>>from around the globe. It's the Cube with digital coverage of out systems. Next Step 2020 Brought to you by Out Systems Hi and welcome to the Cubes coverage of out systems. Next step. I'm your host stew Minimum and happy toe. Welcome back to the program. He's relatively fresh off the keynote stage. He's also a cube alum. Eso happy to welcome paella risotto. He's the founder and CEO of Out systems. Hello, Thanks so much for joining us. And thanks for having the queue. But your event >>now it's a pleasure to glad to be here. >>So you know your keynote. You know, one of the big themes we've been talking about for quite a while in the industry, of course, is the growth and importance of developers Onda, something that I heard loud and clear from what you and your team are talking about. It's really about helping companies, you know. It's move faster, it's be more agile, and it's really X. It's banding. Uh, you know, we need mawr developers. We need them to be ableto on ramp faster. Uh, on especially here in 2020. As I said, you and I spoke earlier this year at kind of the early stages of the global pandemic. Right now we know it's, you know, we can't have people slow down even when they can't go to the office, even though a lot of developers were dispersed as it is. So if you could see, you know, give us you know it did this your high level, you know, your customers, the developer community that that you're welcoming here to the show? >>No, Absolutely. I mean, we're really excited about this event is a This has gone way beyond our wildest expectations in terms of tendency and all of that. It's bean to an absolutely fantastic e mean what what we've seen. What we've seen is a growing demand from enterprises for solutions that are extremely differentiated. Um, you can actually get software. You can get digital systems out off out of the box, but there's a new increasing number of systems like portals and the work flows and applications that you actually have to infuse with your with your business process with your intellectual property with you as a business and therefore you have to build your own software. And so the the amount of software that's being built inside organizations is increasing its zits, increasing to a point where these these enterprises are facing all sorts of issues related to to to proliferation to skill. Set the fact that they cannot hire enough developers enough architect and offset cops people. I mean, the skill sets that just staggering and they heard, because they are they want to build this software, but they have a lot of difficulties in finding the tools and the skill sets. >>Yeah, it's great to come to an event like this and hear people. They're excited about building applications. They're they're they're getting into code. Um, it's been almost too easy this year, Palo to say, Uh, there's so many challenges, you know, at home everyone's fighting over bandwidth and space. Andi, there's those challenges. So, you know, we need to be able to see kind of that, that joy into what I can win. I can build things and get things done. So, you know, how are you seeing that? You know what? What feedback are you getting? Um and you know, as we said, 2020 we all know is a challenging year. >>Yeah, it's It's been a challenging gear. But it's also, you know, it's also been a near off year off opportunities. And we see that, uh, all over are we stall based on our prospect days and our partners and our community. And in general, these things events. Adult systems have a very different vibe from your typical corporate event, because one of one of the things that Z that's unique about our systems is everyone who comes to this event have built something unique. And so and it it zvehr e gratifying. When you're talking with customers and you're talking with developers, the one thing they want to talk about is how they fixed one particular, very unique problem that they face using our systems and the exchange these war stories, about how fast they were and how quickly they managed to overcome a particular challenge. Or, uh, when they got the change request from the business, that was, we need to do this in in two hours or 24 hours, whatever horrible timeline that they get and they were able to do it. It's these stories that get exchange around the next step floor in this event, and this one has been going on exactly as we've seen. The other ones which were physical events in the past. >>S O Paulo. On the keynote stage, you talked about the fact that you've now got over 1400 customers. You've got 300 partners. Uh, you're not just some, you know, New startup out system's been around for two decades. Now, talk a little bit about, you know, your growth. Some of the innovations that air that air driving customers in increasing, you know where they're coming houses. >>No, absolutely. I mean, the major major innovations that we have been doing is we we we we have been focused a lot on addressing the need for speed. I mean, the cycles of innovation have been compressing in the past years, and every year there is Ah, there is a further compression of the cycle. And so business are coming back to developers are coming back to i. T. They are some of these business. Uh, some of these business folks departments are completely autonomous in terms of what? Of building some digital systems, and all of them have this need for speed for very high productivity. And so we've bean Ah, lot of our investment has bean first and foremost in, how can we make all these folks way more productive? And we've been doing a tremendous amount of research into the anatomy of building these these applications understanding what are the the typical, most common patterns abstracting them, making them really use using a lot of ai and machine learning to create, uh, to create a almost like a a artificial bots that can help developers move quicker and create serious applications with big architectures without making mistakes. But very, very quickly, Um, and therefore, uh, when When we we provide these things extreme speed, we make sure at the same time. And this is where a lot of our innovation also comes along is ah, is this notion of building these applications right? Which is you. You have to be fast, but not at the expense of lack of security, lack of scalability, lack of availability, non observe ability. You know all these things that are that you don't really pay attention when you just want to create a nap and put some functional requirements designed something into either a nap or workflow, whatever. But when you're scaling from 20 users toe one million users. You need to make sure that you can do that. When you're exposing a portal to the external world, you need to make sure that you're not going to be attacked by hackers. Are you going to have the now service attack or at your mobile application is completely shielded and secure and cannot be penetrated. All of these things are things that are all part that cannot be at the expense of speed. And so that's what we try to do. We try to bring together the speed increasing speed, but at same time building fast building it right and making sure that as you evolve that your application is evergreen doesn't create technical debt. So build it for the future. And we focus a lot on this reason. >>Yeah, definitely heard that team loud and clear. Looking forward to actually, I've got so g your head of products toe walk through. Some of the announcement also got your head of a I in that really fascinating stuff as, uh, you know, like emails. Do they kind of, you know, start making suggestions and, you know, it feels like the tech technology is getting better. It's not like it was a few years ago where it was like I just want to turn that off because the suggestions were slowing me down rather than speeding me up, but moved faster. Um, you know, you see what I want to get to You talked about that flexibility of change, Really. One of the big challenges you know right now is that there's always new technologies. There's new opportunity. I need to move fast. So how do I make sure that I could do something today and not be, you know, locked out of that next new thing thing or be able to make a change? So how do you make sure that you, you know, you've got an architect? We said that that's now been around for decades, but, you know, meeting the needs of developers helping to bring on new developers. Um, that you make sure that you can stay, you know, always modern, if you will. >>Now that's that's a That's a fantastic question. It's a really good point. I mean, one of the trade offs of, uh, one of the easy ways of building these these type of products or platforms is you actually your visual modeling your obstructions, Uh, the things that you build so that you increase productivity in a lot of, um in a lot of scenarios. The easiest path is towards linking whatever technology you're going toe power these applications to the way you build the modeling. Um, and one of the things that that out systems as as has always done we design our platform from day one with the perspective that we knew the underlying technology. Name it. Web stacks to kubernetes toe on premise. Virtual machines to containers serverless, uh, technologies, micro application servers. All of these things we knew they were going to dramatically change in the next years. And we've been proven right in the sense that not only take underneath technology or technology that that's used to build these applications have been changing, but they've been changing faster. And the turmoil of technologies that you can build applications is accelerating at creating a huge problem for enterprises that once a certain level of stability. But they don't also want to become whole old. And so the art systems platform allows you to build your applications at the layer where we adult systems we can replace the underlying technology without you having to rewrite the application and because of our technology, you can basically just republish or we upgrade our platforms and automatically your applications will run on the next best of breed technology that's now hot and that is providing you extra scalability, extra security, extra high availability. We take care of that and we show you how we do it because we were following those type of standards. But it's really around the architectures off of the product at the same time, Ato level of the development of the modeling and a lot of these things. We make sure that there is a certain level of stability and we keep on improving it so that we can bring developers into our community. And those sets are constantly relevant as they move from customer to customer as they move from simpler applications toe highly complex ones. All the investment that they've made on our systems gets rewarded in the next 2357 years. We have a community. We have members of argument that have been with us for more than 15 years and we want to keep it that way >>well, that That's impressive. I'm curious. You know, we've We've had this discussion, I guess. How many years ago was it that now that mark injuries and said that software is eating the world? Palo eso So many companies now you're talking about, you know, building software building that application needs to be a key thing. You know, the role of I t. Just servicing the business isn't enough. I t needs to be tightly. I'd with the business and that capability of building software, doing things fast and reacting eyes so important. So what does this kind of these waves coming together? I mean, for out systems the growth of the company. And, you know, I would have to expect that some of your your newer customers look a little bit different than the ones that have been with you for 15 years. >>You know what? It z actually interesting that the problem that we solving is is a very basic, very old problem. And so it's just that what what has changed in in the recent years is that before it was acceptable for a 19 person to go to the business and say this project is going to take three years or this new report that this change that you want to put in your application is going to take a six months or three months to go into production. And today that's an unacceptable answer. Um, and so today, with these type of platforms, like out systems, this provides it provides a tremendous, uh, pleasant life for the guys who are actually developing and delivering thes digital systems. These applications, because the relationship with the business is a much more constructive one. Instead of you saying no Oh, I want this. I want this new mobile app and, uh, and someone coming back to you. Okay, give me two million and give me 12 months or 14 months to build this this app. Now you can go back and say, OK, well, that that's going to take me one week and I have off a guy ready to build that for you. That first version and they can work together with you so that we get those requirements right, because we know that the model application is going to be it. The first version we're going to produce is not going to be the one that you want And so we want to reiterate that conversation is the holy Grail of what we always wanted in the relationship between 90 and the business and now way have it with without systems. And that's the That's the alert. Now, if you look into the tens of industries, this particular type of characteristic is this dynamic between business I t and building. These things exist in every industry, and that's why our target addressable market is so huge. And that's why we're growing so fast at this point, because it's a it's a capability that everyone wants and before it just looks magic now, before it was considered impossible. And that's why people didn't ask for >>it. Paolo talking about that, that growth in that potential? What's your commentary on? You know the skill gaps out there, You know, how do we onboard Mawr developers, You know what's what's the opportunity and the challenge that you see out there just really when you talk about the future of jobs in this space? >>Well, um, what what we've seen is that, for instance, we measured we're very scientific. Adult systems about looking had the anatomy of skills and the what are the skill sets needed to build what type of systems. And it's not all or nothing thing. A lot off. People try to sometimes simplify and say there is this notion of the professional developer on the business developer or or even the cities and developer, which is a term we don't really enjoy it out systems that much. Um, but it's this very binary separation, and what we've seen in reality is that there is, ah, continuum. A spectrum of skill sets that we can pile up. And we can create and develop tools and capabilities, for instance, in the out systems platform that allow us to take an increasingly larger number of backgrounds and people to build an increasingly larger number of more complex applications. And so it z kind of a moving target. But the potential is that the shortage of computer science grads that exist today in the world on its not Onley in the Western world is it's all over Asia Latin America places where you'd consider that you have enough talent to fulfill the demand. Demand is huge compared with that supply of developers and so being able to, for instance, happening on on the stem, Um, the science majors being able to tap on social grads like architectural, uh, architect's and normal civil architects and the, uh, social engineers and and and all of that, all of those profiles we have found that we can bring them into the out systems community, and then they have them complement the sum of their natural skills with some technical skills and being able to actually produce these systems. And so we by doing that, we multiplied by 10 the pool of available resources to our to our customers and to to the enterprises want to build software. But they're facing this issue of the skills shortened. >>Oh, Paula, we We've got a great lineup for our coverage with the Cube. I've got a couple of your customers. I mentioned some of the executives. I've got your head of developer and community on there, but want to give you the final word. You know, takeaways you want. You know that the the audience out there toe have to understand about out systems today in the strategy going forward. >>Well, I think what what I wanted to say is that we've we've proven that we've been around for some time. And the reason for this is because it takes a while to build a product that's truly comprehensive and powerful enough that you can build complex, serious applications very quickly, but that are also that do not, uh, that you don't have to be facing a wall of security, of scalability and all of that. So this is a platform that takes a long time to get right. It takes a lot of input from our from our install base. Takes a lot off. Ah, lot of learnings from all the, uh, hundreds of thousands of applications and projects we've seen. But today our customers can take that benefits and move forward very, very quickly. Andi, we're going to stay around for many years to come because it's such a pleasurable job to be able to help all of these enterprises become as innovative as they can and as fast as they can. So I'm really excited about being in this position as we have today. >>Well, Paulo, really pleasure for us toe Be part of this event. Thanks so much and definitely looking forward to talking to the rest of your your team's your customer in the ecosystem. >>Thank you too. >>Stay with us for more coverage. Jumps to minimum. And thanks. As always, for watching. Thank you.

>> Announcer: From theCUBE studios in Palo Alto and Boston, connecting with thought leaders all around the world, this is a CUBE Conversation. >> Hi, I'm Stu Miniman, and welcome to a CUBE Conversation. We always love talking to founders of companies. We love supporting the Boston-area community, but even more, right now, we're of course talking to leaders in the industry about some of the challenges facing with the global pandemic, so, happy to welcome to the program first-time guest Paulo Rosado, who is the founder and CEO of OutSystems. You are based in Boston, your company is global. Paulo, thanks so much for joining us, and let's start out talking about kind of the age we are in right now and how you are supporting your customers, your employees, and the developer community that you engage with. >> Absolutely, and it's a pleasure to be here, Stu. Actually, since the 23rd of March, that our 1,100 employees are all working remote, so we've had more than 1,000 Zoom calls logged, at least among the people that I know. And we have dogs and kids everywhere, and we have to adjust, 'cause we have a lot of new parents, so the kids are all over them and whatever. But actually, productivity and morale is really at a high rate. The business is going really, really well. However, as in a very OutSystems type of way, actually, because we're so fast building these digital solutions that we've launched a program with our partners. We asked them for ideas, we got more than 200 ideas coming in, and we're sponsoring 20 of those ideas. One of them is with Deloitte, for instance, where we fundamentally, in one week, they've created a full logistics system to manage all the supplies within 16 municipalities, including ventilators, masks, PPEs and the like. >> Well, that's great to hear, right. So if people want to find out more on the OutSystems website, it's the COVID-19 Community Response Program, and love to see, Paulo, we're going to talk a bit about OutSystems and what you're doing for customers. Of course, the speed of development of new applications is what your company's been doing for a long time, and it kind of becomes a little bit bromide that we talk about, "Oh, well, software's eating the world." Well, in challenging times, how is software hoping to meet the challenges that communities, municipalities, employees, companies need to survive in these challenging situations? So anything else you want to talk about, kind of the community program? >> Yeah, well, so what we did is we opened up the community, worldwide community, actually, because today we serve about 60 countries, and so we wanted to have projects that really add impact. We had a couple from Germany, and some from Asia, and it's amazing. Today, we have sponsored 14, so we have 14 scalable installations already running. Some of these projects have gone live, some are still in development. But what's interesting is that the 200,000-plus communities, that they're getting together. We have all these virtual teams, subject matter experts, relationships with house officers and house offices, and developers, and we're just churning away. And the innovation of the people when they have, actually, something that they can build real solutions fast, they can iterate on top, it's absolutely amazing. And it's our contribution, also, to the world here, really. >> Yeah, very important, Paulo, thank you for doing that. Boy, I think, Paulo, you started the company back in 2001. The discussion around software and developers was rather nascent back in those days. So bring us a little bit through the journey of the company, if you would, and some of the major things that are different now in, really, you're entering the third decade of the company, so bring us back to some of the early days, as well as, what is significantly different today? >> Actually, the idea that we had initially was very much the one that has become truth. We were just about 14 years ahead of the market. So the company's called OutSystems because at the time, we believed that a large percent of systems would migrate out of the data center. That is what today is called the cloud. We believed, at the time, based on all the evidence, that a lot of software that companies were going to be building needed to be done in a very agile way, which is, you need to build fast, but not only build fast, but change very, very fast. And it took us a while until we reached about three to four years ago, when suddenly, everything became agile. Suddenly, everything that you build, all the software that you build, you no longer had one year or 18 months to build this project. Now, you had weeks, and those times have been compressing. And so, what's happening now is we encounter ourselves in a world where companies increasingly want to build more software because they want to be differentiated, they want to compete, but the talent available and the speed they have to build these pieces of software are becoming more and more challenging, and we help a lot in doing that. We are the most mature, the most advanced no-code/low-code platform in the market. And so, it's a great time for us now. >> Yeah, Paulo, I'd like to help understand software development, application modernization are very important topics for a number of years now. I think back to last year, Satya Nadella on stage at Microsoft Ignite, and he was talking about just the massive amounts of new applications that would be built over the next few years. And it's interesting, a company like Microsoft that, you go back 10 years ago, it'd be like, "Well, you'll be using all of our software, "not thinking about building your own software." So you've got partnerships with the public cloud providers, there's all sorts of new partners as well as competitors entering the space. So help us understand kind of where OutSystems fits in this ecosystem and differentiates itself from some of the other noise that's out there. >> No, absolutely. Well, we've woken up a lot of giants, definitely, with this approach. One of the differentiators is that these platforms are actually pretty hard to build, and so, if you look into what Satya said in that particular conference, he was mentioning the fact that fundamentally, every company needs to become a cloud software company. But in order for you to become a cloud software company, you need a very large number of talent skills. You need good web developers, front-end developers, back-end developers. You need to have people who understand DevOps, you need to understand scalability, security, all of these things. You can do that with the tens and even hundreds of tools that are in the market, but what the platform like OutSystems stands up by doing is ends up abstracting a lot of debt and just gives you a very fast capacity for you to build your mobile applications, your pricing engines, your workflows, your portals, in a very fast way. So leveraging the people that you have, leveraging the unique knowledge of the business that you have, and letting you catch up to disruptors that really have all those technical skill sets that today are so rare. >> Yeah, and I'd love to hear, tell us a little bit about your customer base. So you've been around for many years, so I'm sure it is quite diverse, but how many customers does OutSystems have? If you've got a key use case or two that might help us understand where this low-code/no-code solution is helping them through their journey. >> Oh, absolutely, we have companies like Safeway, Chevron, T-Mobile. All of them have somehow different use cases, because we are in the business of innovation, and so, whatever you want to innovate with, you innovate typically with OutSystems. We have a particular company which is the largest oil and gas terminal management company in the world. They have 73 terminals. And one of the things they built was a full ERP, a full platform, digital platform, to manage all logistics of the tankers that come into the ports, deploy the oil in the reservoirs, and then having trucks that come and take the oil away. It's a very complex business, and they were looking at, fundamentally, a four- to six-year project to build this, and they did it in seven months. And so, these type of compressions of time for these very large systems is a huge, huge differentiator. Then we have, on the other hand, companies that have built their front ends, typically mobile applications integrated with web applications, and those applications change, fundamentally, almost every day or every week. We have a bank, for instance, that's releasing a version per day in their applications. That speed of development gives them a huge competitive advantage but puts a lot of pressure on the stack and all the IT that's needed, and we help there because of the platform. >> Yeah, Paulo, we've been talking for years about some of the transformations that companies are going through, and that application transformation really is one of the bigger challenges that they face along those lines. In some of the events I go to, the communities I look at, there's a lot of talk about how containerization in Kubernetes is helping to move the infrastructure team to get ready for this. Of course, we've talked a bit already about how public cloud's changing things. Serverless is a different paradigm for how application developers should think about the platforms they're living on. How does OutSystems kind of plug in to these trends which have come along in the time since you've been out there? >> Oh, very well. The way these platforms work, at least, the way the OutSystems platform works, is that we have an automation layer who's responsible, fundamentally, for compressing time and making things increasingly easier. Basically, just give an IT department or company the capacity to build things 100 times faster. But underneath, we actually use the newest architectures that give us high scalability, also scaling resilience, 99.999% of uptime. And in those cases, for instance, for that, we use containers, Linux, Docker, all of those type of technologies. We run standard on AWS, we also run on Azure. And so, we can provide automation, but underneath, we're fundamentally using the same tools that all enterprise-grade architects are using. >> Okay, great, Paulo. Last question I have for you, give us a little bit your outlook on the future of software development, what we should be looking at when it comes to OutSystems and your community. >> Well, actually, it's not only about OutSystems, it's all about development of the software. We believe, and we see evidence of it, that while software development used to be done by some elites about 10, 15 years ago, today, every company needs to build their own software. And more than 65% of new software that's going to be built in the next three to five years is going to be done with a no-code or low-code platform. That's just too much, you just need that speed, you don't have enough talent. And actually, what we see, and we're doing a lot of research there, is that complementing the developers, we're seeing more and more AI bots that actually assist development in a lot of the boring tasks that are part of the development and deployment cycle, like validation of code, automatic testing, creating the right patterns of architecture for high scalability and maintainability. We're introducing a lot of those things in the platform. So in the next years, we believe we'll see more and more developers being helped by artificial intelligence bots, therefore progressing in that 100X to 1,000X automation productivity enhancement. >> Well, I tell you, you're hitting on one of our favorite topics to talk about. (Paulo chuckles) We did an event years ago with Andy McAfee and Erik Brynjolfsson from MIT, talking about how it really is about racing with the machines. So I've seen things that said, "Oh, computer programmers, you're the next things "that are going to be replaced by robots." And what I'm hearing from you is, of course, what we know is that really it is the combination of people plus this software that are really going to supercharge things going forward. And you're nodding, so you would agree. >> That's exactly it. And we already have evidence of that because we have a lot of our AI is already deployed inside the platform, and so we're measuring, we're learning with it. And we can see tremendous, almost exponential improvements. It's almost as if a developer, as they're creating these functional requirements, gets augmented with an extra brain. So it really works, and it's time now, it's reaching time for AI to be used to help the software development cycle. >> Right, well, Paulo, thank you so much for the conversation. Absolutely we hope that these kind of technologies are the ones that are going to help the global economy as we hopefully move forward from the results of the current global situation here. So thank you so much for joining us, and definitely look forward to keeping track of the company in the future. All right-- >> Thank you, Stu, it was a pleasure. Thank you very much. >> Thanks, I'm Stu Miniman, and as always, check out theCUBE.net for all of the digital events, as well as the archives of interviews that we've done, reach out to us if you have any questions, and as always, thank you for watching theCUBE. (upbeat electronic music)