>>from our studios in the heart of Silicon Valley. Palo ALTO, California It is a cute conversation. >>Hi, and welcome to the Cube studios for another cube conversation where we go in depth with thought leaders driving innovation across the tech industry. I'm your host, Peter Burroughs. The difference between business and digital business is simple. It's the role that data plays in a digital business. It's an asset that drives business innovation that drives customer experience and drives profitability in an otherwise business. It's not. It's something that's just associate with applications, But that's why traditional businesses are transforming to make better use of data. As businesses start to invest in date as an asset, they need to invest in the capabilities that take care of data's an asset. And that's one of the major challenges at all enterprises face today. It's an extremely hot domain, but not all options take full advantage of the cloud. And what does that mean? What does it mean to have a set of data protection data management capabilities be fully embedded with Cloud and Native Cloud Service's To have that conversation, we've got John Kumar, who is the CEO and co founder of clue meal with us today. John. Welcome to the show. >>Thank you. Very nice to be here. >>So give us the update. Include me. Oh, >>so come you. Ah, two year old company, right? We dress recently launched out of stealth. So so far, you know, we we came out with the innovative offering which is a sass solution to go and protect on premises in November and vmc environments. That's what we launch out of style two months ago. We want our best of show. When we came out off Stilton in November 20 >>19. >>But ultimately we started with a vision about protecting data respective off, buried, recites. So it was all about you know, you know, on premises on Cloud and other SAS service is so one single service that protects data introspective about recites So far we executed on on premises VM wear and Vmc Today What we're announcing for the first time is our protection to go and protect applications natively built on aws. So these are application that ineptitude natively built on aws that clue me in as a service will protect respective off. You know them running, you know, in one region or cross region cross accounts and a single service little our customers to protect native AWS applications. The other big announcement we're making is a new round of financing, and that is testament to the interest in the space and the innovative nature off the platform that we have built. So when we came out of still, we announced we had raised two rounds of financing, $51 million in series and Series B round of financing. Today, what we're announcing is a serious see around the financing off $135 million the largest. I would say Siri, see financing for a sass and the price company, especially a company that's a little over two years >>old. Look, graduations that's gonna buy a lot of new technology and a lot of customer engagement. >>But what customers is a set up from where customers are really looking for is they're looking for >>tooling and methods and capabilities that allow them to treat their data differently. Talk a bit about the central importance of data and how it's driving decisions. ACLU Mia. >>Yes, so fundamentally. You know, when we built out the data platform, it was about going after the data protection as the first use case in the platform. Longer term, the journey really is to go from a data protection company to a data management company. And this is possible for the first time because you have the public cloud on your side. If you're truly built a platform for the cloud on the public cloud, you have this distinct and want a JJ off. Now, taking the data that you're protecting and really leveraging it for other service is that you can enable the enterprise for and this is exactly what and the prices are asking for, especially as they, you know, you make a transition from on premises. So the public cloud where they're powering on more and more applications in the public cloud and they really, you know, sometimes have no idea in terms of where the data is sitting and how they can take advantage off all these data sources that ultimately clueless protecting >>well, no idea where the data sitting take advantage of these data. Sources presumably facilitate new classes of integration. That's how you generate value out of data that suggests that we're not just looking at protection as >>crucially important as it is, we're looking at new classes of service. Is that >>gonna make it possible to alter the way you think about data management? If I got that right and >>what are those in service is? >>Yes, it's a journey, as I said, very starting with an organ data protection. It's also about doing there the protection across multiple clouds, right? So ultimately, were a platform. Even though we're announcing, you know, aws, you know, applications support today. We've already done the Emperor and BMC As we go along. You'll see us kind of doing this across multiple clouds. So an application that's built on the cloud running across multiple clouds AWS, azure and DCP whatever it might be, you'll see it's kind of doing there, the protection across in applications in multiple clouds. And then it's about going and saying, you know, can we take advantage of the data that we're protecting and really power on adjacent use cases? They could be security use cases because we know exactly what's changing when it's changing. There could be infrastructure and let excuse cases because people are running tens of thousands off instances and containers and envy EMS in the public cloud on. If a problem happens, nobody really knows what caused it. And we have all the data and we can kind off, you know, index it in the back end and lies in the back end without the customer needing to lift a finger and really show them what happened in their environment that they didn't know about right. So there's a lot of interesting use cases that get powered on because you have the ability to index all the data year. You have the ability to essentially look at all the changes that are happening and really give that visibility. Tow the end customer and all of this one click and automating it without the customer needing to do much. >>I will tell you this that we've talked to a number of customers of Romeo and the fundamental choice. The clue. Meo choice was simplicity. How are you going to sustain that even as you have these new classes of service is >>that is the key right? And that is about the foundation we have built at the end of the day, right? So if you look at all of our customers that have on border today. It's really the experience where in less than 15 minutes they can essentially start enjoying the power of the platform and the back in that we have built. And the focus on design that we have is ultimately why we're able to do this with simplicity. So so when when we when we think about you know all the things we do in the back, and there's obviously a lot of complexity in the back end because it is a complex platform. But every time we ask ourselves the question that okay from a customer perspective, how do we make sure that it is one click and easy for them? So that focus and that attention to detail that we have behind the scenes to make sure that the customer ultimately should just consumed the service and should not need to do anything more than what they absolutely need to do so that they can essentially focus on work, adds value to the business, >>takes a lot of technology, a lot of dedication to make complex things really simple? Absolutely. John Kumar, CEO and co founder of Coolio. Thanks very much for being on the Cube. Thank you. Bigger and thanks for joining us for another cube conversation on Peter Burress. See you next time

>>from our studios in the heart of Silicon Valley. Palo ALTO, California It is a cute conversation. >>Welcome to another wicked bond digital community event, this one sponsored by Clue Me. Oh, I'm your host, Peter Burroughs. Any business that aspires to be a digital business needs to think about its data differently. It needs to think about how data could be applied to customer experience, value propositions, operations and improve profitability and strategic options for the businesses that moves forward. But that means openly, either. We're thinking about how we embed data more deeply into our operations. That means we must also think about how we're going to protect that data. So the business is not suffer because someone got a hold of our data or corrupted our data or that system just failed and we needed to restore that data very quickly. Now what we want to be able to do is we're going to do that in a way that's natural and looks a lot like a cloud because we want that cloud experience in our data protection as well. So that's we're gonna talk about with Clue Meo Today, a lot of folks think in terms of moving all the data into the cloud. We think increasingly we have to recognize the cloud is not a strategy for centralizing data but rather distributing data and being able to protect that data where it is utilizing a simple, common cloudlike experience has become an increasingly central competitive need for a lot of digital enterprises. The first conversation we had was with poo John Kamar, who John is a CEO and co founder of Cuneo. Let's hear a Peugeot on had to say about data value. Data service is and clue Meo. John, Welcome to the show. >>Thank you. Very nice to be here. >>So give us the update. Include me. Oh, >>so come you. Ah, a two year old company, right? We dress recently launched out of stealth. So so far, you know, we we came out with the innovative offering which is a sass solution to go and protect on premises in November and vmc environments. That's what we launched out of style two months ago. We want our best of show. When we came out off Stilton in November 2019. But ultimately we started with a vision about protecting data respective off buried, recites So it was all about, you know, you know, on premises on Cloud and other SAS service is so one single service that protects data introspective about recites So far, we executed on on premises VM wear and Vmc. Today What we're announcing for the first time is our protection to go and protect applications natively built on aws. So these are application that ineptitude natively built on aws that clue me in as a service will protect respective off. You know them running, you know, in one region or cross region cross accounts and a single service little our customers to protect native AWS applications. The other big announcement we're making is a new round of financing, and that is testament to the interest in the space and the innovative nature off the platform that we have built. So when we came out of still, we announced we had raised two rounds of financing $51 million in series and series B round of financing. Today, what we're announcing is a serious see around the financing off $135 million the largest. I would say Siri see financing for a sass and the price company, especially a company that's a little over two years >>old. Look, graduations that's gonna buy a lot of new technology and a lot of customer engagement. But what customers is a set up from where customers are really looking for is they're looking for tooling and methods and capabilities that allow them to treat their data differently. Talk a bit about the central importance of data and how it's driving decisions. ACLU mia >>Yes, so fundamentally. You know, when we built out the data platform, it was about going after the data protection as the first use case in the platform. Longer term, the journey really is to go from a data protection company to a data management company, and this is possible for the first time because you have the public cloud on your side. If you're truly built a platform for the cloud on the public cloud, you have this distinct and want a JJ off. Now, taking the data that you're protecting and really leveraging it for other service is that you can enable the enterprise for, and this is exactly what and the prices are asking for, especially as they you know, you make a transition from on premises. So the public cloud where they're powering on more and more applications in the public cloud and they really, you know, sometimes have no idea in terms off where the data is sitting and how they can take advantage off all these data sources that ultimately clueless protecting >>Well, no idea where the data sitting take advantage of these data. Sources presumably facilitate new classes of integration because that's how you generate value out of data. That suggests that we're not just looking at protection as crucially important as it is we're looking at new classes of service is they're gonna make it possible to alter the way you think about data management. If I got that right and what are those in service is? >>Yes, it's It's a journey, As I said, very starting with Finnegan Data protection. It's also about doing there the protection across multiple clouds, right? So ultimately we had a platform. Even though we're announcing, you know, aws, you know, applications support. Today. We've already done the ember and BMC as we go along. You'll see us kind of doing this across multiple clouds, an application that's built on the cloud running across multiple clouds, AWS, Azure and DCP. Whatever it might be, you see, it's kind of doing there, the protection across in applications and multiple clouds. And then it's about going and saying, Can we take advantage of the data that we're protecting and really power on adjusting to use cases, they could be security use cases because we know exactly what's changing when it's changing. There could be infrastructure. Analytics use cases because people are running tens of thousands off instances and containers and envy EMS in the public cloud. And if a problem happens, nobody really knows what caused it. And we have all the data and we can kind off index it in the back end and lies in the back end without the customer needing to lift a finger and really show them what happened in their environment that didn't know about right. So there's a lot of interesting use cases that get powered on because you have the ability to index all the data year. You have the ability to essentially look at all the changes that are happening and really give that visibility. Tow the end customer and all of this one click and automating it without the customer needing to do much. >>I will tell you this that we've talked to a number of customers of Romeo and the fundamental choice. The clue. Meo choice was simplicity. How are you going to sustain that? Even as you have these new classes of service is >>that is the key right? And that is about the foundation we have built at the end of the day, right? So if you look at all of our customers that have on border today, it's really the experience where in less than 15 minutes they can essentially start enjoying the power of the platform and the back end that we have built. And the focus on design that we have is ultimately why we're able to do this with simplicity. So so when when we when we think about you know all the things we do in the back, and there's obviously a lot of complexity in the back end because it is a complex platform. But every time we ask ourselves the question that okay from a customer perspective, how do we make sure that it is one click and easy for them? So that focus and that attention to detail that we have behind the scenes to make sure that the customer ultimately should just consumed the service and should not need to do anything more than what they absolutely need to do so that they can essentially focus on what eggs value to the business >>takes a lot of technology, a lot of dedication to make complex things really simple. Absolutely. John Kumar, CEO and co founder of Coolio. Thanks very much for being on the Cube. Thank you. Great conversation with you, John. Data value leading to data service is now. Let's think a little bit more about how enterprises ultimately need to start thinking about how to manifest that in a cloud rich world, Chad Kenney is the vice president and chief acknowledges a Cuneo and Chad and I had an opportunity to sit down to talk about some of the interesting approach. Is that air possible because of cloud and very importantly, to talk about a new announcement that clue me is making as they expand their support of different cloud types? What's your Chad had to say? The notion of data service is has been around for a long time, but it's being upended, recast, reformed as a consequence of what cloud can do. But that also means that Cloud is creating new ways of thinking about data service. Is new opportunities to introduce and drive this powerful approach of thinking about digital businesses centralized assets and to have that conversation about what that means. We've got Chad Candy, who's a VP and chief technologist of Kumiko with us today. Chad, welcome to the Cube. >>Thanks so much for having me. >>Okay, so what? Start with that notion of data service is and the role because gonna play clue. Meo has looked at this problem or looked this challenge from the ground up. What does that mean? >>So if you look at the cloud is a whole customers have gone through a significant journey. We've seen you know that the first shadow I t kind of play out where people decided to go to the cloud I t was too slow. It moved into kind of a cloud first movement where people realize the power of cloud service is that then got them to understand a little bit of interesting things that played out one moving applications as they exist. We're not very efficient, and so they needed to re architect certain applications. Second, SAS was a core way of getting to the cloud in a very simplistic fashion without having to do much of whatsoever. And so, for applications that were not core competencies, they realized they should go sass. And for anything that was a core competency, they needed to really re architect to be able to take advantage of those very powerful cloud service is. And so when you look at it, if people were to develop applications today, cloud is the default. They'd go tours. And so for us, we had the luxury of building from the cloud up on these very powerful cloud service is to enable a much more simple model for our customers to consume. But even more so to be able to actually leverage the agility and elasticity of the cloud. Think about this for a quick second. We can take facilities, break them up, expand them across many different compute resource is within the cloud versus having to take kind of what you did on prim in a single server or multitudes of servers and try to plant that in the cloud from a customer's experience perspective. It's vastly different. You get a world where you don't think about how you manage the infrastructure, how you manage the service, you just consume it. And the value that customers get out of that is not only getting their data there, which is the on ramp around our data protection mechanisms, but also being able to leverage cloud. Native service is on top of that data in the longer term, as we have this one comment global index and platform. What we're super excited today to announce is that we're adding in eight of US native capabilities to be ableto protect that data in the public cloud. And this is kind of the default place where most people go to from a cloud perspective to really get their applications are up and running and take advantage of a lot of those cloud. Native service is >>well, if you're gonna be Claude native and promised to customers is going to support There were clothes. You've got to be obviously on eight of us, So congratulations on that. But let's go back to this notion of you use the word powerful 80 of the U. S. Is a mature platform, G C P is coming along very rapidly. Azure is also very, very good. There are others as well, but sometimes enterprises discover that they have to make some tradeoffs. To get the simplicity, they have to get less function, to get the reliability they have to get rid of simplicity. How does clue Meo think through those trade offs to deliver that simple? That powerful, that reliable platform for something is important. Data protection and data service is in general, >>so we wanted to create an experience that was single click, discover everything and be able to help people consume that service quickly. And if you look at the problem that people are dealing with a customer's talk to us about this all time is the power of the cloud resulted in hundreds, if not thousands of accounts within eight of us. And now you get into a world where you're having to try to figure out how did I manage all of these for one? Discover all of it and consistently make sure that my data, which, as you've mentioned, is incredibly important to businesses today as protected. And so having that one common view is incredibly important to start with, and the simplicity of that is immensely powerful. When you look at what we do as a business, to make sure that that continues to occur is first, we leverage cloud. Native Service is on the back, which are complex, and getting those things to run and orchestrate are things that we build on the back end on the front end. We take the customers view and looking at what is the most simple way of getting this experience to occur for both discovery as well as you know, backup recovery and even being able to search in a global fashion and so really taking their seats to figure out what would be the easiest way to both consume the service and then also be able to get value from it by running that service >>A W s has been around well, a ws in many respects founded the cloud industry. It's it's certainly sales force on the South side. But a W. S is the first company to make the promise that it was gonna provide this very flexible, very powerful, very agile infrastructures of service. And they've done absolutely marvelous job about it, and they've also advanced the stadium to the technology dramatically and in many respects, are in the driver's seat. What tradeoffs? What limits does your new platform faces? It goes to eight of us. Or is it the same Coolio experience, adding, Now all of the capabilities of eight of us? >>It's a great question. I think a lot of solutions out there today are different parts and pieces kind of club together. What we built is a platform that these new service is just get instantly added. Next time you log in to that service, you'll see that that available Thio and you could just go ahead and log in to your accounts and build to discover directly. And I think that the the power of sass is really that not only have we made it immensely secure, which is something that people think about quite a bit with having, you know, not only did in flight, but data at rest, encryption on and leveraging really the cloud capabilities of security. But we've made it incredibly simple for them to be able to consume that easily, literally not lift a finger to get anything done. It's available for you when you log into that system. And so having more and more data sources in one single pane of glass and being able to see all the accounts, especially in AWS, where you have quite a few of those accounts, and to be able to apply policies in a consistent fashion to ensure that your you know, compliant within the environment for whatever business requirements that you have around data protection is immensely powerful to our >>customers. Judd Jenny, chief technologist Clue me Oh, thanks very much for being on the Cube. Thank you. Great conversation. Chad especially interested in hearing about how Camilo is being extended to include eight of US service, is within its overall data protection approach and obviously into data service is let's take a little bit more into that clue. MEOWS actually generated and prepared a short video we could take a look at that goes a little bit more deeply into how this is all gonna work. >>Enterprises air moving rapidly to the cloud. Embracing sass for simplified delivery of key service is in this cloud centric world. I T teams could focus on more strategic work, accelerating digital transformation initiatives when it comes to backup. I t is stuck designing, patching and capacity planning for on Prem Systems. Snapshots alone for data protection in the public cloud is risky, and there are hundreds of unprotected SAS applications in the typical enterprise. Move to cloud should make backup simpler, but it can quickly become exponentially worse. It's time to rethink the backup experience. What if there were no hardware, software or virtual appliances to size, configure, manage or even by it all? And by adding enterprise backup, public cloud workloads are no longer exposed to accidental data Deletion and Ransomware and Clooney. Oh, we deliver secure data backup and recovery without any of that complexity or risk. We provide all of the critical functions of enterprise backup de Doop and scheduling user and key management and cataloging because were built in the public cloud, weaken rapidly, deliver new innovations and take advantage of inherent data security controls. Our mission is to protect your data wherever it's stored. The clue. Meo authentic SAS backup experience scales on demand to manage and protect your data more easily and efficiently. And without things like cloud bills or egress charges, Clooney oh gives you predictable costs. Monitor and global back of compliance is far simpler, and the built in always on security of clue. Meo means that your data is safe. Take advantage of the cloud for backup with no constraints. Clue. Meo Authentic sass for the Enterprise. >>Great video as we think about moving forward in the future and what customers are trying to do. We have to think more in terms of the native service is that cloud can provide and how to fully exploit them to increase the aggregate flexibility both within our enterprises, but also based on what our supplies have to offer. We had a great conversation with Runes Young, who is thesis CTO and co founder of Cuneo, about just that. Let's hear it wound had to say everybody's talking about the cloud and what the cloud might be able to do for their business. The challenge is there are a limited number of people in the world who really understands what it means to build for the cloud utilizing the cloud. It's a lot of approximations out there, but not a lot of folks are deeply involved in actually doing it right. We've got one here with us today, wound junk is thesis CEO and co founder of Clue Meo Womb. Welcome to the Cube. >>Happy to be here. >>So let's start with this issue of what it means to build for the cloud. Now Lou MEOWS made the decision to have everything fit into that as a service model. What is that practically need? >>So from the engineering point of view, building our sauce application is fundamentally different. So the way that I'll go and say is that at Cuneo we actually don't build software and ship software. What we actually do, it builds service and service is what you're actually shipped Our customers. Let me give you an example. In the case of Kun, you they say backups fail like so far sometimes fails. We get that failures too. The difference in between Clooney oh, and traditional solutions is that if something were to fail, we are they one detecting that failure before our customers do Not only that, when something fails, we actually know exactly why it failed. Therefore, we can actually troubleshoot it, and we can actually fix it and operate the service without the customer intervention. So it's not about the books also or about the troubleshooting aspect, but it's also about new features. If you were to introduce a new features, we can actually do this without having customers upgraded call. We will actually do it ourselves. So essentially it frees the customers from actually doing all these actions because we will do them on behalf of them >>at scale. And I think that's the second thing I want to talk about quickly. Is that the ability to use the cloud to do many of the things that you're talking about? At scale creates incredible ranges of options that customers have at their disposal. So, for example, a W s customers of historically used things like snapshots to provide ah modicum of data protection to their AWS workloads. But there are other new options that could be applied if the systems are built to supply them. Give us a sense of how clue Meal is looking at this question of, you know, snapshots were something else. >>Yes, So, basically, traditionally, even on the imprints, out of the things, you have something called the snapshots and you had your backups right, and they're they're fundamentally different. But if you actually shift your gears and you look at what A. W s offers today. They actually offers stability for you to take snapshots. But actually, that's not a backup, right, And they're fundamentally different. So let's talk about it a little bit more what it means to be snapshots and a backup, right? So they say, there's a bad actor and your account gets compromised like your AWS account gets compromised. So then the bad actor has access not only to the EBS volumes, but also to the snap shows. What that means is that that person can actually go in and delete the E. V s volume as well as the TVs nuptials. Now, if you had a backup, let's say you are should take a backup of that TVs William to whom you that bad actor would have access to the CVS volumes. However, it won't be able to delete the backup that we actually have, including you. So in the whole thing. The idea off Romeo is that you should be able to protect all of your assets, that being either an on Prem or neither of us by setting up a single policies. And these are true backups and not just snapshots >>and that leads to the last question I have, which is ultimately the ability to introduce thes capabilities. At scale creates a lot of new opportunities of customers can utilize to do a better job of building applications, but also, I presume, managing how they use AWS because snapshots and other types of service can expand dramatically, which can increase your cost. How is doing it better with things like Native Backup Service is improve customers ability to administer the AWS spend and accounts. >>So, great question. So, essentially, if you look at the enterprises today, obviously they have multiple on premise data centers and also a different car providers that they use like AWS and Azure and also a few SAS applications, Right? So then the idea is for Camilo is to create this single platform what all of the stains can actually be backed up in a uniform way where you can actually manage all of them. And then the other thing is all doing it in the cloud. So if you think about it, if you don't solve the problem, fundamental in the cow, their stings that you end up paying later on. So let's take an example. Right. Uh, moving bites. Moving bites in between one server to the other. Traditionally basically moving bites from one rack to the other. It was always free. You never had to pay anything for that. >>Certainly in the data center. >>Right? But if you actually go to the public cloud, you cannot say the same thing, right? Basically, moving by across AWS recent regions is not free anymore. Moving data from AWS to the on premises. That's not for either. So these are all the things that you know cop provider service providers are gods has to consider and actually solved so that the customers can on Lee back it up into come you. But then they actually can leverage different cloud providers, you know, in a seamless way, without having to worry all of this costs associated with it so criminal we should be able to back it up. But we should be able to also offer mobility in between either aws back up the M word or the M C. >>So if I can kind of summarize what you just said that you want to be able to provide to an account to an enterprise, the ability to not have to worry about the back and infrastructure from a technical and process standpoint, but not also have to worry so much about the back and infrastructure from a cost of financial standpoint that by providing a service and then administering how that service is optimally handled, the customer doesn't have to think about some of those financial considerations of moving get around in the same way that they used to. Have I got that right, >>I absolutely, yes, basically multiple accounts, multiple regions, multiple couple providers. It is extremely hard to manage. What come your does. It will actually provide you a single pane of glass where you can actually manage them all. But then, if you actually think about just and manageability this, actually you can actually do that by just building a management layer on top of it. But more importantly, you really need to have a single data repository for you. For us to be able to provide a true mobility in between them. One is about managing, but the other thing is about if you're done, if you're done in the real divide way, it provides you the ability to move them and leverages the cloud power so that you don't have to worry about the cloud expenses but whom you internally is the one that actually optimizing all of this for our customers. >>Wound young cto and co founder of Coolio. Thanks very much for being on the Q. Thank you. Thanks very much. Room I want to thank clue me Oh, for providing this important content about the increasingly important evolution of data protection Cloud. Now, here's your opportunity to weigh in on this crucially important arena. What do you think about this evolving relationship? How do you foresee it operating in your enterprise? What comments do you have? What questions do you have of the thought leaders from Clue Me? Oh, and elsewhere. That's what we gonna do now we're gonna go into the crowd chat. We're gonna hear from each other about this really important topic and what you foresee in your enterprise as your digital business transforms, it's crochet

[Music] hi and welcome to another cube conversation this time from the MCS Hilux immersion day at the Santa Clara Marriott beautiful Northern California we're going to be spending the entire day having a series of discussions about what it means to do a better job of both digital services management and operations management and how those technologies are coming together to dramatically alter how business operates how customers get value and ultimately how profits are generated we're going to start this conversation with a CDO a chief digital officer from Genpact sanjay sri tvasta welcome to the cube thank you very much so to start tell us a little bit about Jim pacts interesting company comprised we are indeed Genpact is a large global professional services provider for digital transformation services we serve many of the fortune 500 companies around the world and we help them think through their business processes in the business models and digitally transform that to take advantage of so all the new capabilities that are coming through so digital service outcomes is a very important feature of that because I presume that when you have those conversations with customers you're talking about the outcomes that they're trying to achieve yeah and not just the services that you're gonna provide it's fine so tell us a little bit about what is a digital service outcome and why is it so important yeah well I think the reality is that what technology is doing it it's disintermediating the ecosystem so many of the industries our clients operate in and they have to go back and reimagine their value proposition of the core of what they do with the use of new innovative technologies and it's that intersection of new capabilities of new innovative business models that really use emerging technologies but intersect them with their business models with their business processes and the requirements of their clients and help them rethink reimagine and deliver the new value proposition that's really what it's all about so digital service outcome would then be the things that the business must do and must do well but ideally with a different experience or with a different degree of flexibility and agility or with and cost profile I got that right correct so when we think about that what are some of the key elements of a digital service success we like to think about three critical success factors in driving any digital transformation the first one is the notion of experience and what I mean by that is not user interface for a piece of software but the journey of a customer an employee a provider a partner in engaging with you in your business model and we think about journey mapping that scientifically we think about design thinking on the back of that and we think about reimagining what the new experience looks like one of the largest things we learned in the industry is digital transformation on the back of costs take out a productivity or efficiency is is is insufficient to drive and optimize the value that digital can bring and using experience as the compass is sort of the Northstar in that journey is a meaningful differentiator and drive our business benefits so that's number one in the second area that's become increasingly apparent is the intersection of domain with digital and the thinking there is that to materialize the benefit of digital in an enterprise you have to intersect it with the specifics of that business how users interact what clients seek how does business actually happen you know we talk about it artificial intelligence a lot we do a lot of work in AI is an example and there's key thing about machine learning is goal orientation and what is goal orientation it's about understanding the specifics of your environments you can actually orient the goal of the machine learning algorithm to deliver higher high accuracy results and it's something that can often easily get overlooked so indexing on the two halves of the whole the yin and the yang the the the piece around digital and the innovative technologies and being able to leverage and take advantage of them but equally be founded and domain understand the environment and use that knowledge to drive the right materialization of the and that's the second critical success factor I think to get it right I think that third one is the notion of how do you build a framework for innovation you know it's not the sort of thing where large fortune company 100 500 fortune 500 companies can necessarily experiment and you know it's a little bit for go happy-go-lucky strategy it doesn't really work you have to innovate at scale you have to do it in a fundamental fashion you have to do it as a critical success factor and so one of the biggest things we focus on is how do you innovate at the edge innovation must be at the edge this is where the rubber meets the road but governance has to be at the core let me build on that for a second because you said innovations at the edge so basically that means where the brand promise is being enacted for the customer and that could be at an industrial automation setting or it could be in recommendation if any any number of things but it's where the value proposition is realized for the customer correct okay that's exactly right and that's where innovation must happen so as a large corporation you must be you know it's important to set up a framework that allows you to do innovation at the edge otherwise it's not meaningful innovation if you will it's just a lot of busy work and yet as you do that and if you change your business model is you bring new components to the equation how do you drive governance and it's increasingly becoming more important you think about we're gonna be in a AI first world increasingly more and more that's the reality the world we're going in and in that AI first world you know III work here in Palo Alto I walk into my office a couple of hundred people in any given day if tomorrow morning I walked in and hundred people didn't show up for work I would know right away because I can see them now fast forward to an environment where we have digital workers we have automation BOTS we have conversationally I chat box and in that world understanding which of my AI components are on which ones are off which ones showed up for work today which ones fell sick and really being able to understand that governance and that's just the productivity piece of it then you think about data and security AI changes complete dimensions on that and you think about bias and explained ability to become increasingly important and notion of a digital ethics board and thinking about ethics more pervasively so I think that companies and clients we serve that do really well in digital transformation are those that keen on those three things the notion of experience is the true compass for how you try transformation the ability to intermix domain and digital in a meaningfully intersecting fashion and to be thoughtful proactive and get governance right up front in the journey to come so let me again building out a little bit because people are increasingly recognizing that we're not going to centralized with cloud we're going to greater distribute we're going to distribute data more we're going to distribute function more but you just added another dimension that some some of us have been thinking about for a long time and that's this notion of distributing authorities yeah so that an individual at the edge can make the decision based on the data and the resources that are available with the appropriate set of authorities and that has to be handled at a central in a in a overall coherent governed way so that leaves the next question and just before you go that I mean I think the best example of that is we do that most corporations do that really well in the financial scheme of things business is that the edge make decisions on a day-to-day basis on pricing and and relationships and so on and so forth and yet there's a central audit committee that looks through the financials and make sure it meets the right requirements and has the right framework and much in the same way we're gonna start seeing digital ethics committees that become part of these large corporations as they think about digitizing the business governance at the end of the day is how do you how you orchestrate multiple divergent claims against a common set of assets and and being able to do that it's absolutely essential and it leads to this notion of we've got to cite these ideas of digital business digital services and operations management how are we going to weave them together utilizing some of these new technologies new fabrics that are now possible to both achieve the outcomes we're talking about at scale in its speed yeah well the the technology capabilities are improving really well in that area and so the good news is there's a set of tools that are now available that give you the ingredients the the components of the recipe that's required to make dinner well you know the the work that needs to happen is actually how to orchestrate their that to figure out which components you to come in and how do you pull together a vertical stack that has the right components to meet your needs today and more importantly to address the needs of the future because this is changing like no other time in history you want options with everything you do now you want to make sure that you have a stream of options for the future and that's especially important here that's right that's exactly right and and the the the quick framework we've established there is sort of the three-legged stool of how do you integrate quickly how do you modular eyes your investments and how do you govern them into one integrated whole and those become really important I'll give you examples you know much of the work we do will work with the consumer bank for instance and they'll want to do a robotic process automation engagement will run on for nine months they'll get 1,800 robots up and running and the next question becomes well now we have all this data that we didn't really have because now we have an RPA running how do I learn some machine learning insights from there and so we then work with them to actually drive some insights and get these questions answered and then the engagement changes to well now that we have this pattern recognition that we understand more questions will be asked how do I respond to those questions a automatically and before they get asked this notion of next best action and so you think about that journey of a traditional client you know the requirements change from robotics to machine learning to conversationally AI to something else and keeping that string of investments that that innovative sort of streak true and yet being able to manage govern and protect the investments that's the key role and especially if we do want to look at innovation at the edge because we want to see some commonalities otherwise we freaked people out along the way don't exactly right so I'm J Street of AUSA thank you very much for being on the cube thank you for having me and once again I'm Peter Burroughs and we'll be back with our next guest shortly from BMC Hilux immersion day here at the Santa Clara Marriott thanks very much for listening

from our studios in the heart of Silicon Valley Palo Alto California this is a cute conversation hi and welcome to the cube Studios for another cube conversation where we go in-depth with thought leaders driving innovation across the tech industry I'm your host Peter Burris one of the dominant considerations that every business faces today is how do they work through the complex outcomes associated with cybersecurity as they find new ways to use their data and apply it to new classes of customer and market problems this is not a small problem especially given that so many bad actors out there are now also seeing a company's data as a potential enormous source of value now to see what businesses are doing to try to achieve those complex outcomes while at the same time lowering their overall security risk we've got a great conversation first off welcoming back Eric Herzog who's the chief marketing officer and vice president of worldwide storage channels from IBM storage Eric welcome back to the queue yeah thank you love to come and Eric you bought with you a really distinguished individual kaeleen Sanchez as vice president of IBM worldwide Systems lab service and some technical universities Colleen welcome back to the cube thank you so let's get the quick update where are we in this world of the outcomes of businesses seeking let's start with you what what our business is trying to do with cybersecurity today protect data and ensure that we provide a certain level of security levels to enable the overall end-to-end protection holistically so it's really important that we enable a full stack hence the strong partnership with Eric and I too and also the global team to pull together solutions then enable data protection so let's talk about the reasons why it's becomes that much more acute or that needs to become that much more acute because we've got we've got the reality that everybody's going to get penetrated in the next year of any size that it takes a long time often to figure out that you have been penetrated you've got new types of attacks the old ones of just kind of know phishing and whatnot while still prevalent so a problem now we've got ransomware and we've got a lot of new types of actions that bad people are taking what are some of the things that we're trying to protect ourselves from these days so the B's thing is you mentioned ransomware it's like this idea that we want to protect and also act as a worm so to speak to provide an abstraction layer to enable protection holistically of any given solution because data can be everywhere nowhere so yeah there's discussions about it's the new oil it's not the new oil necessarily it's pervasive it's everywhere so our data from our perspective can be in any device any media type and we need to figure out how to protect it at its core and so you see it as a full stack that just means we have to go lower in layers in order to protect the overall data so kind of what you're saying is that the more the security is closer to the data the more the data itself is secure the less reliant we are on policy which can lead to human error or human mistakes which could allow folks come in I got that right you're correct it's smart data it's this idea that it's multiple pieces and multiple owners of a maker checker policy that keeps the overall solution accountable that doesn't diminish the need for policy but Eric it certainly raises the specter or the spectrum of the fact that increasingly the smart folks within a business that are insuring or trying to diminish risk and ensuring assurance of the data need to start looking at how storage or the role that storage plays in this overall security framework I got that right yeah if you think about a traditional company their approach is we need to get security software to keep the bad guys out and they mean it's the Chiricahua for when we are breached to track them down talking to several CIOs at even midsize companies let alone the fortune 500 is sometimes it takes them days even weeks as you said to know they've even been training penetrated yet track it down while they're doing that imagine someone coming into your house and the police don't show up for 10 minutes even though your alarm went off and by the time the police go your house is totally empty and IBM stores you make sure that that doesn't happen it's as if everything is bolted down everything is locked and if they do steal something for example it's say write once read many technology they can't really use it right because it's wormed they can't change it so it's almost as if your TV required a fingerprint and even if they stole it they couldn't use your TV and that's the kind of thing I want to do is be pervasive and get enterprises as well as even small and mean courts to realize an overall cyber resiliency and security strategy involves keeping the bad guys out email will track them down but when they are in the house making sure everything is secure and essentially nothing can be stolen or utilized of your incredibly valuable data so using your metaphor of making sure the TV is bolted down or whatever is is bolted down that's however doesn't diminish the business's ability to move the TV if they want to if they have the rights and privileges to do so so let's talk about how the new tooling of storage is being bought together with some of the new services approaches to achieve these complex outcomes how is IBM looking at storage and storage related technologies as a as a foundation for achieving the new outcomes that the businesses want so for my services perspective we go in and partner with our core technologies within the storage portfolio to enable like something like bare metal to enable the armor around the overall solution we work to with the client to understand their pain points etc and how we optimize the solution to substantiate that we provide highly resilient flexible access to data but at the same time it's protected now this is a fast changing world and it's there's there's an enormous expertise both on the good side and the bad side obviously you've got you've got a development background talk a little bit about how IBM is relying on customers relying on universities other sources of deep knowledge about security issues and then translating that into IP that then finds itself into places like Eric storage portfolio so so we have processes like for instance the technical universities so we have discussions with an extended set of worldwide engineers and scientists to talk about specific important pain points related to cyber security so when we obtain that data we provide the training we collect information and then we provide or funnel that back into Eric's portfolio from an IBM storage perspective so Eric look you've you're an old man for an act as amaya as am i and so that is one area where security has not been an afterthought it's not been that separate how to what degree has that relationship between security and data and storage of permeated the way that you think about solutions solution directions and engaging your customers with your value propositions so one of the big things we've done is make sure that our security is across the entire portfolio primary data flash disk secondary data disk or tape and in fact as you know IBM is known for its hybrid multi cloud storage technology capable of easily and transparently tearing out to multiple public cloud providers when that data is in flight sure site better be encrypted so we've made sure that where this ransom where malware protection data encryption rest across the entire portfolio right once read many technology things like FIPS 140 - - which is a very important federal specification around security malware and ransomware protection with air gapping both to tape but also to cloud so we've made sure that the security aspect of storage is pervasive primary storage secondary storage cloud storage whatever you're doing your storage will always be secure so when they do breach the wall and they track the bad guy down as they're rooting around your file your block your object storage it's secure and they can't get anybody from the data you still can but they can't steal that data from you and that's a critical capability of spreading it beyond just the mainframe we have great technology with our new safeguard copy product we brought out last year that does incredible things to secure data but in fact we make sure that all sorts of security and resiliency technologies from an IBM perspective are spread even into our lowest end product our store wise 50 10 e has full data rest encryption encryption and flight so all those technologies everyone from the very entry products all the way up to our high-end product the DES family and everything in between yeah well one of the things about digital business is we're discovering new ways of leveraging data and unanticipated avenues to try to generate additional business and one of the things we've seen as we talk to customers is that increasingly that means that the weakest link in your security chain is going to be it's going to be instrumental at defining your overall security policy so treating security is an option is because you can secure something over here is increasingly difficult as you find new ways of integrating data so how is IBM helping to get customers to see that so I would say two points from lab services perspective as well as our business partners we we take on a consultative discussion or partnership so we learn from our clients and partners and users as much as they learn from us and we provide offerings to really explore that full stack to make that data smarter as we discussed before so digital business is happening it's transforming very rapidly IBM talks about the rise of the incumbents as they bring some of these digital native capabilities into their business I'm going to ask each of you for the one thing that you think is going to be most important for customers to think about this relationship between data storage and security Eric I'll start with you what do you think is the one thing that people need to start thinking more about over the course next year storage is not an afterthought in your secure strategy killing how about you co-create with our end users to enable the full and and prediction as you mentioned before and as you co-create don't forget that storage is intrinsic to whether or not it's secure or not great conversation thank you both for being here Eric Herzog's the chief marketing officer and vice president worldwide storage channels at IBM storage Colleen Sanchez is the vice president IBM worldwide Systems lab services and technical universities once again thank you both for being here and talking about this crucially important area thank you for having us thank you alright and once again I'm Peter Burroughs and until next time this has been a cube conversation [Music] you

>> live from Miami Beach, Florida It's the que covering demon 2019. Brought to you, by the way. >> Welcome back to Miami. Everybody watching the Cube, The leader in live tech coverage. This is Day two of the mon 2019 3 cubes. Third year at V mon, We did New Orleans. We did Chicago last year. Course here at the Fountain Blue in Miami. Great venue for an event like this. I'm Dave a lot. It was my co host, Peter Burroughs. Abba Dabbas. Eye is Adi is here. He's the head of a Charles Russell speech. Liza London based law firm. How about great. Great to see you. Thanks for coming on. Thankyou. So you tell us about this judge. Interesting name. Charles Russell. Speech lease. It was a merger of two firms, Right. Tell us how it all came about. >> Back in 2,014 Charles, loss of species performed for a merger between two different companies. Charles docile and speaks Lee Burcham from a 90 perspective. That was very interesting for the two departments coming together s So we have a limited time period where we had to merge these two companies Two different systems different data centers, different data sets. So it was formed by emerging back in 2,014 for five years on way here today >> that we see this a lot, you know, Emanate goes down. The acquiring company of this sounds like it was a merger. You know, they sort of battle. Okay, who's going toe? Really? Which framework is going to win? Because I'm sure had that conversation. But so to take us through that merger, what it entailed what? What the scenario looked like and how you plan for it. Sure. >> So I was part of the Charles. Also legacy Charles Russell team on, then obviously speaks about. Some had their own team as well. So initially, when we first found out about the merger, it was essential for the two teams to get together to work out. Okay, What systems? You have free mail. What systems you have for document management system playing trump cards. Which is who's got the best system and which way do we wantto move forward? A little. >> Ah, >> so but being a law firm, most law firms around the world and in the UK especially used the same types of software so essentially that from that perspective it was It was it was quite simple. But then way had to work out. How do we How do we go forward with this? Because two different headquarters in the London area. Which office do we move into? Sort of logistics around that. Can we fit in pre merger? It was six. Charles Lawson had sickle. Roughly 600 people, especially birds, had roughly 500 people. So pretty comparable. Yeah, yeah. So working out space logistics was was an issues >> making that even even more complicated, right? Yeah. >> One of the things that's interesting about a law firm, like versus a traditional manufacturer or AW financial services firm that has a lot of very fast right writing systems and have to scale on those lines is a law firms feature very complex dogs, very complex in from out of files, a lot of files that are written. But at the same time, you have to be repurposed to a lot of different work flows very sensitive to external contingent regulatory change. And so you have all of that happening, especially, I mean, two years ago from now on MySpace steak, and it was you're getting into brexit stuff, too, so that also had to be a source of uncertainty. So how has it been combining external regulatory issues the way that technology is being used in law firms and some of the new work clothes that you guys trying to support? And then adding, On top of that, the complexity of bringing these two firm GPR >> GPO itself was It was a year old project for us on. Obviously, we've got offices. The Middle East, but obviously is in the Far East on DH in Central Europe has well, so data logistics or where it sits, is an issue for us as well. So GDP, ours being a big project for us in terms of the merger itself. It was it was very, very difficult for the two I T departments to come together on actually work out. How how do we go to one unified systems? Essentially one doctor man, just in one email system. All of that took a lot of plan in law project management on essentially within the legal press itself. We got doubted in the time frames that we had that we can achieve it on within. I think It was 18 month period. We had merged order, different systems and various offices because speech the Bertram and Time is what I had. Offices in Zurich and Geneva were to merge with different offices together as well. So it was. It was a big, big task for the i T department on the firm itself. >> They're very tight migration deadlines. And and as you started to approach those deadlines you had to worry about, Okay, When we're going to cut over, how do we avoid downtime? How do we make sure that we don't? You know, I have bad data, data, corruption and the like. So how did you plan for that? And how did it go? >> So wait, we're here. C'mon on DH. Veen was It was it was a big part of our migration process. So where we had two different parts of the business Different storage systems, Different actualization system's way used to mean a CZ. The middleman basically, to my great data, from one day to center to another, using swink it. So where there was a large amount of terabytes and terabytes, amount of data way had swing kit available to us using team were able to be to be essentially a love the environments into the swing care and then bring them over to the other side of the business. And vain was essentially part on on top of that, making sure that the data that we were coming that will bring in a cross is true and not corrupt on DH, that using some of their technology is sure backups and stuff like that really, really was essential to, you know, do migration going well >> And was was Wien installed and both organizations at the time? Or was that something that you had to sort of redeploy? >> And yeah, So Legacy Charles also had way was actually myself going back probably eight years ago. Version For a time, I think team had 20,000 customers. So to here >> there were version 10 now 33 150 >> 1,001,000, 4,000 month. >> That makes me proud that we invested in vain when we did good car. So yeah, it was It was a good call from us, and essentially three other side of the business did not have. But then we just wait. Expanded our Venus State to look at both sides and then bring him across on. And then, ever since then, we've grown our vamos state across the world, across all of officers. So >> So how did you do that? So that was that was another migration that had to occur. And did you? You kind of do those simultaneously. Did you do the theme of migration first, and then bring the two systems together? >> Do you seem to do Stouffer special sauce in the migration? >> Yeah. So Veen was essentially a tool that we used to my great data sensors from one data center to another using their backup technology using their replication technology, we were able to replicate all of one side's virtual machines to the other. And then that gave us that gave us the flexibility as well. When when we had the limited down time periods that we've had, they give us the flexibility to actually Circe the business is during these particular ours. We're not gonna be able to You're not gonna have access to these systems because we're going to bring up systems from point A to point B. So veen was essential to them if >> you had to do it over again. If he had a mulligan, what would you have done differently? What what advice might you give to somebody who's trying to go through a similar migration? >> I would say Give your partners and lawyers more realistic time. Pray the time frame that we would get. >> Or don't let them give you an unrealistic time for him. >> Exactly. Yeah, so says ensured that the amount of work it's it's not just day to itself. You know, we're talking network and we're talking security. We're talking, you know, to to similar sized companies coming together. We were very, very limited time frame, consolidating all of their systems into one which is essential for the two parts of the business to collaborate together because, you know, way could have taken our time. We could have got to take this free four years a CE, far as we're concerned. But the fact that we did do it in such a quick time for him and that business to parts of the business from Day one can collaborate much better with each other. So >> we talked a lot about digital business transformation and you know, our approach or our observations on the digital business transformations, the process by which you altar and change your firm to re institutionalize the work. Change your game. Tomato Grover. All governments model as you use data as an asset, so that's affecting every firm everywhere. How's it affecting a law firm and you know your law from specifically on? How is that going to change your stance in your approach to data protection >> Data is incredibly important to unlawful. A zit is to most most organizations, but in terms of, you know, one of one of the things that's quite important in terms of law firms. We work with the financial institutions, so we held information by that. We hold personal data way hold all times of information. Charles Oscar speech leads works with Aware is of law apart from Kunal. So the areas of law that they worked with his vast in terms of the amount of data that we hold and essentially I mean, for us data is the most important thing that runs the firm and having visibility tow our data. How do we How do we work that data? How do we then market based on the data that we have? How do we market ourselves from that data. You know, there might be one area the business that's dealing with a family issue, family law. But then, you know that that could correspond with the litigation issue. You know, how do we work that data? To be to be an advancing to our businesses is extremely important. For >> what? What do you think of the announcements this week? I'm kind of curious. I was liketo ask the practitioners of what they think about. You know what was announced. You had, uh, well, you had the ve made $1,000,000,000. That's kind of fun and cool, but But you had the with the program, which was kind of interesting. The whole ap I look the beam availability orchestrator, where they're really talking about recovering from backups as a host that needed to recover from, you know, a replicated instance. You know, some of the automated testing stuff was kind of interesting. They talked about dynamic documentation, things you saw this week that you'll actually go back and say, Hey, I can apply that to solve a problem. Sure. >> So, essentially, I think I've been a really good question is very relevant to us many of not just ourselves law firm but many of the other law firms around the world are now looking at cloud based services now for us. I mean, this was a big thing five years ago way you know, everyone was talking about public clouds. Us. We're now we're now looking clouds and where basically, we've bean pushed by the vendors themselves to go towards cloudlike Citrix, for example. Their licensing model was based around their services. So is Microsoft in Mike's off? You don't you don't really have, you know, exchange anymore. Within premises you have off 365 A lot of the SAS applications are moving toward the cloud on DH. What wrote me? I had to say doing the keynote in regards to act, too. And how team are trying to be the visionaries in terms of look at that cloud is their next big thing for the next 10 years, offering often a crucial and for businesses like ours who have limited exposure to cloud technologies limited understanding, essentially having a tool that could migrate from one cloud to another. It's fantastic, you know, we've offered, you know I've spoken to, obviously are United directors around the other law firms where I wanted to have gone to the public cloud. But they don't know how to come back in and having a tall that essentially gives you that flexibility to bring it back in house to go form a ws to zoo. Or if there's a particular assess application, for example, that piers better with a W s. But you've got your other application that piers with that particular application is your Why would you want to have in the door? You'll probably want to move into a W eso for us, I think. What? The message coming out of'em on this year has bean really, really helpful for us. >> So So when you started with theme, they had it said 20,000 custom You like the 20001st customer on DIT was coincided with the virtual ization, you know, craze. Do you feel like the team knowing what you know about them, you have a lot of experience with them Consort of Replicate that success in this town intendant and in Act two, >> I think when I first looked at them, Wow, this is really, really simple. It's a bit like an iPhone. You know you given iPhone to your grandmother or to your children, and they have to play with it. And I see the beam as an intuitive piece of software that easy fighting professionals to get on with it, as their slogan said a few years ago. It just works. It does just work. Wear were great advocates of him. It's worked wonders for us. We've acquired smaller businesses using we've managed companies using and when I see you know, when you go to the sessions and you see the intelligence behind their thinking, I think going back to your question I think Wei si oui, si, vamos a strategic partner for us when we see their vision and we believe in their vision, and I think what they're doing in terms of what they working on next few years, I think we're well favor there, and I think, you know, essentially, that's where the most of their business is going to come from, >> where you sit down with, you know, rat mayor over over vodka and he says, Tell me the one thing I could do to make your life you know, easier, better you can't say cut prices s a hellhole. But what would you advise him to >> make my life better >> other than Jim instead of >> yeah, eyes that >> would make you crazy. >> So in terms of a zoo, a technology, >> your business relationship or something, she'd like to see them do that would. I >> think in terms of mergers and acquiring companies, seen license rentals will be a good thing. I know, I know. They give you a valuation license keys, and that's something that you can use. So, for example, if we were to acquire a company that has hundreds of servers and PM's having license rentals for a period of time, able >> to spin it up and spin it down actually allowed >> Exactly. Yeah, that would be an advantage. I think in terms of what you know what they're doing in the marketplace, and a lot of law firms use him. I feel I can't do any more than they are doing now. And in all the years that we've used to be my fingers on eight years now, but we've only had one serious problem, and the way they got that problem, you know the way, the way they communicated to reverse the way they a lot of different teams across the the Europe and the US go involved. I think, you know, in terms of service, in terms of software, in terms of what they what they do for us. I don't think there's anything more to add. Teoh. Right? Maia's vision. >> That's great for their custom of it. Well, thanks so much for coming on. The Cube is not heavy. Really? Thank you very much. You're welcome to keep it right there, buddy Peter, and I'll be back with our next guests right after this short break. We're live from Miami at the front of Blue Hotel. You're watching the Cube from Vienna on 2019 right back.

live from Miami Beach Florida it's the queue covering beam on 2019 brought to you by V hello everyone welcome back to Miami this is the cubed a leader and live tech covers is day two of our coverage of v-mon 2019 at the Fontainebleau Hotel in sunny Miami Dave Volante with Peter Burroughs Trevor stars is here is the director of systems engineering for pure storage Trevor great to see you again yeah thanks for having me yeah well we've been following pure since the did the early days I remember interviewing Scott Dietzen it's a snw way back when and seeing the ascendency and the rise fewer hits escape velocity he goes public just been an awesome ride you guys have really kind of transformed the industry started out as you know the flash play but now really getting much deeper into sort of data and data strategies and data protection is one of those so we're here at v-mon what are your impressions so far this week the conference has been great a lot of great interactions theme has been an incredibly strong alliance partner for us the synergies are just incredible because you know as we've evolved as you mentioned from a singular product in all flash array and disrupting the market there back in the early 2010's evolving into more of a data platform company and data protections actually turned out to be a great business for us it's growing incredibly fast and you know like I said a lot of great synergies with beam so the systems engineering role has always been a critical part of the the sales process right this right the SC's is like I need an se you know and then you guys will go in help the sales team really understand what the customer needs you'll help solve problems but how was that roll it to find a pure and how was it evolving in the industry yeah absolutely and I think similar to our products in the early days we we hired a lot of folks who were storage specialists and and we've evolved into having to go far beyond that right into the different realms around things like AI machine learning data protection you know virtualization containers and so it it's definitely evolving it's challenge to us as a company and we're certainly trying to not maintain a status quo we want to continue to disrupt and do that in adjacent markets so how do you work with veem just in terms of taking your platform and their software and making a solution that's kind of simple for customers it's not you know stove-piped you know single throat to choke describe that whole process yeah yeah so we recently earlier this year maybe it was late last year we we developed some integration with beam to where we we actually integrate with their universal storage API so beam can control pure storage snapshots which you're which are probably familiar with pure snapshots on flash are incredibly powerful it's a it's a very powerful metadata engine in purity and which means we can take thousands of snapshots with no performance impact in their near instantaneous with veeam we can instantly integrate that into Veen backup and data protection workflows and vm can completely control pure storage snapshots both honoré and offer a which we'll talk about without having to have a storage administrator log into pure at all okay and so talk more about how the system plays with your customers I mean when you're when you're in with the customer and you're sort of scoping it out how is that conversation changing is just in terms of as you say you went from okay here's an array and flash now there's all the spectrum of other things that you're doing that's what's the data protection conversation like how does it relate to their digital transformation their digital business where do you guys fit there well operationally we've seen a huge trend from customers that a decade or so ago you saw the trend of going from disk to disk to tape tape for long term archive what we're actually here at the conference really promoting is this idea of the next big wave of evolution there which is we see customers going from flash to flash for the first step in backup and then instead of off-site tape going to the cloud so that's been an incredibly successful message for us early on and so that actually started with you know I mentioned the pure flash or a snapshot integration but actually moving those snapshots off of flash array to our second product which is flash blade flash blades a really unique product it was originally designed with the next big wave of innovation in mind around things like containers and deep learning where high amounts of bandwidth and parallelism are just absolutely critical billions of small files it just so happens that actually caters really well to backup performant and restore performance so backing up to disk was a big success for a lot of customers but what they're seeing now and what we're seeing as workloads continue to get more diverse is that there's a restore challenge so we have customers that are backing up to disk but they're seeing massive challenges around getting their data back and getting back online the recovery time objective pressures from the business are becoming more and more important this actually started for us in the SAS industry where one of the world's largest SAS providers out in Silicon Valley had to do an increasing amount of restore and they've they actually started using flash blade as what we call a rapid restore platform so they're able to nearly instantaneously restore these databases and what we found is nearly across the board and in all other industries that there's a large number of customers that have that challenge more so then we find you know going to market with flash played for like AI for example there's not as many people doing that quite yet we've been successful in the ones that are but across the board healthcare legal high-tech you name it it there's a restore problem and with flash played we've seen people go you know for example one of our really other customers outside of the SAS world is in the healthcare space the industry's number one cancer center in the in the world is actually leveraging it for rapid restore for databases but they're also doing some other neat things because flash blades not a purpose-built backup appliance it can be used for other things anything file an object works great so what you can do is you can combine the use cases and that's been really powerful from a TCO perspective you might say customers might say well you know flash is too expensive but if there's a restore problem that may not matter and then if you combine it with other use cases we call that our data hub story it's even more powerful in the TCO becomes you know really attractive so the healthcare using it for PACs and rapid restore you know there's other industries like you know my gaming industry like I mentioned high tech so that data hub message has been really powerful that's return on asset and asset leverage oh absolutely and and and one of the things I'd like to talk about Trevor is relating to that is there are a lot of ways of describing some of those fundamentals some of those really contingent and essential changes that are taking place in the industry today but one of them clearly is flash allows us to move from a data storage orientation of record and you know save the data to one of deliver the data to new applications pure has been at the vanguard of that and has seen a lot of these new use cases as we think about no return on data assets and whatnot how is your visibility into those new use cases changing Pure's perspective and pure customers perspective on data protection because it seems like the notion of data protection which has been around for a long time is starting to fray as these new use cases say it's not just protecting about what's happened it's setting me up for doing new types of work in the future so how is that how is pure seeing that how does that conversation about data protection changing because of some of the drive that purus got in them in the marketplace yeah and I think the first step is hey I can backup my data but if I can't use it it's kind of worthless right so being able to use that data and much much more rapidly but also repurposing that this idea of data silos has been around IT for years and with flash blade and that data hub story we're really breaking down those silos to be able to say hey the same the same platform that you're storing your data protection data as well as other data it's the same platform that I might be able to spin that data up so beams got a great story with data labs where you can actually spin up these virtual environments and run and on a purposeful backup device you know you it's it's questionable if that actually works right and having to pull that back over the network to another silo with Flash blade and the data hub it makes that realistic and and getting so much more out of the data delivering that back to the business and actually be able to deliver these key insights into what my data is actually doing and be able to make better business decisions as what the output you see kind of an analogy of a relationship between previous to now where storage was about persisting data and therefore was about protecting what has happened to flash being about delivering data to new applications and therefore there's some new concept our customers pushing you guys towards something that goes that's bigger than data protection I mean it's something that we're struggling with and one of the customers we have is struggling with how do I talk about what these services are when I'm spitting up kubernetes clusters like that that's right so is it is there some new conversation that you're starting to see you guys are one of the first to have a conversation about data you know flash data for AI are you starting to have conversations about you know deliver data something more than protection yeah near real-time ability to spin up development environments see ICD pipelines all of those things we actually have a product that as a pure customer you get as inclusive of maintenance contract called pure source service Orchestrator which can actually help provision end-to-end container environments and being able to repurpose that data for like I said test dev development pipelines and those kind of things and we're also as you've probably heard we're tying that into a cloud strategy as well so there's there's products we've announced cloud block storage side as well as object engine which is a product we haven't talked about yet which enables customers to truly see the benefit of a hybrid cloud scenario so they may be developing an application on Prem and pushing the cloud or vice versa and we're actually going to give them that back capability to do that talk more about object engines specifically what it is that means been inferring object yes store and object engine you know you hear the name it could mean a number of things but clearly it has to do with object storage so object engine was actually a technology that was born in the cloud so it was a cloud native application that was really designed around data reduction for cloud workloads what we've done as part of that product it folded into peers we've actually ironically it is not what we used it for first we'd developed an appliance and we call that our object engine appliance that's just phase one so what object engine delivers is a highly scalable highly performant data reduction platform we're starting with backup and data protection workloads so vemma obviously does their in-line data reduction technology if the customer finds that they need something more scalable they can actually leverage object engine to do that and then flash blade on the back end as the initial tier and then the future vision for object engine is that it's going to give you the cloud connectivity to be able to say okay I want to automatically push my backup workloads from an archive perspective out to the cloud we're starting in AWS we're gonna do Azure and others as well so the next big wave of that that you'll see is actually running object engine in the cloud in a hybrid scenario and be able to move those work clothes back and forth so kind of envision you know the the near-term backup and restore most of the resource happen within a week or two on Prem and then 100% also stored in the cloud for more long-term archives so that really it really completes the flash to flash the cloud story but we're not gonna stop with backup workloads either and where's your sort of value added in that equation and where's VM and how do you sort of what's the connection points there good question good question so I you know I think again I mentioned via obviously has their in line data reduction technology where we insert object engine is really one of two reasons one if if our data reduction offsets the cost of the whole solution without using it with just using beams data reduction because it is it's a hardware offload essentially and then the second one is if you need a you know a large amount of data that you want to push out to the cloud as our kind of phase two of that product right okay I want to ask you about the partnership from the terms from the standpoint of values sure the values of pure are you guys are fun company I love orange you go to pure accelerate everybody's wearing orange to come here everybody's wearing green so these seem to be kind of birds of a feather but but we just talked about value add what about the values of your company and sort of how you guys getting along yeah we're getting along great I like I said there's a lot of synergies from a solution standpoint but just from a go-to market standpoint trying to be you know a disruptive company it just technology disruptive solutions what is that next thing right not being a me-too player in the market and so I think we share a lot of those those same values but also customer success we really focus on the outcomes and a happiness of the customer and that that's down in the core of our engineering same thing with beam where I think we can really help each other is Veeam has a big push right now to move up market into the enterprise and we feel like we can help beam in that respect we've been very successful in enterprise and likewise veem obviously has a major presence in amia and that's a market that is is is growing for us substantially but we've got a lot of upside so we really think we can help each other there and I actually failed to mention the very first object engine flash Blade sale we did was with him so you know it was it was it was just natural in that perspective and I think pre object engine and before this whole idea of rapid restore really took off with flash blade it was it was just the flashier a protection and even that's still pretty new but now it's much more comprehensive so we've got common common competitors as well and pure accelerates coming up in September it's in Austin you're your hometown I'm town in Austin Texas so yeah we'll be there September 15th to 18th and we're going to be talking about a ton of stuff obviously flash to flash the cloud but well beyond storage as well so even if you know don't think of it as just a storage conference it's always fun event we've covered now I think twice this will be our third year so in Austin is a great great town and looking forward to that Trevor thanks so much for coming on the cube love that loved it thanks for having me feel very welcome all right keep it right to everybody we'll be back with our next guest right after this short break I'm Dave Volante with Peterborough's v-mon 28 2019 from Miami right back

from our studios in the heart of Silicon Valley Palo Alto California this is a cute conversation welcome to the cube studios for another cube conversation where we go in-depth with thought leaders driving business outcomes with technology I'm your host Peter Burris every Enterprise that is trying to do digital transformation finds themselves facing two challenges one their digital assets themselves are a source of value and to other assets that are sources of value are becoming increasingly digitized and that creates a lot of challenges a lot of security concerns that bad agents out in the internet are exploiting and requires a programmatic fundamental response to try to ensure that the digital assets or digitized assets aren't mucked with by bad guys so to have that conversation we're here with Tony Jian Domenico Tony's a senior security strategist and a researcher and the CTI lead at Ford NIT Tony welcome back to the cube hey Pete it's great to be here man so as you get to see you yeah well we've been doing this for a couple of years now Tony and so let's get just kick it off what's new so what's new should we start talking about a little bit about the index here what we saw with the overall threat landscape sure well cool so you know y'all like you know like we always do we always like to start off with an overall threat landscape at least they give an overview of what that index looks like and it really consists of malware botnets application exploits and what we looked at over the quarter there was a lot of volatility throughout the quarter but at the end of the day it ended up only 1% higher than the quarter before now some of that volatility really is being driven by what we've talked about a lot of times Peter and a lot of these other episodes is that swarm like activity whenever an actual vulnerability is successfully exploited by an adversary everybody swarms in on that vulnerability and our fertig are labs you see that really like super spike up a great example of that would be in the last year in December think PHP which is an application that's a framework to rapidly develop web apps they had a vulnerability that if you successfully exploited it it would give you remote the remote access or I'm sorry remote code execution and they were exploiting that and we definitely seen a huge uptick now that wasn't the only one for the quarter but that and along with some of the other ones it's really what's kind of driving on volume so the index has been around for a few quarters now and it's a phenomenal way for folks out there to observe how overall trends are evolving but as you said one of the key things that's being discovered is that or you're discovering as you do this research is this notion of swarming it seems as though there ought to be a couple of reasons why that's the case Tony it's it's we've talked about this in the past there's folks who want to get a little bit more creative in creating bad stuff and there's other folks who just want to keep the cost low and just leverage what's out there which approach are the bad guys tend to using more and or is there an approach one of the other approach is more targeted to one or another kind of attack well it's funny you usually see the folks in the cyber crime ecosystem that are really focusing on you know identifying them not so much where they're doing more sort of targeted attacks it's more of a you know pray and spray you know type of thing and you see a lot of that you know anytime they can hire you can get a life of cybercrime right in the leverage some of these common you know you know services you have code reuse you know which is out there so you have that sort of like group there right and then you have more of the you know more of the you know hands-on sort of keyboard the more you know targeted attacks that are really focused on specific you know victims so you have those you know those two groups I say now with that though there kind of is a commonality there where there's this concept and it's nothing new we've been talking about this for years in the cybersecurity industry it's living off the land right where once a victim is on the actual machine itself they start leveraging some of the tools that are already available there and usually these tools their administration tools to be able to minister the actual network but these tools can also be used in the farías ways from example here would be you know PowerShell they you know a lot of admins use PowerShell for efficiencies on the network but that also can be used in the forest ways and the bad guys are using that and then this past quarter you know we did see a lot of PowerShell activity now you know Peter having said that though I think as a whole with the security community we're getting better at being able to identify these types of PowerShell attacks one we got better technology on the endpoint and I think to Microsoft is in a better job of being able to provide us more hardening capabilities for PowerShell like being able to restrict access to PowerShell as well as giving us better logging capability to be able to identify that malicious activity so we are getting better and the bad guys know this so I think what we can probably look for in the future is them leveraging either a different interface or different language because all they really need to do is interface with that dotnet framework which is part of a Windows system and they can start doing the same exact things they were doing with PowerShell and we're seeing that it in the open-source community now things like Silent Trinity open source tool that allows you to do those same things so for C an open source pretty much guarantee we're gonna see it out there in the wild here soon so we've got a group of bad actors that are using this living off the land approach to leverage technology that's out there and we've still got kind of the big guys having to worry about being targeted because you know that's how you make a lot of money if you're successful but it certainly does sound is that a general business practice for a lot of these guys is to leverage common infrastructure and that this common infrastructure is increasingly becoming you know better understood have I got that right no I you know Peter you're spot-on here what we did we did some exploratory research in this last quarter and what we found out is with the exploits within that quarter or or or the axe will come threats sixty percent of those threats are using the same infrastructure what I mean by infrastructure you know I I mean things like you know infrastructure to download malware maybe to redirect you to some other site and then downloads malware and that makes a lot of sense Peter you know why because in this cybercrime ecosystem if you didn't realize this it's a vicious competitive market everybody is trying to sell their wares and they want to make sure that their service is the best it's better than someone else's and they want to make sure that it's stable so they find these you know community you know infrastructures that are tried-and-true you know some of them are from you know bulletproof hosting so you know services you know things of that nature so you see a lot of the folks in a cybercrime ecosystem using them now on the flip side though you definitely see some of the thread actors that are more sort of you know more the advanced threat actors maybe what they want to do is hide a little bit so they'll hide in that larger community to be able to possibly be able to bypass that that attribution back to them because they don't want to be sort of labeled with oh hey this particular thread actor always uses this infrastructure so if they can blend in a lot harder to find them so they can use what is available but at the same time differentiate themselves in this bad actor ecosystem to take on even more challenging the potentially lucrative exploits now tell me if we know something about this common infrastructure as you said sixty percent of these attacks are using this common infrastructure that suggests we can bring a common set of analysis frameworks to bear as we consider who these actors are and what their practices are have I got that right yeah yeah absolutely if you can align your PlayBook defenses with the offensive actual playbook that the threat actors are using they're better off you're gonna be right because then you can be able to combat them a lot better and as a matter of fact I mean we've kind of introduced this sort of concept in conjunction with our our partnership with the cyber threat Alliance we're actually producing these thread actor play books you know and what we're doing is the idea behind this is if we can identify the malicious activity the threat actors are actually doing to complete their cyber mission expose some of them tactics those techniques those procedures we could possibly disrupt some of that malicious activity and you know this past this past quarter here we focused on a group you know Peter called the the silence group and they're really focused on identifying and stealing financial data they're looking at banks banking infrastructure and ATM machines and you'll get a kick out of this with the ATM machines they're doing something called jackpot II where they if they can find the axle software behind the ATM machine find that ATM process they can inject a malicious DLL into that process giving them total control over the ATM machine and now they can dispense money at will and they can have these money mules on the other side receive that actual money so you know we have a lot of different campaigns in play books that we've identified on our website and that once we understand that we align that with our security fabric and ensure that our customers are protected against that particular playbook Tony I'm not happy to hear that so this is this is my distressed face that I use during these types of interviews but it's if if we're able to look at how bad guy play books are operating then we ought to be able to say and what are those fundamentals that a shop should be using the security professionals should be using that are just you know so basic and so consistent and it seems that are you guys have identified three to do a better job of taking a fabric approach that starts to weave together all assets into a more common security framework to to do a better job of micro and macro segmentation so that you can identify where problems are and then finally increase your overall use of automation with AI and m/l how is this translating into your working with customers as they try to look at these playbooks and apply their own playbooks for how they set up their response regimes yeah so I mean I think overall I mean I think you can hit it on the head computer you kind of nailed down really those some it was kind of fundamental sort of concepts here now you can identify and you can document as many playbooks as you want but if you're not able to quickly respond when you identify those actual playbooks you know that's really half the battle I mean if you need to be able to identify you know one not only when the threat actors in your environment but then also you need to be able to quickly you know take action and like you were saying with that fabric if we can have that actual fabric being able to talk to the other controls within that fabric and take some action they're better off you're gonna be because you can align your defenses there and that's a great would you gotta make sure that all the controls within that fabric are all communicating together they're working together they're sharing information and they're responding together sure enough yeah are you starting to advise customers I'm curious you advising customers that even as they increase the capabilities of their fabric and how they handle their architectures from a micro macro segmentation and increase their use of automation or are there things that they can do from a practice standpoint just to ensure that their responses are appropriate fast and accurate yeah sure sure I mean I think a lot of the actual fabric once you actually build that fabric there's certain you know playbook responses that you can program into that fabric and I'll also even go I know we talked about you know fundamentals but I'll even dive a little bit lower here and you know you have that fabric but you also have to make sure you understand all the assets you have in your in you know your environment because that that information and that knowledge helps you with that macro and micro segmentation because when you can isolate you know different areas if there is a certain area that gets infected you can quickly turn the knobs to isolate that particular threat and that specific you know area or that's a specific segmented area and that is really gonna allow you to fight through the attack give you more time and ultimately reduce the impact of that particular breach so Tony we got the summer months coming up that means more vacations which is you jest less activity but then we got summer interns coming in which you know may involve additional clicking on things that shouldn't be clicked on any ideas what what should security pros be thinking about in the summer months what's the trend show well I think we're gonna continue to see that you know I I think the same type of threats that we've seen in the first quarter but I would say you know there may be a slight sort of drop-off right we got kind of kids that are gonna be out on vacation so you know schools may not see as much activity you got you know folks gonna be taking vacations and at the end of the day most of these exploits are client-side exploits which means you know a lot of times you need somebody to do something on the actual computer either you know clicking that link or clicking the attachment and if they're not there to do that they'll just sit there and you'll see less activity over time so we might see a little reduction in volume but I still think we'll see very similar types of you know threats in the coming months so good time good time are a good opportunity for security pros to double down on putting in place new architecture practices and response regime so that when stuff kicks up in the fall they're that much more prepared da Tony G on Domenico fort Ned great once again thanks very much for being on the cube hey you know Peter it's always a pleasure being here man hope to see you again soon you will and once again I'm Peter Burroughs until next time [Music]

>> Hi, I'm Peter Burroughs. And welcome to another cube conversation. This one is part of a very, very special digital community event sponsored by day trip. What we're going to be talking about today. Well, date comes here with a special product announcement that's intended to help customers do a better job of matching their technology needs with the speed and opportunities to use their data differently within their business. This is a problem that every single customer faces every single enterprise faces, and it's one that's become especially acute as those digital natives increasingly hunt down and take out some of those traditional businesses that are trying to better understand how to use their data. Now, as we have with all digital community events at the end of this one, we're gonna be running a crowd chat, so stay with us, will go through a couple of day trim and datum customer conversations, and then it'LL be your turn toe. Weigh in on what you think is important. Ask the questions of Data Room and others in the community that you think need to be addressed. Let's hear what you have to say about this increasingly special relationship between data technology and storage services. So without further ado, let's get it kicked off. Tim Page is the CEO of Datum. Tim, Welcome to the Cube. Thank you, Peter. So data give us a quick take on where you guys are. >> Yeah, Day tree ums formulated as a software to find converged infrastructure company that takes that converges to the next level. And the purpose of us is to give the user the same experience, whether you're working on Prem or across multi cloud. >> Great. So let's start by saying, that's the vision, but you've been talking a lot of customers. What's the problem that you keep hearing over and over that you're pointing towards? >> Yeah, it's funny. So it's so meet with the number CEOs over the years and specifically is related to a tree, and they'LL tell you they were on an on demand economy that expects instant outcomes, which means you have to digitally transform. And to do that, you've got to transform it, which means it's got to be easy. It's got to be consistent. You've got to get rid of a lot of the management issues, and it's got a feel and take advantage of the services that cloud has to offer. >> All right, so that's the nature of the problem. You've also done a fair amount of research looking into the specifics of what they're asking for. Give us some insight into what day terms discovering as you talk to customers about what the solutions are going to look like. >> It's interesting. So if you look at how to resolve that, you've got to conf urged to transform in some form or fashion. If you look at the first level of convergence a lot of people have done, it's been directly as relates the hardware architecture. We've taken that to a whole new level until Point were saying, How do you actually automate those mundane task that take multiple groups to solve specifically primary backup disaster recovery? All the policies involved in that is a lot of work that goes into that across multiple groups, and we set out to solve those issues, >> so there's still a need for performance. There's still the need for capacity to reduce management time and overhead etcetera. But Tim, as we move forward, how our customers responding this you're getting some sense of what percentage of them are going, Teo say Yeah, that's it >> s so interesting. So we could start a survey and got over five hundred people leaders to respond to it. It's interesting is they talk about performance management security, but they're also talking about consistency of that experience. And specifically, we asked how many of you is important to have your platform have built in backup and policy services with encryption built in et cetera. We got a seventy percent rate of those applicants of those those people interviewed saying is really important for that to be part of a plan. >> So it sounds like you're really talking about something Mohr than just a couple of products. You really talking about forcing customers or you're not forcing. Customers are starting the process of rethinking your data infrastructure, and I got that right. >> That's right. If you look at how infrastructure is grown in the last twenty years, right? Twenty years ago, san technology was related, and every time you throw open app, you had to put different policies that Apple put different one tight management to how much of my resources and go to certain things. We set out to actually automate that which is why it took us four years. To build this platform with a hundred programmers is, Well, how do we actually make you not think about how you're going to back up? How do you set a policy and no disaster recovery is going to run? And to do that, you've gotta have it one code base and we know we're on to something, even based on our survey, because the old array vendors are all buying Bolton's because they know users want an experience. But you can't have that experience with the ball time. You have to have it your fundamental platform. >> Well, let me let me step in here. So I've been around for a long time him and heard a lot of people talk about platforms. And if I have kind of one rule companies and introduce platforms that just expand, typically failed companies that bring an opinion and converge more things so it's simpler tend to be more successful. Which direction's date >> going? So we definitely That's why we took time, right? If you want to be an enterprise class company, you can't build a cheap platform in eighteen months and hit the market because were you, architect, you stay. So our purpose from the beginning was purposefully to spend four years building an enterprise clap platform that did away with a lot of the mundane task seeing management That's twenty years old. Technology right? One management. So if you're buying your multi cloud type technology experience in cages, you're just buying old stuff. We took an approach saying, We want that consistent approach that whether you're running your services on from or in any type of cloud, you could instantly take advantage of that, and it feels the same. That's a big task because you're looking to run the speed of storage with the resiliency of backup right, which is a whole different type of technology. Which is how our founders, who have built the first words in this went to the second, almost third version of that type of oven. Stan she ation of a platform. >> All right, so we know what the solution is going to look like. It's going to look like a data platform that's rethought to support the needs of data assets and introduces a set of converge services that really focus the value proposition to what the enterprise needs So what do you guys announcing? >> That's exactly right. So we've finalized what we call our auto matrix platform. So auto matrix in inherently In it we'LL have primary backup Disaster recovery D Our solution All the policies within that an encryption built in from the very beginning. Soto have those five things we believe toe actually have on the next generation experience across true multi cloud. You're not bolting on hardware technologies. You're bolting on software technologies that operate in the same manner. Those five things have to be an errand or you're a bolt on type company. >> So you're not building a platform out by acquisition. You build a platform out by architecture and development. >> That's right. And we took four years to do it with one hundred guys building this thing out. It's released, it's out and it's ready to go. So our first we're announcing is that first in Stan she ation of that as a product we're calling control shift, which is really a data mobility orchestrator. True sas based you could orchestrate from the prime from the cloud cloud to cloud, and our first generation of that is disaster recovery so truly to be able to set up your policies, check those policies and make sure you're going to have true disaster recovery with an Rto zero. It's a tough thing we've done it. >> That's upstanding. Great to hear Tim Page, CEO Data Room, talking about some of the announcement that were here more about in the second. Let's now turn our attention, Teo. A short video. Let's hear more about it. >> The bank is focused on small businesses and helping them achieve their success. We want to redesign the customer engagement in defining the bank of the future. This office is our first implementation of that concept, as you can see is a much more open floor plan design that increases the interaction between our lead bank associates and our clients with day tree and split provisioning. Oliver Data is now on the host, so we have seen eighty times lower application. Leighton. See, this gives our associates instant responses to their queries so they can answer client questions in real time. That time is always expensive in our business. In the past we had a forty eight hour recovery plan, but with the atrium we were able to far exceed that plan we've been able to recover systems in minutes now instead of backing at once per day with that backup time taking eighteen hours. Now we're doing full system snapshots our league, and we're replicating those offsite stay trim is the only vendor I know of that could provide this end to end encryption. So any cyber attacks that get into our system are neutralized with the data absolution. We don't have to have storage consultants anymore. We don't have to be stored. Experts were able to manage everything from a storage perceptive through the center, obviously spending less time and money on infrastructure. We continue to leverage new technologies to improve application performance and lower costs. We also want to animate RDR fail over. So we're looking forward to implementing daydreams. Product deloused orchestrate an automaton. RDR fell over process. >> It is always great to hear from a customer. Want to get on Peterborough's? This's a Cube conversation, part of a digital community event sponsored by Data Room. We were talking about how the relationship between the new digital business outcomes highly dependent upon data and the mismatch of technology to be able to support those new classes of outcomes is causing problems in so many different enterprises. So let's dig a little bit more deeply into someone. Tatum's announcements to try to find ways to close those gaps. We've got his already who's the CTO of data on with today, says all are welcome to the Cube, >> that being a good to see you again. >> So automate tricks give us a little bit more toe tail and how it's creating value for customers. >> So if you go to any data center today, you notice that for the amount of data they have their five different vendors and five different parts to manage the data. There is the primary storage. There is the backup on DH. There is the D R. And then there's mobility. And then there is the security or think about so this five different products, our kind of causing friction for you if you want to move, if you want to be in the undermanned economy and move fast in your business, these things are causing friction. You cannot move that fast. And so what we have done is that we took. We took a step back and built this automatics platform. It's provides this data services. We shall kind of quality that autonomous data services. The idea is that you don't have to really do much for it by converging all this functions into one simple platform that we let him with all the friction you need to manage all your data. And that's kind of what we call auto metrics that >> platform. So as a consequence, I gotta believe, Then your customers are discovering that not only is it simpler, easy to use perhaps a little bit less expertise required, but they also are more likely to be operationally successful with some of the core functions like D are that they have to work with. >> Yeah, So the other thing about these five five grandpre functions and products you need is that if you want to imagine a future, where you going, you know, leverage the cloud For a simple thing like the R, for example, the thing is that if you want to move this data to a different place with five different products, how does it move? Because, you know, all these five products must move together to some of the place. That's not how it's gonna operate for you. So by having these five different functions converge into one platform is that when the data moves between the other place, the functions move with it giving the same exist same exact, consistent view for your data. That's kind of what we were built. And on top of all the stuff is something we have this global data management applications to control the all the data you have your enterprise. >> So how are customers responding to this new architecture of autumn matrix converge services and a platform for building data applications? >> Yeah, so our customers consistently Teyla's one simple thing is that it's the most easiest platform there ever used in their entire enterprise life. So that's what we do aimed for simplicity for the customer experience. Autonomous data services give you exactly that experience. So as an example, last quarter we had about forty proof of concept sort in the field out of them, about thirty of adopted already, and we're waiting for the ten of the results to come out this quarter. So generally we found that a proof of concept don't come back because once you touch it, experience simplicity offered and how how do you get all this service is simple, then people don't tend to descend it back. They like to keep it and could have operated that way. >> So you mentioned earlier, and I kind of summarizing notion of applications, Data services, applications tell us a little bit about those and how they really toward a matrix. >> Right? So once you have data in multiple places, people have not up not a cloud. And we're going to also being all these different clouds and report that uniform experience you need this date. You need this global data management applications to extract value out off your data. And that's kind of the reason why we built some global data management applications. I SAS products, I think, install nothing to manage them. Then they sit outside and then they help you manage globally. All the data you have. >> So as a result, the I and O people, the destruction operations administrators, I can think of terms of automata whose platform the rest of the business could look at in terms of services and applications that through using and support, >> that's exactly right. So you get the single dashboard to manage all the data. You have an enterprise >> now I know you're introducing some of these applications today. Can you give us a little peek into? Yeah. >> Firstly, our automatics platform is a soft is available on prime as a software defined converge infrastructure, and you can get that we call it D V X. And then we also offer in the cloud our services. It's called Cloud Devi Ex. You could get these and we're also about kind off announcing the release ofthe control shift. It's over for one of our first date. Imagine applications, which kind of helps you manage data in a two different locations. >> So go over more specific and detail in the control shift. Specifically is which of those five data services you talk about is control shift most clearly associating with >> right. So if you go toe again back to this question about like five different services, if you have to think about B r o D. R. Is a necessity for every business, it's official protection. You need it. But the challenge is that you know that three four challenges you gently round into the most common people talk about is that one is that you have a plan. You'LL have a proper plan. It's challenging to plan something, and then you think about the fire drill. We have to run when there's a problem. And then last leaving actually pushed the button. Tofail over doesn't really work for you. Like how fast is it going to come up? So those three problems we can have one to solve really like really solidly So we call our service is a dear services fail proof tr that's actually takes a little courage to say fail proof. So control shift is our service, which actually does this. The orchestration does mobility across the two different places from could be on prime time on Prem on prompted the cloud. And because we have this into end data services ourselves, the it's easy to then to compliance checks all the time so we could do compliance checks every few minutes. So what that gives you that? Is that the confidence that that your dear plan's going to work for you when you need it? And then secondly, when you push the button because you also prime restoration back up, it's then easy to bring upon your services at once like that, and the last one is that because we are able to then work across the clouds and pride, the seamless experience. So when you move the data to the cloud, have some backups there. When you push a button to fail over, we'LL bring up your services in via MacLeod so that the idea is that it look exactly the same no matter where you are in the D. R or North India and then, you know, you watch the video, watch the demos. I think they look and see that you can tell the difference. >> Well, that's great. So give us a little bit of visibility into how day Truman intends to extend these capabilities, which give us a little visibility in the road map. Next. >> So we are already on Amazon with the cloud. The next time you're gonna be delivering his azure, that's the next step. But But if I step back a little bit and how do we think about our ourselves? Like if you look at his example Google, Google, you know, fairies, all the data and Internet data and prizes that instant search for that instant like an access to all the data you know, at your finger finger tips. So we wanted something similar for enterprise data. How do we Federated? How do we aggregate data and the property? The customer, the instant management they can get from all the data. They have already extract value from the data. So those things are set off application We're building towards organic scum. Examples are we're building, like, deep search. How do you find the things you want to find? You know, I've been a very nice into to weigh. And how do you do Compliance? GPR. And also, how do you think about you know, some dependent addicts on the data? And so we also extend our control shift not to just manage the data on all platforms. Brawls hardly manage data across different platforms. So those kind of things they're thinking about as a future >> excellent stuff is already CTO daydream. Thanks very much for talking to us about auto matrix control shift and the direction that you're taking with this very, very extreme new vision about data on business come more easily be bought together. So, you know, I'll tell you what. Let's take a look at a demo >> in today's enterprise data centers. You want a simple way to deal with your data, whether in the private or public cloud, and ensure that dealing with disaster recovery is easy to set up. Always complied and in sync with the sites they address and ready to run as the situations require built on consistent backups, allowing you to leverage any current or previous recovery point in time with near zero rto as the data does not have to be moved in order to use it. Automated orchestration lets you easily test or execute recovery plans you have constructed with greater confidence, all while monitoring actions and progress from essential resource. This, along with maintaining comprehensive run books of these actions, automatically from the orchestration framework. Managing your Systems Day Tree in autumn matrix provides this solution. Run on local host flash and get the benefits of better performance and lower. Leighton sees back up and protect your data on the same converged platform without extracting it to another system while securing the data in your enterprise with end and encryption automating salas desired for your business needs with policy driven methods. The capture the what, when and where aspects of protecting your data, keeping copies locally or at other sites efficiently Move the data from one location to another weather in your private or public cloud. This is the power of the software defined converged infrastructure with cloudy are from day tree, um, that we call Oughta Matrix. >> Hi. And welcome back to another cube conversation once again on Peter Births. And one of the biggest challenges that every user faces is How did they get Mohr out of their technology suppliers, especially during periods of significant transformation? Soto have that conversation. We've got Brian Bond, who's the director of infrastructure? The meter A seaman's business. Brian, welcome to the Cube. >> Thanks for having me. >> So tell us a little about the meteor and what you do there. >> So E Meter is a developer and supplier of smart grid infrastructure software for enterprise level clients. Utilities, water, power, energy and, ah, my team was charged with managing infrastructure for that entire business units. Everything from Deb Test Q and sales. >> Well, the you know, the intelligent infrastructure as it pertains to electronica rid. That's not a small set of applications of small city use cases. What kinds of pressure is that putting on your infrastructure >> A lot of it is the typical pressures that you would see with do more with less doom or faster. But a lot of it is wrapped around our customers and our our other end users in needing more storage, needing Mohr at performance and needing things delivered faster on a daily basis. Things change, and keeping up with the Joneses gets harder and harder to do as time moves on. >> So as you think about day trims Auto Matrix. How is it creating value for you today? Give us kind of, Ah, peek into what it's doing to alleviate some of these scaling and older and researcher pressures, >> So the first thing it does is it does allow us to do a lot more with less. We get two times the performance five times the capacity, and we spend zero time managing our storage infrastructure. And when I say zero time I mean zero time, we do not manage storage anymore. With the data in product, we can deploy thanks faster. We can recover things faster are Rto and R R P. O matrix is down two seconds instead of minutes or hours, and those types of things really allow us to provide, Ah much better level of service to our customers. >> And it's especially critical. Infrastructure like electronic grid is good to hear. That the Rto Harpo is getting is close to zero as possible. But that's the baseline today. Look out and is you and vision where the needs of these technologies are going for improving protection, consolidating converging gated services and overall, providing a better experience from a business uses data. How do you anticipate that you're goingto evolve your use of autumn matrix and related data from technologies? >> Well, we fully intend to to expand our use of the existing piece that we have. But then this new autumn matrix piece is going to help us, not witches deployments. But it's also going to help us with compliance testing, data recovery, disaster recovery, um, and also being able to deploy into any type of cloud or any type of location without having to change what we do in the back in being able to use one tool across the entire set of the infrastructure they were using. >> So what about the tool set? You're using the whole thing consistently, but what about the tool set when in easiest for you within your shop, >> installing the infrastructure pieces themselves in its entirety. We're very, very easy. So putting that into what we had already and where we were headed was very, very simple. We were able to do that on the fly in production and not have to do a whole lot of changes with the environments that were doing at the time. The the operational pieces within the D. V X, which is this the storage part of the platform were seamless as far as V Center and other tools that we're using went and allowed us to just extend what we were doing already and be able to just apply that as we went forward. And we immediately found that again, we just didn't manage storage anymore. And that wasn't something we were intending and that made our r I just go through the roof. >> So it sounds like time to value for the platform was reserved for quick and also it fit into your overall operational practices. So you have to do a whole bunch of unnatural acts to get >> right. We did not have to change a lot of policies. We didn't have to change a lot of procedures, a lot of sounds. We just shortened. We took a few steps out on a lot of cases. >> So how is it changing being able to do things like that, changing your conversation with your communities that you're serving a CZ? They asked for more stores where they ask for more capabilities. >> First off, it's making me say no, a lot less, and that makes them very, very happy. The answer usually is less. And then the answer to the question of how long will it take changes from? Oh, we can get that done in a couple of days or, oh, we can get that done in a couple hours to I did that while I was sitting here in the meeting with you, and it's it's been handled and you're off to the races. >> So it sounds like you're police in a pretty big bed and a true, uh, what's it like? Working with them is a company. >> It's been a great experience from from the start, in the initial piece of talking to them and going through the POC process. They were very helpful, very knowledgeable SCS on DH, and since then They've been very, very helpful in allowing us to tell them what our needs are, rather than them telling us what our needs are and going through and working through the new processes and the and the new procedures within our environments. They've been very instrumental and performance testing and deployment testing with things, uh, that a lot of other storage providers didn't have any interest in talking with us about so they've been very, very helpful with that and very, very knowledgeable people that air there are actually really smart, which is not surprising. But the fact that they can relay that into solutions to what my actual problems are and give me something that I can push forward on to my business and have ah, positive impact from Day one has been absolutely, without question, one of the better things. >> Well, it's always one of the big, biggest challenge when working with a company that just getting going is how do you get the smarts of that organization into the business outcomes that really succeeded? Sounds like it's working well. Absolutely. All right. Brian Bond, director Vital infrastructure demeanor, Seaman's business Thanks again for being on the Cube >> has been great >> on. Once again, this has been a cube conversation, and now what we'd like to do is don't forget this is your opportunity to participate in the crowd. Chat immediately after this video ends and let's hear your thoughts. What's important in your world is you think about new classes of data platforms, new rules of data, new approaches to taking great advantage of the data assets that air differentiating your business. Have those conversations make those comments? Asked those questions. We're here to help. Once again, Peter Bourjos, Let's go out yet.

>> live from Orlando, Florida It's the que covering accelerate nineteen. Brought to you by important. >> Welcome back to the Cube. We air live in Orlando, Florida, for accelerate border, not accelerate twenty nineteen. Lisa Martin with Peter Burroughs And we're pleased to welcome back to the Cube. Chief information Security officer See, So from Fortinet fell quite Phil. Thank you so much for joining Peter and me on the Cube today. >> Thanks for much. >> So lots of news, Lots of buzz. You can hear a lot of the folks behind us in the Expo hall here. We've had probably, I think five or six or seven guests today. So far you are on the front lines as to see so afforded it talking with si sos. I'd love to get your your view on what are some of the things they're top of mind for si sos today. The challenge is that they're facing and how are they looking to for doughnut to mitigate this challenge is >> the good news is that the solution sets not as complicated a cz youthink So all the sea says and senior people I talked to are very much focused on How can they reduce complexity, And how can they better leverage automation? I know there's some overlap between those two things, but they care quite a bit about that. Why? Because with less complexity, there's less mistakes with less complexity. There's less optics, right costs, costs for people and then with automation. It also helps with the op ex problem. But automation also allows humans to do things that humans you're better doing things. That and let's machines do things that their better doing that. So, complexity management, Lebanese automation are really top of mind. Of course, you know the next level down, you really need to do segmentation. Well, you need to have good visibility, need to inspection something that But I'd say those couple things are definitely top of mind, no matter who you talked to. >> But one of the things that's especially important about this issue complexity is that the threat surface goes to value, right so that, as you think about I ot as you think about Mohr devices, Mohr elements, et cetera, the threat surface is going to go up the on ly way that you're going to be able to bring that in in a managed way that delivers consistent value without dramatically exploding amount of risk is to reduce the complexity of the rest of the threat >> surface. Thie. If you're trying to place the face the problem of of, of speed and scale, you have to adopt the solutions of automation in integration you need a strategy on. Of course, hope is never a strategy, and so you need to leverage these technologies to do that. Instead, it's all about automation integration, >> right on this notion of the threats surface going to values, gotta have some mean si SOS sort of. Some of the ones that I'm talking to are using terminology like that. Maybe not that concept directly, but they want to make sure that whatever task that they're performing, whatever, uh, whatever risked their engendering or dealing with has some corresponds back to value. Are you seeing that as well? >> Yeah, and since we're talking about value, the end point is becoming a whole lot more interesting in terms of value. So traditionally we think of the endpoint is being a place where there's desktops and then laptops and tablets, and now smartphones, and they've always been part of our cyber domain. But there's this new thing that's happening, I think just left of end point. And it's where there's going to be the heavy instrumentation of physical processes and things. So it's starting with OT operational technology. It's going to be magnified by I ot and, of course, building automation. And so all of a sudden, the definition of value, I think, is going to be places that can collect data about physical processes and things, protect that data and then commoditize it. So value is moving further, further and out into the endpoint defined as thie, a collection of information about physical processes, something so I call this environment cyber physical or, more specifically, more catchy. SciFi right. It's where cyber data, physical data will be intermingled to provide value and efficiencies to customers and things like that. It's a really important area that's the new in point >> in physics. We talk about transducers, right? The transducer is something that takes one form of energy and turns into another form of energy so they could perform a different kind of work. We're talking about what we call information transducers the idea, take one form of information and turn it into another form of information so that it can perform work that's seminal to this notion that you're describing with the side fi. >> That's a >> great analogy. I haven't heard it described that way before. It's kind of like, you know, back in the day where where people use fire to heat and people used sales to move things right. And one day >> it was a more >> wins, right? Wait, move sales. Sorry. Wings. Yeah. Okay. And, uh, someone saw the story. As the story goes, someone saw a pot on the fire, a kettle full of water boil and the lid of the pop move. So they realized I can use heat to move it. So they started integrating different ways of doing things to achieve new effects. And I think that's what you're talking about. He used the word trans transducer, but I think it's the same thing. And how can you use things previously kept separate to do things that you previously couldn't D'Oh. >> So let's talk about this SciFi era C y dash p H y. For those watching at home, what are some of the security challenges that this brings, but also the opportunities to be uncovered by that boiling point analogy. >> Yeah, if you don't mind, I'LL start with the start with positives right where the was a potential benefits to society. So we are all of us and everyone behind us. We're creatures, the physical domain and the opportunities that there will be new data connected about this physical domain that can affect his very personally. So in cyberspace, its ultimate a virtual world. So there could be compromises in cyberspace. That effect is in cyber ways, but when you have compromises in the physical domain, it could be a lot more personal. So let's say that you have a medical device or you have a something else that instruments the temperature, heat, humidity, vector, you name it. Failures in those areas can have a really profound effect on a negative way in this physical oriented domain. So now the flip side of that is because it has a very, very positive effect, Right? Thes healthcare devices could bring new conveniences or perhaps even help address some very important things where they'd be physical or mental disabilities weaken instrument very heavily how we create food products. And so maybe this heavy instrumentation of how you create food can help address world hunger. I know I'm getting kind of heavy about this, but heavy instrumentation of this physical domain has a lot of promise. Now back to the other side. It also has a lot of responsibility involved, right, because, as I mentioned earlier, we're creatures of the physical domain. So if you get it wrong, you could mess up something really important to our health. Care for our transportation, Andi. We also have a very strong feeling towards privacy. At some point, collecting too much about us physically is just too much. So you need to make sure that that any sense data's you have privacy protections built it. So like anything with great opportunity. There's great challenges involved. But by giving their name and starting described, this challenge is we are. We're one step down the path, I think. >> But if we take that and then turn it into a set of cyber security challenges, no secure network challenges, that one of the other things you describe is we're constantly learning about what are the characteristics of a good, competent, reasonable interface between the physical and digital worlds. That knowledge then has to be put back into how we handle network security. >> That's right. I like your use of the word knowledge. And earlier today I gave a talk about something I'm calling a digital big bang. It's an analogy of that. We had a digital big bang fifty years ago where an explosion of data is among us and there's some challenges will get back that in a second. The analogy is thie cosmic big bang of fourteen billion years ago. And it wasn't until we started certain had a quest for knowledge about the fundamental elements of the cosmic Big Bang and the hard sciences behind it. Physics, chemistry, biology, things like that that we actually started obtaining an accumulating knowledge. So I think to your point, there's a lot of knowledge accumulation that we need to start a quest for in this cyber physical domain. And that's that's all about treating cybersecurity more like a science rather than an art. And I think this cyber SciFi domain is a great place to start practicing that accumulating knowledge in a very, very scientific way, build on the build on the successes of our our forefathers. I could say >> Sorry if I can build on this for one second. Sorry, Lisa, that the entropy gets everything in the end. But isn't it interesting that the process of creating Mohr information creating more knowledge and then securing it is our main fight against entropy? Right. That's how we create increase optimization of our resources. How we get Maura out of less on DH. That seems to me to be an especially important thing here. A CZ we think about it is how we utilize that knowledge, share it and in so doing security so that we're sharing inappropriately. >> There's a there's a great saying. I'm sure you're familiar with each of you. It's called. I use it often. Data is the oil the twenty first century, right? So the last century, those who could find oil explored it put it good use and protected dominated that century. Let's fast forward to the twenty first century. I think the same words apply data right. Those who can find it generate wisdom from it, insight from it and protect it will dominate in a good way the twenty first century. So, on the way you were going to do that. This is the collective we is bias. You said Collect, Ate it. Make it better. Send it back out, bring it back in. Make it better. Send it back out. It's a somewhat circular, but I think it's a very, very healthy example of, ah, circular augmentation. >> So don't think I want to touch on a little bit with you. Feel before we let you go is we talked about knowledge a minute ago and sharing that knowledge forty nights Very dedicated to education. Educating your customers, educating your partners When you're talking with si SOS and we know that there's an ostensible skills got with cyber security. What are some of the solutions that you talked to those customers that like Hey, this is how fourteen that nurse ecosystem partners can help you here. Address this so you can leverage the power of that data to, As you said, you know, for the twenty first century, for example, data becomes the new oil. What's that education conversation like there's >> a There's a long game in a short game, you know, the short game is about leveraging like we talked about a few minutes ago. Speed, speed, automation, integration, too. Compliment the shortage of human beings right rely machines, moron for what machines we're good at on DH. Take the humans, the humans, the steel personnel and have them do the higher order thinking. So the near term game. It's foreign. It's really well. Pasha provide our customers is speed, automation and integration. So that's the short game. Long game is about creating, Ah, larger workforce or larger population of folks who could all be construed contribute to this great new world we've been talking about. And that's training. And that's education. And I think, you know important. It's also, you know, working the long game as well, with some near term training at multiple levels for folks in in the networking world, but were also part of something called the World Economic Form West's Center for Cyber Security. We're founding member, and there were trying to create a long game where we can help educate a whole lot of people on cybersecurity and create the future. Workforce is in the long game. So short term long game, both her important >> except well, Phil, thank you so much for joining Peter and me on the cute this afternoon. We appreciate your time. >> Thanks again. It was nice. Nice being back and >> excellent. Our pleasure for Peter. Boris. I'm Lisa Martin. You're watching the Cube

>> Narrator: Live from Orlando, Florida. It's theCUBE. Covering Accelerate 19. Brought to you by Fortinet. >> Welcome back to theCUBE. We are live in Orlando, Florida for Fortinet Accelerate 2019. I'm Lisa Martin with my co-host for the day Peter Burroughs. Peter and I are pleased to welcome back to theCUBE Patrice Perche, the senior executive vice president of world wide sales and support from Fortinet. Patrice, it's a pleasure to have you, fresh from the Keynote Stage, here on theCUBE program. >> Yeah, well thank you for inviting me here. It's a great opportunity. >> So lots of people this morning and an energy infused keynote starting from all this loud music that I loved and helped wake me up, so thanks to your events team for that. About 4000 attendees, >> Patrice: Yeah. >> From 40 countries. You have a ton of partners here. You can hear a lot of the noise behind us. I'd like you to share with our audience the connection that you made in your keynote about what you guys shared last Accelerate 2018 and the connection to the world economic forum from just a few months ago. >> Okay well, the last year we definitely in fact exposed our strategy in term of the product, in term of the go to market and of course how we can increase in fact the value proposition to our customer, it was all about the fabric and the eco-system that we build around the fabric. So we have been of course since now 12 months working hard on expanding and growing what I call the Phase two of the fabric and when Cain went to Davos which the World Economic Forum is held early in January. And when we got all this, I would say a vision from Klaus Schwab which is the Chairman and Founder of the World Economic Forum. Explaining that the false revolution that we are all going through. The Cyber Security its a massive, I would say problem for them and it will be a key point for the future because they will enable, in fact, most of those take technology and use it that we will go for this revolution, so >> Peter: It's intrinsic. >> It's intrinsic, they call it guardian. So it really is something that if we can't, fix this problem, it's all about digital trust. So none of the user, you, myself we will not trust maybe voting system, or you cannot trust. We know that everything is going digital. And they expressed the need for of course the education, because you need to educate and you need to, increase the skilled people especially with cyber-security as we have a huge shortfall about 1.5million, some say even two million for next year. They need also need to work as an eco-system. So, for them the eco-system is really to see public, private collaboration but also Government, technologies, companies like us. And that's in fact the purpose of Davos. To bring all this different, in fact groups and be able to talk and share and define some line for the future. And for us of-course, the concept of the eco-system is all about building around in fact this major problem that we are facing, has all the traits. In fact, a collective approach where everybody can add value. We as a vendor we build technology, we build a lot of value but we can't be with each of the customers. So and we want to build a partnership not only with the partner but also with the customer because cyber security is a real time problem. So when something happen, you need to jump, and you need to make sure that all the line is set and then everybody can work together to fix the problem. So this eco-system really resonates value well for us after we was talking last year at the Accelerate. And the last I will say pillar for the Economic Forum is about of course Education and clearly I was mentioning one of the Engineers from the SERP which is nuclear agency in Europe Januity she said that 3D, of course the problem is that with these robots we will have a lot of jobs that will be omitted. So they talk about 800 million. So it's a massive number but it sees more than an opportunity to up-skill people. So the education is really helping of course especially the young generation to go and to up-skill it and especially on the cyber security. Because, as everything is going digital, we have to secure everything so it's really, these pieces will grow much beyond that what we think today. Those three pillars are the Education, the Eco-system and of course the Technology. And the good news is that Ken was representing in fact cyber security at the Davos, so it was also a great moment for us to see in fact pushing 14 at that stage of level of discussion so. Those three pillars: Education, Technology and Eco-system of course fit very well with our strategy that we build and that's why I decided to share a bit this morning. It's not everybody going to such a place. And what really resonate well in term of the strategy and the vision we are in fact pursuing so that's what we are doing. >> So I want to build on something that you said to do so I want to paraphrase. Peter who is much smarter than I am, Peter Drucker who observed many years ago there's a difference in strategies between what he called: value in exchange was his presumption that what I am selling is valuable. And value in utility which is a presumption that the value stems from how the something is used. And that notion of partnership that Fortinet has put in place with its customers so they can get value in utility is so crucially important. And you talked a bit this morning about you know the different levels of customization, and how you are going to allow customers to engage you and apply technology to suit their business. Could you take a bit about that especially based on your experience in the field? >> Yeah so as I mention I think we, it has been also our sales strategy from day one. So we always consider that in order to succeed, we need to work through the partners and through the people that are very close to our customer. And as technology evolves of course it's a real challenge to keep them at the level. Even for us, internally, we used to understand and be always at the top level about the new technology that we are putting in place. We imagine that, just for the employees, it's a challenge so we do a lot of training. But then for the partner it's another challenge. So, I think we have been always trying to help them to of course evolving on this expertise, but we don't see that the cloud of course there is a certain I will say a trend about Okay lets go Direct because we don't. The cloud can allow to sell direct to the customer so you don't need those channels. So there's no value for them. We don't see that in the cyber security because it's a much more complex environment and I think that is why we have been successful. We even see some of our competitor, they tempted to go on this direction. I think it's maybe one of the challenges we'll face in the future. So for us they key message I was trying to give this morning to the partner is really that we count on them, it's a partnership, it's very important and of course when we adapt our partner program we want to learn from them to make sure that the three pillars of this program will fit well with their, in fact, view because of course we are from a vendor in certain perspective, they have of course a different perspective on their side. What I was mentioning the goal to market because we see that some are very specialized on the cloud, some are specialized on the premise. We have to define what is the go to market here. What kind of expertise there are in fact having because as you can see we have very broad product of frame cover, you know from almost everything, so from OT, IT, even imbedded. So, we are working with partners that are, as an example, on the connected car. That's for maybe the next two years where we will secure those car. They are not the typical or traditional partner that you see on the networking business so, we try to adapt in fact our engagement with them and make sure that in fact we build a value proposition that can fit in fact for the customer requirement. So it's really about be very close and try to have a bit of a-la-carte kind of approach. And not try to enforce a very historical view that we had in fact, to be honest. But okay, you have like three tiers, depending of level of business and then you sign. So it's really moving away from that. >> I want to stay in this notion of partners because I think it's so crucially important. You talked about the skills that they have the capabilities that they have, but your partners in general are amongst the companies that have to learn the most about cyber security. Because they are the ones that are trying to match technology to the outcomes the customers have. That leads to a question about your education programs. I got to believe that there is, that even as you're trying to educate your enterprise customers, you're also really investing in your enterprise, in upgrading and up scaling your partnership. Talk a bit about the relationship of education and Eco-system from a very practical standpoint. >> Yeah so it's a very good point because of course we need to help them to evolve and as an example we have seen traditional IT partner, interested to evolve on this OT security but they didn't have too much skill so it was new for them. So we see the purpose of building this NSC training vocation course which we have eight level, which started in 2015 and we have about now almost 200 000 certified engineers. A very large portion of those Engineers come from partners. So, on this program, in fact the origin of the program, depending on where you want to play. If it's cloud, you will have to go for NSC4. If you want to go beyond a OT, it can be NSC5. We build in fact this expertise and we ask them also to of course follow those course so the engagement with us, the requirement will be also that they have the right certified Engineer. Depending on level of engagement they want to work with us. So we build this course which is a lot of work and we have a lot of, a big team to make this happen. We have to refresh constantly because it's evolving almost every day. But as for this, the great value, you may have seen it pass on the networking sites. Cisco made a bit similar approach, which was very successful. I think we went like three years ago on thinking about this and that's what we are achieving right now and we are in fact the most I will say advanced in such a report and I think it's all NSC certification is becoming a bit stand out in the market. Both from end-user but the partner. And even going as we was mentioning, we are also working with the Academics to build in fact and train in fact new Engineers that will come in the market in the next two to three years. So we help them on, it's not pure about product, it's really about cyber security expertise that we have and of course we help them on understanding a bit how the Fortinet value can deploy on the customer, so that aspect and we try to target of course young I will say people going for university but also veterans who we had program to bring those veterans because they're also looking we are talking about up skilling. That's a perfect example on bringing a change to them. And I think it's high level, maybe it's a bit, you know think that we have a high potential. But we want of course to help on resolving the overall challenge to be unemployed. I can tell you that if you invest time and you get a certification on cyber security you will never have any problems with a job. So that's a bit the overall idea we have behind this education and certification. And truly the partner, I will say, evolution in terms of their expertise, it's based about this NSC. >> Alright Patrice as we kind of get towards the end here, let's talk about outcomes. Peter mentioned that word, I know that when I was looking at my notes here that in Q4 of 2018, service providers, and managed security service providers represented 11 of the top 25 deals. You guys also closed a massive seven figure deal in Europe. Let's talk about outcomes that Fortinet and your partner eco-system are helping businesses achieve at the business level. Not just in terms of obviously improving security but are you helping businesses generate new revenue streams, skip to new products on market faster, identify attacks and become pro active? What is one of those really key outcomes that you are proud of? >> I think the, and I was part of the presentation last year. We all, I would say on this digital transformation journey. Whole company, even us. We're evolving with much more tools, much automation. So I think every sector, whether it's public or private company, has to go for this evolution. The biggest challenge is all about digital so again the blocking point is about security. So last year we explained about how we can help with positioning our platform in the security fabric to run to this obstacle and that was the purpose of the security transformation that we was talking last year. And I know it's some, even complete as relayed a message, it was interesting that it was part of all. So I think it was really trying to unlock this digital transformation that add business benefit because at the end this whole, those company will evolve in the future, generate more profit, be more efficient, leverage, I would say, the data that they are collecting from almost everywhere. From customer but also the sensor, and transform this to a more business intelligence and then I will say generate in fact future revenue and future dollars from that. That has been a bit the idea behind. So we definitely help on evolving and going through this digital transformation journey. I think we had few example of course as one of our customers, they deploying world wide on their gas-station. A better customer journey. Typically of course you calm, you try to make your gas and you want to be connected. And they try to increase of course by upselling a lot of things. So of course you have your go for the coffee machine, you can even buy many goods. We have been deploying you know, with secure access so they have secure access they go for the internet so that's where we play with segmentation. But our wireless which is fully connected also to the Fortigate and the analytic tools allow them to do business intelligence in term of where people are moving inside you know the shops. And then, you know, redesign and rethink about okay, how they move here. So that's, that allow them to accelerate even more business or decide that maybe this spot doesn't work well, so they push that to the side and they evolve. That's depicted the value of all this intelligence and we can grasp from the data that we collect to transform to a business value. >> So I want to make one comment before we close here and that is that I don't know the degree to which people really understand the relationship between secure networking and digital business. Data is an interesting asset. It could be shared, it could be copied, it could be easily corrupted. In many respects over the next five years we believe that people will recognize that network security is the basis for privatizing data. It is what you do to turn data into an asset. I don't think people have made that connection, to the degree that they need to. >> No I agree, I agree because maybe the mindset they think about network, they think about wired. In fact we are talking about 5G, we are talking about Wireless so the data is that what we want to protect because we don't want that people stole your personal information or even company. >> It's more than protect. You want to create the asset. >> Yes, we integrate the asset. And then of course when we talk about network it's no longer wires, of course it's much more virtual I would say networks. And that's the misinterpretation and why they feel okay the network is moving away. No, it's even more in the future. And as Cain mentioned early this morning: I think the edge will become much more important in future because the compute power that we are having now on every device and even. That will in fact allow to of course generate much more data. Yeah and you need to protect. You notice when you need to go and to consolidate this into the cloud. So it's really, the age will become a very important aspect. But this will be a hybrid and that's what we feel as Fortinet we've been building in fact the very comprehensive offer and to the partner and to our customer. We just want, in fact to give them the time to move at their pace. But they have everything ready for today. That's a bit the concept. >> Well if only we had more time Patrice, we could keep going and going. Thank you so much for sharing some time on the program today talking about your GTM, what you are doing to educate partners and customers and this tremendous potential that Fortinet is attacking. We appreciate your time. >> Thank you very much, I appreciate it too. >> We want to thank you for watching for Peter Burroughs, I'm Lisa Martin. You're watching theCUBE. (upbeat music)

>> From our studios in the heart of Silicon Valley. HOLLOWAY ALTO, California It is a cube conversation >> high on Peter Birds and welcome to another cube conversation from our beautiful Palo Alto studios. One of the things that makes a cube so exciting as we get great guest from great companies coming on here and talking about some of their new products that they're trying to get in the marketplace of customers Khun Doom or with their technology. And we've got that today. Eric Herzog, cmon VP of worldwide storage channels that IBM storage. He's here to talk about some new things that IBM is doing that especially relevant to high performance, closer, more down market, branch oriented kinds of applications. Eric, welcome to the Cube. >> Thank you, Peter. Really appreciate. Very excited to be with Cuba's Always. >> All right, So what? Start Give us the quick business update and IBM, And let's talk about how that inform some of the new announcement. You >> sure? So two thousand eighteen was a great year for IBM storage. Lots of new introductions and portfolio continue with our multi cloudiness. Everything we've doing now for seven years, all about my multi cloud hybrid private, multiple public cloud providers would continue that mantra. You always something very interesting from a storage array system level perspective brought out extensive portfolio around Envy Me the newest high performance protocol, both inside of a storage array and connecting a storage rate into a network fabric for storage. >> Now let's talk about that. Envy me because envy Me has been associate ID a little bit more higher and stuff. Some of the new things you're doing are bringing envy me and related classes of technology flash to a new class of workload. New class of Hugh's case. Tell us about it. >> Absolutely so what we're doing is bringing out the >> brand new >> refresh store wise portfolio. We start with R V seven thousand, which has envy me both inside the array and support for envy him Over Fibre channel. We have our fifty one hundred just below that, also supporting Envy me in the storage system. We're bringing out a new version of our fifty thirty called the fifty thirty at the very entry space are fifty tenny. These solutions all deliver dramatic performance gains but incredible price discounts as well. For example, the fifty ten e is not only twice as fast as the older fifty ten, but it happens to be up to twenty five percent less expensive. More for the money. That's the key watchword in the store. Wai's family. >> So tell us a little bit more about the fifty Tenney. What kind of use you love talking about applications, workload? Use cases? What kinds of applications were close use cases Are we talking about? >> So we've done a couple things. So first of all, we're leading with all flash across the portfolio. Yes, we still sell hybrids and hard drive a ways, and we'LL still do that in the fifty Tenney, for example. So if you're using hard drive, raise backup in archive work loads. Of course. Now, when using all flash arrays in a smaller shop, it could be your primary storage. Herzog's Barn Grill. That might be the great way to go when you're thinking more of the broader enterprises. It's great for edge. So branches of a bank, all of the outlets of a retail location and even a core data center. Not every workload is even not every data set is even so. Certain things need more expensive arrays and other ways you can go with an entry product. Still deliver the availability, the reliability of the performance you need, but you don't need to spend the most amount of money and stories gives you. That breath gives you the right price point the right software, and it even gives you six nines of availability, which is only thirty one seconds of downtime in a full year on an entry product. That's incredible. >> Well, I would think that the fifty thirty he would be especially relevant for some of those scale at work loves. Tell us about that. >> So in the fifty thirty, we can scale out into two note cluster up to thirty two petabytes, but we start small. You could get it at twelve. Same thing two. Ex Performance. Up to thirty percent less money and all of the store West family comes with our award winning Spectrum Virtualized software, which delivers enterprise class data services. Such a snapshot replication data rest, encryption, tearing, migration, et cetera, et cetera, not only for IBM store wise portfolio, but actually could work with over four hundred fifty raise, most of which are not ours. Great value for the money. Great software and bring better performance at a lower price. The fifty thirty and the whole portfolio includes our spectrum virtually software family. >> Now that's important because as we think about that, the relationship between these and other IBM or other products in the portfolio and multi cloud I know there's some work that's being done there tell us a bit about some of the some of the new updates that you've made. How that spectrum family is becoming even more relevant in the multi club so >> well, when you look at the whole family, everything in the spectrum family has heavy clarification in a multi cloud environment. Let's take spectrum protect not new from an announcement perspective of what we're doing and what we're launching on what we're doing from a new perspective. But it's been ableto backup to the cloud for years. In fact, over three hundred fifty cloud providers use spectrum protect as the engine further back. Oppa's a service portfolio Spectrum virtualized Computer Club. But we also have spectrum virtualized for public cloud that allows you to do staff shot replication only for IBM arrays, but for competitive a raise out to a public loud and even supports a rhe air gapping with a snapshot so you don't have to worry about ransomware malware, that's all. With Spectrum Virtualized family are spectrum sale product can automatically tear to the cloud IBM clad object storage could go from on premise toe off premise. So the big thing we've done with all of our portfolio, the software and then the arrays that sit on it when the case of spectrum protect backup is make sure we can work with any and almost every single cloud in the industry. Whether it's a big cloud like IBM Cloud, Amazon or Microsoft or a small cloud provider, you may want to use a local cloud provider depending on where you're located, not use one of the big club fighters. We work with that cloud provider to, But you made >> some made some special for spectrum virtual eyes. I mean spectrum virtualized. You're adding a new brother to the portfolio >> so that spectrum virtualized Republic Cloud. We first brought it out on IBM Cloud only. It now supports a ws. We know customers multi cloud most end users and you guys have written about it extensively at Weeki Bond in the Cube and silicon angle. That and users will not use one public loud. They will have four, five, six different public clouds. So spectrum virtualized republic loud delivers to onsite arrays. All the capability spectrum virtualized for public cloud sits in a V m wear virtualized in stand station out of the public cloud provider. Giving all those enterprise class functionalities and allowing us to move data back and forth to IBM. Cloud allows to move data back and forth to an Amazon cloud not only first store wise but also for again over four hundred fifty Raise that aren't ours using the spectrum virtualized software. So that's a great edition. We had it for IBM Cloud now for Amazon. As Republican Stanley first brought it out last year. It will also be extended to more clouds in the future as well. >> So store rise gonna refresh nooooo spectrum virtualized for public cloud Also getting, you know, adding to the portfolio great stuff. How do you anticipate that customers are gonna respond? >> Well, we've already had a great response for those customers we talked to under a non disclosure agreement. Now we're public with this new portfolio. What's not to like? You get extensive software capably spectrum virtualized with our fifty one hundred store wise and are seven thousand stories. Now get thie Envy Me technology, which is white hot performance technology in the storage injury, except at a much lower price point that when our competitors are brought out. So he brought Andrea me high end technology into the entry price point space, which is great. And we also have a nice portfolio that gives you certain products. Accuse the court data center other pranks that you would use the edge like banking and all the locations or in retail. So you're not going to put the most expensive practice. But you have a great six nines of availability, extensive software, twice the performance, and I said up to twenty five percent or thirty percent less, depending on which of our products than the older product. Bigger, faster, better, cheaper. >> So, Eric, let me be one of first congratulate you thie IBM storage journey since you and Ed Assualt have shown up at IBM or come backto idea in some cases has it's been a great thing to watch. You really refreshed portfolio made some great strides and we're getting great feedback from customers about the effort. So congratulations. >> Great. Thank you. And the new store lives is the latest in that and look for more just like we did in two thousand eighteen. Refresh across the plug. There's more coming in the second half here in other elements of our portfolio. >> Great sea IBM back and relevant in storage World Eric Herds on CMO VP of worldwide store channels, IBM Storage Thanks once again for being on the Cube. >> Thank you, Peter on. >> I'm Peter Burroughs. Thanks for listening until next time. Thanks for participating in this cube conversation.

[Music] hi I'm Peter Burroughs welcome to another cube conversation from our beautiful Studios here in palo alto california as we do with every cube conversation we come up with a great topic and we find someone who really understands it so they can talk about it we capture them for you so you can learn something about some of the new trends and changes in the industry and we've doing that today too the topic that we're talking about is how do you do a better job of mapping the costs that are being generated by the cloud or that informations coming out of cloud suppliers related to what you're using with the actual business activities that generate the differential capabilities that customers are looking for that's a tough tough challenge and to understand that better we're talking with junior Stormin who's a co-founder of cloud ability Jaron welcome to the cube thanks Peter good to be here so so let's talk about first who are you yeah so I am co-founder of cloud ability and credibility is focused around improving the unit economics of cloud spend so our customers tend to be those who are spending large amounts in AWS or Azure or GC P and we take their billing data their utilization data various metadata about their business and do machine learning and data science on top of it to help them get better visibility into sort of where that spend is going how they're using it but more importantly to give them some controls around how they want to optimize an optimize doesn't necessarily mean save money in a cloud world because most companies who are moving into cloud very heavily are doing that for the innovation for the speed so they can deliver you know better data faster but it's really about fine-tuning the conversation say okay here we want to save money here we want to move faster here we want to focus on quality and really providing a way for the the various groups that aren't normally talking the finance teams with the engineering teams with the procurement teams all these groups to come together and be able to take executive input to say okay how do we want to operate and how do we one improve those your economics as we go well I want to start with just quick comment on this notion of Union I can when people here historically hear the notion of unit unit economics they think of you know increasing scale so the average cost per unit goes down yeah I think you're talking about more than that right are you really also talking about a mapping of what spend is generating to the business activities that actually generate value and ensuring that you get the differential or the optimized Union economics unit cost yeah oh so the mapping is actually really interesting ly challenging in cloud it's hard enough in traditional IT if you look at somebody like AWS they have two hundred thousand SKUs different products you can buy and they now bill at a second level resolution so what this means is you've got all these engineers out there using cloud in a very good way to move quickly and of 8/2 little more features and they kind of have an unlimited credit card that they can go spend on as quickly as they need and they never see the statements they never see the bills and the other side you've got finance teams procurement teams who've sort of lost control of traditionally the power of the PIO that they have to actually rein that in and they're they're struggling just to understand what is the spend and then to the mapping question how do i allocate these hundreds and millions of charges that i have this month into cost centers and business units and getting that sorted in a world where engineers are focused on moving fast or not they're not tagging things based on cost and are typically so once you get that sort of mapping aspect sorted to the next point you brought as is in bringing the business value so how do we start to relate that back there's a concept a lot of you know IT has been a cost center and now it's sexual driver of value in a world where businesses are increasingly delivering their value through software so we need to start tying the spending mapping into the business and then tying that to the value delivered a great example of this I was sitting last week with one of the largest cloud spenders in the world there have been you know nine figures with their primary vendor and in the conversation with the executives we realized that nobody was looking at both sides of that equation you had the the finance people who were saying hey we're tracking the cost and we think I was happening there and then you had the the revenue generators looking at the money coming anyhow the cloud people with that but there wasn't this centralized view to say alright we want to have a conversation about what value I were getting to spend and the question that always comes up what that is I was doing the right amount well let me build on that because it's seat because IT is historically and this is one of the things that we've been doing over the last few years IT has historically done things on a project level yes all right so we had waterfall development we tried to change that with agile we had you know buy the hardware upfront and then deploy the application on a cloud changes that so this project orientation has led to a set of decisions about finance at the moment that the business asides to do it we've changed the practices that we use at a development level we've changed the practices that we use at an asset level is it now time to change the practices that we use at a finance level is that really kind of what's going on here it is that the project analogy is good because what we're seeing is they're shifting from a project basis to a productive basis and products that deliver value increasingly if you think about the change that's happened with DevOps it in the scene and cloud companies are delivering more of their value through software and they're not just using IT for internal projects right it's actually the driver of business how we interact with Airlines and banks and all these things so that's the shift to say okay now we've gotten good at DevOps moving fast and we've gotten good at deploying and building better data stores now we need to bring in this new discipline and the discipline is what the market is calling fin ops which essentially is combining financial financial operations but you simply combine technology applied specifically do a cloud roll and it only can really happen in cloud it can't happen in data centers because data centers have fixed spending right you have to wait to get resources once you make the investment it's a sunk cost there's months of lead time cloud introduced the removal of constraints which means you can get whatever you want as quickly as you want and DevOps meant it's all automated so instead of your collection of 60 servers you've got thousands that are coming up and down all the time so what you don't have to do is bring in all these groups engineers have to think about cost as a new efficiency metric they have to think about the impact of their business at this code this confirmation template they just wrote is going to have and the finance teams have to shift from this mode of I'm under report retro actively and at a quarterly granularity sixty days after it happened and block investment to be I'm going to partner with these teams report in a real-time fashion give them the visibility help forecast and actually bring them together to make better business decisions about the cloud spend so cloud has allowed development to alter practically agile has been around for a long time before the cloud predates the cloud but it became practical and almost demanded as a consequence of what you could do with cloud so cloud change development through agile it changed infrastructure management through DevOps where now you're you're deploying software infrastructure of code and know as code and what you're saying is the third leg of that stool cloud is now changing how you do financial management of technology financial management of IT and we're calling that fin ops yeah and you you you can't really have fin ops without cloud or without DevOps and if you have the two together you alter we need this new set of it's a new operating model the reason this has come to a head of late is you know if you look at going to the Amazon riemeck conferences a few years back it was like well how much is cloud gonna be a thing and okay clouds now gonna be a thing when's it gonna happen now it's about the how and how do we do this better cloud is hitting for the material spend levels now at bigger organizations I mean the you know see the the cloud projections where it's going I think it's now 360 billion the next few years and we're seeing CFO's at public companies look to say okay it's not my biggest line-item yet but it's the most variable and fastest growing cogs expense so it's actually start to affect our margins we needed a new set of process used to actually manage this so one of the things that's coming to market is this new group called the phenoms Foundation which is a non-profit trade association that initially has a few dozen of some of the largest cloudspinners of the world there's the Spotify as the alaskans the nation why it's Autodesk's and they've all come together as a set of best practice practitioners to start to codify this into something that can be you know scaled out in organizations so that group is gonna be putting out a user conference around this area there's a new o'reilly book that's coming out the end of the year that's going to be sort of the treatise and all this stuff pulled together because what we found in you know me is in code ability in the last eight years we bring in technology and platform to show the recommendations of visibility how to do this but the real challenge companies run into is they don't have the internal expertise their finance teams understand what they need to the engineers don't and so you know they came to us last year saying can you help figure out the processes can you educate us and that's really where you know the spin offs foundation is growing bringing together those people to define those processes so the the impact of cloud on each of these different groups on the development group on the infrastructure team and now on the finance team the interest the developer groups I think some of them resisted it but generally speaking it's gone okay and and eventually tooling from a variety different players came along that made it easy to enact best practices and software development through an agile mechanism in the last few years after significant battles within infrastructure teams about whether or not they were going to use software as code we've seen new products new tooling that has facilitated the adoption of those practices what kind of tooling are we going to see introduced that facilitates thin ops so that finance teams procurement teams move from a project orientation to a strategic management of the resource orientation I mean I think the first is on the engineering side is seeing costs become a first-class citizen of an efficiency metric that they need to look at so you know in their build processes baked in the CI CD looking to see am I properly sizing my compute request for the workload that it needs there's some research research just came out showing that I think it's like 80 percent of the market is not using the best discounting options the cloud providers offer you hear these horror stories it's too expensive we said overspend that's not actually a problem with the cloud providers that's a problem with the enterprises not using the tools offered the discounts the reserved ences the infrequent access door exactly so I think at the end of the day it's the first step in this is getting those checks in place to say are we using the things that help drive the right cost for our needs and the other side of that the finance team is really changing the way that they are interacting with their technology teams becoming partners becoming advocates in this versus a passive you know retroactive reporter down the line and this enables these sort of micro optimization discussions that can happen where data center world we bought it some cots is sitting there odd world we can make decisions today that impact you know the business tomorrow so let me make sure I got this so I have a client who who I was having a conversation with them they told me that their their Amazon there AWS bill is 87 gigabytes mm-hmm not that monthly that's 87 pages that's 87 gigabyte yeah so we get we bring this 87 gigabytes in and it's a story about what I consume out of Amazon it's not a story what my business utilizes to achieve its objectives so we're now entering into a world where we're trying to introduce those financial visit that financial visibility into how that spend can be mapped to what the business does so the finance group can look at a common notion of truth and the IT group can look at a combination of troop application owners can look at a common notion of truth and that's what is fin ops is providing if I got that right yeah absolutely and the eighty-seven gigabyte example is the exactly reason why it is fin option not just cloud financial management you can't have a person with a spreadsheet looking at that and trying to make decisions about it right it has to be automated its IT finances code it's got to be baked into the processes you know we we've seen organizations that have hundreds of millions of individual charges hitting them in a consumption based manner the other thing that's come in with the fin ops as a core tenant is we're now seeing a decentralization of accountability for that spend so if you look at the big cloud spenders out there maybe spending tens or hundreds mils a year some of them have thousands of cloud environments gone is the day of we have a centralized Group begins to say we're gonna turn this off turn this off we want to give each of those teams the ability to see there's just their portion of that bill in the right mapped way as you said and to be able to take actions on the back of that so that's changed and they you know you run it you maintain it you understand which shutdown what has sort of come back to the old centralized model is this notion and this is where procurements job is shifted to largely of we deal still want to centralize the rate reduction so engineers you go use less right essentially finance team procurement work together with the cloud vendors to get the best possible rates through reserved instances can be reduced discounts you know volume discounts negotiated rates whatever it is and they become sort of strategic sourcing just say you're gonna use whatever you're going to use and you're gonna watch that to make sure you're using the right amount will targets threshold we're gonna make sure we get the best rate and that's sort of the two sides of the coin well very importantly procurement has always been organized on episodic purchases where the whole point is to bring the price point down and now we're talking about a continuous services where you were literally you're literally basing your business on capabilities provided by a third party and that is a very very very different relation just-in-time purchasing right and it's and it's a new supply chain management process where you have so many SKU options and you are making these purchase decisions sometimes thousands a day and that impacts everything down the road excellent gr storm and co-founder of cloud ability talking about Finn ops and cloud abilities role in helping businesses map the cloud spend to their business activities for a better more optimal views of how they get what they need out of their cloud expenditures Jr thanks very much for being on the connects here and once again I'm Peter burrows and thanks for listening to this acute conversation until next time [Music] you

>> Hi, I'm Peter Burroughs Wellcome to wicked bon action >> item from the Cube Studios in Palo Alto, California So today we've got a great conversation, and what we're going to be talking about is hybrid cloud hybrid. Claude's been in the news a lot lately. Largest consequences from changes made by a Ws is they announced Outpost and acknowledged for the first time that there's going to be a greater distribution of data on a greater distribution of function as enterprise has moved to the cloud. We've been on top of this for quite some time, and it actually coined what we call true hybrid cloud, which is the idea that increasingly, we're going to see a need for a common set of capabilities and services in multiple locations so that the cloud could move to the data and not the data automatically being presumed to move to the cloud. >> Now to have that >> conversation and to reveal some new research on what the cost in value propositions of the different options are available. Today. We've >> got David Foyer. David. Welcome to the Cube. Thank you. So, David, let's start. When we talk about Hybrid Cloud, we're seeing a continuum of different options start to emerge. What are the defining characteristics? >> Yes, we're seeing it could continue him emerging. We have what we've called standalone off course. That one is end of the spectrum on DH. There we have multi cloud, and then we have loosely and tightly coupled, and then we have true and as you go up the spectrum. So the dependence upon data depends on the data plane dependence upon low latent see dependance on writing does a systems of record records. All of those increase as we going from from lonely for High Leighton Sea and High Band with all way up to low late. >> So let me see if I got this right. It's true. I've a cloud is at one end and true. Either cloud is low late and see right on into workloads simplest possible administration. That means we're typically goingto have a common stack in all locations. Next to that is this notion of tightly coupled hybrid cloud, which could be higher late. And see, right oriented could probably has a common set of software on all no common mental state. And then, kind of this. This notion of loosely coupled right multi or hybrid cloud, which is low, high late and see, write or read oriented, which may have just a P I level coordination and commonality and all >> that's right. And then you go down even further to just multi cloud, where you're just connecting things, and each of them is independent off each other. >> So if I'm a CEO and I'm looking at a move to a cloud, I have to think about Greenfield applications and the natural distribution of data for those Greenfield applications. And that's going to help me choose which class of hybrid clawed him and he used. But let's talk about the more challenging from a set of scenarios for most CEOs, which is the existing legacy applications as I cry that Rangel yeah, systems of record. As I try to bring those those cloud like experience to those applications, how am I going through that thought process? >> So we have some choices. The choices are I could move it up to lift and shift up to on a one of the clouds by the large clouds, many of them around. And what if I if I do that what I'm need to be looking at is, what is the cost of moving that data? And what is the cost of pushing that up into the cloud and lost the conversion cast if I need to move to another database, >> and I think that's the biggest one. So it just costs of moving the data, which is just uninterested. It's a cost of format changes at our migration and all the other out conversion changes. >> So what I did in my research was focus on systems of record, the the highly expensive, very, very important systems of record, which obviously are fed by a lot of other things their systems, the engagement analytics, etcetera. But those systems of record have to work. They you need to know if you've taken on order, you need to have consistency about that order. You need to know always that you can recover any data you need in your financials, etcetera. All of that is mission critical systems of record. Andi, that's the piece that I focused on here, and I focused on >> sort of. These are loaded and she >> low, very low, latent, right oriented, very right orientated types of applications. And I focused on the oracle because the majority ofthe systems of record run on Oracle databases on the large scale ones, at least so that's what we're we're focusing on here. So I looking at the different options for a C I O off. How they would go on DH. There are three main options open at the moment. There's there's Arkalyk Cloud Cloud, a customer, which gives thie the cloud experience. There is Microsoft as your stack, which has a a Oracle database version of it on DH outposts. But we eliminated outposts not because it's not going to be any good, but because it's not there yet, is >> you get your Razor John thing. >> That's right. So we focused on Oracle on DH as you and we focused on what was the benefit of moving from a traditional environment where you've got best of breed essentially on site to this cloud environment. >> So if we think about it, the normal way of thinking about this kind of a research is that people talk about R. A Y and historically that's been done by looking by keeping the amount of work that's performed has given constant and then looking at how the different technology components compare from a call standpoint. But a move to cloud the promise of a move to cloud is not predicated on lowering costs per se, but may have other financial considerations, of course, but it's really predicated on the notion of the cod experience, which is intended to improve business results. So we think about our lives being a numerator question. Value is the amount of work you do versus the denominator question, which is what resources are consumed to perform that work. It's not just the denominator side we really need to think about. The numerator side is well, you create. So what? What kind of things are we focused >> on? What we think about that value created his consequence of possibilities and options of the cloud. >> Right? So both are important. So so Obviously, when you move to a cloud environment, you can simplify operations. In particular, you can simplify recovery. You, Khun simplify a whole number of things within the shop and those give you extra resources on. Then the question is, Do you just cash in on those resources and say OK, I've made some changes, Or do you use those resources to improve the ability of your systems to work and one important characteristic off it alight and systems of record in particular is that you get depreciation of that asset. Over time, it becomes less fitted to the environment it has started with, so you have to do maintenance on it. You have to do maintenance and work, and as you know most means most work done in my tea shop is on the maintenance side minutes. An enhancement. It's maintenance. An enhancement, yes. So making more resources available on making it easier to do that maintenance are making less, less things that are going to interfere with that faster time to to to maintenance faster time. Two new applications or improvements is really fundamental to systems of record, so that is the value that you can bring to it. And you also bring value with lower of better availability, higher availability as well. So those are the things that we put into the model to see how the different approaches. And we were looking at really a total one. One supplier being responsible for everything, which was the Oracle environment of Oracle clouded customer to a sort of hybrid invite more hybrid environment where you had the the the work environment where you had the equipment coming from different place vendor that the service, the oracle, the as your service coming from Microsoft and, of course, the database coming then from Arkham itself. And we found from tremendous improvement in the value that you could get because of this single source. We found that a better model. >> So the common source led to efficiencies that then allowed a business to generate new classes of value. Because, as you said, you know, seventy plus percent of a night organ orb business is spending. Biology is associate with maintaining which they're enhancing. What's there in a very limited amount is focused on new greenfield or new types of applications. So if you can reduce the amount of time energy that goes into that heritage set of applications those systems of record, the not opens up that frees up resources to do some of the things >> on DH Having inflexibility now with things like As your stack conned in the future E. W. S off. Putting that resource either on premise or in the cloud, means that you can make decisions about where you process things things about where the data is about, where the data needs to be, the best placement of the data for what you're trying to do >> and that that decision is predicated on things like late in sea, but also regulatory, environment and intellectual property, controlling >> the custom moving data up and down. So the three laws of off off the cloud so having that flexibility of moving, keeping it where you want to, is a tremendous value in again in terms ofthe the speed of deployment on the speed of improved. >> So we'll get to the issues surrounding the denominator side of this. I want to come back to that numerator sites that the denominator again is the resources consumed to deliver the work to the business. But when we talk about that denominator side, know you perhaps opening up additional monies to do new types of development new times of work. But take us through some of the issues like you know what is a cloud experience associated with single vendor Faster development. Give us some of the issues that are really driving the value proposition. Look above the line. >> I mean, the whole issue about cloud is that you go on, take away all of the requirements to deal with the hardware deal with the orchestration off the storage deal with all of these things. So instead of taking weeks, months to put in extra resources, you say I want them on is there. >> So you're taking out administrate your taking administrative tasks out of the flow out of the flow, and as a consequence, things happen. Faster is the time of values. One of the first one. Give us another one. >> So obviously the ability to no I have it's a cloud environment. So if you're a vendor of that cloud, what you want to be able to do is to make incremental changes quickly, as opposed to awaiting for a new release and work on a release basis. So that fundamental speed to change speed to improve, bring in new features. Bringing new services a cloud first type model that is a very powerful way for the vendor to push out new things. And for the consumer, too, has absorbed them. >> Right? So the first one is time to value, but also it's lower cost to innovation. >> Yes, faster innovation ability to innovate. And then the third. The third most important part is if you if you re invest those resources that you've saved into new services new capabilities of doing that. To me, the most important thing long term for systems of record is to be able to make them go faster and use that extra Leighton see time there to bring in systems off systems of analytics A. I systems other systems on provide automation of individual business processes, increased automation that is gonna happen over time. That's that's a slow adding to it. But it means you can use those cloud mechanisms, those additional resources, wherever they are. You can use those to provide a clear path to improving the current systems of record. And that is a much faster and more cost effective way than going in for a conversion or moving the data upto the cloud or shifting lift and shift. For these types of acts, >> what kind of they're all kind of related? So I get, I get. I get superior innovation speeds because I'm taking new technology and faster. I get faster time to value because I'm not having to perform much of tasks, and I could get future could imbue additional types of work in support of automation without dramatically expanding the transactional wait and see on arrival rate of turns actions within the system of record. Okay, So how did Oracle and Azure with Oracle stack up in your analysis? >> So first of all, important is both a viable solutions. They both would work okay, but the impact in terms of the total business value, including obviously any savings on people and things like that, was two hundred nineteen eighty three hundred million dollars additional. This was for Robert to come in for a a Fortune two thousand customer, so it was around two billion dollars. So a lot of money over five years, a lot of money. Either way, you would save two hundred million if you were with with the zero but three hundred with the oracle, so that that to me, is far, far higher than the costs of I T. For that particular company, it's It is a strategic decision to be able to get more value out quicker. And for this class of workload on Oracle than Arkalyk, Cloud was the best decision to be absolutely fair If you were on Microsoft's database. And you wanted to go to Microsoft as you. That would be the better bet you would. You would get back a lot of those benefits, >> so stay with him. The stack, if you can't. Correct. All right, So So two billion dollars a year. Five years, ten billion dollars in revenue, roughly between two hundred million and saving for one Congress all around three. Treasure Quest. Oracle three hundred millions were one percent swing. Talk to us about speed value. What >> happens in the numerator side of that equation >> S Oh, so it is lower in caste, but you have a higher. The cast of the actual cloud is a little a little higher. So overall, the pure hardware equipment Cass is is awash is not going to change much. It might be a little bit more expensive. You make the savings a cz? Well, because of the people you less less operators, simpler environment. Those are the savings you're going to make. And then you're going to push those back into into the organization a cz increased value that could be given to the line of business. >> So the closure of the researchers If your CEO, you look at your legacy application going to be difficult to move, and you go with stack. That's best for those legacy applications. And since the vast majority of systems of record or running all scale large scale, then that means work. A cloud of customers is a superior fit for most from a lot of chances. So if you're not there, though, when you look at other options, all right, David Floy er thank you. Thanks very much for being on the Cube today, and you've been watching other wicked bon action >> item from the Cube Studios and Power Rialto, California on Peter Burke's Thanks very much for watching.

[Music] hi I'm Peter Burris and welcome to another Cube conversation from the cube studios here in beautiful Palo Alto California today we're going to talk about some new things that are happening in the security world obviously this is one of the most important domains within the technology industry and increasingly because of digital business in business overall now to do that we've asked Eric manki to come back Derick is the chief of security insights and global threat alliances at Fort Net Derek welcome back to the cube absolutely the same feel the same way Derek okay so we're going to get into some some predictions about what the bad guys are doing and some predictions about what the defenses are doing how we're going to see them defense opportunities improve but let's set the stage because predictions always are made on some platforms some understanding of where we are and that has also changed pretty dramatically so what's the current state in the overall security world Derek yeah so what we saw this year in 2019 a lot is a big increase on automation and I'm talking from an attackers point of view I think we talked about this a little bit earlier in the year so what we've been seeing is the use of frameworks to enhance sort of the day-to-day cycles that cyber criminals and attackers are using to make their you know criminal operations is that much more efficient sort of a well-oiled machine so we're seeing toolkits that are taking you know things within the attack cycle and attack change such as reconnaissance penetration you know exploitation getting into systems and just making that that much quicker so that that window to attack the time to breach has been shrinking thanks to a lot of these crime kits and services that are offered out there now one other comment on this or another question that I might have on this is that so speed is becoming an issue but also the risk as digital business takes on a larger four portion of overall business activities that ultimately the risks and costs of doing things wrong is also going up if I got the right yeah absolutely for sure and you know it's one of those things that it's the longer that a cybercriminal has a foothold in your system or has the opportunity to move laterally and gain access to other systems maybe it's your I o T or you know other other platforms the higher the risk right like the deeper down they are within an attack cycle the higher the risk and because of these automated toolkits are allowing allowing them to facilitate that it's a catalyst really right they can get into the system they can actually get out that much quicker the risk is a much higher and we're talking about risk we're talking about things like intellectual property exfiltration client information this sort of stuff that can be quite damaging to organizations so with the new foundation of speed is becoming an increasingly important feature probably think about security and the risks are becoming greater because digital assets are being recognized as more valuable why do you take us through some of the four Donets predictions on some of the new threats or the threat landscape how's the threat landscape changing yeah so as I said we've already seen this shift in automation so what I would call the basics I mean knowing the target trying to break into that target right when it comes to breaking into the target cyber criminals right now they're following the path of least resistance right they're finding easy ways that they can get into IOT devices I into other systems in our world when we talk about penetration or breaking into systems it's through zero days right so the idea of a zero day is essentially a cyber weapon there's movies and Hollywood that have been made off of this you look at attacks like Stuxnet in the past they all use zero day vulnerabilities to get into systems all right so the idea of one of the predictions we're seeing is that cyber criminals are gonna start to use artificial intelligence right so we talk about machine learning models and artificial intelligence to actually find these zero days for them so in the world of an attacker to find a zero day they have to do a practice called fuzzing and fuzzing is basically trying to trick up computer code right so you're throwing unverified parameters out at your turn T of throwing and unanticipated sequences into code parameters and and input validation and so forth to the point that the code crashes and that's from an attackers point of view that's when you take control of that code this how you know finding weapons into system cyber weapons in this systems work it typically takes a lot of a lot of resource it takes a lot of cycles it takes a lot of intelligence that takes a lot of time to discovery we can be talking on month for longer it's one of the predictions that we're hitting on is that you know cyber criminals are gonna start to use artificial intelligence fuzzing or AI F as I call it to be able to use AI to do all of that you know intelligent work for them so you know basically having a system that will find these gateways if you will these these you know new vulnerabilities into systems so sustained use of AI F to corrupt models so that they can find vulnerabilities that can then be exploited yeah absolutely and you know when it comes to the world of hacking and fuzzing it's one of the toughest things to do it is the reason that zero days are worth so much money you know they can suffer hundreds of thousands of dollars on darknet and in the cyber criminal you know economy so it's because they're talk talk to finally take a lot of resources a lot of intelligence and a lot of effort to be able to not only find the vulnerability but then actively attack it and exploit it right there's two phases to that yeah so the idea is by using part of the power of artificial intelligence that cyber criminals will start to leverage that and harness it in a bad way to be able to not only discover you know these vulnerabilities but also create that weapon right create the exploit so that they can find more you know more holes if you will or more angles to be able to get into systems now another one is that virtualization is happening in you know what the good guys as we virtualized resources but is it also being exploited or does it have the potential be exploited by the bad guys as well especially in a swarming approach yeah virtualization for sure absolutely so the thing about virtualization too is you often have a lot of virtualization being centralizes especially when we talk about cloud right so you have a lot of potential digital assets you know valuable digital assets that could be physically located in one area so when it comes to using things like artificial intelligence fuzzing not only can it be used to find different vulnerabilities or ways into systems it can also be combined with something like I know we've talked about the const that's warm before so using you know multiple intelligence infected pieces of code that can actually try to break into other virtual resources as well so virtualization asked definitely it because of in some cases close proximity if you will between hypervisors and things like this it's also something of concern for sure now there is a difference between AI fai fuzzing and machine learning talk to us a little bit about some of the trends or some of the predictions that pertain to the advancement of machine learning and how bad guys are going to exploit that sure so machine learning is a core element that is used by artificial intelligence right if you think of artificial intelligence it's a larger term it can be used to do intelligent things but it can only make those decisions based off of a knowledge base right and that's where machine learning comes into place machine learning is it's data it's processing and it's time right so there's various machine learning learning models that are put in place it can be used from everything from autonomous vehicles to speech recognition to certainly cybersecurity and defense that we can talk about but you know the other part that we're talking about in terms of reductions is that it can be used like any tool by the bad guys so the idea is that machine learning can be used to actually study code you know from from a black hat attacker point of view to studying weaknesses in code and that's the idea of artificial intelligence fuzzing is that machine learning is used to find software flaws it finds the weak spots in code and then it actually takes those sweet spots and it starts probing starts trying to attack a crisis you know to make the code crash and then when it actually finds that it can crash the code and that it can try to take advantage of that that's where the artificial intelligence comes in right so the AI engine says hey I learned that this piece of software or this attack target has these weak pieces of code in it that's for the AI model so the I fuzzy comes into place to say how can I actually take advantage how can i exploit this right so that's where the AI trussing comes into play so we've got some predictions about how black hats and bad guys are going to use AI and related technologies to find new vulnerabilities new ways of exploiting things and interacting new types of value out of a business what are the white hats got going for them what are their some of the predictions on some of the new classes of defense that we're going to be able to put to counter some of these new classes of attacks yeah so that's that's you know that's honestly some of the good news I believe you know it's always been an armor an arms race between the bad guys and the good guys that's been going on for decades in terms of cybersecurity often you know the the bad guys are in a favorable position because they can do a million things wrong and they don't care right from the good guys standpoint we can do a million things right one thing wrong and that's an issue so we have to be extra diligent and careful with what we do but with that said you know as an example of 49 we've deployed our forty guard AI right so this is six years in the making six years using machine learning using you know precise models to get higher accuracy low false positives to deploy this at reduction so you know when it comes to the defensive mechanism I really think that we're in the drivers position quite frankly we have better technology than the Wild West that they have out on the bad guys side you know from an organization point of view how do you start combating this sort of onslaught of automation in AI from from the bad guys side well you gotta fight fire with fire right and what I mean by that is you have to have an intelligent security system you know perimeter based firewalls and gateways they don't cut it anymore right you need threat intelligence you need systems that are able to orchestrate and automate together so in different security products and in your security stack or a security fabric that can talk to each other you know share intelligence and then actually automate that so I'm talking about things like creating automated security policies based off of you know threat intelligence finding that a potential threat is trying to get into your network that sort of speed through that integration on the defensive side that intelligence speed is is is the key for it I mean without that any organization is gonna be losing the arms race and I think one of the things that is also happening is we're seeing a greater willingness perhaps not to share data but to share information about the bad things that are happening and I know that fort and it's been something at the vanguard of ensuring that there's even better clearing for this information and then driving that back into code that actually further automates how customers respond to things if I got that right yeah you hit a dead-on absolutely you know that is one of the key things that were focused on is that we realized we can't win this war alone right nobody can on a single point of view so we're doing things like interoperating with security partners we have a fabric ready program as an example we're doing a lot of work in the industry working with as an example Interpol and law enforcement to try to do attribution but though the whole endgame what we're trying to do is to the strategy is to try to make it more expensive for cyber criminals to operate so we obviously do that as a vendor you know through good technology our security fabric I integrated holistic security fabric and approach to be able to make it tougher you know for attackers to get into systems but at the same time you know we're working with law enforcement to find out who these guys are to go after attribution prosecution cut off the head of the snake as I call it right to try to hit cyber criminal organizations where it hurts we're also doing things across vendor in the industry like cyber threat Alliance so you know forty knots a founding member of the cyber threat Alliance we're working with other security vendors to actually share real time information is that speed you know message that we're talking about earlier to share real time information so that each member can take that information and put it into you something actionable right in our case when we get intelligence from other vendors in the cyber threat Alliance as an example we're putting that into our security fabric to protect our customers in new real-time so in sum we're talking about a greater value from being attacked being met with a greater and more cooperative use of technology and process to counter those attacks all right yeah absolutely so open collaboration unified collaboration is is definitely key when it comes to that as well you know the other thing like I said is is it's the is the technology piece you know having integration another thing from the defensive side too which is becoming more of a topic recently is deception deception techniques this is a fascinating area to me right because the idea of deception is the way it sounds instead of to deceive criminals when they're coming knocking on your door into your network so it's really what I call like the the house of a thousand mirrors right so they get into your network and they think they're going to your data store but is it really your data store right it's like it's there's one right target and a thousand wrong targets it's it's a it's a defensive strategy that organizations can play to try to trip up cyber criminals right it makes them slower it makes them more inaccurate it makes them go on the defensive and back to the drawing board which is something absolutely I think we have to do so it's very interesting promising you know technology moving forward in 2019 to essentially fight back against the cyber criminals and to make it more expensive to get access to whatever it is that they want Derek max Lilly yeah Derrick McKey chief of security insights and global threat Alliance this is for net thanks once again for being on the cube it's a pleasure anytime look forward to the next chat and from Peter Burroughs and all of us here at the cube in Palo Alto thank you very much for watching this cube conversation until next time you