>> Voiceover: Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE. Covering Dell EMC World 2017. Brought to you by Dell EMC. >> Okay, welcome back, everyone. We are live here in Las Vegas for Dell EMC World 2017. theCUBE's 8th year of coverage of what was once EMC World, now it's Dell EMC World. The first official show of the combination of two companies. I'm John Furrier with SiliconANGLE. My cohost this week for three days of wall-to-wall coverage, Paul Gillin. And our next guest is Max, Matt Waxman, Vice President of Product Management, Dell EMC Data Protection and A.J. Wineski, who's with UNIX and Microsoft Technologies Managers at Shazam ITS. Welcome to theCUBE, good to see you guys. >> Thanks for having us. >> Thank you. >> So data protection on stage, it's hot. I mean, it is the hottest category, both on the startup side but also customers, as they go to the cloud, are rethinking the four-wall strategy of data management, data protection. Why is, is it the cloud? What's the, why is it so hot? >> Yeah, I think you nailed it. It is very hot. It's, backup is not boring. I think customers like A.J. are talking about simplifying, automating, getting to the cloud, and so we oughtta modernize data protection. Our announcements this week were all about how we're doing that. We had a great announcement around a new appliance that's a turnkey solution, out of the box, time to value less than three hours. That's the agility that customers are really looking for. And of course our cloud data protection's evolved a lot. Great new use cases, disaster recovery now for the cloud, great use case. >> Matt, A.J., I want to get your thoughts in a second, but Matt, first talk about the dynamics that the customers are facing right now, because really there's two worlds that exist now, pure cloud native, born in the cloud. Completely different paradigm for backup and recovery, data protection, all on this scheme that has to be architected. And then companies that are moving quickly that had a data domain, had a pre-existing apps that have been doing great, but now have to be architected for that cloud, hypercloud. Those are the two hot areas. Can you just break that down real quick? >> Yeah, yeah, you know, I think you have a good framework there. Right, there are customers who will go through a re-platforming, and think about how they can move their application and its existing eco system into the cloud. That's where we've seen a lot of traction. We would call that "lift and shift." You know, move the application as is. And then this cloud native space is really different. It's developer-centric. It's thinking about "How do you cater to "the application developer who wants to build "off of a modern tool-set?" And there it's all about micro services, it's API-driven. You know, it's a-- - [John] Programmable infrastructure. >> Absolutely. >> John: Programmable backup. >> Exactly, right? That's what makes a text-- >> Alright, A.J., the proof is in the pudding, when you sit there and you look at that scenario, programmable, being agile, automations all coming down the pike, what's it look like for you? >> Well, for us, prior to having the ECS, the Elastic Cloud Storage Suite, we were running everything to backup tape. And we were having to do two sets of tapes. It was taking us two weeks sometimes to do our tape retentions. We had a set retention policies at 11 year across the board because our past backup software didn't allow us to set retention periods very well. Once we got to Elastic Cloud Storage Suite, it was couple clicks, you set retention periods, it takes care of itself. Automatically replicates to our DR site and we don't have to worry about it. It's done. I used to have three and a half FTEs who took care of backup suites all the time. I'm down to a half-guy now. So I gained back-- >> So you re-deployed those resources on other things. >> On other products; what I hired them for in the beginning, and now since that's happened, I'm able to use a lot more of those resources for the projects we should be using them for. We don't have to worry about backups like we used to. I don't have to worry at night, "Did it back up? "Did it not? Did my essential databases "get backed up to tape?" I don't have to worry about that anymore, it's done automatically. >> What was that transition like for you? Going from tape to cloud? >> Painful. It was because we were having to move everything that was on tape on to ECS. Takes a while to redo that. Finally we decided at one point that after this period, no longer are we going to be writing to tape, we're going to write everything to ECS. Just became too painful. So once that transition was done, once we made a decision that we were no longer going to tape, it was easy. >> How about the cost? I mean, you now have an operational cost instead of a capital cost in your backup equipment. Over the long-term, is this a better, a lower cost happen for you? >> Oh, much better. We're saving $350,000 a year just in backups. And over the five-year TCO of that product, it's $2.7 million that we are saving over five years for that product alone. We're a small non-profit organization that we can then, in turn, turn around and give our customers some of that money back because we're not having to charge them so much for some of the backups that we have to do. >> Matt, talk about the dynamic, you mentioned developers. This comes back down to the developer angle because, just a scenario, data is becoming the life-blood for developers, and providing that data available in that kind of infrastructure's code way, or data as code, as we say, the DataOps world, if there is one yet. But I'm a developer, okay, I want the data from the application, from an hour ago, not two weeks ago, or those backup windows used to be a hindrance to that agility. >> Yeah, yeah. >> How is that progressing, and where is that going in terms of making that totally developer-centric infrastructure? >> Yeah, I mean, I'd answer that on two fronts. I think there's the cloud-native view of that where, you know, what those developers are looking for is inherent protection. They don't want to have to worry about it. Regardless of their app framework, regardless of the size of their app. But at the same time you also have database sizes that are growing so dramatically. I mean, when I was here even two years ago, I remember talking to customers who had databases that were over a hundred terabytes was like, 1 out of 10. Now I talk to 6 out of 10, hundred, two hundred terabyte infrastructures. At a certain point you can't back up anymore. And you have to go to the more transformative-- >> And the time alone, the time is killer too. >> Absolutely, absolutely. And so customers are replicating, and how do you put the same sort of controls around replication to get the levels of data protection that you expect? >> Well we're in a world where people are, customers are collecting everything now, they're saving everything. And they don't have to save everything necessarily. They don't find out until they start to use it. Is data protection becoming more of a service, a filtering service also, of how you, of what data you really need to back up? >> Yeah, I think that gets into the whole notion of data management. And that whole space is, "How can you "leverage the information out of the data, "as opposed to just managing the infrastructure?" And through automation, we're going to enable our customers to get there. Automate the infrastructure to the point where it's completely turnkey. Set a policy, set an SLA, and go. And at that point, you're managing the metadata. Analytics become really important. We've got a really cool new offering called Enterprise Copy Data Analytics. It's a SAS-based solution. Literally log on to our website and you enter your serial number, you're off and running. Analytics, predictive recommendations, based off of machine learning. That, to me, is the transition-- >> Is that managing your copies, you mean? >> That will give you visibility into your copies, that will give you visibility into your protection levels, and it'll actually score you so you have a very simple way to understand where you're weak, where you're not. >> So this is A.J.'s point about staff efficiency. You have that machine learning, like an automated way, what used to be crawling through log data, looking at stuff, pushing buttons, and provisioning (laughs). I mean, do you see that impact on your end? >> Oh, it's huge on our end. Because in the past, our database administrators would have to write something, and if a developer needed a backup copy of that database, it took potentially days, if not weeks, depending upon the size of that, to get it from tape. Or to go back to the old tape set to do that. Now, with ECS and DD Boost, it's instantaneous. They can restore that instantaneously to where the developers need it. It's a tremendous, tremendous savings for us. >> Some recent research I've seen says that there's still a sizable minority of customers who are concerned about the private security and the integrity of their data in the cloud. Does that, is that an issue for you? >> It is. We're heavily regulated through different regulations 'cause we're in the financial services industry, so we have PCI compliance, we have FFIEC compliance, SOC compliance. That's huge. And making sure that that data is protected at all times, is encrypted from end to end, is encrypted in transmission. Those are all things that the Dell EMC Suites give us. >> Talk about your data environment, because the data industry's growing, and I remember calling up Dave Velante years ago in 2010, 2011. The companies that were selling data stuff weren't really data companies, they were selling software. And a lot of the innovation came from, we call "data full" companies. They actually had a ton of data to deal with. They had the data lakes piling up. And they had to figure it out along the way. You guys have a lot of data. >> A.J.: We do. >> Can you insight into how big the data size coming in, because Tier 2 data is very valuable. You have data lakes going to be more intelligent, and that comes another factor into the architectural question. >> Yeah, we, the amount of data we collect is enormous, and we're just starting to get into the analytics of that and how can we use that data to better serve our customers, and how can we better advertise and pull our customers in to us to provide those services for us. The data, I mean, we're doing over 90 million transactions a month is what we're coming through our system. And-- >> John: So you're data full. You're full of data. >> Oh yeah, we're full of data. (laughs) And so there's just a tremendous amount of stuff that comes through us, and that data used for analytics is very powerful for us to be able to turn around and provide services to our customers. >> Matt, talk about the dynamic of, as you get into more analytics, this brings up where the data world's going, and this where kind of the data protection question is. Okay, all this data's coming in, you got some automation in there, you got some wrangling, you got some automation stuff now, analytics surfaces the citizen analysts now decided to start poking and touching the data. Okay, so now policy's the-- how do you back that up? So you have now multiple touch points on the data. Does that impact the data protection scheme and architecture? >> Yeah, I think it does. You know, fundamentally there's going to be a shift from the traditional backup admin role. And not just managing the policy, but also managing the data itself. To a role that's more centric around managing the policy. And compliance against it. As you go to decentralized environments and centers of data as opposed to data centers, you need to rethink the whole model and-- >> John: Data center. Data. Center. >> Exactly. >> John: Not server center. >> Right. >> It's the data center. (laughs) >> Paul: As you look-- >> And data's gone mass, right, so it doesn't move very easily. >> As you move to a more distributed model in an "Internet of things" type of environment, how will that affect data protection? You have to re-architect your service? >> We have been on a journey to transform data protection. We last year talked about some new offerings in that space with our Copy Data Management and Analytics solution. And that's really oriented towards that decentralized model. It's a different approach. It's not your traditional combine-your-data-path- and-your-control-path, it's truly a decentralized distributed model. >> Paul and I were talking on the intro today with Peter Burris, our head of research at Wikibon, and we know about the business value of data, and not to spare you the abstract conversation we had, we were talking about the valuation of companies were based on the data that they have and data under-management might be a term that we're fleshing out, but the question specifically comes back down to the protection and security of the data. I mean, you look at the marketing capital of Yahoo on that hack that they had, I think you mentioned Yahoo hack, really killed the value of the company. So the data will become instrumental in the valuation, so if that's the case, if you believe that, then you got to believe that the protection is going to be super important, and that there's going to be real emphasis on ground management policies and also the value of that data. You guys talk about that in your world? You guys think that holistically and can you share some insight into that conversation? >> Yeah, I mean, I think that comes back to your very first point about "data protection is hot." It's hot because there are a lot more threats out there, and of course there's that blurry line a little bit between security and data protection sometimes, but absolutely, if you look at regulations, if you look at things like GDPR in the EU, this is going to drive an increased focus on data protection. And that's where we're focusing. - [John] And IoT doesn't make this thing any easier. >> Absolutely not. >> John: (laughs) He shook his head like, "Yeah, I know." ATMs will be devices, wearables will be using analytics to share security data and movement data of people. >> Yeah. And so, us, security is one of the top priorities, it has to be. You look at what's happened with Target and Sony and Yahoo and all the other breaches. That keeps me up at night. And being sure that, >> John: I can imagine. >> being sure that we have a stable backup is integral to our system, especially with some of the recent ransomware threats and things like that. >> Paul: Yeah, going to ask you about that. >> That's scary stuff. And one way to be sure that you are protected from that is being sure that you have, number one, a good security system, but number two, you have a good backup. >> Over half of companies now have been hit by ransomware. Is there a service, a type of service that you have specifically for companies that are worried about that? >> Yeah, we have, I think A.J. said it very well, it's a layered approach. You have to have security, you have to have backups. We have a solution called Isolated Recovery, which is all about helping our customers create a vaulted, air-gap solution as the next level of protection. And some of the largest firms out there are leveraging it today to do exactly that. It's your data. You got to get it off prem, you got to get it into a vaulted area, you got to get it off the network. >> Matt, A.J., thanks so much for sharing the insight on the data protection, great customer reference, great testimonial there in the products. Congratulations. Final question. Your take on the show, it's the first year, big story is Dell EMC World, as a customer are you kind of like, "Mmm, good, it's looking good off the tee, "middle of the fairway, you know?" >> No, I'm impressed. I was really kind of skeptic coming in last year when it was announced and "What is this going to mean?" and things like that, and just seeing this year the integration of all the technologies with Vmware and the Dell desktops, laptops, the server line, the VxRail, VxRack, and all the other suites that EMC Dell products offer, it's refreshing to me as a customer knowing that now I have that one call for just about anything in the IT world. >> As they say in the IT, "one throat to choke, "single pane of glass." We're kind of going back down, congratulations on the solution. >> Matt: Thanks very much. >> Data protection, data center, they call it for a reason, the data center, you got to protect it. It's theCUBE, bringing you all the data here from Dell EMC World 2017, I'm John Furrier with Paul Gillin with SiliconANGLE Media. We'll be right back with more, stay with us. (upbeat tech music)

>> Live from Boston, Massachusetts, it's the Cube. Covering AWS re:Inforce 2019. Brought to you by Amazon Web services and its ecosystem partners. >> Okay, welcome back everyone. It's the Cube's live coverage in Boston, Massachusetts for Amazon Webster's AWS re:Inforce: their first inaugural conference around security, cloud security. I'm John Furrier with my host Dave Vellante. If you're talking about security, you can not talk about cybersecurity, how it impacts government, society and commercial. We've got two great guests here from Telos, leader in cyber out of D.C. AJ Turcot, business development, and Tom Ryder, VP of commercial sales at Telos. Great to see you guys. Welcome to the Cube. >> Thank you, John- (A.J. talks over) >> Thanks, John, great to be here. >> I've been intrigued by Telos over the years. One, great company you guys, so congratulations. John Wood is phenomenal CEO. He's been hanging around for a long, long time. He's seen many cyber waves in security. You guys have a lot of experience. Now, we're talking about modernization of government. A week and a half ago we were at AWS Public Sector Summit which is this show in DC with Theresa Carlson's team. That's all about modernizing government, public sector, procurement, modernization in technology cloud. Here, the security conference feels the same kind of vibe for security. Not so much modernization but kind of level up, get faster, get better, get stronger. You know, everything's great, now lets go do it. So, similar kind of experience. You guys are in the middle of both those worlds. >> Yes. >> What's your impression? Are these coming together? Are they two separate? What's your impression of the show? >> Uh. It's, security is job zero. People have been saying that for a long time. The rubber's meeting the road now. You can see, this is, this wouldn't have been this big years ago. So, we're happy to be here and be part of this. Our company has been focused on cybersecurity since the word 'go'. And we're definitely seeing you can't do modernization without baking security in. Everybody gets it. It's not a bow tie any more. Wouldn't you say? >> Absolutely and it goes from the software development of the life cycle all the way up the stack. Little anecdote, John has been around for a long time. He's actually in the, and he'll hate me for saying this, but he's the longest standing CEO of a company in Virginia right now at 25 years. (laughter) We've been around for a long time. We understand cyber security and we've seen it morph as the various platforms have evolved. But, definitely a great show. A lot of vendors: some new, some old. We meet some friends that were with one that are now with another. And asking them why they changed and they say, "Well, the old school and the new school, different methodologies, different ways to approach it." But the problem fundamentally stays the same. >> Everyone else uses the old guard, uses the term 'old guard, new guard.' That's Jazzy and Theresa's word. But it really is about the transformation of that all companies are becoming security companies. They say that about media. All companies are becoming media companies. You inherently have in this horizontal impact of security. It used to be that this firms does security. You hire them and they come in, they do the job. But now, to where you got to bake it in, you start to see the brands: Microsoft, all these brands that were once software companies in general purpose areas really getting deeper into security. And then companies themselves like Capital One, Liberty Mutual, they're building out. >> Right. >> And potentially now turning it from a cost center to a revenue center. So, the model's upside down right now in a good way. What's that doing to the industry? And do you believe that it's happening then too? What do you see happening? >> The challenge in front of us right now is security has to keep up the pace and the scale of the cloud and the modern world. I know that we've had to change our tunes in our product suite to be able to, you know, test and demonstrate compliance at pace and at scale. Otherwise, you're just slowing down development. I mean, the real beauty of the cloud is, uh, the speed at which you can fail, recover, get the feedback loop, move forward and security's now at that pace and I think you'll see around here the companies that are offering that, not just a new coat of paint on a traditional offering are going to excel in this space. >> Well, this is why I like what you guys do because you talk to practitioners. They say their number one challenge is how to keep up with that pace. I mean, you could talk to one person at Amazon and no one person knows all the services or they think 'Oh, Amazon doesn't have that or oh, yes they do have that." So, having a partner like you guys to help navigate that pace of change is critical. So, how have you made that, you know, a tailwind for you guys. And what are customers telling you that they need help with? >> Uh, what we, our end of it, the piece of the elephant we touch, >> Yeah. is, um, the customers are allowed to use the cloud. They're encouraged to use the cloud. They're going to school to get trained and certified. But you can't go at this pace unless you are authorized. Right? You need permission. Nobody's allowed to put in the plug without their permission. And that's where our end of it is. And we've had to really retool to go at this cloud pace. I've been at Telos for over nineteen years and it's exciting now. And when we had the opportunity to go into the commercial side of things, I really lept at that because we're now building, you know, as I said, tooling out to keep at this pace of 'how do I test? Don't be a detractor. Don't be a slower-downer.' and, you know, it's the way we got to be. >> Take a minute to explain your product offerings for the commercial sector. What are you guys offering? What's the value proposition? >> Sure, um, our product suite is called Exacta. It's a mature product in the fed space. It's been around for nineteen years. And it's in very wide use in the fed space to operationalize their assessment and authorization: the NIST risk management framework. We're now seeing NIST cybersecurity standards are getting a lot of traction in spaces outside the fed. If you're a software company like we see around here, you want to business in the fed, you got to get a fed ramp authorization. Exacta's tooled to do that now. We're seeing state and local government embracing NIST cybersecurity standards. The defense industrial base has NIST 800-171. It's built into the defense acquisition regulations. You need to corporately meet these security controls. So, you know, it's not just for an agency on its own anymore. Everyone's getting in the game. >> So those standards are moving to commercial? >> Yes. >> You guys were baked out, bulletproof hardened product you're bringing that into commercial? >> And I would say if you take spreadsheets off the table, Exacta is the number one NIST cybersecurity automation and management platform. >> Yes. >> Spreadsheets will always be number one. It's like- >> Spread sheets are dead sheets >> Other than the pie chart. (mumbling) >> Right, right. >> So, you know, it used to be, and I'm wondering if it still is, the public sector would look to the commercial for sort of best practice, they might be a little slower to adopt things, and there's certainly examples of that today. You see Theresa at public sector announces something that maybe Amazon announced a year ago and now it's available public sector. But the cloud feels a little bit different. You've had cloud first mandates, things like Jedi. Is that trend changing? You just sort of gave us an example where certification's bringing that up to commercial, Is there still a wide gap between commercial adoption and public sector adoption? >> Well, I think one thing that we see is a lot of commercial or government entities built data centers because they had to. Right? Now, you see entities that have, you know, big robust data center infrastructure, they like what they do in there but not necessarily keeping up that data center. So, they're looking, they're all going to the cloud in varying degrees of speed. But nobody wants to be in the data center business like they used to. >> Charles Phillips from Infor says, 'friends don't let friends build data centers." >> Data centers, right. (laughter) >> That's right. AJ, how about some customer use cases and examples where you guys are helping them? What's their challenge? Give us some real-world experiences. >> Sure, sure. So, one of the industries that's highly regulated is financial industry. And, you know, we talk about healthcare with HIPAA, and different regulations. But in financials, they're really hit from regulatory bodies throughout the country. And they can change from state to state and a lot of times it just piles on top. So, one of the main issues that these companies face is audit fatigue. Internal audit teams to make sure they're compliant, external audit requests that come in, and they're really looking for a way to reduce this audit fatigue. One of the ways of doing it is to operationalize as we do with out tool, the systems internally to make sure that you can be compliant and, I'll throw out a phrase here, we believe strongly that you apply good cybersecurity hygiene, a byproduct of that will be compliance. So if foundationally things are good and you're taken care of cybersecurity from the get go, you know, you might have to tweak a few things to demonstrate compliance but you will be able to comply to many different regulatory products. >> So being built in from the beginning. >> Being baked in, right. So, what this particular organization, they've been around for a hundred years, they're in the financial sector, they've got a lot of regulations and state to state, as I mentioned, are different, they were really looking, and they use all the tools, they've got them all. They have data centers. They have one of the largest networks outside of the defense in the country. So they're quite big. And they were really feeling this audit fatigue. Eight hundred auditors working day in and day out to get, to meet these requirements are thrown at them. We're able to help them take the process from months to weeks. So, just there, there's an economy of time as well. So, the resources can really go off and do what their mission is without having to, you know, daily deal with the grind of going through spreadsheets, for example. >> Yeah. >> And the different systems. >> Do you, do you discern any patterns in terms of can you get more specific on what they're doing with that freed up budget or the digital transformation. Are they developing apps? Are they retraining people? How, how are they dealing with that? >> Sure. In this particular case, a lot of training internally. And it's like moving a cruise ship, you know? >> Yeah. >> It doesn't turn on a dime so you have direction on the top. They take primary focus might change and they have study groups. Interesting about them is they don't make, they make group decisions. So, they do, they're very big on data analytics. They're all actuaries I guess and they're used to that. And they want to look at the value. And I think that's something that we see. That's a tendency we see throughout all the different industries we work with. The demonstration of value. So, it might be neat. It might be fun. It might be more secure, less secure. Do we accept the risk? What value does that bring to the organization? And what they've done through training, through trying to change the old guard, you know, it's also reorganizing their systems internally and how they do things. Not just tools. >> So you guys got to love the fact that Amazon decided to have a security focused show. I mean, every show Amazon does is security focused but dedicated. (mumbles) You were mentioning the other day that, you know, a lot of partners here, a lot of vendors, but actually it's very attendee heavy event. >> Yes. >> Yeah. >> This is now like a huge COMDEX show floor. A lot of practitioners, sec ops guys, >> Yes. >> You know, developers. What are your thoughts on why Amazon did this? And your reaction to this. >> Well, Amazon has, you know, like we said, security is job zero for everyone at Amazon. They put their money where their mouth is. This was not an experiment. This was an eventuality. And, you know, there's zero doubt they're going continue to do this year on, year round. It's going to get bigger. >> Houston next year. >> Houston. >> Kind of an interesting choice: Houston. >> Yeah. >> It's going to be hot in June. >> Stay in the air conditioning. (lauging) >> I wish they'd stay in Boston. >> Yeah. >> I like Boston. >> I like Boston, too. >> Better than Houston. >> Yes. >> But the show is to your point, some dev ops and sec ops. So, again, there's bus dev folks here. >> Yep. >> You got geeks here. Not a lot of CEOs of big companies because it's not a glam converse. There's no big fanfare announcements. The announcements are pretty meaty: VPC traffic mirroring huge announcement, security you have general ability, not a surprise, but just smaller announcements. >> A lot of CSOs obviously. >> A lot of CSOs. >> Yeah, I'd say CSO in that vertical down. >> Yeah. >> The CSO, this is CSOs cloud security show. A lot of things getting invested in. Seems to be heavy activity. >> So, going into this when it was announced, you know, AJ and I had our hands up right away saing, "Let's do this." And then we get here and we're like 'okay, is this going to be a direct hit for us?' and I wouldn't say that everyone we talk to's a direct hit, but everyone that comes by the booth has some understanding of what we do. And there's been no wasted time. We're having a lot of good conversations. >> They're right where you guys are. They know what you do, the value to them. >> Right. >> All right, so here's a question for you on the show, given that you guys have this perspective so many years at Telos and cyber, shipping a great product, now commercial's changing cloud scale, cloud security, what do you think the most important stories are that should be told? That the media should be telling? Or maybe they are telling and need to be amplified. Or isn't being told that should be told. What are the top stories coming out of this event and this industry right now that should be told? >> I think that the two trends I'm seeing is that, like we said before, um, building and maintaining data centers is not, it's not cool anymore. And you see the trends of all these entities getting out from under that and they might be making a big commitment to the cloud or phasing out their data centers over time, but that is happening. And I want to read more about it because that helps us, you know, target who's going to be most receptive to our message. And then the other thing, like we said before, the security at scale and at pace. I know we've had to retool for it. The other companies here that are built for that are going to succeed. >> Yeah. >> There's an appetite for that. >> AJ, anything to add on that? >> Good point. No, very good point. At scale and to be able to pivot quickly and someone mentioned before to be able to fail, retool, start again. >> Yep. >> But to have, it's really essential to have security baked in. That confidentiality, integrity, availability of data, you know, the basics. >> You guys have partnered well with Amazon in the public sector now you're in commercial. Not a lot has changed. Amazon is still Amazon. Question for you is what are you guys think about what the opportunity is to differentiate is? You guys have your solution: speed and scale. Totally agree? (agreement) Size, speed, scale. You guys take the benefits of that by partnering with Amazon. But as it gets bigger and bigger, you guys still have to differentiate help customers. >> Yeah. >> How, how, what is the formula for success? You don't just do things, do a relationship saying "we're done" now collect the business. They're moving so fast that if you don't iterate on top of it you die seems to be the playbook. What do you guys think the value for ecosystem partners, the formula to be successful, what does that, what does that formula for, with an eighth of this cloud scale? >> Well, you know, everyone would just love to hitch your partner wagon to a, you know, something that's rising and not do a lot of work. But, that's not the way we roll. I think we get in a great partnership with Amazon because we have a lot of similarities, especially the customer obsession. You know, we want the customer to be successful and we ride along on that train. That's how we're successful. >> Great. Well, guys, congratulations, great to see you here. >> Likewise. >> It'll be a good journey. Cube's kicking off their security coverage at this event. Obviously cloud security changing the game. >> Yep. >> And it's got to level up with dev ops, agility. You guys have been doing. Thanks for sharing your insights. Appreciate it. >> Thank you. Thanks for having us. >> It was terrific. >> Cube coverage continues here in Boston for AWS: reInforce. I'm John Furrier with Dave Vellante. Stay tuned for more coverage after this short break. (digital music)