from the cube studios in Palo Alto in Boston connecting with thought leaders all around the world this is a cube conversation hi buddy welcome back to the cube this is Dave Volante and you're watching a special presentation data ops enacted made possible by IBM you know what's what's happening is the innovation engine in the IT economy is really shifted used to be Moore's Law today it's applying machine intelligence and AI to data really scaling that and operationalizing that new knowledge the challenges that is not so easy to operationalize AI and infuse it into the data pipeline but what we're doing in this program is bringing in practitioners who have actually had a great deal of success in doing just that and I'm really excited to have it Kumal a Himalayan Manali is here she's the executive head of data management or personal and business banking at Standard Bank of South Africa the tomb of length thanks so much for coming in the queue thank you for having me Dave you're very welcome and first of all how you holding up with this this bovid situation how are things in Johannesburg um things in Johannesburg are fine we've been on lockdown now I think it's day 33 if I'm not mistaken lost count and but we're really grateful for the swift action of government we we only I mean we have less than 4,000 places in the country and infection rate is is really slow so we've really I think been able to find the curve and we're grateful for being able to be protected in this way so all working from home or learning the new normal and we're all in this together that's great to hear why don't you tell us a little bit about your your role you're a data person we're really going to get into it but here with us you know how you spend your time okay well I head up a date operations function and a data management function which really is the foundational part of the data value chain that then allows other parts of the organization to monetize data and liberate it as as as the use cases apply we monetize it ourselves as well but really we're an enterprise wide organization that ensures that data quality is managed data is governed that we have the effective practices applied to the entire lineage of the data ownership and curation is in place and everything else from a regulatory as well as opportunity perspective then is able to be leveraged upon so historically you know data has been viewed as sort of this expense it's it's big it's growing it needs to be managed deleted after a certain amount of time and then you know ten years ago of the Big Data move data became an asset you had a lot of shadow I people going off and doing things that maybe didn't comply to the corporate ethics probably drove here here you're a part of the organization crazy but talk about that how what has changed but they in the last you know five years or so just in terms of how people approach data oh I mean you know the story I tell my colleague who are all bankers obviously is the fact that the banker in 1989 had to mainly just know debits credits and be able to look someone in the eye and know whether or not they'd be a credit risk or not you know if we lend you money and you pay it back the the banker of the late 90s had to then contend with the emergence of technologies that made their lives easier and allowed for automation and processes to run much more smoothly um in the early two-thousands I would say that digitization was a big focus and in fact my previous role was head of digital banking and at the time we thought digital was the panacea it is the be-all and end-all it's the thing that's gonna make organizations edit lo and behold we realized that once you've gotten all your digital platforms ready they are just the plate or the pipe and nothing is flowing through it and there's no food on the face if data is not the main photo really um it's always been an asset I think organizations just never consciously knew that data was that okay so so what sounds like once you've made that sort of initial digital transformation you really had to work it and what we're hearing from a lot of practitioners like self as challenges related to that involve different parts of the organization different skill sets of challenges and sort of getting everybody to work together on the same page it's better but maybe you could take us back to sort of when you started on this initiative around data Ops what was that like what were some of the challenges that you faced and how'd you get through them okay first and foremost Dave organizations used to believe that data was I t's problem and that's probably why you you then saw the emergence of things like chatter IP but when you really acknowledge that data is an essay just like money is an asset then you you have to then take accountability for it just the same way as you would any other asset in the organization and you will not abdicate its management to a separate function that's not cold to the business and oftentimes IT are seen as a support or an enabling but not quite the main show in most organizations right so what we we then did is first emphasize that data is a business capability the business function it presides in business makes to product management makes to marketing makes to everything else that the business needs for data management also has to be for to every role in every function to different degrees and varying bearing offense and when you take accountability as an owner of a business unit you also take accountability for the data in the systems that support the business unit for us that was the first picture um and convincing my colleagues that data was their problem and not something that we had to worry about they just kind of leave us to to it was was also a journey but that was kind of the first step into it in terms of getting the data operations journey going um you had to first acknowledge please carry on no you just had to first acknowledge that it's something you must take accountability of as a banker not just need to a different part of the organization that's a real cultural mindset you know in the game of rock-paper-scissors you know culture kinda beats everything doesn't it it's almost like a yep a trump card and so so the businesses embrace that but but what did you do to support that is there has to be trust in the data that it has to be a timeliness and so maybe you could take us through how you achieve those objectives and maybe some other objectives that business the man so the one thing I didn't mention Dave is that obviously they didn't embrace it in the beginning it wasn't a it wasn't there oh yeah that make sense they do that type of conversation um what what he had was a few very strategic people with the right mindset that I could partner with that understood the case for data management and while we had that as as an in we developed a framework for a fully matured data operations capability in the organization and what that would look like in a target date scenario and then what you do is you wait for a good crisis so we had a little bit of a challenge in that our local regulator found us a little bit wanting in terms of our date of college and from that perspective it then brought the case for data quality management so now there's a burning platform you have an appetite for people to partner with you and say okay we need this to comply to help us out and when they start seeing their opt-in action do they then buy into into the concept so sometimes you need to just wait for a good Christ and leverage it and only do that which the organization will appreciate at that time you don't have to go Big Bang data quality management was the use case at the time five years ago so we focused all our energy on that and after that it gave us leeway and license really bring to maturity all the other capabilities at the business might not well understand as well so when that crisis hit of thinking about people process in technology you probably had to turn some knobs in each of those areas can you talk about that so from a technology perspective that that's when we partnered with with IBM to implement information analyzer for us in terms of making sure that then we could profile the data effectively what was important for us is to to make strides in terms of showing the organization progress but also being able to give them access to self-service tools that will give them insight into their data from a technology perspective that was kind of I think the the genesis of of us implementing and the IBM suite in earnest from a data management perspective people wise we really then also began a data stewardship journey in which we implemented business unit stewards of data I don't like using the word steward because in my organization it's taken lightly almost like a part-time occupation so we converted them we call them data managers and and the analogy I would give is every department with a P&L any department worth its salt has a FDA or financial director and if money is important to you you have somebody helping you take accountability and execute on your responsibilities in managing that that money so if data is equally important as an asset you will have a leader a manager helping you execute on your data ownership accountability and that was the people journey so firstly I had kind of soldiers planted in each department which were data managers that would then continue building the culture maturing the data practices as as applicable to each business unit use cases so what was important is that every manager in every business unit to the Data Manager focus their energy on making that business unit happy by ensuring that they data was of the right compliance level and the right quality the right best practices from a process and management perspective and was governed and then in terms of process really it's about spreading through the entire ecosystem data management as a practice and can be quite lonely um in the sense that unless the whole business of an organization is managing data they worried about doing what they do to make money and most people in most business units will be the only unicorn relative to everybody else who does what they do and so for us it was important to have a community of practice a process where all the data managers across business as well as the technology parts and the specialists who were data management professionals coming together and making sure that we we work together on on specific you say so I wonder if I can ask you so the the industry sort of likes to market this notion of of DevOps applied to data and data op have you applied that type of mindset approach agile of continuous improvement is I'm trying to understand how much is marketing and how much actually applicable in the real world can you share well you know when I was reflecting on this before this interview I realized that our very first use case of data officers probably when we implemented information analyzer in our business unit simply because it was the first time that IT and business as well as data professionals came together to spec the use case and then we would literally in an agile fashion with a multidisciplinary team come together to make sure that we got the outcomes that we required I mean for you to to firstly get a data quality management paradigm where we moved from 6% quality at some point from our client data now we're sitting at 99 percent and that 1% literally is just the timing issue to get from from 6 to 99 you have to make sure that the entire value chain is engaged so our business partners will the fundamental determinant of the business rules apply in terms of what does quality mean what are the criteria of quality and then what we do is translate that into what we put in the catalog and ensure that the profiling rules that we run are against those business rules that were defined at first so you'd have upfront determination of the outcome with business and then the team would go into an agile cycle of maybe two-week sprints where we develop certain things have stand-ups come together and then the output would be - boarded in a prototype in a fashion where business then gets to go double check that out so that was the first iterate and I would say we've become much more mature at it and we've got many more use cases now and there's actually one that it's quite exciting that we we recently achieved over the end of of 2019 into the beginning of this year so what we did was they I'm worried about the sunlight I mean through the window you look creative to me like sunset in South Africa we've been on the we've been on CubeSat sometimes it's so bright we have to put on sunglasses but so the most recent one which was in in mates 2019 coming in too early this year we we had long kind of achieved the the compliance and regulatory burning platform issues and now we are in a place of I think opportunity and luxury where we can now find use cases that are pertinent to business execution and business productivity um the one that comes to mind is we're a hundred and fifty eight years old as an organization right so so this Bank was born before technology it was also born in the days of light no no no integration because every branch was a standalone entity you'd have these big ledges that transactions were documented in and I think once every six months or so these Ledger's would be taken by horse-drawn carriage to a central place to get go reconcile between branches and paper but the point is if that is your legacy the initial kind of ERP implementations would have been focused on process efficiency based on old ways of accounting for transactions and allocating information so it was not optimized for the 21st century our architecture had has had huge legacy burden on it and so going into a place where you can be agile with data is something that we constantly working toward so we get to a place where we have hundreds of branches across the country and all of them obviously telling to client servicing clients as usual and and not being able for any person needing sales teams or executional teams they were not able in a short space of time to see the impact of the tactic from a database fee from a reporting history and we were in a place where in some cases based on how our Ledger's roll up and the reconciliation between various systems and accounts work it would take you six weeks to verify whether your technique were effective or not because to actually see the revenue hitting our our general ledger and our balance sheet might take that long that is an ineffective way to operate in a such a competitive environment so what you had our frontline sales agents literally manually documenting the sales that they had made but not being able to verify whether that or not is bringing revenue until six weeks later so what we did then is we sat down and defined all the requirements were reporting perspective and the objective was moved from six weeks latency to 24 hours um and even 24 hours is not perfect our ideal would be that bite rows of day you're able to see what you've done for that day but that's the next the next epoch that will go through however um we literally had the frontline teams defining what they'd want to see in a dashboard the business teams defining what the business rules behind the quality and the definitions would be and then we had an entire I'm analytics team and the data management team working around sourcing the data optimising and curating it and making sure that the latency had done that's I think only our latest use case for data art um and now we're in a place where people can look at a dashboard it's a cubed self-service they can learn at any time I see the sales they've made which is very important right now at the time of covert nineteen from a form of productivity and executional competitiveness those are two great use cases of women lying so the first one you know going from data quality 6% the 99% I mean 6% is all you do is spend time arguing about the data bills profanity and then 99% you're there and you said it's just basically a timing issue use latency in the timing and then the second one is is instead of paving the cow path with an outdated you know ledger Barret data process week you've now compressed that down to 24 hours you want to get the end of day so you've built in the agility into your data pipeline I'm going to ask you then so when gdpr hit were you able to very quickly leverage this capability and and apply and then maybe other of compliance edik as well well actually you know what we just now was post TDP our us um and and we got GDP all right about three years ago but literally all we got right was reporting for risk and compliance purposes they use cases that we have now are really around business opportunity lists so the risk so we prioritize compliance report a long time it but we're able to do real-time reporting from a single transaction perspective I'm suspicious transactions etc I'm two hours in Bank and our governor so from that perspective that was what was prioritize in the beginning which was the initial crisis so what you found is an entire engine geared towards making sure that data quality was correct for reporting and regulatory purposes but really that is not the be-all and end-all of it and if that's all we did I believe we really would not have succeeded or could have stayed dead we succeeded because Dana monetization is actually the penis' t the leveraging of data for business opportunity is is actually then what tells you whether you've got the right culture or not you're just doing it to comply then it means the hearts and minds of the rest of the business still aren't in the data game I love this story because it's me it's nirvana for so many years we've been pouring money to mitigate risk and you have no choice do it you know the general council signs off on it the the CFO but grudgingly signs off on it but it's got to be done but for years decades we've been waiting to use these these risk initiatives to actually drive business value you know it kind of happened with enterprise data warehouse but it was too slow it was complicated and it certainly didn't happen with with email archiving that was just sort of a tech balk it sounds like you know we're at that point today and I want to ask you I mean like you know you we talking earlier about you know the crisis gonna perpetuated this this cultural shift and you took advantage of that so we're out who we the the mother nature dealt up a crisis like we've never seen before how do you see your data infrastructure your data pipeline your data ops what kind of opportunities do you see in front of you today as a result of ovid 19 well I mean because of of the quality of kind data that we had now we were able to very quickly respond to to pivot nineteen in in our context where the government put us on lockdown relatively early in in the curve or in the cycle of infection and what it meant is it brought a little bit of a shock to the economy because small businesses all of a sudden didn't have a source of revenue or potentially three to six weeks and based on the data quality work that we did before it was actually relatively easy to be agile enough to do the things that we did so within the first weekend of of lockdown in South Africa we were the first bank to proactively and automatically offer small businesses and student and students with loans on our books a instant three month payment holiday assuming they were in good standing and we did that upfront though it was actually an opt-out process rather than you had to fall in and arrange for that to happen and I don't believe we would have been able to do that if our data quality was not with um we have since made many more initiatives to try and keep the economy going to try and keep our clients in in a state of of liquidity and so you know data quality at that point and that Dharma is critical to knowing who you're talking to who needs what and in which solutions would best be fitted towards various segments I think the second component is um you know working from home now brings an entirely different normal right so so if we had not been able to provide productivity dashboard and and and sales and dashboards to to management and all all the users that require it we would not be able to then validate or say what our productivity levels are now that people are working from home I mean we still have essential services workers that physically go into work but a lot of our relationship bankers are operating from home and that face the baseline and the foundation that we said productivity packing for various methods being able to be reported on in a short space of time has been really beneficial the next opportunity for us is we've been really good at doing this for the normal operational and front line and type of workers but knowledge workers have also know not necessarily been big productivity reporters historically they kind of get an output then the output might be six weeks down the line um but in a place where teams now are not locate co-located and work needs to flow in an edge of passion we need to start using the same foundation and and and data pipeline that we've laid down as a foundation for the reporting of knowledge work and agile team type of metric so in terms of developing new functionality and solutions there's a flow in a multidisciplinary team and how do those solutions get architected in a way where data assists in the flow of information so solutions can be optimally developed well it sounds like you're able to map a metric but business lines care about you know into these dashboards you usually the sort of data mapping approach if you will which makes it much more relevant for the business as you said before they own the data that's got to be a huge business benefit just in terms of again we talked about cultural we talked about speed but but the business impact of being able to do that it has to be pretty substantial it really really is um and and the use cases really are endless because every department finds their own opportunity to utilize in terms of their also I think the accountability factor has has significantly increased because as the owner of a specific domain of data you know that you're not only accountable to yourself and your own operation but people downstream to you as a product and in an outcome depend on you to ensure that the quality of the data you produces is of a high nature so so curation of data is a very important thing and business is really starting to understand that so you know the cards Department knows that they are the owners of card data right and you know the vehicle asset Department knows that they are the owners of vehicle they are linked to a client profile and all of that creates an ecosystem around the plan I mean when you come to a bank you you don't want to be known as a number and you don't want to be known just for one product you want to be known across everything that you do with that with that organization but most banks are not structured that way they still are product houses and product systems on which your data reside and if those don't act in concert then we come across extremely schizophrenic as if we don't know our clients and so that's very very important stupid like I can go on for an hour talking about this topic but unfortunately we're we're out of time thank you so much for sharing your deep knowledge and your story it's really an inspiring one and congratulations on all your success and I guess I'll leave it with you know what's next you gave us you know a glimpse of some of the things you wanted to do pressing some of the the elapsed times and the time cycle but but where do you see this going in the next you know kind of mid term and longer term currently I mean obviously AI is is a big is a big opportunity for all organizations and and you don't get automation of anything right if the foundations are not in place so you believe that this is a great foundation for anything AI to be applied in terms of the use cases that we can find the second one is really providing an API economy where certain data product can be shared with third parties I think that probably where we want to take things as well we are really utilizing external third-party data sources I'm in our data quality management suite to ensure validity of client identity and and and residents and things of that nature but going forward because been picked and banks and other organizations are probably going to partner to to be more competitive going forward we need to be able to provide data product that can then be leveraged by external parties and vice-versa to be like thanks again great having you thank you very much Dave appreciate the opportunity thank you for watching everybody that we go we are digging in the data ops we've got practitioners we've got influencers we've got experts we're going in the crowd chat it's the crowd chat net flash data ops but keep it right there way back but more coverage this is Dave Volante for the cube [Music] you

>>Yeah, >>from The Cube Studios in Palo Alto and Boston. It's the Cube covering IBM. Think brought to you by IBM. >>Everybody welcome back. This is Dave Vellante, and you're watching the Cube's coverage of IBM. Think 2020 the digital version of IBM, thinking the Cube is pleased to be providing the wall to wall coverage, as we have physically. You know, so many years at big IBM events Spaces. Man test is here. He's the managing partner for global strategy for IBM and the Global Business Services. Jesus, great to see you. Thanks for coming on. >>Great to be here, Dave. >>So every guest that we've talked to this week really? We've talked about Cove it, but just briefly Ah, here. We're going to do a big drill down and really try to get Jesus, your perspectives and IBMs Point of view on what's going on here. So let me start with We've never seen anything like this before, Obviously. I mean, there are some examples going back to 1918. Try to get some similarities. But in 1918 was a long, long time ago. So So what's different about this? What are the similarities? >>Yeah, it's Ah, >>you know what Mark Point used to say? That history doesn't repeat, but it often rights, I think that are similar interests off what we're experiencing right now >>in this pandemic with father from that makes like Spanish blue. I think the situation is unique in terms off the I'm the synchronicity of that impact. Right? So we can go back while they're everyone economic crisis or our society crisis >>where you have either one country of one aspect being disrupted. But this is really a society being disrupted, you know, on a global scale. So it impact is unprecedented in that in that perspective, in more than time. And I think all of us are adjusting to it. Um, one of the points of view. Um, we've been able to if you want curate this. IBM is we upgrade 170 countries, so we've been able to see if you want every element of the curve off these convenient, right? So from from getting back to a new normal, that is happening already in China and some of the countries in Asia Pacific to being just kind of like coming over the peat in Europe, North America to some of the emerging countries where they're coming up. So so it gives thing gives us up what business continuity means and the importance of being prepared for this. I think it gives us a perspective on the health aspect of it as well as the economic impact. And most importantly, we've been very focused. Nous ous IBM. I don't have a lot of clients is figuring out What are they going to return back to when we say we want to return to work? I think is, what are we returning to? What are going to be the permanent changes? Where's the adaptation that is gonna be systemic and permanent? I'm not going to be just like, you know, we're going to get through this way. >>Whenever we had a CIO tell us that they weren't ready from a business resiliency business continuity standpoint, they said, we're we were all d are focused, very narrow. Uh, and wow, we really need to rethink that kind of another myth. Your thoughts on that? >>Correct. I think you go back the last three years. Business continuity in most of the decisions that binds would do, I would say I check on the box, right? So he was assumed that you needed to have a business. Continuity was heavily focused on disaster recovery that it was. He must evaluate it under the expectation that it decides there really happens that has now changed permanently, or at least for the foreseeable future, where business continuity is not a check on the box is actually a differentiating feature. And the differentiating feature comes from the fund that on now every one of our fines were prepared. Now every one of our competitors was prepared to the changes, the agility, the efficiency on if you want. The cloud ification of your business is the ability to provide the services in the face of a crisis that forces people to be socially distant, forces people to have to deliver from home. So that has actually become a much >>more important criterion buying decision. So So we, uh, fortunately, we have support very well in that we have 95% of IBM employees. I work from home in 99% of our global delivery centres on network is work from home. And we made that shit even before some of the country's declare that it was a stay at home or so. So that has Bean a feature that now our clients are appreciated. We've been able to to deliver those services so our clients could continue to deliver their services and going forward. I think that's gonna be a much more important if you want. A feature is how cloud ified is your delivery. How prepare are you? Not for just one crisis, but to make, probably subsequent crisis something normal, that one disrupt your operation? You just adapt. >>It's interesting. I had a conversation earlier with Ed Walsh, was one of your GM, said one of your hardware divisions. And and And he was explaining to me that, you know, across your 170 plus countries, you know, it was really the local supply chain. And he actually made the point detection really good quarter in Italy, which surprised me and he said, but they were sort of micro managing at the local level to your to your point. I want I want to ask you about digital transformation because I've made the point that, you know, while a lot of people talk digital transformation, there's been a lot of complacency because they're not in my lifetime where we're a bank. We're making a lot of money. We're doing okay. How do you think over 19 will sort of change that complacency and really accelerate digital transformation is a mindset and actually turn it into action? >>Yeah, I think the best way to put it is, um, digital transformation. Five months ago, it was about obtaining a competitive advantage on digital transformation. Today, in many industries, it's about survival. That is, that is how big of a change car it is. The the need for efficiency and cost savings, the need for resiliency that we have talked about. They need to be able to, um, to drive agility, to be able to switch and about. They need to make hyper local decisions right to use data that none of that can be done unless you have fully digitize processes. You are consuming local data and you have to train the people to really, um, operate in those new, more intelligent processes. So it has gone from Optionality is okay. You can do okay, but if you digitize, you're gonna do better to. Unless you digitize your business may not access next year. I think just change the changes. I think now is widely understood that the majority of our digital digitization processes have to be accelerated. And I would say that is, ah, great statistic that when we go back in history, Andi has been many. As I mentioned off this crisis, you can look back. The two behaviors >>that businesses have one is to play defense funding. What happens two years later on the other one is you defense. But you immediately switched to offense. And then what happens two years later? Those companies that use this time to just defend and hunker down history said in a couple of years later, 21% of them out there for But those businesses that they shift from defense to offense and actually accelerate in this case is, um uh, programs like digitalization. 37% of perform so very sad premium for businesses that right now actually immediately switched to offense. Focus on this set of digitalization and empowering cloud managing data, ensuring the skills of the people. They're more likely not only to survive but thrive in the next three years that don't just use this thanks >>to your point. It's about survival. It's not about, you know, not getting disrupted because you're going to get disrupted. It's almost a certainty. And so, in order to survive, you've got to digitally transform your final thoughts on digital transformation that I want to ask you if there's a silver lining and all this. >>No, I think I mean, um, I'd say the final thoughts is this a sigh said is, I don't think anybody anybody would say that government in and the Christ World crisis that that comes, is is anything that anybody would wish for or would help for. But we can change. I mean, that is the reality it is here. It's impact. It's devastation. Um, I think the human toll that comes from that many families that are being impacted for that, um, you know, I think my my my heart goes to roll those families, my own family. It's in the Spain, one of the worst countries in the world that is being impacted for this. Um so it's ah, it's clearly a tragedy. I think what we do we can't change the company. Um, but we cannot let the conflicts define who we are. Either it's individuals for this company. Well, we can do is to choose How do we act on that pump it? I would say, um, those organizations and those individuals that take advantage of inspiration to understand that some of these behaviors are going to change on this time, that the more that we should technology to the cloud, the more that we should Workloads to the cloud the more that we use technologies like artificial intelligence on Dr Nonlinear decisions that massively optimize everything we do from the way that we deliver healthcare. So the way that we manage supply change to the way that we secure food, frankly, to the way that we protect the environment that is a silver lining, that technology. It is one of those solutions that help in all of these areas, and the silver lining of this is is hopefully, let's use this time to get better, prepare for the next academia to get better, prepare for the next crisis, to implement technologies that drive efficiency faster, they create new jobs, they protect the environment and what we cannot change the fund that we have 19. We can change what happens after the 19 So we return to there's something better than what we enter before. >>Very thoughtful commentary. Jesus. Thank you so much for coming on the cube. A blessing Steer to your family and yourself. >>Appreciate it, Dave. Thank you. And thank you for everything. You do too well, Keep everybody informed. >>Really? Our pleasure. And thank you for watching everybody. This is Dave Volante. You're watching the Cube's coverage of IBM. Think 2020. The digital event. Right back. Right after this. Short break. >>Yeah, yeah, yeah.

>>from Miami Beach, Florida It's the >>Q covering >>a Cronus Global Cyber Summit 2019. Brought to you by a Cronus. Welcome back to the cubes coverage here in Miami Beach of the Blue Hotel. I'm John Kerry. Hosting the Cube for Cronus is global Cyber. Summit 2019. We're here with the chief marketing officer CMO Guide. Our magnet. Nora. Welcome to the Cube. Thanks for having us. And thanks for coming on. Thank you for talking to me. Not a bad venue. Miami Beach People like it here. It's got a good vibe. >>Yes, a lot of entertainment, actually. For an event perspective, having people in such a nice place is very tough because you have to keep them inside somehow. And you cannot lock their doors. So we have to have really good content. >>People are feeling good. I can see a lot of people smiling people very happy. Congratulations. Take us through the event. Why the event here? What's the main theme? What's the top story that you're telling here at the global Cyber summit? 2019? Sure. So >>way were talking about cyber protection for quite a while. And cyber protection is simple. Terms is combining data protection of cyber security because what we see is happening in the digital world is that traditional data protection, not enough anymore cannot really protect you against all of the threats that you have out there and the number of messages growing. So cyber protection super important and we're developing and selling it for quite a while. But now it is time to keep off really a big push for cyber protection because we have the products that can enable our partners, resellers, service providers, enable and customers and enterprise I t. To deliver seven protection to their work clothes. What we do here at the Summit way, announcing three major things One is a furnace cyber infrastructure, which is a secure, hyper converged infrastructure for running cyber protection. That's external port on the edge workloads because when you run something in the data center, you have the perimeter security. You can protect you with moment. You get out of the data center, you need something really secure and easy to use and also cost efficient because the number of foreclosures growing outside of data center rapidly. So we have this cyber infrastructure way prevented here. Second piece is cyber platform. Cyber is the way for any third party to customize, integrate or extend cyber protection so they can take parts and pieces and integrated into their applications, for they can integrate an application support for customers so they can expand the portfolio of solutions. So that's another picnic. It's a huge thing. No, everybody can integrate cyber protection in any solution and support any type of work. And the third thing going on here is the product, according Cyber Protect, which is basically combination off back up, just a recovery. Cyber security. We have a non to virus. We have anti malware capabilities, but we also have vulnerability assessment, Hatch management, remote management. So it's a combination of multiple tools into one package. So that's really designed for a guy who is already tied off agent for teeth. They don't lots of obligations and doing different things. Tired of managing many things so way, offering them a tool that combines everything that they need to manage outside of the data center. >>You know, I've been really impressed with you guys and do my research for this. Two things jumped out at anyone recover cybersecurity, most from the enterprise space, but also from a data space. You guys have been around for a long time. Great growth, a lot of customers. Great channel relationship with Go to market, which has been successful for you guys in cyber. So cyber security has been your wheelhouse is company, but it's interesting. This theme of the enterprise is coming into focus. So to me, I think it's a huge opportunity. From a market standpoint on the enterprise, you're Tim has traditionally been cyber security. But story is interesting. Your since you're telling an i t story with cyber telling a data story in context to cyber these air coming together, these worlds are here. Talk about that dynamic in the market because that's a market you're targeting specifically. >>So, first of all, a little correction. We do cyber protection, and it's an important difference between several protection of several security, because what we do wait combined data protection so traditional backup disaster recovery file, sink and share all those tools with security. That's vision what is needed for the border protection. So Christ was a traditional data protection company for quite a while, and then we realized that there is this need for security integrated with data protection way started to implement that. So now we're introducing to the market a new type of solution that everybody now recognizes integrated solution between data protection and cyber security. So the market without solution is virtually anybody. But when you talk about the enterprise, the key workloads where you really need that is the edge. So everything outside of the data center edge and end points. And the thing here is that you have just a tiny fraction of all of the devices in your data center. Everything is outside and protecting it, managing it. It's really complicated. That's what we offer now. So you can start protecting those workloads and the edge, what it's like for clothes and >>talk about the product specifically because this platform enabling is interesting. You have a P eyes. You're opening up your developer network of S, V S and M S P's and your customer base. How is that platform going to help that EJ problem and simplify the protection has taken years. >>That helps in a different expects. So in one hand, way as a company would never be able to support all types of work clothes because there's so many different applications and people want to have application and wear protection. So any third party, any eyes via have the expertise with a particular application, they can develop their own workload support so they can support more loads that can support different type of stores. Destinations they can create. Different service is on top off the data so they can process the data. So, for example, they can deliver a malware scanner on top of the back of that will be integrated in the backup solution right so they can extend the platform in that sense. But also it's an opportunity for service providers because full service provided they trying thio differentiate. They all look for something that I will help them to tell the story that they different from the others because the major problem is that if you a service provider you have multiple customers for them, it's very easy to switch to another service providers. So the old for those differentiators and without blood when they can customize they can integrate it with a particular systems and they can focus on specific application. So let's say electronic medical records they can support that for their particular customers. And the customers are going to switch to another provider because they have this customization. And they have a lot of expertise that they can implement through the platform and create a custom my solution, that only them can develop and deliver. So that's That's another aspect of the platform. Only four eyes, these wonderful service providers. Then we talk about resellers and distributors. They can integrate the plot, thicken, integrated with their market places they can. Cell service is directly from the tools that they're building already or the solution marketplace ability. >>Talk about the difference between data protection and cyber protection, because those are kind of now coming together. As you're pointing out target persona for I t. Has been C i o or T buyer on, then you have a C so chief of security from large firms way, Who's buying? Who's using the product, is it? See I owe with staffers in the sea so and because it's like a data protection the old way, it's like, OK, storage, that's the I t. Fire down the list. Five. Storage, both on data protection. That's the old way. The new way is kind of bring it together. Who's that? Is a very good >>question. So I would think about the traditional data center, and we think about the rows of people who work with the data center, their storage guys, working guy, security guys. They may have different goals, different budget. They can be separate. Organization may not even be talking to each other. So selling a combination integrate solution to the data percent. It's complicated, and we've seen that stories many times. C'mon taken very. They try to sell security together. They failed just because it's very difficult to do that. But what we do is we go to the other type of person to the edge guy, the guy who's responsible for the whole infrastructure outside of a data center. Usually it's one team of one person, and they cover everything and they have a problem. They have multiple solution. They have to manage more solutions. You have people, you have to hire more training you have to make, and the reliability of this is just going down because you have to manage multiple tools. Update on different schedules and it's a disaster for a lot of companies. So we go to that guy with the department and tell them, Hey, here's a solution. Now we'll cover most of your knees >>and the number one problem you're solving. What? What's the problem? Statement. Take the high order bid on the promise the >>protection of the device So you protect data application and system that device. Talk >>aboutthe. Range the platform protection. Get the core platform protection infrastructure. Cloud backup. You've got core areas in the model, which one is the most popular in terms of where customers start to rethink their architecture when they start thinking platform versus tools? Because a lot of custom that we talk to and we pull in our community are all in the sea, so specifically are hard core way Don't want another tool way have a lot of tools in the tool shed, so to speak way want to get data horizontally scalable? We don't want to have an enabling platform software, but they have a machine learning and may I be very specific in service is that we use so trying to balance that architecture is what's on there. That's essentially what you guys are doing. So why that's important and why it's important for the customer. >>Exactly. And I I would take a step back here. So a lot of people want to think about protection of data, sleeping in traditional terms, data protection back up. I have a coffee somewhere. So in case something bad happens, I will be able to get back to that coffee. But now people started to understand it's not enough. First of all, they want to get value from the data, so data should be available. It should be fresh, and it should be authentic, So they want to make sure that they have the data they can trust. So the moment the shift from traditional having a coffee to having data that I can use and get Mellie from the data we start thinking about how they can make it work in a way that you always have data available. You don't wasting time, you know, losing anything. And you have a proof that you have that regional data thistles where we play. So we come to them and tell them that simple story. So in the past, you hit by run somewhere for you hit by malware. Attack somebody. A Texas system. You would say, OK, I'll go back to my backup, I'll find those files. I'll recover them. I would hope that they're not too old way offer them is the automatic recovery. They get everything back and they have everything. That was the most fresh data that they need. And we have guarantee that this is the original data they have because what's happening now in the cyber security market? And there were a lot of people Aquino they were talking about it and security experts. Is that the hackers Not on Lee, corrupting a day of stealing your data, the old so mortifying in a way, to influence your decisions. So they do like small, tiny modification, and you're sending your paychecks to somebody else. That's what they basically trying to do all the time. So you have to be able to trust the day of the job. So the moment you think about the chocks enough in the city of the Data, you think, OK, it's not just back up anymore. I need cyber protection. I need something that will actually help me to trust my data. >>You see in the examples everywhere you pointed out visual threats, you know the automation of cyber crime. You're seeing Ransomware. That's killer. And then just personal attacks. This is a really key area. I gotta ask you a question that came up on Twitter the other day. We were talking to folks. This comes up a lot with C. Sosa's well on. This is a quote from acute conversation I had with C. So said, Lookit my environment becoming more complex and costly going up. So that's one killer problem that he has in terms of what he's dealing with his environment. So complexity is going up. You mentioned the edge. It's a big one, right of other things out there wearables and then costs too many vendors, not enough sharing data. So again, this is a very complex and nuanced point. But how did you guys answer that question? So I see it costs. I want cost to go down. I want Plus, he's never gonna go down your abstract thataway. >>Yeah, even more. It's only complexity and cost is also security. More complexity that surfaces. Attack of attack is getting bigger, so you have to find a way to protect it. So answer is integrated type of protection. So what we do. We address five acres of protection and in the digital world, way we call him a Comsat passes safety. You have a copy, you can recover accessibility. You have a copy that you can access when you need it, where you need it. On privacy. You have control where your data is and who can access the data. That authenticity. You have a way to prove that. This is your reach, Dana. And then security. You have protection against external attacks. So we combine it all together into one solution. So you deploy one single agent that will provide backup just recovery. Crossing in. Sure. Hold the service that you need to work with your data Creative copy of the data to share your data, but also its integrated security. So we'll ensure that we passed your system. You have up to date Aly update installed. You have everything up to date. Everything's protected. Then we have an antivirus we have on tomorrow where we have the ability to manage the system. So everything is packed, packaged into one solution. So you don't have multiple agents that are incompatible. Multiple agencies have to update on different schedules multiple people who have to support different types of agents. Everything is combined. So that way we decrease the complexity and then increase the security because security is already integrated. And then the last final piece of the cost is the infrastructure solution that way. So what? We have a current seven infrastructure. It's either a softer applying to heart of our clients that is designed specifically for cyber protection were close, so it can't replace your standard H c I. But it gives you an ability to store data in the mosque obstetrician way. You get our appliance like in the hardware. You have a cheap stories for your secondary data for disaster. Recovery you can do that is to recover that appliance, or you can take our soccer appliance and deployed to commodity hardware. You don't have to buy a very expensive story track. You just deployed to the hard way that you have and use it on there. So that way we sold. It caused problems >>to get multiple options basically on that. Okay, so I gotta ask you the hard question that's going through everyone's mind is okay. I hear this story is too good to be true. Everyone must be. It must be a platform from wars are out there, sees this. They're pandering to customers. What makes you different? Prove that you're valuable to me. Show some evidence Where your differentiation How do you answer the differentiation? What makes you guys different? >>I would say the answer to that is innovation. So everybody has a platform. Everybody's building a glass from I. D. C was proclaiming its in Europe platforms probably three or four years ago. So everybody's talking about it, right? So way do they have the platform about the core differentiation is the innovation that we have Where the first company to use Blockchain for authenticity so we can record way hash coats Oh, files to change And then you can use it to get the verification that you have the original copy of the file in a time step where the 1st 1 to integrate the anti ransomware protection into the back so you don't really have to recover after my run somewhere you get all the files back, it will be the most recent files that you had. So you're getting it all back and it works there, So those innovation they already implemented off platform. So the moment you get a lot from you have all that you need. Old basics. You have user management quarter management so you can deploy and feel for you. Can you? Can? >>Was interesting is you have a holistic view on data, not just narrow view on day that Zach Lights and the I think the integrated is killer customer success. Anecdotal sound bites you can share. What are some of that? Some of feedback you hear from customers on this >>so feedback from customers. The best feedback is that we're hearing from our customers have issues, right? That's the best thing to d'oh. So when things go right with customers happy and you can go online and check out the mosque. Interesting case that >>we have with our scores partnerships because sports of becoming digital so >>everything's difficult depends on data. When you think Formula One isn't data, they lose data, they lose the race, so they have a tremendous amount of data and they have to transfer to a different location to transfer from the track to the headquarters. So we had implemented our cyber protection for a few teams in Formula One and you can just go online and check out that way. Ken Story, Williams Formula One. Great story. They actually tell people how they use it, how it helps them way. Have a bunch of those stories. >>You know, industrial I o. T. Is a huge area. I think you guys have a great opportunity there. People talk about digital threats and getting hacked as individuals. Equipment, machinery can get back to a device on your car. Certainly sports betting on it. Certainly someone's gonna want to manipulate it everything >>now, because we have our separate protects Operation center. We have engineers and security expert watching What's going on. We're collecting feedbacks from our customers and partners. We kill some crazy story all the time. Like what hikers now do. They would have into your email start fortifying your e mails and your documents that you had there because it's digital. There is no trace. You don't really know what was their original documents, so they eventually it will get you to transfer money to wrong account or do something with your assets. You will not going todo and it's just becoming more and more prominent because every digital. Now you don't even have a cocky or a document that's stating how much money you have in your bank. What if you wake up tomorrow instead of $1,000,000? You see $1000 you have no proof that you actually had something else, right? >>Cyber protections of data problem. You guys tackling with creative platform? Yes. Congratulations. Better. Thanks for coming on the Cube. Thanks for your insights. It's a cube jumper. You're watching us here at Miami Beach of the Crows Global Cyber Summit 2019. More coverage after this short break.

>> live from Atlanta, Georgia. It's the two you covering. Citric Synergy. Atlanta 2019. Brought to You by Citrix >> Welcome back to the Cubes. Continuing coverage of Citrix Energy, 2019 from Atlanta, Georgia. I'm Lisa Martin. My co host for the event is Keith Townsend and Keith and I are excited to talk. Teo, one of the Citrix Innovation Award nominees, Indiana University, with a couple of folks from Indiana University joining us. Stephanie Cox, manager, a Virtual Platform Services and Mat Link, associate vice president of research Technologies Guys, thanks so much for joining Keith and me, Thank you. And congratulations on Indiana University being nominated for an innovation award. I was talking with Tim in hand there CMO yesterday, saying there was over a thousands nomination. So to even get down to being in the top three is pretty exciting stuff. Talk to us a little bit about Indiana University. Us. This is a a big, big organization. Lots of folks accessing the network through lots of devices. Matt, let's start with you. Give us that picture of what's going on there. Yes, so I >> u is about 130,000 students across seven campuses. We've got about 20,000 faculty and staff across those seven campuses. One of the things that makes us a little unique is were consolidated shop. So there are 1,200 of us and I you that support the entire university and all the campuses and anyone point in time, there could be 200,000 devices touching the network and using those services. >> That's a Big 70 talk. Talk to us about your virtual a footprint. How How big is the location? Data centers? What's the footprint? >> Well, we have two data centers. One of them is in Indianapolis, which is my home. It's one of our larger campus is calling Indiana University Purdue University affectionately, I U P y. There is a data center there, but our large danna center is at the flagship campus, which is in Bloomington, Indiana, >> and to support 100,000 plus people and to hundreds of any given the 2nd 200,000 devices. How have you designed that virtual infrastructure to enable access to students, faculty, etcetera and employees. >> So from the network perspective, we have several network master plans that have rolled, and we're in our 2nd 10 year next network master plan, and the network master plan is designed to continually upgrade the network. Both the physical network, the infrastructure and the wireless network in our last 10 year budget, for that was around $170,000,000 of investment just to support the network infrastructure. And then Stephanie rides on top of that as the virtual platform with Citrix to deliver the images anywhere on campus. Whether it's wirelessly or whether it's connected via network connection >> kill seven campuses is already a bit. If you ever look at a map, Indiana sits Christ map damp in the middle of the country. It's a big space. Right before we hit record, we were just talking about that. Drive off I 65 from Indianapolis to Chicago is just a lot of rules area, and I'm sure part of your mission is to make sure technology and education is the sensible thing. Everyone in Indiana talk to us about the challenges of getting connective ity and getting material virtual classrooms to those remote areas. >> Yeah, it's really one of the major strengths of our partnership with Citrix. They are really at the premiere Remote solution connectivity offering at Indiana University. So we built our citrix environment. Teo encompass everyone. We wanted to make sure we could have enough licenses and capacity for all of our 130,000 faculty, staff and students to use the service. Do they all show up at the same time? No, thank goodness. But we do offer it to everyone, which is I found in the education. You're in a very unique tin Indiana University. Another another thing to have consolidated I t. And then to be able to offer a service like ours to everyone and not just restricted to specific pockets of the university. With that, we've been able to them extend offering of any application or something that you might need for a class to any of our other remote location. So if you're a student who is working in or go, you know, lives in rule Indiana and you want Teo get in Indiana University degree, you can do that without having to travel to one of our campus sites or locations. We I have a very nice of online program, just a lot of other options that that we've really tried Teo offer for remote access. >> So Citrix has really enabled this. I think you call it the eye. You anywhere. Indiana University anywhere Program. Tell us about opening up this access to everyone over the time that you've been ascetics Customer, how many more people can you estimate have access now, that didn't hurt not too long ago. >> Yeah, I think initially, and Matt was probably no more before me before I Even before I even came on the scene, I believe that the original youth case was really just trying. Teo, extend what we were already doing on premise in what we call just our Indiana University lab supported areas. Right? So just your small, like the old days you would goto your college campus and you go into your computer lab with it. We just really wanted Teo the virtual Isar expand the access to just those specific types of APS and computers. And that was an early design. Since then, over the years, we've really kind of, you know, just really expanded. Really. We used the Citrix platform to redesign and distribute how we deliver the applications and the virtual desktops. So now not only do we service those students who would who would normally come onto the campus just to use your traditional computer lab. Wait do a lot, especially programs for other schools. Like we, we deliver a virtual desktop for our dentistry. Students may actually use that whole platform in the dental clinic to see real patients are third tier. Third year doctors do that way. Also replicated that same thing and do it in our speech and hearing sciences for our future audiologist. We have certain professors that have wanted to take a particular course that they're teaching and extended to different pockets all over the world. So we might host a class from Budapest or Africa somewhere else. You know, wherever that faculty and staff has three sources that they know they need to get to in their content already virtualized. We worked to make that happen all the time. >> That's a lot of what you just said is first of all, initially, maybe before Citrix being able to provide support in the computer labs for your maybe seven core campuses. Now you get your giving 130,000 plus individuals anywhere, anytime. Access that is the ex multiplier on that is massive, but you're also gone global It's not just online, it's you're able to enable professors to teach in other parts of the world where it was before. It was just people that were in Indiana, but master and and >> you're just limited by the network. So that's the only draw back. When you go to the rule areas way out, you're just limited by the network. You know, the initial program was really you really thought of as a cost saving measure way we're goingto put thin clients out. We wouldn't have to do life cycle replacements for desktop machines that were getting more expensive and more expensive, you know, 10 years ago, and now the way that we look at it is I you wants to provide services across the breath of the organization and make those services at no additional cost and open to everybody open access to everybody. The desktop, for example, is one of you know Stephanie is, is the brainchild behind the desktop, took three years of dedicated hard work to create an environment to support the visually impaired. >> Talk to us more about that because that was part of the video and that captured my intention immediately. What is 80 accessibility, technology, accessibility technology is inaccessible to get that. So I'm just, you know, hundreds thousands, and not just those that are sight and hearing. >> So one of the things then I think it's just a wonderful thing about working at a university. We're able to buy software licenses in a big quantity, large quantity, right? Because we have that kind of buying power software that I normally never would see or get access to, even in my private sector. Administer tricks engineer for a long time. But when you come to a university and then you're selling or you're getting licenses for 50 60 70 80,000 you get to see some of these products that you don't normally as a regular consumer. You'd like it, but you know you can't really afford it. So with that, when we started looking at all of the different applications that they could buy in a large quantity site licence, you know, the way we thought, Oh my goodness, let's virtualized these and make sure everybody gets access to them and the ones that were really attractive to us, where the ones for the visually impaired, sure they're in niche and They're very, very expensive, but we but let's just try it. We'll see how well they perform in a virtual environment. And with that, our Citrix infrastructure underneath they performed quite well. Plus, the apse have evolved a great deal over just the last four years. So we're really proud to offer our virtual desktop to our blind students. We had to work really hard to make sure that the speech recognition software was fast enough for them. It turns out that blind people listen to speech really, really, really, really, really fast, and so we had to make sure that we kept our platform while we're working on it to keep it sped an updated so that it's usable to them right since functional to me. But they really need it to be like, 10 times faster. I found that out after even shooting the award video and spending even more time with them, I thought, Why don't you guys tell me it was slow to you? But yeah, it's, uh, it's been an honor, really, Teo to be up for that award. But tow work with those students to learn more about their needs to learn more about the city different applications that people write for people with old disabilities. I hope we can do more in that space. >> So the young man in it and why I don't remember his name. >> Priscilla, Bela, Chris. So >> share just quickly about Chris's story. >> Yeah, and he watches the Cube. I hope he's listening because I >> think I think this whole >> kind of >> really put a little bit icing on the cake because you're taking an environment and urine empowering a student to do what they want to do versus what they are able or not able to do. So Christmas story is pretty cool of where he wants to go with his college career. >> Yeah, I won't say he's a big, you know, proponent, user of the virtual desktop, because he's just so advanced. He's like, way beyond everything We're learning from him. But he is Indiana University's believe. I'm saying this right, very first biomedical chemical engineer who is blind and fourth completely blind, Yes, wow and is quite a brilliant young man, and we were lucky to have him be r. He will test anything for me and and Mary Stores, who was featured in the video Chris Meyer. And he's also featured in the video. Gonna remember their names? I mean, it's a hole. I'm lucky to have a whole community of people that will Yeah, they know where we want to be there for them. We don't always get it right. What? We're gonna listen and keep trying to move forward. So >> But if you kind of think of even what a year or two ago not being able to give any of this virtualized desktop access to this visually impaired and how many people are now using it? >> Um, well, we open it up to everyone. We have hundreds and hundreds of users, but we know not everyone who uses it is blind. People like you can use it if you want it or not way. Don't really understand why some people prefer to use that one over there. The other But it does have some advantages. I mean, there there are different levels of sight impairment, too, as I've just been educated right. There are some people who are just at the very beginning of that journey of just losing their site. So we if if that happens to be, you know, someone that we can extend our environment to. It's probably better t use it now and get really familiar with that issue. Transition to losing your sight later in life. I've been told so >> So you ask a little bit about the scope of of the desktop, so I'll layer on a little bit of the scope of eye you anywhere. Last year, around 65,000 individual unique users over well over 1,000,000 Loggins and 8,000,000 and the average session time was around 41 minutes. That's so our instructors teach with it. Are clinicians treat people with it? We've built it in two. How's Elektronik protected health data? Er hit. The client's gonna be critical, writes the hip a standard because you can't say compliance anymore because you can't be compliant with a standard change. That wording several times way are very familiar with meeting hip. A standard we've been doing that for about 12 years now with where I came from was the high performance computing area of the university. So that's my background, and I >> so one thing we didn't get a chance to talk, uh, touch 12 100,000 devices were a citrus citrus is a Microsoft partner. Typically, when those companies think of 200,000 users, they think for profit. There's, you know, this is a niche use case for 200,000 users. Obviously, you guys have gotten some great pricing as part of being a educational environment. What I love to hear is kind of the research stories, because the ability to shrink the world, so to speak, you know, hi HPC you're giving access to specialized equipment to people who can't get their normally. You know, you don't have to be physically in front of GPU CPUC century. What other cool things have been coming out of the research side of the house because of the situation able? >> So this is cool. I mean, >> I get it. So >> So one of our group's research software solutions stole the idea from Stephanie to provide a research desktop. Barr >> imitation. Highest form of flattery, Stephanie. Absolutely. So what we've >> done is is is we always continually to try to reduce the barriers of entry and access? Uh, you know, supercomputing. Before you had to be this tall to ride this ride. Well, now we're down to here and with the hopes that will get down even farther. So what we've done is we've taken virtualized desktop, put it in front of the supercomputers, and now you can be wherever you want to be and have access to HPC. Untie you and that's all the systems. So we have four super computers and we have 40 petabytes of spinning disc ah, 160 petabytes of archival tape library. So we're we're a large shop and, you know, we couldn't have done it without looking at what Stephanie has done and and really looking in that model differently. Right? Because to use HPC before, you'd have to use a terminal and shell in and now, looking at you anywhere that gives you just the different opportunity to catch a different and more broad customer base. And I call on customers because we try to treat him as customers and and helps the diversity of what you're doing. So last year alone, our group research technologies supported a 151 different departments way were on 937 different grants, and we support over 330 different disciplines. Uh, it I you and so it's It's deep, but it's also very broad. First, larger campus we are. And as a large organization as we are, you know, we're fairly nimble. Even a 1,200 people. >> Wow! From what I've heard, it's no wonder that what you've done at Indiana University has garnered you the Innovation Award nominee. I can't imagine what is next. All that you have accomplished. Stephanie. Matt, thank you so much for joining Key to me. We wish you the best of luck and good a citric scott dot com Search Innovation Awards where you can vote for the three finalists. We wish you the very best of luck will be waiting with bated breath tomorrow to see who wins. >> So thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you. Keep >> our pleasure for Keith Townsend. I'm Lisa Martin. You're watching the Cube live from Citrix. Synergy 2019. Thanks for watching

>> Hello, Room. Welcome back to London. You watching the Cube? The leader and tech coverage. My name is Dave Volante. We're here in a special program that we've constructed. It's the day before the eight of US London summit and we wanted to come and talk to some customers, some executives of startups, and really dig into what's going on in the public sector. Chris Heman is here. He's the director of UK and Ireland Public sector for eight of us. Chris, Thanks for coming on the Cube. >> Thanks for vitamins. Christ. >> Yeah. So you guys have a special public sector healthcare pre day that's going on downstairs? What's that all about? >> Yes. So obviously we'LL remain summit tomorrow expecting about twelve thousand people, which is phenomenal today that we could do something with one of our special industries, which is health care. So we've invited a number of customers and executives along for that today to learn more about cloud, how they can get going with the cloud and get, you know, start adopting a pace. So I believe you spoke with the missus about earlier on. So he misses a supplies the n hs, but also people and hs digital and so on her adopting the platform. So that's what today's all about. >> So health care is one of those sectors. It's ripe for disruption. It really hasn't been, you know, disrupted in a big way and digitized and it's starting. But the challenge is, how do you balance the cost of health care? Everybody's sensitized to that with the quality. Yeah, here. And so that's what really the problem. Show yourself. How does he ws in the cloud? Help solve that. >> Yeah, I think across the public sex. Really not just for the healthcare, but, you know, one of the things organizations are trying to do is reduce that large legacy footprint of infrastructure and really deliver against their mission, whether it be patients or citizens or whatever it may be. Ah, good example. In the in the case of the health care is we're working with a partner and I just school Business Services Authority on they have a large call center that was a really, you know, costly experience having traditional call center set up. So they've used our connect platform, our call center platform, and also some voice technologic called Lex. And they're able to reduce they stood up in about three weeks is a phenomenal effort, and they reduce their call volume by forty two percent. So basically getting the computer's towards some of the really easy queries, which, of course, meant that some of the tougher call center queries went to the actual humans and the call center handlers. So you know those sort things, I really think impact the bottom line for the HS and save some cost, but really helping to innovate a swell for for their patients and sis isn't so. >> Let's stay in health care for a second. So any just has, ah, nearly half a billion pound initiative to modernize. So if had they asked me, they didn't ask me. But had they ask me, I say, Well, part of that should be to get rid of the heavy lifting, so moved to the cloud and then really try toe transform your labor force to focus on more value added areas. It's actually helps to solve your problems. Is that essentially, what's happening? >> Understand, so that the contacts into very you know, that the people are now answering fines aren't doing those sort of Monday enquiries were it's just going to take four to six weeks. It's Maur, you know, transferring that. You know that's the computer and letting the humans do the heavy lifting. So I think that's you know, certainly one thing. But I think it's also enabling these organizations to really be closer to their citizens into their patients as well. With free liquor organizations like in the local authority, space, like else prevail. There are also using voice technology with Alexa to enable citizens to answer queries like You know who is my counselor or to update about various things within their sort of council record. And socially public sector organizations love that because they've now got this unique touch point with the sisters and at scale, whereas they would never have been able to do that previously. So that's a really good, you know, close engagement for them. >> So you hear the bromide people say data is the new oil. It's it's the it's the new natural resource. We actually think date is more valuable than oil because you can only use oil in one place. The data you can use many, many places, so data becomes increasingly important. But the problem that most traditional companies have is there, Their data is locked in silos. It's hardened into an application. And so so how are you guys attacking that problem? What do you see? A CZ trends in the customer base in terms of being able tto have sort of, ah, unified data model. And what role does the cloud >> play there? Yeah, I think it's really good questions. So there's a number of things that we're doing. First of all, we're very passionate about public date sets. So we host a number of public day sets like Lanza imagery and these sort of things, you know, fundamentally, we believe data has gravity, so, you know, for overto host and provide this data at scale for researchers and so on. That has tremendous huge benefit. But you're right about public sector organizations, and I silos a good example. Where we've we've worked is with transport for London. Obviously, if you want to get in and around the city of London, typically you go to tear filled look after UK, which runs on a dress, and you'LL say, I want to get from you know, Frank and to Liverpool Street, and that's all kind of running on top of a dress. But the really cool thing is they've opened up all that information so they don't have to develop. Those ups themselves are effectively crowd sourcing the development of those APS. So they've got some four thousand developers now working against all this data. Ah, Delight recently did a study. They reckon it's goingto generate economic benefits of one hundred thirty million pounds per annum just by making this really time data available. So So you're gaining unique business in size. But not only that, you've got organizations like city mapper who can commercialize that data develop, perhaps, and sell those apse on behalf of you know, you took to the community and so on. So you've got double bubble of s on the engagement, but also the public benefit as well. So that's really cool >> now, years ago Ah, in a past life, I had an opportunity when I worked for I d see the research company to run the government business. And when I went around and talked to the heads of military heads, the heads of agencies, there was a common theme. They were trying to close the gap between public sector and commercial. Yeah, and they never quite could get there. The cloud seems to me, Chris, to be changing that. I mean, to me, the CIA deal in twenty thirteen was a seminal moment for just the cloud and need of us specifically. But increasingly, you're seeing innovation. Yeah, it's still very difficult because you get turnover and agencies and administrations and so forth. But what are you seeing in terms of of those trends? Are you seeing public sector organizations leaning in modernizing? And again, what role does the cloud play there? >> Yeah, one hundred cent. I think you're absolutely rise. It is a unifier. In that sense we worked with, you know, we're moving mission systems to the cloud now with our customers. Ah, we worked with Dr Vehicle Stands Agency. So they're responsible for making sure our car's unroadworthy in the UK. They migrated their entire platform, which supports on thirty thousand small businesses. Try the rest in ten weeks. So it's amazing what public sector organizations are able to achieve with the pace of cloud. And a lot of it starts with experimentation. You know, that's the great thing is that you can try something. If it doesn't work, you can turn it off and you haven't lost anything but that that pace of being out to move, even mission systems. So the cloud is happening in public sexual across the board, >> and I mentioned the CIA before they start to be the American sort of parachuting in, and it's obviously a bias that I have. I'm working on my accent. But But But But the CIA was significant because everybody in the early days were so concerned about security that the head of tea in the CIA stood up last year at the D. C. Public sector Summit and said, My worst day of security in the cloud is better, far better than my client server ever. Wass. Yeah. So what about security concerns? Have they abated? They they still there? How is that evolving? >> Well, I think first of always, absolutely right that public sector organizations one hundred percent laser focused on security. But the good news is that we are to you know, its job. Zero for us is absolutely everything that we don't live and breathe by. And I think we've demonstrated that in a number of ways. I mean first of all, just the way in which we operate our physical infrastructure and everything that we do it physical pace, but then above the layer with the kind of the things that are a customer's responsible for. We have something called a shared responsibility model, so the responsibility for kind of everything above the physical infrastructure, but we provide the tools that they just never would've been able to get access to in a in a physical world, you know what our CEO's in public sector organizations do You know every servant you have, you know, just things like that. And they would just be like Now I've got no idea, but with a cloud, you have that visibility. You can see every single thing that's happening in the environment. So you get farm or visibility in control that he ever was ever were able to in a physical world. So I think that's first thing and obviously everything that we do around certification atter stations around. I so certification all the reporting and so on that we do Teo to assure our customers that we do a good job of that level as well. Ministry of Justice actually came out and said you could be more secure in the cloud than on premises and you have to focus on those areas where you're not in the cloud. So I think that was a huge testament by the UK. Come and say, Actually, this is this is secure, and this is fit for purpose, which is which is good. >> One of the things I've observed boat just technology adoption in general. You know, Silicon Valley's unique, obviously, And but, you know, outside of Silicon Valley, maybe technology adoption, you know, twenty years ago occurred more slowly. It seems like cloud adoption is very much consistent across the globe. I wonder if you could talk about that, But then specifically, public sector jobs in the cloud Do you see this Very similar sort of cadence from, you know, us rest of >> world? Yeah, I do. And I think you know, we were doing a fantastic job in the UK, Actually. Really fantastic job. Talked about some of stuff we're doing round. I I am machine learning. You know, some of these things are really leading edge on DH. If you speak to a miss earlier, they're investigating things like Blockchain for their tops of solution. So these sort of things are really pushing the boundary. But Paramount, All of that is this idea that you can experiment to try things. There's no longer there's a kind of is no longer a disparity around. Think something's fundamentally when you when you log into the console, you got access to one hundred sixty five different things and you can get going with you in the UK whether you're in the candor or in North America. So our customers are picking these things up on DH, accelerating a pace, which is which is fantastic trying all different types of things and work lights. >> Okay, if I were to ask Alexa what's gonna happen with Brexit, what would what would you tell me? I think first of >> almost, you know, with the way we think about it is it's just business as usual for us. You know, it's a fairly mundane answer, but fundamentally, you know, organization still need to adapt. This stone is transformed. They still need to evolve, and that's where we're helping and we're leaning in, you know, we're helping them with some of their EU accept programs around tooling and process and things like that. But I still came to adopt cloud a place which is which is also >> so come back to the session that you guys are running downstairs. I saw some of descriptions of it and I think there were three areas of focus. The public payers, the health care providers in the publicly funded research organizations is kind of what you guys are focused on today. So maybe close there and give us a vision for where you see eight of us public sector in the UK and >> I I think this were obviously healthcare's really fast growing vertical for us, which is fantastic upper across the board. Demand has never been greater, which is phenomenal on DH were really pushing the boundaries of what can be achieved. Yeah, we're working with, you know, I talked about some the public sector organizations with working with, you know, partners like he miss, but also small businesses as well as great example. Working with a company called Ad Zuna, which provides job search functionality. They run on a dress and they want a contract for Jobcentre Plus, which part of our department work and pensions. So it's not just the direct engagement we have with our customers. But it's also a ll the partners that we're working with to enable that in tow and functionality, which is which is really good. So we're doing a lot, lots of work in that space. And I could liken see Maura Mohr organizations not just customers in customers, but also partners technology providers coming to talk to us. Ah, and then across the spectrum, in health care, whether it's supplies to the chess or at the NSS himself, an individual trusts and and hospitals and so on, the kind of using our technology. So it's a real broad mixing spectrum of adoption. >> Outstanding, Chris, thanks so much for coming on. The Cube really appreciate it. And they were seeing the growth of a device is a DBS is actually astounding thirty billion dollars run rate company growing at forty plus percent a year. But more importantly, you're starting to see not only region expansion, but you're seeing expansion into specific verticals and ecosystems forming startups. And you guys are doing a great job of attracting these. Thanks very much for coming. Thanks. Thanks. Alright, Keep it right there. Buddy. This is David, Dante and the Cuba right back. Right after this short break. Wait

>> live from Anaheim, California. It's the queue covering nutanix dot next twenty nineteen. Brought to you by Nutanix. >> Welcome back, everyone to the cubes. Live coverage of nutanix dot Next here in Anaheim, California. I'm your host, Rebecca Night, along with my co host, John Furrier. We have two guests for this next segment. We have Stephanie Scare Aldi. She is the director of operations and support for Electra. Thank you so much for coming on the cues. And we have James Ellery, director innovation and governance at Electra. Thank you, James. >> Thanks for having us. >> So I want to start with you, James. Tell our viewers a little bit about electorates. Ontario, based for our viewers who are not familiar. What do what do you do? What do you about? >> So we are a energy solutions provider in Ontario, Canada. Basically, we are an ldc a local distribution company, but we're trying to transition from the poles and wires into really energy solutions provider. We We're about a million customers are approaching a million customers right now and wear actually four utility companies that came together to form Electra. And we just recently emerged with a fifth now, so We're rapidly growing in the in Ontario, and we have very much more growth to come. >> It's all those mergers. How does I t all fit together? Different systems, all kind of legacy. Mishmash. What's what's What's the environment like? >> So the environment Right now there is a tremendous amount of data center Stephanie's actually leading our data center consolidation project. There are tremendous amount of data centers across a fast geographical location, and we're using NUTANIX actually to consolidate everything onto a single platform right now. So there's a lot of work to be done. Definitely a lot of integration to be done, but we're confident that we'LL get it all done and we want to move to new tanks by phone. >> So right now we have about, I think, eleven data centers and we've been mandated to get down to two. So we're use up utilizing technology like nutanix too kind of, you know, get down and scale ability. So wait >> here for a lot of customs from nutanix around, how it's been a great system for manageability and also getting rid of some older gear, whether it's old GMC Cem Dale stuff. So we're seeing a lot of, you know, go from twenty four racks to six. This is kind of the ratios pushing stuff from eight weeks. Tow two hours, new operational benefits. How close are you guys up to that now? Because you get all this stuff you consolidating down the merger's makes a lot of sense. What's some of the operational benefits you seeing with nutanix That you could share, >> I think, is a per example that you just gave. We're working on a front office consolidation project and we're moving. We're doubling our VD i environment, and we actually just got three new nodes in a few weeks ago and it took a matter of two hours to get everything spun up and ready. So traditionally, it would take us weeks of planning and getting someone in and specialized technicians and now make a phone call a few hours and it's done. So you see, like already the benefits of you know growing are our infrastructure, and it's enabling us to merge faster with different utilities. >> I want to actually back up now and talk about the journey to Nutanix and talk about life before nutanix and now life after it. What was that what were sort of the problems that you were trying to solve? And why was Nutanix the answer >> So I could speak to that way back in twenty fifteen? We're looking at video, and we're implementing it across organization. And we're running its issues on three tier architecture where whenever there was a performance issue, we would talk to the sand guy and we'LL talk to the server guy and we talked to the networking guy. And although everyone's trying to help everyone sort of looking at each other, saying, Okay, where is this problem? Really, really land? And the issue with that is, as you guys know what VD I I mean, user performance and user experience is key, right? That's King. So you know, when you're trying to take away someone's physical desktop and give him a virtual desktop, they want the same or better performance. And anytime we had an issue, we had to resolve it rapidly. So when we look at everything we said, Okay, this is okay, but it's not sustainable for the scale, ability in the growth that we had, especially because with, you know, ah media environment, its scales very rapidly and If the application scares wrapped scales rapidly, you need the infrastructure to scale as rapidly as your application and perform just as good. So what happened was we looked at nutanix. We said, You know what? If we can look at a single pane of glass to figure out where any performance issues lie, that makes operations much more operations, that management administration much easier for us. And that's really where we started our journey with nutanix. We went from a three note cluster to start and we're up to fourteen nodes now, just in our VD I cluster alone. >> And what about about the future? What? What is the future hold in terms of this partnership, >> I think for us were really hoping to go to fully H V in the next six or twelve months. Uh, I know, James. We're really pushing it and trying to get that in because, you know, way want to simplify our technologies. And I think by moving to a Chevy, I think, you know, we'LL save some money. >> So what we're looking to do with Nutanix isn't you know, there's been a lot of wins for us moving to NUTANIX, especially with regards to support Support's been fantastic. I mean, you know, although we don't like to call support because I mean something's probably wrong way love calling you guys because every time we call support, it's, you know, everyone's always there to help. And I'm not only the support from the support team, but also through our venders or a vendor are counts, you know, I've or who we love way love the whole team because they're there for you to help me. We run into some pretty significant issues. One of the things that happened to us was we had some changing workloads in our media environment. Through no fault of nutanix is you know when when we introduce some additional workloads, we didn't anticipate some of the challenges that would come along with introducing those workloads. And what happened was we filled up our hot storage rather rapidly. Nutanix came in right away because we call them up and said, You know, we're having big performance issues. We need some help and they brought in P E O. C notes to help us get over the hump. They were there for us. I mean, within a week, they got us right back up and running and fully operational and even better performance than we had before. So until we could get our own notes procured and in house, which was fantastic, I've never seen that levels from another organization. So we love the support from Nutanix on DH. Since then, we've grown. So we've actually looked at nutanix for General server computer platform as well. And we're doing Christ Cross hyper visor Support across high provides a replication Sorry from production to D. R. So we're actually running Acropolis. Indy are running GM. Where in production. But has Stephanie alluded to? We're trying to get off of'Em were completely, you know, everyone talks about the attacks. We don't like the V attacks with Phil on a baby anywhere for something that's commodity. And we're looking to repurpose that money so we can look at other things such as you ten exciting way very much. Want to move to the cloud for D R. And that's sort of our direction. >> OK, so you guys have the m we're now, not you Not yet off the anywhere, but you plan to be >> playing to be Yes. >> Okay, So what's it going to look like How long is that gonna take or what is that? We're >> really hoping at the next six to twelve months. So I think we're really gonna push hard at. We've been talking to some people and it seems like it's gonna be a pretty smooth transition, So looking forward to it. And I think our team is really looking for true as well. That's >> one of the challenges right. That the team is really is one of the challenges because we've merged and there's a lot of change going on organization. It's difficult to throw more change at people, right? There's a whole human component, Teo everything that we do. So you know Well, that's why we moved GHB into d. R. To start because we said, You know what, give the operations folks time to look at it, timeto play with it, time to get familiar with it. And then we'LL make the change in production. But like we said, you know, moving over age, he's going to save us a ton of money like a ton of money that we can repurpose elsewhere to really start moving the business forward >> about operations for second. Because one of the things you told earlier is that consolidation? You're leading the project at the VD. I think we're new workloads. There's always gonna be problems. Always speed bumps and hot spots, as they say. But what has changed with the advent of software and Dev ops and automation starts to come into it. How do you see that playing out? Because you tell this is a software company. So you guys knew them when they were five years ago Now, But this is the trend in I t. Operations have clean program ability for the infrastructure. What's your view on that? What's your reaction to that? And you guys getting theirs at the goal >> that is >> like part of our road map. And we're gonna be working with our NUTANIX partners t build a roll map, actually, the next coming few weeks. So because we are emerging all these utilities, we'd love to get automation and orchestration, and we actually have another budget in three years. So it is on our road map. We want to get there right, because we want to have her staff work on business strategy. We don't want their fingers to keyboards. We want them actually working with the business and solution ing and not, you know, changing tapes or working on supporting a system when we don't have to do that anymore. Because now there's so it's so much simpler running any tennis environment. I know James is saying a lot of change for employees. There used to be M where Nutanix is new to a lot of them. I think they're quickly seeing the benefit of managing it because now they get to do things that are a little bit more fun than just managing an environment. >> And this is point cost to repurpose what you're paying for a commodity for free. And if you can repurpose and automata way the manual labor that's boring and repetitive, moving people to a higher value activity. >> Exactly. And we love the message we heard today about being invisible. >> Yeah, I love that >> way, Lovett. I mean, that's essentially we wanted. The business doesn't really care what you're doing behind the scenes, right? They just want their applications to work. They want everything to work seamlessly. So that's what we want to get, too. We want to get to that invisibility where we're moving the business, Ford. We're enabling them through technology, but they don't need to worry about the back end of what's actually going on. >> Stephanie, I want to ask you about both a personal and professional passion of yours, and that is about bringing more women into technology. You are a senior woman in technology, and we know we know the numbers. There is a dearth of female leaders. There is a dearth of underrepresented minorities, particularly in in high level management roles. So I want to hear from you both from a personal standpoint in terms of what your thoughts are on this problem and why, why we have this problem and then also what you, an elector are doing to remedy it. >> Yeah, I think you know, I'm really lucky to work at Electra because we actually have a diversion inclusion committee that I'm part of with a lot of stem organizations. But I think you know, there's all these great programs going on, and but I still don't see enough women in this in this industry, and I think a lot of it stems from you walk into a room, and if you're the only one of you it's really intimidating. So I think we really need to work on making people feel more welcome. You know, getting more women in cedar senior leadership positions and kind of bring them to events like this, gaming them on the Internet. Going to the university is going to the schools and talking to education and talking to, you know, CEOs and seals that don't have sea level women executives and saying, You know, there's a business benefit toe having diversity of all kinds in an organization, you know, you know, strength lies in differences, not in similarities. And I think we can really grow businesses and have that value if we have different types of opinions. And I think there's, you know, statistic shows when you have more diversity, your business is more successful. So I think senior leaders should pay attention and, you know, purposely try to hire more a more diverse workforce >> and what do you have anything to add to that? I mean, I know that it that it's maybe tougher for a man to weigh in on this issue, but at the same time it is one that affects all of us. >> Absolutely. And I think seventy, said it best right when you bring in, you know, multiple bill from different ethnicities from different genders. I mean, it's it's that wealth of knowledge and everyone brings from the different experiences they have in life, and I think that's what you need. You don't want to know the collective all thinking the same way you want the collective that bring the diversity into your organization. And I think you know, when I was in school, we had one woman in my entire computer engineering class, and you know that you wanted to see that change, right? I love to see more of that disease. More women being in the work force, especially within technology. >> I >> think that's Ah, it's fantastic for technology. >> Stephanie, What's your advice for young girls out there? Maybe in high school college, who are having gravitating towards either it's computer science or some sort of stem related field that might be intimidated? >> I think the one important thing you can do is like really rely on your family and friends for encouragement, cause I think sometimes it is gonna be intimidating, you know, For me I'd walk into a course and I was the only female my computer networking class. But I had, like my father, always encouraged me to push me to say, like, Don't ever be intimately. Don't ever be scared and you need a little bit of a fix. Came because for a little bit it is going to be just you in a room. But I think the more you speak up and the more you just kind of push yourself, I think it is going to get better. And I think it's almost kind of cool when you're the only female. Because you feel that pride. I want to do better. I want to do better for all of us to say like we can be. Not just a good, even better. >> Great. So great advice. Yeah. Stephanie James. Thank you both. So much for coming on. Thanks for having us. Pleasure talking, Teo. Thanks. I'm Rebecca Knight for John Furrier. We will have so much more of nutanix dot Next coming up in just a little bit

>> Live from Barcelona, Spain. It's the cue covering Sisqo. Live Europe, Brought to you by Cisco and its ecosystem partners. >> Come back. Everyone live here in Barcelona is the key. Exclusive coverage of Sisqo Live twenty nineteen. John for David Want my co host for the week, and Stupid Man was also here, doing interviews. Our next two guests is Mike Bundy, senior director of Global Cisco Lines with pure storage and Z, who's in charge of Christ Francisco. Welcome to the Cube. Thanks for joining >> us. Thank you for having us here. >> Also one, but we're in the definite zone. It's packed with people learning really use cases. Get rolling up the sleeves. Talk about the Cisco pure relationship. How do you guys fit into all this? What's the alliance? >> You understand? >> Sure. So we have a partnership with Cisco, primarily around a solution called flashback in the Converse infrastructure space. And most recently, we've evolved a new use case, an application together for our official intelligence that Z's business unit have just released a new platform that works with Cisco and in video to accomplish. You know, customer application needs mainly in machine learning, but but all aspects of our official intel it >> Hey, Eyes, obviously hot trend in machine learning. But today it's Cisco. The big story was, it's not about the data center as much anymore is. It's the data at the center of the value proposition, which spans the on premises I ot edge and multiple clouds. So data now is every where you gonna store it? So it's going to start in. The cloud is on premises. Data at the center means a lot of things you can programme with its gotta be addressable and has be smart and aware and take advantage of networking. So, with all that is a background backdrop, what is the A I approach? How should people think about a I in context to storing data using data, not just moving package from point A to point B? But you're storing it? You're pulling it out. You're in agreeing into apple cases. A lot of moving parts there. What's that? >> Yeah, you got a really good point here. When people think about machine learning traditional age, they just think about training. But we look at this more than Chinese. The whole did a pipeline that starts with collecting the data stored the data, analyze the data between the data and didn't deploy it and then for the data back. So it's really a vory. It's a cycle there, right? It's it's where you need to consider >> how you actually collect the data from the edge, how you store them in the speed that you can and give the data to the training side. So I believe way work was pure. We try to create this as a whole data pipeline and thinking about entire data movement and the star, which need that would look here. >> So we're in the definite zone, and I'm looking at the machine learning with Python ML library >> center >> Flow of Apache sparked a >> lot of this data >> science type stuff, but increasingly a ISA workload that's going mainstream. But what The trends that you guys are seeing in terms of, you know, traditional, I tease involvement is >> it's still sort of >> a I often an island. What are you seeing there? So I'll take a take a gas stab at it. So, really, every major company industry that we work with have you know, Aye, aye. Initiatives. It's the core of the future for their business. So, no, what we're trying to do is partner with I t to get ahead of the large infrastructure demands that will come from those smaller, innovative projects that Aeryn pilot mode so that they are a partner to the business and the data scientist, rather than, you know, a laggard in the business. The way that you know, sometimes there the reputation that that I guess we want to be the infrastructure solid, you know, like a cloud like experience for the data scientists. So they can worry more about the applications, the data, what it means the business and less about the infrastructure. Okay. And so you guys are trying to simplify that >> infrastructure, whether it's converged infrastructure. No other sort of unifying approaches is Are you seeing the shift of a sort of that heavy lifting of people out now? Shifting resource is, too. You work loads like a I Maybe you could discuss trends, are there? >> Yeah, absolutely. So I think I started was more like a data signs experiment. Right? You see, want to date, assigns a couple of data science experiment. Now it's really getting into ministry. More and more people report into that and us. Apologize. Mike, Mike, The way we start that questions my deep apology. I need a GP or something. >> Like, I need to >> store the data better. >> Your fortnight? Yes. >> So as Micah's had early on, right? It's it's not just the data scientist is actually all a challenge as well. And I think was Cisco, where twenty do was pure. Here is, you know, that Cisco thing. We're saying we're breach right. We want to bridge the gap between the data scientists and the it and make it not just as experiments, but a scale at production level and be wedded to actually, Crew will impact with the technology infrastructure that we can table >> might talk about yours position You guys have announced here in the cloud. Yes, he's seeing that software. Focus software is the key here. Or you can get to a software model. Aye, aye. And she learned Only we're talking about is software data is now available to be addressed and managing that software. Lifecycle. How is this Corolla software for you guys? With converge infrastructure at the San Francisco announce your downstage day, we'll converge infrastructure to the edge. >> Yeah, so if you look at the plant, one that we built, that's it's referenced by being called the data hub. The data hub has a very tight synergy, with all the applications referring to spark tenser PLO, etcetera, etcetera cafe. So we look it as the next generation analytics, and the platform has a super layer on top of all those applications because that that's going to really make the integration possible for the data scientists. They could go quicker and faster. What we're trying to do underneath that is used the data hub that no matter what the size, whether it's small data, large data transaction based or more bulk data warehouse type applications, you know the data hub in the flash blade solution or need handle all of that very, very different and probably more optimizing and easier than traditional legacy infrastructures, even tradition, even even even flash, you know, from some of our competitors. Because, you know, we've built this a purpose built application for that, you know, not trying to go backwards in terms of technology, >> I want to put both you guys on the spot for a question. We hear infrastructure is code for going on many, many years since the few started at nine years ago. Infrastructures code. Now it's here. The network's programmable infrastructures, programmable storages, programmable What a customer! Or someone asked you. How is infrastructure Network's in storage, Programmable. And what do I do? I'm used to provisional storage. I've got servers. I'm going cloud. What do I do? How do I become? A. I enabled that I could program the infrastructure. How do you guys answer that question? >> So a lot of that comes to the infrastructure management layer, right? How do you actually using policy and using the white infrastructure managing to make the right configuration want? And I think one thing from program eligibility is also flexibility. Instead of having just a fixed conflagration. What we're doing with pure here is really having that flexibility right where you can put pure Star Ridge different kind of star, which was different, kind off. Compute that you have. No matter. It's we're talking about two are used for you. That kind of computing power is different and connects with a different Star wars, depending on what the customer use cases. So that flexibility driven by the driven to the proper program ability that is managed by the infrastructure. Imagine a layer, and we're extending that So pure and Cisco's infrastructure management actually tying together it's really single pane of glass was in decide that we can actually manage both pure and Cisco. That's the program ability that we're talking >> about. Get pure storage and to end manageability. >> Where's the Cisco compute its A single pane of glass. >> So what do I buy? I want to get started. What? What do you got for me? What you have, it's pretty simple. Three basic components, you know, Cisco Compute and a platform for machine learning that's powered by and video GP. Use Cisco Flash Blade, which is the data hub and storage component and then network connectivity from the number one network provider in the world. Francisco. Very simple. It's askew. It's a solution. It's very, very skewed. It's very simple. It's data driven, so you know it's not tied to a specific skew. It's more flexible than that. So you have a better optimization of the network. You know you don't buy a one thousand Siri's ex. Okay, Only used fifty percent of it. It's very customized. Okay, so I can customize it for my whatever data science team or my workloads and provisioning for multipurpose. Same way of service provider would ifyou're a large organization >> trend trend around Breaking Silas has been being discussed heavily. Talk about multiple clouds on premise and cloud and edge all coming together. How should companies think about their data architecture on? Because Silas Air good for certain things to make multi cloud work and all this and to end and intent based networking and all the power of a eyes around the corner. You gotta have the date out there, right? It's gotta be horizontally scaleable of you. How do you break down those silos? Twitter advises air use cases or anarchic for architecture. >> You know what I think? It's a classic example of how it has evolved to not think just silos and be multi cloud. So you know, we've advocate is is you have a date, a platform that transpires the entire community, whether its development, test engineering production applications and that, you know, runs holistically across the entire organization that would include on from it would include integration with the cloud. Because most you know cos now require, That s so you could have different levels of high availability or lower cost if your data needs to be archived. So it's really, you know, building and thinking about The data is on platform across the across the company and not just you know, silos for >> replication never goes away. Never. It's gonna be around for a long, long time. >> Deaf tests never goes away. Yeah, >> you thought some >> s o i. D On top of that, We believe where you infrastructure should go is where the data goes, right? You want to follow that where the data is, And that's exactly why I want a partner was pure here because we see a lot of the data sitting today in the very important infrastructure which is built by pure storage and want to make sure that we're not just building a sidle box sitting there where you have for the data in there all the time, but actually connected our chips. Silver was pure storage in the most manageable way. And it's the same kind of manager layer you're not thinking about All have to manage all the Sala box or the shadow it that some day that time would have under their desks. Right. That's the least thing you want it. >> And the other thing that came up in the Kino today, which we've been seeing on the Cuban, all the experts reaffirm, is moving data cost money got late in sea. Costs also just cost to move traffic around, so moving compute to the edge of moving. Compute to the data has been a big hot trend. How is the computer equation changed? I got storage. I'm moving. I'm not just moving packets around. I'm storing it and moving it around. How does that changed the computers? It put more emphasis on the computer. >> Wait, It's definitely putting a lot more emphasis on computer. I think it's where you want to compute to happen, right? You can pull all the data and I want it happen in the centre place. That's fine if that's the way you want to manage it. If you have, if you have already simplify the data, you want to put it in that way. If you want to do it at the edge near where the data sources, you can also do the cleaning there. So we want to make sure that no matter how you want to manage it. We have the portfolio that can actually help you to manage. And >> his alternative alternate processors mentioned video first. Yeah, you would deal with them in other ways to you've got to take advantage of technologies like uber, Nettie says. Example. So you can move the containers where they need to be and have policy managers for the computer requirements. And also, you know, storage so you don't have contention or data and integrity issues. So embracing those technologies and a multi cloud world, it's very, very >> like. I want to ask you a question around customer trends. What are you seeing as a pattern from a customer standpoint as they prepare for a I and start re factory? Some of their end or resource is. Is there a certain use case that they set up with pure in terms of how they set up their storage? Is it different by customers? Are a common trend that you see >> there are some commonalities, you know, like take financial services want trading as an example. We have a number of customers that leverage our platform for that. Is this very you know, time sensitive, high availability data? So really, I think the customers the trend over all of that would be a step back. Take a look at your data and focus on how can I correlate, Organize that and really get it ready so that whatever platform used from a story standpoint, you're you're thinking about all aspects of data and get it in a format in a forum where you can manage and catalog, because that's kind of the sentence. >> I mean, it really highlights all the key things that would say it in storage for a long time. I availability integrity of the data. And now you got at patient developers programming with data. This's a hole with a P IIs. Now you're slinging FBI's around like it's Tom mentioned me its weight should be. This is like Nirvana finally got here. How far along are we in the progress? How far we earlier we moving the needle? Where the >> customers himself a partnership partnership. Deanna >> and General, You guys were going to say, You got you got storage, You got networking and compute all kind of working together. That's reflex school elastic like the cloud >> I my feeling, mike, contract me or you can disagree with me. I think right now, if we look at all the wood analysts saying what we're saying, I think most of the companies more than fifty percent of companies either have deployed a Emma or are considering implant off deploying that right. But having said that, we do see that we're seeing at a relatively early stage because the challenges off making a deployment at scale where data scientist and I'd really working together, right? You need that level of security in that level, off skill ofthe infrastructure and software involving Devon I. So my feeling is where stew At a relatively early stage, >> I think we are in the early adopter face. You know, we've had customers for last two years. They've really been driving this way, worked with about seven of the automated car, you know, driving Cos. But, you know, if you look at the data from Morgan Stanley and other analysts, is about a thirteen billion dollars infrastructure that's required for a eye over the next three years from twenty, nineteen, twenty, twenty one. So you know, that is probably six x seven x what it is today, so we haven't quite hit that. >> So people are doing their homework right now. You are the leader. >> Its leaders in the industry, not mastering everybody else is going to close that gap. So that's where you guys come into helping that scale way built this. This platform with Cisco on is really flashback for a I is around scale for, you know, tens and twenties of petabytes of data that will be required for >> these targeted solution for a I with all the integration pieces Francisco built in. Yes. Great. We'll keep track of a look sighting. We think it's cliche to say future proof, but this, in this case, literally is preparing for the future. The bridge? >> Yes. Future. Yes. You >> know, as the news is good, it's acute coverage. He live in Barcelona with more live coverage after this short break. Thanks for watching. I'm John Barrier, but David won't they stay with us. >> Thank you.

[Music] we're on welcome to the special cube conversation we're here with some breaking news we got some startup investment news here in the Q studios palo alto I'm John for your host here at Jerry Chen partnered Greylock and the CEO of rock said Venkat Venkat Rahmani welcome to the cube you guys announcing hot news today series a and seed and Series A funding 21 million dollars for your company congratulations thank you Roxette is a data company jerry great this is one of your nest you kept this secret forever it was John was really hard you know over the past two years every time I sat in this seat I'd say and one more thing you know I knew that part of the advantage was rocks I was a special company and we were waiting to announce it and that's right time so it's been about two and half years in the making I gotta give you credit Jerry I just want to say to everyone I try to get the secrets out of you so hard you are so strong and keeping a secret I said you got this hot startup this was two years ago yeah I think the probe from every different angle you can keep it secrets all the entrepreneurs out there Jerry Chen's your guide alright so congratulations let's talk about the startup so you guys got 21 million dollars how much was the seed round this is the series a the seed was three million dollars both Greylock and Sequoia participating and the series a was eighteen point five all right so other investors Jerry who else was in on this I just the two firms former beginning so we teamed up with their French from Sequoia and the seed round and then we over the course of a year and half like this is great we're super excited about the team bank had Andrew bhai belt we love the opportunity and so Mike for an office coin I said let's do this around together and we leaned in and we did it around alright so let's just get into the other side I'm gonna read your your about section of the press release roxette's visions to Korea to build the data-driven future provide a service search and analytics engine make it easy to go from data to applications essentially building a sequel layer on top of the cloud for massive data ingestion I want to jump into it but this is a hot area not a lot of people are doing this at the level you guys are now and what your vision is did this come from what's your background how did you get here did you wake up one Wednesday I'm gonna build this awesome contraction layer and build an operating system around data make this thing scalable how did it all start I think it all started from like just a realization that you know turning useful data to useful apps just requires lots of like hurdles right you have to first figure out what format the data is in you got to prepare the data you gotta find the right specialized you know data database or data management system to load it in and it often requires like weeks to months before useful data becomes useful apps right and finally you know after I you know my tenure at Facebook when I left the first thing I did was I was just talking you know talking to a lot of people with real-world companies and reload problems and I started walking away from moremore of them thinking that this is way too complex I think the the format in which a lot of the data is coming in is not the format in which traditional sequel based databases are optimized for and they were built for like transaction processing and analytical processing not for like real-time streams of data but there's JSON or you know you know parque or or any of these other formats that are very very popular and more and more data is getting produced by one set of applications and getting consumed by other applications but what we saw it was what is this how can we make it simpler why do we need all this complexity right what is a simple what is the most simple and most powerful system we can build and pulled in the hands of as many people as possible and so we very sort of naturally relate to developers and data scientists people who use code on data that's just like you know kind of like our past lives and when we thought about it well why don't we just index the data you know traditional databases were built when every byte mattered every byte of memory every byte on disk now in the cloud the economics are completely different right so when you rethink those things with fresh perspective what we said was like what if we just get all of this data index it in a format where we can directly run very very fast sequel on it how simple would the world be how much faster can people go from ideas to do experiments and experiments to production applications and how do we make it all faster also in the cloud right so that's really the genesis of it well the real inspiration came from actually talking to a lot of people with real-world problems and then figuring out what is the simplest most powerful thing we can build well I want to get to the whole complexity conversation cuz we were talking before we came on camera here about how complexity can kill and why and more complexity on top of more complexity I think there's a simplicity angle here that's interesting but I want to get back to your background of Facebook and I want to tell a story you've been there eight years but you were there during a very interesting time during that time in history Facebook was I think the first generation we've taught us on the cube all the time about how they had to build their own infrastructure at scale while they're scaling so they were literally blitzscaling as reid hoffman and would say and you guys do it the Greylock coverage unlike other companies at scale eBay Microsoft they had old-school one dotto Technology databases Facebook had to kind of you know break glass you know and build the DevOps out from generation one from scratch correct it was a fantastic experience I think when I started in 2007 Facebook had about 40 million monthly actives and I had the privilege of working with some of the best people and a lot of the problems we were very quickly around 2008 when I went and said hey I want to do some infrastructure stuff the mandate that was given to me and my team was we've been very good at taking open source software and customizing it to our needs what would infrastructure built by Facebook for Facebook look like and we then went into this journey that ended up being building the online data infrastructure at Facebook by the time I left the collectively these systems were surveying 5 plus billion requests per second across 25 plus geographical clusters and half a dozen data centers I think at that time and now there's more and the system continues to chug along so it was just a fantastic experience I think all the traditional ways of problem solving just would not work at that scale and when the user base was doubling early in the early days every four months every five months yeah and what's interesting you know you're young and here at the front lines but you're kind of the frog in boiling water and that's because you are you were at that time building the power DevOps equation automating scale growth everything's happening at once you guys were right there building it now fast forward today everyone who's got an enterprise it's it wants to get there they don't they're not Facebook they don't have this engineering staff they want to get scale they see the cloud clearly the value property has got clear visibility but the economics behind who they hire so they have all this data and they get more increasing amount of data they want to be like Facebook but can't be like Facebook so they have to build their own solutions and I think this is where a lot of the other vendors have to rebuild this cherry I want to ask you because you've been looking at a lot of investments you've seen that old guard kind of like recycled database solutions coming to the market you've seen some stuff in open source but nothing unique what was it about Roxette that when you first talk to them that but you saw that this is going to be vectoring into a trend that was going to be a perfect storm yeah I think you nailed it John historic when we have this new problems like how to use data the first thing trying to do you saw with the old technology Oh existing data warehouses akin databases okay that doesn't work and then the next thing you do is like okay you know through my investments in docker and B and the boards or a cloud aerosol firsthand you need kind of this rise of stateless apps but not stateless databases right and then I through the cloud area and a bunch of companies that I saw has an investor every pitch I saw for two or three years trying to solve this data and state problem the cloud dudes add more boxes right here's here's a box database or s3 let me solve it with like Oh another database elastic or Kafka or Mongo or you know Apache arrow and it just got like a mess because if almond Enterprise IT shop there's no way can I have the skill the developers to manage this like as Beckett like to call it Rube Goldberg machination of data pipelines and you know I first met Venkat three years ago and one of the conversations was you know complexity you can't solve complex with more complexity you can only solve complexity with simplicity and Roxette and the vision they had was the first company said you know what let's remove boxes and their design principle was not adding another boxes all a problem but how to remove boxes to solve this problem and you know he and I got along with that vision and excited from the beginning stood to leave the scene ah sure let's go back with you guys now I got the funding so use a couple stealth years to with three million which is good a small team and that goes a long way it certainly 2021 total 18 fresh money it's gonna help you guys build out the team and crank whatnot get that later but what did you guys do in the in those two years where are you now sequel obviously is lingua franca cool of sequel but all this data is doesn't need to be scheming up and built out so were you guys that now so since raising the seed I think we've done a lot of R&D I think we fundamentally believe traditional data management systems that have been ported over to run on cloud Williams does not make them cloud databases I think the cloud economics is fundamentally different I think we're bringing this just scratching the surface of what is possible the cloud economics is you know it's like a simple realization that whether you rent 100 CPUs for one minute or or one CPU 400 minutes it's cost you exactly the same so then if you really ask why is any of my query is slow right I think because your software sucks right so basically what I'm trying to say is if you can actually paralyze that and if you can really exploit the fluidity of the hardware it's not easy it's very very difficult very very challenging but it's possible I think it's not impossible and if you can actually build software ground-up natively in the cloud that simplifies a lot of this stuff and and understands the economics are different now and it's system software at the end of the day is how do I get the best you know performance and efficiency for the price being paid right and the you know really building you know that is really what I think took a lot of time for us we have built not only a ground-up indexing technique that can take raw data without knowing the shape of the data we can turn that and index it in ways and store them maybe in more than one way since for certain types of data and then also have built a distributed sequel engine that is cloud native built by ground up in the cloud and C++ and like really high performance you know technologies and we can actually run distributor sequel on this raw data very very fast my god and this is why I brought up your background on Facebook I think there's a parallel there from the ground this ground up kind of philosophy if you think of sequel as like a Google search results search you know keyword it's the keyword for machines in most database worlds that is the standard so you can just use that as your interface Christ and then you using the cloud goodness to optimize for more of the results crafty index is that right correct yes you can ask your question if your app if you know how to see you sequel you know how to use Roxette if you can frame your the question that you're asking in order to answer an API request it could be a micro service that you're building it could be a recommendation engine that you're that you're building or you could you could have recommendations you know trying to personalize it on top of real time data any of those kinds of applications where it's a it's a service that you're building an application you're building if you can represent ask a question in sequel we will make sure it's fast all right let's get into the how you guys see the application development market because the developers will other winners here end of the day so when we were covering the Hadoop ecosystem you know from the cloud era days and now the important work at the Claire merger that kind of consolidates that kind of open source pool the big complaint that we used to hear from practitioners was its time consuming Talent but we used to kind of get down and dirty the questions and ask people how they're using Hadoop and we had two answers we stood up Hadoop we were running Hadoop in our company and then that was one answer the other answer was we're using Hadoop for blank there was not a lot of those responses in other words there has to be a reason why you're using it not just standing it up and then the Hadoop had the problem of the world grew really fast who's gonna run it yeah management of it Nukem noose new things came in so became complex overnight it kind of had took on cat hair on it basically as we would say so how do you guys see your solution being used so how do you solve that what we're running Roxette oh okay that's great for what what did developers use Roxette for so there are two big personas that that we currently have as users right there are developers and data scientists people who program on data right - you know on one hand developers want to build applications that are making either an existing application better it could be a micro service that you know I want to personalize the recommendations they generated online I mean offline but it's served online but whether it is somebody you know asking shopping for cars on San Francisco was the shopping you know was the shopping for cars in Colorado we can't show the same recommendations based on how do we basically personalize it so personalization IOT these kinds of applications developers love that because often what what you need to do is you need to combine real-time streams coming in semi structured format with structured data and you have no no sequel type of systems that are very good at semi structured data but they don't give you joins they don't give you a full sequel and then traditional sequel systems are a little bit cumbersome if you think about it I new elasticsearch but you can do joins and much more complex correct exactly built for the cloud and with full feature sequel and joins that's how that's the best way to think about it and that's how developers you said on the other side because its sequel now all of a sudden did you know data scientist also loved it they had they want to run a lot of experiments they are the sitting on a lot of data they want to play with it run experiments test hypotheses before they say all right I got something here I found a pattern that I don't know I know I had before which is why when you go and try to stand up traditional database infrastructure they don't know how what indexes to build how do i optimize it so that I can ask you know interrogatory and all that complexity away from those people right from basically provisioning a sandbox if you will almost like a perpetual sandbox of data correct except it's server less so like you don't you never think about you know how many SSDs do I need how many RAM do I need how many hosts do I need what configure your programmable data yes exactly so you start so DevOps for data is finally the interview I've been waiting for I've been saying it for years when's is gonna be a data DevOps so this is kind of what you're thinking right exactly so you know you give us literally you you log in to rocks at you give us read permissions to battle your data sitting in any cloud and more and more data sources we're adding support every day and we will automatically cloudburst will automatically interested we will schematize the data and we will give you very very fast sequel over rest so if you know how to use REST API and if you know how to use sequel you'd literally need don't need to think about anything about Hardware anything about standing up any servers shards you know reindex and restarting none of that you just go from here is a bunch of data here are my questions here is the app I want to build you know like you should be bottleneck by your career and imagination not by what can my data employers give me through a use case real quick island anyway the Jarius more the structural and architectural questions around the marketplace take me through a use case I'm a developer what's the low-hanging fruit use case how would I engage with you guys yeah do I just you just ingest I just point data at you how do you see your market developing from the customer standpoint cool I'll take one concrete example from a from a developer right from somebody we're working with right now so they have right now offline recommendations right or every night they generate like if you're looking for this car or or this particular item in e-commerce these are the other things are related well they show the same thing if you're looking at let's say a car this is the five cars that are closely related this car and they show that no matter who's browsing well you might have clicked on blue cars the 17 out of 18 clicks you should be showing blue cars to them right you may be logging in from San Francisco I may be logging in from like Colorado we may be looking for different kinds of cars with different you know four-wheel drives and other options and whatnot there's so much information that's available that you can you're actually by personalizing it you're adding creating more value to your customer we make it very easy you know live stream all the click stream beta to rock set and you can join that with all the assets that you have whether it's product data user data past transaction history and now if you can represent the joins or whatever personalization that you want to find in real time as a sequel statement you can build that personalization engine on top of Roxanne this is one one category you're putting sequel code into the kind of the workflow of the code saying okay when someone gets down to these kinds of interactions this is the sequel query because it's a blue car kind of go down right so like tell me all the recent cars that this person liked what color is this and I want to like okay here's a set of candidate recommendations I have how do I start it what are the four five what are the top five I want to show and then on the data science use case there's a you know somebody building a market intelligence application they get a lot of third-party data sets it's periodic dumps of huge blocks of JSON they want to combine that with you know data that they have internally within the enterprise to see you know which customers are engaging with them who are the persons churning out what are they doing and they in the in the market and trying to bring they bring it all together how do you do that when you how do you join a sequel table with a with a JSON third party dumb and especially for coming and like in the real-time or periodic in a week or week month or one month literally you can you know what took this particular firm that we're working with this is an investment firm trying to do market intelligence it used age to run ad hoc scripts to turn all of this data into a useful Excel report and that used to take them three to four weeks and you know two people working on one person working part time they did the same thing in two days and Rock said I want to get to back to microservices in a minute and hold that thought I won't go to Jerry if you want to get to the business model question that landscape because micro services were all the world's going to Inc so competition business model I'll see you gets are funded so they said love the thing about monetization to my stay on the core value proposition in light of the red hat being bought by by IBM had a tweet out there kind of critical of the transactions just in terms of you know people talk about IBM's betting the company on RedHat Mike my tweet was don't get your reaction will and tie it to the visible here is that it seems like they're going to macro services not micro services and that the world is the stack is changing so when IBM sell out their stack you have old-school stack thinkers and then you have new-school stack thinkers where cloud completely changes the nature of the stack in this case this venture kind of is an indication that if you think differently the stack is not just a full stack this way it's this way in this way yeah as we've been saying on the queue for a couple of years so you get the old guard trying to get a position and open source all these things but the stacks changing these guys have the cloud out there as a tailwind which is a good thing how do you see the business model evolving do you guys talk about that in terms of you can hey just try to find your groove swing get customers don't worry about the monetization how many charging so how's that how do you guys talk about the business model is it specific and you guys have clear visibility on that what's the story on that I mean I think yeah I always tell Bank had this kind of three hurdles you know you have something worthwhile one well someone listen to your pitch right people are busy you like hey John you get pitched a hundred times a day by startups right will you take 30 seconds listen to it that's hurdle one her will to is we spend time hands on keyboards playing around with the code and step threes will they write you a check and I as a as a enter price offered investor in a former operator we don't overly folks in the revenue model now I think writing a check the biz model just means you're creating value and I think people write you checking screening value but you know the feedback I always give Venkat and the founders work but don't overthink pricing if the first 10 customers just create value like solve their problems make them love the product get them using it and then the monetization the actual specifics the business model you know we'll figure out down the line I mean it's a cloud service it's you know service tactically to many servers in that sentence but it's um it's to your point spore on the cloud the one that economists are good so if it works it's gonna be profitable yeah it's born the cloud multi-cloud right across whatever cloud I wanna be in it's it's the way application architects going right you don't you don't care about VMs you don't care about containers you just care about hey here's my data I just want to query it and in the past you us developer he had to make compromises if I wanted joins in sequel queries I had to use like postgrads if I won like document database and he's like Mongo if I wanted index how to use like elastic and so either one I had to pick one or two I had to use all three you know and and neither world was great and then all three of those products have different business models and with rocks head you actually don't need to make choices right yes this is classic Greylock investment you got sequoia same way go out get a position in the market don't overthink the revenue model you'll funded for grow the company let's scale a little bit and figure out that blitzscale moment I believe there's probably the ethos that you guys have here one thing I would add in the business model discussion is that we're not optimized to sell latte machines who are selling coffee by the cup right so like that's really what I mean we want to put it in the hands of as many people as possible and make sure we are useful to them right and I think that is what we're obsessed about where's the search is a good proxy I mean that's they did well that way and rocks it's free to get started right so right now they go to rocks calm get started for free and just start and play around with it yeah yeah I mean I think you guys hit the nail on the head on this whole kind of data addressability I've been talking about it for years making it part of the development process programming data whatever buzzword comes out of it I think the trend is it looks a lot like that depo DevOps ethos of automation scale you get to value quickly not over thinking it the value proposition and let it organically become part of the operation yeah I think we we the internal KPIs we track are like how many users and applications are using us on a daily and weekly basis this is what we obsess about I think we say like this is what excellence looks like and we pursue that the logos in the revenue would would you know would be a second-order effect yeah and it's could you build that core kernels this classic classic build up so I asked about the multi cloud you mention that earlier I want to get your thoughts on kubernetes obviously there's a lot of great projects going on and CN CF around is do and this new state problem that you're solving in rest you know stateless has been an easy solution VP is but API 2.0 is about state right so that's kind of happening now what's your view on kubernetes why is it going to be impactful if someone asked you you know at a party hey thank you why is what's all this kubernetes what party going yeah I mean all we do is talk about kubernetes and no operating systems yeah hand out candy last night know we're huge fans of communities and docker in fact in the entire rock set you know back-end is built on top of that so we run an AWS but with the inside that like we run or you know their entire infrastructure in one kubernetes cluster and you know that is something that I think is here to stay I think this is the the the programmability of it I think the DevOps automation that comes with kubernetes I think all of that is just like this is what people are going to start taking why is it why is it important in your mind the orchestration because of the statement what's the let's see why is it so important it's a lot of people are jazzed about it I've been you know what's what's the key thing I think I think it makes your entire infrastructure program all right I think it turns you know every aspect of you know for example yeah I'll take it I'll take a concrete example we wanted to build this infrastructure so that when somebody points that like it's a 10 terabytes of data we want to very quickly Auto scale that out and be able to grow this this cluster as quickly as possible and it's like this fluidity of the hardware that I'm talking about and it needs to happen or two levels it's one you know micro service that is ingesting all the data that needs to sort of burst out and also at the second level we need to be able to grow more more nodes that we we add to this cluster and so the programmability nature of this like just imagine without an abstraction like kubernetes and docker and containers and pods imagine doing this right you are building a you know a lots and lots of metrics and monitoring and you're trying to build the state machine of like what is my desired state in terms of server utilization and what is the observed state and everything is so ad hoc and very complicated and kubernetes makes this whole thing programmable so I think it's now a lot of the automation that we do in terms of called bursting and whatnot when I say clock you know it's something we do take advantage of that with respect to stateful services I think it's still early days so our our position on my partner it's a lot harder so our position on that is continue to use communities and continue to make things as stateless as possible and send your real-time streams to a service like Roxette not necessarily that pick something like that very separate state and keep it in a backhand that is very much suited to your micro service and the business logic that needs to live there continue should continue to live there but if you can take a very hard to scale stateful service split it into two and have some kind of an indexing system Roxette is one that you know we are proud of building and have your stateless communal application logic and continue to have that you know maybe use kubernetes scale it in lambdas you know for all we care but you can take something that is very hard to you know manage and scale today break it into the stateful part in the stateless part and the serval is back in like like Roxette will will sort of hopefully give you a huge boost in being able to go from you know an experiment to okay I'm gonna roll it out to a smaller you know set of audience to like I want to do a worldwide you know you can do all of that without having to worry about and think about the alternative if you did it the old way yeah yeah and that's like talent you'd need it would be a wired that's spaghetti everywhere so Jerry this is a kubernetes is really kind of a benefit off your your investment in docker you must be proud and that the industry has gone to a whole nother level because containers really enable all this correct yeah so that this is where this is an example where I think clouds gonna go to a whole nother level that no one's seen before these kinds of opportunities that you're investing in so I got to ask you directly as you're looking at them as a as a knowledgeable cloud guy as well as an investor cloud changes things how does that change how is cloud native and these kinds of new opportunities that have built from the ground up change a company's network network security application era formants because certainly this is a game changer so those are the three areas I see a lot of impact compute check storage check networking early days you know it's it's it's funny it gosh seems so long ago yet so briefly when you know I first talked five years ago when I first met mayor of Essen or docker and it was from beginning people like okay yes stateless applications but stateful container stateless apps and then for the next three or four years we saw a bunch of companies like how do I handle state in a docker based application and lots of stars have tried and is the wrong approach the right approach is what these guys have cracked just suffered the state from the application those are app stateless containers store your state on an indexing layer like rock set that's hopefully one of the better ways saw the problem but as you kind of under one problem and solve it with something like rock set to your point awesome like networking issue because all of a sudden like I think service mesh and like it's do and costs or kind of the technologies people talk about because as these micro services come up and down they're pretty dynamic and partially as a developer I don't want to care about that yeah right that's the value like a Roxanna service but still as they operate of the cloud or the IT person other side of the proverbial curtain I probably care security I matters because also India's flowing from multiple locations multiple destinations using all these API and then you have kind of compliance like you know GDP are making security and privacy super important right now so that's an area that we think a lot about as investors so can I program that into Roxette what about to build that in my nap app natively leveraging the Roxette abstraction checking what's the key learning feature it's just a I'd say I'm a prime agent Ariane gdpr hey you know what I got a website and social network out in London and Europe and I got this gdpr nightmare I don't we don't have a great answer for GDP are we are we're not a controller of the data right we're just a processor so I think for GDP are I think there is still the controller still has to do a lot of work to be compliant with GDP are I think the way we look at it is like we never forget that this ultimately is going to be adding value to enterprises so from day one we you can't store data and Roxette without encrypting it like it's just the on you know on by default the only way and all transit is all or HTTPS and SSL and so we never freaked out that we're building for enterprises and so we've baked in for enterprise customers if they can bring in their own custom encryption key and so everything will be encrypted the key never leaves their AWS account if it's a you know kms key support private VP ceilings like we have a plethora of you know security features so that the the control of the data is still with the data controller with this which is our customer but we will be the the processor and a lot of the time we can process it using their encryption keys if I'm gonna build a GDP our sleeves no security solution I would probably build on Roxette and some of the early developers take around rocks at our security companies that are trying to track we're all ideas coming and going so there the processor and then one of the companies we hope to enable with Roxette is another generation security and privacy companies that in the past had a hard time tracking all this data so I can build on top of rocks crack okay so you can built you can build security a gbbr solution on top rock set because rock set gives you the power to process all the data index all the data and then so one of the early developers you know stolen stealth is they looking at the data flows coming and go he's using them and they'll apply the context right they'll say oh this is your credit card the Social Security is your birthday excetera your favorite colors and they'll apply that but I think to your point it's game-changing like not just Roxette but all the stuff in cloud and as an investor we see a whole generation of new companies either a to make things better or B to solve this new category problems like pricing the cloud and I think the future is pretty bright for both great founders and investors because there's just a bunch of great new companies and it's building up from the ground up this is the thing I brought my mother's red hat IBM thing is that's not the answer at the root level I feel like right now I'd be on I I think's fastenings but it's almost like you're almost doubling down to your your comment on the old stack right it's almost a double down the old stack versus an aggressive bet on kind of what a cloud native stack will look like you know I wish both companies are great people I was doing the best and stuff do well with I think I'd like to do great with OpenStack but again their product company as the people that happen to contribute to open source I think was a great move for both companies but it doesn't mean that that's not we can't do well without a new stack doing well and I think you're gonna see this world where we have to your point oh these old stacks but then a category of new stack companies that are being born in the cloud they're just fun to watch it all it's all big all big investments that would be blitzscaling criteria all start out organically on a wave in a market that has problems yeah and that's growing so I think cloud native ground-up kind of clean sheet of paper that's the new you know I say you're just got a pic pick up you got to pick the right way if I'm oh it's gotta pick a big wave big wave is not a bad wave to be on right now and it's at the data way that's part of the cloud cracked and it's it's been growing bigger it's it's arguably bigger than IBM is bigger than Red Hat is bigger than most of the companies out there and I think that's the right way to bet on it so you're gonna pick the next way that's kind of cloud native-born the cloud infrastructure that is still early days and companies are writing that way we're gonna do well and so I'm pretty excited there's a lot of opportunities certainly this whole idea that you know this change is coming societal change you know what's going on mission based companies from whether it's the NGO to full scale or all the applications that the clouds can enable from data privacy your wearables or cars or health thing we're seeing it every single day I'm pretty sad if you took amazon's revenue and then edit edit and it's not revenue the whole ready you look at there a dybbuk loud revenue so there's like 20 billion run which you know Microsoft had bundles in a lot of their office stuff as well if you took amazon's customers to dinner in the marketplace and took their revenue there clearly would be never for sure if item binds by a long shot so they don't count that revenue and that's a big factor if you look at whoever can build these enabling markets right now there's gonna be a few few big ones I think coming on they're gonna do well so I think this is a good opportunity of gradual ations thank you thank you at 21 million dollars final question before we go what are you gonna spend it on we're gonna spend it on our go-to-market strategy and hiding amazing people as many as we can get good good answer didn't say launch party that I'm saying right yeah okay we're here Rex at SIA and Joe's Jerry Chen cube cube royalty number two all-time on our Keeble um nine list partner and Greylock guy states were coming in I'm Jeffrey thanks for watching this special cube conversation [Music]

>> Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE, covering VMworld 2018. (upbeat music) Brought to you by VMware and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back to theCUBE's continuing coverage of VMworld 2018, I'm Lisa Martin with Dave Vellante. Hey Dave! >> Hey Lisa, how's it going? >> Good, day two. >> Good to see you back here again. >> Exactly! >> Bouncin' between the sets. >> I am. >> 94 guests, it's good. >> In three days, yeah. We've learned a lot already and we're nearing the end of day two. Excited to welcome two new guys to theCUBE, we've got Colin Durocher, Project Manager from Dell EMC, and Sandro Bercelli, Global Product Manager at Telefonica. Gentlemen, it's nice to have you here. >> Great to be here, first time on theCUBE. >> So first time on theCUBE, 20th anniversary of VMware, lots to celebrate, lots going on. From an announcement perspective, momentum perspective, Colin, let's start with you. What are some of the market trends, the customer voices that you were hearing regarding data protection and it's criticality in this multi-cloud world, in which all these enterprises now live? >> Sure, I think we have to put it into context with the growth of the cloud. The cloud is growing exponentially and data protection is one of the leading use cases. I think IDC did a survey recently, 58% of people using the cloud are doing data protection in the cloud. Backup and recovery is the number one use case. So that's one trend. Another trend is more specific to VMworld and VMware. Their vCloud provider program is, or the business unit is one of the fastest growing business units at VMware. They're having incredible success built on the back of fantastic products. And so what we've done is, about a year ago actually, at VMworld last year we formed a three-way partnership between Telefonica, VMware and Dell EMC, to provide a turnkey solution for cloud providers to deliver data protection as a service. >> So I wonder if we can talk a little bit about Telefonica and your business and how it's evolved, say, over the last, I don't know, pick a time frame, decade, better part of a decade. How is it evolving and changing? >> It's a long partnership that you have between Dell EMC and Telefonica and VMware. So we start many years ago, launching new versions of it to see 2.0, 3.0, and now moving to 4.0. So was not so easy doing this journey to improve our service catalog to our customers. And right now, with the VDC 4.0 with the new interface of the cloud director 9.x (mumbles) in data protection software of VMC, but increasing a lot the functionalities show our customers, increasing the user experience of our customers. It is our very valuable to our customers in this new approach of the VDC 4.0. >> So if you think about, if you go back to the early days of virtualization, everybody sort of, you know, took 10 servers, and brought them down to one, which is great, because all the compute power was under-utilized. But of course the one job that needed all that compute power was backup. >> [Colin And Sandro] Sure. >> Then you saw data protection change to accommodate that. Okay, and customers re-architected, et cetera. Now we enter the cloud era, we're knee-deep in it. How is data protection changing, whether it's architecturally, or processes to accommodate multi-cloud? Maybe Colin, you can start. >> Well, so I think another trend that we're seeing is the move from managed services to more of a self service delivery. So providers like Telefonica want to enable their tenants to access data protection as a service, and that has certainly some architectural impacts to it. And, you know, I think that's what's really behind this announcement that we're making here at VMworld. >> The most important part you mentioned is talking about the VDC. It's not just infrastructure as a service platform, it's everything as a service platform. So more than this, you're putting to our customers they're developed services, for example, data protection. Data protection is very important. So our idea in the user experience is to change the customer's life easy. So with the new port, self-serve support or for data protection, the customers right now can do everything in the VDC. This was possible with the partnership between VMworld and WMC. Developing together the new integration of a mod integration using the API for the cloud director, for the new version, is very valuable to us. >> So in terms of impact, give us an example, Sandro, of how this three-way partnership that Telefonica has with Dell EMC and VMware, how is it impacting, not just your customers business, but Telefonica's business? How is it enabling your transformation, from a top line perspective? >> Sure. I think that what we are thinking right now, with Dell EMC and VMware, is a model that must be followed by the other manufacturers. Because they're creating the future, if there's integration between data protection software of Dell EMC and VMware, it impacts directly to our customer, because now our oldest versions, the customer needs to require some... For example, historic procedures, you just talk to someone in Telefonica to asking them. So right now, is immediately through the self-service portal. And this is very important to us to increase the user experience and our customer experience, which is very valuable to us. >> So customer experience improves. How have you been able to expand your customer base globally leveraging this partnership. >> For example, VDC and Telefonica talking about our business. We are the most important deployments of VM around the world. We are more than 80 countries around the world, in South America and Europe, running the VDC software. This is very valuable to us because if opening our global catalog and using the VMware data protection software producing the TCO to us and to our customers using for example the data duplication and the new functions in the solution is very good to us and to our customers. >> So vCloud director, maybe we could drill into that a little bit in terms of how it's impacted your business. Talk more about the value that it brings to not just you, but your customers. >> Jesus Christ, it was not so easy during that time, you know, we are using vCloud director since the beginning of our global brothers and global structures, so following, during these years, we have the oldest version, we have a lot of limits in the vCloud directory interface. So right now, using the vCloud director nine in the cloud's extension, the cloud director availability, so this is very valuable to us because the VMware changes a lot, the user exchange interface. The old user interface was very ugly to our customers. So right now, vCloud director 9.1 and 9.x is very good interface. In the same way, improving the user experience in the quality of our services. >> So the business impact is that it's simpler to manage, so saving time so people can... >> Sure. And integration. >> Well, I think you have to think about how do service providers like Telefonica differentiate themselves, right? A cloud provider that only offers infrastructure as a service, they're getting their margins squeezed, right? So they have to bring in these value added services. How do they do that better than the others? They differentiate themselves through a better user experience, which means, you know, the way the user interacts with the product. Also it means, it comes down to the cost, right? So that goes directly to the service provider's bottom line. They're able to pass that on to their customers. Then also, performance and scale. Right, so these are really very, very, important points, and that's what I think our partnership is all about. >> How do you guys go to market? Is it a three way? Two way? What's the go-to-market strategy? >> So, our strategy do not compete for the hyperscale providers. >> Right. >> Our VDC, you have our own services running in our own data centers and combining with our global network infrastructure. We can provide a better service to our customers in local perspective, local billing, local support. In this partnership with Dell EMC, consuming the software and technologies many years ago, so we are evolving our services this way and this is the right thing to do right now, to differentiate us from the hyperscale providers. >> And you were.. I'm sorry, go ahead, Colin. >> Well, I was just going to add to that that in terms of our go-to-market, we've made a very big announcement here at VMworld 2018, which is that VMware, the VCPP business unit is actually selling Dell EMC data protection to their service providers. So this is actually our goal, is to really make it a native feature of vCloud director built right in. >> So the VMware cloud, provider business unit is essentially OEM-ing, reselling, your product... >> Yep. >> Which ultimately makes it into Telefonica. >> Sure. And the way that they're doing that, is actually really interesting because it adds value for us in the sense that they allow service providers to pay by the drip. So the way that we sell it is very different than other routes to market that we have and something that I think is of a lot of value to service providers like Telefonica. >> So it's paid by the drip, by that you mean it's a monthly service? >> It's a monthly per-protected VM, very simple, very simple business model. They pay a certain number of cloud provider points for one offering, a different amount for the other offering, and it's paid in arrears on a monthly basis based on what they've consumed. >> And I can cancel any time, it's not like I got to buy three years in advance, or? >> No, absolutely. >> Absolutely. >> So we've been hearing a lot, we hear this a lot, "better together," right, David? At every event and every aspect of life, there's a lot of things that are better together. What, I'm curious, Colin, from your perspective, Dell EMC, VMware, lots of change in the last few years... >> Absolutely. >> How is this, you know, we talked about value streams that go to market, how are you seeing your customers embracing and feeling what Dell EMC and VMware are doing as really better together? How do you simplify the complexities that all these customers are living in with this partnership? >> So, I can say that over the course of history we've had a lot of co-engineering partnerships. Right, between Dell EMC and VMware. I mean, I could probably name five or six of them, and there's a number of them happening right now. This partnership, this aspect of it, is a little bit different because there's a sales and marketing aspect to it, so that's taking the partnership to the next level. Never before has VMware sold Dell EMC product. Right, so that's.... >> Pretty groundbreaking. >> Yeah. This is the next step in better together. For our customers, I mean, there's been an incredible response. We had service provider round tables on Sunday. Lot of excitement about this and actually, I heard two service providers have actually decided to go with this, based on the fact that we have this partnership. So, that's amazing for us. >> Awesome. >> Yeah. >> And then in terms of the evolution of the partnership of the technology, what's the customer feedback loop, if you will, how are they helping to influence the direction the technology goes. >> I think that evolving the catalog and making the customer's life easy and providing the new functionalities, the new features, in the easiest mold, is very valuable to our customers. It's more than providing the (mumbles) in platform service. For more added value of service to the customers, the (mumbles) services, the multi-cloud environments. So our goal is to put all together, providing the hybrid cloud ship, multi-cloud solutions to our customers, is valuable, just as our customers asking to us and claiming to us today. Around the world. >> Well you mentioned your presence in 80 countries? >> Our virtual data centers are present in 80 countries, serving the Americas and Europe. >> Was this possible before the VMware, Dell EMC, Telefonica? >> No, no, we are evolving together. It was not built easy before. Not possible to doing alone before. >> So a lot of growth, what's next? Where do you go from there? You got 80! >> (laughs) >> Where do you go from there? >> I believe that our strategy should evolve in the cataloging freezing the partnership with Dell EMC and VMware, and increasing the... Putting together this new ecosystem and the integration between vCloud director API, ecologic stations in the protection software. I think that is the way, this is the goal, this is our... The processes that are moving now should do... Manufactures are the big parts of our ecostystem is the VDC 4.0. >> So you got a couple of breakout sessions tomorrow? >> Yeah. (laughs) >> Give us the top three takeaways that the attendees will glean from your session. >> Oh gosh. The attendances? >> The key takeaways. What are they going to learn? >> So I think at least one of the sessions that Sandro's participating in is a data protection session. So it's a general session covering all of our recent announcements, our technology, kind of a thought leadership type of thing, and using Telefonica's experience with the vCloud director extensions as a testimonial, an example, to share with the... >> The validation. >> The validation to share with the other customers. >> Bringing together some of the hot topics at the show, obviously, cloud, data protection, walk around the floor, everybody's talking about data protection. >> That's what it's all about, yeah. >> Great! Congratulations! >> Thank you so much. >> Colin, Sandro, thanks so much for joining Dave and me on theCUBE and sharing with us what you guys are doing with this partnership. We appreciate your time. >> Thank you! >> Thank you so much, thank you. >> Thank you, Dave. >> We want to thank you for watching theCUBE. We are continuing day two of VMworld 2018, I'm Lisa Martin with Dave Vellante. Stick around, we'll be right back. (upbeat music)

>> Narrator: From Berlin, Germany, it's theCUBE, covering DataWorks Summit Europe 2018, brought to you by Hortonworks. >> Well, hello, and welcome to the Cube. I'm James Kobielus. I'm the lead analyst for Big Data Analytics with the Wikibon team within SiliconANGLE Media. We are here at the DataWorks Summit 2018 in Berlin, Germany. And I have a special guest, we have a special guest, Bernard Marr, one of the most influential, thought leaders in the big data analytics arena. And it's not just me saying that. You look at anybody's rankings, Bernard's usually in the top two or three of influentials. He publishes a lot. He's a great consultant. He keynoted this morning on the main stage at Dataworks Summit. It was a very fascinating discussion, Bernard. And I'm a little bit star struck 'cause I assumed you were this mythical beast who just kept putting out these great books and articles and so forth. And I'm glad to have you. So, Bernard, I'd like for you to stand back, we are here in Berlin, in Europe. This is April of 2018, in five weeks time, the general data protection, feels global 'cause it sort of is. >> It is. >> The general data protection regulation will take full force, which means that companies that do business in Europe, in the EU, must under the law protect the personal data they collect on EU citizens ensuring the right to privacy, the right to be forgotten, ensuring user's, people's ability to withhold consent to process and profile and so forth. So that mandate is coming down very fast and so forth. What is your thoughts on GDPR? Is it a good thing, Bernard, is it high time? Is it a burden? Give us your thoughts on GDPR currently. >> Okay, first, let me return all the compliments. It's really great to be here. I think GDPR can be both. And for me it will come down very much to the way it gets implemented. So, in principle for me, it is a good thing because what I've always made companies do and advise them to do is to be completely transparent in the way they're collecting data and using data. I believe that the big data world can't thrive if we don't develop this trust and have this transparency. So in principle, it's a great thing. For me will come down to the implementation of all of this. I had an interesting chat just minutes ago with the event photographer saying that once GDPR kicks in he can't actually publish any photographs without getting written consent for everyone in the photograph. That's a massive challenge and he was saying he can't afford to lose 4% of his global revenue. So I think it will be very interesting to see how this will-- >> How it'll be affecting face recognition, I'm sorry go ahead. >> Bernard: Yeah maybe. >> Well maybe that's a bad thing, maybe it's a good thing. >> Maybe it is, yeah, maybe. So for me, in principle a very good thing. In practice, I'm intrigued to see how this will get implemented. >> Of the clients you consult, what percentage in the EU, without giving away names, what percentage do you think are really ready right now or at least will be by May 25th to comply with the letter of the law? Is it more than 50%? Is it more than 80%? Or will there be a lot of catching up to do in a short period of time? >> My sense is that there's a lot of catching up to do. I think people are scrambling to get ready at the moment. But the thing is nobody really knows what being ready really means. I think there are lots of different interpretations. I've been talking to a few lawyers recently. And everyone has a slightly different interpretation of how far they can push the boundaries, so, again, I'm intrigued to see what will actually happen. And I very much hope that common sense prevails and it will be seen as a good force and something that is actually good for everyone in the field of big data. >> So slightly changing track, in the introduction of you this morning, I think it was John Christ of Hortonworks said that you made a prediction about this year that AI will be used to automate more things than people realize and it'll come along fairly fast. Can you give us a sense for how automation, AI is enabling greater automation, and whether, you know, this is the hot button topic, AI will put lots of people out of work fairly quickly by automating everything that white collar workers and so forth are doing, what are your thoughts there? Is it cause for concern? >> Yes, and it's probably one of the questions I get asked the most and I wish I had a very good answer for it. If we look back at the other, I believe that we are experiencing a new industrial revolution at the moment, and if you look at what the World Economic Forums CEO and founder, Klaus Schwab, is preaching about, it is that we are experiencing this new industrial revolution that will truly transform the workplace and our lives. In history, all of the other three previous industrial revolutions have somehow made our lives better. And we have always found something to do for us. And they have changed the jobs. Again, there was a recent report that looked at some of the key AI trends and what they found is that actually AI produces more new jobs than it destroys. >> Will we all become data scientists under, as AI becomes predominant? Or what's going on here? >> No I don't, and this is, I wish I had the answer to this. For me is the advice I give my own children now is to focus on the really human element of it and probably the more strategic element. The problem is five, six years ago this was a lot easier. I could talk about emotional, intelligence, creativity, with advances in machine learning, this advice is no longer true. And lots of jobs, even some of the things I do, I write for Forbes on a regular basis. I also know that AIs write for Forbes. A lot of the analyst reports are now machine generated. >> Natural language generation, a huge use case for AI that people don't realize. >> Bernard: Absolutely. >> Yeah. >> So, for me I see it, as an optimist I see it positively. I also question whether we as human beings should be going to work eight hours a day doing lots of stuff we quite often don't enjoy. So for me, the challenge is adjusting our economic model to this new reality, and I see that there will be significant disruption over the next 20 years that with all the technology coming in and really challenging our jobs. >> Will AI put you and me out of a job. In other words, will it put the analysts and the consultants out of work and allow people to get expert advice on how to manage technology without having to go through somebody like a you or a me? >> Absolutely, and for me, my favorite example is looking at medicine. If you look at doctors, traditionally you send a doctor to medical school for seven years. You then hope that they retain 10% of what they've learned if you're lucky. Then they gain some experience. You then turn up in the practice with your conditions. Again, if you're super lucky, they might have skim read some of your previous conditions, and then diagnose you. And unless you have something that's very common, the chance that they get this right is very low. So compare this with your old stomping ground IBMs Watson, so they are able to feed all medical knowledge into that cognitive computing platform. They can update this continuously, and you think, and could then talk to Watson eight hours a day if I wanted to about my symptoms. >> But can you trust that advice? Why should you trust the advice that's coming from a bot? Yeah, that's one of the key issues. >> Absolutely, and I think at the moment maybe not quite because there's still a human element that a doctor can bring because they can read your emotions, they can understand your tone of voice. This is going to change with affective computing and the ability for machines to do more of this, too. >> Well science fiction authors run amok of course, because they imagine the end state of perfection of all the capabilities like you're describing. So we perfect robotics. We perfect emotion analytics and so forth. We use machine learning to drive conversational UIs. Clearly a lot of people imagine that the technology, all those technologies are perfected or close to it, so, you know. But clearly you and I know that it's a lot of work to do to get them-- >> And we both have been in the technology space long enough to know that there are promises and there's lots of hype, and then there's a lot of disappointment, and it usually takes longer than most people predict. So what I'm seeing is that every industry I work in, and this is what my prediction is, automation is happening across every industry I work in. More things, even things I thought five years ago couldn't be automated. But to get to a state where it really transforms our world, I think we are still a few years away from that. >> Bernard, in terms of the hype factor for AI, it's out of sight. What do you think is the most hyped technology or application under the big umbrella of AI right now in terms of the hype far exceeds the utility. I don't want to put words in your mouth. I've got some ideas. Your thoughts? >> Lots of them. I think that the two areas I write a lot about and talk to companies a lot about is deep learning, machine learning, and blockchain technology. >> James: Blockchain. >> So they are, for me, they have huge potential, some amazing use cases, at the same time the hype is far ahead of reality. >> And there's sort of an intersection between AI and blockchain right now, but it's kind of tentative. Hey, Bernard, we are at the end of this segment. It's been so great. We could just keep going on and on and on. >> I know we could just be... >> Yeah, there's a lot I've been wanting to ask you for a long time. I want to thank you for coming to theCUBE. >> Pleasure. >> This has been Bernard Marr. I'm James Kobielus on theCUBE from DataWorks Summit in Berlin, and we'll be back with another guest in just a little while. Thank you very much.

>> Announcer: Live from Silicon Valley, it's theCUBE, covering Mobile World Congress 2017. Brought to you by Intel. >> Welcome back, everyone. We're here live in Palo Alto for SiliconANGLE Media's theCUBE's new studio, 4500 square feet in Palo Alto. Just moved in less than a month ago, and we're bringing you all the in-studio coverage of what's going on in Barcelona, Spain at Mobile World Congress. This is day two of two days of coverage. Here in the studio we're bringing people in that's in Silicon Valley into the studio, experts, entrepreneurs, venture capitalist investors, angel investors, and of course, analysts here from our own team, and we have Peter Burris with me here. And we're covering all the action. Of course, we have reporters and analysts and friends on the ground doing call-ins in Barcelona, bringing you all the action, and really, bringing the big story that's not being told, which is AI, IOT, and cloud-ready, cloud-native action is happening. This is the disruptor, the calm before the storm as we were saying earlier yesterday. Peter Burris, great to see you. We were talking yesterday morning on the kickoff, let's take that to the next level. Cloud-native, IOT, really the big story that's not being told at Mobile World Congress this year, mainly because it's just in everyone's face right now, and people are making sense of it. Your thoughts on this as you are looking at the research, looking at the marketplace, this is reality. The IOT is real. >> Oh, it's very much real, John. Let's start with why cloud and mobile are so important together. In many respects, the thing that made the cloud real is mobility because the minute that you don't know where your device is going to connect, where the termination point's going to be, then you don't want to have to control and own that network. And so in many respects, the whole concept of mobility catalyzed the need for the cloud because you didn't want to have to utilize a, you didn't want to have to build your own network to support people as they moved around. So the cloud as a front end, or as a set of capabilities that supports mobility is really crucial to this whole concept, and it's somewhat surprising that it's not more closely tied together at Mobile World Congress. But the most important thing that we could talk about obviously is that IOT is going to have a major impact on all kinds of different factors. It's going to have a major impact on the devices that are manufactured, it's going to have a major impact on what the scale efficiencies that you have in manufacturing, the nature of the sensors, the nature of microprocessors, how much memory gets put on stuff, how much flash memory is going to be manufactured over the next decade. All these things are going to have a significant impact on the concept of mobility and what it means and the networks it provided over the course of the next 10 years. >> Peter, I want to bring up something that you brought up yesterday, and I think this is important, that's why I wanted to do a real drill down on what seems to be a major paradigm shift and inflection point. We've been talking about autonomous vehicles, media entertainment, smart cities, smart homes. Those are all the sexy demos at Mobile World Congress. But the real change, as pointed out by Val Bercovici who just came in as CTO is that the sea change underneath it, and you pointed out yesterday the convergence between enterprise and consumers coming together is that this internet of things and people, IOTP, or IOTNP, 'cause things can be sensors and devices, are changing it, and what's obvious to us and now coming out of Mobile World Congress as it's just starting to be seen by the mainstream press and media and community is that the TelCos aren't used to dealing with rapidly provisioning things. They're used to a subscriber who buys a phone, dials up a service, gets provisioned and connected, and they have a number, and then they try to connect to the base station and get on the internet. That's simple, and those connections we all know fail, but now imagine that multiplied by millions and millions of devices that are going to be turned on and connected. This is a scale problem, this is a network problem, this is a physics problem. >> Well, it's a physics problem-- >> Explain your theory on this. >> Yeah, it's a physics problem at a very, very base level. Just talking about the TelCos for a second. You're absolutely right, John. We're talking about, when we talk about the scale problem in the TelCos, it's not that they don't know what to do with their networks, it's not that they don't know how to connect devices to the networks. They just don't know how to provide it at a service level. It's going to be demanded by the scale of the devices moving into and out of networks as we think about IOT and P, the TelCos have historically thought about, they've thought about the assets that they have in place, the rates that they charge for those assets, the returns they generate, the tariff rules they work with with governments around the globe. They tend to focus on, good or bad, 10, 20-year time horizons. >> And their P is phone, not people. >> That's right, their P is absolutely. Their P is phone, and I can, and you were probably around. I can remember when you could not buy a phone that didn't have, on a particular company's network, you still can't buy a phone on a network today. You buying a mobile phone and it goes, it's associated with-- >> You're buying a carrier. >> That's right, that's exactly right. And that's how TelCos want to work. Now, they're hoping that eventually they're going to find themselves in the position to be able to spin up devices very quickly, but the reality is that's not how provisioning works in the real world. It's one of the reasons why TelCos continue to get their lunches eaten by companies that are building out their own networks and doing a much better job of rapid provisioning. >> You and I were talking last night off-camera about this notion of IOT and P, and of course, we all believe in and we're passionate about it, but you made a comment that was interesting. It was that we're going to look back at this time in history as a moment where before and after kind of, before Christ, after Christ, however you want to look at it. I mean, there's always that AD, BC kind of thing going on where before, I always call it before Steve Jobs and iPhone. Now it's going to a whole other level with the societal changes from little things, like we had a guest on talking about waste disposal efficiency. Traffic light management, healthcare, every single digital service. NTT Docomo's investor was on yesterday. She was talking about investing in services and bringing AI as a service, not network services, lifestyle services. What do you mean by that, that this is going to be something that we're going to look back 50 years from now and say this was the moment? Can you expand your? >> Yeah, absolutely, John, and it's really actually pretty simple. If you take a look at how executives are starting to think, what's happening is for the first time, we're really starting to look at data as an asset. That's a big question, but let me try to break it down and be a little bit more concise about what I mean by that. When we think about IOT and P, we're thinking about the idea that we can distribute enormous, billions of devices that are going to be sources of data. They're going to be going into the analog world, put into the analog world, and they're going to take analog signals and turn them into, and transduce them into digital signals. Once those signals become digital, then they hit big data, they hit AI, they hit machine learning. That's what's catalyzing a lot of the social concerns about, well, what does it mean for machines to be more autonomous, to take more responsibility? What's going to happen with business accountability when business are increasingly relying on machines that quote, "think." When we think about these big societal changes, we're talking about the ability that IOT's providing, IOT and P is providing, that for the first time how we're going to capture enormous net-new data, how we're going to process that enormous net-new data, and then ultimately, what we call systems of enaction, how we're going to enact specific events back in the real world as a consequence of what machines say is the right thing to do. That is a demarcation point. It moves from a machine being regarded as a tool, and almost exclusively as a tool, something that performs work better but having that work be very well described and very well articulated and the concept clear to something that might actually introduce new work or do work differently. Take responsibility for how it performs work. That's a major sea change. And so when we say that it's going to be, we'll look back and say, "It was before this time "and after this time," it's because we are now in the position to economically be able to gather these streams of data, process them in ways that are unprecedented, and then have the results of that processing enact in unpredictable ways, and that's a major change. >> I don't know if we can talk about some of your research that's coming out, I dunno, can we touch on some of the points? This has yet to be released research from the Wikibon team headed up by Peter with SiliconANGLE Media. I want to just point out, 'cause I find this interesting, you say that there's a architectural decision point within IOTP, a new phrase, hashtag IOTP if you're interested in working with us, just hit us up at Twitter. But there's really four points you point, physics, the law, legal, of course, everything's legal. Physics, legal, economical, economics, and then, authority. >> Right. >> What do you mean by those four? Can you just take us through conceptually these are dimensions, they interplay, are they dependencies, are they interdependent, are they all intertwined? What's the rationale behind these architectural forces? >> When people think about information systems historically, they've been relatively well circumscribed. So, I have an employee that I'm going to provide a service to from a network that I control that has latency requirements and aren't that big a problem because at the end of the day a human being doesn't operate at nanosecond kind of levels, and I got a machine that's mine, and I own running an application that I've licensed. That is a very, very tightly bound unit. When we start introducing IOTP and some of these other things, now we're talking about emergent behaviors that might be far away that we don't control, we're working with partners, et cetera, and the basic architectural challenge of thinking about what do we have to do to get a handle on the requirements of the processing, 'cause at the end of the day these things are still computers, and they still have operational characteristics that have to be accommodated. We think that there's going to be four factors that are going to influence how what we call the edge zone expands or compresses based on the work that needs to be conducted. One is physics. You're not going to go faster than the speed of light, and in fact, generally speaking, if you look at the distance that you have to travel, you're going to be outside the automation zone. You're going to be outside the automation zone if light has to travel, at best, you're going to be about a 10th of the speed of light, so if your automation zone, if you want your automation zone to be about 100 miles, then it means that from there and back with the speed of light you're not going to be able to automate anything that takes longer than that, just for example. Physics is one. >> Physics and wireless is a great example of physics. >> Wireless is, yeah. >> And moving packets around. >> None of this stuff works without physics, right. The second one is legal, that the reality is is that while the laws of physics are relatively immutable as far as we know, there are also government regulations that are what they are, and that could include privacy, it can include requirements for disclosing things, and so, those also, borders are going to have an impact on this notion of automation zones, or edge zones as we call them. Economics is another one. It costs money to move data from point A to point B, and the question is how much data's going to move. A lot of people think that everything's going to go up to the cloud, it's going to be processed up there, and then some instruction's going to come down for automation. That's probably not the way it's going to work. Our findings are suggesting-- >> Not only is it the cost of data, I would argue that also the product design criteria will be impacted economically on that decision point. >> Absolutely. But that's based on how much does it cost to move the data around. The operational characteristics of a product or service are fundamentally, a digital product or service, are fundamentally tied to the cost of moving data. We think that 95-plus percent of the data's actually going to stay in the edge. And the last one is authority, and we kind of touched upon this a second ago in that we're now suggesting that machines are going to take actions without human intervention. Not just actions, but they're actually going to change the scope and nature of the actions that are going to be taken. What does that mean? What does it mean for a machine to act on behalf of a brand? Or on behalf of a person? People use a simple explanation, "Does the autonomous car take out the old lady "or the cub scouts if you got a problem? "Or does it do something else?" It's those kinds of things that we don't know the answer to. A lot of the questions of authority and how we distribute authority and how we codify authority and how we track authority is going to have a major impact on what limits to behavior we put on these things. >> There's also the security angle alone is another one, too, just like basic stuff. These are interesting. And you see these architectural forces. Are you calling them forces, factors, variables? >> Just factors simply because the concept of factor, or you can call it constraints, is the idea that your decision has to factor these things, so we're just calling 'em factors right now. >> Alright, so let's step back now, and look at some of the commentary from this week in Mobile World Congress and our interviews here in theCUBE as well as the remotes. Certainly the hallway conversation is the business model of the TelCos. Saar Gillia who was on yesterday brought up a point of, hey, where's the use cases? Show me the use case, and then I'll say yes. And it's this too complicated, he was not seeing the use cases, and he was saying, "I'd prefer more battery life than "more one gigabit wireless right now" given that's his current situation. The balancing of where to get started seems to be the number one theme. What do I do next, what's the first step? Will the bridge collapse that I'm trying to cross to this future? Or I can't see the other side? Is the world flat or round? These are kind of more personal feelings that people have around taking that leap of faith into this new world? How do you advise and package that together and assimilate that? I mean, do you, how should people look at that? >> I think it's a great question, and I wasn't part of the conversation yesterday, but let's look at that for example. Today, if you're using your phone, you effectively have a relatively simple number of sensors in your phone, relatively simple number of transducers, right. You have a chip that turns your analog voice into a digital signal, so there's that in there. You have some neat stuff that presents the screens, so there's that in there. You have a microphone, et cetera, that kind of stuff, but when we start thinking about 5G and what networking could become, as we talked about yesterday, it's not so much the absolute bandwidth speeds, and it certainly is not going to have any impact on latency for the most part. It really is the number of devices that you can support at one time. It allows for greater density of sources. Now, without looking at 5G, we can talk about a phone being able to support not just a few generators, or a few sources of data on that phone, but maybe dozens, so maybe things that, you know, the whole concept of wearables. Again, do I want to get involved in the use case? No, you and I are sitting here being analysts, and that's not our business. But are there going to be use cases for more wearable technology? Well, if you're sick, if you have a chronic disease, just for example, yeah, that's a use case. I could see people actually living much higher quality lives because they can support more sensors as a result of 5G, with greater security. Again, we go to the autonomous car. There's going to be a lot of sensors in an autonomous car. Most of them are going to operate locally, but having said that, it might be nice if we could actually have a very, very fast low-cost network with inside the car itself to handle a lot of that work. I think we've, human beings, developers, have always found new use cases when given more compute, more memory, and more networking. I don't think that's going to change. I think we're going to see more of that. >> Peter, what's your thoughts, if you had to summarize and encapsulate it into a narrative, Mobile World Congress 2017, now looking back at day two kind of coming to a close, seeing what's out there, how do you look at that? How would you tell someone here is the story of Mobile World Congress? Tell that story. >> To me, John, having looked at the stuff come over the transom and you know, a lot of new devices being talked about and generating a little bit of excitement, a lot of new this and a little bit of excitement, I think that the question for me is are we moving into a period where integration's going to matter again? And I think in many respects that's going to be kind of the subtext of what's coming out of Mobile World Congress. Is it good enough to have the best of breed device and this and that, with a software stack that's doing this and that? Or is there going to be more value to the enterprise and ultimately to the consumer by taking more of an end-to-end perspective? Apple from a consumer and an experience standpoint has done that and has, what is it? They're worth $150 billion more than any other company on the planet right now or something crazy like that? Don't quote me on that, but I think that's what somebody told me. >> Trillions of dollars in cash overseas, for sure. >> Yeah, so it's that notion of are we moving back into a world where integration is going to matter because we're going through a period of significant discontinuity. >> Integration is a great point, 'cause I see that, I do see that as a thing, and bring the Apple example. Apple, the way they develop might be different than say, what we see in an open source, for instance. If you look at what Intel's doing, and I look at Intel as a bellwether, and this is from my perspective, because they have such a huge long game in play, they have been the leader in my opinion in the tech industry playing the long game, and they have to because they make chips. And they're looking at the 5G as an ecosystem play, and they're admitting and saying it's not one vendor. They don't say take village, but they're basically saying it takes a village to rise all the tide or float all the boats, if you will. If you look at what Intel's doing, they're essentially saying that it's an integration game through their own moves, which is ecosystem, playing well together. Now, you could fight for best of breed on point solutions, whether it's a Snapdragon Qualcom, or Intel processor on the device. At the end of the day, it's, as we were saying, network function virtualization to make those dynamic networks work seem to be the key. To play in that, if as a society globally, to your four factors, it has to be an integration game. No one company can do those factors. >> You're absolutely right. Here's how I would say it to put a slightly different twist on it. The tech industry has moved from a product orientation to a service orientation, or is moving from a product orientation to a service orientation, from an orientation where we focus on what's the intrinsic value of what we're buying to what's the utility of what we're using. From a "Hey, let's a put a spend a lot of money upfront "and maybe we'll get to some point of time in the future "where it's valuable" to a, "Let's only pay for what we got." It's difficult to imagine the tech industry moving successfully into that service orientation without taking more of an integration approach to it. Certainly that's what Amazon's trying to do or AWS is trying to do, that's what Google is trying to do, that's what all the companies that are trying to move infrastructure into the cloud are trying to do, so I think that this is a general issue. If we're moving to a service orientation, we have to start taking the integration view on things. >> Awesome, great, Peter. You're watching theCUBE. This is SiliconANGLE Media, Inc., and SiliconANGLE Media, Inc. comprises of siliconangle.com, led by Rob Hof, that's our publishing journalism, wikibon.com led by Peter Burris and research, and theCUBE, our internet TV led by Jeff Frick, and of course CrowdChat is the data brand and the data science, and we love bringing you this great content. Pete, I'll give you quick plug because I know that you've been doing a ton of work building out the research team at Wikibon and expanding the work behind the firewall, it's a paid subscription. Some premium that we see on siliconangle.com for the most part. A great body of work on the research. I want to congratulate you, but give you an opportunity to share with the folks who are watching what's going on with research and some of the things that you're working on and why they should potentially reach out to Wikibon. >> Yeah, so we're focused on a couple of relatively simple things. We're not a huge team, so we tend to focus less on products, again, the idea of let's take a look at the intrinsic value of products, and we focus more on the impacts. What does it mean to get utility out of things? How do you get utility out of whatever you buy? The other thing we focus on is disruption, and we talked a lot about what are the disrupting factors. IOT, big data, and what we call the systems of enaction, all supported by significant changing infrastructure and new digital business models. So, it's kind of a combination of those five things that we are focusing our time and attention on. Ultimately, we want to be in a position to help our clients make decisions that improve the value of their business by better utilizing data through these digital models, digital business models that require these technology changes to go. >> Great, and it also helped show Mobile World Congress is about cloud-ready. You had a great report on Amazon we posted on siliconangle.com. What was the summary, bottom line that big body of work you did about Amazon that the headline was, "How big can Amazon be?" What was the key findings from your big assembled report on Amazon Web Service? >> The big finding is Amazon's going to get big, but the cloud's also going to get big, and we think that Amazon, the simple finding is, we think Amazon's going to hold share. That may not sound like much, but for the most part, most of the value's going to go into SaaS, most of the value's going to go into the use cases associated with stuff. That's where a lot of the money's going to go. Amazon holding share, given that they're one of the, in many respects, they created this whole thing, is actually a pretty stunning statement. And it all started, John, because when we went and we looked at our semi-annual update to what's going on in the cloud marketplace, the question that kept coming to us was, okay, so we think it's going to go this fast. Well, what's Amazon going to do with that? What's it going to mean to Amazon? How is Amazon's growth going to affect these things? And so, we started with that answer. We built our models and talked to a lot of users, built our scenarios, so we think that Amazon's going to continue to grow very fast, we think it's going to be a $40 billion company, $40 billion-plus company >> John: In revenue. >> In revenue, AWS. >> John: Not Amazon. >> Not Amazon, Amazon's a totally different beast. We'll see what Amazon does. But AWS will be about a $40-plus billion company in four or five years, and still have about eight-plus percent market share in the entire-- >> And Microsoft has changed their game, they're coming right after Amazon. >> Microsoft, Oracle, IBM, Google, and when you start talk internationally, Ali Baba, there's going to be a dozen companies that create enormous businesses. >> And there are companies that don't have a cloud that are late to the game and might not have a seat when the music stops in the old musical chair analogy, so certainly we know who they are. >> You know, what's going to happen to the TelCos? Good question. >> The world, we live in very exciting times as the saying goes. Peter Burris, great to have you, great commentary. Love what you're doing, I think the research around IOT and the edge is a fundamental architectural shift. You've got the four forces laid out. Congratulations, looking forward to doing more where there's totally going to be a game-changer. This will impact everything that we live, and it'll make the autonomous vehicles and the drones and the AI and smart cities a reality. Thanks for the commentary. More Mobile World Congress coverage here in Palo Alto, breaking it all down. We've got a couple late night call-ins, so stay with us. Hopefully, folks will be sauced up a bit, and maybe share some of the news and breaking stories from the hallway. More from theCUBE after this short break. Thanks for watching. (upbeat electronic music)

and we're here with sicky junta and psyche is with CSC she's uh she's an entrepreneur she's a cloud expert she's a technologist a businessperson her official title is global vice president of cloud computing and cloud services at CSC welcome thank you it's good to see good to see you here and we're very excited to be at sapphire this is day 3 of course we're gonna talk cloud with the woods with sicky so so why don't we start off sick you tell us you know what is what is cloud all about is that is it living up to the hype I personally believe that cloud it is the way of the future we don't have enough trees and data centers for the generation that we are breathing you know the generation that we are breathing produce a tremendous amount of these data by the minute us digital data texting data voice data and all this data has to be Monte so the cloud it is the future to go and it's actually changed in the last three years I've been working loud for quite a while the dynamics of the last 12 months people have gone from being educational I want to know and we have to spell MC sounds like cloud and and then you say to them now their projects they have money they have value added in Rio the termination in that cloud project how was it changing good business Missy SC is a very well-known you know broad-based service provider outsourcing and so far how is the cloud changing your business it is very interesting because it's kind of transforming the business of cici's it transformed the way that we interact with our customers and prospects we use a lot of digital new yahoo the way we approach to our custom is very different we do pilots in our cloud the business model is changing we run we don't take hasit and people like it outsourcing deal we just run it for my fabric or we deliver cloud fabric at the customer data centers and we managers or we can say to them will give you the cloud fabric and you are like an Amazon you can manage it yourselves and we just keep the fabric well we'll provide the provisioning we provide your constructions and you are your own service provider is it very different than what she does to the top reason folks talk to you about you get a lot of clouds going on building clouds and you've been in technology preneur in the past sold your companies but you're at CC big brands are coming to you what is the number one thing you're seeing the pattern of the customer requests and or the new customers I think the customers they're really serious about cloud want agility version Assad Julia um I T delivery time to deliver a off even six weeks three months that is traditional it is not possible today customers wants to build application and modern weeks instead of months the new platforms like force calm and a zoo or do you have spring source vm having google apps they actually have this very beautiful object-oriented way for you to write application we're very very fast and so that requires a delivery mechanisms that can sustain that more I think that they want to build brand new applications so they can stay with them for the next 20 years and and we're waiting to us come on this morning we're talking on prior you said the cloud is a user experience I think that's really profound can you expand on that that was pretty compelling I think people look at the cloud as is odd this tech I and big iron in there but you talk about what you mean by the cloud is a user experience so I there are two type of Christ there is the consumer clouds that's the cloud that we do every your typing on the cloud and we have facebook and twitter and all this i play Angry Birds that's a gaming it's a big cloud that's any user experience of the cloud so if you leave in your cloud and use your spirits and then you go away you just say why do I have to win six weeks when I can play you know I can play final fantasy in real time with people in Hong Kong that's really the experience of the castle and enterprise is not there yet and there has two issues first of all the technology really was not they are still provide that the applications like sa peas and and the evolution of the systems second the processes are going internal IT are really very rigid sometimes you have to go fill up in requesting gotta get all this approval and has to be seen by 25 people on business model and all that so we have the challenge of accelerating a business classes and providing the same end user experience there and that's why it's CSC we have pilots in our plans we say to customer currents bosses and you know use our portal our provisioning environments upload workloads start to understand what does it mean interacting with about you know try it out there like in a mixed thing you know they got us growing you know puppy and then there they're stuck with the animal the cloud that's yeah I do never compare Jonna come up with a lot of those in the next half hour secure your company is technology agnostic of anyways right you know the real you get wed to a particular technology or services company so you have to be a trusted advisor to use clients on we're here at sapphire we're hearing a lot about in-memory computing and hannah we were talking a little bit about that off-camera what's your take on on this notion that sa p is putting forth they call them the ram cloud in-memory computing the Hana cloud what's your angle on that so first of all let's all understand the ROM and memory is the juice of clouds and I'll give you an analogy the cloud is like an apartment building where if the guy at the top takes a hot shower and uses all the shot that hot water the guy the bottom has no it has a cold shower and that's really the real analogy in a cloud vector if I have a very intense memory usage workload some could be SI p JD edwards and some others the other everybody in that community in that multi-tenant that's what it is multi-tenant ones we are all together feels the same problems and so memory it is deduce a cloud but that doesn't mean that because i have a lot of memory I don't have to optimize systems systems should be optimized and agile by themselves that's why a lot of refactoring a lot of building you know legacy java to a spring environment where you have encapsulation to take home see where you have object orientations and that makes you a John workers that really are optimized to use the maximum of the memory we actually going through this period right now he talks about private clouds and public laws in a hybrid clouds we've sort of in this period where we've got one foot in the legacy camp because you can't we don't a rip rip and replace and we've got another foot in this you know agile new world are you seeing a lot of sort of native new application development that's going to take advantage of these new cloud architectures new potential business processes you've seen that today and how long do you think it will take to actually see that bring true innovation to business I think that today the biggest usage of cloud are Gavin test so if the Devon test is the biggest user God that means that all the new projects are being developed to be delivered on the cloud vector and that's really very very very important today gets virtualized uses a platform but there is a big movement to refactor my applications because waiting for everything new there is only twenty percent of innovation in every large shop of IT today so there is a lot of companies that do create a roadmap for their workload and and when I talk to them I say divide you your workload part in three categories the legacy one that will never move that's the one that I in agreed environments and virtualized their heart the databases to bake the construct is not a job and the one that you want to do straight away Devon test email unified communications serum and the other things evaluate do I have to do I is it core that I have to own it and build it on or could I sauce it so to provide I system that it was already out there that it's like for sales culture of this world the NetSuite of this world workday is success factor 0 or any type of HR systems and say why do I have to own it why can't i have a SAS cloud environment where i can buy the serious doing this exercise helps them understand what its core what is not and why should I spend the money to take legacy applications to to the cloud can see it's a major changes in all layers who invited the you've got your your your device here your iPad we've hearing a lot of changes at the application layer and of course the infrastructure as well how is infrastructure changing and there's a lot of talk about convergence and there's logical blocks of infrastructure what are your thoughts there well I think that and the infrastructure layer we are actually seeing two major chain changes that are coming very fast first of all the multi-core environment 20 course is gonna beat ah here soon you're just sooner than we think and so all this memory conversation will already evaluated again because how's that memory gonna work with all this capacity our computer we have and that's that's a real conversations in and the IKE advisor that has the interaction with the fabric will need to be optimized to be able to take advantage of that storage is going through a lot of chambers multi-tier being the ability to say I don't want to maintain this for a long time understanding the retention here is it's even more critical than before because the access to the data now it's very fast and understanding the tiering and how you're going to do or not network storage what they're gonna cash what are you gonna close it creates a lot of questions when you build an application or when we refactor the applications a lot of it I think we have to realize that the systems have speed as a requirement and optimize from the end user to the art to the bear models what's the most efficient path just mentioned some real hot tech areas that we were all over I'll see the multicores and you the course the in-memory got solid state changing her essay p guys here saying summaries the new disc disc is the new tape tape is dead pretty pretty simple message there but multi core memory the hypervisor role of virtualization and the change will storage all those forces are colliding yeah when twins win some argue that that's an opportunity for redefinition of a new operating environment so to your point about optimization how do you see that revolving is that fantasy it gotta like a wish list you see new architectures developing definitely new architecture love being developed tonight's a new architecture for instance it's an optimized act architecture for mobility and to create a very pleasant user experience with all the data that sa p has because as if he has all this come on up data lock deals and so it's a new architecture you just say instead of changing the structure of the data or the app i am actually moving the interaction at the mobility level to a new device so that the experience is better in some cases used we will have to go back all the way and brought in right brand new systems that can suppose support that but I i believe the new architecture I've built all the time I think that um we haven't probably have a scene um what's the preferred what's the preferred visually for the future for this type of texture that that you're seeing and that you're driving towards mostly memory stuff immediate benefits to caching what do you see is the preferred methods that are driving right now I think that sounds looking at mobility so that that you can divide the user from the system's is very protesting because if you don't do that we actually slow down the end user experience and the end user is the productivity that we get every day second it's we have to look at business logics and can isolate the business logic so that I can can I really change it in a dynamic way in the last 10 years of 20 years we built system where we encoded everything he has to talk to this database over this IP address with that all this um hardcore stana configurations yes it's very hard in the cloud environment dynamic environment new media environment so we have to look at the system say how can I use so object orientations platforms separations logic how can i isolate the data if I have to how can I put it you know virtual data Mart's on top of it so that I can I'll cute the data because if I kind of a what Hana is was I'm sorry structure data then I cubix and then the cube gets talked to everybody and normally i know that in dededo there is eighty percent again used 20 bars are all right reverse so it's really an interaction and reactant acting from the end user best experience i want to do that facebook experience i want to give it that um gaming experience so how do i get to the data and adina you know it's probably 20 years old and it's really mainframe in monster well you're not gonna go ahead sir so when we talk to some of the vendors like for instance an emc they talk about the block at ciscos pushing UCS and it and they call it cloud ready or cloud enabled or cloud optimized i guess the term they use is that just good marketing or is it really the right model for the cloud to have that sort of single logical block of infrastructure which you're taking away well CC is a V block user we use Vblock for all our fabric cloth fabric deployment and a full hour in this cloud that is the first we have private cloud delivered on premises on the red card it's a unique value proposition no nobody has meaning you don't have to buy millions we delivered to you it's ready just provision the workload we teach you how to do it and we can do it in 10 weeks now we can only do it with a optimized block well the hard work and they're hard when storage and network and compute off very integrated and then we used EDM where I'd advisors are um has their communication macaluso we believe and I personally believe that that's today the best technology available UCS was built for cloud means project California that server was built thinking virtualization the optimization to the upper visor to the chip so that's why I think it is for CCM for our customer the best solutions it has a future-proof solution all the other architecture in the hardware have to change like HP just did a brand new set of equipment so and so I use that word future proof yeah it's like a punch like it Flashman does that expand know it's a good term it means basically you buy something and yes headroom you could it takes you into the future so just drill down on that more detail cuz that's a really important point that folks they don't want the cloud washing mentality they want to see specific so just expand on that you could so first of all um clouds there's no magic there and there is a project you say I want to take my Devon test to the cloud you have to plan it rough too tested you have to make it happen so there's no magic in cloud no pixie dust is like any other the ability to what I call future proof is what I call cloud plus far something that I can sustain in the next five years and not having to do it an architecture change or a major change I will do refreshes because the hardware is moving faster point releases add some stuff to it yeah but my architectural substantial architectural layers and everything is kind of stable for that but cloud pushes innovation to the US as a provider to our suppliers and to our end users all the time because it as a brand new paradigms so future is the roadmap that you built for yourself their customers i'm gonna say i have my roadmap I know what my clouds are gonna look in five years I know they thinks that I'm you know evaluating html5 for everything that is an end you see this vblock for the fabric I'm looking at how do i integrate cloud providers the api structures we are building a very interesting platform for cloud service programs where we will be the broker on all the cloud providers and look at the Echelon and maintain transparency so I know exactly what my cloud I'm gonna look in five years so that's when I seed with my CIS I say you don't have to do cloud the doctor doesn't say that you have to do cloud but if you do understand the business value and what's the roadmap and what's the current state to end state and the value that you want to be able to the post so CSE obviously cloud service provider and the Chinese proverb may you live in interesting times and we're in the technology business so we always live in interesting times i guess but so you have your cloud business your provisioning your own cloud you have your own data centers we see SI p announced today the Hana cloud and so but you of course a big SI p partner now you're sort of quasi competitor are you gonna build your own Hana cloud of me how does that all work you live in this age of cooperation can you talk about that a little bit but that's the beauty of cloud cloud doesn't bring competition brings integration so I'll give you another example we work very strongly with Microsoft Azure in their environment but our customer comes to CSC because they they want the full service experience and they want security and they want somebody that really looks at the architecture of what they do it expertise not just a class so we have created a federation model where no customer comes in our cloud is called cloud belt and say I want to build myself a force applications the integration to the force platform is similis to the end users we actually integrated us force platform and we'd actually run the code in the first platform but the customer said I want to now put it as my data in the public knowledge I want to get having them physical I wanted on your data center so we take care of all that in the Federation loss so we talked a lot about SCP with SI p in the last a day about hannah and they have their business on demand a platform that it is a way to write applications in situ and we asked him you know we want to run the application they plot from ourselves because I value added and then already so that's okay we will do a fixed platform like force or Google oh I absorb but we have portable platforms like spring or chorus or alarm stock and but remember well the customer fields a lock-in because they know they can only run it down beauty and and when you wrote it a nap in a strict platform you kind of just say okay I take it and I run in there he runs only there it's off two months like if you ride a force up you can write it in a matter of days I runs only there you can't just say I don't like yourself horse I'm gonna walk with my data we're going yeah you walk with you did about the Alpha stays there Thank so there is a lot of lock-in in this new their plan yet but Federation is the value on it the CSC brings we understand the de world is dynamic in nature and we will push hard on all our suppliers to say when can we have the ability for them to have portable bar codes instead of fix work that the CSC leading executive forum did some work a couple years ago that I read and it was they were talking to some CIOs those guys and they said as part of CSC very good work that they do and they said anecdotally that the discussions with CIOs this is probably 2001 9 time frame during the downturn suggested that CIOs are accelerating IT organizations are accelerating their adoption of cloud by as much as 12 to 18 months and then he went out into the Wikibon community and confirm that same thing I was really compressing that cycle and and I think it you would describe it as everybody needed the cloud it was sort of this cloud frenzy and now it's a little bit more selective one of the areas that seems to be having good uptake in flowers the federal government they seem to you know the new federal CIO is really hitting hard on cloud um is a supporter yeah and so um so what are you seeing there why is that is and how much money can you actually save with clouds that's a very good question so in the federal case since 1999 they had 400 data centers and when they lead the last census of all the data center i think was 2008 they had over a thousand data centers and so that's a huge growth everybody I want my own data centers until the garlic laptops iPads yeah that's a data center so I am so I think the government has come to the conclusion to say we all belong to the same family yes we all have our differences and security and privacy but let's trot learn how to share and I think there's a strong mandate for federal to use cloud vectors in fact CeCe's part of the data center consolidation committee where Jim Schaffer our president of public sector is a contributing member they are interesting things that we see is that actually federal for the first time turns to commercial and says good what is he working on the commercial side let's take commercial structures and architectures and apply so that we can move much much faster and reduce the cost so now comes to the cops um i dissect the cost of cloud in various sections first of all you have to virtualize and so virtualization brings in fifteen percent you're going from 700 servers to let's say 200 servers and that's a saving say he said in energy is saving now agility you you save them space and he'd never thing and that's a real hardcore cost rather cost that you have to buy new our hardware they will around and virtualized environment poverty if you take all your refresh cycle everything that's coming to be done you buy new hardware that can support that you can synchronize that as you can see what a nice day Saudi there is in the big girls then if you do infrastructure-as-a-service you got another you know 15 I mean maybe ten percent like I go to Amazon but then you hit a brick wall and that r equal is your applications and don't run on the cloud and you know you don't have any more things to cry so that's why I say to my CL we have to look at the IT Park and your eyes we have to go to the hardcore runner Montaigne IT budget today is sixty percent and evaluate how are we going to write new applications that get modernized or how can we refactor the application so that we can reduce this run and montane down to no more than fifty percent so we can use all the other 50 for your innovation and that's why it's seriously we believe we've somebody takes this portfolio approach we can commit up to forty to forty-five percent cartridge on a traditional on a traditional company which now if you are a brand new company and you really do the analysis core versus non core and you go this route you actually can reduce your cost a lot when I was a CIO I add a data set I see the data center and I said I don't want to run datacenters I just builds after I don't have to have a data center the last person that was holding up was my CFO and he says oh I like my sister now I ever say well six months you are not sweet otherwise you are met and and now is the number one that sweets speaker for public company of using cell system so it is a culture that's a great I mean it's great movement right now cloud there's a SiliconANGLE TV the worldwide leader and online tech coverage this is the cube this is where we talk about all the great stories and content with Suki Kunta great conversation here at SiliconANGLE dot TV question on the service is angle Dave and I have been talking for weeks now about how the services business changing both the services of delivery consulting integration which you mentioned that's where cloud is not about competition bout integration and also the services that can be offered on the cloud so how was the the services business changing the value chain of the architecture to the wind services that are being delivered we call that services angle mean what's your angle on the services business is changing into in two ways one it becomes more strategic so all this road mapping and understanding of the asset portfolio and why do you want to be on three years and what's the type of IT leader you want to be for your organization so it's moving upwards and then actually is becoming very very technical people the really most virtualization optimization infrastructure and can really what i call the youngsters the guys that can really write apps very fast the young Dae young coders know what we are crap that really don't want to spend the times on you know I'll ride this big proposal he's there and I'll show you and that's when i interviewed it for CSC the kid in five minutes his own is the ipod alive stop on top here I know that he lives the cloud everyday leavin this is really the new people that I say we have to look for but there is a big difference the culture change the consultant with the tie and phil italia proceeds one in two and three so the kids say give me two hours and i give it back to you yeah it's a huge there's conflict back in the 90s remember that that's the consultant suit they're making a lot of money project management huge schedules kind of slow now it's like you got these gunslinger coders who can whip up apps deploy it on the cloud in a couple days in a day and set change very used to start with a word document to powerpoint and now they're starting with you know code well know if they're the most used tool is a mind map for a project instead of a bullet and and I think that's when you start come in a conversation with a customer you follow the threads of where he wants to be and then the end you end up with a map or what it needs to be done but it is a different culture and the beauty of having the traditional thing though is is that you can have you can actually provide structure to discredit creativity so the end result is a quality because you know cowboy is intact it's cowboying intact and I you don't want to have that especially with our customers where we get them and can't we have small and large I mean I have olympic system a small bite active coupons so that that's my spectrum but quality is the most important thing nothing so we have to put quality within relationships we're here with the