>> Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE covering AWS re:Invent 2018, brought to you by Amazon Web Services, Intel, and their ecosystem partners. >> And welcome back to Las Vegas. We are live here at AWS re:Invent along with Justin Moore and I'm John Wallis. I know when you travel these days, all you want is, you want it to work, right? >> Yeah. >> We just want to get there. Well, I'll tell you what, Phil Wood from EasyJet wants you to get there as well. As does Matt Leonard from CenturyLink. Gentlemen, glad to have you with us. >> Thanks very much. >> We appreciate it. >> EasyJet, a European-based carrier just north of London, so we're talking about air travel. You are, as we've just recently learned, you are a Catalyst Award winner from CenturyLink, there's a reason for that and that's a point of distinction. So Matt, if you would maybe take us through a little bit about what EasyJet did to earn that distinction. >> Sure, the Catalyst Award is an award that we give out in combination with VMware to kind of highlight customers that are doing new and exciting things with regard to digital transformation. We've been a provider of services and a partner with EasyJet for a long time and they've done some really cool things with regard to services they provide their end customers. And we play a very very small part of that. Two exciting things that are my personal favorites with regard to EasyJet is the Look and Book service. So within the application if you want to book a new trip you normally have to type in the airport that you want to go to, and you have to figure out what's the name of the airport, or the three-digit code. With the EasyJet application you can upload a picture and it has intelligence that's used to figure out that picture and what that landmark is and then what the nearest airport is. So that's pretty exciting. And the second exciting thing within the application >> is a trip in one tap. So you can basically justdial in how much money you want to spend for a trip, hit the Go button, in literally one tap it'll recommend a city, a hotel, and a fun and exciting thing that's happening during that duration of time. So for last minute travelers, my family's certainly one of those, we got a free period of time, one tap it'll tell you where to stay, how to get there with EasyJet and then what's exciting happening within that city. >> So I could put in, I say, I want to spend 300 dollars a ticket, and tap boom, and it'll say you can go to Brussels, you can go to Amsterdam but you can't make it to Dublin this weekend, right? Or whatever. I love that. So what has that done for your business in terms of, on a micro level and a macro level, what's it doing in terms of that interface and what's it mean to your business in general? >> As a business, we're 23 years old, so we started very much like a startup and we kind of came in at low-cost airline bracket. But now what we're renowned for is the convenience, and you've got two examples there where our customers love that because it's a convenient way. They don't have to do lots of searching, they can just take the photograph and they know exactly where they're going to go. And that's really what differentiates us is that convenience and the customer experience that we offer to all of our customers. We have a lot of customers. We have 90 million passengers a year. They come to us because they know not just that we give great value but that experience. So what it's done, it's made us grow. And that's literally how we continue to grow is to expand those customer services and Centurylink have been a part of that journey for over half of our tenure as an airline. >> It sounds like technology is actually right on the edge of driving that value for customers and making things easy. Like just the experience of being able to walk out and take a photo of something and say, I want to go here. I would like to go out and see if I can trick it by taking a photo of the Eiffel Tower out in the back here. >> We'll go and try it out in a bit. >> I'm confident. >> We'll see how it goes. That's making use of a whole bunch of technologies. It's got mobile technology in there, it's got image recognition, it's got machine learning. What else are you seeing at the show here at AWS, what are some of the technologies that you think will drive the next evolution of things, what's going to win you the next award? >> I think one of the things I've really been looking at is around data and around the personalization. So we talked about customer experience but our whole journey of taking a plane, taking a holiday, for example, it's from the moment you book it to the moment you get back. There's so many touch points during that and there's so much data that we can take from that. So I've been really interested in looking at how different organizations and how Amazon have been using data. I also think you can't come to a show like this without looking at machine learning and AI. We're using aspects of that in how we analyze our data, but that's certainly something I think's going to change the airline industry moving forward. >> How important is a partnership with someone like CenturyLink in making sure that you get the best use of these technologies? >> Matt talked about that they have a small part to play but you've got to understand that every single customer, every single search on our website goes through a network. In order for us to connect to our customers, be they booking a flight, be they on a flight, we've got to go through a reliable network. And the way I describe it, it needs to be effortless. It needs to just work. You mentioned that right at the beginning. But I also think as well for us to exploit technologies like the cloud, which is what we're starting to invest a lot more into, we need a partner who can help us on that journey. So again, that's where CenturyLink and the partnership we've got has been absolutely crucial. The things that we're doing with CenturyLink around making sure that we're only paying for our network for what we use. We're an airline. Our airports are seasonal so kind of traditional networks, what you'll end up doing is paying for bandwidth all year, when in the winter seasons if you're not flying there that's dead money. So it's simple things like that but that makes a huge difference towards my cost base perspective. >> And time of day, I assume that affects that as well? >> Absolutely. I mean, clearly in our summer periods we fly a lot, so time of day during the summer, there's not that many hours we don't fly. >> You get a lot of daylight over there, right? (laughter) >> But certainly in winter where we have our kind of summer destinations, it makes a big big difference. And that's cost we pass on to the customer as well which is massively important. >> What is it about the customer that you don't know? You talked about AI, what that could do for you down the road. How much information, how much data do you think you can extract from the customer to make that experience even better, and what do you need to know about them, and how will CenturyLink help you get there? >> You need to know everything. I mean, we know that we sell a hundred seventy million bacon sandwiches a year. Whether that's useful or not, but we know that. >> There's hungry people. >> That's a lot of bacon. >> It is a lot. But it means that we know the type of food that our customers want to eat, we know the top destinations, even knowing how long between booking a flight and actually flying. So we know from a price perspective and from a making sure our planes are full or making sure we're not overselling our flights. All of that information, there's just a wealth of data that you're getting out there. And it's not just customers. One of the big factors for us is safety. So we use our data now to analyze maintenance. So we have predicted maintenance around when's the right time to put in spare parts but also what's the most efficient time so that we're not disrupting the customer. So actually we may want to bring a maintenance cycle sooner so we can open up more routes for customers to fly when they want to. So it's very hard to answer that question cause every day we're coming up with new ideas or new bits of information that at the time we never thought we needed to know but that actually turns out to be an absolutely crucial part of our offer. >> That's not an unusual thing for most people in a world where there's this much dynamic, this much change going on. So what process do you run through to figure out, where should we be looking to find out the next set of optimizations? Or how do you discover what is the next thing that you should work on, like where does the idea for, maybe we should build this app. Where does that come from? >> I don't think there's one model. I think what's always been at the heart of EasyJet is innovation, and we've always focused on the customer. So we have a great loyalty scheme and our customers are very loyal. We have 75% loyalty with our customers which is phenomenal. We get a lot of feedback and that feedback drives a lot of the ideas that we push forward. So I think it's a mixture of our passion, it's a mixture of our experience, but I'd say that feedback from the customer, that drives a lot of the ideas that we do moving forward. >> From the CenturyLink perspective, you received certification for the MSP designation. >> Yup. >> Working in the travel business, what does that do, or how does that MSP certification translate over to learning about a different industry, to applying different approaches, unique approaches, because it's not one size fits all. They have very, very specific challenges that you're trying to address. >> Yeah, so on a broader sense, our mission with clients like EasyJet and customers interested in the cloud is really to connect, migrate, and then manage their workloads within the cloud. That's really what we're focused on. And there's certainly commonalities within verticals but every customer's different, and really assessing, starting with the customer, and that's a common thing that I think both EasyJet as well as CenturyLink and certainly Amazon have in common, really focused on that customer journey. One of the approaches that we take through a program called CustomerLink is put the customer right in the center of the team and we've applied the Agile methodology to that customer engagement process. So we do a standup meeting once every two weeks, we do sprints once every two weeks. A lot of our customers are part of that board that we use to activate the sprint and to define priorities and what actions are. So really pulling the whole team together across different departments, focusing on the customer first, and in many cases the customer's customer first cause a lot of your priorities are based on what your customers are after, and really making sure that we're working on the right activity in a very lean way, pulling away as much waste as possible that aren't contributing to adding value to the customer journey. >> And then from your side of the fence going forward, you've mentioned four or five general areas, you've said, we could improve here, we could look at this, we could look at that. How do you prioritize and say, okay, let's focus here now and then we'll move on. So if you had to focus now, or for the next twelve months, what would that be on? >> So we've actually just relaunched our strategy. At the heart we are an airline so our priority is about being number one or number two in all the primary airports. We've got to keep that. But we also recognize from the data that the amount of our customers who will book hotels or book further products through some of our partners that's something that we can actually capitalize on. So we're looking more into holidays now. Taking that customer centricity, and how do we make the end-to-end journey for our customers so including travel to and from airport and the whole day. So that's a priority for us. Continue building our customer loyalty. So as much as we pride ourselves on loyalty, we believe there's a lot more you can do. I think the airline loyalty schemes need to be shaken up a little bit more. If you look in the retail sector or things like that they're focusing on different things. It's no longer just the case of air miles. People want speedier boarding, or they want a better experience, better seating arrangements. So we're looking at our loyalty. And then also business. We talk about, we've got really good slots for when we fly planes. And they're slots that are competitive to a business traveler. So that's our three main areas, I would say, are business, holidays, and loyalty. >> Matt, you're going to be in business for a while. I think you're okay. If you could work on legroom, I'm sold. Matt and Phil, thank you for being with us. We appreciate the time. Join us here on theCUBE. You're watching our live coverage from Las Vegas at AWS re:Invent. (electronic music)

>> Live from Las Vegas. It's theCUBE covering AWSre:Invent 2018. Brought to you by, the Amazon Web Services, Intel and their ecosystem partners. >> Well, welcome back here to the stands. As we continue our coverage here on theCUBE of AWSre:Invent as the day starts to wind down here. Still a lot of energy out there on that show floor. As we are packed with all kinds of great exhibits here. A lot of interesting folks here still making themselves at home. Tom Murphy's with us now, along with Justin Moore and John Walls. He's the Chief Marketing Officer, Turbonomic and Tom glad to have you here on theCUBE. Thank you for joining us. >> Yeah, great to be here. >> So just tell us a little bit about Turbonomic, first off. And then we'll drill down a little bit there. So why you're here at AWS but what do you do for the folks at home? >> Yeah, ultimately what we're doing is we have workload automation for hybrid cloud. And workload automation for us is ultimately where we go out, we discover the workloads, we optimize performance, cost and compliance simultaneously in real time. So what that gives for the customer is we call them smart workloads. Self managing anywhere in real time. The outcome of that for the customers is, they get guaranteed performance, a short performance, a short compliance. And they eliminate a lot of the complexity that they're experiencing today. >> So you're trying to grease the skids, more or less, right? >> Grease the skids, make sure that they're life's easier and they can actually accomplish the outcomes they want. >> Complexity's been a theme that we've been covering in the last couple of days. It's come up quite a bit. The customers are struggling with the amount of choices. We had Andy Jassy on stage today, again, announcing another zillion products today that the US has created. And that gives you a lot of flexibility. It means that you can optimize for particular choices that suit you very, very well. But being able to choose between them can be a pretty daunting task. Now how does Turbonomic help customer decide which of these choices is right for them? >> What we see from our customers is that they're actually looking at typically three platforms. They're still running on prem with VMware. They're looking at AWS, of course. That's why we're out here. And they're looking at Azure as well. So when it comes to choices, they want that flexibility to decide where the workloads can run. By looking at the workloads versus the infrastructure, we abstract the work that's running. And we can model for them, for example, a VM workload that's running on pram, we can pick it up and say what would that look like if it runs on AWS? What will that look like when it runs on Azure? So for us, by abstracting the work from the underlying infrastructure, that gives the customers the flexibility, the simplicity to understand and de risk any migration projects that they have. >> When you identify the way something could go based on what the workload is, do you just tell customers what that is or are you able to automate that decision making process for them? >> When a customer decides to actually deploy workloads they don't know necessarily how big the resources should be. They don't know where should they be placed. But our analytics engine, what it does is it goes out and says we understand the complete infrastructure, we're agent less, we plug into vCenter, we plug into Azure, we plug into AWS, we pull the configurations back and when we decide where to place it, we know best where to place it. We decide how big it is, we know best how big it should be at that time. Should the demand change, what we can do is actually dynamically adjust, in real time, automatically, the size of the workload, where it lives. We can scale out on prem, we can multiply the number of instances or we can actually scale up which means add more resources to the actual workloads. >> And what about that decision then because you talk about on prem and a lot of people have heard a lot. Making the move over, going public. There's a little bit of pain there for some people, right? >> For sure. >> There's some barriers there, what are you saying and what are you trying I guess to lead people through that consideration so they get it. Alright, so it's going to hurt a little bit, maybe. >> Yeah, for sure. >> But, ya know, we're going to be a lot better off by the end of the day. >> Ultimately what we see is, especially on a lift and shift where customers take existing workloads and they move them to the Cloud. A lot of times when you think about how utilized they are on prem, they tend around 50% utilization. So if you actually take that box of, lets say the resources that you've defined on prem and just pick it up and drop it into the Cloud, you're 50% over prevision. Part of the pain point is knowing exactly the resources they need, but understanding not just what you allocated but what you consume, which is a smaller view. Looking at the consumption and using consumption in the Cloud versus the allocation. That's a quick, efficient use case for making sure that they use exactly what they need when they get there. But then not compromising performance when they get there. They have the right performance at the right cost. >> This isn't a static decision either because as we've seen, there's new announcements everyday so we get new instant types that have been announced at the show, but also workloads and the demands for what customers need to do with those workloads. It's constantly changing, so you need to be able to react to that and to change what the right option is from moment to moment. >> And then when you add on top of that, like reserved instances, right. So the complexity of what instance type to use, let's say there's millions of choices when you look at the combinations. Ultimately, there's new one's introduced regularly, so how do I take advantage of that? There's discounting that's applied, there's discounts that come out, bundles that come out. And also the RI's. So RI's, thing of the two metrics for RI's, one would be utilization of the RI's, so I want to make sure if I actually buy RI's and invest in RI's, I want to make sure I use them. And the second is, out of all the instances that I have, what percentage of my environment actually is RI's? So think of that as coverage. So the two metrics that we look at closely with RI's as an example is coverage, which means I'm taking advantage of RI's, I'm not just doing one percent, I'm doing more than that. And the second is utilization which means of the one's I've purchased, I'm making sure that I'm using those, they're not going to waste. >> So customers who are doing this well, like clearly you've got plenty of customers who've done this successfully. So what is doing this well look like? >> Sure, well they start with an assessment, which they look at their on prem in many cases. They right size that, they run models, they run plans as to when they're looking at workloads that are picking up and moving to the Cloud, what do I need when I get there? Once they're in the Cloud, that's just the beginning of the journey, really. And what it is, is they continually optimize. And the continual optimization means that we're constantly meeting, I started talking about supply and demand earlier. But constantly making sure that the demand of the workloads is matched with the underlying supply at all times for the benefit of performance, for cost and also making sure we're compliant with business policies at all times as well. >> So if you have a customer that maybe comes to the show, and the catch the bug, right, they got the fever. We're going to go back, hey Tom. They're on the phone tomorrow, we got to go now. Do you ever have to tell people, just slow your roll, we're going to do this in a methodical way, we're going to do this in a responsible way. We're not going to go nuts. I know you want to go -- >> Go now! >> But people get excited, right? >> For sure. >> So, I mean, how do you handle that? >> Well, I think what I hear from customers today is you guys talked about complexity, right? So, if you think about complexity, and then on top of that you think about a little bit of a skills gap that's happening because there's really not the maturity of the expertise to manage a lot of the transitions that are taking place. And then lastly, once they're in the Cloud, again, I said it's not done, right? So to address really that how do they get through that, what do they use? We don't necessarily say slow down because we can actually get people to the Cloud very very quickly, in a responsible way. The thing that we like to say is we take the guess work out so what we're doing is we're taking the analytics, we're giving them intelligence that they can actually make very rapid decisions. Our solution can probably make decisions about what to do faster that people already to make the progress so, ultimately, we want to go at the pace they want to go. We've had customers call us on a weekend to ploy the software, actually go live like in a couple days. So, it's up to the customer. We feel confident in our decision making. You can't automate decisions and actions if you don't feel confident about it and we've got the customer points that give us to prove. >> So based on what you've seen so far at the show and your experience with customer who have been moving to Cloud, figuring out where they're going to put these workloads, what's next? What do you think people are going to be doing next? >> It's a great question, 'cause as a company, I'm really proud that we started as VMturbo many people still know us as Vmturbo. And what happened was Virtual Machines was were we started. We plugged into vCenter, we pulled information back and all of the sudden we're making decisions and actions about what to do on a virtualized environment on prem. Well, we started doing the Cloud, all of the sudden its like well it's more than just VM, it's Cloud too. We literally had to change the name of the company to accommodate the capabilities. So by having this economic supply and demand model, it'll alow us to really just apply it to not just VM on prem, not just Cloud. So to answer your question, containers or micro services is steam rolling into, we hear that in all of our customers now. When I came here three years ago it was worth thinking about Cloud. Last year, actually, we're testing, right? This year it's we're live. Next year it's going to be containers, containers, that's what I think cause containers are just going to be just coming in, Cloud Native applications, we're past a litte bit of lift and shift. We're moving into Cloud Native so that's what I think is going to happen next year. >> I think you can stick with Turbonomic. I think you're okay for a while. >> (laughing) Sure. >> Hey thanks for being with us Tom. >> Absolutely guys, I appreciate the opportunity, thank you. >> You bet, have a great show the rest of the time here in Las Vegas. >> Thanks very much. >> Excellent, Tom Murphy joining us from Turbonomic and that will be it for this day here on theCUBE AWS:reInvent. Back with you tomorrow Thursday for Justin Moore and I'm John Walls, thank you for watching. (electric sounding music)

>> Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE. Covering AWS re:Invent 2018. Brought to you by Amazon Web services, Intel, and their eco-system partners. >> Well good morning and welcome back to Las Vegas, day two here at AWS reinvent. Along with Justin Moore and I'm John Walls and we're joined by Arabella Hallawell at Netscout. Good morning Arabella, good to see you. >> Good morning. >> Everybody have a good night last night, by the way. Did Las Vegas treat everybody okay? >> Yeah it was pretty good. >> It was good >> Good dinner and all that right? >> I'm on east coast time so, any time past midnight- >> It's always a tough transition isn't it? Alright tell us a little about Netscout and your primary responsibilities there. >> Netscout is a company that's been helping the largest organizations. 90% of Fortune 100 organizations, about 90% of the worlds communications service providers. Basically troubleshoot their most complicated application and service probelems, and we've been helping these organizations for almost three decades. And what's really interesting about a show like this is we've seen so much technical transformation, it's so rapid right now. I mean even as we talk about, serverless, agentless computing. We're talking about microservices and containers still when it comes to our customers, the IT teams they still have the very same problems that they were tasked with 20, 30 years ago which is it better work make sure that service that's being delivered to customers works and we want to make sure it has the performance and the security our customers and our business need. It's interesting because if anything that watermark is getting higher and higher for the IT organization yet what they've been dealt with is so much more complexity because of all of this innovation. So that's what's really exciting as well is how do we help our customers manage to this new transformation and make sure that they're successful for their organizations, making sure that service experience, the customer experience is protected. >> So you talk about complexity. Is that the driver of the biggest problems today. You said this has been going on for 20 or 30 years But now because of the sophistication of the technology, you've got a whole new slew of problems. So how would you categorize them tody as supposed to 10 or 15 years ago. >> The biggest seat change is in many ways some of these definitions that we hear about here. Hybrid Cloud, most organizations have been a journey for a number of years transforming their physical footprint to virtual footprint, and then a public cloud footprint. They see it sometimes linear, and then sometimes people make a dramatic move forward. I think what we're going to see here and over the next year is basically that whole definition of hybrid cloud should actually be re-thought of as almost a data center without walls. Because going back to the complexity, the new technologies, the new capabilities, being able to have a workload anywhere you want, being able to spin something up using some kind of instance that goes up and goes down is amazing form the business perspective because they can have what they want when they want it. The piece of innovation is dramatic. The complexity comes in from an IT perspective, how do you manage that exponential increase in the number of services, being able to see all those services, where are they, what are they doing, and what are all the dependencies. So back to what you were saying. Five, ten years ago a (mumbles) where people kind of, "Hey there's a problem somewhere, is it the network team, "is it the server team, who's problem is it?" Right now that problem has just become so much harder to diagnose and that's really what we're trying to help our customers do. How do we get that end-to-end visibility around what's happening in this kind of data center without walls. Which is essentially where it's all going. >> That's certainly a theme that's come up. We spoke about it a little bit yesterday John, that this complexity of the data systems and these work loads, it could be anywhere. And there's so many more of them, we've got Microservices, we've got Serverless, keeping track of that as humans, the problem is so complex now it's almost beyond human capability so we need to augment the humans with some kind of technology. Do you see that with customers, is that what they come to Netscout for? >> Absolutely, and it many ways as we've seen with the technology transformation, even in our homes today from smart refrigerators and driverless cars. Technology can make the humans smarter but I think the pace of innovation is almost too fast for the human. Because it's so hard to grapple that type of complexity and often times it's organizational. Because even if you can spin up these new things, you can compute anywhere anytime. If you're an IT organization and you still have the same people, processes, tools that you've always been working towards, that's when you really run into problems. That's where we're seeing some organizations say, it's not just dev sec ups, it's how do I change the mindset and the processes and then it just comes to the tooling. And the tooling isn't really available either to get that visibility into this new landscape. Most organizations still have silos of different types of data, different types of interfaces, and at the core of that is the IT organizations still tends to have their more traditional silos. To your point, is because humans often are slow to change. We're probably the biggest inhibitor to the technological progress. >> Well I like to say that there's three parts to it, there's people, process, and technology. Technology is only one of those three things. So you need to change the people and process in order to make use of these new technologies. It does sound like we're moving to a higher level of abstraction though, where rather worrying about particular servers or pieces of infrastructure, we're now looking at workloads and data that could be anywhere. And we're now managing that data at this higher level of abstraction, is that where you see this business user going for, where they don't really want to deal with the nuts and bolts of the IT? >> I think again, this goes back to having a data center without walls, I think in the future and even today it's increasing hard to say and point to, it's that server and that data center that's causing a problem because it's so spread out and it's made up of so many different components so I would say yes, the business wants that higher level information which is, "I want my workload "anywhere, anytime, with the service levels that I require." The problem with that is the IT organization then has to manage, often a very difficult environment where the business maybe have chosen to put an application or workload in this place because of regulatory requirements, or they like the service levels, so they like what that particular vendor did. But then you've got basically a panoply of all of these different capabilities, and how do you manage that when someone says, "I can't have any latency over a 5G network." You can't have latency when it's some kind of operating room cardiac machine, you can't say to a parent- (laughing) That latency kind of caused a big problem during the operation, it's just unacceptable with the new type of technology and again it is a human issue. The technology that we're using is to fuel human progress, but we at the end of the day have to find a way to manage the complexity. I think that begins with actually the people first. How does the IT organization potentially needs to re-organize so that they can get to that level abstraction and then distend it from that perspective. Because most of the time they're looking at their silos of data. >> You mentioned a little bit ago about the repitity of change in innovation. What about expectation versus innovation in terms of your clients, and trying to satisfy that. You eluded to it yourself just a few moments ago. It's really hard to keep up if you will. So how do you manage that with your clients, what they're looking for you to point them toward as supposed to what's realistic. >> I think that again, progress and understanding where change is going you never want to resist it because it's scary, but making sure you can manage that transition and that journey with confidence is what we really focus on with our customers. So even something as relatively simple as we're taking a cloud that was in a physical data center, even in a software data center and putting in a public cloud environment, do you know the service dependencies, do you know what it looked like before you went, and then once you're there how do you make sure that you still have the same types of performance that you've always had, even though that sounds bread and butter. For many organizations making sure that they move to this more fluid, frictionless environment and sort of have a continuous type of visibility, and end-to-end visibility is key because as we started this whole conversation, at the end of the day the problem is what it was 20 years ago. Which is, is my service working as it should for the customer of the business on the other end. Does it have errors, does it have latencies, is it insecure. Continuing to provide that regardless of where, so we work with AWS, we work with VMware, we're trying to work with every single part of this new fabric so that our customers can still have that same confidence. That's kind of the goal for us. >> It's a brave new world, good luck and thanks for sharing your time with us this morning . >> Great, thank you very much. >> We'll continue here on theCUBE, we're live in Las Vegas, at the AWS, we'll be back in just a minute.

>> Announcer: Live from Las Vegas, it's The Cube. Covering AWS re:Invent, 2017. Presented by AWS, Intel, and our ecosystem of partners. >> Welcome back to Las Vegas. We are live here on The Cube continuing our coverage of re:Invent. The AWS, the big tent. As we were just talking about with our guest, Justin Moore and John Walls here. Your hosts here on The Cube and we're joined by Kiran Bhageshpur, who's the CEO of Igneous Systems and Kiran, thanks for being with us here on the Cube. Good to see you. >> Great to be here. >> Now we were talking about, you know, this is the big tent now. Didn't used to be that way, right? >> Nope, nope. >> It wasn't that long ago this was, I wouldn't say a specialty show, but you said this has certainly taken on a very different vibe, a very different feel. I mean, explain that a little bit before we get into Igneous and what you're doing here. >> Absolutely. I was first here in 2012, I believe it was the first year they had AWS at re:Invent and it was a very different feel, much smaller, maybe about 6,000 or so people. Mostly engineers, hardcore engineers who were discovering this new cool set of toys, if you will, or tools that was quite revolutionary and niche at that time. Fast forward now. It's much more of a mainstream show. It's much more corporate IT, lots and lots of large enterprises are present out here. There still is a lot of developers, but it's more the devops, more people who are operationalizing this rather than building on it for the very first time. So big change from early stage to very mainstream right now. >> And Justin, you made a comment. I mean, to the extent of a jacket, I've got a suit and tie, a jacket. We've all been to shows where maybe the wardrobe was maybe a little different, but this is illustrative of, again, of the maturation of the marketplace and expansion of the marketplace. >> Yeah, you go to some of the developer conferences and you see a lot more people with spiked purple hair and then utilikilts. I've yet to see a single utilikilt here at the show so it does feel, unlike at previous years where there's been, again, a lot more engineers and people are still here in hoodies and casual clothes, but there are a lot more suits. There's clearly a lot more money here and it's become a little more corporate. It'd be interesting to see how it transitions over the next couple of years whether Amazon or AWS is able to maintain that kind of developer vibe as all of these other companies come in and start to see actually, this is a pretty robust and mature ecosystem now. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. And obviously, the expansion reflects that. You're here exhibiting for the first time. >> Yes we are. >> Your booth back at K37 if you're here at the show. Kudos to Igneous. Let's talk a little bit about what you do and why are you here? Who are you trying to talk to this weekend and why does this week matter? >> That's great. So what we do, Igneous is an early stage company. We have launched our company a year ago. We have a bunch of customers right now sort of growing very nicely at this stage and what we do is enable businesses, enterprises with lots and lots of file data on premises as well as in the public cloud to better manage and have a handle on this. So our customers tend to be businesses with sort of literally billions of files, hundreds of petabyte or dozens of petabytes spread across a lot of systems traditional, legacy that hook, attach to a system on premises and what they are seeing in their growth is they're going from one data center to multiple data centers within their own infrastructure and now to multiple clouds and as this core asset, data continues to grow. They look to folks like us to help manage that better. So the very first thing we do is we enable them to back up and protect all this data on premises into public clouds like AWS so we literally have scalable solutions which go into their data center, talk to all of their filers as they're called, interrogate all of that data, and create a copy of that into AWS S30 glacier. >> Yeah. There's a lot of companies who are struggling with the idea. Two things really. One is being able to manage data everywhere because data has gravity as people like to say, but also this multi-cloud idea and being able to manage my data in multiple physical locations. Some of it will be on my own site. Some of it will be in Collo. Some of it will be in one or as you say multiple clouds. That really hybrid IT way of things. What are you seeing as the driver behind that need to have this data in multiple locations? >> Yeah, that's a great question. For the things that we see is, look, things have remained on premises. It's not gone away and things continue to grow on premises and Amazon recognizes that. That's why you see starting last year into this year a lot more push into hybrid clouds, if you will. You saw that with the big partnership with Vmware and so on. So that's continuing to grow, but in the same time, they're having new applications being born in the cloud or leveraging the cloud. So one thing which is very common for a lot of our customers is they have infrastructure on premises which is already paid for and continues to grow, but they want to leverage the public clouds, AWS, for its elasticity and its agility to be able to burst into it and use it as they see fit. Now to do that, you require agility of applications and data between on premises and the public clouds and say AWS. So that's kind of where, you know, we come in to go help them in that and the other thing we're also seeing is customers are not in a single cloud. Even if they started in one place, they're starting to exist in multiple different locations. Good example will be in, you know, most of our customers tell us that, say, a Google cloud has the advantage for things like AI and machine learning whereas Amazon has the more mature infrastructure. So they might quite have a lot of infrastructure and data on premises as well as on Amazon, but they might be running a bunch of new applications which are leveraging the machine-learning APIs and Google Cloud. But then how do you get the data from on premises Amazon cloud into Google Cloud, use it but not leave it around and triple pay for it all around so that's really the management challenge. >> Yeah so you mentioned a particular use case there that happened to use Google. So AI and machine learning is something and I'm hearing that in talking to customers myself that they like to use different cloud for different reasons. So what are some of the workloads that you're seeing from customers who are needing to put their data not just on site, but they say, you know what, I want to burst into the cloud, I want to use some of that elasticity that cloud is so great at. What are some of the workloads that you're seeing them use your product for? >> Yeah, I'll give you a great example. Let's take the word of the movie world, right? So lots of it is all digital right now. The data is created and you're gonna go create heavily CGI or computer generated effects using lots and lots of computer cores. What you come to is at the end of the movie, there's a crunch time where they need way more compute than they have available within their data centers. In fact, in the past, there used to be a vibrant side business where little boutique companies would rent you servers and they would literally carve that into your data center for six weeks and take it away again so now that's gone and you'd rather use the public cloud, you use Amazon and EC2 instances for that workload. That's a good example which everybody can relate to. Hey, it's crunch time, movie's coming up for release. I have a lot more work to do, but that pattern exists in pretty much every industry whether it's drug discovery or electronic design. Everywhere, there is a need to grow burst beyond what you have available and that kind of drives the adoption for workflows which already exist on premise to also adopt a cloud. >> Yeah. >> You got it. >> What manageability. I mean, talking about multi-cloud. >> Kiran: Yeah. >> And obviously as you parcel out your assets, you decide what data's gonna reside in what environment managing all that and then managing the cost of all that. I mean how do you keep up corale on that and also help your clients get a handle on where their data's going, 'cause yeah. I don't know, right? >> So that's what we exist to do which is help customers manage this data asset that they have across multiple locations no matter where it lives. The first thing we do in our journey with our customer is just back that stuff up which is all on premises into the cloud so it gets a copy of the dat into the public cloud. Now that enables workflows like being able to use the cloud for disaster recovery or use the clouds for burst computing very well. But it's just beyond that. It's also how do you get the data, where it lives, which could be on premise, on a T01 filer to where it ends to be. Perhaps the public cloud for a back-up deal or a burst-use case or perhaps into a separate cloud for using machine learning and when you do this, how do you ensure you have one copy, one protected copy of the data, not three or four every place? In fact, if you look at the world today on premises, already customers will tell us they have hundreds of systems that it's not infrequent that hey, they have infrastructure say in Santa Clara as well as Israel and it's a same copy which exists in both places because they have no way of globally looking at this in one single way. >> That's kind of what we do is hey, what are your data assets, where do they live, how do we ensure you have one copy of it or n copies as you desire but not a proliferation of that dataset, three how do we get the data from where it lives to where it's needed in a programatic, systematic way that your end user can sort of you know, help themselves too rather than requiring an IT trouble ticket and somebody going through a manual process. So those are sort of good sets of early things we are helping customers out with. The other thing that goes into here and this is where the cloud comes in again is we had targeted customers who are looking at literally billions, tens of billions of files, hundreds of petabytes, tens of petabytes to 100 of petabytes of data spread across many locations and many hundreds of systems. How do you get your hand, your head around that? It's beyond human scale and it's only possible with software and sort of machine learning if you want to use the buzzword and that's the sort of next place where you come in and provide a human comprehensible structure for the sort of data which continues to grow and it's important because this is core assets for businesses today. >> Yeah we were discussing this earlier, both of us, actually. It's that idea of automation because humans don't scale. >> Yeah. >> So when you have these billions of files as you're talking about, that's just not trackable for humans to deal with. So what are some of the automation and autonomous systems capabilities that Igneous has? >> So the first thing we do is go ahead and ensure your automatically and at scale, being able to discover all of that data, right? So think of, you know, if you look in the consumer world, really what the web is goes and crawls every website and indexes all of the data. Well we do that except within the enterprise for the unstructured file data, which happens to live on a net app filer or a Dell cluster or maybe it's living in AWS inside S3 where we go crawl all over that, index, all of that and give you a view into that. That's the first level, simple way of doing that. But then the next level beyond that is if you can give a level of structure on that because it's not useful to just find it. You wanna know what you have or where you have it, how it's changing, who is accessing it, what applications are accessing your data? What applications are modifying your data? Today, that is an extremely manual process within businesses. >> Yeah. In order to make sense of that, again, you're trying to appeal to developers. What APIs and sort of programmatic aspect do you have for that rather than having to employ 1,900 humans who would all have to sit there and drive around with, going through interfaces? >> So since our customers tend to be sort of more on the business side of IT today who are trying to go understand about this data, the interfaces we provide them is clearly the higher level abstraction of what the data looks like of how they want to interact with that, but everything you do in the modern world is API enabled and the vision is clearly to go expose all of this through API such that customers, developers within their organization can go consume it. >> So before we let you go, I want to talk about your presence here, the decision to exhibit. It's not a light one, I know that. At the end of the day, when you walk out of here on Thursday, what do you want to accomplish and I guess from the, in terms of the kinds of audience that you're hoping to be exposed to, who would that be? >> So the customers, the prospects we talk to are typically businesses, enterprises with lots and lots of unstructured data so people in the media world, in the design world, any form of design that is electronic and automated to. You know, geospatial imagining. All of these folks and they are all present here this year. This is the show to be, you know. In the past, it used to be Microsoft PDC, it was RealWorld, it was Oracle World. Today it is AWS re:Invent and they're all here and for us, it's success if we walk out of this being exposed to a whole bunch of people. We as a smaller organization could not have had immediate access to without coming to this show and that's what I think we get out of here. >> Well, good luck on the next three days. It sounds like you're off to a great start in the right place at the right time. >> Yes, indeed. >> And we wish you all the best down the road. >> Thank you. >> Kiran thank you for being here. >> Thank you very much. >> Live on the Cube, you're watching us here at re:Invent where it's AWS's big show here in Las Vegas back with more live coverage in just a moment. (energetic music)

>> Announcer: Live from Las Vegas, it's the Cube, covering AWS reInvent 2017, presented by AWS, intel, and our ecosystem of partners >> Hello everyone, welcome to the Cube here, live in Las Vegas for Amazon web services, AWS annual conference reInvent 2017 and I'm John Furrier here, the co-founder of SiliconANGLE Media, co-host of the Cube. We are here for our fifth year in a row as Amazon Web Services continues to go on a thundering pace of product announcements and massive growth and we're here with two live sets, we're growing so much, there's so much action, there's two cubes, double barrel shotgun of innovation and data we're sharing with you, go to SiliconAngle.com, check out all the stories, all the news and we're hear kicking it of with an analysis, getting ready for tomorrow, the big day, today's officially the partner day, Sunday night they had Midnight Madness, the first ever event for Amazon, where they used the March Madness, kind of copied Cube Madness if you follow the Cube and they do a little preview, I'm here with Justin Moore and Keith Townsend, two great analysts in the community, guys and co-host this week at the cube. First of all thanks for co-hosting the Cube this week and thanks for coming by >> It's a pleasure >> Nice being here with my 50,000 closest friends (laughs) >> It's so good to have you guys here, one, the hosting but more importantly more Cloud thinking men but we've been watching this evolution, both when the Amazon start, I know you both have been involved in the game, in the Cloud watching it and participating but watching just like the tipping point, you're starting to see that moment where, people are calling this the Vmware 2008 moment, Where it's like oh my God its kind of gone mainstream but its still got a community, can they keep that alive? Meanwhile everybody is just getting blown away by Amazon, no matter what is being said, they're clearly the leader in Cloud, Microsoft pedaling as fast as they can, cobbling together their legacy Cloud, to try to keep up. Google, a new guard company looking really good with developers but not international, not a lot of things there yet but certainly looking great and then you got everybody else. >> Keith: Is there anybody else, really? >> As Dave Alonzo would say, what horses are on the track? >> Yeah there's lots of smaller players who are calling themselves Cloud, they're much more like, manage service providers and collocation kind of things, its not really Cloud they way you would think of it from the AWS kind of perspective. >> I've been talking to a lot of Fortune 500's lately and all of their internal customers, when they describe what they want, they're describing AWS, Azure and Google compute and everything else is just not even part of the discussion >> Yeah it needs to look like AWS, that's like the bench mark so this is what it is >> Total gold standard, the bell weather, let's talk about Amazon because I was writing a post on Forbes, I posted about kind of, trying to tell the story in a way that was kind of understood by the mainstream, still not really truly understood but they're changing the game, they're just kind of minding their knitting, they're just all steam ahead, you know, why look in the rear view mirror when your top dog? Why do that but the game is changing, they're constantly introducing new stuff, serverless is the hot trend that we've been tracking, you're seeing it here, you're seeing real developer centric, customer centric announcements. Even during the analysts meeting I heard rumblings, we can't even keep up with all the news, it's so massive so just thundering pace of announcements. Where's the innovation? What's Amazon doing now? What do they gotta do to distance themselves from the field? >> It's interesting, I reckon the competitors to Amazon are actually distancing themselves from AWS, they're trying to find their own way of doing things because you cannot AWS AWS >> Keith: Rackspace learned that a couple years ago right? >> Yeah, trying to compete head on, you're gonna lose so then we see Google is pushing really really hard, machine oiling and they are in top systems, a lot of people are using them for that big data and genomics research, Microsoft is all about office 365 and their traditional enterprise applications that all of their customers today, they know and love >> Yeah so Microsoft is doing what Microsoft does, which is taking care of their enterprise customers and I think this is where AWS needs to innovate in and its not maybe a technical innovation more than a operating and sales approach to how they treat enterprise customers. Enterprise customers still I think, are struggling to this date on how to interact with AWS and AWS is still trying to figure out how do they sale and help manage enterprise accounts. >> So let's separate IT because obviously two factors are merging, the CXO which is traditional IT, which we're all familiar with and a new kind of developer model is emerging and I won't say it's developer speeds and fees, developer programs, where developers are shaping the agenda. It used to be CXO's have the cash, they drive everything. Now you got this developer mojo and I can see early signs of a cult here, where all the innovation that's come in the field, is from customers saying screw it, I don't need the big dog telling me, the old guard, the old CIO up there, I'm just gonna go do it, get out of my way, three feet in the Cloud dust, get a prototype up and running. So you guys see that dynamic, with this cultural shift, what's your thoughts? >> Cloud is a state of mind... (laughs) It's a way of operating the business, its not so much about the infrastructure, its not so much about the services that live on top of it, it's how you use them and that way of doing things that the developers like, is that they get to pick and choose their favorite tools from what they think is the best solution and a lot of the time that's been AWS and then they blend them together and they just stitch this system together based on the favorite tools that they have and that just lives in a completely different level of abstraction than what we've seen before. >> And the speed too, I mean that's just changing the game too, right? >> Well you can do that a lot faster than waiting, raise a PO, wait for three months for someone to rack ans stack a whole bunch of gear, wait for everything to clear through purchasing and then you get access to the enterprise, anointed correct thing, so we saw it the same with sales floors, where people would... sales guys would just go with a credit card and just say, yes I'll have some of that, thanks >> It's much more than a credit card, VMware worked their re-Cloud air service a couple years, said, I can take your credit card, build a data center, my son a developer, in college, I gave him that solution, he looked at it, he was like what's a load balancer, why do I need to configure a firewall, I just want to build a application man, I just want to build, I just want to code, and AWS has figured that out, how to get developers back to what they love to do, which is solving problems via code and you see it, even before the start of this show, there's a lot of hoodies and shorts at this conference, compared to the culture that we see at a lot of other and past shows. >> I find it inspirational, so couple key points, so I asked Andy Jassy, an exclusive one on one with him last Monday and I asked him, you know, he was talking and he made a comment to me and I'll tell you the story here, he says, you know, we have a conversation inside Amazon, this is Andy talking about if we were gonna start Amazon all over again, cause he tells the story about the scar tissue and all the pain they went through with S3. He says if we're going to do it all over again, we would use Lambda, and the serverless trend is interesting because now that speaks to your son's objective, I don't need routers, I don't need load balances, I don't need gear... >> What do you mean how many CPUs I need? I don't know >> What's a patch? >> You tell me, alright, yeah >> Load Linux? What's Linux? So, okay if that's the norm, the driver has to be a new programming methodology, not agile, we're talking about compose ability and a level where no one says, oh I need Oracle for that or I need Mongodb for that, there's just data bases. So a whole new things happening where this choice that used to be the religious war between vendor A or B... serverless could change the game on this >> We're just gonna end up with a new religious war I think, it's gonna be, instead of Vim versus Emacs, it's gonna be should I use Amazon Lambda or should I use Google Cloud functions, it's gonna be one of those, which programming language is the best. >> Okay old guard, new guard, it's a term that Jassy uses, I like it because I'm old, so maybe I'm old guard trying to be new guard, old guard means legacy, he's really talking about Oracle, IBM, probably say Microsoft, so move over and put them in that bucket, so new guard players, clearly Amazon, saying they're new guard, but Google's new guard in Cloud, they're not really trying to do anything legacy, they have legacy infrastructure but they're approaching a... a market from a new guard perspective. What's you guys take on old guard, new guard and do you agree with that statement and what do the old guards have to do to be cool with the new school? >> So the Cube has been at almost every major conference, this year, take an example, what some of the old guard is trying to do, NetApp is trying to get into the Cloud conversation. Google has none of that legacy concern of needing to sell boxes, you look at a solution like Kubernetes, Kubernetes has come on and taken over the container orchestration conversation because Google doesn't need to make money off of Kubernetes, they don't need it to sell more boxes, there's a bit of freedom... >> They may have moved some work loads off Amazon, don't you think? >> It's a great way to move work loads out of Amazon, AWS has joined the CNCF because they no longer have a choice in the matter, Kubernetes has won the containers war so because of that, these new school competitors can compete in ways that a HPE, Dell EMC, etc., simply can't. >> Josh I gotta ask you this, I agree with what he's saying, I'll take it one step further, the old guards trying to slow the game down, move the goal post as an expression, they gotta try to slow this freight train down because otherwise it could be less than it does and they have leverage, they've got customers, they have market power, even Oracle I would say is in that category so they gotta kind of slow the game down but is the scale and the unprecedented amount of announcements, the differentiator as more services come on, their thesis here at Amazon, as I release more services faster, more available capability thus more, total address full markets available. Do you buy those two things, slowing down and services being the advantage? >> That's interesting I think it's more of a scatter gun approach in a way, it's like you know, fail fast. So if we throw enough services out there, throw enough stuff at the wall, we'll just find the ones that work and concentrate on those, as someone who tries to keep up with what Amazon is doing and this happens with developers as well. When you release 800 new services in a year, name them all, as a human that's really really difficult to manage. So I think in some ways it's a little bit... >> I've got four kids I can't even name, I get them all confused >> It's a little bit like Microsoft Word, it's got 800 billion different features but for any given customer they're gonna use maybe 10% of them and yet all of them are there because different customers use a different 10%. I think that's a little bit what Amazon is going for, kind of ubiquitous market coverage, as much market as it can possibly get, it's a lot like it's retail strategy, we want to be in everything, where some of the competitors are being a little bit more focused about saying well rather than just being a generic service that covers everything, we're gonna focus on particular areas that we think have enough value in that for it to be worth that time. >> Okay I wanna ask you guys a question about value creation, entrepreneurial, the startups, companies that are trying to go, you kind of see, certainly in Silicon Valley, where I live, startups are getting pummeled, if they were born before 2012, they're really going.6.. they try to go big but they're mostly going home. Barracuda Networks just announced this week that they're gonna go private, private equity's squabbling up all these companies that have pretty good sizeable funding, 100 million dollar invests from Andressen Horowitz, Graylog, Sequoia, big names, folding tent and being acquired which is code words for we can't got public and even big public companies that don't have a Cloud player, kind of retooling. So the question is, are we at a point now where scale and speed of the game is causing some havoc in the market place. >> Well look no further than what's going on in Europe now, the Cube is at HPE reInvent. HPE's discover in Europe and HPE is a completely different company than it was three years ago as a direct result of what Amazon has done in the Cloud space and gobbling up all of these smaller accounts and new opportunity. You mentioned it earlier, HPE is still HPE, HPE is gonna get that interview or session with the CIO, Meg makes the call, someones going to pick up the line. >> Now Antonio >> Yeah, now Antonio But AWS has been changing that story, impacting and taking the air out. HPE chose a interesting approach, get smaller, become more agile, Dell chose the opposite route of getting bigger to compete, we'll see which one plays out, in the meantime 18 billion dollar run rate and no sign of slowing down. >> 18 billion dollar run rate with 40% growth on that bassline is pretty significant, I think they might even be doing better than that next quarter but that speaks to the traction, it's not just startups, those numbers aren't just startups. Airbnb is a big company now but they started out small. We use Amazon, a lot of people use Amazon, they're winning big enterprise deals, why? What do you guys think, what's the reason why? >> You know what... Go a little bit intuitive here, look at VMware on AWS, I've been kind of critical of that solution but it is a easy win, if VMware made the exact same announcement on IBM, the year before at VM world... the Fortune 500's I talk to don't consider that Cloud, the exact same solution and AWS is Cloud, that's the Cloud check box. AWS, they do a much better job at controlling their brand Kleenex but they are the Kleenex, they are the Xerox of Cloud, you don't have Cloud unless you have AWS from a enterprise perspective, that's what Azure, Google Compute, and all the other Cloud providers have to compete against >> First of all those guys are incomplete in their Cloud and that's just on a feature by feature basis, I do agree it's kind of like Outlook or Word, I like Outlook because it's more bloated than Word and less useful but my point is, that's the name of the game, getting functional value creation. So final question for you guys is, as we look at reInvent this week obviously I looked at the industry day yesterday and the board, a lot of Alexa repeats. So you can see what sessions are repeating so that's a indicator of popularity so Alexa's got traction, serverless with Lambda. What do you guys see as the big, so far, early show buzz? >> I'm hearing a lot about containers, containers and like you say, things like Lambda and Alexa, anything that has AI machine learning in it, that's very hot at the moment whether or not it's just hype and the bubble on that will pop in a few years, I personally think that that is mostly hype and hot air but it'll settle down and there'll be some real value in there. That's where I'm seeing the noise. >> So over at the RA, they have the container kind of show, it's a show within a show and I'm hearing similarities with containers but not just containers, to your point, serverless, it was a term that we struggled with a couple years ago, now it's generally accepted, you know what, I can just write code and that code can be executed without regard to infrastructure operations. That has proved to be insanely popular right now. >> Okay final question, I'll start it, we're gonna end this on this last segment, I know I wanna get one more in, that's the buzz. I wanna ask you guys, what tea leaves are you reading, what signals are you looking for? Because remember Amazon is very scripted up right now, you can see them on message, I'm trying to poke holes, and which tea leaves, smelling it, putting my ear, ear to the ground, think about that question, my view is, I'm looking at, is this developer trend a cultural shift and to what extent is that developer traction in terms of mind share and love of the brand, Kleenex, the Cloud, the real Cloud, and how much will that tip the CXO conversation. Where's that power shift? So me, I'm trying to read what the tea leaves are saying, if this developer tipping point happens at this scale, developers could really be in the drivers seat. Not just oh developers are in charge, I'm talking about really making the decisions on all big deployments, that's my tea leaf read. What are you looking at? >> So I'm talking to a lot of vendors, their number one reason for being at AWS, when I say vendors, vendors that we see at traditional infrastructure shows, they're here to talk to new audiences, to that developer audience that you mentioned and what I want to know from them, more than just interest, do these developers have money? One of those challenges that all of these Cloudy type companies have faced is that the developers fall in love with them, Docker is a great example, developers fell in love with Docker, millions of downloads. However that doesn't translate to POs and purchases, do these guys actually have the buying power to see through that initial contact all the way to the sale of the solution. >> Influence the buying decisions and IT, thoughts? >> You made the same comment I think earlier about 2008 VM world, it has a very similar vibe to me here, I'm seeing that this is now the crossover between where it was developers, where it was all hoodies and tracksuits and pink hair, I'm seeing a lot of suits, seeing a lot of money floating around this conference, so I'm starting to think that this is the point where AWS is starting its transition from being the new guard to the old guard, they would love to be IBM, IBM made a lot of money. >> Turning into an old guard is very good financially >> It makes you a lot of money. So I'm looking to see where on that transition are we and how long can AWS maintain that momentum of being a new guard company. >> If they can hold the line on new guard they win everything as long as they could in my opinion. Alright, I'm John Furrier here with Justin Moore and Keith Townsend kicking off the first day of three days of wall to wall coverage here at AWS reInvent, stay tuned for more analysis opinion, commentary, of course go to SiliconANGLE.com for all the exclusive interviews with Andy Jassy and all the top executives of Amazon. We'll be back with more after this short break. (slow futuristic music)

>> Announcer: Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE! Covering AWS re:Invent 2017. Presented by: AWS, Intel and our ecosystem of partners. (lively electronic music) >> Welcome back everyone, this is theCUBE special exclusive coverage of AWS re:Invent 2017. CUBE's our flagship program, we go out to the events and we extract the signal noise. I'm John Furrier your co-host. With me today is Justin Moore, an analyst. We have two sets here in Las Vegas. Our next guest is Sumeet Singh, Vice President of Cloud Analytics with Juniper Networks, formerly of AppFormix, which was bought about a year ago. CUBE alumni back. New team, Juniper, welcome back. Last time we chatted with you you were entrepreneurial. >> Yeah. >> Taking names, kicking ass, now you're-- >> Bought out Juniper Networks, yeah. >> You bought out Juniper Net, what's going on? >> So we've essentially been building, building more and more and it's actually been a totally awesome experience. So, Last year when we spoke, we were essentially looking at a whole lot of private cloud deployment. Looking at OpenStack, looking at (mumbles), looking at VMware, and since, what we've now started really expanding into is, of course, the multi-cloud and hybrid cloud scenario. And looking at how to secure these clouds on prem, in the cloud, multi-cloud, as well as bring rich analytics into real-time operations insight as to what's going on in all of these environments. And how to optimize them. >> Yeah, that whole multi-cloud hybrid cloud thing is really exploded in the last 12 months. I'm hearing from customers a lot more that they are pursuing a multi-cloud strategy, but it seems that there's just this proliferation of things that you've now got to monitor and secure. So, how are you helping customers to do that? >> So, I mean, you're going to start with the basics. Right? So, the first thing that we got to realize is there are, of course, those companies that are born in the cloud. But then, there's a whole bunch of others who have for long run their own data centers and run their application stacks on prem, who are now looking to migrate to the public cloud and build all that multi-cloud scenario. In that situation, I would say, you need a little bit of hand-holding. You need to understand how your application's running on prem, which ones can be moved to the cloud, how can they be moved to the cloud, you want to ensure that those policies that you were implementing on prem you'll be able to implement those same policies in the public cloud, as well. The monitoring really starts on prem. All of those policies that operation starts on prem, and then you take them and you build them and you >> I'll get your take on, we'll have to get your take too, Justin, on something that's going on that I see clear visibility on. Infrastructure operations, data center cloud, get your house in order, networks, migration, hybrid cloud, multi-cloud, and then all that stuff. Then you've got this developer tsunami going on, a renaissance of real new development, new kinds of development, multiple databases using in app, IoT, so, the software development methodologies are changing for developers. That's obvious. What's the impact to the infrastructure guys, because you're starting to see Lambda and Server List as a way for saying complete infrastructure is code. How does that change the notion of, what the hell the data center is? Because you could argue that's just an edge now. So, what's the software, what are some of the software practices you see that are notable? >> The ones truly amazing, like in all these things that you're saying, is that you no longer need to use one approach to build anything. Any product that we put out, or any service that you put out, now uses a combination of all of these things. It could be Lambda, it could be IoT, it could be a wholesale application that's office started using (mumbles), that's spanning that multi-cloud environment. So, it's the beauty of all of this is the power of choice. We have so much more choice available to us. Right? But then, when choices, with choice comes that explosion and that complexity. It's >> Complexity is key, but speed is also there. You see. So, the question is, at what point does the cream rise to the top, and the people that are slow get run over. >> We're just seeing another evolution in obstruction, really, it's like, we don't write an assembly code anymore. We're writing directly to the hardware. We added in high-level programming languages, and now, in terms of the infrastructure, developers don't care about infrastructure as much as people talk about dev ops, and the thing like dev ops is a thing, developers don't want to deal with the infrastructure. They want to deal with code, cuz that's where they live. And the infrastructure folks, well, a lot of them are actually becoming developers now. So, they're learning how to use tools like, using development tools to actually get their job done. Which is where we're seeing infrastructure is going. So, there's a lot more ob abstraction into pure software, so you don't have to worry about the underlying obstructions, at least, not very much. >> All right, Sumeet, question to you now on that is, that requires the network guys, Juniper, you're part of that, and all the analytics to think differently about what you're instrumenting. To do what he said, to make it free, you gotta enable a lot of policy, a lotta data analytics, take us through what's the current state of the art there. >> So, the current state of the art, is essentially, if you talk about Juniper products, we have our family of SRX products, where you can have on prem firewalls, as well as virtual firewalls in the cloud, and using these tools, you can have consistent policies on prem and in the cloud. You can free up transit VPCs. Then there are the obligations in the multi cloud world, and do all kinds of fancy things. But where we also going with our solutions is to make them much more simpler to consume. It's truly all about simplicity, right? Because now you have all this choice, and you can have Lambda, and you can have all these new ways to bring up your applications. What becomes key is that the policies that you wanna implement become automatic. Right? And the way to do that is, the way we are doing that is, essentially, doing this auto-learning of your environment. Right? Automatically understanding, Automation, right? But, not, automation in two parts, as in automatically detect what's going on, but then automatically apply the policies as well, no matter where the workload is and where it's scaling, we automatically apply the policies to it. >> So, it's a lot of investment in this mart of underly-- Making something simple is actually quite complex to do. So, you need to understand what are the right things to automate, and what are the few things where you actually wanna give humans that choice, without it becoming overwhelming, so that, okay, I have to choose between one of 800 different ways of doing this. That's just not something that humans cope well with, whereas machines are actually really good at that. >> And that's the value here. We want to hide all the complexity under the hood. You know, use those advanced logarithms, use, you know, where they be on prem or in the cloud, but running all the analysis, implementing all the right policies for you, right? And new, new workload comes up it should automatically get the policy, right? And we are now able to do that both in the private data center, as well as in the public cloud, and bridge those policies together for you, automatically. >> The common theme we're seeing in cloud, we had a guest on from Thorn, where they automate, essentially, police officers writing down notes in a notebook to fully spotting with machine learning and all this great stuff, to find missing and exploited children, manual sucks, basically. Manual's slow-- >> The workload's too dominant now for you to think about manual. >> I want real-time. So most organizations, what's going on there? How do you guys help there, what's the progress? >> Oh. So, this is actually a great question, by the way, so, and this is part of the reason why we like, as a company, as a start up, maybe, we're like, doing all this cool stuff, and, you know, not really thinking about all the, hey, this is slowing me down. The reason why we went to Juniper, if you look at the history of Juniper, and the product portfolio, and the stock at Juniper, when it comes to automation, when it comes to things like ABI, when it comes to things like policy, they've always kind of like led the pack in that networking space, and now this is the opportunity to take that that wealth of knowledge, and scale it out, and take it to a little bit broader multi-cloud, hybrid cloud space. But, that's truly where it is, and even if you, kind of like go down low level to the devices, all Juniper devices are able to stream real-time elements. We are able to do ML in real-time, even on the physical devices, right? Similar for all virtual devices, and now, with our Formix, we even bring in the performance and operations inside, from the running infrastructure, whether it's on prem and in the cloud, not just networking, but the compute, the databases, your applications, your clusters, all of that, to build for you this end-to-end view, right? Not just the networks, your servers, Vms, workloads, the underlying network, the connectivity, all of it. >> How does that, because the developers, they live in application land, and again, they don't really care about that infrastructure, but as it turns out, sometimes it's quite useful to know which particular network devices, or what the infrastructure is that underpins things, like where you sometimes need to be able to drop into assembly code to really optimize things, so are you making that information about the infrastructure visible to developers in a way that they like to, to know and consume? >> Absolutely, so, one key thing about, you know, our product portfolio, and how we are releasing our services, essentially, we've wrapped everything around, you know, these role-based access interfaces. Where both the operators are able to get their views, they're able to construct views that the developers are able to see, and then both can implement their own policies, right? If, let's say, there's some infrastructure that's down, or is unhealthy, then having that global topology view helps you in real-time totally, and in real-time informs you what the impact of that outage is. Like who are the developers who would be impacted, what are their obligations? And, you know, we can bring that insight, and consume it to run the automation. So, if, let's just say, some infrastructure's unhealthy, can you read off the graph? >> Sumeet, talk about what you guys are doing here. How's Amazon, big learning conference, but it's a massive show, 45,000 people here, across multiple hotels. A lot of sessions. What do you guys talk about? What's the big cloud piece for you guys? >> For us, really, first, it's just visibility, right? We have a product portfolio that gives you visibility. Like, both for your physical infrastructure, and your virtual structure. Then, the next thing is, of course, You know, yeah, you have the visibility. But then, at our scale, no human can consume all that information. It's too slow. It's too slow. So, you've gotta have the machine-learning built in. So, it's promoting that visibility into insights in real time, and then, it's about how do you secure your workloads? So, consuming all of that insight to implement all of the policies, implement all of the automation, to ensure that everything is running as you want it to. >> What's your Juniper message to the developers here? Is there a new face to Juniper, a new vibe? You mentioned Juniper's always had great products, like, you move packets around at lightning speeds, you know, wire speeds, all that great stuff. How do you, what's new? What's it mean for me as a developer, what is Juniper, how's it make my life easier? >> What's new is that now it's easier for developers to consume our products. Our products are now available in the Amazon marketplace, right? Our visibility products, our machine-learning products, our security products, right? You can just click, install, and start using them. That's new for Juniper, right? I mean, traditionally you would think of-- >> You probably get Juniper goodness just by treating it like a library. >> That's it. You can just download, not even download, right? You're -- >> It's server-less. It's router-less. It's device-less. >> There you go. You can just start consuming them. And then, if you do have that knowledge of how do you use those devices on prem, then you can apply that knowledge in the cloud, and then use them all. >> Must be computing back in, what, like 20 years ago. I mean, is it just like a grid now. >> Oh, yeah, pretty much, yeah. >> It's a fabric. >> It's the same, if you already know how to use it one place, you know how to use it everywhere. >> Yeah, but, I mean, it's, really, the value of the cloud is making it even simpler, right? Running all of that automation, like we talked about Lambda, like even within our products family, we can, we use Lambda to constantly see what's changing, and that's how we process lots of our internal transactions, as well. >> Sumeet, congratulations on your acquisition and your entrepreneurial journey, and now you're at Juniper. Looking forward to keeping in touch. Sumeet Singh, Vice President of Cloud Analytics, and now at Juniper Networks, formerly AppFormix, CUBE alumni, thanks for coming on and sharing your commentary. I'm John Furrier, and Justin Moore, here on theCUBE, main stage in Las Vegas at AMS re:Invent We'll be back with more after this short break. (lively electronic music)