(bright upbeat music) >> Now welcome back to theCUBE as we continue our coverage here at AWS re:Invent 22, or of course in the Venetian here in Las Vegas. It's Wednesday day, I guess two and a half of the show. Things are going really well here and we're going to move our attention now to banking and tech like so many other verticals that financial industry making huge moves with their digital plays. And we're going to talk about that with a couple of guys that know what that is all about. Ken Meyer, chief Information and Experience Officer at Truist. Ken, good to see you, sir. >> Good to have me. Thank you very much. >> It is. And Gys Hyman, who is a principal at Deloitte the lead though for a converge prosperity we'll explain that in just a second. Hi, it's good to see you as well. >> Nice, yeah. Awesome having me. >> Right, so jump in on that for a converge prosperity so we understand what the product is and or what the opportunity is for what Deloitte brought to market for what folks like Truist are putting into practice. >> Yeah, so converge prosperity is really our focus where we building solutions production reduced solutions for the financial services industry. So if you think about the demand on the bank side right now is they want to launch new products, new services those innovative products and services that they want to take to market. And they also want to modernize, a lot of their sort of legacy infrastructure and modernize some of the components within their architecture. So we, together with AWS actually, are co-investing sort of in a multi-year strategy where we're saying, let's build these solutions that we can take to market that can sort of help these banks be more agile, launch products faster to market and also help address the modernization journey for the banks. And that's really sitting within the converged prosperity business unit within Deloitte. >> And Ken, for you, what was the attraction or what is the attraction in terms of that kind of an offering? >> Well, I think when you think about the banking journey to the Cloud, a lot of folks look on the channel experiences and they've leveraged Cloud to create differentiated experiences that are just... They couldn't build before with the speed of the scale and everything else. But, the challenges that many banks have is once you get below that layer there's a lot of legacy type technology that lives in the product offerings that we all offer. So, the idea of these folks or others that are trying to make that a little bit easier to kind of connect that front end to that backend all with the true modern stack is something that's differentiated. >> Yeah, if I hear pulling this big old weight along with me right? >> That's right. >> I've got all this old stuff but I still have to use some of the old stuff. >> Well, and some of the old stuff works, right? It runs. So, why would you want to mess up anything that's running? And so even that if these folks and others can find ways to start breaking it into more modular pieces so we can consume things differently than we've done before versus take that big old elephant on every time, it's a differentiator. >> So what's the trick then in making sure that what is new is working with what is old? Because what is new these days, obviously you know, faster, sleek, or, I mean, we go on and on as opposed to what you were working with in Legacy. So what's the trick there, Gys in making sure that you're doing the right match up? >> It's part of the approach. I mean, you can either do a big bang approach which is sort of lengthy and high risk for the bank which is obviously we don't see a lot of appetite in the banks to take the big bang approach or the large transformational approach. And then the approach that we sort of take to this is to say, and that we're seeing that success in the market is around more a phased approach which we call on the edge, is really to say, how can we launch something on the side, and take that to market really quick to show the benefit to the business and demonstrate success. And at the same time have a really sort of modular architecture that you can say, you don't have to have this monolith solution that you need to plug or replace your existing one. That you can really sort of componentize that and say which are the components that we want to start replacing in a phased approach, with these new next generation technologies, which, yeah. >> The part that he mentioned there at the end on module architecture is a 100% the key, right? I mean, architecture matters probably now more than ever. When you're trying to stitch all these things to together and you can find ways to make it a little bit more seamless versus some of the monoliths that we've dealt with in the past, it's extremely helpful. >> So, give us some examples here for what your experience has been then. >> Yeah... >> 'I mean, you are as I see you're the experience officer, so, (all laughing) >> We'll leave that one alone, (all laughing loudly) but now, I mean I think some of the on the edge stuff that Gys has been talking about, we're a large bank, we have subsidiaries we have a subsidiary, which is our national lending platform and LightStream as an example. And we decided to say, Hey let's really learn from what we could do with a more modern core banking platform. And we ultimately stood that up in production and we're close to going generally available but we've got production accounts on modern core platforms that we're learning every day from. And it's not just the learning on the tech side, that tech side might be the easy part, to be honest. The change in this technology and the different technologies that are available it really is impacting how we run our operations. So moving from batch processing which has always been how banks operate to this concept of real time processing, that's a big step. And not only does it change in the operations and how we service our clients but now you got to think about compliance, right? And legal and all of the the risk elements, >> 'security changing. >> Security, all that. It's all a part of that change. So you could say that the tech is really hard and it's difficult and we got to look at the architecture but at the end of the day, it's about bringing the entire organization back to the table to say how do we do this different? And how do we create a better experience and create new value for our clients through the technology. >> All right, can you gimme an example though? I mean, about some... What's going to be the biggest change you think then? >> I think operationally is the biggest change, in my opinion. I mean, when you start thinking about the way in which we've worked for years around this concept of batch processing, so, you know, yes, you make a deposit at your branch and that's really nice and we might credit you and you do the memo post but it doesn't clear until the night runs and you finish your batch process, at 3:00 AM and then all your downstream systems run and all of that. And even the concept of collecting checks, right? And thinking about all the item processing aspects of that when you start talking about real time and it immediately you make your deposit and immediately balances your general ledger and it clears and it's all right there at that point in time, all of those processes go away, right? The batch processes change the way in which all the downstream impacts for reporting and analytics and all of those things, it all changes. And so that can be really scary, but it also can be really exciting when you think about creating new products and new services that are truly real time and changing the way in which we operate with our clients. >> So scary and exciting, right? A couple of moods or situations that maybe some folks in banking don't want to be in, right? I don't like scary. I want here... >> Well change is scary for a lot of people right? But there's an evolution in this space. >> Gys, what are you seeing with your experiences in terms of... >> 'i think that it also creates opportunity to sort of (clears throat) to lay the foundation of how do you coexist between the old world and the new world? And these modern technologies really allow you to sort of, put a event driven platform in place to say, understand that the banking world is fairly batch driven right now as Ken's comment and also the broader banking ecosystem is still batch driven but it allows us to put a platform in place to say how do we coexist with that batch environment and the real time environment? And the other thing that the banks are trying to do is they're trying to work with a number of sort of the fintechs out there in the market, these leading fintechs that are offering new products and services that they can embed into their offering and then offer as a service to their customers at the end of the day. But doing that with existing banking technology is difficult because it's not as modular, it's not as open. These next generation technologies and certainly the solution that we building with AWS is really sort of that power strip or that fabric layer where we are allowing fintechs to plug in easier into that ecosystem and into the bank's ecosystem as well. >> Yeah, I think with Goldman Sachs is that what I read is that one that comes to mind about repurposing and making it available to their client base. >> They certainly building a platform model where they're bringing other ecosystem partners into their platform and then they're offering out as business services to their customers. >> So, Ken how do you get buy in on this? I mean, because, it sure looks good on paper, right? But when it comes to time actually execute and implement, you need, you know, buy in for more than just your slice of the business, right? >> Yeah, I mean, I think there's a lot of different elements that come into getting that buy in and kind of making that leap and starting to experiment. One is our clients, right? So our clients are demanding new products, new services they don't expect things like maintenance windows and other, like they want what they want when they want it. So if you're listening to your clients and they want more product innovation and they want everything available when they need it that's clear. Cloud and security, we've... Everything that we've ever done when it comes to moving workloads or building experiences with the Cloud has been by continuing to increase our security posture. So we can create a more secure environment and a more available environment because we've have deployments that are spanning different regions and they're continuously available, and the automation and the speed in which we can go to market. I mean, when you can create a new product and launch a new product in weeks versus months or years in the past with all of the complexity and create simplicity while also using modern capabilities to create intelligent experiences, that's a game changer. And it's hard to argue with it but I think the other part of it that's a reality is that we're facing a really interesting time where there's not a whole lot of COBAL programmers laying around these days. And so at some point there's going to be a workforce issue. >> Skills gap. >> Absolutely. >> Yeah. So looking at it with through your Deloitte lens, then I mean, that's a very real threat, right? Is it not to all of a sudden, not a regression but certainly a delay in progress, (chuckles) how do we overcome that as far as training and skills and whatever? >> We believe that this on the edge approach also, the other benefit to the bank is it allows the benefit to sort of test and learn a little bit with these new technologies. These new Cloud native, Cloud based technologies are very different, you know, different skill set that you need in the design side and the build side and also in the maintain and operate side. But it allows the bank to sort of take more of a phased approach and sort of get the training wheels around the skills, get comfortable around how these different platforms work, and how do you slowly sort of phase that into the organization, which makes a big difference. >> So what's the training part of that then? I mean, what does that look like? >> It's training at the engineering level to say there are a new set of tools. You know if you think about the Cloud the infrastructure layer, those technologies are very different from, servicing the on-prem technologies that the banks are used to servicing. So that's certainly at the engineering level there's a difference in training, but there's also a different training required at how do you configure and work with these new next generation, core platforms, which opens up a whole set of opportunities of what are the types of financial services products that the banks can take to market, but they work very differently than your sort of your traditional more monolithic technologies. And then I think the bigger area, as Ken mentioned is on the servicing side, the bank has now got a say we are now introducing a new solution together with an old solution, and how do we coexist and how do we create a servicing layer for the customer to have that sort of consistent experience across all the new but also your middle office and your back office and your front office, people have got to work on this platform and how do you not give them a broken experience in the... >> 'well, and your clients don't care about what your black end platforms look like. >> All right. That's right. >> So you want to be able to, it's kind of it's do it on the device, right? It doesn't matter what if it's a hundred years old or if it's 10 days old, it doesn't matter. >> Right, right. You talked about the modular configurations, right? Are some more critical than others? I mean, not knowing what that looks like or have you been able to give feedback on the converged prosperity side, say, you know, fine tune... >> 'i give a lot of feedback. >> Okay, (all laughing loudly). >> We won't do his review right now. >> All right, all right, good. All right, so let's not do... >> 'no, I think that we've done a lot of learning together throughout all of these processes because before they had this really fancy converge prosperity thing we were just working together, right? And we've been able to learn along the way and there's some learnings that are great for us and there's other things that they can tailor for a broader set of clients, which is great. I mean that's what the partnerships about is continuing to learn together and Gys and his team have been phenomenal partners. As we think about being very, very intentional about how we launch products on these new platforms we give a lot of feedback on, Hey these are areas that might be really important for you to think about as you look to build out your side of the platform. And some of those things we might consume some of those things we might not, and that's okay. But for us it's about truly partnering and doing that test and learn and trying to learn about how does this impact all of the downstream stuff because it's not just about technology, although we like to think it is every once in a while this is about clients. And so you got to continue to put them in the front and then similarly, our teammates that we have because they're servicing those clients on the front lines every day. >> Yeah, they'll tell you if it's working. >> 'they will tell you. >> 'you'll know right away. >> Absolutely. >> See what kind of use we have going on here and... >> 'a 100%. >> And if something's broken or not. Just real quick about the relationship going forward then, like you've launched converged prosperity, right? It's been out in the marketplace less than a year, but you got it up and running, things are going well. When you hear feedback like this from Ken and others what kind of fine tunings going on in here with you? And then from your side of the equation too what do you want more of? What do you want to see more of here in 2023? >> Yeah, I mean we work with sort of the non-traditional banks out there. So we work with FinTech that want to launch banking offerings. So there are a lot of lessons that we learn from them in terms of what are the features and capabilities that they're looking for. We work with some of the larger banks that are saying, we want to be more modular in terms of how we consume the banking suite solution. We don't want to take sort of an end-to-end proposition. We really want to take selective components of that banking suite solution and embed it into our existing or new infrastructure. And I think the lessons for us is really just around what are the new customer capabilities that their customers are looking for that we should be building for in our platform. I think the other thing that you need to look at is these next generation core banking platforms they are like any new software business they are growing, they are learning and they are maturing. So you are also looking for customers that have the appetite to grow with some of those and whose product roadmap aligns with those vendors out there. So, I guess for us, it's important to work with partners that are willing to work with us and walk that journey. But we also feel that these technologies and solutions are really.... Banks are moving past design, past thinking, they are really now thinking about how do we start implementing and making it real and how do we take that initial use case sort of to market out there. >> Yeah, I would say, if I simplify what Gys and team have done they've taken modernization of commodity services, right? So, banks don't want to just go out and build commodities all the time, right? That's not how we're going to differentiate. So we need to be thinking about what are the different ways that we can create a competitive advantage against everybody else who has, a lot of different and similar products and service offerings. So, if we can continue to look and help influence roadmaps and also consume some of those types of services that are truly commoditized, and we can go focus on the modernization of the areas that are the biggest possible competitive advantages for us then there's a lot of value in that type of value problem. >> I know we didn't have time for this, but do you have a pick by the way, in the national championship in college football? >> I'm a dog. >> I know you are, (laughing loudly). >> I'm a dog. >> How about them dogs? >> How about them dogs? >> All right, thanks for the time guys. >> Thanks much. >> Really do appreciate it much. Really great session. Talking about banking and what's going on at the bottom really is AWS, driving things and making it happen. All right, you've been watching the Cube, of course. The leader in high tech coverage. (bright upbeat music)

>>The cube presents HPE discover 2022 brought to you by HPE. >>Welcome back to HPE. Discover 2022. You're watching the cubes, uh, coverage where day two here at Dave ante with John furrier, HaCo Myers here. He's the executive vice president and chief sales officer, newly minted, relatively newly minted chief sales officer at HPE at HPE and Paul Hunter. Who's the senior vice president and managing director of north America for Hewlett Packard enterprise gentlemen. Welcome to the cube. >>Thank you. Thanks having us. >>Hi coach. This is the first time back in Vegas in a while three years. I think it's been. And your first as the chief sales officer. Yep. What's the vibe like how how's, how's >>It feel? I can tell you. It's so cool. Is it you, you walk down the hallway, everybody's smiling and you see people from, you have seen three years ago or in this format on your screen the last three years, I think, uh, what is amazing. We had exactly three years ago, we had this event and Antonio mentioned, Hey, and by end of 20, 22, you will see everything being available as a service. Yeah. And nobody thought about that. We will not meet in person until 2022 at that point in time. Yeah, indeed. And that's what happened that I can tell you, what's the best decision to make an in person event here in vigor with so many people, uh, because it's about, Hey, the change in the market, the demand, the transition. And, uh, so I think it, I, couldn't be more happy to see the last two days and looking for, for the, to the rest of the event, >>Paul, you have a, a, a background in the, the channel, um, and now you're heading north America. What are you seeing in the ecosystem? Is it, is there a difference as HaCo was saying from 2019, is there a different, you know, feeling different conversations? What are you seeing? Yeah. >>Well, the good thing is like, because we haven't been here for three years, you've got a really marked moment of comparison. So you cast your mind back. What were the conversations like? I think three years ago we were talking about cloud services and partners were nodding their heads and thinking, yeah, but the world is gonna continue as normal and we fast forward three years and, uh, the partners are really talking about, uh, proactively how do they build up that cloud services? And, uh, they're also talking about customer experiences as well. We've landed and won new customers. So, uh, that's really sort of thrilling to hear that they're really excited about the journey on with us. >>You know, I'd like to get your perspective on the, what happened during the pandemic, because we saw, um, first of all, you know, zoom and video com saved the internet, uh, had meetings, but the partner, the partners delivered a lot of value. Um, customers had to pivot, or if they had a tailwind, they had, they took advantage of it. Some had headwinds with the pandemic everyone's working at home. So a lot of disruptions for all the companies, but a lot of the partners had success during the pandemic. And because they have that solution. What was the, uh, uh, the learnings that you guys saw during the pandemic, because now with cloud cloud scale hybrid, mainstream, and now steady state people lived it and partners delivered a lot of solutions in hybrid mode. Yeah. In virtual mode. What was the learnings for you guys out, coming out of that with customers and partners? >>I think first of all, we, we all learned during the pandemic that, uh, you can business, uh, do business in a different way, but as well, you learned, uh, how to pivot faster in the digital transformation. This makes a difference. And this creates value. And I think together with our partner ecosystem, we were able to develop faster solutions there while we developed everything as a service and came up with more and more cloud services. The good thing is it resonates. And our history with the partners is I donors, as long as I can, uh, think back in my career. And you only can do that together with the channel partners. And I think they appreciate that. We learn from each other. We do the same enablement from my guys, like from the partner guys and this close relation, I think made a difference, >>You know, in 2019 GreenLake, as a service was really a financial vehicle right now that's, that's evolved. And now, you know, two years on three years on it's actually a cloud service. Absolutely. And so what's the resonance been with customers because I mean, every everybody says they want that cloud experience. They may not all want OPEX. Yeah. But so what have you hearing from customers? So >>First of all, what I hear is, um, not the, if, so the strategy is clear, the customer they'll love it. They like it. They have, they want to have the cloud-like experience and guess what? We have 70 cloud services now. Yeah. And we have announced a lot of new one the last couple of days, but it's not so much that if they should do this, it's more the question, how can we help me to scale faster? Yeah. And, uh, that's the, the, the, the feedback I got the last couple of days, and for us, it's a motivation. We are on the right track. There is, this is a moment where you have a demand from the market and a strategy that fits, and this is so strong and you can do this with the partner through the partners and you see the, the customers, they love it. I have never seen an event where I got so many requests the last two days where I say, I thought that, can you help me to get there faster? It's perfect. >>Yeah. I think, I think it was also a landmark moment when we presented the cloud platform as part of the Antonio's keynote, I've had a lot of partners say this was sort of really marked the moment where we felt there was there's real substance to the offering now. And, uh, I had one of the sales guys relate to me a story where they have a, a, a client in the audience. And, uh, they're thinking about how they might, um, have a relationship with us and through seeing the kind of significance of it for us, we're able to close deals. So that's also, you know, a really exciting thing. We're actually know we're closing deals and, and winning new >>Customers, Hey, being agile and closing deals fast is a good thing. Right? I mean, that's what you guys like. Yeah. >>I mean, that's >>What it, so I, so I love the channel conversation partners because one of the things that I've observed and, and, and, and, and knowing the HP channels so strong, they're obviously they want make money. Gross margin is all about the profit, the profit motive, but the enablement that you guys have, how is that translated into this, this, this shift everyone's aligned behind GreenLake and as a service, cuz this seems to be a good fit for partner. Cause they're gonna go to the customer, the ultimate end customer and bolt on services. >>Yeah. >>How is that going? Cuz this is, to me, seems like a dream scenario for services, which we all know is high gross margin. >>Yeah. Yeah. I think it's a journey. What's a journey for our sales organization. Like it is for the partners, but it's a journey worth to do that. And um, so what, what is our, our strategy to have this together with our channel partners in mind, uh, to, to combine their strengths and they can, we, we have a kind of modular approach so that they can plug in their strengths, their IP, or as well, their services, which makes them sticky and, uh, relevant to the customer. And it drives profitability. And I think that's the, the, the secret behind the model, working with the channel, not, uh, separate to the channel. And I think this resonates this story, it's, it's a journey. And, uh, we learned a lot the last three years how to sell it. We, in the past we were selling, uh, transactional hardware. Yeah. Now we are selling services, cloud services, like you mentioned different game and this is an enablement. And we, we, um, we offer the same trainings we are doing with our folks to our channel partners because we are together in this journey. >>Yeah. It, you, you described it really well. And uh, so did, Hico essentially, this is, it requires a lot of persistence because you, you're not gonna get it right the first time. And so we now seen partners try and fail several times, but now try fail and succeed. So that's exciting. Um, and also I think what we're also seeing is partners is doing quite a good job of building services that integrate into the cloud services. So they're right into the APIs. I was, I was with a meeting with a partner called CBTS and they talked about the whole of their services portfolio now is embedded in, in GreenLake. So that certainly was not the case three years ago. >>Yeah. And the other, the big tailwind too, as you got the open source software movement, you're seeing, you know, the ability for partners and ultimately the channel being software enabled they're adding services, not just professional services, but cloud services where they have the domain expertise. Yeah. They're close to the customer. Yeah. And they could really be, um, customizing solutions. Um, and that's gonna always be great for the customer. The question I have for you guys is do you see that domain specialism with machine learning and with software, do you see partners start to get vertically focused and like, and start, get more targeted towards save verticals? >>Yeah. >>You go, no, go first. Yeah. >>Well, again, I was, uh, it's funny, your questions are completely resonating with the conversations we've been having all day. Like I was with our partner called connection and they're talking about how do they build practices in four areas? And they're, I'm quite closely allowed to aligned to our areas of edge cloud and data. Um, they have another one which is also workplace transformation. So, and they're thinking, how do we add expertise? How do we hire, recruit and retain the best talent? And, uh, that again, that wasn't a conversation we were having two, three years ago. So where partners really add value to us is through their services and their expertise and progressive partners are hiring and doing that. >>Yeah. And this transformation I mentioned earlier, it's selling outcomes, business outcomes for the end customer. And, uh, I think selling outcomes means you need to be specialized in something, be it on a domain area or be on a vertical. And I think, uh, when you focus on that, uh, that's the best way you can add value to a customer. This creates this trust, this trust relationship. Yeah. >>So edge cloud and data, obviously, I, I think edge, you guys, you got sending stuff and outta space, that's the ultimate edge. So you got some proof points there. Deep edge, I think. Deep edge. Yeah. >><laugh> I is very good. >>I think cloud, you showed the console Alma. It was very, had a very clear and strong platform message say, okay, now go build the data piece to me is the least mature when I walk around. Although I did see Starburst. Yeah, yeah. Out there. I think Starbursts a very advanced leading edge thinker. So that was a good sign. What do you see as having to happen to really build out that data ecosystem now? >>So I think what is important, this, this is all connected to each other edge cloud and data. And at the end, it's about, uh, how we can create insights out of the data, uh, and uh, where they, they live, where they come up, the data, how we structure them, how we get insights out of the data. So I think this is an area we see much more. It's not only about AI, but it's about having a data strategy as a customer. This is one of those areas. We have customer advisory bots that tell us, Hey, help us. We want to create our data strategy. And this is something where I think we can play together with our partners to really create value, get these insights out of the data. >>Are you hearing conversations where cus customers or partners are saying, okay, I wanna get insights out of the data, but I actually want to build a data business. I wanna build data products on, on, on GreenLake. Are you hearing that yet? >>Yeah, we are. Um, particularly the sort of, we, we think of them as sort of information, um, modern companies, um, they're building out new service lines. I mean, you, you, we see it in a lot of industries. Now you can see like how car manufacturers are increasingly thinking about how do they monetize their data, they're getting from it. And, uh, so there are new businesses being established, like in lots of different verticals. Pharmaceuticals will be another one where, um, traditional players are really being challenged and there are big businesses growing very rapidly based off data. So we're seeing it quite extensively. And, and we have to think about how do we access those new customers? How do we intersect them? And it's not just the people that we've been dealing with for 10, 20 years. They're very new companies, >>Which, which announcement's got the most buzz in your conversations with customers, partners. >><laugh>, it's funny. So I, I had, uh, when, when, when I started my conversation at a couple of, uh, meetings now, the last two days always started and said, what, what resonates? Yeah. And first of all, the funny thing is everybody told me the clarity of the message, the strategy second, uh, the consistency that we do, what we promise to do. Um, a couple of them, I know that down ISS, private cloud enterprise, uh, it's a great solution here. And, uh, then, uh, what, what I hear as well with our clarity and the strategy we are leapfrogging the competition. That's what I get out of these meetings. And I think that's the best compliment we can get for the two days. Yeah. >>Yeah. And I think the platform and the conversations around machine learning, AI, we even had an HP executive talk about quantum. Yeah. So you guys are already starting to think about what's around the corner. And I think if the platform works, the test will be, and the results will be enablement ecosystem will be flourishing, and we're gonna watch that. So I wanna get your, your take on the early, um, shift. Cause I think this year with GreenLake and the platform it's, it's maturing enough to the right. No doubt about it. We see the momentum, but there's still a lot more to do than go. So how do you guys envision the ecosystem developing? Because that'll be the true test, the flourishing, cuz if you enable people will get value out of it and it's gotta be a step function, not incremental value. >>Yeah. I think we, we, we, we always talk about, Hey, we landed and then we expand from there. That's the beauty of the model. And the good thing is there's no window looking for the customer. So they are free. That's a modular system. And what we see it's uh, really first of all, to understand the customer digital journey, where are the journey and they're all in a different place. And we have this digital, uh, uh, next advisor workshops when we have this anchor point mm-hmm, <affirmative>, you start there, you really can grow. And then you add workloads based on where the customer sits, what are the partnerships we have to bring to that? So it's really a model which starts and is, uh, designed for the future. >>The field must love it. The folks in the field, we love it. Yeah. You guys love that. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. Give it the customer plan future and >>I can tell you the partners love it the, well, yeah, >>Got it. When I talk to CIOs, I, I, and I ask them, you know, what's changed, you know, with Ukraine and supply chain and inflation and rising interest rate, what's changed in terms of your assumption from the beginning of the year, you know, let's say, you know, in, in terms of it spend and they're saying, well, not a lot, actually we're gonna continue to spend, we are reprioritizing. You know, we got, we're taking Robb a little bit from over here to put it into security. Yeah. Okay. But generally speaking, it's, it's the same as we expected, let's call it six, 7% growth, which is pretty good on top of last year. Um, and, and maybe there's some dry powder there, depending on how business goes. It also seems like there's, there's a lot of headwinds at the macro and B to C you know, some of the consumer companies, but B2B is booming. >>So I think >>That what do you guys are seeing? >>Absolutely. I, I completely agree that the demand will continue. Mm-hmm <affirmative> for different reasons. It could be a little bit shift within the demand as you described, but, uh, they know exactly they're on a journey in the digital transformation. If they stop now, they have a competitive disadvantage. So they are wisely in investing. So I think that the, the demand will stay here. Yes. Everybody talks about macroeconomics recession. Uh, we are confident we will see in our B2B >>Part continued demand and they're well capitalized as are a lot of the ecosystem partners. >>Yeah. And it's not a nice to have. It's a must have, I mean, I dunno of any customers that are deinvest in technology, deinvest in the life blood of their business >>Business. Exactly. Guys, thanks so much for coming on the cube. Great. Great to see you. Yeah. Congratulations on being here and, and, and best of luck with all the follow up from the show. I'm sure that lot we're gonna update next year. You see how it turned out? Yeah. >><laugh> numbers >><laugh> thanks for having us. Thank you for watching this segment. This is Dave ante for John furrier, the cubes coverage of HPE discover 22 from Las Vegas. We'll be right back.

(electronic music) >> Announcer: Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE. Covering NetApp Insight 2018. Brought to you by NetApp. >> Welcome back to theCUBE's continuing coverage of NetApp Insight 2018. From the Mandalay Bay in Las Vegas. I'm Lisa Martin with Stu Miniman and we're welcoming back to theCUBE one of our alumni, Jennifer Meyer, Senior Director of Cloud Product Marketing at NetApp. And welcoming to theCUBE Alok Arora, Senior Director of Cloud Data Services and the Product Owner for NetApp Cloud Advisor, which we'll talk about today. So guys, the keynote this morning, one of the things that George Kurian, your CEO, whose going to be on the program I think next with Stu and me, talked about the four pillars of digital transformation, and one of them was hybrid and multi-cloud is now the de facto architecture. Jennifer, from a cloud marketing, product marketing stand point, how is NetApp engaging with your customers, both your install base enterprise customers and engaging with new customer to help them evolve a successful multi-cloud strategy? >> Well what's funny about that is it's not really even up to us, it's up to the customer and where they're at today, meeting them there and then taking them kind of to that destination that's interesting or important for them. And what we know today is that not only are customers in the cloud because they want to be close to innovation, that's one of our big themes, inspiring innovation with the cloud, but they've got their hands in multiple clouds. And studies show that at least 80-81% of customers are doing multi-cloud with two or more public clouds, and I think that's really interesting, you know I think that in some cases it's because their end uses, or their customers, have chosen a cloud that they want to go with and so they're trying to service those needs where they exist, but also maybe they realize that they want to subscribe or consume services in one cloud versus what's available in another cloud, and so it's not our job really to tell them where to go, it's to make sure we've got a consistent seamless amount of services to give these customers to consume, wherever they may be, in whichever public cloud. >> Yeah, well I like what you said, meeting them where they are, cause I think in some ways we're giving customers a little bit of credit that this was actually planned for as to how they got to where they are, you know I'm sure if we took that 81% that say they know they're multi-cloud, if we go with the other 19%, most of them are probably multi-cloud and just don't realize it. >> Jennifer: Absolutely. >> Because just like we had an IT in the old day, I have an application, a business unit, or somebody drives something, and oh my gosh, that's how we ended up with silos, we ended up breaking those things apart. >> Or shadow IT, right? You've got a lot of developers that know exactly what tools they want. >> We had a good discussion with Anthony Lye and Ted Brockway talking about Azure and some unique functionality that NetApp's looking to drive into that partnership with Microsoft. I wonder if we could step back, if you could help us understand kind of the cloud portfolio of NetApp, people that just know NetApp as "Oh it's, that's that filer company that I've probably "got a lot of products from." The multi-cloud has been evolving, for quite a few years now, so I want to help understand the breadth and depth of the offering. >> That's right and I think you know we always think about it almost like a four layer stack, in terms of our strategy and what we're doing to bring more of these innovative data services to our install base to your point, but also our net new buyers, folks that are coming to us through Microsoft Azure, or Google Cloud, or AWS, and so it really does start with our legacy and our foundation of, in this case, cloud storage, and the data services, or the advanced data management that's built upon those storage protocols. So of course it's NFS, NSMB, but when you think about being able to offer that, and compliment what's available in the public clouds today, because that's why they've chosen to partner with NetApp. On top of that we are delivering advanced services in those public clouds that have never been available before, things like automatic snapshots, or rapid cloning, and backup, and tiering, and I think it's really important because what it does is it extends our customers' experience from On-prem into the public cloud, without having to sacrifice a thing. >> Alok, it's a tough thing that customers are trying to figure out. When I look at it and talk to customers, they've got an application portfolio. What are they modernizing? What are they starting from fresh? And then they've got all the other stuff that they have, how is NetApp helping with what they do? >> Yeah, absolutely, I think that's a great point. So you talked about the offerings that we have with multi-cloud and that creates all the options for future state architecture, I can build there, however, in order to understand how do I get there I need to understand where I am today, right? So we start looking at your current state footprint, we look at our customer's current state footprint. Understand how it is architected. How it is designed, how it is serving up the applications. Because it can be really a tedious job to get started, to get to the cloud and building the roadmap. So what Cloud Advisor does is it leverages active IQ data to get that inside for us and be leveraging data science, machine learning, to give them a guidance as to how they can get there. What should be their migration approach. How should they build a transition strategy. Because a lot of times they would call the consultants to help with the transition strategy, at the end they get a PowerPoint, which is not very actionable. We started this grounds up, we understand their detail you know, how the stuff, the bits and bites, are organized so we start giving them an actionable strategy they can execute upon. So that's really Cloud Advisor geared for accelerating that journey to the cloud that our customers should be taking to. >> How are you guys helping customers to start embracing emerging technologies, IoT devices, we had Ducati on this morning, a MotoGP bike is basically an IoT device, but in terms of, Jennifer you talked about this, and Alok you reinforced it, you are basically co-developing in partnership with your customers, it's about where they, helping them understand where they are, what they can do today. How are some of the services helping them to be able to harness the power of AI, say for example, to work with data authority to use that data for actionable business insight, and outcomes? >> Yeah it's interesting you talk about the IoT, I think NetApp saw that 20 years ago. I mean ASAP is our original IoT, that is what we get billions of data points from our customers. Controllers, millions of controllers worldwide, and we build on that mirror data, and we apply the artificial intelligence in there. We actually start looking at classifying their applications so that, if they have a strategy driven by the application, as you were saying, hey there is a director from a BU, from majority point of view, we want to take these applications in the cloud. How do you figure out what application are? Where does the data live? How does it governed? We figure that out by that IoT data, by that artificial intelligence and also making sure that these applications, no work loads are left behind because applications can be complicated they talk to each other. So when you start thinking about taking one part of the application, you also want to make sure the other parts that make that application whole also go to the cloud. And that is where we're leveraging Artificial Intelligence to cluster these applications and recommending the customer that: "Hey don't make, don't leave these workloads behind "because otherwise you're going to have a failed strategy." So we warn them upfront to make sure they're successful when they start making the executions. >> I think another piece to that too is just the fact that for many years we've had workloads just trapped On-prem. They haven't had a place to go into the public cloud without a ton of refactoring or rearchitecting, right. You'd have to rewrite them for objectory. You'd have to do a lot of manual labor and things just to make it happen. In most cases it hasn't been worth it. And so when you looked at the fact that about 80% of On-prem files where in NFS V3 protocol, there wasn't really a place in the public cloud to match that and so by even just delivering Cloud Volumes Service for Google Cloud and AWS or Azure NetApp Files which is the version for Azure, we're able to give customers an, a way to free up that trapped set of workloads, put those into the public hub, so that it then can be available to all of those advanced services that live on those public clouds to do things like Big Data Analytics or to do developing, you know, applications and services of their own and for their own benefit. >> You Know. >> Yeah I think that's a great point because >> He's so excited.| >> Sorry. >> Because when you start looking at building your strategy you want to have confidence in your strategy. >> Jennifer: right. >> So, with your protocols and all that discovery. We also not only give you the option that NetApp offers but show you what are the other options you have within Hyperscalers and how would your workload perform with NetApp technology. So you can move with confidence, right. So that's the good part of about Cloud Advisor to make sure you're moving with confidence not just, you know, with a blind spot with you. >> You know one of the transitions we've been watching is really the ascendancy with the developer in DevOps. And I've talked to the SolidFire team for many years, I see them at some of the shows that we've been covering. In the Keynote this morning George Kurian said that Kubernetes and Istio are the multi-Cloud control plane. Jennifer I'm wondering if you can help explain the StackPointCloud acquisition. >> Jennifer: (agrees) >> Some people that might not have the context of about what NetApp and SolidFire, even before the acquisition were doing. You know, we're being like: "Wait I don't understand, you know." >> Sure. >> Kubernetes is something That you know Google and you know, Red Hat and others are doing. >> Why is NetApp talking about Kubernetes? >> Why is NetApp talking about Kubernetes? >> And we even learned what the abbreviation for is was. >> Stu: K8s. >> It's like we're all hip. Absolutely. >> Absolutely, just because. >> It's all about concatenate long words together. So it, it's really interesting because when I talked about that four layer strategy, right the third layer. So it's you know cloud storage at the bottom. Then it's the advanced capabilities and data management above that. But the one that's next is orchestration and integration. And there's really a few things that live in there. You know, the, our cloud orchestration sort of technology is really what we got from our Qstack acquisition. Our teams in Iceland and what they've been able to do largely to underpin a lot of what we've seen with cloud volume service today. But certainly right in there is NetApp Kubernetes service, which as you now know, is from our StackPoint intellectual property. And so back on September 18th, when we announced this acquisition it was really to kind of give our developers and our DevOps folks a way to finally start solving for some of that data gravity that I think we've been periled by over the last few years. And what we now know is Kubernetes is the operating system of the clouds, right. It is the clear winner of container orchestration among things so it made a lot of sense to pair that kind of multi-cloud orchestration again given our strategy to be where our customers want to be with some of our cloud orchestration technology from our Qstack acquisition and make sure that with Trident and some of the ways that we're able to deliver finally persistent storage to those containers. I mean this is like a match made in heaven. Right, we're going to give people the way to make sure that they know that containers are a femoral and data is not. So let's help them do kind of all the things that they want to do in the clouds if they want to do them. >> I think I read on line that, was the StackPointCloud acquisition based on after actually NetApp used it internally. >> Jennifer: Yes. >> Tell us a little bit more about that. Because I think the NetApp on that up story is probably something that could be leverage, you're a marketer, as a differentiator when customers have so much choice. >> Well and I feel like it's a story that every vendor should be forced to tell. If you're not willing to use your own IP and technology what is that saying to your customers. >> Lisa: Yeah. >> So it is true and a lot of our developer teams, if you've hear of Jonsi Stefansson and Anthony Lye's team, that is how this sort of came about as we were looking for a way to sort of do it ourselves. And we thought man through all this investigation there's something here. There's something that we shouldn't hold to ourselves and we should share with the rest of the world. And so at one point we need to get those guys on with you as well so they can tell a little bit more about their story. >> So proof is always in the pudding. Can you give uan example of one of your favorite customer stories. We'll start with you Alok. Who have really embraced the clouds, first of all helped you develop the optimal cloud services are now really achieving big business benefits with the cloud services NetApp is developing. >> Yeah so, several of the customers as we talked to you and specially for Cloud Advisor, as we were looking at their journey as they were starting to think about how much money they were spending upfront to figure out a strategy, they had a strategy driven by a data center that was, were the lease was coming up, and so they had to plan to evacuate that data center into the cloud from there they need to figure out what applications they're running there obviously the virtualization also was there, so that had to be configured in the cloud. So we started thinking about in that use case that we need to provide these triggers and strategy points to our customers. At the same time the other shift that we saw was that these guys were not just talking amongst the infrastructure teams, they had to talk to the application owners and they had to have conversations with CFO's to talk about the economics of the clouds. So we made sure that when we build this that give them the tools that enable them to talk to various stakeholders. Give them the application footprint that is running there. Give them the economics. What it is going to cost to run these applications and workloads that they have identify too when they're in the cloud. So give them the data point that they can go and talk to their CFO. So with that really it starts shaping a product that will meet their needs and meet the needs of all of our customers. >> Lisa: Jennifer, favorite customer example. >> Oh, it's easy this week because it's all about WuXi NextCODE and I don't know if you picked up on any of their story cause we've plastered it around our conference this week because we're so proud of, not only what they're doing as a mission which is very impressive in terms of genomics sequencing and the scale at which they're doing it but the fact that they've based their foundation now on NetApp Cloud Volume services is huge. And really what they came to us and said is: "Look, we are trying to sequence all of these genomes "in parallel and our benchmark is really to look at about "a hundred thousand individuals at once." When they were trying to do that on their own, using there own self-managed storage in the cloud, they could never complete it. It would either fail or they would have some sort of a problem where they just couldn't get it to work. And with NetApp Cloud Volume Service they were able to complete in about 45 minutes. And so what their finding is again with this extreme performance, with the ability to scale and most importantly the tie it back to our discussion, it's multi-cloud, they themselves are multi-cloud because of their big pharma and hospitals that they serve. They have customers in every one of those public clouds and so we are able to help them where ever they need us to be. And that's very exciting. >> It's also one of those great examples that everybody understands. Genomic sequencing related to healthcare, you know disease predictions and things like that. So it's a story that resonates well. >> Jennifer: Sure. >> But something that you just said sort of reminded me of one of the four principles that George Kurian talked about this morning. And speed is the new scale. And this sounds like a customer who's achieving that in spades. >> Well it's so fun because I think for a long time we've been really fast On-prem and I think people have just sort of come to expect a certain level of it's good enough in the public cloud and what we're showing them in droves again on AWS GCP or with Azure is that you should expect more. Particularly for high-performance computing workloads or things that you really just, if you're moving your SAP workloads to the cloud and speed is, there is no option it has to be fast. We are showing people now possibilities that they didn't ever dream of before because of this extreme performance through things like Cloud Volumes Service. >> It's really too bad you guys aren't excited about this. (laughs) >> I know how much longer do you have? >> (laughs) Jennifer, Alok, thank you so much for stopping by and having a chat with Stu and me. And talking about how customers are really helping NetApp become a data authority that they need to be to help customers become data driven. We appreciate your time. >> It's our pleasure. >> Have a great time at the rest of the show. >> Thank you. >> Thank you both. >> Thank you. >> For Stu Miniman, I'm Lisa Martin. You're watching theCUBE live from NetApp Insight 2018, from Mandalay Bay, Las Vegas. Stick around Stu and I will be back shortly with our next guest. (electronic music)

>> Announcer: Live from Madrid, Spain, it's the Cube, covering HPE Discover Madrid 2017, brought to you by Hewlett Packard Enterprise. >> Welcome back to Madrid, Spain everybody, this is the Cube, the leader in live tech coverage. We're here covering HPE Discover 2017. I'm Dave Vellante with my cohost for the week, Peter Burris, Randy Meyer is back, he's the vice president and general manager Synergy and Mission Critical Solutions at Hewlett Packard Enterprise and Paul Shellerd is here, the director of the Center for Theoretical Cosmology at Cambridge University, thank you very much for coming on the Cube. >> It's a pleasure. >> Good to see you again. >> Yeah good to be back for the second time this week. I think that's, day stay outlets play too. >> Talking about computing meets the cosmos. >> Well it's exciting, yesterday we talked about Superdome Flex that we announced, we talked about it in the commercial space, where it's taking HANA and Orcale databases to the next level but there's a whole different side to what you can do with in memory compute. It's all in this high performance computing space. You think about the problems people want to solve in fluid dynamics, in forecasting, in all sorts of analytics problems, high performance compute, one of the things it does is it generates massive amounts of data that people then want to do things with. They want to compare that data to what their model said, okay can I run that against, they want to take that data and visualize it, okay how do I go do that. The more you can do that in memory, it means it's just faster to deal with because you're not going and writing this stuff off the disk, you're not moving it to another cluster back and forth, so we're seeing this burgeoning, the HPC guys would call it fat nodes, where you want to put lots of memory and eliminate the IO to go make their jobs easier and Professor Shallard will talk about a lot of that in terms of what they're doing at the Cosmos Institute, but this is a trend, you don't have to be a university. We're seeing this inside of oil and gas companies, aerospace engineering companies, anybody that's solving these complex computational problems that have an analytical element to whether it's comparative model, visualize, do something with that once you've done that. >> Paul, explain more about what it is you do. >> Well in the Cosmos Group, of which I'm the head, we're interested in two things, cosmology, which is trying to understand where the universe comes from, the whole big bang and then we're interested in black holes, particularly their collisions which produce gravitational waves, so they're the two main areas, relativity and cosmology. >> That's a big topic. I don't even know where to start, I just want to know okay what have you learned and can you summarize it for a lay person, where are you today, what can you share with us that we can understand? >> What we do is we take our mathematical models and we make predictions about the real universe and so we try and compare those to the latest observational data. We're in a particularly exciting period of time at the moment because of a flood of new data about the universe and about black holes and in the last two years, gravitational waves were discovered, there's a Nobel prize this year so lots of things are happening. It's a very data driven science so we have to try and keep up with this flood of new data which is getting larger and larger and also with new types of data, because suddenly gravitational waves are the latest thing to look at. >> What are the sources of data and new sources of data that you're tapping? >> Well, in cosmology we're mainly interested in the cosmic microwave background. >> Peter: Yeah the sources of data are the cosmos. >> Yeah right, so this is relic radiation left over from the big bang fireball, it's like a photograph of the universe, a blueprint and then also in the distribution of galaxies, so 3D maps of the universe and we've only, we're in a new age of exploration, we've only got a tiny fraction of the universe mapped so far and we're trying to extract new information about the origin of the universe from that data. In relativity, we've got these gravitational waves, these ripples in space time, they're traversing across the universe, they're essentially earthquakes in the universe and they're sound waves or seismic waves that propagate to us from these very violent events. >> I want to take you to the gravitational waves because in many respects, it's an example of a lot of what's here in action. Here's what I mean, that the experiment and correct me if I'm wrong, but it's basically, you create a, have two lasers perpendicular to each other, shooting a signal about two or three miles in that direction and it is the most precise experiment ever undertaken because what you're doing is you're measuring the time it takes for one laser versus another laser and that time is a function of the slight stretching that comes from the gravitational rays. That is an unbelievable example of edge computing, where you have just the tolerances to do that, that's not something you can send back to the cloud, you gotta do a lot of the compute right there, right? >> That's right, yes so a gravitational wave comes by and you shrink one way and you stretch the other. >> Peter: It distorts the space time. >> Yeah you become thinner and these tiny, tiny changes are what's measured and nobody expected gravitational waves to be discovered in 2015, we all thought, oh another five years, another five years, they've always been saying, we'll discover them, we'll discover them, but it happened. >> And since then, it's been used two or three times to discover new types of things and there's now a whole, I'm sure this is very centric to what you're doing, there's now a whole concept of gravitational information, can in fact becomes an entirely new branch of cosmology, have I got that right? >> Yeah you have, it's called multimessenger astronomy now because you don't just see the universe in electromagnetic waves, in light, you hear the universe. This is qualitatively different, it's sound waves coming across the universe and so combining these two, the latest event was where they heard the event first, then they turned their telescope and they saw it. So much information came out of that, even information about cosmology, because these signals are traveling hundreds of billions of light years across to us, we're getting a picture of the whole universe as they propagate all that way, so we're able to measure the expansion rate of the universe from that point. >> The techniques for the observational, the technology for observation, what is that, how has that evolved? >> Well you've got the wrong guy here. I'm from the theory group, we're doing the predictions and these guys with their incredible technology, are seeing the data, seeing and it's imagined, the whole point is you've gotta get the predictions and then you've gotta look in the data for a needle in the haystack which is this signature of these black holes colliding. >> You think about that, I have a model, I'm looking for the needle in the haystack, that's a different way to describe an in memory analytic search pattern recognition problem, that's really what it is. This is the world's largest pattern recognition problem. >> Most precise, and literally. >> And that's an observation that confirms your theory right? >> Confirms the theory, maybe it was your theory. >> I'm actually a cosmologist, so in my group we have relativists who are actively working on the black hole collisions and making predictions about this stuff. >> But they're dampening vibration from passing trucks and these things and correcting it, it's unbelievable. But coming back to the technology, the technology is, one of the reasons why this becomes so exciting and becomes practical is because for the first time, the technology has gotten to the point where you can assume that the problem you're trying to solve, that you're focused on and you don't have to translate it in technology terms, so talk a little bit about, because in many respects, that's where business is. Business wants to be able to focus on the problem and how to think the problem differently and have the technology to just respond. They don't want to have to start with the technology and then imagine what they can do with it. >> I think from our point of view, it's a very fast moving field, things are changing, new data's coming in. The data's getting bigger and bigger because instruments are getting packed tighter and tighter, there's more information, so we've got a computational problem as well, so we've got to get more computational power but there's new types of data, like suddenly there's gravitational waves. There's new types of analysis that we want to do so we want to be able to look at this data in a very flexible way and ingest it and explore new ideas more quickly because things are happening so fast, so that's why we've adopted this in memory paradigm for a number of years now and the latest incarnation of this is the HP Superdome flex and that's a shared memory system, so you can just pull in all your data and explore it without carefully programming how the memory is distributed around. We find this is very easy for our users to develop data analytic pipelines to develop their new theoretical models and to compare the two on the single system. It's also very easy for new users to use. You don't have to be an advanced programmer to get going, you can just stay with the science in a sense. >> You gotta have a PhD in Physics to do great in Physics, you don't have to have a PhD in Physics and technology. >> That's right, yeah it's a very flexible program. A flexible architecture with which to program so you can more or less take your laptop pipeline, develop your pipeline on a laptop, take it to the Superdome and then scale it up to these huge memory problems. >> And get it done fast and you can iterate. >> You know these are the most brilliant scientists in the world, bar none, I made the analogy the other day. >> Oh, thanks. >> You're supposed to say aw, chucks. >> Peter: Aw, chucks. >> Present company excepted. >> Oh yeah, that's right. >> I made the analogy of, imagine I.M. Pei or Frank Lloyd Wright or someone had to be their own general contractor, right? No, they're brilliant at designing architectures and imagining things that no one else could imagine and then they had people to go do that. This allows the people to focus on the brilliance of the science without having to go become the expert programmer, we see that in business too. Parallel programming techniques are difficult, spoken like an old tandem guy, parallelism is hard but to the extent that you can free yourself up and focus on the problem and not have to mess around with that, it makes life easier. Some problems parallelize well, but a lot of them don't need to be and you can allow the data to shine, you can allow the science to shine. >> Is it correct that the barrier in your ability to reach a conclusion or make a discovery is the ability to find that needle in a haystack or maybe there are many, but. >> Well, if you're talking about obstacles to progress, I would say computational power isn't the obstacle, it's developing the software pipelines and it's the human personnel, the smart people writing the codes that can look for the needle in the haystack who have the efficient algorithms to do that and if they're cobbled by having to think very hard about the hardware and the architecture they're working with and how they've parallelized the problem, our philosophy is much more that you solve the problem, you validate it, it can be quite inefficient if you like, but as long as it's a working program that gets you to where you want, then your second stage you worry about making it efficient, putting it on accelerators, putting it on GPUs, making it go really fast and that's, for many years now we've bought these very flexible shared memory or in memory is the new word for it, in memory architectures which allow new users, graduate students to come straight in without a Master's degree in high performance computing, they can start to tackle problems straight away. >> It's interesting, we hear the same, you talk about it at the outer reaches of the universe, I hear it at the inner reaches of the universe from the life sciences companies, we want to map the genome and we want to understand the interaction of various drug combinations with that genetic structure to say can I tune exactly a vaccine or a drug or something else for that patient's genetic makeup to improve medical outcomes? The same kind of problem, I want to have all this data that I have to run against a complex genome sequence to find the one that gets me to the answer. From the macro to the micro, we hear this problem in all different sorts of languages. >> One of the things we have our clients, mainly in business asking us all the time, is with each, let me step back, as analysts, not the smartest people in the world, as you'll attest I'm sure for real, as analysts, we like to talk about change and we always talked about mainframe being replaced by minicomputer being replaced by this or that. I like to talk in terms of the problems that computing's been able to take on, it's been able to take on increasingly complex, challenging, more difficult problems as a consequence of the advance of technology, very much like you're saying, the advance of technology allows us to focus increasingly on the problem. What kinds of problems do you think physicists are gonna be able to attack in the next five years or so as we think about the combination of increasingly powerful computing and an increasingly simple approach to use it? >> I think the simplification you're indicating here is really going to more memory. Holding your whole workload in memory, so that you, one of the biggest bottlenecks we find is ingesting the data and then writing it out, but if you can do everything at once, then that's the key element, so one of the things we've been working on a great deal is in situ visualization for example, so that you see the black holes coming together and you see that you've set the right parameters, they haven't missed each other or something's gone wrong with your simulation, so that you do the post-processing at the same time, you never need the intermediate data products, so larger and larger memory and the computational power that balances with that large memory. It's all very well to get a fat node, but you don't have the computational power to use all those terrabytes, so that's why this in memory architecture of the Superdome Flex is much more balanced between the two. What are the problems that we're looking forward to in terms of physics? Well, in cosmology we're looking for these hints about the origin of the universe and we've made a lot of progress analyzing the Plank satellite data about the cosmic microwave background. We're honing in on theories of inflation, which is where all the structure in the universe comes from, from Heisenberg's uncertainty principle, rapid period of expansion just like inflation in the financial markets in the very early universe, okay and so we're trying to identify can we distinguish between different types and are they gonna tell us whether the universe comes from a higher dimensional theory, ten dimensions, gets reduced to three plus one or lots of clues like that, we're looking for statistical fingerprints of these different models. In gravitational waves of course, this whole new area, we think of the cosmic microwave background as a photograph of the early universe, well in fact gravitational waves look right back to the earliest moment, fractions of a nanosecond after the big bang and so it may be that the answers, the clues that we're looking for come from gravitational waves and of course there's so much in astrophysics that we'll learn about compact objects, about neutron stars, about the most energetic events there are in the whole universe. >> I never thought about the idea, because cosmic radiation background goes back what, about 300,000 years if that's right. >> Yeah that's right, you're very well informed, 400,000 years because 300 is. >> Not that well informed. >> 370,000. >> I never thought about the idea of gravitational waves as being noise from the big bang and you make sense with that. >> Well with the cosmic microwave background, we're actually looking for a primordial signal from the big bang, from inflation, so it's yeah. Well anyway, what were you gonna say Randy? >> No, I just, it's amazing the frontiers we're heading down, it's kind of an honor to be able to enable some of these things, I've spent 30 years in the technology business and heard customers tell me you transformed by business or you helped me save costs, you helped me enter a new market. Never before in 30 plus years of being in this business have I had somebody tell me the things that you're providing are helping me understand the origins of the universe. It's an honor to be affiliated with you guys. >> Oh no, the honor's mine Randy, you're producing the hardware, the tools that allow us to do this work. >> Well now the honor's ours for coming onto the Cube. >> That's right, how do we learn more about your work and your discoveries, inclusions. >> In terms of looking at. >> Are there popular authors we could read other than Stephen Hawking? >> Well, read Stephen's books, they're very good, he's got a new one called A Briefer History of Time so it's more accessible than the Brief History of Time. >> So your website is. >> Yeah our website is ctc.cam.ac.uk, the center for theoretical cosmology and we've got some popular pages there, we've got some news stories about the latest things that have happened like the HP partnership that we're developing and some nice videos about the work that we're doing actually, very nice videos of that. >> Certainly, there were several videos run here this week that if people haven't seen them, go out, they're available on Youtube, they're available at your website, they're on Stephen's Facebook page also I think. >> Can you share that website again? >> Well, actually you can get the beautiful videos of Stephen and the rest of his group on the Discover website, is that right? >> I believe so. >> So that's at HP Discover website, but your website is? >> Is ctc.cam.ac.uk and we're just about to upload those videos ourselves. >> Can I make a marketing suggestion. >> Yeah. >> Simplify that. >> Ctc.cam.ac.uk. >> Yeah right, thank you. >> We gotta get the Cube at one of these conferences, one of these physics conferences and talk about gravitational waves. >> Bone up a little bit, you're kind of embarrassing us here, 100,000 years off. >> He's better informed than you are. >> You didn't need to remind me sir. Thanks very much for coming on the Cube, great pleasure having you today. >> Thank you. >> Keep it right there everybody, Mr. Universe and I will be back after this short break. (upbeat techno music)

>> Announcer: Live from Madrid, Spain. It's the Cube. Covering HP Discover Madrid 2017. Brought to you by Hewlett Packard Enterprise. >> Good afternoon from Madrid everybody. Good morning on the East Coast. Good really early morning on the West Coast. This is the Cube, the leader in live tech coverage. We're here day one at HPE Discover Madrid 2017. My name is Dave Velonte, I'm here with my cohost Peter Berse. Randy Meyers here is the Vice President and General Manager of the Mission Critical business unit at Hewlett Packard Enterprise. And he's joined by Alexander Zhuk, who is the SAP practice lead at Eldorado. Welcome to the Cube, thanks for coming on. >> Thanks for having us. >> Thank you. >> Randy we were just reminiscing about the number of times you've been on the Cube, consecutive years, it's like the Patriots winning the AFC East it just keeps happening. >> Or Cal Ripkin would probably be you. >> Me and Tom Brady. >> You're the Cal Ripken of the Cube. So give us the update, what's happening in the Mission Critical Business unit. What's going on here at Discover. >> Well, actually just lots of exciting things going on, in fact we just finished the main general session keynote. And that was the coming out party for our new Superdome Flex product. So, we've been in the Mission Critical space for quite some time now. Driving the HANA business, we've got 2500 customers around the world, small, large. And with out acquisition last year of SGI, we got this fabulous technology, that not only scales up to the biggest and most baddest thing that you can imagine to the point where we're talking about Stephen Hawking using that to explore the universe. But it scales down, four sockets, one terabyte, for lots of customers doing various things. So I look at that part of the Mission Critical business, and it's just so exciting to take technology, and watch it scale both directions, to the biggest problems that are out there, whether they are commercial and enterprise, and Alexander will talk about lots of things we're doing in that space. Or even high performance computing now, so we've kind of expanded into that arena. So, that's really the big news Super Dome Flex coming out, and really expanding that customer base. >> Yeah, Super Dome Flex, any memory in that baby? (laughing) >> 32 sockets, 48 terabyte if you want to go that big, and it will get bigger and bigger and bigger over time as we get more density that's there. And we really do have customers in the commercial space using that. I've got customers that are building massive ERP systems, massive data warehouses to address that kind of memory. >> Alright, let's hear from the customer. Alexander, first of all, tell us about your role, and tell us about Eldorado. >> I'm responsible for SAP basis and infrastructure. I'm working in Eldorado who is one of the largest consumer electronics network in Russia. We have more than 600 shops all over the country in more than 200 cities and towns, and have more than 16,000 employees. We have more than 50,000 stock keeping units, and proceeding over three and a half million orders with our international primarily. >> SAP practice lead, obviously this is a HANA story, so can you take us through your HANA journey, what led to the decision for HANA, maybe give us the before, during and after. Leading up to the decision to move to HANA, what was life like, and why HANA? >> We first moved our business warehouse system to HANA back in 2011. It's a time we got strong business requirements to have weak reporting. So, retail business, it's a business whose needs and very rapid decision making. So after we moved to HANA, we get the speed increasing of reports giving at 15 times. We got stock replenishment reports nine times faster. We got 50 minute sales reports every hour, instead of two hours. May I repeat this? >> No, it makes sense. So, the move to HANA was really precipitated by a need to get more data faster, so in memory allows you to do that. What about the infrastructure platform underneath, was it always HP at the time, that was 2011. What's HP's role, HPE's role in that, HANA? >> Initially we were on our business system in Germany, primarily on IBM solutions. But then according to the law requirements, we intended to go to Russia. And here we choose HP solutions as the main platform for our HANA database and traditional data bases. >> Okay Data residency forced you to move this whole solution back to Russia. If I may, Dave, one of the things that we're talking about and I want to test this with you, Alexander, is businesses not only have to be able to scale, but we talk about plastic infrastructure, where they have to be able to change their work loads. They have to be able to go up and down, but they also have to be able to add quickly. As you went through the migration process, how were you able to use the technology to introduce new capabilities into the systems to help your business to grow even faster? >> At that time, before migration, we had strong business requirements for our business growing and had some forecasts how HANA will grow. So we represented to our possible partners, our needs, for example, our main requirement was the possibility to scale up our CRM system up to nine terabytes memory. So, at that time, there was only HP who could provide that kind of solution. >> So, you migrated from a traditional RDBMS environment, your data warehouse previously was a traditional data base, is that right? And then you moved to HANA? >> Not all systems, but the most critical, the most speed critical system, it's our business warehouse and our CRM system. >> How hard was that? So, the EDW and the CRM, how difficult was that migration, did you have to freeze code, was it a painful migration? >> Yes, from the application point of view it was very painful, because we had to change everything, some our reports they had to be completely changed, reviewed, they had to adopt some abap code for the new data base. Also, we got some HANA level troubles, because it was very elaborate. >> Early days of HANA, I think it was announced in 2011. Maybe 2012... (laughing) >> That's one of the things for most customers that we talk to, it's a journey. You're moving from a tried and true environment that you've run for years, but you want the benefits in memory of speed, of massive data that you can use to change your business. But you have to plan that. It was a great point. You have to plan it's gonna scale up, some things might have to scale out, and at the same time you have to think about the application migration, the data migration, the data residency rules, different countries have different rules on what has to be there. And I think that's one of the things we try to take into account as HPE when we're designing systems. I want to let you partition them. I want to let you scale them up or down depending on the work load that's there. Because you don't just have one, you have BW and CRM, you have development environments, test environments, staging environments. The more we can help that look similar, and give you flexibility, the easier that is for customers. And then I think it's incumbent on us also to make sure we support our customers with knowledge, service, expertise, because it really is a journey, but you're right, 2011 it was the Wild West. >> So, give us the HPE HANA commercial. Everybody always tells us, we're great at HANA, we're best at HANA. What makes HPE best at HANA, different with HANA? >> What makes us best at HANA, one, we're all in on this, we have a partnership with SAP, we're designing for the large scale, as you said, that nobody else is building up into this space. Lots of people are building one terabyte things, okay. But when you really want to get real, when you want to get to 12 terabytes, when you want to get to 24 to 48. We're not only building systems capable of that, we're doing co-engineering and co-innovation work with SAP to make that work, to test that. I put systems on site in Waldorf, Germany, to allow them to go do that. We'll go diagnose software issues in the HANA code jointly, and say, here's where you're stressing that, and how we can go leverage that. You couple that with our services capability, and our move towards, you'll consume HANA in a lot of different ways. There will be some of it that you want on premise, in house, there will be some things that you say, that part of it might want to be in the Cloud. Yes, my answer to all of those things is yes. How do I make it easy to fit your business model, your business requirements, and the way you want to consume things economically? How do I alow you to say yes to that? 2500 customers, more than half of the installed base of all HANA systems worldwide reside on Hewlett Packard Enterprise. I think we're doing a pretty good job of enabling customers to say, that's a real choice that we can go forward with, not just today, but tomorrow. >> Alexander, are you doing things in the Cloud? I'm sure you are, what are you doing in the Cloud? Are you doing HANA in the Cloud? >> We have not traditional Cloud, as to use it to say, now we have a private Cloud. We have during some circumstance, we got all the hardware into our property. Now, it's operating by our partner. Between two company they are responsible for all those layers from hardware layer, service contracts, hardware maintenance, to the basic operation systems support, SEP support. >> So, if you had to do it all over again, what might you do differently? What advice would you give to other customers going down this journey? >> My advice is to at first, choose the right team and the right service provider. Because when you go to solution, some technical overview, architectural overview, you should get some confirmation from vendor. At first, it should be confirmed by HP. It should be confirmed by SEP. Also, there is a financial question, how to sponsor all this thing. And we got all these things from HP and our service partner. >> Right, give you the last word. >> So, one, it's an exciting time. We're watching this explosion of data happening. I believe we've only just scratched the surface. Today, we're looking at tens of thousands of skews for a customer, and looking at the velocity of that going through a retail chain. But every device that we have, is gonna have a sensor in it, it's gonna be connected all the time. It's gonna be generating data to the point where you say, I'm gonna keep it, and I'm gonna use it, because it's gonna let me take real time action. Some day they will be able to know that the mobile phone they care about is in their store, and pop up an offer to a customer that's exactly meaningful to do that. That confluence of sensor data, location data, all the things that we will generate over time. The ability to take action on that in real time, whether it's fix a part before it fails, create a marketing offer to the person that's already in the store, that allows them to buy more. That allows us to search the universe, in search for how did we all get here. That's what's happening with data. It is exploding. We are at the very front edge of what I think is gonna be transformative for businesses and organizations everywhere. It is cool. I think the advent of in memory, data analytics, real time, it's gonna change how we work, it's gonna change how we play. Frankly, it's gonna change human kind when we watch some of these researchers doing things on a massive level. It's pretty cool. >> Yeah, and the key is being able to do that wherever the data lives. >> Randy: Absolutely >> Gentlemen, thanks very much for coming on the Cube. >> Thank you for having us. >> Your welcome, great to see you guys again. Alright, keep it right there everybody, Peter and I will be back with our next guest, right after this short break. This is the Cube, we're live from HPE Discover Madrid 2017. We'll be right back. (upbeat music)

(upbeat techno) >> Announcer: Live, from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE. Covering NetApp Insight 2017. Brought to you by, NetApp. >> Hello, everyone, welcome back to our Cube coverage, exclusive coverage here at the NetApp Insight 2017. This is theCUBE, I'm John Furrier, the co-host, co-founder of the SiliconANGLE Keith Townsend CTO advisor here in Las Vegas, Nevada at the Mandalay Bay, our next guest is Jennifer Meyer, senior director cloud product marketing, and Ingo Fuchs who's the senior manager cloud product marketing. You guys are doing a lot of the heavy lifting on the front lines for NetApp on the cloud, welcome to theCUBE, good to see you. >> Thank you so much for having us. >> Okay, so, we've been covering it, but now it's pretty clear there's a cloud play, there is a cloud play for Netapp, you guys are showing product, lot of products in the keynotes, both in the data center in the next generation but the cloud's the big part of the story, it's certainly we hear resonating with customers, and all the guests that have come up on the A teams, and your partner channels, all are like this is really, really great thing. >> Yeah, I think -- >> Part of the plan? >> Absolutely part of the plan, I mean if you caught any of the latest messaging which, you know, Jean and the team have worked really hard on, it's all about us being the data authority and the hybrid cloud, right, and so, if you think about, let's unpack hybrid cloud, there's only about 1% of the population of the planet that's not adopting cloud in some way, and we believe that after the last 25 years of our history in data management and our leadership with things like ONTAP that we are well-equipped to help people get there, how they want to get there and with what, right. >> And you have an install base too, so you've been selling boxes, everyone knows you for selling, that's an old term but I'm showing my age, (Jennifer laughs) hardware, but hardware's not going away either, Amazon makes their own stuff too, so you got to still store stuff, so storage will be there, servers will be there, hyperconverging, all that's happening under the hood, but the software's where the value is, certainly, you know, we have expression at SiliconANGLE, software's eating the world as Mark Andreesen said, but data's eating software, Anthony, your general manager came on and said, you know, data is trumping applications, used to be applications had data, now data has applications. >> Right. >> So that flips things, upside-down, and you guys got to go build that market out for your customers. How do your customers at NetApp, and prospective customers, new customers, NetNew, engage with NetApp and what's the positioning, what's the value? >> Yeah, there are a lot of different ways to do it. So if you're an existing NetApp customer today, a really really easy way to get into the cloud, so we have one of our product called ONTAP Cloud, it's our storage operating system, the number one operating system in the world, running inside Azure and AWS hyperscalers so you use all the same tools, all the same mechanisms that you would use on premises, but you're now running in the cloud, so that makes it really easy to lift and shift applications that are using NFS or CIFS or iSCSI protocols, straight into the cloud, because you have the same storage operating system that you have on premises, you have datafication, you have snapshot, you have cloning, you have all of the advantages of data management infrastructure that has been developed over the last 25 years. >> So some of the push-back that I've seen is that, yeah, you have the tooling, but isn't the cloud all about the new? Can you actually build new apps with on, using ONTAP and Microsoft Azure NFS, can you talk to us a little bit about the story, about not just bringing your legacy tools, quote unquote, but also, the new capabilities that developers will find as a result of the cloud offerings. >> Yeah, absolutely, I think in my opinion the most exciting announcement this week, and others may argue differently -- >> You're a little biased. >> You're a little bit, yeah. >> I'm a little bit biased, because you know, >> We'll take it with a grain of salt. >> It's my baby so I do care about it, is that we, that Microsoft announced, and that we announced that we are the technology provider for Microsoft launching an Enterprise-class NFS service natively in Azure. Now, if you think about that, if it runs natively in Azure, it sits right next to the infrastructure that is processing HDInsight, that's running SQL server, Microsoft announced that they are having SQL running on Linux, so suddenly having an Enterprise cloud very very fast, high performance, managed by NetApp NFS service running natively in Azure opens up the opportunities to do IoT, run your Enterprise databases against this infrastructure and really opening up the door for customers to do more. And because you're using tools like HDInsight, you can run analytics, you can now expand into AI, into machine learning, all of that is now open to people that are cloud-native, and cloud natives don't want to go back and learn how to manage a storage infrastructure, that's not a good use of their time, so something like the NFS service in Azure, you don't have to learn how to do storage, all you do is go to the portal, you provision it, you click on it, it's running, it's done. >> I think that's a really important point, because everybody just hears it's a new native or first-party service in Azure, which frankly is industry-first. I mean, nobody, especially from the storage provider standpoint is doing that today, but I think the ability to get all those Enterprise-class services without it feeling like a prostate exam is probably a first for everybody. (men laughing) >> Probably you get, you get put under for that these days, but I mean, my point is, the multi-cloud thing's interesting to me, and I think you guys have hit on something with the Cloud Orchestrator product we saw on stage, the demo, is that multi-cloud, customers don't want to be locked in. >> That's right. >> That's the number one thing we hear in theCUBE, and the suppliers, whoa, we don't lock in, now open-source has been growing, that's great, but you know, the new lock-in as we still call it, is functionality, are you helping customers scale up and scale out at the same time, so the question for you is, how far along is that cloud orchestrator, and is that the guiding principle of the cloud group to seamlessly, first of all the cloud orchestrator allows you to move data around just by clicking buttons, so it takes away all the under-the-covers work that's needed. >> That's right. >> 'Cause each cloud has its own architecture. >> That's right. >> How they do things. So, that's a value quotient I think will be a home run. >> It is, and a big priority for NetApp and specifically in our cloud business unit and our cloud marketing is to make sure that people feel like they have the freedom to choose where they want to go and how, right, and so think about it like a compass, a compass still needs you to pick the destination, and it tells you the best way to get there. That's really sort of what we're trying to do and the orchestrator is just a very flexible way to help people do it, even at the API level. >> Alright, so for all the naysayers out there that are, oh NetApp, they're just cloud washing, they're not really in the cloud game, what does this mean, how do you put that to rest, 'cause I know you've been involved in Amazon for some time, now with the Microsoft deal pretty significant, what do you say to the naysayers or customers that might learn for the first time wow, good story there, or there's a path to the cloud. >> You know, we joked one time we should have an entire marketing campaign that said, oh, I didn't know NetApp did that, because there are so many things, even me, being fairly new to NetApp that I didn't even know we were doing, let alone how long we were doing them for, so it might shock some people to know that we've been doing the ONTAP cloud product for four years, I mean four years, and that product frankly was born out of our own need to abstract the software and test it on our own for TestApp, right, >> Well Jean's in town so she's a good marketer so she should do a good job of changing the marketing angle, but the tell sign to me at events is on keynotes, right, this is to me the relevance barometer, I think Amazon has really nailed this, they have so many announcements they can't even keep track of them, they actually, there's just a tsunami, and that is an indicator of success, and that's to me the competitive advantage, keep on introducing new products. You guys had how many products introduced on stage today, I mean, it was just not enough time. >> A lot, the payload was huge. >> There's a huge -- >> It's a really good sign of momentum and what's to come, yeah. >> Great sign, great sign. And I think what's going to, I'm sorry, we're so excited we can't even help ourselves. (men laughing) I think what's going to be interesting and a challenge for marketing moving forward is how do you put a net around it when you want to announce it, because when you look at continuous innovation and delivery, we're going to be doing something every few days, right, once a month, once every two weeks, so -- >> Well you guys have a good install base, and I always said you can't go out of business if you have money in the bank and if you have customers, thousands of customers do you guys have, not losing that core, building on the core, so how are you guys, from a product marketing standpoint, you got to package to the core, you got to have your core base, but now you have new constituencies, new personas in your base, now, developing, you have analytics, you have chief data officers, you have the guy who's going to be thinking about governance now and GP, GS, >> GDPR. >> G, D, >> G, D, P, R, >> G, E, P, R. Gettin' late in the day. (Jennifer laughing) But it's a global skill, you guys now have a new territory to take down, what's the plan? >> You take that one. >> Yeah, I think it's a really interesting one. Let me give you a specific example, and then we can broaden the story a little bit, but we recognize that one of the problems that our customers have is packing up their SAS environments. So that they have come from on-premises environments, where they were maybe using our storage, maybe not, moved into the cloud, and now, like one of our customers was talking recently about, he has hundreds of SAS providers, and he doesn't really know what data they have, so he's concerned about data protection, he's concerned about losing that data, obviously hacking attacks and similar things. >> Yeah. >> So we actually started a program around a product that we call Cloud Control, and Cloud Control for Office 365 is a first iteration of that that we launched just a few months ago, and it takes the Office 365 data and protects it and retains that data so that if something happens, somebody hacks, somebody corrupts your files, your CEO deletes emails and three months later you want it back, that data is there and it's protected and it's secure, so that's a native cloud service, you don't buy any equipment from us, your earlier comment about moving boxes, so the cloud for us is a great vehicle to get to these new buyers, and the interest that we're getting back is tremendous, but you're absolutely right that we need to find different ways and we are finding different ways to get to these buyers, to get to these personas that are out there. >> Well, not having a hardware-specific thing is certainly a great way, cloud, I mean. >> Exactly. >> Absolutely. >> you got a lot of data back in the recovery, there's no walls in the cloud, so the on-premises paradigm changes it a lot. >> Yeah, and this time we're talking SAS to SAS, right? >> That's great, so ecosystem partners, one of the big successes is partnerships. What's the strategy on partners, I mean cloud-native foundation, cloud CNCF cloud native compute foundations has grown, who's in there are you guys getting involved in that, what's your position, what's the strategy for partnering. >> Yeah, so as you would expect, you know, cloud is different enough that one framework doesn't match the things that we've been doing for those 25 years that we've been so successful in this business, so what we've tried to do in this new cloud first partner program that we've launched several months ago is really target our cloud native partners, these guys that couldn't care less about on-prem, they don't even know how to spell the word storage, and see how do we help service them with some of these great data services that we're bringing to bear, really, and these guys have no previous NetApp history with us. And we've got, you know, a couple dozen partners that have already signed up on our behalf, and we'll continue that momentum, but we're certainly excited to give them a new level of treatment that NetApp hasn't done before. >> So I would love to hear feedback from the lower-level from the ecosystem. NetApp I think, which is I think is a good thing, is very opinionated when it comes to its approach to cloud. This isn't oh, bring any old object store to the, it's you know what if you adopt ONTAP, if you adapt NetApp, data-driven vision, the data fabric, if you adopt that, then you enable a new level of cloud mobility. So if you, as you've brought that nest to the ecosystem, what's been the response, I mean a lot of these guys are pretty opinionated themselves. >> I was going to say you've already talked to Anthony and he's pretty opinionated. >> Yes (laughing). >> Yeah, no I think it's well-received, right, I mean, who doesn't want the ability to have some freedom to move around and choose their partners as we go, and I think one thing that Ingo was alluding to earlier is the fact that we're pretty heterogeneous in our data services, you don't have to have NetApp to be able to benefit from Cloud Control, or Cloud Sync, or OnCommand Insight, which is one of our sort of business insight tools for infrastructure and cloud-cost monitoring. So, it's nice to be able to give them a more sort of open message, but still have a pretty strong opinion on where people need to go and why. >> So let's talk about Cloud Control a little bit more, is Cloud Control an API, or is that just a, is that only control plane? >> It's a service, so it's a native cloud service, you can buy it on the marketplace, you can do free trials, you don't buy any hardware anywhere, it will grab the data through official APIs out of Office 365 and store it in a choice of locations, so we can host the storage for you, or you can store it in AWS, you can store it in Azure, or you can store it on-premises and storage with AppScale, which is our object store, so you know, for some customers it's important for compliance reasons to have an off-site on-premises copy, other customers would prefer to use Azure, use AWS, depends on what kind of licensing agreement, or massive purchase agreements they might have, so we give our customers that flexibility, but that is an example for native cloud service. We have another one that's called Cloud Sync, which is a data migration tool, you can go from CIFS, NFS, or S3, to CIFS, NFS, or S3. To, and it transforms the data, so you can go from an NFS source and move it natively into an S3 object in the cloud. It's another example for a native cloud service, it's not a license, it's not something that you buy and install on-premises. >> So that brings a question about data mobility today, I know cloud orchestrator is something that's coming in the future, but as far as data mobility, can I do something as simple as, say, or as complex, depending on your perspective, say I have two AWS regions, I'm front-ending this with ONTAP and I'm using ONTAP as a filer, and I want to replicate storage from one AWS region to another one, can I do that with object in the back-end and then use ONTAP to present that as files on both coasts, for example? >> Yeah, it depends a little bit on your application, the database that you're using, but say you're using ONTAP cloud, you can replicate between regions using cross-region replication, that's easy. But what's different is we have HA, so what you can do with ONTAP cloud is that you can do a fail-over from one availability zone to another availability zone, and that's all managed within the software. So if you're thinking about moving Enterprise application, mission-critical applications running production inside the cloud, you definitely do want to have HA, we did, we tackled this a little bit different for the NFS Azure service 'cause we were running and operating the infrastructure that is underneath the Azure portal so we have the reliability built into our product because it's running on our equipment. So we have complete control over that. >> Guys, final question, I know we got to go but I want to get your thoughts on management software, because the management game is changing the cloud too, as the trend of having the same code bases running on-prem or on the cloud, or applications working across multiple clouds brings up the role of the folks that are being shifted to high-value activities. One of them is, you know, managing dashboards automating some of the system management, application management, OnCommand has been around for a long, long time, NetApp has a history of good management tooling. How does that translate to the products in the cloud? >> It does, and I want to pull back to talk a little bit about OnCommand Insight 'cause we kind of overlook it because it's been around for a little while and it's more traditionally thought of as an SRM tool, but really, some of the capabilities that we've talked about even as early as today, was the fact that now we're extending sort of those infrastructure analytics and those business insights so you can identify resources that are wasted or places where you're out of capacity and you're bottlenecking, now into the cloud for things like cost-monitoring. So, imagine you're a CIO and you have people going around your back swiping credit cards to find whatever tools they want to use in the SAS universe to get their jobs done, only you have no idea where they're spending your money. Now you'll have the ability to look at almost a unified bill and see which departments are charging what money, and charge back those departments to keep them accountable in your budget. >> John: We call that the toolshed problem. >> Toolshed >> All these tools. >> They're everywhere. >> They're everywhere, don't be a tool, get out, get that toolshed, there's too many things in a tool, you get too many tools >> We have a lot of tools. Yeah, so we're happy to have things like that that help to give people a little bit more empowerment to first identify what's going on and how to fix it. >> The problem is though, in tools, they buy a tool, sometimes it turns into something else, like you buy a hammer and it turns into a lawnmower, but that's not what it's designed for. >> That's right. >> You can't mow your lawn with a hammer. >> You can't. >> So a final question before we break is product marketing focus. What's your to-do items, you guys got your list, I know you're making decisions on there with the product teams on how to take it to market, what's the to-do list for you guys. >> I'll give my answer and then I'll let you close, but it's messaging, messaging, messaging, right? I think in marketing we traditionally get sick of our own message before sometimes our audiences have heard it, and certainly we don't want to let Jean down, because she's done such a phenomenal job of getting the ship steered in a singular direction, so you're going to see a lot of big bold messages from us, a lot of us not being apologetic about some of the great IP that we've got and some of the things that we're doing, so we want to be sort of out there, reiterating that we're helping people harness the power of the hybrid cloud, and that we are the data authority on the hybrid cloud. >> And they say position it and they will come. That's absolutely right, anything you'd like to add? >> You know, so I spend a lot of time both with our internal product team and with our partners like Microsoft for example, it's really exciting the last few weeks, and the great thing for me is that we have more and more partners coming to us, wanting to leverage our products and working with us and understanding how they can participate in the data fabric vision, how can they be part of this network of partners and solutions and services that we're building, and that has been really, really exciting, cloud is real, and we're making it work. >> We're a little excited. >> Cloud is real, we look forward to following up, I'll have to get you guys into the studio in Palo Alto, a lot to talk about, lot more certainly, Kubernetes containers, we're getting a huge renaissance in application development that's going to create a lot of value, you guys are at the center of it. That's the keyword, the center of the action, here in Las Vegas with NetApp Insight 2017, we'll be right back with more live coverage afterwards I'm John Furrier, Keith Townsend, we'll be right back. (upbeat techno)

>> Announcer: Live from Stanford University, it's the Cube, covering the Women in Data Science Conference 2017. (electronic music) >> Hi, and welcome back to the Cube. I'm Lisa Martin live at the Women in Data Science Conference, second annual, here at Stanford University, #WiDS2017. Fortunate to be joined next by Miriah Meyer, who is an Assistant Professor at the University of Utah in the School of Computing. Miriah, welcome to the Cube. >> Thank you. >> It's great to have you here. You're a speaker at this event this year. >> Yes. >> Tell us a little bit about how you got involved in WiDS and what excites you about being able to speak to this very passionate, invigorating audience? >> Yeah, so I got an invitation from one of the organizers, seems like quite some time ago, and when I looked into the conference, it just looked fantastic. I was so impressed with the speakers they had last year and the speakers for this year. It's a really amazing powerhouse of a community here. The fact that it's a great technical conference that, oh, just happens to be all women, it was pretty awesome, I was pretty flattered to get invited. Then the sort of, the energy in there is really awesome. It is different, it feels different than other technical conferences I go to. >> I completely agree. I love that you talked about just the community, because that's really what it is, and I think some of the, just the vibe that you can feel sitting here is one of excitement, it's one of passion of women who have been in this industry for a very long time in computer science, and then those young girls who are looking for inspiration. I think it's very symbiotic, right? They're learning from you, but I think you're probably also learning from them. >> Definitely. I find that every time I present my work to another group of people, a different community, I always have to come up against what my own assumptions are about how easy or not it is to understand the kind of work I do. I personally find it just so important to communicate clearly, it's probably partly why I do the work that I do. But I learn a lot every time I give a talk at a place like this. >> Wow, outstanding. Well, speaking of your talk, your research is in visualization systems. Share with us what you shared with the audience today, goals, outcomes, current outcomes of your visualization research. >> Mm-hmm. My research passion is around helping people make sense of complex data. I've particularly done a lot of work with scientists, particularly that in biology, where there's just been this amazing explosion of data and people are just trying to wrap their heads around what they have and what kinds of amazing discoveries they're sitting on. But it's really interesting, we've gotten so good at creating data, but then, that's wonderful, but if you can't make sense of it, who cares? >> Lisa: Right. >> I have this incredibly privileged position where I get to go and work with people who are at the cutting edge of their field and learn about this amazing work that they've been spending their lifetime on. Then I help them, I design tools with them that sometimes changes even the way that they're thinking about the problem. It's incredibly satisfying and it's very much in the spirit of team science and it's a lot of fun. I was talking about just some of the basics behind how do you create effective visualizations, which, for me, it also draws heavily on the notion of how do we collaborate effectively, how do you get at people's deep needs when it comes to making sense of data, when they often times can't articulate it themselves. I refer to it as data counseling, because it feels very much like, I talk with people who have problems but they can't articulate it, so I ask them lots of questions to help them uncover the root of their problems. >> Lisa: Right. >> That's basically what I do. >> That data counseling. That's fantastic. >> Yeah, and then you use what you discover in order to design tools. >> Share with us a little bit about the courses that you teach in Computer Science at the University of Utah. >> Yeah, so I teach a graduate level visualization course. It is just about the basic foundational principles we have behind perception and cognition and what that means for how we encode information, and then also, the process of how do you evaluate visualizations effectively. It's a really wonderful course where we have people from, actually, all across campus, so a lot of people are bringing problems that they have in other fields and trying to learn how to be more effective in their own exploration with visualizations. Then at the undergrad level, I actually teach our second semester programming course, so these things are worlds apart. This is one of our large 200 person introduction to data structures and algorithms. >> OK. What are some of the things that are inspiring? We'll talk about your graduate students for a moment. What are some of the things that you find are inspiring them to want to understand data in this way? Is it because they were kids that grew up in STEM programs, or they just had a computer since the time they were little, or are there other factors that you're finding that are really drivers of them wanting this type of education? >> So the students that I work with directly, I think, kind of fall into two camps. One camp is, they're a sort of non-traditional computer scientist, where they enjoy the engineering, they enjoy the programming, but they also really enjoy people and are passionate about making a difference. They also really enjoy the interaction that we have to go through in trying to understand what someone needs. There's also a design component, it's really fun to get to create things that feel good and look good. That's definitely one class, so it's the sort of non-traditional computer scientist. The other class, I have a couple of students who come from a science background, who love science, but find that they like building things more than they like doing the science itself, and visualization is kind of a wonderful place in the middle where you can be part of science but doing the making and building that we do in computer science, as opposed to doing the sort of experimentation and studying that you do as a scientist. That was definitely, for myself, I have a background in science and that's what really drew me, when I discovered computer science and visualization itself. >> What are some of the traditional skills that a good educated computer scientist needed maybe five years ago, and how are you seeing that change? Are there new behavioral traits or skills that really are going to be essential for these people going forward? >> Yeah, I think especially in the space of data science and remembering that at the end of the pipeline there's a person sitting there either bringing their knowledge to bear or that you're trying to tell a story to you from data. I think one trait is the idea of having empathy and being able to connect with people, and to just understand that as technologists, we're, not all of us, but largely creating technology for people. That's something that I think has traditionally been undervalued and perhaps a little bit filtered out by perceptions of what a computer scientist is. But as technology is becoming more ubiquitous and people are understanding the impact that they could have, I think it is bringing in a different group of people that have different motivations for coming to the field. >> What are some of the, as your graduate students finish their education and go on to different industries, what are some of the industries that you're seeing that they're using their skills in? >> Yeah, so a lot of it is getting hired in companies that, their core product that they develop isn't necessarily a piece of technology. But they're using data now to really understand their business needs and things like that. I have a student right now who's actually at a government organization in DC, working with some amazing global health specialists. But these are midwives and social workers and they don't have the deep skills in data analysis. So there's opportunities for people in visualization and data science to go and really make an impact in a whole variety of interesting fields. That's actually one of the things that I always love to tell undergrads who come to talk to me about, "Oh, should I do computer science?" The thing I love most about it is that, whatever your passion is in life, whether it's medicine or whether it's music, or whether it's skiing, there is a technology problem there. If you have those skill sets, you can go and apply it to anything that you care deeply about. >> I couldn't agree more. That's such an important message to get out. I mean, every company, we're sitting here in Silicon Valley, where car companies are technology companies, every company these days, Walmart is a technology company. I think that's an important message for those kids to understand, following their passion. I don't think that that can be repeated enough, because you're right, whatever it is, there's a technology component to that. With that tip, let me ask you, what were some of your passions when you were younger in school? You mentioned your science degrees. But what were some of the things that really helped or maybe people shape your career and where you are today? >> Yeah, growing up, I was, my dad's a scientist, my mother's an artist, so there's definitely, both of those. >> Lisa: Art and science, so yes. >> Yeah, influences of both, and I really wanted to be an astronaut, but it turns out I get really motion sick. >> Oh, that's a bummer. >> So I had to give up that dream. I studied science, but at the same time, my mom always had me creating and doing things with her in her studio. I think I found this love of just being able to make something and how satisfying that is. I think that was influential. Then also, when I was in college, I was an astronomy major, and I had the opportunity to take lots of electives, which, in hindsight, I think was really important, because it let me explore many things. I found myself taking a lot of women's studies classes. What was interesting about that is just the way that you think and problem solve in a discipline like that where it's all critical analysis. That, sort of coupled with the deep analytics that I was, skills I was learning in physics, made for this just really interesting, I think, multiple, gave me perspectives to look at problems in multiple different ways. I think that that's been really important for being able to bring that suite of perspectives to how we solve problems. It's not all just quantitative, and it's just all qualitative. But it's really a nice mixture of both, if it gets us to good places. >> Absolutely. I think that zigzag career path that you're sounding like you're talking about, I know I had one as well, gives you perspectives that you wouldn't have even thought to seek, had you not been on these trails. >> Mm-hmm. >> I think that's great advice that people that are, whether they're in your classes or they're being able to listen to you here, should be able to know that it's OK to try things. >> Yes. Yes, exactly. I think back to the person I was when I was, say, 18. I didn't know. I think the one sort of constant in my career trajectory has been just, wow, this thing looks really interesting, I don't know where it's going to go, but I'm going to follow that path. Inevitably, if it's something that catches your attention, there's going to be something interesting that can come out of it. I think sort of letting go of this need to have everything defined from day one and instead following your passions is, that's the theme I've heard over and over again from the speakers in here, too. >> Absolutely. Don't be afraid to fail is one of the themes that has come out from this morning. Diane Greene, SVP of Google Cloud, who was in morning keynote, had even said, "Don't be afraid to get fired." I mean, could you imagine your parents saying that to you? >> Yeah. >> I couldn't, but it's also something that just shows you that there is tremendous opportunity in many different disciplines and domains for this type. >> By the way, if you have a technical computer science background, you can always find another job. (laughter) >> That is true. What is next on your plate in terms of research, what are you looking forward to the rest of 2017? >> Wow. >> Lisa: Sorry, was that too big of a question? >> Yeah. We have a couple of really interesting problems around color, around some new tools for helping designers and journalists work with data. I think also, I'm starting to think about trying to focus more on K through 12 education and trying to understand what some of the roadblocks are to getting computer science to a younger community of people. In Utah, we have a lot of rural populations. We also have Native American reservations. I think there's some really interesting challenges with getting computer science into those communities. I'm sort of thinking about working with some folks to try to understand more about that. >> That's fantastic. I mean, you bring up a good point, that kind of depending, then, where you are, here we are sitting at Stanford University, one of the pre-eminent universities in the world, and there's a tremendous amount of technology and resources available. But then you look at, really, the needs of communities in Utah, and they need people like you to help, go, "You know what, we have challenges here, and we need to solve that." Because that's part of the next generation of the people that are here speaking at these types of events. >> Miriah: Right. >> Absolutely critical problem. Well, Miriah, thank you so much for being on the Cube. >> Thank you for the opportunity. >> It's been a pleasure, we wish you the best of luck with your big plans for 2017. >> Thanks. >> Lisa: Hopefully, we'll see you next time. >> Great. >> We thank you for watching the Cube again, Lisa Martin, live at Stanford University at the Women in Data Science Second Annual Conference. Stick around, we've got more, we'll be right back. (electronic music)

>>Mm. >>Amdocs is a leader in providing software and services to some key industries, like telecommunications, media and financial services. In our next session, >>we >>welcome Cedric Jay Gould, who is the head of technical product at Amdocs. And we'll learn about Amdocs modernisation journey and how it added value for their end customers. Cedric. Welcome. >>Welcome. Good. >>Thank you. So describe your modern application, your portfolio, and you know what you're delivering for customers. >>So home dogs is B s s S s players who we are providing a food digital suite for customers. Uh, our customers are communication service providers, which are have to deploy a full digital sweets customer experience. Um, we're for the full os BSS, BSS tax. So, actually, Amdocs is one of the leader in this kind of digital transformation. >>So of course you talk about this as and BS. I mean, you're talking about some really hardened, uh, stacks, right? Uh, telco industry. Uh, say what you want about it, but, boy, the phone works when you dial it. So So you've got this sort of a decades old, you know, platform that you guys have been evolving over the over the years. described this modernisation journey and and the role that couch base played. What value does this offer This modernisation offer to your organisation. And where does Couch based fit? >>Yeah, exactly the same. So that so. Basically what, uh, all solution is You know, it's a broad for you of a large number of components which have to deal with funds, uh, experience of the user and from and then dealing all the, uh, activation of the services in the network in order to deliver a solution, Uh, your services, like mobile services or communication services to, uh, Susan users. So we have a full suites, which, uh, was previously based on, you know, on technology is based on the oracle with web logic and things like that. And what we did is that we do a modernisation of, uh, this something, like, six years ago. A bit more than six years ago. We start to modernisation and transformation of our product into a creative solution. Collaborative solutions. So, uh, and when we did that, we start with Coach base as a partner, uh, to provide the nominative database. So we are actually delivery. We have a guarantee of more than 8000 people developing this product. It's a product which is used by more than 300 customers. Uh, so So it's it's real product that needs to be very flexible. That needs to address many kind of use cases from, uh, Telco or customers, which RCs PS usually till 0 to 1 telco. So we what we wanted to build is a food creative solution that can work on any cloud, then can can skill very, very easily and can address multiple use cases. Okay, And that's why, Coach Base, when we selected Coach Basit, it matched a lot of requirements and criteria as we had. And when we decided to modernise our product, we decided to work with >>you. So you had a lot of experience and and legacy with Oracle and Web logic. I'm curious just to follow up. Why didn't you stay with Oracle? You mentioned? Gotta run any cloud. You gotta be flexible. But could you could you double click on what Couch based delivered from a requirement standpoint, that was such a good fit? >>Well, there's there's a good fit with technology that such as, uh, coach basis. First it's a noise school detonates, right? So it's in terms of performance for some of the youth case that we have. It's very important to have, you know, technology which are are done and optimised for the noise secure use cases. That's the first thing. The second thing as I mentioned the scalability, the fact that you can, almost indefinitely infinitely you can increase the size of your cluster. You can have more, uh, servers and and and And this will skill, you know, very rapidly. And also what we're very interesting to have from coach bases the ability to have something which can be replicated across multiple sites. So with visual technology from coach base, which enable to build, you know, very modern architecture with deployment on multiple agents to have disaster recovery, active, active sites, you know, things like that which are very becoming like the main requirement for more customers now. >>Okay, so I'm presuming there were parts of your application portfolio that you weren't gonna touch and throw away that you had to collect or connect the new with the old. That's always, you know, you know, a challenge. I'm wondering what advice you give to an organisation. That's kind of investing in a similar path, trying to deliver the best digital experiences to customers. You know what? What would you say are the modernisation you gotta have must have, whether it's architecture, internal culture, what are some of those items? >>So so that yes, you're right. I think the integration with the legacy systems is actually, you know, very, very important topic in all domain in the domain. But we we made a very, uh, will see drastic choice or brave choice choice. When, uh, 60 years from now, when we decided to reformat to re platforms are completely or portfolio. Okay, So we we changed more than 95% of our portfolio and 95% of the portfolio today, Arklow native. Which means that they can be deployed on any cloud that actually, they are fully scalable and and and still, we did this transformation. Now, when we do the digital transformation of the, uh, customer system, then we need to integrate with legacy systems, and we need to help our customers to migrate from the legacy systems to creative solutions and doing so, it's important to have in the database domain. It's very important to have a solution which is very flexible in terms of, uh, what kind of data I can manage. And I can, as I said, skill easily, for sure. But also, it's sexual. Okay, Because when you are moving the data from a legacy system or record based or whatever to, uh, another type of, uh, database, you want to be sure that you are you can do it securely, and you're you're not, uh, compromising in any sense, Uh, in terms of security scalability, uh, etcetera. Right. So So, um, in this case, I mean, I will say And then in this opportunities journey, uh, this was very, very, very, very important component in, uh, you know, in our strategy, for all the reasons I mentioned right, it's very coordinative. It's scalable, It's secure. Uh, it's another product, uh, grade. So? So that's that's why it really is. So there's there's a chest back to you. >>You know, this notion that 90 per you really re platform 90% of your portfolio and made a cloud native. That's that's a It's a brave move because a lot of companies do that that I've talked to. They will build an abstraction layer and microservices and make that piece cloud native and then have that kind of overlay. You decided not to do that. Why is that? Was that for performance reasons? You were worried about just bringing along technical debt. I mean, that really must have been an interesting discussion internally in your company. >>Yeah, it's true. I mean, the main motivation, the main driver was business flexibility. Because now we live in a world where our customers, what they need is to be able to test the new feature quickly. And they need to be able to scale the system in a matter of hours. Okay, so we are not in a domain anymore. Where you you when you have to upgrade something, you need to take a few days. It needs to be done in a very, very quickly. And the only way to achieve those, uh, requirements business requirements is to be creative. It's to build microservices and to really realise one of those per cent of, uh, micro services architecture because this is the only way you will have the business flexibility. You will be able to have a resilient architecture. Uh, you know, you can, uh you can deploy this with full high availability across multiple zones, multiple regions and feeling that so, uh, any modern architecture today that that is competing with us, Actually, a micro services based architecture. There is no other way to achieve, uh to to to meet the requirement of the market today, and especially when five g is coming, things will become much more complex. Will become much more, uh, distributed. Uh, you cannot work anymore with the model it architecture. And again, I think the database is nowhere different. Needs to follow the same kind of architecture needs to follow the same principles. So that's that's why am I mean another another point about Yeah, >>So if I If I summarised, it sounds like your top three requirements would be flexibility, which you're getting from the cloud native and microservices piece the scale and the security. Is that right? That I get that right? The three top >>That's right. And the resilience as well. I mean the fact that now you know, with micro services architecture, if one of the system is done, he knows how to self to restart it himself. Right itself. Sorry. So So that's this kind of architecture that we built. It's an architecture which can be resilient in a sense that it can sense itself, and it can ensure full availability. And if something is going down, is not working properly, then on some kind of mechanisms will happen in order to go back to a stable state. >>Yeah. So you've got that automation in there. So you don't doesn't require the labour that it might have 10 years ago. So you're obviously embracing cloud native microservices. So you're on that jury. I'm curious. What are you doing with that? You're you're freeing up. You guys used to bring in lab coats and dig in and figure out what's wrong or restart the system. Where are you in your journey, and how are you? Sort of reallocating those resources. And where do you see that going? >>Yeah, Okay, so that's that's a very good point. Because actually, we when we build this new system, which is unable to do, you know, to self heal himself, right? Uh, actually, the question was more about how we can improve the system, even know how we can be sure that, uh, you know, issues that we we any issues which we are we are facing will not happen again. Well, not actual again. Okay. And this is a, uh, principle. Okay, Practise that we have now people are walking on automation. They're building automation around all these recovery procedures about, uh, fixing. So they're not actually digging into the application now anymore into the system, they learn how the system is walking and buildings all the right automation task to ensure that the system is constantly, constantly resilient. Alright, so that's the necessary practises organisation is now built around. You know, this kind of this approach developed computer develops being fully a geologically having sa reorganisation SRE oriented organisation. And, uh and that's the only way you know you can reach very high, uh, in terms of availability. >>So the big problem that your traditional telco customers have is the amount of data that they're servicing going through the roof and the cost per bit is sinking like that. And you have all the over the top providers coming in creating these customer experiences with modern applications and they've owned the customer data. You mentioned five g. So I'm interested in what the future of modern apps looks like for Amdocs and your customers because five G gives your traditional telco customers the ability if they can have these flexible systems that you're providing to now have better relationships with customers and actually kind of reclaim, you know, some of that that value that they've lost to a lot of competitors, your thoughts on the future. >>So first, you know, technically speaking, we we we will have two challenges. One is about data, and other one is about distribution of the work. Okay, because when we are speaking about five g, we're speaking about the age. We're speaking about the fact that an application may be located very closely to the network because it needs to be to to achieve, you know, to to deliver a very short latency, and, uh and this application can move. Okay, so you you you you will have to be able to distribute completely your your solutions. Okay. And that's why we are working closely with, uh, club providers at the US as you Google and because we we need to be sure that the applications of the systems that we are building will be able to distribute the application as close as possible to the end users. Okay, so that's that's one of the key challenges. Which means that the application is to be very possible and he'd be very scalable, and then it needs to be able to move very quickly from one place to another. That's really what is what What, what? What is happening now and what will become, uh, with five G? The other challenge is behind the communication of all these components is really the data, because now we will capture more and more that are coming from the different systems. And I'm not speaking only about the consequence the customer that are who they are, what they what they like and what they want to do, etcetera. And speaking also about, uh, monitoring that of the systems. Okay, so we will generate a lot of information and this this information needs to be traded very quickly, needs to be stored in very large data lake, and we need to have extraction and manipulation of the data very, very quickly to to give the right information to the applications. Um, in this case, okay, it's very important to have application to have databases that can as I said, skill very quickly. But also we'll be able to have very ideal city note, you know, sense that they with a certain amount of memory or sentiment of storage, you can store a lot of data. And this is where we are always, you know, checking what is the best technologies. And so far, not coach bases, technologies that we're using for for stalking, storing all the data. Because because it's it's a ratio in terms of, uh, performance on the number of data you can store, Uh is very high. Okay, so that's that's another challenge that we're addressing. Of course, God is not the only solution, but it's another another one. >>Excellent. Okay, we're gonna leave it there. Cedric, Thanks so much. A great storey and really appreciate your insights. >>You're welcome. Thank you very much. >>Okay, that's it for today. I hope you've enjoyed the application. Modernisation summit made possible by Couch Base. We shared some fresh survey data and got the perspectives of three expert analysts. We got an outstanding roadmap from Ravi Meyer. Um, who's the CEO of Couch base? And of course, we got the customer angle from Cedric. So look, Maybe you're an organisation going through a modernisation initiative. And if you're thinking about what the future of applications looks like cheque out couch. Based on the road this summer, the application modernisation summit is hitting the road traversing North America and Europe. Find out where they will be where they will be near you by visiting couch based dot com slash roadshow. Ravi is gonna be there along with other thought leaders and peers who will be sharing learnings and best practises on how to modernise now and for the future. And you'll get a chance to interact with some of those piers, something that everyone I know is looking forward to. This is Day Volonte. Thanks for joining us today. And thanks for watching the Cube. Mhm. Yeah. Mm, yeah.

>>long from Las Vegas. It's the Q covering a ws re invent 2019. Brought to you by Amazon Web service is and in Came along with its ecosystem partners. >>Hey, welcome back to the Cube. Lisa Martin at AWS Reinvent in Vegas. Very busy. Sands Expo Center. Pleased to be joined by my co host this afternoon. Justin Warren, founder and chief analyst at Pivot nine. Justin, we're hosting together again. We are. >>It's great to be >>here. It's great to have you that. So. Justin Meyer, please welcome a couple of our cue ball. Um, back to the program. A couple guys from nut up. We have Anthony Lie, the S B, P and G m of the Cloud business unit. Welcome back at the >>very much great to be here >>and color coordinating with Anthony's Jandi Stephenson, Chief Technology officer and GPS Cloud. Welcome back. >>Thank you. Thank you >>very shortly. Dress, guys and very >>thank you. Thank you. It's, uh, the good news Is that their suits anymore. So we're not going to have to wear ties >>comfortable guys net up a w s this event even bigger than last year, which I can't even believe that 65,000 or so thugs. But, Anthony, let's start with you. Talk to us about what's new with the net up AWS partnership a little bit about the evolution of it. >>Yeah. I mean, you know, we started on AWS. Oh, my gosh. Must be almost five or six years ago now and we made a conscious effort to port are operating system to AWS, which was no small task on dhe. It's taken us a few years, but we're really starting to hit our stride Now. We've been very successful, were on boarding customers on an ever increasing rate. We've added more. Service is on. We just continue to love the cloud as a platform for development. We can go so fast, and we can do things in in an environment like aws that, frankly, you just couldn't do on premise, you know, they're they're complexity and EJ ineighty of on premise was always a challenge. The cloud for us is an amazing platform where we can go very, very fast >>and from a customer demand standpoint. Don't talk to me about that, Chief technologist. One of the thing interesting things that that Andy Jassy shared yesterday was that surprised me. 97% of I t spend is still on from So we know that regardless of the M word, multi cloud work customers are living in that multi cloud world. Whether it's by strategy, a lot of it's not. A lot of it's inherited right, but they have to have that choice, right? It's gonna depend on the data, the workload, etcetera. What can you tell us about when you're talking with customers? What what? How are they driving NetApp evolution of its partnership with public provider AWS? >>So actually, I don't know if it's the desired state to be running in a hybrid, mostly cloud fashion, but it's it's It's driven by strategy, and it's usually driven by specific workloads and on the finding the best home for your application or for your workers at any given time. Because it's it's ultimately unrealistic for on premise customers to try to compete with like a machine and keep learning algorithms and the rate of development and rate off basically evolution in the cloud. So you always have to be there to be able to stay competitive, so it's becoming a part of the strategy even though it was probably asked that developers that drove a lot off cloud adoption to begin with. Maybe, maybe not. Not in favor of the c i o r. You have, like a lot of Cloud Cloud sprawling, but there's no longer sprawling it. It's part of the strategy before every company in my way >>heard from any Jesse in the keynote yesterday about the transformation being an important thing. And he also highlighted a lot of enterprise. Nedda has a long history with enterprise, Yes, very solid reputation with enterprise. So it feels to me like this This is an enterprise show. Now that the enterprise has really arrived at with the cloud, what are you seeing from the customers that you've already had for a long time? No, no, no, I'm familiar with it. Trust Net up. We're now exploring the Clouded and doing more than just dipping their toe in the water. What are they actually doing with the cloud and and we'll get up together, you know, >>we see and no one ever growing list of workload. I think when people make decisions in the cloud, they're not making those traditional horizontal decisions anymore. They're making workload by workload by workload decisions and Internet EPPS history and I think, uh, performance on premises, given customers peace of mind now in the cloud, they sort of know that what's been highly reliable, highly scaleable for them on premise, they can now have that same confidence in the cloud. So way started. Like just like Amazon. We started off seeing secondary workloads like D r Back Up Dev ops, but now is seeing big primaries go A s, a p big database workloads, e commerce. Ah, lot of HBC high forming compute. We're doing very well in oil and gas in the pharmaceutical industries where file has been really lacking on the public cloud. I think we leaned in as a company years ago and put put, put a concerted effort to make it there. And I think now the workloads a confident that were there and we can give them the throughput. We give them the performance on the protocols and now we're seeing big, big workloads come over to the public clouds. >>And he did make a big deal about transformation being important. And a lot of that was around the operational model. Let's let's just the pure technology. But what about the operating model? How are you seeing Enterprises Transformer? There's a lot of traditionally just taken a workload, do a bit of lift and shift and put it to the cloud. Where are they now transforming the way they actually operate? Things because of >>cloud? Absolutely. I mean, they have to They have to adopt the new technologies and new ways of doing business. So I mean, I think they are actually celebrating that to answer point. I think this is not a partnership and we're partnering with. We have a very unique story. We're partnering with all of them and have really deep engineering relationship with all of them. And they are now able to go after enterprise type workloads that they haven't been gone. I've been able to go after before, so that's why it's such a strategic strategic relationship that we have with all of them. That sort of brings in in the freedom of choice. You can basically go everywhere anywhere. That, in my opinion, is that true hyper cloud story lot has always been really difficult. But with the data management capabilities of not top, it's really easy to move my greater replicate across on premise toe are hyper scaler off choice. >>I mean, I think you know, if you're in enterprise right now, you know you're a CEO. You're probably scared to death of, like, being uber, you know exactly on. Uh, you know, if you're you know, So speed has now become what we say. The new scale they used to be scaled is your advantage. And now, if you're not fast, you could be killed any day by some of these startups who just build a mobile app. And all of a sudden they've gotten between you and the customer and you've lost. And I think CEOs are now. How fast are we going? How many application developers do we have? And did a scientist do we have? And because of that, that they're seeing Amazon as a platform for speed on. So that's just that paranoia. I think digital transformation is driving everybody to the cloud. >>You're right. If we look at transformation if a business and Andy Jassy and John for your talked about this and that exclusive interview that they did the other day. And Andy, if you're and a legacy enterprise and you're looking at your existing market share segment exactly, and you're not thinking there's somebody else. What assisting on there on the side mirror? Objects in mirror are closer. Not getting ready for that. You're on the wrong. You're going to be on the wrong side of that equation. But if we look at cloud, it has had an impact on traditional story one of naps. Taglines is data driven. If we look at transformation and if we'll even look at the translation of cloud in and of itself, data is at the heart of everything. Yes, and they talk to us about net APS transformation as cloud is something that you're enabling on prime hybrid multi cloud as you talked about. But how is your advantage allowing customers to not only be data driven, but to find value in that data that gives them that differentiation that they need for the guy or a girl that's right behind them. I already did take over. >>Well, I think if you're you know, if you're an enterprise, you know, the one asset you have is data. You have history now >>a liability Now with an asset. >>Can they can they do anything with it. Do they know where it is? Do they know how to use it where it should be, you know, Is it secured? Is it protected all of those things? It's very hard for enterprise to answer those questions. What one end up, I think it's done incredibly well, is by leaning in as much as we did onto AWS way. Give our customers the absolute choice to leave our on premise business and a lot of people, I think years ago thought we were crazy. But because now we've expanded our footprint to allow customers to run anywhere without any fear of lock in, people will start to see us now not as a storage vendor but as a strategic partner, and that that that strategic partnership is really has really come about because of our willingness to let people move the data and manage the data wherever they needed to be. On that something our customers have said, you know, used to be a storage vendor on along with the other storage vendors and now all of a sudden that we're having conversations with you about strategy where the data should be, you know who's using it is. It's secured all of those kinds of conversations we're having with customers. >>You mentioned moving data, and that was something that again came up in the keynote yesterday. And he mentioned that Hey, maybe instead of taking the data to the computer, we should bring the computer's data. That's something that Ned Abbas has long actually talked about. I remember when you used to mention data fabric was something about We want to take your data and then make it available to where the computer is. I'd like you to talk it through that, particularly in light of like a I and ML, which is on the tip of everybody's tongue. It's It's a bit of I think, it's possibly reaching the peak of the hype cycle at the moment s o what our customers actually doing with their data to actually analyze it? Are they actually seeing real value from machine learning? And I are We still isn't just kicking the tires on that. >>I mean, the biggest problem with deep learning and machine learning is having our accumulating enough on being able to have the data or lessening that gravity by being able to move it then you can take advantage off states maker in AWS, the big Cleary and Google, whatever fits your needs. And then, if you want to store the results back on premise, that's what we enable. With it out of harbor having that free flowing work clothes migration has to count for data. It's not enough to just move your application that that that's the key for machine learning and thought the lakes and others, >>absolutely in terms of speed. Anthony mentioned that that's the new scale. How is flash changing the game >>with perspective, you know, flashes a media type, but it's just, you know, the prices have come down now that you know the price performance couple flashes an obvious thing. Um, and a lot of people are, I think now, making on premise decisions to get rid of spinning disc and replaced with Flash because the R. O. I is so good. Tco the meantime between failures, that's that's so many advantages that percent workloads. It's a better decision, of course. You know, AWS provides a whole bunch of media Onda again. It's just you like a kid in a candy store, you know, as a developer, you look at Amazon. You're like, Oh, my God. Back in the day, we had to make, like, an Oracle decision and everything was Oracle. And now you can just move things around and you can take advantage of all sorts of different utilities. And now you piece together an application very differently. And so you're able to sort of really think I think Dion sees point. People are telling us they have to have a date, a strategy, and then, based on the data strategy, they will then leverage the right storage with the right protocols. They'll then bring that to compute whatever compute is necessary. I think data science is, you know, a little fashion, you know, conscious. Right now, you know, everybody wants to say how many did a scientist they have on their teams? They're looking for needles in haystacks. Someone, they're finding them. Some of them are but not doing it, I think it is. Makes companies very, very nervous. So they're going the results, gonna trying as hard as they can to leverage that technology. >>And you'll see where is that data strategy conversation happening if we think about the four essentials that Andy Johnson talked about yesterday for transformation in one of the first things he said was, it has to be topped at senior level decision. Then it's going to be aggressively pushed down through the organization. Are you seeing this data strategy at the CEO level yet? >>Yeah, we are. But I'm also seeing it much lower. I mean, with the data engineers with the developers, because it's asked, is it is extremely important to be developing on top off production data, specifically if you're doing machine and deep learning. So I think it's both. I think the decision authority has actually moved lower in the company where the developers are the side reliability engineers are actually choosing more technology to use. That fits the product that they are actually creating off course. The strategy happens at the tall, but the influencer and the decision makers, in my opinion, has been moving lower and within the organization. So I'm basically contradicting what yes is a. But to me that is also important. The days off a C t o r C E o. Forcing a specific platform or strategy on to developers. Those days are hopefully gone. >>I think if you're a CEO and you know of any company in any industry you have to be a tech company, you know, it used to be a tech industry, and now every company in the world is now tech. Everyone's building APS. Everyone's using data. Everybody's, you know, trying to figure out machine learning. And so I think what's happening is CEOs are are increasingly becoming technically literate. They have to Exactly. They're dead if they're not. I mean, you know whether your insurance company, your primary platform, is now digital if you're a medical company or primary platform additional. So I think that's a great stat. I saw that about two and 1/2 years ago. The number of software engineering jobs in non tech surpassed the number of jobs in tech, so we used to have our little industry and all the software engineers came to work for tech companies. Now there are more jobs outside the tech segment for engineers, and there are in the text >>well, and you brought up uber a minute ago and I think of a couple of companies examples in my last question for you is real. Rapid is about industries. You look at uber for example, what the fact that the taxi cab companies were transitional. And we're really eager to, you know, AP, if I their organizations, and meet the consumer demand. And then you look at Airbnb and how that's revolutionized hospitality or pellet on how it's revolutionized. Fitness Last question, Jonesy, Let's go for you. Looking at all of the transformation that cloud has enabled and can enable what industry you mentioned when the gas. But is there any industry that you see right now that is just at the tipping point to be ableto blow the door wide open if they transform successfully? >>Well, I mean way are working with a lot off pharma companies and genome sequencing companies that have not actually working with sensitive data on if those companies, I mean, these are people's medical histories and everything, so we're seeing them moving now in close into the cloud so those companies can move to the cloud. Anybody can move to the cloud. You mean these sort of compliancy scaremongering? You cannot move to the cloud because of P. C. I or hip power. Those days are over because aws, Microsoft and Google, that's the first thing they do they have? Ah, stricter compliancy than most on premise Homemade tartar sentence. So I see. I see that industry really moving into the cloud. Now >>who knows what a ws re invent 2020 will look like Gentlemen I wish we had more time, but thank you. Both Young and Anthony were talking with Justin and me today sharing what's new with netapp. What? You guys are enabling customers. D'oh! In multiple. Same old way. We appreciate your time where my car is. Justin Warren, I'm Lisa Martin. You're watching the Cube from AWS or reinvent 19 from Vegas. Thanks for watching.

>>Live from Copenhagen, Denmark. It's the cube covering Nutanix dot. Next 2019 brought to you by Nutanix. >>Welcome back everyone to the cubes live coverage of next here in Copenhagen. We are of course here at the Nutanix show. We are wrapping up a fantastic today show. I'm your host, Rebecca Knight. Been Cosa hosting alongside of Stu Miniman. We are joined by Simon Taylor. He is the CEO of haiku, a good friend of the cube. Thank you so much for coming back on the show. It's a pleasure to be here. It's great to see you guys again. Final guest. Oh my gosh. It's a, it's a fare to stay interested in your energy. Yes. So for our viewers who are not as familiar with haiku, tell us a little bit about your business and how you are a strategic partner of Nutanix. >> Sure, sure. So haiku actually is a software company that focuses on data protection as a service. We actually started by spinning out of a much larger company called calm train that had about a thousand engineers and was doing all sorts of things, but they had an amazing talent for building backup and recovery software. >>Um, my vision was really that we can move up the value chain and we can establish ourselves as our own brand, as long as we could find a place in the market that was fast growing, building like a rocket ship and was really requiring a new kind of data protection and backup. And honestly, as soon as we fell, we saw Nutanix, we sort of fell in love. We realized that, you know, they had developed an entirely new category of business with hyperconverged and they were really a pioneer in that space. So we said is why don't we build the world's first purpose-built backup and recovery for Nutanix? And that's exactly what we did. And I think, you know, Stu was actually one of the first people to ever hear about it. Uh, we came on the cube and we talked about that. We've GA that in 2017 in July. I think@that.next, um, so just two and a half years later, we now have 1200 customers and we're in 62 countries around the world. So it's been absolutely astonishing. It's been wonderful growth. We're seeing 300% year over year growth. Uh, and really a lot of that is just based on our ability to protect the data of Nutanix customers around the world. >>Well and and Simon, right? That early question was, is new CanOx is going to be big enough to support ISV is that, you know, can run the, you know, grow their business underneath them before we get further and talk about mine and everything. Give us a little bit, you know, the state of the state for haiku because started with Nutanix, but that's not the only solution they are offering Dave. So just give us kind of the snapshot of the whole business. >>What we realized as we were building out high Q in this purpose build backup recovery for new TEDx. We said that's the on-prem, you know, but there's a lot of on prem that is still legacy three tier architecture. So we added a VMware product. But really the goal was to offer true multi-cloud data protection as a service. So what we did is we built the independent purpose-built backup and recovery service from Nutanix, one for VMware. Then we built the world's first purpose build backup as a service for Google cloud. And I'm really thrilled to announce the next month we're launching Azure backup as well. And the brilliant thing about our system and our solution is that we actually enabled customers to not only back up their data independently for that cloud, but that then migrate their data to whatever other cloud they want to use. So we actually becomes data protection as a service, data migration, and dr. >>So for, for customers, this is wonderful, but how is it to be strategic partners with all of these big players? >> Oh yeah, absolutely. I think you have to place your bets, right? So if you notice, I didn't say AWS and almost every company that I talked to says, why wouldn't you start with AWS? They're the biggest, you know, that's never been our philosophy. You know, I think the fact that we attach ourselves to Nutanix so early, not just because they were a rocket ship on fire, but also because we truly believed in their vision. We believe in the Nutanix products, we love Daraja entire philosophy around simplicity and customer delight and we felt like we could be students of Nutanix, we could actually build out our product with those same philosophies and principles in mind. You know? So I think really going deep with Nutanix is number one for us remains number one. I would also say though that you know, Google has been an excellent partner and Microsoft been an excellent partner. So with the large cloud providers you have to take a different approach. You cannot offer a downloadable product, right? All of our public cloud backup and recovery is a true managed service. You go into their app store, you turn it on rather than download it, you configure and you're able to perform all your backup and do all your recovery right from the console. >>All right, so Simon let, let's get into the kind of the, the, the guts of what's happening at Nutanix. Mine, of course is a partnership to extend for data protection, partnering with Veeam and haikus as a, as the first two partners. Uh, the other thing that everybody's pretty excited about is XY clusters. And that sounds like, and we've talked to Newtanics people, you know, as Nutanix brings their stack into the clouds, not just on the clouds, will that pull things like mine along with them. And so, so give us what you're seeing with mine first and maybe he's, I clusters along. >>Yeah. So maybe we start with mine, right? This whole concept that I think that these guys have pioneered and they've done a really terrific job of it. I think, you know, the, the vision there, and you know, I count marketing or Meyer in this group and Tim Isaacs and some wonderful folks on the product team in Nutanix. Their vision was, you know, there's rubric and there's Cohesity, there's these sort of large secondary storage platforms. Personally, when I look at them, what I see as Newtanics with a backup workload, right? And I think that, you know, Nutanix being the original is the best. It's the most complete solution. And it's very, very comprehensive. So I think the, the tannics folks understood this intuitively and their idea was instead of us building our own backup and going after that space, we've got amazing partners like haiku. Why don't we just natively integrate them into the mind platform and offer that sort of secondary storage workload, uh, as a key part of Nutanix is product proposition. >>So the really exciting thing for us is that we are skewed up with Nutanix. Nutanix, we'll be able to resell haiku as a part of mine. Uh, and I think that's gonna really complete their end tour tire story when it comes to being able to own the data center, uh, and really own the sort of cloud in general. You know. So I think your second question still was about clusters. And I think that the answer there is very simple. You know, multi Gloucester is, has become extremely important for Nutanix customers. They've done a great job of going after that. The simple fact is if you don't support XY clusters as a backup vendor, you really can't compete in this market. So I'm really thrilled to announce, of course, that haiku is the first backup recovery vendor that does support. Gluster. >>Okay. So interesting. We talked about how you hadn't done a solution for AWS. Sounds like this might be a path for you to get with Nutanix onto AWS. >>Absolutely, absolutely. And again, for us it's not about looking for some Trojan horse or backdoor into a go to market strategy. It's about making sure that the customers are truly delighted by the value that we provide. And I think that when we go after a specific market, we want to do it the best, you know, so we don't go shallow and just sort of check the box. We want to make sure, for example, when we build out Azure that we're not just dealing with, you know, the, the general principle of backing up and keeping things consistent. We want to make sure the applications people are running on Azure or supported by haiku. That's what we do with Nutanix. That's what we do with GCP. We want to always go as deep as possible so we can really compliment the platform in a really, really comprehensive way. >>One of the things you said earlier was that your philosophy is very much aligned with Nutanix, your your end goal to simplify and delight the customer, uh, this, this much more intuitive, uh, youth and user interface. So talk a little bit about how you, you said you wanted to become a student of Nutanix, yo, this, this cross company learning is very interesting to me. How, how, what have you learned? Yeah. What have you learned and how do you go about being tutored by your customers? >>No, I'm a very visual guy, right? And whenever I think about Nutanix, I always had this image in my head. All right. Whenever I thought about legacy, three-tier architecture and the move to hyperconverged, rather, I always pictured an 80 stereo system. Remember those big eighties boxes? And they have all the graphic equalizers and all the way down. And some kid would come and push them all down. You could never reset the darn things, you know? And then along comes, you know, automation and suddenly, you know, you press a button and you listen to jazz and it sounds like good jazz and the treble and the bass all fixed themselves. You know, I effectively think that Nutanix brought that same concept, funnily enough into the data center. They simplified so much that was impossible to handle for admins across the world. They made it so simple to use their product that actually the customers could start to enjoy their work more. >>And I really love that. That's a true, that's a really an intangible sort of value proposition that I think people don't talk about it enough. Yes, you want to save time. Yes, you want to save money, but if you could enjoy your job more as a result of getting a product, what's better than that? Um, so I think that philosophy is something we baked into haiku in the following ways. You know, the first is when we were designing the UI, we wanted it to look and feel like the platform it supports. So when you use haiku for Nutanix, it looks like prism, when you are using our console for GCP, you're gonna feel like you're using GCP. The idea is that backup and recovery should be an extension of that cloud expression, that platform, so that the customer who is an expert with that platform can easily manage this with no training at all. So again, driving that simplicity right there and in the platform. >>Yeah. So Simon, you know, one of the things we love to do is get hear from customers and what they're doing. Of course you've got 1200 customers that are Nutanix customers. So we'd love to hear, you know, any insights you have in a lot of discussion about AHV in the last 12 months has been about half of the deployment. Is there anything around HV or any of the, you know, new software features and products and experiences that Nutanix has been launching that you hear customers buzzing and talking to you about? >>I mean, I, I, the first thing I would say is it is truly a multicloud world now. Um, I think that legacy vendors are having a harder and harder time coping with the fact that cloud washing no longer works. You know, if you show up to the market and you say, Oh, this, now I can deploy an agent into this cloud, it's sort of stop, stop, don't say agent around me. You know? So I think, I think the ability to really natively integrate into any of these clouds and support all of these clouds equally is key. You know? So in the past a vendor would start with one thing and it would be great, right? And I won't use names here, but then they would do something else. They might move to another hypervisor and it was a little bit less great. Right. And I think that that notion has to change in a multicloud world, which brings me to the concept of HV. >>I think that HV has really grown. I mean, I would say that right now, you know, over half of our customers are HV customers. And I would say that that grows every single quarter and it not only grows in terms of net new logos, it also grows in terms of existing customers that we're finding SWAT to switch to HV and they want to switch fast. You know, they don't want to pay the V tax anymore, but more than that, I think they're seeing HV as a really robust enterprise hypervisor that really meets the complete need for the customer. And I think that's, that's been terrific to watch. So when you hear at.next, and this is not your first hot next, but what kinds of conversations are you having? What's been interesting to you? What are you going to take back to haiku? Yeah, head back to Brookline. Yeah. >>I mean obviously there's all the new stuff. I mean, Kubernetes, you know, containers. Um, I think these are all things we've been working on for some time. We'll have some surprises for you guys in Q4 at the end of Q four around that. Um, but you know, I think the big takeaway for me is we spent the first two years building our brand, getting the word out there, proving to companies and customers around the world that we were truly enterprise ready cause we were the new kid on the block. And you have to sort of start somewhere and show that. I think now we, you know, we added physical last year, we added tape support, we've really got all of the major applications covered at this point. I think that conversation, we've checked the box, right? So today's conversations are about what's next, how much more deeply will you integrate with Nutanix? >>How can I use Nutanix to then manage my data in the cloud and bring it back again? And can haikus support that or will it distract me? And you know, the simple answer is it will support that completely because it's so natively integrated. You know. And again, I think when you choose a platform at this stage, and this is something we've seen again and again and again, people do not want a second silo, right? In order to, you know, run their backup and recovery. You know, customers who are choosing Nutanix or choosing any platform want to run that platform and they want to make that one holistic experience. You know, they want to reduce the training required and they want to make sure they get the most out of their investment. So we're where I think two or three years ago, Stu, when we first met, everybody was trying new things, right? It was sort of, there were all these new platforms and it was all very exciting. I think now people are doubling, tripling, quadrupling down on the platforms they fundamentally believe in. And we're thrilled about that because we support those platforms and we'll continue to do so. >>Great. Excellent little. Simon, thank you so much for coming on the cube. It was a real pleasure talking to you and it's been great. Yes, no, absolutely. Thank you very much. Thank you so much. Thank you for having me. That wraps up two brilliant days in Copenhagen at the Bella center at Nutanix dot. Next. Thank you so much for joining us and we hope to see you next time.

>> live from Atlanta, Georgia. It's the two you covering. Citric Synergy. Atlanta 2019. Brought to You by Citrix >> Welcome back to the Cubes. Continuing coverage of Citrix Energy, 2019 from Atlanta, Georgia. I'm Lisa Martin. My co host for the event is Keith Townsend and Keith and I are excited to talk. Teo, one of the Citrix Innovation Award nominees, Indiana University, with a couple of folks from Indiana University joining us. Stephanie Cox, manager, a Virtual Platform Services and Mat Link, associate vice president of research Technologies Guys, thanks so much for joining Keith and me, Thank you. And congratulations on Indiana University being nominated for an innovation award. I was talking with Tim in hand there CMO yesterday, saying there was over a thousands nomination. So to even get down to being in the top three is pretty exciting stuff. Talk to us a little bit about Indiana University. Us. This is a a big, big organization. Lots of folks accessing the network through lots of devices. Matt, let's start with you. Give us that picture of what's going on there. Yes, so I >> u is about 130,000 students across seven campuses. We've got about 20,000 faculty and staff across those seven campuses. One of the things that makes us a little unique is were consolidated shop. So there are 1,200 of us and I you that support the entire university and all the campuses and anyone point in time, there could be 200,000 devices touching the network and using those services. >> That's a Big 70 talk. Talk to us about your virtual a footprint. How How big is the location? Data centers? What's the footprint? >> Well, we have two data centers. One of them is in Indianapolis, which is my home. It's one of our larger campus is calling Indiana University Purdue University affectionately, I U P y. There is a data center there, but our large danna center is at the flagship campus, which is in Bloomington, Indiana, >> and to support 100,000 plus people and to hundreds of any given the 2nd 200,000 devices. How have you designed that virtual infrastructure to enable access to students, faculty, etcetera and employees. >> So from the network perspective, we have several network master plans that have rolled, and we're in our 2nd 10 year next network master plan, and the network master plan is designed to continually upgrade the network. Both the physical network, the infrastructure and the wireless network in our last 10 year budget, for that was around $170,000,000 of investment just to support the network infrastructure. And then Stephanie rides on top of that as the virtual platform with Citrix to deliver the images anywhere on campus. Whether it's wirelessly or whether it's connected via network connection >> kill seven campuses is already a bit. If you ever look at a map, Indiana sits Christ map damp in the middle of the country. It's a big space. Right before we hit record, we were just talking about that. Drive off I 65 from Indianapolis to Chicago is just a lot of rules area, and I'm sure part of your mission is to make sure technology and education is the sensible thing. Everyone in Indiana talk to us about the challenges of getting connective ity and getting material virtual classrooms to those remote areas. >> Yeah, it's really one of the major strengths of our partnership with Citrix. They are really at the premiere Remote solution connectivity offering at Indiana University. So we built our citrix environment. Teo encompass everyone. We wanted to make sure we could have enough licenses and capacity for all of our 130,000 faculty, staff and students to use the service. Do they all show up at the same time? No, thank goodness. But we do offer it to everyone, which is I found in the education. You're in a very unique tin Indiana University. Another another thing to have consolidated I t. And then to be able to offer a service like ours to everyone and not just restricted to specific pockets of the university. With that, we've been able to them extend offering of any application or something that you might need for a class to any of our other remote location. So if you're a student who is working in or go, you know, lives in rule Indiana and you want Teo get in Indiana University degree, you can do that without having to travel to one of our campus sites or locations. We I have a very nice of online program, just a lot of other options that that we've really tried Teo offer for remote access. >> So Citrix has really enabled this. I think you call it the eye. You anywhere. Indiana University anywhere Program. Tell us about opening up this access to everyone over the time that you've been ascetics Customer, how many more people can you estimate have access now, that didn't hurt not too long ago. >> Yeah, I think initially, and Matt was probably no more before me before I Even before I even came on the scene, I believe that the original youth case was really just trying. Teo, extend what we were already doing on premise in what we call just our Indiana University lab supported areas. Right? So just your small, like the old days you would goto your college campus and you go into your computer lab with it. We just really wanted Teo the virtual Isar expand the access to just those specific types of APS and computers. And that was an early design. Since then, over the years, we've really kind of, you know, just really expanded. Really. We used the Citrix platform to redesign and distribute how we deliver the applications and the virtual desktops. So now not only do we service those students who would who would normally come onto the campus just to use your traditional computer lab. Wait do a lot, especially programs for other schools. Like we, we deliver a virtual desktop for our dentistry. Students may actually use that whole platform in the dental clinic to see real patients are third tier. Third year doctors do that way. Also replicated that same thing and do it in our speech and hearing sciences for our future audiologist. We have certain professors that have wanted to take a particular course that they're teaching and extended to different pockets all over the world. So we might host a class from Budapest or Africa somewhere else. You know, wherever that faculty and staff has three sources that they know they need to get to in their content already virtualized. We worked to make that happen all the time. >> That's a lot of what you just said is first of all, initially, maybe before Citrix being able to provide support in the computer labs for your maybe seven core campuses. Now you get your giving 130,000 plus individuals anywhere, anytime. Access that is the ex multiplier on that is massive, but you're also gone global It's not just online, it's you're able to enable professors to teach in other parts of the world where it was before. It was just people that were in Indiana, but master and and >> you're just limited by the network. So that's the only draw back. When you go to the rule areas way out, you're just limited by the network. You know, the initial program was really you really thought of as a cost saving measure way we're goingto put thin clients out. We wouldn't have to do life cycle replacements for desktop machines that were getting more expensive and more expensive, you know, 10 years ago, and now the way that we look at it is I you wants to provide services across the breath of the organization and make those services at no additional cost and open to everybody open access to everybody. The desktop, for example, is one of you know Stephanie is, is the brainchild behind the desktop, took three years of dedicated hard work to create an environment to support the visually impaired. >> Talk to us more about that because that was part of the video and that captured my intention immediately. What is 80 accessibility, technology, accessibility technology is inaccessible to get that. So I'm just, you know, hundreds thousands, and not just those that are sight and hearing. >> So one of the things then I think it's just a wonderful thing about working at a university. We're able to buy software licenses in a big quantity, large quantity, right? Because we have that kind of buying power software that I normally never would see or get access to, even in my private sector. Administer tricks engineer for a long time. But when you come to a university and then you're selling or you're getting licenses for 50 60 70 80,000 you get to see some of these products that you don't normally as a regular consumer. You'd like it, but you know you can't really afford it. So with that, when we started looking at all of the different applications that they could buy in a large quantity site licence, you know, the way we thought, Oh my goodness, let's virtualized these and make sure everybody gets access to them and the ones that were really attractive to us, where the ones for the visually impaired, sure they're in niche and They're very, very expensive, but we but let's just try it. We'll see how well they perform in a virtual environment. And with that, our Citrix infrastructure underneath they performed quite well. Plus, the apse have evolved a great deal over just the last four years. So we're really proud to offer our virtual desktop to our blind students. We had to work really hard to make sure that the speech recognition software was fast enough for them. It turns out that blind people listen to speech really, really, really, really, really fast, and so we had to make sure that we kept our platform while we're working on it to keep it sped an updated so that it's usable to them right since functional to me. But they really need it to be like, 10 times faster. I found that out after even shooting the award video and spending even more time with them, I thought, Why don't you guys tell me it was slow to you? But yeah, it's, uh, it's been an honor, really, Teo to be up for that award. But tow work with those students to learn more about their needs to learn more about the city different applications that people write for people with old disabilities. I hope we can do more in that space. >> So the young man in it and why I don't remember his name. >> Priscilla, Bela, Chris. So >> share just quickly about Chris's story. >> Yeah, and he watches the Cube. I hope he's listening because I >> think I think this whole >> kind of >> really put a little bit icing on the cake because you're taking an environment and urine empowering a student to do what they want to do versus what they are able or not able to do. So Christmas story is pretty cool of where he wants to go with his college career. >> Yeah, I won't say he's a big, you know, proponent, user of the virtual desktop, because he's just so advanced. He's like, way beyond everything We're learning from him. But he is Indiana University's believe. I'm saying this right, very first biomedical chemical engineer who is blind and fourth completely blind, Yes, wow and is quite a brilliant young man, and we were lucky to have him be r. He will test anything for me and and Mary Stores, who was featured in the video Chris Meyer. And he's also featured in the video. Gonna remember their names? I mean, it's a hole. I'm lucky to have a whole community of people that will Yeah, they know where we want to be there for them. We don't always get it right. What? We're gonna listen and keep trying to move forward. So >> But if you kind of think of even what a year or two ago not being able to give any of this virtualized desktop access to this visually impaired and how many people are now using it? >> Um, well, we open it up to everyone. We have hundreds and hundreds of users, but we know not everyone who uses it is blind. People like you can use it if you want it or not way. Don't really understand why some people prefer to use that one over there. The other But it does have some advantages. I mean, there there are different levels of sight impairment, too, as I've just been educated right. There are some people who are just at the very beginning of that journey of just losing their site. So we if if that happens to be, you know, someone that we can extend our environment to. It's probably better t use it now and get really familiar with that issue. Transition to losing your sight later in life. I've been told so >> So you ask a little bit about the scope of of the desktop, so I'll layer on a little bit of the scope of eye you anywhere. Last year, around 65,000 individual unique users over well over 1,000,000 Loggins and 8,000,000 and the average session time was around 41 minutes. That's so our instructors teach with it. Are clinicians treat people with it? We've built it in two. How's Elektronik protected health data? Er hit. The client's gonna be critical, writes the hip a standard because you can't say compliance anymore because you can't be compliant with a standard change. That wording several times way are very familiar with meeting hip. A standard we've been doing that for about 12 years now with where I came from was the high performance computing area of the university. So that's my background, and I >> so one thing we didn't get a chance to talk, uh, touch 12 100,000 devices were a citrus citrus is a Microsoft partner. Typically, when those companies think of 200,000 users, they think for profit. There's, you know, this is a niche use case for 200,000 users. Obviously, you guys have gotten some great pricing as part of being a educational environment. What I love to hear is kind of the research stories, because the ability to shrink the world, so to speak, you know, hi HPC you're giving access to specialized equipment to people who can't get their normally. You know, you don't have to be physically in front of GPU CPUC century. What other cool things have been coming out of the research side of the house because of the situation able? >> So this is cool. I mean, >> I get it. So >> So one of our group's research software solutions stole the idea from Stephanie to provide a research desktop. Barr >> imitation. Highest form of flattery, Stephanie. Absolutely. So what we've >> done is is is we always continually to try to reduce the barriers of entry and access? Uh, you know, supercomputing. Before you had to be this tall to ride this ride. Well, now we're down to here and with the hopes that will get down even farther. So what we've done is we've taken virtualized desktop, put it in front of the supercomputers, and now you can be wherever you want to be and have access to HPC. Untie you and that's all the systems. So we have four super computers and we have 40 petabytes of spinning disc ah, 160 petabytes of archival tape library. So we're we're a large shop and, you know, we couldn't have done it without looking at what Stephanie has done and and really looking in that model differently. Right? Because to use HPC before, you'd have to use a terminal and shell in and now, looking at you anywhere that gives you just the different opportunity to catch a different and more broad customer base. And I call on customers because we try to treat him as customers and and helps the diversity of what you're doing. So last year alone, our group research technologies supported a 151 different departments way were on 937 different grants, and we support over 330 different disciplines. Uh, it I you and so it's It's deep, but it's also very broad. First, larger campus we are. And as a large organization as we are, you know, we're fairly nimble. Even a 1,200 people. >> Wow! From what I've heard, it's no wonder that what you've done at Indiana University has garnered you the Innovation Award nominee. I can't imagine what is next. All that you have accomplished. Stephanie. Matt, thank you so much for joining Key to me. We wish you the best of luck and good a citric scott dot com Search Innovation Awards where you can vote for the three finalists. We wish you the very best of luck will be waiting with bated breath tomorrow to see who wins. >> So thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you. Keep >> our pleasure for Keith Townsend. I'm Lisa Martin. You're watching the Cube live from Citrix. Synergy 2019. Thanks for watching

>> From our studios in the heart of Silicon Valley. HOLLOWAY ALTO, California It is a cube conversation. >> Welcome to the special. Keep conversation here in Palo Alto, California. I'm John for a co host of the Cube. Were Arsenal was a C I S O. C. So for Microsoft also corporate vice President, Chief information security. Thanks for joining me today. >> Thank you. >> Appreciate it. Thanks. So you have a really big job. You're a warrior in the industry, security is the hardest job on the planet. >> And hang in sight >> of every skirt. Officer is so hard. Tell us about the role of Microsoft. You have overlooked the entire thing. You report to the board, give us an overview of what >> happens. Yeah. I >> mean, it's you know, obviously we're pretty busy. Ah, in this world we have today with a lot of adversaries going on, an operational issues happening. And so I have responsibility. Accountability for obviously protecting Microsoft assets are customer assets. And then ah, And for me, with the trend also responsibility for business continuity Disaster recovery company >> on the sea. So job has been evolving. We're talking before the camera came on that it's coming to CEO CF roll years ago involved to a business leader. Where is the sea? So roll now in your industry is our is a formal title is it establishes their clear lines of reporting. How's it evolved? What's the current state of the market in terms of the sea? So it's roll? >> Yeah, the role is involved. A lot. Like you said, I think like the CIA or twenty years ago, you know, start from the back room of the front room and I think the, you know, one of things I look at in the role is it's really made it before things. There's technical architecture, there's business enablement. There's operational expert excellence. And then there's risk management and the older ah, what does find the right word? But the early see so model was really about the technical architecture. Today. It's really a blend of those four things. How do you enable your business to move forward? How do you take calculated risks or manage risks? And then how do you do it really effectively and efficiently, which is really a new suit and you look at them. You'LL see people evolving to those four functions. >> And who's your boss? Would you report to >> I report to a gentleman by the name of a curtain. Little Benny on DH. He is the chief digital officer, which would be a combination of Seo did officer and transformation as well as all of Microsoft corporate strategy >> and this broad board visibility, actually in security. >> Yeah, you >> guys, how is Microsoft evolved? You've been with the company for a long time >> in the >> old days ahead perimeters, and we talk about on the Cube all the time. When a criminalist environment. Now there's no perimeter. Yeah, the world's changed. How is Microsoft evolved? Its its view on security Has it evolved from central groups to decentralize? How is it how how was it managed? What's the what's the current state of the art for security organization? >> Well, I think that, you know, you raise a good point, though things have changed. And so in this idea, where there is this, you know, perimeter and you demanded everything through the network that was great. But in a client to cloak cloud world, we have today with mobile devices and proliferation or cloud services, and I ot the model just doesn't work anymore. So we sort of simplified it down into Well, we should go with this, you know, people calls your trust, I refer to It is just don't talk to strangers. But the idea being is this really so simplified, which is you've got to have a good identity, strong identity to participate. You have to have managed in healthy device to participate, to talk to, ah, Microsoft Asset. And then you have to have data in telemetry that surrounds that all the time. And so you basically have a trust, trust and then verify model between those three things. And that's really the fundamental. It's really that simple. >> David Lava as Pascal senior with twenty twelve when he was M. C before he was the C E O. V M. Where he said, You know his security do over and he was like, Yes, it's going to be a do over its opportunity. What's your thoughts on that perspective? Has there been a do over? Is it to do over our people looking at security and a whole new way? What's your thoughts? >> Yeah, I mean, I've been around security for a long time, and it's there's obviously changes in Massa nations that happened obviously, at Microsoft. At one point we had a security division. I was the CTO in that division, and we really thought the better way to do it was make security baked in all the products that we do. Everything has security baked in. And so we step back and really change the way we thought about it. To make it easier for developers for end users for admin, that is just a holistic part of the experience. So again, the technology really should disappear. If you really want to be affected, I think >> don't make it a happy thought. Make it baked in from Day one on new product development and new opportunity. >> Yeah, basically, shift the whole thing left. Put it right in from the beginning. And so then, therefore, it's a better experience for everyone using it. >> So one of things we've observed over the past ten years of doing the Cube when do first rolled up with scene, you know, big data role of date has been critical, and I think one of the things that's interesting is, as you get data into the system, you can use day that contextually and look at the contextual behavioral data. It's really is create some visibility into things you, Meyer may not have seen before. Your thoughts and reaction to the concept of leveraging data because you guys get a lot of data. How do you leverage the data? What's the view of data? New data will make things different. Different perspectives creates more visibility. Is that the right view? What's your thoughts on the role of Data World Data plays? >> Well, they're gonna say, You know, we had this idea. There's identity, there's device. And then there's the data telemetry. That platform becomes everything we do, what there's just security and are anomalous behavior like you were talking about. It is how do we improve the user experience all the way through? And so we use it to the service health indicator as well. I think the one thing we've learned, though, is I was building where the biggest data repositories your head for some time. Like we look at about a six point five trillion different security events a day in any given day, and so sort of. How do you filter through that? Manage? That's pretty amazing, says six point five trillion >> per day >> events per day as >> coming into Microsoft's >> that we run through the >> ecosystem your systems. Your computers? >> Yeah. About thirty five hundred people. Reason over that. So you can Certainly the math. You need us. Um, pretty good. Pretty good technology to make it work effectively for you and efficiently >> at RC A Heard a quote on the floor and on the q kind of echoing the same sentiment is you can't hire your way to success in this market is just not enough people qualified and jobs available to handle the volume and the velocity of the data coming in. Automation plays a critical role. Your reaction to that comment thoughts on? >> Well, I think I think the cure there, John, those when you talk about the volume of the data because there's what we used to call speeds and feeds, right? How big is it? And I used to get great network data so I can share a little because we've talked, like from the nineties or whatever period that were there. Like the network was everything, but it turns out much like a diverse workforce creates the best products. It turns out diverse data is more important than speeds and feeds. So, for example, authentication data map to, you know, email data map to end point data map. TEO SERVICE DATA Soon you're hosting, you know, the number of customers. We are like financial sector data vs Healthcare Data. And so it's the ability Teo actually do correlation across that diverse set of data that really differentiates it. So X is an example. We update one point two billion devices every single month. We do six hundred thirty billion authentications every single month. And so the ability to start correlating those things and movement give us a set of insights to protect people like we never had before. >> That's interesting telemetry you're getting in the marketplace. Plus, you have the systems to bring it in >> a pressure pressure coming just realized. And this all with this consent we don't do without consent, we would never do without consent. >> Of course, you guys have the terms of service. You guys do a good job on that, But I think the point that I'm seeing there is that you guys are Microsoft. Microsoft got a lot of access. Get a lot of stuff out there. How does an enterprise move to that divers model because they will have email, obviously. But they have devices. So you guys are kind of operating? I would say tear one of the level of that environment cause you're Microsoft. I'm sure the big scale players to that. I'm just an enterprising I'm a bank or I'm an insurance company or I'm in oil and gas, Whatever the vertical. Maybe. What do I do if I'm the sea? So they're So what does that mean, Diversity? How should they? >> Well, I think they have a diverse set of data as well. Also, if they participate, you know, even in our platform today, we you know, we have this thing called the security graph, which is an FBI people can tap into and tap into the same graph that I use and so they can use that same graph particular for them. They can use our security experts to help them with that if they don't have the all the resource and staff to go do that. So we provide both both models for that to happen, and I think that's why a unique perspective I should think should remind myself of which is we should have these three things. We have a really good security operations group we have. I think that makes us pretty unique that people can leverage. We build this stuff into the product, which I think is good. But then the partnership, the other partners who play in the graph, it's not just us. So there's lots of people who play on that as well. >> So like to ask you two lines of questions. Wanting on the internal complex is that organizations will have on the external complexity and realities of threats and coming in. How do they? How do you balance that out? What's your vision on that? Because, you know, actually, there's technology, his culture and people, you know in those gaps and capabilities on on all three. Yeah, internally just getting the culture right and then dealing with the external. How does a C so about his company's balance? Those realities? >> Well, I think you raised a really good point, which is how do you move the culture for? That's a big conversation We always have. And that was sort of, you know, it's interesting because the the one side we have thirty five hundred people who have security title in their job, But there's over one hundred thousand people who every day part of their job is doing security, making sure they'LL understand that and know that is a key part we should reinforce everyday on DSO. But I think balancing it is, is for me. It's actually simplifying just a set of priorities because there's no shortage of, you know, vendors who play in the space. There's no shortage of things you can read about. And so for us it was just simplifying it down and getting it. That simplifies simplified view of these are the three things we're going to go do we build onerous platform to prioritize relative to threat, and then and then we ensure we're building quality products. Those five things make it happen. >> I'd like to get your thoughts on common You have again Before I came on camera around how you guys view simplification terminal. You know, you guys have a lot of countries, the board level, and then also you made a common around trust of security and you an analogy around putting that drops in a bucket. So first talk about the simplification, how you guys simplifying it and why? Why is that important? >> You think we supply two things one was just supplying the message to people understood the identity of the device and making sure everything is emitting the right telemetry. The second part that was like for us but a Z to be illustrative security passwords like we started with this technology thing and we're going to do to FAA. We had cards and we had readers and oh, my God, we go talk to a user. We say we're going to put two FAA everywhere and you could just see recoil and please, >> no. And then >> just a simple change of being vision letters. And how about this? We're just going to get rid of passwords then People loved like they're super excited about it. And so, you know, we moved to this idea of, you know, we always said this know something, know something new, how something have something like a card And they said, What about just be something and be done with it? And so, you know, we built a lot of the capability natively into the product into windows, obviously, but I supported energies environment. So I you know, I support a lot of Mac clinics and IOS and Android as well So you've read it. Both models you could use by or you could use your device. >> That's that. That's that seems to be a trend. Actually, See that with phones as well as this. Who you are is the password and why is the support? Because Is it because of these abuses? Just easy to program? What's the thought process? >> I think there's two things that make it super helpful for us. One is when you do the biometric model. Well, first of all, to your point, the the user experience is so much better. Like we walk up to a device and it just comes on. So there's no typing this in No miss typing my password. And, you know, we talked earlier, and that was the most popular passwords in Seattle with Seahawks two thousand seventeen. You can guess why, but it would meet the complexity requirements. And so the idea is, just eliminate all that altogether. You walk up machine, recognize you, and you're often running s o. The user experience is great, but plus it's Actually the entropy is harder in the biometric, which makes it harder for people to break it, but also more importantly, it's bound locally to the device. You can't run it from somewhere else. And that's the big thing that I think people misunderstanding that scenario, which is you have to be local to that. To me, that's a >> great example of rethinking the security paradigm. Exactly. Let's talk about trust and security. You you have an opinion on this. I want to get your thoughts, the difference between trust and security so they go hand in hand at the same time. They could be confused. Your thoughts on this >> well being. You can have great trust. You can, so you can have great security. But you generally and you would hope that would equate like a direct correlation to trust. But it's not. You need to you build trust. I think our CEO said it best a long time ago. You put one bucket of water, one bucket. Sorry, one truffle water in the bucket every time. And that's how you build trust. Over time, my teenager will tell you that, and then you kick it over and you put it on the floor. So you have to. It's always this ratcheting up bar that builds trust. >> They doing great you got a bucket of water, you got a lot of trust, that one breach. It's over right, >> and you've got to go rebuild it and you've got to start all over again. And so key, obviously, is not to have that happen. But then, that's why we make sure you have operational rigor and >> great example that just totally is looking Facebook. Great. They have massive great security. What really went down this past week, but still the trust factor on just some of the other or societal questions? >> Yeah, >> and that something Do it. >> Security. Yeah, I think that's a large part of making sure you know you're being true. That's what I said before about, you know, we make sure we have consent. We're transparent about how we do the things we do, and that's probably the best ways to build trust. >> Okay, so you guys have been successful in Microsoft, just kind of tight the company for second to your role. It's pretty well documented that the stock prices at an all time high. So if Donatella Cube alumni, by the way, has been on the cue before he he took over and clear he didn't pivot. He just said we'd go in the cloud. And so the great moves, he don't eat a lot of great stuff. Open source from open compute to over the source. And this ship has turned and everything's going great. But that cheering the cloud has been great for the company. So I gotta ask you, as you guys move to the cloud, the impact to your businesses multi fold one products, ecosystem suppliers. All these things are changing. How has security role in the sea? So position been impact that what have you guys done? How does that impact security in general? Thoughts? >> Yeah, I think we obviously were like any other enterprise we had thousands of online are thousands of line of business applications, and we did a transformation, and we took a method logical approach with risk management. And we said, Okay, well, this thirty percent we should just get rid of and decommission these. We should, you know, optimize and just lifting shifting application. That cloud was okay, but it turns out there's massive benefit there, like for elasticity. Think of things that quarterly reporting or and you'll surveys or things like that where you could just dynamically grow and shrink your platform, which was awesome linear scale that we never had Cause those events I talk about would require re architectures. Separate function now becomes linear. And so I think there is a lot of things from a security perspective I could do in a much more efficient must wear a fish. In fact, they're then I had to have done it before, but also much more effective. I just have compute capability. Didn't have I have signal I didn't have. And so we had to wrap her head around that right and and figure out how to really leverage that. And to be honest, get the point. We're exploited because you were the MySpace. I have disaster and continent and business. This is processed stuff. And so, you know, everyone build dark fiber, big data centers, storage, active, active. And now when you use a platform is a service like on that kind of azure. You could just click a Bach and say, I want this thing to replicate. It also feeds your >> most diverse data and getting the data into the system that you throw a bunch of computer at that scale. So What diverse data? How does that impact the good guys and the bad guys? That doesn't tip the scales? Because if you have divers date and you have his ability, it's a race for who has the most data because more data diversity increases the aperture and our visibility into events. >> Yeah, I you >> know, I should be careful. I feel like I always This's a job. You always feel like you're treading water and trying to trying to stay ahead. But I think that, um, I think for the first time in my tenure do this. I feel there's an asymmetry that benefits. They're good guys in this case because of the fact that your ability to reason over large sets of data like that and is computed data intensive and it will be much harder for them like they could generally use encryption were effectively than some organization because the one the many relationship that happens in that scenario. But in the data center you can't. So at least for now, I feel like there's a tip This. The scales have tipped a bit for the >> guy that you're right on that one. I think it's good observation I think that industry inside look at the activity around, from new fund adventures to overall activity on the analytics side. Clearly, the data edge is going to be an advantage. I think that's a great point. Okay, that's how about the explosion of devices we're seeing now. An explosion of pipe enabled devices, Internet of things to the edge. Operational technologies are out there that in factory floors, everything being I P enables, kind of reminds me of the old days. Were Internet population you'd never uses on the Internet is growing, and >> that costs a lot >> of change in value, creation and opportunities devices. Air coming on both physical and software enabled at a massive rate is causing a lot of change in the industry. Certainly from a security posture standpoint, you have more surface area, but they're still in opportunity to either help on the do over, but also create value your thoughts on this exploding device a landscape, >> I think your Boston background. So Metcalfe's law was the value the net because the number of the nodes on the network squared right, and so it was a tense to still be true, and it continues to grow. I think there's a huge value and the device is there. I mean, if you look at the things we could do today, whether it's this watch or you know your smartphone or your smart home or whatever it is, it's just it's pretty unprecedented the capabilities and not just in those, but even in emerging markets where you see the things people are doing with, you know, with phones and Lauren phones that you just didn't have access to from information, you know, democratization of information and analysis. I think it's fantastic. I do think, though, on the devices there's a set of devices that don't have the same capabilities as some of the more markets, so they don't have encryption capability. They don't have some of those things. And, you know, one of Microsoft's responses to that was everything. Has an M see you in it, right? And so we, you know, without your spirit, we created our own emcee. That did give you the ability to update it, to secure, to run it and manage it. And I think that's one of the things we're doing to try to help, which is to start making these I, O. T or Smart devices, but at a very low cost point that still gives you the ability because the farm would not be healed Update, which we learn an O. T. Is that over time new techniques happen And you I can't update the system >> from That's getting down to the product level with security and also having the data great threats. So final final talk Tracking one today with you on this, your warrior in the industry, I said earlier. See, so is a hard job you're constantly dealing with compliance to, you know, current attacks, new vector, new strains of malware. And it's all over the map. You got it. You got got the inbound coming in and you got to deal with all that the blocking and tackling of the organization. >> What do you What do >> you finding as best practice? What's the what if some of the things on the cso's checklist that you're constantly worried about and or investing in what some of >> the yeah, >> the day to day take us through the day to day life >> of visited a lot? Yeah, it >> starts with not a Leslie. That's the first thing you have to get used to, but I think the you know again, like I said, there's risk Manager. Just prioritize your center. This is different for every company like for us. You know, hackers don't break and they just log in. And so identity still is one of the top things. People have to go work on him. You know, get rid of passwords is good for the user, but good for the system. We see a lot in supply chain going on right now. Obviously, you mentioned in the Cambridge Analytical Analytics where we had that issue. It's just down the supply chain. And when you look at not just third party but forthe party fifth party supply and just the time it takes to respond is longer. So that's something that we need to continue to work on. And then I think you know that those are some of the other big thing that was again about this. How do you become effective and efficient and how you managed that supply chain like, You know, I've been on a mission for three years to reduce my number of suppliers by about fifty percent, and there's still lots of work to do there, but it's just getting better leverage from the supplier I have, as well as taking on new capability or things that we maybe providing natively. But at the end of the day, if you have one system that could do what four systems going Teo going back to the war for talent, having people, no forces and versus one system, it's just way better for official use of talent. And and obviously, simplicity is the is the friend of security. Where is entropy is not, >> and also you mentioned quality data diversity it is you're into. But also there's also quality date of you have quality and diverse data. You could have a nice, nice mechanism to get machine learning going well, but that's kind of complex, because in the thie modes of security breaches, you got pre breached in breech post breach. All have different data characteristics all flowing together, so you can't just throw that answer across as a prism across the problem sets correct. This is super important, kind of fundamentally, >> yeah, but I think I >> would I would. The way I would characterize those is it's honestly, well, better lessons. I think I learned was living how to understand. Talk with CFO, and I really think we're just two things. There's technical debt that we're all working on. Everybody has. And then there's future proofing the company. And so we have a set of efforts that go onto like Red Team. Another actually think like bad people break them before they break you, you know, break it yourself and then go work on it. And so we're always balancing how much we're spending on the technical, that cleanup, you know, modernizing systems and things that are more capable. And then also the future proofing. If you're seeing things coming around the corner like cryptography and and other other element >> by chain blockchain, my supply chain is another good, great mechanism. So you constantly testing and R and D also practical mechanisms. >> And there in the red team's, which are the teams that attacking pen everything, which is again, break yourself first on this super super helpful for us >> well bred. You've seen a lot of ways of innovation have been involved in multiple ways computer industry client server all through the through the days, so feel. No, I feel good about this you know, because it reminds me and put me for broken the business together. But this is the interesting point I want to get to is there's a lot of younger Si SOS coming in, and a lot of young talent is being attractive. Security has kind of a game revived to it. You know, most people, my friends, at a security expert, they're all gamers. They love game, and now the thrill of it. It's exciting, but it's also challenging. Young people coming might not have experience. You have lessons you've learned. Share some thoughts over the years that scar either scar tissue or best practices share some advice. Some of the younger folks coming in breaking into the business of, you know, current situation. What you learned over the years it's Apple Apple. But now the industry. >> Yeah, sadly, I'd probably say it's no different than a lot of the general advice I would have in the space, which is there's you value experience. But it turns out I value enthusiasm and passion more here so you can teach about anybody whose passion enthusiastic and smart anything they want. So we get great data people and make them great security people, and we have people of a passion like you know, this person. It's his mission is to limit all passwords everywhere and like that passion. Take your passion and driver wherever you need to go do. And I >> think the nice >> thing about security is it is something that is technically complex. Human sociology complex, right? Like you said, changing culture. And it affects everything we do, whether it's enterprise, small, medium business, large international, it's actually a pretty It's a fasten, if you like hard problem. If you're a puzzle person, it's a great It's a great profession >> to me. I like how you said Puzzle. That's I think that's exactly it. They also bring up a good point. I want to get your thoughts on quickly. Is the talent gap is is really not about getting just computer science majors? It's bigger than that. In fact, I've heard many experts say, and you don't have to be a computer scientist. You could be a lot of cross disciplines. So is there a formula or industry or profession, a college degree? Or is it doesn't matter. It's just smart person >> again. It depends if your job's a hundred percent. Security is one thing, but like what we're trying to do is make not we don't have security for developers you want have developed to understand oppa security and what they build is an example on DSO. Same with administrators and other components. I do think again I would say the passion thing is a key piece for us, but But there's all aspects of the profession, like the risk managers air, you know, on the actuarial side. Then there's math people I had one of my favorite people was working on his phD and maladaptive behavior, and he was super valuable for helping us understand what actually makes things stick when you're trying to train their educate people. And what doesn't make that stick anthropologist or super helpful in this field like anthropologist, Really? Yeah, anthropologist are great in this field. So yeah, >> and sociology, too, you mentioned. That would think that's a big fact because you've got human aspect interests, human piece of it. You have society impact, so that's really not really one thing. It's really cross section, depending upon where you want to sit in the spectrum of opportunity, >> knowing it gives us a chance to really hire like we hire a big thing for us has been hard earlier in career and building time because it's just not all available. But then also you, well, you know, hire from military from law enforcement from people returning back. It's been actually, it's been a really fascinating thing from a management perspective that I didn't expect when I did. The role on has been fantastic. >> The mission. Personal question. Final question. What's getting you excited these days? I mean, honestly, you had a very challenging job and you have got attend all the big board meetings, but the risk management compliance. There's a lot of stuff going on, but it's a lot >> of >> technology fund in here to a lot of hard problems to solve. What's getting you excited? What what trends or things in the industry gets you excited? >> Well, I'm hopeful we're making progress on the bad guys, which I think is exciting. But honestly, this idea the you know, a long history of studying safety when I did this and I would love to see security become the air bags of the technology industry, right? It's just always there on new president. But you don't even know it's there until you need it. And I think that getting to that vision would be awesome. >> And then really kind of helping move the trust equation to a whole other level reputation. New data sets so data, bits of data business. >> It's total data business >> breath. Thanks for coming on the Q. Appreciate your insights, but also no see. So the chief information security officer at Microsoft, also corporate vice president here inside the Cuban Palo Alto. This is cute conversations. I'm John Career. Thanks for watching. >> Thank you.