>>Hey everyone, welcome to this cube conversation. I'm your host Lisa Martin, and I have the pleasure of welcoming back our most prolific guest on the cube in its history, the CMO of Fin Ad, Eric Herzog. Eric, it's great to see you. Welcome back, >>Lisa. It's great to be here. Love being on the cube. I think this might be number 55 or 56. Been doing 'em a long time with the Cube. You guys are great. >>You, you have, and we always recognize you lately with the Hawaiian shirts. It's your brand that's, that's the Eric Hizo brand. We love it. But I like the pin, the infin nut pin on brand. Thank you. >>Yeah. Oh, gotta be on brand. >>Exactly. So talk about the current IT landscape. So much change we've seen in the last couple of years. Specifically, what are some of the big challenges that you are talking with enterprise customers and cloud service providers? About what, what are some of those major things on their minds? >>So there's a couple things. First of all is obviously with the Rocky economy and even before covid, just for storage in particular, CIOs hate storage. I've been doing this now since 1986. I have never, ever, ever met a CIO at any company I've bid with. And I've been with four of the biggest storage companies on this planet. Never met a cio. Used to be a storage guy. So they know they need it, but boy, they really don't like it. So the storage admins have to manage more and more storage. Exabytes, exabytes, it just ballooning for what a storage admin has to do. Then you then have the covid and is it recession? No. Is it a growth? And then clearly what's happened in the last year with what's going on in Europe and the, is it a recession, the inflation. So they're always looking to, how do we cut money on storage yet still get what we need for our applications, workloads, and use cases. So that's definitely the biggest, the first topic. >>So never met a CIO that was a storage admin or as a fan, but as you point out, they need it. And we've seen needs changing in customer landscapes, especially as the threat landscape has changed so dramatically the last couple of years. Ransomware, you've said it before, I say it too. It's no longer if it's when it's how often. It's the frequency. We've gotta be able to recover. Backups are being targeted. Talk to me about some of, in that landscape, some of the evolutions of customer challenges and maybe those CIOs going, We've gotta make sure that our, our storage data is protected. >>So it's starting to change. However, historically with the cio and then when they started hiring CISOs or security directors, whatever they had, depending on the company size, it was very much about protecting the edge. Okay, if you will, the moat and the wall of the castle. Then it was the network in between. So keep the streets inside the castle clean. Then it was tracking down the bad guy. So if they did get over, the issue is, if I remember correctly, the sheriff of Nottingham never really caught Robinhood. So the problem is the dwell time where the ransomware malware's hidden on storage could be as much as 200 days. So I think they're starting to realize at the security level now, forget, forget the guys on the storage side, the security guys, the cso, the CIO, are starting to realize that if you're gonna have a comprehensive cybersecurity strategy, must include storage. And that is new >>That, well, that's promising then. That's new. I mean obviously promising given the, the challenges and the circumstances. So then from a storage perspective, customers that are in this multi-cloud hybrid cloud environment, you talked about the the edge cloud on-prem. What are some of the key things from a storage perspective that customers have to achieve these days to be secure as data volumes continue to grow and spread? >>So what we've done is implement on both primary storage and secondary storage and technology called infin safe. So Infin Safe has the four legs of the storage cyber security stool. So first of all is creating an air gap. In this case, a logical air gap can be local or remote. We create an immutable snapshot, which means it can't be changed, it can't be altered, so you can't change it. We have a fenced forensic environment to check out the storage because you don't wanna recover. Again, malware and rans square can is hidden. So you could be making amenable snapshots of actually malware, ransomware, and never know you're doing it right. So you have to check it out. Then you need to do a rapid recovery. The most important thing if you have an attack is how fast can you be up and going with recovery? So we have actually instituted now a number of cyber storage security guarantees. >>We will guarantee the SLAs on a, the snapshot is absolutely immutable. So they know that what they're getting is what they were supposed to be getting. And then also we are guaranteeing recovery times on primary storage. We're guaranteeing recovery of under one minute. We'll make the snapshot available under one minute and on secondary storage under 20 minutes. So those are things you gotta look for from a security perspective. And then the other thing you gotta practice, in my world, ransomware, malware, cyber tech is basically a disaster. So yes, you got the hurricane, yes, you got the flood, yes, you got the earthquake. Yes, you got the fire in the building. Yes you got whatever it may be. But if you don't practice malware, ransomware, recoveries and protection, then it might as well be a hurricane or earthquake. It will take your data, >>It will take your data on the numbers of customers that pay ransom is pretty high, isn't it? And and not necessarily able to recover their data. So it's a huge risk. >>So if you think about it, the government documented that last year, roughly $6 trillion was spent either protecting against ransomware and malware or paying ransomware attacks. And there's been several famous ones. There was one in Korea, 72 million ransom. It was one of the Korea's largest companies. So, and those are only the ones that make the news. Most of 'em don't make the news. Right. >>So talk to me then, speaking and making the news. Nobody wants to do that. We, we know every industry is vulnerable to this. Some of the ones that might be more vulnerable, healthcare, government, public sector education. I think the Los Angeles Unified School district was just hit as well in September. They >>Were >>What, talk to me about how infin out is helping customers really dial down the risk when the threat actors are becoming more and more sophisticated? >>Well, there's a couple things. First of all, our infin safe software comes free on our main product. So we have a product called infin Guard for Secondary Storage and it comes for free on that. And then our primary storage product's called the Infin Box. It also comes for free. So they don't have to use it, but we embed it. And then we have reference architectures that we give them our ses, our solutions architects and our technical advisors all up to speed on why they should do it, how they should do it. We have a number of customers doing it. You know, we're heavily concentrated the global Fortune 2000, for example, we publicly announced that 26% of the Fortune 50 use our technology, even though we're a small company. So we go to extra lengths to a B, educated on our own front, our own teams, and then B, make sure they portray that to the end users and our channel partners. But the end users don't pay a dime for the software that does what I just described, it's free, it's included when you get you're Infin box or you're ingar, it's included at no charge. >>That's pretty differentiating from a competitive standpoint. I might, I would guess >>It is. And also the guarantee. So for example, on primary storage, okay, whether you'd put your Oracle or put your SAP or I Mongo or your sequel or your highly transactional workloads, right? Your business finance workload, all your business critical stuff. We are the first and only storage company that offers a primary guarantee on cyber storage resilience. And we offer two of them on primary storage. No other vendor offers a guarantee, which we do on primary storage. Whether you the first and right now as of here we are sitting in the middle of October. We are still the only vendor that offers anything on primary storage from a guaranteed SLA on primary storage for cyber storage resilience. >>Let's talk about those guarantees. Walk me through what you just announced. There's been a a very, a lot of productivity at Infin DAT in 2022. A lot of things that you've announced but on crack some of the things you're announcing. Sure. Talk to me specifically about those guarantees and what's in it for me as a customer. It sounds pretty obvious, but I'd love to hear it from you. >>Okay, so we've done really three different types of guarantees. The first one is we have a hundred percent availability guarantee on our primary storage. And we've actually had that for the last, since 2019. So it's a hundred percent availability. We're guaranteed no downtime, a hundred percent availability, which for our customer base being heavily concentrated, the global Fortune 2000 large government enterprises, big universities and even smaller companies, we do a lot of business with CSPs and MSPs. In fact, at the Flash Memory Summit are Infin Box ssa All Flash was named the best product for hyperscaler deployment. Hyperscaler basically means cloud servers provider. So they need a hundred percent availability. So we have a guarantee on that. Second guarantee we have is a performance guarantee. We'll do an analysis, we look at all their workloads and then we will guarantee in writing what the performance should be based on which, which of our products they want to buy are Infin Box or Infin Box ssa, which is all flash. >>Then we have the third one is all about cyber resilience. So we have two on our Infin box, our Infin box SSA for primary storage, which is a one the immutability of the snapshot and immediately means you can't erase the data. Right? Camp tamper with it. Second one is on the recovery time, which is under a minute. We just announced in the middle of October that we are doing a similar cyber storage resilience guarantee on our ARD secondary product, which is designed for backup recovery, et cetera. We will also offer the immutably snapshot guarantee and also one on the recoverability of that data in under 20 minutes. In fact, we just did a demo at our live launch earlier this week and we demoed 20 petabytes of Veeam backup data recovered in 12 minutes. 12 >>Minutes 2012. >>20 petabytes In >>12 bytes in 12 minutes. Yes. That's massive. That's massively differentiating. But that's essential for customers cuz you know, in terms of backups and protecting the data, it's all about recovery >>A and once they've had the attack, it's how fast you get back online, right? That that's what happens if they've, if they can't stop the attack, can't stop the threat and it happens. They need to get that back as fast as they can. So we have the speed of recovery on primary stores, the first in the industry and we have speed on the backup software and we'll do the same thing for a backup data set recovery as well. Talk >>To me about the, the what's in it for me, For the cloud service providers, they're obviously the ones that you work with are competing with the hyperscalers. How does the guarantees and the differentiators that Fin out is bringing to market? How do you help those cloud SPS dial up their competitiveness against the big cheeses? >>Well, what we do is we provide that underlying infrastructure. We, first of all, we only sell things that are petabyte in scale. That's like always sell. So for example, on our in fitter guard product, the raw capacity is over four petabytes. And the effective capacity, cuz you do data reduction is over 85 petabytes on our newest announced product, on our primary storage product, we now can do up to 17 petabytes of effective capacity in a single rack. So the value to the service rider is they can save on what slots? Power and floor. A greener data center. Yeah, right. Which by the way is not just about environmentals, but guess what? It also translate into operational expense. >>Exactly. CapEx office, >>With a lot of these very large systems that we offer, you can consolidate multiple products from our competitors. So for example, with one of the competitors, we had a deal that we did last quarter 18 competitive arrays into one of ours. So talk about saving, not just on all of the operational expense, including operational manpower, but actually dramatically on the CapEx. In fact, one of our Fortune 500 customers in the telco space over the last five years have told us on CapEx alone, we've saved them $104 million on CapEx by consolidating smaller technology into our larger systems. And one of the key things we do is everything is automated. So we call it autonomous automation use AI based technology. So once you install it, we've got several public references who said, I haven't touched this thing in three or four years. It automatically configures itself. It automatically adjusts to changes in performance and new apps. When I put in point a new app at it automatically. So in the old days the storage admin would optimize performance for a new application. We don't do that, we automatically do it and autonomously the admin doesn't even click a button. We just sense there's new applications and we automate ourselves and configure ourselves without the admin having to do anything. So that's about saving operational expense as well as operational manpower. >>Absolutely. I was, one of the things that was ringing in my ear was workforce productivity and obviously those storage admins being able to to focus on more strategic projects. Can't believe the CIOs aren't coming around yet. But you said there's, there's a change, there's a wave coming. But if we think about the the, the what's in it for me as a customer, the positive business outcomes that I'm hearing, lower tco, your greener it, which is key. So many customers that we talk to are so focused on sustainability and becoming greener, especially with an on-prem footprint, workforce productivity. Talk about some of the other key business outcomes that you're helping customers achieve and how it helps them to be more competitive. >>Sure. So we've got a, a couple different things. First of all, storage can't go down. When the storage goes down, everyone gets blamed. Mission. When an app goes down, no one really thinks about it. It's always the storage guy's fault. So you want to be a hundred percent available. And that's today's businesses, and I'd actually argue it's been this way for 20 years are 24 by seven by 365. So that's one thing that we deliver. Second thing is performance. So we have public references talk about their SAP workload that used to take two hours, now takes 20 minutes, okay? We have another customer that was doing SAP queries. They improved their performance three times, Not 3%, not 3%, three times. So 300% better performance just by using our storages. They didn't touch the sap, they didn't touch the servers. All they do is to put our storage in there. >>So performance relates basically to applications, workloads and use cases and productivity beyond it. So think the productivity of supply chain guys, logistics guys, the shipping guys, the finance guys, right? All these applications that run today's enterprises. So we can automate all that. And then clearly the cyber threat. Yeah, that is a huge issue. And every CIO is concerned about the cyber threat. And in fact, it was interesting, Fortune magazine did a survey of CEOs, and this was last May, the number one concern, 66% in that may survey was cyber security number one concern. So this is not just a CIO thing, this is a CEO thing and a board level >>Thing. I was gonna say it's at at the board level that the cyber security threats are so real, they're so common. No one wants to be the next headline, like the colonial pipeline, right? Or the school districts or whatnot. And everybody is at risk. So then what you're enabling with what you've just announced, the all the guarantees on the SLAs, the massively fast recovery times, which is critical in cyber recovery. Obviously resilience is is key there. Modern data protection it sounds like to me. How do you define that and and what are customers looking for with respect to modern cyber resilience versus data protection? >>Yeah, so we've got normal data protection because we work with all the backup vendors. Our in ARD is what's known as a purpose built backup appliance. So that allows you to back at a much faster rate. And we work all the big back backup vendors, IBM spectrum Protect, we work with veritas vem com vault, oracle arm, anybody who does backup. So that's more about the regular side, the traditional backup. But the other part of modern data protection is infusing that with the cyber resilience. Cuz cyber resilience is a new thing. Yes, from a storage guy perspective, it hasn't been around a long time. Many of our competitors have almost nothing. One or two of our competitors have a pretty robust, but they don't guarantee it the way we guarantee it. So they're pretty good at it. But the fact that we're willing to put our money where our mouth is, we think says we price stand above and then most of the other guys in the storage industry are just starting to get on the bandwagon of having cyber resilience. >>So that changes what you do from data protection, what would call modern data protection is a combination of traditional backup recovery, et cetera. Now with this influence and this infusion of cybersecurity cyber resilience into a storage environment. And then of course we've also happened to add it on primary storage as well. So whether it's primary storage or backup and archive storage, we make sure you have that right cyber resilience to make it, if you will, modern data protection and diff different from what it, you know, the old backup of your grandfather, father, son backup in tape or however you used to do it. We're well beyond that now we adding this cyber resilience aspect. Well, >>From a cyber resilience perspective, ransomware, malware, cyber attacks are, that's a disaster, right? But traditional disaster recovery tools aren't really built to be able to pull back that data as quickly as it sounds like in Trinidad is able to facilitate. >>Yeah. So one of the things we do is in our reference architectures and written documentation as well as when we do the training, we'd sell the customers you need to practice, if you practice when there's a fire, a flood, a hurricane, an earthquake or whatever is the natural disaster you're practicing that you need to practice malware and ran somewhere. And because our recovery is so rapid and the case of our ingar, our fenced environment to do the testing is actually embedded in it. Several of our competitors, if you want the fenced environment, you have to buy a second product with us. It's all embedded in the one item. So A, that makes it more effective from a CapEx and opex perspective, but it also makes it easier. So we recommend that they do the practice recoveries monthly. Now whether they do it or not separate issue, but at least that's what we're recommending and say, you should be doing this on a monthly basis just like you would practice a disaster, like a hurricane or fire or a flood or an earthquake. Need to be practicing. And I think people are starting to hear it, but they don't still think more about, you know, the flood. Yeah. Or about >>The H, the hurricane. >>Yeah. That's what they think about. They not yet thinking about cybersecurity as really a disaster model. And it is. >>Absolutely. It is. Is is the theme of cyber resilience, as you said, this is a new concept, A lot of folks are talking about it, applying it differently. Is that gonna help dial up those folks just really being much more prepared for that type of cyber disaster? >>Well, we've made it so it's automated. Once you set up the immutable snapshots, it just does its thing. You don't set it and forget it. We create the logical air back. Once you do it, same thing. Set it and forget it. The fence forensic environment, easy to deploy. You do have to just configure it once and then obviously the recovery is almost instantaneous. It's under a minute guaranteed on primary storage and under 20 minutes, like I told you when we did our launch this week, we did 20 petabytes of Veeam backup data in 12 minutes. So that's pretty incredible. That's a lot of data to have recovered in 12 minutes. So the more automated we make it, which is what our real forte is, is this autonomous automation and automating as much as possible and make it easy to configure when you do have to configure. That's what differentiates what we do from our perspective. But overall in the storage industry, it's the recognition finally by the CISOs and the CIOs that, wait a second, maybe storage might be an essential part of my corporate cybersecurity strategy. Yes. Which it has not been historically, >>But you're seeing that change. Yes. >>We're starting to see that change. >>Excellent. So talk to me a little bit before we wrap here about the go to market one. Can folks get their hands on the updates to in kindergar and Finn and Safe and Penta box? >>So all these are available right now. They're available now either through our teams or through our, our channel partners globally. We do about 80% of our business globally through the channel. So whether you talk to us or talk to our channel partners, we're there to help. And again, we put our money where your mouth is with those guarantees, make sure we stand behind our products. >>That's awesome. Eric, thank you so much for joining me on the program. Congratulations on the launch. The the year of productivity just continues for infinit out is basically what I'm hearing. But you're really going in the extra mile for customers to help them ensure that the inevitable cyber attacks, that they, that they're complete storage environment on prem will be protected and more importantly, recoverable Very quickly. We appreciate your insights and your input. >>Great. Absolutely love being on the cube. Thank you very much for having us. Of >>Course. It's great to have you back. We appreciate it. For Eric Herzog, I'm Lisa Martin. You're watching this cube conversation live from Palo Alto.

(upbeat music) >> Good evening, guys. Welcome back to Las Vegas, theCUBE is here live at AWS re:Invent 2021. I'm Lisa Martin. We have two live sets, two remote sets, over 100 guests on theCUBE talking with AWS, and its massive ecosystem of partners bringing you this hybrid tech event, probably the biggest of the year, and I'm pleased to welcome Stephen Kovac next, the Chief Compliance Officer at Zscaler. Stephen, how's it going? >> Well, it's going well, Lisa. Thank you for asking, enjoying Vegas, loving the conference, unbelievable. >> Isn't it great to be back in person? >> Oh, it's so great, I've seen people. >> Conversations you can't replicate on video conferencing, you just can't. >> Can't, and you see people you haven't seen in two years, and it's like all of a sudden you're best buddies again. It's just wonderful, it's so great to back. >> It is, and AWS in typical fashion has done a great job of getting everybody in here safely. I'm not at all surprised, that's what I expected, but it's been great. And I hope that this can demonstrate to other companies, you can do this safely. >> You can, I think so. I mean, there's a lot of effort going into this, but as usual AWS does it right. So, you expect that. >> They do. Talk to me about the Zscaler-AWS partnership. What's going on? >> Well, it's a great partnership. So AWS and Zscaler have been partners since the beginning of Zscaler. We are the largest security cloud in the world. We're born and bred in the cloud security company. So literally we wrote one application that does global security, everything from firewall to proxy, secure web gateway, to DLP, to all this in one piece of software. So, in the past where people would buy appliances for all these devices and put them in their own data center, we wrote a software that allows us to put that in the cloud, run it on the cloud globally around the world. And our partnership with AWS is, we originally built that on AWS, and today still AWS is our prime partner, especially in the zero trust side of our business. So, great relationship, long-term and great I think for both of us, it's been a very, very... >> Fruitful partnership, synergistic? >> Synergistic, love that, so yes. >> You mentioned zero trust, and we have seen such massive changes to the security and the threat landscape the last 20, 22 months. Talk to me about the recent executive order calling for zero trust, how does Zscaler's partnership with AWS help you enable organizations, fed, SLED, DoD, to be able to actually bring in and apply zero trust? >> Yeah, great question. Five years ago I was tasked to bring Zscaler into the government side of the business. So I was employee one to do that. It was a great honor to do it. And the first thing we did is we partnered with AWS because we needed to get FedRAMP compliant. We knew we were going to go into DoD. So we needed to go to the Impact Level five. And eventually we'll be able to go up level six with AWS. And so it was our partnership started there. And as you've seen in five years with all the change that's happened, that obviously the breaches like SolarWinds, and the people up here talking about them all week with you I'm sure. The executive order came down from the Biden Administration, who I completely salute for being just tremendous leaders in the cybersecurity space. And the executive order, one of the big pieces of the executive order was every agency must produce a plan for zero trust. So our cloud platform that is on AWS is a zero trust platform. It is the first and only zero trust platform to get authorized by the federal government at the FedRAMP level, and now the IL five level. So, together we are literally capturing and taking over the, being the leader in the zero trust space for the federal government. And I'm going to get a sip of water, so forgive me, I've been here all week talking to a lot of people, so forgive me for that. >> That's one thing that we don't have to deal with when we're on Zoom, right, is you don't really have the risk of losing your voice. >> Stephen: There you go. >> But in terms of the executive order, something that you mentioned, SolarWinds, Colonial Pipeline, we only hear about some of the big ones. The fact that ransomware happens one attack every 10, 11 seconds, it's a matter of when we get hit, not if. >> As you know, the story coming up from me, coming up on stage with you today, I just got myself breached just this morning, just individually. So yes, it's going to get all of us. And especially, I think when you look at zero trust and ransomware and how they worked out how zero trust can prevent it, you look at the SLED market, you know, state, local governments, they don't have the dollars to go spend like DHS does, or say, some of the DoD does. So, our partnership with AWS allows us to produce a product that is very cost-effective on a per user basis, consumption model, which is what AWS has been famous for since day one, right, the consumption model, use it when you need it, don't use it when you don't. We built our software the same way. So, at some point in a year, in a school year, we'll ramp up with some schools up to a hundred thousand users in the district, and over the summer we'll ramp down to a thousand, and we just bill them for that. So it's a beautiful relationship that we partner in not just the executive order, but being a partner in SLED, fed in the sense that matches making our business together, match the government's business. And that makes us a true leader and makes us a cost-effective solution. And if you think about it just for a moment, yesterday, I told you I was testifying in front of the Senate. And one of the questions I got asked was, oh, how many security updates do you guys see a year? I said, a year, well, we do over 200,000 a day. 200,000 security updates from potential hackers every single day. And we're doing that over 200 billion transactions a day run on AWS. So it's tremendous partnership, and to be able to work like that, and at that kind of volume, and be able to go up and down with the, and you got AWS able to scope up and down, and us to be able to ride that wave with them. It's been great. >> One of the things that we always talk about when we talk AWS is they're customer focused or customer obsession that, hey, we start backwards, we work backwards from the customer. Same thing, synergistic from a cultural perspective? >> Absolutely, I mean, one of the things I always love about AWS and I've been a customer of AWS for many years, even prior to my Zscaler days, I love the way they approach things, right? If they're not trying to go out and sell it, they're trying to meet with the customer and find out what the customer needs, and then build a solution. We're the same way. I always tell, you know, when you think of our solutions, Zscaler, I always tell my sales teams, I say it takes four sales calls for people to really understand what we do. And AWS, in the beginning of AWS, it was kind of the same thing. In the old days, you know, we all just built data centers and we had all these racks, and all this expense and mesh is what you did. It was unusual back in the day, 10 years ago, and I've been to every single re:Invent. I mean, the first one there was like, you're actually going to put all your stuff in this unknown cloud thing, and it will be available when you need it? So yes, you know, the way that they did it is the same way we do it together today. And we do it together today. We partner on many deals today where we're both, our teams are in there together, selling together, whether it's the DoD, federal agencies, SLED agencies, and commercial, you know, selling it hand-in-hand because it's that same philosophy is we're going to build what a customer needs. We're not going to tell the customer what they need. We're going to hear what they need, and that's the same relationship. So I'm going to get another sip real quick. >> Go for it. One of the things that has been a theme that we've heard the last couple of days is every company needs to be a data company or private sector, public sector, and if they're not, they're probably not going to be around much longer. How do you help customers get their handle around that? Because the security threats are only increasing. I mean, it's ransomware as a service. The fact that these criminals are getting much more brazen, you just had this happen to yourself, but enabling them to become data-driven organizations and use the data, extract the value from it securely, that's hard. >> It is, I mean, if you think back in the day, I mean, companies didn't have chief compliance officers that worked in the space that we do. Their chief compliance officer back in the day was the guy that was writing your HR issues and what OSHA issues, and of course, I still deal with some of that stuff, but my true job is really around the data, right? You know, how do we build our platforms, what decisions we make on our platforms, how we're going to certify them to support that, and I mean, chief data officers, chief security officers, I mean, you go into companies today, even car dealerships today. I mean, I'm picking one, you never thought of them having a security officer, but they do, they have to, they have to. And I mean, basic school districts, I mean, I don't about you, when I was a kid and went to school, they didn't have computers, but when my kid went to school, they did, but they didn't have a security officer. Now today, every single school district has security officers. I mean, I love how you said it, that data-driven, that data thought is there. It has to be, it's a real threat. And the sad thing is of these ransomware attacks, how many don't get reported. >> Oh, right, we're only hearing about a select few. >> The numbers are something like 88% don't get reported. It's that big. So that just tells you, we hear the big ones, right, Colonial Pipeline, things like that. We don't hear about West Texas or Middle Illinois school district that paid five grand because somebody had something on the school. That's how, as you said, this ransomware as a service security, we call it a security as a service, there's SaaS, which is software as a service, we're security software as a service, and AWS is the infrastructure as a service that we run on. And that's how it works well together. >> Do you guys go into accounts together from a go-to-market perspective? >> We, do, we can always do a better job. And my good friend here at AWS, who's probably listening, we can always do better. But yeah, so it is become something that, especially in the government space we do, in federal, DoD, because the certifications are really important, certifications are important everywhere, and we have many, we talked about all the certifications we have in federal, FedRAMP and IL five, and we have a plethora of those certifications in the commercial space. But they mean in a federal space, they're really the ticket. They call them the ENERGY STAR of approval, good housekeeping piece. So, you know, having that, teaming up with AWS who we partner together and because AWS has the same certs, we can sell at the same levels. And we do a really great job of co-selling in that space together. And I think when they look at us and they say, well, you're AWS, they've got their FedRAMP high, IL five, and you're Zscaler, you got your FedRAMP high, IL five. Yes, we can do business with these guys, and that's important. >> So you guys both open doors for each other. >> We do, we do in many cases, yeah. As a matter of fact, re:Invent five years ago, a buddy of mine here opened a big, big account for us, which is today our largest account in federal came from re:Invent, where came up to me and said, hey, my customer wants to, he's looking to do something, they're an agency that has global footprint, and they're like, we want to do something as a security as a service. They don't want to ship boxes all over the place. And we just met the customer for a coffee, and next thing you know, became our, still today, our probably largest customer in federal. >> Wow, well, this is the 10th re:Invent, you said you've been to all of them. >> Stephen: I have been to all of them. I can't lie, but I can't say I did all the virtual ones. I mean, I was logged in. (laughs) >> That's okay, we'll wink on that one. But, one of the things then, we've just got about a minute left here, is in new leadership, Andy Jassy being promoted to the CEO of Amazon, we've got Adam Selipsky, heard lot of announcements and news from Adam yesterday, but some of the things that we've been talking about on theCUBE is the first 15 years of innovation at AWS, that's going to accelerate. Do you see that also, like if you look forward to the next decade, do you see things moving much faster than they did the past decade? >> I don't think they can't. I mean, I shouldn't say they have to. And the change of the guard as you might call it here, is it's always good to have a change of the guard I think. You know, the question is when's Andy going to go to space? I mean, that's the next. (Lisa laughs) I think you have the guys who got AWS to the dance, and now the dance, who's going to become the belle of the ball. And this next generation of leadership coming in is fabulous. I think they've made great decisions, and I think they're going to do really well. And we're behind them, we support it. I got a chance to meet with most of them, love a chance to meet with Andy, I haven't met with him yet. So Andy, I'd love to meet you sometime soon. But I'm very impressed with what they've done. And yes, I think it's going to be, the last 10 years of growth is going to be a year next year. I think literally, you take 10 years be compressed to a year, and then next year it will be compressed to a day. So it's moving that fast. >> Yep, get your neck brace on, prepare for that whiplash. >> Yeah, right? That's what I said to Jeff when Jeff went to space, that's how fast we're about to travel, right? But it's really relative. >> It is, there is no limit. Well, Stephen, thank you for joining me, talking about Zscaler, AWS, what you guys are doing, how you're helping to revolutionize the public sector, fed, SLED, a lot of great stuff there. Security is an ever-evolving topic, and we appreciate all of your insights. >> Well, it was wonderful to be here. Great to see you again. And great to be back with all our friends at re:Invent. >> All of our friends, exactly. >> Stephen: Thank you so much for the time today. >> My pleasure. For Stephen Kovac, I'm Lisa Martin. You're watching theCUBE, the global leader in live tech coverage. (pleasant music)

>> Good day, everyone. Thank you for joining me. I'm Cindy Maike, joined by Rick Taylor of Cloudera. We're here to talk about predictive maintenance for the public sector and how to increase asset service reliability. On today's agenda, we'll talk specifically around how to optimize your equipment maintenance, how to reduce costs, asset failure with data and analytics. We'll go into a little more depth on what type of data, the analytical methods that we're typically seeing used, the associated- Brooke will go over a case study as well as a reference architecture. So by basic definition, predictive maintenance is about determining when an asset should be maintained and what specific maintenance activities need to be performed either based upon an assets actual condition or state. It's also about predicting and preventing failures and performing maintenance on your time on your schedule to avoid costly unplanned downtime. McKenzie has looked at analyzing predictive maintenance costs across multiple industries and has identified that there's the opportunity to reduce overall predictive maintenance costs by roughly 50% with different types of analytical methods. So let's look at those three types of models. First, we've got our traditional type of method for maintenance, and that's really about uncorrective maintenance, and that's when we're performing maintenance on an asset after the equipment fails. The challenges with that is we end up with unplanned downtime. We end up with disruptions in our schedules, as well as reduce quality around the performance of the asset. And then we started looking at preventive maintenance and preventative maintenance is really when we're performing maintenance on a set schedule. The challenges with that is we're typically doing it regardless of the actual condition of the asset, which has resulted in unnecessary downtime and expense. And specifically we're really now focused on condition-based maintenance, which is looking at leveraging predictive maintenance techniques based upon actual conditions and real time events and processes. Within that, we've seen organizations and again, source from McKenzie, have a 50% reduction in downtime, as well as overall 40% reduction in maintenance costs. Again, this is really looking at things across multiple industries, but let's look at it in the context of the public sector and based upon some activity by the department of energy several years ago, they really looked at what does predictive maintenance mean to the public sector? What is the benefit of looking at increasing return on investment of assets, reducing, you know, reduction in downtime as well as overall maintenance costs. So corrective or reactive based maintenance is really about performing once there's been a failure and then the movement towards preventative, which is based upon a set schedule. We're looking at predictive where we're monitoring real-time conditions. And most importantly is now actually leveraging IOT and data and analytics to further reduce those overall down times. And there's a research report by the department of energy that goes into more specifics on the opportunity within the public sector. So Rick, let's talk a little bit about what are some of the challenges regarding data, regarding predictive maintenance? >> Some of the challenges include having data silos, historically our government organizations and organizations in the commercial space as well, have multiple data silos. They've spun up over time. There are multiple business units and note, there's no single view of assets. And oftentimes there's redundant information stored in these silos of information. Couple that with huge increases in data volume, data growing exponentially, along with new types of data that we can ingest there's social media, there's semi and unstructured data sources and the real time data that we can now collect from the internet of things. And so the challenge is to collect all these assets together and begin to extract intelligence from them and additional insights and and that in turn, then fuels machine learning and what we call artificial intelligence, which enables predictive maintenance. Next slide. >> Cindy: So let's look specifically at, you know, the types of use cases and I'm going to- Rick and I are going to focus on those use cases, where do we see predictive maintenance coming in to the procurement facility, supply chain, operations and logistics? We've got various level of maturity. So, you know, we're talking about predictive maintenance. We're also talking about using information, whether it be on a connected asset or a vehicle doing monitoring to also leveraging predictive maintenance on how do we bring about looking at data from connected warehouses facilities and buildings? I'll bring an opportunity to both increase the quality and effectiveness of the missions within the agencies to also looking at looking at cost efficiency, as well as looking at risk and safety. And the types of data, you know, that Rick mentioned around, you know, the new types of information. Some of those data elements that we typically have seen is looking at failure history. So when has an asset or a machine or a component within a machine failed in the past? We've also looking at bringing together a maintenance history, looking at a specific machine. Are we getting error codes off of a machine or assets looking at when we've replaced certain components to looking at how are we actually leveraging the assets? What were the operating conditions? Pulling up data from a sensor on that asset? Also looking at the features of an asset, whether it's, you know, engine size it's make and model, where's the asset located? To also looking at who's operated the asset, you know, whether it be their certifications, what's their experience, how are they leveraging the assets? And then also bringing in together some of the pattern analysis that we've seen. So what are the operating limits? Are we getting service reliability? Are we getting a product recall information from the actual manufacturer? So Rick, I know the data landscape has really changed. Let's, let's go over looking at some of those components. >> Rick: Sure. So this slide depicts sort of the, some of the inputs that inform a predictive maintenance program. So we've talked a little bit about the silos of information, the ERP system of record, perhaps the spares and the service history. So we want, what we want to do is combine that information with sensor data, whether it's a facility and equipment sensors, or temperature and humidity, for example. All this stuff is then combined together and then used to develop machine learning models that better inform predictive maintenance, because we do need to take into account the environmental factors that may cause additional wear and tear on the asset that we're monitoring. So here are some examples of private sector maintenance use cases that also have broad applicability across the government. For example, one of the busiest airports in Europe is running Cloudera on Azure to capture secure and correlate sensor data collected from equipment within the airport. The people moving equipment more specifically, the escalators, the elevators, and the baggage carousels. The objective here is to prevent breakdowns and improve airport efficiency and passenger safety. Another example is a container shipping port. In this case, we use IOT data and machine learning to help customers recognize how their cargo handling equipment is performing in different weather conditions to understand how usage relates to failure rates and to detect anomalies in transport systems. These all improve port efficiency. Another example is Navistar. Navistar is a leading manufacturer of commercial trucks, buses, and military vehicles. Typically vehicle maintenance, as Cindy mentioned, is based on miles traveled or based on a schedule or a time since the last service. But these are only two of the thousands of data points that can signal the need for maintenance. And as it turns out, unscheduled maintenance and vehicle breakdowns account for a large share of the total cost for vehicle owners. So to help fleet owners move from a reactive approach to a more predictive model, Navistar built an IOT enabled remote diagnostics platform called On Command. The platform brings in over 70 sensor data feeds for more than 375,000 connected vehicles. These include engine performance, trucks speed, acceleration, coolant temperature and break ware. This data is then correlated with other Navistar and third-party data sources, including weather, geolocation, vehicle usage, traffic, warranty, and parts inventory information. So the platform then uses machine learning and advanced analytics to automatically detect problems early and predict maintenance requirements. So how does the fleet operator use this information? They can monitor truck health and performance from smartphones or tablets and prioritize needed repairs. Also, they can identify that the nearest service location that has the relevant parts, the train technicians and the available service space. So sort of wrapping up the benefits. Navistar's helped fleet owners reduce maintenance costs by more than 30%. This same platform has also used to help school buses run safely and on time. For example, one school district with 110 buses that travel over a million miles annually reduce the number of tows needed year over year, thanks to predictive insights, delivered by this platform. So I'd like to take a moment and walk through the data life cycle as depicted in this diagram. So data ingest from the edge may include feeds from the factory floor or things like connected vehicles, whether they're trucks, aircraft, heavy equipment, cargo vessels, et cetera. Next, the data lands on a secure and governed data platform where it is combined with data from existing systems of record to provide additional insights. And this platform supports multiple analytic functions working together on the same data while maintaining strict security, governance and control measures. Once processed the data is used to train machine learning models, which are then deployed into production, monitored and retrained as needed to maintain accuracy. The process data is also typically placed in a data warehouse and use to support business intelligence analytics and dashboards. And in fact, this data life cycle is representative of one of our government customers doing condition-based maintenance across a variety of aircraft. And the benefits they've discovered include; less unscheduled maintenance and a reduction in mean man hours to repair, increased maintenance efficiencies, improved aircraft availability, and the ability to avoid cascading component failures, which typically costs more in repair cost and downtime. Also, they're able to better forecast the requirements for replacement parts and consumables and last, and certainly very importantly, this leads to enhanced safety. This chart overlays the secure open source Cloudera platform used in support of the data life cycle we've been discussing. Cloudera data flow, provides the data ingest, data movement and real time streaming data query capabilities. So data flow gives us the capability to bring data in from the asset of interest, from the internet of things. While the data platform provides a secure governed data lake and visibility across the full machine learning life cycle eliminates silos and streamlines workflows across teams. The platform includes a integrated suite of secure analytic applications. And two that we're specifically calling out here are Cloudera machine learning, which supports the collaborative data science and machine learning environment, which facilitates machine learning and AI and the Cloudera data warehouse, which supports the analytics and business intelligence, including those dashboards for leadership Cindy, over to you. >> Cindy: Rick, Thank you. And I hope that Rick and I provided you some insights on how predictive maintenance condition-based maintenance is being used and can be used within your respective agency, bringing together data sources that maybe you're having challenges with today, bringing that more real-time information in from a streaming perspective, blending that industrial IOT, as well as historical information together to help actually optimize maintenance and produce costs within each of your agencies. To learn a little bit more about Cloudera and our, what we're doing from a predictive maintenance, please visit us at Cloudera.com/Solutions/PublicSector And we look forward to scheduling a meeting with you. And on that, we appreciate your time today and thank you very much.

>>Hi, this is Cindy Mikey, vice president of industry solutions at caldera. Joining me today is chef is Molly, our solution engineer for the public sector. Today. We're going to talk about speed to insight. Why using machine learning in the public sector, specifically around fraud, waste and abuse. So topic for today, we'll discuss machine learning, why the public sector uses it to target fraud, waste, and abuse, the challenges. How do we enhance your data and analytical approaches the data landscape analytical methods and shad we'll go over reference architecture and a case study. So by definition, fraud, waste and abuse per the government accountability office is fraud. Isn't an attempt to obtain something about value through unwelcome misrepresentation waste is about squandering money or resources and abuse is about behaving improperly or unreasonably to actually obtain something of value for your personal benefit. So as we look at fraud, um, and across all industries, it's a top of mind, um, area within the public sector. >>Um, the types of fraud that we see is specifically around cyber crime, uh, looking at accounting fraud, whether it be from an individual perspective to also, uh, within organizations, looking at financial statement fraud, to also looking at bribery and corruption, as we look at fraud, it really hits us from all angles, whether it be from external perpetrators or internal perpetrators, and specifically from the research by PWC, the key focus area is we also see over half of fraud is actually through some form of internal or external, uh, perpetrators again, key topics. So as we also look at a report recently by the association of certified fraud examiners, um, within the public sector, the us government, um, in 2017, it was identified roughly $148 billion was attributable to fraud, waste and abuse. Specifically about 57 billion was focused on reported monetary losses and another 91 billion on areas where that opportunity or the monetary basis had not yet been measured. >>As we look at breaking those areas down again, we look at several different topics from permit out payment perspective. So breaking it down within the health system, over $65 billion within social services, over $51 billion to procurement fraud to also, um, uh, fraud, waste and abuse that's happening in the grants and the loan process to payroll fraud, and then other aspects, again, quite a few different topical areas. So as we look at those areas, what are the areas that we see additional type of focus, there's a broad stroke areas. What are the actual use cases that our agencies are using the data landscape? What data, what analytical methods can we use to actually help curtail and prevent some of the, uh, the fraud waste and abuse. So, as we look at some of the analytical processes and analytical use crate, uh, use cases in the public sector, whether it's from, uh, you know, the taxation areas to looking at, you know, social services, uh, to public safety, to also the, um, our, um, uh, additional agency methods, we're gonna use focused specifically on some of the use cases around, um, you know, fraud within the tax area. >>Uh, we'll briefly look at some of the aspects of, um, unemployment insurance fraud, uh, benefit fraud, as well as payment and integrity. So fraud has it it's, um, uh, underpinnings inquiry, like you different on government agencies and difficult, different analytical methods, and I usage of different data. So I think one of the key elements is, you know, you can look at your, your data landscape on specific data sources that you need, but it's really about bringing together different data sources across a different variety, a different velocity. So, uh, data has different dimensions. So we'll look at structured types of data of semi-structured data, behavioral data, as well as when we look at, um, you know, predictive models. We're typically looking at historical type information, but if we're actually trying to look at preventing fraud before it actually happens, or when a case may be in flight, which is specifically a use case that shad is going to talk about later is how do I look at more of that? >>Real-time that streaming information? How do I take advantage of data, whether it be, uh, you know, uh, financial transactions we're looking at, um, asset verification, we're looking at tax records, we're looking at corporate filings. Um, and we can also look at more, uh, advanced data sources where as we're looking at, um, investigation type information. So we're maybe going out and we're looking at, uh, deep learning type models around, uh, you know, semi or that, uh, behavioral, uh, that's unstructured data, whether it be camera analysis and so forth. So for quite a different variety of data and the, the breadth and the opportunity really comes about when you can integrate and look at data across all different data sources. So in a looking at a more extensive, uh, data landscape. So specifically I want to focus on some of the methods, some of the data sources and some of the analytical techniques that we're seeing, uh, being used, um, in the government agencies, as well as opportunities, uh, to look at new methods. >>So as we're looking at, you know, from a, um, an audit planning or looking at, uh, the opportunity for the likelihood of non-compliance, um, specifically we'll see data sources where we're maybe looking at a constituents profile, we might actually be investigating the forms that they've provided. We might be comparing that data, um, or leveraging internal data sources, possibly looking at net worth, comparing it against other financial data, and also comparison across other constituents groups. Some of the techniques that we use are some of the basic natural language processing, maybe we're going to do some text mining. We might be doing some probabilistic modeling, uh, where we're actually looking at, um, information within the agency to also comparing that against possibly tax forms. A lot of times it's information historically has been done on a batch perspective, both structured and semi-structured type information. And typically the data volumes can be low, but we're also seeing those data volumes on increase exponentially based upon the types of events that we're dealing with, the number of transactions. >>Um, so getting the throughput, um, and chef's going to specifically talk about that in a moment. The other aspect is, as we look at other areas of opportunity is when we're building upon, how do I actually do compliance? How do I actually look at conducting audits, uh, or potential fraud to also looking at areas of under-reported tax information? So there you might be pulling in some of our other types of data sources, whether it's being property records, it could be data that's being supplied by the actual constituents or by vendors to also pulling in social media information to geographical information, to leveraging photos on techniques that we're seeing used is possibly some sentiment analysis, link analysis. Um, how do we actually blend those data sources together from a natural language processing? But I think what's important here is also the method and the looking at the data velocity, whether it be batch, whether it be near real time, again, looking at all types of data, whether it's structured semi-structured or unstructured and the key and the value behind this is, um, how do we actually look at increasing the potential revenue or the, um, under reported revenue? >>Uh, how do we actually look at stopping fraudulent payments before they actually occur? Um, also looking at increasing the amount of, uh, the level of compliance, um, and also looking at the potential of prosecution of fraud cases. And additionally, other areas of opportunity could be looking at, um, economic planning. How do we actually perform some link analysis? How do we bring some more of those things that we saw in the data landscape on customer, or, you know, constituent interaction, bringing in social media, bringing in, uh, potentially police records, property records, um, other tax department, database information. Um, and then also looking at comparing one individual to other individuals, looking at people like a specific, like a constituent, are there areas where we're seeing, uh, >>Um, other >>Aspects of, of fraud potentially being occurring. Um, and also as we move forward, some of the more advanced techniques that we're seeing around deep learning is looking at computer vision, um, leveraging geospatial information, looking at social network entity analysis, uh, also looking at, uh, agent-based modeling techniques, where we're looking at simulation Monte Carlo type techniques that we typically see in the financial services industry, actually applying that to fraud, waste, and abuse within the, uh, the public sector. Um, and again, that really, uh, lends itself to a new opportunities. And on that, I'm going to turn it over to chef to talk about, uh, the reference architecture for, uh, doing these buckets. >>Thanks, Cindy. Um, so I'm gonna walk you through an example, reference architecture for fraud detection using, uh, Cloudera's underlying technology. Um, and you know, before I get into the technical details, uh, I want to talk about how this would be implemented at a much higher level. So with fraud detection, what we're trying to do is identify anomalies or novelists behavior within our datasets. Um, now in order to understand what aspects of our incoming data represents anomalous behavior, we first need to understand what normal behavior is. So in essence, once we understand normal behavior, anything that deviates from it can be thought of as an anomaly, right? So in order to understand what normal behavior is, we're going to need to be able to collect store and process a very large amount of historical data. And so incomes, clutters platform, and this reference architecture that needs to be for you. >>So, uh, let's start on the left-hand side of this reference architecture with the collect phase. So fraud detection will always begin with data collection. We need to collect large amounts of information from systems that could be in the cloud. It could be in the data center or even on edge devices, and this data needs to be collected so we can create our normal behavior profiles. And these normal behavioral profiles would then in turn, be used to create our predictive models for fraudulent activity. Now, uh, thinking, uh, to the data collection side, one of the main challenges that many organizations face, uh, in this phase, uh, involves using a single technology that can handle, uh, data that's coming in all different types of formats and protocols and standards with different velocities and velocities. Um, let me give you an example. Uh, we could be collecting data from a database that gets updated daily, uh, and maybe that data is being collected in Agra format. >>At the same time, we can be collecting data from an edge device that's streaming in every second, and that data may be coming in Jason or a binary format, right? So this is a data collection challenge that can be solved with cluttered data flow, which is a suite of technologies built on a patch NIFA in mini five, allowing us to ingest all of this data, do a drag and drop interface. So now we're collecting all of this data, that's required to map out normal behavior. The next thing that we need to do is enrich it, transform it and distribute it to, uh, you know, downstream systems for further process. Uh, so let's, let's walk through how that would work first. Let's taking Richmond for, uh, for enrichment, think of adding additional information to your incoming data, right? Let's take, uh, financial transactions, for example, uh, because Cindy mentioned it earlier, right? >>You can store known locations of an individual in an operational database, uh, with Cloudera that would be HBase. And as an individual makes a new transaction, their geolocation that's in that transaction data can be enriched with previously known locations of that very same individual. And all of that enriched data can be later used downstream for predictive analysis, predictable. So the data has been enrich. Uh, now it needs to be transformed. We want the data that's coming in, uh, you know, Avro and Jason and binary and whatever other format to be transformed into a single common format. So it can be used downstream for stream processing. Uh, again, this is going to be done through clutter and data flow, which is backed by NIFA, right? So the transformed semantic data is then going to be stricted to Kafka and coffin. It's going to serve as that central repository of syndicated services or a buffer zone, right? >>So coffee is going to pretty much provide you with, uh, extremely fast resilient and fault tolerance storage. And it's also gonna give you the consumer APIs that you need that are going to enable a wide variety of applications to leverage that enriched and transformed data within your buffer zone, uh, allowed that, you know, 17. So you can store that data in a distributed file system, give you that historical context that you're going to need later on for machine learning, right? So the next step in the architecture is to leverage a cluttered SQL stream builder, which enables us to write, uh, streaming SQL jobs on top of Apache Flink. So we can, uh, filter, analyze and, uh, understand the data that's in the Kafka buffer in real time. Uh I'll you know, I'll also add like, you know, if you have time series data, or if you need a lab type of cubing, you can leverage kudu, uh, while EDA or, you know, exploratory data analysis and visualization, uh, can all be enabled through clever visualization technology. >>All right, so we've filtered, we've analyzed and we've explored our incoming data. We can now proceed to train our machine learning models, uh, which will detect anomalous behavior in our historically collected data set, uh, to do this, we can use a combination of supervised unsupervised, uh, even deep learning techniques with neural networks. And these models can be tested on new incoming streaming data. And once we've gone ahead and obtain the accuracy of the performance, the scores that we want, we can then take these models and deploy them into production. And once the models are productionalized or operationalized, they can be leveraged within our streaming pipeline. So as new data is ingested in real-time knife, I can query these models to detect if the activity is anomalous or fraudulent. And if it is, they can alert downstream users and systems, right? So this in essence is how fraudulent activity detection works. >>Uh, and this entire pipeline is powered by clutters technology, right? And so, uh, the IRS is one of, uh, clutter's customers. That's leveraging our platform today and implementing, uh, a very similar architecture, uh, to detect fraud, waste, and abuse across a very large set of historical facts, data. Um, and one of the neat things with the IRS is that they've actually recently leveraged the partnership between Cloudera and Nvidia to accelerate their spark based analytics and their machine learning, uh, and the results have been nothing short of amazing, right? And in fact, we have a quote here from Joe and salty who's, uh, you know, the technical branch chief for the research analytics and statistics division group within the IRS with zero changes to our fraud detection workflow, we're able to obtain eight times to performance simply by adding GPS to our mainstream big data servers. This improvement translates to half the cost of ownership for the same workloads, right? So embedding GPU's into the reference architecture I covered earlier has enabled the IRS to improve their time to insights by as much as eight X while simultaneously reducing their underlying infrastructure costs by half, uh, Cindy back to you >>Chef. Thank you. Um, and I hope that you found, uh, some of the, the analysis, the information that Sheva and I have provided, um, to give you some insights on how cloud era is actually helping, uh, with the fraud waste and abuse challenges within the, uh, the public sector, um, specifically looking at any and all types of data, how the clutter platform is bringing together and analyzing information, whether it be you're structured you're semi-structured to unstructured data, both in a fast or in a real-time perspective, looking at anomalies, being able to do some of those on detection, uh, looking at neural network analysis, time series information. So next steps we'd love to have additional conversation with you. You can also find on some additional information around, I have caught areas working in the, the federal government by going to cloudera.com solutions slash public sector. And we welcome scheduling a meeting with you again, thank you for joining us Sheva and I today. We greatly appreciate your time and look forward to future progress. >>Good day, everyone. Thank you for joining me. I'm Sydney. Mike joined by Rick Taylor of Cloudera. Uh, we're here to talk about predictive maintenance for the public sector and how to increase assets, service, reliability on today's agenda. We'll talk specifically around how to optimize your equipment maintenance, how to reduce costs, asset failure with data and analytics. We'll go into a little more depth on, um, what type of data, the analytical methods that we're typically seeing used, um, the associated, uh, Brooke, we'll go over a case study as well as a reference architecture. So by basic definition, uh, predictive maintenance is about determining when an asset should be maintained and what specific maintenance activities need to be performed either based upon an assets of actual condition or state. It's also about predicting and preventing failures and performing maintenance on your time on your schedule to avoid costly unplanned downtime. >>McKinsey has looked at analyzing predictive maintenance costs across multiple industries and has identified that there's the opportunity to reduce overall predictive maintenance costs by roughly 50% with different types of analytical methods. So let's look at those three types of models. First, we've got our traditional type of method for maintenance, and that's really about our corrective maintenance, and that's when we're performing maintenance on an asset, um, after the equipment fails. But the challenges with that is we end up with unplanned. We end up with disruptions in our schedules, um, as well as reduced quality, um, around the performance of the asset. And then we started looking at preventive maintenance and preventative maintenance is really when we're performing maintenance on a set schedule. Um, the challenges with that is we're typically doing it regardless of the actual condition of the asset, um, which has resulted in unnecessary downtime and expense. Um, and specifically we're really now focused on pre uh, condition-based maintenance, which is looking at leveraging predictive maintenance techniques based upon actual conditions and real time events and processes. Um, within that we've seen organizations, um, and again, source from McKenzie have a 50% reduction in downtime, as well as an overall 40% reduction in maintenance costs. Again, this is really looking at things across multiple industries, but let's look at it in the context of the public sector and based upon some activity by the department of energy, um, several years ago, >>Um, they've really >>Looked at what does predictive maintenance mean to the public sector? What is the benefit, uh, looking at increasing return on investment of assets, reducing, uh, you know, reduction in downtime, um, as well as overall maintenance costs. So corrective or reactive based maintenance is really about performing once there's been a failure. Um, and then the movement towards, uh, preventative, which is based upon a set schedule or looking at predictive where we're monitoring real-time conditions. Um, and most importantly is now actually leveraging IOT and data and analytics to further reduce those overall downtimes. And there's a research report by the, uh, department of energy that goes into more specifics, um, on the opportunity within the public sector. So, Rick, let's talk a little bit about what are some of the challenges, uh, regarding data, uh, regarding predictive maintenance. >>Some of the challenges include having data silos, historically our government organizations and organizations in the commercial space as well, have multiple data silos. They've spun up over time. There are multiple business units and note, there's no single view of assets. And oftentimes there's redundant information stored in, in these silos of information. Uh, couple that with huge increases in data volume data growing exponentially, along with new types of data that we can ingest there's social media, there's semi and unstructured data sources and the real time data that we can now collect from the internet of things. And so the challenge is to collect all these assets together and begin to extract intelligence from them and insights and, and that in turn then fuels, uh, machine learning and, um, and, and what we call artificial intelligence, which enables predictive maintenance. Next slide. So >>Let's look specifically at, you know, the, the types of use cases and I'm going to Rick and I are going to focus on those use cases, where do we see predictive maintenance coming into the procurement facility, supply chain, operations and logistics. Um, we've got various level of maturity. So, you know, we're talking about predictive maintenance. We're also talking about, uh, using, uh, information, whether it be on a, um, a connected asset or a vehicle doing monitoring, uh, to also leveraging predictive maintenance on how do we bring about, uh, looking at data from connected warehouses facilities and buildings all bring on an opportunity to both increase the quality and effectiveness of the missions within the agencies to also looking at re uh, looking at cost efficiency, as well as looking at risk and safety and the types of data, um, you know, that Rick mentioned around, you know, the new types of information, some of those data elements that we typically have seen is looking at failure history. >>So when has that an asset or a machine or a component within a machine failed in the past? Uh, we've also looking at bringing together a maintenance history, looking at a specific machine. Are we getting error codes off of a machine or assets, uh, looking at when we've replaced certain components to looking at, um, how are we actually leveraging the assets? What were the operating conditions, uh, um, pulling off data from a sensor on that asset? Um, also looking at the, um, the features of an asset, whether it's, you know, engine size it's make and model, um, where's the asset located on to also looking at who's operated the asset, uh, you know, whether it be their certifications, what's their experience, um, how are they leveraging the assets and then also bringing in together, um, some of the, the pattern analysis that we've seen. So what are the operating limits? Um, are we getting service reliability? Are we getting a product recall information from the actual manufacturer? So, Rick, I know the data landscape has really changed. Let's, let's go over looking at some of those components. Sure. >>So this slide depicts sort of the, some of the inputs that inform a predictive maintenance program. So, as we've talked a little bit about the silos of information, the ERP system of record, perhaps the spares and the service history. So we want, what we want to do is combine that information with sensor data, whether it's a facility and equipment sensors, um, uh, or temperature and humidity, for example, all this stuff is then combined together, uh, and then use to develop machine learning models that better inform, uh, predictive maintenance, because we'll do need to keep, uh, to take into account the environmental factors that may cause additional wear and tear on the asset that we're monitoring. So here's some examples of private sector, uh, maintenance use cases that also have broad applicability across the government. For example, one of the busiest airports in Europe is running cloud era on Azure to capture secure and correlate sensor data collected from equipment within the airport, the people moving equipment more specifically, the escalators, the elevators, and the baggage carousels. >>The objective here is to prevent breakdowns and improve airport efficiency and passenger safety. Another example is a container shipping port. In this case, we use IOT data and machine learning, help customers recognize how their cargo handling equipment is performing in different weather conditions to understand how usage relates to failure rates and to detect anomalies and transport systems. These all improve for another example is Navistar Navistar, leading manufacturer of commercial trucks, buses, and military vehicles. Typically vehicle maintenance, as Cindy mentioned, is based on miles traveled or based on a schedule or a time since the last service. But these are only two of the thousands of data points that can signal the need for maintenance. And as it turns out, unscheduled maintenance and vehicle breakdowns account for a large share of the total cost for vehicle owner. So to help fleet owners move from a reactive approach to a more predictive model, Navistar built an IOT enabled remote diagnostics platform called on command. >>The platform brings in over 70 sensor data feeds for more than 375,000 connected vehicles. These include engine performance, trucks, speed, acceleration, cooling temperature, and break where this data is then correlated with other Navistar and third-party data sources, including weather geo location, vehicle usage, traffic warranty, and parts inventory information. So the platform then uses machine learning and advanced analytics to automatically detect problems early and predict maintenance requirements. So how does the fleet operator use this information? They can monitor truck health and performance from smartphones or tablets and prioritize needed repairs. Also, they can identify that the nearest service location that has the relevant parts, the train technicians and the available service space. So sort of wrapping up the, the benefits Navistar's helped fleet owners reduce maintenance by more than 30%. The same platform is also used to help school buses run safely. And on time, for example, one school district with 110 buses that travel over a million miles annually reduce the number of PTOs needed year over year, thanks to predictive insights delivered by this platform. >>So I'd like to take a moment and walk through the data. Life cycle is depicted in this diagram. So data ingest from the edge may include feeds from the factory floor or things like connected vehicles, whether they're trucks, aircraft, heavy equipment, cargo vessels, et cetera. Next, the data lands on a secure and governed data platform. Whereas combined with data from existing systems of record to provide additional insights, and this platform supports multiple analytic functions working together on the same data while maintaining strict security governance and control measures once processed the data is used to train machine learning models, which are then deployed into production, monitored, and retrained as needed to maintain accuracy. The process data is also typically placed in a data warehouse and use to support business intelligence, analytics, and dashboards. And in fact, this data lifecycle is representative of one of our government customers doing condition-based maintenance across a variety of aircraft. >>And the benefits they've discovered include less unscheduled maintenance and a reduction in mean man hours to repair increased maintenance efficiencies, improved aircraft availability, and the ability to avoid cascading component failures, which typically cost more in repair cost and downtime. Also, they're able to better forecast the requirements for replacement parts and consumables and last, and certainly very importantly, this leads to enhanced safety. This chart overlays the secure open source Cloudera platform used in support of the data life cycle. We've been discussing Cloudera data flow, the data ingest data movement and real time streaming data query capabilities. So data flow gives us the capability to bring data in from the asset of interest from the internet of things. While the data platform provides a secure governed data lake and visibility across the full machine learning life cycle eliminates silos and streamlines workflows across teams. The platform includes an integrated suite of secure analytic applications. And two that we're specifically calling out here are Cloudera machine learning, which supports the collaborative data science and machine learning environment, which facilitates machine learning and AI and the cloud era data warehouse, which supports the analytics and business intelligence, including those dashboards for leadership Cindy, over to you, Rick, >>Thank you. And I hope that, uh, Rick and I provided you some insights on how predictive maintenance condition-based maintenance is being used and can be used within your respective agency, bringing together, um, data sources that maybe you're having challenges with today. Uh, bringing that, uh, more real-time information in from a streaming perspective, blending that industrial IOT, as well as historical information together to help actually, uh, optimize maintenance and reduce costs within the, uh, each of your agencies, uh, to learn a little bit more about Cloudera, um, and our, what we're doing from a predictive maintenance please, uh, business@cloudera.com solutions slash public sector. And we look forward to scheduling a meeting with you, and on that, we appreciate your time today and thank you very much.

(upbeat music) >> Hey, welcome to this Cube conversation with NetScout. I'm Lisa Martin. Excited to talk to you. Richard Hummel, the manager of threat research for Arbor Networks, the security division of NetScout. Richard, welcome to theCube. >> Thanks for having me, Lisa, it's a pleasure to be here. >> We're going to unpack the sixth NetScout Threat Intelligence Report, which is going to be very interesting. But something I wanted to start with is we know that and yes, you're going to tell us, COVID and the pandemic has had a massive impact on DDoS attacks, ransomware. But before we dig into the report, I'd like to just kind of get some stories from you as we saw last year about this time rapid pivot to work from home, rapid pivot to distance learning. Talk to us about some of the attacks that you saw in particular that literally hit close to home. >> Sure and there's one really good prime example that comes to mind because it impacted a lot of people. There was a lot of media sensation around this but if you go and look, just Google it, Miami Dade County and DDoS, you'll see the first articles that pop up is the entire district school network going down because the students did not want to go to school and launched a DDoS attack. There was something upwards of 190,000 individuals that could no longer connect to the school's platform, whether that's a teacher, a student or parents. And so it had a very significant impact. And when you think about this in terms of the digital world, that impacted very severely, a large number of people and you can't really translate that to what would happen in a physical environment because it just doesn't compute. There's two totally different scenarios to talk about here. >> Amazing that a child can decide, "I don't want to go to school today." And as a result of a pandemic take that out for nearly 200,000 folks. So let's dig into, I said this is the sixth NetScout Threat Intelligence Report. One of the global trends and themes that is seen as evidence in what happened last year is up and to the right. Oftentimes when we're talking about technology, you know, with analyst reports up and to the right is a good thing. Not so in this case. We saw huge increases in threat vectors, more vectors weaponized per attack sophistication, expansion of threats and IOT devices. Walk us through the overall key findings from 2020 that this report discovered. >> Absolutely. And if yo glance at your screen there you'll see the key findings here where we talk about record breaking numbers. And just in 2020, we saw over 10 million attacks, which, I mean, this is a 20% increase over 2019. And what's significant about that number is COVID had a huge impact. In fact, if we go all the way back to the beginning, right around mid March, that's when the pandemic was announced, attacks skyrocketed and they didn't stop. They just kept going up and to the right. And that is true through 2021. So far in the first quarter, typically January, February is the down month that we observe in DDoS attacks. Whether this is, you know, kids going back to school from Christmas break, you have their Christmas routines and e-commerce is slowing down. January, February is typically a slow month. That was not true in 2021. In fact, we hit record numbers on a month by month in both January and February. And so not only do we see 2.9 million attacks in the first quarter of 2021, which, I mean, let's do the math here, right? We've got four quarters, you know, we're on track to hit 12 million attacks potentially, if not more. And then you have this normal where we said 800,000 approximately month over month since the pandemic started, we started 2021 at 950,000 plus. That's up and to the right and it's not slowing down. >> It's not slowing down. It's a trend that it shows, you know, significant impact across every industry. And we're going to talk about that but what are some of the new threat vectors that you saw weaponized in the last year? I mean, you talked about the example of the Miami-Dade school district but what were some of those new vectors that were really weaponized and used to help this up and to the right trend? >> So there's four in particular that we were tracking in 2020 and these nets aren't necessarily new vectors. Typically what happens when an adversary starts using this is there's a proof of concept code out there. In fact, a good example of this would be the RDP over UDP. So, I mean, we're all remotely connected, right? We're doing this over a Zoom call. If I want to connect to my organization I'm going to use some sort of remote capability whether that's a VPN or tunneling in, whatever it might be, right? And so remote desktop is something that everybody's using. And we saw actors start to kind of play around with this in mid 2020. And in right around September, November timeframe we saw a sudden spike. And typically when we see spikes in this kind of activity it's because adversaries are taking proof of concept code, that maybe has been around for a period of time, and they're incorporating those into DDoS for hire services. And so any person that wants to launch a DDoS attack can go into underground forums in marketplaces and they can purchase, maybe it's $10 in Bitcoin, and they can purchase an attack. That leverage is a bunch of different DDoS vectors. And so adversaries have no reason to remove a vector as new ones get discovered. They only have the motivation to add more, right? Because somebody comes into their platform and says, "I want to launch an attack that's going to take out my opponent." It's probably going to look a lot better if there's a lot of attack options in there where I can just go through and start clicking buttons left and right. And so all of a sudden now I've got this complex multi-vector attack that I don't have to pay anything extra for. Adversary already did all the work for me and now I can launch an attack. And so we saw four different vectors that were weaponized in 2020. One of those are notably the Jenkins that you see listed on the screen in the key findings. That one isn't necessarily a DDoS vector. It started out as one, it does amplify, but what happens is Jenkins servers are very vulnerable and when you actually initiate this attack, it tips over the Jenkins server. So it kind of operates as like a DoS event versus DDoS but it still has the same effect of availability, it takes a server offline. And then now just in the first part of 2021 we're tracking multiple other vectors that are starting to be weaponized. And when we see this, we go from a few, you know, incidents or alerts to thousands month over month. And so we're seeing even more vectors added and that's only going to continue to go up into the right. You know that theme that we talked about at the beginning here. >> As more vectors get added, and what did you see last year in terms of industries that may have been more vulnerable? As we talked about the work from home, everyone was dependent, really here we are on Zoom, dependent on Zoom, dependent on Netflix. Streaming media was kind of a lifeline for a lot of us but it also was healthcare and education. Did you see any verticals in particular that really started to see an increase in the exploitation and in the risk? >> Yeah, so let's start, let's separate this into two parts. The last part of the key findings that we had was talking about a group we, or a campaign we call Lazarus Borough Model. So this is a global DDoS extortion campaign. We're going to cover that a little bit more when we talk about kind of extorted events and how that operates but these guys, they started where the money is. And so when they first started targeting industries and this kind of coincides with COVID, so it started several months after the pandemic was announced, they started targeting a financial organizations, commercial banking. They went after stock exchange. Many of you would hear about the New Zealand Stock Exchange that went offline. That's this LBA campaign and these guys taking it off. So they started where the money is. They moved to a financial agation targeting insurance companies. They targeted currency exchange places. And then slowly from there, they started to expand. And in so much as our Arbor Cloud folks actually saw them targeting organizations that are part of vaccine development. And so these guys, they don't care who they hurt. They don't care who they're going after. They're going out there for a payday. And so that's one aspect of the industry targeting that we've seen. The other aspect is you'll see, on the next slide here, we actually saw a bunch of different verticals that we really haven't seen in the top 10 before. In fact, if you actually look at this you'll see the number one, two and three are pretty common for us. We almost always are going to see these kinds of telecommunications, wireless, satellite, broadband, these are always going to be in the top. And the reason for that is because gamers and DDoS attacks associated with gaming is kind of the predominant thing that we see in this landscape. And let's face it, gamers are on broadband operating systems. If you're in Asian communities, often they'll use mobile hotspots. So now you start to have wireless come in there. And so that makes sense seeing them. But what doesn't make sense is this internet publishing and broadcasting and you might say, "Well, what is that?" Well, that's things like Zoom and WebEx and Netflix and these other streaming services. And so we're seeing adversaries going after that because those have become critical to people's way of life. Their entertainment, what they're using to communicate for work and school. So they realized if we can go after this it's going to disrupt something and hopefully we can get some recognition. Maybe we can show this as a demonstration to get more customers on our platform or maybe we can get a payday. In a lot of the DDoS attacks that we see, in fact most of them, are all monetary focused. And so they're looking for a payday. They're going to go after something that's going to likely, you know, send out that payment. And then just walk down the line. You can see COVID through this whole thing. Electronic shopping is number five, right? Everybody turned to e-commerce because we're not going to in-person stores anymore. Electronic computer manufacturing, how many more people have to get computers at home now because they're no longer in a corporate environment? And so you can see how the pandemic has really influenced this industry target. >> Significant influencer and I also wonder too, you know, Zoom became a household name for every generation. You know, we're talking to five generations and maybe the generations that aren't as familiar with computer technology might be even more exploitable because it's easy to click on a phishing email when they don't understand how to look for the link. Let's now unpack the different types of DDoS attacks and what is on the rise. You talked about in the report the triple threat and we often think of that in entertainment. That's a good thing, but again, not here. Explain that triple threat. >> Yeah, so what we're seeing here is we have adversaries out there that are looking to take advantage of every possible angle to be able to get that payment. And everybody knows ransomware is a household name at this point, right? And so ransomware and DDoS have a lot in common because they both attack the availability of network resources, where computers or devices or whatever they might be. And so there's a lot of parallels to draw between the two of these. Now ransomware is a denial of service event, right? You're not going to have tens of thousands of computers hitting a single computer to take it down. You're going to have one exploitation of events. Somebody clicked on a link, there was a brute force attempt that managed to compromise a little boxes, credentials, whatever it might be, ransomware gets put on a system, it encrypts all your files. Well, all of a sudden, you've got this ransom note that says "If you want your files decrypted you're going to send us this amount of human Bitcoin." Well, what adversaries are doing now is they're capitalizing on the access that they already gained. So they already have access to the computer. Well, why not steal all the data first then let's encrypt whatever's there. And so now I can ask for a ransom payment to decrypt the files and I can ask for an extortion to prevent me from posting your data publicly. Maybe there's sensitive corporate information there. Maybe you're a local school system and you have all of your students' data on there. You're a hospital that has sensitive PI on it, whatever it might be, right? So now they're going to extort you to prevent them from posting that publicly. Well, why not add DDoS to this entire picture? Now you're already encrypted, we've already got your files, and I'm going to DDoS your system so you can't even access them if you wanted to. And I'm going to tell you, you have to pay me in order to stop this DDoS attack. And so this is that triple threat and we're seeing multiple different ransomware families. In fact, if you look at one of the slides here, you'll see that there's SunCrypt, there's Ragnar Cryptor, and then Maze did this initially back in September and then more recently, even the DarkSide stuff. I mean, who hasn't heard about DarkSide now with the Colonial Pipeline event, right? So they came out and said, "Hey we didn't intend for this collateral damage but it happened." Well, April 24th, they actually started offering DDoS as part of their tool kits. And so you can see how this has evolved over time. And adversaries are learning from each other and are incorporating this kind of methodology. And here we have triple extortion event. >> It almost seems like triple extortion event as a service with the opportunities, the number of vectors there. And you're right, everyone has heard of the Colonial Pipeline and that's where things like ransomware become a household term, just as much as Zoom and video conferencing and streaming media. Let's talk now about the effects that the threat report saw and uncovered region by region. Were there any regions in particular that were, that really stood out as most impacted? >> So not particularly. So one of the phenomena that we actually saw in the threat report, which, you know, we probably could have talked about it before now but it makes sense to talk about it regionally because we didn't see any one particular region, one particular vertical, a specific organization, specific country, none was more heavily targeted than another. In fact what we saw is organizations that we've never seen targeted before. We've seen industries that have never been targeted before all of a sudden are now getting DDoS attacks because we went from a local on-prem, I don't need to be connected to the internet, I don't need to have my employees remote access. And now all of a sudden you're dependent on the internet which is really, let's face it, that's critical infrastructure these days. And so now you have all of these additional people with a footprint connected to the internet then adversary can figure out and they can poke at it. And so what we saw here is just overall, all industries, all regions saw these upticks. The exception would be in China. We actually, in the Asia Pacific region specifically, but predominantly in China. But that often has to do with visibility rather than a decrease in attacks because they have their own kind of infrastructure in China. Brazil's the same way. They have their own kind of ecosystems. And so often you don't see what happens a lot outside the borders. And so from our perspective, we might see a decrease in attacks but, for all we know, they actually saw an increase in the attacks that is internal to their country against their country. And so across the board, just increases everywhere you look. >> Wow. So let's talk about what organizations can do in light of this. As we are here, we are still doing this program by video conferencing and things are opening up a little bit more, at least in the states anyway, and we're talking about more businesses going back to some degree but there's going to still be some mix, some hybrid of working from home and maybe even distance learning. So what can enterprises do to prepare for this when it happens? Because it sounds to me like with the sophistication, the up and to the right, it's not, if we get attacked, it's when. >> It's when, exactly. And that's just it. I mean, it's no longer something that you can put off. You can't just assume that I've never been DDoS attacked, I'm never going to be DDoS attacked anymore. You really need to consider this as part of your core security platform. I like to talk about defense in depth or a layer defense approach where you want to have a layered approach. So, you know, maybe they target your first layer and they don't get through. Or they do get through and now your second layer has to stop it. Well, if you have no layers or if you have one layer, it's not that hard for an adversary to figure out a way around that. And so preparation is key. Making sure that you have something in place and I'm going to give you an operational example here. One of the things we saw with the LBA campaigns is they actually started doing network of conasense for their targets. And what they would do is they would take the IP addresses belonging to your organization. They would look up the domains associated with that and they would figure out like, "Hey, this is bpn.organization.com or VPN two." And all of a sudden they've found your VPN concentrator and so that's where they're going to focus their attack. So something as simple as changing the way that you name your VPN concentrators might be sufficient to prevent them from hitting that weak link or right sizing the DDoS protection services for your company. Did you need something as big as like OnPrem Solutions? We need hardware. Do you instead want to do a managed service? Or do you want to go and talk to a cloud provider because there's right solutions and right sizes for all types of organizations. And the key here is preparation. In fact, all of the customers that we've worked with for the LBA extortion campaigns, if they were properly prepared they experienced almost no downtime or impact to their business. It's the people like the New Zealand Stock Exchange or their service provider that wasn't prepared to handle the attacks that were sent out them that were crippled. And so preparation is key. The other part is awareness. And that's part of what we do with this threat report because we want to make sure you're aware what adversaries are doing, when new attack vectors are coming out, how they're leveraging these, what industries they're targeting because that's really going to help you to figure out what your posture is, what your risk acceptance is for your organization. And in fact, there's a couple of resources that that we have here on the next slide. And you can go to both both of these. One of them is the threat report. You can view all of the details. And we only scratched the surface here in this Cube interview. So definitely recommend going there but the other one is called Horizon And netscout.com/horizon is a free resource you can register but you can actually see near real-time attacks based on industry and based on region. So if your organization out there and you're figuring, "Well I'm never attacked." Well go look up your industry. Go look up the country where you belong and see is there actually attacks against us? And I think you'll be quite surprised that there's quite a few attacks against you. And so definitely recommend checking these out >> Great resources netscout.com/horizon, netscout.com/threatreport. I do want to ask you one final question. That's in terms of timing. We saw the massive acceleration in digital transformation last year. We've already talked about this a number of times on this program. The dependence that businesses and consumers, like globally in every industry, in every country, have on streaming on communications right now. In terms of timing, though, for an organization to go from being aware to understanding what adversaries are doing, to being prepared, how quickly can an organization get up to speed and help themselves start reducing their risks? >> So I think that with DDoS, as opposed to things like ransomware, the ramp up time for that is much, much faster. There is a finite period of time with DDoS attacks that is actually going to impact you. And so maybe you're a smaller organization and you get DDoS attacked. There's a, probably a pretty high chance that that DDoS attack isn't going to last for multiple days. So maybe it's like an hour, maybe it's two hours, and then you recover. Your network resources are available again. That's not the same for something like ransomware. You get hit with ransomware, unless you pay or you have backups, you have to do the rigorous process of getting all your stuff back online. DDoS is more about as soon as the attack stops, the saturation goes away and you can start to get back online again. So it might not be as like immediate critical that you have to have something but there's also solutions, like a cloud solution, where it's as simple as signing up for the service and having your traffic redirected to their scrubbing center, their detection center. And then you may not have to do anything on-prem yourself, right? It's a matter of going out to an organization, finding a good contract, and then signing up, signing on the dotted line. And so I think that the ramp up time for mitigation services and DDoS protection can be a lot faster than many other security platforms and solutions. >> That's good to know cause with the up and to the right trend that you already said, the first quarter is usually slow. It's obviously not that way as what you've seen in 2021. And we can only expect what way, when we talk to you next year, that the up and to the right trend may continue. So hopefully organizations take advantage of these resources, Richard, that you talked about to be prepared to mediate and protect their you know, their customers, their employees, et cetera. Richard, we thank you for stopping by theCube. Talking to us about the sixth NetScout Threat Intelligence Report. Really interesting information. >> Absolutely; definitely a pleasure to have me here. Lisa, anytime you guys want to do it again, you know where I live? >> Yes. It's one of my favorite topics that you got and I got to point out the last thing, your Guardians of the Galaxy background, one of my favorite movies and it should be noted that on the NetScout website they are considered the Guardians of the Connected World. I just thought that connection was, as Richard told me before we went live, not planned, but I thought that was a great coincidence. Again, Richard, it's been a pleasure talking to you. Thank you for your time. >> Thank you so much. >> Richard Hummel, I'm Lisa Martin. You're watching this Cube conversation. (relaxing music)

(upbeat music) >> Hey, welcome to this Cube conversation with NetScout. I'm Lisa Martin. Excited to talk to you. Richard Hummel, the manager of threat research for Arbor Networks, the security division of NetScout. Richard, welcome to theCube. >> Thanks for having me, Lisa, it's a pleasure to be here. >> We're going to unpack the sixth NetScout Threat Intelligence Report, which is going to be very interesting. But something I wanted to start with is we know that and yes, you're going to tell us, COVID and the pandemic has had a massive impact on DDoS attacks, ransomware. But before we dig into the report, I'd like to just kind of get some stories from you as we saw last year about this time rapid pivot to work from home, rapid pivot to distance learning. Talk to us about some of the attacks that you saw in particular that literally hit close to home. >> Sure and there's one really good prime example that comes to mind because it impacted a lot of people. There was a lot of media sensation around this but if you go and look, just Google it, Miami Dade County and DDoS, you'll see the first articles that pop up is the entire district school network going down because the students did not want to go to school and launched a DDoS attack. There was something upwards of 190,000 individuals that could no longer connect to the school's platform, whether that's a teacher, a student or parents. And so it had a very significant impact. And when you think about this in terms of the digital world, that impacted very severely, a large number of people and you can't really translate that to what would happen in a physical environment because it just doesn't compute. There's two totally different scenarios to talk about here. >> Amazing that a child can decide, "I don't want to go to school today." And as a result of a pandemic take that out for nearly 200,000 folks. So let's dig into, I said this is the sixth NetScout Threat Intelligence Report. One of the global trends and themes that is seen as evidence in what happened last year is up and to the right. Oftentimes when we're talking about technology, you know, with analyst reports up and to the right is a good thing. Not so in this case. We saw huge increases in threat vectors, more vectors weaponized per attack sophistication, expansion of threats and IOT devices. Walk us through the overall key findings from 2020 that this report discovered. >> Absolutely. And if yo glance at your screen there you'll see the key findings here where we talk about record breaking numbers. And just in 2020, we saw over 10 million attacks, which, I mean, this is a 20% increase over 2019. And what's significant about that number is COVID had a huge impact. In fact, if we go all the way back to the beginning, right around mid March, that's when the pandemic was announced, attacks skyrocketed and they didn't stop. They just kept going up and to the right. And that is true through 2021. So far in the first quarter, typically January, February is the down month that we observe in DDoS attacks. Whether this is, you know, kids going back to school from Christmas break, you have their Christmas routines and e-commerce is slowing down. January, February is typically a slow month. That was not true in 2021. In fact, we hit record numbers on a month by month in both January and February. And so not only do we see 2.9 million attacks in the first quarter of 2021, which, I mean, let's do the math here, right? We've got four quarters, you know, we're on track to hit 12 million attacks potentially, if not more. And then you have this normal where we said 800,000 approximately month over month since the pandemic started, we started 2021 at 950,000 plus. That's up and to the right and it's not slowing down. >> It's not slowing down. It's a trend that it shows, you know, significant impact across every industry. And we're going to talk about that but what are some of the new threat vectors that you saw weaponized in the last year? I mean, you talked about the example of the Miami-Dade school district but what were some of those new vectors that were really weaponized and used to help this up and to the right trend? >> So there's four in particular that we were tracking in 2020 and these nets aren't necessarily new vectors. Typically what happens when an adversary starts using this is there's a proof of concept code out there. In fact, a good example of this would be the RDP over UDP. So, I mean, we're all remotely connected, right? We're doing this over a Zoom call. If I want to connect to my organization I'm going to use some sort of remote capability whether that's a VPN or tunneling in, whatever it might be, right? And so remote desktop is something that everybody's using. And we saw actors start to kind of play around with this in mid 2020. And in right around September, November timeframe we saw a sudden spike. And typically when we see spikes in this kind of activity it's because adversaries are taking proof of concept code, that maybe has been around for a period of time, and they're incorporating those into DDoS for hire services. And so any person that wants to launch a DDoS attack can go into underground forums in marketplaces and they can purchase, maybe it's $10 in Bitcoin, and they can purchase an attack. That leverage is a bunch of different DDoS vectors. And so adversaries have no reason to remove a vector as new ones get discovered. They only have the motivation to add more, right? Because somebody comes into their platform and says, "I want to launch an attack that's going to take out my opponent." It's probably going to look a lot better if there's a lot of attack options in there where I can just go through and start clicking buttons left and right. And so all of a sudden now I've got this complex multi-vector attack that I don't have to pay anything extra for. Adversary already did all the work for me and now I can launch an attack. And so we saw four different vectors that were weaponized in 2020. One of those are notably the Jenkins that you see listed on the screen in the key findings. That one isn't necessarily a DDoS vector. It started out as one, it does amplify, but what happens is Jenkins servers are very vulnerable and when you actually initiate this attack, it tips over the Jenkins server. So it kind of operates as like a DoS event versus DDoS but it still has the same effect of availability, it takes a server offline. And then now just in the first part of 2021 we're tracking multiple other vectors that are starting to be weaponized. And when we see this, we go from a few, you know, incidents or alerts to thousands month over month. And so we're seeing even more vectors added and that's only going to continue to go up into the right. You know that theme that we talked about at the beginning here. >> As more vectors get added, and what did you see last year in terms of industries that may have been more vulnerable? As we talked about the work from home, everyone was dependent, really here we are on Zoom, dependent on Zoom, dependent on Netflix. Streaming media was kind of a lifeline for a lot of us but it also was healthcare and education. Did you see any verticals in particular that really started to see an increase in the exploitation and in the risk? >> Yeah, so let's start, let's separate this into two parts. The last part of the key findings that we had was talking about a group we, or a campaign we call Lazarus Borough Model. So this is a global DDoS extortion campaign. We're going to cover that a little bit more when we talk about kind of extorted events and how that operates but these guys, they started where the money is. And so when they first started targeting industries and this kind of coincides with COVID, so it started several months after the pandemic was announced, they started targeting a financial organizations, commercial banking. They went after stock exchange. Many of you would hear about the New Zealand Stock Exchange that went offline. That's this LBA campaign and these guys taking it off. So they started where the money is. They moved to a financial agation targeting insurance companies. They targeted currency exchange places. And then slowly from there, they started to expand. And in so much as our Arbor Cloud folks actually saw them targeting organizations that are part of vaccine development. And so these guys, they don't care who they hurt. They don't care who they're going after. They're going out there for a payday. And so that's one aspect of the industry targeting that we've seen. The other aspect is you'll see, on the next slide here, we actually saw a bunch of different verticals that we really haven't seen in the top 10 before. In fact, if you actually look at this you'll see the number one, two and three are pretty common for us. We almost always are going to see these kinds of telecommunications, wireless, satellite, broadband, these are always going to be in the top. And the reason for that is because gamers and DDoS attacks associated with gaming is kind of the predominant thing that we see in this landscape. And let's face it, gamers are on broadband operating systems. If you're in Asian communities, often they'll use mobile hotspots. So now you start to have wireless come in there. And so that makes sense seeing them. But what doesn't make sense is this internet publishing and broadcasting and you might say, "Well, what is that?" Well, that's things like Zoom and WebEx and Netflix and these other streaming services. And so we're seeing adversaries going after that because those have become critical to people's way of life. Their entertainment, what they're using to communicate for work and school. So they realized if we can go after this it's going to disrupt something and hopefully we can get some recognition. Maybe we can show this as a demonstration to get more customers on our platform or maybe we can get a payday. In a lot of the DDoS attacks that we see, in fact most of them, are all monetary focused. And so they're looking for a payday. They're going to go after something that's going to likely, you know, send out that payment. And then just walk down the line. You can see COVID through this whole thing. Electronic shopping is number five, right? Everybody turned to e-commerce because we're not going to in-person stores anymore. Electronic computer manufacturing, how many more people have to get computers at home now because they're no longer in a corporate environment? And so you can see how the pandemic has really influenced this industry target. >> Significant influencer and I also wonder too, you know, Zoom became a household name for every generation. You know, we're talking to five generations and maybe the generations that aren't as familiar with computer technology might be even more exploitable because it's easy to click on a phishing email when they don't understand how to look for the link. Let's now unpack the different types of DDoS attacks and what is on the rise. You talked about in the report the triple threat and we often think of that in entertainment. That's a good thing, but again, not here. Explain that triple threat. >> Yeah, so what we're seeing here is we have adversaries out there that are looking to take advantage of every possible angle to be able to get that payment. And everybody knows ransomware is a household name at this point, right? And so ransomware and DDoS have a lot in common because they both attack the availability of network resources, where computers or devices or whatever they might be. And so there's a lot of parallels to draw between the two of these. Now ransomware is a denial of service event, right? You're not going to have tens of thousands of computers hitting a single computer to take it down. You're going to have one exploitation of events. Somebody clicked on a link, there was a brute force attempt that managed to compromise a little boxes, credentials, whatever it might be, ransomware gets put on a system, it encrypts all your files. Well, all of a sudden, you've got this ransom note that says "If you want your files decrypted you're going to send us this amount of human Bitcoin." Well, what adversaries are doing now is they're capitalizing on the access that they already gained. So they already have access to the computer. Well, why not steal all the data first then let's encrypt whatever's there. And so now I can ask for a ransom payment to decrypt the files and I can ask for an extortion to prevent me from posting your data publicly. Maybe there's sensitive corporate information there. Maybe you're a local school system and you have all of your students' data on there. You're a hospital that has sensitive PI on it, whatever it might be, right? So now they're going to extort you to prevent them from posting that publicly. Well, why not add DDoS to this entire picture? Now you're already encrypted, we've already got your files, and I'm going to DDoS your system so you can't even access them if you wanted to. And I'm going to tell you, you have to pay me in order to stop this DDoS attack. And so this is that triple threat and we're seeing multiple different ransomware families. In fact, if you look at one of the slides here, you'll see that there's SunCrypt, there's Ragnar Cryptor, and then Maze did this initially back in September and then more recently, even the DarkSide stuff. I mean, who hasn't heard about DarkSide now with the Colonial Pipeline event, right? So they came out and said, "Hey we didn't intend for this collateral damage but it happened." Well, April 24th, they actually started offering DDoS as part of their tool kits. And so you can see how this has evolved over time. And adversaries are learning from each other and are incorporating this kind of methodology. And here we have triple extortion event. >> It almost seems like triple extortion event as a service with the opportunities, the number of vectors there. And you're right, everyone has heard of the Colonial Pipeline and that's where things like ransomware become a household term, just as much as Zoom and video conferencing and streaming media. Let's talk now about the effects that the threat report saw and uncovered region by region. Were there any regions in particular that were, that really stood out as most impacted? >> So not particularly. So one of the phenomenon that we actually saw in the threat report, which, you know, we probably could have talked about it before now but it makes sense to talk about it regionally because we didn't see any one particular region, one particular vertical, a specific organization, specific country, none was more heavily targeted than another. In fact what we saw is organizations that we've never seen targeted before. We've seen industries that have never been targeted before all of a sudden are now getting DDoS attacks because we went from a local on-prem, I don't need to be connected to the internet, I don't need to have my employees remote access. And now all of a sudden you're dependent on the internet which is really, let's face it, that's critical infrastructure these days. And so now you have all of these additional people with a footprint connected to the internet then adversary can figure out and they can poke it. And so what we saw here is just overall, all industries, all regions saw these upticks. The exception would be in China. We actually, in the Asia Pacific region specifically, but predominantly in China. But that often has to do with visibility rather than a decrease in attacks because they have their own kind of infrastructure in China. Brazil's the same way. They have their own kind of ecosystems. And so often you don't see what happens a lot outside the borders. And so from our perspective, we might see a decrease in attacks but, for all we know, they actually saw an increase in the attacks that is internal to their country against their country. And so across the board, just increases everywhere you look. >> Wow. So let's talk about what organizations can do in light of this. As we are here, we are still doing this program by video conferencing and things are opening up a little bit more, at least in the states anyway, and we're talking about more businesses going back to some degree but there's going to still be some mix, some hybrid of working from home and maybe even distance learning. So what can enterprises do to prepare for this when it happens? Because it sounds to me like with the sophistication, the up and to the right, it's not, if we get attacked, it's when. >> It's when, exactly. And that's just it. I mean, it's no longer something that you can put off. You can't just assume that I've never been DDoS attacked, I'm never going to be DDoS attacked anymore. You really need to consider this as part of your core security platform. I like to talk about defense in depth or a layer defense approach where you want to have a layered approach. So, you know, maybe they target your first layer and they don't get through. Or they do get through and now your second layer has to stop it. Well, if you have no layers or if you have one layer, it's not that hard for an adversary to figure out a way around that. And so preparation is key. Making sure that you have something in place and I'm going to give you an operational example here. One of the things we saw with the LBA campaigns is they actually started doing network of conasense for their targets. And what they would do is they would take the IP addresses belonging to your organization. They would look up the domains associated with that and they would figure out like, "Hey, this is bpn.organization.com or VPN two." And all of a sudden they've found your VPN concentrator and so that's where they're going to focus their attack. So something as simple as changing the way that you name your VPN concentrators might be sufficient to prevent them from hitting that weak link or right sizing the DDoS protection services for your company. Did you need something as big as like OnPrem Solutions? We need hardware. Do you instead want to do a managed service? Or do you want to go and talk to a cloud provider because there's right solutions and right sizes for all types of organizations. And the key here is preparation. In fact, all of the customers that we've worked with for the LBA extortion campaigns, if they were properly prepared they experienced almost no downtime or impact to their business. It's the people like the New Zealand Stock Exchange or their service provider that wasn't prepared to handle the attacks that were sent out them that were crippled. And so preparation is key. The other part is awareness. And that's part of what we do with this threat report because we want to make sure you're aware what adversaries are doing, when new attack vectors are coming out, how they're leveraging these, what industries they're targeting because that's really going to help you to figure out what your posture is, what your risk acceptance is for your organization. And in fact, there's a couple of resources that that we have here on the next slide. And you can go to both both of these. One of them is the threat report. You can view all of the details. And we only scratched the surface here in this Cube interview. So definitely recommend going there but the other one is called Horizon And netscout.com/horizon is a free resource you can register but you can actually see near real-time attacks based on industry and based on region. So if your organization out there and you're figuring, "Well I'm never attacked." Well go look up your industry. Go look up the country where you belong and see is there actually attacks against us? And I think you'll be quite surprised that there's quite a few attacks against you. And so definitely recommend checking these out >> Great resources netscout.com/horizon, netscout.com/threatreport. I do want to ask you one final question. That's in terms of timing. We saw the massive acceleration in digital transformation last year. We've already talked about this a number of times on this program. The dependence that businesses and consumers, like globally in every industry, in every country, have on streaming on communications right now. In terms of timing, though, for an organization to go from being aware to understanding what adversaries are doing, to being prepared, how quickly can an organization get up to speed and help themselves start reducing their risks? >> So I think that with DDoS, as opposed to things like ransomware, the ramp up time for that is much, much faster. There is a finite period of time with DDoS attacks that is actually going to impact you. And so maybe you're a smaller organization and you get DDoS attacked. There's a, probably a pretty high chance that that DDoS attack isn't going to last for multiple days. So maybe it's like an hour, maybe it's two hours, and then you recover. Your network resources are available again. That's not the same for something like ransomware. You get hit with ransomware, unless you pay or you have backups, you have to do the rigorous process of getting all your stuff back online. DDoS is more about as soon as the attack stops, the saturation goes away and you can start to get back online again. So it might not be as like immediate critical that you have to have something but there's also solutions, like a cloud solution, where it's as simple as signing up for the service and having your traffic redirected to their scrubbing center, their detection center. And then you may not have to do anything on-prem yourself, right? It's a matter of going out to an organization, finding a good contract, and then signing up, signing on the dotted line. And so I think that the ramp up time for mitigation services and DDoS protection can be a lot faster than many other security platforms and solutions. >> That's good to know cause with the up and to the right trend that you already said, the first quarter is usually slow. It's obviously not that way as what you've seen in 2021. And we can only expect what way, when we talk to you next year, that the up and to the right trend may continue. So hopefully organizations take advantage of these resources, Richard, that you talked about to be prepared to mediate and protect their you know, their customers, their employees, et cetera. Richard, we thank you for stopping by theCube. Talking to us about the sixth NetScout Threat Intelligence Report. Really interesting information. >> Absolutely; definitely a pleasure to have me here. Lisa, anytime you guys want to do it again, you know where I live? >> Yes. It's one of my favorite topics that you got and I got to point out the last thing, your Guardians of the Galaxy background, one of my favorite movies and it should be noted that on the NetScout website they are considered the Guardians of the Connected World. I just thought that connection was, as Richard told me before we went live, not planned, but I thought that was a great coincidence. Again, Richard, it's been a pleasure talking to you. Thank you for your time. >> Thank you so much. >> Richard Hummel, I'm Lisa Martin. You're watching this Cube conversation. (relaxing music)

(upbeat music) >> Narrator: From around the globe, it's theCUBE with digital coverage of AWS Public Sector Online brought to you by Amazon Web Services. >> Welcome back to theCUBE's coverage of AWS Public Sector Summit Online. I'm John Furrier, your host of theCUBE. I wish we could be there in person, but we're doing remote because of the COVID and the pandemic. We've got a great guest, Paul Grist. Worldwide Public Sector, Head of Education International for AWS. Paul, thank you for coming on remotely. >> Great to be here, John. >> There's a lot of disruption in the education space this year with universities and schools still uncertain about what the future will look like. What are some of the biggest trends you're seeing? >> John, what we've seen is the rapid adoption of technology and the growth of flexible online learning, learning that can take place anytime, anywhere. What we've seen is universities, national education systems, and schools rapidly migrating systems and content to the cloud, spinning up new applications. And we've seen companies that provide technology and content and platforms, the ed techs and publishers of the world, increasing their capacity, increasing their capability to deliver new applications to education. >> What is some of this research that you're finding out there? >> Yeah. You know, a time of much change and things happening very, very fast. We responded fast to the changes, John. Got a load of customer conversations together, looking at speeches by educationalists who were responding to the changes at some of the online events that spun up very quickly at places like the University of Buckingham, ASU, JSV, Inside Higher Education, places like Blackboard World. And really just talked to those leaders about their responses to the change, what kinds of things they were doing, and brought that together into the research. It's underpinned by some in-depth research and insights from education reports and articles too. >> Thanks Paul, really appreciate it. Having that research is critical. I know you guys do a lot of work on that. I know you got some news, take a quick plug for the new research that's coming out. You guys just put out today, just take a minute to quickly explain what it's about and how to find it. >> We're publishing today some new research that shows the seven key emerging trends in this new world of education. Check it out on the AWS website. Two key trends, flexible learning and the new world of employability. >> So you guys got a lot of data. It's great with Amazon, got a lot of customers. Good to see you guys getting that research. The question I have for you Paul is, what amount of the research shows really the COVID situation? Because there's before COVID, there's kind of during, and then there's going to be a post-COVID mode. Was that prior research in place with COVID or after COVID? Can you share kind of the update on the relevance of your research? >> Yeah, I think the sector has changed. The sector has gone through the fastest change it's ever gone through. And undoubtedly most of the issues, most of the challenges and opportunities in the sector, predate the pandemic. But what we've seen is COVID accelerate many of the challenges and the opportunities, but also bring new opportunities. >> Yeah, one of the things we've seen with education is the disruption, and the forcing function with COVID. There's a problem, we all know what it is. It's important, there's consequences for those. And you can quantify the disruption with real business value and certainly student impact. There's been downsides with remote education. More teacher-parent involvement and students having to deal with isolation, less social interaction. How do you guys see that? Or what is Amazon doing to solve these problems? Can you talk about that? >> Yeah. I think you know, education is very much a people business. And what we've been trying to do is partner with organizations to ensure that the people are kept at the center of the business. So working with organizations such as LS, sorry, Los Angeles United School District in the US to spin up a call center to allow students to contact their tutors. And parents to interact with tutors, to get questions answered. >> So one of the challenges these academic institutions are facing is speed, it's pace of change. What's going on with competition? How are they competing? How are universities and colleges staying relevant? Obviously there's a financial crisis involved. There's also the actual delivery aspect of it. More and more mergers. You're starting to see ecosystem changes. Can you talk about what's going on in the educational ecosystem? >> Yeah I mean, educational institutions are being forced to rethink their business models. It's an international marketplace in higher education. It's been a growing marketplace for many, many years. That suddenly stopped overnight, so every university has had to rethink about where their revenues are coming from, where the students are coming from. There's been some surprises too. I mean in the UK, actually international enrollments are up post-COVID because one of the strange side effects of COVID is without being able to travel, there's actually a cost saving for students. And so we've seen universities in the UK benefit from students who want to study, perhaps travel and the cost of study was too high previously. Now being able to study remotely. It's an unexpected and unintended consequence. But it kind of shows how there are opportunities for all organizations during this time. >> Many countries had to cancel exams altogether this year, which has been a big, huge problem. I mean people are outraged and people want to learn. It's been, you know, the silver lining in all this is that you have the internet (laughs). You have the cloud. I want to get your thoughts. How are universities and schools dealing with this challenge? Because you have a multi-sided marketplace. You've got the institutions, you've got the students, you got the educators, they all have to be successful. How are universities dealing with this challenge? >> Yeah I think, you know, teaching and learning has been online for 20, 30 years. And I think a lot of organizations have adopted online teaching and learning. But I think assessment is the one big area of education that remains to be made available at scale at low cost. So most assessment is still a pen-and-paper-based. There's big trust and identity issues. And what we're seeing through this COVID change is organizations really getting to grip with both of those issues. So, having the confidence to put assessment online, to make it available at scale, and then also having the confidence to tackle trust and identity questions. So who is taking the exam, where are they sitting? Can we be sure that it's actually that person taking that exam? So you know, the rise of things like proctoring technologies giving organizations the opportunity to assess remotely. >> How has this crisis affected research at academic institutions? Because certainly we know that if you need a lab or something, certainly we're seeing students need to be physically in person. But with remote and all those changes going on with the scale and the pace of change, how has research at academic institutions been impacted? >> Yeah I mean, research has always been a really collaborative activity, but we've seen that collaboration increase. It's had to increase. Researchers have had to go remote. Many of them work in labs. They haven't been able to do that. They've needed to spin up applications and new technologies in the cloud to continue working. But what we're seeing is governments taking an increased interest in the research being applicable, making sure that it leads to innovation which is meaningful. Getting much more involved and insisting that the research is made available now. And of course there's no place that that's clearer than in health research and trying to find a cure for COVID. And then secondly, we're seeing that research is becoming much more collaborative not just across institutions but also countries. So one of the great projects we're involved in at the moment is with the University of Adelaide who are collaborating with researchers from the Breeding and Acclimatization Institute in Poland on a project to study the increase in crop yield of wheat. >> One of the things that's coming out of this, whether it's research or students is open online courses, virtual capabilities. But a concept called stackable learning. Can you explain what that is? >> Yeah. We're in a global marketplace in education and there's increased competition between universities and education providers to make new types of certificates and online badges available. We know that employers are looking for ever more agile methods of scaling and upskilling. And stackable learning is a concept that's been around for a couple of decades now, where learning is broken down into smaller chunks, put together in a more personalized way from a number of different providers. Spun up very, very quickly to respond to need and then delivered to students. We're seeing some of the big providers like edX and Coursera who, again have been around for over a decade become really prominent in the provision of some of these stackable credentials. Their systems run on the cloud. They're easy to access, in many, many cases they're free. We're seeing an increasing number of employers and education institutions adopt and embed these types of delivery systems into their curriculum. >> Totally a fan of stackable learning, it's called the Lego model, whatever I call it. But also online brings the nonlinear progressions. The role of data is super important. So I'm very bullish on education being disrupted by cloud providers and new apps. So you know, I wanted to call that out because I think it's super important. Let me get to a really important piece that it has to be addressed, and I want to get your thoughts on. Cyber security. Okay, cyber attacks and privacy of students are two areas that are super important for institutions to address. What's your reaction to that? >> Yeah, I mean the use of more technology becomes, you know again, a target for cyber attack and unfortunately it's an increasing phenomenon. Simply put, every organization needs to put security first. Needs to operate as a security-first organization. They need to adopt technologies, people and processes that can protect their investments. And work with data management vendors, cloud vendors who've got the compliances and the common privacy and security frameworks such as GDPR in place to make sure that they provide secure services. AWS's security offerings include auditing, login and identity management, data encryption capabilities that offer more transparency and control, to allow institutions protect student data. >> Super important, thanks for sharing. Finally, what's the steps institutions can take to close the digital divide because now some people are taking gap years. Research is changing. People might not even have PCs or internet connections. There's still, this exposes the haves and have nots. What steps can institutions take to do their part? >> Yeah, digital learning is here to stay, John. We've learned that many learners do not have access to technology necessary for online learning. Whether those are devices or a reliable internet connection. But again, you know governments, states, educational authorities have all turned their attention to these issues over the last few months. And we're seeing organizations partner with technology providers that can provide internet connections. Partners in AWS, such as Kajeet who've installed hotspot devices on buses to deploy in areas with no connectivity. You know whether that's a place like Denver, Colorado or whether it's a place, you know, in Nigeria in Africa, remote connection remains a problem everywhere. And we're seeing everybody addressing that issue now. >> Paul, great to have you on theCUBE and sharing your insights on what's going on in international education. Final question for you. In your own words, why is this year at the AWS Public Sector Summit Online important? What's the most important story that people should walk away in this educational industry? >> The most important story, John, is it's a time of incredible change but also incredible opportunity. And we're seeing organizations who have wanted to change, who've wanted to deliver more to their students, who want to deliver a greater experience, who want to access more students and have much greater reach. Now with the appetite to do that. re:Invent is a great opportunity to work with AWS, to understand what's going on with our partners, with our customers. And look at some of the common solutions for the challenges that they're looking to solve. >> Paul Grist, thank you for coming on theCUBE. Really appreciate it. Worldwide Head of Education for International AWS. Thank you for sharing. >> Thanks John, great to be here. >> Okay, this is theCUBE's coverage of AWS Public Sector Online Summit. Remote, virtual, this is theCUBE virtual. I'm John Furrier, your host. Thanks for watching. (upbeat music)

>>from around the globe. It's the Cube with digital coverage of next level network experience event brought to >>you by info blocks. Okay, welcome back, everyone. This is the Cube's coverage of the next level networking experience. Virtual event within four blocks. I'm John Furrow, your host of the Cube. We're here in our Palo Alto, Calif. Studios as part of our remote access during Covic, getting the interviews and the stories and sharing that with you. We got a great guest here, then savages the network operations manager at Morgan School District in Utah. A customer of info blocks to share a story. Then thanks for coming on. >>Thanks for having >>me. First of all, the Red Sox had a plus interview. I would say right now is gonna go great. Go Sox. Which baseball was in season. Great to have you on. Um, >>we'll get there. We'll >>get there. Um, my Yankee fans say when I say that. But anyway, Miss baseball, um, you know. But that brings up covert 19 baseball season sports. Life has been impacted. Your district. Like many school districts around the world, we're told to shut down, send workers home. That meant sending kids home, too. So we got the educators, get the administration, and you've got the kids all going home. >>Yeah. >>What did you do to keep things going? Because then stop. They had to do the remote learning and new things were emerging. New patterns, new traffic, new kinds of experiences. What did you learn? What's going on? >>Well, first we tried to lock the doors and pretend we weren't there, but they found us. Um, really? I mean, real quickly in our school district, we're not a 1 to 1 operation, so the, uh that caused a big change for us. Um, we had to quickly adapt. And we chose to use chromebooks because that's what we have for the students to use in their classes. So getting that, uh, squared away and send out into the family's was was a big challenge. But then on top of that being the school district, we then had to decide. Okay, how do we protect and filter provide the filtering that the students are gonna need even though they're at home? So there's some relative safety there when they're online and and accessing your email and things like that. So those were. Our two are probably our two. Biggest hurdles was, you know, ramping up the devices and then and then providing, making sure, you know, the network access from a filtering and consistency standpoint was going to work. >>You know, I got to ask you because I see this kind of disruption you don't You don't read about this in the i t. Manual around disaster recovery and, you know, disruption to operations. But essentially, the whole thing changes, but you still got to connect to the network, DNS. You gotta get the access to the content. You got content, you get systems. You got security all to be managed while in flight of dealing with connection points that remote. So you've got the disruption and the craziness of that, and then you've got this big I o t experiment basically edge of the network, you know, in all over the place. You know, on one hand, you kind of geek out and say, Wow, this is really kind of a challenge is an opportunity to solve the problem at the same time, you know, What do you do? So take us through that because that's a is a challenge of locking down the security in a borderless environment. People are everywhere. The students business has to get done. You got to resolve to. The resource is >>so thankfully, we had migrated If it blocks several years ago. Um and just this last, I would say in October, I finally got us on. Ah, cloud the blocks. One threat defense Cloud portion of it too. So from a security standpoint, we already had a really good, um foundation in place from both the DNs aspect and the DNS security aspect. Um so that was to be honest, most users. It was seamless transition. In many regards, both users didn't even realize they were being, You know, pushed through the info blocks is cloud DNs server, you know, which was providing security and filtering. So that was a big plus for us because it it was less man hours. We had to spend troubleshooting people's DNS resolutions. Why sites Wouldn't you know? Maybe they weren't being filtered correctly. All that was was to be honest, perfect. Where other platforms we had previously were just a nightmare to manage, >>like, for example, of the old way versus the new way here and marital, is it? What files configuration will take us through? What? You >>know, it was like a separate. It was a separate product content filter that works in conjunction with the firewall. Um, and I'm not going to name the company's name. I don't want, you know, even though many company but it seemed with that product we were spending, on average about 3 to 4 hours a day fixing false positives just from a filtering aspect because it would interfere with the DNS. And it does. It didn't really do it. I mean, how it filters is not based on DNS. Totally right. So by migrating temple blocks are DNS and the filtering the security is all handling at the DNs level. And it was just much more, um, to be I mean, frankly, honestly, is much more invisible to the end user. So >>more efficient. You decouple filtering from DNs resolution. Got it. All right, this is the big topic. I've been talking with info blocks people on this program in this event is on how this new d d I layer DNs d XP and I p address management kind of altogether super important. It's critical infrastructure Yeah. No spoilers, Enterprise. You're borderless institution. Same thing you go to school as a customer. How does the d I lay out this foundational security play for delivering this next level experience? What's your take on that? >>Well, for our like, for a school platform, we we use it in a number of ways. Besides, I mean, the filtering is huge, but just for the ability, like, for example, one of the components is is response policy zones or DNS firewalls what they call it, and that allows you one to manage, um, traditional, like DNS names, right? P addresses you can. You can manage those by creating essentially a zone that is like a white list of blacklist rewrite. So you've got a lot of control, and again it's filtering at the DNs level, so it's looking based on DNS responses inquiry. The other aspect of that is, is the feeds that you receive from info blocks. So by subscribing to those, we, um we have access to a lot of information that info Blocks and their partners have created identifying, you know, bad actors, malware attack vectors based on again DNs, uh, traffic, if you will, and so that takes a load office. Not having to worry. I'm trying to do all that on our own. I mean, we've seen a lot of attacks minimized because of the feeds themselves. So that again frees us up. We're a very small school district. In some regards, there's a I am the only network person in the district, and there's like, a total of four of us that manage, you know, kind of the support aspect. And so, being able to not have to spend time researching or tracking down, you know, breaches and attacks as much because of the DNS. Security frees me up to do other things, you know, like in the more standard networking realm, from a design and implementation. >>Great. Thanks for sharing that. I want to ask about security as a very competitive space security here and everyone promising it different things at different security things. You know, by I gotta ask you, why did you guys decide to use info blocks and what's the reason behind it? >>Well, to be frankly honest, I'm actually in info blocks trainer and I've been training for 15 years, so I kind of had an agenda when I first took this job to help out the school district. In my experience, I've been doing working in networking for over 20 years. And in my experience, I ever boxes one of the most easy and in best managed DNS solutions that I've come across. So, um, you know, I might be a little biased, but I'm okay with that. And so I I pushed us to be honest, to get there and then from the security aspect has all that has evolved. It just makes to me it makes sense. Why not wrap the more things you can maybe wrapped together. And so you know, when you're talking about attacks, over 90% of attacks use DNS. So if I have a solution that is already providing my DNS and then wraps the security into it, it just makes the most sense for me. >>Yeah. I mean, go back. The info box is DNA. You got cricket. Liu Stuart Bailey, the founder, was this is zero. This didn't just wake up one day and decided to start up these air practitioners early days of the Internet. They know DNS cold and DNS is we've been evolved. I mean, and when it needs that when you get into the DNS. Hacks and then you realize Okay, let's build an abstraction layer. You've seen Internet navigation discovery, all the stuff that's been proven. It is a critical infrastructure. >>Well, and to be honest, it's It's one of those services that you can't can't filter the firewall right. You have to have it. You have to. It's that foundation layer. And so it makes sense that Attackers air leveraging it because the fire will has to let it through in and out. And so it's a natural, almost a natural path for them to break in. So having something that speaks native DNS as part of your security platform makes more sense because it it can understand and see those attacks, the more sophisticated they become as well. >>So I gotta ask you, since you're very familiar info blocks and you're actually deploying its great solution. But I got this new DD I Layer, which is an abstraction, is always a great evolution. Take away complexity and more functionality. Cloud certainly cloud natives everywhere. That's but if it's for what is the update, if if I'm watching this month, you know I've been running DNS and I know it's out there. It's been running everything. And I got a update, my foundation of my business. I got to make my DNS rock solid. What's the new update? What's info blocks doing now? I know they got DNS chops seeing that on it. What's new about info blocks? What do you say? >>Well, it's, you know, they have a couple things that they've been trying to modify over the last several years. In my opinion, making more DNS like a you know, like software as a service, you know, service on demand, type of approach. That's a yes. So you have the cloud components to where you can take a lot of the heavy lifting, maybe off of your network team's shoulders. Because it is, it is. Um, I think people will be surprised how many customers out there. I have, ah, teams that are managing the DNS and even the D HCP aspect that that's not really what their experiences and then they don't They don't have, ah, true, maybe background Indians, and so having something that can help make that easier. It's almost, you know, hey, maybe used this term it almost sounds like it's too simple, but it's almost like a plug and play approached for some. For some environments, you know you're able to pop that in, and a lot of probably the problems they've been dealing with and not realizing what the root cause was will be fixed. So that's always a huge component with with info blocks. But their security is really what's come about in the last several years, Um, and and back as a school district, you know, our besides securing traffic, which every customer has to do, um, we have our you know, we're We have a lot of laws and regulations around filtering with with students and teachers. So anyone that's using a campus own device And so for us this I don't think people realized that the maturity that the filtering aspect of the blocks one defence now it's it's really evolved over the last couple of years. It's become a really, really good product and, like I said earlier, just work seamlessly with the data security. So it is going to be using >>an SD Wan unpacked everything. You go regular root level DNs is it? So I gotta ask you. How is the info blocks helping you keep network services running in system secure? >>Well, I think I think we're more on just the DNs d It does R d eight DNS and DCP. So from that standpoint, you know, in the five years almost we've been running that aspect. We have had very little if if maybe one or two incidents of problems with, you know from a DNS TCP so so are our users are able to connect, you know, when they turn on their computer To them, the Internet's up. You know, there's no there's no bumps in the road stopping them from from being able to connect. So that's a huge thing. You know, you don't have to deal with those Those constant issues again is a small team that just takes time away from the big projects. You're trying to, um, and then to the being able to now combine things. Security filtering solution. Uh, that alone has probably saved us. Oh, we'll probably you know, upwards of 500 man hours in the last eight months. So where normally we would be spending those hours again, troubleshooting issues that false positives, things like that. And there's a small team that just sucks the life out of you when you have to. You always spend time on that. >>I mean, you always chasing your tails. Almost. You want to be productive. Automation plays >>a >>key role in that, >>right? Yeah. >>So I got to ask you, you know, just a general question. I'm curious. You know, one of the things I see is sprawling of devices. WiFi was a great example that put an access point up a rogue access point, you know, as you get more connections. De HCP was amazing about this is awesome. But also, you had also de HCP problem. You got the the key Management is not just around slinging more d HDP around. So you got the trend? Is more connections on the eyepiece? Not how does info blocks make that easier? Because for people who may not know, the DNS ends announcing TCP and IP address management. They're all kind of tied together. Right? So this >>is the >>magic of DD I in my head. I want to get your thoughts on how you see that. Evolving. >>Yeah, I think that's another kind of back twice. It's kind of almost like a plug and play for a lot of customer environments. They're getting, you know, you're getting the DSP, DNs and eye Pam all wrapped in once you have this product that speaks, well, those languages, if you will and that And, um along with some of the reporting services and things of that nature. Um, when I look for, like, a Mac address in my influx database, I'm not just going to get ah, Mac address and what the i p addresses. I'm not just going to get the DNs like the host name. Maybe you know, the beauty and fully qualified domain name. Either I have the ability to bring in all this information that one. The client is communicating with the DCP DNS server on top of things like metadata that you can configure in the database to help really color in the picture of your network. So when you're looking at what device is using this I p when we talk about rogue devices or things like that, uh, I can get so much more information out of info blocks that almost almost to the point where you're almost being able to nail down the location of where the devices that even if it's a wireless client because it works in conjunction with some of our wireless appointments, too. So within, you know, a matter of minutes we have almost all the information we would need to take whatever action is appropriate for something like that, that getting used to take us hours and hours to troubleshoot. >>Appreciate a lot of the other interviews I've done with the info blocks, folks. One of the things that came out of them is the trailing. You can see the trail they're getting. They got to get in somewhere. DNS is the footprints of there you got? That's the traffic, and that's been helping on a potential attacks in D DOS is, for example, no one knows what that is, but DNS is what he said. A lot of the surface areas, DNS. With the hackers are makes it easier to find things. >>Well, you know, by integrating with the cloud I've I've got, you know, that the cloud based with the blocks one, it added a advanced DNS security, which helps protect skins Adidas as well as any cast to help provide more availability because I'm pushing on my DNs traffic through those cloud servers. It's like I've I'm almost equivalent of a very large organization that would normally spend millions of millions of dollars trying to do this on their own. So I'm getting the benefits and kind of the equivalent from that cloud hybrid approach that normally we would never have have. The resource is, >>Well, then I really appreciate you taking the time out of your busy day to remote into the Cube studios. Talk about next level networking experience, so I want to just ask you, just put your experience hat on. You've been You've seen some waves. You've seen the technology evolve when you hear next level networking and when you hear next level networking experience almost two separate meetings. But next level networking means next level. Next level networking experience means is some experience behind it. One of those two phrases mean to you next level networking and next level networking experience. >>Well, to me, I always look at it as the evolution of being able to have a user experience that's consistent no matter where you're located, with your home in your office and special with in today's environment. We have to be able to provide that consistent experience. But what I think what a lot of people may not think about or my overlook if you're just, you know, more of an end user is along with that experience, it has to be a consistent excess security approach. So if I'm an end user, um, I should be able to have the access the, um and the security, which, you know, you know, filtering all that fun stuff to not just allow me the connectivity, but to bring me, you know, that to keep the secure wherever I met. And ah, um, I think schools, you know, obviously with code and in the one the one that everyone was forced to do. But I think businesses And generally I think that's, you know, years ago, Cisco when I worked with Cisco, we talked about, you know, the remote user of the mobile user and how Cisco is kind of leading, uh, the way on that. And I think, you know, with the nature of things like this pandemic, I think being able to have your your users again have that consistent experience, no matter where they're at is going to be key. And so that's how I see when I think of the network evolution, I think that's how it it has to go. >>Well, we appreciate your your time sharing your insights Has a lot of a lot of people are learning that you've got to pour the concrete to build the building. DNS becoming kind of critical infrastructure. But final question for you. I got you here, you know? How you doing? Actually, schools looks like they're gonna have some either fully virtual for the next semester or some sort of time or set schedule. There's all kinds of different approaches. This is the end of the day. It's still is this big i o t experiment from a traffic standpoint. So new expectations create new solutions. What do you see on the horizon? What challenges do you see as you ride this way? Because you've got a hold down the fort, their school district for 3000 students. And you got the administration and the faculty. So you know What are you expecting? And what do you hope to see Evolve Or what do you want to stay away from? What's your opinion? >>I think? I think my my biggest concern is, you know, making sure our like, our students and staff don't, uh, you know, run into trouble on by say that more from, you know, you know, by being, you know, being exposed to attacks, you know, their data with Delta becomes, you know, comes back to our data as a district. But, you know, the student data, I think I think, you know, with anything kids are very vulnerable. Ah, very role, vulnerable targets for many reasons. You know, they're quick to use technology that quick to use, like social media, things like that. But they're they're probably the first ones to do security Does not, you know, across their mind. So I think my big my big concern is as we're moving this, you know, hybrid, hybrid approach where kids can be in school where they're going to be at home. Maybe they'll change from the days of the week. It'll fluctuate, uh, keeping them secure, you know, protecting them from themselves. Maybe in a way, if I have to be the guy is kind of the grumpy old dad it looked at. I'm okay with wearing that hat. I think that's my biggest. Our concern is providing that type of, uh, stability and security. So parents at the end of that could be, you know, I have more peace of mind that their kids you know, our online even more. It's great >>that you can bring that experience because, you know, new new environments, like whether it zooming or using, try and get the different software tools that are out there that were built for on premise premises. You have now potentially a click here. Click there. They could be a target. So, you know, being safe and getting the job done to make sure they have up time. So the remote access it again. If you've got a new edge now, right? So the edge of the network is the home. Exactly. Yeah. Your service area just got bigger. >>Yeah. Yeah, we're in. You know, I'm everybody's guest, whether they like it or not. >>I appreciate that. Appreciate your time and good luck. And let's stay in touch. Thanks for your time. >>Hey, thanks for having me. You guys have a good rest of your weekend? Day two. State State. >>Thank you very much. It's the Cube's coverage with info blocks for a special next level networking experience. Pop up event. I'm John for the Cube. Your host. Thanks for watching. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

>>from around the globe. It's the queue with digital coverage of AWS Public sector online brought to you by Amazon Web services. >>Hi, I'm stupid man. And this is the Cube's coverage of AWS Public Sectors Summit Online. We've done this show for many years. Of course, this this time it's online rather than in person in the District of Washington D. C Happy to welcome to the program First time guest. Very good partner of Aws is from Salesforce is Casey Coleman. She is the senior vice president of Global Government Solutions, together with sales work. Casey, thanks so much for joining us. >>Thank you. Glad to be here. >>All right. So first of all, maybe if you could give us a little bit of level set your role at Salesforce and obviously, you know, a long partnership with Amazon. Tell us a little bit about that. >>Yes. My role at Salesforce is to work with our customers in the public sector globally and really help them map out their digital transformation. You know, it's an ongoing journey and we help them understand how to how to break that down into actionable steps and really transformed what they're doing to serve their constituents and citizens better. >>Excellent. So it of course said that the public sector show a lot about the leverage of govcloud and the other services. All the compliance that goes into that ahead of this event you had Ah, new update at Salesforce in partnership with AWS. Talk to us about it's the government cloud plus s o. You know what's entailed there? Uh, and, uh, tell us how AWS and Salesforce work together to launch this solution. >>Yeah, thanks Do. We are so excited to announce the launch of govcloud Plus, which is sales force is a customer 3 60 crm platform that runs on Amazon Web services in the govcloud in their govcloud environment. And we've just received a provisional 80 0 provisional authority to operate from the FEDRAMP program office at the high security level. So we are announcing govcloud Plus is fed ramp. I'm ready to go generally available and ready for customers. >>Excellent. Maybe bring us inside. You know what's different about how government agencies leverage sales force most companies out there, You know, Salesforce is a critical piece off how they manage, you know, number one, they're salesforce marketing and lots of other pieces, anything specific that we should understand about the public sector. >>Yeah, it's a great question because even our name Salesforce sounds like a commercial kind of thing to do. Governments don't think of themselves as selling, but if you break down to a level of detail about what governments actually do, it is the same kind of functions case management, its benefits delivery. It's communications and outreach. It's all the same kind of function that are necessary for commercial organizations to drive. And so that's what we do. We translate that into government ready terms so that they can serve child welfare, health information delivery record, former information, all kinds of services for the constituents of the public sector. And they might call them customers. They might call them citizens, residents constituent. But it's those they >>Yeah, well, what one of the things about Salesforce is, as you said, it's not just, you know, a sales tool. There's so much you've got a very broad and deep ecosystem. Their asses Well, as you know, people that know how to use it, they get underneath the covers. You know, when I think of not only a sales force. You know, the first company that I probably thought of and heard about that it was SAS. But if you talk about the AP economy, if you talk about how things integrate, Salesforce does a lot for developers. So I know one of the other pieces you had. There's everybody knows Dream Force. Maybe not as many people know, that trailhead DX show that that that Salesforce has had for developers. So bring us a little bit inside. What would Salesforce is doing for developers? And, of course, the government angle along those lines, too? >>Yeah, there's a lot going on in the developer world. We were glad to be able to host a virtual version of our trailhead developer conference and announced a lot of exciting new developments, including salesforce anywhere, which is really bringing an immersive voice, video and chat environment to collaborate in the developer environment and into the delivery environment. And you bring that into the public sector. And the benefits are amazing because one of the key challenges with government is keeping up with the pace of the public expectations. In a pace of change in the commercial world, all of the shop and bank and live on our mobile devices. And governments are being faced with the same expectations from the public to do any time anywhere personalized delivery as the code rapid development environments that force offers give public sector I t team the ability to quickly and respond to changing conditions like the code 19 pandemic and roll out applications that are not only fast to develop into boy but they also benefit from being in the govcloud environment. And so the compliance is party built in and that's another key challenges. Often it rises. The public sector is not almost building new applications and making sure they're secure with Salesforce all built in >>Yeah, sounds sounds a lot of sis similarity to what we hear in the private sector, of course, that the balance between what it is doing and how we enable developers, of course security, you mentioned super important anything specifically from the government sector that you'd say, Well, that might be different from what we see in the general enterprise world. >>You know, the but security is top of mind for the public sector, always because they're dealing with the most sensitive data they're dealing with the public trust and trust is really the currency of government. They're not dealing in profit and market share, but they are dealing in a public trust and protecting information like financial data, health data, personal data. And so it's essential that the government had the best in class commercial tools to make sure they are providing world class security for for their their constituents in their mission. And that's one reason we're so excited to be partnering with AWS on Golf Club was because Amazon AWS has already deployed the Fed Ramp I version of their infrastructures of service. And so, by riding on top of that, we inherit all of those existing controls at our own Fed ramp controls. And our customers benefit from the best in class security from two of the most trusted name in public Cloud >>Great. You know, absolutely. Govcloud has been a real boon for the entire industry. When it talks about how government agencies they're leveraging cloud, you talked about sitting on top of ah govcloud the government cloud plus, you know, leverages some of the certifications and like, can you bring us inside a little bit? How long did this effort take? to get anything specific in the integrations were, you know, functionality that that you might be able to highlight about this joint effort. >>Yeah, we've been working on for some time now because it's it's essential to really think from the ground up. And this is not just re platform ing our cloud solutions on AWS. It is rethinking the whole architecture so that we really are organically taking advantage of infrastructure services that AWS provides. So it is a really deep integration. And it's not only a technical tech, integration is the strategic partnership, and you're going to see a lot more now that's coming from both of us about the integration capabilities we're bringing together and a lot of the work we're going to be doing to continue to bring innovation to our joint customers. >>Excellent. You made reference to the pandemic. Uh, what are you hearing from your customers? How does this new offering impact them and support them both? Today is they're reacting to what happens as well as you know, going forward as we progress. >>Yes. Do you know the coveted 19 pandemic really exposed fault line in government programs that weren't scale to meet this demand. We saw website crashing when people were going to them and just overwhelming them with questions about the health situation. We saw benefits programs that only works where people could come in and sign up in a fly in person and obviously with government offices shut down, that wasn't an option. And a lot of government workers were sent home to tell a work without much notice, and their infrastructure just couldn't support it. And so just in general, there are a lot of breakdown along the way. But the good news is that a lot of public sector organizations and programs making that pivot quickly. For example, we worked with one state agency that experienced a 400% spikes in demand for applications for unemployment benefits. It makes sense people are out of work. They need unemployment benefit. But they just couldn't respond to that kind of surging demand. So we worked with them along with AWS and in less than a week stood up a virtual contact center with chatbots so that could meet the demand and provide those vital services to their residents at a time of real needs. So there's a lot to the optimistic about in the middle of this crisis, there is a lot of transformation happening. This kind of forcing function is producing a lot of innovation, transformation. And I think it's really going to make a fundamental shift in how we re imagined government in the future. >>Yeah. Okay, so you're absolutely right that this pandemic has shown a real spotlight on where you know what works and what doesn't, Um, and I think about not only government, but you know, a lot of how finances were often times you have your plans in place, you have your budgets in place. You have, you know, funding cycles. So you know what? What our sales force and Amazon doing to help those you talk about. They have to ramp things up a weight where they financially ready for this. Some companies Oh, wait. I have to temporarily dial things down. That's not in my 12 month or 36 month plan. So are there things that you're doing to help customers, you know, short term in and long term? Are you seeing some? Some change in how people think about their planning and how they could be ready for what change happens out there. >>Yeah, you know, one of the big findings from this whole experience, not just in the public sector but across every industry has been that digital transformation may in the past has been viewed as a nice to have. It is now really the only way to connect and serve both customers and employees, and so digital First, digital transformation is rapidly becoming an urgent imperative because this situation is is not going away overnight. And even when we get back to some state of normal, it's going to be different. It's a digital first and being able to move quickly to roll out services rapidly, to be able to start small and then scale rapidly. These are things that benefit any organization, whether it's government or commercial. >>Excellent. Okay, so I'll let you have the final word. What people want. What you want people to have is their take away of salesforce is participation in the AWS public sector online event. >>We are just so excited to be here with AWS to jointly come to our customers with govcloud plus the fed ramp. I authorized environment for the best in class theory, M and customer and employee services. Our partnership with AWS is one that we're excited about. You're going to see a lot more announcements coming to. It's not only a technology integration, it's also a strategic partnership. And we think our customers jointly. Just going to be really excited about the development. So thank you for the time and glad to be here. >>All right, well, thank you so much. Casey. Congratulations on the government cloud plus launch. And absolutely look forward to hearing more about it. >>Thank you. >>Alright. Be sure to stay tuned. Lots more coverage of the Cube at AWS Public Sector Summit online. I'm Stew Minimum. And thank you for watching the Cube. >>Yeah, Yeah, yeah, yeah.

>>from around the globe. It's the queue with digital coverage of AWS Public sector online brought to you by Amazon Web services. >>Everyone welcome back to the Cube's coverage of AWS Public sector summit. Virtual, of course, is the Cube virtual. We're here sheltered in place in our quarantine studio. I'm John Furrier, host of the Cube. Got a great guest here? Cube Alumni. Can Eisner, Who's the director of worldwide education programs for AWS Amazon Web services? Ken, great to see you. Thanks for coming on. This could be a great segment. Looking forward to chatting. >>Thanks so much, John. Great to talk to you again. >>You know, I'll say, Cube Virtual public sector summit Virtual. We've been virtualized as a society. I'll see the pandemic and all the things that is going on around has been pretty crazy. And one of the things that's most notable is the impact on Education. New York Times This morning and many published reports around the impact College education. Not only economics on the campus aside, the state of the people in the society and Covert 19 is pushed schooling online for the foreseeable future. What's your reaction is you're in charge you've done a lot of work on the foundational level to get Amazon educational programs out there. Take a minute to explain how how this has impacted you guys and your ability to bring that educational stuff to the to the foreseeable future. >>Yeah, the first thing I'd say is this This truly is an absolutely unprecedented time There. Move from virtual instruction. Excuse me from in person classroom instruction into the virtual world at such amazing scale, rapidity is something that educational institutions weren't ready for that couldn't be ready for at this time. We had to enter it with amazing lump levels of empathy for what was going on on the ground in K 12 schools and higher ed schools with our educational technology and publisher providers. So I think the first thing was we had or for the speed at which it happened, we did have to step back and look at what was going on. There are some changes that are happening in the immediacy, and there are some things that Corbett, 19 is has sped educational institutions around the world to look at. An AWS is working with those K 12 providers, higher educational providers teachers and so on on that switch, whether it's providing infrastructure that move into online learning, helping teachers as they prepare for this sort of new normal you some of examples of what has happen. We've been working with the University of Arizona. Help them stand up contact centers with the onset of of cove it and students and teachers. It's being pushed into their home environment or into virtual environments to give instruction to receive instruction. There have been a lot of calls that happen in virtual environments to staff to help them support this. And so we stood up with the University of Arizona and Amazon Amazon Connect help staff provide mobile solutions through the cell phone or computer for for students. >>I want to get your thoughts. Absolutely. I talked to Andy Jassy about this as well as well about agility. This is the Amazon wheelhouse, and you guys have gone into the I T world now developers. You went cloud native, you in that market. He won the enterprise I t market. But the reason why is that you took an old school outdated, antiquated system of I t and made it agile. That seems enough This is the country with Teresa and Andy about education in public sector. The modernization is happening, but there's also the triage and you guys have to do now in terms of getting people online. So what specifically are you doing to help education customers continue their instruction online? Because they still got to execute. They still need to provide this discussion around the fall window Coming up. You got to have the foundational things. I know you've done that, but it is hard. So what's the downstream triage when you come out of this mode of Okay, here you go. And how do you get people set up and then how they transform and re invent? >>Yeah, at this time, the disaster recovery from how do you get in that phase one with this immediate move was so prominent. And we're trying to work through that phase one and sort into sort of phase two delivery of education, which is you're moving with scale moving with agility into this world, speed and agility are really going to be the new normal for education. There were some advances that just weren't happening quick enough. Students should always have access to 24 7 learning, um, and access into that mobile arena. And they weren't having that several things that we did was we looked at our infrastructure were some of those key infrastructure elements that helped with both learning and work remotely. There were things such as Amazon, your work Doc's, which enables thieves virtual our workspaces, which enable virtual desktop environments, and appstream, which enables it APs to be streamed through virtual arena onto your removal or your desktop. Yeah, Amazon connect as I. As I mentioned before, there were services that were vital in helping speed into the cloud that was quick burst into the cloud. And so we enabled some of those services to have special promotional free rates or a given time period, and we have actually now extended that offer a into the fall into September 30th. So first we have to help people really quickly with educators. So I run this program AWS Educate, which is Amazon's global program. To provide students and educators around the world with resource is needed, help them get into cloud learning. But what we saw was that teachers around the world we're not prepared for this massive shift what we did to help that preparedness is we looked at our educators. We found that we did a survey over the weekend and found that 68% of them had significant experience or enough experience in teaching distance or online virtual education, too. Potentially leverage that for other educators around the world. So we and the other thing is teachers are really eager to help other teachers in this move, especially as they saw and they empathize with With her was the panic. Our confusion are best practices and moving into that online arena. So we saw both that they had that experience in a mass willingness to help other people, and we immediately spun up a Siri's of educator and educator help tools, whether it was a Morris Valadez are No a gift, and Doug Berman providing webinars and office hours for other educators around the world. We also did a separate tech talks offering for students. So there were there was the helping scale, whether it's getting blackboard as they ramped up to over 50 x of their normal load in 24 hours to help them deliver on that scale, whether it waas the Egyptian ministry that was trying to had to understand. How could they help students access the information that they need it in speed? And they worked with thinkI, which is a net educational technology provider, to provide access to 22 million students who needed to get access online or whether it was the educator mobilization initiative that we ran. Threat US of AWS Educate Helps Teachers have the resource is that they need it with the speed that they needed to get online. This is we are working. We're learning from our customers. As this happens, this is a moving target. But when I move from this immediacy of pushing people into the virtual space into what's gonna happen this summer, as students need toe recapture, learning that they might have lost in the spring are depending where you are worldwide. There's getting to your point all K 12 higher ed and educational technology providers into the position where they can act with that agility and speed. And it's also helping those educators as they go through this. We're learning from our customers every day. >>Yeah, I want to get into those some of those lessons, but one of things that will say, You know, I'm really bullish about what you do. Getting cloud education, I think, is going to change the literacy and also job opportunities out there. I'm a huge believer that public sector is the next growth wave, just like I t was. And it's almost the same movie, right? You have inadequate systems. It's all outdated. You need these workloads, need to run and then run effectively, which you guys have done. But the interesting thing with Cove it is it essentially exposes the scabs and the uh out there because, you know, online has been an augmentation to the physical space. So when you pull that back, people like me go, wait a minute. I have kids. I'm trying to understand their learning impact. Everyone sees it now. It's almost like it's exposed. Whether it's under provisioned VP ends or black boys networking and everyone's pointing their fingers. It's your fault and its the end. So you brought this up. There's now stakeholders whose jobs depend upon something that's now primary that wasn't primary before. Whether it's the presenter, the content presented the teacher certainly high availability. I t. Um >>all these things >>are just under huge pressure. So I gotta ask you, what are the key lessons and learnings that you have seen over the past few months that you could share because people are shell shocked and they're trying to move faster? >>Yeah. So first of all is speed and agility and education are the new normal. They should have been here for a while. They need to be here now when you've got a 30 year textbook, your ruling over education when students need to get the skills of tomorrow. Today we need to be adapting quickly in order to give those students the skills to give educational institution those opportunities. Every institution needs to be enable virtual education. Every institution needs to have disaster recovery solutions and they weren't in place. These solutions need to be comprehensive. Students need access to devices. Teachers need access to professional development. We need contact centers. We worked with Los Angeles Unified School District not just to stand up a contact center, which we did with yeah, Amazon connect. But we also connected their high school seniors too, with headphones. I think we provide 132,000 students with headphones. We are helping to source with through our Amazon business relationship devices for everybody. Every student needs access in their home. Every student needs access to great learning and they needed on demand. Teachers need that readiness. I think the other thing that's happening is the whole world is again speeding through changes that probably should have happened to the system already that virtual learning is vital. Another thing that's vital is lifelong learning. We're finding that and we probably should have already seen. This is everybody needs to be a student throughout their entire life, and they need to be streaming in and out of education. The only way that this could be properly done is through virtual environments through the cloud and through an access to on demand learning. We believe that this that the work that's being done I was actually talking to some people in Australia the other day and they're saying, You know, the government is moving away from degree centrist city and moving into a more modular stackable education. We've been building AWS educate to stack to the job to stack to careers, and that type of move into education, I think, is also being spent So were you were seeing the that move Apple absolutely accelerate. We're also seeing the need to accelerate the speed to research. Obviously with what's going on going on with Kobe 19 there is a need for tools to connect our researchers two cures to diagnostic, um, opportunities. We worked with the University of British Columbia, Vancouver General Hospital and the Vancouver I Get this thing, the Vancouver Coastal Health Research UNE Institute to develop to use Amazon sage maker to speed ai diagnostic tool so that pushed towards research is absolutely vital as well. We just announced a $20 million investment in helping you speak that that research to market so education needs to operate at scale education needs to operate at speed, and education needs to deliver to a changing customer. And we've got to be partners on that journey. >>And I think I would just add reinvent a word. You guys name your conference after every year. This is a re invention opportunity. Clearly, um, and you know, I was talking to some other parents is like, I'm not going to send my kids to school online learning for zoom interview, zoom, zoom, zoom classes. I'm like, Hey, you know, get a cloud data engineering degree from Amazon educate because they'll have a job like that. Once you put on linked in the job skills are out there. The jobs are needed. Skills aren't so. I got to ask you, you know, with this whole re Skilling, whether it's a Gap year student in between semesters, while this takes care of our up Skilling people on the job, this is huge world economic form said by 2020 half of the employees will need to be re skilled up skilled. This is a huge impact and even more focus with covert 19. >>That's absolutely correct. Yeah, I think one thing that's happening is we're cloud computing has been the number one Lincoln skill for the past four or five years. The the skill. Whether it's software development in the cloud cloud architecture, your data world, our cyber security and other operational rules, those are going to be in the most demand. Those are the skills that are growing. We need to be able prepare people for rules in technology. The lifelong worker, the re skill up skill opportunities, absolutely vital Gap year is going to be available for some students. But we also got a look at you know how the this that how covert 19 can accelerate gaps between students. Every student needs access to high quality education. Every teacher needs to be equipped with the latest professional development. We've got focused like a laser, not just on. The people could afford a gap. Here are the people who who are going to be some schools who actually had solutions that could immediately push there kids into their their youth, their students in college or even employees. You need those re skills. We're all home. But it also needs to extend into the middle of the middle of Los Angeles and and you're into low income students. And in Egypt, I was really excited. We we've been working with Northern Virginia community colleges as I think you know, they were one of the lead institutions. On launching an associate degree in the cloud, they took their courses and offer what they call a jump year to 70,000 high school senior. Our high school students in Northern Virginia in the northern Virginia area, including enabling some of our cloud computing horses, are the work courses that we worked on with them to the students. So yeah, those new partnerships, that extension of college into high school and college into re skill up skills, absolutely vital. But institutions need to be able to move fast with the tools that the cloud provides you into those arena. >>Well, you know, I think you've got a really hard job to do there. It's foundational in love, what you're doing and you know me. I've been harping people who watch the Cube know that I'm always chirping and talking about how the learning is non linear. It's horizontally scalable. There's different application. You can have an application for education. It's a Siri's of different things. The workload of learning is completely different. I think to me what you guys are doing right now setting that basics foundation infrastructure. It's like the E. C two s three model. Then you got more on top of it platform, and I think ultimately the creativity is going to come from the marketplace. Whoever can build those workloads in a very agile, scalable way to meet the needs, because, let's face it, it can't be boring. Education is gonna be robust, resilient and got to deliver the payload and that's gonna be customized applications that have yet to be invented. Reinvented >>absolutely. Hopefully were jump starting that next wave of innovation spreading the opportunities Teoh all students. Hopefully we are really looking at those endemic issues and education and following leaders like University of Arizona. What the Ministry of Education, um in in Egypt has done and Northern Virginia community. Hopefully we are really taking this the opportunity of this disaster to invent on behalf of our students. Bring in you forward to the 21st century as opposed to yeah, just looking at this naval gazing way we do wrong and the past. This is an exciting opportunity, albeit a obviously scary one is we're all dealing with this with this and >>there's no doubt once we've retrenching and get some solid ground postcode 19. It's a reinvention and a reimagine growth market opportunity because you got changing technology, changing economics and changing expectations and experiences that are needed. These are three major things going down right now. >>Absolutely, absolutely. And to your point, the retraining of workers, the up skill that the great thing is that governments realize this imperative as do educational institutions and obviously yet students. This is, and we seem like what educators can do when they want to help. Yeah, other educators, this is This is an opportunity in our society to really look at every everybody is a constant learner were a constant learning from our customers. But everybody, there is no end to education. It cannot be terminal. And this is an opportunity to really provide the students learners with skills that they need in an on demand fashion at all times and re think re innovate, reinvent the way we look at education in general. >>Well, a man, Jeff Bezos says Day one. It's a new day, one, right? So you know that there is going to reinvent Ken. You doing great work. Director of worldwide education programs Ken Eisner with Amazon Web services, Certifications and degrees and cloud computing will be the norm. It's gonna happen again. If you're a cloud data engineer. Data says you're going to get a job. I mean, no doubt about it. So thanks so much for sharing your insights. Really appreciate it. Thank you, >>John. Thank you very much for your time. I appreciate it. >>Can guys They're here Inside the Cube. Virtual coverage of AWS Public sector Online Summit. We've been virtualized. I'm John Furrier, your host. Thanks for watching. Yeah, >>Yeah, yeah, yeah.

>> Announcer: From around the globe, it's theCUBE with digital coverage of AWS Public Sector Online. Brought to you by Amazon Web Services. >> Hi, I'm Stu Miniman and this is theCUBE's coverage of AWS Public Sector's Summit Online. We've done this show for many years, of course, this time it's online rather than in person in the District of Washington, D.C. Happy to welcome to the program first time guest, a very good partner of AWS's, from Salesforce, it's Casey Coleman. She is the Senior Vice President of Global Government Solutions, once again, with Salesforce. Casey, thanks so much for joining us. >> Stu, thank you, glad to be here. >> All right, so first of all maybe, if you could, give us a little bit of level set, your role at Salesforce and obviously a long partnership with Amazon. Tell us a little bit about that. >> Yes, my role at Salesforce is to work with our customers in the public sector, globally, and really help them map out their digital transformation. You know, it's an ongoing journey and we help them understand how to break that down into actionable steps and really transform what they're doing to server their constituents and citizens better. >> Excellent, so of course, at the Public Sector Show a lot about leverage of GovCloud and the other services, all of the compliance that goes into that. Ahead of this event, you had a new update at Salesforce in partnership with AWS. Talk to us about it's the Government Cloud Plus. So what's entailed there? And tell us how AWS and Salesforce work together to launch this solution. >> Yeah, thanks Stu. We are so excited to announce the launch of GovCloud Plus which is Salesforce's Customer 360 CRM platform that runs on Amazon Web Services in the GovCloud in their GovCloud environment and we've just received a provisional APO provisional authority to operate from the FedRAMP Program office at the high security level. So we are announcing GovCloud Plus is FedRamp High, ready to go, generally available and ready for customers. >> Excellent, maybe bring us inside. What's different about how government agencies leverage Salesforce. For most companies out there, Salesforce is a critical piece of how they manage not only their sales force but marketing and lots of other pieces, anything specific that we should understand about the public sector. >> Yeah, it's a great question because even our name, Salesforce, sounds like a commercial kind of thing to do. Governments don't think of themselves as selling, but if you break down to a level of detail about what governments actually do, it is the same kind of functions. It's case management, it's benefits delivery, it's communications and outreach, it's all the same kind of functions that are necessary for commercial organizations to thrive. And so that's what we do, we translate that into government-ready terms so that they can serve child welfare, health information delivery, patient records, farmer information, all kinds of services for constituents of the public sector. And they might call them customers, they might call them citizens, residents, constituents, but it's those they serve. >> Yeah, well one of the things about Salesforce is, as you said, it's not just a sales tool, there's so much. You've got a very broad and deep ecosystem there as well as people that know how to use it. They get underneath the covers. When I think of not only is Salesforce the first company that I probably thought of and heard about that it was SaaS, but if you talk about the API economy, if you talk about how things integrate, Salesforce does a lot for developers. So I know one of the other pieces you had that everybody knows Dreamforce, maybe not as many people know the TrailheaDX Show that Salesforce just had for developers, so bring us a little bit inside what Salesforce is doing for developers and of course, the government angle along those lines, too. >> Yeah, there's a lot going on in the developer world. We were glad to be able to host a virtual version of our Trailhead Developer Conference and announce a lot of exciting, new developments, including Salesforce Anywhere which his really bringing an immersive voice, video, and chat environment to collaborate in the developer environment and in the delivery environment. And you bring that into the public sector and the benefits are amazing because one of the key challenges with government is keeping up with the pace of the public expectations at a pace of change in the commercial world. All of us shop and bank, and live on our mobile devices, and governments are being faced with the same expectations from the public to do anytime, anywhere, personalized service delivery. It's the (audio distortion) rapid development environment that Salesforce offers gives the public sector IT teams the ability to quickly respond to changing conditions like the COVID-19 pandemic, and rollout applications that are not only fast to develop and deploy, but they also benefit from being in the GovCloud environment, and so the compliance is already built in. And that's another key challenge that often arises, the public sector (audio distortion) is not only fielding new applications but making sure they're secure, and so with Salesforce, it's all built in. >> Yeah, it sounds a lot of system similarity to what we hear in the private sector. Of course, the balance between what IT is doing and how we enable developers. Of course, security, you mentioned, is super important. Anything, specifically, from the government sector that you'd say might be different from what we see in the general enterprise world? >> You know, the security is top of mind for the public sector, always, because they're dealing with the most sensitive data. They're dealing with the public trust. And trust is really the currency of government. They're not dealing in profit and market share, but they are dealing in a public trust and protecting information like financial data, health data, personal data, and so it's essential that the government has the best in class commercial tools to make sure they are providing world class security for their constituents and their mission. And that's one reason we're so excited to be partnering with AWS on GovCloud Plus because Amazon AWS has already deployed the FedRAMP High version of their infrastructures and service, and so by riding on top of that, we inherit all of those existing controls, add our own FedRAMP High controls, and our customers benefit from the best in class security from two of the most trusted names in the Public Cloud. >> Great, you know, absolutely, GovCloud has been a real boon for the entire industry when it talks about how government agencies are leveraging Cloud. You talked about sitting on top of GovCloud, the Government Cloud Plus leverages some of the certifications and the like. Can you bring us inside a little bit? How long did this effort take to get? Anything specific in the integrations or functionality that you might be able to highlight about this joint effort? >> Yeah we've been working on it for some time now, because it's essential to really think from the ground, up. And this is really not just re-platforming our Cloud solutions on AWS, it is rethinking the whole architecture so that we really are organically taking advantage of infrastructure services that AWS provides. So it is a really deep integration. And it's not only a tech integration, it's a strategic partnership too, and you're going to see a lot more announcements coming from both of us about the integration, the capabilities we're bringing together. And a lot of the work we're going to be doing continue to bring innovation to our joint customers. >> Excellent. You made reference to the pandemic. What are you hearing from your customers? How does this new offering impact them and support them both, today, as they're reacting to what happens as well as going forward, as we progress? >> Yeah, Stu, you know, the COVID-19 pandemic really exposed a fault line in government programs that weren't scaled to meet this demand. We saw Websites crashing when people were going to them, and just overwhelming them with questions about the health situation. We saw benefits programs that only worked when people could come in and sign up and apply in person, and obviously, with government offices shut down, that wasn't an option. And a lot of government workers were sent home to tele-work without much notice, and their infrastructure just couldn't support it. And so just in general, there was a lot of breakdowns along the way. But the good news is that a lot of public sector organizations and programs are making that pivot quickly. For example, we worked with one state agency that experienced a 400% spike in demand for applications for unemployment benefits. It makes sense. People are out of work, they need unemployment benefits, but they just couldn't respond to that kind of surge in demand. So we worked with them along with AWS and in less than a week, stood up a virtual contact center with chatbot so they could meet the demand and provide those vital services for their residents at a time of real need. So there's a lot to be optimistic about in the middle of this crisis; there is a lot of transformation happening. This kind of forcing function is producing a lot of innovation and transformation and I think it's really going to make a fundamental shift in how we reimagine government in the future. >> Yeah, Casey, you're absolutely right. This pandemic has shown a real spotlight on what works and what doesn't. And I think about not only government, but a lot of how finances work. Oftentimes, you have your plans in place, you have your budgets in place, you have funding cycles, so what are Salesforce and Amazon doing to help those customers? You talk about they have to ramp things up. Oh wait, were they financially ready for this? Some companies, "Oh wait, I have to temporarily "dial things down that's not in my 12-month "or 36-month plan." So are there things that you're doing to help customers short-term and long-term? Are you seeing some change in how people think about their planning and how they can be ready for what change happens out there? >> Yeah, one of the big findings from this while experience, not just in the public sector, but across every industry, has been that digital transformation may, in the past, have been viewed as a nice-to-have. It is now really the only way to connect and serve both the customers and employees, and so digital first, digital transformation is rapidly becoming an urgent imperative because this situation is not going away overnight. And even when we get back to some state of normal, it's going to be different. And so digital first and being able to move quickly to rollout services rapidly, to be able to start small and then scale rapidly, these are things that benefit any organization, whether it's government or commercial. >> Excellent, well Casey, I'll let you have the final word what you want people to have as their takeaway of Salesforce's participation in the AWS Private Sector Online Event. >> We are just so excited to be here with AWS to jointly come to our customers with GovCloud Plus, the FedRAMP High authorized environment for the best in class CRM, and customer and employee services. Our partnership with AWS is one that we're excited about. You're going to see a lot more announcements coming soon. It's not only a technology integration, it's also a strategic partnership, and we think our customers are, jointly, just going to be really excited about the development. So thank you for the time and glad to be here. >> All right, well thank you so much, Casey. Congratulations on the Government Cloud Plus launch and absolutely look forward to hearing more about it in the future. >> Thank you, Stu. >> All right, be sure to stay tuned. Lots more coverage of theCUBE at AWS Public Sector Summit Online. I'm Stu Miniman and thank you for watching theCUBE. (soft electronic music)

>> Narrator: From around the globe, it's theCUBE! Covering HPE Discover Virtual Experience. Brought to you by HPE. >> Welcome back, I'm Stu Miniman, and this is theCUBE's coverage of HPE Discover 2020 the Virtual Experience, really happy to welcome to the program, we have a returning guest. Tarkan Maner is the Chief Commercial Officer at Nutanix, in a new role since the last time we had him on the program, and joining him, we have Herman Brown, who's the CIO for the City of San Francisco's District Attorney. Gentlemen, thank you so much for joining us. >> Thank you for having me. >> So, Tarkan, help set the stage for us. As I mentioned, we know you, our network knows you, but, new to Nutanix in the last year, and talk to us a little bit about this HPE Nutanix partnership. >> Yeah, if you noticed, first of all, thank you for hosting us, great to be here. This is probably, who knows, my fiftieth CUBE I guess, over the past two decades, especially the last twenty years have been crazy for us, obviously in the industry, lots of movement, lots of change. So let me go into the context, that led to Nutanix joining the company, about six months ago in the capacity of Chief Commercial Officer, a hybrid role with some product aspects, business development global market, our cloud infrastructure digitalizes and some of the Corp Dev we're working on. In that context, obviously, HPE is a very, very important strategic partner to us. As you know, the companies, the two companies have been working together for a long time, but especially the last, I would say, six to twelve months, we have this phenomenal relationship around what I call "three focused areas" of our business. Around our digital infrastructure, upward converge infrastructure, a business on top of that, our solutions from data center to DevOps and to this stuff, services, it's three specific segments, we built this really interesting really strong relationship with HPE with some of our philosophies and HPE's platform, now obviously, working through a multicloud channel, who are our own Nutanix cloud, our own hosted cloud, in addition to it, our Telco and SSP partners using their cloud infrastructure as well as some of the hyperscaling work we're doing, with Azure, AWS in addition to our direct SalesForce and private cloud approach, HPE and Nutanix are working hand in hand in this multicloud so to speak operating model. So it's a new relationship in some ways, from a multicloud perspective, but if it has to grow in segments, we had a phenomenal quarter in the last three months, we just released our results, and HPE is growing for us. And we're given definitely a great suite of solutions to our customers with the typical usual, simple to deploy, simple to use mechanics customer delight on the HPE platform. So I'm sure we've got a whole lot more, but glad to be here also with Herman Brown, from the DA's office in San Francisco, my favorite city in the world, so glad to be here. Thank you, Stu, again, for hosting us. >> Great, thanks so much, Tarkan. You know, Herman, we're going to get into a lot of the technology pieces, you with your CIO hat on, you know, want to understand how cloud, how modern infrastructure, your applications are changing, but, give us a little bit about your personal background and really the purview that you cover in the city of San Francisco District Attorney's office. >> Yes, well, you know, I've been with the DA's office for just over 3 years, it'll be 4 years I guess in August of this year, and I come from twenty plus years of private sector experience, some government experience. And, you know, the city and county, the government is really no different than any other organization other than we're known to be a little bit slower to adopt the technologies, which is why I'm here. I want to help government become more efficient, more productive through the use of technology, and so I'm excited to be here and thank you, first and foremost, for having me on the show. I appreciate it. >> I love that you brought that up, because we've been doing theCUBE for just over a decade now, and in the early parts of that, it's like, right, okay, I'm talking to a local government, we understand, your budgets are tight, you're using older technology, you've got duct tape and baling wire to keep things going. The last few years, some of my favorite conversations have been in the public sector, because you talk about some of the tools that are out there, and don't need a huge capital investment to get started, I can modernize, so Herman, digital transformation, is that a term that you've brought from the private sector over to the public sector, or what kind of transformations are you going through and what is it that's I guess driving the need for transformation in your world? >> So yeah, I've been with the city and county of San Francisco for nine years, so I'd love to say that I brought digital transformation or at least the term with me, but I was actually here in the DA's office or in the city and county's employment when that terminology came out. Being the CIO for the San Francisco District Attorney's office, I mean, we're essentially a law firm. And law firms are historically just paper intensive organizations, right, you have court filings and rap sheets, all these physical documents that have to be physically ink signed and transferred from one attorney to another to the courts, and between police departments and sheriffs and so forth and so on. And we just looked at, what are we doing, how can we work more efficient, you know? As a lot of organizations, we're always finding ourselves to be understaffed for the amount of work that we have going on, the city and county of San Francisco, the DA's office, we see roughly 26,000 cases a year, we try about half of those cases per year. And we're a staff of 320 people. That includes everyone, the attorneys, the paralegals, finance folks, IT, investigators. And so it was like, we need to really embrace technology and be able to help transform this paper intensive processes into automated, digital forms and documents that can minimize the physical transferring of data, especially now, during Covid-19. >> Yeah, Herman, that transformation process is often multi-step, there's a lot of people, there's technology, and then there's the applications. It was at a Nutanix show that the comment I made is, well, let's modernize the platform, then you can modernize the applications on top of it. Tarkan, maybe, I'd love to hear just a little commentary from you, you've got a great perspective on this. That modernization effort, where your customers are, some of the levers that Nutanix is helping them along that journey. >> Yeah, so everything Herman said is very interesting, and obviously, a delight to my ears, because as a technologist in the industry for the past three decades, we're dealing with this, what I call, transformational waves, and you know, in the last ten years, the cloud transformation from the server to transition transformation now, increasingly, we're seeing this very fast migrations from the old school legacy data centers with legacy infrastructure and apps, basically are lifting and shifting these applications to a new cloud, so to speak, opened the model. The cloud to us, in a sense, it's not a destination, it's an open model, so if we see the customer's needs at the end of the day, just like Herman outlined, Herman is not trying to do cloud or digitization for the digital cloud's sake, he's trying to lead his team and the DA's office, with the most DAs by the way, in the nation, making sure that they can process data faster. They can achieve their goals, working especially in this post-pandemic world, and the entire change that are happening in our country, in a big way over the past few weeks, the events, and how our country is going to change for the future. So there's going to be a lot of work going to be happening in the government, this transformation or digitization, migration to the cloud, is going to be a big deal, so as a company, it very quickly we've seen this as a huge opportunity for our customers, as we're partnering with them in a multi cloud way. We still believe our server partners are super important in this context with HPE, but the cloud services around HPE Greenlake, the things we are doing with them, at the same time, working with HPE and some of our partners delivering our own Nutanix cloud services as well as some of the things we have been doing with some of Telco's and service providers, to give choice to our customers to consume the services we provide on-prem, through our old cloud services through a third party telephone service provider, or the choice of hyper scale into the U.S. As your Google, unlimited oracle. So in this context this partnership is hugely important, so there's a lot going on with HPE with Antonio, with our CEO, with Tarak, our CFO, with Tom Black, it's Sonali. The entire executive team are working very closely with them, and with Hyko in the fuel organization, our fuel organization, and we really cherish customers like the DA's office who are doing the transformation, who are leading the transformation, during this pandemic and during this massive change in our country and hopefully it's going to make a transformative change to our world in terms of obviously not only technology, but social change, so you see this as a transformative time frame for companies like us and HPE and partners like Herman and DA's office. >> Herman, please! >> Yeah, I was just going to say, and absolutely I agree with Tarkan, and the way that we're able to react so quickly to this pandemic is the fact that we've already have started this digital transformation, that we've already been looking at these cloud services, we've already started down this path, and so it's made the transition with this surging overnight change of the office nine to five, five days a week to you know, everyone is remote every day now, we couldn't do that without having these cloud services such as Nutanix and HPE partnership, to make that possible. >> Yeah, is there something specific you talk, the work from home initiative, did you have to scale something out, did you have to, you know, bring us inside that change that helped enable your workforce that you wouldn't have been able to do without this technology. >> Yeah, we absolutely had to scale out the workforce. I would say that before the beginning of this pandemic, we had roughly 15 people that probably had VPN access from outside the office, now you have to also understand that the DA's office is very unique in the form of the types of data that we handle and deal with, so I have HIPPA data, I have CJIS, which is criminal justice information, that's managed by DOJ, so there are certain systems that we normally would not be able to access from outside the office that we had to be able to access now remotely. And so it's taken some time to get us there to that point, but you know, having this environment that allowed us to scale up easily, start looking at digitizing this process and being able to have the storage and compute and processing power to be able to support that initiative is really what we're talking about, and that's what we've been doing. We've been quickly scaling, adding in additional storage but popping in drives and making this all possible in a very quickly and seamlessly process. >> Excellent. Maybe we've talked a little bit about the results and how you can move faster, you know, digital information all about leveraging your data and be able to react more quickly, so you know, the pandemic definitely has put services to the test and it sounds like they're doing well. Maybe step us back a little bit as to what led you to HPE and Nutanix, how you made that decision. >> Well, you know, we went through a trial, a period, proof of concept, we looked at Dell, we looked at HPE and Nutanix, we looked at a few different solutions, and it really boiled down to cost, and what we were getting, bang for the dollar. I think there are some other great solutions out there or good solutions out there but none of them came to the value that the partnership with HPE and Nutanix actually have to offer to us. You know, one of the things is that with this partnership is when there's a support issue, I call Nutanix, I'm not calling HPE, I'm not calling this, the other third party vendor, I'm not getting the runaround of "oh, that's not our problem, that's someone else's problem, you need to call the software team, you need to call the hardware team," no. It's one person that you know, we call, as I like to say, "one throat to choke." And fortunately, we haven't had to go that route, Nutanix has been an excellent partner for ours and they have been great to work with, and on the ball, and that's what I always talk about, success is not just the success of the organization, but the success of the individuals and the success of the partnership between organizations. And that's what I looked for is a business partner that wants to help me at my role at my organization be successful. >> Great. Herman, we talked about modernizing the environment, bring us inside the applications, if you would, what applications you're using, you know, are there new initiatives that you're doing from an application standpoint? >> Yeah, so we're running the same standard applications that most organizations are running, with DHCPISS, you know, I have some other systems that we run just because of the CIO, CICA hat that I also wear within the organization, I'm very security conscious about talking about those applications. But we run pretty much the same basic applications as most organizations do. Those specialized applications that we also operate on, we do see an improvement in performance, we do see the speediness of the access, the more stability and reliability of the solutions, and so we're very pleased with the performance that we're getting. >> Excellent. You also, you talked about the efficiency of what you're doing. I mentioned earlier that, public sector, you can get started, you know, for smaller chunks using things like Nutanix, but budget, obviously, still a concern, I'm sure, anything you're doing with the verbalization in the infrastructure that is helping you keep budget under control? >> Absolutely, I mean, the Nutanix environment is scalable, it allows us to be able to look at other solutions such as CDI, which we're talking about and looking at, potentially doing for staff members that don't have laptops that may need laptops or need remote access into the system. We also have that ability to scale up with just another leg, more storage, it makes it very easy to go with where you're looking at cost-saving measures, currently running BMWare on the back end, but looking to convert that over AHV, yes, in the future, that can also help us reduce those costs in the future as well. Especially at this point in time, where city and county is looking for department budget savings. >> Excellent. Tarkan, I guess this would be a good point for you to chime in on, you know, generally, AHV and any other commentary you've got regarding-- >> I was just trying to hold my words back, because the things that Herman is doing are so exciting in a way, you know, techies like myself still get really excited. Like Herman talked about we're not doing infrastructure for infrastructure's sake. At the end of the day, Herman and his office like many government offices both in the fed as in state or local, have to do more with less. Obviously in this post-pandemic world, you get even more efficient, more innovative, and get most output from our input. In that context, bringing storage, compute, networking, all integrated in a converged way, it's smart, it's not just adding them up, one plus one plus one equals three, but one plus one plus one equals less than one, in terms of cost, making it make sure it's infrastructures are simplified, easy to deploy, easy to use, that's why we keep an NPS score of 90, by the way, part of the reason, a little bit of shameless plug there for you. I don't know many companies who have an NPS 90 because we make infrastructure simple. So if you settle this, to Herman's point, all those applications he's managing and building and then obviously digitizing, and in some way, lifting a shifting and creating a new cloud digitized model, he want to make sure Herman and companies and organizations like the DA's office under leadership, with innovative CIOs like Herman, making sure they have choice. They can choose the prem model they want, on-prem, off-prem, hybrid, or multicloud, or in a government cloud fashion, and deliver these services. To give you an example, we talked about home as the extended enterprise. Our home office is now part of the office. I have to secure my home the way I secure my Nutanix headquarters because I'm now running my business from home. So in the past, there was a delineation between home and office. Now home is part of the extended office. The way I manage my trash, the way I manage my peer flows, applications, the network, latency, everything has to be dealt with in a very smart way. But even our paper trash in our office, we manage it carefully because of the IP, you know, people steal IP. Guess what, now at home, I have to have the same vigor. Guess what, you know, DA's office, the things that Herman is dealing with, they have to be so careful, not only in the office, but at home. So in that sense, that's the better service, your two desktops, all these new technologies I'm going to deal with in this simple way. Our new solution, all requires a browser, that's it, and no deliver a browser-based application, integration, to home, in a secure way, the things that we've been praying for for a long, long time. So this post-pandemic world is going to make us more agile, is going to make us more efficient, and hopefully we're going to do much more with less. >> Excellent, well, Herman, I have one more question for you, if you can, give us a little bit of a look forward. We always love to hear from a CIO just, number one, what's on your plate, and as you look at this solution, what you'll be using it for and going, and secondly, if you've got anything, if you could have something more that the ecosystem, maybe HPE and Nutanix, or maybe just in general from the ecosystem out there, that would make your life and your staff's easier. >> Well, you know, that's a great question. We have over 30 projects on our project list right now that are active projects that's going on. I have a staff of 9 IT professionals with three open positions, so I should say, 9, I have six, actual staff members with three open positions, currently, and we're on a hiring freeze. So one of the great things about the Nutanix HP solution has been that I've been able to downsize from the two systems engineer to the one system engineer without necessarily losing any bandwidth or knowledge or experience because the environment is so easy to manage, which has been great. We will continue to move forward with the digitization of our records and utilizing the cloud services that are available, through the various channels, and it's just an unprecedented time. I see that this is going to be the new norm. >> Excellent, so Tarkan, we'll let you put the exclamation point on it, give us the final takeaway for HPE and Nutanix. >> So, look, at the end of the day, we are in this new software defined growth and multicloud fashion having a partnership within two companies which covers data center services, DevOps services, as well as end user services, end to end, both in private clouds, also in a multicloud fashion, through telco as well as hyperscalers and Azure, deliver the service, with the open end model the customer chooses. Again, end to end, from data center, to DevOps, to end user, is the perfect marriage that HPE and Nutanix's relationship delivers. So we are really looking forward to working with customers like Herman, to deliver on that dream, on that journey, making sure that cloud migration and cloud consolidation happens efficiently end to end. Again, from the data center, to DevOps, to end user, all the way in a fashion that we do more with less in this post-pandemic world, and we're looking forward to that partnership as we move forward, and thank you Stu and thank you, Herman, for the time today. >> Excellent, well, Tarkan Maner, always a pleasure to catch up with you, really great to get all the update from you and really appreciate HPE and Nutanix bringing us Herman Brown, CIO, Herman, thank you so much for joining us, really appreciate you sharing your story, hopefully, you'll be able to open up and hire those three people that you're looking to hire in your future. Thank you both so much for joining us. >> Thank you, thank you very much for having me, Tarkan, it's always a pleasure, thanks Nutanix and HPE for just making a solid, great solution that can help in the success of the DA's office. Really do appreciate it. >> Thank you so much, Herman, again, I really appreciate it. >> We'll be back with more coverage from HPE Discover 2020, the Virtual Experience. I'm Stu Miniman, thank you, as always, for watching theCUBE. (gentle music)

>> Narrator: From around the globe, it's theCUBE! Covering HPE Discover Virtual Experience. Brought to you by HPE. >> Welcome back, I'm Stu Miniman, and this is theCUBE's coverage of HPE Discover 2020 the Virtual Experience, really happy to welcome to the program, we have a returning guest. Tarkan Maner is the Chief Commercial Officer at Nutanix, in a new role since the last time we had him on the program, and joining him, we have Herman Brown, who's the CIO for the City of San Francisco's District Attorney. Gentlemen, thank you so much for joining us. >> Thank you for having me. >> So, Tarkan, help set the stage for us. As I mentioned, we know you, our network knows you, but, new to Nutanix in the last year, and talk to us a little bit about this HPE Nutanix partnership. >> Yeah, if you noticed, first of all, thank you for hosting us, great to be here. This is probably, who knows, my fiftieth CUBE I guess, over the past two decades, especially the last twenty years have been crazy for us, obviously in the industry, lots of movement, lots of change. So let me go into the context, that led to Nutanix joining the company, about six months ago in the capacity of Chief Commercial Officer, a hybrid role with some product aspects, business development global market, our cloud infrastructure digitalizes and some of the Corp Dev we're working on. In that context, obviously, HPE is a very, very important strategic partner to us. As you know, the companies, the two companies have been working together for a long time, but especially the last, I would say, six to twelve months, we have this phenomenal relationship around what I call "three focused areas" of our business. Around our digital infrastructure, upward converge infrastructure, a business on top of that, our solutions from data center to DevOps and to this stuff, services, it's three specific segments, we built this really interesting really strong relationship with HPE with some of our philosophies and HPE's platform, now obviously, working through a multicloud channel, who are our own Nutanix cloud, our own hosted cloud, in addition to it, our Telco and SSP partners using their cloud infrastructure as well as some of the hyperscaling work we're doing, with Azure, in addition to our direct sales floors and private cloud approach, HPE and Nutanix are working hand in hand in this multicloud so to speak operative model. So it's a new relationship in some ways, from a multicloud perspective, but if it has to grow in segments, we had a phenomenal quarter in the last three months, we just released our results, and HPE is growing with us. And we're given definitely a great suite of solutions to our customers with the typical usual, simple to deploy, simple to use mechanics customers like on the HPE platform. So I'm sure we've got a whole lot more, but glad to be here also with Herman Brown, from the DA's office in San Francisco, my favorite city in the world, so glad to be here. Thank you, Stu, again, for hosting us. >> Great, thanks so much, Tarkan. You know, Herman, we're going to get into a lot of the technology pieces, you with your CIO hat on, you know, want to understand how cloud, how modern infrastructure, your applications are changing, but, give us a little bit about your personal background and really the purview that you cover in the city of San Francisco District Attorney's office. >> Yes, well, you know, I've been with the DA's office for just over 3 years, it'll be 4 years I guess in August of this year, and I come from twenty plus years of private sector experience, some government experience. And, you know, the city and county, the government is really no different than any other organization other than we're known to be a little bit slower to adopt the technologies, which is why I'm here. I want to help government become more efficient, more productive through the use of technology, and so I'm excited to be here and thank you, first and foremost, for having me on the show. I appreciate it. >> I love that you brought that up, because we've been doing theCUBE for just over a decade now, and in the early parts of that, it's like, right, okay, I'm talking to a local government, we understand, your budgets are tight, you're using older technology, you've got duct tape and baling wire to keep things going. The last few years, some of my favorite conversations have been in the public sector, because you talk about some of the tools that are out there, and don't need a huge capital investment to get started, I can modernize, so Herman, digital transformation, is that a term that you've brought from the private sector over to the public sector, or what kind of transformations are you going through and what is it that's I guess driving the need for transformation in your world? >> So yeah, I've been with the city and county of San Francisco for nine years, so I'd love to say that I brought digital transformation or at least the term with me, but I was actually here in the DA's office or in the city and county's employment when that terminology came out. Being the CIO for the San Francisco District Attorney's office, I mean, we're essentially a law firm. And law firms are historically just paper intensive organizations, right, you have court filings and rap sheets, all these physical documents that have to be physically ink signed and transferred from one attorney to another to the courts, and between police departments and sheriffs and so forth and so on. And we just looked at, what are we doing, how can we work more efficient, you know? As a lot of organizations, we're always finding ourselves to be understaffed for the amount of work that we have going on, the city and county of San Francisco, the DA's office, we see roughly 26,000 cases a year, we try about half of those cases per year. And we're a staff of 320 people. That includes everyone, the attorneys, the paralegals, finance folks, IT, investigators. And so it was like, we need to really embrace technology and be able to help transform this paper intensive processes into automated, digital forms and documents that can minimize the physical transferring of data, especially now, during Covid-19. >> Yeah, Herman, that transformation process is often multi-step, there's a lot of people, there's technology, and then there's the applications. It was at a Nutanix show that the comment I made is, well, let's modernize the platform, then you can modernize the applications on top of it. Tarkan, maybe, I'd love to hear just a little commentary from you, you've got a great perspective on this. That modernization effort, where your customers are, some of the levers that Nutanix is helping them along that journey. >> Yeah, so everything Herman said is very interesting, and obviously, a delight to my ears, because as a technologist in the industry for the past three decades, we're dealing with this, what I call, transformational waves, and you know, in the last ten years, the cloud transformation from the server to transition transformation now, increasingly, we're seeing this very fast migrations from the old school legacy data centers with legacy infrastructure and apps, basically are lifting and shifting these applications to a new cloud, so to speak, opened the model. The cloud to us, in a sense, it's not a destination, it's an open model, so if we see the customer's needs at the end of the day, just like Herman outlined, Herman is not trying to do cloud or digitization for the digital cloud's sake, he's trying to lead his team and the DA's office, with the most DAs by the way, in the nation, making sure that they can process data faster. They can achieve their goals, working especially in this post-pandemic world, and the entire change that are happening in our country, in a big way over the past few weeks, the events, and how our country is going to change for the future. So there's going to be a lot of work going to be happening in the government, this transformation or digitization, migration to the cloud, is going to be a big deal, so as a company, it very quickly we've seen this as a huge opportunity for our customers, as we're partnering with them in a multi cloud way. We still believe our server partners are super important in this context with HPE, but the cloud services around HPE Greenlake, the things we are doing with them, at the same time, working with HPE and some of our partners delivering our own Nutanix cloud services as well as some of the things we have been doing with some of Telco's and service providers, to give choice to our customers to consume the services we provide on-prem, through our old cloud services through a third party telephone service provider, or the choice of hyper scale into the U.S. As your Google, unlimited oracle. So in this context this partnership is hugely important, so there's a lot going on with HPE with Antonio, with our CEO, with Tarak, our CFO, with Tom Black, it's Sonali. The entire executive team are working very closely with them, and with Hyko in the fuel organization, our fuel organization, and we really cherish customers like the DA's office who are doing the transformation, who are leading the transformation, during this pandemic and during this massive change in our country and hopefully it's going to make a transformative change to our world in terms of obviously not only technology, but social change, so you see this as a transformative time frame for companies like us and HPE and partners like Herman and DA's office. >> Herman, please! >> Yeah, I was just going to say, and absolutely I agree with Tarak, and the way that we're able to react so quickly to this pandemic is the fact that we've already have started this digital transformation, that we've already been looking at these cloud services, we've already started down this path, and so it's made the transition with this surging overnight change of the office nine to five, five days a week to you know, everyone is remote every day now, we couldn't do that without having these cloud services such as Nutanix and HPE partnership, to make that possible. >> Yeah, is there something specific you talk, the work from home initiative, did you have to scale something out, did you have to, you know, bring us inside that change that helped enable your workforce that you wouldn't have been able to do without this technology. >> Yeah, we absolutely had to scale out the workforce. I would say that before the beginning of this pandemic, we had roughly 15 people that probably had VPN access from outside the office, now you have to also understand that the DA's office is very unique in the form of the types of data that we handle and deal with, so I have HIPPA data, I have CJIS, which is criminal justice information, that's managed by DOJ, so there are certain systems that we normally would not be able to access from outside the office that we had to be able to access now remotely. And so it's taken some time to get us there to that point, but you know, having this environment that allowed us to scale up easily, start looking at digitizing this process and being able to have the storage and compute and processing power to be able to support that initiative is really what we're talking about, and that's what we've been doing. We've been quickly scaling, adding in additional storage but popping in drives and making this all possible in a very quickly and seamlessly process. >> Excellent. Maybe we've talked a little bit about the results and how you can move faster, you know, digital information all about leveraging your data and be able to react more quickly, so you know, the pandemic definitely has put services to the test and it sounds like they're doing well. Maybe step us back a little bit as to what led you to HPE and Nutanix, how you made that decision. >> Well, you know, we went through a trial, a period, proof of concept, we looked at Dell, we looked at HPE and Nutanix, we looked at a few different solutions, and it really boiled down to cost, and what we were getting, bang for the dollar. I think there are some other great solutions out there or good solutions out there but none of them came to the value that the partnership with HPE and Nutanix actually have to offer to us. You know, one of the things is that with this partnership is when there's a support issue, I call Nutanix, I'm not calling HPE, I'm not calling this, the other third party vendor, I'm not getting the runaround of "oh, that's not our problem, that's someone else's problem, you need to call the software team, you need to call the hardware team," no. It's one person that you know, we call, as I like to say, "one throat to choke." And fortunately, we haven't had to go that route, Nutanix has been an excellent partner for ours and they have been great to work with, and on the ball, and that's what I always talk about, success is not just the success of the organization, but the success of the individuals and the success of the partnership between organizations. And that's what I looked for is a business partner that wants to help me at my role at my organization be successful. >> Great. Herman, we talked about modernizing the environment, bring us inside the applications, if you would, what applications you're using, you know, are there new initiatives that you're doing from an application standpoint? >> Yeah, so we're running the same standard applications that most organizations are running, with DHCPISS, you know, I have some other systems that we run just because of the CIO, CICA hat that I also wear within the organization, I'm very security conscious about talking about those applications. But we run pretty much the same basic applications as most organizations do. Those specialized applications that we also operate on, we do see an improvement in performance, we do see the speediness of the access, the more stability and reliability of the solutions, and so we're very pleased with the performance that we're getting. >> Excellent. You also, you talked about the efficiency of what you're doing. I mentioned earlier that, public sector, you can get started, you know, for smaller chunks using things like Nutanix, but budget, obviously, still a concern, I'm sure, anything you're doing with the verbalization in the infrastructure that is helping you keep budget under control? >> Absolutely, I mean, the Nutanix environment is scalable, it allows us to be able to look at other solutions such as CDI, which we're talking about and looking at, potentially doing for staff members that don't have laptops that may need laptops or need remote access into the system. We also have that ability to scale up with just another leg, more storage, it makes it very easy to go with where you're looking at cost-saving measures, currently running BMWare on the back end, but looking to convert that over AHV, yes, in the future, that can also help us reduce those costs in the future as well. Especially at this point in time, where city and county is looking for department budget savings. >> Excellent. Tarkan, I guess this would be a good point for you to chime in on, you know, generally, AHV and any other commentary you've got regarding-- >> I was just trying to hold my words back, because the things that Herman is doing are so exciting in a way, you know, techies like myself still get really excited. Like Herman talked about we're not doing infrastructure for infrastructure's sake. At the end of the day, Herman and his office like many government offices both in the fed as in state or local, have to do more with less. Obviously in this post-pandemic world, you get even more efficient, more innovative, and get most output from our input. In that context, bringing storage, compute, networking, all integrated in a converged way, it's smart, it's not just adding them up, one plus one plus one equals three, but one plus one plus one equals less than one, in terms of cost, making it make sure it's infrastructures are simplified, easy to deploy, easy to use, that's why we keep an NPS score of 90, by the way, part of the reason, a little bit of shameless plug there for you. I don't know many companies who have an NPS 90 because we make infrastructure simple. So if you settle this, to Herman's point, all those applications he's managing and building and then obviously digitizing, and in some way, lifting a shifting and creating a new cloud digitized model, he want to make sure Herman and companies and organizations like the DA's office under leadership, with innovative CIOs like Herman, making sure they have choice. They can choose the prem model they want, on-prem, off-prem, hybrid, or multicloud, or in a government cloud fashion, and deliver these services. To give you an example, we talked about home as the extended enterprise. Our home office is now part of the office. I have to secure my home the way I secure my Nutanix headquarters because I'm now running my business from home. So in the past, there was a delineation between home and office. Now home is part of the extended office. The way I manage my trash, the way I manage my peer flows, applications, the network, latency, everything has to be dealt with in a very smart way. But even our paper trash in our office, we manage it carefully because of the IP, you know, people steal IP. Guess what, now at home, I have to have the same vigor. Guess what, you know, DA's office, the things that Herman is dealing with, they have to be so careful, not only in the office, but at home. So in that sense, that's the better service, your two desktops, all these new technologies I'm going to deal with in this simple way. Our new solution, all requires a browser, that's it, and no deliver a browser-based application, integration, to home, in a secure way, the things that we've been praying for for a long, long time. So this post-pandemic world is going to make us more agile, is going to make us more efficient, and hopefully we're going to do much more with less. >> Excellent, well, Herman, I have one more question for you, if you can, give us a little bit of a look forward. We always love to hear from a CIO just, number one, what's on your plate, and as you look at this solution, what you'll be using it for and going, and secondly, if you've got anything, if you could have something more that the ecosystem, maybe HPE and Nutanix, or maybe just in general from the ecosystem out there, that would make your life and your staff's easier. >> Well, you know, that's a great question. We have over 30 projects on our project list right now that are active projects that's going on. I have a staff of 9 IT professionals with three open positions, so I should say, 9, I have six, actual staff members with three open positions, currently, and we're on a hiring freeze. So one of the great things about the Nutanix HP solution has been that I've been able to downsize from the two systems engineer to the one system engineer without necessarily losing any bandwidth or knowledge or experience because the environment is so easy to manage, which has been great. We will continue to move forward with the digitization of our records and utilizing the cloud services that are available, through the various channels, and it's just an unprecedented time. I see that this is going to be the new norm. >> Excellent, so Tarkan, we'll let you put the exclamation point on it, give us the final takeaway for HPE and Nutanix. >> So, look, at the end of the day, we are in this new software defined growth and multicloud fashion having a partnership within two companies which covers data center services, DevOps services, as well as end user services, end to end, both in private clouds, also in a multicloud fashion, through telco as well as hyperscalers and Azure, deliver the service, with the open end model the customer chooses. Again, end to end, from data center, to DevOps, to end user, is the perfect marriage that HPE and Nutanix's relationship delivers. So we are really looking forward to working with customers like Herman, to deliver on that dream, on that journey, making sure that cloud migration and cloud consolidation happens efficiently end to end. Again, from the data center, to DevOps, to end user, all the way in a fashion that we do more with less in this post-pandemic world, and we're looking forward to that partnership as we move forward, and thank you Stu and thank you, Herman, for the time today. >> Excellent, well, Tarkan Maner, always a pleasure to catch up with you, really great to get all the update from you and really appreciate HPE and Nutanix bringing us Herman Brown, CIO, Herman, thank you so much for joining us, really appreciate you sharing your story, hopefully, you'll be able to open up and hire those three people that you're looking to hire in your future. Thank you both so much for joining us. >> Thank you, thank you very much for having me, Tarkan, it's always a pleasure, thanks Nutanix and HPE for just making a solid, great solution that can help in the success of the DA's office. Really do appreciate it. >> Thank you so much, Herman, again, I really appreciate it. >> We'll be back with more coverage from HPE Discover 2020, the Virtual Experience. I'm Stu Miniman, thank you, as always, for watching theCUBE. (gentle music)

(upbeat jazzy music) >> Announcer: From our studios, in the heart of Silicon Valley, Palo Alto, California. This is a CUBE Conversation. >> Hello and welcome to theCUBE studios for another CUBE conversation. Here where we go in depth with thought leaders driving innovation across the tech industry. I'm Donald Klein, today I'm here with Tom Stepien, CEO of Primus Power. We're going to talk about the state of clean tech. Tom, welcome to the show. >> Great to be here, thank you very much, Don. >> Okay, great, well look, we're going to kind of get into the state of climate change, and what's happening and why the solutions that you provide are kind of important, but first just why don't you just give a quick overview of Primus Power and what you guys do. >> Sure, so Primus Power is a stationary energy storage company. Our flow batteries work on both sides of the meter, the utility side, the guys who are supplying electricity, and the behind the meter side, the folks who use electricity, like this studio. And what we do is offer a solution that allows that allows you to optimize your electricity use. You charge the batteries typically when the price of electricity is low, and the usage is low, and then you pull from those batteries, instead of the grid, when the grid prices are high, and the cost is high. >> Donald: Okay. >> And that allows our customers to save money on both sides. >> Excellent, and so just quickly, who's the you, who's the customers here, who are the primary focus that you're selling to? >> Sure, sure, so the utilities are PG&E, the utility that's putting electrons to this studio, to smaller utilities, there's several thousand utilities in the US and then worldwide, of course. Folks who are supplying electricity. Also think about renewable plants, right, Solar-Plus storage, wind farms have curtailment problems because wind is gusty, tends to show up at the wrong time sometimes. You can save wind when it's extra, and then dispatch it when timers low. So renewables projects are customers. And then homeowners are customers. I lost power on the way here this morning, if I had a battery in my garage or by the side of my house I would have been able to keep the lights on and the garage door open. >> Okay, excellent, okay, all right. Well, lets, lets talk about kind of clean tech, right? So everybody's interested in what's happening with climate change, it's kind of front and center in the news cycle these days. California's actually been a real leader in implementing legislation to accelerate the adoption of Grid-tied storage solutions to make better use of renewable energy, correct? >> They sure have, absolutely. The California Energy Commission has been a leader in this space, the CPUC that governs the three investor owned utilities in California, initially 8-10 years ago put out a very important law that Nancy Skinner lead, relative to using storage and mandating storage in chunks for the three IOU's over the next 10 years. >> Interesting. >> We have exceeded those goals, I think it has helped drive down the cost of storage. It's helped companies like Primus blossom because it's created a market. Other states have jumped on that bandwagon, New York has, you know, done that, Oregon has storage goals, and many other states also, and it's helped improve the technology for sure. >> Interest, but so California's really been leading the charge since 2010 in this area? >> Yes, yes, I travel a lot, I've been to China, and Europe, and Kazakhstan, and all places. Everyone asks me, "What's happening in California?" If you look at Bloomberg numbers about energy storage, California is broken out and often the leader. South Korea did a lot last year, but within the US, California leads for sure, and will continue to do so. >> Interesting, and then they doubled up on those numbers again back in 2016, is that right? >> They are, they're continuing to up the goals, right? As a state we now have a carbon free goal. Wisconsin just this morning I read is also moving to carbon free goals under Energy Mix. So California has led for sure, but other cities, Chicago has a goal, other states are following, but it all has started here, for sure. >> And just talk about this connection between, kind of, a carbon free energy solution and grid-tied battery solutions, what is the connection? How do the batteries help with making states carbon free? >> Yeah, for sure, so solar is the least expensive way of generating electricity, full stop, right? What Germany did years ago with Feed-in Tariff and has driven down the cost is actually somewhat similar to what California did and helped drive down the cost and improve the technology. It is now at a point where it is the cheapest form, it is less expensive to put in a new solar plant than to run some of these gas plants. >> Interesting. >> California has no coal, got rid of that years ago, but has a lot of gas. Point in fact, in earlier this year in the Southern California Edison district the California Public Utility Commission, the guys who rule the utilities, said, "No, no, no, lets not put a couple hundred million dollars "to update and refurbish some of these gas plants, stop, "instead lets move that toward energy storage." >> Interesting. >> So here's how it's going to look in the future, you have solar, right? And we all know the low, low cost of that, right? Next Era Energy, using some of their numbers, because their the largest, one of the largest developers in the US, has the 20 year power purchase agreement price of solar by itself, is $25 to $35 a megawatt hour, right? Really low, so two and a half cents a kilowatt hour, right? I pay 10, 12, 18 cents per kilowatt hour for electricity at my home, depending on the uses. So, wow, right, it's an order of magnitude less than that. And then we all know what solar looks like, right? It's great during the day, but there's two dynamics that are important with solar. One are clouds, right? If you lose power because clouds go over, that intermittency is a problem. Quick acting batteries can take that out. The second one that everyone knows is the solar parabola tends to fall down when the sun sets, well what do you do for the other, either 12 or 18 hours of the day? And that's where batteries of a different type come in that gets charged in the middle of the day with that extra electricity from the peak and dissipated at night. >> Okay. >> That is the grid of the future, for sure. >> And you can do this both at a residential level, right? But also at a distribution center, replacing an older, kind of, you know, peak generation plant? >> Absolutely, right, and if you look at the refurbishments that are happening up and down the coast here in California, that's exactly what they're moving towards, and here in California we have a utility that got into a bit of trouble because of some of the wildfires and not maintaining some of the lines as we all have read about. Now they are publishing and turning off parts of the grid, if there are wildfire concerns. That is going to drive the use of storage at home, and the tariffs also are going to encourage that, right? Where you are encouraged economically to save extra electricity if you have panels on your roof, and then use that at night. So it's helping drive that market, and it's the right way to go. >> Interesting, so both in terms of houses that are in, sort of, forested areas, right, they're going to need this type of local energy storage solution. You've also got replacing the, kind of, peaker plants with using grid-tied storage to be able to push out energy over the grid, right? So these are going to be increasing use cases, so we're going to see battery installations both at plants and also in homes, but all of these battery solutions they're all tied to the cloud, correct? They're all tied to the internet, they're effectively functioning as IOT devices at the edge. Maybe talk a little bit about how that works and how, what the benefits are from a leveraging those types of technologies. >> Sure, yeah, so yes you're absolutely right, they are at all points of the grid, and different types of batteries for different functions. And it's fascinating, there is a whole class of companies that, of course, are emerging on the battery scene, right? Lithium-ion batteries, flow batteries like Primus, etc., and other types, really long thermal batteries are going to be coming, but then there's the class of the software companies that are helping manage these assets because you need to smartly charge and discharge. Sometimes driven by weather signals. Okay, it's going to be really windy tonight so I want to enter tonight with an empty battery if I'm a wind farm down in Palm Springs so I can take that extra wind and put it into the battery. Sometimes they're driven by economic signals, right? Because it's a really hot day and the prices of producing electricity are going to be high, so therefore I can take a different type of action. >> Interesting. >> And they will control those assets, batteries, on either side of the grid and make intelligent choices, driven by economics to provide the best outcome for, again, either the utility or the homeowner, maybe even the neighbors, right? At some point we're going to be able to share electricity. Why can't I use my neighbors panels if they're out of town for two weeks, and they can do the same when I'm out of town? So that will all come here over time. >> And that's all being enabled by a new class of software companies that are really treating these energy solutions as, kind of, you know, IOT devices. >> Absolutely, and they, it's a great model because it's just another IP address, right, and there's some attributes that it has and you understand the batteries and you can make economic decision. So think of it like a trading platform if you will. So those are emerging, you know, there's some really fascinating companies that are young and starting but off to a great start on those tasks. >> Excellent, okay, so why don't we just talk a little bit about Primus Power itself for a second. So you're in particular type of energy solution. Why don't you talk about that, and how you differ from some of the other providers that are out there? >> Sure, so there's lots of different types of batteries, right, and one thing to mention, that there's no perfect battery. There's always trade offs on batteries, right?. You always, of course, get less out than you put in, because you can't create energy. So there's efficiency differences. We're probably all familiar, the audience here is, with lithium ion batteries, with the Powerwall and Sonin and some, you know famous companies. SolarEdge has done a great job putting batteries with solar, or just having batteries by themselves. Those batteries today, most of the market is lithium ion. Lithium ion is 20-30 years old, first showed up on the Sony Handycam, very bankable, very proven, but like all batteries, have trade offs. We know the fade that we've experienced with our laptops and our cell phones-- >> Absolutely. >> Which is lithium ion. That's okay, because you can buy a new iPhone every three years, but if you have that on the grid, not so good, you don't want to go out to the substation every three years with a new set of batteries. Well, there's also fire concerns. There were 30-40 fires in South Korea last year, lithium ion based, and there was a big one earlier this year in Surprise, Arizona, bit of a Surprise down there, it sent some firefighters to the hospital. So that's some of the strengths and weaknesses of lithium ion. A flow battery, like ours, gets its name because we flow a liquid electrolyte, and a typical flow battery has two tanks and you're moving liquid from one tank to the other take through a reaction chamber, that's a stack of electrodes, and you plate a metal, we plate Zinc, other people plate iron, or you're playing tennis with electrons. This is high school chemistry coming back to haunt all of us, you're changing valance states of Vanadium, for example, Primus, if I talk about that difference, is unique in that it only has a single tank because we exploit the density differences in our electrolyte, kind of got a oil and vinegar separation going on, and we don't have a membrane in our stack of electrodes, so it's about half the cost, half of the price compared to other batteries. It's earlier, right? That's our biggest detriment is that we're not quite at bankable scale yet, we'll get there, right? As a young company you have to earn your stripes and get the UL certification and get enough things out there to do that. But there will be a number of winners in this space. Lithium ion is really good for certain applications, flow generally is good for daily discharges, think solar plus storage, deep discharge, multiple hour 4, 5, 6, 8 hour storage, and then there's going to be week long batteries that might be thermal based. There's a company that's moving, got a nice round of funding last week that's blocks of concrete around because you can, just like the pumped hydro you can move water up and down depending on the price of electricity and the use, you can move concrete blocks up and down. Spend energy moving it up, and then use gravity as your friend when you need electricity from the concrete battery. >> So, so in terms of future battery economy, like with multiple types of solutions for different sort of use cases right? >> Exactly. >> Whether sort of transportation or handheld, right, to residential, to grid-tied, etc.-- >> Absolutely, sure, and it will be drive by economics and then, you can't have a concrete battery in downtown San Francisco but you could in the middle of the Mojave-- >> Understood. >> So it would be-- >> Understood-- >> Absolutely-- >> Okay, so in order to kind of let you go here why don't you just talk a little bit about Primus, how you, where you guys are at in terms of your own evolution. How much deploy battery pods do you have out there in the world today? >> Sure, so Primus is at a stage now where we are growing. We're trying to grow at the right rate, because you don't want to get too far ahead of yourselves. We have systems up and down California, at some projects that have been put at waste water treatment centers, right, where we can help optimize the economics of the waste water treatment centers. They have components that are spending electricity they have solar, okay, batteries can help improve those economics. We have them at utilities that are testing them to see, "Okay, how well do these work?" Many of these new battery companies are where we are, where our customers are a try before you buy or a test before you invest type of a situation. We have a battery in China at one of China's largest wind turbine provider. Wind curtailment is acute in certain provinces in China. In fact in one of the provinces, Qinghai, in northwest China they passed a law a couple years ago that said "every new wind turbine has to have "a battery with it," so that's created a market there. >> Okay. >> There's also, we will be coming out with a residential version for some of the same reasons we mentioned about the wildfire concerns. >> Excellent, and so just give a sense how big, you talked about your pipeline and how many kind of quoted sales you've got out there. Just give us, the audience, a rough idea of what kind of pipeline you're looking at. >> Sure, so as a company we're moving from single digit million type of revenue that we did last year, to double digit million that we want to do next year. That translates into roughly 200-300 of our systems. Our systems, by the way, are think of a large washing machine, two meters, by two meters, by two meters. We have, in our pipeline of projects that we've quoted, more than a billion dollars worth of projects, a lot of solar-plus storage, a couple years from now. We won't get them all, for sure, but it shows the really strong interest in solutions like ours. >> Excellent, well exciting stuff Tom. Thank you for coming into TheCUBE and having a conversation with us. Appreciate you taking the time. >> Don, thank you very much, it was wonderful, really appreciate it! >> Donald Klein, thank you for joining us for another CUBE conversation, we'll see you next time. (upbeat jazzy music)

(click) >> Stu: Hi, I'm Stu Miniman and this is a special on-the-ground here at the VTUG: Summer Slam 2019. It's the 16th year of the event and unfortunately it's actually the final event. I've been to a few of these in Maine. I've been to many more of them at the Winter Warmer at Gillette Stadium and welcoming back to the program someone that's been to many more of these that I have, Chris Collotti, who's a principal technologist today at Cohesity but you know, who is doing many other jobs and actually used to live here in New England, southern New Hampshire before. >> Chris: That's right. Chris, welcome back. >> Chris: Thank you, good to see you as always. >> Yeah, give us a little bit of your history with these events and you know, what you've been seeing at you know, user groups and regional events and what brought you back for the final one. >> So this one was interesting cause even last night when I showed up for the night before, I think I knew everybody in the room, it was all hugs and you know, it's just, it's all about the people, I mean, this is all the same people that we've had up here. But, yeah, I grew up in southern New Hampshire, since moved to Tennessee five years ago but I was actually at another event before this and when we found it was the last one, well, Cohesity has always sponsored it but I actually decided to fly over here, being the last one cause knowing the Harneys really well and see all you guys it's just, it's kind of an odd thing to have the curtain go down. >> Yeah, you talk about the people and communities, Chris, I think back to the earliest days that I came to this event I'm like, there's that guy on stage, he's almost always wearing a Patriots jersey there and >> (laughs) I did make that famous. >> Figuring out it was I believe P90x and some of the other things there so, you know, what's the workout regime today? >> Uh, this morning I actually jacked up my neck, um, back in to lifting heavy a little bit but yeah, it was always great to be the guy who always came up on stage and always had a Brewsky jersey on or something. I remember the one year that someone told me they were practicing that year and I was in the middle of the presentation and I was, you know, conflicted on what to do but, um, no I think it's always been good to come back and talk, not just about technology, but I've had so many conversations over the years about where my career's gone and the changes and it was always that opportunity a couple times a year to figure out what changed for everybody. And even now, I mean, there's guys that I've seen that have different shirts on that we're, you know, I have one different from last year when I was at the Winter Warmer. >> Yeah, 16 years it's safe to say almost everyone here has changed what logo they had here. Many of the companies >> We've lost a little more hair, we've got a little more gray. >> So a lot of changes. One thing I tell you, 16 years has been a good run for the Patriots over the last 16 years >> People don't like us when we talk about that for some reason >> We're here in New England, we're allowed to talk about it. >> That's true, that's true. >> At this event, Chris, it's The Cube, you always like talking about sports and if they don't like this piece of it that's all right but, you know, I tell you talking to the vendors here, they're always hiring, like, SEs, technical people, you know, if they understand that latest in technology, usually they can find a job here. What else are you seeing? What are some of the you know, kind of in-demand jobs, of course, you know, the space that your company is playing in, data, is at the center of so much of what we talk, >> Absolutely. Data protection, data management, is a super hot space. >> Yep. I think, I've definitely seen a lot of, all the new companies are always hiring SEs, right? They got to get their sales up and running. For Cohesity, it's a bit similar. I mean, we took over another couple of floors in one of the other buildings in San Jose, which is great, the growth is unbelievable. For people who don't know, you know, we've got a truck rolling around the country that John Hildebrand and I personally, pretty much built over the course of a couple a months, but I think that speaks to it. There's all this stuff happening and everybody's trying to find a different way to get out in front of customers, right, whether it's a salesperson, whether it's the marketing, whether it's creative videos or something else and we're always trying to figure out what's the next, well, not even technical ability, but what's just the next ability you want to hire, right, is it a coder, is it, I mean, we always have developers, we're always hiring developers, but around here, I've been out of the area so much I'm really not sure, like what the hotbed is right now around the Boston area and southern New Hampshire. >> Boston's such a hotbed lately for, you know, everything that's going in IoT, of course, Cloud's having an impact, those people that hadn't been to the Seaport District, oh my gosh, it's great to see those buildings go up. >> Oh yeah. >> You know, not just, you know, Red Hat put in a big facility there, AWS and Amazon, of course, has a strong presence, but between Cambridge and Boston there's so much growth here. Chris, want to give you the kind of final word, as you've been at more of these events than many people, you know, what's it like to see kind of the end of an era and any final memories you have from these shows. >> The only, and I've been talking about this memory, and you may remember this one, and Ed Hartley would too, I think, Tex, he will, when my Challenger broke down. Were you here for that one, when I pulled into Gritty's? That's my worse memory of these but it's the one that always comes up when I come back and everybody saw it on the flatbed driving by, you know, Luigi and everybody. What made it interesting was a horrible situation for me because I drove up here but it speaks to the community because everybody ran out to ask what happened, do you need a ride home, what's going on? And I do think the Harneys have done such an incredible job over the years just bringing all these people together. It's a little bit sad I think, you know, my wife came up for this, Julie actually flew up because she knows everybody and being the last one. She also won't turn down lobster, at all. I'm happy for them though, I think, a lot's happened in their lives in the last couple years and to finally get down to Florida and spend more time down there, I'm happy for them, I think it's great, I think they've done a, they've left a legacy, really I think, I don't think anybody can match up here. >> The intersections of great information, great people and you throw in >> Great food. a great New England Lobsterfest, you really can't go wrong with that, Chris, thank you so much for sharing the update. Always great to catch up with you. >> Yeah, great seeing you again. We'll see you tonight at the bake. >> All right and we'll see Chris and many others at VMWorld later this year as well as lots of other shows. Be sure to check out thecube.net. I'm Stu Miniman and as always, thanks for watching. (digital tones)