>>Live from Denver, Colorado. It's the cube covering com vault go 2019 brought to you by Combalt. >>Hey, welcome back to the cube Lisa Martin with steam and man we are live on the show floor of comm vault go 2019 fourth annual event, a couple thousand customers here and Steve and I are welcoming back the COO of combo. Chris pal. Chris, welcome back. Thanks. Great to be here. We're excited to be here. We just came out of the keynote. Some interesting news to talk about but let's, let's to talk about what's happened. Combat is a 20 year young company, tremendous amount of acceleration in the last nine months. Lot of leadership changes he must be going to hold onto the table cause you got like the whiplash, right? So tell us, here we are at the fourth annual go news in terms of sales leadership changes go to market opportunities with metallic, with a new partner programs for the enterprise. Tell us what are some of the things that are exciting to you and how come vault is really in 20 FYE 2020 position? Like, Hey, we're listening to our customers and partners. >>Yeah, yeah. Well, and a lot of the things that you're seeing here at this show is just that it's, it's, it's market-driven. It's us responding to what we're seeing in the market, working with our partners. And a show like this is all about working with partners. Our customers and the, the announcements that we're making here are really releasing a completely new combo that the brand refresh that we've done just over the last month or so is been tied to a lot of the things that are changing with regards to the product portfolio. Uh, that Hedvig acquisition and a lot of the different leadership changes that you're seeing and the leadership changes are really driving a lot of this shift of focus. And really, I shouldn't say shift really extended focus for the organization from a technological standpoint as well as from working with our partners. >>Yeah, it's interesting. The news ahead of the show of metallic Convult now a SAS providers. So it's interesting to get you give us your, your view as a marketer. On the one hand you need to be the trusted enterprise supplier with a lot of customers. And the other one, you know, they've got cloud microservices, all the latest buzz words and you know sasses the model that a lot of customers want to be able to consume their software standpoint. So, so >>I know you have Rob Kalusi and who's going to be coming on. So I'll steal some of his thunder and I'll try not to steal too much to don't tell them the what excites me so much about the metallic product when leap, when we first started down this path, it was we, we really started looking at the market and the challenge that came from Sanjay when he just first entered the building really was we have industry leading technology. A lot of folks will talk about how we have industry leading technology. But if you really took a step back, you would have to have an honest view and say, sometimes they would say, well look, if it's a, if it's a really straight forward installation, maybe Commonwealth and might be a bit bring too much to the party, so why don't you look at some of the other solutions. >>And as we were talking to different customers out there, they were looking for SAS solutions and but they at the same time, they didn't want to make any compromises. And so much of the research that Rob and team working with Janet and with David, no, we're seeing is that as they were going out there, the Seuss solutions that were available today, and this sounds like marketing spin, right? But it's really what we were hearing back, that they weren't very good there, that they weren't SAS solutions. They're supposed to be easy. The customers really didn't see them as easy. They were running into scale issues, they were running into flexibility issues. So from the standpoint of building the solution, what we quickly realized is if we could reach Sanjay's challenge to us, which is bringing this fundamentally solid technology to a broader audience with a simplified use cases that there's a great opportunity for us to bring value to more companies. So that's, that's where this went. And then the beginning reviews of this as we brought this into beta and different people were seeing at different customers, different partners, they even came into the conversation a little bit pessimistic and they all left excited about what they were seeing. It's it's, it's really good. It's really good. >>So targeted towards mid market companies with around 2,500 or 500 to 2,500 employees. Give me just a little bit of a perspective on the choice that Commonweal is now offering the midmarket with complete backup and recovery. That's one of your flagship and metallic. >>So the the metallic offerings your men for some of the most common use cases that are out there. So 65 and the what we're, what we're trying to inject into the market and the target of 500 to 2,500 employees is really just where we see the sweet spot of most of the customers of those sizes are the ones that are looking at SAS solutions right now. But that's not to say as we've talked to larger enterprises, many of them are considering the addition of metallic as into their either subsidiaries or other areas of their business. And what Sanjay talks about, he sort of refers to as the data brain is really bringing this together where you can add SAS solutions onto your existing on prem solution. So if you're running combo complete, you can also be running metallic across other aspects of your business. So that's, that's one of the things that makes it powerful upmarket, but then we're also targeting the more common use cases that are more turnkey down-market. Yeah. >>Let's switch gears a little bit. So your team had a little bit of fun opening up the keynote. You had some of the stunt doubles a for Thor from Starwood and the woman has done both star Wars and Marvel on and talking about the unsung heroes behind the scenes. Kind of like your, your customers here. But there was another connection because they were vendors and con vault is, I believe it's the global Avengers and it has to do with sustainability, which I know is something near and dear to your heart. So explain a little bit about why that's important in what it is. >>So it's definitely a passion of mine and something that we accumbent are looking to every company as we're driving this should try to stand for something bigger than themselves. And as we look at this all started two years ago when we sponsored and I joined Robert Swan's expedition to the South pole. We were the data sponsor for that expedition and it was the first expedition to rely solely on renewable energy. And what has evolved from that from different conversations, we started having discussions throughout about the carbon footprint of data and with 5g the internet of things coming and more and more data on the horizon. The people that we're speaking with. And the reality I think that tech has come to is that we can't be part of the problem. We have to be part of the solution. So through a series of connections, we ended up speaking with the folks who were responsible for the UN global goals. Um, it's the 17 global goals around the world that were endorsed by all of the UN countries five years ago and there's 10 more years of it. And Kamahl is extremely proud to be joining some of the largest companies in the world. Coca Cola, Microsoft, Google, Salesforce, many in our industry and outside, obviously to sponsor one of the global global goals. But the way the program works is it 17 global goals and there's one company for each one of them in order to try to represent it and drive it forward. >>Chris, you actually took a few of us around the show floor before it opened last night. We know conferences can have a bit of an impact from a negative standpoint. So tell some of what Combolt's doing to make sure that this conference, you know, doesn't have such an impact. >>So as you mentioned before, it's about 2000 people that are here and I was shocked to learn and a lot of this is all in education. As you go through life, the, an event of this size typically will generate 25,000 pounds of rubbish of trash. So what we've done is partner with our good customer, which is the Gaylord Gaylord hotel systems and leaf put together a model where we're trying to minimize the overall footprint. So we donate a lot of what you see around here. Construction materials are donated to schools and local organizations. We're using all of the natural plants that will go back into the, uh, into the environment after this. Um, no plastic. I'm trying. And then the, uh, the cups you see here on the table are all plant based. So we're, we're trying to be very conscientious about everything that we're doing here at the show and minimize the footprint. >>When you're talking with customers, as I'm sure as cou are doing a lot, we talk, we often Sue and I and the rest of the cube crew. Sustainability is a topic that comes up at every event. We're, is that when you're talking with customers in any industry, whether it's healthcare or oil and gas, where is sustainability in >>terms of conversation? Is that one of the key things that comes up? That was also really important for Commonwealth to say, Hey, we want to be able to make sure that the technologies we're delivering are going to help our customers meet their sustainability goals. >>Absolutely. And it's, it's increasingly part of some, a number of RFPs. They will come in for Combalt. So they're there. Companies are looking to have us be able to really represent what our sustainability, what our corporate social responsibility systems are and what we put in place. And so we look at this through the lens of what do we do within our facilities? What do we do in events like this? And then also what can we do with our customers? So it's increasingly relevant and their sons of research, I'm sure you guys have seen the, the, as the millennial generation becomes more and more part of either significant influencers or decision makers, they're looking for companies that have a mission, you know, and that that stand for something all. >>So Chris, we're talking about sustainability is something you're passionate about. How does that tie into the broader brand discussion of Convolt companies going through, we talked about the executive change and you've got a lot of new products. So when people leave Combalt go 2019 how do you want them to think of Convult? >>That's a great question. I think what we're hoping that we were really using combo Alco as a combination of so many of the things that have been happening over the last couple of quarters. And certainly as I looked through what we're representing now, it's what are we as an organization, what's the story we're trying to tell? So we launched just in the last few weeks a new tagline, which is be ready. And that whole concept of data readiness is something that we're having within this show and it'll be in a lot of our messaging as we move forward. So this, I'm thinking of as the organization that enables you to be ready and then extending that should of saying, well what does that mean? And that's around how we protect the data, help you control where it resides, help you manage it for compliance and different regulatory needs, and then help you use it and get value from it. So that's the big takeaway we're hoping that people have. The other piece of this that we have each year is we expose people to such expertise here at the show. This is not combo talking about combo. 70% of our sessions in the breakout theaters are partners or customers or other influencers. So we want people to come here and really see convolve as data experts, as the people who are willing to work with them. >>Yeah. One little nugget you shared also, you've been growing. How many developers you bring from internal to the show. I have to think that Sanjay has a little bit of push from that based on his last. Yeah, yeah. >>Roll. Yeah. Certainly the DevOps community is increasingly, especially with some of the moves we've made in Hedvig, the dev community is going to be increasingly an audience for us to, to engage with. But the, we bring 45 developers to the show this year. It's about 40 from a combo and five more that have joined with Hedvig and they have 30 or 60 minute whiteboard sessions and they're completely jam packed. There's, I think last year there was over 150 whiteboard sessions over two days with customers just coming in and going through the details of this because a lot of organizations, they're there, they're faced with right now and in Sanjay's words, they have to move from something to something and they need people to be able to sit down and have honest conversations with them. Um, I joke with people sometimes that one of the terrible things that happened has happened to marketing with the advent of technology is we have to be truthful now when you know you can't, you can't just spin things. And so we're stuck having to tell the truth. But, but combo has a great truth that sets, we've got a really solid truth to tell. We just need to tell it. >>Well, and I love how marketing is so scientific these days. You're right, you have to tell the truth. But you also have, if you have the right foundation within your organization, the ability to access data actually glean insights from it, develop, whether it's a new partner program or new technologies, new routes to market. That's the power of that. Having visibility and access to the data can deliver to any type of organization. When you, when you talk with customers who've been, we've got some on the show today, Hey, we've been using Convolt for 10 years. When you talk to them today, this theme of be ready more than ready. How are they perceiving their foundation with combo and all of the changes that you've made, not just in the last 10 years, but in the last nine months alone. Which like customer feedback. Yeah, >>the customer feedback has been tremendous. I think they, they, so many customers are something that's so great about combo. Does our customers want us to succeed and they, they see this market shifting tremendously. They've been with us for a while and they want us to succeed. When they look at the changes that they're having to overcome, they're excited about really beginning to learn that as they move from something to something that we can help them on that journey. That they don't have to go somewhere else for that journey. So whether that's looking into SAS areas, whether it's modernizing their infrastructure, whether it's moving to multi-cloud and those environments, we, we have the right solutions in the right way for them to be able to make this transition for their company. So >>Chris, we're relatively early still in this show, so I hate to ask, but give us a little bit of a go forward. Lot of change in the last nine months. What should your customers be expecting from comm vault through the rest of the year? And by the time we come back to Convolt go 20, 20? >>Well, I think when you talk to Sanjay, he always says, puts me back on my heels a little bit and tells me that it's a, there's more coming, there's more coming, we're going to keep going. So it, Sanjay is a very dynamic leader and he's looking to make sure that the company isn't just driving to combo go and then it's going to sort of be smooth sailing with these things. I think this is an exciting time to be here at combo. This is an exciting time to be in the industry. So as we look forward to, um, the new leadership that's come in and some of the things they'll be able to do in terms of our go to market, I think we're going to be exciting. Avinash coming into this organization and his expertise, his skill set and all of the brilliant engineers he's, he's brought in to sort of join our industry leading engineering team. Uh, it's, it's going to be, uh, I can't wait to see what they come up with from a marketing standpoint. You know, we, we had a solid product for a number of years, but it's always challenging to sort of continue to tell a story and come up with new ways to tell it. As you get new things in your, in your box to be able to talk about, it's, it's great to be here. >>Well, Chris, we want to thank you for joining us on the queue today. We're excited about the next two days of all of the folks, leaders, new leaders, customers, partners that we're going to be talking to you and really unpacking what being ready means to them. So we thank you for your time and we look forward to a great event. Thanks very much for Steven. Amen. I am Lisa Martin. You're watching the Q from ball go 19.

>> Announcer: Live from Nashville, Tennessee, it's theCUBE, covering Commvault GO 2018, brought to you by Commvault. >> Welcome back to Nashville. You're watching theCUBE at Commvault GO. Our first year at this show, the third year of the show. I'm Stu Miniman, my co-host, Keith Townsend. Happy to welcome to the program Chris Powell, who's the Chief Marketing Officer at Commvault. Thanks so much. >> Thanks, Stu. >> For inviting us to the Music City, and your party. >> We're glad to have you guys, thanks for being here. >> All right, so Chris, Commvault... I really like what I've seen at the show, so far. You made a statement that really resonated with me yesterday. You said, look, this is a 20 year old company, but it's very different than it was. We know cloud and AI and all these things are kind of changing. >> Yeah. >> Things like ransomware and GDPR are hot in the data world. When we look at our research, data is at the center of everything. So, you know, what's the brand of Commvault? If we think of a company that has lots of customers, but going through its own transformation, how should we be thinking of the company? >> I think what we're trying to do with Commvault is make sure that we, there's some times in marketing, where you end up in a place where it's either, it's perception is driving reality or reality is driving perception, and Commvault's in that transitional period where it's more about reality that we need to use to drive that perception, because there's some old perceptions. And as you said, in any company, especially in the tech space, that's 20 years old, you end up in a place where there's a lot of different perceptions of you from days gone by. Those can be about pricing. They can be about the usability of the products. The different technology innovations that you've had because you have such a long history, so we, sort of, need to continue to shift that and shape that as we go forward. For us, the Commvault brand has really evolved into Commvault is about being data experts and helping our customers be data experts. As you said, data is the new oil. Data, as we said at the show this morning, the new water, and it's definitely, sort of, this space where everybody's recognizing what's happening, but it's such early days in this world of data that's changing everything around us. >> Well, we have a friend of the program, Alan Cohen, that said, here's the challenge in IT, used to be that IT was the, always the no, and then you go to the procurement people and they're really slow. And, Chris, do you know what we need everybody to do? We need them to go. (laughs) I really like the branding of the show. Probably not where you came up with the term, but you've got 2,000 people here. The show floor, I've been to five or six thousand person shows that have a smaller expo hall here. You've got customers, with booths. You've got partners with booth. You know, Nashville's got a great energy. So, for people who haven't come here in person, give us a little bit about, why Nashville, what you hope to accomplish with the expo, the flow and then the show? >> Well, the why Nashville, and a lot of what we were trying to get with is, we've all been to probably one or two too many conferences in other cities, that we won't name here because I love those other cities too, but what we've done in our partnership with the Gaylord Hotels, which is a great customer of Commvault's as well, is trying to find just venues that are a little bit more interesting, and unexpected and different. That it was all part of the plan, as we were coming up with this, is to really project Commvault in a way that we believe, really, was more about our image. Towns like Nashville, last year we were in Washington, D.C., it's, they're great representations of what we're trying to do in the market. I was with people last night and they said so many people said they'd never been to Nashville, and this is a great town, and it really represents our brand well. >> So Chris, 20 years, 20 years of data. There's companies that are just waking up, realizing that they have this asset locked away in their, whether it's on tape, on media that's sitting aside in some random storage facility, but they have this asset that they can now unlock. What's the central message you want these customers to know about Commvault and your ability to help them to unlock that data. >> Keith, the... it's so true in that when you talk to people who are more on the data scientist side of things, it's this, it's this understanding that the... usually, the very well-paid data scientists struggle with just a couple of very basic things that they don't want to struggle with and it's not even what you pay them for. It's, can I get access to the data? Is the data all brought together in a form that I can really now serve it up, use it, get value from it? And as Commvault's been, sort of, developing and expanding our overall portfolio, it's really trying to address both of the issues of, if you're someone who's responsible for data in your organization, you have a bit of a challenge on an ongoing basis. You need to make sure the data is protected so it's secure. It's available when you need it. But it's also that you can serve it up and you can get value from it. The portfolio that Commvault's really been refining and introduced this past July, and continued to introduce things just this week, is made up of products that both enable the protection of that data but also serving that data up. The Commvault Activate product line and the portfolio that we're starting to introduce now is all meant to try to drive value out of the data. You're so right, in that, I was talking to some of our... we have a great expert in AI that's going to be with us tomorrow, Y.Y. Lee, who's also one of our board of director members, and she was just talking about how so many companies, as you've said, have locked that data away. It's not... it's not available to them and now they're bringing in these data scientists and their job is to try to find value in that data but they can't get access to that data. So this is a, this is a very straight-forward challenge that we're trying to help our customers with. >> Chris, I'd like you to take us inside your customers because when I think about five or ten years ago, backup, there was usually a storage person. It's like, okay, how do I have it? Do I have a backup window? Got to worry about recovery, something we would look at, but when you talk about data, you talk about data scientists. We're going up the stack. How do I use analytics and everything? Is this... >> Yeah. >> Is there a C.D.O. in my organization, worries about that? Governance and compliance are board-level discussions. So, bring us through where are you talking to the customers? Is there, kind of, the traditional customer, and the new customer? How'd that impact your whole field? It's a, it's a big, broad question. We don't have a ton of time but, yeah. >> Chris: Well, the way that I usually look at it is you can almost come at this from two different directions but you end up telling a very similar story. It's just almost the order of operation that you tell it. What I mean by that is, in the world of the folks who were really responsible for their virtual environment, their physical environment, and backing it up, you can talk to them about what they need and their desires in terms of the strongest backup and recovery, but then eventually you pretty quickly find yourself talking about a better understanding of what that data is so that you can apply your policies against it, so that you can show your compliance, and then eventually, to be able to serve that data up for more higher-value needs of your organization. And if you end up speaking to someone often, it's a more senior IT person in an organization or even all the way into the CEO's office. It's sort of just almost a different direction you go. It's you want to talk about how you can get value out of your data, and in order to get that value out of your data, you need to be able to understand truly what it is, where it is, who created it, who has access to it, and then eventually, you find yourself to: Is it protected? So it's a very similar story but if you go to a CEO and you start with backup, they don't really want to talk to you. And, if you go to a backup administrator and start talking about the value of data, they don't really want to talk to you. So, but what we've come to realize is that it's the same story, just told in a different direction. >> So talk... talk to us about bridging that gap. We're at Commvault GO, two thousand people, over 150 sessions, guys have been pretty clear this is an educational event. How did you help bridge the gap with such a large... difference of users? You have over five hundred partners attended the, the Partners Session. You have customers from the backup, admin, all the way up to the data scientists, and even executives that have to make these decisions. How does Commvault GO help bridge that gap? >> So, in a lot of ways, we use data so we're... we're as the old saying goes, eating your own dog food, kind of thing. We're using data from the previous conferences and always refining this. It's a... there's 182 Break-Out Sessions that occur over two days. There's, what we call, 30 and 30. It's 30 structured labs and 30 hands-on labs that you can, sort of, experience while you're here at the show. There's a lot of mini sessions, so there's the theaters that hold 120 people and then there's the theaters that hold 15 people. And through a lot of the technology of the shows now, the mobile apps, you can really refine what you want to experience at the show. The Meet the Experts Sessions, we have our developers here. The first year we did this, I wasn't sure how this would work, but we brought about, I think we brought about 10 developers for a Meet the Experts Sessions. The next year, we ended up bringing 20, and this year, we brought 40. 40 developers and engineers are here to have whiteboard sessions and just sit and talk to people. So, it's a... we've really divined, defined, sorry, this show in a way that looks at the audience first and, from a marketing perspective, I can tell you that when we came into this, nobody wants to be marketed to in this, in this industry. They, they want real information and what Commvault GO has been about is real information. It's, you talk about the reality driving the perception. Commvault is strong in reality. You know, it's, that's our reality. We just need to be able to communicate that and we use this show to make sure we're doing it, and not selling to people. We're here to provide real information. >> Chris, one of the things that actually surprised me, the portfolio is actually broader than I expected and part of that, you had quite a bit of hard news. What I mean by that, you announced quite a lot of products, everything from the ASA service through the Commvault Activate. >> Yeah... extended appliances. >> There's a whole lot of things there. We're going to have a lot of your, your team on to go through that, but give us what, when you, people walk away from the show, what you want them to know about Commvault, announcements. >> Yeah, so I think the big... there's so many different pieces, you're right, that have come from the show, very tangible, specific things, new product line around Commvault Activate, what you can utilize that... solution for, in terms of, understanding your data, things like, for sensitive data governance, then you get into the Commvault appliance and the extended appliance offering. We've taken the start of the appliance that was just in its initial forms last year at this time, at the last GO Conference, and then extended that this year with a larger appliance offering, as well as a smaller. And that's just a testament to how these things are being adopted in the market and the amount of customer uptake we're beginning to see on it. And then, when you look within our product portfolio, we've tried to make sure that some of our foundational products, like Commvault Complete Backup Recovery, that's been a big change for us recently. In terms of offering what we consider to be, and in terms of the name, the most complete backup and recovery solution, and what that was, is an answer to the market. Over the last 20 years, and it's not just Commvault, the whole market started to disperse their backup and recovery products. If you wanted backup and recovery, you had to go out and buy 10, 15 different products. You had to piece all these different things together, and what we realized is that what customers were really... longing for was something that really brought this together, so that they stopped spending all their time trying to figure out how to piece together a backup and recovery solution, and started spending more of their time about how to get value out of that data. >> As your CEO and COO said on the stage this morning, there's the difference between simple and smart, >> Chris: Yeah. >> And often, smart will end up being easier than, than doing this in part. >> Yep. >> Chris, I really appreciate you helping us to get a flavor for the show at the beginning. We've got lots more interviews to dig through all the product announcements, talk to the customers, talk to the partners. For Keith Townsend, I'm Stu Miniman, back with lots more coverage. Thanks for watching theCUBE. (light electronic music)

>> Narrator: Live from San Francisco, it's the Cube. Covering Informatica World 2017. Brought to you by Informatica. (futuristic electronic music) >> Welcome back, everyone. We're here live in San Francisco. This is the Cube's exclusive coverage of Informatica World 2017. I'm John Furrier looking to angle the Cube. My co-host, Peter Burris, head of research for SiliconANGLE media, also general manager of Wikibon.com. Our next guest is Albrecht Powell who's the enterprise information management global lead at Accenture Analytics. Welcome to the Cube. >> Thanks very much. Good to be here today. >> John: See you're sporting the sideways A, not to be confused with siliconANGLE red A, which is the other way around. Great to have you on. >> That would be the accent on the future. (laughing) Our moniker. >> So, um. Great to have you on. Center analytics. A lot of people may or may not know-- huge investment in data science. You guy's are doing a lot of work, and integrating in with customers. Not just on the management consulting side, but, you know, a lot of the architecture, a lot of the delivery-- You essentially manage services across the board. >> Albrecht: Oh yeah. >> There's a lot of architecture going on, so I got to ask you about the data powered enterprise vision that you have, because that's the theme that you guys have. What does that mean, first of all? And how does it relate to Informatica World, and ultimately the customers just trying to get to the Cloud, lower their costs, increase their top line. What's the digital transformation connection? >> Boy, lots of questions in there. So, you know, to us, in the digital revolution that's happening right now, the expectations on companies are just growing exponentially. You've got customers, you've got shareholders, business partners. You've got stockholders that all have so much more insight on companies. They want more, and they're putting so many demands on companies today. So, it's causing disruption in the industry. We all know about the Uber's. We all know about going from print media to digital media. But you've got companies like John Deere; they sell tractors, right? But they're moving toward a platform based company now, where they're now working with farmers, they're working with agriculture, helping to support. So, when you've got that as a different business model, you've got that coupled with the explosion in data. So, you know, the statistics-- Amazon, I think it took six years to get their first trillion. Now it's you know, the next trillion they got in one year. By the year, I think 2020, 1.7 megabytes of data is going to be created per person per second. These are staggering numbers. And when you put those two together, I personally think that the next big wave, the next big value proposition for clients, is going to be data, and harnessing the power of that. When I look back over my 28 year career, I go back to the ERP days. That was the big wave. Right? You had to be on Oracle or SAP or PeopleSoft or JD Edwards. I think right now, we're just starting in this phenomenal wave of opportunity. >> You mentioned re-platforming, or platform approach. The word re-platforming is an industry buzzword. But that really is an impact to IT, business operations, and personnel, and ultimately the business model! I mean, this is like a serious impact. >> It really is, and that is where this data powered enterprise comes in. We're trying to work with our clients to figure out how to harness this value proposition, unlock the data that they've got stuck in their systems, the dark data wherever it may be, and unleash that and try to gain business insights from that. >> Alright. Take us through the playbook, because okay-- I buy it. I see the train coming down the tracks that is really high speed. I bet I got to move to the new model. You look at Amazon, it's a great proof point. Hockey sticks since 2010. No doubt about it. Just one tell sign. I want to move. Now, I got to be careful, if I move too fast I get over my ski's, or over-rotate-- whatever metaphor you want to use, but how do I get there? What are you guys doing with clients and what's the strategy? Playbook. >> You know, the biggest thing we try and do is the relationships we have with clients are long term, trust based relationships. And when we go in, we're not selling a product. We're trying to help them drive business value. So, what we typically do around the data space is help them figure out what's the strategy, what's the vision, where do they want to go? They may think they need a data quality solution, an MDM solution. But you know, we come in and we talk to them and we realize: what are you trying to get out of it? Where do you want to go? And lay out a vision, a set of guiding principles. And that framework often times help them drive within the next one-two years, a much more sustainable set of growth as opposed to trying to do a point solution. So typically, we'll start there. But, you know, we'll also come in if they're hemorrhaging, if they're bleeding, if they've got major problems. Or, if they're trying to hit a strategic adjective, procurement spend analytics, or growth, or disruption in the market. Those are the type of things that we'll come in and talk to them about to start with. >> Is there a mindset-- obviously, there's a mindset shift. But given that, certainly if the certain room's on fire, you take care of those first. I get the critical piece of it, 'cause sometimes it is mission critical right out of the gate. But, is there an architectural mindset? Is it a building blocks approach? Has there been a shift in how to deploy and iterate through, in an agile way, that you've seen a pattern that's emerged? >> I mean obviously Cloud is big with everybody today, and the hype out there is everybody's moving everything to Cloud. And in reality, a lot of our clients-- They've invested a lot in these data centers, so they're reticent to make the leap. So, we're working with them to help, and Informatica has been phenomenal with some of the tools and solutions that they have to help them pull over to you know, Cloud based solutions. And you know, most of our clients right now, they have a hybrid architecture. They're moving in that way. They've got some stuff that they want to keep close and tight, they've got some stuff that they want to move. But between OpenSource with the new subscription models-- For instance, and Informatica has. It's a game changer for our clients. Because now, they're able to get solutions up faster, quicker, and we do a lot of work with our liquid studios to help them pile at those type of solutions. >> But it's still got to be in service to some outcome, or to some idea? >> Albrecht: Absolutely. >> So, that suggests that one of the challenges that people have been having in the big data universe is this disconnect between what we want to do, and implementing a dupe on a cluster. And that notion of how do we actually introduce some of the concepts of design into that process so that we can see realistically, and practically, and in a way that executed, a process to go from the idea down to the actual implementation? So, use cases are a big issue. Getting developers more involved and active is a big issue. But, what is the role of design in this process? >> So one of the things that we've shifted to is we have a set of innovation centers, where we'll bring clients in, and we might start with a workshop or two, right? To talk to them about the capabilities. But very quickly we evolve that into design thinking sessions, to really draw out what's the real challenge they're trying to find? Because half the time, they think they know what the problem is, but they really don't, and we help them uncover that. And then, from a design standpoint, we do a lot more prototyping now, where we'll go through and actually build in a matter of weeks, a real time capability that they can go take and run with. We have this thing called the Accenture Insights Platform, where we've negotiated with a lot of partners, such as Informatica, to have their tools, their software, in a hot, ready Cloud-based environment, where again, in the matter of a couple of weeks, we can stand something up, and they can see it, they can touch it. It's no longer the big capital investments to go start these type of projects. >> But it has to again, be something that people can touch and can play with. >> Albrecht: Exactly. >> And start themselves, to start saying, "Well, yes, "it works here. It doesn't work here." So they can start iterating on it. It's a way of increasing the degree to which iteration is the dominant feature of how things roll out. Ties back to the use case. As you guys think about the tooling that's available, from Informatica and elsewhere, how does the tooling-- Is the tooling robust enough at this point to really support that process, or is there still some holes we have to fill? >> Yeah, you know, I almost feel like the technology is there, right? We can do so much. The challenge that I run into when I meet with the C-suite-- I always ask the question, "What's your holy grail question?" If you knew this piece of information, how would that be a game changer? Eight times out of ten, I hear, "If I knew sales by quarter by region, "and that is was accurate, "I could really do something." It's like, that's not your question. The question should be: Who should I acquire? When is a customer going to walk out of the store? What's the weather going to be? What's the minimum amount of water I need to put in a plant for it to grow? You, know, in a drought situation. And those are the kind of questions that we are trying to draw out from our clients. And again, these design thinking sessions help us drive to that. >> John: Is that liquid studio's and the innovation centers the same thing? You mentioned liquid studios. What is that? Real quick. >> They are. So, again the whole idea behind these studios is that instead of doing, you know, starting with a massive project, or driving a massive five year RFP for a program. Again, get it in a liquid fashion; very agile, very prototypical, you know, build something. >> John: Very fluid. (laughs) >> Exactly right. And so that they can see, touch, feel, and manipulate these things. And then from there, they may want to scale that up. And you know, they may do it themselves. Often times, they'll partner with us to do it. >> You're partnering in the real time requirements definition of what they're trying to do. >> Albrecht: Correct. >> Well, it must be organized. I saw on Twitter that Accenture received the Informatica Ecosystem Impact Award last evening. Congratulations. >> Albrecht: Thank you very much, I appreciate that. Very excited. >> Where did that come from, and why is it important to you guys? Obviously, the recognition with Informatica, you guys are doing well with them. >> Now, Informatica is a very strong strategic partner of ours. I mean, we've worked with them for the last 18 or so years. I personally been involved with them the whole time. The company has vision, you know, when you talk to Anel, you talk to Ahmet, who was just on-- The vision that they have for their products, they know where they want to go. The reinvention that they've done here with the new branding, and the new marketing-- A lot of our clients had traditionally thought of them as more the power center, and more the-- >> John: The plumbing. >> Exactly. >> John: I'll say it. >> And we keep challenging them. It's like, you know, why aren't you bigger? Why isn't everybody using you? Because I think the tool set is robust enough right now. And again, it's finding these use cases to be able to apply this. >> Well, they made a big bed. The joke in silicon valley right now, in infrastructure companies, is that plumbers are turning into machinists, as kind of an analogy. But now with machine learning, you're starting to see things that they've made a bed on that's flowering, and it's important. And I think they made some good bets. They'll be on the right side of history, in my opinion. But I want to ask you a personal question, because you know, you mention waves. You mention the ERP waves and the software wave of the mini computer, which then became local area networks, inter-networking, et cetera. Basically the premise of what IT has turned into. With now, the disruption that's going on, how is it different? Because Informatica seems to be on that same software cycle in a new way. What is different about this new world order that's different than those days, the glory days, of rolling out SAP implementations, or Oracle ERP and CRM's. Shorter time cycles. What are the things that you're seeing that are key things that customers should pay attention to, they need to avoid, and things they should double down on, relative to this new wave of software? And how does Informatica fit into all that? >> Sure. The ERP wave was critical. It was the way to get everything under one umbrella. Very important, right? But today, the idea of single instance, companies can't keep up. They can't do that. So it's the nimble, it's the agile. I'm really excited about Informatica is that they've got the end to end solution, which is phenomenal, but they've also got the piece parts. And there's a lot of our clients that you know, they're trying to integrate multiple ERP systems together, they're trying to integrate multiple platforms, so MDM is becoming much more important today. Data governance. Absolutely critical out there. They've had a gap, frankly, in data governance for years. And yeah their acquisition, their AXON tool-- Again, it's a game changer out there and a lot of our clients are aggressively looking at that, and trying to do that. >> Paul: How does it change the game for some of your clients? Give an example. You don't have to name the customer, but in the use case basis. >> Everybody needs, you know. We talk about the need for governance, right? And it comes into whether it's paper based, whether it's automation-- Some way to get processes standardization and so forth around governance, and get people accountable. The tools that have been out in the market-- There are some that are good, but they're not integrated. There's no interoperability between them. And what I like about AXON now is they can sell it as a single point solution. Great way to get in the door of a client. But, they can also then integrate that with all of the other platform pieces that Informatica has, and that tie is really powerful. >> Well, governance also plays a role when you think about, for example, the idea that we want greater distribution of data-- Data is going to be more distributed. We want some visibility into that data through metadata, and (mumbles) talked about that. But, we heard from healthcare conversation this morning, and others, that one of the big barriers is, do I have access? Do I have rights? Do I have privileges to this data? And governance has to follow that process where people know in advance: What rights do I have? What access do I have? Am I using it properly? Am I breaking rules? That notion of governance can't just be centered on compliance and regulation, it has to be moved into more of an asset management approach. Do you agree? >> Right. Agreed. And the way we look at governance, it's expanding now. It's not the traditional data-owner, data-steward, data-operator any more. >> Yeah, it's not the central group. It's a corporate set of responsibilities. >> Right. And we're rolling governance now out to the end-user. So, how they are looking at data and interacting with data. Because data, now, it's a utility. It is something that everybody touches, everybody uses, not just an IT thing anymore. When you take that, and again you take the expanse of that into security. You know, as you talked about-- Secured source for example. The play in tying the two of those together. Very powerful solution. And even within Accenture, you know, we're tying our data, our governance, our security practices, much more tightly together as a single, unified solution. >> John: How does the AI machine learn, 'cause we hear in Claire their new interface, see LX out there, and Amazon. I mean Google I/O's announcing neural nets that train computers! Certainly it's a lot of buzzwords out there. Does that make the master data management, and the MDM, and the data quality more relevant? Or less relevant? >> I think just as relevant as it's always been. There's a lot of people that sit and say that the traditional data stuff is a commodity now. And again, machine learning is absolutely essential, AI. We need that because we're scaling so much bigger out in industry today. But, MDM is not going away. The integration between platforms, the need for good data quality. And I think, we almost took a shift in the industry to the buzzwords. Right? It's all about big data and AI and everything, and in some ways we almost left the traditional behind. And now we're coming back to realizing that you need good data to power the different data sources you've got, the big data and everything else, that then needs to be scaled, and that's where the machine learning-- >> And freed up for developers who have a DevOps mindset don't want to get into the nuances of being a data wrangler. >> Well, the patterns of data usage are going to be important, thinking about MDM. Because at the end of the day, you're not going to have copies of everything. >> No. >> You're going to have relationships, increasingly. >> Right. >> Peter: And MDM has to be able to capture that, too. >> Exactly. >> Alright, final question I have to ask you, what's the future for you guys? What do you guys see? 'Cause you guys always got the top brains in the industry working on things. what is Accenture's view of the future? What's the most important things coming down after this wave? Or is this wave just multiple sets, and to your clients, what are the top three things, or top things that you guys see as future waves or items that you're working on? >> You know, again, this data wave right now-- Again, it's the most exciting time that I've ever had in the career. And I see the growth that we're doing. And you know at Accenture, we have a lot of investment in research and development, we've got a team of data scientists that's out trying to mine data, figure out, you know, what the insights are that are out there. The liquid studios that we're pulling together. And, you know, as we talk to our clients, it's all about the art of the possible. It's not so much trying to sell a tool or solution. That's obviously important. But, where can we take you? What are the things that the industry hasn't thought of yet that we can take you as a company and help you disrupt into a new business market? >> Re-imagining the future. Thanks for coming, Albrecht. Appreciate it. Albrecht Powell with Accenture Analytics. Exciting this time in the industry-- I would agree data is certainly intoxicating at one level, but really great value opportunity. Thanks for coming on the Cube, and sharing the data with us as we analyze. Here on the Cube, more great coverage after this short break. At Informatica World 2017, I'm John Furrier, Peter Burris. We'll be right back with more. (futuristic electronic music)

>> From theCUBE studios in Palo Alto in Boston bringing you data driven insights from theCUBE and ETR. This is breaking analysis with Dave Vellante. >> Despite fears of inflation, supply chain issues skyrocketing energy and home prices and global instability caused by the Ukraine crisis CIOs and IT buyers continue to expect overall spending to increase more than 6% in 2022. Now, while this is lower than our 8% prediction that we made earlier this year in January, it remains in line with last year's roughly six to 7% growth and is holding firm with the expectations reported by tech executives on the ETR surveys last quarter. Hello and welcome to this week's wiki bond cube insights powered by ETR in this breaking analysis, we'll update you on our latest look at tech spending with a preliminary take from ETR's latest macro drill down survey. We'll share some insights to which vendors have shown the biggest change in spending trajectory. And we'll tap our technical analysts to get a read on what they think it means for technology stocks going forward. The IT spending sentiment among IT buyers remains pretty solid. >> In the past two months, we've had conversations with dozens of CIOs, chief digital officers data executives, IT managers, and application developers, and across the board, they've indicated that for now at least their spending levels remain largely unchanged. The latest ETR drill down data which will share shortly, confirms these anecdotal checks. However, the interpretation of this data it's somewhat nuanced. Part of the reason for the spending levels being you know reasonably strong and holding up is inflation. Stuff costs more so spending levels are higher forcing IT managers to prioritize. Now security remains the number one priority and is less susceptible to cuts, cloud migration, productivity initiatives and other data projects remain top priorities. >> So where are CIO's robbing from Peter to pay Paul to focus on these priorities? Well, we've seen a slight uptick in certain speculative. IT projects being put on hold or frozen for a period of time. And according to ETR survey data we've seen some hiring freezes reported and this is especially notable in the healthcare sector. ETR also surveyed its buyer base to find out where they were adjusting their budgets and the strategies and tactics they were using to do so. Consolidating IT vendors was by far the most cited tactic. Now this makes sense as companies in an effort to negotiate better deals will often forego investments in newer so-called best of breed products and services, and negotiate bundles from larger suppliers. You know, even though they might not be as functional, the buyers >> can get a better deal if they bundle together from one of their larger suppliers. Think Microsoft or a Dell or other, you know, large companies. ETR survey respondents also cited cutting the cloud bill where discretionary spending was in play was another strategy or tactic that they were using. We certainly saw this with some of the largest snowflake customers this past quarter. Where even though they were still growing consumption rapidly certain snowflake customers dialed down their consumption and pushed spending off to future quarters. Now remember in the case of snowflake, anyway, customers negotiate consumption rates and their pricing based on a total commitment over a period of time. So while they may consume less in one quarter, over the lifetime of the contract, snowflake, as do many other cloud companies, have good visibility on the lifetime value of a deal. Now this next chart shows the latest ETR spending expectations among more than 900 respondents. The bars represent spending growth expectations from the periods of December, 2021 that's the gray bars, March of 2022 survey in the blue, and the most recent June data, That's the yellow bar. So you can see spending expectations for the quarter is down slightly in the mid 5% range. But overall for the year expectations remain in the mid 6% range. Now it's down from 8%, 8.3% in December where it looked like 2022 was going to really be a breakout year and have more momentum than even last year. Now, remember this was before Russia invaded Ukraine which occurred in mid-February of this year. So expectations were a little higher. So look, generally speaking CIOs have told us that their CFOs and CEOs have lowered their earnings outlooks and communicated that to Wall Street. They've told us that unless and until these revised forecasts appear at risk, they continue to expect their budget levels to remain pretty constant. Now there's still plenty of momentum and spending velocity on specific vendor platforms. Let's take a look at that. >> This chart shows the companies with the greatest spending momentum as measured by ETRs proprietary net score methodology. Net score essentially measures the net percent of customers spending more on a particular platform. That measurement is shown on the Y axis. The red line there that's inserted that red dotted line at 40%, we consider to be a highly elevated mark. And the green dots are companies in the ETR survey that are near or above that line. The X axis measures the presence in the data set, how much, you know sort of pervasiveness, if you will, is in the data. It's kind of a proxy for market presence. Now, of course we all know Kubernetes is not a company, but it remains an area where organizations are spending lots of resources and time particularly to modernize and mobilize applications. Snowflake remains the company which leads all firms in spending velocity, but as you'll see momentarily, despite its highest position relative to everybody else in the survey, it's still down from its previous levels in the high seventies and low 80% range. AWS is incredibly impressive because it has an elevated level but also a big presence in the data set in the survey. Same with Microsoft, same with ServiceNow which also stands out. And you can see the other smaller vendors like HashiCorp which is increasingly being seen as a strategic cross cloud enabler. They're showing, spending momentum. The RPA vendors you see in there automation anywhere and UI path are in the mix with numerous security companies, CrowdStrike, CyberArk, Netskope, Cloudflare, Tenable Okta, Zscaler Palo Alto networks, Sale Point Fortunate. A big number of cybersecurity firms hovering at or above that 40% mark you can see pure storage remains elevated as do PagerDuty and Coupa. So plenty of good news here, despite the recent tech crash. So that was the good, here's the not so good. So >> there is no 40% line on this chart because all these companies are well below that line. Now this doesn't mean these companies are bad companies. They just don't have the spending velocity of the ones we showed earlier. A good example here is Oracle. Look how they stand out on the X axis with a huge market presence. And Oracle remains an incredibly successful company selling to high end customers and really owning that mission critical data and application space. And remember ETR measures spending activity, but not actual spending dollars. So Oracle is skewed as a result because Oracle customers spend big bucks. But the fact is that Oracle has a large legacy install base that pulls down their growth rates. And that does show up in the ETR survey data. Broadcom is another example. They're one of the most successful companies in the industry, and they're not going after growth at all costs at all. They're going after EBITDA and of course ETR doesn't measure EBIT. So just keep that in mind, as you look at this data. Now another way to look at the data and the survey, is exploring the net score movement over the last period amongst companies. So how are they moving? What's happening to the net score over time. And this chart shows the year over year >> net score change for vendors that participate in at least three sectors within the ETR taxonomy. Remember ETR taxonomy has 12, 15 different segments. So the names above or below the gray dotted line are those companies where the net score has increased or decreased meaningfully. So to the earlier chart, it's all relative, right? Look at Oracle. While having lower net scores has also shown a more meaningful improvement in net score than some of the others, as have SAP and Teradata. Now what's impressive to me here is how AWS, Microsoft, and Google are actually holding that dotted line that gray line pretty well despite their size and the other ironically interesting two data points here are Broadcom and Nutanix. Now Broadcom, of course, as we've reported and dug into, is buying VMware and, and of, of course most customers are concerned about getting hit with higher prices. Once Broadcom takes over. Well Nutanix despite its change in net scores, in a good position potentially to capture some of that VMware business. Just yesterday, I talked to a customer who told me he migrated his entire portfolio off VMware using Nutanix AHV, the Acropolis hypervisor. And that was in an effort to avoid the VTEX specifically. Now this was a smaller customer granted and it's not representative of what I feel is Broadcom's ICP the ideal customer profile, but look, Nutanix should benefit from the Broadcom acquisition. If it can position itself to pick up the business that Broadcom really doesn't want. That kind of bottom of the pyramid. One person's trash is another's treasure as they say, okay. And here's that same chart for companies >> that participate in less than three segments. So, two or one of the segments in the ETR taxonomy. Only three names are seeing positive movement year over year in net score. SUSE under the leadership of amazing CEO, Melissa Di Donato. She's making moves. The company went public last year and acquired rancher labs in 2020. Look, we know that red hat is the big dog in Kubernetes but since the IBM acquisition people have looked to SUSE as a possible alternative and it's showing up in the numbers. It's a nice business. It's going to do more than 600 million this year in revenue, SUSE that is. It's got solid double digit growth in kind of the low teens. It's profitability is under pressure but they're definitely a player that is found a niche and is worth watching. The SolarWinds, What can I say there? I mean, maybe it's a dead cat bounce coming off the major breach that we saw a couple years ago. Some of its customers maybe just can't move off the platform. Constant contact we really don't follow and don't really, you know, focus on them. So, not much to say there. Now look at all the high priced earning stocks or infinite PE stocks that have no E and divide by zero or a negative number and boom, you have infinite PE and look at how their net scores have dropped. We've reported extensively on snowflake. They're still number one as we showed you earlier, net score, but big moves off their highs. Okta, Datadog, Zscaler, SentinelOne Dynatrace, big downward moves, and you can see the rest. So this chart really speaks to the change in expectations from the COVID bubble. Despite the fact that many of these companies CFOs would tell you that the pandemic wasn't necessarily a tailwind for them, but it certainly seemed to be the case when you look back in some of the ETR data. But a big question in the community is what's going to happen to these tech stocks, these tech companies in the market? We reached out to both Eric Bradley of ETR who used to be a technical analyst on Wall Street, and the long time trader and breaking analysis contributor, Chip Symington to get a read on what they thought. First, you know the market >> first point of the market has been off 11 out of the past 12 weeks. And bare market rallies like what we're seeing today and yesterday, they happen from time to time and it was kind of expected. Chair Powell's testimony was broadly viewed as a positive by the street because higher interest rates appear to be pushing commodity prices down. And a weaker consumer sentiment may point to a less onerous inflation outlook. That's good for the market. Chip Symington pointed out to breaking analysis a while ago that the NASDAQ has been on a trend line for the past six months where its highs are lower and the lows are lower and that's a bad sign. And we're bumping up against that trend line here. Meaning if it breaks through that trend it could be a buying signal. As he feels that tech stocks are oversold. He pointed to a recent bounce in semiconductors and cited the Qualcomm example. Here's a company trading at 12 times forward earnings with a sustained 14% growth rate over the next couple of years. And their cash flow is able to support their 2.4, 2% annual dividend. So overall Symington feels this rally was absolutely expected. He's cautious because we're still in a bear market but he's beginning to, to turn bullish. And Eric Bradley added that He feels the market is building a base here and he doesn't expect a 1970s or early 1980s year long sideways move because of all the money that's still in the system. You know, but it could bounce around for several months And remember with higher interest rates there are going to be more options other than equities which for many years has not been the case. Obviously inflation and recession. They are like two looming towers that we're all watching closely and will ultimately determine if, when, and how this market turns around. Okay, that's it for today. Thanks to my colleagues, Stephanie Chan, who helps research breaking analysis topics sometimes, and Alex Myerson who is on production in the podcast. Kristin Martin and Cheryl Knight they help get the word out and do all of our newsletters. And Rob Hof is our Editor in Chief over at siliconangle.com and does some wonderful editing for breaking analysis. Thank you. Remember, all these episodes are available as podcasts wherever you listen. All you got to do is search breaking analysis podcasts. I publish each week on wikibon.com and Siliconangle.com. And of course you can reach me by email at david.vellante@siliconangle.com or DM me at DVellante comment on my LinkedIn post and please do check out etr.ai for the best survey data in the enterprise tech business. This is Dave Vellante for the CUBE insights powered by ETR. Stay safe, be well. And we'll see you next time. (soft music)

>> From around the globe, It's theCUBE. With digital coverage of IBM Think 2021, brought to you by IBM. >> Hi, welcome back to theCUBE's coverage of IBM Think 2021 virtual. I'm John Furrier host of the CUBE. We got a great guest here. Brian Bouchard is the co-founder president and CEO of Alacrinet. Brian great to see you remoting in all the way from Puerto Rico to Palo Alto. >> That's right. >> Great to see you. >> Thanks for First of all, thanks John, for having me. I really appreciate the opportunity. >> Yeah, great to see you. Thanks for coming on. First of all, before we get into what you guys do and and how this all ties in to Think. What do you guys do at Alacrinet? Why the name? A it's good you're at the top of the list and alphabetically, but tell us the, the, the the secret behind the name and what you guys do. >> So, first of all Alacrinet is based on the root word alacrity which means a prompt and willing, a prompt a joyous prompt to, excuse me, to achieve a common goal. So we ultimately are a network of individuals with the traits of alacrity. So Alacrinet. So that's our name. >> Great. So what's your relationship with IBM and how you guys have been able to leverage the partnership program in the marketplace? Take us through the relationship. >> So, well, first of all Alacrinet is a platinum IBM business partner and it was awarded recently the 2020 IBM North American partner of the year award. And we were selected amongst 1600 other business partners across North America. We've been actually a consulting, an IT consulting company for almost 20 years now. And we were founded in 2002 in Palo Alto and we have focused specifically on cyber security since 2013. And then as part, go ahead. >> What are some of the things that you guys are working on? Because obviously, you know, the business is hot right now. Everyone's kind of looking at COVID saying we're going to double down on the most critical projects and no time for leisurely activities when it comes to IT. And cloud scale projects, you know mission critical stuff's happening what are you guys working on? >> So we're, we're focused on cybersecurity, our security services really compliment IBM's suite of security solutions and cover the full spectrum from our research and penetration testing, which helps identify vulnerabilities before a breach occurs. And we also have managed security services which helps prevent, detect and remediate attacks in real time. And then finally, we also have a security staffing division and a software resell division, which kind of rounds out the full amount of offerings that we have to provide protection for our clients. >> What are some of the biggest challenges you guys have as a business, and how's IBM helping you address those? >> Well, as you know, John, we all know the importance of cybersecurity in today's world, right? So it's increasing in both demand and importance and it's not expected to wane anytime soon. Cyber attacks are on the rise and there's no there's no expected end in sight to this. And in fact, just this week on 60 minutes, Jay Powell, the chairman of the federal reserve board he noted that cyber attacks were the number one threat to the stability of the US economy. Also this week, a public school in Buffalo New York was hacked with ransomware and the school you know, this, the school district is just contemplating you know, paying the ransom to the hackers. So there's literally thousands of these attacks happening every day, whether it's in local school district or a state government, or an enterprise even if you don't hear about them, they're happening In adding to the complexity that the cyber attackers pose is the complexity of the actual cybersecurity tools themselves. There isn't a single solution provider or a single technology, that can ensure a company's security. Our customers need to work with many different companies and disconnected tools and processes to build an individual strategy that can adequately protect their organizations. >> You know, I love this conversation whenever I talk to practitioners on cybersecurity, you know that first of all, they're super smart, usually cyber punks and they also have some kinds of eclectic backgrounds, but more importantly is that there's different approaches in terms of what you hear. Do you, do you put more if you add more firefighters, so to speak to put out the fires and solve the problems? Or do you spend your time preventing the fires from happening in the first place? You know, and you know, the buildings are burning down don't make fire fire, don't make wood make fire resistance, you know, more of a priority. So there's less fires needing firefighters So it's that balance. You throw more firefighters at the problem or do you make the supply or the material the business fireproof, what's your take on that? >> Yeah, well, it kind of works both ways. I mean, we've seen customers want it. They really want choice. They want to, in some cases they want to be the firefighter. And in some cases they want the firefighter to come in and solve their problems. So, the common problem set that we're seeing with our that our customers encounter is that they struggle one, with too many disparate tools. And then they also have too much data being collected by all these disparate tools. And then they have a lack of talent in their environment to manage their environments. So what we've done at Alacrinet is we've taken our cybersecurity practice and we've really specifically tailored our offerings to address these core challenges. So first, to address the too many disparate tools problem, we've been recommending that our clients look at security platforms like the IBM Cloud Pak for security the IBM Cloud Pak for security is built on a security platform that allows interoperability across various security tools using open standards. So our customers have been responding extremely positively to this approach and look at it as a way to future-proof their investments and begin taking advantage of interoperability with, and, tools integration. >> How about where you see your business going with this because, you know, there's not a shortage of need or demand How are you guys flexing with the market? What's the strategy? Are you going to use technology enablement? You're going to more human driven. Brian, how do you see your business unfolding? >> Well, actually really good. We're doing very well. I mean, obviously we made the, the top the business partner for IBM in 2020. They have some significant growth and a lot of interest. I think we really attack the market in a, in a with a good strategy which was to help defragment the market if you will. There's a lot of point solutions and a lot of point vendors that various, you know, they they spent specialized in one piece of the whole problem. And what we've decided to do is find them the highest priority list, every CSO and CIO has a tick list. So that how that, you know, first thing we need we need a SIM, we need an EDR, we need a managed service. We need, what's the third solution that we're doing? So we, we need some new talent in-house. So we actually have added that as well. So we added a security staffing division to help that piece of it as well. So to give you an idea of the cybersecurity market size it was valued at 150 billion in 2019 and that is expected to grow to 300 billion by 2027. And Alacrinet is well-positioned to consolidate the many fragmented aspects of the security marketplace and offer our customers more integrated and easier to manage solutions. And we will continue to help our customers select the best suite of solutions to address all types of cybersecurity, cybersecurity threats. >> You know, it's it's such a really important point you're making because you know, the tools just have piled up in the tool shed. I call it like that. It's like, it's like you don't even know what's in there anymore. And then you've got to support them. Then the world's changed. You get cloud native, the service areas increasing and then the CSOs are also challenged. Do I, how many CLAWs do I build on? Do I optimize my development teams for AWS or Azure? I mean, now that's kind of a factor. So, you have all this tooling going on they're building their own stuff they're building their own core competency. And yet the CSO still needs to be like maintaining kind of like a relevance list. That's almost like a a stock market for the for the products. You're providing that it sounds like you're providing that kind of service as well, right? >> Yeah, well, we, we distill all of the products that are out there. There's thousands of cybersecurity products out there in the marketplace and we kind of do all that distillation for the customer. We find using, you know, using a combination of things. We use Forrester and Gartner and all the market analysts to shortlist our proposed solutions that we offer customers. But then we also use our experience. And so since 2013, we've been deploying these solutions across organizations and corporations across America and we've, we've gained a large body of experience and we can take that experience and knowledge to our customers and help them, you know, make make some good decisions. So they don't have to, you know, make them go through the pitfalls that many companies do when selecting these types of solutions. >> Well congratulations, you've got a great business and you know, that's just a basic search making things easier for the CSO, more so they can be safe and secure in their environment. It's funny, you know, cyber warfare, you know the private companies have to fight their own battles got to build their own armies. Certainly the government's not helping them. And then they're confused even with how to handle all this stuff. So they need, they need your service. I'm just curious as this continues to unfold and you start to see much more of a holistic view, what's the IBM angle in here? How, why are you such a big partner of theirs? Is it because their customers are working with you they're bringing you into business? Is it because you have an affinity towards some of their products? What's the connection with IBM? >> All of the above. (chuckles) So I think it probably started with our affinity to IBM QRadar product. And we have, we have a lot of expertise in that and that solution. So that's, that's where it started. And then I think IBM's leadership in this space has been remarkable, really. So like what's happening now with the IBM Cloud Pak for security you know, building up a security platform to allow all these point solutions to work together. That's the roadmap we want to put our customers on because we believe that's the that's the future for this, this, this marketplace. >> Yeah. And the vision of hybrid cloud having that underpinning be with Red Hat it's a Linux kernel, model of all things >> Yeah. Super NetEase. >> Locked in >> It's portable, multiple, you can run it on Azure. IBM Cloud, AWS. It's portable. I mean, yeah, all this openness, as you probably know cyber security is really a laggard in the security in the information technology space as far as adopting open standards. And IBM is I think leading that charge and you'll be able to have a force multiplier with the open standards in this space. >> Open innovation with open source is incredible. I mean, if you, if, if if open source can embrace a common platform and build that kind of control plane and openness to allow thriving companies to just build out then you have an entire hybrid distributed architecture. >> Yeah. Well, I think companies want to use the best in breed. So when we, when we show these solutions to customers they want the best in breed. They always say, I don't, when it comes to security they don't want second best. They want the best it's out there because they're securing their crown jewels. So that makes sense. So the problem with, you know having all these different disparate solutions that are all top in their category none of them talk to each other. So we need to address that problem because without that being solved, this is just going to be more it's going to compound the complexity of the problems we solve day to day. >> Awesome. Congratulations, Brian, great story. You know entrepreneur built a great business over the years. I think the product's amazing. I think that's exactly what the market needs and just shows you what the ecosystem is all about. This is the power of the ecosystem. You know, a thousand flowers are blooming. You got a great product. IBM is helping as well. Good partnership, network effects built in and and still a lot more to do. Congratulations. >> Absolutely. >> Okay. >> Thank you very much >> Brian Bouchard >> Made my impression. I appreciate that >> Thanks for coming on theCUBE Appreciate it. I'm John Furrier with IBM thinks 2021 virtual coverage. Thanks for watching. (outro music plays)

>> From around the globe. It's theCUBE. With digital coverage of IBM Think 2021. Brought to you by IBM. >> Welcome back to theCUBE's ongoing coverage of IBM Think 2021. The virtual cube. You know, the pandemic has caused us to really rethink this whole concept of operational resilience. So we're going to dig into that and talk about the importance of constructing a holistic resilience plan and get the perspective of some really great domain experts. Allen Downs is the Vice President in Global Cloud Security and Resiliency Services at IBM. And he's joined by Ms. Michelle Weston who is the Director of Cloud Security and Resiliency Offerings at IBM. Folks, welcome to theCUBE. Thanks for coming on. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Now, before we get into it, I said, IBM, but I want to ask you Allen, about an announcement you made last month about Kyndryl, new spinout from IBM. What can you tell us? >> Very excited about the name. I think there's a lot of meaning in the name censored around new growth and censored around partnership and relationship. So if you look at the name that was announced, I think it really does typify what we set out to be as a trusted partner in the industry. All born around new growth, censored around strong partnership and relationship. So very pleased and excited. I look forward to the opportunity we have going forward. >> Yeah. Congratulations on that. Add some clarity, Martin Schroeder, new CEO, Cube alum, great exec. Love it. So good luck. Allen, let me stay with you for a second. I mean, operational resilience it means different things to different people. And we know from speaking with CIOs in our community during the pandemic, it doesn't just mean Disaster Recovery. In fact, a lot of CIO said that their business continuing strategy were too focused on DR. Allen, what does operational resilience mean from your perspective? >> So I'll answer it this way. Operational resiliency risk is defined as the quantifiable steps is defined as the quantifiable steps that any client needs to take in order to respond, recover from an unplanned outage. It sits squarely within operational risk and if you think about it operational risk is the kind of non-financial element of risk and defined within that category, operational resiliency risk is trying to identify those steps, trying to identify those steps, both preactive and reactive both preactive and reactive that a client needs to consider that they would have to take in the event of an unplanned disruption or an unplanned outage that would impact their ability to serve their clients or to serve their organization. That's how I define operational resiliency risk. >> Great. And I wonder Michelle if you can add to that, but I think, you know, I sometimes say that the pandemic was like a forced march to digital and part of that was business resilience but you know, where do we go from here? You know, we had 14 months shoved into our face and now we have some time to think about. So how should clients think about evolving their strategies in this regard? >> Yeah, well certainly with respect to what was called NewCo now, Kyndryl, our approach has been advisory-led. We will help clients along this journey. One thing that I'd like to point out and one of the journeys that we've been taking over the last couple of years is it really is about security and resiliency together. If you think of that planning and how to mitigate your operational risk, if the security and resiliency go hand in hand, they're the same people within the organization that are planning for that and worried about it. And so we had already started about three years ago to pull the two together and to have a unified value proposition for clients around security and resiliency both being advisory-led doing everything for a client from project-based to the digital consumption world, which we know clients live in today to a fully managed service all around security and resiliency together. >> Yeah. So, I mean, it's a really important topic. I mean, you heard Chair Powell last month. He was, he was on 60 Minutes saying, well, yeah, yeah. We're worried about inflation but we're way more worried about the security. So, so Allen, where, let's say you're in the virtual conference room with the board of directors, what's that conversation like? Where does it start? >> I think there is a huge concern right now with regards to security and obviously resiliency as well. But if you just think about what we've all been through and what's transpired in the last 12 months, the, what we call the threat landscape has broadened significantly. And therefore clients have had to go through a rapid transformation not just by moving employees to home base, but also their clients having a much higher expectation in terms of access to systems, access to transactions, which are all digital. So you referred to it earlier but the transformation our clients have had to go on driving a higher dependence on those systems that enable them to serve their clients digitally and enable them to and allow the employees to work remotely in this period has increased the dependencies that they have across the environment that are running many of the critical business processes. So the discussion of the boardroom is very much, are we secure? Are we safe? How do we know? How safe and secure and resilient should we be? And based on that facts about how fit, safe and secure should we be, where are we today as an organization? And I think these are the questions that are at the boardroom. It's basically from a resiliency, security perspective where should we be that supports our strategy, vision and our client expectation? And then the second question is very much, where are we today? How do we know that we are secure? How do we know that we can recover from any unplanned or unforeseen disruption to our environments? >> So Michelle, I mean Allen just mentioned the threat surface is expanding and we're just getting started. Everybody's like crazy about 5G, leaning in the Edge, IoT and that's just going to be orders of magnitude by the end of the decade compared to where it is today. So how do you think about the key steps that organizations should take to ensure operational resilience? You know, not only today, but also putting in a roadmap. >> Yeah. Yeah. And one thing that we do know from our clients is those that have actually planned for resiliency and security at the forefront. They tend to do that more effectively and more efficiently. It's much better to do that than to try to do that after an outage. You'll certainly learn a lot but that's not the experience that you want to go through. You want to have that planning and strategy in the forefront as Allen said. In terms of the threat vector, the pandemic brought that on as well. We saw a surgent of cyber attacks, opportunistic attacks. You know, we saw the best of people in the pandemic as well as the worst in people. Some of those attacks were on agencies that were trying to recover or trying to treat the public with respect to the COVID-19 pandemic. So none of us can let our guard down here. I think we can anticipate that that's only going to increase. And with the emergence of these new technologies like Cloud, we know that there's been such a massive benefit to clients. In fact those that were Cloud-enabled sustained their businesses during the pandemic. Full stop. But with that comes a lot more complexity. Those threat vectors increased, 5G, I expect to be the same. So again, resiliency and security have never been more relevant, more important. We see a lot of our clients putting budget there and those that plan for it with a strategic mindset and understand that whatever they have today may be good enough, but in the future they're going to have to invest and continue to evolve that strategy, are those that have done the best. >> Yeah. The bolt-on strategy doesn't really work that well. But, and I, and I wonder if you think about when when we talk to CSOs for example, and you ask them, what's your biggest challenge? They'll say things like lack of talent. We got too many tools. It's just as we're under the hamsters on wheels. So I would think that's, you know, unfortunately for some, but it's good for your, your business. That's a dynamic that you can help with. I mean, you're a services organization. You've got deep expertise in this. So I wonder if you could talk a little bit about that, that lack of talent that skills gap and how you guys address that. >> I think this is really the fit for managed services providers like Kyndryl. Certainly with some of our largest clients, if we look at Pettus as an example, that notion of phone a friend is really important. When it starts to go down, and you're not sure, you know, what you're going to do next, you want the expertise. You want to be able to phone someone and you want to be able to rely on them to help you recover your most critical data. One of the things clients have also been asking us for is a vaulted capability. Almost like the safe deposit box for your data and your critical applications being able to put them somewhere and then in the event of needing to recover, you certainly could call someone to help you do exactly that. >> Allen, I wonder if you could address this. I mean, I like IBM. I was, I'm a customer. I, I trust IBM, what's your relationship? Are you still going to, you know, be able to allow me to tap the pieces that I like and maybe you guys can be more agile in some respects? Maybe you could talk about that a little bit. >> Yeah, sure Dave. And many of our clients we have a long history with and a very positive experience of delivering, you know, market-leading and high, high quality of services and product. The relationship continues. So we will remain very close to IBM and we will continue to work with many of IBM's customers as well, IBM work with our customers going forward. So the relationship I believe whilst the different dynamic, will continue and I believe engenders an opportunity for growth. And, you know, we mentioned it earlier the very name signifies the fact that it's new growth. And I do think that partnership will continue and will continue together to deliver the type of service, the quality of products and services that our clients have you know, enjoyed from IBM over the last number of years. >> Michelle, I might take one of my takeaways from your earlier comments that you guys are hands on, consultative in nature. And I think about the comment I made about a lot of CIOs said we were way too, DR-focused, but when I think about DR, a lot of times it was a checkbox to the board. Hey, we got it. But when was the last time you tested it? Well, we don't test it because it's too risky to test. We do, we do fail over but we don't want to fail back because it's just too risky. Can I stress test? You know, my environment. Are we at the point now where technology and expertise will allow us to do that is that part of what you bring to the table? >> It is exactly what we bring to the table. So from a first of all, from a compliance and regulatory perspective, you no longer have that option. A lot of the auditors are asking you to demonstrate your DR plan. We have technology and I think we've talked about this before. About the automation that we have in our portfolio with resiliency orchestration that allows you to see the risk in your environment on a day-to-day basis, proactively manage it. I tried to recover this. There's a, there's a failure and then you're able to proactively address it. I also give the example from a resiliency work restoration perspective in this very powerful software automation that we have for DR. We've had clients that have come in scheduled a DR Test. It was to be all day they've ordered in lunch. And the DR Test fail over, fail back, took 22 minutes and lunch was canceled. (Dave laughs) >> I love it. >> So that is very powerful and very powerful with an auditor. >> That's awesome. Okay, guys, we got to leave it there. Really great to get the update. Best of luck to you. And congratulations. Thanks for coming on. >> Thank you. >> Thank you so much. >> All right. And thank you for watching. This is Dave Vellante for theCUBE's continuous coverage of IBM Think 2021. Be right back. (calm music)

>>from >>Around the globe. It's the cube with digital coverage of IBM think 2021 brought to you by IBM. >>Welcome back to the cubes ongoing coverage of IBM Think 2021 virtual cube, you know, the pandemic has caused us to really rethink this this whole concept of operational resilience and we're gonna dig into that and talk about the importance of constructing a holistic resilience plan and get the perspective of some really great domain experts. Alan Downs is the vice president, global Cloud security and resiliency services at IBM and he's joined by MS Michelle what? Weston who is the director of cloud security and resiliency offerings at IBM folks. Welcome to the cube. Thanks for coming on. >>Thank you. >>Now before we get into it, I said IBM but I want to ask you, alan about an announcement you made last month about Kendrell new spin out from IBM. What can you tell us? >>Very excited about the name? I think there's a lot of meaning in the name centered around new growth and censored around partnership and relationship. So if you look at the name that was announced I think it really does typify what we set out to be as a trusted partner in the industry. All born around new growth centered around strong partnership and relationship. So very pleased and excited and look forward to the opportunity we have going forward. >>Yeah congratulations on that. Had some clarity martin schroder. New ceo Cubillan. Great executive love it. So good luck. Um Alan let me stay with you for a second. I mean operational resilience it means different things to different people and we know from speaking with C. IOS in our community during the pandemic. It doesn't just mean disaster recovery. In fact a lot of C. I. O. Said that their business continuing strategy were too focused on on D. R. Ellen. What does operational resilience mean from your perspective? >>So I'll answer it this way. Operational resiliency risk is defined as the quantifiable steps that any client needs to take in order to respond, recover from an unplanned outage. It sits squarely within operational risk. And if you think about it, operational risk is the kind of non financial element of risk. And defined within that category, operational resiliency risk is trying to identify those steps both pre active and reactive that a client needs to consider that they would have to take in the event of an unplanned disruption or an unplanned outage that would impact their ability to serve their clients or to serve their organization. That's how I define operational resiliency risk. >>Great and I wonder Michelle if you can add to that but I think you know I sometimes say that the pandemic was like a forced march to digital and part of that was business resilience. But You know, where do we go from here? You know, we had 14 months shoved into our face and now we have some time to think about. So how should clients think about evolving their strategies in this regard? >>Yeah, Well, certainly with respect to what was called Newco now, Kendrell, um our approach has been advisory led. Uh we will help clients along this journey. Uh, one thing that I'd like to point out in one of the journeys that we've been taking over the last couple of years is it really is about security and resiliency together. If you think of that planning and how to mitigate your operational risk, the security and resiliency go hand in hand through the same people within the organization that are planning for that and worried about it. And so we had already started about three years ago to pull the two together and to have a unified value proposition for clients around security and resiliency, both being advisory lead, doing everything for a client from project based to the digital consumption world which we know clients live in today to a fully managed service all around security and resiliency together. >>Yeah, so I mean it's really important topic. I mean you heard Chair Powell last month. He was he was on 60 minutes saying well yeah worried about inflation, were way more worried about security. So so alan you know, were let's say you're in the virtual, you know, conference room with the board of directors. What's that conversation like? Uh where does it start? >>I think there is a huge concern right now with regard to security and obviously resiliency as well. But if you just think about what we've all been through and what's transpired in the last 12 months, the what we call the threat landscape has broadened significantly and therefore clients have had to go through a rapid transformation not just by moving employees to home base, but also their clients having a much higher expectation in terms of access to systems, access to transactions which are all digital. So you referred to it earlier. But the transformation, our clients have had to go on driving a higher dependence on those systems that enable them to serve their clients digitally and enable them to allow the employees to work remotely in this period has increased the dependencies that they have across the environment that are running many of the critical business processes. So the discussion in the boardroom is very much are we secure? Are we safe? How do we know how safe and secure and resilient should we be? And based on that fact about how safe and secure should we be? Where are we today as an organization? And I think these are the questions that are at the boardroom is basically from a resiliency security perspective, where should we be that supports our strategy vision and our client expectation? And then the second question is very much where are we today? How do we know that we are secure? How do we know that we can recover from any unplanned or unforeseen disruption to our environments? >>So Michelle, I mean I just mentioned the threat surface is expanding and we're just getting started, everybody's like crazy about five G leaning in the edge Iot and that's just uh this could be orders of magnitude by the end of the decade compared to where it is today. So how do you think about the key steps that organizations should should take to ensure operational resilience, you know, not only today, but also putting in a road map. >>Yeah, yeah. And and one thing that we do know from our clients is those that have actually planned for resiliency and security at the forefront. They tend to do that more effectively and more efficiently. Um It's much better to do that than to try to do that after an outage. You certainly learn a lot. Um but that's not the experience that you want to go through. You want to have that planning and strategy in the forefront. As Alan said in terms of the threat vector, the pandemic brought that on as well. We saw surgeons Of cyberattacks, opportunistic attacks. Um you know, we saw the best of people in the pandemic as well as the worst in people. Some of those attacks were on agencies that we're trying to recover. We're trying to treat the public with respect to the COVID-19 pandemic. So none of us can let our guard down here. I think we can anticipate that that's only going to increase. And with the emergence of these new technologies like cloud, we know that there's been such a massive benefit to clients. In fact those that were cloud enabled to sustain their businesses during the pandemic full stop. But with that comes a lot more complexity. Those threat vectors increase five G. I expect to be the same. So again, resilience and security have never been more relevant. More important, we see a lot of our clients putting budget there and those that plan for it with a strategic mindset and understand that whatever they have today may be good enough, but in the future they're going to have to invest and continue to evolve that strategy. Are those that have done the best. >>Yeah, the bolt on strategy doesn't doesn't really work that well, but and I wonder if you think about when we talk to CSOS for example, and you ask them what's your biggest challenge? They'll say things like lack of talent. We got too many tools. It's just as we're on the hamsters on wheels. So I would think that's, you know, unfortunately for some, but it's good for your, your business. That's that's a dynamic that you can help with. I mean you're a services organization, you got deep expertise in this. So I wonder if you could, could talk a little bit about that, that lack of talent, that skills gap and how you guys address that. >>I think this is really the fit for managed services providers like Kendrell, um, certainly with some of our largest clients, if we look at Peta as an example, that notion of phone a friend is really important when it starts to go down and you're not sure what you're gonna do next. You want the expertise, you want to be able to phone someone and you want to be able to rely on them to help you recover your most critical data. One of the things clients have also been asking us for is a vaulted capability, almost like the safe deposit box for your data and your critical applications. Being able to put them somewhere and then in the event of needing to recover, um, you certainly could call someone to help you do exactly that >>Ellen. I wonder if you can address this. I mean, I like IBM I was I'm a customer. I trust IBM. What's your relationship? Are you still gonna, you know, be able to allow me to tap the pieces that that I like and maybe you guys can be more agile in some respects, maybe you can talk about that a little bit. >>She has Sure, Dave and many of our clients, we have a long history with a very positive experience of delivering, you know, market leading and high high quality of services and product the relationship continue. So we will remain very close to IBM and we will continue to work with many of IBM's customers as will IBM work with our customers going forward. So the relationship, I believe whilst a different dynamic will continue and I believe engenders an opportunity for growth and you know, we mentioned earlier the very name signifies the fact that it's new growth and I do think that that partnership will continue and we'll continue together to deliver the type of service, the quality of products and services that our clients have, you know, enjoyed from IBM over the last number of years, >>Michelle my, one of my takeaway from your earlier comments as you guys are hands on consultative in nature. Um, and I think about the comment I made about a lot of Ceo said we were way too d our focus. But when I think about d are a lot of times it was a checkbox to the board. Hey, we got it. But it was last time you tested it. Well, we don't test it because it's too risky to test. You know, we, we do fail over, but we don't fail back because it's just too risky. Can I stress test, you know, my environment, we, at the point now where technology and expertise will allow us to do that is that part of what you bring to the table? >>It is exactly exactly what we bring to the table. So from a first of all, from a compliance and regulatory perspective, you no longer have that option. A lot of the auditors are asking you to demonstrate your d our plan. We have technology and I think we've talked about this before about the automation that we have in our portfolio with resiliency orchestration that allows you to see the risk in your environment on a day to day basis. Proactively manage it. I tried to recover this, there's a there's a failure and then you're able to proactively address it. I also give the example from a resiliency orchestration perspective in this very powerful software automation that we have for D. R. We've had clients that have come in scheduled A. D. R. Test, it was to be all day they've ordered in lunch And the D. R. test fail over failed back took 22 minutes and lunch was canceled. >>I love >>it. Very powerful and very powerful with an auditor. >>That's awesome. Okay guys, we've got to leave it there. Really great to get the update. Best of luck to you and congratulations. Thanks for coming on. >>Thank you so much >>and thank you for watching. This is Dave Volonte for the cubes continuous coverage of IBM think 2021 right back. >>Mhm.

>>From around the globe. It's the Cube with digital coverage of IBM think 2021 brought to you >>by IBM. Welcome back to the cubes coverage of IBM Think 2021 virtual. I'm john ferrier host of the Q. We've got a great guest here brian Bouchard, co founder president and ceo of Allah credit brian, great to see you um promoting it all the way from Puerto rico to Palo Alto. >>Great to >>see. First of all. Thanks for having me. I really appreciate the opportunity. >>Yeah great, Great to see you. Thanks for coming on. Um first of all, before we get into what you guys do and how this all ties in to think what do you guys do? It Alex Burnett, Why the name uh is good, you're at the top of the list and alphabetically, but tell us the secret behind the name and what you guys do. >>So first of all, a crochet is based on the root word alacrity, which means a prompt and will prompt a joyous prompt itude excuse me to achieve a common goal. So we ultimately our network of >>individuals with >>the traits of alacrity. So eloquent. So that's our name. >>Great. So what's your relation with IBM and how you guys been able to leverage the partnership program in the marketplace take us through the relationship >>so Well, first of all, L. A. Quartet is a platinum IBM business partner and was awarded recently the 2020 IBM north american Partner of the Year award. And we were selected among 1600 other business partners across North America. We've been actually a consulting an IT. consulting company for almost 20 years now and we were founded in 2002 in Palo Alto. And we have focused specifically on cybersecurity since 2013. What is >>Right, what are some of the things you guys are working on? Because obviously, you know, the business is hot right now, everyone's kind of looking at Covid saying we're gonna double down on the most critical projects and no time for leisurely activities when it comes to I T and cloud scale projects, you know, mission critical stuff is happening. What are you guys working on? >>So we're focused on cybersecurity. Our our security services really complement IBM suite of security solutions and cover the full spectrum from our research and penetration testing, which helps identify vulnerabilities before it reach occurs. And we also have managed security services which helps prevent detect and remediate attacks in real time. >>And then finally, we also have a security staffing division and a software resale division which kind of rounds out the full amount of offerings that we have to provide protection for our clients. >>What are some of the biggest challenges you guys have as a business and house IBM helping you address those? >>Well, as you know, john, we all know that the importance of cyber security in today's world, so it's increasing in both demand and importance and it's not expected to wait any time soon. Cyber attacks are on the rise and there's >>no >>Uh there's no expected end in sight to this and in fact just this week on 60 minutes, uh, the Jay Powell, the chairman of the Federal Reserve Board, he noted that cyber attacks were the number one threat to the stability of the US. economy. >>Also this week, >>a public school in Buffalo new york was hacked with ransomware >>and the school, this uh, >>the school district is just contemplating you're paying the ransom to the hackers. So there's literally thousands of these attacks happening every day, whether it's in a local school district or state government or an enterprise, even if you don't hear about them, they're happening. And adding to the complexity that the cyber Attackers pose is the complexity of the actual cybersecurity tools themselves. There isn't a single solution provider or single technology that could ensure a company security. Our customers need to work with many different companies and disconnected tools and processes to build an individual strategy that can adequately protect their organizations. >>You know, I love this conversation whenever I talked to practitioners, uh, cybersecurity, you know, first of all, they're super smart, usually cyber punks, and they also have some kind of eclectic background, but more importantly, is that there's different approaches in terms of what you hear. Do you do you put more if you add more firefighters so to speak, to put out the fires and solve the problems? Or do you spend your time preventing the fires from happening in the first place? You know, and you know, the buildings are burning down, Don't make a fire fire uh don't make would make fire resistance, you know, more of a priority. So there's less fires, not firefighters. So it's that balance. You throw more firefighters at the problem or do you make the supply or the material, the business fireproof? What's your take on that? >>Well, it kind of works >>both ways. I mean, we've seen customers want to, they really want choice. They >>wanna, in some >>cases they want to be the firefighter and in some cases they want the firefighter to come in and solve their problems. So >>the common problem set that we're seeing with our our customers encounter is that they struggle one with too many disparate tools and then they also have too much data being collected by all these disparate tools and then they have a lack of talent in their environment to manage their environment. So what we've done at Lacqua net is we've taken our cybersecurity practice and we've really uh specifically tailored our offerings to address these court challenges. So first to address the too many disparate tools problem, uh We've been recommending that our clients look at security platforms like the IBM cloud pack for security. The IBM cloud fax for security is built on a security platform that allows interoperability across various security tools using open standards. So our customers have been responding extremely positively to this approach and look at it as a way to future proof their investments >>and begin taking advantage of >>interoperability with >>hand tools integration. >>Talk about what you see your business going with with this because you know there's not a shortage of of need um demand. Um How are you guys flexing with the market? Uh What's the strategy are you going to use technology enablement? You're gonna more human driven brian how do you see your business of unfolding >>Well? Actually really good. We're doing very well. I mean obviously we've made the top business partner for IBM in 2020. Um we have some significant growth and a lot of interest I think we really attacked the market in a good strategy which was to help defragment the market if you will. There's a lot of point solutions and a lot of point vendors that you know they they spent uh specialize in one piece of the whole problem and what we've decided to do is find them the highest party list. Every see so and see IO has a tick list. So >>they have that >>you know uh first thing we need we need a sim we need a E. D. >>Are we need a >>managed service? We need um what's the third solution that we're doing? So we need some new talent in house. So we actually have the added that as well. So we added a security staffing uh division to help that piece of it as well. So to give you an idea of the cybersecurity market size, It was valued at 150 billion in 2019. And that is expected to grow to 300 billion by 2027. >>And Akron is well positioned to consolidate the many fragmented aspects of the security marketplace and offer our customers more integrated and easier to manage solutions. And we will continue to help our customers select the best suite of solutions to address all types of cyber security, cyber security threats. >>You know, it's such a really important point you're making because, you know, the tools just piled up in the tool shed, I call it like that, It's like, it's like you don't even know what's in there anymore and then you've got to support them, then the world's changed, get cloud native, the service area is increasing and then the CSOs are also challenged. Do I have any clouds? Do I build on? Do I optimize my development teams for AWS or Azure? Now, that's kind of a factor. So you have all this tooling going on? They're building their own stuff, they're building their own core competency. And yet the sea so still needs to be like maintaining kind of like a relevance list. That's almost like a stock market for the, for the products you're providing, that it sounds like you're providing that kind of service. >>Uh, yeah, as well. Right? We distill all of the products that are out there, there's thousands of cybersecurity products out there in the marketplace and we kind of do all that distillation for the customer we find using, you know, using a combination of things we use uh Forrester and Gartner and all the market analysts to shortlist are, are solutions that we offer customers. But then we also use our experience. And so through since 2013, we've been deploying these solutions across organizations and corporations across America and we've gained a large body of experience and we can take that experience and knowledge to our customers and help them make some good decisions. So they don't have to make them go through the pitfalls that many companies do when selecting these types of solutions. >>Well, congratulations, got a great business and uh you know, that's just a basic, starts making things easier for the sea. So more so they can be safe and secure in their environment. It's funny, you know, cyber warfare, you know the private company have to fight their own battles, going to build their own armies. Certainly the government's not helping them and they're confused even know how to handle all this stuff. So they didn't they need your service. I'm just curious as this continues to unfold and you start to see much more of a holistic view. What's the IBM angle in here? Why are you such a big partner of theirs? Is it because their customers are working with you? They're bringing you into business? Is it because you have an affinity towards some of their products? What's the connection with IBM, >>all of the above? So >>I think it probably started with our affinity to IBM P radar products and we have a we have a lot of expertise in that in that solution. Um, so >>that's that's where it >>started. And then I think I B. M. S leadership in this space has been, Yeah, >>remarkable. Really. So like what's happening now with the IBM compaq for security, building a security platform to allow all these points solutions to work together. Uh that's the road map we want to put our customers on because we believe that's the that's the future for this, this uh, this marketplace >>and the vision of hybrid cloud having that underpinning be with red hat, it's a Lennox Colonel model of >>all things you can you can run it on. Sure. I've been plowed uh aws it's portable. Yeah. All this openness, as you probably know, uh, cybersecurity is really a laggard in the security and the information technology space as far as adopting open standards and IBM is I think leading that charge and you'll be able to have a force multiplier >>uh >>with open standards in the space. >>Open innovation with open source is incredible. I mean if you if if open source can embrace a common platform and build that kind of control, playing and openness to allow thriving companies to just build out, then you have an entire hybrid distributed >>architecture. Yeah, well, I think companies want to use the best in breed. So when we, when we show these solutions to customers, they want the best in breed, they always say, I don't, when it comes to security, they don't want second best. They want the best that's out there because they're securing their crown jewels. So that makes sense. Um, so the problem is having all these different disparate solutions that are all top in their category, none of them talk to each other so we need to address that problem because without that being solved this is just going to be a more, it's going to compound the complexity of the problems we solve day to day, >>awesome, congratulations brian, great story. Um you know entrepreneur built a great business over the years um I think the products amazing, I think that's exactly what the market needs and it just shows you what the ecosystems all about. This is the power of the ecosystem. You know 1000 flowers are blooming, you got a great product. IBM is helping as well. Good partnership network effect builds in and and still a lot more to do. Congratulations. >>Absolutely. Okay thank you very much >>brian thanks >>for coming on the q appreciate it. I'm Sean Fourier with IBM thinks 2021 virtual coverage. Thanks for watching. Mhm.

>>Hello, My name is John John Sheikh from Iran Tous. Welcome to our session on new extensions for doctors CLI as we all know, containers air everywhere. Kubernetes is coming on strong and the CNC F cloud landscape slide has become a marvel to behold its complexities about to surpass that of the photo. Letha dies used to fabricate the old intel to 86 and future generations of the diagram will be built out and up into multiple dimensions using extreme ultraviolet lithography. Meanwhile, complexity is exploding and uncertainty about tools, platform details, processes and the economic viability of our companies in changing and challenging times is also increasing. Mirant ous, as you've already heard today, believes that achieving speed is critical and that speed results from balancing choice with simplicity and security. You've heard about Dr Enterprise Container Cloud, a new framework built on kubernetes, the less you deploy compliant, secure by default. Cooper nineties clusters on any infrastructure, providing a seamless self service capable cloud experience to developers. Get clusters fast, Justus, you need them, Update them seamlessly. Scale them is needed all while keeping workloads running smoothly. And you've heard how Dr Enterprise Container Cloud also provides all the day one and Day two and observe ability, tools, the integration AP ICE and Top Down Security, Identity and Secrets management to run operations efficiently. You've also heard about Lens, an open source i D for kubernetes. Aimed at speeding up the most banding, tightest inner loop of kubernetes application development. Lens beautifully meets the needs of a new class of developers who need to deal with multiple kubernetes clusters. Multiple absent project sufficiently developers who find themselves getting bogged down and seal I only coop CTL work flows and context switches into and out of them. But what about Dr Developers? They're working with the same core technologies all the time. They're accessing many of the same amenities, including Docker, engine Enterprise, Docker, Trusted registry and so on. Sure, their outer loop might be different. For example, they might be orchestrating on swarm. Many companies are our future of Swarm session talks about the ongoing appeal of swarm and Miranda's commitment to maintaining and extending the capabilities of swarm Going forward. Dr Enterprise Container Cloud can, of course, deployed doctor enterprise clusters with 100% swarm orchestration on computes just Aziza Leah's. It can provide kubernetes orchestration or mixed swarming kubernetes clusters. The problem for Dr Dev's is that nobody's given them an easy way to use kubernetes without a learning curve and without getting familiar with new tools and work flows, many of which involved buoys and are somewhat tedious for people who live on the command line and like it that way until now. In a few moments you'll meet my colleagues Chris Price and Laura Powell, who enact a little skit to introduce and demonstrate our new extended docker CLI plug in for kubernetes. That plug in offers seamless new functionality, enabling easy context management between the doctor Command Line and Dr Enterprise Clusters deployed by Dr Enterprise Container Cloud. We hope it will help Dev's work faster, help them adapt decay. TSA's they and their organizations manage platform coexistence or transition. Here's Chris and Laura, or, as we like to call them, developer A and B. >>Have you seen the new release of Docker Enterprise Container Cloud? I'm already finding it easier to manage my collection of UCP clusters. >>I'm glad it's helping you. It's great we can manage multiple clusters, but the user interface is a little bit cumbersome. >>Why is that? >>Well, if I want to use docker cli with a cluster, I need to download a client bundle from UCP and use it to create a contact. I like that. I can see what's going on, but it takes a lot of steps. >>Let me guess. Are these the steps? First you have to navigate to the web. You i for docker Enterprise Container Cloud. You need to enter your user name and password. And since the cluster you want to access is part of the demo project, you need to change projects. Then you have to choose a cluster. So you choose the first demo cluster here. Now you need to visit the U C p u I for that cluster. You can use the link in the top right corner of the page. Is that about right? >>Uh yep. >>And this takes you to the UCP you. I log in page now you can enter your user name and password again, but since you've already signed in with key cloak, you can use that instead. So that's good. Finally, you've made it to the landing page. Now you want to download a client bundle what you can do by visiting your user profile, you'll generate a new bundle called Demo and download it. Now that you have the bundle on your local machine, you can import it to create a doctor context. First, let's take a look at the context already on your machine. I can see you have the default context here. Let's import the bundle and call it demo. If we look at our context again, you can see that the demo context has been created. Now you can use the context and you'll be able to interact with your UCP cluster. Let's take a look to see if any stacks are running in the cluster. I can see you have a stack called my stack >>in >>the default name space running on Kubernetes. We can verify that by checking the UCP you I and there it iss my stack in the default name space running on Kubernetes. Let's try removing the stack just so we could be sure we're dealing with the right cluster and it disappears. As you can see. It's easy to use the Docker cli once you've created a context, but it takes quite a bit of effort to create one in the first place. Imagine? >>Yes. Imagine if you had 10 or 20 or 50 clusters toe work with. It's a management nightmare. >>Haven't you heard of the doctor Enterprise Container Cloud cli Plug in? >>No, >>I think you're going to like it. Let me show you how it works. It's already integrated with the docker cli You start off by setting it up with your container cloud Instance, all you need to get started is the base. You are all of your container cloud Instance and your user name and password. I'll set up my clothes right now. I have to enter my user name and password this one time only. And now I'm all set up. >>But what does it actually dio? >>Well, we can list all of our clusters. And as you can see, I've got the cluster demo one in the demo project and the cluster demo to in the Demo project Taking a look at the web. You I These were the same clusters we're seeing there. >>Let me check. Looks good to me. >>Now we can select one of these clusters, but let's take a look at our context before and after so we can understand how the plug in manages a context for us. As you can see, I just have my default contact stored right now, but I can easily get a context for one of our clusters. Let's try demo to the plug in says it's created a context called Container Cloud for me and it's pointing at the demo to cluster. Let's see what our context look like now and there's the container cloud context ready to go. >>That's great. But are you saying once you've run the plug in the doctor, cli just works with that cluster? >>Sure. Let me show you. I've got a doctor stack right here and it deploys WordPress. Well, the play it to kubernetes for you. Head over to the U C P u I for the cluster so you can verify for yourself. Are you ready? >>Yes. >>First I need to make sure I'm using the context >>and >>then I can deploy. And now we just have to wait for the deployment to complete. It's as easy as ever. >>You weren't lying. Can you deploy the same stack to swarm on my other clusters? >>Of course. And that should also show you how easy it is to switch between clusters. First, let's just confirm that our stack has reported as running. I've got a stack called WordPress demo in the default name space running on Kubernetes to deploy to the other cluster. First I need to select it that updates the container cloud context so I don't even need to switch contexts, since I'm already using that one. If I check again for running stacks, you can see that our WordPress stack is gone. Bring up the UCP you I on your other cluster so you can verify the deployment. >>I'm ready. >>I'll start the deployment now. It should be appearing any moment. >>I see the services starting up. That's great. It seems a lot easier than managing context manually. But how do I know which cluster I'm currently using? >>Well, you could just list your clusters like So do you see how this one has an asterisk next to its name? That means it's the currently selected cluster >>I'm sold. Where can I get the plug in? >>Just go to get hub dot com slash miran tous slash container dash cloud dash cli and follow the instructions

(water running) (upbeat music) (electric buzzing) >> Fuel up! (upbeat music) (audience clapping) (upbeat music) >> Announcer: From around the globe. It's the queue with digital coverage of DockerCon live 2020, brought to you by Docker and its ecosystem partners. >> Hello everyone, welcome to DockerCon 2020. I'm John Furrier with theCUBE I'm in our Palo Alto studios with our quarantine crew. We have a great lineup here for DockerCon 2020. Virtual event, normally it was in person face to face. I'll be with you throughout the day from an amazing lineup of content, over 50 different sessions, cube tracks, keynotes, and we've got two great co-hosts here with Docker, Jenny Burcio and Bret Fisher. We'll be with you all day today, taking you through the program, helping you navigate the sessions. I'm so excited. Jenny, this is a virtual event. We talk about this. Can you believe it? Maybe the internet gods be with us today and hope everyone's having-- >> Yes. >> Easy time getting in. Jenny, Bret, thank you for-- >> Hello. >> Being here. >> Hey. >> Hi everyone, so great to see everyone chatting and telling us where they're from. Welcome to the Docker community. We have a great day planned for you. >> Guys great job getting this all together. I know how hard it is. These virtual events are hard to pull off. I'm blown away by the community at Docker. The amount of sessions that are coming in the sponsor support has been amazing. Just the overall excitement around the brand and the opportunities given this tough times where we're in. It's super exciting again, made the internet gods be with us throughout the day, but there's plenty of content. Bret's got an amazing all day marathon group of people coming in and chatting. Jenny, this has been an amazing journey and it's a great opportunity. Tell us about the virtual event. Why DockerCon virtual. Obviously everyone's canceling their events, but this is special to you guys. Talk about DockerCon virtual this year. >> The Docker community shows up at DockerCon every year, and even though we didn't have the opportunity to do an in person event this year, we didn't want to lose the time that we all come together at DockerCon. The conversations, the amazing content and learning opportunities. So we decided back in December to make DockerCon a virtual event. And of course when we did that, there was no quarantine we didn't expect, you know, I certainly didn't expect to be delivering it from my living room, but we were just, I mean we were completely blown away. There's nearly 70,000 people across the globe that have registered for DockerCon today. And when you look at DockerCon of past right live events, really and we're learning are just the tip of the iceberg and so thrilled to be able to deliver a more inclusive global event today. And we have so much planned I think. Bret, you want to tell us some of the things that you have planned? >> Well, I'm sure I'm going to forget something 'cause there's a lot going on. But, we've obviously got interviews all day today on this channel with John and the crew. Jenny has put together an amazing set of all these speakers, and then you have the captain's on deck, which is essentially the YouTube live hangout where we just basically talk shop. It's all engineers, all day long. Captains and special guests. And we're going to be in chat talking to you about answering your questions. Maybe we'll dig into some stuff based on the problems you're having or the questions you have. Maybe there'll be some random demos, but it's basically not scripted, it's an all day long unscripted event. So I'm sure it's going to be a lot of fun hanging out in there. >> Well guys, I want to just say it's been amazing how you structured this so everyone has a chance to ask questions, whether it's informal laid back in the captain's channel or in the sessions, where the speakers will be there with their presentations. But Jenny, I want to get your thoughts because we have a site out there that's structured a certain way for the folks watching. If you're on your desktop, there's a main stage hero. There's then tracks and Bret's running the captain's tracks. You can click on that link and jump into his session all day long. He's got an amazing set of line of sleet, leaning back, having a good time. And then each of the tracks, you can jump into those sessions. It's on a clock, it'll be available on demand. All that content is available if you're on your desktop. If you're on your mobile, it's the same thing. Look at the calendar, find the session that you want. If you're interested in it, you could watch it live and chat with the participants in real time or watch it on demand. So there's plenty of content to navigate through. We do have it on a clock and we'll be streaming sessions as they happen. So you're in the moment and that's a great time to chat in real time. But there's more, Jenny, getting more out of this event. You guys try to bring together the stimulation of community. How does the participants get more out of the the event besides just consuming some of the content all day today? >> Yes, so first set up your profile, put your picture next to your chat handle and then chat. John said we have various setups today to help you get the most out of your experience are breakout sessions. The content is prerecorded, so you get quality content and the speakers and chat so you can ask questions the whole time. If you're looking for the hallway track, then definitely check out the captain's on deck channel. And then we have some great interviews all day on the queue. So set up your profile, join the conversation and be kind, right? This is a community event. Code of conduct is linked on every page at the top, and just have a great day. >> And Bret, you guys have an amazing lineup on the captain, so you have a great YouTube channel that you have your stream on. So the folks who were familiar with that can get that either on YouTube or on the site. The chat is integrated in, So you're set up, what do you got going on? Give us the highlights. What are you excited about throughout your day? Take us through your program on the captains. That's going to be probably pretty dynamic in the chat too. >> Yeah, so I'm sure we're going to have lots of, stuff going on in chat. So no cLancaerns there about, having crickets in the chat. But we're going to be basically starting the day with two of my good Docker captain friends, (murmurs) and Laura Taco. And we're going to basically start you out and at the end of this keynote, at the end of this hour and we're going to get you going and then you can maybe jump out and go to take some sessions. Maybe there's some stuff you want to check out and other sessions that you want to chat and talk with the instructors, the speakers there, and then you're going to come back to us, right? Or go over, check out the interviews. So the idea is you're hopping back and forth and throughout the day we're basically changing out every hour. We're not just changing out the guests basically, but we're also changing out the topics that we can cover because different guests will have different expertise. We're going to have some special guests in from Microsoft, talk about some of the cool stuff going on there, and basically it's captains all day long. And if you've been on my YouTube live show you've watched that, you've seen a lot of the guests we have on there. I'm lucky to just hang out with all these really awesome people around the world, so it's going to be fun. >> Awesome and the content again has been preserved. You guys had a great session on call for paper sessions. Jenny, this is good stuff. What other things can people do to make it interesting? Obviously we're looking for suggestions. Feel free to chirp on Twitter about ideas that can be new. But you guys got some surprises. There's some selfies, what else? What's going on? Any secret, surprises throughout the day. >> There are secret surprises throughout the day. You'll need to pay attention to the keynotes. Bret will have giveaways. I know our wonderful sponsors have giveaways planned as well in their sessions. Hopefully right you feel conflicted about what you're going to attend. So do know that everything is recorded and will be available on demand afterwards so you can catch anything that you miss. Most of them will be available right after they stream the initial time. >> All right, great stuff, so they've got the Docker selfie. So the Docker selfies, the hashtag is just DockerCon hashtag DockerCon. If you feel like you want to add some of the hashtag no problem, check out the sessions. You can pop in and out of the captains is kind of the cool kids are going to be hanging out with Bret and then all they'll knowledge and learning. Don't miss the keynote, the keynote should be solid. We've got chain Governor from red monk delivering a keynote. I'll be interviewing him live after his keynote. So stay with us. And again, check out the interactive calendar. All you got to do is look at the calendar and click on the session you want. You'll jump right in. Hop around, give us feedback. We're doing our best. Bret, any final thoughts on what you want to share to the community around, what you got going on the virtual event, just random thoughts? >> Yeah, so sorry we can't all be together in the same physical place. But the coolest thing about as business online, is that we actually get to involve everyone, so as long as you have a computer and internet, you can actually attend DockerCon if you've never been to one before. So we're trying to recreate that experience online. Like Jenny said, the code of conduct is important. So, we're all in this together with the chat, so try to be nice in there. These are all real humans that, have feelings just like me. So let's try to keep it cool. And, over in the Catherine's channel we'll be taking your questions and maybe playing some music, playing some games, giving away some free stuff, while you're, in between sessions learning, oh yeah. >> And I got to say props to your rig. You've got an amazing setup there, Bret. I love what your show, you do. It's really bad ass and kick ass. So great stuff. Jenny sponsors ecosystem response to this event has been phenomenal. The attendance 67,000. We're seeing a surge of people hitting the site now. So if you're not getting in, just, Wade's going, we're going to crank through the queue, but the sponsors on the ecosystem really delivered on the content side and also the sport. You want to share a few shout outs on the sponsors who really kind of helped make this happen. >> Yeah, so definitely make sure you check out the sponsor pages and you go, each page is the actual content that they will be delivering. So they are delivering great content to you. So you can learn and a huge thank you to our platinum and gold authors. >> Awesome, well I got to say, I'm super impressed. I'm looking forward to the Microsoft Amazon sessions, which are going to be good. And there's a couple of great customer sessions there. I tweeted this out last night and let them get you guys' reaction to this because there's been a lot of talk around the COVID crisis that we're in, but there's also a positive upshot to this is Cambridge and explosion of developers that are going to be building new apps. And I said, you know, apps aren't going to just change the world, they're going to save the world. So a lot of the theme here is the impact that developers are having right now in the current situation. If we get the goodness of compose and all the things going on in Docker and the relationships, this real impact happening with the developer community. And it's pretty evident in the program and some of the talks and some of the examples. how containers and microservices are certainly changing the world and helping save the world, your thoughts. >> Like you said, a number of sessions and interviews in the program today that really dive into that. And even particularly around COVID, Clement Beyondo is sharing his company's experience, from being able to continue operations in Italy when they were completely shut down beginning of March. We have also in theCUBE channel several interviews about from the national Institute of health and precision cancer medicine at the end of the day. And you just can really see how containerization and developers are moving in industry and really humanity forward because of what they're able to build and create, with advances in technology. >> Yeah and the first responders and these days is developers. Bret compose is getting a lot of traction on Twitter. I can see some buzz already building up. There's huge traction with compose, just the ease of use and almost a call for arms for integrating into all the system language libraries, I mean, what's going on with compose? I mean, what's the captain say about this? I mean, it seems to be really tracking in terms of demand and interest. >> I think we're over 700,000 composed files on GitHub. So it's definitely beyond just the standard Docker run commands. It's definitely the next tool that people use to run containers. Just by having that we just buy, and that's not even counting. I mean that's just counting the files that are named Docker compose YAML. So I'm sure a lot of you out there have created a YAML file to manage your local containers or even on a server with Docker compose. And the nice thing is is Docker is doubling down on that. So we've gotten some news recently, from them about what they want to do with opening the spec up, getting more companies involved because compose is already gathered so much interest from the community. You know, AWS has importers, there's Kubernetes importers for it. So there's more stuff coming and we might just see something here in a few minutes. >> All right, well let's get into the keynote guys, jump into the keynote. If you missing anything, come back to the stream, check out the sessions, check out the calendar. Let's go, let's have a great time. Have some fun, thanks and enjoy the rest of the day we'll see you soon. (upbeat music) (upbeat music) >> Okay, what is the name of that Whale? >> Molly. >> And what is the name of this Whale? >> Mobby. >> That's right, dad's got to go, thanks bud. >> Bye. >> Bye. Hi, I'm Scott Johnson, CEO of Docker and welcome to DockerCon 2020. This year DockerCon is an all virtual event with more than 60,000 members of the Docker Community joining from around the world. And with the global shelter in place policies, we're excited to offer a unifying, inclusive virtual community event in which anyone and everyone can participate from their home. As a company, Docker has been through a lot of changes since our last DockerCon last year. The most important starting last November, is our refocusing 100% on developers and development teams. As part of that refocusing, one of the big challenges we've been working on, is how to help development teams quickly and efficiently get their app from code to cloud And wouldn't it be cool, if developers could quickly deploy to the cloud right from their local environment with the commands and workflow they already know. We're excited to give you a sneak preview of what we've been working on. And rather than slides, we thought we jumped right into the product. And joining me demonstrate some of these cool new features, is enclave your DACA. One of our engineers here at Docker working on Docker compose. Hello Lanca. >> Hello. >> We're going to show how an application development team collaborates using Docker desktop and Docker hub. And then deploys the app directly from the Docker command line to the clouds in just two commands. A development team would use this to quickly share functional changes of their app with the product management team, with beta testers or other development teams. Let's go ahead and take a look at our app. Now, this is a web app, that randomly pulls words from the database, and assembles them into sentences. You can see it's a pretty typical three tier application with each tier implemented in its own container. We have a front end web service, a middle tier, which implements the logic to randomly pull the words from the database and assemble them and a backend database. And here you can see the database uses the Postgres official image from Docker hub. Now let's first run the app locally using Docker command line and the Docker engine in Docker desktop. We'll do a Doc compose up and you can see that it's pulling the containers from our Docker organization account. Wordsmith, inc. Now that it's up. Let's go ahead and look at local host and we'll confirm that the application is functioning as desired. So there's one sentence, let's pull and now you and you can indeed see that we are pulling random words and assembling into sentences. Now you can also see though that the look and feel is a bit dated. And so Lanca is going to show us how easy it is to make changes and share them with the rest of the team. Lanca, over to you. >> Thank you, so I have, the source code of our application on my machine and I have updated it with the latest team from DockerCon 2020. So before committing the code, I'm going to build the application locally and run it, to verify that indeed the changes are good. So I'm going to build with Docker compose the image for the web service. Now that the image has been built, I'm going to deploy it locally. Wait to compose up. We can now check the dashboard in a Docker desktop that indeed our containers are up and running, and we can access, we can open in the web browser, the end point for the web service. So as we can see, we have the latest changes in for our application. So as you can see, the application has been updated successfully. So now, I'm going to push the image that I have just built to my organization's shared repository on Docker hub. So I can do this with Docker compose push web. Now that the image has been updated in the Docker hub repository, or my teammates can access it and check the changes. >> Excellent, well, thank you Lanca. Now of course, in these times, video conferencing is the new normal, and as great as it is, video conferencing does not allow users to actually test the application. And so, to allow us to have our app be accessible by others outside organizations such as beta testers or others, let's go ahead and deploy to the cloud. >> Sure we, can do this by employing a context. A Docker context, is a mechanism that we can use to target different platforms for deploying containers. The context we hold, information as the endpoint for the platform, and also how to authenticate to it. So I'm going to list the context that I have set locally. As you can see, I'm currently using the default context that is pointing to my local Docker engine. So all the commands that I have issued so far, we're targeting my local engine. Now, in order to deploy the application on a cloud. I have an account in the Azure Cloud, where I have no resource running currently, and I have created for this account, dedicated context that will hold the information on how to connect it to it. So now all I need to do, is to switch to this context, with Docker context use, and the name of my cloud context. So all the commands that I'm going to run, from now on, are going to target the cloud platform. So we can also check very, more simpler, in a simpler way we can check the running containers with Docker PS. So as we see no container is running in my cloud account. Now to deploy the application, all I need to do is to run a Docker compose up. And this will trigger the deployment of my application. >> Thanks Lanca. Now notice that Lanca did not have to move the composed file from Docker desktop to Azure. Notice you have to make any changes to the Docker compose file, and nor did she change any of the containers that she and I were using locally in our local environments. So the same composed file, same images, run locally and upon Azure without changes. While the app is deploying to Azure, let's highlight some of the features in Docker hub that helps teams with remote first collaboration. So first, here's our team's account where it (murmurs) and you can see the updated container sentences web that Lanca just pushed a couple of minutes ago. As far as collaboration, we can add members using their Docker ID or their email, and then we can organize them into different teams depending on their role in the application development process. So and then Lancae they're organized into different teams, we can assign them permissions, so that teams can work in parallel without stepping on each other's changes accidentally. For example, we'll give the engineering team full read, write access, whereas the product management team will go ahead and just give read only access. So this role based access controls, is just one of the many features in Docker hub that allows teams to collaboratively and quickly develop applications. Okay Lanca, how's our app doing? >> Our app has been successfully deployed to the cloud. So, we can easily check either the Azure portal to verify the containers running for it or simpler we can run a Docker PS again to get the list with the containers that have been deployed for it. In the output from the Docker PS, we can see an end point that we can use to access our application in the web browser. So we can see the application running in clouds. It's really up to date and now we can take this particular endpoint and share it within our organization such that anybody can have a look at it. >> That's cool Onka. We showed how we can deploy an app to the cloud in minutes and just two commands, and using commands that Docker users already know, thanks so much. In that sneak preview, you saw a team developing an app collaboratively, with a tool chain that includes Docker desktop and Docker hub. And simply by switching Docker context from their local environment to the cloud, deploy that app to the cloud, to Azure without leaving the command line using Docker commands they already know. And in doing so, really simplifying for development team, getting their app from code to cloud. And just as important, what you did not see, was a lot of complexity. You did not see cloud specific interfaces, user management or security. You did not see us having to provision and configure compute networking and storage resources in the cloud. And you did not see infrastructure specific application changes to either the composed file or the Docker images. And by simplifying a way that complexity, these new features help application DevOps teams, quickly iterate and get their ideas, their apps from code to cloud, and helping development teams, build share and run great applications, is what Docker is all about. A Docker is able to simplify for development teams getting their app from code to cloud quickly as a result of standards, products and ecosystem partners. It starts with open standards for applications and application artifacts, and active open source communities around those standards to ensure portability and choice. Then as you saw in the demo, the Docker experience delivered by Docker desktop and Docker hub, simplifies a team's collaborative development of applications, and together with ecosystem partners provides every stage of an application development tool chain. For example, deploying applications to the cloud in two commands. What you saw on the demo, well that's an extension of our strategic partnership with Microsoft, which we announced yesterday. And you can learn more about our partnership from Amanda Silver from Microsoft later today, right here at DockerCon. Another tool chain stage, the capability to scan applications for security and vulnerabilities, as a result of our partnership with Sneak, which we announced last week. You can learn more about that partnership from Peter McKay, CEO Sneak, again later today, right here at DockerCon. A third example, development team can automate the build of container images upon a simple get push, as a result of Docker hub integrations with GitHub and Alaska and Bitbucket. As a final example of Docker and the ecosystem helping teams quickly build applications, together with our ISV partners. We offer in Docker hub over 500 official and verified publisher images of ready to run Dockerized application components such as databases, load balancers, programming languages, and much more. Of course, none of this happens without people. And I would like to take a moment to thank four groups of people in particular. First, the Docker team, past and present. We've had a challenging 12 months including a restructuring and then a global pandemic, and yet their support for each other, and their passion for the product, this community and our customers has never been stronger. We think our community, Docker wouldn't be Docker without you, and whether you're one of the 50 Docker captains, they're almost 400 meetup organizers, the thousands of contributors and maintainers. Every day you show up, you give back, you teach new support. We thank our users, more than six and a half million developers who have built more than 7 million applications and are then sharing those applications through Docker hub at a rate of more than one and a half billion poles per week. Those apps are then run, are more than 44 million Docker engines. And finally, we thank our customers, the over 18,000 docker subscribers, both individual developers and development teams from startups to large organizations, 60% of which are outside the United States. And they spend every industry vertical, from media, to entertainment to manufacturing. healthcare and much more. Thank you. Now looking forward, given these unprecedented times, we would like to offer a challenge. While it would be easy to feel helpless and miss this global pandemic, the challenge is for us as individuals and as a community to instead see and grasp the tremendous opportunities before us to be forces for good. For starters, look no further than the pandemic itself, in the fight against this global disaster, applications and data are playing a critical role, and the Docker Community quickly recognize this and rose to the challenge. There are over 600 COVID-19 related publicly available projects on Docker hub today, from data processing to genome analytics to data visualization folding at home. The distributed computing project for simulating protein dynamics, is also available on Docker hub, and it uses spirit compute capacity to analyze COVID-19 proteins to aid in the design of new therapies. And right here at DockerCon, you can hear how Clemente Biondo and his company engineering in Gagne area Informatica are using Docker in the fight with COVID-19 in Italy every day. Now, in addition to fighting the pandemic directly, as a community, we also have an opportunity to bridge the disruption the pandemic is wreaking. It's impacting us at work and at home in every country around the world and every aspect of our lives. For example, many of you have a student at home, whose world is going to be very different when they returned to school. As employees, all of us have experienced the stresses from working from home as well as many of the benefits and in fact 75% of us say that going forward, we're going to continue to work from home at least occasionally. And of course one of the biggest disruptions has been job losses, over 35 million in the United States alone. And we know that's affected many of you. And yet your skills are in such demand and so important now more than ever. And that's why here at DockerCon, we want to try to do our part to help, and we're promoting this hashtag on Twitter, hashtag DockerCon jobs, where job seekers and those offering jobs can reach out to one another and connect. Now, pandemics disruption is accelerating the shift of more and more of our time, our priorities, our dollars from offline to online to hybrid, and even online only ways of living. We need to find new ways to collaborate, new approaches to engage customers, new modes for education and much more. And what is going to fill the needs created by this acceleration from offline, online? New applications. And it's this need, this demand for all these new applications that represents a great opportunity for the Docker community of developers. The world needs us, needs you developers now more than ever. So let's seize this moment. Let us in our teams, go build share and run great new applications. Thank you for joining today. And let's have a great DockerCon. >> Okay, welcome back to the DockerCon studio headquarters in your hosts, Jenny Burcio and myself John Furrier. u@farrier on Twitter. If you want to tweet me anything @DockerCon as well, share what you're thinking. Great keynote there from Scott CEO. Jenny, demo DockerCon jobs, some highlights there from Scott. Yeah, I love the intro. It's okay I'm about to do the keynote. The little green room comes on, makes it human. We're all trying to survive-- >> Let me answer the reality of what we are all doing with right now. I had to ask my kids to leave though or they would crash the whole stream but yes, we have a great community, a large community gather gathered here today, and we do want to take the opportunity for those that are looking for jobs, are hiring, to share with the hashtag DockerCon jobs. In addition, we want to support direct health care workers, and Bret Fisher and the captains will be running a all day charity stream on the captain's channel. Go there and you'll get the link to donate to directrelief.org which is a California based nonprofit, delivering and aid and supporting health care workers globally response to the COVID-19 crisis. >> Okay, if you jumping into the stream, I'm John Farrie with Jenny Webby, your hosts all day today throughout DockerCon. It's a packed house of great content. You have a main stream, theCUBE which is the mainstream that we'll be promoting a lot of cube interviews. But check out the 40 plus sessions underneath in the interactive calendar on dockercon.com site. Check it out, they're going to be live on a clock. So if you want to participate in real time in the chat, jump into your session on the track of your choice and participate with the folks in there chatting. If you miss it, it's going to go right on demand right after sort of all content will be immediately be available. So make sure you check it out. Docker selfie is a hashtag. Take a selfie, share it. Docker hashtag Docker jobs. If you're looking for a job or have openings, please share with the community and of course give us feedback on what you can do. We got James Governor, the keynote coming up next. He's with Red monk. Not afraid to share his opinion on open source on what companies should be doing, and also the evolution of this Cambrin explosion of apps that are going to be coming as we come out of this post pandemic world. A lot of people are thinking about this, the crisis and following through. So stay with us for more and more coverage. Jenny, favorite sessions on your mind for people to pay attention to that they should (murmurs)? >> I just want to address a few things that continue to come up in the chat sessions, especially breakout sessions after they play live and the speakers in chat with you, those go on demand, they are recorded, you will be able to access them. Also, if the screen is too small, there is the button to expand full screen, and different quality levels for the video that you can choose on your end. All the breakout sessions also have closed captioning, so please if you would like to read along, turn that on so you can, stay with the sessions. We have some great sessions, kicking off right at 10:00 a.m, getting started with Docker. We have a full track really in the how to enhance on that you should check out devs in action, hear what other people are doing and then of course our sponsors are delivering great content to you all day long. >> Tons of content. It's all available. They'll always be up always on at large scale. Thanks for watching. Now we got James Governor, the keynote. He's with Red Monk, the analyst firm and has been tracking open source for many generations. He's been doing amazing work. Watch his great keynote. I'm going to be interviewing him live right after. So stay with us and enjoy the rest of the day. We'll see you back shortly. (upbeat music) >> Hi, I'm James Governor, one of the co-founders of a company called RedMonk. We're an industry research firm focusing on developer led technology adoption. So that's I guess why Docker invited me to DockerCon 2020 to talk about some trends that we're seeing in the world of work and software development. So Monk Chips, that's who I am. I spent a lot of time on Twitter. It's a great research tool. It's a great way to find out what's going on with keep track of, as I say, there's people that we value so highly software developers, engineers and practitioners. So when I started talking to Docker about this event and it was pre Rhona, should we say, the idea of a crowd wasn't a scary thing, but today you see something like this, it makes you feel uncomfortable. This is not a place that I want to be. I'm pretty sure it's a place you don't want to be. And you know, to that end, I think it's interesting quote by Ellen Powell, she says, "Work from home is now just work" And we're going to see more and more of that. Organizations aren't feeling the same way they did about work before. Who all these people? Who is my cLancaern? So GitHub says has 50 million developers right on its network. Now, one of the things I think is most interesting, it's not that it has 50 million developers. Perhaps that's a proxy for number of developers worldwide. But quite frankly, a lot of those accounts, there's all kinds of people there. They're just Selena's. There are data engineers, there are data scientists, there are product managers, there were tech marketers. It's a big, big community and it goes way beyond just software developers itself. Frankly for me, I'd probably be saying there's more like 20 to 25 million developers worldwide, but GitHub knows a lot about the world of code. So what else do they know? One of the things they know is that world of code software and opensource, is becoming increasingly global. I get so excited about this stuff. The idea that there are these different software communities around the planet where we're seeing massive expansions in terms of things like open source. Great example is Nigeria. So Nigeria more than 200 million people, right? The energy there in terms of events, in terms of learning, in terms of teaching, in terms of the desire to code, the desire to launch businesses, desire to be part of a global software community is just so exciting. And you know, these, this sort of energy is not just in Nigeria, it's in other countries in Africa, it's happening in Egypt. It's happening around the world. This energy is something that's super interesting to me. We need to think about that. We've got global that we need to solve. And software is going to be a big part of that. At the moment, we can talk about other countries, but what about frankly the gender gap, the gender issue that, you know, from 1984 onwards, the number of women taking computer science degrees began to, not track but to create in comparison to what men were doing. The tech industry is way too male focused, there are men that are dominant, it's not welcoming, we haven't found ways to have those pathways and frankly to drive inclusion. And the women I know in tech, have to deal with the massively disproportionate amount of stress and things like online networks. But talking about online networks and talking about a better way of living, I was really excited by get up satellite recently, was a fantastic demo by Alison McMillan and she did a demo of a code spaces. So code spaces is Microsoft online ID, new platform that they've built. And online IDs, we're never quite sure, you know, plenty of people still out there just using the max. But, visual studio code has been a big success. And so this idea of moving to one online IDE, it's been around that for awhile. What they did was just make really tight integration. So you're in your GitHub repo and just be able to create a development environment with effectively one click, getting rid of all of the act shaving, making it super easy. And what I loved was it the demo, what Ali's like, yeah cause this is great. One of my kids are having a nap, I can just start (murmurs) and I don't have to sort out all the rest of it. And to me that was amazing. It was like productivity as inclusion. I'm here was a senior director at GitHub. They're doing this amazing work and then making this clear statement about being a parent. And I think that was fantastic. Because that's what, to me, importantly just working from home, which has been so challenging for so many of us, began to open up new possibilities, and frankly exciting possibilities. So Alley's also got a podcast parent-driven development, which I think is super important. Because this is about men and women rule in this together show parenting is a team sport, same as software development. And the idea that we should be thinking about, how to be more productive, is super important to me. So I want to talk a bit about developer culture and how it led to social media. Because you know, your social media, we're in this ad bomb stage now. It's TikTok, it's like exercise, people doing incredible back flips and stuff like that. Doing a bunch of dancing. We've had the world of sharing cat gifts, Facebook, we sort of see social media is I think a phenomenon in its own right. Whereas the me, I think it's interesting because it's its progenitors, where did it come from? So here's (murmurs) So 1971, one of the features in the emergency management information system, that he built, which it's topical, it was for medical tracking medical information as well, medical emergencies, included a bulletin board system. So that it could keep track of what people were doing on a team and make sure that they were collaborating effectively, boom! That was the start of something big, obviously. Another day I think is worth looking at 1983, Sorania Pullman, spanning tree protocol. So at DEC, they were very good at distributed systems. And the idea was that you can have a distributed system and so much of the internet working that we do today was based on radius work. And then it showed that basically, you could span out a huge network so that everyone could collaborate. That is incredibly exciting in terms of the trends, that I'm talking about. So then let's look at 1988, you've got IRC. IRC what developer has not used IRC, right. Well, I guess maybe some of the other ones might not have. But I don't know if we're post IRC yet, but (murmurs) at a finished university, really nailed it with IRC as a platform that people could communicate effectively with. And then we go into like 1991. So we've had IRC, we've had finished universities, doing a lot of really fantastic work about collaboration. And I don't think it was necessarily an accident that this is where the line is twofold, announced Linux. So Linux was a wonderfully packaged, idea in terms of we're going to take this Unix thing. And when I say package, what a package was the idea that we could collaborate on software. So, it may have just been the work of one person, but clearly what made it important, made it interesting, was finding a social networking pattern, for software development so that everybody could work on something at scale. That was really, I think, fundamental and foundational. Now I think it's important, We're going to talk about Linus, to talk about some things that are not good about software culture, not good about open source culture, not good about hacker culture. And that's where I'm going to talk about code of conduct. We have not been welcoming to new people. We got the acronyms, JFTI, We call people news, that's super unhelpful. We've got to find ways to be more welcoming and more self-sustaining in our communities, because otherwise communities will fail. And I'd like to thank everyone that has a code of conduct and has encouraged others to have codes of conduct. We need to have codes of conduct that are enforced to ensure that we have better diversity at our events. And that's what women, underrepresented minorities, all different kinds of people need to be well looked off to and be in safe and inclusive spaces. And that's the online events. But of course it's also for all of our activities offline. So Linus, as I say, I'm not the most charming of characters at all time, but he has done some amazing technology. So we got to like 2005 the creation of GIT. Not necessarily the distributed version control system that would win. But there was some interesting principles there, and they'd come out of the work that he had done in terms of trying to build and sustain the Linux code base. So it was very much based on experience. He had an itch that he needed to scratch and there was a community that was this building, this thing. So what was going to be the option, came up with Git foundational to another huge wave of social change, frankly get to logical awesome. April 20 April, 2008 GitHub, right? GiHub comes up, they've looked at Git, they've packaged it up, they found a way to make it consumable so the teams could use it and really begin to take advantage of the power of that distributed version control model. Now, ironically enough, of course they centralized the service in doing so. So we have a single point of failure on GitHub. But on the other hand, the notion of the poll request, the primitives that they established and made usable by people, that changed everything in terms of software development. I think another one that I'd really like to look at is Slack. So Slack is a huge success used by all different kinds of businesses. But it began specifically as a pivot from a company called Glitch. It was a game company and they still wanted, a tool internally that was better than IRC. So they built out something that later became Slack. So Slack 2014, is established as a company and basically it was this Slack fit software engineering. The focus on automation, the conversational aspects, the asynchronous aspects. It really pulled things together in a way that was interesting to software developers. And I think we've seen this pattern in the world, frankly, of the last few years. Software developers are influences. So Slack first used by the engineering teams, later used by everybody. And arguably you could say the same thing actually happened with Apple. Apple was mainstreamed by developers adopting that platform. Get to 2013, boom again, Solomon Hikes, Docker, right? So Docker was, I mean containers were not new, they were just super hard to use. People found it difficult technology, it was Easter Terek. It wasn't something that they could fully understand. Solomon did an incredible job of understanding how containers could fit into modern developer workflows. So if we think about immutable images, if we think about the ability to have everything required in the package where you are, it really tied into what people were trying to do with CICD, tied into microservices. And certainly the notion of sort of display usability Docker nailed that, and I guess from this conference, at least the rest is history. So I want to talk a little bit about, scratching the itch. And particularly what has become, I call it the developer authentic. So let's go into dark mode now. I've talked about developers laying out these foundations and frameworks that, the mainstream, frankly now my son, he's 14, he (murmurs) at me if I don't have dark mode on in an application. And it's this notion that developers, they have an aesthetic, it does get adopted I mean it's quite often jokey. One of the things we've seen in the really successful platforms like GitHub, Docker, NPM, let's look at GitHub. Let's look at over that Playfulness. I think was really interesting. And that changes the world of work, right? So we've got the world of work which can be buttoned up, which can be somewhat tight. I think both of those companies were really influential, in thinking that software development, which is a profession, it's also something that can and is fun. And I think about how can we make it more fun? How can we develop better applications together? Takes me to, if we think about Docker talking about build, share and run, for me the key word is share, because development has to be a team sport. It needs to be sharing. It needs to be kind and it needs to bring together people to do more effective work. Because that's what it's all about, doing effective work. If you think about zoom, it's a proxy for collaboration in terms of its value. So we've got all of these airlines and frankly, add up that their share that add up their total value. It's currently less than Zoom. So video conferencing has become so much of how we live now on a consumer basis. But certainly from a business to business perspective. I want to talk about how we live now. I want to think about like, what will come out all of this traumatic and it is incredibly traumatic time? I'd like to say I'm very privileged. I can work from home. So thank you to all the frontline workers that are out there that they're not in that position. But overall what I'm really thinking about, there's some things that will come out of this that will benefit us as a culture. Looking at cities like Paris, Milan, London, New York, putting a new cycling infrastructure, so that people can social distance and travel outside because they don't feel comfortable on public transport. I think sort of amazing widening pavements or we can't do that. All these cities have done it literally overnight. This sort of changes is exciting. And what does come off that like, oh there are some positive aspects of the current issues that we face. So I've got a conference or I've got a community that may and some of those, I've been working on. So Katie from HashiCorp and Carla from container solutions basically about, look, what will the world look like in developer relations? Can we have developer relations without the air miles? 'Cause developer advocates, they do too much travel ends up, you know, burning them out, develop relations. People don't like to say no. They may have bosses that say, you know, I was like, Oh that corporates went great. Now we're going to roll it out worldwide to 47 cities. That's stuff is terrible. It's terrible from a personal perspective, it's really terrible from an environmental perspective. We need to travel less. Virtual events are crushing it. Microsoft just at build, right? Normally that'd be just over 10,000 people, they had 245,000 plus registrations. 40,000 of them in the last day, right? Red Hat summit, 80,000 people, IBM think 90,000 people, GitHub Crushed it as well. Like this is a more inclusive way people can dip in. They can be from all around the world. I mentioned Nigeria and how fantastic it is. Very often Nigerian developers and advocates find it hard to get visas. Why should they be shut out of events? Events are going to start to become remote first because frankly, look at it, if you're turning in those kinds of numbers, and Microsoft was already doing great online events, but they absolutely nailed it. They're going to have to ask some serious questions about why everybody should get back on a plane again. So if you're going to do remote, you've got to be intentional about it. It's one thing I've learned some exciting about GitLab. GitLab's culture is amazing. Everything is documented, everything is public, everything is transparent. Think that really clear and if you look at their principles, everything, you can't have implicit collaboration models. Everything needs to be documented and explicit, so that anyone can work anywhere and they can still be part of the team. Remote first is where we're at now, Coinbase, Shopify, even Barkley says the not going to go back to having everybody in offices in the way they used to. This is a fundamental shift. And I think it's got significant implications for all industries, but definitely for software development. Here's the thing, the last 20 years were about distributed computing, microservices, the cloud, we've got pretty good at that. The next 20 years will be about distributed work. We can't have everybody living in San Francisco and London and Berlin. The talent is distributed, the talent is elsewhere. So how are we going to build tools? Who is going to scratch that itch to build tools to make them more effective? Who's building the next generation of apps, you are, thanks.

>> connecting with thought leaders all around the world, this is a CUBE Conversation. Hi, everybody this is Dave Vellante of theCUBE, and welcome back to my CXO series. I've been running this through really since the start of the COVID-19 crisis to really understand how leaders are dealing with this pandemic. Sri Ambati is here, he's the CEO and founder of H20. Sri, it's great to see you again, thanks for coming on. >> Thank you for having us. >> Yeah, so this pandemic has obviously given people fits, no question, but it's also given opportunities for companies to kind of reassess where they are. Automation is a huge watchword, flexibility, business resiliency and people who maybe really hadn't fully leaned into things like the cloud and AI and automation are now realizing, wow, we have no choice, it's about survival. Your thought as to what you're seeing in the marketplace. >> Thanks for having us. I think first of all, kudos to the frontline health workers who have been ruthlessly saving lives across the country and the world, and what you're really doing is a fraction of what we could have done or should be doing to stay away the next big pandemic. But that apart I think, I usually tend to say BC is before COVID. So if the world was thinking about going digital after COVID-19, they have been forced to go digital and as a result, you're seeing tremendous transformation across our customers, and a lot of application to kind of go in and reinvent their business models that allow them to scale as effortlessly as they could using the digital means. >> So, think about, doctors and diagnosis machines, in some cases, are helping doctors make diagnoses, they're sometimes making even better diagnosis, (mumbles) is informing. There's been a lot of talk about the models, you know how... Yeah, I know you've been working with a lot of healthcare organizations, you may probably familiar with that, you know, the Medium post, The Hammer and the Dance, and if people criticize the models, of course, they're just models, right? And you iterate models and machine intelligence can help us improve. So, in this, you know, you talk about BC and post C, how have you seen the data and in machine intelligence informing the models and proving that what we know about this pandemic, I mean, it changed literally daily, what are you seeing? >> Yeah, and I think it started with Wuhan and we saw the best application of AI in trying to trace, literally from Alipay, to WeChat, track down the first folks who were spreading it across China and then eventually the rest of the world. I think contact tracing, for example, has become a really interesting problem. supply chain has been disrupted like never before. We're beginning to see customers trying to reinvent their distribution mechanisms in the second order effects of the COVID, and the the prime center is hospital staffing, how many ventilator, is the first few weeks so that after COVID crisis as it evolved in the US. We are busy predicting working with some of the local healthcare communities to predict how staffing in hospitals will work, how many PPE and ventilators will be needed and so henceforth, but that quickly and when the peak surge will be those with the beginning problems, and many of our customers have begin to do these models and iterate and improve and kind of educate the community to practice social distancing, and that led to a lot of flattening the curve and you're talking flattening the curve, you're really talking about data science and analytics in public speak. That led to kind of the next level, now that we have somewhat brought a semblance of order to the reaction to COVID, I think what we are beginning to figure out is, is there going to be a second surge, what elective procedures that were postponed, will be top of the mind for customers, and so this is the kind of things that hospitals are beginning to plan out for the second half of the year, and as businesses try to open up, certain things were highly correlated to surgeon cases, such as cleaning supplies, for example, the obvious one or pantry buying. So retailers are beginning to see what online stores are doing well, e-commerce, online purchases, electronic goods, and so everyone essentially started working from home, and so homes needed to have the same kind of bandwidth that offices and commercial enterprises needed to have, and so a lot of interesting, as one side you saw airlines go away, this side you saw the likes of Zoom and video take off. So you're kind of seeing a real divide in the digital divide and that's happening and AI is here to play a very good role to figure out how to enhance your profitability as you're looking about planning out the next two years. >> Yeah, you know, and obviously, these things they get, they get partisan, it gets political, I mean, our job as an industry is to report, your job is to help people understand, I mean, let the data inform and then let public policy you know, fight it out. So who are some of the people that you're working with that you know, as a result of COVID-19. What's some of the work that H2O has done, I want to better understand what role are you playing? >> So one of the things we're kind of privileged as a company to come into the crisis, with a strong balance and an ability to actually have the right kind of momentum behind the company in terms of great talent, and so we have 10% of the world's top data scientists in the in the form of Kaggle Grand Masters in the company. And so we put most of them to work, and they started collecting data sets, curating data sets and making them more qualitative, picking up public data sources, for example, there's a tremendous amount of job loss out there, figuring out which are the more difficult kind of sectors in the economy and then we started looking at exodus from the cities, we're looking at mobility data that's publicly available, mobility data through the data exchanges, you're able to find which cities which rural areas, did the New Yorkers as they left the city, which places did they go to, and what's to say, Californians when they left Los Angeles, which are the new places they have settled in? These are the places which are now busy places for the same kind of items that you need to sell if you're a retailer, but if you go one step further, we started engaging with FEMA, we start engaging with the universities, like Imperial College London or Berkeley, and started figuring out how best to improve the models and automate them. The SEER model, the most popular SEER model, we added that into our Driverless AI product as a recipe and made that accessible to our customers in testing, to customers in healthcare who are trying to predict where the surge is likely to come. But it's mostly about information right? So the AI at the end of it is all about intelligence and being prepared. Predictive is all about being prepared and that's kind of what we did with general, lots of blogs, typical blog articles and working with the largest health organizations and starting to kind of inform them on the most stable models. What we found to our not so much surprise, is that the simplest, very interpretable models are actually the most widely usable, because historical data is actually no longer as effective. You need to build a model that you can quickly understand and retry again to the feedback loop of back testing that model against what really happened. >> Yeah, so I want to double down on that. So really, two things I want to understand, if you have visibility on it, sounds like you do. Just in terms of the surge and the comeback, you know, kind of what those models say, based upon, you know, we have some advanced information coming from the global market, for sure, but it seems like every situation is different. What's the data telling you? Just in terms of, okay, we're coming into the spring and the summer months, maybe it'll come down a little bit. Everybody says it... We fully expect it to come back in the fall, go back to college, don't go back to college. What is the data telling you at this point in time with an understanding that, you know, we're still iterating every day? >> Well, I think I mean, we're not epidemiologists, but at the same time, the science of it is a highly local response, very hyper local response to COVID-19 is what we've seen. Santa Clara, which is just a county, I mean, is different from San Francisco, right, sort of. So you beginning to see, like we saw in Brooklyn, it's very different, and Bronx, very different from Manhattan. So you're seeing a very, very local response to this disease, and I'm talking about US. You see the likes of Brazil, which we're worried about, has picked up quite a bit of cases now. I think the silver lining I would say is that China is up and running to a large degree, a large number of our user base there are back active, you can see the traffic patterns there. So two months after their last research cases, the business and economic activity is back and thriving. And so, you can kind of estimate from that, that this can be done where you can actually contain the rise of active cases and it will take masking of the entire community, masking and the healthy dose of increase in testing. One of our offices is in Prague, and Czech Republic has done an incredible job in trying to contain this and they've done essentially, masked everybody and as a result they're back thinking about opening offices, schools later this month. So I think that's a very, very local response, hyper local response, no one country and no one community is symmetrical with other ones and I think we have a unique situation where in United States you have a very, very highly connected world, highly connected economy and I think we have quite a problem on our hands on how to safeguard our economy while also safeguarding life. >> Yeah, so you can't just, you can't just take Norway and apply it or South Korea and apply it, every situation is different. And then I want to ask you about, you know, the economy in terms of, you know, how much can AI actually, you know, how can it work in this situation where you have, you know, for example, okay, so the Fed, yes, it started doing asset buys back in 2008 but still, very hard to predict, I mean, at this time of this interview you know, Stock Market up 900 points, very difficult to predict that but some event happens in the morning, somebody, you know, Powell says something positive and it goes crazy but just sort of even modeling out the V recovery, the W recovery, deep recession, the comeback. You have to have enough data, do you not? In order for AI to be reasonably accurate? How does it work? And how does at what pace can you iterate and improve on the models? >> So I think that's exactly where I would say, continuous modeling, instead of continuously learning continuous, that's where the vision of the world is headed towards, where data is coming, you build a model, and then you iterate, try it out and come back. That kind of rapid, continuous learning would probably be needed for all our models as opposed to the typical, I'm pushing a model to production once a year, or once every quarter. I think what we're beginning to see is the kind of where companies are beginning to kind of plan out. A lot of people lost their jobs in the last couple of months, right, sort of. And so up scaling and trying to kind of bring back these jobs back both into kind of, both from the manufacturing side, but also lost a lot of jobs in the transportation and the kind of the airlines slash hotel industries, right, sort of. So it's trying to now bring back the sense of confidence and will take a lot more kind of testing, a lot more masking, a lot more social empathy, I think well, some of the things that we are missing while we are socially distant, we know that we are so connected as a species, we need to kind of start having that empathy for we need to wear a mask, not for ourselves, but for our neighbors and people we may run into. And I think that kind of, the same kind of thinking has to kind of parade, before we can open up the economy in a big way. The data, I mean, we can do a lot of transfer learning, right, sort of there are new methods, like try to model it, similar to the 1918, where we had a second bump, or a lot of little bumps, and that's kind of where your W shaped pieces, but governments are trying very well in seeing stimulus dollars being pumped through banks. So some of the US case we're looking for banks is, which small medium business in especially, in unsecured lending, which business to lend to, (mumbles) there's so many applications that have come to banks across the world, it's not just in the US, and banks are caught up with the problem of which and what's growing the concern for this business to kind of, are they really accurate about the number of employees they are saying they have? Do then the next level problem or on forbearance and mortgage, that side of the things are coming up at some of these banks as well. So they're looking at which, what's one of the problems that one of our customers Wells Fargo, they have a question which branch to open, right, sort of that itself, it needs a different kind of modeling. So everything has become a very highly good segmented models, and so AI is absolutely not just a good to have, it has become a must have for most of our customers in how to go about their business. (mumbles) >> I want to talk a little bit about your business, you have been on a mission to democratize AI since the beginning, open source. Explain your business model, how you guys make money and then I want to help people understand basic theoretical comparisons and current affairs. >> Yeah, that's great. I think the last time we spoke, probably about at the Spark Summit. I think Dave and we were talking about Sparkling Water and H2O our open source platforms, which are premium platforms for democratizing machine learning and math at scale, and that's been a tremendous brand for us. Over the last couple of years, we have essentially built a platform called Driverless AI, which is a license software and that automates machine learning models, we took the best practices of all these data scientists, and combined them to essentially build recipes that allow people to build the best forecasting models, best fraud prevention models or the best recommendation engines, and so we started augmenting traditional data scientists with this automatic machine learning called AutoML, that essentially allows them to build models without necessarily having the same level of talent as these great Kaggle Grand Masters. And so that has democratized, allowed ordinary companies to start producing models of high caliber and high quality that would otherwise have been the pedigree of Google, Microsoft or Amazon or some of these top tier AI houses like Netflix and others. So what we've done is democratize not just the algorithms at the open source level. Now, we've made it easy for kind of rapid adoption of AI across every branch inside a company, a large organization, also across smaller organizations which don't have the access to the same kind of talent. Now, third level, you know, what we've brought to market, is ability to augment data sets, especially public and private data sets that you can, the alternative data sets that can increase the signal. And that's where we've started working on a new platform called Q, again, more license software, and I mean, to give you an idea there from business models endpoint, now majority of our software sales is coming from closed source software. And sort of so, we've made that transition, we still make our open source widely accessible, we continue to improve it, a large chunk of the teams are improving and participating in building the communities but I think from a business model standpoint as of last year, 51% of our revenues are now coming from closed source software and that change is continuing to grow. >> And this is the point I wanted to get to, so you know, the open source model was you know, Red Hat the one company that, you know, succeeded wildly and it was, put it out there open source, come up with a service, maintain the software, you got to buy the subscription okay, fine. And everybody thought that you know, you were going to do that, they thought that Databricks was going to do and that changed. But I want to take two examples, Hortonworks which kind of took the Red Hat model and Cloudera which does IP. And neither really lived up to the expectation, but now there seems to be sort of a new breed I mentioned, you guys, Databricks, there are others, that seem to be working. You with your license software model, Databricks with a managed service and so there's, it's becoming clear that there's got to be some level of IP that can be licensed in order to really thrive in the open source community to be able to fund the committers that you have to put forth to open source. I wonder if you could give me your thoughts on that narrative. >> So on Driverless AI, which is the closest platform I mentioned, we opened up the layers in open source as recipes. So for example, different companies build their zip codes differently, right, the domain specific recipes, we put about 150 of them in open source again, on top of our Driverless AI platform, and the idea there is that, open source is about freedom, right? It is not necessarily about, it's not a philosophy, it's not a business model, it allows freedom for rapid adoption of a platform and complete democratization and commodification of a space. And that allows a small company like ours to compete at the level of an SaaS or a Google or a Microsoft because you have the same level of voice as a very large company and you're focused on using code as a community building exercise as opposed to a business model, right? So that's kind of the heart of open source, is allowing that freedom for our end users and the customers to kind of innovate at the same level of that a Silicon Valley company or one of these large tech giants are building software. So it's really about making, it's a maker culture, as opposed to a consumer culture around software. Now, if you look at how the the Red Hat model, and the others who have tried to replicate that, the difficult part there was, if the product is very good, customers are self sufficient and if it becomes a standard, then customers know how to use it. If the product is crippled or difficult to use, then you put a lot of services and that's where you saw the classic Hadoop companies, get pulled into a lot of services, which is a reasonably difficult business to scale. So I think what we chose was, instead, a great product that builds a fantastic brand, that makes AI, even when other first or second.ai domain, and for us to see thousands of companies which are not AI and AI first, and even more companies adopting AI and talking about AI as a major way that was possible because of open source. If you had chosen close source and many of your peers did, they all vanished. So that's kind of how the open source is really about building the ecosystem and having the patience to build a company that takes 10, 20 years to build. And what we are expecting unfortunately, is a first and fast rise up to become unicorns. In that race, you're essentially sacrifice, building a long ecosystem play, and that's kind of what we chose to do, and that took a little longer. Now, if you think about the, how do you truly monetize open source, it takes a little longer and is much more difficult sales machine to scale, right, sort of. Our open source business actually is reasonably positive EBITDA business because it makes more money than we spend on it. But trying to teach sales teams, how to sell open source, that's a much, that's a rate limiting step. And that's why we chose and also explaining to the investors, how open source is being invested in as you go closer to the IPO markets, that's where we chose, let's go into license software model and scale that as a regular business. >> So I've said a few times, it's kind of like ironic that, this pandemic is as we're entering a new decade, you know, we've kind of we're exiting the era, I mean, the many, many decades of Moore's law being the source of innovation and now it's a combination of data, applying machine intelligence and being able to scale and with cloud. Well, my question is, what did we expect out of AI this decade if those are sort of the three, the cocktail of innovation, if you will, what should we expect? Is it really just about, I suggest, is it really about automating, you know, businesses, giving them more agility, flexibility, you know, etc. Or should we should we expect more from AI this decade? >> Well, I mean, if you think about the decade of 2010 2011, that was defined by software is eating the world, right? And now you can say software is the world, right? I mean, pretty much almost all conditions are digital. And AI is eating software, right? (mumbling) A lot of cloud transitions are happening and are now happening much faster rate but cloud and AI are kind of the leading, AI is essentially one of the biggest driver for cloud adoption for many of our customers. So in the enterprise world, you're seeing rebuilding of a lot of data, fast data driven applications that use AI, instead of rule based software, you're beginning to see patterned, mission AI based software, and you're seeing that in spades. And, of course, that is just the tip of the iceberg, AI has been with us for 100 years, and it's going to be ahead of us another hundred years, right, sort of. So as you see the discovery rate at which, it is really a fundamentally a math, math movement and in that math movement at the beginning of every century, it leads to 100 years of phenomenal discovery. So AI is essentially making discoveries faster, AI is producing, entertainment, AI is producing music, AI is producing choreographing, you're seeing AI in every walk of life, AI summarization of Zoom meetings, right, you beginning to see a lot of the AI enabled ETF peaking of stocks, right, sort of. You're beginning to see, we repriced 20,000 bonds every 15 seconds using H2O AI, corporate bonds. And so you and one of our customers is on the fastest growing stock, mostly AI is powering a lot of these insights in a fast changing world which is globally connected. No one of us is able to combine all the multiple dimensions that are changing and AI has that incredible opportunity to be a partner for every... (mumbling) For a hospital looking at how the second half will look like for physicians looking at what is the sentiment of... What is the surge to expect? To kind of what is the market demand looking at the sentiment of the customers. AI is the ultimate money ball in business and then I think it's just showing its depth at this point. >> Yeah, I mean, I think you're right on, I mean, basically AI is going to convert every software, every application, or those tools aren't going to have much use, Sri we got to go but thanks so much for coming to theCUBE and the great work you guys are doing. Really appreciate your insights. stay safe, and best of luck to you guys. >> Likewise, thank you so much. >> Welcome, and thank you for watching everybody, this is Dave Vellante for the CXO series on theCUBE. We'll see you next time. All right, we're clear. All right.

>> Starting the record, Dave in five, four, three. Hi, everybody this is Dave Vellante, theCUBE, and welcome back to my CXO series. I've been running this through really since the start of the COVID-19 crisis to really understand how leaders are dealing with this pandemic. Sri Ambati is here, he's the CEO and founder of H20. Sri, it's great to see you again, thanks for coming on. >> Thank you for having us. >> Yeah, so this pandemic has obviously given people fits, no question, but it's also given opportunities for companies to kind of reassess where they are. Automation is a huge watchword, flexibility, business resiliency and people who maybe really hadn't fully leaned into things like the cloud and AI and automation are now realizing, wow, we have no choice, it's about survival. Your thought as to what you're seeing in the marketplace. >> Thanks for having us. I think first of all, kudos to the frontline health workers who have been ruthlessly saving lives across the country and the world, and what you're really doing is a fraction of what we could have done or should be doing to stay away the next big pandemic. But that apart I think, I usually tend to say BC is before COVID. So if the world was thinking about going digital after COVID-19, they have been forced to go digital and as a result, you're seeing tremendous transformation across our customers, and a lot of application to kind of go in and reinvent their business models that allow them to scale as effortlessly as they could using the digital means. >> So, think about, doctors and diagnosis machines, in some cases, are helping doctors make diagnoses, they're sometimes making even better diagnosis, (mumbles) is informing. There's been a lot of talk about the models, you know how... Yeah, I know you've been working with a lot of healthcare organizations, you may probably familiar with that, you know, the Medium post, The Hammer and the Dance, and if people criticize the models, of course, they're just models, right? And you iterate models and machine intelligence can help us improve. So, in this, you know, you talk about BC and post C, how have you seen the data and in machine intelligence informing the models and proving that what we know about this pandemic, I mean, it changed literally daily, what are you seeing? >> Yeah, and I think it started with Wuhan and we saw the best application of AI in trying to trace, literally from Alipay, to WeChat, track down the first folks who were spreading it across China and then eventually the rest of the world. I think contact tracing, for example, has become a really interesting problem. supply chain has been disrupted like never before. We're beginning to see customers trying to reinvent their distribution mechanisms in the second order effects of the COVID, and the the prime center is hospital staffing, how many ventilator, is the first few weeks so that after COVID crisis as it evolved in the US. We are busy predicting working with some of the local healthcare communities to predict how staffing in hospitals will work, how many PPE and ventilators will be needed and so henceforth, but that quickly and when the peak surge will be those with the beginning problems, and many of our customers have begin to do these models and iterate and improve and kind of educate the community to practice social distancing, and that led to a lot of flattening the curve and you're talking flattening the curve, you're really talking about data science and analytics in public speak. That led to kind of the next level, now that we have somewhat brought a semblance of order to the reaction to COVID, I think what we are beginning to figure out is, is there going to be a second surge, what elective procedures that were postponed, will be top of the mind for customers, and so this is the kind of things that hospitals are beginning to plan out for the second half of the year, and as businesses try to open up, certain things were highly correlated to surgeon cases, such as cleaning supplies, for example, the obvious one or pantry buying. So retailers are beginning to see what online stores are doing well, e-commerce, online purchases, electronic goods, and so everyone essentially started working from home, and so homes needed to have the same kind of bandwidth that offices and commercial enterprises needed to have, and so a lot of interesting, as one side you saw airlines go away, this side you saw the likes of Zoom and video take off. So you're kind of seeing a real divide in the digital divide and that's happening and AI is here to play a very good role to figure out how to enhance your profitability as you're looking about planning out the next two years. >> Yeah, you know, and obviously, these things they get, they get partisan, it gets political, I mean, our job as an industry is to report, your job is to help people understand, I mean, let the data inform and then let public policy you know, fight it out. So who are some of the people that you're working with that you know, as a result of COVID-19. What's some of the work that H2O has done, I want to better understand what role are you playing? >> So one of the things we're kind of privileged as a company to come into the crisis, with a strong balance and an ability to actually have the right kind of momentum behind the company in terms of great talent, and so we have 10% of the world's top data scientists in the in the form of Kaggle Grand Masters in the company. And so we put most of them to work, and they started collecting data sets, curating data sets and making them more qualitative, picking up public data sources, for example, there's a tremendous amount of job loss out there, figuring out which are the more difficult kind of sectors in the economy and then we started looking at exodus from the cities, we're looking at mobility data that's publicly available, mobility data through the data exchanges, you're able to find which cities which rural areas, did the New Yorkers as they left the city, which places did they go to, and what's to say, Californians when they left Los Angeles, which are the new places they have settled in? These are the places which are now busy places for the same kind of items that you need to sell if you're a retailer, but if you go one step further, we started engaging with FEMA, we start engaging with the universities, like Imperial College London or Berkeley, and started figuring out how best to improve the models and automate them. The SaaS model, the most popular SaaS model, we added that into our Driverless AI product as a recipe and made that accessible to our customers in testing, to customers in healthcare who are trying to predict where the surge is likely to come. But it's mostly about information right? So the AI at the end of it is all about intelligence and being prepared. Predictive is all about being prepared and that's kind of what we did with general, lots of blogs, typical blog articles and working with the largest health organizations and starting to kind of inform them on the most stable models. What we found to our not so much surprise, is that the simplest, very interpretable models are actually the most widely usable, because historical data is actually no longer as effective. You need to build a model that you can quickly understand and retry again to the feedback loop of back testing that model against what really happened. >> Yeah, so I want to double down on that. So really, two things I want to understand, if you have visibility on it, sounds like you do. Just in terms of the surge and the comeback, you know, kind of what those models say, based upon, you know, we have some advanced information coming from the global market, for sure, but it seems like every situation is different. What's the data telling you? Just in terms of, okay, we're coming into the spring and the summer months, maybe it'll come down a little bit. Everybody says it... We fully expect it to come back in the fall, go back to college, don't go back to college. What is the data telling you at this point in time with an understanding that, you know, we're still iterating every day? >> Well, I think I mean, we're not epidemiologists, but at the same time, the science of it is a highly local response, very hyper local response to COVID-19 is what we've seen. Santa Clara, which is just a county, I mean, is different from San Francisco, right, sort of. So you beginning to see, like we saw in Brooklyn, it's very different, and Bronx, very different from Manhattan. So you're seeing a very, very local response to this disease, and I'm talking about US. You see the likes of Brazil, which we're worried about, has picked up quite a bit of cases now. I think the silver lining I would say is that China is up and running to a large degree, a large number of our user base there are back active, you can see the traffic patterns there. So two months after their last research cases, the business and economic activity is back and thriving. And so, you can kind of estimate from that, that this can be done where you can actually contain the rise of active cases and it will take masking of the entire community, masking and the healthy dose of increase in testing. One of our offices is in Prague, and Czech Republic has done an incredible job in trying to contain this and they've done essentially, masked everybody and as a result they're back thinking about opening offices, schools later this month. So I think that's a very, very local response, hyper local response, no one country and no one community is symmetrical with other ones and I think we have a unique situation where in United States you have a very, very highly connected world, highly connected economy and I think we have quite a problem on our hands on how to safeguard our economy while also safeguarding life. >> Yeah, so you can't just, you can't just take Norway and apply it or South Korea and apply it, every situation is different. And then I want to ask you about, you know, the economy in terms of, you know, how much can AI actually, you know, how can it work in this situation where you have, you know, for example, okay, so the Fed, yes, it started doing asset buys back in 2008 but still, very hard to predict, I mean, at this time of this interview you know, Stock Market up 900 points, very difficult to predict that but some event happens in the morning, somebody, you know, Powell says something positive and it goes crazy but just sort of even modeling out the V recovery, the W recovery, deep recession, the comeback. You have to have enough data, do you not? In order for AI to be reasonably accurate? How does it work? And how does at what pace can you iterate and improve on the models? >> So I think that's exactly where I would say, continuous modeling, instead of continuously learning continuous, that's where the vision of the world is headed towards, where data is coming, you build a model, and then you iterate, try it out and come back. That kind of rapid, continuous learning would probably be needed for all our models as opposed to the typical, I'm pushing a model to production once a year, or once every quarter. I think what we're beginning to see is the kind of where companies are beginning to kind of plan out. A lot of people lost their jobs in the last couple of months, right, sort of. And so up scaling and trying to kind of bring back these jobs back both into kind of, both from the manufacturing side, but also lost a lot of jobs in the transportation and the kind of the airlines slash hotel industries, right, sort of. So it's trying to now bring back the sense of confidence and will take a lot more kind of testing, a lot more masking, a lot more social empathy, I think well, some of the things that we are missing while we are socially distant, we know that we are so connected as a species, we need to kind of start having that empathy for we need to wear a mask, not for ourselves, but for our neighbors and people we may run into. And I think that kind of, the same kind of thinking has to kind of parade, before we can open up the economy in a big way. The data, I mean, we can do a lot of transfer learning, right, sort of there are new methods, like try to model it, similar to the 1918, where we had a second bump, or a lot of little bumps, and that's kind of where your W shaped pieces, but governments are trying very well in seeing stimulus dollars being pumped through banks. So some of the US case we're looking for banks is, which small medium business in especially, in unsecured lending, which business to lend to, (mumbles) there's so many applications that have come to banks across the world, it's not just in the US, and banks are caught up with the problem of which and what's growing the concern for this business to kind of, are they really accurate about the number of employees they are saying they have? Do then the next level problem or on forbearance and mortgage, that side of the things are coming up at some of these banks as well. So they're looking at which, what's one of the problems that one of our customers Wells Fargo, they have a question which branch to open, right, sort of that itself, it needs a different kind of modeling. So everything has become a very highly good segmented models, and so AI is absolutely not just a good to have, it has become a must have for most of our customers in how to go about their business. (mumbles) >> I want to talk a little bit about your business, you have been on a mission to democratize AI since the beginning, open source. Explain your business model, how you guys make money and then I want to help people understand basic theoretical comparisons and current affairs. >> Yeah, that's great. I think the last time we spoke, probably about at the Spark Summit. I think Dave and we were talking about Sparkling Water and H2O or open source platforms, which are premium platforms for democratizing machine learning and math at scale, and that's been a tremendous brand for us. Over the last couple of years, we have essentially built a platform called Driverless AI, which is a license software and that automates machine learning models, we took the best practices of all these data scientists, and combined them to essentially build recipes that allow people to build the best forecasting models, best fraud prevention models or the best recommendation engines, and so we started augmenting traditional data scientists with this automatic machine learning called AutoML, that essentially allows them to build models without necessarily having the same level of talent as these Greek Kaggle Grand Masters. And so that has democratized, allowed ordinary companies to start producing models of high caliber and high quality that would otherwise have been the pedigree of Google, Microsoft or Amazon or some of these top tier AI houses like Netflix and others. So what we've done is democratize not just the algorithms at the open source level. Now, we've made it easy for kind of rapid adoption of AI across every branch inside a company, a large organization, also across smaller organizations which don't have the access to the same kind of talent. Now, third level, you know, what we've brought to market, is ability to augment data sets, especially public and private data sets that you can, the alternative data sets that can increase the signal. And that's where we've started working on a new platform called Q, again, more license software, and I mean, to give you an idea there from business models endpoint, now majority of our software sales is coming from closed source software. And sort of so, we've made that transition, we still make our open source widely accessible, we continue to improve it, a large chunk of the teams are improving and participating in building the communities but I think from a business model standpoint as of last year, 51% of our revenues are now coming from closed source software and that change is continuing to grow. >> And this is the point I wanted to get to, so you know, the open source model was you know, Red Hat the one company that, you know, succeeded wildly and it was, put it out there open source, come up with a service, maintain the software, you got to buy the subscription okay, fine. And everybody thought that you know, you were going to do that, they thought that Databricks was going to do and that changed. But I want to take two examples, Hortonworks which kind of took the Red Hat model and Cloudera which does IP. And neither really lived up to the expectation, but now there seems to be sort of a new breed I mentioned, you guys, Databricks, there are others, that seem to be working. You with your license software model, Databricks with a managed service and so there's, it's becoming clear that there's got to be some level of IP that can be licensed in order to really thrive in the open source community to be able to fund the committers that you have to put forth to open source. I wonder if you could give me your thoughts on that narrative. >> So on Driverless AI, which is the closest platform I mentioned, we opened up the layers in open source as recipes. So for example, different companies build their zip codes differently, right, the domain specific recipes, we put about 150 of them in open source again, on top of our Driverless AI platform, and the idea there is that, open source is about freedom, right? It is not necessarily about, it's not a philosophy, it's not a business model, it allows freedom for rapid adoption of a platform and complete democratization and commodification of a space. And that allows a small company like ours to compete at the level of an SaaS or a Google or a Microsoft because you have the same level of voice as a very large company and you're focused on using code as a community building exercise as opposed to a business model, right? So that's kind of the heart of open source, is allowing that freedom for our end users and the customers to kind of innovate at the same level of that a Silicon Valley company or one of these large tech giants are building software. So it's really about making, it's a maker culture, as opposed to a consumer culture around software. Now, if you look at how the the Red Hat model, and the others who have tried to replicate that, the difficult part there was, if the product is very good, customers are self sufficient and if it becomes a standard, then customers know how to use it. If the product is crippled or difficult to use, then you put a lot of services and that's where you saw the classic Hadoop companies, get pulled into a lot of services, which is a reasonably difficult business to scale. So I think what we chose was, instead, a great product that builds a fantastic brand, that makes AI, even when other first or second.ai domain, and for us to see thousands of companies which are not AI and AI first, and even more companies adopting AI and talking about AI as a major way that was possible because of open source. If you had chosen close source and many of your peers did, they all vanished. So that's kind of how the open source is really about building the ecosystem and having the patience to build a company that takes 10, 20 years to build. And what we are expecting unfortunately, is a first and fast rise up to become unicorns. In that race, you're essentially sacrifice, building a long ecosystem play, and that's kind of what we chose to do, and that took a little longer. Now, if you think about the, how do you truly monetize open source, it takes a little longer and is much more difficult sales machine to scale, right, sort of. Our open source business actually is reasonably positive EBITDA business because it makes more money than we spend on it. But trying to teach sales teams, how to sell open source, that's a much, that's a rate limiting step. And that's why we chose and also explaining to the investors, how open source is being invested in as you go closer to the IPO markets, that's where we chose, let's go into license software model and scale that as a regular business. >> So I've said a few times, it's kind of like ironic that, this pandemic is as we're entering a new decade, you know, we've kind of we're exiting the era, I mean, the many, many decades of Moore's law being the source of innovation and now it's a combination of data, applying machine intelligence and being able to scale and with cloud. Well, my question is, what did we expect out of AI this decade if those are sort of the three, the cocktail of innovation, if you will, what should we expect? Is it really just about, I suggest, is it really about automating, you know, businesses, giving them more agility, flexibility, you know, etc. Or should we should we expect more from AI this decade? >> Well, I mean, if you think about the decade of 2010 2011, that was defined by software is eating the world, right? And now you can say software is the world, right? I mean, pretty much almost all conditions are digital. And AI is eating software, right? (mumbling) A lot of cloud transitions are happening and are now happening much faster rate but cloud and AI are kind of the leading, AI is essentially one of the biggest driver for cloud adoption for many of our customers. So in the enterprise world, you're seeing rebuilding of a lot of data, fast data driven applications that use AI, instead of rule based software, you're beginning to see patterned, mission AI based software, and you're seeing that in spades. And, of course, that is just the tip of the iceberg, AI has been with us for 100 years, and it's going to be ahead of us another hundred years, right, sort of. So as you see the discovery rate at which, it is really a fundamentally a math, math movement and in that math movement at the beginning of every century, it leads to 100 years of phenomenal discovery. So AI is essentially making discoveries faster, AI is producing, entertainment, AI is producing music, AI is producing choreographing, you're seeing AI in every walk of life, AI summarization of Zoom meetings, right, you beginning to see a lot of the AI enabled ETF peaking of stocks, right, sort of. You're beginning to see, we repriced 20,000 bonds every 15 seconds using H2O AI, corporate bonds. And so you and one of our customers is on the fastest growing stock, mostly AI is powering a lot of these insights in a fast changing world which is globally connected. No one of us is able to combine all the multiple dimensions that are changing and AI has that incredible opportunity to be a partner for every... (mumbling) For a hospital looking at how the second half will look like for physicians looking at what is the sentiment of... What is the surge to expect? To kind of what is the market demand looking at the sentiment of the customers. AI is the ultimate money ball in business and then I think it's just showing its depth at this point. >> Yeah, I mean, I think you're right on, I mean, basically AI is going to convert every software, every application, or those tools aren't going to have much use, Sri we got to go but thanks so much for coming to theCUBE and the great work you guys are doing. Really appreciate your insights. stay safe, and best of luck to you guys. >> Likewise, thank you so much. >> Welcome, and thank you for watching everybody, this is Dave Vellante for the CXO series on theCUBE. We'll see you next time. All right, we're clear. All right.

>>Live from Denver, Colorado. It's the cube covering comm vault. Go 2019 brought to you by Combolt. >>Hey, welcome back to the cubes coverage of combo go 19. Stu Miniman is here with me, Lisa Martin and we are wrapping up two days of really exciting wall to wall coverage of the new vault and we're very pleased to welcome a couple of special guests onto the program. To help us wrap up our two days, we have Miranda foster, the vice president of worldwide communications for comm vault and Al Bunty is here, the co founder, former COO and board member. Welcome Miranda and Al. Great to have you on the program. Thanks Lisa. So a lot of energy at this event and I don't think it has anything to do with our rarefied air here in the mile high city. Al, let's start with you. >>Well, there's other things in Colorado. >>There are, yeah, they don't talk about it. They talked about that on stage yesterday. So owl, you have been with convo ball as I mentioned, co-founder. What an evolution over the last 20 years. Can you take us back? >>Surely. So, um, yeah and it's been, it's, it's really kind of cool to see it coming together at this point. But if you go back 20 years when we started this, the whole idea was around data. And remember we walked into a company that was focused on optical storage. Um, we decided it would be a good company to invest in. Um, for two reasons. One, we thought they were really great people here, very creative and innovative and two, it was a great space. So if we believed we believe data would grow and that was a pretty decent thesis to go with. Yeah. And then, then it started moving from there. So I tell people I wasn't burdened with facts so I didn't understand why all these copies were being made of the same set of data. So we developed a platform and an architecture focused on indexing it so you just index at once and then could use it for many different purposes. >>And that just kept moving through the years with this very data centric approach to storage, management, backup protection, etc. It was all about the data. I happened to be lucky and said, you know, I think there's something to this thing called NAS and sand and storage networks and all those things. And I also said we have to plan for fur on scale on our solution of a million X. Now it was only off a magnitude of about a thousand on that, but it was the right idea. You know, you had to build something to scale and, and we came in and we wanted to build a company. We didn't want to just flip a company but we thought there is a longterm vision in it and if you take it all the way to the present here it's, it's really, um, it's, it feels really good to see where the company came from. It's a great foundation and now it will propel off this foundation, um, with a similar vision with great modern execution and management. >>Yeah. Al, when we had the chance to talk with you last year at the show in Nashville, it was setting up for that change. So I want to get your view there. There are some things that the company was working on and are being continued, but there's some things that, you know, Bob hammer would not have happened under his regime. So want to get your viewpoint as to the new Convolt, you know, what, what is, what are some of those new things that are moving forward with the company that might not have in the previous days? >>Yeah, that's a good questions. Do I think Mo, a lot of the innovation that you've seen here, um, would have happened maybe not as quickly. Um, we, the company obviously acquired Hedvig. Uh, we were on a very similar path but to do it ourselves. So you had kind of been a modern, we need to get to market quicker with some real pros. I think, um, the, the evolution of redoing sales management essentially was probably the biggest shift that needed to be under a new regime, if you will. Yeah. >>So Miranda, making these transitions can be really tricky from a marketing standpoint. Talk, talk us through a bit, some of the, how do you make sure trusted yet innovative and new that you've accomplished at this show? >>Well, trust it is obviously the most important because the Bob, the brand that Bob and Al built really embodies reliability for what we provide to our customers. I mean that's what gives them the peace of mind to sleep at night. But I'll tell you, Sanjay has been with us for just eight months now, February of 2019 and it's been busy. We've done a lot of things from a points on J transition with Bob and now to his point we've, we've acquired Hedvig, we've introduced this new SAS portfolio and you're exactly right. What we need to do is make sure that the reliability that customers have come to rely on Convolt for translates into what we're doing with the new Convolt and I think we've done a really good job. We've put a lot of muscle behind making sure, particularly with metallic that it was tried, it was trusted, it was beta tested, we got input from customers, partners, industry influencers. We really built it around the customer. So I think the brand that comm brings will translate well into the things that we've done with these, with these new shifts and movements within the company >>on, on that questions too as well. Um, I think Miranda is a good example of somebody that was with the company before a tremendous talent. She's got new opportunities here and she's run with it. So it's kinda that balance of some, uh, understood the fundamentals and the way we're trying to run the business. And she's grasped the new world as well. So, >>and Rob as well, right? Robin in his new, >>yeah, that's another good point. So that was all part of the transitioning here and Sanjay and the team had been very careful on trying to keep that balance. >>Change is really difficult anywhere, right? Dissect to any element of life. And you look at a business that's been very successful, has built a very strong, reliable brand for 20 years. Big leadership changes, not just with Sanjay, but all of the leadership changes. You know, analysts said, all right, you've got to upgrade your Salesforce. We're seeing a lot of movement in the area. You got to enhance your marketing. We're seeing metallic has the new routes to market, new partner focus, so PSI focuses. We're also seeing this expansion in the market, so what folks were saying, you know a year ago come on is answering in a big way and to your point in a fast way that's not easy to do. You've been here nine years since the beginning. Can you give us a little bit of a perspective, Miranda, about some of the things that were announced at the show? >>How excited everybody is, customers, partners, combo folks. How do you now extend the message and the communications from go globally after the show ends? That's an awesome question. I'm really passionate about this. So you know, Monday we announced metallic, we announced a new head of channels and alliances and Mercer Rowe, we had crazy technology innovation announcements with activate, with the acceleration of the integration with Hedvig with the momentum release that we put out today. We're also doing cool stuff with our corporate social responsibility in terms of sponsoring the new business Avengers coalition. That's something that Chris Powell is really championing here at, at the show and also within combo. So we're very excited about that. And then when you add people like yourselves, you know the tech field day folks, because not everybody can be here, right? Not everybody can be at go. So being able to extend the opportunity for, for folks to participate in combo, go through things like the cube through things like tech field day and using our social media tools and just getting all of the good vibes that are here. Because as Al says, this really is an intimate show, but we try to extend that to anybody who wants to follow us, to anybody who wants to be a part of it. And that's something that we've really focused on the last couple of years to make sure that folks who aren't here can, can get an embrace the environment here at Commonweal go. >>It's such an important piece that you're here helping with the transition I talked about. It's important that some of the existing >>get new roles and do responsibility going forward. What's your role going to be and what should we expect to see from you personally? Somebody has got to mow the lawn. >>Yeah. >>But yes, do I, I'll stay on the board. Um, we're talking through that. I think I'll be a very active board, not just the legal side of the equation. Um, try and stay involved with customers and, and strategies and, and even, uh, potential acquisitions, those kinds of things. Um, I'm also wandering off into the university environment. Uh, my Alma mater is a university of Iowa. I'm on the board there and uh, I'm involved in setting up innovation centers and entrepreneurial programs and that kind of thing. Um, I'll keep doing my farming thing and uh, actually have some ideas on that. There's a lot of technology as you guys know, attacking Nat space. So, and like I said, I'll try to keep a lot of things linked back into a combo. >>What Al can have confidence in is that I will keep him busy. So there's that. And then I will also put on the table, we agree to disagree with our college athletic loyalties. So I'm a big kid just because we don't compete really. Right. So I mean, but if I won Kansas wherever to play, then we would just politely disagree. Yeah. Well that's good that you have this agreement in place. I would love to get some anecdotal feedback from you of some of the things that you've heard over the last three days with all this news, all these changes. What are you hearing from customers and partners who you've had relationships with for a very long time? >>I think they're, I think they're all really excited, but, and maybe I'm biased, but they liked the idea that we're trying to not throw out all the old focus on customers, focus on technologies, continue the innovation. I'm pleased that we, Miranda and the team started taking this theme of what we do to a personal level, you know, recovery and those kinds of things. It isn't just the money in the business outages. It's a really a effect on a personal lives. And that resonates. I hear that a lot. Um, I asked our bigger customers and they've loved us for our support, how we take care of them. The, the intimacy of the partnership, you know, and I think they feel pleased that that's staying yet there's lot of modern Emity if that's a good word. I think fokai was what you, I think it's the blend of things and I think that really excites people. >>We've heard that a lot. You guys did a great job with having customers on stage and as a marketer who does customer marketing programs, I think there's nothing more validating than the voice of a customer. But suddenly today that I thought was a pivot on that convo, did well as Sonic healthcare was on main stage. And then he came onto the program and I really liked how he talked about some of the failures that they've been through. You know, we had the NASA talking yesterday, NASA, 60 years young, very infamous, probably for failure is not an option, but it is a very real possibility whether you're talking about space flight or you're talking about data protection and cyber attacks and the rise of that. And it was really, I'd say, refreshing to hear the voice of a customer say, these are the areas in which we failed. This is how come they've helped us recover and how much better and stronger are they? Not just as a company as Sonic healthcare, but even as an individual person responsible for that. That was a really great message that you guys were able to extend to the audience today and we wanted to get that out. >>I loved that as well. I think that was good. I have also back on driving innovation, I always felt one of my biggest jobs was to not punish people that failed. Yeah. I, you know, with the whole engineering team, the bright people in marketing, I, I would be very down on them if they didn't try, but I never wanted them to feel bad about trying and never punish them. >>And one of the things Matthew said on main stage, first of all, I love him. He's great. He's been a longtime CommonWell supporter. I love his sense of humor. He said, you know, combo came to me and said, can you identify, you know, your biggest disaster recovery moment? And he was like, no, because there's so many. Yes. Right? Like there's so many when you're responsible for this. It's just the unpredictability of it is crazy. And so he couldn't identify one, but he had a series of anecdotes that I think really helped the audience identify with and understand this is, these are big time challenges that we're up against today. And hearing his use case and how con ball is helping him solve his heart problems, I think was really cool. You're right. I loved that too. He said, I couldn't name one. There are so many. That's reality, right? As data proliferates, which every industry is experiencing, there's a tremendous amount of opportunity. There's also great risk as technology advances for good. The bad actors also have access to that sort of technology. So his honesty, I thought was, was refreshing, but spot on. And what a great example for other customers to listen to the RA. To your point, I, if I punish people for failure, we're not going to learn from it. >>Yeah, you'll never move forward. >>Miranda. So much that we learn this week at the shows. Some, a lot of branding, a lot of customers, I know some people might be taking a couple of days off, but what should we expect to be seeing from con vault post go this year, >>continue to innovation. We're not letting our foot off the gas at all. Just continuing innovation as as as we integrate with Hedvig continued acceleration with metallic. I mean those guys are aggressive. They were built as a startup within an enterprise company built on Comvalt enterprise foundation. Those guys are often running, they are motivated, they're highly talented, highly skilled and they're going to market with a solution that is targeted at a specific market and those guys are really, really ready to go. So continued innovation with Hedvig integrate, sorry, integration with Hedvig with metallic. I think you're just going to be seeing a lot more from Combalt in the future on the heels of what we consider humbled, proud leadership with the Gartner magic quadrant. You know the one two punch with the Forrester wave. I think that you're just going to be seeing a lot more from Combalt and in terms of how we're really getting out there and aggressive. And that's not to mention Al, you know what we do with our core solutions. I mean today we just announced a bunch of enhancements to the core technology, which is, which is the bread and butter of, of what we do. So we're not letting the foot off the gas to be sure >>the team stay in really, really aggressive too. And the other thing I'd add as a major investor that I'm expecting is sales. Now I'd love to just your, your final thoughts that the culture of Convolt because while there's some acceleration and there's some change, I think some of the fundamentals stay the same. Yeah, it's, it's right to, and again, that's why I feel we're at a good point on this transition process. You alluded to it earlier, but I feel really good about the leadership that's in, they've treated me terrifically. I'm almost almost part of the team. I love that they're, they're trying to leverage off all the assets that were created in his company. Technology, obviously platform architecture, support base, our support capabilities. I, I told Sandy today I wish she really would have nailed the part about, and by the way, support and our capabilities with customers as a huge differentiator and it was part of our original, Stu knows he's heard me forever. Our original DNA, we wanted to focus on two things. Great technology, keep the great technology lead and customer support and satisfaction. So those elements, now you blend that stew with really terrific Salesforce. As Ricardo says, have you guys talk with Ricardo soon? But anyway, the head of sales is hiring great athletes, particularly for the enterprise space. Then you take it with a real terrific marketing organization that's focused, Oh, had modern techniques and analytics on all those things. You know, it's, it's in my opinion, as an investor especially, I'm expecting really good things >>bar's been set well. I can't think of a better way for Sue and me to our coverage owl veranda. Thank you. This has been fantastic. You've got to go. You get a lawn to mow, you've got a vacation to get onto and you need some wordsmithing would focus your rights. You have a flight ticket. They do five hours. Hi guys. Thank you. This has been awesome. Hashtag new comm vault for our guests and I, Lisa Martin, you've been watching the cubes coverage of Convault go and 19 we will see you next time.

>> Hi, I'm Peter Birds. And welcome to another Cube conversation from the Cube studios here in Beautiful >> Powell to California. >> Today, we're going to talk about network assurance that problem that's becoming increasingly important to large organizations as they envisioned greater distribution of their digital capabilities and have that conversation you've got. David Ericsson is the CEO and co founder of Forward Networks David. Welcome to the Cube. >> Thank you. Pleasure to be here. >> So let's start by getting a sense of what forward networks is. Tell us a little bit about four networks, and then we'll jump into it. >> Yeah, four networks is ah, startup company here in Silicon Valley. Were based out of Palo Alto. Been in business for about five years now. Our background was four of us is co founders were in the networking group at Stanford under Nick McEwen. We graduated with PhDs in computer science and working in twenty thirteen, saw major problem and network operations and in the network Assurance space, and decided to go after it. Big hairy problem which will dig into. But it's been about two years since we've been in market. And >> all right, so let's talk about the big hairy problem. Aiken. Remember the days when network administration and operations was about finding a device plugging something into it, making sure that you had electrical circuit in place and then going back and telling everybody you've done your job? That was Those were very simple network, so it took a long time. Some of them are pretty complex as we move to increasingly complex physical networks, but even more complex software to find networks that assurance that that certainty that we have the network that we think we have kind of has gone away. So talk a little bit about this notion of network assurance. What is thie enterprise problem that we're trying to solve? >> Yeah, I mean, you're you're dead on If you look at the history of networking, we started very simple. We could manage this with humans. We only had so many changes we had to make on a day to day week. Do we basis but over time were now operating networks with thousands, even tens of thousands and hundreds of thousands of network devices in them. And that's as you indicated on ly growing with software to find. Networking is we're bringing and dropping software elements. They're also doing forwarding to bear on this, but unfortunately, well at the same time, we also had a huge increase in applications and mission critical day today, business operations and infrastructure that depend on this network to stay up and working. But if you look at what actually has done to ensure they're working properly and what the change process looks like, it's it's somewhat depressing. To be completely honest, we make an awful lot of changes in production with minimal, if any, pre testing. Our post testing is, you know, our customers calling us or our internal customers calling us, telling us it works or not if they're not, you know, maybe we'll do a couple of peeing and simple trace route tests and and and move on. And of course, this is tremendously risky to the business, let alone security, which is a whole nother topic we can dig into. But we need to bring in. And this is what part of what for Knox has focused on is helping our customers understand and ensure that their network is always up in stable, achieving what they want to achieve that they've changed what they wanted to change and that it's as secure as they expect it to be. >> Now let me let me let me build on this notion over network assurance because we could think about it. Don't just say three levels right now. There's a lot of folks who do some sort of network device assurance. Have you updated that device? Have you updated that software construct? We got answer, but we've got a number of other tools. You could do some of those things. We also have tooling that Khun tell you. Generally speaking, you know, in a knock whether or not the network is up available, but I think what you're talking about is something that's in between where we're talking about the network being, ah, logical organization of resources that communicate with each other and assuring that as we make changes that context, that notion of things in a relationship working together is not lost. If I got that right, >> perfectly right. So today it's reasonably straightforward to with answerable or N S o R T a laugh. You know, whatever. Like some some system today to go out, make a change to the network, and then you come along behind and maybe with some other scripts ensure that that actually went out. But what's really hard is to paint the holistic picture that even though I made these changes, all of my critical applications are actually still functioning. And so this is what we would bucket in a higher level term called intent based networking. This is a reason, you know, reasonably recent entrant into how we think about networking. But it's very simple. From a high level, it's I need to. I need to holistically paint a picture for what my network should deliver to me on an end in basis. And I need to assure that this is always happening. And this Khun B from a connectivity perspective. You know, imagine, imagine I'm ah Web company that has a bunch of customers that need to come in from the Internet and hit my critical application. That's that's underpinning everything my business does, right? So I need to know that my network has paths in it that are enabling that to occur one hundred percent of the time. And so that's that's kind of the crux of of intent based networking. Butt's thinking in high level Indian actions as opposed to the very nitty gritty nuances of what's going on in any of these guys, >> actually give you know, the use case. So I can imagine a Tell Cohen operator that used to have physical devices and cordon off some of those physical devices by customers to provide their network. But as they try to, you know, gain flexibility, gain speed, game profitability. They're using a software based network approached to do a better job of ministering changes and management of those resources. It's whether customers so they want to be able to assure a customer that the network that the customer thinks it has in the context of the telcos overall network is assured it's there. The customer can weaken, validate for the customer that even though he made a change, their network is still in place, right? >> Absolutely. Multi tendency is a great use case for this, where you've got a bunch of different, even isolated networks that maybe sharing underlying physical infrastructure that are also being spun up with software software elements that are really, you know, sucking the software out of existing hardware but making it more flexible on demand. All of those capabilities, and we see that for sure, in telcos and and in that space. But we also see it in the cloud is people are moving applications up to the cloud. The same type of software elements are being controlled and set up there and have all the same pain and suffering that you see on premise. And I think you know, there's certainly not enough people that have set those up that understand that today. But as soon as they dive in and and realize all of the configuration permutations that exist in cloud networking, they can pattern majin sale. This is the same difficulty that I've had for years in my own Prem environment. >> Well, let's talk a bit about that security thing because we can dive into it because there is a close relationship between being able to say being able state categorically that this network contractually is in place on assured and that we now have an understanding of what security is required on that set of resources. How does network assurance, intent based network and security come together? Especially for you guys? >> Absolutely. So I think this to talk about this is good to talk a little bit about how the software works. So underneath the covers, we go and collect all of the data from the individual network elements without agents without actually needing packets. We build a digital twin or a model of the underlying network in software, and then we run analytics that air, based on research that came out of years and years of phD study by one of my colleagues, plus US production izing that as an organization that using an actual mathematical model we can trace where every packet could ever go in that entire environment and why this is important is to be able to prove security properties of a network. You have to know where everything could ever go to conclusively prove it right. And more often than not today we're using very small sampling methods to try toe, prove properties with humans and doing port scans and things of that nature that just aren't comprehensive. And so this is This is part of our core technology that we bring to bear on. This problem is knowing everything the network is capable of and then being able to mathematically prove security problems to your to your previous case. Imagine you've got a service provider that's offering and a network to two competitors, right? You want to make sure that those networks air actually completely isolated and that there's no possible cross talk that could occur between there. So with our software, we can analyze that we can prove the disc, you know that they're completely disconnected. And in the event that there not show you exactly why they're not when it began occurring and then quickly help you get that corrected and prove that you fixed it. >> You know it's interesting because increasingly digital business is going to mean that very, very complex partnerships are engaged through digital mechanisms. And in the world of contracting, there's a notion of a secured facility where I put something in there and you can take it out. You can look at it, but you can't take it out. And I could imagine you're your tool could also be used to set up those kinds of, you know, we used to come to Militarize owns all these types of things, but at a business level, a facility where we can assure that we know who gets in when they get in and how to get in and when they don't >> absolutely on obvious use case that occurs all the time is guest WiFi. Every company on this planet has no right. You want to make sure, though, that when people are coming and consuming your guest WiFi that they're not able to get back into your database and cause you a privacy or security incident, And this is this is something we can assist with. >> So we're talking about moving from a probabilistic approach to assurance to a categorical mathematical approach to insurance and being able to start to layer on some of those intent based networking things. Let's talk about how the prom is going to get worse. Five. G for folks who might be saying, Oh, yeah, well, I got this issue. It's going to get even richer and more complex as we put out networks out there that can have greater densities of devices within them. Higher band with, you know, even less time to assure that the networks behaving the way we expect it to. How is that going to fold into this whole story? >> Yeah, absolutely. In almost every dimension, networking is growing in complexity every single year five g is a perfect example. We talked about cloud earlier U. C S D When is another one is we kind of shift from MP lest overlays over the Internet? Um, and in the pace, the pace of that is just increasing. So if we don't, if we don't catch up to that from an operational capabilities perspective, it was going to lose control of it, frankly, and the amount of outages, security incidents, time to deliver product internally in my business. If that all continues to increase, we're going to be in a really bad place. And so that's why four networks has focused on trying to solve that and to bring up the capabilities of the operational teams to match that growing complexity and tow. Level it out, frankly, and so that it becomes something that we can consistently bring into our environmental want to transform our networks to bring in these technologies. But if we can't get ahead of the operational aspect of it, we can't do it >> way failed to adopt them. So you know, you raise something interesting, so just really quickly. How does network assurance tooling like what four Network provides change the mindset of the network administrator from I used to do it this way. And now I'm going to do it that way. >> Yeah, we think of it, Really, as Net Dev ops. It's bringing the devil ops mindset that we have in software development of all the way to test driven development where you write the test, then you write your code and then when the test passes, you know that you did what you need to do. You push that into production, you tested again and you just continue. You know, the continuous integration cadenas deployment cycle, that is the type. And we've refined that over thirty to forty years in software development. That's what enables us to have all the amazing services that we get on the broader Internet today. We believe that that same sort of mentality and the characteristics of that pipeline need to be brought to networking, to be able to give us confidence before we make changes. What the outcome of that's going to be into my network as we deploy them out to the network, that it's doing exactly what we expected to dio and then to continue to monitor that because networks are living, breathing things that have humans that are out there on keyboards, touching and changing things. If you don't keep an eye on it, it can run away from your really quickly. And so >> which one is one makes a knox such an exciting place your hand out of your All right. So very quickly. Last couple minutes here, uh, where do you see four networks going with the tooling? What's next? >> Yeah, we think that we think of it very holistically, as we would like for networks to be the single source of truth for everything about your networking environment today. This is, you know, layer two through layer for switching, routing, load balancers, firewalls, allowing you to get the visibility that you've craved across all of that to get that across the cloud, to get that across all of the leading technologies, from the various vendors and and toe layer in additional data over time. But ultimately, it's to help you have up time confidence in what you're doing to be ableto speed through the roadblocks and hurdles that you deal with internally and delivering product, delivering network applications into your network, and then just evolving that into the future. I think that this is the enabling technology to get us to the place that we have scalable five G services that we have. You know, these planet wide networks that are being put into space shortly, right, Tio, help reach every corner of the planet. And to enable the next generation of overlay services that change our lives, we need the network needs to be as reliable as power delivery and deliver the bandwidth and all of these things that we need. But to do that, we have to have scaleable network operations. Otherwise, the companies that deliver the services to us can't pay for it. >> Yeah, so it's it's Ah, it's a major challenge for and I digital business Transformation on DH. Quite frankly. Good guys versus bad guys. Yeah, Alright. David Erickson, CEO and co founder of Forward Networks. Thanks for B again for being on the Cube. Thank you very much. And I'm Peterborough's. Thanks for listening about talking about network assurance. So until next time