live from Las Vegas it's the Cuban covering AWS reinvent 2017 presented by AWS Intel and our ecosystem of partners ok welcome back everyone we're here live in Las Vegas forty two thousand plus people maybe forty five huge numbers here at AWS reinvent twin seventeen Amazon Web Services annual conference wall-to-wall coverage our third day I'm John Ferrier the co-founder of silicon Anglo what's two Minutemen we're here with Andy Jesse the CEO of Amazon Web Services the Andy crate to see you again great to see you thanks for having me on graduations we had a great chat a week ago you and I sat down for breakfast and you kind of laid out you kind of laid out with a plan for the show here but I you kind of left a lot out of this you hold it back I've know every three hours from I thought I had a great story you needed the floor our breakfast oh damn it's good what an announcement I mean your keno two and a half hours I mean the longest keynote I've seen just non-stop announces you went right into a no preamble right into the announcements how many announcements did you do like fifty plus or what was the number I think there were 22 news services and features announced in the keynote I did alright so you gotta look back now as it's coming down to an end to reap the parties tonight what's your take I mousey you're absorbing it still he's still kind of like numb pinch me moment what's what's the vibe what are you feeling right now you know it's been a fantastic week and this is our favorite week of the year just having the chance to spend the week with our entire community and I think that it's been a very successful week in terms of what we were trying to accomplish which was it's always first and foremost of learning and education conference and I think that people feel like the array of sessions they've been able to go to and what they've learned both about the services altogether the new services we announced and then just especially what other peers are doing on top of the platform I think has been really valuable and I've had a lot of customer meetings over the last few days and the conversations have been so excited you know people saying I just can't you know you guys already had so much functionality but I just can't believe the amount of innovation and capability the two guys just released over the last couple days and several people said to me you know how to I knew I was having a meeting with you so I had a list of things I was gonna ask you to to deliver and during your keynote I kept going check check check so they're a really positive excited conversation talk about the flywheel what's going on with you guys right now I use that term kind of a pun intended because you've got some flywheel going on as you add more services I detailed in my story after we met I teased out this is a competitive advantage for you you just listen to listening to customers but you're putting out more services there's leveraging those services so it's good for customers but I worry about the complexity and they might worry about the complexity how do you talk about that and how does your team address that because I mean tsunami of services yeah well you know I think that the first thing to remember is that simply because we have a lot of functionality doesn't mean that customers have to know about every single service and every single feature they use what they need when they need it and they don't have to pay for it up front and so you know one of the reasons we release so many things during the area of over 1300 services and features this year alone and in about 70 new releases just at reinvent this week is that when you have millions of active customers you have lots of diversity in those customers you know lots of different businesses lots of different priorities lots of different needs and so you know even in the set of customer meetings I've had this week the first question I asked every single customer i sat down with is what are your impressions what are you excited about they were some who said I can't believe I'm so excited about sage maker it's gonna completely change the accessibility of doing machine learning in my org and some said oh I really really wanted those language application services and machine learning others were totally focused on the multi master or aurora on the global tables for dynamodb and the graph database and then still others said you know I love ECS but I've wanted a kubernetes option and then now that I don't even have to manage containers at the server level and I can manage the task level is what I'm excited about still others who are IOT customers that's what cared about so we have so many customers it was such diversity in their businesses and their priorities that they all have a bunch of needs keep on delivering on that and I want to get your reaction something that we've been talking about in the cube all week which is well I've been pushing its due and I've been kind of debating it but we see a clear path towards a new renaissance in software development and invention and it comes down to some of the things that you guys have enabled we saw a lot of go get excited by some of the deep learning I'll see lecture for business and two other things it's easier to do stuff now the application layer because you don't have to build the full stack so we're you guys are talking about a reimagining architecture that was Vernors keynote it's all kind of pointing to a new Renaissance a new way to create value what's your reaction then how do you share that the customers because it's kind of a new new model yeah well I think that this has been happening now for you know the last ten years and I think that people aren't building applications for the most part the way they used to it you know if you if you're building new applications and you're trying to build all the hosting software and all the storage software and all the database software at all the messaging and queuing and analytics and and machine learning you're just wasting resource because because when you when you have the option of using 120 services from a platform like AWS that has thousands and thousands of people working on it delivering on average three-and-a-half new features a day that you could choose to use or not it's so much faster and so much more empowering to let your builders take advantage of that platform you get from idea to implementation and orders of magnitude faster using the cloud and that you know what keeps happening is we just keep adding more and more capabilities that allow people get now even the marketplace we just had Barry Russell on and you go now are bringing a global reach opportunity so not only can you help them get to market faster with coding and building value this growth so it's not just parking the marketplace and hope that something happens they're taking advantage of that growth I think it's a really important point it's it's not just a set of services that we're building but are thousands and thousands vis--vis and SAS providers who are also building products on top of AWS where their business is growing by leaps and bounds I mean one of the interesting things about the marketplace I don't know how much you guys have talked about this in the past or currently is that most if you talk to most software buyers they hate the process it you know it's just how long it takes the negotiation process most the software sellers also hate the process and so if you can find a mechanism which is what we're trying to provide with the AWS marketplace where buyers and sellers can complete those transactions and find each other so much faster it totally changes the world of buying software and consuming software Andy I came in this week pretty excited to look at the adoption of server lists and you know congratulations you've impressed a lot of announcements talked a lot of customers the thing that probably impressed me the most is it went from being kind of just lambda to really integrated all the service it's a much more holistic view but you made a comment that I that a lot of us in the community kind of you know poked at a little witches if you were to build AWS today in 2017 you would build it you know on you mean Amazon yes sorry Amazon on it today now I've talked to startups that are building all server list but you know it was on D gigantic company and you know I talked to Tim I talked to the team a lot of things I can't do so is this a goal or you know it just being kind of kind of the future or you know do you feel that I can put you know a global you know company of your size you know built with yeah yeah it's a good question and you know I really the comment I made was really about directionally what Amazon would do you know in the city in the very earliest days of AWS Jeff used to say a lot if I were starting Amazon today I'd have built it on top AWS we didn't have all the capability and all the functionality at that very moment but he knew what was coming and he saw what people were still able to accomplish even with where the services were at that point I think the same thing is true here with lambda which is I think if Amazon we're starting today it's a given they would build it on the cloud and I think we with a lot of the applications that comprise Amazon's consumer business we would build those on our server list capabilities now we still have plenty of capabilities and features and functionality we need to add to to lambda and our various serverless services so that may not be true from the get-go right now but I think if you look at the hundreds of thousands of customers who are building on top of lambda and lots of real applications you know FINRA is built a good chunk of their market watch application on top of lambda and Thompson Reuters has built you know that one of their key analytics apps like people are building real serious things on top of lambda and the pace of iteration you'll see there will increase as well and I really believe that to be true over the next year or two and you talked a little bit more about competition than then I'm used to hearing in the keynote I mean there's been some pokes at some of the database stuff in that migration but you know when it walked talked about there was this colorful bar chart you put up and you had some data pointing about that you know in your market chairs growing your continuing growth you know how do you look at the market landscape what are people you know still getting wrong yeah I think that I don't think that we actually talked that much more or less about competitors in the keynote there was a slide that had a color chart that may have been the only difference but you know for us it's always about you you could spend so much your time trying to look at what others are doing and wondering what they're gonna do the reality is if you don't stay focused on your customers and what they actually care about you know you're wasting your time about mobile and business years ago Alexa for business is a new thing voice we heard from Berner today it's a new interface so we were talking on the cube it's the first time we're kind of talking about this constant maybe we're the first ones to say it so we'll just say it voice first strategy mobile first created a massive wealth creation iPhone new kinds of application development voice has that same feel voice first interface could spawn massive innovation yeah what's your view their reaction what do you guys talk about internally at Amazon in terms of a how voice will take advantage of all your scale yeah well I strongly agree with what you heard Verner communicate in the in his keynote today which is just you know when we first had phones that had apps and you could do all kinds of things by tapping on the phone like that was revolutionary but then when you experienced a voice app it makes tapping on your phone so circa 2010 and so I think that the world will have a huge amount of voice applications it's gonna be people's preference and in part because it's just a more natural expression than actually tapping and trying to click and type things and so we we had so many customers almost a good chunk of our enterprise meetings that we have throughout the year one of the things customers want to talk about is how can I actually be involved in using Alexa how can I build skills for Alexa and then over the last few months that conversation has started to turn to hey you thinking about making Alexa more useful inside of businesses and for work and so there's so much applicability I think that voice first it's gonna have the same kind of impact or more than the mobile trend or I think it has a chance to have as big an impact I mean all the devices have to continue to evolve and you can see that at Amazon we're continuing to build all kinds of diverse devices but I think voice is gonna be a major mode of how people interact with handi 42,000 people I don't know how you top it congratulations on all your success and appreciate the growth and you've done with the company congratulate breaking chicken wing contest to Tonka yeah we said a Guinness I what is that about come on tell us about this door well I Tatanka is a buffalo wing eating club that we started in Seattle back in 1997 and we go for wings we used to go every Tuesday night for wings and we have membership standards you can become a regular member if you need 10 wings with five pasty wings a pasty wing is you know when the wing sauce sits the room temperature and it kind of congeals it gets Spacey so it's five wings wrapped in that pays platinum membership is 25 wings plus five pasties then we started having eating contests and we call it a tonka Bowl and so when we start a reinvent we very much wanted to have a conference that had a lot of interesting fun quirky events and one of the ideas we had was we said well let's try an eating contest and the first year we tried it we did it a lunchtime down in the basement and nobody wanted to have an eating contest at one o'clock in the afternoon in the middle of rain BAM so then we moved it to Lagasse Stadium here in the Venetian and people started coming so this year we had two groups of about a hundred each one at Lagasse won at the MGM and they they did a 30-minute round and then the top five wing eaters in each venue came back to one place for a second round and the winner apparently ate a cumulative total of 59 wings there were three thousand eight hundred and fifty-seven Wings consumed in the contest about as many features as Amazon has released since the first time event sounds like to continue the momentum and you're eating away at the competition congratulations Andy jazzy CEOs on Web Services the cube thanks for coming in man and I appreciate it guys thanks for being here appreciate it live coverage here from Las Vegas Amazon webster's reinvent annual conference 2017 s the cube I'm John Force to Minutemen be back with more live coverage after this short break [Music]

>> Announcer: Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE. Covering AWS re:Invent 2017. Presented by AWS, Intel and our ecosystem of partners. >> Hey, welcome back everyone. We're live here in Las Vegas. It's theCUBE's exclusive coverage of AWS. Amazon Web Services re:Invent 2017. Amazon web Services annual conference, 45,000 people here. Five years in a row for theCUBE, and we're going to be continuing to cover years and decades after, it's on a tear. I'm John Furrier, my co-host Stu Miniman. Exciting science, one of the biggest themes here is AI, IoT, data, Deep Learning, DeepLens, all the stuff that's been really trending has been really popular at the show. And the person behind that Amazon is Swami. He's the Vice President of Machine Learning at AWS, among other things, Deep Learning and data. Welcome to theCUBE. >> Stu: Good to see you. >> Excited to be here. >> Thanks for coming on. You're the star of the show. Your team put out some great announcements, congratulations. We're seeing new obstruction layers of complexity going away. You guys have made it easy to do voice, Machine Learning, all those great stuff. >> Swami: Yeah. >> What are you most excited about, so many good things? Can you pick a child? I don't want to pick my favorite child among all my children. Our goal is to actually put Machine Learning capabilities in the hands of all developers and data scientists. That's why, I mean, we want to actually provide different kinds of capabilities right from like machine developers who want to build their own Machine Learning models. That's where SageMakers and n21 platform that lets people build, train and deploy these models in a one-click fashion. It supports all popular Deep Learning frameworks. It can be TensorFlow, MXNet or PyCharm. We also not only help train but automatically tune where we use Machine Learning for Machine Learning to build these things. It's very powerful. The other thing we're excited about is the API services that you talked about, the new obstruction layer where app developers who do not want to know anything about Machine Learning but they want to transcribe their audio to convert from speech to text, or translate it or understand the text, or analyze videos. The other thing coming from academia where I'm excited about is I want to teach developers and students Machine Learning in a fun fashion, where they should be excited about Machine Learning. It's such a transformative capability. That's why actually we built a device meant for Machine Learning in a hands-on fashion that's called DeepLens. We have developers right on re:Invent where from the time they take to un-box to actually build a computer with an application to build Hotdog or Not Hotdog, they can do it in less than 10 minutes. It's an amazing time to be a developer. >> John: Yeah. >> Stu: Oh my God, Swami. I've had so many friends that have sat through that session. First of all, the people that sit through it they get like a kit. >> Swami: That's awesome. >> Stu: They're super excited. Last year it was the Ecodot and everybody with new skills. This year, DeepLens definitely seems to be the one that all the geeks are playing with, really programing stuff. There's a bunch of other things here, but definitely some huge buzz and excitement. >> That's awesome, glad to hear. >> Talk about the culture at Amazon. Because I know in covering you guys for so many years and now being intimate with a lot of the developers in your teams. You guys just don't launch products, you actually listen to customers. You brought up Machine Learning for developers. What specifically jumped out at you from talking to customers around making it easier? It was too hard, was it, or it was confined to hardcore math driven data scientists? Was it just the thirst and desire for Machine Learning? Or you're just doing this for side benefits, it's like a philanthropy project? >> No, in Amazon we don't build technology because it's cool. We build technology because that's what our customers want. Like 90 to 95% of our roadmap is influenced by listening to customers. The other 5 to 10% is us reading between the lines. One of the things I actually ... When I started playing with Machine Learning, having built a bunch of database storage and analytics products. When I started getting into Deep Learning and various things I realized there's a transformative capability of these technologies. It was too hard for developers to use it on a day to day fashion, because these models are too hard to build and train. Our data now, the right level of obstruction. That's why we actually think of it as in a multi-layered strategy where we cater to export practitioners and data scientists. For them we have SageMaker. Then for app developers who do not want to know anything about Machine Learning they say, "I'll give you an audio file, transcribe it for me," or "I'll give you text, get me insights or translate it." For them we actually we actually provide simple to use API services, so that they can actually get going without having to know anything about what is TensorFlow or PyCharm. >> TensorFlow got a lot of attention, because that really engaged the developer community in the current Machine Learning, because we're like, "Oh wow, this is cool." >> Swami: Yeah. >> Then it got, I won't say hard to use, but it was high end. Are you guys responding to TensorFlow in particular or you're responding to other forces? What was the driver? >> In amazon we have been using Machine Learning for like 20 years. Since the year of like 1995 we have been leveraging Machine Learning for recommendation engine, fulfillment center where we use robots to pick packages and then Elixir of course and Amazon Go. One of the things we actually hear is while frameworks like TensorFlow or PyCharm, MXNet or PyCharm is cool. It is just too hard for developers to make use of it. We actually don't mind, our users use Cafe or TensorFlow. We want the, to be successful where they take from idea to product shell. And when we talk to developers, this process took anywhere from 6 to 18 months and it should not be this hard. We wanted to do what AWS did to IT industry for compute storage and databases. We want to do the same for Machine Learning by making it really easy to get started and consumer does in utility. That was our intel. >> Swami, I wonder if you can tell us. We've been talking for years about the flywheel of customers for Amazon. What are the economies of scale that you get for the data that you have there. I think of all the training of all the Machine Learning, the developers. How can you leverage the economies of scale that Amazon has in all those kind of environments? >> When you look at Machine Learning, Machine Learning tends to be mostly the icing on the cake. Even when we talk to the expert professors who are the top 10 scientists in the world, the data that goes into the Machine Learning is going to be the determining factor for how good it is in terms of how well you train it and so forth. This is where data scientists keep saying the breath of storage and database and analytics offerings that exist really matter for them to build highly accurate models. When you talk about not just the data, but actually the underlying database technology and storage technology really is important. S3 is the world's most powerful data leg that exists that is highly secure, reliable, scalable and cost effective. We really wanted to make sure customers like Glacier Cloud who store high resolution satellite imagery on S3 and glacier. We wanted them to leverage ML capabilities in a really easy one-click fashion. That's important. >> I got to ask you about the roadmap, because you say customers are having input on that. I would agree with you that that would be true, because you guys have a track record there. But I got to put the dots that I'm connecting in my mind right now forward by saying, you guys ... And telegraphing here certainly heard well, Furner say it and Andy, data is key and opening up that data and we're seeing New Relic here, Sumo Logic. They're sharing anonymous data from usage, workloads really instructive. Data is instructive for the marketplace, but you got to feed the models on the data. The question for you is you guys get so much data. It's really a systems management dream it's an application performance dream. You got more use case data. Are you going to open that up and what's the vision behind it? Because it seems like you could offer more and more services. >> Actually we already have. If you look at x-rays and service that we launched last year. That is one of the coolest capabilities, even I am a developer during the weekends when I cool out. Being able to dive into specific capabilities so one of the performance insights where is the borderline. It's so important that actually we are able to do things like x-raying into an application. We are just getting started. The Cloud transformed how we are building applications. Now with Machine Learning, what is going to happen is we can even do various things like ... Which is going to be the borderline on what kind of datasets. It's just going to be such an amazing time. >> You can literally reimagine applications that are once dominant with all the data you have, if you opened it up and then let me bring my data in. Then that will open up a bigger aperture of data. Wouldn't that make the Machine Learning and then AI more effective? >> Actually, you already can do similar things with Lex. Lex, think of it as it's an automatic speech recognition natural language understanding where we are pre-trained on our data. But then to customize it for your own chat bots or voice applications, you can actually add your own intents and several things and we customize it underlying Deep Learning model specific to your data. You're leveraging the amount of data that we have trained in addition to specifically tuning for yours. It's only going to get better and better, to your point. >> It's going to happen, it's already happening. >> It's already happening, yeah. >> Swami, great slate of announcements on the Machine Learning side. We're seeing the products get all updated. I'm wondering if you can talk to us a little bit about the human side of things. Because we've seen a lot of focus, right, it's not just these tools but it's the tools and the people putting those together. How does Amazon going to help the data scientists, help retrain, help them get ready to be able to leverage and work even better with all these tools? >> Machine Learning, we have seen some amazing usage of how developers are using Machine Learning. For example, Mariness Analytics is a non-profit organization that its goal is to fight human trafficking. They use recognition which is our image processing. They do actually identify persons of interest and victims so that they can notify law enforcement officer. Like Royal National Institute of Blind. They actually are using audio text to speech to generate audio books for visually impaired. I'm really excited about all the innovative applications that we can do to simply improve our everyday lives using Machine Learning, and it's such in early days. >> Swami, the innovation is endless in my mind. But I want to get two thoughts from you, one startup and one practitioner. Because we've heard here in theCUBE, people come here and saying, "I can do so much more now. "I've got my EMR, it's so awesome. "I can do this solving problem." Obviously making it easy to use is super cool, that's one. I want to get your thoughts on where that goes next. And two, startups. We're seeing a lot of startups retooling on Cloud economics. I call it post-2013 >> Swami: Yeah. >> They don't need a lot of money, they can hit critical mass. They can get market product, market fit earlier. They can get economic value quicker. So they're changing the dynamics. But the worry is, how do I leverage the benefit of Amazon? Because we know Amazon is going to grow and all Clouds grow and just for you guys. How do I play with Amazon? Where is the white space? How do I engage, do I just ...? Once I'm on the platform, how do I become the New Relic or slunk? How can I grow my marketplace and differentiate? Because Amazon might come out with something similar. How do I stay in that cadence of growth, even a startup? >> If you see in AWS we have tens of thousands of partners of course, right from ISV, SIs and whatnot. Software industry is an amazing industry where it's not like winner take all market. For example, in the document management space, even though we have S3 and WorkDocs, it doesn't mean Dropbox and Box are not successful either, and so forth. What we provide in AWS is the same infrastructure for any startup or for my team, even though I build probably many of the underlying infrastructure. Nowadays for my AI team, it's literally like a startup except I probably stay in an AWS building, but otherwise I don't get any internal APIs, it's the same API so easy to S3. >> John: It's a level playing field. >> It's a level playing field. >> By the way, everyone should know, he wrote DynamoDB. As an intern or was that ...? (Swami laughs) And then SQS, rockstar techy here, so it's great to have. You're what we call a tech athlete. Great to have you on. No white space, just go for it. >> Innovation is the key. The key thing, what we have seen amazing startups who have done exceptionally well is they intently listen to customers and innovate and really look for what it matters for their customers and go for it. >> The biggest buzz of the show from your group. What's your biggest buzz from the show here? DeepLens? >> DeepLens has been ... Our idea was to actually come up with a fun way to learn Machine Learning. Machine Learning, it used to be, even until recently actually as well as last week, it was actually an intimate thing for developers to learn while there is, it's all the buzz. It's not really straight forward for developers to use it. We thought, "Hey, what is a fun way for developers "to get engaged and build Machine Learning?" That's why we actually can see DeepLens so that you can actually build fun applications. I talked about Hotdog, Not Hotdog. I'm personally going to be building what I call as a Bear Cam. Because I live in the suburbs of Seattle where we actually have bears visiting our backyard digging our trash. I want to actually have DeepLens with a pre-train model that I'm going to train to detect bears. That it sends me a message through SQS and SNS so I get a text. >> Here's an idea we want to do, maybe your team can build it for us. CUBE Cam, we put the DeepLens here and then as anyone goes by, if they're a Twitter follower of theCUBE they can send me a message. (John and Swami laughing) Swami, great stuff. Deep Learning again, more goodness coming. >> Swami: That's awesome. >> What are you most excited about? >> In Amazon we have a phrase called, "It's Day One." Even though we are a 22-year-old company, I jokingly tell my team that, "It's day one for us, "except we just woke up and we haven't even "had a cup of coffee yet." We have just scratched the surface with Machine Learning, there is so much stuff to do. I'm super excited about this space. >> Your goals for this year is what? What's your goals? >> Our goals for this year was to put Machine Learning capabilities in the hands of all developers of all skill levels. I think we have done pretty well so far I think. >> Well, congratulations Swami here on theCUBE. Vice president of Machine Learning and a lot more, all those applications that were announced Wednesday along with the Deep Leaning and the AI and the DeepLens all part of his innovative team here at Amazon. Changing the game is theCUBE doing our part bringing data to you, video and more coverage. Go to Siliconangle.com for all the stories, Wikibon.com for research and of course theCUBE.net. I'm John Furrier and Stu Miniman. Thanks for watching, we'll be right back.

>> Announcer: Live from Las Vegas it's theCube covering AWS re:Invent 2017 presented by AWS, Intel and our ecosystem of partners. >> Hey! Welcome back to theCube's continuing coverage of AWS re:Invent 2017 from beautiful Las Vegas. I'm Lisa Martin with my co host Keith Townsend. We're very excited to welcome back Cube alumni Nayaki Nayyar from BMC. The president of Digital Services Management. Welcome back to theCube! >> Thank you Lisa. Thank you Keith. Really excited to be here. I've been here before and I love this forum and how you are able to scale this and get our word around the world on this forum; thank you. >> Well fantastic. So one of the first things I wanted to ask you, you know, we hear buzz words all the time. Every event that we're at no matter what and I wanna know what is Multi-Cloud? What does it mean to your customers? Or do they say "Nayaki, what is Mutli-Cloud? "Do we need one?" >> Yes. So you know that's a very good question. Every customer I go talk to the number one challenge they have is what we call this Multi-Cloud challenge. Because now customers are evolving their workloads. We heard from Andy how everyone is evolving the workloads into cloud. But it's not one cloud. They have hybrid clouds, managed clouds, private clouds you name it. The privilege of clouds is becoming a norm now. And how you help them manage the complexity of these Multi-Cloud is what is very unique for BMC and all the technology that they are releasing in the market is that's our sweet spot right now. >> So when a customer comes and says "help me navigate this process." Where do you start? >> Yeah, so you know the number one. You'd be surprised. When customers are planning the migration or they're in the journey of migrating their workloads to cloud the first thing is they have to know what they own. Discovering their assets and it'd be interesting for most of the CIOs or heads of technology that I talk to they don't even know what they own across all the data centers. So we have a product called Discovery for Mutli-Cloud. Where it can discover all assets customers have on-prim but also assets across AWS. That is a partnership we announced with AWS. And with Azure or any other clouds that they have. And it actually builds a relationship across all of these assets so you can plan if you move one of those assets what is the impact on the rest of the service. That is the beauty of it. >> So Nayaki, I really love the discovery conversation and it is a big challenge for most enterprises. AWS announcing 1,300 features this year alone. Amazing skill. But those assets don't look like traditional CI, configuration items, that we've seen in the past. There's server-less, there's databases. What does an asset look like in BMC so that we normalize that and look at it across multiple clouds. >> There are like technology assets but most importantly when we took a look at an asset it is a business asset. You're providing a service. End to end service. The service could be listing as a service for an eBay website. And for that service you have databases. You have application service. You have code running on various parts. That is what discovery does. Being able to discover for that service. That business service that you have. Delivering to your customers or to your business what all is mapped to that service. So when you actually asses that impact. If you move any one of them or bring any one of them down. What is the impact to that business service. >> So obviously something like a dependency. If I have a listing service for eBay and it's designed for eBay process but I move it somewhere else what does that mean towards basically the employee that needs to go and list an item on eBay their job is impeded. >> Yeah so it immediately detects what impact any one of those assets are moved or brought down or shut down for whatever reason what is the impact on the rest of the relationships and also the business outcome or business service that you are providing. >> So one of the things that John likes to take on is the concept of Multi-Cloud. Getting more into this definition of Mutli-Cloud. Is that we're not running workloads everywhere, are we? Saying that we can't defeat gravity and the speed of light. That you're not going to have AI running and AWS and across object storage and Google. Multi-cloud. How are customers using Multi-cloud? >> Yeah, so I would not say you would not have like 20 clouds that you are using. Typically companies have, of course on-prim, everyone has on-prim, all large enterprises. But then they also have a private cloud of their own. But then have one or two public clouds that they may have workloads. They may have AWS for sure and Azure. So typically that's what a customer landscape looks like. But even within these four or five clouds that you have to manage it's still a big landscape that technology leaders have to manage and secure. >> Talk to us about what you guys have heard this week from AWS. One of the things that you mentioned this year alone over 1,300 new services and features. Last year I think it was 1,117. So the accelerated pace of innovation at AWS is mind blowing. Do you think they probably need like a neck brace? They're going at such warp speed. But I'm wondering how does their pace of innovation with your strategic partnership. How does that influence BMC and what are some of the things that excite you about what you've heard this week. >> So a couple of things. The very first one is for our customers, BMC has what we call Remedy, one of the largest suite for helping customers manage ITSM or IT Service Management. Most of our customers are moving that workload into public clouds like AWS so for us instead of trying to run it our own cloud or in our data centers it's easier for our customers to just move that workload into clouds. So with the pace of innovation that AWS is releasing with 1,300 new features, we don't have to invest in all that. Or our customers don't have to invest on the infrastructure there. We can just focus on the app side, the Remedy side. That's one. The second one I was so excited about was Arora. The announcement of Arora on Postgres. We were actually working very closely with AWS right now on certifying Remedy with Arora and Postgres. We are like few weeks, few months away from that announcment and that release and once that gets out all of our customers should be able to migrate to their gravity system onto Arora with using Postgres as a database which is a huge cost savings for companies on the database side. So those are the two big announcements we are very excited about. >> So, I know this talks to the pace of change. So you guys cutting edge to move Remedy to Postgres on Arora. Serverless for Arora was just announced yesterday. How does that impact? >> That even makes it our job even more easier right? For it to be able to just scale elastically without being like dependent on any one instance or one server is I think this tremendously futuristic and can help our customers and for us not to manage those server assets in AWS. Absolutely. >> So reducing friction. What does it mean to consume Remedy as a service versus worrying about all of that infrastructure. What does that actually mean to your customer? >> So it's not consuming Remedy as a service. It's service management as a service. Right. So if you look at customers want to provide IT Service Management to their employees. How they consume that with a combined solution from BMC and AWS is the beauty of our partnership coming together. >> Let me ask you on that front, what is some of the feedback that you're getting from customers that helps reinforce the partnership with AWS and improve it? >> Yeah, in fact, after we announced the partnership with AWS I would say the intake. The flood of questions I got from customers around the world is they're so happy to hear the partnership because now they can have BMC and AWS at the table discussing how we move their workload, which they had on-prim into AWS and leverage the strength and the power of what AWS gives along with the power of what Remedy gives. >> So service management a huge. You know I've heard CEOs and CIOs call Service Management the ERP of IT. Meaning this is the central point where I go to consume IT services. How does Mutli-Cloud impact the consumption of IT services through something like Remedy. >> Yes. So think of it right. In the past you were providing service management for all your on-prim assets. Now your assets are all over Mutli-Cloud. So it is like Multi-Cloud service management. So we do have the next iteration of Remedy which we call Mutli-Cloud Service Management. So now customers can use launches to provide service for their on-prim assets but all their cloud assets through one service management tool. That's one. But even more little futuristic that Viore announced with AWS is what we call Cognitive Service Management. Is service management a future is not reactive, it's proactive. You detect an issue before it actually happens and proactively provide that service and that is where our integration with Alexa and the AI services come from Amazon. >> So as customers prepare to get ready for Multi-Cloud and the interface into Service Management, what are some of the things that they should be thinking about today? >> So as customers, first of all discover, making sure you discover all the assets, plan the phase at which those assets will move into cloud but then don't forget that at the end of the day you're providing a service to your end customers or end employees. How that service is provided through a single, I would say technology set or single suite, will take them a long ways. So that's where AWS and BMC's suite really becomes very powerful as customers are planning this journey. >> You mentioned Alexa for business and of course we heard all about that this morning. I see a smile on your face. What is that gonna mean for BMC? >> So in fact we announced a partnership with Amazon on Alexa for Business. Well think of it when you go to work and instead of typing a ticket for requesting a service, you just ask Alexa. Alexa, my laptop's not working or my phone is having an issue and it automatically >> Alexa, my laptop. (laughing) >> So that is where we call Alexa for Business where it's not just for consumer world it's not entering into what I call the enterprise world and being able to provide that experience, that end user experience right, through what we call virtual agents and virtual assistants like Alexa for customers and employees to just ask a question and the entire service will be fulfilled right through Alexa. >> So obviously some of the first thoughts that come to my mind when it comes to that type of service. I had an Alexa at home for a little while and I should probably start calling it Echo cause we're setting off a bunch of echos all across the world here. But I quickly got rid of it because my nine year old would come in the room and would say "Order ten cases of bubble gum." And there's no authentication. So, how are those types of enterprise issues getting addressed? >> So, that's what we call enterprise grade. How do you bring enterprise rigor into the technology that is coming from the consumer world. That's why when you ask Alexa for a certain service or a request. It will validate whether you have the authorization to get that service. And all of that integration inside our core ITSM Suite is already done and that's where the power of Alexa plus Remedy really becomes powerful. >> So how many cases of gum do you actually have? >> I don't even like gum so it's gonna take her a while to chew through all of that. (laughing) >> Oh well if only we had more time to explore that. Nayaki, thank you so much for coming back visiting us on theCube and sharing the excitement at BMC. Your energy and excitement for what you guys are doing is electric so thank you for sharing that. >> Thank you Lisa. Thank you Keith. It was an absolutely pleasure and thank you everyone. Thanks a bunch. >> Awesome. And we want to thank you for sticking around with us for my co-host Keith Townsend I'm Lisa Martin. You're watching theCube live at AWS re:Invent 2017. Don't go anywhere. We have great more segments coming back. (pop tech music)

>> Announcer: Live from Las Vegas, it's The Cube covering AWS re:Invent 2017. Presented by AWS, Intel, and our ecosystem of partners. >> Hey, welcome back to The Cube. Continuing live coverage on day three of AWS re:Invent 2017. We have had three days of great coverage, 44,000 or plus people at this event, lots of great announcements from AWS, from their partners, and we're very excited to be joined by our next guest, Christoph Pfister, the Executive Vice President of products from SolarWinds. Thanks for stopping by and chatting with Justin and me today. >> Thank you for having me. >> So tell us, what's going on at SolarWinds? What are some of the cool things that you're here to announce? >> Right, so first of all, great show, isn't it? >> Justin: Amazing. >> Lisa: Very (mumbles). Yes. (Christoph laughs) >> And it's a great show for us because we've announced a few new products and initiatives, and amongst them, the first product that provides both powerful and affordable full-stack monitoring for DevOps people. And so we'll talk hopefully a little bit more about that in a few minutes, but that's really the heritage of SolarWinds. We provide software that's simple, yet powerful and affordable, and we've been doing that since about 1999, when the company was founded in Austin, Texas. And the big thing about this is that we build software that IT professionals love, and they love it because it's simple, approachable, affordable, yet powerful, and that has propelled us to a leadership position in Network Management, Network Monitoring. So, SolarWinds is the number one by market share in that space, and we're now aiming to bring that to the... That simplicity, that power to cloud monitoring as well. >> So, you have a great community of people-- >> Yes, huge community. >> Who love SolarWinds. Massive community, the ThWACK community, and everything that people talk about online-- >> You know the company well. That's good. >> I know the company well. I've been to Austin many times, I've been to the campus. It's a great company. So, people know those tools really well. As you say, you're very, very strong in network monitoring, so tell us a bit more about this full-stack monitoring that you're doing. What do you mean by "full-stack"? >> Yes, so if you think about some of the key trends we see in the market... Let's go top to bottom. AWS announcing all these services here at the event, machine learning services, (mumbles) services, new database stuff... Amazing. And so, all of these services gonna to make their way, eventually, into applications, into apps, right? So, there's going to be more and more apps, and these apps gonna deliver value to business, to consumers, and therefore need to run pretty much flawlessly, right? Yet, behind this usually simple user experience of these apps, these apps have become massively complex, right? So, back in the day, and I'm going to date myself a little bit now, when I started in monitoring, it was pretty simple. There was a (mumbles) server, three tiers, and the app was pretty static, right? So nowadays, it's all about microservices-- >> All those microservices. >> All these dependencies that exist, which means that if there's a failure, it may be cascading failure, and so it's much, much more difficult to figure out if your app is doing well or not. And so, monitoring becomes so much more important in that context. And by the way, here at the show, people talk about monitoring a lot, and maybe (mumbles) that I would have is that in the marketplace, one of the top eight categories that Dave (mumbles) mentioned on stage at the (mumbles) event was monitoring is the one thing in the marketplace that people just need and want, so monitoring is important, and so what we're announcing here at... What we've announced here at the show is a brand new product called AppOptics, and AppOptics converges traditional infrastructure and application performance management, and provides coverage for what we call "The Three Layers of Observability," which are metrics, logs, and transaction traces, because we think that without transaction traces in these microservices-type architectures, very, very difficult to get to the root cause of issues, and so, we aim to cover the three layers of, or the three pillars, of observability: metrics, logs and traces, with AppOptics, and do it in a way that is simple and approachable. >> What do you mean by... I think it was a press article that you were quoted in about "democratizing monitoring." What do you mean by-- >> Do you like that term? >> It's very cool. (Christoph laughs) But what does it mean? >> What does it mean? Alright, so if you think about companies with application portfolios, right, so large companies may have between 500 and 800 apps, but there's studies out there that say only about 10% to 15% are being monitored. And so, why is that? It's for two reasons in our view. One is that application performance monitoring has been very affordable, so it's a question of "If I need to buy... If you need to pay $100 a host to get application performance monitoring, then many companies are not going to do it. And second reason is approachability and simplicity, meaning if you have to instrument you app manually... And I know you guys had a guest the other day, who talked about the importance of instrumenting apps. That's totally true, but you have to make it approachable, meaning the instrumentation has to be automatic. And that's exactly what we provide. We provide automatic, one single line instrumentation for all these microservices' languages. So, we cover seven languages, we cover PHP, Python, Java, the .Net... And I'm forgetting a few, of course, and so making your application performance and infrastructure monitoring number one, cheaper... So, we start with AppOptics at $7.50 a host a month. If you compare that to the hundreds of bucks a host a month that are kind of common game in the industry right now, that's pretty disruptive. And we make it much, much quicker to instrument these apps. So, that's what we mean by democratizing application performanceand infrastructure management because we think many more companies will be able to afford it, and many more companies will be able to actually deploy this stuff in a timely manner. >> So once you've instrumented it, who's it targeted for? Because, developers love to live in code land and do everything through APIs, but operators do actually like to be able to see things in charts, and for me, I like living on the command line absolutely, but I enjoy a good picture as well, and sometimes it's much, much easier to see what's happening if I just draw a graph, rather than sitting there looking at streams of code flying by. >> Christopher: Absolutely. >> So, do you have both of those options available in a DevOps model or... >> Christoph: We totally (mumbles). Who are the people you target for? So, we target the DevOps engineers, sometimes called System Reliability Engineer, and so, we provide dashboards, like the metrics, of course, that you would traditionally want to see and see how things are going over time. We provide the traces, and also, that's very graphical, so you see how much time a transaction spends in each of the layers of the app in each of the microservices. >> Justin: Okay. >> And that's very visual as well. And then, of course, we provide RESTful APIs as well to a lot of developers to do stuff with it. >> Yeah. >> So, couple things that I heard you say in terms of the value preposition SolarWinds brings is being able to facilitate from 15% to hopefully 100% of applications being monitored. That price has really been-- >> 80% would be great. >> If we get to 80%, we'll be great. (Lisa laughs) >> Well, you said that price has been a really big inhibitor, so you guys do it for a lot less and faster. Can you give an example of a customer that you've really helped transform, so that they get much more visibility into upwards of 80% of their applications? >> Yeah, so I mean, AppOptics is just coming out, so we've announced it; it's a new product. And so, we've had tons (mumbles) in beta. The first thing that I would say is that all of them were up and running, and actually getting metrics into the dashboard in between three and five minutes, so very, very fast. (Mumbles) this one line... Auto-instrumentation really clicks. And so there's universities, there is smaller IT shops, there's big companies who are interested in that kind of stuff. In general, one of the things that people don't necessarily know about SolarWind's portfolio is we've started to invest in Cloud, in roughly 2014. We've acquired some premiere product and franchises, one of them being Pingdom, for digital experience monitoring. Another one being Papertrail, which is an amazing hosted log-management solution. And between these solutions, we have about... Slightly short of a million users already. >> Lisa: Wow. >> So, significant, significant footprint in the marketplace, and so, customers that are "cloud native," born in the cloud companies like GitHub, Spotify, AirBnb, and so... Uber, as an example... And you have the traditional companies: New York Times, BBC, packaging companies, smaller compa-- I mean, it really running the gammit of the space out there. >> What is digital experience monitoring, and how are you doing that? >> That's a great question. (Lisa laughs) >> So, we look at digital experience monitoring from two facets, really. The first facet is... So, I talked a lot about observability and sort of the white-box monitoring, where you gotta drill down into the code and the transaction, and so on, but typically one goal of monitoring is to be ahead of your consumers in terms of noticing problems. And so for that, the best way, is really, is to have synthetic transactions that simulate user behavior hitting your app. And so, that's one... Synthetic monitoring's one dimension of digital experience. But beyond that, and that's where we're investing very heavily with Pingdom is this notion of... Yeah, we talk a lot about apps, but there's lots of companies out there that are putting their stuff out on websites, right? So nowadays, if I go to the doctor and later on, I want to see my test results, it's on a website. If I go to take my car to the garage, they make appointments on a website. And many times, these people have no idea how their site is doing, what the response time is, all that kind of stuff. And that's what Pingdom provides, but what we're doing, taking it beyond the simple (mumbles) time and performance is we're marrying business metrics, like bounce rates... What's a bounce rate of the site? What's the revenue that's the site driving right now if it's a revenue-generating site, and correlating that with the performance aspects of the site. How are the transactions doing? How long does it take from the first click to the shopping cart? And so, that's what we think of as digital experience, and there's much, much more to do because, really, what you want to do at the end is to see how users flow through your webpage, and where they probably disengage, where they move somewhere else. You want to detect these spots and see if it has to do anything with the performance or the way you laid out the site. And so, digital experience monitoring, we think, is going to be huge. >> Lisa: Absolutely. Well, thank you so much for stopping by, Christoph, and speaking with Justin and me. We could keep going, but unfortunately-- >> Christoph: Yeah! >> We are out of time. >> It's so short. >> Exactly, but we look forward to having you back on the show next time. >> I'd be delighted. >> And we want to thank you for watching. I'm Lisa Martin for my co-host, Justin Warren. You're watching The Cube live from day three at AWS re:Invent 2017. Stick around, we'll be right back.

>> Narrator: Live from Las Vegas, it's theCube covering AWS re:Invent 2017 presented by AWS, Intel, and our ecosystem of partners. (upbeat music) >> Okay, welcome back everyone. We're here live in Las Vegas. This is theCube's exclusive coverage of Amazon Web Services re:Invent 2017, our fifth year covering AWS re:Invent. I'm John Furrier the founder of SiliconANGLE Media with my co-host Stu Miniman. I'm so excited 45,000 people and boy, I remember when it was just a small, little, fast-growing company. We're here with Teresa Carlson who's been here with us the whole way. She's a Senior Vice President of Public Sector. Teresa, welcome to theCube, good to see you. >> I'm always glad to be here on theCube. >> So, you've been running public sector, you've been really, I've gotta say, I gave a tweet, not to sound that I'm fawning over you right now, but you've really grown the business in a significant way. As Andy was saying, a meaningful way. Take us through, because it's almost mind-blowing. We have already had a few guests on theCube. I went to your breakfast. You are changing the game, but not without scar tissue. You've done a lot of hard work to get there, so, one, congratulations, but give us a state-of-the-union right now for public sector, because you're winning, you're doing great, but it wasn't easy. >> No, it's not been easy, but it's been a lot of fun. I mean, it's been a lot of fun, in fact, as you said, this is our sixth year of doing re:Invent and yesterday or two days ago, we had a public sector breakfast and it was so full, we got shut down by the fire marshal. So that is when you know you've got customers and partners showing up, because they want to be there. We have grown significantly and that has been through the work of both working with customers and partners on security, compliance, policy, acquisition vehicles, to just make sure that we have the right balance of everything needed to really drive and grow the business in the right way. As I've talked about we didn't leave any stone unturned. We had to really go through all the hard processes to do this right and I think it really has paid off because you never want to take short-cuts. You wanna make sure you're doing the right thing in order for customers to have better technology, for us to help drive good government, good education. >> I gotta say, one of the big trends we're seeing here on siliconANGLE, theCube, and Wikibon is the public-private Partnerships are accelerating. You're seeing public sector help on security to the private sector, private sector helping government move faster and so you're seeing a balance and an equilibrium coming together, but also old guard companies sometimes have a federal division or a separate DNA culture. You guys don't, you have one culture at Amazon, but the striking thing for me, is that you're now enabling companies to get into public sector that couldn't before. So I wanted to ask you specifically, is it like that now, we're you're starting to see new people come in with solutions because you guys have done that heavy lifting where before they'd have to wait in line, get certified, are we seeing new solutions, are you enabling that, is that actually happening? >> It absolutely is happening and we never forget our roots of start-ups here at AWS, because they are really a huge reason why we exist and for public sector, I saw a change in my previous life I never had venture capitalists or private equity firms come and say we want our companies in government. We are creating new education tech companies, which was really not even heard of. >> It's a growth strategy for them. >> It's a huge growth strategy, so venture capitalist and private equity like Andreessen Horowitz, Madrona, C5, Bridgewater, we see tons and they come to us saying, we have this portfolio, can you help us talk to them about how they get into government? As a result of that, we do sales and marketing, we work with them on FedRAMP I-E slash security compliance. We ensure that they understand the elements and components of how they work in government and by the way, government loves that we are bringing in innovative new technologies. We can also do that through the marketplace, the AWS marketplace, which allows them to move faster, be more agile, and start getting that business. >> Teresa, I'm wondering if you could share a little more. You talk about innovation, we've been lovin' for years, I love when I talk about regional governments, education, you get non-profits under your umbrella, where it used to be, I didn't have the budget, I can't move fast. Now, we're seeing some great innovation from the private side as well as well as some of the public-private interactions. >> Definitely, in fact, I was in California about a month ago where we announced an innovation center with California Polytechnic University, CalPoly and the president there, Jeff Armstrong, it is amazing, they literally had been looking at what AWS was doing and they took the pillars that they'd been seeing us talk about for public sector and they created an innovation center to work on these opportunities and challenges and just as in public safety, health, agri, sex trafficking and child exploitation, through seeing what Thorn was doing in the International Center for Missing and Exploited Children. >> How is this leveling the playing field? Because everyone, citizens at least in the United States, I'm sure it's happening in other markets as well, they want the government to move faster. And you guys are like the freight train that's out of control speed-wise, just more and more services. How does the government keep up? Because I would imagine that if I am a government official or I'm the public sector, oh my God, I can't handle Amazon. I can't ride that beast, it's too strong. I mean do they say that, is that the wrong vibe, or are they more hey I want you to do, is it more your flywheel, do they have to get involved? What's the relation, what's the sentiment of the government? >> Well, they wanna move fast. In fact, in the U.S. government, the White House does have an entire initiative now on modernization. You're seeing countries like the U.K government go cloud native. You saw the country of Bahrain which is going all-in in the cloud and they've already established new policies and a cloud-first policy of moving. But I would tell you, if you look at groups like the intelligence community in the U.S. government, we just announced our secret region and that allows them to have top-secret capabilities, secret, unclassified in our GovCloud, so they have capabilities across the entire spectrum of workloads and what they've always said to us and our other customers is can we build cloud tools, can we build a cloud? Yes, but can we innovate at the rate and speed you're innovating? No, because we provide them innovation ahead of their demand. >> Yeah, Teresa, I remember when GovCloud launched and it was, like, wow, this is like AWS isn't just like a monolithic service around the globe and everything. It seems like secret region goes along that line. How does the dynamic between AWS as a whole and what you're doing in your organization, how do you work through that and kinda balance, I want services around the globe, yet meet the needs of your clients. >> On the GovCloud region, that was our first entre into doing something unique for government. That region has grown 185% every year since 2011 and we just announced a second region on the east coast for GovCloud, U.S. GovCloud. The interaction with our services team is amazing. Charlie Bell who runs all of our services, we have a tight relationship, we talk to our government customers in these regions, understand their priorities, then we roll them out and it's really that simple. They get the exact same thing in their classified regions as we give our other customers, it's just their network. >> Well, you got the date set, I'm looking at my picture here I took, June 20th and 21st, save the date, AWS Public Sector Summit, #AWSPSSummit as it's called on Twitter hashtag. Every year, you started out in a little conference room, in a ballroom, bigger hotel, now the convention center. Massive growth. >> And theCube was there this year, which I was happy. >> That makes it legitimate, and theCube's there, we'll be there this year, >> Good, yes. >> But of course, this is the growth. V.C.s, private equity, this is a growth market, this is not a unique, siloed market anymore. You guys have leveled the silos within Amazon, I mean you never had silos, but you are now agile to come to the government. What's next for you? You've done a great job, you're now cruising altitude, what's your growth strategy for Public Sector Summit, how are you going to take it to the next level? >> Well, even though we have grown a lot, thank you to our customers and partners, we really are just scratching the surface. It is day one still for us. Our customers are really just still getting going on a lot of mission critical workloads. They're moving in things they really hadn't thought about. They're starting to do things like higher more developers in government, so they can take advantage of the tools used, a lot you saw yesterday. But additionally, what we're seeing is we are spending a lot of time going into countries around the world, helping countries set a strategy for digital transformation. New jobs growth, new companies, economic development, how do they train and educate for a cloud-based workforce, we call it and that's really fun to go in and tell governments, look you really have to prepare your country for a digital transformation and again if you look at groups like Bahrain, what the U.K have done, they are doing that and they are making a massive transformation around this. >> Final question for you, what are you most proud of looking back since you joined AWS seven years ago. I think it was seven years ago you started? >> Yep, seven years ago this month. >> Congratulations, so what are you most proud of and then two, what do you think about the most as you execute day-to-day in growing the business? >> Well, I would say the fact that I have had an amazing brand to work with out of the gate Amazon was such a great brand, and the fact that, again, based on think big, Andy Jassy's leadership, really he and I having a conversation together saying, we can change the world and make it a better place and you've heard me say a lot in my openings, we have two themes that we talk about in public sector, which is paving the way for disruptive innovation and making the world a better place. And if I look back, it's really the things that we're helping to do this that we are driving new policies, companies are seeing results, agencies, and we are making the world a better place. I would say that's humbling and amazing and we're just getting going. >> As a chief of public sector, you're like, you've seen it grow and you're running it every day and you have a great team, do you ever have a pinch me moment once in a while? Kind of say, wow, what have you done? >> Well, I think the pinch me moments are when I hear the customers and partners tell me how fast they're moving and the results they have. We always have a goal of really working with our mission partners and we've hired now more than 17,000 veterans at Amazon and growing. It's things like that that we can do to really help that transformation and not just talk the talk, but walk the walk as a company. I would say for where we wanna go and what I sort of worry about our growth, I guess I worry and stay up a little late at night to make sure that we keep our hiring bar high, that we really maintain our focus on customer obsession, >> John: Security. >> Security is always on my mind. >> Do you sleep at all it must keep you up late a lot. >> No, I don't really, no. But the last thing I would say is just really thinking through ensuring that we're continually pushing hard, that we have a little bit of sharp elbows, going in we're trying to change policy, we don't give up on the things that really matter for doing this massive transformation, for countries, for state and local agencies, for feds, for educational institutions around cloud transformation. >> I really respect your results and I love your hard-charging style. It's fantastic, your success obviously speaks for itself. We'll see you at the Summit in June. This is theCube, Teresa Carlson The Chief of the Public Sector business, she's the Vice President of Public Sector. I'm John Furrier, Stu Miniman. More live coverage here at AWS re:Invent after this short break. (upbeat music)

>> Announcer: Live from Las Vegas, it's The Cube. Covering AWS re:Invent 2017. Presented by AWS, Intel, and our ecosystem of partners. >> Welcome back to The Cube's continuing coverage of AWS re:Invent 2017. We're live from Las Vegas, day three. There's still a ton of people here. We have a great guest next and we're excited to talk about Mark Kelly, the director of Cloud and Infrastructure Services Architecture, talking with myself, Lisa Martin, and my co-host Stu Miniman. Mark, welcome to The Cube. >> Thank you, glad to be here. >> So Scripps Networks, tell us a little bit about that. I know a few things, HGTV, Food Network, I watch those a lot but, tell us a little bit more about Scripps Network. >> So Scripps, when I say that name, most people do not know it. But we are the leading provider of home, food, and travel content for broadcast, the web, and for emerging technologies at this point in time. So, we've got a lot of brands in our umbrella. You said HGTV, we've got Food Network in there, Cooking Channel, DIY Network, Great American Country, and Travel Channel. >> Yeah so Mark, I know my family binges a lot of these shows so-- >> Really? >> As do I. >> Take us little bit, you know, what's happening in that industry today? You know binging versus watching online, cloud, digital, the joke of course is that at least things are pretty stable and not changing in your world, right? >> Oh I know, absolutely. It is changing on a very rapid pace so, as more and more people, you know, the big buzzword is that cord cutting thing. We have got big concern in out industry around that. But as more and more people talk about it, we're adapting our technologies to be there just to provide for them. So we're on those emerging technologies. We're on all of the said top boxes. Apple TV, Roku, we're actually developing networks specifically for those technologies. So we're trying to adapt. The broadcast world is still our bread and butter, so until we figure out the revenue models for these new technologies, we're gonna be in the broadcast world for some time. >> So Mark, talk us through a little bit of what's your role there. You've been there six years I believe you said. How has Cloud changed the way Scripps works. >> So, Cloud has definitely changed the way we work. When I first came on board, Scripps was looking for a way to move the business faster. Scripps, because it is changing so rapidly, they're in the business of-- They have to compete with startups. And when they're competing with startups, startups don't have the same process as it controls around everything that the bigger enterprises do. So it was an extreme challenge to them. And you know, when they don't understand-- They don't have budget concerns like big enterprises either. When I go in to do a project to launch a new network, they don't understand it. I've got to buy hundreds of thousand dollars worth of hardware or whatever associated with it. So when we're looking at the Cloud, we needed a way to accelerate that. We wanted the make the business process much quicker. We weren't going to have those lead times for purchasing hardware, purchasing software, getting licensed, you know, racking it, stacking it, doing all that. We were looking to ways to move that out of the way so everybody could focus on providing more value for the business. And that was the primary reason we actually started looking at the cloud. >> So from an end user goal perspective, obviously you mentioned speed and having to compete with other networks and other native original content companies. How does the end users demand for 24 by 7 content, how does that drive really, the pace of innovation that Scripps has to meet? >> Yeah that is a very good question. I think we're still trying to figure that out because the whole consumption method for all of our end users is changing. They're going from their traditional TV to where they're watching it on their phone, to switching to their iPads, to everything else in between. So we're developing technology methods so that we're providing it for them as they need it and want it. >> Yeah, Mark can you give us a snapshot of what is your infrastructure look like today? What are the kinds of major things that have changed and what's kind of on the table? >> Today we are running about 3000 instances in AWS. So AWS is our primary cloud provider. We run a lot of auto scaling to take into account our seasonal loads. That's probably one thing that we-- One of the challenges we had going into the cloud is that we were up against certain times of the year when the load was extremely high but it was only extremely high for a couple of weeks. I mean literally we'll be running at two to three hundred percent of what normal was, and it would do it for two to three weeks. So we were having to purchase hardware in advance for that and it would just sit there idle for the rest of the year. So we were looking to ways to avoid that excess purchase and still scale to support our consumers and needs. >> So when you started this journey, and we were talking to Veeam earlier about-- Cloud is a destination, you get there, great, you're done. But when you start this journey you mentioned AWS and we're here at re:Invent, where did you start? What were some of the stakeholders that you had (Mark laughs) on the business side that you had to say, >> Absolutely. >> Alright guys, let's come to the table, we have a great opportunity here, this industry is transforming, as you know, the joke Stu made earlier. Where did you start with those business discussions? >> So I think it was more around trying to figure out that solution. It's like when I said earlier we're trying to get to market quicker. So it was easier to go to the stakeholder and say, "Hey I think I can go this route, and I think I can get you to market twice as fast." >> Lisa: Their ears perk up? >> Oh absolutely. Ears will perk up, eyes will light up. They're like, "Really? How much more is this gonna cost me?" And I'm like, I don't think we're gonna-- They went to represent the on-demand cost models. I think we don't have to do all these big upfront costs and that got a little bit more excitement out of the stakeholders. And we went forward from there. So we would um-- It took a while. Don't get me wrong. Everybody gets set in their ways. They're going to do things normally. Change sometimes is difficult to push through. >> Lisa: Absolute-- Cultural change. Very, very challenging. >> Absolutely. So it is a complete cultural change. They go from your traditional on-premise to the cloud model where you're not managing the hardware as much. You're focusing on the engineering around it. >> So Mark, you bring up managing. You know, monitoring something that's gonna change very differently. Talk a little bit about your people, you know, the skill sets they had to change, what's the difference is kind of before, during, and after that migration. >> So beforehand, when we were on our on premise environment, we were focused on tool sets, for monitoring, and managing infrastructure that were very vast. I mean we had a large number of them. One of our goals moving to the cloud was to consolidate that tool so that we wanted to get down to a minimal set that would actually accomplish our goals to get everything that we needed. So we didn't have to go through training people to learn 50 different tool sets for monitoring whatever it was. Network equipment, storage equipment, or the computer equipment. We were actually focusing on monitoring our applications and still getting some of that underlying infrastructure reporting on our monitoring, but we didn't have to have the same level where we were monitoring the hypervisors, we were monitoring the network switches, that kind of went away. So our focus became more on the operating system up and engineers developed. They no longer had to focus on that hardware. >> So what are you using for that, you know, how many people does it take to do that? Do you know if it can kind of compare to what you had before, yeah. >> Our standard monitoring switch is actually composed of New Relic. New Relic has been a great partner for us. They had the same mindset as us. We're looking to compete with the startups, at the time New Relic was the startup. Because we've been using them for between five and six years now. We brought them in because they had that same hunger and mentality that we were looking for. Their culture mashed really well. And we got in and deployed all of their suites to every environment. We actually leverage it in from development up through production. So we try not to separate our monitoring. We try to keep it all uniform so out troubleshooting gets a lot simpler. We actually have the same people monitoring our DeckStats that are monitoring out production stats. So they can troubleshoot and help get through there. It became a lot easier for them to do that. >> Could you talk about kind of, how many people you had, managing infrastructure before versus the monitoring, and some of the training they had to go through or? >> Before, it was all specialized people. I don't even have that. I couldn't even give you the headcount cause most of that was before my time. >> Stu: Yeah. >> But every individual was actually specialized on each application for monitoring. So it was actually teams that would focus on each part of the business. So as we migrated into cloud, we became more standardized. Made it simpler. We actually have our-- My cloud team is really in between about 15 to 20 people. And we're managing 3000 instances in AWS, and about six petabytes of storage. We've got quite a bit of a content up there already. >> And you're on the customer advisory board for New Relic. >> Mark: I am. >> You mentioned cultural alignment between Scripps and that vendor, and that's really key, but talk to us about this collaboration and it sounds-- Maybe by direction of that, you're able to maybe influence some of the things and help them make their technologies better. >> Absolutely, we've got a really good relationship with them so anytime we have a challenge, one of our current challenges is serverless. As we move, we have a lot of development teams that want to move into serverless. We've been working with the New Relic teams and giving feedback to them on what our challenges are with that, and how we're monitoring it, cause we've got certain things where I wanna be able to monitor those functions in serverless, and I'll need to give a cost back to my stakeholders to say this is what you'd cost. It's challenging to do that now but we're working with the New Relic team to help them deliver some of that knowledge to us. >> Mark, you hit a hot button for me. So bring us inside, you know, why serverless, and what are you hoping to gain from that. I've seen New Relic actually has been tracking for the last couple of years, adoption of containers in serverless so-- >> Containers in serverless is kind of the new hotness you know. We've been moving into serverless primarily because again, it's the next generation of speed for us. Makes it even simpler for the developers to get started, we can give them a standard framework, they can start developing their code and just push deploy and it's running, and they don't have to worry about any infrastructure or managing anything. Again, the challenge has been the monitoring part of it, but working through that and actually getting pretty good results out of it so far. >> So you've got about 70% of your consumer facing side is on AWS which has got some latency sensitive workloads that are still on-prem? >> A hundred percent of my consumer facing properties are on AWS. >> Oh fantastic. >> We do have some workloads that-- Those are really not designed for cloud. It's our end use, end financial systems, our critical business systems that need to be close to those departments. Those actually still live on-premise for us. When we started this journey, the on-premise was-- it was a slow, horrible process but, as we evolved, the cloud, they've evolved that on-premise stuff to keep us with them as well. We're actually looking at, so you know, some of the other monitoring solutions out there. New Relic has been an option for us to actually look at on-premise will, monitoring as well. >> So all the advancements that you guys have achieved in your six year or so transition to cloud that you've talked about. What's next for Scripps? What are some of the maybe new business opportunities that this optimization, cost reduction is enabling? >> So next for us is actually machine learning and AI. We have large initiatives going on that right now. We are trying to analyze our video, analyze our content, lots of it's to help remove some of the manual processes that we have now. Because a lot of that stuff when you're delivering to our different partners, there's certain requirements around the video, and the only way to do it right now is with eyeballs watching the videos. So is this somebody sitting there watching it for hours and hours a day. We're leveraging the machine learning stuff to actually auto classify this video, pull out thumbnails for the authors so they can put it in there, the metadata awareness form, and we're doing lots of things with AI. So we're looking for that to be a really hot feature for us in the next couple of years. >> Excited with what you heard this week from AWS about AI in ML? >> Absolutely. The first day keynotes were completely blown away. They were all things we were looking for. >> Stu: Anything specific that you've been waiting for, or just not waiting for, but got excited by? >> Yeah there was lots of it. The Kinesis video streams were actually really good. The video API, I'm drawing a blank on the exact name of it, but that one actually had some really good features for us because we are looking to do exact things that that one does. We're looking to pull time stamps out for when stuff shows up in videos and provide that back to our end users where they can search and find things in the videos much more quickly. >> Excellent. Well Mark, thanks so much for stopping by The Cube and sharing what you guys have been doing at Scripps Network with us. >> Mark: No problem. >> It sounds like you've seen a massive transition and you're really have a great foundation to continue going forward and >> Thank you. >> Lisa: And we look forward to continue to watch great shows on the network. >> Awesome, thank you guys. >> And for my co-host Stu Miniman, I'm Lisa Martin. We would like to thank Mark for stopping by. You're watching The Cube's continuing coverage from Las Vegas of AWS re:Invent 2017. Stick around guys, we'll be right back.

>> Voiceover: Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE, covering AWS re:Invent 2017, presented by AWS, Intel, and our ecosystem of partners. (upbeat music) >> Well, welcome back. We are live, here on theCUBE, which, of course, is a flagship broadcast of SiliconANGLE. And we're really a media, and we're very glad to have here with us for the second of our three days of coverage here at re:Invent, AWS, throwing quite a bash, here at The Sands in Las Vegas. Along with Stu Miniman, I'm John Walsh, and we're joined now by Manan Shah, who is the director of product management, at, or a director of product management, I'd say, at Cisco Systems. Are you used to hearing that yet, at Cisco Systems? >> We are getting close to it. >> Primarily at Viptela, acquisitioned just three months ago, so things are going well for ya. >> Things are going great. We are really excited to take the journey forward. It's been less than 90 days since we got acquired. We had a great ride at Viptela, As Steven told me, we were the market leaders with the largest traction in the fortune finders space. And Cisco was a natural fit. And now we are very excited to take this journey forward with Cisco's broader partner ecosystem and the customer base. >> So what's that all about? What brought the two of you together, in your opinion? >> Manan: That's a very interesting question. >> Stu: You mean other than money, right? (laughing) >> Always the big driver. >> Absolutely. >> But when it comes down to doing business, what was it? >> So, if you look at Cisco and how they're transitioning. I'll talk about business and technology together. If you talk about business, Cisco as a company is all moving toward a subscription-based business model. A large portion of Cisco's business today is very CapEx-heavy. And Viptela was all about subscription business model. And so that was very attractive to Cisco. The other piece was, we went head to head against Cisco in a lot of different fortune finder account. And we had a lot of success. So they saw the solution that we brought to the table and they saw the benefits of keeping it simple, yet sophisticated. That was a strand of Viptela solution. And that was very, very enticing to Cisco. The other piece was that this large deployment, a lot of customers are moving toward a cloud-first model. And one of the key value provs of Viptela was everything was cloud first and 90% of our customers, we were hosting their control plan and management plan in the cloud. And so as customers moved toward this cloud journey, they wanted to consume it as a service. And that was very attractive to Cisco, also. So all of these together made it very attractive for Cisco to look at us as not just a competition but something they can build on, build a business. >> John: Complement, right? >> Yeah >> So, the ST-WAN's been a hot space and, you know, been a couple of acquisitions that happened. Cisco had, you know, one or two solutions already before the acquisition, depending on who you talk to. Talked about that fit. Can you walk us through a little bit, kinda, you know, I'm sure you have to go through the portfolio stuff, how you position it, things like that, you think about the customers. But yeah, walk us through the -- >> So, Cisco had I-WAN solution, which was the legacy ST-WAN that Cisco had. Cisco also has Meraki ST-WAN solution. And now with acquisitions, Cisco has Viptela biz ST-WAN. So, the way we looked at it is the way Viptela, the ST-WAN solution was built, is all of the intelligence was in the fabric. And the end nodes were, what we call the edge routers were connecting into the fabric and building the leveraging the intelligence that was there. Now, the end nodes could be residing in a branch, be residing in a data center, or in a cloud location like AWS. And so the way we are approaching is, the intelligence will all remain in the fabric and rather than just having Viptela's routers as the end node, we will leverage the Cisco's broader portfolio as end nodes into that fabric. So, if you look at Viptela's, it was all internet-based products. Now, if you wanted a T1E1 interface, if you wanted a DSL interface, we, Viptela, did not have it. Cisco already has it. So it naturally made sense to leverage all of the breadth of portfolio that Cisco had and build that into the fabric. And that is what we are moving towards. In the next few months we will have a new software which will leverage all of those capabilities and have the full breadth of portfolio connecting to that ST-WAN fabric. >> All right, can you connect the dots with us now, being here at AWS, how's that fit in, you know, networking, of course, critical component for cloud, but yeah. >> Absolutely, and this is the best time. If you look at what AWS did over the last few months, they actually had a third party evaluate a lot of different ST-WAN vendors and they published a paper that talked about in toto ST-WAN. Listed all of the vendors and the capabilities. So they are acknowledging ST-WAN as a big movement going forward, and a big market, and they want to be part of it. We have seen a lot of customers, as they move their workloads into cloud, and into AWS, they want to extend the network fabric, continue to use the same tools that they will be using, and automate the capability of extending the fabric into the cloud. So, segmentation, so security, visibility, automation. Those are some of the key value prop or key data points that customers are asking us, saying, we want a single tool that will do that. And that is what we have done with the automation that we have built. >> I've seen over the last, this is my fifth year at the show. About two years ago, networking seemed to really kinda pick up. If I'm correct, I saw more than one Cisco booth, even. 'Cause I think there was another acquisition -- >> Manan: That's right. >> Cisco have. Can you give us a little bit of an overview of kind of Cisco in the public cloud these days? >> Yeah, so Cisco has always embraced cloud. And Cisco's overall strategy has been, we will enable customers to take their workloads wherever they want to be. So whether it's the traditional data centers, or AWS, or any other cloud, Cisco always has this multi-cloud strategy. And helping customers to build this fabric that would extend not only from branch to data centers, but branch to cloud, branch to data center, data center to cloud, no matter where the applications are, no matter where the users are. It's all about connecting users to the application, wherever they decide. >> So what's affected that, in terms of multi-cloud and my decision about where I'm gonna put whatever workload? I mean, different capabilities, right? I've got different considerations. So what do you think is motivating people now, or what's instigating people to make these decisions about what they're gonna do where? >> So, there's various evaluation criteria on how you adopt a cloud. So a lot of customers start with one cloud, get familiar with it, run some, develop applications, then run some production application. Once they get comfortable with it, then they want to expand to multi-cloud and less reliant on one particular cloud. But essentially leverage the best of what each cloud provider has to offer. And that is what we want to enable all customers to do, connect applications wherever, whichever cloud they decide, and connect users to those applications. >> Yeah. When I think back, I've worked with Cisco for a lot of my career. You know, branch was something that was critically important. How much has changed, moving to cloud? How much is the same, kind of extending from branch to cloud? >> Yeah, that's a great point. If you look at how the branch and the WAN has not evolved for the last 20 years, it was all about MPLS and the connectivity and getting service from the providers. Well, with the applications moving outside of data centers into cloud, historically, you would take all of your branch staffing into your data center, get it serviced by the applications that are in the data center, and only about 5% would go out to the internet. But if the applications are in the cloud, why do I need to take all the traffic from branch to the data center? Why can't I just go from branch to the cloud? Or data center to the cloud? Or campus to cloud? So, the fundamental design principals have changed. And as a result, you have to evolve in terms of how you design the WAN, how you deploy it, and how you evolve the thought process around consumption model. The other aspect that has changed is, because of internet and cellular, and customers want to build a ST-WAN fabric that is transport agnostic. You can leverage MPLS, you can leverage internet, you can leverage cellular. Why do I care about what connected? I tie my applications to a certain SLA. As long as any part that meets that SLA, I'm okay as the solution takes it, as long as it's secure. And that is what customers are looking for. The last piece that customers are looking for is the change in the consumption model. A lot of customers want to consume it as a service. Historically, they would get everything from a MSP or a service provider. Now they are looking at, okay, how do I, instead of having everything in my plan, consume it as a service. And that's where we saw, in the early days of Viptela, 90% of our customers consuming control plan and management plan from our hosted locations. >> Great. Wanna understand, you know, it's been three months since the acquisitions. I'd expect, being part of Cisco, you get access to a lot more customers. What else has changed? What is it like, coming to an event like this, under the Cisco umbrella mean? >> Yeah, so, there are a few other things that have changed. The first and foremost, as you rightfully said, is access to a lot of Cisco customers. Cisco is a great brand. And going against them, I always faced that. And now, being part of Cisco, I am leveraging that. Cisco has a great brand and what customers want is that, the product from Cisco that is solid and that works for years to come. The other aspect that has changed is, with us being part of Cisco, we are not only leveraging the customer and the partner ecosystem, we are integrating with the broader product portfolio that Cisco has. I give you the example of the routing portfolio that we are integrating in. In addition to that, Cisco has a great product portfolio in the security side. So we are leverage, we are integrating in the Cisco security portfolio, as well, to provide this end-to-end customer solution that leverages security, networking and a whole bunch more. >> So, I don't know if it's a friction point, but you did things a certain way. >> Absolutely. >> Right? You were a competitor. >> Yes. >> Cisco does things a certain way. They were a competitor. So, I mean, how do you make that work? Because ultimately, there's gotta be, I just assume, some difference of approach. >> Manen: And I would, I would be very honest -- >> It's inevitable, right? >> Yeah, it's inevitable, and it's there. The way, the pace at which we were delivering, right? We want to continue to deliver at the same pace. We want to continue to renew it at the pace that we were delivering as a startup. And that is one of the promises that Cisco has done. Cisco leadership has been very up front about, tell us what worked as a startup, and we want to incorporate that. And that has been one of the surprising things that, walking in, I was always cautious that, hey, would we be able to execute at the rate we want to execute. And that is one of the leadership promises that we have got is, we are behind you, we fully trust the capabilities that you have. Go run with it. And we are, we see that day in and day out, across the entire leadership team. >> John: It's a great stamp to have, right? >> It is a great stamp to have. And now, when we were as a startup, a lot of customers, when we are trying to close a business, they will say, do I really wanna do business with a startup? And there was always that financial and other conveniences that would come into play. Well, all of those is off table now. Now that we are part of Cisco, we have the Cisco brand that's backing us. And that's been a huge advantage and it has increased our sales byplan significantly. >> Your world's gone to this. >> Exactly. >> Right, right. Well, good for you. >> Manan: Thank you. Congratulations on the acquisition. And look forward to maintaining the surveillance on the progress, here. >> Absolutely, we are very excited. >> John: Thank you, Manan. >> Thank you. Thanks for having me. >> Manan Shah from Cisco Systems. Back with more, Stu and I will be, here from re:Invent. We're at AWS here in Las Vegas, and back in a bit. (upbeat music)

>> Announcer: Live from Las Vegas. It's theCUBE, covering AWS re:Invent 2017, presented by AWS, Intel, and our ecosystem of partners. (cheerful electronic music) >> Hey, welcome back to theCUBE's continuing coverage of AWS re:Invent 2017. We're hearing upwards of 45,000 attendees across, I think, five hotels here in Las Vegas. Incredible announcements, incredible buzz. I'm Lisa Martin with my co-host, Keith Townsend, and we're very excited to welcome Paul Young to theCUBE, first time. You are the Global Vice-President of Customer Strategy, SAP Database and Data Management. Welcome to theCUBE. >> Thank you, good to be here. >> Paul, first question, how can businesses accelerate their digital transformation by running SAP in the AWS cloud? >> It's a good question, and there's a really great but incredibly long answer to this. Put it simply, I think you have to put the context of what SAP does first. We have a huge number of customers globally. Depending on how you count the numbers, we probably run about 85% of the global economy. So on that point, when you work for SAP and you wake up in the morning, you know there's a pretty serious responsibility that comes with that and then equally, a lot of our customers have now been with us 25 years, we have customers who've been with us 40 years, and so in that context when you say, how can we change digitally, customers constantly innovate but we operate on a much longer timeline than I think most of the start-ups and everybody else do. There's a responsibility in what we do in terms of running companies and supply chains where you have to think longer term and so it's not necessarily about doing new things in the cloud, it's about doing things, but there is an ability to unlock a speed and capacity that our customers have never had before, and I think that's where we get value out of this. >> So, this, I think interesting statement. When I think of SAP, I think of ECC, SRM, all of the business weeks that come along, all the apps that come along with powering that 85% of the economy and that's, I've worked in the SAP environment, and you don't make changes to SAP, you make changes very slowly, very determined. We're at a cloud convention where we think about breaking things fast. Those things don't meld very well. How does SAP bringing that stayed, true reliability to AWS? >> So I'll give you a really quick example. When you break down our business, on the one hand you have our pure cloud property, so the success factors that concur with everything else. So those are really common things that most companies run the same. So historically, you run those inside an ECC and every time an HR rule changes somewhere in the world we have to upgrade the system and cut it down. So the extent we can take travel expenses, and HR, and purchasing, things everyone does commonly, and move it out to native cloud applications, then you get the benefit of native cloud infrastructure for those things and you reduce the cost and you reduce, you can decrease the restrictions on customers. On the other hand, you have the pure HANA stuff that we do where we do very cool, very exciting projects that have just never been done before. The bit in the middle, you come back to that, is the bit that you would define as not changing fast? >> Keith: Right. >> If I pull out an industry-specific, pharmaceuticals, so we make high 90s percent out of all the pharmaceuticals on the planet, heavily-regulated world, right? You can't just upgrade your system because the FDA needs to know that it's all compliant at all times through. So it's not that we can't move fast, it's just there are restrictions, there are rules that make that happen and that's why customers come to us, because we have that compliance. Below that, however, customers still want to innovate, they still want to change. And probably a little bit of the change historically is the point where a customer comes to us and says, "I want to do the next thing." Historically, we have a very rigid change-control process you're aware of. I'll tell you to go to a consultant, I'll tell you to start in your dev environment, I'll tell you to go buy new hardware, I'll tell you to start doing the migration cross, and then once you've done that, the answer is, well, that kinda worked, but I haven't yet seen any volume, so now I'm going to do it for QA, and you can spend a lot time burning a lot of cycles before you get to the point of belief that it's possible. >> From the ask to delivery, and a lot of SAP, especially in pharmaceuticals, can be a couple of years, realistically, going through that entire cycle. In the mean time, you have commercial groups inside of pharmaceuticals saying, that's valuable data, I want to get at that data and innovate from a digital transformation perspective. So how does that happen? >> So I'll give you an example of where we're at with AWS right now. What we introduced in, actually, we introduced to customers secretly, a little bit over a year ago, what we made public in June with AWS, and actually now with the other cloud providers as well, is what AWS calls fast, what we call rapid data migration for SAP. But what we did is we looked at this world where you can provision a HANA server inside AWS in 30 minutes. So you can provision a half, a one, a two, or a four-terabyte HANA server right now in 30 minutes. AWS is on record that next year they'll introduce eight and 16-terabyte servers. That's, with very few exceptions, basically almost all of our customer base can provision a new box in 30 minutes. The challenge then is, on our side, how do we change process to allow customers to unlock that? So what we did is, in June, we announced publicly a new program where we have a bit of software where you can provision a server in the cloud and we have a client that runs on your production box and we'll replicate all the data, code, and everything that's running in your production box out to AWS while the box is still running. It allows you to do all the patches, all the upgrades, everything else, and you'll get a complete replica of your production box, upgraded to whatever version you choose, within about 48 hours generally. There's customers that take longer. We actually just did a 25-terabyte SAP VW system in 44 hours, start to finish, completed and delivered. >> So is that going from a legacy Oracle VW-based system to SAP HANA running in AWS? >> SAP HANA. In 44 hours, start to finish. I've done some in as little as 29 hours. And actually, even less than that for some customers. So that just opens up a huge potential here where historically, that timeline that says you want to start an upgrade, so six months from now we'll be able to try, you can literally come in on Monday morning and the software is free from us, the support comes from us if you're currently on your support contract, so all you do is you pay Amazon by the hour for the server and by Tuesday night, Wednesday morning, you can see your system running in the cloud, which is secondary to in the latest version, at speed, you know all the things you're concerned about, about code, performance, and everything are answered 'cause it's a full production system and at that point, now we can make a plan to accelerate. That's a huge jump for our customer base. Huge opportunity. >> Speaking of opportunities, one of the great things that we hear from Amazon all the time, not just at the annual re:Invent shows but during the summits as well is this accelerated pace of innovation. While managing operational efficiency at massive scale and building this great ecosystem of partners, looking at, you mentioned, SAP also worked with the other cloud providers. How does Amazon's accelerated pace of innovation that they've maintained for a very long time now, how does that inspire what SAP is doing and how does that message translate to the pharmas all the way down to some of maybe the newer customers of SAP's? >> There's a little bit of tension here, obviously, because again, it's funny, I was at the customer advisory board on Monday and we were discussing some of this about how do we innovate quickly, but also how do we cover the risks and everything for them? And at the end of the day I had a conversation with several customers where I basically said, look, as much as we're asking for all this stuff, and I agree, we can also all agree at this point that 10 years from now, everyone in this room could agree to meet back here and I guarantee you're probably all still going to be SAP customers, right? And no one disagreed with me. So it is a little bit different because we do have to think longer timelines on this, and so there's always a little bit of a conflict, I have to say, with as much as everyone says fast innovation, part of why you buy from SAP is that you get a guarantee that three years from now, we won't drop support. If you're running your business and three years from now, we say, we won't come to you and say, I'm sorry, you better turn off your system in six months because it doesn't work. So if you're a start-up company, you can take that risk. Generally, my customers can't. To a certain extent, we have to work on a controlled environment for that section of our customer base where we know that they'll be successful and we know that we have a future guarantee going forwards. But at the same time, we want to unlock the potential for them to try. And that's a large part of what we see, again, with the, if we just go back to the core SAP customer base, historically, you can try. The customers you know, you have to go buy a new server so you've got to be pretty certain that project's gonna work to go out and buy the hardware and install it and everything yourself. If I come to you and say, hey look, you can provision a new box, we can do a quick test for you, and if it doesn't work, four days from now we can burn it again, that really unlocks that. So it's less, for me, about all the additional features and functions. Just the basic blocking and tackling of that ability to provision and drop servers is just something that our customer base has never had before. And they will take advantage of all the surrounding stuff, but just unlocking that thought process that says I can run a test for a week, and if it doesn't work, I can drop it again, opens up a huge amount of potential. That's incredibly exciting. >> As a former SAP customer running HP-UX boxes, I can attest to SAP continuing to support legacy solutions going into the future. The one conversation on the transition from a traditional, on-premises environment to cloud, specifically you guys have been pushing HANA and AWS pretty hard. HANA itself can be a hard argument. 25-terabyte VW database to a HANA-instance in-memory. In-memory databases are much more expensive, how do you sell that to a customer? >> That's a good question. Well, I'll answer it slightly differently. If you look at the, again, one of the things that the cloud providers in general, and AWS does specifically, is just modify the price curve in a huge way. So HANA runs on stock Intel boxes. They're specially configured, they have high back planes, they have specific memory readers, but they're stock Intel boxes. Candidly, they don't seem to have been priced like they were stock Intel boxes for customers who've bought them in the past. The thing I love about the cloud providers, and AWS specifically, is they price them as if they were stock Intel boxes. So a two-terabyte HANA box, if you're on a three-year flex agreement with AWS at this point is $80,000 a year, effectively. That's a tenth of what it would cost if you were buying from a hardware provider. So at that point, the cost curve just bent massively. >> That appliance model that SAP came out with HANA initially, that what was, you're looking at $150,000 for a similar solution and that's what follows support. >> So you just massively bent that price curve. I've got customers right now who, again, because of the way HANA fails over inside AWS you don't need to permanently run an HA box, depending on your environment. If you can take a 15-minute fail over, you just shut down and provision a new server and continue on, so you've just halved the cost of that. So there's cloud economics here. Yeah, that price curve that may have been the objection before is disassembling really quickly. The 25-terabyte Oracle box, by the way, fit on a 10-terabyte cluster on AWS, so it's five two-terabyte boxes clustered together, provision in 30 minutes, you're looking at $800,000 a year, tell me where you can get a 25-terabyte Oracle cluster for that price right now? Nevermind the speed performance attribute also that you're getting to run your business. We're at a point where the economics have changed dramatically. >> I'm gonna bring you guys back up. We've got about one minute left. Paul, just coming up from the technology bits, from an industry perspective, where are you seeing, you mentioned pharma a little bit ago, where are you seeing the biggest opportunity for industries to successfully run SAP in the AWS cloud? >> There's interest from all over. There's some specifically stand out. I think the pharma guys specifically stand out. AWS does a great job, I'll give them credit here. Part of the challenge with pharma is it's not just running a system, you have to be fully FDA regulated and compliant, and AWS is able to do that. And it's not cheap to run a data center that's fully FDA regulated. So, AWS offers some really compelling cost advantages on top of that right now. I'm sure the other guys will step up and match them but they're doing that. Oil and gas has been a big one. Again, the oil and gas guys, the price of oil's come back up but I think they're looking at long-term economics of how they run their environments and what they can do. Consumer products is another one. There's, what's really interesting, I'll tell you, just one note is, historically there's normally an adoption curve of industries. You can predict leader industries. Like high technology leads and there's industries that follow. One of the huge breakouts as we've been through this initially with HANA is warehouse distribution logistics. Normally, they're slightly trailing because they live on very small margins. Very up front in this process because the part of HANA unlocks huge advantages to them and their ability to run their business much better, much more efficiently. >> And they can get stuff done that you couldn't do before. >> Get answers quicker, and then the cloud stuff allows them to do it cheaper. So it affects everyone, however, the adoption curve doesn't look like the historic adoption curve for industries. It's a better question for another day, when we have more time, but the adoption rate has changed in the customer base, by industry. It's a very interesting question. >> Very interesting, well, if only we had more time. Paul, thank you so much for joining Keith and me on the program today and sharing your insights. >> Thank you. >> For my co-host, Keith Townsend, I'm Lisa Martin. You've been watching theCUBE live on day two of our continuing coverage of AWS re:Invent 2017. Stick around, we have more great content coming up next. (cheerful electronic music)

>> Narrator: Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE covering AWS re:Invent 2017. Presented by AWS, Intel, and our ecosystem of partners. (techno music) >> Welcome back to The Sands. We are live here in Las Vegas as theCUBE continues our coverage of re:Invent. Still a jam packed show floor, it was like that yesterday. Talking about 42 to 45,000 attendees. I don't thing anybody's left the place yet. It's that kind of excitement that is certainly built within this community, so hats off to AWS for putting on such a great show. Along with Stu Miniman, I'm John Walls. We're now joined by Alok Ojha, who is the senior product manager and the lead for container security at CloudPassage. Alok, good to see you, Sir. >> Good to be here. >> Welcome to kind of breaking your maiden here on theCUBE, right, first time? >> Alok: First time here, yes, and super excited to be here. >> We're glad to have you, been talking about all kinds of fascinating things, gaming and security, we might get into that a little bit later on. First off, tell us a little bit about CloudPassage. I know you've only been there a short period of time, so, not only what it does, but what you're doing there. >> Great, great, so, CloudPassage is a cloud security, a cloud application security, infrastructure security company. We help our customers secure their workloads, whether they're running on servers, bare metal servers or VMs, and now yesterday we actually made an announcement around container security, so we now support containers as well. >> John: Alright, so go into that a little bit. I know you're pretty excited about that. >> Yeah, yeah we're pumped about it. So what we're hearing from our customers is that they have been using us to secure their workloads today whether it's running on Amazon, Azure, Google, their own data center, it doesn't really matter. What they're really looking for is one single platform that helps them secure and be compliant across the board. The next step in that direction of evolution is to have support for containers. And we announced the support for container security. We call it, pretty smartly, CloudPassage Container Secure. >> John: How long did it take you to come up with that, that must have been? >> Took us a million dollars to actually find somebody to get the idea. So we announced that yesterday, we are seeing a lot of excitement in our customer base. We actually had a pretty exciting beta as well where we had 10-plus Fortune 1,000 companies participating and a good chunk of them are actually looking at getting on board and using Container Secure. >> Alok, I want you to step back for a second. Security's been going through massive renaissance. It feels every few years there's always discussion, oh we're going to change the security model, but especially with DevOps. One of the main changes, I've talked to my friends that are developers, you read the literature, it's DevOps forces some of those changes in security and while it's one of the challenges, it's really one of the huge opportunities. Maybe talk about your thoughts on that. You've been in this industry a while. I think it's one of the reasons that brought you on to CloudPassage. >> Alok: I'll actually take multiple steps back because I kind of look from a broad perspective. So, when I look at trends, to me it's more about what's happening and how are the lives of people changing when it comes to people, process, and technology, right? So I'll start with tech. If you look at tech, there are three major changes that are relevant to our customers. On the infrastructure side, we have seen customers using servers, moving to containers, moving to surface architecture, right? And in between, there was this massive shift that happened between customers moving from pure place servers to VMs and there was huge concern about, hey, how do we handle security for VMs? Now we are past that and now the next wave of questions and concerns are around how do you secure your containers running across your infrastructure? The second piece is people used commercial, off the shelf software and that's moving on, but companies like Amazon providing services like databases, we had a huge set of announcements from Mandy Jesse today in the morning about databases and some interesting comments made there. So, we have seen trends in that direction. We're also seeing a trend that people are building monolithic applications and now they're breaking it apart and building micro services. Now because of these major tech changes, we are seeing significant changes on the people process side, which is what you're talking about. So you had people structured as IT, operations and IT security, buying commercial software, providing security and compliance based on it and driving business. It changed, as Mark Anderson said, software is eating the world, and as a result, you're seeing more developers getting hired by organizations, building softwares fast, delivering it to meet their respective customer needs, and as a result, there's a major shift happening driven by technology, as well as needs from the customer where now we're looking at Ops and DevSecOps. >> I want you to bring us inside a little bit, that container security discussion. Remember back, kinda two years ago, it was like, oh, containers aren't secure, shove 'em in a VM, no, you don't want to do that. Oh, maybe the isolation of containers actually will give us an opportunity. So what is the state of security? What is your company doing? What's special about the offering you have? And how does that fit in with kind of what Amazon's doing, the open source piece, I mean it's a big, hairy ball there, but yeah? >> It's interesting, so what we're seeing on the container side, the reason why the industry is using containers is because it simplifies deployment. You build your application, mostly images, and it becomes easier to deploy them. Doesn't matter where you're deploying them, which infrastructure it is, who owns it, doesn't really matter. But from a security standpoint, there's a huge benefit that Docker provides as well, which is the whole name space operation across processes, networks, so on and so forth. But the key challenge that we see is because Docker has inherent security, it's not still good enough. So, if you look at the images themselves that the developers are building, the images could have embedded secrets in them. They could have vulnerable packages in them. And you could have images that are getting deployed in production that are not authorized images. So you have to be kind of watchful of those things. You look at the container run time, you have to be aware of the configurations the container has. Are they privileged? Are they read-only? Are there configuration drifts happening on the containers? At the same time, you have to look at the third pillar, which is the Docker host on which the container is running, because containers are only as secure as the underlying operating system, the host. >> Where does the container strategy fit in with the holistic security that companies need to look at? >> Alok: As I said earlier, our customers are looking for one platform where they can secure the host, the virtual machines, and the containers, and our strategy is solely focused on that. Going from VMs to containers and you're also looking at supporting several less end services. >> I was kind of kidding there off the top when I said, we're talking about gaming, we're talking about all kinds of things here. We were talking about that, but on a different plane, about generations. You said, yeah, as a parent, we have different problems, but they're the same problems. So in the security world, you have the same nature of problems, but the magnitudes may be changed. So what do you think the next generation of security issues, what is that going to be? And how do you think your colleagues and you at CloudPassage are going to have to address that? >> That's a great question. The trend that we are seeing, and I think a couple of years from now what's gonna happen is the IT security organization is gonna go through a major transformation, right? Software is eating the world, and as a result, DevOps is going to become front and center of what's gonna happen. If I'm a VPO for application development, I would like to have both DevOps and security part of the entire process because I, as a business owner, I am accountable for the brand, the use case and the problems I'm solving for my customers, but at the same time, meeting security and compliance requirements. So security and compliance as a problem is still the same, but how people are building and delivering software, where they're doing it, what infrastructure they're actually running on, as to complexity, as to scalability problems, and last but not least, because you're looking at big-scale, automation is key. >> Look, I'm curious how IOT fits into this. I hear surface area, magnitude, you know, huge kind of threat when it comes to security. >> So we don't do much in the IOT space. But I think what's happening is customers who are looking at using IOT for their infrastructure, they're using more and more of microservices and containers to deliver that service, which is where we come in. We are seeing, as they're adopting IOT and delivering services using IOT, tracking trucks, devices, and those pieces across their network, we are the vendor of choice when it comes to securing those pieces of infrastructure as well as virtual machines and hosts they are running on. >> What kind of customer interactions are you having here? What are kind of some of the top issues that are driving customers to your booth and challenges that they're looking to solve? >> Customers are coming to us, saying, hey, we have a mandate, the IOT security guys and the DevOps guys are saying, from the business perspective, we have a mandate to deliver software fast, we have to meet our customer needs and stay ahead and up our game every day. In order to do that, you have to look at how you move security to the left of the DevOps pipeline. So customers are coming to us and asking, how do you fix that? How do you help us meet those needs that we have? How do I secure my workload? How do I move security to the left on the DevOps pipeline? And while doing all of that, be continuously compliant? And we're having so many conversations on these topics with our customers and containers happens to be front and center of that. >> You said you've been five months at CloudPassage? What was, in your mind, the most attractive element that pulled you in, and what do you see then, as you've created this business from scratch, what little bumps are you hitting along the way in your work, forget your clients, I mean for you, what you have to handle when you are trying to create this whole new enterprise within a system? >> It's a great question, so when I looked at CloudPassage, I was looking for two things. One from a market perspective, I clearly believed in what CloudPassage was doing back then when I was looking at them, and they still continue to do that, which is enterprise IT is going through a significant change and DevOps and DevSecOps is becoming front and center. And CloudPassage is solely focused on that. So it's a big check for me, from a market trend standpoint. At the same time, it's a great team, great people. So I came in with a mandate to actually build and define the container security product which we announced yesterday. Moving forward, I think in terms of bumps, it's interesting as a start-up, which areas do we focus on? Because you look at containers, customers are talking about a very broad spectrum. I mean security container run time, but they're also talking about microsegmentation and different pieces, but what we're finding in general, is that customers are still figuring out how to use Docker, how to containerize their application. And the challenge that we are facing and we are focused is you have to solve the problem across visibility, you know, use cases across the platform, be it VMs or containers, instead of going too deep vertically on the container side alone. So we are going broad, helping meet the needs of our customers as they're deploying it today. >> I'd love to hear your viewpoint, what's it like being in the AWS ecosystem these days? >> It's amazing, I mean the rate at which these guys are innovating, developers are adapting, they have the eyes and the ears of the developers. What that means is DevOps is going to speed up. What is also means is the use of infrastructures is going to speed up. What it means for us is our customers are going to be requiring means to secure and be compliant with the various regulations as they're deploying the software and containerizing different applications as they're deploying ECS, well moving forward maybe ETS, and we are the vendor of choice to help them get there. >> I think it means good news. >> Great news, yes. >> Well, congratulations on the news yesterday. And we certainly wish you all the well, all the continued success down the road. >> Thank you. >> John: I know five months probably felt like five days, right it's been flying by for ya? >> Of course. >> John: Good luck. >> Thank you. >> Thanks Alok, we're back with more here from re:Invent. AWS putting on the show here in Las Vegas. We're in The Sands and we're live here on theCUBE. Back with more in a bit. (techno music)

>> Narrator: Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE covering the AWS re:Invent 2017. Presented by AWS, Intel, and our ecosystem of partners. >> Welcome back, I'm Stu Miniman joined by my co-host, Keith Townsend, and this is one of the interviews we've been really excited. Of course, we've got about 60 interviews. We love all of them. Lots of good excitement. Lots going on at this ecosystem. Over 43 thousand in attendance here in Las Vegas, but happy to welcome back to the program, Chris Wolf, who's the Vice President and CTO of Global Field and Industry at VMware. Chris, great to see you. >> Thanks Stu, thanks Keith. Great to see you guys. >> So for the year, the whole VMware on AWS has been a hot buzz discussion. We've all been arguing internally and on theCUBE about you know, partnering and how does that work and who gets the most benefit out of it, but let's start, Chris I'd love to hear your viewpoint, you know. You talk to a lot of customers. I've talked to some customers that are really excited about it, especially at VMWorld, that were there testing it and doing it. Give us the customer viewpoint. What's really exciting them? What's interesting them? And I know there's a lot of new news we're wanna gonna get into. >> Yeah, you know, there's so much that I think is exciting to customers because you know, they're struggling with being more agile, being more software defined, being able to have more flexibility in their environments. And to be able to leverage VMware Cloud on AWS allows them to go through data center consolidation easier. It allows them to get applications to the Cloud to take advantage of Cloud services. One of the things people, I think kind of falls between the cracks in VMware Cloud on AWS is the fact that if I want to modernize an application or a traditional application, refactoring an application is enormously expensive. It's very hard to do. It's very time consuming. If I can start to move an application into the VMware Cloud on AWS and then start to integrate that with other native AWS services, I get the benefit of modernizing that application without having to touch any of the application code, which is a huge benefit to customers. >> Yeah, we've spent the last couple of years at this show, which well, do I lift and shift? Do I just re-platform it? Do I refactor it? Do I totally rewrite it? You know, the number of customers that I've talked to at this show, their advice that they give to their peers is like well, go faster. And how do we go faster? Do I just take my VMware stuff that I was doing in my own data center, stick it in VMware on AWS, start using all the cool stuff. Is that kind of the path that you see? >> That's part of it. You know, I think there's a couple threads here. There's the notion that you know, I wanna go faster, but to go faster, I have to slay some old demons in IT. Where I have to change my mindset. You know, I can't say I want to be more software defined and more agile and then have specific hardware requirements in my architecture. Of course, that's not for all applications, but that's part of that shift in mindset is how can I go faster? And if it's harder to transform some of my data centers, if I can get into that operational model by getting on Amazon quicker, then that's good for my business. >> Yeah, let me just poke on one more thing on that and I know Keith wants to jump in here, but one of the great things, I think back to 15 years ago. It was like, you know my Windows operating system going end to life. I'm gonna stick it in VM and keep it there forever. But, boy that application was all the technical data. My users hated it and everything like that. How does VMware go from I managed what you had to enabling your future? >> The thing that we're really focused on here in terms of enabling the future, when you think about programmatic compute and networking and storage and security, all applications need them. I can abstract all that away with a Lambda function or whatever, but at the end of the day, somebody has to do it and that part of the fabric becomes really important for things like having a security auto-trell. The other thread there is where VMware's strategic to customers is that they say, "You know I might wanna start this in the Cloud, "but I wanna maintain full control "of all of the intellectual property, "so I wanna use Kubernetes, I wanna use containers, "I wanna use a variety of open source projects. "I wanna use their native API's for my software engineers, "but I wanna have flexibility to build these applications "without pre-destining their future." Maybe it runs in a Cloud today, maybe it runs in a data center tomorrow, maybe it runs out at the edge. Maybe I do an acquisition and it has to run in that facility. The bottom line is, I don't always know what the future holds for my apps. And for the aspect of the apps that are core to your business, there's a lot value in running them on VMware because we can allow you to maintain that flexibility and independence, just like we've done way back in the past with your traditional enterprise applications. >> So Chris, that's a great setup for the next set of questions, which is, VMware has been known to move at the speed of the CIO. We're at AWS re:Invent. These folks move much faster than the speed of the CIO. The question is around, what's VMware's focus? You know, there's VMware Cloud on AWS, there's PKS, there's VIG. You guys came out with Openstack, VMware integrated Openstack 4.0, and then even VMware Cloud on AWS, the promised innovation three and a half months after the release. Iteration on that. That's much faster than what the CIO used to have. How are those conversations balanced between the CIO and the new business user here at AWS? >> Yeah, way to sugarcoat Keith. That's a good question. Look at CIOs today. There's very innovative CIOs. We had the NFL CIO up on stage in the morning Keynote, right? And I thought that was highly dynamic, really talking about how you have to transform business. What we're really focused on in terms of helping customers is making sure that that fabric that runs their business applications is just as fluid and dynamic as their businesses. The security has to be as fluid and dynamic or more dynamic than the threats that you face. So, these are areas that we're focused on, but your point is: how can VMware continue to deliver quick innovation? I think VMware integrated Openstack actually is an example of VMware integration or innovation, so I'm glad you brought it up. We don't talk about Openstack that much now, but VMware was the very first Openstack distro-vendor to make upgrades of Openstack versions they feature as software. Where our competitors in that space were making it a professional services engagement. You look at us, what we've done in terms of supporting containers natively on vSphere. We announced PKS and we were very quick to embrace Kubernetes. We announced Greengrass preview that we're bringing to market as well on vSphere. So, you're absolutely right to give us the feedback that in the past, you could say Vmware was a bit conservative of a company. We were slow and deliberate in some of our innovations. They were important and we were deliberate because we had a reputation to uphold for product quality. That's what our customers expect, but at the same time, it's very good feedback to say that we have to work quicker, and that's the model that we're in. I think that the AWS partnership for Vmware is one example of how we've had a couple of companies learning from each other in terms of AWS and interacting with the enterprise and VMware in terms of innovating a Cloud space, and you're staring to see the benefits and the fruits of that labor now. >> So, ironically I ran into the VMUG president, Ben Clayton doing a show floor. It's amazing to see the crossover between the VMware community and the AWS community. I think VMware Cloud on AWS has been a boom, a realizing that Cloud is coming into the enterprise in a great way. Let's talk about the community and the users. How do you help move that traditional community of, I think VMUG is 200,000 users. How do you help move that membership forward to this new speed of IT? >> It's a terrific question. There's definitely some challenges with getting folks. Part of it is IT folks, we're builders at heart. We love building everything. We love the pieces and parts. We can understand how they matter, but even if they matter like this much, it doesn't necessarily mean that I should build a snowflake for my business because some of the problems that VMware solves, you could say that every business in the world has to solve the same problems. So why focus on some of those smaller nuisances? What we've been really after is providing much more content into the VMUG communities around transformation, around how more modular IT architectures are important. Even beyond the VMUG community, if you think about some traditional VMware channel partners, where their core focus was on some very tightly integrated hardware-based solutions. Those partners, the more innovative ones, are now building hybrid applications across VMware and AWS components and modernizing enterprises that way. We're trying to encourage our VMUG community to do the same thing. I've had talks with VMUG events this year talking to them about Edge Compute and how VMware is investing there and what R&D looks like. Part of this is, I think all of us in IT, we have to have that point in time where we say "I have to let go, "I know the market's shifting, "I know I have to do something different." If I didn't let go in my past, I would still be known for being a Certified Novell Engineer, right? Times change and we have to change too, so it's really important to be prescriptive and give our community all the tools they need to evolve with us. >> Chris, you mention the Greengrass thing that you have in preview for a bit. I want you talk about that a little bit and when I heard Andy Jassy this morning, he talked about the continuum. Instances, which underneath, that's virtualization from VMware. There's containers and there's serverless. Andy says if he was to build IWBS today, he'd build it all serverless. We know it's not a zero sum game and nothing changes overnight, but virtualization is not decimated by containers overnight and containers doesn't go away now that serverless comes out. I want you to talk about the Greengrass and how that spectrum fits into the customers you're talked to in the VMware journey. >> I think it's really, really exciting and certainly I'm a huge proponent of serverless. My 14 year old son has an Echo Dot in his bedroom and he likes to program it to do really fun things. My favorite example is he had it talking about who the ugliest person in the world is and wanted Alexa to name his sister. There's a part of me that's like "No don't do that, son" but then the other part's like "I'm so proud of you." >> That's awesome. But if we step back, there's this huge press to start doing more in terms of getting the analytics and the intelligence to either where the data's being created or where the data's being consumed. We've had a lot of customers come to us jointly, saying "Look, I can't move the data to the Cloud "to do deep analytics or machine learning. "It defies the laws of physics "or the networking costs are just too much. "Or there's latency considerations. "I need a faster transaction execution time." We have a customer, a joint customer, where they're monitoring the heat of the brake pad on a train and they're trying to understand in real time, how that impacts the train's maintenance schedule and when they should take it out of service. They need to get the intelligence of the Cloud closer to where these things are occurring. Let's bring that all back to Greengrass on vSphere. You heard an announcement of machine learning on Greengrass today. To do machine learning, I need some considerable compute horsepower to really make it effective. Most of our customers already have a lot of that horsepower already out at the edge. One of our customers has six to 10 servers. This is very common of a lot of retail organizations, six to 10 servers per stores times 10,000 stores. They're trying to do more with IOT and more analytics. They want to leverage the investments that they already have an infrastructure. The other part that's strategically important to VMware is this: we want to have Cloud services be able to execute where the data's being created and that's a natural use case for virtualization. Then second, we want to have a platform that can allow the most popular opensource technologies to also run there to give customers all of that choice. So for us, it's all about promoting heterogeneity at the edge. We see those Cloud services as really that new generation of application platforms that customers, they don't want some artificial constraint of a Cloud data center to say "this is where it has to run." I want it to run wherever the business requirements say it needs to run and that's what's important and that's what we're doing with this announcement. >> Chris, we talk to a lot of CTOs, senior architects, CIOs and even looking at VMware, trust that part of it has been very stable in the environment for years, the product selection can be overwhelming. CIOs, CTOs need to focus their investment and their strategies in a certain area. Conversations, where are you telling CTOs, CIOs to focus their investment? >> It's a really good question. You definitely have to have a focus area and for us, it's about a platform for rapid agility and innovation. That's really key. We don't know what the future's gonna be. We can guess and you are both two very visionary guys and you have a general idea of what's gonna happen over the next 12, 18 months, but there's things that are just unexpected, especially in the business context. We can understand technology, but business dynamics change very quickly. Helping CTOs and CIOs understand how to build a fabric that can make them more agile and flexible is really key. That's one. So, greater automation, greater efficiencies, rapid innovation, but even more importantly for a lot that's really top of mind is security. Giving them a way to do rapid recovery, being able to start to segment some of their resources, being able to dynamically offer and adjust security and understand threats in real time and combat them in real time is key. The traditional model of security is: I have a dynamic threat so I'm gonna have increased layers of static security to combat it and I'll just add more layers. Doesn't work. We've had customers have massive outages that we've worked with because they've had ransomware attacks and things like that, so they want to be more agile and more dynamic. Their VMware environments, they've been able to get up very quickly, but these lessons are teaching organizations that they have to think differently. So really, that security and agility I see is really top of line for a lot of folks. >> Chris, I've seen lots of traffic at the VMware booth, talked to a lot of customers that are interested. The elephant in the room when I talk to all of them is cost. We've looked at Big Bear Metal, Amazon released that instance. That's a big hunking instance, a lot of memory, a lot of networking. I've talked to a couple customers that said, "I did the analysis on VMware over AWS "versus heck, just buying a rack "and stick it in my environment." You get a significant difference in there. One customer is like "Hey, it was 3x the cost "for me to just buy it and do it myself, "and I didn't feel I was gonna get any "operational efficiencies even doing it "'cause I know VMware and I know how to run it." What do you say to those customers? What are they missing? I'd love any misconceptions that you're hearing out there. >> I'll give ya an example. Let's use the cost analogy. My daughter wants a new radio for Christmas. I can go to Best Buy and buy a really nice stereo, but that's actually 3x the cost of me buying the circuit board kit, say on Amazon, and soldering in the components myself. When you think about that in a practical, real world example, we used to buy motherboards and build PCs and servers back in the day. We don't even think about doing it anymore and even if I could save 25 dollars doing it, I still wouldn't do it because there's more important things I can be doing with my time to differentiate my business. Look, we are-- >> I wanna poke at that. Because you're partners at Delium Sig and I buy one of the VX whatever family from their team. It's pretty easy to ploy, I do that. I understand how to do VMware. It's not gonna take me months to deploy. I know how to a VMware environment and it's that type of configuration. They're saying it's not building versus buying and I understand there's a spectrum there, but just the raw VMware and AWS. They said "I'm gonna get two bills. "I'm gonna get one from VMware and one from Amazon" and the price of it does seem pretty massive compared to what they were doing. So, are they wrong about that? >> I'm really surprised at that. We're not hearing that from our customers We're seeing them have very solid in terms of cost saving, in terms of running on AWS because unlike a traditional Cloud environment, I can oversubscribe physical hosts, I can run more workloads because it is native VMware. You're also getting additional benefits. I'm getting V-SAN storage, I'm getting NSX for networking and security. To say I'm just gonna take vSphere and compare, I would say that that's probably not the closest comparison. There's other aspects that we're providing that operate in a Cloud environment. And, listen, we had this before. Five years ago, people were saying, "Well, Cloud's too expensive so I'm gonna stay on premises." We don't even think that way anymore. There's other benefits that you're getting in the Cloud model that you have to weigh into consideration and we've seen VMware Cloud on AWS is as price competitive as a lot of the native public Cloud services are without all the added benefits of networking and security and management and other things that we throw in. >> Chris, wanna give you the final word. What's exciting you these days? You used to sit on kind of this side of the table, look at the environment. You're deep in some of the emerging pieces. What's getting you excited? I'd love to hear any final insights on partnering between VMware and Amazon, which a lot of us on the outside are like cats and dogs living together. >> Okay, let's hit a couple of them. First, certainly for me, the innovation that's occurring at the edge, I think is extremely exciting. Driving new use cases around augmented reality, more machine learning. How we're looking in terms of moving services to where data's being generated instead of moving the data, which is always problematic. That's a new wave of innovation that I think is really exciting. So that's the certainly the area I'd say that's most exciting for me, is how we can innovate there. It's also around hybrid applications. It's the integration of things like Lambda functions in a traditional file system. I was with a major global financial services organization yesterday and we were not talking about traditional Lambda function use cases. We were talking about integrating Lambda with database and file system events and VM's running on vSphere. So, there's this whole new way to modernize applications that we're just at the cusp of. That pace of innovation's happening faster and faster. I'll say this about Amazon: we are really committed to working together and I think what you're seeing in the industry in general, it's not just VMware with AWS, but it's with our partners in the container spaces. An example is containers as a service and platform as a service, is we're being very pragmatic about focusing on what we're really, really good at. And there's areas where VMware is fantastic at it, in terms of reliability and heterogeneity at the edge and there's natural synergies where we can work together with Amazon web services. In my opinion, they've been a fantastic partner. All of the work that we've done with the Greengrass team and the IOT team, in terms of bringing Greengrass to market on vSphere, has been an enormously positive experience. We share lessons learned, we share engineering, work together. It's extremely collaborative because just like all of our technology partners, there's always areas where we're going to compete a little bit and there can be some overlap, but there's a lot more areas where we get to work together and that's what we're really focused on with VMware and AWS. >> Well, Chris, I know Keith and I always appreciate your perspectives, the VMware community engagement, know you're always open to having some good, real discussions here, so really appreciate you coming sharing all our viewpoints. Congratulations on all the progress here. We're certainly excited to see where it goes. >> I appreciate the opportunity. >> Alright, for Keith Townsend, I'm Stu Miniman. We'll be back with lots more coverage here. You're watching theCUBE. (upbeat music)

>> Narrator: Live from Las Vegas, it's The Cube, covering AWS re:Invent 2017. Presented by AWS, Intel, and our ecosystem of partners. >> Bob: It's actually a little quieter here. >> Hey, welcome back to AWS re:Invent 2017. I am Lisa Martin. We're all very chatty. You can hear a lot of chatty folks behind us. This is day two of our continuing coverage. 42,000 people here, amazing. I'm Lisa Martin with my co-host Keith Townsend, and we're very excited to be joined by a Cube alumni Bob Muglia, CEO and President of Snowflake. >> Thank you. >> Lisa: Welcome back. >> Thank you, good to be back. >> And Kelly Mungary, the Director of Enterprise Data and Analytics from Lionsgate. A great use case from Snowflake. Thanks so much guys for joining us. So one of the hot things going on today at the event is your announcement Bob with AWS and Snowpipe. What is Snowpipe? How do customers get started with it? >> Great, well thanks. We're excited about Snowpipe. Snowpipe is a way of ingesting data into Snowflake in a streaming, continuous way. You simply can drop new data that's coming in into S3 and we'll ingest it for you automatically. Makes that super, super simple. Brings the data in continuously into your data warehouse, ensuring that you're always up to date and your analysts are getting the latest insights and the latest data. >> So, when you guys were founded, about five years ago, as the marketing says on your website, a complete data warehouse built for the Cloud. What was the opportunity back then? What did you see that was missing, and how has Snowflake evolved to really be a leader in this space? >> So you know, if you go back five years this was a time frame where no SQL was the big rage, and everybody was talking about how SQL was passe and it's something that you're not see in the future. Our founders had a different view, they had been working on true relational databases for almost 20 years, and they recognized the power of SQL and relational technology but they also saw that customers were experiencing significant limits with existing technology, and those limits really restricted what people could do. They saw in the Cloud and what Amazon had done the ability to build a all new database that takes advantage of the full elasticity and power of the Cloud to deliver whatever set of analytics capabilities that the business requires. However much data you want, however many queries simultaneously. Snowflake takes what you love about a relational database and removes all the limits, and allows you to operate in a very different way. And our founders had that vision five years ago, and really successfully executed on it. The product has worked beyond our dreams, and our customers, our response from our customers is what we get so excited about. >> So, the saying is "Data is the new oil". However, just as oil is really hard to drill for and find, finding the data to service up, to even put in a data lake to analyze has been a challenge. How did you guys go about identifying what data should even be streamed to Snowpipe? >> Well, yeah, that's a great question. I mean, in entertainment today, we're experiencing probably like in pretty much every type of business. A data explosion. We have, you know, streaming is big now. We have subscription data coming in, billing data, social media data, and on and on. And the thing is, it's not coming in a normal, regular format. It's coming in what we call a semi-structured, structured, json, xml. So, up until Snowflake came onto the scene with a truly Cloud based SAAS solution for data warehousing pretty much everyone was struggling to wrangle in all these data sets. Snowpipe is a great example of one of the avenues of bringing in these multiple data sets, merging them real time, and getting the analytics out to your business in an agile way that has never been seen before. >> So, can you talk a little bit about that experience? Kinda that day one up, you were taking these separate data sources, whether it's ERP solution, data from original content, merging that together and then being able to analyze that. What was that day one experience like? >> Well, you know, I gotta tell you, it evolves around a word, that word is "Yes", okay? And data architects and executives and leaders within pretty much every company are used to saying, "We'll get to that" and "We'll put it on the road map", "We could do that six months out", "Three months out". So what happened when I implemented Snowflake was I was just walking into meetings and going, "Yes". "You got it". "No worries, let's do it". >> Lisa: It liberated. >> Well, it's changes, it's not only liberating, it changes the individual's opportunities, the team's opportunities, the company's opportunities, and ultimately, revenue. So, I think it's just an amazing new way of approaching data warehousing. >> So Bob, can you talk a little bit about the partnership with AWS, and the power to bring that type of capability to customers? Data lakes are really hard to do that type of thing run a query against to get instant answers. Talk about the partnership with AWS to bring that type of capability. >> Well Amazon's been a fantastic partner of ours, and we really enjoy working with Amazon. We wind up working together with them to solve customer problems. Which is what I think is so fantastic. And with Snowflake, on top of Amazon, you can do what Kelly's saying. You can say yes, because all of a sudden you can now bring all of your data together in one place. Technology has limited, it's technology that has caused data to be in disparate silos. People don't want their data all scattered all over the place. It's all in these different places because limits to technology force people to do that. With the Cloud, and with what Amazon has done and with a product like Snowflake, you can bring all of that data together, and the thing that's interesting, where Kelly is going, is it can change the culture of a company, and the way people work. All of a sudden, data is not power. Data is available to everyone, and it's democratizing. Every person can work with data and help to bring the business forward. And it can really change the dynamics about the way people work. >> And Kelly, you just spoke at the multi-city Cloud Analytics Tour that Snowflake just did. You spoke in Santa Monica, one of my favorite places. You talked about a data driven culture. And we hear data driven in so many different conversations, but how did you actually go about facilitating a data driven culture. Who are some of the early adopters, and what business problems have you been able to solve by saying yes? >> Well, I can speak entertainment in general. I think that it's all about technology it's about talent, and it's about teaching. And with technology being the core of that. If we go back five years, six years, seven years, it was really hard to walk into a room, have an idea, a concept, around social media, around streaming data, around billing, around accounting. And to have an agile approach that you could bring together within a week or so forth. So what's happening is, now that we've implemented Snowflake on AWS and some of the other what I call dream tools on top of that. The dream stack, which includes Snowflake. It's more about integrating with the business. Now we can speak the same language with them. Now we can walk into a room and they're glad to see me now. And at the end of the day, it's new, it's all new. So, this is something that I say sometimes, in kidding, but it's actually true. It's as if Snowflake had a time traveler on staff that went forward in the future ten years to determine how things should be done in the big data space, and then came back and developed it. And that's how futuristic they are, but proven at the same time. And that allows us to cultivate that data driven culture within entertainment, because we have tools and we have the agile approach that the business is looking for. >> So, Kelly, I'm really interested, and I love the concept of making data available to everyone. That's been a theme of this conference from the keynote this morning, which is putting tools in builder's hands, and allowing builders to do what they do. >> Kelly: That's right. >> And we're always surprised at what users come back with. What's one of the biggest surprises from the use cases, now that you've enabled your users. >> Well, I'm gonna give you one that's based on AWS and Snowflake. A catch phrase you hear a lot of is "Data center of excellence", and a lot of us are trying to build out these data centers of excellence, but it's a little bit of an oxymoron to the fact that a data center of excellence is really about enabling your business and finding champions within marketing, within sales, within accounting, and giving them the ability to have self-service business intelligence, self-service data warehousing. The kinds of things that, again, we go back five, six years ago, you couldn't even have that conversation. I'll tell you today, I can walk into a room, and say, "Okay, who here is interested in learning "about data warehousing?". And there'll be somebody, "Okay, great". Within an hour, I'll have you being dangerous in terms of setting up, standing up, configuring and loading a data warehouse. That's unheard of, and it's all due to Snowflake and their new technology. >> I'd love to understand Bob, from your perspective. First of all, it sounds like you have a crystal ball according to Kelly, which is awesome. But second of all, collaboration, we talked about that earlier. Andy Jassy is very well known and very vocal about visiting customers every week. And I love their bottom, their backwards approach to, before building a product, to try to say, "What problem can we solve?". They're actually working with customers first. What are their requirements? Tell me a little bit Bob about the collaboration that Snowflake has with Lionsgate, or other customers. How are they helping to influence your crystal ball? >> You know what, this is where I think what Amazon has done, and Andy has done a fantastic job. There's so much to learn from them, and the customer centricity that Amazon has always had is something that we have really focused to bring into Snowflake, and really build deeply into our culture. I've sort of said many, many times, Snowflake is a value space company. Our values are important to us, they're prominent in our website. Our first value is we put our customer's first. What I'm most proud of is, every customer who has focused on deploying Snowflake, has successfully deployed Snowflake, and we learn from them. We engage with them. We partner with them. All of our customers are our partners. Kelly and Lionsgate are examples of customers that we learn from every day, and it's such a rewarding thing to hear what they want to do. You look at Snowpipe and what Snowpipe is, that came from customers, we learned that from customers. You look at so many features, so many details. It's iterative learning with customers. And what's interesting about that, it's listening to customers, but it's also understanding what they do. One of the things that's interesting about Snowflake is is that as a company we run Snowflake on Snowflake. All of our data is in Snowflake. All of our sales data, our financial data, our marketing data, our product support data, our engineering data. Every time a user runs a query, that query is logged in Snowflake and intrinsics about it are logged. So what's interesting is because it's all in one place, and it's all accessible, we can answer essentially any question, about what's been done. And then, driving the culture to do that is an important thing. One of the things I do find interesting is, even at Snowflake, even at this data centered company, even where everything is all centralized, I still find sometimes people don't reference it. And I'm constantly reinforcing that your intuition, you know, you're really smart, you're really intuitive, but you could be wrong. And if you can answer the question based on what's happened, what your customers are doing, because it's in the data, and you can get that answer quickly, it's a totally different world. And that's what you can do when you have a tool with the power of what Snowflake can deliver, is you could answer effectively any business question in just a matter of minutes, and that's transformative, it's transformative to the way people work, and that, to me, that's about what it means to build a data driven culture. Is to reinforce that the answer is inside what customers are doing. And so often, that is encapsulated in the data. >> Wow, your energy is incredible. We thank you so much Bob and Kelly for coming on and sharing your story. And I think a lot of our viewers are gonna learn some great lessons from both of you on collaboration on transformations. So thanks so much for stopping by. >> Yeah. >> Thank you so much, we really enjoyed it. Thanks a lot. >> Likewise, great to meet you. >> Thanks Kelly. >> Thank you. >> For my co-host Keith Townsend, and for Kelly and Bob, I am Lisa Martin. You've been watching The Cube, live on day two, continuing coverage at AWS re:Invent 2017. Stick around, we have great more guests coming up. (upbeat music)

>> Narrator: Live, from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE, covering AWS re:Invent 2017, presented by AWS, intel, and our ecosystem of partners. Hello, everyone, welcome back to theCUBE. This is Silicon Angle's exclusive coverage with theCUBE, here at Amazon, re:Invent 2017. It's our 5th year covering Amazon's explosive growth. I'm John Furrier, the founder of Silicon Angle media. I'm here with Justin Warren, my cohost here, our next guest on set one is Tom Siebel, who is the founder and CEO of C3 IOT, industry legend, knows the software business, been around the block a few times, and now part of the new wave of innovation. Welcome to theCUBE. >> Thank you. >> I hear you just got in from San Francisco. What a world we're living in. You're at the front-end of your company that you founded and are running, an IOT big data play, doing extremely well. Even last year, the whisper in the hallway was C3 IOT is absolutely doing great, in the industrial side, certainly in the federal government side, and on commercial, congratulations! >> Thank you. >> What's the update, what's the secret formula? >> Well, we live at the convergence of elastic cloud computing, big data, AI, and IOT, and at the point where those converge, I think, is something called digital transformation, where you have these CEOs that, candidly, I think, they're concerned that companies are going through a mass-extinction event. I mean, companies are being, 52% of the Fortune 500 companies, as of 2000 are gone, right, they've disappeared and it's estimated as many 70% might disappear in the next 10 years, and we have this new species of companies with new DNA that look like Tesla and Uber, and Amazon, and, they have no drivers, no cars, and yet they own transportation, and I think that these CEOs are convinced that, unless they take advantage of this new class of technologies that they might be extinct. >> And it's certainly, we're seeing it, too, in a lot of the old guard, as Andy Jassy calls it, really talking about Oracle, IBM, and some of the other folks that are trying to do cloud, but they're winning. I gotta ask you, what's the main difference, from your perspective, that's different now that the culture of a company that's trying to transform, what's the big difference between the old way and new way now, that has to be implemented quickly, or extinction is a possibility? I mean, it's not just suppliers, it's the customers themselves. >> The customers have changed. >> What's the difference? >> So, this is my 4th decade in the information technology business and I've seen the business grow from a couple hundred billion to, say, two trillion worldwide, and I've seen it go from mainframe to mini-computers, to personal computers to the internet, all of that, and I was there when, in all of those generations of technology, when we brought those products to market, would come up in the organization, through the IT organization, to the CIO, and the CIO would say, "well, we're never gonna use a mini computer." or, "we're never gonna use relations database technology." or, "we're never gonna use a PC." And so, you'd wait for that CIO to be fired, then he'd come back two years later, right? Now, so meanwhile we build a two trillion dollar information technology business, globally. Now, what's happening in this space of big data, predictive analytics, IOT, is all of a sudden, it's the CEO at the table. CEO was never there before, and the CEO is mandating this thing called digital transformation, and he or she is appointing somebody in the person of a Chief Digital Officer, who has a mandate and basically a blank check to transform this company and get it done, and whereas it used to be the CIO would report to the CEO once a quarter at the quarterly off-site, the Chief Digital Officer reports to the CEO every week, so, and virtually everyone of our customers, CAT, John Deere, United Healthcare, you name, ENGIE, Enel, it's a CEO-driven initiative. >> You bring up a good point I wanna get your thoughts on, because the old way, and you mentioned, was IT reporting to the CIO. They ran things, they ran the business, they ran the plumbing, software was part of that, now software is the business. No one goes to the teller. The bank relationship's the software, or whatever vertical you're in there's now software, whether it's at the edge, whether it's data analytics, is the product to the consumer. So, the developer renaissance, we see software now changing, where the developer's now an influencer in this transformation. >> True. >> Not just, hey, go do it, and here's some tools, they're in part of that. Can you share your perspective on this because, if we're in a software renaissance, that means a whole new creativity's gonna unleash with software. With that role of the CDO, with the blank check, there's no dogma anymore. It's results. So, what's your perspective on this? >> Well, I think that there's enabling technologies that include the elastic cloud that include, computation and storage is basically free, right? Everything is a computer, so IOT, I used to think about IOT being devices, it's that IOT is a change in the form-factor of computers. In the future, everything's a computer, your eyeglasses, your watch, your heart monitor, your refrigerator, your pool pump, they're all computers, right, and then we have the network effect of Metcalfe's law, say we have 50 billion of theses devices fully connected and well, that's a pretty powerful network. Now, these technologies, in turn, enable AI, they enable machine learning and deep learning. Hey, that's a whole new ball game. Okay, we're able to solve classes of problems with predictive analytics and prescriptive analytics that were simply unsolvable before in history and this changes everything about the way we design products, the way we service customers, the way we manage companies. So, I think this AI thing is not to be underestimated. I think the cloud, IOT, big data, devices, those are just enablers, and I think AI is-- >> So, software and data's key, right? Data trains the AI, data is the fundamental new lifeblood. >> Big data, because now we're doing, what big data is about, people think that big data is the fact that an exabyte is more than a gigabyte, that's not it. Big data is about the fact that there is no sampling error. We have all the data. So, we used to, due to limitations to storage and processing we used to, you know, basically, take samples and infer results from those samples, and deal with it on the level of confidence error that was there. With big data, there's no sampling error. >> It's all there. >> It is a whole different game. >> We were talking before, and John, you mentioned before about the results that you need to show. Now, I know that you picked up a big new customer that I hope you can talk about publicly, which is a public-sector company, but that sounds like something where you're doing predictive maintenance for the Air Force, for the U.S. Air Force, so that's a big customer, good win there, but what is the result that they're actually getting from the use of big data and this machine learning analytics that you're doing? >> By aggregating all the telemetry and aggregating all their maintenance records, and aggregating all their pilot records, and then building machine learning class of ours, we can look at all the signals, and we can predict device failure or systems failure well in advance of failure, so the advantage is some pretty substantial percentages, say of F16s, will not deploy, of F18s will not deploy because, you know, they go to push the button and there's a system failure. Well, if we can predict system failure, I mean, the cost of maintenance goes down dramatically and, basically, it doubles the size of your fleet and, so the economic benefit is staggering. >> Tom, I gotta ask you a personal question. I mean, you've been through four decades, you're a legend in the industry, what was the itch that got you back with this company. Why did you found and run C3 IOT? What was the reason? Was it an itch you were scratching, like, damn, I want the action? I mean, what was the reason why you started the company? >> Well, I'm a computer scientist and out of graduate school, I went to work with a young entrepreneur by the name of Larry Ellison, turned out to be a pretty good idea, and then a decade later, we started Siebel Sytems, and I think, well, we did invent the CRM market and then it turned out to be a pretty good idea and I just see, at this intersection of these vectors we talked about, everything changes about computing. This has been a complete replacement market and I though, you know, there's opportunity to play a significant role in the game, and this what I do, you know. I collect talented people and try to build great companies and make customers satisfied. This is my idea of a good time. You're on the beach, you're on your board hangin' 10 on the big waves. What are the waves? We're seeing this inflection point, a lotta things comin' together, what are the waves that you're ridin' on right now? Obviously, the ones you mentioned, what's the set look like, if I can use a surfing analogy. What's coming in, what are the big waves? The two biggest ones are IOT and AI. I mean, since 2000 we've deployed 19 billion IOT sensors around the world. The next five years, we'll deploy 50 billion more. Everything will be a computer, and you connect all these things that they're all computing and apply AI, I mean we're gonna do things that were, you know, unthinkable, in terms of serving customers, building products, cost efficiencies, we're gonna revolutionize healthcare with precision health. Processes like energy extraction and power delivery will be much safer, much more reliable, much more environmentally-friendly, this is good stuff. So, what's your take on the security aspect of putting a computer in everything, because, I mean, the IT industry hasn't had a great track record of security, and now we're putting computers everywhere. As you say, they're gonna be in watches, they're gonna be in eyeglasses, what do you see as the trend in the way that security is gonna be addressed for this, computers everywhere? Well, I think that it is clearly not yet solved, okay, and it is a solvable problem. I believe that it's easier to secure data in cyber space than it is in your own data room. Maybe you could secure data in your data room when it took a forklift to move a storage device. It doesn't take a forklift anymore, right? It takes one of these little flash drives, you know, to move, to take all the data. So, I think the easiest place we can secure it is gonna be in cyber space. I think we'll use encryption, I think we'll be computing on encrypted data, and we haven't figured out algorithms to do that yet. I think blockchain will play an important role, but there's some invention that needs to happen and this is what we do. >> So, you like blockchain? >> I think blockchain plays a role in security. >> It does. So, I gotta ask you about the way, you're sinking your teeth into a new venture, exciting, it's on the cutting-edge, on the front lines of the innovation. There are a lotta other companies that are trying to retool. IBM, Microsoft, Oracle, if you were back them, probably not as exciting as what you're doing because you've got a new clean sheet of paper, but if you're Oracle, if you're Larry, and he went to be CTO, he's trying to transform, he's getting into the action, they got a lot to do there, IBM same thing, same with Microsoft, what's their strategy in your mind? If you were there, at the helm of those companies, what would you do? >> Well, number one, I would not bet against Larry. I know Larry pretty well and Larry is a formidable player in the information technology industry, and if you have to identify one of four companies that's surviving the long-run, it'll be Oracle that's in that consideration, in that set, so I think betting against Larry is a bad idea. >> He'll go to the mat big time, won't he? I mean, Jassy, there's barbs going back and forth, you gotta be careful there. >> Well, I mean, Andy Jassy is extraordinarily competent, I think, as it relates to this elastic cloud I think he's kinda got a lock on that, but, you know, IBM is hard to explain. I mean, IBM is a sad story. I think IBM is, there's some risk that IBM is the next Hewlett-Packard. I mean, they might be selling this thing off for piece parts this, you mean, if we look at the last 23 quarters, I mean, it's not good. >> And Microsoft's done a great job recently with Satya Nadella, and they're retooling fast. You can see them beavering away. >> But IBM, I mean, how do you bet against the cloud. I mean, are you kidding me? I mean, hello! IBM's a sad story. It's one of the world's great companies, it's an icon. If it fails, and companies like IBM's size do fail, I mean let's look at GE, that would be a sad state for America. >> Okay, on a more positive upbeat, what's next for you? Obviously, you're doing great, the numbers are good. Again, the rumors in the hallways we're hearing that you guys are doing great financially. Not sure if you can share any color on that, big wins, obviously, these are not little deals you're on, but what's next? What's the big innovation that you got comin' around the corner for C3 IOT. Well, so our business grew last year about 600%, this year it'll grow about 300%. We're a profitable, cash-positive business. Our average customer is, say, 20 to $200 billion business. We're engaged in very, very large transactions. In the last 18 months, we've done a lotta work in deep learning, okay. In the next 18 months, we'll do a lotta work in NLP. I think those technologies are hugely important. Technologically, this is where we'll be going. I think machine learning, traditional ML, we have that nailed, now we're exploiting deep learning in a big way using GPUs, and a lotta the work that Jensen Wang's doing at Nvidia, and now NLP, I think, is the next frontier for us. >> Final question for you, advice to other entrepreneurs. You're a serial entrepreneur. you've been very successful, inventive categories. You're looking at Amazon, how do you work with the Amazons of the world. What should entrepreneurs be thinking about in terms of how to enter the market, funding, just strategy in general. The rules have changed a little bit. What advice would you give the young entrepreneurs out there? >> Okay, become a domain expert at whatever domain you're proposing and whatever field you're gonna enter, and then surround yourself with people, whatever job they're doing, engineering, marketing, sales, F&A, who are better than you at what they do and, to the extent that I have succeeded, this is why I've succeeded. Now this might be easier for me than for others, but I try to surround myself with people who are better than me and, to the extent that I've been successful, that's why. >> We really appreciate you taking the time coming on. You're an inspiration, a serial entrepreneur, founder and CEO Tom Siebel of C3 IOT, hot company, big part of the Amazon Web Services ecosystem. Doing great stuff, again, serial entrepreneur. Great four-decade career. Thanks for coming on theCUBE, Tom Siebel. Here inside theCUBE, I'm John Furrier and Justin Warren, here in Las Vegas for AWS re:Invent. We'll be back with more live coverage after this short break. >> Thanks guys, good job.

>> Announcer: Live from Las Vegas It's theCube covering AWS re:Invent 2017 presented by AWS, Intel, and our ecosystem of partners. >> Welcome back to our live coverage. theCube here at AWS re:Invent 2017 Our fifth year covering Amazon Web Services and their massive growth. I'm John Furrier, my co-host Lisa Martin. Here our next guest is CTO of WANdisco, Jugane Sundar. Welcome back to theCube. >> Thank you John. >> You guys are everywhere. WANdisco around the table and all these deals so you guys have been doing extremely well with (indistinct talking) property. What's new? You got some news? >> Yes we do, we recently announced integration with Amazon's AWS Snowball device which gives you the ability to do migration of on-premises workload into the Cloud without down time, and then the end result is a hybrid cloud environment that you can have an active for right environment on both sides. That's a unique capability, nobody else can do that today. >> What does it mean for AWS and their customers 'cause they're very customer focused. What are you guys bringing to the table? >> We bring a whole lot of big data workloads, analytics workloads, IoT workloads into their Cloud. And the beauty of the cloud is that you may have a 20 node cluster on-premises but you can run analytics with a 1000 nodes up in the Cloud on demand and pay just for that use. We think it's a very powerful value proposition. >> Where are you seeing the most traction? We've talking about the massive growth at 18 billion dollar annual runway that fit AWS and Andy's conversation with you John the other day said we haven't gotten that big on startups alone. So even some of the things like the advertising that AWS is now starting to do suggests they're going up the stack to the Enterprise and to the Sea Suites. Where are you guys seeing the most traction with AWS? Is it in the Enterprise space, is it in the start up space, both? >> So somewhat because of our route, what we're finding is that the large majority of Big Data customers and analytics customers from the last two, three years are all considering some form of addition of a cloud to their environment. If it's not a wholesale migration, it's a hybrid environment. It's bursting out into the cloud type of use case and what you're finding is that growth of on-premise Big Data and analytics systems is slowing down because once you get to the Cloud, the plethora of tools you have, the facilities that the scale brings to you is just unmatched. That's the trend we really see in the market. >> We've seen a lot of people go and use it in the marketplace. Juniper Networks for instance, are seeing some activity at the network. Who would have thought a network player is gonna to pick it in the Cloud, but this is what industrial-strength cloud looks like. You guys have the active active. Where does that fit in for the customers who wanna leverage the apps, and don't wanna worry about the networks? >> Exactly, the traditional model of thinking was use the Cloud for back up. You have your on-premise stuff. The cheapest way to back it up is into the Cloud. But that's really just scratching the tip of the iceberg. Once you put your data up in the Cloud, you have the ability to have it strongly consistently replicated then you can do amazing things from the Cloud. You can do a whole new analytics system. Perhaps you want to experiment with Spark in the Cloud and have it on on high on-premise that works very well. Now that both sides are actively writeable, you can create partitions of your data that are dynamically generated written to both sides. These are things that people did not consider. Once they stumble upon it, it just opens their mind to a whole new way of operating. >> Business Park, I've heard some rumors and rumblings in the developer community here that they're running Spark on Lando. People always hacking with new stuff. So Lando server list I think is coming down. How does that relate to some of things that are driving WANdisco's, how do you relate to that? Does that help you? Does that hurt you guys? >> It helps us, the way we look at it. We're all about strong replication of storage. Lando is no storage, you talk to the underlying storage of some kind. It's S3, it's EBS volumes whatever. So long as the storage comes through our system. Any growth, any simple easy way for applications to be written is hugely positive for us. >> What are the start ups out there? We've seen a lot of start ups really missed the mark. They misfired on the Cloud and you seen some stars that have played it well. They've got in the tornadoes as we say. In fact, Geoffrey Moore, I think is rewriting his book Inside the Tornado, which is a management paradigm. But there really seems to be a new business model. You guys are like ever green at WANdisco because you're unique (indistinct talking) property. How are you guys working with that business model and what are some of the things you're seeing with start ups and companies who are trying to play the cloud but are misfiring? >> Right so WANdisco as you know stands for Wide Area Network Distributed Computing, and the Cloud is like a huge bonus to it. It's all about the Wide Area Network. We are now consolidating a bunch of work in the cloud, but guess what? It's gonna go back to going to go into the edge in some way 'cause the edges are getting smarter. You need replication between those. We see a lot of that coming up in the next two, three, five years. IoT workloads and use cases all involve somewhat of edge smart computing. We replicate between those really well. >> Lisa, we always talk about the trend is your friend. In your case, Cloud is your friend. >> Indeed, it is. The Cloud is all about wide area network computing and we are the ones who can really replicate-- >> How does a customer know what to do when it comes down to getting involved with WANdisco? It's not obvious. Spell it out, why do they need you guys? When do you get involved? What specific things should be red flags to a potential customer or a customer who says I'm gonna go in on the Cloud. Unpack that. >> Let me give you a simple example. We look at Amazon S3, it's a Cloud service storage. But do you know that it's actually on a per region basis. When you create a bucket to put objects into the bucket, it's located in one region. If you want it replicated elsewhere, they have cross-region replication which is an eventually consistent replication system that doesn't give you the consistent results that you want. If you have such a situation employing our technology immediately gives you consistent replication. Be it Cloud regions, Cloud to Cloud or on-premise to Cloud. The end result is the minute you step into replication across the land, every solution out there doesn't do it consistently and that's our core-- >> And that's your unique IP. >> Indeed, it is. >> Okay so I'm seeing Amazon racing their roll out regions. They got one coming in China, one in the Middle East. That's a big part of the strategy. Does that help you or what does that do? >> Absolutely it helps us a great deal, partly because customers now do not look at their applications as a single region applications. That doesn't fly anymore. The the notion that my banking app cannot work because a data center went down is just not acceptable in the modern world anymore. The fact that we depend so much on the services means they need to be up all the time. More regions, more data replication. That's why we step in. >> So that sounds like a lot of symbiosis here. You talk about S3 and replication challenges. So tell us how WANdisco is actually helping AWS. That's one example but help you us understand the symbiosis with your relationship with AWS. >> The best example I can give you is a large travel service company in the internet. They had to Adobe infrastructure that was growing out of control. They wanted to manage costs by moving some workloads to Amazon but didn't really know where to start, because you can't do such a thing as take a copy of the data, ship it off on a Snowball into the Cloud and tell the users of that data, stop writing to it now. It's gonna be available in the Cloud, a week, 10 days from now. Then you can start writing again. That's just not acceptable. This is live data problem. The problem here is that you need to be able to ship out your data on Snowballs, continue to write the on-premise storage. When it shows up in the Cloud, start writing that. Both are consistently replicated, you have a proper hybrid Cloud environment. So this was a great bonus to them. As for AWS, they watched this and they look at it as a easy way to move vast majority of data from on-premise big Data analytics systems. >> Have they been a fuel to your fire, in a sense that they've been on this incredible acceleration of their innovation and as Andy Joci said many times to you John. It's speed and customer focus. So how has their accelerated pace of innovation helped fuel WANdisco's so that like you were saying the unique value. How have they really ignited that? >> So they started off with just plain Snowball two years ago. Last year they announced Snowball Edge which is a pretty improved device. Now they have in the works, capability to do some compute on those boxes. That's very interesting to us. Now our services can decide on the Snowball, It arrives at a customer site. He plugs it in, turns it on instant replication capabilities Those are fueled both by Amazon's drive and extreme speed and our own capabilities. So Amazon is a wonderful partner for us partly because their charge to us innovation is quite amazing. >> Snowball, snow mobile, it's gonna be a white Christmas for you guys. Business is good. >> Business is great. >> Okay, final question. What's the conversations you're having here this year, share with us some of the quick conversations you're having in the hallways, meetings, Amazon got execs, partners. >> So most of the conversation are about moving workloads from on-premise into the Cloud. I personally am very interested in IoT use cases because I see the volume of data and the ability for us to do some interesting replications at being critical. That's where our focus is right now. >> Jugane Sundar, CTO of WANdisco. Big announcement, partnership with Amazon Web Services and Snowball replication active active. Great solution for replication. You got regions across regions. Check out WANdisco. Thanks for coming by, great to see you again. Congratulations on all your success. This is theCube, live coverage day one. It's coming down to an end. The halls open, we got two more days of packed two Cubes. Stay tuned for more, we got some great guest coming up, stay with us. (uptempo techno music)

Live from Las Vegas. It's the Cube covering AWS Reinvent 2017 presented by AWS, Intel, and our ecosystem of partners. >> Hello, welcome back. This is live coverage of the Cube's AWS re:Invent 2017. Two sets, a lot of action, day one of three days of wall to wall coverage. I'm John Furrier with my co-host Keith Townsend. Our next guest cube alumni is Yaron Haviv who's the founder and CTO of Iguazio, a hot new start up. And big news coming next. We got a big announcement. In following their work, Yaron, good to see you again. Thanks for coming back on. >> Hi, thanks! >> Hey you got a new shirt. Share that logo there. >> That's nuclio. That's our new serverless brainwork which is open source. Really kicks ass, it's about 100 times faster than Amazon. >> Word says it's 200 times faster. >> Yeah we don't want to shame. >> You set the bar. >> We doing 400,000 events per second on a single process. They do about 2000. Most of the open source project around the same ball park. >> Yaron, I got to get this off the bat. And then we can have a nice discussion afterwards. A pleasant discussion. Serverless. Let's first define what that means. Because there's a bunch of- I can take nuclio, install it in my data center, run it, am I serverless? >> You know so I mean I'm in the serverless working group. >> For CNCF >> for CNCF. And a we had a hot debate between the open source start ups. Doing what is called functional service and Amazon and others trying to push the notion of serverless. Which is serverless stands for server less. Meaning you don't manage server. And the way we position nucleo, it's actually both. Because on one end you can consume it as an open source project. Very easy to download. Single docker instruction and it's up and running unlike some other solutions. And on the other hand you can consume it as something within the Iguazio data platform. There is a slide from Amazon which I really like. Which is about serverless. They show serverless is attached to kinesis, DynaomoDB, S3 and Athena. Four services of data that attach to Lamda. Iguazio has API compatibility with kineses, DynamoDB with S3 and Presto, which is Athena as well. So exactly the same four data services that they position as far as the service ecosystem are supported on our platform. So we provide one platform, all the data services at Amazon has or at least interesting ones, serverless functions which are a hundred times faster, a few more tricks that they don't have-- >> So what is the definition then. In a pithy way, for someone out there who's learning about serverless. What is it? What's the definition? >> So the notion as a developer, you're sort of avoiding IT. You go, open a nice portal, you write the function, or you write your function in a get up repository somewhere. You click on a button and it gets deployed somewhere. Right now you know where it's going to get deployed. In the future, you may not know. >> Instead of an EC2 instance, get that prepared >> It's not really an EC2. >> The old way. The old way was. Right? >> The old way there were infrastructure guys building your EC2 instance, security layers, milware, etc. You go develop on your laptop and then you need to go and conform and all the continuous integration play was very complicated. Serverless comes inherently with scale out without the scale in, with continuous integration. You have versioning for the code. You can downgrade the version, you can upgrade the version. So essentially its a package version of a cloud native solution. That's the general idea. >> So I can do that if I'm doing it and managing it myself. It functions as a server. And if I'm doing it and it's a provided it as a cloud provider as a server, as a service, it's serverless. None of my operations team is dealing with servers. It's just writing code and just go. >> Yeah, you're writing a function. Push commit. You should play with nucleo, not just other things. But you'll see you're writing a function. Even see it has a built in editor. You write, you push deploy and it's already deployed somewhere. >> So give us some perspective before you move on. On the game what the impact is to a developer. Apples to oranges. Our old way you described it, new ways, it sounds easier! What's the impact? Is it time? Money? Can you quantify? >> The biggest challenge for businesses is to transform. I saw an interesting sentence. It's not about digital transformation, it's about businesses that need to work in a digital world. Okay? Because again, most of the communication of customers to businesses is becoming digital. Okay? Whether it's today from mobile apps tomorrow through Alexa. >> As Luke Cerney says, it's all software. Your business is the software. >> It's all about interactive really. Okay. As a business I always position there are two things you need to take care of as a business. One is increasing the revenue. And that's by engaging more customers. And increasing the revenue per customer. How do you engage more customer? Through digital services. Whether it's Twitters or proving a new service through your web portal. And the next thing is how do you generate more revenue from a customer is by showing recommendations. >> Finding more value. >> And the other aspect is operational efficiency. How do you automate your reparations to reduce the cost. You know Amazon uses robots to do the shipping and packing. So their margins can now be lower. So the generator is both those things. Reducing cost is becoming more and more dependent on automation which is digital. And increasing revenue become more about customer engagement which is digital. Okay so now you're a traditional enterprise. And you have your exchange to worry about. And all the legal stuff and the mainframes. But if you're not going to work on the transformation piece. You're going to die. Because some other start up is going to build insurance company which is sort of agile and all that. >> So you made an interesting comment earlier when you were talking about nucleo. And integrating the functions that really matter. The services that matter. Amazon releases 800 new services a year. >> Actually 1300. >> I'm sorry 1300. >> This time less, no? >> Right now they're at 1130 and they expect 1500, 1700 by the end of the year. Two years ago it was like 750 and then the year before that was 600. >> So is that an indicator as to Amazon's leading this race between the big, I don't know, three, four cloud providers. Rack and stack them for us. How do we assess the capability? >> It's a matter of mentality. Okay. Persos thinks like a supermarket. Just like an Amazon market. I could say I need a cover for my iPad. I'm gonna get 100 covers for my iPad. No one really, I need to now choose. So their strategy is we'll put dozens of services that do similar things. One is better at this, one is better at that. We control the market we'll sell more. We have a different approach. We do fewer services but each one sort of kicks ass. Each one is much better, much faster, much better engineered. Okay? This is also why we are on data plus provides 10 different data APIs and not 10 different individual data platforms. >> Alright so let's talk about the scoreboard. Even though they might be thinking about the supermarket. You've got Amazon, Azure Microsoft and Google. I've looked at some of the data. I mean, Microsoft's been international for a while from their MSN business. They now have Skype. They have data centers, they know a little bit about cloud. Amazon's got a lot more services. They support multiple versions of things. Google is kind of non-existent on the scale of comprehensiveness. >> Have you looked at their serverless functions? By the way? >> There's new stuff. Tensorflow, serverless. >> But serverless they only support an OJS. They have very few triggers and it's still defined as beta. >> That's the point, so people are touting my Forbes article. They're touting like a feature. There's a lot more that needs to get done. So the question I have for you is. There's a level of comprehensiveness that you need now. And I know you guys spend a lot of time building your solution. We've talked abut this at our last Cube interview. So the question is the whole MVP cousin, minimal viable product. Is great when you're building a consumer app for an iPhone. But when you start talking about a platform and now cloud. Question to you is there a level of completeness bar to be hurdled over for a legit cloud or cloud player? >> I don't think you need 1000 services to build a good cloud. But you do need a bunch of services. Okay? Now the way we see the world like Satya. Okay? Which is there is a core cloud. But there is sort of a belt around it which is what we call intelligence cloud. We would define ourselves as the intelligence cloud. So if someone is building a machine learning model and it needs a 5 year worth of data. And it just needs to do crawling on top of it. It's not really an interesting problem. It's commoditized, lots of CPO power, object storage. But the bigger challenge is doing game referencing close to the edge. This is what needs to happen in real time. You need fewer services but you need to be real time. >> Smarter integration to do that. Right? I mean. >> You have density problems. You don't have a lot of room to put a 100 servers. It needs to be a lot more integrated. You know look at Azure stack. Their slogan is consistency. Look at a slide that shows which Azure services are part of Azure stack. Less than 20%. Because it's a lot more complicated to take technology design whereas hyper scale and put them on few servers. >> How do customers figure it out? What does a customer do? It's all mind boggling. >> I love that concept of core services and then value around those core services. What are those core services that a cloud must have before I start to invest in that cloud providers strategy? >> So the point again, there's a lot of legacy that you need to grab with you. Especially someone like Amazon. So they have to have VMs and migration services from Oracle, etc. But let's assume I'm a start up and building a new client native applications. Do I need any of that? No. I can probably can do with containers. I don't really need to be VMs. I can use something like cybernetics, I can use sequel databases maybe some like sequel. So I can redesign my application differently with a lot fewer services. The problem for someone like Amazon in order to grow and be a supermarket, you have to have ten of everything. If I'm someone that focus on new applications I don't need so many services and so much legacy. >> Well I'll say one thing. You can call them a supermarket, use that retail analogy, I buy that analogy only to the extent that you used it. But if that's the case, then everyone's hungry for food. And they're the only supermarket in town. >> But Wholefoods maybe less stuff on the shelf. >> Everyone else is like a little hot dog stand compared to the supermarket. Amazon is crushing it. Your thoughts? I say that. Are they kicking ass? >> Obviously Amazon is kicking ass. But I think Azure is ramping up faster. Amazon is generating more alienation among people that they are starting to compete with. You know. >> Azure is copying Amazon. Right? >> Yeah. But they have a different angle. They know how to sell to enterprises. They already have the foot in the door for Office 365. I've talked to a customer. We're going Azure. I say why? >> Together: They've got 365. >> We already certify the security with 365 for us to use Azure it's a- >> Right up until that next breech. >> So the guys owning ITs, it's easier for them to go to Azure. The developers want Amazon. Because Amazon is sexier. >> We got to break. We debated this on the intro segment with he analyst. Question. IT buyers have been driven by a top down CIO driven, CXO driven waterfall, whatever you want to call it, old way. With developers now at the driver's seat, with all of this serverless function, serverless coming around the corner very fast. Are developers driving the buying decisions or not? Or is it IT? The budget's still there. They want to eliminate labor. They want more efficiencies. Are you seeing it again? Will it happen? >> Yeah because we are just in the middle. On one end we're an infrastructure. We're an infrastructure consumed by developers. So we keep on having those challenges within the accounts themselves. IT doesn't get what we're doing. Serverless, and database is serverless. Because they like to build stuff. They want to take the nutanix and take a hundred services on top of it. And it will take them two years to integrate it. By that time the business already moved somewhere else. >> So IT could be a dinosaur like the mainframe? >> Right. I think the smart ITs understand they need to adopt cloud instead of fight it. And more the line further up the step. And that sort of the thing we are trying to provide to them. When you are building stuff you are buying EMC storage. You are not just taking discs. So why do you focus on this low level block storage when you're buying infrastructure. Why no buy database as a service. And then you don't need all the hassle. Streaming is a service. Serverless is a service. And then you don't need all that stack. >> Yaron, you should be our guest analyst. But you're too busy building a company. We're going see you next week in Austin for Cubicon. Congratulations. I know you guys have worked hard. The founder and CTO of Iguazio. You're going to hear a lot about these guys. Smart team. They're either going to go big or go home. I think they're going to go big. Congratulations. More coverage here at AWS Re:Invent after this short break. I'm John Furrier with Keith Townsend.

>> Announcer: Live from Las Vegas, it's the CUBE, covering AWS re:Invent 2017, presented by AWS, Intel, and our ecosystem of partners. >> Hey, welcome back to the CUBE. We are live on day one of AWS re:Invent 2017. This is their sixth event, our fifth time here with the CUBE. I'm Lisa Martin, along with Justin Warren, my co-host. There are upwards of 40,000 plus, I've heard even 50,000 people are here, incredible three day event. And we are excited to be joined by another guest from BMC, Daniel Nelson, AVP of Product Management, Security, Compliance and Automation, welcome to the CUBE. >> Thank you so much for having me, I'm excited to be here. >> We're excited to have you here. So one of the things that I'd love to understand is when you talk to customers who are in the enterprise, on this journey to cloud as you know, that term is used a lot, what are some of the biggest challenges that they face knowing they have no choice but to do this? What are some of the biggest challenges that they face that BMC can help to mitigate on this journey? >> Oh, I'd be happy, absolutely. So one of the things about us is that for the past twenty years, we've been helping large enterprises help keep their environment secure, fully automated, be able to have greater efficiencies within their data centers. And as our customers are transitioning to a multi-cloud world, everything that they had to do back at the data center, they still have to do in the public cloud, it still has to be compliant, it still has to be secure, it still has to be governed. And so what we help our customers do is to make that transformation and be able to bring together those two worlds so while they currently are looking as a goal to use AWS, use public cloud, use private cloud, they still have to manage their internal systems and be able to provide one platform to do that is what BMC's all about. >> Yeah, I've been a longtime user of BMC products, back in the day, you know Control-M and some of the things-- >> Still a great product, lots of people use it. >> Absolutely, it was a great product and we used it a lot. So I know that BMC has that rich history and experience of being able to automate things, particularly in scale, so how is that translating across into the world of cloud? 'Cause to me it actually seems like it's basically the same problem. >> Oh, and it is, absolutely. So what it used to be, scale was the measure of number of servers that you have. Now it's much more number of applications that you have, the number of developers you have, the number of configurations you have to keep in touch with, the number of policies you have to enforce, so the scale problem's exactly the same, just the physical mechanism of what's scaling has changed and that is an added complexity to it. >> Yeah, so given that level of similarity and what you've been able to translate from the inside world across into the cloud, what is it that's different? What is the thing that people are struggling with and the customers are really challenged by in this journey to cloud? >> Well, in one word it's speed. So everything that you had to do in the past was at a particular cadence. And so if you're releasing applications once a year, once every six months, even once a quarter, there was a certain amount of slack in the system where if something went wrong, you had time to adjust, you had time to keep up with it. Well now that you're down to hours, minutes, sometimes even seconds, pushing out code all the time, updating your applications all the time, you can't operate, it's beyond human scale and so that's where things like automation being able to tie back to your core systems, be able to have all that automated governance control really helps, you know, all of our customers. >> Speed is one of the things that AWS has done extremely well continuing to-- what? Last year I think it was 1,017 new features and services. This year it's over 1,100 already and you know, Andy Jassy has been very vocal about speed and customer focus is what's helping them. So with that focus on speed and accelerating pace of innovation, how is BMC alike AWS in getting what customers need faster than your competitors? >> You know, absolutely. And so what AWS does really well is providing the core preeminence that the underlying, you know, building blocks of what you need and allowing you to assemble those very quickly to have you realize your own vision and your own dreams. What we do very well is keeping some guardrails on those building blocks and making sure that, you know, we've seen it all over the place. One developer makes a mistake and suddenly, you've got a data breach. Uh, you know, one piece of code doesn't get updated the way it should be or you have a password in GitHub somewhere and now all of a sudden, you know, all your data's out there and you're on the front page of Wall Street Journal. What we help our customers do is to keep out of that news and into the news of satisfying their customers and going fast. So while AWS helps you build things really quickly, we help you do that in the right way, that keeps you safe, keeps you compliant, and keeps you you know, within the normal, corporate governance. >> So what's your favorite example of a customer doing that, where they had this issue and then they came to BMC and you were able to help them to actually solve that problem; what's a great example? >> Well we obviously do a lot of business with a lot of big banks and we have one of our customers, is a very large bank, was hesitant about the cloud, was experimenting with it, and they started with just five projects and within six months that five, those five projects had ballooned up to 65 projects, and all without really governance control oversight. And then WannaCry hit and our customer was so nervous, so scared about it, that their only response was, since they didn't know what their exposure was, they just shut 'em all down, they just pulled the plug, and says, "We're not gonna do anything." And so what we did is we came in and provided them the ability to do that, to revive those innovation products, to provide the ability to build quickly, but also know where you are, how to be safe, and can continue to update, you know, your compliance and security posture with new information as it comes in. So it gives them that safety factor that they can feel safe. One of my favorite examples and one of the best metaphors I've had is one of my customers from Savience said, "You know, Daniel, look I love to go fast, but the last thing I want to do is put my problems on roller skates, like that doesn't do any good." And I was like , "That's what we're here to do. We're here to provide you, you know, those bumper rails on the bowling alley so you can go fast." >> I do love that problems on roller skates idea. >> I'm gonna use that. >> Yeah, I was feeling that one. >> Go ahead, I use it all the time. >> So you know, we talk a lot about a lot of buzzwords, a lot of hot terms, right? Uh, multi-cloud. I'm curious about what BMC is doing in multi-cloud. How does an enterprise understand what multi-cloud is? What's hybrid cloud? How do you guys help sort of break down some of these buzzwords into actions for your customers so they can be fast and competitive? >> So for me, if I were to sound out what multi-cloud really means is that you're choosing the best technology at the best price point for what the need of the business is. And sometimes that means running of the data center. And there are a lot of things in the data center that run, you know, more cheaply, more efficiently, but at a much more cost effective basis than they ever will in the cloud. And those things belong in the data center. And I think over time, you'll see the data center loads will actually increase, as well. There's some things that you have to go very quickly, you can be experimental with it, you have to have the DevOps team attached to, and the public cloud is great for those things. And then even within the public cloud space, there are things that Azure does well, there's things that AWS does well, and individual enterprises, especially large enterprises, which is our constituency, need to be able to make those choices and be able to do that for the best underlying reason of their technology. What BMC then provides you is ability to say whether it's OnPrem, whether it's in Azure, whether it's AWS, wherever you wanna run that, you know, we can provide you the controls and the compliance and the governance that you can be safe regardless. You get the same policies in place regardless of where that individual technology's targeted. >> Yeah, absolutely. And when talking with large, particularly large customers as you've point out, you only have to buy one other company and all of a sudden, you're multi-cloud. You might've decided, "You know what, we're all in on AWS." A different company that you'd buy for business reasons may have decided, "You know what, I wanna have some Azure, I wanna have some Google Cloud." It's like kaboom, you buy them and now all of a sudden, IT has this multi-cloud issue and they need someone who can help them to manage that. And really, you wanna be able to manage that in the same way across all of the different environments and I can see that that's where BMC would be really strong. >> You know, you're exactly right. Give me one of the great things, like this is a great show, and there's so many vendors and there's so much great technology here, but if you talk to Gardner or Forester or ADC or 451, one of the main things they'll tell you is you've got to have not individual tools for every individual problem, you need to have a platform in place that provides you the breadth of coverage where you have the ability to be flexible across those technologies. And that's another thing that BMC is offering in the market. >> Yeah, so one of the challenges of building that platform, though, is that you've got all of these little different silos that tend to just sort of build up all by themselves. And then when you come and try like the central IT comes along and says, "No, thall shalt use the one true solution." How do you actually provide the right level of flexibility for individual solutions that can be tailored in need, but still provide that scalability and sameness across everything that gives you those efficiencies in scale? How does BMC help you manage that? >> Well that's one of BMC's historical strongest parts of the offering, is the breadth of content, being able to support, you know, in the data center all of the different operating systems, all of the different applications. We do the same thing now by us forwarding all the different microservices within AVDS, all of the different microservices within Azure, being able to then provide that breadth of content so that the developer, himself, can choose whatever and then from a central IT standpoint, you know you've got the policies in place to be able to make sure that they're safe. Another one of my favorite expression is that developers will argue with people but they won't argue with systems. And so if you then being able to incorporate that, the compliance and control into the DevOps pipeline, into the DNAP driven-approach, where a developer does something that's outside of those guidelines and they just get an immediate response back saying, "No, I'm sorry, that's not allowed." or you know, "There's an air message in law." they're like, "Okay, well I gotta go fix that." verus being on the phone or having to go through any of that process. Developers are very argumentative about that. So what we do is be able to take that corporate IT perspective and just be able to eject it programmatically across all the different dev teams. >> I think our question we wanna pivot on the developer role for a second, you know, AWS has done a great job of attracting a lot of awareness in the developer community for a long time now. They've never really had to advertise, because this awareness was so strong, very sticky. We've seen them this year, sort of advertising, which as a marketer kinda signaled to me, interesting. We know that their massive growth rate isn't predicated upon us, you know, startups alone. That the enterprise is also a major play for AWS and they need to get to now, the CEO, the corporate board. I'm just curious, is BMC seeing in like a customer, like a large bank or an insurance company for example, where are you seeing the C-Suite help influence product development? How influential is that higher tier of management now as this transition becomes an absolute business imperative? >> Well, it's interesting because you see not only the rise of the CIO as a digital transformer within the business, you also see the CEO being more and more involved with us. And you also have the rise of the CSO. So being able to inject security into this conversation, and so you've got a monopoly of different voices that are all happening at the board level and that there's board visibility in the center of these things as well. But the board now pays attention to, "How are we developing our applications? Are they safe? Are they secure? You know, is there an existential risk to our business by the way that we're conducting ourselves from an information technology standpoint?" So those conversations are obviously happening. You know, we see them happening all the time, it's been really great for our business, because we've been working with these companies for years and years and years to help them be safe and compliant, to keep their banking licenses in order, things of that nature, and now we're just extending that to the cloud, as well. So we definitely see it and honestly, it's one of the things that we feel like is a core competitive advantage for us, is we have those relationships in place today and have for decades. >> Yeah, do you see yourselves going into customers in sort of a partnering relationship with AWS, particularly for those enterprises? I can see that, I mean IT has been wanting a seat at this table for so, so long. It's like, "Well, you've got one now. It happened to come from security which is possibly not the best introduction ever." But now that they have their seat at the table, how are you finding to manage that conversation to influence board level, which is a far different conversation than what it would be when you're talking about technical things? And even from developer land, it's like, "API's and so on", that's not really a board level conversation or is it? >> Well AWS is one of our strategic partners and so it's very easy for us to go into customers together, and be able to tell that message of, "Go safe but be fast at the same time." And so we're much more of an and-world now than an or-world, you know, that we were in the past. And the ability to make trade-offs with somebody that we all kinda took for granted, but now we really don't have that ability anymore, like we have to be all things to all people and that forces a lot of innovation. And it forces a lot of the kind of the new things that you're seeing everyday, no matter of AWS and other vendors as well. It's really an exciting time to be in information technology. >> Never a dull moment. And yeah I wanted to kinda pivot on it, symbiosis. Like how much business do you drive for AWS, but also conversely, how much does AWS sorta push BMC to innovate at their pace? >> Right, so you know, just being a AWS partner pushes you. Because you're now along for the ride and wherever they go, whatever they're doing, you know, our customers are looking at us and saying, "When do you support that? And how are you gonna support that?" You know, we want to be easing into these things and so we've had to put on ourselves, a very strict SLA that as soon as AWS gets someone new, we have to support it with our very breviated time, 'cause that's what our customers have had it and that's great 'cause it enforces us to innovate, forces us to do things in new ways and be able to you know, actually have a lot of the technologies, a lot of the processes in place that our customers, themselves are trying to emulate. So that's been wonderful. In addition to that, if you look at you know, how we're pushing AWS, AWS is definitely you know, is already in the enterprise, there's a lot of enterprises that already used us but being able to think about things from an enterprise standpoint is different than a developer bottom-up standpoint and so we've always been a lot more holistic about understanding what are the needs of the business? And especially from a C-Suite communication perspective, like how do we articulate and how do we do that well? And that's part of what we bring to the relationship. >> You mentioned a lot of customers are banks and insurance companies, I'm curious about healthcare. There's sort of an anticipation that Andy Jassy might be announcing a broader partnership with Cerner, who has 25% market share in electronic health records. Healthcare being historically slower to adopt cloud, massive security challenges there. What are you guys seeing in the healthcare space? What are some of the primary concerns there that you're helping to mitigate? >> Well so if you talk about healthcare, the first thing that everybody will talk about, especially in the IT space is HIPAA, right? So it's you know, what am I doing with my private data? If you talk about it from an AMIA perspective, you know, it's GDPR, you know, what are we gonna do about private data, how do we keep it segregated? You know, how do we not only have those mechanisms in place, but how do we ensure that they're in place, be able to prove that they are in place? And when our auditors come to us, we can provide them all that data. And that's exactly what BMC provides. So we have out of the box content for HIPAA compliance, for SOX, for PCI, for anything that you want to do. And so we can just look at your systems or they're in the data center or in the cloud, tell you exactly how they need to be configured, and then also I'll remediate them for you. So we can take that next step and provide the automation in place for you, so that you can actually then just worry about running your business. So it's a really, really interesting vertical for us to go into 'cause of our history and 'cause of our background. >> Yeah, there's gonna be so much growth in that area. I mean, even from my part of the world, down in Australia. We've got our electronic health records is a big, big thing with the whole program of work that's involved in putting that in, being able to keep that data safe, but also useful. It's gonna be a big challenge and I can only see it getting larger. >> Oh right, absolutely. And it's important for us not to lose sight that the end person we're protecting is the consumer. The end person we're protecting is the individual who that's their data, like they own that, and so it's our job and our duty to do the best we can for our customers to protect that. And ultimately, that's the value. >> Last question for you, some of the things that have come out already in the last day and a half or so, from AWS on AI, what are you seeing in terms of customers' comprehension of machine learning and what the potential is for them to truly become data driven, leveraging advanced technologies like that? >> So we're definitely in the hype cycle with AI, right? I mean and I think we all kinda know that. I think when you talk about machine learning and basing and reasoning and-- it's all part of the cape on having the data in place to do the analysis on. And so just like we saw with the data, it's like, "Oh I want big data, but then now what do I do with it?" Now, we have AI machine learning for the people that do have large data sets, they can start to do some interesting analysis, they can start to do some interesting things. But you have to have the data first, before you start to apply the actual algorithms to it. 'Cause the algorithm, you know, just give it two data points, it's not gonna be very smart. Give it two trillion and it's gonna be able to do some really interesting things. >> So what can people see and learn and touch and feel at the BMC booth here? >> So just this week, we launched a new product called policy service, which is policy and compliance for public cloud and for DevOps pipelines, so we'd love to show anybody who wants to come by a demo of that, we're very excited about it. Also it ties back to our core automation and so if you have to do something also in the data center, we can bring those two worlds together for you. >> Excellent. Well Daniel Nelson, thank you so much for joining us. You're now in the CUBE alumni. >> Alright, that's exciting, I appreciate it. >> And I'm Lisa Martin, for my co-host Justin Warren, we are live from day one of our three day coverage at AWS re:Invent 2017, stick around, we'll be right back. (techno music)