(upbeat music) >> Narrator: theCUBE presents KubeCon and CloudNativeCon Europe 2022, brought to you by Red Hat, the Cloud Native Computing Foundation and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome to Valencia, Spain, in KubeCon, CloudNativeCon Europe 2022. It's near the end of the day, that's okay. We have plenty of energy because we're bringing it. I'm Keith Townsend, along with my cohost, Paul Gillon. Paul, this has been an amazing day. Thus far we've talked to some incredible folks. You got a chance to walk the show floor. >> Yeah. >> So I'm really excited to hear what's the vibe of the show floor, 7,500 people in Europe, following the protocols, but getting stuff done. >> Well, at first I have to say that I haven't traveled for two years. So getting out to a show by itself is an amazing experience. But a show like this with all the energy and the crowd too, enormously crowded at lunchtime today. It's hard to believe how many people have made it all the way here. Out on the floor the booth are crowded, the demonstrations are what you would expect at a show like this. Lots of code, lots of block diagrams, lots of architecture. I think the audience is eating it up. They're on their laptops, they're coding on their laptops. And this is very much symbolic of the crowd that comes to a KubeCon. And it's just a delight to see them out here having so much fun. >> So speaking of lots of code, we have Varun Talwar, co-founder of Tetrate. But, I just saw I didn't realize this, Istio becoming part of CNCF. What's the latest on Istio? >> Yeah, Istio is, it was always one of those service mesh projects which was very widely adopted. And it's great to see it going into the Cloud Native Computing Foundation. And, I think what happened with Kubernetes like just became the de-facto container orchestrator. I think similar thing is happening with Istio and service mesh. >> So. >> I'm sorry, go ahead Keith. What's the process like of becoming adopted by and incubated by the CNCF? >> Yeah, I mean, it's pretty simple. It's an application process into the foundation where you say, what the project is about, how diverse is your contributor base, how many people are using it. And it goes through a review of, with TOC, it goes through a review of like all the users and contributors, and if you see a good base of deployments in production, if you see a diverse community of contributors, then you can basically be part of the CNCF. And as you know, CNCF is very flexible on governance. Basically it's like bring your own governance. Then the projects can basically seamlessly go in and get into incubation and gradually graduate. >> Another project close and dear to you, Envoy. >> Yes. >> Now I've always considered Envoy just as what it is. It's a, I've always used it as a low balancer type thing. So, I've always considered it some wannabe gateway of proxy. But Envoy gateway was announced last week. >> Yes. So Envoy is, basically won the data plane war of in cloud native workloads, right? And, but, and this was over the last five years. Envoy was announced even way before Istio, and it is used in various deployment models. You can use it as a front load balancer, you can use it as an ingress in Kubernetes, you can use it as a side car in a service mesh like Istio. And it's lightweight, dynamically programmable, very open with the right community. But, what we looked at when we looked at the Envoy base was, it still wasn't very approachable for application developers. Like, when you still see like the nouns that it uses in terms of clusters and so on is not what an application developer was used to. And, so Envoy gateway is really an effort to make Envoy even more stronger out of the box for an application developer to use it as an API gateway, right? Because if you think about it, ultimately people, developers, start deploying workloads onto their Kubernetes clusters, they need some functionality like an API gateway to expose their services and you want to make it really, really easy and simple, right? I often say like, what Engine X was to like static websites, like Envoy gateway will be to like APIs. And it's really, the community coming together, we are a big part, but also VMware, and as well as end users, like in this case Fidelity, who is investing heavily into Envoy and API gateway use cases, joining forces saying, let's do this in upstream Envoy. >> I'd like to go back Istio, because this is a major step in Istio's development. Where do you see Istio coming into the picture? And Kubernetes is already broadly accepted, is Istio generally adopted as an after, an after step to Kubernetes, or are they increasingly being adopted together? >> Yeah. So, usually it's adopted as a follow on step. And, the reason is, primarily the learning curve, right? It's just to get used to all the Kubernetes and, it takes a while for people to understand the concepts, get applications going, and then, Istio was made to basically solve, three big problems there, right? Which is around, observability, traffic management, and security, right? So as people deploy more services they figure out, okay, how do I connect them? How do I secure all the connections? And how do I do more fine grain routing? I'm doing more frequent deployments with Kubernetes, but I would like to do canary releases, to make safer roll outs, right? And those are the problems that Istio solves. And I don't really want to know the metrics of like, yes, it'll be, it's good to know all the node level, and CPO level metrics, but really what I want to know is, how are my services performing? Where is the latency, right? Where is the error rate? And those are the things that Istio gives out of the box. So that's like a very natural next step for people using Kubernetes. And, Tetrate was really formed as a company to enable enterprises to adopt Istio, Envoy, and service mesh in their environment, right? So we do everything from, run an academy for like courses and certifications on Envoy and Istio, to a distribution, which is, compliant with various rules and tooling, as well as a whole platform on top of Istio, to make it usable in deployment in a large enterprise. >> So paint the end to end for me for Istio and Envoy. I know they can be used in similar fashions as like side cars, but how do they work together to deliver value? >> Yeah. So if you step back from technology a little bit, right? And you make sort of, look at what customers are doing and facing, right? Really it is about, they have applications, they have some applications that new workloads going into Kubernetes and cloud native, they have a lot of legacy workloads, a lot of workloads in VMs, and with different teams in different clouds or due to acquisitions, they're very heterogeneous, right? Now our mission, Tetrate's mission is power the world's application traffic. But really the business value that we are going after is consistency of application operations, right? And I'll tell you how powerful that is. Because the more places you can deploy Envoy into, the more places you can deploy Istio into, the more consistency you can get for the value pillars of observability, traffic management, and security, right? And really if you think about what is the journey for an enterprise to migrate from VM workloads into Kubernetes, or from data centers into cloud, the challenges are around security and connectivity, right? Because if it's Kubernetes fabric, the same Kubernetes app and data center can be deployed exactly as it is in cloud, right? >> Keith: Right. >> So why is it hard to migrate to cloud, right? The challenges come in the security and networking layer, right? >> So let's talk about that with some granularity and you can maybe give me some concrete examples. >> Right. >> Because as I think about the hybrid infrastructure, where I have VMs on-premises, cloud native stuff running in the public cloud or even cloud native next to VMs. >> Varun: Right. >> I do security differently when I'm in the VM world. I say, you know what? This IP address can't talk to this Oracle database server. >> Right. >> Keith: That's not how cloud native works. >> Right. >> I can't say, if I have a cloud native app talking to a Oracle database, there's no IP address. >> Yeah. >> Keith: But how do I secure the communication between the two? >> Exactly. So I think you hit it, well, straight on the head. So which is, with things like Kubernetes IP is no longer a really a valid noun, where you can say because things will auto scale either from Kubernetes or the cloud autoscalers. So really the noun that is becoming now is service. So, and I could have many instances of it. They could, will scale up and down. But what I'm saying is, this service, which you know some app server, some application can talk to the Oracle service. >> Keith: Hmm. >> And what we have done with the Tetrate Service Bridge which is why we call our platform service bridge, because it's all about bridging all the services, is whatever you're running on the VM can be onboarded onto the mesh, like as if it were a Kubernetes service, right? And then my policy around this service can talk to this service, is same in Kubernetes, is same for Kubernetes talking to VM, it's same for VM to VM, both in terms of access control. In terms of encryption what we do is, because it's, the Envoy proxy goes everywhere and the traffic is going through them we actually take care of distributing certs, encrypting everything, and it becomes, and that is what leads to consistent application operations. And that's where the value is. >> We're seeing a lot of activity around observability right now, a lot of different tools, both open source and proprietary Istio, certainly part of the open telemetry project, and I believe you're part of that project? >> Yes. >> But the customers are still piecing together a lot of tools on their own. >> Right. >> Do you see a more coherent framework forming around observability? >> I think very much so. And there are layers of observability, right? So the thing is, like if we tell you there is latency between these two services at L seven layer, the first question is, is it the service? Is it the Envoy? Or is it the network? It sounds like a very simple question. It's actually not that easy to answer. And that is one of the questions we answer in like platforms like ours, right? But even that is not the end. If it's neither of these three, it could be the node, it could be the hardware underneath, right? And those, you realize like those are different observability tools that work on each layer. So I think there's a lot of work to be done to enable end users to go from IP, like from top to bottom, to make, reduce what is called MPTR or meantime to, resolution of an issue where is the problem. But I think with tools like what is being built now, it is becoming easier, right? It is because, one of the things we have to realize is with things like Kubernetes we made the development of microservices easier, right? And that's great, But as a result, what is happening is that more things are getting broken down. So there is more network in between. So there's, harder it gets to troubleshoot, harder it gets to secure everything, harder it gets to get visibility from everywhere, right? So I often say like, actually if you're going, embarking down microservices journey, you actually are... You better have a platform like this. Otherwise, you're taking on operational cost. >> Wow, Jevons paradox, the more accessible we make something, the more it get used, the more complex it is. That's been a theme here at KubecCon, CloudNativeCon Europe 2022, from Valencia, Spain. I'm Keith Townsend, along with my cohost Paul Gillon. And you're watching theCUBE, the leader in high tech coverage. (upbeat music)

>>The cube presents, Coon and cloud native con Europe, 22 brought to you by the cloud native computing foundation. >>Welcome to ity of Spain and cube con coup con cloud native con Europe 2022 is near the end of the day. That's okay. We, we, we have plenty of energy because we're bringing it. I'm Keith Townsend, along with my coho, Paul Gillon Paul, this has been an amazing day. Thus far. We've talked to some incredible folks. You got a chance to walk the show floor. Yeah. So I'm really excited to hear what's the vibe of the show floor, 7,500 people in Europe following the protocols, but getting stuff done. >>Well, first I have to say that I haven't traveled for two years. So getting out to a show by, by itself is, is an amazing experience, but a show like this with all of the energy and the crowd, she is enormously crowded at lunchtime today. It's hard to believe how many people have made it, made it all the way here out on the floor. The boots are crowded. The, the demonstrations are what you would expect at a show like this. Lots of code, lots of, lots of block diagrams, lots of architecture. I think the audience is eating it up. You know, when they're, they're on their laptops, they're coding on their laptops. And this is very much symbolic of the crowd that comes to a cubic con. And it's, it's a, just a delight to see them outta here. I so much fun. >>So speaking of lots of gold, we have Bome Toro co-founder of pet trade, but, you know, just saw, didn't realize this Isto becoming part of CNCF was the latest on infield. >>Yeah. Is still is, you know, it was always one of those service mesh projects, which was very widely adopted. And it's great to see that going into the cloud native computing foundation. And I think what happened with Kubernetes, like just became the defacto container orchestrator. I think similar thing is happening with Isto and service mesh. >>What, >>So I'm sorry, Keith, what's the process like of becoming adopted by and incubated by the CNCF? >>Yeah, I mean, it's pretty simple. It's an application process into the foundation where you say, you know what the project is about, how diverse is your contributor base, how many people are using it. And it goes through a review of with TC. It goes through a review of like all the users and contributors. And if you see a good base of deployments in production, if you see a diverse of contributors, then you can basically be part of the CNCF. And as you know, CNCF is very flexible on governance. Basically it's like, bring your own governance. And then the projects can basically seamlessly go in and, you know, get into incubation and gradually graduate >>Another project close and dear to you Envoy. Yes. Now I've always considered Envoy just as what it is. It's a, I've always used it as, as a load balancer type thing. So I've always considered it somewhat of a gateway proxy, but Envoy gateway was announced last week. Yes. >>So Envoy is basically won the data plane war of in cloud native workloads. Right. And, but, and this was over the last five years, Envoy was announced even way before Rio and it is used in various deployment models. You can use it as a front load balancer. You can use it as an Ingres in Kubernetes. You can use it as a side car and a service mesh like steel, and it's lightweight dynamically, programmable, very open with a white community. But what we looked at when we looked at the Envoy base, was it still, wasn't very approachable for application developers. Like when you still see like the nouns that it uses in terms of clusters and so on is not what an application developer was used to. And so Envoy gateway is really an effort to make Envoy even more stronger out of the box for an application developer to use it as an API gateway. >>Right? Because if you think about it, ultimately, you know, people de developers start deploying workloads onto their Kubernetes clusters. They need some functionality like an API gateway to expose their services and you wanna make it really, really easy and simple. Right? I often say like what, what engine X was to like static websites like Envoy gateway will be to like, you know, APIs and it's really few the community coming together. We are a big part, but also VMware and as well as end users, like in this case, fidelity who is investing heavily into Envoy and API gateway use cases, joining forces saying, let's do this in upstream Envoy. >>I'd like to go back to IIO because this is a major step in IIOS development. Where do you see SIO coming into the picture? And Kubernetes is already broadly accepted. Is IIO generally adopted as an after an after step to, to Kubernetes or are they increasingly being adopted together? >>Yeah. So usually it's adopted as a follow on step and the reason is primarily the learning curve, right. It's just get used to all the Kubernetes and, you know, it takes a while for people to understand the concepts, get applications going, and then, you know, studio was made to basically solve, you know, three big problems there. Right. Which is around observability traffic management and security. Right. So as people deploy more services, they figure out, okay, how do I connect them? How do I secure all the connections and how do I do more fine grain routing? I'm doing more frequent deployments with Kubernetes, but I would like to do Canary releases to make safer rollouts. Right. And those are the problems that Isto solves. And I don't really want to know the metrics of like, yes, it'll be, I it's good to know all the node level and CPO level metrics. >>But really what I want to know is how are my services performing? Where is the latency, right? Where is the error rate? And those are the things thatto gives out of the box. So that's like a very natural next step for people using Kubernetes. And, you know, Tetra was really formed as a company to enable enterprises, to adopt STO Envoy and service mission, their environment. Right? So we do everything from run an academy for like courses and certifications on Envoy and STO to a distribution, which is, you know, compliant with various bills and tooling as well as a whole platform on top of STO to make it usable and deployment in a large enterprise. >>So paint the end to end for me, for STO in Envoy. I know they can be used in similar fashions is like side cars, but how they work together to deliver value. >>Yeah. So if you step back from technology a little bit, right, and you like, sort of look at what customers are doing and facing, right. Really it is about, they have applications. They have some applications that new workloads going into Kubernetes and cloud native. They have a lot of legacy workloads, a lot of workloads on VMs and with different teams in different clouds or due to acquisitions. They're very heterogeneous right now. Our mission Tetrad's mission is power. The world's application traffic, but really the business value that we are going after is consistency of application operations. Right? And I'll tell you how powerful that is because the more places you can deploy Envoy into the more places you can deploy studio into, the more consistency you can get for the value pillars of observability, traffic management, and security. Right. And really, if you think about what is the journey for an enterprise to migrate from workloads into Kubernetes or from data centers into cloud, the challenges are around security and connectivity, right? Because if it's Kubernetes fabric, the same Kubernetes app and data center can be deployed exactly as is it in cloud. Right. Right. So why is it hard to migrate to cloud, right. The challenges come in the security and networking layer. >>Right. So let's talk about that with some granularity and you can maybe gimme some concrete examples, right? Because it, as I think about the hybrid infrastructure where I have VMs on premises, cloud, native stuff, running in the public cloud, or even cloud native next to VMs, right. I do security differently when I'm in the VM world. I say, you know what, this IP address, can't talk to this Oracle database server. Right. That's not how cloud native works. Right. I, I can't say if I have a cloud, if I have a cloud native app talking to a Oracle database, there's no IP address. Yeah. But how do I, how, how do I secure the communication between the two? Exactly. >>So I think you hit it straight on the head. So which is with things like Kubernetes, IP is no longer a really a valid noun where you can say, because things will auto scale either from Kubernetes or, you know, the cloud autoscales. So really the noun that is becoming now is service. So, and I could have many instances of it. They could go scale up and down. But what I'm saying is this service, which, you know, some app server, some application can talk to the article service. Hmm. And what we have done with the te trade service bridge, which is why we call our platform service bridge, because it's all about bridging all the services is whatever you're running on, the VM can be onboarded onto the mesh, like as if it were a ity service. Right. And then my policy around this service can talk to this service is same in Kubernetes is same for Kubernetes talking to VM it's same for VM to VM, both in terms of access control in terms of encryption. What we do is because it's the Envoy, proxy goes everywhere and the traffic is going through them. We actually take care of distributing, certs, encrypting, everything, and it becomes, and that is what leads to consistent application operations. And that's where the value is. >>We're seeing a lot of activity around observ observability right now, a lot of different tools, both open source and proprietary STO certainly part of the open telemetry project, I believe. Are you part of that? Yes. But the customers are still piecing together a lot of tools on their own. Right. Do you see a, a more coherent framework forming around observability? >>I think very much so. And there are layers of observability, right? So the thing is like, if we tell you there is latency between these two services at L seven layer, the first question is, is it the service? Is it the Envoy? Or is it the network? It sounds like a very simple question. It's actually not that easy to answer. And that is one of the questions we answer in like platforms like ours. Right. But even that is not the end. It, if it's neither of these three, it could be the node. It could be the hardware underneath. Right. And those, you realize like those are different observability tools that work on each layer. So I think there's a lot of work to be done, to enable end users to go from app, like from top to bottom to make, reduce what is called MTTR or meantime to, you know, resolution of an issue, where is the problem. >>But I think with tools like what is being built now, it is becoming easier, right? It is because one of the things we have to realize is with things like Kubernetes, we made the development of microservices easier. Right. And that's great. But as a result, what is happening is that more things are getting broken down. So there is more network in between. So that's harder. It gets to troubleshoot harder. It gets to secure everything harder. It gets to get visibility from everywhere. Right. So I often say like, actually, if you're going embarking down microservices journey, you actually are, you better have a platform like this. Otherwise, you know, you're, you're taking on operational cost. >>Wow. J's paradox. The more accessible we make something, the more it gets used, the more complex it is. That's been a theme here at KU con cloud native con Europe, 2022 from Licia Spain. I'm Keith Townsend, along with my host, Paul Gillman. And you're watching the queue, the leader in high tech coverage.

>>From around the globe. It's the cube with digital coverage of IBM. Think 20, 21 brought to you by IBM. >>Welcome back to the cubes. Continuous coverage of IBM. Think 2021. My name is Dave Volante and I'm one of your hosts for our virtual coverage. We're going to talk about cloud and hybrid cloud. What it is, what it means to clients and how the cloud journey will likely unfold in the coming several years with me to address these issues is Varun Mitch Lonnie. Who's the managing partner hybrid cloud transformation at IBM. Welcome Varun. Good to see you. >>Thank you, Dave. Wonderful to talk to you. Sorry. >>You hear people talk about, you know, they say cloud first cloud, we've got a cloud first strategy. And what does that even mean? What is a cloud strategy? Is it a technology roadmap? Is it a, is it an experience? Is it a business strategy? What really is a cloud strategy all about? And importantly, how does it support the business outcomes? That's really what matters. >>Brilliant, great question. I always believe it's, uh, it's less about the journey to the cloud and it's more important what you do when you get there. That is, you know, what business outcomes does it actually support now many different starting points for an enterprise to embark upon a cloud enabled transformation. You know, things like reducing technical debt and costs, creating new products and services, accelerating time to market and even changing working practices in an organization. Now, as we work with clients, we are seeing increasingly value coming from open innovation. What I mean by that is expanded revenue opportunities with broad ecosystem, you know, new ideas, new platforms, and increase time to market. Now accessing value from what we call those, you know, ecosystems and that open innovation we believe requires, uh, open hybrid multicloud architecture with that. It enables you to plug into those in those ecosystems allows you to fully consider a modernization across your estate and create consistent operating models. >>Also helps reduce, you know, talent and risk, uh, skill risks that organization have. And interestingly, this is exactly where red hat also shines as it's the best hybrid cloud platform out there today. But coming back to the main objective around business objectives, we are seeing that when leaders anchor their transformation on such a holistic strategy, they are driving towards two and a half times, uh, increased economic return as compared to let's say just a singular one single public cloud strategy. And they're able to drive impact on their business case, across multiple dimensions. Things like accelerating the business. So impacting top line, new product services, uh, number two is around accelerating application development and, uh, optimizing, uh, costs associated with that estate, uh, improving infrastructure utilization, um, reducing the cost of security and compliance. And that gives that architectural flexibility, but that was the basis of approach for clients like Delta and is Columbia used. Therefore cloud is absolutely about business outcomes, both top line and bottom line. >>Yeah. Really trying to change that operating model versus of the, of the organization versus just the it model. I mean, we could talk about some of the, the headwinds that organizations face and maybe some of the typical challenges that after they get to the cloud, whether it's organizational technical, there's integration, there's security, maybe even culture. What are you seeing in that regard, >>Uh, spot on, I think you, you you've already started recognizing some of those, you know, when, when, uh, client started, uh, earlier in the journey, they started focusing on consumer driven innovation. They had digital and AI experimentation, and we saw user applications moving to the cloud. Now they are recognizing the need to look at enterprise driven innovation. And how do you start embedding AI into the business at scale? Uh, and therefore they are now realizing that they need to look at their core portfolio, their mission critical applications, you know, 90% of companies, uh, were on the cloud in 2019, but in all estimates, you know, only about 20% of their workloads actually move to the cloud. So, uh, there are a number of different challenges that our clients face, you know, things like economic limits to how many workloads you can move to the public cloud. >>You called out security and regulatory challenges, yourself, speed to value or dealing with complex applications and the uncertain interactions, the data gravity and dependencies. Sometimes they get into the loop of analysis paralysis. You know, another one that I get quite closely involved with is does the cloud technology transformation actually drive and deliver process change? Does it take your old business process and make it into an intelligent workflow? The other dimension is execution in silos today and federated organizational constructs, the, the lack, the right skill and expertise. And then finally is things like technology lock-in and the struggle that people have with inflexible tools and methods, which hinder scale and speed. So those are the few things. >>When I think about just the history of cloud modern cloud, you know, there was, there was a lot of tire kicking early on, and then the financial crisis actually accelerated some moves to cloud. And then coming out of that, there was a lot of shadow it, but it was still as you pointed out very early days. Uh, and then, you know, the comment you made about mission critical is kind of interesting to me because I'm curious, you set out a vision before, uh, of what I call this, this layer of abstraction that hides the complexity. I don't care if I'm on prem and public cloud across clouds, the edge. I, I just, I want you to take care of that in R and D. I want to worry about my business. And so early days, do people want to move their mission critical workloads to the cloud and why, or did they just want to create a modernization layer and hide that complexity? You know, maybe in the context of some of those challenges that you can talk about, what are you, how are you advising clients that they, they take the next step and, and of course, how IBM can help? >>Oh, spot on. So, yes, I think now they're recognizing that there is value of looking at those complex core applications and looking at where should that, what needs to happen to my complex core application by mission critical application. Do I need to, uh, defragment that, do I need to decompose into, uh, new capabilities? Do I need to just move it to the cloud? We need to keep it where it is because in some instances that's where I get maximum security and data gravity. So if I reflect on this, I think there are four key things I would call out as what I would call the get rights. Uh, number one is ensure that we are aligning with business outcomes. Number two, clarity of target architecture and portfolio. Number three is, you know, accelerating the journey with the right methods, tools, and patterns. And the fourth one, which is closest to my heart is about delivering via an improved operating model. >>So let's, let's just scratch the surface on this a little bit. Now, when you talk about aligning with business outcomes, first of course, is, you know, clear business ownership and alignment with the overall strategy, but what's important is what capabilities does the business need to deliver that strategy? And how is cloud going to help enable those capabilities? For example, you know, integration with ecosystem partners, foster launch of new products and services, monetizing data assets, things like that. And this was one of the key drivers for a healthcare company that I recently worked with in, in North America. When we talk about clarity of target portfolio, you know, uh, this is about what's my architecture going to be across the edge, on-prem private public, what should I do to my applications? And where should they resigned? Should I keep, should I kill? Should I modernize? What should I do? >>So for example, we've seen, you know, a lot of companies around 15% of applications, you may not touch at all. Uh, 20% of those applications, you may replace with SAS solutions. Um, 45 to 50% is where you start looking at modernizing. And that's where you look at, what do you do with your monolithic applications and how do you modernize them? And around 15% you might say is building brand new native capabilities on the cloud. So that's kind of the second get, right? The third was about accelerating with proven patterns and methods and tools. And this is about increasing speed to value early wins and being able to analyze and decompose complex applications quickly and reliably. And once they're executing on that journey, how do you grow from garage to scale capabilities? Now here, we've made some, uh, you know, strong folks and investments in this space. >>Uh, we have a set of standard patterns that allow you to modernize and migrate applications, you know, depending on looking at your operating system, the integration technology, the container standards, and so on. And it's, uh, important to have the right tools that bring in AI and machine learning to bear. For example, we have our own, you know, cloud advisory tool that looks at the operating system and the code to explain and give guidance on what disposition and what containerization is most applicable. And then finally, you know, this consistent operating model, how should the ways of working actually change on the ground? How should platform engineering and the application teams work together? Should I instantiate that with a competency center that helps me get onto the journey? How do I have the right skills, uh, not being siloed, the consistent security approach, and especially for companies that are in the looking at real complex mission, critical workloads to them that becomes even more important and in regulatory environments. So to recap, I'd say those four things alignment with the business clarity of target portfolio, uh, accelerating with the right methods and tools, and of course, embedding through a sustainable operating model. I'll pause there. >>Yeah. Great. Thank you for that. I would say my takeaway is this is not your grandfather's application rationalization exercise, you know, which was kind of a one-shot deal every 10 years, Oh, Y2K. We're going to ride whatever it was. And what you're describing is essentially a way to have continuous improvement is obviously a lot of automation there, but very importantly, there's a gain sharing aspect where you can reinvest in innovation. And I think, you know, one of the areas you mentioned is ecosystem. We haven't even talked about it. We don't have the time, but, but the whole data opportunity there for around innovation, because that is how ecosystems are they're going to form around, you know, that data model. And it's a, it's an, it's a new world. And thank you so much for your very articulate vision that you set out and congratulations on all the progress that you've made. And I really appreciate your time. >>Thank you very much, Dave. Wonderful to talk to you, looking forward to more conversations >>I am as well. And thank you for watching everybody. This is Dave Volante for the cube. You're watching our continuous coverage of IBM think 2021, the virtual edition. We're right back.

>>from >>around the globe. It's the >>cube >>With digital coverage of IBM. Think 2021 brought to you by IBM. >>Welcome back to the cubes, continuous coverage of IBM Think 2021. My name is Dave Volonte and I'm one of your hosts for our virtual coverage. We're gonna talk about cloud and hybrid cloud, what it is, what it means to clients and how the cloud journey will likely unfold in the coming several years with me to address these issues is varun vigilante. Who is the managing partner? Hybrid cloud transformation at IBM Welcome Baron. Good to see you. >>Thank you. Dave. Wonderful to talk to you. >>So you hear people talk about, you know, they say cloud first cloud, we've got a cloud first strategy. What does that even mean? What is a cloud strategy? Is it a technology roadmap? Is it is it an experience? Is it a business strategy? What really is a cloud strategy all about? And importantly how does it support business outcomes? That's really what matters? >>Brilliant. Great question. I always believe it's less about the journey to the cloud and it's more important what you do when you get there. That is, you know, what business outcomes does it actually support no many different starting points for an enterprise to embark upon a cloud enabled transformation, you know, things like reducing technical debt and costs, creating new products and services, accelerating time to market and even changing working practices in an organization. Now, as we work with clients, we are seeing increasingly value coming from open innovation. What I mean by that is expanded revenue opportunities with broad ecosystems, you know, new ideas, new platforms and increased time to market. Now accessing value from what we call those ecosystems and that open innovation we believe requires open hybrid, multi cloud architecture with that, it enables you to plug into those those ecosystems, allows you to fully consider modernization across your estate and creates consistent operating models also helps reduce talent and risk a skill risks that organization have. And interestingly, this is exactly where Red Hat also shines as it's the best hybrid cloud platform out there today. But coming back to the main objective around business objectives, we're seeing that when leaders anchor their transformation on such a holistic strategy, they are driving towards 2.5 times uh increased economic return as compared to let's say, just a you know, singular one single public cloud strategy. And they're able to drive impact on their business case across multiple dimensions. Things like accelerating the business or impacting top line new products services. Number two is around accelerating application development and optimizing costs associated with that estate, uh improving infrastructure, utilization, um reducing the cost of security and compliance. And that gives that architectural flexibility. But that was the basis of approach with clients like Delta and somebody used. Therefore cloud is absolutely about business outcomes. Both top line and bottom line. >>Yeah, really trying to change that operating model versus of the of the organization versus just the I. T. Model. And then we can talk about some of the headwinds that organizations face and maybe some of the typical challenges after they get to the to the cloud, whether its organizational technical, this integration, the security, maybe even culture. What are you seeing in that regard? >>Spot on. I think you've already started recognizing some of those, you know, when when uh clients started earlier in the journey, they started focusing on consumer driven innovation. They had digital and AI experimentation and we saw user applications moving to the glove. Now they are recognizing the need to look at enterprise driven innovation and how do you start embedding AI into the business at scale. And therefore they are now realizing that they need to look at their core portfolio, Their mission critical applications. You know, 90 of companies, Uh, we're on the cloud in 2019, but In all estimates only about 20 of their work lords actually move to the cloud. So, uh, there are a number of different challenges that our our clients face. You know, things like economic limits to how many work lords you can move to the public club, you called out security and regulatory challenges yourself speed to value or dealing with complex applications and the uncertain interactions, the data, gravity and dependencies. Sometimes they get into the loop of analysis. Paralysis. You know, another one that I get quite closely involved with this. Does the cloud technology transformation actually drive and deliver process change. Does it take your old business process and make it into an intelligent workflow? The other dimension is execution in silos today and Federated organizational constructs, the lack of the right skill and expertise and then finally is things like technology locking and and the struggle that people have with inflexible tools and methods which hinder scale and speed. So those are a few things >>when I think about just the history of cloud, modern cloud, you know, there was there was a lot of tire kicking early on and then the financial crisis actually accelerated some moves to cloud and then coming out of that there was a lot of shadow I. T. But was still, as you pointed out very early days. Uh and then you know, the comment you made about mission critical. It is kind of interesting to me because I'm curious as and you set out a vision before of what I call this, this layer of abstraction that hides the complexity. I don't care if I'm on prem in a public cloud across clouds. The edge. I I just I want you to take care of that in R and D. I want to worry about my business and so, so we're early days. Do people want to move their mission critical workloads to the cloud and why? Or do they just want to create a modernization layer and hide that complexity? You know, maybe in the context of some of those challenges that you can talk about. What are you, how are you advising clients that they take the next step in? And of course how IBM can help? >>Oh, spot on. So yes, I think now they're recognizing that there is value of looking at those complex core applications and looking at where should that what needs to happen to my complex core application? My mission critical applications. Do I need to uh defragment that? Do I need to decompose into uh new capabilities? Do I need to just move it to the cloud? Do I need to keep it where it is? Because in some instances that's where I get maximum security and data gravity. So if I reflect on this, I think there are four key things I would call out as what I would call the get rights. Uh Number one is ensure that we are aligning with business outcomes. Number two, clarity of target architecture and portfolio. Number three is accelerating the journey with the right methods, tools and patterns. And The 4th 1 which is closest to my heart is about delivering via an improved operating model. So let's let's just scratched the surface on this a little bit. Now, when you talk about aligning with business outcomes, first, of course is clear business ownership and alignment with the overall strategy. What's important is what capabilities does the business need to deliver that strategy and how is cloud going to help enable those capabilities? For example, you know, integration with ecosystem partners, faster launch of new products and services, monetizing data assets, things like that. And this was one of the key drivers for a health care company that I recently worked with in north America. When we talk about clarity of target portfolio, you know, this is about what's my architects are going to be across the edge on prem private, public. What should I do to my applications and where should they decide Should I keep, should I kill, should I modernize? What should I do? So for example, we've seen, you know, a lot of companies around 15 of applications. You may not touch at all. 20 of those applications you may replace with Saas solutions Uh 45-50 is where you start looking at modernizing and that's where you look at. What do you do with your monolithic applications and how do you modernize them? And around 15 you might say is building brand new native capabilities on the cloud. So that's kind of the second get right. The third was about accelerating with proven patterns and methods and tools and this is about increasing speed to value early wins and being able to analyze and decompose complex applications quickly and reliably and once they're executing on their journey, how do you grow from garage? Two skilled capabilities. Now here we've made some uh you know, strong focus and investments in this space. We have a set of standard patterns that allow you to modernize and migrate applications, you know, depending on looking at your operating system, the integration technology, the container standards and so on. And it's important to have the right tools that bring in AI and machine learning to bear. For example, we have our own, you know, card advisory tool that looks at the operating system and the code to explain and give guidance on what disposition and what container Ization is most applicable. And then finally, you know, this consistent operating model, how should the ways of working actually change on the ground? How should platform engineering and the application teams work together? Should I instant share that with a competency center that helps me get onto the journey, How do I have the right skills not being siloed? The consistent security approach, especially for companies that are looking at real complex mission critical workloads to them, that becomes even more important and in regulated environments. So to recap, I'd say those four things, alignment with the business clarity of target portfolio accelerating with the right methods and tools and of course embedding through a sustainable operating model cause they're >>Great, thank you for that. I would say my takeaway is this is not your grandfather's application rationalization exercise, which was a kind of a one shot deal every 10 years, oh y two K we're going to whatever it was and what you're describing is essentially a way to have continuous improvement. There's obviously a lot of automation there, but very importantly there's a gain sharing aspect where you can reinvest in innovation and I think, you know, one of the areas you mentioned is ecosystem, we haven't even talked about it, we don't have the time, but the whole data opportunity there for around innovation because that is how ecosystems they're gonna form around, you know, that data model and it's a it's a it's a new world and and ruin. Thank you so much for your very articulate vision that you set out and congratulations on all the progress that you've made and I really appreciate your time. >>Thank you very much. A wonderful to talk to you. Looking forward to more conversations. >>Alright. I am as well. And thank you for watching everybody's day volonte for the Cube. You're watching our continuous coverage of IBM think 2021 the virtual edition will be right back. >>Mm.

>> live from San Francisco celebrating 10 years of high tech coverage. It's the Cube covering Veum World 2019 brought to you by IBM Wear and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back to San Francisco. We continue our coverage here. Live on the Cube. 10th year John of covering Veum World This is 29 teens version John for John Wall's Got to have inside the Moscone Center. We're joined now by Varun Chabrol It was the vice president of marketing at Delhi M. C. Good to see you today. >> Thanks for having me. >> How's your week been? So far? >> It's been amazing. How can you don't get excited? All the innovation we're seeing this week >> we'll hear about some big announcements. Do you guys have made? And Moon Young Man Azzedine, who is the vice president of product marketing that for cloud security and works based solutions at Veum wear when you're good to see you. >> Good to see you again. You, By >> the way, you might be the busiest guy here. Yesterday, when you came into the set, you were coming in. Just spoken to 1300 people in a standing room only session You coming out? 500 folks, How many sessions have you done? The seven. So >> you don't count the the one on one with the analyst. And, uh, you know, the customers and partners and press. And tomorrow actually host ah 140 press media analyst on campus in Palo Alto from Asia Pacific because they float all the way from Asia >> plus 140. Yeah, it's a piece of cake. >> Yeah, hose them from 10 to 4. So, I mean, >> you're always smiling >> knowing that this is a pretty wide audience to whom you've been speaking. But just generally, what are you if there's a common thread at all about the kinds of questions that people are coming to you with, or or the concerns or maybe just the things they want to talk about being inspired. But what they're hearing here at the show, >> Okay. Now, according to two aspects of it, one obviously from analysts themselves, you know, they are actually have been very complimentary about the way we've taken our approach. I'm not sure if you could have paid attention. In the last couple of years, we've been talking especially the cloud side, the narrative, to be very much about use cases, solving problems. You know the key? No, we talked about hate my grade modernize. It wasn't about Hey, I've got the next big product here with all these features and capabilities. You do this and that. So we're gonna shifted out narrative. And it was very, you know, the the analyst across the boat. You know, we've been seeing an appreciative of the fact that you actually changing a narrative to be re compelling and we're gonna reflected. And we have some things here like Cloud City, where it's not a standard demo boot. It's a it's ah, Customers walk in and they touch and feel and see which we did it, Adele technology will, too. It's like, What's your business? Probably going through these applications. I'm sitting. I don't know if I should be modernizing them or should be migrating into Amazon. A ridge or so. So you know that narrative the analysts are appreciative off, and that reflects into the customer conversations I've been having in the briefings, like one on one with customers. They're really kind of lost us. D'oh! Hey, I've I'm working in this environment. There's a lot of pressure for me. Thio modernize my applications or go adopt my cloud. First strategy is where do I start? Where do I go? It's like, you know, there's a big pressure, so they just want clarity. I think in the end, everything we're gonna we're doing in our study that comes out obviously the buzzword for this weird world. It stanza, right? And, you know, >> we've won the product announcements was >> actually Brandon can Oh, yeah. Branding announcement, to be honest is yeah, because we're trying to bring together, as you know, in Tansy has landed in Bill Run Manage billed as in you know how our intent to acquire Pivotal Already acquired Big Tommy. How all our different acquisitions with different brand names are coming together to establish our bills portfolio again. The sphere. Everybody knows the sphere Project Pacific P ks. All of those create a good run time, environment and manageability like Adi manage with assets from ve Franta gain morbid Nami and you know it. So this multiple brands that are coming into this package off Iran. So we had a creative tan Xue too, you know, put forward statement together that yes is going to be 78 different brands coming into this, but going forward to stand. >> So so that's a great strategy on De Liam Seaside on Del Technology. Michael Dell was in here and I asked him. I said he could have been number one in everything you could. Let's talk about I'm number one in servers again. You kind of get on HP, little baby. But those air peace parts now. So we've got the cloud game. It's bringing despair it at parts together kind and making it coherent from a positioning standpoint and understandable and deployable. So you guys are going down there. That's your cloud strategy. Take a minute to explain that. >> Yeah, absolutely, John. So So what? What we've been doing. We announced this at Del Technologies will this year. But, you know, in the cloud infrastructure space, we're working very closely with the anywhere too tightly integrate our hardware solutions with their their cloud software. And we think that by combining these two in a tightly integrated joined engineer, jointly engineered solutions coupled with the service, is that you know, both of'em were and l e m c bring the customers we think we have. We're giving customers are very consistent experience both with their own premises, infrastructure with public cloud as well as with the edge cloud. And that's really what we're trying to do. That's what we've been building upon and uniting the announcements this week. You know, just just hopefully show customers that the sky's the limit, whether it's not just your infrastructure management. Also app development. Managing your APS both traditional and and cloud native. It's all here for And >> what's the big takeaway free from your standpoint that you'd like people to know about what's going on? Adele the emcee for the VM. Where relation. What's the big top item? >> Yeah, there's there's there's just so much good Doctor Wait forever drank the town about. If someone rises >> way, only have two hours >> time work. The most important thing that people should should know about it, >> you know, both deli M. C and V. M. R. I think, are very, very customer driven companies that we respond to customer feedback and we try to respond to them very fast. That's been true to our respective lifetimes and what we've done in the so that I think there's two broad areas of collaboration. One is in the cloud space, which is all about, you know, making sure that the the innovation that GM is bringing the market, we're providing that in a toy tightly integrated infrastructure solution. Right. So we announced from a deli in seaside support for Vienna, where p ks being deployed automatically on Vieques trail using VCF return. Our customers can you know, a lot of teams were telling us we have our developers and turning developers banging slash knocking on the door, saying we need to build a cloud. Native applications. You need to give us an environment that we can use. And you know, if if all righty, if these IittIe teams don't turn around and give them something relatively quickly Well, guess what? The developers will go somewhere else, right? Yeah, exactly. So And if you look at the kubernetes environment today, if you really look look at what the work that's required to set up kubernetes and ready infrastructure. So a lot of scripting a lot of manual, you know, work command line interface is testing stuff. And what what? V m r p k s does. And you know what times you will do as well is really makes it easy when we've taken that with the magic of the American Foundation sitting on top of the exhale to make it super easy for our customers to be able to deploy kubernetes ready infrastructure and then have it be ready for scale, right? And then the important thing here also is this is the same infrastructure of the expelling bcf that our customers are using for traditional applications as well, right? Trying to reduce that complexity. Give them the one platform. So this cloud, you know, we had we were doing the same integration on just with R A C I platform, but also with our best to breach storage or we're not working with the C f. And then we're also making investments on data protection like it's so important to be able to manage your data in this multi cloud world. We have applications sitting everywhere, data. We all know that it is a crown jewel. So >> it's really a king validating from the Vienna a point of view. How that works right is is about applications is about the infrastructure, and it's about the operation and it really kind of together as we talk about Han Xue p. K s is giving our customers that Chuy's off. You pick Cuban eighties, you know, environments, application choice. >> Um, >> it took us. Actually, we didn't We didn't arrive it in that order. Wait. Did it. In the outer off Infrastructure Plot Foundation is a critical piece of the joint engineering. But being aware and the Della Bella Technologies is really from aviary perspective. It took Locke Foundation, and that's the stack that runs in every public cloud. So, you know AWS as your G C P 4000 plus, you know, cloud provider partners. But Flat Foundation is a platform that was validated on. They'll take hardware and you know, that's the package. But now, as you see, we're lighting that it's same infrastructure up for traditional and culminated applications. >> I think the app sides important to point out, because if you could ve m wears heritage, you look at Dale's heritage. You had abs that ran on PCs absent, ran on servers, client server. And if you look at the fertilization that wasn't under the covers, apt an innovation that didn't require code changes. So that's the DNA that you guys have. Now, when you think about like cloud to point out which we've been riffing on that concept that's basically enterprise cloud mean donut. Hybrid cloud applications are gonna drive. The value on our premises is that they're going to be customer requirements that traditionally wouldn't have fit in the product. Marketing, management, featureless customs. Gonna define what they want. They'll build it, and then they'll dictate to the infrastructure to make it run. What? We can't do that yet. It'll be, Yes, we cannot be enabled to be dynamics. This is a a new cloud. 2.0, feature. This changes the complete game on suppliers >> completely agree. You know to your point, because, you know, you bring it thio back toward civilization. We've been going higher up the stack on So Day zero virtualization infrastructure will virtual eyes. So the line off abstraction has just been climbing from hardware retort realization next to like, you know, Pat platform of the service, and you kind of were working up our way down infrastructure. Now that base infrastructure platform looks like plants. Right? >> And there were times out a little bit over here. On the upside, you meet in the middle of >> it in the middle >> that is Hello, >> absolutely so ap and at middle wears shrinking down this way. Infrastructures. You know that the cloud incriminating stride in the middle to say, Well, that's a bit of, you know, infrastructure is a Kodak and pull. He's a bit of a AP AP eyes I can can I draw from And that's kind of nice future middleware. But our dad, I >> mean, I think applications air in charge, right? I mean, that's not sure That's the dynamic. That's the way it should be. But it never was that way before is basically the infrastructure was your gating factor. The network exact cloud two points Network security data. Yes, Dev Ops. A true Dev Ops Devane, Ops, Infrastructures Code. >> The only point I wanted to add is the reason the emphasis on abscess change acts in the past. Used to be a business support system after today is business. >> Yeah, I mean, it's >> really or you're you're gonna live or die based on the digital services you provide your customers. The other thing I was going to say about cloud 2.0, is that it's also becoming increasingly clear when we Dr customers that, um, customers are realizing Cloud is not a place right. There was this kind of cloud. One point it was okay. Big honking data centers, hyper skaters will be found now is that customers have gone through that process of and there's a lot more maturity in terms of understanding. What is good, better running on premises. What is what's better running in public Cloud? There's a place for both of them and that, um, and the cloud is actually the automation, the service delivery. It's Maurin operation and a way of being almost than a place. >> And what is it? Well, what does it do for you all? Then, in terms of challenge, especially at your teams, because you talk about all this customization, you're allowing the application to almost drive. You know, you're changing places in terms of who's the power of the relationship? Yes. Oh, me, yeah, How what? What does that do for you? Oh, in terms of how you approach that, how you change of mindset and how you change what you deliver? >> I think John, it's the way I think about it is that both daily emcee in Vienna, or any technology provider that's worth their salt is in the business of building platforms. Right? And platforms are essentially extensible. They're really they really provide a foundation that other people can innovate on top of it. And that's how I think you handled the customers issue. If one thing I think we can all agree on is that I t has always taught us there's no one size fits. All right? Right. So I think providing choice along every single dimension is super important for our >> customers. Yeah, I think that platform thing is a huge point. And I was gonna ask that question before John got jumped in because one of the things that you just brought up was platform is you guys have to build an enabling platform. One as suppliers. Okay, The successful cloud to point out cos are ones that are innovating in weird areas. Monitoring, for instance, they who will have thought that monitoring now observe ability would be such a massive, lucrative sector four. I pose M and A Why? Because it's data. It's instrumentation. This is operating system kind of thinking here is like network. So thinking like a platform on the supplier size one, the customers got to start thinking like a platform because their stakeholders air their internal developers or a P I shipping to suppliers. This is new for enterprises. This is news requires full hybrid capability. This requires date at the center of the value proposition. >> That's again the biggest value is business and I tr coming together on the area of applications and data. Yeah, that's starting up giving because the successful businesses are the ones who leveraged. Those guys have failed in the future, or the ones who don't pay attention to how critical applications are to the business logic and how critical data is to be able to mine and get the behavioral analytics to get ahead. And >> now the challenge in all this. But I'm learning and covering some of the public sector activity from the C I. A contract Jedi with Amazon to we had Raytheon Her here earlier is another customer example with another client is that procurement? And how they do business is not just a technical thing. There's like all this old legacy, things like, How do you procure technology, who you hire her and we hire developers? We build our own stack, so there's a lot of things going on. >> Yes, and you know, it's really interesting on the even on the procurement front, how our customers experience with Cloud has changed expectations, right, And that's really what we're doing with the McLaren DMC is what customers told us is, Hey, I love the agility of the cloud portal based access. Easy procurement. I love just being able to click a button and not have to navigate all this complexity. I need that for my own premises infrastructure. Imagine FRA structure. And that's, you know, in an example, while all of these dynamics are really all converging, >> well, if you can create abstraction, layer on a level of complexity and make things easy, simple and affordable, that's good business. Model >> one of our customers without taking the name right. The massive retailer you know they're spinning up, um, the retail outlets like crazy. They measure success in This was one truck roll, so they wanna have the entire infrastructure come into stand up one of the retail outlets in one truck roll. When everything comes in one button push that everything gets in a provision and up together. >> So that means I gotta have full software instrumentation automation Got intelligence. This is kind of where cloud 2.0, will lead us all >> likely. And that's expectation now that they go so fast and deploying this one Truck roll Hardware's there. Switch it on from the cloud it stood up and they're in operation 24 hours. >> Well, guys, we're going to get you on our power panels in our Palace of studio on this topic cloudy. But it's gonna be very aggressive and controversial topic because it's going to challenge the status quo. And that's really what this we're talking about >> that's in our DNA. >> And the good news is that that's more time with John. >> So as we before, we say so long, we've talked about clients. We talked about the folks you bet here. We talked about the presentation on this thing and what they're all getting out of it. What are you getting out of this? I mean, what are your takeaways? As you had back to your respective work orders, you get first. Okay? >> I think for me the biggest takeaway is just how incredibly vibrant via more user communities. I mean, it is unlike anything else I've seen before and now with the things like Project Pacific. I just feel like it's It's an opportunity for this community to be able to take the skills they have right now and actually go into this brave new world of containers with so much help forces having to do this all by yourself. Which means it's gonna be, you know, if you think about how largest community is, think about how much innovation this will spore in the container space and because of that in the application space and then because of that in business is I mean, this is a It just feels like a tipping point for me >> to me. Sure, I got high fives from every tech geek, you know, when we came out, you know, I also on our technical advisory boats for the company that these are the hot core geeks who were followed and you know us to the, you know, these were the fans and they were like, you know, they always kind of like if you walk out of them and you talk to them and they, uh how did it work? Because they my bar, you have a very high bar. They cut through all your marketing messaging. They go right to the hay. Is there meet in this And the high fives? I got the hajj. I got out. This is like, guys, you're nailing it. That's enough to tell me that a This is, like, 10 years ago. Yeah, that body. It's like you're so busy. I'm still smiling because the energy is I >> can't give you a hug. Give me a high five. Right. Good work, gentlemen. Thanks for the time. Always, he's still smiling to >> get you to a step. >> Good deal. Thanks for being with us. Thank you. Live on the Cube. You're watching our coverage in world 2019. Where? San Francisco. Back with more. Right after this.

>> live from San Francisco, celebrating 10 years of high tech coverage. It's the Cube covering Veum World 2019 brought to you by IBM Wear and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back, I'm stew minimum like co host for this segment is Justin War, and this is the 10th year of the Cube here at VM World 2019 when the lobby of Mosconi North and happened. Welcome to the program first, a first time guest on the program. June Yang, who is the vice president of product management and engineering at VM. Where. Thank you so much for joining us. >> Thank you for having me. >> And welcoming back to the program is Marin Cabra, who's the vice president. Product marketing of Cloud at Delhi emcee for in Great to See You, thanks to All right, June so many different pieces talking about Cloud Way. Think back 10 years ago, you know, Pomerance was talking about it like it's the software mainframe. What we're talking because, you know, even back then, you know, Cloud isn't really it's not a destination or a place. You know, there is no cloud is just somebody else's computer. It's more of an operating model, so of course, the VM work cloud on various solutions. Of course. Sitting here with Del, I'm sure we'll be talking about the V. MacLeod, a deli emcee. But just give us over a little bit about you know, you're in a lot of customer meetings. You know what's resonating with your customers. What are they coming to you tow? Discuss when it comes to their overall cloud strategy? >> Yeah, I think for a lot of customers, they're really looking for both the hybrid cloud story as well as a multi call story. I mean, this is something that Pat spend quite a bit of time talking to you on the Mondays keynote. We see customers clearly. Many of them have very large existing footprints on premises and edges again as a growing segment off their infrastructure. It's also getting very significant, making very significant investment over there. And of course, the public cloud itself. So we see many customer really trying to straddle the combination off the private cloud, the public cloud and the edge side, and our strategy is really we want to have a consistent infrastructure that's running everywhere, so therefore we have a consistent operational model that enables the customer and their advance to be to do that. >> Yeah, In some ways, it reminds me back. You know, in the early days when I worked with VM where every group had some application they'd built and you know which server they bought, you know, you know, they would run VM. We're underneath that because it would help with the efficiency in there. So in some ways, is multi cloud similar to what we had in multi vendor back in the day, >> I mean, we think of, you know, you think about the first it oration. Of'em were right. We're really thinking about We're taking the hype, the hyper visor, and making all the hardware underneath that to be really invisible right you're using, You're dealing with a high. You're doing the hyper visor and really hide it a head virginity off. What's underneath that? And then we talk about our STD Sierra, which is really focusing software defined data center were virtualized not only compute, but also storage and network as well and really hide in the head Virginity for that. And so the third iteration flies really looking at the cloud as the next level off you know, different instructor comes from money again. We want to go to hide that and offer consistent operational model there. >> So from the customer perspective, back in the day when Vienna, where was new It was new and scary for a lot of customers. And we had we saw that with cloud as well. So 10 years ago, Cloud was evil and wrong, and we should never use it. Customers have moved on in both of those cases Have we have We reached the point now where cloud is just Yes, it's accepted and we're going to be doing it. Are we? Are we going to have another battle about whether hybrid or multi cloud or customers just moved past that and are now looking at? We know what we want to use this for, so we know that we need to choose it. We're not gonna be moving everything to the cloud, but we're not gonna be putting everything in V EMS either. We're going to choose what is the right solution for the for the different views. Guys, >> I think over the last court, a couple of years that has become sort of the defective standard people comfortable with the cloud people comfortable with on premises. They know that it's gonna be hybrid cloud world. It's gonna be a multi cloud world. >> So Varun, we talked about the VM War cloud on Delhi M C. We had a number of conversations back. Adelle Technologies World. You know, earlier this year when you look out in the general market place, they're like, Oh, I look at the family. Well, Della's the hardware Veum. Where's the software? There are a lot of announcements this week that we're the cross pollination of pieces, and a lot of those are software pieces from the Dell family that tie into what's happening on VCF and the like. So bring us the update. >> Mr Was, as June said, both Daddy M. C and V M were incredibly customer driven companies, right? So what we've been hearing from customers is one. They're really excited about being able to try out the Ember cloud and a GMC, so we're very, very happy to be working with the hammer to bring this to market first. So that's something that that our customers have been asking us for. But then, along with that, as customers start understanding the model of the fully manage data. So you know the fully manage infrastructure you can. The next question that customers have is okay. I can now focus on higher value added service is And one of the things that immediately comes up next is okay. What about my data out? We're protected, right? I'm gonna be running applications on this. And we've already spoken on this show many times before. Data is increasingly one off our organization's most valuable assets. It's a competitive differentiator. Bc news, Every day, if it falls in the wrong hands, what happens? Right? So what we've been doing now, in addition to the three amazing amount of work that we've been doing the June's team to bring this to market, they've also been working on the data protection side. So now the deli emcee data protection is now validated to be working on Williams of you, MacLeod and DMC as the data protection solution. So this means that customers can not only take advantage of the the integration that we have on the infrastructure earlier. You can also take advantage of just have the peace of mind that our industry leading data protection solutions Will will be there to help them manage the data and protect their data. >> So it sounds like it's something that you don't have to think about it as an afterthought, which is often the challenge with data protection. If you if you wait to think about it, it never happens. So this pretty much just comes. We know it's gonna work. Turn it on Day one. Just have it. Start with your data being protected and just have that baked into the way that you run your operations so that it no longer becomes spinning up a specific backup project. Because those things that they always expensive, there's no there's no perceived value to the business of doing this, whereas if it's just now part off, this is how you run your infrastructure. So this is how you stand up via MacLeod on Delhi emcee, and this is just how you should do business. >> You know, it's absolutely like that way. What would we find? That's really exciting. What the Hammer Claw Run DMC is. Customers are asking us to deliver the cloud model right to their data centers do their edge locations, so that's how they want to consume software solutions as well. So what's amazing about the solution is you're you're doing everything to the browser. So that's how you're gonna cause you Data protection becomes an ad on service that you want to add on that. And I'm sure over time we're gonna enter the capabilities as well. But it's really that's the key part here. The ease of consumption it Sorry, The ease of use and basically being able to consume things through the browser is a game changer for for infrastructure, on data in the data center on the edge. >> So June 1 of the things that definitely has caught our attention and one of the bigger announcements this week is Tom Zoo in the con to Mission Control. That's what they call it because from going to have multiple locations, we've been looking for my entire career in I t o. You know, we're gonna have some tool that's going to manage across these environments and made a VM wear cloud, you know, on Delhi emcee. But I probably of'em were cloud on some of the public clouds, and I you might also be doing some kubernetes. That's not even with the V a more pieces, so help paint a picture is kind of where we are today and where we're going when it comes to you know that management consumption and maybe even some of the finances in getting to that cloud operating model across all my environments. >> Yeah, tonsil Vincenzo is a kind of follow. Your name for a number of products was in that tons of mission control, of course, is one part of that. The way we view Content Zoo is that this is really a multi called platform. We understand that customers of developers in particular, wanted to use consume, consume carbon eighties cluster and the often they want to choose communities. Cluster based on different cloud for variety reasons, sometimes cause something's resiliency, sometimes just geographical availability. And then there needs the way to be able to see this in the consolidated fashion. And that's what tons of mission control does. And that's when I showcase yesterday the keynote to really show that you can now have a single pane glass to be able to see all of these clusters across multiple clouds and and then be able to, you know, do some troubleshooting and so forth making things much easier that, of course, buildup Holly policies on top of these clusters and then welcome propagated changes and making sure those in force. So those are some really, really, I think, really good operational capabilities that really simplifies the data. The operational cut, you know, kind of the task that operator has to do its part of the >> driver for this, that that enterprises who got this investment in v sphere. So they've spent 10 years of 10 more years investing in envy sphere. And then all of a sudden, you've got these cloud people who want to come and do things in a completely different way. So now, as a business, I either I have to make a choice of what do I invest a lot of money in both of these things? Do I move everything to one model? It sounds like you're actually trying to provide customers with away. That's a look. You've already made these investments and you don't have to throw them all away. You can still operate things here, but you can also have these cloud things without having to move everything off into a completely different operating model. Is that fairly >> accurate. So I think we're very customer driven by We want to deliver what customer wants to. It wants to be able to consume S o. You know, That's why you know, part of the reason we're so excited about a Project Pacific on top of the V sphere side is really customer has made a huge investment on the visa for platform. And we've got 500,000 customers out there and tons of customers does. He becomes their standard in the data center and that you now have a kubernetes coming in and containers coming in and we don't want a customer. Have to do a siloed platform for it. And by embedding communities directly into V's for yourself, we have now made V's fear The platform for containers and for VMC Sport was well, so that investment customer has made on the on the VCR side. Now kind of moves out to people to cover the communities and containers as well. And because our std see and our hybrid cloud story we're taking the same V sphere across to be a mark on the deli Emcee the Mark child on aws mbm were cloud, you know on edge and so forth. That means all this benefits that fracture. Pacific greens is now going everywhere. >> Having spoken to some clients about the experience of even managed community service is it's really, really painful for them. So being about having these of use of these fear, if you could bring that to group in a visa and have that is a manage service, I'm sure you'll make a lot of people very happy. >> That's that's why we're so excited about it. >> Do you want to click one level further on the product Pacific stuff? Because the thing that struck me at first it's like, Wait, you know, containers and communities That's gonna be the cloud and being, you know, feast fear. We want to modernize it. But you know, that's not what I want to put in the public cloud. But Product Pacific. Is this primarily a data center offering? If I'm doing via more cloud in a public cloud to expect to be leveraging the native public cloud and then tan to helps me manage across them? Is that how we think of them? Or am I not getting the full story? >> So I think a little bit about you think about. There's 111 track is you can do is all these fear based clouds, right? These fear based on premise the sphere based on dahlia MSI ve sphere based on top of you know, public cloud right, That's one track if you follow that track than Project Pacific essentially allows you to be able to run both kubernetes and virtual machines on a single platform. Now, if customers also wanted to be able to run a native cloud, then this is what kind of bring tons of mission control in, because that's a multi called story. So that was kind of what paddle trying explain at the keynote in terms of hybrid cloud versus the versus the multi cloud. >> Okay, so you don't actually have to make a choice of one way of saying things, the tyranny of the single glass of pain. I have to make choices and you can't have a lot of things. And if there's one thing enterprises, height is that that's dedicating themselves to just one way of doing things, they like to have choice. >> We want to give them choices. Well, >> s O. B. Having that ability to be able to make those choices and have it be an end decision instead of war. I think that's >> so one of the questions we've gotten from customers this week is you know, your partners he had VM wear have just made a lot of acquisitions. It's a lot of integration work that needs to get it done. Their bills got strong experience in these things. That sit on top of the stack gives a little bit of what we should see going forward on your planet. >> I mean, I think if there's anything that's that's apparent this week, is that being there and L Technologies are just getting started. I mean, even as a having having known a little bit about some of these announcements, it was just so exciting to see all that stuff come Rio. And we're very, very excited to continue to work with the, um, where to bring. You know, Tan Xue. The various components attends a more Cooper container stuff as well, as well as other other capabilities that we saw in you realize orchestrator and automation. We want to bring that to our customers in an integrated fashion so that it's easy for them to deploy just easy for them to use. And so I think what you're seeing here is just the start. >> That sounds fantastic. Yeah. So all of this investment that women there were saying from from the M wear and from Delhi and see like our customers going to see the payoff immediately, like tomorrow. Or we're going to have to wait. Another wait for some of these investments and integration is to pay off. How long are we going away? >> You think a lot of this is coming to fruition already? We announced availability. Of'em were called on Dahlia emcee at B M World. So it's ready for customer to purchase today, right? If a customer wanted Thio, you know much like what I demolition at the keynote. If a customer has a data center, they want to stood up wherever they need to be taken, literally place, order and be able to get that right. So that's the benefit they can have immediately. And of course, a lot of the longer term things have been talking about by layering additional capabilities. When Project Pacific comes into for a shin, this becomes available, you know, across the veer mark Wild and tell'em see products as well. I mean, these things will all kind of continuous snowballing as we go forward. But there's immediate benefit today and they'll be ongoing benefit as we go forward, making additional investment. >> Excellent. I don't have to wait forever. >> Yes, yes, it's about instant gratification. That's the trick. Now >> what? Wonder if you could speak to kind of changing application portfolio. His customers are modernizing, Going cloud native on that, what's the impact on your platforms and what are you seeing and hearing from customers? >> You know, uh, there is obviously a lot of interest in containers, and customers are either already trying it out or having some sort of applications that her back is there or they have or they're looking at it and saying, This seems really interesting. In some ways, it seems very, very similar to what What I saw from customers five years ago when people were saying, I'm gonna move everything to the public club and, you know, sometimes you hear a little bit of I'm gonna move everything to containers. I think what we will likely see over the next few years is a little bit of rationalization, just like we saw with public and private, is that it's both. I think we will continue to see sort of traditional applications and new applications live in more off of'em centric model. And I think there will be as their new applications being built or as I squeeze package of their applications to be more container friendly. We'll see some go that way. I you know, if anything, I've learned it is One thing I've learned in the I T industry in all these years is there really isn't a one size fits all solution. We get very excited about things, >> and we're like, Oh, >> everybody's going to do this But the reality is, things balanced themselves out and into June's point as a vendor. What we want to do is we want to give our customers choice. But we know that there's no one size fits all, and we want them to choose what's right for their business and help them achieved their goals. >> So, June last question I have for you. Congratulations on the keynote yesterday way Heard way. No, a lot of the inside work and, you know, heard like the guy that swim across the English Channel like that got added to the agenda, you know, like days beforehand flew way. Understand? What happened with demos and last minute gives a little bit is to kind of the making of the team that helped put that together. You know anything that you know, you were super excited. That actually made the final stage that you might not have thought would've gotten there, >> you know, we started out was we were very ambitious, right? And we put in 15 or 16 demos into it. And as we started putting things together, time was our biggest enemy, you know? You know our friend Joe, who is, you know, running the day to show he was telling me you are 30 seconds over on this particular done, though you are 45 seconds on the other day. You give yourself credit here. I'm trying to tell the story here. So, unfortunately, we actually had to cut some demos out just because he couldn't fit into the scope of time. We want to make sure the story really comes out and the customer really understood what we're trying to show. I mean, I'm just so excited as part of the, you know, me doing the key day to keynote. I actually learned about a bunch of products I wasn't that familiar with. And so I was like, Wow, I didn't even know were doing that. And so just to see the amount of capabilities that we're bringing to bear, it's pretty astonishing and it's it's exciting. >> June, I'll say It reminds me of other cloud shows where there's so much going on so much new products getting launched that no single person can keep up with that. But thank you, June and Vern for helping our audience learn a little bit more about the areas that you're doing with >> my pleasure. >> Thank you for having us. >> Justin Warren. I'm still Minuteman back with more coverage at VM World 2019. Thank you for watching the Cube

>> Live from Las Vegas. It's theCUBE. Covering Dell Technologies World 2019. Brought to you by Dell Technologies and Etico System partners. >> Welcome back everyone. You are watching day three of theCUBE's live coverage of Dell Technologies World here in Sin City Las Vegas, Nevada. I'm your host Rebecca Knight along with my co-host Stu Miniman. We have Varun Chhabra who is the Vice President Product Marketing Cloud Dell EMC, welcome back to theCUBE Varun. >> Thanks for having me. >> And Mark Lohmeyer SVG/PM of Cloud Platform VMware. Thank you so much for coming on theCUBE. >> Thanks great to be here. >> So before the cameras were rolling we were talking that it should be a rap song, VMC on Dell EMC. (laughing) Tell us about the news this week. >> Yeah sure. So maybe I can kick it off. So real excited this Monday to introduce the VMware Cloud on Dell EMC and you know, as I sort of think back to when we first started discussions together between the two companies, we really had this sort of this angle in mind which was how do we bring the simplicity, the agility and sort of the consumption economics of a public cloud model right, but with the control, the security, the enterprise class capabilities, you know performance that customers expect from an on-prem environment and how could VMware and Dell work together to really jointly engineer something that we think would be really special and achieve those goals, and based on feedback that we got from customers, we're really pleased at sort of the reaction to this, and we think that's really going to hit the sweet spot of kind of best of those both worlds. >> So Varun, Dell EMC's been in the private cloud market for a bit, actually it was somebody on the EMC side that, as far as I know, was credited with coming with that terminology so some of this isn't new. Give us what is new about this offering compared to what we've done in the past. >> Yeah. Great question Stu. So essentially what is really innovative about this is that this is taking the public cloud model to on-premises as Mark said. It's a fully managed service where Dell Technologies and VMware are working together behind the scenes to provide that public cloud like experience, the hands-off operations, the ability to provision resources using a cloud portal right and have it be installed for you and set up. Once it's set up, software patches, operating system updates, hardware updates, all of them are basically going to be managed for you. If there's any support issues, the VMware team will file a ticket for you. You don't even need to file a ticket, it will be managed for you. This issue will be resolved. You know we think that this will be a really transformative way for customers to consume cloud resources, and this is all about bringing that cloud model to the data center where there's so much data, that customers already have. >> All right. So Mark there were ripples in the industry, a couple of years ago when the VMware cloud on AWS was out. >> Right. You know some people may have like hey why wasn't it done on the Dell stuff first but the thing I want to ask is, what have you learned from that AWS engagement and how did that impact what you're doing now on the Dell EMC? >> Yeah it's a great question. So I think one thing, so we learn from our customers right and the feedback they give us? One of the things that they shared is look they really like the fact that we're taking all of that grunge work off the table for them right? I mean if you're an IT department and a customer you're looking at for how you can deliver more value to the business right? And patching our software, upgrading our software, being responsible for hardware issues, that's not adding value to the business right? Ensuring their delivery in the application SLA, ensuring the application is secure, helping reduce cost, those are adding tremendous value to the business right? So the fact that we're able to deliver to them a cloud service, allows them to sort of elevate the value that they can offer and so that was one key insight. We wanted to bring all of those benefits to VMware cloud on Dell EMC on-prem. The second thing I would say is just technically you know, it's a very different model to ship a customer software and hardware and say you manage it right? You're responsible for the SLA versus delivering a true cloud service right? It requires a very different way to run your engineering team, it requires this thing called service ownership right? That you're accountable for the SLA of your code running your production, you need to build out a site reliability engineering team, and it really requires a very close engineering relationship between everyone who's working together to deliver that integrated cloud solution. So we're taking all of those learnings and insights that we got from our experience in the public cloud, and now applying them with Dell to bring those same benefits to customers in the private cloud. >> One of the things that we've talked a lot on theCUBE about, in particular this week, is just how close the Dell VMware relationship seems. You have said Stu, and you really know your stuff, that this is the tightest you've ever seen it. And here you are talking about this jointly designed, engineered. Can you describe a little bit about sort of the culture of this partnership and how these two tech giants work together? >> Yeah I can take a stab at it (mumbles). Look this is not new to us. We have been working together for a long time. But I think as you saw on the Keeno stage with Jeff and Pat together, this is a new level of a relationship in terms of having our engineering teams work together, figuring out how to deliver the best customer experience right? We already see that when we made our announcement three weeks ago with VxRail and VMware cloud foundations, being able to manage the entire life cycle, right from the workload all the way down to the physical infrastructure using VMware cloud foundations. This is a natural extension of that model for us. We're taking some of the same engineering work, the tight integration, and then adding on another benefit of managing this for the customer and making things simpler for them. And you know we think this is just the start. We think there is so much more goodness we can uncover for our customers as part of this journey. >> Yeah I think it's great. The only thing I would add is you know, the analogy I like to use is sort of like weightlifting. This is a muscle that we've been building between VMware and Dell for many years now right? Delivering a full cloud service on top of Dell hardware, that's like bench-pressing 200 pounds right? (laughing) So if you just like had never worked out before and someone gave you 200 pounds to bench-press, you probably wouldn't be successful. Now the good news is we've been working together for a number of years now. We've been building that muscle together between the two companies right? VMware on VxRail, VMware cloud on VxRail, and so now we're taking this next step forward, hey maybe we're going from benching 150 to benching 200. We have the ability to get there right? And so in many ways, our ability to be successful at this is based on the fact that we have been working together so well for a number of years now and building on that. >> Okay so Varun, we look at these different solutions in the marketplace and the space and sometimes it's a little tough to differentiate them because you know, you look underneath the covers and you got a lot of hardware geeks you know? I'm one of them, I'm open the back of the cabinet and show me and I'm like oh I recognize that box and I do this but like say for example, if I go talk to Microsoft and I look at Andro Stack, they like don't really think about the Dell server underneath there and the partner they got to have, this is Azure, so when you think about the operating model, when you think about the consumption model, when you think about the applications, this is "Azure". What I've had a little bit of trouble, and I'm hoping you can help me explain is, I think it's a similar type of story but there is no Dell EMC public cloud. There's VMware in a couple of environments so is that the right model to be thinking of? I mean this is as a service, it's a consumption model but are the applications similar to what I had if I've built a stack with Dell and VMware or you know, give me the compare and contrast as to what I've done before and some of the other options out there. >> Great question and I think it's something a lot of customers ask us as well. Look I think this is a very unique offer compared to what we've seen in the market recently for a variety of reasons. But the first thing I'll start with saying is that customers today are already using VMware and LEMC for their existing workloads right? This is essentially the same platform so the tools that they use today vSphere, it's the extra migrate workloads, NSX, VSAN, they are going to be able to carry forward all the work they've done there on this platform. That's why it's no different from that perspective. So the learnings they have, the processes, the automation, the eco-system of back-up disaster recovery that they use today, they're going to be able to use later as well, with this as well so this is less disruptive for them. So that's the first thing. The second thing I'd say is you know, we think we have a unique advantage because we have a long heritage of working with customers in their data centers. Whether its VMware or Dell EMC or us combined together. Being able to manage the complexity, the thousands of variables in a data center that a customer has, where things are not just homogenous, everything is not standardized, it's very very different problem from talking about a homogenous cloud data center where everything is standardized, everything is built for automation. We think we have a unique capability to be able to do that, and not only from a day zero day one perspective, also from a support perspective. You know this is a fully managed service which means if things are you know, if something breaks, we may have to go down and actually go to the customers site and actually fix that. We have a support organization across VMware and Dell EMC already built today. Full scale. Every single country. Wherever people's data centers are. Again a different support model. We think this will be a journey for folks who don't have that built out, and finally, I think, I'm biased, but I think infrastructure matters. If you're going to take a bet on this platform for your edge locations, your retail locations, your thousands of retail locations, sure it's a fully managed service but you need to have the peace of mind that this is going to continue to work for you. Even in a fully managed scenario, it is disruptive if there's hardware failures. So VxRail is a platform that customers all around the world bet on. There's more than 4000 customers at VMware and Dell EMC have jointly driven success with so we think these are going to be unique factors that will create value for customers. >> Okay. So for the support model I understand. The question we've been talking the various solutions in the portfolio is the nirvana is that cloud operating model that I don't need to worry about what version it's running. Whether the latest security patch is in there because that's been taken care of for me. Are we close to that? Are we at that? How does that look? >> That's exactly the idea. That's exactly what we're going to deliver right? And that's powerful for the reasons you articulated. But even more than that I would say it's an amazing vehicle for us to deliver value and innovation to our customers right? You know, traditional model hey VMware developed software. It takes a year or two to develop. We deliver to the customer. They take another six months to a year to upgrade it, it's two to three years' latency between when an engineer has a good idea or a customer asks for something before they can reasonably get to take advantage of it in production. With this new cloud delivery model that we're building together, that latency shrinks down to potentially just weeks right? Because we are upgrading that service on a continuous basis. We can push those new innovations to our customers much more rapidly and they can immediately begin consuming them. Like literally those new features just show up in the service just like on your iPhone or whatever other service you might be using. Same model can now apply to the data center so its an incredibly powerful thing for our joint customers. It's also real exciting for our joint engineering teams right? You think about an engineer. They take pride in seeing the value of their work being used by customers and we can take that from two to three years, to two to three weeks. That's a tremendous thing. >> Real instant gratification. >> Yeah! >> Which makes for a happier employee, which makes for-- >> Time to innovate more right? >> All of that. >> You got it yeah. >> Great. Well Mark and Varun thank you so much for coming on the show. It was great having you. >> Thanks for having us. >> Thanks for having us. >> I'm Rebecca Knight for Stu Miniman. We will have much more of theCUBE's live coverage of Dell Technologies World coming up in just a little bit. (digital music)

>> Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE, covering Dell Technologies World 2019. Brought to you by Dell Technologies and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back to theCUBE's live coverage of Dell World Technologies here in Las Vegas. I'm your host, Rebecca Knight, along with my co-host, Stu Miniman. We have two guests on this segment. Both CUBE veterans, so. (laughs) We have Varun Chhabra. He is the VP, Product Marketing, Cloud Dell EMC and Muneyb Minhazuddin, VP Solutions Product Marketing at VMware. Thank you so much for coming on the show. >> Thanks for having us. >> Thanks for having us. >> So we just had the keynote address. We heard from Michael Dell, Sachin Adela, Pat Gelsinger. It's a real who's who of this ecosystem. Break it down for us. What did we hear? What is sort of the most exciting thing from your perspective, Varun? >> So, Rebecca, what we hear from customers again and again is it's a multicloud world, right? Everybody has multiple cloud deployments. We saw Pat mention five on average, cloud architectures in customer environments. And what we keep hearing from them is there are operational silos that develop as part of the tool set, the SLAs that are different, the machine formats. All of these things just lead to a lot of operational silos and complexity. And what customers are overwhelmingly asking Dell EMC as well as VMware, is that how do we reduce this complexity? How do we be able to move work loads together? How do we manage all of this in a common framwork and reduce some of that complexity, so that really they can take advantage of the promise of multicloud. >> So Muneyb, theCUBE goes to, you know, all the big industry shows. >> Right. >> I feel like everywhere I go used to be, you know, it's like Intel and NVIDIA up on stage with the next generation. Well, for the last year, it felt like, you know, Pat and Sanjay were, you know, somebody like that, you know, up on stage. We have the Google cloud event a couple of weeks ago. There was Sanjay up on stage. You come here, there's Sachin Adela up on stage. So, let's talk about that public cloud piece. You know, we know the relationship with AWS, VMware cloud on AWS sent ripples through the industry. And, you know, the Google cloud piece. So tell us what's new, anything different about the Microsoft piece when it comes to public cloud. And how does that fit in relation to all the other clouds? >> Sure, no, I'll amplify what Varun said, right. We think about customer's choice first. And really customer choice as you know, you got multiple cloud providers. We've seen customers makes this choice of, I need to make this, you know, a multi-cloud world. Why are they going towards the multi-cloud world is because applications are going there. And really VMware's strategy has been to say how do we empower customers with that choice? Our, you know, AWS partnership is as strong as ever. We continue to innovate there. And that was our first kind of choice of platform. And Pat alluded to this on the stage. We have 4,000 cloud provider partners, right. And the 4,000 cloud provider partners we've built over the years, and that include, you know, not small names. They include IBM. Like you know they've got Rackspace, some of the biggest cloud providers. So our strategy has always been how do we take our stack and land it in as many public clouds as possible? So we took the first step of IBM, then about 4,000 other cloud providers, be it Rackspace, Fujitsu, Hitachi. Then came Amazon, Amazon being the choice of destination for a lot of public clouds. Today, we kind of further extend that with Microsoft, and you know a few weeks ago with Google. So this is really about customer choice and customers when they want the hybrid multi-cloud piece, it's app-driven. Right, you got two worlds. You got an existing application and you're looking to get some scale out of that existing application. And you're building a lot of native cloud, native applications. They want this, you know, in multiple places. >> All right, so if I could just drill down one level deep. So if I'm going to ask your customer today, my understanding is the VMware's DDC Stack, what does that mean, what do I use, how is that look and feel compared, do I use the Microsoft system center, am I using vCenter, you know. >> Sure, this is really, again, an app-driven conversation, right. There were multiple announcements in here, just to unpack them. It was like, hey, we have the Dell Technologies cloud platform. The Dell Technologies cloud platform is powered by DELL EMC infrastructure and VMware Cloud Foundation on top, virtualizing your full compute network storage with vShere, vSAN, NSX, and management, right. And the second part was really we've got VMware Cloud on a Dell EMC. This is to bring cloud to the work loads, which did in public clouds. We're seeing this repatriation of work loads back on the data center or the edge. This is really driven by a lot of customers who have built native IP in the public cloud, be it Amazon, be it Azure, who want to now bring some of those work loads closer to the data center or the edge. Now this comes to, how do I take my Azure work loads and bring it closer to the edge or my data center? Why is that a need? You know we have large customers, large customers, multi-national, they have 500,000 employees 90 locations worldwide who've built IP, or when I say IP applications natively in cloud. Suddenly for 500,000 employees in 90 locations, they're going ingress egress traffic to the cloud, public cloud, it's huge. How do I bring it closer to my data centers, right? And this is where taking Azure work loads, bringing them on prem, closer, solves that big problem for them. Now, how do I take that work loads and bring them closer, is that's where we landed in the VMware on Dell EMC infrastructure because this brings you closer to the data center, gives me either low latency, data governance, and control, as well as flexibility to bring these work loads back on prem, right? So the two tangents that you're driving, both your cloud growth and back to the edge, the second tangent of growth or explosion is cloud native work loads. You're able to bring them closer to your data center is purely the value proposition, right. >> Well, we heard so much about that on main stage this morning, about just how differently the modern workforce works, in terms of the number of devices they use, the different locations they are when they are doing the tasks of their job. Can you talk a little bit about the specifics in terms of customers you're working with, you don't need to name names, but just how you are enabling those people to be more productive, be more collaborative, and to get their jobs done. >> You know, we get feedback from customers in all industries, so Muneyb can share a few as well. We have large banks that are, you know, they're standardized their work loads on VMware today, as have many more organizations and they're looking for the flexibility to be able to move stuff to the cloud or move it back on premises and not have to reformat, not have to change their machine formats and just make it a little bit easy. They want the flexibility to be able to run applications in their bank branches in the cloud. But then they don't necessarily want to adopt a new machine format or a new standardized platform. That's really what the Azure announcement helps them do. Just like with Data Blue S can now move work loads seamlessly to Azure, use vCenter, use your other tools that you're familiar with today already to be able to provision your work loads. >> All right, Varun, wonder if we can drill into the stack a little bit here. I went to the Microsoft show last year and it was like, oh, WSSD is very different than Azure Stack, even if you look at the box, then it's very much the same. Underneath the covers, there was a lot of discussion of VxRail. We know how fast that's been growing. Can you, I believe there was two pieces to this, there's the VCF on VxRail and then, you know, help explain some of the differences. >> Yeah, so for the Dell Technologies cloud platform announcement, which is, as you said, VxRail HCI infrastructure with VMware Cloud Foundations tightly integrated. So that that the storage, compute, and networking capabilities off of VMware Cloud Foundation are all incorporated and taken advantage of within the HCI infrastructure. This is all about making things easier to consume, reducing the complexity for customers. When they get VxRail, they overwhelmingly tell us they want to use VMware Cloud Foundations to be able to manage and automate those work loads. So we're packaging the sup out of the box. So when customers get it, they have the cloud experience on premises without the complexity of having to deploy it because it's already integrated tightly. The engineering teams have actually worked together and then you can then, as we mentioned, extend those work loads to public cloud using the same tools, the same VMware Cloud Foundation tools. >> And you know, we built on Cloud Foundation for a while. I'm sure you followed us on the Cloud Foundation. And that has been, when, yes, we talk about consistent infrastructure, consistent operations in this hybrid cloud world. And what we really mean is that VMware Cloud Foundations stack. Right, so when we talk about VMC on AWS, is that Cloud Foundation stack running inside of Amazon. When we talk about, you know, our partnership with Azure is that VMware Cloud Foundation stack running on Azure. When we talk about these 4,000 partners, cloud certified, IBM, it is the Cloud Foundation stack. And the key components being the full stack, vSphere, vSAN, NSX, and there's a critical bar in Cloud Foundation call life cycle management. It's missed quite easily, right. The benefit of running a public cloud, they key three attributes you get is you get everything as a service, you get all your infrastructure as software, and the third part is you don't spend any time maintaining the inter-operability between your compute, network, storage. And that is a huge deal for costumers. They spent a lot of time just maintaining this inter-op. And VMware Cloud Foundation has this life cycle manager which solves that problem. That is key. >> Thank you for bringing that up, because, right, one of the big differences you talk about public cloud, go talk to your customer and say, hey, what version of Microsoft Azure are you running? And they'll laugh at you and say, like, well, Microsoft takes care of that for me. Well, when I differentiate and I say, Oh, okay, I want to run the same stack in my environment, how do I keep that up-to-date. We know that VMware customer, it's like, there's lot of incentives to get them there but oftentimes they're N minus one, two, or something like that. So how do we manage and make sure that it is more cloud-like and up-to-date? >> Yeah, absolutely, so there's two ways to do that. One of them is, because the VMware and Dell EMC teams are working on engineering closely together, we're going to have the latest version supported right out of the gate. So you have an update, you know that it's going to work on your hardware, or vice versa. So that's one level. And then with VMware Cloud on Dell EMC, we're also providing the ability to basically have hands-off management and have that infrastructure run in your data center or your edge locations, but at the same time not have to manage it. You leave that management to Dell Technologies and to VMware, to be able to manage that solution for you. So really, as Muneyb said, bringing that public cloud experience to your on-premise locations as well. >> And I think that's one of the big differentiators that's going to come, right? People want to get that consumption model, and they're trying to say, hey, how do I build my own data center, maintain it, but at the same time I want to rely on Dell and VMware to come and help us build it together, right. And the second part of the announcement was really, hey, VMware, Dell, on a Dell EMC, is that manage service offer. The demo you saw from June Yang was being able to have a consumption interface where you can kind of click of a button roll it back into a data center as well as an edge. 'Cause you have really literally very little IT skill sets where in the edge environment, and as edge compute needs become more prolific with 5G, IoT devices, you need that same kind of data governance model and data center model there as well. And that really the beauty of coming to VMware and Dell DMC, Dell Technologies' power, is to maintain that everywhere, right? >> I want to ask you about innovation. One of the things that was really striking during the keynote was the Bank of America executive saying I rely on Dell Technologies to be thinking about four steps ahead of me, even though I obviously have my own customers' needs that I need to be thinking of. I need Dell to be four steps ahead. So how are you, how are you getting in the heads of these obvious problems. >> I think it really comes down to listening to customers, right. As Dell Technologies, as VMware, we have the advantage of working with so many customers, like hundreds of thousands of customers around the world. We get to hear and listen and understand what are the cutting-edge things that customers are looking for. And then we can now take that back to customers like Bank of America, who may have thought about certain scenarios that we would learn from, but they might not have thought about other industries where things could be applicable to their industry. So that drives a lot of our innovation. We are very proud about the fact that we are customer-focused. Our innovation is really driven by listening to customers and having smart people just work on those problems. >> And, you know, customer voice is a big deal. Customer choice, that's why we're doing what we're doing with multiple cloud providers, right? And I think this is really a key to, if you just look at VMware's innovation, we're already talking about this multi-cloud world, where it's like, hey, you've got work loads natively, so how do you manage those? We're already ahead in thinking about Kubernetes with acquisition of Heptio. And you think about it, we've done this innovation in the cloud space, established this hybrid credibility, and we've launched it with Dell Technology now. We're already ahead in this multi-cloud operational model, we're already ahead in this Kubernetes evolution. We'll bring it back with the family and listen to the customers for choice because at the end of the day, we're here to solve customer problems, right? >> I think that's another dimension of choice that we offer, which is both traditional applications as well as applications of the future that will increasingly be customer container based. >> Yeah, I'm just wondering if you can expand on a little bit. You know, one of the things I said, VMware is great, it really simplified the environment. I go back 15 years ago. One of the things it did is, let me take my old application that was probably long in the tooth to begin with, my hardware's out of date, my operating system out of date, stick it in a VM and leave it for another five years. And the users of that are like, oh my gosh, I need an update. How do we get beyond that and allow this joint solution to be an accelerant for applications? >> Yeah, and I think that application is probably the crux of the business, right, we're-- >> It's a long pole in the tent for making change, but uh. >> And applications have evolved. This is actually the evolution journey of IT itself, is where there used to be support systems, now they become actually translate to business dollars, 'cause you know the first thing that your customer, often customer touches, is an application. And you can drive business value from it. And customers are thinking about these old applications and new applications, and they have to start thinking about where do I take my applications, where do they need to land, and then make the choice of what infrastructure is the best platform for it. So really you're going to flip the thing on, don't think infrastructure first and then retrospect apps to it, think app first and then make a choice on infrastructure based on your application need. And really, like you said, VMware kind of took the abstraction layer away from infrastructure and made sure that your VMs could from everywhere. We're taking the same for applications to say, doesn't matter if it's a VM-based, it's a cloud native, we'll give you the same consistent infrastructure and operations. >> Okay, Varun, last thing, could you just tell us of the announcements that are made. What's available today? What's coming later this year? >> Absolutely, so the Dell Technologies cloud platform that's based on VxRail and VMware Cloud Foundation is available now as an integrated solution. The VMware Cloud on Dell EMC, the fully managed offer, is available in the second half of this year. It's in beta right now and, as you saw, we have really good feedback from our customers. And then I think the Azure VMware Solutions offer will be available soon as well. >> All right, well, Varun and Muneyb, congratulations on the progress. We look forward to talking to the customers as they roll this out, and Rebecca and I will be back with lots more coverage here at Dell Technologies World 2019, wall-to-wall coverage, two sets, three days, tenth year of theCUBE at EMC and Dell World. I'm Stu Miniman and thanks so much for watching theCUBE. (upbeat music)

>> live from Las Vegas. It's the queue covering del Technologies. World twenty nineteen. Brought to you by Del Technologies and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back to the cubes Live coverage of Del World Technologies Here in Las Vegas. I'm your host, Rebecca Night, along with my co host Stew Minutemen. We have two guests on the seven, both both Cube veterans. So we have Varun Cabra. He is the VP product Marketing Cloud Delhi Emcee and Moeneeb unit. Minute Soudan VP Solutions Product marketing at VM. Where. Thank you so much for coming on the show. >> Thanks for having >> thanks for having us. So we just had the keynote address we heard from Michael Dell Satya Nadella Pack Girl Singer It's a real who's who of this of this ecosystem. Break it down for us. What? What did we hear? What is what is sort of the most exciting thing from your perspective? >> So, Rebecca, what? What we hear from customers again and again is it's a multi cloud world, right? Everybody has multiple cloud deployments, but we saw that mentioned five on average cloud architectures in customer environments and what we keep hearing from them is they There are operational silos that developed as part of the to set the fellas that are different. The machine formats. All of these things just lied a lot of lead to a lot of operational silos in complexity, and the customers are overwhelming or willingly asking William C. As well as being Where is that? How do we reduce this complexity? How do we we'll be able to move, were close together? How do we manage all of this in a common framework and reduce some of the complexity? So there's really they could take advantage off the promise of Monte Club. >> Yeah, so many. The Cube goes to all the big industry shows. I feel like everywhere I go used to be, you know, it's like intel and in video, up on stage for the next generation. Well, for the last year, it felt like, you know, patent Sanjay, or, you know, somebody like that, you know, up on stage with Google Cloud of a couple of years ago, there was Sanjay up on St Come here. They're searching Adela up on stage. So let's talk about that public cloud piece China. We know you know the relationship with a wsbn were clad in a ws sent ripples through the industry on you know, the guru cloud piece. So tell us what's new and different peace when it comes to come up to public clouded. How does that fit with in relation to all the other clouds? >> Sure, no, I'll amplify. You know what Aaron said, Right? We think about customer choice first. Andrea Lee, customer choice. As you know, you got multiple cloud providers. We've seen customers make this choice off. I need to make this, you know, a multi cloud world. Why're they going towards the multi clothing world? It's because applications air going there on really well, where strategy has bean to say, How do we empower customers without choice? Are you know, eight of us partnership is as strong as ever, but we continue to eat away there, and that was their first going to choice a platform. And Patty alluded to this on the stage. We have four thousand cloud provider partners right on the four thousand block provider partners we've built over the years, and that includes, you know, not small names. They include IBM. They, like, you know, they've got in Iraq space. Some of the biggest cloud providers. So our strategy is always being. How do we take our stack and and lighted and as many public laws? It's possible. So we took the first step off IBM. Then you know, about four thousand. You know, other plot providers being Rackspace, Fujitsu, it's Archie. Then came Amazon. I'm is on being the choice of destination for a lot of public clouds. Today we kind of further extend that with Microsoft and, you know, a few weeks ago with Google, right? So there's really about customer choice and customers when they want the hybrid multi Claude fees his abdomen right. You got two worlds, you couldn't existing application and you're looking Just get some scale out of that existing application and you're building a lot of, you know, native cloud native applications. They want this, you know, in multiple places. >> All right, so if I could just drilled down one level deep, you know? So if I'm in as your customer today, my understanding it's Veum or STD. Sea Stack. What does that mean? You know what I use, You know? How is that? You can feel compare? Do I use the Microsoft? You know System Center. Am I using V Center? You know, >> shark now, and this is really again in an abdomen. Calm conversation, right where they were multiple announcements in here just to unpack them there. It's like, Hey, we had the Del Technologies Cloud platform. The Del Technologies clock platform is powered by, you know, Delhi emcee infrastructure and be aware Cloud Foundation on top, where slicing your full computer network storage with the sphere of visa and a sex and management. Right. And the second part was really We've got being where cloud on a deli emcee. The system brings a lot of the workloads which stood in public clouds. We're seeing this repatriation off workloads back on. You know, on the data center are the edge. This is really driven by a lot of customers and who have built native I pee in the public cloud beyond Amazon beat ashore who want to now bring some of those workloads closer to the, you know, data center or the edge. Now this comes to how do I take my azure workloads and bring it closer to the edge or my data center? Why's that? I need you know, we have large customers, you know. You know, large customers multinational. They have, you know, five hundred thousand employees, ninety locations will wide. Who built to I p or when I say I p applications natively in cloud suddenly for five thousand employees and ninety locations, they're going ingress egress. Traffic to the cloud public cloud is huge. How do I bring it closer to my data centers? Right. And this is where taking us your workloads. Bringing them, you know, on prime closer salts. That big problem for them. Now, how do I take that workloads and bring them closer? Is that where we landed in the Veum wear on Del, you know AMC Infrastructure? Because this big sea closer to the data center gives me either Lowell agency data governance and you know, control as well as flexibility to bring these work clothes back on. Right? So the two tangent that you're driving both your cloud growth and back to the edge The second tangent of growth or explosion is cloud native workloads. We're able to bring them closer. Your data center is freely though the value proposition, right? >> Well, we heard so much about that on the main stage this morning about just how differently with modern workforce works in terms of the number of devices that used the different locations they are when they are doing the tasks of their job. >> You talk a little bit about the >> specifics in terms of customers you're working with. You don't need a name names. But just how you are enabling the >> way get feedback from customers in all industries, right? So you don't even share a few as well Way have large banks that are, you know, they're standardized their workloads on VM where today, right as as have many Morgan is ations, and they're looking for the flexibility to be able to move stuff to the cloud or moving back on premises and not have to reformat, not have to change that machine formats and just make it a little easy. They want the flexibility to be able to run applications in their bank branches right in the cloud, right? But then they don't they don't necessarily want adopt a new machine format for a new standardized platform. That's really what Thie azure announcement helps them do, Just like with eight of us, can now move workloads seamlessly to azure USVI center. Use your other you know, tools that you're familiar with today. Already to be ableto provision in your work clothes. All >> right, so for and what? Wonder if we could drill into the stack a little bit here? You know, I went to the Microsoft show last year, and it was like, Oh, WSSD is very different than Azure Stack even if you look at the box and it's very much the same underneath the covers, there was a lot of discussion of the ex rail. We know how fast that's been growing. Can you believe there's two pieces? This there's the VCF on Vieques rail and then, you know, just help. Help explain >> s o for the Del Technologies Cloud Platform announcement, which is, as you said, VX rail in first hcea infrastructure with Mia McLeod foundations tightly integrated, right, so that the storage compute and networking capabilities of off the immortal foundation are all incorporated and taken advantage off it. In the end structure. This is all about making things easier to consume, right, producing the complexity for customers. When they get the X trail, they overwhelmingly tell us they want to use the metal foundations to be able to manage and automate those workloads. So we're packaging this up out of the box. So when customers get it, they have That's cloud experience on premises without the complexity of having to deploy it because it's already integrated, cited the engineering teams have actually worked together. And then you can then, as we mentioned, extend those workloads to public loud, using the same tools, the same, the MSR foundation tools. >> And, you know, uh, we built on Cloud Foundation for a while, and I'm sure you followed us on the Cloud Foundation. And that has bean when you know yes, we talk about consistent infrastructure, consistent operations, this hybrid cloud world and what we really mean. Is that really where? Cloud foundation stack, right? So when we talk about the emcee on eight of us, is that Cloud foundation stack running inside of Amazon? When we talk about you know, our partnership with the shore, he's not being where Cloud Foundation stack running on a shore. We talk about this four thousand partners. Cloud certified IBM. It is the Cloud Foundation stack and the key components being pulled. Stack the Sphere v. Santana Sex and there's a critical part in Cloud Foundation called lifecycle management. It's, you know, it's missed quite easily, right? The benefit of running a public cloud. The key through the attributes you get is you know, you get everything as a service, you get all your infrastructure of software. And the third part is you don't spend any time maintaining the interoperability between you compete network storage. And that is a huge deal for customers. They spent a lot of time just maintaining this interrupt and, you know, view Marie Claude Foundation has this life cycle manager which solves that problem. Not not just Kee. >> Thank you for bringing it up because, right, one of the big differences you talk about Public Cloud, go talk to your customer and say, Hey, what version of Microsoft Azure are you running and the laughter you and say like, Well, Microsoft takes care of that. Well, when I differentiate and I say Okay, well, I want to run the the same stack in my environment. How do I keep that up today? We know the VM where you know customers like there's lots of incentives to get them there, but oftentimes they're n minus one two or something like that. So how do we manage and make sure that it's more cloud like enough today? >> Yeah, absolutely. So. So there's two ways to do that to one of them is because the V m. A and L E M C team during working on engineering closely together, we're going to have the latest word in supported right right out the gate. So you have an update, you know that it's gonna work on your your hardware or vice versa. So that's one level and then with via MacLeod and L E M C. We're also providing the ability to basically have hands off management and have that infrastructure running your data center or your eyes locations, but at the same time not have to manage it. You leave that management to tell technologies into somewhere. To be able to manage that solution for you is really, as Moody said, bringing that public loud experience to your own premise. Locations is long, >> and I think that's one of the big, different trainers that's going to come right. People want to get that consumption model, and they're trying to say, Hey, how do I build my own data center, maintain it, but the same time I want to rely on, you know, dull and beyond Where to come and help us build it together. Right? And the second part of announcement was really heavy and wear dull on the d l E M C. Is that Manager's offered the demo you saw from June. Yang was being able to have a consumption interface where you could connect click of a button, roll it back into a data center as well. It's an edge because you have real Italy. Very little skill sets where night in the edge environment and as EJ Compute needs become more prolific with five g i ot devices, you need that same kind of data governance model and data center model. There is well and not really the beauty off, you know, coming to be aware. And Delta, you know Del DMC del. Technology's power is to maintain that everywhere, right? I >> won't ask you about >> innovation. One of the things that's really striking during American executive, Even though I obviously have my own customers, >> I think it really comes down to listening to customers. Write as as Del Technologies is Liam, where we have the advantage of working with so many customers, hundreds of thousand customers around the world we get to hear and listen and understand what are the cutting edge things that customers are looking for? And then we can not take that back to customers like Bank of America who may have taught about certain scenarios right that we will learn from. But they may not have thought about other industries where things could be applicable to their street, so that drives a lot of our innovation. Very. We are very proud about the fact that we're customer focused. Our invasion is really driven by listening to customers on. And, you know, having smart people just work on this one to work on this problems. And, >> you know, customer wise is a big deal customer choice. That's why we're doing what we're doing with multiple cloud providers, right? And I think this is really a key, too. If you just look at being where's innovation were already talking about this multi claude world where it was like, Hey, you've got workloads natively. So we How do you manage? Those were already ahead and thinking about, you know come in eighties with acquisition of Hip Tio and you if you think about it, you know, we've done this innovation in the cloud space established this hybrid credibility on we've launched with Del Technology. Now we're already ahead in this multi cloud operational model. We're already ahead in this coop in eighties. Evolution will bring it back with the family and listen to the customers for choice. Because of the end of the day, we're here to South customer problems. I >> think that's another dimension of choice that we offer, which is both traditional applications as well as applications of the future that will increasingly, because container based, >> yeah, I just wonder if you could spend on a little bit. You know what? One of the things I said via Moore is great. It really simplified and by environment, I go back. Fifteen years ago, one of things that did is let me take my old application that was probably long in the tooth. Begin with my heart was out of date, my operating system at eight, sticking in of'em and leave it for another five years, and the users that are like, Oh my gosh, I'd need an update. How do we get beyond that and allow this joint solution to be an accelerant for applications? >> Yeah, and I think you know the application is probably the crux of the business, right? >> We'Ll call in the tent from >> change applications of Evolve. This is actually the evolution journey of itself is where they used to be, like support systems. Now they become actually translate to business dollars because, you know, the first thing that your customer awful customer touches is an application and you can drive business value from it. And customers are thinking about this old applications and new applications. And they have to start thinking about where do I take my applications? Where do they need to line and then make a choice off? What infrastructures? The best black mom for it. So really can't flip the thing on. Don't think infrastructure first and then retrospect APS to it. I think at first and then make a charge on infrastructure based on the application need and and really look like you said being where kind of took the abstraction layer away from infrastructure and make sure that you'll be EMS could run everywhere. We're taking the same for applications to say. Doesn't matter if it's of'Em based. It's a cloud native will give you the same, you know, inconsistent infrastructure in operations. >> Okay, we're in that last thing. Could you just tell us of the announcements that were made? What's available today? What's coming later this year? >> Absolutely So Del Technologies Cloud Platform that's based on the X Trail and via MacLeod Foundation is available now as an integrated solution via MacLeod and Daddy and see the fully managed offer is available in >> the second half of this >> year. It's invader right now. And as you saw, we have really good feedback >> from our customers. And then I think >> the, uh, the Azure BMR Solutions offer will be available soon as well. >> All right, well, Varun and many Congratulations on the progress. We look forward to talking to the customers as they roll this out, and Rebecca and I will be back with lots more coverage here. Del Technologies World twenty nineteen. Little coverage to sets three days, tenth year, The Cube at M. C and L World. I'm still many men. And thanks so much for watching

>> Announcer: Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE covering Dell Technologies World 2018. Brought to you by Dell EMC and its ecosystem partners. (upbeat music) >> Welcome back to theCUBE's continuing coverage of Dell Technologies World live from Las Vegas. I'm Lisa Martin with my co-host Keith Townsend and we're excited to welcome to theCUBE for the first time, Varun Chhabra, Senior Director, Product Marketing, Dell EMC Storage and Data Protection. Hi Varun. >> Hi, thank you for having me. >> Oh, our pleasure. So, the theme of first Dell Technologies World, huge 14,000 people. >> Absolutely. >> 5,000 plus partners here (audio dropping) make it real. What does that mean? What are you helping customers make real as it relates to all these different, transformational initiatives. Digital, IT, workforce, security. >> I'm a product marketer by trade, so we throw around a lot of buzz words, right. We've been guilty of that. But one of the things that I've observed over the last year or so is, every customer that we speak to, they're really thinking about digital transformation. And, you know, it could have different words but really what it means is, the economy is getting increasingly digitized. When you have something getting increasingly digitized it leaves a digital marker. Every activity leaves a digital marker. In other words, that's basically data. What is data but a digital marker? It's just fascinating, the customers that we talk to, they're very aware that there's because of all this activity that they're able to track and draw insights out of, if they don't do that, their competitors might do it. You could have up starts coming up and disrupting a particular business model. In the media, we often hear a lot about, you know, Netflix, Tesla and of course those are great examples, but we see this in every industry. Whether it's genomics, health care, in media and entertainment, it's happening everywhere, whether it's companies reinventing themselves, trying to disrupt their own business models to stay relevant or new startups coming in and trying to say how can we do this differently. >> So let's talk about the impact of digital transformation on storage and data protection. What data is, the new oil, all the buzz words we want to throw onto that. You, as a marketer, you have to translate into what that means from a technology perspective. For the boots on the ground what does digital transformation mean to people concerned with storage and data? >> Absolutely, it basically means, it means data. What is underpinning, a lot of times we talk to customers, they'll say, oh, I have big data initiatives, because they're trying to to make digital transformation real, you need to pull our insights from the data. So, it's big data, IoT, you know pick your buzz word. ML, AI, but if you take a step back all of these initiatives, they are basically dependent on data. You can't run an ML or AI algorithm without data. People talk about neural networks, neural networks are networks of data. What we find with customers is that they know that they have a lot of data, but they run into a lot of challenges with them. So there's really three big challenges. One is, how do we, you know, you could have data sitting in one system, you could have data sitting in another system, it's in silos. If you have data locked in silos you can't correlate them, we can't correlate them you really can't run analytics. The magic of insights comes out when you're correlating disparate data. That's one problem. Now, if you have everything in one single unified data Lake let's say you don't have silos, then there's this the the volume of data that's growing. It's incredible, it's not uncommon for our customers to tell us that they're seeing 30, 40, 50% year-over-year growth in their data. I mean, if you think about it, you're talking exponential growth iin a few years. So, how do you harness all that growth? How do you keep it on your systems of record without going bankrupt? Because it, often, it is a question of just managing all that data growth. Now, let's say that's challenge number two, let's say you've done that as well and you need to be able to draw insights out of it. Just because you have data sitting somewhere doesn't mean that you're going to be able to pull out analytics, doesn't mean that your processes and systems are really organized with it. All of this is really what we help try to do with customers. We have products like Isilon and ECS that are at the forefront of unstructured data. Which is really, 80% of the data today is unstructured, we help create unified data lakes for our customers so they don't have data sitting in silos. Then, these platforms are scalable platforms, so they scale very cost-effectively. Then they all support analytics natively. So you can run a big data analysis on the storage platform itself. >> You mentioned insights, and that's actionable insights another marketing buzz word there. But it's imperative for an organization to be able to have a foundation to be able to act on those insights. You talk about, you know, people say data, more buzz words, the new oil, really kind of think of it, a former biologist, as a. (audio dropping) Companies that do it well, that transform well, are able to apply data to different, multiple use cases at the same time yes, combine it, recombine it. But then, they also need to have this agile infrastructure to be able to take advantage of that, be able to adapt their software. Use things like sensors and smart devices, that are telling them how the customers are interacting the products and services and deliver something that's differentiated. So, as Dell EMC is doing that yourselves, is there any (audio dropping) that pops to mind because this is a great hallmark of digital transformation. >> Yeah, and to just talk about, extend what you said, we actually are starting to call data a capital asset. It's not very different from the other things that you have on your balance sheet. There just isn't a scientific method or an agreed-upon method we really value it yet. But I am sure that ten years from now or maybe earlier, just like we have stock exchanges, you could probably have data exchanges, where you have data be traded, it's monetized, it's valued. A classic example of what you said is we had a customer come in that owns a sports franchise, a very popular sports franchise in the United States. They also own their own arenas. They have Bluetooth sensors, 80 Bluetooth sensors, sitting all over their stadium. They have loyalty apps for their customers. When they come in, they open the app up, you know, with permissions, it connects to the Bluetooth sensors and now, to your point about the data, unlocking or catalyzing different the sheer number of things that can be done with that data to help improve experience, both for the viewer but also for the businesses that support, the restaurants that are in there, the vendors that are in the arena as well it's just mind boggling. For example, you can now, these people can now track when someone's walking. Whether they're walking towards, let's say, a barbecue joint a vendor in the arena. As they're standing there, first, they could actually know if they're standing or they're just walking by. If they're standing they have digital signage close to these places, but they can serve up ads and say hey, here's a discount. Because you're probably looking at the barbecue joint and thinking well, do you want to eat this or maybe I should do, am I in the mood for ribs today, and then presto, you get an ad next to you saying, hey we have a two-for-one or something. That's great from a commerce perspective. But then also for like the restroom lines. If you know that a lot of people are congregated in one restroom, you can actually say, hey, direct people towards other areas. Then beer kegs, like if we could have sensors under their beer kegs that are tracking when a beer keg is almost empty. All right, you're going to send a signal to the kitchen, they're going to roll out a beer keg before it gets over. Think about how that reduces wait times while you're replacing beer kegs. It's all one set of data, enabling so many different things for just improving experience. >> Wherever this place is, let's go. (panel laughing) >> Yeah, it sounds like a cool place. So let's kind of blow out or a section of your title that's deceptive, I think, in a sense. (audio dropping) To protect that access. But data protection has now become, I think, a catch-all for much more than just data protection. These products backing data protection are all not just about protecting data but adding mobility to data. Can you talk about the need to be able to take data and move it from where it's ingested to where it can be further crunched from a machine learning perspective? >> Yes, that's a great point. We talk about data originating in different sources, the edge, the core, or the cloud and really that mobility is super critical. If you just expand out a little bit more and just think about the Dell Technologies portfolio, we have data that's being generated on the edge, with sensors and devices. With the advent of the edge computing, you're beginning to see a lot more new computing models. So now, you have this notion of the fog, so you have many data centers that are collecting data. You could be running some real-time analytics on there. High level, real-time analytics to make decisions about let's say you're in a factory, you could have a fog data center in a factory or you could call it the edge as well, basically detecting defects in a particular spare part. And then you have real-time analytics going on there. But then all of that data also gets pushed into a central data center where you're running machine learning algorithms and you're training your real-time analytics systems to be that much more effective, to be that much more accurate. In these situations, like every point, single point decimal makes a huge difference in a company's bottom or top line. Yes, I think data mobility from the edge to the core, to the cloud or the fog, whatever you want to call it, is very, very critical. Different use cases in different areas are driving the that mobility. >> I'd love to understand what some of the differentiators are. What, we're at Dell Technologies, we're at the first one, indicative of the absorption of the EMC Federation companies within Dell. What differentiates what you're delivering and hoping customers achieve from your competition? >> Yeah, I mean, my specific areas of expertise are basically Isilon, ECS, our file storage platform an object storage platform. There are three things that differentiate us. We are really focused on creating eliminating silos. So, unifying everything in one data lake. Whether it's in the edge, the core, or the cloud, we want to provide a common, some data lake experience for our apps and for our users. The second thing is, we're we're hyper focused on providing cost-effective scaling mechanisms. So, if you scale, you're going to be able to handle that data in a much more cost-effective manner than if you have a product that does not scale out for example. The third thing that we do is that's really different is that we support inline analytics on the storage platform itself. If you think about a large model, a large part of the model for analytics array is directed at storage and I think that's going to continue have a large place to play. But shared storage is becoming increasingly viable option for running analytics, without having to move it somewhere, running the analytics on it and moving it back. Just more efficient, you just basically run analytics on it. It's really those three things that we think differentiate us from our competition. >> We can't have a conversation about storage and data without talking about cloud. You talk about the cloud strategy that integrates with your product portfolio. >> Absolutely, you know, as Michael said in the keynote yesterday, a cloud is not a destination, it's a model. Really, what we find is, every customer has their own cloud roadmap. So as a vendor it doesn't behoove us to say, we have this one-size-fits-all solution for you. It's really incumbent upon us to really meet the customer where they are. So whether it's with Isilon or with ECS, we have a host of different consumption models. You could run it as an appliance from us, or (audio dropping). You could run, for example, ECS is a software-defined platform, so if you're running, if you want to be really agile and you want to have servers that are running, you know, industry standard servers versus proprietary hardware, we can do that as well. Then, as we start thinking about the public cloud, we just announced, actually Michael announced yesterday that we're now offering Isilon with Google cloud. So, you could actually run Isilon systems, co-located with your Google compute clusters. All the wealth of the analytics capabilities that Google has, and then the compute capabilities that they have, you now don't have to compromise in terms of your file storage platform. You can actually run enterprise ready, scalable file system co-located with the Google cluster as well. That's a new model that we're looking at with customers. Because customers are telling us they love our products, on-premises there is a place for that, but they also want to be able to, if they're making bets on some of the big cloud providers, they want to be able to consume our products and take advantage of the features that they have on-premises, in the cloud as well. We're we're definitely trying to meet customers where they are in the cloud. >> And last question as we wrap up here, 5,000 channel partners, technology partners that are here, what are you hearing from the channel as often times the channel partners are at the forefront of talking with customers about a digital transformation strategy. What's some of the feedback from the channel been? >> The first thing that I noticed as a product marketer our partners always keep us honest, and the minute they hear a buzz word, you see their face frown. But I will tell you that in my meetings this year, anytime I talk about digital transformation they are looking at us with rapt attention. Because they are validating to us that their customers, just like ours, our customers together, this is top of mind for them. The other thing that I'm hearing from partners a lot is this notion that data actually has value, that it's an asset that customers are starting to value. It's honestly a great time to be in the tech space. Great time to be in the storage space because we're able to show customers how we can help transform their business. Five or six years ago to be able to say that about a storage platform, was probably marketing speak. But it's real right now. >> Varun, thanks so much for stopping by, sharing what's new and as we've talked about, digital transformation isn't a buzz word, it's not a nice to have, it's a mandatory. So, thanks for your time and your clarifying things, it was very, very informative. Thanks for dealing with this loud music show that's going on here. We want to thank you for continuing to watch theCUBE. I am Lisa Martin with Keith Townsend live from Dell Technologies World 2018. Stick around, we'll be right back. (upbeat music)