>> live from San Francisco, celebrating 10 years of high tech coverage. It's the Cube covering Veum World 2019 brought to you by VM Wear and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back. We're here at V Emerald 2019 in the lobby of Mosconi north, back in San Francisco, where it all began. 10th year of the Cube covering VM world. I'm stupid and my co host is John Troyer. Expensive time working for Vienna, where he's been doing the kid with us now for over three years. It was Veum world that we brought in the first time. >> I believe I was working with you on the other side. That that here >> absolutely and welcoming. First back to the program. One of our cube alumni, Rawlinson Rivera, who's the CTO of the global field at Cohesive E. Thanks for joining us again. My pleasure, man. Always excited when we get to talk to Ah, customer is a customer and a service provider. Brock Marie, who's the chief technologist at? Whoa, >> Correct. Thanks for having. >> All right. So we're gonna get Tau Whoa in a second, cause really want to dig in an interesting name? I'm sure you guys have some fun with that, I would hope. But Rawlinson, first of all, you know Veum world always big celebration back in San Francisco celebration. But 10 years of the Cube to you know, what's it all mean to you? >> Amazing. The fact that I've been here a couple of times now it's great. It's a good, great way to put a stamp on my existence. He would be able to >> Yeah, you know, amazing ecosystem and lots of ah ah, as we said, we just had Jerry chain on. It's the deviant where? Mafia. I'm sitting here with two former VM where employees do so even when they've left their still tight with a lot of going on there. All right, Brock, you've been to this event Ah, a few times before we get into Whoa, Just tell us, You know, what does the world mean to you? >> Soviet world is obviously it's a huge networking event. You get Thio not only see your peers, but also other players in the industries and be able to evaluate their products and see what they have. >> All right, so tell us a little bit about Whoa. >> So what dot com was founded in 2013 we ah, tout ourselves as a cyber secure cloud platform. Ah, we've done more than just stand up TVM where bits for hosting we've actually integrated some threat protection and some network defense items. Uh, around that infrastructure. >> All right, give us a little bit of the Brett. You know, how many locations? Verticality. All that kind of. >> So our headquarters is in Hollywood, Florida. We have a data center presence in Miami, a data center presence in Grand Rapids, Michigan, and one and switch LV in Las Vegas. So that gives us coverage over the United States. All >> right, I've toward one of those facilities. You probably amazing facility. So, uh, >> yeah, well, can you tell us a little bit about what was business? And I'm in particular interested in being a service provider in 2019 right? A lot of noise about the big public clouds. But as the folks here at B M, where no, there's trillions of dollars flowing through a nightie ecosystem that, you know, some of it's going to the public cloud. But there's lots of need for service providers. Providing specialty service's or hands on service is or I'm kind of curious. What is your business? What is your business and like, how does it intersect with data, Which is where we're getting to hear? >> Yeah, absolutely. So with our focus on compliance, that's really one of the major differentiators from us with the hyper scale Er's or the Big three is a lot of people like to call them, um that gives us the ability also to tune and make sure that their workloads are precise and running the way that they want with the security models around them. Uh, plus, it's the you know you got, you could reach out and you can contact us. We pick up the phone, we support all of our customers. Uh, we love to go above and beyond and make sure that they're happy. So we want to kind of give them that that boutique type feel and be able to provide. The service is out. >> We're talking verticals like, >> yes. Oh, health care is a big one. Obviously, um and then there's, you know, huge requirements around that for data protection and ah, data isolation and so forth. Um and also, you know, on the cyber security side, cyber scan the new release from these guys is something that we're definitely foaming at the mouth to get at it. Something that we're ready to put into play because it's it's a value, add back to our customers and having their product in that position gives us an advantage, >> right? Rawlinson. He teed you up. But you know, in general, you know, we know where cohesive He has played in the enterprise on what's been happening. A lot of the environment gives a little bit of the landscape for the service providers and where cohesively plays. We know that that's you know, it's been a great no only customer, but almost a channel for many technology in the space for a number of years. Well, you >> know, we have our own sort of like division within the Coast, just with sports writer of market. What we doing, we're enabling them to provide their customers with the value that we gave our enterprise customers already so opening up more than just the backup, right? So one of the things that rock mentioned is this new capability. Have a performing scans for vulnerability scans within the systems. When have you ever been able to do that on something that just sits there and it's just an insurance policy in the past. Now we can give you the ability to provide your customers ability to look into their data whether there have a vulnerability or not in place and tell him before they do it. Did you want to restore this? You wanna protect it with X amount of vulnerabilities. You want to fix it before you do it, And that kind of level of service is being provided. It delivers in immense value to customers everywhere. All >> right, So is this the first product that uses a few city or have you been using other >> s? So we obviously we dove in headfirst with data protection? Um, our previous data protection product wasn't living up to, ah, up to its claims. And that sparked us to go out and start looking at other vendors. And it actually happened at the end world. A few years ago, I came across Cohesive E, uh, worked with their guys. We did a POC. Um, we attacked some of our major pain points right off the bat, and cohesive handled it without any problems. >> I'm kind of curious. So we're talking about a second secondary storage platform. You know, uh, backup is is a use of it, But once you live in the world now we don't. We still put something, the things on tape, but okay, the bits are live there on a disk somewhere, and back them up. So as an example of this for the security scans, some of this ransomware stuff can lie dormant for months before turning on. So it's not a matter of like, Oh, I've just restored the backup from last week. You may have to go search through the all your your your checkpoints. Right. So that's an example of how having a secondary storage platform really enables a lot of security. So that's my with my understanding. Several out, maybe. Tee you up. Can you talk about data? The secondary storage data platform in general And security is one aspect. Data protection is another. I don't know. >> I mean, that's right. Yeah. The thing about what we do is that we as a data management platform, which was kind of getting falling into that there's many fastest to managing with data. We started with the data protection piece. Now we adding other value to the areas which is just pointed out. There's a lot of dark data that you don't get to see because of description of silos, and >> I >> don't really use that Now. We have the ability to provide that value that everyone else on the service provider business can leverage because now they have. Like you said, I have to go look through all these different generations of that protection job that I'm doing now. We do that instantaneous. We do that at the core. So now you're able to identify and report on that and be able to correct it before you have to go through that process, which is which is incredible. Now, if that's on the data protection side, we also have the ability of using. You can use cohesive as a file if they want to do that. Now we're talking to live information that can access the same suite of capability and tools, are there and can report the same way. >> Yeah, if I can add to that to one of the one of the really cool features that I that I like that Cohee City does is when you're using filer service is and things like that. You still have the ability to protect that data as well. So you can replicate those snapshots out to other locations and so forth. So ah, we found that was, ah, pretty good benefit for us. We have a configuration management platform that we ended up putting amount on one of those servers, and we want to protect that in our other location. And this is our own internal operations. So we leverage the platform is well, we protect that data by replicating into another Geo >> Brock. Connect the dots for us. We understand us pain points. But what is this colucci city solutions that you're using mean for your ultimate end user customers >> Confidence, That's, you know, knowing that when that backup report comes in and hits their inbox, that all of those jobs are gonna be successful. And ultimately, what that turns into is when they need that data back, they need to restore it. It's going to be there for them, all right? >> Anything you'd add about the impact on the customers when you're working with service providers, any kind of broader discussion of the service writers. >> I mean, it's great the things that we do because now we're not only typically we enable our enterprise customers to do this. Now we're neighbors and our service providers to enable their customers to do that as well. And you know what? We just we just in the background. It's their business, right? They're the ones who are providing the service, making a service for for the customer based on what they need. And it is good for us to kind of enable that and let them do what they need to. They would just make money, make money, protect their money and make more money. >> Brock, I'm kind of curious you and your your customers, right? A lot of talking vigil, transformation at agility. We've all gotta make money. We've all gotta move fast, and I'm guessing you know it again. In an ecosystem where there are very big players and very small players, part of you still have to move fast, and your customers expect you to be delivering News Service's and reliable service is et cetera. Can you maybe just talk a little bit about kind of what your customers are looking for? Uh, you know how the relationship goes with, Maybe with a with a provider like like you have a team And will he see building healthy? You know, how fast can you turn on the service is how fast is that ramp up in? Maybe with the >> Sure so. And it's funny because I've actually been having some other conversations on how we can improve the existing workflow. Ah, but the workflow has been, uh, not, um, we've had to re architect a couple of network items to be able to, ah, to facilitate external backups. For example, being a service provider, I don't just back up the EMS within my environment. I backup PM's in customers environments as well. So laying the foundation to be ableto have these. Ah, these units replicate between each other, eases that path and and again it comes down to revenue. The faster I can get that box coming in, the faster that I can realize revenue on the product. >> A lot of discussion in this show about some of the future things you know, the emerging, where is talking about container ization and building communities into Evie's fear, talking about their multi cloud connectivity that they're having. I know the City's got a strong play partnering with all the public cloud environment. Give us look out as toe. How does that impact your business? Where do you see that going from your roadmap standpoint? >> Absolutely. So, uh, with with the cohesive platform, especially with the, uh, the big three hyper scale er's, for example, we're actually looking at a way to put our long term storage out on that out on those service is we'll keep our short term storage internal or on Prem wherever the customers scenario might be. But we want to leverage that that long term storage so that we don't have to manage that data over a seven year period. We do manage it. We'll ever do your guys tools to be able to do it, but it's in a hyper scaler. I don't need to worry about it. >> And to add to that were also as a Zvi, Ammar moves alone and catches on the wave of the Cuban. Any journalist after we also do that already so we can actually provide protection of name spaces for for the kubernetes environment, something you'll start seeing, you'll see we released very soon. So we already given the short stories provides the ability to compete with the hyper scale is providing those newer cloud Native service is they need to be. You have available for them to know we're gonna make that would enable that for everyone. Still haven't we would offer it universal. >> Well, actually, that that brings up a question Brock hour in terms of being cloud native. Either you, you guys spending up more service is more cloud native APS or your customers. And I'm not sure if they're building off if they're bringing off the shelf APS to you or if they're building custom maps. I mean, where do you see the evolution of this hole field in terms of Dev Ops and Cloud Native? >> Definitely. So Cloud Native is ah, is a very interesting architecture play, especially with the micro service's and dynamically building machines on the fly. And things like that is very, very exciting. Very intriguing. Um, our workloads tend to be more traditional vm type workloads. Uh, I have been having conversations with customers, technical groups. Hey, you guys should start looking at Micro service. Is this is something you guys can improve your guys. Your service delivery with um, we haven't gotten there yet. We're using some container service is internally for our own operations, but externally, we're still trying to, you know, part of the digital transformation. Work with your customers to provide them >> solutions. All right, Brock, when you know one of the things we come to this show, we always get. Okay, great. Here's where we are today. Here's where we going tomorrow. Usually have a wish list, you know, we know service fighters. Yes. If you could make it a little cheaper, you know, we need to be able to pass those margins, you know, down to our customer. What? What's on your wish list? What would make you know your company's life easier? >> Ah, well, cohesive. He's done a very good job of that already, so ah, again, you know, having confidence in your backups and being able to sleep at night is definitely huge. Um, so on my wish list, I like the direction they're going with the integration and, ah, lot of the workbench products and so forth. Honestly, I don't have a ton of wish list. I'm more sitting back watching what these guys are gonna come out with because cyber scans, one that actually came out of left field for me. And, um, this >> is awesome. What I think is interesting about these these architecture is that there are this this app layer that they that they're now introducing that Yes, there's kubernetes there, but it's a lot of APS. Data service is that are very close to the data. I don't know what What do you guys have in store? What are you talking about here at the show in terms of new service is because it's now you just containerized it. You, Doc, arise it and stick it in your thing and your your plane. And it's there on the on the device that >> the focus for us has basically continue to deliver value on the platform that people only thought it was data protection. It's way more than that. He has he comes availability scanners being one of them, but also opening the platform for customers and cell service providers. You know what you need. You know what service? If you need to create a developed for what you need to do, do it and put it on us. Do not move the date away from where where is safely stored, located, bring the application to it. That eliminates risks of, you know, data leakage and all these kinds of things that you have a secure, centralized, scalable everything you want. It's all in place. >> Yeah, I think it's a great point. You know, when when the company first came out, it's like, Okay, well, here's the product at the day. But Mohit is building a platform that is his history, and that's not what he's doing. And I know that's what excited a lot of people in the early days. And as you said, your data management platform now. So we know we're now actually are, at least at the early stages of where the company is going with the overall solution. >> Your moments very methodical. He decided to go one way, one thing at a time, right? We're not a Swiss army knife. We're not gonna Well, the ocean we come out, we master the one thing that was the most painful so far. Data protection. We fixed back up, and now we're going to give you the rest of what you get from the platform after we master that. All >> right? I want to give you the final words. You've been going through this journey now for a few years when you talk to your peers, What advice would you give than anything you've learned along the way? Is that all? It's great, But boy, I wish I could have shortcut. Certain things were, you know, planned something a little bit different. You know what learning is gonna share? >> Eso definitely plant plan your deployments. You know, there's there's some new features and new items that are coming out. But, you know, again, one of the great things about you he city you have a virtual ization of the E series. Go in there and break it on the V E Siri's and then deployed on your hardware. >> All right, >> Brock and Rawlinson Thank you so much for joining us. Appreciate all the updates and congratulations on the progress we've been making for John Troyer. Arms to Minuteman. Back with lots more coverage at the midpoint of three days. Walter Wall coverage two sets 10th Year of the Cube at VM World 2019. Thanks as always, for watching

Cisco extracting the signal from the noise it's the cube covering vmworld 2015 brought to you by VMware and its ecosystem sponsors now your host still minimun welcome back to vmworld 2015 here in San Francisco this is SiliconANGLE tv's live broadcast of V emerald 2015 I'm stupid a man with Wikibon calm happy to have on this segment talking about the future of software-defined storage hyper converged everything there is Christo's Carol Manolos who's the CTO and principal engineer in the vmware storage group because those first time in the cube thank you for joining us thank you for having me here all right so you know the buzz over the last year when one of the hottest topics inside the vmware ecosystem has been this whole you know virtual sand v vols of course has had you know quite a bit of activity can he first set for us you know what what's your role inside vmware how long you been there sure i've been a long time ER at vmware I've been with VMware for 10 years almost now and for most of this time I've been working on storage and availability products the last few years I've been working on virtual son specifically I was one of very original architects of the product and the people that had the original idea and most recently the last few months have have had a wider olam now the the city of the business unit with a responsibility for technical insight and robot for a range of products not only this on but also our availability products course Torres features and included in this yeah sir Sir sir Sir Christos Charles said I think their stuff ever member 8 500 engineer's inside that the storage unit 10 years ago yeah I'm curious how many were in that group oh we were a handful we could you know you could always walk down the hallway to the engineer you need to deal with so yes it has been a no a very big change in that respect even though invent a new york teams we still maintain a a mentality of a small company startup of you is where everybody works closely with everybody else and even though now we're distributed we organize our projects such a way that teams are very agile they work very closely together yes so I mean I think everybody that watches this space knows that you know VMware's always had a lot of storage pieces and interaction you know back to you know what happens with SRM wood storage vmotion when that came out but the role has become a lot more front and center when you talk about what's happening with v Vols and virtual sand can you just give us kind of your personal journey and insight as that dress actually this goes back many years I would say probably sometime around two thousand nine where we started thinking a little bit more fundamentally about what is the stores how is the industry what in this industry evolving and what do we see VMR all banking this a new world and we made an explicit decision that we need to drive the narration that we need to drive the industry in a direction would be we believe this the best direction for our customers current and future so our vision around stores from back then in 2009 when actually we we shared a white paper with a many partners back then was twofold on one hand we're going to introduce a management model from from storage that is much more application centric a model where the owner the application that administrator can require in at a high level in the form of policies as we call them what they want from the storage without necessarily having to know all the gory details of the hardware or implementation details of every individual vendors products so you say what you want know how to do it and then the storage platform should be able to automatically configure provision your stores and so that you get a quality of service the properties you want for your application that is one side and that led us to a number of projects and features now that range from storage policy based management to virtual volumes and a number of data protection as solutions around that on the other hand we also decided that we should really give to our customers a storage platform that implements that vision in the best possible way so that was that you know the genesis of a virtual son essentially virtual son is vmware's own storage platform that follows a certain architecture we decided that a hyper converts architecture is the best way to go because meth emits the best possible way the requirements of our customers requirements for streamlined simple procurement deployment configuration and operational management of of their stores infrastructure and do that in a way that does not require specialization that doesn't require to be expert in any specific vendors products or you know don't need to even know the gold details of their storage hardware instead of that we want to offer to the customers a way to manage stores in the same way they manage today their computing infrastructure the computer resources and now with NSX also the network resources a unified model we can manage their clusters that provide all the fundamental services they need for their applications yeah I think Charles Phan had a good way of looking at it he said we don't think of a visa and cluster it's just a vsphere cluster that uses V Sam so it's very different operational model you know we know that the growth of the virtualization admin you know highlighted always this year and we see you know record numbers of attendees so talk a little bit about you know is this you know a major shift or you know it just kind of a continuation an expansion of what you know we've been seeing from vSphere so last decade I would like to differentiate here since you know I'm an engineer that's how the technology and the product the the visa on storage space room has been designed as its genetic storage platform and here at vmware will have a number of sessions where we actually talked about that and we stress some of the advantage of that approach now for the specific product we have we're releasing we have released and we are supporting now we decide to take a certain packaging approach if you wish which is make this product very easy to manage by essentially taking making the storage cluster to be the same as your computer pastor that has sounds like a very simple idea but has tremendous benefits starting from the fact that we'd only need to introduce new management obstructions you don't have to configure and provision your store ads and then decide which host has visibility which data store all those no fencing and zoning techniques that you probably are very familiar yourself with which actually the kind of complex management operations we try to eliminate moreover by making this simple constraint very simple constraint on the product we allowed management to be done with simple extensions to existing management abstractions and workflows and even api's that are extremely common among our customers that they're used to write scripts or code that automate the management of every infrastructure so with virtual Sun now we have added a few new API s and extend a few existing API so for the vSphere at mean this is a natural extension of managing their computer clusters yeah I I thought just came to me because you know you think back as to what happened in storage kind of last 15 years you know there was a many attempts to do what we called storage virtualization and what a layer of abstraction in there and try to help clean it up well storage is pretty complex and while virtualization from a compute standpoint we've seen huge benefit from a storage pan standpoint there were usually real limits as to I couldn't leverage the functionality underneath it true head of genera tejan 80 underneath was difficult um you're not trying to virtualize storage here at all i don't think what you really help to simplify what's happening and you're leveraging the platform that you have is that a fair statement it is from from a customer's perspective yes it is but from a technology guess there is there are some complexity there obviously but that is the whole point we're trying to hide the complexities and deal with some of those I've worked on some of those early virtualization products myself what we're trying to do is hide all that complexity that we were exposing to the administrators before and help them in a way which is automated where the options are the obvious ones and because we we have certain constraints we have the class as we have the certain types of hardware we can afford to do some of those things automatically now and so that in addition to an extensive card compatibility list certification process who have allows to deal with a broad range of hardware without having to expose some of the gory details of the decisions of how you configure that hardware up to the administrator so but as you pointed out very well from the administrator this is not really about stores this is about the data consumption needs of their applications and that is exactly that the abstractions were exposing upstream to the application of the administrator yeah thnkx it could practically break down some of the technology versus the packaging one of the frustrations I've had when people look at this market is they tend to say okay when the first version comes out there and we shrink wrapped it and you know and shipped it out as here's the skew and here's the sheet metal and they're like oh okay hyper convergence it's a box and it's like hyper convergence as a trend the box is the least interesting piece of this it's super important to have the stack the hard worked out a bit early list who have tested that out I mean that if we simplify that that that's such a huge savings because operationally we know how things break but I want to give you know you're CTO hat you know what do you see as the vision you know this dissolution is good today but it's not the end where does this journey take us and what what's the vision going for this is the few billion dollars question I guess so I see two two directions there on one hand we today we have a platform that as we discuss already the management which is centered around the management of your corner of your computer clusters and those compute classes those management obstructs exists in vsphere today because they they're the core around which we do distributes resource scheduling around which we deploy features such as AIT's a DRS vMotion and why do you have those because applications today are the so-called monolithic applications they do not have natively the ability to be fault tolerant to be highly available to be able to tolerate and co Tori's resource changes themselves so this is why vSphere has been so successful because we add all these business continuity features to applications that had no idea about such concepts when they were in similar design now we're moving gradually towards a wall of cloud native applications their platform applications whatever you want to to call them where we see that the application by definition is more aware of the infrastructure scalability distribution and even fault tolerance features are natively integrating the application so Rick needs for things like DRS or HEA are very different or may not even exist in some of the new applications however now we see these applications having scalability requires which exceed the current limits of vSphere clusters computer classes which are up to 64 node as you understand so one set of challenges and opportunities I see ahead of us is how to deal with storage infrastructures that can meet the demands of those applications how can we use a plot from like a virtual Sun to extend it and deal with the management of infrastructures that span thousands perhaps tens of thousands of physical cause with applications that even our distribute across geographical location so one set of challenges is management of storage infrastructure at very large scale and we have a few interesting ideas and I had the opportunity to talk to customers today in a couple of events about those on one hand what we are exploring as we speak with a few prototypes in the lab is new management models where we collect and process a lot of data that have to do with the physical infrastructure with the application workers that ran on that virtual infrastructure we store them we process them and through that processing and analytics we run on them we provide the users we fed a holistic view of their infrastructure allowing them to zoom in and air in the areas of interest where that those areas have to do with problems and help them do troubleshooting and help them decide what is what are the right remediation actions or there is just a awareness of how the application is doing how it is evolving and what are the chances that should be aware of so they're prepared in terms of investment in hardware infrastructure and so on so that is one one dimension that's I'm very excited that we have some really cool ideas there are other dimension has to do with this consumption of storage I said all these nice things about fine grain policy based management where an application gets the quality of service requires without the administrator need to having to do any fine grain configuration of physical hardware well we want to take this model to go beyond traditional virtual machines with the ritual skazhi disk to a model where applications that use other obstructions perhaps file systems or native blog protocols like nvme or perhaps even object stores like ancestry and similar types of stores that they can really take advantage of a single platform with a unified management model along the lines of what I described a few seconds ago but still be able to consume different types of storage and manage them with the same approaches so that is the other thing offered to the applications for example containerized cloud native applications file systems distribute file systems that solve some of the critical problems that we know the address image management sir data volumes and so on well Christmas I feel like I'm looking back to my year to summary that I did on servers and and one of the critiques I gave is current solutions today they're using the same applications typically that sat in your traditional standard ass environments and they hadn't been it's not the modern applications it's not that you know the cloud native hugely scalable architectures you laid out a bunch of the challenges there do you think we're going to hit from a technology standpoint that the growth of those applications and the maturity of this solution set do you think they match pretty well you know yes that's a good question which is you know what we all are not debating here but I believe at a high level we have the building blocks for the technologies that are required I believe we have the ability to scale to infrastructures of thousands of physical we have the ability to provide the storage even a third model of storage with high availability and served by the platform for cloud native applications where I think the bigger the biggest challenges are and where things really you know make a difference is the model of managing those infrastructures and this is something which is a little subjective that is something you have to develop in an iterative fashion jointly with customers and see you know what is the right motor because nobody quite know these things today with this a few of software development teams that have currently built such applications they are very sophisticated or they build applications for very specific environments I think the talents and the opportunity for companies like VMware is to develop a model a management model that allows and facilitates many different software organizations from different companies to take advantage of these new ideas without having to reinvent the wheel from Scrubs all right well Chris does really appreciate you taking time I know you've been talking a lot this week as with all of us trying to keep our voices through the final sprint here lots of stuff to look forward as to the maturation growth of you know this really important trend so then you offend you forget I'm here it was an opportunity to talk with you and appreciate it awesome thank you for watching we'll be right back wrapping up day three here over the next couple hours here were SiliconANGLE tv's coverage of v emerald 2015 thanks for watching you

okay we're back at vmworld twenty twelve i'm john fairy with SiliconANGLE calm this is the cube this is our flagship telecast we go out to the events extract a signal from the noise and share that with you i'm joe and stu miniman my co-host with this segment and martine casado the co-founder of nicera you guys are ranking number one on our trending tool that we built under networking because it moved up to the top of the list because of vmworld company had spent a billion dollars for you guys jaishree from Arista called you guys the Instagram of networking kind of tongue-in-cheek on the huge buyout but hey congratulations great wired story today SR with you guys we've done about the talent you have and you brought over the vmworld and you're the top story here so congratulations thank you welcome to the cube thank you so take us through the logic and your motion around past year okay up until the buyout what a roller coaster so just share with us personally from Europe as an entrepreneur what was it like what highlights of what happened well I guess I've been very focused on changing networking right so for me it's been largely a technical ride and since we started the company five years ago we've been focusing on developing core technology and we did that for the first three years and then the last year to us was primarily about execution and customer engagement and so you know we've spent a lot of time proving the technology getting into production doing the support and fixing out that model and so it turned out is a very natural transition point when the acquisition happened because we had gotten traction we had starting to realize how difficult it is to address a market as large as this within a small start-up and so it was very welcome to come join a much larger company where we can kind of provide this as a much box so you guys have some big backers obviously you know they're all it's all well documented in the valley but every entrepreneur has that moments like wait a minute is this what I wanted is this tea but the dollars was so good and vmware's asti growing company what clicked for you what made you go is this the right thing take us through that decision you know absolutely so I mean like to me business guides behavior and at the end of the day the goal is is how do you change networking and have a very very firm belief that the access layer to that network is moving from within the network towards the edge and so we wanted to develop technologies that can use this position to re-implement networking and software and so once you get the core technology done once you prove it out with large customers once you prove out the market the question is is kind of what is the best way to have the biggest impact and I think in some respects you can look at vmware is one of the largest networking companies in the in the world just based on port count right the number of virtual ports that they control is as large as any large networking vendor so this is the opportunity of a lifetime to change in industry so like I've been doing this now you know sdn since those doing my PhD at stanford for so going on 10 years now and this is the the opportunity of a lifetime to actually have broad broad like planet scale impact well congratulations certainly you disrupted the market not only in the validation of the acquisition but as you guys were moving out and talking about some of the deployments you guys were doing it just came out of left field for most people but in the inside baseball sure people knew it was going on in terms of like how you guys are disrupting so so congratulations thank you here I want to talk about is also the messaging here at vmworld very solid around suffered to find datacenter sure and that really kind of brings you into a whole nother beyond networking so you know we've been covering converged infrastructure that's looking a look upon you know around house storage servers and networking so its bigger now than just networking right so now you're taking it to a whole nother leg of the journey so connect the dots out there for the folks between software virtualization and software-defined networking to this to the data center help them understand what is going to happen under that next leg of the journey yeah of course so we're all familiar with compute virtualization right I mean this is how vmware initially changed the world where the time it takes to provision a workload when from weeks to literally minutes like two minutes however I t isn't about single workloads ideas about applications and all the network services that those applications require for example firewalling or security or or monitoring debugging and so even though we reduce the time it took to provisional workload from weeks two minutes you still took days to do everything else that was required so if we take a broad scope if we take a broad look at a thai tea we still realize it still takes days to provision new applications and to provision new workloads and so the only way to get past this the next step that we want to take is to virtualize every aspect of infrastructure and so there's three of those there's there's compute which is virtualized their storage which we're making good progress on and there's network and network really is a pivot piece right it's the one piece that touches everything right it is between the compute in the storage it is between the different types of compute and so if you look at large data centers even cloud data centers the long pole in the tent and provisioning is the network so we must must virtualize that so the goal is the software-defined data center that's like everything's in software everything's totally dynamic you create it on demand you can move it its liquid it's like water it'll go anywhere but in order for this dream to be realized we've got to get the network out of the way and that's what the sierra does we've been talking about going to go and Wikibon we've just kicked up a whole kind of research section on what we're calling data infrastructure and really highlighting this modern era right and we kind of use a lot of sports analogies but you know a modern era meaning the new way not the old way right so you're a classic example of disruption in a new way so talk about the enablement that you see happening from a from a marker play standpoint just you know open your mind and share the crowds and vision around what you will enable with this because networking is has to be dynamic it has that makes total sense you guys have done it what's going to happen next in your mind's eye in terms of what the possibilities are yeah yeah absolutely so I think ultimately this is where we want to get to we want to build a platform that will provide that will recreate you know every Network Service and functionality in a virtualized manner in software from the edge and that means that there can be any service available anywhere over any type of hardware at any scale that's needed and it can be done all at virtualization timeframe so this is like you do an API call you get a virtual network abstraction you add a firewall to it you you configure ackles to it and so all of network configuration all of network services all of network operations become soft state it becomes like a VM image and it's available anywhere that you want it to and so that is the first step so I believe these transformations and systems and this happened many times in the past happen in two steps the first one is you virtualize and when you virtualize you offer the same thing but in a more flexible manner like when you virtualize compute you offered an x86 cpu but you did it in software after you virtualize you can actually change the operational paradigm like when you when they created compute virtualization they didn't immediately get to migration or snapshot or rewind all these other kind of operational benefits these came later so the first step is any networking anywhere you want at any scale automatically and then the second step is like drastically changing the operational paradigm so you can do things like better security so you can rewind configuration state I mean things that we can't even think about today because now we have this ultimate point of indirection that's virtualized this virtualized layer and who's the candidate for these developers just admins net admins all the above is it going to be software programmatic I mean how does that it takes DevOps right to a level of functionality that is just mind-boggling so yeah who's the new personnel yeah it was like who's life does this impact think what happens called a CI easy out there well I mean it's a good question whose life does this impact I mean I mean immediately anybody that's building out a data center like a cloud architect is going to have this this primitive that that they can use to architect better system just like you gave them a virtual machine they use that as a primitive for building better data centers now we're giving them virtual networks as a primitive build virtual data centers so the cloud architects job gets easier application developers don't have to worry about the basics of you know the way networks work our network configuration operations will have a lot more flexibility and the virtual layer of where they can move things around as far as the physical networking layer the problem actually becomes quite a bit simpler but you still have to focus the on the problem of building a physical network so for example when server virtualization came around you didn't like reduce the need for servers you needed more servers and just like the same thing will happen with with network virtualization which is you'll still need physical networks and they're going to probably have to be better physical networks but the problem now is more of how do you build a physical network with high capacity that can support any workload and less about doing all the operational stuff you do today how does an impact we just had chris hoffman from juniper who's now a worker he's been a big security buff a great guest for us but we just were just riffing on the security problems right so give us your perspective on how this new canvas of software-defined virtualization is gonna impact security paradise yeah so I mean I think there are a couple of answers i actually think ultimately the security model is improved honestly so yeah the original work was done with the intelligence community actually the the original funding for nasira came from the intelligence community my background I used to work for the intelligence agencies and when you move everything to software we already have a fundamental security paradigm which is crust consolidation in the hypervisor right and with network virtualization you follow the same paradigm which is you you entrust the hypervisor to enforce things like isolation enforce the security but now you've got a strongly authenticated endpoint there you're not guessing about things but but it requires the security community to evolve with the virtualization community so I think that there's much more of a socialization hurdle more of a social hurdle than a technical hurdle like all of the technology is there to do good security in the cloud I think getting the traditional vendors to evolve their tools into of all they're thinking it's much more difficult so I've got one more thing to add I actually think there's an opportunity to do security in entirely new ways ones that again can transform the industry so for example with virtualization you've got deep semantics into the workloads I mean you're in the hypervisor you can look inside the VMS you know who's using them know what applications they're using guy you could even know what the documents are being sent or or read or passed around and because you have this information at the edge if you virtualize the network as well you can pass this context into the network so now instead of like looking at packets and kind of trying to guess what application there is by looking at traffic you can actually get past like the ground truth information from the hypervisor so I think we have the potential so it's like drastically improved security that's Martine if you look at the networking industry there's lots of companies that have tried to change it in the past when you talk about innovation standards have a lot of times slow things down yep you know there's the legacy thought set you know great respect for ccie s but you know they have their install base in their way of doing things so you know there's there's so many pieces that make up networking and even the first time I saw your solution there's multiple standards and open you know groups working on this so you know how do you guys tease through and work through all of these issues yeah so clearly a very complex and multifarious question so I'm going to I'm going to attack one piece of it and we can go from there one of the primary benefits of actual virtualization like actual virtualization is that what you end up with should look like what you started with right so like if you're fundamentally changing an operational paradigm you're probably not doing virtualization so for example in a network virtualization solution the physical network is still a physical Network and it needs to be managed like a physical network with physical networking tools and in order to be fully virtualized the virtual abstraction I give you if I give you a virtual network that should also look like the networks that you've kind of grown to love as a child right they should have all the counters all the debugging the ability to interpose services right and so from from that standpoint you're still preserving the interfaces that people are used to it says there's more of them so like for example when I talk to a network operator today they're like oh this is confusing I've got virtualization I say actually instead of having one network that's really complicated you've got em and simple networks now you've got a very simple physical Network and if you got any virtual networks and they all all of the same interfaces that you use to manage it however there's one catch and that one catch is is there's an additional bit of information which is how do you map this virtual world to the physical world which happened in compute virtualization as well so like everybody understood a virtual machine everybody understood the physical machine but people weren't entirely sure how you debug the mapping between the two and that's incumbent as US is software providers and solution providers to provide that to provide the ability to to map from this kind of you know like platonic virtual reality down to this kind of gritty physical reality okay so from a standard standpoint you I mean you guys helped invent OpenFlow you guys created the open V switch you're heavily involved in OpenStack Andy there's been a lot of buzz since the acquisition about you know the involvement in OpenStack and yeah yeah kind of God how many people today everything in what's your thoughts on it yeah so let me also teach a tease apart you know two things before I get to that one so in networking standards are really important and like in the way standards work he's got a bunch of people that kind of go and talk about things and they design things they agree on them that's actually quite different than open source right and like their different processes different communities different rules of engagement so let me focus on the open source first then we'll go back to the standards thank you because I perfect just to give you a little bit foreshadowing like I hope the world goes open source not open Stan so can we do to it so but we'll get there right so as far as open source yes so I wrote the first version of open flow I mean it came out of my thesis right the first three employees of nicera created the first craft of open flow and it was it was just something that we wanted to use to control switches right i mean we wrote the first reference implementation the first open flow controller you know we seeded the stanford stuff of course i'm a consulting a faculty at stanford so i was involved there we also are the primary developers behind open V switch it's in the linux kernel you know we've probably put you know many millions of dollars in developing that it's used by competitors and partners alike that's used in many clouds and then we've heavily participated in an OpenStack in particular you know where the Delete on quantum which is the networking portion of OpenStack we've done a lot of development bear so as far as the merger is concerned the acquisitions concerned none of that will change we're fully committed to open V switch to OpenStack will continue and even escalate our contribution there quick quick note on OpenStack i was told that something for folks have actually entered some code into the OpenStack of storage just kind of curious about that so and we touched many areas of OpenStack and again the the networking piece touches everything and you know we do a lot of the development on quantum and we run actually nasira internally randa an openstack cloud for internal dev cloud and we've got thousands of VMs on it that we use it and so we're heavily we're like heavy users and contributors to both OpenStack and linux I mean if you look in Linux we've actually fixed a lot of the veal and issues in the kernel right so like and we're very very involved in open source but we're involved as users right like we don't sell you know linux we don't sell OpenStack but we do believe for to have a vibrant ecosystem is nice to have these tools out there and as we use the tools we fix them and we contribute it back okay what about multi hypervisor environments because that was one of the things that really impressed me about like the open D switch is it really doesn able kind of that that multi hypervisor even more than kind of heterogeneous switches it's the multi hypervisor piece yeah that's right so if you kind of zoom away like I think we've had like a fairly myopic focus in the industry on servers over the last 10 years and it's like if you zoom away from the server to a data center you end up in this realm of heterogeneous technologies multiple cloud management systems multiple hypervisors and so when we came up with our our initial strategy of building a network virtualization layer we knew networks touch everything we must support all of those technologies and so it was like a fundamental tenant of the technology that we might support all hypervisors and physical hardware switches as well because there are workloads that are not july's and so you know open V switch itself which is the V switch that we use it's in sports in kvm bare metal linux it's been ported to bsd it's been ported to other operating systems it's been ported to top-of-rack hardware switches so we can use all of them to do to do network virtualization so mark can I want to ask you about the sufferer define partnering strategy from a technical perspective obviously we're really big believers in open source as well they love that we'd love to think it's great and it's now a business model in the industry so it's great to see all that work as vmware now with you guys in the family there go to other unifying clouds so they took a multiple clouds at this point so you know what would you bring to the table from hyper Microsoft hyper-v environment and other big vendors HP Dell yeah Microsoft what can you bring to the table in working with those guys or are you outgoing are you talking to them and and if you were having those conversations what does what would those conversations be well so the product itself that we're developing and we we do bring to market now we will continue is a network virtualization platform that's multi hypervisor right and so the goal is to have something that you can deploy into any cloud environment regardless of what CMS are running and regardless of what of what hypervisors they're using now we have many many partners whether their system integrators with the solution partners and so you know we don't have any religion on on the type of technologies in play we want to provide the best virtual networking solution in the industry and that's really our primary our primary focus let me ask you about it Trent some trends in the in the tech community in in academia and the research areas obviously at this example just randomly low-level virtual machines that kind of those kinds of shifts are happening could you talk about just what you're tracking right now that your get your eye on in terms of what's going on at some of the top university obviously low-level virtual machines at the University of Illinois and in Chicago so what other areas can you share with us that you monitoring listen this is a great question to ask a nap academic and I'm going to totally disappoint you in that I you know I i I'm on a lot of pcs and I follow a lot of research I mean you know I submit papers you know all the time and like I've mostly lost faith in the academic process on the research side lately which i haven't relevant so in terms of trends no but that's exactly the point I think that there's enough vision to last for a century and like now it's time to do work and if it were up to me we would all be taking these ideas that we've come up with over the last 10 years there's very few new ones in my opinion and we'd be executing like crazy and so well again while i'm on the pcs and while i do review the papers i do submit the papers i think we should all focus on like changing infrastructure into software executing like hell and changing the world that way and so and I don't have a really bad attitude about this especially as abuse or but it's a bad attitude okay we say it we hit it all hang out so final question for me and if she wants to get one more in and don't you can't say the acquisition as the answer what is the biggest surprise that that that you fell out of your chair over the past 24 months around you in the industry in your entrepreneurial venture here now at VMware and it could be like a surprise and this trend didn't happen that happened that you know these are the things that happened it could be good or bad what's the biggest surprise that caught you off guard this year that's 24 months yeah it's a good question I think the one that actually been a little the most shocking is how how difficult is being just very honest is how difficult to manage perception in the industry and if you look at kind of social media and you look at a lot of the buzz in the rags so much of it is generated by non disinterested parties so invested parties and so I think it's possible to be a perfectly good citizen and then get paint in a very negative light or be a very negative citizen and be painted in a very good light and it's been counterintuitive to me how you manage this effectively like almost a dynamic feedback system so for example this year has been an enormous contributor to open source I think we've contributed more than anybody in our space by you know factor of 10 or more we contributed most of the core technologies and often people like well but it's a proprietary solution on the other hand there sometimes we're like okay this is a closer source product people like we should use this here because it's the open solution and so well I think that definitely felt on both sides you know being both open source and close or sometimes it's worked for us and for the wrong reasons sometimes it's not worked for us for the right reasons and so that dynamic has been the least intuitive to me so I'm not sure I fell off my chair but definitely it's been the most surprising yeah and you know and that's what we're trying to solve a SiliconANGLE as we say we're agile media and ultimately with social media the whole media business is changing so we know one of the things that we care about here so that's why we have the qubits we just this is raw data we want to share be provocative be edgy is too it's a data-driven world and we believe the media business is absolutely screwed up beyond all recognition so so because of just lack of fact-checking just old techniques aren't working and but it's the same game right so it's just so things circulate things get branded and we've seen a time and time again I've seen great people show up as like almost painted as criminals yeah so it's just a sad state of reporting and media so would agree with you there okay John so if I if I can have that one last question your machine you know the networking industries is a big community and when you talk about kind of the jobs that people are doing today what's your recommendation to folks out there in the networking industry what should what should they start to you know we'd or you know start playing with to kind of understand where things are going down the line honestly I don't want to say a cliche but I actually really believe this one I think I think networking networks are evolving to become proper systems and proper systems in an end-to-end manner meaning that goes a very well-defined hardware a software layer they all work together and I think the data center is is becoming a large computer and I think the most important thing is to view the industry and that lens meaning you know I would get as much information as I could on how guys like Google or Amazon or Facebook build their data centers and you realize that if you do a cross-section of these things like the Capital savings the operational savings the flexibility of the software like that's changing the world and if it's not changing the world directly by changing infrastructure it's changing the world to the surfaces they deliver and understanding that model in your bones I think is the beacon going forward so if it were me the first thing I do is I really understand why they make those decisions what the benefits are and I would use that to guide my learning going forward okay Martinez out of this co-founder of this year now at do you have a title at VMware yet or do you I mean did i do I don't know my head honcho of the Sierra am where Thanks coming inside the cube really preciate it we right back with our next guest we're going to wrap up try to wrap up the day as they start to bon jovi soundcheck here at V emerald 2012 this is SiliconANGLE calm and Wikibon doors continues coverage at vmworld great thank you