[Music] from the cube studios in Palo Alto in Boston it's the cube covering the IBM think brought to you by IBM hi everybody we're back and this is Dave Valentine you're watching the cubes coverage of the IBM think 20/20 digital event experience lisa cisco is here she's the global head of go to market and IBM cloud at wit-pro Lisa good to see you thanks for coming on how you doing you're welcome how things holding up down in Florida you guys staying safe good working from home like like most of us everyone's doing good so I want to ask you don't go right to it talk about digital transformation and I want to get your take and maybe share some thoughts that we've heard from clients but digital transformation you're kind of in the heart of it you've got cloud you do and work with cognitive and AI and and blockchain and and the like so what are you seeing in terms of how clients are adopting this notion this digital transformation journey and how has kovat affected that great question so the hopefully the digital transformation won't always be about Kovan but there always will be a need for companies to move quickly and adopt new technologies and do things that are unexpected whether that's from an acquisition or an unexpected competitive move or new market that they want to be in so any of those things and affect businesses and what we're seeing right now is businesses who have adopted digital technology and by extension adopted cloud as the backbone to that digital technology have been able to move faster in this environment they're able to do things like work from home they're able to ensure security is in place they're able to give their employees and their customers access to information in a faster and more cost-effective way and so we're really not excited to have coated but we're really it's an interesting time to be looking at digital technologies and first mover advantages here and the digital Tudo era is all about enabling business responsiveness and those are the things that we're doing with the technology plays that we're working on today yeah I mean the customers we've talked to the the CIOs the CISOs they've said in many hard-hit industries hey we basically has shut down spending with some exceptions digital transformation being one of them you've got experience in two areas that are being affected pretty dramatically by kovat want a supply chain on the other is e-commerce you know supply chains are just you know especially for a while we're just in shambles or seeming to come back you know a little bit but what have you seen from the supply chain and what do you think what kind of changes do you expect are gonna be affected by koban going forward so again this was an area that if you had invested in your supply chain and you have automated some of those processes you're having an easier time onboarding your suppliers and knowing where your shipments are and understanding what your forward-looking position is going to be if you haven't done those things um even though your IT budgets might be being slashed they're things that you have to do right now and so doing some of those things using supply chain automation on the cloud it's it's um it's the right way for companies to go right now that find themself in a predicament and maybe aren't as prepared as they'd like to be so some of the technologies that we're helping bring to market we've we're seeing results with with things like five times faster adoption and 40% more cost efficient than if they weren't trying to do these things in an automated way using the cloud and so for companies that that need help doing this iBM has some of the best supply chain solutions in the market and and Wipro certainly has years of experience bringing those turquoise and then e-commerce is the other one I mean obviously there's been an explosion nobody wants to go out if they don't have to we're ordering anything and everything online there's been a kind of similar situation right if you if you had your kind of e-commerce you know we have you been running water through the pipes and you've perfected that over the last you know a couple of years or part of a decade then you're in pretty good shape but what are you seeing there with if you didn't have a loyal customer base now the time to really get used to interacting with your customers in that way so restaurants for example think the local mom-and-pop shops I live in a small town outside of Orlando and I'm seeing little businesses get online and and sew clothing and wine and things that they wouldn't normally see and dabbling in e-commerce so it's it's really comfortable for most people now to buy things online and we're seeing services that you wouldn't normally be be having online things like education k12 all allerjies everything can be pretty much bought on-line these days or consumed in a digital format and so I think again customers that have experience in doing this are ahead of the curve and customers that don't are going to quickly find that they have too I want to turn our attention to in the conversation to cloud and get your perspectives I mean I've reported a number of times that you know the IBM cloud it's not it's not an infrastructure as a service and the race to the bottom obviously IBM offers infrastructure of service but IBM strategy is not to try to take AWS head-on and you know storage cost per bit it's really to bring value through its software estate and portfolio and help its customers really take advantage of that the cloud model how are you and your clients taking advantage of the IBM cloud what kind of solutions do you have that are that are specific that leverage the IBM cloud that's correct we have two solutions that we're working on building out with with IBM and leveraging hybrid clouds so for an environment where 94% of enterprises have multiple clouds now they all have a combination of AWS or Azure or private clouds or IBM cloud and 73% of our clients see the ability to move between those clouds as a high priority and we are addressing that with two main solutions that we've built out at with row one is called our boundary list enterprise solution and you can think of that as the infrastructure and the knowledge we've taken the knowledge from thousands of successful hybrid cloud migrations that we've done and we've built it into this framework to help our customers be able to have a single dashboard and manage their view across hybrid cloud in an automated way and be able to be nimble and move between those clouds as business requirements it demand that they do and so that's the boundary-less Enterprise side the other side that we're working on with IBM is the application and integration modernization and we have a solution that we call moderniser and that is using some of the IBM technologies some third-party technologies and again the with our knowledge from our successful engagement and making it so that we can easily see what the workload is going to be to contain a rise and a single integration methodology that we're going to be bringing to our clients to help them be able to do this in a in an automated in a better way a faster way a more economical way so those are the two things that we're working on now and some of IBM's products are under the covers things like multiple cloud manager some of their DevOps and automation tools and there's some some tools again from third parties in firmware that we've brought in there as well so the boundary let's enterprise them in the idea there is that you've got a layer that allows you to go across clouds and have the same experience whether you're on pram whether you're in an Amazon Cloud and IBM cloud as you're wherever is that correct and it's a single sort of cloud experience single dashboard you know glass that you can look and you can serve you know in an IT environment your constituents the best way possible so that you're not locked into any cloud vendor and you can take advantage of where your workloads need to go and the modernization piece the modernized moderniser you talk about how clients are approaching it where do they start when they modernize their applicants that they do kind of and you help them do an application portfolio assessment they identify the high value workloads in their portfolio maybe the ones that they're going to sunset is a rationalization exercise the first step may be to talk about that every client is different but if the plant was to approach us and recommend the best practice we actually have a free two-week consulting engagement that we use for our clients that take a look at the workloads that they have and potentially will want to move to good we help them organize those workloads and figure out what the low-hanging fruit will be the things that will take a little bit more time on the things that are going to give them the highest bang for the buck and we will make some recommendations to them and that that two-week engagement about how to get started what about the I wanna shift gears talk about the you guys done in India with the Novus lab what is that all about what kind of expertise is there how does how two clients take advantage of that so we in IBM and out of the first soon-to-be announced we've just built it and we're soon to launch the I began with pro nobis loan you know this is the latin word from new or for innovation and that's what we plan to be doing in this lounge together so we have we pro talent and 150 seats where we'll have clients and different experts coming in and in residing in that center as well as access to all of the products i just talked about we'll be working closely with the IBM on GSI labs and bringing in new technologies building out new solutions so everything from taking supply chain to the next step to adding additional industry solutions one of the first things that we're going to do in that IBM Davis line just take advantage of the new IBM finance services cloud which is going to be a covering cloud focused at that industry and we're really excited to get started working on that technology to bring in our clients so ok so that's a that's an example of an industry solution and it's what it's it's optimized or for for banking and financial services or explain that if you would that's correct so iBM has worked with their clients in the financial services industry and they have packaged some of the governance and security and regulations that are needed for the financial services industry and they've put that into a solution that they'll be rolling out shortly I'm sure you'll hear more about it at IBM thing and that solution is going to be based on the industry guidelines by country on rolling out in the US and then shortly to Europe and we're going to be able to use that to jumpstart a lot of the workloads that we want to bring to our financial services clients without having to make them reinvent the wheel or all of the governance and security and regulatory things that they need well I can see you guys doing this across multiple industries kind of an out of the box you know tune something for retail government financial services Manufacturing healthcare where you've got the the requisite of security and compliance edicts depending on where you are in the world if it's a global organization you're able to you know identify what those local laws are maybe there's certain analytics capabilities and dashboards that you'd include is that is that kind of the right way to think about this that's exactly where we're headed and we're already starting to talk about healthcare as the next industry where we tackling after the services yeah well I mean the healthcare is that there are so heads down right now yeah believe you know we could think they'd come out of this and take a take a little breather and then can really you know get back to some of the more strategic things that they want to do in the industry I'll leave you with the last word kind of where you see the IBM Wipro partnership going you know what's your vision for that we really like IBM's approach in terms of avoiding vendor lock-in but we love what's happened with the acquisition of Red Hat and being able to use that technology more easily in our solutions we think that the industry approach is the right approach all of those things will have our focus in the noon double Ange this year and so while things are unusual in this current environment and we have a lot of things that we have to do immediately to help our clients just be able to survive we're very much looking to the future and what we can bring when this is all over that will help our clients make sure that they're ready for whatever the next Rose might be well Lisa thanks very much for coming on the cube you got a deep experience appreciate you sharing that with our with our audience they say you're welcome and thank you for watching everybody this is Dave Volante for the cube and our continuing coverage wall-to-wall coverage of IBM think 2020 the digital event experience you watch in the cube we were right back right after this short break [Music] you

(upbeat music) >> The transformation of Dell into Dell EMC and now Dell Technologies has been one of the most remarkable stories in the history of the enterprise technology industry. The company has gone from a Wall Street darling rocket ship PC company, to a middling enterprise player forced to go private, to a debt-laden powerhouse that controlled one of the most valuable assets in enterprise tech i.e VMware. And now is a 100 billion dollar giant with a low margin business, a strong balance sheet, and the broadest hardware portfolio in the industry. Financial magic that Dell went through would make anyone's head spin. The last lever of Dell EMC, of the Dell EMC deal was detailed in Michael Dell's book, "Play Nice But Win." In a captivating chapter called Harry You and the Bolt from the Blue, Michael Dell described how he and his colleagues came up with the final straw of how to finance the deal. If you haven't read it, you should. And, of course, after years of successfully integrating EMC and becoming VMware's number one distribution channel, all of this culminated in the spin out of VMware from Dell in a massive wealth creation milestone. Pending, of course, the Broadcom acquisition of VMware. So where's that leave Dell and what does the future look like for this technology powerhouse? Hello, and welcome to theCUBE's exclusive coverage of Dell Technology Summit 2022. My name is Dave Vellante and I'll be hosting the program. Now, today in conjunction with the Dell Tech Summit, we're going to hear from four of Dell's senior executives Tom Sweet, who's the CFO of Dell Technologies. He's going to share his views on the company's position and opportunities going forward. He's going to answer the question, why is Dell a good long-term investment? Then we'll hear from Jeff Boudreau who's the president of Dell's ISG business. That unit is the largest profit driver of Dell. He's going to talk about the product angle and specifically, how Dell is thinking about solving the multi-cloud challenge. And then Sam Grocott who is the senior vice president of marketing will come on the program and give us the update on Apex, which is Dell's as-a-service offering, and then the new edge platform called Project Frontier. Now, it's also Cyber Security Awareness month that we're going to see if Sam has anything to say about that. Then finally, for a company that's nearly 40 years old, Dell actually has some pretty forward-thinking philosophies when it comes to its culture and workforce. And we're going to speak with Jennifer Saavedra who's Dell's chief human resource officer about hybrid work and how Dell is thinking about the future of work. However, before we get into all this, I want to share our independent perspectives on the company and some research that will introduce to frame the program. Now, as you know, we love data here at theCUBE and one of our partners, ETR has what we believe is the best spending intentions data for enterprise tech. So here's a graphic that shows ETR's proprietary net score methodology in the vertical axis. That's a measure of spending velocity. And on the x-axis is overlap of pervasiveness in the data sample. This is a cut for just the server, the storage, and the client sectors within the ETR taxonomy. So you can see Dell CSG products, laptops in particular are dominant on both the X and the Y dimensions. CSG is the client solutions group and accounts for nearly 60% of Dell's revenue and about half of its operating income. And then the arrow signifies that dot that represents Dell's ISG business that we're going to talk to Jeff Boudreau about. That's the infrastructure solutions group. Now, ISG accounts for the bulk of the remainder of Dell's business and it is, as I said, it's most profitable from a margin standpoint. It comprises the EMC storage business as well as the Dell server business and Dell's networking portfolio. And as a note, we didn't include networking in that cut. Had we done so, SISCO would've dominated the graphic. And frankly, Dell's networking business is an industry-leading in the same way that PCs, servers, and storage are. And as you can see, the data confirms the leadership position Dell has in its client side, its server and its storage sectors. But the nuance is look at that red dotted line at 40% on the vertical axis. That represents a highly elevated net score and every company in the sector is below that line. Now, we should mention that we also filtered the data for those companies with more than a 100 mentions in the survey, but the point remains the same. This is a mature business that generally is lower margin. Storage is the exception but cloud has put pressure on margins even in that business in addition to the server space. The last point on this graphic is we put a box around VMware and it's prominently present on both the X and Y dimensions. VMware participates with purely software-defined high margin offerings in these spaces, and it gives you a sense of what might have been had Dell chosen to hold onto that asset or spin it into the company. But let's face it, the alternatives from Michael Dell were just too attractive and it's unlikely that a spin in would've unlocked the value in the way a spin-out did, at least not in the near future. So let's take a look at the snapshot of Dell's financials to give you a sense of where the company stands today. Dell is a company with over a 100 billion dollars in revenue. Last quarter, it did more than 26 billion in revenue and grew at a quite amazing 9% rate for a company that size. But because it's a hardware company primarily, its margins are low with operating income 10% of revenue and at 21% gross margin. With VMware on Dell's income statement, before the spin its gross margins were in the low 30s. Now, Dell only spends about 2% of revenue on R&D because because it's so big, it's still a lot of money. And you can see it is cash flow positive, Dell's free cash flow over the trailing 12-month period is 3.7 billion but that's only 3.5% of trailing 12-month revenue. Dell's Apex and of course it's hardware maintenance business is recurring revenue and that is only about 5 billion in revenue and it's growing at 8% annually. Now having said that, it's the equivalent of Service now's total revenue. Of course, Service now has 23% operating margin and 16% free cash flow margin and more than $5 billion in cash on the balance sheet and an 85 billion dollar market cap. That's what software will do for you. Now, Dell, like most companies, is staring at a challenging macro environment with FX headwinds, inflation, et cetera. You've heard the story, and hence it's conservative and contracting revenue guidance. But the balance sheet transformation has been quite amazing thanks to VMware's cash flow. Michael Dell and his partners from Silver Lake et al, they put up around $4 billion of their own cash to buy EMC for $67 billion and of course got VMware in the process. Most of that financing was debt that Dell put on its balance sheet to do the transaction to the tune of $46 billion it added to the balance sheet debt. Now, Dell's debt, the core debt, net of its financing operation is now down to 16 billion and it has 7 billion in cash in the balance sheet. So dramatic delta from just a few years ago. So pretty good picture. But Dell, a 100 billion company, is still only valued at 28 billion or around 26 cents on the revenue dollar. HPE's revenue multiple is around 60 cents on the revenue dollar. HP Inc, Dell's laptop and PC competitor, is around 45 cents. IBM's revenue multiple is almost two times. By the way, IBM has more than $50 billion in debt thanks to the Red Hat acquisition. And Cisco has a revenue multiple, it's over 3X, about 3.3X currently. So is Dell undervalued? Well, based on these comparisons with its peers, I'd say yes and no. Dell's performance relative to its peers in the market is very strong. It's winning and has an extremely adept go to market machine. But it's lack of software content and it's margin profile leads one to believe that if it can continue to pull some valuation levers while entering new markets, it can get its valuation well above where it is today. So what are some of those levers and what might that look like going forward? Despite the fact that Dell doesn't have a huge software revenue component, since spinning out VMware, and it doesn't own a cloud, it plays in virtually every part of the hardware market. And it can provide infrastructure for pretty much any application, in any use case, in pretty much any industry, in pretty much any geography in the world and it can serve those customers. So its size is an advantage. However, the history for hardware-heavy companies that try to get bigger has some notable failures. Namely HP which had to split into two businesses, HP Inc and HPE, and IBM which has had in abysmal decade from a performance standpoint and has had to shrink to grow again and obviously do a massive $34 billion acquisition of Red Hat. So why will Dell do any better than these two? Well, it has a fantastic supply chain. It's a founder-led company which makes a cultural difference, in our view, and it's actually comfortable with a low margin software light business model. Most certainly, IBM wasn't comfortable with that and didn't have these characteristics and HP was kind of just incomprehensible at the end. So Dell in my opinion is a much better chance of doing well at a 100 billion or over, but we'll see how it navigates through the current headwinds as it's guiding down. Apex is essentially Dell's version of the cloud. Now remember, Dell got started late. HPE is further along from a model standpoint with GreenLake. But Dell has a larger portfolio so they're going to try to play on that advantage. But at the end of the day, these as-a-service offerings are simply ways to bring a utility model to existing customers and generate recurring revenue. And that's a good thing because customers will be loyal to an incumbent if it can deliver as-a-service and reduce risk for customers. But the real opportunity lies ahead, specifically Dell is embracing the cloud model. It took a while, but they're on board. As Matt Baker, Dell's senior vice president of corporate strategy likes to say, it's not a zero sum game. What he means by that is just because Dell doesn't own its own cloud, it doesn't mean Dell can't build value on top of hyperscale clouds, what we call super cloud. And that's Dell's strategy to take advantage of public cloud CapEx and connect on-prem to the cloud, create a unified experience across clouds and out to the edge. That's ambitious and technically it's non-trivial. But listen to Dell's vice chairman and co-COO Jeff Clarke explain this vision. Please play the clip. >> You said also technology and business models are tied together and enabler. If you believe that, then you have to believe that it's a business operating system that they want. They want to leverage whatever they can and at the end of the day, they have to differentiate what they do. >> No, that's exactly right. If I take that and what Dave was saying and I summarize it the following way. If we can take these cloud assets and capabilities, combine them in an orchestrated way to deliver a distributed platform, game over. >> Yeah, pretty interesting, right? John Freer called it a business operating system. Essentially, I think of it sometimes as a cloud operating system or cloud operating environment to drive new business value on top of the hyperscale CapEx. Now, is it really game over as Jeff Clarke said, if Dell can do that? I'd say if it had that today, it might be game over for the competition but this vision will take years to play out, and of course it's got to be funded. And now it's going to take time and in this industry, it tends to move, companies tend to move in lockstep. So as often as the case, it's going to come down to execution and Dell's ability to enter new markets that are ideally, at least from my perspective, higher margin. Data management, extending data protection into cyber security as an adjacency and, of course, edge at Telco slash 5G opportunities. All there for the taking. I mean, look, even if Dell doesn't go after more higher margin software content, it can thrive with a lower margin model just by penetrating new markets and throwing off cash from those markets. But by keeping close to customers and maybe through tuck in acquisitions, it might be able to find the next nugget beyond today's cloud and on-prem models. And the last thing I'll call out is ecosystem. I say here ecosystem, ecosystem, ecosystem. Because a defining characteristic of a cloud player is ecosystem and if Apex is Dell's cloud, it has the opportunity to expand that ecosystem dramatically. This is one of the company's biggest opportunities and challenges at the same time, in my view. It's just scratching the surface on its partner ecosystem. And it's ecosystem today is is both reseller heavy and tech partner heavy. And that's not a bad thing, but it's starting to evolve more rapidly. The snowflake deal is an example of up to stack evolution. But I'd like to see much more out of that Snowflake relationship and more relationships like that. Specifically, I'd like to see more momentum with data and database. And if we live at a data heavy world, which we do, where the data and the database and data management offerings coexist and are super important to customers, I'd like to see that inside of Apex. I'd like to see that data play beyond storage which is really where it is today and it's early days. The point is, with Dell's go to market advantage, which company wouldn't treat Dell like the on-prem, hybrid, edge, super cloud player, that I want to partner with to drive more business? You'd be crazy not to. But Dell has a lot on its plate and we'd like to see some serious acceleration on the ecosystem front. In other words, Dell as both a selling partner and a business enabler with its platform. Its programmable infrastructure as-a-service. And that is a moving target that will rapidly involve. And, of course, we'll be here watching and reporting. So thanks for watching this preview of Dell Technology Summit 2022. I'm Dave Vellante, we hope you enjoy the rest of the program. (upbeat music)

>>from around the globe. It's the Cube presenting accelerating automation with definite brought to you by Cisco. >>Hello and welcome to the Cube. I'm John for a year host. We've got a great conversation virtual event, accelerating automation with definite Cisco. Definite. And of course, we got the Cisco Brain Trust here. Cube alumni Suzy we Vice President, senior Vice President GM and also CTO of Cisco. Definite and ecosystem Success C X, All that great stuff. Many Wadley Who's the director? Senior director of definite certifications. Eric Field, director of developer advocacy. Susie Mandy. Eric, Great to see you. Thanks for coming on. >>Great to see you down. So >>we're not in >>person. We >>don't Can't be at the definite zone. We can't be on site doing definite created All the great stuff we've been doing in the past three years were virtual the cube Virtual. Thanks for coming on. Uh, Susie, I gotta ask you because you know, we've been talking years ago when you started this mission and just the succession had has been awesome. But definite create has brought on a whole nother connective tissue to the definite community. This is what this ties into the theme of accelerating automation with definite because you said to me, I think four years ago everything should be a service or X a s is it's called and automation plays a critical role. Um, could you please share your vision? Because this is really important. And still only 5 to 10% of the enterprises have containerized things. So there's a huge growth curve coming with developing and program ability. What's your What's your vision? >>Yeah, absolutely. I mean, what we know is that is, more and more businesses are coming online is I mean, they're all online, But is there growing into the cloud? Is their growing in new areas as we're dealing with security is everyone's dealing with the pandemic. There's so many things going on. But what happens is there's an infrastructure that all of this is built on and that infrastructure has networking. It has security. It has all of your compute and everything that's in there. And what matters is how can you take a business application and tie it to that infrastructure. How can you take, you know, customer data? How can you take business applications? How can you connect up the world securely and then be ableto really satisfy everything that businesses need. And in order to do that, you know, the whole new tool that we've always talked about is that the network is programmable, the infrastructure is programmable, and you don't need just acts writing on top. But now they get to use all of that power of the infrastructure to perform even better. And in order to get there, what you need to do is automate everything. You can't configure networks manually. You can't be manually figuring out policies, but you want to use that agile infrastructure in which you can really use automation. You can rise to a higher level business processes and tie all of that up and down the staff by leveraging automation. >>You remember a few years ago when definite create first started, I interviewed Todd Nightingale and we're talking about Muraki. You know, not to get in the weeds, but you know, switches and hubs and wireless. But if you look at what we were talking about, then this is kind of what's going on now. And we were just recently, I think our last physical event was Cisco um Europe in Barcelona before all the cove it hit and you had the massive cloud surgeon scale happening going on right when the pandemic hit. And even now, more than ever, the cloud scale the modern APS. The momentum hasn't stopped because there's more pressure now to continue addressing Mawr innovation at scale. Because the pressure to do that because >>the stay alive get >>your thoughts on, um, what's going on in your world? Because you were there in person. Now we're six months in scale is huge. >>We are, Yeah, absolutely. And what happened is as all of our customers as businesses around the world as we ourselves all dealt with, How do we run a business from home? You know, how do we keep people safe? How do we keep people at home and how do we work? And then it turns out, you know, business keeps rolling, but we've had to automate even more because >>you >>have to go home and then figure out how from home can I make sure that my I t infrastructure is automated out from home? Can I make sure that every employee is out there in working safely and securely? You know, things like call center workers, which had to go into physical locations and being kind of, you know, just, you know, blocked off rooms to really be secure with their company's information. They had to work from home. So we had to extend business applications to people's homes in countries like, you know, well around the world. But also in India, where it was actually not, you know, not they wouldn't let They didn't have rules toe let people work from home in these areas. So then what we had to do was automate everything and make sure that we could administer. You know, all of our customers could administer these systems from home, so that puts extra stress on automation. It puts extra stress on our customers digital transformation. And it just forced them toe, you know, automate digitally transform quicker. And they had to because you couldn't just go into a server room and tweak your servers. You have to figure out how to automate all of that. >>You know, one of them >>were still there, all in that environment today. >>You know, one of the hottest trends before the pandemic was observe ability, uh, kubernetes serve micro services. So those things again. All Dev ups. And you know, if you guys got some acquisitions, you thought about 1000 eyes. Um, you got a new one you just bought recently Port shift to raise the game in security, Cuban, All these micro services, So observe, ability, superhot. But then people go work at home, as you mentioned. How do you think? Observe, What do you observing? The network is under huge pressure. I mean, it's crashing on. People zooms and WebEx is and education, huge amount of network pressure. How are people adapting to this in the upside? How are you guys looking at the what's being programmed? What are some of the things that you're seeing with use cases around this program? Ability, challenge and observe ability, challenges? It's a huge deal. >>Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, going back to Todd Nightingale, right? You know, back when we talked to Todd before he had Muraki and he had designed this simplicity, this ease of use, this cloud managed, you know, doing everything from one central place. And now he has This goes entire enterprise and cloud business. So he is now applying that at that Bigger Attn. Bigger scale. Francisco and for our customers. And he is building in the observe ability and the dashboards and the automation of the A P. I s and all of it. But when we take a look at what our customers needed is again, they had to build it all in, um, they had to build in. And what happened was how your network was doing, how secure your infrastructure was, how well you could enable people toe work from home and how well you could reach customers. All of that used to be a nightie conversation. It became a CEO and a board level conversation. So all of a sudden CEOs were actually, you know, calling on the heads of I t and the CEO and saying, You know, how is our VPN connectivity? Is everybody working from home? How many people are, you know, connected and ableto work and watch their productivity? Eso All of a sudden, all these things that were really infrastructure I t stuff became a board level conversation and you know, once again, at first everybody was panicked and just figuring out how to get people working. But now what we've seen in all of our customers is that they're now building in automation, additional transformation and these architectures, and that gives them a chance to build in that observe ability. You know, looking for those events. The dashboards, you know? So it really has been fantastic to see what our customers are doing and what our partners air doing to really rise to that next level. >>Susan, I know you gotta go, but real quick, um, describe what? Accelerating automation with definite means. >>Well, you've been fault. You know, we've been working together on definite in the vision of the infrastructure program ability and everything for quite some time. And the thing that's really happened is yes, you need to automate, but yes, it takes people to do that. And you need the right skill sets in the program ability. So a networker can't be a networker. A networker has to be a network automation developer. And so it is about people. And it is about bringing infrastructure expertise together with software expertise and letting people run. Things are definite. Community has risen to this challenge. People have jumped in. They've gotten their certifications. We have thousands of people getting certified. You know, we have you know, Cisco getting certified. We have individuals. We have partners, you know, They're just really rising to the occasion. So accelerate accelerating automation while it is about going digital. It's also about people rising to the level of, you know, being able to put infrastructure and software expertise together to enable this next chapter of business applications of cloud directed businesses and cloud growth. So it actually is about people, Justus, much as it is about automation and technology. >>And we got definite create right around the corner virtual. Unfortunately, being personal will be virtual Susie. Thank you for your time. We're gonna dig into those people challenges with Mandy and Eric. Thank you for coming on. I know you got to go, but stay with us. We're gonna dig in with Mandy and Eric. Thanks. >>Thank you so much. Thank you. Thanks, John. Okay. >>Mandy, you heard Susie is about people, and one of the things that's close to your heart you've been driving is a senior director of definite certifications. Um is getting people leveled up? I mean, the demand for skills cybersecurity, network program, ability, automation, network design solution, architect cloud multi cloud design thes are new skills that are needed. Can you give us the update on what you're doing to help people get into the acceleration of automation game? >>Oh, yes, absolutely. The you know what we've been seeing is a lot of those business drivers that Susie was mentioning those air. What's accelerating? A lot of the technology changes, and that's creating new job roles or new needs on existing job roles where they need new skills. We are seeing, uh, customers, partners, people in our community really starting to look at, you know, things like Dev SEC ops engineer, network Automation engineer, network automation developer, which sues you mentioned and looking at how these fit into their organization, the problems that they solve in their organization. And then how do people build the skills to be able to take on these new job roles or add that job role to their current, um, scope and broaden out and take on new challenges? >>Eric, I want to go to you for a quick second on this, um uh, piece of getting the certifications. Um, first, before you get started, describe what your role is. Director of developer advocacy, because that's always changing and evolving what's the state of it now? Because with Cove and people are working at home, they have more time to contact, switch and get some certifications and that they can code more. What's your >>What's your role? Absolutely So it's interesting. It definitely is changing a lot. A lot of our historically a lot of focus for my team has been on those outward events. So going to the definite creates the Cisco lives and helping the community connect and help share technical information with them, doing hands on workshops and really getting people into. How do you really start solving these problems? Eso that's had to pivot quite a bit. Obviously, Sisco live us. We pivoted very quickly to a virtual event when when conditions changed and we're able to actually connect, as we found out with a much larger audience. So you know, as opposed to in person where you're bound by the parameters of you know how big the convention center is. We were actually able to reach a worldwide audience with are definite day that was kind of attached onto Sisco Live, and we got great feedback from the audience that now we're actually able to get that same enablement out to so many more people that otherwise might not have been able to make it. But to your broader question of you know what my team does. So that's one piece of it is is getting that information out to the community. So as part of that, there's a lot of other things we do as well. We were always helping out build new sandboxes, new learning labs, things like that that they can come and get whenever they're looking for it out on the definite site. And then my team also looks after communities such as the Cisco Learning Network, where there's there's a huge community that has historically been there to support people working on their Cisco certifications. We've seen a huge shift now in that group that all of the people that have been there for years are now looking at the definite certifications and helping other people that are trying to get on board with program ability. They're taking a lot of those same community enablement skills and propping up community with, you know, helping answer questions, helping provide content. They move now into the definite spaces well and are helping people with that sort of certifications. So it's great seeing the community come along and really see that >>I gotta ask you on the trends around automation. What skills and what developer patterns are you seeing with automation? Are Is there anything in particular? Obviously, network automation been around for a long time. Cisco's been leader in that. But as you move up, the staff has modern applications or building. Do you see any patterns or trends around what is accelerating automation? What people learning? >>Yeah, absolutely. So you mentioned observe ability was big before Cove it and we actually really saw that amplified during co vid. So a lot of people have come to us looking for insights. How can I get that better observe ability now that we needed? Well, we're virtual eso. That's actually been a huge uptick, and we've seen a lot of people that weren't necessarily out looking for things before that air. Now, figuring out how can I do this at scale? I think one good example that Susie was talking about the VPN example, and we actually had a number of SCS in the Cisco community that had customers dealing with that very thing where they very quickly had to ramp up and one in particular actually wrote a bunch of automation to go out and measure all of the different parameters that I T departments might care about about their firewalls, things that you didn't normally look at. The old days you would size your firewalls based on, you know, assuming a certain number of people working from home. And when that number went to 100% things like licenses started coming into play where they need to make sure they had the right capacity in their platforms that they weren't necessarily designed for. So one of the essays actually wrote a bunch of code to go out, use them open source, tooling to monitor and alert on these things, and then published it so the whole community code could go out and get a copy of it. Try it out in their own environment. And we saw a lot of interest around that and trying to figure out Okay, now I could take that. I can adapt into what I need to see for my observe ability. >>That's great, Mandy, I want to get your thoughts on this, too, because as automation continues to scale. Um, it's gonna be a focus. People are at home. And you guys had a lot of content online for you. Recorded every session that in the definite zone learning is going on sometimes literally and non linearly. You've got the certifications, which is great. That's key. Great success there. People are interested. But what other learnings are you seeing? What are people, um, doing? What's the top top trends? >>Yeah. So what we're seeing is like you said, people are at home, they've got time, they want toe advance, their skill set. And just like any kind of learning, people want choice. They wanna be able to choose which matches their time that's available and their learning style. So we're seeing some people who want to dive into full online study groups with mentors leading them through a study plan. On we have two new expert lead study groups like that. We're also seeing whole teams at different companies who want to do an immersive learning experience together with projects and office hours and things like that. And we have a new offer that we've been putting together for people who want those kind of team experiences called Automation Boot Camp. And then we're also seeing individual who want to be able to, you know, dive into a topic, do a hands on lab, gets, um, skills, go to the rest of the day of do their work and then come back the next day. And so we have really modular, self driven hands on learning through the Definite Fundamentals course, which is available through DEV. Net. And then there's also people who are saying, I just want to use the technology. I like Thio experiment and then go, you know, read the instructions, read the manual, do the deeper learning. And so they're They're spending a lot of time in our definite sandbox, trying out different technologies. Cisco Technologies with open source technologies, getting hands on and building things, and three areas where we're seeing a lot of interest in specific technologies. One is around SD wan. There's a huge interest in people Skilling up there because of all the reasons that we've been talking about. Security is a focus area where people are dealing with new scale, new kinds of threats, having to deal with them in new ways and then automating their data center using infrastructure as code type principles. So those were three areas where we're seeing a lot of interest and you'll be hearing more about that at definite create. >>Awesome Eric and man, if you guys can wrap up the accelerated automated with definite package and virtual event here, um, and also t up definite create because definite create has been a very kind of grassroots, organically building momentum over the years. Again, it's super important because it's now the app world coming together with networking, you know, end to end program ability. And with everything is a service that you guys were doing everything with a piece. Um Onley can imagine the enablement that's gonna enable create Can >>you hear the >>memory real quick on accelerating automation with definite and TF definite create. Mandy will start with you. >>Yes, I'll go first, and then Eric can close this out. Um, so just like we've been talking about with you at every definite event over the past years, you know, Devon, it's bringing a p I s across our whole portfolio and up and down the stack and accelerating automation with definite. Suzy mentioned the people aspect of that the people Skilling up and how that transformed team transforms teams. And I think that it's all connected in how businesses are being pushed on their transformation because of current events. That's also a great opportunity for people to advance their careers and take advantage of some of that quickly changing landscape. And so would I think about accelerating automation with definite. It's about the definite community. It's about people getting those new skills and all the creativity and problem solving that will be unleashed by that community with those new skills. >>Eric, take us home. He accelerate automation. Definite and definite create a lot of developer action going on cloud native right now, your thoughts? >>Absolutely. I I think it's exciting. I mentioned the transition to virtual for definite day this year for Cisco Live, and we're seeing we're able to leverage it even further with create this year. So whereas it used to be, you know, confined by the walls that we were within for the event. Now we're actually able to do things like we're adding a start now track for people that I want to be there. They want to be a developer. Network automation developer, for instance, We've now got a track just for them where they could get started and start learning some of the skills they'll need, even if some of the other technical sessions were a little bit deeper than what they were ready for. Eso. I love that we're able to bring that together with the experience community that we usually do from across the industry, bringing us all kinds of innovative talks, talking about ways that they're leveraging technology, leveraging the cloud to do new and interesting things to solve their business challenges. So I'm really excited to bring that whole mixed together as well as getting some of our business units together to and talk straight from their engineering departments. What are they doing? What are they seeing? What are they thinking about when they're building new AP eyes into their platforms? What are the what problems are they hoping that customers will be able to solve with them? So I think together, seeing all of that and then bringing the community together from all of our usual channels. So, like I said, Cisco Learning Network, we've got a ton of community coming together, sharing their ideas and helping each other grow those skills. I see nothing but acceleration ahead of us for automation. >>Awesome. Thanks so much. God, man, can >>I add one had >>one more thing. >>Yeah, I was just going to say the other really exciting thing about create this year with the virtual nature of it is that it's happening in three regions. And, you know, we're so excited to see the people joining from all the different regions. And, uh, content and speakers and the region stepping upto have things personalized to their area to their community. And so that's a whole new experience for definite create that's going to be fantastic this year. >>You know, that's what God is going to close out and just put the final bow on that by saying that you guys have always been successful with great content focused on the people in the community. I think now, during with this virtual definite virtual definite create virtual the cube virtual, I think we're learning new things. People working in teams and groups on sharing content. We're gonna learn new things. We're gonna try new things, and ultimately people will rise up and will be resilient. I think when you have this kind of opportunity, it's really fun. And whoa, we'll ride the wave with you guys. So thank you so much for taking the time to come on. The Cuban talk about your awesome accelerate automation and definitely looking forward to it. Thank you. >>Thank you so much. >>Happy to be here. >>Okay, I'm John for the Cube. Virtual here in Palo Alto studios doing the remote content amendment Virtual until we're face to face. Thank you so much for watching. And we'll see you at definite create. Thanks for watching.

>>from around the globe. It's the Cube presenting accelerating automation with definite brought to you by Cisco. >>Hello and welcome to the Cube. I'm John for a year host. We've got a great conversation virtual event, accelerating automation with definite Cisco. Definite. And of course, we got the Cisco Brain Trust here. Cube alumni Suzy we Vice President, senior Vice President GM and also CTO of Cisco. Definite and ecosystem Success C X, All that great stuff. Many Wadley Who's the director? Senior director of definite certifications. Eric Field, director of developer advocacy. Susie Mandy. Eric, Great to see you. Thanks for coming on. >>Great to see you >>down. So we're not in person. We >>don't Can't be at the definite zone. We can't be on site doing definite created All the great stuff we've been doing in the past three years were virtual the cube Virtual. Thanks for coming on. Uh, Susie, I gotta ask you because you know, we've been talking years ago when you started this mission and just the succession had has been awesome. But definite create has brought on a whole nother connective tissue to the definite community. This is what this ties into the theme of accelerating automation with definite because you said to me, I think four years ago everything should be a service or X a s is it's called and automation plays a critical role. Um, could you please share your vision? Because this is really important. And still only 5 to 10% of the enterprises have containerized things. So there's a huge growth curve coming with developing and program ability. What's your What's your vision? >>Yeah, absolutely. I mean, what we know is that is, more and more businesses are coming online is I mean, they're all online, But is there growing into the cloud? Is their growing in new areas as we're dealing with security is everyone's dealing with the pandemic. There's so many things going on. But what happens is there's an infrastructure that all of this is built on and that infrastructure has networking. It has security. It has all of your compute and everything that's in there. And what matters is how can you take a business application and tie it to that infrastructure. How can you take, you know, customer data? How can you take business applications? How can you connect up the world securely and then be ableto really satisfy everything that businesses need. And in order to do that, you know, the whole new tool that we've always talked about is that the network is programmable, the infrastructure is programmable, and you don't need just acts writing on top. But now they get to use all of that power of the infrastructure to perform even better. And in order to get there, what you need to do is automate everything. You can't configure networks manually. You can't be manually figuring out policies, but you want to use that agile infrastructure in which you can really use automation. You can rise to a higher level business processes and tie all of that up and down the staff by leveraging automation. >>You remember a few years ago when definite create first started, I interviewed Todd Nightingale and we're talking about Muraki. You know, not to get in the weeds, but you know, switches and hubs and wireless. But if you look at what we were talking about, then this is kind of what's going on now. And we were just recently, I think our last physical event was Cisco um Europe in Barcelona before all the cove it hit and you had the massive cloud surgeon scale happening going on right when the pandemic hit. And even now, more than ever, the cloud scale the modern APS. The momentum hasn't stopped because there's more pressure now to continue addressing Mawr innovation at scale. Because the pressure to do that because >>the stay alive get >>your thoughts on, um, what's going on in your world? Because you were there in person. Now we're six months in scale is huge. >>We are, Yeah, absolutely. And what happened is as all of our customers as businesses around the world as we ourselves all dealt with, How do we run a business from home? You know, how do we keep people safe? How do we keep people at home and how do we work? And then it turns out, you know, business keeps rolling, but we've had to automate even more because >>you >>have to go home and then figure out how from home can I make sure that my I t infrastructure is automated out from home? Can I make sure that every employee is out there in working safely and securely? You know, things like call center workers, which had to go into physical locations and being kind of, you know, just, you know, blocked off rooms to really be secure with their company's information. They had to work from home. So we had to extend business applications to people's homes in countries like, you know, well around the world. But also in India, where it was actually not, you know, not they wouldn't let They didn't have rules toe let people work from home in these areas. So then what we had to do was automate everything and make sure that we could administer. You know, all of our customers could administer these systems from home, so that puts extra stress on automation. It puts extra stress on our customers digital transformation. And it just forced them toe, you know, automate digitally transform quicker. And they had to because you couldn't just go into a server room and tweak your servers. You have to figure out how to automate all of that. >>You know, one of them >>were still there, all in that environment today. >>You know, one of the hottest trends before the pandemic was observe ability, uh, kubernetes serve micro services. So those things again. All Dev ups. And you know, if you guys got some acquisitions, you thought about 1000 eyes. Um, you got a new one you just bought recently Port shift to raise the game in security, Cuban, All these micro services, So observe, ability, superhot. But then people go work at home, as you mentioned. How do you think? Observe, What do you observing? The network is under huge pressure. I mean, it's crashing on. People zooms and WebEx is and education, huge amount of network pressure. How are people adapting to this in the upside? How are you guys looking at the what's being programmed? What are some of the things that you're seeing with use cases around this program? Ability, challenge and observe ability, challenges? It's a huge deal. >>Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, going back to Todd Nightingale, right? You know, back when we talked to Todd before he had Muraki and he had designed this simplicity, this ease of use, this cloud managed, you know, doing everything from one central place. And now he has This goes entire enterprise and cloud business. So he is now applying that at that Bigger Attn. Bigger scale. Francisco and for our customers. And he is building in the observe ability and the dashboards and the automation of the A P. I s and all of it. But when we take a look at what our customers needed is again, they had to build it all in, um, they had to build in. And what happened was how your network was doing, how secure your infrastructure was, how well you could enable people toe work from home and how well you could reach customers. All of that used to be a nightie conversation. It became a CEO and a board level conversation. So all of a sudden CEOs were actually, you know, calling on the heads of I t and the CEO and saying, You know, how is our VPN connectivity? Is everybody working from home? How many people are, you know, connected and ableto work and watch their productivity? Eso All of a sudden, all these things that were really infrastructure I t stuff became a board level conversation and you know, once again, at first everybody was panicked and just figuring out how to get people working. But now what we've seen in all of our customers is that they're now building in automation, additional transformation and these architectures, and that gives them a chance to build in that observe ability. You know, looking for those events. The dashboards, you know? So it really has been fantastic to see what our customers are doing and what our partners air doing to really rise to that next level. >>Susan, I know you gotta go, but real quick, um, describe what? Accelerating automation with definite means. >>Well, you've been fault. You know, we've been working together on definite in the vision of the infrastructure program ability and everything for quite some time. And the thing that's really happened is yes, you need to automate, but yes, it takes people to do that. And you need the right skill sets in the program ability. So a networker can't be a networker. A networker has to be a network automation developer. And so it is about people. And it is about bringing infrastructure expertise together with software expertise and letting people run. Things are definite. Community has risen to this challenge. People have jumped in. They've gotten their certifications. We have thousands of people getting certified. You know, we have you know, Cisco getting certified. We have individuals. We have partners, you know, They're just really rising to the occasion. So accelerate accelerating automation while it is about going digital. It's also about people rising to the level of, you know, being able to put infrastructure and software expertise together to enable this next chapter of business applications of cloud directed businesses and cloud growth. So it actually is about people, Justus, much as it is about automation and technology. >>And we got definite create right around the corner virtual. Unfortunately, being personal will be virtual Susie. Thank you for your time. We're gonna dig into those people challenges with Mandy and Eric. Thank you for coming on. I know you got to go, but stay with us. We're gonna dig in with Mandy and Eric. Thanks. >>Thank you so much. Thank you. Thanks, John. Okay. >>Mandy, you heard Susie is about people, and one of the things that's close to your heart you've been driving is a senior director of definite certifications. Um is getting people leveled up? I mean, the demand for skills cybersecurity, network program, ability, automation, network design solution, architect cloud multi cloud design thes are new skills that are needed. Can you give us the update on what you're doing to help people get into the acceleration of automation game? >>Oh, yes, absolutely. The you know what we've been seeing is a lot of those business drivers that Susie was mentioning those air. What's accelerating? A lot of the technology changes, and that's creating new job roles or new needs on existing job roles where they need new skills. We are seeing, uh, customers, partners, people in our community really starting to look at, you know, things like Dev SEC ops engineer, network Automation engineer, network automation developer, which sues you mentioned and looking at how these fit into their organization, the problems that they solve in their organization. And then how do people build the skills to be able to take on these new job roles or add that job role to their current, um, scope and broaden out and take on new challenges? >>Eric, I want to go to you for a quick second on this, um uh, piece of getting the certifications. Um, first, before you get started, describe what your role is. Director of developer advocacy, because that's always changing and evolving what's the state of it now? Because with Cove and people are working at home, they have more time to contact, switch and get some certifications and that they can code more. What's your >>What's your role? Absolutely So it's interesting. It definitely is changing a lot. A lot of our historically a lot of focus for my team has been on those outward events. So going to the definite creates the Cisco lives and helping the community connect and help share technical information with them, doing hands on workshops and really getting people into. How do you really start solving these problems? Eso that's had to pivot quite a bit. Obviously, Sisco live us. We pivoted very quickly to a virtual event when when conditions changed and we're able to actually connect, as we found out with a much larger audience. So you know, as opposed to in person where you're bound by the parameters of you know how big the convention center is. We were actually able to reach a worldwide audience with are definite day that was kind of attached onto Sisco Live, and we got great feedback from the audience that now we're actually able to get that same enablement out to so many more people that otherwise might not have been able to make it. But to your broader question of you know what my team does. So that's one piece of it is is getting that information out to the community. So as part of that, there's a lot of other things we do as well. We were always helping out build new sandboxes, new learning labs, things like that that they can come and get whenever they're looking for it out on the definite site. And then my team also looks after communities such as the Cisco Learning Network, where there's there's a huge community that has historically been there to support people working on their Cisco certifications. We've seen a huge shift now in that group that all of the people that have been there for years are now looking at the definite certifications and helping other people that are trying to get on board with program ability. They're taking a lot of those same community enablement skills and propping up community with, you know, helping answer questions, helping provide content. They move now into the definite spaces well and are helping people with that sort of certifications. So it's great seeing the community come along and really see that >>I gotta ask you on the trends around automation. What skills and what developer patterns are you seeing with automation? Are Is there anything in particular? Obviously, network automation been around for a long time. Cisco's been leader in that. But as you move up, the staff has modern applications or building. Do you see any patterns or trends around what is accelerating automation? What people learning? >>Yeah, absolutely. So you mentioned observe ability was big before Cove it and we actually really saw that amplified during co vid. So a lot of people have come to us looking for insights. How can I get that better observe ability now that we needed? Well, we're virtual eso. That's actually been a huge uptick, and we've seen a lot of people that weren't necessarily out looking for things before that air. Now, figuring out how can I do this at scale? I think one good example that Susie was talking about the VPN example, and we actually had a number of SCS in the Cisco community that had customers dealing with that very thing where they very quickly had to ramp up and one in particular actually wrote a bunch of automation to go out and measure all of the different parameters that I T departments might care about about their firewalls, things that you didn't normally look at. The old days you would size your firewalls based on, you know, assuming a certain number of people working from home. And when that number went to 100% things like licenses started coming into play where they need to make sure they had the right capacity in their platforms that they weren't necessarily designed for. So one of the essays actually wrote a bunch of code to go out, use them open source, tooling to monitor and alert on these things, and then published it so the whole community code could go out and get a copy of it. Try it out in their own environment. And we saw a lot of interest around that and >>trying >>to figure out Okay, now I could take that. I can adapt into what I need to see for my observe ability. >>That's great, Mandy, I want to get your thoughts on this, too, because as automation continues to scale. Um, it's gonna be a focus. People are at home. And you guys had a lot of content online for you. Recorded every session that in the definite zone learning is going on sometimes literally and non linearly. You've got the certifications, which is great. That's key. Great success there. People are interested. But what other learnings are you seeing? What are people, um, doing? What's the top top trends? >>Yeah. So what we're seeing is like you said, people are at home, they've got time, they want toe advance, their skill set. And just like any kind of learning, people want choice. They wanna be able to choose which matches their time that's available and their learning style. So we're seeing some people who want to dive into full online study groups with mentors leading them through a study plan. On we have two new expert lead study groups like that. We're also seeing whole teams at different companies who want to do an immersive learning experience together with projects and office hours and things like that. And we have a new offer that we've been putting together for people who want those kind of team experiences called Automation Boot Camp. And then we're also seeing individual who want to be able to, you know, dive into a topic, do a hands on lab, gets, um, skills, go to the rest of the day of do their work and then come back the next day. And so we have really modular, self driven hands on learning through the Definite Fundamentals course, which is available through DEV. Net. And then there's also people who are saying, I just want to use the technology. I like Thio experiment and then go, you know, read the instructions, read the manual, do the deeper learning. And so they're They're spending a lot of time in our definite sandbox, trying out different technologies. Cisco Technologies with open source technologies, getting hands on and building things, and three areas where we're seeing a lot of interest in specific technologies. One is around SD wan. There's a huge interest in people Skilling up there because of all the reasons that we've been talking about. Security is a focus area where people are dealing with new scale, new kinds of threats, having to deal with them in new ways and then automating their data center using infrastructure as code type principles. So those were three areas where we're seeing a lot of interest and you'll be hearing more about that at definite create. >>Awesome Eric and man, if you guys can wrap up the accelerated automated with definite package and virtual event here, um, and also t up definite create because definite create has been a very kind of grassroots, organically building momentum over the years. Again, it's super important because it's now the app world coming together with networking, you know, end to end program ability. And with everything is a service that you guys were doing everything with a piece. Um Onley can imagine the enablement that's gonna enable create Can >>you hear the >>memory real quick on accelerating automation with definite and TF definite create. Mandy will start with you. >>Yes, I'll go first, and then Eric can close this out. Um, so just like we've been talking about with you at every definite event over the past years, you know, Devon, it's bringing a p I s across our whole portfolio and up and down the stack and accelerating automation with definite. Suzy mentioned the people aspect of that the people Skilling up and how that transformed team transforms teams. And I think that it's all connected in how businesses are being pushed on their transformation because of current events. That's also a great opportunity for people to advance their careers and take advantage of some of that quickly changing landscape. And so would I think about accelerating automation with definite. It's about the definite community. It's about people getting those new skills and all the creativity and problem solving that will be unleashed by that community with those new skills. >>Eric, take us home. He accelerate automation. Definite and definite create a lot of developer action going on cloud native right now, your thoughts? >>Absolutely. I I think it's exciting. I mentioned the transition to virtual for definite day this year for Cisco Live, and we're seeing we're able to leverage it even further with create this year. So whereas it used to be, you know, confined by the walls that we were within for the event. Now we're actually able to do things like we're adding a start now track for people that I want to be there. They want to be a developer. Network automation developer, for instance, We've now got a track just for them where they could get started and start learning some of the skills they'll need, even if some of the other technical sessions were a little bit deeper than what they were ready for. Eso. I love that we're able to bring that together with the experience community that we usually do from across the industry, bringing us all kinds of innovative talks, talking about ways that they're leveraging technology, leveraging the cloud to do new and interesting things to solve their business challenges. So I'm really excited to bring that whole mixed together as well as getting some of our business units together to and talk straight from their engineering departments. What are they doing? What are they seeing? What are they thinking about when they're building new AP eyes into their platforms? What are the what problems are they hoping that customers will be able to solve with them? So I think together, seeing all of that and then bringing the community together from all of our usual channels. So, like I said, Cisco Learning Network, we've got a ton of community coming together, sharing their ideas and helping each other grow those skills. I see nothing but acceleration ahead of us for automation. >>Awesome. Thanks so much. God, man, can >>I add one had >>one more thing. >>Yeah, I was just going to say the other really exciting thing about create this year with the virtual nature of it is that it's happening in three regions. And, you know, we're so excited to see the people joining from all the different regions. And, uh, content and speakers and the region stepping upto have things personalized to their area to their community. And so that's a whole new experience for definite create that's going to be fantastic this year. >>You know, that's what God is going to close out and just put the final bow on that by saying that you guys have always been successful with great content focused on the people in the community. I think now, during with this virtual definite virtual definite create virtual the cube virtual, I think we're learning new things. People working in teams and groups on sharing content. We're gonna learn new things. We're gonna try new things, and ultimately people will rise up and will be resilient. I think when you have this kind of opportunity, it's really fun. And whoa, we'll ride the wave with you guys. So thank you so much for taking the time to come on. The Cuban talk about your awesome accelerate automation and definitely looking forward to it. Thank you. >>Thank you so much. >>Happy to be here. >>Okay, I'm John for the Cube. Virtual here in Palo Alto studios doing the remote content amendment Virtual until we're face to face. Thank you so much for watching. And we'll see you at definite create. Thanks for watching.

>> Narrator: From the Cube Studios in Palo Alto in Boston, connecting with thought leaders all around the world, this is a CUBE conversation. >> Hi, and welcome to this CUBE conversation, I'm Stu Min and I'm coming to you from our Boston area studio, we've been digging in with the Pensando team, understand how they're fitting into the cloud, multi-cloud, edge discussion, really thrilled to welcome to the program, first time guest, Silvano Gai, he's a fellow with Pensando. Silvano, really nice to see you again, thanks so much for joining us on theCUBE. >> Stuart, it's so nice to see you, we used to work together many years ago and that was really good and is really nice to come to you from Oregon, from Bend, Oregon. A beautiful town in the high desert of Oregon. >> I do love the Pacific North West, I miss the planes and the hotels, I should say, I don't miss the planes and the hotels, but going to see some of the beautiful places is something I do miss and getting to see people in the industry I do like. As you mentioned, you and I crossed paths back through some of the spin-ins, back when I was working for a very large storage company, you were working for SISCO, you were known for writing the book, you were a professor in Italy, many of the people that worked on some of those technologies were your students. But Silvano, my understanding is you retired so, maybe share for our audience, what brought you out of that retirement and into working once again with some of your former colleagues and on the Pensando opportunity. >> I did retire for a while, I retired in 2011 from Cisco if I remember correctly. But at the end of 2016, beginning of 2017, some old friend that you may remember and know called me to discuss some interesting idea, which was basically the seed idea that is behind the Pensando product and their idea were interesting, what we built, of course, is not exactly the original idea because you know product evolve over time, but I think we have something interesting that is adequate and probably superb for the new way to design the data center network, both for enterprise and cloud. >> All right, and Silvano, I mentioned that you've written a number of books, really the authoritative look on when some new products had been released before. So, you've got a new book, "Building a Future-Proof Cloud Infrastructure," and look at you, you've got the physical copy, I've only gotten the soft version. The title, really interesting. Help us understand how Pensando's platform is meeting that future-proof cloud infrastructure that you discuss. >> Well, network have evolved dramatically in the data center and in the cloud. You know, now the speed of classical server in enterprise is probably 25 gigabits, in the cloud we are talking of 100 gigabit of speed for a server, going to 200 gigabit. Now, the backbone are ridiculously fast. We no longer use Spanning Tree and all the stuff, we no longer use access code aggregation. We switched to closed network, and with closed network, we have huge enormous amount of bandwidth and that is good but it also imply that is not easy to do services in a centralized fashion. If you want to do a service in a centralized fashion, what you end up doing is creating a giant bottleneck. You basically, there is this word that is being used, that is trombone or tromboning. You try to funnel all this traffic through the bottleneck and this is not really going to work. The only place that you can really do services is at the edge, and this is not an invention, I mean, even all the principles of cloud is move everything to the edge and maintain the network as simple as possible. So, we approach services with the same general philosophy. We try to move services to the edge, as close as possible to the server and basically at the border between the sever and the network. And when I mean services I mean three main categories of services. The networking services of course, there is the basic layer, two-layer, three stuff, plus the bonding, you know VAMlog and what is needed to connect a server to a network. But then there is the overlay, overlay like the xLAN or Geneva, very very important, basically to build a cloud infrastructure, and that are basically the network service. We can have others but that, sort of is the core of a network service. Some people want to run BGP layers, some people don't want to run BGP. There may be a VPN or kind of things like that but that is the core of a network service. Then of course, and we go back to the time we worked together, there are storage services. At that time, we were discussing mostly about fiber tunnel, now the BUS world is clearly NVMe, but it's not just the BUS world, it's really a new way of doing storage, and is very very interesting. So, NVMe kind of service are very important and NVMe as a version that is called NVMeOF, over fiber. Which is basically, sort of remote version of NVMe. And then the third, least but not last, most important category probably, is security. And when I say that security is very very important, you know, the fact that security is very important is clear to everybody in our day, and I think security has two main branches in terms of services. There is the classical firewall and micro-segmentation, in which you basically try to enforce the fact that only who is allowed to access something can access something. But you don't, at that point, care too much about the privacy of the data. Then there is the other branch that encryption, in which you are not trying to enforce to decide who can access or not access the resource, but you are basically caring about the privacy of the data, encrypting the data so that if it is hijacked, snooped or whatever, it cannot be decoded. >> Eccellent, so Silvano, absolutely the edge is a huge opportunity. When someone looks at the overall solution and say you're putting something in the edge, you know, they could just say, "This really looks like a NIC." You talked about some of the previous engagement we'd worked on, host bus adapters, smart NICs and the like. There were some things we could build in but there were limits that we had, so, what differentiates the Pensando solution from what we would traditionally think of as an adapter card in the past? >> Well, the Pensando solution has two main, multiple pieces but in term of hardware, has two main pieces, there is an ASIC that we call copper internally. That ASIC is not strictly related to be used only in an adapter form, you can deploy it also in other form factors in another part of the network in other embodiment, et cetera. And then there is a card, the card has a PCI-E interface and sit in a PCI-E slot. So yes, in that sense, somebody can can call it a NIC and since it's a pretty good NIC, somebody can call it a smart NIC. We don't really like that two terms, we prefer to call it DSC, domain specific card, but the real term that I like to use is domain specific hardware, and I like to use domain specific hardware because it's the same term that Hennessy and Patterson use in a beautiful piece of literature that is the Turing Award lecture. It's on the internet, it's public, I really ask everybody to go and try to find it and listen to that beautiful piece of literature, modern literature on computer architecture. The Turing Award lecture of Hennessy and Patterson. And they have introduced the concept of domain specific hardware, and they explain also the justification for why now is important to look at domain specific hardware. And the justification is basically in a nutshell and we can go more deep if you're interested, but in a nutshell is that the specing, that is the single tried performer's measurement of a CPU, is not growing fast at all, is only growing nowadays like a few point percent a year, maybe 4% per year. And with this slow grow, over specing performance of a core, you know the core need to be really used for user application, for customer application, and all what is known as Sentian can be moved to some domain specific hardware that can do that in a much better fashion, and by no mean I imply that the DSC is the best example of domain specific hardware. The best example of domain specific hardware is in front of all of us, and are GPUs. And not GPUs for graphic processing which are also important, but GPU used basically for artificial intelligence, machine learning inference. You know, that is a piece of hardware that has shown that something can be done with performance that the purpose processor can do. >> Yeah, it's interesting right. If you term back the clock 10 or 15 years ago, I used to be in arguments, and you say, "Do you build an offload, "or do you let it happen is software." And I was always like, "Oh, well Moore's law with mean that, "you know, the software solution will always win, "because if you bake it in hardware, it's too slow." It's a very different world today, you talk about how fast things speed up. From your customer standpoint though, often some of those architectural things are something that I've looked for my suppliers to take care of that. Speak to the use case, what does this all mean from a customer stand point, what are some of those early use cases that you're looking at? >> Well, as always, you get a bit surprised by the use cases, in the sense that you start to design a product thinking that some of the most cool thing will be the dominant use cases, and then you discover that something that you have never really fought have the most interesting use case. One that we have fought about since day one, but it's really becoming super interesting is telemetry. Basically, measuring everything in the network, and understanding what is happening in the network. I was speaking with a friend the other day, and the friend was asking me, "Oh, but we have SNMP for many many years, "which is the difference between SNMP and telemetry?" And the difference is to me, the real difference is in SNMP or in many of these management protocol, you involve a management plan, you involve a control plan, and then you go to read something that is in the data plan. But the process is so inefficient that you cannot really get a huge volume of data, and you cannot get it practically enough, with enough performance. Doing telemetry means thinking a data path, building a data path that is capable of not only measuring everything realtime, but also sending out that measurement without involving anything else, without involving the control path and the management path so that the measurement becomes really very efficient and the data that you stream out becomes really usable data, actionable data in realtime. So telemetry is clearly the first one, is important. One that you honestly, we had built but we weren't thinking this was going to have so much success is what we call Bidirectional ERSPAN. And basically, is just the capability of copying data. And sending data that the card see to a station. And that is very very useful for replacing what are called TAP network, Which is just network, but many customer put in parallel to the real network just to observe the real network and to be able to troubleshoot and diagnose problem in the real network. So, this two feature telemetry and ERSPAN that are basically troubleshooting feature are the two features that are beginning are getting more traction. >> You're talking about realtime things like telemetry. You know, the applications and the integrations that you need to deal with are so important, back in some of the previous start-ups that you done was getting ready for, say how do we optimize for virtualization, today you talk cloud-native architectures, streaming, very popular, very modular, often container based solutions and things change constantly. You look at some of these architectures, it's not a single thing that goes on for a long period of time, but it's lots of things that happen over shorter periods of time. So, what integrations do you need to do, and what architecturally, how do you build things to make them as you talk, future-proof for these kind of cloud architectures? >> Yeah, what I mentioned were just the two low hanging fruit, if you want the first two low hanging fruit of this architecture. But basically, the two that come immediately after and where there is a huge amount of radio are distributor's state for firewall, with micro-segmentation support. That is a huge topic in itself. So important nowadays that is absolutely fundamental to be able to build a cloud. That is very important, and the second one is wire rate encryption. There is so much demand for privacy, and so much demand to encrypt the data. Not only between data center but now also inside the data center. And when you look at a large bank for example. A large bank is no longer a single organization. A large bank is multiple organizations that are compartmentalized by law. That need to keep things separate by law, by regulation, by FCC regulation. And if you don't have encryption, and if you don't have distributed firewall, is really very difficult to achieve that. And then you know, there are other applications, we mentioned storage NVME, and is a very nice application, and then we have even more, if you go to look at load balance in between server, doing compression for storage and other possible applications. But I sort of lost your real question. >> So, just part of the pieces, when you look at integrations that Pensando needs to do, for maybe some of the applications that you would tie in to any of those that come to mind? >> Yeah, well for sure. It depends, I see two main branches again. One is the cloud provider, and one are the enterprise. In the cloud provider, basically this cloud provider have a huge management infrastructure that is already built and they want just the card to adapt to this, to be controllable by this huge management infrastructure. They already know which rule they want to send to the card, they already know which feature they want to enable on the card. They already have all that, they just want the card to provide the data plan performers for that particular feature. So they're going to build something particular that is specific for that particular cloud provider that adapt to that cloud provider architecture. We want the flexibility of having an API on the card that is like a rest API or a gRPC which they can easily program, monitor and control that card. When you look at the enterprise, the situation is different. Enterprise is looking to at two things. Two or three things. The first thing is a complete solution. They don't want to, they don't have the management infrastructure that they have built like a cloud provider. They want a complete solution that has the card and the management station and there's all what is required to make from day one, a working solution, which is absolutely correct in an enterprise environment. They also want integration, and integration is the tool that they already have. If you look at main enterprise, one of a dominant presence is clearly VMware virtualization in terms of ESX and vSphere and NSX. And so most of the customer are asking us to integrate with VMware, which is a very reasonable demand. And then of course, there are other player, not so much in the virtualization's space, but for example, in the data collections space, and the data analysis space, and for sure Pensando doesn't want to reinvent the wheel there, doesn't want to build a data collector or data analysis engine and whatever, there is a lot of work, and there are a lot out there, so integration with things like Splunk for example are kind of natural for Pensando. >> Eccellent, so wait, you talked about some of the places where Pensando doesn't need to reinvent the wheel, you talk through a lot of the different technology pieces. If I had to have you pull out one, what would you say is the biggest innovation that Pensando has built into the platform. >> Well, the biggest innovation is this P4 architecture. And the P4 architecture was a sort of gift that was given us in the sense that it was not invented for what we use it. P4 was basically invented to have programmable switches. The first big P4 company was clearly Barefoot that then was acquired by Intel and Barefoot built a programmable switch. But if you look at the reality of today, the network, most of the people want the network to be super easy. They don't want to program anything into the network. They want to program everything at the edge, they want to put all the intelligence and the programmability of the edge, so we borrowed the P4 architecture, which is fantastic programmable architecture and we implemented that yet. It's also easier because the bandwidth is clearly more limited at the edge compared to being in the core of a network. And that P4 architecture give us a huge advantage. If you, tomorrow come up with the Stuart Encapsulation Super Duper Technology, I can implement in the copper The Stuart, whatever it was called, Super Duper Encapsulation Technology, even when I design the ASIC I didn't know that encapsulation exists. Is the data plan programmability, is the capability to program the data plan and programming the data plan while maintaining wire-speed performance, which I think is the biggest benefit of Pensando. >> All right, well Silvano, thank you so much for sharing, your journey with Pensando so far, really interesting to dig into it and absolutely look forward to following progress as it goes. >> Stuart, it's been really a pleasure to talk with you, I hope to talk with you again in the near future. Thank you so much. >> All right, and thank you for watching theCUBE, I'm Stu Miniman, thanks for watching. (upbeat music)

>> Narrator: Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE. Covering AWS re:Invent 2019. Brought to you by Amazon Web Services and Intel, along with it's ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back, about 65,000 here in attendance, at AWS re:Invent 2019. You're watching theCUBE, and I am Stu Miniman, the host for this seg, and happy to welcome back to our program two of our CUBE alumni. Sitting to my right is Abby Fuller, who is the principal technologist for containers and Linux, with Amazon Web Services. Sitting to her right is Deepak Singh, Vice President of Compute Services, also with AWS. Thank you so much for joining us on the program. >> Thanks for having us. >> Thank you for having us. >> Stu: All right, so as I said, both of you have been on the program, and boy your team's been busy. I mean, one of the things I love, first of all, there is a roadmap for many of the things that are going on. So, we do understand what's happen in the future, but, Deepak, maybe just tell us a little bit about your group and kind of the main focus, and let's start there. >> Deepak: So, my group goes beyond containers. It includes things like Linux systems, our high performance computing organization. But for the purposes of re:Invent, let's stick to the containers org. The containers org owns all of AWS's containerized products. So that includes ECS, EKS, Fargate. We also own our service mesh offering, which is App Mesh. So the way I like to think about it is, it's the right way to build applications in the modern era group, and it's a team that stays quite busy, because this is such a hot space to be in. >> Stu: All right, so we're going to talk mostly about containers, but your shirt is talking about the Linux piece. Tell us what your shirt says. >> Deepak: Ahh, yes, this is the only right way to spell AMI. Unfortunately, my previous, when I was in New York, Corey was at the table interviewing me, and I wore this just for him. >> Stu: So, so, so, if it is AMI, then we're going to spend some time talking about EKS. >> Yes. (Abby chuckling) >> And Esses. >> Yes, which one? (Deepak laughing) We will figure that. For AWS is AWS, I think, is how we will do it. So, absolutely, we're not going to talk about ontological arguments in there. But, Abby, a whole lot of new services in the container space. I want to put a pin and put Fargate to aside for a second. >> Abby: Sure. >> Cause lots of things we want to dig into there. But a lot of other things have been announced, in like the last month or so. Maybe, give us a little bit of a view. >> Yeah, I think a couple big ones for us. So, Fargate and Spot, so run on spare Fargate Capacity for up to a 70% discount off of standard Fargate pricing. (mumbling) things like vulnerability image for scanning for images on ECR. We launched, over the last few days as re:Invent, a capacity providers for ECS, which let's you run, split your traffic between on-demand and spot instances in the same cluster. We also launched something called Cluster Auto Scaler. So, some finer-grained control over how your cluster scales in on ECS. >> Stu: All right, want to take a quick step back. So , Fargate, announced a couple of years ago. >> Deepak: Yep. >> Was only first supported on ECS. Definitely, I've talked to lots of customers, very excited about it. >> Deepak: Yep. >> Maybe talk to us a little bit about how Fargate fits in the whole container discussion. >> Deepak: Yeah. >> And we'll hit with the news. >> Yeah, and, actually, a good way to think about it is from a native US standpoint. If you're a customer running containers, the way we think about our services is: You need a place to store those containers, so that's ECR. You could use your own registry, you could pick a third party one, that's fine. But most of our customers just use ECR. Then you pick your containers carrier. That's either ECS or EKS depending on your preferences. And then you need to figure out where you want to run your containers. And, of course, when we launched ECS five years ago, at re:Invent, there was only one way to do it: On EC2 instances. And two years ago, we added in what in our mind is a cloud native natural way to run containers, which is Fargate. So Fargate serves as a runtime compute engine for containers, and you can pick your scheduler on top of it, and go make hay with your applications. So that's kind of how we think the hierarchy works, and it works pretty well for most customers. They'll start off often with EC2 and move to Fargate over time or mix and match, and it's kind of fascinating to see how many customers of ours have decided they want to be all-in on Fargate. Which is a great place to be for us. >> Stu: Okay, but the big news which actually got a good cheer in the key note yesterday, is Fargate for EKS. So what's the importance of this? >> Yeah I think (mumbling) I think it's saying we've been talking to customers about for a while and it's the ability to run your Kubernetes pods on Fargate Capacity. I think it's really speaking to folks love Kubernetes as a tool and as a community, but it can be a pretty significant lift operationally. And with Fargate they can use APIs that they want or the open source tooling that they want but they don't have to worry about provisioning and managing that EC2 capacity. >> Stu: All right, so Deepak I actually was having a conversation with a good AWS customer, yesterday, and he said he actually started out on Kubernetes before EKS existed, on AKS. And migrated over to AWS when EKS became available. And he said Fargate really interests me, but one of the main reasons he does Kubernetes is he wants to have some portability, has some concerns that, he knows what services he uses and how if he needed to move something there, what do you say to customer that says Fargate's interesting me, but I'm concerned I'm going to get locked in if I buy into this model. >> I would say that he shouldn't worry about it, because of two reasons: maybe more than two. One is: the unit in Fargate that you interact with and work on is the same unit that you interact and work on with Kubernetes in general. Which is the Kubernetes pod. It's the broadspec, it's just a pod, no difference. You can take that same pod and run it on Timbuktu cloud and it will still run. So that's part one. The other one is that he's using the same tools, he's using coup CDL. And in fact you can mix and match your Kubernetes casters. You can run 95% of the application on Fargate, and five percent of it on EC2. All they are doing is changing the part annotation, and if you decide you want to run none of it on Fargate, you just flip that and suddenly everything is running on EC2 capacity. So actually think there's that much to worry about, because it's just the same pod. It's still the same tooling, the operational model is a lot simpler. >> So Abby, we've talked to you at DockerCon, and KubeCon, simplicity is not the word that we hear when we talk about this whole container space. >> Abby: Sure. >> Traditionally. How are we doing overall? I mean, I'm watching the community here, and it's like, wait, Fargate sounds cool but where's my persistent volumes? You know, where are we in, you know give us a little bit of the road map as to where we are to make this, you know, simple and managing more of my environment. >> Yeah, I think the way that I like to look at it, right, is that we've spent, and it's not just us, but we spent a lot of time looking at things like patterns and abstractions that help make these work flows easier for developers. And I think one of the launches that's interesting in that vein is the ECS CLI version two, which we launched a few days ago. And that will help you deploy like a production ready containerized application. It'll help you with the CICD angle, it'll help you with the monitoring and the observability. So I think it's about abstracting away, and adding patterns on top to make some of these common operations and work flows really modular and repeatable, and extendable. And then it's about having the ability to customize where I need to. So being able to run on Fargate, but also to use work loads running on EC2 where I need to, and being able to mix and match, and to focus my energy where I really get any benefit from customizing, rather than having to do the whole thing from the ground up. >> Stu: You know, feedback I've gotten from my friends and the app dev community, is that hybrid is more and more becoming a standard deployment model. Obviously things like outposts and some of the other solutions from Amazon are extending the AWS model of doing things, but many of them also look at just Kubernetes, >> Deepak: Yep >> as a layer to do that. How should we be thinking of this from your solutions? >> Deepak: Yeah, so I thought without both, though, if you noticed in Andy's announcement yesterday, among the list of services available on day one were ECS and EKS. And actually app meshes well weren't on the list, but app meshes available on our post on day one as well. I think when we think about customers who want to run and stay in their own capacity and their own data centers, because EKS is built on (mumbling) Kubernetes with no modifications, the same application, as long as they're running on upstream Kubernetes, on their side, will just run on EKS. And there's a number of models that work there. A great model is the kind that SisCo is running, where they will manage it for you in both places. They become the first person you call, and on AWS it's just EKS. And on premise (mumbling) it's what SisCo has decided to build. Our pro-serf team will also help you by example. So I think there's a number of modes that work there but the key part, and it's the reason why we have stayed with (mumbling) stream Kubernetes, is we never want to make someone say, oh we can't use EKS because they're (mumbling). Somehow modified Kubernetes, and I think that is super important for us. >> Stu: Yeah, I mean Abby I know you're an active participant in the community, what do you say to people that look at Amazon, Deepak you talked a little bit about Fargate. You don't need to be concerned to the same images, so speak a little bit, maybe if you could, to Amazon's community participation, and what you're generally hearing from your customers. >> Abby: Yeah, so I think the root of it right is that we're all building with the same building blocks. I think something that Amazon has been really strong at is open sourcing primitive. So, Firecracker last year, I think was a good example. And we, I think we do really well with saying we built this to solve a problem for us, but we think you might want it too. And in terms of community support, we have been open sourcing more over the last year, we open source our road maps in November last year. We run developer previews off the GitHub road map, App Mesh has a public preview channel as well, so we've been trying to involve the community participation earlier and earlier in our product development life cycle, so that, especially with things like service mesh, where it's really pretty new, we can make sure that we have the voice of all our users and our customers, and there, as early as possible. But to get their hands on keyboards to try it out as soon as they can. >> Deepak: And actually a great example of that is, a word that Weave Works has done. Talking about people who can run Kubernetes on AWS and on premises, they have this project called "Weave Ignite" where they're basically running Kubernetes on Firecracker on premises. And then on AWS a customer just runs on EKS, as an example. And that, I think that part has been not everybody realizes that this is possible. But I think the fact that people are doing it is, excites us a lot. >> Stu: All right, I know you're both meeting with a lot of customers this week, maybe Deepak start with you. Any surprises or any misconceptions other than I know there a lot of people wearing teal shirts, with a certain pronunciation. But bring us inside some of the mind set of your customers here. >> Deepak: So actually, our conversation is very consistent. I think the community as a whole, our customer base has a whole, they all want to get to the same place. How can we move really quickly? How can we give our developers the ability to be more productive? Without putting our company at risk, having the right level of governance? Having the right controls, in place? And I think that's mainly consistent theme across the board. I guess the one thing that would be hard to remind people of a little bit, is a lot of people often think Fargate sits on top of ECS and EKS, it sits below that, and actually the fact that now there is an EKS Fargate, people understand that more quickly. Before that it was a little trickier. But other than that, I think our customers almost all. They come from different places, have very similar problems, they want developers to move quickly and develop deliver business value, and platform engineering teams that we speak to want to figure out how to get out of the way. And that's been great! >> It's interesting, Abby, I love your view point from the developer community Andy talked on stage about very much, to do true transformation, there needs to be the leadership driving things down. I'm curious what you're seeing, customers you're talked to, people you had, cause many of these tools we're talking about, you know, started in the developer world. >> Yeah, I mean there's been, like an increasing amount of curiosity around the cultural side of it. So how can I get my team to work like that? How can I get my team to ship more safely, more quickly, but getting operations out of the way? And I think you see more and more interest in that. So how can we build the tools that work the way our developers do? So we get all the thing that we want, so security and compliance and availability. The developers get what they want, which is easy work flows that match the way they want to work. So you see a lot of curiosity around that. So how do we get to the place where we can run everything on Fargate, and benefit from all the new serverless, severless style (mumbling). >> Stu: All right, real quick just give you the final word. Any websites, or events, or things that people should know when they want to learn more and get engaged? >> Yeah, I think I'd send people first and foremost to the GitHub public road maps. It is the easiest, fastest way to let us hear your voice, and what you want to see us build next. I think especially these next couple weeks coming out of re:Invent, as people start to get their hands on what we announced, think I'm really curious for them to take that back, and then be like, this is great, but here's what I want to see next. And I'd love to see that happen on the road maps. >> Yeah, about a month or so ago, maybe a couple months, we started a dedicated blog for containers on AWS site. One of the nice things about it is a lot of the contributors to that blog site are principal engineers, and engineers in our organization. For example, one of our, the principal engineers in my org are Malcolm Featonby, has a whole blog post on how should to think about scaling and best practices. I think I would encourage people who've now seen what we have, all the new services we're developing, and that's where you'll get the details on how you can use them, how we built them, and I encourage everybody to go to that blog site and check out what we're doing. >> Stu: All right, Deepak, Abby, congratulation to you and your team, great progress, and really appreciate (mumbling) are able to look at the road map, and definitely hope to catch up with you both soon. >> Abby: Thanks so much! >> Thank you so much. >> Stu: All right, I'm Stu Miniman, and back with much more, right in a second, thank for watching theCube. (Techno music)

>> fly from San Francisco. It's the Cube covering Google Club next nineteen, right Tio by Google Cloud and its ecosystem partners. >> Okay, welcome back, everyone. We are here live in San Francisco for cubes. Coverage of Google next twenty nineteen. Hashtag Google. Next nineteen, Google's Cloud Conference, where their customers, developers all come together Cubes. Three days of coverage. Day one. I'm John forward, my Coast, Dave Aloft as well. Astute many men Who's out there doing some reporter? Next guess Allison. Wagon filled is the CMO of Google Cloud. Great to see you. Thanks for joining us. >> Thanks for having me. I'm glad to be here, >> so I got to say, looking out on the floor here, we're in the middle of the floor. Great demographics. A lot of developers, lot of enterprise customers. A lot of you know, sea levels will also enterprise architects and cloud architects. So this is not just a developer fest. This is a business developer conference. >> Yes. So that's been a real change this year. Not only have we increase the numbers I think I mentioned earlier that we have thirty thousand people are actually able even more than that. We had a cap registration we sold out last week. But the composition is different this year because this year we have over seventy percent from enterprise companies and then within enterprise Cos it's Dev's decision makers, business leaders. And then we have a whole executive track of leader Circle program as well. So it's been a really great mix of different energy, different questions in different sessions. >> You guys do a great job in event kudos to the team original Google Io was a great event that continues to be the consumer side on Google. You guys have that same kind of grew swing going on a lot of sessions. Take him in to explain the theme of the show. What's going on around the events? Breakouts? What's the focus? >> Yes, so the focus? Well, there's a theme and a couple different levels. The broad theme is a cloud like no other, because we've introduced a lot of new, different features and products and programs. We introduced Antos this morning, which was really revolutionary way of using containers broadly multi cloud, high but cloud. So it's from a product standpoint, but it's also a cloud like no other, because it's about the community that's here, and it's truly a partnership with our customers and our partners about building this cloud together, and we see the community as a really key part of that. It's really corta Google's values around openness, open source technology and really embracing the broader community to build the cloud together. >> And I thought was interesting. The Kino was phenomenal. You had the CEO of Google come out Sundar Pichai and the new CEO on the job for ten weeks. T K >> Sommers. Korean. Yes. Lot of action >> going on a Google right now. >> Yeah, it's been great to have Thomas. Diane was phenomenal and building the business. It's wonderful. Have Sundar here. He's got a lot of commitment, really engaged with our customers. And so it's a lot of energy and a lot of excitement. A Google. >> I thought the vory class act of Thomas Curry and his first words on stage at the CEO was to give props. The Diane Green very, very respected, that was >> great, was very gracious of, Thomas >> said. Sorry, he said. The press, sir, that one of things I really like about Google is not afraid of hard problems, So I wanted to ask you a CMO I always asked the most about brand promise. What's the brand promise? That you want customers and the community to take away from an event like this? >> So the brand promise has a couple different areas. First and foremost, we want our customers to be successful with their customers. And so we think, really holistically about lessons. Make sure that we're delivering the cloud technologies so that customers can really serve everyone that they want to serve, whether it be a retailer that wants to create a wonderful, offline and online experience, whether it's a health care provider that wants to ensure that every doctor, it knows all of the right data about all the patients or within a hospital. And so that's the way we're always thinking is how do we ensure that we help our customers set up to be successful? >> So one of the big teams we heard this morning was the industry focus, and you just referenced that again. It seems to be an increasingly important part of the messaging and the technologies that you're creating, and it ties into digital transformation. You seeing every industry transform data is at the heart of that transformation. You're seeing big companies traverse different industries. So what if you could talk about the industry focus? Uh, where'd that come from? Where do you see it going? >> Yes, So there's really three core parts of what we've been talking about today. First and foremost is the infrastructure and ensuring that we have the world's best infrastructure. Then, on top of that, it's ensuring that we have all the right applications to help with digital transformation. And then, as part of that further, is the industry solutions. Because in our six focus industries, we want to make sure that we're really developing the right applications with the right solutions and half a deep expertise that companies are looking for so that we can really part with partner with them and really, truly be innovative. And we could feel much more comfortable being innovative. But we really understand our customer problems >> keep Part of that is the global s eyes. You look out here, you see all the big names I won't name because I'll forget one. But there's two obvious ones right there because once you start to see those guys come into the ecosystem, that's when you can partner and get really deep industry expertise globally, >> I agree. And so we do have a great partnerships that said here with Accenture in tow, Lloyd and Antos or three of them, many more that we were working really closely with. And there really are an extension of what we want to build because we know that we will not be able Teo create every single last mile industry solution and every single industry, and working with those companies really helps us. >> I was on the plane last night watching the game. Of course, I love you guys got to see it. You're probably appear busy, but I focused. Google was all over the this year, >> so this is our second year of our partnership with the law, and it's been great. There's a couple dimensions to that partnership. First and foremost, we help them analyze eighty years worth of data. And through all of that analysis, we've been working with him about making predictions about games in helping them understand players and coaches and teams better. Everything from creating brackets. Teo, how do you fan experience? And then as part of that, we also had opportunity to do some advertising within their games. So you may have seen some of the TV spots that we did, which was about analyzing that data. We put ourselves on the line by making predictions during the game about what we thought would happen based on all of our analysis. And then the Big Chef this year was we included students, so it was really studies. Last year we created all these models, but we did it within Google. We had Google, Debs and Google engineers creating prediction models. We said, like, What if we brought students in tow? Help us? So we recruited thirty or so all star students around the country from their schools, brought them together. They learned DCP like that. It was awesome. And then they started working together doing predictions. And so a lot of what you saw in the Games and on our hub was actually students using Google Claude platform to make predictions about the games. >> So just get this right. The reference on stage by T K students. So you had data from the that was exposed to the students. They had a hackathon. How much lead time that they have? What was that >> did everything with thirty days. So they hack it on was about two months ago or so. But within the last thirty days, they did all of these different projects and they were actually doing really creative things about trying to come up with new types of stats like explosiveness. What does that mean? Does that mean that you move in closer to the basket or does it mean that here they're coming up, the stats around pace of game and different elements of the place? It was really fun. >> How many slam dunk this, Miss Fowles? So >> question, Who do you who you're rooting for? I was >> writing from Virginia. You know, Let's say I >> was right for >> Virginia after my bracket got busted, so I was allowed to kind of change a little bit. And they're Michigan. Once they were gone, I was like, >> So I use no way. I but I hit ninety ninth percentile. So you go. I had Michigan in Michigan State rather in Virginia in my Final Four for Michigan State. Lost, but still, I would have been >> That's pretty good >> night, point nine. So what is with what kind of predictions were the students doing well, >> predictions about everything from, well, last night we had some predictions about the number two point last. We had about how many different times we're going to exchange like the ball will go back and forth between teams. We had predictions about three pointers and one game everything. So it's been really fun. Teo work with >> that kind of in game predictions. To see that a lot. >> You probably saw some stats real >> probability of, ah, victory, which of course, last night. Forget it. I mean, it's changed so quickly. >> Great program. One of those I want to ask you change gears is you have a book in the press room called customer Voices. So this has been a focus, and I think a lot of people have been Lego Google's great tact, but not a lot of customers, which you guys air debunking with. Not only this, but here to show shown the logo slide really kind of showing the traction from a customer's standpoint. >> Yes, about >> the focus on the customer. How does that change? How you doing your job? How is the tech rolling out? Can you share some insight into customer focused. >> Yeah, this has been a really big step change this year. We have over four hundred customers speaking throughout this event, and then we have a number of them that are on stage in the keynotes telling real stories. Two years ago, we had some customers speaking and they would say, I'm looking. I'm dabbling and this But now they're making rial kind of bet The company decisions using our technology. And so this customer voices is looking at those companies. We have something called the customer innovation serious this afternoon, where the CIA of HSBC will be talking about their evolution and Gogo Cloud. Two years ago, Darrell West was on stage talking about just kind of what they will be getting. Two Dio with Google Cloud Platform And now here we are two years later, when they've made a lot of progress and we'LL be sharing their stories that the custom innovation Siri's is one of my favorite parts. It next, >> you know, we cover a lot of events. David eyes were like two ESPN of tech or game day. We've gotten the shows, we see a lot of events and you kind of hear the key words over and over again. Soon these events here we're hearing scale, which we've heard all the time. Google scales, scales, scales solve all our problems. But we're hearing more about customers. OK, this has been a big focus. How have you guys shifted internally? Because this seems to been around for a while. Like you said, I think it's a step function from what we're seeing as well. What's going on internally. How you guys mobilizing, How you guys taking this to the mark? Because you've got great partition. So Cisco onstage VM wears even up there. You got an ecosystem developing a lot of momentum. >> So we're truly this year Enterprise ready to use a buzz word that comes up. So two years ago, we still had some holes in some of our technology stack, and we're still really building to go to market teams. We still vastly scaling that so absolutely growing there. But we're in a whole different place as a business where we are able to serve really large enterprises at scale. McKesson just announced sixth largest company that they are moving and working with us a Google cloud. I mean, so these air major companies that are making big decisions to work with us. And so it's at a whole different level this year, and we're really proud that the customers have chosen to work with us, and we're building the organization to ensure that their successful. So that's our customer success program. That's ensuring we have the right kind of customer engineers working hand in hand with our customers. So it's a big focus ever. Whole group. It's a focus where Thomas Kurian has a lot of background serving enterprise customers at Oracle for twenty years, bringing that expertise. So you'LL see that everywhere. So I'm glad you picked up on that and feel it because it's really permeates everything we're doing at Google clouds, >> and it's been a good, positive change. The results of their What's the focus for you As you look forward, It's a lot to do. You guys are a great opportunity. I always say Google's dark horse now Samson's got a good lead out there being first in, but you guys have a lot of tech. You got the customer focus. You got a lot of momentum on the tech side. Cloud native Open source. Partner ecosystem Developing customer ecosystem. So kind of ball's in your court, so to speak. >> You feel really well, position we It's early. So in the whole market, people seem to think that I like all these decisions, but it's really still eighty percent of workload Zoran data centers of these big enterprises, everybody who's here with us right now. And most companies were choosing a multi club strategy this morning. We announced a major product and those that really enables the multi cloud strategy so enables Google to really be at the center of that multi cloud and provide the services using containers and a lot of the biggest best advances right now. And so as we scale our go to market, we can really bring this technology that way here, over and over again, is the best technology in the business. Yeah, we had it really had to go to market in place to bring it to customers. And this is really where we're taking it so we can help get this awesome technology. It's so fun is a marketer to them, bring it to everybody. >> I always say it so early. The wave is just getting started more ways behind it. I'm very impressed. That intrigue also by the rebranding of the Google Cloud platform what you guys announced last kind of hybrid and those is interesting because it's a rebrand slash new set of integration points Sisco again on stage kind of integrating with your container platform is a key key story that I think is nuanced but kind of points to a whole new Google. What was behind the rebranding? Can you just share some insight that what the commerce she's like Google Cloud Platforms is descriptive. But I mean, >> sister, thanks >> Cloud Services platform when we chose that name last year is when we wanted to Alfa with a product and frankly, within the marketing team, he kind of knew was always a placeholder name. And then the debate was, What do we change the name when you go to Beta, which we did a couple months ago? Or when we go to went to Gaea and we decided this would be a great opportunity to change the name, so we always knew it was going to change the name. Picking a name is always complicated, and so we spent a lot of time thinking about what way wanted that name too mean and what we wanted to stand for. And we really liked Anthros. It's a Greek word. It is a nod to the Greek aspects of the history of the product. With Cooper, Netease, Andhis, Teo and other areas. It means the blossom it means to grow. It means all. And so you many words like Anthology and things like that. So we'd liked both what it meant, And we also liked that with all Namie decisions, it's easy to spell. It's easy to find. It's all great, >> and it's super >> booming in California. Here as we speak. Well, ironic. >> It has an international flavor to it. But you guys, you guys are taking this show overseas, right? They've got a big show in London in November, I know and yes, >> be in Tokyo in July at next and then London in November. And then we do it between all of these. What we call Clouds Summit Siri's, which are in country slightly smaller. But we bring a lot of the same technology, and speakers and sessions just have a slightly scaled down version. >> Intimate. We really appreciate your support. We love doing the Cube hearing a lot of Czech athletes, as we say here on the show floor. Lot of knowledge, good customer converses. Alison's Thanks for sharing the inside congratulates on the great >> show, so I left be here. Thanks >> for rebranding as the market shifts. Great time to have a rebrand, certainly when it means something more. Multi cloud hybrid cloud Google Cloud Platform now and those that cube bring you live coverage here from the floor at Google next twenty nineteen. Stay with us for more after this short break.

(cheerful music) >> Live from San Francisco. It's theCUBE. Covering IBM Think 2019. Brought to you by IBM. >> Welcome to theCUBE, I'm Lisa Martin. We are at day one of IBM Think 2019, I'm with Dave Vellante. Hey Dave! Hey Lisa, good to see you. The new improved Moscone. >> Exactly, and Stu Miniman, yeah. >> Shiny. >> Yeah, this is the new, it is shiny, The carpets smells new. This is the second annual IBM Think, gentleman where there's this conglomeration of five to six previous events. Doesn't really kick off yet today. I think Partner World starts today but here we are in San Francisco. Moscone North, I think south, and west they have here expecting about 25,000 people. No news yet today, Dave, so let's kind of talk about where IBM is right now with the early part of Q1 of 2019. Red Hat acquisition just approved by shareholders last month. What are your thoughts on the status of Big Blue? >> Well, I think you're right, Lisa, that the Red Hat news is the big news for IBM. We're now entering the next chapter but if you look back for the last five years IBM had to go out and pay two billion dollars for a soft layer to get into the cloud business. That was precipitated by the big, high profile loss of the CIA deal against Amazon. So that was a wake up call for IBM. So they got into the public cloud game. So that's the good news. The bad news is the public cloud's not easy when you're going up against the likes of Google and Microsoft and of course, Amazon. But the linchpin of IBM's cloud strategy is it's SAS portfolio. Over the last 20 years Steve Mills and his organization built a very large software business which they now have migrated into their cloud and so they've got that advantage much like Oracle. They're not a big, dominant cloud infrastructure as a service player but they have a platform where they can put things like Cognitive Solutions and Watson and offer those SAS services to clients. So you'll check on that but when you'll peel through the numbers IBM beat it's numbers last quarter. Stock was up. You know, when it announced the Red Hat acquisition the stock actually got crushed because when you spend 34 billion dollars on a company, you know the shareholders don't necessarily love that but we'll talk about the merits of that move. But they beat in the fourth quarter. They beat on the strength of services. So IBM remains largely a services company, about 60% plus of it's revenues comes from services. It's a somewhat lower margin business, even though IBM margins have been ticking up. As I say, you go back the last five, six years IBM Genesys did Mike's it's microelectronics business, which was a, you know, lost business. It got rid of it's x86 business which is a x86 server business, which is a low margin business. So again, like Oracle, it's focusing on high margin software and services and now we enter the era, Stu, of hybrid cloud with the Red Hat acquisition. A lot of money to pay, but it gets IBM into the next generation of multi cloud. >> Yeah, Dave, the knock I've had against IBM is in many ways they always try to be all things to all people and of course we know you can be good at some things but, you know, it's really tough to be great at everything. And, you know, you talked about cloud, Dave, you know, the SoftLayer acquisition to kind of get into public cloud but, you know, IBM is not one of the big players in public cloud. It's easy. It's Amazon and then followed by you know, Azure, Google, and let's talk Alibaba if we're talking globally. In a multi cloud world IBM has a strong play. As you said, they've got a lot of application assets, they have public cloud, they partner with a lot of the different cloud players out there and with Red Hat they get a key asset to be able to play across all of these multi cloud environments whether we're talking public cloud, private cloud, across all these environments. IBM's been pushing hard into the Kubernetes space, doing a lot with Istio. You know, where they play there, in Red Hat is a key piece of this puzzle. Red Hat running at about three billion dollars of revenue and paying 34 billion dollars but, you know, this is a linchpin as to say how does IBM stay relevant in this cloud world going forward? It's really a you know, a key moment for IBM as to what this means. A lot of discussion as to you know, it's not just the revenue piece but what will Red Hat do to the culture of IBM? IBM has a strong history in open source but you know, you got to, you have a large bench of Red Hat's strong executive team. We're going to see some of them here at the show. We're even going to have one Red Hat executive on our program here and so what will happen once this deal finally closes, which is expected later this year, probably October if you read, you know everything right. But what will it look like as to how will, you know, relatively small Red Hat impact the larger IBM going forward? >> Well, I think it's a big lever, right? I mean we were, Lisa, we were at Cisco Live in Barcelona last week kind of laying out the horses on the track for this multi cloud. Cisco doesn't own it's own public cloud. VMware and Dell don't own it's own public cloud. They both tried to get into the public cloud in the early days and IBM does own it's own public cloud as does Oracle but they're also going hard after this notion of multi cloud as is Cisco, as is VMware. So it sort of sets up the sort of Cisco, IBM Red Hat, VMware, Dell, sort of competing to get after that multi cloud revenue and then HPE fits in there somewhere. We can talk about that. >> So I saw a stat the other day that said in 2018, 80% of companies moved data or apps from public cloud. Reasons being security, control, cost, performance. So to some of the things I've read, Dave, that you've covered recently, if IBM isn't able to really go head to head against the Azures and the AWS, what is their differentiator in this new, hybrid multi cloud world? Is it being able to bring AI, Watson, Cognitive Solutions, better than their competitors in that space that you just mentioned? >> Yeah, IBM does complicate it. You know and cloud and hybrid cloud is complicated and so that's IBM's wheelhouse. And so it tends not to do commodity. So if it's complicated and sophisticated and requires a lot of services and a lot of business processing happening and things like that, IBM tends to excel. So, you know, if you do the SWOT analysis it's big opportunity is to be that multi-cloud provider for it's largest customers. And the larger customers are running, you know, transaction systems on mainframe. They're running cognitive systems on things like power. They've got a giant portfolio, at IBM that is, and they can cobble things together with their services and solve problems and that's kind of how IBM approaches the marketplace. Much different than say, Stu, Cisco or VMware. >> Yeah, Dave, you're absolutely right. You know one of the things I look at is you know, in this multi-cloud space we've see the SI's that are very important there. Companies like Accenture and KPMG and the like. IBM partners with them but IBM also has a large services business. So, you know who's going to be able to help customers get in there and figure out this rather complicated environment. So we are definitely one of the things I want to dig into this week is understand where IBM is at the Cisco Show, Dave. We've talked about their messaging was the bridge to you know what's possible. You know meet the customers where they are, show them how to reach into the future and from Cisco's standpoint, it's strong partnerships with AWS and Google at the forefront. So IBM has just one of the broadest portfolios in the industry. They absolutely play in every single piece but you know customers need good consulting as to Okay, what's going to be the fit for my business. How do I modernize, how do I go forward? And IBM's been down this trip for a number of years. >> Well the in the legacy of Ginni Rometty, in my opinion is going to be determined by the pace at which it can integrate Red Hat and use Red Hat as a lever. Ginni Rometty, when she was doing the roadshow with Jim Whitehurst kept saying it's not a backend loaded deal, and the reason it's not a backend loaded deal is because IBM is a 20 plus billion dollar outsourcing business and they're going to plug Red Hat right into that business to modernize applications. So there's a captive revenue source for IBM. In my view they have to really move fast, faster than typically IBM moves. We've been hearing about strategic initiatives and cloud, and Watson and it's been moving too slow in my opinion. The Red Hat acquisition has to move very very quickly. It's got to move at the speed of cloud and that's going to determine in my opinion-- >> So, actually, so a couple of weeks after the acquisition Red Hat had brought in an analyst to hear what was going on, and while the discussion is Red Hat will stay a distinct brand, there's going to be no lay offs were >> Yeah absolutely. >> Going to keep them separate, what they will get is IBM can really help them scale so >> Yep. Red Hat is getting into some new environments, you know that whole services organization, Red Hat doesn't have that. So IBM absolutely can plug in there and we think really accelerate, the old goal for Red Hat was okay how do we get from that three billion dollars to five billion dollars in the next couple of years. IBM thinks that they can accelerate that even faster. >> And Lisa I think the good news is IBM has always had an affinity toward open source. IBM was really the first, really to make a big investment you know they poured a billion dollars into Linux as a means of competing with Microsoft back in the day, and so they've got open source chops. So for those large IBM customers that might not want to go it alone on open source and you know Red Hat's kind of the cool kid on the block. But at the same time, you know there's some risks there. Now IBM can take that big blue blanket wrap it around it's largest customers and say okay, we've got you covered in open source, we've got the Red Hat asset, and we've got the services organization to help you modernize your application portfolio. >> One of the things too that Stu, you brought up a couple minutes ago is culture. And so looking at what, Red Hat estimates that it's got about eight million developers world wide using their technologies and this is an area that IBM had historically not been really focused on. What are some of the things that you're expecting to hear this week or see this week with respect to the developer community embracing IMB? >> Yeah and Lisa it's not like IBM hasn't been trying to get into the developer community. I remember back at some of the previous shows Edge and Pulse and the like, they would have you know Dev at and try to do a nice little piece of it but it really didn't gain as much traction as you might like. Compare and contrast that with cisco, we've been watching over the last five years the DevNet community. They've got over half a million developers on that platform. So you know, developer engagement usually requires that ground level activity where I've seen good work from IBM has been getting into that cloud native space. So absolutely seen them at the Kubernetes shows working in the container space very heavily and of course that's an area that Red Hat exceeds. So the Linux developers are absolutely there. Now you mentioned how many developers Red Hat has and in that multi cloud, cloud native space, you know Red Hat one of the leaders if not kind of the leader in that space and therefore it should help super charge what IBM is doing, give them some credibility. I'd love to see how many developers we see at this show, you know, you've been to this show Dave and you've been to this show before, it looked more enterprisey to me from the outside-- >> Well, I'm glad you brought up developers because that is the lynch pin of the Red Hat acquisition. If you look at the companies that actually have in the cloud that have a strong developer affinity obviously Microsoft does and always had AWS clearly does Google has you know it's developer community. Stu you mentioned Sisco. Sisco came at it from a networking standpoint and opened up it's network for infrastructure's code. One of the few legacy hardware companies that's done a good job there. VMware, you know not so much. Right? Not really a big developer world and IBM has tried as you pointed out. When they announced Bluemix but that really didn't take off in the developer world. Now with Red Hat IBM, it's your point eight million developers. That is a huge asset for IBM and one that as I said before it absolutely has to leverage and leverage fast. >> And what are you expectations in terms of any sort of industry deeper penetration? There's been some big cloud deals, cloud wins that IBM has made is recent history. One of them being really big in the energy sector. Are you guys kind of expecting to see any sort of industry deeper penetration as a result of what the Red Hat Acquisition will bring? >> Well thats IBM's strength. Stu you pointed out before, it's Accenture, you know Ernie Young, to a lesser extend maybe KPNG but those big SI's and IBM. When IBM bought PWC Gerstner transformed the company and it became a global leader with deep deep industry expertise. That is IBM's you know, savior frankly over these past many many years. So it can compete with virtually anybody on that front and so yes absolutely every industry is being transformed because of digital transformation. IBM understands this as well as anybody. It's a boon for services, it's a good margin business and so that's their competitive advantage. >> Yeah I mean it ties back into their services. I think back when I lived on the vendor side I learned a lot of the industry off of watching IBM. I see how many companies are talking about smarter cities. IBM had you know a long history of working In those environment's. Energy, industrial, IBM is very good at digging into the needed requirements of specific industries and driving that forward. >> So we're going to be here for four days as we mentioned, today is day one. We're going to be talking a lot about this hybrid multi-cloud world. But some of the double clicks we're going to do is talking about data protection, modern data protection, you know a lot of the statistics say that there's eighty percent of the worlds data isn't searchable yet. We all hear every event we do guys, data is the new oil. If companies can actually harness that, extract insights faster than their competition. Create new business models, new services, new products. What are your expectations about how, I hear a lot get your data AI ready. As a marketer I go, what does that mean? What are your thoughts Stu on, and we're sitting in a lot of signage here. How is IBM going to help companies get AI, Data rather AI ready and what does that actually mean? >> So IBM really educated a lot of the world and the broader world as to what some of this AI is. I mean I know we all watched many years ago when Watson was on Jeopardy and we kind of hit through the past the peak and have been trying to sort out okay well how can IBM monetize this? They're taking Watson and getting it into healthcare, they're getting it into all these other environments. So IBM is well known in the AI space. Really well known in the data space but there's a lot of competition and we're still relatively early in the sorting how this new machine learning and AI are going to fit in there. You know we spent a lot of time looking at things like RPA was kind of the gateway drug of AI if you will robotic process automation. And I'm not sure where IBM fit's into that environment. So once again IBM has always had a broad portfolio they do a lot of acquisitions in the space. So you know how can they take all those pieces, pull them together, get after the multicloud world, enable developers to be able to really leverage data even more that's possible and as you said you know more than eighty percent of data today isn't used, you know from an infrastructure stand point I'm looking at how do things like edge computing all get pulled into this environment and lot of questions still. >> IBM is going after hard problems like I said before. You don't expect IBM to be doing things like ad serving with Alexa. You know that's not IBM's game, they're not going to appropriate to sell ad's they're going to take really hard complex problems and charge a lot of money for big services engagements to transform companies. That's their game and that's a data game for sure. >> It's a data game and one of the pieces too that I'm excited to learn about this week is what they're doing about security. We all know you can throw a ton of technology at security and infrastructure but there's the people piece. So we're going to be having a lot of conversations about that as well. Alright guys looking forward to a full week with you and with John joining us at IBM Think I'm Lisa Martin for Dave Vellante and Stu Miniman. You're watching theCUBE live day one IBM Think 2019. Stick around we'll be right back with our next guest. (energetic electronic music)

>> From Palo Alto, California, it's theCUBE, covering the conference boards sixth annual Innovation Master Class. >> Hey, welcome back everybody, Jeff with theCUBE, we're at the Innovation Master Class at Xerox Parc in Palo Alto. It's put on by the conference boards, a relatively small event. But a bunch of really high powered people, terrific presentations. If you ever get a chance to go, I suggest you check it out. We're happy to be here for our first time, we're here and one of the big themes on innovation is how do you innovate well as a big company. It's not easy to do, there's a lot of barriers in the way. We're excited to have an expert in the field, he's Alex Goryachev the senior director of innovation strategy and programs at Sisco. Great to see you. >> Thank you, I'm glad to be here. >> So you just gave a presentation on this topic so first off, give us a little overview of what your role is at Sisco and how it plays with innovation. >> So at Sisco, I'm lucky to lead two things. One is how do we work with the ecosystem, at our network of global innovation centers. And the second one is how do we capture best ideas from our employees. And most importantly, support them in making those ideas happen, turning them into products, or process improvements. >> Right, so Sisco's an interesting company, it's like intel and a lot of really dominant players in their field. Terrific market share, dominant for a long time. So it's really hard, that innovators dilemma is really written for companies like Sisco, so those innovation centers, how did those come about, how many of them are there, and what is the mission of the innovation centers? >> So the mission, if you think about innovation, it doesn't happen in San Jose or doesn't happen only in San Jose, it happens around the world. So when we think about the innovation centers, we've got around 12 of them around the globe. With a core mission of working with ecosystem players. Whenever that's start ups, customers, partners, academia, governments, and coming up with solutions that then we can deploy in a local market and potentially scale around the globe. >> So it's interesting, you lead with really working with the ecosystem partners, so their mission is more leveraged that greater ecosystem versus we need to come up with the great ideas inside of our four walls. >> Absolutely, because if you think about it, we have a lot of great ideas inside the four walls, but when we look at the specific problems that are you know, problems for Japan, may not necessarily be the same that they are for Australia. And what we really want to do, is be able to work on an issue of national relevancy and focus on the economic strengths and problems that are in the particular area, so that we can make a meaningful impact. >> Right, so one of the topics in one of the earlier presentations here, was how do big companies manage innovation centers, and we're here at Xerox Parc, this is probably one of the most historic innovation centers ever in computers industry. So how do you manage this kind of dichotomy between having them kind of set aside, the people at the innovation center in their own separate little location and still be innovative and kind of unbridled from some of the corporate tail winds I guess, would be head winds I should say. But also make them part of the bigger Sisco environment and still make em feel like they're included and that these things are important, not just to what they're working on and even their ecosystem, but are important to the whole Sisco. >> It's a great question, and I think that's where the corporate government comes in really well. Because at the end of the day with the innovation centers we don't want to boil the ocean right? We want to make sure that everybody wins. So when we think of creating products and solutions, we want to work with customers that have real problems and with start ups that can potentially close that gap and help us co develop a solution with them. So we're very focused on ar engineering priorities and be our specific country priorities and particular opportunities that exist in the country. For example, we have a center in Australia, right? And if you look at the Australian economy, a lot of it is with agriculture, right? So what we have in Australia is a concertia with other industry players in the region to focus on solving some problems for the agriculture. Which utilizes the internet of thinks technology. So that's one of the ways that we're connected to companies mission which is iot, one of the corporate missions. And at the same time we're solving the local problem, working with the ecosystem and creating something that can then be scaled around the world. >> Right, so the other part of your job that you mentioned is inside the four walls and trying to help foster the innovation that does come from your own internal people that are in line jobs, more regular jobs. So what are some of the initiatives that you have in place to identify and to surface and to ultimately support and maybe those grow into new products and divisions and whatever. What are some of the secrets you can share there. >> Well I think the secret is very simple. It's everyone, at the end of the day, everything in the company comes down to talent. People generally invest in talent, not necessarily in ideas. So, one is recognizing that the innovation is a mindset, and then the second thing is really focusing on empowering every single employee to innovate. And in practical terms, that means that we have to redefine innovation. It's not only about new product development, it's not only about top line grove, right? It could be about process improvements. It could be about other things that bring value to the company. Could be about corporate social responsibility, when you go in and listen and engage with employees across the entire company, you actually have far better ideas that touch all aspects of your business, and can produce a lasting impact. Not only in products but with sound process improvement as well. >> And how do you support that? How do you give people the encouragement to say listen, we're interested in your ideas or interested in your innovations across this broad swath of opportunities, like I said from product all the way to social responsibility or cleaning out the Guadalupe river, I'm sure there's all kinds of interesting things that you can point to. How do you make sure that's communicated, that this is a priority for us, the company, that we want to support you, our employee, in some of these opportunities. >> Well first of all, we're lucky to have the sponsorship of our CO Chuck Robbins, who really put this as one of his key priorities. The second one is because innovation is about talent first and product second, we're lucky to work with our chief people officer, Francine, and she's a sponsor for this as well. So we have an incredible opportunity to go and message this as a top corporate priority to our employee's year after year. But the other thing, which is the key, is for every single function in the company, we worked with them to define innovation ambition. So that when we got to employee's and say hey help us, give us your best ideas, we can go and guide them towards some of the Sisco's key priorities. So we connect them with strategy. Obviously at the end of the day, some of them will give us whatever ideas they're passionate about. And there are a lot of great things there as well. >> So Alex I'll give you the last word. We'll be at Sisco live in Barcelona, it's right around the corner, and Sisco live US, etc. This is a really small event. So for you as an attendee and also as a presenter what is this type of event here at the innovation master class mean to you, what are you hoping to get out of it, what do you get out of participating in these type of events? >> Well if I think about, the most important thing, again going back to Sisco, we believe that no single company can do this alone. The innovation program that I just talked about, they innovate everywhere, we put it for the entire world to use and I think just connecting with other fellow practitioners is very important. At the end of the day, innovation teams, they typically go against the grain. So a lot of this is group therapy, it's support. It's the human connection, but then we learn so much from each other, right? Because at the end of the day, we face the same challenges, we face the same problems together. So any industry concertia, we can make a meaningful difference for our companies and for our employee's. And by the way, if you're at Sisco live Barcelona, do stop by our booth, we have the innovation network booth, where we talk about the Sisco innovation centers, and the innovation programs that we run. >> Great, we'll do that. Well Alex thank you for taking a few minutes, and I guess we'll see you in Barcelona. >> Pleasure. >> Alright, he's Alex and I'm Jeff, and you're watching theCUBE, we're at the Innovation Master Class, put on by the conference board here at Xerox Parc in Palo Alto, thanks for watching. (upbeat techno music)

(uplifting music) >> Hi, I'm Stu Miniman and this is a CUBEConversation at SiliconANGLE's, Palo Alto studio, happy to welcome to the program, a first time guest and and new to Nutanix, the Chief Marketing Officer, Ben Gibson. Ben, thank you so much for joining us. >> Stu thanks for having me here. I love the studio and love the chance to chat with you. >> Alright, so our audience know Nutanix really well, so let's introduce them to you first of all. Give our audience a little bit about your background and, you know, we know Nutanix IPO'd not that long ago. Exciting. Growing real fast so, you know, I'm sure it makes sense but why for Ben? >> Yeah. For me, firs and foremost, it's such an exciting company. We're going through a lot of fairly strong growth right now. We've really created a category in the Space Realm Hyperconvergence and now we're really expanding from that position and to be in the middle of that, I think is really exciting. >> So your background is mostly in the networking space and it's one of those things, I'm a networking guy by background. >> Yeah. >> Networking is changing a lot, lately, but not nearly as fast as some of the other parts so, you know, tell us a little bit about your background, where you've been, what your skillset is going to bring to Nutanix, in that ecosystem. >> Yeah, you know, I did, like you, I hailed from the networking industry. I spent a good portion of my career at Sisco, I spent part of my career at Aruba Networks, which is in the Wi-Fi, wireless space, but I think you're right. I think the acceleration of innovation in Nutanix's industry a lot of stuff has changed so quickly in that space, so networking hasn't quite kept up with that level of change of things and for me it's kind of getting on a much faster train and moving forward with it. >> Alright, so we've had theCUBE at every single one of the DotNext conferences >> Ben: Thank you. >> They're fun. Your predecessor Howard Ting had a certain flair so let's talk a little bit about the show and, you know are there things that your going to be putting your stamp on at this show, coming up in New Orleans? >> Yeah, I mean first of all it great to succeed Howard, in the role. I used to be an advisor for the company and so Howard and I used to have periodic pancake breakfasts and I told him what I thought and he shared with me a lot about how exciting things were. What was happening at Nutanix and how they really move forward. And I knew about DotNext, I've seen DotNext I know what an exciting show it is. For a company like Nutanix to draw, this year, over 5000, attendees to this show, that's notable. And, what, to me, that signals is the level of intensity and the level of loyalty that we enjoy in our customer base, they're believers and they're coming to the show to learn from us, to connect with each other and really to accelerate some of their plans on how they continue to innovate. >> Yeah, you know, we travel to so many different shows and absolutely, it is at it's core, it's a user conference, it's users there wanting to learn how to use what they have even better. Learn about the cool net technologies. Dave Valente and I have talked about Nutanix is up there with companies like Service Now, that have, just, people that come and are just, you know, kind of fanatically supported. It reminds me of, you know, Vmware's a great company, doing well today. Many years ago everybody had the I love VMware bumper stickers. Vmware is a great show. We'll be there this year >> Ben: Yeah, so will we. >> And your company will too, so ah, what, what do people what brings them to that show from your standpoint and give us a little insight as to, kind of, some of the special things they'll be seeing this year in New Orleans. >> Yeah, you know, I think one of the biggest attractions of coming to this show is if you think about the role of an infrastructure professional, someone who's looking at hybrid Cloud environments and how do you manage those. Thinking about what applications run on what cloud platform. There's a lot of change and fluidity to that and I think the nature or the role of an IT or an Infrastructure professional is changing. Server Store J-Admin is quickly evolving because that's converging, just like the technology has and so, for me this show is about how do you get ahead of those trends. How do you position yourself to be as strategic as possible, within your own organization? And that's the way I like to think of Dotnext, it's a place that a professional can come to learn and to grow their career and their technology expertise. >> Yeah it's a great point, one of the things I've loved on theCUBE is there are speakers that aren't just from the tech industry, so everyone from Deepak Malhotra, who is from Harvard, um, thought leaders in the space to onstage at one of the shows it was David Blaine doing a magic trick while one of your engineers was configuring stuff. So there's some great speakers that'll be at the event this year to, not only learn the tech but as you said, you're thinking about the persons career and how do they embrace change and how do they help become more valuable to their company. >> Yeah, you know, there's two in particular that are going to be joining this year that I'm very excited about. One is Dr. Brene Brown. If you haven't seen her TED talk on YouTube I highly recommend you go and check it out. It's something different. It's about how do you be vulnerable, with yourself, with your career. How do you take chances? How do you take risk, and that's a lot of what's going on in our in our industry right now. The second one I think is going to be really fun and that's Anthony Bourdain. Known for his show, Parts Unknown and he's going to have colorful language, right, noted, some colorful language but also he's just a riot. He's the one I think is going to bring his special kind of flair to the show and get everyone really excited, laughing and maybe a little bit of gasping, in terms of what he's going to be sharing with us. >> Yeah, absolutely I mean, New Orleans is a great culinary destination and so I know everybody that's going there you'll want to check out the music, the culture and a lot going in there. So, excited about the show. We're going to have theCUBE there for two days. Last thing I want to talk to you about, Ben, just, Nutanix as a company, when I registered for the show there was one of the questions I thought was pretty interesting. They said, "What do you think Nutanix is?" You know, how do you, what's your relationship with Nutanix? And I'm trying to remember, I know one of the options was M: Is Nutanix a hypercovergence infrastructure player? Are they a cloud player? I think storage might even be in there, it's been one of those things as to, who is Nutanix? What are you today and what do you want to be in the next phase of growth? >> You know, it's a great question Stu, "Who is Nutanix?" We are focused on helping our customers build their enterprise cloud. Our taglines could be Your Enterprise Cloud. Enterprise Cloud is not only how you modernize your own data center but it's also, how do you embrace? How do you have a strategy? How do you govern? How do you bring together the right workload, for the right cloud platform at the right time? And that's the direction we're taking with our innovation. This is what more and more of our customers are looking to do. Not every application's going to a public cloud provider. Not every application is staying on premise. We're going to be living in the hybrid world, Enterprise Cloud is about how do you take the ingredients of hyperconvergent infrastructure? Take the ingredients for automation and management, over these different workloads, across these different environments and do so in a way that makes the complexity of infrastructure and multiple cloud management and make that all invisible. So for us that's our mission. It's building that Enterprise Cloud and making all that complexity go away. And that's the vision we're going to be talking about and that's what we think our attendees are really looking to get the guidance and, kind of the vision of how they move their careers forward and flourish in that space >> Ben, it's the barometer that I've been using for probably the last two years. If I spend a lot more time in kind of the Dev/Op Cloud native, you know, worlds these days. We were at an Amazon summit yesterday but, absolutely. It's heterogeneous world. IT has never, you know, let's throw out the old and start the new. Sure there's some new companies that might do that but it's a heterogeneous world, it's a multi-cloud world and big struggle for people is how do they get their arms around it? So if I look at a company that has started mostly on premises, it's like, oh how are you evolving? How are you working with the public Cloud? You know, Nutanix has been working very closely with Google over the last year or so. A new acquisition recently that I know plays into this whole story. Tell us a little bit about the acquisition and, you know, how does Nutanix look at itself, which is now, I mean, if you read the Wall Street reports, Nutanix is a software company. And you're getting great multiples on that and it's helping and you know I've been pretty vocal on this from it's early days, is Nutanix was never a hardware company. It, you know, building an appliance was a go to market choice to simplify and make it easy for customers but as the company matured, >> Yep. >> It made a lot more options and today it makes perfect sense that really software is where it goes, so you talked about a bunch of things there but specifically, kind of the multi-cloud and the acquisition first. >> You know Stu, we're really excited about this recent acquisition we made. It's a company called Minjar and the offering is essentially it's going to be integrated into our broader software platform, that allows customers to be able to assess on a realtime basis. What's the right Cloud platform for a particular workload from a costing perspective? From reliability standpoint. Derish talks about the law of the land. The laws of physics and the like, you need to apply these all to determine what you're going to run where. And what we got with this Minjar acquisition, is a really sophisticated way that our customers can embrace and is part of their enterprise cloud. Because part of this is taking back control over all this disaggregation of workloads running everywhere. You're losing control. Losing governance of your data and your applications if you don't really keep on top of it, this acquisition, I believe, is going to be a really key part of helping IT organizations regain that control. Yet still enjoy all the benefits of hybrid-cloud environments. Whether it be with an AWS an Azure a Google Cloud platform, like we're partnering very closely with, as well as what they're building with their Enterprise Cloud on premise. Whether it be, you know, with Nutanix. >> Yeah, it reminds me of, was it Progressive Insurance, I think has the, you know >> Yeah. >> We're going to give you quote on all of the things there. Cloud is complicated these days. Is there bias towards it, pushing towards, you know, Nutanix closer partners in the technology itself. >> Yeah, I mean it certainly has. There's a lot of complexity around that and to me the industry hasn't solved a lot of new complexity that has come out of the emerging trend of a different line of businesses starting to develop a new application now, on a certain Cloud platform and the like. And as you're seeing this demand for more application mobility between clouds, so all of a sudden the partners that are coming to us and the partners we're seeing and are demanded of that we work with in the market our players are looking at application automation. Players that are looking at dev/ops tools and the like and it both guides how we innovate on our Calm platform, which we introduced last year at DotNext as well it helps us expand our reach. So, we talked to our traditional buyers but there's a lot of new buyers now that are building those apps and managing those environments and we're going to start to see some of those come into the DotNext show. >> Alright. Ben I want to give you the final word. DotNext is one of the many events that I know you do lots of regional shows and the like, what should we expect to see from Nutanix through 2018? >> Yeah, you know the first thing is that the dialogue, the narrative for the company, that we're going out with we've moved to be a software only company and I think our customers tell us and I heard this from one of our largest retail industry customers just a few weeks ago, by moving to a software only model, it's given them freedom to take advantage of Nutanix, regardless of their hardware platforms. And like you said we've never been a hardware company, it's all been about software value and what you're going to see from us is a new narrative. An expansion of the branded Nutanix talking about the freedom we give for customers to build the data center they've always wanted to build. Freedom to run their application or the workload that they've wanted to run, where they choose to run it based on that insight I talked about. And in another realm, the freedom to play. Freedom to get their weekends back. A lot of our value proposition is because of all the complexity we've taken out of the equation, is that we give our customers their weekends back. This is a story that our DotNext attendees, I think, know better than other but we want to spread the word and so part of that is harnessing that freedom concept to build, to run, to play to invent and tell the world. And DotNext, whether is be in New Orleans, which I think is going to be a blast. When we take it to Europe, London and we do this all around the world, to me that's kind of ground zero for that story. For the community of what we've built together with our customers and partners and that what we take out to the world. >> Alright, well Ben Gibson, I'm glad we could introduce you to our community today because we're going to be seeing you at lots of other events, you and your team, of course, theCUBE will be at Nutanix, DotNext in New Orleans. Nutanix and you will be at Dell Technologies World in Las Vegas. Google Cloud Next happening this summer in San Fransisco. Lots of other shows so be sure to tune in to theCUBE.net, get the list of all the upcoming shows, Ben, Nutanix and of course lots of the Cloud and infrastructure ecosystem. Check it all out. I'm Stu Miniman and thanks for watching theCUBE. (uplifting music)

>> Narrator: Live from Las Vegas, it's the Cube. Covering NetApp Insight 2017. Brought to you by NetApp. >> Hello everyone, welcome back. We're live in here Las Vegas with NetApp Insight 2017. This is the Cube's exclusive coverage. I'm John Furrier, the host of Cube. Also co-founder of SiliconANGLE Media. My co-host Keith Townsend, CTO advisor, talking about the channels, talking about services, talking about data fabric. Our next two guests is Mark Carlton, it's the group technical director of Concorde Technology group, and Adam Bergh who's the data center practice director of Presidio. Guys you're on the front lines. Got the A-Team shirts on. Guys you're on the A-Team, which is a very high bar at NetApp, so congratulations. I've had a few on today already. What's exciting is that this whole digital transformation kind of cliche, it's kind of legit. It's happening. No brainer on that. But it's not a buzzword anymore, it's actually happening. Here's from the front lines. Share your perspective on what this means because most of the folks that are adopting data realize that it's not an after thought. It's fundamental, foundational thinking. But they're busy. They got a lot on their plate. They got dev option, the cloud, and on-premise transformation. They got data governance architecture. They got security practices that are being unbundled from IT. Internet of things over the top. All this stuff's happening. It's crazy. >> Yeah I mean you're absolutely right. So this concept of data transforming and data transformational services was sort of a buzz word three years ago, even when NetApp rolled out this concept of the data fabric right? It really was just a buzz word. It was an idea of freely moving your data in and out of multiple clouds. Not having siloed data. Being able to move your data where you need it when you need it. I mean we're really finally at this point in time, this inflection point where this is a reality for our customers. And I actually want to kind of bring up what NetApp announced here today at insight with ONTAP 9.3. So a little history lesson, NetApp has been promising this data fabric where they're able to freely move data in and out of their different portfolio products. And one of that vision was to move data between their SolidFire platform and their ONTAP platform. So there's two major platforms that they have in the all flash world. So with 9.3 and element 10, which was also announced simultaneously, we actually have the ability now to move data between these two platforms to really start to envision this data fabric world. So I'm really excited that we're actually seeing this vision that was kind of laid out by NetApp three and four years ago. >> That's super hard too by the way. It's not easy, but I got to ask you because, again, in the cloud world you see things like kubernetes, certainly containers has been the rage. But the orchestration aspect of cloud native services in apps is key. You're bringing up an issue around the data. Orchestration of data isn't easy. How do you do it? Okay you can, I get the announcement. SolidFire and ONTAP working well together in 9.3. Is it easy? >> Yep. >> Can you share your thoughts on how easy it is or what needs to be done to set up for that (mumbles)? >> We don't really talk about this, but I'm going to because we saw it today. Cloud orchestrator. >> Yep. >> So this is a gorgeous new interface that NetApp's putting out there to bring that reality of in going to click a button and I'm going to deploy a kubernetes workload. I'm going to deploy doc or I'm going to deploy workloads in Azure. I'm going to deploy a workload in ONTAP on-premises. I'm going to deploy a workload in AWS. And I'm going to be able to freely move that data. I've got a button that's going to make this, the data orchestration happen. It's really fundamentally changing something that's very complex into something that's very easy and accessible to most customers. >> And that's, by the way, the premise of multi-cloud too by the way. So you're saying that they're going to be able to orchestrate and move data across clouds? >> Yes. >> Seamlessly? >> Yeah, across clouds. >> That's hard to do. Mark you have a comment on that? >> Yeah and I think that's really given us the flexibility-- >> John: By the way, not a lot of companies do this probably? >> No, no. And that's why NetApp stands out. And this it makes the conversation with customers really easy now today when we're talking to customers. We're not talking about the technology all the time, we're talking about what you want to do. What do you want to do for your business? How do you want to use your data? How do you want to access your data? And the tools that NetApp are starting to bring out around this, and giving us the capability and flexibility to give control back to the customer. To do what they want to do at that time. They don't have to make them decisions now. So and having that so it's orchestrated across the multiple cloud platforms, and be able to move that data to where the data's best placed for what that business needs is a great conversation to have. We couldn't have that a few years ago. We weren't able to, you were talking about this with data. And now when I talk to customers, I talk about the data fabric, but I don't actually mention it. It's just a strategy in my head. So as I'm going through a conversations, I'm starting to under right what are you wanting to do and how you want me to point it out? >> John: It went from pipe dream to reality basically? >> Yeah. >> Alright so let me just get this so I get right 'cause this again, and we've been looking at this. Not a lot of people do it so we're tracking it. Multi-cloud certainly is what customers want. It's hard to get there. So the question is, every cloud's got a different architecture. S3 and Amazon then how you move and stack it from there is different. It's also different on-prem. So you go back and look at like I got Spark on this, Dupe on this, and I'm pipe lining data here. But then they pipeline it differently (mumbles). So you have different clouds, but then on-prem might be different. How does a, if a customer says okay bottom line me. On-prem, I can move data from on prem to the cloud or is it only across clouds? Or both? >> So we can move data freely, anywhere we want it today. >> Including on premise? >> Today. >> Okay. So let me paint you a picture. Traditional architectures, I'm going to talk about something like a flex pod architecture from NetApp in Sisco. That's your traditional, I'm running traditional workloads on premises. I need some of that data now to flow up into AWS. I spin up instantaneously a cloud ONTAP workload. I click a mouse button, I have a snap mirror to Amazon AWS. Wait a minute. I wanted that data over in Azure. I click a mouse button, I've spun up a cloud ONTAP instance over in Azure, and I've snap mirrored my data over there freely. I want that data back into an S3 type bucket down into on-premises, I'm going to set up a storage grid web scale workload. I can bring that data into an object S3 type data workload instantaneously. I have that data-- >> So your abstracting away the complexity of the cloud so I don't have to rewrite code? >> Adam: Absolutely. >> Does it for you? Alright I'm going to throw-- you guys is good. Cracking the host here. You guys are killin me here. Good, your good. Alright here's a tough one. Okay I got a policy question. I got region in Germany. My data's in Germany, but I replicated it in the U.S., and I don't know what's going on over there. How does a customer deal with that because now in cloud you got regional issues. You got GDPR now going on. So your in the UK, you know what I'm talkin about. So I check the box on the policy. I'm okay in Germany, but my data center in Ireland has replicated data. >> Yeah. >> So this is a really conflict in the privacy. How do you manage that? Is that managed? (speakers talk over each other) >> It genuinely goes down to what sort of data, and what are they doing at the time, or what type of data you're collecting. The conversations I'm having with customers around the GDPR as such because in the UK we're talking about it all the time. Every customer is wanting to talk about are they done the road? Where are they? Try to build that foundation and understanding of-- >> Is that the number one thing you're talkin about to customers is GDPR right now? >> GDPR comes up, you see I wouldn't say it comes up in every conversation. I mean it has to. The main reason it has to is because now we've got that privacy by design so you've got to start to understand as you're designing these solutions and you're designing where this data's going to sit-- >> And the deadline is looming right? I mean I don't know the exact date but-- >> May the 28th in 2018, and it's creeping up. Customers are still sat trying to think about GDPR. They-- >> They're procrastinating till, right. >> Yeah. And I'll still walk into meetings and mention GDPR, and people will look at me and go, "Well what's that." >> You're going, "You're screwed." >> Yeah and we're just getting (mumbles). >> Could be an interesting conversation. >> Y2K all over again. >> It is, and as soon as start getting some (mumbles) conversations. But if you look at what Azure's doing around that NWS, and how they're strengthening that message. Some people are moving it to like an Azure cloud platform because of the GDPR capabilities and the security capabilities that it has, and how that-- And that goes for things like the Office 365 suites and those sorts of areas. Because you're able to start moving your data and freely have that movement, and then we go into things like cloud control and how you can back that up and how we can move the data again from NetApp. It's a software element that gives you the capability to backup Office 365 suites from one cloud to another cloud. >> So GDPR, you see, as a big opportunity for cloud providers like Azure. >> So long as it's-- >> They bring something to the table right? >> Yeah they bring different things to the table. They bring, you have elements of data where you need that on-premise solution. You need to have control, and you need to have that restriction about where that data sits. And some of the talks here that are going on at the moment is understanding, again, how critical and how risky is that data? What is it you're keeping, and what is-- How high does that come up in our business value it is? So if that's going to be your on-premise solution, then maybe other data that can go push out into the cloud. But I would say Azure, the AWS suites, and Google they are really pushing down that security. What you can do, how you can protect it, how you can protect that data, and you've got the capabilities of things like LSR or GSR on having that global reach or that local repositories for the object storage. So you can to control by policies, you can write into this country, but you are not allowed to go to this country and you're not allowed to go to that one. And cloud does give you that to a certain element, but also then you have to step back into maybe search the thing that-- >> So does that make cloud orchestrated more valuable or does it still got more work to do because under what Adam was saying is that the point and click is a great way to provision. >> Man: Mhm. >> Right? You can move onto other things pretty quickly. So in your scenario about the country nuances, does cloud orchestrator handle that too or? >> So the cloud orchestrator will, I mean the promise is that you will be able to pick and choose where you want your data to live. When you want it to move it tomorrow, you know you pick the data center, you pick the geo, you pick your AWS availability zone, and that's where you move your data. You'll have a drop down box that will show you a list of AWS availability zones where your data will live. So if you have specific requirements, specific compliancies that you need to abide by, that will be baked into the application. And if specific requirements change, you can change with it very, very easily. >> John: You can manage a policy to an interface. >> Managing the policy's very easily. And the point being is that we can no longer build silos where your data is stuck in the space that it is. Because of some things like GDPR in Europe or other regulations, you need to have the ability to move that data when you need to. Maybe even at a moment's notice. >> So I got to ask. This is obviously a pressing time in our country, obviously the attacks happened in Vegas. So a lot of people aren't going to make the trip here, have not made the trip, some people stayed at home. So I'd love to ask you guys if you can just take a minute for each of you to share what's exciting that's happening here. Because you know this is a cool announcement. Cloud orchestrator is getting a lot of good buzz. I've been watching the feedback on Twitter from some of the influencers and some of the practitioners. We had a previous guest mention it. What's ah-ha moment here for folks that should know about what's happening that might have missed it because they couldn't make it? >> So I don't know. For me the ah-ha moment was when they said NetApp was finally delivering that the real vision of NVME over fabrics. So we've had a lot of, there's a lot of other storage partners out there that have been talking about NVME as this game changing platform, but really what they're doing's NVME on the backend. Really the promise of NVME is the over the fabric portion of it. NetApp is building into their flagship ONTAP platform a checkbox that says, "I'm going to make this NVME over fabric. "I'm going to make this "storage class memory as a check box." >> John: What's the impact of customers? >> Impact is ultra low latency. Latencies that you can't even achieve with SSDs today. Even with SSDs, NVME on the backend of your controllers. It really is going to enable the high quality analytics. The data services that we just couldn't even achieve at one millisecond latencies, we're down into sub millisecond. .1 millisecond latencies. >> John: So huge performance gains? >> Huge performance gains. It's really going to enable a whole new suite of ideas that we can't even think about. >> And developers will win on this too. It makes data more valuable (mumbles). Mark thoughts on what's exciting here for the folks that couldn't make it? >> I think from my point of view it is that going into orchestration and management point. So leading on from really what Adam was saying then, you were going into developers and how they're going to get the benefit of working with the more performing kit, easier to manage, so they can start to develop that. The orchestration and management and the provisioning and being able to roll out these environments. There's the plugins to some of the areas that we talked about today, and the expansion of that management suite and the ease of that management suit for multiple different users to be able to benefit from it. I want to say from a development and a, or a customers side: the easier we make it to manage, the infrastructure you kind of forget about. Which means you can start to concentrate on the application, how you deliver, what you deliver. And that's really where I see NetApp moving too. It's taken it away from this is the infrastructure and you've got a flexpod, taking it to the next level and going, "Right okay. "Now let's show you what we can do "and how you can use this infrastructure "to be able to benefit your business." And that's one of the big things that I am starting to see. >> The thing I am excited about is the pub initiative. The NetApp.io is the URL. ONTAP, pun intended, you know beer. The developer dev-op story is coming together. I think when you combine some of the Invenio fabric issues is look at the developer pressures to make the infrastructure programmable. That's a huge challenge, and automation's got to be enabled. So I'd love to get your thoughts on how NetApp is positioned visa via what customers want to get to which is, I call self driving infrastructure. Larry Elson calls it self driving databases. But that's pretty much what we want. You want to have under the hood stuff work. But it's the developers and it's using the data in a programmatic way to do automation, hit that machine learning, some of that bounded activity's going to be automated, but then the unbounded data analytics starts to kick in really nicely. >> So element OS is really one of NetApp strategies of what they're calling the next generation data center. And I kind of talk about it with customers as we call it transparent infrastructure to your developers and dev-ops teams. Infrastructure that they don't even have to carry about, care about. That it's highly scalable, highly performant, API driven, cloud like architectures, but on-premise, on-premises so you don't have to worry about cloud sort of data security issues, encryption issues up in the cloud. So you have that cloud like transparent architecture. I mean who knows what hardware runs in the cloud. Do you know what hardware runs in AWS Azure? We don't really care right? >> John: They make their own. >> Yeah we don't care. It works right? It's transparent to the end user, and that's what NetApp is promising really. >> John: Well server-less looks good too right? >> Yeah absolutely. >> Interesting. >> That's really what we're talking about, and that's element OS from NetApp is really the heart of that sort of story. >> Alright so take a step back. You guys are very successful, super smart. Thanks for sharing. It's great conversation, wish we had more time. But the role of the channel is changing. It used to be move boxes through the channel back in the day. That's no longer a storage company. They're a data company, I get that. High level message. I get the positioning. But the reality is you still need to gear to store the stuff on. So still some business there, but the role of the channel and the providers, whether you call em VARS or global (mumbles). You guys in particular have a lot of expertise. The cloud guys are very narrow. They get all the large scale business. But as these solutions start to become vertical, you need data that's specialized to the app, but you want the horizontally scalable benefits of the infrastructure. So you got to balance specialism, which is domain expertise, in a vertical and general, scalable cloud. So that means it's an opportunity for the channel to be basically cloud providers. So the question is, is that happening in your mind? Do you see that playing out because that means bringing technology to the table and using native clouds, not cloud natives, like the native infrastructures of service. 'Cause the action SaaS. Everyone's going to be a SaaS company. >> I mean we're fundamentally turning Presidio in from that traditional, "Hey we're slinging hardware" to a data service is a data management and cloud consulting model where we're even developing our own cloud based tools. Our own cloud based orchestration tools. So we're developing a tool called cloud concierge. So cloud concierge is something that we're not even going to charge for, but what it does it multi-cloud management on-premises, point and click deployment models. Single point of billing infrastructure for multi-cloud charge back and other features like that. So that's where we really see the future of a company like Presidio is something like cloud concierge. >> 'Cause you could bring a lot to the table, so why not build your own tech on top of clouds. >> So we're really becoming a tool company where we're developing our own intellectual property-- >> It's kind of a loaded question, but you guys are on the front lines. It's really kind of, it's more of a directional thing. Mark do you see the same thing in the UK? >> Yeah I was going to say from my point of view we, in our company we deliver infrastructure as a service, platform as a service, backup as a service. So there's lots of different cloud elements that we build within the company. Really that's driven through the conversations, again, we're having with customers. And customers don't, the customers we're talking to and the customers in UK, a lot of them don't jump straight into a cloud opportunity. It's either, like a little bit of data, see what it does, make sure it's the right application. But the, again, that conversation. Because it's changing, our business is having to change. >> Well the purpose of sales channels is to have indirect sales. And companies can't hire people fast enough that actually know the domain specific things. So I see the trend really moving fast along the lines of the specialty channel partners now turning into actual technology partners. >> Yes-- >> So that's going to be a threat to (mumbles) of the world. >> And that's the thing. That's one of the key things. Customers when I talk to them, they're not looking for a partner to sell them something. They're looking for a partner to help them strengthen their IT solutions. >> John: And cross the bridge to the future. >> Yeah. And that's it. And they want a partner they can grow with and keep moving with-- >> Keith you want to get a question in edgewise here? I mean come on buddy. (laughs) >> It was pretty tough. Actually I would like to bring it back to the technology. I'm a technologist at heart. And while this sounds great and magical, one of the practical problems we run into in this type of data mobility is cost and just size of data. So... Let's operationalize this. Bring this down to the ops guy. When, at the end of the month, am I going to see a large egress bill from AWS, Azure. At the end of the month am I going to have the equivalent of bad MPV scores from my internal developers just saying, "Yeah I asked for the data to be moved "from AWS to Azure, "but it was several terabytes and it took several days." So operationalize this for me. Bring it down to the ops perspective. Where is the op cost in this solution. >> NetApp has some really cool technologies around this. I want to talk about one or two real quick. NetApp private storage. This is your own hardware connected to multiple clouds. You want to take that cloud from IBM SoftLayer to Azure to AWS, the data doesn't even have to move. You're basically making a cloud connect through an Equinex data center into multiple clouds. You have the ability to have zero egress charges and multi-cloud hyper scaler access for that for those analytical services. That's one solution. Another one is what's rolling out in the new storage grid web scale 11.0 that NetApp just announced today. It's complete hooks into AWS for all their analytical tools that are prebuilt in AWS. So your data can live on-premises in your own S3 buckets, but you can make API calls into AWS when certain data changes. Where you have the analysis happening in the cloud on your data, but your data never leaves your own physical hardware where you control the data governance of that data. So there are solutions out there that NetApp is really on the forefront of solving these solutions where-- I want my data on-premise. I don't want to pay egress charges, but I still want to take advantage of these amazing services that AWS and Azure are putting together. >> So speedlight. I think we still need to answer that speedlight problem. You know I have, let's say that I go with a CNF like Equinix, and Equinix has data centers across the U.S. and the world practically. But data still has gravity. I can't magically move terabytes of data from one facility, CNF, to another one. What are the limits of the technologies? Where can we go? What are other solutions we need to probably take a look at when it comes to sharing data across geographic regions? >> Yeah so I would say from my point of view, this is when things come into such as our (mumbles) region. And you look at what we're doing with the SJ platforms and how they spread those out because their repositories are moving that data about. And how you can drive that policy driven, you're writing into one place in the background. Then the data is seamlessly moving between different areas. If it's something like a migration where you're actually moving data from one platform to another, there's tools. If you think of things within the MPS solution, which Adam talked about earlier, if it was set within a Equinix building, and you had your express routes and you had your direct connects into the cloud providers that are there, you can use tools that are built into NetApp to actually be able to move that data between those cloud providers or change the VMs and such. It's the virtual machines from a VM platform or hyper V platform, or whichever it'd be to be able to move that using an on command shift tool. So no data is having to move. You're not having to, you've got none of those costs. I think from a management, because of how easy it is to move the data or of the control we have over data now. Using things like OCI and those tools to be able to manage and understand what your costs are, what the drawbacks are, understand where you've got VMs. Do you use that data? A lot of customers don't have that insight. They will go, "I need to move 10 terabytes." Because they think that's what they have. Realistically, 8 terabytes of that data has been sat there, not touched for the last 10 years. And if you move all that 8 terabytes, it's going to cost you money because it's just going to be sat there. You need to move the data that you need to work with. And that's one of the conversations that I have with customers today. It's not about just throwing everything up into the cloud 'cause that's not always the cost effective solution. It's about putting the right data into the right place and the right file solution. So it might be one terabyte needs to go there, but it's what you're going to do with it. Are you going to use it primarily to run analytics again to start to use it to drive the business forward, or is it a terabyte that you're going to sit there and archive. >> Yeah the cheapest data, the cheapest faster data transfer is that transfer you never have to make. So if you don't have to make the data transfer, you'll save money in both time and cost for moving that data. I really appreciate that feedback. >> Guys thanks for coming on the Cube. The A-Team, love when it comes all together. Love the riff on the A-Team. But the bar is high. You guys are really smart. Love the conversation goin back and forth. You guys are answering all the tough questions. Final question for you is, you're on the front lines. The world's changing. What's the advice to your peers out there that are watching? How to attack this environment because how do you win under this pressure? It's a hard game right now, a lot of hard stuff's being done. Whether that's cloud architecting, that's on-prem private cloud, or moving to the cloud. A lot of heavy lifting's going on. It looks easy. I want the magic. I want push button cloud orchestration to consumer apps. Your advice. >> Find a strong partner. So I mean if you're going out there, you're not going to be able to learn everything yourself. You want to have a strong partner that's got a big team. A team that has the breath and scope to deal with some of the big challenges out there that can put together best of breed solutions from multiple vendors. So not just NetApp, not just our cloud partners, but someone who has the breath and depth and scope. Find that right partner that's good for you and your organization. >> John: Mark? >> And I agree in the way of the partnership side of things. That's really what's going to drive customers. In making sure that you've got a partner that you can rely on to be able to move forward. Make sure they can help you understand your business, but you clearly understand what your business is trying to achieve. So it's, I ask people today what's your business? Do you understand your business? Do you understand your customers? And a lot of the time it's yeah. We understand what they do. But they don't understand the business. And it's key to understanding what you need to do, how you need to achieve it, and having a partner that can support you through that phase. >> Awesome, great. Thanks for coming on. I really appreciate it. I would add community as the open source continues to grow, big part of it. Being part of the community, being great partnerships, being transparent. It's the Cube bringing all the data to you here live in Las Vegas for NetApp Insight 2017. I'm John Furrier with Keith Townsend. More live coverage after this short break. >> Woman: Calling all barrier breakers, status quo smashers, world changers.

>> It's a pleasure to be here with you and to tell you about something I've been dreaming about and working for for many years and now is coming to the surface quite powerfully and quite usefully in many areas. I apologize, sometimes this flickers for some reason but I hope it doesn't disturb the story. I'd like to give you a little touch of history since I was there at the beginning of this journey and give you a brief introduction to what we mean for Fog Computing. And then go quickly to three powerful application spaces for this technology, together with industrial internet and one is industrial automation. That's the focus of our activity as Nebbiolo Technologies. The other one is one of my favorite ones and we'll get there is the automotive that caught fire here in Silicone Valley in the last years, the autonomous car, the connected vehicle and so on. And this is related to also to intelligent transportation and Smart Cities. And then a little touch on what Fog Computing means for Smart grid energy but many, many other sectors will find the same usefulness, the same architecture dimensions of Fog Computing applicable. So this is the story that comes back hopefully, here, the day in 2010 when Fog Computing, the word started here, oh God, is this jumping around? I think it's the connector, this is the age of the connector, this is the age of the Dongles. This is not an Apple Dongle and so we are having troubles. And this is not yet one of the last machines that are out. Let's hope for, I never had this problem, okay. Alright, this date 2010 at the Aquarium Research Center in Monterey where I gave a talk about robots going down deep in the bottom of those big valleys under the ocean and when I finished, the lady, Ginny in the middle approached me and told me, look, why don't you call what you're talking about fog computing? Because it's cloud computing brought too close to the ground and I protested for about 15 minutes. And on the drive home, I thought that's really a good name for what we are doing, what we have been doing in the last years and I started trying it out and using it and more and more I found good response and so seven years later, I'm still here talking about the same thing. What's happening is Fog, the edge of the metric zone was very important but it was always very important in IT, is still very important in IT in mobile, in content distribution but when IOT came to the surface, it became even more relevant to understand the need of resources, virtualized real time capable, secure, trusted with storage computing and networking coming together at the edge. At the edge of the IT network, now they are calling this mobile edge, they realize we are realizing that mobile can benefit from local resources at the edge, powerful real time capable resources but also and more importantly for what we are doing in this space of operational technologies, this is the space, the other and the other side of the boundary between information technologies and operational technologies and here is where we are living with Fog Computing these days so, apologize, I apologize for this behavior that is, maybe I have another Dongle, Apple Dongle. Maybe I could look at that, maybe Morris can help me out here, anyway, so what is Fog Computing? Fog Computing is really the platform that brings modern, Cloud inspired Computing storage here is important here for our friends at Western Digital and networking functions closer to the data producing sources. In our case, machines, things, but not just bringing Cloud down, it's also bringing functions up from the machine world, the real time, the safety functions, the trusting and reliability functions required in that area and this is a unified solution at the edge that really brings together communication, device management, data harvesting, analysis and control. So this is kind of new except for our friends in Wall Street. The real time part was not as sensitive. Now we are realizing how important it is and how important the position of resources is in the future of solutions in this space and so it's not boxes. It's a distributed layer of resources, well managed at the edge of the network and really has a lot of potential across multiple industries. Here we see the progress also in the awareness of this topic with the open fog control room that is now a very active and even the Vcs. Peter Levine here is talking about the importance of the edge. What is really happening is the the convergence. I think we should probably stop and use a different Dongle. Is this the one, no, no, this is not the right Dongle. The world of Dongles, sorry. Oh boy. Oh you have the computer with the, okay, is the right Dongle with the right computer, okay. Here we are, okay. Alright, we're getting back there. This is the new Apple. Okay, we are here, this looks better, thank you. Alright, so this is to be understood. This is the convergence of IT functionality, the modern IT functionality with the OT requirements and this is fundamentally the powerful angle that Fog Computing brings to IOT and machine world so all the nice things that happened in the Cloud come down but meet the requirements of resources, the needs and the timing of the Edge. And so when you look at what is brought into particularly the world of operations, you see these kind of functions that are not usually there. In fact, when you meet this operational world, you find microprocessors, you find Windows machines, industrial Pcs and so on, not so much Linux, not so much the modern approaches to computing. These are the type of dimensions that you'll see have a particular impact on the pain points seen in the wold of applications. So now we go to the Use cases in, use cases in the internet of things. I think it's on your side, I'm sorry. Because it's the second machine. Okay, well, maybe here's the solution. So we have seen this picture of IOT multiple times. A lot of verticals, we are concentrating on this tree, one is the industrial, the second one is the autonomous vehicle in intelligent transportation, the third one, just touched upon is the Smart Grid. This is the area of activity for Nebbiolo Technologies. Those kind of body shops and industrial floors with large robots with a lot of activity around those robots with cells protecting the activities within each working space, this is the world PLCs, industrial Pcs controlling robots, very fragmented. Here we are really finding even more critical this boundary between operational and informational technologies. This is a fire wall, also a mental fire wall between the two worlds and best practice is very different in one place than the other particularly also in the way we handle data, security, and many other areas. In this space, which is also a little more characterized here with this kind of machines that you see in this ISA 99 or ISA 95 type of picture, you see the boundary between the two spaces, once more when we come back. And alright, so the key message here, very tough to go across, it's very complex, the interaction between the two worlds. And there is where deeply we find a number of pain points at the security level, at the Hardware architecture level, at the data analytics and storage level, at the networking, software technologies and control architecture. There's a lot happening there that is old, 1980's time frame, very stable but in need of new approaches. And this is where Fog Computing has a very strong impact And we'll see, sorry, this is a disaster here. Alright, what do we do, alright. Maybe I should go around with this computer and show it to you. Okay, now it's there for a moment. Now, this is, maybe you have to remember one picture of all this talk, look at this, what is this? This is a graphical image of a body shop of a an important car company, you see the dots represent computers within boxes, industrial Pcs, PLCs, controllers for welding machines, tools and so on. That is, if you sum up the numbers, it's thousands of computers, each one of them is updated through a UPC, USB stick, sorry and is not managed remotely. It's not secure because there's a trust that the whole area is enclosed and protected through a fire wall on the other side but it's very stable but very rigid. So this is the world that we are finding with dedicated, isolated, not secure computing, this is Edge Computing. But it's not what we hope to be seeing soon as Fog Computing in action there so this is the situation. Very delicate, very powerful and very motivating. And now comes IOT and this is not the solution. It's helping, IOT tries to connect this big region, the operational region to the back end to the Clouds, to the power of computing that is there, very important, predicting maintenance, many other things can be done from there but it's still not solving the problem. Because now you have to put little machines, gateways into that region, one more machine to manage, one more machine to secure and now you're taking the data out. You are not solving a lot of the pain points. There's some important benefits, this is very, very good. But it's not the story, the story is sold once you really go one step deeper, in fact, from connectivity between information technologies and informational technologies to really Convergence and you see it here where you're starting to replace those machines supporting each cell with a fog node, with a powerful convergent point of computing, real time computing that can allow control, analytics and storage and networking in the same nodes so now these nodes are starting to replace all the objects controlling a cell. And offer more functions to the cell itself. And now, you can imagine where this goes, to a convergent architecture, much more compact, much more homogeneous, much more like Cloud. Much more like Cloud brought down to the Edge. When this comes back, okay, almost there. So this is okay, this is now the image that you can image leads to this final picture that is now even not, okay, do you see it, okay. Now you're seeing the operational space with the fabric of computing storage and networking that is modern, that is virtualized, that supports an application store, now you have containers there. You can imagine virtual machines and dockers living the operational space. At the same time, you have it continuing from the Cloud to the network, the modern network, moving to the Edge into the operational space. This is where we are going and this is where the world wants us to go and the picture representing this transition and this application of Fog Computing in this area is the following, the triangle, the pyramid is now showing a layer of modern computing that allows communications analysis control application hosting and orchestration in a new way. This is cataclysmic, really is a powerful shift, still not fully understood but with immense consequences. And now you can do control, tight, close to the machines, a little slower through the Fog and a little slower through the Cloud, this is where we are going. And there's many, many used cases, I don't dwell on those. But we are proceeding with some of our partners exactly in this direction. Now the exciting topics if I can have five more minutes making up the time wasted. What's going on here, the connected vehicle, the autonomous vehicle, the electrification of automobile are all converging and I think it's very clear that the para dime of Fog Computing is fundamental here. And in fact, imagine the equivalent of a manufacturing cell with a converging capabilities into the Fog and compare it with what's going on with the autonomous vehicle. This is a picture we used a Sysco seven years ago. But this is now, a car is a set of little control loops, ECUs, little dispersed, totally connected computers. Very difficult to program, same as the manufacturing cell. And now where are we going, we are going towards a Fog node on wheels, data center on wheels but better a Fog node on wheels with much better networking between, with a convergence of the intelligence, the control, the analytics, the communications in the middle and a modern network deterministic internet called TSN is going to replace all these CAN boxes and all these flakey things of the past. Same movement in industrial and in the automobile and then you look at what's going on in the intelligent transportation, you can imagine Fog Computing at the edge, controlling the junctions, the traffic lights, the interactions with cars, cars to cars and you see it here, this is the image, again where you have the operational space of transportation connected to the Clouds in a seamless way which these nodes of computing storage and networking at the junctions inside the cars talking to each other, so this is the beautiful movement coming to us and it requires the distribution of resources with real time capabilities, here you see it. And now, the Smart Grid, again, it cannot continue to go the same way with a utility data center controlling everything one way, it has to have and this is from Duke and a standardization body, you can see that there's a need of intelligence in the middle, Fog nodes, distributed computing that are allowing local decisions. Energy coming from a microcell into the grid and out, a car that wants to sell it's energy or buy energy doesn't need to go slowly to a utility data center to make decisions so again, same architecture, same technologies needed, very, very, very powerful. And we could go on and on and on, so what are we doing? We won't advertise here but the name has to be remembered. The name comes from a grape that grows in the Fog in Northern Italy, it's in Piedmont, my home town is behind that 13th century castle you see there. Out there is Northern Italy close to Switzerland. That vineyard is from my cousin, it's a good Nebbiolo, starting to be sold in California too. So this is the name Nebbia Fog comes to, Nebbiolo Technologies, we are building a platform for this space with all the features that we feel are required and we are applying it to industrial automation. And our funders are not so much from here, are from Germany, Austria, KUKA Robotics, TTTech, GiTV from Japan and a few bullets to complete my presentation. Fog Computing is really happening. There's a deep need for this converged infrastructure for IOT including Fog or Edge as someone calls it. But we need to continue to learn, demonstrate, validate through pilots and POCs and we need to continue to converge with each other and with the integrators because these solutions are big and they are not from a little start up. They are from integrators, customers, big customers at the other end, an ecosystem of creative companies. No body has all the pieces, no Sisco, no GE and so on. In fact, they are all trying to create the ecosystem. And so let's play, let's enjoy the Cloud, the Fog and the machines and try to solve some of the big problems of this world. >> Okay, Flavio, well done. >> Sorry for that. Sorry for the hiccups. >> Now we do that on purpose to see how you'd react and you're a pro, thank you so much for the great presentation. >> Alright. >> Alright, now we're going to get into panel one, looking at the data models and putting data to work.

(upbeat electronic music) >> Male Voiceover: Live from New York, it's the Cube, covering big data New York City 2016. Brought to you by headline sponsors Sisco, IBM, Nvidia, and our ecosystem sponsors. Now, here are your hosts. Dave Vellante and Peter Burress. >> We're back in the Big Apple. This is the Cube, the worldwide leader in live tech coverage, we're here at Big Data NYC, Big Data week is part of strata plus dupe world. Shaun Connolly is here as the vice president of strategy at Horton Works, long time friend and Cube alum, great to see you again. >> Thanks for having me, were back at the same venue last year, always a pleasure. >> Yeah, it's good, we're growing, I guess the event's growing, we haven't been over there yet, but some of our guys have, but what's it like over there? >> You know, it feels the same, some of the different use cases, I think last year was streaming, we're hearing more machine learning and things like that as far as use cases, so similar vibe. >> Yeah, so things are evolving, right? How's Hortonworks evolving? >> We're continuing to report our quarterly earnings as the only publicly traded company in this space, things from a business perspective are doing well. Our connected data platforms strategy which we unveiled at the beginning of this year, which is written data in motion and data at rest and enabling these new gen transformational applications continues to play out. The data in motion piece is sort of decoupled and unrelated to a hadou platform, it's really about acquiring and handling the FedEx for data delivery type notions, data logistics, secure transmission. That's based on the Apache Ni-Fi tech that was originally built sort of at the NSA over the past eight years, so. Really a nice robust piece of technology that we've pushed out to the edge in our latest release so you can really skin these down into a secure site to site transmission. A lot of sophisticated capabilities there, so we're seeing a lot of uptake in that sort of architectural vision, the products are maturing, both on prem and in the cloud, things are pretty exciting. >> Well this cloud thing seems pretty real. (Shaun laughing) You can get a lot of traction, right? Everybody kind of knew it was coming, but what are you seeing? >> Yeah so it was, I guess I started the journey back in 2009, when I was at Springsource in Paul Moretz was CEO of Vmware, and that was pre sort of cloud at that time. We were talking about this notion of platform as a service, and things like that. And that resonated really well with folks back then, but their main ask was how do you solve the data problem, how do actually get the data to the apps that need it. Fast forward to 2016, I think it's been a lot of open source innovation, you know a lot of commercial innovation, the rise of cloud for providing a fast path to value, booting up these used cases, it's a fascinating transition to watch. Many of our customers are, people use the word hybrid. What that means to me is they'll have data center workloads, or multi data center workloads, but they also have cloud workloads, sometimes even multi cloud workloads, and that inherent nature of the beast is why I use sort of the term of connected data architecture, is y%ou need an architecture that inherently is built to span that fact. And that's just increasing, that's just the world we live in today. >> But the fact is because there speed of light issues, there's data fidelity issues. >> Shaun: Yup. >> There's other types of things, how are you starting to see those practical and very physical realities start to impact the whole concept of design as it pertains to data, as it pertains to analytics, as it pertains to the infrastructure associated with the two? >> Yup, so at Hoop Summit that we had last June, there were really some really good sessions that were there. Folks like Comcast, Ford, Schlumberger talked about this connected data architecture reality, right. If you look at like, I like to use the connected car ecosystem as a good example, cause there were insurance providers and others that were sort of speaking on behalf of that, where you have the cars and other data that's inherently born up there, and there's a slug of use cases that are around edge analytics, streaming analytics, time series analytics, and we're seeing that, and I think the cloud lends itself really well for those types of use cases. But we also see manufacturing line data for the cars, where you want to get a 360 degree view of operational issues, and dovetail that with manufacturing line elements, and that's inherently what we've seen is, what your classic sort of on prem data wake, in quotes has been used for so you can get that 360 degree operational intelligence type of analytics to come out of that, right? So that type of use case, whether you apply it to oil and gas and having the sensors on the oil rigs, in the Schlumberger example, that pattern is repeating itself across different industries. British Gas, in Europe talks about how they're fundamentally changing the nature of the relationship with their customer because of the smart meters, and their connectivity in the homes and they can deliver a better value there. So that's inherently connected data realm, there's cloud use cases, and in the data center use cases. So I see these use cases, you know, they'll be use case specific in applications that are sprinkled across that fabric, if you will. And that's really what we're seeing. >> At our panel last year here in this venue, we would talk about a lot of things, one was the market, the sort of ebbs and flows you just mentioned, you guys are the only public player, Talon's joining that crew. >> Shaun: Yeah. Excellent. >> You've seen some. >> Shaun: We need more. >> We need more, we've seen some MNA, Plat 4 taken out, I don't know if that was, I don't know the specifics of that deal. Might have been an acu hire, might not, I don't know. And Data Mere did a raise, so you're seeing these rip currents, in all directions. What are you seeing in the marketplace, lot of funding early on, lot of players, lot of innovation, and now it's like, okay, the music at some point's going to stop, but. >> Yeah. >> What's your take? >> So in our last call, and I think we repeated it on our prior earnings call, you know, our focus and then we put out there in our earnings, in our Q3 earnings will sort of reiterate where we stand is, we basically said Q4 is when we look to go adjust to even or break even. >> Right. >> And then 2017 we'll go from there. We reiterated that guidance, we had a little over 62 million in billings for the quarter, so the business is pretty robust and growing, it's a. We're only five years into this, I mean we're just five years old, so it's a very fast pace of billings growth, right? That's almost a 250 million run rate, right? For exiting that quarter. You know, annual run rate. So we see a lot of the use cases really continuing to move on. I think what I and what our customers ask us is, they're on a digital transformation journey, and they want the industry to start talking about those types of business value drivers, right? So I think we should expect to see a transition from the piece parts animals in the zoo and what's the right open source piece of technology, and more why should you care, right? As a business, how is this transforming what you do? How does this open up new lines of business? We started seeing that at Hadoop Summit when I think about two dozen customers were sharing, very rich stories, right? So that's where things are. But I think running a company is, you have to run it with a certain sense of rigor and that was one of the reasons why we chose to go public, right? >> So, we by the way, we totally agree that customers want to stop talking about digital business in platitudes and start actually identifying specifically what is it about it that's new and different, and find ways of doing it. >> Shaun: Sure. >> Coming back to the issue, however, of how you go about making some of those transformations relevant. There is clearly a knowledge gap about what digital business is, what it isn't, certainly. But there's also a fair amount of skills that have yet to be developed, that are required for a lot of the use cases that companies are pursuing. Not just in terms of implementing the technology appropriately, but actually constructing and conceptualizing the use cases. >> Shaun: Sure. >> So that suggests that there's two paths forward. There's a path forward where we can do a better job of diffusing knowledge through people, and there's a path for where we can do a better job of building software that's easier to use. >> Shaun: Mm hmm. >> And there's both. How do you see this playing out over the course of the next few years? >> Yep, and I think in any new area as technology's emerging, like one of the things I use is Apache Software Foundation. Literally every other week there's a new data related Apache project that lands, so it's. It can be really confusing, but it's exhilarating from the fact of I participate in that, and I try and figure out what ones we can harness in a consumable platform, whether it's one prem or a cloud or what have you. What use cases can it light up? So I think you have both of those vectors, and it really depends on, I like to use the classic software adoption curve, you have a lot of the left side of the chasm folks, where a lot of this new stuff is going to be sharper edges, and they're always going to be trailblazers, right? But we are also seeing a lot of some of these advanced analytics. Some of these new solutions are automating the pipeline, so you can actually let the infrastructure and these engines do more of the thinking for you, so you get your model's output. Even to the point where you run multi model simulation in parallel, and out pops the best fit. That's where things will head, right? I think it's just a matter of the technology maturing, making sure we address things like security, metadata management, governance, and those illities that the enterprise expects, and then really forcing ourselves to simplify and automate as much as possible, right. And that was one of the reasons on that last one why in October 2011 we basically chose Teradata and Microsoft as key partners. Teradata because in 2011, clearly, right? >> Peter: Teradata. >> They're Teradata, right? Microsoft because it simplifies technologies and brings them to billions of users, right? And so we need to do both, you need to harden it, right? For the most rigorous large enterprises, but you need to simplify it for the meat of the market adopters, right? The early majority and late majority. You have to do both. >> Shaun, you're sitting across from a CEO, and you have to say these are the three things you need to do to enact this digital transformation. >> Shaun: Yup. >> What are the three things you're telling him? >> So, I think they need as a business to identify how do they want to leverage data as capital, and what pockets of value do they want to go chase, number one. Number two, how is their business being impacted by the fact that you have the rise of IOT and inherently increasing connected society and infrastructure. How is that impacting them? And number three is, how do they evolve what they're used to doing, right? You have to align it, exactly. >> Because that's really many respects of, I like to say there's a difference between invention and innovation. Invention is the engineering act, innovation's a social act, it's adopting those new practices >> Shaun: Exactly. >> That actually allow you to enact the invention and generate revenue. >> Exactly. Now in our space, I think we have a very compelling renovate value prop which is a cost savings where you can drive cost out, but the innovate use cases are the ones. Like if all you're going to do is renovate, then you will fail, you will stall, right? Because it's not a balance of cost savings. It's about how do you actually transform your business. And in the case of like the British Gas example, I used that as how they engaged that end consumer is fundamentally changing. So that's the question I put back in those conversations is how do you want to evolve your business and how do you leverage data as capital? Because the beauty of data as capital is you can actually generate multiple lines of interest off of a single data set, cause you can derive different insights off of that, so it's not like a dollar, right? And single compound, it's multiple compound annual interest rate on that. But they have to chase the right use cases. >> Although, we've also learned from great design that if you do the right thing better, you get rid of a lot waste and so coming back to your point, doing the right thing better often leads to cost savings. >> Yes. Exactly. One inherently can drive the other, but if you're just driving it then >> Peter: Just doing cost. >> You're not going to transform your buisiness. >> Peter: You're just going to continue to do the same or wrong things worse. >> Shaun: Exactly. >> Or wrong things cheaper. >> And that's difficult for enterprises. Because there's a certain way to do data management inherently inside in a highly structured manner, but I do think the rise of like IOT, I don't see as a market, I see it as infinite slices of prosciutto, right? (laughter) It's a very thinly sliced set of market opportunities, right? But it's forcing people to think about different use cases and how that might impact their business. >> We see those set of capabilities. >> Yup. >> Which leads to the prosciutto. >> Exactly. >> So you, and come up with a really nice sandwich. (laughter) >> It's my Italian. >> Let's keep going. >> I'm loving it. >> I'm getting a little hungry. >> You have always made a big deal out of your partnerships not being barney deals but being deep integration relationships. So you mentioned two here, Teradata and Microsoft. As the cloud becomes more prevalent, as things evolve and machine learning becomes the hot buzzword, et cetera. How have you evolved those relationships specifically in terms of the integration work that you've done? Have you kept up that engineering ethos, or? >> And that was the thing. With Microsoft, we clearly spent a lot of sweat equity on the Azure HDInsight service, but if you look at that ecosystem, they have Azure machine learning, right? They have a whole raft of services, right, that you can apply to the data when it's in the cloud, right? So how that piece integrates with the broader ecosystem of services is a lot of engineering work as well. I've always said, there's work to be done in our green box, but the other half of the work is how it plumbs into the rest. And so if you look at the AWS ecosystem, how do you optimize for S3 as a storage tier, and ephemeral workloads where HDFS is maybe a caching mechanism but it's not your primary storage, right? It brings up really interesting integration modes and how you actually bring your value out into really interesting use cases, right? So I think it's opened up a lot of areas where we can drive a lot more integration, drive the open source tech in a way that's relevant for those use cases. >> Alright, we got to go but, summit in Tokyo, is it next month? >> Yes, end of October. >> End of October. >> It's our first time, so primarily summits have been US and Europe. We had Melbourne end of August, and we have Tokyo end of October. I'll be, they're bringing the right hander out of retirement, so I'll be onstage in Tokyo. (laughing) I've usually been behind the scenes. >> Throwing the slurve? (laughter) >> Yeah, exactly. So I'm looking forward to it, it'll be exciting. >> Alright, good, and then 17, you're going to start again in the spring. >> Shaun: Yup. >> You're in Munich. >> Shaun: Yup. Munich. >> You were in Dublin last year, you're moving to Munich this year. >> Shaun: Exactly. >> Hopefully the Cube will be back, in Munich, alright? >> We love you guys, you guys do a good job. >> Let's make it happen, do good stuff in Europe, so thanks again for coming out. >> Shaun: Thanks for having me. >> Always a pleasure. Alright, keep it right there, we'll be back right after this short break. This is the Cube, we're live from New York City. ( upbeat electronic music)

(upbeat music) >> Work, sorry. >> Okay, we're live here at VMworld 2012. This is SiliconANGLE.tv's exclusive continuous coverage of VMworld. Day two, we're here, excited to have the new CEO of VMware, a long time, seven time Cube alumni when he was a lowly president of the EMC, Pat Gelsinger, with my cohost Dave. And welcome back to theCUBE. >> Hey, thank you very much guys, great to be here. >> Pleasure to see you again. >> First time as CEO, so first of all, how do you feel, tell us what it's like. Obviously, just for the folks who haven't watched the EMC World interview, I asked you a pointed question. I said Pat, if you were running VMware, what would you work on? So we'll get to that later, but. >> Okay. >> It turned out to be true. >> Turned out to, yeah once again, theCUBE got it nailed, like always, right? >> Absolutely. >> So just give us some personal color around the transition. So you know Paul, obviously you guys had great rapport, obviously, on stage yesterday. You got a standing ovation, he's being called the King on Twitter, he's got a huge respect. You guys work together, just take us through emotionally, the Pat Gelsinger, inside Pat, what went down there? How did it feel? >> And the way he, said handing over the custodianship of the community, to Pat Gelsinger, that was really, I think a great way to put it. >> Well you know, first thing, Paul and I are just great friends, you know? For 30 years, we've worked together. It's like you know, a great pick and roll team in basketball right, you know he knows when to pick, I know when to roll. You know, we just have really learned how to work together over the years. And just great respect for each other's talents. And Paul embraced me, and really endorsed me to the VMworld, and the community, in that sense, is powerful, right? But it also was intimidating. A bit of a responsibility as well. And you know, I had dinner with Tom Jorgens last night. Right, it's sort of like oh, two weeks ago, we were trying to kill each other. Now, my new best friend, right? So it is this very rapidly shifting role. As well as, we laid out a pretty bold vision this week. >> And you were at Intel too, you understand the whole partnership dynamic, we talk about this in theCUBE, the ecosystem, obviously VMware, the beginning of this massive opportunity of extending beyond the VMware look. I mean you announced, as an example, people who not VMworld, that's always been about VMware, they've been dominant in the enterprise. But yesterday you announced changes to the pricing. I mean you guys are thinking bigger now. Is that part of the plan, to think bigger, beyond VMware, and extend to other vendors? Obviously great love fest on the CEO panel yesterday, and also the demos up on stage. So talk about that mindset, and what you plan to do to take it beyond just VMware. >> Well it is very much a community. And when you think about what we're doing with software defined data center, right we're always touching everything, as Paul said. It's virtualizing the data center. And to do that, you know it's the networking guys, the security guys, the storage guys, the management guys, the new application vendors, right? It really is this ever broadening community. And as part of that is both a great opportunity, as well as a great responsibility too, all of those community players. And how can we innovate together, collectively, to bring about this next layer of fundamental innovation, agility, and speed, for the software defined data center of the future. >> So we want to get to that in a second. I want to ask you about about Paul Maritz again, just to kind of come back to the Paul thing. He has yet to be on theCUBE, so we're trying to get him on theCUBE and say it's a safe place. >> Does he not like you? What'd you do, you offended him? >> We haven't-- >> I don't know, he's... >> People want to know about him, he made some really, kind of cool, tongue in cheek comments yesterday about Facebook's valuation and VMware, everyone had a good chuckle out of it. But talk about Paul Maritz as a person. He's rarely doing public appearances, he's a total tech geek, he's a cool guy. So share with the folks out there, what's he like? >> Well you know, I think of Paul as sort of the Michael Jordan of strategy and technology, right? You know, he is just, you know, I don't think of myself as a bad strategist, this is like, the best strategist operating in the industry today around technology, and it's somebody who's deep in the technology, but also strategically very, very broad. And in that sense, his new role is really to allow him to really go focus on what he truly loves, his longterm strategy, understanding the technology trends and really going deep in that area. >> And the technology right, and he's also a huge technologist. >> Oh yeah right, you know he's sort of like, tops and bottoms, right, he's higher in the stack, I'm lower in the stack and boy, right between us, we sort of cover from sand to solutions. >> Well you said it's somewhat intimidating. And you're a lifelong hardware guy, now taking over a software company, how do you think about that, and how do you think you might change the way you approach your leadership? >> Well I think in some ways, I've always thought of myself as an infrastructure guy, right? And you know, most of silicon is done in software these days, so in that sense, I don't see it as that radical in that regard. But I have had the opportunity to really build the hardware infrastructure that every aspect of cloud is built on, and now to be able to put tops on bottoms, right, to be able to layer that software on top of it, to me is just a great opportunity, to take on this next piece of finishing that overall portfolio. >> How does he fit with Joe Tucci? Because I just love the dynamic was on there yesterday. You know, and we've had a chance to, Joe's been on theCUBE, and we've talked to him in person. Great guy, he's just such a great executive CEO. He's been around the block. Paul's like his sidekick now, and those two guys are going to cause some trouble. What's your prediction on the Joe Tucci, Paul Maritz dynamic, because you've got a strategist that no one's ever seen before in the tech business in Maritz, now with a canvas, painting a new canvas. He's done VMware, he's got that thing kicked off, laid out the roadmap in 2010, it's all filling in nicely. It's all going great, you're going to take it from there and ride that ship, and sail into good waters. But now he's now painting a new canvas. What is Joe and Paul talking about? What's that next canvas? >> Well, if you sort of think about Joe right, he's really become, at this point of his career, I'd say the elder statesman of the industry. Where everybody likes Joe, he makes everybody comfortable with him. And you know, there's just this comfort that Joe really brings to any situation. So here you have the big brains of Paul being combined with the experience, the relationships of Joe, and to me, I expect it to be a really powerful combination. >> You know I was commenting to Dave on a lot of things yesterday, and tying in some kind of trendy stuff, like Apple's market share value, and looking at that percentage of market share. And then also when you guys were up on the panel, one of the observations was, you've got the elder statesman in Tucci, and the senior experience of Joe with Pat, you and Paul, and a lot of the companies like Facebook, are run by people under the age of 35. So there's a generation of kids out there running big companies that have market caps of a billion dollars, so that's now coming on to the scene. How do you see that all playing out? Is there a trend towards business value, some kind of digs around the social media discontent, and the markets changing? You made a comment about that. But is it shifting to business value? Is that kind of what you guys are trying to get there? What do you say to those young leaders out there? And also what's happening in that market? >> Well I do think that there is this aspect of you know, building infrastructure, data centers, right, there's just this piece of okay, it's hard work, right, you have to transition people over time, your customers or CIOs, there is a level of security, confidence, et cetera, that needs to occur on that side. And then you have the dynamism of the consumer trends. And you know, Cook at Apple clearly is the elder statesman of the consumer social side of the world as well, and you know, he's not a teenager anymore, in that sense. But clearly it's this ability to generate extraordinary growth, extraordinary new valuation, as we've seen with Google and with Facebook. And how all of that matures, for social to become a sustained monetization model in the industry, isn't really proven yet. >> You know I was really liking Michael Dell on stage, trying to really make his point, I'm not going away, yeah we did a direct business model, we're the PC guys. And then he's advocating, and it's good to see him back in the game like that-- >> Yeah, me too, I think Michael, over the last two years, you know he has a tough job. HP has a tough job, to really transform those companies. And we have to say okay, Michael, he's really made progress. >> A lot of the CEOs in that PC era, they put a lot of East Coast mini computer companies out of business I think, don't want to see that happen to themselves, are a lot more paranoid to these (chuckling) year olds companies firms, and really more aggressive about staying the course. >> Yep, and Michael I think, has clearly said, I'm up for this challenge, and I'm going to take my namesake company through that challenge. >> So I got to ask you a hardware question. Because you know that business. Now you're going to be moving more into the different kind of this, with virtualization and apps. But HP and Dell are classic PC vendors. They've innovated, they were part of the whole Wintel generational shift. They have huge market shares, still. Margins yeah, are tight, but the market's changing. You guys' point about that, a new way. Apple has huge market value, and they have single digit share and growing, in hardware, yet they're so valuable. So the logic is, if you connect the dots, small, single digit share, yet huge profits. Really great, good products obviously. But they're wrapping services in other business models around the hardware, what's your take on that? I you were at Dell and HP, and saying hey, don't give up that PC business, just move fast, don't become driftwood, but what kind of services are they going to have to wrap around these products? Because the end user computing world, yes it is changing, multiple devices, but Apple has demonstrated that you can have a very strong hardware business and wrap around it. So what's your advice to those guys? >> Well I don't think of Apple as a hardware business, in that sense, I think Apple has been focused on a user experience that happens to be embodied in hardware and services, right? And in that sense, they have owned the user experience. They're maniacal about industrial design, they're maniacal about that whole experience, and have really innovated in how consumers buy, utilize, their products, and I think any aspect of things that touch the user have to have that in mind. It's all about the user experience, and they've done it well, and they've said, it's not hardware, it's not software. It's that integrative platform and experience. And my advice to anybody in that space, whether it's Dell, HP, Lenovo, RIM, Nokia, Microsoft, you have to really take that very aggressively in mind. >> So you had your put your man on the moon moment up in your keynote, you said let's get to, virtually 100% of applications, versus, I think you said 90%. That's intimidating, I'm reminded of the climber who's climbing to the top of the mountain and it's like this false summit, right? So, my question is, to get there you're going to have to lick the complexity problem. And over the years in IT, we think we've got that problem solved, and then you peel the onion, and and oh boy, there's more complexity there. To get to that 90%, you're going to have to solve that complexity problem, are we, have we solved it, are we on that path? >> Well, I think we're beginning to lay the foundation for it. And I think some of the software defined data center pieces, okay you know, we got to attack management and orchestration, we got to attack the network and security. So clearly those are elements of it. We have to make storage easy and available. But we also have to attack some of the higher level problems as well. Some of the cloud foundry, the PAZ layers as well, because it's not just about modernizing the old, with things like GemFire, and Data Fabric, and rebuilding the database environment, but it's also enabling the new, and enabling those across the multi cloud environments. And you know, so it's a lot of work to go do. But I think we've laid out the core pieces of the vision, and now my job is really to refine, execute and accelerate that endgame. >> Pat, I got to ask you about disruption and change. Joe Tucci made a comment that I thought was pretty Joe Tucci-like, when asked about the trends. And he said the horizontal's getting shorter, and the vertical's getting steeper in terms of the time, the change and the disruption. And he's hyper focused on that. I know you are too, and you tend to move fast and executive in watching your career. So let's take this software defined networking trend. I know we reported that you were in, when you took over EMC Ventures and looked at that, and you guys moved on some of those deals. So that's really key success, and we talk about it on theCUBE, but that's a game changer for VMware, like SpringSource was acquired, acquisition changed the developer landscape, now you got the Nicira deal as a game changing statement, but you have existing stuff going on like VCE, which is pioneering a lot of the vBLock stuff right? So you got VCE out there, and now you got the software defined data center at the merging side. So how do you sort that out? I know you're you know, first week on the job, or first second day on the job, but I mean you know the history. So, VC obviously, is a flagship offering is the vBLock, how does that fit into this change? I mean it's quickly, the disruption's positive. But they got to react, so a lot of the moving parts have to kind of, get tweaked. What do you see there for VCE? >> Well, and clearly you know, we have, on the SDN side, before I answer the VCE piece of it, you know we have two incredible assets. Right, we have the whole vShield, VXLAN capability, which you'd say, inside of the VMware environment was already well down the path of SDN, and now we have the Nicira assets, and NBP, and Open vSwitch, et cetera, so now, job one for us is bring those together as the most complete offering for the SDN space in the industry. You know we got two great teams. Bring those together, and unquestionably, we got the top talent in the world. So we got to make that happen, and then, we have to make that available for our partners to be able to then innovate with us, underneath us, and on top of us. We announced Sisco partnership yesterday, around how we're going to work together on that hardware, software boundary. And then with VCE, it's used them as the world class delivery vehicle for converged infrastructure, but now from the VMware role, it's hey guess what, you know HP just did a great integrated demo of their converged integrated. How are they going to participate with our SDN assets? And how do we enable them, how do we enable Dell, how do we enable the rest of the industry? >> And VCE now, how's that relationship, that's a separate company, but it's well funded and they've knocked down some good deployments. It's pretty solid, is it a high end offering? Is it more of, I mean how do you sort that out product wise? >> Well you know, VCE vBLock has always been a higher end offering, that's where UCS is positioned. It really is the premiere platform in in the industry. And we expect to continue to invest in that and partner with them, and VCE's doing well, hitting a billion dollar run weight, so we're happy with them. But as I'm quickly learning, I've got other great partners as well. >> So ecosystems obviously, are organic, they're ever changing. How do these acquisitions that you make change the balance of the ecosystem? >> Well everyone of them is aimed at, can we do it through partnership, or should we do it as an integrated offering? And that, where that line is, is never the same. Right, and we might make a decision that hey, it's better done in ecosystem today, and two years from now, hm, it's time to integrate into the core operating system of VMware, that's just the nature of how software and operating systems are built over time. Now that said, hey we're going to be an ecosystem friendly company, and even where we choose to integrate will always have OpenAPIs that enable industry innovation around us because there's more bright people outside of VMware than there are inside of VMware. So, and if we don't allow people to innovate with us, well yeah, they're going to go innovate somewhere else. >> Well, they have to move fast. You can't predict every innovation that's going to come down the road, and boom, something like Nicira was started in 2007, I mean-- >> You know, and I did a speech last year. I called it the Golden Triangle of Innovation. And there are are three primary pools of innovation. What we do organically, inside of an enterprise, like VMware, what happens in the university community, and what happens in the startup community. And we believe that we effectively have to participate in all three of those. Yeah we have our roots from Stanford and that community, and Nicira comes from Stanford and Berkeley, so clearly we see the university piece of it. We see the inorganic piece of acquisitions, and obviously organic, cool things we're that doing like VXLAN inside of the company. >> You've done a great job, I mean we can honestly say, we've been tracking you from the original interview, you did those things, and every year we ask you, we'll ask you at the end of this interview, what's your plan for the next 12 months? So congratulations on that. The question I want to ask you is, yesterday we heard abstract, pool, automate, which kind of is like code words for operating system. And you know you got to abstract away complexities, have resource management, and then automate and make all of that link and load together. >> You're pretty smart, that's good. >> (chuckles) I had to look that up this morning on Wikipedia, so that's cool, and you've also talked about your historical experience at Intel, cadence of Moore's law, so the question I want to ask you is, as you take over the helm at VMware, you have a different kind of OS cadence going on that's very rapid, as Joe Tucci pointed out. What's your Moore's Law for applications look like? Because now you have an enabling infrastructure in the VMware products and technologies as well as the ecosystem, and you've got to foster that enabling technology. So what is the cadence of the app market? >> Yeah, and you know first I'll say at the operating system level, with VMware, we say boy, we like this yearly cadence. And it's nice that it sort of matches with tick-tock model at Intel which I helped create. And sort of the major, minor releases of VMware are sort of in lock step with that. And you know, because what sets a cadence? Why shouldn't it be three or four years? What should be the right thing? And hey you know, we sort of set, we built on a firm foundation of SILICA, and we're going to align heavily on that. To me this tick-tock through through the stack, and then if I look to the next level of the stack, clearly you know, agile and sprints and so on, have allowed app development to occur, I'll say in a social, crowd sourced model in an effective way, but I think fundamentally, you got to say what is your foundation? And I'd say boy, you know a yearly major release cycle, I think there's good, solid technical foundations for that. And then making sure that you have an effective ability to continue to do continuous innovation. >> So Pat, for the last five or seven years, this industry obviously, has focused on doing more with less, operational efficiencies, obviously the conversion infrastructure trend. John talked about abstracting, automating, or pooling and automating, all those things really driving efficiencies, and you know the story with IT spending. It's flat, it's been down, but there's a thinking out there, with big data, and with new Flash architectures, that we can have major impacts on productivity. When John asked you at EMC World, what would you do if you were running VMworld, you answered, part of your answer was more tighter storage integration. I want to ask you specifically about a top down storage integration, in other words, bringing Flash, really managed from the server level, doing atomic writes, and driving new levels of productivity for organizations that go beyond just sort of cutting costs and better TCO. Can you talk about just the vision of, is that the right place to do it? In other words, controlling the metadata from fast servers versus slow storage? You know, it's an interesting transition from a storage company to now where you are as the head of VMware. >> Yeah, unquestionably, you know we have to do a better job at VMware of taking advantage of Flash on the server side, the performance capabilities of that, the IO gap that's opened up. In-memory data applications, but at the same time, we're seeing the polar extremes become more polar. The size of big data, will forever drive these larger and larger pools of scale out data on the one end, and now with in-memory and Flash technology on the server side, the things that you can do with extreme performance characteristics, at the server, at the application level, and VMware has to do a better job of making that available. And some of the things that Steve talked about with vFlash is an example of that. And we are going to do a lot better job of enabling those high performance, in-memory characteristic applications on this end, while an agent with larger and larger pools of shared storage on the other end. >> And embracing Hadoop you get one in further, you're going to bring big data analytic applications, and actually potentially feed those transaction applications that you're virtualizing in near real time, is that direction. >> Oh yeah, absolutely, but to me, the phenomenal thing is the extremes that are emerging here, where everything used to be just in a shared storage array, we're now sort of blown apart, right? Now we have high performance and memory on one end, and these massive scale platforms, and multi petabytes on the other end. It's pretty spectacular, and I said I essentially want to operate on both of them in essentially real time. >> What's interesting Pat, when we were at EMC World, I asked you can there be a red hat for Hadoop, and you said, you know, editorialized, you said you don't think it could be. We recently had that debate on SiliconANGLE and pretty much the crowd is weighing in that there is no red hat for Hadoop, mainly because just the market conditions are different. So just, I wanted to share that with you, and that we're going to continue to do that-- >> I'm glad they agree with me, I like that, so. >> You've made some good calls on big data. The question I want to ask you is though, is in the major presentation yesterday, you guys laid out the new experiences, and you talked about old way, new way. Access, it was access, app, and infrastructure, PC users, to mobile users, existing apps to new apps and big data, service to cloud. So I wanted to ask you about converged infrastructure. Because that's the old way, so a lot of the definitions around converged infrastructure has been defined as part of that old side, that side of the street that's old. Yet, in the new operating system future that we talk to everyone about, data's now a key kernel part of the design. So I want to ask you, data infrastructure, define what data infrastructure is as it relates to the new converged, if it's not replacing converged infrastructure, how has converged infrastructure changed from old to modern with data at the center of the value proposition? >> Yeah, you know, my EMC World keynote speech touched on this a little bit, this idea of data gravity. Where data gets bigger and bigger and heavier and heavier, and as the networks become agile, and VMs become mobile, things sort of move around that gravity well of the data. And I expect that to continue forward. So today, converged infrastructure, you'd say what's at the center of a vBLock? Right, you say well, sort of the UCS servers, because that's where the apps run. And I think increasingly in the future, the center of converged infrastructure's more around the storage infrastructure, because VMs are so mobile and light in comparison. But the idea of collapsing the boundaries between server, network and storage, I think is still a very fundamental concept. And when you go look inside of a Google data center, they don't quite think about it the same way. It's this array of infrastructure that is agilely available for their different applications. And I think that's fundamentally the right model. And a cloud scale version of converged infrastructure makes a lot of sense as well. >> And highly homogeneous, and many have observed, obviously, the advantage that Amazon and Google have. And you're clearly, the software defined data centers moving toward a homogeneous environment. >> Right, one common software layer across a set of services that are embodied in converged infrastructure hardware. >> And historically, homogeneous has meant you don't get best of breed. So how do you achieve best of breed? Is that through the ecosystem? Maybe, if you could elaborate on that a little bit. >> Well I think in this case, the scale operation characteristic swamp, the individual characteristics are best of breed in that sense. And they become enabled through this layer. But that hardware, software boundary is always a point of innovation. When virtualization of VMware first emerged, Mendel had this paranoia, we would rely on no hardware. We'll make it work on anything. And then over time, the hardware got better at doing things like page table mapping, memory breakthroughs, et cetera, for virtualization. All of a sudden, it's sort of like, oh the hardware's enabling better virtualization. You took advantage of it. And the same thing will emerge as you go think about converged infrastructure for networking and storage as well. The hardware will continue to evolve to better enable this virtualization layer of software and automation above it. >> We're starting at the hook, but you know we want to go, you got multi core, high megahertz clock speed right now, with Pat, we have a couple minutes left. I have two questions, one is around the future of virtualization, we're following, on SiliconANGLE.com, some of the new advances around large data centers that have commodity gear. So obviously, the usual suspects are Google, Facebook and whatnot, having a lot of commodity machines. And low level virtual machines is a really big trend now, looking at how to deploy VMwares at a programmatic layer. I don't know if you're following that. So I want you to comment on what you're following relative to some of the new trends around VMs. Obviously down to the low level, low level virtual machines and how they're playing up the stack, and then my final question after that would be, in the next 12 months, what's on your to do list? >> Yeah, well you know, I think you know, part of our task is sort of today, the leader in virtualization, is continue to leading the trends in that sense. Continuing to reduce the overhead of virtual machines, IO stack improvements, the Flash example that we gave before is a big piece of that. And continuing to enable better app affinity. You saw the Hadoop work, you know some of the big VM work around databases as well, and saying now how does, because in many ways, databases, VMs operate on, under provision hardware, and be able to over provision, and databases are over provisioning in memory for an under provisioned resource of the database, it's almost the inverse. So how do we address that? The Serengeti Hadoop work is another example of that. So there's lots of things to continue to innovate at the virtualization layer, both as you look down toward the hardware, as well as as you look up toward the application, and I think in that sense-- >> Is that where the software kind of tie in, that's why you're not seeing software-defining networking, more stuff with defined data centers? You have some ranges there, is that the part? >> Well that's a big piece of it yeah. Right, and you wanted all that to become policy based. Because you want essentially, what Steve likes to call the virtual data center to associate the policy of the application requirements as well as with the policy mechanisms of the underlying infrastructure. So that you know, the virtualization, the networking, the security elements, all of those become embodied in that as a set of services to the VM or this virtual data center. Next 12 months, obviously job one is make the transition smooth. Job two is get plan 13 in place, as the year concludes here. And then some of the key agendas of those we already talked about, operate on the SDN. We just made 1.3 billion, I better make a good use of that. Figure out our storage and security virtualization strategies, our management stack, and some of the horizon things today are really pretty thrilling for that next generation end user experience. >> Pat Gelsinger, always a blast on theCUBE, now as officially the CEO, great to have you on. >> Well actually I'm not official yet, T-minus three days now, September 1st, so I got-- >> Three days, okay September 1st. (chuckles) >> Well congratulations on the-- >> Pat Gelsinger. >> Thank you very much. >> CUBE alumni, great guy and tech athlete for sure. This is theCUBE, SiliconANGLE.com's flagship coverage of all the events extracting the signal from the noise. We'll be right back with our next guest after this short break.