>>Okay, welcome back everyone. There's the cubes coverage of VMware Explorer, 22 formerly world. We've been here since 2010 and world 2010 to now it's 2022. And it's VMware Explorer. We're here at the CEO, regular writer. Welcome back to the cube. Great to see you in person. >>Yeah. Great to be here in person, >>Dave and I are, are proud to say that we've been to 12 straight years of covering VMware's annual conference. And thank you. We've seen the change in the growth over time and you know, it's kind of, I won't say pinch me moment, but it's more of a moment of there's the VMware that's grown into the cloud after your famous deal with Andy jazzy in 2016, we've been watching what has been a real sea change and VMware since taking that legacy core business and straightening out the cloud strategy in 2016, and then since then an acceleration of, of cloud native, like direction under your leadership at VMware. Now you're the CEO take us through that because this is where we are right now. We are here at the pinnacle of VMware 2.0 or cloud native VMware, as you point out on your keynote, take us through that history real quick. Cuz I think it's important to know that you've been the architect of a lot of this change and it's it's working. >>Yeah, definitely. We are super excited because like I said, it's working, the history is pretty simple. I mean we tried running our own cloud cloud air. We cloud air didn't work so well. Right. And then at that time, customers really gave us strong feedback that the hybrid they wanted was a Amazon together. Right. And so that's what we went back and did and the andjay announcement, et cetera. And then subsequently as we were continue to build it out, I mean, once that happened, we were able to go work with the Satia and Microsoft and others to get the thing built out all over. Then the next question was okay, Hey, that's great for the workloads that are running on vSphere. What's the story for workloads that are gonna be cloud native and benefit a lot from being cloud native. So that's when we went the Tansu route and the Kubernetes route, we did a couple of acquisitions and then we started that started paying off now with the Tansu portfolio. And last but not the least is once customers have this distributed portfolio now, right. Increasingly everything is becoming multi-cloud. How do you manage and connect and secure. So that's what you start seeing that you saw the management announcement, networking and security and everything else is cooking. And you'll see more stuff there. >>Yeah know, we've been talking about super cloud. It's kinda like a multi-cloud on steroids kind a little bit different pivot of it. And we're seeing some use cases. >>No, no, it's, it's a very great, it's a, it's pretty close to what we talk about. >>Awesome. I mean, and we're seeing this kind of alignment in the industry. It's kind of open, but I have to ask you, when did you, you have the moment where you said multicloud is the game changer moment. When did you have, because you guys had hybrid, which is really early as well. When was the Raghu? When did you have the moment where you said, Hey, multicloud is what's happening. That's we're doubling down on that go. >>I mean, if you think about the evolution of the cloud players, right. Microsoft really started picking up around the 2018 timeframe. I mean, I'm talking about Azure, right? >>In a big way. >>Yeah. In a big way. Right. When that happened and then Google got really serious, it became pretty clear that this was gonna be looking more like the old database market than it looked like a single player cloud market. Right. Equally sticky, but very strong players all with lots of IP creation capability. So that's when we said, okay, from a supplier side, this is gonna become multi. And from a customer side that has always been their desire. Right. Which is, Hey, I don't want to get locked into anybody. I want to do multiple things. And the cloud vendors also started leveraging that OnPrem. Microsoft said, Hey, if you're a windows customer, your licensing is gonna be better off if you go to Azure. Right. Oracle did the same thing. So it just became very clear. >>I am, I have gone make you laugh. I always go back to the software mainframe because I, I think you were here. Right. I mean, you're, you're almost 20 years in. Yeah. And I, the reason I appreciate that is because, well, that's technically very challenging. How do you make virtualization overhead virtually non-existent how do you run any workload? Yeah. How do you recover from, I mean, that's was not trivial. Yeah. Okay. So what's the technical, you know, analog today, the real technical challenge. When you think about cross cloud services. >>Yeah. I mean, I think it's different for each of these layers, right? So as I was alluding to for management, I mean, you can go each one of them by themselves, there is one way of Mo doing multi-cloud, which is multiple clouds. Right. You could say, look, I'm gonna build a great product for AWS. And then I'm gonna build a great product for Azure. I'm gonna build a great product for Google. That's not what aria is. Aria is a true multi-cloud, which means it pulls data in from multiple places. Right? So there are two or three, there are three things that aria has done. That's I think is super interesting. One is they're not trying to take all the data and bring it in. They're trying to federate the data sources. And secondly, they're doing it in real time and they're able to construct this graph of a customer's cloud resources. >>Right. So to keep the graph constructed and pulling data, federating data, I think that's a very interesting concept. The second thing that, like I said is it's a real time because in the cloud, a container might come and go like that. Like that is a second technical challenge. The third it's not as much a technical challenge, but I really like what they have done for the interface they've used GraphQL. Right? So it's not about if you remember in the old world, people talk about single pan or glass, et cetera. No, this is nothing to do with pan or glass. This is a data model. That's a graph and a query language that's suited for that. So you can literally think of whatever you wanna write. You can write and express it in GraphQL and pull all sorts of management applications. You can say, Hey, I can look at cost. I can look at metrics. I can look at whatever it is. It's not five different types of applications. It's one, that's what I think had to do it at scale is the other problem. And, and >>The, the technical enable there is just it's good software. It's a protocol. It's >>No, no, it's, it's, it's it's software. It's a data model. And it's the Federation architecture that they've got, which is open. Right. You can pull in data from Datadog, just as well as from >>Pretty >>Much anything data from VR op we don't care. Right? >>Yeah. Yeah. So rego, I have to ask you, I'm glad you like the Supercloud cuz you know, we, we think multi-cloud still early, but coming fast. I mean, everyone has multiple clouds, but spanning this idea of spanning across has interesting sequences. Do you data, do you do computer both and a lot of good things happening. Kubernetes been containers, all that good stuff. Okay. How do you see the first rev of multi-cloud evolving? Like is it what happens? What's the sequence, what's the order of operations for a client standpoint? Customer standpoint of, of multicloud or Supercloud because we think we're seeing it as a refactoring of something like snowflake, they're a data base, they're a data warehouse on the cloud. They, they say data cloud they'd they like they'll tell us no, you, we're not a data. We're not a data warehouse. We're data cloud. Okay. You're a data warehouse refactored for the CapEx from Amazon and cooler, newer things. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's a behavior change. Yeah. But it's still a data warehouse. Yeah. How do you see this multi-cloud environment? Refactoring? Is there something that you see that might be different? That's the same if you know what I'm saying? Like what's what, what's the ne the new thing that's happening with multi-cloud, that's different than just saying I'm I'm doing SAS on the cloud. >>Yeah. So I would say, I would point to a, a couple of things that are different. Firstly, my, the answer depends on which category you are in. Like the category that snowflake is in is very different than Kubernetes or >>Something or Mongo DB, right? >>Yeah. Or Mongo DB. So, so it is not appropriate to talk about one multi-cloud approach across data and compute and so, so on and so forth. So I'll talk about the spaces that we play. Right. So step one, for most customers is two application architectures, right? The cloud native architecture and an enterprise native architecture and tying that together either through data or through networks or through et cetera. So that's where most of the customers are. Right. And then I would say step two is to bring these things together in a more, in a closer fashion and that's where we are going. And that is why you saw the cloud universal announcement and that's already, you've seen the Tansu announcement, et cetera. So it's really, the step one was two distinct clouds. That is just two separate islands. >>So the other thing that we did, that's really what my, the other thing that I'd like to get to your reaction on, cause this is great. You're like a masterclass in the cube here. Yeah, totally is. We see customers becoming super clouds because they're getting the benefit of, of VMware, AWS. And so if I'm like a media company or insurance company, if I have scale, if I continue to invest in, in cloud native development, I do all these things. I'm gonna have a da data scale advantage, possibly agile, which means I can build apps and functionality very quick for customers. I might become my own cloud within the vertical. Exactly. And so I could then service other people in the insurance vertical if I'm the insurance company with my technology and create a separate power curve that never existed before. Cause the CapEx is off the table, it's operating expense. Yep. That runs into the income statement. Yep. This is a fundamental business model shift and an advantage of this kind of scenario. >>And that's why I don't think snowflakes, >>What's your reaction to that? Cuz that's something that, that is not really, talk's highly nuanced and situational. But if Goldman Sachs builds the biggest cloud on the planet for financial service for their own benefit, why wouldn't they >>Exactly. >>And they're >>Gonna build it. They sort of hinted at it that when they were up on stage on AWS, right. That is just their first big step. I'm pretty sure over time they would be using other clouds. Think >>They already are on >>Prem. Yeah. On prem. Exactly. They're using VMware technology there. Right? I mean think about it, AWS. I don't know how many billions of dollars they're spending on AWS R and D Microsoft is doing the same thing. Google's doing the same thing we are doing. Not as much as them that you're doing oral chair. Yeah. If you are a CIO, you would be insane not to take advantage of all of this IP that's getting created and say, look, I'm just gonna bet on one. Doesn't make any sense. Right. So that's what you're seeing. And then >>I think >>The really smart companies, like you talked about would say, look, I will do something for my industry that uses these underlying clouds as the substrate, but encapsulates my IP and my operating model that I then offer to other >>Partners. Yeah. And their incentive for differentiation is scale. Yeah. And capability. And that's a super cloud. That's a, or would be say it environment. >>Yeah. But this is why this, >>It seems like the same >>Game, but >>This, I mean, I think it environment is different than >>Well, I mean it advantage to help the business, the old day service, you >>Said snowflake guys out the marketing guys. So you, >>You said snowflake data warehouse. See, I don't think it's in data warehouse. It's not, that's like saying, you >>Know, I, over >>VMware is a virtualization company or service now is a help desk tool. I, this is the change. Yes. That's occurring. Yes. And that you're enabling. So take the Goldman Sachs example. They're gonna run OnPrem. They're gonna use your infrastructure to do selfer. They're gonna build on AWS CapEx. They're gonna go across clouds and they're gonna need some multi-cloud services. And that's your opportunity. >>Exactly. That's that's really, when you, in the keynote, I talked about cloud universal. Right? So think of a future where we can go to a customer and say, Mr. Customer buy thousand scores, a hundred thousand cores, whatever capacity you can use it, any which way you want on any application platform. Right. And it could be OnPrem. It could be in the cloud, in the cloud of their choice in multiple clouds. And this thing can be fungible and they can tie it to the right services. If they like SageMaker they could tie it to Sage or Aurora. They could tie it to Aurora, cetera, et cetera. So I think that's really the foundation that we are setting. Well, I think, I >>Mean, you're building a cloud across clouds. I mean, that's the way I look at it. And, and that's why it's, to me, the, the DPU announcement, the project Monterey coming to fruition is so important. Yeah. Because if you don't have that, if you're not on that new Silicon curve yep. You're gonna be left behind. Oh, >>Absolutely. It allows us to build things that you would not otherwise be able to do, >>Not to pat ourselves on the back Ragu. But we, in what, 2013 day we said, feel >>Free. >>We, we said with Lou Tucker when OpenStack was crashing. Yeah. Yeah. And then Kubernetes was just a paper. We said, this could be the interoperability layer. Yeah. You got it. And you could have inter clouding cuz there was no clouding. I was gonna riff on inter networking. But if you remember inter networking during the OSI model, TCP and IP were hardened after the physical data link layer was taken care of. So that enabled an entire new industry that was open, open interconnect. Right. So we were saying inter clouding. So what you're kind of getting at with cross cloud is you're kind of creating this routing model if you will. Not necessarily routing, but like connection inter clouding, we called it. I think it's kinda a terrible name. >>What you said about Kubernetes is super critical. It is turning out to be the infrastructure API so long. It has been an infrastructure API for a certain cluster. Right. But if you think about what we said about VSE eight with VSE eight Kubernetes becomes the data center API. Now we sort of glossed over the point of the keynote, but you could do operations storage, anything that you can do on vSphere, you can do using a Kubernetes API. Yeah. And of course you can do all the containers in the Kubernetes clusters and et cetera, is what you could always do. Now you could do that on a VMware environment. OnPrem, you could do that on EKS. Now Kubernetes has become the standard programming model for infrastructure across. It >>Was the great equalizer. Yeah. You, we used to say Amazon turned the data center through an API. It turns, turns of like a lot of APIs and a lot of complexity. Right. And Kubernetes changed. >>Well, the role, the role of defacto standards played a lot into the T C P I P revolution before it became a standard standard. What the question Raghu, as you look at, we had submit on earlier, we had tutorial on as well. What's the disruptive enabler from a defacto. What in your mind, what should, because Kubernetes became kind of defacto, even though it was in the CNCF and in an open source open, it wasn't really standard standard. There's no like standards, body, but what de facto thing has to happen in your mind's eye around making inter clouding or connecting clouds in a, in a way that's gonna create extensibility and growth. What do you see as a de facto thing that the industry should rally around? Obviously Kubernetes is one, is there something else that you see that's important for in an open way that the industry can discuss and, and get behind? >>Yeah. I mean, there are things like identity, right? Which are pretty critical. There is connectivity and networking. So these are all things that the industry can rally around. Right. And that goes along with any modern application infrastructure. So I would say those are the building blocks that need to happen on the data side. Of course there are so many choices as well. So >>How about, you know, security? I think about, you know, when after stuck net, the, the whole industry said, Hey, we have to do a better job of collaborating. And then when you said identity, it just sort of struck me. But then a lot of people tried to sort of monetize private reporting and things like that. So you do you see a movement within the technology industry to do a better job of collaborating to, to solve the acute, you know, security problems? >>Yeah. I think the customer pressure and government pressure right. Causes that way. Yeah. Even now, even in our current universe, you see, there is a lot of behind the scenes collaboration amongst the security teams of all of the tech companies that is not widely seen or known. Right. For example, my CISO knows the AWS CSO or the Microsoft CSO and they all talk and they share the right information about vulnerability attacks and so on and so forth. So there's already a certain amount of collaboration that's happening and that'll only increase. Do, >>Do you, you know, I was somewhat surprised. I didn't hear more in your face about security would, is that just because you had such a strong multi-cloud message that you wanted to get, get across, cuz your security story is very strong and deep. When you get into the DPU side of things, the, you know, the separation of resources and the encryption and I'll end to end >>I'm well, we have a phenomenal security story. Yeah. Yeah. Tell security story and yes. I mean I'll need guilty to the fact that in the keynote you have yeah, yeah, sure time. But what we are doing with NSX and you will hear about some NSX projects as you, if you have time to go to some of the, the sessions. Yeah. There's one called project, not star. Another is called project Watchman or watch, I think it's called, we're all dealing with this. That is gonna strengthen the security story even more. Yeah. >>We think security and data is gonna be a big part of it. Right. As CEO, I have to ask you now that you're the CEO, first of all, I'd love to talk about product with you cuz you're yeah. Yeah. We just great conversation. We want to kind of read thet leaves and ask pointed questions cuz we're putting the puzzle together in real time here with the audience. But as CEO, now you have a lot of discussions around the business. You, the Broadcom thing happening, you got the rename here, you got multi-cloud all good stuff happening. Dave and I were chatting before we came on this morning around the marketplace, around financial valuations and EBIDA numbers. When you have so much strategic Goodwill and investment in the oven right now with the, with the investments in cloud native multi-year investments on a trajectory, you got economies of scale there. >>It's just now coming out to be harvest and more behind it. Yeah. As you come into the Broadcom and or the new world wave that's coming, how do you talk about that value? Cuz you can't really put a number on it yet because there's no customers on it. I mean some customers, but you can't probably some for form. It's not like sales numbers. Yeah. Yeah. How do you make the argument to the PE type folks out there? Like EBIDA and then all the strategic value. What's the, what's the conversation like if you can share any, I know it's obviously public company, all the things going down, but like how do you talk about strategic value to numbers folks? >>Yeah. I mean, we are not talking to PE guys at all. Right. I mean the only conversation we have is helping Broadcom with >>Yeah. But, but number people who are looking at the number, EBIDA kind of, >>Yeah. I mean, you'd be surprised if, for, for example, even with Broadcom, they look at the business holistically as what are the prospects of this business becoming a franchise that is durable and could drive a lot of value. Right. So that's how they look at it holistically. It's not a number driven. >>They do. They look at that. >>Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. So I think it's a misperception to say, Hey, it's a numbers driven conversation. It's a business driven conversation where, I mean, and Hawk's been public about it. He says, look, I look at businesses. Can they be leaders in their market? Yeah. Because leaders get, as we all know a disproportionate share of the economic value, is it a durable franchise that's gonna last 10 years or more, right. Obviously with technology changes in between, but 10 years or more >>Or 10, you got your internal, VMware talent customers and >>Partners. Yeah. Significant competitive advantage. So that's, that's really where the conversation starts and the numbers fall out of it. Got it. >>Okay. So I think >>There's a track record too. >>That culture >>That VMware has, you've always had an engineering culture. That's turned, you know, ideas and problems into products that, that have been very successful. >>Well, they had different engineering cultures. They're chips. You guys are software. Right. You guys know >>Software. Yeah. Mean they've been very successful with Broadcom, the standalone networking company since they took it over. Right. I mean, it's, there's a lot of amazing innovation going on there. >>Yeah. Not, not that I'm smiling. I want to kind of poke at this question question. I'll see if I get an answer out of you, when you talk to Hawk tan, does he feel like he bought a lot more than he thought or does he, did he, does he know it's all here? So >>The last two months, I mean, they've been going through a very deliberate process of digging into each business and certainly feels like he got a phenomenal asset base. Yeah. He said that to me even today after the keynote, right. Is the amazing amount of product capability that he's seeing in every one of our businesses. And that's been the constant frame. >>But congratulations on that. >>I've heard, I've heard Hawk talk about the shift to, to Mer merchant Silicon. Yeah. From custom Silicon. But I wanted to ask you when you look at things like AWS nitro yeah. And graviton and train and the advantage that AWS has with custom Silicon, you see Google and Microsoft sort of Alibaba following suit. Would it benefit you to have custom Silicon for, for DPU? I mean, I guess you, you know, to have a tighter integration or do you feel like with the relationships that you have that doesn't buy you anything? >>Yeah. I mean we have pretty strong relationships with in fact fantastic relationships with the Invidia and Intel and AMD >>Benon and AMD now. >>Yeah. Yeah. I mean, we've been working with the Pendo team in their previous incarnations for years. Right, right. When they were at Cisco and then same thing with the, we know the Melanox team as well as the invi original teams and Intel is the collaboration right. From the get go of the company. So we don't feel a need for any of that. We think, I mean, it's clear for those cloud folks, right. They're going towards a vertical integration model and select portions of their stack, like you talked about, but there is always a room for horizontal integration model. Right. And that's what we are a part of. Right. So there'll be a number of DPU pro vendors. There'll be a number of CPU vendors. There'll be a number of other storage, et cetera, et cetera. And we think that is goodness in an alternative model compared to a vertically integr >>And yeah. What this trade offs, right. It's not one or the other, I mean I used to tell, talk to Al Shugar about this all the time. Right. I mean, if vertically integrated, there may be some cost advantages, but then you've got flexibility advantages. If you're using, you know, what the industry is building. Right. And those are the tradeoffs, so yeah. Yeah. >>Greg, what are you excited about right now? You got a lot going on obviously great event. Branding's good. Love the graphics. I was kind of nervous about the name changed. I likem world, but you know, that's, I'm kind of like it >>Doesn't readily roll off your phone. Yeah. >>I know. We, I had everyone miscue this morning already and said VMware Explorer. So >>You pay Laura fine. Yeah. >>Now, I >>Mean a quarter >>Curse jar, whatever I did wrong. I don't believe it. Only small mistake that's because the thing wasn't on. Okay. Anyway, what's on your plate. What's your, what's some of the milestones. Do you share for your employees, your customers and your partners out there that are watching that might wanna know what's next in the whole Broadcom VMware situation. Is there a timeline? Can you talk publicly about what? To what people can expect? >>Yeah, no, we, we talk all the time in the company about that. Right? Because even if there is no news, you need to talk about what is where we are. Right. Because this is such a big transaction and employees need to know where we are at every minute of the day. Right? Yeah. So, so we definitely talk about that. We definitely talk about that with customers too. And where we are is that the, all the processes are on track, right? There is a regulatory track going on. And like I alluded to a few minutes ago, Broadcom is doing what they call the discovery phase of the integration planning, where they learn about the business. And then once that is done, they'll figure out what the operating model is. What Broadcom is said publicly is that the acquisition will close in their fiscal 23, which starts in November of this year, runs through October of next year. >>So >>Anywhere window, okay. As to where it is in that window. >>All right, Raghu, thank you so much for taking valuable time out of your conference time here for the queue. I really appreciate Dave and I both appreciate your friendship. Congratulations on the success as CEO, cuz we've been following your trials and tribulations and endeavors for many years and it's been great to chat with you. >>Yeah. Yeah. It's been great to chat with you, not just today, but yeah. Over a period of time and you guys do great work with this, so >>Yeah. And you guys making, making all the right calls at VMware. All right. More coverage. I'm shot. Dave ante cube coverage day one of three days of world war cup here in Moscone west, the cube coverage of VMware Explorer, 22 be right back.

>> Announcer: From theCUBE studios in Palo Alto, in Boston, connecting with thought leaders all around the world. This is a CUBE conversation. >> Hey, welcome back, you're ready. Jeff Frick here with theCUBE. We are still getting through the year of 2020. It's still the year of COVID and there's no end in sight I think until we get to a vaccine. That said, we're really excited to have one of our favorite guests. We haven't had him on for a while. I haven't talked to him for a long time. He used to I think have the record for the most CUBE appearances of probably any CUBE alumni. We're excited to have him joining us from his house in Palo Alto. Bill Schmarzo, you know him as the Dean of Big Data, he's got more titles. He's the chief innovation officer at Hitachi Vantara. He's also, we used to call him the Dean of Big Data, kind of for fun. Well, Bill goes out and writes a bunch of books. And now he teaches at the University of San Francisco, School of Management as an executive fellow. He's an honorary professor at NUI Galway. I think he's just, he likes to go that side of the pond and a many time author now, go check him out. His author profile on Amazon, the "Big Data MBA," "The Art of Thinking Like A Data Scientist" and another Big Data, kind of a workbook. Bill, great to see you. >> Thanks, Jeff, you know, I miss my time on theCUBE. These conversations have always been great. We've always kind of poked around the edges of things. A lot of our conversations have always been I thought, very leading edge and the title Dean of Big Data is courtesy of theCUBE. You guys were the first ones to give me that name out of one of the very first Strata Conferences where you dubbed me the Dean of Big Data, because I taught a class there called the Big Data MBA and look what's happened since then. >> I love it. >> It's all on you guys. >> I love it, and we've outlasted Strata, Strata doesn't exist as a conference anymore. So, you know, part of that I think is because Big Data is now everywhere, right? It's not the standalone thing. But there's a topic, and I'm holding in my hands a paper that you worked on with a colleague, Dr. Sidaoui, talking about what is the value of data? What is the economic value of data? And this is a topic that's been thrown around quite a bit. I think you list a total of 28 reference sources in this document. So it's a well researched piece of material, but it's a really challenging problem. So before we kind of get into the details, you know, from your position, having done this for a long time, and I don't know what you're doing today, you used to travel every single week to go out and visit customers and actually do implementations and really help people think these through. When you think about the value, the economic value, how did you start to kind of frame that to make sense and make it kind of a manageable problem to attack? >> So, Jeff, the research project was eyeopening for me. And one of the advantages of being a professor is, you have access to all these very smart, very motivated, very free research sources. And one of the problems that I've wrestled with as long as I've been in this industry is, how do you figure out what is data worth? And so what I did is I took these research students and I stick them on this problem. I said, "I want you to do some research. Let me understand what is the value of data?" I've seen all these different papers and analysts and consulting firms talk about it, but nobody's really got this thing clicked. And so we launched this research project at USF, professor Mouwafac Sidaoui and I together, and we were bumping along the same old path that everyone else got, which was inched on, how do we get data on our balance sheet? That was always the motivation, because as a company we're worth so much more because our data is so valuable, and how do I get it on the balance sheet? So we're headed down that path and trying to figure out how do you get it on the balance sheet? And then one of my research students, she comes up to me and she says, "Professor Schmarzo," she goes, "Data is kind of an unusual asset." I said, "Well, what do you mean?" She goes, "Well, you think about data as an asset. It never depletes, it never wears out. And the same dataset can be used across an unlimited number of use cases at a marginal cost equal to zero." And when she said that, it's like, "Holy crap." The light bulb went off. It's like, "Wait a second. I've been thinking about this entirely wrong for the last 30 some years of my life in this space. I've had the wrong frame. I keep thinking about this as an act, as an accounting conversation. An accounting determines valuation based on what somebody is willing to pay for." So if you go back to Adam Smith, 1776, "Wealth of Nations," he talks about valuation techniques. And one of the valuation techniques he talks about is valuation and exchange. That is the value of an asset is what someone's willing to pay you for it. So the value of this bottle of water is what someone's willing to pay you for it. So everybody fixates on this asset, valuation in exchange methodology. That's how you put it on balance sheet. That's how you run depreciation schedules, that dictates everything. But Adam Smith also talked about in that book, another valuation methodology, which is valuation in use, which is an economics conversation, not an accounting conversation. And when I realized that my frame was wrong, yeah, I had the right book. I had Adam Smith, I had "Wealth of Nations." I had all that good stuff, but I hadn't read the whole book. I had missed this whole concept about the economic value, where value is determined by not how much someone's willing to pay you for it, but the value you can drive by using it. So, Jeff, when that person made that comment, the entire research project, and I got to tell you, my entire life did a total 180, right? Just total of 180 degree change of how I was thinking about data as an asset. >> Right, well, Bill, it's funny though, that's kind of captured, I always think of kind of finance versus accounting, right? And then you're right on accounting. And we learn a lot of things in accounting. Basically we learn more that we don't know, but it's really hard to put it in an accounting framework, because as you said, it's not like a regular asset. You can use it a lot of times, you can use it across lots of use cases, it doesn't degradate over time. In fact, it used to be a liability. 'cause you had to buy all this hardware and software to maintain it. But if you look at the finance side, if you look at the pure play internet companies like Google, like Facebook, like Amazon, and you look at their valuation, right? We used to have this thing, we still have this thing called Goodwill, which was kind of this capture between what the market established the value of the company to be. But wasn't reflected when you summed up all the assets on the balance sheet and you had this leftover thing, you could just plug in goodwill. And I would hypothesize that for these big giant tech companies, the market has baked in the value of the data, has kind of put in that present value on that for a long period of time over multiple projects. And we see it captured probably in goodwill, versus being kind of called out as an individual balance sheet item. >> So I don't think it's, I don't know accounting. I'm not an accountant, thank God, right? And I know that goodwill is one of those things if I remember from my MBA program is something that when you buy a company and you look at the value you paid versus what it was worth, it stuck into this category called goodwill, because no one knew how to figure it out. So the company at book value was a billion dollars, but you paid five billion for it. Well, you're not an idiot, so that four billion extra you paid must be in goodwill and they'd stick it in goodwill. And I think there's actually a way that goodwill gets depreciated as well. So it could be that, but I'm totally away from the accounting framework. I think that's distracting, trying to work within the gap rules is more of an inhibitor. And we talk about the Googles of the world and the Facebooks of the world and the Netflix of the world and the Amazons and companies that are great at monetizing data. Well, they're great at monetizing it because they're not selling it, they're using it. Google is using their data to dominate search, right? Netflix is using it to be the leader in on-demand videos. And it's how they use all the data, how they use the insights about their customers, their products, and their operations to really drive new sources of value. So to me, it's this, when you start thinking about from an economics perspective, for example, why is the same car that I buy and an Uber driver buys, why is that car more valuable to an Uber driver than it is to me? Well, the bottom line is, Uber drivers are going to use that car to generate value, right? That $40,000, that car they bought is worth a lot more, because they're going to use that to generate value. For me it sits in the driveway and the birds poop on it. So, right, so it's this value in use concept. And when organizations can make that, by the way, most organizations really struggle with this. They struggle with this value in use concept. They want to, when you talk to them about data monetization and say, "Well, I'm thinking about the chief data officer, try not to trying to sell data, knocking on doors, shaking their tin cup, saying, 'Buy my data.'" No, no one wants your data. Your data is more valuable for how you use it to drive your operations then it's a sell to somebody else. >> Right, right. Well, on of the other things that's really important from an economics concept is scarcity, right? And a whole lot of economics is driven around scarcity. And how do you price for scarcity so that the market evens out and the price matches up to the supply? What's interesting about the data concept is, there is no scarcity anymore. And you know, you've outlined and everyone has giant numbers going up into the right, in terms of the quantity of the data and how much data there is and is going to be. But what you point out very eloquently in this paper is the scarcity is around the resources to actually do the work on the data to get the value out of the data. And I think there's just this interesting step function between just raw data, which has really no value in and of itself, right? Until you start to apply some concepts to it, you start to analyze it. And most importantly, that you have some context by which you're doing all this analysis to then drive that value. And I thought it was really an interesting part of this paper, which is get beyond the arguing that we're kind of discussing here and get into some specifics where you can measure value around a specific business objective. And not only that, but then now the investment of the resources on top of the data to be able to extract the value to then drive your business process for it. So it's a really different way to think about scarcity, not on the data per se, but on the ability to do something with it. >> You're spot on, Jeff, because organizations don't fail because of a lack of use cases. They fail because they have too many. So how do you prioritize? Now that scarcity is not an issue on the data side, but it is this issue on the people resources side, you don't have unlimited data scientists, right? So how do you prioritize and focus on those opportunities that are most important? I'll tell you, that's not a data science conversation, that's a business conversation, right? And figuring out how you align organizations to identify and focus on those use cases that are most important. Like in the paper we go through several different use cases using Chipotle as an example. The reason why I picked Chipotle is because, well, I like Chipotle. So I could go there and I could write it off as research. But there's a, think about the number of use cases where a company like Chipotle or any other company can leverage your data to drive their key business initiatives and their key operational use cases. It's almost unbounded, which by the way, is a huge challenge. In fact, I think part of the problem we see with a lot of organizations is because they do such a poor job of prioritizing and focusing, they try to solve the entire problem with one big fell swoop, right? It's slightly the old ERP big bang projects. Well, I'm just going to spend $20 million to buy this analytic capability from company X and I'm going to install it and then magic is going to happen. And then magic is going to happen, right? And then magic is going to happen, right? And magic never happens. We get crickets instead, because the biggest challenge isn't around how do I leverage the data, it's about where do I start? What problems do I go after? And how do I make sure the organization is bought in to basically use case by use case, build out your data and analytics architecture and capabilities. >> Yeah, and you start backwards from really specific business objectives in the use cases that you outline here, right? I want to increase my average ticket by X. I want to increase my frequency of visits by X. I want to increase the amount of items per order from X to 1.2 X, or 1.3 X. So from there you get a nice kind of big revenue hit that you can plan around and then work backwards into the amount of effort that it takes and then you can come up, "Is this a good investment or not?" So it's a really different way to get back to the value of the data. And more importantly, the analytics and the work to actually call out the information. >> The technologies, the data and analytic technologies available to us. The very composable nature of these allow us to take this use case by use case approach. I can build out my data lake one use case at a time. I don't need to stuff 25 data sources into my data lake and hope there's someone more valuable. I can use the first use case to say, "Oh, I need these three data sources to solve that use case. I'm going to put those three data sources in the data lake. I'm going to go through the entire curation process of making sure the data has been transformed and cleansed and aligned and enriched and met of, all the other governance, all that kind of stuff this goes on. But I'm going to do that use case by use case, 'cause a use case can tell me which data sources are most important for that given situation. And I can build up my data lake and I can build up my analytics then one use case at a time. And there is a huge impact then, huge impact when I build out use case by use case. That does not happen. Let me throw something that's not really covered in the paper, but it is very much covered in my new book that I'm working on, which is, in knowledge-based industries, the economies of learning are more powerful than the economies of scale. Now think about that for a second. >> Say that again, say that again. >> Yeah, the economies of learning are more powerful than the economies of scale. And what that means is what I learned on the first use case that I build out, I can apply that learning to the second use case, to the third use case, to the fourth use case. So when I put my data into my data lake for my first use case, and the paper covers this, well, once it's in my data lake, the cost of reusing that data in a second, third and fourth use cases is basically, you know marginal cost is zero. So I get this ability to learn about what data sets are most important and to reapply that across the organization. So this learning concept, I learn use case by use case, I don't have to do a big economies of scale approach and start with 25 datasets of which only three or four might be useful. But I'm incurring the overhead for all those other non-important data sets because I didn't take the time to go through and figure out what are my most important use cases and what data do I need to support those use cases. >> I mean, should people even think of the data per se or should they really readjust their thinking around the application of the data? Because the data in and of itself means nothing, right? 55, is that fast or slow? Is that old or young? Well, it depends on a whole lot of things. Am I walking or am I in a brand new Corvette? So it just, it's funny to me that the data in and of itself really doesn't have any value and doesn't really provide any direction into a decision or a higher order, predictive analytics until you start to manipulate the data. So is it even the wrong discussion? Is data the right discussion? Or should we really be talking about the capabilities to do stuff within and really get people focused on that? >> So Jeff, there's so many points to hit on there. So the application of data is what's the value, and the queue of you guys used to be famous for saying, "Separating noise from the signal." >> Signal from the noise. Signal from a noise, right. Well, how do you know in your dataset what's signal and what's noise? Well, the use case will tell you. If you don't know the use case and you have no way of figuring out what's important. One of the things I use, I still rail against, and it happens still. Somebody will walk up my data science team and say, "Here's some data, tell me what's interesting in it." Well, how do you separate signal from noise if I don't know the use case? So I think you're spot on, Jeff. The way to think about this is, don't become data-driven, become value-driven and value is driven from the use case or the application or the use of the data to solve that particular use case. So organizations that get fixated on being data-driven, I hate the term data-driven. It's like as if there's some sort of frigging magic from having data. No, data has no value. It's how you use it to derive customer product and operational insights that drive value,. >> Right, so there's an interesting step function, and we talk about it all the time. You're out in the weeds, working with Chipotle lately, and increase their average ticket by 1.2 X. We talk more here, kind of conceptually. And one of the great kind of conceptual holy grails within a data-driven economy is kind of working up this step function. And you've talked about it here. It's from descriptive, to diagnostic, to predictive. And then the Holy grail prescriptive, we're way ahead of the curve. This comes into tons of stuff around unscheduled maintenance. And you know, there's a lot of specific applications, but do you think we spend too much time kind of shooting for the fourth order of greatness impact, instead of kind of focusing on the small wins? >> Well, you certainly have to build your way there. I don't think you can get to prescriptive without doing predictive, and you can't do predictive without doing descriptive and such. But let me throw a really one at you, Jeff, I think there's even one beyond prescriptive. One we're talking more and more about, autonomous, a ton of analytics, right? And one of the things that paper talked about that didn't click with me at the time was this idea of orphaned analytics. You and I kind of talked about this before the call here. And one thing we noticed in the research was that a lot of these very mature organizations who had advanced from the retrospective analytics of BI to the descriptive, to the predicted, to the prescriptive, they were building one off analytics to solve a problem and getting value from it, but never reusing this analytics over and over again. They were done one off and then they were thrown away and these organizations were so good at data science and analytics, that it was easier for them to just build from scratch than to try to dig around and try to find something that was never actually ever built to be reused. And so I have this whole idea of orphaned analytics, right? It didn't really occur to me. It didn't make any sense into me until I read this quote from Elon Musk, and Elon Musk made this statement. He says, " I believe that when you buy a Tesla, you're buying an asset that appreciates in value, not depreciates through usage." I was thinking, "Wait a second, what does that mean?" He didn't actually say it, "Through usage." He said, "He believes you're buying an asset that appreciates not depreciates in value." And of course the first response I had was, "Oh, it's like a 1964 and a half Mustang. It's rare, so everybody is going to want these things. So buy one, stick it in your garage. And 20 years later, you're bringing it out and it's worth more money." No, no, there's 600,000 of these things roaming around the streets, they're not rare. What he meant is that he is building an autonomous asset. That the more that it's used, the more valuable it's getting, the more reliable, the more efficient, the more predictive, the more safe this asset's getting. So there is this level beyond prescriptive where we can think about, "How do we leverage artificial intelligence, reinforcement, learning, deep learning, to build these assets that the more that they are used, the smarter they get." That's beyond prescriptive. That's an environment where these things are learning. In many cases, they're learning with minimal or no human intervention. That's the real aha moment. That's what I miss with orphaned analytics and why it's important to build analytics that can be reused over and over again. Because every time you use these analytics in a different use case, they get smarter, they get more valuable, they get more predictive. To me that's the aha moment that blew my mind. I realized I had missed that in the paper entirely. And it took me basically two years later to realize, dough, I missed the most important part of the paper. >> Right, well, it's an interesting take really on why the valuation I would argue is reflected in Tesla, which is a function of the data. And there's a phenomenal video if you've never seen it, where they have autonomous vehicle day, it might be a year or so old. And he's got his number one engineer from, I think the Microprocessor Group, The Computer Vision Group, as well as the autonomous driving group. And there's a couple of really great concepts I want to follow up on what you said. One is that they have this thing called The Fleet. To your point, there's hundreds of thousands of these things, if they haven't hit a million, that are calling home reporting home every day as to exactly how everyone took the Northbound 101 on-ramp off of University Avenue. How fast did they go? What line did they take? What G-forces did they take? And every one of those cars feeds into the system, so that when they do the autonomous update, not only are they using all their regular things that they would use to map out that 101 Northbound entry, but they've got all the data from all the cars that have been doing it. And you know, when that other car, the autonomous car couple years ago hit the pedestrian, I think in Phoenix, which is not good, sad, killed a person, dark tough situation. But you know, we are doing an autonomous vehicle show and the guy who made a really interesting point, right? That when something like that happens, typically if I was in a car wreck or you're in a car wreck, hopefully not, I learned the person that we hit learns and maybe a couple of witnesses learn, maybe the inspector. >> But nobody else learns. >> But nobody else learns. But now with the autonomy, every single person can learn from every single experience with every vehicle contributing data within that fleet. To your point, it's just an order of magnitude, different way to think about things. >> Think about a 1% improvement compounded 365 times, equals I think 38 X improvement. The power of 1% improvements over these 600,000 plus cars that are learning. By the way, even when the autonomous FSD, the full self-driving mode module isn't turned on, even when it's not turned on, it runs in shadow mode. So it's learning from the human drivers, the human overlords, it's constantly learning. And by the way, not only they're collecting all this data, I did a little research, I pulled out some of their job search ads and they've built a giant simulator, right? And they're there basically every night, simulating billions and billions of more driven miles because of the simulator. They are building, he's going to have a simulator, not only for driving, but think about all the data he's capturing as these cars are riding down the road. By the way, they don't use Lidar, they use video, right? So he's driving by malls. He knows how many cars are in the mall. He's driving down roads, he knows how old the cars are and which ones should be replaced. I mean, he has this, he's sitting on this incredible wealth of data. If anybody could simulate what's going on in the world and figure out how to get out of this COVID problem, it's probably Elon Musk and the data he's captured, be courtesy of all those cars. >> Yeah, yeah, it's really interesting, and we're seeing it now. There's a new autonomous drone out, the Skydio, and they just announced their commercial product. And again, it completely changes the way you think about how you use that tool, because you've just eliminated the complexity of driving. I don't want to drive that, I want to tell it what to do. And so you're saying, this whole application of air force and companies around things like measuring piles of coal and measuring these huge assets that are volume metric measured, that these things can go and map out and farming, et cetera, et cetera. So the autonomy piece, that's really insightful. I want to shift gears a little bit, Bill, and talk about, you had some theories in here about thinking of data as an asset, data as a currency, data as monetization. I mean, how should people think of it? 'Cause I don't think currency is very good. It's really not kind of an exchange of value that we're doing this kind of classic asset. I think the data as oil is horrible, right? To your point, it doesn't get burned up once and can't be used again. It can be used over and over and over. It's basically like feedstock for all kinds of stuff, but the feedstock never goes away. So again, or is it that even the right way to think about, do we really need to shift our conversation and get past the idea of data and get much more into the idea of information and actionable information and useful information that, oh, by the way, happens to be powered by data under the covers? >> Yeah, good question, Jeff. Data is an asset in the same way that a human is an asset. But just having humans in your company doesn't drive value, it's how you use those humans. And so it's really again the application of the data around the use cases. So I still think data is an asset, but I don't want to, I'm not fixated on, put it on my balance sheet. That nice talk about put it on a balance sheet, I immediately put the blinders on. It inhibits what I can do. I want to think about this as an asset that I can use to drive value, value to my customers. So I'm trying to learn more about my customer's tendencies and propensities and interests and passions, and try to learn the same thing about my car's behaviors and tendencies and my operations have tendencies. And so I do think data is an asset, but it's a latent asset in the sense that it has potential value, but it actually has no value per se, inputting it into a balance sheet. So I think it's an asset. I worry about the accounting concept medially hijacking what we can do with it. To me the value of data becomes and how it interacts with, maybe with other assets. So maybe data itself is not so much an asset as it's fuel for driving the value of assets. So, you know, it fuels my use cases. It fuels my ability to retain and get more out of my customers. It fuels ability to predict what my products are going to break down and even have products who self-monitor, self-diagnosis and self-heal. So, data is an asset, but it's only a latent asset in the sense that it sits there and it doesn't have any value until you actually put something to it and shock it into action. >> So let's shift gears a little bit and start talking about the data and talk about the human factors. 'Cause you said, one of the challenges is people trying to bite off more than they can chew. And we have the role of chief data officer now. And to your point, maybe that mucks things up more than it helps. But in all the customer cases that you've worked on, is there a consistent kind of pattern of behavior, personality, types of projects that enables some people to grab those resources to apply to their data to have successful projects, because to your point there's too much data and there's too many projects and you talk a lot about prioritization. But there's a lot of assumptions in the prioritization model that you can, that you know a whole lot of things, especially if you're comparing project A over in group A with project B, with group B and the two may not really know the economics across that. But from an individual person who sees the potential, what advice do you give them? What kind of characteristics do you see, either in the type of the project, the type of the boss, the type of the individual that really lends itself to a higher probability of a successful outcome? >> So first off you need to find somebody who has a vision for how they want to use the data, and not just collect it. But how they're going to try to change the fortunes of the organization. So it always takes a visionary, may not be the CEO, might be somebody who's a head of marketing or the head of logistics, or it could be a CIO, it could be a chief data officer as well. But you've got to find somebody who says, "We have this latent asset we could be doing more with, and we have a series of organizational problem challenges against which I could apply this asset. And I need to be the matchmaker that brings these together." Now the tool that I think is the most powerful tool in marrying the latent capabilities of data with all the revenue generating opportunities in the application side, because there's a countless number, the most important tool that I found doing that is design thinking. Now, the reason why I think design thinking is so important, because one of the things that design thinking does a great job is it gives everybody a voice in the process of identifying, validating, valuing, and prioritizing use cases you're going to go after. Let me say that again. The challenge organizations have is identifying, validating, valuing, and prioritizing the use cases they want to go after. Design thinking is a marvelous tool for driving organizational alignment around where we're going to start and what's going to be next and why we're going to start there and how we're going to bring everybody together. Big data and data science projects don't die because of technology failure. Most of them die because of passive aggressive behaviors in the organization that you didn't bring everybody into the process. Everybody's voice didn't get a chance to be heard. And that one person who's voice didn't get a chance to get heard, they're going to get you. They may own a certain piece of data. They may own something, but they're just waiting and lay, they're just laying there waiting for their chance to come up and snag it. So what you got to do is you got to proactively bring these people together. We call this, this is part of our value engineering process. We have a value engineering process around envisioning where we bring all these people together. We help them to understand how data in itself is a latent asset, but how it can be used from an economics perspective, drive all those value. We get them all fired up on how these can solve any one of these use cases. But you got to start with one, and you've got to embrace this idea that I can build out my data and analytic capabilities, one use case at a time. And the first use case I go after and solve, makes my second one easier, makes my third one easier, right? It has this ability that when you start going use case by use case two really magical things happen. Number one, your marginal cost flatten. That is because you're building out your data lake one use case at a time, and you're bringing all the important data lake, that data lake one use case at a time. At some point in time, you've got most of the important data you need, and the ability that you don't need to add another data source. You got what you need, so your marginal costs start to flatten. And by the way, if you build your analytics as composable, reusable, continuous learning analytic assets, not as orphaned analytics, pretty soon you have all the analytics you need as well. So your marginal cost flatten, but effect number two is that you've, because you've have the data and the analytics, I can accelerate time to value, and I can de-risked projects as I go use case by use case. And so then the biggest challenge becomes not in the data and the analytics, it's getting the all the business stakeholders to agree on, here's a roadmap we're going to go after. This one's first, and this one is going first because it helps to drive the value of the second and third one. And then this one drives this, and you create a whole roadmap of rippling through of how the data and analytics are driving this value to across all these use cases at a marginal cost approaching zero. >> So should we have chief design thinking officers instead of chief data officers that really actually move the data process along? I mean, I first heard about design thinking years ago, actually interviewing Dan Gordon from Gordon Biersch, and they were, he had just hired a couple of Stanford grads, I think is where they pioneered it, and they were doing some work about introducing, I think it was a a new apple-based alcoholic beverage, apple cider, and they talked a lot about it. And it's pretty interesting, but I mean, are you seeing design thinking proliferate into the organizations that you work with? Either formally as design thinking or as some derivation of it that pulls some of those attributes that you highlighted that are so key to success? >> So I think we're seeing the birth of this new role that's marrying capabilities of design thinking with the capabilities of data and analytics. And they're calling this dude or dudette the chief innovation officer. Surprise. >> Title for someone we know. >> And I got to tell a little story. So I have a very experienced design thinker on my team. All of our data science projects have a design thinker on them. Every one of our data science projects has a design thinker, because the nature of how you build and successfully execute a data science project, models almost exactly how design thinking works. I've written several papers on it, and it's a marvelous way. Design thinking and data science are different sides of the same coin. But my respect for data science or for design thinking took a major shot in the arm, major boost when my design thinking person on my team, whose name is John Morley introduced me to a senior data scientist at Google. And I was bottom coffee. I said, "No," this is back in, before I even joined Hitachi Vantara, and I said, "So tell me the secret to Google's data science success? You guys are marvelous, you're doing things that no one else was even contemplating, and what's your key to success?" And he giggles and laughs and he goes, "Design thinking." I go, "What the hell is that? Design thinking, I've never even heard of the stupid thing before." He goes, "I'd make a deal with you, Friday afternoon let's pop over to Stanford's B school and I'll teach you about design thinking." So I went with him on a Friday to the d.school, Design School over at Stanford and I was blown away, not just in how design thinking was used to ideate and bring and to explore. But I was blown away about how powerful that concept is when you marry it with data science. What is data science in its simplest sense? Data science is about identifying the variables and metrics that might be better predictors of performance. It's that might phrase that's the real key. And who are the people who have the best insights into what values or metrics or KPIs you might want to test? It ain't the data scientists, it's the subject matter experts on the business side. And when you use design thinking to bring this subject matter experts with the data scientists together, all kinds of magic stuff happens. It's unbelievable how well it works. And all of our projects leverage design thinking. Our whole value engineering process is built around marrying design thinking with data science, around this prioritization, around these concepts of, all ideas are worthy of consideration and all voices need to be heard. And the idea how you embrace ambiguity and diversity of perspectives to drive innovation, it's marvelous. But I feel like I'm a lone voice out in the wilderness, crying out, "Yeah, Tesla gets it, Google gets it, Apple gets it, Facebook gets it." But you know, most other organizations in the world, they don't think like that. They think design thinking is this Wufoo thing. Oh yeah, you're going to bring people together and sing Kumbaya. It's like, "No, I'm not singing Kumbaya. I'm picking their brains because they're going to help make their data science team much more effective and knowing what problems we're going to go after and how I'm going to measure success and progress. >> Maybe that's the next Dean for the next 10 years, the Dean of design thinking instead of data science, and who knew they're one and the same? Well, Bill, that's a super insightful, I mean, it's so, is validated and supported by the trends that we see all over the place, just in terms of democratization, right? Democratization of the tools, more people having access to data, more opinions, more perspective, more people that have the ability to manipulate the data and basically experiment, does drive better business outcomes. And it's so consistent. >> If I could add one thing, Jeff, I think that what's really powerful about design thinking is when I think about what's happening with artificial intelligence or AI, there's all these conversations about, "Oh, AI is going to wipe out all these jobs. Is going to take all these jobs away." And what we're actually finding is that if we think about machine learning, driven by AI and human empowerment, driven by design thinking, we're seeing the opportunity to exploit these economies of learning at the front lines where every customer engagement, every operational execution is an opportunity to gather not only more data, but to gather more learnings, to empower the humans at the front lines of the organization to constantly be seeking, to try different things, to explore and to learn from each of these engagements. I think it's, AI to me is incredibly powerful. And I think about it as a source of driving more learning, a continuous learning and continuously adapting an organization where it's not just the machines that are doing this, but it's the humans who've been empowered to do that. And my chapter nine in my new book, Jeff, is all about team empowerment, because nothing you do with AI is going to matter of squat if you don't have empowered teams who know how to take and leverage that continuous learning opportunity at the front lines of customer and operational engagement. >> Bill, I couldn't set a better, I think we'll leave it there. That's a great close, when is the next book coming out? >> So today I do my second to last final review. Then it goes back to the editor and he does a review and we start looking at formatting. So I think we're probably four to six weeks out. >> Okay, well, thank you so much, congratulations on all the success. I just love how the Dean is really the Dean now, teaching all over the world, sharing the knowledge and attacking some of these big problems. And like all great economics problems, often the answer is not economics at all. It's completely really twist the lens and don't think of it in that, all that construct. >> Exactly. >> All right, Bill. Thanks again and have a great week. >> Thanks, Jeff. >> All right. He's Bill Schmarzo, I'm Jeff Frick. You're watching theCUBE. Thanks for watching, we'll see you next time. (gentle music)

>>From the cube studios in Palo Alto in Boston. It's the cube covering IBM thing brought to you by IBM. >>All right, ready? We're back. This is the cubes continuous coverage of IBM 2020 the digital event experience. My name is Dave Volante. Dasgupta is here. She's the vice president of marketing at IBM. She's also the COO of the global business services. good to see you. Thanks for coming back in the cube. Oh, I'm so happy to be here. Deva fantastic to be here. Do you have a lot of experience with brands? IBM itself, you know, amazing well known, a leading brand well, I'm wondering if you have any thoughts on what you're seeing in terms of how brands are responding to the 19 crisis. There are things out there that you're seeing that are inspiring you and yeah. What should we be looking for? Oh my gosh. I mean all around the last two, two months we have been living now in a, in an, in a new reality and this is not going to go back, do what we knew was normal. >>Right. This is going to be the new normal and how brands react to it sets us up for future growth and future success. You know, as a in the global business services steam as a CMO there I meet a lot of every single day and they are coming to us with business challenges. What makes the big difference right now? I think in terms of of being a successful brand is the resilience and the adaptive. If you see a company like IBM and you've talked a little bit about how iconic this brand is, it's been there for about 108 hundred and nine years now and it is being able to successfully reinvent itself every turn of the century and every turn of what's happening around us. Uh, it being able to I think it's extremely important. What also is important as a brand is the emphasis that you can feel towards the growth and success of your client's business. I think sets, um, any, any brand apart from growth. So adaptability and empathy. Those would be my two big thanks. We talked to a number of CIO is IBM came out as one of the companies really helping. It wasn't just IBM, there were many, many large organizations, small organizations that really had this empathic, we're in this together. >>That's exactly right. If you look at it, it's, it's both of what we do for our clients but also what we do for our own employees. Um, 95% of our work IBM is not working from home in a safe and secure environment. We've been able to work with our clients and move those teams that work with our clients also in a more safe and safe your environment. For example, something like our cocreation workshop, the IBM garage would think that for cocreation innovation, you all need to be together in a room and put up sticky notes on the board behind you. Okay. Yeah. We have moved into to be a virtual experience and we are now offering free trials of a lot of our products and solutions to our clients for the next 90 days where they can get their most resting business. Yes. Problem solved. You know, we just want to make sure we get that together and get the economy back on track. Get the companies back on the track of. >>Now, one of the other passions of yours I know is this notion of of the cognitive business, a smarter business. And, and I want to ask you, help us understand what that is. You know, beyond the sort of marketing taglines, what is a smarter business? >>Yes, a smarter business is adaptive and resilient. that would be the biggest things, um, that I would highlight. Now, how do they do that? They do that because they are able to have business arms. They use the data that they have at their disposal. Then mind you, this is not the, um, data that is searchable online. 80% of or customer data is with. The organizations themselves. Now, how do they use that data to create business plans, forms that give them competitive advantage is one of the core tenets of what makes a smarter business. The second piece is around workflows that are more intelligent. Now, what makes these work, those more intelligent, what are these words? Those, these are end to end processes. So think of supply chain. How do you make your supply chain more resilient in the covert crisis right now that many, um, many companies are grappling with. >>How do you strengthen your direct to consumer routes? Many companies that used to deliver to stores now are figuring out how to get direct to consumers. So yeah, making these work close more intelligent, more resilient. How do you manage your work of course, right? Um, how do you make sure that the customer data that many employee's work is safe and secure? Sure. So second is the intelligence. Yes. And the third thing is all about the expedience and being able to engage with your customers in you are ways, if you think of some specific industries that are dealing with customer claims, you know, you look at the health, yeah. Provider industry, you're looking at insurance claims and and things like that. They are grappling with this new reality and being to then connect with your customers in new and engaging ways. I think is of utmost importance. So the three things, platforms, most expedience is what makes us smarter business possible. And that business is adaptive and resilient. >>Uh, the way in which brands are engaging dramatically different then it was just a few months ago. And our thinking is there's going to be some permanent changes here. What, what are your thoughts in that regard? >>Absolutely. 100% agree. Um, when we go back work, when we all get out of our home offices, um, it's going to be an a new way of. Right. Okay. And we're already seeing, uh, the engagement within our own work. Forced rising. Yeah. For example, I just came off of a, one of our all hands calls and we create these new videos on how we have new coworkers. We have, you know, pets and kids and parents cared for at home. Yeah. Mmm. all of this though, there is a greater sense of togetherness. There is a greater sense of solidarity. And what inspires me the most is when I look at the people around us in the delivery, uh, deems, you know, across the world. If you look at India, if you look at Philippines in our big teams that are delivering for clients every single day, the resiliency that they have shown in being able to overcome these, these hurdles are giving us ideas that this is not a one and done. >>This could actually be the new normal going beyond it. The automation that we have been able to apply. Um, uh, when you have like AI, how do you processes different if things are more efficient, wouldn't it be a better idea? Just have that go throughout to the rest of, you know, um, what's the new normal around us? So this is absolutely gonna change the way we work, the way we engage with our clients and the kind of, um, new ways of a new routes to market. I think that is the most exciting to me. How can we, how can we feel T and find out new routes to market new customers and be able to provide them value. The Watson Watson digital assistant is, is interesting to me because it allows us as one example of a hospital to be able to put out information that's accurate and timely. >>These things have to be done in near real time. As we know, the Covance situation, it changes daily. You know, maybe the change is, is decelerating a little bit, but it's still several times a week. there was a period of time where it was changing multiple times for days. Yes. So for instance, do I wear a mask? Do I not wear a mask? How far do I have to stand away? Can I can I actually get this by walking behind somebody, et cetera, et cetera. So much information that changed so quickly is the medical community got that. So you have to be able to access that data and you know, to your point about that, yeah, intelligent workflow, be able to do that in near real time. And that's what to me anyway, it's about operationalizing that data, you know, AI capability across the organization. >>Not just in some stovepipe where I have to ask somebody to some analysis for me that that is a huge change in the way in which businesses operate, isn't it? It is a huge change. And I think it's also about visibility, um, that the common man is right now the citizens that the people who are, who are, um, trying to access these technology. Yes. I think it gives them a renewed hope, um, in what technology could really provide. How are we are still being able to work while we are stuck in our homes, how we are still able to buy things online and the not jeopardize the safety of our loved ones who, you know, I'm the who maybe immunocompromised. You cannot go out and shop how we are able to still do the delivery. And, and the beauty of this is we in the technology industry we knew this, so >>go back one year we were working with. Um, no a company that supplies life saving medicines to many parts of Africa, the supply chain there and the technology and the intelligence that we had embedded in that hello made it possible for this human and tech interaction. And I think that is what the beauty of this is the renewed understanding of what technology can do for you. Yeah. And the ability to interact with the technology to make that happen. For example, in Africa, you have to sometimes rely on the Goodwill of the local villagers when there are floods and the pats are run over with water. You have to trigger, um, uh, an email or you know, you have to go to your cell phone so that the locals can then the medicine's over. Yeah. Uh, over the flooded planes to the hospitals. The interaction of the human with the technology that is there to help you and make your lives easier. I think right now there's renewed understanding and acceptance of that and I think it's a, it's a good thing. It's a good thing for all of us. >>I mean, it really is the, the uniqueness of IBM, deep industry expertise, knowledge, and yet know tons of R and D and technology. Oh, galore. Manny, thanks so much for coming back on the cubes. Great to see you. Hopefully next time it'll be face to face, but I really appreciate your time. >>Oh, I, I so wished for that I, so I, I do miss the the live connections, but you know, technology will take us forward till then and, uh, fantastic to be here. I loved it. Toxin. >>Great. And thank you for watching everybody. This is Dave Volante, but the cube for the IBM digital event experience, you 2020. We'll be right back right after this short break.

>> Live, from Las Vegas. It's theCUBE. Covering the AWS Accenture Executive Summit brought to you by Accenture. >> Welcome back everyone to theCUBE's live coverage of the AWS Executive Summit. I'm your host, Rebecca Knight. We're joined by Annette Rippert. She is the Senior Managing Director Accenture Technology, North America. Thanks so much for coming on theCUBE. >> Well, I'm happy to be here today. >> So, let's talk a little bit about Accenture's innovation for society initiative. Give our viewers a little background on it. >> Sure. Well, you know, for quite a while we've been known as a company around innovation. But I think one thing that doesn't always come forward is the fact that you know, since our very early days we've had this very tight coupling with corporate citizenship, with philanthropy. In fact we invest 1% of our pre-taxed dollars in philanthropic related initiatives. And you know, for a number of years we've had initiatives like Tech4Good that are part of the DNA of our organization. So, when you think about the innovation side of the organization, and then you think about our philanthropic desires and couple that now with all of the digital technologies, really the possibilities are almost endless when you think about ways that, really, we strive to be able to conquer, not only business problems but societal problems with technology. >> So how do you decide where you're going to focus your energy, your time, your resources. How do you choose the biggest most pressing problems? >> Yes. Well I think one of the things that's really important is we always start with the business process or the societal issue itself as opposed to thinking about how can we use a particular technology to instantiate something we start with really, what's the social problem. And one of the ways that we do this, we have a global innovation contest. Our people get so excited to be apart of this as you could imagine. And one of the tracks is really around Tech4Good and so, teams from around the world think of ways that they can use technology to solve a particular societal issue. And it's really exciting to see the kind of innovations that come out of that. In the end the winners globally are funded to be able to take that idea and actually develop it and put it out in to use. >> So talk about some of the winners and the most exciting entrants from your perspective. >> Well, there's one that I think is maybe a good place to start and that's really around the area of home care, elder care, you know striving to keep a connection together with somebody who's in that circumstance. And being able to provide sort of a real world interaction. So, one of the teams took, with that in mind, concepts around natural language processing, around AI, and really IoT as well. Connecting in sensors in the home, whether that be to doors or to beds or to stoves which can represent safety concerns. And this innovation was built around an Amazon Echo show and around the Amazon platform. And really enables a lot of freedom and a opportunity for the person who's home bound like that to be able to interface with family, with caregivers and really better enable an independent living situation that extends that home care environment. >> So particularly, as the world's population is aging, that's something that we're experiencing here in the US, you can see how that really would help to solve a social challenge. >> Yes, pretty exciting. >> Yeah, so. Talk to me a little bit more about how this contest works in terms of teams within Accenture working together, collaborating and do the self-form the teams? Does Accenture tell them how to ... >> We announce the competition and people self-form it can be an individual, it can be a team. They do this on their own time. They spend time really thinking about how they can apply new concepts. So for us, it's a opportunity for people to learn but then they also think about wanting to address something that's another part of them, you know doing social good. So, it's also an opportunity to contribute and give back through the process of this competition. >> I know that one of the parts of the innovation for social good is the skills to succeed initiative. Can you tell our viewers a little bit more about that? >> Sure, well this is a program really that has taken off like wildfire and we've been doing it for many, many years and it's targeted with extending technology skills to individuals who come from lesser than means. It's a way of extending skills and capability and coaching to provide them the ability to really re-enter the work force. Re-enter the work force with skills and get on their feet. It's been something, it is pervasive across our business. Most of our people have participated in some way whether through coaching or other initiatives and it's been very successful. >> So you go in to these communities and coach marginalized communities? >> Yes, and then it provides an opportunity for them to be able to re-enter, whether re-enter the work force whether with us or any other organization. We look most to provide them with skills. We also provide them with other things that you don't think about when somebody is trying to re-enter the work force, whether that happens to be clothing or other capability to be able to get back on your feet. >> So let's talk about this moment in time in the technology industry. So we have this explosion of digital technologies, as you were saying, AI and machine learning and big data, data analytics and we have companies sort of coming together saying hey, there are a lot of pressing global challenge, societal challenges. We need to harness these technologies to solve them. I mean, do you think that, can you describe, since you are really on the ground, your boots on the ground in the middle of this, what it's like to be in this environment. Do you think that other companies are sort of following Accenture's lead? How would you describe what's going on? >> Well, I think that for a very long time, as I was mentioning, part of our mission statement as a company is to help the way the world works and lives. And so it's been kind of core to the way that we operate the business in our core values. But I think what's happening now is there's a lot more awareness of social good. And instead of supporting a charity or being a partner together with a charity, now we find ways we can really amplify our ability to make a difference. And that is by leveraging our capability around technology to help take that devotion of time, that interest, and really step it up in a pretty significant way. To bring that technology in a way that really's disruptive to changing the societal issue. >> But at the same time you don't want to necessarily start with the technology itself. You want to make sure you're starting with the problem. >> Well that really comes back to the way that we address business problems and the way we address the societal problems, is all of our people are taught concepts around designed thinking. Around human centered design. And so that concept of starting with what is the human problem, is a very natural course because that's the way that we solve all of our business problems. And so, I think that that's a, in thinking about how we solve those issues or collaborate in order to do that I think really drives a lot more complete answers in fact, to the kind of problems that we look to solve. And that's why starting with the societal issue and really what's at risk. What are we trying to address? And then thinking of creative ways to be disruptive around that. Some cases it's not even around the technology. It's about, you know, thinking in a new way about how to address those issues. >> And a cultural shift and getting people to, yeah exactly, collaborate differently. So I know you've just came from a hackathon and you were helping charities think different, think about a problem they wanted to solve and then think about how we could use technology to solve it. Tell our viewers a little bit more about the hackathon here. >> Sure, well you know, our interest in this area is, you can tell I'm very passionate about it. We invest a lot of time from a corporate standpoint and we're helping to sponsor this hackathon here at AWS re:Invent and we're doing that together with several organizations. For example, Girls Who Code, let me see, GameChanger, Compassion, and Goodwill are all other organizations that are participating in the hackathon. And had really interesting problems that they brought to the table. In fact, one of the problems that we talked about today, that the teams are over hacking away thinking about, is there are many organizations that sponsor very under privileged children and create, in this organization situation, they create a one to one relationship between a sponsor and a child and they were looking for ways to be able to connect those two parties by using natural language processing, they wanted to facilitate a near real time kind of dialogue across the boundaries of language in a way that ensures protection of the child and that there's nothing malicious that could happen through that direct connection. Of course we expect everyone to be well-meaning in that but part of the innovation is also protecting the children too. So the teams are over hacking away looking at this and several other kind of problems, social problems, Tech4Good type of initiatives throughout the day today. >> So at next year's, let's look in to our crystal balls here and think about what we're going to be talking about at next year's AWS Executive Summit. What is on the table for this year and what kinds of things are most exciting you that you're ... >> Well I think all the innovation, just further enables it, the way that we think about how we're using today, artificial intelligence, and you couple that together with so many other things around, whether, the example I just gave, around natural language processing and you couple that together with the societal and business problems that are here. I mean, it's really quite explosive. So you think about all of the new innovation that's being announced this week. I think the opportunity to be able to drive that even deeper into, whether it happens to business or societal problem, will be even more interesting next year. >> We'll end that, thank you so much for coming on theCUBE. It was great talking to you. >> Thank you. >> A really fun conversation. >> Enjoyed it. >> I'm Rebecca Knight. We will have more from the AWS Executive Summit coming up in just a little bit. (electronic music)

>> Live from Washington D.C. It's theCUBE covering AWS Public Sector Summit 2018 brought to you by Amazon web services and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back to Washington D.C. everybody you're watching theCUBE, the leader in live tech coverage I'm Dave Vellante, with John Furrier, we're covering the AWS public sector summit Barry Russell is here, the General Manager of Worldwide Business Development and Operations for the AWS marketplace and service catalog and he's joined by Dmitri Alperovitch who is the co-founder and CTO of CrowdStrike a hot new company, just raised a boatload of dough we're going to talk about that, but welcome gentleman, thanks for coming on theCUBE. Barry, let's start with you. So we saw Teresa put up a slide, I tried to count and it was over two hundred ISVs and SAS providers for GovCloud, the marketplace is booming. What's going on from your perspective? >> So we launched marketplace in the GovCloud at New York summit last year, back in 2017 and we launched it in a little over four hundred products that were available. The team is more than double that now, there's nine hundred and fifty or more products available. But the exciting thing for us is that today we're able to make SAS; SAS inscription, SAS contracts available from partners such as CrowdStrike. It just gives customers more flexibility and choice in how they deploy software into a region like GovCloud. >> So Dmitri, we're going to get into the funding and the news in a second. But from your standpoint, marketplace, why the attractiveness, no concerns, it's all systems go, go hard in. What's your perspective? >> Absolutely. AWS has been a huge partner for us since really the beginning of the company. We've built our entire business on AWS, we're cloud end point security vendors so we have a little agent that lives on every server, desktop, laptop, both on premise and cloud environments. But the back-end is all on AWS where we process mass amounts of data and the exciting thing in the last year or so in partnering with AWS is being able to offer that capability to their customers through the marketplace where every asset that you have on AWS can now be protected by CrowdStrike and we're very very excited about that and actually today, we launched our 'Falcon' is the name of our product on GovCloud, offering to target primarily the Federal Government as well as the state and local and other enterprises actually, that are interested in that high level of assurance that GovCloud provides. >> What specifically- can you just drill down the product I just want to make sure that we get that right. So, you're on Amazon, you're protecting Amazon end points within their cloud. That's great for Amazon commercial enterprises, repeat one more time the public sector piece, how does that work? Who's the customer? Is it just the agency, or is it also enterprises who work with that? Talk about the dynamics. >> So when you look at our customers it's a mix of large enterprises, about twenty percent of fortune 500 companies, and various federal agencies. Basically we install on every machine they have that runs Windows, Mac or Linux systems so servers, desktops, laptops, everything within their environment but there's no on-premise equipment. So the agent connects to our cloud which runs on AWS and we collect all the execution activities that are taking place and apply machine learning and artificial intelligence to discover security threats. So it's a big data problem and we collect over a hundred billion events every single day just to give you a sense of how much that is, in two days we process the amount of data that Twitter processes in a year. So, really huge amounts of data. >> So Barry, do you go out to partners, do you even have to sell them on this concept, are they beating down your door, what's that dynamic like? >> Yeah, we work with partners that, well first of all, we have to get them to architect for AWS. So, before we even think about listing a product in marketplace, Dmitri will tell you, they have to first architect to run well on AWS so that when the software is deployed or the customer accesses that environment, it's running optimally. And the customer is protecting both assets that they have running on AWS and On-Prem. I think vendors have really warmed up to the idea of marketplace as a sales channel for them. And the reason for that is we really serve two different types of customers. One type of customer who can go to the public marketplace website and subscribe to a product, deploy that and immediately purchase it. And then, for large enterprise and public sector federal government customers, we still have that feature of private offers, which enables the customer and the vendor to negotiate on price and terms but still transact digitally through marketplace and have it all seamlessly built by AWS. Lots of flexibility for sales teams that are in the field. >> Okay, so they work out the financial arrangements and you guys facilitate that experience? >> That's right. We handle the deployment, subscription and billing for the customer. >> So obviously, you know, the commercial space SAS is exploding. What are the drivers in federal, are they similar, what are the differences? >> For customers that are wanting to move to SAS based applications, I think it's pretty simple. Customers have reached a point where they don't necessarily want to manage the underlying infrastructure or software itself. So they're really looking to manufacturers like CrowdStrike who have a fully managed SAS based environment running on AWS. All the customer wants is the outcome the functionality of the software, for it to be performant and do what the vendor said that it was going to do. Managing all of that infrastructure and underlying technology, that's the expertise of the manufacturer themselves and the movement to SAS is all about simplifying for customers. >> How about CrowdStrike news I want to get to the valuation question. You guys are valued at over three billion dollars just reported on siliconangle.com and around the world you guys raised two hundred million dollars in a round of funding. Total capitalization is about four hundred million, roughly? >> Yeah, over four hundred million. >> OK. So you're feeling good today, right? >> Very good. More than anything else it's an indication of our growth, we've doubled the company in terms of revenue last year. We had a year over year increase of five hundred percent in terms of one million dollar deals we've closed. So it's really an indication that we're separating ourselves from the rest of the pretty crowded endpoint security marketplace and establishing ourselves as a leader. >> And what's the money going to be used for? Mostly expansion, sales, marketing? >> It's further expansion, our growth internationally sales and marketing, engineering, helping build out more of the platform capabilities. >> I want to get your take on the cloud because you guys built your business on day one. We were commenting off-camera saying that with our company we have never owned a data center. Have you ever owned a data center? >> We do a few things, small things, but most of our stuff is on AWS. >> So, for the people out there trying to do cloud that don't have that clean sheet of paper of a start-up like you guys were seven years ago. The key to success, to really take advantage of the cloud, not just migrate to it, but actually use it. >> Well, you know, it's interesting in security it's been an interesting journey because when we started back in 2011, doing security in the cloud was a heresy. In fact, I remember meetings with major banks back in those days when we were telling them about our plans and how we're going to do security in a very different way. They said 'This sounds intriguing, but we'll never be a customer because we'll never do cloud." Now, most of these guys are customers, so the mindset has definitely changed a lot. And what we're seeing now is actually our competitors that for years have been trying to compete with us by saying 'Well we're on-premise, CrowdStrike is cloud, you can't trust cloud.' Now they're desperately trying to move to the cloud and of course, unless you build it natively in the cloud to begin with it's very very hard to do. You can't just put an appliance in a data center and call it a cloud, and that's what they're struggling with. >> How do customers determine whether something- How does it pass the smell test? You know, you can say you do things, what's the flaw in having that non-optimized fully cloud-ready, or born in the cloud solution? What's the test? >> That's a great question. So, one test is scalability. We replace a lot of our competitors because they just couldn't scale. Because they used traditional sequel-based databases, single appliances, not a multi-tenet environment, they deploy it to two hundred thousand end points and the thing just comes crashing down. So that's one big thing and then in terms of better security, unless this is what the cloud really gives you in security, unless you can aggregate all of this data, and we process a hundred billion events per day and do machine learning on that data to try and discover new types of attacks, you're not leveraging the benefits of the cloud you're not delivering better protection. >> We've had many interviews over the years, Dave and I, around security with Amazon. You took a lot of heat on it being not secure turns out the cloud is actually becoming more secure, you're an expert in security, you've done a lot of thread analysis over the years looking at your bio and you're successfully leading a great company. Hackers love to attack where the data is, so the cloud's complexity, if you will, or its distributive nature, makes it less hackable, some say. What's your take on that? How do you view that opportunity? So say, look at it, if I put everything in one spot, I can brute-force it, or I'm going to get hacked. What's your take on using the cloud as an opportunity to have better security? >> You know, in this day and age almost every single company that is not concerned in moving to the cloud is making a huge mistake because the reality is, when you look at the security teams that Amazon has, or other cloud providers have, they are way ahead of virtually everyone in this market. They're way ahead of the big banks that have a lot of money,6 they're certainly way ahead of the federal government, so you're getting the best of the best and security technologies they have the same level of scale that we do in terms of seeing all these types of attacks and can react a lot faster. So yes, while it may present itself as a bigger target the reality is that you'll be getting a much higher level of protection than you can ever do yourself. >> So what's the inside scoop on the tipping point? You were talking before, years ago, financial services, customers for example said 'Never, we'll never go to the cloud'. We've had many interviews, 'that's an evil word.' >> That's right. >> What was the tipping point? Was it the realization that companies like Amazon could do a better job? Was it fear of missing out? Was it economics? Was it the losses that they were taking? What was it? >> I think it was a combination of everything. It's funny because in those days we actually asked them, 'Well, how did you feel about virtualization when it came out? I bet you didn't like that either.' 'No, we didn't like that, now we use the virtualization.' 'How do you feel about open source?' 'No, no. We hated it. Now we use it.' Right, so it's a journey for a lot of companies. Whenever something new comes out that's a big paradigm shift. But a few years in typically they realize the adoption. What we're seeing now particularly in the public sector is that realization that the commercial sector went through probably three or four years ago. And now we're seeing the big push and the executive order from the present that you have to adopt cloud, that you have to move to modern IT infrastructure and we're seeing a lot of success and the federal government agencies are realizing we need to do security in particular very differently and the cloud is a huge differentiator. >> How about, anything you can add to that Barry? Your perspectives on it? >> No, we're seeing enterprise customers and not just in financial services but across all industries. On the public sector side, you have organizations like GoodWill or City and Newport and then on the enterprise side, you have really large organizations like Siemens or 3M that are not only leveraging AWS but have also started leveraging solutions that are available in the marketplace and I think that in the past couple of years we have seen a turn both in the enterprise customer and in public sector customers that are really starting to adopt cloud and move to that as their primary mechanism. >> And we have seen in the last year huge adoption of the public sector across many sensitive agencies they're starting to adopt our solution on the GovCloud platform because they're seeing the benefits of that security model. >> It's a no-brainer, really, if you look at the speed and scale that you can do things, but you've got to check the boxes of the public sector, a little bit different than the commercial enterprise. So, talk about the public sector we're here at the public sector summit, it's like a reinvent in and of itself of that ecosystem. What does the current landscape look like? What's the orientation? What's the posture of their technology strategies? What's their appetite? Can you guys just give us some color commentary on the public sector customers? >> Sure, go ahead? >> Yeah. You know, one of the reasons that GovCloud was built and stood out was to give customers that needed FedRAMP or ITAR compliancy, you know and an opportunity to operate those workloads that they were moving over. Here's what I would say, you know, it's not just traditional public sector customers, like government agencies or the federal government that are operating in GovCloud, it's also enterprise customers that serve those needs. So there's this cross-section of pollination of customers and server team partners that are serving the federal government and government entities and large educational institutions or state and local government. But they want the same level of innovation, scale, they want to free up their developers to develop new applications and services for the citizens that they serve. They want all of the same things that the enterprise customers that we've been talking about have had for a number of years. They want the exact same thing. >> The paradigm shift, Dmitri, we were talking off-camera about the public sectors looking to the private sector because there's leadership there. No-one says, 'Hey, let's just do what the government does, there's no real- the inefficiencies that use cases there. You mention paradigm shift. How has the paradigm of operating and servicing and selling and delivering product value to the public sector changed? I mean, we still hear, the Oracle, thing was in the news about the DOD JEDI project? So the old way of selling and procuring is changing? >> It is, and the fact that customers can now leveraging Amazon and buy through the marketplace, all of these services directly from Amazon without having to go do separate contracting vehicles and separate prosumers, but the other benefit you get is the SAS deployment model in times of value. Traditional security solutions as an example take literally twelve to eighteen months to deploy. We had an agency in the US government that bought our solution recently and deployed throughout the entire agency in two weeks. So that ability to automatically get value of the solution helps secure the enterprise is something that you can only achieve with a cloud-based solution. >> I talk to a lot of people in D. C., we've been covering, opening up more coverage here it's still hot-market for the cloud area and certainly government as well. And then, in an off-the-record conversation, I won't say the name, but he says 'Look, I can't deny the Amazon solution, this cloud-native stuff is amazing, when have prices ever gone up? They don't, they go down, but they take more account-control because they get more penetration. So the prices go down. In the old way, prices went up! So, again, this is the shift in the mindset where you get more business, but you're driving the prices down at the element level. Is this the key thing that you're hearing too? >> Absolutely, and when you look at some of the customers that, I don't want to speak for you, but that Amazon has acquired in terms of intelligence community and others that you would never think would ever move to the cloud given the sensitivity that they have, and yet they've realized that to do things differently, to accomplish their mission, they have to use the cloud. So we're absolutely seeing that paradigm shift and the nice thing is that it's coming both from the bottom-up with these agencies realizing that they have to do things differently, and there is support in the White House in terms of IT modernization that we need to adopt the cloud to be successful. >> So do you feel like we'll finally start turning the corner in security? What I mean by that, is if you look at some of the metrics about, OK, a company gets infiltrated, they don't even realize it for whatever, two hundred and seventy five days, we spend more on security every year but we feel less secure. Is the cloud beginning to change that or are some of those metrics or even subjective measurements, I'm happy to spend more but I want to be more secure, are we starting to see the fulfillment of that promise? >> Absolutely, no question about it. And I'll give you a very concrete example. We actually launched, two weeks ago, a guarantee. If you're a customer using our service and you get breached on a system we protect, we pay up to a million dollars of various costs that you have because we believe that we can actually secure you and we're willing to put our money where our mouth is and establish that guarantee and there's no one in the industry that is doing anything like that. >> That's putting your money where your mouth is, I mean that's fantastic, usually these guarantees give a free month of service. >> No, no, no. We will pay cash to reimburse various expenses and set a response, legal fees, everything else that comes into it. >> Congratulations for taking that step. I mean, others are going to have to follow. >> That's good leadership. One of the guys on the stage from the CIA, Dave, you had the quote said that security-- >> Cloud security on its worst day- Cloud security on its very worst day is far better than my client's server systems. (John laughs) >> So there it is, to your point, OK, let's get the plug in for you guys. So you've got eight months of you starting to work together in the marketplace. >> We did. >> Tell us about that relationship, how's it going? What do you guys do? You're selling products together? Give a quick update on the relationship between that. >> Okay, so our Falcon platform in the last eight months has been on marketplace where customers that are coming in, and provisionary resources on EC2, on AWS can immediately get Falcon to protect those resources and that has been a fantastic growth area for us. We've also been partnering on the new GuardDuty offering that Amazon launched last year we're the intelligence provider for that platform. So it's been a great partnership we're looking to do a lot more, in particular with the GovCloud in the public sector. >> Last word? >> Well for us now, we're able to have a solution we can recommend to customers that's fully SAS-based, running on AWS and proven in its capability so, you know, it's great to partner with their sales and alliance team on the commercial and public sector side. We're going to look forward to seeing what we can do for the rest of the year. >> Well, Barry, thanks for coming back again it's great to have you on theCUBE and Dmitri, wonderful, and congratulations on the raise and making some progress, really appreciate your insights. >> Thank you so much. >> You're welcome. >> Alright, keep it right there buddy, John Furrier and I will be back with Stu Miniman, we're live from AWS Public Sector Summit. You're watching theCUBE.

>> Announcer: From New York, it's The Cube! Covering Blockchain Week. Now here's John Furrier. >> Hello, and I'm John Furrier with The Cube. We're back here on the ground for coverage of Consensus 2018, part of Blockchain Week New York, and we've got some amazing action going on here. We got Omar Bham, who's with Crypt0, C-R-Y-P-zero. Also got a great podcast. Great to see you. Crypt0 News, you're doing a lot of great social. Love the hat, love the swag. >> Thank you so much. >> Lookin' good. >> Thank you so much. Yeah, this is a swag actually, a follower of mine actually sent me, so I get these random boxes of just shirts, but I love 'em because my entire closet is crypto shirts, and now Goodwill, because I donate all these crypto shirts. (laughs) >> That's awesome. >> Yeah, thanks. >> Well, great to have you on. >> A pleasure. >> You're a celebrity, media celebrity, but you're really an example of a rising new kind of stakeholder in the ecosystem and the community. You're producing content. You're producing with the community. It's a co-development model. You're building a network. >> Yeah, it's... >> Not audience, they're already there, but you've got a network. >> Yeah, it's that thing where you want to find that niche. >> You know? >> John: Yeah. >> And it's just we've been blessed, some of us, to find this space pretty early on and develop that presence before others perhaps could. It's just a blessing. >> So what's your take on all this place? I got to ask you, what's your thoughts? Massive crowd. What's the analysis? >> You know, I was here last year, and we were expecting, I think it was 2750 last year, this year 4000. Turns out to be 8000 people, and a big trending Twitter post today was do you think that you're getting work done? This is my Amin Gunsir. He's one of the big blockchain, he looks at the code very deeply in different blockchains. And so he said, do you feel like you're getting work done with that many people, or do you feel like you're not? And more people were actually getting work done. I think it was, like, 62% to 38%, the vote. (John chuckles) So even with the amount of people here, people are close, tight, and still getting work, you know, (mumbles). >> Well, one other thing, and this brings up a good point. I mean, when you're face to face at a physical event, you have engagement on a whole nother level. It's not digital. Not digital face to face. >> Yeah. >> And I was down in the cafeteria for the little cafe. It's supposed to be public, open, for when you buy your lunch. >> Yeah. >> It was like a conference room. I couldn't sit down. People having meetings. There is so much business being done, relationships being built. So this community really is kind of getting work done. >> Yeah. >> And a lot of it's relationship-based. >> Sure. Yes, absolutely. And, you know, it's a lot of it to do with old relationships blossoming into new relationships. It's that I trust somebody who I already trust. So a lot of these guys have been coming to conferences together for years. >> John: Right. >> And you get introduced to somebody, and then it just works that way. And that kind of a beautiful... >> John: Yeah. >> It's like a mesh network. It's not just coming here and trying to, you know, like, necessarily shill. It's like, oh, here's my friend who I trust. >> John: Yeah. >> We went to school together. And naturally automatically, maybe it's a human thing, we just connect to that person a little bit easier. >> Talk about the work you do. And you got a YouTube channel, you got a podcast, you do some Facebook. >> Yeah. >> What's the format of the show? What's your style? What are you looking for? What kind of content are you producing? Obviously it's very engaging, it's very popular. >> Yeah. >> What's your style? >> Well, originally my style was a belief that the economy was going to collapse, so I was a big investor in stocks, I was trading, and I was trying to save my 401(k). Believe it or not, this was a while back. And I was thinking, how do I grow my capital and preserve it? I was worried that we were going to have another collapse, like 2008 was the beginning of it. So I thought about the future, the singularity, and this one point where we look at Moore's law where computing prices get cut in half for chips every year and a half, was the original road map. Prices cut in half. And basically how do we connect that old world collapsing, perhaps, (John chuckles) into this new infrastructure? And cryptocurrency came at that point, where I had already had some bitcoin, and then Ethereum was coming out, and I realized Ethereum could very well provide that base protocol for the next internet of things, so... >> And the developer community uptake has been phenomenal for Ethereum. >> Yeah, it's incredible, yeah. >> So let's do a little show right now. Omar, what's going on? How's it going? (Omar laughs) What's the content like? What's the coolest thing you're seeing here? Share some stories from the show. What have you seen? >> Let me see. I did interviews with some huge people. So it's so cool just to run into, like, the creator of Lightcoin's right there giving out stickers for his cryptomagical friends. Creator of Monero talking about how he lost all his crypto in a boating accident to me yesterday. (John laughs) Talking to some big trader dudes. Hearing about some stuff I can't even talk about, like, because I promised, and we did a verbal NDA, and I honor those. But, I don't know, it's, everywhere you look, there's something to learn, and you'll be amazed. >> It's got everything into it. I mean, I love this wave, right, because one, technically it's some magical shit happening. >> Sure. >> And it's happening big time. Starting out is growing fast. Business side, radical disruption to business models. Community has been open source, kind of an extension to open source communities. So, and then you've got a glam factor, money. >> Um-hum. >> (laughs) Right, so, I mean, money, I mean... Well, what is it missing? >> You know, I had a friend actually tell me that he got kidnapped, he got kidnapped, tied up, and held at gunpoint for three hours for all his crypto, so he lost all his crypto. So mostly the people who are, like, way up there don't do all that flaunting and showy stuff. You look at the big developers aren't rolling up in the Lambos and Ferraris. Generally you want to be pretty humble and modest about what your earnings are. And so I think it's, maybe it's a sign of, like, that Floyd Mayweather phenomenon, let me show it off. >> John: Yeah. >> Yeah, let's flaunt it. But mostly, like, I think it's that, you know, when you work for somebody, you wear a suit. When you work for yourself, no offense. (laughs) >> Yeah. >> I think you look great. You go the jeans on. >> I'm not wearing a tie, so... >> Exactly. And then when you work for yourself, you can show up in pajamas. >> Yeah. >> So... >> Well, I got to agree with you that I love the mojo, and I think one of the things that's notable in this industry is the pioneers, the guys who are making the money on the front end, they're developers, too. >> Um-hum. >> They're not just, you know, guys rolling the financial Wall Street kind of thing. They're making money and they're paying it forward, right? There's a huge pay it forward culture here. >> Yes, absolutely. >> And I think that is, I think, the differentiator that no one sees, is that that ethos is self-governing. >> Um-hum. >> Yeah, I think there'll be a mainstream adoption pretty quickly. >> Um-hum. >> But still right now it's tight-knit. >> Um-hum. >> It's very cool, and it's a pay it forward culture. >> This is mainstream to me, man. Two years, seeing this space just blossom. But we're getting there. I think it's the early adopter phase. >> John: Yeah. >> Maybe a little bit of early adopter, early majority in the United States. It depends where you are in the world. In LA, everyone has at least heard of bitcoin... >> John: Yeah. >> ...or has some bitcoin where I live. It wasn't the case before when I was living in Miami and (mumbles). >> Well, Omar, I'm a big fan of your work. We showed you the clip or two. >> Oh, I'm a fan of yours. >> We're going to get that to you. >> I love what you're doing. Thank you so much for sharing it to me. >> Yeah. >> I have to have you on my own show, for sure. >> Yeah, what's the URLs? Give a plug, what's the URLs, YouTube channel, coordinates, how do people get in touch with you? >> You can go to youtube.com slash C-R-Y-P-T-zero, so it's basically crypto, but without a zero. You can go to Twitter, so you can follow me on... >> Without an O. >> Yeah? >> It's crypto without an O, or with an O? >> Not the letter O, just the letter, the number zero. >> The number zero, okay. >> So C-R-Y-P-T-zero. Then you go to Crypt0's News. Same way, I'm always Crypt0 with a zero at the end instead of a letter. So Crypt0's News, Instagram, Twitter. We're on SteamIt, Crypt0 everywhere. >> Well, let's do some code development together. You're now a Cube alumni. >> Yeah. >> Welcome to The Cube. >> Thank you so much for having me. We just met... >> Yeah, yeah. >> ...but I'm really excited to have met you. Super personality, man. >> Love the new producers. We love co-developing. We do it out in the open. We're in the open right now. We're on the floor here at Consensus 2018 bringing you all the coverage. Going to do 10 more interviews tomorrow. I did eight interviews last night. We interview anything that moves that's high-quality. Omar, thanks for coming on. It's The Cube. I'm John Furrier. Thanks for watching. >> Thanks, John. >> Announcer: Live from the campus of MIT in Cambridge, Massachusetts, it's The Cube! Covering the MIT Chief Data Officer and the Information Quality Symposium. Now here's your host Stu Miniman.

>>The cube at IBM. Impact 2014 is brought to you by headline sponsor. IBM. Here are your hosts, John furrier and Paul Gillin. >>Hey, welcome back everyone. This is Silicon angle's the cube. It's our flagship program. We go out to the events district as soon from the noise. We're ending out day two of two days of wall to wall coverage with myself and Paul Galen. Uh, 10 to six 30 every day. I'm just, we'll take as much as we can just to get the data. Share that with you. Restrict the signal from the noise. I'm John furrier the bonus look at angle Miko is Paul Gilliam and our special guests, Holger Mueller, Mueller from constellation research analyst covering the space. Ray Wang was here earlier. You've been here for the duration. Um, we're going to break down the event. We'll do a wrap up here. Uh, we have huge impact event for 9,000 people. Uh, Paul, I want to go to you first and get your take on just the past two days. And we've got a lot of Kool-Aid injection attempts for Kool-Aid injection, but IBM people were very, very candid. I mean, I didn't find it, uh, very forceful at all from IBM. They're pragmatic. What's your thoughts on it? >>I think pragmatism is, is what I take away, John, if it gets a good, that's a good word for it. Uh, what I saw was a, uh, not a blockbuster. Uh, there was not a lot of, of, uh, of hype and overstatement about what the company was doing. I was impressed with Steve mills, but our interview with him yesterday, we asked about blockbuster acquisitions and he said basically, why, why, I mean, why should we take on a big acquisition that is going to create a headache, uh, for us in integrating into your organization? Let's focus on the spots where we have gaps and let's fill those. And that's really what they've, you know, they really have put their money where their mouth is and doing these 150 or more acquisitions over the last, uh, three or four years. Um, I think that the, the one question that I would have, I don't think there's any doubt about IBM's commitment to cloud as the future about their investment in big data analytics. They certainly have put their money where their mouth is. They're over $25 billion invested in big data analytics. One question I have coming out of this conference is about power and about the decision to exit the x86 market and really create confusion in a part of their business partners, their customers about about how they're going to fill that gap and where are they going to go for their actually needs and the power. Clearly power eight clearly is the future. It's the will fill that role in the IBM portfolio, but they've got to act fast. >>Do you think there's a ripple effect then so that that move I'll see cause a ripple effect in their ecosystem? >>Well, I was talking to a, I've talked to two IBM partners today, fairly large IBM partners and both of them have expressed that their customers are suffering some whiplash right now because all of a sudden the x86 option from IBM has gone away. And so it's frozen there. Their purchasing process and some of them are going to HP, some of them are looking at other providers. Um, I don't think IBM really has has told a coherent story to the markets yet about how >>and power's new. So they've got to prop that up. So you, so you're saying is okay, HP is going to get some new sales out of this, so frozen the for IBM and yet the power story's probably not clear. Is that what you're hearing? >>I don't think the power story is clear. I mean certainly it was news to me that IBM is taking on Intel at the, at this event and I was surprised that, that, >>that that was a surprise. Hold on, I've got to go to you because we've been sitting here the Cuban, we've been having all the execs come here and we've been getting briefed here in the cube. Shared that with the audience. You've been out on the ground, we've bumped into you guys, all, all the other analysts and all the briefings you've been in, the private sessions you've been in the rooms you've been, you've been, you've been out, out in the trenches there. What have you, what are you finding, what have you been hearing and what are the, some of the soundbites that you could share with the audience? It's not the classic God, Yemen, what are the differences? >>The Austin executives in cloud pedal, can you give me your body language? He had impact one year ago because they didn't have self layer at a time, didn't want to immediately actionable to do something involving what? A difference things. What in itself is fine, but I agree with what you said before is the messaging is they don't tell the customers, here's where we are right now. Take you by the hand. It's going to be from your door. And there's something called VMs. >>So it's very interesting. I mean I would consider IBM finalized the acquisition only last July. It's only been nine months since was acquired. Everything is software now. It leads me to think of who acquired who IBM acquired a software or did soflar actually acquire IBM because it seems to, SoftLayer is so strategic. IBM's cloud strategy going forward. >>Very strategic. I think it's probably why most transformative seemed like the Nexans agenda. And you've heard me say assault on a single thing. who makes it seven or eight weeks ago? It's moving very far. >>What do you think about the social business? Is that hanging together, that story? Hang on. It's obviously relevant direction. It's kind of a smarter planet positioning. Certainly businesses will be social. Are you seeing any meat on the bone there? On the collaboration side, >>one of the weakest parts, they have to be built again. Those again, they also have an additional for HR, which was this position, this stuff. It's definitely something which gives different change. >>I have to say, John, I was struck by the lack of discussion of social business in the opening keynote in particular a mobile mobile, big data. I mean that that came across very clear, but I've been accustomed to hearing that the social business rugby, they didn't, it didn't come out of this conference. >>Yeah. I mean my take on that was, is that >>I think it's pretty late. I don't think there's a lot of meat in the bone with the social, and I'll tell you why. I think it's like it's like the destination everyone wants to go to, but there's no really engine yet. Right. I think there's a lot of bicycle riding when they need a car. Right? So the infrastructure is just not is too embryonic, if you will. A lot of manual stuff going on. Even the analytics and you know you're seeing in the leaderboard here in the social media side and big data analytics. Certainly there are some core engine parts around IBM, but that social engine, I just don't see it happening. You risk requires a new kind of automation. It's got some real times, but I think that this is some, some nice bright spots. I love the streams. I love this zone's concept that we heard from Watson foundations. >>I think that is something that they need to pull out the war chest there and bring that front and center. I think the thinking about data as zones is really compelling and then I'll see mobile, they've got all the messaging on that and to give IBM to the benefit of the doubt. I mean they have a story now that they have a revenue generating story with cloud and with big data and social was never a revenue generating story. That's a software story. It's not big. It's not big dollars. And they've got something now that really they're really can drive. >>I'll tell you Chris Kristin from mobile first. She was very impressive and, and I'll tell you that social is being worked on. So I put the people are getting it. I mean IBM 100% gets social. I think the, the, it's not a gimmick to them. It's not like, Oh, we got some social media stuff. I think in the DNA of their soul, they, they come from that background of social. So I give them high marks on that. I just don't see the engine yet. I'm looking for analytics. I'm looking for a couple of eight cylinders. I just don't see it yet. You know, the engine, the engines, lupus and she wants to build the next generation of education. Big data, tons of mobile as the shoulder equivalent to social. I'm skeptical. I'm skeptical on Bloomix. I'll tell you why. I'm not skeptical. I shouldn't say that. >>It's going to get some plane mail for that. Okay. I'll say I'll see what's out there. I'll say it. I'm skeptical of Blumix because it could be a Wright brothers situation. Okay, look, I'm wrong guys building the wrong airplane. So the question is they might be on the wrong side of history if they don't watch the open source foundations because here's the problem. I have a blue mix, gets rushed to the market. Certainly IBM has got muscle solutions together. No doubt debting on cloud Foundry is really a risk and although people are pumping it up and it's got some momentum, they don't have a big community, they have a lot of marketing behind it and I know Jane's Wars over there is doing a great job and I'm Josh McKinsey over there with piston cloud. It'll behind it. It has all the elements of open collaboration and architecture or collaboration. However, if it's not a done deal yet in my mind, so that's a, that is a risk factor in my my mind. >>We've met a number of amazing, maybe you can help to do, to put these in order, a number of new concepts out there. We've got Bloomex the soft player, and we've got the marketplace, and these are all three concepts that approval, which is a subset of which, what's the hierarchy of these different platforms? >>That's hopefully, that's definitely at the bottom. The gives >>us visibility. You talk about the CIO and CSI all the time. Something you securities on every stupid LCO one on OCS and the marketplace. Basically naming the applications. Who would folded? IBM. IBM would have to meet opensource platform as a service. >>Well, it's not, even though it's not even open source and doing a deal with about foundries, so, so they've got, I think they're going in the middle. Where's their angle on that? But again, I like, again, the developer story's good, the people are solid. So I think it's not a fail of my, in my mind that all the messaging is great. But you know, we went to red hat summit, you know, they have a very active community, multiple generations in the data center, in the Indiana prize with Linux and, and open, you know, they're open, open shift is interesting. It's got traction and it's got legit traction. So that's one area. The other area I liked with Steve mills was he's very candid about this turf. They're staking out. Clearly the cloud game is up, is there is hardcore for them and in the IBM flavor enterprise cloud, they want to win the enterprise cloud. They clearly see Amazon, they see Amazon and its rhetoric and Grant's narrative and rhetoric against Amazon was interesting saying that there's more links on SoftLayer and Amazon. Now if you count links, then I think that number is skewed. So it's, you know, there's still a little bit of gamification going to have to dig into that. I didn't want to call him out on that, but know there's also a hosting business versus, you know, cloud parse the numbers. But what's your take on Amazon soft layer kind of comparison. >>It's, it's fundamentally different, right? Mustn't all shows everything. Why did see retailers moves is what to entirely use this software, gives them that visibility machine, this accommodation more conservatively knowing that I buy them, I can see that I can even go and physically touch that machine and I can only did the slowly into any cloud virtualization shed everything. >>Oh, Paul, I gotta say my favorite interview and I want to get your take on this. It was a Grady food. She was sat down with us and talk with us earlier today. IBM fell up, walks on water with an IBM Aussie legend in the computer industry. Just riveting conversation. I mean, it was really just getting started. I mean, it felt like we were like, you know, going into cruising altitude and then he just walked away. So they w what's your take on that conversation? >>Well, I mean, certainly he, uh, the gritty boujee interview, he gave us the best story of, of the two days, which is, uh, they're being in the hospital for open heart surgery, looking up, seeing the equipment, and it's going to be used to go into his chest and open his heart and knowing that he knows the people who program that, that equipment and they programmed it using a methodology that he invented. Uh, that, that, that's a remarkable story. But I think, uh, uh, the fact that that a great igloo can have a job at a company like IBM is a tribute to IBM. The fact that they can employ people like that who don't have a hard revenue responsibility. He's not a P. and. L, he's just, he's just a genius and he's a legend and he's an IBM to its crude, finds a place for people like that all throughout his organization. >>And that's why they never lost their soul in my opinion. You look at what HP and IBM, you know, IBM had a lot of reorganizations, a lot of pivots, so to speak, a lot of battleship that's turned this in way. But you know, for the most part they kept their R and D culture. >>But there's an interesting analogy too. Do you remember the case methodology was mutual support of them within the finance language that you mailed something because it was all about images, right? You would use this, this methodology, different vendors that were prior to the transport itself. Then I've yet to that credit, bring it together. bring and did a great service to all for software engineering. And maybe it's the same thing at the end, can play around diversity. >>You've got to give IBM process a great point. Earlier we, Steve mills made a similar reference around, it wasn't animosity, it was more of Hey, we've helped make Intel a big business, but the PC revolution, you know, where, what's in it for us? Right? You know, where's our, you know, help us out, throw us a bone. Or you know, you say you yell to Microsoft to go of course with the licensing fee with Gates, but this is the point, the unification story and with grays here, you know IBM has some real good cultural, you know industry Goodwill, you agree >>true North for IBM is the Antal quest customer. They'll do what's right where the money and the budget of the enterprise customers and press most want compatibility. They don't want to have staff, of course they want to have investment protection >>guys. I'd be able to do a good job of defining that as their cloud strategy that clearly are not going head to head with Amazon. It's a hybrid cloud strategy. They want to, they see the enterprise customers that legacy as as an asset and it's something they want to build on. Of course the risk of that is that Amazon right now is the pure play. It has all the momentum. It has all the buzz and and being tied to a legacy is not always the greatest thing in this industry, but from a practical revenue generating standpoint, it's pretty good. >>Hey guys, let's go down and wrap up here and get your final thoughts on the event. Um, and let's just go by the numbers, kind of the key things that IBM was promoting and then our kind of scorecard on kind of where they, where they kind of played out and new things that popped out of the woodwork that got your attention. You see the PO, the power systems thing was big on their messaging. Um, the big data story continues to be part of it. Blue mix central to the operations and the openness. You had a lot of open, open openness in their messaging and for the most part that's pretty much it. Um, well Watson, yeah, continue. Agents got up to Watson. >>Wow. A lot of news still to come out of Watson I think in many ways that is their, is their ACE in the hole and then that is their diamond. Any other thoughts? >>Well, what I missed is, which I think sets IBM apart from this vision, which is the idea of the API. Everybody else at that pure name stops the platform or says, I'm going to build like the org, I'm going to build you. That's a clear differentiator on the IBM side, which you still have to build part. They still have to figure out granularity surface that sets them apart that they have to give one. >>Yeah, and I think I give him an a plus on messaging. I think they're on all the right fault lines on the tectonic shifts that we're seeing. Everyone, I asked every every guest interview, what's the game changing moment? Why is it so important? And almost consistently the answers were, you know, we're living in a time of fast change data, you know, efficiency spare or you're going to be left behind. This is the confluence of all these trends, these fall lines. So I think IBM is sitting on these fall lines. Now the question is how fast can they cobbled together the tooling from the machineries that they have built over the years. Going back to the mainframe anniversary, it's out there. A lot of acquisitions, but, but so far the story and the story >>take the customer by the hand. That's the main challenge. I see. This wasn't often we do in Mexico, they want zero due to two times or they're chilling their conferences. It's the customer event and you know, and it's 9,000 people somehow have to do something to just show, right? So why is my wave from like distinguished so forth and so and so into? Well Lou mentioned, sure for the cloud, but how do we get there, right? What can we use, what am I SS and leverage? How do I call >>guys, really appreciate the commentary. Uh, this is going to be a wrap for us when just do a shout out to Matt, Greg and Patrick here doing a great job with the production here in the cube team and we have another cube team actually doing a simultaneous cube up in San Francisco service. Now you guys have done a great job here. And also shout out to Bert Latta Moore who's been doing a great job of live tweeting and help moderate the proud show, which was really a huge success and a great crowd chat this time. Hopefully we'll get some more influencers thought leaders in there for the next event and of course want to thank Paul Gillen for being an amazing cohost on this trip. Uh, I thought the questions and the and the cadence was fantastic. The guests were happy and hold there. Thank you for coming in on our wrap up. >>Really appreciate it. Constellation research. Uh, this is the cube. We are wrapping it up here at the IBM impact event here live in Las Vegas. It's the cube John furrier with Paul Gillen saying goodbye and see it. Our next event and stay tuned if it's look at angel dot DV cause we have continuous coverage of service now and tomorrow we will be broadcasting and commentating on the Facebook developer conference in San Francisco. We're running here, Mark Zuckerberg and all Facebook's developers and all their developer programs rolling out. So watch SiliconANGLE TV for that as well. Again, the cube is growing with thanks to you watching and thanks to all of our friends in the industry. Thanks for watching..

>>Hey, welcome back and roll here. Live in San Francisco for Amazon web services summit. that's the hashtag. Go on Twitter. Go to crowd chat.net/aws summit. Rolling a special crowd chat document in the conversation. According every tweet in that room, join that community. I'm John furry, the founder's Silicon angle. This is the cube, our flagship program. We go out to the events and extract the signal from the noise. I'm joined my cohost, Jeff Frick filling in for Dave Volante. Uh, Jeff, always hard to fill up with Dave a lot day. Um, who was on those per, it doesn't look good on you. I know you're from California and Ariel Ariel Kelman worldwide marketing lead head of worldwide. Margaret Amazon. Welcome back to the cube. Thanks for having me. You were here last less than that. Reinvent, um, kinda markets itself, the company. I mean, you just tried to features out there on stage and keep on pushing new. What we try and do is lean back and just like the customers' testimonials. Let me come on. >>Yeah, I mean we try and just focusing on educating our customers. About what our services are doing, how customers are using them, which is something they ask for a lot. And then, you know, go pretty light on the marketing. Most technical people don't like to be marketed to and they find our approach quite refreshing. >>And when you're in the lead, you don't need to really worry about too much layer. You've got some meat on the bone, you've got great use cases, you've got great technology and a market leader in cloud and you're forging it a new territory. So there is a new element in the enterprise now coming in where you guys are being attacked. Certainly in the market. Google had some moves this week, as you can see, know IBM is doing HP, Oracle, the list goes on and on. So okay, those guys are kind of putting up the seawall for the big innovation way that you guys have built. The question is will it last? And so there is people really moving quickly to Amazon. The customer uptake is pretty comprehensive. So I'd say it's mainstream. So now as you go to the enterprise, you've got to do some messaging, right? You gotta you gotta have the innovation message. So what is the core opportunity for you there? >>There's a couple of things in the enterprise I think, you know, first of all we're helping people save money. We have organizations like Dow Jones that predict they're going to save over a hundred million dollars essentially by shutting down data centers and moving more of their infrastructure to the cloud. But I think the real interesting part is how we make these companies more innovative that if we can lower the cost of using technology to roll out their new projects, then essentially we take the cost of experimentation and have it almost approach zero. So then now if you want to try something new, the costs of failure aren't so high that they prevent people from sticking their neck out of the line and trying new things. And so we see a lot of these companies are adopting us more heavily. Their culture is changing their employees or are excited about trying things because when they try something out, the cost of failure is a fraction of what it was before because they don't have to buy servers. >>Delta buys all this equipment, get data center space, they can try something quickly. If it works, great, they expand. If not, they don't have to live with all this expense that they tried it out. So it's increasing the pace of innovation and also allowing more people in the company to be able to try new things, involve technology because we're eliminating these gatekeepers where before if you get a project required a lot of money, a lot of infrastructure, think about the committees you have to go, all the justifications. But if anyone could go spin up these resources with self-service, totally changed the dynamics of who can innovate. >>Yeah. I mean the whole try before you buy the puppy dog close as they used to say in the sales tactics is, let me try it before you buy it. Yeah. Shadow it as the, legitimize the fact that for very little cost and collateral damage, as Andy talks about, you can get something up and running pretty quickly. So the old I, that'll never work. Comment. That's a killer phrase of innovation gets eliminated because, no, no, no, I already tried it. Here's the numbers. Is that, is that a big part of it too? >>I'm a little bit, I mean it's almost like we need a new term there. There's, you know, people talk about shadow it and what we typically see is that once you give the CIO the keys to the cloud infrastructure and you set up a governance approach where you can decide what people can do, how much money they can spend, what things they can try. Um, then you get the best of both worlds. You still have a vetted platform from a security perspective. You have governance controls and sure people doing the right thing, but then it doesn't have to say, no, sorry, you've got to wait in line. You got to wait till next year. Um, so that is the new model that we're seeing where you're seeing developers distributed across the organization and smaller official it departments, but more people doing it stuff in the company because everyone can have access to infrastructure when they go big on cloud, especially with AWS. >>And are they getting it? Are the corporate it guys getting it that this is a good thing for them and they can leverage this to actually add more value in the company and enable more at the end of the day. More ideas. Yeah, absolutely. The companies that we talked to, look, they've got a lot of questions. If you're a big organization, you want to know if we can meet your security requirements, your compliance requirements. Can you run a sends Alaska? Well look, we want to do two things. We want to run the software the last 20 years in the cloud. Can you help us with that? And then we want to build these new cloud native applications so we can be as agile and efficient as some of these new internet startups that now we're competing with. And so we spent a lot of time with them to talk through what it should do first, how I should think about it, what apps make sense to run on us and, and you know, more importantly with the sequences, which lady first us should ask us. Like we want to go, we've, we've played around, we've tested, we've had lots of developers using this for years, but now we want to go big. I having a material percentage of our infrastructure in the cloud so we can fundamentally change how it adds value to the business. And like those are the conversations we love having the customers. >>I want to ask you about just to show by, just to get, check this out. Check the box on the interview here because I want to make sure people can understand Amazon. Reinvent your mega show. That's your global conference. And why don't you explain, explain, reinvent versus the, >>sure. So the AWS summits, um, it's our three one day event, uh, that we do maybe like 14, 15 around the world. It's two purposes. One for people that are new to AWS, they can come in one day, get an overview of what it's about, how to use it and get inspired on what they can do with it. And then for our existing customers who are having users, they get an update on what's new, which may sound kind of tactical, but we released them, you gotta do stuff right. And so that's of my biggest challenge is how do we make sure that people know what all the new stuff is. They come here for one day, go to our keynote, go to a bunch of breakout sessions, do some training, and they get ramped up on everything we've done in the past year. Speaking of it, so we had you on last year and we were here. >>So what's been the big change from 2013 to 2014? I mean, we've had a lot of new services that we've released. We're going to new areas and think about Amazon workspaces. It's more of an it business application, right? Um, what you saw our demo today wasn't people coding. It was someone actually as an end user using, um, a virtual desktop on their iPad, on their computer. And so different types of applications, but we're, we're still going after that same goal, which is to allow these enterprise it organizations to take advantage of the cloud with more workloads. Essentially the larger percentage of their projects that they're doing that we can help them with, the happier they are with the relationship and the test, the test dev conversation seems to have simmer down quite a bit where it seemed like last year that was, and that was everybody's kind of testing waters. >>That's where you had initial traction, the initial shadowing it and that, that seems to really have dying down. And I mean, I think it's kind of gone mainstream or whatever is past mainstream where, you know, if you're a big SAP shop and your developers don't have their own SAP development environments, you're kinda, you're behind the curve. Same for Oracle, for SharePoint, if that's the new standard. Um, and so people don't talk about as much because they're already doing it. Right. It's, it's a, you know, the idea of well, you know, what are the big bets, um, you know, what should we use it for next? Should I do big data analytics using, um, like our Redshift product or should they build new high-scale web applications? Should this be my mobile infrastructure? That's where more of the conversation is coming on. Now >>Eric, I want to ask you about marketing and kind of one-on-one, you know, take me through the business school level marketing relative to your vision of Amazon and how the company's operating. I see Andy sets the tone up on stage, very customer centric. We hear all the people on Amazon talk about, Hey, we listened to the customer. They said they're tight on the messaging, they're really tight on the messaging. But you know, you starting to see, you know, tweets on the wild emerge. Like the new strategy for Amazon is price reduction as a service. And you know, it's like, so you seeing these messages come out. So is that, is that your plan to message just the price reduction to show the continuous improvement in terms of cost reductions and improvements in innovation and capability and just kind of be humble. >>So what, what our market organization is trying to do is to educate our customers in the easiest, most scalable way about what our services do, what are the best practices, how could they can use them and how they can save money near site. Andy talked about it a little bit earlier. We want our customers to feel like they're spending the least amount of money they need with us cause we want a longterm relationship and a price reductions. I mean it's probably one of the top three or four most boring parts of marketing AWS because every service team is trying to relentlessly take costs out of uh, their services. And when they get to a certain point, we pass those cost savings along to customers. It's kind of like clockwork two of them. Is that an internal metric for you guys? You guys all under pressure or mandated? >>That's just the DNA of the company. Let's get the cost out. Let's strap, distract away, cost and complexity. There's some bragging rights, little competition between the teams. How many price reductions have you done? I mean, it's a sign that they're being efficient and that they're making customers happy. It's a great metric. Price reduction and also feature increase. So again, now with flash, you start to see some new stuff hit the table. Yeah, that's part of the plan, right? Price reductions and more functioning. I mean the most, one of the most important parts of our overall strategy is to constantly innovate both on building new services, let people run more things in the cloud, but then also adding new functionality based on feedback we get from our customers. We'd like to release services relatively early versus sitting in an ivory tower trying to figure out what the perfect feature set is. >>We'll get this out early. Uh, get feedback from customers because you know, we're often surprised what people do with these services and uh, you know, they take on a life of their own. But ultimately that's how we get the best. You guys are like, you guys are like the big gorilla in the industry, but I was talking to someone last night at a VIP event, San Francisco, all these CEO of venture capitalists, Oh, Amazon, they loaded with money. You know, I'm like guys, they're like a lean startup. So that's pretty much the case. We've validated in talking to some folks, you guys are like a startup. I mean you're huge, you got great resources, but it's not like you're like Swoon and money thrown it around. You guys are very tight on budgets. You don't like just throwing around money. If you want to know about Amazon's culture, just type into Google, Amazon leadership principles. >>And there's about a, is it about a dozen or so core values? One of them is frugality. It's kind of, you know, part of how we operate the company and believe in what it means is that we only spend money on things that are useful to our customers. And that's a real good grounding. And then you see, we don't have 80 foot tall posters of our products or our executives here. You know, we spend the time on computers for people to do training and when we're planning events, we want to have everything focused on stuff that's useful to customers. We build the service too. We try and be relentless and driving cost out of our suppliers so we can pass on those costs and these customers. And it's just, you know, when you, um, when you operate a frugal fashion where you really think about costs, you end up being scrappy or, and you end up innovating more, it sends a good signal to your customer base because it's like a probably a laundry list of things that you guys have laid out then you still need to do and do innovate. >>Yes, exactly. If you wasting money on, you know, weirdness people that say, Hey, we didn't, why aren't they spending that energy on building new stuff? Exactly. Like we didn't 10 Howard street and close off the road to have a rock concert held companies. I mean, we have our crowd chat. Have you've seen that? We built that all on Amazon would not be possible without it. We hear testimony and testimonial customers saying, Hey, Amazon would have been 15 people minimum just to actually manage the gear on an offside without avatars. So yeah, it's just pretty massive. So, so with that, I got to ask you, the marketing question is how do you roll up all that Goodwill, Tony, when this great, great case study data you have? I mean referenceability it's not about, I mean, the number one marketing strategy we have is let our customers do the marketing for us. >>So I mean, part of why we do these events is to let our customers and people who are not customers yet interact with each other. And even when we have a reception and one of the best marketing strategies, if you have a product that people like is you combined your customers, your prospects and alcohol, and then they, you let them talk, right? You haven't asked questions. And that's how you get the relevant. Like, okay, you don't wanna believe our salespeople talk to our customers and really get a sense of what's going on. All right, there's too much smoke and mirrors. But these old guard hardware and software companies for much more open, much more transparent, um, because we believe in our, in our products and they're available for anyone. Anytime. It's almost like it's not even worth making up things that aren't true because anyone in the world can evaluate any of our services anytime they want. >>It's almost boringly boringly good. And you hear Andy talking about, well we did this for that. We did definitely, it was like a laundry list. I was listening to the keynote. I'm like, okay, he's going to stop now. Yeah, no, I'm just like, it's more and more just dropping, dropping more and more feature releases. Um, so obviously you guys are shipping more product. You reducing the prices for shipping. I mean, pushing on services. Yeah. You push code in the cloud, we can create a box for you. You can ship that ship means, you know, Sam sends send to the cloud. But that's the dev ops culture that DevOps culture is to be scrappy but think differently. So you guys are thinking differently. Like I gotta ask you, how do you thinking differently because it's clear and ecosystems developing around me and that's something that you do have to nurture. >>You have to invest in this community and you're helping them as business partners now, not just customers. Your customer base now spans the partners. Yeah. Have you balanced it? Still? Same philosophy. What tweaks if you've made your job and an organization based upon the tsunami of an ecosystem growth. I mean our customer ecosystem is really important to our strategy and to our customers. The way we think about it as a um, cloud's new and people are gonna need help. So from consulting firms, systems integrators, managed service providers, which is a really fast growing space. We want to make sure that when our customers want to bet big on AWS, there are those trusted people with certified engineers who can help them either in the short term or longterm basis. And then on the technology partner ISV side, we spent a lot of time making sure that we work collaboratively with these companies to pre sort of certify these applications to run on AWS. >>And then we create pre configured versions of them that run in our marketplace where our customers can browse through a catalog of software pre-configured or run in AWS. They can install with one click of the button and then it just shows up on their AWS bill. So we're trying to make it a lot easier for people to use a lot of these partners technology. And you know what, we're not going to come out with everything. You know, we'd like the creativity of our partners. The customers like to know if they, if they bet on AWS and they say, huh, you know, I wonder if you know, there's some good no SQL databases that run on AWS. Oh there's Mongo, there's Cassandra and whatever space you pick, there may be something we offer and there may be four or five other solutions from our partners. We love that choice because that's what customers ask us. Well, >>congratulations on all your success now. And my final question for you is really probably the hardest question and you can answer it or not answer it. Um, obviously the competitive landscape has significantly increased the heat in the kitchen around you guys for a while you were uncontested. Yes. Some people kind of pick an ankle biting around Amazon's, you know, leadership. But now you've got some pretty big players. IBM, HP, Oracle, Google, EMC, pivotal, VMware gunning, Rackspace, trickles, OpenStack, all of those kind of going around and no, you don't focus on competition and you focus on the customer. We've heard that before, but like you gotta think about that. That's going to put some pressure. How is that affecting you guys? I see you're mindful of it. Are you guys doing anything different to address it? >>I've never seen a market before where it wasn't healthy for both the leader and for the customers to have competition. And we've always expected this to be a market that would have multiple vendors. We look at our, every other technology, a space that was new and became large. There's multiple vendors and it, you know, it enhances innovation, keeps people honest. It's a good thing. >>So the final question then is what will you tell the folks out there who are watching? Is Amazon enterprise ready, um, what's going on right now? This event, you get the big announcements, give them a recap of what you guys did today and comment on the, on the Amazon is enterprise ready or the enterprise may be ready, not ready for the Amazon. So how do you respond to all that FID out? >>Yeah, I mean that was a question people asked a lot about us in the enterprise three, four years ago. I think we've invested a pretty big deal of our R and D over the past four or five years on just maniacally going through all these enterprise features. I mean, if you look at Gartner's magic quadrant for infrastructure and service, which is 100% designed for enterprise decision makers, we're, we're the faraway leader. Uh, and um, you know, we Mark off their checklist pretty well. And I think that's one of the reasons why we're really becoming the safe choice for it managers and large organizations, large enterprises, large government agencies. Um, I mean, my biggest point of advice is to take a look at our website and we're constantly coming out with new services. And if you haven't looked at this recently, I bet you're going to go there and find some things that you didn't know. Randomness and you'll get some ideas about new projects, new workloads that you can run in the cloud. >>Okay. Final word on re-invent to now. Three major things were announced Canisius app stream and workspaces. Are you happy with what's happened since then and now? It gives a quick guys a feeling of >>yeah, I mean the, the uh, we did a private beta for all three of them. We had a lot of participation. Uh, we showed in the keynote some of the real creative applications people are building with app stream where they're streaming very graphically intensive applications out to a variety of devices. Really making it easier for developers, workspaces, the interest. I've never seen a product like this before. Um, where the customer is in the private beta are just so excited about giving us some features, talk about how we can make it better. Um, tons of, tons of energy, tons of excitement. And Canisius is one of these things where, you know, we didn't know what to expect. I mean it's, it's a, a, a realtime analytics service to ingest massive amounts of data and you can build all kinds of apps on top of it. And I think, uh, one of the things we talked about today, uh, was a gaming company. Supersolid makes classic plans to take all the click stream and usage data of their application to figure all these intelligent endgame offers and how to make their games more efficient and more fun. And uh, that's the best part is when we can come out with technology that is pretty broad and can be used for a lot of things. And then we let customers be creative and we can see what they do. >>Then they do Italia. Luckily they generally anymore, right there you'll come and you actually have the hardest and easiest job in the world kind of at the same time. One is you just have great customers. You have the sizzle and the steak, as we say, meat on the bone. Um, great product mix. You guys introducing that stuff here, prices dropping and functionality increasing and innovation having the same time. It's actually quite an amazing thing. So we're really impressed. Again, we're happy customer with Bouchut that's coming on the cube. Again, appreciate it for having me. This is the cube. This is what we do. We go out to the events, we go where the action is, and the action is at Amazon web services summit in San Francisco. This is the cube. We'll be right back with our next guest after this short break.