>> from our studios in the heart of Silicon Valley. HOLLOWAY ALTO, California It is a cube conversation. >> Hi, and welcome to the Cube studios for another cube conversation where we go in depth with thought leaders driving innovation across the tech industry. I'm your host today, Peter Boris. One of the biggest challenges that every enterprise faces is how best to focus attention on the most important assets that are driving or facilitating that drive the digital business and digital business transformation. There's been a lot of emphasis over the last 50 years in tech on the hardware assets, but increasingly we need to look at the elements of it that are actually creating net new value within a business now, maybe the people, the services and the data that make digital business possible. And that requires that we rethink our approach is to how we actually manage, conceive of and monitor those key assets and is likely to lead to some very interesting unification Tze over the next few years, especially in SEC ups and neck cops now and have that conversation got a great guest today. Sanjay Moon. She is the vice president, product management, that net scout Technologies. Sanjay, welcome to the >> Cube. Thank you, Peter. Thank you. >> So, Sanjay, I said a lot upfront. But before we get into that, tell us a little bit about Net Scout. >> Thank you, Peter, for the introduction. Net Scout is a smart data company. Net Scout has three decades of leadership and innovation in troubleshooting monitoring and securing it based networks. We are deployed in 90% off the Fortune 500 companies and 90% off the top communication service providers. World White. We have 50% market teacher In each of the three segments that we playing. Where is the next biggest competitor? We have has less than 5%. Those three areas are number one network and application performance monitoring for hybrid cloud infrastructure for enterprises, D does and on security for enterprise and service providers and service assurance for service providers, which includes mobile operators, cable providers as well as I speak. Today we operate in 50 plus countries worldwide. We have 25 100 plus employees and 500 plus pattern store credit. >> Impressive story. Let's get right to the issue, though, and how Net scout is actually participating in some of these crucial transformations. I mentioned upfront that one of the biggest challenges that every enterprise has is to focus Maura their attention on those digital assets that are actually driving change and new sources of value named of the data, the services and the devices and the people, the applications or people that use those. So one >> of >> the challenges that we've had is that, ah, focus on devices leads to a focus on certain classes of data that are mainly improved or focus on improving the productivity of devices. Give us a background and how that's what that means. >> Let me in to do the concept of smart data that's that's born out ofthe nets, calibrated with smart data. Next called Pioneer. The leverage off Wired ate our package data three decades back that drives over ingenious portfolio that drives net ops and cloud tops. S i r. Adapt to service intelligence. This is a smart data that comes out ofthe packets with S I smart data. We uniquely converge application and network performance monitoring you are customers Toro visibility across application tears and two and networks and diverse data center locations. >> So just toe pick up on that moving away from a log focus, which is again mainly, Let's improve the productivity of the device. We're moving in a sigh, which is focus on Let's improve the productivity of the connection in the application. >> Absolutely absolute. And we'll talk a little bit more about long. Let's talk about Log and Net flew other sources of data that folks have gravitated towards, which is not there, not there, not authority to by any means. Let's say log data, for example, this log data, you know, as soon as a threat actor, for example, gets access to your systems. The first thing the protector will do is to turn off flogging are doing verse changed the log days, change the cyst, log messaging itself. Let's take a look at net flow data. For example, Net flow data number one Problem is, it's not Doesn't have layers. Seven. Intelligence, innit? Number two. It's not generated by all the devices in the network. For example, the Coyote devices do not generate any kind of flow data, so only data that authoritative and that comes with high fidelity is packet or wire data. That's one element off of smart data that we have the other element of smart data comes from our arbor portfolio. Arbor products are deployed in 400 plus tier one operators, mobile operators and service providers worldwide. And as such, we see 1/3 of the Internet traffic to our strategically located. Sensors in the service provider corps were able to generate another type of smart data that we call Atlas Intelligence feed R A F in sharp air for it. Plus intelligence Feed essentially tracks cyber reputation across domains across joe locations and across user identities. The combination of the A S I smart data that is generated from the core of the hybrid cloud infrastructure. Let's call it intranet and F Smart data that is generated from the Internet Corps gives Net Scout a unique data set combination that's unparalleled in the marketplace and makes us perhaps Lee, one of the food vendors who can drive a consolidated visibility architectures across net ops, cloud ups and second >> Okay, So let's turn that into against very practical things for folks, because what it has historically done is by focusing on individual devices or classes of devices and the data that those devices generate, they end up with a panoply Ah, wide arrangement of security tools that are each good at optimizing those devices with those, he said, they may not necessarily be a forte tive, but it's difficult to weave that into a consolidated, unified SEC ops Net ops overall, not just architecture but platform for performing the work crucial work of sustaining your digital business infrastructure. How does smart data translate into unified operation >> is appoint Peter? Thank you. That's a very good point. So let me give an example and talk about the customers that we have deployed our smart data, our hybrid cloud infrastructure. This is a typical Fortune 500 where we are deployed. Next card is deployed as the hybrid cloud monitoring infrastructure, and the networks in the club cloud upside. Typically, you will see this type of organization has one tool to cover the entire hybrid cloud monitoring infrastructure across their entire portfolio, whether it is on Prem, whether it's in the cloud, whether it's in the core location facility. But when you look at the SEC locks and the security side, the story is completely different. The same organization, the same Enterprise customer, has 25 to 30 different disparate display tools As a matter of fact, analysts are saying today that a typical Fortune 500 the US has 70 disparate security tools. Why is that the case? Why is it that on the net tops and cloud upside, they need 11 tool net scout, for example? But in the second up there, 70 different products. The reason is not only smart data but also smart architecture. So what? We have seen what we have done over the past three decades, We have designed this two tier architecture that generates Margarita. The dear one is our distributed instrumentation of sense of framework, which we call in Finnish Stream or the Stream. This is the distributor sensor framework that is deployed in the hybrid cloud infrastructure that generates the smart data. And then we had the centralized Analytics layer, which is our ingenious platform that essentially correlates data across the hybrid cloud infrastructure and provide customers complete visibility across the portfolio off the data centers. On the second upside, security side security is roughly 1 10 to 15 years old. Security tried to emulate the studio model as well, but the security industry failed. In doing that, nobody could design this distributed sensor instrumentation cost effectively tto make violate our feasible for analytics with the result they migrated to. As you said, this subpar sources of data like CeCe log like net flow. And today they put all the emphasis on the analytics layer with the result. They need one tool for use case or one vendor per use case on the second offside. And that's why you see the two proliferation because they don't have this distributed sensor framework that will make violate our package data feasible for the analytics lately. >> And I want I want to build on something you're saying because, uh, the it's a It's a misperception that all resources and all work of digital business and technology is going to end up in a central crowd location. The cloud really is an architecture form or broad distribution of data and work, which means, ultimately, that if we don't deal with this proliferation security tools now we're going tow. Probably have an even greater explosion in the number of security tools, which will mohr radically diminish or ability to establish new classes of options and digital business. >> Very good point. As a matter of fact, just a couple of years back, the average number of tools was 40 in in a SEC cops portfolio on enterprise has in the U. S. To date 70 it could go 200. But if you look at the risk profile, well, this profile has stayed the same, are in and make mint. Many cases deteriorated, right? What we found is the tool that a number of tools is going up. The cost of breaches going up the third. The number of breaches are going up, and at the same time, the number of analysts is always and Earth. So in short, high investments on the security side failed to reduce risk. So the risk and investment factor both are going in the north bound go, both are going up. So how do you control that? How do you make them come down? The only way? Smart data on a smart platform on a smart analytics later. >> Yeah. Again, let me emphasize this crucial point because it's one of things that we've seen in our conversation with clients is, ah, proliferation of tools. Proliferation of data leads to a proliferation of tasks and response responsibilities within a business, and you end up with more human failures of consequence. So by bringing all these things together, you end up with smarter data, smarter platform, simpler operations, more unified operations and get greater leverage. So so, let's talk then about ultimately, how should a business What's the road map? What's the next two or three things that an enterprise needs to do to start bringing these to start unifying these resources and generating the simplicity so that you open up greater strategic options for how you configure your digital business? >> That's a very good point. So >> two things we talked about already one is smart data relying on smart data, which comes from wide ate our package data. And the second is smart, smart architecture, which comprises of this two tier architecture with distributed instrumentation and centralized analytics. What happens when you do that is the first thing is early warning detection. What we have realized, Peter, is that if you look at the traditional kill chain in Lockheed Martin's kill chain, our miter mortal that people are using now traditional reconnaissance weaponization shin as well as ex filtration, we have seen that if you rely, if you generate analytics based on packet date are smart data, which we do as a net scow. You can detect these phases much earlier than if you rely on device data. Net floor, sis log. So what I call day minus not day zero, but day minus so leveraging the smart data and smart architecture. Er, we're able tto detect these threats or compromises much earlier than a traditional kill chain more than lot of miter models, >> but But again, the reason why is because we're looking at patterns in the traffic. >> We're looking at behavioral patterns in the traffic. That's correct. Let me go little bit more technical, if you will, were looking at transactions at the DNA's level, transactions at the CP level or at the active directly level that happened much earlier than when electoral movement or a reconnaissance is detected. This happens much earlier because we have the smart data, the wide ADA that enables us to do this early warning detection, >> get more visibility to source as opposed to the target. >> That's correct. The second thing that happens with US smart architecture, the two tier architecture is the consolidation of fuse case. We talked about it a little bit, so today if you want in our in our hybrid cloud scenario that we the next card is deployed in Fortune five hundreds. Over the past 23 decades, our customers have moved from private cloud infrastructure. First they had the core righty. Then they moved Private cloud. You know, I am Francisco. Then they moved echolocation clinics and others. And then they moved also to public cloud. All the workloads are migrating and everywhere we did not make any change to our instrumentation there. Can you believe it? No changes You only changes we made was in the analytics layer to take care of the news cases. So with the result, we could consolidate multiple whose case is in the cloud monitoring in tow. One platform, the smart platform that smart data. Now we're building that value into security with the smart platform and smart data that we talked about. So the consolidation of use cases on the security side is the second advantage other than the early warning detection that we talked about. >> So this has got to improve. Detection has got intrude. Management's gonna improve. Forensics. If I got that right, >> made a good point. And forensics we should talk about a little bit more. Perhaps the second set of things that we're doing is we have done is consolidate in the SEC upside forensics and detection. So let me explain that a little bit more. If you look at a typical enterprise today, they use Seymour security information and even management platforms to correlate data from multiple sources. So in the event off a seam alert, off alert generated best SIM platform forensics teams need to determine what happened and what systems were impacted. Essentially the what when, how, where off, the off the alert or the compromise that has been detected today. As we said, security teams are not using packet data at all but foreign. 16. In orderto validate that alert, they need toe access sessions. They need to access packets belonging to that Ellen, but they cannot today because none of the devices none of the security platforms is using violator in the first place. So what the security teams are doing? Forensic analysts. They're leveraging devices like via shark and tracking investigations with spreadsheets. This is delaying the investigation time. As you know today, it's well known that this cause is alert, fatigue and 50% of the alerts that are going to the seam today are disregarded by the security analysts. With the result, the real threats are getting unabated, and enterprises come to know about a security breach from the media rather than from their own IT department. >> Sanjay. So we've had a great conversation talking about how smart data smart platform is going to lead to greater unification of tasks, people, responsibilities and set ups and net tops and some of the it impacts on eh enterprises Overall response stance both from a detection, management and forensic standpoint. So what's going on? Thank you very much for being on the cue. Sanjay Moon. She Thank you. Thank you. And thanks again for joining us for the Cube conversation. We've been Sanjay Moon, she of Net scout technology. I'm Peter Burke's. See you next time

and we're here with sicky junta and psyche is with CSC she's uh she's an entrepreneur she's a cloud expert she's a technologist a businessperson her official title is global vice president of cloud computing and cloud services at CSC welcome thank you it's good to see good to see you here and we're very excited to be at sapphire this is day 3 of course we're gonna talk cloud with the woods with sicky so so why don't we start off sick you tell us you know what is what is cloud all about is that is it living up to the hype I personally believe that cloud it is the way of the future we don't have enough trees and data centers for the generation that we are breathing you know the generation that we are breathing produce a tremendous amount of these data by the minute us digital data texting data voice data and all this data has to be Monte so the cloud it is the future to go and it's actually changed in the last three years I've been working loud for quite a while the dynamics of the last 12 months people have gone from being educational I want to know and we have to spell MC sounds like cloud and and then you say to them now their projects they have money they have value added in Rio the termination in that cloud project how was it changing good business Missy SC is a very well-known you know broad-based service provider outsourcing and so far how is the cloud changing your business it is very interesting because it's kind of transforming the business of cici's it transformed the way that we interact with our customers and prospects we use a lot of digital new yahoo the way we approach to our custom is very different we do pilots in our cloud the business model is changing we run we don't take hasit and people like it outsourcing deal we just run it for my fabric or we deliver cloud fabric at the customer data centers and we managers or we can say to them will give you the cloud fabric and you are like an Amazon you can manage it yourselves and we just keep the fabric well we'll provide the provisioning we provide your constructions and you are your own service provider is it very different than what she does to the top reason folks talk to you about you get a lot of clouds going on building clouds and you've been in technology preneur in the past sold your companies but you're at CC big brands are coming to you what is the number one thing you're seeing the pattern of the customer requests and or the new customers I think the customers they're really serious about cloud want agility version Assad Julia um I T delivery time to deliver a off even six weeks three months that is traditional it is not possible today customers wants to build application and modern weeks instead of months the new platforms like force calm and a zoo or do you have spring source vm having google apps they actually have this very beautiful object-oriented way for you to write application we're very very fast and so that requires a delivery mechanisms that can sustain that more I think that they want to build brand new applications so they can stay with them for the next 20 years and and we're waiting to us come on this morning we're talking on prior you said the cloud is a user experience I think that's really profound can you expand on that that was pretty compelling I think people look at the cloud as is odd this tech I and big iron in there but you talk about what you mean by the cloud is a user experience so I there are two type of Christ there is the consumer clouds that's the cloud that we do every your typing on the cloud and we have facebook and twitter and all this i play Angry Birds that's a gaming it's a big cloud that's any user experience of the cloud so if you leave in your cloud and use your spirits and then you go away you just say why do I have to win six weeks when I can play you know I can play final fantasy in real time with people in Hong Kong that's really the experience of the castle and enterprise is not there yet and there has two issues first of all the technology really was not they are still provide that the applications like sa peas and and the evolution of the systems second the processes are going internal IT are really very rigid sometimes you have to go fill up in requesting gotta get all this approval and has to be seen by 25 people on business model and all that so we have the challenge of accelerating a business classes and providing the same end user experience there and that's why it's CSC we have pilots in our plans we say to customer currents bosses and you know use our portal our provisioning environments upload workloads start to understand what does it mean interacting with about you know try it out there like in a mixed thing you know they got us growing you know puppy and then there they're stuck with the animal the cloud that's yeah I do never compare Jonna come up with a lot of those in the next half hour secure your company is technology agnostic of anyways right you know the real you get wed to a particular technology or services company so you have to be a trusted advisor to use clients on we're here at sapphire we're hearing a lot about in-memory computing and hannah we were talking a little bit about that off-camera what's your take on on this notion that sa p is putting forth they call them the ram cloud in-memory computing the Hana cloud what's your angle on that so first of all let's all understand the ROM and memory is the juice of clouds and I'll give you an analogy the cloud is like an apartment building where if the guy at the top takes a hot shower and uses all the shot that hot water the guy the bottom has no it has a cold shower and that's really the real analogy in a cloud vector if I have a very intense memory usage workload some could be SI p JD edwards and some others the other everybody in that community in that multi-tenant that's what it is multi-tenant ones we are all together feels the same problems and so memory it is deduce a cloud but that doesn't mean that because i have a lot of memory I don't have to optimize systems systems should be optimized and agile by themselves that's why a lot of refactoring a lot of building you know legacy java to a spring environment where you have encapsulation to take home see where you have object orientations and that makes you a John workers that really are optimized to use the maximum of the memory we actually going through this period right now he talks about private clouds and public laws in a hybrid clouds we've sort of in this period where we've got one foot in the legacy camp because you can't we don't a rip rip and replace and we've got another foot in this you know agile new world are you seeing a lot of sort of native new application development that's going to take advantage of these new cloud architectures new potential business processes you've seen that today and how long do you think it will take to actually see that bring true innovation to business I think that today the biggest usage of cloud are Gavin test so if the Devon test is the biggest user God that means that all the new projects are being developed to be delivered on the cloud vector and that's really very very very important today gets virtualized uses a platform but there is a big movement to refactor my applications because waiting for everything new there is only twenty percent of innovation in every large shop of IT today so there is a lot of companies that do create a roadmap for their workload and and when I talk to them I say divide you your workload part in three categories the legacy one that will never move that's the one that I in agreed environments and virtualized their heart the databases to bake the construct is not a job and the one that you want to do straight away Devon test email unified communications serum and the other things evaluate do I have to do I is it core that I have to own it and build it on or could I sauce it so to provide I system that it was already out there that it's like for sales culture of this world the NetSuite of this world workday is success factor 0 or any type of HR systems and say why do I have to own it why can't i have a SAS cloud environment where i can buy the serious doing this exercise helps them understand what its core what is not and why should I spend the money to take legacy applications to to the cloud can see it's a major changes in all layers who invited the you've got your your your device here your iPad we've hearing a lot of changes at the application layer and of course the infrastructure as well how is infrastructure changing and there's a lot of talk about convergence and there's logical blocks of infrastructure what are your thoughts there well I think that and the infrastructure layer we are actually seeing two major chain changes that are coming very fast first of all the multi-core environment 20 course is gonna beat ah here soon you're just sooner than we think and so all this memory conversation will already evaluated again because how's that memory gonna work with all this capacity our computer we have and that's that's a real conversations in and the IKE advisor that has the interaction with the fabric will need to be optimized to be able to take advantage of that storage is going through a lot of chambers multi-tier being the ability to say I don't want to maintain this for a long time understanding the retention here is it's even more critical than before because the access to the data now it's very fast and understanding the tiering and how you're going to do or not network storage what they're gonna cash what are you gonna close it creates a lot of questions when you build an application or when we refactor the applications a lot of it I think we have to realize that the systems have speed as a requirement and optimize from the end user to the art to the bear models what's the most efficient path just mentioned some real hot tech areas that we were all over I'll see the multicores and you the course the in-memory got solid state changing her essay p guys here saying summaries the new disc disc is the new tape tape is dead pretty pretty simple message there but multi core memory the hypervisor role of virtualization and the change will storage all those forces are colliding yeah when twins win some argue that that's an opportunity for redefinition of a new operating environment so to your point about optimization how do you see that revolving is that fantasy it gotta like a wish list you see new architectures developing definitely new architecture love being developed tonight's a new architecture for instance it's an optimized act architecture for mobility and to create a very pleasant user experience with all the data that sa p has because as if he has all this come on up data lock deals and so it's a new architecture you just say instead of changing the structure of the data or the app i am actually moving the interaction at the mobility level to a new device so that the experience is better in some cases used we will have to go back all the way and brought in right brand new systems that can suppose support that but I i believe the new architecture I've built all the time I think that um we haven't probably have a scene um what's the preferred what's the preferred visually for the future for this type of texture that that you're seeing and that you're driving towards mostly memory stuff immediate benefits to caching what do you see is the preferred methods that are driving right now I think that sounds looking at mobility so that that you can divide the user from the system's is very protesting because if you don't do that we actually slow down the end user experience and the end user is the productivity that we get every day second it's we have to look at business logics and can isolate the business logic so that I can can I really change it in a dynamic way in the last 10 years of 20 years we built system where we encoded everything he has to talk to this database over this IP address with that all this um hardcore stana configurations yes it's very hard in the cloud environment dynamic environment new media environment so we have to look at the system say how can I use so object orientations platforms separations logic how can i isolate the data if I have to how can I put it you know virtual data Mart's on top of it so that I can I'll cute the data because if I kind of a what Hana is was I'm sorry structure data then I cubix and then the cube gets talked to everybody and normally i know that in dededo there is eighty percent again used 20 bars are all right reverse so it's really an interaction and reactant acting from the end user best experience i want to do that facebook experience i want to give it that um gaming experience so how do i get to the data and adina you know it's probably 20 years old and it's really mainframe in monster well you're not gonna go ahead sir so when we talk to some of the vendors like for instance an emc they talk about the block at ciscos pushing UCS and it and they call it cloud ready or cloud enabled or cloud optimized i guess the term they use is that just good marketing or is it really the right model for the cloud to have that sort of single logical block of infrastructure which you're taking away well CC is a V block user we use Vblock for all our fabric cloth fabric deployment and a full hour in this cloud that is the first we have private cloud delivered on premises on the red card it's a unique value proposition no nobody has meaning you don't have to buy millions we delivered to you it's ready just provision the workload we teach you how to do it and we can do it in 10 weeks now we can only do it with a optimized block well the hard work and they're hard when storage and network and compute off very integrated and then we used EDM where I'd advisors are um has their communication macaluso we believe and I personally believe that that's today the best technology available UCS was built for cloud means project California that server was built thinking virtualization the optimization to the upper visor to the chip so that's why I think it is for CCM for our customer the best solutions it has a future-proof solution all the other architecture in the hardware have to change like HP just did a brand new set of equipment so and so I use that word future proof yeah it's like a punch like it Flashman does that expand know it's a good term it means basically you buy something and yes headroom you could it takes you into the future so just drill down on that more detail cuz that's a really important point that folks they don't want the cloud washing mentality they want to see specific so just expand on that you could so first of all um clouds there's no magic there and there is a project you say I want to take my Devon test to the cloud you have to plan it rough too tested you have to make it happen so there's no magic in cloud no pixie dust is like any other the ability to what I call future proof is what I call cloud plus far something that I can sustain in the next five years and not having to do it an architecture change or a major change I will do refreshes because the hardware is moving faster point releases add some stuff to it yeah but my architectural substantial architectural layers and everything is kind of stable for that but cloud pushes innovation to the US as a provider to our suppliers and to our end users all the time because it as a brand new paradigms so future is the roadmap that you built for yourself their customers i'm gonna say i have my roadmap I know what my clouds are gonna look in five years I know they thinks that I'm you know evaluating html5 for everything that is an end you see this vblock for the fabric I'm looking at how do i integrate cloud providers the api structures we are building a very interesting platform for cloud service programs where we will be the broker on all the cloud providers and look at the Echelon and maintain transparency so I know exactly what my cloud I'm gonna look in five years so that's when I seed with my CIS I say you don't have to do cloud the doctor doesn't say that you have to do cloud but if you do understand the business value and what's the roadmap and what's the current state to end state and the value that you want to be able to the post so CSE obviously cloud service provider and the Chinese proverb may you live in interesting times and we're in the technology business so we always live in interesting times i guess but so you have your cloud business your provisioning your own cloud you have your own data centers we see SI p announced today the Hana cloud and so but you of course a big SI p partner now you're sort of quasi competitor are you gonna build your own Hana cloud of me how does that all work you live in this age of cooperation can you talk about that a little bit but that's the beauty of cloud cloud doesn't bring competition brings integration so I'll give you another example we work very strongly with Microsoft Azure in their environment but our customer comes to CSC because they they want the full service experience and they want security and they want somebody that really looks at the architecture of what they do it expertise not just a class so we have created a federation model where no customer comes in our cloud is called cloud belt and say I want to build myself a force applications the integration to the force platform is similis to the end users we actually integrated us force platform and we'd actually run the code in the first platform but the customer said I want to now put it as my data in the public knowledge I want to get having them physical I wanted on your data center so we take care of all that in the Federation loss so we talked a lot about SCP with SI p in the last a day about hannah and they have their business on demand a platform that it is a way to write applications in situ and we asked him you know we want to run the application they plot from ourselves because I value added and then already so that's okay we will do a fixed platform like force or Google oh I absorb but we have portable platforms like spring or chorus or alarm stock and but remember well the customer fields a lock-in because they know they can only run it down beauty and and when you wrote it a nap in a strict platform you kind of just say okay I take it and I run in there he runs only there it's off two months like if you ride a force up you can write it in a matter of days I runs only there you can't just say I don't like yourself horse I'm gonna walk with my data we're going yeah you walk with you did about the Alpha stays there Thank so there is a lot of lock-in in this new their plan yet but Federation is the value on it the CSC brings we understand the de world is dynamic in nature and we will push hard on all our suppliers to say when can we have the ability for them to have portable bar codes instead of fix work that the CSC leading executive forum did some work a couple years ago that I read and it was they were talking to some CIOs those guys and they said as part of CSC very good work that they do and they said anecdotally that the discussions with CIOs this is probably 2001 9 time frame during the downturn suggested that CIOs are accelerating IT organizations are accelerating their adoption of cloud by as much as 12 to 18 months and then he went out into the Wikibon community and confirm that same thing I was really compressing that cycle and and I think it you would describe it as everybody needed the cloud it was sort of this cloud frenzy and now it's a little bit more selective one of the areas that seems to be having good uptake in flowers the federal government they seem to you know the new federal CIO is really hitting hard on cloud um is a supporter yeah and so um so what are you seeing there why is that is and how much money can you actually save with clouds that's a very good question so in the federal case since 1999 they had 400 data centers and when they lead the last census of all the data center i think was 2008 they had over a thousand data centers and so that's a huge growth everybody I want my own data centers until the garlic laptops iPads yeah that's a data center so I am so I think the government has come to the conclusion to say we all belong to the same family yes we all have our differences and security and privacy but let's trot learn how to share and I think there's a strong mandate for federal to use cloud vectors in fact CeCe's part of the data center consolidation committee where Jim Schaffer our president of public sector is a contributing member they are interesting things that we see is that actually federal for the first time turns to commercial and says good what is he working on the commercial side let's take commercial structures and architectures and apply so that we can move much much faster and reduce the cost so now comes to the cops um i dissect the cost of cloud in various sections first of all you have to virtualize and so virtualization brings in fifteen percent you're going from 700 servers to let's say 200 servers and that's a saving say he said in energy is saving now agility you you save them space and he'd never thing and that's a real hardcore cost rather cost that you have to buy new our hardware they will around and virtualized environment poverty if you take all your refresh cycle everything that's coming to be done you buy new hardware that can support that you can synchronize that as you can see what a nice day Saudi there is in the big girls then if you do infrastructure-as-a-service you got another you know 15 I mean maybe ten percent like I go to Amazon but then you hit a brick wall and that r equal is your applications and don't run on the cloud and you know you don't have any more things to cry so that's why I say to my CL we have to look at the IT Park and your eyes we have to go to the hardcore runner Montaigne IT budget today is sixty percent and evaluate how are we going to write new applications that get modernized or how can we refactor the application so that we can reduce this run and montane down to no more than fifty percent so we can use all the other 50 for your innovation and that's why it's seriously we believe we've somebody takes this portfolio approach we can commit up to forty to forty-five percent cartridge on a traditional on a traditional company which now if you are a brand new company and you really do the analysis core versus non core and you go this route you actually can reduce your cost a lot when I was a CIO I add a data set I see the data center and I said I don't want to run datacenters I just builds after I don't have to have a data center the last person that was holding up was my CFO and he says oh I like my sister now I ever say well six months you are not sweet otherwise you are met and and now is the number one that sweets speaker for public company of using cell system so it is a culture that's a great I mean it's great movement right now cloud there's a SiliconANGLE TV the worldwide leader and online tech coverage this is the cube this is where we talk about all the great stories and content with Suki Kunta great conversation here at SiliconANGLE dot TV question on the service is angle Dave and I have been talking for weeks now about how the services business changing both the services of delivery consulting integration which you mentioned that's where cloud is not about competition bout integration and also the services that can be offered on the cloud so how was the the services business changing the value chain of the architecture to the wind services that are being delivered we call that services angle mean what's your angle on the services business is changing into in two ways one it becomes more strategic so all this road mapping and understanding of the asset portfolio and why do you want to be on three years and what's the type of IT leader you want to be for your organization so it's moving upwards and then actually is becoming very very technical people the really most virtualization optimization infrastructure and can really what i call the youngsters the guys that can really write apps very fast the young Dae young coders know what we are crap that really don't want to spend the times on you know I'll ride this big proposal he's there and I'll show you and that's when i interviewed it for CSC the kid in five minutes his own is the ipod alive stop on top here I know that he lives the cloud everyday leavin this is really the new people that I say we have to look for but there is a big difference the culture change the consultant with the tie and phil italia proceeds one in two and three so the kids say give me two hours and i give it back to you yeah it's a huge there's conflict back in the 90s remember that that's the consultant suit they're making a lot of money project management huge schedules kind of slow now it's like you got these gunslinger coders who can whip up apps deploy it on the cloud in a couple days in a day and set change very used to start with a word document to powerpoint and now they're starting with you know code well know if they're the most used tool is a mind map for a project instead of a bullet and and I think that's when you start come in a conversation with a customer you follow the threads of where he wants to be and then the end you end up with a map or what it needs to be done but it is a different culture and the beauty of having the traditional thing though is is that you can have you can actually provide structure to discredit creativity so the end result is a quality because you know cowboy is intact it's cowboying intact and I you don't want to have that especially with our customers where we get them and can't we have small and large I mean I have olympic system a small bite active coupons so that that's my spectrum but quality is the most important thing nothing so we have to put quality within relationships we're here with the