>> Live from Las Vegas. It's theCUBE. Covering VMworld 2018. Brought to you by VMware and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome to theCUBE. We are live at VMworld 2018. Day one, VMware's 20th anniversary. I am Lisa Martin, very excited to be joined by Dave Vellante. Hey, Dave! >> Hey, Lisa, good to see you again. >> Good to see you, too. We are welcoming back to theCUBE, an alumni, Geoff Waters, the VP of Global Cloud Sales for Vmware, hi, Geoff. >> Hi, great to be here, guys. Last year, we talked about the buzz, VMware getting the buzz back. Boy, this is a sonic boom this year. >> Yeah, it's a lot of buzz. >> Superpower infused. And we've also got David Wigglesworth, the Chief Revenue Officer for OVH. David, welcome to theCUBE. >> Thank you very much, both of you, Dave and Lisa. >> So, I have to ask first, do you have the VMware tattoo that Pat Gelsinger sported this morning? >> I don't have VMware, but I do have OVHcloud. Okay, so, speaking of OVH, David give our viewers an overview of what you guys are doing and what momentum you have created with VMware. >> Yeah, you know, it's an exciting time for us, especially to be here, as a Global Diamond sponsor, right? This is our second year, as OVHcloud, to be here. Last year, when we came, it was right after the vCloud Air acquisition of the asset from Vmware. Which is where our partnership just continued to grow more and more. And, so, for the last year, what we've been doing is we've really been focusing on deploying our data centers here, as well as getting our products ready to go to market. I always joke that OVHcloud is, probably, the best-kept secret in the US because that, when we acquired vCloud Air's assets, is when we kind of launched in the US. But, as Geoff can tell you in a few minutes, we've been a partner with VMware for years, right? And it's been really exciting. >> Yeah, I wonder if you could talk about that, Geoff, a little bit, I mean, the signal on vCloud Air early on, you guys kept having to tune the radio station, so to speak. >> Yep. >> Yep. >> And then, boom, finally it hit the OVH acquisition and then AWS deal, of course, IBM and other cloud service providers. Talk about how that all came about, and the track that you're on now. >> Yes, so, I mean, we've been partnering with OVH for actually nine years, I went back and I researched it. >> Did you? >> Yeah, back in Europe. So, they've actually been a seven-time Service Provider of the Year award winner. So, our relationship with OVH is nothing new. And we've been working with them for years. The other thing is the breadth of the portfolio adoption, the full SDDC stack, so not just vSphere, NSX, vSAN, the entire stack. So, you know, OVH is right in the forefront of our overall cloud strategy, and it has been for years. >> Yeah, and as a global infrastructure provider, we have almost a million 500 thousand customers, in 138 different countries. We have 28 data centers, three here in North America. We've got the breadth to go to the market in a big way. So, it's exciting to be here. >> So, lay out the options that you have for OVH customers. What services can they get from you? What are the platforms? >> No, it's a great question. So, obviously, have a very purpose-felt solution built on VMware, right, with our Hybrid Private Cloud. It's all built on the SDDC stack. So vSphere, vSAN, NSX, everything that Geoff mentioned. We also offer a bare metal solution. And then we also have a public cloud offering that's built on our relationship that we have with OpenStack. So, we give our customers three different choices on what they want to go to the market with. >> So, what do you make of, what's the AWS-VMware partnership mean for OVH? How do you guys take advantage of that? >> Well, I mean, you know, look. I think Pat, in his keynote this morning, talked about that eight out of every 10 customers is using cloud today, multi-cloud strategy. The average large customer is using, what did he say, eight clouds? >> Yep. >> He said that they're forecasting that there would be 10 clouds by the end of 2019. I'd like to take one of those two spots, if you don't mind. So, no, we think there's huge opportunity. I mean, Amazon's built a business on, and has created kind of the standard. We think there's plenty of room to play in a very large market. >> Well, the services market has always been highly fragmented. >> Yep. >> And it's always been local in nature. Maybe not as to the degree and scale, but, so, you've got, what did you say, a million and a half customers? >> Globally. >> So what are they telling you about their cloud strategy? >> Well, what our customers are asking for is they're asking for agility. They're looking for low cost. You know, we announced a partner program earlier this morning, where we're launching that. And our partners are coming to us saying, David, give us choice, give us flexibility, and help us save a little bit of money. I mean, all of our partners are dealing with margin erosion, as well as everybody else in the industry. So, if we can come to market and actually help them go acquire a customer, and help them do that in a way that's cost-effective, they're very excited about that. >> So, what's the conversation that you're having with customers? You know, we were, a lot of press, a lot of news came out this morning. A lot of great announcements made by Pat and team on stage. Customers talking about migrating from on-prem to the cloud, from public back to on-premises, for security compliance reasons. What are some of the things that you guys are hearing from customers, when you're having those business-level discussions about being able to execute a successful cloud strategy? >> You want to hit that first, and I'll come over. >> Go ahead. Well, I can. So, what our customers are talking about is simplicity. One of the things that we're excited to work about, to work with VMware on, is that our customers, when they move their solution on-prem to our hybrid cloud, they use the exact same resources that they use on-prem today. They don't have to go hire new people. It's all of the exact same economics that they've built to an on-prem solution, is in their off-prem solution with OVHcloud. That's what makes this so unique, right? I mean, look, part of the vCloud Air acquisition, what are we doing? We're migrating VMware customers, right, that are using VMware technology, that we're setting on vCloud Air into OVH data centers, using VMware technology to do it. And, so, it's. >> Just to add to that, the beauty is reducing day two complexity onto the operations, day two operations. So, instead of customers having to build out all themselves and integrating it, OVH is doing that already. Right out of the gate, in a hosted managed environment. >> That's because it is a like to like homogeneous, and you guys have laid that vision out years ago. >> Yep, yep. >> We sure did. >> When Maritz was running the company. But how does that actually manifest itself? So, a customer says, look, I'm sick of the heavy lifting, I want to get to the cloud. Alright, so they come to you guys, what are the steps that they take to get there? >> Well, there's, you know, the first thing you'll do is you'll sit down with the client. And some clients know exactly what they want to do and how they want to do it. And some customers say, hey, I think I need to be in the cloud, please help me. So we'll have that conversation, right, first of all. Yeah, exactly, it's from A to Z, soup to nuts, whatever you want to say. So, you know, a lot times we'll sit down and we'll walk them through that journey to the cloud. And then, once we determine what applications or workloads we want to move, then we'll back into, okay, well here's the best way to move that, right, and whatever technologies we then decide to do. And if it's vSphere based, it makes it real simple, right? >> And you hit the nail on the head. It starts with the application. It's always about the application. What is the end goal? Right, once you identify that, you start looking at the use cases, a lot of it's app migration, a lot of data center evacuation. A lot of these data centers, as the different leases are coming up, they want to get out of there. Right, and that's the opportunity to then have the discussion. There's also tools that we got. HDX, which allows for bulk migration of workloads and it reduces, you know, the complexity of going to another cloud and another hypervisor from, like, years down to months and weeks. We've had some customers that have done that, migrated hundreds of VMs over a weekend. >> Oh sure. And we're in the process of that right now. >> So, go ahead, please. >> Oh, thank you, I was going to say, could you give us an example of a customer, whether they're in Europe, where you guys have really had a lot success, or here in the Americas, that have really demonstrated substantial business outcomes, revenue, et cetera, leveraging the joint service? >> Well, sure, I mean, you know, we've got customers both in the U.S. and in EMEA, but, you know, I'm thinking about a customer in particular that's based in the U.K.. That, they're a MNA company, right? And, at one time, they had 97 data centers that they were trying to manage. The complexity of that. And, so, they originally went to vCloud Air because they were like, help us with this complexity, we're built on VMware, but we've got to close these data centers, right, we need to go to more of an asset-like model, and we need to be able to manage it effectively with the staff that I have that's already overworked. So that's how we won them as a client with vCloud Air. What's exciting is, is when we come in and we start talking about what we're doing with OVH, and some of the new technology that we're building, on the VMware stack, right, plus the fact that we own our own network. I don't charge ingress and egress charges, right. A lot of the things that we do, We've got 33 points of presence, you know, globally. Then we start having a conversation and they're like, listen I already had a great solution in vCloud Air on VMware, now I've got that on steroids. I've got the benefit of both companies coming together for a solution for my client. >> So how do you get the data from point A to point B? Do you back up the Chevy truck and load it on? >> You can do it that way. >> You talked about your network. What's the kind of best practice? >> Yeah, so the best practice is to come in and understand the actual environment we're working with. What is the tolerance to take that workload up or down? But, if we use technology like HDX, I don't have to take that workload down at all. I'm able to basically, essentially, and don't let me get over my skis, VMware guy, but I am going to essentially do a Vmotion over my network, right, no cost to the customer, into my data center, and the customer can continue to use the app while that's happening. >> And the time that takes is a function of, obviously, the volume of the data, >> Sure, of course. The bandwidth. >> The number of VMs, the complexity of that. >> So you'll schedule that out over a period of, what, days, weeks, months? >> Exactly Years, even, I mean, maybe not years but, maybe I have a multi-year strategy, right? So that's how you're seeing people do it? It's sort of a planned approach. >> Weeks and months is sort of. >> I would say, typically. >> It's project based, yeah. >> So, within months, I can get an entire data center from my on-premises into your platform. Is that a fair statement? >> And if you ever wanted to bring it back, we can do that real easy too. >> You see that happening? >> We see customers moving workloads back and forth, it depends on seasonality. I mean, you take the retail industry, right? There's a lot of times where, during the retail industry, they'll send things to us, they'll flip it around, and, after the holidays are over, they'll bring there on-prem or what have you. >> And, more importantly, I think having network access back into the on-prem data center, with HDX, allows you to have a network connection. So it does need a talk back. The whole workload may not move back, but you need to have communications back into the network. And that's what HDX, their technology, allows. >> Right. >> So it allows me to leave whatever component of my workload I want to keep there. >> Yep, that's right. >> When I'm talking to each other. >> That's right. >> Okay, so for years at VMware, we heard this theme, any app, any workload, really anywhere in the world. >> Exactly. >> Now, you guys, right, you guys have an open source based public cloud. Vmware, obviously, like, hey, some of these cloud native apps, we'd like a piece of that action. You hear Pat talking about Kubernetes and containers. So what's that conversation like, between you guys, I mean you want some of that, right? Are you talking about Edge? Is that more integration? You guys got some work to do there to really compete in the that space? >> Well, I mean, it's your solution. But I'll start off of on the Edge. So, the announcement on Edge today, I don't know if you guys have heard it yet, but really exciting. We've actually announced a lot of different solutions around automation of the data center. I mean, this whole cloud operations is becoming sort of a major problem, as we have eight to 10 global service providers in most enterprises. So, reducing the complexity of that down is incredibly important. All the pieces that we're announcing, a VMware as a service, we're going to roll to our service providers in a managed service environment. So all these new technologies that we just announced, right, David and OVH are going to get access to that and have the same capability. >> That's right. >> I'll let you guys speak, specifically on your OpenStack. >> Well, I mean, listen, the beautiful thing about OpenStack is it's open, right, so, I mean, it doesn't really matter what cloud's out there, we can interface with it, right? So, that's the beauty of it, right? And it doesn't change at all the way that we go to market. It's just, really, we're giving the customers choice. What do you want? And it depends on the app, right? That's what's beautiful about it, is when we've sit down and meet with customers or partners, it's, like, what do you want to do, what workload would you want to move? And we've got choice for you. >> Yeah, I remember when we talked to Pat about this, years ago, when OpenStack was kind of the hot new toy, and he said, OpenStack, we like OpenStack, that's cool, we'll embrace it, no problem, and we're like, really? Yeah, I mean, that's kind of exactly what's happened. I mean, you're seeing the same thing with Kubernetes, and containers, and the like. But, again, you guys still got some work to do to really earn their business for those types of workloads, and I presume you're hard at work. >> We are. I don't know if you wanted to hit on some of the announcements that you. >> Yeah, I'd love to. >> Yeah, let's do that. >> So, the real thing I'm excited about is this morning we announced the announcement of our partner program at OVHcloud. It's an exciting day for us on that because, if you'll remember a few minutes ago, I was talking about all of the things we've been doing for the last year, right, getting our data centers ready, and, also, building out our product stack to be able to go to market, and migrating our customers. Well, the fourth thing we were doing, for the last nine to 12 months, is we've been meeting with partners. And I'm fortunate, from my years at EMC-Vmware, and my team, we have a lot of relationships out there. And so we were able to go meet with these partners and say, listen, here's what we're thinking, what do you guys think, what are you looking for, right? We've got all these big players out there, obviously we know all the names, but what differentiation could we bring to your business to help you go grow revenue? And, you know, they came back to us and they said, Wiggs, what we really want to be able to do is we want to be able to come in slowly, expand that as much as we can, make big commitments, make small commitments, we want the ability to be agile, we want to be able to, help us figure out a way that we can save money and worry about that. Help us resolve that issue of that margin erosion. That's a big thing that a lot of the channel's dealing with today. And, so, that's what we did. We came up with a program of four different levels, right? You can dip your toe in, and with a very minimum commitment, the higher commitment you make, not only do you get a better price, but you also get a ton of support on the backend. So, I actually come in and work with you on your messaging. I have sales teams that can actually go out and help them sell the solution, with us as the infrastructure layer in the underpinning, right, and, so far, it's been really good. >> So these are, don't hate me for saying this, these are sort of traditional box sellers, now trying to transform their business, right, and add more value, or their value added supply. Maybe they're SAP. >> Well, you've got manage service providers. You've got manage service providers. >> Okay, so hosting. >> You've got the SI's and the OS's, right? So, you know, some of these guys they either want a private label, right? Or white label your solution? Some guys just want to go to mark up their solution and they just need an asset like model, right? They're just exhausted with, you know, investing in infrastructure, right? So, they're like, "Listen >> And bodies. >> And body, you take that over and let us worry about that. >> You see, from VMware's perspective, that's exactly what we're seeing. We've got an ecosystem of 42 hundred global service providers. They build their own data centers, have a VMwares based hosted solution of some type. A lot of different flavors. They want to get out of the hardware space and out of the data center management space. This is why it's a great solution for OVH, they want to focus on, and, again, we call this asset light, they want to focus on high margin trusted value. Things that they're good at, where they can make a lot of money. >> Which is what? Like, I always see there's a consulting piece up front, security. >> It could be security specialist. >> Yep, security security services. >> Patching monitor, you know, automation, migration services, I mean, the exact discussion we just talked about, right? Customers need that journey. So OVH abstracts a way, the need to do hardware, and that allows them to go focus on the rich or higher margin services that they offer. >> And how are they making it sticky? Because, obviously, they want that, right? So what do you see there and how are you helping them? >> I think anytime you're adding a value added service, if you add that value it is sticky, right? >> Yeah. >> I mean, for an example, to help our relationship with Vmware, and just how strong it is, you know, FusionStormers was one of the partners that we had announced today, right? And they had a quote in there. And I was just sitting in Pat's keynote, next to our customer. You know, and I'm like, so, you know, I get this, it makes sense, you're looking for this, you know, infrastructure as a service play. He's like, David, what we're trying to do is help our customers that love the VMware stack, we're trying to help them to get to the Cloud, right? They don't care about the infrastructure, all they want is great service, right, and great support. And he said, that's my secret sauce, that I am able to offer that. And he goes, you guys handle the infrastructure. He said, it's perfect. >> Last question, David, for you. What are people going to be able to see and feel and touch at the OVH booth here at VMWorld? >> Oh, that's a great question. So, you're going to be able to go over, and you're going to be able to learn about some of our other announcements, with VMwares. Specifically, around what we're doing on the whole SCDC as a stack, right? In the VMware Cloud foundation, and the announcement we had on that this morning. Or, actually, I think that was Friday. You're actually going to be able to go over and they'll pull up and they'll show you some demos, and be able to see the technology live. I think they have a show every hour, and you go over there. And if you go over, you might win a Yeti mug. I think they're giving a Yeti mug to whoever pays the most attention. (Lisa and Dave ooh) So, go over there and learn about that. >> Can always use another Yeti, yeah, I love the Yeti. >> Yeah >> You can't have too many Yeti's. >> Does it come with caffeine? Because that, I'm all over it. >> No, well, we'll leave it clean, yes, maybe caffeine. >> Okay, awesome. David, Geoff, thanks so much for joining Dave and me this morning. >> Thank you so much, we really enjoyed it. >> You're watching theCUBE, live from VMWorld 2018. Day one, Lisa Martin for Dave Vellante, stick around, we'll be right back. (electronic music)

>> Announcer: Live from Las Vegas, it's the Cube, covering VMworld 2017, brought to you by VMware and its ecosystem partners. >> Welcome back everyone live, here in Las Vegas from VMworld 2017, I'm John Furrier of the Cube, live coverage of VMworld 2017 with my cohost Dave Vellante, next guest Dom Delfino, senior vice president of sales and systems engineering, Cube alum, great to see you, welcome back. >> Thanks guys, good to be here again. >> RAC are covering VMworld, the ecosystem has been a little tide goes out, tide comes in, real clarity this year, cloud, you want it on private cloud, public to private cloud or Amazon. >> Dom: Right. >> Any questions? >> Dom: Exactly. Clear. >> This is the vision coming to fruition. This is what you're seeing this year at VMworld. I think in particular when you talk to the customers, they're now in a state of cloud reality. There was sort of this big rush, I'm going to try to move as much to the public cloud as possible and then in terms of the scale they got there, they start to have then challenges on that side, they realize, I need to have a dual strategy. I need to have a private, a public, a hybrid strategy. I think you see all the announcements that we've made today, with DFC on AWS going live now, with more coming around the world in different zones as we progress throughout the rest of the year and into next year, as well as all the service offerings we just announced, Wave Run is a service, VRNI is a service, NSX is a service, app defense, which is our latest security strategy as well. Customers really see how it comes together now and they want to go down that journey with VMware. >> It's important too to clarify, I call the high level messaging, so it's got clarity, but also VMware and ecosystems has a lot under the hood and it can get very technical, so you got to balance the speeds and feeds to feed the red meat to all the practitioners and then the high level. I got to ask you the question because people that are sitting out there on this cloud reality that you mentioned, they don't have a lot of people sometimes. Someone's got to implement this stuff, automation's coming, okay I get that, but getting to the cloud is not easy. I still got to run my shop, what is that operational reality right now because cloud reality, okay I get it, but now I got to turn my on premise into a true private cloud with a new operating model, new practices, how are the VMware customers dealing with that? >> I think that's part of moving away from the legacy as fast as you can or at least where you have to keep it, you've got to sort of isolate it and put it in a corner because it's the legacy that's holding most of us back, right? Because I got to understand how to run the legacy, keep the lights on, that takes 20, 30, 40, 50% of my time, depending on the customer, depending on their infrastructure at the same time I've got to retool my skills, I've got to retool my tool kits that I use, my run books, my operational processes, but now they at least have a direction to build to. All the customer meetings we're having here today it's about software defined. How do I build this abstraction layer? Okay we've been doing this with VMware for years on the compute side, many of them have ventured down the journey with us on the NSX side, we see 10,000 customers roughly on the VSAN side as well and that's about putting together, putting the automation tool set around it and really building that same experience that they can get in the public cloud, which it's fast and it's easy on their on prem data centers as well. Sometimes there's many reasons to retain on the private side, data sovreignty, intellectual property, all of those things as well. I think that's where the customers are in the journey right now and it's now they feel comfortable with the direction and they're going to adopt quickly. >> I like this idea of cloud realities. We've been talking on the Cube today about configuring the cloud to the realities of your organization's data. You're talking about governance, security, data locality, etc. so it really comes back to a data challenge. You can't just take all your data and shove it up into the cloud. What are you seeing from customers in that regard? >> I think there's a regulatory component to that as well, particularly if you go overseas, to Europe and Asia, there's a lot more challenges around that as well. I think what you're seeing is that customers recognize the fact that not everything is going to go into the public cloud at this point, so they're really prioritizing, burstable work loads, temporary work loads, definitely a prime opportunity to put in the public cloud. New application development, definitely a primary opportunity to put in the cloud. If I'm in the health care business and I have to retain health care records for x number of years and I'm responsible for HIPPA compliance around them, maybe not something that I'm just going to shove up into the cloud today. It's use case specific depending on and application specific, depending on the vertical industry, the customer resides in and depending on where they are in their journey to the cloud as well. >> You've got a lot of momentum in your business right now. Basically you're on fire. We talked about the cloud realities, that's part of it. The AWS announcement last year, even though it was a year ahead of time, gave a lot of clarity to people. How much of the momentum is due to those factors? Again, the cloud reality, the fact that people are now more comfortable with your cloud strategy and saying okay, I'm willing to make maybe a multi-year commitment with VMware. Is that a factor? >> It is a factor, it is a factor and I think the two remaining components, accelerating and capturing momentum in the market of our SCDC strategy being VCN and NSX has also helped that reality come to fruition for customers as well. It is software defined, we've been talking about software defined data center for a long time, like everybody else in the industry, we talk about things sometimes a lot sooner than they come to fruition, but now that they put together VC ware with NSX with VSAN, and they say hey, I can actually build a private cloud that's fast and easy, which is the reason a lot of my IT people or my application developers were going around me, because the public cloud was faster and easier. Wasn't necessarily cheaper, but it was definitely faster and easier, now customers who've been on that journey with us for the last year realize they can offer the same thing on prem as well and take advantage of both. Does that make sense? >> Yeah. What's the biggest walk away for you right now, looking at VMware, if you had to talk to customers that are not here and looking at the online coverage, certainly Twitter you'll bump into a lot of Cube coverage and lot of pictures, lot of architectural slides. What's the big walk away so far, day one? >> I think tremendous innovation is the big walk away. In many different categories coming forward, you'll hear another big announcement tomorrow coming up in terms of what we'll be doing in conjunction with one of our sister companies in the application development world. But also about taking security to the next level with app defense, so microsegmentation has become fairly ubiquitously known within the industry now, how do I take that into the guest, into the operating system, into the application layer? How do I secure those things as well? You see a lot of customers getting hit with ransomware attacks this year, those are big reality checkers for you if you're the one sitting behind the keyboard that's got to defend your environment against that and rebuild it and I think they really see VMware continue to push the envelope to develop very innovative solutions to these approaches that are very cost effective and that are also very high performance. >> Personal question, as you're out in the field talking to customers, you've been in the industry for a while, you've seen the waves. What's the biggest thing that you notice, observe out there right now? What's happening? Share some color with the landscape in the marketplace. >> I think there's some good recognition from customers around the type of operational transformation that they're going to have to go through in this journey. It's not about the network independent from storage independent from security independent from computer anymore. Infrastructure is one entity, that's the way the application owners and the application developers view it and want to consume it, that's the way that infrastructure teams are going to have to deliver it. I think there's a lot of recognition of that. I think there's recognition that the security problem is bigger and badder and worse than ever and it's not going away any time soon and there's sort of no magic box. If there was, you'd pay a lot of money for it to make your problems go away, but it's really something that has to be ubiquitous. Infosect policy has to be aligned with infrastructure security implementation. I could have the greatest policy in the world, if I can't actually implement it, I'm not going to get the benefit to that security there. I think those are some of the things as well. I think sort of the container world is going through a little bit of the post high upcycle, what's the reality check of that environment as well right now, we saw this with open flow and SDN five and six years ago. >> John: Saw it on big data with Hadoub. It's so expensive to run, why even do it? At some point, it can be total cost ownership and ease of use, old school topics. >> We're well into production ready phase of software defined networking. We're well into the production ready phase of software defined storage and hyperconverge infrastructure we need to take containers into that next phase as well. >> Bottom line, what does cloud ready mean to an enterprise these days? >> Cloud ready means that application, that work load is portable and I can deliver the same level of availability, service and agility, whether it's in the public cloud or whether it's in my private data center. Or I move it back and forth between both. We're certainly excited about the momentum we see with our customers, I think you can see and hear the buzz around VMware going on this year and I think it's the best it's been in a few years. >> You run the SE team as well right? >> Dom: Yes I do. >> How does that work? SE's are like the Navy SEALS John always talks about on the beach, they, >> I like to call them the conscience of the sales force. >> There you go, right. Customer trusts them, but at the same time, they understand the customer requirements at a very deep level. How are they organized? How do they fit into the partner ecosystem, maybe you could explain that a little bit. >> Yeah I think traditionally we've organized our SE's, aligned them with product categories, so I've got networking and security SE's, I've got cloud management, automation, orchestration SE's and software defined storage SE's, but I think that sort of is the base line and then you start to build their skill sets toward solution, towards a solution. What types of solution? Is it containers on open stack? Is it VMware's STDC stack? Is it around particular vertical solutions? If you're an SE on my health care team, you're probably very focused on electronic health records and EPIC and Medtronic and different applications like that. How do you solve those customers' problems at the higher level and be able to drill down at the same time with the domain experts from those customers when they want to understand how OSPF works and NSX or they want to understand how lund creation works in VSAN. It's sort of an evolution in terms of building skills. You've got to start at the deepest levels and then you got to build to how those products and those technologies integrate together to provide the customer with a solution. >> So as you move toward this multi cloud word, throwing another buzz word, but is this cloud architect like SE role emerging? >> We'll call them a solution architect. That solution may be a cloud solution, it may be a vertical solution targeted at a specific customer base and make sure that we do what's appropriate to serve our customers. >> John: What's the coolest thing you've worked on this year? >> I've got to think that app defense is the coolest thing that we've got out this year. I think that we've solved a lot of problems with microsegmentation from a network security perspective. I think now going up into the guest and into the application layer and providing an analogous functionality there is going to be really a very very prevalent way of preventing breaches, malware, malware propagation, ransomware in the future as well. I'm a little bit of a security geek, it's attractive to me. I really see that as just an ongoing, it's not even a battle anymore, it's a war now for our customers. We want to help them win that war. >> John: Ransomware has been so brutal. >> Ransomware's been brutal and I mean, see customers almost going out of business. >> Well it's become a board-level topic overnight. It is a serious board-level topic, not just lip service. You're seeing that right? >> You will see in some circumstances boards actually pulling the chief information security officer out of IT and having them report directly to the board. >> Well it makes a lot of sense. >> John: The pressure is unbelievable. >> The pressure is unbelievable right? >> In a lot of regards you would think that the CSO certainly should not report to the CIO, it's kind of like the fox watching the hen house dynamic. Maybe that's not the best analogy, but there should be an inherent tension there number one, but number two is what's the right regime? Why is it IT's problem? It shouldn't be. >> Yeah I think it goes back to information security policy versus actual implementation and the gap that's existed between those two for years for many reasons, networking being a flagrant issue in that context, where I could say oh, this application, this user needs to talk to this application, this application needs to this set of data. How do we implement that? That's not the easiest thing with the tool set that customers who run legacy networks have had historically. I think now that we have some of those things, you'll see the scenario I just described where a few organizations are pulling the CSO out of IT and reporting to the board or some, we've seen board level mandates for segmentation initiatives within the technology area as well so I think this is going to be an ongoing battle that we face moving forward. >> This is the biggest problem I would say at the Cube all day long because part of the value proposition of cloud and dev ops and apps is having data in real time. To be liberal with the data, you run the risk of opening it up so you can't do it the old way. >> Part of the cloud adoption and the new wave of applications about moving these businesses forward, the security is one of those things that will move you backwards from where you are today. I think it's important that we be able to tackle all these battles on all different fronts at the same time. >> If I may, I know we got to go, but there's another dynamic as well which is the recognition that we are going to get penetrated and yet I think it was the third leg of Pat's slide today was response. Boards are saying it's not if, it's when. How do we respond? That's a critical part of the implementation. >> I think it's, we talk about IOT. Think about the number of new entry points you create into your infrastructure, every device you connect to the network itself. Keeping them out is a huge challenge. The question is what can you do as the owner/operator once they are inside? How do you limit, how do you restrict the level of risk that you have and exposure you have to your data, to your applications to your customer information, so on and so forth and I think that's what we've brought to the table in a substantial way with microsegmentation with NSX and I think you'll see that continue to really raise the game with app defense as well. >> Dom Delfino, great to have you, great color, great commentary, you're like a pro. He's just like a anchor with us, SportsCenter >> If Pat fires me am I in? No? >> John: You're in. >> All right. >> Pat fire him so we can hire him. >> John: Don't fire me, Pat, I like my job. >> Dom, thanks so much, good coverage, always great. >> Dave: Thank you, pleasure. >> Bringing a great attitude to the Cube, great energy. More come, day one as we continue down, wind down day one and three days of wall to wall coverage with the Cube VMworld two sets, double barrel shotgun of content here at the Cube, we'll be back with more after this short break. (electronic music)