(Latin music) >> Announcer: Live from San Juan, Puerto Rico. It's the Cube, covering Blockchain Unbound, brought to you by Blockchain Industries. >> Hello, everyone and welcome back to our special, exclusive coverage in Puerto Rico for Blockchain Unbound. I'm John Furrier, your host of the Cube. We're here getting all the action, extracting the signal from the noise. Our next guest is Sunil Verma, who's the partner of Team in Residence venture capital firm doing traditional VC as well as investing in token economics, blockchain, and decentralized applications. Sunil, welcome to the Cube. >> Thank you. >> So I got to get your perspective because you guys have done a lot of high profile deals on the venture side, Slack, Instacart and a slew of others, great portfolio. But you guys also got your eye on the prize on token economics. So explain the strategy of the investment thesis. Is it still venture, all in on token, mix, what's the makeup of the firm, what are you guys doing? >> Yeah, for sure. It's definitely a combination of both. We really feel there's opportunity in the decentralized world and we're really looking at sort of the white spaces there. So what is the LinkedIn of Blockchain look like? What does the Amazon of Blockchain look like? So those are the things we're trying to solve for. But at the same time we're really looking at companies that have the governance and the accountability, and transparency that Blockchain really locks in. That's really what we're investing in. So if there's a token or tokenomic that we really appreciate and we really understand, we'll be participating. >> That's good stuff, I want to ask you kind of the question and it's the classic Silicon Valley metaphor, but I want to put it in context of the venture architecture. How do you architect a venture in this new world? So the minimum viable product, or MVP, minimum viable, MVV, minimum viable venture architecture. What do you look for? Because you mentioned government, governance, we hear consensus, we hear transparency, we hear open source. We're seeing a new venture architecture emerging, it's not your grandfather's classic VC deal, which is team, team, team, patented technology, things are running much faster, running hotter, it's a moving train of technology, the plumbing level, but the business models as you mention are pretty clear, on some of them. What is the minimum viable architecture of a venture look like? >> Yeah, that's a really good question. I think when we were, what we're looking at is not your traditional venture companies, I think team, technology, the financials, product/market fit, all those things still apply in a big way here, and really what we're banking, what we're kind of looking at is how responsible is the team itself? I think over the last sort of 12 months, we've seen folks go out raise really big amounts of capital with no product road map, no business road map, no real way to get from zero to X, and now really what we're focusing on is is there a product that's already been built, do they really understand tokenomics, are they trying to shoehorn a regular business onto the blockchain and just assume that by adding Crypto at the end of toilet paper, they're going to get something? I think that's stuff that we have our red flags up on. >> I want to get your reaction to a comment I made earlier on the Cube, but also on this event. There's three types of profile types that we see, I want to get your reaction to this. One, the startup, we have an idea, it's going to be blockchain enabled, good vision, white paper, check. Maybe some VC might want them, but it's more token. And then the other end of the spectrum, I call the oh, shit, we're going out of business. I call that a pivot. They throw the hail Mary. Then the middle one is the growth company that's growing with token economics, all the elements are in place for a real go to market. What's your reaction to that? Do you see that's something similar and how do you identify each one and the role that you might play as an investor in that? >> No, for sure, I think that when we come at it, we're looking at it from a full stack experience so does the company need resources on blockchain developers, does the company need product and marketing support, do they need PD support? And once you've actually gone live, one of the things we're starting to realize now is you have to really approach this from both a PR standpoint as well as a hire standpoint. And you will have to sort of divorce what the company and what the employees are thinking about and what the investors really want. It's really about, and for a lot of the protocols out there, it's really about the next sort of 15 to 24 months and really getting the exposure that they need. From the early stages it is about the white paper, it is about the technology, it is about making sure you're thinking about it in the right way. >> So you just got to be cognizant what you're saying, if it's early stage, they got to have self-awareness to know that they got some work to do to build it out. >> Sunil: Yup, exactly. >> And then where's the growth elements? >> Sunil: Yeah, exactly. >> All right so I want to get your reaction to the ulity token versus the security token. Obviously a lot of people say, hey, I've got a utility token, and then basically raise money without a product, that's essentially, there's no utility yet, there's no product and people are trying to shortcut that, which is really not an optimized experience, because you've rushed the product to market, in some cases it takes a year to get there, so essentially that CC is kind of signaled against that. So, as an investor, how do you decide what's the best avenue, security token, or utility token, and why in each case would you go for either one? >> Yeah, that's a great question. I think it comes down to where they actually domiciled, where they being, and where are the customer base, right. In all honesty, the center of gravity for blockchain has shifted away from Silicon Valley. It's not Silicon Valley, itself. It definitely is around the Asian marketplace. When we look at the SEC and some of the stuff that they're kind of saying, that's great, no problem, I think we definitely need those checks and balances in place, we're investing in security tokens, that's not a problem for us, that's something that we do all day long. >> John: It's a process you know. >> Yeah, it's a process we understand, exactly. >> Credit investor, reg D, form D. >> We do KYC all day long. The thing is on the utility side, it's like, is there a utility that's broad enough that really is going to affect a billion plus people that we're actually interested in? And to your earlier point, they do have to have a product ready to go. So we're working with folks like Orchid, who have been working on their product for over a year plus. They've actually waited to do the token offering and what not, so those kinds of things, which is decentralized, those kinds of things are the ones that are really exciting to us. >> So what about the dynamic where a company might want to do a security token, raise some cash, and also have a utility token for either consensus or other things and can a company coexist with two ice deals at the same time. Have you seen that? >> You know that's a really good question. I would point you to a lot of the smaller public companies that are on the Nasdaq that are just adding Crypto to their product offering and you know seeing huge spikes. They have to manage both the public investors, and they also have to manage the token offerings, and token investors that they're doing now. I think it's, there are definitely ways to do it but at the end of the day is the team structured correctly to manage it and are we going to see a convergence of the pricing. You're not really going to get the same premium you will in the token markets as you will as on the public markets. >> Quick question on security token, what are you looking for for pledged against the security? Are you okay with future revenues, is it equity, what's your preferred, do you care, is there a preference? >> No, it definitely it's some equity in the company, I think, you know depending on the stage of the company, and the security token type that they're doing, it's equity, might be future revenue sometimes it's dividends or the opportunity to get dividends, so it's a combination of a lot of things. >> Do you have a preference, you care? >> At the end of the day, equity is always preferable. >> Okay, what are you looking at here, what deals have you seen here? Did you do any deals here? >> Yeah, we do, we have a couple, one is called, Creator.AI, they are a decentralized contact creation platform. One is iCash, which is one of the security tokens that's actually kind of out there. Another is Renovo Financial, they're actually doing a JCO, Jobs from the Jobs Act, a token offering based on that, they're actually going to be announcing some really big stuff that is coming up in the next week or so. >> I'm interest to talk about, let's talk about the Jobs Act and how instrumental that was, how that's changed the game on NGO's and mission-driven investing, which we've been covering a lot in DC. Sunil, we'd love to have you come down to our studio in Palo Alto, and talk more. Great to have you, thanks for spending the time. >> Thank you. >> Team in Residence, doing a lot of hot deals on the front end of investing. You get nervous at all, you worried about things these days, what's your mindset like, I mean, it's like white water rafting, you're in the middle of the action, what's it like? >> Oh, for sure, it's exciting, it's fast-paced. I think with the hair cut over the last few days, everyone's sort of rubbing their heads right now, but at the end of the day you have to have the stomach for it, and I think you have to be as educated as you can. >> And look for new liquidity ways. This is the key thing, new liquidities out there. >> I think we're seeing a lot of new liquidity. I think Telegram is a really good example of that. I think folks that didn't want to participate in round one are now getting sort of slugs of time tokens that are out there and they're buying it at a premium and it's all happening in the secondary market. >> That's awesome, with new infrastructure, new dynamics, new reimagining wealth, creation value caps, restore, harnessing that value is changing liquidity, changing the structure of entrepreneurship. Thanks so much, Sunil Verma, thanks for coming on the Cube, appreciate it. I'm John Furrier, more live action coming here in Puerto Rico, the Cube, be right back with more after this short break. (techno music)

>> Narrator: Live from Washington D.C. it's the Cube covering AWS Public Sector Summit. Brought to you by Amazon Web Services. >> Welcome back everyone to the Cube's live coverage of the AWS Public Sector Summit here in our nation's capital, I'm your host Rebecca Knight. We are joined by Aileen Gemma Smith, the CEO and co-founder of Vizalytics Technology. Thank you so much for coming on the cube. >> Thank you for having me, it's a pleasure to be here. >> Let's start by telling our viewers a little bit about Vizalytics, there's a story there about how you founded it. >> Thank you, the mission of Vizalytics is enabling change with data and we saw tremendous opportunity in open and public available data to say, let's make a difference for communities and the whole reason why we started was in 2012 Hurricane Sandy hit my home town of Staten Island and I saw firsthand digital divide, people need access to information, it's not put together in a format that they can use, but it actually is there, so I said, we've got to do something to make a difference. Our first product was a mobile app for shopkeepers. We had thousands of users throughout New York City and then that led on to out first enterprise client being the City of New York. >> The mobile app for shopkeepers could do what? What did it do? >> It let you know everything that was going on outside and around your business that could make a difference to your bottom line, so imagine all you had to do is business name, business address, I'm going to tell you here's your risk for fines, here's when there's going to be public works, here's when someone's filed for a different permit, et cetera, and shopkeepers loved it because we didn't have to do anything to get that information, you told me exactly what I needed to know and you made it really easy to share. >> And now you are a woman founder, a female founder with a she builds t-shirt on and an AWS Hero medallion. Tell me more about this. >> Absolutely, it is a distinct privilege to be an AWS Community Hero. Community Heroes are evangelists for the community where we're talking about how can we build and create more diverse and inclusive communities. I'm privileged and honored to be the only female hero in the Australia and New Zealand region, so I'm determined to say, how can we support more women, how can we support more underestimated founders and tech developers? We have this whole series called She Builds on AWS. We've got events in Sydney, Melbourne, soon to be in Perth, et cetera and that's how we're doing more for our community and as a Community Hero how can I find more voices who aren't me, give them a platform to say, we need to hear what you're building and what you're doing and how can we all support one another as we want to build on on AWS. >> What is it to be like at event like this, where as you said you're the only female Community Hero here, how often are you getting together, collaborating, learning, and how are best practices emerging and what are those best practices? >> First off I want to mention that we have the first ever developer's lounge here in the main hall which is great because we need to see that here in public sector and having those opportunities to meet and greet and talk with folks, hey, you're working on this as well? Tell me more about what you're doing, let me surface out what kind of solutions you're doing, that's where all of the energy and the excitement happens because then you start to discover, oh, I didn't know. Folks are working on this and this, hey we've got the same problem and especially in public sector where folks so often have the challenge of different siloes. I didn't know what I didn't know, how can we bring them all together, so seeing that here in public sector where we can champion, you've got all of these different folks who are working together, it's just a wonderful opportunity. >> And what are you hearing? The big theme here is about IT modernization in the public sector, the public sector, for better or for worse has a reputation of being a little slow or a little more antiquated, there's certain divisions of the government in particular and educational institutions that are incredibly innovative. >> Absolutely. >> Rebecca: Where do you think things stand right now? >> There's absolutely positive change and I like to celebrate here are the leaders and here are the folks that are doing more, yes, public sector does, for good reasons in some cases take a long time to say, how do we want to change, do we feel safe for this change, et cetera, but then you see pockets of excellence. I'm currently based in Sydney, Australia. Transport for New South Wales is one of our clients and I am honored and excited by all that they're doing where at the executive level you have buy-in and you have support. You have support for saying we need organizational change. You have support for saying, let's do proof of concept, let's do these explorations, let's actually have a startup accelerator hub so we as public sector can interact with startups and early-stage founders or university students to make that kind of a difference. When you see that, that's part of why, okay great, we're in Australia now because there's this energy and action and a willingness to move so that's where I think look to those centers of excellence and say, how can we do that within our organization and what can we do better. >> But not saying that we're not seeing quite that energy in the US or how did you think about the differences? >> Again, it depends district by district. Different municipalities have different challenges, different size, et cetera. When you look at this, for example, in San Francisco where you have the Startup in Residence program, started off small, cohort, five or six companies, great, now how can we scale that program and make it national where they had something like 700 applications for maybe a cohort of 50 or 60 companies that are working. That's where you start to see there's an energy that's flowing through, so I think the opportunity for change comes in that kind of cross collaboration and if you have an event like this where you've got public sector folks from all over the world saying, really interesting, you feel my pain, how can we work together on this, what's your team doing, how can I learn from that, how can I take that back to my teams or where can we think about some of the harder problems of organizational change and what do we do if we don't have that executive champion, how can we start to get there? I think that's the kind of energy and opportunity of all the things we're seeing here at Public Sector Summit. >> But as you said, it's also looking for the rest of us, looking at these centers of excellence, see what they're doing, see how they're experimenting, getting those proofs of concept and then saying, hey, we've got something there, let's see if we can replicate this. >> Absolutely, and within public sector, when you have that opportunity to say, and look at how we're doing this in London, look at how we're doing this in Toronto, look at how we're doing this in Sydney and how we're doing this in Melbourne then you can suddenly go back to New York and say, okay great, we do have these other examples, it is being done so we can use that as a guide for what we wanted to do as we continue to innovate. >> What are some of the most exciting things that you're seeing here, some new public sector initiatives, technology, services that you think are really going to be game changers. >> How much time do we have? (laughing) First off, the energy to we want to collaborate, we want to be more agile, we want to make a difference. The sense that this event has grown from just a small cohort to 1,000, couple of thousand, now I believe there's something like 15,000 attendees. >> 18,000 according to Theresa Carlson. >> Think about the fact that we're all willing to be here together, that's a line in the sand that we need to be able to do more, so it's not about a particular technology per se, but willingness to say, we need to be here, we need to face these problems. We've got this challenge of should we bring these legacy systems over, should we think about how we want to work together in public product partnerships that we can all come together and start to work at this and also think about, we've got Public Sector Summits throughout the world, please join us at Canberra Summit that's going to be going on in late August. We've got Tokyo Summit going on right now, so it's not just all here in D.C., you're starting to see these clusters move out and that's really wonderful and exciting for us. >> It's wonderful and exciting on the one hand and yet this summit is taking place against a backdrop where we're seeing a real backlash against technology. The public sentiment has really soured, regulators and lawmakers are sharpening their blades and saying, hey, maybe we should pay attention more to what these technology companies are doing and just how powerful they've become in all of our daily lives. What's the sentiment that you're hearing on the ground, particularly as the founder yourself. >> I think that's where knowledge can be powerful. Can we empathize with some of the challenges? I hope that all companies choose to act with integrity, not necessarily that they do, but there are a lot of folks saying, we need to be able to do more. From a policy perspective, how can tech companies partner with policymakers who may not understand how all of these technologies work and what they're capable of or not capable of, we need more clarity on that because I think that's where it becomes a black box of conflict and if you can change it to say, this is challenges that you have with facial recognition or sentiment analysis or what have you, let's really think about do the systems today do, what are the guard rails that we need to put in and how can we work as partners with policymakers so it's not just driven by lobbyists but there's actually an understanding of, this is the implication of these systems. >> Here are the unintended consequences. >> Absolutely and if I can come back to New York for a second, New York City has one of the strongest open data logs in the nation. Part of that is because Gale Brewer, the Borough President of Manhattan said we need to formalize this. How do we put this together? She didn't come from a tech background, but she saw a problem that needed to be solved and she said, how do we put this together and how do we get the right folks to the table to think about doing this in a really scalable, meaningful way, so the more that we see those opportunities in that backdrop of tensions and concerns, that's how we move forward, facing those hard questions. It's not Rome was built in a day, it's not. It's going to take us a lot of time and there's a lot of unanswered ethical questions as well that we have to start really thinking deeply about. >> But it starts, as you said, with making the data visible and then getting more voices who-- >> Making it visible and also understanding what's not included in the data. Coming back to when I started my company, there was a lot of, but this isn't being counted and what happens when you're saying, I'm making a bias based on this particular dataset that leaves out this whole community over here. Can we think about what's not included in that data or how the data collection itself or the organization itself is changing things, so that's why, coming back to, you need more female founders, you need more underrepresented populations to have those voices of have you considered this, have you given representation to this particular group, to this population. Without doing that, then you're just reinforcing the same siloes and the same biases and we have an obligation to our community and to one another to change that. >> I know you have a keen interest in diversity issues and, as you're talking about, bringing in more women and more underrepresented minorities to lend their perspective to these very important issues that are shaping our lives. How do we solve this problem? Technology has such a bro culture and we're seeing the problems with that. >> First off, from a founder's point of view, you have to know when not to listen, you have to know when not to let someone shut you down because they'll say-- >> The noise. >> Oh my goodness, the noise of, we've got ageism, we've got sexism, we've got racism, we've got elitism. I went to Brooklyn College, I'm very proud of that fact. I had venture capitalists say, I don't want to invest in you, you're too old and you didn't go to a pedigree school, well guess what, my company's still here, some of the folks you've invested in, they folded a long time ago, so part of it is a willingness to drive forward but it's also building networks of support. Coming back to being the community hero, how can I elevate these voices and say, we need to give them an opportunity to be here, we need to change this, so part of it is we want more seats at the table, but if that table's not going to welcome me, I'm creating a whole 'nother table over here where we can start to have that cluster effect and that's where the dedication, the tenacity and you see things like we power tech, where we're really looking to elevate those voices. That change can't happen unless we keep doing that and unless the folks who are like, but this is how we've always done it, are willing to say, actually, shortcoming here, let's think about changing this and broadening the conversation. >> Is that changing though? >> We were talking a lot about how there's a new generation of workers coming up who do think differently and they do grow up with this stuff and they say, we don't need this red tape, why is this taking so long? They're impatient and maybe a more willingness to listen to other voices, are you seeing a difference? >> Absolutely, I'm seeing a difference for sure. That doesn't mean sexism, ageism, elitism has gone away. It has not, but you're starting to see, again, clusters of excellence and I think if you really want to make change you focus on where that traction is, use that as your foothold to build and scale and then start to be able to do more because that's the only way. We've got some barriers that for other founders I empathize with how insurmountable it can be, but if you've got that dedication, if you refuse to be defined by what someone else says you are or what your company is capable of being and then you find those great partners to say, let's do this together, the whole conversation changes. >> Aileen Gemma Smith those are great words to end on. Thank you so much for coming on the Cube. >> Absolute pleasure, thank you. >> I'm Rebecca Knight, we will have much more of the Cube's live coverage of the AWS Public Sector Summit here in Washington D.C. coming up in just a bit. (techno music)

>> From the Amazon Meeting Center in downtown Seattle, it's theCUBE covering IMAGINE: A Better World, a Global Education Conference, sponsored by Amazon Web Services. >> Hey, welcome back everybody. Jeff Frick here with theCUBE. We're in downtown Seattle at AWS IMAGINE Education. First year of the show, 900 registrants, 20 countries represented, really all the public sectors show, but this one's just focused on education as its own track. A lot of really interesting innovation going on, and as part of the keynote, we saw a really cool concept video about bringing Alexa into the class. The Echo Dot talking, and so, we're excited to have kind of the guy driving this whole project. He's David Hakanson, the CIO of Saint Louis University. First off, what a great keynote you had this morning. >> Thank you, thank you, and we're really excited to announce this today. So, today we announced that we are putting an Amazon Echo Dot in every single residence hall room. So, over 2,300 devices that will be in every room awaiting students for this fall. The device will be essentially their virtual assistant. They can ask questions specific to the university, through our custom skill, or any other question that's normally through the Alexa platform. >> So, the voice of God is talking above us, but that's okay. So, it was interesting when you were starting your presentation earlier today, I'm like, what are the applications going to be? I mean, what are these kids going to do with this? Like, we've got a Dot at home. We ask it to play music all the time, but you really did your homework on trying to think through what are the different use cases, what types of information are going to help the kids get their information a little bit faster, a little easier? >> That's right. We want this to be valuable for our students, and our students are active inside and outside of the classroom. Our university does over a million hours of community service a year, so we attract a very active student. We don't want them to be spending time searching for information. We want them to get that information immediately. Whether it's something simple, such as when is the library closed? Or, what channel is their favorite show going to be on? We want them to be able to get very fast access to information because right now, they have to search through web pages or calendars to find out what's going on on campus or other key information, and that takes time. >> Right. Well, it's funny because there's a lot of conversation about the educational experience, and really trying to develop an engaging experience for the kids in school, for the students, but the question is always, you know, how do you define engagement, what is engagement, and what are the actual things, the physical activities, that are going to drive this? And you guys, amazing stat. You said you went from concept to delivery in three months, and in that process, really explored a lot of interesting concepts. I wonder if you can add a little bit more color to that development process. >> Absolutely. It started with a six week pilot program, where we tested different virtual assistant technology to see what did the students really like, and they chose the Amazon Echo system. And once we made that decision, we were able to go from that concept to completion in three months, which was fantastic for us because we wanted to make sure we were ready for the fall semester. To do that, we worked very closely with AWS and the Alexa for Business team, as well as the partner, the skill development partner, called Empowered. We were able to use the partner ecosystem to allow us to move very quickly, and through that process engaging our students, engaging our stakeholders to make sure that the device was going to meet their needs, not just be something that looked good on their desk. >> Right. So was voice part of the initial design criteria, or did that come when you were looking at different type of interactive devices? Because clearly, the kids today are super adept on their phone, and they can text with their eyes closed with one finger tied behind their back. Voice is still relatively new. At least, maybe it's not as new as I think, so how did you get to the voice as the main UI for kind of this new, cutting edge information system? >> So, we started with voice saying we want a virtual assistant that's voice based because we see that as the future. So, if you're on your smart phone looking for information, you're still having to go to a website or to different data sources to get that, whereas asking a question is much faster, and getting that answer, it's a much faster transaction. So, we started with that saying how can we use voice technology to help our students be more productive, and then, engaged our students in that conversation, and they were very excited about that. >> Right. So, one of the really cool things about Alexa and the Dot is the programmability, which, obviously, you guys took advantage of. So, a little color on kind of how you chose what to program, but I think even more exciting is what kind of opportunities that opens up as an individual student, as a CS project in the class, and as you said, your university has a lot more going on than just incoming students. You've got graduate degrees, medical things going on, so I wonder if you can shed a little light on kind of how you developed what you have for the launch date, but you know, some of the future things that you see down the road. >> That really goes to the Alexa for Business foundation that we chose, and Alexa for Business was the differentiator for us. It was a key area because through that tool and ecosystem, we could manage the devices, and we could group the devices. So, we could group a learning community of engineers, of students studying engineering, and give them specialized skills or allow them to develop a skill and have that only on their devices, not on everyone else's devices. So, the ability to manage these allowed us to really focus on that educational experience, allow students to start creating skills, and then be able to manage and deploy them at scale. >> That's great. I can't wait to come back a year from now and hear kind of what happened. I'm sure there's going to be all kinds of cool surprises, tough surprises, you know, upsides and downsides 'cause you said they're getting installed this week and the kids are showing up in a couple weeks. >> That's correct, that's correct. (laughing) We're moving very quickly. >> Alright David. Well again, I'm going to give you the last word as you touched on it a little bit, but you know, how working with Amazon and AWS specifically you know, kind of impacted this project and how does that help you, you know deliver your objectives more efficiently and faster? >> Yeah, the only way we could have gone from concept to completion in three months was by working closely with AWS and the partner ecosystem. We could not have done this at any scale or efficient timeframe without them. They were a fantastic partner, helping us all the way from choosing the right partner to develop the skill to helping us on how do we get all these devices to work on our network, to how do we get all these devices working on our network and installed within a couple days, and so, from beginning to end AWS has been instrumental in our success to bring this new innovative technology to our students. >> Okay, well we might have to have a field trip out to Saint Louis and check it out. >> You're welcome to come. >> Alright, he's David, I'm Jeff. We're at AWS in downtown Seattle at AWS IMAGINE. Thanks for watching.