great to see you is also great to be here >> to have you. So you are branding expert. We've had a lot of conversations about this. You and I go way back. Do you brand Is everything every touch point? I mean, you would tell me a story last night and I let you pick it up from here of Apple. You see the apple logo, but so why is Brandon so important? What's M. C I experience and how are you helping brands? >> Yeah, Well, Dave, I think it's really amazing, like this event today. You know, we have a lot of technology out there today. We're really digitally enabled, and that's great. I mean, it's amazing what we can do now with technology, but, you know, it also is a little distracting. And and some in fact, there was a recent study that said that kids air haven't developed social skills because there is, they feel more comfortable communicating online, you know? So I think the technology is really great and it's important. But that human human connection is really the thing that makes the difference. And I think brands are starting to recognize that that actually live experiences do cut through the clutter, the digital clutter and getting people together with common interests, getting them engaged. Letting them participate really makes a difference in terms of their affinity and loyalty and even advocacy for your brand. >> So M. C. I experience does that. >> Yeah, that's were essentially work with companies across a lot of industries, but certainly the tech industry. But helping companies, um, developed ways of engaging with their audiences and more meaningful ways. And actually, it's a very human centric approach. So basically the way we look at it is it's not so much about logistics. That's important. Of course, right. You gotta register people. You're gonna have so many breakout rooms got over that gotta, gotta thank you guys. But it's really more about understanding your audience on DH, where they drive benefit and making sure that you're meeting that need. And that's really where your band, your brand, starts to benefit. So we use a design thinking methodology. We're really very focused on the audience using empathy and ideation and you know, just really, really getting to know who those guys are like this crowd and making sure that every touch point of the experience, how it smells the temperature, the lighting, everything smells house. No, seventy percent of your memory is from smell, you know, and yet we never even think about >> it. It's weird when you run a defense, >> you don't even think about it. really. It's just like Exactly. So it's, uh, that sort of multi sensory, engaging aspect of what we do is what m. C. A Experienced specializes in and working with clients to help them sort of look at new ways of creating experiences that really engaged their audiences and really create community around those audiences in terms of loyal fans and customers. >> So we hear it at Amazon. You see this audience? Obviously a developer crowd? Yeah. Um what, do your thoughts here just walking around? >> Well, as I was saying, I think you know, we were talking about this earlier. You know, developer crowd doesn't like flashy marketing because they're suspicious of it, right? You think I like you? David Tyree? Exactly. Uh, Mrs Perfect Tone. I think the tone created here is great. It's a little rough and ready, and that's great. And that's how it should be because that's ah, developers and warranted in the content than the show. And I think it's got the audience bang on. >> So how do you use data to inform this brand experience? >> Yeah, so date is becoming obviously really important, and event technology is you know, it's amazing today the kinds of things we can do. I mean, we can track people and monitor them and take their temperature. I mean, if we want to, you know, you could do an amazing number of things, see >> how they smell >> exactly. And the thing about it is, that date is important. Of course it is. But insights even more important. And that means using data in the right way the right analytics asking the right questions, not just relying on demographics, but really getting to know people on building personas and understanding who your audience is. And I think it's the two things need to fit hand in hand in hand. >> Data is plentiful, actionable insights, you're saying are not necessary, >> not necessarily, not necessarily, and that that that, I think, is really, really important. You know, we call an empathy planning, but it's kind of like walking in the shoes of your audience like, would you like this? Would you be happy with this, or would you find this long queue to register annoying? You know, you have to sort of, you know, actually get in there, get in their shoes and and feel it just like you're going to feel it. >> Well, it's sometimes it's hard to predict it. It is. This is a pretty large venue. But it was packed today, but I don't think they could hold many more people. So I guess you have to say sorry. We've got to cut it off of this because of the experience. I mean, making hard decisions like that. Is that what you recommend? Yeah, >> I think of you. Well, the other thing, too, is, you know, our our attention span time. Someone told me recently that our attention spans like less than a gold fish. I don't know, I don't know anymore, but, you know, it's ah, you know what I want. One thing about the audience now is that they don't need to be polite, and they don't need to pay attention to boring content. And they don't need to do any of that because they're in power, right? Exactly. You know how many bent So I've been to where the entire audience is like looking at their phones with their ipads or the computers on DH checking out on the content, you know. So if you really want to engage people, you need to make sure that the experience really resonates with them. And having said that, you need to use technology because we live in this kind of on live world and people say to me like What's on line like you ever drive was sat Now you know you're driving, but you're being instructed by an application and a lot of what we do today, whether you're finding the bank on your phone, your dentist or your phone or you're doing this or that, we're connected in both ways. And so I think that's really important that we recognize that you can't tell people to turn their phones off. You can't necessarily, you know, use technology and interruptive way. It needs to be part of how people live their lives around this. >> So I have observed that we do a lot of these events and that's it becomes like rock concerts, and sometimes you say, Wow, this is a little over the top Now that's not from inferring right. That's not necessarily a bad thing. If your audience is into it, if your audience is, you know, some guy who provisions lungs, you know every day and gets out to Las Vegas once a year. Maybe that's an OK thing. I think it is. It's really understanding the audience. >> It is understanding the audience. And I think it is a good okay thing. And, you know, you want to have your audience entertained, engaged and, you know, have fun. And I want to tell people about it. Like I'm in Las Vegas. You're not, You know, they're like, you want people to get really fired up about what you're doing. And and and by the way, they're going to give your brand credit for that. They're going to say, you know, bam. I was at this event. Was it rocked? It was amazing. There was great entertainment. There is also a great content. There was great networking, you know, And the beer wasn't all that cheap. So, you know, you get all that stuff together and you have a really great time. >> So you're built your now building out a team? Yeah. Yeah. Tell me about tell me about the team and your vision. >> Okay, So, m c. I is a big company. We're in sixty three countries around the world, so we're not small fry. But the truth is, you know, the A big part of our business had been P. C. A. Is PCO professional. Congress organizes a lot of association events, and that's something and meetings, planning. And that's one thing. And of course, today experiences. They're changing. And it's not about just the logistics. It's really about again. Understand your audience, using strategy and creative to create compelling experiences. And that's what I'm CIA experience is doing. And we're doing it here in the UK we're getting set up, and it's going really, really well, and we're going to roll it out, you know, it's going to It's going to go around the world. So, um, we're working with some Fantastic brand's doing some fantastic project so we're all really excited. >> So what? Follow up question. But other than that, you're awesome. You are. You really have been an expert at this. You've You've worked. You know, I'd G worked G p j worked at Freeman, and I'm not on. Yeah, yeah. You've seen it around too much. You've seen the good, the bad and the ugly. And now you've taken that experience and you're bringing it to M. C. I experience no pun intended and you're trying to build out a sort of a next generation experience from Butt. But other than the fact that you're awesome, why should I work with you? >> Well, I tell you, you know, I think that the most of the clients that we work with come to us saying, You know, we don't know. We don't know And I think that's really, really important. I always tell this story. It's called the It's called the Drunkards Paradox, where a drunk man is underneath the lamppost pounding the ground and another man walks by. And so So what do you doing? And he says, I'm looking for my keys. And so the other guy gets down on his hands and knees. He's padding around. And then he said, Did you drop your keys right here under the lamppost? Because no, I dropped them across the street in the dark. Well, then why are you looking here? Because the light is much better here. And I have I tell you that I have a lot of experience in this business and events professionals on DH. Even some experience agencies tend to look where the light is better not where the breakthrough ideas are, and I think we are committed to making sure that we were really closely replying to really understand their brand, really understand who they're trying to build relationships with and and beg, borrow and steal from other disciplines, you know, in an intersectional way to create new kinds of opportunities for engagement. >> One of the things that mantra inside one of the many monsters inside of Amazon has raised the bar. I was at their UK headquarters yesterday, and she raised the bar signs all over the place. It's not a rinse and repeat culture. That's really what you're saying here that is easy to rinse and repeat. It's easy to look for the keys where the light the light is better, right? But that's not transformational. That's not transformation. It's really awesome. Having I'LL give you the last word the conference >> are Well, I think the conference was It was a great day here, and I think, you know, just just testimony to that is how long people stayed and stayed till the very end. You know, they were they were engaged and lots of great conversations were going on, you know, so fantastic. Well done. A WS and Amazon Web services and, um, yeah. More to come. >> Pleasure having you. Thanks for coming. All right. Thank you for watching everybody. That's a wrap here from London. Check out silicon angle dot com for all the news. The cube dot net is where all you find all these videos. Wicked bond dot com for the research Is David Dante signing out from London? Thanks for watching.

>> live from London, England. It's the key covering a ws summat London twenty nineteen brought to you by Amazon Web services. >> Welcome back to London. Everybody, this is David. Continue watching the Cube. The leader in live tech coverage. We're here at the London A ws sum of twelve thousand people here for one day summit, which is typically the size of a large tech event that we cover in Las Vegas. John Lovelock is here is a vice president analyst that gardeners essentially gardeners Chief Forecaster John, Thanks for coming with huge pleasure to have you. Thanks for >> having me. It's a great show today. Great event. Happy to be here. >> You're in from Toronto. And, uh, yeah, I'm very impressed with the crowd. He obviously a developer crowd. You and I aren't ties. They see us coming. They think we're trying to sell him something. Waseem have >> ah, monopoly on all the ties and the rule. We have a very diverse group here, but they're all very enthusiastic. Could be here. It's been a great conference. >> So everywhere we go, we hear numbers. Obviously people want toe talk about the size of the market, its growth. That's your job to figure that out. I mean, I've heard numbers that it's a multi trillion dollar market now, uh, growing faster than GDP. I'd love to get your your thoughts on that. Where do we start? Top level macro. What's the pick? >> Top level macro cloud in all of its forms is the fastest growing tech the gardener is tracking. There is definitely spending in there. We're in the twenty twenty five percent growth globally. Nothing else comes close. Your overall growth rate for Total I'd spend this year is one point one percent cloud a twenty five percent. It is moving the market. The only way is doing that, of course, it's by taking money away from legacy lines of business. You know, it's about the switch and spending preference from legacy it and moving that into clouded in all of its forms. >> So it's a share shift you see going on. So you've got the total market growing below global GDP. Is that is that a fair statement? >> It's just below global TV >> usually tracks pretty closely. You would think right? I mean, it's logical that it would >> actually this almost no correlation between GDP and spend really It is one of the biggest things that we have to fight again. >> So that's a myth. >> Absolute myth here to tell you it is dead. There is a flight co relation, but there's no causation. Yl move between GDP and spending, just not there. >> So that makes your job even harder. It does. We have to >> watch what the vendors. They're selling off what they hope to spend. But most importantly, it's about what the demand side is doing. What are people doing? Why air they buying what they're buying? How much are they spending on the stuff that they have, what's get retired and what gets replaced with something new? And that's the whole big shift that we're seeing is a lot of things that are being retired out of the CEOs bag of tricks and a lot of new things coming in. So the spending shift that we're seeing it's all down to where is the CEO in their journey? Howie? How quickly are they able to move from legacy? I t to the new it How quickly is their business moving into being a digital business? >> So okay, so it's one plus percent growth on what we're talking two trillion, three trillion. I mean, what's the four trillion >> four trillion dollars by twenty twenty? >> Okay, And you said Cloud computing growing its twentieth twenty five percent. Eight of us, a thirty billion dollars run right business now growing at forty two percent. Inconstant currency. We're going in at nearly or maybe even slightly more than twice the market. That's astounding, that basically adding nine to ten million dollars a year. >> And they are right in the sweet spot for cloud growth. Do >> you think they hit the law of large numbers of people have been predicting that for years. Could get a company that size in your experience. Continue to grow at that pace? >> Absolutely there is. There is nothing stopping a ws from taking advantage of this market. We're nowhere near saturated for cloud changes. Most of software spend is still on legacy and maintenance of of software. On Prem. There's still a great deal of money being spent on servers and infrastructure and networking equipment, and all of that gets bled out into the cloud. Eventually, where they have opportunity to shift is almost limitless. You know the amount of money that is being spent by enterprises on cloud is different around the world. In the US, where cloud basically started where the infection started and it's spreading around the world. Back in twenty sixteen, there were about sixty percent of overall enterprise spend was on cloud. The rest of the world is tracking towards that. We have company countries that air close the U. K Canada one two years behind France Germany three four, most of Europe in the three to five years behind. We have some countries that are lagging a little bit further and several dinner just resisting that are not on track to get to cloud. We don't see them getting to cloud even in the ten year times, fam. But the fact that cloud spend in the U. S. Still makes up over fifty percent of global spending on cloud, but only twenty five percent of global spending on it, a lot of money still left to move over. >> That's interesting that that was the facts that's that suggest that there is a delta and cloud adoption between between United States and rest of world that the vendor narrative would not have you believe that? Am I getting that right? Is it? Is it not only slower adoption? What are they they as sophisticated in their adoption, or is there a delta there as well? >> There is a bit of it. There is a delta also in the sophistication. We know that there's a skill gap when it comes to cloud. Everywhere in the world faces the skill gap of the number of people they need with the new skills and cloud and the people they have with the skills that they have. Many companies are missing the fact that some of their Cobol programmers are the ones that should be developing their new cloud applications because it's about changing the business. And nobody knows their business better than the guys that have been writing the legacy apse that have been running the business for the last twenty years. So the training opportunity is actually with their Kobol programs with their long term programmers. We're not seeing that hitting into the market as much as we'd like. >> So your job very difficult job spent. The consolidation makes your job harder in a way, because part of a squint through companies want to tell you what they want to tell you, but you got to figure out what the truth is. When you think about Cloud, it appears relatively straightforward. It's a pure play. They now report their numbers. That must have helped you a lot. But a lot of vendors will throw everything the kitchen sink, you know, numbers for cloud. So you have to parse through that. You have to come up with common definitions across. I mean, good example. Certainly. IBM Oracle broke it out earlier, but now they sort of consolidate everything. One wonders, OK, Where they trying to hide? Not not to pick on people, but their large, established legacy companies. But they want to show their investors. Oh, we're growing at this. The Sirait. So how do you parse through that and squint through that and then come out the other end with the >> real numbers? Well, we have a lot of advantages of Gardner. We spend millions of dollars every year on surveying out globally. We get, we get responses back from CEOs from around the world. We do the largest CEO survey every single year, so we're getting feedback on where the money is being spent. We also have interviews that we do with our clients every single day. We do over two hundred fifty thousand enquiries with clients every year. So we're getting a great deal of feedback from where the money is being spent. We have to reconcile both sides of it. What the vendors air expecting to be what they're telling us that they're making and reconcile ing that with what we're being told is being spent. So we have multiple sides to get to this angle and again. When you start with a vendor, you start with their global revenue. It has to parse out from They're >> gonna match the income statement somehow. But so you've got the empirical data from your surveys. You've got the vendor data. You bottom up. You could do that. And you've got the anecdotal data from your inquiry. You know, your your corporate memory on kind of putting your job is to put all that together. >> Yeah, and we're tracking what we call our peer inside data. We're asking our clients, you know, when they're making a choice which fenders air, they choosing Which friends are they considering? Why did they make the choices? They are. We have our talent neuron database where we're scraping job postings from around the world. So we have somewhere over four billion job postings covering the last five years. So when a company is telling us that they have a large new division, we could go back and say, I don't see you ever hiring those people. So we do have multiple points of light that all really have to come together. It is a tremendously interesting job in a bit of a challenge, but it's one that keeps me up. >> Okay, I often joke. Well, well, Doctor, Uh, Oz. Sorry, Dr Watson. Replace Dr Welby and the answer comes back. Well, you won't replace Dr Oz because you still have to have that nurturing and that interaction. Do you feel as though machine intelligence Based on what? You know, Gardner analysts, You got experts? Many, I'm sure that Follow artificial intelligence machine intelligence. Do you feel like you guys can start applying? Aye, aye. Deep learning, et cetera. To identify patterns to make your job easier, more effective, more science than art. What? Your thoughts on >> that? Well, we have taken a different road. Artificial intelligence requires a lot of good bad data going into it in order to make the right decision. It is changing so quickly. It's difficult to get enough data points together to train and artificial intelligence. We do do some augmentation way. Do have tools that automates certain processes for us and feed us results from multiple millions of data points. But at the end of the day, it's not about coming up with four trillion dollars. That's interesting to anybody. It's the why is it four trillion dollars? Why is it a different four trillion dollars than last year's three point nine trillion dollars? And what's the changing environment that is going >> on >> and the story behind it? The segments, the share shifts and those other trends that you're seeing? >> Because everybody on this floor, all of these eyes start ups, they desperately want to make my number's wrong. They want to change the market in such a dramatic way that they disrupt all of the spending. I can't train in a eye to watch for that >> is your background in econometrics. You an economist? Do you have a math whiz or you're computer scientist? >> All of that, Yeah, have degrees in economics and statistics. I have forty years almost in computer programming been through this cycle for many, many times. So I did a great job from he has all of my sword skill sets coming together. >> You're obviously not a one man band. You mentioned you do, you know, spend millions of dollars on surveys. Two hundred fifty thousand enquiries, but still hurting all that data and actually making sense of it, is it is. It is a challenge. How do you How do you manage that? How are you evolving your your systems, your models? I mean what you used today The tooling is different than it was ten years ago, and you've gotta stay. Current >> are are forecasting model generically. We call the market dynamic models, and what they do is build out user behavior. Where's demand coming from? How are we fulfilling on that demand? What do we do with the investments that we've already made? The's models run from nineteen eighty through twenty thirty. It takes somewhere in the neighborhood of eight hundred thousand calculations to come up with one segment forecast for forty three countries. We have over two hundred fifty segments that we forecast, so you could see the complexity that we're getting into. There are over two hundred fifty analysts that gardener who are working on from what we call her our technology and service provider research group, to help our vendor clients know where their market is, know where it's going, and the partners that they should be looking >> towards you factor in or how do you factor in if it all your geo political trends? Um, tariffs, things of that nature. What do you say? You know what we're gonna do? A clean forecast on DH. Let the market figure that out. How do you handle it? At >> the end of the day, there's two very important pieces within a model. They break into signal and noise. The signal is the shifting buying patterns. When the demand level changes, there's a signal there when a choice pattern changes. Instead of buying license software, I'm starting to buy Cloud. That's a signal change. Those are the things that we focus on. The stuff that you were talking about the economic situations brexit, terrorists, China. Those were all noise. They're important. They have to be taken account of in the model, but they're not the most important thing. All right, Brexit right now is depressing the US air, the European spending on it. It is below that one point one percent growth rate. Because of the uncertainty. People are keeping their finger, their hands in their pockets when it comes to big changes in it. But the big shift is still happening. We're still seeing movement towards cloud. We're still seeing movement towards digital business. All those big signals air there, there dampened a little bit by the noise of the economy. >> So the rip currents obviously cloud. You mentioned that digital business, which I interpreted is data orientation toward a business a little >> bit more with you. >> But please add some color to that. And what are some of the other rip currents that you're seeing? >> Artificial intelligence is another riptide that is moving through. It is a big trend that is changing what's expected of technology at every level. Digital business is changing what's expected of customer interactions at every level. Digital business ecosystems, where companies air able to interact in a way that moves data from one organization to the other without necessarily having trust, commitment or a contract is a major change that we're seeing it reduces the friction of handoff between one business and the other speeds. The process drops the cost. >> A lot of your clients are large, established businesses, gardeners well known for advising those businesses. Many of those businesses, their data lives in silos. They have legacy infrastructure, technical debt. Call it whatever you want it, and they're getting disrupted by these. You know, the guys who were doing Cloud Native, all the guys out here that want to make your full forecast wrong. How does Gardner see just sort of anecdotally, those guys closing the gap, the traditional, the incumbents closing that gap >> into the source extent they don't have to, right? Certainly their size is going to give them longevity. Whether they make change or not, they will see their influence on the market. Chip away if they don't start to, they don't have the same urgency is the small vendors that are moving quickly. Where we see them doing things is very patiently and incrementally, they're taking different processes and moving them to the cloud. It is very common to see them take something that they're already doing are comfortably doing and moving that to a new platform and improving that small piece incremental change. The world gets better with incremental change. Where we love to see them do something is where they actually change the business model first using the technology that's going to enable that we have the company in China who has managed to get home food delivery cheaper than buying it in a restaurant because they change the business model First. They work with the places that are selling the food they're doing group on their doing direct cash, ordering they're doing guaranteed sale so that they could get food less expensively. They're using artificial intelligence to workout delivery routes and pick up so that multiple deliveries are made at the same time. In most of the world, that's not the That's not been the model. They've changed one part of delivery. We're going to make it easier for you to order food on your phone, and then we're going to charge you for the delivery, and we're going to charge you more for the food that's coming in. That's incremental. It's nice, it's helping. But when we change the model first, the outcome is so much better. >> So last course of U. S. Largest market, right? In terms >> of largest market for fifty eight percent of cloud. Spend >> little nightie spending Generally correct. Correct. China. When do you think Do you think China will overtake The U. S. Is the largest market for I spent >> china right now. Is Scott almost double the growth and cloud spending of the U. S. It is as a percentage of spends still well below. But they're the only country that is breaking the trend of following the US. They're on a much steeper incline. They could be above the US spend by twenty twenty five, even with a growth rate that the U. S. Is on. >> John. Awesome having you on. Thanks so much for having me really a pleasure having you great insights from Gardner analyst John Lovelock. And you're watching the Cube were bringing it all to you live from London this day. Volonte, we're right back right after this short break

>> live from London, England. It's the queue covering a ws summat. London twenty nineteen Brought to you by Amazon Web services >> Welcome back to London Summit Everybody, this is David Lamont and you watching the Cube, the leader in live tech coverage. We loved to go out to the events. We extract the signal from the noise. This is our one day coverage of a WS summit London, and it's packed house twelve thousand people here. The twenty six thousand people registered, which is just outstanding. Chris Bunches. Here's the general manager of a MIA for cloud reach, and he's joined by Mark Randy, whose CEO of signal FX. Gentlemen, welcome to the Cube. >> Thank you. >> Okay, let's start with signal effects. What's going on at the show? What's the buzz like? >> Very busy. Dozens deep. A lot of demonstrations feature in our massively scalable metrics platform and distributed tracing platform. So we've had a very good show. Good showing in London. >> Good. We're going to get into some of that. Chris, tell us about cloud reach. What you guys do? >> Sure. So Cloud Reach was founded in two thousand and nine. So quite a long time ago in the history of cloud confusing, at least >> was right after the Cloud City with >> quite a pure vision around helping complex organizations to adults public cloud computing technologies to doom or faster and better. That's all we've ever done. It's all we ever intend to do way work these days with enterprise organizations across the cloud lifecycle starting with adoption, helping them to understand White Cloud. How am I going to do this? How am I going to move my data center's into the cloud? How am I gonna build new services moving on through the life cycle? We help them with that. At that migration, we helped them to shut down their data centers on rebuild them in a WS. We helped build New Cloud native Services. Using the latest offerings from from Amazon and other cloud providers, we worked with him on Data analytics, helping them to generate insights from their data. Data flows in an ever faster pace from across the across the world into their organization. On all of that is wraps with an MSP manage service twenty four hours a day, seven days a week. >> So, Mark, I gotta ask you so back back in the day, the narrative was that the public law was going to kill every man, his service provider out there. It's been nothing but a tailwind for your business. Business is booming. What's what actually happened to give you that? Left >> on the signal effects side I look, the big trends are the move to the cloud number one. The second piece is just a change in the architecture's you know, the move to communities, the introduction for elastic burst e type use cases of things like Lambda and and that even more importantly, just the process of developing software movement from, you know, waterfall, Dad, agile and the Whole Dev ops movement in introduction of micro services. So that's it's It's just a lot of a lot of these ways been going on for quite some time, but they're really starting to hit the shore to shore right now, and I think it's been a great great opportunity for companies like Cloud Reach Tio to take advantage of were very excited by the partnership. >> Well, it has. It has ripple effects on the rest of the business, doesn't it? I was saying earlier in a segment that it used to be the business of No, we can't do that because and now you look around this audience, it's all doers and builders, and, you know, it's it's actually great marketing because it works, doesn't it? So clouded has been a fundamental component of >> Yeah, I mean, our whole businesses around making t v enabler helping businesses to innovate. Once upon a time, the message was all around. Cost saving is the reason to move to the cloud, and there's still an element of that. Nobody wants to pay Mohr, but actually, increasingly, what we're seeing is organizations moving to Amazon because they want the agility, they want to move faster. And they don't want to be the the culture of no and have a process that takes six months to deliver a new service to the business. They want to be out of deliver things in hours or minutes in the some cases, and they want to do so quickly on they want to innovate, a pace that they've never been able to before, partly from a competitive threat perspective and partly from a market opportunity. There's so much, but we can deliver to customers if we put our minds to it and use the primitives, the Amazon providers, as building blocks to enable new >> services. You know where you live in the Bay Area. I spent a lot of time out there, were based in Palo Alto and use a vortex that unique that sometimes I think way think that that's where all the action is. You come to London and you see all these startups. Every business is becoming a software company. And you know, we don't in Silicon Valley in America have a monopoly on innovation anymore, >> not even close. So there's a lot of great innovation all over Europe. Uh, here in the U K. All the way to Northern Europe, Doc, uh, Paris Way we see it across the board. So >> So what are people doing? They building new cloud native APS in the public loud. Are they doing a lifted shift and trying to get more agility out of those traditional APs? What's the landscape? Looks like? >> It's ah, combination of the two. The startup organizations, of course, is starting with no legacy. There's nothing to my great and they are building cloud native and they're doing so far, >> we have no I d >> no. Yeah, technically, before nine years, four hundred on eBay test migrations. But that's the only hardware for the museum. Exactly the larger organizations. They have huge volumes of legacy infrastructure, some of it dating back to the seventies. In the case of financial institutions or public sector, then all of that is an opportunity to modernize, and not just for the agility and innovation but in some cases just to reduce risk. There is huge business risk in these old, untouched, dusty, cobweb ridden servers that nobody understands anymore. And there's a really opportunity to move that to the public cloud, reduce and remove that risk. And while you're there, take advantage of the new technologies and innovative deliver a better service to you or in consumer whoever that may be >> so prik uber, Netease and micro services, even though containers have been around for a while. But the modern doctors ascendancy. You know why? To K was the year of the decade of modernization. It was like four or five years leading up to y two K at some I T shop said, Okay, we're going to modernize, but but none of these micro services existed, so it really was. It was about dates, maybe some application portfolio rationalization. What's different today that I could take those apse that were written in the seventies with a lot of custom code? How am I able to modernize, though >> I think it's the maturity of the services. You look at something a platform like Amazon. There's one hundred twenty hundred thirty, or Mohr. It grows almost every week. Building blocks primitives, the Amazon are providing, and its a rating on it. At an incredible rate on DH, there's almost a service for everything. And when you think they've run out of services to introduce, a new services is created. And, you know, we talked about micro services. They introduced Lambda back in two thousand fourteen, which was there. Serve Elice environment driving event based micro services architectures, and it's ahead of the game. It's ahead of the curve. It's causing people to think very differently about what's even possible from a night perspective. And there's no way. In most organizations, you, Khun, build that kind of infrastructure on that kind of platform that is build and costs you on a Microsoft microsecond basis. I mean, it's it's >> incredible. It was amazing. I remember the first virtual machine. It would be anywhere that I saw spun up like, Wow, this is going to change the world. And then the cloud comes along like a while. This is going to change the world. And now survivalists. I don't even have to deploy servers anymore. It's side by Amazon >> way. See this? Even even in some of the more traditional organizations we we worked with in the UK and in Germany and France and elsewhere, you don't even need to be looking at service. Just the ability toe programmatically spin up a virtual machine without a human touching anything. That's incredible to some organizations, right? They're used to it, taking six months to provision of infrastructure to deploy an application. Now they can click a button, and by the time they've made a cup of coffee, it's it's up and running, and it's It changes the way people >> think So much Talk about Cloud Region signal effects. What's the partnership like between you two and what's your partnership like with eight of us? >> Um, on the cloud reach side, we went through an extensive evaluation by cloud reach, and over several months they evaluated all the alternatives on the market and ended up selecting us to be their standard for their many service provider business. It's We're super excited about that. On the go for it, we're rolling that out with them there. Current customer based on DH. We were hoping that, uh, using signal effects, that cloud reach that will help them be the point of spear on all cloud native. You know, in their marketplaces, they go pursue other customers, so it's pretty excited about. >> So it's not a pressure release deal, not a Barney deal. Like we like to say that >> they're up there, They're a paying customer. And, you know, I made a big bet on signal effects going forward. >> So why the choice to go with manage service provider? You have You could have built it yourself and take us through that. >> Yeah. I mean, the nature of the business we're in is very much predicated on the fact that you don't build it yourself. You know, you look at the market and if somebody is already doing it well and provides excellent service as a commodity, you use it. We've been in the MSP space since round about twenty ten very soon after the the company was was founded, and we know it pretty well. We have a large customer base. We are one of the top tier MSP for along the major cloud vendors in the world, lots of large organizations. However, as we look to refresh our tooling with a view on Maura, an application centric approach, which is what all of our customers want and expect a CZ we look to micro services and the very latest platforms and technologies he's being released by the hyper scale cloud vendors. We recognize the need for a newer, more modern tooling on DH. After a thorough evaluation, a CZ mark says signal effects came out on top. Why is that? Partly it's the cloud native element. You know, some of that sounds a little bit like a marketing buzzword, but in reality, what it means is the company was founded relatively recently and as a result, was geared towards modern technology. So out of the box they support doctor, they support containers, they understand, and they're orchestrated around micro services. It deals with scale on volume, and we we want to low test things in a big way. We only serve large scale and surprise customers. And they are going to throw tens of thousands of containers on micro services at their tooling, and it has to be able to track tto handle that massive volume of transactions. >> It's a complicated picture, actually. You know, sometimes micro services aren't so micro. Yes, and you've got to secure all these containers. Got spinning up of'Em is easy. >> Well, >> you see multiples. So how do you guys deal with that? I mean, you're obviously experts at it, but But give us the sales pitch >> on. Yeah. So I think you kind of you covered it earlier with, You know, all these great new technology with introduction of micro services. I mean, developers in our writing it the running it, they're pushing code directly into production environment. You know, you went from releasing code once or twice a year, a few years back now toe several releases and you know your people lifting shift. They're starting with a few micro services. Someone we're getting up into the hundreds, even thousands in our most advanced deployments. It it it ends up being worth a situation Where Alright, all this innovation is great, but it also introduces a ton of complexity. And based on the way we've architect of our system, really time streaming like within seconds, you're going to need to see it, to react to it, whatever the use cases. And that's what differentiates signal FX is this massively scalable streaming architect we built for from a Metrix platform standpoint and then from an Eastern West standpoint for your from your custom code are Micro Services, a PM solution on top of that to go help measure what those transactions air how they're performing across the entire complex environment. So we feel like we're just purpose built for today to help in the lift and shift crowd and or for the more advanced customers, they're intothe point dozens, if not hundreds of micro services. >> Tell me more about this metrics platform you mentioned a couple times. What is that all about? >> Well, we start with essentially, you know, the three big pillars are logs, metrics and eight p. M. And you know, our company was found it. We have deep roots. Back in the two thousand seven ranges, our founders were you know, they built the monitoring stack at Facebook and so had several years, you know, kind of earning and learning that secret. You know, in the early days, they didn't call it Dev Ops. Back then they called it move fast, break things, didn't call >> it. They didn't call it >> a micro services. I mean, and then twenty, twenty, thirteen, early, two thousand fourteen. That's when the founders got together and started. The company is also the same time frame. Doctor came out. Were just purpose built for this for this environment. >> Final thoughts. Yeah. Thie event where you guys were headed. Maybe little road map, if you could. >> The event has been incredible. Every year it gets a little bit bigger. It gets a little bit more exciting. There's, ah, bigger range of organizations, different industries. And it changes a little bit over time. This year, financial services has been particularly of interest for us, but this event is a lot of large large banks, investment houses, those kind of companies here on DH. That's been really exciting for us. I think trend I'm most excited about is really around machine learning. Amazon talked about it in the keynote this morning and democratization of very, very complex technology bring it to the masses is a as a manage service that can be provisioned in minutes and seconds. And to me that something that's that's really exciting and using the signal FX platform, we're now in a position to provide manage service wrappers around the machine learning based solutions that we build for our >> customers. Yeah, the financial services. Interesting. Back in two thousand nine when you started, a lot of the banks in New York thought they could scale and compete essentially with KWS >> world. The world changes very quickly. Absolutely >> final thoughts for you. >> Yeah, I think they think we're moving past that point. You know, even the later adopters. I think we're moving past that point and look at that name there getting pressure from the startup community, whether it's intact or or any industry's gonna have that type of pressure. You talked about that y two k moment. I think in any vertical out there, it's that you know those cloud native type companies the companies are becoming software companies were going toe transform yourself or you're going to have some pressure from the start up going forward. We're >> guys. I'm thrilled that you could make time to come in the queue. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks for having us. All right. Keep it right there. But it is. Dave Alonso will be back with our next guests right after this short break. You watching the Cube from London? Eight of US Summit right back.

>> Narrator: Live from London, England. It's theCUBE, covering AWS Summit London 2019. Brought to you by Amazon Web Services. >> Welcome back to Excel London everybody. My name is Dave Vellante, and you're watching theCUBE, the leader in live tech coverage, we go out to the events, we extract the signal from the noise, this is our day long coverage of the AWS Summit in London, 12,000 people here. It's a Summit, it's like a mini reinvent. Dominic Deacon is here, he's the sales director for cloud and alliances at CenturyLink, Dominic, thanks for coming on theCUBE. >> Thanks very much for having me. >> So, what's going on here at the show, what's CenturyLink showing? What are the conversations like, and what are you guys up to? >> Well, it's been a fantastic day for us here at CenturyLink, we've got a big stand presence out on our floor here, it's been fantastic to see the vast number of people here today, and fascinating from all different types of industries, different types of technology companies, manufacturing companies, it's just a vast, different array of people. And some fantastic conversations on the stand today. >> So cloud computing when it came in, a lot of people sort of didn't understand it. A lot of people ignored it. A lot of people thought they could replicate it. But now, it's starting to come into focus, now that we're in, you know, whatever it is, 15 years in. >> Dominic: Yeah. >> 12, 13 years in. It's been a real tailwind for your business. Describe why that is, where you fit in the value chain of the ecosystem. >> Sure, so you know, CenturyLink is a global IT network technology organization. So we operate in many many different countries, 60 off countries globally. And for us the value proposition with CenturyLink is around connecting customers to AWS cloud. It's around then helping do the migration and transition of workloads to AWS and the cloud. And then for us, a key part of our heritage is the managed services, so then we are able, once applications have been, and workloads, have been transitioned to AWS, we're able to managed those as a managed service provider for the organizations, and a lot of enterprises now are on this digital transformation journey, you know, a lot of industries today are being disrupted by new entrants, and we've seen a lot of those over the past, kind of five to ten years. Probably name a, you know, 25 of them off the top of my head if we wanted to right now. So industries are being disrupted, and we're there to really help organizations in that digital transformation journey through connecting, through migration, and then through the management aspect. >> So the early days of cloud, of course you saw a lot of startups, and a lot of innovators moving to the cloud. You saw large corporations maybe doing a little shadow IT... >> Dominic: Yeah. >> You saw IT maybe throwing up some crapplications, you know, we used to jokingly call them in the cloud. Now the cloud is essentially running, you know, any workload, any application, anywhere in the world. What are you seeing in terms of some of the trends, in terms of what people are doing with the cloud, what they're putting in the cloud, who are they, what's your customer based look on it? >> Yeah, I mean it's, you know, it's been a fascinating journey over the last kind of ten years really. You know, I remember going back ten years ago and, you know, enterprise organizations were, yeah this cloud thing, not sure, they'd give you a million reasons why they wouldn't do it, and then you'd have some parts of the organization generally you know, lines of businesses that were, that were a bit stuck with their own IT departments around speed and agility, hey we need this now, but you guys are telling me it's gonna take four months just to deliver some service and then another month to build it out, I can't wait six months to be able to, you know, accelerate our business, so we needed different ways, so that's when we starting seeing the shadow IT aspects, and especially with AWS, right? Well I've got a credit card, I can get the resources that I need within 30 seconds, I've just logged in, right? I've got all the resources there right now, we can accelerate, and now we can go, and that really started the revolution, but also, became a bit of a challenge to enterprises because now they've got unregulated IT spends, we've got lots of different silos of applications, that starts to become a challenge to manage that at scale, which really started to turn enterprises into understanding, well actually, digital transformation for us, cloud fixes at the core part of those strategies, okay, so now let's start bringing that in, how do we start utilizing that to the best of our ability, and we've seen that shift over the last ten years to really get to a point where we are today with some really cool things happening with, you know, large scale enterprise mission critical applications now being deployed in AWS. SAP, ERP applications for example, ten years ago, I didn't think anyone would've realized that you could've run that in AWS, and here we are today where you can. >> I don't know if you saw the keynote this morning, but the guy from Saintsbury said that they moved an Oracle rack instance into AWS, and I got a lot of questions for him... (laughs) but he ran off, and there were a number of examples of Oracles, not trivial to move Oracle in, but SAP of course is not as antagonistic with regards to AWS as Oracle are, but so there's a better partnership there. So you're seeing those types of applications now moved to the cloud. What's the motivation for people doing that? Are they able to change the operating model, how are they able to affect their business by doing that? >> Well I think the fundamental change in the last, maybe five years is that their, is that the board of their enterprise organizations have actually woken up to the fact that we can start delivering transformation at speed and at scale, utilizing services like AWS. And the broad ecosystem of specialist partners that sit in and around AWS to be able to deliver that value, and the board and steering committees, of, you know, the large enterprise customers have kind of sat there going, right, the time is now, disruption is, you know, quite prevalent in our marketplace now, so we need to change, we need to become more agile, we need to change our cost base, we need to change our operations model, we need to be thinking more about the customer experience and how do we deliver new services quickly to remain relevant, and you kind of have this tidal wave of everything aligning, and the realization that there is a way to be able to do this, and realize the benefits of that. And I think that's really what we've seen in the last few years or so. >> Now, you guys obviously, first talk about your AWS partnership, how did it start, how's it going, what's the relationship like, what's that journey been like? >> Sure, so, yeah, CenturyLink, as I said before, provides global network services, and also provides, you know hosting, cloud, and managed services that combine with that with a security wrap and a managed security service that goes across, you know, network, infrastructure, and applications. That's the core of our business globally. I'd say for us, you know, essentially, we made a pivot around three or four years ago, which was to say, do we really need to own our data centers anymore, or do we just want to be able to provide the expertise and services that come from a data center? So rather than building all of our own, you know, cloud infrastructure and trying to take that to market, actually what we are experts in is being able to deliver value with that infrastructure from an application standpoint, and being able to manage that and optimize it in the most economical model to be a service provider for those customers, and so, you know, we've been on that journey ourselves for probably the last three or four years, and that led us up to the point where, you know, a lot of our customers were asking us, hey, I've got some applications and some kind of traditional hosting with CenturyLink, but we're also looking at AWS for some of our newer workloads, hey CenturyLink, are you able to help us across both of these, and then we kind of saw the magnification of, you know, the hybrid IT kind of platform come in, I've got applications that I need to set in a private cloud, or some legacy infrastructure, I'm also looking at my AWS public cloud, and actually what I need is a service provider to be a consistent provider across all of these different infrastructure types now as we transition. So CenturyLink made that pivot, we joined forces with AWS about three years ago now. It's a fantastic partnership for us, and we deliver all of those cool capabilities that we have for years with the AWS platform as part of their partner ecosystem, delivering that value for our mutual customers. >> So Matt Garmin said this morning in the keynote that, you know, he firmly believes they do this, he believes that over time, the vast majority of workloads are gonna live in the public cloud. Having said that, he said something you didn't hear AWS recognize several years ago, which was hybrid. You just mentioned hybrid. >> Dominic: Yup. >> And then he laid out a number of things that they're doing for folks on prem, I think you mentioned Snowball, which I think was one of the first ones. >> Dominic: Yeah. >> You know, and then a number of other ones, of course Outpost. >> Dominic: That's the big one. >> Grab a lot of attention, so my point of this question is that, and a sort of observation and then question, is AWS, never say never, when it comes to AWS. >> Dominic: Absolutely. >> You know, years ago, people said no, they'll never do on prem, never do hybrid, of course now, they're gonna become a leader in hybrid, predicted that on theCUBE for a while. There's also this world of multi cloud, of course AWS doesn't wanna talk about, you know, non, other clouds, but there's a multi cloud world, every show you go to, everybody's talking about multi cloud, it's a huge opportunity for you. I've contended that multi cloud is largely a symptom of multi vendor, and line of business, and shadow IT, and as we said now, we've got this mess out there that IT's gotta deal with. >> Yeah. >> But it's an opportunity, you know, chaos is cash for you guys, so what are your thoughts on multi cloud, how real is it, how far are we into the journey of multi cloud? >> Yeah, I mean that's a, that's a really interesting questions, and actually, we see, we see that more and more in the enterprise space now. I think as that, as the thinking in enterprises has matured, there's a realization that, you know, it's not always that one thing fits everything. So it's about understanding, you know, the workload that I've got today, and where's the best platform for that workload to reside on that delivers the scale, the performance, you know, from a compliance perspective, am I compliant with this workload, and which platform is the most compliant around that? So there's a number of factors that come into play, which leads to, you know, some platforms being, we call it the best execution venue, becomes the best venue to deploy the application. You know, public cloud is fantastic and provides the agility, speed, innovation, but sometimes isn't necessarily the right platform for some of the legacy workloads that actually just need to transition out of a customer status center, because they don't want a data center anymore. So, there is movements today where, you know, as that market's maturing, the organizations are sort of saying to themselves, well I need a, I need a staging post to now understand what I do with these workloads before I can then do a level of migration and transition and refactoring, and so that I can get to, get to private cloud. Generally that comes down to, you know, sometimes it's capex avoidance, I don't wanna refresh my whole data center, or I actually don't wanna own bricks and mortar anymore, for us we just wanna be able to consume the service under an SLA that's outcome driven. So that's where we start seeing the, you know, the hybrid cloud model, and that's a mixture of private cloud, and sometimes a mixture of public clouds as well. Sometimes, enterprises look at it and go, well if I put all my eggs in one basket, does that blast my risk compliance? Or do I split it out, and you know, basically have two public clouds that we mitigate the risk and can move one workload into another? There's a number of different factors that are driving that, but generally it's around risk mitigation, speed, and economics. >> I'm glad you brought that up too, and as well horses for courses, you know? You were saying that sometimes, there's, you know, a workload that fits best here. So I, we've predicted on theCUBE that eventually, Amazon will get into that business, you'll see, because once it gets big enough, and if it's real, Amazon will have a solution, you know. >> Dominic: Sure. >> Because their customers will ask for it. >> Dominic: Absolutely. >> Amazon says they're customer driven, they actually are. >> Dominic: Yeah. >> Enough customers say that's how things like Outpost... >> Dominic: Absolutely. >> Occur. So take use back to sort of, what's happening in your business today, where you see this sort of next near term, to mid term, going for CenturyLink. >> Sure so, you know, for us our focus is on really, you know, delivering great customer outcomes and customer experience. And it's about delivering the value add in partnership with AWS, so combining the strength of CenturyLink with the strength of AWS delivers great customer experience, also delivers great customer business outcomes, which keeps, you know, our mutual customers together with us for many many years, hopefully. And that's really for us focusing on delivering, you know, our core innovation with, on top of AWS around how we deliver our automated managed services, we're looking at simplification, automation of operational functions for our customers, because if we can streamline that, the economics become better, SLAs increase, their business productivity and performance increases along with that, and it's a mutual win win win for all three partners involved, which is what we're all striving for. >> Well, as somebody once said, the network is the computer, you guys are the network, so, thanks very much for coming on theCUBE Dominic. >> Dominic: Thank you for having me. >> You're very welcome. All right, keep it right there everybody, we'll be back with our next guest, you're watching the cube, this is Dave Vellante, live from London AWS Summit, we'll be right back.

>> live from London, England. It's the queue covering a ws summat. London twenty nineteen Brought to you by Amazon Web services >> Hello and welcome to the Age Ws Summit live from London's Excel Center. I'm Susanna Street, and this is my co host on the Cube Day Volonte on. There are lots of breakout sessions taking place right across this venue. One of them all about Bring Thio life, the eight of us marketplace and really helping people, companies and stand cow to make that journey to the cloud. And my two guests here right now have been at that session trying to communicate that toe many delegates who were there here Mobile, who's from Computer Center. He is the public cloud lead for the UK and Ireland, and Garforth, who's a director off a ws marketplace. Thank you very much for joining us >> to be here >> Now there are riel complexities are their way. Just helping people navigate their way through. Tell me that a bit more about how marketplace has evolved because it's being rapid. Hasn't >> it? Has been rapid. We launched a CZ initial service in two thousand twelve, so we just had our seventh birthday last year. We started with pretty modest aspirations, and it was all about helping developers take advantage of the sea to and be able to take advantage of. A bus. Service is available at the time. So it was a cattle about two hundred fifty mostly open source applications that developers could sort of find, explore, discover and provisions straight from the council where they were doing their work. Overtime. We've added support for a lot of new product type, so we support SAS applications. All right, reinvent Last year, we announce support for Dr in being able to take Dr Images and deploy those into stage maker. We're talking about that earlier. Also support for containers. And so his customers are moving to more of a survivalist type architecture. We have already made set of container images that they could deploy directly into the S E. K s or far gate. I'd say one of more interesting sort of inflection point in our evolution was when people started buying real stuff for real money because I think when we got started serving the developers, I kind of think of that is kind of a Lamborghini kind of crowd. That's a customer, by the way, but, uh, Lamborghini guys just, you know, developers want to go as fast as they possibly can. They don't really care for speed limits, you know, they just want to get the job done as quick as they can. Um, we had an example, for example, our first million dollar transaction. Wait, We're surprised to see it. We woke up on Monday and we saw a million dollar transaction. So I told my finance team not to get too excited. I went to the customer and I said, Was this a mistake or did you intend >> to do >> that? And the developer team said No, that was the best software sale ever because I didn't have to talk to anybody. >> I couldn't make money while you sleep isn't absolutely, but they were >> able to. Basically, they didn't have to go through a lengthy process of procurement and legal reviews and everything else. They literally were able to subscribe to the product and get it deployed within seconds, and the estimated that it took about three months off of their engineering cycle was being able to go that fast. But >> the interesting thing on >> million dollar transactions is, there's a lot of other people that care about that. So I got a letter about eight weeks later from their corporate headquarters in New York. It said that Development team was not >> really authorized to spend that much money on that product, >> and so that is what I call the Volvo crowd. And there are big parts of our customer that are very, very interested in safety and airbags and collision avoidance and all that other fun stuff. And so what Marketplace has been really innovating on in the last couple of years is finding a way to modernize how companies buy and deploy softer in the cloud. Do that at speed. But do it in a way that's compliant with whatever regulations governing the things. >> So do it speed but variable speed, >> variable speed and just, you know, a lot of our customers in the public sector or in health care financial services. They're heavily regulated on on their own, and they have a certain way they need to do things. And so we've been building features like the private marketplace which we just launched actually allows the customer to go in and reason over our catalog We've got forty eight hundred listings in our catalog, fourteen hundred different vendors and they can decide on their own. Which one of those air fruit for use or not, >> because it's very hard to meet the procurement demands of various of public sector organization because they're so >> they are very diverse. But that's also one of the reasons, like I'm excited too heavy in here. We've been working for the last couple of years to figure out how we can more effectively work with partners to sort of serve our joint customers. So he and what's your story? How >> do you fit what? It's a good question. So I think Computer Center entered into the fray with eight of us, sort of circa reinvent twenty seventeen. So just a time where Marketplace was launching two partners, I guess in the mainstream on on, we looked at what the offering in partnership with these guys and what it would mean to our customers, and that was kind of very customer letters and organization if you know anything about us. Customers were asking for different ways to potentially by traditional software packages as they moved into the Ws Cloud, and they were moving at scale and that velocity that we talk about and it was about well, is this a product or a mechanism that can help them streamline? Can they simplify on the way? Can they cut some of that complexity on that journey? We see that very much as a Roald. Help them achieve that. This seems like a really good mechanism, so we fast forward through twenty eighteen. We do some great deals together, those sort of way talk about on way. See that this is becoming more mainstream for customers. Is their landing in a ws in the cloud and thinking about different ways? Different software titles challenging Do We Need to Do Things is normal, or should we do things a different way? What about this dynamic that we were just talking about? That garden was just saying about the procurement folk, the >> Volvo crowd versus the Lamborghini Cross You what do you have developed a workflow approval process that it worked? Yeah, well, unpack it a little bit, the the private marketplace allows, and every customer is a little bit different. Sometimes it's the chief security officer who kind of makes the final decision. Sometimes it's procurement. Sometimes the legal team has specific move constraints on what they what. They want to prove that not I really haven't found two customers that are identical in terms of how they're worked over an l O B manager. Correct CFO. I mean, you're right, lots of different roles. So we effectively, we did some surgery on the underlying service to create a new I am role. And so if Ian is the administrator for his organization, regardless of role, he's given permission to go approve and disapprove products. And some customers are kind of in a white list load, which is basically you can use, uh, only the things that I wait listed. So everything's forbidden until I've explicitly approved it. Other companies, like a lot of smaller companies that may not have that much process. We're more of a blacklist mode. We're sort of like everything in the marketplace is fair game, except the ones I've specifically said not to use on DH. So we just created this really flexible infrastructure that lets customers customize the marketplace to their needs. So you give superpowers to some admin and then the white list black blacklist, depending on what it is. And then it becomes frictionless. It becomes frictionless, and then the user experience the customer can actually have their own logo. They can put their own language around, kind of how they wantto sort of represent that to the developers. And then every developer in their organization then sees that experience and they can see what's been approved in what hasn't. OK, so you get a private label through the channel. Yeah, so that I, as a consumer see whatever brand that your customer yet need to see exactly. And then we've also got a facility because, you know, with over forty eight hundred listings in the marketplace, fourteen hundred different vendors, you know, nobody's got time to go reason over every single item, and we're adding hundreds every year, so that keeps growing. And so we've got a facility. If the developer has a specific technology that they really require, we've got a little simple work flow so developed could say, I need this widget to build this thing, and then we kick it off to the admin who could approve it. And as we were talking about for our video closet, you gonna have precise understanding of the pricing. You know this one hundred percent clarity. And then once you have that on you, Khun, split the pie hole, then you can split up and we did. But like one of the foundational technologies that we launched, twenty seventeen was this notion of a private offer. And so if I want to make a private offer to Ian at a price that he and I have negotiated on legal terms that he and I have agreed to, I can do that through marketplace. And then what with the way that would work in a large organization is once somebody's subscribes Once to that price, everybody in the organization that used that product is using it at the agreed price. OK, right. And then we extended that to enable Channel partners now. So for the ice fees that included center works with now, he's now able to go create private offers for his custom. So what, you're essentially created a two sided >> marketplace that effect? Yeah, I think the interface between the two organizations is really important. It becomes that sort of tripartite with the ice V, putting the customer right in the center. I think that's the signage is that we seem to organizations. >> Do you really see what your input has bean there items that are listed as well. Did you get that >> for, like, selection? >> Yeah, yeah, that that like, you know, >> saying it's pretty customer focused, you know, we work with customers we have. We have a set of people around the world that do what we call category management, and they theirjob is to work with customers and make sure that we're stocking the right inventory on the shelves, so to speak. So we get that input like every day, >> and then that helps you develop you new products, >> New continent, new products. And that's >> ahead of the competition. >> Wei. Try to think more about like, let's focus on our customers. Wei don't spend a lot of time chasing tail lights, but very customer obsessed. What things always >> interested me about the marketplaces. It's so complex in terms of region's >> tax laws, pricing considerations on and on and on so many permutations. You talk a little bit about how you've >> succeeded in just essentially making that all transparent and what what's behind that? >> Um well, I think you know Amazon >> and eight of us like we operate within the legal frameworks and all the countries where we operate in. So we have our own requirements in terms of how we remit and collect tax in countries compliant with local laws. Right. So we had to do that just to operate a to B S right way were able to leverage a lot of the same plumbing we had to build for ourselves and effectively make that available to our lives. So we have, like, there's a small eyes. We actually they've grown to be quite big. But here in the UK is a company called Matile Ian, who uses us exclusively a cz, their cloud channel. Um and we take him the HBS available eighteen regions marketplace on, and then everywhere we need to we will remit and collect tax on his behalf and then give him reports that he could share with his auditor to ensure compliance with local laws. And so we do a lot of that stuff. He's a small firm, you know, and for us to be able to sort of, like, extract and abstract all that complexity from him and just give him a nice monthly report that shows him all the taxes we can on his behalf. That's a big service right >> now. How's it transform your business? >> So I say transforming rather than transformed because it's a continuum thing all the time. I think it's absolutely that a different way of procurement is, firstly, the thing that customers are asking for. So it's just one cog in the wheel for a ws that customs picking up on. I think the point that golf is very well glossing over is that between us, we're doing the heavy lifting on behalf of the customer. I think that's today's point thing. That's that's the whole point here, where that we've all got a part to play in the ecosystem and it's it's all about customer experience. That's most important. I think what we're seeing is repeat customers come back. Actually, that's the biggest from if I look up from the start of twenty eighteen to the end, it was the repeat visits, so you get you know, the one million pound or dollar deal customer coming back twice or three times in the year to do the same thing again, >> but have any being put off by this new >> approach, but I haven't seen that so genuine. It hasn't appeared so far, so there's some education. Of course, that has to happen because it's different. It's not the norm. If you think about enterprise customers, they've been buying up a particular mode for twenty or thirty years or longer, a CZ we joke about. So this is just an education process that let them know what on how on then, what's there on the bandwagon? It kind of becomes that streamline process. >> Yeah, ad I'd build on top again. Sport like you kind of think about the way way >> customers thought about procuring infrastructure before eight of us existed, like back in way. But in the way big back of two thousand five, like buying hardware in storage and networking gear was crazy, hard and very difficult and long and laborious. And your racket and stacking everything else. And then a dubious comes along with services like Three and Easy to know what it makes provisioning access, the hard work. It's seconds, you know, not months of procurement, and in a way, we're kind of software is now catching up, and in a way, what marketplace is trying to do is to revolutionize the way people acquire software for the cloud in the same way that eight of us to infrastructure well, and you're creating a to be a consumer dynamic, not unlike my Amazon retail, where there's trust, simplicity, comfort levels on DH. You know, you even don't tell Jeff. I'Ll pay a little bit more from, you know, Amazon website cause I trust it. Yeah, you know, not too much, right? And you guys have to stay price competitive. Absolutely so. But that to me, is that it's that consumer like experience that you're obviously it is more complex but somewhat creating that way looked, we look to retail for all sorts of cool inspiration. You know, on the retail side, they have a retail marketplace, which is huge and thriving business with millions of merchants. And so we're constantly comparing notes and saying, like one of the things that you're doing for your merchants and are the things that can inspire us on our side kind of follow suit. I will note that you know, I when I get in front of customers I like to do, I'd like to show our user experience we have a pretty website and all that other good stuff. The vast majority of customers actually interfaced with us through command line and automation tools and all that other stuff. So retail analogy gets me so developers, >> thank >> you very much for it's really great to have you here, Director A ws marketplace and here mobile. As you say, >> we're in the midst of this transformation. It's really great to hear your story. So thank you very much for two years here >> on the Cube, on the aid everywhere summits in London That's all from us for now.

>> Narrator: Live from London, England, it's theCUBE covering AWS summit London 2019, brought to you by Amazon Web Services. >> Welcome back to XL London everybody, My name is Dave Velante and you're watching theCUBE, the leader in live tech coverage. This is our one-day coverage of AWS summit, London. theCUBE will go up to the events we extract the signal of the noise and I have recruited a co-host Theresa Carlson who's a friend and vice president worldwide public sector at AWS and we have a really special segment for you today. Anna Sergeant is here. She's a computing teacher and Charlotte who's a student at Townley. Wait till you see what we have in store for you. Theresa, let's get it started. So first of all, welcome (mumbles). >> Well, and I'm so thrilled to be your co-host, I just wanna tell you that right now. >> That's a first for you, right? >> Yes, it is. >> I finally got one up on for you. >> Yeah, exactly, I get to be on theCUBE (mumbles). >> So here's the deal, so you have this GetIT program. Tell us what that's all about and then we'll get into it. >> Well you know, we talked about over the last few years just in general about skills. Skills development, how critical it is and important for every age and GetIT is really a continuation of what we're trying to do to create job skills around cloud computing at every age, especially in elementary and primary school years. So GetIT today, what you're going to see from both Charlotte and Anna is we did a competition, there was over 160 applicants and it got netted down to ten schools that came here today and then we had two finalists and then we deemed a winner and they're going to get support and help but also, all these schools are gonna get support and help but it's really about the experience of them learning how to utilize cloud computing in a real-world application that actually matters to them which you can also fight to kind of social responsibility which most of these young people really relate to because they want to do something that matters to them. Just tech for tech is not exciting but tech for good is very exciting and I think that's what you're gonna hear about here today. >> We love to talk about tech for good and Anna, you're at the heart of this so how did you get into this, how did you get this all started, tell us your story. >> Well, my head teacher is quite an innovative person and she's been in conversations with Amazon and Future Foundations and they came to the school with the idea last year and invited the school to be part of the pilot program and so the Amazon ambassadors delivered their presentation to the school in September and as a team in the computing department, we got together and said, well we think this is a great opportunity for girls in tech. So we actually rolled it out as an actual scheme of lessons so the whole year eight, so that's 224 year eight students got together. They all were divided into groups of their own choice and we gave them the outline or the brief and said you know, think of an app for good that would fulfill a social need in your community. So think about the community and prepare a pitch and we then set timelines and deadlines and helped them through the research and obviously spoke to Amazon, came to the London offices as well and spent some time with your colleagues in the London office and you know, and then basically helped the girls pitch their final idea. >> So Charlotte, you got this prompt essentially and then you took it from there. Tell us a little bit about yourself and then how this all came about and what you guys did with that prompt. >> And today is your birthday so happy birthday. >> Congratulations. >> Thank you. So basically I'm 13 at the moment but we've been doing this project in year eight as Anna said and basically, we were given the idea to make an app and everyone was really excited initially, but we weren't too sure about what we wanted to make it on and we were lucky enough to have the choice to choose whatever topic we wanted to make it on and kind of decide what cause we wanted to help and the solution to help it with and then we were given loads of help with the Amazon ambassadors and they really were like really kinda generous with all their help. They came to visit us and they watched our presentations and it really gained our confidence because we presented to the class and in front of the teachers and Amazon ambassadors and it's been really lovely because we've been able to gain skills that we didn't have before in computing and it's gained our confidence, it's boosted it and we've just become much like more interested in STEM and computing. >> Charlotte, let me ask you, what was your application about and what inspired you for the application? >> So my app was called Positive Of Me and we based it off of a mental health and kind of having a more positive outlook on life and we decided to do that topic because we thought that it was really important to students to have a stress-free time in school rather than always feeling stressed and under the weather because they have a lot of work or they're under-organized and stuff like that so we believe that it was quite important to help people like that so our features included like a planner, a mood tracker and just other things to kind of keep you organized and happy throughout your school life. >> So fascinated by the adoption of this approach and were you always interested in STEM or was it something that, this catalyzed your interests in your colleagues. >> I was always interested in STEM and in Townley, they like promote it a lot and they're very interested in like, because it's an all-girls school. We promote females and like we try to make sure that girls are interested in all subjects no matter what and it's been quite nice but I believe that it kind of made me more interested in STEM with my classmates because we've had a fun experience. It's not just been doing computing, it's been having a fun experience. We've been designing our own thing that we're passionate about so it's been really lovely in that sense. >> Dave: So, please go ahead. >> Well, I was gonna ask you, how did you bring it together as a group. What were kind of the core components that you worked on to bring the app together and then have the final that you got here today with. >> So we kind of thought of the idea first about mental health, that was kind of our starting point and then we developed it to what features we can include in the app. We made a mind map saying whatever features we wanted, what topics we wanted to cover and then we thought about the target audiences and they really helped us think about this in the boot camp that they hosted. It was really helpful because Amazon ambassadors came to each kind of app and they helped us with what we could include and how to build on that idea. So that helped us include the target audiences, the ages that we wanted to target our app towards and it kind of helped us with that general theme and how many features we wanted to include. >> Because you had time pressures, right, so you have to make some trade-offs. So how did you make those trade-offs? You just talked to the potential recipients of the app or sort of brainstorm? >> We did a lot of surveys to what features people thought were the most important for our app and a lot of groups did that because it kind of, because there were a few different times that we needed to get it done by and every time we obviously had a time limit and so we needed to put the most important features in to our PowerPoints and our presentations and the prototypes and so people, we did surveys and people answered what features they thought were the most important to put in the app and then we implemented those before any other like more unnecessary ones. >> How did you organize your team? How many pizzas did they eat? >> Did you hear about that two pizza team, did Amazon talk to you about, Amazon Web Services, that if you had more people on your team that feeds two pizzas, that's too many 'cause that way you can move faster. >> We mainly decided to team because we got to choose like our friends to work with and obviously, we work better with the people who we're more comfortable around. So that was quite nice that we got to decide who we worked with but then the roles that we were given, we kind of just decided on what each person knew the most about, wanted to do research on and then from there, we kind of just carried on with the topics that we were initially started with. >> You told me something a while ago that really peaked my interest. You said you're an all-girl school and you almost had to reverse engineer your gender because it was all too pink. Can you talk about your thinking around a different kind of diversity. >> So basically we wanted to make the app like accept all the beliefs and stuff so that was our main focus with diversity and we didn't really realize initially that it was mainly quite girly, but then when we presented our initial presentation, obviously we got through the first round where we presented to the class but then we got some feedback from Miss and she really helped us telling us that you know, we want to make it unisex so that it's more approachable for all people and all students rather than just girls schools and then it would have more not purchases but it would have more audience. >> Yeah, better adoption but so, what did that involve? Was it colors, was it language, was it, what made it less girly? >> I mean, it was more colors and the whole theme of the app like the logo. We made it logo that was quite like not young, but quite young and girly a bit and it was mainly the colors though. We did like pink, which is, I mean it's traditionally seen as girly, pink, so we tried to make it, we searched up like unisex colors and it was more green, purple, blue, stuff like that so we implemented that into our app in the second round so that it was more unisex. >> Last time I interviewed you, I had my pink tie and pink shirt on. >> Yes, which I like, I think that was good. I've got my unisex on screen but one of the things that you did do that I really liked is you did the usability which you went out and you asked individuals what features would they like the most. I think that was really important and you can of course always do that with those boys and girls and figure out but that was really smart. So let me ask you another question. One of the things that we do find with girls and something I've been passionate about is they don't get into STEM or technology and they don't stay there. After going through this experience, one, do you think you might be more inclined to stay with technology and then I'd like to just know your opinion on how we can continue to forward this with girls after this experience, what else would you recommend? >> Yes, so as I said earlier, Townley promotes STEM massively. They have STEM days and everything so the girls at our school, we are really interested in it. This project has like really boosted my confidence and like my interest in STEM though because it's, as I said, it's made it more fun. It's not only just doing the computing work, it's made it a fun way to do it and you're working for, you're targeting towards an achievement at the end, to get the app made so everyone's trying really hard to get it done and that kind of gains your knowledge and then you learn all the new technology as you're going along so it's quite interesting. >> What are your thoughts on that Anna. I mean, we're always having this discussion on theCUBE. You look around the show, amazing show first of all, but there's a lot of men here. The line out the men's room is huge and so, because in a male-dominated industry, you look inside your own circles and your circles happen to be other men's so it's a challenge that we want to surface and be aware of. What more would your recommendations be to break those barriers? >> To do the programs like this, to actually go into schools and encourage young people because I think by encouraging all young people you know, you'll get the diversity and also the awareness. We're very subject driven in a way that our education system and actually a lot of the job roles out there we're in school, we're not aware of because we're busy teaching. So it's great to actually come in and we think about app developers and we think about testers and we think about programmers but there's all the other aspects as well which actually, unless industry comes into education and helps us show the students what the breadth of roles are out there you know, it's very easy for students to just go into a sort of like a very sort of set path. So by having programs like this coming into schools and having the industry come and talk to the students and inspire them is you know, a fantastic opportunity hence the reason why we decided to run in the whole year eight, the program >> And I've seen, like you saw today from all the groups but the kind of tech for good that the girls and the boys were able to actually decide on something that was meaningful to them and I've seen that a lot just around the world that when you go and talk to children about tech, you've got to connect the dots and I think you guys did that really well and what you were doing with your particular application but across the board the thing that we saw today which I think inspired them even more 'cause it was the thing that they were passionate about which teaches them along the way. >> Yes, yeah. >> So we love tech and I was introduced at age 12, the C prompt and learn basic. Kids today, you learn tech before you can speak you're you know, punching devices but so what was the tech behind what you were doing. Were you programming, were using cloud technologies. What was behind it? >> We mainly use more simple technology and most of the work was just making PowerPoint presentations and Word documents but obviously there were side things like we made the surveys on Word. We used Photoshop to make prototypes of the screens for the app and we learned a lot of technology at the bootcamp as well. We learned about the different kind of things we could use to make features of the app work and we learnt about obviously, Amazon were like the leaders of the program. >> You Learned about S3 storage, right. You learned about EC2, you learned about all the applications in AWS that you could build it because at the end as you build it, you'll use hopefully all those technologies is what we'll be helping you with. >> You know what I love about this story though is, and Teresa you know this, you can do almost anything with tech. Now sometimes it's too expensive or too complicated but the tech in many ways is the least important. It's more important to understand what the consumer wants, what the customer wants, what that experience is like, what the colors should be, right and then you can make the tech, apply the tech to solve that problem. >> 100%, and put all those tools together but I do hope that you learned what cloud computing was during your, because that was, I always kind of joke because one of the students at the beginning they use it but they don't always know what cloud computing is. So kind of learning the scalability and how, the ease and testing and just moving fast. So I think that's what you guys have done in a big way. From a teacher's point of view, are there other aspects that you think that should be done like either continued or done even better or faster that we're not getting to. >> This is definitely a step in the right direction. We are a bit more traditional because we introduce the students to Python. So they sort of start programming using Python and perhaps we should look more at cloud technology in greater detail in schools but we're kind of a little bit behind in terms of education in the way that we actually, and we need and we need to speed that up. >> And this is one of the big things that we're trying to do on the AWS side, is bring the new technologies into education because that is the highlight of what we see is there's using kind of older outdated technologies and getting them excited to understand how they learn with and utilize new technologies within AWS and a cloud platform because you can move faster, experiment, have quick failures and recoveries and the expenses you know a lot less expensive than you normally did. >> Well I've been around a long time. AWS changed the world and it changed it from a world where technology, especially information technology and enterprises was a world of no. We can't do that because it'll take too long, it's too expensive, no, no, no and what Amazon has done has sort of removed all that friction and turned it into a world yes you know, and builders and it's just amazing what's happening. You're the future and it's really such a pleasure having you both today. >> Thank you. >> Thank you for having us. >> Anna and Charlotte and of course Teresa, thank you guys for being on theCUBE. >> It's an honor, I agree, it's an honor to co-host but to have you guys and hear your passion and excitement for what you're doing. So my advice, keep it up, don't give up, stick with technology and STEM, you will not regret it, it's a great career. >> And have fun, all right, thanks again. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> All right and thank you for watching. Keep it right there, we'll be back with our next guest. We're live from the Excel center here at AWS summit London, you're watching theCUBE. (light electronic music)

>> live from London, England. It's the queue covering a ws summat London twenty nineteen, Brought to you by Amazon Web services. >> We're at the A. W s summits here in London, at the XL Center there are thousands and thousands of delegates here looking to see the future for their own technologies on what Kyle will hold for them, as well as lots of the other established players here. There are plenty of startups. I'm just down the street and this is my co host, Dame Ellen. We're gonna be talking to a few of the startup founders who are with us here on the Cuban. It's great to have you here. So first up, Hu Pei jin, Who is that? The co founder of the three d mapping based service. And this is called Escape Technologies, but also chanting Jane. And you are the co founder. A swell founder, I believe is it found it found in co founder ofyour organization called Kwan. Now let me festival starts talking to Jan Di and about what you do because you're offering a service to financial services. Are you on helping them with machine learning? Teo, try and offer the best portfolio managers for wealth investment. How does it work? What you're offering? >> Yes, our platform basically allows traders, portfolio managers, asset managers who want to make smarter investment decisions to build machine learning models. To do this Theo idea is that data driven investing should help funds make more profits for themselves and their clients. But there's not enough data, scientists, King data scientist who can actually do more good for them. And we address this lack of talent by using a community of data scientist people who come from outside of finance to help them crowd to help fund managers crowdsource model, using their intelligence, their talent. So the process is really simple. Clients come to us with what we like to call an investment problem or a finance problem. We take that problem and convert it into a pure matter. And she learning problem. That's someone who is not from finance, can understand and soil >> so really interesting. You say that because I've spoken to other founders of other data companies who say, for example, be looking at the stars for their main bread and butter. But then Khun transfer those skills and astronomy to the financial sector and those types of people that you're trying to harness their skills. >> Yeah, exactly. So our community is made up of people who work at tech. Companies at Google and Amazon have sport off people who are putting graduate program and computer science and math machine learning, but don't necessarily know finance. And the idea is, can you make this problem than two problems? Can you make finance problem into problems that this community of data scientists really smart data scientists understand without needing to know finance? >> It's interesting that it lord, because ofthe a lack of of data scientists, Really? But do you think if you eliminate all the kind of heavy lifting out of what you do in the future, though, will be a need for fewer data? Scientists? >> I don't think we need to fut the scientist, but they wouldn't be a need for reform Toe have in house teams. They will basically be able to. A data scientist working in an unequal miss company should be able to solve problems of a finance company. The scientists working in uber should be able to solve problems for a hedge fund because we're building this translator that can allow knowledge from anywhere to be used to solve any kind of problems. >> Okay, let me talk to you because you do three d mapping services. Why do you think these are essential for technologies large and small? Going forward, >> Esso and every future industry in the future is going to have some autonomous aspect to it. So if you think about Atanas vehicles, ever think about delivery Jones. These are going to be machines. They're going to be acting autonomously in human like environments, and they're going to make decisions based on purely what they're observing with hardly human in between. So the only way that this can happen intelligently and safely is if those machines also have a human like understanding ofthe human like environment, just like you humans. So while we are providing these things, machines with Is that human like understanding and the first service that we're building towards that is a visual positioning system to provide the machines with the ability to answer the question. Where am I now? The only way that you can provide official positioning system is this. If you also have a visual map off of the world on this math needs to be updated in real time. So for every future industry, having a real time update version off the real world is fundamental. That's the pinnacle around. Every single every single decision that autonomous agent is going to make is going to be based upon this map. >> So this map was really value Peace Corps piece, um, that we're building. So I've often wondered if people talk about autonomous cars, but we don't have things like autonomous cart's right now. People will say, Well, an Amazon warehouse would have that. But there, following beacons or stripes, Yeah, what you're talking about is potentially taking >> us to the point where you can break that barrier. Is that fair? Exactly. And for warehouses, I would forever advice to use those beacons. Because warehouses are pre pre massaged environments, you define what the environment looks like. Whereas humans we walk around in cities, in nature and all these places that are not pre processed, we have to take our cues from the visuals that we observe. So if you go back to your hometown, for example, you observe a Starbucks logo Starbucks logo and observe our street sign, you might be able to very opposition based on those visual visual cues. Even though the environment itself was not pre processed to provide those cues, the cues are already in the nature. So >> we've heard that there have bean in these trials that have bean accident. There's a limit that is >> Oh, yeah, totally. So at the moment, they're sure are accidents, But you are a human. You can navigate properly with any human environment, using your visual sense it your eyes. Therefore, any machine will, in the future only need that visual sensor as well. So only a camera to navigate around the world were seeing great great progress on the neural networks, deep learning as well as on the geometry and visual image processing, like the type of computer vision that we do that are making so much progress that guaranteed a couple of years from now, the devices will have the understanding off the world like humans do. And we'LL be able to make decisions even better than humans do because they don't got there. They don't get tired. They don't need coffee. S o. B. Guaranteed. More safe than any human knowledge. It's Sunday, and you probably hate the term robo investing, right? But but it sounds like you're doing that form of machine investing for and with hedge funds is that isn't fair. And is your background finance data science or both? >> Both. Actually, I studied engineering, but I started working as a trader of infidelities trading company in Chicago. On that I started with them. We were very old school discretionary, you know, a couple of very senior guys who were making everything based on their past experience and that contusion about the market. On my time with them, he started shifting from this manual human process driven trading to something that was more systematic, inconsistent again. That's where the whole idea >> for all >> Kwan came from. I saw firsthand the benefits that making your trading more data driven more model and algorithms driven could have >> unique. You probably hate this trump to your unicorn, but I'm guessing you guys have no it shop is You're right. It is in the cloud. Is that writer OK, >> it is, you know, straight onto the cloud todo in that started. You didn't exist before. >> Yeah, yeah, Waylon Street in the club. >> And you got a team of developers. They program infrastructure. Totally. >> Yeah. We have a team off for developers and the city of totally tech team of five based out of India. We have a developed sky who basically runs everything for us. Our website, Our platform where the data scientist party prision where our clients see the mortals where client fronts for data to us and where our machine learning computations run >> right three t mapping used to buy a box the Unix box, maybe get a database mother software. Yeah, so we're in scale were thought of as well, right? So when we what you need is the process. If you want to create a three d map off even a city but we have to do is run eight hundred GPS in parallel, blasting through imagery data. Now, this is impossible. If we as a starter had to buy a GPU wreck right from the bat, we would have been bankrupt even before we started. So, like being able to spin up GPU servers in the cloud and also killing them after we're done with them say there's a lot of money but also provides so much flexibility for us to do prototyping and two on DH to make everything affordable and east implement with very, very small team of very talented system. >> It's a real kind of pick and mix approach. Just what kind of services do I need to get off the shelf? And then it happened to you? >> I think one of the great things that a US has been able to do infrastructure used to be a very dusty and tangled industry on one of the beauties that Davy was able to do is actually product eyes, product, eyes, infrastructure. So you can now actually pick and choose different products from the idea of a library and put them together, connect them, tied him up very, very cleanly. With a very small team, I create something that is just accedes. Any expectations from a start of twenty years ago. So why, why eight of us? A lot of other clouds out there who has got a good cloud. Microsoft has a big cloud. Why did you guys migrate or moved to eight of us not moved to start with a W s. How was that decision made? >> I mean, we started with eight of us because we were gonna start a program a date afterwards. But then we just really liked the support that we got a way. We had access to someone twenty four seven. We had a dedicated person who was helping us on DH. We were just starting out. So the first time interacting with a cloud infrastructure, uh, the support was greater than the pricing will go great. For a start, it would have to say that's just a start of ur cost sensitive and the ability to turn on on and off services as and when we need them. I think that was fantastic. >> Does it concern you that we've heard a lot about how the cost of services has come down quite a lot? There's a lot of Costco going, but in the future, if you're overly reliant on your provider, can that put you into a corner? >> I mean, you get into troubles if your spotify skill, but as a start of the environment that ate us created for startups to flourish, is incredible. The amount of I think you have the same, like we receive a huge amount of credits just for starting. So if you raise a seed round of money which is, let's say, one million U. S. Dollars. US puts one hundred thousand worth of credit. On top of that, that's ten percent extra funding for free provided. Wait. Oh, yes. Furthermore, they have this great architects. The help you out with all the questions that you might have if this is the first time that you are actually designing a whole our detector around a data processing apartment or an FBI or a Web platform? Very, very supportive. What was that? What's the one thing a ws would could do to make your life easier? If you're sitting here with Andy Jassy, what would you tell him? >> I mean, it's already fantastic. It's made our life so much easier. I really don't think of anything that could have gone better. >> Really? Nothing. I mean, you had reduced the cost even way prices. >> Okay. Well, thank you so much for talking to us about your experiences here on the Cube. Who? Heiner. Thank you. Co founder of Escape. And also it'LL really, Jane, it's really be fascinating to hear how you've grown your businesses. So I really appreciate you joining us here with me. Damayanti here at eight Ws summits in London

>> Announcer: Live from London, England, it's theCUBE, covering AWS Summit London 2019, brought to you by Amazon Web Services. >> Today, we're here at the AWS Summit live at the ExCel Center in London. I'm Susannah Streeter, and this is my cohost Dave Vellente, here today. Now, we've talked a lot about the benefits of Cloud and the opportunities, and also the challenges sometimes, for startups and other businesses. But, also, there has been massive growth of the use of Cloud services by public sector organizations. And our next two guests here on theCUBE today, really, this is your area of business isn't it? So, we have Johnny Hugill, who's from Public, but also Max Peterson, VP of Worldwide Public Sector, AWS. Thank you very much for coming on to talk to us. >> Thank you. >> Now it's really interesting, during the keynote speeches, I was really taken by one of the speeches from the Chief Digital Information Officer at the Ministry of Justice, Tom Read, and he says, "We don't innovate for professional advantage, we do it to take care of people." And, Johnny, this is what your business is about, isn't it? Trying to link up startups and public sector organizations, to ensure that more people are taken care of. >> Yeah, I mean, that's exactly right. I think what we've seen in sort of almost every other sector you can think of, is this big proliferation of startups, of new market entrant's of completely new companies, really kind of coming to dominate those markets. And we haven't quite seen as much of that as I would like to see in the public sector. So, what we're trying to do is help tech startups, help innovative new companies, to come in and ultimately to deliver better services for everyone. >> There is real concern, though, among traditional companies about this. For example, your local pharmacy concerned that a really big player is going to move in and take away what they do. How do you kind of bring them along and say, well actually, if you work with a startup, it could improve the way you do business and keep you in business. >> Totally. I think pharmacy is a really interesting example. Because, in the UK, we've seen a bunch of new digital-first pharmacies come in and completely transform how people can access their pharmacy. So, Echo is one example of a UK startup that, now, you can get door-to-door prescriptions, instead of having to go to your pharmacy, make appointments, you know, waste loads of time queuing. My view is that these organizations really have to kind of get up to speed with how things work in the wider digital economy. So, people have certain expectations for how services should be delivered, for how quickly they should be accessed, to be able to access things. I think government services are no different. That's pharmacies, that's schools, that's teaching, that's everything. >> We're here in London. How big is the UK in terms of the growth of your business? >> Max: Well, the UK has been a leader for a long time, so from the time that they undertook the government digital services business through the G Cloud, 11 iterations, with big ministries, like the UK MOJ that you heard, with big nonprofits, like Comic Relief, and everything in between, educational institutions, startups. We're very proud we've partnered with Public to help continue to encourage that kind of innovation in government technology. >> I think, when we last talked Max, you, John and I, I think we were in DC. >> I think it was. >> And you were helping us understand, look, this public sector is not just about DC. And you've got a number of activities. We interviewed several of theCUBE yesterday At AWS headquarters. One of the things we talked about was GDPR. We were having a conversation with a privacy expert earlier today. He said, you know, the big players really haven't, really weren't ready for GDPR. You made a point in DC last year, you said, day-one you guys were ready, end-to-end encryption, a number of other services. so, I wanted to circle back to you. >> Max: Sure. >> I said, okay, we gotta peel the onion. I gotta ask Max, put him on the spot. You guys really anticipated this, it's not like you were scrambling at the last minute. Is that fair to say, and I wonder, if, Johnny, if you could confirm or deny that. >> Well, I would tell you that at Amazon, we think security is job-zero. If we are not making sure that we are continuously raising the bar to improve customer security, security for small businesses, then we need to do a better job. A couple of examples: GDPR was a good one, where, two months before GDPR came into a lawful requirement, Amazon announced that we were GDPR compliant. So people could confidently build on top of Amazon. In the UK, early on in 2016, we delivered one of our advanced security services called AWS Shield, which gives everybody using the AWS Cloud in the UK and, in fact, around the world, automatic protection against DDoS. No additional cost. You get it by using the Cloud. Those are the types of security services that Amazon delivers, and probably one of the most important these days, when you're working with sensitive workloads, is encryption. On Amazon, it's check-the-box easy to implement encryption for your data on the fly or when it's at rest. >> So, I hear that a lot, about encryption, and how simple it is. You guys using encryption? Do you guys got it as part of your... >> So, we work with technology companies who want to work with government, so many of the companies we back are using encryption. As I'd say, some of the, sort of, particularly in policing and defense, and some of the more sensitive areas of the public sector, this stuff is really, really crucial. And you simply can't, kind of, get into government without being GDPR compliant, and without having all of the SAP security essentials. A lot of the companies we've backed, are using AWS Cloud, have gone on to win public sector business, so, in that sense, I'm sure everything's E-checked. >> Are there any special considerations, with regard to encryption, things like, out-of-scope requirements that I should think about as a customer, or is it really as simple as Max is saying, click a button and check a box and don't even worry about it, it's all taken care of. What's your advice to people on encryption, is it just encrypt everything? >> Yeah. >> Are there performance considerations or...? >> I mean, again, it totally depends on the scale of the contract, of the requirements that your kind of going off of. For big major contracts with Ministry of Justice, Ministry of Defense, there are a number of different performance, kind of requirements, that you need to consider. But, in general, I think, yeah, it's pretty quite straightforward. >> Yes, kind of a no-brainer. >> I think the answer is encrypt everything, everywhere, all the time. And that also means on premise, it also means on your devices, right? I mean it needs to be just the standard approach that people take to data protection these days. And, unfortunately, for many organizations internally, it's hard, and so that's why people are moving to Amazon so that they get that security built in. It actually is the number one reason why people are moving to AWS today. They want the built-in security and then, after that, they want speed and innovation. And there was a really interesting statistic today at the keynote. Did you hear that LSE, London School of Economics, just completed a study and they showed that 95% of all startups that happen today would not happen if they had to depend on legacy infrastructure, because it was hard and expensive, and that's, candidly, why being a startup in today's Cloud-based world, is a much better value proposition. You can focus on the problem rather than all of these important but complicated factors like encryption. >> The other thing there, the London School of Economics study showed is the productivity gains for those companies that use Cloud. Now, there haven't been obvious productivity gains as a result of technology across the board. We're starting to finally see the uptick. Remember back in the PC days, you could see productivity, you could see upticks everywhere except in productivity, and then all of a sudden it shot up. And we've been predicting, for a couple of years now, you're going to start to see it, Cloud being one of the reasons, other new technologies, and so that was another key finding of that study that I found intersting. >> Well, Sainsbury was up on the stage today again, and what they have now found, right, was they have found a 60% to 70% improvement in productivity. That was their number up on the stage. >> Interesting, you're talking about kind of legacy companies. We've got Ministry of Justice, in fact there was a bit of a battle wasn't there? Yeah, well we've been balanced since 1170. (laughter) >> That was hilarious wasn't it? >> Sainsbury's only 150 years old. >> MOJ got up and said, "Well, in this battle of historical significance, our mission started in 1178. (laugher) >> But it's interesting to talk about those, but really, your bread and butter, Johnny Hugill, is the startups, isn't it, trying to spot talent out there and think, who could I partner these guys up with. >> Yeah, totally right. A really important thing to any organization that is trying to innovate today can do is to market horizon scanning, really understand what is out there, what the art of the possible looks like, what the new technologies that are going to change the game look like, what these companies are actually really capable of, where their sweet spot of innovation is. >> Susannah: And they might not know that themselves. >> But it's a really difficult thing to know, especially if you think about what the kind of day-to-day job of government is, which is really running the country, right? It's pretty difficult to ask them, by the way guys, you also need to really understand what the prospects of AI startups are looking like across the country, or across the world. You need to understand who the kind of BotChain innovators are. It's a big challenge, and it's something that we are really trying to help them along the way. As you said, a lot of that is partnering with bigger companies, and kind of forming the right ecosystems of smaller companies, large companies that can help them scale, and kind of taking government on that journey along with them. >> Well, and the pace of change is another challenge. Six months in this business now is an eternity it seems like. I remember crypto was so hot a year ago, I mean I'm a fan of a lot of the underlying technologies. It was interesting to see how Amazon dealt with that. You asked a lot of questions, like what do you really need to do this, you guys came up with a couple of solutions there, but, keeping up with the pace of change is one of the, I would think, one of the key values that you provide. >> It's really a challenge, and I think now, in infant tech, 15% of the financial revenue in the UK has come from startups founded in the last five years, right? So a big legacy market as important as financial services, has just been completely turned on its head, by Revolut, by Monzo, by all these new guys. And in government we are going to see the same thing at some point. >> Dave: I'd observe that in financial services those are good examples, but the industry still hasn't been disrupted yet. Healthcare still hasn't been disrupted. They're both ripe for disruptions and it's happening. >> Max: Yeah, but I think if you look at those, that's part of what Johnny was saying. Some of these early industries, like finance, have maybe been the initial disrupters, but I do believe that there is a wave of opportunity and disruption coming in this whole gov-tech space. One of them recently was at Zuna. Zuna came in and acquired a contract with UK government that completely upended an old way of doing job search. They had a better mousetrap. And, fortunately, in this case, government recognized it and they used them. >> [Johnny} Yeah, I mean, I would say that was a really momentous thing. The most used website in the entire UK Government, which is the kind of find-a-job search site. As Zuna came along, replaced an incumbent supplier who'd been doing it for years, probably quite badly, came along with their new AI-driven platform, using AWS Cloud and are now just delivering a service that everyone prefers. >> Dave: I saw NHS has announced, what, a half-billion pound almost, transformation project, modernization. And when you peel the onion, you see a lot of startups. Behind the startups, you see a lot of Cloud going on because the Cloud attracts startups, startups are where the innovation is, and if you're going to modernize and spend a half-billion pounds, you better look to the innovation engine. >> Yeah, one of the things about the Cloud computing and one of the things about government policy that's critical, is that it actually encourages that kind of innovation. Because a lot of small companies are the source of new ideas, but, procurement sometimes gets in the way. One of the things that we think, in fact, has worked well is the UK G Cloud contract, where on the UK G Cloud, over 90% of the suppliers on the G Cloud contract are in fact small and medium enterprises, and where 45% of the sales since inception on G Cloud have actually gone to SMEs. >> So it's really transformative. >> yeah. >> Well thank you very much for talking to us about this really fascinating space. I really appreciate it Max Peterson and Johnny Hugill. Thank you for joining us on theCUBE. >> Thank you. >> Thank you so much. >> Great talk. >> That's all from us for now from the Excel Center AWS Summit here in London.

>> Narrator: Live from London, England. It's theCUBE. Covering AWS Summit London 2019. Brought to you by Amazon Web Services. >> Hello and welcome to the AWS Summit here at the XL Center in London. I'm Susannah Streeter and Dave Vellante is my co-host on The CUBE today. So much to talk about. It is immense this Summit. Thousands upon thousands of attendees talking about everything to do with the Cloud, of course. AI machine learning, but privacy keeps coming up again and again. And I'm please to say that Bill Mew is here. He's a privacy campaigner and tech consultant and is now CEO of crisisteam.co.uk. Now Bill, we have talked a lot really about the growth of AWS and also the start-ups using the public Cloud. It's interesting that that growth is intensified even though the GDPR regulations came into force and right now lobbyists are really hard at work, 6aren't they? Particularly in the United States trying to limit the impact of coming regulations. Do you think that they'll be successful? >> Well, I think there was a big argument when we first looked at the introduction of regulation around privacy and sort of ethical issues. But it would be a big restraint on innovation and I think what we're seeing here at this AWS Summit is the fact that innovation is well, and it's alive, and it's really healthy and there's a great deal happening. We just need to be careful with what we do with people's data and there's a very good reason for this. It really matters to people. You, me, people in the street, consumers. Number one issue, now, for most people is security and privacy and how their data is handled. It's interesting that only six months, eight months ago, if you surveyed the same group of people, they might have said diversity or sustainability. Now, because of a number of the horror stories around data breaches, the number one issue out there is now how their data is handled. And therefore, companies need to take it very seriously. And obviously AWS has got an enormous infrastructure and it's claiming that it's GDPR compliant in the way it handles it's own data. But there are a lot of people that host on its platform and they're sometimes vulnerable. So, what I'm doing is I'm helping to influence where some of the regulation is going to try and head things off, to ensure we have the right balance between meaningful protections because that needs to be in place, but ensuring that meaningful protections don't hinder innovation or economic and social value. But at the same time, I also work, I was apart of the crisis team with some of the top lawyers in Cyber Law and a whole bunch of crisis management experts, or ex UN or whoever, and we help step in when things go wrong for companies. Not only helping them come together with a legally defensible position, helping them communicate it effectively, and actually across our social media campaign and our reach and some of the other channels like this that we use, we help to counter some of the hysteria and misinformation that is often inevitable in that type of situation. So, there's a whole spectrum there and an enormous scope for debate. >> So you're talking there about fake news in particular, are you? >> Well, I think that when a story breaks there can be a lot of misinformation about exactly what happened. Things can get a little bit out of hand and hysteria can take off. You can talk about alternative facts, you can talk about hysteria, you can talk about fake news. What we try and do is not only help companies formulate what is likely to be the most realistic defensible position they have, but also to make sure that they're countering some of the really terrible hysteria that can occur at a time when typically their own credibility in the market is an all time low. And maybe there are, if you've got some credible privacy campaigners, some real thought leaders in the market who can step in and say, "Hold on guys, look, there's a little bit of reality we need to touch on here. This isn't quite what happened, this may have happened, and this is what they're doing to try to address it". Then maybe we can counter some of that hysteria. We can help people who might be unduly concerned, and also we can help protect some brands out there that are sometimes facing a lot of reputational harm. >> So Scott McNealy famously said one day that, he was the former CEO of Sun Microsystems, a very successful company that was sold to Oracle, but he said, "There is no privacy in the internet, get over it". And that was before social media took off. Social media obviously has affected this discussion. But, for years, and still, people put stuff on the social channels that is absurdly private. Yet, it's open for the public. So- >> Yeah, but I think there was a level of naivety once upon a time. If we were to ask a number of questions a while ago about privacy, I think people would not be really too concerned, but they've seen some of the breeches like the Equifax breech, where there was some really very sensitive information made available. Sometimes. that led to very real concerns around people. But also, we're looking at new technologies that are going to come along. We've got AI on the horizon, we've got facial recognition. These kind of technologies are actually going to dominate our lives in the future. And we're already seeing in countries like China, where they're using facial recognition to score people, a bit like you have a credit score, you have a citizenship score, a how good a citizen you are, whether you jaywalk, whether you do all sorts of other different things. And your access to credit, your access to travel opportunities, your access to a whole load of services is based on your score. I think there will be a lot of people in the possibly democratic western societies who might see that as a little bit Big Brother. >> Even though you are still seeing some states and cities already bringing in regulations to limit some of the advances we see here. >> Yeah, it's interesting, I think in Washington state in the U.S., there have been a number of different proposals put forward in terms of how they introduce the sort of privacy regulations we've already seen California and elsewhere. And some of the proposals there would be nigh on sort of a banning facial recognition entirely because the barometric constraints were really quite severe. And I think, part of what I've been doing, I work with a lot of privacy campaigners, but I also work with other corporates to see how we can strike the right balance. We want meaningful protections, absolutely, because there's some really sensitive data out there. And the way it's used can affect our lives. At the same time, we don't want to stifle innovation, the type of innovation we're seeing here at the AWS Summit. We want maximize the economic and social value. And that's a really delicate balance to strike. >> Susannah: It's a tight rope, isn't it? >> It sounds good, but so, I think of the cloud, how it's enabled small businesses to have access to IT infrastructure that's the same quality as large companies. In a way, doesn't this stack the deck for large companies who can actually afford the compliance officers and all the infrastructure necessary in the software and the people to actually comply with these new regulations. >> I think there is some truth in that, because there is absolutely an overhead, but I don't think we need to get away from the fact that data is really important and it needs to be protected. I don't think we're just looking at privacy here, we're also looking at data protection and I don't think you should underestimate the vulnerability that we now see. I mean, we are more of an inter connected society than we have ever been. The number of attacks that are on the horizon are growing exponentially. We are also seeing the fact that the number of opportunities, the threat landscape, is increasing. We've got massive numbers of IOT devices and other things. It's going to be very, very difficult. It's going to be a full time challenge. Indeed it's a sort of AI arms race as either side use AI to discover either vulnerabilities to introduce attacks, or vulnerabilities in order to introduce patches. >> We hear a lot about just how valuable our data is. And we were even discussing at one point that it's more valuable than oil for many companies. Do you think that consumers have really woken up to the fact, just how valuable their data is? And could you foresee a time where by actually the consumers say, "You want my data, you've really got to pay me for it"? >> I think there have been some proposals along that front in terms of how we separate private data and give people control over it. The right to be forgotten was a step in that direction. But, if we can have some sort of infrastructure that does allow people separate their own private data and allow access to it on a permissions basis, then that could provide a future internet. There's been a lot of discussion along that front from Tim Berners-Lee and a number of other really top thinkers in that particular arena. But the value of that data possibly was overlooked in the past. Plus also the vulnerability as well, and therefore I think people are waking up to it now. That's why they care so much more about it now then they ever have in the past. >> Well there's certainly a lot of talk in the Blockchain and crypto world about using that technology to allow the users to own their own data, to control their own data. I mean take Facebook for example, there's a built in incentive for them to appropriate our data, so they can sell ads to us. But, what if, as the theory goes, the user could control it, the user could monetize his or her own data. So there is some discussion going on there, there is some technology development going on there at the low level protocol. What do you think about that? >> I certainly think that technology will provide the answer. Exactly how we do a sort of new version of the internet that allows that sort of control, is still open to discussion and there are a lot of opinions both on, on either side here. Interestingly enough, Blockchain has been put forward as a possible solution, but there's a slight irony in the fact that Blockchain's immutability's actually at odds with GDPR's right to be forgotten. So, the two are actually mutually incompatible. So there's some real difficult issues for us to address here. >> So technology got us into this problem, it can potentially help us get out of this problem, but maybe not is what I'm hearing. >> It's not entirely straight forward, and actually if we are going to be moving in a direction where we give users more control over their data, it's actually gonna have to be an internationally adopted standard. At the moment, GDPR has come forward as a standard here in Europe, but it is set sort of the golden benchmark against which other regulations are now going to be measured. >> Susannah: And are you seeing signs of that? Do you expect the U.S. to adopt a model which is very much based on the one Europe has. >> It may not be exactly GDPR like, but there will be things in common. I think many of the organizations world wide that really care about their user's data, and I told you earlier about the attitudinal surveys that have been out there. Companies are very wise if they wake up to this and actually take proactive steps to change the culture in their organization, to have a digital ethics culture. It means not only are they going to care for data more often, more carefully, they're going to be less prone to the type of inadvertent leaks, as well as a sort of hacks. But at the same time, a culture of that nature helps them to deal with a situation if it even does occur. It's actually having the right culture. And those companies that have a truly digital ethics oriented culture have not only adopted GDPR in Europe, they've chosen to adopt it globally. >> I think there's a sentiment in the U.S., that look, we're doing this for European consumers, we might as well adopt the same standards globally. >> Bill: Yeah. >> We've got the processes in place, they seem to be working for Europe, why not use them? It's just more convenient, it's going to be lower cost to do that, so it just makes sense. >> That's why GDPR has emerged as a global benchmark. And many of the other countries, in India and America and elsewhere are measuring their potential regulations against GDPR. >> I've heard it criticized on this show as a socialist agenda, but it seems to having quite a bit of momentum, and a lot of sensible parts of GDPR. >> Well it, I'm not sure we could call it socialist or whatever. >> Dave: Not my words, (laughter) I'm just quoting somebody. >> What I think we've seen is a change in the balance, where actually previously, people's right to privacy wasn't recognized at all. And we had a sort of the tech revolution where people didn't really care. Facebook were talking all about a sharing culture and that was their orientation. We've seen the tech backlash where Facebook and others have all been punished and there's been a sort of sudden switch or pivot towards privacy. What we need to do is look beyond those because we need to have a level playing field. We need to have an equilibrium where we're absolutely balancing the right protections, meaningful protections, with absolutely maximizing the sort of innovation you see here and the economic and social value that's going to underpin our lives. >> Self governance is not likely to work, let's face it. >> I think we've seen, and Facebook is an example, we'll be oft quoted in this respect, that self regulation doesn't work necessarily in this way because it's just too tempting to use data in the way that you see fit. Unwinding some of the mistakes they've made in the past is not going to be easy for them, but we'll see how well they keep to the new promise of their pivot to privacy. >> Dave: I think it'll define their legacy, personally. >> Yeah. >> Well, Bill it's been fascinating having you on here, because you've really been at the forefront of all of these changes, so it's great to hear your thoughts. So, thank you very much. Bill Mew, CEO of crisisteam.co.uk. And you've been watching theCUBE at the AWS Summit in London. (tech music)

>> live from London, England. It's the queue covering a ws summat. London twenty nineteen, Brought to you by Amazon Web services, >> come to the A. W s summit in London's Excel Center. I'm Susanna Street, and David Aunty is my co host today on the Cube. This means so much to talk about here at the summit today to do with machine learning and a I. And I'm really pleased to say that we have to really key people here to discuss this. We've got time. Tom Summerfield, who is head off commerce, a foot asylum on also Richard Potter, who is the CEO of Peak. Now you guys have really formed a partnership. Haven't you put asylum? Is a leisure wear really? Retailer started in bricks and mortar stores. Really moved online on Peak is a pioneer for artificial intelligence. System's really well to get together. What What sparked? Really your demands. Ready for their services, Tom. >> Yeah, well, so way knew that we needed to be doing something with data on A and we didn't really know exactly what it would be Way were interested in personalization, but then also in a bigger picture, like a wider digital transformation piece for the business where well established bricks, a martyr business, but then a fast growing online business. And we're interested to know how way could harness the momentum of the stores to help the digital side of the business and also vice versa. On we thought data would be the key, and we ended up having a conversation with the guys at Peak, and that's exactly what we've been able to do. Actually, on the back of that deliver, we're delivering a hyper personal experience for our consumers Now. >> I was one of the statue that I notice when looking into what you be doing, a twenty percent increase in email revenue. So that's quite remarkable, Really. So Richard, tell us, you know how you're able to do this? What kind of services that you lean on? T make those kind of result. >> It's a combination of a lot of things, really. You know, you obviously need people who know what they're doing from a returning a business perspective. Married with technical experts, data science algorithms, data. Um, I think specifically how we've done it is a pig's built, a fairly unique A I system that becomes almost like the central brain within our customers. Businesses on off that algorithms help automate certain business processes and deliver tangible uplifts in business performance like the twenty eight percent uplifting sales here, Um, in order to do it. So it's quite a long journey, I suppose. The outlook we took when we started collaborating was was that if we could deliver that hyper personalized shopping experience, we were always going to be ableto show customers the right product at the right time. And if we were doing that that we would lead Toa High brand engagement, higher loyalty higher on higher lifetime values of customers. And that's and that's what's shown to be the case in silent example. >> Yeah, definitely that echo that. You know that the high profits hypothesis wass If you can show the right custom of the right product at the right time, then their purchase frequency average order Volumetrics all start to move positively and ultimately than affecting their long term engagement with our brand, which increases revenue on also delivers a more, you know, a frictionless consumer experience, hopefully for the customer, >> because I suppose your experience is the same. So many companies out there they're sitting on this huge pile of data, yet they don't know how to best optimize that data. When did you first realize, Richard that there was this kind of gap in the market for Pete to grow? >> Yeah, I think data and analytics have come on a bit of a journey away from common sense reporting tio more advanced analytics. But when you get a I and machine learning what you're talking about, his algorithms being our self learning make predictions about things that actually fundamentally changes the way businesses can operate on DH. And in this case, a great example is you know, we're sending hyper personalized marketing communications, Teo, every single for silent customer. They don't realize necessarily that they are tailored to them, but they just become more relevant. But it doesn't require a digital marketing to create every single one of those campaigns or emails and even trigger the sending of those materials. Brain takes care of that. It can automate it. And what the marketer needs to do is it's faded, engaging content and set up digital campaigns. And then and then and then you're left with this capability where eyes saying you might be a market for this product. Let's let's send you something that might appeal to you on DH that just gives that gives a marketing team scale. And then, as we move into other use cases like in the supply chain for film and delivery of product the same thing the team's just get huge scale out of letting algorithms do those things for them. Andi, I suppose the realization for us that there was that gap in the market was just that you can see the out performance of certain cos you can see that Amazon attributes five percent of their sales to their machine learning recommendation systems. I think Netflix says eighty five percent of all content is consumed >> because it's Al Burns. Andi. Companies >> like that can harness machine learning to such a great degree. How does how did howto other businesses do it? Who can't access that talent pool of Silicon Valley or along the global? You know, the global talent leaders in tech and that's that's where we had the insight that his peak way could create a company that gave our custom is that that technology and that capability Teo deliver that same kind results that the Amazon and Netflix >> so before the Internet brand's had all the power you could price however you wanted if you overprice, nobody even even knew. And the Internet was sort of like the revenge of the consumer. Aye, aye, And data now gives the brands the ability to learn more about its customers. But you have to be somewhat careful, don't you? Because their privacy concerns obviously DPR etcetera. So you have to have a value proposition for the customer, as you were saying, which they made are you know that machine is providing these offers, but they get value out of it. So how do you guys think about that in terms of experience for the customer? And how do you draw that balance? >> I think from my angle, that Richard touch on a couple of bits there to do it scale first and foremost across the entire alarm on Thai network of consumers is killer element to it. But to deliver that personal experience, I think consumers nowadays are so they're more expectant of this. Really. We would have considered it innovation a couple of years ago, but now actually it's expected, I think, from the consumer. So it's actually in the name ofthe You have to move forward to stand still. So but way think where we're right at the front of this at the moment. And we're really looking now how we optimize the journey for the consumer so that actually we know if we're from some transactional data that we have in a little bit of over behavioral data that, you know, we're really conscious of the whole GDP, our peace and stuff, and that's really, really relevant and super important. Andi, I'm pleased to say that you know, we have that. We know that by a peek, it's completely on lock down from that perspective as >> well. Where did the data's where the data source of comfort. You mentioned some transaction data. Where is the other day to come from using show social data and behavioral data? Where does that come? >> So those elements of social data, some of it is a little bit black box. You can't always access it, and that's a GDP, our peace there, and rightly so. Actually, in some cases we have a loyalty scheme which allows us to understand our Kashima's better in our bricks and mortar retail, which is really cool that we've got some of that transactional data on a customer level from the stars. We know that some people in our sector maybe don't have that, so that so that allows us to complete sort of single customer view, which then we can aggregate in peaks brain, then transaction data on the website in the app and bits off browsing, you know, just within our own network. You know where customs potentially being and reacted with somethin. A piece of content. Janet within the website, that's that's how we build that view. >> Do you think this is the way that more bricks and more two stores Khun survive? Because so many are closing in high streets up down the UK and in other countries because simply they're not really delivering what the customer wants? >> Yeah, I think so. We rich now. Both feel quite strongly now that wear so onto this now a little bit. It's a really As as our relationship for the two businesses has evolved, it's become clearer and clearer that actually we've armed with this. You know this data, our fingertips, we can actually breathe fresh life into the stores, and it's in the eye of proper true Omnichannel retailing way. Don't mind where the cost consumer spends the money. We just need to be always on in a connected environment so that A Z said before pushing the right product at the right time. And when they're when they're in market, we turn up the mark the message a little bit. But then understanding when they're not in market and maybe to back off him and maybe we warn them what with a little bit of a different type of message then and actually we're trapped with one challenge ourselves to send but less better marketing communications to our consumers. But absolutely that store piece is now, so we tail back. Our store opening strategy is a business to focus more on the digital side of things, but now it's possible that way might open some more stores now, but it will be with a more reform strategy of wet, wet where, why we need to do that? >> Isn't this ironic? The brick and mortar marketplaces getting disrupted by online retailers, obviously Amazons, that big whale in the marketplace, and your answer to that is to use Amazons, cloud services and artificial intelligence to pave the way for your future. Yeah, I mean, that's astounding when you think about >> me. Yeah, this sort of unified commerce approach, Tio, you know, there's a place in the world for shops. It's like it's not Romance isn't completely dead and going shopping. It turns out, you know so on. Actually, yeah, we're using honesty in the eight of us, but we'LL hire our friends at Peak. Yeah, it's it's some irony there. I think it's really cool. >> And that decision that you made obviously wasn't made made lightly. But you saw the advantages of working with the clouds outweighing the potential trade offs of competition. >> Yeah, I mean, that's not that was never really, really no, I'm certainly not know. I think this is something that is happening, that data, and on harnessing it in a safe, responsible, effective way, I believe, is the future of all commerce. So >> that as far as security is concerned because, of course, we have had data breaches your customers, credit card details, access. How do you ensure that it's as secure as possible in the way that you you you choose the services I think >> that come that just comes down to best practice infrastructure on the way we look at it, a peak is there's no bear tools in the world to do that, then the same technologies that Amazon themselves use. It's to do with how you configure those services until ls to make it secure, you know, And if you have an unsecure open database on a public network, of course that's not secure. But you could have the same thing in your own infrastructure, and it wouldn't be secure. So I think the way we look at it is exactly the same thing on actually, being in the Amazon prime for us gives us a greater comfort, particularly in terms of co location of date centers and like making sure that our application fails over into different locations. It gives us infrastructure we couldn't afford otherwise, and then on top of that, we get all these extra pieces of technology that can make us even more secure than we could do. Otherwise we'd have to wait, have to employ an army of infrastructure engineers, and we don't have to do that because we run on Yes. >> Okay, so we were able to eliminate all that heavy lifting. That same goes. You've got this corpus of data. I'm interested in how long it took to get through. A POC trained the models how much data science was involved. How much of a heavy lift was that? Yeah, well, I think for >> us we better be pretty rapid. Actually, we started working together in January last year, so we're only just sort of year into that. >> And in that faith in that entire >> sofa length of of our relationship, we've gone from high for personalizing digital campaigns to recommendation systems on a website to now optimizing customer acquisition on social media and then finally into the supply chain and optimizing demand and so on it. And I think there's >> a lot of reasons >> why we've been able to do it quickly. But that's fundamental to the technologies that the peak is built. There's two. There's two sides to it. Our technologies cut out a lot of the friction so way didn't run a proof of concept. We were able to just pick it up, run with it and deliver value. And that's to do with I think, the product that peak is built. But then you obviously need a a customer who's who's going on a transformation journey and is hungry to make that make that stick in London on. Then when the two come together, >> I think that it's an interesting point that, though, because while suite for asylum, we always I always say it's that we're not. We're not massive, but we're not tiny, but it's the sort place you Khun turn upon a Monday and say, I've had an idea about something and we're not doing it by Friday. That's That's a nice, agile culture. It can create some drama as well. Possibly. I think it's really straightforward to get straight into it. And I think this is where some of the bigger, um, sleepier high street retailers that Amar, fixed in a in a brick from our world, needs to not be too afraid to come out and start embracing it, because I think some of them are trying now. I think it might be a little bit late for some now, but it's just it's just it just wasn't that hard really to get going >> and you've seen the business results, can you share any measurements? or quantification. We've >> got a really a really good one that we're just talking about at the moment. Actually, Way were able to use segmentation tools within within the peak brain Teo to use them on Social than Teo. Create lookalike audiences. So Facebook Custom tools, Right? We'LL help you create audiences that it thinks you're the right buyer. It's complex algorithms itself, but we almost took a leap ahead of their algorithms by fire, our algorithms uploading our own segments to create a more sophisticated lookalike audience. We produced a row US results or return on that spend. People are not familiar with that of eight thousand four hundred percent, which Wei would normally be happy as a business, we've sort of seven, eight hundred percent. If you're running that that we've say on AdWords campaign or something like that, that's quite efficient campaign. So it's at zero. We were a bit like it felt like it's a mistake that, you >> know that is >> not the right, >> Yeah, but not so that's super cool. And that's really that's really opened our eyes to the potential of punishing that the, you know, our sort of piquet I brain to then bring it onto Social on. Do more outward. Advertise on there. >> So moving the goal post meant that your teeth are really high school. Thank you. Thank you very much for telling us all about that time someone feels on which floor. Sir. Thank you for joining me and David Auntie here at the eight of US Summit in London. Merchant to come on the King.

>> live from London, England. Q. Covering A Ws summat. London twenty nineteen Brought to you by Amazon Web services >> to the A. W s Summit in London's Excel Center home. Susanna Street and David is my co host today on the Cube. They mean so much to talk about here at the summit today to do with machine learning an A I and I'm really pleased to say that we have to really key people here to discuss this. But we've got some Tom Summerfield who is head off commerce, a foot asylum on also Richard Potter, who is the CEO of Peak. Now, you guys have really formed a partnership, haven't you? Foots asylum is a leisure wear really. Retailer started in bricks and mortar stores. Really moved online on Peak has been a pioneer for artificial intelligence systems really well to get together. What what comes? Sparked Really your demands ready for their services, Tom? >> Yeah, well, so way knew that we needed to be doing something with data on A and we didn't really know exactly what it would be way were interested in personalization, but then also in a bigger picture, like a wider digital transformation piece for the business where well established bricks, a martyr business but a fast grow in online business. And we're interested to know how we could harness the momentum of the stores to help the digital side of the business and also vice versa. On we thought data would be the key, and we ended up having a conversation with the guys at Peak, and that's exactly what we've been able to do. Actually, on the back of that deliver, we're delivering a hyper personal experience for our consumers Now. >> I was one of the statue that I notice when looking into what you be doing, a twenty percent increase in email revenue. So that's quite remarkable, really. So Richard, tell us you how you're able to do this. What kind of services that you lean on? T make those kind of result. >> It's a combination of a lot of things, really. You know, you obviously need people who know what they're doing from a returning a business perspective. Married with technical experts, data science algorithms, data, I think specifically how we've done is picks built a fairly unique A I system that becomes almost like the central brain within our customers businesses on off that algorithms help automate certain business processes and deliver tangible uplifts in business performance like the twenty eight percent up lift in sales here, Um, in order to do it. So it's quite a long journey, I suppose. The outlook we took when we started collaborating was was that if we could deliver that hyper personalized shopping experience, we were always going to be ableto show customers the right product at the right time. And if we were doing that that we would lead Tio Hi brand engagement, higher loyalty, higher on higher lifetime values of customers. And that's and that's what's shown to be the case in a silent example. >> Yeah, definitely that echo that. You know that the hypothesis hypothesis, wass. If you can show the right custom of the right product at the right time, then their purchase frequency average order Volumetrics all starts move positively and ultimately than affecting their long term engagement with our brand, which increases revenue on also delivers a more, you know, a frictionless consumer experience, hopefully for the customer, >> because I suppose your experience is the same. So many companies out there they're sitting on this huge pile of data, yet they don't know how to best optimize that data. When did you first realize, Richard that there was this kind of gap in the market for Pete to grow? >> Yeah. I think data and analytics have come on a bit of a journey away from common sense reporting Thio more advanced analytics. But when you get a I and machine learning what you're talking about, his algorithms being our self learning make predictions about things, and that actually fundamentally changes the way businesses can operate on DH. And in this case, a great example is you know, we're sending hyper personalized marketing communications, Teo every single foot silent customer. Um, they don't realize necessarily that they are tailored to them, but they just become more relevant. But it doesn't require a digital marketed to create every single one of those campaign or emails and even triggered the sending of those materials. The brain takes care of that. It can automate it. And what the marketer needs to do is feed it engaging content and set up digital campaigns. And then and then and then you're left with this capability where eyes saying you might be a market for this product. Let's let's send you something that might appeal to you on DH that just gives that gives a marketing team scale. And then, as we move into other use cases like in the supply chain for film and delivery of product the same thing that teams just get huge scale out of letting algorithms do those things for them. Andi, I suppose the realization for us that there was that gap in the market was just that you can see the out performance of certain cos you can see that Amazon attributes thirty five percent of their sales to their machine learning recommendation systems. I think Netflix says eighty five percent of all content is consumed >> in prison. It's Al Burns. Andi. Companies >> like that can harness machine learning to such a great degree. How does how do you know howto other businesses do it? Who can't access that talent pool of Silicon Valley or along the global? You know, the global talent leaders in tech and that's that's what we have. The insight that is Peak Way could create a company that gave our system is the that technology and that capability Teo deliver that same kind results that the Amazon and Netflix >> So before the Internet Yeah. Brand's had all the power you could price however you wanted if you overprice, nobody even even knew. And the Internet was sort of like the revenge of the consumer. Aye, aye. And data. How gives the brands the ability to learn more about its customers. But you have to be somewhat careful, don't you? Because your privacy concerns, obviously. Gpr etcetera. So you have to have a value proposition for the customer, as you were saying, which they may not even know that machine is providing these offers. Yeah, but they get value out of it. So how do you guys think about that in terms of experience for the customer? And how do you draw that balance? >> I think from my angle that Richard touch on a couple of bits there to do it scale first and foremost across the entire all on on Thai network of consumers is killer element to it. But to deliver that personal experience, I think consumers nowadays are so they're more expectant of this. Really? We would have considered it innovation a couple of years ago, but now Actually, it's expected, I think, from the consumer. So it's actually in the name ofthe You have to move forward to stand still. So but way Think we're We're right at the front of this at the moment. And we're really looking now how we optimize the journey for the consumer so that actually we know if we're from Simpson transactional data that we have in a little bit of over behavioral data that, you know, we're really conscious of the whole GDP, our peace and stuff, and that's really, really relevant and super important. Andi, I'm pleased to say that you know, we have that backed by a peek. It's completely on lock down from that perspective as >> well. Where do the data's where the data source of comfort. You mentioned some transaction data. Where is the other data come from? Using show social data and behavioral data? Where does that come >> with these elements of social data? Some of it is a little bit black box, so you can always access it. And that's the GPR piece there. And rightly so. Actually, in some cases we have a loyalty scheme which allows us to understand our Kashima's better in our bricks and mortar retail, which is really cool that we've got some of that transactional data on a customer level from the store's way know that some people in our sector maybe don't have that, so that so that allows us to complete sort of single customer view, which then we can aggregate in peaks brain, then transaction data on the website in the app and bits off browsing, you know, just within our own network. But you know where customers potentially being and reactive of somethin, a piece of content on journeys within the website, That's that's how we build that view. >> Do you think this is the way that more bricks and more two stores Khun survive? Because so many are closing in high streets up down that you can in other countries, because simply they're not really delivering what the customer wants? >> Yeah, I think so. Rich Now, both feel quite strongly now that wear something to this now a little bit. It's a really As as our relationship for the two businesses has evolved, it's become clearer and clearer that actually we've armed with this. You know this data, our fingertips, we can actually breathe fresh life into the stores, and it's in the eye of proper true omnichannel retailing way. Don't mind where the cost consumer spends the money. We just need to be always on in a connected environment. So that way said before pushing the right product at the right time. And when that when they're in market, we turn up the mark the message a little bit. But then understanding when they're not in market and maybe to back off him and maybe we warn them what with a little bit of a different type of message then and actually we're trapped would want to challenge ourselves to send but less better marketing communications to our consumers. But absolutely that store piece is now, so we tail back. Our store opening strategy is a business to focus more on the digital side of things, but now it's possible that way might open some more stores now, but it will be with a more reform strategy of wet, wet where, why we need to do that? >> Isn't this ironic? The brick and mortar marketplaces getting disrupted by online retailers, obviously Amazons, that big whale in the marketplace and your answer to that is to use Amazon's cloud services and artificial intelligence to pave the way for your future. Yeah, I mean, that's astounding when you think about >> coming. >> Yeah, sort of unified commerce approach, Tio. You know, there's a place in the world for shops. It's like it's not Romance isn't completely dead and going shopping Friends out, you know so on. Actually, yeah, we're using honest in the eight of us, but we'LL hire our friends at Peak. Yeah, it's it's some irony there. I think it's really cool. >> And that decision that you made obviously made made lightly. But you saw the advantages of working with the clouds outweighing the potential trade offs of competition. >> Yeah, I mean, that's not that was never really, really no, I'm certainly not know. I think this is something that is happening, that data, and on harnessing it in a in a safe, responsible, effective way, I believe, is the future of all commerce. So >> that as far as security is concerned because, of course, we have had data breaches. Yeah, customers, credit card details, access. How do you ensure that it's as secure as possible in the way that you you you choose the services. I think >> that come that just comes down to best practice infrastructure on the way we look at it, a peak is there's no bear tools in the world to do that, then the same technologies that Amazon themselves use. It's to do with how you configure those services until ls to make it secure. You know, if you have an unsecure open database on a public network, of course that's not secure. But you could have the same thing in your own infrastructure, and it wouldn't be secure. So I think the way we look at it is exactly the same thing on actually, being in the Amazon plan for us gives us a greater comfort, particularly in terms of co location of data centres, like making sure that our application fails over into different locations. It gives us infrastructure we couldn't afford otherwise, and then on top of that, we get all these extra pieces of technology that can make us even more secure than we could do. Otherwise we'd have to wait, have to employ an army of infrastructure engineers, and we don't have to do that because we run on Yes, >> okay, so we were able to eliminate all that heavy lifting. Same goes. You've got this corpus of data. I'm interested in how long it took to get through. A POC trained the models how much data science was involved. How much of a heavy lift was that? Yeah, well, I think for us >> we better be pretty rapid. Actually, we start working together in January last year, so we're only just sort of year into that. >> And in that faith in that entire >> sofa length of of our relationship, we've gone from high for personalizing digital campaigns to recommendation systems on a website to now optimizing customer acquisition on social media and then finally into the supply chain and optimizing demand. And so on and on. I think there's a lot of reasons why we've been able to do it quickly, but that's fundamental to the technologies that that peak is built. There's two. There's two sides to it. Our technologies cut out a lot of the friction so way didn't run a proof of concept. We were able to just pick it up, run with it and deliver value. And that's to do with I think, the product that peak is built. But then you obviously need a a customer who's who's going on a transformation journey and is hungry to make that make that stick in London on. Then when the two come together, >> I think that it's an interesting point that, though, because while suite for asylum, we always I always say it's that we're not. We're not massive, but we're not tiny, but it's the sort place you Khun turn upon a Monday and say, I've had an idea about something and we're not doing it by Friday. That's That's a nice, agile culture. It can create some drama as well. Possibly. I think it's really straightforward to get straight into it. And I think this is where some of the bigger, um, sleepier high street retailers that Amar fixed in a in a brick Samara world need to not be too afraid to come out and start embracing it. Because I think some of them are trying now. I think it might be a little bit late for some now, but it's it was just it was just wasn't that hard really to get going here >> and you've seen the business results. Can you share any measurements or quantification. We've >> got a really a really good one that we're just talking about at the moment. Actually, Way were able to use segmentation tools within within the peak brain, too to use them on social than Teo. Create lookalike audiences. So Facebook custom tools, right? We'LL help you create audiences that it thinks will be wrapped pirates complex algorithms itself. But we almost took a leap ahead of their algorithms by fire, our algorithms uploading our own segments to create a more sophisticated lookalike audience. We produced a row US results or return on that spend People are not familiar with that of eight thousand four hundred percent which we we would normally be happy as a business. We've sort of seven, eight hundred percent. If you're running that that we've say on AdWords campaign or something like that, that's quite efficient campaign. So it's at zero. We were a bit like it felt like it's a mistake that, you >> know, that is >> not the right Yeah, but not so that's super cool. And that's really that's really opened our eyes to the potential of punishing that the, you know, our sort of piquet I brain to then bring it onto Social on. Do more outward. Advertise on there. >> So moving the goal post meant that your teeth have really high school. Thank you. Thank you very much for telling us all about that time someone feels on Richard for so thank you for joining me and David Auntie here at the age of Lou s summit in London. Merchant to come on the King.

>> live from London, England. It's the queue covering a ws summat London twenty nineteen, brought to you by Amazon Web services >> Hello and welcome to the A W s summit here in London's Excel Center. This is the Cube. Is my co host a Dilantin also. Now we're joined by present Chandrasekhar, who is the senior vice president and general manager act rack space and everything. If you're here to talk about really the next generation of cloud services, what are they on? What do you communicating to you? Partners here at the >> conference? Absolutely. Thank you, Susanna and day, for having me back on the show. Big fan of the Cube. Eso No, >> really, I >> think Rackspace next generation Cloud services absolutely foundational to what we do for our customers. And so, you know, ultimately what we're trying to deliver is a utility based model of service is very similar to how Amazon thinks about the cloud and what you know, they were effectively lead over the mass passed many years. So I think that the world we believe the world of traditional I t services of large, monolithic contracts where you got traditional size that are going and working with companies to say, Let us transform you with little transformation and you know, what about so services? I think those days are effectively gone and they're dead. So from our perspective, customers are on this journey from one platform to another. They're moving from traditional workloads through the public cloud. There's that hybrid journey that's underway, and we've talked about how Amazon has, you know, really acknowledged that through its working outposts, etcetera. But the idea is for us to say Listen, customers are in a very bespoke journey. Everyone's in a different journey. Individual journey. Let's feed them exactly where they are in that journey. Whether that's you know, right now moving, uh, traditional I t work loads to the public cloud. So let's go on architect and deploy them and migrate them based on best practices that we've gained from thousands of these engagements. Or, you know, if they're further along and they're actually did need to manage and operate these in a very you know, container centric or Cuban Eddie centric world, we can help them. They're too, or if they're already know several years in and there you see, the costs are getting hard to control because they've got sprawl within the organization. We can help them with cast optimization and governance. And all this is enabled through what we call a service walks model attract space, which really stitches together various of the's no peace part, if you will, of services across the infrastructure, security applications across the whole stack. And so that's the idea. So how would you categorize first? Not the rackspace strategy people remember. Of course. You guys catalyzed in incubated the open stack movement, which was kind of a Hail Mary against eight of us. And then others chimed in. And then you realize that Wow, we're going to step away. Yeah, it was great. Open source project. Amazing on DH. Now you partnering on Amazon? What's the strategy? How would you describe that? Yes. You know, I think if you've learned anything over the past, you know, ten, twenty years and that practice has been around for now, twenty one years, you know that it's an extremely dynamic market and is driven by customers ultimately and their pace of change and so on. So when we started as a company, you know, twenty years ago, we started manage hosting business and services is the foundation element of what we do and support and expertise for customers enabled by technology. And so that really helped us, you know, take us to the first ten years of our journey. And then the cloud movement enabled a lot by Amazon really took off and where it was really a mainstream consideration or an early consideration to say its more mainstream now, obviously. But back then, So we competed with the open stack from the cloud business on. Then, very soon we realised our customers were all also operating in Amazon, and so that really said, Listen, we've always historically said, Lets go where customers want to go and we've always been a services technology serves this company at heart, so it doesn't make a lot of sense for us to do move away from that DNA and that ethos. So it's no different from fasten it, saying, uh at a high level, you know, Windows O. R. Lennox. We can have a very kind of, you know, dogmatic view about one of the other. We just have to say this and what the customers want to work on based on what their various various factors that the take in consideration so no different. Here. Platforms are just platforms, their choices that customers have. And so we started saying, You know what? If customers want help on Amazon, there's still asking us for it. Lets go in partners with Amazon to do exactly that. So that's exactly what we did in twenty fifteen. >> So where do you fit in that value change? How do you help customers and weirdos? Rackspace add unique value. >> Yeah, so I think ultimately, you know there's various elements of value along the way, and I sort of describe the service rocks model is the way in which we really bring it together. So customers are either looking for help to get to the cloud. And they're asking us, You know, what is the best way for me to get there, given my current state. And so there's a deep, you know, assessment that's done from a kind of way, have a lot of expertise, and Laxmi is over a thousand data be a certified experts on certification. So we bring those experts to the customer, talk about you know why they're trying to go. Hey, they're trying to really reduce your meantime to recovery. You're trying to increase your release cycles on a kind of, you know, per you know, a certain rate that's very aggressive operate with the devil's principle and mindset. You know all those things are the object of the customers has and then be then enable them to go and say Okay, given all that here, the workloads we'd would enable you to kind of, like move or to kind of like build from scratch, bring an entire set of services with their infrastructure, security or applications services, start with the value added set of workloads, and then build from that effectively prove the case and then move on. To >> date, the very fact that Amazon websites its growth has bean so rapid. And there are so many new services coming online. You know, every bump that's actually helping you because people need help to navigate. >> Indeed. I mean, that's a that's a phenomenal point. I mean that ultimately, you know, bar the reason why customers in our install base we're reaching out to us and saying, Hey racked with you, done a phenomenal job helping us in our first evolution of our journey. Can you help us now in this new world where it's actually quite complicated? You know, that's sixteen hundred features on average of forty hundred features on average are being launched by Amazon on a yearly basis. And that's just, you know, despite what we hear in the headlines where cloud first companies and us, the startups of today are absolutely leveraging. You know, Lambda out of the gate or containers out of the gate, you know. But there there's a whole host of companies that are going through this massive digital disruption, trying to compete with these startups that >> need >> a lot of help to re skill their workforce, to change the way they think about process within the within their organization, between their business development and technology and operations teams. And then, ultimately, you know, how do they actually build out much more agile? We have respond to customers so that work requires a company like Rackspace to come and help them navigate through that. Really, really, you know, large, you know, set of features. >> I suppose that it's a space that you certainly didn't forsee ten years ago. >> Oh, absolutely, No. That's what's so dynamic about the space where I think that nobody, I think, could have predicted, You know, even today we're seeing this's a ton of kind of like, you know, momentum with concepts that were very nascent only a few years ago. The Cuban Eddie's There's a concept, you know, almost every one of our eight of us customers at Rackspace, what we call fanatical A W s eyes absolutely looking for help on communities. And so, you know, when we think about Doctor A few years ago on Doc Enterprise on, we think about communities and there was that, you know, battle today, you know, the battle has been won Carbonetti XYZ pretty much pretty much the defacto orchestration engine. So nobody could have predicted that a couple years ago tomorrow. Somebody else. Exactly. So it's fascinating, And that's why customers need help navigating. >> You know, all those guys are. The experts carried people through the journey. It's mentioned hybrid before customers want choice. You know, even the Amazon wants everybody to put their data. Their cloud. Yeah, customers sometimes have multi clouds and absolutely as a hybrid. And Marty, I think, >> is a is becoming a lot more. I think even Amazon is very much acknowledging that the big opportunity is high. Isn't hybrid Cloud Because if you think about where we are and the technology adoption curve and the trillion dollars have spent that ultimately going to move, there's no doubt that it's a class for cloud First World. Their destination is the cloud, but the vast majority. The workloads exists in traditional i t. And so how do we take that hybrid moment? You know, and outposts? It's a great acknowledgement of that on. So they're very aggressively investing. We're investing with them and helping our customers along that money effectively. >> Okay, Present for a second. Thank you very much for talking to us from Iraq Space. And my co host, David Lynch has been helping us. Navigator, What's happening here had the A W s Web something. I'm Susanna Street. Thanks for watching the Cube.

>> live from London, England. It's the queue covering a ws summat. London twenty nineteen Brought to you by Amazon Web services. >> Thiss really is huge, >> isn't it? David >> London is my co star today on the Cube. We're going to be extracting the signal from the noise and there is a lot of noise. Just trying to register. Here was an event in itself, and one guy in the queue with me earlier said, You know, this is like an army of young technologist backing one particular platform, and we've had the main keynote speeches already in the conference hall. There are breakout sessions going on as well as we speak. And in those keynote speeches, it really wants the focus again on Hey I and machine learning and a huge array of services that eight of us now provide. Because, of course, every tech company, every company is a tech company these days. Where do you work in transportation or defense or retail? Let's talk >> about Dave a little bit about a ws and the exponential growth that it's seen over the past two years because it just keeps on getting bigger and you could see testament really out there just so many people here. >> You know, Susannah, when a WS announced its first service in two thousand six, very quietly announced E C, too, which is a computer service. Nobody really paid much attention. But a devious has permanently changed the landscape of the of the technology business. And we're here in London twelve thousand people at a one day summit. I mean, that's his large as many or or larger than most U. S based three day conferences. >> And there are many thousands more watching the life streaming as well, >> right? And when you talk to the people here, they're a division. First of them has builders, and it was interesting to hear some of the key knows this morning talking about some of the innovations that occurred in the UK he obviously UK, very prideful country. The first lights in electric lights work the Savoy Theatre, the Colossus, you know, Code breaker and many, many others. Home computing originated in the UK It so a diverse are connecting that invention and that what they call reinvention. Eight of us talks about his differentiation. The number of regions that it has around the world believe they said twenty one regions, sixty for availability zones, which are little, many regions inside of the regions. In case there's a problem, you can fail over fourteen database services. You know what's happening is all the traditional tea, which is eighty percent of the market place, trying to sort of hang on to their legacy install basis. So they're trying to substantially mimic eight of us. The problem is, eight of us moves faster, has more services, and it's just growing at such a phenomenal rate. >> And it's really kind of bottom up. A CZ. Well, it's so got that head start. So it's learning from its current customers and those it's had in the past, really to find out what new services they want that has his wealth of data ofthe gods to build on it, doesn't it? So every it seems every month it's it's another step ahead. >> Well, the data is critical. Amazon. Is it a dogfight? I always say, for your data with Google and Microsoft and Oracle, they all want your data. Why? Because data is the most valuable resource today, right? People talk about data is the new oil. We think data is more valuable than oil. You could put oil in your car. You can put in your house, but you can't put it in. Both data is reusable in a way that we've never seen a natural resource before. So it's extremely powerful applying machine intelligence to data. So Amazon knows if it can get your data into the cloud and do so cost effectively and deliver services that make you happy and delight you that they have a perpetual business model that's really unbeatable. The company now is at a thirty billion dollars run rate, growing at a constant currency rate of forty two percent per year. No people will say, Well, well, Microsoft is going faster. Microsoft is growing at seventy two percent here, but it's a much, much smaller base we're talking about single digit, a few billion versus thirty billion. So Amazon each year is growing at a nine to ten billion dollars incremental rate. Even more importantly, the operating income is phenomenal. I mean, a WS is only twelve percent of Amazon's revenue, but it accounts for fifty percent of its operating income. Hey, Ws is operating income is is in the high twenties, twenty eight twenty nine percent higher than Cisco, higher than AMC when it when he had seen was a public company. And those air very profitable companies the only companies that are more profitable on a percentage basis that that Amazon a pure place, software companies like an oracle. So Amazon, who's an infrastructure company, is as profitable almost as a software company. It's astounding, >> really interesting to see some of the partners that were invited on. It's about the keynote speeches. For example, Saint spreads so real traditional retailer at a prompter state that they'd be in the business for one hundred fifty years and some would say in many ways a competitive toe. Amazon at marketplace because they sell a vast array of goods and services to the customers. But they talked about how they're using around eighty eight WS services. It's always like a kind of a pic, a mix sweet shop. Or, as you would say, a candy store isn't and I think that's that's some of the benefits that some customers view for A W. S. Some would say, actually, I would prefer all of my product be in one place or the car that access and services in one place. And so is this pick a mix idea that I think really is taking off, isn't it? >> I'm glad you brought up the state's very example because, essentially, in a way, they are in adjacent competitors Teo, eight, of us. And yet they've chosen to put their data. And there's in leverage Amazon services. It's like Netflix. Everybody uses Netflix as the example. I mean, they compete vigorously with with Amazon Prime Video, and yet they choose to run in the age of U. S code. Now this is one of the areas where you heard at the Google Cloud next show a lot of talk about retail companies, you know, considering using Google, because, of course, they're concerned about Amazon eating their lunch. And so it's a hard decision for retail companies to make. Sainsbury obviously has said OK, we can compete. We have a unique advantage with Amazon retail, you know, but it's something worth watching for sure, because, you know, Walmart obviously doesn't wantto run in the eight of us Cloud because it's it's fearful. Ah, at the same time, Amazon would tell you, Auntie Jessie offenses look. There's a brick wall between eight of us and the retail side. We don't share data, so it's just a matter of that. Trade off is the risk of running in a ws er and potentially running at a competitors sight worth the extra value that you get out of the services. And that's what the market has to decide, >> yet certainly does interesting as well. We had the Department of Justice on the UK Department of Justice because they're has beans real concerned about security, about putting all your eggs in one basket effectively put a your data into a club no operated by you. And it does, though seem is, though little by little, some of those security fears are being laid up. Play >> well, there was this. The seminal moment in a WS. His history was in two thousand thirteen, when it won the CIA CIA contract who was more security conscious than the CIA. And they beat Big Blue IBM for that contract way back in two thousand thirteen, and the analysis that came out of that because IBM contested that contract. What came out of that was information that suggested that eight of us said the far superior solution forced IBM to go spend two billion dollars on a company called Software to actually get into the public Cloud does. It couldn't really compete with its own sets of services, and since that, Amazon has only accelerated its lead. IBM, of course, has a public cloud, and it's competitive in its own right. But the point is that the CIA determined that security the cloud was better than it could do on Prem. Now you're seeing the big battle for the Jet I contract Joint Enterprise Defensive Initiative. It's the biggest story in DC Amazon is the front runner. It's down the Amazon and Microsoft. Not surprisingly, Oracle has contested that because the government uses these sources from multiple suppliers and there's contesting it, saying, Hey, that's not fair to use one cloud. When a vendor contests Abid, a lot of information comes out. The General Accountability Office and the D. O. D determined that a single cloud was more secure, more reliable, more cost effective and less complex to run. So this is big debate around multi cloud versus single cloud. And again, Amazon continues to lead in the marketplace and in many many instances, is winning >> on DH. There were a few comments made in certainly one of the key notes today, trying to kind of blow the competition out of the water again knows whether a few specific references, in fact, to Oracle and Microsoft >> were right. And so they called the database freedom they had hashtag database freedom again. As they say, Microsoft, IBM, Oracle, Amazon, they're in a fight for your data. That's why Oracle has launched fourteen database services. Now it's not trivial. So Sainsbury and the Ministry of Justice both talked about moving Oracle databases into the eight of us Cloud. It's not trivial. It's much easier for data warehouse and stateless applications for online transaction processing. Things like banking much, much more difficult to migrate into the clouds. So it's interesting. Sainsbury talked about racquets stands for a really application close. There's a very high end, complicated Oracle database that they migrated to Aurora. The Ministry of Justice talked about moving Oracle in tow. RGS, this is a battle I tweeted today earlier, Susana, you pick up the Wall Street Journal is a quarter page ad on the front page. Cut your Amazon bill in half now, of course, what? Oracle doesn't tell you is that they date to X the price when you're running on or on Amazon versus Oracle. So they're playing pricing games. Having said that organism very good database, the best database in the industry, the most reliable. So for mission critical applications, Oracle continues to be the leader. However, Oracle, strong arms people, they'LL, they'LL raise prices, they'LL get you in a headlock and do audits. And that's what Amazon was referring today about Microsoft and Oracle will do out. It's so they position. They tried a D position Oracle as an evil company. The Oracle, of course, so way add value. We have the best database, and they're trying to add value for the customers. Build their own cloud. So it's quite a battle that's going on, and you see the instance. Creation of that battle manifest itself in the general contract. >> Absolutely interesting is well, what we heard from really both states bruise on the Ministry of Justice, really talking about the end users and how they're so different. So for public sector organizations, this isn't about making more money making profit. It's about the experience for the user. But in fact, that came up from Sainsbury's as well, making sure that the right products are with the right part of the store. And that's how a I could help them do that and efficient, usable data they currently have. >> I think every enterprise really wants to have a consumer app like experience, and very few do. I mean, we all know used these enterprise APS from large, you know, brands, and they're often times not that great. So what, you're seeing a closing of the Gap? People see what's happening with Facebook and Instagram and Whatsapp and so forth and say we should be able to have apse that run that simply and so you're seeing that gap clothes. I don't see how you could do that without some kind of public cloud infrastructure because of the massive scale that's required. It's so companies like Saintsbury are moving in that direction. Mobile has been critical for the last decade, and so that's what the consumer wants. That's what the cloud can provide. >> Is that what every consumer wants? Because increasingly, we're hearing a lot more concerned about privacy, that people not wanting to give all of her data across to private companies and do you think this could be dist sticking point ready going forward and could actually hold back the growth all they ws and its competitors >> a great point because you have a problem. Wonder problems. You have this app creep. I can tell you have dozens and dozens and dozens of app on my phone. I don't know if I trust them with the data. So having said that, one way to simplify that is to eliminate the need to do heavy lifting and patching of your infrastructure. Let us take care of that and build value up the stack by focusing re shifting your resource is on on value added services. Could it be a problem? I think no question. When Snowden came out in the U. S. People in Europe for sure. As you know, we're concerned about putting their data in the cloud that seems to have attenuated. I don't hear much about that anymore, you know. But if the NSA can come in and demand access to my data, well, that could be problematic. That's why I ws is putting so much or one reason why they're putting so much emphasis on setting up regions. It not just eight of us, Amazon and Google and Microsoft as well for many reasons. Privacy. GPR compliance on of course, Leighton. See the laws of physics? >> Absolutely. Okay, Dave Melody, thank you very much for being with me here at the age of us. That summit here >> in London at the XL Center there is still so much going on here. Lots of breakout sessions, many more kind of individual keynotes taking place with the various different subsections. Although the A W s business and also its partners. So we will be keeping across all of those on the Cube. Thanks for watching.