(upbeat music) >> Welcome back to Supercloud two where we're gathering a number of industry luminaries to discuss the future of cloud services. And we'll be focusing on various real world practitioners today, their challenges, their opportunities with an emphasis on data, self-service infrastructure and how organizations are evolving their data and cloud strategies to prepare for that next era of digital innovation. And we really believe that support for multiple cloud estates is a first step of any Supercloud. And in that regard Oracle surprise some folks with its Azure collaboration the Oracle database and exit database services. And to discuss the challenges of developing a mission critical Supercloud we welcome Juan Loaiza, who's the executive vice president of Mission Critical Database Technologies at Oracle. Juan, you're many time CUBE alums so welcome back to the show. Great to see you. >> Great to see you, and happy to be here with you. >> Yeah, thank you. So a lot of people felt that Oracle was resistant to multicloud strategies and preferred to really have everything run just on the Oracle cloud infrastructure, OCI and maybe that was a misperception maybe you guys were misunderstood or maybe you had to change your heart. Take us through the decision to support multiple cloud platforms >> Now we've supported multiple cloud platforms for many years, so I think that was probably a misperception. Oracle database, we partnered up with Amazon very early on in their cloud when they had kind of the the first cloud out there. And we had Oracle database running on their cloud. We have backup, we have a lot of stuff running. So, yeah, part of the philosophy of Oracle has always been we partner with every platform. We're very open we started with SQL and APIs. As we develop new technologies we push them into the SQL standard. So that's always been part of the ecosystem at Oracle. That's how we think we get an advantage by being more open. I think if we try to create this isolated little world it actually hurts us and hurts customers. So for us it's a win-win to be open across the clouds. >> So Supercloud is this concept that we put forth to describe a platform or some people think it's an architecture if you have an opinion, and I'd love to hear it but it provides a programmatically consistent set of services that hosted on heterogeneous cloud providers. And so we look at the Oracle database service for Azure as fitting within this definition. In your view, is this accurate? >> Yeah, I would broaden it. I'd see a little bit more than that. We just think that services should be available from everywhere, right? So, I mean, it's a little bit like if you go back to the pre-internet world, there was things like AOL and CompuServe and those were kind of islands. And if you were on AOL, you really didn't have access to anything on CompuServe and vice versa. And the cloud world has evolved a little bit like that. And we just think that's the wrong model. They shouldn't these clouds are part of the world and they need to be interconnected like all the rest of the world. It's been a long time with telephones internet, everything, everything's interconnected. Everything should work seamlessly together. So that's how we believe if you're running in one cloud and you're running let's say an application, one cloud you want to use a service from another cloud should be completely simple to do that. It shouldn't be, I can only use what's in AOL or CompuServe or whatever else. It should not be isolated. >> Well, we got a long way to go before that Nirvana exists but one example is the Oracle database service with Azure. So what exactly does that service provide? I'm interested in how consistent the service experience is across clouds. Did you create a purpose-built PaaS layer to achieve this common experience? Or is it off the shelf Terraform? Is there unique value in the PaaS layer? Let's dig into some of those questions. I know I just threw six at you. >> Yeah, I mean, so what this is, is what we're trying to do is very simple. Which is, for example, starting with the Oracle database we want to make that seamless to use from anywhere you're running. Whether it's on-prem, on some other cloud, anywhere else you should be able to seamlessly use the Oracle database and it should look like the internet. There's no friction. There's not a lot of hoops you got to jump just because you're trying to use a database that isn't local to you. So it's pretty straightforward. And in terms of things like Azure, it's not easy to do because all these clouds have a lot of kind of very unique technologies. So what we've done is at Oracle is we've said, "Okay we're going to make Oracle database look exactly like if it was running on Azure." That means we'll use the Azure security systems, the identity management systems, the networking, there's things like monitoring and management. So we'll push all these technologies. For example, when we have monitoring event or we have alerts we'll push those into the Azure console. So as a user, it looks to you exactly as if that Oracle database was running inside Azure. Also, the networking is a big challenge across these clouds. So we've basically made that whole thing seamless. So we create the super high bandwidth network between Azure and Oracle. We make sure that's extremely low latency, under two milliseconds round trip. It's all within the local metro region. So it's very fast, very high bandwidth, very low latency. And we take care establishing the links and making sure that it's secure and all that kind of stuff. So at a high level, it looks to you like the database is--even the look and feel of the screens. It's the Azure colors, it's the Azure buttons it's the Azure layout of the screens so it looks like you're running there and we take care of all the technical details underlying that which there's a lot which has taken a lot of work to make it work seamlessly. >> In the magic of that abstraction. Juan, does it happen at the PaaS layer? Could you take us inside that a little bit? Is there intelligence in there that helps you deal with latency or are there any kind of purpose-built functions for this service? >> You could think of it as... I mean it happens at a lot of different layers. It happens at the identity management layer, it happens at the networking layer, it happens at the database layer, it happens at the monitoring layer, at the management layer. So all those things have been integrated. So it's not one thing that you just go and do. You have to integrate all these different services together. You can access files in Azure from the Oracle database. Again, that's completely seamless. You, it's just like if it was local to our cloud you get your Azure files in your kind of S3 equivalent. So yeah, the, it's not one thing. There's a whole lot of pieces to the ecosystem. And what we've done is we've worked on each piece separately to make sure that it's completely seamless and transparent so you don't have to think about it, it just works. >> So you kind of answered my next question which is one of the technical hurdles. It sounds like the technical hurdles are that integration across the entire stack. That's the sort of architecture that you've built. What was the catalyst for this service? >> Yeah, the catalyst is just fulfilling our vision of an open cloud world. It's really like I said, Oracle, from the very beginning has been believed in open standards. Customers should be able to have choice customers should be able to use whatever they want from wherever they want. And we saw that, you know in the new world of cloud that had broken down everybody had their own authentication system management system, monitoring system networking system, configuration system. And it became very difficult. There was a lot of friction to using services across cloud. So we said, "Well, okay we can fix that." It's work, it's significant amount of work but we know how to do it and let's just go do it and make it easy for customers. >> So given Oracle is really your main focus is on mission critical workloads. You talked about this low latency network, I mean but you still have physical distances, so how are you managing that latency? What's the experience been for customers across Azure and OCI? >> Yeah, so it, it's a good point. I mean, latency can be an issue. So the good thing about clouds is we have a lot of cloud data centers. We have dozens and dozens of cloud data centers around the world. And Azure has dozens and dozens of cloud data centers. And in most cases, they're in the same metro region because there's kind of natural metro regions within each country that you want to put your cloud data centers in. So most of our data centers are actually very close to the Azure data centers. There's the kind of northern Virginia, there's London, there's Tokyo I mean, there's natural places where everybody puts their data centers Seoul et cetera. And so that's the real key. So that allows us to put a very high bandwidth and low latency network. The real problems with latency come when you're trying to go along physical distance. If you're trying to connect, you know across the Pacific or you know across the country or something like that, then you can get in trouble with latency within the same metro region. It's extremely fast. It tends to be around one, you know the highest two millisecond that's roundtrip through all the routers and connections and gateways and everything else. With everything taken into consideration, what we guarantee is it's always less than two millisecond which is a very low latency time. So that tends to not be a problem because it's extremely low latency. >> I was going to ask you less than two milliseconds. So, earlier in the program we had Jack Greenfield who runs architecture for Walmart, and he was explaining what we call their Supercloud, and it's runs across Azure, GCP, and they're on-prem. They have this thing called the triplet model. So my question to you is, are you in situations where you guaranteeing that less than two milliseconds do you have situations where you're bringing, you know Exadata Cloud, a customer on-prem to achieve that? Or is this just across clouds? >> Yeah, in this case, we're talking public cloud data center to public cloud data center. >> Oh okay. >> So add your public cloud data center to Oracle Public Cloud data center. They're in the same metro region. We set up the connections, we do all the technology to make it seamless. And from a customer point of view they don't really see the network. Also, remember that SQL is actually designed to have very low bandwidth and latency requirements. So it is a language. So you don't go to the database and say do this one little thing for me. You send it a SQL statement that can actually access lots of data while in the database. So the real latency requirement of a SQL database is within the database. So I need to access all that data fast. So I need very fast access to storage very fast access across node. That's what exit data gives you. But you send one request and that request can do a huge amount of work and then return one answer. And that's kind of the design point of SQL. So SQL is inherently low bandwidth requirements, it was used back in the eighties when we used to have 10 megabit networks and the the biggest companies in the world ran back then. So right now we're talking over hundred hundreds of gigabits. So it's really not much of a challenge. When you're designed to run on 10 megabit to say, okay I'm going to give you 10,000 times what you were designed for it's really, it's a pretty low hurdle jump. >> What about the deployment models? How do you handle this? Is it a single global instance across clouds or do you sort of instantiate in each you got exudate in Azure and exudates in OCI? What's the deployment model look like? >> It's pretty straightforward. So customer decides where they want to run their application and database. So there's natural places where people go. If you're in Tokyo, you're going to choose the local Tokyo data centers for both, you know Microsoft and Oracle. If you're in London, you're going to do that. If you're in California you're going to choose maybe San Jose, something like that. So a customer just chooses. We both have data centers in that metro region. So they create their service on Azure and then they go to our console which looks just like an Azure console and say all right create me a database. And then we choose the closest Oracle data center which is generally a few miles away, and then it it all gets created. So from a customer point of view, it's very straightforward. >> I'm always in awe about how simple you make things sound. All right what about security? You talked a little bit before about identity access how you sort of abstracting the Azure capabilities away so that you've simplified it for your customers but are there any other specific security things that you need to do? How much did you have to abstract the underlying primitives of Azure or OCI to present that common experience to customers? >> Yeah, so there's really two big things. One is the identity management. Like my name is X on Azure and I have this set of privileges. Oracle has its own identity management system, right? So what we didn't want is that you have to kind of like bridge these things yourself. It's a giant pain to do that. So we actually what we call federate across these identity managements. So you put your credentials into Azure and then they automatically get to use the exact same credentials and identity in the Oracle cloud. So again, you don't have to think about it, it just works. And then the second part is that the whole bridging the network. So within a cloud you generally have virtual network that's private to your company. And so at Oracle, we bridge the private network that you created in, for example, Azure to the private network that we create for you in Oracle. So it is still a private network without you having to do a whole bunch of work. So it's just like if you were in your own data center other people can't get into your network. So it's secured at the network level, it's secured at the identity management, and encryption level. And again we did a lot of work to make that seamless for customers and they don't have to worry about it because we did the work. That's really as simple as it gets. >> That's what's Supercloud's supposed to be all about. Alright, we were talking earlier about sort of the misperception around multicloud, your view of Open I think, which is you run the Oracle database, wherever the customer wants to run it. So you got this database service across OCI and Azure customers today, they run Oracle database in AWS. You got heat wave, MySQL, heat wave that you announced on AWS, Google touts a bare metal offering where you can run Oracle on GCP. Do you see a day when you extend an OCI Azure like situation across multiple clouds? Would that bring benefits to customers or will the world of database generally remain largely fenced with maybe a few exceptions like what you're doing with OCI and Azure? I'm particularly interested in your thoughts on egress fees as maybe one of the reasons that there is a barrier to this happening and why maybe these stove pipes, exist today and in the future. What are your thoughts on that? >> Yeah, we're very open to working with everyone else out there. Like I said, we've always been, big believers in customers should have choice and you should be able to run wherever you want. So that's been kind of a founding principle of Oracle. We have the Azure, we did a partnership with them, we're open to doing other partnerships and you're going to see other things coming down the pipe on the topic of egress. Yeah, the large egress fees, it's pretty obvious what goes on with that. Various vendors like to have large egress fees because they want to keep things kind of locked into their cloud. So it's not a very customer friendly thing to do. And I think everybody recognizes that it's really trying to kind of course or put a lot of friction on moving data out of a particular cloud. And that's not what we do. We have very, very low egress fees. So we don't really do that and we don't think anybody else should do that. But I think customers at the end of the day, will win that battle. They're going to have to go back to their vendor and say, well I have choice in clouds and if you're going to impose these limits on me, maybe I'll make a different choice. So that's ultimately how these things get resolved. >> So do you think other cloud providers are going to take a page out of what you're doing with Azure and provide similar solutions? >> Yeah, well I think customers want, I mean, I've talked to a lot of customers, this is what they want, right? I mean, there's really no doubt no customer wants to be locked into a single ecosystem. There's nobody out there that wants that. And as the competition, when they start seeing an open ecosystem evolving they're going to be like, okay, I'd rather go there than the closed ecosystem, and that's going to put pressure on the closed ecosystems. So that's the nature of competition. That's what ultimately will tip the balance on these things. >> So Juan, even though you have this capability of distributing a workload across multiple clouds as in our Supercloud premise it's still something that's relatively new. It's a big decision that maybe many people might consider somewhat of a risk. So I'm curious who's driving the decisions for your initial customers? What do they want to get out of it? What's the decision point there? >> Yeah, I mean, this is generally driven by customers that want a specific technology in a cloud. I think the risk, I haven't seen a lot of people worry too much about the risk. Everybody involved in this is a very well known, very reputable firm. I mean, Oracle's been around for 40 years. We run most of the world's largest companies. I think customers understand we're not going to build a solution that's going to put their technology and their business at risk. And the same thing with Azure and others. So I don't see customers too worried about this is a risky move because it's really not. And you know, everybody understands networking at the end the day networking works. I mean, how does the internet work? It's a known quantity. It's not like it's some brand new invention. What we're really doing is breaking down the barriers to interconnecting things. Automating 'em, making 'em easy. So there's not a whole lot of risk here for customers. And like I said, every single customer in the world loves an open ecosystem. It's just not a question. If you go to a customer would you rather put your technology or your business to run on a closed ecosystem or an open system? It's kind of not even worth asking a question. It's a no-brainer. >> All right, so we got to go. My last question. What do you think of the term "Supercloud"? You think it'll stick? >> We'll see. There's a lot of terms out there and it's always fun to see which terms stick. It's a cool term. I like it, but the decision makers are actually the public, what sticks and what doesn't. It's very hard to predict. >> Yeah well, it's been a lot of fun having you on, Juan. Really appreciate your time and always good to see you. >> All right, Dave, thanks a lot. It's always fun to talk to you. >> You bet. All right, keep it right there. More Supercloud two content from theCUBE Community Dave Vellante for John Furrier. We'll be right back. (upbeat music)

>> Announcer: "theCUBE" presents HPE Discover 2022. Brought to you by HPE. >> Welcome back to HPE Discover 2022. You're watching "theCUBE's" coverage. This is Day 2, Dave Vellante with John Furrier. Sheila Rohra is here. She's the Senior Vice President and GM of the Data Infrastructure Business at Hewlett Packard Enterprise, and of course, the storage division. And Omer Asad. Welcome back to "theCUBE", Omer. Senior Vice President and General Manager for Cloud Data Services, Hewlett Packard Enterprise storage. Guys, thanks for coming on. Good to see you. >> Thank you. Always a pleasure, man. >> Thank you. >> So Sheila, I'll start with you. Explain the difference. The Data Infrastructure Business and then Omer's Cloud Data Services. You first. >> Okay. So Data Infrastructure Business. So I'm responsible for the primary secondary storage. Basically, what you physically store, the data in a box, I actually own that. So I'm going to have Omer explain his business because he can explain it better than me. (laughing) Go ahead. >> So 100% right. So first, data infrastructure platforms, primary secondary storage. And then what I do from a cloud perspective is wrap up those things into offerings, block storage offerings, data protection offerings, and then put them on top of the GreenLake platform, which is the platform that Antonio and Fidelma talked about on main Keynote stage yesterday. That includes multi-tenancy, customer subscription management, sign on management, and then on top of that we build services. Services are cloud-like services, storage services or block service, data protection service, disaster recovery services. Those services are then launched on top of the platform. Some services like data protection services are software only. Some services are software plus hardware. And the hardware on the platform comes along from the primary storage business and we run the control plane for that block service on the GreenLake platform and that's the cloud service. >> So, I just want to clarify. So what we maybe used to know as 3PAR and Nimble and StoreOnce. Those are the products that you're responsible for? >> That is the primary storage part, right? And just to kind of show that, he and I, we do indeed work together. Right. So if you think about the 3PAR, the primary... Sorry, the Primera, the Alletras, the Nimble, right? All that, right? That's the technology that, you know, my team builds. And what Omer does with his magic is that he turns it into HPE GreenLake for storage, right? And to deliver as a service, right? And basically to create a self-service agility for the customer and also to get a very Cloud operational experience for them. >> So if I'm a customer, just so I get this right, if I'm a customer and I want Hybrid, that's what you're delivering as a Cloud service? >> Yes. >> And I don't care where the data is on-premises, in storage, or on Cloud. >> 100%. >> Is that right? >> So the way that would work is, as a customer, you would come along with the partner, because we're 100% partner-led. You'll come to the GreenLake Console. On the GreenLake Console, you will pick one of our services. Could be a data protection service, could be the block storage service. All services are hybrid in nature. Public Cloud is 100% participant in the ecosystem. You'll choose a service. Once you choose a service, you like the rate card for that service. That rate card is just like a hyperscaler rate card. IOPS, Commitment, MINCOMMIT's, whatever. Once you procure that at the price that you like with a partner, you buy the subscription. Then you go to console.greenLake.com, activate your subscription. Once the subscription is activated, if it's a service like block storage, which we talked about yesterday, service will be activated, and our supply chain will send you our platform gear, and that will get activated in your site. Two things, network cable, power cable, dial into the cloud, service gets activated, and you have a cloud control plane. The key difference to remember is that it is cloud-consumption model and cloud-operation model built in together. It is not your traditional as a service, which is just like hardware leasing. >> Yeah, yeah, yeah. >> That's a thing of the past. >> But this answers a question that I had, is how do you transfer or transform from a company that is, you know, selling boxes, of course, most of you are engineers are software engineers, I get that, to one that is selling services. And it sounds like the answer is you've organized, I know it's inside baseball here, but you organize so that you still have, you can build best of breed products and then you can package them into services. >> Omer: 100%. 100%. >> It's separate but complementary organization. >> So the simplest way to look at it would be, we have a platform side at the house that builds the persistence layers, the innovation, the file systems, the speeds and feeds, and then building on top of that, really, really resilient storage services. Then how the customer consumes those storage services, we've got tremendous feedback from our customers, is that the cloud-operational model has won. It's just a very, very simple way to operate it, right? So from a customer's perspective, we have completely abstracted away out hardware, which is in the back. It could be at their own data center, it could be at an MSP, or they could be using a public cloud region. But from an operational perspective, the customer gets a single pane of glass through our service console, whether they're operating stuff on-prem, or they're operating stuff in the public cloud. >> So they get storage no matter what? They want it in the cloud, they got it that way, and if they want it as a service, it just gets shipped. >> 100%. >> They plug it in and it auto configures. >> Omer: It's ready to go. >> That's right. And the key thing is simplicity. We want to take the headache away from our customers, we want our customers to focus on their business outcomes, and their projects, and we're simplifying it through analytics and through this unified cloud platform, right? On like how their data is managed, how they're stored, how they're secured, that's all taken care of in this operational model. >> Okay, so I have a question. So just now the edge, like take me through this. Say I'm a customer, okay I got the data saved on-premise action, cloud, love that. Great, sir. That's a value proposition. Come to HPE because we provide this easily. Yeah. But now at the edge, I want to deploy it out to some edge node. Could be a tower with Telecom, 5G or whatever, I want to box this out there, I want storage. What happens there? Just ship it out there and connects up? Does it work the same way? >> 100%. So from our infrastructure team, you'll consume one or two platforms. You'll consume either the Hyperconverged form factor, SimpliVity, or you might convert, the Converged form factor, which is proliant servers powered by Alletras. Alletra 6Ks. Either of those... But it's very different the way you would procure it. What you would procure from us is an edge service. That edge service will come configured with certain amount of compute, certain amount of storage, and a certain amount of data protection. Once you buy that on a dollars per gig per month basis, whichever rate card you prefer, storage rate card or a VMware rate card, that's all you buy. From that point on, the platform team automatically configures the back-end hardware from that attribute-based ordering and that is shipped out to your edge. Dial in the network cable, dial in the power cable, GreenLake cloud discovers it, and then you start running the- >> Self-service, configure it, it just shows up, plug it in, done. >> Omer: Self-service but partner-led. >> Yeah. >> Because we have preferred pricing for our partners. Our partners would come in, they will configure the subscriptions, and then we activate those customers, and then send out the hardware. So it's like a hyperscaler on-prem at-scale kind of a model. >> Yeah, I like it a lot. >> So you guys are in the data business. You run the data portion of Hewlett Packard Enterprise. I used to call it storage, even if we still call it storage but really, it's evolving into data. So what's your vision for the data business and your customer's data vision, if you will? How are you supporting that? >> Well, I want to kick it off, and then I'm going to have my friend, Omer, chime in. But the key thing is that what the first step is is that we have to create a unified platform, and in this case we're creating a unified cloud platform, right? Where there's a single pane of glass to manage all that data, right? And also leveraging lots of analytics and telemetry data that actually comes from our infosite, right? We use all that, we make it easy for the customer, and all they have to say, and they're basically given the answers to the test. "Hey, you know, you may want to increase your capacity. You may want to tweak your performance here." And all the customers are like, "Yes. No. Yes, no." Basically it, right? Accept and not accept, right? That's actually the easiest way. And again, as I said earlier, this frees up the bandwidth for the IT teams so then they actually focus more on the business side of the house, rather than figuring out how to actually manage every single step of the way of the data. >> Got it. >> So it's exactly what Sheila described, right? The way this strategy manifests itself across an operational roadmap for us is the ability to change from a storage vendor to a data services vendor, right? >> Sheila: Right. >> And then once we start monetizing these data services to our customers through the GreenLake platform, which gives us cloud consumption model and a cloud operational model, and then certain data services come with the platform layer, certain data services are software only. But all the services, all the data services that we provide are hybrid in nature, where we say, when you provision storage, you could provision it on-prem, or you can provision it in a hyperscaler environment. The challenge that most of our customers have come back and told us, is like, data center control planes are getting fragmented. On-premises, I mean there's no secrecy about it, right? VMware is the predominant hypervisor, and as a result of that, vCenter is the predominant configuration layer. Then there is the public cloud side, which is through either Ajour, or GCP, or AWS, being one of the largest ones out there. But when the customer is dealing with data assets, the persistence layer could be anywhere, it could be in AWS region, it could be your own data center, or it could be your MSP. But what this does is it creates an immense amount of fragmentation in the context in which the customers understand the data. Essentially, John, the customers are just trying to answer three questions: What is it that I store? How much of it do I store? Should I even be storing it in the first place? And surprisingly, those three questions just haven't been answered. And we've gotten more and more fragmented. So what we are trying to produce for our customers, is a context to ware data view, which allows the customer to understand structured and unstructured data, and the lineage of how it is stored in the organization. And essentially, the vision is around simplification and context to ware data management. One of the key things that makes that possible, is again, the age old infosite capability that we have continued to hone and develop over time, which is now up to the stage of like 12 trillion data points that are coming into the system that are not corroborated to give that back. >> And of course cost-optimizing it as well. We're up against the clock, but take us through the announcements, what's new from when we sort of last talked? I guess it was in September. >> Omer: Right. >> Right. What's new that's being announced here and, or, you know, GA? >> Right. So three major announcements that came out, because to keep on establishing the context when we were with you last time. So last time we announced GreenLake backup and recovery service. >> John: Right. >> That was VMware backup and recovery as a complete cloud, sort of SaaS control plane. No backup target management, no BDS server management, no catalog management, it's completely a SaaS service. Provide your vCenter address, boom, off you go. We do the backups, agentless, 100% dedup enabled. We have extended that into the public cloud domain. So now, we can back up AWS, EC2, and EBS instances within the same constructs. So a single catalog, single backup policy, single protection framework that protects you both in the cloud and on-prem, no fragmentation, no multiple solutions to deploy. And the second one is we've extended our Hyperconverged service to now be what we call the Hybrid Cloud On-Demand. So basically, you go to GreenLake Console control plane, and from there, you basically just start configuring virtual machines. It supports VMware and AWS at the same time. So you can provision a virtual machine on-prem, or you can provision a virtual machine in the public cloud. >> Got it. >> And, it's the same framework, the same catalog, the same inventory management system across the board. And then, lastly, we extended our block storage service to also become hybrid in nature. >> Got it. >> So you can manage on-prem and AWS, EBS assets as well. >> And Sheila, do you still make product announcements, or does Antonio not allow that? (Omer laughing) >> Well, we make product announcements, and you're going to see our product announcements actually done through the HPE GreenLake for block storage. >> Dave: Oh, okay. >> So our announcements will be coming through that, because we do want to make it as a service. Again, we want to take all of that headache of "What configuration should I buy? How do I actually deploy it? How do I...?" We really want to take that headache away. So you're going to see more feature announcements that's going to come through this. >> So feature acceleration through GreenLake will be exposed? >> Absolutely. >> This is some cool stuff going on behind the scenes. >> Oh, there's a lot good stuff. >> Hardware still matters, you know. >> Hardware still matters. >> Does it still matter? Does hardware matter? >> Hardware still matters, but what matters more is the experience, and that's actually what we want to bring to the customer. (laughing) >> John: That's good. >> Good answer. >> Omer: 100%. (laughing) >> Guys, thanks so much- >> John: Hardware matters. >> For coming on "theCUBE". Good to see you again. >> John: We got it. >> Thanks. >> And hope the experience was good for you Sheila. >> I know, I know. Thank you. >> Omer: Pleasure as always. >> All right, keep it right there. Dave Vellante and John Furrier will be back from HPE Discover 2022. You're watching "theCUBE". (soft music)

>>Hey everyone. Welcome to this cube conversation featuring Carto I'm Lisa Martin. And today we're excited to be joined by Javier Delatorre, the founder and chief strategy officer at Carto. We're going to be talking about how Carto is bringing cloud native spatial analysis to the cloud with AWS. How do you are great to have you on the program? Talk to us about cartel. What do you guys do? >>Great. So, uh, part two is a location intelligence platform, but we really use some neighboring organizations to work with location data on the AWS cloud. So essentially enabling organizations to analyze what do they, what should they open new stores? Whereas today probably the new internet, in essence, understanding the locations. I mentioned just helping them to figure out where to do things >>From Carter's perspective. Talk to me about why spatial analysis, location data is important. What power does it give to businesses in any industry? >>Right. I mean, we like to say that everything happens somewhere, right? So we understand that, you know, like the physical world is a very important dimension. So understanding where things happens and the relation within space is a pretty fundamental dimension when it comes to another. I like to put examples of, um, before your neighbors, uh, install alarms in their phones, the likelihood that you will get an alarm is also versus quite a lot. So that's eight years old, says that we are influenced by things that happens around us. And if you can model and understand those spacial relations, you can then look to optimize or predict what is going to happen based on where things are happening. And this is something that we've seen a lot, for example, with the pandemic, but now we're seeing, you know, like many organizations utilizing it for yeah. For finding out where they can find new customers, stores, like say, where did they deploy the new infrastructure? Everything that the ANZ has a spatial component. And that's what is spatial analytics and location intelligence allows you to do? >>Give me some examples of spatial data. And the first thing that pops into my mind is GPS. But I know that there's a lot more than that. >>Uh, GPS has been one of the most important types of data for, so since you know, the inability of GPS and, and with mobile and different sensors are staring at it, we've seen an incredible amount of location data coming into place, but you're right. There's many other types of location data that people tend not to be so aware. I'd say any company that is handling customers, you know, they're likely going to have their addresses. So we have the address of the customer. You have a location already, we'll have, we'll call that the process of geocoding. We transform an address that coordinates, right? But you also have the same, you know, with bees, you have the same, uh, with many different sip codes, it's many different ways that you can represent location. And once you identify those, uh, location bits in your data, then you can start thinking about what type of analysis you can do with them. So it is, like I said, like in many, many places, but definitely the, the rise of, uh, GPS and sensors have been very dramatic. Now we see in also like acute stream of location data coming, for example, from satellites, you know, with all these constellations of satellites, capturing daily images on from earlier, that is also giving us a lot of contextual information. But so it is, you know, mobile phones, when you connect to cell towers, there's many different businesses that are now kind of giving us location data. >>So you alluded to that earlier, a lot more businesses are using location data in their strategies. Talk to me about the acceleration that you seen of that in the last couple of years alone. >>Yeah. So I think one thing that we see in, you know, like massively on the industry obviously is these companies are going through the digital transformation. They are applying analytics to bigger and bigger areas of their, of their, of their business, right. And in a way to showcase, to kind of came as while the last time I mentioned that a lot of organizations started to look at, and over the last few years, we've seen that change in a lot. We've seen it within the many more organized spaces. Now making the questions around where things happens, how does actually matter to my business. So this is celebration, you know, has the sensitive men that many more people are now starting to look at, not only seeing things on a map, like, you know, where my customers are, where my warehouses are, my logistics supply chain, where is it located? >>Now, we're starting to see many more organizations looking at questions about how can I predict where something is going to happen, or how can I optimize my business process so that, um, you know, I, I try to reduce the number of kilometers that I have to drive miles. So, um, I guess it's a mix of the need for sustainability optimizing the business process. And the fact that more and more organizations are starting to do much more deep transformation that now location data has become a much more interesting aspect for many more organizations. So I think all these things together has to make in a way that perfect storm. And now we've seen a lot of the men too, um, for companies that want to go will be John seeing things in a map to understanding why things happen in those spaces. And that's, I think that like, again, a multitude of drivers, you know, that is supposed to in this industry. >>Can you talk about some of the key use cases and maybe some of the vertical industries where you've really seen this takeoff in the last couple of years? >>Yes. And I think he's just in a way, one of the most interesting factors of our industry traditional industries have been on the area around security in the public sector was very much on the military and the, in the, in the, uh, intelligence ecosystem. But now we've seen tremendous adoption on industries like retail, right, where they are lying now consolidating what is their, what is their physical presence? Where do they open stores? You know, like, uh, food chains, what do they open restaurants? And it's a much more analytical process now towards making businesses because, and that involves the usage of location intelligence and space analytics. We do touch one, but we still also like tremendous increase in usage on things like telcos telecommunication. Now with all the deployment of 5g networks, fiber optics, most of those operators require a very good understanding of where you should apply your networks, which, which areas you want to go start first tablet, smart CapEx car, like a strategy. >>So that's telco, I would say it's also has been a tremendous increase. Um, the public secretary is obviously very important, you know, especially, you know, with a lot of the, in a way we all got to master or do you know why geography matters? You know, how to understand your location. Um, and the last one that I would say that it's also connected very much with climate change, transportation and logistics are very, very important factor now. So understanding what is the best strategies for last mile delivery, how to organize your warehouses to better meet your needs. Those are the places that now we're seeing really growing really fast. >>So tremendous amount of use cases, a lot of opportunity there for optimization. How have companies traditionally analyze spatial data and why does that need to change? >>Yeah, so, um, I mean, to a certain extent, I would like to say that there's not been, um, that much use of location data. And that I think is one of the most exciting parts that for many organizations, this is the first time that they're looking at location as a, as a need. I mentioned that they need to understand. So there were, there were several organizations doing already a spatial analytics, but right now it's really, we really see in the expansion of our industry and you're not catching up in, in major, uh, major companies. So those are not like more advanced, you know, we'll have used so-called the traditional GIS systems. GIS is a, is a type of software. That's been existing for many years, but it's only the second used by a very small needs of analysts. You have to go almost four years to school, you know, to become a GIS expert and then do GIS analyst. >>This is right now trending dramatically. And I think, you know, Carter's part of that, uh, transition to necessity, making best patient analysis and GIS part of just the generic general analytics. And I think this is one of the most exciting times that we have, because we've seen the demo by station of his face. And it takes now to imagine why there are, so now we've seen, you know, like analysts that, you know, used to be just to know how to make a map. So things are not with a map, you know, where, where something was happening. Now we starting to see them making much more interesting plastics. So I'm like, okay, if it happens here, where else could they be happened? Right. So that's what I, right now, they, the, the, the huge statements, I'd say, I'd say like many organizations is the first time they go into jail. People like me for being very passionate about the possibilities of really improving processes. I mean, this is super, super exciting time. >>I can definitely feel your passion here through zoom, or talk to me a little bit about how cartel and AWS are helping organizations to embrace the democratization of spatial data and really unlock its super powers. >>Yeah. Well, I mean, obviously, you know, that AWS as the leader on the cloud, in a way that has fundamentally changed the way that we think about like analytics, right? So, um, not only the clouds provide us with the scalability, scalability, affordable the scale of anything. So that's one of the things that, you know, has been incredibly, um, transformative in our industry, uh, with AWS. Now we can do analysis at the scale that wasn't possible before. So that's, that's, that's one thing. So for us, you know, what we've embarked with AWS is rethinking how we can do a spatial analytics in the cloud. We're calling it car to cloud native is providing a full cloud native approach towards performing the spatial analytics, traditional GIS. And for us to utilize this game, even as huge amount of scalability, we use services like Retsef the now with their server last capabilities, we like a, an organization have their data already on that data warehouse on breaths test and using Kartra space. >>now they can do a special ethics directly on the warehouse. This is one of the biggest characteristics of cartel made by being the first cloud data platform. Every computing that we do actually gets pushed down to the warehouse. So the customer is already using the computing engine that they're already, they've been using it for many other things they're paying for already. And they give us scalability. Uh, also very cost-effectiveness this storage competed in separation that the rest of service provides. It makes it very competitive from a call like a cost perspective, and then also is very convenient. So it means that you can use just traditional sequel that are many analysts, know how to use it within the tools that they've been using for many. So I think the participation is essential to read safe, and then also with incorporating the Amazon location services. So we can talk to, and it certainly provides a cloud native it's scalable, affordable, efficient, and much more easy to use solution to performance, space analytics that anything that has been done before. >>It's a tremendous amount of opportunity. It sounds like we're just scratching the surface, but really interesting things that cartoon was doing and how you're enabling organizations in every industry to accelerate the use of spatial data. Javier, thank you so much for joining me on the program today. Fascinating information and best of luck to you. >>Thank you very much >>For Javier Delatorre I'm Lisa Martin. You're watching the cubes stay right here for more coverage of the hybrid tech event world.

>> What does it take for an entrepreneur to develop a disruptive idea, prove that it works and bring it to market. I can think of a lot of things, but one of the most important is speed. (jet engine roars) This is Dave Vellante from theCUBE inviting you to join me and John Furrier for a special CUBE on cloud startup showcase made possible by AWS. Joining theCUBE will be Michael Lebow of McKinsey. We'll also be joined by Greylock's Jerry Chen. He's going to bring the VC perspective. CIO Ben Haynes is also going to be there to lay down his practical knowledge. We'll also have Jeff Barr of AWS and together we'll feature 10 innovative companies from the AWS Global Startup Program. So if you're a technology practitioner, you'll see some of the innovations that might help transform your business. If you're an investor, you'll get a glimpse of the future and if you're an entrepreneur, you'll see how 10 companies are rocketing toward escape velocity. So join us March, 24th at 9:00 AM Pacific for theCUBE on cloud startup showcase, Innovations with Cloud Data and Cloud Ops. We'll see you there. (upbeat music)

>>Yeah. >>All right. Welcome back to our third session, which is all about administering analytics at Global Scale. We're gonna be discussing how you can implement security data compliance and governance across the globe at for large numbers of users to ensure thoughts. What is open for everyone across your organization? So coming right up is Cheryl Zang, who is a senior director of product management of Thought spot, and Kendrick. He threw the sports sports director of Systems Engineering. So, Cheryl and Kendrick, the floor is yours. >>Thank you, Tina, for the introduction. So let's talk about analytics scale on. Let's understand what that is. It's really three components. It's the access to not only data but its technology, and we start looking at the intersection of that is the value that you get as an organization. When you start thinking about analytics scale, a lot of times we think of analysts at scale and we look at the cloud as the A seven m for it, and that's a That's an accurate statement because people are moving towards the cloud for a variety of reasons. And if you think about what's been driving, it has been the applications like Salesforce, Forcados, Mongo, DB, among others. And it's actually part of where we're seeing our market go where 64% of the company's air planning to move their analytics to the cloud. And if you think of stock spotted specifically, we see that vast majority of our customers are already in the cloud with one of the Big Four Cloud Data warehouses, or they're evaluated. And what we found, though, is that even though companies are moving their analytics to the cloud, we have not solved. The problem of accessing the data is a matter of fact. Our customers. They're telling us that 10 to 25% of that data warehouse that they're leveraging, they've moved and I'm utilizing. And if you look at in General, Forrester says that 60 to 73% of data that you have is not being leveraged, and if we think about why you go through, you have this process of taking enterprise data, moving it into these cubes and aggregates and building these reports dashboards. And there's this bottleneck typically of that be I to and at the end of the day, the people that are getting that data on the right hand side or on Lee. Anywhere from 20 to 30% of the population when companies want to be data driven is 20 to 30% of the population. Really what you're looking for now it's something north of that. And if you think of Cloud data, warehouse is being the the process and you bring Cloud Data Warehouse and it's still within the same framework. You know? Why invest? Why invest and truly not fix the problem? And if you take that out and your leverage okay, you don't necessarily have the You could go directly against the warehouse, but you're still not solving the reports and dashboards. Why investing truly not scale? It's the three pillars. It's technology, it's data, and it's a accessibility. So if we look at analytics at scale, it truly is being able to get to that north of the 20 to 30% have that be I team become enablers, often organization. Have them be ableto work with the data in the Cloud Data warehouse and allow the cells marking finding supplies and then hr get direct access to that. Ask their own questions to be able to leverage that to be able to do that. You really have to look at your modern data architecture and figure out where you are in this maturity, and then they'll be able to build that out. So you look at this from the left to right and sources. It's ingestion transformation. It's the storage that the technology brains e. It's the data from a historical predictive perspective. And then it's the accessibility. So it's technology. It's data accessibility. And how do you build that? Well, if you look at for a thought to spot perspective, it truly is taking and driving and leveraging the cloud data warehouse architectures, interrogated, essay behind it. And then the accessibility is the search answers pen boards and embedded analytics. If you take that and extend it where you want to augment it, it's adding our partners from E T L R E L t. Perspective like al tricks talent Matile Ian Streaming data from data brings or if you wanna leverage your cloud, data warehouses of Data Lake and then leverage the Martin capability of your child data warehouse. The augmentation leveraging out through its data bricks and data robot. And that's where your data side of that pillar gets stronger, the technologies are enabling it. And then the accessibility from the output. This thought spot. Now, if you look at the hot spots, why and how do we make this technology accessible? What's the user experience we are? We allow an organization to go from 20 to 30% population, having access to data to what it means to be truly data driven by our users. That user experience is enabled by our ability to lead a person through the search process. There are search index and rankings. This is built for search for corporate data on top of the Cloud Data Warehouse. On top of the data that you need to be able to allow a person who doesn't understand analytics to get access to the data and the questions they need to answer, Arcuri Engine makes it simple for customers to take. Ask those questions and what you might think are not complex business questions. But they turn into complex queries in the back end that someone who typically needs to know that's that power user needs to know are very engine. Isolate that from an end user and allows them to ask that question and drive that query. And it's built on an architecture that allows us to change and adapt to the types of things. It's micro services architecture, that we've not only gone from a non grim system to our cloud offering, in a matter of of really true these 23 years. And it's amazing the reason why we can do that, do that and in a sense, future proof your investment. It's because of the way we've developed this. It's wild. First, it's Michael Services. It's able to drive. So what this architecture ER that we've talked about. We've seen different conversations of beyond its thought spot everywhere, which allows us to take that spot. One. Our ability to for search for search data for auto analyzed the Monitor with that govern security in the background and being able to leverage that not only internally but externally and then being able to take thought spot modeling language for that analysts and that person who just really good at creating and let them create these models that it could be deployed anywhere very, very quickly and then taking advantage off the Cloud Data warehouse or the technology that you have and really give you accessibility the technology that you need as well as the data that you need. That's what you need to be able to administer, uh, to take analytics at scale. So what I'm gonna do now is I'm gonna turn it over to Cheryl and she's gonna talk about administration in thought spot. Cheryl, >>thank you very much Can take. Today. I'm going to show you how you can administrator and manage South Spot for your organization >>covering >>streaming topics, the user management >>data management and >>also user adoption and performance monitoring. Let's jump into the demo. >>I think the Southport Application The Admin Council provides all the core functions needed for system level administration. Let's start with user management and authentication. With the user tab. You can add or delete a user, or you can modify the setting for an existing user. For example, user name, password email. Or you can add the user toe a different group with the group's tab. You can add or delete group, or you can manage the group setting. For example, Privileges associated with all the group members, for example, can administrate a soft spot can share data with all users or can manage data this can manage data privilege is very important. It grants a user the privileges to add data source added table and worksheet, manage data for different organizations or use cases without being an at me. There is also a field called Default Pin Board. You can select a set of PIN board that will be shown toe all of the users in that group on their homepage in terms off authentication. Currently, we support three different methods local active directory and samel By default. Local authentication is enabled and you can also choose to have several integration with an external identity provider. Currently, we support actor Ping Identity, Seaside Minor or a T. F. S. The third method is integration with active directory. You can configure integration with L DAP through active directory, allowing you to authenticate users against an elder up server. Once the users and groups are added to the system, we can share pin board wisdom or they can search to ask and answer their own questions. To create a searchable data, we first need to connect to our data warehouses with embraced. You can directly query the data as it exists in the data warehouse without having to move or transfer the data. In this page, you can add a connection to any off the six supported data warehouses. Today we will be focusing on the administrative aspect off the data management. So I will close the tap here and we will be using the connections that are already being set up. Under the Data Objects tab, we can see all of the tables from the connections. Sometimes there are a lot of tables, and it may be overwhelming for the administrator to manage the data as a best practice. We recommend using stickers toe organize your data sets here, we're going to select the Salesforce sticker. This will refined a list off tables coming from Salesforce only. This helps with data, lineage and the traceability because worksheets are curated data that's based on those tables. Let's take a look at this worksheet. Here we can see the joints between tables that created a schema. Once the data analyst created the table and worksheet, the data is searchable by end users. Let's go to search first, let's select the data source here. We can see all of the data that we have been granted access to see Let's choose the Salesforce sticker and we will see all of the tables and work ship that's available to us as a data source. Let's choose this worksheet as a data source. Now we're ready to search the search Insight can be saved either into a PIN board or an answer. Okay, it's important to know that the sticker actually persist with PIN board and answers. So when the user logging, they will be able to see all of the content that's available to them. Let's go to the Admin Council and check out the User Adoption Pin board. The User Adoption Pin board contains essential information about your soft spot users and their adoption off the platform. Here, you can see daily active user, weekly, active user and monthly active user. Count that in the last 30 days you can also see the total count off the pin board and answers that saved in the system. Here, you can see that unique count off users. Now. You can also find out the top 10 users in the last 30 days. The top 10 PIN board consumers and top 10 ad hoc searchers here, you can see that trending off weekly, active users, daily, active users and hourly active users over time. You can also get information about popular pin boards and user actions in the last one month. Now let's zoom in into this chart. With this chart, you can see weekly active users and how they're using soft spot. In this example, you can see 60% of the time people are doing at Hawk search. If you would like to see what people are searching, you can do a simple drill down on quarry tax. Here we can find out the most popular credit tax that's being used is number off the opportunities. At last, I would like to show you assistant performance Tracking PIN board that's available to the ad means this PIN board contains essential information about your soft spot. Instance performance You this pimple. To understand the query, Leighton see user traffic, how users are interacting with soft spot, most frequently loaded tables and so on. The last component toe scowling hundreds of users, is a great on boarding experience. A new feature we call Search Assist helps automate on boarding while ensuring new users have the foundation. They need to be successful on Day one, when new users logging for the first time, they're presented with personalized sample searches that are specific to their data set. In this example, someone in a sales organization would see questions like What were sales by product? Type in 2020. From there are guided step by step process helps introduce new users with search ensuring a successful on boarding experience. The search assist. The coach is a customized in product Walk through that uses your own data and your own business vocabulary to take your business users from unfamiliar to near fluent in minutes. Instead of showing the entire end user experience today, I will focus on the set up and administration side off the search assist. Search Assist is easy to set up at worksheet level with flexible options for multiple guided lessons. Using preview template, we help you create multiple learning path based on department or based on your business. Users needs to set up a learning path. You're simply feeling the template with relevant search examples while previewing what the end user will see and then increase the complexity with each additional question toe. Help your users progress >>in summary. It is easy to administrator user management, data management, management and the user adoption at scale Using soft spot Admin Council Back to you, Kendrick. >>Thank you, Cheryl. That was great. Appreciate the demo there. It's awesome. It's real life data, real life software. You know what? Enclosing here? I want to talk a little bit about what we've seen out in the marketplace and some of them when we're talking through prospects and customers, what they talk a little bit about. Well, I'm not quite area either. My data is not ready or I've got I don't have a file data warehouse. That's this process. In this thinking on, we have examples and three different examples. We have a company that actually had never I hadn't even thought about analytics at scale. We come in, we talked to them in less than a week. They're able to move their data thought spot and ask questions of the billion rose in less than a week now. We've also had customers that are early adoption. They're sticking their toes in the water around the technology, so they have a lot of data warehouse and they put some data at it, and with 11 minute within 11 minutes, we were able to search on a billion rows of their data. Now they're adding more data to combine to, to be able to work with. And then we have customers that are more mature in their process. Uh, they put large volumes of data within nine minutes. We're asking questions of their data, their business users air understanding. What's going on? A second question we get sometimes is my data is not clean. We'll talk Spot is very, very good at finding that type of data. If you take, you start moving and becomes an inner door process, and we can help with that again. Within a week, we could take data, get it into your system, start asking business questions of that and be ready to go. You know, I'm gonna turn it back to you and thank you for your time. >>Kendrick and Carol thank you for joining us today and bringing all of that amazing inside for our audience at home. Let's do a couple of stretches and then join us in a few minutes for our last session of the track. Insides for all about how Canadian Tire is delivering Korean making business outcomes would certainly not in a I. So you're there

>>Yeah, yeah. Welcome back to the third session in our building, A vibrant data ecosystem track. This session is unleash the power of your cloud data warehouse. So what comes after you've moved your data to the cloud in this session will explore White Enterprise Analytics is finally ready for the cloud, and we'll discuss how you can consume Enterprise Analytics in the very same way he would cloud services. We'll also explore where analytics meets cloud and see firsthand how thought spot is open for everyone. Let's get going. I'm happy to say we'll be hearing from two folks from thought spot today, Michael said Cassie, VP of strategic partnerships, and Vika Valentina, senior product marketing manager. And I'm very excited to welcome from our partner at AWS Gal Bar MIA, product engineering manager with Red Shift. We'll also be sharing a live demo of thought spot for BTC Marketing Analytics directly on Red Shift data. Gal, please kick us off. >>Thank you, Military. And thanks. The talks about team and everyone attending today for joining us. When we talk about data driven organizations, we hear that 85% of businesses want to be data driven. However, on Lee. 37% have been successful in We ask ourselves, Why is that and believe it or not, Ah, lot of customers tell us that they struggled with live in defining what being data driven it even means, and in particular aligning that definition between the business and the technology stakeholders. Let's talk a little bit. Let's look at our own definition. A data driven organization is an organization that harnesses data is an asset. The drive sustained innovation and create actionable insights. The super charge, the experience of their customers so they demand more. Let's focus on a few things here. One is data is an asset. Data is very much like a product needs to evolve sustained innovation. It's not just innovation innovation, it's sustained. We need to continuously innovate when it comes to data actionable insights. It's not just interesting insights these air actionable that the business can take and act upon, and obviously the actual experience we. Whether whether the customers are internal or external, we want them to request Mawr insights and as such, drive mawr innovation, and we call this the for the flywheel. We use the flywheel metaphor here where we created that data set. Okay, Our first product. Any focused on a specific use case? We build an initial NDP around that we provided with that with our customers, internal or external. They provide feedback, the request, more features. They want mawr insights that enables us to learn bringing more data and reach that actual data. And again we create MAWR insights. And as the flywheel spins faster, we improve on operational efficiencies, supporting greater data richness, and we reduce the cost of experimentation and legacy environments were never built for this kind of agility. In many cases, customers have struggled to keep momentum in their fleet, flywheel in particular around operational efficiency and experimentation. This is where Richie fits in and helps customer make the transition to a true data driven organization. Red Shift is the most widely used data warehouse with tens of thousands of customers. It allows you to analyze all your data. It is the only cloud data warehouse that sits, allows you to analyze data that sits in your data lake on Amazon, a street with no loading duplication or CTL required. It is also allows you to scale with the business with its hybrid architectures it also accelerates performance. It's a shared storage that provides the ability to scale toe unlimited concurrency. While the UN instant storage provides low late and say access to data it also provides three. Key asks that customers consistently tell us that matter the most when it comes to cost. One is usage based pricing Instead of license based pricing. Great value as you scale your data warehouse using, for example, reserved instances they can save up to 75% compared to on the mind demand prices. And as your data grows, infrequently accessed data can be stored. Cost effectively in S three encouraged through Amazon spectrum, and the third aspect is predictable. Month to month spend with no hitting charges and surprises. Unlike and unlike other cloud data warehouses, where you need premium versions for additional enterprise capabilities. Wretched spicing include building security compression and data transfer. >>Great Thanks. Scout um, eso. As you can see, everybody wins with the cloud data warehouses. Um, there's this evolution of movement of users and data and organizations to get value with these cloud data warehouses. And the key is the data has to be accessible by the users, and this data and the ability to make business decisions on the data. It ranges from users on the front line all the way up to the boardroom. So while we've seen this evolution to the Cloud Data Warehouse, as you can see from the statistic from Forrester, we're still struggling with how much of that data actually gets used for analytics. And so what is holding us back? One of the main reasons is old technology really trying to work with today's modern cloud data warehouses? They weren't built for it. So you run into issues of trying to do data replication, getting the data out of the cloud data warehouse. You can do analysis and then maintaining these middle layers of data so that you can access it quickly and get the answers you need. Another issue that's holding us back is this idea that you have to have your data in perfect shape with the perfect pipeline based on the exact dashboard unique. Um, this isn't true. Now, with Cloud data warehouse and the speed of important business data getting into those cloud data warehouses, you need a solution that allows you to access it right away without having everything to be perfect from the start, and I think this is a great opportunity for GAL and I have a little further discussion on what we're seeing in the marketplace. Um, one of the primary ones is like, What are the limiting factors, your Siegel of legacy technologies in the market when it comes to this cloud transformation we're talking about >>here? It's a great question, Michael and the variety of aspect when it comes to legacy, the other warehouses that are slowing down innovation for companies and businesses. I'll focus on 21 is performance right? We want faster insights. Companies want the ability to analyze MAWR data faster. And when it comes to on prem or legacy data warehouses, that's hard to achieve because the second aspect comes into display, which is the lack of flexibility, right. If you want to increase your capacity of your warehouse, you need to ensure request someone needs to go and bring an actual machine and install it and expand your data warehouse. When it comes to the cloud, it's literally a click of a button, which allows you to increase the capacity of your data warehouse and enable your internal and external users to perform analytics at scale and much faster. >>It falls right into the explanation you provided there, right as the speed of the data warehouses and the data gets faster and faster as it scales, older solutions aren't built toe leverage that, um, you know, they're either they're having to make technical, you know, technical cuts there, either looking at smaller amounts of data so that they can get to the data quicker. Um, or it's taking longer to get to the data when the data warehouse is ready, when it could just be live career to get the answers you need. And that's definitely an issue that we're seeing in the marketplace. I think the other one that you're looking at is things like governance, lineage, regulatory requirements. How is the cloud you know, making it easier? >>That's That's again an area where I think the cloud shines. Because AWS AWS scale allows significantly more investment in securing security policies and compliance, it allows customers. So, for example, Amazon redshift comes by default with suck 1 to 3 p. C. I. Aiso fared rampant HIPPA compliance, all of them out of the box and at our scale. We have the capacity to implement those by default for all of our customers and allow them to focus. Their very expensive, valuable ICTY resource is on actual applications that differentiate their business and transform the customer experience. >>That's a great point, gal. So we've talked about the, you know, limiting factors. Technology wise, we've mentioned things like governance. But what about the cultural aspect? Right? So what do you see? What do you see in team struggling in meeting? You know, their cloud data warehouse strategy today. >>And and that's true. One of the biggest challenges for large large organizations when they moved to the cloud is not about the technology. It's about people, process and culture, and we see differences between organizations that talk about moving to the cloud and ones that actually do it. And first of all, you wanna have senior leadership, drive and be aligned and committed to making the move to the cloud. But it's not just that you want. We see organizations sometimes Carol get paralyzed. If they can't figure out how to move each and every last work clothes, there's no need to boil the ocean, so we often work with organizations to find that iterative motion that relative process off identifying the use cases are date identifying workloads in migrating them one at a time and and through that allowed organization to grow its knowledge from a cloud perspective as well as adopt its tooling and learn about the new capabilities. >>And from an analytics perspective, we see the same right. You don't need a pixel perfect dashboard every single time to get value from your data. You don't need to wait until the data warehouse is perfect or the pipeline to the data warehouse is perfect. With today's technology, you should be able to look at the data in your cloud data warehouse immediately and get value from it. And that's the you know, that's that change that we're pushing and starting to see today. Thanks. God, that was That was really interesting. Um, you know, as we look through that, you know, this transformation we're seeing in analytics, um, isn't really that old? 20 years ago, data warehouses were primarily on Prem and the applications the B I tools used for analytics around them were on premise well, and so you saw things like applications like Salesforce. That live in the cloud. You start having to pull data from the cloud on Prem in order to do analytics with it. Um, you know, then we saw the shift about 10 years ago in the explosion of Cloud Data Warehouse Because of their scale, cost reduced, reduce shin reduction and speed. You know, we're seeing cloud data. Warehouses like Amazon Red Shift really take place, take hold of the marketplace and are the predominant ways of storing data moving forward. What we haven't seen is the B I tools catch up. And so when you have this new cloud data warehouse technology, you really need tools that were custom built for it to take advantage of it, to be able to query the cloud data warehouse directly and get results very quickly without having to worry about creating, you know, a middle layer of data or pipelines in order to manage it. And, you know, one company captures that really Well, um, chick fil A. I'm sure everybody has heard of is one of the largest food chains in America. And, you know, they made a huge investment in red shift and one of the purposes of that investment is they wanted to get access to the data mawr quickly, and they really wanted to give their business users, um, the ability to do some ad hoc analysis on the data that they were capturing. They found that with their older tools, the problems that they were finding was that all the data when they're trying to do this analysis was staying at the analyst level. So somebody needed to create a dashboard in order to share that data with a user. And if the user's requirements changed, the analysts were starting to become burdened with requests for changes and the time it took to reflect those changes. So they wanted to move to fought spot with embrace to connect to Red Shift so they could start giving business users that capability. Query the database right away. And with this, um, they were able to find, you know, very common things in in the supply chain analysis around the ability to figure out what store should get, what product that was selling better. The other part was they didn't have to wait for the data to get settled into some sort of repository or second level database. They were able to query it quickly. And then with that, they're able to make changes right in the red shift database that were then reflected to customers and the business users right away. So what they found from this is by adopting thought spot, they were actually able to arm business users with the ability to make decisions very quickly. And they cleared up the backlog that they were having and the delay with their analysts. And they're also putting their analysts toe work on different projects where they could get better value from. So when you look at the way we work with a cloud data warehouse, um, you have to think of thoughts about embrace as the tool that access that layer. The perfect analytic partner for the Cloud Data Warehouse. We will do the live query for the business user. You don't need to know how to script and sequel, um Thio access, you know, red shift. You can type the question that you want the answer to and thought spot will take care of that query. We will do the indexing so that the results come back faster for you and we will also do the analysis on. This is one of the things I wanted to cover, which is our spot i. Q. This is new for our ability to use this with embrace and our partners at Red Shift is now. We can give you the ability to do auto analysis to look at things like leading indicators, trends and anomalies. So to put this in perspective amount imagine somebody was doing forecasting for you know Q three in the western region. And they looked at how their stores were doing. And they saw that, you know, one store was performing well, Spot like, you might be able to look at that analysis and see if there's a leading product that is underperforming based on perhaps the last few quarters of data. And bring that up to the business user for analysis right away. They don't need to have to figure that out. And, um, you know, slice and dice to find that issue on their own. And then finally, all the work you do in data management and governance in your cloud data warehouse gets reflected in the results in embrace right away. So I've done a lot of talking about embrace, and I could do more, but I think it would be far better toe. Have Vika actually show you how the product works, Vika. >>Thanks, Michael. We learned a lot today about the power of leveraging your red shift data and thought spot. But now let me show you how it works. The coronavirus pandemic has presented extraordinary challenges for many businesses, and some industries have fared better than others. One industry that seems to weather the storm pretty well actually is streaming media. So companies like Netflix and who Lou. And in this demo, we're going to be looking at data from B to C marketing efforts. First streaming media company in 2020 lately, we've been running campaigns for comedy, drama, kids and family and reality content. Each of our campaigns last four weeks, and they're staggered on a weekly basis. Therefore, we always have four campaigns running, and we can focus on one campaign launch per >>week, >>and today we'll be digging into how our campaigns are performing. We'll be looking at things like impressions, conversions and users demographic data. So let's go ahead and look at that data. We'll see what we can learn from what's happened this year so far, and how we can apply those learnings to future decision making. As you can already see on the thoughts about homepage, I've created a few pin boards that I use for reporting purposes. The homepage also includes what others on my team and I have been looking at most recently. Now, before we dive into a search, will first take a look at how to make a direct connection to the customer database and red shift to save time. I've already pre built the connection Red Shift, but I'll show you how easy it is to make that connection in just three steps. So first we give the connection name and we select our connection type and was on red Shift. Then we enter our red shift credentials, and finally, we select the tables that we want to use Great now ready to start searching. So let's start in this data to get a better idea of how our marketing efforts have been affected either positively or negatively by this really challenging situation. When we think of ad based online marketing campaigns, we think of impressions, clicks and conversions. Let's >>look at those >>on a daily basis for our purposes. So all this data is available to us in Thought spot, and we can easily you search to create a nice line chart like this that shows US trends over the last few months and based on experience. We understand that we're going to have more clicks than impressions and more impressions and conversions. If we started the chart for a minute, we could see that while impressions appear to be pretty steady over the course of the year, clicks and especially conversions both get a nice boost in mid to late March, right around the time that pandemic related policies were being implemented. So right off the bat, we found something interesting, and we can come back to this now. There are few metrics that we're gonna focus on as we analyze our marketing data. Our overall goal is obviously to drive conversions, meaning that we bring new users into our streaming service. And in order to get a visitor to sign up in the first place, we need them to get into our sign up page. A compelling campaign is going to generate clicks, so if someone is interested in our ad, they're more likely to click on it, so we'll search for Click through Rape 5% and we'll look this up by campaign name. Now even compare all the campaigns that we've launched this year to see which have been most effective and bring visitors star site. And I mentioned earlier that we have four different types of campaign content, each one aligned with one of our most popular genres. So by adding campaign content, yeah, >>and I >>just want to see the top 10. I could limit my church. Just these top 10 campaigns automatically sorted by click through rate and assigned a color for each category so we could see right away that comedy and drama each of three of the top 10 campaigns by click through rate reality is, too, including the top spot and kids and family makes one appearance as well. Without spot. We know that any non technical user can ask a question and get an answer. They can explore the answer and ask another question. When you get an answer that you want to share, keep an eye on moving forward, you pin the answer to pin board. So the BBC Marketing Campaign Statistics PIN board gives us a solid overview of our campaign related activities and metrics throughout 2020. The visuals here keep us up to date on click through rate and cost per click, but also another really important metrics that conversions or cost proposition. Now it's important to our business that we evaluate the effectiveness of our spending. Let's do another search. We're going to look at how many new customers were getting so conversions and the price cost per acquisition that we're spending to get each of these by the campaign contact category. So >>this is a >>really telling chart. We can basically see how much each new users costing us, based on the content that they see prior to signing up to the service. Drama and reality users are actually relatively expensive compared to those who joined based on comedy and kids and family content that they saw. And if all the genres kids and family is actually giving us the best bang for our marketing >>buck. >>And that's good news because the genres providing the best value are also providing the most customers. We mentioned earlier that we actually saw a sizable uptick in conversions as stay at home policies were implemented across much of the country. So we're gonna remove cost per acquisition, and we're gonna take a daily look how our campaign content has trended over the years so far. Eso By doing this now, we can see a comparison of the different genres daily. Some campaigns have been more successful than others. Obviously, for example, kids and family contact has always fared pretty well Azaz comedy. But as we moved into the stay at home area of the line chart, we really saw these two genres begin to separate from the rest. And even here in June, as some states started to reopen, we're seeing that they're still trending up, and we're also seeing reality start to catch up around that time. And while the first pin board that we looked at included all sorts of campaign metrics, this is another PIN board that we've created so solely to focus on conversions. So not only can we see which campaigns drug significant conversions, we could also dig into the demographics of new users, like which campaigns and what content brought users from different parts of the country or from different age groups. And all this is just a quick search away without spot search directly on a red shift. Data Mhm. All right, Thank you. And back to you, Michael. >>Great. Thanks, Vika. That was excellent. Um, so as you can see, you can very quickly go from zero to search with thought Spot, um, connected to any cloud data warehouse. And I think it's important to understand that we mentioned it before. Not everything has to be perfect. In your doubt, in your cloud data warehouse, um, you can use thought spot as your initial for your initial tool. It's for investigatory purposes, A Z you can see here with star, Gento, imax and anthem. And a lot of these cases we were looking at billions of rows of data within minutes. And as you as your data warehouse maturity grows, you can start to add more and more thoughts about users to leverage the data and get better analysis from it. So we hope that you've enjoyed what you see today and take the step to either do one of two things. We have a free trial of thoughts about cloud. If you go to the website that you see below and register, we can get you access the thought spots so you can start searching today. Another option, by contacting our team, is to do a zero to search workshop where 90 minutes will work with you to connect your data source and start to build some insights and exactly what you're trying to find for your business. Um thanks, everybody. I would especially like to thank golf from AWS for joining us on this today. We appreciate your participation, and I hope everybody enjoyed what they saw. I think we have a few questions now. >>Thank you, Vika, Gal and Michael. It's always exciting to see a live demo. I know that I'm one of those comedy numbers. We have just a few minutes left, but I would love to ask a couple of last questions Before we go. Michael will give you the first question. Do I need to have all of my data cleaned and ready in my cloud data warehouse before I begin with thought spot? >>That's a great question, Mallory. No, you don't. You can really start using thought spot for search right away and start getting analysis and start understanding the data through the automatic search analysis and the way that we query the data and we've seen customers do that. Chick fil a example that we talked about earlier is where they were able to use thoughts bought to notice an anomaly in the Cloud Data Warehouse linking between product and store. They were able to fix that very quickly. Then that gets reflected across all of the users because our product queries the Cloud Data Warehouse directly so you can get started right away without it having to be perfect. And >>that's awesome. And gal will leave a fun one for you. What can we look forward to from Amazon Red Shift next year? >>That's a great question. And you know, the team has been innovating extremely fast. We released more than 200 features in the last year and a half, and we continue innovating. Um, one thing that stands out is aqua, which is a innovative new technology. Um, in fact, lovely stands for Advanced Square Accelerator, and it allows customers to achieve performance that up to 10 times faster, uh, than what they've seen really outstanding and and the way we've achieved that is through a shift in paradigm in the actual technological implementation section. Uh, aqua is a new distributed and hardware accelerated processing layer, which effectively allows us to push down operations analytics operations like compression, encryption, filtering and aggregations to the storage there layer and allow the aqua nodes that are built with custom. AWS designed analytics processors to perform these operations faster than traditional soup use. And we no longer need to bring, you know, scan the data and bring it all the way to the computational notes were able to apply these these predicates filtering and encourage encryption and compression and aggregations at the storage level. And likewise is going to be available for every are a three, um, customer out of the box with no changes to come. So I apologize for being getting out a little bit, but this is really exciting. >>No, that's why we invited you. Call. Thank you on. Thank you. Also to Michael and Vika. That was excellent. We really appreciate it. For all of you tuning in at home. The final session of this track is coming up shortly. You aren't gonna want to miss it. We're gonna end strong, come back and hear directly from our customer a T mobile on how T Mobile is building a data driven organization with thought spot in which >>pro, It's >>up next, see you then.

>> Narrator: From theCUBE studios in Palo Alto, in Boston, connecting with thought leaders all around the world. This is theCUBE conversation. >> Everyone welcome to this special CUBE conversation. I'm John Furrier, host of theCUBE here in our Palo Alto studios. During this time of the pandemic, we're doing a lot of remote interviews, supporting a lot of events. theCUBE virtual is our new brand because there's no events to go to, but we certainly want to talk to the best people and get the most important stories. And today I have a great segment with a world-class entrepreneur, Ajeet Singh co-founder and executive chairman of ThoughtSpot. And they've got an event coming up, which is going to be coming up in December 9th and 10th. But this interview is really about what it takes to be a world-class leader and what it takes to see the future and be a visionary, but then execute an opportunity because this is the time that we're in right now is there's a lot of change, data, technology, a sea change is happening and it's upon us and leadership around technology and how to capture opportunities is really what we need right now. And so Ajeet I want to thank you for coming on to theCUBE conversation. >> Thanks for having me, John. Pleasure to be here. >> For the folks watching, the startup that you've been doing for many, many years now, ThoughtSpot you're the co-founder executive chairman, but you also were involved in Nutanix as the co-founder of that company as well. You know, a little about unicorns and creating value and doing things early, but you're a visionary and you're a technologist and a leader. I want to go in and explore that because now more than ever, the role of data, the role of the truth is super important. And as the co-founder, your company is well positioned to do that. I mean, your tagline today on the website says insight is the speed of thought, but going back to the beginning, probably wasn't the tagline. It was probably maybe like we got to leverage data, take us through the vision initially when you founded the company in 2012. What was the thinking? What was on your mind? Take us through the journey. >> Yeah. So as an entrepreneur, I think visionary is a very big term. I don't know if I qualify for that or not, but what I'm really passionate about is identifying very large markets, with very, very big problems. And then going to the white board and from scratch, building a solution that is perfectly designed for the big problem that the market might be facing from scratch. And just an absolute honest way of approaching the problem and finding the best possible solution. So when we were starting ThoughtSpot, the market that we identified was analytics, analytics software. And the big problem that we saw was that while on one hand, companies were building very big data lakes, data warehouses, there was a lot of money being spent in capturing and storing data how that data was consumed by the end-users, the non-technical people, the sales, marketing, HR people, the doctors, the nurses, that process was not changing. That process was still stuck in old times where you have to ask an analyst to go and build a dashboard for you. And at the same time, we saw that in the consumer space, when anyone had a question they wanted to learn about something, they would just go to Google and ask that question. So we said, why can't analytics be as easy as Google? If I have a question, why do I have to wait for three weeks for some data experts to bring some insights to me for most simple questions, if I'm doing some very deep analysis, trying to come up with fraud algorithms, it's understood, you know, you need data expert. But if I'm just trying to understand how my business is doing, how my customers are doing, I shouldn't have to wait. And so that's how we identified the market and the problem. And then we build a solution that is designed for that non-technical user with a very design thinking UX first approach to make it super easy for anyone to ask that question. So that was the Genesis of the company. >> You know, I just love the thinking because you're solving a problem with a clean sheet piece of paper, you're looking at what can be done. And it's just, you can bring up Google because you know, you think about Google's motto was find what you're looking for. And they had a little gimmicky buttons, like I'm feeling lucky, which just took you to a random webpage at that time while everyone else was tryna build these walled gardens and this structural apparatus, Google wanted you in and out with your results fast. And that mindset just never came over to the enterprise and with all that legacy structure and all the baggage associated with it. So I totally loved the vision, but I got to ask you, how did you get to beachhead? How did you get that first success milestone? When did you see results in your thinking? >> Yeah, so I mean, I believe that once you've identified a big market and a big problem, it comes down to the people. So I sort of went on a recruit recruiting mission and I recruited perhaps the best technology and business team that you can find in any enterprise segment, not only just analytics, some of the early engineers, my co-founder, he was at Google before that, Amit Prakash, before that he was at Microsoft working on Bing. So it took a lot of very deliberate effort to find the right kind of people who have a builder's mentality and are also deep experts in areas like search large-scale distributed systems. Very passionate about user experience. And then you start building the product, you know, it took us almost, I would say one and a half three years to get the initial working version of the product. And we were lucky enough to engage with some of the largest companies in the world, such as Walmart who are very interested in our solution because they were facing these kinds of problems. And we almost co-developed this technology with our early customers, focusing on ease of use, scale, security, governance, all of that, because it's one thing to have a concept where you want to make access to data as easy as Google, you have a certain interface people can type and get an answer. But when you are talking about enterprise data and enterprise needs, they are nowhere similar to what you have in consumer space. Consumer space is free for all, all the information is there you can crawl it and then you can access it. In enterprise, for you to take this idea of search, but make it production grid, make it real and not just a concept card. You need to invest a lot in building deep technology and then enabling security and scalability and all of that. So it took us almost , I would say a two and a half to three years to get to the initial version of the product and the problem we are solving and the area of technology search that we are working on. We brought it to the market. It's almost an infinite game. You know, you can keep making things easier and easier. And we've seen how Google has continued to evolve their search over time And it is still evolving. We just feel so lucky to be in this market, taking the direction that we have taken. >> Yeah. It's easy to talk a big game in this area because like you said, it's a hard technical problem because it'll structural data, whether it's schema databases or whatever, legacy baggage, but to make it easy, hard. And I like what you guys go with this, find the right information and put it in the right place, the right time. It's a really hard problem. And the beautiful thing is you guys are building a category while there's spend in the market that needs the problem today. So category creation with an existing market that needs it. So I got to ask you, if you could do me a favor and define for the audience, what is search-driven analytics? What does that mean from your standpoint? >> Yeah, what it means is for the end user, it looks like search but under the hood is driving large scale analytics. I like to say that our product looks like a search engine on the surface, but under the hood, it's a massive number crunching machine. So Search and AI driven analytics. There's two goals there. One, if the user has, any user and we're talking about non-technical users here, we're not talking about necessarily data experts, but if a user has a question, they should be able to get an answer instantly. They shouldn't have to wait. That is what we achieve with Search and with Spot IQ, our AI engine, we help surface insights where people may not even know that those are the questions they should be asking because data has become so complex. People often don't even know what question they should be asking. And we give them a pool that's very easy to use, but it helps surface insights to them. So there is both a pool model that we enabled through Search and a push model that we enable through Spot IQ. >> So I have to ask you that you guys are pioneering this segment you're in first. And sometimes when you're first, you have arrows in your back as you know, it's not all the beginners survive, they get competition copies, but you guys have had a lead. You had success. What's different today as you have competition coming in trying to say, "Oh, we got Search too." So what's different today with ThoughtSpot? How are you guys differentiated? >> Yeah. I mean, that's always a sign of success. If what you are trying to do, if others are saying we have it too, you have done something that is valuable. And that happens in all industry. I think the best example is Tesla. They were the first to look at this very well-known problem. I mean, we haven't had a very sort of unique take on the existence of the problem itself. Everybody knows that there is a problem with access to data, but the technology that we have built is so deep that it's very, very hard to really copy it and make it work in real world with Tesla in automotive industry in cars, there is obviously so many other companies that have launched battery powered cars, electric cars, but there is Tesla and there is all the other electric cars which are a bit of an afterthought, because if you want to build an analytics product, where Search is at the core, Search cannot be added on the top, Search has to be the core, and then you build around it. And that requires you to build a fundamental architecture from the ground up. And you can't take an existing BI product that is built for dash boarding and add a search bar. I have always said that adding a search bar in a UI is perhaps, you know, 10 to 20 lines of JavaScript code. Anyone can add it and there is so much open source stuff out there that you can just take it and plug it. And many people have tried to do that, but taking off the shelf, Search technology that is built for unstructured data and sticking it on to a product that is required to do analytics on enterprise data, that doesn't work. We built a search technology that understands enterprise data at a very deep level, so that when our customers take our product and bring it into their environment, they don't have to fundamentally change how they manage their data. Our goal is to add value to their existing enterprise data Cloud Data Warehouses and deliver this amazing Search experience where our Search engine is enable to understand what's in their data Lake, what's in their Cloud Data Warehouse. What are the schema, the tables, the joints, the cardinality, the data archive, the security requirements, all of things have to be understood by the technology for you to deliver the experience. So now that said, we pride ourselves in not resting on our laurels. You know, we have this sort of motto in the company. We say we are only 2% done. So we are on our own sort of a continuous journey of innovation. And we have been working on taking our Search technology to the next level. And that is something really powerful that we are going to unveil at our upcoming conference, Beyond, in December. And that is one to create even more distance between us and the competition. And it's all driven by what we have seen with our customers, how they're using our product or learnings what they like, what they don't like, where we see gaps and where we see opportunity to make it even easier to deliver value to our customers and our users. >> I think that's a really profound insight you just shared, because if you look at what you just said around thinking about Search as an embedded architectural foundational, you know, embedded in the architecture, that's different than bolting on a feature where you said Java code or some open source library. You know, we see in the security market, people bolted on security had huge problems. Now, all you hear is, "Oh, you got a big security in from the beginning." You actually have baked Search into everything from the beginning. And it's not just a utility, it's a mindset. And it's also a technology metadata data about data software, and all kinds of tech is involved. Am I getting that right? I mean, cause I think this is what I heard you say. It's like, you got to have the data. >> This is totally right. I mean, if I can use an analogy, there is Google search and obviously Yahoo also tried to bring their own search Yahoo search Yahoo actually, Yahoo versus Google is a perfect example or a perfect analogy to compare with ThoughtSpot versus other BI product Yahoo was built for predefined content consumption. You know, you had a homepage, somebody defined it. You could make some customizations. And there is predefined content you can consume it. Now, they also did add search, but that didn't really go so far. While Google said, we will vary from scratch ability to crawl all the data, ability to index all the data and then build a serving infrastructure that deliver this amazing performance and interactivity and relevance for the user. Relevance is where Google already shined. And you can't do those things until you think about the architecture from the ground up. >> Ajeet I'm looking forward to having more deep dive conversations on that one topic. But for the folks who might not be old enough, like me to remember Google back at that time, Yahoo was the best search engine and it was directory basically with a keyword search. It was trivial, technically speaking, but they got big. And then the portal wars came out, we got to have a portal. Google was very much not looked down as an innovator, but they had great technical chops and they just stayed the course. They had a mission to provide the best search engine to help users find what they're looking for. And they never wavered. And it was not fashionable about that time to your point. And then Yahoo was number one, then Google just became Google and the rest is history. So I really think that's super notable because companies face the same problem. What looks like fashionable tech today might not be the right one. I think that's... >> Yeah, and I totally agree. And I think a lot of times in our space, there's a lot of sort of hype around AI and machine learning. We as a company have tried to stay close to our customers and users and build things that will work for them. And a lot of stuff that we are doing, it has never been done before. So it's not to say that along the way, we don't have our own failures. We do have failures and we learn from them. >> Yeah. Yeah. Just don't make the same mistake twice. >> Yeah, I think if you have a process of learning quickly, improving quickly, those are the companies that will have a competitive advantage. In today's world, nobody gets it right the first time. If you're trying to do something fundamentally different, if you're copying somebody else, then you're too late already. >> I totally agree. >> If you do something new, it's about how fast you penetrate And that's... >> That's a great mindset. That's a great mindset. And I think that's worth capturing calling out, but I got to ask you because what's first of all, distinguished history and I love your mindset and just solving problems, big problems. All great. I want to ask you something about the industry and where you guys were in 2012 alright when you started the company, you were literally in what I call the before Cloud phase. Cause it was before Cloud companies and then during Cloud companies and then after Cloud, you know, Amazon clearly took advantage of that for a lot of startups. So right around 2012 through 2016, I'd call that the Amazon is growing up years. How did the Cloud impact your thinking around the product and how you guys were executing because you were right on that wave. You were probably in the sweet spot of your development. >> Yeah. >> Pre business planning. You were in the pre-business planning mode, incomes, Amazon. I'm sure you're probably using Amazon cause your starters and all start up sort of use Amazon at first, but I just think about, do we all have found premise with a data center? How did that impact you guys? And how does that change today? >> Certainly. Yeah it's been fascinating to see how the world is evolving how enterprises have also really evolved in depth, thinking on how they leverage the cloud infrastructure now. In the Cloud, there is the compute and storage infrastructure. And then you have a Cloud Data Warehouse, the analytics stack in the Cloud. That's becoming more popular now with a company like Google, having BigQuery and then Snowflake really amazing concepts and things like that. So when we started, we looked at where our customers are , where is their data. And what kind of infrastructure is available to us at the time there wasn't enough compute to drive the search engine that we wanted to build. There were also not any significant Cloud Data Warehousing at the time, but our engineering team our co-founders, they came from companies like Google, where building a Cloud based architecture and elastic architecture, service oriented architecture is in their DNA. So we architected the product to run on infrastructure that is very elastic that can be run practically anywhere. But our initial customers and applies the Global 2000. They had their data on-prem. So we had started more with on-prem as a go-to-market strategy. and then about four and a half years ago, once cloud infrastructure I'm talking about the compute infrastructure started to become more mature, we certified our software, to run on all three clouds So today we have more than 75 to 80% of our customers already running our software in the Cloud. And as now, because we connect to our primary data sources, our Cloud Data Warehouses, Cloud Data Lakes. Now with Snowflake and BigQuery and Synapse and Redshift, we have enough of our customers who have deployed Cloud Data Warehouses. So we are also able to directly integrate with them. And that's why we launched our own hosted SaaS Offering about a month ago. So I would say our journey in this area has been sort of similar to companies like Splunk or Elastic, which started with a software model initially deployed more on-prem, but then evolved with the customers to the Cloud. So we have a lot of focus and momentum and lot of our customers, as they're moving their data to the Cloud, they're asking us as well to be in the Cloud and provide a hosted offering. And that is what we have built for the last one year. And we launched it a month ago. >> It's nice to be on the right side of history. I got to say, when you're on the way to be there. And that also makes integrations easy too. I love the Cloud play. Let's get to the final segment here. I want to get your thoughts on your customers, your advice. There's a huge untapped opportunity for companies when it comes to data, a lot of them are realizing that the pandemic is highlighting a lot of areas where they have to go faster and then to go to Cloud, they're going to build modern apps more data's coming in than ever before. Where are these untapped opportunities for customers to take advantage of the data? And what's your opinion on where they should look and what they should do? >> Yeah, I really think that the pandemics has shown for the first, the value of data to society at large, there is probably more than a billion people in the world that have seen a chart for the first time in their life. Everybody is being... and COVID has done some magic. But everybody was looking at charts of infection and so on and so forth. So there is a lot more broad awareness of what data can do in improving our society at large for the businesses of course, in the last six, seven months, you heard it enough from lot of leaders that digital transformation is accelerating. Everybody is realizing that the way to interact in the world is becoming more and more digital expecting your customers to come to your branch to do banking is not really an option. And people are also seeing how all the SaaS companies and SaaS businesses, digital businesses, they have really taken off. So if a company like Zoom can suddenly have a a hundred, $150 billion valuation, because you are able to do everything remote, all the enterprises are looking to really touch their customers and partners in a lot more digital way than they could do before. And definitely COVID has also really created this almost, you know, pool buckets of organization. There is lot of companies that have tremendously benefited from it. And there a lot of companies that have been poorly affected, really in a difficult place. And I think both of them for the first category, they are looking at how do I maintain this revenue even after COVID, because one of this thing, you know, hopefully early next year we have a vaccine and things can start to look better again sometime next year. But we have learned so much. We have attracted so many new customers, how do we retain and grow them further? And that means I need to invest more and more in my technology. Now, companies that are not doing well, they really want to figure out how to become more operationally efficient. And they are really under pressure to get more value from there and both categories, improving your revenue, retaining customers. You need to understand the customer behavior. You need to understand which products they are buying at a fine grain level, not with the law of averages, not by looking at a dashboard and saying our average customer likes this kind of product. That one doesn't really work. You have to offer people personalized services and that personalization is just not possible at scale, without really using data on the front lines. You can't have just manager sitting in their office, looking at dashboards and charts and saying these are the kinds of campaigns I need to run because my average customer seems to like these kinds of offers. I need to really empower my sales people, my individual frontline workers, who are interfacing with the customer to be able to make customized offers of services and products to them. And that is possible on the data. So we see a really, a lot more focus in getting value from data, delivering value quickly and digital transformation broadly but definitely leveraging data in businesses. There is tremendous acceleration that is happening and, you know, next five years, it's all going to be about being able to monetize data on the front lines when you are interfacing with your customers and partners >> Ajeet, that's great insight. And I really appreciate what you're saying. And you know, I wrote a blog post in 2007. I said, data will be the new development kit. Back then we used to call development kits, software user development. >> John, you are the real visionary. It took me until 2012 to be able to do this. >> Well, it wasn't clear, but you saw other data was going to have to be programmed be part of the programming. And I think, what you're getting at here is so profound because we're living 2020 people can see the value of data at the right time. It changes the conversations, it changes what's going on in the real time communications of our world with real-time access to information, whether that's machine to machine or machine to human, having data in the right place, changes the context. >> Yap. >> And that is a true, not a tech thing, that's just life, right? I think this year, I think we're going to look back and say, this was the year that everyone realized that real time communications, real-time society needs real time data. And I think it's going to be more important than ever. So it's a really big problem and important one. And thank you for sharing that. >> Yeah. And actually you bring up a very good point programming, developing big data. Data as a development kit. We are also going to announce a new product at Beyond, which will be about bringing ThoughtSpot everywhere, where a lot of business users are in their business applications. And by using ThoughtSpot product, using our full experience, they can obviously do enterprise wide analytics and look at all the data. But if they're looking for insights and nuggets, and they want to ask questions in their business workflows. We are also launching a product capability that will allow software developers to inject data in their business applications and enable and empower their own business users to be able to ask any questions that they might have without having to go to yet another BI product. >> It's data as code. I mean, you almost think about like software metaphors, where's the compiler? Where's the source code? Where's the data code? You start to get into this new mindset of thinking about data as code, because you got to have data about the data. Is it clean data, dirty data? Is it real time? Is it useful? There's a lot of intelligence needed to manage this. This is like a pretty big deal. And it's fairly new in the sense in the science side. Yeah, machine learning has been around for a while and you know, there's tracks for that. But thinking of this way as an operating system mindset, it's not just being a data geek. You know what I'm saying? So I think you're on the right track Ajeet. I really appreciate your thoughts here. Thank you. >> Thank you John. >> Okay. This is a cube conversation. Unpacking the data. The data is the future. We're living in a real-time world and in real-time data can change the outcomes of all kinds of contexts. And with truth, you need data and Ajeet Singh co-founder executive chairman of ThoughtSpot shares his thoughts here in theCUBE. I'm John furrier. Thanks for watching. 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>>It's the queue covering the virtual vertical Big Data Conference 2020. Brought to you by vertical. >>Hello, everybody. Welcome to the new Normal. You're watching the Cube, and it's remote coverage of the vertical big data event on digital or gone Virtual. My name is Dave Volante, and I'm here with Colin Mahoney, who's a senior vice president at Micro Focus and the GM of Vertical Colin. Well, strange times, but the show goes on. Great to see you again. >>Good to see you too, Dave. Yeah, strange times indeed. Obviously, Safety first of everyone that we made >>a >>decision to go Virtual. I think it was absolutely the right all made it in advance of how things have transpired, but we're making the best of it and appreciate your time here, going virtual with us. >>Well, Joe and we're super excited to be here. As you know, the Cube has been at every single BDC since its inception. It's a great event. You just you just presented the key note to your to your audience, You know, it was remote. You didn't have that that live vibe. And you have a lot of fans in the vertical community But could you feel the love? >>Yeah, you know, it's >>it's hard to >>feel the love virtually, but I'll tell you what. The silver lining in all this is the reach that we have for this event now is much broader than it would have been a Z you know, you know, we brought this event back. It's been a few years since we've done it. We're super excited to do it, obviously, you know, in Boston, where it was supposed to be on location, but there wouldn't have been as many people that could participate. So the silver lining in all of this is that I think there's there's a lot of love out there we're getting, too. I have a lot of participants who otherwise would not have been able to participate in this. Both live as well. It's a lot of these assets that we're gonna have available. So, um, you know, it's out there. We've got an amazing customers and of practitioners with vertical. We've got so many have been with us for a long time. We've of course, have a lot of new customers as well that we're welcoming, so it's exciting. >>Well, it's been a while. Since you've had the BDC event, a lot of transpired. You're now part of micro focus, but I know you and I know the vertical team you guys have have not stopped. You've kept the innovation going. We've been following the announcements, but but bridge the gap between the last time. You know, we had coverage of this event and where we are today. A lot has changed. >>Oh, yeah, a lot. A lot has changed. I mean, you know, it's it's the software industry, right? So nothing stays the same. We constantly have Teoh keep going. Probably the only thing that stays the same is the name Vertical. Um and, uh, you know, you're not spending 10 which is just a phenomenal released for us. So, you know, overall, the the organization continues to grow. The dedication and commitment to this great form of vertical continues every single release we do as you know, and this hasn't changed. It's always about performance and scale and adding a whole bunch of new capabilities on that front. But it's also about are our main road map and direction that we're going towards. And I think one of the things have been great about it is that we've stayed true that from day one we haven't tried to deviate too much and get into things that are barred to outside your box. But we've really done, I think, a great job of extending vertical into places where people need a lot of help. And with vertical 10 we know we're going to talk more about that. But we've done a lot of that. It's super exciting for our customers, and all of this, of course, is driven by our customers. But back to the big data conference. You know, everybody has been saying this for years. It was one of the best conferences we've been to just so really it's. It's developers giving tech talks, its customers giving talks. And we have more customers that wanted to give talks than we had slots to fill this year at the event, which is another benefit, a little bit of going virtually accommodate a little bit more about obviously still a tight schedule. But it really was an opportunity for our community to come together and talk about not just America, but how to deal with data, you know, we know the volumes are slowing down. We know the complexity isn't slowing down. The things that people want to do with AI and machine learning are moving forward in a rapid pace as well. There's a lot talk about and share, and that's really huge part of what we try to do with it. >>Well, let's get into some of that. Um, your customers are making bets. Micro focus is actually making a bet on one vertical. I wanna get your perspective on one of the waves that you're riding and where are you placing your bets? >>Yeah, No, it's great. So, you know, I think that one of the waves that we've been writing for a long time, obviously Vertical started out as a sequel platform for analytics as a sequel, database engine, relational engine. But we always knew that was just sort of takes that we wanted to do. People were going to trust us to put enormous amounts of data in our platform and what we owe everyone else's lots of analytics to take advantage of that data in the lots of tools and capabilities to shape that data to get into the right format. The operational reporting but also in this day and age for machine learning and from some pretty advanced regressions and other techniques of things. So a huge part of vertical 10 is just doubling down on that commitment to what we call in database machine learning and ai. Um, And to do that, you know, we know that we're not going to come up with the world's best algorithms. Nor is that our focus to do. Our advantage is we have this massively parallel platform to ingest store, manage and analyze the data. So we made some announcements about incorporating PM ML models into the product. We continue to deepen our python integration. Building off of a new open source project we started with uber has been a great customer and partner on This is one of our great talks here at the event. So you know, we're continuing to do that, and it turns out that when it comes to anything analytics machine learning, certainly so much of what you have to do is actually prepare the big shape the data get the data in the right format, apply the model, fit the model test a model operationalized model and is a great platform to do that. So that's a huge bet that were, um, continuing to ride on, taking advantage of and then some of the other things that we've just been seeing. You continue. I'll take object. Storage is an example on, I think Hadoop and what would you point through ultimately was a huge part of this, but there's just a massive disruption going on in the world around object storage. You know, we've made several bets on S three early we created America Yang mode, which separates computing story. And so for us that separation is not just about being able to take care of your take advantage of cloud economics as we do, or the economics of object storage. It's also about being able to truly isolate workloads and start to set the sort of platform to be able to do very autonomous things in the databases in the database could actually start self analysing without impacting many operational workloads, and so that continues with our partnership with pure storage. On premise, we just announced that we're supporting beyond Google Cloud now. In addition to Amazon, we supported on we've got a CFS now being supported by are you on mode. So we continue to ride on that mega trend as well. Just the clouds in general. Whether it's a public cloud, it's a private cloud on premise. Giving our customers the flexibility and choice to run wherever it makes sense for them is something that we are very committed to. From a flexibility standpoint. There's a lot of lock in products out there. There's a lot of cloud only products now more than ever. We're hearing our customers that they want that flexibility to be able to run anywhere. They want the ease of use and simplicity of native cloud experiences, which we're giving them as well. >>I want to stay in that architectural component for a minute. Talk about separating compute from storage is not just about economics. I mean apart Is that you, you know, green, really scale compute separate from storage as opposed to in chunks. It's more efficient, but you're saying there's other advantages to operational and workload. Specificity. Um, what is unique about vertical In this regard, however, many others separate compute from storage? What's different about vertical? >>Yeah, I think you know, there's a lot of differences about how we do it. It's one thing if you're a cloud native company, you do it and you have a shared catalog. That's key value store that all of your customers are using and are on the same one. Frankly, it's probably more of a security concern than anything. But it's another thing. When you give that capability to each customer on their own, they're fully protected. They're not sharing it with any other customers. And that's something that we hear a lot of insights from our customers. They want to be able to separate compute and storage. But they want to be able to do this in their own environment so that they know that in their data catalog there's no one else is. You share in that catalog, there's no single point of failure. So, um, that's one huge advantage that we have. And frankly, I think it just comes from being a company that's operating on premise and, uh, up in the cloud. I think another huge advantages for us is we don't know what object storage platform is gonna win, nor do we necessarily have. We designed the young vote so that it's an sdk. We started with us three, but it could be anything. It's DFS. That's three. Who knows what what object storage formats were going to be there and then finally, beyond just the object storage. We're really one of the only database companies that actually allows our customers to natively operate on data in very different formats, like parquet and or if you're familiar with those in the Hadoop community. So we not only embrace this kind of object storage disruption, but we really embrace the different data formats. And what that means is our customers that have data pipelines that you know, fully automated, putting this information in different places. They don't have to completely reload everything to take advantage of the Arctic analytics. We can go where the data is connected into it, and we offer them a lot of different ways to take advantage of those analytics. So there are a couple of unique differences with verdict, and again, I think are really advance. You know, in many ways, by not being a cloud native platform is that we're very good at operating in different environments with different formats that changing formats over time. And I don't think a lot of the other companies out there that I think many, particularly many of the SAS companies were scrambling. They even have challenges moving from saying Amazon environment to a Microsoft azure environment with their office because they've got so much unique Band Aid. Excuse me in the background. Just holding the system up that is native to any of those. >>Good. I'm gonna summarize. I'm hearing from you your Ferrari of databases that we've always known. Your your object store agnostic? Um, it's any. It's the cloud experience that you can bring on Prem to virtually any cloud. All the popular clouds hybrid. You know, aws, azure, now Google or on Prem and in a variety of different data formats. And that is, I think, you know, you need the combination of those I think is unique in the marketplace. Um, before we get into the news, I want to ask you about data silos and data silos. You mentioned H DFs where you and I met back in the early days of big data. You know, in some respects, you know, Hadoop help break down the silos with distributing the date and leave it in place, and in other respects, they created Data Lakes, which became silos. And so we have. Yet all these other sales people are trying to get to, Ah, digital transformation meeting, putting data at their core virtually obviously, and leave it in place. What's your thoughts on that in terms of data being a silo buster Buster, How does verdict of way there? >>Yeah, so And you're absolutely right, I think if even if you look at his due for all the new data that gets into the do. In many ways, it's created yet another large island of data that many organizations are struggling with because it's separate from their core traditional data warehouse. It's separate from some of the operational systems that they have, and so there might be a lot of data in there, but they're still struggling with How do I break it out of that large silo and or combine it again? I think some some of the things that verdict it doesn't part of the announcement just attend his migration tools to make it really easy. If you do want to move it from one platform to another inter vertical, but you don't have to move it, you can actually take advantage of a lot of the data where it resides with vertical, especially in the Hadoop brown with our external table storage with our building or compartment natively. So we're very pragmatic about how our customers go about this. Very few customers, Many of them tried it with Hadoop and realize that didn't work. But very few customers want a wholesale. Just say we're going to throw everything out. We're gonna get rid of our data warehouse. We're gonna hit the pause button and we're going to go from there. Just it's not possible to do that. So we've spent a lot of time investing in the product, really work with them to go where the data is and then seamlessly migrate. And when it makes sense to migrate, you mentioned the performance of America. Um, and you talked about it is the variety. It definitely is. And one other thing that we're really proud of this is that it actually is not a gas guzzler. Easy either One of the things that we're seeing, a lot of the other cloud databases pound for pound you get on the 10th the hardware vertical running up there. You get over 10 x performance. We're seeing that a lot, so it's Ah, it's not just about the performance, but it's about the efficiency as well. And I think that efficiency is really important when it comes to silos. Because there's there's just only so much horsepower out there. And it's easier for companies to play tricks and lots of servers environment when they start up for so many organizations and cloud and frankly, looking at the bills they're getting from these cloud workloads that are running. They really conscious of that. >>Yeah. The big, big energy companies love the gas guzzlers. A lot of a lot of cloud. Cute. But let's get into the news. Uh, 10 dot io you shared with your the audience in your keynote. One of the one of the highlights of data. What do we need to know? >>Yeah, so, you know, again doubling down on these mega trends, I'll start with Machine Learning and ai. We've done a lot of work to integrate so that you can take native PM ml models, bring them into vertical, run them massively parallel and help shape you know your data and prepare it. Do all the work that we know is required true machine learning. And for all the hype that there is around it, this is really you know, people want to do a lot of unsupervised machine learning, whether it's for healthcare fraud, detection, financial services. So we've doubled down on that. We now also support things like Tensorflow and, you know, as I mentioned, we're not going to come up with the best algorithms. Our job is really to ensure that those algorithms that people coming up with could be incorporated, that we can run them against massive data sets super efficiently. So that's that's number one number two on object storage. We continue to support Mawr object storage platforms for ya mode in the cloud we're expanding to Google G CPI, Google's cloud beyond just Amazon on premise or in the cloud. Now we're also supporting HD fs with beyond. Of course, we continue to have a great relationship with our partners, your storage on premise. Well, what we continue to invest in the eon mode, especially. I'm not gonna go through all the different things here, but it's not just sort of Hey, you support this and then you move on. There's so many different things that we learn about AP I calls and how to save our customers money and tricks on performance and things on the third areas. We definitely continue to build on that flexibility of deployment, which is related to young vote with. Some are described, but it's also about simplicity. It's also about some of the migration tools that we've announced to make it easy to go from one platform to another. We have a great road map on these abuse on security, on performance and scale. I mean, for us. Those are the things that we're working on every single release. We probably don't talk about them as much as we need to, but obviously they're critically important. And so we constantly look at every component in this product, you know, Version 10 is. It is a huge release for any product, especially an analytic database platform. And so there's We're just constantly revisiting you know, some of the code base and figuring out how we can do it in new and better ways. And that's a big part of 10 as well. >>I'm glad you brought up the machine Intelligence, the machine Learning and AI piece because we would agree that it is really one of the things we've noticed is that you know the new innovation cocktail. It's not being driven by Moore's law anymore. It's really a combination of you. You've collected all this data over the last 10 years through Hadoop and other data stores, object stores, etcetera. And now you're applying machine intelligence to that. And then you've got the cloud for scale. And of course, we talked about you bringing the cloud experience, whether it's on Prem or hybrid etcetera. The reason why I think this is important I wanted to get your take on this is because you do see a lot of emerging analytic databases. Cloud Native. Yes, they do suck up, you know, a lot of compute. Yeah, but they also had a lot of value. And I really wanted to understand how you guys play in that new trend, that sort of cloud database, high performance, bringing in machine learning and AI and ML tools and then driving, you know, turning data into insights and from what I'm hearing is you played directly in that and your differentiation is a lot of the things that we talk about including the ability to do that on from and in the cloud and across clouds. >>Yeah, I mean, I think that's a great point. We were a great cloud database. We run very well upon three major clouds, and you could argue some of the other plants as well in other parts of the world. Um, if you talk to our customers and we have hundreds of customers who are running vertical in the cloud, the experience is very good. I think it would always be better. We've invested a lot in taking advantage of the native cloud ecosystem, so that provisioning and managing vertical is seamless when you're in that environment will continue to do that. But vertical excuse me as a cloud platform is phenomenal. And, um, you know, there's a There's a lot of confusion out there, you know? I think there's a lot of marketing dollars spent that won't name many of the companies here. You know who they are, You know, the cloud Native Data Warehouse and it's true, you know their their software as a service. But if you talk to a lot of our customers, they're getting very good and very similar. experiences with Bernie comic. We stopped short of saying where software is a service because ultimately our customers have that control of flexibility there. They're putting verdict on whichever cloud they want to run it on, managing it. Stay tuned on that. I think you'll you'll hear from or more from us about, you know, that going going even further. But, um, you know, we do really well in the cloud, and I think he on so much of yang. And, you know, this has really been a sort of 2.5 years and never for us. But so much of eon is was designed around. The cloud was designed around Cloud Data Lakes s three, separation of compute and storage on. And if you look at the work that we're doing around container ization and a lot of these other elements, it just takes that to the next level. And, um, there's a lot of great work, so I think we're gonna get continue to get better at cloud. But I would argue that we're already and have been for some time very good at being a cloud analytic data platform. >>Well, since you open the door I got to ask you. So it's e. I hear you from a performance and architectural perspective, but you're also alluding two. I think something else. I don't know what you can share with us. You said stay tuned on that. But I think you're talking about Optionality, maybe different consumption models. That am I getting that right and you share >>your difficult in that right? And actually, I'm glad you wrote something. I think a huge part of Cloud is also has nothing to do with the technology. I think it's how you and seeing the product. Some companies want to rent the product and they want to rent it for a certain period of time. And so we allow our customers to do that. We have incredibly flexible models of how you provision and purchase our product, and I think that helps a lot. You know, I am opening the door Ah, a little bit. But look, we have customers that ask us that we're in offer them or, you know, we can offer them platforms, brawl in. We've had customers come to us and say please take over systems, um, and offer something as a distribution as I said, though I think one thing that we've been really good at is focusing on on what is our core and where we really offer offer value. But I can tell you that, um, we introduced something called the Verdict Advisor Tool this year. One of the things that the Advisor Tool does is it collects information from our customer environments on premise or the cloud, and we run through our own machine learning. We analyze the customer's environment and we make some recommendations automatically. And a lot of our customers have said to us, You know, it's funny. We've tried managed service, tried SAS off, and you guys blow them away in terms of your ability to help us, like automatically managed the verdict, environment and the system. Why don't you guys just take this product and converted into a SAS offering, so I won't go much further than that? But you can imagine that there's a lot of innovation and a lot of thoughts going into how we can do that. But there's no reason that we have to wait and do that today and being able to offer our customers on premise customers that same sort of experience from a managed capability is something that we spend a lot of time thinking about as well. So again, just back to the automation that ease of use, the going above and beyond. Its really excited to have an analytic platform because we can do so much automation off ourselves. And just like we're doing with Perfect Advisor Tool, we're leveraging our own Kool Aid or Champagne Dawn. However you want to say Teoh, in fact, tune up and solve, um, some optimization for our customers automatically, and I think you're going to see that continue. And I think that could work really well in a bunch of different wallets. >>Welcome. Just on a personal note, I've always enjoyed our conversations. I've learned a lot from you over the years. I'm bummed that we can't hang out in Boston, but hopefully soon, uh, this will blow over. I loved last summer when we got together. We had the verdict throwback. We had Stone Breaker, Palmer, Lynch and Mahoney. We did a great series, and that was a lot of fun. So it's really it's a pleasure. And thanks so much. Stay safe out there and, uh, we'll talk to you soon. >>Yeah, you too did stay safe. I really appreciate it up. Unity and, you know, this is what it's all about. It's Ah, it's a lot of fun. I know we're going to see each other in person soon, and it's the people in the community that really make this happen. So looking forward to that, but I really appreciate it. >>Alright. And thank you, everybody for watching. This is the Cube coverage of the verdict. Big data conference gone, virtual going digital. I'm Dave Volante. We'll be right back right after this short break. >>Yeah.

>> live from San Francisco, celebrating 10 years of high tech coverage. It's the Cube covering Veum World 2019. Brought to you by VM Wear and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back, everyone. Day three Q coverage here in San Francisco for V emerald. 2019. I'm just for a student, Um, in here with David Lan. Take days free kick off. We have two sets wall to wall coverage. Guys, this is the time where we get to take a deep breath two days under our belts look and reflect on all the news we've covered in a dark to last analysis sessions but also kind of riff on. We got two nights in hallway conversations we learned a lot of the party means do. I learned a lot last night. Dave. I know you. You learned a lots, do you, Thomas? When things that the chatter Certainly twittersphere hashtag the emerald. A lot of action on there, but it's the hallway conversations. It's the party that people have a few cocktails in them day that you start to hear the truth. The real deal comes out, >> No doubt. And and again Jon Stewart, there's real concern over from the from the practitioners we talked to about this acquisition spree. Are they going to be integrated? Are they going to just throw all this stuff at us and keep jamming products and service is down our throats? Or is this going to be a coherent set of solutions that solves our problem? We also had a little little interesting side conversation about, you know, Snowflake, Frank's lumens new company and how basically Frank is bringing back the Pirates from Data Domain and from service. Now Mike Scarpelli is over there. He's a rock star. CFO Beth White is eventually is back over there. And Frank's Lupin. He's the guy who takes companies from, you know, 100 million to a billion, so that's gonna be >> very serious money making him going on there. >> We have been following his career for a number of years now. We watched him take data domain. We watched him pull that that rabbit out of his hat with the sale with net app, and then the emcee swooped in. And then we saw what he did service. Now we've documented this is an individual to watch, you know, >> he's a world class management team member I mean, he's executes. >> Oh, yeah, no doubt. And >> he has >> a formula that's been proven and in time and time again. And to me, the biggest testament salute Min is the success of the continued success of Data Domain. After he left Hey, he really helped clean up the emcees data protection mess. Um, and then the second thing is, look at service now is performance after he left, I haven't missed a beat. And, yeah, John Donahoe, great executive and all, but it's because Frank's Lubin had everything in place and that was a really well run >> dry. And they got a nice little oracle like business model. >> Yeah. No, you're right. They kind of, you know, the big complaint now as well. Your price is too high that Oracle. >> What have you learned? What you hear in the hallways? I mean, a lot of chatter. >> Yes, John, we We've been reflecting back a lot. It's 10 years in 10th year of the Cube here and back here in San Francisco. The new Mosconi, our third show that I've been at this year in Mosconi and we always track year to year. But since it's been what 45 years since we were here for VM World. When I talked to the average vendor. When I talk to you know, the analysts here were like, Oh, thank goodness we're not in Vegas. When I talked to the average attendee, they're like, Oh my God, what happened to San Francisco since last time we were here? It is too expensive. And the experience walking around San Francisco has really not nearly as nice as it might have been five or 10 years ago. And many of them we were talking to, Ah, woman that runs an event that has been Vegas in San Francisco. And she said, Oh, we did in San Francisco and got tremendous feedback. Don't do it there again. Brings back to Vegas both for costs and the enjoyment of being around the environment. >> Where was a shit show here in San Francisco is horrible right now, I got to say to your right eye was walking this morning from my hotel. Literally. A homeless person passed out the middle of the sidewalk. Um, your smells like urine. It's P, and it's It's just I mean, it's really bad this tense now. I mean City of San Francisco is gonna do some. Mosconi, by the way, has been rebuilt. Awesome. So, you know, in terms of the new Mosconi stew, that's a serious upgrade. Hotel rooms are scarce and just the homeless problem. It's just ridiculous. I don't know what they're >> doing. So one of the other big things when I was reflecting coming into here two years ago when VM wear really started down right before the war on AWS announcement, they made a big announcement. IBM because they had sold off the cloud air toe Oh, VH And for two years Oh, VH was a big partner, Talked about that transition, said we handed off this great asset over h isn't here at the show. I was like, Oh, my gosh, you know, that was, you know, such a big story and other companies like New >> 12. That's good. One lets someone who's not at the show and why. Yeah, oh, VH wired to hear >> They aren't here because, well, they've got customers. More of them are in Europe That was supposed to be a big entry into the United States. Obviously, it wasn't as valuable for them to be here, even though I'm sure they're still part of that service provider ecosystem. They have other big one for us, and we've had on the Cube Nutanix. You know, we've had Dheeraj Pandey. First time we had him on was that this show is still the majority of Nutanix. Customers are VM where customers I've talked to lots of Nutanix customers at the event, even part of the analyst event. Some of the customers I talked to were like, Oh, yeah, my hardware stacks Nutanix and amusing NSX. And I'm using other things there. But they are not here. They're not allowed to be at the show. And I >> mean, they were blatantly told they can't come. >> They can't come here. They can't come to the regional things. They can't do the partner things. So that that that relationship is definitely >> from red hat. What kind of presence have you seen from Red s? >> So their number companies like red Hat that they're kept at a lower level of sponsorship. So they're here. They participate, you know. Open shift, of course, is you know, big enemy for cloud native. Lots of open shift runs on V sphere. So many of those companies that are part of the ecosystem, but not the ones that they want to celebrate and put front and forward. So it's always interesting kind of walk around on those. Even Microsoft is an interesting relationship for, you know, decades with the M wear. You know, of course, azure they partner with. But hyper V was long a competitors. So, you know, we understand those competitive relationships >> could be interesting. Stew and Dave on the ecosystem Jerry Chan Day when we just doing my interview yesterday on the other set mentioned that the ecosystem reinvents itself the community. The question now is with Delhi emceeing Del Technologies obviously heard Michael Dell essentially laying out his plan, which is he's got. He's trying to keep people distracted, but the bottom line is going to top people putting together the cloud right well service provider model. So you know, that's what he's gonna be a big impact. VM wear the crown jewel of Del Technologies certainly is looking more and more like It's >> well and yesterday remember the first VM world we did in 2010? It was It was del I mean course and see only the time Who's Del? It was H p Yes, the emcee was there, but it was net app. I mean, everybody could've had equal standing yesterday at the keynotes. It was Project Dimension of V M, where cloud on Delhi emcee and long keynotes >> data protection into the VM were >> also it's It's all very heavily, you know, Jeff Clarke has his his thumb on, you know, the the deli emcee folks pushing that through Veum where Michael is orchestrating the whole thing. Pat obviously is allowing it. I was sitting in the audience Next next, Some folks from Netapp they're like, you know, this kind of a bummer. Calvin Sito from h p e tweeted Wow how to stick it in the face of your ecosystem partners. He then later went on Facebook saying, Hey, I love this ecosystem, so sort of balancing it out because, you know, he wants to be a good, good citizen, but clearly the ecosystem partners who basically brought VM where you know, to the the position where it's in through distribution, our little ruffled. Right now you can't blame him, But at the same time, the mandate is clear. Michael Dell is driving his products and his solutions through VM were period the end. And, you know, if you don't like it, leave >> right. They had such great success with V San and VX rail in that joint product development and go to market. If they can replicate that with a number of other solutions, they get that the synergies. If >> you don't like it, don't leave. That leave is worse than that. They say you don't like it, you know, invited you. But >> how about what Pat said yesterday in the Cube about when they announced on Gwen heavily leaned into V san. He said publicly that Joe Tucci was pissed and I hate her. They were going at it so that so that shows you the change, right? I mean, so so so e m. C. When it owned VM where was very cautious about allowing Veum wears a software company to drive value somewhere Now is just acting like a software company. >> Well, I think I mean, I learned last night's do, um and you can appreciate this. I learned that the top executives of'em where are looking heavily and working hard at understanding and drive them kubernetes cloud native thing because this is not a throwaway deal. This is not a you know, far anything that they are investing. They get their top brass tech execs on kubernetes fto. Two big players job. Ada, Craig McCaw calumnies. We know interviews since day one, but I think the cloud native thing is going to be interesting. And I think it's gonna be evolution. I think there's gonna be a very dynamic road thing's gonna be a series, of course, corrections, but directionally they're all in on. They're going for it, they're not. >> And actually, I had a, you know, good discussion with Chad Attack. It's a good friend of the program now working at GM, where for the first time, but came from AMC worked at Pivotal. He said, culturally, such a gap between VM wear don't have to touch your app, you know, move everything along lifted shift is nice and easy versus pivotal, you know must go completely You know, dual programming, you know, agile everything there, so bridging those because there's multiple paths and the rail pharaoh announcement is that would be cloud native stuff that won't necessarily go to the EMS. We're going to retool V EMS to now be a platform for kubernetes so that they have a few passed to bridge or to build towards the future. Here's the >> answer strategy. Discussion That and Rayo Farrell was now running Cloud native. Think this is just really >> ties in the interesting discussion that I had with some folks was that you've essentially got well, Jerry Chen brought this up last time we had him on it and reinventing because >> we have >> a conversation all the time about this Amazon have to go up the stack. And Jerry Chen made a really he said, Look, it they're not They're not gonna become an e r peace offer company. What they're gonna do is give tools to the builders so that they can disrupt Europea. They can disrupt service. Now they can disrupt Oracle. That's their strategy, at least for now. Okay, so what does that say? I think the strategy discussion inside of'em were and and l is about by whatever clouds gonna be 35 to 50% of the market. Fine. And the cloud native abs. Great. But you got this mission critical. E r p is an example. Database saps that are on Prem. What we have to do is keep them there. So we're going to sell to the incumbents and we're going to give them cloud native tools, toe modernize. Those APS have build new acts on Prem, and that's the that is the collision course that's coming. So the big question is, can the cloud native guys and AWS disrupt that >> huge? I've always said I'm is on and like the way they're coming in, a tsunami is coming in. And who's gonna build that sea wall to stop it right? And that's essentially only hope that these guys have. You look at all the competitive strategy. Was Oracle. Whoever just gotta stop it? You can't like >> the sea >> wall. That's a great building. A sea wall I was, I would say, is Is that you know, they're only hope at this point is to, you know, get in the game because see Amazon is the stack. They're not really moving up the stack. You hear that from Cisco and Dale and other people? That's where it's a game of musical chairs. Right now, the music's you know, there's still a lot of shares left, but soon chairs getting pulled away and Cisco Deli emcee VM, where they're all fighting for these big chairs. And one >> thing >> we talked about yesterday is that VM wears very directional, product driven. Otherwise they pick a direction, is a statement of direction and don't really have a lot of meat on the bone. In the product side, Sister is actually in market with service providers there in market with NETWORKINGS to this no vapor there that's installed basis and incumbent business. You have developers Esso Baton talks about suffered to find data center, suffer defined networking. I mean, come on, Really. I mean, they're getting there, but it didn't have the complete solution. Cisco >> Coming into this week, I expected here a bit more about the progress and all the customers of'em wear on AWS and feel like Vienna actually downplayed the AWS. We know what a strong partnership it is at every Amazon show we go to, and we got a lot of them Now there's a big presence there, and I can talk to customers that are starting to roll out and move there, but it felt like it was David's. You pointed out there are some messaging differences when you talk about multi cloud and how they're positioning it. So, you know, put those >> here Amazon. If your Amazon you're not happy with Microsoft Dell Technologies World The big announcement that was positioned a cloud foundation Although it wasn't a joint engineering, But the press picked it up as though the Amazon deal has been replicated with Microsoft and Google. I mean, you gotta be gotta be hurt if your Amazon >> So I've I've just been taking notes this this event, there's I've noted at least five major points of difference between a W s what they're saying and their philosophy and the anywhere so eight of us. We know they they don't talk multi cloud. They've told their partners, If you're doing joint marketing with us, you cannot say multi cloud aws that reinforce John. We saw this. Steven Schmidt said that this narrative that security is broken doesn't help the industry. Security's not broken, you know, we're doing great. The state of the nation is wonderful. Aws Matt. Not really. I agree. By the way. Uh, that's not the case. I agree with Pat saying Security's broken. It's a do over VM where wants to be the best infrastructure and developer software company. Who's the best infrastructure and software development platform. Eight of us. The M one wants to be the security cloud. Who's the security cloud? Eight of us. And then, uh, they talked about 10,000 cloud data Listeners are those really cloud data centers at Vienna. And the last one was this was a little nuanced Veum was talking about We know about migrating, modernize, lifted ship shift and then modernize The empire's not talking about modernize and then migrate. If you want to. I totally in conflict >> as a collision course. That's got Look, look, look at the data center was Look, it looks like we're going. We're going away, right to the data center. Staying. That's music to Michael Dell's VM. Where's years they live in the Data City? Do you pointed out yesterday? Data Senate goes away. So does begin. Where's business? >> One of things. I'm surprised. I'm wondering you both have talked to some of the service fighter telco pieces of'em, where they're doing that project dimension, which is the VM where stack on del that looks just like outposts on. And I know they had deployments on this for months. If I was them, you know, it's everybody's hearing about Outpost to talk about it, being more like we're already doing it in. This has you in that Amazon ecosystem. It might be a little strong for the Amazon story, but have you been hearing any about that this week? >> I think they keep a lot of cards close to the chest, but it's clear from the announces that they're doing certainly del the VM, where on Delhi Emcee Cloud or whatever it's called, it's not a cloud but their their infrastructure that is essentially a managed service. That's gonna be really strong for I t. People, because I think that the value proposition of going toe i t and saying we have this, you don't need to do anything. It's very strong, I mean, because I didn't want him >> and justified because this the project to mention it is that single, that thinner stack like what we saw on Outpost in the Amazon video, as opposed to Veum, where cloud on AWS, which is the full C i r h d. I stack. >> I haven't heard anything still on >> well, but the conversation I had from from Vienna, where standpoint, they could make money on that manage service. That's why it's the preferred partnership, right? And so that's their part of their cloud play. If you don't have a public cloud, I said this yesterday, you have to redefine Cloud and you have to get into cloud service. And that's what's happening. And that's exactly what's happening. And what I like about what V M where is doing is they are transitioning their model to a sass based model. Now it's only 12 and 1/2 percent of the revenues today. But both pivotal and carbon black are gonna add, you know, ah, $1,000,000,000 next year to that subscription based $3 billion in year two. Um, and so you know, Pat said the other day, I think we could get to 50 50. I don't necessarily think in the near term we're gonna go beyond that. It's not the Adobe >> way could be critical. Critical of'em were in some areas, but I gotta tell you their core strength that they went to a software operators on the data center friend of prices. That's been a great strategy. Focusing on their core building from there is Jerry 10 point out adding other products so their software company, So I think they're really got a good solution. And you? The data shows that people are increasing their spending, John. Just one based on >> that. Because I had a couple of really good conversation with customers, customers that would deploy VCF So they've got the full stack on there. So using H C I, but not necessarily on Dell hardware, could be Cisco Hardware. Could be HB hardware in the like or they're buying NSX. But the virtual ization team owns it, and they get kind of put in. A box storage team says That's not the array I'm used to buy. Well, maybe I'll put a pure storage box and put it in between. The networking team says I'm refreshing my Cisco hardware. You know, we're like, but we have NSX, and it's great. Well, you can use NSX over there. We're going to use a C I over here. So the term I heard from a number of customers is organizations still have hardware to find roles, and they're trying to figure out how to move to that software world. Which hurts me, cause I spent years trying to get beyond silos and helping people you know, move through those environments. And still, in 2019 it's a big challenge. That organizational shift is we know how tough that is. >> So just couple points in the data, because you're right. There are some countervailing trends, though. So, yes, people are spending Maurin VM where in the second half. But at the same time, the data shows that cloud is hurting VM wear spend. So this that's kind of gets interesting. Our containers gonna kill VM where? No, there's no evidence that container's air hurting VM where spend. But there's clearly risks there, you know, as we've talked about who's best position of multi cloud. Well, it turns out three guys with the public cloud are best positioned in multi Google and Microsoft on, and so and then the pivotal thing is interesting, and ties ties all this in so that the data is actually really interesting. It's like you're seeing tugs at both sides, and I think your your notion about the seawall is dead on. That's exactly what they're doing. >> You see that with Oracle's trying to stop jet. I just want they can't win this one to stop Amazon just on the tracks gave great data. Great reporting, Stoop. Good observations. Get all the day that night and parties we're gonna certainly keep doing that. Day three of wall to wall coverage here. You bringing to the insights and interviews here live from the Emerald Twin 19. Stay with us for more after this short break.

>> live from San Francisco, celebrating 10 years of high tech coverage. It's the Cube covering Veum World 2019. Brought to you by IBM Wear and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome to our live coverage here in Mosconi North Lobby, Of'em World 2019. I'm John for a Student and a Volante celebrating our 10th VM World or 10 years of covering the M world. Dave's stew. What a run been Go back across Mosconi South 10 years ago with the green set. This is 10 years later. 10:10 p.m. World BMC Rule No longer the show, so that kind of folds in the Dell Technologies Man, The world's changed. Pat Nelson had just delivered his keynote as CEO Sanjay Poon and a CEO came on talk to customers stew. A lot of acquisitions, a lot of cloud native, a lot of cloud. 2.0, this is turning into VM. Wear 2.0, where vm zehr kind of only one part of the equation. So let's jump into the analysis, Dave. I mean, you put out some killer research on silken angle dot com, and we keep on dot com around customer spend still, we put out a lot of analysis on all the key trends that Vienna was playing into. Cloud two point. Oh, is what we're calling it. It's enterprise Cloud of fresh scale Day. What? What? What? What do you want? Your analysis, Latino >> John, when you go back. 10 VM Worlds ago, it was all about virtualization, completely changing the deployment dynamics. When when I first saw a VM deployed, I went, Oh, my God, This is gonna change everything. And it did. But while compared to now what's happening with cloud and a I we heard so much about five g. It was also the big, big difference in the ecosystem. Back when e. M. C owned VM wearing 2010 there was that sort of Chinese wall stew. You were working there, you know, just before that. And there wasn't a lot of, you know, swapping of I P, if you will. They were sort of treating them as unequal player to net app and everybody else out there. Tod Nielsen used to say, for every dollar spent on of'em were licensed, 15 spent an ecosystem. You don't hear that kind of narrative anymore, you hear we're crushing the HC. I vendor where number one basically a sort of backhand to Nutanix We heard on the on the keynote Very tight integration VX rail project Dimension So much, much tighter integration since Pat Tell Singer joined VM. Where from the emcee lots has changed >> will be a lot of research on reporting leading up to the show around Cloud two point. Oh, I'll see Dev. Ops is willing to home of the dimension on enterprise scale, the number of acquisitions of'em wears made and then, boom. They dropped two monsters on the table or the 11th hour pivotal for 2.7 billion carbon black for 2.1 billion. Lot of stories in those AK was other acquisitions, your analysis and how that played out today on the >> Kino. As Dave said when we started coming to this event back in 2010 you know, the virtual machine was the center of the universe. What were these servers that it lived on, how to storage and network and get fixed to be ableto live in that environment And the keynote. It was a lot of cloud, you know, John, we brought in a lot of the Cloud camp people that first year and some people were like, Why are we talking about Cloud? This is VM World, and we're like, Well, this is the future. And today we're not talking about V EMS at the center we're talking about containers were talking about cloud native applications, that multi cloud world absolutely something that pack l singer did. Front center actually felt it almost glossed over a little bit of the H C, I and NSX and all these wonderful things. Sure, there was some big del pieces in there. The M word cloud on Delhi emcee the Del Di are, you know, data protection, power protect, you know, into the VM where peace something that you definitely would not have seen under the old emcee Federation model. So Michael Dell, absolutely having his strong footprint here. Dave's done a lot of analysis talking about things like Pivotal getting pulled in and like so many different acquisitions, Pivotal came out of'em wear and, you know, carbon black Boston based companies so many different pieces here to get them talking about applications and where Veum, where the company sits in this multi cloud world where they're trying to be, you know, maintain their relationship with us. >> Let's get into the analysis on the whole ecosystems. I really want to dig into the work. Dave, you didn't and the team did. But let's go through the keynote first. So my personal opinion was it felt like, um, I'll give him a C plus Pat because it just didn't have a lot of meat. In my opinion, it felt like it was too much tech for good, although super important to have that mission driven stuff I think is really valuable as the market tends to look >> at tech >> as bad actors. I thought that was addressing. That was a positive thing, but it felt too much. I didn't see a lot of specifics. It felt do is and David, if they were hiding something, they were putting a lot of it didn't seem like there's a lot of substance coming out specifically around how Kubernetes was going to be impacted. Specifically, how Cooper is going to sit within the VM where ecosystem products specifically I just didn't feel like the product side was there. >> Well, you know what? I'll say it, John and General, I agree with you because Day one usually is here is the company vision. And if the vision is kubernetes, well, we've been hearing kubernetes for a bunch of years. Kubernetes is not the answer. Kubernetes is an enable ionizing technology job. Ada, who we up on stage? You know, we had him on the Cuban. He's like, look committed. This is not a magic layer. It's this thin layer that's gonna help us go between clouds. Getting into some of their future projects is something I usually would expect on Day two, the vision of V. M. Whereas a company, it feels like we're in that transition from who do you want a big tech for? Good? That that's great stuff. You know, Pat has a long history of talking about, you know, that moral compass that he has and wants the company to live. That which is a good change from many of the Silicon Valley companies. But, you know, I didn't get a strong feel for their vision and it was not >> a conservative. They didn't want to actually put a position down there because I think everyone in the hallway that I talked to wants to know how Cooper is gonna impact the sphere for instance, is gonna change the makeup of the sphere. And what's the impact on the product side the head that stat about bare metal being 8%. I was like, a little bit biased. Maybe there, So are they. They tiptoeing. Dave, you think? I mean, the spend numbers show that if you could just hold the line for 24 months and the new trends won't take away from that license, I mean, is it a tactical thing? Or do you think that here's the >> thing? I want to go back? I do want to give'em where? Props on one thing and you've used this term to If you go back to 8 4009 Paul Maritz talked about. We're building the software mainframe and passed them pretty consistent about that they used, they said, Any workload, any app? What's different today than back then is, he said, any workload, any up any cloud. Really. Cloud wasn't as much of a factor back then, but that vision has been fairly consistent it to you. Answer your question, Veum. We're spending remains strong, you know they're spending data that we shared with the GT R on silicon angle yesterday and today is that 41% of the VM were installed. Base is going to spend Maurine the second half of 2019 and only 7% are going to spend less. Okay, that's a real positive. But at the same time, the data clearly shows that cloud is negatively impacting VM wear spend and so that's a real threat. So multi club Pat said today technologists who Master Master Multi Cloud will own the next decade. He's talking to his audience. I'm not sure I agree with that. How much you're mastering Multi Cloud is what's gonna be the determining factor to own the next decade. >> Well, I'm stumped. Stick with my position. That multi cloud is not a reality. I think it's really more overhyped, and our actually just started to be hyped and probably will be then over hypes. And then seven years from now we'll start seeing multiple clouds truly interoperable. But I think multi cloud is we find on the Cuba simply enterprises have multiple vendors and multiple environments that happen to be those vendors have cloud, so I don't think it actually is an operating model yet. But again, just like on the Cube 2012 stew. We talked about hybrid Cloud. I called. I asked, yes. When was it a halfway house of the weigh station? He had a connection. >> So gassy. So, John, here's what I say. Number one is customers today absolutely have multiple clouds. But for multi cloud, to be a reality multi cloud must be greater than the sum of just the piece is that it's made up today and absolutely were not there. Today. VM wear has a strong reason why it should be at the center of that discussion. But they're gonna be right at loggerheads with Red Hat and Microsoft and Google and Cisco in that kind of debate at the multi cloud >> and we had, we had a story on our special report on silicon angle dot com. Check it out. It's called Coping With Multi Cloud. Were coping was by design. Coping as a mechanism used to deal with uncertainty. Coping strategies is what CEOs are going to deal with. But read that post. But in it I kind of see. I mean, I kind of agree and disagree. We have two perspectives, Dave developing. You want to get your thoughts butts do on this C I ose that come from a traditional I t background tend to like multi vendor things because they know they don't want lock. And they're afraid if you then swing to the progressive side si SOS, for instance, who are have a gun to their head in terms of security, they're all saying no, we're betting on one cloud and we'll have backup clouds, but our development staff is gonna build stacks. Have AP eyes, and we'll share those AP ice to our suppliers. Cloud vendors are saying Support our specs. So to spectrums the old school I t. Guys saying Multi vendor equals multi cloud. And then then, on the other end, See says to say, I'm gonna build technology and build a stack, exposed FBI's and let the clouds support my my tooling that not the other way around your thoughts. I >> pulled a quote in my piece That's on Silicon angle as well. From David. If lawyer and he was defining a hybrid multi cloud, he said, any application of application service can run on any note of the hybrid cloud without rewriting re compiling a re testing. My argument would be you're never gonna have that North Star without a high degree of homogeneity. And there's three examples of high degrees of homogeneity in hybrid Cloud. Today it's azure stack. It's clouded customer, and it's outposts. You're so this idea that we're gonna have this diverse set of clouds and yet they're all gonna run is one to me. I ask, Is it technically feasible? And is it Is it practical? >> Well, Steve, Steve Harry was on his Hey had announced the signal. FX has come. Portfolio can be sold on a big deal to split when he was on The Cube with me last week and he said one of them looking back on the 10 years that 1 may be M where great was virtual ization allowed for massive efficiencies and improvements without rewriting the apse. The question today's point is, is that a reality? Can what's next? So that that next gain that's not gonna require people to rewrite their APs >> well and that actually not rewriting the axes where VM or has its strength. Because, you know, I I made a joke during the keynote. It was like you have a V M insert magic. Congratulations. You now have a cloud workload because I just did. VM were cloud and it's the same app. But on the other hand, that's actually been my biggest dig on V M. Where is the long pole? In the tent and modernization is modernizing wraps. And that is that Tom Zoo that Veum were announced. They're taking bit Nami and pivotal because we do need to modernize the application. If you have an application, you've been running long enough that your users are complaining about it. We need to modernize that. VM wear has not been much of enabler of that pivotal. Yes, absolutely. That's what the cloud Foundry Labs, the pivotal Labs has been doing for years. It is a tough thing to do. That's what the developers we hear it Amazon. They're building new abs. I don't hear modern building new app at VM where, but they are moving in that >> direct question for you guys and John you in particular, but also used to as well followed AWS probably more closely than any two people I know, Pat said. Strength, lies and differences, not similarities. I've noted many differences in philosophy between A. W S and V M. where they're both winning in the market place. We know a divorce is growing much faster, but a divorce doesn't believe in multi cloud. A Devil's doesn't believe security is broken. That's that's VM wears narrative VM where says it wants to be the best infrastructure and develop our software company. That's kind of like eight of us is the platform for that. They both want to be the security cloud, and and VM were said today they have 10,000 cloud data centers, and I'm guessing that Andy Jassy wouldn't think that many of those data centers are cloud data centers. Your thoughts on the differences between between A. W S s philosophy and VM wears narrative. And can they both? Is there enough market for them both to win? >> Well, it's strikingly different. I mean, AWS is just in a breed of its own. VM wears hedging and playing there their bets. They're kind of putting, you know, bets on each horse, right? Interesting enough in the cloud thing. There was no mention of Google Cloud. I didn't see that mentioned there. Andi was speculation. Wouldn't Oracle be great partnering with Google? That's not a rumor. I'm just kind of put it out there. That would be a good combination partnership, given the Oracle's cloud is failing miserably, I think v M. Where because of the operating leverage in the enterprise, has that operational layer down to me, Amazon is the model, the future, because they are clearly born with a dev ops mindset. They have an environment where developers can build applications and they could operate. It scale with all the efficiencies of operations. So I think cloud to foreigners were calling. It is all about having developers and operational excellence without a lot of disruption or re platforming. So I think that's where the differences are. You have company that have toe have to work with this world of legacy applications, and that requires first lift and shift, which doesn't become attractive. Then you add containers on the game changes. So I think container ization really was, I think, the seminal moment in the shift where where you got kubernetes and containers. So let the enterprise cloud. Native guys get in and have an operational framework that takes advantage of the horsepower of public cloud, which is computing storage, which is why we think networking and security will be the absolute focus areas for Cloud two point. Oh, and Amazon is just dominating the depth and the ops. And I don't think anyone is coming close. >> I'd love to hear your thoughts, too, but I just got caught. I don't think Oracles Cloud is failing miserably. I think it's I wouldn't say it that way. I think their infrastructures of service is irrelevant and the cloud is all about SAS. But just, you know, that's what I think. Waken debate that somebody >> has been great for the Oracle customers. But in terms of all metrics in terms of public and enterprise, cloud with multiple environments nonstarter. >> So there's a bit of a schism out there if you talk to customers. There are many customers when they deploy in Public Cloud, although uses, you know, compute storage and, like the identity management and that's it. And they'll stop and I talkto you con many customers that are using kubernetes so that if they want to hit the eject button, but they're all on Amazon today, so it's not like they're all fleeing Amazon or doing it. But we talked to lots of developers that are deep in aws they're using those service is they're using Lambda and they're building it. So how deep will they go? And that's where I look at this VM we're offering. And it's if I'm gonna take the sphere and extend that with kubernetes. I saw Cuba. Well, um, actually in the Twitter stream said it is, you know, cloud lock in to Dato is what we get if we do that. Because the whole reason VM were originally created called Foundry. So they didn't have to take that entire V's fear colonel and put it everywhere. So it's a nice bridge. That van, where has the partnership they have with AWS is a great strategy. But I still think it is a bridge to an ultimate solution where they'll still use the M where the embers not going anyway. But that shift of where my application live in what service is I do is going to change a lot over the next 3 to 5. >> Let's not lose sight, Dave, of where we are in the industry. I mean, we're at VM World 2019. We go to reinvents coming up. We kind of live in a tech bubble in the sense that all this stuff is all kind of great skating to where the puck is gonna be. But the reality is in most I tea shops, and again, I use ceases as a proxy in my mind, because they're in the cutting edge of all the real critical nature of security, of the impact that harm that could happen to a company. So I look at sea. So she's more of a canary in the coal mine for trends than the nutritional CEO. At this point, most enterprises are just trying to rationalize kubernetes, generally speaking like never mind, like making a centerpiece of their entire architecture. They're looking at their existing environment saying, Hey, I got V EMS that did great for me. Serve a consolidation enabled more efficiency, not rewriting code. Now what? I gotta do kubernetes and do all this other stuff. How do I suspect my VM with kubernetes? Is it on bare metal? So I think we're way ahead right now. In the narrative, I think the reality is that people catch up. That's where the proof is gonna come into. That's why the customer survey numbers are interesting. >> Keep keep. Townsend is set on the Cube VM, where moves at the speed of the CEO, so they're not moving too far ahead of them, but they are key heating up with them. >> Let me share some data to share some data so you could go to Silicon Angle. Look at the V M World 2019 90 spending survey containers, Cloud NSX and pivotal its data from Enterprise Technology Research that we analyzed. There's no evidence right now that Container's air hurting VM wear. But then that was the narrative that containers are gonna kill the M where but long term. There's real threats there. So that's what the pivotal acquisition, at least in part was about. I want to address the pivotal acquisition cause we haven't dug into it a little bit a cz, Much as I'd like to see. There's really three things there. One pivotal was struggling. You look at the stock price, you look at their buying patterns, you know the stock was down that not even close to their original AIPO price, so they wanted to get out of the public eye right now would not be on that 30 day shot clock. The second is it's a hedge on containers. And the third is it's a financial scheme. I mean, I'll call it that VM wears paying $800 million in cash for an asset that's worth $4 billion. How can that be? Well, they already owned 15% of pivotal there. Give. They're exchanging stock. So their trade trading paper to Adele in exchange for Dell's 70% ownership in Pivotal. So they pick up this asset, and it's basically a forced migration by Michael Del, who controls 96% of the voting shares. So there's all kinds of inside nuance going on there that nobody's really talked about it a >> great deal for Of'em. Where and Michael Dell? It's >> a very good deal for VM wear and Michael Dell. >> Let's unpack that are rapidly. >> Just did the one piece on that, right, because kubernetes it was the elephant, the room that was damaging what Pivotal was doing. VM were made a couple of acquisitions VM where needs to react at, so it made sense to pull out back in. Even if it does go against some of the original mission, that Cloud Foundry and Pivotal had to be able to be that cloud native without that full strong time, >> it's all about building apse, right? It's all about enabling developers. >> Let's on that note. Let's go around the horn and talk about what we expect from the emerald this year. And then we'll kick off three days of wall to wall coverage. I'll start, I expect. And I'm not looking for is how VM wear and its ecosystem and who's really deep in the ecosystem, who's kind of independent and neutral, what they're doing with their containers and kubernetes play. Because I think the container revolution that was started with Dr Absolutely is very relevant to the C i o and the Sea. So so and then how they're using data in that in their applications. So you know how VM Way wants to position themselves on the control plane, how that fits in the NSX. I think containers in the container ization is going to change. I think bare metal is gonna be a super important topic in the next couple of years. Dio I'm kind of swinging back to the my feeling that you know, hyper convergence what it did for server storage networking back when you were calling those those moves. I think that kind of hyper convergence mentality is coming up the stack, and I think Containers and the Kubernetes Chess Board will will play out. >> I think if you my feelings, if you don't own a public cloud, you better convince your customers in your ecosystem that the future is in our definition of cloud, which is multi cloud. And that's what this VM world to me is all about. >> Yeah, you know, Veum wears taking their software state and trying to live in all of those cloud world. So you know, V. Amar has 600,000 customers and they want to be the ones to educate them on the kubernetes containers. You know you're at modernization, but there's a lot of other places customers can learn about this. No one understand where VM wear really adds value beyond all of those pieces, because all the cloud platforms have their kubernetes. >> A lot of other places, like the public cloud. That's where all the action >> exactly comes back down the cloud 2.0 Dev and ops developers and operations all come together with software. Thank you. Breaking it down here for three days. Wall to wall coverage here in Moscow north to set celebrating our 10th year covering VM World. Thanks for watching stay with us from or action after this short break.

>> fly from San Francisco. It's the Cube covering Google Cloud next nineteen Rodeo by Google Cloud and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back to San Francisco, everybody. This is the Cube, the leader in live tech coverage. And we hear it. Mosconi Center, Google Cloud. Next twenty nineteen. Hashtag Google. Next nineteen. I'm Dave, along with my co host student, Amanda's Day two for us. Anthony Lives here. Senior vice president, general manager of the Cloud Data Services Business Unit That net app Cuba Lawman Louis Versi. Who's senior cloud engineer at Cloud Health. Gentlemen. Welcome, Cardinal. Help that I got cloud in the brain. Gentlemen, welcome to the Cube. Thank you much for coming on, Luis. Let's start with you. Uh, a little bit about Cardinal Health. What you guys air are all about. Tell us about the business. Sure. >> Uh, Cardinal Health is a global supply chain medical products services company. We service hospitals, pharmacies throughout the world. We're drivers are delivering cost effective solutions to our two patients right throughout the world. >> Awesome. We're gonna get into that, Anthony, you've been in the Cube a couple times here almost a year since we were last at this show. it's grown quite a bit. Good thing Mosconi is new and improved. He's got all these new customers here. Give us the update. On what? Look back a year, What's transpired? One of the highlights for you. >> Open it up. You know, we've achieved a tremendous amount. I mean, you know, we were a Google partner of the year, which was quite nice. Wasn't even award for the hard work? You know, we have a very special relationship with Google. We actually engineer directly into the Google console, our services that their products that are sold by Google, which gives us a very unique value proposition. We just keep adding, you know, we have more services and we had more regions on. We continue to sort of differentiate the basic services that that customers are now using for secondary workloads and increasingly very large primary work. Look all >> right, we're going to get into it and learn more about the partnership. But but thinking about what's going on, a cardinal health question for you, Lewis is one of the drivers in your business that are affecting your technology strategy and how you're dealing with those. >> Sure, there's a few things on. I'm sure this is the same in many industries, right? We're facing cost pressures. We need to deliver solutions at a lower cost than we have been in the past. We need to move faster. We need to have agility to be able to respond to changes in the market place. So on Prem doesn't didn't give us a lot of that flexibility to turn those lovers in any of those three areas that those three things have really driven our push into the cloud. All >> right, Louis, let let's dig into that a little bit. You could kind of Do you still have on Prem as part of your solution way? Still have >> some eso We've been working over the past two years to my great work loads out of our data center into the cloud. We're about eighty percent of the way there. There's gonna be some workloads. I Siri's doesn't run in the cloud. Very well. You know, we've got Cem >> Way. Were just joking about that earlier today. Yes, yes, yes. Lots of things. But in the back corner somewhere, I've got that icier running or the day working on that Anthony way. >> Blessed with blessed. You know, this is a customer of ours, and way enabled him to run some, you know, pretty heavy on Prem workloads that required NFS can now run, you know, production on Google clouds. So >> yeah, and you're basically trying to make that experience Seamus Wright A cz muchas. You can wait. Talk about that. That partnership with Google, What are the challenges that you guys are tryingto tackle? I'm just going to refer to your >> question. I mean, you know, what we see is that there's a sort of a pivot with the clouds that traditional i t people thought horizontally and they try and sort of you had a storage team and you had a security team and you had a networking team in the cloud. It's sort of pivots ninety degrees, and you have people who don't work clothes on the workload. People are experts in every single thing, and so they go to the cloud, assuming that the cloud itself will take care of a lot of that problem for So we worked with Google and we built a service. We didn't We didn't build it for a storage guy tow, configure. And you know it undo the bolts and nuts way built it like dial tone. That there is. The NFS is always on in Google Cloud and you come and provisioned an end point and you just tell us how much capacity you want and how much performance. And that's it. It takes about eight seconds to establish a volume in Ghoul Cloud that may take through, you know, trouble tickets, and I t capital purchases about six months to do. >> Yeah, Anthony. Actually, one of my favorite interviews last year is I talked to Dave Hits at your event, and he talked about when we first started building it. We build something that storage people would love, and you shot him down and said, No, no, no, This needs to be a cloud first Clouds absolution. Louis, I want to poke at you. You actually said Price is a main driver for cloud agility. Absolutely. But bring this inside a little bit. I know you're speaking at the show a year. You know, people always say, it's like, Hey, you know, cloud isn't easy. Is it cheap? Well, you know, Devil's in the details there. So would love to hear your experience there. And you know how you know less expensive translates in your world? Sure. >> So when we were looking for something, we tried to get away from Nasim. We're moving to the cloud and we just can't do it right There's way have a lot of cots, applications, a lot of processes that you just have to have known as right and we're looking for something Is Anthony described that with a click of a button are developers Khun spin up their own storage. The price point was lower than then. Frankly, you could get just provisioning the type of disk that you need in the cloud fur, and that was acceptable for most of our workloads. The the the ability to tear right. There's through three classes of storage and in the cloud volume services. Most of our workloads are running on the standard tear, but we've got some workloads where they've got higher performance and we provisioned them right on the standard. And when that you're doing, they're testing like, hey, we need a little bit more with a click of a button there at a higher tier of storage. No downtime, no restarting, no moving storage. It's I just worked. So the cost, the agility were getting all of that out of the solution to >> manage those laces, that sort of, ah, sort of automated way or you sort of monitoring things. And what's the process for for managing, which slays the slaves on the different tiers of storage. If >> we provide him, Yeah, we're not. We're not money for s. >> So it's all automated. >> Run it. And we stand by guarantees throughput guarantees on we take the pain away. You know, I always like to say, you know, what people want to do in the public cloud is innovate, not administrator. And generally, you know. So when when people say clouds cheaper, it's because I think they've decided that they're better use of the dollar is in application development, data science, and then they can retire people and put application developers into the business. So what ghoul does, I think incredibly well as it has infrastructure to remove the sort of the legacy barrier and the traditional stuff. And then it has this wonderful new innovation that, you know, maybe a few companies in the world could decide could use it. But most people couldn't afford to put TP use or GP use in their data center, so they know he was really two very strong Valley proposition. >> And maybe what they're saying is when they say the cloud is cheaper, maybe is better are why I'm spending money elsewhere. That's give me a better return. >> I do things that make you different. Not the same, right, >> right, right. So storage strategy. I mean, I'm sure there should be such a thing anymore. Work illustrated back in the day when used to work A DMC was II by AMC for Block Net out for file Things have changed in terms of how you run a strategy. Think about your business. So what is your strategy when you think about infrastructure and storage and workloads? >> So we really don't want to have to focus on an infrastructure strategy, right? Right now we're mostly running traditional workloads in the cloud running on PM's. We're working towards getting a lot of work loads into geeky, using that service and in Google Cloud platform, >> so can you just step back for a second? How do you end up on Google? Why'd you choose them versus some of the alternative out there. >> So we started our cloud journey a couple of years ago. Started out with really the main cloud player in town, like most people have. Um, and about a year in, not all of our needs were being met. You know, they that company entered decided to enter our business segment. S O, you know, starts asking some questions. People start asking some questions there. So that prompted us to do an r f p to try to see technologically really, were we on the right cloud cloud platform? And we compared the top three cloud providers and ended up on GP from a technological decision, not just a business decision. It gave us the ability to have a top level organization where we could provisioned projects to application teams. They could work autonomously within those projects, but we still had a shared VPC, a shared network where we could put Enterprise Guard rails in place to protect the company. >> Dominic Price was on earlier with Google and he was saying some nice things about net happened. I'd like to hear your perspective is why Ned App What's unique about Nana. What's so special about net app in the cloud. Sure, a few of the >> things that Anthony talked about were really differentiators for us. We didn't have to go sign a Pio with another company, and we didn't need to commit to a certain amount of storage. We didn't need to build our own infrastructure. Even in the cloud, the service was just there. You do a little bit of up front, set up to connect your networking and weaken prevision storage whenever we want. We can change the speed the through. Put that we're getting on that storage at any point in time. We congrats. That storage with no downtime. Those are all things that were really different and other solutions that were out there. >> I mean, it's interesting infrastructure. Tio was really still even in a cloud. It's kind of like a bunch of Lego blocks on what we always said it was. You know, people want to buy the pirate ship, you know, they don't want to, like, have to dig in all these bins. And so we sort of said, Let's build storage, Kind of like a pirate ship that you just know that the end result is a pirate ship and I don't have to understand how to pick a ll Those pieces. Someone's done that for me. So, you know, we're really trying, Teo. I was I'd say we like to create easy buns. You know, people just hit the easy button and go. Someone else is going to make sure it's there. Someone else is going to make sure it performs. I am just a consumer off it, >> Anthony Wave talkto you and Ned app. You play across all the major cloud providers out there and you've got opinion when it comes to Kerber Netease, Help! Help! Help! Give us the you know where what you think about what you've heard this weekend. Google. You know, I think how they differentiate themselves in the market. >> You know, I think it's great, you know, that Google, I think open source community. So I think that was a ninja stry changing event. And, you know, I think community's really starts to redefine application development. I think portability is obviously a big thing with it, But But for an application, developer of the V. M. Was something that somebody added afterwards, and it was sort of like, Oh, no way overboard infrastructure. So now we'Ll virtual eyes it But the cost of virtual izing things was so expensive, you know, you put a no s in a V m and communities was, was built and was sort of attracted to the developer. And so the developers are coding and re factoring, and I just You just look around now and you just see the ground swell on Cuban cnc f is here, and the contributions that were being made to communities are astonishing. It's it's reached a scale way bigger than Lennox. The amount of innovation that's going into cos I think is unstoppable. Now it's it's going to be the standard if it isn't already >> Well, Louis, I'd love you to expand. You said it sounded like you moved to the cloud first, but now you're going down that application modernization, you know, how does Cooper Netease fit into that? And what what other pieces? Because it's changing the applications and get me the long pole in the tent and modernization. So >> cardinal took the approach of we need to get everything into the cloud. And then we can begin modernizing our applications because if we tried to modernize everything up front, would take us ten to fifteen years to get to the cloud, and we couldn't afford to do that. So lifting and shifting machines was about seventy eighty percent of our migration to the cloud. What we're looking at now is modern, modernizing some of her applications R E commerce solution will be will be running on Cooper. Nettie is very shortly on DH will be taking other workloads there in the future. That's definitely the next step. The next evolution >> Okuda Cloud or multi Cloud? That is the question way >> are multi cloud. There are, you know, certain needs that can only be met in certain clouds, right? So Google Cloud is our primary cloud provider. But we're also also using Amazon for specific >> workloads and used net up across those clouds erect. Okay, so is that What's that like? Is that nap experience across clouds so still coming together? Is it sort of highly similar? What's experience like? >> So it's it's using that app in both solutions is the same. I think there's some stuff that we're looking forward to, that where where things will be tied together a little bit more and >> that brings me to the road map Question. That's Please get your best people working on that. >> Oh, yeah. No, no. I mean, I So, look, I think storages that sort of wonderful business because, you know, data is heavy, it's hard, it doesn't like to be moved, and it needs to be managed. It's It's the primary asset of your business these days. So So we have we have, you know, we released continuously new features onto the service. So, you know, we've got full S and B nfs support routing an FSB four support routing a backup service. We're integrating NFS into communities, which is a very frequently asked response. A lot of companies developers want to build ST collapse and Block has a real problem when the container failed. NFS doesn't So we're almost seeing a renaissance with communities and NFS So So you know, we just we subscribe to that constant innovation and we'll just continue to build out mohr and more services that that allow I think cloud customers to, as I said, to sort of spend their time innovating while we take care of the administration for them >> two thousand six to floor. And I wrote a manifesto on storage is a service. Yeah, I didn't know it. Take this long, but I'm glad you got there. Last question, Lewis. Cool stuff. You working on fun projects? What's floating your boat these days? >> My time these days is, uh, the cloud. As I said, we went to the cloud for cost for cost savings. You can spend more money than you anticipate in the cloud. I know it's a shocker. So that's one of the things that I'm focusing our efforts on right now is making sure that way. Keep those costs under control. Still deliver the speed and agility. But keep an eye on those things >> that they put a bow on. Google next twenty nineteen. Partner of the year. That's awesome. Congratulations. Thank >> you. Uh, you know, I would say, you know, to put in a bone it's great to see Thomas again. You know, I went to Thomas that Oracle for about six and a half years. He's an incredibly bright man on DH. I think he's going to do a lot of really good things for Google. As you know, I work for his twin brother, George on DH. They are insanely bright people and really fun to work with. So for me, it was great to come up here and see Thomas and I shook hands when we won the award, and it was kind of too really was like, you know, we're both in a Google event. >> Yeah, it was fun. I'm gonna make an observation. I was saying the studio in the Kino today. They were both Patriots fans. So Bill Bala check. He has progeny. Coaches leave. They try to be him. It just doesn't work. Thomas Curie is not trying to be Larry. I'm sure they, you know, share a lot of the same technical philosophies and cellphone. But he's got his own way of doing things in his own style. So I really it's >> a great Haifa. Google great >> really is. Hey, guys, Thanks so much for coming to the cure. Thank you. Keep right, everybody Day Volante with student meant John Furry is also in the house. We're here. Google Next twenty nineteen, Google Cloud next week Right back. Right after this short break

>> Live from Barcelona, Spain, it's theCUBE, covering Cisco Live Europe. Brought to you by Cisco and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back to Barcelona, everybody. You're watching theCUBE, the leader in live tech coverage. My name is Dave Vellante. I'm here with my cohost, Stu Miniman. This is day one of Cisco Live Barcelona. Katie Colbert is here. She's the vice president of alliances at Pure Storage, and she's joined by Kaustubh Das, otherwise known as KD, who's the vice president of computing systems at Cisco. Katie and KD, welcome to theCUBE, good to see you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Alright, so let's start off, KD2, if you could just tell us about the partnership. Where did it start, how did it evolve? We'll get into it. >> We just had a terrific partnership, and the reason it's so great is it's really based on some foundational things that are super compatible. Pure Storage, Cisco, both super technology-driven companies, innovating. They're both also super programmatic companies. They'll do everything via API. It's very modern in that sense, the frameworks that we work on. And then from a business perspective, it's very compatible. We're chasing common markets, very few conflicts. So it's been rooted in solid foundations. And then, we've actually invested over the years to build more and more solutions for our customers jointly. So it's been terrific. >> So, Katie, I hate to admit how long we talk about partnering with Cisco >> It's going to age us. >> So you and I won't admit how many decades it's been partnering with Cisco, but here we are, 2019, Cisco's a very different company than it was a decade or two ago. >> Absolutely. >> Tell me what it's like working with them, especially as a company that's primarily in storage and data at Pure, what it means to partner with them. >> Absolutely, you're right. So, worked with Cisco as a partner for many years at the beginning of my career, then went away for, I'd say, a good 10 years, and joined Pure in June, and I will tell you one of the most exciting reasons why I joined Pure was the Pure and Cisco relationship. When I worked with them at the beginning of my career, it was great and I would tell you it's even better now. I will say that the momentum that these two companies have in the market is very phenomenal. A lot of differentiation from our products separately, but both together, I think that it's absolutely been very successful, and to KD's point, the investment that both companies are making really is just astronomical, and I see that our customers are the beneficiaries of that. It makes it so much easier for them to deploy and use the technologies together, which is exciting. >> So we always joke about Barney deals, I love you, you love me, I mean, it's clear you guys go much much deeper than that. So I want to probe at that a little bit. Particularly from an engineering standpoint, whether it's validated designs or other innovations that you guys are working on together, can we peel the onion on that one a little bit? Talk about what you guys are doing below that line. >> I'll start there then I'll hand it over to the engineering leader from Cisco. But if you think about the pace of this, the partnership, I think, is roughly 3 or so years old. We've 16 Cisco-validated designs for our FlashStack infrastructure. So that is just unbelievable. So, huge amount of investment from engineers, product managers, on both sides of the fence. >> Yeah, totally second that. We start out with the... Cisco-validated designs are like blueprints, so we start out with the blueprints for the standard workloads: Oracle, SAP. And we keep those fresh as new versions come out. But then I think we've taken it further into new spaces of late. ACI, we saw in the keynote this morning, it's going everywhere, it's going multi-site. We've done some work on marrying that with the clustering service of Pure Storage. On top of that, we're doing some work in AI and ML, which is super exciting, so we got some CBDs around that that's just coming out. We're doing some work on automation, coupling Intersight, which is Cisco's cloud-based automation suite, with Pure Storage and Pure Storage's ability to integrate into the Intersight APIs. We talked about it, in fact, I talked about it in my session at the Cisco Live in the summer last year, and now we've got that out as a product. So tremendous amount of work, both in traditional areas as well as some of these new spaces. >> Maybe we can unpack that Intersight piece a bit, because people might look at it initially and say, "Okay, multi-cloud, on-prem, all these environments, "but is this just a networking tool?" And working we're working with someone with Pure, maybe explain a little bit the scope and how, if I'm a Pure administrator, how I live into this world. >> Absolutely, so let's start with what is Intersight, just for a foundational thing. Intersight is our software management tool driven from the cloud. So everything from the personality of the server, the bios settings, the WLAN settings, the networking and the compute pieces of it, that gets administered from the cloud, but it does more. What it does is it can deliver playbooks from the cloud that give the server a certain kind of personality for the workload that it's supporting. So then the next question that anyone asks is, "Now that we have this partnership, "well can it do the same thing for storage? "Can it actually provision that storage, "get that up and running?" And the answer is yes, it can, but it's better because what it can not only do is, not only can it do that, getting that done is super simple. All Pure Storage needed to do was to write some of those Intersight APIs and deliver that playbook from the cloud, from a remote location potentially, into whatever your infrastructure is, provisioning compute, provisioning networking, provisioning storage, in a truly modern cloud-driven environment, right? So I think that's phenomenal what it does for our customers. >> Yeah, I'd agree with that. And I think it'll even become more important as the companies are partnering around our multi-cloud solutions. So, as you probably saw earlier this year in February, sorry, the end of 2018, Pure announced our first leaning into hybrid cloud, so that's Pure Cloud Data Services. That enables us to have Purity, which is our operating system on our storage, running in AWS to begin with. So you can pretty easily start to think about where this partnership is going to go, especially as it pertains to Intersight integration. >> And just to bounce on that, strategically, you can see the alignment there as well. I mean, Cisco's been talking about multi-cloud for a bit now, we've done work to enable similar development environments, whether we're doing something on-prem or in the cloud, so that you can move workloads from one to the other, or actually you can make workloads on both sides talk to each other, and, again, combined with what Katie just said, it makes it a really really compelling solution. >> Like you said, you've got pretty clear swimming lanes for the two companies. There's very little overlap here. You can't have too many of these types of partnerships, right, I mean, you got 25 thousand engineers almost, but still, you still have limited resources. So what makes this one so special, and why are you able to spend so much time and effort, each of you? >> I could start, so from a Pure perspective, I think the cultures are aligned, you called it out there, there's inherently not a lot of overlap in terms of where core competencies are. Pure is not looking at all to become a networking company. And just a lot of synergies in the market make it one that our engineers want to invest in. We have really picked Cisco as our lean-in partner, truthfully, I run all of the alliances at Pure, and a lion's share of my resources really are focused at that partnership. >> Yeah, and if you look at both these companies, Pure is a relative youngster among the storage companies, a new, modern, in a good way, a new, modern company built on modern software practices and so forth. Cisco, although a pretty veteran company, but Cisco compute is relatively new as well as a compute provider. So we are very similar in how our design philosophies work and how modern our infrastructures are, and that gets us to delivering results, delivering solutions to our customers with relatively less effort from our engineers. And that pace of innovation that we can do with Pure is not something we can do with every other company. >> We had a session earlier today, and we went pretty deep into AI, but it's probably worth touching on that. I guess my question here is, what are the customers asking you guys for in terms of AI infrastructure? What's that infrastructure look like that's powering the machine and intelligence era? >> You want to start? >> You want to go, I'll go first. This is a really exciting space, and not only is it exciting because AI is exciting, it's actually exciting because we've got some unique ingredients across Pure and Cisco to make this happen. What does AI feed on? AI feeds on data. The model requires that volume of data to actually train itself We've got an infrastructure, so we just released the C4ATML, the UCC4ATML, highly powered infrastructure, eight GPUs, interconnected, 180 terabytes on board, high network bandwidth, but it needs something to feed it the data, and what Pure's got with their FlashBlade is that ability to actually feed data to this AI infrastructure so that we can train bigger models or train these models faster. Makes for a fantastic solution because these ingredients are just custom made for each other. >> Anything you can add? >> Absolutely I'd agree with that. Really, if you look at AI and what it needs to be successful, and, first of all, all of our customers, if they're not thinking about it, they should be, and I will tell you most of them are, is, how do you ingest that amount of data? If you can't ingest that quickly, it's not going to be of use. So that's a big piece of it, and that's really what the new Cisco platform, I mean, the folks over at Pure are just thrilled about the new Cisco product, and then you take a look at the FlashBlade and how it's able to really scale out unstructured data, object it and file, really to make that useful, so when you have to scrub that data to be able to use it and correlate it, FlashBlade is the perfect solution. So really, this is two companies coming together with the best of breed technologies. >> And the tooling in that world is exploding, open source innovation, it needs a place to run all the Kafkas and the Caffes and the TensorFlows and the Pythons. It's not just confined to data scientists anymore. It's really starting to seep throughout the organization, are you seeing that? >> Yeah. >> What's happening is you've got the buzzwords going around, and that leads to businesses and the leaders of businesses saying, "We've got to have an AI strategy. "We've got to hire these data scientists." But at the same time, the data scientists can get started on the laptop, they can get started on the cloud. When they want to deploy this, they need an enterprise class, resilient, automated infrastructure that fits into the way they do their work. You've got to have something that's built on these components, so what we provide together is that infrastructure for the ITTs so that the data scientists, when they build their beautiful models, have a place to deploy them, have a place to put that into production, and can actually have that life cycle running in a much more smooth production-grade environment. >> Okay, so you guys are three years in, roughly. Where do you want to take this thing, what's the vision? Give us a little road map for the future as to what this partnership looks like down the road. >> Yeah, so I can start. So I think there's a few different vectors. We're going to continue driving the infrastructure for the traditional workloads. That's it, that's a big piece that we do, we continue doing that. We're going to drive a lot more on the automation side, I think there's such a lot of potential with what we've got on Intersight, with the automation that Pure supports, bring those together and really make it simple for our customers to get this up and running and manage that life cycle. And third vector's going to be imparting those new use cases, whether it be AI or more data analytics type use cases. There's a lot of potential that it unleashes for our customers and there's a lot of potential of bringing these technologies together to partner. So you'll see a lot more of that from us. I don't know, will you add something? >> Yeah, no, I absolutely agree. And I would say more FlashStack, look for more FlashStack CVDs, and AI, I think, is one to watch. We believe Cisco, really, this step that Cisco's made, is going to take AI infrastructure to the next level. So we're going to be investing much more heavily into that. And then cloud, from a hybrid cloud, how do these two companies leverage FlashStack and all the innovation we've done on prem together to really enable the multi-cloud. >> Great, alright, well Katie and KD, thanks so much for coming to theCUBE. It was great to have you. >> Great. Thanks for having us. >> Thank you very much. >> You're welcome, alright. Keep it right there everybody. Stu and I will be back with our next guest right after this short break. You're watching theCUBE Live from Cisco Live Barcelona. We'll be right back. (techy music)

>> Live from Barcelona, Spain, it's The Cube, covering Cisco Live Europe. Brought to you by Cisco and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back to Barcelona, everybody. You're watching The Cube, the leader in live tech coverage. My name is Dave Vellante. I'm here with my cohost, Stu Miniman. This is day one of Cisco Live Barcelona. Katie Colbert is here. She's the vice president of alliances at Pure Storage, and she's joined by Kaustubh Das, otherwise known as KD, who's the vice president of computing systems at Cisco. Katie and KD, welcome to The Cube, good to see you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Alright, so let's start off, KD2, if you could just tell us about the partnership. Where did it start, how did it evolve? We'll get into it. >> We just had a terrific partnership, and the reason it's so great is it's really based on some foundational things that are super compatible. Pure Storage, Cisco, both super technology-driven companies, innovating. They're both also super programmatic companies. They'll do everything via API. It's very modern in that sense, the frameworks that we work on. And then from a business perspective, it's very compatible. We're chasing common markets, very few conflicts. So it's been rooted in solid foundations. And then, we've actually invested over the years to build more and more solutions for our customers jointly. So it's been terrific. >> So, Katie, I hate to admit how long we talk about partnering with Cisco >> It's going to age us. >> So you and I won't admit how many decades it's been partnering with Cisco, but here we are, 2019, Cisco's a very different company than it was a decade or two ago. >> Absolutely. >> Tell me what it's like working with them, especially as a company that's primarily in storage and data at Pure, what it means to partner with them. >> Absolutely, you're right. So, worked with Cisco as a partner for many years at the beginning of my career, then went away for, I'd say, a good 10 years, and joined Pure in June, and I will tell you one of the most exciting reasons why I joined Pure was the Pure and Cisco relationship. When I worked with them at the beginning of my career, it was great and I would tell you it's even better now. I will say that the momentum that these two companies have in the market is very phenomenal. A lot of differentiation from our products separately, but both together, I think that it's absolutely been very successful, and to KD's point, the investment that both companies are making really is just astronomical, and I see that our customers are the beneficiaries of that. It makes it so much easier for them to deploy and use the technologies together, which is exciting. >> So we always joke about Barney deals, I love you, you love me, I mean, it's clear you guys go much much deeper than that. So I want to probe at that a little bit. Particularly from an engineering standpoint, whether it's validated designs or other innovations that you guys are working on together, can we peel the onion on that one a little bit? Talk about what you guys are doing below that line. >> I'll start there then I'll hand it over to the engineering leader from Cisco. But if you think about the pace of this, the partnership, I think, is roughly 3 or so years old. We've 16 Cisco-validated designs for our FlashStack infrastructure. So that is just unbelievable. So, huge amount of investment from engineers, product managers, on both sides of the fence. >> Yeah, totally second that. We start out with the... Cisco-validated designs are like blueprints, so we start out with the blueprints for the standard workloads: Oracle, SAP. And we keep those fresh as new versions come out. But then I think we've taken it further into new spaces of late. ACI, we saw in the keynote this morning, it's going everywhere, it's going multi-site. We've done some work on marrying that with the clustering service of Pure Storage. On top of that, we're doing some work in AI and ML, which is super exciting, so we got some CBDs around that that's just coming out. We're doing some work on automation, coupling Intersight, which is Cisco's cloud-based automation suite, with Pure Storage and Pure Storage's ability to integrate into the Intersight APIs. We talked about it, in fact, I talked about it in my session at the Cisco Live in the summer last year, and now we've got that out as a product. So tremendous amount of work, both in traditional areas as well as some of these new spaces. >> Maybe we can unpack that Intersight piece a bit, because people might look at it initially and say, "Okay, multi-cloud, on-prem, all these environments, "but is this just a networking tool?" And working we're working with someone with Pure, maybe explain a little bit the scope and how, if I'm a Pure administrator, how I live into this world. >> Absolutely, so let's start with what is Intersight, just for a foundational thing. Intersight is our software management tool driven from the cloud. So everything from the personality of the server, the bios settings, the WLAN settings, the networking and the compute pieces of it, that gets administered from the cloud, but it does more. What it does is it can deliver playbooks from the cloud that give the server a certain kind of personality for the workload that it's supporting. So then the next question that anyone asks is, "Now that we have this partnership, "well can it do the same thing for storage? "Can it actually provision that storage, "get that up and running?" And the answer is yes, it can, but it's better because what it can not only do is, not only can it do that, getting that done is super simple. All Pure Storage needed to do was to write some of those Intersight APIs and deliver that playbook from the cloud, from a remote location potentially, into whatever your infrastructure is, provisioning compute, provisioning networking, provisioning storage, in a truly modern cloud-driven environment, right? So I think that's phenomenal what it does for our customers. >> Yeah, I'd agree with that. And I think it'll even become more important as the companies are partnering around our multi-cloud solutions. So, as you probably saw earlier this year in February, sorry, the end of 2018, Pure announced our first leaning into hybrid cloud, so that's Pure Cloud Data Services. That enables us to have Purity, which is our operating system on our storage, running in AWS to begin with. So you can pretty easily start to think about where this partnership is going to go, especially as it pertains to Intersight integration. >> And just to bounce on that, strategically, you can see the alignment there as well. I mean, Cisco's been talking about multi-cloud for a bit now, we've done work to enable similar development environments, whether we're doing something on-prem or in the cloud, so that you can move workloads from one to the other, or actually you can make workloads on both sides talk to each other, and, again, combined with what Katie just said, it makes it a really really compelling solution. >> Like you said, you've got pretty clear swimming lanes for the two companies. There's very little overlap here. You can't have too many of these types of partnerships, right, I mean, you got 25 thousand engineers almost, but still, you still have limited resources. So what makes this one so special, and why are you able to spend so much time and effort, each of you? >> I could start, so from a Pure perspective, I think the cultures are aligned, you called it out there, there's inherently not a lot of overlap in terms of where core competencies are. Pure is not looking at all to become a networking company. And just a lot of synergies in the market make it one that our engineers want to invest in. We have really picked Cisco as our lean-in partner, truthfully, I run all of the alliances at Pure, and a lion's share of my resources really are focused at that partnership. >> Yeah, and if you look at both these companies, Pure is a relative youngster among the storage companies, a new, modern, in a good way, a new, modern company built on modern software practices and so forth. Cisco, although a pretty veteran company, but Cisco compute is relatively new as well as a compute provider. So we are very similar in how our design philosophies work and how modern our infrastructures are, and that gets us to delivering results, delivering solutions to our customers with relatively less effort from our engineers. And that pace of innovation that we can do with Pure is not something we can do with every other company. >> We had a session earlier today, and we went pretty deep into AI, but it's probably worth touching on that. I guess my question here is, what are the customers asking you guys for in terms of AI infrastructure? What's that infrastructure look like that's powering the machine and intelligence era? >> You want to start? >> You want to go, I'll go first. This is a really exciting space, and not only is it exciting because AI is exciting, it's actually exciting because we've got some unique ingredients across Pure and Cisco to make this happen. What does AI feed on? AI feeds on data. The model requires that volume of data to actually train itself We've got an infrastructure, so we just released the C4ATML, the UCC4ATML, highly powered infrastructure, eight GPUs, interconnected, 180 terabytes on board, high network bandwidth, but it needs something to feed it the data, and what Pure's got with their FlashBlade is that ability to actually feed data to this AI infrastructure so that we can train bigger models or train these models faster. Makes for a fantastic solution because these ingredients are just custom made for each other. >> Anything you can add? >> Absolutely I'd agree with that. Really, if you look at AI and what it needs to be successful, and, first of all, all of our customers, if they're not thinking about it, they should be, and I will tell you most of them are, is, how do you ingest that amount of data? If you can't ingest that quickly, it's not going to be of use. So that's a big piece of it, and that's really what the new Cisco platform, I mean, the folks over at Pure are just thrilled about the new Cisco product, and then you take a look at the FlashBlade and how it's able to really scale out unstructured data, object it and file, really to make that useful, so when you have to scrub that data to be able to use it and correlate it, FlashBlade is the perfect solution. So really, this is two companies coming together with the best of breed technologies. >> And the tooling in that world is exploding, open source innovation, it needs a place to run all the Kafkas and the Caffes and the TensorFlows and the Pythons. It's not just confined to data scientists anymore. It's really starting to seep throughout the organization, are you seeing that? >> Yeah. >> What's happening is you've got the buzzwords going around, and that leads to businesses and the leaders of businesses saying, "We've got to have an AI strategy. "We've got to hire these data scientists." But at the same time, the data scientists can get started on the laptop, they can get started on the cloud. When they want to deploy this, they need an enterprise class, resilient, automated infrastructure that fits into the way they do their work. You've got to have something that's built on these components, so what we provide together is that infrastructure for the ITTs so that the data scientists, when they build their beautiful models, have a place to deploy them, have a place to put that into production, and can actually have that life cycle running in a much more smooth production-grade environment. >> Okay, so you guys are three years in, roughly. Where do you want to take this thing, what's the vision? Give us a little road map for the future as to what this partnership looks like down the road. >> Yeah, so I can start. So I think there's a few different vectors. We're going to continue driving the infrastructure for the traditional workloads. That's it, that's a big piece that we do, we continue doing that. We're going to drive a lot more on the automation side, I think there's such a lot of potential with what we've got on Intersight, with the automation that Pure supports, bring those together and really make it simple for our customers to get this up and running and manage that life cycle. And third vector's going to be imparting those new use cases, whether it be AI or more data analytics type use cases. There's a lot of potential that it unleashes for our customers and there's a lot of potential of bringing these technologies together to partner. So you'll see a lot more of that from us. I don't know, will you add something? >> Yeah, no, I absolutely agree. And I would say more FlashStack, look for more FlashStack CVDs, and AI, I think, is one to watch. We believe Cisco, really, this step that Cisco's made, is going to take AI infrastructure to the next level. So we're going to be investing much more heavily into that. And then cloud, from a hybrid cloud, how do these two companies leverage FlashStack and all the innovation we've done on prem together to really enable the multi-cloud. >> Great, alright, well Katie and KD, thanks so much for coming to The Cube. It was great to have you. >> Great. Thanks for having us. >> Thank you very much. >> You're welcome, alright. Keep it right there everybody. Stu and I will be back with our next guest right after this short break. You're watching The Cube Live from Cisco Live Barcelona. We'll be right back. (techy music)

>> Live from Seattle, Washington, it's theCUBE, covering KubeCon and Cloud Native Con North America 2018. Brought to you by RedHat, the Cloud Native Computing Foundation and its ecosystem partners. >> Okay welcome back everyone we're here live in Seattle for KubeCon and Cloud Native Con. I'm John Furrier your host, Stu Miniman from Wikibon here. Next guests Anthony Lye, whose the senior vice president general manager of Cloud Data Services at NetApp, and Jonsi Stergesson, CTO and VP of Cloud Services. Great to have you guys on, great to see you again Anthony. >> As always thank you. >> So first I want to get out there we talked lots in the Kube lounge just to reset. The value parsons of NetApp have significantly been enhanced with the cloud. What is that value proposition? What have you guys seen the explosive headroom for value creation that you guys are enabling with NetApp and the cloud? >> You know what I think NetApp has done over now, probably five years, is really pushed itself to embrace the cloud. To recognize that the cloud is a very important part of everybody's IT infrastructure whether it's an extension of the existing IT infrastructure for things like DR or backup or whether it's the primary platform for legacy workloads or, as we're all here to do, to discuss the refactoring and rebuilding of applications around microservices. I think NetApp chose, unlike all of the traditional storage vendors, to see the cloud as an opportunity and I think it's helped the company and it's helped our customers to operate in what is, I think, is by default now, the end state for many companies is hybrid cloud. >> You guys also made some good moves early on with the cloud. We've documented certainly on SiliconANGLE and theCUBE early on. And then as flash comes in for performance, now you've got compute, storage and networking all being optimized in the cloud, creates app developers an environment where it's programmable infrastructure finally. I mean dev ops is happening, this is where services and notion of compute has gone from standing something up in seconds on the cloud to with functions milliseconds. This is changing the dynamic of applications but you've still got to store the data. Talk about, Jonsi, the impact of the services in piece to the developer, storage, services, provisioning, all that and it covers. >> We are taking, I mean all of our services that are running in all the hyperskills in Google and Azure and AWS and more and even on premise. Our view is our role is always to find the best home for any workload at any given time. Even though it's in public cloud or on premise. However storage has always been sort of left aside, it's always been living in this propietary chunk that is hard to move and the weight of the data is actually quite heavy. So we actually want to use Kubernetes and microservices and resistant volume claims by taking that data and making that very easily migratable replicated between locations, between hyperscalers and sort of adopt a true multi cloud strategy. With data with it not only moving those workloads or applications but the data is key, data is key. >> Sometimes, you know, you want to move the data to a compute and sometimes you want to move compute to the data. >> And that's been validated by Amazon's RDS announcement on VMware, Amazon announced outposting on premises, and the number one thing was latency, work was not yet moving. This is exactly to what you guys have been doing and implementing, today, this is like real product. >> I think the reality of the world is, you know, while there is a ton of innovation that exists in public cloud there are well documented use cases that struggle with a cloud only environment. I think NetApp has chosen to make each one of those three potential persistent stores equal to one another. So whether that's in a traditional on premise and upgrading on premise environments to get better price performance characteristics, embracing the public cloud or combining public and private cloud. >> While it's not trivial NetApp, at it's core, always was software so moving it from a hardware appliance, I mean, back in the day Network Appliance was the original name of the company to a software defined solution to being multi-cloud, you can kind of see that genesis where it can go. A lot of times the tougher part is from the customer standpoint. You know, the traditional person that bought and managed this was a storage administrator and getting them to understand cloud native applications and dev ops and all those things, those are pretty challenging moves so how much of it is education? How much of it is new buying centers inside the company or new clients, help us walk through that. >> Yeah I would make two points in maybe answering to you. So I think NetApp's history, actually 25 years ago, NetApp started off as selling into the developers who were running SUN workstations, who wanted shared everything and NetApp actually you know went around IT and put those appliances into the developers. We built a SaaN business, a very successful SaaN business, with the IT people. Now you're absolutely right, the people around here fall into the, sort of, the modern day dev ops characters. What Google calls the SREs the Site Reliability Engineers. And they're a new breed, they're young, they're doing more and more CICD. Storage is an integral part of what they do but maybe not a primary part. They expect storage to work. We are really lucky you know, a little company called Microsoft and another little company called Google sell our stuff so we get introduced into all of those cloud first, cloud only sort of use cases. Not just of refactoring of primary but building. So we're actually, in many cases now, very relevant to those people but we've been fortunate enough to leverage the big public clouds together. >> So you have a relationship with AWS, Google and Microsoft, Microsoft and Google, which you've just mentioned. You mentioned SRE, Site Reliability Engineer, this is a new persona that's clearly emerging and it has a focus around operations, now IT operations has been around for a long time, dev is changing too but this is, if they sell your stuff, their customers need to operate at scale. This is a big point, can you elaborate on the importance of this and what you guys are doing specifically to help that. >> So the Site Reliability Engineer, he is not doing operations. He is actually in charge of running the workload or the development or the application or the product that comes from development. They have to abide by specific rules that are actually set by the SRE. And to your point, because you were talking about different selling motions and not selling into the storage admin or not selling to traditional IT. This is actually what has actually been really surprising and showcases the power of Kubernetes and how widely adopted it has been, both on premise and in the public cloud because customers are actually coming to us and saying, "Hey we had no idea NetApp was actually "doing all of this in the public cloud. "We had no idea that you had your own Kubernetes services "that actually help solve one of the biggest problems "which is persistent volume claims and application of data." So it's actually coming, and you sort of see how important CNCF is, because they're actually educating the market and educating the enterprise space just as well as the new up and coming development team like I've traditionally come from. So I'm actually seeing that it's easier than I would have sort of thought in the beginning. So they're actually becoming more educated about microservices, more educated about how to run their, actually everybody almost in any company that I go into now, they have the SRE playbook somewhere in their meeting room somewhere and everybody sort of getting educated on how they need to, sort of, elevate themselves from being traditional system administrators into that SRE or dev op role. >> And it's also a cultural thing too, they have to develop, not just the playbook, but have some experience in economies of scale, managing it, and certainly it's a tail wind for you guys, storage because, again, it's also a lot of coating involved they need a pool of resources, storage being one of them. But the other thing that's interesting, those are single clouds, Amazon, Google, multi cloud is really where the action is, right? So multi cloud to me is just, to me, a modern version of multi vendor, which basically is about choice. Choice is critical, but having choice around the app, it becomes the value creator. So if you guys can scale with the app development environments that seems to be a sweet spot. How are you guys talking about that particular point because this becomes an under the covers, a new kind of operations, a new kind of scale, pushing code, not just you know stacking interacting boxes but, like, really making things, patching security things or could have been head of security things so doing things in a really really automated way. >> Yeah, I mean, I think the one thing I'm most proud of at my time at NetApp and what the team does and what the team continues to do is we took a very, very, I think, deliberate perspective that we would deliver storage, but we would do it in a very unique way. That my background was from Saas, I spent my entire career building applications, and when you build an application, you run the application, there is nothing you give the customer and say, "Here, administer it." When you look at a lot of the infrastructure services, they make the customer do a lot of work. So what we did at NetApp was we decided that we ourselves would almost create like an always available protocol that people could just ask for it and it would be there. There was no concept of setting it up or patching it or upgrading it. And that's really I think we have set a bar now on the public clouds that, I think, even the public clouds themselves have not done, and giving those developers that I asked for a storage through an API and all I need to do is ask for capacity and throughput. Nothing else, that's something to a developer they're like, "So now I don't even have to ask "anybody with storage skills. "I can tell my application to ask for it's own storage." >> It's interesting you're living in a new world where you need the scale of a system but the functionality of like an app server. I feel like we're living in that app server days where that middle ground and app development was the key focus, you've got to have both now. You need scalable systems but really application performance. >> And then you add an additional layer because now everybody wants to be able to use the same deployment script, the same configuration management system, Terraform, whatever they're actually using to deploy it on premise or in a public cloud but it needs to be done in a unified manner. This is why it's so important to be upstream compatible and there's a lot of companies out there that are actually destroying that model and not following the true cloud concept. >> Yes give them a slap on the wrist, get in line, fix it! >> If you are going to play in this space with the CNCF and with Kubenetes, you better play by the rules and do the open standards. And so you're actually compatible no matter where your workload resides. >> We've been monitoring how storage is maturing in this whole cloud native Kubenetes ecosystem here. A year ago there were a lot of backroom arguments over what were the right architectures, a few sub projects working through here, it actually blew me away in the keynote this morning to hear that 40% of all applications that are deployed in Kubernetes are stateful. So where are we? What's working? What's good for customers? And what do we still need to work on to kind of solidify the storage data piece of this? >> I think it's interesting, 'cause I think we, sort of, ourselves now consider NetApp to be a data company. Storage is an enabler but what's interesting, everyone talks about their Saas strategy, their PaaS strategy their IaaS strategies. I always ask people, "What's your data strategy?" and that's something I think the CNCF Kubernetes, themselves, recognize that they've done a lot of really great things for compute around the microservices themselves but the storage piece has always been something of a challenge. And we said, about solving that problem, we have an open source project called Trident, that essentially enables people to make persistent volume claims and if the container dies, they can essentially start a new container and pick up the storage exactly where they left off. So we really believe that stateful is an ever increasing percentage of the overall application model. Databases are important things, people need them. >> I would agree with that and that's developing too, it's early on. All right so I want to ask you guys a question, kind of outside the box. Multi cloud certainly is part of a hybrid, what they call a hybrid today, it's really a choice, multi cloud will be a future reality, no matter what anyone says, I believe that. How is multi cloud changing IT investments? Business investments, technical investments or both, what's your guys thoughts on how multi cloud is driving and changing IT investments? >> Well I actually think it offers you the opportunity to have like placement policy algorithms that fit your workload at any given time. For example, if this particular application is latency sensitive, and I created an application that all of a sudden became really popular in Mexico, then I should be able to see which one of the hyperscalers actually has a presence in Mexico City, deploy it there. If I'm under utilizing my private cloud and I have a lot of space on it and there is no specific requirements, it gives you that flexibility to, like I said, always find the best home for your workload at any given time. >> Dynamic policy based stuff? >> Yeah, precisely. And it allows you also, I mean, you can choose to do it whether its based on workload requirements or you can start doing it in a least cost effective route, I mean least cost routing. So it actually impacts both from a technical and a business sense in my opinion. >> I think you know you cannot help but get excited every day with what one cloud delivers over another cloud, and we're seeing something not unlike the arms race, you know, Google does this, then Amazon does this, then Microsoft does this. As developers we're very keen to take advantage of all these capabilities and we want to, in many cases, let the application itself make the decision. >> So yeah Amazons got there, everyone's catching up. Competitions good. All right, final question. Predictions for multi cloud in 2019. What's going to happen? Is there going to be a loud bang? Is there going to be a crash? Is it going to be fruit on the trees? What's the state of the multi cloud predictions for 2019? >> Well I actually believe it's going to become a standard. Nobody should be locked into any region or any one provider, I don't even care if it's on premise or NetOps specific, you should be able to... I mean, I think it's just going to become standard. Everybody has to have a multi cloud strategy and you can see that, like the IDC report that 86% of Fortune 500 companies are adopting multi cloud. And I think I'm actually quite fed up of this hyper cloud stuff because, in my opinion, on premise is just the fourth or the fifth hyperscaler and should be treated as such. So if you actually have that true cloud concept, you should be able to deploy that using the same script, the same APIs to deploy it everywhere. >> As I said in theCube the data center and non print, they're just an edge, a big edge. If it's an operating mall? >> My prediction? Your prediction. >> 2019 is the year of Istio. I think we've become enamored with Kubernetes, I think what Istio brings significantly advances Kubernetes, and we barely scratched the surface, I think, with the service mesh and all of the enhancements and all the contributions that will go into that. I think, you know, that 2019 will probably see as many vendors here next year with Istio credentials and STO capabilities as we see today with Kubernetes. >> Anthony, Jonsi, thanks for coming on, great insights, smart commentary, appreciate it. We should get in the studio and dig into this a little bit deeper. Really a great example of an incumbent, large company, NetApp, really getting a tailwind from the cloud, good smart bets you guys made, programmable infrastructure, dynamic policy routing, all kinds of under the covers goodness from smart cloud deployments. This is where software drives the data. >> Yep data is the new oil, that's what they say right? If you don't have a data set you're not very competitive. >> Thanks for coming on I appreciate it. More Kube coverage here, getting all the breakdown here, the impact of cloud computing at scale, the role of data software, all happening here at the CNCF. This is the KubeCon, I'm John Furrier and Stu Miniman, thanks for watching. More live coverage after this short break.

(bright instrumental music) >> Hi everyone, I'm John Furrier. Here in the Cube Studios in Palo Alto, for a special Cube conversation on some big news from PureStorage. We're here with Chadd Kenney, who's the Vice President of Product and Solutions at PureStorage. Big Cloud news. A historic announcement from PureStorage. One of the fastest growing startups in the storage business. Went public, I've been following these guys since creation. Great success story in Silicon Valley and certainly innovative products. Now announcing a Cloud product. Cloud data services, now in market. Chadd, this is huge. >> It's exciting time. Thank you so much for having us. >> So you guys, obviously storage success story, but now the reality is changed. You know we've been saying in the Cube, nothing changes, you get storage computer networking, old way, new way in the Cloud. Game is still the same. Storage isn't going away. You got to store the data somewhere and the data tsunami is coming. Still coming with Edge and a bunch of other things. Cloud more important than ever. To get it right is super important. So, what is the announcement of Cloud Data Service. Explain what the product is, why you guys built it, why now. >> Awesome. So, a couple different innovations that are part of this launch to start with. We have Cloud Block Store which is taking Purity, which is our operating system found on-prem and actually moving it to AWS. And we spent a bunch of time optimizing these solutions to make it so that, we could actually take on tier one, mission critical applications. A key differentiator is that most folks were really chasing after test-dev and leveraging the Cloud for that type of use case. Whereas Cloud Block Storage, really kind of industry strength and ready for mission critical applications. We also took protection mechanisms from FlashArray on-premises and actually made it so that you could use CloudSnap and move and protect data into the public Cloud via portable snapshot technology. Which we can dig into a little bit later. And then the last part is, we thought it was really ripe to change data protection, just as a whole. Most people are doing kind of disc to disc, to tape, and then moving tape offsite. We believe the world has shifted. There's a big problem in data protection. Restoring data is not happening in the time frame that its needed, and SLAs aren't being met, and users are not happy with the overall solution as a whole. We believe that restorations from Flash are incredibly important to the business, but in order to get there you have to offset the economics. So what we're building is a Flash to Flash to Cloud solution which enables folks to be able to take the advantages of the economics of Cloud and be able to then have a caching mechanism of Flash on-premises. So that they can restore things relatively quickly for the predominant set of data that they have out there. >> And just so I get everything right here. You guys only been on-premises only, this is now a cloud solution. It's software. >> Correct. >> Why now? Why wait 'til now, is the timing right? What's the internal conversation? And why should customers know, is this the right time. >> So, the evolution of cloud has been pretty interesting as we've gone through it. Most customers went from kind of a 100% on-premises, the Cloud came out and said, hey, I'm going to move everything to the Cloud. They found that didn't work great for enterprise applications. And so they kind of moved back and realized that hybrid cloud was going to be a world with they wanted to leverage both. We're seeing a lot of other shifts in the market. VMware already having RDS in platform. Now it's true hybrid cloud kind of playing out there. Amazon running an AWS. It's a good mixture just to showcase where people really want to be able to leverage the capabilities of both. >> So it's a good time because the customers are re-architecting as well. >> It's all about- >> Hybrid applications are definitely what people want. >> 100% and the application stack, I think was the core focus that really shifted over time. Instead of just focusing on hybrid cloud infrastructure, it was really about how applications could leverage multiple types of clouds to be able to leverage the innovation and services that they could provide. >> You know, I've always been following the IT business for 30 years or so and it's always been an interesting trend. You buy something from a vendor and there's a trade-offs. And there's always the payback periods, but now I think with this announcement that's interesting is you got the product mix that allows customers to have choice and pick what they want. There's no more trade-offs. If they like cloud, they go to cloud. If they like on-premise, you go on-premises. >> It sounds like an easy concept, but the crazy part to this is the Cloud divide is real. They are very different environments. As we've talked to customers, they were very lost on how it was going to take and enterprise application and actually leverage the innovations within the Cloud. They wanted it, they needed it, but at the same time, they weren't able to deliver up on it. And so, we realized that the data layer, fundamentally was the area that could give them that bridge between those two environments. And we could add some core values to the Cloud for even the next generation developer who's developing in the Cloud to bring in, better overall resiliency. Management and all sorts of new features that they weren't able to take advantage of in traditional public cloud. >> You know Chugg wants to do minimal about the serviceless trend and how awesome that is. It's just, look at the resource pool as a serviceless pool of resource. So is this storageless? >> So it's still backed by storage, obviously. >> No, I was just making a joke. No wait, that you're looking at it as what serviceless is to the user. You guys are providing that same kind of storage pool, addressable through the application of, >> Correct >> as if it's storageless. And what's great about taking 100% software platform and moving it to the Cloud is, customer can spin this up in like minutes. And what's great about it is, they can spend many, many, many instances of these things for various different use cases that they have out there, and get true utility out of it. So they're getting the agility that they really want while not having to offset the values that they really come to love about PureStorage on-premises. Now they can actually get it all on the public cloud as well. >> I want to dig into the products a little bit. Before we get there, I want you to answer the question that's probably on people's minds. I know you've been at Pure, really from the beginning. So, you've seen the history. Most people look at you guys and say, well you're a hardware vendor. I have Pure boxes everywhere, you guys doing a great job. You've pioneered the Flash, speed game on storage. People want, kill latency as they say. You guys have done a great job. But wait a minute, this is software. Explain how you guys did this, why it's important. People might not know that this is a software solution. They might be know you for hardware. What's the difference? Is there a difference? Why should they care and what's the impact? >> So, great question. Since we sell hardware products, most people see us as a hardware company. But at the end of the day, the majority of vinge and dev is software. We're building software to make, originally, off the shelf components to be enterprise worthy. Over time we decided to optimize the hardware too, and that pairing between the software and hardware gets them inherently great values. And this is why we didn't just take our software and just kind of throw it into every cloud and say have it, to customers. Like a lot of folks did. We spent a lot of time, just like we did on our hardware platform, optimizing for AWS to start with. So that we could truly be able to leverage the inherent technologies that they have, but build software to make it even better. >> It's interesting, I interviewed Andy Bechtolsheim at VMworld, and he's a chairman of Arista. He's called, Les Peckgesem calls him the Rembrandt of motherboards. And he goes, "John, we're in the software business." And he goes, "Let me tell ya, hardware's easy. Software's hard." >> I agree. >> So everyone's pretty much in the software business. This is not a change for Pure. >> No, this is the same game we've been in. >> Great. Alright, let's get into the products. The first one is Cloud Block Store for AWS. Which is the way Amazon does the branch. So it's on Amazon, or for Amazon as they say. They use different words. So this is Pure software in the Cloud. Your company, technically Pure software. >> Yup. >> In the Cloud as software, no hardware. >> Yup. >> A 100% storage, API support, always encrypted, seamless management and orchestration, DR backup migration between clouds. >> Yup. >> That's kind of the core premise. So what does the product do, what's the purpose of the product. On the Amazon piece, if I'm a customer of Pure or a prospect for Pure, what does the product give me? What's the capabilities? >> Great. I would say that the biggest thing that customers get is just leverage for their application stack to be able to utilize the Cloud. And let me give you a couple of examples 'cause they're kind of fun. So first off, Cloud Block Storage is just software that sits in the Cloud that has many of the same utilities that run on-premises. Any by doing so, you get the ability to be able to do stuff like I want to replicate, as a DR target. So maybe I don't have a secondary site out there, and I want to have a DR target that spin up in the event of a disaster. You can easily set up bi-directional replication to the instance that you have running in the Cloud. It's the exact same experience. The exact same APIs and you get our cloud data management with Pure1 to be able to see both sites. One single pane of glass, and make sure everything is up and running and doing well. You could also though, leverage a test-dev environment. So let's saying I'm running production on-premises, I can then go ahead and replicate to the Cloud, spin up an instance for test-dev, and running reporting, run analytics. Run anything else that I wanted on top of that. And spin up compute relatively quickly. Maybe I don't have it on-prem. Next, we could focus on replicating for protection. Let's say for compliance, I want to have many instances to be able to restore back in the event of a disaster or in the event that I just want to look back during a period of time. The last part is, not just on-prem to the Cloud, but leveraging the Cloud for even better resiliency to take enterprise applications and actually move them without having to do massive re-architecture. If you look at what happens, Amazon recommends typically, that you have data in two different availability zones. So that when you put an application on top of it, it can be resilient to any sort of failures within an AZ. What we've done is we've taken our active cluster technology which is active-active replication between two instances, and made it so that you can actually replicate between two availability zones. And your application now doesn't need to be re-architected whatsoever. >> So you basically, if I get this right, you had core software that made all that Flash, on the box which is on-premise, which is a hardware solution. Which sounds like it was commodity boxes so this, components. >> Just like the Cloud. >> You take it to the Cloud as an amazing amount of boxes out there. They have tons of data centers. So you treat the Cloud as if it's a virtual device, so to speak. >> Correct. I mean the Cloud functionally is just compute and storage, and networking on the back end has been abstracted by some sort of layer in front of it. We're leveraging compute resources for our controllers and we're leveraging persistent storage media for our storage. But what we've done in software is optimize a bunch of things. An example just as one is, in the Cloud when you, procure storage, you pay for all of it, whether you leverage it or not. We incorporate de-dupe, compression, thin provisioning, AES 256 encryption on all data arrest. These are data services that are just embedded in that aren't traditionally found in a traditional cloud. >> This makes so much sense. If you're an application developer, you focus on building the app. Not worrying about where the storage is and how it's all managed. 'Cause you want persistent data and uni-managed state, and all this stuff going on. And I just need a dashboard, I just need to know where the storage is. Is it available and bring it to the table. >> And make it easy with the same APIs that you were potentially running on, on-premises. And that last part that I would say is that, the layered services that are built into Purity, like our snapshot technology and being able to refresh test-dev environments or create 10 sandboxes for 10 developers in the Cloud and add compute instances to them, is not only instantaneous, but it's space saving as you actually do it. Where as in the normal cloud offerings, you're paying for each one of those instances. >> And the agility is off the charts, it's amazing. Okay, final question on this one is, how much is it's going to cost? How does a customer consume it? Is it in the marketplace? Do I just click a button, spin up things? How's the interface? What's the customer interaction and engagement with the product? How they buy it, how much it costs? Can you share the interaction with the customer? >> So we're just jumping into beta, so a lot of this is still being worked out. But what I will tell you is it's the exact same experience that customers have come to love with Pure. You can go download the Cloud formation template into your catalog with an AWS. So you can spin up instances. The same kind of consumption models that we've built on-prem will be applied to cloud. So it will be a very similar consumption model, which has been super consumer friendly that customers have loved from us over the years. And it will be available in the mid part of next year, and so people will be able to beta it today, test it out, see how it works, and then put it into full production in mid part of next year. >> And operationally, in the work flows, the customers don't skip a beat. It's the same kind of format, languages and the words, the word flow. It feels like Pure all the way through. >> Correct. And not only are we a 100% built on a rest API, but all of the things we've built in with, Python libraries that automate this for developers, to PowerShell toolkits, to Ansible playbooks. All the stuff we've built on codeupyourstorage.com are all applicable to both sites and you get Pure1, our Cloud based management system to be able to see all of it in one single pane of glass. >> Okay, let's move on. So the next piece I think is interesting. I'll get your thoughts on this is that the whole protection piece. On-premises, really kind of held back from the Cloud, mainly to protect the data. So you guys got CloudSnap for AWS, what does this product do? Is this the protection piece? How does this work? What is the product? What's the features and what's the value? >> So, StorReduce was a recent acquisition that we did that enables de-duplication on top of an S3 target. And so it allows you to store an S3 de-duplicated into a smaller form factor and we're pairing that with both an on-premises addition which will have a flash plate behind it for super fast restores. So think of that as a caching tier for your backups, but then also be able to replicate that out to the public cloud and leverage store reduce natively in the public cloud as well. >> So that's the store reduce product. So store reduce on it is that piece. As an object store? >> It is, yes. And we pair that with CloudSnap which is natively integrated within FlashArray, so you can also do snapshots to a FlashBlade for fast restores for both NFS, and you can send it also to S3 in the public cloud. And so you get the inherent abilities to even do, VM level granularity or volume level granularity as well from a FlashArray directly, without needing to have any additional hardware. >> Okay so the data services are the; Block Storage, Store Reduce and CloudSnap on a four AWS. >> Correct. >> How would you encapsulate this from a product and solution standpoint? How would you describe that to a customer in an elevator or just a quick value statement? What's in it for them? >> Sure. So Pure's been seen by customers as innovation engine that optimized applications and allowed them to do, I would say, amazing things into the enterprise. What we're doing now, is we're evolving that solution out of just an on-premises solution and making it available in a very agile Cloud world. We know this world is evolving dramatically. We know people really want to be able to take advantage of the innovations within the Cloud, and so what we're doing is we're finally bridging the gap between on-premises and the Cloud. Giving them the same user experience that they've come to love with Pure and all of the Clouds that they potentially need to develop in. >> Okay so from the announcement standpoint, you guys got Cloud Block Storage limited public beta, right out of the gate. GA in mid 2019. CloudSnap is GA at announcement and Store Reduce is going into beta, first half of 2019. >> Correct, we're excited about it. >> So for the skeptics out there who are- Hey you know, Chadd, I got to tell ya. I love the Cloud, but I'm a little bit nervous. How do I test and get a feeling for- this is going to be simple, if I'm going to jump in and look at this. What should I look at first? What sequence, should I try this? Do you guys have a playbook, for them to either kick the tires or how should they explore to get proficient in the new solution. >> Good question. Right, so for one if you're a FlashArray customer, CloudSnap gives you the ability to be able to take this new entity, called a portable Snapshot. Which is data paired with metadata, and allow you to be able to move data off of a FlashArray. You can put it to an NFS target or you can send it to the Cloud. And so that's the most logical one that folks will probably leverage first because it's super exciting for them to be able to leverage the Cloud and spin up instances, if they'd like to. Or protect back to their own prem. Also, Cloud Block Storage, great because you can spin it up relatively quickly and test out applications between the two. One area that I think customers are going to be really excited about is you could run an analytics environment in the Cloud and spin up a bunch of compute from your production instance by just replicating it up into the Cloud. The last part is, I think backup is not super sexy. Nobody like to talk about it, but it's a significant pain point that's out there, and I think we can make some major in-roads in helping businesses get better SLAs. We're very, very interested to see the great solutions people bring with- >> So, I'm going to put you on the spot here and ask you, there's always the, love the cliche, is it a vitamin or is it an Asprin. Is there a pain point? So obviously backup, I would agree. Backup and recovery, certainly with the disaster, you see the wildfires going on here in California. You can't stop thinking about what the, disaster recovery plan and then you got top line growth with application developers. The kind of the vitamin, if you will. What are the use cases, low hanging fruit for someone to like test this out from a pain point standpoint. Is it backup and what's the growth angle? I wanted to test out this new solution, what should I look at first? What would you recommend? >> It's a very tough question. So, CloudSnap is obviously the easy one. I'd say Cloud Block Store is one that I think, people will. I look at my biggest, customers biggest challenges out there it's how do I get application portable. So I think Cloud Block Store really gives you the application portability. So I think it's finally achieving that whole, hybrid cloud world. But at the end of the day, backup is really big pain point that the enterprise deals with, like right this second. So there's areas where we believe we can add inherent values to them with being able to do fast restores from Flash. That meets SLA's very quickly and is an easy fix. >> And you guys feel good about the data protection aspect of this? >> Yes, very much so. >> Awesome. I want to get your personal take on this. You were early on in Pure. What's the vibe inside the company? This is Cloud and people love Cloud. There's benefits for Cloud, as well as on-premises. What's the mood like inside PureStorage? You've seen from the beginning, now you're a public company and growing up really, really fast. What's the vibe like inside PureStorage? >> It's funny, it hasn't really changed all that much, in the cultural side of the thing, of the business. I love where I work because of the people. The people bring so much fun to the business, so much innovation and we have a mindset that's heavily focused on customer first. And that's one of the things. I always tell this kind of story is, when we first started, we sat in a room on a whiteboard and wrote up, what is everything that sucks about storage. And instead of trying to figure out how we make a 2.0 version of some storage array, we actually figured out what are all the customer pain points that we needed to satisfy and then we built innovations to go do that. Not go chase the competition, but actually go alleviate customer challenges. And we just continue to kind of focus on customer first and so the whole company kind of, rallies around that. And I think you see a very different motion that what you do in most companies because we love hearing about customer results of our products. Engineering just will rally around when a customer shows up just to hear exactly their experience associated to it. And so with this, I think what they see is a continued evolution of the things we've been doing and they love seeing and providing customer solutions in areas that they were challenged to deal with in the past. >> What was some of the customer feedback when you guys started going, hey, you've got a new product, you're doing all of that early work. And you got to go talk to some people and knock on the, hey, what do you think, would you like the Cloud, a little bit of the Cloud. How would you like the Cloud to be implemented? What was some of the things you heard from customers? >> A lot of them said, if you can take your core tenets, which was simplicity, efficiency, reliability, and customer focus around consumption, and if you could give that to me in the Cloud, that would be the Nirvana. So, when we looked at this model, that's exactly what we did. We said, let's take what people love about us on-prem, and give 'em the exact same experience in the Cloud. >> That's great and that's what you guys have done. Congratulations. >> Thanks so much. >> Great to hear the Cloud story here Chadd Kenney, Vice President of Products and Solutions at PureStorage. Taking the formula of success on-premises with Flash and the success there, and bringing it to the Cloud. That's the big deal in this announcement. I'm John Furrier here in the Palo Alto studios, thanks for watching. (upbeat instrumental music)

(electronic music) >> Announcer: Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE. Covering NetApp Insight 2018. Brought to you by NetApp. >> Welcome back to theCUBE's continuing coverage of NetApp Insight 2018. From the Mandalay Bay in Las Vegas. I'm Lisa Martin with Stu Miniman and we're welcoming back to theCUBE one of our alumni, Jennifer Meyer, Senior Director of Cloud Product Marketing at NetApp. And welcoming to theCUBE Alok Arora, Senior Director of Cloud Data Services and the Product Owner for NetApp Cloud Advisor, which we'll talk about today. So guys, the keynote this morning, one of the things that George Kurian, your CEO, whose going to be on the program I think next with Stu and me, talked about the four pillars of digital transformation, and one of them was hybrid and multi-cloud is now the de facto architecture. Jennifer, from a cloud marketing, product marketing stand point, how is NetApp engaging with your customers, both your install base enterprise customers and engaging with new customer to help them evolve a successful multi-cloud strategy? >> Well what's funny about that is it's not really even up to us, it's up to the customer and where they're at today, meeting them there and then taking them kind of to that destination that's interesting or important for them. And what we know today is that not only are customers in the cloud because they want to be close to innovation, that's one of our big themes, inspiring innovation with the cloud, but they've got their hands in multiple clouds. And studies show that at least 80-81% of customers are doing multi-cloud with two or more public clouds, and I think that's really interesting, you know I think that in some cases it's because their end uses, or their customers, have chosen a cloud that they want to go with and so they're trying to service those needs where they exist, but also maybe they realize that they want to subscribe or consume services in one cloud versus what's available in another cloud, and so it's not our job really to tell them where to go, it's to make sure we've got a consistent seamless amount of services to give these customers to consume, wherever they may be, in whichever public cloud. >> Yeah, well I like what you said, meeting them where they are, cause I think in some ways we're giving customers a little bit of credit that this was actually planned for as to how they got to where they are, you know I'm sure if we took that 81% that say they know they're multi-cloud, if we go with the other 19%, most of them are probably multi-cloud and just don't realize it. >> Jennifer: Absolutely. >> Because just like we had an IT in the old day, I have an application, a business unit, or somebody drives something, and oh my gosh, that's how we ended up with silos, we ended up breaking those things apart. >> Or shadow IT, right? You've got a lot of developers that know exactly what tools they want. >> We had a good discussion with Anthony Lye and Ted Brockway talking about Azure and some unique functionality that NetApp's looking to drive into that partnership with Microsoft. I wonder if we could step back, if you could help us understand kind of the cloud portfolio of NetApp, people that just know NetApp as "Oh it's, that's that filer company that I've probably "got a lot of products from." The multi-cloud has been evolving, for quite a few years now, so I want to help understand the breadth and depth of the offering. >> That's right and I think you know we always think about it almost like a four layer stack, in terms of our strategy and what we're doing to bring more of these innovative data services to our install base to your point, but also our net new buyers, folks that are coming to us through Microsoft Azure, or Google Cloud, or AWS, and so it really does start with our legacy and our foundation of, in this case, cloud storage, and the data services, or the advanced data management that's built upon those storage protocols. So of course it's NFS, NSMB, but when you think about being able to offer that, and compliment what's available in the public clouds today, because that's why they've chosen to partner with NetApp. On top of that we are delivering advanced services in those public clouds that have never been available before, things like automatic snapshots, or rapid cloning, and backup, and tiering, and I think it's really important because what it does is it extends our customers' experience from On-prem into the public cloud, without having to sacrifice a thing. >> Alok, it's a tough thing that customers are trying to figure out. When I look at it and talk to customers, they've got an application portfolio. What are they modernizing? What are they starting from fresh? And then they've got all the other stuff that they have, how is NetApp helping with what they do? >> Yeah, absolutely, I think that's a great point. So you talked about the offerings that we have with multi-cloud and that creates all the options for future state architecture, I can build there, however, in order to understand how do I get there I need to understand where I am today, right? So we start looking at your current state footprint, we look at our customer's current state footprint. Understand how it is architected. How it is designed, how it is serving up the applications. Because it can be really a tedious job to get started, to get to the cloud and building the roadmap. So what Cloud Advisor does is it leverages active IQ data to get that inside for us and be leveraging data science, machine learning, to give them a guidance as to how they can get there. What should be their migration approach. How should they build a transition strategy. Because a lot of times they would call the consultants to help with the transition strategy, at the end they get a PowerPoint, which is not very actionable. We started this grounds up, we understand their detail you know, how the stuff, the bits and bites, are organized so we start giving them an actionable strategy they can execute upon. So that's really Cloud Advisor geared for accelerating that journey to the cloud that our customers should be taking to. >> How are you guys helping customers to start embracing emerging technologies, IoT devices, we had Ducati on this morning, a MotoGP bike is basically an IoT device, but in terms of, Jennifer you talked about this, and Alok you reinforced it, you are basically co-developing in partnership with your customers, it's about where they, helping them understand where they are, what they can do today. How are some of the services helping them to be able to harness the power of AI, say for example, to work with data authority to use that data for actionable business insight, and outcomes? >> Yeah it's interesting you talk about the IoT, I think NetApp saw that 20 years ago. I mean ASAP is our original IoT, that is what we get billions of data points from our customers. Controllers, millions of controllers worldwide, and we build on that mirror data, and we apply the artificial intelligence in there. We actually start looking at classifying their applications so that, if they have a strategy driven by the application, as you were saying, hey there is a director from a BU, from majority point of view, we want to take these applications in the cloud. How do you figure out what application are? Where does the data live? How does it governed? We figure that out by that IoT data, by that artificial intelligence and also making sure that these applications, no work loads are left behind because applications can be complicated they talk to each other. So when you start thinking about taking one part of the application, you also want to make sure the other parts that make that application whole also go to the cloud. And that is where we're leveraging Artificial Intelligence to cluster these applications and recommending the customer that: "Hey don't make, don't leave these workloads behind "because otherwise you're going to have a failed strategy." So we warn them upfront to make sure they're successful when they start making the executions. >> I think another piece to that too is just the fact that for many years we've had workloads just trapped On-prem. They haven't had a place to go into the public cloud without a ton of refactoring or rearchitecting, right. You'd have to rewrite them for objectory. You'd have to do a lot of manual labor and things just to make it happen. In most cases it hasn't been worth it. And so when you looked at the fact that about 80% of On-prem files where in NFS V3 protocol, there wasn't really a place in the public cloud to match that and so by even just delivering Cloud Volumes Service for Google Cloud and AWS or Azure NetApp Files which is the version for Azure, we're able to give customers an, a way to free up that trapped set of workloads, put those into the public hub, so that it then can be available to all of those advanced services that live on those public clouds to do things like Big Data Analytics or to do developing, you know, applications and services of their own and for their own benefit. >> You Know. >> Yeah I think that's a great point because >> He's so excited.| >> Sorry. >> Because when you start looking at building your strategy you want to have confidence in your strategy. >> Jennifer: right. >> So, with your protocols and all that discovery. We also not only give you the option that NetApp offers but show you what are the other options you have within Hyperscalers and how would your workload perform with NetApp technology. So you can move with confidence, right. So that's the good part of about Cloud Advisor to make sure you're moving with confidence not just, you know, with a blind spot with you. >> You know one of the transitions we've been watching is really the ascendancy with the developer in DevOps. And I've talked to the SolidFire team for many years, I see them at some of the shows that we've been covering. In the Keynote this morning George Kurian said that Kubernetes and Istio are the multi-Cloud control plane. Jennifer I'm wondering if you can help explain the StackPointCloud acquisition. >> Jennifer: (agrees) >> Some people that might not have the context of about what NetApp and SolidFire, even before the acquisition were doing. You know, we're being like: "Wait I don't understand, you know." >> Sure. >> Kubernetes is something That you know Google and you know, Red Hat and others are doing. >> Why is NetApp talking about Kubernetes? >> Why is NetApp talking about Kubernetes? >> And we even learned what the abbreviation for is was. >> Stu: K8s. >> It's like we're all hip. Absolutely. >> Absolutely, just because. >> It's all about concatenate long words together. So it, it's really interesting because when I talked about that four layer strategy, right the third layer. So it's you know cloud storage at the bottom. Then it's the advanced capabilities and data management above that. But the one that's next is orchestration and integration. And there's really a few things that live in there. You know, the, our cloud orchestration sort of technology is really what we got from our Qstack acquisition. Our teams in Iceland and what they've been able to do largely to underpin a lot of what we've seen with cloud volume service today. But certainly right in there is NetApp Kubernetes service, which as you now know, is from our StackPoint intellectual property. And so back on September 18th, when we announced this acquisition it was really to kind of give our developers and our DevOps folks a way to finally start solving for some of that data gravity that I think we've been periled by over the last few years. And what we now know is Kubernetes is the operating system of the clouds, right. It is the clear winner of container orchestration among things so it made a lot of sense to pair that kind of multi-cloud orchestration again given our strategy to be where our customers want to be with some of our cloud orchestration technology from our Qstack acquisition and make sure that with Trident and some of the ways that we're able to deliver finally persistent storage to those containers. I mean this is like a match made in heaven. Right, we're going to give people the way to make sure that they know that containers are a femoral and data is not. So let's help them do kind of all the things that they want to do in the clouds if they want to do them. >> I think I read on line that, was the StackPointCloud acquisition based on after actually NetApp used it internally. >> Jennifer: Yes. >> Tell us a little bit more about that. Because I think the NetApp on that up story is probably something that could be leverage, you're a marketer, as a differentiator when customers have so much choice. >> Well and I feel like it's a story that every vendor should be forced to tell. If you're not willing to use your own IP and technology what is that saying to your customers. >> Lisa: Yeah. >> So it is true and a lot of our developer teams, if you've hear of Jonsi Stefansson and Anthony Lye's team, that is how this sort of came about as we were looking for a way to sort of do it ourselves. And we thought man through all this investigation there's something here. There's something that we shouldn't hold to ourselves and we should share with the rest of the world. And so at one point we need to get those guys on with you as well so they can tell a little bit more about their story. >> So proof is always in the pudding. Can you give uan example of one of your favorite customer stories. We'll start with you Alok. Who have really embraced the clouds, first of all helped you develop the optimal cloud services are now really achieving big business benefits with the cloud services NetApp is developing. >> Yeah so, several of the customers as we talked to you and specially for Cloud Advisor, as we were looking at their journey as they were starting to think about how much money they were spending upfront to figure out a strategy, they had a strategy driven by a data center that was, were the lease was coming up, and so they had to plan to evacuate that data center into the cloud from there they need to figure out what applications they're running there obviously the virtualization also was there, so that had to be configured in the cloud. So we started thinking about in that use case that we need to provide these triggers and strategy points to our customers. At the same time the other shift that we saw was that these guys were not just talking amongst the infrastructure teams, they had to talk to the application owners and they had to have conversations with CFO's to talk about the economics of the clouds. So we made sure that when we build this that give them the tools that enable them to talk to various stakeholders. Give them the application footprint that is running there. Give them the economics. What it is going to cost to run these applications and workloads that they have identify too when they're in the cloud. So give them the data point that they can go and talk to their CFO. So with that really it starts shaping a product that will meet their needs and meet the needs of all of our customers. >> Lisa: Jennifer, favorite customer example. >> Oh, it's easy this week because it's all about WuXi NextCODE and I don't know if you picked up on any of their story cause we've plastered it around our conference this week because we're so proud of, not only what they're doing as a mission which is very impressive in terms of genomics sequencing and the scale at which they're doing it but the fact that they've based their foundation now on NetApp Cloud Volume services is huge. And really what they came to us and said is: "Look, we are trying to sequence all of these genomes "in parallel and our benchmark is really to look at about "a hundred thousand individuals at once." When they were trying to do that on their own, using there own self-managed storage in the cloud, they could never complete it. It would either fail or they would have some sort of a problem where they just couldn't get it to work. And with NetApp Cloud Volume Service they were able to complete in about 45 minutes. And so what their finding is again with this extreme performance, with the ability to scale and most importantly the tie it back to our discussion, it's multi-cloud, they themselves are multi-cloud because of their big pharma and hospitals that they serve. They have customers in every one of those public clouds and so we are able to help them where ever they need us to be. And that's very exciting. >> It's also one of those great examples that everybody understands. Genomic sequencing related to healthcare, you know disease predictions and things like that. So it's a story that resonates well. >> Jennifer: Sure. >> But something that you just said sort of reminded me of one of the four principles that George Kurian talked about this morning. And speed is the new scale. And this sounds like a customer who's achieving that in spades. >> Well it's so fun because I think for a long time we've been really fast On-prem and I think people have just sort of come to expect a certain level of it's good enough in the public cloud and what we're showing them in droves again on AWS GCP or with Azure is that you should expect more. Particularly for high-performance computing workloads or things that you really just, if you're moving your SAP workloads to the cloud and speed is, there is no option it has to be fast. We are showing people now possibilities that they didn't ever dream of before because of this extreme performance through things like Cloud Volumes Service. >> It's really too bad you guys aren't excited about this. (laughs) >> I know how much longer do you have? >> (laughs) Jennifer, Alok, thank you so much for stopping by and having a chat with Stu and me. And talking about how customers are really helping NetApp become a data authority that they need to be to help customers become data driven. We appreciate your time. >> It's our pleasure. >> Have a great time at the rest of the show. >> Thank you. >> Thank you both. >> Thank you. >> For Stu Miniman, I'm Lisa Martin. You're watching theCUBE live from NetApp Insight 2018, from Mandalay Bay, Las Vegas. Stick around Stu and I will be back shortly with our next guest. (electronic music)