>>The Cube presents Ignite 22, brought to you by Palo Alto Networks. >>Welcome back to Vegas. Guys. We're happy that you're here. Lisa Martin here covering with Dave Valante, Palo Alto Networks Ignite 22. We're at MGM Grand. This is our first day, Dave of two days of cube coverage. We've been having great conversations with the ecosystem with Palo Alto executives, with partners. One of the things that they have is unit 42. We're gonna be talking with them next about cyber intelligence. And the threat data that they get is >>Incredible. Yeah. They have all the data, they know what's going on, and of course things are changing. The state of play changes. Hold on a second. I got a text here. Oh, my Netflix account was frozen. Should I click on this link? Yeah. What do you think? Have you had a, it's, have you had a little bit more of that this holiday season? Yeah, definitely. >>Unbelievable, right? A lot of smishing going on. >>Yeah, they're very clever. >>Yeah, we're very pleased to welcome back one of our alumni to the queue. Wendy Whitmore is here, the SVP of Unit 42. Welcome back, Wendy. Great to have >>You. Thanks Lisa. So >>Unit 42 created back in 2014. One of the things that I saw that you said in your keynote this morning or today was everything old is still around and it's co, it's way more prolific than ever. What are some of the things that Unit 42 is seeing these days with, with respect to cyber threats as the landscape has changed so much the last two years alone? >>You know, it, it has. So it's really interesting. I've been responding to these breaches for over two decades now, and I can tell you that there are a lot of new and novel techniques. I love that you already highlighted Smishing, right? In the opening gate. Right. Because that is something that a year ago, no one knew what that word was. I mean, we, it's probably gonna be invented this year, right? But that said, so many of the tactics that we have previously seen, when it comes to just general espionage techniques, right? Data act filtration, intellectual property theft, those are going on now more than ever. And you're not hearing about them as much in the news because there are so many other things, right? We're under the landscape of a major war going on between Russia and Ukraine of ransomware attacks, you know, occurring on a weekly basis. And so we keep hearing about those, but ultimately these nations aid actors are using that top cover, if you will, as a great distraction. It's almost like a perfect storm for them to continue conducting so much cyber espionage work that like we may not be feeling that today, but years down the road, they're, the work that they're doing today is gonna have really significant impact. >>Ransomware has become a household word in the last couple of years. I think even my mom knows what it is, to some degree. Yeah. But the threat actors are far more sophisticated than they've ever written. They're very motivated. They're very well funded. I think I've read a stat recently in the last year that there's a ransomware attack once every 11 seconds. And of course we only hear about the big ones. But that is a concern that goes all the way up to the board. >>Yeah. You know, we have a stat in our ransomware threat report that talks about how often victims are posted on leak sites. And I think it's once every seven minutes at this point that a new victim is posted. Meaning a victim has had their data, a victim organization had their data stolen and posted on some leak site in the attempt to be extorted. So that has become so common. One of the shifts that we've seen this year in particular and in recent months, you know, a year ago when I was at Ignite, which was virtual, we talked about quadruple extortion, meaning four different ways that these ransomware actors would go out and try to make money from these attacks in what they're doing now is often going to just one, which is, I don't even wanna bother with encrypting your data now, because that means that in order to get paid, I probably have to decrypt it. Right? That's a lot of work. It's time consuming. It's kind of painstaking. And so what they've really looked to do now is do the extortion where they simply steal the data and then threaten to post it on these leak sites, you know, release it other parts of the web and, and go from there. And so that's really a blending of these techniques of traditional cyber espionage with intellectual property theft. Wow. >>How trustworthy are those guys in terms of, I mean, these are hackers, right? In terms of it's really the, the hacker honor system, isn't it? I mean, if you get compromised like that, you really beholden to criminals. And so, you >>Know, so that's one of the key reasons why having the threat intelligence is so important, right? Understanding which group that you're dealing with and what their likelihood of paying is, what's their modus operandi. It's become even more important now because these groups switch teams more frequently than NFL trades, you know, free agents during the regular season, right? Or players become free agents. And that's because their infrastructure. So the, you know, infrastructure, the servers, the systems that they're using to conduct these attacks from is actually largely being disrupted more from law enforcement, international intelligence agencies working together with public private partnerships. So what they're doing is saying, okay, great. All that infrastructure that I just had now is, is burned, right? It's no longer effective. So then they'll disband a team and then they'll recruit a new team and it's constant like mixing and matching in players. >>All that said, even though that's highly dynamic, one of the other areas that they pride themselves on is customer service. So, and I think it's interesting because, you know, when I said they're not wanting to like do all the decryption? Yeah. Cuz that's like painful techni technical slow work. But on the customer service side, they will create these customer service portals immediately stand one up, say, you know, hey it's, it's like an Amazon, you know, if you've ever had to return a package on Amazon for example, and you need to click through and like explain, you know, Hey, I didn't receive this package. A portal window pops up, you start talking to either a bot or a live agent on the backend. In this case they're hu what appeared to be very much humans who are explaining to you exactly what happened, what they're asking for, super pleasant, getting back within minutes of a response. And they know that in order for them to get paid, they need to have good customer service because otherwise they're not going to, you know, have a business. How, >>So what's the state of play look like from between nation states, criminals and how, how difficult or not so difficult is it for you to identify? Do you have clear signatures? My understanding in with Solar Winds it was a little harder, but maybe help us understand and help our audience understand what the state of play is right now. >>One of the interesting things that I think is occurring, and I highlighted this this morning, is this idea of convergence. And so I'll break it down for one example relates to the type of malware or tools that these attackers use. So traditionally, if we looked at a nation state actor like China or Russia, they were very, very specific and very strategic about the types of victims that they were going to go after when they had zero day. So, you know, new, new malware out there, new vulnerabilities that could be exploited only by them because the rest of the world didn't know about it. They might have one organization that they would target that at, at most, a handful and all very strategic for their objective. They wanted to keep that a secret as long as possible. Now what we're seeing actually is those same attackers going towards one, a much larger supply chain. >>So, so lorenzen is a great example of that. The Hafnia attacks towards Microsoft Exchange server last year. All great examples of that. But what they're also doing is instead of using zero days as much, or you know, because those are expensive to build, they take a lot of time, a lot of funding, a lot of patience and research. What they're doing is using commercially available tools. And so there's a tool that our team identified earlier this year called Brute Rael, C4 or BRC four for short. And that's a tool that we now know that nation state actors are using. But just two weeks ago we invested a ransomware attack where the ransomware actor was using that same piece of tooling. So to your point, yak can get difficult for defenders when you're looking through and saying, well wait, they're all using some of the same tools right now and some of the same approaches when it comes to nation states, that's great for them because they can blend into the noise and it makes it harder to identify as >>Quickly. And, and is that an example of living off the land or is that B BRC four sort of a homegrown hacker tool? Is it, is it a, is it a commercial >>Off the shelf? So it's a tool that was actually, so you can purchase it, I believe it's about 2,500 US dollars for a license. It was actually created by a former Red teamer from a couple well-known companies in the industry who then decided, well hey, I built this tool for work, I'm gonna sell this. Well great for Red teamers that are, you know, legitimately doing good work, but not great now because they're, they built a, a strong tool that has the ability to hide amongst a, a lot of protocols. It can actually hide within Slack and teams to where you can't even see the data is being exfiltrated. And so there's a lot of concern. And then now the reality that it gets into the wrong hands of nation state actors in ransomware actors, one of the really interesting things about that piece of malware is it has a setting where you can change wallpaper. And I don't know if you know offhand, you know what that means, but you know, if that comes to mind, what you would do with it. Well certainly a nation state actor is never gonna do something like that, right? But who likes to do that are ransomware actors who can go in and change the background wallpaper on a desktop that says you've been hacked by XYZ organization and let you know what's going on. So pretty interesting, obviously the developer doing some work there for different parts of the, you know, nefarious community. >>Tremendous amount of sophistication that's gone on the last couple of years alone. I was just reading that Unit 42 is now a founding member of the Cyber Threat Alliance includes now more than 35 organizations. So you guys are getting a very broad picture of today's threat landscape. How can customers actually achieve cyber resilience? Is it achievable and how do you help? >>So I, I think it is achievable. So let me kind of parse out the question, right. So the Cyber Threat Alliance, the J C D C, the Cyber Safety Review Board, which I'm a member of, right? I think one of the really cool things about Palo Alto Networks is just our partnerships. So those are just a handful. We've got partnerships with over 200 organizations. We work closely with the Ukrainian cert, for example, sharing information, incredible information about like what's going on in the war, sharing technical details. We do that with Interpol on a daily basis where, you know, we're sharing information. Just last week the Africa cyber surge operation was announced where millions of nodes were taken down that were part of these larger, you know, system of C2 channels that attackers are using to conduct exploits and attacks throughout the world. So super exciting in that regard and it's something that we're really passionate about at Palo Alto Networks in terms of resilience, a few things, you know, one is visibility, so really having a, an understanding of in a real, as much of real time as possible, right? What's happening. And then it goes into how you, how can we decrease operational impact. So that's everything from network segmentation to wanna add the terms and phrases I like to use a lot is the win is really increasing the time it takes for the attackers to get their work done and decreasing the amount of time it takes for the defenders to get their work done, right? >>Yeah. I I call it increasing the denominator, right? And the ROI equation benefit over or value, right? Equals equals or benefit equals value over cost if you can increase the cost to go go elsewhere, right? Absolutely. And that's the, that's the game. Yeah. You mentioned Ukraine before, what have we learned from Ukraine? I, I remember I was talking to Robert Gates years ago, 2016 I think, and I was asking him, yeah, but don't we have the best cyber technology? Can't we attack? He said, we got the most to lose too. Yeah. And so what have we learned from, from Ukraine? >>Well, I, I think that's part of the key point there, right? Is you know, a great offense essentially can also be for us, you know, deterrent. So in that aspect we have as an, as a company and or excuse me, as a country, as a company as well, but then as partners throughout all parts of the world have really focused on increasing the intelligence sharing and specifically, you know, I mentioned Ukrainian cert. There are so many different agencies and other sorts throughout the world that are doing everything they can to share information to help protect human life there. And so what we've really been concerned with, with is, you know, what cyber warfare elements are going to be used there, not only how does that impact Ukraine, but how does it potentially spread out to other parts of the world critical infrastructure. So you've seen that, you know, I mentioned CS rrb, but cisa, right? >>CISA has done a tremendous job of continuously getting out information and doing everything they can to make sure that we are collaborating at a commercial level. You know, we are sharing information and intelligence more than ever before. So partners like Mania and CrowdStrike, our Intel teams are working together on a daily basis to make sure that we're able to protect not only our clients, but certainly if we've got any information relevant that we can share that as well. And I think if there's any silver lining to an otherwise very awful situation, I think the fact that is has accelerated intelligence sharing is really positive. >>I was gonna ask you about this cause I think, you know, 10 or so years ago, there was a lot of talk about that, but the industry, you know, kind of kept things to themselves, you know, a a actually tried to monetize some of that private data. So that's changing is what I'm hearing from you >>More so than ever more, you know, I've, I mentioned I've been in the field for 20 years. You know, it, it's tough when you have a commercial business that relies on, you know, information to, in order to pay people's salaries, right? I think that has changed quite a lot. We see the benefit of just that continuous sharing. There are, you know, so many more walls broken down between these commercial competitors, but also the work on the public private partnership side has really increased some of those relationships. Made it easier. And you know, I have to give a whole lot of credit and mention sisa, like the fact that during log four J, like they had GitHub repositories, they were using Slack, they were using Twitter. So the government has really started pushing forward with a lot of the newer leadership that's in place to say, Hey, we're gonna use tools and technology that works to share and disseminate information as quickly as we can. Right? That's fantastic. That's helping everybody. >>We knew that every industry, no, nobody's spared of this. But did you notice in the last couple of years, any industries in particular that are more vulnerable? Like I think of healthcare with personal health information or financial services, any industries kind of jump out as being more susceptible than others? >>So I think those two are always gonna be at the forefront, right? Financial services and healthcare. But what's been really top of mind is critical infrastructure, just making sure right? That our water, our power, our fuel, so many other parts of right, the ecosystem that go into making sure that, you know, we're keeping, you know, houses heated during the winter, for example, that people have fresh water. Those are extremely critical. And so that is really a massive area of focus for the industry right now. >>Can I come back to public-private partnerships? My question is relates to regulations because the public policy tends to be behind tech, the technology industry as an understatement. So when you take something like GDPR is the obvious example, but there are many, many others, data sovereignty, you can't move the data. Are are, are, is there tension between your desire as our desire as an industry to share data and government's desire to keep data private and restrict that data sharing? How is that playing out? How do you resolve that? >>Well I think there have been great strides right in each of those areas. So in terms of regulation when it comes to breaches there, you know, has been a tendency in the past to do victim shaming, right? And for organizations to not want to come forward because they're concerned about the monetary funds, right? I think there's been tremendous acceleration. You're seeing that everywhere from the fbi, from cisa, to really working very closely with organizations to, to have a true impact. So one example would be a ransomware attack that occurred. This was for a client of ours within the United States and we had a very close relationship with the FBI at that local field office and made a phone call. This was 7:00 AM Eastern time. And this was an organization that had this breach gone public, would've made worldwide news. There would've been a very big impact because it would've taken a lot of their systems offline. >>Within the 30 minutes that local FBI office was on site said, we just saw this piece of malware last week, we have a decryptor for it from another organization who shared it with us. Here you go. And within 60 minutes, every system was back up and running. Our teams were able to respond and get that disseminated quickly. So efforts like that, I think the government has made a tremendous amount of headway into improving relationships. Is there always gonna be some tension between, you know, competing, you know, organizations? Sure. But I think that we're doing a whole lot to progress it, >>But governments will make exceptions in that case. Especially for something as critical as the example that you just gave and be able to, you know, do a reach around, if you will, on, on onerous regulations that, that ne aren't helpful in that situation, but certainly do a lot of good in terms of protecting privacy. >>Well, and I think there used to be exceptions made typically only for national security elements, right? And now you're seeing that expanding much more so, which I think is also positive. Right. >>Last question for you as we are wrapping up time here. What can organizations really do to stay ahead of the curve when it comes to, to threat actors? We've got internal external threats. What can they really do to just be ahead of that curve? Is that possible? >>Well, it is now, it's not an easy task so I'm not gonna, you know, trivialize it. But I think that one, having relationships with right organizations in advance always a good thing. That's a, everything from certainly a commercial relationships, but also your peers, right? There's all kinds of fantastic industry spec specific information sharing organizations. I think the biggest thing that impacts is having education across your executive team and testing regularly, right? Having a plan in place, testing it. And it's not just the security pieces of it, right? As security responders, we live these attacks every day, but it's making sure that your general counsel and your head of operations and your CEO knows what to do. Your board of directors, do they know what to do when they receive a phone call from Bloomberg, for example? Are they supposed supposed to answer? Do your employees know that those kind of communications in advance and training can be really critical and make or break a difference in an attack. >>That's a great point about the testing but also the communication that it really needs to be company wide. Everyone at every level needs to know how to react. Wendy, it's been so great having, >>Wait one last question. Sure. Do you have a favorite superhero growing up? >>Ooh, it's gotta be Wonder Woman. Yeah, >>Yeah, okay. Yeah, so cuz I'm always curious, there's not a lot of women in, in security in cyber. How'd you get into it? And many cyber pros like wanna save the world? >>Yeah, no, that's a great question. So I joined the Air Force, you know, I, I was a special agent doing computer crime investigations and that was a great job. And I learned about that from, we had an alumni day and all these alumni came in from the university and they were in flight suits and combat gear. And there was one woman who had long blonde flowing hair and a black suit and high heels and she was carrying a gun. What did she do? Because that's what I wanted do. >>Awesome. Love it. We >>Blonde >>Wonder Woman. >>Exactly. Wonder Woman. Wendy, it's been so great having you on the program. We, we will definitely be following unit 42 and all the great stuff that you guys are doing. Keep up the good >>Work. Thanks so much Lisa. Thank >>You. Day our pleasure. For our guest and Dave Valante, I'm Lisa Martin, live in Las Vegas at MGM Grand for Palo Alto Ignite, 22. You're watching the Cube, the leader in live enterprise and emerging tech coverage.

from the cube studios in palo alto in boston bringing you data-driven insights from the cube and etr this is breaking analysis with dave vellante aws is pointing the way to a revolution in system architecture much in the same way that aws defined the cloud operating model last decade we believe it is once again leading in future systems design the secret sauce underpinning these innovations is specialized designs that break the stranglehold of inefficient and bloated centralized processing and allows aws to accommodate a diversity of workloads that span cloud data center as well as the near and far edge hello and welcome to this week's wikibon cube insights powered by etr in this breaking analysis we'll dig into the moves that aws has been making which we believe define the future of computing we'll also project what this means for customers partners and aws many competitors now let's take a look at aws's architectural journey the is revolution it started by giving easy access as we all know to virtual machines that could be deployed and decommissioned on demand amazon at the time used a highly customized version of zen that allowed multiple vms to run on one physical machine the hypervisor functions were controlled by x86 now according to werner vogels as much as 30 of the processing was wasted meaning it was supporting hypervisor functions and managing other parts of the system including the storage and networking these overheads led to aws developing custom asics that help to accelerate workloads now in 2013 aws began shipping custom chips and partnered with amd to announce ec2 c3 instances but as the as the aws cloud started to scale they really weren't satisfied with the performance gains that they were getting and they were hitting architectural barriers that prompted aws to start a partnership with anaperta labs this was back in 2014 and they launched then ec2 c4 instances in 2015. the asic in c4 optimized offload functions for storage and networking but still relied on intel xeon as the control point aws aws shelled out a reported 350 million dollars to acquire annapurna in 2015 which is a meager sum to acquire the secret sauce of its future system design this acquisition led to a modern version of project nitro in 2017 nitro nitro offload cards were first introduced in 2013 at this time aws introduced c5 instances and replaced zen with kvm and more tightly coupled the hypervisor with the asic vogels shared last year that this milestone offloaded the remaining components including the control plane the rest of the i o and enabled nearly a hundred percent of the processing to support customer workloads it also enabled a bare metal version of the compute that spawned the partnership the famous partnership with vmware to launch vmware cloud on aws then in 2018 aws took the next step and introduced graviton its custom designed arm-based chip this broke the dependency on x86 and launched a new era of architecture which now supports a wide variety of configurations to support data intensive workloads now these moves preceded other aws innovations including new chips optimized for machine learning and training and inferencing and all kinds of ai the bottom line is aws has architected an approach that offloaded the work currently done by the central processing unit in most general purpose workloads like in the data center it has set the stage in our view for the future allowing shared memory memory disaggregation and independent resources that can be configured to support workloads from the cloud all the way to the edge and nitro is the key to this architecture and to summarize aws nitro think of it as a set of custom hardware and software that runs on an arm-based platform from annapurna aws has moved the hypervisor the network the storage virtualization to dedicated hardware that frees up the cpu to run more efficiently this in our opinion is where the entire industry is headed so let's take a look at that this chart pulls data from the etr data set and lays out key players competing for the future of cloud data center and the edge now we've superimposed nvidia up top and intel they don't show up directly in the etr survey but they clearly are platform players in the mix we covered nvidia extensively in previous breaking analysis and won't go too deep there today but the data shows net scores on the vertical axis that's a measure of spending velocity and then it shows market share in the horizontal axis which is a measure of pervasiveness within the etr data set we're not going to dwell on the relative positions here rather let's comment on the players and start with aws we've laid out aws how they got here and we believe they are setting the direction for the future of the industry and aws is really pushing migration to its arm-based platforms pat morehead at the 6-5 summit spoke to dave brown who heads ec2 at aws and he talked extensively about migrating from x86 to aws's arm-based graviton 2. and he announced a new developer challenge to accelerate that migration to arm instances graviton instances and the end game for customers is a 40 better price performance so a customer running 100 server instances can do the same work with 60 servers now there's some work involved but for the by the customers to actually get there but the payoff if they can get 40 improvement in price performance is quite large imagine this aws currently offers 400 different ec2 instances last year as we reported sorry last year as we reported earlier this year nearly 50 percent of the new ec2 instances so nearly 50 percent of the new ec2 instances shipped in 2020 were arm based and aws is working hard to accelerate this pace it's very clear now let's talk about intel i'll just say it intel is finally responding in earnest and basically it's taking a page out of arm's playbook we're going to dig into that a bit today in 2015 intel paid 16.7 billion dollars for altera a maker of fpgas now also at the 6.5 summit nevin shenoy of intel presented details of what intel is calling an ipu it's infrastructure processing unit this is a departure from intel norms where everything is controlled by a central processing unit ipu's are essentially smart knicks as our dpus so don't get caught up in all the acronym soup as we've reported it's all about offloading work and disaggregating memory and evolving socs system-on-chip and sops system on package but just let this sink in a bit a bit for a moment intel's moves this past week it seems to us anyway are designed to create a platform that is nitro like and the basis of that platform is a 16.7 billion dollar acquisition just compare that to aws's 350 million dollar tuck-in of annapurna that is incredible now chenoy said in his presentation rough quote we've already deployed ipu's using fpgas in a in very high volume at microsoft azure and we've recently announced partnerships with baidu jd cloud and vmware so let's look at vmware vmware is the other you know really big platform player in this race in 2020 vmware announced project monterrey you might recall that it's based on the aforementioned fpgas from intel so vmware is in the mix and it chose to work with intel most likely for a variety of reasons one of the obvious ones is all the software that's running on on on vmware it's been built for x86 and there's a huge install base there the other is pat was heading vmware at the time and and you know when project monterey was conceived so i'll let you connect the dots if you like regardless vmware has a nitro like offering in our view its optionality however is limited by intel but at least it's in the game and appears to be ahead of the competition in this space aws notwithstanding because aws is clearly in the lead now what about microsoft and google suffice it to say that we strongly believe that despite the comments that intel made about shipping fpgas and volume to microsoft that both microsoft and google as well as alibaba will follow aws's lead and develop an arm-based platform like nitro we think they have to in order to keep pace with aws now what about the rest of the data center pack well dell has vmware so despite the split we don't expect any real changes there dell is going to leverage whatever vmware does and do it better than anyone else cisco is interesting in that it just revamped its ucs but we don't see any evidence that it has a nitro like plans in its roadmap same with hpe now both of these companies have history and capabilities around silicon cisco designs its own chips today for carrier class use cases and and hpe as we've reported probably has some remnants of the machine hanging around but both companies are very likely in our view to follow vmware's lead and go with an intel based design what about ibm well we really don't know we think the best thing ibm could do would be to move the ibm cloud of course to an arm-based nitro-like platform we think even the mainframe should move to arm as well i mean it's just too expensive to build a specialized mainframe cpu these days now oracle they're interesting if we were running oracle we would build an arm-based nitro-like database cloud where oracle the database runs cheaper faster and consumes less energy than any other platform that would would dare to run oracle and we'd go one step further and we would optimize for competitive databases in the oracle cloud so we would make oci run the table on all databases and be essentially the database cloud but you know back to sort of fpgas we're not overly excited about about the market amd is acquiring xi links for 35 billion dollars so i guess that's something to get excited about i guess but at least amd is using its inflated stock price to do the deal but we honestly we think that the arm ecosystem will will obliterate the fpga market by making it simpler and faster to move to soc with far better performance flexibility integration and mobility so again we're not too sanguine about intel's acquisition of altera and the moves that amd is making in in the long term now let's take a deeper look at intel's vision of the data center of the future here's a chart that intel showed depicting its vision of the future of the data center what you see is the ipu's which are intelligent nixed and they're embedded in the four blocks shown and they're communicating across a fabric now you have general purpose compute in the upper left and machine intelligent on the bottom left machine intelligence apps and up in the top right you see storage services and then the bottom right variation of alternative processors and this is intel's view of how to share resources and go from a world where everything is controlled by a central processing unit to a more independent set of resources that can work in parallel now gelsinger has talked about all the cool tech that this will allow intel to incorporate including pci and gen 5 and cxl memory interfaces and or cxl memory which are interfaces that enable memory sharing and disaggregation and 5g and 6g connectivity and so forth so that's intel's view of the future of the data center let's look at arm's vision of the future and compare them now there are definite similarities as you can see especially on the right hand side of this chart you've got the blocks of different process processor types these of course are programmable and you notice the high bandwidth memory the hbm3 plus the ddrs on the two sides kind of bookending the blocks that's shared across the entire system and it's connected by pcie gen 5 cxl or ccix multi-die socket so you know you may be looking to say okay two sets of block diagrams big deal well while there are similarities around disaggregation and i guess implied shared memory in the intel diagram and of course the use of advanced standards there are also some notable differences in particular arm is really already at the soc level whereas intel is talking about fpgas neoverse arms architecture is shipping in test mode and we'll have end market product by year end 2022 intel is talking about maybe 2024 we think that's aspirational or 2025 at best arm's road map is much more clear now intel said it will release more details in october so we'll pay attention then maybe we'll recalibrate at that point but it's clear to us that arm is way further along now the other major difference is volume intel is coming at this from a high data center perspective and you know presumably plans to push down market or out to the edge arm is coming at this from the edge low cost low power superior price performance arm is winning at the edge and based on the data that we shared earlier from aws it's clearly gaining ground in the enterprise history strongly suggests that the volume approach will win not only at the low end but eventually at the high end so we want to wrap by looking at what this means for customers and the partner ecosystem the first point we'd like to make is follow the consumer apps this capability the capabilities that we see in consumer apps like image processing and natural language processing and facial recognition and voice translation these inference capabilities that are going on today in mobile will find their way into the enterprise ecosystem ninety percent of the cost associated with machine learning in the cloud is around inference in the future most ai in the enterprise and most certainly at the edge will be inference it's not today because it's too expensive this is why aws is building custom chips for inferencing to drive costs down so it can increase adoption now the second point is we think that customers should start experimenting and see what you can do with arm-based platforms moore's law is accelerating at least the outcome of moore's law the doubling of performance every of the 18 to 24 months it's it's actually much higher than that now when you add up all the different components in these alternative processors just take a look at apple's a5 a15 chip and arm is in the lead in terms of performance price performance cost and energy consumption by moving some workloads onto graviton for example you'll see what types of cost savings you can drive for which applications and possibly generate new applications that you can deliver to your business put a couple engineers in the task and see what they can do in two or three weeks you might be surprised or you might say hey it's too early for us but you'll find out and you may strike gold we would suggest that you talk to your hybrid cloud provider as well and find out if they have a nitro we shared that vmware they've got a clear path as does dell because they're you know vmware cousins what about your other strategic suppliers what's their roadmap what's the time frame to move from where they are today to something that resembles nitro do they even think about that how do they think about that do they think it's important to get there so if if so or if not how are they thinking about reducing your costs and supporting your new workloads at scale now for isvs these consumer capabilities that we discussed earlier all these mobile and and automated systems and cars and and things like that biometrics another example they're going to find their way into your software and your competitors are porting to arm they're embedding these consumer-like capabilities into their apps are you we would strongly recommend that you take a look at that talk to your cloud suppliers and see what they can do to help you innovate run faster and cut costs okay that's it for now thanks to my collaborator david floyer who's been on this topic since early last decade thanks to the community for your comments and insights and hey thanks to patrick morehead and daniel newman for some timely interviews from your event nice job fellas remember i published each week on wikibon.com and siliconangle.com these episodes are all available as podcasts just search for breaking analysis podcasts you can always connect with me on twitter at d vallante or email me at david.velante at siliconangle.com i appreciate the comments on linkedin and clubhouse so follow us if you see us in a room jump in and let's riff on these topics and don't forget to check out etr.plus for all the survey data this is dave vellante for the cube insights powered by etr be well and we'll see you next time

>> Jeff: Hello everybody, and thank you for joining us today for the virtual Vertica BDC 2020. Today's break-out session has been titled, "Migrating Your Vertica Cluster to the Cloud." I'm Jeff Healey, and I'm in Vertica marketing. I'll be your host for this break-out session. Joining me here are Sumeet Keswani and Chris Daly, Vertica product technology engineers and key members of our customer success team. Before we begin, I encourage you to submit questions and comments during the virtual session. You don't have to wait, just type your question or comment in the question box below the slides and click Submit. As always, there will be a Q&A session at the end of the presentation. We'll answer as many questions as we're able to during that time. Any questions that we don't address, we'll do our best to answer them offline. And alternatively, you can visit Vertica forums at forum.vertica.com to post your questions there after the session. Our engineering team is planning to join the forums to keep the conversation going. Also as a reminder that you can maximize your screen by clicking the double arrow button in the lower right corner of the slides. And yes, this virtual session is being recorded and will be available to view on demand this week. We'll send you a notification as soon as it's ready. Now let's get started. Over to you, Sumeet. >> Sumeet: Thank you, Jeff. Hello everyone, my name is Sumeet Keswani, and I will be talking about planning to deploy or migrate your Vertica cluster to the Cloud. So you may be moving an on-prem cluster or setting up a new cluster in the Cloud. And there are several design and operational considerations that will come into play. You know, some of these are cost, which industry you are in, or which expertise you have, in which Cloud platform. And there may be a personal preference too. After that, you know, there will be some operational considerations like VM and cluster sizing, what Vertica mode you want to deploy, Eon or Enterprise. It depends on your use keys. What are the DevOps skills available, you know, what elasticity, separation you need, you know, what is your backup and DR strategy, what do you want in terms of high availability. And you will have to think about, you know, how much data you have and where it's going to live. And in order to understand the cost, or the cost and the benefit of deployment and you will have to understand the access patterns, and how you are moving data from and to the Cloud. So things to consider before you move a deployment, a Vertica deployment to the Cloud, right, is one thing to keep in mind is, virtual CPUs, or CPUs in the Cloud, are not the same as the usual CPUs that you've been familiar with in your data center. A vCPU is half of a CPU because of hyperthreading. There is definitely the noisy neighbor effect. There is, depending on what other things are hosted in the Cloud environment, you may see performance, you may occasionally see performance issues. There are I/O limitations on the instance that you provision, so that what that really means is you can't always scale up. You might have to scale up, basically, you have to add more instances rather than getting bigger or the right size instances. Finally, there is an important distinction here. Virtualization is not free. There can be significant overhead to virtualization. It could be as much as 30%, so when you size and scale your clusters, you must keep that in mind. Now the other important aspect is, you know, where you put Vertica cluster is important. The choice of the region, how far it is from your various office locations. Where will the data live with respect to the cluster. And remember, popular locations can fill up. So if you want to scale out, additional capacity may or may not be available. So these are things you have to keep in mind when picking or choosing your Cloud platform and your deployment. So at this point, I want to make a plug for Eon mode. Eon mode is the latest mode, is a Cloud mode from Vertica. It has been designed with Cloud economics in mind. It uses shared storage, which is durable, available, and very cheap, like S3 storage or Google Cloud storage. It has been designed for quick scaling, like scale out, and highly elastic deployments. It has also been designed for high workload isolation, where each application or user group can be isolated from the other ones, so that they'll be paid and monitored separately, without affecting each other. But there are some disadvantages, or perhaps, you know, there's a cost for using Eon mode. Storage in S3 is neither cheap nor efficient. So there is a high latency of I/O when accessing data from S3. There is API and data access cost. There is API and data access cost associated with accessing your data in S3. Vertica in Eon mode has a pay as you go model, which you know, works for some people and does not work for others. And so therefore it is important to keep that in mind. And performance can be a little bit variable here, because it depends on cache, it depends on the local depot, which is a cache, and it is not as predictable as EE mode, so that's another trade-off. So let's spend about a minute and see how a Vertica cluster in Eon mode looks like. A Vertica cluster in Eon mode has S3 as the durability layer where all the data sits. There are subclusters, which are essentially just aggregation groups, which is separated compute, which will service different workloads. So for in this example, you may have two subclusters, one servicing ETL workload and the other one servicing (mic interference obscures speaking). These clusters are isolated, and they do not affect each other's performance. This allows you to scale them independently and isolate workloads. So this is the new Vertica Eon mode which has been specifically designed by us for use in the Cloud. But beyond this, you can use EE mode or Eon mode in the Cloud, it really depends on what your use case is. But both of these are possible, and we highly recommend Eon mode wherever possible. Okay, let's talk a little bit about what we mean by Vertica support in the Cloud. Now as you know, a Cloud is a shared data center, right. Performance in the Cloud can vary. It can vary between regions, availability zones, time of the day, choice of instance type, what concurrency you use, and of course the noisy neighbor effect. You know, we in Vertica, we performance, load, and stress test our product before every release. We have a bunch of use cases, we go through all of them, make sure that we haven't, you know, regressed any performance, and make sure that it works up to standards and gives you the high performance that you've come to expect. However, your solution or your workload is unique to you, and it is still your responsibility to make sure that it is tuned appropriately. To do this, one of the easiest things you can do is you know, pick a tested operating system, allocate the virtual machine, you know, with enough resources. It's something that we recommend, because we have tested it thoroughly. It goes a long way in giving you predictability. So after this I would like to now go into the various platforms, Cloud platforms, that Vertica has worked on. And I'll start with AWS, and my colleague Chris will speak about Azure and GCP. And our thoughts forward. So without further ado, let's start with the Amazon Web Services platform. So this is Vertica running on the Amazon Web Services platform. So as you probably are all aware, Amazon Web Services is the market leader in this space, and indeed really our biggest provider by far, and have been here for a very long time. And Vertica has a deep integration in the Amazon Web Services space. We provide a marketplace offering which has both pay as you go or a bring your own license model. We have many, you know, knowledge base articles, best practices, scripts, and resources that help you configure and use a Vertica database in the Cloud. We have several customers in the Cloud for many, many years now, and we have managed and console-based point and click deployments, you know, for ease of use in the Cloud. So Vertica has a deep integration in the Amazon space, and has been there for quite a bit now. So we communicate a lot of experience here. So let's talk about sizing on AWS. And sizing on any platform comes down to you know, these four or five different things. It comes down to picking the right instance type, picking the right disk volume and type, tuning and optimizing your networking, and finally, you know, some operational concerns like security, maintainability, and backup. So let's go into each one of these on the AWS ecosystem. So the choice of instance type is one of the important choices that you will make. In Eon mode, you know, you don't really need persistent disk. You can, you should probably choose ephemeral disk because it gives you extra speed, and speed with the instance type. We highly recommend the i3.4x instance types, which are very economical, have a big, 4 terabyte depot or cache per node. The i3.metal is similar to the i3.4, but has got significantly better performance, for those subclusters that need this extra oomph. The i3.2 is good for scale out of small ad hoc clusters. You know, they have a smaller cache and lower performance but it's cheap enough to use very indiscriminately. If you were in EE mode, well we don't use S3 as the layer of durability. Your local volumes is where we persist the data. Hence you do need an EBS volume in EE mode. In order to make sure that, you know, that the instance or the deployment is manageable, you might have to use some sort of a software RAID array over the EBS volumes. The most common instance type you see in EE mode is the r4.4x, the c4, or the m4 instance types. And then of course for temp space and depot we always recommend instance volumes. They're just much faster. Okay. So let's go, let's talk about optimizing your network or tuning your network. So the best, the best thing you can do about tuning your network, especially in Eon mode but in other modes too, is to get a VPC S3 endpoint. This is essentially a route table that makes sure that all traffic between your cluster and S3 goes over an internal fabric. This makes it much faster, you don't pay for egress cost, especially if you're doing external tables or your communal storage, but you do need to create it. Many times people will forget doing it. So you really do have to create it. And best of all, it's free. It doesn't cost you anything extra. You just have to create it during cluster creation time, and there's a significant performance difference for using it. The next thing about tuning your network is, you know, sizing it correctly. Pick the closest geographical region to where you'll consume the data. Pick the right availability zone. We highly recommend using cluster placement groups. In fact, they are required for the stability of the cluster. A cluster placement group is essentially, it operates this notion of rack. Nodes in a cluster placement group, are, you know, physically closer to each other than they would otherwise be. And this allows, you know, a 10 Gbps, bidirectional, TCP/IP flow between the nodes. And this makes sure that, you know, you get a high amount of Gbps per second. As you probably are all aware, the Cloud does not support broadcast or UDP broadcast. Hence you must use point-to-point UDP for spread in the Cloud, or in AWS. Beyond that, you know, point-to-point UDP does not scale very well beyond 20 nodes. So you know, as your cluster sizes increase, you must switch over to large cluster mode. And finally, use instances with enhanced networking or SR-IOV support. Again, it's free, it comes with the choice of the instance type and the operating system. We highly recommend it, it makes a big difference in terms of how your workload will perform. So let's talk a little bit about security, configuration, and orchestration. As I said, we provide CloudFormation scripts to make the ease of deployment. You can use the MC point and click. With regard to security, you know, Vertica does support instance profiles out of the box in Amazon. We recommend you use it. This is highly desirable so that you're not passing access keys and secret keys around. If you use our marketplace image, we have picked the latest operating systems, we have patched them, Amazon actually validates everything on marketplace and scans them for security vulnerabilities. So you get that for free. We do some basic configuration, like we disable root ssh access, we disallow any password access, we turn on encryption. And we run a basic set of security checks to make sure that the image is secure. Of course, it could be made more secure. But we try to balance out security, performance, and convenience. And finally, let's talk about backups. Especially in Eon mode I get the question, "Do we really need to back up our system, "since the data is in S3?" And the answer is yes, you do. Because you know, S3's not going to protect you against an accidental drop table. You know, S3 has a finite amount of reliability, durability, and availability. And you may want to be able to restore data differently. Also, backups are important if you're doing DR, or if you have additional cluster in a different region. The other cluster can be considered a backup. And finally, you know, why not create a backup or a disaster recovery cluster, you know, storage is cheap in the Cloud. So you know, we highly recommend you use it. So with this, I would like to hand it over to my colleague Christopher Daly, who will talk about the other two platforms that we support, that is Google and Azure. Over to you, Chris, thank you. >> Chris: Thanks, Sumeet, and hi everyone. So while there's no argument that we here at Vertica have a long history of running within the Amazon Web Services space, there are other alternative Cloud service providers where we do have a presence, such as Google Cloud Platform, or GCP. For those of you who are unfamiliar with GCP, it's considered the third-largest Cloud service provider in the marketspace, and it's priced very competitively to its peers. Has a lot of similarities to AWS in the products and services that it offers, but it tends to be the go-to place for newer businesses or startups. We officially started supporting GCP a little over a year ago with our first entry into their GCP marketplace. So a solution that deployed a fully-functional and ready-to-use Enterprise mode cluster. We followed up on that with the release and the support of Google storage buckets, and now I'm extremely pleased to announce that with the launch of Vertica 10, we're officially supporting Eon mode architecture in GCP as well. But that's not all, as we're adding additional offerings into the GCP marketplace. With the launch of version 10 we'll be introducing a second listing in the marketplace that allows for the deployment of an Eon mode cluster. It's all being driven by our own management consult. This will allow customers to quickly spin up Eon-based clusters within the GCP space. And if that wasn't enough, I'm also pleased to tell you that very soon after the launch we're going to be offering Vertica by the hour in GCP as well. And while we've done a lot to automate the solutions coming out of the marketplace, we recognize the simple fact that for a lot of you, building your cluster manually is really the only option. So with that in mind, let's talk about the things you need to understand in GCP to get that done. So wag me if you think this slide looks familiar. Well nope, it's not an erroneous duplicate slide from Sumeet's AWS section, it's merely an acknowledgement of all the things you need to consider for running Vertica in the Cloud. In Vertica, the choice of the operational mode will dictate some of the choices you'll need to make in the infrastructure, particularly around storage. Just like on-prem solutions, you'll need to understand the disk and networking capacities to get the most out of your cluster. And one of the most attractive things in GCP is the pricing, as it tends to run a little less than the others. But it does translate into less choices and options within the environment. If nothing else, I want you to take one thing away from this slide, and Sumeet said this earlier. VMs running, about AWS, Sumeet said this about AWS earlier. VMs running in the GCP space run on top of hardware that has hyperthreading enabled. And that a vCPU doesn't equate to a core, but rather a processing thread. This becomes particularly important if you're moving from an on-prem environment into the Cloud. Because a physical Vertica node with 32 cores is not the same thing as a VM with 32 vCPUs. In fact, with 32 vCPUs, you're only getting about 16 cores worth of performance. GCP does offer a handful of VM types, which they categorize by letter, but for us, most of these don't make great choices for Vertica nodes. The M series, however, does offer a good core to memory ratio, especially when you're looking at the high-mem variants. Also keep in mind, performance in I/O, such as network and disk, are partially dependent on the VM size, so customers in GCP space should be focusing on 16 vCPU VMs and above for their Vertica nodes. Disk options in GCP can be broken down into two basic types, persistent disks and local disks, which are ephemeral. Persistent disks come in two forms, standard or SSD. For Vertica in Eon mode, we recommend that customers use persistent SSD disks for the catalog, and either local SSD disks or persistent SSD disks for the depot and the temp space. Couple of things to think about here, though. Persistent disks are provisioned as a single device with a settable size. Local disks are provisioned as multiple disk devices with a fixed size, requiring you to use some kind of software RAIDing to create a single storage device. So while local SSD disks provide much more throughput, you're using CPU resources to maintain that RAID set. So you're giving, it's a little bit of a trade-off. Persistent disks offer redundancy, either within the zone that they exist or within the region, and if you're selecting regional redundancy, the disks are replicated across multiple zones in the region. This does have an effect in the performance to VM, so we don't recommend this. What we do recommend is the zonal redundancy when you're using persistent disks, as it gives you that redundancy level without actually affecting the performance. Remember also, in the Cloud space, all I/O is network I/O, as disks are basically block storage devices. This means that disk actions can and will slow down network traffic. And finally, the storage bucket access in GCP is based on GCP interoperability mode, which means that it's basically compliant with the AWS S3 API. In interoperability mode, access to the bucket is granted by a key pair that GCP refers to as HMAC keys. HMAC keys can be generated for individual users or for service accounts. We will recommend that when you're creating HMAC keys, choose a service account to ensure that the keys are not tied to a single employee. When thinking about storage for Enterprise mode, things change a little bit. We still recommend persistent SSD disks over standard ones. However, the use of local SSD disks for anything other than temp space is highly discouraged. I said it before, local SSD disks are ephemeral, meaning that the data's lost if the machine is turned off or goes down. So not really a place you want to store your data. In GCP, multiple persistent disks placed into a software RAID set does not create more throughput like you can find in other Clouds. The I/O saturation usually hits the VM limit long before it hits the disk limit. In fact, performance of a persistent disk is determined not just by the size of the disk but also by the size of the VM. So a good rule of thumb in GCP is to maximize your I/O throughput for persistent disks, is that the size tends to max out at two terabytes for SSDs and 10 terabytes for standard disks. Network performance in GCP can be thought of in two distinct ways. There's node-to-node traffic, and then there's egress traffic. Node-to-node performance in GCP is really good within the zone, with typical traffic between nodes falling in the 10-15 gigabits per second range. This might vary a little from zone to zone and region to region, but usually it's only limited, they're only limited by the existing traffic where the VMs exist. So kind of a noisy neighbor effect. Egress traffic from a VM, however, is subject to throughput caps, and these are based on the size of the VM. So the speed is set for the number of vCPUs in the VM at two gigabits per second per vCPU, and tops out at 32 gigabits per second. So the larger the VM, the more vCPUs you get, the larger the cap. So some things to consider in the NAV ring space for your Vertica cluster, pick a region that's physically close to you, even if you're connecting to the GCP network from a corporate LAN as opposed to the internet. The further the packets have to travel, the longer it's going to take. Also, GCP, like most Clouds, doesn't support UDP broadcast traffic on their virtual NAV ring, so you do have to use the point-to-point flag for spread when you're creating your cluster. And since the network cap on VMs is set at 32 gigabits per second per VM, maximize your network egress throughput and don't use VMs that are smaller than 16 vCPUs for your Vertica nodes. And that gets us to the one question I get asked the most often. How do I get my data into and out of the Cloud? Well, GCP offers many different methods to support different speeds and different price points for data ingress and egress. There's the obvious one, right, across the internet either directly to the VMs or into the storage bucket. Or you can, you know, light up a VPN tunnel to encrypt all that traffic. But additionally, GCP offers direct network interconnect from your corporate network. These get provided either by Google or by a partner, and they vary in speed. They also offer things called direct or carrier peering, which is connecting the edges of the networks between your network and GCP, and you can use a CDN interconnect, which creates, I believe, an on-demand connection from the GCP network, your network to the GCP network provided by a large host of CDN service providers. So GCP offers a lot of ways to move your data around in and out of the GCP Cloud. It's really a matter of what price point works for you, and what technology your corporation is looking to use. So we've talked about AWS, we've talked about GCP, it really only leaves one more Cloud. So last, and by far not the least, there's the Microsoft Azure environment. Holding on strong to the number two place in the major Cloud providers, Azure offers a very robust Cloud offering that's attractive to customers that already consume services from Microsoft. But what you need to keep in mind is that the underlying foundation of their Cloud is based on the Microsoft Windows products. And this makes their Cloud offering a little bit different in the services and offerings that they have. The good news here, though, is that Microsoft has done a very good job of getting their virtualization drivers baked into the modern kernels of most Linux operating systems, making running Linux-based VMs in Azure fairly seamless. So here's the slide again, but now you're going to notice some slight differences. First off, in Azure we only support Enterprise mode. This is because the Azure storage product is very different from Google Cloud storage and S3 on AWS. So while we're working on getting this supported, and we're starting to focus on this, we're just not there yet. This means that since we're only supporting Enterprise mode in Azure, getting the local disk performance right is one of the keys to success of running Vertica here, with the other major key being making sure that you're getting the appropriate networking speeds. Overall, Azure's a really good platform for Vertica, and its performance and pricing are very much on par with AWS. But keep in mind that the newer versions of the Linux operating systems like RHEL and CentOS run much better here than the older versions. Okay, so first things first again, just like GCP, in Azure VMs are running on top of hardware that has hyperthreading enabled. And because of the way Hyper-V, Azure's virtualization engine works, you can actually see this, right? So if you look down into the CPU information of the VM, you'll actually see how it groups the vCPUs by core and by thread. Azure offers a lot of VM types, and is adding new ones all the time. But for us, we see three VM types that make the most sense for Vertica. For customers that are looking to run production workloads in Azure, the Es_v3 and the Ls_v2 series are the two main recommendations. While they differ slightly in the CPU to memory ratio and the I/O throughput, the Es_v3 series is probably the best recommendation for a generalized Vertica node, with the Ls_v2 series being recommended for workloads with higher I/O requirements. If you're just looking to deploy a sandbox environment, the Ds_v3 series is a very suitable choice that really can reduce your overall Cloud spend. VM storage in Azure is provided by a grouping of four different types of disks, all offering different levels of performance. Introduced at the end of last year, the Ultra Disk option is the highest-performing disk type for VMs in Azure. It was designed for database workloads where high throughput and low latency is very desirable. However, the Ultra Disk option is not available in all regions yet, although that's been changing slowly since their launch. The Premium SSD option, which has been around for a while and is widely available, can also offer really nice performance, especially higher capacities. And just like other Cloud providers, the I/O throughput you get on VMs is dictated not only by the size of the disk, but also by the size of the VM and its type. So a good rule of thumb here, VM types with an S will have a much better throughput rate than ones that don't, meaning, and the larger VMs will have, you know, higher I/O throughput than the smaller ones. You can expand the VM disk throughput by using multiple disks in Azure and using a software RAID. This overcomes limitations of single disk performance, but keep in mind, you're now using CPU cycles to maintain that raid, so it is a bit of a trade-off. The other nice thing in Azure is that all their managed disks are encrypted by default on the server side, so there's really nothing you need to do here to enable that. And of course I mentioned this earlier. There is no native access to Azure storage yet, but it is something we're working on. We have seen folks using third-party applications like MinIO to access Azure's storage as an S3 bucket. So it might be something you want to keep in mind and maybe even test out for yourself. Networking in Azure comes in two different flavors, standard and accelerated. In standard networking, the entire network stack is abstracted and virtualized. So this works really well, however, there are performance limitations. Standard networking tends to top out around four gigabits per second. Accelerated networking in Azure is based on single root I/O virtualization of the Mellanox adapter. This is basically the VM talking directly to the physical network card in the host hardware, and it can produce network speeds up to 20 gigabits per second, so much, much faster. Keep in mind, though, that not all VM types and operating systems actually support accelerated networking, and you know, just like disk throughput, network throughput is based on VM type and size. So what do you need to think about for networking in the Azure space? Again, stay close to home. Pick regions that are geographically close to your location. Yes, the backbones between the regions are very, very fast, but the more hops your packets have to make, the longer it takes. Azure offers two types of groupings of their VMs, availability sets and availability zones. Availability zones offer good redundancy across multiple zones, but this actually increases the node-to-node latency, so we recommend you avoid this. Availability sets, on the other hand, keep all your VMs grouped together within a single zone, but makes sure that no two VMs are running on the same host hardware, for redundancy. And just like the other Clouds, UDP broadcast is not supported. So you have to use the point-to-point flag when you're creating your database to ensure that the spread works properly. Spread time out, okay, this is a good one. So recently, Microsoft has started monthly rolling updates of their environment. What this looks like is VMs running on top of hardware that's receiving an update can be paused. And this becomes problematic when the pausing of the VM exceeds eight seconds, as the unpaused members of the cluster now think the paused VM is down. So consider adjusting the spread time out for your clusters in Azure to 30 seconds, and this will help avoid a little of that. If you're deploying a large cluster in Azure, more than 20 nodes, use large closer mode, as point-to-point for spread doesn't really scale well with a lot of Vertica nodes. And finally, you know, pick VM types and operating systems that support accelerated networking. The difference in the node-to-node speeds can be very dramatic. So how do we move data around in Azure, right? So Microsoft views data egress a little differently than other Clouds, as it classifies any data being transmitted by a VM as egress. However, it only bills for data egress that actually leaves the Azure environment. Egress speed limits in Azure are based entirely on the VM type and size, and then they're limited by your connection to them. While not offering as many pathways to access their Cloud as GCP, Azure does offer a direct network-to-network connection called ExpressRoute. Offered by a large group of third-party processors, partners, the ExpressRoute offers multiple tiers of performance that are based on a flat charge for inbound data and a metered charge for outbound data. And of course you can still access these via the internet, and securely through a VPN gateway. So on behalf of Jeff, Sumeet, and myself, I'd like to thank you for listening to our presentation today, and we're now ready for Q&A.

from the Hard Rock Hotel in Las Vegas it's the cube recovering no joke on 2018 brought to you by Osho okay welcome back everyone we're here live here at hosts show con in Las Vegas the first security conference for blockchain its inaugural event and we're here with Gabriel Shepherd VP of strategy at Global Strike for host show they're the hosts of the event although it's an industry conference for the entire community all coming together Gabriel thanks for coming on and spend the time yeah thanks for having me thanks for you know supporting the event and we appreciate your team coming out and covering what we're trying to build here well we think it's super important now so you guys are doing a great service for the industry and stepping up and put in the event together and so props to you guys thank you this is not a hosts show sales like conference you guys aren't selling anything you're doing the service for the community so props to you guys in the team great stuff and we know this is a kernel of all the smartest people and its really an industry event so it shows in the session so appreciate that yes we think it's important because you know we see a lot of trends the queue has a unique advantage in how we cover hundreds of events and yeah so we get to go we see a horizontal observation space from the industry and when you have formation like this with the community this is important you guys have up leveled the conversation focused the conversation around blockchain where security is the top-level conversation that's it no I feel pitches right so for the folks watch and this is really one of those events where it's not a huge number of people here like the thousands and thousands of other blockchain shows that make money off events this is about community and around getting the conversations and having substantive conversations so great job so for the folks watching the content agenda is super awesome host show con-com you go browse it but give us some color commentary on some of the types of speakers here the diversity yeah I think I think the first thing that we wanted to accomplish was with Hojo Khan was we we wanted to put front and center the conversations that were not taking place at other events there are plenty of platforms and opportunities for companies early-stage companies to go pitch there are other great conference organizers that do events and have their own wheelhouse but what we wanted to do was put together a conference that was focused around a type of conference that we ourselves would want to attend as a cybersecurity firm and you know after traveling the world I mean you know you you and artesia spoke many times and hosho has sponsored quite a few events around the world after attending by the end of 2018 will attended something like a hundred plus events in some capacity and so it was clear to us early on that companies weren't our conferences weren't going to focus on security or at least put them on the main stage where I believed that they should be at least with all the hacks happening so what we wanted to do was bring together thought leadership with respect to security technical leadership with respect to developers and security engineers and we wanted to bridge those two what I mean by that is we wanted thought leadership that could get executives to start the non-technical people so start thinking about security in the larger format and how it's applicable to their company but what we also wanted to do is we wanted to connect these non-technical people with the technical people in an intimate setting where they could learn think about the brain power that we have in this hotel for hosho Khan you've got the minds of Andre Assante innopolis Diego's LDR of RSK Michael berkland of shape-shift josub Kuan of hosho we've got Ron stone from c4 you've got an on Prakash a world-class white hat bug bounty hunter consider what he's top-5 bug bounty hunter for our top top bug bounty hunter for Facebook five years in a row the the level of the calibre of technical talent in this building has the potential to solve problems that Enterprise has been trying to solve individually for years but those conversations don't take place in earnest with the non-technical people and so the idea behind hoshikawa was to bridge those to provide education that's what we're doing things like workshops sure we have keynotes and panels but we also have the ability to teach non-technical people how to enable two-factor authentication how to set up PGP for your email how to set up your hardware wallet these things aren't these conversations are not the bridge is a clearly established we interview people from on the compliance side all the way down to custodial services which again the diversity is not a group think events just giving them more props here because I think you guys did a great job worthy of promotion because you not only bridge the communities together you're bringing people in cross functionally colonizing and the asset test for me is simple the groupthink event is when everyone's kind of rah rah each other I know this conditions we got Andre is saying hey if you put database substitute database for blockchain and it reads well it's not a real revolutionary thing and oh all you custodian services you're screwed I mean so you have perspectives on both side that's right and there's contentious conversation that's right and that to me proves it and as well as the sessions are highly attended or we don't want it we don't want a panel of everybody in agreeance because we know that's not reality i mean that you you bring up the issue of curse of custody a prime example is we had a great talk a four-person panel led by Joe Kelly who's the CEO of Unchained Capital he had a panel with traditional equities custodian Paul pooi from edge wallet Joseph Kwon is the CEO of hosho and there was clear differences of opinion with respect to custody and it got a little contentious but isn't that the point yeah it's to have these conversations in earnest and let's put them out in the public on what's right and what's wrong for the community and let the community to decide the best way forward that's the best is exactly what you want to do I gotta ask you what are the big surprises for you what have you learned what's the big reveal for you that you've super surprised you or are things you expected what were some of the things that went on here yeah I think the biggest surprise to me was the positive feedback that we received you know I understand that we know people maybe looked at how shock on year one and said hosho like they're a cybersecurity firm what are they doing running a conference right but my background is a you know I've produced conferences I have a former employee of South by Southwest I believe a big an experience and so when we started to put this together we thought we knew we would make mistakes and we certainly made mistakes with respect to programming and schedule and just things that we had didn't think about attention to detail but we had plans far in that the mistakes were mitigated that they weren't exposed to the public right there behind the scenes fires that kind like a wedding or a party but no one actually really notices sure we put them out behind the scenes nobody that the our guests don't notice and that was my biggest concern I'm pleasantly surprised at the positive feedback we've yet to get any negative feedback publicly on Twitter telegram anecdotally individually people now they made just being nice to my face but I feel good about what the response that we've got it's been good vibes here so I gotta ask you well sure the DJ's were great last night good experience yeah experience and knowledge and and networking has been a theme to correct I lost him the networking dynamics I saw a lot of people I had I had ran to some people I met for the first time we've had great outreach that with the queue was integrated in people very friendly talked about the networking and that's been going on here yeah I mean this panels are great I'd love to hear from from panels and solo presentations but a lot of work gets done in the hallways and we have a saying in the conference business hallway hustlers right the ones that are hustling in the hallways are those early stage entrepreneurs or trying to close deals trying to figure out how to get in front of the right person serendipitously are at the bar at the same time as somebody they want to meet that is to me conference 101 that is the stuff I grew up on and so we wanted to make sure that we were encouraging those interactions through traffic flow so you'll notice that they're strategically the content rooms are strategically placed so that when you're changing rooms people are forced to cross interact with each other because they're forced to bump into each other and if you look at the programming we purposefully to our demise to be honest year one put a lot of programming that was conflicted with each other we made people make a decision about what talk they wanted to go to because there were two really compelling people at the same time or 10 minutes off yeah and so you had to make a decision vote with your feet you got to vote with your feet and and and from a conference perspective we call that FOMO right we want our guests to FOMO not because we want them to miss a particular talk but because we want them to be so overwhelmed with content and opportunity with networking that they when they walk away they've had a good experience they're fulfilled but they they think I got to go back here too because that thing I missed I'm not gonna miss this yeah we will point out to you guys made a good call on film all the session everything so everything's gonna be online we'll help guys do that yep so the video is gonna be available for everyone to look on demand you also had some good broadcast here we had a couple shows the cubes been here your mobile mention the DJs yeah yeah so good stuff so okay hallway conversations our lobby con as we call it when people hang up a lot on it's always good hallway con so what Gabriel in your mind as you walked around what was some of the hallway culture that you overheard and and that you thought were interesting and what hall would cartridges were you personally involved in the personal conversations I was involved with is why isn't somebody not this station why someone not Gardens but I will tell you i from what I heard from from conference attendees the conversations that I heard taking place were and I hope Jonathan doesn't mind but Jonathan Nelson from hack fund spoke on our main stage and I hope he doesn't mind me speaking out of turn but he came to me said this is one of the best run blockchain conferences I've ever been to and to have somebody like Jonathan say that who has done hundreds of talks and thousands was really meaningful but but what was more important is to talk to him and him feel comfortable enough to sit down with me and just talk generally that's the vibe we want for every attendant we want you to feel comfortable meeting with people in the hallway who you've never met and be vulnerable from a security perspective you know Michael Turpin for example sitting down and talking proactively about being the AT&T hack great these are opportunities for people to really talk about what's happened and be vulnerable and have the opportunity to educate us all how to get better as an industry you know the other thing I want to get your thoughts on is obviously the program's been phenomenal in the content side thank you but community is really important to us we're of a community model to q you guys care about the community aspect of this and as a real event you want to have an ongoing year after year and hopefully it'll get bigger I think it will basically our results we're seeing talk about the community impact because what you're really talking about there is community that's right well I mean Vegas we talk about there's multiple communities right regionally post-show is a Vegas based company we're born here we close I think forty some employees all based here in Las Vegas which is our home so the first thing that we did with respect to community as we created a local local price if you're a Nevada resident we didn't want you to have to invest a significant amount of money to come to something in your own town the second thing we did is we've invited the local Vegas Bitcoin meet up in aetherium meet ups to come and partake and not only participate but contribute to the content and opening day in fact there was so much influx of people from those meetups it wasn't official it wasn't like a program where we had actually a VTEC set up I thought I was gonna be like a meet-up there were so many people that attended we had to on the fly provide AV because we were overwhelmed with the amount of people that showed up so that's a regional community but with respect to the community from blockchain community what we wanted to do is make sure we brought people of all ethnicities all countries we have 26 countries represented in the first blockchain security conference and you had some big-name celebrities here yeah Neil Kittleson Max Keiser you go mama Anan Prakash Yakov Prensky a layer from your side pop popcorn kochenko has some big names yeah I'll see andreas yes here keynoting yeah I'm Michel parkland andreas Diego Zaldivar I mean these lena katina Viren OVA I mean these are big names yeah these big names okay what so so what's your takeaway of you as you know my takeaway is that there's a there's a yearning for this type of event my takeaway is that we're doing something right we have the luxury as hosho and that we're not an events company people think that might be a disadvantage to run a confident you're not a cotton vent company I think it's an advantage yeah because it holds my feet to the fire yeah much closer than an event organiser who doesn't have a company reputation and brand to protect hosho as you know has a good brand in the cybersecurity world with respect to blockchain we don't have the luxury of throwing a poor event giving you a bad experience because that would tarnish house of but also your in the community so you're gonna have direct feedback that's right the other thing too I will say I'm gonna go to a lot of events and there are people who are in the business of doing events and they have a profit motive that's right so they'll know lanyards are all monetize everything is monetized yeah and that sometimes takes away from the community aspect correct and I think you guys did a good job of you know not being profligate on the events you want to yeah a little bit of cash but you didn't / yeah / focus on money-making finding people right for the cash you really needed about the content yeah and the experience for and with the community and I think that's a formula that people want yeah I would like to see the model I would like to see the model changed over time if I'm being honest a majority of crypto conferences today are paid to play so a lot of the content you're getting this sponsored so I'm okay with that but I think it should be delineated between con disclose your disclosure you don't want water down the country but but the conference circuit and crypto is not ready for that it hasn't rest in my opinion hasn't reached that level of maturation yet like I told you I I'm a former South by Southwest guy that like my belief is you create the content and the sponsors will come I don't I don't begrudge conference organizers for for for sponsoring out events because they're really really expensive a cost per attend to manage demand to this hype out there yeah hundreds of dollars per attendee I get it I understand why they do it but what I would like to see is the model change over time whereas as we get more sophisticated as a technology space we should also grow as a vent and conference circuit as well what I mean by that is let's change the model that eventually someday it's free for all attendees to come and those conferences and the costs associated with them are subsidized by companies that want access to the people that are tending them it sounds like an upstream open source project sure how open source became so popular you don't screw with the upstream yep but you have downstream opportunities so if you create a nice upstream model yep that's the cube philosophy as well we totally agree with you and I think you guys are onto something pioneering with the event I think you're motivated to do it the community needs it yeah I think that's ultimately the self governing aspect of it I think you're off to something really good co-creation yeah I'll see we believe in that and the results speak for themselves congratulations thank you so much I appreciate you guys coming here and investing your time and I hope that all our staff has been accommodated and the hard rock is treated you well you guys been great very friendly but I think again you know outside of you guys is a great company and great brand and you guys and speaks for itself and the results this is an important event I agreed because of the timing because of this focus its crypto its crypto revolution its cybersecurity and FinTech all kind of coming together through huge global demand I mean we haven't gotten into IOT and supply chain yeah all the hacks going on with China and these things being reported this is serious business is a lot on the line a lot and you guys having a clear focus on that is really a service business Thank You staff doing it alright our cube coverage here in Las Vegas for host Joe Kahn this is the first conference of its kind where security is front and center it is the conference for security and blockchain bringing the worlds together building the bridges and building the community bridges as well we love that that's our belief as well as the cube coverage here in Vegas tigress more after this short break

>> From Orlando, Florida, it's theCUBE. Covering SAP SAPPHIRE NOW 2018 Brought to you by NetApp. >> Welcome to theCUBE, I'm Lisa Martin with Keith Townsend and we are in Orlando at SAP SAPPHIRE 2018. This is an enormous event, 16 football fields. American football fields is the size of this space. Incredible, we're welcoming back to theCUBE, one of our distinguished alumni. >> Thank you. >> Uddhav Gupta you are the global vice-president and GM of the SAP App Center, welcome back to theCUBE. >> Yes, thank you so much, thank you for having me. And isn't this a lovely event? >> It's amazing. >> It is. >> So much energy and excitement yesterday during Bill McDermott's keynote. He talked about SAP, 46 years old now, has 398,000 customers and is responsible for 77% you said of the world's transactions. >> Yes, yes. >> Unreal. >> And you know the best part about this is we got 77% of the transactions, and if you walk around and ask people about SAP, they don't even know SAP, right? It's funny, I'm from the Bay Area and the first time people started taking SAP and acknowledging the brand of SAP was when they start to see SAP Center. Because that's home. >> The shark tank. >> To the Sharks. >> Yup. >> And they're like, oh, that was the first time. And then the second time we put a building out. We bought SuccessFactors and we got a SuccessFactors building by the airport and then, "Oh yeah we know SAP from the building next to the airport." But now people are starting to becoming really serious of associating themselves with the brand because now they started understanding what a crucial role SAP plays in their lives, right? If SAP doesn't do what it does, the entire supply chain for many large enterprises stops, right? Which means, your beverages don't come, and your food doesn't come in, nothing, right? Your lines are stopped. >> Yeah, we're with you. Your medicine doesn't come. >> Right. >> It is just. >> Yes. >> Well you guys have had Bill McDermott has talked about for a while about, we wanna become one of the world's top 10 most valuable brands but for invisible software you know you talk about, you want to be up there with the Apples and we can engage and touch with so many of these brands, and people probably don't know, a lot of people. >> Yes. >> That they are using SAP that's driving so many businesses, industries, and you guys have done a very good job of articulating your brand value through the voices of your customers who are transforming industries, they're saving lives, and also your partner ecosystem. So talk to us about the partner ecosystem and how they're really enabling partners like NetApp. What you're doing with the App Center to really enable SAP's growth and transformation through your partner ecosystem. >> Absolutely, so one of the good things is, if you look at the different transformations that the software industry has gone and cloud is one big one, right? And right now, with the cloud that one day we've regarded is the Cloud is a completely different dynamics of software. It's a very closed environment, the software itself so not everybody can actually basically just go ahead and deploy anything within the software itself, right? So that's created a huge economy of ecosystem for us where we've got partners that are building Sas Solutions, that extend our core business products. We got partners that are building content services that can actually be consumed within our business products. Similarly, SAP has made this transition from being more of a software applications company to actually being a platform company and now taking it into the cloud. So we've got a whole new generation of partners that we kind of started working with that provide technology services into the platform, right? And that's why we work with partners like NetApp. We work with partners like (mumbles). We works with partners, even SIs. They're starting to build a whole bunch of repeatable solutions, right? So in order to bring all these innovations that are happening around the SAP ecosystem, in the hands of our customers, like NetApp is a customer of SAP, too. How do we bring that easily into their hands so they can discover these products? They can try the products, they can buy these products. And then they can manage these products. And that's the whole idea of the App Center. >> And this has only been around for a year. In fact, you just celebrated your first birthday. >> Exactly. >> But a tremendous volume of apps that are already available. >> Yes, it's amazing. >> For try and buy. >> The ecosystem has really embraced us, they put their hands open, right? So within a year we've got 1100 partners that are on the App Center. We've got 1500 solutions that are on the App Center. And we are growing like crazy, right? We've got amazing endorsements from partners and donor. We've got amazing endorsement from customers. Some customers have come and done repeated purchases on the App Center within a month, right? The number of trials we're executing for partners is huge. On the whole, it's doing really well. >> So let's talk about the range of applications. I know when I think of App Center I think of App Center on my phone. >> Yes. >> And I can go and get something as silly as a flashlight or, in my case, as life-changing as my running app that keeps track of my fitness over the course of several years and I have great data to mine from that. What types of applications and industries, what industries do they serve in the App Center? >> So the App Center is really made for businesses. >> Right. >> So definitely we don't have Candy Crush there, right? (everyone laughs) >> Don't ask them. >> I don't know if that's a good thing. >> Oh, that's good, right, but you have a bunch of fun application for enterprises, right? Which allow them to get a better insight in how the company is operating. And then we have, to give you analogy to your fitness application that gives you a better idea of how your body works. We've got application that basically do the same thing for enterprises, right? So let me give you an example. We've got a major SI that actually has built an audit and compliance application for HR, right? So I can actually tell you, within your organizations what's your diversity ratio, what's your compliance ratio, how are people being paid, gender equality and gender pay, equal pay is a big topic that many CIOs are looking at. It kind of helps on those kinds of areas, right? Then we've got apps or solutions in there that basically deal with helping customers do better sales, right? We have apps in there that basically help provide you tools that can better monitor your platforms, right? Tools that help you migrate. All these things are available on the App Center. >> I'm curious from a differentiation standpoint, SAP has been very vocal about wanting, challenging the old legacy CRM. >> Yes. >> And wanting to be number one. Against their, you know, the (mumbles) competitors. How does the App Center and how you've enabled it so quickly and with such diversity of apps, how does this differentiate SAP? >> Absolutely, so we've owned the back office for a very long time now, right? So now it's time for us to basically get in front of the end users and get into the daily work that they do. It's very important for us to also own different offers. That's a whole big initiative, you heard with C4, right? To enable that, we've got cloud platform, right? And that's the other biggest piece of the puzzle, right? Now when you add these two things up, you don't basically, when you look at customers, the biggest thing for them is time to value, right? The whole concept of the bill versus buy is kind of starting to fade and the customer like, "Here's my problem, is there a solution out of the box "that can actually solve my problem?" If he gets a 100%, great, if he gets 90%, okay. If he gets 80%, I'll take it and then I'll improvise on it. And that's exactly what the App Center does. It gives you an out of the box solution from our ecosystem. So you can get started with it, and then you can collaborate with the ecosystem, to either improvise on it or take a step back and say, "Okay, now we've plugged the hole, now let's find "a more detailed solution to actually build "a more scalable outcome out of it." >> So let's talk about licensing flexibility from apps and App Center. One how do customers pay for. >> Yes. >> Their apps in the App Center? And then two, what are the licensing options for both partners and customers, for those individual apps? >> So the beauty of the apps and then the way we started up is the transaction is directly happening between the partners and the customers. So the partners can actually price their applications the way they wanted, right? So some partners that are basically doing content services are doing it by based on utilization, right? So you actually use this many number of API calls, that's how it's priced. Some of the others are doing SAS applications and they are pricing it by users. So the partners have complete flexibility of pricing and packaging the way they want. Also because we're actually using the App Center to sell to enterprises, it's very unlikely that somebody's gonna go ahead and say, "Oh, he has a gold, bronze, and silver package, "I'm just gonna pick one of them." On the App Center you can actually go ahead and custom package or create custom packages with tailored customs and conditions that are specific to that customer. And the customer can then buy it, right? So we've kind of thought of this from an enterprise standpoint. And that's the beauty, right? When you work with partners like NetApp, that is important for them, right? NetApp is a partner that basically goes ahead and works with some of the largest businesses, right? It's important for them to have the flexibility to go ahead and do the business with them digitally. >> So I'm curious. At every event we talk about digital transformation, right? It's table stakes these days. But at SAPPHIRE 2018 there's been a lot of discussion around the intelligent enterprise. >> Yes. >> I'm curious how this one year old App Center that SAP has built and that you're managing, how are you using the data that you're getting about the types of apps that are being developed and consumed, how are you utilizing that data to transform SAP? >> Absolutely, if you think of the intelligent enterprise, we're doing everything that we can from the platform side. But what's the point of being intelligent if you don't apply your intelligence somewhere, right? And that's exactly. >> You're like my mother. >> (laughs) And that's what we're trying to do with their apps, right? So while the platform is intelligent. It can do a lot of stuff. The apps are the one that will help you derive the value from the platform. And that's where the App Center is super important and the apps that are on the App Center support the product. That's the role within the apps in the place for the intelligent enterprise. >> So Bill McDermott also talked about trust and the trust is the new currency. When you put forth something like the SAP App Center, you're kind of co-signing that, you know what, these apps, these are partners, and this is a partner exchange. Can you talk to the value to the enterprise of wanting to something like a App Center to purchase applications? >> Oh, trust is a big thing, right? These days, I mean, you. Enterprises come to SAP because they know SAP is such a trusted brand. So when we did the App Center we also made sure that every app that goes on the App Center is actually totally validated by an integration and certification center team, right? So you don't find anything on the App Center that has not gone through a vetting process. The second thing you don't know show that on the app center you find apps that are relevant to your SAP landscape and that's not a Shopify, right? You're not going and selling something that has no relevance to the enterprise. The third thing that we've done, and very important for customers is we've actually built workflows that allows them to still have the same comfort of procuring a software but only doing it digitally. So, for example, a customer may say, "Look, not every user "in my company is allowed to buy apps." But if a user is interested in buying an app, he should be able to request purchase, and then somebody who's entitled in the company to go through contracts and negotiate on behalf of the company can actually negotiate it, and then the purchase happens. So we will employ trust at every level of the App Center. >> Security is such a hot topic these days, right? I mean, there's been so many public breaches of corporate data, there's just one again the other day with, I think it was MyDNA or MyHeritage. >> Yes. >> And that kind of opportunity for people to submit a cheek sample and get their DNA is so popular. That's a lot of personal information. So the security woven into the fabric of that is all key. >> Absolutely. >> So you mentioned the number of partners and the number of apps. I think you said thousand partners. >> A thousand partners and 1500 apps. >> 1500 apps in the first year. >> In the first year. >> What are you excited about for the next year? What do you think we're gonna be talking about next SAPPHIRE? >> I think the growth in the number of apps and partners that are gonna come over, it's gonna be a hockey stick event we're completely looking forward to that. But what's gonna be interesting is, as these apps come by, and you've pointed it out, security is one topic, but GDPR compliance is another big one. So one of the things that we've been working with a lot of these partners is to basically become more and more GDPR compliant. Because some of these apps are dealing with HR data. Some of these apps are gonna start dealing with customer data and they have to be GDPR compliant. So that's what we're working on with them and we'll see more and more of those kind of things happen. But the second big thing that we're looking forward is going beyond the apps, right? We call it the App Center, we could call it Solution Center, we could call it anything. But the idea is you gonna have apps, but you're also gonna have vendors like NetApp being able to digitally sell the products to our end customers, right? Somebody bought HANA, they need a HANA appliance, with an adapt storage, that's possible on the App Center. Or some other tools, somebody's existing NetApp customer managing really large SAP landscapes. And they can buy tools that will basically help them manage the NetApp landscape, right? Or SAP landscape running a NetApp gear. So those are kinds of things that I'm looking forward to actually coming into the App Center. The third thing is sensors. People are building IoT Scenarios and we are having tons of partners basically certify sensors against our IoT technology. How about we bring those into the App Center, right? So it's gonna be a huge and beautiful portfolio of solutions. >> Practical question before we let you go is. Simple concept 'cause my mind is working and I come from a traditional SAP shop. So I'm thinking, what interesting things have you seen customers do with SRM and the App Center. I mean, it seems like, App Center, another supplier for SRM should be some integrations? Am I making an assumption? What are some of, as we look at, or even App Center and someone that has SAP core products, what are some of the integration for them? >> Oh, you hit the nail, right? What some of the customers are coming back to us and asking is, can you actually do an App Center specifically for my enterprise, right? Where I as a user can basically go, curate a whole bunch of apps that I've kind of looked at the terms and conditions or have met certain standards, etcetera. And accept the terms of conditions for those products right? Accept those products, negotiate the price, or whatever they do. And then make that open to all of my users of their ecosystem, right? So that way, anybody in that scenario can actually go purchase an app and start using it in production. >> And then I have all of my work full from SRM to approve the purchase of the app. >> Exactly, so it kind of ties in very neatly into that. >> So your 18th SAPPHIRE. >> Yes. >> What are some of the key takeaways that you're gonna go back to the Bay Area with? >> You know, the beauty is every SAPPHIRE keeps growing bigger and bigger and the questions every three, four year we've done a new transformation, right? Last year when I come to this conference, people were still kind of unaware and not really ready to embrace the cloud in an enterprise base. This year, I didn't hear one customer say, "Should we go to the cloud?" Everybody like, "We are on the cloud, how can you help us?" How can SAP and customers and partners like NetApp actually help us get there? And that's a refreshing feel, right? Because now we can talk to them about all the grand plans that we have for them. Prior we were basically still selling them on the concept. Now we're actually walking them and talking to them about how they embrace the cool stuff that we're doing. >> Awesome. >> So it's refreshing. >> It is cool stuff. >> It is. >> Uddhav, thanks so much for stopping by theCUBE. >> Thank you so much for having me. >> Talking with Keith and me about what you guys are doing with the App Center and happy first birthday again. >> Thank you, thank you. >> Thank you for watching theCUBE. Lisa Martin with Keith Townsend at SAP SAPPHIRE 2018. Thanks for watching.

>> From Orlando, Florida, it's theCUBE! Covering SAP SAPPHIRE NOW 2018. Brought to you by NetApp. >> Welcome to the CUBE we are in Orlando, at SAP SAPPHIRE 2018, I'm Lisa Martin with Keith Townsend as my co-host. We're in the NetApp booth, and we are very excited to talk to the VP of the Chief Customer Office at SAP, Mark Marcus, Mark, welcome to theCUBE. >> Thank you, glad to be here I appreciate it. >> This event is enormous. One of the things that really struck me in Bill McDermott's key note was, you know, we always here about, oh we are expecting 20 thousand people, he talked about a million people engaging with SAP SAPPHIRE this week, via the in person, and the live, and the on demand video experiences. Massive! 390 thousand customers, hundreds of customer sessions the voice of the customer validating SAP as one of the world's most valuable brands is not only pervasive here its palpable. So talk to us about the Chief Customer Office. What is it, what's it's mission, why was it created? >> Yes, okay that's a great, a great way, so first of all thank you, I appreciate you being here, I live in Orlando so it's great to see this event in my-- People wonder why SAPPHIRE is actually in Orlando, it's because I live here. (all laughing) >> You're the reason! >> You're the reason. >> I'm the reason SAPPHIRE is in Orlando, Florida. >> Okay, you heard it, Mark Marcus, you're the reason. >> No, so what happened is, when Bill McDermott came to SAP, he was a different type of leader, and what he wanted to do immediately is start meeting with customers. So what he did is, he started meeting with customers, and he said if you have any questions or problems, give me a call. And so what happened is, his phone started ringing, people needed help, so he needed somebody that could help him with the customers when he ran North America. And so that was the genesis to Chief Customer Office. So we started off, first, we were extremely reactive. And so what I mean by that is, if the customer had a problem, we'd have to go in, and we'd have to help them. And it's much more difficult when you have a problem, then try to prevent a problem. So what we've been doin' the last several years, is trying to be much more proactive, so instead of waiting for the phone to ring, we've been getting with customers, and making sure, you know, as their project start, begin their steering committee meetings and make sure that things go well. >> So, you've taken that more proactive approach, it's almost how the organization's evolved. What is the focus today? >> Yes, well the focus has always been the customer, but I think it's more of, taking the best practices that we've learned, and actually sharing those with the customers, and helping them explain how other people have done their journey, because what you'll find, is people are in different phases of their journey, and what they like to hear more of is, you know, what did other customers do, what did they do right, what did they do wrong, and how can we be more successful? So we've been able to, over the years, if you think about, just to put it in perspective again, there are, SAP North America has 158 thousand customers, and we're only on, my particular team only has about a hundred of those customers, that we have. So it's a very, very small amount, they're are ones that, you know, are strategic to SAP, that we get involved in. But what we're able to do though, is, through social media and other areas is, customers wanna hear what happened, again, in the past, and how we can, you know, learn from that and move forward. >> So, I'm a big social media fan. Twitter handle has 38 thousand followers, which a lot for your focus on a hundred customers, so I think that, that you're echoing the, the theme very well. Talk to us about how it's changed over the past, 14 or so years, shift has focused from on-premises solutions to hybrid-cloud, to cloud analytics, AI, what's the, what are customers talking about? >> I'll tell you what, you're talkin' my language now, (Keith laughing) okay, because what happened is what we did is, actually what I'm in part, what I'm a part of is actually the cloud ambassador program. And so what that is, is it's focusing on our cloud customers so, you know, success factors, Ariba, Concur, and those kinda things, and so, really what happened, is, you know, when SAP, when I came to SAP 14 years ago, it was all on-premise ERP, alright? So it's very contained, very controlled with what people had now there's Cloud's, we're not really sure what customers are doing, how they're interacting with the solutions, and so what we have to do is we really focus, and again, my group is 100% focused in on that, so. What part of our mission has been is, we're not necessarily know what customers are doing, so we're helping to understand what they're doing, and trying to help educate groups inside SAP to be more responsive and help them. >> So you mentioned having responsibility for some strategic accounts, about a hundred. Do those represent kind of a subset of some of the key areas in which you're looking for the voice of the customer, and their practice using your technology to influence the direction of some of the key technologies? >> Yes, 'cause I'd say they're some of the biggest, most strategic customers that we have, and so what we do a lot of is, we're able to, we align directly with the executives, at the customer, so one of things with Chief Customer Office, is we're aligned at the C level, so it's, the CIO, the CEO, the CFO, at that level, so we're able to say we heard directly from the leaders of the companies, our most important customers, key customers, and we're able to take that back the other areas of SAP, and say, this is the what the leadership's demanding, and that's what we're able to help them with. >> So, as we're going through this phase of digital transformation, through a lot of organizations, that audience is even more important than, what?! (chuckles) Tell me how, as digital transformation has become, more than just a buzzword but a imperative from the C-suite, from CEOs to CIOs, CMOs, CDO, all the C's, CXO! How has the conversation between those groups changed, from the SAP perspective? >> Yeah, I'll tell ya, that is, again, I'm not just sayin' that you are, you're hitting exactly what we focus in on because, traditionally SAP has been focused more on the CIO level, so it's more the IT groups of implemented ERP, it's been more of a back-office type solution, well now, what we're finding is the line of businesses are the people that are actually making the decisions. So what we're finding out is that, it's not necessarily so much that the, technically, how they work, it's more the business processes they have, and how we can help actually, basically automate, and help them run more smoothly. >> Yeah, Hasso Plattner actually, and some of the guys this morning during the keynote talked about that, in terms of, customers were saying, you know, I'm getting kind of confused, there's so many different product names, a lot of acquisitions, he was talking about that, we heard from customers that there was confusion there. So when he was talking about, in the context of C4 for example of, making things simpler to understand, but also to your point, the back office and the front office now has to be connected so they also talked about that, in terms of, the integration with SAP Cloud, and how they really focused on enabling wholistic integration because it's the processes that have to now communicate together, so that, a whole, kind of proactive, customer responsiveness, that was really apparent this morning. 46 years young SAP, you have a new initiative about the customer for life, tell us about that. >> Okay, so customer for life is a new initiative that we have, so what I told you, at the Chief Customer Office we've done, we're able to touch very few customers, but, you know, again, you know we have 156 thousand, in SAP North America, you know, multiply that all over the world, I mean, it's many customers, okay. So what we've tried to do, is take what we've done on a small scale in the Chief Customer Office, and make that pervasive throughout the whole company. And so what we're really good at too is actually, you know, understanding what the customers do, finding them a solution, but now what we wanna do is go through the whole life-cycle of what we do so, I mentioned, you know, having a customer executive assigned to every customer. Being able to be part of the steering committees that we have, and being able to follow them through so we can help guide them, so it's not only selling the solutions but actually helping them through all the way, so the new initiative we set is customer for life, it's something that we're rolling out right now, and we've had, and again, it's taking what we did in the Chief Customer Office and, you know, propagating that through the rest of SAP. >> So, this facility, you like to say it, 16 football fields, American football fields, so that's a big facility. I walked the facility this morning, got in about three thousand steps. Hundred plus partners on the floor, ranging from system integrators, technology partners, and infrastructure space, software SIs. Help us understand as SAP, 20 thousand plus people here at the show, a million people online engaging on SAPPHIRE, SAP is becoming a platform company. How has that changed your role, your conversations? >> Well, I think what has happened a lot is, especially in the cloud projects, again I'm gonna focus more on what I'm a part of is, you know, there's a lot of new partners that come up. Because what happened is that, you know, we acquired several companies, we did, you know Concur, Ariba, SuccessFactors, a lot of big companies, and a lot of different partners. So really what our role is, in the Chief Customer Office is, to basically, to help these partners to understand how to work together, and we do a lot of things in meetings, we have, what we do, is, it's usually like the three legged stool, it is, you know, it's SAP, the partner, and the customer together, and we all do that together. And what I've found is, some of the problems that we've had is not neces-- you know, I always say like, how can take the exact same solution, and it works well in one company, and it doesn't work in another company? And what it is, to your point, with all the partners here, is it's communication, are they working together, you know, is the partner, and SAP, and the customer all working together, and so that's what I'm really focused on today is meeting with all the, you know, do the SAPPHIREs, to meet with the partners, to make sure we're aligned, you know, talk about our key customers, and make sure that we're all working together. >> We talked to one of the gentleman yesterday who was running some of the communities around HANA and Leonardo and, just the massive amount of content that is being generated to enable and educate customers across 25 plus industries, was massive, as well as, leveraging that peer validation from customers, like you're saying, you know, some customers in certain industries have a ton of success with the same thing that others customers struggle, depending on a lot of different variables. So that sort of collaboration and communication, even within the SAP communities alone, was very apparent yesterday that that's one of the big drivers, of I'm sure, the customer for life initiative is, as you have evolved, so have your customers. One thing that struck me yesterday was, you know, looking at, you're now number 17 of the World's top most valuable brands up there with Apple, you know, products that we can engage with and, I saw on a bus yesterday some of the messaging, and ERP you can talk to, and hear from. (Keith laughing) So SAP really set a very lofty ambition of being up there with the Amazons, and the Coca-Colas, and the Googles, and now you have technology that people can, you know, like at home with their digital assistant, talk to and communicate with. I thought that was very powerful message. >> And I'd say that's, I'd say too that, you know, I've worked with SAP for 14 years, and when I came to SAP, nobody had really heard of SAP and what they were, they thought maybe, you know, sometimes on TV when you see SAP when it's translated in other languages or something, that's what they think of SAP, they don't really know what the company is but, yeah, it's been great to see how, you know, people would stop you, you know, whether you're wearin', you know, they'll see somethin' on your laptop, on your shirts or somethin' like that, yeah so it's been good. I think that's been a big focus of getting it out because, one thing is is we have 150 million cloud users, that's a lot of people, so a lot of people use SAP, so. Again, one of the cloud products that we have is called Concur, it's for expense and reporting, and so a lot of times people might not've heard of SAP, but they've heard of Concur, because they all do their expenses, that kinda stuff. So, exactly right, it is pretty good, you know, when you have even family members know who SAP is now. They've done a great job, you know, hiring, you know, with the market department and the people they've hired, it's been great, it's been good. >> So, okay, we talked a little bit about analytics and the customer experience as we're looking at intelligent business. Is that a message that's actually resonating with customers in that top 100 strategic accounts, are they using analytics to actually power business, What are some of the data analysis success stories? >> Yeah, I would say that, what I would say is that, what I've found a lot of times is that, you know, people can get the information in, but they need to be able to get the information out. And so, everybody across that has done it, so, I would just say almost every customer we have has basically needed to get that out, and do reporting and those kinda things, you know? So, part of what we do at the Chief Customer Office is, you know, not only, you know, help them with the reports that they have, but to be able to run that kinda stuff. >> You guys also have, you know, some really interesting use-cases, I'm a Formula One fan, I've worked with Formula One before, I'm, I understand it from a fan perspective. You guys are really involved in McLaren Motorsport, for example, from finance, to procurement, to manufacturing. How are you seeing some of these really big use-cases like Formula One, or Coca-Cola, infuse into some of the, you know, the mid-sized businesses, who, you say, might be using Concur for example. What is some of the value that a small company can get from the massive users? >> Yeah, well I'd say there's a lot of things, because what happens is that from those big massive customers that we have, we're able to put together as we call model company. And so what a model company is, is it takes the best practices you have and puts it into more of a, I'd say nothings out-of-the-box, but makes it much more easier to implement, to be able to do it, so what we're able to do is, you know, with the massive amounts of info like McLaren, I think Hasso mentioned what, there's 400 sensors that they're getting on their cars, and that kind of stuff. So basically being able to take all the information that we have, and then from that, distill it down into where it's a very, repeatable type instance we can use for other customers. So there's a lot, I mean that's what we do with a lot of the, what the customers have, we try to get that back to where other people can use it. >> A Formula One car is basically an IOT device. You said 400 sensors, generating a ton of data, per race weekend, times three days, times 20 events a year. I read from Gartner just the other day that by 2020, which is around the corner, there's expected to be 20 billion IOT devices. What are you hearing from your customer base regarding IOT and being able to synchronize this, you know, modern next-gen data center with myriad devices? >> Yeah, so that is one of our top initiatives that we have right now. Because, one of the things that we've done is, we have an offering that we have called Leonardo, and what Leonardo is, it was named after the inventor Leonardo da Vinci, alright? So, you know, in his time he was, you know, a great innovator, actually went and saw his house and went over to Europe, and I've done a lot with Leonardo, you know what I'm sayin'? To be able to do that, right? But what that is, is that's basically all about, you know, getting devices to be able to get that information in. Because what you do is, you have you know, thousands of sensors and stuff like that and a good, you asked me earlier about a good success story on that, is one of the ones that I think resonates the most on that is in Buenos Aires, they have a massive problem with rain, you know, it rains a lot, and they have severe flooding, and the architecture is antiquated. But what they've found, is the reason that they were having these flooding problems, is because the sewers and the drains were all getting clogged up. So what they did was, they put a sensor in every one of the drains to be able to make sure that they were unclogged and they were flowing freely. So what they did is, they were able to, if the water flow started going down they were able to empty out the drains, even with an antiquated sewer system, because they were keeping it aligned with, you know, using Leonardo now, they can go and keep it cleaned out, they've had massive rains and the flooding hasn't really been there where it is, so now, what's interesting is every time I go by and see a gutter that's all clogged up, I think, you know, they need Leonardo to be able to help! >> I was reading as well about Alicia Tillman, your CMO, who's been at the helm for about nine months now and, in the context of this desire to become one of the top global brands with an invisible product, she said, you know, that one of the most important things for SAP right now is brand narrative, messages and campaigns will change quarterly or, every six months as they should but, she said, you know, to be able to show the value of basically under-the-hood software, you've gotta be able to show how it transforms countries, lives, industries, and that's one of the things that I think is very, very palpable here at the event is how much impact SAP is making in, whether it's rhino conservation in Africa or, you know, helping water scarcity in India, the impact, which is really the most, the biggest validation that you get, right from the voice of your customers is massive. >> Yeah, and I'd say to that, you know I like to say that, you know, it sounds like, you know, yes we're a software company, and, you know, that kinda stuff, but, it is really a noble endeavor, because we are doing a lot of things to help people's lives, and to run their businesses better, and what you realize is that, Chief Customer Office sometimes we see that other side when the systems aren't running properly at times, you know, they're usually runnin' right, but sometimes they have problems, and when they do, you can just see the impact you have on, you know, people's lives and businesses and stuff like that, that it is really running, you know, it is core to what you have, you know. So I'll tell you one of the interesting things that SAP's involved in is, they do a lot with instant messaging, so they have a part of, one of the acquisitions we have does instant messaging, well, you don't think about that but like, when you use, let's say, Facebook Messenger, or something like that, those messages go inside an SAP infrastructure at times, right? So imagine, you know, if you can't change messages, or doin' those kinda things, you know, so. You're exactly right, it definitely does, what we're doing does really impact a lot of peoples lives, so it's important. >> Well mark, thanks so much for taking some time to stop by theCUBE and chat with us about what SAP is doing with customers, how they're really symbiotically working together with you to evolve and transform this company. >> I wanna say one other thing too, it's great to work with two professionals here, you guys have really helped me a lot. >> Aww! >> I don't do this a lot, but it really made me feel comfortable, so you, I appreciate your help, thank you. >> Our pleasure, thanks so much! And, so you're the reason SAPPHIRE's in Orlando, are you also the reason they got Justin Timberlake tomorrow night?! (Mark laughing) >> I would like that. But I would like to say real quick, one thing before we cut real quick, I would like to say one thing just about the NetApp partnership we have. So RJ Bibby is the person that I work with at NetApp, and, just what he's done to basically, because NetApp really helps run a lot of our infrastructure inside SAP, so it's success factors, some of the high-availability in things that we have, and just working with RJ, and kinda learning how we, how we work and can help other customers, they've really volunteered to help a lot of our customers, and so, I just wanna thank NetApp again for helping us sponsor this. >> Great, great closing. We wanna thank NetApp for having theCUBE in their booth. Lisa Martin, with Keith Townsend, we are at SAP SAPPHIRE NOW 2018, thanks for watching! (bubbly music)

>> From Orlando, Florida, it's theCUBE, covering SAP SAPPHIRE NOW 2018. Brought to you by NetApp. >> Hey, welcome to theCUBE. I am Lisa Martin with Keith Townsend, and we are live in the NetApp booth at SAP SAPPHIRE 2018. We are joined by Robert Stumpf, Senior Director of IT, Enterprise Solutions Delivery. Welcome to theCUBE! >> Thank you, thank you. >> So we're here in the NetApp booth at SAPPHIRE NOW. As they said in the keynote this morning, they're expecting a million people to engage with SAP SAPPHIRE this week. >> Yes. >> Think, I've heard rumblings there's about 20+ thousand people here in attendance. >> Yeah. >> Huge event, huge show, lots of announcements. Let's talk about NetApp and SAP as partners. Specifically in the context of the Next-Gen Data Center, bringing cloud-ready solutions to business application. What are you guys doing there with SAP? >> Sure, I can talk a little bit about that. The NetApp solutions fit into the Next-Generation Data Center in a variety of different ways. We have the All FAS Flash that really is the core of our product base and is really the workhorse of all the hardcore applications, gives you really a strong performance in the storage area. Then we have the Cloud Volumes with when you want to scale out to hyper scaler, and you can use the Cloud Volumes abilities there. And then when you look at our HCI components, it is capable of giving you a lot more of the container-based compute power, so we fit into a variety of different components there. >> So, Robert, we're at SAP. And SAP hasn't been traditionally known as a cloud-aware application. Tell us, from the NetApp perspective, what's changed with SAP over the years that now, you can comfortably talk about SAP as a cloud-aware application? >> So SAP's moving a long way in that direction. You saw it this morning in the keynote that they were talking about the C4, their customer-focused applications. That's really kind of putting a framework on top of all of the customer engagements, and making the customer the center of everything. So they're moving a lot in that direction. We at NetApp have implemented their Hybris platform, their cloud for customer application. We just went live with that last year, so we're on that journey with SAP as well. >> So, as we talk about that, what makes the application, or what make applications in general cloud-aware? >> Okay, when you look at making something cloud-aware, you want to really look at the architecture that you have underneath it. So you'll build something that has a lot more automation in it, a lot more scalable, where you don't have to, the scalability's built into the framework, like you're leveraging. In the case of our NetApp support site, which we just completely re-architected and went live last month, we have built that on what's called a MEAN stack, so that's where the Mongo database and the back-end that's a NoSQL database, and then on top of an Angular node.js, which gives you much more robust framework for you to be able to scale-out your application. So with it being a website, and your volume can go up and down, so you want to be able to scale the application without needing people to get involved in that scaling, so they will just fire up new containers as needed as the volume increases, and it's a lot more robust in architecture. >> So if we look at Hybris and we look at NetApp products and solutions, that framework and architecture. Can you paint a picture for us what NetApp solutions and products are cloud-aware? >> Sure, the cloud-aware applications, really you need to look at the complete stack of the Next-Generation Data Center, which is really embodying the on-prem data center, your hyperscaler cloud data centers, and then a private cloud if you so wish to build one. So the Next-Generation Data Center takes advantage of the All FAS Flash on your on-prem solution, so you've got your performance, high-performance scalability. Then your Cloud Volumes allows you to move your data between your on-prem out to the hyperscaler as you need to, and the HCI component gives you that container-based compute array that allows the applications to scale. Also, you can leverage StorageGRID, which is much more of an object-based data base, which is something that you'll use extensively on cloud-aware applications. >> So, thanks Keith. So one of the things that was announced this morning, you mentioned C/4HANA where Bill McDermott was sort-of expected to announce what SAP was going to be doing that's gonna help differentiate them. They want more share from Salesforce and Oracle. He made kind of some aloof references to that, but one of the things that he talked about was: companies need, in this day and age, speed obviously, but to move away from a 360-degree view of sales automation to an actual 360-degree view of the customer. I'd love to get your insight on NetApp and SAP as partners together. Are you seeing any particular industries leading here? We think of manufacturing, maybe automotive oil and gas, but I'm just wondering from NetApp's perspective, are you seeing any industries that are really leading-edge here in evolving to a Next-Gen Data Center that enables this 360-degree view? >> There's a variety of different industries that are doing that. If you take a look at applications like Netflix and Amazon Prime, those applications are architectured to be scalable and to be much more robust, and they are much more focused on the customer. And because you don't have outages, right? They don't take the system offline when they're doing an upgrade to their capabilities. When was the last time you heard of Netflix going offline for twelve hours to do an upgrade? So, these applications are built much more robustly around that, and that's what one thing that we are looking to do at NetApp with the Hybris implementation that we did with SAP, and we're also upgrading our back office CRM system to their CRM on HANA on-prem, and we're gonna be taking advantage of the Hybris capabilities there to give that full picture of the customer. We'll be heavily engaged with SAP on their C4 journey and making sure that we are a part of that as well. >> So it's great that you brought up Netflix as an example that continues to be operating an environment that has this huge back-end automated with technology. SAP traditionally hasn't been considered a technology that you could upgrade on the fly. I've managed an SAP environment where we can only take twelve hours of downtime a year because mission critical, it's very difficult to get that time. >> Yes. >> How has the NetApp data fabric story played into making that a possibility in your own environment and customers' environments? >> Okay, we leverage a lot of the NetApp storage on our on-prem system. I'm in the exact place, same situation as you were talking about. We have a lot of mission critical customers that are on our support application. I have to give 90-days notice to take the system down for any longer than four hours at a time, so I'm in that very similar situation. So we leverage a lot of the NetApp technologies to make sure that the applications are available when I'm doing the upgrades, and we can do rapid copies of the data that's in there, make sure it's all robust. Our data, failover database, failover systems, are set up that way so that they take advantage of the snapshots that we got from the application, and we're working with SAP. The SAP Hybris application is actually built on top of NetApp storage, and we're working very closely with SAP to re-architect our applications, to take advantage of the capabilities that NetApp storage brings to the equation. >> So none of this coming into its own in this hybrid cloud model that's been around 26 years, right, long time. But now, it's everything you see. You mentioned Netflix, and I don't know anybody on the planet that would survive if Netflix went down for an hour, let alone twelve. So speed, access to data, but this evolution of NetApp, I'm interested, and you know now again in this hybrid cloud model, you guys made your name from building network attached to storage on-prem data centers, the announcement with Google Platform just last week. Talk to us about some of the evolution from NetApp, from your perspective, from the storage perspective, into really facilitating this hybrid cloud model. >> Sure, we are really at the forefront of that because at the end of the day, it's all about the data. Right, your application can run wherever you want, but wherever your data is is really the key. And that's the framework that we're putting in place is to make your data a lot more mobile. So if you want to keep the data on-premise, then you can keep it on-premise. If you want to move it out next to the hyperscaler, you can burst it out, you can use the Cloud Volumes and migrate the data. So the NetApp picture, the story is really in making your data much more mobile and moving it to the location of choice for any particular workload that you're looking for. >> So, we can't have a discussion in 2018 about data without talking about privacy and security. What's the relationship in ensuring that NetApp and SAP is one, media requirements in GDPR, we have to talk about GDPR, we have to talk about security. How is NetApp securing data and ensuring that in-users' and organizations' data stay private? >> That's a very good question, right? It's definitely a challenge that a lot of companies are struggling with, and the tools that NetApp provides with our storage systems are paramount, security is paramount, and that's something that we're very much focused on in making sure that your data is your data, and the specific components of the data that you want to keep on-premise, which you want to keep as much more secure, then you can keep that on the NetApp All FAS Flash storage systems, and then you protect it as if it's in your own kingdom. But then the data that's a little bit more lax on the security sites, then you can push that out onto the hyperscalers and use the NetApp Cloud Volumes to have it outside of your on-premise. You know, it's like your own firewall. >> So one of the basic things as a ONTAP customer that ONTAP customers depend on and the private data centers, this ability to encrypt data on the fly. Now that we look at, you know we see ONTAP in the cloud, do we get that same basic capability to encrypt data on the fly or encrypt data while it's in transit? How do I know my data is protected from an encryption perspective? >> You get the same capabilities when you're using the on-cloud tools that we provide, so there's no real difference in that, and that's the beauty behind that. You're using the same storage management tools for your Cloud Volumes as you would be for your on-premise systems. >> I want to ask a question on competition. There's a lot of co-opetition that's going on just at SAPPHIRE alone. With what you talked about about how NetApp is leveraging Hybris, you mentioned, to really kind of get towards that model of connecting supply chain with demand, getting that full view of customers, SAP partners with probably all of your competitors. So how is what NetApp is doing internally to digitally transform, how do you see it as giving NetApp that competitive edge against the other guys? >> Okay, the way that we look at our competitive edge at NetApp from an application standpoint is really focusing on keeping our core capabilities very, very vanilla. So in the implementation with Hybris, we were very much focused on not customizing the application. But because at the end of the day, you sell stuff, you build stuff, you manufacture it, and you support it. So those are the core capabilities, and we've kept that very vanilla as much as possible within the implementation. Where we differentiate, that's where we customize. So our application landscape is much more focused on customizing for the differentiating capabilities, and that's the component that's specific to NetApp and how we do business. And that's the way that we go about differentiating ourselves from our competitors. So we use the core capabilities of all the enterprise applications that we have, that we purchase such as Hybris, and then we go build our custom solutions that are differentiated, that really searches our ASUP, AutoSupport system, that gets what's embedded right from day one, that's a custom-built application, it's very proprietary, it's really the keys to the kingdom for our organization. And that's something that's very, very integral as part of the NetApp culture. >> So, let's talk about some lessons learned from that. One of the pain points for many SAP customers is they look at capability like ECC on HANA, really want it, but they've customized their environment too much, so making that switch is extremely difficult for them. What have you learned as a team that says, you know what, the best way to stay in line with SAP and follow that roadmap for mission critical applications that are both stable and differentiating, you should follow these basic policies from a hygiene perspective. >> Sure, we actually went through that last year with our project where we replaced our Sales Force Automation system, and we implemented C4, C4C Hybris. So the key to that is really getting the executive sponsorship bought-in to making sure that you're adhering to the vanilla applications and not customizing it. So we were very fortunate where we had Henri Richard and Bill Miller, our CIO. They were the executive sponsors of the project, and they were adamant that we would not customize the application, and we went through, it took us six months to replace our CRM system for an office CRM system. Very proud of that project. It was an incredible painful journey to go through, but the benefits that we got out of the end of it are phenomenal because we were in that situation where we had an overly-custom SAS application that was running our sales organization that really wasn't meeting the needs of the business. Now we have a much more agile implementation that's on top of SAP's Hybris platform, and we're taking advantage of the new capabilities they introduce, rather than focusing on our own customizations. >> That's a great summary. I think you articulated very well what, one of the themes was from Bill McDermott's keynote this morning, is making things simple, is not an easy thing to do, but it's critical. There are so many-- >> It's totally critical. >> business outcomes that come out of that, not just stream-learning processes, improving sales and marketing and connecting them together, but really affecting revenue, profit, share, et cetera. So Robert, thanks so much for stopping by theCUBE and chatting with Keith and me today about what you guys are doing with SAP. >> Great, thank you, thank you for your time. >> We want to thank you. You're watching theCUBE: Lisa Martin with Keith Townsend from SAP SAPPHIRE 2018, thanks for watching! (light percussive music)

>> From Orlando Florida, it's theCUBE. Covering SAP SAPPHIRE NOW 2018 brought to you by NetApp. >> Hi, welcome to theCUBE. I'm Lisa Martin with Keith Townsend. We are in Orlando at SAPPHIRE NOW 2018. We're in Vanetta booth talking to all sorts of guests and we're welcoming to theCUBE for the first time, Anand Chellam at KPIT, the Global Leader for SAP at KPIT. Welcome to theCUBE Anand. >> Thank you, thank you so much for having me here. >> So you have been working with SAP in some capacity for twenty years or so. You've no doubt seen a lot of transformation that SAP has undergone, since then. You're now with KPIT, who was just named yesterday a Hybris America Service Delivery Partner of the Year. Congratulations. Talk to us about one, the evolution that you've seen at SAP and two, how that excites you being on the the KPIT partner site. >> Absolutely, absolutely. It's been interesting. This is my 20th Sapphire, so you know it's been a long journey, and while today in the keynote while watching some of the demos, it goes back to, we saw a demo by Hasso Plattner when they launched mysap.com in Philadelphia. There was a big storm and there was a lot of notion that is SAP going back because internet was new and SAP was not in the bandwagon and SAP was trying to prove themselves that no they are, and they are an internet friendly software and there's a lot of debate whether that's going to be transformed or not, but looking at today, they've done a phenomenal job. I really think the last 10 years, the 50 billion dollar investments, which SAP has done through acquisitions, I feel it's been very rewarding to a lot of our customers, our partners and it's really truly the next generation software, which all of us can look forward to to get the most value. So I'm personally very excited to see how SAP has really looked ahead and done these acquisitions, and more importantly integrating them. I think one of the keys at least in the ecosystem I've seen companies, they acquire a lot of software, but the biggest challenge is integrating them and making them seamless to the customers, and I think a lot of credit goes to SAP for being able to have a plan and integrate that, so it's very seamless. So net-net I'm very excited about what's ahead of us. >> Tell us about KPIT, what do you guys do and then what do you do specifically with SAP? >> We're in Sapphire and KPIT's theme this year is elevate IT, elevate IT or elevate IT. And it's basically elevating to the next level at every level, whether it's from front office to back office, whether it's integrating the connected devices, whether it's building some intelligent automation in the ERP, whether it is adopting and rolling out a personalized cloud model. All of it we are in, and we're very fortunate to being able to you know one is obviously, we planned this. We had a planned strategy on which are the focus areas we're very focused. S/4, we are one of the leaders in the S/4. We have over 120 HANA implementations which is pretty sizeable. If you see there is gonna be some press releases coming out, that has been some piracy where we are the leaders in S/4. And we're excited to see how much of that automation is going to come into the picture. So S/4 is a big area of growth for us. Connected devices is because we're a very strong engineering firm, so it comes very naturally how those two, engineering and IT come together and that comes along very well. In Hybris as you said thank you again we were very excited to get the delivery partner of the year for Americas, which is a pretty amazing accomplishment given you know the last four years our focus has been, but I think what's more exciting for us is the co-innovation we're doing with our customers. As an example you know we are co-innovating building the dealership portals for a lot of their dealers for their customers and see how that's integrating well. The other aspect is CPQ. Big in configuring products and how they can one, bring it to market and two, position that so that their customers are able to configure their products, so we're able to doing a lot of that. We are uberizing service to see on an on demand model how is it that they can provide. So lots of activity around that area as well. >> Anand talk to us, 20 years it's a long time to have observed and participated in the SAP ecosystem. I think it would be fair to say that 20 years ago the conversation in a typical enterprise would be you know what, we're waiting on SAP, whether it's some innovation, practically some batch foul process to end to now we're in a market that SAP is driving business. Can you talk to us about the importance of the relationship of this trifecta of SAP, NetApp, KPIT, how do you guys bring this new business capability? What's the critical components of you bringing this new critical capability to customers, where you can now say that innovations that KPIT, whether it's Hybris or S/4 coupled with NetApp is able to bring innovation to digital transformation. >> Excellent, good point. I think we're not, I'm stating the obvious. There has been so much changes happening in the IT world that it's very important I believe to coexist with partners, and that's where I see the SAP, NetApp, KPIT partnership is a very critical one right, because all of them bring such critical components to bear that we really can use the software, the infrastructure, the disaster recovery the implementation services and the IP, which brings to the table, bundle it together to see some very fast outcomes. I'll give you an example. We just went live with an S/4 implementation. And day one, day one we had a 40% increase in order entry, which is phenomenal so the point being 20 years back that would be unheard of. It would be like oh if we go live and we still can (all talking) were great, so the velocity aspect has increased tremendously. That comes through all these partnership, the underlying infrastructure, which supports the software and the people and the processes, which come into bear. So it's very important that the trifecta effect is seen in outcomes which customers really benefit from. >> Who are you talking to when you guys are going in together as this partnership that you just articulated. Who are you talking to? I mean because the C suite has has shifted so much right? I was reading from the CMO council that 67% of marketing execs rank marketing and commerce technology is critical to their overall performance. We've got the chief digital officer who have to drive cultural change, the CIO who needs to be bimodal. When you guys are talking with customers, what are are those conversations like? What's driving the innovation that KPIT needs to deliver for these customers? >> Very good point. So we've started adopting some of the newer areas to see some of the benefits, which customers are looking for. As an example, one of our customers who make packaging machines, they wanted to see how they can overall reduce their service costs by 20% and how they can implement, an IOT based solution on Leonardo Connected Goods to help reduce and build a new business model, so what in this new age it's just not about implementing a software. It's about how does it drive efficiency by reducing cost, but more importantly how does it spur and build new business models, so it's no longer restricted to an IT solution. I think in this digital era, it's more important how does how does it look differently, how are the models which we never thought about before are being brought in and we were part of the Medallion select group of Leonardo partners and we're very proud to see how that grows. >> What excites you about that because I just saw that announcement come out yesterday. Tell us a little bit about the KPIT's SAP Leonardo innovation portfolio and what you're delivering or will be delivering to customers with respect to that? >> We're focusing in many areas, but the couple which come to mind is Connected Goods. This is an example where we talk about how we reduce the overall service cost by 20% right by just implementing something around that lines. We're also doing a lot of work on the predictive maintenance side of things, where being able to predict failures, before it happens to reduce the downtime and increase the overall productivity, where KPIT is big in automotive and the vehicle insights are something, which we are working with closely to build some of those outcome based models, which I think will be very much beneficial to lot of the customers we have being seeing. >> So if we were live, John Fourier would be DM'ing us and saying this is a perfect opportunity to ask about blockchain in general, so let's not jump on a blockchain bandwagon. Let's talk about other enabling applications including blockchain. As you look out into the next few years, how important is SAP becoming a true platform company that embraces technology such as blockchain? Or they're reaching out to Internet of Things and manufacturing companies, the solutions, other supply chain integration points, how important is SAP's participation in the larger ecosystem and technology? How important is that to the overall success of this partnership? >> You know I think the concept of intelligent enterprise is truly evolving in SAP. What it's helping I think a lot of customers do is it's connecting the dots between their customer experiences, the 360-degree view of their customers. It's looking at connected devices where there's so many devices out there, how do we bring that to the table. it's building a lot of intelligent automation. It's building connected factories so that the production efficiency is where I think there's a lot of emphasis in the next few years going to happen and of course supply chain right, where there has been the case. I think what it's bringing it all together to really have an intelligent enterprise where using whether it's blockchain, using machine learning, to be able to bring that together, because I think in isolation there are benefits, but I think the power of all of this is how do we bring it together in a very seamless manner, and that's what's very exciting. >> When they announced that this morning speaking of integration that C/4 HANA, they talked about that. I thought they did a good job of showing integrations and talking about that, but if I kind of distill that down to one of the things that their CEO has been really vocal about it's got to modernize Legacy CRM and connect, synchronize the supply chain with the demand chain. With what they're doing this momentum that the SAP is carrying through, how do you see that as a differentiator for KPIT's business to be a partner with SAP? >> Absolutely, you know, fortunately for us we've been very strong in the three-generation CRMs. I know we are now talking about the fourth generation CRM, which is C4/HANA. But having lived through the journey of the three generations, I think KPIT has a very unique proposition in the market place. We know very importantly what not to do, what are the things which did not work. I think that's a very important aspect, which I think SAP themselves have learned and that's probably why they're talking about the fourth generation CRM. And I think we are in a very unique position and that's the example. We have implemented this for a long time, and I see that with their integration what they've done with some of the other softwares like Callidus, this is gonna be a complete portfolio of solutions, which they can offer, which I think KPIT is in a very unique position, whether it's cloud for service, cloud for sales, Hybris Commerce, the Callidus, commissions. We're very well positioned to be able to provide all of this to our customers, so the portfolio is a lot more enriched, and I think it's going to be very rewarding. >> What are some of the things in terms of all those announcements that you're looking forward to at Sapphire this year in terms of I can imagine there's a wealth of, I think there's a thousand SAP sessions alone, from an education perspective? Is your team here ready to, you said your theme was Elevate IT? >> Yes. >> What are some of the things that you're excited to learn how to do for those boots on the ground? >> I think one of the areas we are excited about is we're seeing the S/4 adoption going up. I think we're very excited about that. >> I think you said 1800 customers. >> Yes and there's lots... >> And counting. >> Lot's to go but I think yeah. >> Lot of opportunity here. >> Exactly, so I think that's one we want to make sure and then I think the intelligent Enterprise. I think we're very excited about that, along with the data hub. I know it's early days, but we'll closely be watching that because data is going to be a critical aspect for all of this to be successful. So I think we're right on very excited to see those three, four areas and I think we're well positioned to really be able to take this momentum to the next level. >> So you said this was your 20th Sapphire. I think when I was doing some research on this event, it looks like they had done this for about 25 years. Wow, so do you remember back 20 years ago like how many people were at Sapphire back then compared to the... >> Absolutely. >> 20 some thousand that are just here physically this week. >> Yeah I still remember I think it was '99 Sapphire in Las Vegas, that was the only Sapphire happened Vegas. It's easier for me. I don't know why they don't do that. >> Really? >> Yeah, so there I was sitting and one of the big areas we were very excited was, if I was able to enter sales order in HP Jornada. Believe it or not, it was one of the handheld devices. >> I remember that. >> And we were very excited to see oh we are able to enter an order in an HP Jornada. And today we're talking about virtual reality where we are able to look at stuff, change the colors, and be able to order just looking at what you like. >> Transparently. >> Yeah it is unbelievable the change, so to your point, lots have changed, all the way around, whether it's technology, whether it's expectations, whether it's the number of people, number of sessions, and you know we ourselves have got about 12 sessions, customer sessions in this Sapphire. We used to have two or three at the most. >> Wow there's customer centers here and theaters. >> Yes absolutely. >> So another 20-year perspective and looking towards the future. One of the great things about SAP is, also one of the challenges. 46 years of technology and moving customers along, SAP HANA, no question it changes businesses. The stat you gave earlier 40% more orders in one single day, day one. However, what are some of the major barriers that customers face with Legacy infrastructure and moving into taking advantage of S/4 HANA? Is it customization of environments that they did? Is that business processes? Like what's the top one or two challenges customers are facing? >> Very, very good point actually. I'm glad you brought this up. We've been at this for four years. In fact one of the first HANA migrations was done by KPIT at Varian Medical, one of the very early days. So from my perspective, the customers are looking to reduce risk, because they've been working on SAP for such a long time. They built it, it's evolved, it's customized. So how do we reduce risk? In fact KPIT has built a monetization tool, which automatically correct codes, so that it takes away, reduce the risks and reduces the time. So that's one aspect is, customers are very worried about the risks aspect. Second is of course the cost, because they don't want to be spending time in just implementing another system. They want to take leverage about the intelligence, which can built in the different processes, the advantage, so they do want to make sure that that aspect is there, but I think the biggest aspect is, they are looking for the business nuggets. You know what we talked about can this propel them into different business models. Can this be relevant for the next 20 years? Because this is a big investment and that's one of the big roadmap discussions we are having with a lot of our customers. >> Relevance, you know, you really hit the nail on the head. Customers have to be relevant. They have to be able to compete and become intelligent in order to do that. Well and I wish we had more time, but we're out of time. Thank you so much for joining us on theCUBE, and again congratulations on the award, the service delivery partner of the year for Hybris that KPIT has won. >> Thank you, thank you so much. Thanks for getting me here. >> Our pleasure. We want to thank you for watching theCUBE. I'm Lisa Martin with Keith Townsend, and we are at Sapphire Now 2018. Thanks for watching. (upbeat music)

>> Announcer: Live, from Las Vegas, it's the Cube, covering AWS Re:invent 2017 presented by AWS, Intel, and our ecosystem of partners. >> Welcome back everyone, we're here live in Las Vegas for 45,000 tech industry folks and customers with Amazon re:Invent 2017. This is the Cube's exclusive coverage, I'm John Furrier, with my co-host Justin Warren this segment. Our next guest, Bill Magro, is the Chief Technologist for Intel covering HPC high performance computing. Bill, welcome to the Cube. >> Thank you. >> John: Thanks for coming on. You guys, your booth's behind us, I don't if they can see it in the wide shot, but Intel is really taking advantage of the I don't want to say Intel inside the Cloud 'cause that's really what you guys are doing, but you got so much compute, this is your wheelhouse. Compute is what Intel is. >> Bill: Right. >> Andy Jassy at AWS, talking with their customers, they want more compute, edge of the network, so HPC, high performance computing's been around for awhile. What's the state of the art and how should people think about HPC versus the Cloud, are they the same, what's the relationship? >> Intel actually thinks of HPC or high performance computing more in terms of the activity and the workloads than the infrastructure that it runs on. So very early in the days of Cloud computing, there were a lot of people who said that the Cloud was kind of the opposite of HPC and therefore, they could never go together. But we think of Cloud as a delivery vehicle, a way to get access to compute storage networking and HPC is what you're doing. And so then, if you think about HPC as kind of a range of workloads, you can start to think about which ones are a good fit for the Cloud, and which ones aren't. So we talk a little bit about the high performance computing and tailored infrastructure for the most extreme cases of HPC. That's where you see the biggest differences with Cloud, 'cause they're at opposite ends of the spectrum. >> But you see holistically the Cloud is interplaying with HPC. >> Yeah. >> They're not mutually exclusive. >> Absolutely, we see Cloud as a way to deliver HPC capabilities. So if you think of the most demanding HPC problems, the ones that are used in national security, that are used to design commercial airplanes, and so on, those are some of the hardest problems. Predicting the climate change, predicting the weather, paths of hurricanes, those are what we call grand challenge problems. Those are not running in the Cloud. Those are running on dedicated, tailored, infrastructure built for high performance computing at that extreme. And those systems have a lot of characteristics such as very high performance networks, different from ethernet, custom topologies and are designed with software to really minimize variation because it's one large problem that has to move forward. The Cloud is kinda the opposite in a sense. It started as taking a large amount of resources and making it possible to carve them up, right. It's the opposite of aggregating resources. And so that's where a lot of the early thoughts of Cloud and HPC being at odds with each other. >> It seems to be a dream scenario because I mean, in the old days, in 80s and 90s when I was breaking into the business. If you were a database guy or a compute guy, you were a specialist, it was high end kind of computing. Moore's Law, certainly Intel, you guys took advantage of it. But now, you see so much, it's cool to do more compute. So like, it's been democratized. Databases and compute, certainly in all the conversations, for everybody, not just, the technologists. >> Right, where that's where Cloud fits in for HPC. So if you think of HPC in terms of the characteristics of the workload, it's something that's really demanding computationally. The product of the computation is like an intellectual insight. You can design a better airplane wing, a safer car, you can figure out where that hurricane is going and tell which people to evacuate. There's an intellectual product to the compute. And then the last characteristic is when you apply more compute power appropriately, you get a more valuable result. So it could be better prediction of that hurricane path, it could be a safer car because you have more time, you have more capability and were able to build a better design ahead of that deadline to get that model year of the car out. And so, if you think about that, there's a lot, there's a broad spectrum and I talked about some of those most extreme problems, but even in something like designing an airplane, there might be 16, 20, a hundred different small design variations you want to explore. Well those can actually be great for The Cloud, 'cause they're small calculations and you run many of them at the same time. And the elastic capability of The Cloud augments the supercomputer that you might be using to run your hardest problems. >> So the aperture of problem-solving is huge now. >> Bill: That's right. >> You can do more. I mean we had Thorn on yesterday. Thorn was a company that partners with Intel to do, you know, find missing and exploited children. AI for good, so everything's possible. >> Yeah even AI we think of as an example of a high performance computing workload because what does it do? It gives you insights that you didn't have otherwise, it's compute intensive, and it does better when you apply more resources. So that fits our definition. So AI is definitely under the umbrella of high performance computing. >> One of the things, one of the great benefits of Cloud is the elasticity which you mentioned before. It's like, and some of the, we know that Amazon's just brought out the C5 Instances which is a specific instance site, which would be quite useful for HPC. But what is it about the bursting workloads or that elasticity that specifically works well for HPC do you think? >> Well, there's a couple use cases that we think are particularly relevant. One of them is an existing company. Just imagine some Fortune 50 manufacturer. They have a lot of stuff that they really need to build their own supercomputer for, their own high performance computing system, but their usage, even though they keep that system busy all the time, there is some variability and they have opportunity costs of an engineer sitting while their job is in the queue, 'cause you're paying that engineer but you're not giving them insights, right. And so the Cloud can augment that, but we have a lot of examples of large Fortune 500, Fortune 50 companies augmenting their on-premise with Cloud as a way to push those workloads that can run on the Cloud there, to free up those on-prem resources which are much more tailored, much more expensive and get more value out of them. >> Okay, and what's Intel doing to help customers figure out which of those workloads is best suited for Cloud and which ones are better suited for something which is running on site? >> Well, it's mostly through our influencer sales force who engages with many, many major companies and provides consulting, because Intel doesn't sell computers directly to anyone, so it's more of a knowledge, our knowledge and sharing that with people. And what we're trying to help enterprises understand is what workloads need to stay on premise, which ones can go to the Cloud and how this, the elasticity of the Cloud can augment those on-premise resources and thus, you know, go back and forth. >> It's the classic mission for Intel, make the apps go faster, faster, smaller, cheaper, right. >> And get 'em land in the right place. So really, the two biggest considerations we find in deciding whether a workload goes into the Cloud or stays on-premise in high performance computing are the following, one, is really the sensitivity of the IP. There's a lot of workloads that could run in the Cloud and people simply want to keep it on-premise 'cause they're more comfortable knowing that their IP is sitting inside their own firewall. Though the reality is, more and more companies are getting comfortable with Cloud security as they see data breaches. And realize that some of the big Cloud providers, like Amazon, maybe have better access to the security talent than they do. >> I think Goldman-Sachs just announced they're going all in. That's Goldman-Sachs, they never do a testimonial. >> So the privacy and the sensitivity of the data is king, you know, you have to be willing to put it in the Cloud. Then the second question is, is it a technical fit? And that's where this spectrum of workloads comes in. The bigger a workload goes and the more you want to speed it up but keep the workload the same size, that's what we call strong scaling and that starts to stress the network, and stress the system. And that's where these tailored systems come in. And so, you have to look at where things fall on the spectrum. A good example of workloads that would fit is these design space explorations, anything we would call pleasingly parallel or embarrassingly parallel in the industry where the communication does happen, but it's not the limiter of the calculation. So screening for a drug candidates, for personalized medicine, lot of life sciences applications, financial services is a good fit, in manufacturing a design space exploration maybe for different designs and materials for a dashboard or a component of a car. >> Bill, when you were at your Thanksgiving dinner and your family or wherever, you're moving around in your personal life, you're a technologist. How do explain the phenomenon of Amazon Web Services and the Cloud action right now? Because, you know, you're in it every day. You're close to all the action. But I get asked all the time, what's the hub-bub about AWS and it's hard to explain the phenomenon. How would describe the, I mean you're talking about tailored systems, elasticity, I mean it's a tech dream. I mean, how do you explain it to like a normal person? >> The conversation's usually pretty short because my family involves a historian, an English major, an accountant and people who really couldn't have, a musician, a singer, people who really don't have the slightest interest in technology. >> It's hard to talk about lambda, when you're. >> So I'm really the only technologist in my family so I just avoid it, but the question does come up with my parents. You know, parents like to brag on their kids so they like to know what you do, and every year my mom asks me what I do and I try to explain high performance computing to her and she says, oh, I don't get it. But when you explain it in terms of things like climate modeling and being able to support the nuclear test ban that's worldwide, that's done with high performance computing. Safing cars, finding missing children, better quality of life through all the AI that we're now experiencing. >> John: Analytics is a great use case. >> Then people say, oh, you know, they can understand the use cases. The elasticity of the Cloud, really is not something that I discuss with family, but even coworkers, I think, that's what the conversation focuses on. Recognizing that high performance computing is a range of workloads. >> Okay, so I'll rephrase it differently. What's your perspective on, what observations that you get excited about that are enabled now by these new use cases? 'Cause there's new things now that are possible. The number of computations, you got analytics, you mentioned a few of them. What jumps out at you, wow, that's really awesome, we can do that now? >> You know, this is gonna sound a little odd, and maybe not what you expected, but I'm not actually a technology enthusiast, believe it or not, despite. I think technology's cool, I like what it does, but I don't get super excited about technology. One of the things that I'm excited about with the Cloud is probably at the opposite extreme of what you would expect which is, back to, how does the elasticity of the Cloud fit? There's so many companies in this world who could benefit from high performance computing and don't today. A recent study showed that 95 percent of U.S. small medium manufacturers which is over 300,000 are not using HPC today. And so, as they're part of this supply chain, whether it's into a Boeing or and Airbus or a Lockheed Martin or a Honda or a Toyota, there's this whole supply chain. HPC's being used at the top, it's not being used at the bottom, so I think the Cloud is actually really, really exciting because it allows somebody to get over those initial hurdles, the cap-ex, getting access to pay as you go, prove the value proposition, because a small medium business actually has to take a risk to use HPC. They have to divert capital and divert resources. And they could lose a contract. >> So do you see a lot more companies starting to take advantage of some of this high performance computing capability just because it's now, you can rent it by the hour and try it out, give it a bit of a whirl, and then see, actually this is going to be really valuable for us, and then deploy a lot more of it. >> Exactly and that's one of the key things we're promoting is 'cause we want to bring more people into the world of high performance computing. So, AWS provides all the building blocks. Compute, elastic storage and so on. But high performance computing applications really expect a specific type of platform that they can run on, and that platform aggregates the resources so there's a number of companies Rescale is one, Psycho-Computing, and others who are actually providing that platform layer. And then once you've got the platform layer, all the, I'll call it the, geeky stuff that they do, AWS has abstracted away. Now the applications can run and that's that's what's bringing new users in. >> Bill, final question for you. AWS launched its C5 Instances. What's that about, what's it mean for customers? Can you explain a little bit more on that one piece? >> Sure, we're delighted to see Amazon deploying the C5 Instances. It's based on our latest technology in the Xeon product family. We call that the Intel Xeon scalable processor family. It includes, it's based on what we call Skylake technology or code name Skylake. There's a lot of innovations in that processor and that platform that are specifically driven by the needs of high performance computing. There's something called AVX 512, which is a doubling of the vector width. Means that every core can actually do 32 floating point, double-precision floating point operations per clock. That's tremendous, tremendous compute capability, in a 2X over the previous generation. On the memory bandwidth side, which is another huge factor for high performance computing applications, like 66 percent increase in memory bandwidth. So it's a balanced platform, and we're seeing improvements in high performance computing apps of anywhere from 1.7x sometimes almost up to 5x improvement in going from the C4 to C5 Instances on a per note basis. >> This is really going to enable a lot of action. IOT, tons of great stuff. >> Absolutely and as I talked about that range of HPC and you know, what fits and what doesn't fit in the Cloud, every generation of technology, what fits in the Cloud is growing, and C5 is another important step in that direction. >> Bill, thanks for coming on the Cube. Bill Magro, Chief Technologist at Intel, HPC, high performance computing. The Cloud is one big high performance machine in the sky, wherever you want to look at it, really great opportunity at enabling all new use cases, doing things for society benefits, and customers. Great stuff here, Cloud impact is significant. IOT to the Cloud. This is the Cube, doing our share here at AWS in Las Vegas. We'll be right back with more coverage after this short break. (electronic music)

>> Announcer: Live, from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE, covering AWS re:Invent 2017. Presented by AWS, Intel, and our ecosystem of partners. >> Welcome back everyone, live here in Las Vegas it's AWS re:Invent, it's theCUBE exclusive coverage of re:Invent 2017, our 5th year covering Amazon, watching the explosive growth. I'm John Furrier, the co-founder of SiliconANGLE Media, with Justin Warren my co-host here for this segment. Our next guest is Raejeanne Skillern, Vice President of the Data Center Group and also General Manager of the Cloud Service Provider, part of Intel. Welcome to theCUBE. >> Thank you very much, it's nice to be here again. >> So, Intel inside the Cloud is big growth for you, what's the numbers look like, your earnings look pretty good, what's the business update? >> You know, it is growing, and it's growing in so many different angles, it's coming from multiple fronts. Part of it is just these killer workloads that are driving the need for change. Artificial Intelligence, immersive media, network transformation to handle all the data. It is causing this real spur in growth, from both the very largest of Cloud service providers across the ecosystem, and one of the things when I look at the growth, I try to say, now where is it really coming from? Yes, Amazon is just insanely growing fast and the big guys are doing well, their global expansion, But, also, the next wave of Cloud service providers, and regions, and different countries, are doing really well too, they're actually growing faster, so the whole ecosystem is growing with demand. >> Yeah, it's certainly not slowing down. I can't see any way in which that it would slow down at all, if anything it's just gonna get faster. >> I think so, and when I track trends like CapEx spending and analyst predictions on the future, consumer demand, everything indicates we're gonna see another strong 5-10 years. >> Justin: Yep. >> So how do the Cloud service providers shake out because if you look at this creativity of software renaissance, the interactivity, all the amazing use cases, from Thorn, finding missing exploited children, to, you know, high end HPC scientists, genome sequencing stuff. Massive use cases. >> Raejeanne: Right. >> So that's going to be a tsunami of software developers, Changing. How does that shape the Cloud providers, does it segment them into tiers, how are you guys looking at that business? >> Well I think it breeds a lot of new opportunity. So, yes, you see more and more new services and capabilities to enable developers to more easily develop code, to more quickly, to get better utilization out of their code. But I also think just the concept of a mocking performance and ease, means new insights, new services, new capabilities, things that we just couldn't, a developer, we could not have done before. So it's that, just like electricity, when you make it cheaper and easier to consume, we use more of it. I think Cloud computing is the same way. So we're seeing kind of a natural tam expansion, market expansion, around these things you just couldn't do without the Cloud. >> And new workloads, too. >> And new workloads. >> And all of those workloads, Intel is basically completely repositioning itself from just being a chip company, it's like, you're a data company now. So, what are some of the things that Intel's doing to help people understand how they can make use of these new software techniques, and these new tools, and the capabilities of the Intel chips they're dependent on. So what are some of the things that Intel's doing there? >> So obviously it starts at the bottom, with the best silicon, not just compute, but compute, network, and storage, and accelerators, for all different workloads. We move up to the platforms, we do a lot of hardware engineering with the ecosystem, with our top CSPs, actually many top CSPs, we do direct engineering work to get better systems of architecture. We have a host of libraries we're creating that ease of use, and mocking performance out of it. Reference architectures, co-partners, and solutions. So for us when we talk about being a data company, we can't do it from just even being a chip, we have to be a solutions partner, with Cloud service providers, enterprise, IOT edge solutions, we try to be there. >> You guys always enabled some very cool demos in the day, even back on the PC you always had interactivity, you pioneered multimedia. You always had that eye on the applications. Okay, on stage today all this greatness is out there: NFL demos, all this cool stuff. That's really powering your business, so talk about your relationship with Amazon web services, what's it like, how do you guys engage with them, what's the relationship, 'cause you guys are power engine for AWS. >> Yeah, well we try to be. We wanna be the best performance into their data center. We've had a many, many, many year deep relationship with Amazon. It started from simple co-development and engineering, and is extended much more pervasively across their environment and it poured sometimes into the services. We just, we want to one, make sure that what we're delivering today has been already optimized specifically for their unique environment, and that means we have to start a year or two before, if not earlier, to really understand where they're going, and get their feedback, so that when we either optimize a product or technology across compute network or storage, or create something potentially custom for them, right, it takes a number of years of work, so our partnership has a lot of in-depth engineering, it has a lot of future and near-term enabling, and then we hope to see an expansion. What we really want to do is use our technology to differentiate Amazon. We want their services better because of the technologies or capabilities we put in, so wherever they wanna align in terms of strategic investment and growth markets, we wanna make sure the silicon can enable it. >> Intel always marched to the cadence of Moore's law, and you guys have always been a rapid machine, execution. Amazon looks good, I mean, they're executing. >> Raejeanne: They're fast. >> I mean, what's it like? Share some story, I mean, they're years ahead, what's it like working with Amazon? >> Well I think, I mean, they are fast. It's amazing how quickly they can move and innovate, how rapidly those innovations roll out to the market. I will be honest, there are times where we miss windows because we are slow, and they just look at us like, "Well we told you "this four weeks ago, here it is, right?" (laughing) >> Can't design a chip in four weeks. We don't have kubernetes, no containers for chips. >> I mean they are just, they have it down. So what we're trying to do is part of this transition from being a client company, to a Cloud and data center company, and IOT company, means everything we have to do is faster. So we have to design our chips more quickly, we have to put in more modularity for faster derivatives, and we have to move at Cloud speed, not classic Intel speed. >> Right, yeah. So what are some of the lessons that other companies can take from Intel, I mean it's a hardware company, or it was originally a hardware company, and now you've transitioned to being a Cloud company, and you're being pushed by Amazon to move faster and faster. So what are some of the lessons that you can share with other companies who are trying to start moving at Cloud speed? >> You know, I think, I love Jeff Bezos' approach, customer-obsessed. If you aren't understanding how the end customers, starting with Amazon's customers, but also then my customer, Amazon, how they're using and consuming technology, we can't really create good technology. I would say a lot of companies create a great thing and then try to go sell it at markets, >> Yep. >> Versus starting with the market, and creating the specific thing. The other thing we've learned, I mean, Intel is a very data driven company, both in our decision making, as well as our company growth, this is, and we talk about it from a developer envirogroup, but it's the same iterate fast. Fail quickly and move on. You don't need perfect. This is one of our learnings, right? Don't wait six months for perfect, move fast, get 70-80% of the way there, I've heard governments say they get 40-50 way percent of there, make decisions, because they have to move that quickly. For military or other exercises. So what we're trying to do is match that type of speed as well. >> It's a world of compute now, I mean, I was at Alibaba Conference, they had their Cloud coachings hearing it here, the same message: more compute. They're not saying I need more little chips, they're saying I want more horsepower. >> Raejeanne: Right. >> And you guys just announced the C5 instance, recently, a couple weeks. >> And the budget. >> What is that gonna do? I mean, it's fairly new. >> Raejeanne: Yes. >> What does that mean? Is that gonna be an IOT edge opportunity? Is it all workloads? That's gonna be like, a pretty big deal. What's your take on it? >> It is, their C instant line has always been for high performances growing workloads. We're seeing like, for HPC workloads, anywhere from two to four-and-a-half X the performance moving from C4 to C5, right? This is an instance that can handle the most demanding workloads from high performance compute to artificial Intelligence to others. So, you know, we have our latest and greatest Intel ZN scalable process in there, a very high performant one, that we customized specifically for their environment, but then they do all this amazing software work and efficiency work around it, to really unlock. I was really glad to see when they talked about those C5 instances launching, 25% on workload's price performance up to 50% price performance improvements on some others. So, I mean, once again, when you can take more compute and make it more cost effective, it's just a lot more things people can do in the industry, so we're very excited about that instance. >> What's the biggest thing in the past five years that jumped out at you in the massive change in the industry? Application, startups, business growth? What amazes you? >> Yeah, there's so much, I would kind of combine it under what the industry calls Digital Transformation. You know, when I look at it, one of the points that always sticks in my mind, is CEOs, 70% of them have digital transformation at the heart because the data suggests that by the end of 2018, the top 40% of the top 20, 40% of the top 20 industries are gonna be disrupted. So that to me, that amount of disruption happening, and the company's trying to disrupt themselves whether it's healthcare, retail, manufacturing, oil and glass, the use and pervasiveness of where technology and Cloud can fit has really kind of astonished me and I love, once again, I love that they're making what they do today better. But the new things that they're doing, I mean, in healthcare, right? It's just amazing. >> I mean, we used to use the word back in the day when I broke into the biz in the '80s, Data Processing Department. I mean, the Cloud is one big data processor. >> It is. It is a compute power. We call it the brain, right? If Cloud is now ubiquitous, right? It is, from public Cloud to private to Edge, and everything in between, it's that brain, right? >> John: It's the brain. >> That's enabling the compute, so we have to-- >> You people have always been on the inside of everything, so congratulations on your success, on the Cloud growth. General manager of the Cloud service provider and Vice President of Data Center Group, Raejeanne Skillern, here inside theCUBE with Intel, I'm Jeff Furrier with Justin Warren, back with more live coverage, here in Las Vegas, for Amazon web services 2017 re:Invent. More after this short break. (techno music)

>> Announcer: Live from Las Vegas. Its theCube, covering NAB 2017. Brought to you by HGST. >> Hi welcome back to theCube, we are live from NAB 2017. I'm Lisa Martin in Las Vegas, excited to be joined by the co-founder of Avalanche, Josh Kolden. Hey Josh, welcome to theCube. >> Thank you. >> So tells us a little bit about what Avalanche is. >> Well, Avalanche is a file navigator for film makers. It allows, the difference being from something like Windows Explorer or an Apple finder, is that it allows you to work with files wherever they are, on different computers, in the cloud, on different units of production as they're moving around the world. Without having to do all the low-level coordinating of that data. >> So in media we're talking about massive files. How is this different from Dropbox, Box, et cetera? >> So those tools actually try to synchronize your data. So they, if you put a big media file in Dropbox it'll try to copy not only the file to the cloud but also of course to any other computers you have your Dropbox running on. What Avalanche is doing, doesn't necessarily can move it, but it doesn't necessarily move it. Instead, let's say you're an editor or studio and you want to see what's happening on set, you can see all the files as they're coming off of a camera and interact with them. Rename them, make notes, whatever has to happen, see the notes that are already applied to them. And when those files show up in editorial, in say hard drive that's when all that happens, and gets synchronized locally. So it allows people to work in a very intuitive and natural production workflow, without actually trying to copy huge amounts of data across the net. >> In terms of like the production life cycle, are we talking about pre-production, production, post-production, or the whole kit and caboodle? >> It's the whole thing, because what happens in production is you see teams of people kind of ad hoc join the production, they might have teams during pre-production that are there for a bit and teams that come on in post-production. So there's always this coordination problem of knowing who has what, you know, where is the camera? Post-production's looking for camera imports that only people that were on set know about. And this provides a mechanism to kind of have a continuity between all those different teams across the entire production pipeline. >> Continuity is key. What, give us an example, you had mentioned, and this is really built for filmmakers. If something is filmed and the crew or the director decides, you know what, that would've been great if we'd actually shot that for VR. What's the process of them, or how simple is it or seamless for them to go back in, pull something out, change it? >> Well, in those kinds of situations, I mean production generally, usually has a lot of planning involved. So you're going to know going in those kinds of issues, if it's something as big as, we want to have extra footage for VR or whatever. But one thing that happens is, let's say for example, there's a costume change where you've got a product which is a suit or something, that needs to be placed in the scene for the financing and then somebody spills something on it, but story-wise that works, so they're going to keep it in. People that are in the product teams later down the line might need to know these changes have occurred so they can either pushback and say, no we need to re-shoot that with a clean suit, or whatever that information might be. That back and forth. So this makes that even possible at all. Before it would just be making sure that somebody on production called the, that team and explained it to them. Right now, with this, you can just put a quick note on any device and it eventually be findable, you can just search it like Google, and find any information related to that suit, or that shot, or that production day. Any kind of different ways of searching for the stuff you're looking for. >> So facilitating a little bit of automation. You talk about the connectivity, but also it sounds like the visibility is there, much more holistic. >> Yeah we call it discoverability, because right now a lot of the stuff isn't discoverable. Once, say you don't know what row database entry is, once you've lost that row number. There's no way to find out where that data comes from anymore, it's just completely disconnected. So we use a framework, it's open sourced underneath, called C4, the Cinema Content Creation Cloud and that framework provides a mechanism that what they called indelible metadata where it binds attributes to media in a way that doesn't easily get lost. So downstream you can discover relationships you didn't expect to be there. You don't have to preplan all the relationships and build them in advance. >> So one of the things you and I were chatting about before we went live is how, how Silicon Valley approaches this cloud. Versus how Hollywood approaches it. Tell us a little bit more about your insights there, I thought it was very intriguing. >> Yeah, this is a really interesting thing because not a lot of people realize, because a lot of people were on both sides, Hollywood and Silicon Valley, were using the same terminology. We're talking about the cloud, we're talking about files, we're talking about copying things. But there's subtle differences that get lost. And so what I've been working on a lot in the open sourced community, and in standards is helping to communicate this new concept that what we really need is, like a web for media production. With a normal web that most of Silicon Valley and cloud tools are built on, you're expecting to be able to transfer all your data each time. You go to the website, you get the webpage right then, you get all the images that it links to right then. But you don't want to do that when you're doing media production cause that might represent terabytes of data for each shot. And you need to work relatively quickly. You might be doing renders or composites, these things might take many many many elements to layer together. You can't be requesting this data as you need it every single time. You want to kind of get there and use, do all the processing you can possibly do all at once. So an architecture like that calls for a different kind of internet. An internet where your data moves less often. You get it to the cloud and you leave it there, and you do all your processing on it. Or it's in editorial, you do all your editing with it. The pieces that you need are in the right places, and you move them as little as possible. You move, command and control and metadata between those locations, but the media itself needs to arrive either maybe by hard drive or get synced in advance, there's different ways of that moving, but it doesn't happen at the same time that the command and control is happening. So yeah, we are trying to communicate that difference. That Hollywood is used to it happening because they have the data center in their building. Silicon Valley's used to it happening because it's small data across the network. And that's where that disconnect is happening, is they both think it's just a quick call, but it works for them because of a different architecture that they're building on top of. >> Different architectures, different, I imagine objectives. How are you helping to influence Silicon Valley coming together with Hollywood and really them influencing each other? Whether it's Hollywood influencing the type of internet that's needed and why, and Silicon Valley influencing maybe get away from the on prem data centers. Leverage hybrid as a destination, as a journey. Leverage the cloud for economies of scale. What's that influence like? >> Yeah, it's really fantastic because I think it's a perfect, it's really really good relationships between the kinds of skill-sets that Silicon Valley companies bring to the table, and the kinds of creations talent that Hollywood has. In fact, there's a lot of what Hollywood production studios don't want to have to invest in. They don't want to have a data center. If they can have a secure, productive, as you need it tool set, that they turn up they performance on when they're in production and then turn it off when they're done. That's exactly what we do with camera equipment. We rent it for the production and we give it back. So we're used to in Hollywood, that production model. So it's kind of teed up and ready to use all those services, it's just this kind of plumbing level that has been everybody's pain point. >> So from a collaboration perspective, are you facilitating, like a big cloud provider meeting with one of the big studios and really collaborating to kind of cross pollinate? >> Yeah so, I've been working with the Entertainment Technology Center, that's funded, at USC yeah, they're funded by all the major studios, and have other members like Google and other big vendors for cloud and whatnot. And these groups are very interested in trying to collaborate with technology companies and figure out the best ways to work together. And I have a lot of experience with cloud and computer technology and Silicon Valley style services. And also for production. So I've been working extensively in trying to bridge that gap, in terms of the understanding, but also in terms of some fundamental tools like I was saying, the open source framework, C4, so that, kind of like the web and HTML and all that stuff came about. Nobody could go to that level of the internet and create that new economy of the internet until those foundations were in place. So that's what we've been pushing. >> Speaking of foundation, last question before we wrap here. Where are you in this, kind of first use case example of the meeting of the minds? How close are you to really fixing this facilitated to really support what both sides need? >> We've actually been doing a number of production tasks over at ETC. We've shot several short films using these things. So all these things are actually in place and usable today. It's just a matter of getting people to start using them, be aware of them. They're all free and, you know, easy to use, relatively for technical people, for Silicon Valley people. And then there's going to be another layer that we're really, that's why we're talking a lot about it, that's going to be the software companies and the hardware companies supporting it. We're pushing it through standards. So it'll be showing up on everybody's radar soon. And we'll see higher level integrations, so the digital artists that don't know how to do that lower level software stuff will just get it for free from the tools they use. And that's kind of what the Avalanche file manager does, it provides a lot of that cloud technology underneath and you don't have to worry about it, it just looks like a file manager. >> Very exciting. Thanks so much Josh for sharing your insights and what you're working on. We look forward to seeing those things coming to the forefront very soon. >> Alright, thank you. >> Thanks for joining us on theCube and we want to thank you for watching theCube. Again I'm Lisa Martin, we are live at NAB 2017, in Las Vegas, but stick around we will be right back.