(upbeat music) >> Welcome to theCUBE's coverage of HPE Discover 2021. I'm your host, Lisa Martin. I've got a couple of guests with me here from Infosys. Alumni Uma Lakshmipathy is back, Senior Vice President and Regional Head of EMEA at Infosys. Uma, it's great to see you welcome back to the program. >> Yeah. Hi Lisa. It's great to be back for Discover 2021. It's been a great opportunity to meet with a lot of stakeholders in HPE. >> Excellent. We're going to dig into that. And Saju Sankarankutty is here as well. The CTO, Cloud Advisory, VP-Hybrid Cloud Engineering, Platforms and Automation at Infosys. Saju, welcome to the program. >> Thank you, Lisa. It's a pleasure to be in the program. It is my first time, but I really enjoyed it as well. >> Well, welcome, welcome. So the next 15 minutes or so, we're going to unpack a survey that was just done. As we know, cloud has catalyzed a lot in the last year. One of those being cloud adoption. Talk to us about some of the things that you've seen as more and more enterprises are moving workloads to cloud. How is the hybrid cloud enabling businesses to grow, enabling them to actually have a competitive edge? >> Lisa, if you look at the pre-COVID scenario, there are many, many clients which actually made a significant move into cloud, but there were many few of the companies who didn't really take a mature cloud adoption. But those companies which actually did the adoption, we see that have taken a big step with the help of the, when the COVID hit them because they were able to be very resilient, but at the same time, they were able to, the cloud adoption really helped them to improve their business profits. When we did this cloud radar survey across all the geographies, we did it across the US, the Latin, the Asia Pacific, the EMEA markets, and when we looked at what our clients and enterprises were able to recover and get all of this whole cloud adoption, we got a number of 414 billions of profits that the enterprises can make by using this cloud adoption. And that's what we saw in this survey that we did with our clients. >> Yeah, that's huge enterprises. The survey found can add up to, you said 414 billion and net new profits annually through effective cloud adoption. Uma, sticking with you for a second, what does Infosys describe as effective cloud adoption? >> When we look at cloud adoption, we have enterprises who started shifting workloads, which are very comfortable for them. And then they started to take the more mature understanding of moving workloads, which are very critical to the business. So when we look at effective, it is a combination of both. The ones that were very easy to go to the cloud. The ones that made businesses able to bring in new applications, the new go-to markets to their segments, to their clients. But then, it is also about taking some of those legacy workloads and making a choice, the right choice to take it by transforming those applications and environments into the cloud adoption. And that's what we call as effective. It's just not the easy ones, but also those are complex and legacy riddled ones that effectively goes on to transform itself into a new way for their clients and for the experience of the users. >> So big changes coming big opportunities. Saju, we see we've talked about this for many times, more and more companies moving to multicloud arrangements for a variety of reasons. What have been some of the things that Infosys has experienced and what are some of your viewpoints on a multicloud? >> Thank you, Lisa. So if you look around, hybrid cloud has been the new normal and if you look at it, private cloud is becoming an essential component for hosting applications. When you look at it, it's more about applications which have low latency requirements, it has regulatory requirements, or it has a static demand of infrastructure. Now, what Infosys has done in this spaces is that we have developed a framework which we call it as a right cloud solution framework. And this is focused on implementing a hybrid multicloud leveraging and in-house developed tools and frameworks as well as platforms along with those strategic partner ecosystem. That is our biggest contribution onto the hybrid multicloud world. Now, the foundation of our framework is Infosys polycloud platform. It's a unified multicloud management platform. It can provision, it can orchestrate, it can also manage the cloud deployment across multiple of the environments. It can be a private, it can be a public, or it can be on the edge. Now, apart from all of these things, it also offers features and functionalities very similar to the hyperscalers. And either it can be in terms of the user experience or it can be in a commercial model or a technology stack or it can be reports or it can be persona based user experience and integration with multiple systems, it brings all of these functionalities seamlessly across the multiple hybrid ecosystem. That's the biggest contribution from Infosys in this space. >> Got it. Okay. Uma, as we see the, just clear growth of multicloud in every industry, talk to us about what the cloud radar survey uncovered with prospective? You've mentioned that big number, the correlation between cloud transformation and profitable growth for enterprises across any industry. >> So I did mention about that Lisa in the previous question as well. When we look at enterprises trying to take the cloud adoption, the big benefits for the enterprises do happen when they cross that layer of moving a significant part of their existing legacy in a very transformed new world. And that brings in the new way of working for the customers, for their end users and internally as well for the various stakeholders. And that I think is creating a cost structure for them, which is very, very optimal from where they were. But at the same time, it is enabling their ecosystem of users and customers to come and operate in a very seamless fashion. And that is the biggest advantage of boosting profits for them at the same time cutting costs within the internal stakeholders. So at one stage, you're optimizing your cost. At the other stage, you're bringing in an easiness for your clients to operate on, which is actually creating that enlarged profit boost. >> Uma, sticking with you for a second. If we unpack that growth, that business profit growth opportunity that the survey uncovered, are we talking about things like faster time to market, increasing scale? What are some of the things underneath that hood? >> So if you look at traditionally, cloud was considered the enabler for quick faster time to market, but now a cloud has become the central theme for resilience. If you look at the COVID pandemic, those enterprises which were already cloud enabled were able to resiliently and sustain their business and grow their businesses. So as the economy started opening up, if I can talk about an automotive client who is today enriching businesses out of China because they have the first economy that has opened up after the pandemic. So you see a lot of enablement for those enterprises which have already taken the cloud journey. And if you look at today, enterprises are in somewhere around 17 to 18% of cloud adoption. And if they can take that to the 40%, that's when they will see that kind of boosted profits and we can clearly see about 400 plus billion dollars of profits that enterprises can make. >> All right. Saju, let's talk to you for a second. If we look at some of the survey results, the acceleration that is expected to be seen by in the next year of enterprises moving so many more workloads to cloud. You talked about hybrid cloud, talk to me about how the experience of working with HPE and creating joint solution suites is going to help the customers facilitate and drive that transformation. >> Thank you, Lisa. So if you look at HPE, HPE comes with a fine set of technology and commercial constructs that complements our right cloud framework and they offer the solution, the whole sort of lot of solutions offer private cloud as a service, which is a major component of our right cloud framework. Either it is a container as a service with HPE's ezmeral data platform on HP hardware or VDA as a service based on a composable and conversed infrastructure or HPC cloud build on great systems and all of them commercially supported with an HPE GreenLake offering makes it very attractive for our customers. Now, these integrations have helped us in providing a very seamless metering and billing along with the chargeback solutions very much in line with what is being provided by hyperscalers. Apart from this, we also work very closely with HPE to create a very compelling sourcing strategy for driving hybrid cloud driven digital transformation while taking costs out and protecting the existing investments through various financial models for our customers helping them in terms of transforming their digital estate in the new cloud world. >> And Uma, I want to get your perspective as well, the HPE Infosys partnership. Talk to me about that being a win-win for your clients in every industry. >> So actually Lisa, it's a great question. And this probably is my third CUBE interview. And I've told this previously as well in my previous interviews as well. The relationship between Infosys and HPE is very, very strategic And it's very, very top down driven. And today, we've seen very high transformative opportunities that two organizations have come together and we won't call it win-win, but we call it win-win-win, which is essentially a win for HPE, win for Infosys, but even for the clients as well. So if you look at some of the engagements that we've jointly done, everything has been transformative. I can talk about energy client where we've done a huge virtual VDI engagement with them where we have been able to dig them very seamlessly when the COVID pandemic hit them. So then they're a significant part of their IT users, but being able to operate from their residences. I can talk about a great story about how we had enabled GreenLake for a wind energy company and how that GreenLake capability helped the customer to migrate the application seamlessly to a hybrid cloud. And there are so many examples of similar scale and size when we look at clients in the manufacturing space and the automobile sector where we really done a work very closely with HPE across all regions and all geographies to make this what I would call a win-win-win partnership. >> I like that, win-win-win. Who wouldn't want that? One more question, Uma for you. Talk to me about the next, as we talked about some of those survey results and I think folks can find that survey, the cloud radar survey on the infosys.com website. I found it on the homepage there. But looking at how much transformation is expected in the next 12 months or so, what are some of the things that we can expect from Infosys and HPE to help drive and catalyze that growth that you expect to see in the next 12 months? >> Yeah. And I was talking to you before this interview and you said that yes, we are to look at this. And I was feeling very happy that you had the opportunity to look at the site. And you said that, look, there's an opportunity to also make, to continuously provide feedback and we're very happy for clients to come in and look at it and do provide us the feedback. This is a constant learning for us. We are a big learning company. And when it comes to the next 12 months of agenda, I think the pipeline is very robust for both us and the HPE in terms of the way we want to take proactive transformational opportunities to our clients. Create a value differentiation on the hybrid cloud for them and clearly, this survey clearly came back to reflect back to us that our strategy that we've done together as partners is the right strategy because there is a significant headroom for growth in the cloud space for both Infosys and HPE. >> Excellent. Well, gentlemen, thank you for joining me today talking to me about what Infosys and HPE are doing together, unpacking some of the significant insights that the cloud radar survey has uncovered. We appreciate your time. >> Thank you, Lisa. Thank you. Thank you for giving us this opportunity. >> Absolutely. For Uma and Saju >> Thank you, Lisa. I'm Lisa Martin, you're watching theCUBEs coverage of HPE Discover 2021. (bright music)

>>from around the globe. It's the cube with >>Digital coverage of IBM think 2021 brought to you by IBM. Welcome back to the cubes coverage of IBM Think 2021 virtual were not yet in real life. We're doing another remote interviews with two great guests cube alumni of course, I'm john for your host of the cube. We've got Jason McGee, IBM fellow VP and CTO of IBM cloud platform and octavian Tennessee. Senior Vice president Hybrid Cloud Engineering at Netapp. Both cube alumni. It's great to see you both. Thanks for coming on. Thank >>you. Great to be here. Thanks for having us. >>So we were just talking before we came on camera that you know what it feels like. We've had this conversation, you know, a long time ago we have Hybrid cloud has been on a trajectory for both of you guys many times on the cube. So now it's mainstream, it's here in the real world, everyone gets it. It's not, there's no real debate now. Multi cloud, that's that. People are debating that. Which means that's right around the corner. So Hybrid cloud is here and now, um, Jason this is really the focus and this is also brings together Netapp in your partnership and talk about the relationship first with hybrid cloud. >>Yeah, I mean, you know, look, we've talked to a number of times together I think in the industry, uh, maybe, maybe a few years ago people were debating whether Hybrid cloud was a real thing. We don't have that conversation anymore. I think, um, you know, enterprises today, especially maybe in the face of Covid and kind of how we work differently now realize that their cloud journey is going to be a mix of on prem and off premise systems. Probably going to be a mix of multiple public cloud providers, um, and what they're looking for now is how do I do that and how do I manage that hybrid environment? How do I have a consistent platform across the different environments I want to operate in. Um, and then how do I get more and more of my work into those environments? And it's been interesting. I think the first, the first waves of cloud, we're infrastructure centric and externally application focused, they were easier things. And now we're moving into more mission critical, more state fel more data oriented workloads. And that brings with it new challenges on where applications run and and how we leverage the club >>Octavia. You guys had a great relationship with IBM over the years, uh, data centric company that it has always been great engineering team. You're on the cloud. Hybrid cloud engineering. What's the current status of the relationship? Give us an update on how the it's vectoring into the hybrid clouds this year? Senior Vice President. Hybrid cloud engineering. >>Well, so first of all, I want to recognize 20 years of a successful partnership with IBM I think uh that happened. IBM have been companies that have embraced digital transformation and technology trends to enable that digital transformation for our customers. And we've been very successful. I think there is a very strong um joint hydrochloric value proposition for customers. Netapp storage and data services complement what IBM does in terms of products and solutions, both for on premise deployments in the cloud. I think together we can build more complete solutions solutions that span data mobility to the governance for the new workloads that Jason has talked about. >>And how are some of the customer challenges that you're seeing? Obviously software defined networking, software defined storage, uh, deVOps has now turned into Deb's sec ops. So you have now that program ability requirement with four dynamic applications, application driven infrastructure, all these buzzwords point to one thing the infrastructure has to be resilient and respond to the applications. >>Yeah, I would say uh infrastructure, you know, will continue to be uh you know, top of mind for everybody whether they're building a private uh you know, cloud or whether there um you know, trying to leverage, you know, something like IBM cloud, I think people want to consume, you know, infrastructure is an A P I I think they want simplicity, you know, security, I I think they want to manage their cost, you know very well. I think we're very proud to be partnering with IBM cloud to build such capabilities. >>Jason what's how are you guys help on some of these customers as they look at new things and sometimes retrofitting and re factoring previous stuff don't transforming but also innovating at the same time as a lot of that going on. What are you guys doing to help with the Hybrid challenges? >>Yeah, I mean, you know, there's a lot of dimensions of that problem, but the one that that I think has been kind of most interesting over the last year has been how um kind of the consumption model of public cloud, you know, api driven self service capabilities operated for you, how that consumption model is starting to spread because I think one of the challenges with hybrid and one of the challenges as customers are looking at these more mission critical data centric kind of workloads was well, I can't always move that applications of public cloud data center or I need that application to live out on the network closer to my end users out where data is being generated maybe in an IOT context. And when you had those requirements, you had to kind of switch operating models, you had to kind of move away from a public cloud service consumption model to a software deployment model. And you know, we have a common platform and things like open shift that can run everywhere. But the missing piece was how do I consume everything as a service everywhere. And so recently we launched this thing called have been brought satellite, which we've been working with the T V. And his team on on how we can actually extend the public cloud experience back into the data center out to the edge and allow people to kind of mix both locational flexibility with public consumption. When you do that, you of course running a much more diverse infrastructure environment. You have to integrate with different storage environments and you wind up with multi tier applications, you know, some stuff on the edge and some stuff in the core. And so data replication and data management start to become really interesting because you're kind of distributing your workloads across this. No complex environment. >>We've seen that relationship between compute and storage change a lot over the past decade. As the evolution goes okay, I gotta ask you this is critical path for companies. They want the storage ready infrastructure. You guys have been doing that for many, many decades party with IBM for sure. But now they're all getting a hybrid cloud big time and it's not it's attributed computing is what it is. It's an operating model. When someone asked you guys what your capabilities are, how do you answer that? In today's world? Because you have storage is well known. You got a great product, people know that, but what is net apps capabilities? When I say I'm going all in and hybrid cloud, complete changeover. >>So what we have been doing is basically rewriting a lot of our software with a few design points in mind. Um the software defined has been definitely, you know, one of the key design points. The second is the um, the hybrid cloud and the internalization of our operating system so they can run both in traditional environments as well as in the cloud. I think the last thing that we wanted to do, it's enabled the speed of scale and that has been by building um, you know, intrinsically in the, in the, in the product, both support or, and also using kubernetes as an infrastructure to achieve that agility that that scale >>talk about this data fabric vision because to me that comes up all the time in my conversations with practitioners. The number one problem that there is a problem that we're solving to solve and the conversation tends to I here was a control playing kubernetes horizontally scalable. This all points to data being available. So how do you create that availability? What does data fabric mean? What does all this mean in hybrid context? >>Well, if you if you think about it data fabric, it's a hybrid cloud, you know, concept, right. This is about enabling data governance, data mobility, data security in an environment where some of the applications will run on premises or at the edge of the smart edge and many of the, you know, perhaps data lakes and analytics, um, you know, and services rich services will be in a central locations or on many or perhaps some large, you know, data centers. So you need to have, you know, the type of, you know, capabilities, data services, you know, to enable that mobility, that governments governance, that that security across this continuum that spans the edge the core and the cloud, >>Jason, you mentioned satellite before. Cloud satellite. Can you go into more detail on it? I know it's kind of a new product, uh what is that about? And tell me what's the benefits and why does it exist and what problems does it solve? >>Yeah. So so in the most simple terms, cloud satellite is the capability to extend iBMS public cloud into on prem infrastructure infrastructure at the edge or in a multi cloud context to other public cloud infrastructures. And so you can consume all the services in the public cloud that you need to to build your application of open shift as a service databases. Deb tools, aI capabilities. Instead of being limited to only being able to consume those services in IBM's cloud regions, you can now add your private data center or add your metro provider or add your AWS or Azure account and now consume those services consistently across all those environments. Um and that really allows you to kind of combine the benefits of public ill with kind of location independence, you see in hybrid and let's solve new problems like, you know, it's really interesting, we're seeing like a I and data being a primary driver. I need my application to live in a certain country or to live next to my mainframe or to live like you know in a metro because all of my, I'm doing like video analytics on a bunch of cameras and I'm not going to stream all that data back to halfway across the country to some cloud region and so lets you extend out in that way and when you do that of course you now move the cloud into a more diverse infrastructure environment. And so like we've been working with Netapp on, how do we then expose um Netapp storage into this environment when I'm running in the data center where I'm running at the edge and I need to store that data replicate the data, secure it. Well how do I kind of plug those two things together? I think john at the beginning you kind of alluded to this idea of you know, things are becoming more application centric, Right? And we're trying to run an I. T. Architecture that's more centered around the application well by combining um clouds, knowledge of kind of where everything is running with a common platform like open shift with a kubernetes aware data fabric in storage layer, you really can achieve that. You can have an application centric kind of management that spans those environments. >>Yeah, I want to come back to that whole impact on I. T. Because this has come up as a major theme here. Think that the I. T. Transformation is going to be more about cloud scale but I want to get octavian on the satellite on Netapp role and how you complement that. How do you guys fit in? He just mentioned that you guys are playing with clouds satellite, obviously this was like an operating model, How does that fit in? >>Um simply put we extend and enable the capabilities that uh IBM satellite uh you know, platform provides, I think Jason referred to the storage aspects um and you know what we are doing, it's enabling not only storage but rich data services around tearing based on temperature or you know, replicated snapshots or you know, capabilities around, you know cashing, you know, high availability encryption and and so forth. So we believe that our our technology integrates very well with red hat open shift um and uh the kubernetes aspect enable the application mobility and in that translation of really distributed computing at scale, you know from you know from the traditional data center um to the edge and uh you know to the massive hubs that IBM is building, >>you know, I gotta say but watching you guys worked together for many decades now and and covering you with the queue for the past 10 years or 11 years now um been a great partnership. I gotta say one thing that's obviously too obvious to me and our team and mainly mainly the world is now you got a new Ceo over at IBM you have a cloud focus that's on unwavering Arvin loves the cloud. We all know that um ecosystems are changing with that. You have already had a big ecosystem and partnerships now it seems to be moving to a level where you gotta have that ecosystem really thrive in the cloud. So I guess we'll use the last couple of minutes if you guys don't mind explaining how the IBM Netapp relationship in the new context of this new partnership, new ecosystem or a new kind of world helps customers and how you guys are working together. >>Yeah, I mean I could start, I mean I think you're right that that cloud is all about platforms and about kind of the overall environment, people operating in the ecosystem is really critical and I think things like satellite have given us new ways to work together. I mean I'd be a minute up, as we said, I've been working together for a long time. We rely on them a lot in our public cloud, for example in our storage tiers but with with the kind of idea of distributed cloud and the boundaries of public cubs spreading to all these new environments. Those are just new places where we can build really interesting, valuable integrations for our clients so that they can deal with day to deal with these more complex apps, you know, in all the places that they exist. So I think it's gonna actually really exciting um to kind of leverage that opportunity to find new ways to work together and and uh and deliver solutions to our clients >>Octavia, >>I would say that data is the ecosystem and we all know that there is more data right now being created outside of the traditional data center, beat in the cloud or at the edge. Um so our mission is, you know, to enable that, you know, hybrid cloud or or that uh, you know, data mobility um and enable, you know, persistence rich data, you know, storage services, whatever data is being created. I think IBM's new satellite platform um you know, comes in and broadens the aperture of people being able to consume IBM services at the edge and or or the remote office. And I think that's very exciting. >>You guys are both experts and solely seasoned executives. Devops DEP sec ops, DEV data Ops whatever you wanna call, data's here. Ecosystems guys, thanks for coming on the key. Really appreciate the insight. >>Thank you. Thank >>you. Okay. IBM think cute coverage jOHN for your host. Thanks for watching. Mhm. Mhm. Mhm.

>> Announcer: From around the globe, it's theCUBE with digital coverage of IBM Think 2021, brought to you by IBM. >> Hi, welcome back to theCUBES coverage of IBM Think 2021 virtual. We're not yet in real life, we're doing another remote interviews with two great guests CUBI alumni. Of course, I'm John for your host of theCUBE. We got Jason MacGee, IBM fellow VP and CTO of IBM's cloud platform and Octavian Tanase senior vice president Hybrid Cloud Engineering at NetApp both CUBE alumni, it's great to see you both. Thanks for coming on theCUBE. >> Yeah, great to be here. >> Thanks for having us. >> So we were just talking before we came on camera that we it feels like we've had this conversation a long time ago we have. Hybrid cloud has been on a trajectory for both of you guys and many times on theCUBE. So now it's mainstream, it's here in the real world, everyone gets it, there's no real debate, now multicloud, people are debating that which means that's right around the corner. So hybrid cloud is here now, Jason this is really the focus and this is also brings together the NetApp in your partnership and talk about the relationship first with hybrid cloud. >> Yeah, I mean, look we've talked a number of times together I think in the industry. Maybe a few years ago people were debating whether hybrid cloud was a real thing, we don't have that conversation anymore. I think enterprises today, especially maybe in the face of COVID and kind of how we work differently now realize that their cloud journey is going to be a mix of on-prem and off-prem systems probably going to be a mix of multiple public cloud providers. And what they're looking for now is how do I do that? And how do I manage that hybrid environment? How do I have a consistent platform across the different environments I want to operate in? And then how do I get more and more of my workload into those environments? And it's been interesting. I think the first waves of cloud where infrastructure centric and externally application focused, they were easier things, and now we're moving into more mission critical more stateful, more data oriented workloads, and that brings with it new challenges on where applications run and how we leverage the club. >> Octavian, you guys had a great relationship with IBM over the years data centric company, NetApp has always been great engineering team, you're on the hybrid cloud engineering. What's the current status of the relationship, give us an update on how the it's vectoring into the hybrid cloud since you're senior vice president of Hybrid Cloud Engineering. >> Well, so first of all, I want to recognize 20 years of a successful partnership with IBM. I think NetApp have been IBM have been companies that have embraced digital transformation and technology trends to enable that digital transformation for our customers, and we've been very successful. I think there is a very strong joint hybrid cloud value proposition for customers on NetApp storage and data services compliment. What IBM does in terms of products and solutions both for on-premise deployments in the cloud. I think together we can build more complete solutions that span data mobility, data governance for the new workrooms that Jason has talked about. >> And how has some of the customer challenges that you're seeing obviously software defined networking software defined storage, DevOps is now turned into DevSecOps. So you have now that programmability requirement with for dynamic applications, application driven infrastructure, all these buzz words point to one thing. The infrastructure has to be resilient and respond to the applications. >> I would say infrastructure will continue to be a top of mind for everybody, whether they're building a private cloud or whether they're trying to leverage something like IBM Cloud. I think people want to consume infrastructure as an API, I think they want a simplicity, security, I think they want to manage their costs very well. I think we're very proud to be partnering with IBM Cloud to build such capabilities. >> Jason how are you guys helping some of these customers as they look at new things and sometimes retrofitting and refactoring previous stuff during transforming but also innovating at the same time. There's a lot of that going on. What are you guys doing to help with the hybrid challenges? >> Yeah, I mean there's a lot of dimensions to that problem but the one that I think has been kind of most interesting over the last year has been how kind of the consumption model public cloud, API driven self service, capabilities operated for you. How that consumption model is starting to spread. Because I think one of the challenges with hybrid and one of the challenges as customers are looking at these more mission critical data centric kind of workloads was well, I can't always move that application to the public cloud data center or I need that application to live out on the network closer to my end users, so out where data is being generated maybe in an IoT context. And when you had those requirements you had to kind of switch operating models, you had to kind of move away from a public cloud service consumption model to a software deployment model, and we have a common platform and things like OpenShift that can run everywhere but the missing piece was how do I consume everything as a service everywhere? And so recently we launched this thing called IBM Cloud Satellite which we've been working with Octavian and his team on how we can actually extend the public cloud experience back into the data center out to the edge and allow people to kind of mix both location flexibility with public cloud consumption. And when you do that, you of course running a much more diverse infrastructure environment, you have to integrate with different storage environments and you wind up with like multi-tiered applications, some stuff on the edge and some stuff in the core. And so data replication and data management start to become really interesting because you're kind of distributing your workloads across this more complex environment. >> We've seen that relationship between compute and storage change a lot over the past decade as the evolution goes. Octavian, I got to ask you this is critical path for companies, they want the storage ready infrastructure, you guys have been doing that for many decades partnering with IBM for sure but now they're all getting hybrid cloud big time and it's attributed computing is what it is, it's the operating model. When someone asks you guys what your capabilities are, how do you answer that in today's world? Because you have storage as well knowing you got a great product people know that, but what is NetApp's capabilities when I say I'm going all in a hybrid cloud complete changeover. >> So what we have been doing is basically rewriting a lot of our software with a few design points in mind. The software defined has been definitely one of the key design points, the second is the hybrid cloud in the containerization of our operating systems so they can run both in traditional environments as well as in the cloud. I think the last thing that we wanted to do it's enabled the speed of scale and that has been by building intrinsically in the product both support or in also using Kubernetes as an infrastructure to achieve that agility that scale. >> So how about this data fabric vision? Because to me, this is comes up all the time in my conversations with practitioners, the number one problem that they're solving to solve in the conversation tends to, I hear words like control plane, Kubernetes, horizontally scalable, this all points to data being available. So how do you create that availability? What does data fabric mean? What does all this mean in a hybrid context? >> Well, if you think about it data fabric it's a hybrid cloud concept, this is about enabling data governance, data mobility, data security in an environment where some of the applications were run on premises or at the edge or the smart edge and many of the perhaps data lakes and analytics, and services, rich services will be in a central locations or on many or perhaps some large data centers. So you need to have the type of capabilities data services to enable that mobility that governance that security across this continuum that spans the edge the core and the cloud. >> Jason, you mentioned satellite before cloud satellite. Could you go into more detail on that? I know it's kind of a new product, what is that about, and tell me what's the benefits and why is it exist and what problems does it solve? >> Yeah, so in the most simple terms, cloud satellite is the capability to extend IBM's public cloud into on-prem infrastructure at the edge or in a multicloud context to other public cloud infrastructures. And so you can consume all the services in the public cloud that you need to to build their application, OpenShift as a service database, as DevTools, AI capabilities instead of being limited to only being able to consume those services in IBM's cloud regions you can now add your private data center or add your Metro provider or add your AWS or Azure accounts and now consume those services consistently across all those environments. And that really allows you to kind of combine the benefits of public cloud with the kind of location independence you see in hybrid and lets us solve new problems. It's really interesting we're seeing like AI and data being a primary driver. I need my application to live in a certain country or to live next to my mainframe or to live like in a Metro because all of my, I'm doing like video analytics on a bunch of cameras and I'm not going to stream all that data back to halfway across the country to some cloud region now. And so it lets you extend out in that way. And when you do that, of course, you now move the cloud into a more diverse infrastructure environment. And so like we've been working with NetApp on how do we then expose NetApp storage into this environment when I'm running in the data center or I'm running at the edge and I need to store that data replicate the data, secure it. Well, how do I kind of plug those two things together? I think John, at the beginning you kind of alluded to this idea of things are becoming more application centric, right? And we're trying to run IT architecture that's more centered around the application. Well, by combining clouds knowledge of kind of where everything's running with that common platform like OpenShift with a Kubernetes aware data fabric and storage layer, you really can achieve that. You can have an application centric kind of management that spans those environments. >> Yeah, I want to come back to that whole impact on IT because this has come up as a major theme here. Think that the IT transformation is going to be more about cloud scale, but I want to get to Octavian on the satellite on NetApp's role and how you compliment that, how do you guys fit in? He just mentioned that you guys are playing with cloud satellite, obviously this was like an operating model. How does that fit in? >> Simply we extend and enable the capabilities that IBM satellite platform provides. I think Jason referred to the storage aspects and what we are doing it's enabling not only storage but rich data services around peering based on temperature or replicated snapshots or capabilities around caching, high availability, encryption and so forth. So we believe that our technology integrate very well with Red Hat OpenShift and the Kubernetes aspect enable the application mobility and in that translation of really distributed computing at scale from the traditional data center to the edge and to the massive hubs that IBM is building. >> You know, I got to say but watching you guys work together for many decades now and covering you with theCUBE for the past 10 years or 11 years now been a great partnership. I got to say one thing that's obviously too obvious to me and our team and mainly the world is now you've got a new CEO over at IBM, you have a cloud focus that's on unwavering, Octavian loves the cloud we all know that. Ecosystems are changing, IBM already had a big ecosystem and partnerships. Now it seems to be moving to a level where you got to have that ecosystem really thrive in the cloud, so I guess we'll use the last couple of minutes if you guys don't mind explaining how the IBM NetApp relationship in the new context of this new partnership a new ecosystem or a new kind of world helps customers and how you guys are working together? >> Yeah, I mean I think you're right that cloud is all about platforms and about kind of the overall environment people operate in and the ecosystem is really critical. And I think things like satellite have given us new ways to work together. I mean, IBM and NetApp, as we set up, been working together for a long time we rely on the MoD in our public cloud, for example, in our storage tiers, but with the kind of idea of distributed cloud and the boundaries of public cloud spreading to all these new environments those are just new places where we can build really interesting valuable integrations for our clients so that they can deal with data, deal with these more complex apps in all the places that they exist. So I think it's been actually really exciting to kind of leverage that opportunity to find new ways to work together and deliver solutions for our clients. >> Octavian. >> I will say that data is the ecosystem and we all know that there's more data right now being created outside of the traditional data center be it in the cloud or at the edge. So our mission is to enable that hybrid cloud or that data mobility and enable know persistence rich data storage services, whatever data is being created. I think IBM's new satellite platform comes in and broadens the aperture of people being able to consume IBM's services at the edge and or remote office and I think that's very exciting. >> You guys are both experts and solely seasoned executives to DevOps, DevSecOps, DevDataOps, what are we going to call data's here ecosystems. Guys, thanks for coming on the queue, really appreciate the insight. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Okay, IBM, Think CUBE coverage, I'm John for your host. Thanks for watching. (upbeat music)

>>from around the globe. It's the >>Cube with digital >>coverage of AWS reinvent 2020 sponsored by Intel, >>AWS and >>our community partners. >>Welcome back to the cubes ongoing coverage of this year's AWS reinvent. You know, normally we'd be in the middle of the San Sands Convention Center. We have two sets and 50,000 of our closest friends. We'd be deking out on cloud. Seems like a long time ago, but the show must go on. And it does. Joe Duffy is here. He's the co founder and CEO of Gloomy, and Justin Fits you is the vice president engineering for Cloud Engineering for snowflake. Welcome, gentlemen. Good to see you. >>It's good to be here, >>Joe. I love what you guys are doing. You know, leading your customers to the cloud and really attacking that I t labor problem that we've dealt with for years and years by playing a role in transforming what I would say is I t ops into cloud ups with programmable infra infrastructure practices. So take >>a >>moment to tell us. Why did you and your co founder start the company how you got it off the ground? People are always interested in how you got it funded. You got a couple of Seattle VCs, Madrona and Tola involved. Any a just got involved. So congrats on that. What's the story of your company? >>Yeah. So my background and my co founder Eric's background. You know, we spent multiple decades at Microsoft just really obsessing over developer platforms and productivity and trying to make you know developers lives as as as as productive as possible. You know, help them harness the power of software >>toe create, >>you know, innovative new applications and really spent time on technologies like Visual Studio and Ahmed. And and, you know, it really struck us that the cloud is changing everything about how we develop software. And yet from our perspective, coming from developer landed had almost changed nothing. You know, most of our customers were still, you know, developing software like they did 15 years ago, where it was a typical enter your application, they'd kind of write the code and then go to their I t team and say, Hey, we need to run this somewhere. Can you provisioned a few virtual machines? Can you prevision You know, maybe a database or two and and And so And then we went and talked Thio, you know, infrastructure teams and found out Hey, you know, folks were really toiling away with tools that air a pale in comparison when it comes to the productivity that we we were accustomed Thio on the developer side. And then frequently we heard from leaders that there were silos between the organizations. They couldn't build things quickly enough. They couldn't move quickly enough in cloud Native and the new public cloud capabilities just really were pushed pushing on that, really, you know. But the most innovative companies we kept hearing were the ones who figured this out, who really figured out how to move faster in the cloud. Companies like Snowflake really are leveraging the cloud toe transform entire businesses. You look at uber lyft Airbnb, these companies that really harnessed the cloud toe not just from a technical productivity standpoint, but really transform the business. Eh? So that was the opportunity that we saw Kalemie was Let's take a step back. We call this cloud engineering. Let's imagine a world where every developers, a cloud developer and infrastructure teams are enabling that new way of building. >>Great. So you mentioned cloud engineering. Now, Justin, you've done a bit a bit of cloud engineering yourself in your day. You know, the Cube has been following Snowflake very closely since it launched really mid last decade. And we've we've covered your novel, architectural approach and your cloud only mantra. Talk about that. And have there been any changes in how you're thinking about cloud adoption and how that's as that's increased and you've seen new use cases emerged. >>Yeah, so I think, you know, obviously Snowflake was was built on the foundation of cloud first, and in fact, cloud Onley are only platform and only infrastructure is is based on the cloud. But, you know, for us, it was absolutely key on. How do you develop a platform and a product that's completely elastic? Lee, scalable on drily, really allows for kind of the paper use and paper consumption model. We didn't really it would be very difficult for us to offer this and Thio offer a product in this way. On def, you start to think about kind of from a cloud engineering perspective. Um, we don't have the typical network engineers. A typical data center engineers that you that you might have seen previously. Instead, we're shifting our model in our what we do include engineering away from kind of an operations model or even devotes model towards the software engineering model. E. I think that's the That's the big shift to cloud engineering is that we're looking to hire and we're building a team of software engineers to build systems and platforms and and tooling Thio have the system self managed as much as possible, and it changes to our infrastructure that we look at any changes in our platform are all through, commits and and deployed via pipelines, as opposed to having Operator's log on and make these changes. And so that's the shift that I think we're seeing. And that's to kind of match the overall stuff like Model of Cloud, first and on and where the product is like just going. >>Like you said in cloud only, Justin, you use Pollux me in your own engineering and also in your product externally. Is that correct? And how so? >>Yeah, we actually use it in, specifically and, um, in our platform, in order to kind of deployed to manage and, uh, just operate a kind of our overall cloud infrastructure. We specifically use it more focused on the good days and and continue ization side of things. But that use cases kind of rapidly expanding across the organization. >>So I'm curious of what do you guys we're seeing in the market place? Joe, you know, thinking about cloud broadly, What's the impact that you're seeing on businesses? Who are the big players that you see out there? Maybe you could talk about some of the differentiation that you've noticed. >>Yeah, I think this notion of plot engineering, you know, even 3.5 years ago when we got started was in its infancy. You know, we definitely saw that. Hey, you know, the world is moving and shifting left, you know, it's just was saying and really, people are looking for new ways to empower developers, but that empowerment has to come with guard rails, right? And so what we're seeing is oftentimes, teams are now modernizing their entire platform infrastructure platform, and they're looking to technologies like kubernetes to do that. But increasingly, you know, aws, Azure gp. You know, when we started, um, there weren't any great managed kubernetes clusters. And now today, fast forward. You know Onley 3.5 years and and many of our customers are using flew me to help them get up and running with the chaos in AWS, for example, you look at a lot of folks transforming on Prem as well again many times, adopting kubernetes is sort of a if they intend to stay on Prem. You know, Thio, at least modernize their approach to application infrastructure delivery. That's where Pollux me really can help. It could be a bridge. Thio hate from on Prem to the public cloud. There's certainly a lot of folks doing great work in the space, you know, I think VM Ware has really kind of emerged as sort of vanguard thought leader in this in this space, especially with, you know, hep dio and now kind of pivotal joining the story. We see other, you know, great companies like hash in court, for we're doing good work in this space. Um, certainly we integrate with a lot of their technologies on you. Combine those with the public cloud providers. There's also a lot of just smaller startups in the space which you know, strikes in my heart. I love I love supporting the startup ecosystem. You know, whether that's for cell or net lif I or server list. You know, really trying to help developers harness more of the cloud. I think that's an emerging trend that we're gonna see accelerating in the coming years. >>Yeah. Thank you. You've mentioned a number of interesting emerging tools companies in the ecosystem. I mean, Justin talked about kubernetes. Are there other tooling that you're using that that might be, you know, some of your customers might like toe to know about. >>Yeah, I think so. So one thing I wanted to actually follow up with what Joe said here is is around kind of the multi cloud nature of what we do is is the tools, like gloomy are critical for us to be able to abstract away specific cloud provider AP ice and such and so given Snowflake operates on all three major public clouds and offers a seamless experience amongst all three of them. We have to have something that abstracts some of that complexity and some of those technical details away. Andi, that's why I kind of blew me, made sense in in this case and has helped us kind of achieved that cloud neutrality piece. Um, in terms of other tools that that you're thinking that we're talking about, I think Bellamy is doing a great job kind of on some of these on some of the kind of that interaction and infrastructure and sensation. But we're looking for tooling to kind of look for the overall workflow automation piece on orchestration. So what sits on top of say, you're using intervals using terra form? You may be using Polonia's well, but what kind of orchestrates all these pieces together? Onda, How do you kind of build workflow automation? And I think there's a lot of companies and technology providers that air starting up in this area to kind of stitch all these pieces together so that you kind of have a seamless kind of work flow across across your infrastructure. >>Got it. So, Joe, I'm kind of curious you talked a little bit about your background at Microsoft, and you're even a TMC where you're helping, you know, people manage Luns. It was a sort of skill set that is not in high demand today. Early. Shouldn't be people really need to transform? I've said that a lot in the queue, but But, you know, maybe talk a little bit about the experiences that you've had in the past that informed the direction that Pollux me is taking and where you see it going specifically. I mean, I've been talking a lot about the next decade of cloud is not gonna be the same as the last decade of the cloud. How did you How do you see it? >>Yeah, I think I recognize a clear trend, you know, in with cloud computing. Uh, you know, back I can't remember 13 years ago, maybe 15 years ago, When, when When the Azure project started. You know Dave Cutler, who actually founded the anti project at Microsoft, Actually, was was one of the first engineers that started Azure. And he called it a cloud operating system. And, you know, I think that vision of hey, the cloud is the new operating system is something that we're still just chipping away at. And that was that was a clear trend, you know, having seen these transformations in the past, you know the shift from, you know, dos to windows from windows to mobile Thio, client server thio now the cloud every step of the way. We always transform the way we build applications. And I think where we're at now is horse, really in the midst of a transition that I think we'll look back. You never know when it's happening right? But you can always look back in hindsight and see that it did happen. And I think the trend that we're going through now with service meshes and just, you know, micro services and service list is really we're building distributed applications. These clouds made of applications, they're distributed applications. And that was the trend that I, I recognized, also recognizes another trend, which is, you know, we spent 30 years building great tools. You know, I d s test frameworks sharing and reuse package managers. We figured out static analysis and how to fix security problems in this in in programming languages that we've got today. Let's not go rebuild all that. Let's leverage that, and and so that's what Eric and I said they want, you know, Let's stand on the shoulders of giants. Let's leverage all this good work that has come before us. Let's just apply that to the infrastructure domain and really try toe smooth things out. Give us a new sort of level playing field to build on. From here is we go forward and I'm excited that Parliament gives us that foundation that we can now build on top of >>Great and Justin, of course, were covered. Aws reinvent you guys. It was kind of your your first platform. It's your largest, the largest component of your business. And I have been saying, Ah lot that, you know the early days of cloud was about infrastructure last 32 throw in some database. But really, there's a new workload that's emerging. And you guys are at the heart of that where people are putting governed data giving access to that data, making it secure, uh, sharing that data across an ecosystem so that new workload is really driving new innovation. I wonder how you see that what you see the next half a decade or decades looking like in terms of innovation? >>Yeah, I think I think it za valid point, which is, um, it's less about infrastructure and more about the services that you're providing with that infrastructure. And what what value are you able to add and So I think that's it, Snowflake. The thing that we're really focused on, which is abstract away, all these tunes and all these knobs and such, and the how much remember you have on a specific and a piece of infrastructure or describes or anything like that. So what's the business value? And how can we present that business value in a uniform way, regardless of kind of the underlying service provider on baby to a different class of business users, someone who wants a low data and just two analysts against that they really don't want to understand what's happening underneath. And I think that's that's where this club engineering piece comes in. Um, and what my team is doing is really focused on How do we abstract away that kind of lower level infrastructure and scalability pieces and allow the application developers to develop this application that is providing business value in a transparent and seamless way and in elastic way such that we can scale up and down we can. We have the ability, obviously, to replicate both within regions and clouds, but also across different clouds. So from a business resiliency and and up time point of view. That's that's something that's been really important. Um, and I think also how do we security is? Becoming is obviously a huge, huge importance, given the classifications type of day that people are putting within our platform. So how are we able Thio ensure that there is a pipeline where developers have reviews and commits of any kind of changes going into the system and their arm's length away, and could be fully audited for various clients and regular regulatory needs? And that's something that kind of this suffer engineering cloud engineering concept has really helped develop and allowed us Thio obviously be successful with various different types of industries. >>Joe, we're almost out of time. I wonder if you could bring us home. I mean, some of the things Justin was talking about I mean, I definitely see a lot of potential disruption coming from the world of developers. Uh, he was talking. He was talking about consumption models different than many of the SAS pricing models. And how do you How do you see it? Developers air kind of the really the new source of innovation. Your final thoughts. >>Yeah. I think we're democratizing access to the cloud for everybody. I think you know it's not just about developers, but it's It's really all engineers of all backgrounds, its developers, its infrastructure engineers, its operations engineers, its security engineers. You know, Justin's mentioning compliance and security. These air really critical elements of how we deliver software into the cloud. So I think you know what you're going to see is you're gonna see a lot of new, compelling experiences built thanks to cloud capabilities. You know, the fact that you've got a I and M l and all these infinitely scalable data services like snowflake and, you know, just an arm's length away that you can use as building blocks in your applications. You know, application developers love that. You know, if we can just empower them to run fast, they will run fast, and we'll build great applications. And infrastructure teams and security engineers will be central to enabling that that new future. I think you also see that you know infrastructure and cloud services will become accessible to an entirely new audience. You know, kids graduating from college, they understand Java script. They understand python now they can really just harness the cloud to build amazing new experiences. So I think we're still, you know, still early days on the transition to the cloud. I know where many years on the journey, but we've got many, many years, you know, in our future. And it's very exciting. >>Well, thank you, guys, Joe and Justin. I really appreciate it. Congratulations on your respective success. I know is Joe said you got a lot more work to do, but I really appreciate you coming on the Cube. >>Awesome. Thank you. You're >>welcome. All right, so we're here covering reinvent 2020. The virtual edition. Keep it right there for more great content. 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