>>Set restaurants. And who says TEUs had got a little ass more skin in the game for us, in charge of his destiny? You guys are excited. Robert Worship is Chief Alumni. >>My name is Dave Ante, and I'm a long time industry analyst. So when you're as old as I am, you've seen a lot of transitions. Everybody talks about industry cycles and waves. I've seen many, many waves. Met a lot of industry executives and of a little bit of a, an industry historian. When you interview many thousands of people, probably five or 6,000 people as I have over the last half of a decade, you get to interact with a lot of people's knowledge and you begin to develop patterns. And so that's sort of what I bring is, is an ability to catalyze the conversation and, you know, share that knowledge with others in the community. Our philosophy is everybody's expert at something. Everybody's passionate about something and has real deep knowledge about that's something well, we wanna focus in on that area and extract that knowledge and share it with our communities. This is Dave Ante. Thanks for watching the Cube. >>Hello everyone and welcome back to the Cube where we are streaming live this week from CubeCon. I am Savannah Peterson and I am joined by an absolutely stellar lineup of cube brilliance this afternoon. To my left, a familiar face, Lisa Martin. Lisa, how you feeling? End of day two. >>Excellent. It was so much fun today. The buzz started yesterday, the momentum, the swell, and we only heard even more greatness today. >>Yeah, yeah, abs, absolutely. You know, I, I sometimes think we've hit an energy cliff, but it feels like the energy is just >>Continuous. Well, I think we're gonna, we're gonna slide right into tomorrow. >>Yeah, me too. I love it. And we've got two fantastic analysts with us today, Sarge and Keith. Thank you both for joining us. We feel so lucky today. >>Great being back on. >>Thanks for having us. Yeah, Yeah. It's nice to have you back on the show. We were, had you yesterday, but I miss hosting with you. It's been a while. >>It has been a while. We haven't done anything in since, Since pre >>Pandemic, right? Yeah, I think you're >>Right. Four times there >>Be four times back in the day. >>We, I always enjoy whole thing, Lisa, cuz she's so well prepared. I don't have to do any research when I come >>Home. >>Lisa will bring up some, Oh, sorry. Jeep, I see that in 2008 you won this award for Yeah. Being just excellent and I, I'm like, Oh >>Yeah. All right Keith. So, >>So did you do his analysis? >>Yeah, it's all done. Yeah. Great. He only part, he's not sitting next to me too. We can't see it, so it's gonna be like a magic crystal bell. Right. So a lot of people here. You got some stats in terms of the attendees compared >>To last year? Yeah, Priyanka told us we were double last year up to 8,000. We also got the scoop earlier that 2023 is gonna be in Chicago, which is very exciting. >>Oh, that is, is nice. Yeah, >>We got to break that here. >>Excellent. Keith, talk to us about what some of the things are that you've seen the last couple of days. The momentum. What's the vibe? I saw your tweet about the top three things you were being asked. Kubernetes was not one of them. >>Kubernetes were, was not one of 'em. This conference is starting to, it, it still feels very different than a vendor conference. The keynote is kind of, you know, kind of all over the place talking about projects, but the hallway track has been, you know, I've, this is maybe my fifth or sixth CU con in person. And the hallway track is different. It's less about projects and more about how, how do we adjust to the enterprise? How do we Yes. Actually do enterprise things. And it has been amazing watching this community grow. I'm gonna say grow up and mature. Yes. You know, you know, they're not wearing ties yet, but they are definitely understanding kind of the, the friction of implementing new technology in, in an enterprise. >>Yeah. So ge what's your, what's been your take, We were with you yesterday. What's been the take today to take aways? >>NOMA has changed since yesterday, but a few things I think I, I missed talking about that yesterday were that, first of all, let's just talk about Amazon. Amazon earnings came out, it spooked the market and I think it's relevant in this context as well, because they're number one cloud provider. Yeah. And all, I mean, almost all of these technologies on the back of us here, they are related to cloud, right? So it will have some impact on these. Like we have to analyze that. Like will it make the open source go faster or slower in, in lieu of the fact that the, the cloud growth is slowing. Right? So that's, that's one thing that's put that's put that aside. I've been thinking about the, the future of Kubernetes. What is the future of Kubernetes? And in that context, I was thinking like, you know, I think in, when I put a pointer there, I think in tangents, like, what else is around this thing? So I think CN CNCF has been writing the success of Kubernetes. They are, that was their number one flagship project, if you will. And it was mature enough to stand on its own. It it was Google, it's Google's Borg dub da Kubernetes. It's a genericized version of that. Right? So folks who do tech deep down, they know that, Right. So I think it's easier to stand with a solid, you know, project. But when the newer projects come in, then your medal will get tested at cncf. Right. >>And cncf, I mean they've got over 140 projects Yeah. Right now. So there's definitely much beyond >>Kubernetes. Yeah. So they, I have numbers there. 18 graduated, right, 37 in incubation and then 81 in Sandbox stage. They have three stages, right. So it's, they have a lot to chew on and the more they take on, the less, you know, quality you get goes into it. Who is, who's putting the money behind it? Which vendors are sponsoring like cncf, like how they're getting funded up. I think it >>Something I pay attention to as well. Yeah. Yeah. Lisa, I know you've got >>Some insight. Those are the things I was thinking about today. >>I gotta ask you, what's your take on what Keith said? Are you also seeing the maturation of the enterprise here at at coupon? >>Yes, I am actually, when you say enterprise versus what's the other side? Startups, right? Yeah. So startups start using open source a lot more earlier or lot more than enterprises. The enterprise is what they need. Number one thing is the, for their production workloads, they want a vendor sporting them. I said that yesterday as well, right? So it depend depending on the size of the enterprise. If you're a big shop, definitely if you have one of the 500 or Fortune five hundreds and your tech savvy shop, then you can absorb the open source directly coming from the open source sort of universe right. Coming to you. But if you are the second tier of enterprise, you want to go to a provider which is managed service provider, or it can be cloud service provider in this case. Yep. Most of the cloud service providers have multiple versions of Kubernetes, for example. >>I'm not talking about Kubernetes only, but like, but that is one example, right? So at Amazon you can get five different flavors of Kubernetes, right? Fully manage, have, manage all kind of stuff. So people don't have bandwidth to manage that stuff locally. You have to patch it, you have to roll in the new, you know, updates and all that stuff. Like, it's a lot of work for many. So CNCF actually is formed for that reason. Like the, the charter is to bring the quality to open source. Like in other companies they have the release process and they, the stringent guidelines and QA and all that stuff. So is is something ready for production? That's the question when it comes to any software, right? So they do that kind of work and, and, and they have these buckets defined at high level, but it needs more >>Work. Yeah. So one of the things that, you know, kind of stood out to me, I have good friend in the community, Alex Ellis, who does open Fast. It's a serverless platform, great platform. Two years ago or in 2019, there was a serverless day date. And in serverless day you had K Native, you had Open Pass, you had Ws, which is supported by IBM completely, not CNCF platforms. K native came into the CNCF full when Google donated the project a few months ago or a couple of years ago, now all of a sudden there's a K native day. Yes. Not a serverless day, it's a K native day. And I asked the, the CNCF event folks like, what happened to Serverless Day? I missed having open at serverless day. And you know, they, they came out and said, you know what, K native got big enough. >>They came in and I think Red Hat and Google wanted to sponsor a K native day. So serverless day went away. So I think what what I'm interested in and over the next couple of years is, is they're gonna be pushback from the C against the cncf. Is the CNCF now too big? Is it now the gatekeeper for do I have to be one of those 147 projects, right? In order enough to get my project noticed the open, fast, great project. I don't think Al Alex has any desire to have his project hosted by cncf, but it probably deserves, you know, shoulder left recognition with that. So I'm pushing to happen to say, okay, if this is open community, this is open source. If CNC is the place to have the cloud native conversation, what about the projects that's not cncf? Like how do we have that conversation when we don't have the power of a Google right. Or a, or a Lenox, et cetera, or a Lenox Foundation. So GE what, >>What are your thoughts on that? Is, is CNC too big? >>I don't think it's too big. I think it's too small to handle the, what we are doing in open source, right? So it's a bottle. It can become a bottleneck. Okay. I think too big in a way that yeah, it has, it has, it has power from that point of view. It has that cloud, if you will. The people listen to it. If it's CNCF project or this must be good, it's like in, in incubators. Like if you are y white Combinator, you know, company, it must be good. You know, I mean, may not be >>True, but, >>Oh, I think there's a bold assumption there though. I mean, I think everyone's just trying to do the best they can. And when we're evaluating projects, a very different origin and background, it's incredibly hard. Very c and staff is a staff of 30 people. They've got 180,000 people that are contributing to these projects and a thousand maintainers that they're trying to uphold. I think the challenge is actually really great. And to me, I actually look at events as an illustration of, you know, what's the culture and the health of an organization. If I were to evaluate CNCF based on that, I'd say we're very healthy right now. I would say that we're in a good spot. There's a lot of momentum. >>Yeah. I, I think CNCF is very healthy. I'm, I'm appreciative for it being here. I love coupon. It's becoming the, the facto conference to have this conversation has >>A totally >>Different vibe to other, It's a totally different vibe. Yeah. There needs to be a conduit and truth be told, enterprise buyers, to subject's point, this is something that we do absolutely agree on, on enterprise buyers. We want someone to pick winners and losers. We do, we, we don't want a box of Lego dumped on our, the middle of our table. We want somebody to have sorted that out. So while there may be five or six different service mesh solutions, at least the cncf, I can go there and say, Oh, I'll pick between the three or four that are most popular. And it, it's a place to curate. But I think with that curation comes the other side of it. Of how do we, how, you know, without the big corporate sponsor, how do I get my project pushed up? Right? Elevated. Elevated, Yep. And, and put onto the show floor. You know, another way that projects get noticed is that startups will adopt them, Push them. They may not even be, I don't, my CNCF project may not, my product may not even be based on the CNCF product. But the new stack has a booth, Ford has a booth. Nothing to do with a individual prod up, but promoting open source. What happens when you're not sponsored? >>I gotta ask you guys, what do you disagree on? >>Oh, so what, what do we disagree on? So I'm of the mindset, I can, I can say this, I I believe hybrid infrastructure is the future of it. Bar none. If I built my infrastructure, if I built my application in the cloud 10 years ago and I'm still building net new applications, I have stuff that I built 10 years ago that looks a lot like on-prem, what do I do with it? I can't modernize it cuz I don't have the developers to do it. I need to stick that somewhere. And where I'm going to stick that at is probably a hybrid infrastructure. So colo, I'm not gonna go back to the data center, but I'm, I'm gonna look, pick up something that looks very much like the data center and I'm saying embrace that it's the future. And if you're Boeing and you have, and Boeing is a member, cncf, that's a whole nother topic. If you have as 400 s, hpu X, et cetera, stick that stuff. Colo, build new stuff, but, and, and continue to support OpenStack, et cetera, et cetera. Because that's the future. Hybrid is the future. >>And sub g agree, disagree. >>I okay. Hybrid. Nobody can deny that the hybrid is the reality, not the future. It's a reality right now. It's, it's a necessity right now you can't do without it. Right. And okay, hybrid is very relative term. You can be like 10% here, 90% still hybrid, right? So the data center is shrinking and it will keep shrinking. Right? And >>So if by whole is the data center shrinking? >>This is where >>Quick one quick getting guys for it. How is growing by a clip? Yeah, but there's no data supporting. David Lym just came out for a report I think last year that showed that the data center is holding steady, holding steady, not growing, but not shrinking. >>Who sponsored that study? Wait, hold on. So the, that's a question, right? So more than 1 million data centers have been closed. I have, I can dig that through number through somebody like some organizations we published that maybe they're cloud, you know, people only. So the, when you get these kind of statements like it, it can be very skewed statements, right. But if you have seen the, the scene out there, which you have, I know, but I have also seen a lot of data centers walk the floor of, you know, a hundred thousand servers in a data center. I cannot imagine us consuming the infrastructure the way we were going into the future of co Okay. With, with one caveat actually. I am not big fan of like broad strokes. Like make a blanket statement. Oh no, data center's dead. Or if you are, >>That's how you get those esty headlines now. Yeah, I know. >>I'm all about to >>Put a stake in the ground. >>Actually. The, I think that you get more intelligence from the new end, right? A small little details if you will. If you're golden gold manak or Bank of America, you have so many data centers and you will still have data centers because performance matters to you, right? Your late latency matters for applications. But if you are even a Fortune 500 company on the lower end and or a healthcare vertical, right? That your situation is different. If you are a high, you know, growth startup, your situation is different, right? You will be a hundred percent cloud. So cloud gives you velocity, the, the, the pace of change, the pace of experimentation that actually you are buying innovation through cloud. It's proxy for innovation. And that's how I see it. But if you have, if you're stuck with older applications, I totally understand. >>Yeah. So the >>We need that OnPrem. Yeah, >>Well I think the, the bring your fuel sober, what we agree is that cloud is the place where innovation happens. Okay? At some point innovation becomes legacy debt and you have thus hybrid, you are not going to keep your old applications up to date forever. The, the, the math just doesn't add up. And where I differ in opinion is that not everyone needs innovation to keep moving. They need innovation for a period of time and then they need steady state. So Sergeant, we >>Argue about this. I have a, I >>Love this debate though. I say it's efficiency and stability also plays an important role. I see exactly what you're talking about. No, it's >>Great. I have a counter to that. Let me tell you >>Why. Let's >>Hear it. Because if you look at the storage only, right? Just storage. Just take storage computer network for, for a minute. There three cost reps in, in infrastructure, right? So storage earlier, early on there was one tier of storage. You say pay the same price, then now there are like five storage tiers, right? What I'm trying to say is the market sets the price, the market will tell you where this whole thing will go, but I know their margins are high in cloud, 20 plus percent and margin will shrink as, as we go forward. That means the, the cloud will become cheaper relative to on-prem. It, it, in some cases it's already cheaper. But even if it's a stable workload, even in that case, we will have a lower tier of service. I mean, you, you can't argue with me that the cloud versus your data center, they are on the same tier of services. Like cloud is a better, you know, product than your data center. Hands off. >>I love it. We, we are gonna relish in the debates between the two of you. Mic drops. The energy is great. I love it. Perspective. It's not like any of us can quite see through the crystal ball that we have very informed opinions, which is super exciting. Yeah. Lisa, any last thoughts today? >>Just love, I love the debate as well. That, and that's, that's part of what being in this community is all about. So sharing about, sharing opinions, expressing opinions. That's how it grows. That's how, that's how we innovate. Yeah. Obviously we need the cloud, but that's how we innovate. That's how we grow. Yeah. And we've seen that demonstrated the last couple days and I and your, your takes here on the Cuban on Twitter. Brilliant. >>Thank you. I absolutely love it. I'm gonna close this out with a really important analysis on the swag of the show. Yes. And if you know, yesterday we were looking at what is the weirdest swag or most unique swag We had that bucket hat that took the grand prize. Today we're gonna focus on something that's actually quite cool. A lot of the vendors here have really dedicated their swag to being local to Detroit. Very specific in their sourcing. Sonotype here has COOs. They're beautiful. You can't quite feel this flannel, but it's very legit hand sound here in Michigan. I can't say that I've been to too many conferences, if any, where there was this kind of commitment to localizing and sourcing swag from around the corner. We also see this with the Intel booth. They've got screen printers out here doing custom hoodies on spot. >>Oh fun. They're even like appropriately sized. They had local artists do these designs and if you're like me and you care about what's on your wrist, you're familiar with Shinola. This is one of my favorite swags that's available. There is a contest. Oh going on. Hello here. Yeah, so if you are Atan, make sure that you go and check this out. The we, I talked about this on the show. We've had the founder on the show or the CEO and yeah, I mean Shine is just full of class as since we are in Detroit as well. One of the fun themes is cars. >>Yes. >>And Storm Forge, who are also on the show, is actually giving away an Aston Martin, which is very exciting. Not exactly manufactured in Detroit. However, still very cool on the car front and >>The double oh seven version named the best I >>Know in the sixties. It's love it. It's very cool. Two quick last things. We talk about it a lot on the show. Every company now wants to be a software company. Yep. On that vein, and keeping up with my hat theme, the Home Depot is here because they want everybody to know that they in fact are a technology company, which is very cool. They have over 500,000 employees. You can imagine there's a lot of technology that has to go into keeping Napa. Absolutely. Yep. Wild to think about. And then last, but not at least very quick, rapid fire, best t-shirt contest. If you've ever ran to one of these events, there are a ton of T-shirts out there. I rate them on two things. Wittiest line and softness. If you combine the two, you'll really be our grand champion for the year. I'm just gonna hold these up and set them down for your laughs. Not afraid to commit, which is pretty great. This is another one designed by locals here. Detroit Code City. Oh, love it. This one made me chuckle the most. Kiss my cash. >>Oh, that's >>Good. These are also really nice and soft, which is fantastic. Also high on the softness category is this Op Sarah one. I also like their bird logo. These guys, there's just, you know, just real nice touch. So unfortunately, if you have the fumble, you're not here with us, live in Detroit. At least you're gonna get taste of the swag. I taste of the stories and some smiles hear from those of us on the cube. Thank you both so much for being here with us. Lisa, thanks for another fabulous day. Got it, girl. My name's Savannah Peterson. Thank you for joining us from Detroit. We're the cube and we can't wait to see you tomorrow.

>>Live from San Diego, California It's the Q covering Koopa and Cloud Native Cot brought to you by Red Cloud, Native Computing Pounding and its ecosystem March. >>Welcome back to the Cube here at Q. Khan Club native Khan, 2019 in San Diego, California Instrumental in my co host is Jon Cryer and first of all, happy to welcome back to the program. Diane Mueller, who is the technical of the tech lead of cloud native technology. I'm sorry. I'm getting the wrong That's director of community development Red Hat, because renew. Goodbye is the technical lead of cognitive technologies at in video game to the end of day one. I've got three days. I gotta make sure >>you get a little more Red Bull in the conversation. >>All right, well, there's definitely a lot of energy. Most people we don't even need Red Bull here because we're a day one. But Diane, we're going to start a day zero. So, you know, you know, you've got a good group of community of geeks when they're like Oh, yeah, let me fly in a day early and do like 1/2 day or full day of deep dives. There So the Red Hat team decided to bring everybody on a boat, I guess. >>Yeah. So, um, open ships Commons gathering for this coup con we hosted at on the inspiration Hornblower. We had about 560 people on a boat. I promised them that it wouldn't leave the dock, but we deal still have a little bit of that weight going on every time one of the big military boats came by. And so people were like a little, you know, by the end of the day, but from 8 a.m. in the morning till 8 p.m. In the evening, we just gathered had some amazing deep dives. There was unbelievable conversations onstage offstage on we had, ah, wonderful conversation with some of the new Dev ops folks that have just come on board. That's a metaphor for navigation and Coop gone. And and for events, you know, Andrew Cliche for John Willis, the inevitable Crispin Ella, who runs Open Innovation Labs, and J Bloom have all just formed the global Transformation Office. I love that title on dhe. They're gonna be helping Thio preach the gospel of Cultural Dev ops and agile transformation from a red hat office From now going on, there was a wonderful conversation. I felt privileged to actually get to moderate it and then just amazing people coming forward and sharing their stories. It was a great session. Steve Dake, who's with IBM doing all the SDO stuff? Did you know I've never seen SDO done so well, Deployment explains so well and all of the contents gonna be recorded and up on Aaron. We streamed it live on Facebook. But I'm still, like reeling from the amount of information overload. And I think that's the nice thing about doing a day zero event is that it's a smaller group of people. So we had 600 people register, but I think was 560 something. People show up and we got that facial recognition so that now when they're traveling through the hallways here with 12,000 other people, that go Oh, you were in the room. I met you there. And that's really the whole purpose for comments. Events? >>Yeah, I tell you, this is definitely one of those shows that it doesn't take long where I say, Hey, my brain is full. Can I go home. Now. You know I love your first impressions of Q Khan. Did you get to go to the day zero event And, uh, what sort of things have you been seeing? So >>I've been mostly I went to the lightning talks, which were amazing. Anything? Definitely. There. A number of shout outs to the GPU one, of course. Uh, friend in video. But I definitely enjoyed, for example, of the amazing D. M s one, the one about operators. And generally all of them were very high quality. >>Is this your first Q? Khan, >>I've been there. I've been a year. This is my third con. I've been accused in Europe in the past. Send you an >>old hat old hand at this. Well, before we get into the operator framework and I wanna love to dig into this, I just wanted to ask one more thought. Thought about open shift, Commons, The Commons in general, the relationship between open shift, the the offering. And then Okay, the comments and okay, D and then maybe the announcement about about Okay. Dee da da i o >>s. Oh, a couple of things happened yesterday. Yesterday we dropped. Okay, D for the Alfa release. So anyone who wants to test that out and try it out it's an all operators based a deployment of open shift, which is what open ship for is. It's all a slightly new architectural deployment methodology based on the operator framework, and we've been working very diligently. Thio populate operator hub dot io, which is where all of the upstream projects that have operators like the one that Reynolds has created for in the videos GP use are being hosted so that anyone could deploy them, whether on open shift or any kubernetes so that that dropped. And yesterday we dropped um, and announced Open Sourcing Quay as project quay dot io. So there's a lot of Io is going on here, but project dia dot io is, um, it's a fulfillment, really, of a commitment by Red Hat that whenever we do an acquisition and the poor folks have been their acquired by Cora West's and Cora Weston acquired by Red Hat in an IBM there. And so in the interim, they've been diligently working away to make the code available as open source. And that hit last week and, um, to some really interesting and users that are coming up and now looking forward to having them to contribute to that project as well. But I think the operator framework really has been a big thing that we've been really hearing, getting a lot of uptake on. It's been the new pattern for deploying applications or service is on getting things beyond just a basic install of a service on open shift or any kubernetes. And that's really where one of the exciting things yesterday on we were talking, you know, and I were talking about this earlier was that Exxon Mobil sent a data scientist to the open ship Commons, Audrey Resnick, who gave this amazing presentation about Jupiter Hub, deeper notebooks, deploying them and how like open shift and the advent of operators for things like GP use is really helping them enable data scientists to do their work. Because a lot of the stuff that data signs it's do is almost disposable. They'll run an experiment. Maybe they don't get the result they want, and then it just goes away, which is perfect for a kubernetes workload. But there are other things you need, like a Jeep use and work that video has been doing to enable that on open shift has been just really very helpful. And it was It was a great talk, but we were talking about it from the first day. Signs don't want to know anything about what's under the hood. They just want to run their experiments. So, >>you know, let's like to understand how you got involved in the creation of the operator. >>So generally, if we take a step back and look a bit at what we're trying to do is with a I am l and generally like EJ infrastructure and five G. We're seeing a lot of people. They're trying to build and run applications. Whether it's in data Center at the and we're trying to do here with this operator is to bring GPS to enterprise communities. And this is what we're working with. Red Hat. And this is where, for example, things like the op Agrestic A helps us a lot. So what we've built is this video Gee, few operator that space on the upper air sdk where it wants us to multiple phases to in the first space, for example, install all the components that a data scientist were generally a GPU cluster of might want to need. Whether it's the NVIDIA driver, the container runtime, the community's device again feast do is as you go on and build an infrastructure. You want to be able to have the automation that is here and, more importantly, the update part. So being able to update your different components, face three is generally being able to have a life cycle. So as you manage multiple machines, these are going to get into different states. Some of them are gonna fail, being able to get from these bad states to good states. How do you recover from them? It's super helpful. And then last one is monitoring, which is being able to actually given sites dr users. So the upper here is decay has helped us a lot here, just laying out these different state slips. And in a way, it's done the same thing as what we're trying to do for our customers. The different data scientists, which is basically get out of our way and allow us to focus on core business value. So the operator, who basically takes care of things that are pretty cool as an engineer I lost due to your election. But it doesn't really help me to focus on like my core business value. How do I do with the updates, >>you know? Can I step back one second, maybe go up a level? The problem here is that each physical machine has only ah limited number of NVIDIA. GPU is there and you've got a bunch of containers that maybe spawning on different machines. And so they have to figure out, Do I have a GPU? Can I grab one? And if I'm using it, I assume I have to reserve it and other people can't use and then I have to give it up. Is that is that the problem we're solving here? So this is >>a problem that we've worked with communities community so that like the whole resource management, it's something that is integrated almost first class, citizen in communities, being able to advertise the number of deep, use their your cluster and used and then being able to actually run or schedule these containers. The interesting components that were also recently added are, for example, the monitoring being able to see that a specific Jupiter notebook is using this much of GP utilization. So these air supercool like features that have been coming in the past two years in communities and which red hat has been super helpful, at least in these discussions pushing these different features forward so that we see better enterprise support. Yeah, >>I think the thing with with operators and the operator lifecycle management part of it is really trying to get to Day two. So lots of different methodologies, whether it's danceable or python or job or or UH, that's helm or anything else that can get you an insult of a service or an application or something. And in Stan, she ate it. But and the operator and we support all of that with SD case to help people. But what we're trying to do is bridge the to this day to stuff So Thea, you know, to get people to auto pilot, you know, and there's a whole capacity maturity model that if you go to operator hab dot io, you can see different operators are a different stages of the game. So it's been it's been interesting to work with people to see Theo ah ha moment when they realize Oh, I could do this and then I can walk away. And then if that pod that cluster dies, it'll just you know, I love the word automatically, but they, you know, it's really the goal is to help alleviate the hands on part of Day two and get more automation into the service's and applications we deploy >>right and when they when they this is created. Of course it works well with open shift, but it also works for any kubernetes >>correct operator. HAB Daddio. Everything in there runs on any kubernetes, and that's really the goal is to be ableto take stuff in a hybrid cloud model. You want to be able to run it anywhere you want, so we want people to be unable to do it anywhere. >>So if this really should be an enabler for everything that it's Vinny has been doing to be fully cloud native, Yes, >>I think completely arable here is this is a new attack. Of course, this is a bit there's a lot of complexity, and this is where we're working towards is reducing the complexity and making true that people there. Dan did that a scientist air machine learning engineers are able to focus on their core business. >>You watch all of the different service is in the different things that the data scientists are using. They don't I really want to know what's under under the hood. They would like to just open up a Jupiter Hub notebook, have everything there. They need, train their models, have them run. And then after they're done, they're done and it goes away. And hopefully they remember to turn off the Jeep, use in the woods or wherever it is, and they don't keep getting billed for it. But that's the real beauty of it is that they don't have to worry so much anymore about that. And we've got a whole nice life cycle with source to image or us to I. And they could just quickly build on deploy its been, you know, it's near and dear to my heart, the machine learning the eyesight of stuff. It is one of the more interesting, you know, it's the catchy thing, but the work was, but people are really doing it today, and it's been we had 23 weeks ago in San Francisco, we had a whole open ship comments gathering just on a I and ML and you know, it was amazing to hear. I think that's the most redeeming thing or most rewarding thing rather for people who are working on Kubernetes is to have the folks who are doing workloads come and say, Wow, you know, this is what we're doing because we don't get to see that all the time. And it was pretty amazing. And it's been, you know, makes it all worthwhile. So >>Diane Renaud, thank you so much for the update. Congratulations on the launch of the operators and look forward to hearing more in the future. >>All right >>to >>be here >>for John Troy runs to minimum. More coverage here from Q. Khan Club native Khan, 2019. Thanks for watching. Thank you.

>>Live from Orlando, Florida. It's the cube covering Microsoft ignite brought to you by Cohesity. >>Good afternoon everyone. You are watching the cubes live coverage of Microsoft ignite. I am your host, Rebecca Knight, along with my cohost Stu Miniman. We are joined by Sean Gifford. He is the senior infrastructure administrator, administrator and infrastructure team lead at Illinois mutual. Thank you so much for coming on the cube. Thanks for having me. This is really fun. Yeah. So tell us a little bit about Illinois mutual. >>Sure. So Alou Mutual's a a life insurance company. We sell life insurance Dai and several other insurance products. We've been around for a little over a hundred years now. So, uh, not myself, but uh, you know, the company. Um, and uh, we are based in Peoria, Illinois, uh, about 200 employees. And uh, we're uh, mostly uh, based on one headquarters there with a couple of their uh, uh, one of their, uh, co located dead center. >>And you are a senior infrastructure administrator. Tell us, tell our viewers a little about what you do. >>Sure. So basically a infrastructure admin means you do just about everything now. Just seems that way sometimes. Um, so, uh, my team, uh, handles everything from windows system, ministration, um, individual systems like a, your exchange, SharePoint, you know, things like that that we would use on prem. Um, too. Also outside of the on prem side, any of our cloud management, et cetera. All right, so, so Sean, you know, this shows decades old and started out at the windows administrator and you know, what's now office or O three 65, uh, at its core. Uh, so have you been to the show before or is this your first time? Uh, on one time, watch. Never on before. Okay. So, but you know, I, I'd love just your viewpoint on Microsoft before we get into some of the environments. Cause of that, you know, Microsoft, you know, started out as people knew kind of windows and some of their apps, but now, you know, the sprawling company with, you know, apps everywhere in the cloud, the edge and the data center, uh, you know, such a big footprint is what they do. >>How you personally in Illinois mutual look at Microsoft? Well, Microsoft is definitely a major partner for Illinois mutual. Right. I mean, we are a very big Microsoft shop. Does that mean that everyone, uh, you know, thinks that Microsoft is the best that every product? Of course not, but, uh, they do a lot of things and they do them really well. So I mean, we obviously rely on them not only for our on prem active directory, but then replicating that out to, to as your, um, you know, I mean our email much just people like might not like to admit it is still one of the most essential pieces of the infrastructure. Um, and that's around on exchange. So I mean, honestly, uh, as much as a, you know, people might want to say Cisco networking is like the backbone of the network. Uh, my Microsoft technologies really are kind of the backbone as far as I look at it. >>Okay. So you still have exchange, you know, in your own shop. You haven't made the move. DOE Microsoft pressure in there. >> Yeah, I know, right? Um, so, uh, no. Yeah, we're, we're still on prem. Um, we have our O three 65 account and we're, um, full disclosure. So, you know, I've been in it for 20 some years, but, uh, uh, been into Eleni mutual for about four. When I was in consulting before only mutual. I did a lot of, uh, in a cloud consulting and getting people on. So it felt really weird to me, but that's, uh, you know, coming into Eleanor mutual where, uh, at the time they came on, uh, it was, the cloud in general was like a bad word. Um, so, and getting past that culture-wise has been a little bit of a struggle. >> Oh yeah. I would, I'd love you to just step back for a second. >>You know, you work for a company that's over a hundred years old, uh, so, you know, exchange in cloud and everything like that is, you know, been around for a very short piece of the overall company. So tell us some of the, you know, what are some of the changes, the pressures going on? Oftentimes there's M and a involved in pulling all those things together. So, uh, you know, Illinois mutual as a company, what are the, what are the drivers and stressors on, you know, your, your, your, your organization? >> Yeah, well first and foremost, data security, right? Um, getting it, uh, any data so that it's fully encrypted at rest in transit and all that sort of thing so that, uh, you know, and, and you don't have to worry about it, uh, leaving anywhere once it's on someone else's prem. Right. Um, it has always been a big part of it. >>Um, trust I mean in is really what it just comes down to. Uh, when you, when you're selling life insurance policies that, you know, go for the life of a human being, you know, that's a pretty longterm relationship. And, uh, going with something, uh, especially a technology like that, that is considered as you say, you know, new to the game, uh, has, has been a struggle for sure. I mean, we're, uh, just to give you an idea, we're a still on mainframe and, uh, we have now to be, to be fair, we have a sizable, uh, uh, project for getting, uh, things moved off of the mainframe, but that, you know, is 40 plus years old. Getting, getting that moving, uh, to, you know, try and hop just into the end of the 20th century, let alone the 21st is always a little bit hard. >>So talk about some of the specific challenges of managing legacy infrastructure, managing tape and, and sort of what, what you do as more of a on the Vanguard of technology in terms of how you're leading your organization to make changes that are, that are much needed. >>Yeah. Uh, so yeah, when, when I came in on, in fact until just a few months ago, you bring up the example of tape. I mean, uh, we had been doing tape off to a, on off-prem, a site that, uh, had been just the way they did it, right. And, uh, um, as a joke, when some people an earlier, um, as the new crew came in, uh, one of the things that we instituted is a, uh, that's how we always done it. Jar. Um, and, uh, instead of people having a swear jar, right, they'd have to throw money in a anytime. They didn't say, I can't do it cause that's how we've always done it. And that's always been just that struggle, you know, with tape, you know, why is it that we're sending our tapes, why are we sending tapes at all? But why are we sending them to this place that's a, you know, three miles away from our place and calling that disaster recovery. >>Um, so I, I, that has been one of the major struggles for sure. Um, getting through that. But, uh, I've been really impressed, uh, culture-wise with the fact that, uh, people are really starting to, to get in line with it. You know, they're seeing the, the advantages that we're bringing. Um, w when you have a cloud strategy that's well thought out and, uh, isn't, uh, at least inherently a, you know, tied to a given vendor as your AWS or whoever it might be. Um, and, and you're not making decisions for cloud just for the sake of calling it cloud. It makes a big difference. I think. So, uh, as you, as you started to embrace cloud, uh, how did things like data protection and security, you know, what stayed the same? You know, what, what things did you need to rethink as you roll those out? >>Data protection changes completely, right? Um, first of all, uh, you know, everyone had that, uh, idea that if it's in cloud, of course it's completely protected, right? It's not right. And so getting people to understand that, uh, as they say, Oh yeah, we're going to, you know, do this new sass offering. It's totally, you know, they take care of everything, the applications on them. You don't have to touch it. Right? Well, no, that's not really the case. You know, that they can lose a data just like anybody else. So getting through pieces like that on the, on the cloud side is, has been a struggle. But, uh, getting into just even normal or excuse me, newer, um, on-prem technologies has, has meant changing completely the way we're doing a lot of things. Um, the, uh, it was becoming harder and harder, especially as we moved data sets off of the, uh, uh, mainframe side to keep up with a lot of those replication timeframes and things like that because, uh, it, as you push more data through what is still a small pipe and it's never big enough, um, it, uh, it became everyday nightmares. >>So it's been a struggle. >>So when you are, when you, when you come to the conclusion that you need to make a change and you need to look for other kinds of solutions, how do you go about finding the right vendor for the problem that you're trying to solve? How do you find the best in class? Right. And that's, >>that's been an interesting piece with w with alimony mutual and, and, uh, having spent time at VARs for the first part of my career, I was used to, you know, answering things like RFPs and whatnot. Right. Um, and we don't necessarily do it within an RFP process, but, uh, honestly conventions like this one and stuff is how I like to do it. Um, you know, we get really stuck in the day to day doldrums and stuff like that too, right? As much as you're trying. And your goal might always be to, you know, get things to at least the cutting edge if not the bleeding edge. Uh, you really need to, you know, be at a places where you can learn about new new technologies now. So when it comes to us, we end up finding a lot of our vendors like that. And, uh, you know, cause we don't really want her to necessarily rely on, you know, the sales people or, or even really our, our, you know, sales people from a VAR or anything like that. >>It's about trying to find, uh, that, that third party knowledge to, to really understand what's the best thing for the needs and the, uh, pain points that you're having. And that's Sean, can you bring us in through, can you tell us, you know, which solutions you were, uh, you were deciding between and how you ultimately came to your final decision? Yeah. So, uh, so we looked at, uh, several different vendors. Um, when it came to our, uh, data protection, uh, analysis, we had looked at a beam for awhile. We had looked at rubric. Um, we had, we had looked at, uh, uh, of course, uh, you know, trying to continue things along with our current vendor at the time we should have been con ball. Um, and we did, uh, we did an M U a you right. a utility attribute analysis. Yeah. Uh, and we, uh, set that up and, uh, just tried to really compare and, uh, uh, you know, what are the actual things we really wanted, what were the selection criteria we have and grading each vendor on those things. >>Um, and ultimately that's what it took to be able to get it through to, you know, to our executives and, and whatnot, uh, building an algorithm that, uh, that, that looked at all those pieces and then, you know, as really address the pain points we were having, you know, uh, not just as a Jeep cause yes, as always a big thing. Right. But is it gonna replicate in time? Is it, is it going to, uh, reduce our overhead, uh, that we're in, that we're experiencing right now? Am I going to have to keep on a full time contractor just to, you know, do my data protection. So, all right, so you ended up choosing Cohesity. So what was it about Cohesity that separated it from, uh, from, from all the others? Yeah, so Cohesity, um, I had pretty given up, uh, when I did the analysis I was talking to you about a couple of years ago. >>Um, I looked around and nobody could quite fit the square peg into the round hole that I was trying to make it work. Right? I wanted a lot of things and nobody had exactly what I was looking for. Can we sit? He was the first one that could really do most of what I wanted to do. Uh, as an example. Um, being able to replicate your data, but while keeping it encrypted on both ends and but still having dedupe and compression and all those things built in, into the platform and, and weight, it's actually searchable wallets in those States, right? I can do like a Google type search and be able to find exactly what I'm looking for. Made a huge difference and it cut it down. Uh, you know, time wise, not only on the administrative effort but also when I had to do a restore and we had a major project just a, a month or so ago where, uh, I had my DBA doing a backup, uh, during a rollout. He accidentally set at the backup to go with the wrong side at the wrong data center. Everyone was kind of freaking out, right? What are we gonna do? We restored it across data centers, across the handling, kept within our timeframes. I was, that's the type of thing, type of thing that really makes it different stuff. So, >>so, so talk about some of the results that you've seen since implementing this. >>Yeah, so replication, um, that I brought up a couple of times, but, uh, it was a really big problem that we would take. For instance, um, I'll take SQL as an example, right? Our SQL data, we would do a data mirroring, right? So it replicated across our wind line for that. We would, uh, we would do a, uh, primary storage replication. So in this case, a nimble Sans that would replicate across with snapshots and then our actual data protection. Uh, so the same exact data would have to replicate across one tiny land line three times for every a replication. Um, since putting in Cohesity, we have experienced an actual, I was blown away when we actually calculated the results, but it was actually a four times increase in replication efficiency. Uh, it just allowed us to do a whole lot more without buying more land bandwidth. So this is a big deal for us. >>So, in terms of this show, as you said this, this is really helpful for you to go and meet different kinds of companies that you might not even know exists. There are new entrance all the time. So what are you going to bring back with you when you go back to Illinois mutual next week? What are some of the things that have stuck out to you, resonated most with you? >>Yeah, so I'm, I'm really encouraged and even with just Cohesity, for instance, I've talked to a, I'm actually met up with a couple of the engineers that I've talked with them, um, who had one of them and even put out a, uh, a new, uh, feature request for us. And he was telling me before lunchtime about some new features available that I can start to change up some of my jobs. I've, I'm really excited. I was texting my, my, uh, data protection, uh, you know, secondary admin, uh, uh, you know, texting furiously to them, we can do this. And, you know, I'm really excited about that. But, uh, honestly on the other side, is these your side? I'm, uh, really, uh, excited to learn about some of the things that we can actually implement, uh, even with older infrastructure, uh, in trying to pull some of those things, uh, into a cloud platform in ways that actually make sense and aren't gonna lose us money in the longterm. So I'm happy with that. Thank you so much for coming on the cube. Thank you very much. It's been fun. I'm Rebecca aid for Stu Miniman. Stay tuned for more of the cube.

>>live from San Francisco. It's the Q covering Micron Insight 2019 to You by Micron. >>Welcome back, everybody. We hear a Pier 27 in San Francisco. Beautiful day. David Floor is my co host on Day Volante, and this is Micron Inside. 2019. Jeff Baylor is here. He's the corporate vice president of the embedded business unit at Micron. Jeff, great to see you again. >>Thank you. Nice to be here >>so love to talk about autos. I o. T Edge. Use cases to talk about the focus of your team. Let's start there. Yeah, >>sure. So the embedded business to point. It's absolutely focused on the automotive industry's way. Call industrial markets. So factory automation, surveillance and stolen a swell as a consumer electronics businesses on we're really in across all those sort of focused on how connectivity and compute is changing inside of those. And, of course, how that drives memory. >>I mean, yeah, memory and storage. They hide in places that we use every day. You don't see them, but if they weren't there, you wouldn't be able to use all these devices. They wouldn't be as life changing as they are. So you know you mentioned some of the consumer stuff. You know what the big trends that are driving your business? Well, I do >>think it is absolutely. That's sort of the ubiquity of connectivity. First of all, and then, sort of the ubiquity of compute has enabled all of these what used to be sort of isolated applications to now be connected and doing a whole lot more analytics inside that machine. Do you think about intelligence in your thermostat on the wall? You think about intelligence, obviously, in the automotive business, where safety features and so on are using so much more electron ICs and a I machine learning. And that's happening really in every application, whether it's the smart speakers at home, voice control on your TV and so on and so forth. All of those drive more intelligence, more connectivity and then more memory and storage behind that. >>When people talk about automotive, of course, everybody wants to talk about autonomous vehicles. I love to talk about autonomous vehicles, but there's so much action going on in today's vehicles dozens and dozens of microprocessors throwing off all kinds of data. So give us the update on the automotive industry. >>Yeah, you're exactly right. I mean, autonomous gets the headlines and it will for several more years just be headlines more or less right? And the real story is what we call eight ass or advanced driver assistant system. So things like lane departure warning, lane departure, keeping things like auto emergency braking those those sort of much simpler, easier problems to solve are still very compute intensive on. So are driving a huge growth and electronics on memory of storage inside the car. The other major part of the car market in the automotive market is what we call infotainment, sort of the center console. More and more large screens going into that more high function capabilities being integrated in that whether it's navigation or streaming media service is and all of those air driving again a much richer mix that's required >>for those applications. I was at the arm conference and they were talking about automotive and some of the challenges, one of the most fascinating areas they were talking about. How do you make something that will last for 20 years in the car on make it such that if it does go wrong that it that it could recover seamless less. Can you talk about some of the technologies that >>are sort of two parts to that? Unpack a little bit? First through? What does it take to succeed in automotive? First of all, it's all about quality. Yeah, right. It is quality, quality, quality location, location, location. It's quality. It's it's reducing and eliminating defense fundamentally at the end of the day and so inside of our process. Design inside of our technology designed our product designs. Our product manufacturing flows are all designed to sort of fundamentally improve and continue to improve the quality level because at the end of the day, that is what what makes or breaks you in the car. As soon as you solve that, you know, small problem. Next problem is longevity and stability of that solution, because the design cycle itself is shortening and automotive. But it's a very long design cycle, and then the life cycle in automotive is still very, very long. I mean, the average car on the road in the U. S. Is 12 or 15 years old, right, and that needs to both continue to be viable but also often need toe continue shipping that product. It's gonna shipment volumes or have spares and replace. So So we have a strategy that sort of focused on both bringing those leading edge technologies that Micron has into automotive as soon as possible and that timeline is shrinking. But then also having a very long life manufacturing strategy to continue to provide those for so long. >>So you're certainly a leader in automotive. You might even be the leader. I'm not sure I have the data, but what is it you mentioned? You know, quality and those other factors. What is it that's allowing you to do so well in automotive? >>So So we are the beater for sure. We're about 40% market share, which is a little more than three times as big as the nearest competitors, right, So leader by far, really an automotive. And it's been a very long time that we're in this industry and very focused on. So it is. It is about the product mix and bringing in particular lately leading edge technology into that story. You know, we are at the very beginnings of LP five, the low power GDR five generation, where the very beginnings of that rolling out into mobile applications, its primary markets at the same time, almost literally the same time. Way air sampling and providing that into our automotive customers and our automotive partners to start beginning building their systems around L P. Five. So that time to adopt leading edge technology is rowing is shrinking very rapidly. And so we're able to provide that leading edge Tech started, coupled with that long life solution and then one of the areas, when you think about being in a 40% market share position, way air investing tremendously in sort of partnering with the customers around, essentially defining and driving the innovation that they need to deliver So way have a number of labs that we've established customer facing labs that were able to bring customers and even our customers customers. So the Auto am is directly into those labs to start looking at usage models and architectural sort of feasibility and optimization kinds of things that we could then plan into our road map to follow two or three years later. After that, >>a lot of domain expertise there, so tremendous I said the Derrick Dicker that Micron has a very large observation space. You sell to a lot of different channels and I want to ask you about industrial I ot David night. We spent a lot of time in the Enterprise and we see a lot of I t company saying, Hey, here's a box. We're gonna throw it over. We're gonna go dominate the edge anywhere you talkto operations, technology, professions there like No, we're talking about machines and equipment and it's like this whole different parlance and language. So what are you seeing? Just in terms of the ecosystem, how it's developing the sort of analog going to digital And that whole explosion? Yeah, >>again, Industrial is extremely broad market, and it means a 1,000,000,000 things toe people. Right? So So, one of the first things we have to do is sort of narrow the field a little bit, at least into specific verticals and specific areas. Way have the right product mix and opportunity, right? So, for example, in the in the space of factory automation, it's a little bit what you're just saying the operational technology guys are trying to figure out how they're gonna drive efficiency, drive productivity inside a factory on, and that is often a question of instrument ing, and putting in my crown is doing a lot of this sort of smart manufacturing deployment. Putting this sensor network multiple cameras, multiple high resolution cameras, audio sensors, accelerometers, sort of sensors and capturing all of that sensor data to Dr Things like better predictive maintenance, better sort of yield detection or excursion detection kind of capability. So you could tell this machine, you know, seven days, five days out of the week Sounds like this. But last night at 10 o'clock, it started sounding different way. Don't know what it means necessarily, but we can detect that. And that's where all of the A I and Machine Learning is now being applied to say. And that means it's due for a P M. About this particular portion of >>what about security at the edge, obviously a hot topic in the Enterprise on every C. I ose mind what's happening with security in Io ti industrial out in the edge. Yeah, I think >>to some extent, security in the I. O. T. I think is, is why I ot is where it is in the hype cycles. Maybe it's sort of still at the bottom of one of these types cycles, meaning solving that increasing security problem, that cyber security problem that the edge is really a big problem. You saw you know the hacks a few years back of the Jeep charity. You saw the hack two years back on surveillance cameras. All these cameras moving toe i p surveillance cameras means they're now connected and open to the world. Dispersed. He just announced last week in a report that basically showed I ot specific hacks up seven fold or seven fold this year after being up tenfold last year. So it's absolutely a growing problem for people thinking about deploying again. Connectivity is a great tool in a great weapon, Depending. And I was so so. One of my crown is doing is is way. >>Have a >>solution called authentic, which is essentially a cybersecurity, is a secure element built into the non volatile memory that goes in each one of these systems. So today, security is not a one chip problem. It is a full and and system problem. And so what we're tryingto build with that is the capability at a very sort of lowest level in the system right where the code is right where the four part of the system is to protect that in the memory itself and sort of a test that that is safe and secure. And then the system can build out about around that. And that sort of simple boot device, in the case of a nor device or Anand device is in every embedded application >>right in the world, >>right? I mean, you think about you go back a long way, Stuxnet. You know, 10 plus years ago with a seaman's controller, which was the and now you think about fast forward, how much Maur infrastructure is out there? How much more complicated it is, It's ah, it's a scary situation is Oh, it is so that we think that's a >>big opportunity. And we're making the announcement later, uh, later in the show today, on an extension of what we're doing already in that space. >>I know you're working with other vendors. People like >>me are worry with Yes, >>it is really >>an end to end. >>This is really an end to an an ecosystem >>activity, for sure, because again, arm is a great example. You know, all of the S o. C. Vendors. You know, everybody in this industry has some slice of the of the rules. Let's say to figure out how they're going to secure this system and we're tryingto build a basic building block that they can then build on >>that when we started this morning was really quiet. But the crowd is rolling in. Now there's a buzz that you can hear, hear. The key was excited to be here, Jeff. Thanks very much for coming on. The king here to see you again. >>Very much nicer here. >>All right. Keep it right to everybody. We're gonna be taking a short break. We'll be back. Day long coverage wall to Wall of Micron inside. 2019. You're watching the cube.

>> from Austin, Texas. It's Theo Cube, covering your storage. Accelerate 2019. Brought to you by pure storage. >> Hi, Lisa Martin with the Cube. Dave Ilan Taste. My co host were at pure Accelerate 2019 in Austin, Texas. One of our Cube alumni is back with us. We have probably the VP and chief architect at Pier Storage. Rob. Welcome back. >> Thanks for having. >> We're glad you have a voice. We know how challenging these events are with about 3000 partners, customers press everybody wanting to talk to one of the men that was on the keynote stage yesterday for announcements came out really enjoyed yesterday's keynote. But let's talk about one of those announcements in particular Piers Bridge to the hybrid cloud. >> Absolutely, absolutely. Yeah. No, I mean, I think it's been a really exciting conference for us so far. Like you said, a lot of payload coming out, you know, as faras the building, the bridge of the hybrid cloud. This has been, you know, this has been I would say a long time coming, right? We've been working down this path for for a couple of years. We started by bringing some of the cloud like capabilities that customers really wanted and were able to achieve into the cloud back into the data center. Right. So you saw us do this in terms of making our own prem products easier to manage, easier to use, easier to automate, you know. But what? Working with customers of the last couple of years, you know, we realized, is that, uh as the cloud hype kind of subsided and people were taking a more measured view of where the cloud fits into their strategies, what tools it brings. You know, we realized that we could add value in the public cloud environment, the same types of enterprise capabilities, the same type of features rich data service is feature sets things like that that we do on premise in the cloud. And so what we're looking to achieve is actually quite simple, all right. We want to give customers the choice whether whether customers want to run on premise or in the cloud. That's just a choice of we wanted. We wanted to make an environmental choice. We don't want it. We don't wanna put customers in a position where they have to make that choice and feel trapped in one location another because of lack of features, lack of capabilities. You know, our economics on DSO the way that we do that is by building the same types of capabilities that we do on Prem in the cloud giving customers the freedom and flexibility to be agile. >> But, you know, you mentioned economics and you were talking from a customer standpoint. I wanna flip it from a from a technology supplier standpoint, the economics of a vendor who traditionally cells on Prem. You would think would be better than one in the cloud. Because you gotta you pay an Amazon for all their service is or I guess, the customers paying for it. But you kind of saw your way through that. A lot of companies would be defensive on. I wonder if you could add any comment. Yeah. No, I mean so So, look, I think >> the >> hardware is only one piece of it, right? At the end of the day, you know, even our products on Prem are really they're really priced for value. Right? There were delivering value to customers in our capabilities are ease of use or simplicity. The types of applications and work close to being able. Um, and basically, everything I just said is pretty much driven by software features by bringing those same capabilities into the cloud, you know, naturally, we you know, naturally that most of that work is really in software, you know, And then, as faras comparing the economics directly of on Prem versus Cloud. You know, it's it's really no secret as the industry's gotten Maur. Understanding that, you know the cloud isn't isn't the low cost option in a lot of use cases, right? And so, rather than comparing apples to apples on premises cloud either on performance or economics, our goal is really to build the best products in either environment. So if a customer wants to run on Prem wanna build the best darn products in that environment, the customer wants to run in the public cloud. We want to build the best darn product for them in that environment on dhe. Increasingly, as customers want Thio use, both environments hand in hand, want to build the right capabilities to allow them. TOC mostly do that >> Well, I think it makes sense because, as you know, we're talking to some customers. Last night he asking what they have in their data center. And they got a lot of stuff in the data center. To the extent that a company like pure can say, OK, you've got simple, fast et cetera on prim. And we've now extended that to the cloud. Your choice. They're going to spend Maur with you than they are with the guys that fight that. >> Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, I think if you look at our approach and how we've built the products and how were, you know, taking them to market? We've taken a very different approach than some of the competitive set. You know, in some ways, we've really just extended the same way that we think about innovation and product engineering from our existing on prime portfolio into the cloud, which is we look for heart problems to solve way take the hard road, we build differentiated products. Even if it takes us a little bit longer, you can see that, you know, in the product offerings, right? We've really focused on enabling tier one mission critical applications. If you look at the competitive, said they haven't started their their reason why we did that. All right, is we knew that you know, we had customers telling us, like if if you're a customer and you want to use the cloud and you want to think about the cloud is a D R site well, when something goes wrong and you two fell over duty, our site, you you need to be sure that it works exactly the same way there as it did on problem. That's everything from data service is data path features to all of the work flows. An orchestration to go around it because when your primary site goes down is not the time when you want to be discovering that. Oh, there's a footnote on that future and it's that's not supported in the cloud version, that sort of thing on dso you know that, Like I said, you know, the focus that we've put on the product development we've done towards Cloud Block stores really been around creating the same level of enterprise grade features on enabling those applications in the cloud as we do in private. >> You know, we don't make the Amazon storage. We make the Amazon storage better. What's that commercial? Essentially what? That's essentially >> what we've done You know, the great thing about that is that we've done it in close partnership with Amazon, right? You know, we had Amazon on stage yesterday on day, were talking a little bit about that partnership process. And ultimately, I think why that partnership has been so successful is we're both ultimately driven by the same thing, which is customer success. All right. In the early days of working with Amazon as we started coming up with the concept of club block store and consulting them on, we're thinking about building it this way. What do you think? What service is should be, You know, should we leverage and m in eight of us to make this happen? It became pretty clear to them that we were setting out to build a differentiated product and not just tick off check boxes on dhe. That's when they their eyes really okay, way. We really would like you to do a differentiated product here. >> Hey, if this takes off, we're gonna sell all the C two at three. >> What are some of the things Sorry day that you've been with here about six years? What are some of the things that have surprised you pleasantly that the customers have catalysed from an architecture perspective that customer feedback coming back t your team and the and the guys and girls engineering the product. Customers are demanding a certain thing that maybe wasn't something that was an internal idea but really was catalyzed by customers anything that just really I think it's very cool. Very surprising. >> Yeah. No, I mean, I think I think a >> couple of things. I think personally one of the things that surprised me was, you know, when I joined Pure in 2013 you know, we're all we're all about simplicity, right? You talk to cause who I think you had on the show earlier. You know, in the early days who tell you our differentiators gonna be simplicity and I got to say when I first joined the company is a little skeptical is like All right, I get it. Simplicity is a thing. Is it really a differentiator? I very quickly was surprised based on customer feedback that no, it really is very, very meaningful on. And that's something that we take all the way through Engineering. Write everything down, Thio how we design features and put them in the user interfaces. If there's, you know, there's an engineer that wants to put a configuration hook or a knob or ah on option in the user interface way kind of stop and say, Well, G, how would you document that? How would you suggest the user make a decision? Tea set that value will describe and say, Okay, well, g, we can make that decision, can't we? Right? Like, why don't we just want we just make it simpler And so that's been That's been a big surprise, I think, from a customer catalyzed, uh, point of view. What I'd say is we've been really surprised at a lot of the use cases that the flash blade product has been put into play for. And, you know, I think a I was one of them when we when we first set out, we had really targeted Flash played at addressing a segment of the commercial HPC Chip Design Hardware Design software development market. Andi is actually a set of customers, very large Web property customer that came to us with an A I use case. They said, Hey, you know, we've got a ton of data video images, uh, text postings. And we want to do a lot of analysis of this. All right, I want to do a facial recognition. We want to do content and sentiment analysis. We've got the Jeep use. We think you guys have the right storage product for that, and that's really that's really taken off. And that was very much a customer driven area. We >> talked a little bit about that within video yesterday. About some of the customer catalyzed innovation where a is concerned. >> Absolutely. What do you see is the critical technical skills that pure needs in the next decade. I mean, you're five. Correct? Remember, you can't have a networking background. Internal networking, I guess of you got guys from Veritas, right? Obviously strong software file system. What do you What do you see is the critical skill. Yeah, that's >> a good question. You know, we have a very diverse team, all right? We we in engineering typically higher and look for people with strong systems, backgrounds that are willing to learn and want to solve her problems. We, you know, typically haven't hired very specific domain areas myself, my doctor, and is in language run times and compilers, Oh, distributed systems so a bit all over the map, You know, What I'd say is that the first phase of pure the first kind of decade was really about reinventing the storage experience on for me. I look at it as taking lessons from the consumer experience, bringing him into the storage on Enterprise World. Three iPhones, example. That's used a lot. There's a couple of examples you can think of. I think the next phase of what we're trying to do and you heard Charlie talk about this on stage with a modern date experience is take some lessons from the cloud experience and bring them into the enterprise. Right? So the first phase is about consumer simplicity for a human think the next phase is really about bring in some more of the cloud experience for enabling automation and dev ops and management orchestration. >> So what kind of work? A long, long, lot of work to do to get we envisioned this massively scalable distributed system where you have that cloud experience no matter where your data lives, that's not there today, Um, and you don't want to ship your date around, it'd be too much data. So you're on a ship metadata and have the intelligence tow. Bring the compute to that. That data. >> What do you >> got to do? What's the work that you have to do to actually make that seamless? That there's that over word overuse word again. It's not seamless today. Yeah, >> so? So, look, I mean, I think there's there's a lot of angles to it right on. And we're gonna We're gonna work our way there to your point. You know, it's not there today, but, you know, you're you're starting to see us lay the groundwork with all the announcements that came out today, right under the umbrella of Hey, we want to end up creating more portable, more seamless, more agile experience for customers. You can see where, as we bring Maur storage media's into play different classes of service, different balances of performance and cost, bringing those together in a way so that an application can use them income in the right combinations, you know, bring a I into play to help customers do that seamlessly and transparently eyes a big part of it. You can see multiple location kind of agility that we're bringing into play with Claude Block >> store >> enabled, like loud snap and snap shot mobility. Things like that on Dhe. Then you know, I think, as we move beyond the block world and way look att, what we can able with applications that sit on top of file on object protocols. There's a lot of, ah, a lot of greenfield there, right? So you know, we think object storage is very attractive, and we're starting to see that as the application vendors, right, as the applications that sit on top of the storage layer are really embracing object storage as the cloud native storage interface, if you will, that's creating a lot of, ah, a lot of, uh, you know, a lot of ways to share data, right? We're starting to see it, even within the data center, where multiple applications now are able to share data because object storage is being used. And so, like I said, there's a lot of angles to this right. There's there's bringing multiple discreet A raise together under the same management plane. There's bringing multiple different types of storage media a little bit closer together from a seamless application mobility perspective. There's bring multiple locations, data centers, clouds together from a migration a d R perspective. And then there's, you know, there's bringing a global name space type of capability to the table, so it's a long journey. But you know, we think it's the right one. And you know what we ultimately want to do is, you know, have customers be able to think about, be ableto provisioned, be able to manage to not just an array, but really more of like an A Z, right. I want a pool. I want it to be about a fast. But you know, I'm willing to pay about yea much for it, and I need this types of data protection policies for it. Please make it happen >> and anywhere do you So you see, it is technically feasible to be able to run any app, any workload on any cloud or on Prem without having a re compile the application, make changes to the application. That's what I really kind of meant by Seamus that you see that as technically feasible in the next called 5 to 10 years, I'll give you I think >> I think it'll take a long wait a long time we'll get there. And I think, you know, I think it'll depend on the application. All right. I think there are gonna be some combinations that look. I mean, if if you have a high, high frequency, low latent see trading database, there's physical limitations, you're not going to run the application here and put the storage in the cloud. But if we if we step back from it, right, the concept, Yeah. I mean, I think that a lot of a lot of things are becoming possible to make this happen, right? Fastener networking is everywhere. It's getting faster application architectures and making it more feasible. You know, the media costs and what we're able to drive out of the media are bringing a lot a lot more than work leads to flash A eyes is coming into play. So, like I said, it's gonna be different on the on the application. But, you know, I think we're entering a phase where, you know, the modern software developer doesn't wanna have to think too hard about where is you know where physically what six sides of sheet metal is. My dad is sitting on. They want to think about what I need from it. What do we need from in terms of capacity, what we need from it in terms of performance, what we need from it in terms of data service capabilities. All right, ends, you know, And I need to be able to control that elastic Lee. I need to be able to control that through my application through software, and that's kind of what we're building towards. >> Last question, Rob, as we wrap up here, feedback that you've heard the last day and 1/2 on some of the news that came out yesterday from customers, analysts, partners. >> Yeah, you know, I'd say if I were to net it out. I think the one piece of you, Doc, we've gotten this. Wow, you guys have a lot of stuff on. It's really nice to see you guys talking about stuff. It's available today, right? That >> that's a >> lot of eyes on that screen. And, you know, I think I had a KN analysts say to me, You know, this is it's really refreshing. Thio kind of See you guys take a both you know, the viewpoint of the customer. What you're delivering the customer, what you're enabling on then be, You know, I got a lot of tech conferences and I hear a lot about, like, way off in the future. Envisioned Andi feedback we got was you guys had a really good balance of reality today. What, You're helping customers today? What's available today to do that? And enough of the hay. And here's where we're headed. So >> we actually heard the same thing. So good stuff, right? Well, congrats on the 10th anniversary, and we appreciate you joining us on the Cube. We look forward to next year already in whatever city. You're gonna take us to >> two. Thanks a lot. >> All right. For day, Volante. I'm Lisa Martin. You're watching the Cube. Thanks for watching.

>> Welcome back everybody. Jeff Frick here with theCUBE. We're in Mountain View, CA at Knightscope, a really interesting company that's making autonomous vehicles. They're not cars, they're robots, and they're for security. And they're deployed and they're in use, I think it's 15 states or 14 states all over the country, just closed a huge round of funding. A lot of great momentum, and we're really excited to be rejoined by Cube alumni Mercedes Soria, she is the VP Software Engineer. Mercedes, great to see you again. >> Thank you for having me. >> Absolutely, well thanks. We had you at the studio last time so thanks for having us over here where all the action's happening. >> Yeah, you're welcome to come anytime. >> So for the people that missed the first interview, just give them a quick overview of what Knightscope's all about. >> We build autonomous security robots. Those are machines, they are running around autonomously, collecting video, collecting signals like thermal signals, the signal from your phone, and collecting a bunch of information that then is transformed into a webpage that a customer can see. So they get alerts to anything that is out of the ordinary. >> So, the application is often in a mall, or in a parking lot or some of these types of places where it's really an ongoing patrol that the robot does. >> Yeah typically what you want a robot to do is the monotonous work. So, at a mall, the security guard walks around all day long, and most of the time nothing happens. So when something happens, only then you want to be notified. Otherwise, it's just a guard that walks around. So that's the job that the autonomous robots do. >> And is there somebody monitoring all of the sensors and stuff all the time, or is it more of an alert system, or is it kind of all over the map? >> It depends on our client. For example, we always monitor all the robots. We get alert systems set up so if anything happens to a robot, we will be notified. But on top of that, some of our customers like to see their video 24 hours a day to see what's going on at their facilities. Some other clients only want the security presence, so they don't look at video. It really just depends on what the client wants. >> What's the big difference by having a Knightscope robot versus just security cameras that are just pointing and on all the time. >> If you have a steady camera, by default it just doesn't move, so you can't cover that much space. You're only going to see that one box that the security camera is covering. With an autonomous machine, you can take it wherever the crime is happening; you see something is wrong, you move the machine over and you take a closer look. So it does a lot more than just this one square that you can look at all the time, you can see everything around the machine, it's 360 degree video that is running 24-7. >> And how does it impact the way that the security people do their job? Let's stick with the mall example. When you've introduced a Knightscope robot, what's the right word, is robot the right word, is it robot? >> It's a robot, yes. >> When you've introduces a Knightscope robot into a mall situation, how does that change the way that people do their jobs? >> The robot will do about 70 or so percent of what a security guard does. But now the guard, instead of having to go and walk around the mall all day long, they get to do a more interesting job So now they're more interested in robots, they know technology, they get to know how to deal with a machine, how to interact with people. Those are things of a higher level. If the machine does all of the monotonous and boring work that the guard does. So at the end of the day, that guard does something that is a lot higher level than what they were doing before. >> Do customers typically have fewer guards, the guards just doing more higher-value, how does it impact their whole security system once they bring in a Knightscope robot? >> It could be one of two things. There are some places that our customers have zero, zero, zero patrolling, so they have nothing. So in that case, if the robot comes in, now you have security that you didn't have before. Some of our other clients, they decide that one of the robots is going to do the job of maybe three people, but those three people now are doing administrator work. So their work is to become of a higher level, so it depends on the client a lot. >> We've got a bunch of the robots behind us here in the shop, I'm sure we'll have them in the intro packet, the different ones. You've got four different ones. First off let's do some of the basics: What are some of the sensors, what are some of the inputs that they are collecting, and why do you have four different ones? >> A lot of why we have four ones is because we wanted to give the customer security regardless of their environment. The first one is the K3, that's an indoor machine; it's a smaller size, it weighs about 340 pounds. >> Small one and you say it weighs 340 pounds? >> Yes, that's the small one. >> No little kids are running up and tipping that one over I don't think. >> No, they're not. People have tried, but not yet. That is for indoors. It has all of the sensors that our other machines have, they all have a thermal detection. They have their regular cameras. They have inertia measuring units. They have lighters, which is what allows you to tell that there is something in your way, that you have to get out of the way. We have ASD, which is Automated Signal Detections. Your phone emits a signal when it's trying to connect to Wifi. We can detect all of those phone signals, and then we can log that into the server. All of the machines have that, it's just how they are using in a different environment. Indoor for the K3, outdoor for the K5, we have the K1, which is a static unit. That's typically going to be put in the door of the places we're going to monitor. And then we have the K7, which is the largest unit that we have so far, and it's going to places that a machine that's smaller cannot typically transverse. >> So that's the one that looks like a little Jeep back here. >> Yeah, in a wind farm, in a solar farm, these machines don't do very well, and that's when these machines go in. >> So definitely for outside >> Outside-- >> On the road, in the dirt >> Large companies-- >> It doesn't have to be in a parking lot, in a paved environment. >> Gravel, any different type of environment. >> What is the experience, why do these things work? Is it just because you have more coverage because you've got a robot that's going places you don't have enough guards? Is it the intimidation that someone is watching me now, you're bringing a camera into the parking lot where maybe it was kind of hidden behind a little wall? Is there a two-way interaction, do people talk to these things and expect them to talk back? Where do you see the most effective, why are these things effective? >> The reason why they're more effective can be summarized in one point: Security guards don't like to do their job. There is a 300% turnover rate in the security industry, people don't normally know that. So you're getting a new team every four months. People don't like their job, it's a job that is very monotonous, very boring. We're putting a robot there to do the same job, so you can free people to do something of a higher level. And that's the main reason why they work. >> I wonder if you can speak a little to where you're using machine learning and some of the deeper technology beyond simply putting a camera on a mobile platform. >> Some of our customers, for example, at night at the malls or corporate campuses, there isn't supposed to be anyone there at night. So one of the big applications that we have is we have an image, and from that image we can train our algorithms to detect people in that image, to detect faces in that image. All of that is done by machine learning. Because we have five years of data of images and people and we train our algorithms to say, this is a pole, or this is a person, this is a tree, this is a person. So we get to detect people in a really high accuracy level, about 80%. We also do the same thing with license plates. We train our algorithms to detect that there's a license plate in an image, you detect that there's a car first, then you detect that there's a license plate, and from there you detect all of the character in that license plate. And all of that uses machine learning, even to differentiate that there is a number one opposed to a letter L. All of that had to be trained as the technologies that we're using. For the future, we're going to use prediction algorithms in the way that, now we have data of what happens around the location where the machine is deployed to. We're going to be able to say, "Okay, this area has a lot of crime that happens "on a daily basis or however often, "you probably should go patrol over in that area." That is what we will do in the future. >> The other interesting thing is you don't sell these, these are not for sale as like, going to buy a car, you actually provide it as a service. So a very different business model, very much in line with what we see more and more, it's a service, people basically rent the robot with the monitoring service? Is that accurate, or are there lots of different flavors that they can buy? >> What we do is called machine as a service. To eliminate our customers having to pay a big amount of money at the beginning, they don't cover that cost, we do. But they pay us a monthly bill. Included in that monthly bill is the machine itself, all the parts, the monitor in there with the one on our end, all of the software upgrades, which we do every two weeks, and all of the hardware upgrades, which we do every six months to every year. All of that is included in that package. How the customers chooses to monitor their machines, that is up to them. We have agreements with two of the largest security guard companies: Securitas and Allied Universal, so they can do the monitoring for the customer if they don't have a security operation center. >> Clearly, you're operating in places where they already have security in place, they have systems, so do you integrate with the existing alert systems and the existing infrastructure they already have in place, do you guys just tie into that? I would imagine there's some industry APIs that you can feed into those systems or is it a completely independent monitoring that they have to do now? >> We did a little bit of the reverse of that, we built our system for it to be integrable. The way we wrote our code, a customer system developer can call our APIs and get the information from the machine that way, so all of that is finished so they can integrate with us opposed to us integrating the other, there's hundreds of systems out there. So if somebody wants to look at data from Knightscope that's already there. >> But you've got the open API into your data feed so they can feed whatever system. >> It of course is secure, you have to have keys and passwords and codes, and all of the information is encrypted So there's measurements that we've taken to make sure that the information is secure at all times. >> So you're a hardware company, you're a software company, you're a services company, you're doing AI. >> Woman: We're doing design too. >> And design, and autonomous vehicles. >> Yes. >> What did I miss? >> Production! We build. >> Production too? >> We build. Yes. >> That's right, I noticed this says on the bottom, reminds me of an Apple product-- >> It is designed and built in California. 85% of what you see in this machine is United States. >> Pretty amazing. So what's next? What's the next big challenge? I know the Seven is not released yet, is it just more form factors, is it different sensors? As you kind look forward from an engineering challenge, what is some of the next big hills that you guys want to take to move this thing along? >> The three next big hills that we have: Number one is getting the K7 out there and patrolling. Number two is concealed weapon detection, that has been requested by a lot of our customers. >> Concealed weapons detection? >> A lot of our customers are requesting that. And third, on the software side of things, the actual prediction of crime that could potentially happen. Those are the next three big goals for Knightscope. >> I would imagine that with the concealed weapons it's just more types of sensors that can see X-rays or whatever to get more visibility. >> Yes. >> The big V. Not necessarily visible light, but visibility from the machine. >> Some of those things have already been requested by our customers, because what we've build is actually a platform. We can add other sensors to the machine depending on the needs of a customer. For example, we have a customer who wanted the machine to be able to identify people, so they wouldn't have to swipe a card. Put the sensor inside, it's accessible, it's already there, you get your sensor and your information. What's the biggest surprise that you hear from customers after they've had one of these deployed for, I don't know what's a reasonable time, six months, so they're kind of used to it in their workflow, how does it really their world, what do they tell you? >> There are two things, number one is how quickly people like the machine, how quickly they go, "Oh, yeah, it's here and it's working." And then also how much crime has actually been eliminated. They thought, "Okay, maybe I have one break-in into "a car every week, well maybe it will just go to less." It goes down to zero. There's people who had lots of crime, and just by the machine being there, they get nothing, they get zero. So that was our surprise for them, and that was a surprise for us as well. That's how the effective the machine actually is. >> It's weird when I just drove up today, there was one right in the middle of the driveway as I was coming in. I was like, "Is it going to move, am I going to move?" It's very, much more intimidating than you might think. It's a presence, for sure. >> Yeah, and we have things like car backup detection, because the machine could be going down the street, and a car could be coming out of there, so we have to detect stuff like that so we don't get run over. All of those little things that we can think of, we have to do that a lot. >> Alright Mercedes, well thanks for inviting us over, it's fun to actually see the machines for real. >> Thank you so much for coming. >> She's Mercedes, I'm Jeff Frick, you're watching theCUBE, we're at Knightscope in Mountain View, California. (upbeat music)

>> Hey welcome back everybody. Jeff Frick here with theCUBE One of our favorite things to do is go out and visit a lot of the cool innovation companies that are all around us here in Silicon Valley. It's a real blessing to be here. We can do it. And so we're really excited to come here today to Nightscope. They are doing so many interesting things that combine software hardware autonomous vehicles, artificial intelligence security a lot of the topics that we talked about all the time sometimes in the general terms. And here it's real. You can feel it. You can touch it. Don't try to not get over, it way too much. But we're excited to be here. We've got the founder he's the chairman and CEO William Santana Li of Knightscope. Great to see you William. >> Welcome a night scope headquarters. Good to have you here. >> Well first off congratulations on the recently announced funding that's good. >> Thank you. It's our fourth round of funding. So we're using that capital to scale across the country. We're now holding contracts in about 14 states and the companies are now starting to accelerate our growth. So we're pretty excited about that. >> So nothing do the whole history but kind of where you come kind of when did you start when did the first one get deployed. And now you're about ready to launch your fourth model. >> Sure, the company started April of 2013. When we started basically we got the first initial round of comments from all sorts of interesting folks.... Bill, you're out of your mind; This will never work; Security is not an investment thesis; You'll need 50 million dollars to build the first one; Oh and by the way it's too complicated; It's hardware and software you should pick one. And like most good entrepreneurs we ignored everyone and just did what we said we were going to do. So we deployed in the real world. Let's see, May 2015 was the first one that actually was out, operating 24/7, and that seems like so long ago but also just recently as well. >> But you really had bitten off a huge chunk of challenges, right, because you have the hardware piece and they're not only hardware, like a computer, but it's a vehicle goes outside it's in the weather. You've got the software piece, you've got the sensors piece, you've got the monitoring. So you did did bite off quite a chunk, and then you're really delivering it as a solution. So you know you're putting all these things together very much like the first iPhone. >> Yes, probably two comments: one, clients don't care about all that they just want their problem fixed. And so whatever it's going to take to fix that problem; in their particular cases it's crime. And second, I'm going X Ford Motor Company executive, spent 10 years in Detroit a little bit fluent in say large scale hardware outdoors. And for me these are lot easier than building a car. Let's put it that way. >> That's right, no people no glass No. No airbags. Things out. OK. But it begs the question how did you get to the design. Cause they're very distinctive. You know they do look like R2D2, some of the mid tier ones, you've got the stationary and this really cool Jeep-looking one back here. How did you come up with designs what were some of your initial thoughts >> Well first of all we design we engineer we build we deploy we support everything start to in-house. So maybe a little background we have a challenge similar to a law enforcement officer or a law enforcement officer and it's a command respect and authority. Shiny shoes stand up straight. But you cannot scare grandma you cannot scare the child. These are not military products so you need to be able to operate within society. So we spent maybe way too much time worrying about every little font every radius every surface color treatment everything else because part of it is putting that physical presence there to deter negative behavior. But at the same time it needs to be inviting enough to be accepted by society so that when and may are 15 when we first put the one out we were worried like what's going to happen are people going to go nuts or or what we didn't expect and ended up happening was a massive amount of robot selfies everyone's wanting to take a picture with the robot. So maybe put it a different way if you showed up today and the machines patrolling outside were painted black with red LEDs glowing with an ominous sound moving ten times faster than they probably wouldn't be sitting here talking. All right >> Exactly. I was scared by the white one when I pulled this afternoon. >> But we need to provide again that genetical presence and the turns it needs to be accepted by society. >> The next thing I think it's really interesting is the business model and I'm sure when you talk to your investors after they told you you were crazy for doing software to create a system then fracturing they probably said you know what's the business model how are you going to support these things how expensive are they going to be for a capital investment point of view. How about maintenance and ongoing upgrades. But you said forget that we're going to go as a service. So if you could tell us a little bit about that decision and how that's impacted your customer relationships. >> So we offer our technology and machine as a service business model so that gives you the machine the data transfer data storage analysis user interface. All the hardware software upgrades all the maintenance service everything one throat to choke were responsible. So one of the things we want to do for our clients is we don't want you setting up the robot robot maintenance service division right. We need. They're already busy. We've got plenty on their plate. All the security officers and our staffs. So we need to be able to empower them and not add more workload to them. So from a service standpoint that works well too. We're at the bleeding cutting edge of technology. If we were to offer it on our purchase type of arrangement let's just say I spent a lot of time in Detroit we could barely cover our cost of capital selling hardware. And that's probably not a good business model to go after long term. So if we can provide a lot more value to the client and then also retain the authority over the assets and be able to upgrade it. And as most technology around here in Silicon Valley it's better and better and better and better as Mercedes mentioned we dropped the software every two weeks on new hardware 3 6 9 months. So the clients continue to get improved technology and then from a security standpoint we want to make sure given the nature of the product that all the assets are under our control. >> It's interesting too I think that I think something that's not spoken about enough is when you have a services relationship with your client and I assume it's a monthly or a quarterly or whatever you structure your payment system. It forces you to maintain a great relationship. It forces you to continue to deliver value when they are you know writing about the feedback loop is the feedback loop is really important. >> So we signed one to three year long contracts and we had quarterly business reviews with our clients and we get to learn real time and we get real time input. So yeah after the transaction the contract signed that's when the work begins. When we get to celebrate we get to celebrate when our clients win. >> Right. So don't tell me the secret sauce or you can't tell me but I'm just curious as to where some of the real significant challenges are that people maybe don't appreciate is that the integration of these various sensors is the way that it moves. I mean what are some of the real things that make a nightscope autonomous security robot special. >> So as an ex auto executive I think self driving technology is going to turn the world completely upside down and I'm really excited to see all the massive amount our India efforts small medium large and extra large that have been going on. However we're the only company in the world that's actually scaling autonomous technology in the real world with real clients doing real work. It's easy to go build prototypes but you want machines running 24/7 in the rain. Cats dogs people cars trucks goats and sheep. And I don't know what else we've seen. That's a whole other level of engineering and fortunately we've been able to operate in that manner for a very long time depending on who you believe. Autonomous are self driving vehicles require a fail over a human one meaning 30 to 70 percent of the times the algorithms fail someone needs to take over. Despite what some people think there there is nobody in their right. >> And so we've got to we've got to be right 100 percent of the hype right. >> And 24/7 and you got to do a good enough job that it is going to pay you for it. Right. And that requires a different level of scale and a different level of discipline. >> Another question in terms of customer adoption. Well first to back up what you just said. I mean that's part of the benefit of your services model right is that you're getting feedback you get these things feel like he said as you've shipped them to heat and snow and this and that you know you're learning all the time so you actually benefit from that relationship too as opposed to just selling them something. I'm curious from the customer adoption point of view. What was the biggest hurdle that people just didn't either didn't buy it didn't expect it. I got great security guards before Mercedes told me that they'd turn over 300 cent a year. But you know clearly it's a new technology it's something new something different I would imagine there was all kind of interesting challenges to overcome. >> One is just a fundamental structure of our country. Most people don't realize that may be different than the Department of Defense. DoD has a 600 billion dollar budget. There is one person in charge. There's a massive industrial complex to build your new favorite submarine, jet fighter or what have you and they give the troops every level capability you might ever imagine and I'm fine with that. What I have a problem with is we have 2 million law enforcement professionals and security guards that get up every morning on our own soil and won't take a bullet for you and your family. And the level of technology that we provide to them as a country is certainly beneath the dignity of this nation. >> And so what I expect to happen is for us to give them the right set of tools for them to do their jobs much more effectively. The Department of Justice and Homeland Security have no federal jurisdiction over the 19000 law enforcement agencies and 8000 private security firms. There's literally no one in charge and there's basically been no innovation and space so when you ask me how you're going to get this into a clients hands. Well we basically took the thing that was on the movie screen and is now operating autonomously on your premises. Right. And that takes a little bit of gall to do that right. >> Probably the best way is showing how you can do as many videoconferences and calls and what have you but also bringing a machine to their premises and instead of having a discussion with just the chief security officer or the director of physical security or whatever it's like hey the robots here and 50 people come streaming downstairs and it's purchasing it's legal it's finance it's the CFO it's everybody who has a stake somehow of this new massive device patrolling their campus. So you get that by in that way and then now that we've got a track record of crime fighting becomes a little bit easier. >> So we've had in some cases of criminal incidents where a client is experiencing one to two vehicle thefts assaults battery you name it on the premises. We put the machine there and for the last year it's all gone down to zero. As was a Mercedes and mentioned earlier and that makes a big impact. Now when the staff says or the guards this area is so crime ridden I won't even patrol. Now this machines come here and actually made the environment that much safer. They're going to renew that contract. Right. And so the adoption starts getting stronger. Just from our own winds. And so we've now been in service and long enough they're starting to get renewals and renewals are based on merit. We had five break ins or negative things happen a month. Now it's gone down to 2 to 1 0. That makes a huge difference and it's extremely cost effective. >> Now what happens I just want to say it is a really rough neighborhood and your and your machine is patrolling in the parking lot. Certainly some bad guys must come up NATO with a baseball bat or something. I mean there's got to be a tough kind of initial reaction of some of these rough neighborhoods. I mean how do they respond. >> So you want to think of this as two different things. One these are tools for the guards to use. So majority of the clients are looking at this as adding additional capability a force multiplier to get really smart eyes and ears for the security guards to cover more ground and be able to do their jobs again more much more effectively in some cases the physical presence deters a lot of the behavior. So simply if I put a marked law enforcement vehicle in front of your home or your office right. Criminal behavior changes right. Most of these guys, and they're mostly guys, are literally just trying to get away with something and looking for the path of least resistance least resistance right. You walk up like you did today. You pull into a parking lot. I have no idea what this thing does. I don't know what it's recording like. I'll go. All right. And that's exactly what happens. And so clients get to see that that there is a net positive brand enhancing effect. So manufacturing plant a puts one in Kentucky is like hey this is kind of working. Let me call my sister plant in Mississippi. Right. And let's put one there you know mall a in San Jose decides you know this is actually working really well. These guys have helped us a lot. In one case for a different client we were able to have a law enforcement agency and issuing an arrest warrant for a sexual predator. Right. That's a huge win for us to be able to do that or there was a someone that showed up with a shotgun to basically steal someone's car. We captured all the video and everything else that nothing above 12 stories looking at the top of your head is going to be very helpful in doing gave the evidence to law enforcement. The guy was caught before he crossed the state state line. We helped the security guard apprehend thief in a retail environment. The list goes on and on and on. So you start having those kinds of wins. The next mall calls up and says Hey I heard things went really well here. How can we get a couple over here. Right. And that's that's where we are now are starting to really accelerate the growth of the company. So I would be remiss if I didn't ask the obligatory security question terms of getting act so. >> High tact everyone who wants to hack the machine they can't get a home. A little bit that kind of how's the communications work. Do they work autonomously. Do they work in teams. And you know clearly someone's going to sit outside with the laptop and on their second trip back to the parking lot. I'm going to crack this code. >> So we try to do a few things one because we don't sell these things outright. They're always in our control. Just as a basic advantage there. Second we change it often. So that gives us another advantage. Third the teams working on hardening a lot of the stuff making making sure stuff's encrypted encrypted and we only transfer a certain amount though we really need or don't need type of things and then we hire white hack a white hat hackers to try to hack the system and we make the changes accordingly. Everything as you know is hackable but we try to do our job as best possible to make these systems as secure as possible. >> So for the not-hacker, at the mall deployment, I mean how should people interact with these things how do people interact with these things in an environment where it's not necessarily the security guard who is trained and knows exactly what the capabilities are but just kind of in the wild weather be in a parking lot or at the mall I think is a bunch of stuff. >> First it's a kid magnet right. So parents can now explain in the real world why you should probably be studying math and science and yes which is an engineering is a really good thing. Second we're about to release in production a concierge's feature that allows a two way dialogue between the human and the machine. So you know walls closing in 30 minutes or where is Macy's or you know what jeans are on sale today. That sort of thing. You can also do that for authentication at a entrance for manufacturing facility. So let's say there's a K1 stationed at the entrance for a manufacturing plant of transmission parts 18 wheeler shows up at 3:00 in the morning. Compress the intercom button to a dialogue get authenticated. We have the plates we've got all the other signatures that we need. Digital or otherwise to allow that that truck in. All right. So there's all kinds of opportunities again to give the guards much more capability. So go back to the math. You have 2 million guards and officers trying to secure 300 million people across 50 states. I don't care what math you're going to come up with. It doesn't work. And by the way the population keeps growing and that taxpayers can't afford funding this stuff. You need something that's going to be the game changer in this is that game changer. Crime has a trillion dollar negative economic impact on the U.S. every single year. It's a hidden tax we all pay in blood tears and treasure and somehow society has found it acceptable that at these levels it's OK. And I don't know about you but I'm sick and tired of waking up every morning looking on my news feed to find some horrific thing happened again. And what do our political leaders do. We extend our thoughts and prayers. Hey listen buddy. No amount of thoughts and prayers are going to fix this problem. I've got a team of very dedicated engineers and patriots here working on trying to actually fix the problem so we have the honor and privilege to be able to do that every single day here in Silicon Valley. >> Well the the passion comes through Bill and clearly it's a very important mission and congrats on the new funding and I can't wait to see you deployed. >> Appreciate it. >> All right. He's Bill, I'm Jeff. We're at Nightscope. Check it in Mt. View, Thanks for watching. We'll catch you next time.