(bright music) >> Okay, we're back in theCUBE. We said we were signing off for the night, but during the hallway track, we ran into old friend Stu Miniman who was the Director of Market Insights at Red Hat. Stu, friend of theCUBE done the thousands of CUBE interviews. >> Dave, it's great to be here. Thanks for pulling me on, you and I hosted Red Hat Summit before. It's great to see Paul here. I was actually, I was talking to some of the Red Hatters walking around Boston. It's great to have an event here. Boston's got strong presence and I understand, I think was either first or second year, they had it over... What's the building they're tearing down right down the road here. Was that the World Trade Center? I think that's where they actually held it, the first time they were here. We hosted theCUBE >> So they moved up. >> at the Hines Convention Center. We did theCUBE for summit at the BCEC next door. And of course, with the pandemic being what it was, we're a little smaller, nice intimate event here. It's great to be able to room the hall, see a whole bunch of people and lots watching online. >> It's great, it's around the same size as those, remember those Vertica Big Data events that we used to have here. And I like that you were commenting out at the theater and the around this morning for the keynotes, that was good. And the keynotes being compressed, I think, is real value for the attendees, you know? 'Cause people come to these events, they want to see each other, you know? They want to... It's like the band getting back together. And so when you're stuck in the keynote room, it's like, "Oh, it's okay, it's time to go." >> I don't know that any of us used to sitting at home where I could just click to another tab or pause it or run for, do something for the family, or a quick bio break. It's the three-hour keynote I hope has been retired. >> But it's an interesting point though, that the virtual event really is driving the physical and this, the way Red Hat marketed this event was very much around the virtual attendee. Physical was almost an afterthought, so. >> Right, this is an invite only for in-person. So you're absolutely right. It's optimizing the things that are being streamed, the online audience is the big audience. And we just happy to be in here to clap and do some things see around what you're doing. >> Wonderful see that becoming the norm. >> I think like virtual Stu, you know this well when virtual first came in, nobody had a clue with what they were doing. It was really hard. They tried different things, they tried to take the physical and just jam it into the virtual. That didn't work, they tried doing fun things. They would bring in a famous person or a comedian. And that kind of worked, I guess, but everybody showed up for that and then left. And I think they're trying to figure it out what this hybrid thing is. I've seen it both ways. I've seen situations like this, where they're really sensitive to the virtual. I've seen others where that's the FOMO of the physical, people want physical. So, yeah, I think it depends. I mean, reinvent last year was heavy physical. >> Yeah, with 15,000 people there. >> Pretty long keynotes, you know? So maybe Amazon can get away with it, but I think most companies aren't going to be able to. So what is the market telling you? What are these insights? >> So Dave just talking about Amazon, obviously, the world I live in cloud and that discussion of cloud, the journey that customers are going on is where we're spending a lot of the discussions. So, it was great to hear in the keynote, talked about our deep partnerships with the cloud providers and what we're doing to help people with, you like to call it super cloud, some call it hybrid, or multi-cloud... >> New name. (crosstalk) Meta-Cloud, come on. >> All right, you know if Che's my executive, so it's wonderful. >> Love it. >> But we'll see, if I could put on my VR Goggles and that will help me move things. But I love like the partnership announcement with General Motors today because not every company has the needs of software driven electric vehicles all over the place. But the technology that we build for them actually has ramifications everywhere. We've working to take Kubernetes and make it smaller over time. So things that we do at the edge benefit the cloud, benefit what we do in the data center, it's that advancement of science and technology just lifts all boats. >> So what's your take on all this? The EV and software on wheels. I mean, Tesla obviously has a huge lead. It's kind of like the Amazon of vehicles, right? It's sort of inspired a whole new wave of innovation. Now you've got every automobile manufacturer kind of go and after. That is the future of vehicles is something you followed or something you have an opinion on Stu? >> Absolutely. It's driving innovation in some ways, the way the DOS drove innovation on the desktop, if you remember the 64K DOS limit, for years, that was... The software developers came up with some amazing ways to work within that 64K limit. Then when it was gone, we got bloatware, but it actually does enforce a level of discipline on you to try to figure out how to make software run better, run more efficiently. And that has upstream impacts on the enterprise products. >> Well, right. So following your analogy, you talk about the enablement to the desktop, Linux was a huge influence on allowing the individual person to write code and write software, and what's happening in the EV, it's software platform. All of these innovations that we're seeing across industries, it's how is software transforming things. We go back to the mark end reasons, software's eating the world, open source is the way that software is developed. Who's at the intersection of all those? We think we have a nice part to play in that. I loved tha- Dave, I don't know if you caught at the end of the keynote, Matt Hicks basically said, "Our mission isn't just to write enterprise software. "Our mission is based off of open source because open source unlocks innovation for the world." And that's one of the things that drew me to Red Hat, it's not just tech in good places, but allowing underrepresented, different countries to participate in what's happening with software. And we can all move that ball forward. >> Well, can we declare victory for open source because it's not just open source products, but everything that's developed today, whether proprietary or open has open source in it. >> Paul, I agree. Open source is the development model period, today. Are there some places that there's proprietary? Absolutely. But I had a discussion with Deepak Singh who's been on theCUBE many times. He said like, our default is, we start with open source code. I mean, even Amazon when you start talking about that. >> I said this, the $70 billion business on open source. >> Exactly. >> Necessarily give it back, but that say, Hey, this is... All's fair in tech and more. >> It is interesting how the managed service model has sort of rescued open source, open source companies, that were trying to do the Red Hat model. No one's ever really successfully duplicated the Red Hat model. A lot of companies were floundering and failing. And then the managed service option came along. And so now they're all cloud service providers. >> So the only thing I'd say is that there are some other peers we have in the industry that are built off open source they're doing okay. The recent example, GitLab and Hashicorp, both went public. Hashi is doing some managed services, but it's not the majority of their product. Look at a company like Mongo, they've heavily pivoted toward the managed service. It is where we see the largest growth in our area. The products that we have again with Amazon, with Microsoft, huge growth, lots of interest. It's one of the things I spend most of my time talking on. >> I think Databricks is another interesting example 'cause Cloudera was the now company and they had the sort of open core, and then they had the proprietary piece, and they've obviously didn't work. Databricks when they developed Spark out of Berkeley, everybody thought they were going to do kind of a similar model. Instead, they went for all in managed services. And it's really worked well, I think they were ahead of that curve and you're seeing it now is it's what customers want. >> Well, I mean, Dave, you cover the database market pretty heavily. How many different open source database options are there today? And that's one of the things we're solving. When you look at what is Red Hat doing in the cloud? Okay, I've got lots of databases. Well, we have something called, it's Red Hat Open Database Access, which is from a developer, I don't want to have to think about, I've got six different databases, which one, where's the repository? How does all that happen? We give that consistency, it's tied into OpenShift, so it can help abstract some of those pieces. we've got same Kafka streaming and we've got APIs. So it's frameworks and enablers to help bridge that gap between the complexity that's out there, in the cloud and for the developer tool chain. >> That's really important role you guys play though because you had this proliferation, you mentioned Mongo. So many others, Presto and Starbursts, et cetera, so many other open source options out there now. And companies, developers want to work with multiple databases within the same application. And you have a role in making that easy. >> Yeah, so and that is, if you talk about the question I get all the time is, what's next for Kubernetes? Dave, you and I did a preview for KubeCon and it's automation and simplicity that we need to be. It's not enough to just say, "Hey, we've got APIs." It's like Dave, we used to say, "We've got standards? Great." Everybody's implementation was a little bit different. So we have API Sprawl today. So it's building that ecosystem. You've been talking to a number of our partners. We are very active in the community and trying to do things that can lift up the community, help the developers, help that cloud native ecosystem, help our customers move faster. >> Yeah API's better than scripts, but they got to be managed, right? So, and that's really what you guys are doing that's different. You're not trying to own everything, right? It's sort of antithetical to how billions and trillions are made in the IT industry. >> I remember a few years ago we talked here, and you look at the size that Red Hat is. And the question is, could Red Hat have monetized more if the model was a little different? It's like, well maybe, but that's not the why. I love that they actually had Simon Sinek come in and work with Red Hat and that open, unlocks the world. Like that's the core, it's the why. When I join, they're like, here's a book of Red Hat, you can get it online and that why of what we do, so we never have to think of how do we get there. We did an acquisition in the security space a year ago, StackRox, took us a year, it's open source. Stackrox.io, it's community driven, open source project there because we could have said, "Oh, well, yeah, it's kind of open source and there's pieces that are open source, but we want it to be fully open source." You just talked to Gunnar about how he's RHEL nine, based off CentOS stream, and now developing out in the open with that model, so. >> Well, you were always a big fan of Whitehurst culture book, right? It makes a difference. >> The open organization and right, Red Hat? That culture is special. It's definitely interesting. So first of all, most companies are built with the hierarchy in mind. Had a friend of mine that when he joined Red Hat, he's like, I don't understand, it's almost like you have like lots of individual contractors, all doing their things 'cause Red Hat works on thousands of projects. But I remember talking to Rackspace years ago when OpenStack was a thing and they're like, "How do you figure out what to work on?" "Oh, well we hired great people and they work on what's important to them." And I'm like, "That doesn't sound like a business." And he is like, "Well, we struggle sometimes to that balance." Red Hat has found that balance because we work on a lot of different projects and there are people inside Red Hat that are, you know, they care more about the project than they do the business, but there's the overall view as to where we participate and where we productize because we're not creating IP because it's all an open source. So it's the monetizations, the relationships we have our customers, the ecosystems that we build. And so that is special. And I'll tell you that my line has been Red Hat on the inside is even more Red Hat. The debates and the discussions are brutal. I mean, technical people tearing things apart, questioning things and you can't be thin skinned. And the other thing is, what's great is new people. I've talked to so many people that started at Red Hat as interns and will stay for seven, eight years. And they come there and they have as much of a seat at the table, and when I talk to new people, your job, is if you don't understand something or you think we might be able to do it differently, you better speak up because we want your opinion and we'll take that, everybody takes that into consideration. It's not like, does the decision go all the way up to this executive? And it's like, no, it's done more at the team. >> The cultural contrast between that and your parent, IBM, couldn't be more dramatic. And we talked earlier with Paul Cormier about has IBM really walked the walk when it comes to leaving Red Hat alone. Naturally he said, "Yes." Well what's your perspective. >> Yeah, are there some big blue people across the street or something I heard that did this event, but look, do we interact with IBM? Of course. One of the reasons that IBM and IBM Services, both products and services should be able to help get us breadth in the marketplace. There are times that we go arm and arm into customer meetings and there are times that customers tell us, "I like Red Hat, I don't like IBM." And there's other ones that have been like, "Well, I'm a long time IBM, I'm not sure about Red Hat." And we have to be able to meet all of those customers where they are. But from my standpoint, I've got a Red Hat badge, I've got a Red Hat email, I've got Red Hat benefits. So we are fiercely independent. And you know, Paul, we've done blogs and there's lots of articles been written is, Red Hat will stay Red Hat. I didn't happen to catch Arvin I know was on CNBC today and talking at their event, but I'm sure Red Hat got mentioned, but... >> Well, he talks about Red Hat all time. >> But in his call he's talking backwards. >> It's interesting that he's not here, greeting this audience, right? It's again, almost by design, right? >> But maybe that's supposed to be... >> Hundreds of yards away. >> And one of the questions being in the cloud group is I'm not out pitching IBM Cloud, you know? If a customer comes to me and asks about, we have a deep partnership and IBM will be happy to tell you about our integrations, as opposed to, I'm happy to go into a deep discussion of what we're doing with Google, Amazon, and Microsoft. So that's how we do it. It's very different Dave, from you and I watch really closely the VMware-EMC, VMware-Dell, and how that relationship. This one is different. We are owned by IBM, but we mostly, it does IBM fund initiatives and have certain strategic things that are done, absolutely. But we maintain Red Hat. >> But there are similarities. I mean, VMware crowd didn't want to talk about EMC, but they had to, they were kind of forced to. Whereas, you're not being forced to. >> And then once Dell came in there, it was joint product development. >> I always thought a spin in. Would've been the more effective, of course, Michael Dell and Egon wouldn't have gotten their $40 billion out. But I think a spin in was more natural based on where they were going. And it would've been, I think, a more dominant position in the marketplace. They would've had more software, but again, financially it wouldn't have made as much sense, but that whole dynamic is different. I mean, but people said they were going to look at VMware as a model and it's been largely different because remember, VMware of course was a separate company, now is a fully separate company. Red Hat was integrated, we thought, okay, are they going to get blue washed? We're watching and watching, and watching, you had said, well, if the Red Hat culture isn't permeating IBM, then it's a failure. And I don't know if that's happening, but it's definitely... >> I think a long time for that. >> It's definitely been preserved. >> I mean, Dave, I know I read one article at the beginning of the year is, can Arvin make IBM, Microsoft Junior? Follow the same turnaround that Satya Nadella drove over there. IBM I think making some progress, I mean, I read and watch what you and the team are all writing about it. And I'll withhold judgment on IBM. Obviously, there's certain financial things that we'd love to see IBM succeed. We worry about our business. We do our thing and IBM shares our results and they've been solid, so. >> Microsoft had such massive cash flow that even bomber couldn't screw it up. Well, I mean, this is true, right? I mean, you think about how were relevant Microsoft was in the conversation during his tenure and yet they never got really... They maintained a position so that when the Nadella came in, they were able to reascend and now are becoming that dominant player. I mean, IBM just doesn't have that cash flow and that luxury, but I mean, if he pulls it off, he'll be the CEO of the decade. >> You mentioned partners earlier, big concern when the acquisition was first announced, was that the Dells and the HP's and the such wouldn't want to work with Red Hat anymore, you've sort of been here through that transition. Is that an issue? >> Not that I've seen, no. I mean, the hardware suppliers, the ISVs, the GSIs are all very important. It was great to see, I think you had Accenture on theCUBE today, obviously very important partner as we go to the cloud. IBM's another important partner, not only for IBM Cloud, but IBM Services, deep partnership with Azure and AWS. So those partners and from a technology standpoint, the cloud native ecosystem, we talked about, it's not just a Red Hat product. I constantly have to talk about, look, we have a lot of pieces, but your developers are going to have other tools that they're going to use and the security space. There is no such thing as a silver bullet. So I've been having some great conversations here already this week with some of our partners that are helping us to round out that whole solution, help our customers because it has to be, it's an ecosystem. And we're one of the drivers to help that move forward. >> Well, I mean, we were at Dell Tech World last week, and there's a lot of talk about DevSecOps and DevOps and Dell being more developer friendly. Obviously they got a long way to go, but you can't have that take that posture and not have a relationship with Red Hat. If all you got is Pivotal and VMware, and Tansu >> I was thrilled to hear the OpenShift mention in the keynote when they talked about what they were doing. >> How could you not, how could you have any credibility if you're just like, Oh, Pivotal, Pivotal, Pivotal, Tansu, Tansu. Tansu is doing its thing. And they smart strategy. >> VMware is also a partner of ours, but that we would hope that with VMware being independent, that does open the door for us to do more with them. >> Yeah, because you guys have had a weird relationship with them, under ownership of EMC and then Dell, right? And then the whole IBM thing. But it's just a different world now. Ecosystems are forming and reforming, and Dell's building out its own cloud and it's got to have... Look at Amazon, I wrote about this. I said, "Can you envision the day where Dell actually offers competitive products in its suite, in its service offering?" I mean, it's hard to see, they're not there yet. They're not even close. And they have this high say/do ratio, or really it's a low say/do, they say high say/do, but look at what they did with Nutanix. You look over- (chuckles) would tell if it's the Cisco relationship. So it's got to get better at that. And it will, I really do believe. That's new thinking and same thing with HPE. And, I don't know about Lenovo that not as much of an ecosystem play, but certainly Dell and HPE. >> Absolutely. Michael Dell would always love to poke at HPE and HP really went very far down the path of their own products. They went away from their services organization that used to be more like IBM, that would offer lots of different offerings and very much, it was HP Invent. Well, if we didn't invent it, you're not getting it from us. So Dell, we'll see, as you said, the ecosystems are definitely forming, converging and going in lots of different directions. >> But your position is, Hey, we're here, we're here to help. >> Yeah, we're here. We have customers, one of the best proof points I have is the solution that we have with Amazon. Amazon doesn't do the engineering work to make us a native offering if they didn't have the customer demand because Amazon's driven off of data. So they came to us, they worked with us. It's a lot of work to be able to make that happen, but you want to make it frictionless for customers so that they can adopt that. That's a long path. >> All right, so evening event, there's a customer event this evening upstairs in the lobby. Microsoft is having a little shin dig, and then serves a lot of customer dinners going on. So Stu, we'll see you out there tonight. >> All right, thanks you. >> Were watching a brewing somewhere. >> Keynotes tomorrow, a lot of good sessions and enablement, and yeah, it's great to be in person to be able to bump some people, meet some people and, Hey, I'm still a year and a half in still meeting a lot of my peers in person for the first time. >> Yeah, and that's kind of weird, isn't it? Imagine. And then we kick off tomorrow at 10:00 AM. Actually, Stephanie Chiras is coming on. There she is in the background. She's always a great guest and maybe do a little kickoff and have some fun tomorrow. So this is Dave Vellante for Stu Miniman, Paul Gillin, who's my co-host. You're watching theCUBEs coverage of Red Hat Summit 2022. We'll see you tomorrow. (bright music)

from around the globe it's the cube with digital coverage of Red Hat summit 2020 brought to you by Red Hat hi I'm Stu min a man and this is the cubes coverage of Red Hat summit 2020 of course this year the event is happening all online and that gives us an opportunity to meet with red hat executives customers partners and practitioners where they are around the globe in this segment one of our favorites ever years we're talking to the women in open source and joining me for this segment first of all we have Elissa and Alexander who is the executive vice president and chief people officer of Red Hat this award fit thunder her domain dallisa it is great to see you again thanks so much for joining us thank you so much for having us all right and we have two of the Award winners so first if you see right next bit Elissa we have an epic Sain who's a doctor and PhD candidate in clinical neuroscience at the University of Gothenburg coming to us from Sweden method great to see you thank you very much all right we also have Megan Burge Sinicki who is a manager of research and operations at the open source program office at Google Megan thank you so much for joining us off though thanks for having me all right so dallisa let me hand it off to you is give our audience a little bit if they're not familiar with whipping an open source what the initiative is the community and you know what might have changed from previous years when we've talked about this sure so we realized that the tech industry is a great industry for diverse populations but a lot of diverse populations don't realize that and so as the open source leader we wanted to shine a light on the contributions that some of our underrepresented populations are making an open source that trying to inspire more people to join communities to participate to contribute we know that more diverse populations help us to innovate more rapidly they help us to solve more problems and so it's really important especially today with what's happening in the world lots of important problems to solve that we really invite more of our other upper sort of populations to join in the communities awesome so absolutely there there are lots of people that volunteer there are lots of people that do it as their day job Megan why don't we fuck you have a roll open source first Google as a strong legacy and open source in general so tell us a little bit about you know what you were working on and what you're being recognized for here yeah well a lot of the recognition comes from my work with the Drupal Association I had been with Drupal for 8 years hoping to build that foundation in supporting that community and lots of different ways from fundraising to community events running sprints and helping with their developer tools and so that was a lot what the award was based on and now I'm at Google and I've been here for about a year and a half and I run their research and operations and so Google is an expression of open source and we have thousands of people using thousands of projects and we want to make sure they do it well they feel supported that we are good citizens in the projects that we participate in and so my group provides the operational support to make sure that happens you know you know what one of the things that's always fascinating when I go to Red Hat there's so many projects there's so many participants from various walks of life last year at the show there was a lot of discussion of you know it was a survey really and said that you know the majority of people that tribute now it's actually part of their job as opposed to when I think back you know you go back a couple of decades ago and it was like oh well in my spare time or down in my basement I'm contributing here so maybe talk a little bit about the communities and you know what what Megan is embodying CSUN she worked on project now she's working for obviously a good partner of Red Hat's that does a lot of open source yeah I love the way she described what her role is at Google and that it's fascinating and Google has been really a huge contributor in the community for in communities for years and years so I think that what we're seeing with the communities and people saying yeah now it's part of my day job is that you know 20 years ago the idea that open-source development would be kind of on par with proprietary development and on par in terms of being used in the enterprise and the data center was something that I think many people questioned proprietary software was the way that most people felt comfortable making sure that their intellectual property is protected and that users could feel comfortable using it within the parameters required so that was the way it was 20 years ago and then now you think about you know most companies there is some form of open source that is part of their infrastructure so now open source is no longer you know that disrupter but it's really a viable alternative and organizations really want to use both they want to have some propriety or they want to have some open sources so that means like every company is going to need to have some need to understand how to participate in communities how to influence communities and Red Hat's a great partner in helping enterprise customers to be able to understand what those red Nets might look like and then helping to kind of harden it make sure things that they need to have application city to have certified or certified and make it really usable in a way they're comfortable with in the enterprise that's kind of special Red Hat place but it's just a tribute to where we come in a world in terms of open source being really accepted and thriving and it helps us to innovate much more rapidly yeah and there's there's no better way to look at not only where we are but where we're going then talk about what's happening in the academic world so that gives it brings us Aneta so you are the academic award winner you're a PhD candidate so tell us a little bit about your participation and open source what it means to be part of this community my PhD project involves using virtual reality to measure the arm movements of people with stroke so we have participants coming in into our lab so they we're these 3d glasses and then they start seeing virtual objects in the 3d space and they use their hands to touch at these targets and make them disappear and we have all these movements data specially interpreters and then we write code and analyze the data and find out how much they have recovered within one year after stroke this is my PhD project but my involvement with open source happens they before like in starting from 2010 I have been editing Wikipedia and I have been writing several articles related to medicine and healthcare so that is where I started with open open knowledge and then I moved on words and after my medical studies I moved to research and worked on this awesome project and so there are multiple ways by which I have engaged with open source that's far that's awesome my understanding is also some of the roots that you had and some of the medical things that you're doing have an impact on what's happening today so obviously we're all dealing with the global pandemic in Koba 19 so I'd like to hear you know what your involvement there you know your data obviously is politically important that we have the right data getting to the right people as fast as possible definitely yes right now I'm working on writing creating content for Wikipedia writing on articles related to Kobe 19 so I mostly work on writing about its socio-economic impact writing about Kobe 19 testing and also about the disease in general mental health issues surrounding that social stigma associated began with it and so forth so I use all these high-quality references from the World Health Organization the United Nations and also from several journals and synthesize them and write articles on Wikipedia so we have a very cool project called wiki project code 19 on Wikipedia where people who are interested in writing articles creating data uploading images related to poet 19 come together and create some good content out of it so I am a very active participant there alright and making my understanding is you you also have some initiatives related to kovat 19 maybe you can tell us a little bit about those yeah well one I'm loosely affiliated with this kovat act now and that is a combination of developers data scientists epidemiologists and US state government officials and it's looking at how was the curve look like and how does that curve get flattened if governor's made decisions faster or differently than what they're making today and how does it impact the availability of ICU beds and ventilators and so that is a tool that's being used today by many decision-makers here in the US and my contribution to that was they needed some resources I reached into Google and found some smart generous volunteers that are contributing to the dataset and actually I just connected with Neda do this award program and now she's connected and is gonna start working on this as well yes oh that's fantastic yeah I mean dallisa you know we've known for a long time you want to move fast if you want to connect you know lots of diverse groups you know open sources is an important driver there what what else are you seeing in your group you know with your hat is the the people officer you know obviously this is a big impact not only on all of your customers partners but on fun Red Hatters themselves well it is a huge impact we're so fortunate that we have some experience working remotely we have about 25 percent of our population that historically works remotely so we have that as a foundation but certainly the quick move the rapid move to really thinking about our people first and having them work from home across the globe that is unprecedented and at this point we have some individuals who have been working from home for many many many week and others that are really in entering their fourth week so we're starting to have this huge appreciation for what it's like to work remotely and what we can learn about more effective inclusion so I think you know back to the idea of women and open source and diversity inclusion one of the things you may always prided ourself in is we focus on inclusion and we think about things like okay if the person is not in the room with their remote let's make sure for including them let's make sure they get to speak first etcetera well now we're learning what it's really like to be remote and for everyone to be remote and so we're creating this muscle as an organization I think most organizations are doing this right getting a muscle you didn't have before we really really having to think about inclusion in a different way and you're building a capability as an organization that you didn't have to appreciate those that are not in the room and to make sure they are included because no one's in the room you know we're really important pieces and dallisa you know one of the things that that's always great about Red Hat summit is you you bring together all these people as we just heard you know that your two Award winners here you know got connected through the awards so maybe give us a little bit of a peek as to what sort of things the community can still look forward to how they can continue to connect even though we're all going to be remote for this event yeah this event is is it going to be great event and I hope everyone joins us along our journey we are fortunate that Red Hat you know as the open source leader really wants to take a leadership position in thinking about how we can shine a light on opportunities for us to highlight the value of diversity and inclusion and so we've got a number of events not throughout the summit that we'd love people to join in and we're going to be celebrating our women and open-source again at our women's leadership community lunch is now not a lunch it is now a discussion unless you're having your lunch that you can check your desk but we're having a great conversation at that event I mean by people to join in and have a deeper conversation and also another look at our women in open source Award winners but these Award winners are just so amazing every year that applications that are submitted are just more and more inspiring and all the finalists were people that are so impressive so I love the fact that our community continues to grow and that they're more and more impressive people that are joining the community and that they're making those connections so that together we can you know really shine a light on the value that women bring to the communities and continue to inspire other underrepresented groups to join in and participate then a you know research obviously is an area where open-source is pretty well used but just give us a little bit of viewpoint from your standpoint yourself and your peers you know I would think from the outside that you know open sourced is just kind of part of the fabric of the tools that you're using is it something that people think specifically about a course or does it just come naturally that people are you know leveraging using and even contributing what what's available the tool I'm using is called cuteness it's an open source tool written in Python and so that gives me the possibility to have a look in deeper into the code and see what's actually inside for example I would like to know how what is the size of the target that is shown in the virtual space and I can fit know that correctly to the millimeters because it's available to me in open source so I think these are the advantages which researchers see when they have tools open-source tools and at the same time there's also a movement in Sweden and in most of Europe where they want the researchers are asking for publishing their articles in open access journals so they want most of their research be published as transparent as possible and there is also this movement where people want researchers want to have their data put in some open data city so that everybody can have a look at it and do analysis on the data and build up on that data if other people want to so there's a lot going from the open access side and knowledge side and also the open source side in the research community and I'm looking forward to what probably 19 will do to this movement in future and I am sure people will start using more more and more open-source tools because after the Manderly yeah making I'm curious from your standpoint when I think about a lot of these communities you know meetups are just kind of some of the regular fabric of how I get things done as well as you know just lots of events tie into things so when you're talking to your colleagues when you're talking to your peers out there how much is kind of the state of reality today having an impact in any any learnings that you can share with gaudí yeah that is definitely a challenge that we're going to figure out together and I am part of a group called Foss responders we are reaching out to projects and listening to their needs and amplifying their needs and helping to get them connected with resources and one of the top three areas of need include how do I run an online community event how do I replace these meetups and what is wonderful is that groups have been moving in this direction already and so who would release a guide of how they run online events and they provide some tooling as well but so has WordPress put out a guide and other projects that have gone down this path and so in the spirit of open source everyone is sharing their knowledge and Foss responders is trying to aggregate that so that you can go to their site find it and take advantage of it yeah definitely something I've seen one of the silver linings is you know these communities typically have been a lot of sharing but even more so everybody's responding everybody's kind of rallying to the cause don't want to give you the final word obviously you know this is a nice segment piece that we usually expect to see at Red Hat summit so what else do you want to help share where the community is final closing thoughts well I think that you know we're not done yet we have been so fortunate to be able to highlight you know the contributions that women make to open source and that is a honor that we get to take that role but we need to continue to go down this path we are not we're not done we have not made the improvement in terms of the the representative in our communities that will actually foster all of the improvements and all the solutions that need to happen in the world though we're going to keep down this pathway and really encourage everyone to think through how you can have a more inclusive team how you can make someone feel included if you're participating in a community or in an organization so that we really continue to bring in more diversity and have more innovation well excellent thank you so much Alisa for sharing it thank you too - both of you Award winners and really look forward to reading more online definitely checking out some of the initiatives that you've shared valuable pieces that hopefully everybody can leverage all right lots more coverage from Red Hat summit 2020 I'm Stu minimun and as always thank you for watching the cube [Music]

>> From around the globe its theCUBE with digital coverage of Red Hat Summit 2020, brought to you by Red Hat. >> Hi I'm Stu Miniman and this is theCUBE's coverage of a Red Hat Summit 2020. Of course this year the event is virtual. We're bringing all the people on theCUBE from where they are and really happy to bring back to the program, one of our CUBE alumni, Paul Cormier, who is the president and CEO of Red Hat. Of course the keynote and you and I spoke ahead of the show. Paul great to see you and thanks so much for joining us. >> My pleasure, always great to see you Stu. My pleasure. >> All right, so Paul lots have changed since last time we got together for summit. One things stayed the same though. So, you know, the big theme, I heard in your keynote, you talked about open hybrid cloud of course. We've been talking about cloud for years when you ran the product theme, you know, making Red Hat go everywhere is something that we've watched, you know, that move. Is anything different when you're talking to customers, when you're talking to your, the product themes, you think about the times were in, why is open hybrid cloud not a buzzword but hugely important in the times were facing? >> Because the big premise to open hybrid cloud is that customers, cloud has become part of people's infrastructure. I've seen very few if any true enterprise customers that are moving everything, every app to one cloud. And so I think what people really realized once they started implementing clouds, part of their infrastructure was that you going to always have applications that are running bare metal. Some are virtual machine maybe on top of VMware it might been a private cloud, and not many people saying you know what the public clouds are all so different from each other I might want to run one application for whatever reason in one in a different one or another I think they started to realize the actual operational cost to that, the security cost of that and even more mobility the development cost of that from the application perspective and now having five silos up there now how that's so costly so now our whole premise since the beginning of open hybrid cloud has been to give you that level playing field to have those things all the same no matter where the application wants whether experimental virtual machine private multiple public cloud and so in the long run as customers start to start to really go to cloud first application development and they can still manage that under one platform in a common way but at the same time managed develop secure it but at the same time they can manage develop and secure their legacy applications that are also on linux as well in the same way so I think in the long run it really brings it together and saves money and efficiency in those areas. >> Yeah it's I always loved I look over time we have certain words that we think we know what they mean and then they mature over time let's just say we'll start with the first piece of what you're talking about open we live through those of us that have been through that the really ascendancy of open-source is in the early days open was free and we joke it was free like puppies >> Yeah. but today open source of course is very prevalent we see it all over the place but give from an open hybrid cloud why open is important today and what customers should think, how do customers think about that today? >> There's probably two most misunderstood things with open so first thing is that open source is a development model, first of all. I always say it's a verb not a noun, I even say well think internally and externally. We're not an open source company, we're an enterprise software company with an open source development model. So you think about that, that's what that's really important. Why is the open source development model so important? It's important because everyone has the same opportunity in terms of the features of within the code everyone has the same opportunity to contribute. The best technology wins that's how it works in the upstream community is it's not a technology driven by one company that may have a one company agenda. It's really a development process that allows the best technology to win and I think that's one of the main things and one of the main reasons why you see all the innovation frankly in the last five years around infrastructure and development, associated pieces and tools around that of being in and around Linux because Linux was available, it was powerful, it was open when people wanted to develop for when people wanted to develop kubernetes for example, they had to make changes to the Linux kernel in order to do that it did work because they could and so those are the things that make it really important as a development model and I think those are the things that get confused a lot. I think the other things that get confuses a lot of people think that, "hey if I have this great technology and I just open-source is that it'll all just work, everyone will come, now that's not the case. The things that really, the projects that really succeed of an open-source perspective are the problems that are common and horizontal across a big group of people so they're trying to solve similar problems and that's one of the things that we found as you go further up the stack the length typically the less community is involved it's the horizontal layers where you need whether you're in banking or retail or telco or whatever they're all the same, those are the pieces where open-source really fits well. >> Alright so the second piece you talk about hybrid I think back to the early days Paul when cloud was first defined and we talked about public and private cloud we had discussions of hybrid cloud and multi clouds and the concern that I have is it was very much an infrastructure discussion and it was pieces and the vision that we always have is, were customers to actually get value is, the total solution needs to be more valuable than the sum of its parts. So it's really about hybrid applications about where my data lives, so do you agree with some of those things I'm saying how does Red Hat look at it and from your team i do get lots of the application and app dev discussion which I always find even more meaningful than arguing over ontologies of how you build your cloud. >> Everything you said is all about the application if you look at just where we started with linux just along what did Linux bring to the enterprise when we first started rally me you and I talked about this earlier that was the thing that really opened things up. The enterprise's started buying Linux they right they started buying Linux for Linux for $29.95 at the book stores but when I first came on board we talked to some of the banking customers in there, they said well we love this technology but every time you guys change a release on my applications breaker when I get new hardware it doesn't work etc. So it's all about the application Linux is better about that all the time from the beginning of time what hybrid it really means here, is that I can run that seamlessly across wherever that footprint is going to live and so I think that's also one of the things that gets confused a bit. When the cloud first started, the cloud vendors were telling people that every application was going to move to one cloud tomorrow right? We knew that was not practical, that's the other thing from open-source developers, we look at a practical perspective, we look back in 2007 I just looked at just to prepare for the note I just put up to the company. Back in 2007 at the summit I talked about any application anywhere anytime. That's really the essence of what hybrid is here, so what we found here is what every application is impractical for every application to move to one cloud and so cloud is powerful but it's become part of people's development and operations and security environment so now as we stitch that in may make that common for those three things for the operation security in development more application development world that's where the power is. So I see the day where application developers and application users won't know or care what platform the back-end day is coming from for whatever applications they're writing, they shouldn't care that should just happen seamlessly under the covers but having said that, that complicates thing and that's why management needs to be retooled with it as well. Sorry on that but I could talk about that for three days right? >> Yeah so as an industry we kind of argue about these and everybody feels that they understand the way the future should look. So Paul for a number of years it was, "we're going to build this stack "and let's have the exact same stack here and there." There were some of the big iron companies that did that a few years ago now you see some of your public cloud partners saying, "we can give you that same experience "that same hardware all the way "down to the chip level things are going to be the same." When I look at software companies, there's two that come to mind to live across dispersed environments. One is very much from a virtualization standpoint they design themselves to live on any hardware out there. Red Hat has a slightly different way of looking at things, so what's your take on kind of the stack and why is hybrid in that hybrid cloud model that you're building probably looks and sounds and feels different then I think almost anybody else out there? >> Well the cloud guys, they all have similar technologies underneath I mean most of it not all of its based on Linux but they're all different I mean remember the UNIX days I'm old enough to remember the UNIX day. That was the goal back then but like each hardware vendor did each cloud vendor is now taking that Linux or the Associated pieces with it and they have to make their changes to adapt to their environment and some of those changes don't allow for applications to be portable outside that environment, that's exactly like the OEM world of the past and so I hope some people hate it when I say this to make this a comparison but I really look at the cloud guys as a mainframe and certainly mainframe as and still does bring a ton of value to certain customer base and so if you're going to keep your application in that one place, a mainframe will all on you mainframe mentality will always stitch it to bet together better but that's not the reality of what customers are trying to do out there. So I really think you have to look at it that way it's not that much different in concept anyways to the OEM days whether from when they started running Linux and the thing that Red Hat's done that some of the others haven't for VMware for example, VMware they have no pieces that touch the application I mean they have some now they had photon, they had some of the other pieces that sort of tried to touch the application but at the end of the day we always concentrated in Linux and especially from a Red Hat perspective of keeping the environment the same, both from an application perspective and from a hardware perspective. Certainly when an application runs in the cloud, we don't have to worry about the hardware anymore but we still have to worry about the application and businesses are all about the application and so we always took that tack from both sides of that. I think that's one of VMware's weaknesses frankly is that applications don't run on hypervisors, they run on operating systems including when I say operating systems I mean containers because that is a Linux operating system. >> Yeah Paul a lot of good points you brought up there and it's interesting the mainframe analogy in the early days of cloud there were some that would throw stones and saying right you're rebuilding the mainframe and you're going to be locked in, this is going to be an environment so I'd love to get your thought you think about what's happening in application development, the rise of is you talked about containers and kubernetes serverless is out there there's that, "we want to enable the application developers but we don't want to get locked into some platform there. Talk about red-hat's role how your products are helping the ship, help customers make sure that they can take advantage of some of these new ways of building, maintaining and changing without being stuck on any specific platform or technology >> Well the first place, I believe I'm sure I will be corrected on this but we really are the only company that I can think of at this moment that is a hundred percent open source. Everything we do when our products go is open source based goes back upstream to the community for everyone to take advantage of so that's the first thing. I mean the second thing we do is one of the big fallacies is, open source has become so popular that people are confusing upstream projects with downstream products and so for us I'll use us as an example, I'll use Linux and I'll use kubernetes as an example, the Linux kernel we all built from the Linux kernel us, Susa, Ubuntu we all build from the Linux kernel but at the end of the day we all make choices when we bring that upstream work down to become a product. In our case we go upstream to rel, we go from fedora to sent us to rel. We all make choices, which file systems were going to package, what development environment we're going to to package, what packages werre gonna package and so when we get down to what's get deployed in the enterprise, those choices in what makes the difference of why by rel is slightly different than SUSE Linux which is slightly different than Canonical's upon - but they're all come from the same heritage, the same as the case with kubernetes is this sort of fallacy that kubernetes is the last time I checked it was 127 different kubernetes vendors out there. They're all just going to magically work together yes they all come from the same place but we have to touch the users face, we have to touch the kernel and so there how do you line that up in the life cycle of what the customers get is going to be different. We might be able to take different pieces from different from those 127, make it work at one point but the first time any of us makes a change, it's not coordinated with the other side, it's probably going to break. Anyone our life cycles go out 10 plus years and so engineering that altogether is something that makes it all work together as you upgrade whether it be hardware or your applications and so some people confuse that with not being old till 100 percent open. When we find a bug in rel, rel that's been out there for five years maybe we give that fix back to the upstream community that's open it's out there and so I think that's the part that this doesn't become so accepted now and so much part of the mainstream now that we very much confused projects with products and so that's one of the biggest confusion points out there. >> Yeah really good points there Paul. So when I think about some of the things we've heard over the years is in the original days it was, "Oh well public hug Paul? I'm not going to need rel anymore they've got Linux then kubernetes has come along and Red Hat's had a really strong position but you look at it and you say, "Okay well if I'm most customers, "if I'm doing Amazon, "if I'm doing Google, "if I'm doing Microsoft, "I'm probably going to end up using some of their native services that they've got built-in. Talk about how the role of Red Hat kind of continues to change and you live in this multi cloud environment and i think it's kind of that intersection that you were talking about, open and compatibility as opposed to. You're not saying that Red Hat's going to conquer the world and take down all the other options >> Well cloud providers bring a ton of value. I mean the users have to be smart on how and when they use that value. If you truly are going to be a hundred percent of your applications in one public cloud, then you probably will get the best solution from that one public cloud. Serverless is a great example if you're an Amazon and you spin up via services serverless that container that gets spun up is never going to run outside that Club, if that's okay with you that's okay with you. (Voice scrambles) The we've gone about this is as I said to give you that seamless environment all the way across. If you want to run just containers, (voice scrambles) on one particular cloud vendor and you want it under their kubernetes and it's never going to run in any other place, that's okay too but if you're going to have an environment with applications that are in multiple cloud vendors infrastructure you're even on your own, you're now going to have to spin up these different silos of that technology even though the technology as the same heritage. So that's a huge operational and development cost as you grow bigger and able to order to do that and so our set a strategy is very simple, it's give the developers operations and security people that common environment to work across and over time (voice scrambles) they shouldn't care where the services are coming from. It should just all work and that's why you seen things like automation being so important now. I mean our nation is our biggest growing business with ansible right now and part of the reason is as people spread out to a container based environment applications that may now spread across those different footprints maybe you want to have your front (voice scrambles) we have one of the rel customers in Europe that has the front facing customer side of their ticket, their ticketing system up in the public cloud and they've got the backend financial transaction database pieces that click credit cards behind their firewall, that's really one application spread across containers, if you have do you want to have to manage the front end of that with one kubernetes and the backend of that were the different kubernetes? Probably not and so that's really what we bring to the table as we've really grown in with this new technology. >> Alright, so final question I have for you Paul I'm actually going to get away a little bit from your background on the product piece you have to talk a little bit about just red hat going forward. So you talked about, we know for many years red hat has been much more than the Linux piece you talk about automation I've got some great interviews this week talking about some of the the latest in application development, lots of open source projects and so many open source projects (laughing) nobody can keep them all straight there. So as customers look at strategic partnerships, what is the role of red hat and with now being under IBM Jim white her steps over to become president there Arvind of course had a long relationship and it was the architect behind the Red Hat acquisition what's the same and what's different as we think about Red Hat 2020 under your leadership? >> I think it's a lot of the same I mean I think the the difference becomes in the world we're in right now is sort of how we can help our customers come out of back and back into re-entry right and so how that's going to to be different than the past (voice scrambles) we're working through that with many of our customers and we think we can be a big help here because we run their business and today where they run their business over the platforms on their business and that's not going to go away for them and in fact if anything that's going to get even more critical for them because they've got to get more automation to get just more efficiency out of it so in terms of what we do and as a company that's not going to change at all I mean we've been on this path that we're on for a long time. I stand up in front of our sales kickoffs every year is hearing and virtual as well and I say, "we'll to talk to you about the strategy." Guess what? It hasn't changed much from last year and that's a good thing because these technology rollouts are multi-year rollouts, so we're going to continue on that I mean the other thing too is, our customers are seeing moving many more of their work close to the Linux environment and so I think we can help them expand that as well and I think from an IBM perspective (voice scrambles) one of the big premises here from our perspective is to help us scale because they're in the process of helping their customers move to this next generation architectures and at the same time be able support the current architectures and that's what we do well and so they can just help us get to places that we just wouldn't have had the time and the resources maybe to get there get on our own so we can expand that footprint even more quickly with IBM. So that's the focus right now is to really help our customers move to the next phase of this in terms of re-entry >> Yeah as I've heard you and many other Red Hatters say Red Hat is still Red Hat and definitely it's something that we can see loud and clear at Red Hat summit 2020. Thank you so much Paul. >> Thank you Stu nice to see you again. >> All right lots of coverage from Red Hat summit 2020 be sure to check out the cube net for the whole back catalogue that we have of Paul their customers, there their partners and thank you for so watching the queue [Music]

from around the globe it's the cube with digital coverage of Red Hat summit 2020 brought to you by Red Hat last year in 2019 IBM made the biggest M&A move of the year with a 34 billion dollar acquisition of red hat it positioned IBM for the next decade after what was a very tumultuous tenure by CEO Ginni Rometty who had to shrink in order to grow unfortunately she didn't have enough time to do the grille part that has now gone toward Arvind Krishna the new CEO of IBM this is Dave Volante and I'm here with Stu minimun and this is our Red Hat keynote analysis is our 7th year doing the Red Hat summit and we're very excited to be here this is our first year doing Stu the Red Hat summit post IVM acquisition we've also got IBM think next week so what we want to do for you today is review what's going on at the Red Hat summits do you've been wall-to-wall with the interviews we're gonna break down the announcements IBM had just announced its quarter so we get some glimpse as to what's happening in the business and then we're gonna talk about going forward what the prognosis is for both IBM and Red Hat well and Dave of course our audience understands there's a reason why we're sitting farther apart than normal in our studio and you know why we're not in San Francisco where the show is supposed to be this year last year it's in Boston Red Hat summit goes coast-to-coast every year it's our seventh year doing the show first year doing it all digital of course our community is always online but you know real focus you know we're gonna talk about Dave you know you listen to the keynote speeches it's not the as we sit in our preview it's not the hoopla we had a preview with pork or mayor ahead of the event where they're not making big announcements most of the product pieces we're all out front it's open source anyway we know when it's coming for the most part some big partnership news of course strong customer momentum but a different tenor and the customers that Red Hat's lined up for me their interview all talking you know essential services like medical your your energy services your communication services so you know real focus I think Dave both IBM and right making sure that they are setting the appropriate tone in these challenging times yeah I mean everybody who we talked to says look at the employees and safety comes first once we get them working from home and we know that they're safe and healthy we want to get productive and so you've seen as we've reported that that shift to the work from home infrastructure and investments in that and so now it's all about how do we get closer to clients how do we stay close to clients and be there for them and I actually have you know business going forward you know the good news for IBM is it's got strong cash flow it's got a strong balance sheet despite you know the acquisition I mean it's just you know raise some more you know low low cost debt which you know gives them some dry powder going forward so I think IBM is gonna be fine it's just there's a lot of uncertainty but let's go back to your takeaways from the Red Hat Summit you've done you know dozens of interviews you got a good take on the company what are you top three takeaways - yeah so first of all Dave you know the focus everybody has is you know what does Red Hat do for the cloud story for IBM OpenShift especially is absolutely a highlight over 2,000 customers now from some really large ones you know last year I interviewed you know Delta you've got you know forward and Verizon up on stage for the keynote strong partnership with Microsoft talking about what they're doing so OpenShift has really strong momentum if you talk about you know where is the leadership in this whole kubernetes space Red Hat absolutely needs to be in that discussion not only are they you know other than Google the top contributor really there but from a customer standpoint the experience what they've built there but what I really liked from Red Hat standpoint is it's not just an infrastructure discussion it's not OPM's and containers and there's things we want to talk about about VMs and containers and even server lists from Red Hat standpoint but Red Hat at its core what it is it they started out as an operating system company rel Red Hat Enterprise Linux what's the tie between the OS and the application oh my god they've got decades of experience how do you build applications everything from how they're modernizing Java with a project called Korkis through how their really helping customers through this digital transformation I hear a similar message from Red Hat and their customers that I hear from Satya Nadella at Microsoft is we're building lots of applications we need to modernize what they're doing in Red Hat well positioned across the stack to not only be the platform for it but to help all of the pieces to help me modernize my applications build new ones modernize some of the existing ones so OpenShift a big piece of it you know automation has been a critical thing for a while we did the cube last year at ansible fest for the first time from Red Hat took that acquisition has helped accelerate that community in growth and they're really Dave pulling all the pieces together so it's what you hear from Stephanie shirasu ironically enough came over from IBM to run that business inside a Red Hat well you know now she's running it inside Red Hat and there's places that this product proliferate into the IBM portfolio next week when we get where it I didn't think I'm sure we'll hear a lot about IBM cloud packs and look at what's underneath IBM cloud packs there's open shift there's rel all those pieces so you know I know one of the things we want to talk about Davis you know what does that dynamic of Red Hat and IBM mean so you know open shift automation the full integration both of the Red Hat portfolio and how it ties in with IBM would be my top three well red hat is now IBM I mean it's a clearly part of the company it's there's a company strategy going forward the CEO Arvind Krishna is the architect of the Red Hat acquisition and so you know that it's all in on Red Hat Dave I mean just the nuance there of course is the the thing you hear over and over from the Red Hatters is Red Hat remains Red Hat that cultural shift is something I'd love to discuss because you know Jim Whitehurst now he's no longer a Red Hat employee he's an IBM employee so you've got Red Hat employees IBM employees they are keeping that you know separation wall but obviously there's flowing in technology and come on so come on in tech you look at it's not even close to what VMware is VMware is a separate public company has separate reporting Red Hat doesn't I mean yes I hear you yo you got the Red Hat culture and that's good but it's a far cry from you know a separate entity with full transparency the financials and and so I I hear you but I'm not fully buying it but let's let's get into it let's take a look at at the quarter because that I think will give us an indication as to how much we actually can understand about RedHat and and again my belief is it's really about IBM and RedHat together I think that is their opportunity so Alex if you wouldn't mind pulling up the first slide these are highlights from IBM's q1 and you know we won't spend much time on the the the IBM side of the business although we wanted to bring some of that in but hit the key here as you see red hat at 20% revenue growth so still solid revenue growth you know maybe a little less robust than it was you know sequentially last quarter but still very very strong and that really is IBM's opportunity here 2,200 clients using red hat and an IBM container platforms the key here is when Ginni Rometty announced this acquisition along with Arvind Krishna and Jim Whitehurst she said this is going to be this is going to be cash flow free cash flow accretive in year one they've already achieved that they said it's gonna be EPS accretive by year two they are well on their way to achieving that why we talked about this do it's because iBM has a huge services organization that it can plug open shift right into and begin to modernize applications that are out there I think they cited on the call that they had a hundred ongoing projects and that is driving immediate revenue and allows IBM to from a financial standpoint to get an immediate return so the numbers are pretty solid yeah absolutely Dave and you know talking about that there is a little bit of the blurring a line between the companies one of the product pieces that came out at the show is IBM has had for a couple of years think you know MCM multi cloud management there was announced that there were actually some of the personnel and some of the products from IBM has cut have come into Retta of course Red Hat doing what they always do they're making it open source and they're it's advanced cluster management really from my viewpoint this is an answer to what we've seen in the kubernetes community for the last year there is not one kubernetes distribution to rule them all I'm going to use what my platforms have and therefore how do I manage across my various cloud environments so Red Hat for years is OpenShift lives everywhere it sits on top of VMware virtualization environments it's on top of AWS Azure in Google or it just lives in your Linux farms but ACM now is how do I manage my kubernetes environment of course you know super optimized to work with OpenShift and the roadmap as to how it can manage with Azure kubernetes and some of the other environments so you know you now have some former IBM RS that are there and as you said Dave some good acceleration in the growth from the Red Hat numbers we'd seen like right around the time that the acquisition happened Red Hat had a little bit of a down quarter so you know absolutely the services and the the scale that IBM can bring should help to bring new logos of course right now Dave with the current global situation it's a little bit tough to go and be going after new business yeah and we'll talk about that a little bit but but I want to come back to sort of when I was pressing you before on the trip the true independence of Red Hat by the way I don't think that's necessarily a wrong thing I'll give an example look at Dell right now why is Dell relevant and cloud well okay but if Dell goes to market says we're relevant in cloud because of VMware well then why am I talking to you why don't I talk to VMware and so so my point is that that in some regards you know having that integration is there is a real advantage no you know you were that you know EMC and the time when they were sort of flip-flopping back and forth between integrated and not and separate and not it's obviously worked out for them but it's not necessarily clear-cut and I would say in the case of IBM I think it's the right move why is that every Krista talked about three enduring platforms that IBM has developed one is mainframe that's you know gonna here to stay the second was middleware and the third is services and he's saying that hybrid cloud is now the fourth and during platform that they want to build well how do they gonna build that what are they gonna build that on they're gonna build that an open shift they they're there other challenges to kind of retool their entire middleware portfolio around OpenShift not unlike what Oracle did with with Fusion when it when it bought Sun part of the reason - pod Sun was for Java so these are these are key levers not necessarily in and of themselves you know huge revenue drivers but they lead to awesome revenue opportunities so that's why I actually think it's the right move that what IBM is doing keep the Red Hat to the brand and culture but integrate as fast as possible to get cash flow or creative we've achieved that and get EPS accretive that to me makes a lot of sense yeah Dave I've heard you talk often you know if you're not a leader in a position or you know here John Chambers from Cisco when he was running it you know if I'm not number one or number two why am I in it how many places did IBM have a leadership position Red Hat's a really interesting company because they have a leadership position in Linux obviously they have a leadership position now in kubernetes Red Hat culturally of course isn't one to jump up and down and talk about you know how they're number one in all of these spaces because it's about open source it's about community and you know that does require a little bit of a cultural shift as IBM works with them but interesting times and yeah Red Hat is quietly an important piece of the ecosystem let me let me bring in some meteor data Alex if you pull up that that's that second slide well and I've shown this before in braking analysis and what this slide shows in the vertical axis shows net score net score is a measure of spending momentum spending velocity the the horizontal axis is is is called market share it's really not market share it's it's really a measure of pervasiveness the the mentions in the data set we're talking about 899 responses here out of over 1200 in the April survey and this is a multi cloud landscape so what I did here Stu I pulled on containers container platforms of container management and cloud and we positioned the companies on this sort of XY axis and you can see here you obviously have in the upper right you've got Azure in AWS why do I include AWS and the multi cloud landscape you answered that question before but yesterday because Dave even though Amazon might not allow you to even use the word multi cloud you can't have a discussion of multi cloud without having Amazon in that discussion and they've shifted on hybrid expect them to adjust their position on multi-cloud in the future yeah now coming back to this this this data you see kubernetes is on the kubernetes I know is another company but ETR actually tracks kubernetes you can see how hot it is in terms of its net score and spending momentum yeah I mean Dave do you know the thing the the obvious thing to look at there is if you see how strong kubernetes is if IBM plus red hat can keep that leadership in kubernetes they should do much better in that space than they would have on with just their products alone and that's really the lead of this chart that really cuts to the chase do is you see you see red Red Hat openshift has really strong spending momentum although I will say if you back up back up to say April July October 18 19 it actually was a little higher so it's been pushed down remember this is the April survey that what's ran from mid-march to mid April so we're talking right in the middle of the pandemic okay so everybody's down but nonetheless you can see the opportunity is for IBM and Red Hat to kind of meet in the middle leverage IBM's massive install base in its in its services presence in its market presence its pervasiveness so AKA market share in this rubric and then use Red Hat's momentum and kind of meet in the middle and that's the kind of point that we have here with IBM's opportunity and that really is why IBM is a leader in at least a favorite in my view in multi cloud well Dave if you'd look two years ago and you said what was the competitive landscape Red Hat was an early leader in the kubernetes you know multi-cloud discussion today if you ask everybody well who's doing great and kubernetes you have to talk about all the different options that amazon has Amazon still has their own container management with ACS of course IKS is doing strong and well and Amazon whatever they do they we know they're going to be competitive Microsoft's there but it's not all about competition in this space Dave because you know we see Red Hat partnering across these environments they do have a partnership with AWS they do have you know partnership with you know Microsoft up on stage there so where it was really interesting Dave you know one of the things I was coming into this show looking is what is Red Hat's answer to what VMware is really starting to do in this space so vSphere 7 rolled out and that is the ga of project Pacific so taking virtualization in containers and putting them together Red Hat of course has had virtualization for a long time with KVM they have a different answer of how they're doing openshift virtualization and it rather than saying here's my virtual environment and i can also do kubernetes on it they're saying containers are the future and where you want to go and we can bring your VMs into containers really shift them the way you have really kind of a lift and shift but then modernize them Dave customers are good you know you want to meet customers where they are you want to help them move forward virtualization in general has been a you don't want to touch your applications you want to just you know let it ride forever but the real the real driver for companies today is I've got to build new apps I need to modernize on my environment and you know Red Hat is positioning and you know I like what I'm hearing from them I like what I'm hearing from my dad's customers on how they're helping take both the physical the virtual the containers in the cloud and bring them all into this modern era yeah and and you know IBM made an early bet on on kubernetes and obviously around Red Hat you could see actually on that earlier slide we showed you IBM we didn't really talk about it they said they had 23% growth in cloud which is that they're a twenty two billion dollar business for IBM you're smiling yeah look good for IBM they're gonna redefine cloud you know let AWS you know kick and scream they're gonna say hey here's how we define cloud we include our own pram we include Cano portions of our consulting business I mean I honestly have no idea what's in the 22 billion and how if they're growing 22 billion at 23% wow that's pretty awesome I'm not sure I think they're kind of mixing apples and oranges there but it makes for a good slide yeah you would say wait shouldn't that be four billion you added he only added two or three billion you know numbers can tell a story but you can also manipulate but the point is the point is I've always said this near term the to get you know return on this deal it's about plugging OpenShift into services and modernizing applications long term it's about maintaining IBM and red-hats relevance in the hybrid cloud world which is I don't know how big it is it's a probably a trillion-dollar opportunity that really is critical from a strategy standpoint do I want to ask you about the announcements what about any announcements that you saw coming from Red Hat are relevant what do we need to know there yeah so you know one of the bigger ones we already talked about that you know multi cloud manager what Red Hat has the advanced cluster management or ACM absolutely is an era an area we should look VMware Tong's ooh Azure Ark Google anthos and now ACM from Red Hat in partnership with IBM is an area still really early Dave I talked to some of the executives in the space and say you know are we going to learn from the mistakes of multi vendor management Dave you know you think about the CA and BMC you know exactly of the past will we have learned for those is this the right way to do it it is early but Red Hat obviously has a position here and they're doing it um did hear plenty about how Red Hat is plugging into all the IBM environments Dave Z power you know the cloud solutions and of course you know IBM solutions across the board my point of getting a little blue wash but hey it's got to happen I think that's a smart move right you know we talked about you know really modernizing the applications in the environments I talked a bit about the virtualization piece the other one if you say okay how do I pull the virtualization forward what about the future so openshift serverless is the other one it's really a tech preview at this point it's built off of the K native project which is part of the CNC F which is basically how do I still have you know containers and kubernetes underneath can that plug into server list order server let's get it rid of it everything so IBM Oracle Red Hat and others really been pushing hard on this Kay native solution it is matured a lot there's an ecosystem growing as how it can connect to Asher how it can connect to AWS so definitely something from that appdev piece to watch and Dave that's where I had some really good discussions with customers as well as the the Red Hat execs and their partners that boundary between the infrastructure team and the app dev team they're hoping to pull them together and some of the tooling actually helps ansible is a great example of that in the past but you know others in the portfolio and lastly if you want to talk a huge opportunity for Red Hat IBM and it's a jump ball for everyone is edge computing so Red Hat I've talked to them for years about what they were doing in the opened stack community with network function virtualization or NFV Verizon was up on stage I've got an interview for Red Hat summit with Vodafone idea which has 300 million subscribers in India and you know the Red Hat portfolio really helping a lot of the customers there so it's the telco edge is where we see a strong push there it's definitely something we've been watching from the you know the big cloud players and those partnerships Dave so you know last year Satya Nadella was up on the main stage with Red Hat this year Scott Guthrie you know there he's at every Microsoft show and he's not the red head show so it is still ironic for those of us that have watched this industry and you say okay where are some of the important partnerships for Red Hat its Microsoft I mean you know we all remember when you know open-source was the you know evil enemy for from Microsoft and of course Satya Nadella has changed things a lot it's interesting to watch I'm sure we'll talk more at think Dave you know Arvind Krishna the culture he will bring in with the support of Jim Whitehurst comes over from IBM compared to what Satya has successfully done at Microsoft well let's talk about that let's let's talk about let's bring it home with the sort of near-term midterm and really I want to talk about the long term strategic aspects of IBM and Red Hat's future so near-term IBM is suspended guidance like everybody okay they don't have great visibility some some some things to watch by the way a lot of people are saying no just you know kind of draw draw a red line through this quarter you just generally ignore it I disagree look at cash flow look balance sheets look at what companies are doing and how they're positioning that's very important right now and will give us some clues and so there's a couple of things that we're watching with IBM one is their software business crashed in March and software deals usually come in big deals come in at the end of the quarter people were too distracted they they stopped spending so that's a concern Jim Cavanaugh on the call talked about how they're really paying attention to those services contracts to see how they're going are they continuing what's the average price of those so that's something that you got to watch you know near-term okay fine again as I said I think IBM will get through this what really I want to talk about to do is the the prospects going forward I'm really excited about the choice that IBM made the board putting Arvind Krishna in charge and the move that he made in terms of promoting you know Jim Whitehurst to IBM so let's talk about that for a minute Arvind is a technical visionary and it's it's high time that I VM got back to it being a technology company first because that's what IBM is and and I mean Lou Gerstner you know arguably save the company they pivoted to services Sam Palmisano continue that when Ginny came in you know she had a services heritage she did the PWC deal and IBM really became a services company first in my view Arvind is saying explicitly we want to lead with technology and I think that's the right move of course iBM is going to deliver outcomes that's what high-beams heritage has been for the last 20 years but they are a technology company and having a technology visionary at the lead is very important why because IBM essentially is the leader prior to Red Hat and one thing mainframes IBM used to lead in database that used to lead in storage they used to lead in the semiconductors on and on and on servers now they lead in mainframes and and now switch to look at Red Hat Red Hat's a leader you know they got the best product out there so I want you to talk about how you see that shift to more of a sort of technical and and product focus preserving obviously but your thoughts on the move the culture you're putting Jim as the president I love it I think it was actually absolutely brilliant yeah did Dave absolutely I know we were excited because we you know personally we know both of those leaders they are strong leaders they are strong technically Dave when I think about all the companies we look at I challenge anybody to find a more consistent and reliable pair of companies than IBM and Red Hat you know for years it was you know red hat being an open-source company and you know the way their business model said it it's not the you know Evan flow of product releases we know what the product is going to be the roadmaps are all online and they're gonna consistently grow what we've seen Red Hat go from kind of traditional software models to the subscription model and there are some of the product things we didn't get into too much as to things that they have built into you know Red Hat Enterprise Linux and expanding really their cloud and SAS offerings to enhance those environments and that that's where IBM is pushing to so you know there's been some retooling for the modern era they are well positioned to help customers through that you know digital transformation and as you said Dave you and I we both read the open organization by Jim lighters you know he came in to Red Hat you know really gave some strong leadership the culture is strong they they have maintained you know really strong morale and I talked to people inside you know was their concern inside when IBM was making the acquisition of course there was we've all seen some acquisitions that have gone great when IBM has blue washed them they're trying to make really strong that Red Hat stays Red Hat to your point you know Dave we've already seen some IBM people go in and some of the leadership now is on the IBM side so you know can they improve the product include though improve those customer outcomes and can Red Hat's culture actually help move IBM forward you know company with over a hundred years and over 200,000 employees you'd normally look and say can a 12,000 person company change that well with a new CEO with his wing and you know being whitehurst driving that there's a possibility so it's an interesting one to watch you know absolutely current situations are challenging you know red hats growth is really about adding new logos and that will be challenged in the short term yeah Dave I I love you shouldn't let people off the hook for q2 maybe they need to go like our kids this semester is a pass/fail rather than a grid then and then a letter grade yeah yeah and I guess my point is that there's information and you got to squint through it and I think that look at to me you know this is like Arvin's timing couldn't be better not that he orchestrated it but I mean you know when Ginny took over I mean was over a hundred million a hundred billion I said many times that I beams got a shrink to grow she just ran out of time for the Gro part that's now on Arvind and I think that so he's got the cove in mulligan first of all you know the stocks been been pressured down so you know his tenure he's got a great opportunity to do with IBM in a way what such an adela did is doing at Microsoft you think about it they're both deep technologists you know Arvind hardcore you know computer scientist Indian Institute of Technology Indian Institute of Technology different school than Satya went to but still steeped in in a technical understanding a technical visionary who can really Drive you know product greatness you know in a I would with with Watson we've talked a lot about hybrid cloud quantum is something that IBM is really investing heavily in and that's a super exciting area things like blockchain some of these new areas that I think IBM can lead and it's all running on the cloud you know look IBM generally has been pretty good with acquisitions they yes they fumbled a few but I've always made the point they are in the cloud game IBM and Oracle yeah they're behind from a you know market share standpoint but they're in the game and they have their software estate in their pass a state to insulate them from the race to the bottom so I really like their prospects and I like the the organizational structure that they put in place in it by the way it's not just Arvind Jim you mentioned Paul Cormier you know Rob Thomas has been been elevated to senior VP really important in the data analytic space so a lot of good things going on there yeah and Dave one of the questions you've been asking and we've been all talking to leaders in the industry you know what changes permanently after the this current situation you know automation you know more adoption of cloud the importance of developers are there's even more of a spotlight on those environments and Red Hat has strong positioning in that space a lot of experience that they help their customers and being open source you know very transparent there I both IBM and Red Hat are doing a lot to try to help the community they've got contests going online to you know help get you know open source and hackers and people working on things and you know strong leadership to help lead through these stormy weathers so Stuart's gonna be really interesting decade and the cube will be here to cover it hopefully hopefully events will come back until they do will be socially responsible and and socially distant but Stu thanks for helping us break down the the red hat and sort of tipping our toe into IBM more coverage and IBM think and next week this is Dave alotta for Stu minimun you're watching the cube and our continuous coverage of the Red Hat summit keep it right there be back after this short break you [Music]

[Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] that will be successful in the 21st century [Music] being open is really important because it comes with a lot of trust the open-source community now has matured so much and that contribution from the community is really driving innovation [Music] but what's really exciting is the change that we've seen in our teams not only the way they collaborate but the way they operate in the way they work [Music] I think idea is everything ideas can change the way you see things open-source is more than a license it's actually a way of operating [Music] ladies and gentlemen please welcome Red Hat president and chief executive officer Jim Whitehurst [Music] all right well welcome to day two at the Red Hat summit I'm amazed to see this many people here at 8:30 in the morning given the number of people I saw pretty late last night out and about so thank you for being here and have to give a shout out speaking of power participation that DJ is was Mike Walker who is our global director of open innovation labs so really enjoyed that this morning was great to have him doing that so hey so day one yesterday we had some phenomenal announcements both around Red Hat products and things that we're doing as well as some great partner announcements which we found exciting I hope they were interesting to you and I hope you had a chance to learn a little more about that and enjoy the breakout sessions that we had yesterday so yesterday was a lot about the what with these announcements and partnerships today I wanted to spin this morning talking a little bit more about the how right how do we actually survive and thrive in this digitally transformed world and to some extent the easy parts identifying the problem we all know that we have to be able to move more quickly we all know that we have to be able to react to change faster and we all know that we need to innovate more effectively all right so the problem is easy but how do you actually go about solving that right the problem is that's not a product that you can buy off the shelf right it is a capability that you have to build and certainly it's technology enabled but it's also depends on process culture a whole bunch of things to figure out how we actually do that and the answer is likely to be different in different organizations with different objective functions and different starting points right so this is a challenge that we all need to feel our way to an answer on and so I want to spend some time today talking about what we've seen in the market and how people are working to address that and it's one of the reasons that the summit this year the theme is ideas worth it lorring to take us back on a little history lesson so two years ago here at Moscone the theme of the summit was the power of participation and then I talked a lot about the power of groups of people working together and participating are able to solve problems much more quickly and much more effectively than individuals or even individual organizations working by themselves and some of the largest problems that we face in technology but more broadly in the world will ultimately only be solved if we effectively participate and work together then last year the theme of the summit was the impact of the individual and we took this concept of participation a bit further and we talked about how participation has to be active right it's a this isn't something where you can be passive that you can sit back you have to be involved because the problem in a more participative type community is that there is no road map right you can't sit back and wait for an edict on high or some central planning or some central authority to tell you what to do you have to take initiative you have to get involved right this is a active participation sport now one of the things that I talked about as part of that was that planning was dead and it was kind of a key my I think my keynote was actually titled planning is dead and the concept was that in a world that's less knowable when we're solving problems in a more organic bottom-up way our ability to effectively plan into the future it's much less than it was in the past and this idea that you're gonna be able to plan for success and then build to it it really is being replaced by a more bottom-up participative approach now aside from my whole strategic planning team kind of being up in arms saying what are you saying planning is dead I have multiple times had people say to me well I get that point but I still need to prepare for the future how do I prepare my organization for the future isn't that planning and so I wanted to spend a couple minutes talk a little more detail about what I meant by that but importantly taking our own advice we spent a lot of time this past year looking around at what our customers are doing because what a better place to learn then from large companies and small companies around the world information technology organizations having to work to solve these problems for their organizations and so our ability to learn from each other take the power of participation an individual initiative that people and organizations have taken there are just so many great learnings this year that I want to get a chance to share I also thought rather than listening to me do that that we could actually highlight some of the people who are doing this and so I do want to spend about five minutes kind of contextualizing what we're going to go through over the next hour or so and some of the lessons learned but then we want to share some real-world stories of how organizations are attacking some of these problems under this how do we be successful in a world of constant change in uncertainty so just going back a little bit more to last year talking about planning was dead when I said planning it's kind of a planning writ large and so that's if you think about the way traditional organizations work to solve problems and ultimately execute you start off planning so what's a position you want to get to in X years and whether that's a competitive strategy in a position of competitive advantage or a certain position you want an organizational function to reach you kind of lay out a plan to get there you then typically a senior leaders or a planning team prescribes the sets of activities and the organization structure and the other components required to get there and then ultimately execution is about driving compliance against that plan and you look at you say well that's all logical right we plan for something we then figure out how we're gonna get there we go execute to get there and you know in a traditional world that was easy and still some of this makes sense I don't say throw out all of this but you have to recognize in a more uncertain volatile world where you can be blindsided by orthogonal competitors coming in and you the term uber eyes you have to recognize that you can't always plan or know what the future is and so if you don't well then what replaces the traditional model or certainly how do you augment the traditional model to be successful in a world that you knows ambiguous well what we've heard from customers and what you'll see examples of this through the course of this morning planning is can be replaced by configuring so you can configure for a constant rate of change without necessarily having to know what that change is this idea of prescription of here's the activities people need to perform and let's lay these out very very crisply job descriptions what organizations are going to do can be replaced by a greater degree of enablement right so this idea of how do you enable people with the knowledge and things that they need to be able to make the right decisions and then ultimately this idea of execution as compliance can be replaced by a greater level of engagement of people across the organization to ultimately be able to react at a faster speed to the changes that happen so just double clicking in each of those for a couple minutes so what I mean by configure for constant change so again we don't know exactly what the change is going to be but we know it's going to happen and last year I talked a little bit about a process solution to that problem I called it that you have to try learn modify and what that model try learn modify was for anybody in the app dev space it was basically taking the principles of agile and DevOps and applying those more broadly to business processes in technology organizations and ultimately organizations broadly this idea of you don't have to know what your ultimate destination is but you can try and experiment you can learn from those things and you can move forward and so that I do think in technology organizations we've seen tremendous progress even over the last year as organizations are adopting agile endeavor and so that still continues to be I think a great way for people to to configure their processes for change but this year we've seen some great examples of organizations taking a different tack to that problem and that's literally building modularity into their structures themselves right actually building the idea that change is going to happen into how you're laying out your technology architectures right we've all seen the reverse of that when you build these optimized systems for you know kind of one environment you kind of flip over two years later what was the optimized system it's now called a legacy system that needs to be migrated that's an optimized system that now has to be moved to a new environment because the world has changed so again you'll see a great example of that in a few minutes here on stage next this concept of enabled double-clicking on that a little bit so much of what we've done in technology over the past few years has been around automation how do we actually replace things that people were doing with technology or augmenting what people are doing with technology and that's incredibly important and that's work that can continue to go forward it needs to happen it's not really what I'm talking about here though enablement in this case it's much more around how do you make sure individuals are getting the context they need how are you making sure that they're getting the information they need how are you making sure they're getting the tools they need to make decisions on the spot so it's less about automating what people are doing and more about how can you better enable people with tools and technology now from a leadership perspective that's around making sure people understand the strategy of the company the context in which they're working in making sure you've set the appropriate values etc etc from a technology perspective that's ensuring that you're building the right systems that allow the right information the right tools at the right time to the right people now to some extent even that might not be hard but when the world is constantly changing that gets to be even harder and I think that's one of the reasons we see a lot of traction and open source to solve these problems to use flexible systems to help enterprises be able to enable their people not just in it today but to be flexible going forward and again we'll see some great examples of that and finally engagement so again if execution can't be around driving compliance to a plan because you no longer have this kind of Cris plan well what do leaders do how do organizations operate and so you know I'll broadly use the term engagement several of our customers have used this term and this is really saying well how do you engage your people in real-time to make the right decisions how do you accelerate a pace of cadence how do you operate at a different speed so you can react to change and take advantage of opportunities as they arise and everywhere we look IT is a key enabler of this right in the past IT was often seen as an inhibitor to this because the IT systems move slower than the business might want to move but we are seeing with some of these new technologies that literally IT is becoming the enabler and driving the pace of change back on to the business and you'll again see some great examples of that as well so again rather than listen to me sit here and theoretically talk about these things or refer to what we've seen others doing I thought it'd be much more interesting to bring some of our partners and our customers up here to specifically talk about what they're doing so I'm really excited to have a great group of customers who have agreed to stand in front of 7,500 people or however many here this morning and talk a little bit more about what they're doing so really excited to have them here and really appreciate all them agreeing to be a part of this and so to start I want to start with tee systems we have the CEO of tee systems here and I think this is a great story because they're really two parts to it right because he has two perspectives one is as the CEO of a global company itself having to navigate its way through digital disruption and as a global cloud service provider obviously helping its customers through this same type of change so I'm really thrilled to have a del hasta li join me on stage to talk a little bit about T systems and what they're doing and what we're doing jointly together so Adelle [Music] Jim took to see you Adele thank you for being here you for having me please join me I love to DJ when that fantastic we may have to hire him no more events for events where's well employed he's well employed though here that team do not give him mics activation it's great to have you here really do appreciate it well you're the CEO of a large organization that's going through this disruption in the same way we are I'd love to hear a little bit how for your company you're thinking about you know navigating this change that we're going through great well you know key systems as an ICT service provider we've been around for decades I'm not different to many of our clients we had to change the whole disruption of the cloud and digitization and new skills and new capability and agility it's something we had to face as well so over the last five years and especially in the last three years we invested heavily invested over a billion euros in building new capabilities building new offerings new infrastructures to support our clients so to be very disruptive for us as well and so and then with your customers themselves they're going through this set of change and you're working to help them how are you working to help enable your your customers as they're going through this change well you know all of them you know in this journey of changing the way they run their business leveraging IT much more to drive business results digitization and they're all looking for new skills new ideas they're looking for platforms that take them away from traditional waterfall development that takes a year or a year and a half before they see any results to processes and ways of bringing applications in a week in a month etcetera so it's it's we are part of that journey with them helping them for that and speaking of that I know we're working together and to help our joint customers with that can you talk a little bit more about what we're doing together sure well you know our relationship goes back years and years with with the Enterprise Linux but over the last few years we've invested heavily in OpenShift and OpenStack to build peope as layers to build you know flexible infrastructure for our clients and we've been working with you we tested many different technology in the marketplace and been more successful with Red Hat and the stack there and I'll give you an applique an example several large European car manufacturers who have connected cars now as a given have been accelerating the applications that needed to be in the car and in the past it took them years if not you know scores to get an application into the car and today we're using open shift as the past layer to develop to enable these DevOps for these companies and they bring applications in less than a month and it's a huge change in the dynamics of the competitiveness in the marketplace and we rely on your team and in helping us drive that capability to our clients yeah do you find it fascinating so many of the stories that you hear and that we've talked about with with our customers is this need for speed and this ability to accelerate and enable a greater degree of innovation by simply accelerating what what we're seeing with our customers absolutely with that plus you know the speed is important agility is really critical but doing it securely doing it doing it in a way that is not gonna destabilize the you know the broader ecosystem is really critical and things like GDP are which is a new security standard in Europe is something that a lot of our customers worry about they need help with and we're one of the partners that know what that really is all about and how to navigate within that and use not prevent them from using the new technologies yeah I will say it isn't just the speed of the external but the security and the regulation especially GDR we have spent an hour on that with our board this week there you go he said well thank you so much for being here really to appreciate the work that we're doing together and look forward to continued same here thank you thank you [Applause] we've had a great partnership with tea systems over the years and we've really taken it to the next level and what's really exciting about that is you know we've moved beyond just helping kind of host systems for our customers we really are jointly enabling their success and it's really exciting and we're really excited about what we're able to to jointly accomplish so next i'm really excited that we have our innovation award winners here and we'll have on stage with us our innovation award winners this year our BBVA dnm IAG lasat Lufthansa Technik and UPS and yet they're all working in one for specific technology initiatives that they're doing that really really stand out and are really really exciting you'll have a chance to learn a lot more about those through the course of the event over the next couple of days but in this context what I found fascinating is they were each addressing a different point of this configure enable engage and I thought it would be really great for you all to hear about how they're experimenting and working to solve these problems you know real-time large organizations you know happening now let's start with the video to see what they think about when they think about innovation I define innovation is something that's changing the model changing the way of thinking not just a step change improvement not just making something better but actually taking a look at what already exists and then putting them together in new and exciting lives innovation is about to build something nobody has done before historically we had a statement that business drives technology we flip that equation around an IT is now demonstrating to the business at power of technology innovation desde el punto de vista de la tecnología supone salir de plataform as proprietary as ADA Madero cloud basado an open source it's a possibility the open source que no parameter no sir Kamala and I think way that for me open-source stands for flexibility speed security the community and that contribution from the community is really driving innovation innovation at a pace that I don't think our one individual organization could actually do ourselves right so first I'd like to talk with BBVA I love this story because as you know Financial Services is going through a massive set of transformations and BBVA really is at the leading edge of thinking about how to deploy a hybrid cloud strategy and kind of modular layered architecture to be successful regardless of what happens in the future so with that I'd like to welcome on stage Jose Maria Rosetta from BBVA [Music] thank you for being here and congratulations on your innovation award it's been a pleasure to be here with you it's great to have you hi everybody so Josemaria for those who might not be familiar with BBVA can you give us a little bit of background on your company yeah a brief description BBVA is is a bank as a financial institution with diversified business model and that provides well financial services to more than 73 million of customers in more than 20 countries great and I know we've worked with you for a long time so we appreciate that the partnership with you so I thought I'd start with a really easy question for you how will blockchain you know impact financial services in the next five years I've gotten no idea but if someone knows the answer I've got a job for him for him up a pretty good job indeed you know oh all right well let me go a little easier then so how will the global payments industry change in the next you know four or five years five years well I think you need a a Weezer well I tried to make my best prediction means that in five years just probably will be five years older good answer I like that I always abstract up I hope so I hope so yah-yah-yah hope so good point so you know immediately that's the obvious question you have a massive technology infrastructure is a global bank how do you prepare yourself to enable the organization to be successful when you really don't know what the future is gonna be well global banks and wealth BBBS a global gam Bank a certain component foundations you know today I would like to talk about risk and efficiency so World Bank's deal with risk with the market great the operational reputational risk and so on so risk control is part of all or DNA you know and when you've got millions of customers you know efficiency efficiency is a must so I think there's no problem with all these foundations they problem the problem analyze the problems appears when when banks translate these foundations is valued into technology so risk control or risk management avoid risk usually means by the most expensive proprietary technology in the market you know from one of the biggest software companies in the world you know so probably all of you there are so those people in the room were glad to hear you say that yeah probably my guess the name of those companies around San Francisco most of them and efficiency usually means a savory business unit as every department or country has his own specific needs by a specific solution for them so imagine yourself working in a data center full of silos with many different Hardware operating systems different languages and complex interfaces to communicate among them you know not always documented what really never documented so your life your life in is not easy you know in this scenario are well there's no room for innovation so what's been or or strategy be BES ready to move forward in this new digital world well we've chosen a different approach which is quite simple is to replace all local proprietary system by a global platform based on on open source with three main goals you know the first one is reduce the average transaction cost to one-third the second one is increase or developers productivity five times you know and the third is enable or delete the business be able to deliver solutions of three times faster so you're not quite easy Wow and everything with the same reliability as on security standards as we've got today Wow that is an extraordinary set of objectives and I will say their world on the path of making that successful which is just amazing yeah okay this is a long journey sometimes a tough journey you know to be honest so we decided to partnership with the with the best companies in there in the world and world record we think rate cut is one of these companies so we think or your values and your knowledge is critical for BBVA and well as I mentioned before our collaboration started some time ago you know and just an example in today in BBVA a Spain being one of the biggest banks in in the country you know and using red hat technology of course our firm and fronting architecture you know for mobile and internet channels runs the ninety five percent of our customers request this is approximately 3,000 requests per second and our back in architecture execute 70 millions of business transactions a day this is almost a 50% of total online transactions executed in the country so it's all running yes running I hope so you check for you came on stage it's I'll be flying you know okay good there's no wood up here to knock on it's been a really great partnership it's been a pleasure yeah thank you so much for being here thank you thank you [Applause] I do love that story because again so much of what we talk about when we when we talk about preparing for digital is a processed solution and again things like agile and DevOps and modular izing components of work but this idea of thinking about platforms broadly and how they can run anywhere and actually delivering it delivering at a scale it's just a phenomenal project and experience and in the progress they've made it's a great team so next up we have two organizations that have done an exceptional job of enabling their people with the right information and the tools they need to be successful you know in both of these cases these are organizations who are under constant change and so leveraging the power of open-source to help them build these tools to enable and you'll see it the size and the scale of these in two very very different contexts it's great to see and so I'd like to welcome on stage Oh smart alza' with dnm and David Abraham's with IAG [Music] Oh smart welcome thank you so much for being here Dave great to see you thank you appreciate you being here and congratulations to you both on winning the Innovation Awards thank you so Omar I really found your story fascinating and how you're able to enable your people with data which is just significantly accelerated the pace with which they can make decisions and accelerate your ability to to act could you tell us a little more about the project and then what you're doing Jim and Tina when the muchisimas gracias por ever say interesado pono true projecto [Music] encargado registry controller las entradas a leda's persona por la Frontera argentina yo sé de dos siento treinta siete puestos de contrôle tienen lo largo de la Frontera tanto area the restreamer it EEMA e if looool in dilute ammonia shame or cinta me Jonas the tránsito sacra he trod on in another Fronteras dingus idea idea de la Magneto la cual estamos hablando la Frontera cantina tienen extension the kin same in kilo metros esto es el gada mint a maje or allege Estancia kaeun a poor carretera a la co de mexico con el akka a direction emulation s 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calidad de vida de atras de mettre personas SI y meet our que el delito perform a trois Natura from Dana's Argentine sigue siendo en favor de esto SI temes uno de los países mess Alberto's Allah immigration en Latin America yah hora con una plataforma mas segunda first of all I want to thank you for the interest is played for our project the National migration administration or diem records the entry and exit of people on the Argentine territory it grants residents permits to foreigners who wish to live in our country through 237 entry points land air border sea and river ways Jim dnm registered over 80 million transits throughout last year Argentine borders cover about 15,000 kilometers just our just to give you an idea of the magnitude of our borders this is greater than the distance on a highway between Mexico City and Alaska our department applies the mechanisms that prevent the entry and residents of people involved in crimes like terrorism trafficking of persons weapons drugs and others in 2016 we shifted to a more preventive and predictive paradigm that is how Sam's the system for migration analysis was created with red hats great assistance and support this allowed us to tackle the challenge of integrating multiple and varied issues legal issues police databases national and international security organizations like Interpol API advanced passenger information and PNR passenger name record this involved starting private cloud with OpenShift Rev data virtualization cloud forms and fuse that were the basis to develop Sam and implementing machine learning models and artificial intelligence our analysts consulted a number of systems and other manual files before 2016 4 days for each person entering or leaving the country so this has allowed us to optimize our decisions making them in real time each time Sam is consulted it processes patterns of over two billion data entries Sam's aim is to improve the quality of life of our citizens and visitors making sure that crime doesn't pierce our borders in an environment of analytic evolution and constant improvement in essence Sam contributes toward Argentina being one of the leaders in Latin America in terms of immigration with our new system great thank you and and so Dave tell us a little more about the insurance industry and the challenges in the EU face yeah sure so you know in the insurance industry it's a it's been a bit sort of insulated from a lot of major change in disruption just purely from the fact that it's highly regulated and the cost of so that the barrier to entry is quite high in fact if you think about insurance you know you have to have capital reserves to protect against those major events like floods bush fires and so on but the whole thing is a lot of change there's come in a really rapid pace I'm also in the areas of customer expectations you know customers and now looking and expecting for the same levels of flexibility and convenience that they would experience with more modern and new startups they're expecting out of the older institutions like banks and insurance companies like us so definitely expecting the industry to to be a lot more adaptable and to better meet their needs I think the other aspect of it really is in the data the data area where I think that the donor is now creating a much more significant connection between organizations in a car summers especially when you think about the level of devices that are now enabled and the sheer growth of data that's that that's growing at exponential rates so so that the impact then is that the systems that we used to rely on are the technology we used to rely on to be able to handle that kind of growth no longer keeps up and is able to to you know build for the future so we need to sort of change that so what I G's really doing is transform transforming the organization to become a lot more efficient focus more on customers and and really set ourselves up to be agile and adaptive and so ya know as part of your Innovation Award that the specific set of projects you tied a huge amount of different disparate systems together and with M&A and other you have a lot to do there to you tell us a little more about kind of how you're able to better respond to customer needs by being able to do that yeah no you're right so we've we've we're nearly a hundred year old company that's grown from lots of merger and acquisition and just as a result of that that means that data's been sort of spread out and fragmented across multiple brands and multiple products and so the number one sort of issue and problem that we were hearing was that it was too hard to get access to data and it's highly complicated which is not great from a company from our perspective really because because we are a data company right that's what we do we we collect data about people what they what's important to them what they value and the environment in which they live so that we can understand that risk and better manage and protect those people so what we're doing is we're trying to make and what we have been doing is making data more open and accessible and and by that I mean making data more of easily available for people to use it to make decisions in their day-to-day activity and to do that what we've done is built a single data platform across the group that unifies the data into a single source of truth that we can then build on top of that single views of customers for example that puts the right information into the into the hands of the people that need it the most and so now why does open source play such a big part in doing that I know there are a lot of different solutions that could get you there sure well firstly I think I've been sauce has been k2 these and really it's been key because we've basically started started from scratch to build this this new next-generation data platform based on entirely open-source you know using great components like Kafka and Postgres and airflow and and and and and then fundamentally building on top of red Red Hat OpenStack right to power all that and they give us the flexibility that we need to be able to make things happen much faster for example we were just talking to the pivotal guys earlier this week here and some of the stuff that we're doing they're they're things quite interesting innovative writes even sort of maybe first in the world where we've taken the older sort of appliance and dedicated sort of massive parallel processing unit and ported that over onto red Red Hat OpenStack right which is now giving us a lot more flexibility for scale in a much more efficient way but you're right though that we've come from in the past a more traditional approach to to using vendor based technology right which was good back then when you know technology solutions could last for around 10 years or so on and and that was fine but now that we need to move much faster we've had to rethink that and and so our focus has been on using you know more commoditized open source technology built by communities to give us that adaptability and sort of remove the locking in there any entrenchment of technology so that's really helped us but but I think that the last point that's been really critical to us is is answering that that concern and question about ongoing support and maintenance right so you know in a regular environment the regulator is really concerned about anything that could fundamentally impact business operation and and so the question is always about what happens when something goes wrong who's going to be there to support you which is where the value of the the partnership we have with Red Hat has really come into its own right and what what it's done is is it's actually giving us the best of both worlds a means that we can we can leverage and use and and and you know take some of the technology that's being developed by great communities in the open source way but also partner with a trusted partner in red had to say you know they're going to stand behind that community and provide that support when we needed the most so that's been the kind of the real value out of that partnership okay well I appreciate I love the story it's how do you move quickly leverage the power community but do it in a safe secure way and I love the idea of your literally empowering people with machine learning and AI at the moment when they need it it's just an incredible story so thank you so much for being here appreciate it thank you [Applause] you know again you see in these the the importance of enabling people with data and in an old-world was so much data was created with a system in mind versus data is a separate asset that needs to be available real time to anyone is a theme we hear over and over and over again and so you know really looking at open source solutions that allow that flexibility and keep data from getting locked into proprietary silos you know is a theme that we've I've heard over and over over the past year with many of our customers so I love logistics I'm a geek that way I come from that background in the past and I know that running large complex operations requires flawless execution and that requires great data and we have two great examples today around how to engage own organizations in new and more effective ways in the case of lufthansa technik literally IT became the business so it wasn't enabling the business it became the business offering and importantly went from idea to delivery to customers in a hundred days and so this theme of speed and the importance of speed it's a it's a great story you'll hear more about and then also at UPS UPS again I talked a little earlier about IT used to be kind of the long pole in the tent the thing that was slow moving because of the technology but UPS is showing that IT can actually drive the business and the cadence of business even faster by demonstrating the power and potential of technology to engage in this case hundreds of thousands of people to make decisions real-time in the face of obviously constant change around weather mechanicals and all the different things that can happen in a large logistics operation like that so I'd like to welcome on stage to be us more from Lufthansa Technik and Nick Castillo from ups to be us welcome thank you for being here Nick thank you thank you Jim and congratulations on your Innovation Awards oh thank you it's a great honor so to be us let's start with you can you tell us a little bit more about what a viet are is yeah avatars are a digital platform offering features like aircraft condition analytics reliability management and predictive maintenance and it helps airlines worldwide to digitize and improve their operations so all of the features work and can be used separately or generate even more where you burn combined and finally we decided to set up a viet as an open platform that means that we avoid the whole aviation industry to join the community and develop ideas on our platform and to be as one of things i found really fascinating about this is that you had a mandate to do this at a hundred days and you ultimately delivered on it you tell us a little bit about that i mean nothing in aviation moves that fast yeah that's been a big challenge so in the beginning of our story the Lufthansa bot asked us to develop somehow digital to win of an aircraft within just hundred days and to deliver something of value within 100 days means you cannot spend much time and producing specifications in terms of paper etc so for us it was pretty clear that we should go for an angel approach and immediately start and developing ideas so we put the best experts we know just in one room and let them start to work and on day 2 I think we already had the first scribbles for the UI on day 5 we wrote the first lines of code and we were able to do that because it has been a major advantage for us to already have four technologies taken place it's based on open source and especially rated solutions because we did not have to waste any time setting up the infrastructure and since we wanted to get feedback very fast we were certainly visited an airline from the Lufthansa group already on day 30 and showed them the first results and got a lot of feedback and because from the very beginning customer centricity has been an important aspect for us and changing the direction based on customer feedback has become quite normal for us over time yeah it's an interesting story not only engaging the people internally but be able to engage with a with that with a launch customer like that and get feedback along the way as it's great thing how is it going overall since launch yeah since the launch last year in April we generated much interest in the industry as well from Airlines as from competitors and in the following month we focused on a few Airlines which had been open minded and already advanced in digital activities and we've got a lot of feedback by working with them and we're able to improve our products by developing new features for example we learned that data integration can become quite complex in the industry and therefore we developed a new feature called quick boarding allowing Airlines to integrate into the via table platform within one day using a self-service so and currently we're heading for the next steps beyond predictive maintenance working on process automation and prescriptive prescriptive maintenance because we believe prediction without fulfillment still isn't enough it really is a great example of even once you're out there quickly continuing to innovate change react it's great to see so Nick I mean we all know ups I'm still always blown away by the size and scale of the company and the logistics operations that you run you tell us a little more about the project and what we're doing together yeah sure Jim and you know first of all I think I didn't get the sportcoat memo I think I'm the first one up here today with a sport coat but you know first on you know on behalf of the 430,000 ups was around the world and our just world-class talented team of 5,000 IT professionals I have to tell you we're humbled to be one of this year's red hat Innovation Award recipients so we really appreciate that you know as a global logistics provider we deliver about 20 million packages each day and we've got a portfolio of technologies both operational and customer tech and another customer facing side the power what we call the UPS smart logistics network and I gotta tell you innovations in our DNA technology is at the core of everything we do you know from the ever familiar first and industry mobile platform that a lot of you see when you get delivered a package which we call the diad which believe it or not we delivered in 1992 my choice a data-driven solution that drives over 40 million of our my choice customers I'm whatever you know what this is great he loves logistics he's a my choice customer you could be one too by the way there's a free app in the App Store but it provides unmatched visibility and really controls that last mile delivery experience so now today we're gonna talk about the solution that we're recognized for which is called site which is part of a much greater platform that we call edge which is transforming how our package delivery teams operate providing them real-time insights into our operations you know this allows them to make decisions based on data from 32 disparate data sources and these insights help us to optimize our operations but more importantly they help us improve the delivery experience for our customers just like you Jim you know on the on the back end is Big Data and it's on a large scale our systems are crunching billions of events to render those insights on an easy-to-use mobile platform in real time I got to tell you placing that information in our operators hands makes ups agile and being agile being able to react to changing conditions as you know is the name of the game in logistics now we built edge in our private cloud where Red Hat technologies play a very important role as part of our overage overarching cloud strategy and our migration to agile and DevOps so it's it's amazing it's amazing the size and scale so so you have this technology vision around engaging people in a more effect way those are my word not yours but but I'd be at that's how it certainly feels and so tell us a little more about how that enables the hundreds of thousands people to make better decisions every day yep so you know we're a people company and the edge platform is really the latest in a series of solutions to really empower our people and really power that smart logistics network you know we've been deploying technology believe it or not since we founded the company in 1907 we'll be a hundred and eleven years old this August it's just a phenomenal story now prior to edge and specifically the syphon ishutin firm ation from a number of disparate systems and reports they then need to manually look across these various data sources and and frankly it was inefficient and prone to inaccuracy and it wasn't really real-time at all now edge consumes data as I mentioned earlier from 32 disparate systems it allows our operators to make decisions on staffing equipment the flow of packages through the buildings in real time the ability to give our people on the ground the most up-to-date data allows them to make informed decisions now that's incredibly empowering because not only are they influencing their local operations but frankly they're influencing the entire global network it's truly extraordinary and so why open source and open shift in particular as part of that solution yeah you know so as I mentioned Red Hat and Red Hat technology you know specifically open shift there's really core to our cloud strategy and to our DevOps strategy the tools and environments that we've partnered with Red Hat to put in place truly are foundational and they've fundamentally changed the way we develop and deploy our systems you know I heard Jose talk earlier you know we had complex solutions that used to take 12 to 18 months to develop and deliver to market today we deliver those same solutions same level of complexity in months and even weeks now openshift enables us to container raise our workloads that run in our private cloud during normal operating periods but as we scale our business during our holiday peak season which is a very sure window about five weeks during the year last year as a matter of fact we delivered seven hundred and sixty-two million packages in that small window and our transactions our systems they just spiked dramatically during that period we think that having open shift will allow us in those peak periods to seamlessly move workloads to the public cloud so we can take advantage of burst capacity economically when needed and I have to tell you having this flexibility I think is key because you know ultimately it's going to allow us to react quickly to customer demands when needed dial back capacity when we don't need that capacity and I have to say it's a really great story of UPS and red hat working you together it really is a great story is just amazing again the size and scope but both stories here a lot speed speed speed getting to market quickly being able to try things it's great lessons learned for all of us the importance of being able to operate at a fundamentally different clock speed so thank you all for being here very much appreciated congratulate thank you [Applause] [Music] alright so while it's great to hear from our Innovation Award winners and it should be no surprise that they're leading and experimenting in some really interesting areas its scale so I hope that you got a chance to learn something from these interviews you'll have an opportunity to learn more about them you'll also have an opportunity to vote on the innovator of the year you can do that on the Red Hat summit mobile app or on the Red Hat Innovation Awards homepage you can learn even more about their stories and you'll have a chance to vote and I'll be back tomorrow to announce the the summit winner so next I like to spend a few minutes on talking about how Red Hat is working to catalyze our customers efforts Marko bill Peter our senior vice president of customer experience and engagement and John Alessio our vice president of global services will both describe areas in how we are working to configure our own organization to effectively engage with our customers to use open source to help drive their success so with that I'd like to welcome marquel on stage [Music] good morning good morning thank you Jim so I want to spend a few minutes to talk about how we are configured how we are configured towards your success how we enable internally as well to work towards your success and actually engage as well you know Paul yesterday talked about the open source culture and our open source development net model you know there's a lot of attributes that we have like transparency meritocracy collaboration those are the key of our culture they made RedHat what it is today and what it will be in the future but we also added our passion for customer success to that let me tell you this is kind of the configuration from a cultural perspective let me tell you a little bit on what that means so if you heard the name my organization is customer experience and engagement right in the past we talked a lot about support it's an important part of the Red Hat right and how we are configured we are configured probably very uniquely in the industry we put support together we have product security in there we add a documentation we add a quality engineering into an organization you think there's like wow why are they doing it we're also running actually the IT team for actually the product teams why are we doing that now you can imagine right we want to go through what you see as well right and I'll give you a few examples on how what's coming out of this configuration we invest more and more in testing integration and use cases which you are applying so you can see it between the support team experiencing a lot what you do and actually changing our test structure that makes a lot of sense we are investing more and more testing outside the boundaries so not exactly how things must fall by product management or engineering but also how does it really run in an environment that you operate we run complex setups internally right taking openshift putting in OpenStack using software-defined storage underneath managing it with cloud forms managing it if inside we do that we want to see how that works right we are reshaping documentation console to kind of help you better instead of just documenting features and knobs as in how can how do you want to achieve things now part of this is the configuration that are the big part of the configuration is the voice of the customer to listen to what you say I've been here at Red Hat a few years and one of my passion has always been really hearing from customers how they do it I travel constantly in the world and meet with customers because I want to know what is really going on we use channels like support we use channels like getting from salespeople the interaction from customers we do surveys we do you know we interact with our people to really hear what you do what we also do what maybe not many know and it's also very unique in the industry we have a webpage called you asked reacted we show very transparently you told us this is an area for improvement and it's not just in support it's across the company right build us a better web store build us this we're very transparent about Hades improvements we want to do with you now if you want to be part of the process today go to the feedback zone on the next floor down and talk to my team I might be there as well hit me up we want to hear the feedback this is how we talk about configuration of the organization how we are configured let me go to let me go to another part which is innovation innovation every day and that in my opinion the enable section right we gotta constantly innovate ourselves how do we work with you how do we actually provide better value how do we provide faster responses in support this is what we would I say is is our you know commitment to innovation which is the enabling that Jim talked about and I give you a few examples which I'm really happy and it kind of shows the open source culture at Red Hat our commitment is for innovation I'll give you good example right if you have a few thousand engineers and you empower them you kind of set the business framework as hey this is an area we got to do something you get a lot of good IDs you get a lot of IDs and you got a shape an inter an area that hey this is really something that brings now a few years ago we kind of said or I say is like based on a lot of feedback is we got to get more and more proactive if you customers and so I shaped my team and and I shaped it around how can we be more proactive it started very simple as in like from kbase articles or knowledgebase articles in getting started guys then we started a a tool that we put out called labs you've probably seen them if you're on the technical side really taking small applications out for you to kind of validate is this configured correctly stat configure there was the start then out of that the ideas came and they took different turns and one of the turns that we came out was right at insights that we launched a few years ago and did you see the demo yesterday that in Paul's keynote that they showed how something was broken with one the data centers how it was applied to fix and how has changed this is how innovation really came from the ground up from the support side and turned into something really a being a cornerstone of our strategy and we're keeping it married from the day to day work right you don't want to separate this you want to actually keep that the data that's coming from the support goes in that because that's the power that we saw yesterday in the demo now innovation doesn't stop when you set the challenge so we did the labs we did the insights we just launched a solution engine called solution engine another thing that came out of that challenge is in how do we break complex issues down that it's easier for you to find a solution quicker it's one example but we're also experimenting with AI so insights uses AI as you probably heard yesterday we also use it internally to actually drive faster resolution we did in one case with a a our I bought basically that we get to 25% faster resolution on challenges that you have the beauty for you obviously it's well this is much faster 10% of all our support cases today are supported and assisted by an AI now I'll give you another example of just trying to tell you the innovation that comes out if you configure and enable the team correctly kbase articles are knowledgebase articles we q8 thousands and thousands every year and then I get feedback as and while they're good but they're in English as you can tell my English is perfect so it's not no issue for that but for many of you is maybe like even here even I read it in Japanese so we actually did machine translation because it's too many that we can do manually the using machine translation I can tell it's a funny example two weeks ago I tried it I tried something from English to German I looked at it the German looked really bad I went back but the English was bad so it really translates one to one actually what it does but it's really cool this is innovation that you can apply and the team actually worked on this and really proud on that now the real innovation there is not these tools the real innovation is that you can actually shape it in a way that the innovation comes that you empower the people that's the configure and enable and what I think is all it's important this don't reinvent the plumbing don't start from scratch use systems like containers on open shift to actually build the innovation in a smaller way without reinventing the plumbing you save a lot of issues on security a lot of issues on reinventing the wheel focus on that that's what we do as well if you want to hear more details again go in the second floor now let's talk about the engage that Jim mentioned before what I translate that engage is actually engaging you as a customer towards your success now what does commitment to success really mean and I want to reflect on that on a traditional IT company shows up with you talk the salesperson solution architect works with you consulting implements solution it comes over to support and trust me in a very traditional way the support guy has no clue what actually was sold early on it's what happens right and this is actually I think that red had better that we're not so silent we don't show our internal silos or internal organization that much today we engage in a way it doesn't matter from which team it comes we have a better flow than that you deserve how the sausage is made but we can never forget what was your business objective early on now how is Red Hat different in this and we are very strong in my opinion you might disagree but we are very strong in a virtual accounting right really putting you in the middle and actually having a solution architect work directly with support or consulting involved and driving that together you can also help us in actually really embracing that model if that's also other partners or system integrators integrate put yourself in the middle be around that's how we want to make sure that we don't lose sight of the original business problem trust me reducing the hierarchy or getting rid of hierarchy and bureaucracy goes a long way now this is how we configured this is how we engage and this is how we are committed to your success with that I'm going to introduce you to John Alessio that talks more about some of the innovation done with customers thank you [Music] good morning I'm John Alessio I'm the vice president of Global Services and I'm delighted to be with you here today I'd like to talk to you about a couple of things as it relates to what we've been doing since the last summit in the services organization at the core of everything we did it's very similar to what Marco talked to you about our number one priority is driving our customer success with red hat technology and as you see here on the screen we have a number of different offerings and capabilities all the way from training certification open innovation labs consulting really pairing those capabilities together with what you just heard from Marco in the support or cee organization really that's the journey you all go through from the beginning of discovering what your business challenge is all the way through designing those solutions and deploying them with red hat now the highlight like to highlight a few things of what we've been up to over the last year so if I start with the training and certification team they've been very busy over the last year really updating enhancing our curriculum if you haven't stopped by the booth there's a preview for new capability around our learning community which is a new way of learning and really driving that enable meant in the community because 70% of what you need to know you learned from your peers and so it's a very key part of our learning strategy and in fact we take customer satisfaction with our training and certification business very seriously we survey all of our students coming out of training 93% of our students tell us they're better prepared because of red hat training and certification after Weeds they've completed the course we've updated the courses and we've trained well over a hundred and fifty thousand people over the last two years so it's a very very key part of our strategy and that combined with innovation labs and the consulting operation really drive that overall journey now we've been equally busy in enhancing the system of enablement and support for our business partners another very very key initiative is building out the ecosystem we've enhanced our open platform which is online partner enablement network we've added new capability and in fact much of the training and enablement that we do for our internal consultants our deal is delivered through the open platform now what I'm really impressed with and thankful for our partners is how they are consuming and leveraging this material we train and enable for sales for pre-sales and for delivery and we're up over 70% year in year in our partners that are enabled on RedHat technology let's give our business partners a round of applause now one of our offerings Red Hat open innovation labs I'd like to talk a bit more about and take you through a case study open innovation labs was created two years ago it's really there to help you on your journey in adopting open source technology it's an immersive experience where your team will work side-by-side with Red Hatters to really propel your journey forward in adopting open source technology and in fact we've been very busy since the summit in Boston as you'll see coming up on the screen we've completed dozens of engagements leveraging our methods tools and processes for open innovation labs as you can see we've worked with large and small accounts in fact if you remember summit last year we had a European customer easier AG on stage which was a startup and we worked with them at the very beginning of their business to create capabilities in a very short four-week engagement but over the last year we've also worked with very large customers such as Optim and Delta Airlines here in North America as well as Motability operations in the European arena one of the accounts I want to spend a little bit more time on is Heritage Bank heritage Bank is a community owned bank in Toowoomba Australia their challenge was not just on creating new innovative technology but their challenge was also around cultural transformation how to get people to work together across the silos within their organization we worked with them at all levels of the organization to create a new capability the first engagement went so well that they asked us to come in into a second engagement so I'd like to do now is run a video with Peter lock the chief executive officer of Heritage Bank so he can take you through their experience Heritage Bank is one of the country's oldest financial institutions we have to be smarter we have to be more innovative we have to be more agile we had to change we had to find people to help us make that change the Red Hat lab is the only one that truly helps drive that change with a business problem the change within the team is very visible from the start to now we've gone from being separated to very single goal minded seeing people that I only ever seen before in their cubicles in the room made me smile programmers in their thinking I'm now understanding how the whole process fits together the productivity of IT will change and that is good for our business that's really the value that were looking for the Red Hat innovation labs for us were a really great experience I'm not interested in running an organization I'm interested in making a great organization to say I was pleasantly surprised by it is an understatement I was delighted I love the quote I was delighted makes my heart warm every time I see that video you know since we were at summit for those of you who are with us in Boston some of you went on our hardhat tours we've opened three physical facilities here at Red Hat where we can conduct red head open Innovation Lab engagements Singapore London and Boston were all opened within the last physical year and in fact our site in Boston is paired with our world-class executive briefing center as well so if you haven't been there please do check it out I'd like to now talk to you a bit about a very special engagement that we just recently completed we just recently completed an engagement with UNICEF the United Nations Children's Fund and the the purpose behind this engagement was really to help UNICEF create an open-source platform that marries big data with social good the idea is UNICEF needs to be better prepared to respond to emergency situations and as you can imagine emergency situations are by nature unpredictable you can't really plan for them they can happen anytime anywhere and so we worked with them on a project that we called school mapping and the idea was to provide more insights so that when emergency situations arise UNICEF could do a much better job in helping the children in the region and so we leveraged our Red Hat open innovation lab methods tools processes that you've heard about just like we did at Heritage Bank and the other accounts I mentioned but then we also leveraged Red Hat software technologies so we leveraged OpenShift container platform we leveraged ansible automation we helped the client with a more agile development approach so they could have releases much more frequently and continue to update this over time we created a continuous integration continuous deployment pipeline we worked on containers and container in the application etc with that we've been able to provide a platform that is going to allow for their growth to better respond to these emergency situations let's watch a short video on UNICEF mission of UNICEF innovation is to apply technology to the world's most pressing problems facing children data is changing the landscape of what we do at UNICEF this means that we can figure out what's happening now on the ground who it's happening to and actually respond to it in much more of a real-time manner than we used to be able to do we love working with open source communities because of their commitment that we should be doing good for the world we're actually with red hat building a sandbox where universities or other researchers or data scientists can connect and help us with our work if you want to use data for social good there's so many groups out there that really need your help and there's so many ways to get involved [Music] so let's give a very very warm red hat summit welcome to Erica kochi co-founder of unicef innovation well Erica first of all welcome to Red Hat summit thanks for having me here it's our pleasure and thank you for joining us so Erica I've just talked a bit about kind of what we've been up to and Red Hat services over the last year we talked a bit about our open innovation labs and we did this project the school mapping project together our two teams and I thought the audience might find it interesting from your point of view on why the approach we use in innovation labs was such a good fit for the school mapping project yeah it was a great fit for for two reasons the first is values everything that we do at UNICEF innovation we use open source technology and that's for a couple of reasons because we can take it from one place and very easily move it to other countries around the world we work in 190 countries so that's really important for us not to be able to scale things also because it makes sense we can get we can get more communities involved in this and look not just try to do everything by ourselves but look much open much more openly towards the open source communities out there to help us with our work we can't do it alone yeah and then the second thing is methodology you know the labs are really looking at taking this agile approach to prototyping things trying things failing trying again and that's really necessary when you're developing something new and trying to do something new like mapping every school in the world yeah very challenging work think about it 190 countries Wow and so the open source platform really works well and then the the rapid prototyping was really a good fit so I think the audience might find it interesting on how this application and this platform will help children in Latin America so in a lot of countries in Latin America and many countries throughout the world that UNICEF works in are coming out of either decades of conflict or are are subject to natural disasters and not great infrastructure so it's really important to a for us to know where schools are where communities are well where help is needed what's connected what's not and using a overlay of various sources of data from poverty mapping to satellite imagery to other sources we can really figure out what's happening where resources are where they aren't and so we can plan better to respond to emergencies and to and to really invest in areas that are needed that need that investment excellent excellent it's quite powerful what we were able to do in a relatively short eight or nine week engagement that our two teams did together now many of your colleagues in the audience are using open source today looking to expand their use of open source and I thought you might have some recommendations for them on how they kind of go through that journey and expanding their use of open source since your experience at that yeah for us it was it was very much based on what's this gonna cost we have limited resources and what's how is this gonna spread as quickly as possible mm-hmm and so we really asked ourselves those two questions you know about 10 years ago and what we realized is if we are going to be recommending technologies that governments are going to be using it really needs to be open source they need to have control over it yeah and they need to be working with communities not developing it themselves yeah excellent excellent so I got really inspired with what we were doing here in this project it's one of those you know every customer project is really interesting to me this one kind of pulls a little bit at your heartstrings on what the real impact could be here and so I know some of our colleagues here in the audience may want to get involved how can they get involved well there's many ways to get involved with the other UNICEF or other groups out there you can search for our work on github and there are tasks that you can do right now if and if you're looking for to do she's got work for you and if you want sort of a more a longer engagement or a bigger engagement you can check out our website UNICEF stories org and you can look at the areas you might be interested in and contact us we're always open to collaboration excellent well Erica thank you for being with us here today thank you for the great project we worked on together and have a great summer thank you for being give her a round of applause all right well I hope that's been helpful to you to give you a bit of an update on what we've been focused on in global services the message I'll leave with you is our top priority is customer success as you heard through the story from UNICEF from Heritage Bank and others we can help you innovate where you are today I hope you have a great summit and I'll call out Jim Whitehurst thank you John and thank you Erica that's really an inspiring story we have so many great examples of how individuals and organizations are stepping up to transform in the face of digital disruption I'd like to spend my last few minutes with one real-world example that brings a lot of this together and truly with life-saving impact how many times do you think you can solve a problem which is going to allow a clinician to now save the life I think the challenge all of his physicians are dealing with is data overload I probably look at over 100,000 images in a day and that's just gonna get worse what if it was possible for some computer program to look at these images with them and automatically flag images that might deserve better attention Chris on the surface seems pretty simple but underneath Chris has a lot going on in the past year I've seen Chris Foreman community and a space usually dominated by proprietary software I think Chris can change medicine as we know it today [Music] all right with that I'd like to invite on stage dr. Ellen grant from Boston Children's Hospital dr. grant welcome thank you for being here so dr. grant tell me who is Chris Chris does a lot of work for us and I think Chris is making me or has definitely the potential to make me a better doctor Chris helps us take data from our archives in the hospital and port it to wrap the fastback ends like the mass up and cloud to do rapid data processing and provide it back to me in any format on a desktop an iPad or an iPhone so it it basically brings high-end data analysis right to me at the bedside and that's been a barrier that I struggled with years ago to try to break down so that's where we started with Chris is to to break that barrier between research that occurred on a timeline of days to weeks to months to clinical practice which occurs in the timeline of seconds to minutes well one of things I found really fascinating about this story RedHat in case you can't tell we're really passionate about user driven innovation is this is an example of user driven innovation not directly at a technology company but in medicine excuse me can you tell us just a little bit about the genesis of Chris and how I got started yeah Chris got started when I was running a clinical division and I was very frustrated with not having the latest image analysis tools at my fingertips while I was on clinical practice and I would have to on the research so I could go over and you know do line code and do the data analysis but if I'm always over in clinical I kept forgetting how to do those things and I wanted to have all those innovations that my fingertips and not have to remember all the computer science because I'm a physician not like a better scientist so I wanted to build a platform that gave me easy access to that back-end without having to remember all the details and so that's what Chris does for us is brings allowed me to go into the PAC's grab a dataset send it to a computer and back in to do the analysis and bring it back to me without having to worry about where it was or how it got there that's all involved in the in the platform Chris and why not just go to a vendor and ask them to write a piece of software for you to do that yeah we thought about that and we do a lot of technical innovations and we always work with the experts so we wanted to work with if I'm going to be able to say an optical device I'm going to work with the optical engineers or an EM our system I'm going to work with em our engineers so we wanted to work with people who really knew or the plumbers so to speak of the software in industry so we ended up working with the massive point cloud for the platform and the distributed systems in Red Hat as the infrastructure that's starting to support Chris and that's been actually a really incredible journey for us because medical ready medical softwares not typically been a community process and that's something that working with dan from Red Hat we learned a lot about how to participate in an open community and I think our team has grown a lot as a result of that collaboration and I know you we've talked about in the past that getting this data locked into a proprietary system you may not be able to get out there's a real issue can you talk about the importance of open and how that's worked in the process yeah and I think for the medical community and I find this resonates with other physicians as well too is that it's medical data we want to continue to own and we feel very awkward about giving it to industry so we would rather have our data sitting in an open cloud like the mass open cloud where we can have a data consortium that oversees the data governance so that we're not giving our data way to somebody else but have a platform that we can still keep a control of our own data and I think it's going to be the future because we're running of a space in the hospital we generate so much data and it's just going to get worse as I was mentioning and all the systems run faster we get new devices so the amount of data that we have to filter through is just astronomically increasing so we need to have resources to store and compute on such large databases and so thinking about where this could go I mean this is a classic feels like an open-source project it started really really small with a originally modest set of goals and it's just kind of continue to grow and grow and grow it's a lot like if yes leanest torval Linux would be in 1995 you probably wouldn't think it would be where it is now so if you dream with me a little bit where do you think this could possibly go in the next five years ten years what I hope it'll do is allow us to break down the silos within the hospital because to do the best job at what we physicians do not only do we have to talk and collaborate together as individuals we have to take the data each each community develops and be able to bring it together so in other words I need to be able to bring in information from vital monitors from mr scans from optical devices from genetic tests electronic health record and be able to analyze on all that data combined so ideally this would be a platform that breaks down those information barriers in a hospital and also allows us to collaborate across multiple institutions because many disorders you only see a few in each hospital so we really have to work as teams in the medical community to combine our data together and also I'm hoping that and we even have discussions with people in the developing world because they have systems to generate or to got to create data or say for example an M R system they can't create data but they don't have the resources to analyze on it so this would be a portable for them to participate in this growing data analysis world without having to have the infrastructure there and be a portal into our back-end and we could provide the infrastructure to do the data analysis it really is truly amazing to see how it's just continued to grow and grow and expand it really is it's a phenomenal story thank you so much for being here appreciate it thank you [Applause] I really do love that story it's a great example of user driven innovation you know in a different industry than in technology and you know recognizing that a clinicians need for real-time information is very different than a researchers need you know in projects that can last weeks and months and so rather than trying to get an industry to pivot and change it's a great opportunity to use a user driven approach to directly meet those needs so we still have a long way to go we have two more days of the summit and as I said yesterday you know we're not here to give you all the answers we're here to convene the conversation so I hope you will have an opportunity today and tomorrow to meet some new people to share some ideas we're really really excited about what we can all do when we work together so I hope you found today valuable we still have a lot more happening on the main stage as well this afternoon please join us back for the general session it's a really amazing lineup you'll hear from the women and opensource Award winners you'll also hear more about our collab program which is really cool it's getting middle school girls interested in open sourcing coding and so you'll have an opportunity to see some people involved in that you'll also hear from the open source Story speakers and you'll including in that you will see a demo done by a technologist who happens to be 11 years old so really cool you don't want to miss that so I look forward to seeing you then this afternoon thank you [Applause]

live from San Francisco it's the cube covering Red Hat summit 2018 brought to you by Red Hat okay welcome back everyone would live here in San Francisco California the Moscone West for the cubes exclusive coverage of Red Hat summit 2018 I'm John for the co-host of the cube was my closest week analyst John Troy a co-founder of tech reckoning advisory and Community Development firm our next two guests is erica kochi co-founder of unicef innovation the United Nations Children's Fund and Mike Walker director of open innovation labs at Red Hat welcome to the cube thanks for coming joining us thanks love this story so Erica take a minute to talk about what you're working on at UNICEF you guys doing a lot of great stuff you got the relationship with Red Hat innovation labs but you doing some pretty amazing things take them into explain what you're doing at UNICEF some of the projects and what we're going to talk about here with the school and the magic fox all the greatness sure so UNICEF innovation essentially what we do is take technology and apply it to the problems facing children around the world and we do that in a variety of ways I think the things that we're probably most most known for is our work in mobile technology to connect frontline health workers and young people to to governments and have let them have a say in what's happening in in you know the halls of government and we have a program called you report which has five million young people from all over the world who are talking directly to their government representatives they need that now more than ever we certainly do yeah so open source obviously with red hat big shared vision talk about the shared mission like what's going on but there where's the connection I was the open source was great for society we've seen the benefits all around the world how is this translating for you guys yeah so I've been at Red Hat for a while and obviously we're the world's largest open source enterprise open source software company and I as a consultant been able to see Red Hat open source software used for many different purposes in every vertical you can think of but this one was really unique because we found a natural partnership I think between some of UNICEF innovations vision to use open source and open principles for maximum impact for good and so when I learned about innovation at UNICEF really by chance I just ran into a colleague at a meeting in New York and and she gave me a few words about it I said this is incredible because we can leverage all of what we learned at Red Hat our knowledge of open source to impact people and culture and not just for technical reasons and and partnered with UNICEF to make maximum social impact for children that need it most and you got red house key a technology company a lot of smart people there but with open source there's been a DNA in your bloodstream of the company around democratization and now we're out in the open with everyone online and everything's good this is a democratization piece talk about some of that the things that you guys are doing with red hat what specifically are you celebrating together here so we had a great collaboration with with Red Hat there at their labs program which really took a look at our challenge of using big data to read or understand what's happening on the ground especially in schools in countries that are either coming out of emergencies or have limited access to a lot of the parts of the country and so we layered satellite imagery information on poverty other sets of data you can really get a clear picture about where we should be allocating our resources and how we should be planning for emergencies and this collaboration just just finished up a couple days ago right and it's really been great what's some of the impact give an example of some of the use cases so actually saving time money will be things around yeah what what are some of the impact things that you see with this project what are some of the things a lot of countries right now are thinking about how they can connect all of their schools and make sure all of it their schools are online and give children this access to information that's really essential to to thrive in the world of today and tomorrow and if you don't know where your schools are and you don't know if they're connected or not and you can't see you know what else is happening it's in the socio-economic way in those areas it's really hard to figure out what to do and where to start so we're really just at the beginning of that process to try to connect every school in the world and we're at the moment we're trying to lay the groundwork to understand where we're at and where we need a level of insight you're providing once you connect the schools you can get people can know what to do and how to align with what's happening it's interesting I was just in Puerto Rico a couple weeks ago and the young kids there have self formed their own blockchain network between the schools and they're teaching themselves how to program because they recognize that to get out of their world and the mess that they're challenging through now post-hurricane they want to participate in the new economy so as someone not knowing that if I know I could help you're kind of providing a window into that kind of dynamic where is that kind of the use case is that how it's working so it's but participation and contribution is absolutely participation is key you know for young people and they need to it like really learn how to acquire the skills that they're gonna need to you know become successful productive adults in the future and school is you know one of the entry points to do that so that's really important and everyone loves that - yeah I'm kind of curious about the structure of the project today in the keynote you know Jim why does she start us off by saying well you know we can't plan everything we've got to be a little bit more agile here's a framework for how to how to really approach problems when we really don't know what the outcome or even what we're gonna hit so can you talk a little bit maybe about the structure of the of the process and did you know did you start with a blank piece of paper or do you know how did how did you figure out the pathway to the ultimate outcome here yeah I can take it first um that's a great question because at labs we experiment with ways to get fast feedback and really in a very short amount of time usually one to three months and a very limited amount of funds how can we make maximum impact using open technologies and open practices so the project was already in progress like most IT projects are right Gardi been some research we have data scientists to work with and one of the first things we did was really talk about really our concerns and fears about how we might work together using an exercise called how might we we kind of came together and said how might we solve this problem or that problem and just got it out on the table one of the aspects that I think work really is dedicating a small team in a residency style engagement where we worked off premise so Red Hatters left their office UNICEF folks left their office we came together in akola works based in New York City that was fairly convenient and you know we all focused on a tough problem and we decided really early on that in order to make sure that this problem actually would be usable and in the hands of end users in the field across the world we needed to get face to face so we made a trip to Latin America to work with a UNICEF field office to get fast feet up feedback on prototypes and that helped us adjust what we ended up shipping as the product at the end of the two months cycle Erika how was the outcome for you and your game it's great I think you know one of the things that really aligns RedHat and UNICEF is not just a commitment to open source and the values around that but also this agile methodology I think that you know to really move something a product forward or sort of a program forward you need to step away from the daily part of life you know and move away from the the email and the connection to the laptop and the phone and I think we were able to do that I also think that you need to ground truth things and so that you know that trip to the field and to really understand the context and the problems that that people are facing is is completely critical to success and that's like agile programming you kind of gotta get get out in the front lines not ask about the data I'm really intrigued so you got multiple data sources coming in love the satellite thing you're changing lives but you're saving lives too is your talk about you may name real-time efforts here what's the data science thing what's the tech behind I mean is it ingesting data as a third party data Z how does it work I mean can you share some some of the mechanics on the date of data science piece er yeah I think there's probably a lot we can talk about I could talk about data all day love data but some of the things that I think were fundamentally really exciting about this project and about what UNICEF innovation has done so let's take for example Facebook they have a whole lot of data but that's one company and it's sort of one lens to the world right it's it's quite broad and we get a lot of information but it's one company what UNICEF innovation has done is found ways to partner with private and public companies and private and public data sources in a way that maintains the security and integrity of that data so that it's not exposing proprietary information but they've been able to create those that community essentially that's willing to share information to solve a really tough challenge for social good and so we have actually a really wide variety of data at our disposal and our job was to create a sandbox that allow data scientists to really both proactively plan for things that might happen and reactively plan when events occur when we don't even know what that event might be so you know I like to think back to Jim Whitehurst's speech last year at summit where I said planning is dead we've got to try learn and modify I think that's exactly what we aim to build a platform that you know hasn't been planned for any one event or action but provides the flexibility for data scientists to try experiment pull different data together learn from it sharing Maps we integrated geospatial data and maps to be able to pass this along quickly and then modify based on the results so we can more quickly achieve something with the greatest impact that's awesome yeah so for example if you take you know you take like for example epidemics right so many factors are so many different types of data are needed to really understand what's happening in an epidemic for example take Zika you have temperature right mosquitos only breed at a certain at a certain temperature you have poverty or which really indicates standing water where mosquitoes can breed you have socioeconomic factors so it does the house more likely does it have mosquito screens or not and then you have the social right what are people talking about what are they concerned about and I think like a really interesting picture emerges when you can start to layer all of these kinds of data and that really helps us see where we should be focusing it's great discovery information using the data to drive kind of we're to look at and we're to focus efforts exactly and also a global footprint right and in previous decades maybe this would have run on a piece with some sort of a proprietary GIS thing or or yeah I'm not even sure right you chip around discs maybe but I mean not not to be too product oriented right built on OpenShift we've seen a whole lot this week right these global footprint you could take it live on any cloud I assume that's a piece of it right at global accessibility now for they out for the the resulting application absolutely and we want to take you know what we've done in one scenario and apply it to many others in many other locations and so being an open source is key for this because we wouldn't be able to do this in other locations are replicated just as easily handed to local folks have them an adapted and/or take it further or have other people work on it whether it's academics other companies us nice I love the structure like how its agile I got a Eric I ought to ask you about this because we're seeing a big trend with open source obviously that's well on its way to becoming it is the standard of doing software but mission driven technology activities aren't just nonprofits anymore you starting to see collaboration the JOBS Act that Obama put in place really set the table for new kind of funding so you've seen a lot more younger people coming in and saying hey you know what I can build it on the cloud and grants aware but the code gets live on right so you seeing a new flywheel around mission driven nonprofits and for-profits a new kind of entrepreneurship culture can you share insight into how this is developer you see a lot of it you have a lot of thoughts on this your them please so I think that you know as technology companies become so much more influential in our lives you know they're not just showing you the news anymore they were they're moving into every aspect of our lives whether it's in our into our homes or even inside our bodies that they're they're occupying as so much more influential role in an individual's life with that comes a tremendous amount of responsibility and I think that while it's not enough to say you should do good because it's the right thing to do I think that employees also really demand it I think that you know and that shift will occur because employees realize that they want to they want to be doing good in the world and if they're gonna be influencing so many people's lives that's really really it's a new citizenship model for the younger generations early Millennials want to work in a company that's not just the profit hungar motive but also there's some dynamics going on with the infrastructure world you look at Facebook as a classic example you know the word weaponizing content has been a bad thing but we've been talking about in the queue there's actually a reverse of that polar opposite which is you can weaponize content for good meaning that all the same principles that do bad things can be used for good things so this is where we started to see a lot more people saying hey let's do more of the fad and punish so the new kind of rules are developing in the society so I find it fascinating and I'm just curious is this known within the societal entrepreneurship culture or what's the what's your view on how to do more how to do better I'm doing a lot of work in what AI is gonna be meaning what's what it's gonna mean for children in the world and you know there are so many opportunities we've been talking about some of them but there are also a lot of risks right what does it mean when your child's best friend is a robot what does that change about our us us you know as human beings and so I think it's you know you have to look at both sides and you have to be very conscious about designing the technology that you want to see in the world that's gonna make the world a good place to live in and I think that there definitely is an awakening and that's going and there's a lot this is a first generation set of problems that social entrepreneurship brings a just society I mean who sets the policy which side of the road the cars drive on or you know there's these new issues that are evolving that I've never been seen before you know cyber bullying - all kinds of things happening so congratulations on all those success so what's the forecast for Red Hat innovation has more of this gonna continue double down on it what are the things do you guys have going on yeah so Labs is growing quite largely we are now live in North America amia and a pack with plans to expand extend to Latin in the future and we're growing quite quickly in terms of our ability to execute I guess you know the labs team is relatively small a small number of specialists but we are all of RedHat so the way we operate is based on what we're trying to achieve together we will look at all of red hat and sometimes even outside of red hat to figure out who we can bring to the table to help solve that problem and so it allows me to work with our engineering with our business units even with our marketing so we brought marketing in to the first meeting not simply because we're creating a marketing event but we realized we need to advertise internally and externally what we build in order to gain adoption it's part of building a community and what I have found is because Labs has an injective that goes beyond you know simply a technological objective we're aiming to change ways of working and to change culture it's really easy to build a lot of interest and adoption among all Red Hatters to bring them together to solve a tough problem a really an interesting facet a lot about labs I know you do these pop-up labs and I think this was what you know you don't make necessarily make people come to you you son can come to them but I think like you said it's important to get outside your your office and your day-to-day for these focused projects you talked a little bit about your approach to yeah so we've learned a lot you know Labs is almost exactly two years old I think we launched in April of 2016 at OpenStack summit and one thing we learned is you know the world is a big place and we can't necessarily have a physical lab location everywhere so we do have first-class facilities in Boston Singapore in London but I would say the large majority of the work efforts we've done to date have been in what we call pop-up labs and what that allows us to do is create that immersion and focus on a tough challenge by getting people out of the office but also provide the ability to go home at the end of the day and have dinner at your home which a lot of people enjoy and from the red head perspective we've got a lot of folks used to travel so we can make that happen meet in the middle and and it's been a good hybrid approach that we end up doing more and more great stuff here actually is my final question for then to take from Jim Whitehouse keynote today how is blockchain changing this open for good economics that's absolutely right and I mean Erika you might want to weigh in as well but I think I love blockchain first of all I love math and I love the science behind it but I love the fact that it was developed in the open it was debated in the open it's radically transparent you can see all of the transactions of anyone in the chain and it's being used in ways that no one ever dreamed of I mean it was meant for a universal currency but you know think about this we might be able to use it as a token system so that we can actually ensure that humanitarian efforts that are done are actually recognized by people that they may not otherwise have funds right someone with very little money can still use so perhaps takers making sure the money gets put to use absolutely and endpoints we have accountability you know we're using it to exchange electronic health records securely and privately with the people that need them and only the people that need them so I don't know where blockchain will be in five years but I am optimistic that I think the mathematics and the fundamental is a blockchain or sound and I think more than anything it's the community that will drive new applications of blockchain and really define and answer that question for you well I know we'll be in New York next week with blockchain for consensus of ennum there's a lot of ents going on we've seen wealthy entrepreneurs donating Bitcoin and aetherium there's a really great project so and a lot of young people love the blockchain and crypto so who knows got to be on that labs we're definitely look you know looking into it and we have a couple experiments around the world that range from trying to do some smart contracts you know in in country environments to taking donations in in blockchain armies Arion cryptocurrencies I think that there are a lot of exciting applications for it in this due to do good space I also think that there's a tremendous amount of hype and you know you really have to ask yourself the key question of like does this need a central trusted Authority or is there one that exists that already is great um and do we need to record every transaction if you can answer those two questions then the other baby going somewhere well great point the other thing I would answer that agree hundred percent and that is is that blockchain and crypto our token economic certainty not the ico scams but is an efficiency heat-seeking missile it it targets efficiencies where there's inefficiencies announced where I see a lot of the action going on and you know efforts and for good are highly inefficient yeah so hey you knows well we'd love blockchain as you can tell we talk about all day long smart contracts token economics thanks for coming on and congratulations on your project thank you you're good to stuff their cube coverage here day two of three days live coverage here in San Francisco the Red Hat summit 2018 moved back after this short break stay with us

(upbeat music) >> Announcer: Live from San Francisco, It's the Cube. Covering Red Hat Summit 2018. Brought to you buy, Red Hat. >> Okay, welcome back everyone. We're live here in the Cube in San Francisco, California, Monscone West, Cube's exclusive coverage of Red Hat Summit 2018. I'm John Furrier, co-host. With John Troyer, he's my analyst co- host, he's the co -founder of Tech Reckoning Advisory and Community Development Firm. My next guest is Marco Bill-Peter, Senior vice-president of Customer Experience and Engagement at Red Hat. Welcome back to the Cube. Good to see you. So, you guys have a great track record with customer support. You guys use gold standard in open source, you've done it well, very reliable. It's a changing world. You know, Open Shift now, certainly the center piece, west, new acquisition. A lot of things happening with in the portfolio. Cloud native new capabilities are on the horizon. So, you've got to figure it out. So, what's the support strategy? What do you guys do? How are you looking? I'm sure it's challenging but never too much of a challenge for you guys. You're smart, what's the support strategy? >> I think the recipe it is really like not getting stuck in a wave, right? And be open to, you know I think Jim Whitehurst and his keynote talk quite a bit about, you used to do all plan, describe and execute. That thing just doesn't work, right? Because supporting customers on Linux, supporting them when they move to Open Shift or even application, is a whole different piece. So, as a leader you got to be flexible as in okay, here we do it this way, let's put more money in this. Let's say Open Shift support, Open Shift kind of, what's the customer experience there, right? Kind of figure out how it works. There's a lot of things that scare me in the daily business as in like okay, we can't do that. But I think Red Hat is really good in reconfiguring, Jim talked about that in a keynote as well, reconfiguring the organization. And so, we move for example, quality assurance into my organization and combining that with support. All of them give some more opportunities realizing, oh this product maybe not ready yet for the market, right? We can not support that. Or, you augmented with, I wouldn't call it AI capabilities, but more like those capabilities. All of the sudden stuff gets done automatically. >> And multi cloud is again, just like multi vendor environment, but it's a little bit different obviously. But multiple clouds you have different architectures. You guys do some progressive things. What's new, architecturally within the support group? Because you have deals announced here with IBM and Microsoft, one of them is a joint, I think integrated program where guys are teaming up. >> Microsoft is interesting. >> We've teamed last three, four years, right? With he first deal and gone further. You're like funny, right? I've been at Red Hat so long and you put people on premise. It's kind of funny. But it's good, right? And that's where you got to glue together. Sometimes it's people. Sometimes it's also more having the data, right? I mean if you go multi cloud. Difference between multi vendor, multi cloud. Multi vendor, you just call the vendor and tell them hey you handle it. Here, I'll put data, you handle it. Or maybe you do it a bit better. But, multi cloud is, well it's running there, how do you get access to that? Then the whole privacy laws comes in. So you got to be more instrumentation, you know, telemetry-- >> You're using tech to help you guys out. That's what you're referring by AI. >> I actually think that the next ten years you will see support changing quite a bit. >> John: In what way? >> But also you have to staff this up, right? You need to upscale your folks as well as technology. >> That doesn't go away. But I think you've got to go more that you really need deep skills. If you want to support Open Shift you've got to, either you understand it from the middle side, from the application side or from the bottom from the infrastructure. You need both skill sets. So you need really highly skilled people. But one the other hand if it's really like real time and people don't have patience to wait two weeks, especially if you're in the cloud. More and more tooling. I see the vision as in it would be less and less based on the scale but I think it's less people involved more and more automation, tooling. >> You kind of see it now with boss, kind of just tip of the iceberg. But you've got automation built into the culture of Red Hat. You've put coral west. They want to automate everything. >> You see Insights, right? We launched Insights three years ago out of support. They take support data, find out what's really happening, create rules that if you match it the customer systems say you have this and this issue. And now it's in the incentive stage of the strategy as in we can automate it, but you can automate it. you have a problem, you want to have it solved. >> You're presenting a support service. >> Exactly, and eventually, we'll not even tell you, in maybe hindsight we'll tell you, hey, you had this network issue or configured the wrong way, we fixed it have a good day. >> Well it came up in Cooper Netty's conversation we had last week in Copenhagen, we were in Denmark for CubeCon around things Cooper Netty's defacto standing, so great stuff, that's certainly great. Istio service mesh is atopic that's highly discussed. And one of the thing that comes up is the automation the down side is potentially it fixes things. So, you could have a memory leak for instance, that you never know gets fixed. But it just crashes every day and reboots itself. So, the new kinds of instrumentation that's emerging. So this is really the though job. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> How do you get in there-- >> Also have automation-- >> And you as the central provider, right, are pulling in data from across the world and across the customer base. So how do you take that, sift it to be more proactive about decision making and support. >> So we capture all this support data. And you know it's fascinating, we have some AI capabilities, some machine learning capabilities go through there. But it's fascinating, sometimes we see new issues coming up. What we do is then, we go well let's look who is exposed to that, just to get a footprint. And then you actually inform customers, hey, you had this and this issue or you have this. It's really a different, I want to get more proactive or I want to get more automated. With the automation I just want to be, right, so we installed, over the last, I would say 18 months, like a bot, simple bot basically, his name is Edmond. And he works on support cases. And we started slow, very slow. We didn't let it go as in total machine or anything. But now, I gave some stats earlier today. In one used case it's 25 percent faster solving a customer issue using Edmond. And he participates in 11 percent of all support cases. >> Wow. >> Edmond is a busy guy. >> And the game is changing too. I mean in the old days, first lines support, second lines support, offline support, then escalation. These things are older IT mechanisms. With this you're talking about completely doing away with, in essence first line support. But also first line support might come in, from say a Microsoft or an IBM. You've got to be ready for anything. >> Actually I think it's not just first line support. And it's not replacing them. It's helping them. It's really making them faster, right? I think the frustration piece is, like, customer opens his support case, some data is missing, right? So, you have a que it gets to that. Engineering looks and oh, there's data missing. Edmond sees that and says hey, I need this data. Based on all the support cases we fixed similar issues, this is the data we need. So Edmond gets the data ready, engineer looks and in some cases Edmond actually closes it out. >> Closes it out. >> Tells the customer here there's a better solution, do it this way. >> Yeah, that's fascinating. >> I'd love to pull the camera back a little bit, right? You are not the SVP of support. You're the SVP of customer experience and engagement, right? That's an entirely different role in some ways, in that you're responsible for customer success at some level. >> That is correct, yeah. >> Talk a little bit about reconfiguring organization to be that-- >> So I think maybe dive in a little bit on the customer success. So we have a organization, they call technical account. It's part of the customer success organization. That's a human business but it's fascinating, right. We put these claims on clients and have them work together. They understand the business. It's an old business but trust me, having still a human in there understanding, okay this is customer x, y, z. That's the business objective, I talked about this today as well, not to forget, hey this customer actually wants to do whatever, whatever on the like an SIP to actually take that further to actually support case and doing that the team helps quite a bit. And then also the commitment, right? We don't want just to do support cases and then that's why you renew with Red Head, we want to make sure you actually get value out of it and that's why you want to renew. So that's why we configured different. It's bigger, right? It's bigger as in really making sure the product is correct. So that's why quality assurance is in my team, this support. That's why I run internal IT for the engineering team. We run the stuff that we sell actually earlier. And some of my team is like, Marco why do we have to do that? Because we learn and I much rather have you feel the pain than the customer feel the pain. That's why we configure different than, I've been 12 a half years right on this and it's still exciting that we are still able to change around-- >> I think the quality assurance piece is still big too cause you're in there as well. Looking at the QA. >> Yeah. >> Making sure that's good too. You're testing out the products and doing QA all within the mindset of customer experience. >> Exactly, and you've got to move that being agile, is more you see developers actually submitting test cases. Tests, so that's the component testing and the basic tests. What we got to do more, is what you mentioned, if somebody does less with Open Shift to contain all that, that thing together, if some service software defines storage, that thing together to bring together that's the hard drive. So I want to move more and more. That we take used spaces from customers, we'll close it. This is how we do it. X, y, z, customer and apply that. >> At the end of the day it's the same game different playing field. The customer wants choice, best possible solution experience, for them. You guys got to enable that, and then support it, make it happen. >> Yeah. >> And with cloud. >> And you see how, I don't know if you saw the demo yesterday when they show basically I think or Amazon was slower and every traffic that routed. This is reality as well, right? I mean if you look at one press release we did yesterday, I just find it a fascinating story. They're kitchen appliances. I don't know if you saw that. But they have over a million kitchen appliances or cooking appliances connected to the internet. It's a German, Swiss company when they got to upgrade the system so they get recipes done, they actually spin up instances in Alibaba in Asia and I think in Amazon in the U.S. They spin it up, they scale out all the appliances connect then they shrink it together. How do you support these customers a whole different case. >> That's great for the customer. >> Yeah. >> But more of a challenge for you guys. >> Then again with preparation of the right integration testing before, with the right set up that we know this is what the customer is doing this weekend. Amadeus as well, talked at the keynote, we worked long time with Amadeus. >> You're a smart team. >> As part of your customer role, you were involved with the Innovation awards. They were up on stage this morning. What struck me was they were both about time to value. And speed of deployment as well as scale. Often these were global companies, we had Amadeus on yesterday, spanning the globe. Huge number of transactions. Anything stand out to you in those Innovation Awards this year? Perhaps, that's been different in previous years? I think that the scale is actually interesting that you say. I think we have much quicker now. I think that's awesome, technology matures. I think we used to have more smaller work projects in getting to a certain scale. But I just goes faster. I think the controlled piece is probably a bit more accepted. This whole containerization is not magic anymore. I think a lot is being moved, is coming from the development side but also from the Linux side. So I think there's a less struggle of that. But I do still see some cultural struggles. You talk to customers, maybe not the Innovation Award winners. but even them they say, hey it took us a long time to convince internal structures, how we change things around. >> Talk about the open source role because you mentioned, before we came on how you guys are all in the open, an open source. Is there like a project that you're part of that supports centric? Is there certain things you're picking out over the source? As you guys do the QA and build you own stuff. >> Yeah we do a lot. We submit a lot to open. There's very few. We don't share data. We can't share customer data for obvious reasons. But tooling, most of the tooling we share if it's data collectors. We re an open source road. There' not much that we don't, there's nothing proprietary. Engineers, that's why they're coming to write. That's the configuration. They want to see, hey how does this stuff get applied. They own the packages, then some stuff is shared. If it's tied to the customer portal, the AI pieces maybe the open source parts of it but-- >> What's it like this year, for the folks who are watching who couldn't make it? What's the vibe here at Red Hat Summit 2018? What's the hallway conversations like? What's some of the dinners? What are you talking about? What's the chatter? >> I think the big chatter for me is kind of like this Open Shift, containers, agile development. You know the agile development comes back and back and really like how do we do this right? And tech connects obviously, how do you take application develop them or how do you take applications put them in a container. And then you see these demos. With multi cloud. >> New applications is not stand alone Linux anymore. >> Yeah. We have containers and tend to be able to run public cloud or multi cloud on premise. The options are endless. And I think that's the strengths from Red Hat. We prove that with Linux we can have a solid API. We don't screw up the applications. And if we can guarantee that across the four footprints, that's Paul's vision five, six years ago. I think we are there. >> You talked about a bit of cultural shift. How can Red Hat help it's customers come up to speed? That's a little bit...but be more agile. >> It's a good example. I think we do a lot of these sessions. I actually think that our sales motion, they are pretty aware with open sources, what the culture is. They do a lot of these sessions with customers. Jim Whitehurst is actually awesome. When he comes to clients. We did a C level event at a bank, based in Zurich and it was in a Swiss bank. And I think that they got like 140 C level, CIO groups. And Jim did a talk about the open organization about breaking down the barriers. I think that's a role that we play. Well some is Red Hat's role, but we go to do that stuff. Because we can share part of it in how we are configured, how we are different. >> I think that kind of thing is high on every CIO's list of agendas. >> And everything in the open is proving that open is winning. Open beats closed pretty much every time and is now pretty standard operating wise we're starting to see but operational wise, not just for software development. >> I actually think that from practice and how to run the company. Some stuff is transparency, right? If you work in a company that you're not transparent with your associates, can you really do this in 2018? >> No. >> And so I think those are elements that I think we do well to have had. And we got to keep internal as well, reminding ourselves, these core principles from open source are really important. >> Hiring, so you're bringing new Red Hatters in? >> At the rate we are hiring it's actually big concerns. How do we maintain this culture, right. This talk is not always polite but it's the way we function. >> You guys are humble. You're playing the long game, I love that about you. So congratulations Marco. Thanks for coming on the Cube show. >> Thanks very much. >> Thanks. >> It's the Cube Live here in San Francisco for Red Hat Summit 2018 here in Moscone West. I'm John Furrier and John Troyer. Stay with us for more live coverage after this short break. (upbeat music)

>> Announcer: Live from San Francisco it's theCUBE, covering Red Hat Summit 2018. Brought to you by Red Hat. >> Hey welcome back everyone, this is theCUBE's exclusive of Red Hat Summit 2018, live in San Francisco at the Moscone West, I'm John Furrier the cohost of theCUBE. Here this week, as a cohost analyst John Troyer, co-founder of TechReckoning, an advisory and community development firm. Our next guest is Jim Whitehurst, the president and CEO of Red Hat, we have the man at the helm, the chief of Red Hat. Jim great to see you thanks for coming on and taking the time. >> Yes great to be here, thank you for hosting with us here. >> So you're fresh off the keynote, you've got a spring in your step, you're pumped up. Red Hat is really getting accolades across the board so congratulations on the big bets you've made. >> Jim: Thank you. >> You guys are looking like geniuses. We know you're super smart as a company so congratulations. >> Either that or lucky, but we'll take it either way. We are well positioned. >> Analysts love your opportunity, we're reading in the financial analysts out in the web it's saying, you know, the expanded market opportunity for Red Hat is looking really good. You've got infrastructure applications and management all kind of come in together. OpenShift is a center piece of all this and the cloud scale world is moving right to your doorstep. This is really the big tailwind for you guys. By design or like, how does that all coming together, is it the master plan? >> Well yeah I think it's two things, one is because we don't bet five years out on technology and write a technology stack to get there. That's not our model. Our model is to engage in communities, and when those communities get popular enough that we think that there's value in a supported version, then we offer the supported version. Now if you flip that around and think about what that means, it means we're never wrong with the technology bet, because we're not providing a product until it's something that's already highly successful. So we didn't offer OpenStack until it was successful. We weren't offering a Kubernetes offering until it was popular, and so I think that's one benefit. We truly work bottom up in communities. And then secondly I do think we've benefited from the fact that we've lived in the old traditional enterprise world for 20 years helping them migrate from Unix to Linux. So I think we understand the old world and the one kind of spin we put on the technologies is we have the sense of, okay for traditional enterprises, it's great there's all this cool stuff that Facebook and Twitter and others are doing, how does that apply to this set of problems? I think we uniquely have a foot in both worlds so we work and develop with the Googles, Facebooks, Twitters, but we really think hard about how those technologies apply to a traditional enterprise and the context and legacy migration and all the other issues that they face. >> You had years of experience dealing with the practical nature of getting support to customers. But you got to bring that new shiny new toy but make it right for the customers. >> Yeah exactly, and I think one of the reasons OpenShift, you mentioned that, it's our Kubernetes platform, is getting so much attention is we have instrumented and architected it to be able to run traditional stateful enterprise applications, and so you can do cloud native 12 factor, blah blah blah blah blah on it, but importantly you can run your traditional application suite on it, and so one of the reasons like you see so much momentum and so much interest in it is we're trying to span both worlds, and really thinking from an enterprise IT mindset in terms of their problems and saying how do you apply these technologies to make it work. So we're not sitting here saying you need to go do this, you need to adopt Google's practices. What we're saying is here's great technology we think you can leverage to kind of help you as you migrate to this new world. >> You guys got some clear visibility, and I think it's interesting in the container trend and Kubernetes, really good timing for Red Hat with this going on, and so two things we were commenting on our open today was we got to interoperability of multiple cloud options going on with Kubernetes and containers with respect to legacy applications, and then you got the cloud native scale for all the new stuff. So the old model in tech was kill the old to bring in the new, but now you have a new model where you can actually keep the old legacy, containerize it while building new functionality all within software that you guys are enabling, so this is kind of a breath of fresh air for a lot of people in the industry, on the enterprise side saying oh I can still use my stuff. But yet build new scale with cloud and on-prem and have a choice. >> Exactly. And it's not just use my old stuff. It is also leverage my existing people and their skills. Recognize the appdev world, most people aren't developing in a stateless cloud native way, and if you look at the traditional enterprise developer, they on average have four hours a month to do continuing education and new skill development. So, the idea that you're going to flick a switch and say all my new applications are going to be in this new model is crazy. Plus so much of the work you're doing is around your existing estate, really providing a platform that says you can develop new with the skills once you have those. You can take your existing people and take them on a journey versus like this big chasm that you have to get over as you think about both your applications and skill sets and build over time. I think that resonates really well with enterprises. >> Jim I really liked the keynote this morning. It was a very customer focused, not technology focused, and a lot of these keynotes lately have been fear based. You know, change or die, right? Your company's going to go out of business. You had a more positive vision, and the stories there were very good. A lot about time to market, time to value, some nice stories. I was joking, I think, you know, flying cars would be great, but I know I'm in the future if T-Mobile can help car makers update the apps in the car within a couple months using OpenShift, right? That's the future as far as I'm concerned. But you had this really nice framework of instead of preplanning everything as IT is want to do, you talked about configure, enable, engage. Can you talk a little bit about that framework and kind of your prescription for upleveling the organization and it's resiliency basically, as it hits the ground running. >> Yeah sure, and so I think you put a really good light on this idea of so many technology companies are out there kind of almost fear mongering around digital transformation, and what's happening is organizations around the world, fundamentally how they create value is changing. And it's all gotten listed under this moniker of digital transformation. But what it's basically saying is the future is very unknowable because the world is changing very, very fast, and it's ambiguous. You're likely to have the uberized, I mean that's a word now, orthogonal competitors coming in different ways. So your normal way of let me do a five year plan, let me prescribe a set of initiatives, organizations, and job descriptions to go attack that, and then execution becomes about compliance against that plan. That model no longer works when you don't know the future well enough to be able to do that. And so rather than just pick on that and say oh you should be scared, you should be scared, what we tried to do is say hey, Red Hat's lived in that world forever. Like, we had no idea that Kubernetes was going to be as successful as it is, and we don't necessarily know where it's going to be five years from now. But we know if we build the right context, it will develop the capabilities required for us to meet our customers' needs. And so applying that same model that we've seen in open source, and frankly we see in a lot of web 2.0 companies, we get asked over and over again, hey you provide me great technology, but help me contextualize this broader problem. Because the problem that everybody has is I need to be able to move more quickly, I need to be able to react to change more quickly, and I need to innovate more effectively. That is not a SKU. If that were a SKU we would be $100 billion company, right? That's not a product you can buy, it's a capability to build. And so the model we talked about was planning gets replaced by configuring, right? So, you don't know what the future's going to be but you know it's going to change, and so configure yourself for change. Prescription, or this idea you lay out all the steps that need to happen for people. In an unknowable world you can't do that and it gets replaced by enablement. So how do you enable people with the strategy, the context, but also the tools, decision support tools and information to make the right decision. And execution becomes less about compliance and more about engagement. So how do you engage your people in your organization to effectively react to change going forward? And so this model, and it's a very open sourceish type model of from plan, prescribe, execute, to configure, enable, engage, I think encapsulates a lot of what organizations will need to go do to be successful. >> I got to ask you a question on the community piece. I think that's where you guys have been successful with the community. It's a great way to be successful. You know, AB testing, you just look at what people want and you deliver on it. There's feedback from the community. So I got to ask you, modern open source, as we look forward on this next wave, what is, in your opinion, the key dynamic going on in open source? How is it changing for the better? What are you guys looking at? Because you're seeing a lot of younger people coming in. Open source is a tier one citizen in the world. Everyone knows that now. I mean and when you guys started it was, you know Red Hat and there's an alternative and now you guys have made that market. But now we're looking at another generation, microservices, cloud scale. Open source has become the model. You're seeing a lot more commercializations. Projects maintaining open, some productization going on at the same time. Is there some key changes that you see that people should be aware of or that you guys are watching in how open source has evolved? >> Yeah, so two changes. One kind of a broad role of open source, and then I'll come back then to how it's consumed. You're exactly right. Ten years ago and certainly 15 years ago, open source was about creating lower costs open alternatives to traditional software, right? And that's what we did. You know, Linux looks a lot like Unix, it's just lower cost and more flexible, etc., etc. Over time, though, as the big web 2.0 companies adopted open source as a model, you get this move so more innovation was coming from users than from vendors. So it's like big data, take that as an example. Big data exists not because of open source, it's because a ton of large IT leaders like Google and Facebook and Microsoft and Yahoo, etc., had these big data problems. And rather than going and finding vendors to solve them they solved them themselves. They did it in open source. And so you see this model move from vendor led to user led, and it's just like the industrial revolution. The industrial revolution, the winner's were at the machine tool manufacturers. These people use the machine tools. So I think we'll continue to see this happening where the majority of innovation is happening from users done in an open source way. Now the flip side then is, I think there was a sense 20 years ago and even 10 years ago among the zealots, that it's a big war between open source and proprietary. What we're seeing now, I think developing, you see this with a lot of the partnerships we announced, is open source will be embedded across virtually any technology platform, right? You can't use your phone, you can't get money out of a bank machine, you can't do a search, you can't do any of that stuff without using a lot of open source software. Doesn't mean the whole stack has to be open. Now we're all open and we're advocates for that, but you're seeing Microsoft embrace it, you're seeing IBM embrace, and so broadly I think you will see a larger and larger share of the technology stacks that people use today, be open source, and that'll continue. >> I mean I think the proprietary thing is pretty much a dead horse at this point. I mean, open has always won, open is winning, but also to your point about earlier making decisions in the community, there's a risk management benefit on this user led. You're taking away the risk. There's all kinds of risk management being done for you. There's no longer operational things that cost money, like managing releases. You can actually get great operational benefits as well as risk management for what to do. >> Well exactly, because these platforms, it's not let me look at three vendor solutions and say which one do I think looks the best. You actually can say what are people using at scale, what's worked well? And unless you are a bleeding edge adopter, you actually can get the observations of how people are using it and what's working and what's not. And I'll tell you from a vendor perspective it's great. When we release a product we never say, oh, does the market want this? We're not releasing the product until after the market's already adopted the technology in a community way in a pretty significant way. It's a great day, certainly game changing, I think it's going to be written up as kind of a new dynamic that's going to certainly be referenced in the history books. I want to get your perspective on the going forward basis. I know you guys are a public company so you can't really talk about the numbers, but in looking at some of the financial analysts reports recently on you guys, there's a quote I want to get your reaction to. This analyst said, "Software containers "look to be much larger opportunity than RHEL ever was, "and if Red Hat can become a leader here, "it will set the company up for many years to come. So there's obviously some people saying, obviously the container thing is pretty big. How are you guys talking to the marketplace, both the industry market, financial market, and customers around the containerization opportunity, how does Red Hat look at that? How is you as the CEO talk to that trend? 'Cause I know RHEL. RHEL's got a track record. But now you got containers. What's the order of magnitude? What's the mental model people should take to think about containers? >> So I can answer that in a couple of different ways. So let me start off with the size of the opportunity. So, as applications go from these monolithic services for applications to containerized microservices, that architecture is very, very different. And in the old world you'd have an operating system. And then you'd have a whole set of tool chains and management tools and all of these things to manage these applications, right? Well, in a containerized world you expect the platform to manage that for you, right? And so in the old world, which still exists in this growing force, but in the Linux world we provide the operating system on which the application ran, and then you got different management tools, application performance management, CMBD, all of this stuff that worked around that, right? You expect your platform to do that now, so if you think about the value we have in OpenShift, which is our platform, it's doing that telemetry, it's doing patching, it's doing a lot of the automation that was happening before. So there's a lot more value in the platform. And so like a two socket server running RHEL versus a two socket server running OpenShift, there's like an order magnitude price difference. And our customers aren't looking at it saying, oh my god that's expensive, they're actually looking at it like it's cheap versus the whole sets of tool change and management tools they were doing in the old world. So fundamentally the container platform has a dramatic amount of value. Now then from a Red Hat perspective, and I'll bring up another company, it's a little bit of a competitor, but VMWare did a great job of becoming the default management tool company around a virtualized infrastructure. Well why? Because in the shift from physical to virtual they were there first. And they kind of built a paradigm for managing that. Well in this world going to containers, containers are Linux containers, so we're there first. And so working to drive that paradigm, I think we can be a significant share player in these new container platforms, and honestly if you look out in the market, the clouds have their individual cloud offerings, which are fine. We actually can span all of that. So if you have any hybrid structure at all, we have by far the best solution to address that, and I think analysts are assuming we're going to be successful at a much higher value add and therefore more expensive product. If we get our RHEL share of that, you know it's an order of magnitude larger opportunity. >> And that's the cloud economics in play right there. 'Cause with that scale you're talking about okay, OpenShift's taking on a new role for the multi-cloud, for the large scale, you know horizontally scalable synchronous services that are coming online like microservices. >> Exactly, exactly. >> (sound distorts voice) cloud scale partnership and ecosystem strategy right? Your customers are deploying OpenShift on clouds like Amazon, Google, big partnership with Microsoft announced this week as well as a big IBM partnership. Can you talk a little bit about how Red Hat is approaching that cooperation and competition and what parts you'd like to keep on Red Hat versus where you're going to end up partnering. >> Yeah so, we, when you think about the fact that we sell free software, right? You got to think hard about the value proposition. And one of the value propositions we've always believed in is we create choice for our customers. So running Red Hat Enterprise Linux, we're geeks we can talk about all this value associated with it. For many purchasing departments the value was always, when it comes up for a hardware refresh, I'm not locked into one vendor now. I can bid that out because every vendor works on RHEL. So if my application runs on RHEL, I have unlocked choice at that layer. So that's built into our DNA. It's not just a value our software adds, it's the flexibility we're providing customers. So when we look at these new generation platforms, we really strongly believe we can add a lot of value by abstracting whether you want to run it on premise, on a server, on VMWare, on any of the public clouds. By abstracting those away we're giving our customers choice at the core platform layer. So part one is to make sure OpenShift is a first-class citizen and runs well everywhere. And so for our customers then, you know that your application will run anywhere. For our ISV partners to take IBM for instance, because IBM has announced all of their software running on OpenShift, that can now run wherever OpenShift runs, which is, by the way, everywhere, without IBM having to do a lot of work. So creating this abstraction layer huge benefits for someone like IBM. So you can now run mission critical IBM software anywhere you want to run it via OpenShift. So real value to a partner like that, obviously a value to us as it drives workloads. Now one of the other things that we've seen a lot is that people have gotten used to cloud, is they're really saying, hey I love OpenShift, this is great, but honestly you manage it for me. That's one of the things I like about cloud, so I love the idea of this abstraction layer, but I don't want to have to build my own management or my organization to be able to manage this at scale, so you be my service provider. And so we built that in a small way, so we have OpenShift Dedicated, which is an offering that Red Hat engineers run that runs on Amazon. But we want to make sure our customers had choice and also they could choose other vendors they want to work with and you know, Microsoft has a lot of heritage in enterprises, so this opportunity for enterprise is to be able to run OpenShift at scale on Microsoft, fully managed and supported jointly by Microsoft and Red Hat we think is a really phenomenal offering, 'cause we just don't have the scale to build out the capabilities to even meet the demand that's coming in right now for us to offer a managed service of OpenShift. >> And you guys are also doing some work, just to point out and I want to get your comment on, to help with the licensing issues. I know there's been some announcements where you guys are trying to get some more support for folks who are dealing with some of the licensing issues when expiring and so we had your associate general counsel on talking about some of the, version two, version three, grace periods. What does that mean for customers? What is the internal motivation behind that? Is it just making it easier? >> Well you know, this whole idea of licensing being an impediment to customer success, I just find horribly bothersome in the technology industry. And so we've always tried to strip that out for Red Hat, with our customers, and now trying to say well Red Hat's big enough it can have enough influence broadly. How do we try to be more influential in communities? So certainly nothing in the open source licensing arena, not just for us but for any vendor, gets in the way of customer success. And I think that's so important this idea of the artifact of protecting IP means you create lack of flexibility for your customers. I don't think anybody wanted that to happen, but it's happened. And so anything we can do to kind of tear that down we're working to do. >> Well congratulations on all your success, and I know that when I hear words like defacto standard it gets my attention. You see Kubernetes, role OpenShift's doing. We're envisioning a huge wealth creation of new value creation market coming online pretty quickly. You guys doing a great job. Congratulations on that. >> Thank you, thank you. >> Awesome work. Final question for you, I know you got to roll, but you guys are also growing, I noticed your teams are growing, how do you maintain the Red Hat culture? You get more people coming on working for the company, what's the strategy? Give them the Kool-Aid injection? Do you got to bring them in, assimilate into the open source ethos that you guys built and are expanding? What's the plan of getting all these new employees and new partners on board with the Red Hat way? You hand them the red pill and the blue pill and they better take the red pill. No in all seriousness, it's a high class problem but it's still a problem. You know, we do grow roughly 20% a year. Taking this account even modest attrition, roughly 25% of the people at the end of the year at Red Hat weren't here at the beginning of the year. And so when you think about a culture based company, and I spend a lot of time talking about our source of advantages and capability that's tied up in our culture, that's critical, so from how we think about recruiting over half our employees come from employee referrals, they say nobody knows a Red Hatter like a Red Hatter, to the way we do onboarding, which people laugh, you walk out of onboarding you still don't know how to get a computer, but you have been indoctrinated in the power of open source to the way we do checkups along the way, the way we use video and a whole bunch of things to do that. Because it is critical. It is who we are and what allows us to be successful. >> Do you get a lot of Red Hatters out there who left the company, started companies, they come back in the fold through acquisitions? So that's always a great, great sign and we love what you're doing. I'll say CUBE are open. We love open always is winning and it's the new standard. So congratulations. >> Well thank you for having me. It's great. And I really appreciate you being here, participating in the summit. >> All right, Jim Whitehurst, CEO of Red Hat. We're here in theCUBE, live coverage day two of three days of wall-to-wall coverage. Check out all the coverage on thecube.net, siliconangle.com, and wikibon.com for all the action. I'm John Furrier, John Troyer, more live coverage after this short break. Stay with us, we'll be right back.

(indistinct chatter, electronic intro music) >> Announcer: Live from San Francisco, it's the Cube! Covering Red Hat summit 2018, brought to you by Red Hat. >> Hello and welcome back this is the Cube's exclusive coverage here in San Francisco, California at Moscone West, I'm John Furrier with John Troyer co-founder of Tech Reckoning and our next guest is Joe Fitzgerald, vice president and general manager of the management and business unit at Red Hat, home of Ansible, among other great capabilities, welcome to the Cube, thanks for stopping by. Red Hat summit 2018's happening all the buzz is all about Kubernetes, containers, obviously Linux, and all the action really transforming the digital journey of customers. I mean, cloud scale: check, data: check, (chuckling) new applications: check, a lot of interesting things now, Kubernetes' workload, multi cloud, all kind of coming together, what's going on for you guys in the show, 'cause you know honestly management, operations, automation, these are all things that are data driven, your thoughts? >> Joe: Yeah, so I'm responsible for management and automation, and so all these technologies that you're hearing about, Red Hat is helping people digitally transform, right, so a lot of the technologies you mentioned, it turns out that these envorironments really require automation to move fast, right, and management is essential to keep these really complex environments up and running, and secure, which is a big issue for people. >> Furrier: IT operations has been around for a while but it's always been, like, managing the data center, but now you've got a lot of things going on. Management, operations, and data is changing the world because now you can apply automation to it, what's a customer to do here? Because a lot of people are recasting, and I won't say replatformizing, but they're definitely looking at a global, cloud native, with containers, legacy is taken care of, how do I instrument this? What is the approach that you guys see customers taking from Red Hat's perspective? >> Joe: Well there's a couple of principles, automation is huge and it's entering because automation on the front edge, getting the containers and cloud services, automation is huge, but we also see automation for people to reduce the burden of their legacy environments, by using automation to free up resources and people, and money that they can put into their front end, you know, digital transformation activities. Right? The other thing besides automation that we're driving is analytics based operations, because these environments, once you build them, and start operating them, get very complex very fast, right? So it's beyond somebody sitting in front of a network console waiting for red lights to come up on the dashboard and reacting. It really has to be automated, and they have to get a lot of insights into what's going on. >> Furrier: It's an interesting challenge, I want to get into the hybrid cloud for a second, because before we get into hybrid cloud challenges, automation is a double edged sword, you can automate something and all of a sudden you could have a memory leak and you don't even know about it, because it's self healing! There's a lot of automation going on, so the analytics have to be smarter. This why we've been hearing this come up a lot, which is 'Okay, I need visibility not just into what's happening, what's breaking, but what's going on beyond the automation.'. These are new dynamics, what's the approach there? How are you guys looking at that trend? Is there any products out there to solve this challenge? >> Joe: So we've had product in our portfolio, it's Red Hat insights, which is a predictive analytics based offering that we've had, and basically what it does is it analyzes our customer's systems and it looks across, you know, sort of a broad set of settings and processes, and configurations and things, and basically can actually tell them 'Hey, these systems are at risk, they're likely to either have performance issues or a crash, or they have security vulnerabilities', and actually tell them what's going to happen, and what they need to do. So that's called Red Hat Insights, as the name implies gives you a very, you know, deep insight into your systems. We've recently tied that to automation, to say 'This is what's wrong with your systems, would you like us to automate and correct them or remediate them?'. Now I can tell you, having been around automation for a while most people don't trust automation. Think about the first time your going to get in your self driving car, and you're going to go 'Wait a minute, I'm going to not have a steering wheel or brake pedal or something?'. That's, like, terrifying right? Automation in IT's the same way, it's like 'Wait, I'm going to have this system do what to my production systems?', so there's usually this cycle where it's like, show me what you're going to do with the automation. Let me get sort of comfortable and verify it, and then let me push the button and then automate it, that's a natural cycle. >> Troyer: Lets go down one level from that and talk about hybrid cloud, so, we see a lot of examples of that, hybrid cloud, multi cloud, on-prem with OpenStack, you know, out in the public cloud with OpenShift, you know, multiple clouds at once. So, you've got your self driving cloud now. One layer down, what do enterprises and IT operators need to look at from a governance and an operations perspective? What are things they need to be worried about if they're going to be running a multi cloud scale operation like that? >> Joe: So let me use the self driving car analogy. Lets say you bought a self driving car from three different car manufacturers. Okay, the instrumentation and the hardware, the software, is all going to be vastly different, but you're supposed to operate those things at a consistent level. So think about a hybrid cloud, all these clouds have different instrumentation, how they get monitored and managed, and the kind of events they generate >> Troyer: The cost models. >> The cost models, all those things, so it's not like you can just write a simple piece of code and say 'Oh just monitor these things' or 'Just make sure they're secure' or compliant, you have to actually instrument into each of the cloud particular, you know, instrumentations, right? And then try to automate that, so one of the things we do is we provide sort of consistent way for people to manage what's otherwise a pretty complex heterogeneous hybrid cloud environment. >> Furrier: And how's that going? Can you give us some anecdotal insight into how that's going? >> Joe: Well it's going very well, we have a number of customers here at summit who are talking about, sort of, their production journeys with Red Hat. Transforming, whether it's on OpenStack for private cloud or OpenShift for containers, or using our middleware services or integration services, and then using our management and automation to actually deploy those things, keep them secure, keep them operational, and run them at scale, it's those huge success points. >> Furrier: Joe, Ansible's been a very successful acquisition for Red Hat, what's the status or the future plans, any updates on Ansible? Its role, its relevance, and so forth? >> Joe: So Ansible's a great story, so Ansible was an open source company, very smart people, very innovative technology, strong community. Red Hat acquired the company about 2 1/2 years ago, and one of the things that we did was we didn't screw it up, right? A lot of times big companies acquire small companies and they basically crush the innovation and they kill whatever the unique thing that company was doing. In this case what we've done is, because Red Hat's so good at open source, and we've actually nurtured that community. We've actually helped that community grow, virally. So the amount of contributors to the community has grown significantly, the amount of integration activities, interest in that community has grown wildly over the past 2 1/2 years. So I think our biggest thing is, we let it do what it's really good at, and we've nurtured it, so we've taken a really smart team with some great technology and we've amplified that with the Red Hat, you know, sort of capabilities. >> Furrier: What was the secret sauce on that? 'Cause this is a really, kind of, hard thing to do. Acquisitions can get mangled a bit, and founders leave, and what did you guys do specifically to not screw it up? Was it leave them alone? Invest some tech? You mentioned nurturing, what specifically did you guys do, looking back at that, that was the secret to that success? >> Joe: So I, having been personally acquired three times, right? I joined Red Hat through acquisition over five years ago, so I've been here a while. When I did the Ansible acquisition I wanted to make sure that what we didn't do was break anything, so a lot of times, in acquisitions, they tend to take the new company apart, and they say 'Okay, marketing moves over to corporate marketing, engineering moves over here, product management moves over there.' and they sort of take the transmission apart, and then they wonder why the engine's not running anymore, why the car's not running anymore. And so the first thing was: don't break anything. Let's understand it, let's understand how it fits in. I also think there was a good culture match. There was a good impedance match, for the fact that they were smart open source guys. So the Red Hat way was, like >> Furrier: So they got Red Hat? >> Yeah, they got Red Hat, and a number of them were ex Red Hatters, I mean, we have a lot of Red Hatters that go off and start up very interesting projects because of their background, and sometimes they come home. And this was that kind of case. >> Furrier: That's good, that's a great practice. I've got to say I've seen many acquisitions mangled, you know, it's the same exact thing, just go to the playbook, they tear them apart. >> Joe: Yeah it doesn't usually end well. You know, when large company acquires small company. >> So I'm curious how you all are looking at the role of the IT admin/operator in this new world, this new cloud data world we're going to, you know, the people formerly known as sysadmins, you know, I think they thought about automation a lot with maybe day zero, like setting things up. But now we've got day one and beyond, you know, we've got to run these clouds. Does IT become full of SRE's and operators? How are you dealing with your community and training them and teaching them how to go to work with a new environment? >> Joe: Yeah so the world has gotten significantly more complicated for those folks, right? In the good old days they were sort of segmented, maybe, into compute, network, and storage teams, and now you've got like, the public cloud team, and the private cloud team, and the container team, and the different teams, right? So the complexity has been amplified, right? What we're trying to do is, we're trying to reduce that complexity by things like Ansible, that basically can automate across those domains. So we introduced Ansible network automation, you can automate storage, you can automate compute, you can do stuff in private cloud, physical servers, different layers with the same set of tools. That means that a person, instead of being a generalist, or specialist, can be what Gartner calls a versitalist. They can actually be good at a number of domains, and in this case with a single tool set, without having to learn five different tools. >> Furrier: Joe, great to have you on the Cube. Thanks for the insights, great to hear your perspective, final question for you; AI, machine learning, always a big part of analytics, are you guys doing anything there? What's the update on what's coming? Because Automation, you've got to love machine learning, got to love some of this software. You guys doing anything in particular, notable, that you want to share? That's worth highlighting? >> Joe: Yeah we showed some stuff in our keynote here, in terms of demos, but we're really driving towards algorithmic IT operations. We're going to keep applying analytics, building towards machine learning and AI for these complex environments. We have some really smart people internally, data scientists and experts, we have a lot of expertise because we're building some of these platforms, and the new technologies. We have a lot of customers, they trust us, they share data with us, so we're really looking forward to advancing this sort of AI ops discipline. >> And the trend as your friend, the winds at your back, whatever you want to call it, you see in Kubernetes, you see in the kind of decomposition of services down to the very low granular level, throw some instrumentation on it, you now have data, data's good right? >> Joe: Speed of transformation is getting faster. >> Joe Fitzgerald, Vice President and General Manager of the management business unit here at Red Hat, on the Cube, sharing his insights here in the Cube, I'm John Furrier with John Troyer, stay with us for more live coverage after this short break. (outro music)

>> Announcer: Live from Boston, Massachusetts, it's The Cube covering Red Hat Summit 2017. Brought to you by Red hat. >> I'm joined by my co-host, Stu Miniman. Stu, this is day one of the conference: 20 keynotes, six general sessions, people from 70 countries gathered here in Boston, Massachusetts. You are a Red Hat Summit veteran. Thoughts, impressions of the first day. What has struck you really? >> So first of all, it's like Red Hat itself. The company just keeps growing. It's just one of those, you know, strong progress. We talked a little bit over the intro this morning with Dave Vellante as, what is it, 60 quarters consecutively that the company has had revenue growth. It's like, I've worked for a lot of tech companies. It's like, I remember when I worked for (mumbles) when they were doing it (mumbles). They have a miss and the stock kind of drops. IBM, you know, has had quarter and quarter and things like this, but with all of these waves and look, Red Hat's not the biggest company out there, but they are an important player in many changes in the ecosystem. This is one of my favorite developer shows that we cover at the show. Of course, Open Source, we used to say, okay, software's leaving the world and Open Source is eating software. Red Hat's right in the middle of this. I think most people agree. There is really only one way to Red Hat. There's not going to be a Red Hat of something else. There's no one else to really capture that. They got involved at a certain point in time where they could have that model, but they've extended it. They understand what they're doing. They're getting involved in a lot of interesting technologies and there's a lot of people, like most conferences that we go to, there's a lot of passionate people that are really interested, very tech savvy group here, going into all of these breakouts. Many came yesterday for some things. They're coming for a whole week to just dig in, do demos. Down on the show floor, they've got little coating challenges and VR things. I mean there's just a lot of pieces of the show and we only get to see a part of it, but I've enjoyed the customers, the executives, and only one day of three that we're covering so far. >> It is early days in the summit, but where would you say that we are in terms of the maturity of the cloud? We heard from Jim Whitehurst, the CEO, he's going to be on the program tomorrow. He talked about how cloud strategy really is the #1 thing on customers' mind. The cloud is not new and we are really evolving and is maturing, where are we? >> Right, a couple of stats from the keynote this morning. It was 84% of customers have a cloud strategy. Now those of us in the analyst world, we might say, "Well, let's see whether they really have a strategy "they understand," and 59% have a multi-cloud environment which doesn't surprise us. Most people, the joke we used to have was, you had two types of customers, those that were using Amazon and those that didn't realize that some group was using Amazon, reminds me of a comment I made earlier, about like Linux itself. There was always, 15 years ago, big companies would be like, "oh, no, we're a Unix shop," or "we're looking at windows." No, no, no, there's the guy in the corner. He's been using Linux for awhile and that's been a big driver, so cloud absolutely is maturing. I loved, it was an interesting discussion we had with Paul Cormier towards the end of the day. We were seeing Ramgji from Google talking about how we've got the infrastructure and we've got the applications. And I'm an infrastructure guy, but I knew from day one, the reason you build infrastructures is because of your application. If I can just buy SaaS, I don't care about the infrastructure underneath it. The SaaS provider sure does. We talked a lot to SaaS providers as to how they're building their solution. If I'm using infrastructure as a service, you know, there's some I need to understand the infrastructure and there's plenty of infrastructure here, everything from, there's the storage and networking teams, Open Source is permeating every corner of the environment, so it's maturing, but in many ways it's gotten more complex. Cloud was supposed to, many of us thought, simplify the environment, but boy, it seems that many of the things that we had in previous ways as it gets more mature, gets a little bit more complex. Red Hat tries to take those pieces together, build them into solutions. We've talked about there's Red Hat Linux. Enterprise Linux is the platform that can live in many environments. Open Shift is something that allows to encapsulate all of those services, things like containers, we're working with our cloud data applications, and how I want to build them, Open Shift's going to help and you know Cooper Netties goes into the mix so Red Hat is places strategic bets, and, you know, has a strong position in the number place and has big partners. It's really interesting to see. We've had a couple on already, and we'll have many on through the week from key providers in the infrastructure and cloud players out there. >> I think the theme of this year's conference is the power of the individual, and it really is. I mean, we heard from Sam Ramji who said, "This is the age of the developer." Developers have more respect, more veneration, than ever before and yet we also heard from Sandra Rivera, it is also harder than it has ever been before to be a developer because there is just so much data and it's hard to know the difference between the good data and the bad data and where you find the right insights to make decisions that drive the business on that data and if you're a developer, you might not have the business savvy to do that, so it's a real balance here that the companies and developers themselves are trying to strike. Are they doing a good job? I mean, is it still too early? >> It's funny. When you say that it makes me think of in the machine-learning space, it's how do we get the data to train the machine to understand what is good or not, and you know, I wish they'd done that for us when we all went to college because in my job, it's always like, okay, what data can we trust? Well, if you remember from Princess Bride, it was like, with Versini, it was like, well, I know a vendor told me information, so therefore, I know I can't trust that data, but if I take someone else's data, you know, it gets very confusing as it, what I'm saying, is any single piece of data a lot of times you know you can throw that out because maybe it's good, maybe it's not, but how do I get, understand the trends, understand what's going on. I love talking to practitioners here that when they're talking about their business and the impact it's had. We had one of the customers on today was like, "Look, I deployed this, and I have like $6 million "worth of savings in my business year every year. I mean, that's hard information, hard to argue with it. Now are there other solutions that might do that? Sure, but yeah, it's challenging to understand what's good data, what's not good data. As an industry, you know, whether that's the kind of the people or the machines themselves. >> I think the other question that we're all grappling with here is that, and you talked about this earlier, just talking about the evolution of Red Hat that you've seen in coming to this summit all these years. This is a company founded in 1993. Today it has a market cap of $15 billion, 2.4 billion in revenue, nearly 8,000 employees. Can a big company, and it's a big company now, can it innovate, can it truly innovate and we heard in the keynote one of the things that Jim Whitehurst was trying to do was to cultivate a startup mindset. Is that possible? >> Yeah, it's a great question, and I know, Rebecca, you and I've been talking about this throughout the week so far as to big companies have challenges because there are the structure and the organization and what drives the business. What's interesting about Red Hat, of course, is that sure they have products, but underneath it, it's all Open Source, so community is in their DNA. As Paul Cormier said, he's like "We couldn't "buy a company and do it closed-source again." They did that a couple years ago, it didn't go well. They were going to transition it, but it's been a case study that's been written up. (talking over each other) >> Me and Jim in the room alone, yes. >> Absolutely, so what's interesting is Red Hat is more like a community in many ways. As Jim Whitehurst spoke, is the open organizations so they act more like an Open Source community than they do a company, of course, that being said, they're profitable, they have employees, they have benefits, they have locations all around the world so it's been interesting to see how Red Hat adopts certain technologies, contributes to them. You know, it would be interesting to see who else Jim Whitehurst tomorrow and say okay, you know, what is a product that was developed by Red Hat versus a project that was taken in by Red Hat, something I've seen over the last three or four years, a lot of acquisitions they made, it was, let's take Open Stack for example. There is a big survey that's done twice a year that said what are people using and what are they interested in with Open Stack, and it felt like that was the buying guide for Red Hat because it was like, "Oh, okay, here's the sent-to-us stuff, "that was pretty interesting. "Well, we can't buy Konica, we'll buy Sento West," and that comes under the umbrella. "Oh, there's this storage management piece "that actually is open source that people "are using for Open Stack, well let me buy that one, too." So Red Hat has become inquisitive, but it's to get deeper engagement in the community. They are all Open Source so always there is that balance in big companies of what do I do with R & D and what do I do with M & A? And Red Hat has done both. I think they've done a good job of moving the industry forward. Innovation is a lot of times a buzz word, but they do some good stuff. They contribute a lot. People here are very positive about what's going on. Just because they haven't created the next flying car or things like that. >> But they're on that. We heard here that they're thinking about it. I mean, I think that's also, I didn't mean to ask the question insinuating that they're not innovating, but I do think that particularly at a time where we are seeing Microsoft years of no growth, Intel, stalled growth, you know, what is Red Hat's secret sauce, and also what is going to the breaking point for these other lagging enterprise companies? When will we see some new ideas and fresh perspective? >> Yeah, it's interesting 'cause we write this whole, the shift of what's happening with cloud, the wave of the machine-learning, the augmented intelligence or artificial intelligence, how much is that going to ding the traditional companies, especially the infrastructure companies. Red Hat touches it, but they're much broader. Their growth, they're an Open Source company. It's interesting. I've seen a lot of other companies, the Open Sourced-based ones, "Oh, we're not "an Open Source company. "We're an enterprise software company," or "software company." I'm sure we asked Red Hat if they were a software company, they will say well, of course, like everything we deliver is software, but at their DNA, they are Open Source, and that kind of sets them apart from the pack even though there are other examples Dave Vellante went through this morning of other companies that are heavily involved in Open Source, struggling with that how do we monetize Open Source. >> Well, is it a problem with the business model? Why is it so challenging? >> It's a great question. The first time I interviewed Jim Whitehurst, it's like "Jim, why aren't there more billion dollar Open Source companies," and his answer was, you know, Not being flippy," he's like, "Look, selling free is hard." >> Yeah, that's a great point, but I think that we should, we need to dig a little deeper and hopefully we can get to the bottom of that by day three. >> Absolutely, and I tell ya, I'm sitting here listening to, you know, we'll be doing the Cloud Foundry Summit in June there, which is pivotal as making a lot of money with that, but most of the other companies not doing so much. We were just a Docker Con. A couple weeks ago, Docker Company seems to be growing, doing well. They just changed their CEO today so hot news out on SiliconANGLE.com. Ben Golub, the CEO, I just interviewed him a couple weeks ago and now he's moving the board, but they're bringing the Chairman of the Board to be CEO, so we look at all these companies: Cloudera just IPO'd. Hortonworks is a public company. These companies that have Open Core or Open Source as a major piece of what they're doing, none have had the just measured growth and success that Red Hat does, so you know, Red Hat has a case study. It still seems to be one that stands alone category by themselves, but you know, partnering and growing and doing great, and it's exciting to cover. >> Day two, anything you're particularly excited about? >> Yeah, so I got a taste of the AWS-enhanced partnership talking about how Open Shift is going to have deeper integration and we talked a little bit with Paul Cormier so I suspect Jim Whitehurst will be talking to him about it. We have one of the main guys involved in that from Red Hat side will be on our program tomorrow. So the keynote tomorrow, I'll be watching here. Maybe there'll be a special guest during the keynote talk about that announcement some, but you know, obviously a space we watch real closely. We had Optum, one of the customers on today, he said, "I use Open Shift and I'm using Amazon and want to do it most and this is a game-changer for me," so we think this is really interest to watch, really, you talked about maturity early in this segment here, the maturity of hybrid cloud. If Amazon starts to get deeper into the data centers, partnering with companies like Red Hat and like VMware, that will help them to stave off some of the competition that's coming at them. (mumbles) to Microsoft and Google who's getting Cooper Netties everywhere. Lots more to dig in with. There's some announcements today but a lot more to come and you know, more customers, more partners, more Red Hatters. >> That's great, great. Well, we are looking forward to being back here tomorrow bright and early. Thank you for joining us. I'm Rebecca Knight for Stu Miniman. We'll see you back here tomorrow. (innovative tones)

>> Voiceover: Live from Boston, Massachusetts, it's the Cube covering Red Hat Summit 2017. Brought to you by Red Hat. >> Hi, I'm Stu Miniman and welcome back to the three days of live coverage here at Red Hat Summit 2017. The sixth key note of the week just wrapped up. Everybody's streamin' out. We've got a couple more segments. Happy to welcome back to the program a couple gentlemen we had on actually the Open Stack Summit. John Allessio, who'd the vice president of - And Nick Hopman, who's the senior director of Emerging Technology Practices, both with Red Hat. Gentlemen, great to see you again. >> Great to see you again Stu, good afternoon. >> Yeah, so a year ago you guys launched this idea of the Open Innovation Labs. We're opening these labs this year. You've got some customers. We actually had Optum on earlier in the week. We're going to have the easiER AG guys on, I should say - I was corrected earlier this week. I shouldn't say guys, actually I think it's two doctors, a man and a woman that are on. >> Andre and Dorothy. Andre and Dorothy - so really amazing customer testimonials for working through. So John, why don't you start with, you know, give us the update on the innovation lab program. Open and innovation get, you know, discussed a lot. Give us the real meat of what happens. >> So, just maybe a quick recap. >> Yeah. >> So Stu, we had about oh a year and a half ago or so, our strategic advisory board tell us, Red Hat, we really are looking for you to help show us the way in how to develop software, but also kind of help us leverage this culture that Red Hat has and developing software the Red Hat way. And so we worked with about a dozen clients across the globe, got a lot of great feedback on what they were looking for. We created an offering and then we launched it, as you said in Austin at Open Stack Summit. And now we've done many engagements in Europe and in North America across multiple different industries. We had here at the Summit this week actually two clients talk on the main stage, both Optum and easiER AG. And both of them have been through innovation lab engagements. Very different industries, very different clients, but what it has proven in both cases is it's really been a great way and a great catalyst to kind of spark innovation, whether it's within an existing IT infrastructure or building out some capability in particular customer environments, like we did with Optum, or kind of taking some ideas. And I'll let Dorothy and Andre tell their story when they come on and work with you. I don't want to take their thunder. But a great way to show you how we can work with a start up and really help them kind of take their vision and make it reality in an application. >> Yeah, Nick, you know, we've done so many interviews about the various pieces, lots of interesting business. It reminds me of that kind of pipelining that you talk about. One of the announcements this week was Open Shift IO, which it helps with kind of the application modernization. Can you maybe help us, you know, put together how the products that Red Hat does and what you're doing in the Open Innovation Labs, how do those go together and mesh and new stuff come in? >> It's actually kind of at the core of what we do anyway. So, we are building on top of the foundation, the technologies at Red Hat's core platform. But in a residency with Open Innovation Labs we are tying in other technologies, other things outside of the Stack. But with like Open Shift IO, what we've created was what we called the push button infrastructure. How are we showing with the process and everything to innovate on top of the Red Hat technology? How do we accelerate that journey? And so we created what was called the push button infrastructure to show that foundational acceleration, and Open Shift IO is actually now kind of part of that core. And adding in other components, other technologies that Red Hat has, whether it's our ISV partners, things in Open Shift commons, all those things to accelerate the application development experience. And so I think with Open Shift IO and as Red Hat continues to evolve in the development kind of tooling landscape, you're going to see how we are helping our customers do cloud data of application development more so than ever before. >> Yep, and maybe to add to that too, Nick, we were talking to a client this morning about some of their challenges and their priorities for this current physical year, And that particular client was talking about Jenkins and a number of non-Red Hat technologies as well because at the end of the day, our customers have Red Hat products, have non-Red Hat products. I think the great thing that maybe you can mention is when you look at that push button infrastructure that we've built, it's not really a Red Hat thing, although it clearly is tied to the Red Hat technology. But it's even bigger than that. And I think that would be important for the team to understand. >> Yeah so we actually have online is what we call our text stack, and it allows the customer to kind of select the current technologies that we've currently got integrated into our push button infrastructure, and it's always evolving. So I think what we're trying to bring to the table from a technology perspective is our more prescriptive approach. But it's always changing, always evolving. So if customers are wanting to use x or y technology, we're able to integrate with that. But even more so, if you take that technology to the foundation, put a couple of droplets of the Red Hat DNA and the culture is really where that innovation and that inspiration kind of where it's - it's culminating on top of it. So they're building out the applications, like the easiER AG examples. >> John: Yeah, excellent. >> It's great, I always love - By the time we get to the end here, oh I see some of the common threads. You know, for example, Ansible's acquired a year and a half ago, boy we've seen Ansible you know weave it's way into a lot of products. >> Nick: Sure. >> Was talking to Ashush just a sort while ago. And the Open Stack commons, which reflected what you were just talking about is customers are coming, they're sharing their stories. And it's not all Red Hat pieces. One thing I think, I go to a lot of technology shows, and it's usually, "Oh, well we want to talk about solutions." But by these pieces, and Red Hat at it's core it's all open source, and therefore there's always going to be other pieces that tie in. How do you extend as to how much of this is driven by the Red Hat business versus you know the problems of the customer? I'm sure those mesh together pretty well, but maybe some learning you've had over the last year that you could share on that. >> Sure. I think one of the great starting points Stu is what we try and do in every case is start with what we call is a discovery session. So it's one of our consultants, or one of our solution architects really going into the client and having a discussion around what is the business problem we're trying to solve, or what is the business opportunity we're trying to capitalize upon. And from there, you know we have a half day to a day kind of discussion around what these priorities are, and then we come back to them with the deliverable that says okay, here's how we could solve that problem. Now there will be areas that we of course think we have Red Hat technology that absolutely is a perfect fit. We're going to put it in and make that as a recommendation. But there's going to be other technologies that we're also going to recommend as well. And I think that's what we've learned in these Innovation Lab engagements. Because often it's a discussion with IT of course, but also a discussion with line of business. And sometimes what happens in these discovery sessions is sometimes it's the line of business and IT perhaps connecting for the first time on this particular topic. And so we'll come back with that approach and it'll be an approach that's tailored to that customer environment. >> One thing kind of pivots a little bit from the topic of the technology, but I mean the culture and how we're doing this. I mean we are working with ISV's and things of how they could come through the residency to get things spun up into Open Shift commons and get their technology in the Stack or integrated with Red Hat's technical solutions. But on the other hand, you know really when they come in and they work with us, they're driving forward with looking at you know changes of their culture. They're trying to do digital transformation. They're trying to do these different types of things, but working with that cross-functional team. They're coming up with, oh wow, we were solving the problems the wrong way. And that's kind of just the point of the discovery session, figuring out what those business challenges are is really kind of what we're bubbling up with that process. >> Yeah, I'm curious. When I think to just open innovation, even outside of the technology world, sometimes we can learn a lot from people that aren't doing the same kind of things that we've been doing. I know you've got a couple of case studies here, customers sharing their stories, but how do we allow the community to learn more? When they get engaged in the innovation lab are customers sharing a little bit more? We know certain industries are more open to sharing than others, but what are they willing to share? What don't they share? How do you balance that kind of security if you will of their own IP as separate from the processes that they're doing? >> John: Sure. >> It's actually kind of interesting, we had a story this week, we have an engagement going on in our London space, which will be launching in a week and a half. But they're going on right now. And there was a customer that was kind of coming through for a regular executive briefing if you will. And we walked him through the space. And they saw the teams working in there and they were before in the sales kind of meaning, they were a little bit close-minded and close-sourced if you will. Trying to not want to share some of their core nuggets of their IP if you will. And once they saw kind of the collaborative landscape, and this is not even technology based, but just the culture of an open conversation. You know I hate to overuse - you know the sticky notes everywhere, the dev ops. I mean they were really doing a conversation with the customer that was engaging. And all of a sudden the customer that was there on the sales conversation goes, "I want to do this session, I want to go through this discovery session with you guys." And so I think customers are trying to do that. And the other thing is, in our spaces and in our locations, like Boston, we are actually having two team environments, and we've designed it to try and create collisions. So they're basically on two sides, but there's also a common area in the middle where we're trying to create those collisions to inspire that open conversation with our clients as well. Some may be comfortable with it, some might not be as comfortable with it, but we're going to challenge them. >> Nick, I love that term collisions. There's a small conference I go to in Providence. Haven't made it every year, but a few times. It's an innovation conference. And they call it the random collision of unusual suspects. It's the things we can learn from the people we don't know at all. Unfortunately, we're too much. You know, we know the people we know. We know a lot of the same information that we know. If somebody outside of the like three degrees of separation that you might find, that next really amazing thing that will help us move to the next piece, it brings me to my next point. You mentioned London and Boston, how do you decide where you're building your next centers, what's driving that kind of piece of it? And, you know, bring us up to speed as the two new locations, one of which if we had a good arm we might be able to throw a baseball and hit. >> Excellent, so let me just start by first of all saying, you know part of what we're doing here is it's this experiential residency is what it is. And that residency can happen at a client location, at a Red Hat location, or even a pop-up you know kind of third party location. And quite frankly, over the course of the last year, we've done all three of those scenarios. So all three of them are valid. As far as it relates to a Red Hat facility, what we try and do is find a location if we can that's either co-located with a large percentage of Red Hat clients, and or maybe Red Hat engineering. Because oftentimes we'll want to bring some of the engineers into these sessions. So, Mountain View, where we have a center today was a natural 'cause we have some engineering capability out on the west coast. And Boston is of course very natural as well because we have a very large engineering presence here in Boston. In fact, I'll let you talk a little bit about the Boston center 'cause that's going to be our next one that opens here in just a few weeks. So maybe Nick, talk a bit about you know what we're doing in the Boston center, which will be, if you will, our world wide hub for Red Hat innovation. It's not just going to be the Boston center, it's also going to be our world wide hub. >> No pun intended that it's in the hub that is Boston. >> You got it, you got it! >> Excellent. >> So you know, what are we doing in the innovation center, and the engineering center, and the customer briefing center all co-located in Boston. >> Yeah so it's actually going back to the collisions. We've even try and create collisions in our own organization. So it's actually an eight-shaped building. We've got four floors, or two floors on each side. So kind of effectively four floors. Engineering on one side on two floors, and an EBC on a floor above the Open Innovation Labs, and the Open Innovation Labs on the third floor if you will. And there's actually floor cut-outs, so people you know if they're coming in from an executive briefing, they can see down, see what's going on there. And then engineering on the other side. And the point there is that open culture just even within our organization, working with the engineers across the board, getting them over into our space, working with us to solving the problems. And showing, you know, I think the key point that I would hit on there is really trying to inspire customers what it's like to work in a community. So community powered innovation. All those types of things. And so the space is trying to do that. The collisions, the openness obviously, flexibility, but also what we're trying to do is create a platform or a catalyst of innovation. And whether or not it's in the location or pop-up location, we're trying to show the customer some of these principals that we're seeing that's effectively allowing Red Hat to drive the innovation, and how they can take that back into their own. So, you know the locations are great for driving a conversation from a sales perspective, and just overall showcasing it. But the reality is we've got this concept to innovate anywhere. We want to be able to take our technology, our open culture, everything you would want to use and go be able to take that back into your organization. 'Cause our immersive experience is only you know, it's kind of camp for coders or camp for the techies if you will. So you know that's working well, but that's not long term. Long term we have to show them how they can drive it forward, you know with themselves. >> Where do I sign up for the summer program? (all laugh) >> It's coming this summer. >> So Boston will launch in the end of June. >> End of June, early July. >> And the June timeframe we had, I don't know how many dozens of clients, and partners, and Red Hatters go through in hard hat tours this week, here at the Summit. And then in two weeks, we'll open in downtown or really in the heart of London. >> Stu: Alright, yeah, quick flat flight across the pond to get to London. Anything special about that location? >> I think just overall the locations all have a little bit of uniqueness to them. I they're definitely - we did design them to inspire innovation, thinking outside the box. So I think you know, if you go visit one of our locations you might a couple kind of hidden rooms if you will. Some other unique things. But overall, they are just hubs in general for the regions. Hubs of technology and innovation. And so from the go forward perspective I mean we are trying to say, you know, Red Hat is doing things different, thinking different. And these are kind of a way to show it. So trying to find that urban location that is a center point for people to be able to travel in and be able to experience that is really kind of the core. >> So London will open in two weeks, and then we're already working on blueprints for Singapore. >> Singapore, yeah. >> For our Asia hub, and had some great conversations with our leader for Latin America about some very initial plans for Latin America as well. So you know, we'll have great presence across the globe. We'll be able to bring this capability to customer sites. We've already done that. We'll be able to do pop ups. 'Cause even in some cases customers are saying you know we don't want to travel, but we want to get out of our home environment so we can really focus on this and have that immersive experience, and that intimate experience. So we'll do the pop ups as well. >> Driving change, we are seeing that that's the best way. Especially with this kind of, you know, the residency. It is a time box. So if we get them out of their day to day, some of the things, you know, sometimes are the things that are holding them out. Get them in the pop up location, get them outside of their space. All of a sudden their eyes open up. And we had a large retailer, international retailer that we did a project with on the west coast, and getting them out of their space got them coming back. The actual quotes from their executives and the key stakeholders were like they came back fired up. >> Stu: Yeah. >> And they came back motivated to try to make change without our organization. So it's disruption on every level. >> Yeah, you can't underestimate the motivation and the spirit that people come out of these engagements with. It's like a renewed sense of, "I can do this." And we saw that exactly with this retail engagement of really already working on preparing for Black Friday, and putting some great plans in place and really building that out for them. >> John Allessio, Nick Hopman; we always love digging in about the innovation. Absolutely something that excites most people of our industry. That doesn't? Maybe you're in the wrong industry. >> Exactly. >> We've got a couple more interviews. Stay tuned with us. I'm Stu Miniman, you're watching the Cube. (light music)

>> Man: Live, from Boston, Massachusetts, it's The Cube, covering Red Hat Summit 2017, brought to you by Red Hat. >> Welcome back to The Cube's coverage of the Red Hat Summit, here in Boston, Massachusetts. I'm you're host Rebecca Knight along with my co-host Stu Miniman. We're joined by Ashesh Badani. He is the Vice President and General Manager of OpenShift here at Red Hat. Thanks so much, Ashesh. >> Thanks for having me on yet again. >> Yes, you are a Cube veteran, so welcome back. We're always happy to talk to you. You're also an OpenShift veteran. You've been there five years, and before the cameras are rolling you were talking about how we really are at a tipping point here with OpenShift, and we're seeing a widespread adoption and embrace of containers. Can you share the context with us. >> Sure, so I think we've spent a fair amount of time in this market talking about how important containers are, the value of containers, DevOps, microservices. I think at this Red Hat Summit, we've spent a fair amount of time trying to ensure that people understand one containers are real, in terms of, you know, adoption level that we're seeing. They're being run in production and at scale. And across a variety of industries, right. So, just at this summit we've had over 30 customers from across the world, across industries like financial services, government, transportation, tech, telco, a variety of different industries talking about how they've been deploying and using containers. At our keynotes we had Macquarie Bank from Australia, Barclay's Bank from the U.K. We had United Health slash OPTUM. All talking about, you know, mission critical applications, how their developers running applications, both new applications, right, microservice-style applications, but also existing legacy applications on the OpenShift platform. >> Ashesh, I've been watching this for a few years, we've talked to you many times, we talked about containers. Maybe I'm oversimplifying it but let me know. It feels like OpenShift is your delivery mechanism to take some things that might be hard if I tried to do them myself and made it a lot simpler. Kind of give like Red Hat did for Linux, I have containers, I have Kubernetes, I have OpenStack, and all three of those I didn't hear a ton at the show, I heard a lot about OpenShift and the OpenShift family because underneath OpenShift are those pieces. Am I gettin' it right, or there's more nuance you need-- >> Great observation, great observation, yeah, and we're seeing that from our customers, too. So, when they're making strategic choice, they're talking about, you know, how can I find the container platform to run at scale. When they make their choice, all they're thinking about well what's the existing, you know, development tools I've got. Can it integrate with the ones that I have in place. What's the underlying infrastructure they can run on. OpenStack of course is a great one, right. We have many customers, Santander, BBVA Bank are just two examples of those, but then also, can I run the OpenShift structure in a hybrid cloud, or I guess what we're calling a multi-cloud world now. Amazon, Google, Asher, and so on. But actually interestingly enough we made some announcements with Amazon as well at the show with regard to making sure some AWS service are able to be integrated into the OpenShare platform. So, we find customers today finding a lot of value in the flexibility of the deployment platforms they have in place, integration with various developer tools. I think my colleague Harry Mower was on earlier talking about OpenShift.io, again, you know, super interesting, super exciting now it's been from our perspective with regard to giving developers more choice. And in addition to that, you know, the other parts of the portfolio, right, going to your point, earlier. We're trying to attach that increasingly as options for customers around OpenShift. Storage is a great example. So we announced some work we've doing with regard to container storage with our classified system for OpenShift. >> So you're talking about simplification and that does seem to be a real theme here. Once you've solved that problem, what's next, what are some of the other customer issues that you need to resolve and help them overcome and make their lives easier? >> Yeah, so, the rate of change in technology, as you well know, you've been following this now for a while is just dramatic, right. I think it's probably faster than we've ever seen in a long, long time. I was having a conversation with a large franchise customer with regard to, you know, just as we feel like, you know, we're getting people to adopt Hadoop, everyone seems to have moved on to Spark. And now we're on Spark and people are talking about, oh, maybe Flink is next. Now that we get to Flink, now they're saying AI and ML is next. It's just like, well, where does this stop, right. So I don't think it stops. The question is, you know, at what point of time do you sort of jump in. Embrace the change, right, that's sort of what Devops all about right, continuous change, you know, embrace it, be able to evolve with it, fail fast, pick yourself up, and then have the organization be in this sort of continuous learning, this kaizen environment. >> Yeah, Ashesh, from day one of the keynote talked about the platforms and you know Red Hat Enterprise Linux was kind of the first big platform that can live a lot of environments. Seems OpenShift is a second platform, and the scope of it seems to be growing. We talked to Harry about the OpenShift.io. He alluded to the fact that we might see expansion into the family there. What is, you said that innovation, and you know change keeps growing. What's the boundaries of what OpenShift's going to cover. Where do you see it today and where's the vision go moving forward? >> Yeah, so (laughs) great question, a double-edged sword right. Because on the one hand of course we want to make sure OpenShift is a foundation for doing a lot of stuff. But then there's also the Linux philosophy. Do one thing, do it well, right. And so there's always this temptation with regard to keeping on wanting to take new things on, right, I mean for a long time people have said, hey, why aren't we in the database business? You know, why aren't you doing more? Well the question is, you know, how many things can we do well? Because anything we commit to, as you well know, Red Hat will invest significant amount of engineering effort upstream in the community to help drive it forward, right. We've done that on Linux container front. We're doing that in Kubernetes. Obviously we do that with RHEL, we've done that Jboss technologies. So, we're very, very cognizant of making sure that we provide an environment and basically an ecosystem around us that can grow and be able to attach the momentum we have in place. As a result of that we announced the container health index at this conference, right. Mostly because, you know, there's just no way for one company to provide all the services that are possible, right. So to be able to grade applications that come in, be able to sort of give customers confidence that, you know, these can be certified and work in our environment, and then be able to kind of expand out that ecosystem is going to be really important going forward. >> Yeah, Ashesh that's an interesting one, the container health index. I'm going to play with the term there. What's the health of the container industry there. We at The Cube at DockerCon a couple weeks ago had a couple of Red Hatters on the program. There was kind of a reshuffling, you know. The Moby project, open source, we've got Docker CE, Docker EE, Docker actually referenced, you know, Fedora and CentOS and RHEL as you know, something that they did similar to but, what's your take on the announcements there? >> Sure, sure, I'll probably butcher this quote tremendously, but it was Mark Twain or someone said, "The rumors of my whatever are greatly exaggerated," so. You know, there's always, you know, some amount of change that sort of happens, especially with new technology, and you've got so many players sort of jumping in, right. I mean of course there's Docker Inc. There's Red Hat but there's, you know, Google and IBM and Microsoft and Amazon, and there's a lot of companies, right, that all look at this as a way of advancing the number of workloads that come onto their platforms. You know, we've seen some of the challenges, if you will, that Docker Inc. has been facing as well as the great work it's been doing to help drive the community forward, right. Those are both interesting things. And they've got a business to run. We've announced, we've seen the changes announced with regard to some of the renaming and Moby, and I think there's still a lot more detail that need to be fleshed out. And so I, we're going to wait for the dust to settle. I think we want to make sure our customers are confident. We've had this conversation with many customers that whatever direction that, you know, we go in, we will continue supporting that technology. We will stand behind it. We will make sure we're putting upstream engineers to help drive the community that will provide the greatest value for customers. >> Ashesh, you're one of the judges for the Innovation Awards here. Can you tell us a little bit more about the secret sauce that you're looking for. First of all, how you choose these winners, and what it is you're looking for. >> Yeah, so I'm really proud of the work I do to help support the judging of the Innovation Awards. You know, I think it's a fantastic thing we do to recognize, I was telling Stu earlier, you know we could probably have done a dozen more awards, right, the entries that are coming in are just fantastic. We try to change up the categories a little bit every year to kind of match with the changes in industry, like for example, you know, DevOps, Macquarie Bank was a great example of enterprise transformation. You know, they had this great line in their keynote right, where their ambition I think really impressed a lot of the judges with regard to, hey our competition is not necessarily the other financial service companies, it's the last app you opened. That's a remarkable thing, right. Especially for an existing traditional financial services company, you see. So, I think what we look for is scope, ambition, and vision, but also how you're executing against it, and what demonstrable results do you have for that. And so, you probably saw that, as, you know, we talked about all the various innovation awards we gave, right, whether it's Macquarie Bank or, you know, British Columbia Empower Individuals, right, so the whole notion of celebrating the impact of individual, and create an exchange for them to engage with the wider civic body. That's really important for us. >> Ashesh, one of the innovation award-winners OPTUM we talked to, they're an OpenShift customer. They're really excited with the AWS announcement. We've been chewing on it, talking to a lot of people. We think it's the most significant news coming out of the show. As you said, there's certain details that need to bake out when we look at some of these things. By the time we get to AWS Reinvent we'll probably understand a little bit some of the pricing and, you know, some of the other pieces, and it'll be there, but, you know, bring us from your viewpoint, from an OpenShift standpoint what this means to kind of an extension of the product line and your customers. >> Yeah, so, we've got, at least at this show you had over 30 customers presenting about their use of OpenShift. And we typically find them deploying OpenShift in a variety of different environments including AWS. So for example Swiss Rail, right, obviously out of Switzerland, is taking advantage of, you know, running it in their own data center, taking advantage of AWS as well. When they're doing that they want to make sure that they can consume services from Amazon. Just as if they were running it on Amazon, right. They like the container platform that OpenShift provides, and they like the abstraction level that it puts in place. Of course they have different choices, right. They can choose to run it on OpenStack, they can choose to run OpenShift in some other public cloud provider, yet there are many services that Amazon's releasing that are extremely interesting and value that they provide to their customers. By being able to have relationship with Amazon, and have an almost native experience of those services with regard to OpenShift, regardless of the underlying infrastructure OpenShift runs, it is a very powerful value proposition, definitely for our customers. It's a great one for Amazon because it allows for their services to be used across a multitude of environments. And we feel good about that because we're creating value for our customers, and of course not precluding them from using other services as well. >> I'm wondering if you could shed a little light on the financials, and how you think about things. I mean, you made this great point about the banks saying our competition is the last app you opened. How do you think, with OpenShift, which is free, how do you view your competition, and how do you think about it in terms of the way companies are making their decisions about where they're putting their money in IT investments. >> Right, so OpenShift isn't free, so I'll just make sure-- (all laugh) >> OpenShift.io >> OpenShift.io, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, yes. >> So, consider OpenShift.io as a great gateway into the OpenShift experience, right. It's a cloud-based web environment allows you to develop in browsers, allows you some collaboration with other developers. There's actually a really cool part of the tech, I don't know if Harry talked about right, which is, we almost have, almost machine-learning aspect part of it, you know, that's in play with regard to, you know, if this is the code you're using, here are what other users are doing with it, making recommendations, and so on, so it's a really modern integrated, you know, development environment that we're sort of introducing. That of course doesn't mean that customers can't use existing ones that they have in place. So this is just giving customers more choice. By doing that, we're basically expanding the span of options the customers have. We introduced something called OpenShift Application Runtimes also at this conference, which is supporting existing Java languages or tools or frameworks, right, whether it's Jboss, EAP, Vortex, WildFly, Spring Boot, but also newer ones like No-JavaScript, right, so again, in the spirit of, let's give you choices, let's have you sort of use what you most want to use, and then from our perspective, right, you know, we will create value when it's been deployed at scale. >> Ashesh, before the event at the beginning of it you guys run something called OpenShift Commons. There's some deep education and a lot of it very interactive. I'm curious if there's anything that's kind of surprised you or interesting nuggets that you got from the users. Either stuff that they were further ahead or further behind, or just something that's grabbin' their attention that you could share with our users. >> Well, what I've been really happy to see with the OpenShift Commons is, well, this is a couple things, right. One is we try our best to make it literally a community event, right, so we call it OpenShift Commons but it is a community event. So in the past and even now, we have providers of technologies, even though they might compete with Red Hat and OpenShift available to talk to. Customers, users of our technology, right, so we want it to be an open, welcoming environment for various providers. Second, we're seeing more and more customers wanting to come out and share their experiences, right. So at this OpenShift Commons, I think we had maybe over 10 customers present on, you know, how they were using OpenShift, and sharing with other customers. Number three, this really attracts other customers. I just had a large financial services institution come and say, you know, we attended OpenShift Commons for the first time. This is a fantastic community. How can we become a part of this? You know, get us involved. There's no cost to join, right, it's free and open, and now our numbers are pretty significant. And then when that's in place, right, the ecosystem forms around it. Now, so we have several different ISVs, global system integrators who are all sort of, you know, coalescing, to provide additional services. >> Ashesh, thanks so much for your time, we appreciate it. It's always a pleasure to have you on the program. >> Ashesh: Thanks again, see you all next time. >> I'm Rebecca Knight for Stu Miniman. There'll be more from the Red Hat Summit after this. (relaxed digital beats)

>> (upbeat music) Live from Boston Massachusetts. It's theCube! Covering Red Hat Summit 2017. Brought to you by Red Hat. >> It is day three of the Red Hat Summit, here in Boston Massachusetts. I'm Rebecca Knight. Along with Stu Miniman. We are wrapping up this conference Stu. We just had the final keynote of the morning. Before the cameras were rolling, you were teasing me a little bit that you have more scoop on the AWS deal. I'm interested to hear what you learned. >> (Stu) Yeah, Rebecca. First of all, may the fourth be with you. >> (Rebecca) Well, thank you. Of course, yes. And also with you. >> (Stu) Always. >> Yeah. (giggles) >> (Stu) So, day three of the keynote. They started out with a little bit of fun. They gave out some "May The Fourth Be With You" t-shirts. They had a little Star Wars duel that I was Periscoping this morning. So, love their geeking out. I've got my Millennium Falcon cuff links on. >> (Rebecca) You're into it. >> I saw a bunch of guys wearing t-shirts >> (Rebecca) Princess Leia was walking around! >> Princess Leia was walking around. There were storm troopers there. >> (Rebecca) Which is a little sad to see, but yes. >> (Stu) Uh, yeah. Carrie Fisher. >> Yes. >> Absolutely, but the Amazon stuff. Sure, I think this is the biggest news coming out of the show. I've said this a number of times. And we're still kind of teasing out exactly what it is. Cause, partially really this is still being built out. There's not going to be shipping until later this year. So things like how pricing works. We're still going to get there. But there's some people that were like "Oh wait!' "Open shift can be in AWS, that's great!" "But then I can do AWS services on premises." Well, what that doesn't mean, of course is that I don't have everything that Amazon does packaged up into a nice little container. We understand how computer coding works. And even with open-source and how we can make things server-less. And it's not like I can take everything that everybody says and shove it in my data center. It's just not feasible. What that means though, is it is the same applications that I can run. It's running in OpenShift. And really, there's the hooks and the API's to make sure that I can leverage services that are used in AWS. Of course, from my standpoint I'm like "OK!" So, tell me a little bit about how what latency there's going to be between those services. But it will be well understood as we build these what it's going to be use for. Certain use cases. We already talked to Optim. I was really excited about how they could do this for their environment. So, it's something we expect to be talking about throughout the rest of the year. And by the time we get to AWS Reinvent the week after Thanksgiving, I expect we'll have a lot more detail. So, looking forward to that. >> (Rebecca) And it will be rolled out too. So we'll have a really good sense of how it's working in the marketplace. >> (Stu) Absolutely. >> So other thoughts on the key note. I mean, one of the things that really struck me was talking about open-source. The history of open-source. It started because of a need to license existing technologies in a cheaper way. But then, really, the point that was made is that open-source taught tech how to collaborate. And then tech taught the world how to collaborate. Because it really was the model for what we're seeing with crowdsourcing solutions to problems facing education, climate change, the developing world. So I think that that is really something that Red Hat has done really well. In terms of highlighting how open-source is attacking many of the worlds most pressing problems. >> (Stu) Yeah, Rebecca I agree. We talked with Jim Whitehurst and watched him in the keynotes in previous days. And talked about communities and innovation and how that works. And in a lot of tech conferences it's like "Okay, what are the business outcomes?" And here it's, "Well, how are we helping the greater good?" "How are we helping education?" It was great to see kids that are coding and doing some cool things. And they're like, "Oh yeah, I've done Java and all these other things." And the Red Hat guys were like, "Hey >> (Rebecca) We're hiring. Yeah. (giggles) >> can we go hire this seventh grader?" Had the open-source hardware initiative that they were talking about. And how they can do that. Everything from healthcare to get a device that used to be $10,000 to be able to put together the genome. Is I can buy it on Amazon for What was it? Like six seven hundred dollars and put it together myself. So, open-source and hardware are something we've been keeping an eye on. We've been at the Open Compute Project event. Which Facebook launched. But, these other initiatives. They had.... It was funny, she said like, "There's the internet of things." And they have the thing called "The Thing" that you can tie into other pieces. There was another one that weaved this into fabric. And we can sensor and do that. We know healthcare, of course. Lot's of open-source initiatives. So, lots of places where open-source communities and projects are helping proliferate and make greater good and make the world a greater place. Flattening the world in many cases too. So, it was exciting to see. >> And the woman from the Open-Source Association. She made this great point. And she wasn't trying to be flip. But she said one of our questions is: Are you emotionally ready to be part of this community? And I thought that that was so interesting because it is such a different perspective. Particularly from the product side. Where, "This is my IP. This is our idea. This is our lifeblood. And this is how we're going to make money." But this idea of, No. You need to be willing to share. You need to be willing to be copied. And this is about how we build ideas and build the next great things. >> (Stu) Yeah, if you look at the history of the internet, there was always. Right, is this something I have to share information? Or do we build collaboration? You know, back to the old bulletin board days. Through the homebrew computing clubs. Some of the great progress that we've made in technology and then technology enabling beyond have been because we can work in a group. We can work... Build on what everyone else has done. And that's always how science is done. And open-source is just trying to take us to the next level. >> Right. Right. Right. And in terms of one of the last... One of the last things that they featured in the keynote was what's going on at the MIT media lab. Changing the face of agriculture. And how they are coding climate. And how they are coding plant nutrition. And really this is just going to have such a big change in how we consume food and where food is grown. The nutrients we derive from fruit. I was really blown away by the fact that the average apple we eat in the grocery store has been around for 14 months. Ew, ew! (laughs) So, I mean, I'm just exciting what they're doing. >> Yeah, absolutely right. If we can help make sure people get clean water. Make sure people have availability of food. Shorten those cycles. >> (Rebecca) Right, right. Exactly. >> The amount of information, data. The whole Farm to Table Initiative. A lot of times data is involved in that. >> (Rebecca) Yeah. It's not necessarily just the stuff that you know, grown on the roof next door. Or in the farm a block away. I looked at a local food chain that's everywhere is like Chipotle. You know? >> (Rebecca) Right. >> They use data to be able to work with local farmers. Get what they can. Try to help change some of the culture pieces to bring that in. And then they ended up the keynote talking more about innovation award winners. You and I have had the chance to interview a bunch of them. It's a program I really like. And talking to some of the Red Hatters there actually was some focus to work with... Talk to governments. Talk to a lot of internationals. Because when they started the program a few years ago. It started out very U.S.-centric. So, they said "Yeah." It was a little bit coincidence that this year it's all international. Except for RackSpace. But, we should be blind when we think about who has great ideas and good innovation. And at this conference, I bumped into a lot of people internationally. Talked to a few people coming back from the Red Sox game. And it was like, "How was it?" And they were like, "Well, I got a hotdog and I understood this. But that whole ball and thing flying around, I don't get it." And things like that. >> So, they're learning about code but also baseball. So this is >> (Stu) Yeah, what's your take on the global community that you've seen at the show this week? >> (Rebecca) Well, as you've said, there are representatives from 70 countries here. So this really does feel like the United Nations of open-source. I think what is fascinating is that we're here in the states. And so we think about these hotbeds of technological innovation. We're here in Boston. Of course there's Silicon Valley. Then there are North Carolina, where Red Hat's based. Atlanta, Austin, Seattle, of course. So all these places where we see so much innovation and technological progress taking place here in the states. And so, it can be easy to forget that there are also pockets all over Europe. All over South America. In Africa, doing cool things with technology. And I think that that is also ... When we get back to one of the sub themes of this conference... I mean, it's not a sub theme. It is the theme. About how we work today. How we share ideas. How we collaborate. And how we manage and inspire people to do their best work. I think that that is what I'd like to dig into a little today. If we can. And see how it is different in these various countries. >> Yeah, and this show, what I like is when its 13th year of the show, it started out going to a few locations. Now it's very stable. Next year, they'll be back in San Francisco. The year after, they'll be back here in Boston. They've go the new Boston office opening up within walking distance of where we are. Here GE is opening up their big building. I just heard there's lots of startups when I've been walking around the area. Every time I come down to the Sea Port District. It's like, "Wow, look at all the tech." It's like, Log Me In is right down the road. There's this hot little storage company called Wasabi. That's like two blocks away. Really excited but, one last thing back on the international piece. Next week's OpenStack Summit. I'll be here, doing theCube. And some of the feedback I've been getting this week It's like, "Look, the misperception on an OpenStack." One of the reasons why people are like, "Oh, the project's floundering. And it's not doing great, is because the two big use case. One, the telecommunication space. Which is a small segment of the global population. And two, it's gaining a lot of traction in Europe and in Asia. Whereas, in North America public cloud has kind of pushed it aside a little bit. So, unfortunately the global tech press tends to be very much, "Oh wait, if it's seventy-five percent adoption in North America, that's what we expect. If its seventy-five percent overseas, it's not happening. So (giggles) it's kind of interesting. >> (Rebecca) Right. And that myopia is really a problem because these are the trends that are shaping our future. >> (Stu) Yeah, yeah. >> So today, I'm also going to be talking to the Women In Tech winners. That very exciting. One of the women was talking about how she got her idea. Or really, her idea became more formulated, more crystallized, at the Grace Hopper Conference. We, of course, have a great partnership with the Grace Hopper Conference. So, I'm excited to talk to her more about that today too. >> (Stu) Yeah, good lineup. We have few more partners. Another customer EasiER AG who did the keynote yesterday. Looking forward to digging in. Kind of wrapping up all of this. And Rebecca it's been fun doing it with you this week. >> And I'm with you. And may the force... May the fourth be with you. >> And with you. >> (giggles) Thank you, we'll have more today later. From the Red Hat Summit. Here in Boston, I'm Rebecca Knight for Stu Miniman. (upbeat music)

>> Announcer: Live from Boston, Massachusetts, it's theCUBE, covering Red Hat Summit 2017, brought to you by Red Hat. >> We are wrapping up day two of theCUBE's coverage here at the Red Hat Summit here in Boston, Massachusetts, I'm Rebecca Knight, I'm here with Stu Miniman. Stu, we started off the morning with Jim Whitehurst, CEO of Red Hat saying planning is dead. We work so hard to infer order where there is none, you're an analyst, you're a forecaster, so I'm sorry to tell you this, but it's not, stop trying. >> Yeah, thanks Rebecca, it's been great, yeah. No, it's funny, I've looked at this from the analyst world, read a book recently called Black Swan, by Nassim Taleb, talks about how really trying to predict some of these big game changers is really challenging. That being said, I've been involved in some technologies early, it's like, I remember playing with the internet when the first graphical browsers came out, and being like, this is going to be a game changer! I had no idea where it was going, but there, I happened to be involved really early in the VMware virtualization days. I started talking to Docker really early. I don't say I'm predicting the future, but, here at Red Hat, communities, we asked Jim Whitehurst about, you build on communities, and I feel I've got a pretty strong network, I'm tied in a lot, through social these days, and feel like I can kind of get the, where's the interesting stuff happening, and where is it just maybe a little bit too, you know, the hype doesn't meet the reality, and one of the other things is how long it takes for certain technologies to kind of mature, what it will look like when it comes through, it's easier to bet on the waves as opposed to some of the particular tools out there, we really loved the conversation with Jim Whitehurst, I always feel like I'm doing one of those executive case studies, that you take at a good business school when you get to sit down and talk with them. >> I agree, he's a great conversationalist, a great guy. During his keynote, and even when he sat down with us, he was talking about the management challenge of technology leaders today, and this is reflective of the theme of this year's conference, which is empowering the individual, and he said that the role of the leader today is to create the context for the individual to try and modify and try again and fail. My question for you is, it implies that the individual was unempowered beforehand, is that accurate? And did engineers not have a voice? >> It's, what is the role of the individual worker, do they know where they're going, do we have a shared clear vision, you talk about most companies, they have their mission statement, and you do studies, and 70% to 80% of most companies, most people in companies are like, "I'm disconnected from the work, "I don't understand how what I do "translates to where I'm going," Red Hat is an interesting, different company, about 10,000 people, we've heard from many of the Red Hatters that it doesn't feel and act like that company, go back to, this is the kind of military-style hierarchy that most businesses have, the structure there, Red Hat is a lot flatter, we talk in kind of the devops world about like two pizza groups, well, the Red Hats committee involved in all of these various projects, hundreds of them that they're involved, it's not one or two opensource things, it's all over the place, and you kind of put your business out on like, well, okay, how do you understand how to, you know, which do you drive and which ones create money, and how are you working in the right place, or are people just contributing to stuff that, you hope if I put good stuff out there in good code, eventually, it will translate to our business, but Red Hat keeps delivering, keeps growing their base, they've made certain acquisitions, and they keep moving forward. >> So I want to talk about those acquisitions, because we had some Ansible people on the show here today, it seems as though the acquisition has really gone well, and the two companies are blending, and it's setting itself up for success. Is that your take too? What do you see as potential obstacles down the road? >> Yeah, that's great, Rebecca, we talk to talk with three different angles of the Ansible team today, and 18 months after the acquisition, it's really broadly integrated. I can tell you, I've worked in big companies, I've worked through a number of acquisitions, 18 months from acquisition to oh my gosh, their secret sauce is all over the place, I'm like, that is quite impressive. It's just, they're a software company, they are agile in their development, and they get to move things forward. And I'd heard great things about Ansible before the acquisition, I hear good things from customers that are using it, some of the other companies in the space that are standalone have been facing some challenges, the third interview that we did, I talked a little bit about how cloud providers were starting to build some of those pieces in. Infrastructure companies have known for a long time that management is one of those big challenges, so, management still seems to be one of those jump balls, it feels like that beach ball bouncing around and everybody's trying to get ahold of it, but Red Hat's figuring how to bake Ansible in, make sure it's touching open shifts specifically, all those things like the cloud forms and insights, and all the other pieces, so, building in more automation fits a lot with what they're doing, and how the Linux administrators understand how to do things, they always wanted to get past, oh, great, I have to go create yet another script and another script and another script, that they'll do that, so, seems to be a great acquisition for them, and helping to move them forward in a lot of spaces. >> Another buzzword we heard a lot today, and it's going to be funny that I described this as a buzzword, but it's simple, simplified, this is what we kept hearing again from partners, saying that this is what they're hearing from customers, because they just have so many different application, they've got old infrastructure, new infrastructure, the cloud, they've got hybrid, and they just want things to work together and play nicely. They're coming out with solutions, are they solutions? Are they in fact simpler? What's your take? Are you skeptical that things are in fact getting simpler? >> Yeah, Rebecca, there's a line I used, the simple enterprise is an oxymoron, it does not exist. If you look at any enterprise today, how many applications they'd have, it's like, well, do you have hundreds of applications, or thousands of applications, depending on how old you are, what the size of your company is. Everything in IT is additive, we had somebody on this week who was talking about the AS/400 sitting in the back, we had HP on, I'm sure they've got lots of customers, still running Superdomes, we've covered the mainframe pieces, and oh, well, Red Hat Enterprise, Linux, lives on lots of these environments, so we're going to standardize the software pieces, but there's only pieces of the puzzle that I can simplify, and really building software that can live in many environments, and help me move towards more composable or distributed architectures is the way we need to go, I liked Red Hat stories, where they're taking us, but I think if you talk to most IT staffs, even if they're like, "Oh, yeah, we're doing a lot of public cloud," or, "We've standardized on a couple of piece and things," most people don't think that IT is simple. >> And then there's the cost, too, I think that one of our guests made this point about proprietary software, and how it really is, it has a higher bar, because customers are going to say, "Why can't I just get this on opensource? "Why do I have to pay for this?" And so that's another question too, where are you seeing the financials of this all play out? >> Yeah, it's interesting, we're talking a lot about hybrid cloud, and when we first started talking public cloud, it was like, oh wait, it'll be cheaper. And then it's like, wait, no, it'll help me be more agile, and maybe that will then lead to cost, it was like, the old faster cheaper better, there're certain people in the development culture, that's like, "Well, if I can just do faster, "faster, faster, it will make up for everything else," then again, if I move too fast, sometimes we're breaking things, we're not being able to take advantage of things, so, it goes back, is this that simple? It sure doesn't sound simple, so it's, IT is a complex world, pricing is one of those things that absolutely is getting sorted out, Red Hat has a nice position in the marketplace, when I look at the big companies in the market, you need to take software companies like Microsoft or an Oracle, one of the first things most people think about when you hear those companies is like, oh, their price. Red Hat has brought adoption, and a lot of customers, and do I hear issues here or there on certain product lines, where yes, they'd like it cheaper, or there? Yes, but it's not a general complaint, oh, well, hey, you want to do, let's just use the Fedora version, or the CentOS version rather than the full enterprise version, and they have some sliders to be able to manage with that, starting to hear more, kind of the elastic cloud-like pricing, from Red Hat and some of their partners that solution that these pieces with, so, yeah, pricing isn't simple yet, it's definitely something that we're going to see more and more as we kind of get to that cloud-like model. >> Today, as particularly in the morning keynote, some of the use cases were from the government, we had three, including British Columbia, which we just had on our show, also Singapore, so it sounds as though government is saying, "Wait, what is this opensource? "This can really help us, this can help us engage "our citizens and help make their lives easier, "and also, by the way, make it easier for us to govern," will government sort of always lag behind, or do you think that there is a possibility that government could really lead the way on a lot of these things? >> Well, it's funny, 'cause we've known for a long time that government typically doesn't get a lot of budget, so when they go to do something, first of all, they sometimes can leapfrog a generation or two, because they've waited, they've waited, they've waited, and I can't necessarily upgrade it, so I might need to skip a generation, secondly, government has, if we talk about things like IoT, and all of those data points out there, the data has gravity, data's the new oil, government has a lot of data, you just interviewed British Columbia, I'm sure there's the opportunity there that as data can be leveraged and turned into more value, working with entrepreneurs, working with communities, government now sits in a place where, if they can be a little bit more open, and they can take advantage of the new opportunity, they can actually be on the vanguard of some of these new technologies, anything you got from your interviews? >> Yes, no, absolutely, I think that one of the things that really struck me was the recruiting and retention piece, because that seems to be one of the hardest things. If you're a hot coder, or an engineer who's graduating from one of the best schools, it's going to take a lot to get you to go work for the government, it just will. >> Rebecca, when I was in college, I did an internship for a municipal government, I digitized all their land management, did a whole database creation, and did one of those things, the old process took two months, and when I was done with it, it could be anywhere from two minutes to maybe a little bit longer, but boy, that was a painful summer to work through some of the processes, their infrastructure was all antiquated, great people, but government moved at a slower speed than I'm used to. >> And that is what I got out of my interview, so they are using the same kind of tools that these coders and developers would be using in the private sector, they're also doing smaller engagements, so you're not signing your life away to the government, you're able to work on a stint here, a stint there, you can do it in your free time and then get paid on PayPal, so I think that that is one way to attract good talent. Stu, we got one more day of this, what do you hope to see tomorrow, what are you going to be looking for, what do you want to be talking about tomorrow at this time? >> Well, what we always get here is a lot of really good customers, I love the innovation stories, right past the hallway here, there's all of these pictures, and Red Hat's a great partner for us on theCUBE, they've brought us many of those customers, we're going to have more of them on, another two keynotes, full day of coverage, so we'll see how many people make it to the morning keynote after going to Fenway tonight, 4,000 people, pretty impressive, I think we'll see, it's not like we'll see more red in the audience than usual, at a game at Fenway, but yeah, you're rooting for the home team, I'm a transplant here, go Pats, you know? >> Mm, okay, alright, so it's the argument, I think, that they were hoping for. So I want to thank you so much, it's been great doing this with you, and I hope you will join us tomorrow for day three of the Red Hat Summit in Boston, Massachusetts, I'm Rebecca Knight for Stu Miniman, thank you, and see you tomorrow! (electronic jingle)

>> Red Hat OpenShift Container Platform >> Announcer: Live from Boston, Massachusetts, it's theCube Covering Red Hat Summit 2017. Brought to you by Red Hat. >> Welcome back to theCube's coverage, I'm Rebecca Knight your host, here with Stu Miniman. Our guest now is Andrius Benokraitis, he is the Principle Product Manager at Ansible Red Hat Network Automation, thanks so much Andrius. >> Thanks for having me I appreciate it. >> This is your first time on the program. >> Andrius: First time. >> We're nice, >> Really nervous, so, okay. we don't bite. >> Start a little bit with your new to the company relatively >> Andrius: Relatively. >> networking guy by background, can you give us a little bit about your background. >> Sure, I mean, I actually started at Red Hat in 2003. And then did about four five jobs there for about 11 years. And then jumped, went to a startup named Cumulus Networks for about two years. Great crew, and then, now I'm at Ansible, been there since about December, so working on the Network Automation Use Case for Ansible. >> Alright, so networking, has a little bit of coverage here, I remember, you know, something like the Open Daylight stuff and I have, actually there are a couple of Red Hatters that I interviewed at one show ended up forming a company that got bought by Dockers, so you know, there's definitely networking people, but maybe give us a broad view of where networking fits into this stuff that you're working on specifically. >> Yeah, sure thing. I think it's interesting to point out that as everything started in the compute side, and everything started to get disaggregated, the networking side has come along for the ride per se. It's been a little bit behind. When we talk about networking a lot of people just think automatically that's the end. And we're actually trying to think a little bit lower level, so layer one, layer two, layer three, so switching, routing, firewalls, load balancers, all those things are still required in the data center. And when people started using Ansible, it started five years ago on the compute side, a lot of the people started saying, I need to run the whole rec, and I'm not a CCIE, and I don't really know what to do there but I've been thrown in to do something, I'm a cloud admin, the new title right. I have to run the network, so what do I do. I don't know anything about networking, I'm just trying to be good enough, well, I know Ansible, so why don't I just treat switches like servers, and just treat them like, like what I know, they just have a lot more interfaces, but they just treat it that way. So a lot of the expertise came from the ground up with the opensource model and said this is the new use case. >> Well, Jay Rivers, the founder of Cumulus, it's like networking will just be a Linux operating model, you know, extended to the network, which is always like, hey, sounds like a company like Red Hat should be doing that kind of stuff. >> Exactly, it's interesting to see a Bash prompt in the networking right, it's familiar to a lot of people, in the devop space, absolutely. >> So it's a very rapidly changing time, as we know, in this digital computing age, the theme of this conference is the power of the individual, celebrating that individual, the developer, empowering the developers to take risks, be able to fail, make changes, modify. You're not a developer, but you manage developers, you lead developers, how do you work on creating that context, that Jim Whitehurst talked about today. >> I think it starts with, the true empowerment, you have the majority of the networking platforms are still proprietary and walled off, walled off gardens, they're black boxes you can't really do much with them, but you still have the ability to SSH into them, you have familiar terms and concepts from the server side in the networking side. So as long as you have SSH in the box and you know your CLI commands to make changes, you can utilize that in part of Ansible to generate larger abstractions to use the play books in order to build out your data center, with the terms and the Lexicon of YAML, the language of Ansible, things that you already know and utilizing that and going further. >> Can you speak to us a little bit about customers, you know, what's holding them back, how are you guys moving them forward to the more agile development space? >> Our customers are mostly brownfield, they're trying to extend what they already have. They have all their gear, they have everything they have that they need but they're trying to do things better. >> I don't find greenfield customers when it comes to the network side of the house, I mean we've all got what I have and we knew that IT's always additive, so, I mean that's got to be a challenge. >> It's a huge challenge. >> Something you can help with right? >> It's a huge challenge, and I think from the network operators and network engineers, a lot of them are saying, again, they're looking at their friends on the compute side, and they can spin up VMs and provision hardware instantaneously, but why does it have to take four to six weeks to provision a VLAN or get a VLAN added to a network switch? That sounds ridiculous, so a lot of the network engineers and operators are saying, well I think I can be as agile as you, so we can actually work together, using a common framework, common language with Ansible, and we can get things done, and we can get all of this stuff I hate doing, and we don't have to do that anymore, we can worry about more important things in our network, like designing the next big thing, if you want to do BGP, design your BGP infrastructure, you want to move from a layer two to a layer three or an SDN solution. >> I love that you talk about everybody, kind of the software wave and breaking down silos, network and storage people are like, oh my God, you're taking my job away. >> Exactly, completely, no, we're not taking your job. We are augmenting what you already have. We're giving you more tools in your tool belt to do better at your job, and that's truly it, we don't have to, people can be smarter so, if you want to add a VLAN, that can be a code snippet created by the sys admin, it can be in Git, and then the network engineer can say, oh yeah, that looks good, and then I just say, submit. What we see today with some of the customers is, yeah, I want to automate, I really want to automate, and you say, great, let's automate. But then you start getting, you peel back the onion, and you start seeing that, well, how are you managing your inventory, how are you managing your endpoints. And they're like, I have a spreadsheet? And you're like, as a networking guy I guess you, (excited clamoring) >> Networking is scary for a lot, >> It's super scary, yeah. >> So how, do you break that down? >> You do what you can, you do it in small pieces, we're not trying to change the world, we're not trying to say, you're going to go 100% devops in the network. Start small, start with something, like again, you really hate doing, if you want to change, something really low risk, things you really hate doing, just start small, low risk things. And then you can propagate that, and as you start getting confidence, and you start getting the knowledge, and the teams, and every one starts, everyone has to be bought in by the way. This is not something you just go in and say, go do it. You have to have everyone on board, the entire organization, it can't be bottom up, it can't be top down, everyone has to be on board. >> And Andrius, when I talk to people in the networking space, risk is the number one thing they're worried about. They buy on risk, they build on risk, and the problem we have with the networks, they're too many things that are manual. So if I'm typing in some you know, 16 digit hexadecimal code >> From notepad, manually you're copying and pasting >> from like a spreadsheet. Copying and pasting, or gosh, so things like that, the room for error is too high. So there's the things that we need to be able to automate, so that we don't have somebody that's tired or just, wait, was that a one or an L or an I. I don't know, so we understand that it actually should be able to reduce risk, increase security, all the things that the business is telling you. >> All these network vendors have virtual instances. You can do all your testing and deployment, all your testing and your infrastructure, and you can do everything in Jenkins and have all your networking switches, virtually, you can have your whole data center in a virtual environment if you want. So if you talk about lower risk, instead of just copying and pasting, and oh was that a slash 24 or a slash 16, oops, I mean that looked right, but it was wrong, but did it go through test, it probably didn't. And then someone's going to get paged at three in the morning, and a router's down, an edge router's down and your toast. So enabling the full devops cycle of continuous integration. So bringing in the same concepts that you have on the compute side, testing, changes, in a full cycle, and then doing that. >> You talked about the importance of buy in and also the difficulties of getting buy in. How much of that is an impediment to the innovation process, but one of the things we've been talking about, is can big companies innovate? What are the challenges that you see, and how do you overcome them? >> That is the number one, that is the biggest issue right now in the network space, is getting buy in. Whether it's someone who has done it on their own, someone can just install Ansible and do something, and then deploy a switch, but if they leave the company and there's no remediation, if it's not in the MOP, if it's not in the Method of Procedure, no one knows about it. So it has to be part of your, you want to keep all the things you have, all the good things you have today with your checks and balances in the networking, and the CIOs and the people at the top have to understand, you can keep all that stuff, but you have to buy in to the automation framework, and everyone has to be onboard to understand how it fits in in order to go from where you are today to where you want to be. >> At the show here what's exciting your customers? You know, give us a little bit of a viewpoint for people that are checking out your stuff, what to expect. >> Well I think the one thing is they're not used to seeing, they think it's black magic, they think it's just magic. They're like, I can use the same things for everything? I say, yeah, you can. The development processes, the innovation in the community, you know for example, if you want to assist, go ACI Module, it's in GitHub, it's in Cisco's GitHub, you can just go ahead and do that. Now we're trying, starting to migrate those things into core. So the more that we get innovation in the community, and that we have the vendors and the partners driving it, and you're seeing that today, you know, we have F5 here we have Cisco, we have Juniper we have Avi, all those people, you know, they have certified platforms with Ansible, Ansible Core, which is going to be integrated with Ansible Tower, we have full buy in from them. They want to meet with us and say how can we do better. How can we innovate with you to drive the nexgen data centers with our products. >> You talked about yourself as a boomerang employee, what is the value in that, and are you seeing a lot of colleagues who are bouncing around and then coming back from ... >> Absolutely, I think pre acquisition Ansible, the vast majority of the people, I believe were ex-Red Hatters that went to Ansible. So what's really nice to come back home and understand the people that left, that came back to understand already what the, >> And people feel that way, it's a coming home? >> Yeah, it's a coming home, it really is. They understand, you know, they came back, they understood the values of opensource and the culture, again, I started Red Hat in 2003, I see the great things, I see new people getting hired and I see the same things I saw back then, 2003, 2004, with all the great things that people are doing, and the culture. You know, Jim's done a great job at keeping the culture how it is, even way back then when there was only 400 people when I started. >> Andrius, extend that culture, I think about the network community and opensource and you know, you talk about, there's risk there, and you know, you think about, I grew up with kind of enterprise, infrastructure mentality, it's like, don't touch it, don't play with it. We always joked, I got every thing there, really don't walk by it and definitely, you know, some zip tie or duct tape's going to come apart. Are we getting better, is networking embracing this? >> Yes, for sure. I think the nice thing is you start seeing these communities pop up. You're starting to see network operators and engineers, they've been historically, if they don't know the answer, they won't go find it. They kind of may be shy, shy to ask for help, per se. >> If it wasn't on their certification, >> Exactly. >> They weren't going to do it. >> If it wasn't there I'm not going to go, we're bringing them into, so we have, whether there's slack instance, there are networking communities, networking automation, communities, just for network automation. And there's one, there's an Ansible channel, on the network decode, select channel, has almost 800 people on it. So they're coming and now they have a place, they have a safe place to ask questions. They don't have to kind of guess or say, you know what, I'm not going to do that. And know they have a safe place for network engineers, for network engineers to get into the net devop space. >> Another one of the sort of sub themes of this summit is people's data strategy, and customers and vendors, how they're dealing with the massive amounts of data that they're customers are generating. What is your data strategy, and how are you using data? >> So there's two aspects here. So the data can be the actual playbooks themselves, the actual, the golden master images, so you can pull configs from switches, and you can store them and you can use them for continuous compliance. You can say, you know, a rogue engineer might make a change, you know, configuration drift happens. But you need to be able to make those comparisons to the other versions. So we're utilizing things like Git, so you're data strategy can be in the cloud, it can be similar on your side, you can do Stash locally. For part of the operations piece, you can use that. A second piece is, log aggregation is a big piece of the Ansible. So when you actually want to make sure that a change happens, that it's been successful, and that you want to ensure continuous compliance, all that data has to go somewhere, right? So you can utilize Ansible Tower as an aggregator, you can go off using the integrations like Splunk and some other log aggregation connectors with Ansible Tower to help utilize your data strategy with the partners that are really the driving, the people that know data and data structures, so we can use them. >> And one of the other issues is the building the confidence to make decisions with all the data, are you working on that too with your team? >> Yes, we are working with that, and that's part of the larger tower organization, so it goes beyond networking. So, whatever networking gets, everyone else gets. When we started developing Ansible Core and the community and Ansible Tower in-house, we think about networking and we think about Windows, that's a huge opportunity there, you know, we're talking about AWS in the cloud. So cloud instances, these are all endpoints that Ansible can manage, and it's not just networking, so we have to make sure that all of the pieces, all of the endpoints can be managed directly. Everyone benefits from that. >> Andrius thank you so much for your time we appreciate it. >> Thanks again for having me. >> I'm Rebecca Knight for Stu Miniman, thank you very much for joining us. We'll be back after this.