>>Okay, welcome back everyone. To the cubes coverage of ADB has re-invent 2021. I'm John fare with Dave Nicholson. My cohost we're here exploring all the future innovations. We've got a great guest we'll lead negam who's the EVP executive vice president chief research innovation officer cap, Gemini engineering will lead. Thanks for coming on the cube. Thank you. So I love the title, chief research, innovation engineering officer. >>I didn't make it up. They did. >>You got to love the cloud evolution right now because just more and more infrastructure as codes happening. You got this whole data abstraction layer developing where people are starting to see. Okay. I can have horizontally scalable governed data in a data lake. That's smart, someone intelligent and use machine learning. It seems to be the big trend here from AWS. More serverless, more goodness. So engineering kind of on the front lines here kind of making it happen. >>Yeah. So, uh, the question that our clients are asking us is how do these data center technologies moving over into cars, planes, trains, construction, equipment, industrial, right? And you know, maybe two decades ago it was called IOT. Uh, but we're not talking about just sensors, vertical lift aircraft, uh, software-defined cars, um, manufacturing facilities as a whole, you know, how are these data center technologies going to impact these companies? And it's not a architectural shift for say the Evie, the electric vehicle, many OEM, it's a financial transformation, right? Because if they can make their vehicle containerized, uh, if they can monitor the cars, behaviors, they can offer new types of experiences for their clients. So the questions we were asking ourselves is how do you get the cloud into the car? >>Yeah. And software driving, all that. So you've got software defined everything. Now you've got data-driven pun intended with the cars cloud everywhere. How does that look? What are the concerns, obviously, latency moving data around. They got outposts. Am I moving the cloud to the edge? How are you guys thinking? How are customers thinking through the architectural, I guess foundational playbook? Is there one? Yeah. >>I, you know, coming into this, I did ask my, my son, the question is hardware or software more important. And then he, you know, he's not, and he said, you know, we're coding our way out of hardware. It was very interesting insight software rules. That that is for sure. But when we're talking about physical products and these talking about trillions of dollars of investments going into green energy, uh, into autonomous driving into green aviation. So we're not, it's not just the matter of verse here. We're dealing real physical products. I think though the point for us as engineers or as an engineering businesses, how do you co-design hardware and software together? What are the questions you to ask about that machine learning model being moved over from AWS? For example, into the car, is the Silicon going to be able to support the inferencing rates that are required right. In real time and whatnot. So some of the things like that, >>Well, that's been a, it's been an age old battle between the idea that, uh, the flour that's nurtured in a walled garden is always going to be more beautiful than the one that grows out in the meadow. In other words, announcement, uh, at, in Adam's keynote, talking about advances in AWS Silicon. So what's your view on how important that is? You just sort of alluded to it as being important, the co-development of hardware and software together. >>Yeah. We're seeing product makers again, think, you know, anybody from a life sciences company building a digital therapeutics product, maybe a blood glucose monitor or, um, an automotive or even an aerospace, uh, going direct to Silicon asking questions around the performance of the Silicon and designing their experience around that. Right. So, uh, if they need a low latency, low power efficiency, green networks, they're taking those questions in-house or asking those questions in house. So, you know, AWS having a, sort of a portfolio of custom or bespoke Silicon now as part of the architectural discussion. Right? And so I look around here, I see a lot of developers who are going to have to get a little bit more versed in some of these questions around, you know, should I use an arm based chip? You know, do I use this Silicon partner? You know, what happens when I move it into the vehicle? And then I have over the air updates, how do I protect that code in an enclave in the car just to continue to use the so there's are a lot of architectural questions that I don't think software engineers typically ask when they're just dealing in the cloud. Uh, although at the end of the day over time, a lot of these will be abstracted from the developer to some degree, you know, that is just the nature of the game. >>It reminds me of the operating system theory of system software meeting hardware. And because you have software developers just want to code now, you're saying, well, now I'm responsible hardware. Well, not if it's programmer, was there a hard top two it's over, these are big questions and important ones I think is we're in a major inflection point, but it comes back down to, you mentioned aerospace space is the same problem. You can't send that break, fix engineer in space. Right. You've got software now. So you've got trust that security supply chain who's right. And who's doing the hardware now you've got the software supply chain. So a lot of interesting kind of, yeah. >>So you, you, you know, you check them off, back in into it, the supply chain problems with Silicon, and there are now alternatives to try and get around the bottlenecks using high-performance computers versus hundreds of ECS and a vehicle allows you kind of get away from the supply chain shortage. Uh there's you know, folks moving from one architecture to another, to avoid kind of getting locked in and then of course creating your own Silicon, or at least having more ownership over the Silicon. I think suffer defined systems, uh, are the way to go regardless of the industry. Uh, so you're going to make some decisions on performance, characteristics of the hardware, but ultimately you want a software defined system, so you can update it regularly. >>I was talking with doc some of the top hair executives. I talked to, um, the marketplace guys here, Deepak, uh, over at the, here at Amazon and containers comes up. You start to see a trend in containers where you see certified containers because containers are everywhere. You can put malware and containers. So, you know, think about like just hacking software. It's a surface area now. So you bring the software security model in there. So to see this kind of like certified containers, I can imagine certified infrastructure now because I mean, what's a processor, it's just a hardened top to a PC. Now you've got the cloud. If I have hardware, how do I know it's workable? How do I trust it? You know, how could it not be hacked? I don't want my car to be hacked and driven off the road. >>So, so, um, when you're dealing with a payment system or you're dealing with tick-tock different than when you're dealing with a car with life consequences. So we are very active in the software defined transformation of automotive. And it's easy to say, I'm just going to load it up with all this data center technology, but there's safety criticality issues that you have to take into considerations, but containers are well suited for that. Just requires some thought. I mean, my excitement, enthusiasm about this product engineering is if you just take any of these products and, and apply them into a product engineering context, there's so much invention and creativity can happen. Uh, but on the safety side, we're working through security enclaves using containers and hardware based roots of trust. So there's ways around, you know, malware and bad actors at the edge. Um, >>What's your, what's your take on explainable AI? Why got you might as well ask because this comes up a lot, explainable AI is hot in college right now, AI, that can be explained. It's kind of got some policy, uh, to it. What's your thoughts on this AI trend? Cause obviously it's everywhere. Um, I mean, what is explainable AI? Is that even real or how do you explain AI? Is that democratized? >>Yeah. Computer vision is a great example. I think to bring it to life I'm all of the audience probably knows this, but you could, you know, you can tell your kid that this is a cat once and they'll know every single cat out there is a cat, but if you, you, you need a thousands of images, uh, for a computer vision model to learn that this is a cat. And even, you know, you can probably give it an example, um, out of say a remote region of the world and it going to get confused. So to me, explainability is about adding some sort of certainty to the decision-making process. Um, and when there's a, some confusion, be able to understand why that happened. I think in, in automotive or any, even in quality assurance, being able to know that this product was definitively defective or this pedestrian definitively did cross the crosswalk or not. You know, it's very important because it could, you know, there are, there are consequences. So just being able to understand why the algorithm or the model said what it said, why did it make that judgment is super important, super important. >>So I've got to ask you now that we're here, re-invent from your engineering perspectives, you look at the landscape of AWS, the announcements. What, what, how do you think about it to other engineers out there trying to, uh, grok all the technology who really want to put innovation in place, whether it's creating new markets, new categories or innovating their existing business, how do you grab the class out and make it work for you? I mean, from an engineering standpoint, how do you look at AWS and say, how do I make this work better for me? >>Uh, so I mean, over the years, I, um, I think it's true. AWS has started to really look like a utility, you know, the days where it was called utility as a service. And, um, you know, I, I, I did attend a workshop on, I think it was called LightSail or something like that, but they are simplifying the way that you can consume this infrastructure to a degree that is somewhat phenomenal. Uh, and they're building any, yeah, they continue to expand the ecosystem. Um, so I mean, for me, it's, it's a utility. Uh, it's it's, it's, it's, it's, it's consumable. Uh, if you got an idea pick and roll your own. >>Okay. So back back to the, uh, the concept of AI and explainability, uh, one of my cars won't allow me to unlock certain functions because of the way that I drive. No one needs to explain to me why, because I know what I'm doing wrong, but I'm still frustrated by it. So that that's sort of leads to kind of the larger philosophical question to you about what you're seeing, where are we in this kind of leapfrog, constant pace of the technology exists, but people aren't culturally ready to accept it because it feels like right now to me that there isn't anything we can't do with cloud technology from a technical perspective, it can all be done. Swami's keynote today, talking about integrating all sorts of sources of data and actually leveraging them in the cloud. Um, technically possible yet 85% of it spend is still on prem. So, so what's your thought there? What are the, what are the inhibitors, what are the real inhibitors from a technology perspective versus the cultural ones? Uh, setting aside my lack of, uh, adherence to, uh, to driving lawful >>I industry by industry. I think in, um, you know, if you're trying to do a diagnostic on an MRI in an automated way, and there's going to be false positives, false negatives, and yes, we know that yeah, we know that there's going to be a physician participating in the final judgment call. Um, I think just getting a really good comfort level on the trustworthiness of these decision points, um, is really important. And so I don't blame folks for being reticent about, you know, trusting or, or asking some questions about, does this really work and are these autonomous systems as they become more and more precise, are they doing the right thing? Uh, I think there's research that has to be done on agency. You know, am I in patrol? What happened? Did I lose control? I think there's questions around handoffs, you know, and participation in decision-making. So I think just overall, just the broad area of trust and, uh, the relationship between the participants, the humans and the machines still. I think there's some work to do, to be honest with you. I think there's some work to do maybe in a manufacturing facility where everything's automated, you know, maybe it's a solved problem, but in an open road, when the vehicles driving, you know, in the middle afternoon, you know, you probably should ask some more questions. >>Well, I want to ask you what we got a couple of minutes left, real time data near real time, real time, always a big, hot topic. Seeing one more databases out there in the keynote today from Swami real-time are we there yet? How are we dealing with real-time data, software consuming the data? It comes to cars and things that are moving real time versus near real time. It could be life or death. I mean, this is big time. Where are we? >>So, um, I was trying to conduct a web conference. I won't tell the vendor because it has nothing to do with the vendor. Um, and I couldn't get a connection. I couldn't get a connection at reinvent. I just couldn't get it. I'm sorry guys. I can't get it. So I, you know, so we talk about real time talking about real-time operating systems and real time data collection at the edge. Yeah. We're there, we can collect the data and we can deploy a model in, you know, in the aircraft on the train to do predictive analytics. If we got to stream that data back home to the cloud, you know, we better figure out how to make sure we have a reliable and stable connection. 5g is a, you know, is, is, will be deployed, right? And it has ultra low latency, uh, and can achieve those types of, uh, requirements. But, uh, you know, it has to be in the right setting, right? That's to be the right setting and a facility, uh, very well controlled where you understand the density of the cell sites, small cells sound cells, and you really can deploy a, uh, a mobile robot, uh, wirelessly. Yes know, we can do that, but you know, kind of in, in, in other scenarios, we have a lot of ask that question about >>With the connections and making that false, huh? Well, he, thanks for coming on. Great insight, great conversation. Very deep, awesome work. Thanks for coming on and sharing your insights from cap Gemini. We're here in the cube, the worldwide leader in tech coverage live on the floor here at re-invent I'm John fare with Dave Nicholson. We write back.

>>From Las Vegas. It's the cube covering Qualis security conference 2019 you buy quality. >>Hey, welcome back. You're ready. Jeff Frick here with the cube. We're in Las Vegas at the Bellagio, at the quality security conference. It's the 19th year they've been doing this. It's our first year here and we're excited to be here and it's great to have a veteran who's been in this space for so long, to give a little bit more of a historical perspective as to what happened in the past and where we are now and what can we look forward to in the future. So coming right off his keynote is Felipe korto, the chairman and CEO of Qualys. Phillip, great to see you. Thank you. Same, same, same for me. Absolutely. So you touched on so many great, um, topics in your conversation about kind of the shifts of, of, of modern computing from the mainframe to the mini. We've heard it over and over and over, but the key message was really about architecture. If you don't have the right architecture, you can't have the right solution. So how has the evolution of architects of architectures impacted your ability to deliver security solutions for your clients? >>So now that's a very good question. And in fact, you know, what happened is that we started in 1999 with a vision that we could use exactly like a salesforce.com this nascent internet technologies and apply that to security. And uh, so, and mod when you have applied that to essentially changing the way CRM was essentially used and deployed in enterprises and with a fantastic success as we know. So for us, the, I can say today that 19 years later the vision was right. It took a significant longer because the security people are not really, uh, warm at the idea of silently, uh, having the data in their view, which was in place that they could not control. And the it people, they didn't really like at all the fact that suddenly they were not in control anymore of the infrastructure. So we had a lot of resistance. >>I, wherever we always, I always believe, absolutely believe that the, the cloud will be the cloud architecture to go back. A lot of people make the confusion. That was part of the confusion that for people it was a cloud, that kind of magical things someplace would you don't know where. And when I were trying to explain, and I've been saying that so many times that well you need to look at the cloud like compute that can architecture which distribute the competing power far more efficiently than the previous one, which was client server, which was distributing the convening power far better than of course the mainframes and the mini computers. And so if you look at their architectures, so the mainframe were essentially big data centers in uh, in Fort Knox, like settings, uh, private lines of communication to a dump terminal. And of course security was not really issue then because it's security was built in by the IBM's and company. >>Same thing with the mini computer, which then was instead of just providing the computing power to the large, very large company, you could afford it. Nelson and the minicomputer through the advanced in semiconductor technology could reduce a foot Frank. And then they'll bring that computing power to the labs and to the departments. And was then the new era of the digital equipment, the prime, the data general, et cetera. Uh, and then kind of server came in. So what client server did, again, if you look at the architecture, different architecture now silently servers, the land or the internal network and the PC, and that was now allowing to distribute the computing power to the people in the company. And so, but then you needed to, so everybody, nobody paid attention to security because then you were inside of the enterprise. So it started inside the walls of the castle if you prefer. >>So nobody paid attention to that. It was more complex because now you have multiple actors. Instead of having one IBM or one digital equipment, et cetera, suddenly you have the people in manufacturing and the servers, the software, the database, the PCs, and on announcer, suddenly there was the complexity, increasing efficiency, but nobody paid attention to security because it wasn't a needed until suddenly we realized that viruses could come in through the front door being installed innocently. You were absolutely, absolutely compromised. And of course that's the era of the antivirus which came in. And then because of the need to communicate more and more now, Senator, you could not stay only in your castle. You needed to go and communicate to your customers, to your suppliers, et cetera, et cetera. And now he was starting to open up your, your castle to the world and hello so now so that the, the bad guy could come in and start to steal your information. >>And that was the new era of the forward. Now you make sure that those who come in, but of course that was a little bit naive because there were so many other doors and windows, uh, that people could come in, you know, create tunnels and create these and all of that trying to ensure your customers because the data was becoming more and more rich and more, more important or more value. So whenever there is a value, of course the bad guys are coming in to try to sell it. And that was that new era of a willing to pay attention to security. The problem has been is because you have so many different actors, there was nothing really central there that was just selling more and more solutions and no, absolutely like 800 vendors bolting on security, right? And boating on anything is short-lived at the end of the day because you put more and more weight and then you also increase the complexity and all these different solutions you need. >>They need to talk together so you have a better context. Uh, but they want the design to talk together. So now you need to put other system where they could communicate that information. So you complicated and complicated and complicated the solution. And that's the problem of today. So now cloud computing comes in and again, if you look at the architecture of cloud computing, it's again data centers, which is not today I've become thanks to the technology having infinite, almost competing power and storage capabilities. And like the previous that I sent her, the are much more fractured because you just one scale and they become essentially a little bit easier to secure. And by the way, it's your fewer vendors now doing that. And then of course the access can be controlled better. Uh, and then of course the second component is not the land and the one, it's now the internet. >>And the internet of course is the web communications extremely cheap and it brings you an every place on the planet and soon in Morris, why not? So and so. Now the issue today is that still the internet needs to be secure. And today, how are we going to secure the internet? Which is very important thing today because you see today that you can spoof your email, you can spoof your website, uh, you can attack the DNS who, yes, there's a lot of things that the bad guys still do. And in fact, they've said that leverage the internet of course, to access everywhere so they take advantage of it. So now this is obviously, you know, I created the, the trustworthy movement many years ago to try to really address that. Unfortunately, the quality's was too small and it was not really our place today. There's all the Google, the Facebook, the big guys, which in fact their business depend on the internet. >>Now need to do that. And I upload or be diabetic, criticized very much so. Google was the first one to essentially have a big initiative, was trying to push SSL, which everybody understand is secret encryption if you prefer. And to everybody. So they did a fantastic job. They really push it. So now today's society is becoming like, okay, as I said, you want to have, as I said it all in your communication, but that's not enough. And now they are pushing and some people criticize them and I absolutely applaud them to say we need to change the internet protocols which were created at a time when security, you were transferring information from universities and so forth. This was the hay days, you know, of everything was fine. There was no bad guys, you know, the, he'd be days, if you like, of the internet. Everybody was free, everybody was up and fantastic. >>Okay. And now of course, today this protocol needs to be upgraded, which is a lot of work. But today I really believe that if you put Google, Amazon, Facebook altogether, and they can fix these internet protocols. So we could forget about the spoofing and who forgot about all these phishing and all these things. But this is their responsibility. So, and then you have now on the other side, you have now very intelligent devices from in a very simple sensors and you know, to sophisticated devices, the phone, that cetera and not more and more and more devices interconnected and for people to understand what is going. So this is the new environment and whether we always believe is that if you adopt an architecture, which is exactly which fits, which is similar, then we could instead of bolting security in, we can now say that the build security in a voting security on, we could build security in. >>And we have been very proud of the work that we've done with Microsoft, which we announced in fact relatively recently, very recently, that in fact our agent technologies now is bundled in Microsoft. So we have built security with Microsoft in. So from a security perspective today, if you go to the Microsoft as your secretly center, you click on the link and now you have the view of your entire Azure environment. Crazier for quality Sagent. You click on a second link and now you have the view of your significant loss posture, crazy of that same quality. Say Sagent and then you click on the third name with us. Nothing to do with quality. It's all Microsoft. You create your playbook and you remediate. So security in this environment has become click, click, click, nothing to install, nothing to update. And the only thing you bring are your policies saying, I don't want to have this kind of measured machine expose on the internet. >>I want, this is what I want. And you can continuously audit in essentially in real time, right? So as you can see, totally different than putting boxes and boxes and so many things and then having to for you. So very big game changer. So the analogy that I want you that I give to people, it's so people don't understand that paradigm shift is already happening in the way we secure our homes. You put sensors everywhere, you have cameras, you have detection for proximity detection. Essentially when somebody tried to enter your home, all that data is continuously pumped up into an incidence restaurant system. And then from your phone, again across the internet, you can change the temperature of your rooms. You can do what you can see the person who knocks on the door. You can see its face, you can open the door, close the door, the garage door, you can do all of that remotely, another medically. >>And then if there's a burglar then in your house to try to raking immediately the incidents or some system called the cops or the far Marsha difficult fire. And that's the new paradigm. So security has to follow that paradigm. And then you have interesting of the problem today that we see with all the current secretly uh, systems, uh, incidents, response system. They have a lot of false positive, false positive and false negative are the enemy really of security. Because if you are forced visited, you cannot automate the response because then you are going to try to respond to something that is not true. So you are, you could create a lot of damage. And the example I give you that today in the, if you leave your dog in your house and if you don't have the ability, the dog will bark, would move. And then the sensors would say intruder alert. >>So that's becomes a false positive. So how do you eliminate that? By having more context, you can eliminate automatically again, this false positives. Like now you take a fingerprint of your dog and of these voice and now the camera and this and the sensors and the voice can pick up and say, Oh, this is my dog. So then of course you eliminate that for solar, right? Right. Now even if another dog managed to enter your home through a window which was open or whatever for soul, you will know her window was up and but you know you cannot necessarily fix it and the dog opens. Then you will know it's a, it's a, it's not sure about, right? So that's what security is evolving such a huge sea of change, which is happening because of all that internet and today companies today, after leveraging new cloud technology, which are coming, there's so much new technology. >>What people understand is where's that technology coming from? How come silently we have, you know, Dockers netics all these solutions today, which are available at almost no cost because it's all open source. So what happened is that, which is unlike the enterprise software, which were more the Oracle et cetera, the manufacturer of that software today is in fact the cloud public cloud vendors, the Amazon, the Google, the Facebook, the Microsoft. We suddenly needed to have to develop new technology so they could scale at the size of the planet. And then very shrewdly realized that effective that technology for me, I'm essentially going to imprison that technology is not going to evolve. And then I need other technologies that are not developing. So they realized that they totally changed that open source movement, which in the early days of opensource was more controlled by people who had more purity. >>If you prefer no commercial interests, it was all for the good of the civilization and humankind. And they say their licensing model was very complex. So they simplified all of that. And then nothing until you had all this technology coming at you extremely fast. And we have leverage that technology, which was not existing in the early days when when socials.com started with the Linux lamp pour called what's called Linux Apache. My SQL and PHP, a little bit limiting, but now suddenly all this technology, that classic search was coming, we today in our backend, 3 trillion data points on elastic search clusters and we return inflammation in a hundred milliseconds. And then onto the calf cabin, which is again something at open source. We, we, we, and now today 5 million messages a day and on and on and on. So the world is changing and of course, if that's what it's called now, the digital transformation. >>So now enterprises to be essentially agile, to reach out to the customers better and more, they need to embrace the cloud as the way they do, retool their entire it infrastructure. And essentially it's a huge sea of change. And that's what we see even the market of security just to finish, uh, now evolving in a totally different ways than the way it has been, which in the past, the market of security was essentially the market for the enterprise. And I'm bringing you my, my board, my board town solutions that you have to go and install and make work, right? And then you had the, the antivirus essentially, uh, for all the consumers and so forth. So today when we see the marketplace, which is fragmenting in four different segments, which is one is the large enterprise which are going to essentially consolidate those stock, move into the digital transformation, leveraging absolutely dev ops, which isn't becoming the new buyer and of course a soak or they could improve, uh, their it for, to reach out to more customers and more effectively than the cloud providers as I mentioned earlier, which are building security in the, no few use them. >>You don't have to worry about infrastructure, about our mini servers. You need, I mean it is, it's all done for you. And same thing about security, right? The third market is going to be an emergence of a new generation of managed security service providers, which are going to take to all these companies. We don't have enough resources. Okay, don't worry, I'm going to help you, you know, do all that digital transformation. And that if you build a security and then there's a totally new market of all these devices, including the phone, et cetera, which connects and that you essentially want to all these like OT and IOT devices that are all now connected, which of course presents security risk. So you need to also secure them, but you also need to be able to also not only check their edits to make sure that, okay, because you cannot send people anymore. >>So you need to automate the same thing on security. If you find that that phone is compromised, you need to make, to be able to make immediate decisions about should I kill that phone, right? Destroyed everything in it. Should I know don't let that phone connect anymore to my networks. What should I do? Should I, by the way detected that they've downloaded the application, which are not allowed? Because what we see is more and more companies now are giving tablets, do the users. And in doing so now today's the company property. So they could say, okay, you use these tablets and uh, you're not allowed to do this app. So you could check all of that and then automatically remote. But that again requires a full visibility on what you are. And that's why just to finish, we make a big decision about a few, three months ago that we have, we build the ability for any company on the planet to automatically build their entire global HSE inventory, which nobody knows what they have in that old networking environment. >>You don't know what connects to have the view of the known and the unknown, totally free of charge, uh, across on premise and pawn cloud containers, uh, uh, uh, whether vacations, uh, OT and IOT devices to come. So now there's the cornerstone of security. So with that totally free. So, and then of course we have all these additional solutions and we're build a very scalable, uh, up in platform where we can take data in, pass out data as well. So we really need to be and want to be good citizen here because security at the end of the day, it's almost like we used to say like the doctors, you have to have that kind of apricot oath that you cannot do no arm. So if you keep, if you try to take the data that you have, keep it with you, that's absolutely not right because it's the data of your customers, right? >>So, and you have to make sure that it's there. So you have to be a good warning of the data, but you have to make sure that the customer can absolutely take that data to whatever he wants with it, whatever he needs to do. So that's the kind of totally new field as a fee. And finally today there is a new Ash culture change, which is, which is happening now in the companies, is that security has become fronted centers, is becoming now because of GDPR, which has a huge of financial could over you challenge an impact on a company. A data breach can have a huge financial impact. Security has become a board level. More and more social security is changing and now it's almost like companies, if they want to be successful in the future, they need to embrace a culture of security. And now what I used to say, and that was the, the conclusion of my talk is that now, today it DevOps, uh, security compliance, people need to unite. Not anymore. The silos. I do that. This is my, my turf, my servers. You do that, you do this. Everybody in the company can work. I have to work together towards that goal. And the vendors need to also start to inter operate as well and working with our customers. So it's a tall, new mindset, which is happening, but the safes are big. That's what I'm very confident that we're now into that. Finally, we thought, I thought it would have happened 10 years ago, quite frankly. And uh, but now today's already happening. >>She touched on a lot, a lot there. And I'll speak for another two hours if we could. We could go for Tara, but I want to, I want to unpack a couple of things. We've had James Hamilton on you to at AWS. Um, CTO, super smart guy and it was, it was at one of his talks where it really was kind of a splash, a wet water in the face when he talked about the amount of resources Amazon could deploy to just networking or the amount of PhD power he could put on, you know, any little tiny sub segment of their infrastructure platform where you just realize that you just can't, you can't compete, you cannot put those kinds of resources as an individual company in any bucket. So the inevitability of the cloud model is just, it's, it's the only way to leverage those resources. But because of that, how has, how has that helped you guys change your market? How nice is it for you to be able to leverage infrastructure partners? Like is your bill for go to market as well as feature sets? And also, you know, because the other piece they didn't talk about is the integration of all these things. Now they all work together. Most apps are collection of API APIs. That's also changed. So when you look at the cloud provider GCP as well, how does that help you deliver value to your customers? >>Yeah, but the, the, the, the club, they, they don't do everything. You know, today what is interesting is that the clubs would start to specialize themselves more and more. So for example, if you look at Amazon, the, the core value of Amazon since the beginning has been elastic computing. Uh, now today we should look at Microsoft. They leverage their position and they really have come up with a more enterprise friendly solution. And now Google is trying to find also their way today. And so then you have Addy Baba, et cetera. So these are the public cloud, but life is not uniform like is by nature. Divers life wants to leave lunch to find better ways. We see that that's what we have so many different species and it just ended up. So I've also the other phenomena of companies also building their own cloud as well. >>So the word is entering into a more hybrid cloud. And the technology is evolving very fast as well. And again, I was selling you all these open source software. There's a bigger phenomenon at play, which I used to say that people don't really understand that much wood, but it's so obvious is if you look at the printing price, that's another example that gives the printing price essentially allowed, as we all know, to distribute the gospel, which has some advantage of, you know, creating more morality, et cetera. But then what people don't know for the most part, it distributed the treaties of the Arabs on technology, the scientif treaties, because the archives, which were very thriving civilization at the time, I'd collected all the, all the, all the information from India, from many other places and from China and from etc. And essentially at the time all of Europe was pretty in the age they really came up and it now certainty that scientific knowledge was distributed and that was in fact the seeds of the industrial revolution, which then you're up cat coats and use that and creating all these different technologies. >>So that confidence of this dimension of electricity and all of that created the industrial revolution seeded by now, today what is happening is that the internet is the new printing press, which now is distributing the knowledge that not to a few millions of people to billions of people. So the rate today of advancing technology is accelerating and it's very difficult. I was mentioning today, we know today that work and working against some quantum computing which are going to totally change things. Of course we don't know exactly how and you have also it's clear that today we could use genetic, uh, the, the, the, if you look at DNA, which stores so much information, so little place that we could have significant more, you know, uh, memory capabilities that lower costs. So we have embarked into absolutely a new world where things are changing. I've got a little girl, which is 12 years old and fundamentally that new generation, especially of girls, not boys, because the boys are still on, you know, at that age. >>Uh, they are very studious. They absorb so much information via YouTube. They are things like a security stream. They are so knowledgeable. And when you look back at history 2000 years plus ago in Greece, you at 95 plus percent of the population slaves. So a few percent could start to think now, today it's totally changed. And the amount of information they can, they learn. And this absolutely amazing. And you know, she, she's, I would tell you the story which has nothing to do with computing, but as a button, the knowledge of, she came to me the few, few weeks ago and she said, Oh daddy, I would like to make my mother more productive. Okay. So I said, Oh, that's her name is Avia, which is the, which is the, the, the either Greece or Zeus weathered here. And so I say, Evie, I, so that's a good idea. >>So how are you going to do it? I mean, our answer, I was flawed, but that is very simple. Just like with, for me, I'm going to ask her to go to YouTube to learn what she needs to learn. Exactly. And she learns, she draws very well. She learns how to draw in YouTube and it's not a gifted, she's a nice, very nice little girl and very small, but all her friends are like that. Right? So we're entering in a word, which thing are changing very, very fast. So the key is adaptation, education and democracy and democratization. Getting more people access to more. Absolutely. It's very, very important. And then kind of this whole dev ops continuous improve that. Not big. That's a very good point that you make because that's exactly today the new buyer today in security and in it is becoming the DevOps shipper. >>Because what? What are these people? There are engineers which suddenly create good code and then they want to of course ship their code and then all these old silos or you need to do these, Oh no, we need to put the new server, we don't have the capacity, et cetera. How is that going to take three months or a month? And then finally they find a way through, again, you know, all the need for scale, which was coming from the Google, from the Facebook and so forth. And by the way, we can shortcut all of that and we can create and we can run out to auto-ship, our code. Guess what are they doing today? They are learning how to secure all of that, right? So again, it's that ability to really learn and move. And today, uh, one of the problem that you alluded to is that, which the Amazon was saying is that their pick there, they have taken a lot of the talent resources in the U S today because of course they pay them extra to me, what? >>Of course they'll attract that talent. And of course there's now people send security. There's not enough people that even in, but guess what? We realized that few years ago in 2007, we'll make a big decision who say, well, never going to be able to attract the right people in the Silicon Valley. And we've started to go to India and we have now 750 people. And Jack Welch used to say, we went to India for the cost and discover the talent. We went to India for the talent and we discover the cost. And there is a huge pool of tenants. So it's like a life wants to continue to leave and now to, there are all these tools to learn, are there, look at the can Academy, which today if you want to go in nuclear physics, you can do that through your phone. So that ability to learn is there. So I think we need just more and more people are coming. So I'm a very optimistic in a way because I think the more we improve our technologies that we look at the progress we're making genetics and so everywhere and that confidence of technology is really creating a new way. >>You know, there's a lot of conversations about a dystopian future and a utopian future with all these technologies and the machines. And you know what? Hollywood has shown us with AI, you're very utopian side, very optimistic on that equation. What gives you, what gives you, you know, kind of that positive feeling insecurity, which traditionally a lot of people would say is just whack a mole. And we're always trying to chase the bad guys. Generally >>speaking, if I'm a topian in in a way. But on the other end, you'd need to realize that unfortunately when you have to technological changes and so forth, it's also create factors. And when you look at this story in Manatee, the same technological advancement that some countries to take to try to take advantage of fathers is not that the word is everything fine and everything peaceful. In fact, Richard Clark was really their kid always saying that, Hey, you know that there is a sinister side to all the internet and so forth. But that's the human evolution. So I believe that we are getting longterm. It's going to. So in the meantime there's a lot of changes and humans don't adapt well to change. And so that's in a way, uh, the big challenge we have. But I think over time we can create a culture of change and that will really help. And I also believe that probably at some point in time we will re-engineer the human race. >>All right, cool. We'll leave it there. That's going to launch a whole nother couple hours. They leave. Congratulations on the event and a great job on your keynote. Thanks for taking a few minutes with us. Alrighty. It's relief. I'm Jeff. You're watching the cube where the Qualice security conference at the Bellagio in Las Vegas. Thanks for watching. We'll see you next time.

>> live from San Francisco, celebrating 10 years of high tech coverage. It's the Cube covering Veum World 2019 brought to you by VM Wear and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back. We're here at V Emerald 2019 in the lobby of Mosconi north, back in San Francisco, where it all began. 10th year of the Cube covering VM world. I'm stupid and my co host is John Troyer. Expensive time working for Vienna, where he's been doing the kid with us now for over three years. It was Veum world that we brought in the first time. >> I believe I was working with you on the other side. That that here >> absolutely and welcoming. First back to the program. One of our cube alumni, Rawlinson Rivera, who's the CTO of the global field at Cohesive E. Thanks for joining us again. My pleasure, man. Always excited when we get to talk to Ah, customer is a customer and a service provider. Brock Marie, who's the chief technologist at? Whoa, >> Correct. Thanks for having. >> All right. So we're gonna get Tau Whoa in a second, cause really want to dig in an interesting name? I'm sure you guys have some fun with that, I would hope. But Rawlinson, first of all, you know Veum world always big celebration back in San Francisco celebration. But 10 years of the Cube to you know, what's it all mean to you? >> Amazing. The fact that I've been here a couple of times now it's great. It's a good, great way to put a stamp on my existence. He would be able to >> Yeah, you know, amazing ecosystem and lots of ah ah, as we said, we just had Jerry chain on. It's the deviant where? Mafia. I'm sitting here with two former VM where employees do so even when they've left their still tight with a lot of going on there. All right, Brock, you've been to this event Ah, a few times before we get into Whoa, Just tell us, You know, what does the world mean to you? >> Soviet world is obviously it's a huge networking event. You get Thio not only see your peers, but also other players in the industries and be able to evaluate their products and see what they have. >> All right, so tell us a little bit about Whoa. >> So what dot com was founded in 2013 we ah, tout ourselves as a cyber secure cloud platform. Ah, we've done more than just stand up TVM where bits for hosting we've actually integrated some threat protection and some network defense items. Uh, around that infrastructure. >> All right, give us a little bit of the Brett. You know, how many locations? Verticality. All that kind of. >> So our headquarters is in Hollywood, Florida. We have a data center presence in Miami, a data center presence in Grand Rapids, Michigan, and one and switch LV in Las Vegas. So that gives us coverage over the United States. All >> right, I've toward one of those facilities. You probably amazing facility. So, uh, >> yeah, well, can you tell us a little bit about what was business? And I'm in particular interested in being a service provider in 2019 right? A lot of noise about the big public clouds. But as the folks here at B M, where no, there's trillions of dollars flowing through a nightie ecosystem that, you know, some of it's going to the public cloud. But there's lots of need for service providers. Providing specialty service's or hands on service is or I'm kind of curious. What is your business? What is your business and like, how does it intersect with data, Which is where we're getting to hear? >> Yeah, absolutely. So with our focus on compliance, that's really one of the major differentiators from us with the hyper scale Er's or the Big three is a lot of people like to call them, um that gives us the ability also to tune and make sure that their workloads are precise and running the way that they want with the security models around them. Uh, plus, it's the you know you got, you could reach out and you can contact us. We pick up the phone, we support all of our customers. Uh, we love to go above and beyond and make sure that they're happy. So we want to kind of give them that that boutique type feel and be able to provide. The service is out. >> We're talking verticals like, >> yes. Oh, health care is a big one. Obviously, um and then there's, you know, huge requirements around that for data protection and ah, data isolation and so forth. Um and also, you know, on the cyber security side, cyber scan the new release from these guys is something that we're definitely foaming at the mouth to get at it. Something that we're ready to put into play because it's it's a value, add back to our customers and having their product in that position gives us an advantage, >> right? Rawlinson. He teed you up. But you know, in general, you know, we know where cohesive He has played in the enterprise on what's been happening. A lot of the environment gives a little bit of the landscape for the service providers and where cohesively plays. We know that that's you know, it's been a great no only customer, but almost a channel for many technology in the space for a number of years. Well, you >> know, we have our own sort of like division within the Coast, just with sports writer of market. What we doing, we're enabling them to provide their customers with the value that we gave our enterprise customers already so opening up more than just the backup, right? So one of the things that rock mentioned is this new capability. Have a performing scans for vulnerability scans within the systems. When have you ever been able to do that on something that just sits there and it's just an insurance policy in the past. Now we can give you the ability to provide your customers ability to look into their data whether there have a vulnerability or not in place and tell him before they do it. Did you want to restore this? You wanna protect it with X amount of vulnerabilities. You want to fix it before you do it, And that kind of level of service is being provided. It delivers in immense value to customers everywhere. All >> right, So is this the first product that uses a few city or have you been using other >> s? So we obviously we dove in headfirst with data protection? Um, our previous data protection product wasn't living up to, ah, up to its claims. And that sparked us to go out and start looking at other vendors. And it actually happened at the end world. A few years ago, I came across Cohesive E, uh, worked with their guys. We did a POC. Um, we attacked some of our major pain points right off the bat, and cohesive handled it without any problems. >> I'm kind of curious. So we're talking about a second secondary storage platform. You know, uh, backup is is a use of it, But once you live in the world now we don't. We still put something, the things on tape, but okay, the bits are live there on a disk somewhere, and back them up. So as an example of this for the security scans, some of this ransomware stuff can lie dormant for months before turning on. So it's not a matter of like, Oh, I've just restored the backup from last week. You may have to go search through the all your your your checkpoints. Right. So that's an example of how having a secondary storage platform really enables a lot of security. So that's my with my understanding. Several out, maybe. Tee you up. Can you talk about data? The secondary storage data platform in general And security is one aspect. Data protection is another. I don't know. >> I mean, that's right. Yeah. The thing about what we do is that we as a data management platform, which was kind of getting falling into that there's many fastest to managing with data. We started with the data protection piece. Now we adding other value to the areas which is just pointed out. There's a lot of dark data that you don't get to see because of description of silos, and >> I >> don't really use that Now. We have the ability to provide that value that everyone else on the service provider business can leverage because now they have. Like you said, I have to go look through all these different generations of that protection job that I'm doing now. We do that instantaneous. We do that at the core. So now you're able to identify and report on that and be able to correct it before you have to go through that process, which is which is incredible. Now, if that's on the data protection side, we also have the ability of using. You can use cohesive as a file if they want to do that. Now we're talking to live information that can access the same suite of capability and tools, are there and can report the same way. >> Yeah, if I can add to that to one of the one of the really cool features that I that I like that Cohee City does is when you're using filer service is and things like that. You still have the ability to protect that data as well. So you can replicate those snapshots out to other locations and so forth. So ah, we found that was, ah, pretty good benefit for us. We have a configuration management platform that we ended up putting amount on one of those servers, and we want to protect that in our other location. And this is our own internal operations. So we leverage the platform is well, we protect that data by replicating into another Geo >> Brock. Connect the dots for us. We understand us pain points. But what is this colucci city solutions that you're using mean for your ultimate end user customers >> Confidence, That's, you know, knowing that when that backup report comes in and hits their inbox, that all of those jobs are gonna be successful. And ultimately, what that turns into is when they need that data back, they need to restore it. It's going to be there for them, all right? >> Anything you'd add about the impact on the customers when you're working with service providers, any kind of broader discussion of the service writers. >> I mean, it's great the things that we do because now we're not only typically we enable our enterprise customers to do this. Now we're neighbors and our service providers to enable their customers to do that as well. And you know what? We just we just in the background. It's their business, right? They're the ones who are providing the service, making a service for for the customer based on what they need. And it is good for us to kind of enable that and let them do what they need to. They would just make money, make money, protect their money and make more money. >> Brock, I'm kind of curious you and your your customers, right? A lot of talking vigil, transformation at agility. We've all gotta make money. We've all gotta move fast, and I'm guessing you know it again. In an ecosystem where there are very big players and very small players, part of you still have to move fast, and your customers expect you to be delivering News Service's and reliable service is et cetera. Can you maybe just talk a little bit about kind of what your customers are looking for? Uh, you know how the relationship goes with, Maybe with a with a provider like like you have a team And will he see building healthy? You know, how fast can you turn on the service is how fast is that ramp up in? Maybe with the >> Sure so. And it's funny because I've actually been having some other conversations on how we can improve the existing workflow. Ah, but the workflow has been, uh, not, um, we've had to re architect a couple of network items to be able to, ah, to facilitate external backups. For example, being a service provider, I don't just back up the EMS within my environment. I backup PM's in customers environments as well. So laying the foundation to be ableto have these. Ah, these units replicate between each other, eases that path and and again it comes down to revenue. The faster I can get that box coming in, the faster that I can realize revenue on the product. >> A lot of discussion in this show about some of the future things you know, the emerging, where is talking about container ization and building communities into Evie's fear, talking about their multi cloud connectivity that they're having. I know the City's got a strong play partnering with all the public cloud environment. Give us look out as toe. How does that impact your business? Where do you see that going from your roadmap standpoint? >> Absolutely. So, uh, with with the cohesive platform, especially with the, uh, the big three hyper scale er's, for example, we're actually looking at a way to put our long term storage out on that out on those service is we'll keep our short term storage internal or on Prem wherever the customers scenario might be. But we want to leverage that that long term storage so that we don't have to manage that data over a seven year period. We do manage it. We'll ever do your guys tools to be able to do it, but it's in a hyper scaler. I don't need to worry about it. >> And to add to that were also as a Zvi, Ammar moves alone and catches on the wave of the Cuban. Any journalist after we also do that already so we can actually provide protection of name spaces for for the kubernetes environment, something you'll start seeing, you'll see we released very soon. So we already given the short stories provides the ability to compete with the hyper scale is providing those newer cloud Native service is they need to be. You have available for them to know we're gonna make that would enable that for everyone. Still haven't we would offer it universal. >> Well, actually, that that brings up a question Brock hour in terms of being cloud native. Either you, you guys spending up more service is more cloud native APS or your customers. And I'm not sure if they're building off if they're bringing off the shelf APS to you or if they're building custom maps. I mean, where do you see the evolution of this hole field in terms of Dev Ops and Cloud Native? >> Definitely. So Cloud Native is ah, is a very interesting architecture play, especially with the micro service's and dynamically building machines on the fly. And things like that is very, very exciting. Very intriguing. Um, our workloads tend to be more traditional vm type workloads. Uh, I have been having conversations with customers, technical groups. Hey, you guys should start looking at Micro service. Is this is something you guys can improve your guys. Your service delivery with um, we haven't gotten there yet. We're using some container service is internally for our own operations, but externally, we're still trying to, you know, part of the digital transformation. Work with your customers to provide them >> solutions. All right, Brock, when you know one of the things we come to this show, we always get. Okay, great. Here's where we are today. Here's where we going tomorrow. Usually have a wish list, you know, we know service fighters. Yes. If you could make it a little cheaper, you know, we need to be able to pass those margins, you know, down to our customer. What? What's on your wish list? What would make you know your company's life easier? >> Ah, well, cohesive. He's done a very good job of that already, so ah, again, you know, having confidence in your backups and being able to sleep at night is definitely huge. Um, so on my wish list, I like the direction they're going with the integration and, ah, lot of the workbench products and so forth. Honestly, I don't have a ton of wish list. I'm more sitting back watching what these guys are gonna come out with because cyber scans, one that actually came out of left field for me. And, um, this >> is awesome. What I think is interesting about these these architecture is that there are this this app layer that they that they're now introducing that Yes, there's kubernetes there, but it's a lot of APS. Data service is that are very close to the data. I don't know what What do you guys have in store? What are you talking about here at the show in terms of new service is because it's now you just containerized it. You, Doc, arise it and stick it in your thing and your your plane. And it's there on the on the device that >> the focus for us has basically continue to deliver value on the platform that people only thought it was data protection. It's way more than that. He has he comes availability scanners being one of them, but also opening the platform for customers and cell service providers. You know what you need. You know what service? If you need to create a developed for what you need to do, do it and put it on us. Do not move the date away from where where is safely stored, located, bring the application to it. That eliminates risks of, you know, data leakage and all these kinds of things that you have a secure, centralized, scalable everything you want. It's all in place. >> Yeah, I think it's a great point. You know, when when the company first came out, it's like, Okay, well, here's the product at the day. But Mohit is building a platform that is his history, and that's not what he's doing. And I know that's what excited a lot of people in the early days. And as you said, your data management platform now. So we know we're now actually are, at least at the early stages of where the company is going with the overall solution. >> Your moments very methodical. He decided to go one way, one thing at a time, right? We're not a Swiss army knife. We're not gonna Well, the ocean we come out, we master the one thing that was the most painful so far. Data protection. We fixed back up, and now we're going to give you the rest of what you get from the platform after we master that. All >> right? I want to give you the final words. You've been going through this journey now for a few years when you talk to your peers, What advice would you give than anything you've learned along the way? Is that all? It's great, But boy, I wish I could have shortcut. Certain things were, you know, planned something a little bit different. You know what learning is gonna share? >> Eso definitely plant plan your deployments. You know, there's there's some new features and new items that are coming out. But, you know, again, one of the great things about you he city you have a virtual ization of the E series. Go in there and break it on the V E Siri's and then deployed on your hardware. >> All right, >> Brock and Rawlinson Thank you so much for joining us. Appreciate all the updates and congratulations on the progress we've been making for John Troyer. Arms to Minuteman. Back with lots more coverage at the midpoint of three days. Walter Wall coverage two sets 10th Year of the Cube at VM World 2019. Thanks as always, for watching

>> live from Boston, Massachusetts. It's the you covering your red hat some twenty nineteen brought to you by bread hat. >> Welcome back to our continuing live coverage here, read. Had summat. Twenty nineteen. You're watching Cube. I'm John Wallis along with stewed minimum. Nice to have you here with us as we head toward the homestretch. Day three of our three days of coverage here on the Q. We're now joined by a couple of guys who they put on their traveling shoes to get here, both hailing from Sydney, Australia. Gilman, pull a Matisse who's a senior innovation lead at Optimise and Vasily Check Culkin, who's a principal software architect, also adopted, which is the second largest mobile phone service provider in Australia. Gentlemen, thanks for being with us. Thanks, fiving. It's a long way to come, right? >> Yes, it is, but it's very worst trip. >> Excellent. Well, you're both on the keynote stage this morning. We'LL talk about that in just a little bit for folks who might not be familiar with obvious once you tell us a little bit about your footprint in Australia and what brings you here to talk about red hat and open >> shift well as you mentioned the obvious is a leading telco in Australia way are lucky that we own our infrastructure, which makes it a fantastic place As software engineers or infrastructure engineers working a CZ, we can develop new products and new solutions or innovate. It was in this network. Um all roles for the city and I adopted is essentially to identify new opportunities to innovate within our networks. We use our core I sets to innovate, but not on ly Just do this research and development also execute on this way. Call this a bit of an applied innovation where a ninety we would work really hard in in taking it, Teo to realise come but live writing on Colossus. >> So we're having a lot of stories with customers about transformation and telecommunications is one that's fascinating to look at because, you know, you work on software, you know, when I think back to tell Comet was, you know, fiber and towers and you know, physical implementation. But, you know, software, such a large part of what's going on. You tell us some of the changes going on and you know what's impacting your role in Annapolis? >> Uh, it's it's impacting all. Tell CAS actually, but yes, kill Cosa Switching from this old mine set off just fathers just hours. And this is Dan movements and five hundred Carmen, which is driving a lot of changes. People start thinking about social network functions and how we can dip alone on edge. How we can help our customers and developers to collaborate on next features how we can leverage although technologists and a state we have. >> I think if you think of software defined network and they moved to naturalization, you can now think of this. Australia is a big country that so you can not think of this entire infrastructure is being virtualized and could be made available for Also use a CZ well, so it's really changing that sense that it's not closed anymore and you can open to new cases. >> You know, you bring up it. Just a point about the pure geography of Australia. Huge country. Twenty five million people. No way would jealous here in the States, you had twenty five just, you know, in the Boston New York area. Probably I would think somewhere around there, but house that factor and just in terms of your operations in general that you do have nine million subscribers spread out over so much geography on dure trying to deliver the state of the art circuit service. Just, >> I said I couldn't take this one. So in terms of distance that there is an important impact. But what Today we were talking about phone calls. Video is essentially managing infrastructure, and you know, it's such a large country as its challenges. But it's something we're getting very good at a CZ. We pushing very hard to be present in regional Australia so you can sink of this beautiful landscape in getting five of there being a challenge, but with challenges that they did. The luck that comes with this is that we get to a parade, a scaled network, maybe not with the scale of subscribers that you have in any US, but we're the same challenges. So when it comes to innovation way, get the opportunities to way find you. >> So in the keynote, there was a lot of residents in the audience when you, you know, talked about breaking the language barrier. Maybe, you know, go in share with our audience here, just a tidbit as to what you were talking about. How that works from a technology standpoint. Roll >> out from technology. A point off you telephone you're stuck is it's complex thing. And if you want to integrate directly this telephone system directly with a phone call, it's our job. Okay, I did it. It's tough we did it. I'm never getting so. And the software developers what we tend to do when the get some complex things to solve. We obstructed away, and for us it was off the solution. We need to obstruct away all this complex ing all complex signaling nadiya handling and a very simple way off getting additional voice services within phone call. It's additional challenges like distance, and you can't just kind of older in the cloud because we need to be close to the customer. Otherwise, it will be very, very but quality. Always what and yeah, and it's opens availability toe innovate further, we can bring more services, not only voice, translation and transcription, but just think about it. You got your voice. We can help you. We can like new exciting services on plain old. >> So we had translate today and that we were here to talk about the technology may also the culture changed around. If on network becomes more open. And if we have these opportunities to live rage this network to try to build new products on DH, there are plenty of products that way. Also working on that are based on this idea that waken build products like people build APS to build a napkin, a smartphone or you need this environment way can expose the network in the same digital environment on DH. Translation is very interesting because it's emotional. If you think of communication, language can be a barrier. The a. D that we digitize the phone call and that we can then let build products or or engineer products that break barriers is very exciting. And so this is where we pick the specific use case for for the keynote today, Aziz, you mentioned before it has a emotional showing it, >> but there was if I got it right and police correct me if I didn't, um, you were engaged in a real time phone call right now and then if we pretended that one of you spoke one language, one of you spoke another. There was an immediate translation from English to French, French to English. And the call was being transcribed in real time as well. So it could be used another medium, right? I want to use it in, you know, e mails or other communications text, whatever. So you were stockpiling all this capability right in through the transcription, but doing real time voice translation. >> Take the venue, We idea. So things like translation is something that Microsoft, for example, does really well and many club companies to really well, the value we add is to move from having an adult translation request conditions like this to Russian, to integrating this in in one of the most natural communication channel, which is person to person. Phone call is a perfect place to start, because if there is one place where you're going to a language barrier as phone calls global, you can call anywhere in the world. This's pretty exciting environment. >> Oh, I thought so. I mean, >> you know, it's fascinating to think kind of history of telecommunications. It's well, you know, every country has their own, you know, system. But there needs to be that interconnection so that you know, today I don't think about whether you know I'm calling across the street across the country or across the globe. It takes care of that boy. If I could just plug into some of the available services on INDU translation, you know, right you're goingto bring Bring the world a little bit closer together. >> And the phone. Nichole's of Quintus, You don't sign up to brand, so you do sign up to a telescope. But this is regardless of your device. You can establish a phone call on used the services. I >> know some teenagers I'd like to have their conversations translated for May. Really helpful. >> You can build it a cz. Well, >> can you do work on that? Good. I'll have to think about it. What about five g And what is that doing for you? Just from a purely technical standpoint, the opportunities that you see coming with that I know rollouts. Probably still year or twenty four months away from taking place. I don't know what the Australia rollout is compared to the U. S. But in terms of what that speed is going to do for you, what kinds of possibilities you think the ceiling exist? I >> must after very developed. I'm thinking, like from Pew Software Development Point of view. Excuse me. Perfect opportunity to be connect customers with developers on an edge on a on your network. Andi, it's all the world later NCIS and bend with and you can do fascinating thing on edge ofthe network I raise that sings real time Rachael here at the open to reality five g will enable it and we'LL keep thiss development and improve speed off this stuff. And I'm looking forward to have all of this available not only for me as I'm looking for Loker, I don't want it close the opening network we're opening Tell Kal Toh the cool world off wonderful software development and it's fascinating >> The Savages. Also, if you think of five, you gotta think about momentum. There is this momentum that we have now to improve our networks, and it's not entirely just five g. We've got network function visualizations. We've got Coyote, and that momentum is very interesting because as we improve our network, it becomes more digital and especially mentioned as it becomes more digital. It's more open and enables new opportunities for enterprise customers off for startups to innovate in this environment. >> Okay, so my understanding from what you talked about and, you know, this is built on open shift, you know, what's the importance? You know, why Open shift and what is that enable for your business and ultimately your customers? >> This is actually something way quite proud off. When we started this journey in this software engineering space, it's inclined narrative. It's only natural to build functions in containers, but there was There was effectively that gap between building new applications in the current state of a network that has a a very different approach of operation. So, communities, where's the right tool for us? But when you operate a carrier network, you need strong support and you need Teo. You need to have a very firm Acela's because you don't drop phone calls. This is very important minute communication, and this is where we had a fantastic relationship is really to find a way to operationalize thiss deployment. >> Ricardo wasn't only like operating this thing way worked hand in hand last few years, they've helped a lot this designing systems like best practices. We learned a lot off each other and it was fantastic journey way really enjoyed working on this. It's extremely professional team, >> No, in from a timing perspective Oh, our journey came together a same time, as read it started seeing telcos has being where the next big thing or the next something to very much start focusing on. >> So so what's your next big thing? We're talking about five G and what that's going to open up, and we've read a lot about it here in the States. But from your perspective, you know what? What is that going to enable? What kind of services? Because for G's already, you know, blowing everybody's mind in some respects, right with the data capabilities there imaging transactions, those kinds of things, but five g your thought, I think, >> previews. Innovation cycles things three G for G Always came, came in with a pre pre baked benefits, often speeds with five minutes a little. My opinion is a little bit different. What's happening? What we're doing is is an example of this is in a V that you have a new environment and important environment where new things can happen and so you're going to see this as Oppen versus closed what it means is that the next big thing is not necessarily five year. And Evie. Next big thing is what software developers will make of this environment. And that might be a start up. Or they could be enterprised could bring you cooperate, right? And we are very much very much open to start conversation with anyone that would like to make use of this. He's >> got the next big thing. That was God the next big thing yet, Right, gentlemen, thank you for making the long trip. I know not just to see us, but we do appreciate your carving out some time for us. Good job this morning. And, uh, good luck down the road. >> Thank you for having us. >> Thank you. Thank you. Back with more live from Boston. You're watching the Cuban. You're watching coverage from Red Hat Summit twenty nineteen