>>from the Cube Studios in Palo Alto and Boston. It's the Cube covering empowering the autonomous enterprise brought to you by Oracle Consulting. >>Welcome back to the Cube, everybody. This is a special digital presentation sponsored by Oracle Consulting. We go out to the events, we extract the signal from the noise and we're going to multiple locations to really try to understand better the rebirth of or consulting. Stephanie Trunzo is here. She's the head of transformation and offerings. North America. Stephanie, good to see >>you. Good to see you. >>Okay, so we talked about sort of the mission of Oracle Consulting. Now let's get into it and talk about what some of the customers we're seeing. There's this theme in the industry that Gartner brought about by motor. Like you guys are talking about Tri Motor like, Yeah. So what is that? All of the >>well, two wasn't good enough. >>So we had 1/3. >>So my model I t to speed I t The idea there is. A lot of modern enterprises are struggling with this challenge between the systems of record that they have that are have to be sources of truth. They're often slow to change. There's a lot of rigor around transfer, forming those systems of record. And then on the second side, on the bi model side, there are the systems of interaction or systems of engagement. They're sometimes called, and those systems are things like the applications where there's users, customers at the other end and they need to move at the speed of business. And so the idea of bi modal i t. And what a lot of our clients are struggling with currently is how do you serve both of those needs? At the same time, there's complications in the process is the tools and certainly in the budget. And at the same time, there's kind of looming out there This, you know, threat almost that if you aren't in ai ml data driven world yet, you're going to fall behind. And so our clients are struggling with the fact that they have not yet successfully addressed by motile I t but still have to figure out how to get into this ai space. So our third system hence try model I t is the systems of intelligence. >>The third piece obviously relates to machine intelligence Ai nml it seems like that type of capability would apply to both systems of record and systems of engagement. Is that is that how you're looking? >>Yes, and so the try motile i t concept is kind of three different systems and how they interlock and relate to one another. If you think about systems of record the currency, so to speak, for systems of record or processes. If you think about the currency for systems of interaction, it's the people. It's the users. It's the humans and the system. The currency for the system of intelligence is data to your point. So when you're talking about systems of intelligence, collecting and leveraging data from all three systems is going to be what fuels your system of intelligence going forward. >>And that's the common thread between all three, and it just seems to me that is ultimately the underpinning of modernization. I wonder what your customers how do they view and how do you view modernization? >>So the awesome thing about being at Oracle is data is our DNA. That's where Oracle started from. That's where we still are today is data underpins everything we dio all of the technology that we build is built on the understanding that it must be data driven. And so when we're looking at all three of those systems and you're looking at it from an Oracle perspective, data is at the heart of even systems of record of even systems of interaction, not only the systems of intelligence. When our clients are looking at modernization, they're trying to figure out a way to kind of leap frogged this story and get the whole way to a place where they're getting intelligence and insights out of their data. They're not just unlocking it. They're not just moving workloads in a lift and shift kind of model. They're doing it because they want to serve the ultimate outcome that they get smarter as a business >>club. Customers want to go from where they are today to some outcome, and I want to spend a $1,000,000,000 they don't want to disrupt their business. They have to make investments clearly. How do they get from point A to point B on that cloud journey? >>So we've built something called the Cloud Evolution Framework. That cloud evolution framework has several different phases and stages, and it's intended to be kind of a skeleton toe have that conversation with clients. Are you thinking about all of the things you need to consider to make a healthy decision that has a real road map behind it? To your point on budget? And this is part of the Tri Motility conversation is they're struggling. I've talked to so many CIOs who are struggling to figure out I right now I'm spending 90% of my spend is on maintenance of systems versus on innovation. So how do I shift that spending story to something that's actually going to move the needle on getting the business ahead? That's going to serve my stakeholders, who are the lines of business in a way that is not additive to my budget but actually a shift of the budget. And so we're looking at from a cloud perspective, helping our clients make that monetary shift. Make the shift of the budget where they're self financing their own innovation by getting smarter and faster on moving their workloads to the cloud. >>Because use this concept and others do as well of the autonomous enterprise, you have autonomous database drill into that get passed the buzzwords. What is the autonomous enterprise and what's Oracle's fit there? >>Yeah, I think one of the big misconceptions when people hear autonomous is that they think it means without people, and that's not right. So autonomous means that you're helping elevate all the parts of the system to their highest value, which means you don't need to worry about security patches. You don't need to worry about repairing things on the database. Those kinds of autonomous things is, is the technology helping heal and serve itself? That doesn't mean you don't need people anymore. What it means is two things you need the experts that can help make sure that you're optimizing the value you get out of the autonomous tooling. But it also means that the humans are now freed up to do different kinds of high value work. So an autonomous enterprise would be one where they're really sort of self actualized in the sense that their technology is feeding itself. It's getting smarter and they're getting insights out of that so that the people in their business are as valuable as they can be. Leveraging the insights from the technology, >>I can see how that trickles into I t. no question about it. You can get the autonomous I T organization trickle into the autonomous enterprise, and I know it's early days, but >>so these kinds of transformations, I believe, are fundamentally across the whole company. And this is true at Oracle as well we have. We have something called Oracle at Oracle, and it's about drinking our own champagne and applying our own technology in house. So it's not just in an I T organization capacity. It's across, you know, HR procurement, legal, every supporting function that you can imagine so that cultural change bleeds out across the entire body of the company. And I believe fully that if you're going after something like an AI mission or an autonomous enterprise, you know, state, which is an evolution that you need to involve everyone in the company in different roles. >>So what's that future state look like? >>I think the future state looks like, ah, place where you're not just getting incremental gains on business processes or task that already exist. Your fundamentally seeing shifts in the way the business runs itself as a result of the technology learning and getting smarter, and the people who were benefiting from that technology, changing the way they operate in the company as well. >>Try model. We watching Stephanie. Thanks so much. >>Absolutely Thanks. >>Thank you for watching you watching the Cube at the special digital presentation. We'll be right back right after this short break.

>>From the cube studios in Palo Alto in Boston. It's the cube covering empowering the autonomous enterprise brought to you by Oracle consulting. >>Welcome back to the cube everybody. This is a special digital presentation sponsored by Oracle consulting. We go out to the events, we extract the signal from the noise and we're going to multiple locations to really try to understand better. The rebirth of Oracle consulting. Stephanie Trunzo is here. She's the head of transformation and offerings at Oracle consulting North America. Stephanie, good to see you. Good to see you. Okay, so we talked about sort of the mission of Oracle consulting. Now let's get into it and talk about what some of the customers are seeing. There's this theme in the industry that Gardner brought up about bi-modal it. You guys are talking about try mode lights, so what is that all about? >>Well, two wasn't good enough, so we had to add a third. So bi-modal it, two-speed it. The idea there is a lot of modern enterprises are struggling with this challenge between the systems of record that they have that are have to be sources of truth. They're often slow to change. Um, there's a lot of rigor around transfer forming those systems of record. And then on the second side, on the bi-modal side, there are the systems of interaction or systems of engagement they're sometimes called. And those systems are things like the applications where there's um, users, customers at the other end and they need to move at the speed of business. And so the idea of bi-modal it and what a lot of our clients are struggling with currently is how do you serve both of those needs at the same time, there's complications in the processes, the tools, and certainly in the budget. And at the same time there's kind of looming out there this, you know, threat almost that if you aren't in the AI ML data-driven world yet you're going to fall behind. And so our clients were struggling with the fact that they have not yet successfully addressed by modal it, but still have to figure out how to get into this AI space. So our third system, hence trimodal it is the systems of intelligence. >>This is the third piece that obviously relates to machine intelligence, AI. And ML. It seems like that type of capability would apply to both systems of record and systems of engagement. Is that, is that how you're doing? >>Yes. And so the tri modal it concept is kind of three different systems and how they interlock and relate to one another. If you think about systems of record, the currency, so to speak, for systems of record or processes. If you think about the currency for systems of interaction, it's the people, it's the users, it's the humans and the cysts. The currency for the system of intelligence is data. To your point. So when you're talking about systems of intelligence collecting and leveraging data from all three systems is going to be what fuels your system of intelligence going forward. >>And that's the common thread between all three. And it just seems to me that is ultimately the underpinning of I wonder what do your customers, how do they view and how do you view modernization? >>So the awesome thing about being at Oracle is data is our DNA. That's where Oracle started from. That's where we still are today is data underpins everything we do. All of the technology that we build is built on the understanding that it must be data driven. And so when we're looking at all three of those systems and you're looking at it from an Oracle perspective, data is at the heart of even systems of record, of even systems of interaction, not only the systems of intelligence. When our clients are looking at modernization, they're trying to figure out a way to kind of leapfrog this story and get the whole way to a place where they're getting intelligence and insights out of their data. They're not just unlocking it, they're not just moving workloads in a lift and shift kind of model. They're doing it because they want to serve the ultimate outcome that they get smarter as a business. >>Talk about cloud. Customers want to go from where they are today to some outcome, some endpoint, and they don't want to spend a zillion dollars and they don't want to disrupt their business. They're going to have to make investments clearly. How do they get from point a to point B on that cloud journey? >>So we've built something called the cloud evolution framework. That cloud evolution framework has several different phases and stages and it's intended to be a kind of a skeleton to have that conversation with clients. Um, are you thinking about all of the things you need to consider to make a healthy decision that has a real roadmap behind it? To your point on budget, and this is part of the tri modal it conversation is they're struggling. I've talked to so many CEOs who are struggling to figure out, I, right now I'm spending, you know, 90% of my spend is on maintenance of systems versus on innovation. So how do I shift that spending story to something that's actually gonna move the needle on getting the business ahead that's going to serve my stakeholders? Who are the lines of business in a way that is, um, not additive to my budget, but actually a shift of the budget. And so we're looking at, from a cloud perspective, helping our clients make that monetary shift, make the shift of the budget where they're self financing their own innovation by getting smarter and faster on moving their workloads. To the, >>you guys use this concept and others do as well of the autonomous enterprise. You have autonomous database. I wonder if we could drill into that path, get past the buzzwords. What is the autonomous enterprise and what's the Oracle's fit there? >>Yeah, I think one of the big misconceptions when people hear autonomous is that they think it means without people. And that's not right. So autonomous means that you're helping elevate all the parts of the system to their highest value, which means you don't need to worry about security patches. You don't need to worry about repairing things on the database. Um, those kinds of autonomous things is, is the technology helping heal and itself? That doesn't mean you don't need people anymore. What it means is two things. You need the experts that can help make sure that you're optimizing the value you get out of the autonomous tooling. But it also means that the humans are now freed up to do different kinds of high value work. So an autonomous enterprise would be one where they're really sort of self actualized in the sense that their technology is feeding itself. It's getting smarter and they're getting insights out of that so that the people in their business are as valuable as they can be. Leveraging the insights from the technical. >>So I can see how that trickles into it. No question about it. Can, can the autonomous it organization trickle into the autonomous enterprise? And I mean, I know it's sort of early days, but how do you see that? >>So the, these kinds of transformations I believe are fundamentally across the whole company. And this is true at Oracle as well. We have, um, we have something called Oracle at Oracle and it's about drinking our own champagne and applying our own technology in house. So it's not just in an it organization capacity, it's across, you know, HR, procurement, legal, every supporting function that you can imagine. Um, so that cultural change bleeds out across the entire body of the company. And I, I believe fully that if you're going after something like an AI mission or an autonomous enterprise, you know, state which is an evolution that you need to involve everyone in the company in different roles. >>So what's that future state look like? >>I think the future state looks like a place where you're not just getting, um, incremental gains on business processes or tasks that already exist. You're fundamentally, um, seeing shifts in the way the business runs itself as a result of the technology learning and getting smarter and the people who are benefiting from that technology changing the way they operate in the company as well. >>Trimodal it will be watching, right. Stephanie, thanks so much. It's great. Thank you for watching. You're watching the cube at the special digital presentation. We'll be right back right after this short break.

(techno music) [Announcer] Live from Las Vegas, its the Cube! Covering Fortinet Accelerate 18. Brought to you buy Fortinet. >> Welcome back to the Cube's continuing coverage of Fortinet Accelerate 2018. I'm Lisa Martin joined by my cohost Peter Burris, and we have a very cozy set. Right now, I'd like to introduce you to our next guests, Daniel Bernard, the vice-president of business development for SentinelOne, and Basil Habib, you are the IT director at Tri City Foods. Gentleman, welcome to the Cube. >> Great to be here, thanks. >> We're excited to have you guys here. So first, Daniel first question to you. Tell us about SentinelOne, what's your role there, and how does SentinelOne partner with Fortinet? >> Sure, I run technologies integration and alliances. SentinelOne is a next generation endpoint protection platform company. Where we converge EPP and EDR into one agent that operates autonomously. So whether its connected to the internet or not, we don't rely on a cloud deliver solution. It works just as well online and offline. And we're there to disrupt the legacy AV players that have been in this market for 25 years with technology driven by artificial intelligence to map every part of the threat life cycle to specific AI capabilities, so we can stop attacks before they even occur. >> And your partnership with Fortinet, this is your first Accelerate, so talk to us about the duration of that partnership and what is differentiating-- >> Yeah. >> Lisa: For you. >> Its great to be here at Accelerate and also to work with Fortinet. We've been working with them for about a year and a half, and we're proud members of the Fortinet Security Fabric. What it means to us is that for enterprises, like Tri City Foods that we'll talk about, a defense and depth approach is really the way to go. Fortinet, leading edge, network security solutions. We have a very meaningful and exciting opportunity to work with Fortinet, given the breadth of our APIs. We have over 250 APIs, the most of any endpoint solution out there on the market. So the things we can enable within Fortinet's broad stack is really powerful. Fortinet has a lot of customers, a lot of endpoints in their environments to protect. So we're proud to partner with Fortinet to help go after those accounts together. To not only go into those accounts ourselves but also strengthen the security that Fortinet is able to offer their customers as well. >> If we can pivot on that for just a second. How do you-- how does SentinelOne help strengthen, for example, some of the announcements that came out from Fortinet this morning about the Security Fabric? How do you give an advantage to Fortinet? >> Sure. So where we come in, is we sit at the endpoint level and we're able to bring a lot of different pieces of intelligence to core and critical Fortinet assets. For example, with the Fortinet connector that we are going to be releasing tomorrow, so a little sneak peek on that right here on the Cube. The endpoint intelligence is actually through API to API connections able to go immediately into FortiSandbox and then be pushed to FortiGate. And that's in real time. So, whether an endpoint is inside of a network or running around somewhere in the world, whether its online or offline, a detection and a conviction we make through the SentinelOne client and the agent that actually sits on the endpoint, all the sudden is able to enrich and make every single endpoint inside of a Fortinet network much smarter and prone and also immune from attacks before they even occur. >> So as you think about that, how does it translate into a company like Tri City which has a large number of franchises, typically without a lot of expertise in those franchises, to do complex IT security but still very crucial data that has to be maintained and propagated. >> Well from Tri City's perspective, we look into security environment. And when you look into the Security Fabric between Fortinet and SentinelOne, that really helps us out a great deal. By looking into automating some of theses processes, mitigating some of these threats, that integration and the zero-day attack that can be prevented, that really helps us out day one. >> So tell us a little bit about Tri City. >> Well Tri City Foods is basically the second largest Franchisees for Burger King. We currently have approximately about 500 locations. Everybody thinks about Burger King as just the, you know, you go purchase Whopper. But nobody knows about all of the technology that goes in the back and in order to support that environment. You look into it, you got the Point of Sale, taking your credit card transaction, you got your digital menu board, you got all of the items in the back end, the drive-through. And we support all of those devices and we ensure that all of these are working properly, and operating efficiently. So if one of these devices is not functioning, that's all goes down. The other thing we do is basically we need to ensure that the security is up, most important for us. We're processing credit card transaction, we cannot afford to have any kind of issue to the environment. And this is, again, this is were SentinelOne comes into the picture where all of our devices down there are protected with the solution, as well as protecting the assets with Fortinet security. >> So I hear big environment complexity. Tell us about the evolution of security in your environment. You mention SentinelOne but how has that evolved as you have to, you said so many different endpoints that are vulnerable and there's personal information. Tell us about this evolution that you helped drive. >> The issue I put an end to when I first started on that is, we had the traditional antivirus. We had traditional antivirus, its just basically protecting what it knows about, it did not protect anything that is zero-day. We got in a head to a couple ransom wares. Which we are not willing to take any chances with the environment. That evolution came through as, no we cannot afford to have these type of system be taken down or be compromised. And we do like to assure the security of our clients. So this is, again, this is where we decided to go into the next gen and for protection. Ensuring the uptime and the security of the environment. >> But very importantly, you also don't have the opportunity to hire really, really expensive talent in the store to make sure that the store is digitally secure. Talk a little bit about what Daniel was talking about, relative to AI, automation, and some of the other features that you're looking for as you ensure security in those locations. >> The process to go down there is basically, we cannot expect everybody to understand security. So in order-- >> That's a good bet! (laughing) >> So in order to make-- >> While we're all here! >> That's right! >> So in order to make it easy for everybody to process the solutions, its best if we have to simplify as much as possible. We need to make sure its zero touch, we need to make sure that it works all the time, irrelevant to if you are on the network or off the network. We needed to make sure that its reliable and it works without any compromise. >> And very importantly, its multibonal right? It can be online, offline, you can have a variety of different operator characteristics, centralized, more regional. Is that all accurate? >> Multi-tenant, on-prem. >> Definitely. With every location, you got your local users, you have your managers, the district managers, they are mobile. These are mobile users that we have to protect. And in order to protect them we need to make sure that they are protected offline as well as online. And again, the SentinelOne client basically provided that security for us. It is always on, its available offline, and its preventing a lot of malware from coming in. >> Talk to us about, kind of the reduction in complexity and visibility. Cause I'm hearing that visibility is probably a key capability that you now have achieved across a pretty big environment. >> Correct. So, before with the traditional antivirus, you got on-prem solution. On-prem solution, in order to see that visibility, you have be logged in, you have to be able to access that solution, you have to be pushing application updates, signature updates, its very static. Moving into SentinelOne, its a successful solution. I don't have to touch anything, basically everything works in the background. We update the backend and just the clients get pushed, the updates get pushed, and its protected. I only have one engineer basically looking after the solution. Which is great in this environment. Because again, everywhere you go, up access is a big problem. So in order to reduce the cost, we need to make sure that we have that automation in place. We need to make sure that everything works with minimal intervention. That issues were mitigated dynamically without having any physical intervention to it. And this where the solution came in handy. >> So I'm hearing some really strong positive business outcomes. If we can kind of shift, Daniel, back to you. This is a great testimonial for how a business is continuing to evolve and grow at the speed and scale that consumers are demanding. Tell us a little bit on the SentinelOne side about some of the announcements that Fortinet has made today. For example, the Security Fabric, as well as what they announced with AI. How is that going to help your partnership and help companies like Tri City Foods and others achieve the visibility and the security that they need, at that scale and speed that they demand. >> Yeah I think Fortinet has very progressive approach when it comes to every part of their stack. What we see with the Fortinet Security Fabric is a real desire to work with best of breed vendors and bring in their capabilities so that customers can still utilize all the different pieces of what Fortinet offers, whether it be FortiGate, FortiSandbox, FortiMail, all these different fantastic products but compliment those products and enrich them with all these other great vendors here on the floor. And what we heard from Basil is what we hear from our other 2000 customers, these themes of we need something that's simple. With two people on the team, you can easily spend all your time just logging into every single console. Fortinet brings that light so seamlessly in their stack 20, 30 products that are able to be easily managed. But if you don't partner with a vendor like Fortinet or SentinelOne and your going into all these different products all day long, there's no time to actually do anything with that data. I think the problem in cyber security today is really one of data overload. What do you do with all this data? You need something that's going to be autonomous and work online and offline but also bring in this level of automation to connect all these different pieces of a security ecosystem together to make what Fortinet has very nicely labeled a Security Fabric. And that's what I believe is what's going inside Basil's environment, that's what we see in our 2000 customers and hopefully that's something that all of Fortinet's customers can benefit from. >> Basil, one of the many things that people think about is they associate digital transformation with larger businesses. Now, Tri City Food is not a small business, 500 Burger King franchises is a pretty sizable business, when you come right down to it. But how is SentinelOne, Fortinet facilitating changes in the in-store experience? Digital changes in the in-store experience? Are there things that you can now think about doing as a consequence of bringing this endpoint security into the store, in an automated, facile, simple way that you couldn't think about before? >> Actually yes, by using the Fortinet platform we deployed the FortiAPs. We have the FortiManager, we're looking into, basically, trying to manage and push all of the guest services, to provide guest services. Before we had to touch a lot of different devices, right now its just two click of a button and I'm able to provide that SSID to all of my stores. We're able to change the security settings with basically couple clicks. We don't have to go and manage 500 locations. I'm only managing a single platform and FortiManager, for instance, or FortiCloud. So this is very progressive for us. Again, when you're working with a small staff, the more automation and the more management you can do on the backend to simplify the environment, as well as providing the required security is a big plus for us. >> There's some key features that we've brought to market to help teams like Basil's. A couple ones that come to mind, our deep visibility capability where you can actually see into encrypted traffic directly from the endpoint, without any changes in network topography. That's something that's pretty groundbreaking. We're the only endpoint technology to actually do that, where you can actually threat hunt for IOCs and look around and see 70 percent of traffics encrypted today and that number is rising. You can actually see into all that traffic and look for specific data points. That's a really good example, where you can turn what you use to have to go to a very high level of SOC analyst and you can have anybody actually benefit from a tool like that. The other one that comes to mind is our rollback capability, where if something does get through or we're just operating in EDR mode, by customer choice, you can actually completely rollback a system to the previously noninfected, nonencrypted state directly from that central location. So whether that person is on an island or in Bermuda, or sitting in a store somewhere, if a system is compromise you don't need to re-image it anymore. You can just click rollback and within 90 seconds its back to where it was before. So, the time savings we can drive is really the key value proposition from a business outcome standpoint because you need all these different check boxes and more than check boxes, but frankly there's just not the people and the hours in the day to do it all. >> So, you said time savings affects maybe resource allocation. I'm wondering in terms of leveraging what you've established from a security standpoint as differentiation as Tri City is looking to grow and expand. Tell us a little bit about how this is a differentiator for your business, compared to your competition. >> I cannot speak to the competition. (all laughs) What I can speak to is, again, the differentiator for us as Daniel mentioned is basically, again, the automation pieces, the rollback features. The minimizing the threat analyses into the environment. All these features basically is going to make us more available for our customers, the environment is going to be secure and customers will be more than welcome to come into us and they know that their coming in their information is secure and their not going to be compromised. >> Well are you able to set up stores faster? Are you able to, as you've said, roll out changes faster? So you do get that common kind of view of things. >> We're at zero zero breach. >> We're at zero zero breach yes. So, basically, in order through a lot faster, we do it lock the source faster. We basically, with the zero touch deployment, that Fortinet is offering, basically send the device to the store, bring it online and its functional. We just push it out the door and its operational. With the SentinelOne platform, push the client to the store and set it and forget it. That is basically the best solution that we ever deployed. >> Set it and forget it. >> I like that. >> Set it and forget it. >> That's why you look so relaxed. (laughs) >> I can sleep at night. (all laugh) >> That's what we want to hear. >> Exactly. So Daniel, last question to you, this is your first Accelerate? >> It is our first Accelerate. >> Tell us about what excites you about being here? What are some of the things that you've heard and what are you excited about going forward in 2018 with this partnership? >> Yeah, well as we launch our Fortinet connector tomorrow, what really excites me about being here is the huge partner and customer base that Fortinet has built over the last 20 years. Customers and partners that have not only bought the first time, but they're in it to win it with Fortinet. And that's what we are too. I'm excited about the year ahead and enabling people like Basil to be able to sleep on the weekends because they can stitch they're security solutions together in a meaningful way with best of breed technologies and we're honored to be part of that Fortinet Security Fabric for that very reason. >> Well gentleman thank you both so much for taking the time to chat with us today and share your story at Accelerate 2018. >> Thanks a lot. >> Thank you. >> For this cozy panel up here, I'm Lisa Martin my cohost with the Cube is Peter Burris. You're watching us live at Fortinet Accelerate 2018. Stick around we will be right back. (techno music)

(upbeat music) >> We are back, approaching the finish line here at Supercomputing 22, our last interview of the day, our last interview of the show. And I have to say Dave Nicholson, my co-host, My name is Paul Gillin. I've been attending trade shows for 40 years Dave, I've never been to one like this. The type of people who are here, the type of problems they're solving, what they talk about, the trade shows are typically, they're so speeds and feeds. They're so financial, they're so ROI, they all sound the same after a while. This is truly a different event. Do you get that sense? >> A hundred percent. Now, I've been attending trade shows for 10 years since I was 19, in other words, so I don't have necessarily your depth. No, but seriously, Paul, totally, completely, completely different than any other conference. First of all, there's the absolute allure of looking at the latest and greatest, coolest stuff. I mean, when you have NASA lecturing on things when you have Lawrence Livermore Labs that we're going to be talking to here in a second it's a completely different story. You have all of the academics you have students who are in competition and also interviewing with organizations. It's phenomenal. I've had chills a lot this week. >> And I guess our last two guests sort of represent that cross section. Armando Acosta, director of HPC Solutions, High Performance Solutions at Dell. And Matt Leininger, who is the HPC Strategist at Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory. Now, there is perhaps, I don't know you can correct me on this, but perhaps no institution in the world that uses more computing cycles than Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory and is always on the leading edge of what's going on in Supercomputing. And so we want to talk to both of you about that. Thank you. Thank you for joining us today. >> Sure, glad to be here. >> For having us. >> Let's start with you, Armando. Well, let's talk about the juxtaposition of the two of you. I would not have thought of LLNL as being a Dell reference account in the past. Tell us about the background of your relationship and what you're providing to the laboratory. >> Yeah, so we're really excited to be working with Lawrence Livermore, working with Matt. But actually this process started about two years ago. So we started looking at essentially what was coming down the pipeline. You know, what were the customer requirements. What did we need in order to make Matt successful. And so the beauty of this project is that we've been talking about this for two years, and now it's finally coming to fruition. And now we're actually delivering systems and delivering racks of systems. But what I really appreciate is Matt coming to us, us working together for two years and really trying to understand what are the requirements, what's the schedule, what do we need to hit in order to make them successful >> At Lawrence Livermore, what drives your computing requirements I guess? You're working on some very, very big problems but a lot of very complex problems. How do you decide what you need to procure to address them? >> Well, that's a difficult challenge. I mean, our mission is a national security mission dealing with making sure that we do our part to provide the high performance computing capabilities to the US Department of Energy's National Nuclear Security Administration. We do that through the Advanced Simulation computing program. Its goal is to provide that computing power to make sure that the US nuclear rep of the stockpile is safe, secure, and effective. So how we go about doing that? There's a lot of work involved. We have multiple platform lines that we accomplish that goal with. One of them is the advanced technology systems. Those are the ones you've heard about a lot, they're pushing towards exit scale, the GPU technologies incorporated into those. We also have a second line, a platform line, called the Commodity Technology Systems. That's where right now we're partnering with Dell on the latest generation of those. Those systems are a little more conservative, they're right now CPU only driven but they're also intended to be the everyday work horses. So those are the first systems our users get on. It's very easy for them to get their applications up and running. They're the first things they use usually on a day to day basis. They run a lot of small to medium size jobs that you need to do to figure out how to most effectively use what workloads you need to move to the even larger systems to accomplish our mission goals. >> The workhorses. >> Yeah. >> What have you seen here these last few days of the show, what excites you? What are the most interesting things you've seen? >> There's all kinds of things that are interesting. Probably most interesting ones I can't talk about in public, unfortunately, 'cause of NDA agreements, of course. But it's always exciting to be here at Supercomputing. It's always exciting to see the products that we've been working with industry and co-designing with them on for, you know, several years before the public actually sees them. That's always an exciting part of the conference as well specifically with CTS-2, it's exciting. As was mentioned before, I've been working with Dell for nearly two years on this, but the systems first started being delivered this past August. And so we're just taking the initial deliveries of those. We've deployed, you know, roughly about 1600 nodes now but that'll ramp up to over 6,000 nodes over the next three or four months. >> So how does this work intersect with Sandia and Los Alamos? Explain to us the relationship there. >> Right, so those three laboratories are the laboratories under the National Nuclear Security Administration. We partner together on CTS. So the architectures, as you were asking, how do we define these things, it's the labs coming together. Those three laboratories we define what we need for that architecture. We have a joint procurement that is run out of Livermore but then the systems are deployed at all three laboratories. And then they serve the programs that I mentioned for each laboratory as well. >> I've worked in this space for a very long time you know I've worked with agencies where the closest I got to anything they were actually doing was the sort of guest suite outside the secure area. And sometimes there are challenges when you're communicating, it's like you have a partner like Dell who has all of these things to offer, all of these ideas. You have requirements, but maybe you can't share 100% of what you need to do. How do you navigate that? Who makes the decision about what can be revealed in these conversations? You talk about NDA in terms of what's been shared with you, you may be limited in terms of what you can share with vendors. Does that cause inefficiency? >> To some degree. I mean, we do a good job within the NSA of understanding what our applications need and then mapping that to technical requirements that we can talk about with vendors. We also have kind of in between that we've done this for many years. A recent example is of course with the exit scale computing program and some things it's doing creating proxy apps or mini apps that are smaller versions of some of the things that we are important to us. Some application areas are important to us, hydrodynamics, material science, things like that. And so we can collaborate with vendors on those proxy apps to co-design systems and tweak the architectures. In fact, we've done a little bit that with CTS-2, not as much in CTS as maybe in the ATS platforms but that kind of general idea of how we collaborate through these proxy applications is something we've used across platforms. >> Now is Dell one of your co-design partners? >> In CTS-2 absolutely, yep. >> And how, what aspects of CTS-2 are you working on with Dell? >> Well, the architecture itself was the first, you know thing we worked with them on, we had a procurement come out, you know they bid an architecture on that. We had worked with them, you know but previously on our requirements, understanding what our requirements are. But that architecture today is based on the fourth generation Intel Xeon that you've heard a lot about at the conference. We are one of the first customers to get those systems in. All the systems are interconnected together with the Cornell Network's Omni-Path Network that we've used before and are very excited about as well. And we build up from there. The systems get integrated in by the operations teams at the laboratory. They get integrated into our production computing environment. Dell is really responsible, you know for designing these systems and delivering to the laboratories. The laboratories then work with Dell. We have a software stack that we provide on top of that called TOSS, for Tri-Lab Operating System. It's based on Redhead Enterprise Linux. But the goal there is that it allows us, a common user environment, a common simulation environment across not only CTS-2, but maybe older systems we have and even the larger systems that we'll be deploying as well. So from a user perspective they see a common user interface, a common environment across all the different platforms that they use at Livermore and the other laboratories. >> And Armando, what does Dell get out of the co-design arrangement with the lab? >> Well, we get to make sure that they're successful. But the other big thing that we want to do, is typically when you think about Dell and HPC, a lot of people don't make that connection together. And so what we're trying to do is make sure that, you know they know that, hey, whether you're a work group customer at the smallest end or a super computer customer at the highest end, Dell wants to make sure that we have the right setup portfolio to match any needs across this. But what we were really excited about this, this is kind of our, you know big CTS-2 first thing we've done together. And so, you know, hopefully this has been successful. We've made Matt happy and we look forward to the future what we can do with bigger and bigger things. >> So will the labs be okay with Dell coming up with a marketing campaign that said something like, "We can't confirm that alien technology is being reverse engineered." >> Yeah, that would fly. >> I mean that would be right, right? And I have to ask you the question directly and the way you can answer it is by smiling like you're thinking, what a stupid question. Are you reverse engineering alien technology at the labs? >> Yeah, you'd have to suck the PR office. >> Okay, okay. (all laughing) >> Good answer. >> No, but it is fascinating because to a degree it's like you could say, yeah, we're working together but if you really want to dig into it, it's like, "Well I kind of can't tell you exactly how some of this stuff is." Do you consider anything that you do from a technology perspective, not what you're doing with it, but the actual stack, do you try to design proprietary things into the stack or do you say, "No, no, no, we're going to go with standards and then what we do with it is proprietary and secret."? >> Yeah, it's more the latter. >> Is the latter? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you're not going to try to reverse engineer the industry? >> No, no. We want the solutions that we develop to enhance the industry to be able to apply to a broader market so that we can, you know, gain from the volume of that market, the lower cost that they would enable, right? If we go off and develop more and more customized solutions that can be extraordinarily expensive. And so we we're really looking to leverage the wider market, but do what we can to influence that, to develop key technologies that we and others need that can enable us in the high forms computing space. >> We were talking with Satish Iyer from Dell earlier about validated designs, Dell's reference designs for for pharma and for manufacturing, in HPC are you seeing that HPC, Armando, and is coming together traditionally and more of an academic research discipline beginning to come together with commercial applications? And are these two markets beginning to blend? >> Yeah, I mean so here's what's happening, is you have this convergence of HPC, AI and data analytics. And so when you have that combination of those three workloads they're applicable across many vertical markets, right? Whether it's financial services, whether it's life science, government and research. But what's interesting, and Matt won't brag about, but a lot of stuff that happens in the DoE labs trickles down to the enterprise space, trickles down to the commercial space because these guys know how to do it at scale, they know how to do it efficiently and they know how to hit the mark. And so a lot of customers say, "Hey we want what CTS-2 does," right? And so it's very interesting. The way I love it is their process the way they do the RFP process. Matt talked about the benchmarks and helping us understand, hey here's kind of the mark you have to hit. And then at the same time, you know if we make them successful then obviously it's better for all of us, right? You know, I want to secure nuclear stock pile so I hope everybody else does as well. >> The software stack you mentioned, I think Tia? >> TOSS. >> TOSS. >> Yeah. >> How did that come about? Why did you feel the need to develop your own software stack? >> It originated back, you know, even 20 years ago when we first started building Linux clusters when that was a crazy idea. Livermore and other laboratories were really the first to start doing that and then push them to larger and larger scales. And it was key to have Linux running on that at the time. And so we had the. >> So 20 years ago you knew you wanted to run on Linux? >> Was 20 years ago, yeah, yeah. And we started doing that but we needed a way to have a version of Linux that we could partner with someone on that would do, you know, the support, you know, just like you get from an EoS vendor, right? Security support and other things. But then layer on top of that, all the HPC stuff you need either to run the system, to set up the system, to support our user base. And that evolved into to TOSS which is the Tri-Lab Operating System. Now it's based on the latest version of Redhead Enterprise Linux, as I mentioned before, with all the other HPC magic, so to speak and all that HPC magic is open source things. It's not stuff, it may be things that we develop but it's nothing closed source. So all that's there we run it across all these different environments as I mentioned before. And it really originated back in the early days of, you know, Beowulf clusters, Linux clusters, as just needing something that we can use to run on multiple systems and start creating that common environment at Livermore and then eventually the other laboratories. >> How is a company like Dell, able to benefit from the open source work that's coming out of the labs? >> Well, when you look at the open source, I mean open source is good for everybody, right? Because if you make a open source tool available then people start essentially using that tool. And so if we can make that open source tool more robust and get more people using it, it gets more enterprise ready. And so with that, you know, we're all about open source we're all about standards and really about raising all boats 'cause that's what open source is all about. >> And with that, we are out of time. This is our 28th interview of SC22 and you're taking us out on a high note. Armando Acosta, director of HPC Solutions at Dell. Matt Leininger, HPC Strategist, Lawrence Livermore National Laboratories. Great discussion. Hopefully it was a good show for you. Fascinating show for us and thanks for being with us today. >> Thank you very much. >> Thank you for having us >> Dave it's been a pleasure. >> Absolutely. >> Hope we'll be back next year. >> Can't believe, went by fast. Absolutely at SC23. >> We hope you'll be back next year. This is Paul Gillin. That's a wrap, with Dave Nicholson for theCUBE. See here in next time. (soft upbear music)

>>Welcome back to Couchbase connect. My name is Dave Vellante and we're going to dig into a customer case study of sorts with two software engineers from a company called trendy all the largest e-commerce platform in Turkey. And with me are in MRA, tan Rivera, both software engineers at trendy. All welcome. Good to see you guys. Hey, before we get into the story, maybe you can tell us a little bit about trendy all. >>Let me answer that question first. Um, tri-annual uh, today is, um, 10 years old. Uh, actually, uh, it starts with them, um, e-commerce company, uh, Jen, uh, especially, uh, for clothing, uh, today, uh, it's serves several, uh, services, uh, mainly still e-commerce right. Um, we, uh, we do our business mainly on technology and we even have a say in technology, uh, technology is our main concern actually. Um, just like that actually now, >>So thank you for that. I mean, you started, I think, I think the company was founded in 2009, 2010. So you weren't, you were just, you know, kind of which we would consider the, sort of the modern era at the same time. When you look back 10 years, you know, major challenges, major advancements from a technology standpoint. So you at, at the time you had a, uh, a legacy database and you, you had a migraine, maybe you could describe the business conditions that drove you to think about actually making a change. What was the before, and then we can get into the after and what was driving that change? >>Um, maybe I could start it a bit. Well, uh, we have a recommendation domain and try new. It's like when you, when you look at a certain product, like for example, you look at a pencil, it it's commanding you, uh, any razor, uh, if you are going to buy a pink dress, it's going to recommend you a yellow dress. So if you're going to maybe buy pants, it will show you some t-shirts according to it. So, uh, since the recommendations, domain group larger, uh, we, we have struggled, uh, to keep it high scale, and it wasn't a relational DB at first, but that's even as product count increased and, uh, our right frequency increased day by day, uh, and our reef performance was affected very dramatically. Uh, I believe. Yeah. >>So you were using a traditional RDBMS, uh, and then, and, and the issue was you quite, you couldn't make the recommendations fast enough. And, you know, we always say what's real time. Real time is before you lose the customer. So you, you have to make those recommendations in time for the customer to act otherwise, you know, what do you do? Send an email after the fact, Hey, you bought this, nobody's going to pay attention to that. Right? You want to catch them in the moment. Um, and so, so what was it that, that led you to, to Couchbase and w and what was the experience of that? You know, whether it was onboarding, you know, the technology, you know, how difficult was it to get up and running to where you are today? >>Um, we were using ch Couchbase in, uh, in inter-annual, um, for several years, and we had experienced on that. Uh, and, uh, we actually, we need performance as described. So, uh, we convert our data structure to, from relational DB to, um, noise, Carol Levy, um, them actually on our recommendation, uh, platform, the main problem was, uh, invalidation process. You know, um, we are selling things and, um, in seconds they can be sold out and we, we shouldn't be recommend them anymore. And we are, we are keeping track of this by invalidation process and relational DB writing those data to our relationship Libby was, uh, was taking two, two minutes too much time. And, um, by changing this structure to, uh, pathways, we, we, we see that benefits, uh, and it takes so, so, uh, uh, short time, actually, >>I'm so sorry if, if I can just clarify w what was taking a long time, the, the updating the actual records, so that you could actually inform a customer that it was out of stock, or was it the coding that was too complicated? >>Well, it was, it was not because, um, there are millions of products intangible, and, uh, those issues are coming huge, actually. So we are keeping track of time if it's sold out or it's, it can be sellable, uh, when, when a product, uh, detail is seen by the customers, we are recommending some other products too, but those other products must be sellable too. So the main, the main problem was that, and, uh, we are writing them in our relational DB. There is a huge rights law actually. So it was not coding. It was the amount of data actually. >>Okay. And so it was the update intensity, um, within the database and the ability of the database to actually return accurate results quickly. So what was the after, like, uh, can you talk about sort of the, the business impact? What were the, the improvements that you've experienced? >>Yeah. Maybe I can ask her that, uh, like parties said that the main reason we switched is because that, uh, there are so many products coming near in trend, and many of them are being stopped being sold out and the updates to it, it was on a relational, the vendor rights, or too much that you couldn't, uh, dur customers that fast reply because the database was getting effected by the amount of high rights. Because when you think about it, there are millions of products coming, and there are millions of rights, uh, operations on the database. So those affecting the reach performance. So, uh, it, it could occur to you that when you click on a product, you would see maybe as took out product as a recommendation, or maybe a product that is not in the website anymore. So, uh, when we switched to, uh, Couchbase that, uh, we saw that, uh, it's using less resources, which, uh, using less posts, active, alive, and it's also, uh, giving responses faster. >>The main reason, uh, we were using relational DB at first was the invalidation process like five. He said, because it was, we had a consumer that was listening to messages, uh, the innovation messages, and then, uh, and then the writing them into database. But, uh, in the part, uh, it meant that actively writing to database that for every product document that you would need to update the document, but for, uh, for, for, uh, for relational DB, it would be vetoed easier to just make this product, uh, every available, false, or true. So that's why we were sticking with relationship with DB at first. And that's why we made it that first as a relational DB, but as time increased and our product count, and our sellers increased, we realized that, uh, we should find another solution to the invalidation process, and we should, uh, switch because, uh, I mean, it CA it has come to a point at one point that it would just maybe, uh, take a solid, so much time that, uh, we were scaling our consumers at nighttime to just not affect daily users anymore. >>Uh, so that's why that's the main reason we switched. And, uh, after switching, we had in, uh, like I said, the response time and high write throughput, and also one of the reasons is also because that the, uh, the application that was with the use of Couchbase because, uh, since strangled is growing larger than our main data centers. And, uh, like we can see that every day, sometimes we deploy our, uh, apps to yet another cluster. And we, that's why we sometimes need to have backups or different data centers, and Couchbase was providing very good relations, very good solutions to this, which is. Yeah. That's why we switched actually. So we asked >>Couchbase running it's if I understand it, it's running the recommendation engine. And do you still use a traditional RDBMS for the transaction system or is Couchbase doing both? >>Yeah, okay. Uh, we are, uh, actually inter-annual, we are in discovery a team, actually, we call it tribe and in discovery, tribe, uh, relational DB, I think, uh, now, uh, very small, uh, small, uh, teams are using it. Um, it's personally just very low actually. Uh, but, uh, other other tribes, for example, orders, checkout, and maybe, uh, uh, promotions, uh, something like other teams are still using RDBMS, but in discovery team, it's very important to serve customers very fast. We need to show them the products immediately. We need to personalize them. Uh, we sh we should, uh, show them, uh, related products in the meantime, in real time, actually. So in this current Stripe, we are, um, barely using it, uh, RDBMS systems, actually. >>How hard was it to migrate from the RDBMS? Because you hear a lot of stories about how difficult that is to do. You've got to freeze the code, you bringing up new code, you've got to synchronize the functionality. How did you manage that? >>Well, to be honest with you, just ask the data science team to just send the products. Uh, at the same time, we were like, we were keeping the legacy API open that the clients were still coming there. And, um, to be honest, there were lots of legs on that, too. So even if, uh, the, the newer products came a bit later, uh, it shouldn't be seen because it was always coming late. So, uh, we had, we made a new API that is connecting to Couchbase and we wanted the data science team to start feeding it, but we asked the clients to switch it by time. I mean, we were still supporting the old one, but, uh, when we, when we asked the clients to switch to the new API, we just closed the last one. So we didn't really migrate any data to be honest. Like we, we, it was from scratch. And since it's a, it's a recommendation domain, uh, we believe it's better to, uh, add data's from scratch because in our new domains, we are storing them in documents. They are always sending a new list to us. So that's how it gets updated all the time. So since it's not a user related data, it wasn't really like a migration process. >>Is this is part of the secret sauce that you're doing. Schema lists, no schema on, right to Couchbase. And is that correct? And how are you handling it? I'm like, how are you getting that awesome write performance? >>Well, the main reason we believe is that, uh, before, when it was relational DB, like for example, loan product to one product and a second product to first product, third product, first of all, that like you were duplicating the records so that when the product gets removed, uh, from, from a product recommendation, or maybe one of, if a product is getting invisible, for any reason, it should be removed, or maybe it could be a stockout that it means it's not that for every record, you are sending your records for invalidation, but in our new system, it means that this, uh, for this content, there are 24 contents let's say, and like four of them that's finished. It's not there. It's okay. You're just replacing the whole list so that you are not duplicating the records. I mean, this is not like first product first and first, the second, and first to third, and first changes you are replicating this, this change three times, like a delete, uh, product one from three, three product, one from two, and you are deprecating the deletion record, but now we are just replacing the list. So you are doing that all of the operation in 1, 1, 1, uh, Kafka queue message. If I should be able, if I was able to, uh, tell about it. So it's a bit hard to explain it in, uh, in speech, but, uh, we have a nice graphic that's showing how we are doing it now. >>That makes sense. Okay. Thank you for that. And so, as you think about, you're modernizing your application infrastructure, where are you at today? How do you see this modernization effort going forward >>Actually, um, today, uh, we are mainly looking for, um, cross cluster replication. Uh, all our products are, uh, uh, deployed, uh, different clusters and different geographical locations. Uh, we, we always using ch um, we try to always use, um, modern products and, uh, uh, try to avoid, uh, old relational databases, especially for our discovery. Right. And, uh, my mandala is modernizing it, uh, all, uh, engineer's keeping up to date with recent technologies and, uh, our customers are happier. They are not seeing some glitches, some, uh, rates, uh, or while they're using our products. >>Okay. So maybe I could double click on that. So, cause you mentioned the impact of customers and I'm interested in your organizational impact and what it means for you internally, but, but when you talk about cross cluster replication, is that to scale, uh, is that a performance impact? Is that for availability? What's the impact of that effort? That modernization effort? >>Uh, I believe it's, it's all, uh, main reason is availability. I believe. Uh, like we can't know when a cluster can go down, we can't be sure about it, uh, in a, in a system we can, but that we should be up and running all the time. And, uh, there should be some, uh, some backups that, uh, that can switch when a cluster goes down. But also the main reason, uh, well, one of the main reasons is to be able to scale because, uh, the, the clusters that we had wasn't enough, uh, considering our user base. So, uh, let's say you want to even extend your user base, but, uh, like the cluster is being a bottleneck to you because you can't get that much users, but, uh, when you do post cluster that you have backup and you have scalability and it's, uh, considering how new considering if the machines are newer, maybe faster response times. I don't know, uh, maybe, uh, network part would know that better, but, uh, yeah, but all of them, I will leave. >>Great guys. Well, thank you so much for sharing your story, uh, uh, MRA and Fati. Uh, appreciate you guys coming on the cube. >>Thanks a lot. Yeah. Thanks. Thanks. Thank you for, uh, hosting. >>Yeah, it's our pleasure. And thank you for watching. Couchbase connect online on the cube, keep it right there for more great content from the event.

>>from Menlo Park, California In the heart of Silicon Valley, it's the Cube covering cloud now. Awards 2020 Brought to you by Silicon Angle Media. Now here's Sonia category. >>Hi, and welcome to the Cube. I'm your host Sonia category, and we're on the ground at Facebook headquarters in Menlo Park, California covering Cloud now's top women entrepreneurs in Cloud Innovation Awards. >>Joining us today is Get the Schmidt CEO of Human. Get that. Welcome to the Cube. >>Thank you. Thanks for having me. >>So just give us a brief overview of your background and more about Humira. All right, A brief >>overview. Let's see. Um, I'll start off that I've been in the industry for some time now. Um, since ah, 97 which I used to actually work at this campus that we're here today at when it used to be Sun Microsystems. So I started out in technology in product management and marketing. Mainly, um, when java was coming out so early days and really learned a lot about what it takes to take a product or a concept out to market very exciting in those early days and sort of, you know, move towards looking at Industries and Sister focused on financial services into the lot around financial services marketing. Also it son. >>And then I moved >>to Denmark, which is sort of a surprise, But I'm married to a day and we decided we would try something different. So I moved to Denmark, working at a consulting company software consulting company based in Denmark, fairly small and Ah, and was part of sort of building out of the conference and business development business they had over there. And ah, and that was a way for us, for me to understand a completely other side of the business consulting aspects where you really build software for a customer and really understand, you know, sort of the customer solution needs that are required versus when you're working at a large enterprise company kind of are separated away from the customers. And that was there where I met the two founding team members of Humi Oh, Christian and Trust in at Tri Fork into you. Essentially, we've been working together for 10 years, and, uh, we sort of all felt like we could really come out with the world's best logging solution and, ah, this was out of some of the pain we were running into by running other solutions in the market. And so we took a leap into building our own product business. And so we did that in 2016. And so that's really what brought me here into the CEO role. So we have a three person leisure leadership or executive team, our founding team, which is to verily technical folks. So the guys that really built the product and and, uh, and keep it running and take it to the next level every single day. But what was missing was really that commercial kind of leader that was ready to take that role, and that's where I came in. So they were very supportive and and bringing me on board. So that was into 2016 where I started that >>that's awesome. So how do you think having like a business and marketing background versus a technical background has helped you become a successful CEO? Um, I >>think it's really, really hard if you don't have different profiles on your founding team to be able to run a successful tech business. So there's technology that you could have the world's greatest technology like an example would be my you know, my co founders were building an amazing product, but until they came into the room, they hadn't thought about going out and trying to get a customer to use it. And essentially, that is one of the issues there is that you can sit and build something and build the best product out there. But if you're not getting feedback really, really early in the design and the concepts of product development, then customers our search of it's not built in. And so a lot of the thought process around him. EOS We like to say customers are in our DNA. We build >>our product >>for people to use 6 to 8 hours a day, and they're in it every day. And so it keeps this feeling of a customer feedback loop. And even if you're technical, it's really exciting. You know that you build something that somebody uses every day. It looks at every day, and so that's the kind of energy that we've tried to, you know, instill. Or maybe I've tried to instill in Humi Oh, that you know, our customers really matter, and I think that's one of the ways that we've been able to move, Let's say really, really fast in building the right features the right functionality, um, and the right things for people are using it on the on the on, the on the other and essentially >>so okay. And, um so you're here to receive an award for being one of the top female entrepreneurs in cloud innovation. So congratulations and And how does it feel to win this award? Super >>exciting. I mean, I'm glad that there are organizations like Cloud now that are doing amazing things for women and and also, you know, making examples of folks that are doing interesting roles in our industry, especially around B two B software. I think that's a real area where there's not many CIOs or leaders in our space where there should be. And, uh, and I think part of it is actually kind of highlighting that. But, you know, the other side is sort of an event like this today is bringing together a lot of other profiles that are women or diverse profiles together to sort of, you know, talk about this problem and acknowledge and also take, let's say, more of an active stance around, you know, making this place not so scary. I mean, I think I remember one of my early events and I was raising our series A when I walked into a VC event where there were no other female CIOs out there. There's 100 CIOs and I was the only one. And I think one of the hard parts is I walked in there and, you know, it felt a bit uncomfortable, But there were some. There were two amazing VC partners at the company that I first started talking to, and that just really used the sort of like, you know, I guess. Uncomfortable, itty. So I think the main focus at things like today or, you know, the people that are here today. So I think we can help each other. And I think that's something that you know. That's something that I'd like to see more of, that we actively sort of create environments and communities for that to happen, and cloud now is one of them. >>So I think a lot of women have had that experience where they're the only woman in the room, you know, and it's just really hard to like. Figure out your path from there. So as the company as Julio, how do you What's your strategy for inclusion? >>Um, so, like I like to call it active inclusion. I think part of this is like having a diverse workforce, which is, you know, obviously including women and different backgrounds. Other things. But >>one of >>the big things we think about at Hume Eo is we really like to, let's say, celebrate people's differences so like that you're able to be yourself and almost eccentric is a good thing. And be able to feel safe in that environment to feel safe, that you can express your opinions, feel comfortable and safe when you're, you know, coming with a opposite viewpoint. Because the diversity of thought is really what we're trying to include in our company. So it means bringing together folks that don't look like each other where exactly, the same clothes and do the exact same hobbies and come from the same countries like we have. Ah, very, you know, global workforce. So we have folks, you know in Denmark of an office in Denmark. We have an office in the UK, and we have folks all over the U. S. We have a lot of backgrounds that have come from different cultures, and I think there's a beauty to that. There's a beauty to actually combining a lot of ways to solve problems. Everyone from a different culture has different ways of solving those. And so I think part of this is all around making that. Okay, right. So, you know, active inclusion is a way to to sort of put it into terms. So So we're definitely looking for people, Actively, that would like to join something like >>this. So I love that. Um, So if you were personally, if you were to have your own board of directors, like, who would they be? Um, it's not really >>the who. It's almost like the profiles or the people. I mean, we already have a personal board like I call it. I mean, it's something that I actively started doing. Um, once I once I started with a company board, I realized, you know, I probably need my own personal board, my own sort of support infrastructure That includes folks like my family, my sisters and my mom. It also includes you know, some younger junior folks that are actually much younger >>than me. >>But I learned so much from so um, to one of my good friend Cindy, who's who is brilliant at describing technology concepts. And and I think just some of the conversations I've had with her just opened my eyes to something that I hadn't seen before. And I think that's the area where I like to say the personal board isn't exactly you know people. It's it's profile. So along the way, as you grow, you're looking for new types of profiles. Let's say you want to learn about a new concept or a new technology or, you know, get better at running or something. So it's part of bringing those profiles in tow, learn about it and then back to this board concept. It's It's not as though it's a linked in network or it's actually sort of a group of people that you sort of rely on. And then it's a It's a two way street. So essentially, you know, there could be things that the other person could gain from knowing me, and ideally, that those were the best relationships in a personal board. So so I encourage alive women to do this because it builds a support infrastructure that is not related to your job. It's not your manager. It's not your co worker. You kind of feel some level of freedom having those discussions because those people aren't looking at your company. They're looking at helping you. So So that's That's sort of the concepts around >>the personal board idea and anything as women like having a sport system is so necessary, especially in this, like male dominated industry. Well, I think it's back >>to that whole feeling like you're the one person in the room, right? Right, so you're not the one person in the room, and I think we need to change that. And I think that's like some you know, all of our kind of roles that for all the women intact. I mean, it's sort of like something that we could help each other with right, and and if we don't do it actively, I mean, you know the numbers and we know you know the percentages of these things. If we want to change that, it does require some active interest on on our part to make that happen. And I think those are the areas where I see, like, the support infrastructures, the events like this really kind of engaging, um, us to be aware and doing something about the >>problem. Thank you so much for being on the key of love having you here. Thanks for >>having me. I really appreciate it. >>I'm Sonia to Garry. Thanks for watching the Cube. Stay tuned for more. >>Yeah, yeah.

>> Announcer: Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE, covering Fortinet Accelerate 18, brought to you by Fortinet. (upbeat techno music) >> Welcome to Fortinet 20... Welcome to Fortinet Accelerate 2018. I haven't had enough caffeine today. I'm Lisa Martin. I'm joined by my co-host, Peter Burris. Peter, it's theCUBE's second time here at Fortinet Accelerate. We were here last year. Great to be back with you. Some exciting stuff we have heard in the keynote this morning. Cyber security is one of those topics that I find so interesting, 'cause it's so transformative. It permeates every industry, everybody, and we heard some interesting things about what Fortinet is doing to continue their leadership in next generation security. Some of the themes that popped up really speak to the theme of this year's event, which is Strength in Numbers. Ken Xie, their CEO, shared some great, very strong numbers for them. 2017, they reached 1.8 billion in billing, which is a huge growth over the previous year. They acquired nearly 18,000 new customers in 2017, and another thing that I thought was very intriguing was that they protect 90% of the global S&P 100. They have over 330,000 customers, and they share great logos: Apple, Oracle, Coca Cola, et cetera. So, great trajectory that they're on. From a security perspective, digital transformation, security transformation, they have to play hand in hand. What are some of the things that you are seeing and that you're looking forward to hearing on today's show? >> Well, I always liked this show. This is the second year, as you said, that we've done this. One of the reasons I like it is because security is very complex, very hard, highly specialized, and Fortinet does a pretty darn good job of bringing it down to Earth and simplifying it so that people could actually imagine themselves becoming more secure, as a consequence of taking actions along the lines of what Fortinet's doing. So, there's clearly a strong relationship between the notion of digital business and the notion of digital security. The way we describe the difference between a business and digital business is that a digital business uses its data assets differently, and in many respects, it is through security concepts and constructs that you go about privatizing, or making unique, your data, so that it doesn't leave your network when you don't want it to, so it can't be subject to ransomware, so that it isn't compromised in some way by a bad actor. So there's a very, very strong relationship between how we think about digital assets and how we think about security, and what Fortinet's overall approach is is to say, "Look, let's not focus just on the device. "Let's look at the entire infrastructure "and what needs to happen to collect data, "to collect information, across the whole thing," what we call a broad approach as opposed to a deep approach. A broad approach to looking at the problem, with partnerships and working with customers in a differentiated way, so that we can help our clients very quickly recognize, attend, and make problems go away. >> One of the things, too, that is interesting is, you know, we hear so much talk at many other shows about digital transformation, DX, everyone's doing it. They're on some journey. There's now such amorphous environments with Multi-Cloud, IoT, opens the-- It spreads the attack surface. I thought they did a great job this morning of really articulating that very well. I'd love to hear your perspective, and we have some of their customers that are going to be talking to us today, but what is the mix of security transformation as a facilitator or an enabler of true digital business transformation? How do companies do that when, as we were talking earlier, companies, and even Ken said, Ken Xie, the CEO, that lot of companies have 20 to 30 different disparate security products in place that are pointed at different things that aren't integrated. How does a company kind of reconcile security transformation to-- as an enabler of digital business transformation? >> Yeah, and I think that's going to be one of the major themes we hear today, is the process that customers are, in 2018, going to have to accelerate. Does that ring a bell? (laughs) Accelerate... >> Lisa: That's genius. Somebody should use that. >> This journey (laughs)... Accelerate this journey... >> Yeah. >> To employing security and security-related technologies and services, much more effectively within their business. There's so many ways of answering that question, Lisa, but one of the-- Let's start with a simple one. That, increasingly, a company is providing its value proposition to its customer bases, whether they're small, residential, whether they're a consumer, or whether they're other businesses, through a digital mechanism, and that could be e-commerce, as pedestrian as e-commerce, or perhaps recommendation engines, or it could be increasingly digital services that are providing, effectively, a digital twin in the home, and, so, your security, your ability to provide those services and those capabilities that consumers want, if those fundamental, or those services are fundamentally insecure, then your brand, no matter how good the service is, your brand's going to take a hit. So, when you think about what Google's trying to do with Nest, if you think about, you know, in the home, a lot of the things that are going into the home, Amazon Alexa, there is an enormous amount of attention being paid to, is our platform, is our fabric a source of differentiation-- security fabric a source of differentiation in our business? Are we going to be able to look a consumer in the eye, or a B2B company in the eye, and say, "You'll be able to do things with us "that you can't do with others, "because of our security profile." And, increasingly, that's got to be the way that boards of directors and CEOs, and IT professionals need to think, "What can we do differently and better "than our competitors because of our security profile "and the security assets that we've invested in?" That's not the way a lot of people are thinking today. >> Why do you think that is? Because, I think you're spot on with providing security capabilities as a differentiator. There's a lot of competition, especially in the detection phase. Ken Xie talked about that this morning, and there's a lot of of coopetition that needs to happen to help companies with myriad disparate products, but why do you think that is that this security capability as a differentiator hasn't yet, kind of, boiled up to the surface? >> I think it's a number of reasons. Some good, some, obviously, not so good, but the main one is, is that, historically, when a CFO or anybody looked at the assets, they looked at tangible assets of the company, and data was, kind of, yeah, was out there, and it was, yeah, secure that data, but we were still more worried about securing the devices, because the devices were hard assets. We were worried about securing the server, securing the routers, securing, you know, whatever else, the repeaters, whatever else is in your organization, or securing your perimeters. Well, now, as data moves, because of mobile, and Ken told us, that 90% of the traffic now inside of a typical enterprise is through mobile, or through wireless types of mechanisms as opposed to wired, well, it means, ultimately, that the first step that every business has to take is to recognize data as an asset, and understanding what what we're really trying to secure is the role the data's playing in the business. How we're using it to engage customers, how we're using it to engage other businesses, how employees are using it, and very importantly, whether the security products themselves are sharing data in a way that makes all that better, and in a secure way, themselves, because the last thing you want is a vulnerability inside your security platform. >> Yes. >> So, the main reason is is that the industry, in most businesses, they talk a great game about digital business, but they haven't gotten down to that fundamental. It's about your data, and how you treat data as an asset, and how you institutionalize work around that data asset, and how you invest to improve the value, accrete value to that data asset over an extended period of time. >> Something that I'm interested in understanding, and we've got Phil Quade, their CSO, on, later today. >> Peter: Smart guy. >> How the role of the CSO has had to evolve, and I'd love to hear... And you asked a little bit about this earlier, the Fortinet on the Fortinet story. What are you doing, internally, to secure and provide security that all elements of your business need? Because I imagine a customer would want to understand, "Well, tell us how you're doing it. "If you're the leader in this, "in providing the products and the technologies, "are you doing this internally?" >> Well, I think, look, I think going back to what I was just talking about, and we had a great... We had a great conversation with Ken Xie that's going to show up in the broadcast today, it is... I think every technology executive increasingly needs to look at their potential customers, their peers, and their customers, and say, "Here's what I can do, as a consequence of using my stuff, "that you can't do, because you're not using my stuff." And Phil, Phil Quade, needs to look at other CSOs and say, "Here's what I can do "as a CSO, because I use Fortinet, "that you cannot do as a CSO, because you don't." Now, the role of the CSO is changing pretty dramatically, and there's a lot of reasons for that, but if we think about the number of individuals that, again, we go back to this notion of data as an asset and how we organize our work around that data. We're hearing about how the CIO's role is changing and how the chief digital officer's changing, or the chief data officer or the CSO. We've got a lot of folks that are kind of circling each other about what really and truly is the fundamental thing that we're trying to generate a return on. >> Lisa: Right. >> When I think about the job of a chief, the job of a chief is to take capital from the board, capital from the ownership, and create net new value, and whether it's a CIO doing that, or anybody. And, so, what Phil's job, or what the CSO's job is is to also find ways to show how investments in the business's security is going to create a differentiating advantage over time. Working with the chief digital officer, the chief data officers and others, but there's a lot of complexity in who does what, but at the end of the day, the CSO's job is to make sure that the data and access to the data is secure, and that the data and the ability to share the data supports the business. >> You mentioned the word "complexity" in the context of the CSO and some of the senior roles, where data is concerned. One of the things I'm interested to hear from some of our guests today, those at Fortinet, and we've got the CSO on we mentioned, and we've also got John Madison, their Senior Vice President of Products and Solutions. We've got their global strategist on security, Derek Manky, but we also have some customers. One from Tri-City, and another from Clark County School District, which is here in Vegas, and I'm curious to understand how they're dealing with complexity in their infrastructure. You know, we talked so much about, and they... have already started today, about Cloud, IoT, multi-cloud, mobile, as you talked about. As the infrastructure complexity increases, how does that change the role of the C-Suite to facilitate the right changes and the right evolution to manage that complexity in a secure way. So I'm very interested to hear how that internal complexity on the infrastructure side is being dealt with by the guys and the gals at the top who need to ensure that, to your point, their data and information assets are protected. We've got some great examples, I think, we're going to hear today, in three verticals in particular: education, healthcare, and financial services. And education really intrigued me because it's been a long time since I've been in college, but there's this massive evolution of smart classrooms, it's BYOD, right? And, there's so many vulnerabilities that are being brought into a school district, so I'd love to understand how do you protect data in that sense when you have so many devices that are connecting to an environment that just drives up complexity, and maybe opens... Perforates their perimeter even more. >> Well, I mean, you know, one of the... We're as a nation, we are living through a recent experience of some of the new tensions that a lot of the school districts are facing, and it could very well be, that voice or facial recognition or other types of things become more important, so I, look. Large or small, well-funded, not well-funded, young or old, consumer or business, all companies are going to have to understand and envision what their digital footprint's going to look like. And as they envision what that digital footprint, companies or institutions, as they envision what that digital footprint's going to look like and what they want to achieve with that digital footprint, they're going to have to make commensurate investments in security, because security used to be, as Ken said when he talked about the three stages, security used to be about perimeter. So, it was analogous to your building. You're either in your building or you're not in your building. You're in your network, or you're not in your network. But, today, your value proposition is how do you move data to somebody else? Today, your security profile is who is inside your building right now? Are they doing things that are good or bad? It's not a "I know everybody, I know where they are, "and I know what they're doing." We are entering into the world where digital business allows us to envision or to execute a multitude of more complex behaviors, and the security platform has to correspondingly evolve and adjust, and that is a hard problem. So, listening to how different classes of companies and different classes of institutions are dealing with this given different industries, different budgets, different levels of expertise, is one of the most important things happening in the technology industry right now. >> Yeah, it's that, how do you get balance between enabling what the business needs to be profitable and grow and compete, and managing the risk? >> And, how... and what is a proper level of investment? Do I have too many vendors, do I have not enough vendors? All those... all of those issues, it's increasing, we have to get-- We have to make our security capacity, our security capabilities, dramatically more productive. And that is going to be one of the major gates on how fast all of these technologies evolve. Can we introduce new AI? Can we introduce faster hardware? Can we introduce new ways of engaging? Can we bring biology and kind of that bio-to-silicon interface and start building things around that? Well, there's a lot of things that we can do, but if we can't secure it, we probably shouldn't do it. >> Lisa: Absolutely. >> So, a security profile is going to be one of the very natural and necessary, reasonable gates on how fast the industry evolves over the next 20-30 years. And that's going to have an enormous bearing and impact on how well we can solve some of the complex problems that we face. >> Well, I'm excited to co-host today with you, Peter. I think we're going to have some great, very informative conversations from some of Fortinet's leaders, to their customers, to their channel partners, and really get a great sense of the things that they're seeing in the field and how that's going to be applied internally to really have security be that enabler of true business transformation. >> Peter: Excellent. >> Alright. Well, stick around. I'm Lisa Martin. Let's hope I don't screw up the outro. Hosting with Peter all day. We're excited that you're joining us live from Fortinet Accelerate 2018. Stick around. We'll be right back. (upbeat techno music)

>> Commentator: Live from San Jose, California. It's theCUBE covering Big Data Silicon Valley 2017. >> Okay, welcome back everyone. We are here live in Silicon Valley for Big Data SV (mumbles) event in conjunction with Strata + Hadoop. Our companion event, the Big Data NYC and we're here breaking down the Big Data world as it evolves and goes to the next level up on the step function, AI machine learning, IOT really forcing people to really focus on a clear line of the side of the data. I'm John Furrier with our announcer from Wikibon, George Gilbert and our next guest, our two executives from Trifacta. The founder and Chief Strategy Officer, Joe Hellerstein and Adam Wilson, the CEO. Guys, welcome to theCUBE. Welcome back. >> Great to be here. >> Good to be here. >> Founder, co-founder? >> Co-founder. >> Co-founder. He's a multiple co-founders. I remember it 'cause you guys were one of the first sites that have the (mumbles) in the about section on all the management team. Just to show you how technical you guys are. Welcome back. >> And if you're Trifacta, you have to have three founders, right? So that's part of the tri, right? >> The triple threat, so to speak. Okay, so a big year for you guys. Give us the update. I mean, also we had Alation announce this partnering going on and some product movement. >> Yup. >> But there's a turbulent time right now. You have a lot of things happening in multiple theaters to technical theater to business theater. And also within the customer base. It's a land grand, it seems to be on the metadata and who's going to control what. What's happening? What's going on in the market place and what's the update from you guys? >> Yeah, yeah. Last year was an absolutely spectacular year for Trifacta. It was four times growth in bookings, three times growth in customers. You know, it's been really exciting for us to see the technology get in the hands of some of the largest companies on the planet and to see what they're able to do with it. From the very beginning, we really believed in this idea of self service and democratization. We recognize that the wrangling of the data is often where a lot of the time and the effort goes. In fact, up to 80% of the time and effort goes in a lot of these analytic projects and to the extent that we can help take the data from (mumbles) in a more productive way and to allow more people in an organization to do that. That's going to create information agility that that we feel really good about and there are customers and they are telling us is having an impact on their use of Big Data and Hadoop. And I think you're seeing that transition where, you know, in the very beginning there was a lot of offloading, a lot of like, hey we're going to grab some cost savings but then in some point, people scratch their heads and said, well, wait a minute. What about the strategic asset that we were building? That was going to change the way people work with the data. Where is that piece of it? And I think as people started figuring out in order to get our (mumbles), we got to have users and use cases on these clusters and the data like itself is not a used case. Tools like Trifacta have been absolutely instrumental and really fueling that maturity in the market and we feel great about what's happening there. >> I want to get some more drilled out before we get to some of these questions for Joe too because I think you mentioned, you got some quotes. I just want to double up a click on that. It always comes up in the business model question for people. What's your business model? >> Sure. >> And doing democratization is really hard. Sometimes democratization doesn't appear until years later so it's one of those elusive things. You see it and you believe it but then making it happen are two different things. >> Yeah, sure. >> So. And appreciate that the vision they-- (mumbles) But ultimately, at the end of the day, that business model comes down to how you organized. Prove points. >> Yup. >> Customers, partnerships. >> Yeah. >> We had Alation on Stephanie (mumbles). Can you share just and connect the dots on the business model? >> Sure. >> With respect to the product, customers, partners. How was that specifically evolving? >> Adam: Sure. >> Give some examples. >> Sure, yeah. And I would say kind of-- we felt from the beginning that, you know, we wanted to turn what was traditionally a very complex messy problem dealing with data, you know, in the user experience problem that was powered by machine learning and so, a lot of it was down to, you know, how we were going to build and architect the technology needed (mumbles) for really getting the power in the hands of the people who know the data best. But it's important, and I think this is often lost in Silicon Valley where the focus on innovation is all around technology to recognize that the business model also has to support democritization so one of the first things we did coming in was to release a free version of the product. So Trifacta Wrangler that is now being used by over 4500 companies, ten of thousands of users and the power of that in terms of getting people something of value that they could start using right away on spreadsheets and files and small data and allowing them to get value but then also for us, the exchange is that we're actually getting a chance to curate at scale usage data across all of these-- >> Is this a (mumbles) product? >> It's a hybrid product. >> Okay. >> So the data stays local. It never leaves their local laptop. The metadata is hashed and put into the cloud and now we're-- >> (mumbles) to that. >> Absolutely. And so now we can use that as training data that actually has more people wrangle, the product itself gets smarter based on that. >> That's good. >> So that's creating real tangible value for customers and for us is a source of very strategic advantage and so we think that combination of the technology innovation but also making sure that we can get this in the hands of users and they can get going and as their problem grows up to be bigger and more complicated, not just spreadsheets and files on the desktop but something more complicated, then we're right there along with them for products that would have been modified. >> How about partnerships with Alation? How they (mumbles)? What are all the deals you got going on there? >> So Alation has been a great partner for us for a while and we've really deepened the integration with the announcements today. We think that cataloging and data wrangling are very complimentary and they're a natural fit. We've got customers like Munich Re, like eBay as well as MarketShare that are using both solutions in concert with one another and so, we really felt that it was natural to tighten that coupling and to help people go from inventorying what's going on in their data legs and their clusters to then cleansing, standardizing. Essentially making it fit for purpose and then ensuring that metadata can roundtrip back into the catalog. And so that's really been an extension of what we're doing also at the technical level with technologies like Cloudera Navigator with Atlas and with the project that Joe's involved with at Berkeley called Ground. So I don't know if you want to talk-- >> Yeah, tell him about Ground. >> Sure. So part of our outlook on this and this speaks to the kind of way that the landscape in the industry's shaping out is that we're not going to see customers buying until it's sort of lock in on the key components of the area for (mumbles). So for example, storage, HD (mumbles). This is open and that's key, I think, for all the players in this base at HTFS. It's not a product from a storage vendor. It's an open platform and you can change vendors along the way and you could role your own and so on. So metadata, to my mind, is going to move in the same direction. That the storage of metadata, the basic component tree that keeps the metadata, that's got to be open to give people the confidence that they're going to pour the basic descriptions of what's in their business and what their people are doing into a place that they know they can count on and it will be vendor neutral. So the catalog vendors are, in my mind, providing a functionality above that basic storage that relates to how do you search the catalog, what does the catalog do for you to suggest things, to suggest data sets that you should be looking at. So that's a value we have on top but below that what we're seeing is, we're seeing Horton and Cloudera coming out with either products re opensource and it's sort of the metadata space and what would be a shame is if the two vendors ended up kind of pointing guns inward and kind of killing the metadata storage. So one of the things that I got interested in as my dual role as a professor at Berkeley and also as a founder of a company in this space was we want to ensure that there's a free open vendor neutral metadata solution. So we began building out a project called Ground which is both a platform for metadata storage that can be sitting underneath catalog vendors and other metadata value adds. And it's also a platform for research much as we did with Spark previously at Berkeley. So Ground is a project in our new lab at Berkeley. The RISELab which is the successor to the AMPLab that gave us Spark. And Ground has now got, you know, collaboratives from Cloudera, from LinkedIn. Capital One has significantly invested in Ground and is putting engineers behind it and contributors are coming also from some startups to build out an open-sourced platform for metadata. >> How old has Ground been around? >> Joe: Ground's been around for about 12 months. It's very-- >> So it's brand new. How do people get involved? >> Brand new. >> Just standard similar to the way the AMPLab was? Just jump in and-- >> Yeah, you know-- >> Go away and-- >> It comes up on GitHub. There's (mumbles) to go download and play with. It's in alpha. And you know, we hope we (mumbles) and the usual opensource still. >> This is interesting. I like this idea because one thing you've been riffing on the cue ball of time is how do you make data addressable? Because ultimately, you know, real time you need to have access to data really really low (mumbles) to see the inside to make it work. Hence the data swamp problem right? So, how do you guys see that? 'Cause now I can just pop in. I can hear the objections. Oh, security! You know. How do you guys see the protections? I'd love to help get my data in there and get something back in return in a community model. Security? Is it the hashing? What's the-- How do you get any security (mumbles)? Or what are the issues? >> Yeah, so I mean the straightforward issues are the traditional issues of authorization and encryption and those are issues that are reasonably well-plumed out in the industry and you can go out and you can take the solutions from people like Clutter or from Horton and those solutions have plugin quite nicely actually to a variety of platforms. And I feel like that level of enterprise security is understood. It's work for vendors to work with that technology so when we went out, we make sure we were carburized in all the right ways at Trifacta to work with these vendors and that we integrated well with Navigator, we integrated with Atlas. That was, you know, there was some labor there but it's understood. There's also-- >> It's solvable basically. >> It's solvable basically and pluggable. There are research questions there which, you know, on another day we could talk about but for instance if you don't trust your cloud hosting service what do you do? And that's like an open area that we're working on at Berkeley. Intel SGX is a really interesting technology and that's based probably a topic for another day. >> But you know, I think it's important-- >> The sooner we get you out of the studio, Paolo Alto would love to drill on that. >> I think it's important though that, you know, when we talk about self service, the first question that comes up is I'm only going to let you self service as far as I can govern what's going on, right? And so I think those things-- >> Restrictions, guard rails-- >> Really going hand in here. >> About handcuffs. >> Yeah so, right. Because that's always a first thing that kind of comes out where people say, okay wait minute now is this-- if I've now got, you know-- you've got an increasing number of knowledge workers who think that is their-- and believe that it is their unalienable right to have access to data. >> Well that's the (mumbles) democratization. That's the top down, you know, governance control point. >> So how do you balance that? And I think you can't solve for one side of that equation without the other, right? And that's really really critical. >> Democratization is anarchization, right? >> Right, exactly. >> Yes, exactly. But it's hard though. I mean, and you look at all the big trends where there was, you know, web one data, web (mumbles), all had those democratization trends but they took six years to play out and I think there might be a more auxiliary with cloud when you point about this new stop. Okay George, go ahead. You might get in there. >> I wanted to ask you about, you know, what we were talking about earlier and what customers are faced with which is, you know, a lot of choice and specialization because building something end to end and having it fully functional is really difficult. So... What are the functional points where you start driving the guard rails in that Ikee cares about and then what are the user experience points where you have critical mass so that the end users then draw other compliant tools in. You with me? On sort of the IT side and the user side and then which tools start pulling those standards? >> Well, I would say at the highest level, to me what's been very interesting especially would be with that's happened in opensource is that people have now gotten accustomed to the idea that like I don't have to go buy a big monolithic stacks where the innovation moves only as fast as the slowest product in the stack or the portfolio. I can grab onto things and I can download them today and be using them tomorrow. And that has, I think, changed the entire approach that companies like Trifacta are taking to how we how we build and release product to market, how we inter operate with partners like Alation and Waterline and how we integrate with the platform vendors like Cloudera, MapR, and Horton because we recognize that we are going to have to be meniacal focused on one piece of this puzzle and to go very very deep but then play incredibly well both, you know, with all the rest of the ecosystem and so I think that is really colored our entire product strategy and how we go to market and I think customers, you know, they want the flexibility to change their minds and the subscription model is all about that, right? You got to earn it every single year. >> So what's the future of (mumbles)? 'Cause that brings up a good point we were kind of critical of Google and you mentioned you guys had-- I saw in some news that you guys were involved with Google. >> Yup. >> Being enterprise ready is not just, hey we have the great tech and you buy from us, damn it we're Google. >> Right. >> I mean, you have to have sales people. You have to have automation mechanism to create great product. Will the future of wrangling and data prep go into-- where does it end up? Because enterprises want, they want certain things. They're finicky of things. >> Right, right. >> As you guys know. So how does the future of data prep deal with the, I won't say the slowness of the enterprise, but they're more conservative, more SLA driven than they are price performance. >> But they're also more fragmented than ever before and you know, while that may not be a great thing for the customers for a company that's all about harmonizing data that's actually a phenomenal opportunity, right? Because we want to be the decision that customers make that guarantee that all their other decisions are changeable, right? And I go and-- >> Well they have legacy systems of record. This is the challenge, right? So I got the old oracle monolithic-- >> That's fine. And that's good-- >> So how do you-- >> The more the merrier, right? >> Does that impact you guys at all? How did you guys handle that situation? >> To me, to us that is more fragmentation which creates more need for wrangling because that introduces more complexity, right? >> You guys do well in that environment. >> Absolutely. And that, you know, is only getting bigger, worse, and more complicated. And especially as people go from (mumbles) to cloud as people start thinking about moving from just looking at transactions to interactions to now looking at behavior data and the IOT-- >> You're welcome in that environment. >> So we welcome that. In fact, that's where-- we went to solve this problem for Hadoop and Big Data first because we wanted to solve the problems at scale that were the most complicated and over time we can always move downstream to sort of more structured and smaller data and that's kind of what's happened with our business. >> I guess I want to circle back to this issue of which part of this value chain of refining data is-- if I'm understanding you right, the data wrangling is the anchor and once a company has made that choice then all the other tool choices have to revolve around it? Is that a-- >> Well think about this way, I mean, the bulk of the time when you talk to the analysts and also the bulk of the labor cost and these things isn't getting the data from its raw form into usage. That whole process of wrangling which is not really just data prep. It's all the things you do all day long to kind of massage these data sets and get 'em from here to there and make 'em work. That space is where the labor cost is. That also means that's spaces were the value add is because that's where your people power or your business context is really getting poured in to understand what do I have, what am I doing with it and what do I want to get out of it. As we move from bottom line IT to top line value generation with data, it becomes all the more so, right? Because now it's not just the matter of getting the reports out every month. It's also what did that brilliant in sales do to that dataset to get that much left? I need to learn from her and do a similar thing. Alright? So, that whole space is where the value is. What that means is that, you know, you don't want that space to be tied to a particular BI tool or a particular execution edge. So when we say that we want to make a decision in the middle of that enables all the other decisions, what you really want to make sure is that that work process in there is not tightly bound to the rest of the stack. Okay? And so you want to particularly pick technologies in that space that will play nicely with different storage, that play nicely with different execution environments. Today it's a dupe, tomorrow it's Amazon, the next day it's Google and they have different engines back there potentially. And you want it certainly makes your place with all the analytic and visualizations-- >> So decouple from all that? >> You want to decouple that and you want to not lock yourself in 'cause that's where the creativity's happening on the consumption side and that's where the mess that you talked about is just growing on the production side so data production is just getting more complicated. Data consumption's getting more interesting. >> That's actually a really really cool good point. >> Elaborating on that, does that mean that you have to open up interfaces with either the UI layer or at the sort of data definition layer? Or does that just mean other companies have to do the work to tie in to the styles? The styles and structures that you have already written? >> In fact it's sort of the opposite. We do the work to tie in to a lot of this, these other decisions in this infrastructure, you know. We don't pretend for a minute that people are going to sort of pick a solution like Trifacta and then build their organization around it. As your point, there's tons of legacy, technology out there. There is all kinds of things moving. Absolutely. So we, a big part of being the decoder ring for data for Trifacta and saying it's like listen, we are going to inter operate with your existing investments and we're going to make sure that you can always get at your data, you can always take it from whatever state its in to whatever state you need to be in, you can change your mind along the way. And that puts a lot of owners on us and that's the reason why we have to be so focused on this space and not jump into visualization and analytics and not jump in to its storage and processing and not try to do the other things to the right or left. Right? >> So final question. I'd like you guys both to take a stab at it. You know, just going to pivot off at what Joe was saying. Some of the most interesting things are happening in the data exploration kind of discovery area from creativity to insights to game changing stuff. >> Yup. >> Ventures potentially. >> Joe: Yup. >> The problem of the complexity, that's conflict. >> Yeah. >> So how does we resolve this? I mean, besides the Trifacta solution which you guys are taming, creating a platform for that, how do people in industry work together to solve that problem? What's the approach? >> So I think actually there's a couple sort of heartening trends on this front that make me pretty optimistic. One of these is that the inside of structures are in the enterprises we work with becoming quite aligned between IT and the line of business. It's no longer the case that the line of business that are these annoying people that they're distracting IT from their bottom line function. IT's bottom line function is being translated into a what's your value for the business question? And the answer for a savvy IT management person is, I will try to empower the people around me to be rabid fans and I will also try to make sure that they do their own works so I don't have to learn how to do it for them. Right? And so, that I think is happening-- >> Guys to this (mumbles) business guys, a bunch of annoying guys who don't get what I need, right? So it works both ways, right? >> It does, it does. And I see that that's improving sort of in the industry as the corporate missions around data change, right? So it's no longer that the IT guys really only need to take care of executives and everyone else doesn't matter. Their function really is to serve the business and I see that alignment. The other thing that I think is a huge opportunity and the part of who I-- we're excited to be so tightly coupled with Google and also have our stuff running in Amazon and at Microsoft. It's as people read platform to the cloud, a lot of legacy becomes a shed or at least become deprecated. And so there is a real-- >> Or containerized or some sort of microservice. >> Yeah. >> Right, right. >> And so, people are peeling off business function and as part of that cost savings to migrate it to the cloud, they're also simplified. And you know, things will get complicated again. >> What's (mumbles) solution architects out there that kind of re-boot their careers because the old way was, hey I got networks, I got apps and stacks and so that gives the guys who could be the new heroes coming in. >> Right. >> And thinking differently about enabling that creativity. >> In the midst of all that, everything you said is true. IT is a massive place and it always will be. And tools that can come in and help are absolutely going to be (mumbles). >> This is obvious now. The tension's obviously eased a bit in the sense that there's clear line of sight that top line and bottom line are working together now on. You mentioned that earlier. Okay. Adam, take a stab at it. (mumbling) >> I was just going to-- hey, I know it's great. I was just going to give an example, I think, that illustrates that point so you know, one of our customers is Pepsi. And Pepsi came to us and they said, listen we work with retailers all over the world and their reality is that, when they place orders with us, they often get it wrong. And sometimes they order too much and then they return it, it spoils and that's bad for us. Or they order too little and they stock out and we miss revenue opportunities. So they said, we actually have to be better at demand planning and forecasting than the orders that are literally coming in the door. So how do we do that? Well, we're getting all of the customers to give us their point of sale data. We're combining that with geospatial data, with weather data. We're like looking at historical data and industry averages but as you can see, they were like-- we're stitching together data across a whole variety of sources and they said the best people to do this are actually the category managers and the people responsible for the brands 'cause they literally live inside those businesses and they understand it. And so what happened was they-- the IT organization was saying, look listen, we don't want to be the people doing the janitorial work on the data. We're going to give that work over to people who understand it and they're going to be more productive and get to better outcomes with that information and that brings us up to go find new and interesting sources and I think that collaborative model that you're starting to see emerge where they can now be the data heroes in a different way by not being the ones beating the bottleneck on provisioning but rather can go out and figure out how do we share the best stuff across the organization? How do we find new sources of information to bring in that people can leverage to make better decisions? That's in incredibly powerful place to be and you know, I think that that model is really what's going to be driving a lot of the thinking at Trifacta and in the industry over the next couple of years. >> Great. Adam Wilson, CEO of Trifacta. Joe Hellestein, CTO-- Chief Strategy Officer of Trifacta and also a professor at Berkeley. Great story. Getting the (mumbles) right is hard but under the hood stuff's complicated and again, congratulations about sharing the Ground project. Ground open source. Open source lab kind of thing at-- in Berkeley. Exciting new stuff. Thanks so much for coming on theCUBE. I appreciate great conversation. I'm John Furrier, George Gilbert. You're watching theCUBE here at Big Data SV in conjunction with Strata and Hadoop. Thanks for watching. >> Great. >> Thanks guys.