>> Narrator: Live from Orlando, Florida it's theCUBE! Covering Microsoft Ignite. Brought to you by Cohesity. >> Good afternoon everyone and welcome back to theCUBE's live coverage of Microsoft Ignite, one of Microsoft's biggest shows of the year 26,000 people here in Orlando. I'm your host, Rebecca Knight co-hosting alongside of Stu Miniman. We are joined by Phoummala Schmitt. She is the Senior Cloud Advocate, Microsoft Azure Engineering. Thank you so much for coming on the show. >> Well thank you for having me. >> Rebecca: For coming back on the show. >> Yeah, last year we were here-- Well, actually, we were what, a month earlier last year? It's November. >> Rebecca: We were indeed, we were indeed. >> Hoping the weather was better, but still warm. >> Well we're not getting much fresh air, but, we're going to talk today about cloud governance. So this is something that companies that are moving to the cloud, often as an experiment and then suddenly it's live. How do you make sure that your governance is in order and how do you help companies wrap their brains around getting things buttoned up? >> Part of it is enabling developers, operations. See, governance, typically is a negative, right? Oh my gosh, governance! It's a road blocker. We have to stop thinking in that way and think of it as an enabler and instead of governance, they're guardrails. We put those guardrails in place in the beginning, enable our developers. Now you've got control and speed, because everything is about speed right now, because if you are not, you know, developing at speed you're not at velocity. You're not meeting business and then developers are off doing their own thing and then, often times, when you're off doing things really, really fast, you forget about the little things. Like leaving a port open, or you're doing a POC and you're like oh we'll come back and fix all that stuff later, let's just get this out the door. And then next thing you know it, you're like, oh, wait! What happened here? >> Phoummala, it reminds me of just a lot of things when you talk about when you rollout DevOps. I need to think about things like security, governance and compliances. Part of what I'm doing and if I'm going to be releasing code constantly, it's not something that I can go back to later, 'cause you're never going to catch up, you're always going to be, you know, N minus X behind what you're doing. So, organizationally, what do companies need to do to make sure that governance is taken care of just as part of the ongoing day-to-day activity and development? >> Well, building is checks and balances, right? So we put those guardrails in place. Let's start with infrastructure guardrails. Your ports, do those audits, just making sure that what you have on premises is the same in the cloud. Once you do that, that's like one checkbox you've done. And then there's the app development portion of it. That's where we're going to get developers thinking let's build security into our application. It's going to make life a lot easier, like you said, than going back and trying to build and trying to put, you now, new code in. And then when you're doing DevOps and that's just like a combination of everything, keeping governance in mind helps the flow of all those different transactions. Personally, I think DevOps is probably the hardest, in terms of just maintaining governance, because you do have different teams working together. You know, it's these different principles all coming together, but it comes down to doing things right. You know, doing what's right, ultimately, because at the end of the day if there's something that's missing and then next you know it you're on the front of the page. Nobody wants to be on the front page. And it's those little things. Like, checking permissions, just making sure that we have the right identity access management. And it's just throwing in some audit, just making sure our ports are closed, multifactor, you can audit and check you know, your root accounts, your administrative accounts. Little things like that just making sure that we have like the proper authentication, multifactor all that good stuff and then you just start building upon that once you have a little bit of governance in play. >> Well, Phoummala, I think, you know, identity management's one of the real strengths that Microsoft has, you know? So, maybe give us a little viewpoint as to how that's gone from, you know, identity just about Outlook or Office 365 to, you know, today's environment where, my users can be anywhere, my applications are everywhere and I still need to make sure that, you now, those corporate guidelines and identity go with me wherever I am and whatever I'm doing? >> So from an Azure standpoint identity management we have Azure AD, we've got all that component, but when you're coming into Azure, we like to emphasize using our back, role-based access control. Let's just make sure that the people that we're giving access to, have access to what they really need to. Building those roles out and people can have multiple roles. I mean, it's as simple as that, right? We started off just defining what's your job? Right, Stu, you've got a job, what are your roles? Let's just make sure we give you those roles and then we build upon that. If you need a little bit more, okay. And then you can give external users access, as well and you can give them roles, but just giving anybody full access to everything... Do you really need it? And it's the same thing with, you know Office and E-mail and SharePoint. So we're just taking those concepts from those applications and putting it into access into the Azure infrastructure. And then developers can actually build that into their applications, as well. >> One of the things that we keep talking a lot about, because Satya Nadella was talking a lot about it is trust and that is really the bedrock of good governance and making sure that people have confidence in your systems and that things are going to be done right, as you say. How much does that play into your work with customers and clients in terms of there's just an inherent trust right now that Microsoft is worthy of this and it is sort of the grown up in the room when it comes to big technology? >> Trust is huge. If you have trust in us as a customer that's, you know, that's amazing. We're going to give you the tools, we're going to give you the features, so that you and your customers have trust. You know, Azure policies. I mean that's just one component of governance and it's-- Policies isn't about completely control, but it's about auditing. Just checking, right? Checks and balances, 'cause that's really what governance is. Those checks and balances make sure that your operations is meeting your business needs. So if we can just do those little checks, simple trust like check marks, it goes a long way. And then, then we've got Azure blueprints which is our governance at scale. So we've taken everything that we've learned about governance in general, those different tools that we had and now you're just going to stamp it. Every time you build a new subscription you're just going to rollout governance and it's just-- I don't want to say as easy as a button, but it sort of is, right? You can do it through the portal. And everything that you've built as a team, those roles that you've created, the policies you've been submitted from your audit checks to controlling who creates what, where they can create that from, because, you know, GDPR that's huge. Because we can actually help you control where you resources are being deployed from. I mean that's going to be huge for most organizations right now. So, knowing that we have the right tools in place for you to run your business, that's trust. >> Phoummala, give us a little bit of a walk-around the show in your shoes. You're speaking at the show, you're hosting people on channel 9, you're behind the scenes helping a lot of people. Give us what you're most looking forward to, what you're most looking to share at the event this week. >> Most looking forward to just meeting all my friends that I've made throughout the years, but meeting new friends and, of course, there's puppies with therapy dogs, as well. Thursday I'm doing several channel 9 live interviews and I've got two sessions-- Well diversity sessions, which, typically, I do technical sessions, but diversity sessions I feel are very, very important. We talk about stuff nobody really wants to talk about all the time, right? We actually have a parenting and tech session tomorrow. How do we handle being a parent and working full time? And then I'm talking about the career journey and those two actually kind of go together, in some way, I mean, I'm-- And everyone's been asking me how I'm doing, my son just went off to bootcamp and so as a parent, I felt it was really important to be part of that session and talk about how, how do I handle it? Where I wasn't here yesterday, the first day, I was off sending my son, starting off his life, his new career and my career, you know, has gone on for several years, but it's a new change now for me and balancing that, that FOMO right? Fear of missing out, like everyone's at work and I have to be here with my son. There is an adjustment and a lot of parents have actually reached out to me and said how do you handle that? So there's several of us speaking tomorrow that, we're going to talk to the attendees and then here are some tips to how we do it. Especially with our traveling schedule. >> Well, I'm interested to hear, because we had another guest who was talking about stress, I mean, I think it was your best friend, Teresa Miller. >> Yes! >> Talking about stress as endemic to this high, stressed, fast-paced industry. Where, as you said, there's a lot of demands on your time, a lot of demands on your travel schedule and really a push for excellence add-all time. How is it to be a hard driving professional and also want to make time for your family, because your kids matter, of course? >> It is-- There's a balance. So the tech career includes that balance. We always want more in that career, right? We all do, but sometimes we have to step back. We've got to play the game a little bit, you know? You can't always have everything all at once and I've learned that. So tomorrow's session's about sharing what I've gone through, you know, as a parent, as a woman in tech. It's been a tough journey, but it's been fulfilling. So I work for Microsoft now and here's what I've done. I've made some bad mistakes, I've made some, you know, some good choices, but overall, there's been a balance. There's been a give-and-take I've had to do and I feel like the journey I've been through could be helpful for others. I've had a lot of people ask me, especially about career journeys now with the cloud, it's very, very scary. And a lot of people are worried, will I still have a job? My job transitions, what do I do? And I'm like, let's talk about this. I went through the same thing, I mean, exchange got us, exchange servers. Most people don't deploy exchange anymore. It's Office 365. So I went through that several years ago, that transition, where do I go next? 'Cause I know I really don't have that much of a life anymore. Like the AS/400 engineers, right? >> And diversity is another, of course, hot button issue in the technology industry. There is a dearth of women, there is dearth of underrepresented groups and LGBTQ. How are you as someone who is a woman of color navigating these thorny issues and helping the next generation come up and to create a different technology industry for the future? >> So it's tough. I navigate through with a lot of candles, a lot of wine. (the ladies laugh) With friends, I've got a great support system, but I strongly believe in paying it forward. There's a lot of stuff I do behind the scenes a lot of people do not know. A lot of forwarding of hey, this person is really good, you know, in this space, you might want to speak with them. I, Tech Field Day, I'm sure you all know the great people over there. I've forwarded a lot of names over there. I feel like I'm-- I've come up the ladder or the elevator, it's time to push that button, send it back down to help others and I've been doing it a lot more, I've always felt it, but now I feel I'm in a position that I can really help others and it just feels really good when someone I've helped Tweets about it. Obviously they're not going to mention my name, but when I see them being so happy, it just makes me feel really, really good, like, wow, you know, you just feel-- Like your heart just fills up like okay. This is good. >> Rebecca: Contributing to their success. >> Yeah and it becomes addictive almost. Like, how can I, you know-- If I see an opportunity to help somebody I will, I'll help 'em, anyway I can. >> So you are an avid blogger and you are considered one of the top 50 tech influencers and thought leaders you should follow. So congratulations on that. >> Phoummala: Thank you. >> I'm interested to hear, how do you keep up on the news and what do you read, who do you talk to, what do you pay attention to? And tell our viewers, too, because they want to know. >> Twitter is probably my source of everything now, 'cause it's quick, but pretty much just keeping up on the internet. Honestly, it's a lot, between my travel schedule, my family, it is almost impossible to stay up to date on everything. And I've learned that I can't. I just-- 'Cause I don't want to get burnout. I've been burnout several times and now I just, I take one day at a time. Oh, there was something that was announced, I didn't hear about it and someone said something I'm like oh, okay, oh that's cool. I'll read up on that later. But I don't feel like I need to know everything all at once. I think when you get to a certain place you're just comfortable knowing what you know and, you know, I'll read, I'll read the news when I get home. You know, something like that where you're-- You've got to be at that place where you're comfortable and not always feeling like I have to know everything, 'cause we're humans, we can't know everything all at once. >> And as we've talked about there has been, talking about not being able to keep up with everything, this conference, Microsoft Ignite. So many new product announcements, new buzzwords, new strategies that are all washing over us. What has been most interesting to you, most exciting? Who have you talked to? What sessions have you seen, that have sort of, sparked your interest the most? >> Azure Arc. Now I'm just reading into it, I haven't gotten real deep into it, but from what I know, from what I've seen, I like it. I like it a lot. It's, when we think about the cloud, it's multicloud, you know, it is right? It's every organization, they're dipping in their toes into just about everything and Azure Arc is giving that opportunity to our customers to be able to say, hey, we know you're in the cloud, in different clouds, here's a view into it. And, you know, you're able to manage these environments and see what's going on. Because that is the future and... Its a hybrid, multicloud. I think that's going to be my word, you know. Hybrid-multi, because we're in everything. I expect every organization to be in a little bit of everything, because it's... It's like, you know, your personal lives, right? You're in that little bit of everything. It makes it more dynamic and I just don't think one, one thing is going to be an organization's like, you know, that's all they're doing. I truly believe everyone's meant to dip their toes in a little bit of everything. They'll have one defined set of, here we're just going to use this one cloud, or this one's servers, but for the most part, they are going to dabble. And we're-- Azure Arc is giving customers the opportunity to manage those environments, where they've decided to dabble a little bit or because of business needs. They need to be in different environments. >> Exactly, renaissance organizations. >> Phoummala: Yeah. >> I love it. Phoummala, thank you so much for coming on theCUBE. Always a pleasure having you. >> Thank you for having me. >> I'm Rebecca Knight for Stu Miniman stay tuned for more of theCUBE's live coverage of Microsoft Ignite. (theCUBE theme song)

>> I'm Stew Minutemen, and this is a special on the ground at the 16th annual end final, The Tugs Summer Slam. We're here in Maine and happy to welcome back to the program. A Cube alumni punishment. Who is a senior cloud advocate with Microsoft but very active member in the communities here. One of the keynote speakers of Viet Formula. So great to see you. >> Thank you for having me. >> And you are representing. We've got the lobster fest tonight, one of your lobster dresses on. I hear even there might be a costume change before this evening. >> There will be a costume change with lobsters and clams. Yeah, I'm a big lobster fans. >> Well, you were definitely on point with Coach her there, and you were right in the mix. You know, love the keynote themes this morning. I think Josh Astral did it well, he said, you know, hey, how many people here? You know, I t operations and like most, the audit And how many years have you been doing it? And it was like one year to year and the over 10 was most of this audience. And of course, we know there's a lot of change going on this industry. But you know, cos and individual careers don't necessarily keep up. So, you know, >> you're a >> little bit about you know, what you've been working on. You know what you see in the communities out there? >> I mean, you're you're definitely right. Cos are struggling to keep up their staff. It's it's tough. There's so much technology out there, you don't know where to begin. So what I've been doing this past year is just helping the community get up to speed, helping them figure out what they want to dio because there's the cloud. What do you want to do in the cloud? Here's some options. I mean, they're just I speak to so many people. They're like, we hear about this as your thing, But what can I do in azure? You know, where can I go learn? And it's it's all good stuff. So that's pretty much my past years. Here's you could dio How can I help you get to your ultimate goal? Just knowing Maur and leveling up? >> Yeah, so you know, I think back to you know, when I was learning it in college, it was getting together with a group of people is one of the best ways to learn who had been through the class or who could you help work through? This virtual ization community was one that worked well together. Groups were ones where people would get together. They'd all right. Blog's about it on. You know, Cloud has been a bit of a transition, so you know what's the same? What's different about Cloud? Then say what we've seen in the virtualization communities. >> So Cloud is fearful. People fear their jobs because they feel like, OK, the cloud is gonna take away my job because now I don't got the manager's infrastructure. And you know what? That's not entirely true. You're still gonna need people the manage, these systems. You're still gonna need people to manage the applications, so one has to govern it. Someone's gotta click the buttons. Yes, it's not on your premises data center, but there's still machine out there running because survivalist doesn't mean there's no servers. So we have to dispel that. Believe for that myth that you won't have a job >> if you go to the cloud. >> Yes, there's some organizations that have reduced some workforce, but it's me. They're still jobs out there. And there's actually more jobs. Cloud related jobs, security focus, a compliance focus that deal with the cloud because, you know, if you look at the headlines now, each day, I'm gonna swear there's always somebody having a data breach there, being fined for doing something not correct with their data. And so there's their jobs out there. So are, you know, the I t staff. The IittIe operation space are so sad mints it's taking up here out. And here's what you could do with it. >> Yeah, yeah, you bring up some great points there. We understand. Look, there are changes happen in John. If you think you can go with the same skill set that you were doing years ago, you probably need to update That being said, there's nobody that I talked to that said, Hey, if I could give you an extra hour or an extra day in the week, do you have other things that you, after working? Absolutely. You brought up security. Is that something that needs more of our attention? And it's not all going to be robots and automation taking care of it. People plus machines need to work together, and therefore there's a lot of ramp. It is early days for all of us in this. So what can I learn? How can I make sure that I'm value for my organization and ultimately, you know, have a longevity in my career? >> Another thing that I've been finding in, what speaking with people is that they just don't have the time. They're like, I'm just so busy at work Where were, you know, with downsized and we're expected to do more with less. I totally get that. I've been in their shoes, but ultimately your career, you own that the company you work for does not own your career. So it's up to you to make that effort to just learn a little bit more. It goes a long way, and I'm seeing a trend now with some I t professionals. They're getting it. They're like, You know what? Yeah, we need to step up. We need to figure out what to do next, because technology is moving so fast, and if we don't keep up, we won't. We won't have jobs. You know you're going to be outdated. It's got it's got to keep moving. Um, you know, Josh is key Note. Perfect. Matzke Newt. >> Perfect >> Technology is constantly evolving. So you, as the IittIe professional we must evolve to. We must evolve with our technologies. You know, it's it's a circle. >> Yeah, You could bring us a great points, You understand? There are only so many hours in the day. And yes, there needs to be some work life balance. But you know what? We need to take control of where we're going and what we're learning. If I just get kind of stuck in my same old way, you're building that rut for yourself as opposed to breaking yourself way. I want to give you a final word. You know, what tips >> do you give people? >> How do they make sure they kind of break out of their existing, you know, environments? And you know, some areas that they might be able to easily in a start understanding what options are available for them in the future. >> The Internet? That's that's easy way M s learned. We've got learning portals for, you know, professionals that go out test things. We've got different labs. There's plenty of blog's out. There's user groups out there, you know, go out to your local user. Groups meet up with people, go the conferences. And I know they cost money, but there's free ones out there. Network linked in find. Find a good network, and it just it just expands from there. And social media, you know, there's a lot through social media between lengthen and whether you could do so much and learn so much from other >> people. Yeah, you bring up some great points. We've talked to you with some of the big shows, like a V M World or a Microsoft ignite. And not everybody can afford the time or the money to do those. But there's meet ups in your local environment. There are user groups usually that can do that. So, you know, reach out and find your committed or online. There is just so many environment. Lots >> of four lots of forms are so much out there and, you know, reach out to me on Twitter. I've exchanged Goddess. I'll point you to the right. >> Absolutely. In Pamela, Thank you so much. You could help introduce our community thio lots of different people. So exchange goddess Twitter. Of course, I'm at Stew on Twitter and we're here from the V tug Summer Slam 2019. Be sure to check out the cute done that for all of the events were gonna be a CZ. Well, as if you do the search, you can actually find some of the historical interviews that we've done with guests like Camilla and many more. I'm still minimum as always. Thanks for >> watching the cue.

>> Announcer: Live from Las Vegas, it's theCUBE. Covering VMworld 2017, brought to you by VMware and its ecosystem partners. (techno music) >> Good morning, welcome to day three of VMworld 2017. This is theCUBE's continuing coverage of this big event in Las Vegas. I am Lisa Martin with my co-host, Stu Miniman, and we're very excited to be joined by a couple of gals in tech. We have Phoummala Schmitt, you are the infrastructure lead for Independence Blue Cross, and Theresa Miller, the founder of the 24x7 IT Connection. Welcome. >> Thank you. >> Thank you for having us. >> So, Phoummala, let's start with you. You are a very leading female in the technology and software space. Tell us about yourself. What do you do, what inspires you as a female leader in technology? >> I'm currently in infrastructure lead at Independence Blue Cross. I manage unified communications applications, Exchange, Skype for Business. What excites me is the ability to show young women that you can do anything. When I was younger, I was told that I didn't understand math very well, so I couldn't be in IT, well, look at me here. So, it's inspiring. I feel inspired when little girls tell me, I want to do something technical. >> That's awesome, Theresa, what about you? What's your journey been like? >> My journey started over 20 years ago by accident, while I was studying at the University of Wisconsin-Whitewater. There was an opportunity to study IT. It made sense to me, and I dropped my accounting major just like that as soon as IT came to the forefront. I've been doing technology ever since, and today, now, I have 24x7 IT Connection. We do writing, we do webinars, and we also do IT consulting. >> So, you guys work together with the 24x7 IT Connection. Tell us a little bit more about that. I know that, Phoummala, you mentioned Microsoft, and here we are at VMworld. Tell us about what kind of topics you cover on that 24x7 IT Connection. >> We cover a broad range of topics. I usually cover the Microsoft, Exchange, Skype world. I actually blog for Theresa, but we do a podcast together, the Current Status, and we talk about all sorts of technology, storage, networking, and just the current trends. And we actually do it on video, through YouTube, and we have a glass of wine. We make it so it's like a casual conversation with your friends, you know, you're just chattin' and talkin' tech, like here at the conference. >> Uh-- >> Just to add to that, so, from the blogging and like the approach we use, it really is about what's relevant to us. So, like she said, we're covering end-user computing, it might be Microsoft, it might be Linux. It just depends. We have several female writers and one male, and it's really about what's relevant, what's going on in their world, because then you know it's going on in someone else's. >> Yeah, Phoummala, you've been in the center of a really interesting transition we've been seeing in the marketplace. You know, I think about my career in tech, you know, deploying servers for email, and that whole push. Microsoft, huge push to get everybody onto Office 365. >> Phoummala: Yes. >> You know, where that lives, we talk about, you know, software's eating the world. You know, so, give us that journey of applications for you. How's that change your role, some of the dynamics? Sounds like you might need a glass of wine after talking through some of these topics, yeah. >> Yeah, I actually started in the server world, server and infrastructure. I was racking and stacking servers, deploying VMs, and then, at the same time, I was also managing Exchange, but as my career progressed, I kind of left that storage and server background and decided, you know what, applications. I wanted to focus a little bit more and really embrace the application world. Since I had that server background, that was my job, it just seems I could actually deploy these applications a lot better, because I understand the underlying foundations behind it, Exchange, and the cloud, so, right now, you know the push is to be in the cloud. Where I work, and a lot of organizations like ourselves, we don't go to the cloud yet. We're just not there. So, there is a very strong push. Eventually, I suspect we'll all be in the cloud. I mean, that's just, it's not if, it's when. >> Yeah, so, but I want to dig down just a tiny bit more, because, you know, most people in the VMware community know Microsoft pretty well. The relationship with Microsoft and their applications with virtualization, and now with cloud, is a really interest dynamic, so you've gone against some of what Microsoft said in the past, kind of do what's best for your organization, why don't you explain some of that to our audience, yeah. >> Yeah, so, Exchange. The preferred architecture for Exchange is, or Exchange 2016, 2013, is to be physical servers, with DAS, direct-attached storage, which is, you know, not what most people are. I mean, it's a virtualized world now. I don't know any company that isn't virtualized. So, I've taken the approach, what is the best situation or deployment for your organization. Yes, there is the preferred architecture, but it's not, I don't look at it as the Holy Grail, or the Bible. I look at what is best for the organization. What are your requirements? So, if the requirement is to reduce data center cost, reduce some rack space, and you can't go to the cloud yet, due to other requirements, let's look at alternative solutions that still follow some of the guidance. So, you know, yes, I break away from it, but it's what's best for your business, because not everybody can deploy physical. >> Yeah, Theresa, I have to imagine you cover a lot of this. You know, what's really happening with customers versus, you know, no offense to our friends on the vendor side, but, you know, they always think its what's right, as opposed to the person doing it, knows what is right for their environment. That's one of the challenges of IT, right? There is no one way to do things, so. >> Every organization is going to take a different path and journey, and that might be to the cloud, that might not be yet. That might be a combination, that could be hybrid IT, I think is another term that we keep hearing where, maybe I have some applications in the cloud, and some that will always remain on prem, but it has to match the culture and the fit of the business, or you won't be successful with any IT project. >> So, ladies, we're at VMworld 2017, given both of your thoughts in terms of, we need to do what's best for the business, Phoummala, let me start with you. What are some of the things that you're hearing, are you hearing other peers of yours echo the same feelings and sentiments? >> Yes, when we're out in the field, you know, I'm talkin' to people, and it's, yeah, it's we're not there yet, we want to go there, yeah, but we can't do it, we don't have the infrastructure, we don't have the resources. And oftentimes, you know, our vendors, they, they forget that budgets, there's constraints, you know, resourcing. So, you know, my word to them is be patient with us. We want to go there, we like your products, but there's so many other factors in play, especially when you work for a large enterprise. You know, there's politics, and large enterprises just take time to do things, especially certain industries, healthcare, financial sectors. You have certain regulations that you have to follow, and in order to get to the cloud, or whatever, you know, the latest trend is, we may have to modify certain policies that are in place and then there's a downward effect, because let's say we want to go to the cloud, then you have to go to, you know, your security department. What regulations or what retention policies do you have to change? And that may, you know, that may take time. So, it's not like it's going to' happen today. >> Theresa, same question, but I guess, maybe, no, maybe a different question. In terms of your podcast, have you heard anything here that's inspired the next conversation that you guys want to have with your glass of wine? >> So, I really think, it's probably going to revolve around cloud again, and in terms of, the other thing I keep seeing is analytics. Everybody's talking about analytics. >> Lisa: Yes. >> And I think that's a really interesting conversation, 'cause it means so many different things. The depth, what are you going to analyze? How do you manage that data? So I could see it being a combination of those topics, and even maybe separate. >> Yeah, yeah, Phoummala, you and I were talking before the interview. Think about this community here. It used to be, you know, it was like hypervisor, virtualizing, we were all in this journey to virtualize. Now, it's a little bit fragmented because there's so many different areas. Analytics, absolutely huge people. Security, lots of people going there. This whole cloud discussion, on all the different apps. What are you seeing in the community? What are the topic areas? Is that, you know, is that a challenge to the community? VMware, the VMworld community was a pretty tight-knit community, and now it feels, you know, while there's great connections and great people, it's broken into a few different pieces. What's your reaction to that? >> I mean, I do feel there's sort of a, not a disconnect, but there's so many different aspects, and I think that's just the evolution of IT. We've evolved to the point where it's beyond IT, it's beyond the technical approaches. It is, um, it's almost like it's, IT's just another business department. We're a business. We provide services to the other business units, and it's just that evolution of, we're service providers, all of us. Whether we are in the data center, or we are an apps develop, we are providing a service to somebody, and we have customers. >> Do you find that that's an advantage? We were talking to some guests earlier this week that, I think it was an analyst from ESG that was saying, you know, you can show that certain problems with storage, certain costs, aren't IT's problem, it's a business problem. Is that an advantage what you just kind of talked about, Phoummala, in terms of getting eyes and ears of the business to provide, okay, this is a business challenge, we need to provide the right expertise, the right funding, to support these services that are needed? >> I definitely think so. I mean, just from my own experience. Understanding what the business wants and needs is huge. And then just puttin' yourself in their shoes. What do they need, what can we do to make their jobs better? So that person, you know, clicking the button of submitting our payroll, or, you know, putting a purchase order in, what can we do to make that better? So, you know, it's one of the things I always do when I'm looking at projects. What value is this going to bring for our business? And, I think, that's just the way IT has evolved to. We're not the programmers in the basement anymore, you know, with the lights turned off and just coding away. We're all business analysts now. Because, at the end of the day, it's our paycheck, too. So, these products that we're hearing about, at the end of the day, it affects us, it affects our business, and the bottom line. >> And what is the website of 24x7 IT Connection that people can see and hear the value that you bring to the community? >> It's 24x7, so that's the 24 by 7, and then itconnection.com. And so, like I said, we share a lot of really great stuff. We have something new every week, so it's definitely worth checking out. >> Well, ladies, thank you so much for joining Stu and myself this morning and sharing your journeys into IT, as well as your insights, what you've learned from the show, what excites you, and where people can go to find more information about the expertise that you bring to the community. We want to thank you for watching again. We are theCUBE live from day three of VMworld 2017. I am Lisa Martin, for my esteemed co-host, Stu Miniman, thanks for watching. We'll be right back. (techno music)