>>live from Seattle, Washington. It's the key nude covering Smartsheet engaged 2019. Brought to you by smartsheet. >>Welcome back, everyone to the cubes. Live coverage of smartsheet engaged here in Seattle, Washington. I'm your host along with my co host, Jeff Rick. We're joined by Jean Farrell. He is the CPO of smartsheet. Thanks for coming on the show. >>Thanks for being here. >>Great to be here here last year and even bigger and better. You moved out of the hotel and convention center. That gets something. Did >>we did, We were. We have almost 4000 strong this year and we're super excited. We've been looking forward to this for a while. So >>So this is the third, the third annual conference yet. Just tell us a little bit. Let's let's open it up by telling our viewers a little bit about what this means to you, how big the show is. Give us a few stats. >>Yeah, well, you know, we ran our first customer conference, our first engaged really three years ago in in Bellevue at a conference center attached to a hotel that's right next to our headquarters, which is so super convenient, and I think we had 5 700 people there, and it was a great start andan. Last year we doubled in size and we actually outgrew the facility in Bellevue on. So when we planned for this year, we said, You know, let's go Big way felt this momentum building. We had such great feedback from customers what they learned and what they came away and could do after coming to engage that we felt we could. We were ready to kind of take it to a big stage. And so it was really exciting. I spent before joining Smartsheet two and half years ago. I spent five years that Amazon Web service is, and I was fortunate enough to be there when they did their first reinvent in Las Vegas, and it was roughly 5000 people, and I had a very interesting deja vu moment walking into the main auditorium here yesterday, Andi, it just brought back all the memories of Oh my gosh, this is like the size of remain so in three years we should be. Roughly 25,000 will be >>in Vegas >>today, up on the main stage. A lot of great new product announcements I want it, I want you to sort of break it down for our viewers. He started talking about how you really served three core customers and these new product announcements are really targeted. Each of these >>Yeah, we kind of broke it out. And what we find >>your way, sir? Customers of all sizes. So from startups, toe, medium sized businesses to large enterprise and within almost every one of those customers, we really see three distinct user groups really work force, which is at the core kind of where we started the I T teams, which many times there to support the workforce but also drive a lot of their own work clothes. And then the business decision makers. Folks that are really looking at, How do I drive overall organizational effectiveness and improve efficiency? And so what we tried to do was make sure we were delivering a set of capabilities for everybody on DSO for the workforce. We announced a bunch of new capabilities. Probably the highlight was our new conversations in context, which we're really excited about. It's gonna enable ah, whole new level of collaboration and engagement within the platform, and >>it was really >>grounded in customer feedback. That said they wanted the ability to actually interact in the context of their work and too many times what they were forced to do is they would have a question and they would have to go send an email or they go send a chat and then the response is disconnected. So it just wasn't as efficient. That could be. So we took that signal and work very closely with customers to design the new experience. So really excited about those those capabilities. We launched new forms, capabilities and multi select dropped down a lot of things that our customers are really excited around. From the workforce perspective on the I t front, we've introduced a ton of new things all year. The two big announcements today were around our accelerator for GDP are which it actually affects almost anybody that does business with an EU citizen. So a lot of folks don't really connect the dots ago. I'm in. You know, I'm in Redmond, Oregon. Why do I need to comply with GDP? Are well, if you sell the anybody in the you need to figure that out, um, and and then, um beyond GDP are. We talked about our federal offering on our new govcloud, which is really key for government agencies but also all the contractors to support government agencies. And so a lot of our customers are very interested in that. And then the final piece was really business leaders. Andi talked there about new enhancements to control center. Do it really let it scale and move across the organization roll ups, ability to do multi tier on then. Importantly, we talked about the new content collaboration capability, which is which is a really big it integrates are our slope technology. So marketing and other types of, uh, disciplines can use content collaboration in their work. I'd be remiss if I didn't mention 10,000 feet. >>So lots to talk about a lot. But you clearly, this is the customers, right? Because I think it was at the pasting. Widgets between Dashboard was a standing ovation. It's amazing the power of copy and paste when you can pull that work, you know, it's it's what the people want. It's funny you say that I am constantly >>amazed with that. The things that when you saw little problems that unlock all sorts of new use cases and many times that cheer you here is because customers have been trying to work around those problems, right? So multi select Drop Down is a great example where they had to do all sorts of gyrations in how they configure their work to support multiple selections. And so now we've made that much more elegant for them, and they're like, ecstatic because they no longer have to invest that time and >>I can't >>let you go. >>Wow, Is that all it took? I would sooner. It is a lot of times right, the simple things that have the huge, a huge improvement in kind of getting away from this repetitive work, which is under the theme we keep hearing over and over and over again. >>No, that's absolute. That's absolutely true. And it is really little things can have a big impact or Or or the analogy I sometimes will use is if you're creating a puzzle or if you have kids and you've ever built, you know, the X wing fighter set. If you're missing a few pieces, it's just not the same, right It just right. You can't kind of complete the work and so sometimes just completing that play for customers, giving them that that last piece they need to really go in power. Their workflow is is really cute. >>And I also think because we're living at a time where we have way demand so much from technology in our personal lives, and it delivers most for most. For the most part, our lives are pretty seamless and the way we can order things from anywhere. And so when we have, when we deal with these little aggravations at work, it's just that much more so. One of the things you said on the main stage is that customers are not shy about telling you what they want. So I want to hear from you how you solicit feedback and your process for making these changes for >>way actually, have >>we actually have a bunch of different mechanisms? We used to listen a customer, and I actually call it customer signal because it comes from a lot of different places. Way have kind of foundation. Aly we have a process actually called enhancement request. So many of our customers can go in our community and actually submit a form and say I really want you to build this Andi, That's very intentional, like there's no confusion, and usually they're very straightforward. But beyond that, we also we have the community in general. So we monitor that we get feedback on on kind of a freefall flowing forum where they give us feedback. We have user groups that this year will due north of 40 user groups around the world, where we bring collections of customers together, many time hosted at different customer locations, and customs will talk and share best practices and give us feedback on things that they'd like to see. I spend a ton of time out in the field with customers just visiting with them, talking about their use cases, helping themselves problems on and importantly, we have AH product advisory Council and a customer advisory board. And these air both specific groups of customer smaller groups that we've recruited and we actually use them tow, consult with us very closely to give us kind of overall direction. And then probably the most valuable feedback once we know where we want to go is once we start building, we have a private beta program, and then what we call an early adopter program. Both of those enroll customers in interacting with things were building before they're launched. And that gives us a chance to get real time feedback into what they like. What? They don't know what we need to improve. And sometimes the product will stay in in that private beta phase for longer than we expected, because the signal we get requires that we make changes. So we think that's really important to make sure we actually hit the mark. Because if you if you're on, if you're not satisfied, customer need or solving a problem, >>they're not gonna buy. What's the point? You're >>surely gonna get a lot of customers signal here at >>engaged over the next couple of Absolutely. And they're absolutely not shy. Every time I'm running some, it's like, Oh, we love this. And here's the 10 things I want that exactly. >>Thank you so much for coming on the Cubans. Pleasure having you >>my pleasure. Thanks for having me. And thanks for being here. It engaged. Thanks >>for having us. Great. >>I'm Rebecca Knight for Jeff. Rick, You are watching the cube. Stay tuned

(upbeat music) >> Live from Bellevue, Washington, it's The Cube! Covering Smartsheet ENGAGE 18. Brought to you by, Smartsheet. >> Welcome back to the Cube's continuing coverage of Smartsheet ENGAGED 2018, their second now annual event, our first one here. I'm Lisa Martin with Jeff Frick and Jeff and I are pleased to be joined right off the keynote stage, the SVP product Gene Farrell. Gene, welcome to the Cube! >> Well, thanks for having me. I'm thrilled to be here today. >> So, packed house, this event has doubled in size from your first one last year. It's about a couple thousand people here representing 1100 companies from 20 countries and you had a really cool interactive keynote this morning where you clearly showed very, I thought, organically how much Smartsheet is collaborating with your customers to drive the innovation of Smartsheet technology. Tell us a little about some of those enhancements and how you got the crowd to burst into applause at least three times. >> Well, I, thank you, I would tell you that Smartsheet, our whole product development process is driven by the customer. 95% of what we decided to build in our roadmap is grounded in customer feedback. And so, for us anytime we can engage with customers to learn not just what do they want, but what is the problem they're trying to solve. And that's really the art of great product management is going beyond just the suggestion to how are you going to use it? How does this help your business? Because, many times there's a better way to do it than what they come up with. And so, for us, coming to this ENGAGE conference, I think we announced over 20 new capabilities that are going to be available either now or in the next couple of months. And it was really easy to know we were going to get that applause because they pretty much told us what to build. So, we looked really smart but it's actually we're just listening. And so today we launched a number of great things like multi sign to, new automations, multi-step workflow, bunch of new connectors, a really cool dashboard widget for all sorts of web content. And we just can't wait to see how customers use it. >> It's pretty interesting when you're up there because we see this at a lot of little shows, when they're just getting started and, I'll still call you guys one of the little shows, where kind of the intimacy is so much tighter and really the knowledge sharing is very, very different than when you go to a big giant show that's got tens and tens of thousands of people. And you can feel that it was palatable, I thought that was pretty brave of Mark to walk out into the crowd and stick a microphone in somebody's face, the guy responded and he had an answer to the question of the way Smartsheet has helped him and I think he had two other people. But, what's really critical, we talked about automation a lot and processes a lot but it's the scale of the simple that becomes a big challenge and that's something that squarely right in your guys' roadmap. >> Well, it's definitely what we focus on and one of the things we have as a value as a company is being authentic. And for us, regardless of however big we get we know it's important to show up and be, you know, the best of who we are and engage with our customers in a real and authentic way and so, I think that really helps us have that connection and I hope when we're a billion dollar plus revenue company that we have that same feeling. And this conference hopefully will grow to tens of thousands but I think staying grounded in customers is just critically important. And I think how we differ from maybe some other folks in the technology space is we really focus on that every day user. How do we provide practical innovation that has the power they need without all the complexity that turns them off or scares them? And that's not, it's something that nobody else really focuses on and you hear a lot from technical companies about their powerful new innovation and these great breakthrough ideas but too many times it's engineers building for technically minded folks. And we've just chosen to go after a different group. >> I'm just curious how the people usually come into Smartsheet because, you know, the workflow space and, you know, there's just so many things out there that are all about the new way to work and you know, competing for my screen that I'm working on the majority of the time. So, I'm just curious where do people find you? How do they usually enter? 'Cause you got a pretty broad suite of applications and you integrate with a lot of different desktop tools so what's kind of that process do you see? >> I would say it's probably two primary ways. First is, we still have over a 100 thousand people every month that show up at our door and sign up for a free trial. Because they're looking for a better solution. They've been living hand to mouth with email and spreadsheets and they're just kind of overwhelmed by the velocity of work that's happening, the pace of change, and the old way isn't working for them anymore. And so, a big part of how people find Smartsheet is just they go out on the internet and say I'm looking for a better way to be more effective or I'm looking for a new way to manage a workflow or a project. The other way, and about 40% of our new customers that sign up for licenses come through our collaboration model. And it's actually kind of unique for us at Smartsheet. When you buy a Smartsheet license you are entitled to share your work with an unlimited number of collaborators both inside and outside your company. And those collaborators can view the work but also participate in the process. They can update sheets, they can provide input to the flow, and they actually get to engage and be part of that. And what we find is when people see the power of how other people manage and they participate they realize, hey, I want to use this for some of my work. >> So, it's not read-only? They can actually engage in my project that I've invited them to participate in? >> Absolutely, and the great they for you as the license owner is you never have to worry, hey, I want to share this with Sue. Does she have a license? Or do I have to go let her know ahead of time? You can share freely and not worry about people being able to participate. >> Well you have a big pipeline 'cause I was reading over the weekend that there's about 650,000 active individual users but about 3 million collaborators. >> Absolutely, yeah. >> Is that a differentiator for Smartsheet in terms of enabling that waterfall of demand generation? >> Well, we certainly think it's unique, right? There's lots of folks that kind of go down the free tier path. Where they say I'm going to give you all the capabilities in a free tier but I'm going to try and ratchet it down so you run into these pay walls at every turn where you then have to kind of license the organization wall to wall. And we just feel that doesn't really work for us. For us, we think it's important that anybody that's creating value in Smartsheet should have to pay for the value that they're using it to go create things with. But, the people that they enroll in that process, until they actually are creating their own stuff they should be able to participate for free. We think it really fits nicely with how modern work is evolving with a lot of teams and frankly a lot of teams across organizations. So, interesting fact is almost 40% of sharing in Smartsheet is with people that are outside of the company sharing. So, if you're sharing with all those folks in different companies and working across different organizations, trying to figure out who has what licenses and how to do things is just going to be a nightmare. So we want to make that just completely frictionless. >> So one of the things that is interesting about Smartsheet is that this is designed for the business user. You know, whether you're in sales, IT, finance, engineering, lot of different use cases you talked about kind of the breadth earlier, Jeff. Walk me through, if I'm at a large enterprise organization and I need to launch an omnichannel marketing campaign, but I use email, I use Slack, we got SalesForce, CRM. Maybe some of my, maybe I'm going to be collaborating with a different function that's using a competitive solution. How do you help me, I need to mange this campaign and I need to launch and I need to measure it. How do you help me connect my Slack, my teammates that aren't using it, that are on email. You're smiling big, walk us through that, what does that integration look like? >> Well, I think the first thing to remember is we really focus on the 60% of work that's unstructured and dynamic. So, this is the work that's constantly changing, and many times left to the business user to figure out how to get things done. And we recognize that in managing that unstructured work there are kind of different tools for different parts of the job, right? Just like if you go to any good mechanic's toolbox he's got more than just a hammer in there. And so for the business user they need messaging tools, like Slack or email to communicate. They create new content with document tools, whether it's G-Suite or O365. When they bridge the old world to the new world in the cloud they need file, sync, and share. People still have files, ironically, that sit on desktops and so they need to able to manage those in the cloud. None of those solutions is going to go away. You still need those for different things. Where we play is really helping people manage the what, when, and by whom. How do you actually execute the work? And today there's not a great platform to do that outside of Smartsheet. And so what we try do then is work seamlessly with all the tools that they're using today. So, to answer your question. If you're a Slack user, to get started with integrating Slack with Smartsheet it's as simple as from Slack, turning on the Smartsheet bot. That Smartsheet bot that enables you to receive signal directly from Smartsheet into Slack on update requests, notifications, approval requests that you can then action without ever leaving Slack. You can actually approve an invoice, you can update a Smartsheet directly from that Slack channel. It's the same type of integrations with file, sync, and share where you can attach documents from a Dropbox, or a Onedrive or a Box directly to a row or a sheet. And have a connection to the other work. >> So you're not driving the user back to do everything through the Smartsheet app, I can share things through Slack but I can also be right in Slack having a conversation with a teammate, >> Absolutely. >> And share everything through that directly. >> Absolutely. In fact, our integrations with our messaging platform, which is a core part of our strategy to kind of support how people work today in these modern platforms, really involves two types of integration. There's a channel integration. So, let's so you have a group of folks that are collaborating on some work, you've got a common sheet that you're using to actually manage the details of how you're going to get stuff done and then you have a Slack channel set up for them to engage, communicate, make decisions, collaborate. You can actually send signal directly from that sheet into the channel where everybody sees it in real time. >> What about mobile? >> Totally, works on mobile and on desktop. And then we actually have the bot, intelligent bot based integrations that are more personal. So, that's really your signal and the actions that you need to take. So, we're trying to really cover all bases and how teams want to engage with messaging. >> Just curious, as you've been rolling this out for a couple years, some of the crazier applications that you had no idea that people would use. This application for this type of use case, you can share us a funny, some great stories. >> There's certainly a broad array of use cases and there's a lot of times when you'll hear about a story and then you're like, well, yeah, I guess Smartsheet would be pretty good for that one. But, I would tell you, the ones that to me I get most excited about are the situations where the customer needs to do something really quickly because they're reacting to a signal or something that's happening in the market. And, so, one of the ones that I thought was really cool was actually last year's hurricanes, with Harvey and Irma. One of our large customers, Starbucks, actually used Smartsheet as a tool to connect with their teams and then manage the recovery. And, what they realized going in was they're team members are going to be on the ground in these areas that have been devastated by the hurricane. And they're not going to have internet connectivity, they're probably not going to have power, they got to reach them through mobile. And so they set up a really simple process where every morning they pushed a mobile form in Smartsheet to all of their crew members in those markets. And, the first thing they asked them was, are you okay, do you need help. And then once they knew that they were alright they then said, hey, are you available to work? Your store's going to be re-opening we want to know if you can work? And then with the managers they would poll on what's the state of the physical location and can we actually get open and start serving this community that's been devastated by this disaster? They literally came up with that idea and deployed in a couple of days. And they were getting, if you talk to their CEO, he would tell that he was getting reports every day on the status of who was available and how things were coming together. And then, the funny part of that is, they actually then were able to use that same Smartsheet mobile app to capture all the damage in store and my understanding was it was the first time they were actually able to get full recovery on insurance claims after an event like that. >> Oh, wow, alright. >> That's not really funny but a I really love that. >> Very impactful. >> But it's super important. But so we'll lighten it up a little bit before we let you go. In a prior life, your worked at Coca-Cola. >> I did. >> And you worked on the Freestyle. And for those who aren't familiar, Freestyle is the really cool vending machine when you go to McDonald's or Wendy's or whatever with all the push buttons. And what I find so interesting about Freestyle, it comes up at all the tech conferences. It was really a digital transformation of brown sugar water >> Absolutely. >> Into a phenomenal data stream that provided all types of transformational stories. I wonder if you can tell us a little bit about that story and add a little color 'cause I think it's just a fantastic example of digital transformation of something that probably most people didn't think was possible. >> Sure, oh no, I'd be happy to. It's one of my favorite stories to tell, actually. It was an amazing six year run for me and really what got me into wanting to be in product. I had spent the first half of my career at Coke really in Sales, Marketing and General Management. And, the Freestyle opportunity really came up because our engineering team at Coke had come up with an idea that was really designed to save money on the supply chain. They thought, let's take the water out of all these, the syrup that we ship all over the country and we can make a lot lighter and we'll save all this money. >> All kinds of benefits from not drying the water out. >> And our leadership looked at that and said, hey, we think there might be something more here. And so, the President of the Food Service division at the time invited me to come back to Atlanta and he showed me this prototype and he said, we're not really sure what this is going to be but we want to put a business leader on this to see if there's something here. He said, it can be three months or three years, you never know. So I uprooted my family from Seattle, moved back to Atlanta kind of a little bit on a whim. Like, we could've been over. And the funny thing is he said, there's lots of jobs in Atlanta. What he didn't say was there's lots of jobs at Coke in Atlanta. So, I'm not sure if he was trying to tell me something. But what was really fun about that was that Coke took a completely different approach. For a 125 year old company, completely different approach to innovation than what they traditionally would've done. Which would've been, hey, let's give it to the innovation group. Let's have senior meetings every three months to decide what to do next. >> Kick out new Coke and that didn't work out very well. >> Yeah, well, kick out new Coke. But what they did was they empowered a small team. I basically ran like a little startup. I reported to a board, I had no line reporting and we kept it totally confidential. We isolated the team away from the rest of the organization and we were allowed to just go run. And my board gave us everything we needed as far as resources and money. And we started with the consumer. And we said, hey, what is it that, if we could transform drinking soda away from home what would that look like? And what we found was people wanted a lot more variety than what they were getting at that time. Used to be six choices, right? Five of them brown, one of them caffeine-free, one of them diet, no caffeine-free diet, I mean it was just like we were missing the boat, right? If you went to a 7-11 there's 3,000 choices. You go to McDonald's, six. And so they wanted a lot more choice and they wanted to be able to pour the drink themselves. And so we thought that was a really powerful insight. What was interesting about that is they didn't trust the kid behind the counter to get it right. Which, I think is kind of ironic but at the end of the day, we invented the technology around this idea of providing almost unlimited choice and really rolling the consumer in the process of creation and it was amazing. When we delivered that to our end users we saw 50% increases in volume, remember this is a brand that's growing 2%, 3%. >> Super mature market. >> Yeah, super mature market, complete game changer. And it really unleashed this sense of creativity with consumers around what's possible, right, on the drink side. Now, on the business side, what was transformative for the company was that this was a completely wired experience. And it had had to be, frankly, to pull off delivering a 125 different choices in a restaurant. You got to arm that customer with lots of information about what do they need, how to configure, how to service. And so those machines were all connected. And they provided tons of great data on what consumption was happening inside the restaurant. But, also air logs on the equipment, how everything was performing and so it really led to a completely rethinking. How do you actually manage a network of connected devices? And it was kind of funny because we were really kind of pre-cloud. >> Pre-cloud, pre IoT. >> When we first started we had the machines called home every night using a wireless modem. We actually started, we did a contract with a IT service provider to provide servers to actually house the data. And we did this contract, oh these will hold you for three years. Within a month we were running out of server capacity because all of the data we were getting. And so it was really, it was super, super fun and we iterated that I spent six years on that and really it was one of the coolest experiences of my life. >> Probably one of the most relatable digital transformation stories and you guys are also doing that at Smartsheet. Gene, I wish we had more time. Thank you so much for stopping by the Cube and one of the things I like that you said in the beginning, and we'll leave it with this, is that Smartsheet is authentic. I think authenticity is contagious. So, thank you for your time. >> Well, thanks for having me, it's a pleasure. >> Thanks. >> And for Jeff Frick, I'm Lisa Martin. You're watching the Cube live from Smartsheet ENGAGE in Bellevue, Washington. Stick around, Jeff, and I'll be right back with our next guest. (upbeat music)

>> Narrator: Live from Las Vegas, it's the CUBE. Covering ServiceNow Knowledge 2018. Brought to you by ServiceNow. >> Welcome back everyone, day two of the CUBE's live coverage of ServiceNow Knowledge 18. Here at the Venetian in Las Vegas Nevada, I'm your host Rebecca Knight along with my cohost Dave Vellante. >> Dave: Still have my voice. >> You still have it yes okay well we'll see how you do tomorrow but you're still going strong. But I'm really excited about this panel we have Pharrel Howe she is a GM in IT service management, asset management, business management. Have I forgotten one? >> Nope. >> Rebecca: I got it all at ServiceNow. >> Dave: This week. >> Exactly, at ServiceNow. You run the biggest business for ServiceNow. >> Yes. >> Thanks for joining us Pharrel. >> Thank you so much for having me. I'm happy to be here. >> So I want to talk about employee experience which is really. It's just the cornerstone of this conference but really ServiceNow's purpose. Why has it become so increasingly important in IT today? >> Okay well in IT really you saw it today in CJ's keynote. The era of great experience is here and in IT we've been really really great at managing productivity and managing cost and making sure we were running efficiently and that we still do that and do it really well. But now we have to also make sure not just our customers have a great experience but our employees do too. And companies that do that well have the competitive advantage. It's absolutely required that we're able to do that now and so you know ServiceNow's paving the way for great experiences on our platform. For customers and employees and we're excited to be leading the next era of great experience. >> So I don't want to minimize the accomplishments that ServiceNow has made because they're phenomenal. >> Pharrel: Alright I'm happy for you not to minimize them. >> But I want to say this, you have thrived. I mean when Fred Luddy developed the platform. You thrived in the sea of mediocrity and you drove a ship through that sea and just mopped up a lot of business. Awesome, congratulations and in this world we live in it's like now it's becoming table stakes. If you guys have pointed out our home lives we live with these consumer interfaces we expect that now so as a leader of ServiceNow's a largest business. How do you continue to push the innovation levier? We expect now so much more, how do you continue to differentiate. Because your competition has woken up, the world was waking up. How do you stay ahead? >> Well you saw, you know earlier today CJ talking again and we're going to, you'll continue to see this theme from us. It is all about the platform. We are a platform company and when we build and innovate, acquire and then innovate. It is all within the platform and that I our competitive advantage. So then every application that was in existence today or that we build in the future can take advantage of that innovation natively. It's all integrated and seamless and there's nobody else out there who is able to do that and deliver those experiences. And so that is going to continue to be our strategy moving forward. >> So let's double click on that a little bit. Maybe get some examples. So clearly there's a big emphasis on UX and design. I think you guys have made some investments in design firms. >> Pharrel: Significant. >> There's machine intelligence I'll call it, AI. You're infusing AI throughout the platform and those are just two examples. >> Yeah. >> Maybe talk about those and give us some others if there are them. >> Sure well you know in the IT keynote that I'm going to have this afternoon. It's all about the era of great experiences and taking the roles that are in IT. It will be about the fulfiller, the requester, the planner and the operator in IT and how we've taken to the road and gone and done user research out with our customers and we're building great experiences in the platform for those roles. You no longer is it going to stand for you to just use your best judgment and go and build product and hope everybody will come. You've got to get out there side by side with your customers. Truly understand the work that they're doing and then build that back into the product and iterate again and again and again. And so that's the direction we're going from a design standpoint to build those experiences. >> So let's unpack this era of great experiences something that's simple, easy, intuitive but what are we really talking abut here. How do you define a great experience? >> Yeah well let's take it from something that we can relate to, we're all requesters of services one way or another right? And me as an employee I need services from IT in order to do my job. The thing is the channels that we have today are not enough. Phone and email aren't going to cut it and a lot of times if I'm in the carpool line waiting to pick up my daughter and her friends from school. I and you know I'm trying to check in on the ticket status for a laptop that I need immediately and I happen to think of it right then. I'm not going to call IT, I'm not in front of the laptop. I need more channels on more devices anytime anywhere at my convenience not someone else's. And so that's the kind of stuff that were talking about. We can't, it can't just be good enough anymore it has to be prolific. >> I'm interested in how you're using and applying machine intelligence. It seems like you're trying to anticipate my needs, put things in front of me that I might. You know I might shorten my search time or might be relevant that I hadn't even though of. Is that the right way to be thinking about how you're using machine intelligence and second part of the question is. What ar you finding that machines can do better than humans and how do they compliment each other? Srt of a long question. >> Sure I love this question. That's okay love it. Okay so our initial approach to agent and to machine intelligence, artificial intelligence. All of that is to you heard CJ say it today. You'll here micro-moments are moments that matter and we're looking to inject intelligence right there. Right there, those are very very practical use cases. They're not a panacea. They are not the answer but they are an answer in a moment that critically matters and so a perfect example of how that would play out would be my example previously of checking in on my laptop. The virtual agent that we're bringing to the market in our London release is all conversation based. And so I can very quickly see what topics that agent can handle and I can you know immediately engage on what that looks like and get the confidence that I need back and forth engaging with the virtual agent in m convenience wherever I am. Whether I'm at work or I'm at home and so you know that is a moment that matters for me because it's not, it eliminates the mental overhead for me to keep track of the administration of just trying to do my job everyday. Now take the flip side of that. The person who's on the other side of that virtual agent or would have been had that virtual agent not be there. They are not having to answer those kind of questions. Is my laptop coming please just assure me. They're not answering questions and so you know maybe that's not necessarily deflecting it an incident. It could be, but it's also reducing the administrivia that's happening when, and so it's cutting down the time it takes to resolve incidents and it's reducing friction and frustration. Between fulfillers and requesters of service ad so that's how we're looking at it. In those moments that matter and then as technology evolves and gets stronger. There may be bigger and larger use cases. >> And the machine verses human thing. I hate to say it that way but things the machines are doing. You're seeing categorization obviously is one at scale. Other things, I mean how do you see that evolving. What are the things that increasingly machine are going to do that humans can't do as well. >> Well I would say a use case besides maybe the virtual agent and those conversation based topics which really are just guided flows for conversation. Another thing might be being able to you know if there's just so much data that would take me a while. Or I would need a business analyst to maybe go and look for insights. That's something that machines can do and that's not replacing humans that's scaling our ability to act. And so that I think is the next foray to really move into and we'll start poking in different areas of insights as well and the moments that matter for work getting done in the enterprise as well. >> Because that is really what we're trying to do is help people get their work done. >> Pharrel: Yes. >> Quicker. >> Pharrel: And more easily. And when we talk about employee experience it's simply that. Please just let me get my work done and let me have some choice. I'm going to have a personal tool chain. Don't force me to use you know ServiceNow, please don't force me to use your messaging client. Our connect chat if I want to Microsoft Teams or Slack let me do that and let me keep that UI. So we're really when we talk about employee experiences it's a very broad arena there and its a great partnership between IT and all the other lines of business to deliver what employee experience is going to look like. >> And you know Rebecca, we talked about this yesterday. John Donahoe took on the machine replacing humans and was very transparent. The example I would use is search. When IDC we had a big library. We had like three or four librarians. They're not there anymore but nobody is saying oh wow. Search I mean search is a machine. It made our lives better, it created new opportunities. I think that's a good example, a small one but one where. I'm an optimist even though things are getting complex. >> Pharrel: Me too, absolutely an optimist on that and so for example with our virtual agent. Go do a search on LinkedIn and you will find for conversation designer. There are new jobs being created to be able to support this kind of technology. You know, jobs are evolving not going away. >> So speaking of jobs. You have been a very successful leader in a high growth organization. >> Thanks. >> I think on your Twitter it says I'm on a rocket ship ride of a lifetime. >> Pharrel: I am, I'm here to tell you. >> I'd love to hear what your advice is for other leaders who are trying to affect transformational change in their IT organizations. >> Alright I think whether it's personal change for yourself, you're trying to evolve or you need to evolve your organization. The first thing you need to do is check your assumptions. You know the older we get and the more we're barraged by noise we think we know. Make sure that you're really clear on and have some self reflection but also go and check that with people around you and get some clarity around alright is this really the reality. What's our reality that we're trying to transform? And when you're talking about transformation it doesn't necessarily happen overnight. It can happen overnight and that's called disruption but transformation that you are initiating. Give yourself a little bit of breathing room. You got to know that this is a marathon and you cannot be doing it at a sprint pace. You will burn out so keep your eye on the horizon and what you're trying to accomplish and just get started. Don't sit there and wait and try to have the perfect plan. You're going to attack your way through it, it's going to change anyway. Just get started. >> The rapid iteration we were hearing about that's so important. >> Yeah absolutely DevOps and you know personal digital transformation. You got it. >> I also want to talk to you about women. There is a dearth of women leaders in technology. You are one of them, what are you doing personally to promote diversity and inclusion at ServiceNow and then what is the company doing and finally what should the tech industry be doing to face this challenge head on? >> Yeah you know my take on it is, it's all about belonging and I got that word from Pat Waters. So diversity, inclusion and belonging. That's something that she's championing and we are so fortunate to have her as our chief talent officer. Prior to having that word I was just really focused on connection. You know really engaging just with people and trying to understand where they're coming from and really making sure that you're practicing active listening. That has been like the key for my success I will say throughout my career. Is just being able to constantly reflect back what I'm hearing. One to make sure I didn't put any filters on it obviously and then two people want to feel heard and so you know whenever I get into the conversation around women in tech. Yes there are some very real facts, fact based, data based challenges ahead of us but where I choose to put my focus is a much broader conversation that includes you know everyone. And really just focusing a lot more on connection and belonging over all makes a huge difference. >> What you're saying is really resonating because I mean that's what we keep hearing is happening but perpetuates the old boys club is that oh I know this guy because we went to college together. Or some other kind of biases that you hold that it's just oh he's like me. I want to promote him and bring him along and there are fewer women in positions of power who they can bring up the people that they see are like them. So I think that's another problem too is that you have to... >> Yeah that goes back to a really great HR practice which is you cannot just reach deep into your network every time you get in trouble. Rely on a great HR standard practice that says no you know we need to go out there and there's great talent out there that you just didn't even think of. So you know when you're going back to, we talked about transformation earlier in this conversation. Check your self awareness, be clear about wait a minute. Do I really know right now what I need. I'm not sure let me broaden my perspective here and HR's been a great partner to be able to do that. >> So that's a great point because gender and race and sexual preference are part of that diversity and certainly other factors. But like a financial advisor when the portfolio gets over balanced in one area he or she has to rebalance that portfolio. And again it sounds formulaic but I think Pharrel your point is what you're looking for is to open up that network to a wider audience. >> Absolutely. >> And not just the good old boys network. >> I have a little bit of a bias here, you know my background. I'm an English major and I'm running the large business for ServiceNow. >> We need to open the diversity to English, it's a liberal arts background. >> I don't want kids these days to think that if they pick one path they're stuck in that path and their locked into certain jobs. It's not true, you can you just need, it's the way that you think, it's having critical thinking skills. Now listen, you're not going to go put me on the platform although I probably could. Go in and start coding, you're not going to rely on me to do that right away. I can learn it but allowing us, allowing yourself to start to believe. That hey wait a minute, you know the labels that I've grown up with and put on people. Maybe I can remove a couple and I love it when I'm surprised and are able to bring an employee on my time that I'm like ah it doesn't necessarily make sense on the paper but look at you. You're amazing. >> Well one of the things that supports that is digital. For years if you were in the financial services business or the manufacturing business or the automotive business. You were there for life but if you have digital skills you can traverse now much more easily. >> Yes absolutely. >> Kids today just have phenomenal opportunities. >> I know, I know it's great. I think it's so cool and I love making. I love opening tech a bit more to make it more accessible. More appealing, that there are so many different roads to come in and it's important that we get people who think differently, creative you know people who are good strong communicators. Who can bring clarity to a situation. We need all of that and that to me is the first step for diversity. >> And because that's the stuff that robots aren't very good at. Is the empathy, the creativity, that kind of broad thinking. >> That's right. >> Awesome way to bring it home. >> Found full circle. Pharrel thanks so much for coming on the program. What a fun and enlightening conversation. >> Oh my gosh, super fun. I really appreciate it. >> And you're speaking today at 1:30, good luck with that. >> And by the way we have a diversity and inclusion belonging lunch with Pat Waters and CJ Desai which will be at I think 12:30 as well so. >> Great plug, excellent. Thank you so much again. I'm Rebecca Knight for Dave Vellante we will have more from ServiceNow Knowledge 18 hashtag know 18 just after this.

>> Hey Jeff Rick here with the cube. We're here in Palo Alto at the Chertoff event, its called security in the boardroom. We're talking about the security conversations that need to happen in the boardroom not just at the IT department and locking down your phone and your VPN. Its really how do we elevate the conversation, especially as things continue to change, digital transformation is forcing people to move quickly and everyone's becoming a digital company. All our assets are becoming digital. So it needs to get elevated. We're excited to have, our next guest, he's Paul Farrell, he's the CEO of Nehemiah. Paul welcome. >> Thank you. >> And joining us again, Jason Cook from the Chertoff Group. Good to see you again. >> Hi. Alright so lets jump into it, so you're CEO... Well before you get it, first tell people about Nehemiah, you are familiar with the company. >> Nehemiah has a cyber security suite where we know, manage and help protect organizations and the knowing part is what we're probably going to talk more about today which is our risk quantifier software. >> Well lets jump in what is risk quantifier software? >> We take a bottoms up look at the organization to get a high fidelity copy of the corporate network and then we layer business applications on top of it so boards can get a look at what the business exposure is to the cyber security risk. >> So the network and the application. So very techy piece of it, how much of it, in terms of the process and the people get filled into that piece as well. >> We call that process BIA or Business Impact Analysis and a lot of the Fortune 500 firms have already been doing this to be compliant with Sarbanes Oxley and other regulations. And its being able to work with them to take some of that information out of the system and combine it with the cyber information we have, to give them a good look at risk. So if I'm looking to invest $2 million dollars, what's my risk buy down. Is it 10 million? Is it two million? Is it nothing? I just need to do it. So these are some of the questions we're trying to help boards answer. >> I'm just curious, from a why do we need to do this point of view. How much of it is compliance and governance and regulation? And how much of it is not? Its just, we need to protect ourselves from the bad guys. I would imagine especially financial services and healthcare, a lot of it was driven by compliance before but is that percentage going down? >> Go ahead. >> So, no not at all. >> Not at all, still mainly governance, compliance regulation. >> And what you have to bring together now is security risk and compliance. Its all the one thing. And at the board level, you don't have those as separate agenda topics anymore and that's why we talk about a risk management program. Especially the Fortune 500 boards becoming very educated and also actioning and taking forward and that's really where that stuff comes together. Compliance, especially if you look at the finance industry, health care industry for example, its always going to be there cause its a duty of care as to the industry, how to run the business and to all of the consumers at the end of the day at the end of that. So you need a bit of (indistinct talking) and its a very useful tool, if you apply risk management to it, if you're applying security to it and bring those things together. Many CSOs will talk about situational awareness and one of things they need to do, if they've got a seat at the board table, is, what do I have, what's my assets? And that's no longer just purely from a technical perspective. You hear the phrase, many organizations have technology silos, that don't talk, that don't come together, perhaps different business units that are running those silos. And at the board level how do you ascertain what you've got when you have an issue and that situational awareness then, is also going to help drive, what parties do I take when I have to take action. So that's something that Nehemiah's security is really focusing on. So they're saying let us put together for you and work with you to assemble your silos of IT network and everything else there. Essentially underpinning your digital footprint as you go on that digital journey. But then how do you have actionable business intelligence that's going to help you prioritize how to run that, how to secure it but also how to invest and run your business through this journey. >> You're going to say summn? >> I think its the word that Jason used a lot is the journey and there's a lot of things we should be doing just because its cyber hygiene and its intelligence, is what we should do to run our business by taking the business information and marrying what we got up and then communicate it in language that the board knows. Which is key, don't be talking about WannaCry viruses and all that and SNB ports. That doesn't make any sense to them, they make business decisions every day, so its we're investing X and you take a risk profile overtime and you say, this will help reduce our exposure here, but its good and we need to do it. Whether compliance says it or not, we need to be protecting our data. That's one of the things that... Compliance is a checklist and we need to check, make sure that's done and everybody does audited financial statements and that's great, we should do it every year but there's somethings that are basic we should do basic stuff in finance, we should do basic stuff in cyber hygiene as well as updating our systems, keeping them current, educating our employees on scams and stuff that happen. These are things that need to happen over time and so its a journey for the board and for the senior management but for every employee, to be able to know these things and to actually integrate it as part of their everyday job, in my opinion. >> It sounds like the cyber hygiene stuff is still just not (laughs), we're not hygienic enough (laughs) as we should be. Its amazing that just continues to be a recurring thing. >> One of the ethos approaches that Nehemiah is taking to this is, they call it know. What do you know about your environment and it starts there. To say so, especially for an organization, as many are on a digital journey. Well what is underpinning all of our digital footprint. Do you know that? And unfortunately so many organizations out there have bits of it but they don't maintain that. So when you have, for example, the famous WannaCry incident, they kicked off very very large organizations as well as many small one were impacted. Why? Well cause they didn't actually understand what they had and they didn't have the business intelligence and the business analytics to make a prioritization to say, we need to invest our focus and time and effort here to respond to this activity from a hygiene perspective. And until those things are addressed, you're not actually going to truly be able to go on your digital journey as an organization. So if anything, what this is doing is heightening the awareness at the board level that you need to have an articulated dialogue, where at the board level you can understand the impact to the business of what's going on here but then take all of that and take all the knowledge that you're building to then drive actionable intelligence, business as well as technology coming together, which underpins risk management in that context. >> And I would imagine those types of incidents are helpful in terms of helping to define what is that risk. >> Tragically helpful. >> Yeah tragically helpful but still without those types of things its probably harder or harder to really monetize what is the risk so that I can come up with a portfolio that then I can validate my investment. >> Its about being prepared. Its about thinking about what are your critical business systems. And so when you got something happening, no matter what it is, lets make sure that critical business systems are protected first and then we'll get to the the less priority systems. Its not that they're not all important, its just that there're some that are more critical. Inventory systems or sales at the end of the quarter, it tends to be we find to be, not only the systems but also the time of the year. If you're selling seeds, March and April, North America is really big. If you're Amazon its Christmas time. The inventory system and order entry system has got to be going so but its taking that step back now and saying; what are our critical business systems, what are the risks and then, the only thing we also look at that we've talked to Jason about is, we know what the risks are but what's the probability those risks are going to hit you. Everybody's not a 100%, some people are 20%. So when you go to the board you got to give them a true idea of, this is the true risk that we're seeing and we've tempered it down by saying if it was a 100 million at risk but you only have a 20% chance of getting that exploit then its really just $20 million that we're talking about not 100 cause the days are gone where we slam our hand on the board that you must do this, you must do this. Boards are more cyber aware now than ever and they don't want to just pay people throw information at them they want to understand it to be able to respond properly and not react. >> Right. So really the Net Nat is speaking a language, boil it down into language in the decision making process in which they're use to doing. Cause its not a zero sum game, it not a one or zero anymore, its really a probability decision and the risk assessment. >> Yeah that happens over time. That's the whole thing. There's ebbs and flows of the year and you look at things over time and I think that's the other thing that we'd like to talk about. And its renassessing, and one of the things that we talk is, we talk with a lot of people and the chief information security officers are embracing us because they're looking for new ways to be able to communicate properly and succinctly to the boards and that's one of the big things that we see. >> Good cause when they get bumped up the agenda items on the board that's what you want to see right. (laughing) >> Absolutely. >> Well Paul and Jason thanks for stopping by really appreciate your time >> Thank you. >> I'm Jeff Rick you're watching the cube, we'll see you next time, thanks for watching.

>> Narrator: Live from Orlando, Florida, it's theCUBE covering ServiceNOW Knowledge17, brought to you by ServiceNOW. >> Dave: We're back, this is theCUBE, the leader in live tech coverage. We go out to the events and we extract the signal from the noise. I'm Dave Vellante with Jeff Frick. Farrell Hough is here she's the general manager of the service management business unit at ServiceNOW, great to see you. >> Farrell: Yes, great to see you, thanks for having me. >> Dave: Awesome, you're welcome. Awesome keynote this morning, you have your baby, which is ITSM, we know, but at the financial analyst meeting and you know, you represent today's keynote, you represented, you know, more than just ITSM, which is, you know, good. But let's start there, so, awesome keynote, lot of energy, so much meat (chuckles). >> Farrell: Yes. >> Dave: In Jakarta. >> Farrell: Absolutely. We have been busy, for sure, in our IT portfolio. In ITSM we really spent a lot of time and energy in giving back to our customer base and making sure that critical capabilities and features in ITSM, have a lot of depth behind them as well. So making sure service level management's solid, service catalog, which is 99% adopted across our customer base, servicing over half a million end users, that making sure that that's solid. And then additionally, making it really easy for new customers to join onto ITSM as well by giving out of the box best practices and a guided set up format like a wizard format that they can within just a couple of hours stand up a brand new incident management process prescribed by ServiceNOW and feel confident in what they're getting. >> Dave: Yeah, so I didn't realize the number was that high in terms of adoption of service catalog. What do you see for CMDB, I mean, when you first started following ServiceNOW it was mixed, 'cause it kind of gets political, but now, today, when you talk to customers it's like, oh yeah that's a big initiative of ours, or we're already there, or what do you see? >> Farrell: Absolutely. I don't have the exact percentage in front of me but I believe that it's upwards of 70% adoption in our customer base. And that is a difference from where we were in the past, for sure. >> Dave: Which is like the mainspring of innovation, 'cause once you get there, with service catalog and CMDB-- >> Farrell: Yep, you get all your assets in there, you get all your services defined, it's go time. >> Dave: Then your operating leverage is huge in terms of when you bring out new function and the impact on the organization, the business impact, can be really enormous. >> Farrell: Absolutely. >> Jeff: And best practice out of the box is a huge, huge coo, everyone we've talked to, you know, they're smart enough now to now customization is bad. Keep it to a minimum, keep it to a minimum, do config but not customizations, so that all those upgrades are easier, easier, easier. So to come out of the box with an integrated best practices workflow, great, great solutions for the customers to get up and running quickly. >> Farrell: It is, and you know, they're asking for prescription, and we're going to give it to them. We've got our own services arm, we have a partner community, we know between all of us in this huge ecosystem what's working and what's not, and we're going to put it in the product and make sure our customers, existing and new, get best practice out of the box. >> Dave: So, kind of three areas you talked about today: service management, we just touched on, we didn't talk about the surveys, but that's cool, that's a nice little feature you guys have added. >> Farrell: Oh yes, that's right. >> Dave: So, you have new and improved surveys. Operations managements, so that's ITOM piece right? >> Farrell: Yep. >> Dave: And then business management. So give us the high level on office management. >> Farrell: I will, yeah, sure. So we announced this year that we're putting out the cloud management platform, and the adoption of cloud is long past it's tipping point. We're seeing cloud being adopted everywhere and cloud resources are extremely easy to procure, stand up, and use, and IT may or may not know about it. And that becomes just a huge problem in terms of cost and even in terms of security and compliance and when we're able to-- we made an acquisition roughly a year ago, the ITOM team, and this is basically the next generation cloud management platform, where now you're able to have a cloud portal where a end user can go and consume and, just like a service catalog, they're going to have a service catalog of cloud services that you've already provisioned very easily with the drag and drop interface, that accounts for all your policy already in those services. And so it makes it very very easy for the business to continue to operate at the pace and the skill that they need to, but for IT to make sure that we have the consistency and the compliance that we need to protect the business overall and manage cost, all with a really great user experience at the same time. So we're thrilled to be able to put out a cloud management platform. And then the second major thing that came out in the IT operations management space was around service mapping. When we went to market with service mapping it was for all on prem services and mapping out what that looked like. This time around we're just bookending it and kind of closing the gap and saying okay, let's look at what's off prem, and let's look what's in the cloud. So you get a holistic view and are able to discover resources in the cloud and on prem as well and you get that holistic view of your services mapped going forward. >> Dave: So I have to ask you, so we're always asking, when ServiceNOW gets into HR, it's like oh does ServiceNOW compete with Workday, no. And when ServiceNOW gets into security, it's like does ServiceNOW compete with FireEyes, et cetera, no no. Now when you talk about this multi-cloud, sort of mapping visibility, there's a lot of talk about, we call it sometimes inter-clouding and inter-cloud management, how far to do you go into that, I mean, can I actually orchestrate across clouds? Is it just giving you visibility, well not just, but, how should I think about the positioning of ServiceNOW in that space of cloud management? >> Farrell: We're out there to create flexibility for customers and we'll start to make it happen that you can orchestrate across different clouds regardless of what they look like. We're not totally there yet, but that's the direction it's going. >> Dave: Well nobody's there. >> Farrell: Yep. >> Dave: This is jump all for the industry. And it's got to be a huge market, I mean, everybody's doing multi-clouds. In fact somebody told me, today David Flora told me in Europe there was a mandate in the banking sector that you have to have a second source for cloud. >> Jeff: Oh really? >> Dave: Yeah, I don't know the context, but good news for the cloud vendors, right? Good news for somebody-- >> Farrell: Exactly. >> Dave: --who manages that. So, okay, and now what about, are we done with ops-- >> Farrell: That was operations management, yep done with that. >> Dave: And then how about business management? >> Farrell: Alright, on the business management side, the big news if the software asset management. We're able to deliver another new product this year, and that's really going to put a lot of power back in the hands of IT. You're no longer caught on your heels with a software audit, realizing you're out of compliance. We struggle with visibility and understanding where are all these software assets, who are they allocated to, are they actually using them, how much is it costing us, and when we're able to have visualization to that because it's on the ServiceNOW platform and we understand where all those items exist, we're able to go in and very easily reclaim licenses, or reallocate them, and to me that's found money. And I just love that. I think that's going to be great, and guess what? You want to find your sourcing for your next IT project it's right there. >> Jeff: Right, right, and you're being humble. I mean that was the thing where the biggest roar came up from the crowd, without a doubt. Super, super well received. >> Dave: We were talking to CJ this morning about how it works and you get the platform, the platform comes out with all these features, and then the business units take advantage of those features. Now of course he described it differently, he said you start with the customer, and then you figure out what to put in the platform knowing that the business units are going to take advantage of it. But when you think about intelligent automation you gave an example of predictive maintenance today, so that's a use case for that so called AI or deep learning, machine learning. So talk about that a little bit. And then I want to get into the DX continuum piece as well. >> Farrell: Yeah, absolutely. When we're sitting on this data set that our customers have and they want us to take advantage of it for them, on their behalf, we're able to go back and apply algorithms to those data sets to say what's the norm? And did it have a good outcome? And all that data is in there, we're able to model it now, you're not having to go do that in some--export that into some other system to try to figure out, with some advanced analytics, what's that looking like, you're able to be able to say very clearly, listen, here's what the normal pattern of behavior is, and establish that for everything else going forward. So it becomes really clear where outliers exist and what suspect events or suspect alerts look like in your environment and then you can fire off a process to say look, this looks like a problem, and with certain signposts associated to it, go ahead and automatically open up that incident. You apply it to change management where you're talking about predictive maintenance. Something has enough failures automatically schedule a change window or decommission it, fail it over, back it out, move it out of the way, so that it's not causing a problem anymore. We put so much on humans to do for so long because the technology wasn't there to allow us to do it, well it's time, it's here now. And so we can take some of the burden away. >> Dave: I just had a thought, we talk in this industry so much about consumerization of IT and trying to mimic consumers, Fred Luddy talks about all the time. What you just described, I thought about an experience of an iPhone user, and anytime you do a migration, my wife just migrated from an android to an iPhone, what question was asked, is it backed up? What you just described is proactive. You're way beyond is it backed up, you're at the point of, we're going to just eliminate any possibility of a disruption. So I guess my question there is, is enterprise IT finally, not only catching up, but in some regards surpassing, this consumerization trend? >> Farrell: Hey, I think there's an opportunity to leapfrog, all the way, and I'm behind a 100%. I do, I think exactly that. And why not get way out ahead and over our skis with that and over-deliver and show that yep, we can see what's coming, we're sitting on all this data. When you choose to go to the cloud, and all that data is accessible, and you're on a single platform, it's all intermingled. You're not having to stitch together, create a data lake that's got all these different integrations pulling data and trying to sort it out from there with some data scientists or some business analysts looking at it, you're now able to lean in way more with your operation and really start to take care of it and truly own it. >> Jeff: I was just going to say my favorite part of your keynote today was kind of teeing off what you said, which is using machine learning and artificial intelligence on relatively simple looking processes that are painful, cumbersome, and horrible, like categorization, prioritization, assignment, to take the first swag, let the machine take the first swag at that stuff, and take that burden off the person because it's tedious, it's cumbersome, and it's painful, so it's this really elegant use of machine learning and AI, which is talked about all the time, on a relatively, again, simple looking activity, that just delivers tremendous value. >> Farrell: Yeah, I'm really really excited about that part because there's a lot of mystic and-- ah, I don't know what the right word is, maybe misunderstanding potentially, which can lead to mistrust of AI and machine learning and what's really going to come of it. And when we're able to say using supervised machine learning, which is the model that we're going after with the auto-classification, you can work with customers to be able to to let them tune the level of accuracy that they are comfortable with. And so you're building trust right away with a really simple example of auto-classification or auto-categorization, that is so frustrating for both parties. The person who is filing the incident, and the for the person who's going to be supporting and fulfilling on that incident as well. And I just love that fact that we can start to dip our toe into this pool and wade in and create trust along the way so we don't leave anyone behind or create mistrust in our user-base that we're just trying to get rid of them in some capacity or pull the wool over their eyes, we're not and we're going to be really transparent about in the way we do it and I think that's phenomenal. >> Jeff: And it's dynamic right, so it continues to learn. You have Spotify, you have a playlist, I like this, I don't like this, the playlist hopefully gets better, so. >> Farrell: That's right, because it took your input. >> Jeff: Correct, right. >> Farrell: And so taking input from the end users is going to then help train that system over time, that's correct. >> Dave: I got so many questions for you. (Jeff laughs) >> Farrell: Okay! Give 'em to me. >> Dave: So the auto-classification piece, that comes from the DX continuum acquisition-- >> Farrell: It does, yes. >> Dave: So explain that, I know you guys re-platformed everything, but what did that give you and let's get into auto-classification a little bit. >> Farrell: Okay, well it gave us some incredibly talented smart engineers and some really great intellectual property in terms of algorithms that we are able to now apply. When we re-platform something we're making sure that it works in the ServiceNOW platform stack and that it is going to be available and pervasive for every application that gets built on top of the platform. >> Dave: Okay so, you had said before, we're not just building a data lake, which, I want to talk to you about that too, 'cause a date lake as we know turns into a data swamp and it's just a mess and then you got to really do a lot of heavy lifting. >> Farrell: Smelly, don't like that. >> Dave: Right? Not good. So-- >> Jeff: Scary critters. >> Dave: You're auto-classifying at the point of creation I presume, or use of that data set. So how does that all work? How is it being applied? Where do you see customers getting value out of this? Explain that a little. >> Farrell: Well really I see in the ITSM side and the IT Space and in the ITSM side specifically, anything that you've got to apply a drop down field to, whether you're an end customer doing it through a service portal, or you're an IT worker, too, like let's help those guys out, why not? Anytime you need to fill out a field through a drop down mechanism, it's one discreet set of values, that's a candidate there. Now you want to have a large data set, which is why incidents, incident category, or assignment, assignment group, or what skill set might be required to work that particular incident, works because there's tons and tons and tons of incidents out there so we have lots of examples around what it could possibly be. And then that's what the data model would be built on. This auto-classification is not meant for the obscure or the random or the infrequent. So when we're talking about high volumes that a service desk sees, this is the perfect setup to apply it. >> Dave: So how will it work? I'll have a corpus of data with a bunch of incidents and I'll just sort of tell the machine go classify this? >> Dave: And it'll do some kind of process? >> Farrell: You're going to have a set of data a portion of the records you're going to use for the training model, the other portion you're going to leave behind, almost as the control group. And you're going to go apply the algorithms to that training set of data and it's going to start to learn and you're going to tell it what fields you want it to learn from and pay attention to and spit a model out on the other side on and it's going to crunch through all that data and it's going to give you a model on the other side, and you'll look at it and see if you agree, and then you're going to take that model and you'll apply it to that control set and you're going to look at what level of accuracy came out on the other side and you'll decide with that data set what accuracy level you want to have. For me, 70% accuracy will work for me on password reset. 'Cause, in all likelihood, what's it going to be? But maybe for a VPN issue I want 90%. You'll be able to start applying accuracy by category to then tune in exactly how you want things to work to make sure you get that good user experience. >> Dave: And then you'll continue to train that model and iterate. >> Farrell: Yes, absolutely. And you'll be able to train it and often as you like. I mean on demand, like yep, I want to train it again. And when you have a service desk worker who goes back in and re-categorizes, because yeah, that wasn't quite right, that's just the same thing as clicking the like button, thumbs up, thumbs down, on Spotify. You're right that you've just given it feedback. When you train it again, it takes that feedback into account. >> Dave: And then the subsequent incidents get auto-classified. >> Farrell: They get the learning. They get the learning. There's not magical learning that happens in this particular case, the technology's not evolved to that state, there's no unicorn back there that's doing all the learning for you. It takes feedback and it'll take some tuning, but hopefully in being able to make the feedback mechanism very easy, the tuning happens naturally, therefore the model gets better over time. >> Dave: Well it's a great use case because it's relatively narrow, and you have tons of data, and it can be implemented right away. >> Jeff: And like you said, even if it just helps you partially down the road, it's better than zero down the road, especially these repeatable processes that have to happen over and over and over, it's like oh please shoot me, this is the work that machines are supposed to do because it's mundane and repeatable and-- >> Farrell: Mind-numbing. >> Jeff: Mind-numbing, thank you. Let me get to solving the customer problem. >> Farrell: That's right. >> Dave: Okay so when we first encountered ServiceNOW we did our first Knowledge, it was from 2013, and it was at the height of the big data sort of hype-cycle. And so we would ask, of course we asked, well what about data, what about big data? The response was always well we got a lot of data and we're looking at that. But now we're here. And you mentioned earlier, it's not some data lake that you're processing as offloading your data warehouse, so what are you doing in that space? So it's not a data lake, it's a corpus of data and you're basically applying these AI and intelligent automation models to, can you explain a little bit about how that works? >> Farrell: Sure, well first off we won't do anything, we have to have our customer's permission to be able to use their data, they showed interest in machine learning services then they will give us permission to leverage their data and all customer data is separated too, within their own instance, within their own database, there's no co-mingling of data, so there will be no data lake whatsoever. But what we are able to do, and it's on a personal level, which I just love, because that's who we are as a company, that we're offering personalized supervised machine learning, personalized auto-classification, we're not taking all the data of all of our customers, kind of aggregating it up and then building models against that, and then saying oh I think this model would pertain to you and then it's only 25% accurate or even relevant. We're building a model very specific to you. And working with your data set and we have access to it, with your permission, and we'll go build that model, using the training set as we described, and then go test it out, and then help you go re-deploy it. So we'll pull that data into a central instance, help retrain it, and then move it back into your instance so that model is always constantly tuned and then you get to decide when you retrain it. >> Dave: So who's we in that example? You have a team of data scientists that do this? >> Farrell: This will be in our platform team. It's a platform service. You don't need data scientists to, I would say on the customer side, maybe if they were wanting to interpret some of that data or do something with it maybe they'd have a data scientist. This is just tried and true engineering and having a good service model behind it, it's just a central instance. >> Jeff: Do--I'm sorry, I interrupted. >> Farrell: No, I was just going to say through our acquisition DX Continuum, those engineers are building those training models and will keep them up to date, but they're not literally turning a crank when that data comes in and it'll be-- >> Dave: So it's a model that they apply, it scales, it's part of the service. Now you iterate that over time-- >> Farrell: That's right. >> Dave: But it's the-- >> Farrell: And you can build out other training models. So we just talked about auto-classification for instant, but this can extend in other areas as well. >> Jeff: Well I was going to say, do you think it's an opportunity for the ecosystem that has specialty expertise around, pick your favorite topic area, we're talking to someone about oil and gas earlier today, that they know what the model is way beyond just simple correlation to take in this and it flow and predict that, I think the example was that the well cap's going to break, or whatever. So do you see that potentially as an ecosystem contribution as well around more specific use cases? >> Farrell: Well I think that would be super cool. If we had customers of similar ilk, whatever that looked like, wanting to collaborate and share and crowdsource something for a greater good that wasn't competitive, I think that that would be amazing to be able to do that. And we would be able to facilitate it. We don't have any current plans to do that right now but I could absolutely see it. >> Dave: Well we've talked about the ecosystem through for years, to see it just burgeoning and awesome story. Thank you for coming on theCUBE and doing a brain dump on us and educating us. >> Farrell: Yeah, thank you so much-- >> Jeff: You really had a great opening line, "exciting time to be in IT," that was your opening line, the key night, I know you've got the excitement >> Farrell: It is! This is the best time to be in IT. I mean oh my gosh, it's fabulous. >> Dave: You're exploding. Alright Farrell, thanks very much. >> Farrell: Alright, thank you. >> Dave: Alright, keep it right there buddy, we'll be back with our next guest, theCUBE, we're live from Orlando, be right back. (techno music)

>>Well, welcome back to the cubes coverage of AWS reinvent 2021. We're here joined by Ian buck, general manager and vice president of accelerated computing at Nvidia I'm. John Ford, your host of the QB. And thanks for coming on. So in video, obviously, great brand congratulates on all your continued success. Everyone who has does anything in graphics knows the GPU's are hot and you guys get great brand great success in the company, but AI and machine learning was seeing the trend significantly being powered by the GPU's and other systems. So it's a key part of everything. So what's the trends that you're seeing, uh, in ML and AI, that's accelerating computing to the cloud. Yeah, >>I mean, AI is kind of drape bragging breakthroughs innovations across so many segments, so many different use cases. We see it showing up with things like credit card, fraud prevention and product and content recommendations. Really it's the new engine behind search engines is AI. Uh, people are applying AI to things like, um, meeting transcriptions, uh, virtual calls like this using AI to actually capture what was said. Um, and that gets applied in person to person interactions. We also see it in intelligence systems assistance for a contact center, automation or chat bots, uh, medical imaging, um, and intelligence stores and warehouses and everywhere. It's really, it's really amazing what AI has been demonstrated, what it can do. And, uh, it's new use cases are showing up all the time. >>Yeah. I'd love to get your thoughts on, on how the world's evolved just in the past few years, along with cloud, and certainly the pandemics proven it. You had this whole kind of full stack mindset initially, and now you're seeing more of a horizontal scale, but yet enabling this vertical specialization in applications. I mean, you mentioned some of those apps, the new enablers, this kind of the horizontal play with enablement for specialization, with data, this is a huge shift that's going on. It's been happening. What's your reaction to that? >>Yeah, it's the innovations on two fronts. There's a horizontal front, which is basically the different kinds of neural networks or AIS as well as machine learning techniques that are, um, just being invented by researchers for, uh, and the community at large, including Amazon. Um, you know, it started with these convolutional neural networks, which are great for image processing, but as it expanded more recently into, uh, recurrent neural networks, transformer models, which are great for language and language and understanding, and then the new hot topic graph neural networks, where the actual graph now is trained as a, as a neural network, you have this underpinning of great AI technologies that are being adventure around the world in videos role is try to productize that and provide a platform for people to do that innovation and then take the next step and innovate vertically. Um, take it, take it and apply it to two particular field, um, like medical, like healthcare and medical imaging applying AI, so that radiologists can have an AI assistant with them and highlight different parts of the scan. >>Then maybe troublesome worrying, or requires more investigation, um, using it for robotics, building virtual worlds, where robots can be trained in a virtual environment, their AI being constantly trained, reinforced, and learn how to do certain activities and techniques. So that the first time it's ever downloaded into a real robot, it works right out of the box, um, to do, to activate that we co we are creating different vertical solutions, vertical stacks for products that talk the languages of those businesses, of those users, uh, in medical imaging, it's processing medical data, which is obviously a very complicated large format data, often three-dimensional boxes in robotics. It's building combining both our graphics and simulation technologies, along with the, you know, the AI training capabilities and different capabilities in order to run in real time. Those are, >>Yeah. I mean, it's just so cutting edge. It's so relevant. I mean, I think one of the things you mentioned about the neural networks, specifically, the graph neural networks, I mean, we saw, I mean, just to go back to the late two thousands, you know, how unstructured data or object store created, a lot of people realize that the value out of that now you've got graph graph value, you got graph network effect, you've got all kinds of new patterns. You guys have this notion of graph neural networks. Um, that's, that's, that's out there. What is, what is a graph neural network and what does it actually mean for deep learning and an AI perspective? >>Yeah, we have a graph is exactly what it sounds like. You have points that are connected to each other, that established relationships and the example of amazon.com. You might have buyers, distributors, sellers, um, and all of them are buying or recommending or selling different products. And they're represented in a graph if I buy something from you and from you, I'm connected to those end points and likewise more deeply across a supply chain or warehouse or other buyers and sellers across the network. What's new right now is that those connections now can be treated and trained like a neural network, understanding the relationship. How strong is that connection between that buyer and seller or that distributor and supplier, and then build up a network that figure out and understand patterns across them. For example, what products I may like. Cause I have this connection in my graph, what other products may meet those requirements, or also identifying things like fraud when, when patterns and buying patterns don't match, what a graph neural networks should say would be the typical kind of graph connectivity, the different kind of weights and connections between the two captured by the frequency half I buy things or how I rate them or give them stars as she used cases, uh, this application graph neural networks, which is basically capturing the connections of all things with all people, especially in the world of e-commerce, it's very exciting to a new application, but applying AI to optimizing business, to reducing fraud and letting us, you know, get access to the products that we want, the products that they have, our recommendations be things that, that excited us and want us to buy things >>Great setup for the real conversation that's going on here at re-invent, which is new kinds of workloads are changing. The game. People are refactoring their business with not just replatform, but actually using this to identify value and see cloud scale allows you to have the compute power to, you know, look at a note on an arc and actually code that. It's all, it's all science, all computer science, all at scale. So with that, that brings up the whole AWS relationship. Can you tell us how you're working with AWS before? >>Yeah. 80 of us has been a great partner and one of the first cloud providers to ever provide GPS the cloud, uh, we most more recently we've announced two new instances, uh, the instance, which is based on the RA 10 G GPU, which has it was supports the Nvidia RTX technology or rendering technology, uh, for real-time Ray tracing and graphics and game streaming is their highest performance graphics, enhanced replicate without allows for those high performance graphics applications to be directly hosted in the cloud. And of course runs everything else as well, including our AI has access to our AI technology runs all of our AI stacks. We also announced with AWS, the G 5g instance, this is exciting because it's the first, uh, graviton or ARM-based processor connected to a GPU and successful in the cloud. Um, this makes, uh, the focus here is Android gaming and machine learning and France. And we're excited to see the advancements that Amazon is making and AWS is making with arm and the cloud. And we're glad to be part of that journey. >>Well, congratulations. I remember I was just watching my interview with James Hamilton from AWS 2013 and 2014. He was getting, he was teasing this out, that they're going to build their own, get in there and build their own connections, take that latency down and do other things. This is kind of the harvest of all that. As you start looking at these new new interfaces and the new servers, new technology that you guys are doing, you're enabling applications. What does, what do you see this enabling as this, as this new capability comes out, new speed, more, more performance, but also now it's enabling more capabilities so that new workloads can be realized. What would you say to folks who want to ask that question? >>Well, so first off I think arm is here to stay and you can see the growth and explosion of my arm, uh, led of course, by grab a tiny to be. I spend many others, uh, and by bringing all of NVIDIA's rendering graphics, machine learning and AI technologies to arm, we can help bring that innovation. That arm allows that open innovation because there's an open architecture to the entire ecosystem. Uh, we can help bring it forward, uh, to the state of the art in AI machine learning, the graphics. Um, we all have our software that we released is both supportive, both on x86 and an army equally, um, and including all of our AI stacks. So most notably for inference the deployment of AI models. We have our, the Nvidia Triton inference server. Uh, this is the, our inference serving software where after he was trained to model, he wanted to play it at scale on any CPU or GPU instance, um, for that matter. So we support both CPS and GPS with Triton. Um, it's natively integrated with SageMaker and provides the benefit of all those performance optimizations all the time. Uh, things like, uh, features like dynamic batching. It supports all the different AI frameworks from PI torch to TensorFlow, even a generalized Python code. Um, we're activating how activating the arm ecosystem as well as bringing all those AI new AI use cases and all those different performance levels, uh, with our partnership with AWS and all the different clouds. >>And you got to making it really easy for people to use, use the technology that brings up the next kind of question I want to ask you. I mean, a lot of people are really going in jumping in the big time into this. They're adopting AI. Either they're moving in from prototype to production. There's always some gaps, whether it's knowledge, skills, gaps, or whatever, but people are accelerating into the AI and leaning into it hard. What advancements have is Nvidia made to make it more accessible, um, for people to move faster through the, through the system, through the process? >>Yeah, it's one of the biggest challenges. The other promise of AI, all the publications that are coming all the way research now, how can you make it more accessible or easier to use by more people rather than just being an AI researcher, which is, uh, uh, obviously a very challenging and interesting field, but not one that's directly in the business. Nvidia is trying to write a full stack approach to AI. So as we make, uh, discover or see these AI technologies come available, we produce SDKs to help activate them or connect them with developers around the world. Uh, we have over 150 different STKs at this point, certain industries from gaming to design, to life sciences, to earth scientist. We even have stuff to help simulate quantum computing. Um, and of course all the, all the work we're doing with AI, 5g and robotics. So, uh, we actually just introduced about 65 new updates just this past month on all those SDKs. Uh, some of the newer stuff that's really exciting is the large language models. Uh, people are building some amazing AI. That's capable of understanding the Corpus of like human understanding, these language models that are trained on literally the continent of the internet to provide general purpose or open domain chatbots. So the customer is going to have a new kind of experience with a computer or the cloud. Uh, we're offering large language, uh, those large language models, as well as AI frameworks to help companies take advantage of this new kind of technology. >>You know, each and every time I do an interview with Nvidia or talk about Nvidia my kids and their friends, they first thing they said, you get me a good graphics card. Hey, I want the best thing in their rig. Obviously the gaming market's hot and known for that, but I mean, but there's a huge software team behind Nvidia. This is a well-known your CEO is always talking about on his keynotes, you're in the software business. And then you had, do have hardware. You were integrating with graviton and other things. So, but it's a software practices, software. This is all about software. Could you share kind of more about how Nvidia culture and their cloud culture and specifically around the scale? I mean, you, you hit every, every use case. So what's the software culture there at Nvidia, >>And it is actually a bigger, we have more software people than hardware people, people don't often realize this. Uh, and in fact that it's because of we create, uh, the, the, it just starts with the chip, obviously building great Silicon is necessary to provide that level of innovation, but as it expanded dramatically from then, from there, uh, not just the Silicon and the GPU, but the server designs themselves, we actually do entire server designs ourselves to help build out this infrastructure. We consume it and use it ourselves and build our own supercomputers to use AI, to improve our products. And then all that software that we build on top, we make it available. As I mentioned before, uh, as containers on our, uh, NGC container store container registry, which is accessible for me to bus, um, to connect to those vertical markets, instead of just opening up the hardware and none of the ecosystem in develop on it, they can with a low-level and programmatic stacks that we provide with Kuda. We believe that those vertical stacks are the ways we can help accelerate and advance AI. And that's why we make as well, >>Ram a little software is so much easier. I want to get that plug for, I think it's worth noting that you guys are, are heavy hardcore, especially on the AI side. And it's worth calling out, uh, getting back to the customers who are bridging that gap and getting out there, what are the metrics they should consider as they're deploying AI? What are success metrics? What does success look like? Can you share any insight into what they should be thinking about and looking at how they're doing? >>Yeah. Um, for training, it's all about time to solution. Um, it's not the hardware that that's the cost, it's the opportunity that AI can provide your business and many, and the productivity of those data scientists, which are developing, which are not easy to come by. So, uh, what we hear from customers is they need a fast time to solution to allow people to prototype very quickly, to train a model to convergence, to get into production quickly, and of course, move on to the next or continue to refine it often. So in training is time to solution for inference. It's about our, your ability to deploy at scale. Often people need to have real time requirements. They want to run in a certain amount of latency, a certain amount of time. And typically most companies don't have a single AI model. They have a collection of them. They want, they want to run for a single service or across multiple services. That's where you can aggregate some of your infrastructure leveraging the trading infant server. I mentioned before can actually run multiple models on a single GPU saving costs, optimizing for efficiency yet still meeting the requirements for latency and the real time experience so that your customers have a good, a good interaction with the AI. >>Awesome. Great. Let's get into, uh, the customer examples. You guys have obviously great customers. Can you share some of the use cases, examples with customers, notable customers? >>Yeah. I want one great part about working in videos as a technology company. You see, you get to engage with such amazing customers across many verticals. Uh, some of the ones that are pretty exciting right now, Netflix is using the G4 instances to CLA um, to do a video effects and animation content. And, you know, from anywhere in the world, in the cloud, uh, as a cloud creation content platform, uh, we work in the energy field that Siemens energy is actually using AI combined with, um, uh, simulation to do predictive maintenance on their energy plants, um, and, and, uh, doing preventing or optimizing onsite inspection activities and eliminating downtime, which is saving a lot of money for the engine industry. Uh, we have worked with Oxford university, uh, which is Oxford university actually has over two, over 20 million artifacts and specimens and collections across its gardens and museums and libraries. They're actually using convenient GPS and Amazon to do enhance image recognition, to classify all these things, which would take literally years with, um, uh, going through manually each of these artifacts using AI, we can click and quickly catalog all of them and connect them with their users. Um, great stories across graphics, about cross industries across research that, uh, it's just so exciting to see what people are doing with our technology together with, >>And thank you so much for coming on the cube. I really appreciate Greg, a lot of great content there. We probably going to go another hour, all the great stuff going on in the video, any closing remarks you want to share as we wrap this last minute up >>Now, the, um, really what Nvidia is about as accelerating cloud computing, whether it be AI, machine learning, graphics, or headphones, community simulation, and AWS was one of the first with this in the beginning, and they continue to bring out great instances to help connect, uh, the cloud and accelerated computing with all the different opportunities integrations with with SageMaker really Ks and ECS. Uh, the new instances with G five and G 5g, very excited to see all the work that we're doing together. >>Ian buck, general manager, and vice president of accelerated computing. I mean, how can you not love that title? We want more, more power, more faster, come on. More computing. No, one's going to complain with more computing know, thanks for coming on. Thank you. Appreciate it. I'm John Farrell hosted the cube. You're watching Amazon coverage reinvent 2021. Thanks for watching.

(light, upbeat music) >> The last decade of cloud computing introduced and popularized an operating model that emphasized, simplified IT infrastructure provisioning and management. As well, it ushered in an era of consumption-based pricing and much more facile IT management, generally. Now these principles, they've bled into traditional data centers, which have increasingly become software led, programmable and DevOps centric. Now as we enter the post isolation era, it's ironic that not only are IT executives pursuing hybrid strategies, but everyone is talking about hybrid. Hybrid work, hybrid teams, hybrid events, hybrid meetings. The world has gone hybrid and the cloud is no exception. The cloud is expanding. Public cloud models are pushing to the data center and the edge on premises infrastructure is connecting to public clouds and managing data workflows and infrastructure across clouds and out to the edge. Now most leading technology executives that I speak with, they're essentially architecting their own clouds. And what I mean by that is they're envisioning and building an abstraction layer that hides the complexity of the underlying infrastructure and manages workloads intelligently. The end customer doesn't know or care where the data is, as long as it's secure, properly governed, and could be accessed quickly, all irrespective of physical location. Now for the most part, this vision, it can't be bought off the shelf. It needs to be built by placing bets on key technology partners and leveraging the so-called API economy. In other words, picking technology vendors that I trust in programmatically codifying and automating where possible my organizational edicts and business requirements into my own cloud to uniquely support my application portfolio in my modern business processes, which by the way, are rapidly evolving. Now, a key to enabling this vision is optionality. Meaning, not getting locked into one single technology platform, but rather having the confidence that as technology evolves, which it always does, I can focus my energies on adding value to my business through process innovation and human capital growth. Hello, everyone and welcome to this cube conversation and video exclusive on a major new industry development and partnership that's designed to maximize customer infrastructure options and move the new era of hybrid cloud computing forward. We have two industry leaders joining us today. Monica Kumar is the senior vice president of marketing and cloud go-to-market from Nutanix, and David Farrell is the senior vice president and general manager for global strategic alliances at Red Hat. Folks, welcome to theCUBE. Thanks for coming on. >> Good to be here today. >> Thank you so much. >> All right, so Red Hat is the poster child for open source success and it's executing on a strategy based on Red Hat Enterprise Linux, RHEL and OpenShift, the industry's leading container platform, to drive cloud-like experiences. Nutanix is a pioneering company and was the first to truly envision and successfully bring to market a cloud operating model to data center infrastructure. So you two, are getting together and forming a deeper, more substantive relationship. So Monica, tell us about the hard news. What's the scoop? >> Yeah, of course. So, first of all, I'm so excited to be here with David Farrell from Red Hat and for those of you who may not know this, I have a very deep personal connection with Red Hat from my previous role as well. I've been working with Red Hat since the early 2000s. So it gives me great pleasure to be here on behalf of Nutanix and with David from Red Hat, to be announcing a formal strategic partnership to deliver open hybrid multi-cloud solutions. Now let me explain to you what I mean by that. This partnership that we're announcing today is going to enable best-in-class solutions for building, scaling and managing containerized and virtualized cloud native applications in of course, hyper-converged infrastructure environments. So the collaboration is going to bring together these industry-leading technologies. Enabling and integrating Red Hat OpenShift and Red Hat Enterprise Linux, onto the Nutanix cloud platform, which includes, you know, our well-known Nutanix AOS and AHV hypervisor technologies. Now the question is, why are we doing all this? It's because of, as you said, Dave, the rapid evolution of hybrid cloud strategies and adoption of containers and Kubernetes in our customer base to develop, deploy and manage apps. And what we're hearing from our customers is that they want this integration between Red Hat Technologies and Nutanix Solutions. >> Okay. Thank you, Monica. So big news David, from Red Hat's perspective. Okay. So Red Hat, Nutanix, both leaders in their respective fields. David, what spurred the decision to partner from your standpoint? >> Yeah. And listen, let me echo Monica's comments as well. So we're really excited about the partnership with Nutanix. And we're excited because Nutanix is the leader in hybrid cloud infrastructure, but we're even more excited because this is what customers have been asking us to do. And that's really at the core of the decision. I think both teams, both companies have been listening to customers and we've got a groundswell of enterprise customers around the world that are asking us to come together. Bring our technologies together from a certification perspective, which Monica spoke about, right, is number one. So RHEL and OpenShift being certified on top of AHV, right. To provide the best-in-class service for enterprise grade applications, but there's more to it than just the certification. Like customers are looking for a world-class integrated support experience as well as they go into, into production. So we also have integrated support, right. So customers can contact Nutanix, they can contact Red Hat and having that seamless, that seamless experience is really, really critical and something that our customers have been asking us for. And then we'll continue to work from a roadmap perspective as well, from an engineering perspective, to make sure that our roadmaps are aligned and the customers have assurance over time and continuity over time so that they can make investments that they know are going to pay off and be safe investments and scalable investments over the long arc of their technology horizon, so. So those are, those are kind of our view of why this is good for customers and back to your points, David, it's about choice and optionality, right? And choice and consistency, and I think the verdict is in now, in the industry, that hybrid is the future, right? Everybody kind of agrees on that, right? In certain applications and certain workloads are going to run on-prem, others are going to run on the public cloud, and customers need choice to be able to decide what's the right destination for those workloads. And that's what Red Hat's all about, that's what RHEL's all about, what OpenShift is all about, is that it runs on any cloud infrastructure. Now it runs on Nutanix HCI. >> So I liked that two, one virtual throat to choke, or maybe better put, maybe one virtual hand to shake. So David staying with you, maybe you could talk about some of the other key terms of the partnership. Maybe focus on joint solutions that the customers can expect and I'm particularly interested in the engineering collaboration. I know there's a go-to-market component, but the engineering collaboration and technology innovation that we can expect. >> Yeah. So there's a few components to it, David. One is, obviously as I talked about roadmap, right. And that's, you know, our technology teams coming together, looking at the existing roadmaps for RHEL and OpenShift, but also adjacent capabilities that are coming from the Red Hat portfolio and capabilities that are coming from our ISV ecosystems and our respective ecosystems. This is a big win for our partners, as well, that have been asking us to work together. So we'll continue to keep the radar up about what some of those functionalities and capabilities ought to be. Whether we make them or somebody else makes them to pull into the, pull into the strategy, if you will. The second big principle around joint engineering is going to be around customer experience, right. So for example, we're starting off with the agnostic installer and by the way, this is coming Thursday, right? I think we're live on Thursday, the 29th, right? So this is in market, it is GA, it's available today, the 29th, right. And then we will move to the, to the UPI- so sorry, to the IPI installer in the second half of this year, right. To provide a more automated experience and then I think on the Nutanix side, Monica can, can talk to this, that Nutanix is building APIs to also automate installation, right? So first and foremost, we're all about getting the solution and getting the jointly engineered technologies working together and providing a superior customer experience for our customers that are deploying Red Hat on top of Nutanix. And that's going to be the guiding, the guiding driver, if you will, for how we work together. >> Yeah. And let me add to that. Like you said, we are, the engineering is already bearing fruit for our customers, right. As of today, when we announcing, we already have certified versions of Red Hat Linux with AHV, number one. Number two, as you said, the agnostic installer is available. We will make the automated installer available so any customer can deploy OpenShift using the Nutanix cloud platform in the very near future, right. Those are the two sort of the beginnings of the engineering and this is going to, this is a longterm partnership, so we will continue to evolve the different configurations that we, you know, that we test and that we validate as well as we go on. So I'm really excited about the fact that we are going to be offering customers fully tested, validated configurations to deploy. (cross talk) >> Go ahead >> David if I may just in there as well, I mean, so that's on the engineering side, right. But there'll also be an important thing, customers expect us to cooperate in to engage proactively as we face them, right. So that both the Red Hat, part of the agreement is that both the Red Hat and the Nutanix field teams, right the customer teams, will also be enabled, right. We'll do technical enablement for our teams, stand up proof of technologies, right. So that we're burning in some of the technology, if you will, and working out the kinks before the customer has to, right. And this is also a key value proposition is we're doing this work upstream, both in the engineering teams and in the field engagement teams so that customers can get time to market, if you will, and speed of solution deployment. >> Got it. So we'd love to talk about the sweet spot, the ideal customer profile at ICP. So is there a particular type of customer Monica, that stands to benefit most from the partnership and the certifications that you're committing to? >> Yeah. I mean, if you look at, you know, cloud native app development, that's happening across all types of segments, but particularly, you know, enterprise customers running, in all industries practically, running tier one applications or building custom applications in the cloud would be a great focus for this. Our customers who are mature in their cloud native journeys and want to build and run cloud native workloads at scale would be another type of audience. I mean, when you really think about the gamut of customers we serve jointly together, it's all the way from, you know, mid-sized customers who are, who may want a complete solution that's built for them, to enterprise customers and even globals accounts that are actually doing a lot of custom application development and then deploying things at scale. So really, I mean, anybody who's developing applications, anybody who's running workloads, you know, database workloads, applications that they're building, analytics workloads, I think for all of them. This is a very beneficial solution and I would say specifically from a Nutanix customer perspective, we've had a demand for, you know, the certification with AHV and RHEL for a long time. So that's something our customers are very much looking forward to. We have a large number of customers who already are deploying that configuration and now they know it's fully tested, fully supported, and there's an ongoing roadmap from both companies to support it. And then as far as OpenShift goes, we are super excited about the possibilities of providing that optionality to customers and really meeting them at every level of their journey to the cloud. >> So you got the product level certifications, that to me is all about trust and it's kind of table stakes, but if I have that, now I can, I can lean in. What other kind of value dimensions should we be thinking about with regard to this, this partnership? I mean, obviously, you know, cost savings, you know, speed, things like that, but maybe you could sort of add more color to that. >> Yeah. Well, absolutely, look. I mean, anytime there's joint there's integration, there is complexity that's taken out of deployment from the customer's hands and the vendors do the work upfront, that results in a lot of different benefits. Including productivity benefits, speed to market benefits, total cost of ownership benefits, as you said. So we expect that the fact that the two companies are now going to do all this work upfront for our customers, they'll be able to deploy and do things that we're doing, you know, much faster than before, right? So that's, you know, definitely we believe, and then also joined support. I think David mentioned that, the fact that we are offering joint support as well to our customers we'll be problem solving together. So the seamless support experience will provide faster resolution for our joint customers. >> Great. David, I wonder if you could kind of share your view of you know, thinking about the Nutanix cloud platform, what makes it well suited for supporting OpenShift and cloud native workloads? >> Well, I think the, look first off, they're the leader, right. They bring the most trusted and tried HCI environment in the industry to bear for customers, right. And they deliver on the promises that Monica just went through, right, around simplicity, around ease of use, around scalability, around optionality, right. And they take that complexity away and that's what customers I think are telling both Red Hat and Nutanix, and really everybody for that matter, right. Is that they want to focus on the business outcomes, on the business value, on the applications, that differentiate them. And Nutanix really takes away a lot of that complexity for the customer at the infrastructure level, right. And then RHEL, and OpenShift and Red Hat do that as well, both at the infrastructure level and at the application level, right. So when it comes to simplicity, and when it comes to choice, but consistency, both Nutanix and Red Hat have that at the core of how we build and how we engineer products that we take to market to remove that complexity so the customers can move quickly, more cost-effectively, and have that optionality that they're after. >> Yeah and David, if I may add to that, and thank you again for saying the things you said, that's exactly why our customers choose us. One of the key factors is our distributed architecture as well, because of the way it's architected, the Nutanix cloud platform delivers an environment that's highly scalable and resilient, and it's well suited for enterprise deployments of Red Hat, OpenShift at scale. The platform also includes, you know, fully integrated unified storage, which addresses many of the challenging problems faced by operators routinely in configuring and managing storage for stateful containers, for example. So there's a lot of goodness there and the combination of Red Hat, both you know, RHEL and OpenShift, any 10x platform, I believe, offers really unparalleled value to our customers in terms of the technology we bring and the integration we bring to our customers. >> Okay, great. Last question, David, maybe you first, and then Monica, you can bring us home. Where do you guys want to see this partnership going? >> We want to see it going where, customers are getting the most value of course, right. And we would like to see obviously adoption, right. So, anytime two leaders like ourselves come together, it's all about delivering for the customer. We've got a long list of customers that have been asking us, as Monica said to do this, and it's overwhelming, right. So we're responding to that. We've got a pipeline of, of customers that we're already beginning to engage on. And so we'll measure our progress based upon adoption, right, and how customers adopt the solution, the shared solution as we go forward. How they're feeding back to us, the value that they're getting, and also encouraging them to engage with us around the roadmap and where we take the solution, right. So I think those are ways that, you know, we'll be focused on adoption and satisfaction around it across the marketplace and the degree of interaction and input we get from customers with respect to the roadmap. And Monica, how do you feel about it? >> Yeah. What's success look like Monica? >> Yeah, look, we all know that technology is a means to an end, right? And the end is solving customer problems, as David said. For us, success will be when we have many, many, many, joined happy customers that are getting benefit from our platform. To me, this is just the beginning of our relationship to help customers. The best is yet to come. I'm super excited, as I said, for many reasons, but specifically, because we know there's a huge demand out there for this integrated solution between Red Hat and Nutanix and we'll start delivering it to our customers. So we've been, we'll be working very closely with our customers to see how that option goes, and we want to delight them with this, with our joint solution. That's our goal. >> Thank you. Well, David, you kind of alluded to it. Customers have been looking forward to this for quiet some time, and number of us have been thinking about this happening and to me, the key, is you're actually putting some real muscle behind it as seen in the engineering resources. And you got to have that type of commitment before you really go forward, otherwise, it's just kind of a yeah a nice press release, nice party deal, this isn't. So congratulations on figuring this out. Good luck. And we'll be really excited to watch your progress. Appreciate you guys coming to theCUBE. Okay. And thank you for watching everybody. This is Dave Vellante for theCube. We'll see you next time. (light, upbeat music)

>> the stage with rail Farrell and Greg Lavender. They had a kind of landscape there of 21 new technologies that are super interesting. I geek out, get excited about any fading. Hey, guys. >> Hey, you're watching live coverage of the M World 2019 on the Cube, the global leader in high tech coverage.

>> live from San Francisco, celebrating 10 years of high tech coverage. It's the Cube covering Veum World 2019. Brought to you by VM Wear and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back, everyone. Day three Q coverage here in San Francisco for V emerald. 2019. I'm just for a student, Um, in here with David Lan. Take days free kick off. We have two sets wall to wall coverage. Guys, this is the time where we get to take a deep breath two days under our belts look and reflect on all the news we've covered in a dark to last analysis sessions but also kind of riff on. We got two nights in hallway conversations we learned a lot of the party means do. I learned a lot last night. Dave. I know you. You learned a lots, do you, Thomas? When things that the chatter Certainly twittersphere hashtag the emerald. A lot of action on there, but it's the hallway conversations. It's the party that people have a few cocktails in them day that you start to hear the truth. The real deal comes out, >> No doubt. And and again Jon Stewart, there's real concern over from the from the practitioners we talked to about this acquisition spree. Are they going to be integrated? Are they going to just throw all this stuff at us and keep jamming products and service is down our throats? Or is this going to be a coherent set of solutions that solves our problem? We also had a little little interesting side conversation about, you know, Snowflake, Frank's lumens new company and how basically Frank is bringing back the Pirates from Data Domain and from service. Now Mike Scarpelli is over there. He's a rock star. CFO Beth White is eventually is back over there. And Frank's Lupin. He's the guy who takes companies from, you know, 100 million to a billion, so that's gonna be >> very serious money making him going on there. >> We have been following his career for a number of years now. We watched him take data domain. We watched him pull that that rabbit out of his hat with the sale with net app, and then the emcee swooped in. And then we saw what he did service. Now we've documented this is an individual to watch, you know, >> he's a world class management team member I mean, he's executes. >> Oh, yeah, no doubt. And >> he has >> a formula that's been proven and in time and time again. And to me, the biggest testament salute Min is the success of the continued success of Data Domain. After he left Hey, he really helped clean up the emcees data protection mess. Um, and then the second thing is, look at service now is performance after he left, I haven't missed a beat. And, yeah, John Donahoe, great executive and all, but it's because Frank's Lubin had everything in place and that was a really well run >> dry. And they got a nice little oracle like business model. >> Yeah. No, you're right. They kind of, you know, the big complaint now as well. Your price is too high that Oracle. >> What have you learned? What you hear in the hallways? I mean, a lot of chatter. >> Yes, John, we We've been reflecting back a lot. It's 10 years in 10th year of the Cube here and back here in San Francisco. The new Mosconi, our third show that I've been at this year in Mosconi and we always track year to year. But since it's been what 45 years since we were here for VM World. When I talked to the average vendor. When I talk to you know, the analysts here were like, Oh, thank goodness we're not in Vegas. When I talked to the average attendee, they're like, Oh my God, what happened to San Francisco since last time we were here? It is too expensive. And the experience walking around San Francisco has really not nearly as nice as it might have been five or 10 years ago. And many of them we were talking to, Ah, woman that runs an event that has been Vegas in San Francisco. And she said, Oh, we did in San Francisco and got tremendous feedback. Don't do it there again. Brings back to Vegas both for costs and the enjoyment of being around the environment. >> Where was a shit show here in San Francisco is horrible right now, I got to say to your right eye was walking this morning from my hotel. Literally. A homeless person passed out the middle of the sidewalk. Um, your smells like urine. It's P, and it's It's just I mean, it's really bad this tense now. I mean City of San Francisco is gonna do some. Mosconi, by the way, has been rebuilt. Awesome. So, you know, in terms of the new Mosconi stew, that's a serious upgrade. Hotel rooms are scarce and just the homeless problem. It's just ridiculous. I don't know what they're >> doing. So one of the other big things when I was reflecting coming into here two years ago when VM wear really started down right before the war on AWS announcement, they made a big announcement. IBM because they had sold off the cloud air toe Oh, VH And for two years Oh, VH was a big partner, Talked about that transition, said we handed off this great asset over h isn't here at the show. I was like, Oh, my gosh, you know, that was, you know, such a big story and other companies like New >> 12. That's good. One lets someone who's not at the show and why. Yeah, oh, VH wired to hear >> They aren't here because, well, they've got customers. More of them are in Europe That was supposed to be a big entry into the United States. Obviously, it wasn't as valuable for them to be here, even though I'm sure they're still part of that service provider ecosystem. They have other big one for us, and we've had on the Cube Nutanix. You know, we've had Dheeraj Pandey. First time we had him on was that this show is still the majority of Nutanix. Customers are VM where customers I've talked to lots of Nutanix customers at the event, even part of the analyst event. Some of the customers I talked to were like, Oh, yeah, my hardware stacks Nutanix and amusing NSX. And I'm using other things there. But they are not here. They're not allowed to be at the show. And I >> mean, they were blatantly told they can't come. >> They can't come here. They can't come to the regional things. They can't do the partner things. So that that that relationship is definitely >> from red hat. What kind of presence have you seen from Red s? >> So their number companies like red Hat that they're kept at a lower level of sponsorship. So they're here. They participate, you know. Open shift, of course, is you know, big enemy for cloud native. Lots of open shift runs on V sphere. So many of those companies that are part of the ecosystem, but not the ones that they want to celebrate and put front and forward. So it's always interesting kind of walk around on those. Even Microsoft is an interesting relationship for, you know, decades with the M wear. You know, of course, azure they partner with. But hyper V was long a competitors. So, you know, we understand those competitive relationships >> could be interesting. Stew and Dave on the ecosystem Jerry Chan Day when we just doing my interview yesterday on the other set mentioned that the ecosystem reinvents itself the community. The question now is with Delhi emceeing Del Technologies obviously heard Michael Dell essentially laying out his plan, which is he's got. He's trying to keep people distracted, but the bottom line is going to top people putting together the cloud right well service provider model. So you know, that's what he's gonna be a big impact. VM wear the crown jewel of Del Technologies certainly is looking more and more like It's >> well and yesterday remember the first VM world we did in 2010? It was It was del I mean course and see only the time Who's Del? It was H p Yes, the emcee was there, but it was net app. I mean, everybody could've had equal standing yesterday at the keynotes. It was Project Dimension of V M, where cloud on Delhi emcee and long keynotes >> data protection into the VM were >> also it's It's all very heavily, you know, Jeff Clarke has his his thumb on, you know, the the deli emcee folks pushing that through Veum where Michael is orchestrating the whole thing. Pat obviously is allowing it. I was sitting in the audience Next next, Some folks from Netapp they're like, you know, this kind of a bummer. Calvin Sito from h p e tweeted Wow how to stick it in the face of your ecosystem partners. He then later went on Facebook saying, Hey, I love this ecosystem, so sort of balancing it out because, you know, he wants to be a good, good citizen, but clearly the ecosystem partners who basically brought VM where you know, to the the position where it's in through distribution, our little ruffled. Right now you can't blame him, But at the same time, the mandate is clear. Michael Dell is driving his products and his solutions through VM were period the end. And, you know, if you don't like it, leave >> right. They had such great success with V San and VX rail in that joint product development and go to market. If they can replicate that with a number of other solutions, they get that the synergies. If >> you don't like it, don't leave. That leave is worse than that. They say you don't like it, you know, invited you. But >> how about what Pat said yesterday in the Cube about when they announced on Gwen heavily leaned into V san. He said publicly that Joe Tucci was pissed and I hate her. They were going at it so that so that shows you the change, right? I mean, so so so e m. C. When it owned VM where was very cautious about allowing Veum wears a software company to drive value somewhere Now is just acting like a software company. >> Well, I think I mean, I learned last night's do, um and you can appreciate this. I learned that the top executives of'em where are looking heavily and working hard at understanding and drive them kubernetes cloud native thing because this is not a throwaway deal. This is not a you know, far anything that they are investing. They get their top brass tech execs on kubernetes fto. Two big players job. Ada, Craig McCaw calumnies. We know interviews since day one, but I think the cloud native thing is going to be interesting. And I think it's gonna be evolution. I think there's gonna be a very dynamic road thing's gonna be a series, of course, corrections, but directionally they're all in on. They're going for it, they're not. >> And actually, I had a, you know, good discussion with Chad Attack. It's a good friend of the program now working at GM, where for the first time, but came from AMC worked at Pivotal. He said, culturally, such a gap between VM wear don't have to touch your app, you know, move everything along lifted shift is nice and easy versus pivotal, you know must go completely You know, dual programming, you know, agile everything there, so bridging those because there's multiple paths and the rail pharaoh announcement is that would be cloud native stuff that won't necessarily go to the EMS. We're going to retool V EMS to now be a platform for kubernetes so that they have a few passed to bridge or to build towards the future. Here's the >> answer strategy. Discussion That and Rayo Farrell was now running Cloud native. Think this is just really >> ties in the interesting discussion that I had with some folks was that you've essentially got well, Jerry Chen brought this up last time we had him on it and reinventing because >> we have >> a conversation all the time about this Amazon have to go up the stack. And Jerry Chen made a really he said, Look, it they're not They're not gonna become an e r peace offer company. What they're gonna do is give tools to the builders so that they can disrupt Europea. They can disrupt service. Now they can disrupt Oracle. That's their strategy, at least for now. Okay, so what does that say? I think the strategy discussion inside of'em were and and l is about by whatever clouds gonna be 35 to 50% of the market. Fine. And the cloud native abs. Great. But you got this mission critical. E r p is an example. Database saps that are on Prem. What we have to do is keep them there. So we're going to sell to the incumbents and we're going to give them cloud native tools, toe modernize. Those APS have build new acts on Prem, and that's the that is the collision course that's coming. So the big question is, can the cloud native guys and AWS disrupt that >> huge? I've always said I'm is on and like the way they're coming in, a tsunami is coming in. And who's gonna build that sea wall to stop it right? And that's essentially only hope that these guys have. You look at all the competitive strategy. Was Oracle. Whoever just gotta stop it? You can't like >> the sea >> wall. That's a great building. A sea wall I was, I would say, is Is that you know, they're only hope at this point is to, you know, get in the game because see Amazon is the stack. They're not really moving up the stack. You hear that from Cisco and Dale and other people? That's where it's a game of musical chairs. Right now, the music's you know, there's still a lot of shares left, but soon chairs getting pulled away and Cisco Deli emcee VM, where they're all fighting for these big chairs. And one >> thing >> we talked about yesterday is that VM wears very directional, product driven. Otherwise they pick a direction, is a statement of direction and don't really have a lot of meat on the bone. In the product side, Sister is actually in market with service providers there in market with NETWORKINGS to this no vapor there that's installed basis and incumbent business. You have developers Esso Baton talks about suffered to find data center, suffer defined networking. I mean, come on, Really. I mean, they're getting there, but it didn't have the complete solution. Cisco >> Coming into this week, I expected here a bit more about the progress and all the customers of'em wear on AWS and feel like Vienna actually downplayed the AWS. We know what a strong partnership it is at every Amazon show we go to, and we got a lot of them Now there's a big presence there, and I can talk to customers that are starting to roll out and move there, but it felt like it was David's. You pointed out there are some messaging differences when you talk about multi cloud and how they're positioning it. So, you know, put those >> here Amazon. If your Amazon you're not happy with Microsoft Dell Technologies World The big announcement that was positioned a cloud foundation Although it wasn't a joint engineering, But the press picked it up as though the Amazon deal has been replicated with Microsoft and Google. I mean, you gotta be gotta be hurt if your Amazon >> So I've I've just been taking notes this this event, there's I've noted at least five major points of difference between a W s what they're saying and their philosophy and the anywhere so eight of us. We know they they don't talk multi cloud. They've told their partners, If you're doing joint marketing with us, you cannot say multi cloud aws that reinforce John. We saw this. Steven Schmidt said that this narrative that security is broken doesn't help the industry. Security's not broken, you know, we're doing great. The state of the nation is wonderful. Aws Matt. Not really. I agree. By the way. Uh, that's not the case. I agree with Pat saying Security's broken. It's a do over VM where wants to be the best infrastructure and developer software company. Who's the best infrastructure and software development platform. Eight of us. The M one wants to be the security cloud. Who's the security cloud? Eight of us. And then, uh, they talked about 10,000 cloud data Listeners are those really cloud data centers at Vienna. And the last one was this was a little nuanced Veum was talking about We know about migrating, modernize, lifted ship shift and then modernize The empire's not talking about modernize and then migrate. If you want to. I totally in conflict >> as a collision course. That's got Look, look, look at the data center was Look, it looks like we're going. We're going away, right to the data center. Staying. That's music to Michael Dell's VM. Where's years they live in the Data City? Do you pointed out yesterday? Data Senate goes away. So does begin. Where's business? >> One of things. I'm surprised. I'm wondering you both have talked to some of the service fighter telco pieces of'em, where they're doing that project dimension, which is the VM where stack on del that looks just like outposts on. And I know they had deployments on this for months. If I was them, you know, it's everybody's hearing about Outpost to talk about it, being more like we're already doing it in. This has you in that Amazon ecosystem. It might be a little strong for the Amazon story, but have you been hearing any about that this week? >> I think they keep a lot of cards close to the chest, but it's clear from the announces that they're doing certainly del the VM, where on Delhi Emcee Cloud or whatever it's called, it's not a cloud but their their infrastructure that is essentially a managed service. That's gonna be really strong for I t. People, because I think that the value proposition of going toe i t and saying we have this, you don't need to do anything. It's very strong, I mean, because I didn't want him >> and justified because this the project to mention it is that single, that thinner stack like what we saw on Outpost in the Amazon video, as opposed to Veum, where cloud on AWS, which is the full C i r h d. I stack. >> I haven't heard anything still on >> well, but the conversation I had from from Vienna, where standpoint, they could make money on that manage service. That's why it's the preferred partnership, right? And so that's their part of their cloud play. If you don't have a public cloud, I said this yesterday, you have to redefine Cloud and you have to get into cloud service. And that's what's happening. And that's exactly what's happening. And what I like about what V M where is doing is they are transitioning their model to a sass based model. Now it's only 12 and 1/2 percent of the revenues today. But both pivotal and carbon black are gonna add, you know, ah, $1,000,000,000 next year to that subscription based $3 billion in year two. Um, and so you know, Pat said the other day, I think we could get to 50 50. I don't necessarily think in the near term we're gonna go beyond that. It's not the Adobe >> way could be critical. Critical of'em were in some areas, but I gotta tell you their core strength that they went to a software operators on the data center friend of prices. That's been a great strategy. Focusing on their core building from there is Jerry 10 point out adding other products so their software company, So I think they're really got a good solution. And you? The data shows that people are increasing their spending, John. Just one based on >> that. Because I had a couple of really good conversation with customers, customers that would deploy VCF So they've got the full stack on there. So using H C I, but not necessarily on Dell hardware, could be Cisco Hardware. Could be HB hardware in the like or they're buying NSX. But the virtual ization team owns it, and they get kind of put in. A box storage team says That's not the array I'm used to buy. Well, maybe I'll put a pure storage box and put it in between. The networking team says I'm refreshing my Cisco hardware. You know, we're like, but we have NSX, and it's great. Well, you can use NSX over there. We're going to use a C I over here. So the term I heard from a number of customers is organizations still have hardware to find roles, and they're trying to figure out how to move to that software world. Which hurts me, cause I spent years trying to get beyond silos and helping people you know, move through those environments. And still, in 2019 it's a big challenge. That organizational shift is we know how tough that is. >> So just couple points in the data, because you're right. There are some countervailing trends, though. So, yes, people are spending Maurin VM where in the second half. But at the same time, the data shows that cloud is hurting VM wear spend. So this that's kind of gets interesting. Our containers gonna kill VM where? No, there's no evidence that container's air hurting VM where spend. But there's clearly risks there, you know, as we've talked about who's best position of multi cloud. Well, it turns out three guys with the public cloud are best positioned in multi Google and Microsoft on, and so and then the pivotal thing is interesting, and ties ties all this in so that the data is actually really interesting. It's like you're seeing tugs at both sides, and I think your your notion about the seawall is dead on. That's exactly what they're doing. >> You see that with Oracle's trying to stop jet. I just want they can't win this one to stop Amazon just on the tracks gave great data. Great reporting, Stoop. Good observations. Get all the day that night and parties we're gonna certainly keep doing that. Day three of wall to wall coverage here. You bringing to the insights and interviews here live from the Emerald Twin 19. Stay with us for more after this short break.

>> from San Francisco. It's the Cube covering the M Wear Radio twenty nineteen brought to you by the M where >> welcome to Special Cube conversation here in San Francisco for PM wears radio event there. Top engineers air here for once a year Get together and show in the best stuff road map to get to great guests. Here we got Mike Petrillo is the senior director of Blockchain of'em were here where their journey is, where they come from and gone to today where they are up to and for Team A Gluckman Engineering leader Blockchain engine both with GM Where great to see you guys. Thanks for coming on. Appreciate spending the time My favorite topic block Jane our favorite topic to thanks for joining me. So, Mike, let's start with you. Take a street where you guys are now Because we talked about a year ago. Just getting the putting the team together. You were here last year radio kind of getting some core mo mentum. Where have you guys come from? And where are you now? Yeah, >> it's been quite a journey. You know, over the past five years, we've been doing a lot of research that research culminated in an open source project called Project Concorde that we announced last year. Then we wrapped some commercial offerings around it around really the operational side. How do you operate a blockchain at scale in an enterprise setting we introduced? That is Veum wear Blockchain. It's a very descriptive on the naming, and it really focuses on three core things. Enterprise grade, decentralized trust, not distributed trust but really decentralized trust. So being able to deploy it across multiple different cloud environments as well as on prim, it concentrates on robust Day two operations. How do you operate it at scale in an enterprise setting? How do you deal with stuff like GDP are the right to be forgotten? You know, data sovereignty issues, things like that, which is much different than other block Janes. And then the third thing is really being developer friendly. Last year we were fully Ethereum compatible. We had the Ethereum language sitting on top of our block chain. Since then, we've added support for Djamel from digital asset. So another language and we're adding more and more languages so the developers can develop in the framework that they're used to on the best scaleable. You know, Enterprise Supporter >> brings him Dev Ops Mojo Concepts to blockchain. Absolutely, absolutely somewhat. The demo you guys did you get on stage? I want to get too, because it's a really use case. So again, rnd concept jewel years of research started putting together making some progress on developer. So the solutions that you guys presented, we really take us through that. >> So the ocean plastics demo that we talked about a radio basically solves this problem or, you know, just the plastics polluted, polluting our oceans today. So if you look at the numbers are staggering and the BP that you actually a consume, you know, in fish it's pretty scary. The other thing is, you know, it's been predicted that we'll have mohr plastic in our oceans than fish by twenty fifty. And one of the things Dell is trying to do is clean up the environment, and they're building these reusable trays or packaging material for their Dell laptops. And so this use case was providing them that functionality. And if you look at del they you know, they have a massive supply chain. They've got hundreds and thousands of renders that you know, they use despite systems that don't actually talk to each other, they've got complicated work flows. There's also a lot off corruption in their supply chain. And one of the things that can really solve a lot of those problems is bmr blockchain. And they have an instance running on our service, which runs on VM CNW s and I walked through the devil of just going through an aggregator to getting to a manufacturer and then assembling these laptops with the trays and shipping them off to >> think this was something we covered. A del technology world. I just wanna point out for the folks watching Dell's taking recycled material from the ocean, using it as materials into their laptops as a part of sustainability. Great business. You know, Malcolm for del the supply chain pieces. Interesting. So you guys are using blockchain and track the acquisition of the plastic out of the ocean? >> Yes. To manufacturing and to end >> Yes. In tow? Yes. >> Using of'em were blocking. >> Yes. So who coded >> this up? It was actually >> del Del developers coded it up. So they quoted up. They took two weeks to code it. We had absolutely no support issues that came away, which really talks about these. A fuse of our platform. And, you know, just the applications that running. >> How does someone get involved real quick at the plug for they have someone joins the bm where? Blockchain initiative? Yes, Via more block >> change. That's ah, manage service offering from us. So it's a license, you know, product. If they're interested, they can go to the inn where dot com slash blockchain or emails? The blockchain dash info beyond where dotcom get it signed up on the beta. We have an active beta. We have lots of enterprise customers all around the planet using it today. You know, at scale >> is a free servicers are licensed paid license. >> There will >> be a paid license for it. You know, we're invader right now, so it is free, right? >> I get it. But we're gonna get you in the snow. So it is. It is a licence service. Yeah, It's Amanda's >> service offering on. That's you know, the beauty of it is that you don't have to worry about updating it, you know, keeping the nose live anything like that. We don't see the transactional data. We don't manage the nodes or anything like that. But we deploy and keep him updated. Keeping refresh. >> You know, one of the benefits Ray Farrell's on. Just how about the ape revolution? How I change the world with the Internet and the web that blockchain has that same kind of inflection point impact you mentioned GDP are that implies, Reed. You know, changing the the values on the block chain will dwell in the Ganges is immutable. How do you handle that? Because if it's already immutable on encrypted, how does Tootie pr work? >> Yeah, just doesn't take >> care of you. Why wait? If it's encrypted, no one can see it. >> Yeah, well, you know, block chains, not about encrypting the data, right? There are some block change that do encrypted data. People get confused because they associated the cryptography with it, which links the blocks together. But the data in there is still visible. Right? We're working on privacy solutions to make privacy per transaction. We're working on GDP our issues right now, because that is an issue. When you get into a regulated environment, which there isn't really a non regulated environment these days. You have to worry about these things. You know, Blockchain gives you a mutability and that gives you to trust. But really, Blockchain is about trust. It's about this decentralized trust. And when you think about it in that context, you say, Well, if I trust that I want to be able to delete that data and we reach consensus on it and we still maintain the order, right, the proper order of the bits, which is really what Blockchain is doing, is giving you trust on that order. Bits and I agree, is a consensus to delete one of those pieces out of the order bit, and we can still maintain trust of the order bits. And that's fine. Now I can't get into details on this engineering secret sauce. >> I. So one of the things I want to ask >> you guys just engineers, because I think this is one of the things that I see is that Blockchain is attractive. There's a lot of unknowns that coming down the pike, but we do know one thing. It's a distributed, decentralized kind of concept that people like it. I see a new generation of attracted the blockchain new generation of entrepreneurs, a new generation of young people, engineers who see use cases that others from old school industry might not. So you start to see. I won't say it's the hipster or cutting edge. It's just that it's attracting this kind of new generation developer for engineer. >> Why do you >> think that's the case? Why, and and is that right assumption to look at? Because, you know, when asked his blockchain, certainly state of the art. Yeah, it's not as fast as a database of I wanted to do something. Technically, that's like saying the Internet dial up was bad. But what happened after? So you know, a lot of people making these arguments, But I see it definitely resonating with young people. Yes, look at Facebook who tried looking blockchain and moving their entire a broken system. Teo blocked, Jammed. Try to fix that so you can feel these indicators. What's your thoughts? >> I think >> part of it. And I definitely saw this, you know, last Friday and Saturday, I was eighty three up in New York City, right, and it was very much that hipster crowd, and I was really attached to the crypto currency phase. Cryptocurrency allowed individuals to make investments. You know, the kind of millennials to make investments. They didn't have to go to a e trade or they didn't have to go to some broker. It wasn't caught up in anything. They could, you know, make these bets. And now they can build applications that are directly attached to that currency. They can make up their own currency. They can make up their own value system. You know, you've done some of that with a cube, right? We've launched an application that provides value around the content and token eyes. Is that value? And now it can transfer that value So it opens up the transfer of that value, the trust of that value. And I think, you know, we're in a generation of trust and transparency. That's what's powering the world right now is about trust and transparency, and that's what Blockchain gives you, gives you trust in the system that no one person or no one government owns, and >> I really like that. >> But one thing important is I mean, we just have to demystify this like we just have to say, This is not about Cryptocurrency. That's one thing, and what I am is doing is enterprise blockchain and, you know, and Mike, you've talked about this. You always say, you know, black jeans, not going toe, you know, save the world or, you know it's not going to get rid of poverty. But there's four use cases that we've drilled down to in the supply chain realm, and there's the financial services. And so those are some of the things we're tackling, and I think it's important to like talk about that. And, you know, there's these hipsters every time we go and talk anything with regarding the blockchain, we know a big chunk of people, therefore Cryptocurrency and apparently at consensus in New York, they reduce their audience from I can't remember the numbers. When >> I was >> in the two thousand >> last year were about House kicked out all the crypto >> currency people, and so it's important to make that distinction. >> I think the crypto winter probably hurt them more than taking up, because last year there was a lot of hype there, but I think the bubble was already burst around February last year. But this piece of the good point is something that we've been kind of covering on silicon angle. The Cube is there's infrastructure dynamic. The engineering goodness. I think that certainly is intoxicating to think about Blockchain as an impact. Engineering wise, the token conversation brings up utility, the decentralized crypto currency, the icy, his initial coin offerings. The fraud part or regulated part has caused a lot of problems. So to me, well, I tell people was looking the CEO kind of scams and fraud kind of put a shadow on token economics. And Blockchain is a technology so supply chain no doubt is great. Blockchain. That's where you guys are focused. That's what the enterprise want. Way start getting into tokens. Tokens is a form of measurement. Uh huh. And that's where I think the regulators to do your point earlier is it's caused a lot of problems. So you know, the says if you got a utility token and you're selling >> it, it's Zane exchanges, not kill each other. So that's you're >> called. A lot of it would call those app developers. >> Yeah, but the up developers were still out there, right? And what's nice is these app developers that are on the side building these unique little applications. They still end up working for these larger companies and driving interesting solutions through like we're doing with supply chain like we're doing financial services like what we're doing in Telco and Media. You look at the people that we're dealing with in these companies. They came from building those applications. Heck, some of our own product managers came from building unique things mining rigs and mining companies. So you still have that background. They still have that entrepreneurial, you know, asset. And that's what's changing these cos they're driving change these companies saying, Hey, look, we can use the blockchain for this really unique thing that opens up a brand new business line, you know, for this large corporation, >> you know, I showed you our check preview. We did a quick preview of'Em World last year with our block changing me with a cube coin token, kind of total experimental thing. And it was interesting time because I think you hit the nail on the head. We as entrepreneurial developers. I had this great application we want to do for the Cube community, but we were stalled by the you know, the crypto winter, and you know, we're Apple developers, so there's many use cases of such scenarios like that. That's kind of people are kind of halfway between a Z A B. What's your advice toe to us, or folks like us who were out there who want to get the project back on track? What what what should we and application will do? They should they free focus on the infrastructure peace? What's your advice for the marketplace? >> It's so early, it's It's so early to actually really comment on that. I mean, I would say Just keep at it because you never know. It's I feel like we're so early in the game that though we can solve world hunger, there's so many use cases and applications that come out of it and we just have to keep going. And I think the developer community is what's going to make this successful, you know, and even emerging standards. I think that's one thing is standards across, You know, these block chains like we don't have that right now, and that's something we really need to need to do. And >> I don't know we program in Ethereum. >> So the question is, is that a bad choice is a lot of cognitive dissonance around with the right to. >> That's what I was just going to bring up is that >> you know, you brought up the point of your an app developer and you become stalled, you know, in your project. And we see that exactly same thing happening in the enterprise. We go into account after account where they've chosen some block change solution that's out there and to become what I call a stalled pioneer. They've gone through. They develop that application. But they either hit a scale, ability issue and then, you know, throughput or the number of nodes. They hit an operations thing. You know, operations comes in and says, Whoa, how are you going to do an audit on that thing? What about data Sovereign? What about GPR? What about this one? How are we? My God, you're gonna operate it inside of my environment? You know, what's the security side? So it's really round scale ability. It's around operations. It's around security. Those are three things we hit on over and over and over again with the stalled pioneers. So those of the accounts that we go into and rescue them essentially right, we say we can provide you the scale. We can provide you the through, but we can provide you the operations. For twenty years, the Empire has been taking large, complex distributed systems and making you operate them at scale in an enterprise setting. Where the experts at it So we're doing that would block chain now and allowing your blockchain projects to succeed and >> really find that term. Yep. Yeah. Okay, So, radio. What's the feedback here? Obviously got. Got the demo. What's been some of the peer review Give us the the four one one on peer review here. People liking what's going on? >> I think the demo really talk to people. It was relatable. You're a There was a social good a demo. I think it really impacted them. Um, but some of the cool stuff we're doing is also like in the financial services side. You know, we've got Mohr interesting stuff on the supply chain, so the feedbacks been great. Ah, lot of focuses on VM are blockchain, which is also cool. We didn't quite have that last year. In radio, we had everyone running off in different directions. So now it's via more blockchain And what Mike talked about installed pioneers is you know, we were seeing scalability throughput on numbers. And, you know, we talked about it at the immoral Barcelona A numbers. They're looking really great. And, you know, we're we're optimizing pushing our platform so we could get to, you know, perhaps the papal numbers rave, and someday visa, >> you have high availability. You guys know scale. Yeah. You happy where you are right now? >> Very happy where we >> are right >> now. I mean, we've got great customers. Great feedback, you know, great solution that solving real world problems. You know, engineers like doing two things shipping code and solving stuff that's going to help the world. At least you're of'em where that's our culture, right? And And we're able to do that day in and day out and the entire block chains the cornerstone to that. That's what makes people happy. >> Mike Protein, We following your journey. Great. Teo, check in Great to hear the progress. Congratulations on the great demo reel Use cases in supply chain. We'LL be following you guys and keep in touch. Thanks for coming on the key. Absolutely. Thank you for >> the time >> chauffeur here with Lisa Martin here in San Francisco for work. You coverage of radio, the top engineering event where they all come together internally with GM, where one of a few press outlets here, the Cube bringing exclusive coverage. Thanks for watching.

>> from Palo Alto, California It's the Cube covering the EM Where women Transforming technology twenty nineteen. Brought to You by VM Wear >> Hi Lisa Martin with the Cube on the ground at the end. Where in Palo Alto, California, for the fourth annual Women Transforming Technology, even W. T. Squared on event that is near and dear to my heart. Excited to welcome back to the Cube pretty much. Rog Lachman, engineering leader, blocked in at the end where pretty much It's so great to have you back on the Cube. Thank you, Lisa. It's amazing to be here, and I can't believe it's been a year, a year. And so last year, when Protein was here, she launched her book. Nevertheless, she persistent love the title You just Did a session, which we'LL get to in a second, but I'd love to get your your experiences in the last year about the book launch. What's the feedback? Ben? What are some of the things that have made me feel great and surprised you at the same time? It's been fantastic. I wasn't expecting that when I started to write this book. It was more like I want to impact one woman's life. But what was interesting is I delivered around twenty twenty five talks last year. My calendar's booked for this year, but every time I go give a talk, my Lincoln goes crazy and I'm connecting with all these women and men. And it's just fantastic because they're basically resonating with everything I talk about in the book. I spoke at the Federal Reserve. Wow, I was like, This is a book on tech and they were like, No, this impacts all of us And I spoke to a group of lawyers and actually, law firms have fifty fifty when they get into law, right when they get into whenever I mean live, I'm not that familiar with it. But getting to partner is where they don't have equality or diversity, and it's resonated. So now I'm like, maybe I should just take the word check out What? You It's been impactful. And so last year was all about companies, so I did. You know, I spoke at uber I spoken Veum, where spoken nutanix it's looking a lot of these companies last year. This year is all about schools, fantastic schools of all different type, so I you know, I've done a talk at San Jose State. I went to CMU. They invited me over Carnegie Mellon. I supported the robotics team, which is all girls team. Nice. And it was fantastic because these girls high school kids were designing robots. They were driving these robots. They were coding and programming these robots and was an all girls team. And I asked them, I said, But you're excluding the men and the boys and they said no. When it's a combined boy girls team, the women end up the girls and organizing the men of the boys are actually writing the code. They're doing the drilling there, doing all that. And so the girls don't get to do any of that. And I was looking at just the competition and as watching these teams, the boy girl steams and those were all organizing. And I thought, this is exactly what happens in the workforce. You're right. Yeah. We come into the workforce, were busy organizing, coordinating and all that, and the men are driving the charge. And that's why these kids where this is at high school, Yeah, thirteen to seventeen, where this is becoming part of their cultural upbringing. Exactly. Pretty. In great. Yes, yes. And a very young age. So that was fascinating. I think that surprised me. You know, you were asking me what surprised you that surprised me. And what also surprised me was the confidence. Though these girls were doing all these things. I've never built a robot. I would love to. I haven't built a robot, and they were doing all these amazing things, and I thought, Oh, my God, >> they're like, >> confident women. But they were not. And it was because they felt that there was too much to lose. They don't want to take risks, they don't want to fail. And it was that impostor syndrome coming back so that conditioning happens way more impossible syndrome is something that I didn't even know what it wass until maybe the last five or six years suddenly even just seeing that a very terse description of anyone Oh, my goodness, it's not just me. And that's really a challenge that I think the more the more it's brought to light, the more people like yourself share stories. But also what your book is doing is it's not just like you were surprised to find out It's not just a tech. This is every industry, Yes, but his pulse syndrome is something that maybe people consider it a mental health issue and which is so taboo to talk about. But I just think it's so important to go. You're not alone. Yeah, vast majority men, women, whatever culture probably have that. Let's talk about that. Let's share stories. So that your point saying why I was surprised that these young girls had no confidence. Maybe we can help. Yes, like opening up. You know, I'm sharing it being authentic. Yeah. So I'm looking at my second book, which basically says what the *** happens in middle school? Because what happens is somewhere in middle school, girls drop out, so I don't know what it is. I think it's Instagram or Facebook or boys or sex. I don't know what it is, but something happens there. And so this year of my focus is girls and you know, young girls in schools and colleges. And I'm trying to get as much research as I can in that space to see what is going on there, because that totally surprised me. So are you kind of casting a wide net and terms like as you're. Nevertheless, she persisted. Feedback has shown you it's obviously this is a pervasive, yes issue cross industry. This is a global pandemic, yes, but it's your seeing how it's starting really early. Tell me a little bit about some of the things that we can look forward to in that book. So one thing that's important is bravery, Which reshma So Johnny, who's the CEO off girls code? She has this beautiful quote, she says. We raise our voice to be brave, and we'd raise our girls to be perfect, pretty telling. And so we want to be perfect. We won't have the perfect hair, the perfect bodies. We want a perfect partner. That never happens. But we want all that and because we want to be perfect, we don't want to take risks, and we're afraid to fail. So I want to focus on that. I want to talk to parents. I want to talk to the kids. I want to talk to teachers, even professors, and find out what exactly it is like. What is that conditioning that happens, like, why do we raise our girls to be perfect because that impacts us at every step of our lives. Not even careers. It's our lives. Exactly. It impacts us because we just can't take that risk. That's so fascinating. So you had a session here about persistent and inclusive leadership at W T squared forth and you will tell me a little bit about that session today. What were some of the things that came up that you just said? Yes, we're on the right track here. So I started off with a very depressing note, which is twenty eighty five. That's how long it's gonna take for us to see equality. But I talked about what we can do to get to twenty twenty five because I'm impatient. I don't want to wait twenty eighty five I'LL be dead by them. We know you're persistent book title. You know, my daughter will be in the seventies. I just don't want that for her. So, through my research, what I found is we need not only women to lean in. You know, we've have cheryl sound. We're talking about how women need to lean in, and it's all about the women. And the onus is on the woman the burdens on the woman. But we actually need society. Selena. We need organizations to lean in, and we need to hold them accountable. And that's where we're going to start seeing that changes doing that. So if you take the m r. I. You know, I've been with him for ten years, and I always ask myself, Why am I still here? One of the things we're trying to do is trying to take the Cirrus early this morning rail Farrell talked about like on the panel. He said, We are now Our bonuses are tied to, you know, domestic confusion, like we're way have to hire, you know, not just gender, right, Like underrepresented communities as well. We need to hire from there, and they're taking this seriously. So they're actually making this kind of mandatory in some sense, which, you know, it kind of sucks in some ways that it has to be about the story that weighing they're putting a stake in the ground and tying it to executive compensation. Yes, it's pretty bold. Yes. So organizations are leaning in, and we need more of that to happen. Yeah. So what are some of the things that you think could, based on the first *** thing you talked about the second one that you think could help some of the women that are intact that are leaving at an alarming rate for various reasons, whether it's family obligations or they just find this is not an environment that's good for me mentally. What are some of the things that you would advise of women in that particular situation? First thing is that it's to be equal partnership at home. A lot of women leave because they don't have that. They don't have that support on having that conversation or picking the right partner. And if you do pick the wrong partner, it's having that conversation. So if you have equal partnership at home, then it's both a careers that's important. So you find that a lot of women leave tech or leave any industry because they go have babies, and that happens. But it's just not even that, like once they get past that, they come backto work. It's not satisfying because they don't get exciting projects to work on that you don't get strategic projects, they don't have sponsors, which is so important toward the success, and they they're you know, people don't take a risk on them, and they don't take a risk. And so these are some of those things that I would really advice women. And, you know, my talk actually talked about that. Talked about how to get mail allies, how to get sponsors. Like what? You need to actually get people to sponsor you. Don't talk to me a little bit more about that. We talk about mentors a lot. But I did talk this morning with one of our guests about the difference between a sponsor and a mentor. I'd love you to give Sarah some of your advice on how women can find those sponsors. And actually, we activate that relationship. So mentors, uh, talk to you and sponsors talk about okay. And the way to get a sponsor is a is. You do great work. You do excellent work. Whatever you do, do it well. And the second thing is B is brag about it. Talk about it. Humble bragging, Yeah. Humble bragging talkabout it showcases demo it and do it with people who matter in organizations, people who can notice your work building that brand exactly. And you find that women are all the men toward and under sponsored. Interesting, Yes. How do you advise that they change that? There was a Harvard study on this. They found that men tend to find mentors are also sponsors. So what they do is, you know, I like you to stick pad girl singer, he says. Andy Grove was his mentor, but Andy Grove was also his sponsor in many ways, in for his career at Intel, he was a sponsor and a mental. What women tend to do is we find out like even me, like I have female spot him. Mentors were not in my organization, and they do not have the authority to advocate for me. They don't They're not sitting in an important meeting and saying, Oh, patina needs that project for team needs to get promoted. And so I'm not finding the right mentors who can also be my sponsors, or I'm not finding this one says right, and that's happens to us all the time. And so the way we have to switch this is, you know, mentors, a great let's have mentors. But let's laser focus on sponsors, and I've always said this all of last year. I'm like the key to your cell. Success is sponsorship, and I see that now. I am in an organization when my boss is my sponsor, which is amazing, because every time I go into a meeting with him, he says, This is about pretty much grew up. This is a pretty mers group. It's not me asking him. He's basically saying It's pretty nose grow, which is amazing to hear because I know he's my mentor in sponsor as well. And it's funny when I gave him a copy of my book and I signed it and I said, And he's been my sponsor to be more for like ten years I said, Thank you for being my sponsor and he looked at me. He said, Oh, I never realized it was your sponsor So that's another thing is men themselves don't know they're in this powerful position to have an impact, and they don't know that they are sponsors as well. And so we need. We need women to Fox and sponsors. I always say find sponsors. Mentorship is great, but focus of sponsors Look, I think it's an important message to get across and something I imagine we might be reading about in your next book to come. I know. Yeah, well, we'LL see. Artie, thank you so much for stopping by the Cube. It's great to talk to you and to hear some of the really interesting things that you've learned from nevertheless you persistent and excited to hear about book number two and that comes out. You got a combined studio. I'd love to thank you and thank you. I'm Lisa Martin. You're watching the queue from BM Where? At the fourth Annual Women Transforming Technology event. Thanks for watching.

(upbeat music) >> Hey welcome back everybody. Jeff Frick here with theCUBE. We're at San Francisco International at Gate 54B if you want to stop by and say hello. We're here for Alaska's Elevated Flying Experience launch. It's really an interesting opportunity. Alaska took advantage of the purchase of Virgin to kind of rethink the brand, rethink the branding of the planes, and add a bunch of new amenities. This is the one that you're going to care about more than any of the others, and we're really excited to have the founder and CEO of Salt & Straw the ice cream, Kim Malek. >> Hi! >> Great to meet you! >> Thank you! >> I am a huge fan! >> Aw! I appreciate that. >> I don't know how many hours I've stood in line and burned, waiting to get into your restaurant in Portland. >> Aw, thank you so much! >> So for folks that haven't stood in line for their Salt & Straw, give us a quick update on Salt & Straw, who you guys are, what you're all about. >> Yeah, so we started actually in 2011 as a little push cart which is a big deal in Portland, and we've grown now to 19 shops up and down the West Coast. We make all of our ice cream in 5 gallon batches, so we savor the smallest and we're the largest small batch ice cream company in the world and we're excited to have this new partnership with Alaska. >> Right, so I don't know kind of what the official industry categories are, but you would certainly be like in the super rich premium category. (laughter) Right. Really, really rich ingredients, fresh ingredients >> Yeah >> crazy flavors. >> So, each city that we operate in we make a different menu, so it reflects that city's local flavors, what's going on with the food scene and we make everything in house, so whether it's a brownie or rendering bone marrow, or making gummy bears ourselves, it's all made in house with great great care and love. >> I'm just curious if you have a feel for, you know, what is the formula for your success? Right, it's ice cream. There's a lot of ice cream choices, of course Farrell's was one of my favorite back at Portland >> Aw, I love Farrell's. Yeah. >> and they don't have that anymore at the zoo. But, what are some of the secrets to have, you know, "a commodity product" if you will, it's ice cream, but to build such a passionate following and really have people that are so connected to the product and the brand? >> Yeah, well we feel so fortunate to have this loyal following and I think it's really, you know we invest a lot in earning people's business and earning that attention, and so like I said, we have a different menu in every city that we operate in, we change our menu every 4 weeks, so it's reflective of what's happening locally and seasonally, and then when you come into our store, we try to offer a pretty special experience, so from the store design to the way we take care of people, they can sample through the whole menu. I was just at one of our stores and a customer said this is like a wine tasting, I mean I'm tasting all of these flavors, hearing the stories behind how they were made, and the collaborations that went into it, so we pack a lot into the experience. >> Right and so it's interesting that we are here at Alaska because Ben and the opening talked about really the culture and about people because the seat, it's kind of the same thing, a seat mile is a seat mile, so how do you differentiate your product and your offering, and he talked about values and wanting to work with companies that reflect the similar values. You're here, so tell the people why are you here at the Alaska event? >> I love that he talked about values. I noticed that as well and you know I think that's definitely one thing that we share, is a care for the people first and foremost. I mean, we scoop ice cream, but you know we offer people I think four days of training before they show up to actually start scooping ice cream, and that's all about you know, how to create connections with people, how to have a really special experience when someone is standing in front of you and how to connect. So, you know, we invest a lot in our team and I think that really shines through in the way that they take care of customers and I definitely see that when I fly with Alaska Airlines and it was one of the reasons I was so excited to be able to partner with them. >> Right, so we got to tell the people, so you can now get Salt & Straw on Alaska Airlines. >> Yeah, that's right, so just for a couple of months now we've been offering a little single serve container that we actually developed in conjunction with Alaska Airlines, so they helped us design the packaging, so that it would really fit with the experience that they were offering and then we launched it in the air and we don't really sell ice cream outside of our stores very much, so it was really a big deal to work with them on this project. >> Yeah and I would imagine in terms of the packaging and the experience, you're so dialed into that, that is such a part of your brand that you probably have a lot of, I would imagine initial concerns about making sure that was consistent with the brand that you guys represent. >> Yeah, definitely, I mean we had a lot of conversations about how they were going to handle the product, how they were going to educate their team about the ice cream so they can be communicating it with the people who were flying and they were of course there in spades and it was a really easy conversation to have. >> Alright, well Kim, thanks for, thanks for the ice cream earlier. >> Aw, thank you. >> And thanks for taking a few minutes. Congratulations and safe flying back to Portland. >> Awesome! I appreciate being here. Thank you! >> You're welcome! She's Kim, I'm Jeff, you're watching theCUBE. We're at San Francisco Gate 54B at the Alaska Airlines Better Experience. Thanks for watching. (upbeat music)

>> Live from Bellevue, Washington. It's theCUBE, covering Smartsheet Engage '18. Brought to you by Smartsheet. >> Hi, welcome to theCUBE. We are live at Smartsheet Engage 2018. Our first time here, I'm Lisa Martin with Jeff Frick. Jeff, it's great to be paired back up with you again. >> Yeah, it's been a little while, great to see you, Lisa. >> It has, you too. So this is the second annual Smartsheet Engage. There's about a couple thousand people here. Double last year and they shared. We just got in from the keynote and they shared some interesting things. First of all, they IPOed just about four or five months ago. I think April 2018. They have presence in 190 countries. They have 75,000 customers. They've got users in half the Fortune 500. 90% of the Fortune 100. And a lot of momentum. What are some of the things that you're excited to learn about Smartsheet today? >> You know, I think it's kind of an interesting story. There's so many components of a lot of different work applications and we go to so many shows. We hear about a new way to work from IBM. One of my favorite lines of the year was actually from Google Cloud where you want to empower people to actually be, as you wrote it down, make judgements instead of drudgery. And these guys are all about that, but it's a little bit confusing 'cause they integrate with a lot of the other type of applications that people interact with at work. The big mentions of the Microsoft Suite, of 365, of Slack and some of those other tools. So what Smartsheet's tryin' to do is really roll those all up under kind of a unified view, parts of project management, parts of task management, a lot of pieces to really add that top level management. So I think it's a little bit of an interesting message. It's a lot of bits and pieces. We're used to that with theCUBE. We have three brands, so I kind of get it. So I'm lookin' forward to learning more about really how they kind of parse that out. >> I am as well 'cause you mention a number of other solutions who they both compete with, Microsoft Teams, JIRA under Atlassian. They also partner with them. And I'm curios to see an example and we've got three customers of theirs on the show today, Jeff. I'm interested to see that in action. If I am at an enterprise, and I am running a marketing project and I want to use Smartsheets, but I also need Slack for messaging, email for communication. I've got maybe another team I'm collaborating with that's using a different workflow automation platform. How does it actually work together? One of the interesting things, when CEO Mark Mader who's our first guest today, was with you in the studio in Palo Alto just a couple months ago, he was talking about the genesis of Smartsheet. And I also saw him say this in a press release when their IPO occurred back in April and said a lot of people, critics, in the very beginning 12 years ago said, you guys are nuts to go base this new technology, this new SaaS platform off of a spreadsheet model. But something interesting that he said is that, that's a construct that 400-500 million people understand. So this is another interesting element to me is that this is technology that's not, you don't have to know how to code or even what an API is. This is for the business users, the lines of business, IT, marketing, engineering, the facilities management. So it's really, it's got a broad spectrum of use cases that I'm also interested in hearing about today. >> It's funny on the worksheet as kind of a construct because we hear that all the time. Especially at all of our big data shows, right? Worksheets in Excel is still used by a lot of people for a significant amount of work. So people are familiar with it and they know how it works. I think they'll have to change that a little bit as they grow a little bit beyond that. Still a lot of conversation about rows and it sounded very spreadsheet centric in the keynote. And I think that'll evolve, but I think what's the most important thing, what I'm excited about, I say this time and time again. We go to so many shows, right? Everyone is struggling to find innovation. To me the answer is, one of the answers is kind of simple. You get more people, more access to more data with more tools to manipulate that data. And then most importantly, the power to do something about it. This was all about empowerment, empowerment, empowerment. Letting people, give 'em the information and then let them actually do something with it. That is so significant and it's kind of interesting. They had a Stephen Covey quote up on their as well that's kind of a similar thing. Taking it to the next step which is that's how you keep people happy, that's how you keep people engaged. Again, less drudgery, more judgment. Let them feel like they can actually make a difference versus just pushin' buttons and movin' paper along. >> Yeah, another theme that we heard a lot on the keynote this morning, Jeff, is about collaboration. And it really seems to me to be this message of symbiotic collaboration. They, Gene Farrell, who's going to be on the show with Jeff and I just in a few minutes or so, talked about, hey, customers we've heard you. You want more, and he actually got the crowd to chant, we want more, it was great. But when he was starting to talk about some of the new enhancements to the features. And yes, you're right, they're still talking about some, I don't want to say antiquated row structures and things like that, there were a number of times where the audience today broke into applause. So, not only are they delivering this SaaS platform to facilitate collaboration between teams at small organizations to big enterprises, they are also collaborating with their customers to continually innovate and improve their product. And I thought, something that I've never seen and we see a lot of keynotes, is that their CEO, Mark Mader, actually went into the audience during his session this morning and asked customers to stand up and talk about how Smartsheet is empowering them. And there were at least three different customers that stood up-- >> Right. >> and quite articulately spoke about how mostly qualitatively, but how their businesses or their team or their productivity is being improved. So this bidirectional collaboration, I thought was very palpable this morning. >> Right, which again I think is one of the huge benefits of the SaaS business model that is way underreported, not by us, we talk about it all the time. Is that if you have a recurring revenue model with your customer it forces you to be engaged. It forces you to deliver value. It forces you to innovate on an ongoing basis. It's not a ship and dump and then release. We'll come back in a year for our 15% maintenance. It's a very different way to go. Other really interesting things, they talked about recent events, Hurricane Florence in North Carolina. Happened to be a customer there able to aggregate and pull together a lot of information into these dashboards and that's something we hear about all the time. We'll hear about it more in the PayPal example. It was referenced in the keynote which is when you have to pull that data together for your weekly executive briefing, this promise of all these dashboards has always been there. Smartsheets is a little bit different because they want to be the primary way, but they want to integrate with all these other applications and other SaaS applications as well, so that you can create that user specific dashboard for the objective and you don't have to reassemble all that data every week for your weekly to roll up to the C-Suite. >> Yeah, and one of the things, speaking of customers, they had over 50 customers speaking at the event this week which is a lot. I was very impressed by that. >> Yeah, out of 2,000 registrants that's a big percentage. >> That is a big number. I think also some of the stats that Mark Mader showed were 1,100 companies are represented here from 20 countries. In fact, I also saw online that nearly a third of their revenue comes from outside the US and they actually don't have much presence outside the US at all. Outside of Converse.AI that they acquired based in Edinburgh, back in I think January of this year. But in terms of customers, the voice of the customer and that customer collaboration, we're also going to be talking to a gentleman who runs their customer success and partner success program. As you mentioned, the SaaS model being different, this isn't just check in every year and dial up the increase in subscription costs. So I'm curious what their new playbook is for customer success that they are developing and implementing or executing, that going to be their word, right? >> Right, right. >> Execution. Based on this new model and how customers want to be engaging with vendors. Ultimately they want things as simple as possible, so I'm curious to hear about how that customer success playbook here might be a differentiator against Atlassian, JIRA, Microsoft Team, and some of the other competitors. And also, how does it facilitate this breadth of collaboration? How does it enable them to collaborate with sales force and Amazon and Microsoft and Slack, for example? A lot of interesting points here and I'm hoping today what we're able to do is help put that together and sort of integrate this message. >> Should be a good day, looking forward to it. >> I think so. >> Our first time here. >> It is our first time. So stick around, Jeff and I are going to be live all day. We are again in Bellevue, Washington at the second annual Smartsheet Engage 2018. I'm Lisa Martin with Jeff Frick. Stick around, we're going to be right back with the CEO in just a minute. (high tech music)

>> Announcer: Live, from Orlando, Florida, it's theCUBE, covering ServiceNow Knowledge17. Brought to you by ServiceNow. >> We're back. This is Dave Vellante with Jeff Frick. Chris Bedi is here, he's the CIO of ServiceNow. Chris, good to see you again. >> Good to see you as well. >> Yeah, so, lot going on this week, obviously. You said you're getting pulled in a million different directions. One of those, of course, is the CIO event, CIO Decisions, it's something you guys host every year. I had the pleasure of attending parts of it last year. Listened to Robert Gates and some other folks, which was great. What's happened this year over there? >> So, CIO Decisions, it's really where we bring together our forward thinking executives. We keep it intimate, about a hundred, because really it's about the dialogue. Us all learning from each other. It really doesn't matter, the industry, I think we're all after the same things, which is driving higher levels of automation, increase the pace of doing business, and innovating at our companies. So we had Andrew McAfee, MIT research scientist, really helping push the boundaries in our imagination on where machine learning and predictive analytics could go. And then we had Daniel Pink talking about his latest book, To Sell is Human. And really as CIOs, we often find ourselves selling new concepts, new business models, new processes, new analytics, new ways of thinking about things. And so, really trying to help, call it exercise, our selling muscle, if you will. Because we have to sell across, up, down, and within our own teams, and that is a big part of the job. Because as we move into this new era, I think the biggest constraint is actually between our own ears. Our inability to imagine a future where machines are making more decisions than humans, platforms are doing more work on behalf of humans. Intellectually, we know we're headed there, but he really helped to bring it home. >> Well, you know, it's interesting, we talk about selling and the CIOs. Typically IT people aren't known as sales people, although a couple years ago I remember at one of the Knowledges, Frank Slootman sort of challenged the CIO to become really more business people, and he predicted that more business people would become CIOs. So, do you consider yourself a sales person? >> I do. Selling people on a vision, a concept, the promise of automation. You know, technology, people fear it, right? You know, when you're automating people's work the fear and the uncertainty endowed, or what I call the organizational anti-bodies, start to come out. So you have to bust through that, and a large part of that is selling people on a promise of a better future. But, it's got to be real. It's got to be tied to real business outcomes with numbers. It can't be just a bunch of PowerPoint slides. >> So we always like to take the messaging from the main tent and then test it with the practitioners, and this year there's this sort of overall theme of working at lightspeed, you and I have talked about this, how does that resonate with CIOs and how do you put meaning behind that? 'Cause, you know, working at lightspeed, it's like, ooh that sounds good, but how do you put meat on that bone? >> So, the way I think about working at lightspeed is three dimensions, velocity, intelligence, and experience. And velocity is how fast is your company operating? I read a study that said 40% of Fortune 500 companies are going to disappear in the next 10 years. That's almost half, right? But I think what's going to separate the winners from the losers is the pace at which they can adapt and transform. And, with every business process being powered by IT platforms, I think CIOs and IT are uniquely positioned to explicitly declare ownership of that metric and drive it forward. So velocity, hugely important. Intelligence. Evolving from the static dashboards we know today, to real time insights delivered in context that actually help the human make decisions. And, BI in analytics as we know it today, needs to evolve into a recommendation engine, 'cause why do we develop BI in analytics? To make decisions, right? So why can't the platform, and it can, is the short answer, with the ability to rapidly correlate variables and recognize complex patterns, give recommendations to the humans, and I would argue, take it a step further, make decisions for the humans. ServiceNow did a study that said 70% of CIOs believe machines will make more accurate decisions than humans, now we just got to get the other 30% there. And then on experience, I think the right experience changes our behavior. I think we in IT need to be in the business of creating insanely great customer and employee experiences. Too often we lead with the goal of cost reduction or efficiency, and I think that's okay, but if we lead with the goal of creating great experiences, the costs and the inefficiencies will naturally drop out. You can't have a great experience and have it be clunky and slow, it's just impossible. >> And it's interesting on the experience because the changing behavior is the hardest part of the whole equation. And I always think back to kind of getting people off an old solution. People used to say, for start ups, you got to be 10x better or 1/10th the cost. 2x, 3x is not enough to get people to make the shift. And so to get the person to engage with the platform as opposed to firing off the text, or firing off an email, or picking up the phone, it's got to be significantly better in terms of the return on their investment. So now they get that positive feedback loop and, ah, this is a much better way to get work done. >> It has to. And we can't, you know, bring down the management hammer and force people to do things. It's just not the way, you know, people work. And very simple example of an experience driving the right behavioral outcome, so ServiceNow is a software company, very important for us to file patents. The process we had was clunky and cumbersome. You know, we're not perfect at ServiceNow either. So we re-imagined that process, made it a mobile first experience built on our platform, of course. But by simply doing that, there was no management edict, you have to, no coercion, if you will, we saw an 83% increase in the number of patent applications filed by the engineers. So the right experience can absolutely give you the right desired economic behavior. >> You talked about 70% of CIOs believe that machines will make better decisions than humans. We also talked about Andrew McAfee, who wrote a book with Eric Brynjolfsson. And in that book, The Second Machine Age, they talked about that the greatest chess player in the world, when the supercomputer beat Garry Kasparov, he actually created this contest and they beat the supercomputer with a combination of man and other supercomputers. So do you see it as machine, sort of, intelligence augmenting human intelligence, or do you actually see it as machines are going to take over most of the decisions. >> So, I actually think they are going to start to take over some basic decision making. The more complex ones, the human brain, plus a machine, is still a more, you know, advanced, right? Where it's better suited to make that decision. But I also think we need to challenge ourselves in what we call a decision. I think a lot of times, what we call a decision, it's not a decision. We're coming to the same conclusion over and over and over again, so if a computer looked at it, it's an algorithm. But in our brains, we think a human has to be involved and touch it. So I think it's a little bit, it'll challenge us to redefine what's actually a decision which is complex and nuanced, versus we're really doing the same thing over and over again. >> Right, and you're saying the algorithm is a pattern that repeats itself and leads to an action that a machine can do. >> Yeah. >> It doesn't require intuition >> And we don't call that a decision anymore. >> Right, right. So, in thinking about you gave us sort of the dimensions of lightspeed, what are some of the new metrics that will emerge as a result of this thinking? >> Yeah, I don't think any of the old metrics go away. I'll talk about a few. You know, in lightspeed, working at lightspeed, we need to start measuring, for one, back on that velocity vector, what is the percentage of processes in your company that have a cycle time of zero, or near zero. Meaning it just happens instantaneously. We can think of loads of examples in our consumer life. Calling a car with Uber, there's no cycle time on that process, right? So looking at what percentage of your processes have a cycle time of zero. How much work are you moving to the machines? What percentage of the work is the platform proactively executing for you? Meaning it just happens. I also think in an IT context of percentage of self healing events, where the service never goes down because it's resilient enough and you have enough automation and intelligence. But there are events, but the infrastructure just heals itself. And I think, you know, IT itself, we've long looked at IT as a percentage of revenue. I think with all of the automation and cost savings and efficiencies we drive throughout the enterprise, we need to be looking at IT as a margin contribution vehicle. And when we change that conversation, and start measuring ourselves in terms of margin, I think it changes the whole investment thesis, in IT. >> So that's interesting. Are you measured on margin contribution? >> We're doing that right now. I don't, if an IT organization is waiting for the CFO or CEO to ask them about their margin contribution, they're playing defense. I think IT needs to proactively measure all of it's contributions and express it in terms of margin. 'Cause that's the language the CEO, and COO, and CFO are talking about, so meet them in a language that they understand better. >> So how do you do, I mean, you certainly can create some kind of conceptual value flow. IT supports this sort of business process and this business process drives this amount of revenue or margin. >> So I stay away from revenue, because I think any time IT stands up and says, we're driving revenue, it's really hard. Because there's so many external and internal factors that contribute to that. So we more focus on automation, in terms of hours saved, expressing and dollarizing that. Hard dollars, that we're able to take out of the organization and then bubbling that into an operating margin number. >> Okay, so you sort of use the income statement below the revenue line to guide you and then you fit into that framework. >> Absolutely. >> When you talk to other CIOs about this, do they say, hey, that sounds really interesting, how do I get started on that, or? >> I think it resonates really well, because, again, IT as percentage of revenue is an incredibly incomplete metric to measure our contribution. With everything going digital, you want to pour more money into technology. I mean, studies have shown, and Andrew McAfee talked about this, over the last 50, 100 years, the companies that have thrived have poured more, disproportionally more, into technology and innovation than their competitors. So, if we only measure the cost side of the equation we're doing ourselves a disservice. >> And so, how do you get started on this path, I mean, let's call this path, sort of, what we generally defined as lightspeed, measured on margin, how do you get started on that? >> First step is the hardest. But, it's declaring that your going to do it. So we've come up with a framework, you know, that maps at a process level, at a department level, and at a company level, where are we on this journey to lightspeed? If lightspeed is the finish line, where are we? And I define three stages, manual, automated, cloud, before you get to lightspeed. And then, using those same three dimensions of velocity, intelligence, and experience, to tell you where you are. And, the very first thing we did was baseline all of our business processes, every single one, and mapped it. But once you have it mapped on that framework then you can say, how do we advance the ball to the next level? And, it's not going to magically happen overnight. This is hard work. It's going to happen one process at a time, right? But pretty soon everything starts to get faster and I think things will start to really accelerate. >> When you think about, sort of, architecting IT, at ServiceNow versus some other company, I mean, you come into ServiceNow as the CIO, everything runs on ServiceNow, that is part of the mandate, right? But that's not the mandate at every company, now increasingly may be coming that way in a lot of companies, but how is your experience at ServiceNow differ from the some of the traditional G2000? >> Probably the unique part about being the CIO at ServiceNow is actually really fun, in that I get to be customer zero in that I implement our products before all of our customers. You know, get to sit down with the product managers, discuss real business problems that all of our customers are facing, and hopefully be their voice inside the four walls of service now, and be the strategic partner to the product organization. Now implementing everything, our goal is to be the best possible implementation of ServiceNow on the planet. And that's not just demonstrated by go lives, it's demonstrated by, again, the economic and business outcomes we're deriving from using the platform. So, that part is fun, challenging, and hard work all at the same time. >> So how's Jakarta lookin'? >> Fantastic. We're super excited about everything that's coming out, whether it's the communities on customer service, or our software asset management. That's been a pain, right, for IT organizations for a long time, which is these inbound software audits, from other companies, and you're responding to them and it's a fire drill. In my mind, our software asset management transforms software audits from a once a year, twice a year event, to always-on monitoring, where you're just fixing it the whole time. And it's not an event anymore. I mean, the intelligence that we're baking into the platform now, super exciting around the machine learning and the predictive analytics concepts, we have more analytics than we had before, I mean there's just so much in there, that's just exciting. We're already using it, I can't wait for our customers to get a hold of it. >> Well, CJ this morning threw out a number of 30-plus percent performance improvement. I had said to myself, your saying that with conviction, that's 'cause you guys got to be running it yourselves. >> Yeah, we are. >> What are you seeing there? >> That's not a trivial number, and I think the product teams have done a great job really digging in and makin' sure our platform operates at lightspeed. >> One of the things that Jeff and I have been talking about this week, and really this is your passion here, is adoption, how do you get people to stop using all these other tools like email, and kind of get them to use the system? >> I think, showing them the promise of what it can bring. I think it's different conversations at different levels. I think, too, an operator, someone who's using the email to manage their work, they're hungry for a different solution. Life, working, and email, and managing your business that way, it's hard, right? To a mid-level manager, I think the conversation is maybe about the experience, how consumers of their service will be happier and more satisfied. At executive level, it gets maybe more into some of the economic outcomes, of doing it. Because implementing our platform, you know, you're going to burn some calories doing it, not a lot. Our time to value is really really quick, but still, it's a project and it's initiative and it's got to have an outcome tied to it. >> You know, Chris, as you're saying that it's always tough to be stuck kind of half way. You know, you're kind of on the tool internally and it's great. >> We don't use the word tool. >> Excuse me, not the tool. The app, the platform, actually. But then you still got external people that are coming at you through text, email, et cetera. I mean, is part of the vision, and maybe it's already there, I'm not as familiar with the parts I should be, in terms of enabling kind of that next layer of engagement with that next layer of people outside the four walls, to get more of them in it as well. Because the half-pregnant stage is almost more difficult because you're going back and forth between the two. >> And our customer service product does a lot of that. If you look at what Abhijit showed today, which is fantastic, Communities is another modality to start to interact with people. Certainly, we have Connect, part of our platform, is a collaboration app within the overall platform, so you can chat, just like you would with any consumer app, in terms of chatting capabilities, and that mobile first experience. We're thinking about other modalities too. Should you be able to talk to ServiceNow, just like you talk to Alexa, and converse with ServiceNow, Farrell touched on this a little bit, through natural language, right? We all know it's coming, and it's there, it's just pushing in that direction. >> How about the security piece? You know, Shawn shared this morning, you guys are well over year in now, and he talked about that infamous number of 200 plus days-- >> Chris: Nine months, yeah. >> Yeah, compressing that. Are you seeing that internally in your own? >> We are. We use Shawn's product, we're a happy customer. The vulnerability management, the security incident response, and very very similar results. And just like the customer who was on stage said, go live in Iterate, and that's exactly what we did. Everyone has a vulnerability management tool, like a Qualys, that's feeding in. Bring in all those Qualys alerts, our platform will help you normalize them and just start to reduce the level of chaos for the SOC and IT operations. Then make it better, then drive the automation, so we're seeing very similar benefits. >> How do you manage the upgrade side, we've been asking a lot of customers this week in the upgrade cycle. Some say, ah, I'll do in minus one just to sort of let the thing bake a little bit. You guys are in plus one. How do you manage that in production, though? >> Sure, so we upgrade before our customers, and that's part of our job, right? To make sure we test it out before our customers. But I'll say something in general about enterprise software upgrades, which is, there is a cost to them and the cost is associated with business risk. You want to make sure you're not going to disrupt your business. There is some level of regression testing you just have to do. Now, strategies I think that would be wise are automating as much of that testing as you can, through a testing framework, which we're helping our customers do now. And I think with some legacy platforms, that was incredibly expensive and hard and you could never quite get there. Us being a modern cloud platform, you can actually get there pretty quickly to the point where the 80, 90% of your regression testing is automated and you're doing that last 10 to 20%. 'Cause at the end of the day, IT needs to make sure the enterprise is up and running, that's job number one. But that's a strategy we employ to make upgrades as painless as possible. >> That's got to be compelling to a lot of the customers that you talk to, that notion of being able to automate the upgrade process. >> For sure, it is. >> You're eliminating a lot of time and they count that as money. >> It is money, and automating regression testing, it's a decision and a strategy but the investment pays off very very quickly. >> Dave: So there's an upfront chunk that you have to do to figure out how to make that work? >> Just like anything worth doing. >> Dave: Yeah, right. >> Right? >> Excellent. What's left for you at the show? >> What's left for me? I love interacting with customers. I got to talk with a lot of CIOs at CIO Decisions. I actually enjoy walking through the partner pavilion and meeting a lot of our partners and seeing some of the innovation that their driving on the platform. And then just non-stop, I get ideas all day from meeting with customers. It's so fun. >> Dave: Chris, thanks very much for coming to theCube. >> Thank you. >> We appreciate seeing you again. >> Chris: Good seeing you. >> Alright, keep it right there everybody. Jeff and I will be back with our next guest. This is theCube, we're live from Knowledge17. We'll be right back.

>> Narrator: Live from Orlando Florida, it's theCUBE! Covering ServiceNow, Knowledge17. Brought to you by ServiceNow. >> Hi everybody, we're back. This is theCUBE and we're live from Knowledge17, I'm Dave Vellante with Jeff Frick. Michael Dippolito, did I say that right? >> D'Ippolito, close enough. >> D'Ippolito, sorry about that. A fellow Italian, I should get that right. D'Ippolito is assistant Vice President of Run Services Delivery, infrastructure and operations for Nationwide Insurance. Nationwide is on your side. >> You got it. It's in our heads right? >> I remember that. >> What a great marketing campaign. Michael, great to see you, thanks for coming on theCUBE. >> Thank you, thanks for having me. >> So how's Knowledge going for ya? >> Very good, very good. I'm really excited about some of the new things coming out with the newest release that was just announced this morning. And as a matter of fact I'm ready to go back and say let's jump to that version right? Because it sounds really exciting. >> So where are you right now? Which version are you on? Are you on the Helsinki? >> We are on the Helsinki release now. We usually like to jump a couple and stay as current as we can, usually you know one release behind maybe but if we find there's good functionality in jumping one we'll do it. >> I want to come back and talk about that, because we like to pick your brains about what's the best practice there, but before we do maybe set up your role at Nationwide. >> Yeah, RunService is a pretty large organization for Nationwide, through acquisitions and through our legacy environments, we have lots of application systems, you know, keeping all those running is a monumental task. So, our group is kind of sitting mainly in the middle of the applications, the infrastructure, the process, and trying to help everything stay running smoothly. >> Okay and you started with IT service management change management, like most customers, is that right? And then, you've been evolving that. Can you talk about that a little bit? >> Yeah we just implemented, about a year ago actually, we installed a year ago. >> Okay. >> We went with the Fuji release that we implemented then we've already jumped to Helsinki, and we pretty much went all processes all at once and kind of a big bang. We actually did ask that management at first does a little bit of a pilot, but then we actually went through all the other ITSM functionality, big bang after that. >> Jeff: So you're all in. >> Michael: Yeah. >> So what was life like, you know, give us a before and after, and maybe take us through the business case and how that all came about. >> I'll give you a perfect example, I just kind of did an after action review for our senior management, on our previous platform, which was an on prem heavily customized platform, to take a release would require a year and a half with a lot of planning and about a million dollars. >> Jeff: To do an upgrade. >> To do an upgrade. (Jeff Laughing) This last release to Helsinki went about six weeks, and about $100,000. So, that's a huge business case right there. Being able to be in the cloud, not having to worry about the infrastructure ourselves, and really we drove a model of zero customization so we wanted to stay out of box as much as possible, just for that reason so we could take releases fast and stay current. >> Wow, I'm sure that benefits. >> In the, you know, was situtation, the cost was predominantly people cost, programming cost, license cost, maintenance, consultants? >> It was mostly hours of effort. >> Yeah. >> The amount of customization we had and then to retrofit and test all those changes back into the release from the vendor was a monumental task and we never want to get into that situation again. >> And so with the ServiceNow upgrade, it's not out of pocket cost as much, you're quantifying time, is that correct? >> Correct. >> Yeah okay. >> It's mostly our internal cost. >> You said the time it took was a year and a half and then, like a typical upgrade in ServiceNow is, >> Michael: Less than two months. >> Okay. >> For us to bring it in test it, exercise it, making sure all our customizations, or configurations actually I should say, are working well. And a lot of it is more just the change management around it, you know, putting out the word, the communications, doing a little bit of training, or whatever it takes to get ready for a smooth launch. >> And some of the upfront planning of that as well. Now, when we talk to customers, there seems to be, we heard today that 90% of customers are adopting service catalog, CMDB, I don't know. It's mixed, right? We hear some yes, some no. Maybe tell us your experiences. >> We have a huge focus on CMDB right now. We think that CMDB is basically the foundation to all your other processes to run more smoothly right? So good trustworthy data enables faster incident resolution, better problem solving, more rigorous change management so you asses your risk of change better. So really when we sold our CMDB project, we didn't sell it based on the CMDB, we sold it based on all those other things, >> All the benefits. >> That get a ramp off of it. You know, from doing that effort. So, we're putting a lot of effort on CMDB maturity. >> So you were talking before about some of the things you saw today in Jakarta that were of interest before we go there, you had mentioned you started with Fuji, and now you're on Helsinki. What was the, you didn't double leapfrog did you? Or did you? What's your upgrade strategy? You said you might be an N minus one, but you like to stay pretty current. What's your strategy in regards to upgrades? >> Right now, we're looking at trying to be N minus one >> Uh huh. >> and taking two per year. So looking at two releases a year. We're trying to plan our schedules around maybe spring and fall. So we organize our work and our patterns around that. But something like that. We haven't really solidified that yet. A lot of it depends on what we see coming up, and what we can take advantage of. Like for example, we're getting ready to implement Work Day. And we want to make sure we have great integration between Work Day and ServiceNow. Some of the things that Jakarta is going to offer us is going to integrate nicely into Work Day. So, we may jump to that version because of that. >> So we heard this morning that the big things, well CJ set up the big things in Jakarta were going to be performance, obviously everybody better performance, maybe some UX stuff in there too, vendor risk management, and then the software asset management, which got the big cheers and the whoohoo! >> Yeah. (Jeff chuckling) >> Yeah, so, what in Jakarta is appealing to you? >> This software as a management I'd say, is very interesting because we're looking at that very closely right now in terms of our strategy around that. The other one I really like is the performance analytics and the predictive analytics that are coming out. I'd really love to be able to benchmark ourselves against other companies in terms of how we're doing. I feel we beat ourselves up a lot internally around things like availability or performance. But then, when I look and talk to others, we're not so bad. (Jeff chuckling) We're actually doing pretty good. So it'd be nice to get that benchmarking. >> Right, right. >> And some of that trend analysis that's offered. And then, finally, how do we get into a more predictive analytics mode where we can prevent incidents from happening before they do? So that's key. >> It was interesting, listening to Farrell Hough this morning talk about sort of the evolution of automation. How do you look at automation? Some shops are afraid of automation, but it seems like the ServiceNow customers we talk to really can't go fast enough. What is your thought, and how are you evolving automation? >> Well, one of our key drivers right now is how do we increase the speed of delivery to the marketplace? But, we also have to stay safe and reliable, right? And the key to speed is through automation. You can't really get that speed if you're not highly automated. And, to be highly automated, you need really high trustworthy data. So that enables fast decision making, and accuracy. >> Jeff: And that ties back to your CMDB commitment. >> Exactly, so, that all entailed enables speed, which we really want because in today's world speed is everything in terms of how you're constantly adapting your systems of engagement out there with your customers. Constantly learning from their patterns and adjusting on the fly. And that requires new mindsets. >> So you start with IT service management, you've got HR as well, is that right? >> We don't have the HR model. Right now we're only IT service management. >> Okay, straight IT services. >> We're looking at other modules, as we speak. >> Okay, so you want to make sure you get the value out of the initial ITSM, and then, how do you see that, you know, evolving? What is the conversation like internally? Do the business lines say, wow, all of a sudden we're getting improved service, and how are you doing that? Or is it more of a push where you go out to the business and say hey, here are some ideas. How does that all work? >> I'll tell you what we're really starting to see is a really change in what's driving innovation. And it's more coming from IT versus, the former models where IT was kind of like the order taker, and the business came up with everything they needed. Now, with the pace of change with technology, new business models are coming from IT to the business. And we're actually almost seeing ourselves more of an IT company than we are an insurance company. And, you starting to see those patterns especially with things like, now we're talking about metered insurance for auto, right? So basically, pay by the mile insurance, versus paying the same rate for six months. With the data we're getting out of vehicles today we can adjust your rates on the fly as you drive. Why should you pay the same rate if your car sits in the garage all weekend, versus you take it out and drive it 200 miles, right? So with the kind of data, big data and analytics that are coming from the vehicles we can do that now. >> So how is that conversation taking place? Is it being initiated by somebody in the IT staff that says hey, did you know that we have this data and we can do this? Let's take it to the business unit. Or does the business unit saying, I just saw Flo, the competitor, sticking the little thing in the dashboard? (Michael chuckling) Can we do that too? You know, there's a lot of talk about IT taking a seat at the business table >> Right. >> But how have you seen it actually been executed inside of Nationwide? >> Actually what we're seeing is, the lines are very blurry now between IT and the business. Almost to where, we're just a team working together versus the silos you used to have, and throwing the ideas over the fence. So we actually have a team that their goal is strategy and innovation. They report up through our CIO, and then business line teams have similar organizations, and they all work in a matrix fashion together. So anybody can bring any type of idea to the table, regardless of who you report up through. And we take those into consideration and we look for partners, we've got partners coming to us all the time that want to join us in innovation. And so it doesn't have to be our own solution. It could just be us on the back end of somebody else's front end, right? So, there's a lot of interesting ideas coming at us. >> What's happening in the business Mike? I mean you've got, obviously you're supporting the big systems or claims, you've got your agents systems, but mobile has exploded onto the scene. >> Yes. >> How has that affected you? What are some of the drivers in the insurance business these days? >> Well, definitely we're in this digital world now so, mobile first is critical. Everything has to be mobile enabled. We have to think of our strategy in a digital way constantly so we have a whole digital strategy that we work on. The traditional models of agency sold insurance won't ever really go away, per se, but they are shrinking. You see the demands and needs of the millennials coming up, very differently and changing. You have to compete on price to get in the door. That's important, so again we're trying to find all those interaction or intercept points with our customers as they need us. People don't really like to think of insurance, it's not on top of mind in their day to day life. But, when certain events happen like oh, I'm going to get married, or I'm going to take a trip, or you know, those kinds of things. >> Jeff: Right, kid turns sixteen. >> Yeah, we have different ways to interact with our customers, and offer some solutions that meet their need at the time. >> Well it seems like you're right, to be competitive, you've got to have the right price for those that say okay, I've got to get insurance, I need to start somewhere, great, but are you able to, as an industry, sell value? I mean, increasingly you're seeing some companies I would say Nationwide is one, where you're selling value. >> Yeah. >> Is that a trend in the business? >> Absolutely, I'll give you an example. One of the things that, normally the insurance model used to be I buy insurance and I'm protected when something bad happens. then when something bad happens, you compensate me. You pay my claim. But what about, if we can help you prevent the bad thing from even happening? So with products like our Smart Home package that you can buy now with internet of things, we can put sensors on those hot water tanks or on those pipes, or connected to your alarm system so that maybe we could alert you when we see your pipe is about to break. >> Right so, we cover, as you know our audience, we cover big data a lot. And the data business, and the insurance business have come mashing together, right? You had mentioned before, Mike, in many regards you're becoming an IT company and digitization is all about data. And the data allows you guys to build new products, to offer new services, to be more competitive and at the end of the day it's all about speed. >> Correct, speed and then that helps drive that value equation, right? So it's not so much being the lowest price, although you have to have a good price to be in the game, but then after that how can you provide that value? >> I'm curious Mike, from an insurance point of view, where before the business was based on, you know you didn't have so much data, right? So you had some big swaths, Age, sex, smoker, not smoker, but now as you're able to get data to the individual level, how that changes the way you look at it? Because it's very different than just kind of aggregating to the bulk, and then the poor unfortunate soul who has a car wreck, you pay the claim. But now, like you said, you know if I'm driving on the weekends, or if I'm parking my car. How is that really shaping the way that you guys look at the marketplace and the opportunities? >> Well you know, in the old days, you used to be able to take basically a subset of data from the past, and make your decisions based on that. >> A subset of data from the past, I love that. >> Now we're taking all the data in real time. >> In real time. >> So that puts more demands on the need for the technologies to provide that. It's critical, like especially if we're going to change your rates daily on how we insure your car, we have to have all the data, all the time. >> I remember Abhi Mehta, one of our early big data CUBE interviews, he made the statement in 2010 he said, "Sampling is dead." And, now, some people will debate that but the point he was making is just the same one you just made Michael is that you've got that data coming in, streaming it in real time. Some consumers, you know, have an issue with sticking that little meter in their car, but ultimately, that's the trend. It's going to happen. >> And you know we're seeing, and you're probably seeing it in other businesses as well, if you can provide that value, customers will give you the access and the data, because they see a value in return. So, it's that value equation. If it's good enough, they'll give you the value, and they'll give you the data. >> Dave: Yeah, you see it every day in mobile apps, right? >> Correct. >> You know, you're in New York City trying to get somewhere and it's like, turn on location services and I can help you. >> When you download any app, there's a big screen that comes up and you say I accept at the bottom, and then it has access to your pictures, access to your location and you're free to hit that accept because you see the value in that application. >> It's a quid pro quo, you know it's interesting we had the author on yesterday, Pink, Daniel Pink? >> Jeff: Pink, Mr. Pink, yes. >> And he was pointing out, he said look there used to be that the brand used to have all the information, and now there's parody in information, but in many regards, this whole digitization is an attempt by the brand to provide, to use more data and to give the consumers more value, and to create differentiation in the marketplace, and that's kind of what you're describing in your business. Last question, what's on ServiceNow's to-do list? What do you want to see a year, year and a half in? >> Well, after we implemented, we partnered with ServiceNow in a project they call Inspire, and basically it's to, what are we going to do next? You know, that very question, how do we leverage now what we've implemented, and take advantage of what the platform has to offer? We see lots of opportunities, as a matter of fact our list is so long we just don't have the bandwidth to do it all (Jeff chuckling) and we have to prioritize, but we see a lot of integration points, we see a lot of APIs coming in, we are in a kind of a really big phase in automation right now, we're trying to automate as much as possible, so for our on prem technology, we really want to go into automated provisioning of our assets, which means being able to connect those into the CMDB as they're provisioned, all automatically, and we want to really shorten those cycle times for when we have to provision infrastructure and support our applications. So ServiceNow is setting us up to do just that. >> Inspire is a great program, it's one of the best freebies in the business, and it leads, it's a win win. The customer gets the best experts, they come in and obviously, the hope is they're going to buy more stuff from ServiceNow, and if the value's there you will. Why not? It's going to drive to the bottom line. >> Using cloud to provision on prem resources, I like that. (all laughing) >> Mike thanks very much for coming to theCUBE, it was really a pleasure having you. >> Thank you, thanks for having me. >> Jeff: Thanks for sharing the insight. >> Alright keep it right there buddy we'll be back with our next guest right after this short break, there's a CUBEr live from Knowledge, be right back. (techno music)

>> Man's Voice: Live from Orlando, Florida, it's theCUBE covering ServiceNow Knowledge17, brought to you by ServiceNow. >> Welcome back to Orlando, everybody. This is theCUBE, the leader in live tech coverage. We go out to the events, we extract a signal from the noise. My name is Dave Vellante, and I'm here with my co-host, Jeff Frick. This is theCUBE's fifth year covering Knowledge. We started in Las Vegas, a little small event, Jeff, at Aria Hotel, and it's exploded from 3,500 all the way up to 15,000 people here in Orlando at the Convention Center. This is day two of our three day coverage. And, we heard this morning, you know, day one was the introduction of the new CEO, John Donahoe, taking over the reins for Frank Slootman. And, actually it was interesting, Jeff. Last night, we went around to some of the parties and talked to some of the folks and some of the practitioners. It was interesting to hear how many people were saying how much they missed Fred. >> Right, right. >> And the culture of fun and kind of zaniness and quirkiness that they sort of have, and there's some of that that's maintained here. We saw that in the keynotes this morning, and we'll talk about that a little bit, but what are your impressions of sort of that transition from, you know, really the third phase now we're into of ServiceNow leadership? >> Right, well as was commented again last night at some of the events, you know, a relatively peaceful transition, right. So, the difference between an evolution and a revolution is people die in revolutions. This was more of an evolution. It was an organized handoff, and a lot of the product leaders are relatively new. We just saw CJ Desai. He said he's only 100 days ahead of where John is at 45 days. So, it is kind of a, I don't know if refresh is the right word, but all new leadership in a lot of the top positions to basically go from, as been discussed many times, from kind of the one billion dollar mark to the four billion dollar mark, and then, of course, onward to the 10. So, it sounds like everyone is very reverent to the past, and Fred has a huge following. He's one of our favorite guest. The guy's just a super individual. People love him. That said, you know, it's a very clear and focused move to the next stage in evolution of growth. >> Well, I think that, you know, Fred probably, I mean, he may have said something similar to this either in theCUBE or sort of in back channel conversations with us, is, you know, ServiceNow, when they brought in Frank Slootman, it needed adult supervision. And, Fred doesn't strike me as the kind of person that's going to be doing a lot of the, you know, HR functions and performance reviews and stuff. He wants to code, right. I mean, that was his thing. And, now, we're seeing sort of this next level of ascension for ServiceNow, and you seen the advancement of their product, their platform. So this morning, CJ Desai kicked off the keynotes. Now, CJ Desai was an executive in the security business. He was an executive at EMC, hardcore product guy. He's a hacker. You heard him this morning saying when he was at a previous company, he didn't mention EMC, but that's what he was talking about, I'm pretty sure. They use ServiceNow, and when ServiceNow started recruiting him, he said I opened up an instance and started playing around with it, and see if I could develop an app, and I was amazed at how easy it was. And, they started talking to some of the customers and seeing how passionate they were about this platform, and it became an easy decision for him to, you know, come and run. He's got a big job here. He run, he's basically, you know, manages all products, essentially taking over for Fred Luddy and, you know, Dan McGee as a chief operating officer even though he hasn't used that title 'cause he's a product guy. But, all the GMs report up into him, so he is the man, you know, on top of the platform. So, he talked this morning about Jakarta, the announcement, and the key thing about, you know, that I'm learning really in talking to ServiceNow over the years, is they put everything in the platform, and then the business units have to figure out how to leverage that new capability, you know, whether it's machine learning or AI or some kind of new service catalog or portal. The business units, whether it's, you know, the managers, whether it's Farrell Hough and her team, she does IT service management, Abhijit Mitra who does customer service management, the IT operations management people, the HR folks, they have to figure out how they can take the capabilities of this platform, and then apply it to their specific use cases and industry examples. And, that's what we saw a lot of today. >> But, it's still paper-based workflow, right? 'Cause back to Fred's original vision, which I love repeating about, the copy room with all the pigeonholes of colored paper that you would grab for I need a new laptop, I need a vacation request, I need whatever, which nobody remembers anymore. But, you know, at the end of the day, it's put in a request, get it approved, does it need to be worked, and then executed. So, whether that's asking for a new laptop for a new employee, whether that's getting a customer service ticket handled, whether it's we're swinging by doing name changes, it's relatively simple process under the covers, and then now, they're just wrapping it with this specific vocabulary and integration points to the different systems to support that execution. So, it's a pretty straightforward solution. What I really like about ServiceNow is they're applying, you know, technology to relatively straightforward problems that have huge impact and efficiency, and just getting away from email, getting away from so many notification systems that we have, getting away from phone calls, getting away from tech-- Trying to aggregate that into one spot, like we see it a lot of successful applications, sass applications. So, now you've got a single system of record for the execution of these relatively straightforward processes. >> Yeah, it really is all about a new way to work, and with the millennial work force becoming younger, obviously, they're going to work in a different way. I saw, when I tweeted out, was the best IT demo that I'd ever seen. Didn't involve a laptop, didn't involve a screen. What Chris Pope did, who's kind of an evangelist, he's in the CSO office, he was on... the chief strategy office, he was on yesterday. He came up with a soccer ball. Right, you saw it. And, he said >> Football. Make sure you say it right. He would correct you. (Jeff laughs) >> And, he said for those of you who are not from the colonies, this is a football. And then, he had somebody in a new employee's t-shirt, he had the HR t-shirt, the IT t-shirt, the facilities t-shirt, and they were passing the ball around, and he did a narrative on what it was like to onboard a new employee, and the back and forth and the touch points and, you know, underscoring the point of how complex it is, how many mistakes can be made, how frustrating it is, how inefficient it is, and then, obviously, setting up conveniently the morning of how the workflow would serve us now. But, it was a very powerful demo, I thought. >> Well, the thing that I want to get into, Dave, is how do you get people to change behavior? And, we talk about it all the time in theCUBE. People process in tech. The tech's the easy part. How do you change people's behavior? When I have to make that request to you, what gets me to take the step to do it inside of service now versus sending you that email? It seems to me that that's the biggest challenge, and you talk about it all the time, is we get kind of tool-creep in all these notification systems and, you know, there's Slack and there's Atlassian JIRA and there's Salesforce and there's Dropbox and there's Google Docs and, you know, the good news is we're getting all these kind of sass applications that, ultimately, we're seeing this growth of IPA's in between them and integration between them, but, on the bad side, we get so many notifications from so many different places. You know, how do you force really a compliance around a particular department to use a solution, as we say that, that's what's on your desk all the time, and not email? And, I think that's, I look forward to hearing kind of what are best practices to dictate that? I know that Atlassian, internally, they don't use email. Everything is on JIRA. I would presume in ServiceNow, it's probably very similar where, internally, everything is in the ServiceNow platform, but, unfortunately, there's those pesky people outside the organization who are still communicating with email. So, then you get, >> Exactly. >> Then, now, you're running kind of a parallel track as you're getting new information from a customer that's coming in maybe via email that you need to, then, populate into those tickets. That's the part I see as kind of a challenge. >> Well, I think it is a big challenge. And, of course, when you talk to ServiceNow people privately and you say to them, "Have you guys eliminated email?" Then, they roll their eyes and "I wish." (Jeff chuckles) But, I would presume their internal communications, as you say, are a lot more efficient and effective. But, you know, it's a Cloud app, and Cloud apps suffer from latency issues. And, it's like when you go into a Cloud app, you know, you log in. A lot of times, it logs you out just for security reasons, so you got to log back in and you get the spinning logo for awhile. You finally get in and then, you got to find what you want to do, and then you do it. And, it's a lot slower just from an elapse time standpoint than, actually not from an elapse time. So, from an initiation standpoint, getting something off your desk, it's slower. The elapse time is much more efficient. >> Jeff: Right, right. >> And so, what I think ends up happening is people default to the simple email system. It's a quick fix. And then, it starts the cycle of hell. But, I think you're making a great point about adoption. How do you improve that adoption? One of the things that ServiceNow announced this morning, is that roughly 30% improvement in performance, right. So, people complain about performance like any Cloud-based application, and it's hard. You know, when you even when you use, you know, look at LinkedIn. A lot of times, you get a LinkedIn request, and you go, "I'll check it later." You don't want to go through the process of logging in. Everybody's experienced that. It's one of those >> Right, right. >> Sort of heavy apps, and so, you just say, "Alright, I'll figure it out later." And, Facebook is the same thing. And, no doubt, that ServiceNow, certainly Salesforce, similar sort of dynamics 'cause it's a Cloud-based app. And so, hitting performance hard, as you say, the culture of leaving it on your desk. The folks at Nutanix, Dheeraj is telling me they essentially run their communications in Slack. (chuckles) and so, >> Right. >> You know, they'll hit limits there, I'm sure, as well, but everybody's trying to find a new way to work, and this is something that I know is a passion of yours, because the outcome is so much better if you can eliminate email trails and threads and lost work. >> Right. And, we're stuck now in this, in the middle phase which is just brutal 'cause you just get so many notifications from so many different applications. How do you prioritize? How do you keep track? Oh my God, did you ping me on Slack? Did you ping me on a text? Did you ping me on a email? I don't even know. The notification went away, went off my phone. I don't even know which one it came through its difficulty. The good news is that we see in sass applications and, again, it's interesting. Maybe just 'cause I was at AWS summit recently. I just keep thinking AWS, and in terms of the efficiency that they can bring to bear, that resources they can bring to bear around CP utilization, storage utilization, security execution, all those things that they can do as a multi-vendor, Cloud-based application, and apply to their Cloud in support of their customers on their application, will grow and grow and grow, and quickly surpass what most people would do on their own 'cause they just don't have the resources. So, that is a huge benefit of these Cloud-based applications and again, as the integration points get better, 'cause we keep hearin' it 'cause you got some stuff in Dropbox, you got some stuff in Google Docs, you got some stuff in Salesforce. That's going to be interesting, how that plays out, and will it boil back down to, again, how many actual windows do you have open that you work with on your computer. Is it two? Is it three? Is it four? Not many more than that, and it can't be. >> Yeah, so today here at Knowledge, it's a big announcement day. You're hearing from all the sort of heads of the businesses. Jakarta is the big announcement. That's the new release of the platform. Kingston's coming, you know, later on this year. ServiceNow generally does two a year, one in the spring summer, one in the fall, kind of early winter. And, Jakarta really comprises performance improvement, a new security capability where, I thought this was very interesting, where you have all these vendors that you're trying to interact with, and you tryin' to figure out, okay, "What do I integrate with "in terms of my third party vendors, and who's safe?" You know, and "Do they comply "to my corpoetics?" >> Right, right. >> And, ServiceNow introducing a module in Jakarta which going to automate that whole thing, and simplify it. And then, the one, the big one was software asset management. Every time you come to a conference like Knowledge, and you get this at Splunk too, the announcements that they make, they're not golf claps. You'd get hoots and woos and "Yes" and people standing up. >> Jeff: That was that and that was the one, right? >> Software SM Management was the one. >> Jeff: (chuckles) put a big star on that one. >> Now, let's talk about this a little bit because they mentioned in, they didn't mention Oracle, but this is a bit pain point of a lot of Oracle customers, is audits, software audits. >> Jeff: Right, right. >> And, certainly Oracle uses software audits as negotiating leverage, and clients customers don't really know what they have, what the utilization is, do they buy more licenses even though they could repurpose licenses. They just can't keep track of all that stuff, and so, ServiceNow is going to do it for ya. So, that's a pretty big deal and, obviously, people love that. As I said, 30% improvement in performance. And, yeah, this software asset management thing, we're going to talk to some people about that and see what their-- >> But, they got the big cheer. >> What their expectation is. >> The other thing that was interesting on the product announcement, is using AI. Again, I just love password reset as an example 'cause it's so simple and discrete, but still impactful about using AI on relatively, it sounds like, simple processes that are super high ROI, like auto-categorization. You know, let the machine do auto-categorization and a lot of these little things that make a huge difference in productivity to be able to find and discover and work with this data that you're now removing the people from it, and making the machine, the better for machine processes handled by the machine. And, we see that going all through the application, a lot of the announcements that were made. So, it's not just AI for AI, but it's actually, they call it Intelligent Automation, and applying it to very specific things that are very fungible and tangible and easy to see, and provide direct ROI, right out of the gate. >> Well, this auto-categorization is something that, I mean, it's been a vexing problem in the industry for years. I mentioned yesterday that in 2006 with the federal rules of civil procedure change that made electronic documents admissible, it meant that you had to be able to find and submit to a court of law all the electronic documents on a legal hold. And, there were tons of cases in the sort of mid to late part of the 2000's where companies were fined hundreds and millions of dollars. Morgan Stanley was the sort of poster child of that because they couldn't produce emails. And, as part of that, there was a categorization effort that went on to try to say, okay, let's put these emails in buckets, something as simple as email >> Right, right. >> So that when we have to go find something in a legal hold, we can find it or, more importantly, we can defensively delete it. But, the problem was, as I said yesterday, the math has been around forever. Things like support vector machines and probabilistic latent semantic index and all these crazy algorithms. But, the application of them was flawed, and the data quality >> Jeff: Right, right. >> Was poor. So, we'll see if now, you know, AI which is the big buzz word now, but it appears that it's got legs and is real with machine learning and it's kind of the new big data meme. We'll see if, in fact, it can really solve this problem. We certainly have the computing horse power. We know the math is there. And, I think the industry has learned enough that the application of those algorithms, is now going to allow us to have quality categorization, and really take the humans out of the equation. >> Yeah, I made some notes. It was Farrell, her part of the keynote this morning where she really talked about some of these things. And, again, categorization, prioritization, and assignment. Let the machine take the first swag at that, and let it learn and, based on what happens going forward, let it adjust its algorithms. But, again, really simple concepts, really painful to execute as a person, especially at scale. So, I think that's a really interesting application that ServiceNow is bringing AI to these relatively straightforward processes that are just painful for people. >> Yes, squinting through lists and trying to figure out, okay, which one's more important, and weighting them, and I'm sure, they have some kind of scoring system or weighting system that you can tell the machine, "Hey, prioritize, you know, these things," you know, security incidence >> Right, right. >> Or high value assets first. Give me a list. I can then eyeball them and say, okay, hm, now I'm going to do this third one first, and the first one second, whatever. And, you can make that decision, but it's like a first pass filter, like a vetting system. >> Like what Google mail does for you, right? >> Right. >> It takes a first pass. So, you know, these are the really specific applications of machine learning in AI that will start to have an impact in the very short-term, on the way that things happen. >> So, the other thing that we're really paying attention here, is the growth of the ecosystem. It's something that Jeff and I have been tracking since the early days of ServiceNow Knowledge, in terms of our early days of theCUBE. And, the ecosystem is really exploding. You know, you're seeing the big SIs. Last night, we were at the Exen Sure party. It was, you know, typical Exen Sure, very senior level, a bunch of CIOs there. It reminded me of when you go to the parties at Oracle, and the big SIs have these parties. I mean, they're just loaded with senior executives. And, that's what this was last night. You know, the VIP room and all the suits were in there, and they were schmoozing. These are things that are really going to expand the value of ServiceNow. It's a new channel for them. And, these big SIs, they have the relationships at the board room level. They have the deep industry expertise. I was talking to Josh Kahn, who's running the Industry Solutions now, another former EMCer, and he, obviously, is very excited to have these relationships with the SI. So, that to me, is a big windfall for ServiceNow. It's something that we're going to be tracking. >> And, especially, this whole concept of the SIs building dedicated industry solutions built on SI. I overheard some of the conversation at the party last night between an SI executive, it was an Exen Sure executive, and one of the ServiceNow people, and, they talked about the power of having the combination of the deep expertise in an industry, I can't remember which one they were going after, it was one big company, their first kind of pilot project, combined with the stability and roadmap of ServiceNow side to have this stable software platform. And, the combination of those two, so complementary to take to market to this particular customer that they were proposing this solution around. And then, to take that solution as they always do and then, you know, harden it and then, take it to the next customer, the next customer, the next customer. So, as you said, getting these big integrators that own the relationships with a lot of big companies, actively involved in now building industry solutions, is a huge step forward beyond just, you know, consultative services and best practices. >> Well, and they have such deep industry expertise. I mean, we talked yesterday about GDPR and some of the new compliance regulations that are coming to the banking industry, particularly in Europe, the fines are getting much more onerous. These SIs have deep expertise and understanding of how to apply something like ServiceNow. ServiceNow, I think of it as a generic platform, but it needs, you know, brain power to say, okay, we can solve this particular problem by doing A, B, C, and D or developing this application or creating this solution. That's really where the SIs are. It's no surprise that a lot of the senior ServiceNow sales reps were at that event last night, you know, hanging with the customers, hanging with their partners. And, that is just a positive sign of momentum in my opinion. Alright, Jeff, so big day today. CJ Desai is coming on. We're going to run through a lot of the business units. You know, tomorrow is sort of Pronic demo day. It's the day usually that Fred Luddy hosts, and Pat Casey, I think, is going to be the main host tomorrow. And, we'll be covering all of this from theCUBE. This is day two ServiceNow Knowledge #Know17. Check out siliconangle.com for all the news. You can watch us live, of course, at thecube.net. I'm Dave Vellante, he's Jeff Frick. We'll be right back after this short break. (easygoing music)

>> Announcer: Live from Orlando, Florida, it's theCUBE covering ServiceNow Knowledge17 brought to you by ServiceNow. >> Welcome back to ServiceNow Knowledge17 everybody this is theCUBE, the leader in live tech coverage my name is Dave Vellante and I'm here with my co-host Jeff Frick. Dan Rogers is here as the CMO of ServiceNow. Dan, welcome to theCUBE. >> Thank you, great to be here with you both. >> Yeah, it's an awesome show we were just talking about the numbers, let's run it down, give us the top line. >> We'll have about 15 thousand attendees for this year, and of course a lot more on the livestream. That's customers, prospects that's new customers that's prospects, it's existing customers. Some of our customers have been here with us 10, 11 years. Truly a show for all our customers. >> You know what struck me, when John Donohoe asked first timers like himself, it was impressive. >> Jeff: It was a big number. >> I don't know how many hands went up. >> Jeff: I was surprised actually. >> Did it surprise you? >> You know obviously I have the registration data so I had a little advantage on you guys. It didn't surprise me, and we've had such phenomenal growth that's going to be the case when you grow 39,40% year on year every two years you have you know as many new customers as you had existing customers. Not only that you know we broadened our aperture in the last 12 months from just IT to customer service, security, HR, and more generally business applications. That attracts a new set of audiences, we were kind of hoping for that really. >> You know what else is interesting, I love sharing cabs with practitioners so I can pick their brains. I think this week, I've shared a cab with a hardcore ITSM guy, an HR person, a CIO, and some other person in a line of business that I'm not even sure really what the role was but it was very clearly not IT. So you really get a diverse set of folks here, and you have events within the event, so talk about that and how you're programming to those multiple channels. >> Yeah so you know John's keynote he really talked about our heritage that we started in ITSM and we got to keep to our heritage so we're keeping on doing a lot of innovation around ITSM. But then more broadly in IT we've done a lot of transformation around operations management and around business management so truly end-to-end IT transformation. And then we said, this service management thing this cutting across the enterprise to drive work, that's applicable to lots of other departments. So you saw that for HR, you saw that for security, you saw that for customer service. Those things got launched last year. But this year was really the year where we were going to come out big with our message around that. So in terms of how the conference is organized it's pretty simple. You know when I first started here 10 months ago as the CMO I met with a bunch of customers and said, hey, what does marketing need to do? They said, you've got lots of products now your pace of innovation is really fast, help us make sense of that. What are your solutions, what are the conversations I should be having with you? We said, there are nine conversations. Nine customer conversations. Codified what those are, then we said, why don't we use those nine customer conversations as the rails for all of our marketing. So earlier this year we had a sales kick-off guess what, there were nine tracts. At Knowledge there were nine tracts, our website has nine solutions. So those things become the rails upon which we were having those conversations. How is Knowledge organized? It's organized across those nine conversations. You can easily select a tract and just follow that follow that journey. >> So we probably don't have time to go into all nine, but any stand out? Any ones that really excite you? >> Well of course we've got our five cloud services so there's a conversation there, many conversations around IT, around service management, around operations management, around being able to measure, to optimize and improve. Then also our newer conversations, how do you deliver customer service at light speed? How do you help employees have a great experience in HR? How do you resolve security issues at light speed? And then how do you build business applications that have this contextual workflow that cut across. >> It's an interesting twist to go to your existing customers as marketing and say what do you need from us, and for them to come back and say help us buy more from you because you have so much stuff I don't understand. You usually think of marketing as much more external focus. Give us the messaging and we can go out and get new customers, but that's a really different tact that really speaks to the flexibility of the platform, as well as peoples desire to do more with it. >> I think the other thing is really cultural thing. Our product teams are very customer-centric they are lead by our customers, you heard that, kind of, history from Fred Luddy, that's kind of how he started. We listen, we build, we learn. That mentality happens in the product team in the sales team, of course they're very dialed in to the customer. My ethos is, that should really happen in the marketing team too. We shouldn't be driven by what the product team are developing we should be driven by what are the conversations our customers want to have with us. Being dialed into that is really important. Now there's nine conversations that I talked about every year they'll change a little bit. What they want to talk to us about but the idea that we are going to have rails on which you run along marketing, those rails are going to be decided by our customers I think there's a big breakthrough in how to do B2B marketing. >> So talk about light speed, it's a good marketing term but what does it mean, put some meat on the bone for us. >> Yeah so, in a way I think it's a way of describing three different concepts. The first concept is, you need to streamline and automate. And again, that's what our customers are saying they want to do with their processes. The second is drive great end-user and customer experiences. You saw John kind of point out this idea that a lot of work today is trapped inside an organization, inside silos. The customer doesn't care, they just want a great experience that cuts through that. Them the third thing is this idea of innovation. We're going to innovate, so that you can stay ahead. Those three concepts com together to be work at lightspeed. A smarter faster way to get work done. So that big epiphany is the idea that those are the three things customers are trying to do. If you give that a label we know it's got something to do with work. Something to do with the way work's getting done across the enterprise, and that work is getting done in a different way. It's going to be a combination of machines and people that are doing that work. So we said look, let's call that work at lightspeed. So I think it's a nice holder for us to make that description of those three things our customers are asking us to do. >> So you really build it up from the ground up. It wasn't kind of a top down hey this would be a cool term let's try to force fit it into what we're doing you started with what the customers are saying and then said, alright how do we describe that. >> That's right, no customer is saying lightspeed and hey lightspeed like there's a little bit of marketing in there, the things that are underneath that as you unpack it is exactly what they're trying to do. >> Excellent, so tell us a little bit more about some of the events within the events at Knowledge. That's always been something that's been fascinating to us. See how that's blossoming. >> So would you believe this thing is 29 work streams and I had the good fortune of last week every one of those work streams turned green. >> I know. >> I read online. >> And until then we were all crossin' our fingers that those things would go green exactly. I wish it all were automated, but unfortunately some real hard craft that goes on underneath. But if you're the highlight cell I can point out the first thing you see is that this year of course we have more keynotes. So last year we just had three general session keynotes. Well now underneath that we have topic keynotes. The topic keynote for IT because we just felt like we're doing so much innovation in IT we need to tell that story, so on the main stage Farrell's going to be going through all of those. We've got a bunch of additions we're doing in security so security has it's own topic keynote. That's going to be a lot of fun. There's going to be a live talk show. They're going to do a, I won't give too much away but they're going to do a little bit of a bake-off. >> Dave: But give a plug. >> I don't remember the time but they are going to do a bake off. The old way of resolving security incidents versus the ServiceNow way. They'll do a little bit of a competition between the two. >> That should be fun. >> I'll give you a little clue, one of the people might not be finished by the time the competition finishes. That's all I'm going to say. And then we have our customer service keynote again, actually , that happened just this morning we made a big announcement around communities there, and we have an HR keynote. Then of course day three is our celebration of developers. We have still got creative, we've got five thousand developers here. In fact, the labs are packed upstairs of people that are really you know, building code and building applications real time. Lots of things going on from the keynote perspective which is really around what is our story how does this all come together. Then of course we've got the CIO decisions program where we invite 100, 120 leading CIO's from around the world. They have their own conference, they're spending a lot more time to support leadership. Where does this thing end? This industry of interaction between machines and humans. What does that world look like? We talk about this idea of the role of IT changing you kind of heard that in the keynote today that IT knows the most about business process transformation it turns out, IT knows the most about service delivery. So it's IT that needs to sort of, step in to the HR world, into the customer service world, make sure they're delivering those great transformative experiences. I spent time with some customers at dinner last night at the CIO Decisions event. I asked them to describe their role. Three of the four people said we're actually Chief Transformation Officers, and in fact two of them had that I their title. This is the idea that they've started their lives in IT but increasingly they were driving these service projects across the organization. So I think that, you know, if anything that's the big epiphany for is this year. Is this idea of transformation, and that IT needs to have a different role in that than they've had before. No longer just about infrastructure management but really around that end-to-end business transformation. >> So those Chief Transformation Officers are they reporting kind of back up duty to CIO within the house that they probably were originally or they now jumping in the COO to CEO's? >> CIO's were reporting into them. >> Really? >> So it's fascinating. >> Dave: Yeah, I'll bet. >> And you know sometimes, you saw Scott Mason today Scott Mason from Novartis, he's a COO and Chief Transformation Officer from a bunch of processes across, he's really parallel to the CIO. Lot's of different ays that we're seeing this play out. >> You know when Jeff and I did our first Knowledge I remember the close and we were talking about one of the things, many things, but one was the ecosystem. At the time you had, you didn't really have any big name SI's, you do today. And the ecosystem is jut exploded. There are some epic ecosystem examples in our industry obviously Microsoft, I think VMware, I love the stat VMware gives for every dollar spent on a VMware license 15, at the peak anyway, is spent on the ecosystem. Those are the kinds of thins we look for. It appears that you aspire to build similar epic eco system. I wonder if you could affirm that and tell me how you're going to do it. >> Well I don't know if you guys can see at home but the backdrop here is the Partner Expo. At the Partner Expo we have about 160 partners on demonstration today and you know really people were clawing to be in that space. Because they know this is a community that's driving transformation, and they want to be part of that. So, I'd say we have all kid of partners here. We have systems integrators, you've seen that in some of our diamond and platinum sponsors. But ISV's that are building applications on the platform. As I said, day three is going to be a lot more about people that are building your applications. But there's really no end to these workflow applications that people can build, it's about creating those great experiences. So, yeah, the core of what we've done, and you probably saw hat I call the family portrait today family portrait basically says the middle layer of all of this us the now platform. The way that we've architected it, I don't know if you're having CJ on here later, the way we've architected ourselves is our cloud services use that common platform for IT, for customer service for HR. But anyone who's building applications can also take advantage of all of those platform elements. Ww announced intelligent automation today. That's in the Now platform. That means that anyone who's building applications can take advantage of it. Anyone can take advantage of the services for requester, for providers, for the service owners, as they build business applications. We've really architected with that in mind, that idea that there are going to be many different ways to express what you're trying to do. Some of which we'll build cloud services around many of which our partners will build on top. >> I want to shift gears just a little bit. You've been in the industry for a long time you worked for a lot of leading companies. What did you see 11 months ago, and probably a little bit more, that brought you here. Because you've worked for some successful cloud companies, people can look up your LinkedIn. What did you see that brought you here? >> Obviously a couple of things, the phenomenal growth is just, that's an obvious one right, this is a rocket ship and a rocket ship is a fun place to be for your career because you just don't now where it's going to go, but there's going to be more opportunities. So that's one, but specific to ServiceNow this customer mentality, this customer mindset was really the secret sauce. I spoke to a bunch of customers, my former employer was a customer. I said, you know, if all the software products you're using which one is growing the fastest, and why do you like it the most? They said ServiceNow and the reason they said ServiceNow is because they loved the engagement with the sales team, but also they could see the extensibility of the platform. They realized that it was going to be at the core of their infrastructure. There will probably be as this kind of all shakes out in the next 10 years, five or six enduring technology companies, technology platforms, my bet is that ServiceNow is going to be one of them. When you talk to customers that make our retention rates at 98, 99% because we're delivering a lot of value. There's something very special there, and we take that seriously, we don't take that for granted. You heard John start out by saying, give us the feedback and we're going to improve it. He loves getting feedback, we love getting feedback. That is a part of our culture. I think that's part of the magic, something I enjoy. That customer centricity, it changes the way you do marketing, it keeps it very fresh. Nothing can happen in an ivory tower. You constantly outward facing outward connecting. >> I want to talk about that a little bit. Specifically the role of the CMO, personally I find marketing very difficult I don't; have the marketing gene, so I think your role is quite challenging, especially given what we talked about as the different personas that you have to target. Now you're a billion dollar company, and you're starting to act like a billion dollar company you aspire to be a four billion dollar company. You have this developer ecosystem as well. You mentioned CreatorCon, so how do you think about from a marketing standpoint addressing all those different personalities? >> First of all, I do think you guys do a great job at marketing yourselves. >> Oh, thank you. >> So I wouldn't say >> It's just the content. >> The CUBE precedes itself. >> Well, like ou we focus on our guests. >> I guess that's how just focus on the customer. >> It's how you build your brand, it's interesting, the quality of the questions. I can't guarantee the quality of the response. So anyway you get out there and do a great job with that. No, I think it's this idea that, it's all about getting the aperture right. So two years ago, three years ago, the aperture for us was really around IT and IT service management. It was very important that we shared the road map around service management and where we were going. As we broaden the aperture to include those other cloud services, you have to do so in a way that stays true to your core. It's no surprise that we're going to spend a lot of time on the IT keynote talking about the innovation that we're doing there. That's a big part of our show, Mot of the attendees of the show are in IT and are in service management. Staying true to that and what we're doing there we're never going to lose that kind of backbone of our relationship with those customers. But then we need to have a more expansive way of describing ourselves so that when you look at our website, yes IT's in the center we have a new kind of cloud image that shows all these five cloud services. This work at lightspeed idea, it kind of transcends work as it's getting done across the enterprise. I think it's being aligned to the idea of staying true to those bits, allowing ourselves to expand, then allowing that maybe far right of that to extend even further. With the possibility of all kind of great business applications, all kind of great ecosystem partners some of the partners in the appstore, just absolutely incredible things that they're building. That we cannot possibly imagine or try and constrain. I'd say that's kind of part of the mission for marketing. >> The other thing I wanted to ask you was about this gauntlet of four billion, in fact John Donohoe actually at the financial analyst meeting even threw out hey, we aspire to even greater, I think he threw out 10 billion. Why not? >> Why not? >> Why not think big. You've got the platform, certainly the TAM is there to support it, how do you get there? >> It's funny, someone actually, I can't remember who it was, I was meeting yesterday said to me the way that they think about it is not TAM but TAP, Total Addressable Pain. It's really interesting because you know you've got these specifically defined areas that maybe analysts are looking at, and you've got this other thing called service management which customers across all those other pre-described things. And so, that doesn't have a TAM, because it's a pain, it's absolutely the biggest pain that our customers have but no one's put a number on that thing. >> Jeff: You'll find it by emails maybe. >> Right, exactly, who knows the pain? Everyone know when they see this back and forward of this stuff trapped in email, stuff trapped in phone calls, stuff trapped in messengers, that back and forward on any process that really deserves to be streamlined, simplified, automated to deliver great experiences. Everyone knows the pain, I don't think anyone's sized that thing up you know and couldn't possibly. Because those are all in the future. This is all going to be a new market space. I think that's probably an interesting answer to your question is this idea that as we move towards that, those lofty numbers, we going to be recategorizing what needs to happen inside an enterprise and maybe that traditional view of how an enterprise works is somewhat antiquated and broken today. >> You know it relates to this question Jeff and I, when we first heard about ServiceNow when we were a small company we were like oh my God I want this. There's always talk about how small companies can now access the cloud and they get access to the same tooling as large companies. I read an article the other day where that is calling into question that the rich are getting richer, that the large companies are driving productivity faster to the extent that they adopt ServiceNow, it seems like they will have an advantage over small companies. I guess two part question one is do you buy that, and two, is there ever going to be a day where little guys like us can get ServiceNow? >> I'd say part of the things we've articulated to financial analysts is to say that around 50% of our 20/20 number is going to come from large enterprise and 50% is going to come from commercial smaller companies. So that's still going to be our bread and butter The reason that's out bread and butter is cuz that's who's kind of leading us on our development you remember 2004 the stories of Fred when he was founding the company. There were a couple of marquis customers, he's actually vacation with them now. It's absolutely no joke, he goes on vacation with our early customers because they were such a tight family. They lead him to where the company goes. And we've kept that family relationship where some of our largest enterprise customers and they're going to pull us and they're going to lead us and that will extend those advantages and benefits do extend to commercial. We haven't codified a specific SMB strategy, but I'd say that partnership with our large companies is how we're innovating on their behalf. >> Excellent, Dan thank you so much for taking some time out and coming to theCUBE really appreciate it. >> Thank you really enjoyed the time. >> Excellent, congratulations for all the success and you know looking for more. Alright keep it right there, we're going to be back with our next guest right after this. We're live from Knowledge17, we'll be right back.