(mellow music) >> Voiceover: Live from Seattle, Washington, it's theCUBE. Covering Smartsheet ENGAGE 2019. Brought to you by Smartsheet. >> Welcome back everyone, to theCUBE's live coverage of Smartsheet ENGAGE, here in Seattle. I'm your host, Rebecca Knight, along with my co-host, Jeff Frick. We are joined by Dr. WandaJean Jones. She is the Digital Learning Evangelist at GE Healthcare. Thank you so much for coming on the show! >> Thank you for having me. I'm so excited. >> Well we're excited to have you. So tell our viewers a little bit about what you do as the Digital Learning Evangelist, which is a very cool title. >> As Digital Learning Evangelist, the main part of my job is to manage our digital learning ecosystem. So, we have a learning management system, we use Adobe Captivate Prime. And then the other part of my job is to teach people how to use digital tools that will help make their lives a little bit easier. Save time, automate processes, and, you know, all the way around, create efficiencies. >> And how (chuckles). Are the employees willing to go there? Or are they naturally skeptical? I mean, what would you say? I mean, introducing a new technology to employees is famously a hard thing to do. How do you find it? >> Well, I'm a teacher at heart, so what I like to do is take what they already know and build off of that. So typically, if an employee comes to me and says, "WandaJean, we really want to learn "how to manage all of these Excel spreadsheets, "there's lots of data." I tell them, you know, "Come to the meeting with your Excel spreadsheets," and then I want them to tell me the story about their process, and then I go through and match them, kind of play matchmaker, and match them to that technology that already fits within their current behavior. There's some things that they'll have to change just a little bit, but we don't want to do it so much that they find it overwhelming, and say, "Oh my gosh, I'm never going to get this." So, I want to make sure they're comfortable and, you know, listening to them talk and seeing the sophistication in their current process, I'll know how far I can go. >> Now are these kind of next-gen productivity tools that you're getting them onto? Or are these kind of new collaboration tools that the company's taken on? What are some of the things you're transitioning them off of and putting them onto? >> I think one of the things is, the best part is, most of the work that's coming to me to transform, if you will, it's very manual. So, it's knowing where the tools are, and I make sure that I am very tool promiscuous. I like to go and look at all of these tools, and I like to understand which tools do what. And then I want to understand the role of the person and what they do for the business. And how those two can come together. So it's a matchmaker. The tools are, most of the time, digital collaborative tools. So we have a full suite of all sorts of tools at GE Healthcare. So we're definitely no short of tools. But sometimes people just haven't taken that digital leap to figure out, "How do I get my process "a little more digitized and save myself some time?" >> So what kinds of things are the people on your team working through, in terms of the kinds of processes you're helping them automate, the kinds of things you're helping them do manually, and how is Smartsheet coming into play here? >> Okay. So, I like to look at things from the triple constraints: Cost, quality, and speed. So, when you think about cost, quality, and speed, you want to take cost out of the process. You want to improve the quality by, you know, creating some sort of a standardization that everybody's going to do. And then you want to speed up the process that people can bring that, whatever it is, to market. And when I look at those three levers, this is exactly what my end users want to do anyway. So Smartsheet is able to answer all of those in such a remarkable way. That's usually the top of the list, when it comes to, you know, how are we going to implement this new digital process, Smartsheet is up there. It's the all-in-wonder. I call it the all-in-wonder tool at work, and people say, "Okay, here she comes. "She's going to talk about Smartsheet." That's because, I always say, "Smartsheet does a thousand things." That's why I really want to listen to what is necessary. I don't want to tell you about a thousand things. I only want to tell you about the things that, you know, you're looking at in this process. When the person starts using the new Smartsheet process, almost always they come back to me and say, "Look what else I found." So as they go on that journey, they start finding other things as well. And then we get excited together, and I say, "But did you see this?" And so, this whole, you know, Santa Claus is comin' to town (all laugh) That's kind of what it feels like. >> So, how has the collaboration culture changed over time? A lot of the conversations here around Smartsheet is that, A, you know, you can bring in people from an external organization, not to mention you can bring in external people from your organization within the big company. Have you seen a big change in you know, kind of how the teams form, and what's kind of the collaborative workgroup as these collaboration tools have suddenly become available? >> I think the biggest part with collaboration is now people know the upstream process and the downstream process. So, what information is going into this process, what do I need to do with it, and then what is the way that it needs to be ready for that next handoff, from a process perspective? So I like that. The @mentions are beyond wonderful. When I think about those @mentions, we have the place, especially in Smartsheet, to create comments. And you create the comment, but I'm too busy. I'm not going to go back to row 87 and see what you said. But, if you do this @mention, I've noticed that people, when they're using the app, you know, the @mention comes through. Even if they're not directly at their email, they'll go and see, "Oh, somebody's talking to me here." And so their app is helping them respond in real time. So, another part of the collaboration piece is cutting out collaboration. So, a lot of meetings, "'Kay, give me the status, what's the status." Well we can certainly just automate those reports, and make it exactly what, you know, the executive or the leader wanted to know, from a high-level perspective. And so, we don't have to have as many meetings. >> I love it though. That collaboration means cutting out collaboration. >> Mm-hmm. >> That is so important. One of the things that you said that was really striking is, understanding the upstream and the downstream. Because we heard on the main stage, and we are hearing a lot today, about how it's providing much more visibility. And leaders are able to see the big picture, and understand where things are working and where things are not working. But it actually, it's also helpful for the everyday employees, for the people who are several notches below, to understand and have that full picture. Can you talk about how having the full information has changed the way your company gets work done? >> Absolutely. So, inside of the process that I own, I'm in a learning and development team, and there are several trainers. There are several people who own curriculum and, you know, we are serving about 4,000 employees. We want to make sure these employees are getting the right learning that they need, and preparing them to do their job. So I certainly want to empower those trainers and curriculum owners to do their thing. I'm not going to go to class with you. I probably don't even know your content. But when I looked at Smartsheet dashboards, I started, you know, reporting is great. But when you flip it around, it's now a portal. And this is a information portal that everybody can be connected to. So, if we have a release in our system, if there's new materials that they can share, these can be happening right there at that portal. So I like it that I can empower people to not need me. And sometimes that can be scary. You think, "Oh, automation, it's coming, "and a robot's going to take over my job!" It's not that it's going to do, I have lots to do. But having this portal view allows people to go in and really be empowered. The other thing I have is sort of a ticketing system. So there's one of me, and 4,000 of them, and everybody might want something from WandaJean. So, I have a intake form that could easily take that work in and talk to me, and I get to know, you know, they put timeframes around when they need this. So I get to bubble up which ones are the most important ones, and which ones I can put off for a little bit. But at the end of the year, my leader might want to come back to me and say, "You know, what have you done for me lately?" And so, all of this input that has come through in this really standardized way could create a dashboard about what I've been doing, and I get to celebrate and understand, wow, I've had 50% more learning requests, and this many people wanted to learn about a tool, and, so I would have those metrics to even celebrate my own work and what I do as an individual. >> That's really interesting, right? 'Cause then you go from, the classic paradigm is there's data, right, which then becomes information, which then hopefully becomes some insight that you can actually take action. So it sounds like you're pulling that just on your straight-up inbound form, to actually get a whole lot of information on what's going on in that community, and where you can prioritize your time, your activities. >> Yes, well we create job requisitions and we hire people for roles. You know, you get this job description, you will do this and you will do that. It will be interesting at the end of the year to look back at this intake and see everything that you've actually done, versus what you signed up to do when you took the job. So, sometimes it looks really different, like, "Wait a minute, I think I need some more money." (Rebecca laughs) "'Cause I didn't get hired for this." >> Right, right, right, I've done so much more. >> Yes. >> Talk a little bit about the silos within the organization, and the ways in which the Smartsheet is helping break down those silos. >> Okay. So I talked to you guys a little earlier and told you that I believe that silo is an acronym for Secrets in the Learning Organization. And when you have those secrets, and you have no idea what this team or this team is doing, it could really cost the company cost, quality, speed. It's going to slow us down. We're going to both duplicate processes. And the quality of our product, instead of having process excellence, we'll have pockets of excellence. And we want to make everybody into these rockstars for the company. So, putting it together and making it more of, you know, a transparent ecosystem is awesome. The one thing that I really like is, when you map out a process and you pull in the right people and get those people involved, you'll get to understand, you know, resource management, any constraints, and you know, "Why is it, Bob, that you haven't done anything with this?" Where, I don't do that. And, you know, it starts a conversation. We can see, number one, what's wrong. And then we could have a conversation with the person about what's wrong. And it gives another action item for us to make it right. So without these sorts of, you know, without Smartsheet really helping us technologically bring those things together, it would be hard for me to even know where Bob is. It's a very big company. GE Healthcare is about 60,000 people. So, I don't know. I don't even know where Bob is right now. Bob, where are you? (laughter) But if Bob gets pulled into that Smartsheet, it shrinks the world, and it makes our big giant company just that much smaller, and people start knowing who you are and what you're supposed to be doing. And you get the right traffic of work. And then anything else that doesn't belong to you, it can get rerouted. >> Love to get your take on re-skilling, which isn't directly part of what you're doing, but you're currently doing re-skilling in terms of tools to execute different, you're training people to probably be more collaborative by using these tools and that different types of process. So important that re-skilling happens in the future, as all the jobs change. Just, you know, are people up for this? Are they excited to learn a new tool? Do they see that there're different ways to get work done than maybe our tradition? Or you still got the old codgers in the back, saying, you know, "That's not the way we did it 20 years ago!" >> Exactly, you do have that, you do have that. But, you know, this whole fake it until you make it, it's not going to work anymore. There's so many opportunities, especially within our company. We are sharing with our people leaders how to have collaboration across teams. Really don't think that your whole world is just right here inside of your job. Think broadly about what you do. And I like to say that, you know, I act locally but I think globally. So that just means, if I see that there is a process that I'm a part of, this is a mindset that we're sharing with our employees. If you see there's a process that you're a part of, and you see that it's broken and you fix it, fix it in such a way that it scales, and that it's applicable. You know, if we're all process managers, you probably have this problem too. So, create the fix, and then celebrate that socially, and show someone else, you can do it too. >> Rebecca: You can replicate this. >> You can replicate this. It's the classic before and after. You know, if we want to lose weight, we don't want to see the skinny person and telling, you know, how we got skinny. We want to see when you were larger, you know? You want to see the before and the after, and make sure that, you know, and when people see that, like, "It's possible? "I don't have to be, like, this superstar coder?" When they see how easy it is and they grab that process, I've seen them just do wonderful things. It's amazing, what our employees do. >> So, as a Digital Learning Evangelist, I mean, I don't know, how many are there of you in the world? And is it lonely? Do you come to these conferences to sort of have some community and some commiseration and understanding? I mean, what is it like, and how do you share your best practices with other people who do what you do in other companies? >> Well, in other companies, of course, our social networks, LinkedIn and those professional communities that I'm a part of, Smartsheet has a user group community, we can share there. Internally, there are people who are very interested in process. We use Yammer, so Microsoft Yammer. And we have a Smartsheet Yammer channel. This is one of the most healthiest channels in our business. We can see the stats on how many people are asking questions. And you have people coming there and saying, "Has anybody ever done this?" When I see that sort of curiosity, when I see someone in Europe jumping to help somebody in Mexico, it really is energizing, and it lets us know that everybody's trying to help everybody win. But how do I collaborate and get with other people? I do. I collaborate with other companies that, you know, I found out that Starbucks actually used Smartsheet during a disaster where there was a hurricane and they sent a Smartsheet forum out to their baristas, "Are you okay? "Can you make some coffee?" And, you know-- (laughter) >> Can you make the coffee. >> "And, oh by the way, take good pictures of the damage, "so we can submit it to our insurance." So, that's something that our company can use. And I'll take that back to our team, and say, "Guess what Starbucks did with this?" And, "Guess what PayPal did with this?" I sent PayPal's Smartsheet movie around to our executive team. They were very impressed. Now, it's not just that they were impressed. It's that, over the next two months, I heard that very same executive say, "We're going to create an integrated marketing calendar, "and we're going to use Smartsheet." That just made me feel so rewarded, that, you know, somebody is listening. You're not just talking! (Rebecca laughs) There are some converts! >> Great. Well, WandaJean, a pleasure having you on the show. >> Thank you, thank you so much. >> Please come back again. >> Yes, I will! >> I'm Rebecca Knight, for Jeff Fricks, stay tuned of more of theCUBE's live coverage of ENGAGE 2019. (minimal techno tone) (mellow music)

>> Live from San Francisco, it's the Cube, covering Google Cloud Next 2018. Brought to you by Google Cloud and its ecosystem partners. >> Hello and welcome back to The Cube coverage here live in San Francisco for Google Cloud's conference Next 2018, #GoogleNext18. I'm John Furrier with Jeff Frick, my cohost all week. Third day of three days of wall to wall live coverage. Our next guest, Carol Carpenter, Vice President of Product Marketing for Google Cloud. And Ayin Vala, Chief Data Science Foundation for Precision Medicine. Welcome to The Cube, thanks for joining us. >> Thank you for having us. >> So congratulations, VP of Product Marketing. Great job getting all these announcements out, all these different products. Open source, big query machine learning, Istio, One dot, I mean, all this, tons of products, congratulations. >> Thank you, thank you. It was a tremendous amount of work. Great team. >> So you guys are starting to show real progress in customer traction, customer scale. Google's always had great technology. Consumption side of it, you guys have made progress. Diane Green mentioned on stage, on day one, she mentioned health care. She mentioned how you guys are organizing around these verticals. Health care is one of the big areas. Precision Medicine, AI usage, tell us about your story. >> Yes, so we are a very small non-profit. And we are at the intersection of data science and medical science and we work on projects that have non-profits impact and social impact. And we work on driving and developing projects that have social impact and in personalized medicine. >> So I think it's amazing. I always think with medicine, right, you look back five years wherever you are and you look back five years and think, oh my god, that was completely barbaric, right. They used to bleed people out and here, today, we still help cancer patients by basically poisoning them until they almost die and hopefully it kills the cancer first. You guys are looking at medicine in a very different way and the future medicine is so different than what it is today. And talk about, what is Presicion Medicine? Just the descriptor, it's a very different approach to kind of some of the treatments that we still use today in 2018. It's crazy. >> Yes, so Presicion Medicine has the meaning of personalized medicine. Meaning that we hone it into smaller population of people to trying to see what is the driving factors, individually customized to those populations and find out the different variables that are important for that population of people for detection of the disease, you know, cancer, Alzheimer's, those things. >> Okay, talk about the news. Okay, go ahead. >> Oh, oh, I was just going to say. And to be able to do what he's doing requires a lot of computational power to be able to actually get that precise. >> Right. Talk about the relationship and the news you guys have here. Some interesting stuff. Non-profits, they need compute power, they need, just like an eneterprise. You guys are bringing some change. What's the relationship between you guys? How are you working together? >> So one of our key messages here at this event is really around making computing available for everyone. Making data and analytics and machine learning available for everyone. This whole idea of human-centered AI. And what we've realized is, you know, data is the new natural resource. >> Yeah. >> In the world these days. And companies that know how to take advantage and actually mine insights from the data to solve problems like what they're solving at Precision Medicine. That is really where the new breakthroughs are going to come. So we announced a program here at the event, It's called Data Solutions for Change. It's from Google Cloud and it's a program in addition to our other non-profit programs. So we actually have other programs like Google Earth for non-profits. G Suite for non-profits. This one is very much focused on harnessing and helping non-profits extract insights from data. >> And is it a funding program, is it technology transfer Can you talk about, just a little detail on how it actually works. >> It's actually a combination of three things. One is funding, it's credits for up to $5,000 a month for up to six months. As well as customer support. One thing we've all talked about is the technology is amazing. You often also need to be able to apply some business logic around it and data scientists are somewhat of a challenge to hire these days. >> Yeah. >> So we're also proving free customer support, as well as online learning. >> Talk about an impact of the Cloud technology for the non-proit because6 I, you know, I'm seeing so much activity, certainly in Washington D.C. and around the world, where, you know, since the Jobs Act, fundings have changed. You got great things happening. You can have funding on mission-based funding. And also, the legacy of brand's are changing and open source changes So faster time to value. (laughs) >> Right. >> And without all the, you know, expertise it's an issue. How is Cloud helping you be better at what you do? Can you give some examples? >> Yes, so we had two different problems early on, as a small non-profit. First of all, we needed to scale up computationally. We had in-house servers. We needed a HIPAA complaint way to put our data up. So that's one of the reasons we were able to even use Google Cloud in the beginning. And now, we are able to run our models or entire data sets. Before that, we were only using a small population. And in Presicion Medicine, that's very important 'cause you want to get% entire population. That makes your models much more accurate. The second things was, we wanted to collaborate with people with clinical research backgrounds. And we need to provide a platform for them to be able to use, have the data on there, visualize, do computations, anything they want to do. And being on a Cloud really helped us to collaborate much more smoothly and you know, we only need their Gmail access, you know to Gmail to give them access and things. >> Yeah. >> And we could do it very, very quickly. Whereas before, it would take us months to transfer data. >> Yeah, it's a huge savings. Talk about the machine learning, AutoML's hot at the show, obviously, hot trend. You start to see AI ops coming in and disrupt more of the enterprise side but as data scientists, as you look at some of these machine learnings, I mean, you must get pretty excited. What are you thinking? What's your vision and how you going to use, like BigQuery's got ML built in now. This is like not new, it's Google's been using it for awhile. Are you tapping some of that? And what's your team doing with ML? >> Absolutely. We use BigQuery ML. We were able to use a few months in advance. It's great 'cause our data scientists like to work in BigQuery. They used to see, you know, you query the data right there. You can actually do the machine learning on there too. And you don't have to send it to different part of the platform for that. And it gives you sort of a proof of concept right away. For doing deep learning and those things, we use Cloud ML still, but for early on, you want to see if there is potential in a data. And you're able to do that very quickly with BigQuery ML right there. We also use AutoML Vision. We had access to about a thousand patients for MRI images and we wanted to see if we can detect Alzheimer's based on those. And we used AutoML for that. Actually works well. >> Some of the relationships with doctors, they're not always seen as the most tech savvy. So now they are getting more. As you do all this high-end, geeky stuff, you got to push it out to an interface. Google's really user-centric philosophy with user interfaces has always been kind of known for. Is that in Sheets, is that G Suite? How will you extend out the analysis and the interactions. How do you integrate into the edge work flow? You know? (laughs) >> So one thing I really appreciated for Google Cloud was that it was, seems to me it's built from the ground up for everyone to use. And it was the ease of access was very, was very important to us, like I said. We have data scientisits and statisticians and computer scientists onboard. But we needed a method and a platform that everybody can use. And through this program, they actually.. You guys provide what's called Qwiklab, which is, you know, screenshot of how to spin up a virtual machine and things like that. That, you know, a couple of years ago you have to run, you know, few command lines, too many command lines, to get that. Now it's just a push of a button. So that's just... Makes it much easier to work with people with background and domain knowledge and take away that 80% of the work, that's just a data engineering work that they don't want to do. >> That's awesome stuff. Well congratulations. Carol, a question to you is How does someone get involved in the Data Solutions for Change? An application? Online? Referral? I mean, how do these work? >> All of the above. (John laughs) We do have an online application and we welcome all non-profits to apply if they have a clear objective data problem that they want to solve. We would love to be able to help them. >> Does scope matter, big size, is it more mission? What's the mission criteria? Is there a certain bar to reach, so to speak, or-- >> Yeah, I mean we're most focused on... there really is not size, in terms of size of the non-profit or the breadth. It's much more around, do you have a problem that data and analytics can actually address. >> Yeah. >> So really working on problems that matter. And in addition, we actually announced this week that we are partnering with United Nations on a contest. It's called Sustainable.. It's for Visualize 2030 >> Yeah. >> So there are 17 sustainable development goals. >> Right, righr. >> And so, that's aimed at college students and storytelling to actually address one of these 17 areas. >> We'd love to follow up after the show, talk about some of the projects. since you have a lot of things going on. >> Yeah. >> Use of technology for good really is important right now, that people see that. People want to work for mission-driven organizations. >> Absolutely >> This becomes a clear citeria. Thanks for coming on. Appreciate it. Thanks for coming on today. Acute coverage here at Google Could Next 18 I'm John Furrier with Jeff Fricks. Stay with us. More coverage after this short break. (upbeat music)

>>Welcome back everyone. This is our final wrap-up of the Amazon web services. Reinvent conferences is SiliconANGLE and Wiki bonds. The cube is our flagship program. We go out to the events, extract the signal from the noise. I'm John furry or the founders to look an angle. And of course I'm joining my cohost partner in crime. Dave Volante, co-founder with you bond.org. Um, really exciting event, Dave, I got to say, this is our wrap up. Let's put a bow on this show. Let's put the bumper sticker on the car and let's see what, uh, what was this document? What happened day one enterprise day to infrastructure day three ties it all together with Kinesis. Amazon is doing two things. That's very, very rare in tech history, and that is a disrupting and innovating at the same time. The magic it's the magic formula. And to me, it's really two tactical executions, one ball moving the ball yard by yard first and 10, do it again to use the football analogy, moving the chains, moving the ball down the field, kind of a running game, ground game, whatever a call it. >>And then the big yardage passing play with Kinesis, I think really brings their success of an integrated stack. And I believe they're going to be the iPhone like model for the cloud they're they're light years ahead of everybody else on public cloud. Uh, they're winning the developers. And again, we just heard from Dr. Matt would kind of reiterating what we were saying in our previous segment about the diversity of the successes. It's not a one trick pony. They got diversity from startups to large enterprises to NASA. So Dave, I mean, I mean, who is going to take on Amazon, who is going to challenge Amazon? That's the question that we want to know right now. It's not looking good right now. They're got a commanding lead in the cloud space and it'd be really interesting to watch how the Kinesis, the enterprise movement, uh, with VDI announcement and workspaces and all the enhancements in the, in the performance is going to shift the sand in the industry. And you're already seeing Cisco down 12% VMware stocks down. I mean, game-changing, the sands are shifting. What's your >>Well, I think we're seeing history in the making here, John. I mean, I think last year at reinvent com leading up to we reinvent, we realized that this event was going to be big and not just the event. The event is a metaphor for the shift that's occurring in the industry. We're talking about a trillion plus dollar marketplace that Amazon is disrupting and believe it or not, they're tiny, even though there are three or 4 billion, they're tiny, it's a trillion dollar Tam that is absolutely getting flipped on its head. And what do we mean by that? Every premise about the it business is changing. We talk about a lot. Amazon has ch has turned the data center into an API. It's a very powerful concept. I think you're right on. It's the, it's the iPhone of the enterprise. Yes. That's. They're not like hall monitors checking about every application in the app store. >>That's not the point. The point is it's a consistent environment that is controlled by Amazon, very tightly controlled and it works. You know what you're getting, and it's innovating at a, at a breakneck speed. It's antithetical to everything we know about it. So, you know, you've been asking people all week what the bumper sticker is on the show. I can't wait to go back and see some of those, but I mean, this is the trend and the trend is your friend, or it might be your enemy. So when you say who's going to be able to compete with Amazon, I think Martin of eucalyptus set a set of best historically in economics. There's always people that will rent and there's always people that will buy. And the, the old guard is Amazon calls them is not going to take this lying down, but the old guard has to replicate an Amazon's model. How does it do that? It's got to create an open entry into its system. That's equivalent in terms of simplicity and power to the Amazon API. Number one, number two is it's got to be able to demonstrate to the developer community that you can inter-operate across those platforms in a way that you can get critical mass, the same way that you can with Amazon. And that's going to be the, the massive battle that's going to take place in the cloud Wars. >>I mean, I think one of the things that's interesting is that the word lock-in was something that we were talking on day one, especially in the enterprise, that's a word that gets kicked around. And you know, my feeling has always been lock-in is not necessarily a bad thing if it's, if you can, if you can have switching costs that aren't super high locking means, switching costs are so high that you can switch. I can switch from my iPhone to Android anytime I want. But the problem is that iPhone is a better product. It's integrated with the apps and I can buy all the same apps. So that's a very key thing. And I think the switching costs here are a lot higher and I, there are Amazon >>On the record. Amazon is the mother of all lock-ins. I mean, this is a beautiful business model and here's, what's so great about it is the customers. You heard them this week say if you took AWS away from me, I would burst out into tears. So Amazon's, I think brilliant challenge here is to how do they keep innovating? They're doing that, but how do they keep lowering prices? So people don't want to leave. So that that's, that's what I see as the disruptive piece. It, >>Well, being in this business all these years were, you know, a little bit older than some of the young guns were on the cube to me lock-in is moving right? You see, um, in the old days, huge capital outlays for, uh, for equipment, you had maintenance, all this stuff was locking. Now the lock-in shifting to OPEX and agility. So what's happening is Amazon is basically commoditizing the old way of how people would spend and shifting the lock-in to the op X side of the equation. I call it the heroin addiction where, Hey, it's so low cost and the agility is the lock-in. So the functionality of agility guarantees the lock. And I think that's what Amazon's betting the ranch on is that when can go to time to market, to value quicker, that is inherently a lock-in, that's a quote, user experience to use my iPhone example. >>If I'm going to have a good experience making money as an enterprise, that's good. That's good. Lock-in right. So it's all a relative term in that the lock-in has been around. I mean, they call it differentiation, but at the end of the day, I think Amazon's got a good, good play there. But like I said, I don't think Amazon has cracked the it nut yet. I think they're going to have some it penetration. And this is top of the first ending, as we were saying, the enterprise, it nut enterprise, it is not, has not. The nut has not been cracked. What >>Do you need to see to be convinced? Well, >>I just think the stack is going to be the, the same paradigm of having an integrated staff. I just want to see different levels of services because the table stakes for the enterprise are different. There's certain compliance issues and you know, they're checking the boxes right now. This is the ground game I was referring to earlier. Amazon is going to start checking the boxes. Oh, VDI, we got workspaces, I got this. I'm going to check the boxes. Ultimately the list is just too long to win everyone. Right? So I think, you know, so it's going to be an opportunity. I think OpenStack has a great hope. I think VMware and IBM and HP are big players. And I think OpenStack needs to step up its game and have a big player, pop down a billion dollars with like IBM David Linux and saying, look at OpenStack, we're behind it. And rally the troops. And that's all >>Sorry, go back to the lock-in comments because this is critical because to me, the definition of lock-in is it's, it's, it's less economically attractive to leave than it is to stay. And that's what Amazon is doing. They're making it, making it more economically attractive to stay than they are to leave. Here's why that's so important. The more people that they pull, and this is why Carlisle and back said, you know, we can't lose to the bookseller. And you said that because they know the old guard knows that if people go to Amazon, they're not going to leave. Cause it's going to be less attractive for them to leave than it is to stay. So there's a huge battle over that trillion dollar Tam. So the key is John that OpenStack and IBM and VMware and Oracle and all the others have to make it economically attractive to not go into Amazon. And that is the battle. >>One of the things that's very clear, Dave, that's coming out of the show for me. My bumper sticker is dev ops wins. And I think what that mean by that is, is that, and we refer to the cloud being in the top of the first inning, meaning really everything else was spring training. He used the baseball metaphor in the sense that this is all that this is all activation of a paradigm shift. That is so game-changing the dev ops concept of software developers. Writing code that trickles into a fully integrated stack is really amazing, right? This really replaces the pain of provisioning hardware cost of it, cost of the infrastructure. That stuff is that that is the real value of the crowd. So if you take the dev ops concepts, which to me is already a winner and put that into the enterprise market, that's going to be cloud ops. >>So to me, I think the opportunity right now for anyone who wants to with Amazon in my opinion, is to go out there and say, look it, you got to win the software developers, look at what a Mongo DB has done. We had Elliot the co-founder on, they made it good goodness for the developer. Whoever can do that for the enterprise will win. And I don't think that there's a direct one-to-one mapping of what dev ops is. It is in the Amazon world. And what dev ops is in the enterprise. I think that's more cloud ops because the guys that are provisioning EMC drives dealing with IBM and red hat a little bit slower, I would say in terms of deployment, they used to the big slow cycles. Dev ops guys are pushing code a little bit more, you know, nimble startup, clean sheet of paper, you know, Uber, Airbnb, those younger generations, but this is a generational shift and it's happening and it's all on the software. So to me, I think dev ops speaks to, >>I wanna, I wanna, uh, keep this thread going. So, so what's the playbook to, for the old guard to compete, you're saying you gotta, uh, attract developers, but that's not enough. You need a cloud platform, right? So take, for example, VMware, VMware announces, you know, hybrid cloud infrastructure as a service it's early days, they need a cloud platform. So what else do you need to compete? You need developers. You need, >>You gotta have, you gotta have trust and security, right? So here's the thing. Developers care about success of creativity for the solutions. And what Amazon's demonstrate is the time to value is the key thing. You hear people, whether they're startups or big company get to some value, double down on success, figure out how to be agile succeed. Fast, move on with the problem right now is that developers are like deer in the headlights. They go where the action is, right? And it's always been that way. I think OpenStack to me is an opportunity or whatever platform that is. Someone's got to get a big anchor tenant in that platform needs to step up and be the galvanizing force and create some solidarity around that approach for it. That is an opportunity for VMware. I think Pat Gelsinger is probably best positioned to do that. Pivotal is a, is a genius, but I think ultimately they might be biting off more than they can chew. So I worry about, you know, their car not being fast enough right now in, in the game. So, you know, worry about pivotal there. But I think VMware probably is a better position there. So they need, they need, they need infrastructure. They need this middleware, which is database queuing notifications. A lot of that, a lot of the stuff you see Amazon doing at the top of the stack managed services. So that's streaming data and all the goodness on them, >>Developers, you got to have a cloud platform at scale, you gotta have trust and security. I would add to that. You got to do things that Amazon's not going to do. So for instance, we heard all week, Amazon doesn't want to do one-offs. They don't like to do customization, whatever they do. They want everybody to benefit from that enterprise enterprises want customization. We've talked about this, John. That's why, for instance, you, you find that some of the customers won't go into Amazon, not because the security is bad, it's just different. And Amazon's not going to change the security profile. They're not going to change the policy. So enterprise, uh, players, the old guard, so to speak must continue to do custom stuff. One-off that Amazon won't do, but here's the bet that Amazon's making Amazon's that its ecosystem will over time be able to do those one-offs for the customer and put a buffer in between the Amazon platform and the customer. So that's, that's really interesting. >>Yeah. I would also add to that, that the main differentiation where Amazon and other potential people to compete with Amazon is scale, scale matters. Scale gives leverage. Amazon has proven that, and they're trying to use that leverage now to catapult into other markets for market expansion. So that's one thing. So, so, so the, so for the enterprise in particular, one area we watch heavily, I see two major trends. I see a cloud service that's similar to Amazon. It smells like an integrated stack, but it just has different feature sets tailored for the enterprise. That's more of that's the hybrid cloud clearly hybrid cloud is a winner. Amazon is not using that term hybrid cloud. And he's a hybrid ID, which is basically a head fake. It really means hybrid cloud. So that's hybrid cloud. The second thing is I think you're going to see data centers be Amazon in a box. >>So that's why I like io.com because io.com has essentially built pods and containers and essentially is cloud in a box. And I think shipping data centers is the future. And I think what I like about IO and here's why I'm interested in double clicking on that company is that they're basically shipping data centers. You've got Goldman Sachs, big companies. So IO IO has got, got that going on. And then you've got hybrid cloud. And then the third thing that's really relevant is that you started to see the vertical integration Dave of, of services. Look at CSC, CSC bought service mesh. We had, uh, this guy Jeff on earlier with, uh, that company is doing all the user experience they're offering full end-to-end full-stack developers for essentially web apps. Okay. That is a shift to what I call the dev ops world. Those two things. You're going to see these industries where it's ISV and integrators are kind of vertically integrated. They're going to actually build their own stuff. And that's going to be the, I think the innovation on the channel side. So the channel is up for grabs. Everything's being disrupted >>Battlefield. We've got developers, we've got cloud scale, we've got trust and security. We've got customization. And I'm going to add another one, which is the ecosystem, which is essentially your, you know, in part in your channel, but got to have a strong ecosystem, want to pick up this discussion with you and getting the hook. >>So the Dave wants to of what's the bumper sticker for the show. Give me the Dave Volante bumper sticker. You. We heard everyone said a story here. Um, >>What AWS, the, the trend is your friend, >>My bumper sticker. I'm going to throw a hashtag in there. The hashtag next generation computer revolution to me, this is the next generation computer revolution, total transformative hashtag next generation computer revolution. I think Amazon's leading the charge and I think they're going to shift the sands and everyone else is going to have to adjust. And that's good for everyone, Dave and the market wins a ruin murky on Hortonworks tweeted. Hey, we'd love it. Market expansion, rising tide floats all boats. And I think that's all >>Ultimately ultimately billion dollar Tam Gianna. I'm thrilled to a >>Part of covering that with the cube. I want to thank everyone for watching. Thanks. This is the day three wrap up this acute exclusive coverage from Amazon web services. Want to thank the crew here? All the guys back at the ranch. Kristen, Nicole art Lindsay, Mark Hopkins. Andrew, we got mic. We got Alex. Good job, Jeff Fricks do, uh, everyone. Jeff Kelly. We have the analysts. Come on. We've got this show covered, Dave. I think we fished this pond out. So look for us next to HP. Discover will be there. And, uh, December the week of the 10th or 11th and 12th, we'll be doing the OpenStack summit as well. Look for that. When that gets announced, um, my maybe doing the node node summit in December, we got also the spark summit and MIT event in January. The security event would be at Berkeley. We're going to all these great events tubes out of control. We've got storage, big data now cloud, we look for a lot of research. You can see a lot of cloud coverage coming out on the research. So I looked for that over the next few months, I will get bon.org. Thank you for watching. Well, that's a wrap day three exclusive coverage. This is the cube. I'm John fryer with Dave Volante here in Las Vegas until next time take care.