>> Announcer: Live from Las Vegas. It's theCUBE. Covering AWS re:Invent 2017. Presented by AWS, Intel, and our Ecosystem of partners. >> Good morning from AWS re:Invent 2017. I'm Lisa Martin with theCUBE. This is our third day of coverage, wall-to-wall, floor-to-ceiling. I'm with my great co-host Stu Miniman, and we are excited to be joined by CUBE alumni, Paul Mattes, the VP of the Global Cloud Group at Veeam. Welcome back to theCUBE. >> Hey, Lisa, thanks for having me. >> Great to have you. We're excited to have you here on day three. You look caffeinated. Your feet are rested. >> Paul: I am ready to go. >> And you have a voice, which is more than I think we can say for Stu. >> Paul: I don't know if it's going to be that way at the end of the day, but we'll see. >> Lisa, we're going to get someone to do ASL, for me. >> Oh, wow, that's interesting. So, one of the things that you said, when you were on theCUBE back at VeeamOn, which I love the name, by the way, was that in terms of how businesses should think of the Cloud, they should think of it as a way to deliver business services, and business results, rather than a destination. Expand on that, and how does Veeam help customers, and businesses understand and apply that? >> Sure, so, I think a lot of customers talk about "we have to get to the Cloud", and I've talked with dozens of people here that said, "I'm moving to the Cloud." And we ask why, we ask what they're doing, and they said "because we have to". In a lot cases there's no real clear understanding of what's the value beyond things like cost efficiency, availability, those kinds of things. So, we'd like to talk to customers about saying, once you're there, focus on the business outcome. Why are you adopting a Cloud infrastructure? What is that really gonna do to drive a good solid business outcome for you? And so when you focus on, 'cause at the end of the day, all technology in enterprises has to result in some sort of outcome for a business, right? It's there to serve a purpose. It's there to serve the business. And so, we really want to emphasize that with customers, and once you're there, you're not done. A lot of customers think, "well I'm in the Cloud, I'm safe, I'm secure, I'm protected. "things are geo-replicated." It's more complicated than that. It's more nuanced than that. And this is where Veeam, where we come in, and we say, first, it's essential that you think about data protection, and availability beyond architecting for high availability, but really have a data protection strategy to go along with that, because, you'll hear us talk a lot about the Always-On Enterprise. Businesses, there's no allowance for downtime anymore. Imagine going to your phone and not having the app that you need. Not having the dashboard that you need about where am I with my customers? You can't have that anymore. So what Veeam does is we say, "Great." Let's work together, create a comprehensive data protection availability strategy, based on what Veeam can provide, because your business depends on it. >> Paul, it was during Werner Vogels' keynote this morning, he went through a lot of this, he said, "The way you used to think about things is very different." Like, security. Everybody should be thinking about security. Security is-- >> Everybody's job. >> Everybody's job, absolutely. And when you talk about availability, he went through this really rigorous. It's like, it's not just one availability zone. It's multiple zones. Here's how you get to three nines, four nines. Walk us through a little bit of that journey. If somebody was building in their signal data center, running virtualizations versus, now we're going to the Cloud. What does the Cloud just do for me, and where does Veeam come in and help complete some of those solutions, and keep me available and protected? >> So, first of all, we did a recent survey, 81% of customers that we surveyed said, "We're going to use more than one Cloud." Now, I know that's a challenge, and customers have to figure out, how to have the right Cloud infrastructure for the right work load. AWS is a phenomenal platform that provides an incredible number of services, but customers may not be ready to make that move holistically. So, what we talk about at Veeam is being able to provide data protection and availability for any data, in any app, on any Cloud. Whether that's a private Cloud that you have on Prem. Whether that's a managed Cloud through a service provider, which we have sixteen thousand of those worldwide now, or whether that's a public Cloud, like AWS, or even software as a service. That's another area of emphasis that we're drawing out with customers thinking, "Well, I'm using Office 365, so I'm OK." not realizing that it's still their responsibility to provide data protection. It's not about if Office 365 goes down, it's what if something gets deleted accidentally, maliciously, it's your responsibility to have that, and so that's why we have solutions to help with that. So, that's why when we talk to customers, we think about looking across the span of, again, all in the context of what does your business need to do? >> Yeah, Paul, talk to us about what you're hearing from customers, because we see most companies have a Cloud strategy today. 85% of companies say they have a Cloud strategy. My discussion with the customers is, well the ink's pretty dry, pretty wet still on those, and it's changing. We say, are they doing tests, of course, Office 365, Sales Force all of the above, they have all of these pieces. One of the big things they're trying to do is get their arms around it, and justify. What are the prevailing strategies out there? What are some of the challenges they're facing, that you're seeing? >> So, I think a couple of things. It's a great question, and it's interesting because we've talking about the Cloud for, I don't know, since 2006, 2007? And despite the fact that I believe that this adoption is happening at a greater pace than we've ever seen of any wave of technology in history, customers are still struggling with it, because it is such a paradigm shift. Virtualization was a shift, but it was kind of easy for customers to get their heads around, you could see the benefits. Cloud is much more complicated, longer term endeavor. What we're hearing from customers is they need help figuring out what I was talking about earlier. What do I do, where? If I could go all-in in Amazon Web Services and build everything, fantastic. I'm gonna go do that. We hear that a lot from customers, that they have not just an idea, but a mandate to say, "I've gotta go do this". The things that they think through is, do I lift and shift applications? Do I do rewrite from the ground up? Do I just say anything new, now is gonna be Cloud native, and I'm gonna slowly sunset other things in my IT portfolio over time. They're struggling with how to do that. There's an education issue there, to get really super smart about how you do that. Security is an overwhelming concern, as you heard this morning. In the last four years, three four years, we've seen amazing improvements in security, and in public Cloud infrastructures, and with managed Cloud service providers as well. It's become such a focus. There's robust capabilities now, and I believe, that in many cases, public Clouds like AWS, managed service projects, they're more secure than maybe a typical enterprise data center is. >> One of the things I'm interested in is healthcare. That's been a historcally slow vertical to move to Cloud, for obvious reasons. HIPPA in the US, a lot of retention, but there's a massive amount of potential that can benefit so many people, whether its getting faster to diagnoses, being able to collaborate across University organizations, or what not, but in terms of security and data protection, and privacy and retention, what are you seeing in terms of maturation and healthcare? Are you seeing more of readiness to start shifting certain workloads to Cloud? >> Yeah, so I spent, probably 19 years of my career in healthcare, both in the provider community, and in pharmaceutical, and life science development. And I think there's two things happening, Lisa, right now, there's the capabilities have been improved dramatically to accommodate and meet HIPPA requirements, meet regulatory requirements over at EMEA, and over at APJ, and now there's more of a willingness to do this. I think we're starting to see a bit of a generational shift in healthcare, where there's an expectation that when I'm in the healthcare system I'll have access to the same kind of information I have about my bank account, my checking, you know, my portfolio, and so, there's a maturity in the IT assets, and there's a willingness now to go do it, and I believe there is probably in more than any other industry, this is a place where you can, the Cloud can have a massive, massive impact. You saw in Verner's keynote this morning, bringing Alexa into the workplace. I think that's gonna be a trend we're gonna continue to see. AI, voice enabled apps, moving in healthcare. Imagine having a dashboard in front of a healthcare worker, where they have all the access and they can use natural language queries to talk about a patient and get access, and analysis to data in an instant. It's gonna happen, it's going to happen, and I think it's gonna happen faster now that we are where we are. >> Paul, these modern applications are a big discussion at a show like this. Everything from microservice to architecture is, you know, no sequel. You mention IOT and AI and everything. How does data protection change for some of these, kinda Cloud native environments? >> It gets trickier in Cloud native, the trick there is figuring out what I need to protect when, right? I think we're seeing when we've had some conversations about is, not backing up, you know backing up the entire app, backing them all up, but backing up the configuration so at the end of the day, maybe the configuration becomes the thing that you focus on protecting because if everything else goes down, you can just rehydrate that configuration, get everything back up online and go. So, it's more complicated, these large-scale databases present some interesting challenges. We are working through some roadmap items now that I think will be pretty interesting in the not too distant future to help address this because I think it's still early days in terms of serverless and containerization. But, we want to be on the front-end of that because again, you can't ignore the idea of data protection or availability just because you have a different development paradigm now. >> The availability for AWS, what are the differentiators, what are the benefits? >> So, a view availability for AWS, we announced a little while ago, it's gonna be coming out probably in early 2018. This is in the idea of when we talk about data protection and availability, our Cloud strategies predicated on three pillars. We talk about too the Cloud, from the Cloud, and within the Cloud. To the Cloud is where everybody's sorta moving to now. That's following what we call the three, two, one rule. Three copy the data, two different media, one of which is stored somewhere else. Customers are now saying, "that should just all be in the Cloud." I heard a quote from a customer that said, "Your capital budget for disaster recovery "and back-up should be zero." All of that stuff should be in the Cloud next model. And then, from the Cloud, is what I talked about earlier, Office 365, backing up sass applications, and then within the cloud is, I wanna be able to back up everything inside a database. I don't want any on prem infrastructure, I don't want anything, I wanna be able to have my whole data protection strategy played out in the Cloud infrastructure. What availability for AWS will provide is the ability to manage easy two instances to provide the availability for EC2 instances at a fine level of granularity, and that can be either within EC2, or if what we have actually, is a surprising number of customers saying, "I'd like to bring that out of the data center." Now, it remains to be seen if, it has a great deal of acceleration and growth. We're gonna allow customer flexibility. If a customer wants to do that, fantastic. If they want to manage it all within AWS, fantastic. We're gonna let them do that. >> Paul, THE VMware on AWS solution, something that gets talked a lot of that show, it seems like something that'd be a natural fit for Veeam to get involved in. Can you bring us up the feed on that? And are there any other announcements this week that are relevant to your ecosystem? >> Yeah, so, no other announcements from us right now. The things that we're talking about in the booth while we're here, one of which is Veeam Back-up and replication for VMC on AWS. >> Stu: That's not a mouthful or anything. >> There's a lot of Vs in there. We think that that could be a game-changer. We really do. I think that was a very good strategic move by both VMWare and AWS to allow customers to do this. We are excited, coming out in version 9.5, update three, which I believe is gonna go GA here in the next couple of days. Customers will be able to use their Veeam infrastructure to provide data protection for those VMWare environments on AWS, just as they would anywhere else in their data center. >> It sounds like you're getting a lot of demand from customers. they're excited for that. I've heard pricing sometimes a concern. What do you hear from customers sometimes about that? >> Yeah, I think customers are still trying to figure out sizing, I think there's still some things to come in terms of how that's gonna roll out over time. I know VMWare has promised to make quarterly updates, I know they've delivered some things this week. We have a fantastic relationship with VMWare, we've been partners for over a dozen years now, and we will continue to engineer our solution with them together so that we can provide the optimal performance for customers. We do think there's gonna a lot of demand for it. We think it could be big. >> Well we know how fast AWS is growing, we know that Veeam is adding 4,000 customers a month. You guys are approaching the one billion dollar mark in revenue, and accelerating very quickly. So, Paul, thanks again for joining us on theCUBE, we appreciate your insight. >> Thank you so much, it was great being here. >> Excellent, and for my co-host, Stu Miniman, I'm Lisa Martin, you are watching theCUBE LIVE from AWS re:Invent 2017 in Las Vegas, stick around, we'll be right back.

>> Announcer: Live from New Orleans, it's The Cube covering VeeamON 2017. Brought to you by Veeam. (upbeat jingle) >> Welcome back to New Orleans everybody. I'm Dave Vellante with Stu Miniman and this is The Cube. The Cube is a leader in live tech coverage, and we're here covering VeeamON 2017. This is day two for us. Paul Mattes is here. He's the vice president of The Global Cloud Group at Veeam. Paul, good to see you. >> Hey, great to be here guys. Thanks for having me in. >> You're welcome. Hosting the conference this morning, throwing Peter MacKay under the bus a little bit. That was kind of funny. He's going to get you in a headlock later. (laughter) No doubt. But you know, it's funny, it's great. VeeamON is an experience for people. You know, it's not just about the hardcore learning, which there's a lot of that going on, but it's about having fun. And a lot of people here are having fun, and you guys embrace that, it's great. >> Yeah, I mean, it's part of our culture, right? I think that's why it's a great company. It's one of the reasons why I came here. And listen, if you can't have fun doing something you love, there's something wrong. So, yeah, we're going to keep that up. >> A lot of sports analogies going on too, which we love in The Cube, oh geeze, ya know? (laughter) Sports angles, and so you guys seem like you're pretty competitive. You're not afraid to put it out there. So, give us the lay of the land. What's happening in the marketplace? >> So, on the cloud specifically this is an area of major growth for us at Veeam. I think it's certainly a competitive landscape, no question about that, but I think we have some advantages given our lineage and where we've evolved from, from an on-prem organization into the cloud. The cloud market's moving very rapidly. You heard me talk about that this morning a little bit, about the pace of cloud adoption. I think it's happening much more quickly than we've ever seen, and I haven't talked to anyone here, and having dozens and dozens of conversations, who haven't talked about having some kind of cloud strategy or trying to figure out how that impacts their go-forward planning in IT. >> You gave some IDC stats I wanted to ask you about that. 46% I think by 2019... >> 2019, right. >> Are going to be doing cloud, and I presume that meant both on-prem cloud? >> Correct. >> So, cloud being an operating model not necessarily a destination. >> That's right, yeah. >> Talk about that a little, what does that mean? >> So, yeah, you hear Danny and I talk about this all the time is that I've been doing the cloud since 2010 when I was with Azure at Microsoft. And everybody talks about moving to the cloud as if that's it, you know, once you're there, it's over with. The reality is, you need to think of the cloud as a way to deliver business results and deliver business solutions. So, just getting to the cloud doesn't mean you're over. Doesn't mean you don't have to think about things like availability and data protection and backup and disaster recovery. So the journey to the cloud, I think it's sort of a, it's a step, right? And then once you're there, there's a whole lot more that you have to do once you're there. >> Paul, one of the things I've been seeing for a couple of years is when it comes to cloud, follow the applications and follow the data. You said you worked on Azure. I mean, no doubt that Azure has lots of applications. Business productivity, I think marketers did a great job this morning laying that out. Virtualization was kind of a tool that applications sat on top. What's that maturation that you see of customers as to how they think about their data and their applications and where things live? >> Yeah, no, it's a great question. I think they're getting much smarter about how they separate and divide those things intelligently. Especially when you think about things like, you know, Mark talked this morning about Stretch DB moving into Azure. And so customers are having to rethink all that that because the cloud really does change how you have to think about application architecture, application deployment. Especially as you do division of data application and sort of the entire architecture end to end. So, I think we're still early days, quite frankly. I think for as much as cloud is in the buzz, and we love where we're evolving to as a cloud organization. The market in general is still early days, and there's a lot of work left to do there. >> Paul, what visibility do you give customers, and how do you help when it comes to the cost of all of this? There's so much, it's often on fud in the market place as to, oh well public cloud's super expensive. No wait, owning it yourself is always expensive. You should always rent versus buy. How do you inject yourself into that conversation? >> Great question, and this is something that has come up since day one. And the assumption is, you've got commodity hardware, you've got scale, so you've got decreasing costs. The reality is it's workload. It's entirely workload dependent, right? There are some workloads that you want to put into the cloud. Absolutely, you would experience amazing economics. We talked today about the scale out backup repository model, taking advantage of Blob story. Perfect example, one of the things customers need to think about is, in addition to those things is ingress and egress costs. It's not just the cost of storage. In the cloud, you have things that surround that in order to make it workable and make it really, really valuable. So one of the things we are doing now with customers is we're starting to work through and develop models to help them think though that. In various stages of network costs, storage costs, and being able to give them some tools that really help them make those decisions. It's not an easy task by any means because at the senior level, executives seem to say, well everybody's saving money in the cloud. Why aren't we there? Why aren't we experiencing that? When you get into the details, it's a little more complicated. But, at the end of the day, the right workload in the right cloud infrastructure, absolutely economic advantages, and more importantly, business advantages. >> Doesn't the savings or business impact really come from what we were talking about earlier, the operating model? Alan Nance, who was the former CIO of Phillips, he was on The Cube, and he said, "If you don't change your operating model, "you're going to just barely scratch the surface of benefits." And so, I wonder if we could explore that a little bit. Is that what you're seeing in the marketplace, that people lift and shift? Maybe there's an advantage that you're shifting CapEx to OpEx, but it's really not moving. >> No, I totally agree. That's not, and it's always frustrated me a little that the economic end of it really seems to dominate a lot of the conversation based on perception. The reality is, yes, this is about changing the operating model and changing the ability of the organization to map to customer demand and map to market demand. The cloud does provide that, and you can't just lift and shift. Yeah, that's okay for some things, but you really have to rethink, okay, if I have this agility and the ability to deliver solutions in a cloud, what does that really mean? How do I really have to think through that from end to end, not just, going back to our earlier question, I'm going to put that in the cloud and we're done. You know? Absolutely you have to rethink everything when you're moving to the cloud from an application's perspective. >> And then from Veeam's perspective, when you think about cloud, obviously you featured Azure up there today. You guys have talked about Affinity with AWS, but there's a lot of cloud providers. >> Paul: Oh yeah, 18,000 of 'em for us. >> And some of those may be managed hosting, but the business model is similar to cloud. So, what are you seeing in terms of the, the market's highly fragmented today. It's very localized. In your view, will it stay that way? Will you see substantial consolidation, or will it be more like the services markets typically are, which is very local, very fragmented, zillions of companies? >> I think, and we think, that there will continue to be a consolidation in this part of the market. There's been an explosion of providers. And what happens is, how do you differentiate if you're a provider in that market, right? What is your secret sauce? What makes you more attractive than another provider? And so, we were already seeing consolidation globally for organizations, so what'll happen, what we think will happen is, yes, there will be some that are very niche, very specialized that continue to have great success, but we will see organizations coming together. Increasingly what we're seeing is providers wrapping new value at its services around their offering, right? This is how they differentiate. We're also seeing service providers that are starting to verticalize. So specializing in a particular healthcare of financial services market as a way to provide value and differentiation for themselves. It's not going to just, and this is why one of the things we've done in Veeam is yes, we will continue to grow the provider base but really focusing ones that differentiate and add value to customers and can partner really, really well with Veeam. >> Paul, Veeam kind of grew up right at that time that not only was was VMware exploding on the market, but there was a new virtualization administrator that didn't exist before. And Veeam helped solve a really salient pain-point that they had. Can you talk to us about when it comes to cloud who are you selling to? The community's very different in a very fragmented cloud world than that kind of big VMware community that we all know. >> Yeah, so it's interesting because we're clearly in an evolution at Veeam. Veeam's legacy, very squarely focused in IT and the IT pro community. That won't change. That will not change. But as you heard from all of our messaging here over the past couple of days, what we really want to continue to evolve to is understanding from a business perspective what is the business value of driving agility, or, driving agility and availability? And so that is now a conversation at a different level. You're talking a CIO level. You're talking COO level. And that's an evolution. It's an easy conversation to have when you're talking about a bits and bytes perspective of how do the bits move, and what are these feature's functions? But you'll see us continually now relate this to, what are the business outcomes? What are the business risks? Why do you need to have an availability strategy, and why is Veeam the choice for that? >> So your positioning is as an availability specialist. No question about that. I want to start by talking a little bit about the market for that. So there's Multi-Cloud, there's Hybrid-Cloud that you've talked about this. I don't know, sometimes we call it inter-clouding. But you are positioning the strategy as positioning in the middle of all that as the availability, the best at availability, always on. So, first of all, how big is that market? Can you talk a little bit about the TAM, however you look at it? Maybe not hardcore numbers, but if you have 'em, we'd love it, but how do you look at that? >> Well I think Peter presented some data in his keynote on Tuesday. And we see the total addressable market as in the six to nine billion dollar range, which is pretty massive. If we can capture just a fraction of that, we're going to easily blow through our stated goals of getting to a billion, a billion five in the next couple of years. So, and that's why we're going to, we will continue to focus across the spectrum of those platforms, right? You heard us talk about, that's the core. We grew up in virtualization, now physical, and that we're going to attack storage. But, and we won't lose that. But now, understanding how all the different cloud assets and cloud platforms intersect that, that whole market is massive and will continue to grow. It's interesting, I was talkin' the other night with an analyst about cloud predictions, and we said, we'd love to go back and look at the last four or five years of predictions from analysts and see, where do they land? Where do they really end up? And I went back, and this is not an in-depth, robust survey, but going back a few years looking at all the estimates of cloud market growth, they were all wrong. And they were all wrong on the low side, all right? And it's hard sometimes to get analysts to not over-hype things, right? But everyone that I looked at, it was more, the reality turned out to be greater than what the prediction was. >> It's the definition of a disruptive technology 'cause we're usually horrible at forecasting it, right? >> (laughing) Yeah, exactly, exactly, which is a good thing. >> So in that sort of center of the cloud, if we can call it that, explain to people why Veeam and not a higher level of abstraction. Like VMware for example, them tryin' to be sort of, even though they're not availability specialists, but they're pretty good at availability. And people are concerned about managers of managers. Why does Veeam win in that scenario? >> I think Veeam wins in that scenario given the breadth of our capability, given the breadth of what we do, thing number one, given the breadth of our ecosystem, number two. We don't have all the answers, but we have an amazing partner ecosystem that does. And number three, I would say the simplicity, right? This mantra that we have at Veeam of it just works, that's very, very valuable. I heard, you know just wandering around here, unsolicited. People don't know who I am when I'm walking with my badge off. And I've heard multiple times, they're not kidding when they say that it just works thing. That's something that we will never ever get away from, and that's a clear differentiator for us. We were talking, we did a breakout session the other day, Danny and I, and we were with a number of service providers, and they asked, we had these canonical examples of what we're doing. And they asked a few questions of why can't we do this? And Danny and I would look back and say, well you can do that, but it's not to the point where we have it yet where we say, it just works. There's a way to string it together. There's a way Veeam can solve that problem, but we need to continue to improve engineering in order to get it to the point where it just works. To make it that simple, elegant, and that's a huge differentiation. >> So the premise there is it's not a zero sum game, certainly between you and VMware because of the simplicity and the integration that you do with VMware. Very interesting dynamic going on in the marketplace. It's early days, but you guys are, I love the positioning. It's clean and it's focused. >> No, thanks, I'm glad because we love the feedback. It's something we work really, really hard at. Veeam is in a great period of transition, bringing Peter on, the leadership team that Peter's brought in. That's really, really important that we're able to communicate where we're going and how we position because we are so passionate about it. You want to make sure that the words come out, well, and that the messaging is proper, and that our strategy is locked on. >> All right, we'll give you the last word on VeeamON 2017, bumper sticker as the trucks are pullin' away... What does it say? >> I mean, I think it's an amazing event. It's my first VeeamON. I have been blown away by the energy and the information that we've shared. I think we have a lot of exciting things that are coming down the pike, and we just can't be thankful enough for the great participation and look forward to the future. >> All right, Paul Mattes, thanks for comin' on The Cube. >> Hey, thanks guys. >> All right, you're welcome. Keep it right there everybody. Stu and I will be back with our next guest at The Cube. We're live from VeeamON 2017 from New Orleans. We'll be right back. (upbeat jingle) (electronica jingle)