(instrumental music) >> Hi everybody, this is Dave Velante. Welcome to the special wikibon community event. VMware, VMworld 2018, strong momentum but still choppy waters. How can you say that Dave? How can you say strong momentum but still choppy waters? The data center is on fire. We just came back from VMworld 2018, the eco system is exploding, revenues are up, profits are up, all looks good. Well we agree in general, but theCUBE was there. We had two sets. We interviewed over 100 guests. 75 segments on theCUBE and right now what we want to do in this special community event is share with you our community and hear from you what you thought of the event, what we thought of the event and let's collaborate and come up with some conclusions. So, what were the key points made on theCUBE by Michael Dell, Pat Kellsinger, Ray Ofarell, Andy Bechtelshtein and number of other folks, customers, practitioners, technologists and eco system partners on theCUBE? What did they say and what does it mean for users? AWS and VMware, a big theme on theCUBE last week was is the AWS VMware partnership a one way trip to the Hotel Cloudifornia or is it a boon for the data center? What about AWS with RDS, the data base, on prim, what does that mean? How effective will that be? What does it say about AWS's strategy and what does it mean for VMware and the eco system? What's VMware's play at the edge? What about containers? Containers are supposedly going to kill VMware or hurt VMware's momentum. What does the community think about that? And what about Dell's new capital structure? Dell is going public again. It's taking an 11 billion dollar dividend out of VMware's 13 billion dollars of cash. Is that the best use of VMware's cash? And is VMware constrained in terms of it's RND going forward? We're going to address these and other items with the following format. We're going to show you now highlights from VMworld 2018 from theCUBE and then we're going to come back in the crowd chat and discuss. So thanks for watching everybody. Take a look at these video clips and these statements from senior leaders and then we'll go into the crowd chat. >> Welcome back to theCUBE, I'm Lisa Martin with Dave Velante, John Furrier, Stu Miniman at the end of day two of our continuing coverage guys of VMworld 2018, huge event. 25,000 plus people here. 100,000 plus expected to be engaging with the on demand, the live experiences, our biggest show, right. 94 interviews in the next three days, two of them down. >> And evolving over the years. I mean at VMworld's core, it is a technical conference. Right, so I would say that the base of the volume of the program is still catered towards a real hands on, technical practitioner and middle management but we are seeing more business executives come. They want to know what their teams are exploring. They want to understand vision and I think VMware you know, value proposition to enterprises is growing and therefore, it's starting to be more of a business conversation. So that is a segment of the audience that is growing. >> A few questions, I think first of all the Amazon news is already on VMware on premises is earth shattering news at many levels. One, Amazon's never done it before. Two, I think people are starting to understand this downstream a little bit later. But it's going to have a significant impact on the opportunities in multi cloud. So, I think Amazon's relationship with VMware is very deep at the level of technology and stay cold is at the top of both companies. Andy Jaci and Pat Gelsinger are both in this to win it together. It's obvious and anyone who says otherwise really isn't really informed. They're deep in the technical side, they have management at the top approving this, they're going to market together in the field. There is a legit synergy and they're going to win the long game. Gelsinger's making the big bet and remember, three years ago Pat Gelsinger was the gun. What's his role going to be? People were nervous about their cloud. Look it, VMware boxed the cloud and they're kicking ass right now with cloud. So they made the right moves. They steered the ship away from the rocks, they're out in the clear sailing. Love their strategy, Keno with Gelsinger was very specifically around the generational shift around VMware and the industry. He went through the bridging and I love the cleverness of the story telling, bridging tech trends of VMware ethos. He talked about the history, servers ESX, BYOD workspace, network NSX, cloud migration, that was their kind of initial private cloud, but right now its multi cloud and profit and people doing tech for good. So I think Gelsinger's laying down the generational shift that Vmware's going for and their making the huge bet on AWS, so it makes the question. What about Asher, what about Google? Is VMware going to be a one cloud game? Are they going to bridge to other clouds? That's going to be a very interesting tell sign 'cause the relationship on stage with Andy Jaci in fact Gelsinger is pretty significant. I think it's going to be a hard thing to go in to other clouds and say, I want to dig you too. >> Last year Pat said that networking has the potential to be the next decade bigger than what virtualization was for the wave and we are seeing good movement. I think I said it on our intro this morning but when Asira was acquired, the promise that we as a networking industry felt that they could be that inter weaving kind of glue for multi cloud and it kind of got hidden for a few years while they built that intersect, they made it really enterprise ready. They did really well with adoption. But now that vision is kind of back in full and that is what VMware can ride. Not to just be virtualization. V spheres great, they'll drive that for awhile, but the networking and security pieces is why VMware has the right to sit at the table in this multi cloud discussion. Now it was funny, I interviewed Keith Townsen and he said VMware, you know, he's now a VMware employee, VMware is the best position to help customers do that transformation. I said, hey Keith, I hear ya, but Microsoft and Amazon and a whole bunch of other management people might kind of step up and say, we've got a right to be at the table too. >> Of course all the legacy guys are trying to figure out, okay, their cloud strategies. But now all the major cloud guys are betting on Prim. We saw Google next, the on Prim strategy was certainly Assure with Assure Stack. Oracle has bets in cloud and with cloud customers got bets for On Prem. Now AWS throws its Admuring. James Kobielus, you sat in the analyst sessions all day. What did you learn? What were your big take aways? What do we need to know? >> Well first of all it's clear that AWS partnership VMware's all in with them. Look at the past year since they announced the customer adoption, partner enablement. They share variety and depth of the integrations that these partners have put together including today. It's pretty serious in terms of VMware's investment in that relationship, deepening that to the point where, there are no splashy Google partnership announcements or IBM or anybody else. It's clear that they're really, they're each others hybrid cloud partner par excolons. I don't think either of them, or I don't think the VMware is going to go anywhere near as deep with the other public club providers any time soon. But really my take away today from the analysis session was that VMware is going seriously to the edge and it's really interesting, they're building an appliance to take their entire stack and bring it down to edge deployment and distribute that around and then manage that for customer on a global basis with automation, there's going to be AI and machine learning built in so that if VMware will be able as a managed service to drive the software defined data center all the way out to the edges for its clients. And they're putting themselves in a position where they could actually, that could be there next major revenue producing business. As the traditional hypervisor VMworld begins to wane in terms of putting cube and server less and so forth on an appliance. Putting that in the clients sight and managing it for them. And then white boxing it potentially to other cloud providers to provide to their customers. This could be in the future coming in the next year or two. Something that can propel VMware to the next stage where they are everybody's preferred multi cloud management, edge management partner. >> Provide a slightly different version of one of the things you said. I definitely agree. I think what VMware hopes to do, I think they're not alone is to have AWS look like an appliance to their console, to have Assure look like an appliance to their console. So through free VMware, you can get access to whatever services you need including your VMware machines your VM's inside those clouds but that increasingly their goal is to be that control point, that management point for all of these different resources that are building and it is very compelling. I think that there's one area that I still think we need more from. As analysts we always got to look through what's more required. And I hear what you say about broad dimensions but I think that the edge story still requires a fair amount of work. >> Oh yeah. >> It's a project in place, but that's going to be an increasingly important focus of how architectures get laid out, how people think about applications in the future, how design happens, how methodologies for building software works. David, what do you think? When you look out, what is more is needed for you? >> So I think there are two things that give me a small concern. The edge, that's a long term view. So they have a lot of time to get that right. But the edge view is very much an IT view top down. And they are looking to put into place everything that they think the OT people should fit in with. I think that is personally not going to be a winning strategy. You have to take it from the bottom up. The world is going to go towards devices, very rich devices and sensors, lots of software, right on that device, the inference work on those devices. And the job of IT will be to integrate those devices. It won't be those devices taking on the standards of IT. It will be IT that has to shape itself to look after all those devices there. So that's the main viewpoint I think that needs adjustment and it will come I'm sure over time. >> But as you said, there's a lot of computer science, it's going to be an enormous amount of new partnerships are going to be fabricated. >> Exactly. >> Once you make this happen... >> I want to see the road map for Kuhernettys and server less. Last year they made an announcement of a server less project, I forgot what the code name is. Didn't hear a whole lot about it this year but they're going up the app stack. They got a coop distribution. They need a developer story. I mean developers are building functional apps and so forth. And they're also containerized. They need developer story and they need a server less story and they need to bring us up to speed on where they're going in that regard, because AWS, they're predominant partner, I mean they've got LAM dysfunctions and all that stuff. That's the development platform of the present and future and I'm not hearing an intersection of that story with VMware's story yet. >> Actually before VMware's was server installation it was work station. >> Work station, that's right. >> And we were an investor of VMware and we thought that was cool. Anyway, so fast forward to 2013, we go private. 2014, Joe Tuchi and I restart the discussion that we'd had earlier back in 2009 about combining together. 2015 we announced it and we thought that if we could combine everything together, that customers would really like it. And thankfully, as we found that that's been true, it's been more true then we thought. And the innovation engines are cranking on high. 12.8 billion dollars in RND invested in the last three years. And you see here at VMworld and in Dell technologies world the strength of the road maps. And so every turn of the crank, we're just getting stronger and stronger. We never believed that everything was going to go one place or the other. It's actually great that the edge is booming. Now if you said, did you know that five or ten years ago? No, I didn't really know, but you can kind of see some things starting to happen. But look, distributed computing will be even more distributed in the future. >> For your commentary, people at the convention of wisdom on that deal was it was a one way trip to the Hotel Cloudifornia and it's become a boon for the data center. Why the misconceptions? Why are you confident that it continues to be a boon for both companies? >> Yeah, and hey we got to go prove it. At the end of the day we have to go prove it. So, but the analysts were sort of viewing hey, there's this big sucking sound in the public cloud where everything congregates. You know point one, and three years ago that was the prevailing wisdom. Right, so that was going to be the case. Now everybody, you know, and like I had the big CIO who basically said, hey I've got 200 apps. I tried to move them to the public cloud. I got two done. I can build new things there, but this moving was really hard until we had the VMC service. So this ability to move things to the cloud and from the cloud, I call the three laws. The laws of physics, the laws of economics and the laws of the land. The laws of physics, hey if need 500 millisecond round trip to the cloud and the robotic arm needs a decision in 200 milliseconds. You know physics, economics. I'm not going to send every surveillance picture of the cat to the cloud. Ban would still cost, right. And then laws of the land right, where people say, government issues, GDPR, other things. So because of that we see this hybrid world and particularly as edge and IOT becomes more prominent, we fully expect that there's going to be more of that not less and as I showed in my key note last year, this pendulum of centralization and decentralization has been swinging through the industry for 40 years and we don't see that stopping and Edge will be a force of more data and compute pushing to the edge and that's obviously part of our key note as well. >> Yeah John, you know, we sat here analyzing this VMware AWS relationship. Is this a one way move to the public cloud? Is Amazon just going to take those 500,000 VMware customers and get them all to migrate? Even in the start of Andy and Pat up on stage you know, Andy goes, the number on use case is migrating our applications to the public cloud and Pat's like, and the number two use case is you know, bursting and on demand and things like that. So it's an interesting dynamic between what we call, you know, you got the gorilla in the data center of VMware and you've got the 800 pound gorilla in the cloud. Fast as the cheetah as Dave Velante says in AWS. But RDS on premises, this is a big deal. I tell you, I'm surprised, most people here are surprised with the discussion. We were at some shows recently when they're spanning the snowball use case. Snowballs great, it's edge, it's helping to migrate things to the data center. This is an Amazon service running into VMware on premise. Didn't think that we would be seeing this from Amazon who's goal was, we thought to get 100 percent of things in the public lap. >> Decisions on cloud. Okay, Andy Jaci comes on stage. You're personally involved with Andy on the Amazon analysis which is, I think people don't know how big that's going to be. But VMware and Amazon are seriously deep in a partnership. This is a big deal. This feels like a little wind tail kind of easy synergies across the board. >> Well you know, in some ways we'll say number one in public coming together with number one in private. That's a big deal. And you know, yesterday's announcement of RDS on premise to me sort of finishes this strategic picture that we were trying to paint where it really is a hybrid world, where we're taking workloads and giving people the access to this phenomenal rapidly growing public cloud. But we're also demonstrating that we can seamlessly connect to the private cloud and now we're bringing services back from the public cloud onto the private and neuron data center. And that's so profound because now customers can say, oh, I like the RDS API. I like the RDS management model. I can put the data wherever I need it for my business purposes and that hybrid bi directional highway is something that we're uniquely building with Amazon and hey, obviously we're working with other cloud providers. But they're our preferred partner and we're pretty thrilled. >> How are customers going to deal with the multiple clouds? I mean is there an infra ability framework coming? Do you see a real disruptive technology enable that'll have that kind of impact that TCP spawn massive opportunity and wealth creation and start ups and functionality? Is there a moment coming? >> So, TCP of course was the proper layering of an interact between the physical layer, you know layer one, layer two and the routing or the internet layer was just layer three. And without that, you know, this is back to the old internal argument, we wouldn't have what we have today on the internet. That was the only rational way to build a architecture that would actually. And I'm not sure if people had a notion in 1979 when TCP was started, that it would become that big. They probably would of picked a bigger adverspace if they had known. But it was, not just a longevity but the impact it had was just phenomenal, right. Now and that applied in terms of connectivity and how many things shift to interact between point a to point b. The NSX level of network management is a little different because it's much higher level. It's really a management plan, back to the point I made earlier about management plans, that allows you to integrate a cloud on your premise with one of Amazon or IBM or the future Google and so on in a way that you can have full visibility and you see, you know exactly what's going on, all the security policies. But this has been a dream for people to deliver but it requires to actually have a reasonable amount of cold in each of these places, both on user. It's not just a protocol, it's an implementation of accountability right. And VMware is the best solution that's available and I can see for that use case which is going to be very important to a large number of enterprises, many of which will want to have a small connection between on premise and off premise and in the future, to Edge, Telcol, and other things that will run a VM environment today but that will allow them to be fully securely linked >> I think, so we are seeing lots of customer energy around what we're doing in storage. There's huge momentum behind product like Vsend and our customers are truly embracing ACI in very mainstream use cases and we've seen customer after customer have gone all in meaning they're taking ACI and made a determination to run that for all of their virtualized workload. It's a very exciting time. But what's more interesting is their expanded view on what ACI is about. You know, certainly, we started was virtualizing computer and storage together on servers. But we're seeing rapid expansion of that definition. You know, we've been believer that HCI is a software architecture. I think now there's more recognition that. And it's also going from just computer storage to the full stack of the entire software defined data center is expanding into the cloud as you see from VMCIWS. It's expanding to the edge, expanding from just traditional apps to cloud native apps. You know we've announced Beta 4, you know V send to become the storage platform for Cupernetis NEV sphere environment. So lots of exciting expansion around how customers want to see HCI and if you look at HCI, hybrid cloud, SDDC the boundary among these three is not very clear. I think they're all converging to work something that's very common. >> That's been proposed. Dell came out a while ago and sort of floated this idea of a reverse merger. Street puked all over it. And then all of a sudden they came up with this other idea of I called it the independence vig. Okay, VMware is having to pay a 11 billion dollar dividend. Nine billion of that is going to go to DVMT shareholders to clean that up. And you're going to get cash or prorata shares and the new Dell. Okay, so the question on the table is will that constrict VMware in anyway in terms of its ability to fund RND? My quick thoughts are short term no, long term, Dell has to walk a fine line between taking VMware cash, paying down it's debt and funding the future. Your thoughts. >> Yes, so here are my thoughts on this. So, I think that, first let's explain to the people what you just talked about, I'll translate. What you described is Michael Dell's going private, 60 billion dollars. That number was debt deal he did to buy Dell DMC so he has all this debt. Debt is like heroin, you get addicted to it, hard to get straight from that. So you gotta pay down the debt. He's been knockin' down the debt and big bag of money called Vmware's sitting there. As long as Vmware's thrown off cash flow that's going to be a key consideration. So, the independent vig as long as this cash flow's coming in, I think is fine. It's not going to really hurt it. But I think Dell's been brilliant in this because he's been essentially land grabbing the computer industry on the infrastructure side and he's going to make more money than ever before. He's going to pull it off and the only thing that could hurt him is either some side of force major or downturn or revenue not coming in from the sources whether either it's a public offering, acquisitions he's trying to sell off, and or VMware sputters which I don't think it will. Now with VM is on, even if they just go all in on Amazon and pull off all the other clouds, they'll still make a boat load of cash. >> I think it goes down in history as one of the greatest trades ever. I mean it's just phenomenal. >> Look, I mean Dave, we talked about when EMC bought VMware it was one of the greatest acquisitions of all time. >> 635 million. >> Right but. >> Now it's 60 billion value evaluation. >> Dell buying EMC, most people were like, I'm not sure what's going to happen but Michael will make a lot of money. VMware is doing so well that they can now fund Dell going public again based on this deal. So it's been one of those fascinating financial orchestration pieces to be out there. >> You ever feel constrained writing an 11 billion dollar dividend? Do you ever feel constrained in terms of your ability to fund the RND necessary to do some of those things? >> No. >> Rio said the same thing off camera but I ask you on camera. >> Yeah, generally I mean, am I constrained at how much RND I can do? Well hey, I've got a budget, we build a PNL, we communicate it to the street and everyday possible I'm pushing the growth of business faster so I can shove more dollars into one of two places. More dollars into RND or more dollars into sales and customer facing. Right and if Robin Matlock is here, I keep giving her the table scraps at the end of those things. But build products that are innovated, radical and break through. Sell products and support our customers using them. That's the two thing... >> And I think it's a really interesting point that after a lot of conversations with a lot of folks saying AWS is all going to go up to the cloud and wondering whether that also is a one way street for VMware customers. But now we're seeing it's much more of a bilateral relationship. >> It's moving it to the right place. And that's the second thing. The embracing of multi cloud by everybody. One cloud is not going to do everything. There's going to be fast clouds, there's going to be multiple places where people are going to put certain workloads because that's the best strategic fit for it. And the acceptance in the market place that that is where it's going to go. I think that gain is a major change. The hybrid cloud and multi cloud environments. And then the third thing is I think the richness of the eco system is amazing. The going on the floor and the number of people that have come to talk to us with new ideas really fascinating ideas is something I haven't seen at all for the last three, four years. >> Alright, we've heard from some of our guests on theCUBE and you've heard our teams initial analysis of the news from VMworld. Now we want to hear from you. Please hop into the crowd chat below, give us your feedback, want a community discussion and let's hear about what everybody thinks about VMware and VMworld 2018. Once again, thanks so much for joining us and look forward to the conversation.

so it is you know this the seminal moment where the industry is seeing the value of the multi cloud error right and abrade and now we're giving them the tools through a break system open you see here on the show floor the whole industry well represented and participating and engaged and that's been an important part of VMware's success from the beginning and will be I would actually say it's the new applications that may start in a cloud that you know have been rolled out it in volume like AI that will maybe the biggest change that people didn't expect I hope is known by our customers as having these two engines engine of innovation innovating product and a variety of other things and focused on customer obsession we do those the plane will go a long way yet for me a couple of the highlights is how now the industry is starting to talk about tech as a force for good so now we're starting to move out of the conversation of just the technologies and the products and the impact but what are we collectively doing to make this world a better place that's a new dial [Music]

>> LIVE from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE! Covering VMworld 2018. Brought to you by VMware and it's Ecosystem Partners. >> Welcome back to theCUBE's continuing coverage of VMworld 2018! I'm Lisa Martin, finally paired up with Stu Miniman. Hey, Stu! >> Lisa, three days, wall-to-wall coverage and how have you and I not been paired together yet? >> Did you do the scheduling, Stu? >> Um. >> That's okay. I'm glad to be paired up with you. The last interview, saving the best for last. Speaking of the last, we've got two guests, welcoming back some alumni to theCUBE, who also seem to be so busy at VMworld that you come to us as our last guests. I like this tradition. >> You had be the bookend, you know? Got to be the bookend. >> Best for last. >> Exactly. We've got Ajay Patel, SVP of VMware, and Russ Reeder, CEO of OVH US. Welcome, guys! >> Thank you, great to be here. - Thank you. >> Saving the best for last. >> Best for last, you bet. >> So, last year just, yeah, VMworld last year, vCloud Air acquisition by OVH had just happened. Give us an update on what's gone on in the last year and the momentum that that is giving the OVH business in the U.S. >> So, we're super excited to be here on second year as a Diamond Sponsor. We, as OVH Cloud, coming to the U.S. is a great opportunity. OVH is the largest hosting company in Europe. Everyone knows who we are in Europe, we come to the U.S. a year and a half ago, every one's like, who's OVH? We acquire vCloud Air, partnered with VMware, which is old news in Europe. For the past nine years, we've been virtualizing vSphere, seven of those nine we've been the award winning partner in Europe. So coming to America, the best way to really launch with the VMware partnership is to acquire vCloud Air. All of those customers, and brought over those employees, and the best news is that we just launched two months ago, starting to migrate those customers over to OVH Cloud. >> Fantastic. >> It's very exciting. >> Yes. >> Ajay, so, Multi-Cloud being the story of the show, we've seen really the maturation after, you know, we've been tracking this for a lot of years. It was like, okay, do we have the VMware Cloud story? Are we happy with it? Things like that. So first of all, congrats to you and your team. >> Thank you. >> We've had some good proof points, a lot of partners I hear. >> Absolutely. >> I'm joking to you, it's like, yeah, OVH- >> OVH clearly one of the important ones. (laughs loudly) >> So, you know, put this in perspective for us as to, from the vCloud Air world to, you know, we're talking AWS, IBM, OVH and many others. >> Stu, you and I talked about it a couple of times now, this is year number four, so thank you for inviting me, first of all. Our strategy's been consistent. How do we get VMware running on as many destinations as possible? And Hybrid, for us, has been a strategy that's been consistent. Glad the market caught up, even having Andy Jassy talk about moving RDS and making it available to vSphere on-prem is really a sign of maturity that the world is going to be hybrid for a long time. So from a strengths perspective, Hybrid is here to stay and we're really focused on what we've been calling this Cloud Verified Partner. So, OVH is a handful of partners that have reached that highest level achievement of delivering a full-stack VMware CDC and it can have a consistent infrastructure experience that cost customers 10 dollars. So we're at a point where the strategy's being realized. Strategic partners like OVH are delivering a full-stack VMware and customers are seeing the value of delivering Cloud, whether public Cloud or on-prem on vSphere. >> Russ, as I said, multi-cloud, it's matured a bit. You know, one of the big questions we had coming into was that AWS partnership, how much of it is a one-way? Well, things like RDS, really interesting. I've spent a bunch of time digging into it and understanding it. The other thing is, it's as Ajay said, the strategy was VMware everywhere. And partners like yourself, okay, where do we play? You know, public cloud's not the enemy, it's what do we do, what do we partner with? How they're help fitting the landscape as to, you know, how OVH and, you know, how do you play in that larger ecosystem and differentiate and, you know? >> Yeah, I think the third generation of the cloud here coming to multi-cloud is kind of going the first generation of hey, someone needs to do it for me. AWS, I'm going to do it myself. Now, hey, I want to do it myself, but I need multi-cloud. I'm not going to put all my eggs in one basket, I need a true infrastructure partner where I have predictability on billing. I don't have ingress or egress charges. I have a true infrastructure partner with the automation that can scale globally. And so, 20 years ago when we started OVH in Europe, the opportunity there was wide open. Coming here to the U.S. now it's a perfect opportunity in multi-cloud where all customers are saying I need to get out of my closet. I have seven-year-old machines in my Colo facility. I'm all-in-one whether it's AWS, or IBM, or another partner out there, they need to put different workloads where they would work best or DR. So coming in as a true infrastructure player with all of our automation, it's actually perfect timing for OVH to come to the U.S. and laugh OVH Cloud. >> So I'm curious, obviously with the European you have their legacy as we've transitioned and it's a spectrum but from kind of the traditional hosted environment to you're almost fully satisfied when you go this. >> Sure. >> The US, do you still have the spectrum or are you more built the modern with the vCloud Air being the foundation? You know, what spectrum of services are you offering customers? >> We offer the full spectrum. We had the opportunity to take OVH, all of our experience and systems, take the next generation of OVH in Europe, launch it in the U.S. and then bringing that back to Europe. So what we're launching in the U.S. is a full spectrum. The initial launch with VMware, fully hosted suite of the VMware products. So we have the VMware, the vSphere, vSAN, NSX offering that we've just announced. And having nine years of experience with vSphere as a service is a great opportunity to launch that. We also have a public cloud and that's the open source OpenStack public cloud, which is a different unique opportunity for a lot of companies that don't want to go the traditional public cloud. We also, being one of the largest dedicated server providers. It's all built on dedicated server, even server-less compute. And so you have to find a infrastructure partner that doesn't want to provide solutions first, and how do we rack and stack second. We understand the infrastructure and the network globally to help our partner's succeed. >> Ajay, I wonder if you could speak a little bit to the portfolio that your partners get to get access to from VMware. I was just interviewing Milin Desai, who you know oh so well. And the SAS piece is so, you know, it gets lost. You know, infrastructure as a service is one piece, but, you know, it's applications and services and, you know, yeah. >> Yeah, so far our cloud provider partners, what we've done is we introduced something we call Cloud Provider Platform. It gives them all the tools they need to sign up for Cloud, as Russ talked about, in a dedicated cloud. We give you a multi-tenant cloud. We're also, now with our cloud hub announcement, taking the VMware IP Cloud Services and making them available to our partners. And when you think about a partner on MSP, he's no longer just the asset heavy like OVH, but he's also the asset like a DXE. So we're now opening up the aperture for anyone who wants to either build clouds, or use clouds to offer managed services on top. I love the fact that OVH has economics, efficiency, and the customer support with the full VMware value proposition. They've always been the leader in kind of vSphere hosting, now they're offering a full private cloud built on VMware and the managed services go with it. So it's really about that choice, which really uniquely makes a provider program so compelling to our end customers. >> We've heard choice a lot. We hear it, Stu, at every show. Customers need choice, companies like VMware, OVH needs to build for what the customers want, not what you guys all think is great. Another thing that we've heard a lot at this show is that the seamlessness of the message, starting with Pat Gelsinger's keynote on Monday morning with people saying, you know, the structure is in place. I also thought it was one that was very cohesive in terms of the messaging and how the technologies are working together. I'm curious to get your feedback on what are some of the things that you've heard around this show from your customers who need a choice or in multi-cloud environments for many reasons, right? Applications that kind of dictate which direction that needs to go in, or through acquisition and, you know, have multiple cloud solutions. How are they taking this message? Especially with what you're doing with OVH in the U.S. And be able to digest this so they can really figure out, alright, here's what I can do with my infrastructure so that my business succeeds, whether I'm a bank or I'm a hospital. Tell us about that. >> I can go first and then Russ can add. So I think one of the things we've done a really good job this time is clarifying the message. I'm hoping, to the market, we're now becoming a very relevant and strategic platform that spans beyond the traditional VMware data center and hybrid cloud. So the first message is, you know, VMware is providing you the solutions while you're building on VMware or you're building on native clouds. And that CloudHealth acquisition is a good indication of VMware's commitment to kind of pure native public cloud. The second I would say is hybrid and this kind of consistent environment for runtime, if you will, and this hybrid control plane that give people a sense that I will lift and shift my workload first to an OVH and then transform leveraging the power of the public cloud. So it's become very pleasing to say, look, I don't need to change for changes sake, I can move and get economics off a public cloud, a dedicator, or even a pure multi-tenant. But then I can now refactor using public cloud services. So the power of VMware is giving them the flexibility to start a leverage cloud without having to make an upfront investment just for change sake, but more for the business transformation they're trying to drive, right? >> Yeah and so, what we've seen from the OVH side is really coming here and looking at all the partners. So we have Veam for backup, we can no offer Zerto for disaster recovery. Obviously, the VMware partnership we just launched earlier in the week which David Wigglesworth, our chief revenues officer was on talking about our partnership strategy and we have an amazing opportunity to bring partners in. FusionStorm is one of those partners, IT services. So OVH Cloud, we don't compete with our partners, true infrastructure partner with they can leverage our 28 data centers and our 15 terabytes of network and no charges for ingress. So what we're seeing here, our customers are coming and saying, hey, I just used you for DR but I'd like to actually take my on-prem full production system and bring it to the cloud now. So the customer's were migrating. There's more comfort going to the cloud, there's more understanding of the partnership ecosystem, and now instead of just saying, oh, we're going to just put DR or backup, we're going to come and we're going to migrate our entire production system because we've tried it out, our foot's been in the water, and now we're going all-in. So that's exciting and talking to all the customers this week, I love it. It's so exciting to talk to our customers that have migrated to OVH Cloud in the U.S. and now they want to bring over those production workloads. That's where it's really kind of that multi-cloud and I think VMware's been a huge asset to the cloud market in their strategy and a great partner. >> Getting that validation from your customers, the momentum that OVH is carrying is working. You've done a lot of education, especially in the last year. They're getting it and you're seeing your technologies and your partnership validating what it is that they're business needs. >> It's disheartening almost that the technology is in place now. We had to migrate from the vCloud Air into the OVH data center. Those tools, those best practices, those skills now are available to the end customer. So the compelling value here is, you want to take the entire data center and move it to OVH, we know how to do it. We have the tools, the people, the skills. And so just that kind of reference, the ability to say I'm not the first one to do it. It's been done before. That confidence is building in their business now. >> We had the opportunity, I mean, I don't want to say that there was a bleeding edge, but we were on a bleeding edge of HCX and it's working seamlessly now. >> Hybrid Cloud Exchange. >> The extension to bring, without any downtime, from on-prem to over to the cloud with OVH Cloud, or from the vCloud Air cloud over to ours. So it's working and the customer's are super excited, they get that trust. They go back to their management team and say, hey, now it's time to go more. I can go to the cloud and the cost efficiency, the savings, the redundancy of the network and the power, and not all this capex. That's why they're all moving to the cloud now. >> Final thing, you've talked about some good high level things. Any specific customer examples? I know you might not be able to mention names, but, you know, Vertical, or things like that as to how businesses are helping to transform themselves after they've done these sort of solutions. >> Yeah, sure, I mean first of all, it's all about the customer. So we, I can't mention any specific names, we will have some, we filmed some customer testimonials in the booth that we'll be announcing and maybe the next time we can bring customers up here to talk about it. Whether it's really education or high-tech, especially on a high-tech, the tech guys love OVH, right? They really love it. But from an infrastructure provider, people that are looking to lift and shift their existing applications without having to rewrite their applications for a public cloud, that's where OVH really comes into play. I've got all of these systems. I've got VMware on-prem, I need to move it but I don't want to rebuild it. So that's where we see the excitement of, of course I'm going to build some new stuff in the cloud, but how do I take all of my thousands of applications that we have, that we're never going to refactor and just move it over to the cloud to have that security. That's where I think customers are saying, wow, I can't actually do more in the cloud than I thought I could. >> For me, I think, I just walked out of a customer meeting, so I won't name them but just kind of give you a sense of what they're doing. They have four clouds, they believe they have monolithic applications, they don't want to be locked in to a particular cloud, so you're hearing the consistent view is, we're trying to figure out how do we change our development practices. You know, how do we leverage container, whether it's PKS, whether it's payloads. What's my development methodology? How do I make sure that deployment gives me a choice of running across clouds? How should I setup my IT operations to operate in the cloud? So consistency, portability, how do I manage the complexity of running on multiple clouds? What's my cost profile and how do I do it effective? So those are the kinds of questions we're getting. They're starting to look to VMware as a trusted advisor, that safe choice, as we talked about, to say, you know, one thing I can bet on is if I bet on VMware technology, it runs on more clouds than I can, you know, when I need them. It is portable, I can take a workload that traditionally I'd run on different hardware, now we run it on different clouds. So we're seeing a tremendous momentum around this notion of VMware's kind of the pathway or the hybrid control plane that we can bet on. And then partners like OVH, etc. But I have this destination that's safe, that's secure, that's consistent with what they're running today. So pretty exciting in terms of how customers kind of take in the message and start to put it into their strategy as they go forward. >> One more thing I'd like to understand, you talked about the tremendous capabilities that OVH and VMware have together with vCloud Air. You can enable customers to do a lot. To transform IT, to facilitate digital transformation. They're comfortable with this. But one of the things that that absolutely requires is cultural transformation. I'd love to get your final thoughts on how is OVH and VMware together helping your customers to understand and really impact the cultural changes that are need to take advantage, full advantage of the technology? >> That's a great question. Go ahead. >> On our side, what we try to do is, we as a company are going through the same transformation. We're a perpetual company becoming a services company. So the lessons learned, I spent some time where I-CIO actually talks about how we're operating our internal cloud. We're talking about the best practices of how we're moving to a service first mentality. How we're creating a CICD development mentality and practices. How are we leveraging public clouds and how are we managing cost? So those internal lessons learned, we're starting to make available to our customers and our partners. We're also packaging some of the products that we make available to VCP, our provider program. So the products that we're building up much more suited to run a services organization, which when we started five years ago at vCloud Air, we took enterprise products and tried to force fit them, now we're much more delivering our own service, eating our own dog food, if you will, have to incorporate that capability into our platform. So it's a combination of product improvement, best practices and lessons learned that we're making available to the market. >> I can talk from specific example. Acquiring vCloud Air, a great customer base, and all of the personnel from VMware in vCloud Air to come over. So not only was it cultural from a customers perspective, but also from an employee perspective. You build culture on trust. So what's interesting is that our employees and our customers that were over in Europe, in our U.K data centers and our German data centers, they're growing much quicker than the ones over in the U.S. The U.S. after a year of working with us and seeing that, hey, we say we're going to do this and now we're actually doing it, and I've migrated and that was really easy, and I can point and click and actually expand my compute and my storage and add more hosts in a matter of minutes. That builds trust, that has a great culture, and that spreads. So, from an education perspective, we have a lot of higher education customers, and now they're like, I'm going to go talk to this school and this school, and that word of mouth is golden. >> That validation of, we've been in your shoes, VMware has been in our shoes, they've done it successfully. Guys, I wish we had more time, but thanks so much for helping Stu and I wrap up the day on this set. It's great to talk to you both. I think it might be fair to say that we'll probably see you at the next VMworld on day three around the same time. >> Yeah, perfect! - Hopefully earlier. >> Maybe. Ajay, Russ, thank you so much for your time. >> Thank you. - Thank you so much, Lisa. >> For my co-host, Stu Miniman, I'm Lisa Martin. You're watching theCUBE's continuing coverage of VMworld 2018. Stick around, we'll be back to wrap up the show. (electronic music)

(upbeat techno music) >> Live, from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE covering VMworld 2018, brought to you by VMware and it's ecosystem partners. >> Okay, welcome back everyone, we're here live in Las Vegas for VMworld 2018 coverage. It's the final analysis, the final interview of three days, 94 interviews, two CUBE sets, amazing production, our ninth year covering VMworld. We've seen the evolution, we've seen the trials and tribulations of VMware and it's ecosystem and as it moves into the modern era, the dynamics are changing. We heard quotes like, "From playing tennis "to playing soccer," it's a lot of complicated things, the cloud certainly a big part of it. I'm John Furrier your host, Stu Miniman couldn't be here for the wrap, he had an appointment. I'm here with Dave Vallente and Jim Kobielus who's with Wikibon and SiliconANGLE and theCUBE team. >> Guys, great job, I want to say thanks to you guys and thanks to the crew on both sets. Amazing production, we're just going to have some fun here. We've analyzed this event, ten different ways from Sunday. >> So many people working so hard for such a steady clip as we have here the last three days, amazing. >> Just to give some perspective, I want to get, just lay out kind of what's going on with theCUBE. I've get a lot of people come up and ask me hey what's going on, you guys are amazing. It's gotten so much bigger, there's two sets. But every year, Dave, we always try to at VMworld, make VMworld our show to up our value. We always love to innovate, but we got a business to run. We have no outside finance, we have a great set of partners. I'm proud of the team, what Jeff Frick did and the team has done amazing work. Sonia's here's, the whole analyst team's here, our whole team's here. But we have an orchestrated system now, we have the blogging at SilconANGLE.com and Rob Hof leading the editorial. Working on a content immersion program. Jim you were involved in with Rob and Peter in the team, bringing content on the written word side, as fast as possible, the best quality, fast as possible, the analysts getting the pre-briefing and the NDAs, theCUBE team setting it up. Pretty unique formula at full stride right now, only going to get better. New photography, better pictures, better video, better guests, more content. Now with the video clipper tool and our video cloud service and we did a tech preview of our block chain, token economics, a lot of the insiders of VMworld, the senior executives and the community, all with great results, they all loved it, they want to do more. Opening up our platform, opening up the content's been a big success, I want to thank you guys for that. >> And I agree, I should point out that one of the things we have that say an agency doesn't offer, I used to be with a large multi national solutions provider doing kind of similar work but in a thought leadership market kind of, let me just state something here, what we've got is unique because we have analysts, market researchers, who know this stuff at the core of our business model, including, especially the content immersion program. Peter Boroughs did a bit, I did a fair amount on this one. You need subject matter experts to curate and really define the themes that the entire editorial team, and I'm including theCUBE people on the editorial team, are basically, so we're all aligned around we know what the industry is all about, the context, the vendor, and somebody's just curating making sure that the subject matter is on target was what the community wants to see. >> So I got to day, first of all, VMware set us up with two stages here, two sets, amazing. They've been unbelievable partners. They really put their money with their mouth is. They allow us to bring in the ecosystem, do our own thing, so that's phenomenal and our goal is to give back to the community. We had two sets, 94 guests this week, 70 interview segments, hundreds and hundreds of assets coming out, all free. >> It was amazing. >> SiliconANGLE.com, Wikibon.com, theCUBE.net, all free content was really incredible. >> It's good free content. >> It's great free content. >> We dropped a true private cloud report with market shares, that's all open and free. Floyer did a piece on VMware's hybrid cloud strategy, near to momentum, ice bergs ahead. Jim Kobelius, first of all, every day here you laid out here's what happened today with your analysis plus you had previews plus you have a trip report coming. >> Plus I had a Wikibon research note that had been in the pipeline for about a month and I held off on publishing until Monday at the show, the AI ready IT infrastructure because it's so aligned with what's going on. >> And then Paul Gillan and Rob Hof did a series in their team on the future of the data center. Paul Gillan, the walls are tumbling down, I mean that thing got amazing play, check that out. It's just a lot of detail in there. >> And more importantly, that's our content. We're linking, we're open, we're linking to other people's content, from Tech Field Day what Foskett's doing to vBrownBag to linking to stories, sharing, quoting other analysts, Patrick Moorehead for more insights. Anyone who has content that we can get it in fast, in real time, out to the marketplace, is our mission and we love doing it so I think the formula of open is working. >> Yeah Charles King, this morning I saw Charles, I thanked him for, he had great quotes. >> Yeah, great guy. >> He's like, "I love with Paul Gillan calls me." John, talk about the tech preview because the tech preview was an open community project that's all about bringing the community together, helping them and helping get content out into the marketplace. >> Well our goal for this event was to use the VMworld to preview some of our innovations and you're going to start to hear more from the siliconANGLE media, CUBE and siliconANGLE team around concepts like the CUBE cloud. We have technology we're going to start to surface and bring out to the marketplace and we want to make it free and open and allow people to use and share in what we do and make theCUBE a community brand and a community concept and continue this mission and treat theCUBE like an upstream project. Let's all co-create together because the downstream benefits in communities are significantly better when there's co-creation and self governance. Highest quality content, from highly reputable people, whether it's news, analysis, opinion, commentary, pontification, we love it all, let the content stand on it's own and let's the benefits come down so if you're a sponsor, if you're a thought leader, you're a news maker, you're an analyst, we love to do that and we love talking with the executives so that's great. The tech preview is about showcasing how we want to create a new network. As communities are growing and changing, VMware's community is robust, Dave, it's it's own subnet, but as the world grows in those multiple clouds, Azure has a community, Google has a community, and people have been trained to sit in these silos, okay? >> Mm-hmm. >> We go to so many events and we engage with so many communities, we want to connect them all through the CUBE coin concept of block chain where if someone's in a community, they can download the wallet and join theCUBE network. Today there's no mechanism to join theCUBE network. You can go to theCUBE.net and subscribe, you can go to YouTube and subscribe, you can get e-mail marketing but that's not acceptable to us we want a subscribe button that's going to add value to people who contribute value, they can capture it. That was the tech preview, it's a block chain based community. We're calling it the Open Community Project. >> Wow. >> Open Community Project is the first upstream content software model that's free to use, where if the community uses it, they can capture value that they create. It's a new concept and it's radical and revolutionary. >> In some ways were analogous to what VMware has evolved into where they bridge clouds and they say that, "We bridge clouds." We bridge communities all around thought leadership and to provide a forum for conversations that bridge the various siloed communities. >> Well Jim you and I talked about this, we've seen the movie and media. In the old school media days and search engine marketing and e-mail marketing and starting a blog, which we were part of, the blogging was the first generation of sharing economy where you linked to other bloggers and shared your traffic, because you were working together against the mainstream media. >> It's my major keyboard, by the way, I love blogs. >> And if you were funded you had to build an audience. Audience development, audience development. Not anymore, the audience is already there. They are now in networks so the new ethos, like blogging, is joining networks and not making it an ownership, lock in walled garden. So the new ethos is not link sharing, community sharing, co-creation and merging networks. This is something that we're seeing across all event communities and content is the nutrients and the glue for those communities. >> You got multi cloud, you got multi content networks. Making it together, it's exciting. I mean there were some people that I saw this week, I mean Alan Cohen as a guest host, amazingly articulate, super smart guy, plugged in to Silicon Valley. Christophe Bertrand, analyst at ESG, a great analysis today on theCUBE, bringing those guys, nominate them into the community for the Open Community Project. >> You know what I like, Dave, was also Jeff Frick, Sonia and Gabe were all at the front there, greeting the guests. We had great speakers, it all worked. The stages worked but it's for the community, by the community, this is the model, right? This is what we want to do and it was a lot of fun, I had a lot of great interviews from Andy Bechtolsheim, Michael Dell, Pat Gellsinger to practitioners and to the vendors and suppliers all co-creating here in real time, it was really a lot of fun. >> Oh yes, amen. >> Well Dave, thanks for everything. Thanks for the crew, great job everybody. >> Awesome. >> Jim, well done. >> Thanks to Stu Miniman, Peter Burris and all the guests, Justin Warren, John Troyer, guest host Alan Cohen, great community participation. This is theCUBE signing off from Las Vegas, this is VMworld 2018 final analysis, thanks for watching. (upbeat techno music)

from Las Vegas it's the queue covering VMworld 2018 brought to you by VMware and its ecosystem partners and we're back here at the Mandalay Bay in somewhat beautiful Las Vegas where we're doing third day of VMworld on the cube and on Peterborough and I'm joined by my two lead analysts here at Ricky bond with me Jim Camilo's who's looking at a lot of the software stuff David floor who's helping to drive a lot of our hardware's research guys you've spent an enormous amount of time talking to an enormous number of customers a lot of partners and we all participated in the Analyst Day on Monday let me give you my first impressions and I want to ask you guys some questions here you thought so I have it this is you know my third I guess VMworld in or in a row and and my impression is that this has been the most coherent of the VM worlds I've seen you can tell when a company's going through a transition because they're reaching to try to bring a story together and that sets the tone but this one hot calendar did a phenomenal job of setting up the story it makes sense it's coherent possibly because it aligns so well with what we think is going to happen in the industry so I want to ask you guys based on three days of one around and talking to customers David foyer what's been the high point what have you found is the most interesting thing well I think the most interesting thing is the excitement that there is over VMware if you if you contrast that with a two three years ago the degree of commitment of customers to viennois the degree of integration they're wanting to make the degree rate of change and ideas that have come out of VMware it's like two different companies totally different companies some of the highlights for me were the RDS the bringing from AWS to on site as well as on the AWS cloud RDS capabilities I think that's a very very interesting thing that's the relational database is services the Maria DB and all the other services that's a very exciting thing to me and a hint to me that AWS is going to have to get serious about well Moore's gone out I think it's a really interesting point that after a lot of conversations with a lot of folks saying all AWS it's all going to go up to the cloud and wondering whether that also is a one-way street for VMware Casta Moore's right but now we're seeing it's much more of a bilateral relationship it's a moving it to the right place and that's the second thing the embracing of multi-cloud by everybody one cloud is not going to do everything they're going to be SAS clouds they're going to be multiple places where people are gonna put certain workloads because that's the best strategic fit for it and the acceptance in the marketplace that that is where it's going to go I think that again is a major change so hybrid cloud and multi cloud environments and then the third thing is I think the richness of the ecosystem is amazing the the going on the floor and the number of people that have come to talk to us with new ideas really fascinating ideas is something I haven't seen at all for the last last three four years and so I'm gonna come back to you on that but it goes back to the first point that you make that yeah there is a palpable excitement here about VMware that two-three years ago the conversation was how much longer is the franchise gonna be around Jim but now it's clear yeah it's gonna be around Jim how about you yeah actually I'm like you guys I'm a newbie to VM world this is my very first remember I'm a big data analyst I'm a data science an AI guy but obviously I've been aware of VMware and I've had many contacts with them over the years my take away my prime and I like Pat Gail singers I agree with you Peter they're really coherent take and I like that phrase even though it sounds clucking impact kind of apologize they are the dial tone to the multi-cloud if the surgery really gives you a strong sense or who else can you character is in this whole market space cloud computing has essentially a multi cloud provider who provide the unifying virtualization glue to help their custom to help customers who are investing in an AWS and maybe in a bit of you know you're adopting Google and Microsoft Azure and so forth providing a virtualization layer that's the above server virtualization network virtualization VDI all the way to the edge nobody can put it all is putting it all together and quite the way that VMware is one of the my chief takeaways is similar to David's which is that in terms of the notion of a hybrid cloud VMware with its whole what's it's doing with RDS but also projects like this project dimension which is in project in progress taking essentially the entire VMware virtualization stack and putting it onto an appliance for deployment on the edges and then for them to manage it VMware of this their plans as an end-to-end managed edge cloud service and so forth Wow the blurring of public and private cloud I don't even think the term hybrid cloud applies it's just a blurry the common cloud yeah it's moving to the workload the clouds moving to the data which is exactly what we say they are halfway there in terms of that vision halfway in a sense that RDS has been announced the you know on the VMware and this project dimension they're well along with that if there was a briefings for the analyst space I'm really impressed for how they're architecting this I think they've got a shot to really dominate well I'll tell you so I would agree with you just to maybe provide a slightly different version of one of the things you said I definitely agree I think what's VMware hopes to do and I think they're not alone is to have AWS look like an appliance to their console to have as you look like an appliance of their Khan so through free em where you can get access to whatever services you need including your VMware machines your VMs inside those clouds but that increasingly their their goal is to be that control point that management point for all of these different resources that are building and it is very compelling I think that there's one area that I still think we need more from as analysts and we always got to look through no and what's yeah what was more required and I hear what you say about project dimension but I think that the edge story still requires a fair amount of work oh yeah it's a project in place but that's going to be an increasingly important locus of how architectures get laid out how people think about applications in the future how design happens how methodologies for building software work David what do you think what when you look out what what is what what is more is needed for you so really I think there are two things that give me a small concern the the edge that's a long term view so they got time to get that right but the edge view is very much an IT view top-down and they are looking to put in place everything that they think the OT people should fit in with I think that is personally not going to be a winning strategy you you have to take it from the bottom up the world is going to go towards devices very rich devices and sensors lots of software right on that device the inference work on those devices and the job of IT will be to integrate those devices it won't be those devices taking on the standards of IT it'll be IT that has to shape itself to look after all those devices there so that's a that's the main viewpoint I think that needs adjustment and it will come I'm sure over time but as you said there's a lot of computer science it's going to be an enormous amount of new partnerships are gonna be fabricate exactly to make this happen Jim what do you think yeah I agree terms of partnerships one big gap from both VMware and Dell technologies partnerships and romance and technology proposes AI now they have a project VMware call from another project called project Magna which is really AI ops in fact I published a wiki about reports this week on AI ops AI to drive IT Service Management and to and they're doing some stuff they're working on that project it's just you know the beginning stages I think what's going to happen is that vmware dell technologies they're gonna have to make strategic acquisitions of AI solution providers to build up that capability because that's going to be fundamental to their ability to manage this complex multi called fabric from end to end continuously they need that competency internally that can't be simply a partner providing that that's got to be their core competencies so you know I'm gonna push it I'll give you the contrarian point of view okay we actually had Khamsin VMware we've had a lot of conversations about this does that is that a reflection of David's point about top-down buying things and pushing it down as opposed to other conversations we've had about how the edge is going to evolve where a lot of OT guys are going to combine with business expertise and technology expertise to create specialized solutions and is and then VMware is gonna have to reach out to them and make VMware relevant to them do you think it's going to be VMware buying a bunch of stuff or an a-grade no solution or is it going to be the solutions coming from elsewhere and VM at VMware I just becoming more relevant to them now you can still be buying a bunch of stuff to get that horizontal in place but which way you think it's going to go I think it's gonna be the top-down they're gonna buy stuff because if I talk to the channel one of the channel people this morning about well you know but they've got an IOT connected bundle and so forth they announced this show you know I think they agree with me that the core AI technology needs to be built into the fundamentals like the IOT stack bundle that they then provide to the channel partners for with you know with channel specific content that they can then tweak and customize to their specific needs but you know the core requirements for a I are horizontal you know it's the ability to run neural networks to do predictive analysis anomaly detection and so forth this is all cross-cutting across all domains it has to be in the core application stack they can't be simply something they source for particular channel opportunities it has to be leveraged across you know the same core tensorflow models for anomaly detection for manufacturing for logistics for you know customer relationship management whatever it's or are you saying essentially that then VMware becomes that horizontal play even though even if the solution providers are increasingly close to the actual action where the edges III I'm gonna disagree we can gently on that but we'd still be friends [Music] no it's you know I'm I'm an OT guy of hearth I suppose and I think that that is going to be a stronger force in terms of VMware but there will be some places where you it will be top-down but other places that where it's going to be need needed to adjust but I think there's one other there very interesting area I'd like to bring up in terms of of this question of acquisition what what we heard about beforehand was excellent results and VMware has been adding a you know a billion dollars a year in terms of free cash there and they have thirteen billion in short term cash there and the the refinancing from Dell is gonna take eleven of that thirteen and put it towards the towards the the company now you can work towards deltek yes well just Dell Dell as a hold and and silver later towards those partners I I personally believe that there is such a lot of opportunity that's going to be out there if you take NSX for example it has the potential to do things in new areas they're gonna need to provide solutions in those new areas and aggressively go after those new areas and that's going to mean big investments and many other areas where I think they are going to need acquisitions to strengthen the whole story they have the whole multi-cloud story about this real-time operating system in a sexy has a network routing virtualization backplane I mean it needs to go real-time so sensitive guaranteed ladies if they need that big investments guarantee yeah they need to go there yeah so what we're agreeing on that and I get concerned that it's not going to be given the right resources you know to be able to actually go after the opportunities that they have genuinely created it's gonna mean from you see how that plays out so I think all drugs in the future I think saying though is that there is going to be a solution a set of solution players that VMware is going to have to make significant moves to make them relevant and then the question is where it's the values story what's the value proposition it's probably gonna be like all partnerships yeah some are gonna claim that they are doing it also some are gonna DM where it's gonna claim that they do more of it but at the end of the day VMware has to make themself relevant to the edge however that happens I want to pick up on NSX because I'm a pretty big believer that NSX may be the very special crown jewel and a lot of the stuff this notion of hybrid cloud whatever we call it let's just call it extended cloud let me talk of a better word like it is predicated on the idea that I also have a network that can naturally and easily not just bridge but truly multi network interoperate internet work with a lot of different cloud sources but also all different cloud locations and there's not a lot of technologies out there that are great candidates to do that and it's and I look at NSX and I'm wondering is that gonna be kind of a I want to take the metaphor too far but is that gonna be kind of a new tcp/ip for the cloud in the sense that you're still gonna run over tcp/ip and you're still gonna run over the Internet but now we're gonna get greater visibility into jobs into workloads into management infrastructures into data locations and data placement predictive movement and NSX is going to be the at the vanguard of showing how that's gonna work and the security side of that especially to be able to know what is connected to what and what shouldn't be connected to what and to be able to have that yeah they need stateful structured streaming others Kafka flink whatever they need that to be baked into the whole nsx virtualization layer that much more programmable and that provides that much better a target for applications all right last question then we got a wrap guys David as you walk out the door get in the plane what are you taking away what's your last impression my last impression is one of genuine excitement wanting to work wanting to follow up with so many of the smaller organizations the partners that have been here and who are genuinely providing in this ecosystem a very rich tapestry of of capability that's great Jim my takeaway is I want to see their roadmap for kubernetes and serverless there wasn't a hole last year they made an announcement of a serverless project I forgot what the code name is didn't hear a whole lot about it this year but they're going up the app stack they got a coop you know distribution you know they're if they need a developer story I mean developers are building functional apps and so forth you know you can and they're also containerized they need they need a developer story and they need a server list story and they need to you need to bring us up to speed on where they're going in that regard because AWS their predominant partner I mean they got lambda functions and all that stuff you know that's that's the development platform of the present and future and I'm not hearing an intersection of that story with VMware's a story yeah my last thing that I'll say is that I think that for the next five years VMware is gonna be one of the companies that shapes the future of the cloud and I don't think we would have said that a couple of names no they wouldn't I agree with you so you said yes all right so this has been the wiki bond research leadership team talking about what we've heard at VMware this year VMworld this year a lot of great conversation feel free to reach out to us and if you want to spend more time with rookie bond love to have you once again Peter burrows for David floor and Jim Kabila's thank you very much for watching the cube we'll talk to you again [Music]

(upbeat techno music) >> Live, from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE covering VMworld 2018, brought to you by VMware and it's eco-system partners. >> Hello everyone and welcome back to theCUBE's live coverage day three of three days of coverage, VMworld 2018 here in Las Vegas, CUBE wall-to-wall coverage, 94 interviews, two sets, our ninth year covering VMworld, I'm John Furrier with my co-host Stuart Miniman on this segment, our next guest is Milin Desai, who is the Vice President and general manager of Cloud Services at VMware, formerly driving the NSX business, been there for multiple years, eight years. Great to see you, thanks for coming on theCUBE. >> Pleasure to be here. >> So you've seen the evolution, you've been there, you've been in the boat. NSX, on a good path, doing really well, cloud services, very clear visibility on what strategy is. >> Mm-hmm. >> Private and public, hybrid multi-cloud, validated by the leader AWS and Andy Jassy, again for the second year. So pretty clear visibility at least on what the landscape looks like. >> Mm-hmm. Multiple clouds, software driving all the value. What's the cloud services piece that you're running now? Take a minute to explain what the landscape looks like, what's your charter, what are you trying to do, and what's happening with news and announcements? >> Sure, so about two years back we started on this journey around cloud services. And the premise was that, increasingly, there are two trends taking place which is; SaaS delivered experiences for on prem. So how can we deliver SaaS experiences on prem? As well as the partnership with, you know AWS for VMware cloud on AWS. So the two things started coming together both in terms of a product opportunity, which is VMware cloud AWS. But overall delivering our capabilities as SaaS, both hybrid as well as in the public clouds. So cloud services is a portfolio that delivers VMware services from management, to security, to operations, as SaaS services to the private cloud as well as to the public cloud. >> Tom Corn, the Senior Vice President of general security projects, was just on theCUBE today as well before you came on. He said, I asked him for a prediction and I'll ask you at the end too, for a 2019 prediction, but he said, "I see the conversation starting to be "security as a service someday," and he's kind of like connecting the dots a bit. But that proves the point it's a SAS business model. The services need to be consumable and scalable. This is a key design criteria and a product guiding principal right, for you guys? >> Yes, So increasingly SaaS makes it easy. The value benefits on that is I don't need to operate, it just works and I can get the value out of what we are delivering. And that's really what's driving the adoption of SaaS. It's easy to use, it gets you to outcomes quicker, and I don't need to worry about the management elements of that and so whether it's you take our updates to cloud management, we announced Cloud Assembly, Service Broker, and Code Stream, all delivered as SaaS to our hybrid infrastructure as well as if you want to deploy workloads in AWS or Azure, same thing. AppDefense, Tom's product, is delivered as a SaaS service. VMC on AWS is a managed SaaS service. So you're seeing that come together as VMware. The idea is can we bring that experience on prem as well as in the hybrid cloud? >> Yeah, Milin really interesting topic because often what gets lost when we're talking about multi cloud is what really matters, is applications and the data that sits on top of it. Maybe walk through a little bit, my on premises vs my SASified stuff vs the cloud native and PKS. How much of the business is driven from all of these pieces? >> So the majority of our business right now, is on premise software. Where customers are building and operating the infrastructure with our software. Now the first evolution into SAS was actually with our service providers, who are using the subscription model to deliver VMware as a service to their end customers. And then the second iteration of that is VMware cloud on AWS, which is growing really well. Both in terms of adoption as well of number of customers and now you are seeing the next evolution. So I would say from a numbers standpoint it's low, but in terms of number of customers adopting it, that number is high. So whether it's cloud operations with Wavefront or the whole automations suite that was launched, AppDefense. We are starting to see the shift to SAS but I would say the majority of our customers are on on prem software with VMware cloud foundation which includes NSX, and a visualized management portfolio which has been driving the majority of the revenue. >> I got to ask you about NSX relative to the cloud services because one of the things we've been pontificating and analyzing is how multi cloud is really going to work and we always try to compare and contrast to networking because Stu and I love networking and storage and some of the infrastructure stuff but if you go back into the evolution of TCPIP and what that did for the industry and Gelsinger likes to talk about this too, is NSX the kind of enabler that TCPIP was? TCP and then you had IP, created a lot of value, in inter-networking. What does the customer challenge look like when you're doing multi-cloud? It's not trivial it's hard to do. Is there a inter-operability framework, is it NSX? What could that be? >> Great question. I think as we go from private, to public, to the edge the virtual cloud network is what connects it all together and so definitely from within the data center with now the Velo Cloud acquisition the WAN, and then layering it with analytics and observability with visualized network insight, the portfolio of NSX allows you to connect these disparate data islands and operate very seamlessly, in this hybrid cloud world. Now the same construct applies, when you go native public cloud, where you can connect into AWS or an Azure and that's where, again the Velo Cloud acquisition alongside how NSX is extending its security policy, into AWS and Azure so that you can get the same security posture on prem, at the Edge, in VMC on AWS, with our VCP providers, as well as Native AWS and native Azure. So definitely NSX is that connective tissue, that's why we call it the Virtual Cloud Network, connects the Hybrid Cloud to the Multi Cloud. >> Seamlessly? >> Seamlessly. >> One of the feedbacks I get from users is, you know multi-cloud is challenging. There's that big elephant, how do I get my arms around all of the pieces where'll my data lives? Maybe give us an update there. I did have a chat with Joe Kinsella on theCUBE yesterday. So if CloudHealth Technologies fits into that overall cloud management piece, I'm sure it does, and you can give a little bit of guidance? I'd like to understand how that fits. >> Yes, you know we talked a lot about SAS and delivering VMware services as SAS to vSphere customers but there's this other world where people are going native AWS, native Azure, native GCP. The interesting thing I tell folks is it's very easy to consume cloud but as you start consuming it, you start dealing with tens of thousands of objects, across multiple projects, hundreds of projects across thousands of users. And when you start looking at the problem statements, same things, visibility, lack of visibility, resource management, you tend to over provision to in the cloud, right? By now you're paying by the drip so there's a definite impact to the bottom line. End to end observability and then configuration compliance. Think about this, you're operating at 10X in terms of changes, the chances of making a configuration mistake like leaving an S3 bucket open, are quite high. >> We've seen examples of that, too. >> Exactly, many a CIO have been fired because of that issue. So what we've been seeing with our customers is this has become a data problem, right? So the acquisition of CloudHealth allows us to essentially provide a platform that has that data, and then deliver to our customers in the native cloud, visibility, I say cost management so using reserved instances over on demand, resource management, hey your old provision on your elastic block storage we can reduce the storage capacity and save money. I can optimize RDS better. Sequel right sizing in Azure, so resource management becomes very interesting. Returns on a typical customer with CloudHealth are upwards of 60%. When you take that into consideration with real time security configuration, Secure State was just announced in beta, this week so real time security configuration. When that mistake happens with an S3 bucket being open? Sub 10 seconds we will notify the user that there is a mis-configuration in the cloud, please go fix it. >> Yeah, I'm curious, one of the other challenges is when I have, especially using lots of different SAS providers, public cloud, private cloud, data protection is a big challenge there. I know VMware has a lot of ecosystem partners, one of the hottest things over the couple years. Is that primarily an ecosystem play? How does VMware position there? >> Yeah so in the hybrid cloud world, like you said we have a very strong ecosystem, multiple vendors here exhibiting, there will be some default elements that we bring into vSAN to help kind of the basics of data, you know back up and management but we will definitely continue to partner with our ecosystem when it comes to an aggregate stack of data management but there will be pockets of just simple back up capabilities that you'll start seeing in vSAN, I think we announced the beta of that this week. >> Talk about your organization, do the general managers, do you have a profit loss responsibility so do you have revenue? >> Yes. >> Talk about the team, how you guys are set up. How big is the team? What's the focus? >> Our team, there's two elements to my team. One is my team drives cloud service across VMware so there are folks developing services themselves. The size of the team is now 70 strong across product, marketing and engineering. And then I also work with my counterparts like Mark Lohmeyer, AJ Singh who are building services on our common platform, right? And it's an aggregate to the customer, they come to cloud.vmware.com they federate their enterprise identity, they log in, they see our catalog. It's like a Netflix-like catalog. You can subscribe to it, you get a common experience in terms of billing and essentially start using the services. So it's not only what my team builds but an aggregate what VMware is building and offering to our end users. >> And what go to market do you have? Which products are you doing that go to market for? >> It's all of our SAS based cloud services. We collectively drive the go to market for that as a team working with our corporate marketing team. >> Awesome. >> Yep. >> So that would be a combination of VMware on AWS, AppDefense, now Secure State, Wavefront, and very soon CloudHealth. >> Yeah, a lot of pressure. (laughing) >> Do the SAS product share, do they live in like the AWS marketplace, IBM, you know DOC or what? Where can they get all of them? >> Today you go to cloud.vmare.com and subscribe to them. Certain offers are starting to get into AWS Marketplace, so CloudHealth is actually in the AWS marketplace. >> Sure, sure. >> And we are looking at Wavefront, which is a hidden jewel in our portfolio is also we are thinking about how can get it into the respective marketplaces of Azure, GCP, and others. But today if you want to access any of these services, you simply go and trial it by just going to our website and starting a trial. >> So they've given you all the new stuff, make it happen. AWS, VMware, AWS, vice versa. RDS on premises, you doing that as well? >> Yes. RDS on vSphere, since the announce we've had phenomenal conversations over here. >> Yeah, it's really exciting, I think people don't understand how big this is. >> John, I had a phenomenal conversation with Yanbing and Christos from the storage and availability business who just really broke down how all of that worked in detail. >> Yes. >> Yeah. >> The customer interest is high. Someone asked me, why RDS? And they said it's such a hard problem and that was my point exactly, there is such a pain when it comes to managing databases and just like everything else, we started off the conversation, customers want a managed service. They don't want to deal with the intricacies of managing databases, they just want the outcomes from how they access databases. Amazon has solved it very elegantly with RDS, it's one of their most popular services. Why not bring it on prem? So that's been a great engineering partnership we are driving with them, and I'm really excited to bring it to market, shortly. >> Well we're looking forward to keeping in touch, we wanted to actually follow up with you on that. It's a story we're going to be following, certainly developing, it's big news, we love it. Thanks for coming on and spending the time. I got to get you to put a prediction out there for 2019. What do you see happening in 2019 that we're going to be talking about next year at VMworld? Personal prediction, could be a VMware prediction. You've seen a lot of what's going on with NSX, you see what's going on in the big picture, wholistically what is the prediction for 2019? >> It might be a boring prediction, but I fundamentally believe this notion of hybrid being bi-directional in nature. I think you'll see more of that. Even Google announced GKE on vSphere, as an example. So I think you will see more of that come through and it won't be a one way destination conversation that we keep having. And you will see VMware truly be a multicloud company. It won't matter if you're deploying the application in the native cloud, or in a vSphere based cloud. We will help the customer where they land the application. My firm belief is next year when we are here, we'll be talking about stories about how we are helping scale customers in Azure and AWS and GCP on one end, and about how we brought cloud on prem with services like RDS. >> Final question, I'm going to put you on the spot. What do you think is the biggest disruptive enabler for the next 10 years in this bi-directional multi cloud world? Can you point to one this that says, that's going to be the disruptive enabler for the next 10 to 20 years? Is there something out there you can point to, trend, technology, the standard? >> So the way I think about the world is a little bit differently in terms of I truly believe that we are getting inundated by data. I'm not talking about the data that you store in terms of running your business but in terms of the metadata that you run your operations and your infrastructure with. And I believe that the layer that will control that portion, the metadata of infrastructure and applications, we have not even begun to understand where that goes and then you apply AI and ML techniques to that? The idea of, I'll throw a term around here, self driving data centers and self optimizing applications I get really excited but it all begins with that data layer. And we are starting to put the beginning signs with CloudHealth, our private cloud assets to start that process. I'm really excited about how AI/ML meets that data layer to achieve those outcomes. >> It automates IT operations, sounds like automation's coming. Milin, thanks for coming on. Milin Desai, he's the vice president general manager of VMware's cloud services. The hottest area, it's emerging, it's got a lot of attention. We'll be following it, of course, on siliconANGLE and Wikibon and theCUBE. We're day three coverage here in the broadcast booth in Las Vegas in the VM village. I'm John Furrier, Stu Miniman, stay with us for more after this short break. (upbeat techno music)

>> Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE covering VMworld 2018. Brought to you by VMware and it's ecosystem partners. >> Hey, welcome back everyone, we are live here in the broadcast booth presented by theCUBE. I'm John Furrier co-host with Dave Vellante. VMworld 2018, day three of three days of wall-to-wall coverage. Our 9th year covering VMworld and the VMware ecosystem. It's great to have on theCUBE Tom Corn, who's the Senior Vice President, General Manager of the Security Products from VMware. Welcome to theCUBE, good to see you. >> Thank you! >> We were just bantering before we came on that you are part of building AppDefense, one-year-old product. >> Yes, yeah. >> You're in the nerd nation, if you will. >> (chuckles) Yes. (laughter) >> We say that with all due respect, Tom. >> I take it. >> I had to stay for Stanford since the football opening day is Friday, so we'll be tailgating at Stanford, but Palo Alto VMware, tons of technology in VMware, we covered the radio event, which was first opened to the press this year, we were there. Security's number one. Pat Gelsinger has said on theCUBE so many times, even four years ago, he said security's a do-over. But it's more than a do-over, it's central to how the Cloud and on-premises are working. >> Yes. >> Hybrid Cloud validated by Andy Jassy this week. >> Yes. >> With RDS on VMware on premises, pretty major industry milestone there. You're in the middle of the security leading the team. What's the update for VMware, still pumping on all cylinders? >> Uh, I think this is actually, we're making some of the biggest strides forward in security right now. I think there is such a huge opportunity to not make the mistakes we made in the past, and start with a clean slate, do security the way it really, ultimately, makes sense. At the end of the day, we're really not trying to protect servers or networks, we're trying to protect data and applications. And being able to see things through, look at the infrastructure through the lens of the application, the lens of the data, and align security to that, is a huge opportunity to fundamentally make Cloud more secure than a traditional, sort of physical environment. >> So, we, I got a stat from TrendMicro, just came by theCUBE today on the briefing, they said one in six dollars are being spent outside the organization and buying other SAAS platforms. Cloud certainly, with Shadow IT has caused that. Whether it's DropBox, ADS-Bih instances, just stuff flying up there opening up, potential vulnerabilities. Virtual networking is clearly a part of the architecture with virtual machines. So security is really under a lot of pressure, and Micro Segmentation seems to be a hot topic. This is driving a lot of new value as the architecture shifts to Hybrid Cloud, which is such a Cloud Operations. >> Yeah. >> Infosec teams, Net Ops, are all working together now, but it seems more confusing than ever. Can you clarify how companies are organizing around the Cloud, Hybrid Cloud operating model in Multi-Cloud with security? >> Yeah, so, first it's important to understand the central idea behind micro-segmentation is to provide a mechanism to compartmentalize all the elements that compose an application, a regulatory scope, so that if one thing falls, everything doesn't fall, right? The reality is a perimeter of a data center is so porous in so many dimensions that you cannot, your security strategy can't be predicated on anything inside my data center is just fundamentally secure. I think we live in a state of compromise. Deal with it, right? And so, the notion of compartmentalizing an application allows for a limited lateral movement of attacks. It also provides a policy boundary to say, you know, I can place controls on the boundaries of an application and that boundary may not exist in the physical world, but it does in the virtual world. You know, the best analogy I came up with for this is imagine you had an entire company in a skyscraper, now all the employees were in that skyscraper. You could put guards in the front door of that building, and the instructions for them on who gets in and who gets out, or what looks weird in the lobby, pretty straightforward, okay? Now take the employees and spread them out into parts of floors of different buildings all over the city, fill the building that you had with employees from lots of different companies, now there's a bank, a TGI Friday's, a bowling alley, and the FBI. Now tell those guards what looks weird in the lobby. Like, now tell those guards who should get in. Now, suddenly, it gets really confusing, and the ability to say I want to create a virtual skyscraper that will put all the employees in one place, that's the idea behind micro-segmentation. >> Tom, you talked about the Cloud, the potential for the Cloud to be more secure than the traditional environment. In June, John and I were at the public sector summit, and we heard the CEO of the CIA say Cloud, on our worst day, from a security standpoint, is better than my client server. 'Cos the first time I'd heard client server in about ten years, but nonetheless, >> (laughs) That's the government. >> So, (laughs) my question for you is, in terms of, so his implication was, it's already there. What has to be done to bring that level of security to that hybrid world? >> Yeah. First, I would be careful with that statement. I think we are probably right for the average company, the way a Cloud provider would secure the infrastructure on down, is actually very solid. The application's your problem. The data that's running on it is your problem. And that's not quite the same thing, there's a different set of things about what can get access, how that's isolated for other things. So-- >> Let me make sure I understand that. So you're saying, the infrastructure check, but that's not the story. >> And what's above the operating system, my applications, and how data's flowing on that, and there's no good excuse that oh, it was running on such and such infrastructures or service, it's not my problem. It's still the company's problem, right? >> Right. >> So a lot of the basic things of access control, alignment of controls, policy, those are still, ultimately, in the hands of the customer. Now, I do agree that the opportunity is to make the simpler, less misalignment, less misconfigurations, those are tremendous opportunities of the Cloud. >> But there's some conventional wisdom in the industry that says, you know what, it's a fait accompli you're going to get hacked, so it's all about how you respond. I'm inferring from you that no, that's not the case, that you could actually protect the data if you take an application view. >> Yeah. >> Of course, response is important. >> Yeah, but I feel like there's no perfect solution. I guess maybe the best way to think of security is as a risk management exercise. You're going to spend whatever you're going to spend. The question is, are you spreading that like peanut butter on a bunch of stuff, or are you investing your time, money, and capital in the things that would have the most material reduction in risk? There's a wonderful framework that Gartner came up with that I liked that, and Neil Macdonald from Gartner came up with it, which is the, he calls it the Cloud Workload Protection Framework. He's stack ranked all the things you could do to protect the workload, in order of how much risk it gets rid of. The things at the bottom, the big risks, patching, segmentation, application control, protect the memory, encryption, those are all things that have to do with reducing attack surface as opposed to finding the attack of the day. The stuff at the top, you know, antivirus running for a server inside the data server behind all these walls, it's not, it's marginal residual risk, so the focus of VMware, in the security realm, has been we can not only bake security in, so you're not adding boxes, you're not managing agents. More importantly, we're in this unique position to understand where things are supposed to be. You know, for example, the AppDefense product that we launched last year, you mentioned, and we have a bunch of new stuff here, we're leveraging the hypervisor itself to understand the intention of the applications you loaded on it, and then use the hypervisor to say that's all it can do, nothing else. It flips the model completely from saying I'm going to try to find bad things to I'm going to really understand what good it's supposed to be, and that's all that's allowed. >> So you're narrowing the scope with policy, bascially? >> 100%. >> I mean, so this comes up with IOT, I heard a guy saying these light bulbs that are WiFi-enabled have full, multi-process threads, we don't need it, it's a light bulb. It needs to go on and off, so by bounding, by bounding the apps, that's what you're saying. >> That's exactly right. >> Using virtualization mechanisms to do that. >> Exactly right. We've never used it for this before, but the hypervisor kernel does a bunch of pretty amazing things, we just. It can see what's running, it can see what you provisioned in the first place, it can do that without adding an agent, it can do that in a way that can't be turned off, without a lot of overheard, and it can do almost anything in response. So the central idea behind AppDefense was, let's use it, it will tell you what all your VM's are for, now you have an application view that says here are the applications in your infrastructure divided into services, divided into machines, here's what they're supposed to be, tell us what you want to have happen if what's running doesn't match what you intended. That's it. >> Well, technology's perfectly positioned with that. And Pat was mentioning NSX, and I want to ask about that in a second about NSX. >> Yes. >> But I want to put you on the spot and ask the question that comes up all the time. Two factors in security that's hard to get your arms around. >> Yeah. >> One is, patching. Which, you said, you don't patch stuff, so you don't patch up the whole surface area. Two, social engineering. 'Cos you've got human error whether you pass or not, did I configure the bounding properly, that's a human error, batching, I call human error and social engineering. Those are two factors that are still prevalent in security. >> Absolutely. >> Your thoughts on that? >> Well, you can't patch humans, so that is all weak, and then the thing that we can really advance there is to move increasingly to automation, and do things that, candidly, humans probably aren't the best at doing that, but you can't just automate, old, unreliable processes, that just makes them faster, it doesn't necessarily make them better. >> Yeah. >> I think that the key to a lot of this is, >> Automating a bad process still makes it a bad process. >> Yeah, it's just faster. (chuckles) It's more efficient. >> (chuckles) An efficiently bad process. >> Exactly, exactly right. So, you know, I think a lot of the automation and ability to compartmentalize things and, candidly, a lot of the policies, whether it's for patching, etc, when thought of through the lens of an application as opposed to like, what's our policy for patching the patient care system, how often? Is my patient care system unpatched, is different from saying I've got thousands of machines, and some of them are patched and some of them are not, how do I prioritize which ones I should get. It really does, not only simplify things, but align things to a business outcome, which really, it goes back to a risk management decision a business has. >> Ransomware is a great example to your point earlier, I think you said that off-camera as well, is that, you know, you don't want to attack the same treadmill of problems. So ransomware, one guy said that on theCUBE here at another event said that, ransomware's easy, just patch them back up and you're good. >> Yeah. >> That sounds simple, doesn't it? >> Yeah. It-- >> Surface area, patch it, back it up. >> Yeah. Sometimes there's reasons why the patch, that people just don't roll out the updates to an absolute critical server on the trading floor, sometimes they have challenges. But, you know, interesting enough, yesterday we were showing, we had a live, we did a live attack on stage with Petya, with a live strain or ransomware, throwing it against the machine, we showed why it worked, and we were just using AppDefense to say, all right, let's assume you didn't patch it, AppDefense is going to make sure that application can't do anything you didn't intend it to do, the ransomware doesn't work. And it's not because we understand what malware you had there, it's because the malware, to work, has to change. >> I'm thinking about security strategies in general for organizations. You know, given that credential theft is still such a huge problem, are the things that you can do with analytics, because you may have visibility on certain parts from the infrastructure standpoint, that you can do to maybe not stop credential theft, that's bad human behavior, but to identify some anomalous behavior. What's happening with analytics, and what role, if any, does VMware play? >> Yeah, so, again, the central theme, I suppose, is summed up as, we're trying to say, here's your applications and data, what is intended? On the network with NSX, on the compute stack with AppDefense, Workspace One is trying to address that from a user and a device perspective. And the questions one asks for what your discussing is, is this who they say they are, are they on the list of invites, and are they on a trusted device? And those were traditionally silo decisions, separately. And what we're saying is, it's about answering those things in concert that allow us to spot the stuff that doesn't make sense. It's the ability to answer them in concert that allows you to make that less intrusive into the daily activities of the users. So the work that's happening on Workspace One Intelligence to do analytics looking at the device and how the device is behaving, the user, and how the user is, what indication, what risk do we see? This may not be the person or the risk that they're working from a device I might not trust even if I trust who it is. Either of those might tip me off to say, you know what, I might want to limit what they have access to, or this is the place I need to look at first. Again, I think that starts to clarify and put things in context. >> We were talking off-camera about the infosec team and the IT team, and often they're in silos and not talking to each other. What's the right regime, in terms of what you see in the marketplace, of best practice to approach this problem? >> It sort of depends on the size and scope. But the infosec team, often lead by the Chief Security Officer, often, in most organizations that I deal with, own the security operation center, security architecture, and governs it's risk and compliance. They're mostly looking at setting overall policy, and seeing when things are breaking down, and reacting to it. But as you point out, there's a lot of security happening in the infrastructure teams, whether it's firewalling, segmentation, locking down the computer stack, even things like AV running by end user services teams. They're looking to set policy, and things that are getting in the data path, that are about locking things down, and they need to collaborate. They need to, to be effective, they need to each know their roles and operate from a single source of truth, and that's where it's breaking down. In fact, I would take it a step further. The other group that needs to be part of this conversation is the application team. And as we move to Dev Ops, and the applications change very rapidly, it's going to be increasingly important that they collaborate, and not ignore each other as silos. >> Mm-hmm. >> I want to ask you, I know we've got one more question left, but, I want to get out there. You mentioned adaptive segmentation is an extension of where micro-segmentation is going. A lot of buzz here at VMworld on micro-segmentation. What is adaptive segmentation? >> So it's really the next logical evolution. Which is, we've taken some of the technology that we've built with AppDefense, that can figure out and map out the applications. Now we have manifests that say what these things are for, and we know the patient care system is actually all these machines and how they interact. It's basically saying, why don't we have the system program the micro-segment, and do it in an automated way? Now you have a micro-segment that is automatically and perfectly aligned driven from the application itself. And the other beauty is, the adaptive portion, which says, if the application changes, that's pushed down through puppet or chef or it's, or something is modified through patching, to have the system to be smart enough to see that's an update, and that automatically changed the actual segment, and lock the network and compute down. That's what we're doing there. >> What is the impact to the customer? And what is the impact of that? >> It's simpler. Much faster time to actually go in. It's simpler, and it's a much more accurate representation of the application. You lock things down both from lateral and direct attacks, so it's a big deal. >> Okay, final, final question. I always like to get the final question in here. Tom, tell us about a prediction for 2019. Next year VMworld, what are we going to be talking about? What are going to be the security issues on the table? More of the same, rinse and repeat issues? What is your prediction for 2019 in the security world? Well, you know what, I think security's going to get more complicated before it gets simpler. I think we're on the right path, but there are so many moving parts. I think, one thing, I don't think you're going to start seeing people increasingly open to security being delivered as SAAS. Because there's too many benefits of machine learning across populations of users. I think we're going to start to see security models that are, to fool one of us you've got to fool all of us. I think those are the kinds of things that are going to be the needle mover. >> Sounds a great service, security's a service, theCUBE is a service bringing these three days of wall-to-wall coverage, we'll be back with more on day three coverage. I'm John, for Dave, stay with us for more after this short break.

>> Live, from Las Vegas, it's "The Cube" covering VMworld 2018, brought to you by VMware and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back. This is The Cube coverage of VM World 2018. Always love when we get to dig in with the practitioners here. I'm Stu Miniman. My cohost is Justin Warren. Welcome to the program first-time guest Andrew Chavez, who is a network and information technology manager with Indian Pueblo Cultural Center out of Albuquerque, New Mexico. >> Out of Albuquerque, New Mexico, that's correct. >> Excellent. Thanks so much for joining us. >> Well, thank you so much for having me. >> Alright, so first of all, tell us a little bit about your organization and your role. >> Well, the Indian Pueblo Cultural Center is kind of a touch point for all the 19 tribes in the state of New Mexico. It's actually one of the only places in the entire world, where 19 tribes, 19 different cultures, really, of Native American people have gotten together, built a cultural center and kind of have formed a gateway in Albuquerque, the largest city in New Mexico, and the gateways to the Pueblos. So it's kind of a cool place. There's just a mix of a lot of neat people, a lot of the different Pueblo people come in and out. It's culturally just a great place to be, just a wonderful, cool place. And on top of that, they at the Pueblo Cultural Center formed a development corporation. So not only do we have the cultural side, which is really neat, but we have this development side, which is developing the old Indian schools. I don't know if you remember the cultural background of the Indian schools throughout the United States of America. >> Yes. >> They've actually taken some of the land for the Cultural Center and the Indian school and are repurposing it, to really help out the Cultural Center and the 19 tribes as we give back to them. >> So is this nonprofit then? >> We have a nonprofit side and a for-profit side. >> OK, give us a little bit of the scope of the operation. You mentioned the tribes and everything, but is it multiple locations? And your scope of responsibilities. >> It's actually multiple locations, so we are actually housed in the Cultural Center itself, but directly across the street we're building up places like hotels, restaurants, office buildings, things of that nature, to kind of diversify the portfolio of things that we offer to the community at large. That money is given back to the stakeholders, who are are the 19 Pueblos. And I was brought in last year, to kind of take what they were as an IT department, and really improve on what they were doing, what they've already done, and just kind of take what's already been done and make it better, and really be able to not only serve the Pueblo Cultural Center, but I'm working to make a showcase there if we can. >> So, Andrew, maybe you could give us a bit of an idea of how IT supports the mission of the Cultural Center. A lot of people are worried that IT is just a cost center and it sits off on the end there and it's something that you have to pay for. So what are some of the things that IT enables the Cultural Center to do, that they wouldn't be able to do otherwise? >> Well, some of the things that we do is... cultural preservation is really one of the big things that we do. Because we do represent all the 19 tribes of New Mexico, different aspects of each of those tribes, in terms of pottery, paintings, all the very rich nature of the hand-crafted pieces that the Pueblos take care of, are all representative of the Cultural Center. So it's not only putting those, but it's cataloging, archiving them, and help with the preservation and dissemination of that information, right? So, when you walk through our museum, all the things are automated. You can go in and press buttons and hear the different languages, see how the pottery is made, see how a lot of these arts and crafts come together, see the history of the Pueblo people and kind of what happened, and how, really, other cultures have interdispersed themselves and interweaved themselves within the rich history of the Pueblo people of New Mexico. And how this overarching culture has really made a difference in the state. Those preservations and on top of that, it's using technology to be able to, again, disseminate it and show how those things work going forward. >> Great stuff, Andrew. Alright, so all the people that visit probably don't understand all the stuff that's behind the scenes. So, it's like all of us that have worked in IT, people are like "Oh, you do computer stuff, right?" So, take us a little bit behind the curtain and tell us a little bit about what technologies you are using to help enable all of those great things you talked about. >> Well, currently what we're using is, we kind of started really green field. The folks that were there before me had worked in more of a single server, hot closet environment (laughs), some of the ways it used to be. There were a lot of consultants, and the decision was made that, to match a lot of the technology initiatives that are going on with the other Pueblos, the Cultural Center needs to catch up. So that's one of the reasons why I was brought in. So one of the first things we did, is say, what can we start doing? And so, when you pull the curtain back one of the things we really decided on was going to a full virtual environment, and finding the right technology and the right player to help us put together a virtual environment, help us build out a data center, and do some of those things. So that's kind of where we started. We started with a five year plan on that build-out and how to maximize not only the budgets that we have, but push those budgets through proper depreciation. So it was really kind of neat to be able to go to a place that I could kind of just pick and choose the things I needed to move forward, and kind of set the course for us moving forward. >> Alright, so could you tell us about some of the decisions you actually made there? So, what did you choose, and what led you to make that particular choice of technology provider? >> Well, initially I started out, because I had worked in a previous endeavor using a UCS, you know, the three in one solution, you have your OS, you have the host, and then you have the navs that's presented to the host, and that's what originally I was going to do because that's what I knew. But I went out to a conference called TribalNet, and was introduced to Nutanix. And I was aware of Nutanix, but I hadn't delved into it. So I kind of talked to one of the reps out there, Justin, and he kind of talked me through Nutanix. When I got back, I searched out a place in Albuquerque called Ardham Technologies, who sells Nutanix, and sat with them. Now, the old UCS was less expensive, cause it's a little older technology, and we didn't think we could get into a hyperconverged solution, but working with the Nutanix rep and my rep from Ardham, they really found a way to make it affordable for us and get us into the hyperconverged technology, which is where I wanted to go. So it was really, kind of... That was the first big decision I made, and I've been very happy with it. >> Excellent. So, having made that deciison and put it in, what are ome of the things that you've now been able to do, given that this is where you wanted to go, and thought maybe it wasn't going to be possible, but now it is. So what's that enabled you to do, that you were looking forward to being able to do? >> Well, it's been abled for us to consolidate a lot of what we have. We haven't used it to its fullest potential because the implementation's only been in about five months. >> Right. >> But what we've been able to do is take those different single servers and move them into a virtualized environment, and then be able to build out a storage area and place user files, and group files, and all the disparate storage areas that were siloed throughout the environment, put it on one single piece of equipment that we can watch. >> Right. >> It's been able to allow us to move to a backup solution that goes to the cloud and isn't fractured, right? So it puts it all in one single area that we can watch, and gives us a single pane of glass for all our servers, which we didn't have before. It's just made us better at what we do, really, and be able to watch what we're doing a lot better. >> Andrew, it's interesting. We talked for years about hyperconvergence. It's not just about converging into the footprint, but it changes the model, because it's really more of a distributed architecture. I think you've got some geographic locations. Maybe help discuss how that fits together, between multiple locations, multi-cloud. It's not just about taking a couple of servers and putting them down to a smaller footprint, it's giving you more flexibility. >> And you've really hit the nail on the head, for the five year plan, right? So year one, it's like choose the vendor, choose the course, but the five year plan is to be able to geographically disperse what we're doing. Because we're using Nutanix, it allows us to put a three-note cluster over here in a single box, we take another single box and put a two-note cluster over here and geographically disperse it. It also allows us, I talked about depreciation, and this is something that I worked on in other places. What we did, is we bought the Nutanix node that we have now for today, right. We plan on using that and buying a secondary node, and using that for the next three years. As we build up, remember I talked about having the development across the road, as we're building new buildings, we're going to build an alternate data center there, and the third year, we're going to take that piece of equipment and move that to the data center and build out a disaster recovery center. So when we buy the new Nutanix node, those two will now be joined. So, not only are we sharing information between the two locations, and have backups geographically dispersed, but we also have been able to use SRM a lot of different ways, to keep the geographical locations up, keep business continuity, but the other portion that is really interesting to us, is that most technology is about a three year depreciation schedule, right. >> Yeah. >> We've been able to take that three year depreciation schedule, and because we're using the older technology as our backup business continuity center, that takes it out to six year depreciation, which extends the life of what we have and be able, when we buy new equipment, it's the newest, greatest, we have the business continuity equipment. And then of course the nodes talk to each other, so we're doing data duplication across two locations. So really when we're all done, we can have up to four to six sets of backups throughout any portion of the day, so it really protects our data and gives us a continuity that we wouldn't have before. >> As someone who really likes a good financial model and spends a lot of time in spreadsheets, mucking around with that, it's really good to hear someone from an IT arena talking about some of the financial impacts on this, some of the business impacts on this. It shows that what is possible when IT takes an interest in the business issues, and shows, we were talking about this earlier on The Cube, about IT people getting a seat at the table, being able to have that conversation about the five year plan, about what makes IT strategically important to the organization. And it's really great hearing a customer actually talk about IT in that context. >> Well, that's one of the things that I think IT gets lost in and as you know, with CIOs, CFOs, CEOs, IT is always seen as a cost center. And we'd eventually like to not be a cost center. (laughs) We'd like to make money, but we have to be fiscally responsible. We have to be fiscally responsible for a number of reasons where I come from at the Indian Pueblo Cultural Center, because we do have a responsibility to our shareholders. We have a responsibility to the Native American people that are taking care of us. We need to take care of them. So if we can find the technology that we need, that we can be a showcase, not only in the technological realm, but also how we budget and take care of money, that shows huge commitment to what we're doing. You know, you can't be a showcase unless you're going to be fiscally responsible as well as technologically responsible, so that's what we're trying to do. >> Yeah, and Andrew, the other thing that strikes me from your conversation, you talk about this five year plan. Sometimes we come to the shows and it's like oh wait, I'm worried about lock-in and enterprise license agreement. Talk about what you look for in choosing partners that will be strategic, that will be with you for this kind of engagement. >> Well, I'm looking for, everybody's always looking for cutting edge, right? But you need to have cutting edge with a background, with a roadmap, right? So what I look for in not only a partner that services me locally, but also in the larger vendor partners, for instance Nutanix. I look for somebody who has a roadmap of what they're doing. Here's what we started with. You know, if I have a five year plan, what's your five year plan? What was your five year plan? Where did you come from? Where are you going to? Can you show me what's going to go on over here? And that's one thing that I really liked about Nutanix, is they had here's what got us here, here's how it's changing, here's what we can show you moving forward, and here's how it can help you. And then, you know, my vendor in Albuquerque, I want the same things. Are you growing? Are you stagnant? What's your customer list? And then the last portion of that is really a relationship sell. There are people out there that will go buy from any vendor because that's what the price ensues, but I can't buy on just price because I need pricing and support and be able to, you know, one call (laughs) We used to say one throat to choke, but I don't like using that any more. But you know, somebody you can drive to and have a conversation with. And that's one thing I've really respected about my vendors, and I like from a customer perspective, is people that are real, they come and see you, and then I can reach out to not only my local vendor, but the folks that support them. I do have to say, with Nutanix, I met Justin who is the rep from Nutanix. He got me involved with the sales engineer at that point and they were on site, they worked directly with me and built just a great relationship around this brand new purchase, something I'm not familiar with but it's a foray into a wider world. And it made me really comfortable with my decision. >> Alright. What's the most exciting thing that you're looking forward to? So you've seen the roadmap, you've spoken to the vendors and you have an idea of what your five year plan is. What's the most exciting thing that's going to be coming up in the next few years? >> The biggest thing for me, and it's probably not even a new thing for Nutanix, but it's what Nutanix is built on. It's what you talked about, the geographical separation, the node building and how we can, Okay, you need more compute? We can give you more compute. You need more storage? We can give you more storage. You need to add something over here? We can do that. It's the flexibility it gives me to stick within budget, we don't have to do this huge budget every year, to be able to prop up what we need. We can buy piece by piece and build it out. And again part of that fiscal responsibility is being forward looking and working with a company that's saying hey, we can get you this today. We're going to take care of you, we're going to listen to your needs, we're going to get you what you need, and here's the bolt-on pieces as we move forward. So I think that's the most exciting piece, is being able to grow within that framework. I like to use a word called platforms for what (laughs) we're doing, right? And I think, from an IT perspective, that's what we're doing and from a cultural perspective, the Indian Pueblo cultural perspective, it's having that platform. So if we say from a museum standpoint, we found the latest and greatest software that's going to allow people to do virtual reality, but we need a back end to support it, I can say I got that. (laughs) We've been able to build the platform to put that on. So it's putting that platform in place, building on that platform, us growing into it and then that company growing with us. And that's been something that's been just transformative for us. >> Well, Andrew, you talked about authentic conversations. We really appreciate you sharing your story with us. Be sure to check out IndianPueblo.org for all that they have to offer. I want to check out the museum. You've got a great list of cultural activities there, so thanks so much for joining us. >> Yes, come see us at the Indian Pueblo Cultural Center. The best time to come is the first week in October for the Albuquerque Balloon Fiesta. We'd love to have you all. >> Alright, for Justin Warren, I'm Stu Miniman. We still have lots more coverage here from Vmworld 2018. Thanks for watching The Cube. (upbeat techno music)

>> Live, from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE. Covering VMworld 2018. Brought to you by VMware and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back. This is theCUBE's coverage of VMworld 2018 here in Las Vegas. I'm Stu Miniman joined by my two guest hosts that have spent a bunch of time with us this week. John Mark Troyer and Justin Warren. Thank you, gentlemen for joining us for the wrap. >> Thanks for having us. >> Thanks for having us. >> We get to have a lot of fun. We get to hang out with community people, geek out on a lot of stuff. This is also a really good checkpoint for a lot of the IT industry. VMware, 800-pound gorilla in the data center. I put out one tweet that was like the 800-pound gorilla in the data center or the 800-pound gorilla in the cloud. The partnerships matured quite a bit, in my mind, for the last year. That was one of the big things that I've seen. RDS on-premises is definitely the thing that sticks out to me the most. John, let's start with you as to, checkpoint from last year. What impressed you? What are they making progress with? Let's start there. >> I think the RDS announcement was maybe even undersold here. We'll see in the coming months what actually happens and if everything works the way it's supposed to work. I think a lot of people who are putting chips down on various outcomes and scenarios in cloud world did not cover that one space in the roulette wheel. Cause that's actually pretty interesting. Stu, I kind of see this as a year of promises kept. Some promises that were made in years past are starting to come out. This multi-cloud world seems more real. VMware's relationships with various clouds and the hints that were thrown are there's more to come. It seems real. The cloud starting to come back on-prem. Both EBS on-prem and now Project Dimension with VMware being a service provider. I've talked to a number of vendors and you and I, Stu. Some are here on theCUBE. People starting to do more managed services from the cloud back into your data center. I see the multi-cloud world working and then this kind of blurring of on-prem and cloud even more. That's kind of what I'm seeing. >> Yeah, I've got to agree. It's that idea that cloud is a state of mind. It's not a location. >> We say it's an operating model at it's core, right? >> Right, yeah, and I think we're seeing a lot of those ideas come to fruition now that you can operate like a cloud on-site. It's how you run things, it's not where exactly you put it. With the multi-cloud world, like you said, we can have, some of it can be on-site, some of it can be in one cloud, another cloud, lots of different clouds. Some of it will be at the edge. We're seeing a lot of growth in edge computing, which is essentially just another way of doing on-site. Being able to use the same tools, and that, for me, is the idea around the RDS announcement. It's the same thing that you're used to in public cloud. Now I can do that on-site. We're seeing a real cross-pollination. You can take VMware and run that in cloud. You can take things from the cloud and now run it back on site. It's pretty exciting. >> This is awesome. We have an easy button. Customers just push a button. Any data, anywhere, moves all over the place. Laws of physics, throw them out. Come on, guys. I need some critical analysis here. The trope that I would have, always, when I became an analyst an eight years ago was like well, if it wasn't for management and security we would have this all sorted out. The multi-cloud world is made progress, but when I still look at it. RDS, super exciting. The thing that's most exciting about it? That's on-premises, it's doesn't have connection to Amazon, but I'm doing cool things with the exact same kind of bits there so I can do it here or there. Doesn't mean, necessarily here and there, or spread between there, because petabytes of data don't just float across the ether. We're still using things like the AWS Snowballs when we have to move a lot of data. Yes, it's matured, but when I look at the management of multi-cloud and how simple, there was a great comment from a company that's been around for a couple of decades on theCUBE and he said look, the new companies all say we're going to make this super easy. It's like well, because you don't have the trusted brand to set beside, simple would be nice but cloud isn't simple. Multi-cloud sure isn't simple. >> There was, probably, a surfeit of single panes of glass here at the show. Any app, any cloud, any whatever. Single pane of glass. We'll blueprint it, we'll manage it, we'll do it. That does seem like that probably isn't that real world. >> Multiple single panes of glass. >> Please, Justin, give me a touchpoint. When you talk to an administrator, how do they spell single pane of glass? >> Oh yes, P-A-I-N, yes, a single glass of pain. That's generally what it is. I think that the manageability and the operational side of things, that is where there's a lot more development required. Cloud is, yes it's a state of mind. It's a very different way of operating and a lot of the tools, particularly in the VMware community, a lot of what people are used to here is very much point and click. It's not really as automated as it would be in, say, developer land. I spend a lot of time with developers and a lot of what they're used to is all programmatic, it's driven from the API. We're seeing movement with things like PowerShell and VMware administrators are getting more comfortable with the idea of scripting and so on. But they're not programmers. They still need GUI tools. They still need things that are able to do point and click. Some things are better in that environment. I think we still have a long way to go with things around automation. The other thing that still has a long way to go, I think, is security. Security particularly around the networking of how you inter-connect with all of these things and do so securely at scale. There is a lot of invasion and work that's required to actually make that happen. >> Absolutely. John, do you have some comment there? >> I was going to say I think you're right. Especially on all those points. The community booth back here behind us this year had a VMware code section, which was jam-packed the whole time. For the first time. VMware's been trying to speak to developers for 10 years and not quite connecting. Now, these weren't developers back there, these were admins, and they're not going to ever be programmers, but they're going to start to learn more programmatic paradigms, automation, things like that. It was super popular this year. >> Luckily, we don't actually need programmers anymore, John, cause it's coding, which means you're really just coping, pasting, and modifying things and everything. Heck, I've even interviewed marketing people that are like oh, server-less, I can build with that stuff. Super easy. I don't think we need everybody to learn to even code, as it were. We bridged that gap. It's matured, it's become easier. They pulled over some of the, it was the EMC code team. It's half that team over there. They had some good gamification. >> Stu, I am an optimist and I think the glass is half full or 40% full at least. We've done some CUBE stuff, theCUBE's been all over the world here this spring, all through 2018. I've done a couple shows with you. The difference that I saw this year was that the use cases were real and the time to value was real. People are implementing cloud projects, multi-cloud projects, and they're getting to a good milestone within weeks or months. Admittedly, these are big, multi-national companies, so it's really at the top level where they have the army of people to do it, but sometimes these projects were very small and they were real. They weren't just marketing hokum up on stage. Of course, they're not the full enterprise in a couple of weeks, but that's the difference this year, I see, Stu. I'm 40% full. >> Absolutely, I'd say look. Energy level was up. Two years ago it kind of hit a nadir. It was doom and gloom. We were all over at the eye candy bar saluting the great run that VMware had and wondering who the next CEO was been. Now, energy level's back up. Investment in the ecosystem, oh my gosh. I don't think I've seen this many parties ever at a VMworld. We got to talk about something other than cloud so give me your non-cloud takeaways from the show. Areas that people should learn more about, things you saw in the ecosystem or from VMware or the community. >> I think that's one of the things I've noticed here at the show. Wandering around the show floor, unlike some of the other shows where it's we will have a storage show or we'll have a backup show. There's a lot more balance this year. There seems to be a good mix of some of everything. I think that it shows that in order to run a successful IT shop, you actually need to have a balance of, you need some backup, you need some data recovery, you need to have some software, you need some monitoring, you need to have security options. Go and have a look at all of the different vendors that are at a show like this to be able to make sure you have a portfolio approach to how you run things. >> Totally. I remember there were a couple of years, four or five years ago, it was like oh, it's VM storage world. >> Yeah. >> OK, yeah. John? >> There is a lot of storage here, but the storage is all connected to the cloud now. I think if you look at some of the big booths and some of the start-ups who have gotten funding recently. Large rounds. Cohesity, Datrium, Rubrik, folks like that, they're delivering on promises made in earlier years. Not particularly like oh wow, I never thought of, but this was the vision that we laid out and now we're delivering it this year. Big rounds of funding, big customer movement, connection to the cloud and solid, interesting DR as a service and data, as opposed to storage, ideas. I thought that was one of the more interesting aisles this year over there in the booths. >> To riff on what you said about developers and the bridge to the code idea, we see Puppet is here at the show, HashiCorp is here for the first time. >> Docker's there, of course. >> Docker's here. >> C & CF had a booth. >> Yep, C & CF had a booth. These are people that you wouldn't have expected to see at a VMware show in years past. >> One thing that struck me is companies with a mission for good. Pat Gelsinger kind of sets the bar. Talked about it in his keynote. Do better, do good, sets that example. He climbed Mt. Kilimanjaro for charity earlier this year. They had Malala up on stage with Sanjay Poonen. I did a couple of interviews here which were inspiring. Mission-driven companies and great to see the infrastructure in software companies being like hey, we're enabling and helping it. That was one to me. Takeaways from the community? Other things as we get to our wrap? >> I do wonder about that point. Just to add a little, slightly critical note on that. I think that there has been a bit of a tech lash, a bit of a backlash against tech companies. I wonder whether, I would like to see more from tech companies to show that this is real. That that social conscience is a real thing and it isn't just a bit of marketing that they've spray painted on to the front of the company. The fact that we had Malala here giving a keynote indicates that there is a commitment to it. I would want to see that carry through for the next couple of years, at least, to show that that sort of thing is real. And certainly, from the rest of the ecosystem, I expect that we're going to see a lot more. >> Diversity in the community, absolutely. I do realize we have three white guys of a certain age sitting here. We try to add diversity. I had my first European host on the program. Lisa's been on a lot this week. We're building out our bench, we're looking to add diversity. John, yeah, the community. >> Community, again, yeah, community was good this year. A lot of old faces have stayed around, which is really interesting but also people have left and come back. You saw people who have gone into the AWS and Microsoft ecosystems coming back in here. Again, some of those old faces. Also, new faces. Global diversity from the southern hemisphere and from other countries that you wouldn't expect are here today. That was super interesting. I do see a lot of energy, a lot of excitement about their careers going forward. I do see that tech needs to be, there was some symbolic do-good things here. But I mean, Justin is a little bit involved in your own home country about how the government has the power with technology to do good or bad. I think that may be an emerging thing that we see here now as you get a layer down of not only charity work but the impacts of technology. I bet we'll end up talking about that next year, Stu. >> Guys, we could start talking for a lot longer. The good news is I know how to get in touch with you. For our audience, by the way, you can hit us all up on Twitter, through various social channels. Jtroyer, jpwarren, I'm of course @stu. That's just S-T-U. Blue Cow is on Instagram. Follow the adventures of Blue Cow, showing where Justin's going all over the place. Thanks so much for joining us. Great coverage here. This community's where I get a lot of my guest hosts and still, it's like homecoming coming to this place. Thank you for watching theCUBE. (electronic tones)

>> Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE covering VMworld 2018. Brought to you by VMware and it's ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back to theCUBE. We are continuing our coverage of VMworld 2018 day 3. I'm Lisa Martin, with two very stylish men next to me. I'm quite impressed. Dave Vellante, my esteemed co-host. >> Oh shucks. >> Rocking the salmon, King Salmon Vellante. And The Zog is back, Eric Herzog. Great to have you back. I was looking at you on Twitter and you have been on theCUBE 17 times. Is this 18 or 19? >> You know, I think Dave said I was on one of the very first CUBEs way back in 2010. So I've been on a few. >> That's a whole other criteria of VIP level. Well thank you for coming back. You have been, not only is he, you can't do a CUBE without Eric Herzog. You've been everywhere all over VMworld. I saw you're speaking at IBM booth on VMware and IBM, you're at Cisco, you're giving sessions. How do you fit it all in and still have time for us? >> Well, I always make time for theCUBE. >> Always? Thank you, thanks for that. >> Always make time for you guys. Love talking to CUBE. You guys have been very helpful. We appreciate everything that you do. Love doing shows, love 'em. I may be 60 years old, but I'm really 18 down underneath, so if I only sleep three hours a night, not a problem. >> What do you love about them? I mean, is it? >> Number one is meeting customers. Customers and channel partners, right? Well, all of the employees of all the various companies here get a paycheck from whoever that may be, me, IBM, someone from other companies, people from VMware. That's not who pays your salary. It's the end-users and the channel partners, if they buy through the channel. They're the ones that really pay your salary. So being close to the customers and the partners is number one. Second thing, of course, is seeing all the cool technology. You know, seeing what's going on, what's hot, what can we leverage from our perspective, what can we tie ourselves to. So for example, the hot things, that IBM's really been doing from a storage perspective. Cloud and modern data protection. Those are the two big things we've been focused on for the last couple of years. And how do we integrate our storage solutions and our modern data protection with cloud infrastructure, and then also how do we, if you're not in the cloud, how do we help customers protect their data better in a modern way and reuse their secondary data, instead of making 27,000 copies of the same data. >> So when theCUBE first started at VMworld, modern data protection at the time was dealing with the lack of physical resources, 'cause you went from 10 servers down to one, and you didn't have all that excess capacity to do a run up back up job anymore. Today, modern data protection is all around cloud and multi-cloud and software defined, so I wonder if you can help us sort of paint a picture of what modern data protection is for IBM? >> Sure, I think there's a couple, couple aspects too. So, first of all, you have to support the cloud, and that's two ways. So for us, several of our backup products are used by cloud service providers. In some cases they use our name, and say, "Featuring IBM Spectrum Protect or Spectrum Protect Plus." Other cases, they have their own brand but it's our software underneath the hood so that if the end user is backing up to their cloud, they're actually using our software. So that's item number one. The second thing is you need to make sure that your traditional storage software can TEAR to the cloud, can migrate data to the cloud, can transparently move data to the cloud in an automated fashion using AI. So using artificial intelligent when the data's hot if you connote a target, and that target could be a cloud, and when the data's hot it TEARs the data to the cloud. Sorry, when it's cold. When it's hot it pulls it back in and that needs to be all automated through AI base. So we've done both, we have our backup software which is available from several cloud providers as a backup as a service, we also offer it through the cloud so IBM Cloud actually sells spectrum protect backup as a service solution All of our primary storage software and even our spectrum scale software can automatically TEAR data to a cloud target device. >> Eric I got to ask you so TEARing used to be predominantly, correct me if you disagree but, it used be a one way trip to the bit-bucket. You just described going there and coming back. Has cloud changed that because of big data, analytics? Where people want to pull back data increasingly? >> So I think of a couple of things. So first of all, there's no doubt that the world is data driven. The most valuable asset isn't gold, it's not silver, it is absolutely not oil, it's not diamonds. It is data. And it doesn't matter whether you're one of the largest banks in the world, you're in manufacturing, you're in the government, or whether you're Herzog's barn grill. The data is your most valuable asset. What you do with your customer data, how you manage your business, what you do with your supply chain if your a services company, how are you servicing, what are you charging, what are you billing, all of that is the most critical thing that you have. So in a data driven world, its critical that you use the data. And that also means that because of valued data, when you backup the data or you snapshot or replicate the data, you now created a secondary copy. Well what if you could use it to do tests? What if you could use it to do big data analytics? What if you could use it for DevOps? So instead of making one copy for tests, one copy for disaster recovery, one copy for this, and have basically a plethora of copies all over the place, with what we've provided in modern data protection, you can use a backup, you can use a snap or a replica, and you can use that to do tests or development or to do big data analytics. And using that one copy not making multiple copies. So that's- >> I just want to pick up on something you said there's going to be some folks in our audience like, "yeah yeah we hear that data is more valuable than oil or more valuable than gold, et cetera, more valuable than platinum." There's evidence, if you look at the market value of the top five companies, Apple, Facebook, Microsoft, Google, and Amazon, they've surpassed the banks, they've surpassed the energy companies, and I would argue its cuz of data. People are recognizing that they're data companies, you agree? >> But if you look at that name the only one that actually builds anything of substance, as a fair amount of their volume of revenue, is Apple. >> Is Apple, right. >> Amazon doesn't, they ship stuff. Facebook clearly doesn't, Google has a few things but not really builds stuff its really about the data. Absolutely and if your a more traditional company like a bank or someone building the table. Whoever builds this table if they have their act together and they're using that data right, they're building the table cheaper than anyone else, they're shipping it to theCUBE cheaper than anyone else could ship it to you. They got more colors because they know what their doing. And they ship you the right color table and they don't screw it up and send you a black table when you want it this color table because black won't show up on theCUBE very well. The more you do that the more money you make. Even something as simple as a table manufacturer. And that's all about the data and how you use that data. >> So Eric you love talking with customers which is great as the CMO for IBM storage. Got to talk to those customers. Let's talk about how you're seeing customers take the efficiencies of what IBM is doing with data protection, storage, et cetera. to be able to harness the power of AI, the superpowers that Pat Gelsinger talked about on Monday, and transform their businesses. Give us some of your favorite customer examples where its really revolutionary. >> So we had a great example today, we did a panel with a bunch of end users as part of the show agenda. And one of the customers is a provider of softwares of service to universities and schools. 45,000 customers between the universities, junior colleges, schools districts, et cetera. In North America so Canada and the U.S. And they are doing softwares of service so for them performance is critical, they can't go down. All of the college bookstores, if you go into a college bookstore, all of the infrastructure behind that is them. So they're called Follet. So a couple of things, one because they're doing softwares of service and managing all that. Its critical, can't go down. Got to be available, it's got to be performant, it's got to be resilient, it's got to be reliable. So that's how the storage melds in. From modern data protection the way it melds in is how many books did Dave buy? What did Eric buy? Oh is Dave buying a used book? Or is Eric buying a new book? Okay say we know that the propensity is certain of members of the community. I went to UC Davis, University of California Davis, are going to buy used books, Dave, whereas Herzog's going to buy new. They can figure that out, how many used books they need, how many new books they need, that's all about efficiency and how they make more money. What are the store hours? Certain universities it's this, other universities it's that. What do they do in the winter time? At UC Davis you can go in the winter time, I know you went to school in Boston its probably snowing, no one's going in the bookstore in the wintertime. >> Trend towards book rentals, how do we capitalize on that? >> That's all they do. One of the things they talked about was how they always have to protect that data and back it up. The other thing they talked about was they have to assume a lot of capacity. So what they do is they bought assuming they would have to refresh in 18 months. And because our storage arrays have a ton of different data reduction technology whether that be block, D2, compression, et cetera. And they have petabytes of data. Petabytes. 12 Petabytes. They've actually calculated it out they won't need to buy new storage for 36 months instead of 18 so they just saved on CapX. Through the intelligence of the storage. So in that case you've got both modern data protection and you've got a storage message. One of our other customers who's a public reference, not here at the show, which is a hospital, they were backing up all their data, both cloud and on premise with our backup software, and they went down and their entire system went down and they didn't lose one stitch of data and its a hospital. It's a teaching hospital, think they're in Pennsylvania, and in the public reference in the video he said, "and we went down and off that backup we were able to get all of the data back. We didn't lose any patient data, we didn't lose any research data, we didn't lose any billing data, if you break your arm they do bill you, they didn't lose anything." >> That's not just money, that's lives so that's huge. >> Absolutely. >> I want to ask you about you know that table example you were giving, and we were talking about the big five companies in terms of market cap being data orientated. There seems to be a gap between those sort of traditional companies and those data companies and that gap tends to be the data is often is often in silos its human expertise or expertise around a bottling plant or the manufacturing plant or whatever it is versus a data model with humans who understand how to leverage that data. Do you see, whether its through new data protection techniques or other storage techniques that IBM is working on, ways to help customers break down those data silos so they can become more digital and be able to take advantage of data? >> So I think there's a couple of things. So first of all at the very tactical level we provide this automated IA based data TEARing. We can tear from anything to anything so we can take data from an IBM array and TEAR it to an EMC array. We can take data from an EMC array and TEAR it to a net app array. A net app array to a Tachi array, an HP array back to our array, so we can do this transparent data move based on hot and cold. Not only does that allow you to control CapX and OpX you can move the data from array to array, and once you move that data set it might be working that other array could be hooked up to a different set of servers through the SAN that's running a different workload and then takes that dataset and use it with that other piece of software out on the server side. So that's item number one. Item number two is IBM not just in the storage but overall has a global program where IBM is promoting, through universities all over the world, data scientists. Part of that is training data scientists not only how to do the science of data and analyzing data and mining data and doing it, but to break down those walls. The value is more there. And we also have from a storage perspective some products are spectrum scale products, one of our customers who's one of the largest banks in the world they run 300,000 servers attached to a giant spectrum scale repository, petabytes and petabytes, and they do real time data analytics to see if Dave Vellante or Lisa's credit card was stolen. >> Thank you! >> Oh yes, thank you! >> So that's real world analytics they run but they need petabytes of data. And then with our IBM cloud object storage technology where we have several customers at the exabyte level in production with an exabyte of data, you put the data out when its cold but guess what, if you want to mine it you might want to pull it back and guess what, you can TEAR data from spectrum scale to IBM cloud object storage and then spectrum scale can pull it back in to do the big data analytic workloads. >> And that AI you're using is it heavy open source? Is there a little bit of Watson sprinkled in there? >> It's stuff the storage division developed years ago and then has peppered in the AI based technology into that software to determine when the dataset is hot or cold and then move it back or forth. We also do the old style, so if you go back 10 years ago, the automation of storage was policy based. So we had it way back when which was if the data is 30 days old move it to this array. >> The old HSM kind of... >> Yeah and it was automated so once it hit 30 days, but now what we've done is, we started with that, what I would call automation, and now we've moved that to AI. And by the way, if you still want to do it the old way and say move this data when its 60 days old, you can still do that. But the modern way is let the storage figure out for you and move it back and forth whether it be to the cloud or whether it be on premises. >> So it's intelligent hierarchical storage management? So if the characteristics change the system knows what to do as opposed to- >> So when it's hot it'll pull the data back into flash, for example, when its cold it'll put it out to cloud, it'll put it out to tape or it'll put it out to slow hard drives, either way. >> Alright Eric, so we're almost out of time here. You've been at IBM a long time, IBM's been around a long time, you said you even have customers at exabyte scale. I'm hearing heterogeneity, customer choice, but if I'm a small hospital in the middle of America and I have choice with data protection vendors, storage vendors, some smaller than IBM that might be able to move faster, what are the top three differentiators of why I would want to go with IBM's storage solutions? >> Sure so the first thing is our broad portfolio. Whether it be file block or object, whether it be modern data protection, whether it be archiving if you still want to use tape, we're the number one provider of tape in the world and we sell gobs of it to the web scale guys. >> Of course you do. >> They're the guys that buy it. >> Cuz its cost effective. >> So we've got one throat to choke, all of it talks to each other, and happens to work with all the cloud vendors not just IBM cloud. We work with Amazon, we work with Microsoft, we work with Google, and we work with IBM's own cloud. So we can work with anything. That's out of mind. Second thing, for smaller shops we have a network of business partners all over the world, some of them even deal with the big global Fortune 500 and others deal with small accounts. And then really the third thing is that IBM makes sure that our stuff works with everyone else's stuff. Whether that be cloud, our spectrum tech software which has been around for years and is the leading enterprise backup package, the bulk of what it backs up is not IBM storage. The vast bulk of it is from two of the competitors on the floor of this show, they also back up our stuff too. And we backup everyone's. There's probably 20 storage vendors we backup every one of their data. So if someone buys storage from XYZ, call me, we can back it up. If someone buys it from one of the big competitors we back it up, from us we back it up. So the fact that our software works with everyone's gear is of an advantage for both the small shop and the big shop. We make sure that our software, whether its embedded in our arrays or whether we sell it as just a pieces storage software and we are the number one storage software provider on the planet as well, we can meet the needs of any company big or small because we have this flexibility of working with our stuff and working with everybody else stuff and most of the other guys don't do that. If its a small shop their stuff usually only works with their stuff. >> And from a support perspective, you play with everybody? >> Global network. I mean we're known for our support whether it be IBM direct or what we do with our partners all the partners are certified, its a big certification process, and if they can't certify the product they can't sell IBM's stuff. That's just how we operate. Other people, if they can move a lot of boxes but they don't have anyone pick up the phone or can come out to Dave's house to install, they let them sell, we don't do that at IBM. We don't use those box mover types we go for guys that add value and know how to work with the cloud, know how to do hybrid cloud. One of our resellers designed a Watson based AI system that's used in bottle factories. Packaging. Beer, soda, milk, and it can figure out if its full or not full, if the bottle or can or carton is damaged. And they used Watson to do it. Now they're regular resell. They resell all the storage, they resell our power, they resell mainframe, but they've gone into the software development side using this Watson thing and they're selling a full solution with the software included to bottling plants all over the world. >> Wow, Eric. This has been a super charged conversation. Thanks for stopping by and talking with Dave and me about not just your excitement about talking with customers but really how IBM is really empowering customers of any size worldwide to succeed. We know we'll see you again soon but thanks for stopping by a couple of times this week. >> Great well thank you. Thank you, really appreciate the time. >> And the outfit choices are just on point guys, you blend well too. For Eric, Dave Vellante, I am Lisa Martin, you're watching theCUBE live from VMworld 2018 day 3. Stick around, we'll be back with our next guest after a short break. (electro music)

from Las Vegas it's the queue covering VMworld 2018 brought to you by VMware and its ecosystem partners welcome back to the cube here in Las Vegas at VMworld 2018 I'm Stu moon with a co-host John we're happy to welcome to the program believes the first time guests know woz Murr who is the senior vice president and general manager of EUC or end-user tutoring at VMware thanks so much for joining us yeah absolutely thrilled to be here great show this year ya know we do a lot of interviews but we don't have enough room for every single GM but we're excited we got a lot going on at this show I mean we've been watching since Sanjay got put in charge of that group of years ago big acquisitions like AirWatch so tell us the the big news yeah I mean there's there's several things that we know a great a great opportunity for us to showcase some of the big big opera leases with work space one you know that we're finding that customers you know really have loved our product for ios and android we've had a lot of customers doing virtual desktops virtual apps now with workspace one we've brought all of it together seamless where they can now manage iOS Android Windows 10 obviously huge in the market both physical and virtual all with one tool and now even Mac right one of the big initiatives we've seen as Mac is a choice right where where employees say hey you know I really want to use a Mac but you know obviously there's one or two windows apps that we have to bring to Mac to make it successful in the enterprise and so obviously workspace one really bringing that together I mean know what you were early in VMware and left for a while came back you've been kind of the art one of the architects of this thing I was at VMware and it's doing with history and EMC you know on the server storage side there was this explosive excitement around virtualization and then desktop virtualization VDI came in that's right and I don't you know we were joking before about the earth video your VDI but it's been there its I went there it's a it's been more of a slow burn but it's it's it's crazy now and it's working and it's here what has been I'm just kind of curious what has been your philosophy and where you want to take VMware now that these you know but with all these technologies super useful super valuable kind of and trance I mean to use some buzzwords transforming the workspace right and it's real so yeah you know the first and foremost you know I think one of the things that we've done is we've matured virtual desktops virtual applications is is really look at what are the right use cases that they come in right you know I think for a while it was every PC is gonna be replaced with virtual and and I think we've you know now seen where it makes sense it's a phenomenal technology right where we have you know folks working from home in sensitive data can we deliver that secure you know real-time experience so I think we've become a lot smarter the second thing is that heterogeneity is now everywhere right people want to work on all these different devices you know there's there's there's Windows and Mac and Chromebooks and and people really want to have that that ability to work anywhere on any platform that they choose you know CIOs are telling us that that they're having a hard time recruiting key talent if they don't give a you know users choice right and so virtualization now helps us it helps us do that a little bit more in a more sophisticated way the other thing is that now people can start to run these workloads a little simpler in the cloud right we introduced Verizon cloud now and SoftLayer and you know on VMC as well now with this you're right so now you're seeing all the tech titans come together say you know run it on your local laptop run it in the cloud so we really see a lot of synergies again bring it back to workspace born yeah I like that the discussion choice you mentioned a whole bunch of cloud tech I made a joke that you know they have both Coke and Pepsi in the solutions Expo you know you can choose your containerized beverage of choice that's right there but at the same time sometimes people don't understand is that when Dells in the mix with VMware Dell has you know some really good history with everything down to the desktop I think back to the wise acquisition absolutely like so what is that whole stack you know if you will look like when you put it together how does that fit yeah it Dell has been a fantastic partner you know we you know as passed out on stage you know we announced a partnership with HP last year Dell this year Dell has done a phenomenal job now with what's called Dell provisioning for workspace one where out of the box you can take a physical Dell PC power it up and go directly into that that local management you know that is managed over over-the-air that you deliver the right applications the right services the right security patch and one of the really interesting things as you know del command tools underlying the OS now can be all managed by workspace one you know you tie that to you know the solutions like del complete where you can get VDI in a whole stack with Dell now you can start to say you know bring together that that whole solution of physical laptops virtual you know really make sense to tie it all together with Dell as an overall provider of the complete solution for enterprise you know one of the interesting things in the cloud evolution last few years is the is the rise of GPUs right we know it's not just a box of x86 and your 616 I've got all these GPUs in the cloud that kind of boomerang straight back to the desktops and how how important is that and how can the workspace you know horizon horizon and workspace view is one of those things I wish we can have the one a couple of customers I talk to you today said you know I said how's it going you know just flat out you tell us the goods the bads and they said I have to say the horizon experience is amazing right and part of that I think is because we have that back-end GPU power that we've never had before where you know there's it literally is difficult to tell the difference between physical and virtual you know we have a lot of our customers some in an auto and anytime people are using CAD or healthcare where they're trying to do rendering of imagery they can now use these back-end GPUs to actually get that full fidelity experience so it's really been opening up the use cases and really making this a real solution for especially highly regulated environments that's super nice so I mean a lot of news product news right that came out anything that you're particularly excited about I want to highlight you know one of the the biggest things is what we call workspace one intelligence I mean every software company here is saying you know analytics and and the machine learning and you know and I'd love to bring it back to you some real-world scenarios you know one of the areas that we all know app compatibility right when we're going for that latest upgrade now with Windows 10 upgrading every six months or so we've been able to look at that and say you know which apps are going to be incompatible how do we go fix them before we do the rollout and that also comes back to user experience right guaranteeing that the users are going to have a great experience making sure that we get those patches down but doing it in a smart way so that we don't break the user experience at the end of the day I really do think that that is going to be a major thrust you know for much of the industry as we get you know bigger and better one of the the facts that I know it's a it's interesting to note just six months in for 150 billion events ingest at a month on this cloud service right and we're just at the very beginning so you're gonna see some numbers over the next coming quarters and months and just how we're able to improve experience really remediates security almost instantly you know be able to do things like you know get rid of the mundane tasks and start to automate out you know some of these these trivial things alright so no I talking to some of the community members and security came up and and specifically around to you see it was like okay NSX I understand but security should s be table stakes in this environment shouldn't be something else it seemed to be a little bit of frustration with how it how it is today you know what's your feet I think Pat really said it well is that that security has to be built in right has to be intrinsic into into what we're building you know one of the things that you've seen we have this solution called trust network where we're what we're trying to do is take the information that we're ingesting all these data points of mobile devices Mac Winton and now start to share that in a way that that partners like CrowdStrike carbon black Symantec McAfee checkpoint Palo Alto you know 11 different providers all looking at that and saying if I correlate your data with my data we are getting insights that we've never seen before right and the the interesting thing about it is that the difference is real-time remediation right you see an event and so for example think about it from from your iPhone right if you jailbreak your iPhone within 30 milliseconds we can say hey you know let's let's eliminate enterprise data leave your personal stuff alone right we don't we don't care we don't want to know but let's get enterprise data off now how about on Windows 10 the same same opportunity right something looks strange listen well you know you're authenticating on this laptop and somebody else is authenticating over in you know Europe let's just pump for a multi-factor right like hey something looks wrong let's take a real-time remediation that's the difference that's the new game-changer that we see in this new modern era is is this ability to see something and just start to go into a normal escalation path of something might be wrong let's let's actually taking that and take an action no want to give you the final takeaway you know you've you've been in this part of the market for a while it's gone through a lot of changes for people that hadn't looked at a little bit what's what's the takeaway you want them to have no I think first and foremost is that this is a journey right this isn't like ESX where you pop a CD into the ROM and hit power on and like all right we're ready to go this is one that we say you know every three months can we say how we're either improving user experience improving security or radically changing the cost paradigm of management right and that's where we say hey you want to roll it office 365 let's make that you know a goal for the next three months hey you want to you know you want to figure out how to improve access to every SAS application in your environment great that's next hey do you want to figure out you know how are you gonna get better insight to where cost is or you want to move workloads out to the cloud here's how we can help you do that that makes our or our partners our customers heroes every three months right getting out in front of that CIO and saying here's what we're delivering for the business there's real business value okay and just in case for our audience a a CD was a thing before he had that's right driver we could have been it was this physical world that we lived in as opposed to today it's more virtual and the clouds that's right thanks so much there's a pleasure to work with you John Troyer I'm Stu minimun stay with us more coverage here from VM roll 2018 thanks for watching the Q thanks a lot [Music]

>> (narrator) Live from Las Vegas, it's the Cube, covering VMWorld 2018. Brought to you by VMware and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back to Las Vegas everybody. You're watching the Cube, the leader in live-tech coverage. My name is Dave Vellante and I'm here with my co-host, David Floyer. Good to see you again David. VMWorld day three, wall to wall coverage. We got sets going on. 94 guests. Patrick Osborne is here, he's the Vice President of Big Data and Secondary Storage at Hewlett Packard Enterprise. Patrick, it's great to see you again. >> Always a pleasure to be on the Cube. >> Big quarter, Antonio Neri early into his tenure. >> Yes. The earnings, raise guidance, great to see that. Got to feel good. Give us the update, VMworld 2018, what's happening with you guys? >> So Q3 was bang up quarter, for all segments of the business. It was great, you know. Obviously it's the kind of earnings you want to have from a CEO in a second quarter. Steering the ship here. I think everyone's jazzed up. He's brought a lot of new life to the company, in terms of technology leadership. He's someone who's certainly grown up, from the grounds up, starting off his career at HPE. So for us who have started off as a Product Manager, an individual contributor, making your way up to CEO is definitely possible. So that's been great and I think it's favorable micro economics and we're taking advantage of that. VMworld's been awesome. I think this whole story around Multicloud and obviously we talk about hybrid IT at HPE, so it fits very well. VMware Technology, partner of the year, again. Four years running, so it's been a really good show for us. >> As last year, data protection is the single, hottest topic. Data protection, obviously Cloud, The Edge, but The Edge is kind of new and it's hot, it's sexy. But in terms of actual business that's getting done, companies that are getting funded, companies getting huge raises, throwing big parties. We saw you back to back nights at Omnia, it's a lot happening in data protection. HPE has got a whole new strategy around data protection. Maybe talk about that a little bit and how it's going. >> So it's going really well, like you said, that part of the market, it's pretty hot right now. I think there's a couple of things playing into that, certainly this new style of IT, like applied to secondary storage. We saw that with primary storage the last few years. Multicloud, the move to all flash, low-latency workloads. And then, certainly a lot of the things, in that area, are disrupting secondary storage. People want to do it different ways, they want to be able to simplify this area. It's a growing area for data, in general. They want to make that data work for them. Test, Dev, workload placement, intelligent placement of data, for secondary and even tertiary storage in the cloud. So a lot of good things happening, from an HPE perspective. >> So not just back up? >> No, not just back up. >> I want more out of my insurance policy. >> Exactly. Something in the past that was moving from purely a TCO type of conversation. My examples are always like, who likes to pay their life insurance premium, right? Because at the end of the day, I'm not going to derive any utility from that payment. So now, it's moving into more ROI. So we have things like, the Hybrid Flash Array, from Nimble, for example. It allows you to put your workloads to work. We have a great cloud service, called HPE Cloud Volumes, that we use for our customers to be able to do intelligent DR, as a service, and be able to apply Cloud compute to your data. So there's a lot of things going on, in the space, that's just outside of your traditional move data from point A to point B. Now you want to make it work for you. >> And what about the big data portfolio? You hear a lot about data. You don't hear a ton about the Big Data, Hadoop piece of the world. I know Hadoop, nobody seems to be talking about that anymore. But everybody's talking about AI, Machine-Learning, Deep-Learning. Certainly The Edge is all about data. What's the Big Data story? >> So at HPE, we're definitely focused on the whole Edge to Core analytic story. So we have a great story and you can see in the numbers from Q3, The Edge business, The Edge line servers, Aruba, driving a lot of growth in the company, where a lot of that data is being created. And then back into the Core, so for Big Data, we see a number of customers, who are using these tools to affect digital transformation. They're doing it, we're doing it to ourselves. So they're moving from batch oriented, to now fast data, so streaming analytics. And then, incorporating concepts of AI and ML to provide better service or better experience for their customers. And we're doing that with, for example, InfoSight. So we have a great product, Nimble, 3PAR. And then we provide a service, on top of that, which is a SAS based service. It has predictive analytics and Machine Learning. And we're able to do that, by using Big Data analytics. >> You're offering that as a service, as a SAS service to your customers? >> Absolutely. And the way we're able to provide those predictive analytics and be able to provide those recommendations and that Machine-Learning across a entire portfolio and be able to scale that service, because it's a service, we got tens of thousands of users using the service on a daily basis, is moving from an ERP system, data warehouse, to batch analytics, to now we're doing Elasticsearch and Kafka and all these really cool techniques, so it's really helped us unlock a lot of value for our customers. >> So, the Nimble acquisision is interesting, it's bringing that sort of Machine-Learning and AI to infrastructure. You got a lot of automation in the portfolio and you can't really talk about Cloud without talking about automations. So talk a little about automation. >> In particular, even at the show here this week, we are a premier technology partner with VMware and I think more that you see in the VMware Ecosystem is all around Cloud and automation. That's really where they're going. And we've been day-zero partners on a lot of different fronts. So VMware Cloud Foundation integration, we do things on the storage level with Vvols and SRM and all these things that allow customers to essentially program that infrastucture and get out of the mundane tasks of having to do this manually. So for us, automation is key part of our story here. Especially with VMware. >> So going a little bit further with that, what sort of examples, what benefit is this to your customers? How are they justifying putting all this in? >> It's a hybrid world, so our customers are going to expect, from us, as a portfolio vendor, the ability to provide an automated solution, on premises, as automated as what you'd get in the cloud. So for us, the ability to have a sourcing experience, that we call GreenLake, so you can buy everything from us, from a solution perspective, in a pay-as-you-go elastic model where you can flex-up, flex-down. And then being able to, essentially provide a different view, depending on what persona you're coming from. Obviously we've been focused on the infrastructure persona, more often, we're getting into the DevOps persona, the Cloud engineer persona, providing all of our infrastructure, whether it's computer networking or storage, that plugs into all these frameworks. Whether it's Ansible, Chef and all these things that we do around our automation ecosystem, it's pretty ubiquitous. >> You're touching on all the Cloud basis and you're seeing a lot of discussion around that. What are you hearing from customers? Sometimes we have to squint through this, a lot of the guys here, we always like to say, move at the speed of the CIO, which sometimes is slow. At the same time, they're all afraid they're going to get disrupted. HPE, over the last two or three years, has really brought in and partnered with some of the guys your talking about. Whether it's containers and companies that do those types of offerings. How fast do the customers actually adopting, where they adopting them, how are they handling, you talked about a hybrid world; How are they bridging the old and the new? >> That's a great question. For a lot of our customers, it's always a brown field conversation. You do have these mission critical workloads that have to run, so there's no Edge to Core without your core ERP system, right? Your Core Oracle System or for smaller customers that are running their businesses on SQL and other things. But what we're seeing is that, by shoring up that Core and we provide a set of services and products that we feel are the best in the industry for that. And then allow them to provide adjacent services on top of that, it's exactly like the same example we had with InfoSight, where those systems use to call home, right now we're taking that data, we're providing a whole ancillary set of services and functions around it and our customers are doing that. Enormous customers, like British Telecom, folks like Wayfair, for example, they're doing this on premises and their disrupting their competitors, in the mean time. >> What do you make of some of the announcements we've heard this week? Obviously VMware making a big deal with what's going on with AWS. We're seeing AWS capitulate, David Floyer you made the call. Got to have an on-prem strategy. Many said no, that'll never happen. They just want to sweep the floor. So that's a tip to the hybrid cap. What are your thoughts on what's going on there? How does HPE sort of participate in those trends? >> I'd say it's, instead of battle and capitulate, we've been very laser-focused on the customers and helping them, along their way, on the journey. So you see a lot of acquisitions we've done around services, advisory service. CTP is a perfect example. So CTP has a whole cadre of experts who understand AGER, who understand ECS and all the services and functions that go along with them And we're able to help people, right size, right place, whatever you want to call it, within their infrastructure. Because we know, we've been in business for 75+ years and have a very loyal customer base, and we're going to help them along their maturity curve and certainly everyone's not on the same path, in the same race. It's been pretty successful so far. >> You guys tend to connect the dots between your HPE Discover in U.S., in Las Vegas and HPE Discover in December. So June to December, you're on these six month cycles, U.S. focus and Europe focus, Decembers in Madrid, again. Second year of Madrid. U.S. is always Vegas, like most of these conferences, what's the cadence that your on? What was the vibe like at Discover? What should we expect leading up to Q4, calendar Q4 in Madrid? >> I'd say that Discover was a big success in Vegas, always fun to spend time here. In Madrid, you'll see a focus around the value part of our business. So we've been growing in automation, we talked about hybrid IT, certainly the Core around storage. We're really focusing and very heavily invested in, not just storage, but intelligent data management. So we really feel that our offerings, especially doubling down and offering more services around InfoSight and some of those predictive and Cloud-ready user stories for our customers is something that definitely differentiates ourselves in the market. So we'll be very focused on the data plan, the data layer and helping customers transform in that area. >> So let's talk some tenor sax. >> (David laughs) >> This is not New Orleans. When we were down in New Orleans, we were at VeeamON, I think you had your sax with you, you jumped in. >> That's right, I played with the Soul Rebels. >> Playing with the Soul Rebels, you were awesome. Leonard, a big jazz man. Love it. I'm a huge TOP fan. What's new in that world? Are you still active? Are you still playing? >> Yeah, the band's still playing. Shout out to my buddies in Jolpe, sitting in with some friends at a Dead cover band coming up, in a couple weeks. So, should be fun. We're going to reenact The Grateful Dead and Branford Marsalis. >> That's wonderful. >> It should be fun. >> We've been getting a big dose of hip-hop this week. >> Yeah. But the new thing is that, in hip-hop, it's getting back to it's original roots, so a lot of folks in the jazz world, collaborating with the folks in the hip-hop world, so not very commercial, definitely underground, but pretty cool. >> I love it. That's right Leonard, you pointing out Miles Davis was one of the first to make that transformation. >> Yeah >> Good call. >> I'm going to get the numbers wrong, but it's about five percent technique and 95 percent attitude. (multiple laughs) >> Jazz, like hip-hop, there's a lot guys just doing their own thing. And somehow it all comes together. >> Absolutely. >> Okay Patrick, great to see you. >> Great to see you guys. Thank you Dave. Yeah, good to see you guys. >> Always a pleasure, go Sox. >> We got some time for talk stocks? >> Alright. >> What do you think? It's getting a little nerve wrecking. >> #Bucky Dent is trending in my Twitter. That's my problem, so hopefully we can..., I definitely don't want to be limping into the playoffs, and still not a fan of this one team wild card playoff, but I think we'll be alright. >> If we go deep... It's a great time to be a Boston fan. >> Celtics. >> Football starting, Celtics are coming in November, so awesome. Great to see you man. >> Thanks for having me. >> Keep it right there everybody, we'll be right back with our next guest. You're watching the Cube, live. Day three at VMWorld 2018, we'll be right back. (techno music)

from Las Vegas it's the queue covering VMworld 2018 brought to you by VMware and its ecosystem partners welcome back to the Mandalay Bay in Las Vegas everybody you're watching the cube the leader and live tech coverage my name is Dave Volante I'm here with my co-host Peter Burroughs Peter great to be working with you we haven't done much this week but I'm really excited to put a great week despite that it's been a great week this day three of our wall-to-wall coverage last year at vmworld one of the biggest hottest trends was data protection same thing this year a lot of buzz a lot of hype a lot of parties Rio Barrett is here so the vice president of product marketing for the data protection division of Dell EMC welcome great to see you again great to be here brian linden is here he is the IT Directorate Melanson Heath out of Austin as well Brian thanks very much for coming on thanks for having me so Rio I mean we talked and I have talked about this yeah what's going on in data protection I mean VMworld it's not it's become the hottest topic absolutely seeing you guys some of the VC funded startups or trying to duke it out throwing big parties all right you guys got all the customers everybody wants them you're fighting like crazy cloud has now come in what's your take what's going on that's really exciting I mean data protection I started out my career in data protection you know but move forward and back in data protection is hotter than ever it's it's great and I think it has to do with the trends that are happening out in the market the big mega trends that are happening we talked about distribution you know data moving out of the data center where the four walls are no longer defining how you secure something so security recoverability are becoming really critical as you talk about edge and data moving to the edge on to cloud computing and multi cloud computing I think it's going to be one of those frontiers that the enterprise still wants to have a reign over how do I recover my data no matter where it's sitting and how do I get it back and how do I secure it so it's very exciting so Brian talked about Melanson heath set it up the company you know tax accounting Boston based in New England etc your and really want to understand the drivers in IT but start with the company please yes lesson Heath is a top-10 accounting regional accounting firm in New England we have offices in Massachusetts New Hampshire and Maine we service other clients in Vermont etc a large portion of our focus is on auditing we do a lot of misrata it's school districts town cities we also do traditional tax accounting there's been advisory the full gamut of accounting professional services you run IT yes okay what are the big drivers in your business and how are they forcing you to sort of rethink the way in which you generally approach IT but specifically approach data protection over the years we've you know we've gone from the traditional everything on premise to moving things to the cloud whether it's a SAS provider or or whatever so we really need to be able to secure our data no matter where it is whether it's in the cloud game it'll have a backup locally between our various offices etc and uptime is paramount we have deadlines that don't don't shift the IRS does not care if we have a storm or we have something wrong with our building we have our professionals have hard deadlines so I one of my tasks is to make sure that no matter what happens we have a timely backup plan and I need to be able to focus on the business and not be focusing on worrying about the backup and data protection so obviously the other part that equation is the recovery plan so really you know we this is our ninth year of the cube and at the time you know when we first started it was a lot of talk about re-architecting backup to handle the the the V blender if you will and the lack of resources now all the conversation Brian just mentioned is cloud so how are you guys - that from a product standpoint oh my god yeah this has been a big topic of conversation I think one of the areas where we really differentiated you know one of the areas that Brian is in the middle of his mid-market and we see a big propensity for an appetite for cloud from an agility standpoint from time to respond standpoint and one of the biggest trends and we heard about it at yesterday's keynote as well is cloud as a disaster recovery site especially for customers that might not have a secondary site so we recently introduced a product called the DP 4400 Brian's actually the first customer to purchase the product so in July we announced it one of the key differentiation of that product is the ease of which customers can now access cloud you know whether it's for a long term retention or cloud disaster recovery without needing any additional hardware literally it's at the fingertips you manage it exactly the way you would you can manage it directly from your VMware operational tools and have access to cloud as a secondary site whether it's for dr or long term retention so that's one of the ways for mid market customers we're really bringing that cloud and bringing it at their fingertips from a recoverability standpoint and then we've done some exciting announcements Beth was here with yang-ming talking about some of the innovations that we've been delivering in cloud whether you're a service provider whether you're a big enterprise across our portfolio so I think we have that's by far one of our key differentiations and better together stories with VMware so I'm really fascinated Brian about some of the things are doing let me let me throw a thesis at you and Andrea you've probably heard this we tend to think that there's a difference between business and digital business and that difference is the degree to which a digital business uses data as an asset in many respects if you start thinking in those terms then data protection for the new world is not just the technical data is protecting your digital business now if you think about an accounting we normally associate accounting with manual processes manual activities but there's a lot more data being generated by your clients by your by the people that are providing the services how is this relationship between data the value of your business and the value of your service is driving you to adopt these new classes of solutions for millions and Heath we are almost completely paperless so all of our data all of our work product goes through technology so we need to you know it's it's imperative that we be protected if servers go down if the site goes down our professionals don't do work and time is money so you know it first is the old thinking of having paper storage or just having local backups if there's a significant enough then we can leverage the cloud and be able to disperse our staff to places where they can sit down with a computer and do work additionally like you said we're collecting a lot more data you know our various software processes are using more machine learning to get more out of that data so having that protected as it expands is critical so increasingly the services that you're providing to your clients are themselves becoming more digital as well that's correct yes so as you think about where this ends up would you characterize yourself as especially interested in the DP 4400 and the set of services that around that as facilitating that process are you going to be able to tell a better story to your business about how they can adopt new practices offer new services etc that are more digital in nature because of this I think so I think having the DP 4400 with its cloud connections will help our our partners our principals become more comfortable with the cloud and and not not fear it they've tended to be you know a little more insular and want to see and feel and you know know that the data is there so you know being able to recover to the cloud or just use the cloud natively is going to be a game-changer for for our firm and our business just add one thing that we've talked about with Brian one of the capabilities with the DP 4400 is the instant access and restore capabilities and we're seeing more of a trend especially in secondary storage platforms much like the ones we're using with DP 4400 we're basically all your data is there right so you're doing your data for recovery your data for disaster recovery for replication is in a place and we're seeing a trend towards wanting to have flash nvme cache to be able to actually do instant access and restore not only for recoverability purposes for app tests and dev type applications and data sharing so that trend has already left the station and even in our mid tier products like DP 4400 well you know targeted specifically for commercial buyers and midsize organizations we're bringing that enterprise class capabilities and making it available to them to be able to leverage not only cloud but also on-premise and your cloud is you all cloud you some cloud you hire hybrid we do have a lot of on-premise we are migrating things over the years to the cloud and that's certainly going to be the trend and is that in effect or in part what's driving you to rethink how you approach data protection or how did that affect your data protection decisions I think having the capacity to touch all types of systems and services is is critical we need to be thinking not what we're doing now but we're gonna do any year five years from now and you know just looking back to the past five years it's a completely different IT environment so ok so I want to translate a little marketing into what it means for the customers but we agree oh when you guys announced with DP 4400 it was simply powerful was kind of attack okay so what is what are you looking for from the standpoint of simplicity and a same question on on on on power simplicity that you know the DP 4400 is a 2-u unit goes right in the rack it's not use of various interconnected components that you have to you know figure out how to connect it's one interface it's extremely simple and quick to deploy you know I have a very lean IT shop we don't have a lot of time a lot of people to be devoting hours and days and weeks to getting a deed protection environment set up our previous solutions we're much more complicated different interfaces always changing interfaces and they didn't really work well I need you know I need to be able to just set it and forget it it's it's an insurance policy is what it is you know when something goes wrong I need to know what's going to happen - from the moment that the disaster is to recognize - when our staff will be able to get back up and working okay and I the DP for 4,400 just makes that extremely simple okay so it's simple not just simpler know that right it's simple example and what about the powerful piece what is it what does that mean the power of having everything in one unit it's one interface you know giving me and my staff the power to do what we need to do without having to have a degree in data protection it's very simple to learn very simple to use it just works and a couple of the things Brian and I talked about earlier was really no one wants to impact production to do data protection write it like you said it's an insurance policy so the performance of the platform is really significant I think performance performance without compromising efficiency because at the end of the day cost is a big consideration especially for midsize organizations when they're buying a solution so I think it's really hey it's simple to use simple to deploy but it's powerful because you can get your stuff done in the you know a lot of times for data protection which is almost zero these days with the efficiency I got also saying really quickly that I would also presume that because every single document is so valuable and so essential power also relates to being able to sustain the organization of that day absolutely absolutely more you know going further into power as we was indicating is the is the performance of the backups the deduplication rate sending things over the over the network to our disaster recovery site very quickly very efficiently we can pull back you know do backups during business hours don't have to throttle it to just the overnight hours which those hours are you know off hours are getting fewer further between because in tax season in particular we have people working seven days a week all day so to send that data it's work needs to go in comp in a compact form doesn't prevent our staff from doing work whenever they want to want and need to be able to do it organizations increasingly focusing on the data data has more value means it's got to be protected in new ways bring in cloud requires new architectures games on is a big market you know thirty billion dollar plus ten when you add it all up rating it on a lot of people want it you're the leader congratulations guys all right thanks very much for coming on the cube Thanks all right keep it right there buddy the cube will be back from VMworld 2018 right after this short break [Music]

>> Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE! Covering VMworld 2018. Brought to you by VMware and its Ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back to theCUBE, I'm Lisa Martin with David Floyer, and Dave and I are here, day three, David, of our VMworld 2018 coverage, if you can believe it. We're excited to welcome to theCUBE, for the first time, a couple of gentlemen from Micron. We have Eric Caward, business development manager, and Greg Kincaid, ecosystem enablement program manager. Welcome guys. >> Thank you, good to be here. >> Thank you very much. >> So day three, you still have voices, that's impressive, your feet are doing okay? >> Yes, yeah. >> Pretty good, pretty good. >> Good, so Greg, tell us a little bit about your role and specifically what some of the new exciting announcements from Micron with respect to flash. >> So my role is to find deployments where SSDs can improve the performance significantly. Also, any case where you can have simplicity for the system administrator. So, with the new version of VMware 6.7, we've got, we've implemented, using NVMe as our cache layer, and set as our capacity layer to get tremendous performance across the spectrum of reads and writes. >> So can you give us some examples of how good that performance is? What sort of impact have you had? >> So, take for instance using NVMe as the cache layer and as data and a capacity layer, you can get small block random reads of 500,000 for a new cluster. >> That's very impressive. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. So can you make some savings in terms of the improvements in the VM density and things like that that you can achieve-- >> Absolutely, so almost all of these, well, all of the SSDs are in a two and a half form factor, and so you can get much better density per U with those kinds of SSDs, as opposed to a hard drive where you have to go to a three-inch to get that kind of density. >> So performance density, tons of data, what are some of the things in your opinion, Greg, that differentiate Micron Solution here, versus all those other guys out there? >> Well, we don't just put together a solution. We actually do considerable amount of testing, both in benchmarking, we also do a quite a bit of application testing as well. And we publish a very thorough reference architecture that's available on our website to act as a pragmatic blueprint for those who want to implement those kinds of solutions. >> Excellent, excellent. So, Eric, you're a part of the NVDIMM brigades. >> Yes. >> Tell us what is NVDIMM. Why is it important? >> Well, NVDIMM is very exciting. It's basically a memory that doesn't forget. So it's on the memory bus, it's comprised of DRAM, a controller, and NAND, and when the power is catastrophically lost, all your data is retained. >> So you go up to, what is it, 32 gigabytes on the DIMM? >> Actually, yes we're releasing our 32 gig NVDIMM in production next month, which is right around the corner. >> Wow, and and how many DIMMs can you have in a? >> You can have up to, typically in a 24 socket system, you can have up to 22 of those can be NVDIMM should you wish to. >> That's a lot of memory. >> It is a lot, and it's very, very fast. >> Very, very fast OK, so, tell us some of the changes that need to be made in order to exploit this. This is this is different, isn't it? So, can you give some examples of how you're working with the ISVs, for example? >> Certainly, certainly. From the operating system standpoint, Microsoft Windows Server 2016 supports, natively supports persistent memory. So does the Linux kernel version 4.2 and newer. Along with that, not only that, but you also have applications that are written from the ground up to support to be persistent memory aware. You have Exchange Server, you have SQL Server 2016, and with those applications they can actually access the persistent memory in byte mode, which is much faster than block mode, but you also can more legacy applications can get benefit from block mode, also. >> Wasn't, sorry Dave, I was just going to say let's dig into a customer example. I always love to hear how are these technologies, one, being co-developed as in collaboration with the end-users, right? And two, how are you seeing them in the, in the field actually helping customers transform their businesses from the inside out? >> Well, so one example that comes to mind, actually VMware just did a study with Oracle licensing, and they took a 12 core solution, and they put the redo log onto traditional storage, and they were able to get a certain amount of performance. Let's just call it a hundred units of performance. They did the same thing with the same workload, but they only used nine cores. So, that's actually a reduction in 25% course, but because the redo log was actually put on persistent memory, which again you're accessing that storage at DRAM like speeds, it kept the CPU much, much more busy, much more active, and they actually saw about a 2% increase in performance, but because the licensing costs are tied to your core count; actually, you could potentially save on licensing cost, even though you purchased a NVDIMM to have faster persistent storage. >> What about other benefits like to a data center in terms of energy efficiency? One of the things that Pat Gelsinger said on Monday was that VMware and their Green Charter, if you will, has saved 540 million, I think, tons of CO2 emissions. What I'm hearing Eric, what you're saying, are customers seeing pretty significant like power savings, and that were like roll into cost savings with the performance in this speed that you're able to deliver? >> Yes, if you look at it one of the other use cases for the NVDIMM, persistent memory, is that they used to NAND storage to write these logs, but because of the endurance, it ends up that they would have to replace the SSDs on a three month cadence. Because of the NVDIMM, the endurance it has just natively comes with DRAM, they were able to replace the SSDs with the NVDIMM, and then continue to use that for many, many quarters. >> It's a big cost savings. >> Definitely. >> So, can I go back to the what we were talking about before in terms of implementation of this? >> Yes. >> So, what's necessary? You need the software, the ISV software. You obviously need the Micron and the DIMM. >> That is correct. >> Anything else that you need? >> Yes, the actual, the hardware that you have to have, you have to have, not necessarily a specific CPU, but if you have to have the BIOS that basically goes in and is aware of NVDIMM. >> Right. >> And, one of the reasons why is when a system boots up, that supports NVDIMM, it goes out and looks and sees, is there a valid image set to true? If so, it will load that image from the NAND, through the controller, into the DRAM. Then when it's completed, it will go on to booting up the OS. The OS is none the wiser that that data wasn't sitting in DRAM the entire time, but as you can see if your, if your bios support isn't there from the start with that, that process would never happen. >> But, you can have that BIOS is available on most, most system. >> On multiple, multiple OEM systems. Yes, that is supported. >> Great. So, that there's no requirement for anything special with other than that? >> Other than that, correct. >> That's amazing. So, you've got a pretty, are you going through other ISVs as well? Are you. >> Yes, there are multiple ISVs that we're working with to enable that, basically the performance benefit and the endurance and the low latency of NVDIMMs. >> And people like SAP, for example? >> Yes. >> Perfect. Okay, that's very excited, very, very exciting indeed. Are you doing the same thing with your, class? >> Yes, we actually work with many partners. We work with not just Vmware, but all of the enterprise partners. We do case studies, and we do cost analysis as well. So, for instance we found that if you statistically, strategically add an SSD to a 200 node cluster for Hadoop, you can get the same performance there that if you had added 80 additional nodes for the entire cluster. So, that's quite a bit of a savings of 80 nodes versus an additional 200 NVMe SSDs. >> Yeah, that's great. >> What's some of the feedback on these new advancements that you're hearing from some of the people that are coming by to visit the Micron booth here at VMworld? >> Well, I think people are a little surprised that we are so focused on systems, and making sure that they work on the performance with SSDs. I think people, sometimes they think of Micron in the early days when we were just simply a commodities broker with DRAM, but we're much, much more than that. >> So, customers are reacting to what sounds like an evolution of Micron? >> Absolutely, absolutely. >> Eric, what are some of your-- >> And to be honest, my favorite is when people come by, and they look at the numbers, and they're just like oh my gosh. (laughing) The performance is really outstanding when you look at an NVDIMM, and it's just, it's simply because it is DRAM acting as a storage device. It's sitting on the memory bus. It's sitting on the memory channel, right next to the CPU. The latency is absolutely fantastic. There are certain workloads that are really, really gain a lot of benefit by low latency for quality of service. Then you have just the raw bandwidth, and this is only with two NVDIMMs in this particular demo system. We could have, excuse me, we could have gone up to six in a CPU. So, we could have tripled our performance just with one CPU on one node. So, it's pretty exciting when when the people that are coming in the booth, they get excited too. It makes, it makes this show really fun. >> I think people also don't understand that there's more than one kind of SSD, and we just announced that QLC, a NAND based SSD, that for write once read many could actually supplant many of the hard drives that are used in secondary storage or archives. >> So, it also must be kind of fun to educate people on, hey guess what? There's not just different flavors, but look what Micron is doing. >> Right. >> Evolving our technologies and enabling them to you know, learn about things that they didn't know about. I imagine that must also be a pretty cool. >> I'm working with a software developers as well, so closely, so this is exciting. >> I mean the applications are just innumerable. I mean we're working with artificial intelligence. We're working on machine learning. Applications are other than just the standard database that most people think of accelerating with SSDs. >> Excellent. >> And, to be honest, I'm very passionate about technology, just, I love to geek out, if you will. >> I can tell. >> And, I love seeing the light bulbs come on in people that I'm talking about. It's just very rewarding. >> So we're gone, more than halfway through 2018, scary. September 1st is Saturday. (laughing) So, going towards the end of the of the calendar year, this excitement that I'm getting from both of you, what are you excited about Micron, you know going into early part of 2019, being able to surprise and delight your customers with? >> All right. >> Well, we're going to continue to, to do all of the performance testings that were done. We're going to, as we bring new SSDs to the market, we're going to continue to add tuning advice, and detailed deployment instructions for our customers. We're going continue to partner with the major players to make sure that our SSDs, their performance and their applications. >> And I think with the fact that we're releasing our 32 gig NVDIMM, actually in September. The ecosystem, as it solidifies, it becomes more robust. There's just going to be use cases that our engineers and our team haven't thought of yet. And, so it's going to be really exciting to see what new use cases are out there for super, very fast NVDIMMs. >> Well guys, thanks so much for stopping by and talking with David and me about-- >> Thanks for having us. >> The evolution of Micron, and the excitement that you get from from hearing that validation in the field, and we look forward to hearing what's coming out shortly. So, we'll have to have you back on. >> Sounds great, thanks Lisa, thanks David. >> Love to be back. >> Excellent. Greg, Eric, thanks for your time. For David Floyer my co-host, I'm Lisa Martin, you're watching theCUBE, live from Vmworld 2018. Stick around, we'll be right back with our next guests. (electronic music)

>> (Announcer) Live, from Las Vegas it's the Cube. Covering VM World 2018. Brought to you by VM Ware and it's ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back to the Cube's continuing coverage of VM World 2018, I'm Lisa Marin, with Dave Vellante >> Hey, Lisa. >> Dave, day three, we have had tremendous guests the last couple of days. And we're- a lot of alumni, a lot of new guests, another alumni joining us, Calline Sanchez, vice president of IMB Enterprise System Storage. Welcome back, Calline, it's great to have you here. >> No, thank you very much for letting me be here. >> And I want to congratulate Calline, because she was just named for the Tucson Hispanic Chamber of Commerce, 2018 Businesswoman of the Year. Just a few weeks ago. Amazing. >> Lovin' Tucson, by the way. >> Thank you. >> U of A. >> Yes. >> Bear Down. >> I appreciate the Wildcats reference, so, >> Haha. >> No doubt. And so, this Saturday, oh, I'm sorry. This Saturday, the first game, so- >> My daughter is a freshman at U of A, Hi, Pilar, I love you, baby. Good luck. You're going to crush it, I know you are. >> Haha. >> Dad of the year going on here. So, just before we get into all the storage stuff- >> Yeah. >> They're doing a, they're honoring you, just in about a month and a half or so, with this- >> Yeah. Yes, and I'm very excited about that. Just like you were saying with the community aspect, it's a high-touch award, and I was very thankful for it, because they gave me specific examples of, what I've done in Southern Arizona, in Tucson in particular, that they'll name. For instance, Excite for Girls, and things like that. >> That's awesome. >> Girls in STEM, right? >> Congratulations, that's fantastic. >> We need more inspiration, so, it's great that we, >> Ah, thank you. >> Now count you as one of our distinguished alumni. So, let's talk about what going on at IMB. Here we are at VM World 2018, we're hearing Dave, numbers of upwards of 21,000 people that have been here the last few days. 100,000 more engaging with, expecting to engage with the live streaming and the on demand experiences. What's going on with IBM, you know, from a revenue perspective, a growth perspective? What is exciting you about where you are today? >> So, I will talk in particular about storage. I'm really, really proud about this, being that we work in partnership with, like, Ed Walsh, and then also Eric Herzog. They've inspired me to get closer to building solutions with our end users. So we meet and work with our clients to build up cloud deployment solutions, in partnership with VM Ware, and we enable things like, okay, so there's tape, and then there's cloud-to-tier, so there's fundamental solutions out there in the marketplace that we as developers want to go and play with. It's almost like a great big sandbox. So to speak. >> So, I've got to ask you, because, I mean, everybody in storage says, well, Tape, tape is dead. And every time I see you we talk about tape. We talk about FLAPE. We talk about innovations that are coming to tape. You're a technologist. Right, you just said, as a developer we love to- dot-dot-dot. So, what is it about things like tape, things like mainframe, DS8000, these technologies that have, tried, true, running businesses, what is about those that excite you as a developer? >> Everything old is new again, >> Yeah, right. >> If we just go back to the basics of like, table stakes, right? Security is table stakes, right? Delivering on-time quality releases with optimizers like, tier-to-cloud, things like that. That's fundamental for us. Now, as it relates to tape, so, everything old is new again, like I mentioned a moment ago. Tape was the first device to fully encrypt. So every drive, if it fell off the truck, it was fully encrypted. So, tape is actually training the rest of our portfolio in similar skills, on how we do the end-to-end encryption elements. So, right now with DS8000, we're working in partnership with system Z, to deliver pervasive encryption. >> I got to ask you, so as a development executive, I see you at a lot of these shows. You like coming here? A lot of times, development execs want to, sort of, stay in the lab. But you're out and about, talking to customers. What are you learning? What is that about you that draws you to these shows? >> I was afraid that WE as a lab team would not be relevant unless we have conversations with end users, partners. You know, to really substantiate what's possible from being innovative. So, I would say, number one is relevance, and I felt like, I wanted to more social, because, I'm definitely in some cases, an introvert, though I'm looking above my shoes. That's I'm wearing- >> That's the definition, of an introvert and an extrovert in the tech world. You know that the difference is, right? >> I don't. >> An introvert looks at his or her own shoes, an extrovert looks at your shoes. >> Well, there you go. I've been looking at some shoes- >> Alright, so you're, you're extrovert oriented out here, what are you learning at VM World? what are the customers saying? What are they asking you for? What are you going to take back to the lab? >> A single pane of glass associated with what we intend with like, v-stream, or some of the aspects of automation, with regards to cloud deployment, to make it, like, completely- connected. If that, so to speak. And what I think is really great about all of that is I hate to put it this way, it's very iTunes like. Where it's like, sticky, and it's easy to use, or and, by the way, it's not so expensive, at least to start up. So, a lot of the discussions we've been having are with the various vendors on the expo floor, that they want to build solutions. IBM solutions associate with the cloud, and then the AWS guys, we meet with them. And they're like, well, how are, how can we ensure that we live in an interconnected data-centric world? And so that's what I think is very exciting is that, it's this idea of coopetition. Let's all be well connected, and do it well. >> Let's talk about the customer collaboration, as you mentioned, everything old is new again, we see that, in every aspect of life. Tape, mainframe, but you talked about we need to be relevant, but also need to developing solutions that you end user customers need to solve their business problems. How are you collaborating with customers to stay relevant, and to ensure that their businesses are able to take advantage of the super powers that Pat Gelsinger talked about on Monday, AI, machine learning, emerging technologies, what's that collaboration like? >> I would say the biggest collaborations that I've been participating recently is with cloud servers providers. And they appreciate the economics of physical media, or tape. And so, they think to themselves or they know the data, it's like, okay, less than a half-cent per gig, that's a big deal, right? So, and then we have discussions about total cost of ownership, aspects like that. So the partnership is also, how do we serve the data? And really having discussions about the data. And then, if evaluating the various work streams where, we would want to serve appropriately based on whatever specific cloud infrastructure. And then, also, taking a step back, we have to be interconnected. There's no question. So, I would say the number one set of skills our end users are working with right now happen to be the cloud service providers. >> What are some of the big business benefits that they're achieving, we think, new business models, new revenue streams, market expansion. What are some of the things that you're proud of that IBM storage solutions are helping your customers to deliver? >> Going to tape, it's the economics, yes. It's the security based on encryption, yes. And then also, the other aspect of, is, we're serving big data. I mean, it's like we're having discussions about they're going to grow to, zettabytes by 2020, things like that. I never thought in my life, especially as an engineering student, or in computer science, I would ever be talking about this big of data. And now we're here. And so, we're learning how to enable in partnership with clients, what would be the right, or appropriate solution. >> So, I'm searching our video library, because somebody said this week something that was really interesting to me and I wanted to get your perspective from a development mind, someone who's technical. We're hearing a lot about migrating to the cloud. And how easy that is. And then, I think it was Pat Gelsinger said, there's three laws. There's the law of physics, the laws of a company, and the law of the land. And, those are immutable, generally. But I want to ask you about the laws of physics. So, in terms of just moving data into the cloud, we talk about petabyte, exabytes, there's so much data. How feasible is it for a customer to move data, and just stuff it all into the cloud, and what are you doing to either help them do that, or bring the cloud experience to their data? >> Depending on the client interests of on-prem, off-prem, or hybrid, right? We work to evaluate APIs in collaborations, so we enable a streamline, so it's not only just understanding the components of the cloud deployment, but it's also partnering with all elements of the entire ecosystem's stack. So, it depends but we really start with the client's end use case. What do you want? What kind of security do you want? Are you okay with off-prem, public clouds? Or, maybe it's specific data, how do we go about managing the data so we secure it, like, we bucket-ize it. So those are some of the discussions we've been having on the floor, here, at VM world, but also, within our labs, and also with the clients directly. >> You know what I love about that answer? I'll translate it. It's not a biz- it's not a technical problem, Dave, it's a business problem, >> Yes. >> Is really what you're tell me. >> And that's a fundament- you asked the question before. That's fundamentally why I am here. >> Right. >> I don't believe we can live in this world anymore, where it's like, we build it, and then they come. >> Field of Dreams does not exist anymore. >> Yeah. And so, now we've got to have conversations with our end users, to develop, what we've going to put on the roadmap. And so I always felt like, okay, well, when I'd see the roadmap in the lab, I'm like, okay, well, who wants this? Who asked for this, right? And those ended up becoming some of my fundamental questions. So then, I started to come here, or conferences like this, because I could have those conversations with the end users and partners. >> That's interesting, who wants this? Who needs this? What problems does it solve? Why us, why now? Those are the kinds of things you're asking. >> Let's talk about why us? IBM has been around for a very long time. What do you think, again, in this got to be relevant, we need it to be really defined by customer needs and uses. Everything old is new again. What, in your opinion, makes, why should a customer go, in my VM environment, IBM. >> I'm going to start with why I even personally want to remain with IBM. It's a great big candy store. >> Haha. >> And what I have to remind myself is, just don't eat too much, right? And, by the way, I still eat way too much. But what's great about it is, it's a sandbox, so, I can talk to you software engineers one day, who are telling me about certain APIs they're building in Python. Then, oh, by the way, I meet with a mechanical set of engineers, cuz they want to enable robot arms. Oh, and by the way, should we have a discussion on microcode and firmware for the entire stack. So I take a step back, and I'm thinking, Wow- the only set of conversation I really prior was not having, is about services. And to me, services is like the wrapping paper, for a present that you're about to receive. And really understanding the overall, end-to-end stack infrastructure. So, I believe from an IBM perspective, it's the ecosystem. It's a great big candy store. Just don't eat too much. >> Haha. So, how do you spend your time? Do you spend your time thinking, collaborating with team on, architecture, on, vision, on, northstar, writing code. How do you spend your time day-to-day? >> Can I say, all of the above? And, the vast majority, right now, really just making sure we're relevant in the marketplace, so that we re-fresh the right amount of cycles. So, right now, what we're going to be doing in 2019, we're going to be talking about it right now. Architecting what the future looks like. And that's part of the reason why I'm here at VM World 2018, is I'm wanting to verify my roadmap. Am I taking the right approach with the extended team? Cuz it is team, and I work with them. These engineers and scientists are so right, and have great ideas. Let's just make sure they're great ideas that will keep us relevant and keep us paid. >> So, have you gotten that validation, in the last few days at VM World? >> Give me one more day. >> Haha. Well, Calline, thanks so much for stopping by and sharing. Not only what IBM is doing to continue to innovate and stay relevant, but also what's exciting to you- >> Yeah. >> About working for IBM, and again, Congrats on getting the award. >> Yes, and thank you very much for highlighting that, cuz it's, I'm very excited as just an individual, it's like, it was unexpected. >> Well, you're representing women in tech, women in STEM, it's awesome, congratulations. >> Thank you very much. >> We're really happy. >> And, by the way, I'll definitely reach out to your daughter at some point. >> Oh, great. >> Say, hey, let's go to a tailgate. >> Love it. >> I won't corrupt. >> Haha. Fantastic, Calline, thank you so much for your time. I'm Lisa Martin with Dave Vellante. We want to thank you for watching the Cube, we are in day three of our continue coverage from VM World 2018. Stick around, we'll be right back with our next guest.