>> From Orlando, Florida, it's theCUBE! Covering SAP SAPPHIRE NOW 2018. Brought to you by NetApp. >> Welcome to the CUBE we are in Orlando, at SAP SAPPHIRE 2018, I'm Lisa Martin with Keith Townsend as my co-host. We're in the NetApp booth, and we are very excited to talk to the VP of the Chief Customer Office at SAP, Mark Marcus, Mark, welcome to theCUBE. >> Thank you, glad to be here I appreciate it. >> This event is enormous. One of the things that really struck me in Bill McDermott's key note was, you know, we always here about, oh we are expecting 20 thousand people, he talked about a million people engaging with SAP SAPPHIRE this week, via the in person, and the live, and the on demand video experiences. Massive! 390 thousand customers, hundreds of customer sessions the voice of the customer validating SAP as one of the world's most valuable brands is not only pervasive here its palpable. So talk to us about the Chief Customer Office. What is it, what's it's mission, why was it created? >> Yes, okay that's a great, a great way, so first of all thank you, I appreciate you being here, I live in Orlando so it's great to see this event in my-- People wonder why SAPPHIRE is actually in Orlando, it's because I live here. (all laughing) >> You're the reason! >> You're the reason. >> I'm the reason SAPPHIRE is in Orlando, Florida. >> Okay, you heard it, Mark Marcus, you're the reason. >> No, so what happened is, when Bill McDermott came to SAP, he was a different type of leader, and what he wanted to do immediately is start meeting with customers. So what he did is, he started meeting with customers, and he said if you have any questions or problems, give me a call. And so what happened is, his phone started ringing, people needed help, so he needed somebody that could help him with the customers when he ran North America. And so that was the genesis to Chief Customer Office. So we started off, first, we were extremely reactive. And so what I mean by that is, if the customer had a problem, we'd have to go in, and we'd have to help them. And it's much more difficult when you have a problem, then try to prevent a problem. So what we've been doin' the last several years, is trying to be much more proactive, so instead of waiting for the phone to ring, we've been getting with customers, and making sure, you know, as their project start, begin their steering committee meetings and make sure that things go well. >> So, you've taken that more proactive approach, it's almost how the organization's evolved. What is the focus today? >> Yes, well the focus has always been the customer, but I think it's more of, taking the best practices that we've learned, and actually sharing those with the customers, and helping them explain how other people have done their journey, because what you'll find, is people are in different phases of their journey, and what they like to hear more of is, you know, what did other customers do, what did they do right, what did they do wrong, and how can we be more successful? So we've been able to, over the years, if you think about, just to put it in perspective again, there are, SAP North America has 158 thousand customers, and we're only on, my particular team only has about a hundred of those customers, that we have. So it's a very, very small amount, they're are ones that, you know, are strategic to SAP, that we get involved in. But what we're able to do though, is, through social media and other areas is, customers wanna hear what happened, again, in the past, and how we can, you know, learn from that and move forward. >> So, I'm a big social media fan. Twitter handle has 38 thousand followers, which a lot for your focus on a hundred customers, so I think that, that you're echoing the, the theme very well. Talk to us about how it's changed over the past, 14 or so years, shift has focused from on-premises solutions to hybrid-cloud, to cloud analytics, AI, what's the, what are customers talking about? >> I'll tell you what, you're talkin' my language now, (Keith laughing) okay, because what happened is what we did is, actually what I'm in part, what I'm a part of is actually the cloud ambassador program. And so what that is, is it's focusing on our cloud customers so, you know, success factors, Ariba, Concur, and those kinda things, and so, really what happened, is, you know, when SAP, when I came to SAP 14 years ago, it was all on-premise ERP, alright? So it's very contained, very controlled with what people had now there's Cloud's, we're not really sure what customers are doing, how they're interacting with the solutions, and so what we have to do is we really focus, and again, my group is 100% focused in on that, so. What part of our mission has been is, we're not necessarily know what customers are doing, so we're helping to understand what they're doing, and trying to help educate groups inside SAP to be more responsive and help them. >> So you mentioned having responsibility for some strategic accounts, about a hundred. Do those represent kind of a subset of some of the key areas in which you're looking for the voice of the customer, and their practice using your technology to influence the direction of some of the key technologies? >> Yes, 'cause I'd say they're some of the biggest, most strategic customers that we have, and so what we do a lot of is, we're able to, we align directly with the executives, at the customer, so one of things with Chief Customer Office, is we're aligned at the C level, so it's, the CIO, the CEO, the CFO, at that level, so we're able to say we heard directly from the leaders of the companies, our most important customers, key customers, and we're able to take that back the other areas of SAP, and say, this is the what the leadership's demanding, and that's what we're able to help them with. >> So, as we're going through this phase of digital transformation, through a lot of organizations, that audience is even more important than, what?! (chuckles) Tell me how, as digital transformation has become, more than just a buzzword but a imperative from the C-suite, from CEOs to CIOs, CMOs, CDO, all the C's, CXO! How has the conversation between those groups changed, from the SAP perspective? >> Yeah, I'll tell ya, that is, again, I'm not just sayin' that you are, you're hitting exactly what we focus in on because, traditionally SAP has been focused more on the CIO level, so it's more the IT groups of implemented ERP, it's been more of a back-office type solution, well now, what we're finding is the line of businesses are the people that are actually making the decisions. So what we're finding out is that, it's not necessarily so much that the, technically, how they work, it's more the business processes they have, and how we can help actually, basically automate, and help them run more smoothly. >> Yeah, Hasso Plattner actually, and some of the guys this morning during the keynote talked about that, in terms of, customers were saying, you know, I'm getting kind of confused, there's so many different product names, a lot of acquisitions, he was talking about that, we heard from customers that there was confusion there. So when he was talking about, in the context of C4 for example of, making things simpler to understand, but also to your point, the back office and the front office now has to be connected so they also talked about that, in terms of, the integration with SAP Cloud, and how they really focused on enabling wholistic integration because it's the processes that have to now communicate together, so that, a whole, kind of proactive, customer responsiveness, that was really apparent this morning. 46 years young SAP, you have a new initiative about the customer for life, tell us about that. >> Okay, so customer for life is a new initiative that we have, so what I told you, at the Chief Customer Office we've done, we're able to touch very few customers, but, you know, again, you know we have 156 thousand, in SAP North America, you know, multiply that all over the world, I mean, it's many customers, okay. So what we've tried to do, is take what we've done on a small scale in the Chief Customer Office, and make that pervasive throughout the whole company. And so what we're really good at too is actually, you know, understanding what the customers do, finding them a solution, but now what we wanna do is go through the whole life-cycle of what we do so, I mentioned, you know, having a customer executive assigned to every customer. Being able to be part of the steering committees that we have, and being able to follow them through so we can help guide them, so it's not only selling the solutions but actually helping them through all the way, so the new initiative we set is customer for life, it's something that we're rolling out right now, and we've had, and again, it's taking what we did in the Chief Customer Office and, you know, propagating that through the rest of SAP. >> So, this facility, you like to say it, 16 football fields, American football fields, so that's a big facility. I walked the facility this morning, got in about three thousand steps. Hundred plus partners on the floor, ranging from system integrators, technology partners, and infrastructure space, software SIs. Help us understand as SAP, 20 thousand plus people here at the show, a million people online engaging on SAPPHIRE, SAP is becoming a platform company. How has that changed your role, your conversations? >> Well, I think what has happened a lot is, especially in the cloud projects, again I'm gonna focus more on what I'm a part of is, you know, there's a lot of new partners that come up. Because what happened is that, you know, we acquired several companies, we did, you know Concur, Ariba, SuccessFactors, a lot of big companies, and a lot of different partners. So really what our role is, in the Chief Customer Office is, to basically, to help these partners to understand how to work together, and we do a lot of things in meetings, we have, what we do, is, it's usually like the three legged stool, it is, you know, it's SAP, the partner, and the customer together, and we all do that together. And what I've found is, some of the problems that we've had is not neces-- you know, I always say like, how can take the exact same solution, and it works well in one company, and it doesn't work in another company? And what it is, to your point, with all the partners here, is it's communication, are they working together, you know, is the partner, and SAP, and the customer all working together, and so that's what I'm really focused on today is meeting with all the, you know, do the SAPPHIREs, to meet with the partners, to make sure we're aligned, you know, talk about our key customers, and make sure that we're all working together. >> We talked to one of the gentleman yesterday who was running some of the communities around HANA and Leonardo and, just the massive amount of content that is being generated to enable and educate customers across 25 plus industries, was massive, as well as, leveraging that peer validation from customers, like you're saying, you know, some customers in certain industries have a ton of success with the same thing that others customers struggle, depending on a lot of different variables. So that sort of collaboration and communication, even within the SAP communities alone, was very apparent yesterday that that's one of the big drivers, of I'm sure, the customer for life initiative is, as you have evolved, so have your customers. One thing that struck me yesterday was, you know, looking at, you're now number 17 of the World's top most valuable brands up there with Apple, you know, products that we can engage with and, I saw on a bus yesterday some of the messaging, and ERP you can talk to, and hear from. (Keith laughing) So SAP really set a very lofty ambition of being up there with the Amazons, and the Coca-Colas, and the Googles, and now you have technology that people can, you know, like at home with their digital assistant, talk to and communicate with. I thought that was very powerful message. >> And I'd say that's, I'd say too that, you know, I've worked with SAP for 14 years, and when I came to SAP, nobody had really heard of SAP and what they were, they thought maybe, you know, sometimes on TV when you see SAP when it's translated in other languages or something, that's what they think of SAP, they don't really know what the company is but, yeah, it's been great to see how, you know, people would stop you, you know, whether you're wearin', you know, they'll see somethin' on your laptop, on your shirts or somethin' like that, yeah so it's been good. I think that's been a big focus of getting it out because, one thing is is we have 150 million cloud users, that's a lot of people, so a lot of people use SAP, so. Again, one of the cloud products that we have is called Concur, it's for expense and reporting, and so a lot of times people might not've heard of SAP, but they've heard of Concur, because they all do their expenses, that kinda stuff. So, exactly right, it is pretty good, you know, when you have even family members know who SAP is now. They've done a great job, you know, hiring, you know, with the market department and the people they've hired, it's been great, it's been good. >> So, okay, we talked a little bit about analytics and the customer experience as we're looking at intelligent business. Is that a message that's actually resonating with customers in that top 100 strategic accounts, are they using analytics to actually power business, What are some of the data analysis success stories? >> Yeah, I would say that, what I would say is that, what I've found a lot of times is that, you know, people can get the information in, but they need to be able to get the information out. And so, everybody across that has done it, so, I would just say almost every customer we have has basically needed to get that out, and do reporting and those kinda things, you know? So, part of what we do at the Chief Customer Office is, you know, not only, you know, help them with the reports that they have, but to be able to run that kinda stuff. >> You guys also have, you know, some really interesting use-cases, I'm a Formula One fan, I've worked with Formula One before, I'm, I understand it from a fan perspective. You guys are really involved in McLaren Motorsport, for example, from finance, to procurement, to manufacturing. How are you seeing some of these really big use-cases like Formula One, or Coca-Cola, infuse into some of the, you know, the mid-sized businesses, who, you say, might be using Concur for example. What is some of the value that a small company can get from the massive users? >> Yeah, well I'd say there's a lot of things, because what happens is that from those big massive customers that we have, we're able to put together as we call model company. And so what a model company is, is it takes the best practices you have and puts it into more of a, I'd say nothings out-of-the-box, but makes it much more easier to implement, to be able to do it, so what we're able to do is, you know, with the massive amounts of info like McLaren, I think Hasso mentioned what, there's 400 sensors that they're getting on their cars, and that kind of stuff. So basically being able to take all the information that we have, and then from that, distill it down into where it's a very, repeatable type instance we can use for other customers. So there's a lot, I mean that's what we do with a lot of the, what the customers have, we try to get that back to where other people can use it. >> A Formula One car is basically an IOT device. You said 400 sensors, generating a ton of data, per race weekend, times three days, times 20 events a year. I read from Gartner just the other day that by 2020, which is around the corner, there's expected to be 20 billion IOT devices. What are you hearing from your customer base regarding IOT and being able to synchronize this, you know, modern next-gen data center with myriad devices? >> Yeah, so that is one of our top initiatives that we have right now. Because, one of the things that we've done is, we have an offering that we have called Leonardo, and what Leonardo is, it was named after the inventor Leonardo da Vinci, alright? So, you know, in his time he was, you know, a great innovator, actually went and saw his house and went over to Europe, and I've done a lot with Leonardo, you know what I'm sayin'? To be able to do that, right? But what that is, is that's basically all about, you know, getting devices to be able to get that information in. Because what you do is, you have you know, thousands of sensors and stuff like that and a good, you asked me earlier about a good success story on that, is one of the ones that I think resonates the most on that is in Buenos Aires, they have a massive problem with rain, you know, it rains a lot, and they have severe flooding, and the architecture is antiquated. But what they've found, is the reason that they were having these flooding problems, is because the sewers and the drains were all getting clogged up. So what they did was, they put a sensor in every one of the drains to be able to make sure that they were unclogged and they were flowing freely. So what they did is, they were able to, if the water flow started going down they were able to empty out the drains, even with an antiquated sewer system, because they were keeping it aligned with, you know, using Leonardo now, they can go and keep it cleaned out, they've had massive rains and the flooding hasn't really been there where it is, so now, what's interesting is every time I go by and see a gutter that's all clogged up, I think, you know, they need Leonardo to be able to help! >> I was reading as well about Alicia Tillman, your CMO, who's been at the helm for about nine months now and, in the context of this desire to become one of the top global brands with an invisible product, she said, you know, that one of the most important things for SAP right now is brand narrative, messages and campaigns will change quarterly or, every six months as they should but, she said, you know, to be able to show the value of basically under-the-hood software, you've gotta be able to show how it transforms countries, lives, industries, and that's one of the things that I think is very, very palpable here at the event is how much impact SAP is making in, whether it's rhino conservation in Africa or, you know, helping water scarcity in India, the impact, which is really the most, the biggest validation that you get, right from the voice of your customers is massive. >> Yeah, and I'd say to that, you know I like to say that, you know, it sounds like, you know, yes we're a software company, and, you know, that kinda stuff, but, it is really a noble endeavor, because we are doing a lot of things to help people's lives, and to run their businesses better, and what you realize is that, Chief Customer Office sometimes we see that other side when the systems aren't running properly at times, you know, they're usually runnin' right, but sometimes they have problems, and when they do, you can just see the impact you have on, you know, people's lives and businesses and stuff like that, that it is really running, you know, it is core to what you have, you know. So I'll tell you one of the interesting things that SAP's involved in is, they do a lot with instant messaging, so they have a part of, one of the acquisitions we have does instant messaging, well, you don't think about that but like, when you use, let's say, Facebook Messenger, or something like that, those messages go inside an SAP infrastructure at times, right? So imagine, you know, if you can't change messages, or doin' those kinda things, you know, so. You're exactly right, it definitely does, what we're doing does really impact a lot of peoples lives, so it's important. >> Well mark, thanks so much for taking some time to stop by theCUBE and chat with us about what SAP is doing with customers, how they're really symbiotically working together with you to evolve and transform this company. >> I wanna say one other thing too, it's great to work with two professionals here, you guys have really helped me a lot. >> Aww! >> I don't do this a lot, but it really made me feel comfortable, so you, I appreciate your help, thank you. >> Our pleasure, thanks so much! And, so you're the reason SAPPHIRE's in Orlando, are you also the reason they got Justin Timberlake tomorrow night?! (Mark laughing) >> I would like that. But I would like to say real quick, one thing before we cut real quick, I would like to say one thing just about the NetApp partnership we have. So RJ Bibby is the person that I work with at NetApp, and, just what he's done to basically, because NetApp really helps run a lot of our infrastructure inside SAP, so it's success factors, some of the high-availability in things that we have, and just working with RJ, and kinda learning how we, how we work and can help other customers, they've really volunteered to help a lot of our customers, and so, I just wanna thank NetApp again for helping us sponsor this. >> Great, great closing. We wanna thank NetApp for having theCUBE in their booth. Lisa Martin, with Keith Townsend, we are at SAP SAPPHIRE NOW 2018, thanks for watching! (bubbly music)

>> From Orlando, Florida, it's theCUBE. Covering SAP Sapphire Now 2018, brought to you by NetApp. >> Welcome back to theCUBE, I am Lisa Martin, with Keith Townsend. We have been here all day at SAP Sapphire 2018. Keith, this venue in Orlando is so huge. It's the equivalent of 16 American football fields. >> Yeah, probably should not have worn a pair of new shoes. >> No, but you did close your rings, so it's a trade-off, right? >> It's a trade-off, yeah. >> So, the keynote this morning started out with a bang. Bill McDermott, the CEO of SAP, is probably the most energetic, evangelical, C-level I've ever seen on stage. You really could feel the excitement, the momentum. They also followed that with some great announcements. You know, they've been saying for awhile, being pretty bullish about wanting to not just disrupt the Sierra market, but wanting to become one of the world's most valuable brands. They wanna be up there with the Apples, and the Googles, and Coca-Cola and Mercedes-Benz, who all have products that we all see, and touch, and feel, and buy. And they announced that the brands e-rankings just came out the other day, that they're number 17, up four spots from last year. So, their momentum is, they're really putting their money where their mouth is. >> Yeah, so SAP is the cash register of the world. 70% of the world's transactions go through SAP, but most of us don't see it. So, it's amazing to see that they're ranked number 17 on those brands that are very, you know, if you told somebody you worked for SAP, they'd be like, oh, okay, I think I might have heard of that. >> Right. >> Or, I've heard that that was the reason why manufacturing is down, because the SAP system was down. So, it is a bold statement to say that you're gonna go from that, to a household name. Interestingly enough, part of that is becoming an ecosystem. So, becoming a platform. What we've heard today was a lot of talk about how SAP is transforming from a product company. You know, a point-of-sale system is one thing, but to say that you've built a ecosystem, and a platform around that, is the goal that I think I heard today from the stage floor. >> And you're right, you talk about, you know, them becoming a household name, with a product that's basically invisible to most people who probably use it. They have amassed 390,000 customers in 46 years. They've been around for a long time. This event, though, is massive. The partner area alone is huge. There's probably more than 20,000 people not just that are here, in Orlando, but, he said, Bill McDermott, a million people engaging with SAP Sapphire via the online experience. That's enormous. But to your point, it's all really fundamentally due to the partnerships, the systems integrators, the technology partners and more who have helped them on their transformation. >> Yeah, we had KPIT on, they said the guest has been on 20 Sapphires for 20 years, the event has gone on for 25 years in some form. He remembered, initially, they might have had one or two sessions. They have 12, KPIT has 12 sessions this year at the Sapphire 2018. There's a huge ecosystem of partners, here on the show floor. Over 500, I think, sessions in general. We had the VP of Community for S/4. They have 1,000 how-to videos on how to just do basic things in S/4. Huge community, huge event. SAP is starting to make end rolls and becoming, again, not just a products company, but an ecosystem company, I think. Sapphire in Orlando is a great example of how they're expanding the brand. >> Yes, and in fact, on the brand part, you know, that's one of the things that their CMO, Alicia Tillman, who was on main stage this morning, that's something that I've heard her talk about before. She's been the CMO for about nine months now, and she said, you know, and marketers will know, campaigns and messaging will change every quarter, six months, and that is fine. It's the brand narrative that they really started to work on at SAP. So, you're seeing this "Best-run companies run on SAP", it's sharing the value of what SAP can deliver with their partner ecosystem, in terms of how it's helping customers transform their businesses, transform industries, save lives. They've done a very focused job on showing how this invisible technology is really revolutionizing the world. They're now going, you know, full-force, embedding A.I., and really being quite bold, they're saying. I loved what Bill McDermott had on the slide this morning, of augmented intelligence. And there's always a lot of concern with A.I, right? Jobs being replaced. And he talked about what he, and some of the other world leaders, were talking about. And I liked augmented intelligence, to augment humanity, this connection of humans and machines working together. They're really being quite bold, and focused, in that area. I'm just curious what your take was from an advanced analytics A.I. perspective. >> So, there's a lot of talk around advanced A.I. analytics. At the end of the day, it's about actual business results. We're here in the booth of NetApp, who has done a great job, frankly, of transforming their image from a storage company in the middle of a transformation to being known as a data-driven company. So, NetApp has gone through a similar change that SAP is looking to do, from a brand perspective. Reasonably enough, we had the CIO, Bill, from NetApp, that talked about that transformation, and how data is a key part of their own transformation, internally. And, how SAP could probably hold NetApp up as a great example of a company that's using the predecessor to C/4HANA, which was just announced, on the staged hypers of taking data, analyzing that data, applying A.I, machine learning, more like machine learning in reality. Machine learning to that data, and then getting insights, so that humans can make better decisions. >> Right. You know, on that front, one of the themes I heard today, Keith, from not just Bill Miller, the CIO of NetApp, who was on here with us earlier, but some of their other partners, NetApp and SAP's partners, all talk about their own transformations, internally, as essential for them to become intelligent enterprises, which is a lot of what SAP's talking about. But I also thought that was quite valuable, from an external perspective, to hear NetApp talk so candidly about their transformation, and share that with their customers who are in similar positions. I think, when vendors will, say, drink their own champagne, and there's real proof there in the pudding. I think that's tremendously valuable for these brands. And we've just heard that kind of consistently throughout the day today, of companies that are showing how they're transforming to then help their customers also transform. >> So, one of the things that we like to ask on theCUBE is not just about current customer base, but, what new customers are you attracting? So, one of the interesting conversations is one of the last ones we had with WorkSpan, and how they're a small company, and they started out the gate with SAP, and how the brand has gone beyond this, oh, this is a manufacturing, supply chain, you must be a Fortune 500 company to even consider rolling it out to. You know what? We're a brand new company, providing a data-driven product, and out of the gate, we're selecting a S/4HANA and the platform to create this new product that's consumed by not necessarily technologists, that powers an alliance platform to find and curate business alliances. I thought that was an extremely interesting interview that shows the power of expanding beyond just a focus on traditional enterprise, but the power of data. And once you've become a platform, how you can power your partner ecosystem. >> I thought that was a great example, as well, of a company that's only been in business for three years, less than four years. How they saw this gap in the market, where they said, you know, we're surrounded by alliance partners of SAP's in this 16 football fields location that we're in. And WorkSpan found that 60 to 75% of announced alliances fail. Huge opportunity for them to then get in from a systematic perspective and align, you know, two companies' marketing automation systems, for example, and sales automation systems. And they really saw this big opportunity to, like you were saying, create an entirely new product, and probably create a new market as a result. I thought that was a really modern example of an idea that saw a huge gap, and can be transformative. I asked Ahmed, after we stopped rolling the cameras, all right, so you found 60 to 75% of these announced alliances fail, typically. What does WorkSpan think you can do to bring that number down? And he said, within two years, we wanna get that down to about 30%. >> Wow. That is an amazing stat. So, let's look at the companies that are digitally transforming. So we had two guests that I want to highlight, one with Mike McGivney from SAP SuccessFactors, which is SAP's people-focused cloud, and then Wolfgang Hopfes, the head of SAP Business for EMEA. And they're on a unique challenge. SAP has been around for 46 years, and in IT years, that's like, you know, 1,000. So, there's a lot of technical debt, that companies are now paying for. You know, back in the nineties, early 2000s, customizing SAP was all the rage. Now, customers are faced with, they have to digitally transform their organizations, how do they do so? Well, it's not so easy to move from a customized SAP to S/4. Bill trumpeted the numbers of 1,800 SAP HANA customers, which is great, well over a billion dollars in sales for an in-memory database. However, SAP has over 300,000 customers. So there's a lot of opportunity, but a lot of challenge. So, the ecosystem of partners, Fujitsu, NetApp, other infrastructure companies looking to help simplify the infrastructure so that technologists within these customer organizations can focus on the higher stack of those larger business challenges of basically pulling apart what they've built. Bill from NetApp shared how difficult their transformation was from their CRM to >> Hypers? >> Hypers. He called it painful, a painful six months. And what we saw today, I think, was a reality check. A lot of enterprises have a lot of pain ahead of them. >> Well, it's pain in a number of areas, and one of them is cultural. And I really thought, you know, you say, SAP being 46 years old is like, 1,000 in IT, or dog years. They're like the Gandalf of IT, right? But one of the things that I found quite remarkable is 46 year-old history, 390,000 customers. But clearly, they have been able to evolve their culture to be able to support what their customers need, and go from just being a supply chain procurement-focused type of business. And I thought that was really quite compelling, to see how they must have had to transform their culture, so that they can help businesses transform. They make it look easy, with the messaging and the momentum, but that was something that for a company that's an incumbent like that, is a bit of, you might say, even a model for how to do that right. >> Yeah, we talked to Joe Lazar, he's the SAP VP of Global Technology Partners. He talked about how SAP likes to be pushed to be a little uncomfortable by their partners, and we asked him the tough questions. You know, there's been tweets and there's been announcements from all the ACI vendors. I've talked to customer after customer that says, you know what, S/4HANA on HCI is what we want. A very quotable comment that he made was, we're not doing S/4 on HANA because we want to, we're doing S/4 on HANA because customers demand it. So, SAP is definitely listening to customer demand, S/4 on HANA is one of those things. You know, he tried to stay away from the bad word of certified on 4HANA, and validated, and focused on solutions, but SAP has a little ways to go. And that's kind of a, you talk to any HCI customer, validated and certified 4HANA is a bad word today, but SAP understands it and they're moving to certify the platform for HCI, so I thought that was a great example of them listening to customers and continuing to transform over the years. >> You're absolutely right. In fact, you know, if you look up digital transformation, one of the first pillars that you're gonna see is you gotta become customer-centric. And we really heard that a lot today. Even NetApp, when you were talking with Bill Miller about ONTAP in the cloud, going it's okay guys, maybe we have to listen to our customers. If we don't we won't be in business. That's a hallmark of an enterprise that is digitally transforming. >> Yeah, I'd argue that Dave Hitts was the one who forced that, that kind of cultural change. You had to bring in the founder to talk to the engineers and that had very engineer-driven thinking And I think Dave was very direct, like you know, we have to make the change or we won't be in business. The pendulum has changed to cloud. The SAP, which is not by any stretch of the mind, was never designed to run in the cloud, but they're adopting the technology for what customers are demanding. There's an AWS booth here, Fujitsu was the first one to say that, you know what, if customers need fail-fast environments, that's exactly where they should go, and put S/4 implementations, and then steady states should be moved to RMPRAM or private dating center or hosted solutions. So, the ecosystem seems to be embracing this change. >> Definitely. Anything that you're particularly looking forward to tomorrow for Day 2? >> You know what? I love talking to customers, so I'm looking forward to more customer conversations, talking about how is this being used? We haven't really talked a lot about Leonardo much. So, you know, IoT, A.I., how are these things that get a lot of press being perceived by actual customers? How are they being implemented? What's their true adoption rate? >> Awesome. Well, I look forward to hosting with you tomorrow, Keith. Thanks so much. >> I appreciate it. >> Thanks for watching. Keith and I have been at SAP Sapphire, bringing you some hopefully great informative content. From the NetApp booth, Lisa Martin for Keith Townsend. Thanks for watching.

>> Announcer: Live from Munich, Germany, it's The CUBE, covering DataWorks Summit Europe 2017. Brought to you by Heartenworks. >> Okay, welcome back everyone, we are here live in Munich, Germany For DataWorks 2017, the DataWorks Summit, formally Hadoop Summit. I'm John Furrier with Silicone Angle's theCUBE, my co-host Dave Vellante, wrapping up day two of coverage here with Christoph Schubert, who's the Senior Director of SAP Big Data, handles all the go-to-market for SAP Big Data, @sapbigdata is the Twitter handle. You have a great shirt there, Go Live >> Go Live or go home. (Laughs) >> John: You guys are a part. Welcome to theCUBE. >> Christoph: Thank you, I appreciate it. >> Thanks for joining us and on the wrap up. You and I have known each other, we've known each other for a long time. We've been in many Sapphires together, we've had many conversations around the role of data, the role of architecture, the role of how organizations are transforming at the speed of business, which is SAP, it's a lot of software that powers business, under transformation right now. You guys are no stranger to analytics, we have the HANA Cloud Platform now. >> Christoph: We know a thing or two about that, yeah. (laughs) >> You know a little bit about data and legacy as well. You guys power pretty much most of the Fortune 100, if not all of them. What's your thoughts on this? >> Yeah, good point. On the topic of some numbers, about 75% of the world GDP runs through SAP systems eventually. So yes, we know a thing or two about transactional and analytical systems, definitely. >> John: And you're a partner with Hortonworks >> With Hortonworks and other Cloud providers, Hadoop Providers, certainly, absolutely but in this case, Hortonworks. We have, specifically, a solution that runs on Hadoop Spark and that allows, actually, our customers to unify much, much larger data sets with a system of records that we now do so many of them around the world for new and exciting new cases. >> And you were born in Munich. This is your hometown. >> This is actually a home gig for me, exactly. So, yes, unfortunately I'll also be presenting in English but yeah, I want to talk German, Bavarian, all the time. (laughs) >> I see my parents tonight. >> I wish we could help you >> but we don't speak Bavarian. But we do like to drink the beer though. It's the fifth season but a lot of great stuff here in Germany. Dave, you guys, I want to get your thoughts on something. I wanted to get you, just 'cause you're both, you're like an analyst, Christoph as well. I know you're over at SAP but, you know, you have such great industry expertise and Dave obviously covers the stuff everyday. I just think that the data world is so undervalued, in my mind. I think the ecosystem of startups that are coming out in the, out of the open source ecosystems, which are well-defined, by the way, and getting better. But now you have startups doing things like VIMTEC, we just had a bank on. Startups creating value and things like block chain on the horizon. Other new paradigms are coming on, is going to change the landscape of how wealth is created and value is created and charged. So, you've got a whole new tsunami of change. What's your thoughts on how this expands and obviously, certainly, Hortonworks as a public company and Cloudera is going public, so you expect to see that level up in valuation. >> They're in the process, yes. >> But I still think they're both undervalued. Your thoughts. >> Well it's not just the platform, right? and that what, I think, where Hadoop also came from. The legacy of Hadoop is that you don't have to really think about how you want to use your data. You have to, don't think ahead what kind of schema you want to apply and how you want to correlate your data. You can create a large data lake, right? That's the term that was created a long time ago, that allows customers to just collect all that data and think in the second stage about what to use with it and how to correlate it. And that's exactly, now, we're also seeing in the third stage, to not just create analytics but also creating applications instead of analytics or on top of analytics, correlating with data that also drives the business, the core business, from an OLTP perspective or also from an OLAP perspective. >> I mean, Dave, you were the one who said Amazon's a trillion dollar TAM, will be the first trillion dollar company and you were kind of, but you looked at the thousand points of Live with Cloud enables, all these aggregated all together, what's your thoughts on valuation of this industry? Because if Hortonworks continues on this peer play and they've got Cloudera coming in and they're doing well, you could argue that they're both undervalued companies if you count the ecosystem. >> Well, we always knew that big data was going to be a heavy lift, right? And I would agree with what Christoph was saying, was that Hadoop is profound in that it was no schema on right and ship five magabytes of code to a pedabyte of data. But it was hard to get that right. And I remember something you said, John, at one of our early SAP Sapphires, When the big data meme was just coming through. You said, "You know, SAP is not just big data, it's fast data". And you were talking about bringing transaction and analytic data together. >> John: Right. >> Again, something that has only recently been enabled. And you think about, you know, continuous streaming. I think that, now, big data has sort of entered the young-adulthood phase, we're going to start seeing steep part of that S-curve returns, and I think the hype will be realized. I think it is undervalued, much like the internet was. It was overvalued, then nobody wanted to touch it, and then it became. Actually, if you think back to 1999, the internet was undervalued in terms of what it actually achieved. >> John: Yeah. >> I think the same or similar thing is going to happen with big data. And since we have an SAP guest on, I'll say as well, We all remember the early days of ERP. >> Mhm, oh yeah. >> It wasn't clear >> Nope. >> Who was going to emerge as the king. >> Right. >> There were a few solutions. You're right. >> That's right. And, as well, something else we said about big data, it was the practitioners of ERP that made the most money, that created the most value and the same thing is happening here. >> Yeah. In fact, on that topic, I believe that 2017 and 2018 will be the big years for big data, so to speak. >> John: Uh huh. >> In fact, because of some statistics. >> John: In what way? >> Well, we just did >> Adoption, S-curve? >> Right, exactly. Utilizing the value of big data. You're talking about valuation here, right? 75% of CEOs of the top 1000 believe that the next three years are more important to their business than the last 50. And so that tells me that they're willing to invest. Not just the financial market, where I believe really run the most sophisticated big data analytics and models today. They had real use cases with real results very quickly. And so, they showed many how it's done. They created sort of the new role of a data scientist. They have roles like an AML officer. It's a real job, they do nothing else but anti-money laundering, right? So, in that industry they've shown us how to do that and I think others will follow. >> Yeah, and I think that when you look at this whole thing about digital transformation, it's all about data. >> John: Yeah. >> I mean, if you're serious about digital transformation, you must become a data-driven company and you have to hop on that curb. Even if you're talking to the, you know, bank today who got on in 2014, which was relatively late, but the pace at which they're advancing is astronomical. >> John: Yeah. >> I don't remember his name, a British mathematician, created, about 11 years already, that according to the phrase "Data is the new oil". >> John: Mhm. >> And I think it's very true because crude oil, in its original form, you also can't use it. >> John: It has to be refined. >> Right, exactly. It has to be refined to actually use it and use the value of it. Same thing with data. You have to distill it, you have to correlate it, you have to align it, you have to relate it to business transactions so the business really can take advantage of it. >> And then we're seeing, you know, to your point, you've got, I don't know, a list of big data companies that are now in public is growing. It's still small, not much profit. >> I mean, I just think, and this is while I'm getting your reaction, I mean, I'm just reading right now some news popping on my dashboard. Google just released some benchmarks on the TPU, the transistor processing unit, >> Dave: Right. >> Basically a chip dedicated to machine learning. >> Yep. >> You know, so, you're going to start to see some abstraction layers develop, whether it's a hardened-top processor hardware, you guys have certainly done innovation on the analytic side, we've seen that with some of the specialty apps. Just to make things go faster. I mean, so, more and more action is coming, so I would agree that this S-curve is coming. But the game might shift. I mean, this is not an easy, clear path. There's bets being made in big data and there's potential for huge money shift, of value. >> See, one of the things I see, and we talked to Hortonworks about this, the new president, you know, betting all on open source. I happen to think a hybrid model is going to win. I think the rich get richer here. SAP, IBM, even Oracle, you know, they can play the open source game and say, "Hey, we're going to contribute to open source, we're going to participate, we're going to utilize open source, but we're also going to put the imprimatur of our install base, our business model, our trusted brands behind so-called big data." We don't really use that term as much anymore. It's the confluence of not only the technology but the companies who, what'd you say, 75% of the world's transactions run though SAP at some point? >> Christoph: Yeah. >> With companies like SAP behind it, and others, that's when this thing, I think, really takes off. >> What I think a lot of people don't realize, and I've been a customer, also, for a long time before I joined the vendor side, and what is under-realized is the aspect of risk management. Once you have a system and once you have business processes digitized and they run your business, you can't introduce radical changes overnight as quickly anymore as you'd like or your business would like. So, risk management is really very important to companies. That's why you see innovation within organizations not necessarily come from the core digitization organization within their enterprise, it often happens on the outside, within different business units that are closer to the product or to the customer or something. >> Something else that's happening, too, that I wanted to address is this notion of digitization, which is all about data, allows companies to jump industries. You're seeing it everywhere, you're seeing Amazon getting into content, Apple getting into financial services. You know, there's this premise out there that Uber isn't about taxicabs, it's about logistics. >> John: Yeah. >> And so you're seeing these born-digital, born in the cloud companies now being able to have massive impacts across different industries. Huge disruption creates, you know, great opportunities, in my view. >> Christoph: Yeah. >> David: What do you think? >> I mean, I just think that the disruption is going to be brutal, and I want to, I'm trying to synthesize what's happening in this show, and you know, you're going to squint through all the announcements and the products, really an upgrade to 2.6, a new data platform. But here in Europe the IOT thing just, to me, is a catalyst point because it's really a proof point to where the value is today. >> David: Mhm. >> That people can actually look at and say, "This is going to have an impact on our business tier digitization point" and I think IOT is pulling the big data industry and cloud together. And I think machine learning and things that come over the top on it are only going to make it go faster. And so that intersection point, where the AI, augmented intelligence, is going to come in, I think that's where you're going to start to see real proof points on value proposition of data. I mean, right now it's all kind of an inner circle game. "Oh yeah, got to get the insights, optimize this process here and there" and so there's some low hanging fruit, but the big shifting, mind blowing, CEO changing strategies will come from some bigger moves. >> To that point, actually, two things I want to mention that SAP does in that space, specifically, right? Startups, we have a program actually, SAP.io, that Bill McDermont also recently introduced again, where we invest in startups in this space to help foster innovation faster, right? And also connecting that with our customers. >> John: What is it called? >> SAP.io Something to look out for. And on the topic of IOT, we made, also, an announcement at the beginning of the year, Project Leonardo. >> Yeah. >> It's a commitment, it's a solution set, and it's also an investment strategy, right? We're committed in this market to invest, to create solutions, we have solutions already in the cloud and also in primus. There are a few companies we also purchased in conjunction with Loeonardo, RT specifically. Some of our customers in the manufacturing space, very strong opportunity for IOT, sensor collection, creating SLAs for robotics on the manufacturing floor. For example, we have a complete solution set to make that possible and realize that for our customers and that's exactly a perfect example where these sensor applications in IOT, edge, compute rich environments come together also with a core where, then, a system of references like machine points, for example, matter because if you manage the SLA for a machine, for example, you just not only monitor it, you want to also automatically trigger the replacement of a part, for example, and that's why you need an SAP component, as well. So, in that space, we're heavily investing, as well. >> The other think I want to say about IOT is, I see it, I mean, cloud and big data have totally disrupted the IT business. You've seen Dell buying EMC, HP had to get out of the cloud business, Oracle pivoted to the cloud, SAP obviously, going hard after the cloud. Very, very disruptive, those two trends. I see IOT as not necessarily disruptive. I see those who have the install base as adopting IOT and doing very, very well. I think it's maybe disruptive to the economy at large, but I think existing companies like GE, like Siemens, like Dimar, are going to do very, very well as a result of IOT. I mean, to the extent they embrace digitization, which they would be crazy not to. >> Alright guys, final thoughts. What's your walkaway from this show? Dave, we'll start with you. >> I was going to say, you know, Hadoop has definitely not failed, in my mind, I think it's been wildly successful. It is entering this new phase that I call sort of young-adulthood and I think it's, we know it's gone mainstream into the enterprise, now it's about, okay, how do I really drive the value of data, as we've been discussing, and hit that steep part of the S-curve. Which, I agree, it's going to be within the next two years, you're going to start to see massive returns. And I think this industry is going to be realized, looked back, it was undervalued in 2017. >> Remember how long it took to align on TCP/IP? (laughter) >> Walk away, I mean interoperability was key with TCP/IP. >> Christoph: Yeah. One of the things that made things happen. >> I remember talking about it. (laughter) >> Yeah, two megabits per second. Yeah, but I mean, bringing back that, what's your walkaway? Because is it a unification opportunity? Is it more of an ecosystem? >> A good friend of mine, also at SAP on the West Coast, Andreas Walter, he shared an observation that he saw in another presentation years ago. It was suits versus hoodies. Different kind of way to run your IT shop, right? Top-down structure, waterfall projects, and suits, open source, hack it, quickly done, you know, get in, walk away, make money. >> Whoa, whoa, whoa, the suits were the waterfall, hoodies was the agile. >> Christoph: That's correct. >> Alright, alright, okay. >> Christoph: Correct. So, I think that it's not just the technology that's coming together, it's mindsets that are coming together. And I think organizationally for companies, that's the bigger challenge, actually. Because one is very subscribed, change control oriented, risk management aware. The other is very progressive, innovative, fast adopters. That these two can't bring those together, I think that's the real challenge in organizations. >> John: Mhm, yeah. >> Not the technology. And on that topic, we have a lot of very intelligent questions, very good conversations, deep conversations here with the audience at this event here in Munich. >> Dave, my walkaway was interesting because I had some preconceived notions coming in. Obviously, we were prepared to talk about, and because we saw the S1 File by Cloudera, you're starting to see the level of transparency relative to the business model. One's worth one billion dollars in private value, and then Hortonworks pushing only 2700 million in a public market, which I would agree with you is undervalued, vis a vis what's going on. So obviously, you're going to see my observation coming in from here is that I think that's going to be a haircut for Cloudera. The question is how much value will be chopped down off Cloudera, versus how much value of Hortonworks will go up. So the question is, does Cloudera plummit, or does Cloudera get a little bit of a haircut or stay and Hortonworks rises? Either way, the equilibrium in the industry will be established. The other option would be >> Dave: I think the former and the numbers are ugly, let's not sugarcoat it. And so that's got to change in order for this prediction that we're making. >> John: Former being the haircut? >> Yeah, the haircut's going to happen, I think. But the numbers are really ugly. >> But I think the question is how far does it drop and how much of that is venture. >> Sure. >> Venture, arbitrage, or just how they are capitalized but Hortonworks could roll up. >> But my point is that those numbers have to change and get better in order for our prediction to come true. Okay, so, but in your second talk, sorry to interrupt you but >> No, I like a debate and I want to know where that line is. We'll be watching. >> Dave: Yeah. >> But the value in, I think you guys are pointing out but I walk away, is IOT is bigger here, and I already said that, but I think the S-curve is, you're right on. I think you're going to start to see real, fast product development around incorporating data, whether that's a Hortonworks model, which seems to be the nice unifying, partner-oriented one, that's going to start seeing specialized hardware that people are going to start building chips for using flash or other things, and optimizing hard complexities. You pointed that out on the intro yesterday. And putting real product value on the table. I think the cards are going to start hitting the table in ecosystem, and what I'm seeing is that happening now. So, I think just an overall healthy ecosystem. >> Without a doubt. >> Okay. >> Great. >> Any final comments? >> Let's have a beer. >> Great to see you in Munich. (laughter) >> We'll have a beer, we had a pig knuckle last night, Dave. We had some sauerkraut. >> Christoph: (speaks foreign word) >> Yeah, we had the (speaks foreign word). Dave, we'll grab the beer, thanks. Good to be with you again. Thanks to the crew, thanks to everyone watching. >> Thanks, John. >> The CUBE, signing off from Munich, Germany for DataWorks 2017. Thanks for watching, see ya next time. (soft techno music)

(smooth electronic music) >> Hello, everyone, welcome to theCUBE here in Palo Alto covering Mobile World Congress 2017, #MWC17. I'm John Furrier. We are here with Dan Lahl who's the Vice President of Product Marketing at SAP. SAP HANA Cloud now named SAP Cloud. Dan, thanks for coming in and talking about Mobile World Congress. >> You bet and I'm happy to talk about SAP Cloud Platform. That's what we're talking about. >> So the big news is a lot of stuff going on with Mobile World Congress but let's get down from SAP's perspective. You guys have changed the name from SAP HANA Cloud Platform to SAP Cloud Platfrom >> [Dan] Yeah that's right. >> So why that nuance there? What's the specific point there? >> It's way more than just dropping a word from the name of the product. It's really about repositioning where SAP is. So SAP has been an application company for forever. But as companies move to now from mode one, which is kind of application running, to mode two, which is doing more about agility, optimizing their enterprise, digital transformation, we have to have an offer in that second place. That's where the SAP Cloud Platform fits. Things like IoT services, and integration services, and over 40 services we offer on the platform. We're now helping companies become more agile by being very easy and able to personalize any SAP asset, any SAP app. So you have S/4HANA, you want to personalize it, customize it? You use Cloud Platform to do that. You want to integrate success factors in with your on premise apps SAP or otherwise? You use Cloud Platform to do that. >> A lot of change over the past year. At Sapphire last year, we talked about this at theCUBE. In Orlando I interviewed you specifically about the cloud momentum. One of the things that was striking me, and we talked specifically about SAP had this installed based customer set, which you guys have some of the biggest names in business from powering by SAP. Then new sets of developers onboarding and significant was the Apple announcement where you guys were partnering with Apple Computer and Apple doesn't usually go up on stage with many partners. >> That's right. >> It's very rare. They were onstage with you guys. This was really a seminal moment because this kind of brings two worlds together. It brings the existing SAP software world and the Apple world. So a lot's changed there. I know the news that's hitting around Apple's GA, general availability, of the iOS kit. But also it's the growth of the cloud within SAP and the SaaSification that you guys are going through that journey. Give us an update on those two fronts. The iOS news, that general availability, what does that mean? Two, how is the SaaSification of SAP inside the entire, across the business? >> You bet, you bet. So really exciting with the Apple SDK. When we met last year, I sat on the edge of the bed and told you how great it's going to be, okay? We really hadn't defined exactly what was going to be in the SDK. We already had the all the parts, and pieces to be able to take an iPhone device, and pull it back in to access SAP applications. But we really didn't have much native work that we had thought through with Apple on the deliver side on the mobile device. So we've added a number of controls that Apple is actually adding in to their system into the iOS 10. We're actually creating applications, taking advantage of these new controls. As enterprise applications work in a little bit more complex way than let's say playing Candy Crush on your iPhone, right? We've come up with new controls to make it more easy for someone like a project manager to do project management over their day. Or a service technician to do how they look at their appointments, how they're going to look at parts and pieces they need to put into different service appointments. It's been a really great collaboration. Then the other thing we're doing is we're adding SAP Academy or iOS Academy. The iOS Academy will be aimed at training a million SAP developers and 10 million Apple developers on how to use this SDK, how to think about delivering enterprise apps using this native iOS environment. >> What's the impact to the customer? Because Apple essentially, it's their phone, so you're talking about a mobile native app. >> [Dan] Yes, exactly. >> Taking a software cloud model to the phone. Is that kind of the key point? >> Yeah. SAP has been awesome at business processes and really funky at how it's displayed on screens. I mean I know when I started work at SAP, every screen I had to look for where the next key was. Apple is just the opposite. They're awesome at the UI but not known for the greatest business processes. So we're marrying those two things together. >> Bill McDermott has always been high on the Apple. I remember four Sapphires ago he was holding up the iPad saying-- >> That's right. >> "This is going to power our analytics business." >> Which it is. >> He was right on that. >> He's driven us to make that happen. Apple's come along which has been really great. Again, now we're delivering. >> How was the SaaSification going on because workloads as a service is a theme that comes up a lot. You see hybrid cloud certainly driving a lot of that momentum. Hybrid cloud is not as sexy as AI and autonomous vehicles. But certainly it's a lot of brute force action going on. People are really moving to the hybrid cloud. >> That's right. Hybrid cloud is going to be with us for at least 10 years. Everybody thought okay, the cloud is going to be awesome. As an LOB, I'm just going to pick my app whether that's CRM, or HCM, or whatever. I'm going to have this awesome app that I'm just going to be able to run in my business. Then they figure out oh, as a line of business, this is hard to manage. I'm going to give it back to IT. IT says, "Wow, the HCM guys are not "tied in with workforce management." There's nothing between how we're managing our people and how we're managing our workforce. Or how we're doing our pipeline with how we're managing our supply chain. The SaaSification, what we're providing with Cloud Platform is the ability to tie those things together. So native integration services to be able to tie things like success factors or, believe it or not, Salesforce into SAP delivery systems, supply chain systems, bringing ecosystems together using SAP Cloud Platform. So the personalization of the SaaS apps, integration of the SaaS apps into the enterprise, and then actually working with customers to create ecosystem hubs believe it or not. So we've got customers that have actually said, "Hey, I'm a manufacturer but I've got a lot of information "about what's going on in the manufacturing process "and how my customers are using my products. "I'm going to build a hub on the Cloud Platform "and get all my customers and partners "working together on that hub. "Now I'm actually selling information "that'll allow me to sell more of my product." So we see that happening too. >> We're with Dan Lahl, the Vice President of Product Marketing with SAP, breaking down the Mobile World Congress 17 coverage. I'm John Furrier here in theCUBE. Dan, I want you to take a minute to just lay out all the news and the key announcements that's happening this week for SAP at Mobile World Congress. In context of the backdrop of the key things that are happening in terms of the trends at the show. >> Yeah so I'll talk mostly about the Cloud Platform content. So there's some other things happening with SAP. But from a Cloud Platform perspective, it really is the shift to Cloud Platform as a strategic platform for the company in the cloud. So that's really big. Along with that, the iOS SDK, we've already talked about. We're going into beta on our IoT services. So we've now got over 40 protocols that we're supporting. We've got device management, device provisioning, dashboards for monitoring and managing those. The IoT services, which will be the foundation for our portfolio of apps that we deliver, is all going to be on Cloud Platform. We're delivering that service. They're going to announce some things in the Leonardo portfolio, which is our IoT applications. Those work together hand in glove. Some other things, some other bits and bites. We're opening data centers in Japan and China. We're hitting the Asia Pacific market pretty hard allowing customers to take their-- >> Those are SAP data centers? >> SAP data centers. >> Cloud, for SAP Cloud. >> To run SAP cloud in Japan and China with backup and recover, disaster recovery, HA, in between those data centers. Then also we're providing the capability for customers to bring their own applications onto our cloud if they want to run them closed to their cloud applications or SAP Cloud applications. So a VM style of service that we bring. But we're not going to compete against AWS in that. But if you want to bring that next to an SAP app, boom, you can do that very easily. >> I want to ask you about some of the hot trends that we're tracking on (mumbles) on thCUBE and certainly looking at the data. It's pretty obviously that IoT is the hottest, I would call tangible, trend. AI is the hottest hyped trend. >> Coming trend, yeah. >> Well I mean I think AI is legit and I'm a big fan of AI. But I think it gives people a more of a mental model than IoT. IoT's like oh, industrial, internet of things. It's kind of esoteric to the mainstream. AI is robots, flying drones, flying saucers, flying cars. So it gives people a kind of a feel for kind of what machine learning and IoT can point to. So I want you to talk about what you guys got going on there. The other thing that comes up from a customer standpoint, I want to get your thoughts and commentary on, is the number one thing that comes up besides topic on IoT is integration. Integration points is critical. So open cloud is something that you guys have promoted. IoT kind of brings that to the table. How do I bridge IoT into the cloud? How do I integrate either my on parameter clouds? These are the kind of the threads that are being discussed right now. >> You forgot big data. You forgot that one too. So hey, I worked for an AI company in the 90s after AI was dead, okay? AI was hot in the 80s. I worked for an AI company in the 90s. It was dead until today. >> It's back again. >> I'm just shocked that it's back. So the AI piece-- >> By the way, machine learning hasn't really changed much since 10, 20 years ago either. >> Exactly either as well. But we're building all of our AI and machine learning capabilities using SAP Cloud as the base. We're bringing in some open source technology from Google and others. But we're going to be building services on top of Cloud Platform that will allow you to build machine learning AI apps as well as delivering bespoke applications like matching invoices and some other things that makes sense for SAP. >> Well the IoT thing you bring up, in joking about AI, I think the reality is that AI's been around for a long time as you mentioned, as well as machine learning. But I think that the trend that comes up that makes it so peaked for real time right now is cloud horsepower is awesome, almost infinite compute power available, and the tsunami of data. So you combine the fact that, all those new data sources, with horsepower, and now with 5G dropping on main stage with Intel's announcement, you're seeing a confluence of a new fabric being kind of weaved together. That's interesting because now you have the compute, that's not a bottleneck anymore. So overhead whether it's security encryption, and/or security techniques, machine learning, goes away. AI can now do other things. So this is an interesting-- >> It's an interesting area. You kind of named it. You have to have the ability to ingest all this stuff through an IoT type of streaming capability. You got to be able to analyze it in real time, that's our in-memory capability. We talked about the AI, analyze it in real time. The one thing we haven't talked about is you have to have a big data repository to be able to troll through months and years of data. We've actually added the Altiscale company to our portfolio. So now Altiscale is part of SAP. We're renaming that Big Data Services. But it'll be basically Altiscale. So now you've got Hadoop in the cloud. So you've got an IoT, you've got your in-memory capability through HANA in the cloud. You've got your Hadoop in the cloud. All of that is one piece of cloth to us. You can apply IoT against that. You can apply AI against that. You can apply machine learning against that. And guess what? Blockchain against that as well. That's a little bit early for us. But that is-- >> It's on the horizon for sure. >> [Dan] Exactly. >> This is basically talking about where you process the data and now see the IoT edge is something that we keep our own research team. Our team's been actively pursuing. So I want to ask you to explain a little bit about this IoT service you guys announced. What is that about? I mean how would you describe that capability in SAP Cloud? >> Well it's funny. IoT is all about streaming data if you think about. I've been in streaming data since 2008 'cause we were heavy into financial services and understanding the transaction. So we were running algorithmic trading back in 2008 and we bought a couple of companies that did that. You would say, "Streaming data," to people and they would go like this, right? But now with the iPhone, and people understanding that their iPhone is a sensor device, and people now finally get that well data streaming is a big deal. >> Autonomous vehicle's a highlight set big time. >> Exactly. You kind of hit the nail on the head when you said you have to have not only an analysis inside the data center, in the cloud, but you have to push as much as can of that out to the edge. So part of what we're delivering as IoT services is a whole edge set of components that will actually do some of the analytics out at the edge in the hubs. Like what Intel provides, or Huawei, or Dell, or other companies with these gateway hubs. As well as capturing streaming data, doing store and forward of that data. So it's pushing IoT out to the edge for real time decision making, bringing it back into the data center for maybe a little bit more real time deeper analysis, and then connecting it to a big data source so you can actually troll through that over time, and say over the last six months, "Here's the supplier that's doing great. "Here's the supplier that's giving me not so great parts." All of those pieces for customers at the end of the day is really important. Making them more agile in the IoT environment. Making them more connected in the IoT environment and big data environment. Connecting the enterprise to that. So it's all helping customers from our view. >> Congratulations on the news. Well first the name change I think symbolizes a cloud centric philosophy company wide, which is great. SaaSification of SAP, which is huge for your customer base. But also the Apple news I've always been bullish on because that brings an opportunity for developers to work with you and vice versa. The monetization for developers to play in your ecosystem certainly is a great opportunity. Those are the two big news. >> Just think about that Apple piece. They can now take a process, they can build a set of controls, build a new app, and then monetize that in the App center. That will be very cool. Monetizing enterprise applications or extensions to enterprise applications. Pretty cool. >> Well that's one of the reasons why the enterprise is super hot right now. 'Cause the consumer market is (mumbles) you've seen those unicorns you see Airbnb, you see Uber, all the examples we talk about. Netflix, Amazon, enabling all that good stuff, and others. But now the enterprise is sexy one, because there's some real transformation going on from the network to the Apple Air. But there's business to be done, there's actual opportunities for people to have their work of art, the developers if you will, be monetized. >> If you put IoT, and big data, and AI behind all of that, and then make it look beautiful on the device, that's beautiful. >> IoT is a real trend. I mean that-- >> It's real. >> It's definitely happening right now and I think that's where the meat on the bone is in my mind. Okay Dan, final question for you. For the folks watching and our paying attention to Mobile World Congress in general and in the world, what is the key thing that you think they should walk away with about SAP Cloud now? With the new name, with the Apple news, all this good stuff happing at Mobile World Congress. What is the key walk away message that you'd like to send to folks to know the current state of SAP Cloud? What's the key message? >> So I would say the key message is we've talked about it but now we're delivering. SAP is all in on the cloud. We're not only delivering the SAP Cloud Platform but also S/4HANA, cloud as well. Tons of apps being built using SAP Cloud Platform. SAP is all in on the cloud, all in in mode two computing to help our customers. That's the big news. >> Dan Lahl, Vice President of Product Marketing at SAP Cloud. I'm John Furrier. You're watching a special two day coverage of Mobile World Congress 2017 here in the studios of Palo Alto covering it from Silicon Valley. We've got folks on the ground bringing you more action after this short break. (smooth electronic music) (light electronic music)

>> Voiceover: Live from Orlando, Florida, It's The Cube covering Sapphire Now, headlining sponsored by SAP HANA Cloud, the leader in platform-as-a-service with support from Console Inc., the cloud internet company. Now, here are your hosts, John Furrier and Peter Burris. >> Hey, welcome back, everyone, We are here, live, in Orlando, Florida SAP Sapphire Now. This is SiliconANGLE Media's The Cube. It's our flagship program, we go out to the events and extract the signal from the noise. I'm John Furrier with my co-host, Peter Burris, want to give a shout out to our sponsors, SAP Hana Cloud Platform, Console Inc, Capgemini, EMC, thanks so much for sponsoring us. Our next guest is Pat Bakey who's the president of SAP's Industry Cloud group. It's the core of the cloud, all SAP. Welcome to The Cube. >> Hi, it's great to be in The Cube, first time in The Cube. >> First time on The Cube, congratulations first time Cuber. Great to have you. You have, as holistically viewing across all the different lines of business, Cloud will be a very big part of the future and across all of SAP, that's the core business. Yet, now you have Hana cloud platform, you got all this other stuff going on. Now, you have cloudification of SAP in kind of a real time happening in this show, it's going to have an impact to the deployment model, the consumption model, and the economics. What's the take, what's the internal discussions? How you guys talk about it externally with costumers and how is it received? >> Right, so, you know what, I'll tell you what, this is the industry cloud organization, so, maybe I can start there. What's industry and cloud doing in the same sentence, in the same title? So, when you talk about digitization, what customers are looking for today, it's value and speed, right, speed and agility. So, the industry part of the equation is all about value. How do we communicated the value of our innovations in a message and understanding that gives the customers confidence to invest in a innovation agenda and that's kind of, historically, has always been the strength of SAP, is the language that we speak with our customers, it's well understood, we just make sure that we express that well across all industries and line of business with the digitization agenda. The cloud portion is where speed and agility comes into play. How do you move quickly, how do you move fast? If in yesterday's business the strength was your ownership of assets, the strength today, the attributes in which these companies compete on is speed, innovation, agility, and that's where cloud comes into play. >> And knowledge of the customer. How are you then bringing those two things together for your customerS? >> So, we're helping, actually, customers across all industries get closer to the customer. If there's one strategy that every customer in every industry is pursuing is get close to the customer. This is important, it may seem sort of simplistic, but it's easy to say, it's hard to do. So, we are helping customers understand what their customers and what their customer's customers are doing. It's driving a blurring of industries. You may say that I'm responsible for 26 industries, maybe oversimplifying 'cause we see this massive blurring of industries because as customers in industries are trying to get closer to their customers, they cross boundaries. >> And conversation let's them do that. >> Yeah, it's like we were talking about before, in this world of atoms, very restrictive, very kind of two-dimensional. Digital, it defies gravity, it defies boundaries, and that's why you see this blurring of boundaries in cross industry plays. >> Yeah, we're seeing that, too, you guys talk about it here, I heard it many times, breaking down the silos and the keynotes, but at the same time, you want to have that getting close to your customer mindset which means that the apps, the workloads are domain specific and there's some blurring, so the question is, how can you be vertically integrated at some level for that domain expertise and then be horizontally scalable because the data really becomes the blurring component, too, you have data moving around, so how do you guys look at that and are customers asking for this kind of architecture? >> Yeah, it's exactly, so... It's interesting, in the old world, you either had deep industry expertise in your applications, your technology, or you had sort of a broad, horizontal, and that got you a seat at the table. You had to be best in class in either of those. So, those still get you to the table, if you have those, but it may be a small table like the table that we deal with, with our customers, is an innovation table, it's a growth table, and it involves the whole board, the whole enterprise. If you get to that table, you need to have deep industry expertise and what do I mean by that? First, you speak the language, you understand their industry from a process and the capability area and then you have to express that across their businesses, so whether that business are traditional COM, the customer business around people, HR, or around procurement or even in the industries where you're taking look at supply chain or you're looking at planning, you need to be able to integrate the industry with the horizontal. When you have that conversation and that message, which we have, you're at the big table. >> The big boy table, so what are some of the conversations at the table, is it really more revenue-driving for the customer's customers? Is it cost-saving, both, is it implementation? What are some of the trending conversations that are happening at the big table? So, at the big table, at the top of the house, strategically, around this topic of digitization, the world of digitization, competition is at the business model level, that's what they're talking about which is, I know I'm in this business today, will I be in this business tomorrow and how do I compete tomorrow? It's less about the assets as we said before, what do you have, but it's the insight that you have and that's opening up a lot of new business opportunities, so at the big table, it's around business model innovation, that's what they're talking about. >> Let me see if I can connect a couple of things you said here, so it used to be that when you thought about industry, you thought about the organization of assets, your organization of assets looks like your organization of assets, how do you handle your balance sheets, but now we're talking about customers and in many respects, the new industry is defined by the things that your customers want to do that are common to your competitor's customers. >> Exactly. >> And sometimes they're the same customers. So, as SAP's ecosystem grows, as it expands, as you're able to attract, through new sources of value, to things like this wonderful Apple partnership that we want to give you guys a chance to talk about, do you see SAP's role moving from a provider of software to actually increasing the provider of a way of thinking about doing business, where SAP, in many respects, becomes an element, almost a core element, of the business model that your customers are using to make things happen. >> That is a great statement and I actually can point you in two directions and I want to get to the Apple relation because it actually expresses our strategy on taking advantage of that. So, I would say, historically, when we were just an application company, the source of innovation came from SAP, we understood business process, we understood industry, we built these remarkable applications, and our ecosystem took 'em, implemented, and customers enjoyed the success. We're in the world now of digitization and massive innovation and there's no way that we can be the single source of innovation, this is why you heard Burn, this is why you heard Robyn Bell talking about the Hana cloud platform. So, we still need to be the catalyst when it comes to defining what is remarkable about our technology and capability to solve business problems, but then we have to enable a massive ecosystem to innovate on top of that, to extend it, to innovate, and that's where the Hana cloud platform comes into play. We are setting the agenda, we are setting the expectation of what great looks like and then tapping into the ecosystems that we have. >> What's interesting about what you just said and Peter brought this up yesterday with the global CTO of Capgemini and your premise was, the old days, you knew the processes, but didn't know the technologies, and you automated those processes, now we know the technology and don't know the processes as their developing. So, you look at IOT, it's an unknown future, but you can kind of guess it's going to be a lot of data, it's going to be an edge of the network, so that reinforces this whole ecosystem point that the innovation will come in an unknown innovation way meaning that you can't say, "I'm going to automate that" 'cause it's not known yet, it's evolving. That to me seems to tie what you just said. Can you expand your thoughts on that because this is what everyone's chasing that's the startup mentality, that's the agile, that's the jump on a grenade, win the beachhead, grow a business, that's going to be the startups and the white space for you guys. >> Look, I'm a lousy dart player, all right, but I could win if I'm throwing a thousand darts at a target and the other guy's throwing three, that's the environment we're in with Hana cloud platform, we got massive darts to throw at the target because it changes so fast you need to have a couple things, you need to have that great ecosystem, you need to be able to innovate, and you need to be able to address volatility. Let me give you a practical example of that. If you take a look at digitization and one of the key dimensions which is how work will be done in this new digital world, we have some pretty good ideas how it's going to be done such as it's not going to be done inside of the enterprise, whether that work is a manufacturing environment or that work is knowledge management in a typical office, it's going to be increasingly mobile and these mobile workers will be connected. And the challenge there is one, how do you understand what the processes will be? We have an idea, but they're going to evolve and second, how do you enable them with real time information 'cause the mobile experience isn't just taking the desktop and putting a different form factor on it, so we take a look at the Apple and SAP announcement, what does this mean? When you hear Tim and you hear Bill discuss it, it's a step change in how these two great companies believe work will be done in the digital world. The way that we execute on that is, again, back to what I said before, we will bring the best of a consumer, user experience, with the best of a business insight experience and bring those together and if you take a look then at what is the standard of a mobile platform, it's iOS which, by the way, is severely underutilized. It's chat, it's phone, it's email. If you take a look at your iPhone and how we're using it as consumers, that's massively underutilized in an enterprise setting, same thing with business information, when you leave the office, you're leaving all that behind, SAP will bring all that, the business process, the business insight, you bring it together and you have these new native applications. >> Interesting, too, on the Apple, by the way, congratulations it's a real phenomenal announcement, super happy to see that. The other nuance there, too, is that swift programming languages is very popular among developers right now and there's also another trend in the developer community what they're calling the non-coding developer, the tools are getting so damn good now that you don't have to go to be a computer science major to write code and there's other, Python, other languages that are good on-ramps, so you have an ecosystem that has the glam of Apple and the sexiness of swift. There's all this monetization opportunities. There's a developer saying, "Hey, I have an ecosystem "I can work with, that I can ride on the back of, "to the marketplace," so it's a great avenue for someone or now business to pick a white space and dominate it, whether it's a tool or a feature, they can come in and be a feature and still be a business, you'll be saying, so could I, was, "Oh, that's a feature not a company." That was the old way, now that's the innovation coming from these entrepreneurs, that, to me, is interesting. Are you guys seeing that kind of excitement from developers and do you see the developers as the core of the ecosystem? Well, what's your thoughts on that, overall? >> We're seeing the developer community becoming a more critical part because it's not just about implementing, remember when I said we're the source of innovation and other people implement it, that the skill set of the ecosystem, now when it's innovation, the source of the innovation needs to come from the ecosystem, and that's the developing community. So, if you take a look again at this Apple announcement, the reference applications and what we're building right now because that's what we and Apple think would look great in specific industries, but then it's this SDK and the Hana cloud platform. If you take 2.5 million SAP developers and you take 12 million iOS developers, you bring 'em together, not only just to work together, but to redefine what this new developing environment is, swift, right, the best of how you design enterprise applications or commercial applications and then the third leg of this is the iOS university because these are new classes of developers and my final point is as much as we think we know how work will be done in this mobile work environment, it's going to change, it's going to change. >> IOT's important, but people are going to work together with people over distance over agendas over boundaries, that's going to change the world. Let me ask you a question. We'd asked a couple of times to some of your folks on The Cube, Is it going to possible at some point in time, I'm going to get an Apple developer who decides to enter into an enterprise space by creating a solution, have an Apple phone customer go up, pull something off the app store because it is SAP complaint, is that going to happen? >> I can envision that happening, I can envision it. It's we are the standard for a trusted enterprise partner. >> Well, think about it, so now you got a situation where you your CIO and your IT organization who wants stable, comply in SAP, and then all the folks out in the field that are doing the work, that are identifying new problems and finding software that they can apply to solve the problem and having SAP and Apple bring both of those sides together, so that the CIO can be certain that what was just grabbed works and is compliant, but also, at the same time, that person knows that this innovative thing is not going to create problems in the backend. Very, very powerful vision, loved to see that notion. >> Yeah, and I think that's what you get when you combine those two brands and those two experiences. As quickly we're innovating and moving forward, you still need to have predictability in the business and a strong core, right? It's the business continuity, so you need to be able to innovate very quickly, rapid innovation, quick failure, fast learning, that's at the edge. So, if we can enable that, but give the predictability and the stability in the business relationships, security, you bring that together, this is the new world that we're creating, calls for new developers, calls for new ecosystems, and new leadership, and that's what we and Apple bring to the equation. >> So, Pat, share the roadmap on the Apple thing, just to kind of just to take the final close, square this out in little bits. Ecosystem, I get the ecosystem, I would evision that's a great outcome. >> Yeah, absolutely. >> Certified SAP apps in the Apple, I'm sure that's the plan. On the SAP side, you're going for the low hanging fruit, you mentioned that you're doing a couple of things, what's the roadmap for the sequence and the progression of SAP-Apple relationship? What are you guys bringing to the table from the core software? >> Yeah, so we've identified specific industries where the dynamics play to the favor of the dynamic at work, so they're mobile, they're standardizing already on iOS and they're connected and they need the rich enterprise information and we've identified high-values cases and those where we'll build the applications, but what we want to do-- >> John: That's a low hanging fruit for you guys. >> That's a low hanging fruit. And create that kind of references of what a great mobile experience looks like and then we're going to enable through the SDK, the ecosystem, so that's where the massive innovation is going to come from and then we'll try to figure out where this takes us. This is a series of six month sprints that we're on. >> Business sprints Love that concept. >> You know, this phrase, a couple of years ago, the speed of business, I forget which SAP soft, I remember in 2013, McDermott's phrase was "Running at the speed of business" with the mobile. Final question for you is, on the Industry Cloud, what's your plans, what's your goals, how do you see it evolving, can you share some anecdotal, you don't have to reveal any sensitive information, but the visions for how you see the Industry Cloud group that you're running, evolving over the next 12, 48 months? >> So, I see us, right now, that there's some things your core values and your core competencies shouldn't change, they should sort of leverage the environment that you're in and so, we're caring for our industry in sight, our focus on an end-to-end capability, high-values cases, and integration where it needs to be and that's what we express. So, we're going to take that and we're going to apply it to helping customers digitize on that journey. Here at Sapphire, the focus has been not on what we're announcing because ask any customer here, we have the requisite capabilities, what they want to get is busy on their journey and they want us to help them reduce uncertainty, reduce risk, and realize value. So, all the conversations here on what are we doing, industry, clear road maps, where we going? What capabilities? Second, road map on value, what value? S4, fastest launch in our history, customers, right now, are saying, "How do we double that, how do we triple that? Is by showing the business value associated with it. So that's what we're doing with industry, is showing a clear path of what great looks like, a road map on how to get there, the business values associated with it, and how working our digital business services customers, how we can help them realize that. >> And the road map is key because that clarifies the ecosystem. They understand kind of the rules of engagement. They can see the line. >> Yeah, what their overall is used. You know, it's interesting, Pat, you look around, there's 60,000 people, the amount of activity, the amount of deal making, that's going on here, it's probably the 25th largest economy in the world right here. >> Oh, it is, in Orlando, that's amazing. Yeah, I need to take a knee guys, I was just hearing about that. >> Final question and I'll let you go 'cause we got to go, we know you're tight on time, what's the coolest thing you've seen at Sapphire this week? >> Coolest thing, boy, I've been in so many meetings, I haven't seen cool. >> Peter: Other than this one. >> Oh, yeah, this is definitely a cool meeting. Oh, geez, coolest thing? >> Coolest phrase, sound bite, feedback, hallway conversation. >> What are you going to tell, in your next management meeting, what's the one thing you're going to tell 'em about Sapphire? >> I'd say that there is so much demand for us to help customers. We're not pushing, we're getting pulled. So, it's about prioritization like how do we focus on what's most important for our customers? That's such a lame answer. >> Peter: Well, but the prioritization of-- >> When you're looking for cool, but it's true. >> There's drones somewhere, I saw a beer tap that got IOT on it for-- >> I did see the guy in kind of the transformer outfit, that was pretty cool, but I'll tell you what, as we become more and more of consumer business oriented, my kids start developing a better understanding of what I actually do when I leave home. It's cool, I mean, SAP is cool. Actually, I'll tell you the one thing. The one thing I heard here from customers that either went to original Sapphires and are back after a while or coming for the first time, they can't believe how fast we're moving. They really can believe how fast we're moving. It's that speed, it's not just the pace of this conversation or the pace of the traffic around here, it's the pace of how quickly business is moving and that we're leading it. >> Pat Bakey, president of Industry Cloud, SAP, this is The Cube, I'm John Furrier with Peter Burris. Be right back, this is The Cube, SiliconANGLE's flagship program. This is The Cube, you're watching The Cube, we'll be right back. (fun, upbeat melody) >> Voiceover: There'll be millions of people in the near future that aren't allowed to be involved in their own personal well-being and wellness. Nobody wants to.