>> Narrator: Live from Orlando, Florida, it's theCUBE, covering Microsoft Ignite. Brought to you by, Cohesity. >> Good morning everyone and welcome back to theCUBE's live coverage of Microsoft Ignite. We are here in the Orange County Convention Center. I'm your host Rebecca Knight, along with Stu Miniman. Stu, this is Microsoft's Big Show. 26,000 people from around the globe, all descending on Orlando. This is the big infrastructure show. Thoughts, impressions, now that we're on day two of a three day show. >> Yeah, Rebecca. Last year I had this feeling that it was a little bit too much talking about the Windows 10 transition and the latest updates to Office 365. I could certainly want to make sure that we really dug in more to what's going on with Azure, what's happening in 6the developer space. Even though they do have a separate show for developers, it's Microsoft build. They actually have a huge partner show. And so, Microsoft has a lot of shows. So it's, what is this show that is decades old? And really it is the combination of Microsoft as a platform today. Satya Nadella yesterday talked about empowering the world. This morning, Scott Hanselman was in a smaller theater, talking about app devs. And he came out and he's like, "Hey, developers, isn't it a little bit early for you this morning?" Everybody's laughing. He said, "Even though we're kicking off at 9:00 a.m., Eastern." He said, "That's really early, especially for anybody coming from the West Coast." He was wearing his Will Code For Tacos shirt. And we're going to have Scott on later today, so we'll talk about that. But, where does Microsoft sit in this landscape? Is something we've had. I spent a lot of time looking at the cloud marketplace. Microsoft has put themselves as the clear number two behind AWS. But trying to figure out because SaaS is a big piece of what Microsoft does. And they have their software estate in their customer relationship. So how many of those that are what we used to call window shops. And you had Windows people are going to start, Will it be .NET? Will it be other operating systems? Will it come into Azure? Where do they play? And the answer is, Microsoft's going to play a lot of places. And what was really kind of put on with the point yesterday is, it's not just about the Microsoft solutions, it is about the ecosystem, they really haven't embraced their role, very supportive of open source. And trust is something that I know both you and I have been pointing in on because, in the big tech market, Microsoft wants to stand up and say, "We are the most trusted out there. And therefore, turn to us and we will help you through all of these journeys." >> So you're bringing up so many great points and I want to now go through each and every one of them. So, absolutely, we are hearing that this is the kinder, gentler Microsoft, we had Dave Totten on yesterday. And he was, as you just described, just talking about how much Microsoft is embracing and supporting customers who are using a little bit of Microsoft here, a little bit of other companies. I'm not going to name names, but they're seemingly demanding. I just want best to breed, and this is what I'm going to do. And Microsoft is supporting that, championing that. And, of course we're seeing this as a trend in the broader technology industry. However, it feels different, because it's Microsoft doing this. And they've been so proprietary in the past. >> Yeah, well, and Rebecca, it's our job on theCUBE actually, I'm going to name names. (laughs) And actually Microsoft is-- >> Okay. >> Embracing of this. So, the thing I'm most interested in at the show was Azure Arc. And I was trying to figure out, is this a management platform? And at the end of the day really, it is, there's Kubernetes in there, and it's specifically tied to applications. So they're going to start with databases specifically. My understanding, SQL is the first piece and saying, it sounds almost like the next incarnation of platform as a service to our past. And say, I can take this, I can put it on premises in Azure or on AWS. Any of those environments, manage all of them the same. Reminds me of what I hear from VMware with Hangzhou. Vmworld, Europe is going on right now in Barcelona. Big announcement is to the relationship with VMware on Azure. If I got it right, it's actually in beta now. So, Arc being announced and the next step of where Microsoft and VMware are going together, it is not a coincidence. They are not severing the ties with VMware. VMware, of course partners with all the cloud providers, most notably AWS. Dave Totten yesterday, talked about Red Hat. You want Kubernetes? If you want OpenShift, if you are a Red Hat customer and you've decided that, the way I'm going to leverage and use and have my applications run, are through OpenShift, Microsoft's is great. And the best, most secure place to run that environment is on Azure. So, that's great. So Microsoft, when you talk about choice, when you talk about flexibility, and you talk about agility cause, it is kinder and gentler, but Satya said they have that tech intensity. So all the latest and greatest, the new things that you want, you can get it from Microsoft, but they are also going to meet you where you are. That was Jeremiah Dooley, the Azure advocate, said that, "There's, lots of bridges we need to make, Microsoft has lots of teams. It's not just the DevOps, it's not just letting the old people do their own thing, from your virtualization through your containerization and everything in between microservices server list, and the like. Microsoft has teams, they have partners. Sure that you could buy everything in Microsoft, but they know that there are lots of partners and pieces. And between their partners, their ecosystem, their channel, and their go-to-market, they're going to pull this together to help you leverage what you need to move your business forward. >> So, next I want to talk about Scott Hanselman who was up on the main stage, we're going to have him on the show and he was as you said, adorned in coder dude, attire with a cool t-shirt and snappy kicks. But his talk was app development for everyone. And this is really Microsoft's big push, democratizing computing, hey, anyone can do this. And Satya Nadella, as we've talked about on the show. 61% of technologist's jobs are not in the technology industry. So this is something that Microsoft sees as a trend that's happening in the employment market. So they're saying, "Hey, we're going to help you out here." But Microsoft is not a hardware company. So how does this really change things for Microsoft in terms of the products and services-- >> Well right, >> It offers. >> So really what we're talking about here, we're talking about developers right? 61% of jobs openings for developers are outside the tech sector. And the high level message that Scott had is your tools, your language, your apps. And what we have is, just as we were talking about choice of clouds, it's choice of languages. Sure they'd love to say .NET is wonderful, but you want your Java, your PHP, all of these options. And chances are, not only are you going to use many of them, but even if you're working on a total solution, different groups inside your company might be using them and therefore you need tools that can spam them. The interesting example they use was Chipotle. And if there's a difference between when you're ordering and going through the delivery service, and some of the back-end pieces, and data needs to flow between them, and it can't be, "Oh wait, I've got silos of my data, I've got silos of all these other environments." So, developer tools are all about, having the company just work faster and work across environments. I was at AnsibleFest show earlier this year. And, Ansible is one of those tools that actually, different roles where you have to have the product owner, the developer, or the the operations person. They all have their way into that tool. And so, Microsoft's showing some very similar things as to, when I build something, it's not, "Oh, wait, we all chose this language." And so many of the tools was, " Okay, well, I had to standardize on something." But that didn't fit into what the organization needed. So I need to be able to get to what they all had. Just like eventually, when I'm picking my own taco, I can roll it, bowl it, soft or hard shell-- >> It was a cool analogy. >> And choose all my toppings in there. So it is Taco Tuesday here-- >> Yes. >> At Microsoft Ignite and the developers like their choices of tools, just like they like their tacos. >> And they like their extra guac. So going back to one of the other points you made at the very opening. And this is the competitive dynamic that we have here. We had David Davis and Scott Lowe on yesterday from a ActualTech Media. Scott was incredibly bullish about Microsoft. And saying it could really overtake AWS, not tomorrow, but within the next decade. Of course, the choice for JEDI certainly could accelerate that. What do you make of it? I mean, do you think that's still pie in the sky here? AWS is so far ahead. >> So look, first of all, when you look at the growth rates, first of all, just to take the actual number, we know what AWS's, revenue is. Last quarter, AWS did $9 billion. And they're still growing at about a 35% clip. When I look at Microsoft, they have their intelligent cloud bucket, which is Azure, Windows Server, SQL Server and GitHub. And that was 10.8 billion. And you say, "Oh, okay, that's really big." But last year, Azure did about $12 billion dollars. So, AWS is still two to three times larger when you look at infrastructure as a service. But SaaS hugely important piece of what's going on in the cloud opportunity. AWS really is more of the platform and infrastructure service, they absolutely have some of the PaaS pieces. Azure started out as PaaS and has this. So you're trying to count these buckets, and Azure is still growing at, last quarter was 64%. So if you look at the projection, is it possible for Azure to catch up in the next three years? Well, Azure's growth rate is also slowing down, so I don't think it matters that much. There is a number one and a number two, and they're both clear, valid choices for a customer. And, this morning at breakfast, I was talking to a customer and they are very heavily on Microsoft shop. But absolutely, they've got some AWS on the side. They're doing Azure, they've got a lot of Azure, being here at our Microsoft show. And when I go to AWS, even when I talked to the companies that are all in on AWS, " Oh, you got O 365?" "Of course we do." "Oh, if you're starting to do O 365, are there any other services that you might be using out of Azure?" "Yeah, that's possible." I know Google is in the mix. Ali Baba's in the mix. Oracle, well, we're not going to talk about Oracle Cloud, but we talked about Oracle, because they will allow their services to run on Azure specifically. We talked about that a lot yesterday, especially how that ties into JEDI. So, look, I think it is great when we have a healthy competitive marketplace. Today really, it is a two horse race. It is, AWS and Azure are the main choices for customers. Everyone else is really a niche player. Even a company like IBM, there's good solutions that they have, but they play in a multi cloud world. Google has some great data services, and absolutely a important player when you talk about multi cloud for all they've done with Kubernetes and Istio. I'm going to be at Kube Con in a couple of weeks and Google is front and center there. But if you talk about the general marketplace, Microsoft has a lot of customers, they had a lot of applications and therefore, can they continue to mature that market and grow their environment? Absolutely. AWS has so many customers, they have the marketplace is stronger. It's an area that I want to dig in a little bit more at this show is the Azure Marketplace, how much we talked about the ecosystem. But, can I just procure through the cloud and make it simpler? Big theme we've talked about is, cloud in the early days was supposed to be cheap and simple. And it is neither of those things. So, how do we make it easier, so that we can go from the 20% of applications in the public cloud, up to 50% or more? Because it is not about all everything goes to the public cloud, but making customers put the applications and their data in the right place at the right time with the right services. And then we haven't even talked about edge computing which Microsoft has a big push on, especially with their partners. We talked to HP, a little bit about that yesterday. But really the surface area that this show and Microsoft covers is immense and global. >> It is indeed, and we are going, this is our second day of three days of coverage and we're going to be getting into all of those things. We've got a lot of great guests. We have Cute Host, Keith Townsend, Dave Cahill, a former Wikibon guy, a lot of other fantastic people. So I'm excited to get it on with you today, Stu. >> Thank you, Rebecca. Great stuff. >> I'm Rebecca Knight, for Stu Miniman. Stay tuned for more of theCUBE's live coverage of Microsoft Ignite. (upbeat music`)

>> Announcer: Live from Las Vegas, it's The Cube, covering Dell EMC World 2017, brought to you by Dell EMC. (electronic music) >> Welcome back to The Cube's coverage of Dell EMC World here in Las Vegas. I'm your host, Rebecca Knight, along with my co-host John Walls. Today we are talking to Chhandomay Mandal. He is the Senior Consultant Product Marketing here at Dell EMC, as well as Pat Harkins who is the CTO Informatics and Technology Services at Royal Victoria Health Center. Thanks so much for joining us. >> Thanks for having us. >> Glad to be here. >> So, Pat, I want to start with you. Tell us a little bit about Royal Health. >> Sure. Well, Royal Victoria Regional Health Center in Barrie, Ontario. We're about an hour north of Toronto, Ontario. It's a regional health center, variety of services. We provide oncology, cardiac, child and youth mental health, and what we're doing up there is providing a regional role, regional services for Meditech. We're host Meditech for a number of other hospitals in our area, and we're currently looking to expand that, and increase our volume, but also change platforms as well. >> So tell us about some of the biggest challenges that you see. >> Some of the biggest challenges that we're seeing right now is within Ontario, is the actual funding model, of course. Everything's a little bit tighter. But from a technology perspective, is actually staying with technology, with limited budgets and so forth, and staying with the latest, greatest, providing the best service to our customers, our physicians, our clinicians, which in turn is the best patient care. >> Chhandomay, you look at a client like Pat, who has very specific needs in health care. You've got time issues, you've got privacy issues. How do you deal, or what do you see as far as health care IT fitting in to what you're doing and the services you're providing to somebody like Pat, specifically knowing that these are very unique challenges and critically important challenges? >> Sure. We at Dell EMC look at what the problem is holistically. As Pat was mentioning, in the health care IT, one of the challenges we see is providing consistent high performance with low latency so that the clinicians, physicians can access the patient data in a timely way, quickly, they do not spend more time entering the data or accessing the data, rather spending more time with the patients. Then there is another problem that Pat alluded to. For any EHR, electronic health record systems, it is actually a consolidation of many workloads. You have the EHR workload itself, then you have analytics that needs to be run on it. There are other virtualized applications, and then there is distal partualization, because all the physicians now says they need to access the patient data. So effectively, we need to have platforms, and in this particular case, essentially All-Flash platforms that can offer very high performance, consistently low latency, high storage efficiency in terms of reduced footprint so that Pat and other health providers can consume less rack space, less space in the data center, reduced power and cooling, all those things, and at the end of the day, ensuring the copy data that they have between all the databases, those are efficiently managed and kind of like transforming the health care IT business workflow. That's what we at Dell EMC come with our All-Flash portfolio for health providers like Royal Victoria Health. >> So Pat, on your side of the fence then, from your perspective, limited resources, right? You've got to be very, very protective of what you have, and obviously you have your own challenges. How do you balance all that out in today's environment, where speed matters? Efficiency matters now more than ever. >> And that's, efficiency matters big time with our physicians, and what's happening is we look for partners like Dell EMC to help us with that. One thing that was happening in our experience with efficiency and with timely presentation of data, we weren't getting that with our previous vendor. And when we went to Dell EMC we work with them as a partner and said, "How can we improve on that? "What can we look for?" And we looked at Flash as being that solution, not only providing the performance that we were looking for but also providing built-in security that we were looking for, but also providing even more efficiency, so when the physician, the clinicians were getting that data, they get it in a timely manner, and that means that they're actually spending more time with the patient, they're not searching for the data, they're not searching for reports and so forth. >> Are you hearing any feedback from the patients themselves about how things have changed at the health center? >> Well, for me I'm still stuck in the dungeon. I'm in IT, so we're in the basement, right? so I don't necessarily-- >> John: Glad you could get out for the week. (laughing) >> Exactly. You know, we grow mushrooms in that area. So what's happening with, I don't necessarily talk with the patient, but we're getting the positive feedback from our clinicians and physicians who are then, if they're happy, that means they're providing usually, providing better patient care, and so that means the patients are happy. (audio cuts out) >> Is understanding the true, the point of patient health care from the point they're born to the point that their life ends, and what we're understanding is how getting that data and being able to provide that information to clinicians, see trends, be able to treat, be more proactive instead of a reactive in health care. That's the goal, and with technology and the storage and collecting the data and analytics we'll actually be able to provide that in the future. >> Chhandomay, from your perspective here, what is it about XtremIO you think that makes this a good match? And now you've had X2, right, and sorry Pat. >> Pat: No, it's fine. >> You just deployed, what, six months ago, you said? But now you've got an X2 version to consider, perhaps for your next deployment. What's the fit? Why does it work? >> So you mention Dell EMC XtremIO. So the core premise of XtremIO is we will be able to provide high performance, consistently in low latency no matter what workload you are running, no matter how many workloads you are consolidating on the same array. It is the same high-performance, low-latency, and we have in line all the time, data reduction technologies that are all working on in-memory metadata, which essentially boils down to we are doing all those storage operations at the control plane level without touching the data plane where the data actually lives or exists. So that in turn helps us to consolidate a lot of the copies. You mentioned analytics, right? You have your production database for your patient data, then you need to load those data in an ETL system for running the analytics, then you possibly have your instant development copies, copies for back-up. Now with XtremIO, all the copies, we do not store anything that's not unique, through that entire cluster, and all the metadata is stored in memory, so for us we can create copies that do not take any extra space, and you can run your workloads on the copies themselves with the same performance as in production volume and with all those data reduction and all those technologies that all those data services run. So what that in turn makes Pat's life easier is he can reduce the footprint, he can reduce or consolidate all the workloads on the ATA itself, and his application developers can bring the medical applications online much more faster, he can run his analytics and reports faster, being proactive about the care, and in a nutshell, pretty much taking the storage maintenance, storage planning, storage operations out of the picture so that they can innovate and they can spend time innovating in IT, helping patient care, as opposed to doing routine maintenance and planning. >> So it lets him focus on what he wants to do. You're not spending a majority of your time on mundane tasks, you're actually improving your operations. Give me a real-life example if you can. We talk about more efficiency and better speed, these are all good things and great terms to talk about, but in terms of actually improving patient care, or providing enhanced patient care, what does it mean? How does it translate? >> Well, how it translates is in a lot of cases with the physicians and what we've seen already with them, just with them, they're able to, because we actually improve performance, we're actually able to get more data in analytics, as we say, but then we're able to produce those reports and turn it around in a lot of cases, a lot quicker than what we've been able to do before. An example was, once we moved to XtremIO and our decision support team. Used to take 14 hours to run some of the reports that they were getting. They would start 'em at four o'clock in the evening, they would run to six a.m. in the morning, roughly. When we put the XtremIO in and they ran the same reports they started at 4 o'clock. By six p.m. that night they were completed. They actually called me because they thought they had something wrong. (laughing) It's never been that quick. >> John: Boss, this is too good. >> Exactly. >> John: I messed up. >> And so they actually ran the report three times, and they cued the QA against the report to understand that yeah, it is that efficient now. Now that we've turned that around we actually provide that to the clinicians. We're getting better patient care and they're able to get their information and react quicker to it as well. >> Talking about the massive amounts of data that's being generated that now needs to be analyzed in order to optimize performance, how much do your developers know about data, and are you doing more training for them so that they know what they're doing? >> Well, we always provide training. We're always working on that, but the thing is, we are providing more training and we're providing it to the point that they actually have to be able to mine that data. There's so much data, it's how to manage the data, mine the data. Our analysts at RVH is that we look to Meditech, our EHR vendor as well, to help us on that, but at the same time we're looking to, we're increasing our data warehouses, we're increasing our repositories and registries so that when we do have that data, we can get at it. >> I'm wondering too if using this kind of cutting-edge technology has had an impact on your recruitment. Michael Dell in his keynote mentioned how increasingly, employees are saying the kinds of technologies that's being used is having an impact. >> No, absolutely. I know our vendors, our staff are very excited about the technology. Where we were going before, they weren't, not that they weren't happy, but we were always dealing with mundane tasks. We had some issues that were always repetitive issues that we couldn't seem to get through. Now that we've actually upgraded to the Flash storage and moving through that, they're excited. They love the management, the ease of use, they have a lot of great ideas now it's actually, they're becoming innovative in their thoughts because they know they have the performance and the technology in the back end to do the job for them. >> I hate to ask you what's next because you're six months into your deployment, but this is a constantly evolving landscape, constantly improving. Obviously the pressure is at Dell EMC is responding really well, competitive pressures. What is your road map? If you look two, three years down the road in terms of the kinds of improvements you want to get, the kinds of efficiencies that you can get gains in, and then realistically from a budgetary standpoint, how do you balance all that together? >> Budgetary, there's always the constant discussion with our CFO, and so he's been very supportive, but where we see it going is we want to be able to actually, maybe not even necessarily go to the Cloud but become a private Cloud for our partners and be able to provide a lot of these regional services that we couldn't before with the technology that we had, and be able to expand the services. In Ontario we're seeing some budget constraints, as I mentioned. A lot of these smaller sites, the patients, the customers, as we would say are expecting the service, but with technology and the dollars, they might not be able to do it on their budget, but as we bring stuff back into our data center and be able to provide the technology, we've been able to spread that out, not only from storage, compute side, as well as virtualization, VDI desktops and so forth. That's where I see we're going over the next little while. >> How much learning goes on between your colleagues at CTOs at other health centers, and even health centers and hospitals in the states? Do you talk a lot about-- >> You know what? We do talk a lot. We share stories. Some good, some bad, but we try, we all have the same problems, and why re-create the wheel when you could actually learn from other people? So a lot of the CTOs, we do get together, informally and formally, and understand where we're going and then we also reach out through our vendors and through some of our user groups and so forth to the US and to some of our cohort CTOs down there to understand what they're doing, because they look at it from a different lens at times. >> So speaking of a different lens, from the other side of the fence, Chhandomay if you would, where are you see this headed in terms of your assistance in health care IT, what X2 might be able to do? What kinds of realizations do you think are on the horizon here, and what's possible for a health care provider like RVH? >> So all the organizations, if you look across the industry, they are in the digital transformation journey. Health care providers are no exception, and what we are enabling is the IT transformation part, and Dell XtremIO, and with the XtremIO X2 that we just announced, we are enabling that IT transformation for all of our customers, including health care providers like Royal Victoria Health. Now, with X2, specifically, we continue to improve upon the high performance, the unmatched storage efficiencies that we offer, effectively, again, bringing down the cost of hosting different types of workloads, managing it on a single platform with a much lower total cost of ownership for the health care providers like Pat, so that at the end of the day, they will be able to provide better patient and better care for the patients, be it like a doctor or clinician, trying to access the data from their endpoints or the finance or billing department trying to turn over the bills in a much shorter span as opposed to the typically 45 days turnover that we see. So that's where we see not only just XtremIO X2, but Dell EMC, the All-Flash storage portfolio, helping the customers in their digital transformation journey in health care, and with the IT department, going into the IT transformation journey to help with it. >> Chhandomay, Pat, thanks so much for joining us. >> Thank you. >> It was great, thank you. >> I'm Rebecca Knight for John Walls. We will have more from The Cube's coverage of Dell EMC World after this. (electronic music)

(intel sound logo) >> [Announcer] Live from Silicon Valley, it's the CUBE. Covering Mobile World Congress 2017, brought to you by INTEL. >> Okay welcome back everyone to our special two days of coverage of Mobile World Congress 2017. I'm John Furrier, here in the Palo Alo Studios covering what's happening in Mobile World Congress in Barcelona, Spain. Of course this is our day two of wall to wall coverage. Eight a.m. to six p.m. for two days and of course, as we kick off our day two and get early morning here in California or mid morning, they're ending the day in Barcelona and all the news is dropping. Again, it's continuing the theme of 5G, IoT and the notion of the super demos, all the flare and glam around IoT, AI and everything else. On the phone right now in Barcelona, Spain, is our friend and analyst with the Futuriom Group, Scott Raynovich, who will also be co-hosting with the CUBE at ONS, Open Networking Summit. Longtime industry analyst, guru in the space around mobile, certainly SDN and what's going on. Scott, welcome and thanks for taking the time to call in from Barcelona. >> [Scott] Thanks, John. Great to be here, and also I might add some color to one thing you said, when you said the day was winding down. (John laughs) Apparently in Barcelona the day never ends. It just goes all the way through. >> Well the show is ending but now the real action happens, all the hallway conversations at dinner and certainly we know that you take a nap around this time and go out and get ready to burn the midnight oil 'til three in the morning. We have many stories of Barcelona, but let's get down to it. What's happened today in Barcelona? What's the big story? What are you seeing on the ground there? What's the vibe? Give us some insight into what's happening, the experiences you're having and what's the big stories today coming out of Mobile World Congress. >> [Scott] Yeah sure, John. Well there's, as you know, there's a lot of hype about a lot of buzz words, so you got to throw all the buzz words out there: IoT, 5g, self driving cars, VR, AR, augmented reality. If you run through the halls you see a lot of those gizmos and gadgets and I would say the scene has shifted a lot in recent years. As you know a couple years ago it was all about Samsung's big tablet or the latest phone and now it's more about these kind of more advanced technologies, they call them interactive technologies that we're going to see coming down the road the next few years, so there's lots of stuff. >> The show has been very telco orientated and still really is a device and telco show basically. The device guys had their moment in the sun on Saturday and Sunday, but Monday kicked off really the telco show. This is really about ... The telco is trying to figure out their future. Their core competency over the years has been how to provision subscribers and billing, and been trying to figure out the over the top, and now as you look at the software that's coming out with the 5g plus the end to end, some of the things happening at the network transformation area. There's some real action happening. I want to just get your thoughts on is this the time where we're starting to see the needle move on the progress of really bringing the kind of networks that are going to power the cool technologies and promises of use cases, whether it's e-sports up to driving cars that are essentially data centers. Huge amount of data problems, huge amount of network reconfiguration, is this the time where there is an inflection point? What's your thoughts? >> [Scott] Yeah, that's a great point. You have the service providers for a number of years have felt a little bit - I don't know what the word is - spurned by success. They created all this plumbing and they put this massive investment into LTE, broadband, that really enabled all these applications, but it was more people like Apple and Netflix and Amazon that kind of stole the show by leveraging that bandwidth for these new services. Cloud services, music services, of course Netflix, the most popular internet service in the world, and so the service providers kind of feel like 5G is another opportunity that they don't want to squander and so they're being very careful about how to position that. But to your point, they have realized that they absolutely need to virtualize their network because what's going to addle a 5G is you have this massive amount of bandwidth but you need to splice it up into different - they called them actually network slices - so that you can provide all these advanced services, and that's where the service providers want to figure out how they're going to monetize that. So it's certainly a launchpad for the technology and the somewhat maligned technology known as NFV, Network Function Virtualization, but I think that the pressure to get 5G out is going to accelerate their investment in NFV because they need that cloud platform to kind of serve up all these next generation services. >> Is the telco's NFV efforts going to make them more cloud ready in your mind? Is that the sentiment? Is it that, do they have to kind of do a lot of things right now? And the question is, what are the use cases if they are cloud ready and if they can get their act together, the network layer to power these aps that are going to be running on 5G, so you know? >> [Scott] Yeah, yeah. I think so, I mean they're progressing. AT&T makes periodic announcements that they've virtualized whatever it is, 30 or 40 percent of the network, and Verizon has a pretty interesting company Radisys, which recently got a 70 million dollar contract from Verizon to install NFV infrastructure. Now that's not ... 70 million dollars is a drop in the bucket in terms of capital spending for a small virtualization platform like Radisys, but that's a pretty big move and so I think you're seeing this stuff finally becoming real, and they are going to have, within a few ... We'll wait for them because they're a much more flexible platform. It's based on the cloud web scale model, where you snap in a bunch of servers and all the networking is virtualized and you can move things around in the cloud and they want to take advantage of new services they can offer, whether that's a virtualized enterprise security service, you know security service in the cloud where you go into the Verizon Data Center and you order it up and you have a cloud security model that it will protect you, or other what we call Virtual Network Functions, another hot area you've probably heard of SD-WAN. There are a lot of SD-WAN services being rolled out >> Cool >> and that's a virtualized WAN solution that doesn't require you to, say you have a bunch of branch offices around the world, you don't have to ship them all routers and then hook them up with expensive leased lines. You can kind of close them in with the cloud if you will, and there are a bunch of hot companies in that area, including Aryaka Networks, Velo Cloud, Viptela, which are all mentioned as active acquisition targets these days, so there's definitely still a lot of virtualization thought going on but I will say it took a backseat to, this year it took a backseat to 5g and IoT. >> Yeah great commentary. I got to say, I talked with Intel with an exclusive interview with Sandra Rivera from Intel GM, with Communications Network Platforms Group, and we were talking about the dynamics and I think the big IoT thing has been autonomous vehicles. Obviously smart cities is, you've got some surveillance, you've got cameras and stuff in towns and cities, and certainly the smart home. You can't move an inch in the industry without hearing about echo and google in the home, kind of voice activated automation. Then you've got media entertainment, you mentioned Netflix. You know all these things are essentially coming back to rear its data center environment. This is like the data center meets consumer, and we were commenting that the autonomous vehicle is essentially a data center on wheels and that there's going to be trade offs between low latency high bandwidth and true mobility. You know car is not going to be dictated by millimeter wave technology because they might have different frequencies, so this brings up this diversity of network. And so I'll get your thoughts on how you see the market evolving with the pressure for open source software, you mentioned SD WAN it's software defined, WAN software defined radio, software defined networks, software defined data center, the whole world is software defined so the role of open standards both on open source software as well as open wireless if you will, meaning not one vendor is going to own it, how do you grok that? How do you pull that picture together and how do you advise your clients on what this actually means for them and their impact? >> [Scott] Yeah that's a great question. Well, you kind of hit the nail on the head with the question, because I spent much of the show looking at all of the ... If you want to break it up into two buckets of things here, you talked about cloud and WAN, so the infrastructure that builds the data center but as you pointed out, this is a service provider show, so a lot of the discussion is around connectivity standards of course, and it's really amazing John. It's amazing. You know we can boil these things down into these neat little buzz words >> IoT and 5G - but just today, I talked to people about at least five different forms of IoT standards and of course 5G today was a super controversial topic. So let me just break those off one by one. With IoT connectivity, you have something called LoRaWAN, which is a open standard, an IoT open standard, and there's about 500 members signed onto the LoRaWAN alliance, including Cisco and IBM and China Electric, so that has a fair amount of momentum. It has certain characteristics. Very low bandwidth, and not in real time so it's, I'll just give you one example. If you want a connected cow, John, I saw a connected cow, and the idea is that is be large. When a massive operation wanted, you want to track your livestock, so you need a very low cost device that does that. That's an example. You also have so called MBIOT, which Cisco's pushing pretty hard narrow band IoT, with another standard that's going to be used for IoT applications. You have the 3GPP working on LPWAN, which is kind of like a 2G recycled for IoT. The characteristics of IoT have to be really cheap there has to be really low power, so you can't use LTE right? So that's another one. Then you have a couple of hot private companies. SigFox, which has over 100 million dollars funding, and it might even be hundreds of millions of dollars at this point, based in France. Another company called Ingenu, which is spun out of east San Diego qualcon hotbed with a lot of really interesting IT and they have a technology called RPMA, so those two companies are building networks worldwide based on proprietary standards. They've said, "We're going to build an IoT network, "a radio network for IoT all over the world, "and it's going to be based on our proprietary technology, "'cuz it works better," so that ... I just gave you IoT, right? Okay, and then you have 5G, which dozens of service providers (incoming call beep) all have different things about that and actually argued about 5G doesn't exist right? Right so you have Verizon rolling out a pretty standard 5G trial and then you have something called 5GNR, New Radio, which is a multi spectrum flavor of 5G that Qualcomm and are fooling around with, and then you have people like Nokia saying, "Woah, woah, woah slow down. We can't push 5G "before its time. We don't want it to fragment, you know? (vibrating phone) "We don't want it to just "splinter all over the place," >> Yeah. >> [Scott] You know, pull like an Android. So I don't know, that was a mouthful but if you- >> So what does it mean? Is it ... >> You get the idea of how these buzzwords, when you unpack them, they get really complicated. >> Is it forking? Is 5G essentially a land grab right now, or is this all part of the evolution in your mind, because it does seem that you need a catalyst. Obviously Intel's taking a leadership position. They've done a deal with Nokia. You've seen some Ericcson announcement but then you've got Qualcomm on the other side with Snapdragon and you know the competition between Intel and Qualcomm is at an all time high, certainly on the handset side. But at the end of the day, the network is the key at this point, and so the question is, is 5G going to be broken down by the forking? >> 5G is a hype grab, it's totally a grab. >> It's a hype grab. (laughs) >> [Scott] Because 5G will not exist for at least ... They won't be rolling it out 'til 2020 and I heard several people argue today that it's really 2021, so it's not a land grab until it actually exists, right? So it's all about positioning your marketing around it, but just to give you an example of one of the controversies today was accelerating. Should we accelerate to 5G? You know and then BT came out and said, "Well we have to be careful because it's really expensive." 5G is actually going to be more expensive than LTE. If you don't have the return on investment, you know you're going to kill yourself, so people are confused. >> Scott, Intel claims they're going to have 5G in Winter Olympics in Korea. That is what they told me on the record. Not sure if that is a trial network or is that going to be just some data stations? >> [Scott] Yeah they'll have some form of 5G. I mean what I'm trying to point out with all these things is when somebody says the buzz word, it doesn't mean one thing, right? >> Yeah. >> [Scott] It means like yeah, it means several things. And it'll certainly be pretty standard 5G trials. I'm just saying right now we don't even know what that is. Nobody has even settled on what the spectrum is for 5G. There's like been four different announcements about different spectrums and then you have this 5GNR thing which is a multi spectrum technology, so it's really hard to say. I'd be shocked if anybody at Intel definitively knows what 5G looks like at this point. >> Well certainly it begs a question for a follow up conversation around what is 5G. Certainly people will argue what that means in terms of bandwidth, but the question we had on The CUBE yesterday was, "What aps are even ready for a gigabyte "and what does that mean?" Is that fixed wire, is that true mobility, is that latency versus bandwidth, and et cetera et cetera. You know the debate will rage on. Honestly I just want to see more bandwidth. I love connectivity so. Alright Scott, thanks so much for taking the time. I got to ask you a final question. You know, what's the best party so far in Barcelona? What's the best tapas you've had? What's the scene like in and around town? What's some of the buzz? >> [Scott] (laughing) Well I haven't been to any big parties to tell you the truth, I've mostly been to private dinners. The food is amazing and so is the wine. >> Yeah. >> [Scott] It's pretty hard to go wrong in Barcelona. It's probably like a foodie's paradise I would say. >> Yeah it certainly is. When we were there last time it was amazing. Great gothic vibe there, great little restaurants. Scott Raynovich here inside the CUBE and Scott you got some new credentials here. You're still at rayno on twitter but you now have a new firm called Futuriom - F-u-t-u-r-i-o-m Research. Congratulations. >> [Scott] Futuriom, yep. >> Futuriom. So appreciate it and thanks for taking the time, want to give you a shout out for the new gig and you'll be hosting for the CUBE at the Open Networking Summit, ONS, coming up. Appreciate that and thanks for calling in and sharing the insight, what's happening in Spain and Barcelona for Mobile World Congress. Thanks so much. >> [Scott] Thanks, John. It was geat. Thanks for having, that was great stuff. >> Great. We'll be back with more after this short break. This is special two days coverage inside the Studios of Palo Alto live, here in California, breaking down what's happening in Barcelona with all the news, the analysis.